Patterico's Pontifications

8/4/2023

Weekend Open Thread – Guest Bloggers in Secure Yet Undisclosed Locations

Filed under: General — JVW @ 7:53 am



[guest post by JVW]

With both guest bloggers on super-secret missions on behalf of brand awareness for Patterico’s Pontifications, this Weekend Open Thread might end up being somewhat slapdash and haphazard. I’m starting this on Tuesday night in the hopes of getting a little bit up every day, but the final product will be what it’s gonna be. With that, it’s rosin on the bow and here we go:

Item 1 – Nicholas Kristof, Affirmative Action Kid
The Chronicle of Higher Education asks why our old friend Nicholas Kristof is claiming to have been the beneficiary of affirmative action, believing that growing up in rural Oregon made him exotic and thus and interesting candidate in the eyes of Harvard’s Admissions Office, when in fact his background was fairly straightforward by Harvard’s standards:

In a recent column, The New York Times’s Nicholas Kristof explained that he had been a beneficiary of affirmative action: “Elite colleges were looking for farm kids from low-income areas to provide diversity. So a school that I had never visited, Harvard, took an enormous risk and accepted me, and I became a token country bumpkin to round out a class of polished overachievers. In time, Harvard gave me a wonderful education, transformed my life and set me on a path to becoming a columnist — which is why you’re stuck reading this.”

Readers were quick to point out that both of Kristof’s parents were professors. His father, Ladis Kristof, was born in a part of the former Austro-Hungarian Empire now in Ukraine; he was imprisoned by the Nazis and eventually made it to the United States, where he graduated from Reed College, in Oregon, in 1955. According to Reed’s alumni magazine, Ladis became “a political scientist of international renown; a Fulbright Scholar to Romania, and a visiting professor at universities in India, Moldova, Poland, and Romania.” Nicholas’s mother, Jane McWilliams, was also a professor; she retired emerita at Portland State.

So Kristof was a double-professor brat with exactly the kind of advantages that might make one unusually competitive when applying for college — no first-generation college student here. Far from taking “an enormous risk,” Harvard was making a very safe bet. Why does Kristof work so hard to imply otherwise?

Mr. Kristof no doubt wrote a stirring essay about getting up at dawn to feed the chickens, milk the cows, bale the hay, hitch up the family’s one ox to the rusty old plow and make a pass at the north field, and then walk the four miles to his one-room schoolhouse where the room was illuminated with kerosene and heated with a coal stove. But maybe he really is onto something. We’ve pointed out before that affirmative action as practiced by Harvard was far more beneficial to middle-class and upper-class minorities than it was to kids from the mean streets, so it’s only fair that Mr. Kristof sees himself as an extension of that phony-baloney program.

Item 10 – Not Looking So Great for the USWNT
The United States Women’s National Team has thus far been incredibly underwhelming at the FIFA Women’s World Cup tournament being jointly hosted by Australia and New Zealand. After a rather pedestrian 3-0 victory over Vietnam, a team the U.S. women were expected to trounce by somewhere around twice that margin, the team played absolutely uninspired tie games with Holland, ranked ninth in the world, and then Portugal, ranked twenty-first. Their record of one victory versus two draws places the U.S., who entered the tournament as the world’s number one ranked team, into the elimination round as the second finisher in their group, placing them in a win-or-go-home game on Sunday morning against Sweden, ranked as the world’s number three team. Should they survive that match, their next opponent would be either Japan, ranked eleventh, or Norway, ranked twelfth, and it would only get harder from there.

Item 11 – Third Time Is the Charm
This ultra-tolerant attitude towards criminality is really paying off in the Bay Area:

CNN senior national correspondent Kyung Lah said her rental car was broken into while she was on assignment in Oakland, Calif., on Wednesday, marking the third time in the last year her car has been broken into while she was on assignment in the Bay Area.

Lah said in a series of posts on X that she was in Oakland shooting a story about crime when her “completely empty” car was broken into.

“We were across the street— this happened in seconds,” she said, adding in a second post that “Even tho the car is empty, the thieves break in and lower the seat so they can steal anything in the trunk.”

[. . .]

Back in March, Lah shared that she and CNN producer Jason Kravarik had their bags stolen out of their rental car while on assignment at San Francisco’s city hall for a story about the city’s rampant crime.

While the pair were conducting an interview at city hall, thieves broke into their car and snatched their bags “in under 4 seconds,” despite the crew having hired private security to keep watch.

[. . .]

This time around, an employee for the rental-car company told Lah that of the 250 cars returned to the lot yesterday, 27 had been broken into — more than 10 percent of returned cars.

How long until the first politician complains about the rising cost of rental car rentals and car insurance in the Bay Area, and blames greedy corporations for gouging the hard-working citizen?

Item 100 – Suing College Accreditation Cartels
Florida pushes the anti-woke agenda further by suing the Southern Associations of Colleges and Schools. George Leef has the details:

College accreditation used to be the most soporific of topics. Almost nobody was interested in it because accreditation meant so little. Accrediting agencies had their standards that kept degree mills from fooling people into thinking they were real colleges. Nothing wrong with that, but it wasn’t a matter of national concern.

In recent years, however, accreditation has become highly controversial. The reason is that the accrediting agencies have ceased to be neutral parties who apply reasonable standards to ensure that students are not squandering their federal student-aid funds on dodgy schools that are just interested in cashing in on easy money. Instead, the accreditors have become activists who want to direct how colleges and universities will be run. They have badly overstepped their boundaries, and that has now triggered a lawsuit against the Department of Education.

You can see where the rest of the story is going, but click through to the article for full details.

Item 101 – The Summer of Strikes Roils the Golden State
In addition to the Writers Guild of America strike, joined in solidarity by the Screen Actors Guild-American Federation of Television and Radio Artists, and the hotel workers strikes ongoing throughout Southern California, comes word that some pretty high-paid state workers might also take to the picket lines:

The union representing doctors and psychiatrists working in California correctional facilities said that 91% of voting members authorized a strike Monday. Non-competitive salaries, strenuous working conditions and an overreliance on higher-paid contracted doctors, make it difficult to hire staff physicians, said Dr. Stuart Bussey, president of the umbrella Union of American Physicians and Dentists.

[. . .]

The biggest sticking point is salaries. Though doctors and psychiatrists pull down between $285,000 and $343,000 annually, according to California Correctional Health Care Services, temporary contracted workers make twice as much, said Dr. Nader Wassef, psychiatrist and chief of staff at Napa State Hospital.

“I am not going to claim poverty. What I’m trying to say is if we plan on getting trained, qualified psychiatrists to treat these patients, we are not going to get any because we are not competitive,” Wassef said.

The vacancy rate among on-site psychiatrists exceeded 50% in June, according to court documents filed by the state in an ongoing lawsuit over prison conditions and prisoner safety. Among all psychiatrists, including telehealth providers, the vacancy rate was 35%.

More than 20% of primary care doctor positions are vacant, California Correctional Health Care Services told CalMatters in an unsigned statement Tuesday. The agency did not respond to questions about contractor pay.

Lucky we have a state dominated by the union-friendly political party, right? But of course that same party receives massive donations from both sides in the Hollywood and the hotel strikes, and they have the challenge of finding the budget money to help pay for all of those prison sawbones and shrinks. Good luck to them.

Item 110 – More on Strike-mania in Southern California
Taylor Swift brings her “Eras” tour to Los Angeles tonight [this is being drafted on Thursday] for the first of six sold-out concerts at the SoFi Stadium in Inglewood. Some 400,000+ tickets have been sold for the shows. Estimates are that Ms. Swift herself realizes a net profit of about $5 million for every show she plays (there are other claims it is closer to three times that amount), and some studies suggest that her 46 shows in 17 U.S. cities this summer will bring $4.6 billion dollars in economic activity over a five month period.

So naturally the aforementioned striking hotel workers want Ms. Swift to cancel her Los Angeles shows in solidarity with their cause. The workers are demanding an immediate raise of $5 per hour, followed by guaranteed raises of $3 per hour each year over the next two years. They also want healthcare, pensions, and no immigration checks via the eVerify system. The union, Unite Here Local 11, even got some of the more dopey and economically-illiterate California politicians such as hypocritical Lt. Governor Eleni Kounalakis; Patterico’s and my County Supervisor, Janice Hahn; and a whole host of other pandering Democrats to sign on to a letter asking Ms. Swift to postpone her Los Angeles concerts until the strike is settled, as if tens of thousands of young Swifties and their angry parents would then force those mean old hotels to immediately pay up. The delusion of labor-owned Democrats knows no bounds, even if Ms. Swift has recently outed herself as a typical entertainment leftie with all of the right political beliefs. Here’s wishing her a successful run at SoFi this extended weekend anyway.

Item 111 – Dianne Feinstein: Too Far Gone to Manage Her Own Affairs But Still Able to Serve in the Senate
The ending to Dianne Feinstein’s grossly overrated career keeps getting more and more sad. Last week we had the spectacle of her yet again acting bewildered in a Defense Committee hearing and having to be stage-managed by her colleagues. Now news comes that her daughter is exercising power of attorney to take care of the Senators personal legal affairs:

The daughter of Sen. Dianne Feinstein, D-Calif., has been given power of attorney over the sitting senator and is handling the 90-year-old’s legal affairs.

Katherine Feinstein, 66, has filed two lawsuits on her mother’s behalf in an effort to gain access to the estate of the senator’s late husband. The senator’s decision to delegate management of her affairs comes as Democrats and Republicans on Capitol Hill argue whether Feinstein is no longer fit for office.

Katherine’s first lawsuit on her mother’s behalf relates to a California beach house owned by the senator’s late husband, Richard Blum. The lawsuit argues that Feinstein is seeking to sell the house in order to raise funds for her ongoing medical treatments.

The second lawsuit challenges the appointment of two other trustees in Blum’s estate: Michael Klein, a longtime lawyer for Blum, and Marc Scholvinck, a business partner of Blum’s, according to The New York Times.

It’s a sad reflection on the broken one-party political system in California which kept electing her long after it was apparent that she was not up to the job, and it’s a sad reflection on her party which keeps her in place in order to hold down an important spot on the Judiciary Committee, where her usefulness is in rubber-stamping President Biden’s nominees. A sad way for her to cement her (at best) mediocre legacy.

Item 1000 – Is this DeSantis-Newsom Thing on, or What?
Unannounced Presidential candidate Gavin Newsom has been out on the hustings challenging announced Presidential candidate Ron DeSantis to a debate over which state model — Newsom’s California vs. DeSantis’s Florida — is more stable and sane. After (rightly) ignoring his West Coast antagonist, the governor of America’s Penis now seems to be poised for a fight. Noah Rothman, for one, believes this might be a fine and necessary thing:

The California model and the Florida model are wildly distinct theories of how to balance economic optimization against the need to maximize human happiness. They are in competition already, and it would be valuable to hash out those distinctions in plain terms on a debate stage. If these two governors can respectfully advocate their respective philosophical approaches to governance, it would greatly clarify the stakes of the coming presidential contest. Indeed, such an engagement would likely prove vastly more informational than one defined by two aged, cantankerous bloviators whose highest aspirations for the country are to ensure that it doesn’t put them or their loved ones in jail.

He also recognizes that this could just turn into a pointless shitshow:

Of course, a DeSantis–Newsom debate could also devolve into bickering, point-scoring, and competing one-liners. If this debate becomes a contest of personalities, DeSantis’s deficiencies in that area could prove fatal. But if Hannity could keep the participants in this deliberation focused on arguing their competing theories of societal organization, it wouldn’t just be a far healthier political exercise than any to which Americans have been privy for many years; it would also showcase the superiority of the conservative model of state governance. And it might go a long way toward convincing the voting public that Florida’s state-level experiments deserve to go national.

In any case, I would sooner tune into this debate than any involving you-know-who. If the majority of Americans look at the California model versus the Florida model and determine that they like better the way the Golden State is managing things, then at least we can drop the pretense that the United States is still (barely) a center-right nation.

Enjoy the weekend. The summer is winding down and the kids will be back to school soon.

– JVW

450 Responses to “Weekend Open Thread – Guest Bloggers in Secure Yet Undisclosed Locations”

  1. At NRO, Jim Geraghty has further thoughts on Dianne Feinstein serving in the Senate while essentially being a ward of her daughter:

    An individual transfers power of attorney to a trusted friend or family member in several circumstances. Some are mundane, like an inability to be in attendance at a meeting that requires signing legal documents. But other situations include a person being mentally incompetent or unable to represent herself. [Katherine] Feinstein and her mother have determined that it is best if Dianne Feinstein does not represent herself in legal matters. But it is apparently just fine and dandy for her to continue to represent California in the Senate.

    Sadly, keeping a Democrat-majority on the Senate Judiciary Committee means letting her serve out the next 17 months of her term, or maybe waiting for her to die in office.

    JVW (2e2c2d)

  2. https://americanaccountabilityfoundation.substack.com/p/ban-the-internal-combustion-engine

    AAF’s Substack

    Subscribe
    Sign in
    ‘Ban the Internal Combustion Engine’: Secret emails reveal true agenda behind today’s CAFE announcement
    Emails expose Biden NHTSA chief’s radical agenda

    AAF
    JUL 28, 2023
    6
    4

    Today the Biden Department of Transportation’s National Highway Traffic Safety Administration announced that they are beginning the process of “updating” fuel economy standards for passenger cars and trucks.

    According to a press release, NHTSA’s proposal includes a “2% per year improvement in fuel efficiency for passenger cars, and a 4% per year improvement for light trucks, beginning in model year 2027 and ramping up through model year 2032, potentially reaching an average fleet fuel economy of 58 miles per gallon by 2032.”

    In addition, it includes a “10% improvement per year for commercial pickup trucks and work vans (with gross vehicle weight ratings of more than 8,500 pounds and less than 14,001 pounds) beginning in model year 2030 and ramping up through model year 2035.”

    These draconian measures in the name of “efficiency” would effectively make electric vehicles mandatory in this country by forcefully limiting Americans’ options. In the name of fighting climate change, the Biden administration is seeking to bend the American people to their will through government coercion. They don’t trust us to make our own choices, and so have decided to make our choices for us.

    This isn’t speculation. We know the plan is to eradicate gas vehicles because we have obtained emails by NHTSA Acting Administrator Ann Carlson revealing a desire to do just that.

    In an email thread from 2020, when Carlson was a UCLA professor, under the subject line “Looking to chat about Newsom order banning gas car sales,” Carlson spoke of a “ban on engines” that “help California achieve the National Ambient Air Quality Standard for ozone pollution, something very difficult to achieve as long as conventional vehicles remain on the road. And it would help the state achieve its climate goals.”

    They want to ban cars and freedom of movement.

    California totalitarianism forced on the nation.

    NJRob (eb56c3)

  3. Re: Strikes in California

    Nobody cares. The Hollywood strike stories are falling farther and farther into the bottom of local newscasts, and there is very little, if any, coverage of the hotel workers’ strikes. And public employees that strike should be arrested.

    Personally the federal labor legislation protecting unions should be repealed, making strikes illegal and the unions subject to anti-trust prosecution.

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  4. Re: Newsom-DeSantis

    It’s the first debate of the general election. 😊

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  5. Re: Newsom-DeSantis II

    Also, DeSantis needs the debate to fix his speaking style. He’s as stiff as a board.

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  6. Text messages provided to the FBI show that a Chinese energy conglomerate that struck a controversial deal in 2017 with Hunter Biden began its pursuit of a relationship with the future first family back in late 2015 when Joe Biden was still vice president, hoping to seize on the name of one of America’s most famous political dynasties to provide cover for its ambitious plan to buy up energy assets inside the United States.

    https://justthenews.com/accountability/political-ethics/text-messages-given-fbi-chinese-wanted-biden-family-name-help

    BuDuh (9a76cd)

  7. JVW, I tried twice posting a quote and a link from here: https://www.tabletmag.com/sections/arts-letters/articles/david-garrow-interview-obama

    I am not sure what is keeping it from posting.

    BuDuh (9a76cd)

  8. That Fox debate is DeSantis’s to lose. If Newsom comes off poorly, well, it’s Fox and Hannity. If Newsom comes out of the lion’s den with a win, DeSantis is badly damaged.

    Kevin M (ed969f)

  9. It’s the first debate of the general election.

    We’ll see. I must admit though, that despite not liking either of them, it would be a far better contest than the odds bet.

    Kevin M (ed969f)

  10. The Hollywood strike stories are falling farther and farther into the bottom of local newscasts

    When the new TV Season is delayed until March, people will notice. You can grab their guns and make them use stupid pronouns, but mess with their TV and they’ll have nothing better to do than come after you.

    Kevin M (ed969f)

  11. CNN Reports ‘Putin Is Counting On Donald Trump to Win’ 2024 In His Ukraine War Plans, According to Top Officials

    https://www.mediaite.com/tv/cnn-reports-putin-is-counting-on-donald-trump-to-win-2024-in-his-ukraine-war-plans-according-to-top-officials/

    BuDuh (9a76cd)

  12. The CPA in me is rebelling against these item numbers.
    I see that none of the items covered illegal immigration, so here’s my offering.

    Paul Montagu (d52d7d)

  13. Regarding DF… I read once (sorry I don’t remember where) about a medieval practice. The law was “so long as there was life in” a person, they could sign contracts. So putting a fly in the mouth of a dead person, and using their hand to sign a document, could be done.

    Sort of sounds like the Senate.

    And all of our culture now is sort of like this:

    https://youtu.be/UUWJWRn5m6E

    It’s the “Crazy Years,” if you recognize the RAH reference.

    Simon Jester (ff9c91)

  14. They want to ban cars and freedom of movement.

    Batteries are getting better. One of the reasons I didn’t buy an electric car, and would maybe lease if I really had to. When batteries get to the point where they’ll last for a 10-hour highway drive, or can be recharged during lunch, that mobility issue will be less of a concern. OTOH, I expect they will have some plan to limit that freedom anyway (e.g. real-time GPS reporting).

    Kevin M (ed969f)

  15. Personally the federal labor legislation protecting unions should be repealed, making strikes illegal and the unions subject to anti-trust prosecution.

    Yes, what could be fairer than every individual having to secure their own deal with a giant corporation?

    As much as union power can be abused (particularly in the public sector), it is necessary in an age of trillion-dollar corporations. There was no noticeable middle class in the pre-union era; even those who work outside the union environment benefited from the changes unions forced.

    A better reform is to ban public-employee unions, as government is responsible to the People, not stockholders.

    Kevin M (ed969f)

  16. I’m actually excited for this DeSantis-Newsom debate.

    There’s no cost for Newsom to do this, even it he flames out.

    There’s HUGE risk for DeSantis to flub this one, so kudos to him willing to stake his chances on this.

    whembly (5f7596)

  17. When the new TV Season is delayed until March, people will notice. You can grab their guns and make them use stupid pronouns, but mess with their TV and they’ll have nothing better to do than come after you.

    Kevin M (ed969f) — 8/4/2023 @ 9:10 am

    Meh. People can stream all the shows they either missed or want to watch again.

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  18. @15

    Personally the federal labor legislation protecting unions should be repealed, making strikes illegal and the unions subject to anti-trust prosecution.

    Yes, what could be fairer than every individual having to secure their own deal with a giant corporation?

    As much as union power can be abused (particularly in the public sector), it is necessary in an age of trillion-dollar corporations. There was no noticeable middle class in the pre-union era; even those who work outside the union environment benefited from the changes unions forced.

    A better reform is to ban public-employee unions, as government is responsible to the People, not stockholders.

    Kevin M (ed969f) — 8/4/2023 @ 9:27 am

    There’s absolutely a place for private-sector unions.

    However, public-sector unions should be prohibited as most of the time the negotiations aren’t adversarial.

    As for Nursing unions, it’s a little unique to other professions as there’s a ‘direct harm’ component…namely, the patients. So, I don’t get the sense that those crossing the lines are treated as “scabs”, because nursing knows intuitively that patients need to be taken care of….beside, it harms the Hospital as they have to backfill positions during a strike with PRN staff, and PRN staff get’s paaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaid!

    whembly (5f7596)

  19. There’s HUGE risk for DeSantis to flub this one……

    whembly (5f7596) — 8/4/2023 @ 9:49 am

    LOL! The DeSantis-Newsom “debate” is a sure sign of the dog days of summer. You would think an active Republican presidential candidate would have better things to do than debate a non-candidate Democrat. DeSantis got trolled and rose to the bait.

    As much as union power can be abused (particularly in the public sector), it is necessary in an age of trillion-dollar corporations. There was no noticeable middle class in the pre-union era; even those who work outside the union environment benefited from the changes unions forced.

    Kevin M (ed969f) — 8/4/2023 @ 9:27 am

    Public sector unions don’t have the power to hold a nation hostage like the International Longshore and Warehouse Union; the twelve unions representing railroad workers; the Teamsters; the Airline Pilots Association; the Oil, Chemical and Atomic Workers; and the United Steelworkers, to name a few. They can strangle the country.

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  20. RIP Marc Gilpin (56). As a child actor played Roy Scheider’s son in Jaws 2. Brother of actress Peri Gilpin (Frasier’s Roz Doyle).

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  21. They can strangle the country.

    And there are laws that deal with that eventuality.

    Kevin M (ed969f)

  22. As a child actor played Roy Scheider’s son in Jaws 2

    I know 2 child actors from the 60s and 70s. Neither has had a happy life.

    Kevin M (ed969f)

  23. I know 2 child actors from the 60s and 70s. Neither has had a happy life.

    Kevin M (ed969f) — 8/4/2023 @ 10:18 am

    I don’t know about Gilpin’s happiness or not, but I doubt it had anything to do with his death from brain cancer.

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  24. NJRob,

    The Biden Administration is also limiting oil and gas production by halting pipeline and refinery construction and monitoring the resulting methane flares (with constant helicopter presence) in a move to force existing wells to be shut in. No producing wells, no oil and gas production, huge increase in gas at the pump.

    That is a great reason to vote Republican. Too bad they are running a conman who only cares about himself.

    DRJ (2e4ac4)

  25. How far does the “defrauding the government” statue reach? Let’s say that a presidential candidate is in possession of a volatile report about her opponent, but they believe it to be utter trash. Still, it seems like it would hurt the opponent, so they give it to contacts in the FBI and then leak it to friendly reporters. The opposing candidate is then subjected to months of FBI harassment, FISA warrants and press smears.

    Has the government been defrauded? Have the People been defrauded? Are there bright lines here?

    Kevin M (ed969f)

  26. * her their.

    My bad.

    Kevin M (ed969f)

  27. That is a great reason to vote Republican. Too bad they are running a conman who only cares about himself.

    Ignoring problems like this is how the CA GOP died. Instead of focusing on traffic, prices, rents and corruption, the CA GOP instead attacked the only fast-growing part of the population.

    Kevin M (ed969f)

  28. The cheapest gas in my old CA zip code is $4.79/gallon. Most stations are well over $5. Here in NM, there are quite a few stations under $3.79.

    Kevin M (ed969f)

  29. @25

    How far does the “defrauding the government” statue reach? Let’s say that a presidential candidate is in possession of a volatile report about her opponent, but they believe it to be utter trash. Still, it seems like it would hurt the opponent, so they give it to contacts in the FBI and then leak it to friendly reporters. The opposing candidate is then subjected to months of FBI harassment, FISA warrants and press smears.

    Has the government been defrauded? Have the People been defrauded? Are there bright lines here?

    Kevin M (ed969f) — 8/4/2023 @ 10:36 am

    *caugh*RussiaGate by Clinton campaign*caugh*

    whembly (5f7596)

  30. I am pleased to see that at least we can agree that Kristof is an insufferable douchebag.

    john (aff6cb)

  31. @29 and 25, the predicate for the investigation into the trump campaign and the SC investigation wasn’t the steel dossier. It was statement made but a campaign staffer to a foreign diplomat.

    The SC was appointed when Trump fired the FBI to stop investigations into Russian hacking of the DNC.

    Time123 (62e27f)

  32. Time,

    That isn’t actually the question. Would knowingly presenting something false, like the Steel Dossier, to government agents for investigation, fall under the scope of this statute? Would knowingly leaking a false report like this to the press constitute a public fraud?

    Not interested in who did what, when. Although the Hillary campaign’s actions did inspire the question, it have utterly no interest in relitigating that mess.

    Kevin M (ed969f)

  33. Kevin, Interesting question. Probably take some research to understand the details of the law and what precedents exist about that scenario

    Time123 (62e27f)

  34. Defrauding the government under Section 371 means to interfere with or obstruct government functions through dishonesty, trickery, etc.

    In your example, you would have to show Hillary knew the Steele Dossier was not true. Asking the government to investigate something she thought might be true, at least in part, strikes me as something the government is supposed to do, so that would not be interfering or obstructing.

    DRJ (2e4ac4)

  35. I don’t know whether leaking it to the media is illegal, but it would not be part of the defrauding the government statute.

    DRJ (b2f0ad)

  36. Wouldn’t they also have to show that the leaked info in question was being presented as fact? If it was “here’s this info we got, some of it’s concerning and we think you should look into it but we can’t promise it’s true.” That would be a different thing.

    Time123 (62e27f)

  37. I’d say that the public sector unions can hold local areas hostage. In the county I live in, 17.5% of our 230,000 or so jobs are public sector union jobs. 137,000 people voted in the midterm. Union influence starts way before the vote. The local Democrat Party is not going to run a candidate without the public union stamp of approval

    steveg (79eba3)

  38. A Useless Exercise:

    Two Tennessee Democrats who were expelled from the state legislature in April over their participation in a gun-control protest won back their seats late Thursday.

    Reps. Justin J. Pearson (D-Memphis) and Justin Jones (D-Nashville) easily defeated their Republican opponents in districts that lean Democratic, according to unofficial results. Pearson faced independent candidate Jeff Johnston, winning more than 90 percent of the votes. Jones went up against Republican Laura Nelson, getting more than 75 percent of the votes.
    ……….
    Pearson and Jones were reinstated days after their expulsion by local officials in their districts, but only on an interim basis, requiring them to run in elections this year to keep their seats.

    “Well, Mr. Speaker, the People have spoken,” Jones said late Thursday on Twitter, the social media platform now rebranded as X. “See you August 21st for special session.”

    Pearson also celebrated his win on Twitter. “The FINAL results confirm, that the voice of District 86 will not be silenced!” Pearson wrote.
    ……….

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  39. USWNT
    #1A The world talent is now better and deeper
    #1B The European womens game is subsidized by the large European clubs
    #2 The USWNT got (over)paid and lost their edge

    The best thing for this team might be to suffer a large, embarrassing defeat and recalibrate. Or maybe they just need to petition FIFA to allow them to begin to transition 23 good U-18 men players so by 2027 they can have a stacked roster

    steveg (79eba3)

  40. Desatan’s largest donor says he has stop funding desatan campaign because they are incompetent.

    asset (8f7e1c)

  41. Do you not realize how juvenile calling him “Desatin” is? It almost makes me want to vote for him.

    lurker (cd7cd4)

  42. Excuse me, I meant “Desatan.” Wouldn’t want to get that wrong.

    lurker (cd7cd4)

  43. @41

    Do you not realize how juvenile calling him “Desatin” is? It almost makes me want to vote for him.

    lurker (cd7cd4) — 8/4/2023 @ 2:53 pm

    The left fears DeSantis.

    He warrants a strong look by the simple fact that his opponents fears him.

    whembly (5f7596)

  44. The left fears DeSantis.

    He warrants a strong look by the simple fact that his opponents fears him.

    LOL! There is nothing to fear from someone who is sinking like a rock:

    ……(A)t the national level, DeSantis has a healthy lead over every other candidate who isn’t named Donald Trump. But in new state-level polling conducted by those D.C. elites at Fox Business, DeSantis is just another member of the trailing-Trump pack.
    …….
    Fox Business evaluated support in the primary among likely voters in Iowa and South Carolina. …….. In each state, Trump leads the next-closest candidate by at least 30 percentage points. In each state, DeSantis is in a statistical tie for that second-place position. In Iowa, he gets 16 percent of support compared with 11 percent for Sen. Tim Scott (R-S.C.). In South Carolina, he gets 13 percent vs. 14 percent for the state’s former governor, Nikki Haley. (Scott gets 10 percent there.)
    ……..
    …….. In Iowa, DeSantis was the second pick of less than a quarter of respondents while Scott is the second pick of 15 percent. In South Carolina, the South Carolina Republicans are both identified as second choices about as often as DeSantis is.
    ……..
    ……..In both states, voters (including those very conservative voters to whom DeSantis wants to appeal) say that beating President Biden is more important than that the candidate shares their views on issues.

    In each state, the percentage of voters who say Trump has the best chance of beating Biden is about the same as the level of his overall support.
    ……….
    The Fox Business polling in Iowa and South Carolina (like the poll in New Hampshire) shows that Trump’s support is actually firmer than that of other candidates.
    ………

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  45. A more graphic portrayal of the DeSantis rock. DeSantis’s high point in January 2023 was a shade over 40%, his polling average now is down to 14%.

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  46. And who consistently comes in second to Biden in head to head polls. Comedy Gold!

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  47. Do you not realize how juvenile calling him “Desatin” is? It almost makes me want to vote for him.

    lurker (cd7cd4) — 8/4/2023 @ 2:53 pm

    Hear, hear.

    Asset, for the love of mike, stop using “Desatan” and “latinx”.

    But only if you want people to take you seriously.

    norcal (dc1a5d)

  48. DeSantis’ biggest donor says he won’t give more money unless changes are made

    Hotel entrepreneur Robert Bigelow, the biggest individual donor to a group supporting Ron DeSantis’ presidential bid, told Reuters on Friday he will not donate more money unless the Florida governor attracts new major donors and adopts a more moderate approach.

    The comments by Bigelow, who gave $20 million to the pro-DeSantis “Never Back Down” super PAC in March, underscore donor concerns about the Florida governor’s struggling campaign, which has been unable to make a dent in former President Donald Trump’s huge lead for the 2024 Republican nomination.
    ………

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  49. The odds of DeSantis becoming President (let alone the Republican nominee) laughably low, behind those of Newsom and RFK, Jr.

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  50. Item 10 – Not Looking So Great for the USWNT:

    Of course the big issue on the political right isn’t the team’s performance on the pitch, but the fact they aren’t singing the national anthem.

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  51. he will not donate more money unless the Florida governor attracts new major donors and adopts a more moderate approach.

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8) — 8/4/2023 @ 3:42 pm

    As if a more moderate approach will dispel the Trump cult

    norcal (dc1a5d)

  52. The weird name calling is reminiscent of two prior frequent posters to this site who were banned for being persistent and obnoxious jackwagons. Your mileage may vary.

    Me, I am tired of flexible yardsticks and schoolyard nonsense.

    To each their own.

    I view this period as an opportunity for each of us to define what we believe in, and why. Not what we are against, but what we are for.

    So even when someone does good things, but is a bad person, should that person be supported? I know how I feel about it. Others differ.

    Simon Jester (c8876d)

  53. The weird name calling is reminiscent of two prior frequent posters to this site who were banned for being persistent and obnoxious jackwagons.

    Were they the ones that said things like Orange Baboon, Trumpinistas, etc?

    I kind of miss that quality conversation. Not really…

    BuDuh (9a76cd)

  54. As if a more moderate approach will dispel the Trump cult

    norcal (dc1a5d) — 8/4/2023 @ 4:17 pm

    Bigelow is speaking about DeSantis, not Trump.

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  55. @41 he is evil. He hurts people for political gain.

    asset (27e4d4)

  56. @52

    So even when someone does good things, but is a bad person, should that person be supported? I know how I feel about it. Others differ.

    Simon Jester (c8876d) — 8/4/2023 @ 4:19 pm

    Yes, if that person advances your preferred policies.

    Because if you cant get past that person, and withhold your support due to the person, then you just voted for the other party.

    We deserve the politicians we get.

    whembly (c88dc4)

  57. I try to give news that is outside the conservative bubble that you might not be getting. I have the same problem with msdnc’s liberal establishment bubble. I need to here from both sides to get the dirt on the other side.

    asset (27e4d4)

  58. Obama promoted ObamaCare to expand health insurance, asset. It spread the wealth so some people got new/increased health benefits and some had benefits reduced. Some people won and some lost.

    My family’s benefits were dramatically reduced because we had always bought the most coverage we could get — someething ObamaCare prohibited. Should I call Obama evil because he did that?

    DRJ (2e4ac4)

  59. Uh oh, one of the dumb nicknames I just listed (@60) must have triggered the moderation filter. I’ll guess it’s the one the left used ubiquitously for Bush 43. Since the mods are on secret mission (for values of “mission” that equal “yacht”), I won’t ask that the comment be retrieved. I’ll just try again with the likely suspect redacted and see how that goes.

    lurker (cd7cd4)

  60. @41 he is evil. He hurts people for political gain.

    If you believe that, then make that argument. Silly pejorative neologisms, whether it’s Desatan, MSDNC, tRump, Shrillary, or [Bush + Hitler], are just tribal signaling. All they do is announce that you have no interest in persuading anyone who doesn’t already agree with you.

    lurker (cd7cd4)

  61. Victory!

    lurker (cd7cd4)

  62. Insurrection in NYC!!

    Riots Erupt in NYC After Twitch Streamer Tells Millions of Followers to Meet at Union Square

    There is no indication as to whether or not the Twitch Streamer ever said “peacefully.”

    More:

    The New York Police Department (NYPD) “became aware at about 1:30 p.m of a crowd forming in Union Square. It was quickly determined that an influencer was posting on social media about showing up to Union Square. He was encouraging all of his followers to come to the park,” Chief of Department Jeff Maddrey said at a press conference.

    The crowd was swarmed when the influencer finally arrived at the park. Individuals in the park began to commit acts of violence towards the police and the public,” Maddrey said.

    Videos at the link.

    BuDuh (9a76cd)

  63. lurker (cd7cd4) — 8/4/2023 @ 6:12 pm

    This is pretty much why nk spends the majority of my time here behind the blocking script.

    BuDuh (9a76cd)

  64. “IF YOU GO AFTER ME, I’M COMING AFTER YOU!”
    –Donald J. Trump, 8/4/2023, one day after being instructed by the magistrate judge to not threaten witnesses

    SC Smith has responded, appropriately so, because we all know that Trump is a bully who will bully others to get what he wants.

    The special counsel just alerted the court to Trump’s threat-tweet in a motion asking the court for a protective order so it can begin providing discovery. There would be serious consequences for Trump if he violates the order. If he keeps it up, he’s got to end up in jail.

    Paul Montagu (d52d7d)

  65. He can be placed in home confinement with direct access to the outside cut off. There’s a lot to like about that.

    Kevin M (ed969f)

  66. I find I’ve got no one on the blocking script these days.

    Kevin M (ed969f)

  67. I try to give news that is outside the conservative bubble that you might not be getting.

    There is no “conservative bubble” — the entire world seems dead set on echoing mainstream “thought.” IF that’s why you are here asset, you are wasting everyone’s time. Near as I can tell, everyone here knows more about everything that you do.

    Kevin M (ed969f)

  68. Yes, if that person advances your preferred policies.

    Because if you cant get past that person, and withhold your support due to the person, then you just voted for the other party.

    This again. It is Trump’s supporters who are putting Trump before policy. If Trump were to fall in a hole or something, we could talk about policy again.

    The GOP has been hijacked since March of 2016. Maybe some of that hijacking was needed but the messenger just won’t shut up, as it has to be about HIM and not the actual message. Someday, after Trump is gone and the collaborators have been dealt with, the GOP can again focus on policy. But not until, and it’s NOT my choice.

    Kevin M (ed969f)

  69. then you just voted for the other party

    Shorter: so long as Trump is in play, there is only one party, and a cult.

    Kevin M (ed969f)

  70. @61 Desatan orders children to take off their protective masks for his political benefit. Arresting ex-felons who have served their time and voter approved reinstatement for political benefit. Harrasing gay teachers with don’t say gay bill and going after transsexuals again for political benefit. Trying to intimidate teachers while pushing racist history. I don’t live in floriduh I am sure those who do can ad many more doings to his evilness.

    asset (27e4d4)

  71. @68 No conservative bubble. Really? One day in Athens the sophists were arguing which one of them was the smartest and couldn’t decide. They decided to go to the oracle of delphi to them which one of them was the smartest. She told them it was socrates not them. They all laughed and said he goes around saying he doesn’t know anything! The orcle said that is why he is the smartest he knows he does not know and you think you do!

    asset (27e4d4)

  72. Yes, if that person advances your preferred policies.

    Because if you cant get past that person, and withhold your support due to the person, then you just voted for the other party.

    As long as the trains run on time……..

    Rip Murdock (b0912e)

  73. BuDuh (9a76cd) — 8/4/2023 @ 6:19 pm

    Twitch streamer arrested after ‘inciting a riot’ of thousands in Manhattan

    A popular social media streamer faced a charge of inciting a riot on Friday when an event at Manhattan’s Union Square Park where he planned to give away video game consoles descended into mayhem, drawing a crowd estimated at several thousand young people.

    In addition to the riot count, the livestreamer, Kai Carlo Cenat III, was expected to be charged with unlawful assembly and, potentially, other crimes, Jeffrey Maddrey, the Police Department’s chief of department, said at a news conference late Friday.
    ………

    Rip Murdock (b0912e)

  74. Because if you cant get past that person, and withhold your support due to the person, then you just voted for the other party.

    The people who support Trump cannot get past everyone besides Trump. They are the impasse.

    Kevin M (ed969f)

  75. @72 faced with facts and truth, you speak in riddles. Just like the oracle.

    A true-blue Trump fan eventually has to leave Trump Social and leave his house. Whereupon he is inundated with the MSM and all its (from their viewpoint) lies. NO ONE is faced with Fox if they refuse to turn that channel on.

    Kevin M (ed969f)

  76. Because if you cant get past that person, and withhold your support due to the person, then you just voted for the other party.

    That’s not necessarily true. For example, by not voting for Trump in California, you do not give your vote to the Democrats. The Democratic nominee has a mortal lock on California’s electoral votes given their registration advantage:

    Democratic 46.9%

    Republican 23.8

    No Party Preference 22.5

    Other 6.8

    Rip Murdock (b0912e)

  77. Actually voting for a candidate says that you want “more like this.” Voting for a libertarian candidate says the same. The effect might be that the Democrat needs one less vote to win, but you could have accomplished that by staying home.

    Voting LP, or for Santa Claus, might be a stupid and futile gesture, but it’s the only way to make certain gestures in the ballot booth.

    Kevin M (ed969f)

  78. Election Interference::

    A Texas man who suggested a “mass shooting of poll workers” and threatened two Maricopa County officials and their children was sentenced yesterday to three and a half years in federal prison, announced U.S. Attorney for the Northern District of Texas Leigha Simonton.

    Frederick Francis Goltz, 52, pleaded guilty in April to interstate threatening communications.……..
    ………..
    According to court documents, Mr. Goltz threatened several individuals in Arizona – including a Maricopa County Attorney’s Office lawyer and a Maricopa County elections official – on the far-right-wing social media platforms Patriots.win and Gab.com.

    In plea papers, Mr. Goltz admitted that on Nov. 21, 2022, he posted the lawyer’s name, purported home address, and purported telephone number on social media along with the sardonic comment, “It would be a shame if someone got to [sic] this children. There are some crazies out there. This kind of info shouldn’t be readily available on the internet.” On the same date, in response to another post referring to other Maricopa County officials, Mr. Goltz said, “Someone needs to get these people AND their children. The children are the most important message to send.”

    ………. When another user commented that kids should be “off limits,” Mr. Goltz responded by saying, “NOTHING is off limits. It’s people like you that are supposedly with us, who don’t have the stomach to do what it takes to get our country back.”
    …………
    ………… (A)ccording to court records, on Nov. 13, 2022, Mr. Goltz advocated for “a mass shooting of poll workers and election officials” in precincts he believed had “suspect” results.

    A few weeks later, he said he was “willing to take lives” in order to protect against what he called a “tyrannical government.”

    ………..Mr. Goltz repeatedly emphasized that “children are not off limits,” and said that going after children is important because “it sends a message… people will pay the price for ‘sins of the father.’ Dead children burn into the memories of people.” He also discussed the potential use of concealed firearms.
    ………….

    Rip Murdock (b0912e)

  79. Wait, what!?

    Canada Minister unhappy that Facebook is following Canada’s new law.

    Meta, the company behind Facebook and Instagram, has started blocking news articles on its social networking services in Canada.

    The change, in response to a new law in Canada that requires tech companies to pay news outlets for using their content, will roll out “over the course of the next few weeks,” Meta said in a blog post on Tuesday. Content posted on Facebook and Instagram by both local Canadian news outlets and international outlets will not be visible to Canadians using the platforms.

    Canada passed the Online News Act in June, joining a push by numerous governments to force big social media companies to compensate news organizations. The Canadian bill requires the platforms and search engines to negotiate with news publishers to license their content.

    Instead, Meta will do exactly what it said they would do: Go Galt.

    Pascale St-Onge, the country’s minister for Canadian heritage, described Meta’s actions as “irresponsible.”

    “They would rather block their users from accessing good quality and local news instead of paying their fair share to news organizations,” Ms. St-Onge said in a statement on Twitter.

    Ms. St-Onge said the Canadian government would stand its ground with the new legislation…

    Google has also said it plans to remove links to local Canadian news content.

    Kevin M (ed969f)

  80. It’s pretty terrible when people announce the unintended consequences and you pass the stupid law anyway. COmplainging after the fact is just whiny. But that’s mostly what the “Minister for Canadian Culture” job implies.

    Kevin M (ed969f)

  81. Election Interference II:

    ………..
    Tyler Jay Marshall, 36, (of Enid, OK) pleaded guilty to the interstate transmission of threatening communications against various government officials, U.S. Attorney Robert J. Troester announced.

    In addition to (Gov. Kevin) Stitt, Marshall tweeted threats to Florida Gov. Ron DeSantis, U.S. Sen. Ted Cruz and Arkansas Gov. Sarah Huckabee Sanders.
    ………..
    In response to a Mother’s Day post by Stitt, which included photos of the governor’s mother, wife and daughters, Marshall allegedly replied with threats to shoot them, and bring guns to events where Stitt would be speaking.
    ………..
    After a DeSantis tweet decrying diversity, equity and inclusiveness in higher education, Marshall replied, “I’ll see you dead in your home.”
    ………..
    Prosecutors said Marshall replied to Sanders, the Arkansas governor:

    “Can’t wait to murder your family. See you soon.”
    #########
    Marshall faces up to five years in prison and a $250,000 fine.

    Rip Murdock (b0912e)

  82. Canada has no culture, eh?

    Rip Murdock (b0912e)

  83. Marshall faces up to five years in prison and a $250,000 fine.

    Hunter Biden would have got probation and a “friend” would have paid the fine.

    That’s not whaddaboutism, that’s straight up cynicism.

    Kevin M (ed969f)

  84. Imagine if Trump advocated a Department of Culture, to clean up the swamp in Hollywood.

    Kevin M (ed969f)

  85. That’s not whaddaboutism, that’s straight up cynicism.

    Kevin M (ed969f) — 8/5/2023 @ 10:47 am

    HBDS

    Rip Murdock (af637b)

  86. Imagine if Trump advocated a Department of Culture, to clean up the swamp in Hollywood.

    Kevin M (ed969f) — 8/5/2023 @ 10:49 am

    LOL! Trump can propose anything he wants (and he has) but whether they constitutional (like your suggestion would not) is another question.

    Rip Murdock (af637b)

  87. HBDS

    MSMDS

    Kevin M (ed969f)

  88. Emerson College Michigan 2024 Primary Poll

    ……..
    In the 2024 Democratic Primary, 65% of Democratic primary voters plan to support Biden for the Democratic nomination, while 11% support Robert Kennedy Jr., and 5% support Marianne Williamson. Seventeen percent are undecided.

    Sixty-one percent (61%) of Republican Primary voters plan to support former President Donald Trump for the 2024 nomination. Thirteen percent support Florida Governor Ron DeSantis, 7% former Vice President Mike Pence, 4% entrepreneur Vivek Ramaswamy, 3% former US Ambassador to the UN and South Carolina Governor Nikki Haley, and 2% support Senator Tim Scott. Six percent are undecided.

    A hypothetical 2024 Presidential match-up between President Biden and former President Trump is statistically even, each candidate receives 44%. Eight percent would vote for someone else and 5% are undecided.

    When Green Party candidate Cornel West is added to the ballot, Trump receives 43%, Biden 41%, West 4%, and 4% support someone else. Seven percent are undecided upon West’s addition to the ballot test.
    ………..
    In the Republican Senate Primary, 68% are either undecided (29%) or would vote for someone other than the candidates listed. The only candidate with double digit support is former Rep. Mike Rogers with 12%.
    ……….
    In a series of hypothetical trial heats between Democratic Rep. Elissa Slotkin and Michigan Republicans, Slotkin leads former Rep. Peter Meijer 42% to 36%, Nikki Snyder 44% to 36%, and John Tuttle 45% to 35%. James Craig who has not announced was included and trailed 45% to 38%.
    ……….

    Full results.

    Rip Murdock (af637b)

  89. Welcome to the Big Leagues:

    ………
    Throughout his decades in the public eye, West, who is an academic at elite institutions and a bestselling author, has blasted the concentration of wealth at the top of U.S. society. Since announcing his run for president, first on the People’s Party ticket and currently on the Green Party’s, he has argued that taxes on the wealthiest Americans need to be “higher, much higher.”

    But West hasn’t been putting his money where his mouth is—literally. An investigation by The Daily Beast, published Thursday, found that West owes $543,778.78 in unpaid taxes.…….

    The IRS has filed liens against West for the years 2005, 2014, 2015, 2016, and 2017, when he failed to pay anywhere from more than $62,000 to nearly $137,000 in taxes. The liens, or federal claims against property for unpaid debts, are all still open.

    …………(West) denied that he hadn’t paid his taxes and said his accountant would provide more information. The accountant never reached out.

    This is apparently not new behavior for West. By 2004, he had accumulated $724,397.26 in liens over the previous six years. He didn’t pay the balance until 2010. In 2012, he paid $34,069.93 in taxes owed for the year 2008.
    …………
    West also has yet to pay a 2003 child support payment of $49,500.
    …………

    Presidential politics ain’t bean bag.

    Rip Murdock (af637b)

  90. Manhattan Institute Poll 8/3/23

    Throughout July, the Manhattan Institute polled representative samples of likely 2024 Republican presidential primary and caucus voters in three key states: Iowa (639 respondents), New Hampshire (704 respondents), and South Carolina (707 respondents). ……….(T)he survey dug into influential early-state Republicans’ feelings about the presidential field and the policies that will shape the nominating contest.

    The results paint a picture of a primary electorate that is more conservative on newer cultural debates revolving around race and gender than it is on perennial social issues such as abortion and gun rights, despite the latter pair of issues still looming larger as a part of GOP identity. ………

    Consistent with other polling, our results suggest that the 2024 nomination is Donald Trump’s to lose. ………
    ………..

    Trump (IA: 42%, SC: 43%, NH: 44%) holds a commanding lead over the GOP field with DeSantis in second place (IA: 17%, SC: 21%, NH: 13%). The third and fourth place positions vary from state to state. Tim Scott (IA: 10%, SC: 11%, NH: 7%) and Nikki Haley (IA: 5%, SC: 8%, NH: 7%) hold the next two slots in their home state of South Carolina, but Chris Christie (IA: 4%, SC: 3%, NH: 11%) and Vivek Ramaswamy (IA: 6%, SC: 4%, NH: 8%) are better positioned in New Hampshire.

    Many voters say they may change their mind: 44% of voters in Iowa, 38% in South Carolina, and 50% in New Hampshire are not sure whether they will ultimately support their first-choice candidate at this stage in the race.

    Trump supporters, however, are much firmer in their commitment to their choice than are supporters of any other candidate. Between 75%–78% of Trump supporters in each state say they will definitely back him. ………

    In a head-to-head race between Trump and DeSantis, the race tightens but Trump retains an edge—by 11% in Iowa, 12% in South Carolina, and 4% in New Hampshire. DeSantis beats Trump by a wide margin in drawing support from voters backing other candidates in the field.

    On the question of who has the best chance to beat President Joe Biden, Trump’s lead narrows once again with primary voters. He edges DeSantis on electability by 5% in Iowa, 6% in South Carolina, and 2% in New Hampshire.
    …………
    In all states polled, DeSantis and Scott lead Trump in net favorability scores among GOP voters, but Trump also scores the highest percentage of “very favorable” responses. ………
    …………
    Trump supporters are disproportionately non-college educated, very conservative, focused on election integrity and guns, and surprisingly female. DeSantis supporters are disproportionately young, focused on issues like education, gender ideology, critical race theory, crime, and—perhaps most interesting—over-indexed on both “somewhat conservative” and “very conservative”.

    Scott supporters are disproportionately older, more moderate, religious, and focused on foreign policy. And Christie supporters are disproportionately moderate or liberal, independent, and do not attend church.
    ………..

    Paragraph breaks added. Figure references removed. Toplines and cross tabs at link.

    Rip Murdock (af637b)

  91. West also has yet to pay a 2003 child support payment of $49,500.
    …………

    Presidential politics ain’t bean bag.

    Rip Murdock (af637b) — 8/5/2023 @ 1:39 pm

    I now see two signs of grifting in West. In addition to running his mouth (which includes loving the sound of his own voice), his finances are in arrears.

    norcal (74a5a6)

  92. @90

    Too funny. It would be funnier still if we found out how much in arrears Congessfolk are.

    Kevin M (ed969f)

  93. Wouldn’t they also have to show that the leaked info in question was being presented as fact? If it was “here’s this info we got, some of it’s concerning and we think you should look into it but we can’t promise it’s true.” That would be a different thing.

    Sorry I didn’t back to this earlier.

    I agree with all you’ve said. They have the same problem with proving the knowing falsehood, and I’m sure that anyone trained in the law would cover their backside when presenting obvious lies as “concerning.”

    There would also be the issue of what the recipient believed. They too might be subject to the fraud stature (as interpreted in the Trump case) if they forwarded it on as “intelligence” when they knew (or had reason to believe) it was a pile of lies.

    In the end though, this is a widening of the law, as far as historical use is concerned. At some point it becomes muddy. Are we there yet?

    Kevin M (ed969f)

  94. (Vivek) Ramaswamy: I ‘don’t believe’ the 9/11 Commission report
    ………….
    In an interview Tuesday night on the conservative Blaze TV, host Alex Stein asked the Republican presidential candidate if he believes 9/11 was an “inside job” or “exactly like the government tells us.”

    “I don’t believe the government has told us the truth,” Ramaswamy said. ……..

    “I haven’t seen evidence to the contrary, but do I believe everything the government told us about it? Absolutely not. Do I believe the 9/11 Commission? Absolutely not.”

    ………..(A)fter a clip of the encounter was shared online by Blaze TV, Ramaswamy moved swiftly to insist he was referring to the Saudi Arabia government’s explanation of the attack.

    “Al-Qaeda clearly planned and executed the attacks, but we have never fully addressed who knew what in the Saudi government about it,” Ramaswamy wrote. “We *can* handle the TRUTH.”
    ………….
    Right before addressing 9/11, Ramaswamy was asked whether he believes America’s 1969 moon landing was real.

    “I have no evidence to suggest it was fake,” Ramaswamy said of the moon landing. “So I’m going to assume it was real.”
    ########

    Go on crackpot networks, get crackpot questions.

    Rip Murdock (af637b)

  95. @78 your right ;but wrong party analogy. Trump voters don’t care and traditional conservative voters pretty much vote economic libertarian policies anyway. Unless you mean dope issue. Every morning hillary clinton wakes up yelling damn you jill stein (green party) When I told the bernie bros in 2016 You lost this is my party! I run the party. How dare you tell me and the DNC that you will vote for jill stein instead of me!

    In 2020 joe biden said I got the nomination ;but I need your votes in az, ga, mich, pa. and wi. so when you AOC and the squad say jump I will ask how high?

    asset (e51380)

  96. Rip Murdock (af637b) — 8/5/2023 @ 5:01 pm

    In his responses to the 9/11 and moon landing questions, VR concedes he doesn’t have the evidence for either claim, yet assumes one is false (that the government has told the truth about 9/11) and the other is true (that man has landed on the moon.)

    Rip Murdock (af637b)

  97. 92, Allen, Kanye, Cornel….who’s the Fourth Horseman?

    urbanleftbehind (7da2d2)

  98. urbanleftbehind (7da2d2) — 8/5/2023 @ 5:31 pm

    RFK, Jr.-I’ll bet he runs as an independent backed by the Trump MAGA right. . Steve Bannon and Alex Jones are fans.

    Rip Murdock (af637b)

  99. Also, Trump called RFK Jr. a “very smart person.” That endorsement may not get him far in the Dem primaries, but it promises a bright future as dictator of a nuclear-armed enemy of the United States.

    lurker (cd7cd4)

  100. And in more news from the tip of the horseshoe, RFK Jr.’s biggest donor is a Trump supporter.

    lurker (cd7cd4)

  101. Allen, Kanye, Cornel….who’s the Fourth Horseman?

    urbanleftbehind (7da2d2) — 8/5/2023 @ 5:31 pm

    Jerry?

    norcal (e0cbb0)

  102. As I’ve said before, Trump and RFK, Jr. have much in common-both are conspiracy theorists and wannabe authoritarians. They would be a perfect bipartisan ticket. Even Steven Bannon agrees, though I disagree with his prediction.

    Rip Murdock (af637b)

  103. Comedy Gold!

    Florida governor and presidential candidate RON DeSANTIS has countered Gov. GAVIN NEWSOM’s proposed rules for their impending Fox News debate with a proposal of his own.…………
    ………….
    Both agree on some of the basics: (1) Hannity is the only person who can ask questions; (2) the debate will run 90 minutes; (3) staff can’t brief either governor once they have started; and (4) speaking time is to be equally divided between the two.

    Hannity has to make sure the “governors do not interrupt each other during their designated time to speak.” (Good luck with that!)
    …………
    DeSantis proposes no opening remarks; each governor can instead provide a two-minute video “to make the case for their governing philosophy” that would air before the program begins

    While Newsom proposed a mano-a-mano debate in an empty room, DeSantis wants a live audience, with tickets distributed “50-50.”
    …………

    More laughter:

    ………..
    “What a joke,” Newsom spokesperson Nathan Click said in a statement. “Desantis’ counterproposal is littered with crutches to hide his insecurity and ineptitude — swapping opening statements with a hype video, cutting down the time he needs to be on stage, adding cheat notes and a cheering section.”

    “Ron should be able to stand on his own two feet,” he added. “It’s no wonder Trump is kicking his ass.”
    ………….

    DeSantis needs to focus on why his polling numbers have fallen from 40% in January 2023 to 14% now, not rising to Newsom’s bait. Too late now.

    Rip Murdock (af637b)

  104. DeSantis polling January- August 1, 2023. His polling is the big line going down, down, down.

    Rip Murdock (af637b)

  105. (Vivek) Ramaswamy: I ‘don’t believe’ the 9/11 Commission report

    Yeah, this is case in point why the Presidency is NOT an entry-level position. Show us you are sane and normal in some lesser government office, preferably an executive position. I suppose the process is exposing his weirdness…but I’m losing faith in the primary process excluding dubiously-qualified individuals. It almost seems designed to elevate them in our drama-craving society. Weird and narcissistic is no longer disqualifying.

    AJ_Liberty (3e6148)

  106. I’m losing faith in the primary process excluding dubiously-qualified individuals.

    AJ_Liberty (3e6148) — 8/5/2023 @ 9:05 pm

    There is no process that will cure dumb voters.

    norcal (9cc43c)

  107. More cowbell?

    AJ_Liberty (3e6148)

  108. AJ_Liberty (3e6148) — 8/5/2023 @ 9:05 pm

    Ramaswamy has proposed changes to the Constitution reminiscent of Robert Heinlein’s Starship Troopers:

    Republican presidential hopeful Vivek Ramaswamy on (May 11, 2023) voiced support for changing the overall U.S. voting age to 25, unless younger Americans fulfill at least six months of service in the military or as a first responder — or pass the same citizenship test administered to those seeking to become naturalized citizens.
    ……….
    ……….. Ramaswamy said in his release that the “absence of national pride is a serious threat to the future of our country” and argued his proposal “can create a sense of shared purpose and responsibility amongst young Americans to become educated citizens.”
    ……………

    Rip Murdock (af637b)

  109. There is no process that will cure dumb voters.

    It’s not that they can’t be cured — stupid people die earlier. It’s Barnum’s 1st Law that’s the problem. Every minute.

    Kevin M (ed969f)

  110. But of course, they do so in a typical statist fashion:

    The law does not phase out full service completely in Oregon’s 16 most populous counties. It requires that no more than half of pumps at any service station be self-serve, and that at least one gas station employee in those communities be available at all times to pump gas. Stations cannot charge more for full service.

    Kevin M (ed969f)

  111. I’m losing faith in the primary process excluding dubiously-qualified individuals.

    AJ_Liberty (3e6148) — 8/5/2023 @ 9:05 pm

    There is no process that will cure dumb voters.

    norcal (9cc43c) — 8/5/2023 @ 9:18 pm

    Somebody agrees with you.

    lurker (cd7cd4)

  112. Somebody agrees with you.

    lurker (cd7cd4) — 8/5/2023 @ 11:08 pm

    Thanks, lurker. I’m not on Twitter. (Besides, I thought Patterico quit it. Guess he relapsed.)

    norcal (9cc43c)

  113. Yes he did and yes he did, the latter for which I’m grateful.

    lurker (cd7cd4)

  114. Here’s one with Casey’s husband promising to “end the weaponization of government”.

    LOL!

    nk (c05da1)

  115. All right, voters may be dumb. and Republican primary voters the dumbest, but DeSantis is really … no, no, wait, wait I got it: DeSantis is going for voters who never heard heard of him!

    nk (c05da1)

  116. Judge Chutkan rejected Trump’s effort to delay tomorrow’s hearing (caused by Trump’s “If you’re going after me, I’m coming after you!” public comment), and I think Jack Smith’s argument was persuasive.

    Rather than spend time complying with the Court’s order, the defendant drafted a filing as to why he did not have the time to review and consider the 5-page proposed protective order.

    Paul Montagu (d52d7d)

  117. “There is no process that will cure dumb voters.”

    Cure? Probably not. But is there a way to lessen their effects? Say, reduce the number of bad options. We hear some about rank choice voting or even returning to the smoke-filled rooms and allowing party leaders to at least winnow down the field to serious vetted candidates who have some minimalist credentials.

    I reject the notion that the chaos of 2016 was unavoidable and unpreventable…and in any way desirable. I also operate under the assumption that any simple solution is likely a wrong solution. Party leaders, however one wants to define them, should be allowed to structure their party’s nominating process to lessen the draw of populist demagogues and interlopers. We need less raw passion and more wisdom in the process. Certainly there was not a lot of wisdom at play in winnowing the field of 20-something down in 2016. Ultimately picking someone with no political experience, little depth of understanding of issues, and serious character questions shows a lot more emotionalism than test-of-time discernment.

    A field of 4 to 7 candidates is likely more than enough to span philosophical, ideological, end experiential differences (we’ll leave ethnic and other diversity differences to the Democrats) while giving voters some choice in personality and message. What’s a party for if not some minimal filtering? Someone like Ramaswamy is simply untested and unvetted.

    Now would this unnaturally deter bold mavericks and individuals desperately trying to change the direction of a foundering party? I’m not so sure. It does press those individuals to establish credibility by being a governor or at minimum getting elected to some statewide position. I hate to think that Twitter propagandist is sufficient status to highjack a party….

    AJ_Liberty (3e6148)

  118. Embrace the Chaos:

    …………
    Even as Speaker Kevin McCarthy and senior Republicans insist they won’t allow federal funding to lapse after Sept. 30, there’s rising angst within the party that its hard-right flank actually wants a shutdown. And even if Congress manages to pass a temporary spending patch to allow more time for negotiations, resistance from ultra-conservatives could make it extremely difficult to get anything close to a long-term spending deal.

    ……….(GOP) hardliners’ fierce determination to further cut spending has raised alarms among lawmakers in both parties that Congress could plunge into chaos for real this time.
    ……….
    The House GOP’s spending bills are already tens of billions of dollars lower than the targets of the debt deal negotiated by McCarthy and President Joe Biden, in addition to further savings that rely on billions of dollars in clawbacks known as “rescissions.” But many conservatives have panned those rescissions as a gimmick that doesn’t amount to real funding cuts, so they’re pressing to further slash those bills before September.

    Once they return from recess, House Republicans have 12 working days to try to pass 11 of their remaining bills before Sept. 30.
    …………
    “I don’t think we’ll have a shutdown,” said Rep. Mike Simpson (R-Idaho), who oversees funding for the Interior Department and EPA. “Because I think we’re smarter than that. As Republicans, it’s never been good policy or politics if we get blamed for it. Why would you go down that road?”

    But passing a stopgap with Democratic support will only further enrage McCarthy’s right flank, creating an even bigger headache for him………
    ………….
    Congress will almost certainly need that kind of short-term bill next month. McCarthy said last week that he would only entertain the idea if the House were “making progress” in spending talks with the Senate. Meanwhile, bicameral talks on appropriations bills have yet to begin, and vast spending and policy differences between both chambers will prove extremely difficult to reconcile.
    ………….
    “………(W)e are just … catering to the fringe. It’s just irritating,” (said centrist Rep. Don Bacon (R-Neb.).) “I feel like we’ve made a deal with the president. And yes, I would have liked to have had more cuts, but when you make a deal, you make a deal.”
    ………….

    If McCarthy folds and relies on Democrats to pass a stopgap budget measure (after promising not to do so), or if in the end supports a continuing resolution for the new FY, (again, after promising only to pass regular appropriation bills), he will certainly face a motion to vacate, which under House rules requires only one member to submit.

    Rip Murdock (af637b)

  119. Mr. Former President Donald Trump, who could have been the girl next door but the gametes were rigged and stolen, is pretty secure in the unlikelihood that he will ever go to prison.

    All it’s costing him is money.

    And it’s all free money from other people.

    nk (c05da1)

  120. AJ_Liberty (3e6148) — 8/6/2023 @ 6:44 am

    Here is a good analysis of deliberate weakening of political parties and what might be done to strengthen them.

    But it won’t happen because it would weaken too many outside interests.

    Rip Murdock (af637b)

  121. Another good entry from Volokh Conspiracy, this one quoting Walter Olson and Lawfare at length about the four counts against Trump.

    Also, Jack E. Smith has a Twitter account. It’s a good thing.

    Paul Montagu (d52d7d)

  122. @123, yeah NR’s “rushed” defense is being expertly deconstructed. A conclusion that all types of fraud required a financial element seemed wrong from the get go. Glad to see VC is in the game.

    AJ_Liberty (3e6148)

  123. I don’t know how “prominent” Richard Hanania is, but he’s been praised by right-wingers like Tucker Carlson and Peter Thiel. Now it turns out that he hid his racism under pseudonym, supporting eugenics, antisemitism and such.

    Paul Montagu (d52d7d)

  124. Ukrainians finally replaced the hammer-and-sickle on their Motherland statue with a Ukrainian coat-of-arms.

    In Odesa, instead of taking down and destroying the Lenin statue, they modified it. After all, Lenin killed four to eight million souls under one Soviet rule and the career of one American journalist.

    Paul Montagu (d52d7d)

  125. Republican primary voters the dumbest

    Here I disagree. The Trumpists may be stubborn in following this dolt since other candidates have taken up the cause, but there are a sizable number of young Socialists in the Democrat primaries and you have to be really really stupid to be Socialist at the start of your tax-paying years.

    Kevin M (ed969f)

  126. I reject the notion that the chaos of 2016 was unavoidable and unpreventable…and in any way desirable.

    A party that prevents correction when it is on the wrong track is a part that is doomed to destruction. Populism, like forest fires, is a necessary part of a healthy system.

    Kevin M (ed969f)

  127. Nikki Haley says if Trump accusations are true, it’s “incredibly dangerous to our national security”

    Former U.N. Ambassador Nikki Haley said in an interview with “Face the Nation” that if the new accusations made against former President Donald Trump are true, “it’s incredibly dangerous to our national security.”

    Haley, a candidate for the Republican presidential nomination, wouldn’t say if she trusted the Department of Justice herself, but promised that if she becomes president, she would “clean it up from the top.”
    ………..
    When Margaret Brennan asked Haley about two of the new obstruction counts in the (Espionage Act) indictment relating to alleged efforts by Trump to have the director of information technology at Mar-a-Lago delete security camera footage sought by a federal grand jury, Haley said, “none of that sounds good.”

    Haley also stressed her desire to “move forward” and stop discussing the multiple indictments against Trump at the federal and state levels, comparing the situation at hand to President Gerald Ford’s pardon of Richard Nixon.
    …………
    “We can’t keep living with indictments and court cases and vengeance of the past,” said Haley. “We’ve got to start going forward. American people are not talking about these indictments.”
    ######## .

    Darling Nikki still straddling.

    Rip Murdock (af637b)

  128. Fair points Catoggio, but I’d rather see the Trump trials, and other federal trials, televised.

    Paul Montagu (d52d7d)

  129. The Reason for the DeSantis Decline?

    ………..
    The term has become a quick way for candidates to flash their conservative credentials, but battling “woke” may have less political potency than they think. Though conservative voters might be irked at modern liberalism, successive New York Times/Siena College polls of Republican voters nationally and then in Iowa found that candidates were unlikely to win votes by narrowly focusing on rooting out left-wing ideology in schools, media, culture and business.

    Instead, Republican voters are showing a “hands off” libertarian streak in economics, and a clear preference for messages about “law and order” in the nation’s cities and at its borders.
    …………
    The findings hint why Mr. DeSantis, who has made his battles with “woke” schools and corporations central to his campaign, is struggling and again show off Mr. Trump’s keen understanding of part of the Republican electorate. Campaigning in Iowa in June, Mr. Trump was blunt: “I don’t like the term ‘woke,’” he said, adding, “It’s just a term they use — half the people can’t even define it, they don’t know what it is.”
    ………..
    When presented with the choice between two hypothetical Republican candidates, only 24 percent of national Republican voters opted for a “a candidate who focuses on defeating radical ‘woke’ ideology in our schools, media and culture” over “a candidate who focuses on restoring law and order in our streets and at the border.”

    Around 65 percent said they would choose the law and order candidate.

    Among those 65 and older, often the most likely age bracket to vote, only 17 percent signed on to the “anti-woke” crusade. …….
    ………….
    …………. About 38 percent of Republican voters said they would back a candidate who promised to fight corporations that promote “woke” left ideology, versus the 52 percent who preferred “a candidate who says that the government should stay out of deciding what corporations should support.”
    ………….
    ………….(S)ome Republican voters seemed to feel pandered to by candidates like Mr. DeSantis and the entrepreneur Vivek Ramaswamy, whose book “Woke Inc.: Inside Corporate America’s Social Justice Scam,” launched his political career.
    …………
    For candidates trying to break Mr. Trump’s hold on a Republican electorate that sees the former president as the embodiment of strength, the problem may be broader than ditching the term “woke.”

    ………… The fact that Mr. Trump has been indicted three times and found legally liable for sexual abuse has not hurt him. Only 37 percent of Republican voters nationally described Mr. Trump as more moral than Mr. DeSantis (45 percent sided with Mr. DeSantis on the personality trait), yet in a head-to-head matchup between the two candidates, national Republican voters backed Mr. Trump by 31 percentage points, 62 percent to 31 percent.
    ………….

    Rip Murdock (af637b)

  130. Darling Nikki still straddling.

    In saying that we have to take care of business and not dwell in recrimination and blame, she’s spot on. Democrats, of course, want the GOP to spend all its time on infighting. And apparently some Republicans.

    I doubt that anyone in the GOP is unaware of the damage that Trump has done, and continues to do. Some are still in favor, but that number is decreasing and will be marginalized in time. He will not be the nominee.

    The object of her campaign (and several others) is to wean GOP voters off the Trump teat. You can’t do that by attacking them and their values — it may be pleasing to the spectators, but it’s useless to the party. Instead you have to offer them another way forward.

    Whether Haley is doing that is another matter. DeSantis tried to be “Trump with Brains” but he failed at both aspects. Maybe the kinder, gentler approach will work, maybe not.

    Kevin M (ed969f)

  131. @131

    Then who? There’s not a lot of Libertarian in the current lot of nominees. We could really use a man like Ronald Reagan again. Those were the days.

    Kevin M (ed969f)

  132. Fair points Catoggio, but I’d rather see the Trump trials, and other federal trials, televised.

    Given that Trump’s followers distrust the media, restricting their access to MSM filtered information will not work well. Instead you will have massive misinformation, conspiracy and disaffection running rampant. Only an unfiltered view into the proceedings has even the slightest hope of eventual acceptance.

    The 6th Amendment says that trials must be public. In a nation of 350 million, with near-universal access to video information, does a courtroom with 100 seats actually satisfy that requirement? Restricting public access to 18th century possibilities seems inconsistent with modern constitutional doctrine.

    Kevin M (ed969f)

  133. The object of her campaign (and several others) is to wean GOP voters off the Trump teat.

    And that is working out so well. Wishing that Trump will just “go away” hasn’t happened yet and is unlikely won’t work in the future when so many of the candidates make excuses for him. Darling Nikki and others who say “if it’s true then it’s bad” but then decry the “weaponization” of the FBI/DOJ (or express a lack of trust) or promise to consider a pardon are still trying to have it both ways.

    Most of the Republican field have implicitly backed Trump, which hasn’t benefited them in polling; it only allows them to avoid being attacked by Trump.

    Rip Murdock (af637b)

  134. Darling Nikki

    This remains more than a little bit sexist.

    Kevin M (ed969f)

  135. Then who?

    The Republican field is pretty much set. Reagan’s politics are dead. There is no point living in the past. You play with the cards you are dealt.

    Rip Murdock (af637b)

  136. Darling Nikki

    This remains more than a little bit sexist.

    Kevin M (ed969f) — 8/6/2023 @ 11:28 am

    How woke. 😉

    Rip Murdock (af637b)

  137. “Populism, like forest fires, is a necessary part of a healthy system.”

    Populism doesn’t correct anything. A lot of the times it’s a temper tantrum. It’s surrendering the car keys to the 8yr-old and hoping for a happy ending. Populism is less about policy….there can be populists on the left or the right…than about style and rhetoric. Populism generally fails because:

    1. National problems are complex and populists generally posit simplistic solutions that appeal to people’s emotions.

    2. Populism channels rage which leads to existential thinking which forecloses compromise. Rage tends to work against rational thinking and leads people to be trapped in #1.

    3. Populism requires messianic leadership where the rhetoric focuses instead of on ideas but on the greatness of that leader. No one but that leader understands the problem and can realize the solution. It enables a cult of personality. The 2020 GOP didn’t even bother with a platform…whatever Trump wanted is fine.

    4. Populism always needs convenient scapegoats including elites, foreigners, and the rich. There’s always a claim that someone is getting something over on the average Joe (no, not that Joe). It’s never bad choices or bad luck. It leads to conspiracy thinking and avoiding hard realities.

    5. Populism tries to give people what they want versus what the nation needs. Right now, a lot of Republicans want their representatives to engage in a lot of accusations about election fraud. What the nation needs is for Republicans to honestly discuss the issue and instill confidence in the electoral system. This reinforcing of populist fear, anger, and mistrust makes the political system toxic and fosters unrest and the potential for insurrection, as leaders lie without account.

    6. Populism sets up us vs them, which again is anathema to the compromise intentionally built into our democratic system. It’s MAGA versus those that ostensibly want to make America worse. A majority of voters likely did not want Muslims banned from the country but we’re sold that this is what “the people” want. Populism sticks us with assertions that may in fact not be that popular…but if it’s sold as anti-elite or against the establishment, then it assumes a tribal mantle.

    The GOP could very well have been ideologically mired in the 2000’s. An unpopular war, a housing collapse, the stress of globalization, and the rise of an enigmatic liberal President. Social media intensified every bias and prejudice we had and weaponized it. We were suddenly in everyone else’s business 24/7. I adamantly believe this was no reason to try and burn everything down with Trump. That’s the 5yr-old throwing the tantrum in the middle of the grocery store candy aisle. That’s no controlled burn….

    AJ_Liberty (5f05c3)

  138. Twitter still has an URL that starts twitter.com and the postings are still called tweet, but there’s a big X on the screen.,

    Elon Musk was a founder of X.com years ago, which was a predecessor of PayPal

    In fact, for many years, typing X+Ctrl-Enter was a shortcut to PayPal

    Sammy Finkelman (598e7c)

  139. “Most of the Republican field have implicitly backed Trump, which hasn’t benefited them in polling; it only allows them to avoid being attacked by Trump.”

    I give it to mid October. At least one more indictment, a debate, trial momentum gaining, and reality crashing down. You might be right that the die has been cast and the party is diving headlong into the nomination abyss. But if that’s true, does it really matter that much what Nikki says? I don’t see Christie, Hutchinson, or Hurd breaking out of the low single digits by unambiguously attacking Trump. I sense Haley and Scott…and maybe DeSantis…are shrewd enough to see their internal data and reasonable know what isn’t going to work. It’s ghastly, but maybe the call is to put it in Jack Smith’s and Judge Chutkan’s hands and hope for the best. I want candidates to lead and tell the truth, but the electorate is who the electorate is….

    There is no magic op ed or blog comment that will solve a GOP cult problem if that ends up being the reality.

    So rather than give into despair, I rather have some hope and simultaneously prepare for disappointment. Trump/Biden 2 will be awful on many levels, but life itself marches on. I’ve long ago accepted that you can’t always get what you want, but you get what you need. Oh yeah….

    AJ_Liberty (5f05c3)

  140. The political system gets what it deserves?

    Sammy Finkelman (598e7c)

  141. How woke.

    Perhaps, but “misogynistic” is worse.

    Kevin M (ed969f)

  142. From the Week, Aug. 11, page 8: The son of the president of Columbia has ben indicted by Columbian prosecutors for taking money from drug dealers

    At least some ($150,000) was taken from a politician who had been convicted in Washington of drug dealing.. It was intended for his father’s 2022 presidential campaign, but his ex-wife says, he pocketed it..

    His father, President Gustavo Petro, says of his son Nicolas Petro, “I hope he can reflect on his mistakes.” (A translation, I suppose)

    His ex-wife has also been arrested and charged with money laundering but both she and him deny it

    Sammy Finkelman (598e7c)

  143. AJ,

    It will take a preference cascade, just like the 2016 nomination did. Once people realize that their friends are backing away from Trump, it will be a quick move to the exits.

    Or it will never happen. One or the other.

    Who benefits? Those that were resolutely anti-Trump (Christie, Hutchinson) or those that straddled? Hard to say, but the mini-Trumps will be lost in the wreckage.

    Or all of them, though, I think that Christie would make the better president.

    Kevin M (ed969f)

  144. I want candidates to lead and tell the truth, but the electorate is who the electorate is….

    The electorate has the bit between its teeth and is not wanting leaders so much as advocates.

    Kevin M (ed969f)

  145. Comedy Gold!

    ……….
    “There is no way I can get a fair trial with the judge ‘assigned’ to the ridiculous freedom of speech/fair elections case. Everybody knows this, and so does she!” Trump wrote on Truth Social about Judge Tanya Chutkan, an appointee of former President Barack Obama who has also been prone to give some of the lengthiest sentences for Jan. 6 defendants.

    Trump continued, “We will be immediately asking for recusal of this judge on very powerful grounds, and likewise for venue change, out [of] D.C.” ……..

    “Deranged Jack Smith… could have brought this [Biden] ‘opponent’ case years ago, but chose to wait and bring it right in the middle of my election campaign. No way!!! I hope you are watching America,” Trump wrote.
    …………
    His Sunday morning Truth Social post comes as his lawyer John Lauro rejected the possibility of the former president accepting a plea deal. Lauro also pledged that Trump’s team plans to seek a motion to dismiss the charges and said that he believes West Virginia would be an “excellent venue to try this case.”

    ………..(Lauro also) said, “In 40 years of practicing law, on a case of this magnitude, I’ve not known a single case to go to trial before 2-3 years.
    ##########

    Trump should be prepared to be disappointed. Just being a judge appointed by the opposing party aren’t grounds for recusal. She was confirmed on a 95-0 vote, including by such radicals as John Cronyn and Lindsey Graham.

    Rip Murdock (b83512)

  146. I’m generally watching America. It’s sometimes disappointing, but rarely boring.

    😛

    Nic (896fdf)

  147. ABC News/Ipsos Poll 8/4/23

    …………
    Overall, 65% of adults think the charges are serious, including 51% who said they are very serious and 14% who said they are somewhat serious.

    Only 24% said they are not serious, including 17% who said they are not serious at all.

    Just over half — 52% — think Trump should have been charged with a crime in this case, while 32% said he should not have been. And a plurality of Americans (49%) said Trump should suspend his presidential campaign, while 36% said he shouldn’t.
    …………..
    These results show that the public believes the latest charges are more serious than those in two other indictments……….
    …………..
    The poll results fall along predictable partisan lines, with only 19% of Republicans thinking the latest charges are very serious, compared with 84% of Democrats and 53% of independents.

    The result among the politically important independent group shows an 11-point increase in the number who consider the current indictment very serious compared to the (Espionage Act) indictment…………
    ………….

    Rip Murdock (b83512)

  148. DeSantis camp hit by Gloom as aides worry race is slipping away
    …………
    Several aides believe the Republican candidate’s bid lacks a coherent strategy and message, according to people familiar with the campaign. The operation is disorganized, with different teams pursuing their own agendas, and little communication between groups, said the people familiar, who requested anonymity to discuss the campaign’s inner workings.

    Even posting an official message on X, the platform formerly called Twitter, is rife with bureaucracy, according to people briefed on the communications strategy. The governor and his wife, Casey DeSantis, must personally approve many of the messages — a process that can take two days and can slow their ability to respond to campaign developments, they said.
    …………
    “The reset hasn’t exactly stopped him from making one unforced error after the other,” said Whit Ayres, a GOP pollster who worked on DeSantis’s successful 2018 gubernatorial race.

    “His issue is he just has a hard time dealing with people. He does not trust anyone other than his wife, Casey. You get this feedback loop between the two of them that no one can be trusted,” added Ayres………
    …………
    One problem is that the campaign has failed to articulate why Republican voters should back DeSantis over Trump, according to allies and strategists. In focus groups, voters tell top DeSantis aides they want Trump for the nominee, even if they like DeSantis.
    ………….
    ………… Donors and allies are urging the governor to stop talking so extensively about his record in Florida and culture war fights and broaden his message to appeal to the concerns of voters in places like Iowa.
    ………..
    ………….(A)t three appearances in rural Iowa last Thursday, DeSantis relied on his Florida-centric stump speech, even as voters at the events said they wanted to hear him talk about the war in Ukraine, education, ethanol policy and immigration.
    ……….

    Rip Murdock (b83512)

  149. AJ_Liberty (5f05c3) — 8/6/2023 @ 12:09 pm

    That is a magnificent critique of populism.

    AJ, I suspect you are a professional political writer who likes to dabble anonymously on a small blog. Prove it isn’t so!

    Anyway, we are lucky to have you.

    norcal (468005)

  150. DeSantis is not going to get the top Republican political campaign guns. Nobody who is running against Trump is. They’re too afraid of stepping on the toes of the Trump political establishment. And he is right not to trust the second-stringers he can get. Not their competence and not their loyalty.

    But that’s not really his problem. His problem is that he is a small and nasty person and the more he shows himself the more it shows.

    nk (bb1548)

  151. I don’t think it has much to do with “offending” Trump. Why should top campaign talent work for someone who is a control freak and doesn’t listen to anyone except his wife?

    Rip Murdock (b83512)

  152. They won’t be offending only Trump. They will also be offending all of Trump’s remoras who are their bread and butter.

    Matt Bevin had the same problem when he challenged Mitch McConnell in the 2014 Kentucky primary. He became persona non grata with the GOP establishment campaign consultants.

    nk (bb1548)

  153. Republican primary voters the dumbest

    Here I disagree. The Trumpists may be stubborn in following this dolt since other candidates have taken up the cause, but there are a sizable number of young Socialists in the Democrat primaries and you have to be really really stupid to be Socialist at the start of your tax-paying years.

    Kevin M (ed969f) — 8/6/2023 @ 9:37 am

    Voter for voter, dumb Democrat voters may or may not be as dumb as dumb Republican voters, but as a group there’s no contest. The Republicans nominated Trump twice, and now that he’s under multiple indictments they seem determined to do it again. Until Democrats actually nominate a comparably fringe candidate, GOP primary voters as a group are manifestly dumber.

    lurker (cd7cd4)

  154. Populism doesn’t correct anything. A lot of the times it’s a temper tantrum. It’s surrendering the car keys to the 8yr-old and hoping for a happy ending. Populism is less about policy….there can be populists on the left or the right…than about style and rhetoric. Populism generally fails because:

    The elites stick their fingers in their ears and pretend they cannot hear that they FUC*ED UP and that they need to change their approach.

    It is the not the reaction of willful children, but of . Hitting them again and telling them to STFU is eventually not going to work.

    A populist revolt does not come out of thin air. Populism is what happens in a democratic system when a sizable portion of the population is up against the wall. It’s not a “tantrum” by willful children (my God, could you not find something more elitist and authoritarian to say?), but an frustrated lashing out by repeatedly abused children.

    It is people who would rather do ANYTHING else than politics who find that their very existence requires it. It takes an amazing amount of bad governance and sh1tty ends of sticks to get them to that point. Usually, some portion of the political class notices soon enough and finds away to focus the anger.

    Ronald Reagan was a populist president. He just wasn’t a buffoon and he had an agenda of “simplistic solutions” (e.g. open markets, low taxes, strong defense). He was able to lead the mob rather than just scamper in front of it like Trump.

    The problem this time was that the “responsible” leaders that AJ seems to favor tried to suppress the rising anger, and failed to deal with the complaints. Instead they sent the IRS after the mob — in a “spare the rod, spoil the child” kind of way — and did everything possible to prevent populist politicians from getting near power.

    And so they found Trump. The longer it takes, the blunter the instrument…

    Kevin M (ed969f)

  155. * It is the not the reaction of willful children, but of abused children. Hitting them again and telling them to STFU is eventually not going to work.

    Kevin M (ed969f)

  156. I so miss the preview

    Kevin M (ed969f)

  157. Until Democrats actually nominate a comparably fringe candidate

    Well, McGovern was pretty terrible. One of his campaign issues was opposing “alphabetism.”

    Kevin M (ed969f)

  158. On Megan Rapinoe.

    Her legacy should be tarnished. Her last acts were those of a 16th place loser. Like it or not, your last few games matter. What really matters is how the leadership role ended with a thud. Rapinoe’s skills had clearly eroded over the last 4 years, so her primary role was leadership… she failed that abysmally

    steveg (3e08eb)

  159. “AJ, I suspect you are a professional political writer who likes to dabble anonymously on a small blog. Prove it isn’t so!”

    norcal you’re way too kind…I’m a dabbler….I think it helps me process the awfulness that is our politics these days.

    I do want to recall an interesting story from my days haunting Volokh Conspiracy. There was a period during the Obamacare NFIB case days where interaction was particularly engaging. Lots of theories were being debated but there was an unusual amount of good faith. A lot of lawyers and at least one judge were participating. Trolls were at bay.

    Fascinating because you would learn a lot….just digging into the opinions and supporting briefs and processing the commentariat’s arguments… and it really did help me see both sides much better. But the judge was anonymous except that she said enough about herself that I actually figured out who she was. Obviously I did not reveal it because she was a great commenter and decent individual, though we disagreed but cordially (I probably did needle her about being an amateur singer…and doing an impressive Cass Elliot). But it’s one of those things where you never know who is out there.

    Maybe one of these days Patterico will have a get together. I think VC did this though I’m not sure if they have done it recently. It has the potential of being quite amusing….

    AJ_Liberty (0151de)

  160. Well, McGovern was pretty terrible.

    1972 Democrats were dumber than 1972 Republicans. What does that have to do with 2023?

    lurker (cd7cd4)

  161. In detail, AJ:

    Populism doesn’t correct anything. A lot of the times it’s a temper tantrum. It’s surrendering the car keys to the 8yr-old and hoping for a happy ending. Populism is less about policy….there can be populists on the left or the right…than about style and rhetoric. Populism generally fails because:

    1. National problems are complex and populists generally posit simplistic solutions that appeal to people’s emotions.

    They posit simplistic solutions because the people are fed up with navel-gazing politicians who cannot get past the smallest nuance. Yes, solving a problem completely is hard, but solving it mostly is often not. Take the homeless problem. Please.

    Populism is never the first reaction to governmental inaction, but the very frustrated last reaction to inertia, often an inertia that serves the governing class.

    2. Populism channels rage which leads to existential thinking which forecloses compromise. Rage tends to work against rational thinking and leads people to be trapped in #1.

    The rage is already there. It comes from a “long train of abuses” that do not seem to have an end. Rage may well work against rationality, but “rationality” hasn’t been working up to that point anyway. You cannot discuss this in a vacuum; it takes incredibly poor leadership to get to this point.

    3. Populism requires messianic leadership where the rhetoric focuses instead of on ideas but on the greatness of that leader. No one but that leader understands the problem and can realize the solution. It enables a cult of personality. The 2020 GOP didn’t even bother with a platform…whatever Trump wanted is fine.

    This is patently false. It CAN lead to that, but in our history it generally doesn’t. Jackson, Lincoln, TR, FDR and Reagan all led popular “revolutions.” It was Donald Trump this time because no one else stepped up. That’s actual greatness 4-2. Note that Jackson and Trump didn’t solve much, but the others did. A cult of personality is merely a pretense of greatness.

    4. Populism always needs convenient scapegoats including elites, foreigners, and the rich. There’s always a claim that someone is getting something over on the average Joe (no, not that Joe). It’s never bad choices or bad luck. It leads to conspiracy thinking and avoiding hard realities.

    Again, it CAN include that, but Lincoln, TR, FDR and Reagan did not resort to that. This is mostly pejorative on your part, not argument.

    5. Populism tries to give people what they want versus what the nation needs. Right now, a lot of Republicans want their representatives to engage in a lot of accusations about election fraud. What the nation needs is for Republicans to honestly discuss the issue and instill confidence in the electoral system. This reinforcing of populist fear, anger, and mistrust makes the political system toxic and fosters unrest and the potential for insurrection, as leaders lie without account.

    The election fraud claim was never part of the movement that elected Trump. It is an outgrowth of the full-court-press that the Establishment threw up to block Trump once elected. The peaceful transition of power was already badly damaged before we got to 2020 by those in the nomenklatura who used their petty powers for their petty partisan purposes.

    Most of the election BS rests on Trump himself, as does the actual reasons for his loss. Without his lead, we would not be talking about it now. Some rests on the Internet, but that’s another subject. But even that does not attach to “Populism” but to the lack of an actual leader.

    6. Populism sets up us vs them, which again is anathema to the compromise intentionally built into our democratic system. It’s MAGA versus those that ostensibly want to make America worse. A majority of voters likely did not want Muslims banned from the country but we’re sold that this is what “the people” want. Populism sticks us with assertions that may in fact not be that popular…but if it’s sold as anti-elite or against the establishment, then it assumes a tribal mantle.

    That ship had sailed somewhere in the 90’s. Maybe before. Populism does not “set up” Us vs Them, it is a reaction to a long period of Us vs Them, where the Thems finally have had enough.

    There had been at least a decade for discussion. Obama could have sat down with the still-responsible leadership of the Teas, or even Paul Ryan, and found common ground. But he preferred to send the IRS and rely on raw majorities in Congress.

    The GOP could very well have been ideologically mired in the 2000’s. An unpopular war, a housing collapse, the stress of globalization, and the rise of an enigmatic liberal President. Social media intensified every bias and prejudice we had and weaponized it. We were suddenly in everyone else’s business 24/7. I adamantly believe this was no reason to try and burn everything down with Trump. That’s the 5yr-old throwing the tantrum in the middle of the grocery store candy aisle. That’s no controlled burn….

    No, it was a reason to compromise and reason together. But that was not attempted. The Tea Party was crushed or ignored, the 2012 contest resulted in Mr Corporate Globalist (who lost to Mr Liberal Corporate Globalist), and the 2016 candidates were deaf as posts, actually arguing for how we needed more H1B visas.

    And so, Trump.

    Kevin M (ed969f)

  162. That’s not completely fair to Jackson. For all his faults he opened the franchise to nearly all white men, which was a terrific accomplishment at the time. But he broke the Democrat Party in two and left the country unable to deal with slavery (or much else) as factions prevailed.

    Kevin M (ed969f)

  163. 1972 Democrats were dumber than 1972 Republicans. What does that have to do with 2023?

    McGovern was just as irresponsible a populist as Trump. His support is now Bernie’s or AOC’s, but it is still there in the wings.

    Kevin M (ed969f)

  164. There was a period during the Obamacare NFIB case days where [Volokh Conspiracy] interaction was particularly engaging. Lots of theories were being debated but there was an unusual amount of good faith. A lot of lawyers and at least one judge were participating. Trolls were at bay.

    I recall those days fondly too. As Orin explained recently, attracting and keeping that level of engagement was labor intensive and artisanal. It was doomed the second moderation was passed over to the Washington Post.

    lurker (cd7cd4)

  165. As for Trump himself, well, this is more meltdown than I ever expected.

    He may go to jail on Monday. I hope they film that.

    Kevin M (ed969f)

  166. McGovern was just as irresponsible a populist as Trump.

    Kevin M (ed969f) — 8/6/2023 @ 7:03 pm

    No. He wasn’t. Terrible policies aren’t nearly equal to bulldozing the pillars of democracy. Without free elections and the rule of law, we’re bereft of guiding principles. Any policy that happens to be useful is an accident of despotic whims.

    His support is now Bernie’s or AOC’s, but it is still there in the wings.

    And this ignores the argument of my previous comment. Obviously the Democrats have extremists, among both their aspiring leaders and their electorate. But even if one concedes that Bernie or AOC is as loathsome and dangerous as Trump, which I adamantly do not, unlike the GOP the Dems have managed not to nominate one of their extremists for over fifty years. See me when they do and we’ll talk about whether they sunk as low as Trump.

    lurker (cd7cd4)

  167. Terrible policies aren’t nearly equal to bulldozing the pillars of democracy.

    Which Trump did not do until near the end. If you insist on coloring the movement that brought Trump to the fore with Trump’s actions 5 years later, I’ll just have to start ignoring you because you’re acting like an irrational person.

    Kevin M (ed969f)

  168. No. He wasn’t.

    McGovern pandered to every crowd, from people with last names late in the alphabet to people who wanted free stuff (“$1000 for everyone!”) from the government. There was no real difference between him and Bernie in 2016, except maybe Bernie was wiser.

    Kevin M (ed969f)

  169. Is it possible for people to oppose Trump, the man, while not wanting to cast all his supporters into the outer darkness? It seems it is not. Because until it is, the country will never recover.

    Kevin M (ed969f)

  170. “AJ, I suspect you are a professional political writer who likes to dabble anonymously on a small blog. Prove it isn’t so!”

    norcal you’re way too kind…I’m a dabbler…

    I have yet to see any reason to believe that this blog has any less adept dabblers. Everyone deserves some credit, IMO. 👍

    BuDuh (528662)

  171. Kevin, I’ll try and read, digest, and respond to your comments later. I’m trying to wind it down here…

    AJ_Liberty (0151de)

  172. As for Trump himself, well, this is more meltdown than I ever expected.

    He may go to jail on Monday. I hope they film that.

    Kevin M (ed969f) — 8/6/2023 @ 8:07 pm

    LOL! What court order did he violate? The DOJ’s protective order is not yet in effect.

    Rip Murdock (b83512)

  173. Well, McGovern was pretty terrible. One of his campaign issues was opposing “alphabetism.”

    Kevin M (ed969f) — 8/6/2023 @ 6:08 pm

    Source?

    Rip Murdock (b83512)

  174. Meet the press (NBC) had some interesting statistics on covid deaths killing off republican voters. More republicans died then democrats and the 3 states az, ga. and wi. were highlighted. More republicans died in those three states the biden/trump margin. Republican deaths along with abortion ruling stopped red wave in 2022.

    asset (a2078d)

  175. No. He wasn’t.

    McGovern pandered to every crowd, from people with last names late in the alphabet to people who wanted free stuff (“$1000 for everyone!”) from the government. There was no real difference between him and Bernie in 2016, except maybe Bernie was wiser.

    Yeah. Only problem is, “No he wasn’t” was my reply to:

    McGovern was just as irresponsible a populist as Trump. (emphasis mine)

    Kevin M (ed969f) — 8/6/2023 @ 7:03 pm

    You equated McGovern with Trump, not Bernie. That’s what I responded to before you moved the goalpost.

    lurker (cd7cd4)

  176. Terrible policies aren’t nearly equal to bulldozing the pillars of democracy.

    Which Trump did not do until near the end. If you insist on coloring the movement that brought Trump to the fore with Trump’s actions 5 years later, I’ll just have to start ignoring you because you’re acting like an irrational person.

    Kevin M (ed969f) — 8/6/2023 @ 8:18 pm

    There was some evidence of Trump’s contempt for the rule of law in 2016, and oodles of it by 2020, but that’s beside the point. I’m talking about the GOP electorate that prefers Trump by 30 points right now. Surely you don’t think voters in 2023 are unaware of what he did in 2021 and before? But if you want to keep changing the subject, then claim I’m the one being irrational, I can’t stop you.

    lurker (cd7cd4)

  177. Source?

    It went so far that the Convention called the states in a random order to avoid alphabetic bias.

    Kevin M (ed969f)

  178. You equated McGovern with Trump, not Bernie. That’s what I responded to before you moved the goalpost.

    Sorry, I view them all as interchangeable clowns. If anything, Trump was better as he wasn’t a socialist. Neither of the other two had a chance to stage a coup though, so that’s a point against Trump. Bernie liked Castro and honeymooned in Brezhnev’s Russia, so he wasn’t all that adverse to dictators.

    Kevin M (ed969f)

  179. I’m talking about the GOP electorate that prefers Trump by 30 points right now.

    It has been made Us vs Them, and they are manning barricades. Tell me, did globalization help or hurt you personally?

    Kevin M (ed969f)

  180. If joe biden is othello does that make gavin newsom Iago?

    asset (a2078d)

  181. McGovern flew five bombing missions as co-pilot and 30 missions as pilot and earned the Distinguished Flying Cross in the European Theater during WWII. I would stop any comparisons to Cadet Bone Spurs right there.

    If I had any inclination to compare a “by his bootstraps” Greatest Generation South Dakotan two-term Congressman and three-term Senator to a “silver spoon in his mouth” Boomer Fifth Avenue fancy boy in the first place.

    nk (26a6c5)

  182. I’m not sure where to start with Kevin’s analysis. On one hand he seems to applaud Trump’s use of populist rhetoric to secure power, but on the other hand recognizes that Trump has neither the skills nor the character to actually get anything done. Kevin’s previous comments would celebrate Trump’s death, believes he committed treason, and wants him to rot to prison. In some way maybe these two Kevins should debate and let me know how it turns out.

    More seriously, Kevin echoes many of the complaints launched by factory working orphan. The establishment/elites started an ill-conceived Iraq war; they allowed massive investment fraud that created a housing collapse and an unconscionable bail out of the bankers; they enabled China and other countries to displace our manufacturing and negotiated trade deals that sacrificed blue collar jobs; they allowed progressives to highjack our cultural institutions and create the fear of being canceled for traditional views; and they sat impotently as illegal immigrants crashed our borders and overwhelmed our schools, social services, and unskilled labor markets.

    It’s quite the indictment. Much of it is true, though the story is a bit more nuanced. OK, a lot more nuanced. For instance, we simply don’t know what would have happened if the banks were allowed to fail in 2007. It could have led to a global recession with the middle and lower economic classes suffering even greater. The same goes for leaving Saddam in power. The war was unquestionably mismanaged and the power vacuum under appreciated, but the regime was evil and destabilizing and it’s difficult to mourn Saddam’s exit from the world stage while still hating the cost. The rise of China as an economic power wasn’t simply because U.S. elites chose it and there’s a whole moral question of keeping Chinese people in abject poverty. Gay marriage was in fact a massive cultural change that now enjoys super-majority of support. The market is open to conservatives making music, films, and news programs championing their point of view. Some of the victimology is overwrought. Unskilled immigrant labor is vital to agricultural markets — U.S. citizens just don’t want to do it. Globalization killed some U.S. markets but also created new opportunities. There is no massive unemployment in this country. It’s still the place immigrants want to come to and where investment income flows into. This isn’t some dystopian country where people can’t earn a living and live comfortably. There is no economic fairy wand that will make everyone upper middle class (and mathematicians’ heads explode) so that no one lives paycheck to paycheck. Libertarians used to understand this.

    This was always the frustration with populists like FWO. They have grievances…many understandable… but the solutions were always kind of sketchy. He frequently wanted a return to 1950 and was angry that politicians couldn’t make that happen, despite the time/space continuum. Populists often draw the false conclusion that political paralysis means politicians are just not fighting hard enough, not that our system is designed for compromise not steamrolling. As we now see, they want Republicans to assume some of the worst habits and practices of the Left.

    OK, this is starting to go on forever. I would however be remiss to note that Reagan was a conservative and did not adopt the rhetoric of populism, though academics will have entire conferences debating what the term even means. I would also argue that his solutions were not simplistic. Dramatically changing the tax system to exchange low rates for fewer tax write-offs only seems simplistic now. The same with bankrupting the Soviet Union. A wall is simplistic; banning Muslims is simplistic; starting trade wars and not expecting retaliation is simplistic; cozying up to white nationalist cultural rhetoric is simplistic. Some things are not even populist but just wrong. Trump wants to break institutions that are in his way. Just like populist dictators in Central America. The populist impulse is not conservative. I stick by my previous observations.

    AJ_Liberty (5f05c3)

  183. As a person, Mar-a-Loser does not even amount to a drop of cow pee in the American milk bucket. Certainly not enough to throw out the whole bucket. Barely a trickle on the barn floor that you don’t want around to stink up the place or accidentally track into the house.

    As for the person vs. policy question, I consider it a variant of “What’s in it for me?” and the answer has already been given by a dead President: Ask not what your country can do for you but what you can do for your country.

    nk (26a6c5)

  184. McGovern flew five bombing missions as co-pilot and 30 missions as pilot and earned the Distinguished Flying Cross in the European Theater during WWII. I would stop any comparisons to Cadet Bone Spurs right there.

    If I had any inclination to compare a “by his bootstraps” Greatest Generation South Dakotan two-term Congressman and three-term Senator to a “silver spoon in his mouth” Boomer Fifth Avenue fancy boy in the first place.

    nk (26a6c5) — 8/7/2023 @ 3:16 am

    Hear, hear!

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  185. Rip Murdock (b83512) — 8/6/2023 @ 2:09 pm

    Doing The Full Ginsburg:

    ………
    (John F. Lauro, Donald Trump’s attorney) appeared in interviews on CNN, ABC, Fox, NBC and CBS. He endeavored to defend Mr. Trump, including against evidence that, as president, he pressured his vice president, Mike Pence, to reject legitimate votes for Joseph R. Biden Jr. in favor of false electors pledged to Mr. Trump.

    “What President Trump didn’t do is direct Vice President Pence to do anything,” Mr. Lauro said on CNN’s “State of the Union.” “He asked him in an aspirational way.”

    Mr. Lauro used the same defense on NBC’s “Meet the Press,” when asked about Mr. Trump’s now-infamous call to Georgia’s secretary of state, Brad Raffensperger. ……
    “That was an aspirational ask,” Mr. Lauro said.

    His portrayal of Mr. Trump’s approach is at odds with two key moments in the indictment……..
    ………..
    As Mr. Lauro made the rounds on all five Sunday news shows — what is known as the “full Ginsburg,” from when Monica Lewinsky’s lawyer, William Ginsburg, did the same amid allegations about her affair with President Bill Clinton — Mr. Trump waged his own campaign on Truth Social.

    “WOW, it’s finally happened! Liddle’ Mike Pence, a man who was about to be ousted as Governor Indiana until I came along and made him V.P., has gone to the Dark Side,” Mr. Trump wrote on Saturday. A few days earlier, he mocked Mr. Pence, now a 2024 rival, for “attracting no crowds, enthusiasm or loyalty from people who, as a member of the Trump Administration, should be loving him.”

    Mr. Trump went on: “I never told a newly emboldened (not based on his 2% poll numbers!) Pence to put me above the Constitution, or that Mike was ‘too honest.’”
    ……….

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  186. @75

    Because if you cant get past that person, and withhold your support due to the person, then you just voted for the other party.

    The people who support Trump cannot get past everyone besides Trump. They are the impasse.

    Kevin M (ed969f) — 8/5/2023 @ 7:59 am

    I’ll only support Trump if he’s the nominee.

    Prior to the nomination, I’m NeverTrump.

    But my point is, you’re going to be offered two choices for President. It’s going to be either a Democrat President or Republican President.

    You refuse to with hold support for one, you’ve effectively gave the other candidate a “boost”.

    Hence why I ended my post with “We deserve the politicians we get”, because with holding your vote is not a ‘cost-free’ act.

    whembly (5f7596)

  187. On Megan Rapinoe.

    Her legacy should be tarnished. Her last acts were those of a 16th place loser. Like it or not, your last few games matter. What really matters is how the leadership role ended with a thud. Rapinoe’s skills had clearly eroded over the last 4 years, so her primary role was leadership… she failed that abysmally.

    Absolutely agree with this. Of course we’re now starting to see the 10,000 think-pieces in the dominant media narrative which insists that it is entirely unpatriotic to criticize Megan Rapinoe and her teammates for their lackluster showing; that it’s a sign of how sexist our society has become since no U.S. men’s team would be held to these standards; and that us nasty right-wingers were likely cheering for the U.S. team to lose.

    For the record, if these women are to be held in the same esteem and compensated to the same degree that male sports stars are, then it is entirely acceptable to ask pointed questions about the deterioration of the team culture and how that affected on-field performance. It’s also ridiculous to pretend that there is sexism in the criticism that the USWNT is receiving. I distinctly recall the degree to which the U.S. Men’s Olympic Basketball Team, chock-full of NBA superstars, was raked over the coals when they returned from the 2004 Athens Olympics with only a bronze medal, so it’s not as though a dominant men’s team is ever given a pass in that regard. And, for the record, I wanted to see the USWNT win this year’s World Cup, but I didn’t want to see them play disjointed soccer yet somehow muddle their way through to the title based upon talent, reputation, and luck.

    But, just to be a jerk about this, I’m going to rehash what I wrote four years ago when, fresh off of a World Cup championship, the USWNT demanded that their collective bargaining agreement be reopened and their compensation immediately adjusted upwards:

    One would think that a good pro-labor Democrat like Kamala Harris might be a little bit skittish about demanding that a collective bargaining agreement which is in effect for another 30 months be tossed aside just because one side now has a stronger hand to play. Imagine if the USWNT had lost in the round of 16 to Spain, and had thus ignominiously bowed out of the tournament much earlier than expected. Would U.S. Soccer be justified in demanding that the collective bargaining agreement be reopened and the player’s compensation adjusted downward? It’s impossible to see Senator Harris supporting that kind of move, so why should she be in favor of abrogating the agreement now?

    So is it now time for the ladies to take a pay cut? Of course not, but it’s always fun pointing out how truly insipid is the ideology of Kamala Harris and Megan Rapinoe.

    JVW (1ad43e)

  188. noun: aspiration

    3.PHONETICS the action of pronouncing a sound with an exhalation of breath.

    Uh-huh.

    nk (26a6c5)

  189. CBS News/YouGov Poll 8/6/23

    America’s response to this week’s indictment of Donald Trump is providing a window into more than just how Americans view his alleged actions per se — but also into what they think it means for democracy itself.

    Half the nation believes Trump tried to stay in office beyond his term through illegal and unconstitutional means. (51% yes/29% stay in office by legal means/20% did not plan to stay in office)

    To most Americans, such an effort would mean undermining democracy. (54% undermine democracy/17% upholding democracy/28% neither)

    For them and for a majority of Americans overall, the series of indictments and ongoing investigations against Trump are seen as “defending democracy” and “upholding the rule of law.” …….

    Just under a third of the country thinks Trump was trying to stay in office through legal, constitutional means — legal, in part because most of them (and including most Republicans) believe Trump’s claim that the election was illegitimate in the first place. ……

    For most Republicans, the series of indictments are also personal, seeing them as “an attack” on people like them — echoing some of Trump’s rhetoric on the campaign trail. (28% upholding the rule of law/26% defending democracy/86% trying to stop Trump campaign/56% attack on people like you)

    And big majorities of Republicans think the indictments are an attempt to stop Trump’s 2024 presidential campaign. (Non-MAGA Republicans: 83% trying to stop Trump campaign/42% attack on people like you)
    ………
    As has been the case since he took office, most Republicans have said they don’t think Mr. Biden was legitimately elected. (Yes 32%/No 68%)

    ………
    Concern about an attempted overturn, and concern about political motivations, aren’t mutually exclusive. Many Americans are concerned about both when asked to weigh them.
    ………

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  190. @163

    No, it was a reason to compromise and reason together. But that was not attempted. The Tea Party was crushed or ignored, the 2012 contest resulted in Mr Corporate Globalist (who lost to Mr Liberal Corporate Globalist), and the 2016 candidates were deaf as posts, actually arguing for how we needed more H1B visas.

    And so, Trump.

    Kevin M (ed969f) — 8/6/2023 @ 6:49 pm

    Nominating/Electing Trump was being nice.

    At the fundamentals, this is about electing politicians sensitive to their constituents. If the old guards refused to adapt, I’m worried what politicians voters would be willing to elect when NOT being nice.

    whembly (5f7596)

  191. Poor Mr. Former President Donald Trump, whose Burma Shave was such a boom they passed the bride and kissed the groom, has bigger problems than what Mike Pence says.

    At his arraignment, he told the judge that he was seventy-seven years old.

    When all the time he had Melania believing that he was, by now, ninety-seven.

    That’s why he looked like a scared puppy.

    nk (26a6c5)

  192. If any one should take a pay cut it should be the men. They are wildly overcompensated based on their performance.

    The US men’s World Cup team is nothing to brag about. Their best performance in a World Cup tournament came in 1930 when the team reached the semi-finals. In the past five tournaments they have made it to the quarter finals only once (2002). They didn’t even qualify for the 2018 WC. And the only reason they have qualified for the 2026 tournament is that the US is a co-host.

    In contrast, the women’s team (until 2023) has placed no lower than third (2007), runners-up in 2011, and champions in 2015 and 2019.

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  193. Acknowledging Reality (But Losing Trump’s Base):

    Gov. Ron DeSantis of Florida clearly stated in a new interview that Donald J. Trump lost the 2020 election, diverging from the orthodoxy of most Republican voters as the former president’s struggling G.O.P. rivals test out new lines of attack against him.

    “Of course he lost,” Mr. DeSantis said in an interview with NBC News published on Monday. “Joe Biden’s the president.”

    The comments came after Mr. DeSantis, who is polling well behind Mr. Trump for the Republican presidential nomination, acknowledged on Friday that the former president’s false theories about a rigged 2020 election were “unsubstantiated.”

    For years, Mr. DeSantis dodged direct answers to questions about whether he believed the election was stolen. During the 2022 midterms, he also campaigned for Republican candidates nationwide who vehemently denied the 2020 results.
    ……….
    Mr. DeSantis’s latest answer, while accurate, may put him at odds with much of the Republican base. Although the 2020 election was widely found to have been secure, roughly 70 percent of Republican voters say that President Biden’s victory was not legitimate……
    ……….
    …….(DeSantis) has also defended Mr. Trump over the criminal charges, saying they represent the “weaponization” of federal government against a political rival of Mr. Biden. Taken together, Mr. DeSantis’s comments on the former president suggest he is inching, rather than running, toward more direct confrontation.
    ……..

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  194. Acknowledging Reality (But Losing Trump’s Base):

    Going where the ducks are. Trump already has all the loons in the bag.

    nk (26a6c5)

  195. @194

    If any one should take a pay cut it should be the men. They are wildly overcompensated based on their performance.

    The US men’s World Cup team is nothing to brag about. Their best performance in a World Cup tournament came in 1930 when the team reached the semi-finals. In the past five tournaments they have made it to the quarter finals only once (2002). They didn’t even qualify for the 2018 WC. And the only reason they have qualified for the 2026 tournament is that the US is a co-host.

    In contrast, the women’s team (until 2023) has placed no lower than third (2007), runners-up in 2011, and champions in 2015 and 2019.

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8) — 8/7/2023 @ 9:41 am

    It isn’t about team performance.

    Men’s Soccer brings in way more money via sponserships and network contracts.

    whembly (5f7596)

  196. Going where the ducks are. Trump already has all the loons in the bag.

    nk (26a6c5) — 8/7/2023 @ 9:53 am

    Too bad that 70% of Republicans polled agree with the loons.

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  197. It isn’t about team performance.

    That’s obvious.

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  198. If any one should take a pay cut it should be the men. They are wildly overcompensated based on their performance.

    Do you live in a world where people are compensated based upon their performance or are they compensated upon what they can get from the market? We’ve gone over this time and time again, Rip: the men’s tournament receives about a hundred times the revenue that the women’s tournament does, and thus the men have a larger pool of money to distribute. Is that fair? I don’t know. Is it fair that the Wall Street banker makes many, many times what the Main Street banker makes? Is it fair that the mechanic on a Ferrari makes a whole lot more than the mechanic on a Ford Fiesta? Is it fair that the chef at the five-star restaurant makes more than the chef at Applebee’s or Denny’s?

    JVW (1ad43e)

  199. Megan Rapinoe choked, sailing the ball over the goal, another did the same, and another doinked it. Three shots were attempted without even a chance of going in.
    Leaving aside all the off-field stuff, the USA team that showed up for the World Cup underperformed throughout and gacked when it counted. Sweden was the underdog, and they deserved to win.
    Personally, I think the USA team needs to clean house after this pathetic performance.

    Paul Montagu (d52d7d)

  200. Trump Civil Litigation Watch:

    ………
    In an order Monday, Judge Lewis Kaplan said that Trump had not proven that Carroll’s statements on CNN the day after the jury awarded her $5 million after finding that Trump sexually abused Carroll and defamed her were false or “not at least substantially true,” which is the legal standard.

    Trump sued Carroll in June based on her response to questions posed on CNN. Carroll was asked about the verdict finding Trump sexually abused Carroll, but did not rape her as defined under New York law and as she alleged. Carroll said, “Oh, yes he did.”

    In throwing out Trump’s lawsuit, the judge wrote, “Indeed, the jury’s verdict in Carroll II establishes, as against Mr. Trump, the fact that Mr. Trump ‘raped her’, albeit digitally……… Thus, it establishes against him the substantial truth of Ms Carroll’s ‘rape’ accusations.”

    Kaplan added: “In consequence, there is no merit to Mr. Trump’s argument that the jury’s finding on Penal Law ‘rape’ question established that Ms Carroll’s statements were false even if her statements reasonably could be construed as referring to ‘rape’ in that specialized Penal Law sense, a subject on which this Court now expresses no view.”

    The judge previously rejected Trump’s request for a new trial.

    Trump is set to go to trial (on January 15, 2024) on another defamation lawsuit brought by Carroll in 2019 for statements Trump made while he was president. That case was tied up in legal issues while the lawsuit brought under the Adult Survivors Act (known as Carroll II) went to trial in May, resulting in the $5 million award.
    ………..

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  201. We’ve gone over this time and time again, Rip……

    And we’re gonna keep on going over it. You have your opinion, I have mine.

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  202. Americans are shifting away from Chinese imports:

    “The behavior of the governments toward each other — the more hostile, confrontational stance — is starting to affect private-sector decision-making because it changes the risk profile,” said Adam Slater, lead economist for Oxford Economics in London.

    Chinese products account for roughly one out of every six dollars Americans spend on imports, down from nearly one in four before the pandemic, according to Oxford data. Japan also is buying less from China. But European countries such as Germany and France are largely standing pat.

    More and more, when I buy products, I try to buy products made by free workers in friendly nations. Apparently others, including profit-oriented businessmen, are beginning to do the same.

    Jim Miller (d7ec43)

  203. Is it fair that the Wall Street banker makes many, many times what the Main Street banker makes? Is it fair that the mechanic on a Ferrari makes a whole lot more than the mechanic on a Ford Fiesta? Is it fair that the chef at the five-star restaurant makes more than the chef at Applebee’s or Denny’s?

    Yes to all, as those at Wall Street banks, mechanics on Italian luxury cars, and five-star chefs are probably far more skilled than their opposites. As with the men’s and women’s WC teams. The women have far over-performed the men over their history of participation in the WC (the women’s WC tournament only goes back to 1991). No comparison.

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  204. Of the eight women’s World Cup tournaments since 1991, the US team has four (1991, 1999, 2015, and 2019).

    I’m surprised the the US Soccer Federation is willing to accept such mediocrity from the men.

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  205. Correction to post 206:

    Of the eight women’s World Cup tournaments since 1991, the US team has won four (1991, 1999, 2015, and 2019).

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  206. This might explain why the US fields such mediocre national teams: In 2023, US nationals make up only 42% of Major League Soccer players. The rest are being trained for their national teams.

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  207. Rip Murdock (d2a2a8) — 8/7/2023 @ 10:58 am

    In contrast, the US National Women’s Soccer League players total 260 players, of which 89% are US nationals.

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  208. Link for statistic in post 209.

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  209. Is there any criminal Republicans won’t vote for?

    DRJ (3e213e)

  210. I watched the 1st half of the US v. Sweden game last night (recorded). I think the US played well, were quick to the ball, maintained more possession, had more corners, and more shots on goal. Rodman in particular had two quality shots and a couple of dangerous crosses. Sometimes the goal and goalie are stubborn. I’ll wait to watch the rest of the game to make any big conclusions. Sweden IS the 3rd rated team in the world, yet they managed only 1 shot on goal for the entire game, including OT (the US finished with 22 shots and 11 on goal). That’s not exactly tearing it up by Sweden. The US also controlled the ball for 58% of the match. The US had 9 corners versus 3 which is a measure of quality chances and stressing the defense.

    I do agree at this level, no one should airmail their PK, but it does happen. Nerves, fatigue, second-guessing yourself…it happens. I’m not a big fan of having PK’s determine a match. I prefer sudden death like hockey…maybe with fewer players on the field to accelerate a finish. But they’ve yet to ask me.

    As to money, I agree that money from the country and facilities should be equal. Money from FIFA should be based on eyeballs at the game.

    Rapinoe has had some great World Cups…this one wasn’t. Yes she was a sub, but her crosses were just a bit off and she had some miss kicks as well. I feel bad for her to go out that way with the missed PK just adding to the misery. I’m no fan of her LGBTQ everything approach. I get that she wants to use her celebrity for good, but most viewers aren’t there for that.

    At the end, it’s hard to truly judge chemistry and comraderie from the game. Yes they’ve played better…meaning, scored more goals. But it’s also true that the world is catching up. Portugal played a really good game last week. Sweden is no joke a top 3 team. Sometimes you lose in a close game.

    AJ_Liberty (5f05c3)

  211. Yes to all, as those at Wall Street banks, mechanics on Italian luxury cars, and five-star chefs are probably far more skilled than their opposites. ……

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8) — 8/7/2023 @ 10:30 am

    And probably have had better educational opportunities and background than their opposites, thereby leading to better positions.

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  212. Is there any criminal Republicans won’t vote for?

    DRJ (3e213e) — 8/7/2023 @ 11:25 am

    At least not for President. 😉

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  213. Rip Murdock (d2a2a8) — 8/7/2023 @ 9:04 am

    Mr. Trump went on: “I never told a newly emboldened (not based on his 2% poll numbers!) Pence to put me above the Constitution,

    And Mike Pence never said tat Trump said that — because whether or not what he was asking Mike Pence to do was in violation of the constitution was a point at issue between them.

    or that Mike was ‘too honest.’”

    He did say that, according to Mike Pence, but in the context of not wanting to endorse a claim in a lawsuit he did not believe in.

    Sammy Finkelman (6484e6)

  214. Trump Civil Litigation Watch II

    ………
    Judge Lewis Kaplan, in a separate order made public Monday, ruled that Carroll’s lawyers can give the Manhattan District Attorney’s office a videotape and transcript of their deposition of Trump that they took last fall for the lawsuit.

    That order raises the chance that Trump’s sworn testimony in Carroll’s case could be used against the former president as part of the DA’s pending criminal prosecution.
    ……….
    Bragg’s office this May issued a subpoena for the videotape and transcript of the deposition Trump gave in Carroll’s civil case last fall.

    Trump’s lawyers then asked a New York state court judge to block the subpoena.

    The judge last month ruled that Kaplan, who is overseeing Carroll’s case, should decide whether a protective order covering the deposition precluded it from being given to the DA’s office by her lawyers.

    Kaplan, in his order made public Monday, said Carroll’s lawyers could comply with the subpoena.

    Although Trump’s lawyers had argued in the state court action that the deposition was covered by the protective order, they did not renew that argument to Kaplan.
    ……….

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  215. I’m not sure where to start with Kevin’s analysis. On one hand he seems to applaud Trump’s use of populist rhetoric to secure power, but on the other hand recognizes that Trump has neither the skills nor the character to actually get anything done. Kevin’s previous comments would celebrate Trump’s death, believes he committed treason, and wants him to rot to prison. In some way maybe these two Kevins should debate and let me know how it turns out.

    Maybe I can help you here. I do not see TRUMP and POPULISM as the same thing, and in fact I see them as almost entirely unrelated.

    Trump not only hijacked the GOP, but he also hijacked a populist groundswell that started in the Oughts, if not before. He was able to do this because the GOP establishment used groups like the Teas when convenient and let them be suppressed when they weren’t.

    Sadly, the only person with the clout and will to tear the GOP the new assh0le they thought it deserved was Donald Trump. Hobson’s Choice. By the time folks like Ted Cruz (for all his faults a better man) wised up, the deal was done.

    If it had not been Trump it would have been someone else. If not anyone then, then later, with more vigor.

    Kevin M (ed969f)

  216. Donald Trump May Get His Wish Real Soon……

    A road located near the Fulton County Courthouse in Georgia has been closed as county District Attorney Fani Willis (D) prepares to potentially bring an indictment against former President Trump in the coming weeks.

    The two southbound lanes of Pryor Street SW between MLK Jr. Drive and Mitchell Street closed to general traffic starting at 5 a.m. Monday and will remain closed through Aug. 18, according to the Fulton County Sheriff’s Office. The closed portion of the street will be converted to media parking, which will be on a first-come, first-served basis.
    ………
    The street closure comes as the Fulton County Sheriff’s Office begins to ramp up security measures ahead of a potential indictment against Trump, who has already been indicted three times this year. Fulton County Sheriff Pat Labat also installed security barriers ahead of a charging decision in a case last month, a decision that Willis labeled as “smart.”
    ……..

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  217. Shorter: If one cannot discuss “populism” without mentioning “Trump” then the argument is flawed through a fallacious association.

    Kevin M (ed969f)

  218. He may go to jail on Monday. I hope they film that.

    Kevin M (ed969f) — 8/6/2023 @ 8:07 pm

    Why do you believe Trump could go to jail today?

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  219. It’s quite the indictment. Much of it is true, though the story is a bit more nuanced. OK, a lot more nuanced. For instance, we simply don’t know what would have happened if the banks were allowed to fail in 2007.

    And now you put words in my mouth, to argue against positions I do not hold. There were lots of mistakes in 2007-2008, such as letting Lehman fail, and TARP was a OMG reaction. It seemed to me that a better path would have been shoring up mortgages, not mortgage holders (e.g. wiping 10% off the principle of all owner-occupied home loans). It would also have been good to put the boards of Fannie Mae and Ginnie Mae in prison, given the way they corruptly debased the mortgage-backed securities that were the international currency.

    But no, just letting the banks fail would have been far far worse than what was done.

    And really, pointing out that *some* populist ideas are stupid isn’t all that convincing when the problem they were addressing was CREATED by these oh-so-nuanced elites.

    Kevin M (ed969f)

  220. *principal

    Kevin M (ed969f)

  221. @211

    Is there any criminal Republicans won’t vote for?

    DRJ (3e213e) — 8/7/2023 @ 11:25 am

    I mean, to be fair, at least half of our politicians would be criminals if they were treated exactly as John/Jane, Doe.

    It’s really difficult, if impossible, to charge them with insider trading, as one example.

    whembly (4716ab)

  222. However, you seem to have thoroughly debated FWO here. How about addressing what I wrote about “populism” without draping it with non sequiturs and snide remarks?

    Kevin M (ed969f)

  223. It’s really difficult, if impossible, to charge them with insider trading, as one example.

    There does appear to be a level of criminality that is allowed in the ruling class. For example, it is hilarious to think that Trump is the only bad actor in the NY City real estate world, or that many city officials aren’t complicit in that.

    Kevin M (ed969f)

  224. RIP William Friedkin (87). Director of two of the seminal and biggest films of the 1970’s: The French Connection (winning a Best Director Oscar); and The Exorcist (Oscar nominee); Other films included Sorcerer (1977, a remake of Wages of Fear with an awesome Tangerine Dream score); The Night They Raided Minsky’s (1968); and To Live and Die in LA (1985).

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  225. I would however be remiss to note that Reagan was a conservative and did not adopt the rhetoric of populism, though academics will have entire conferences debating what the term even means.

    Which one?

    Reagan led a popular wave rejecting the liberalism of the 60s and 70s, by people (like me) who were quite fed up. He was widely accused of simplistic solutions and bumper-sticker ideas. The domestic and diplomatic elite opposed him, and said he was a fool and worse.

    Yet he changed the world.

    Kevin M (ed969f)

  226. So insider trading rules make you not care about any crimes or criminals, whembly? For you, crimes are not a problem when it comes to politicians?

    DRJ (b2f0ad)

  227. I am not sure “populism” comes with an agreed upon definition. Buckley, the least man of the people person there ever may have been, certainly used populist rhetoric as part of his conservatism: (“I would rather be governed by the first 2,000 people in the telephone directory, than by the Harvard University faculty.”)

    I am with Kevin M that it usualy emerges as a symptom of an illness in society, as opposed to any kind of governing platform. In the South, Populism isn’t good — it gave us people like George Wallace and Huey Long and Tom Watson (the villain in the Leo Frank case here in Atlanta). Donald Trump and MTG fit easily into that tradition. William Jennings Bryan, Populist #1, though, probably helped push government in a better direction in the early 1900s.

    Appalled (03f53c)

  228. @228

    So insider trading rules make you not care about any crimes or criminals, whembly? For you, crimes are not a problem when it comes to politicians?

    DRJ (b2f0ad) — 8/7/2023 @ 12:39 pm

    I know you’re framing this with Trump in mind.

    But outside of clear, “meat and potato” crimes, ie things like bribery, murder and the likes… I’d vote for a GOP candidate who’s be convicted of, lets say, classified handling than voting for Democrats.

    I 100% believe that the direction Democrats are going is a clear and present danger to the US.

    whembly (5f7596)

  229. DeSantis: If Election Is a Referendum on Documents by a Mar-A-Lago Toilet Republicans Will Lose

    Governor Ron DeSantis (R-FL) said on NBC’s “Today” that if the 2024 election is a referendum on former President Donald Trump’s legal cases, the Republican Party will lose.

    DeSantis said, “If the election is a referendum on Joe Biden’s policies and the failures that we’ve seen, and we’re presenting a positive vision for the future, we will win the presidency and we will have a chance to turn the country around. If on the other hand, the election is not about January 20, 2025, but January 6, 2021, or what document was left by the toilet at Mar-a-Lago, if it’s a referendum on that, we are going to lose. That’s just the reality.”

    Reporter Dasha Burns said, “But you know with Trump in the race that is largely what it is going to be about and not fighting against Joe Biden, you are fighting against Trump.”

    DeSantis said, “That’s not a pathway for success for the Republican Party. I think a lot of our voters understand that.”
    ……….


    I did not make up the article’s headline…….

    TrumpWorld not amused.

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  230. DeSantis said, “That’s not a pathway for success for the Republican Party. I think a lot of our voters understand that.”

    Apparently 53% of Republican voters don’t understand that.

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  231. AJ_Liberty (5f05c3) — 8/7/2023 @ 6:46 am

    You echoed all the reactions I had to Kevin’s post. I co-sign.

    lurker (cd7cd4)

  232. @234, Glad to have you on board, but Kevin wants me to more directly address his points. I fear repetition.

    AJ_Liberty (5f05c3)

  233. This Can’t Be Good For Rudy:

    Donald Trump ally Bernie Kerik met Monday with special counsel Jack Smith’s investigators who are handling the probe related to the 2020 election aftermath and the January 6, 2021, insurrection.

    The interview largely focused on what Trump’s former attorney Rudy Giuliani did to prove that Trump actually won the election, Kerik’s attorney told CNN.
    ………..
    Kerik discussed “what the Giuliani team was doing” and “all the efforts they took at the time to take all the complaints of fraud, to see what they could do to chase them down,” (Timothy Parlatore, Kerik’s attorney) said. “Really kind of establishing that at that time, when they weren’t really able to necessarily establish proof, they had probable cause and they were pursuing investigation in good faith.”

    Investigators also asked about the seven states that were the focus of Giuliani’s efforts, doing a deep dive on each state to understand the basis for making election fraud claims. Investigators went state by state, asking about each claim of fraud and what it was based on and who they talked to.
    ……….
    Last month, Kerik turned over a tranche of documents to investigators, largely pertaining to Giuliani’s quixotic search for voter fraud. The files included affidavits claiming there were widespread “irregularities,” shoddy statistical analyses supposedly revealing “fraudulent activities,” and opposition research about a senior employee from Dominion Voting Systems.
    ……….

    Another Bad Sign:

    Rudy Giuliani puts luxury Manhattan apartment on the block for $6.5 million

    I expect Rudy will be indicted before the end of the year.

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  234. So you draw the line at murder, even though Trump has said he could murder someone and still be elected, and I believe him.

    Don’t you think Trump and his family have taken and/or would take bribes?

    DRJ (3e213e)

  235. it gave us people like George Wallace and Huey Long and Tom Watsonn

    If Long had not been assassinated, the history of the US in the 20th Century might have been quite different. Imagine Huey Long in the White House in 1941 instead of FDR.

    Which brings up a point: When I listed various Populist movements in US history, I listed the successful ones. Huey Long, Wallace & Perot in the 20th century. Bryan’s FOUR runs at the White House at the end of the 19th. The last two were not completely unsuccessful, as TR and Bill Clinton co-opted the main points. Asset will say that Nixon co-opted Wallace. Not true, but he did co-opt Wallace’s voters.

    Kevin M (ed969f)

  236. Understand again, I am probably the person least congenial towards Trump on the blog. But the movement that he scammed still remains, leaderless right about now. They go through the motions, but they know that Trump is done. But their anger is not and their grievances remain.

    Someone is going to pick them up. It may surprise you that I think the best candidate for that is Chris Christie. He has never attacked THEM, just the charlatan. I think he, of any of them, is capable of making the pivot. I’m sure he understands the deal they seek.

    Kevin M (ed969f)

  237. Glad to have you on board, but Kevin wants me to more directly address his points. I fear repetition.

    No, I want you to separate your criticism of “populism” from “Trump” (or any other individual). Personalities don’t address principles.

    Kevin M (ed969f)

  238. Here’s the secret reason that Trump lost those 7 states:

    He told his followers not to vote absentee, allowing Biden a whole month of GOtV to his one. If even a fraction of the hard-core Trump voters who were unable to make it to the polls day-of had voted by mail instead, Trump would have won the election.

    But he told them not to, and made it a loyalty test.

    Kevin M (ed969f)

  239. A Conversation Between NYT Columnists Bret Stephens and Gail Collins:

    If Mike Pence Is a Big Hero, We’re in Big Trouble
    ………..
    Bret: ……..And, um, speaking of justice, what do we make of Trump indictment No. 3?

    Gail: We’ve gotten to the real bottom line, Trump-crime-wise. The country can get past a president who breaks the law in his private life, hides official documents and hides the evidence that he hides official documents. But we can’t survive a president who makes a serious attempt to wreck the election system and stay in office after he’s been voted out.

    That just can’t be overlooked. He has to be punished.

    Bret: I thought the right remedy for Jan. 6 was political, via immediate impeachment and conviction, as I wrote at the time. I worry that the latest case is going to turn on the question of whether Donald Trump truly believed he had won the election and could have his vice president reject electoral ballots……..

    Gail: All this drama keeps bringing me back to Mike Pence — and believe me, I never thought I’d be in a world where I wanted to be back with Mike Pence in any way, shape or form. But when the critical moment came, he followed through and declared the actual election winner the actual election winner.

    Bret: Sorry, but I will never buy the whole “Mike Pence was a hero” business. He was Trump’s faithful enabler for more than four years, his beard with evangelicals, his ever-nodding yes man. He was mute for the eight weeks after the 2020 election when his boss was busy denying the result. ……..

    Gail: No way I’m going to battle on behalf of the virtues of Mike Pence. You win.

    Bret: The only Republican I like these days is Chris Christie. ……..

    Gail: …….(R)ight now, I’m just rooting for a Christie smash-down at that Republican debate this month. Looks like he’ll qualify. And I guess Trump will be too chicken to attend, right?

    Bret: My guess, too. He has such a commanding lead over the other Republicans that a debate can only hurt him, particularly with Christie in the ring.
    ………
    Bret: ……..Question for you: Considering that the economy is doing relatively well, why aren’t Biden’s poll numbers better — not even on how he handles the economy?

    Gail: Excellent question. You’d think a guy who passes breakthrough legislation on everything from education to global warming, who has done a terrific job handling a very troubled economy and is respected as a leader around the world would be super popular. And I truly think if you had an actual election right now, people would turn out in droves to give Biden another term.

    Bret: I wouldn’t be so sure. The latest New York Times/Siena poll has Trump and Biden in a dead heat. Sixty-five percent of voters think the country is on the wrong track. Food prices keep moving up. The effects of the migration crisis, which have now hit so many places far north of the border, will be felt for years in housing, the school system, even parks. ………

    Gail: I said if we had an election now, they’d turn out in droves to vote for Biden. Not that they’d be excited about it. ……..
    ##########

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  240. I know Trump is willing to bribe for personal gain. He did it with Ukraine. It stands to reason he is open to being bribed.

    So, really, there is no crime Republicans won’t tolerate.

    DRJ (2e4ac4)

  241. Yes to all, as those at Wall Street banks, mechanics on Italian luxury cars, and five-star chefs are probably far more skilled than their opposites. As with the men’s and women’s WC teams. The women have far over-performed the men over their history of participation in the WC (the women’s WC tournament only goes back to 1991). No comparison.

    You’re trying to have your cake and eat it too, Rip. On the one hand you’re saying that differential in pay at places with high profit margins (Wall Street banks, luxury auto mechanics, high-end restaurants) is understandable because they bring in much higher margins than Main Street banks, domestic budget car auto mechanics, and chain restaurant chefs. You then even acknowledge the the U.S. Men play at a higher skill level than the women, which everyone except the Megan Rapinoes of the world accepts is due to physiological advantages that men have. But then you land right back on your assertion that the women should be paid more than the men because their performance on the field has been superior.

    By those metrics, the Main Street banker whose assets grew by 35% last year should be paid more than the Wall Street banker whose assets grew by 20% last year, even if the Wall Street banker managed 100 times the sum that the Main Street banker did. Or the Ford mechanic who repaired 400 vehicles last year should be paid way more than the Ferrari mechanic who repaired 80. Or the chef at IHOP who served 25,000 diners should be paid way more than the cook at Le Cirque who served 5,000 diners.

    JVW (1ad43e)

  242. You then even acknowledge the the U.S. Men play at a higher skill level than the women

    Please provide my exact quote; looking back at my posts I haven’t said that at all. The best thing I said about the men’s WC teams is that they are mediocre.

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  243. Sometimes a grift is only a grift. Or is Trump more popular than Coca-Cola? Or are people less gullible about their politicians than they are about their cold beverages?

    Begging your pardon, but putting a “populist” label on Trump strikes me like the Florida anti-mask lady’s “Things gotta breathe”. Sure, it fits, but it’s not necessarily it.

    nk (8e73e6)

  244. As for you guys talking about the women’s soccer team, I’ve got four words for you: The Radio City Rockettes.

    Sigh. And then we wonder how we got Trump.

    nk (8e73e6)

  245. Rip, I’m with JVW on this one. I don’t care if a WNBA team goes undefeated and wins ten consecutive championships. Its players wouldn’t get even half of what the players on the worst NBA team make. Why? Because the NBA commands a much bigger market.

    It’s not about what’s fair. “Fair” is for Communists. Let the free market rule.

    norcal (d04a50)

  246. Trump and his new lawyer are not on the same page about judge’s recusal

    Donald Trump blared Sunday morning that his legal team would be “immediately asking for recusal” of U.S. District Court Judge Tanya Chutkan from his latest criminal case, proclaiming (but not revealing) “very powerful grounds” for the demand.

    Hours later, his attorney John Lauro would publicly walk back that plan, saying Trump was speaking with a “layman’s political sense” and reacting primarily because Chutkan was nominated to the bench by a Democrat. (She was confirmed 95-0 by the Senate in 2014 after Barack Obama nominated her).
    ……….
    ………Trump has tested Lauro’s public advice in a few ways — primarily by talking about the case at all, and often in incendiary ways.
    ………
    But Trump has at times appeared, in public statements, to push beyond Lauro’s description of the issues he plans to raise in the new case. In addition to demanding that Chutkan recuse, Trump has also contended that he wants to relocate his case outside of Washington, D.C., based on the district’s overwhelming vote for Joe Biden in 2020.

    Lauro has acknowledged Trump’s argument in his own public comments but also told Markus that “political affiliation is not the end all and be all.” Rather, he said, the crux of their argument would hinge on Washington, D.C.’s proximity to the violence of Jan. 6.
    ………

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  247. norcal (d04a50) — 8/7/2023 @ 5:38 pm

    Whatever. I’m not arguing about fairness, I am just pointing out that the men’s WC team for decades has been a failure in the World Cup (they didn’t even qualify for the tournaments between 1954 and 1986) and as I mentioned before only reached the quarter finals once in “recent” history (2002). If there was a powerhouse team representing the US, it’s been the women.

    At best the US men are a regional power, as demonstrated by its record in the CONCACAF Gold Cup (oh, wait, they didn’t enter or qualify between 1963 and 1981). Watch them choke in 2026.

    If the “free” market ruled then the men’s team would receive pay cuts for every mediocre performance. But as you point out, the market isn’t free.

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  248. I don’t care if a WNBA team goes undefeated and wins ten consecutive championships. Its players wouldn’t get even half of what the players on the worst NBA team make. Why? Because the NBA commands a much bigger market.

    norcal (d04a50) — 8/7/2023 @ 5:38 pm

    At least the NBA teams win. You can’t say the same thing about the US Men’s World Cup Team.

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  249. At least the NBA teams win. You can’t say the same thing about the US Men’s World Cup Team.

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8) — 8/7/2023 @ 5:54 pm

    I said the “worst” NBA team versus a perennially undefeated WNBA team.

    Men’s soccer has a HUGE market compared to women’s soccer. Thus, even a poorly performing men’s team will earn more.

    Don’t let your disappointment with the men’s team cloud your economic thinking.

    norcal (d04a50)

  250. Men’s soccer has a HUGE market compared to women’s soccer. Thus, even a poorly performing men’s team will earn more.

    No MLS team comes close to the value of a NFL, MLB, or NBA team. MLS team values are pocket change.

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  251. The men’s soccer market may be HUGE compared to the women’s league, but that’s a pretty low bar. Men’s soccer is a overall pipsqueak game.

    Rip Murdock (b83512)

  252. Who can name a current American men’s team player?

    Rip Murdock (b83512)

  253. No MLS team comes close to the value of a NFL, MLB, or NBA team. MLS team values are pocket change.

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8) — 8/7/2023 @ 6:16 pm

    I never said that was the case.

    I was making a men versus women team comparison.

    Just as an NBA team is worth ten times, if not more, than a WNBA team, men’s world soccer is worth more than women’s world soccer. That’s why, even though the U.S. men’s soccer team performs poorly, it still commands more pay than the U.S. women’s team.

    Men’s soccer market >>>>>>>> women’s soccer market.

    norcal (d04a50)

  254. And please don’t put words in my mouth. I never said that soccer was as big as the NBA or other professional sports.

    norcal (d04a50)

  255. Republican legislature emergency election tomorrow in ohio to raise ballot measure passage from 50% to 60% of vote for abortion rights protection as rethugliKKKans know they will lose other wise. This is why I say they are evil.

    asset (03f304)

  256. Giuliani was nor forging evidence. He relied in part, on Sidney Powell, andbroke with her when she didn’t produce what she claimed she had. He seemed to believe that, as Trump’s lawyer and friend, it was his obligation to believe anything he possibly could an=bout a dishonest election.

    There were false accusations and false indications of election fraud coming out of the woodwork, but where they were really coming from, we don’t know.

    Sammy Finkelman (6484e6)

  257. Rudi Giuliani has always been a slimeball.

    nk (92d3fc)

  258. Sammy Finkelman (6484e6) — 8/7/2023 @ 7:11 pm

    I don’t know who fell further, Giuliani or Ted Cruz. At one point, I would have voted for either of them. Behold what the Mar-a-Loser hath wrought.

    norcal (d04a50)

  259. Good news: Women’s world cup sets new attendance record with 8 games to go
    Bad news: Record was set with an average attendance of 26,000
    Mens world cup in Qatar most venues were 44,000-45,000 capacity and average attendance was 96.5% of capacity
    Womens world cup expectations are so low that some of the first round venues seat under 13,000. Putting the Brazil and England mens teams in a 13,000 seat stadium in the World Cup would be unthinkable, but that is exactly where the womens teams went

    Mens TV revenue was $3 Billion
    Womens TV Revenue projected to be $300M or 10% of the mens

    Serena Williams was the most honest womens athlete on the subject when she noted men tennis players go best of 5, women best of 3. She noted that Andy Murray, the best mens player at the time of the interview would beat her 6-0, 6-0 in less than 10 minutes

    On the home front, NWSL average attendance 7900. MSL 23,000.
    NWSL TV deal was $4.5M spread over 3 years, Sponsorship revenue $26M per year
    MLS TV $7M per season, Sponsorship revenues $812 Million per year

    steveg (2cbb1e)

  260. I think most politicians that come up through the LA-Boston-Philadelphia-NYC-DC-Baltimore schools of local politics are slimeballs. I include T-Rump. I am more inclined to see the Trump’s as doing the bribing rather than the taking of bribes. Nobody ever bribed them to build something in NYC, but they have no doubt greased palms up and down the entire state

    steveg (2cbb1e)

  261. steveg (2cbb1e) — 8/7/2023 @ 7:54 pm

    Thank you for adding the details, Steve.

    norcal (d04a50)

  262. I don’t know who fell further, Giuliani or Ted Cruz.

    Giuliani already had a reputation as an unethical prosecutor and dirty tricks artist by the time of the Gotti trial in 1992. His personal reputation was even worse.

    nk (92d3fc)

  263. USMNT share of World Cup 2022 pot of money was $30 Million for advancing to the knockout round, but they had to give $6.5M of that to the USWNT.
    USWNT share of the money pot for advancing to the knockout round of their tournament is $2.9M and they owe the men about $600K so no doubt the men will be expected by some not to take the $$

    Among the things I supported for the women was equal accomodations, flights, per diem. etc. I’m not a fan of insisting the mens and womens coaches be paid the same as that pay scale is set by professional European clubs

    steveg (2cbb1e)

  264. So, really, there is no crime Republicans won’t tolerate.

    What, DRJ, is a crime? I can name a number of things that Democrats have done OPENLY that I consider worse crimes than bribery. Starting with Obamacare, which robbed 5 million families of health insurance.

    Kevin M (ed969f)

  265. I don’t know who fell further, Giuliani or Ted Cruz. At one point, I would have voted for either of them. Behold what the Mar-a-Loser hath wrought.

    Indeed.

    Kevin M (ed969f)

  266. And please don’t put words in my mouth. I never said that soccer was as big as the NBA or other professional sports.

    norcal (d04a50) — 8/7/2023 @ 6:31 pm

    I didn’t. I included your clear comment, and added additional information.

    Rip Murdock (bac490)

  267. It’s not about what’s fair. “Fair” is for Communists. Let the free market rule.

    norcal (d04a50) — 8/7/2023 @ 5:38 pm

    I said nothing about fairness-it’s a question of merit. Under a purely meritocratic standard, the men’s WC results do not justify paying high salaries to a team that barely makes it halfway through a World Cup tourney every time it plays (if it qualifies at all). What a gig!

    I expect that US team in 2026 will have as much chance winning the tournament (let alone reaching the knockout round) as Chris Christie winning the Republican nomination.

    As far as comparison of MLS, NFL, etc. valuations, it just goes to show that the marketplace doesn’t think much of soccer. The TV numbers posted above also demonstrates that-the TV deals for the NFL, etc. are measured in billions. MLS really isn’t a big deal in the US (and has been pointed out) even less so for women.

    It’s been a great discussion but I’ve said all I’m going to say on this topic.

    Rip Murdock (bac490)

  268. @267 So called obama care was invented by the heritage foundation to counter hillary clinton’s single payer. Romney brought it to mass. when gov. When Obama couldn’t break senate fillibuster on single payer plan he allowed this republican plan which of course was unworkable. What democrats should of done when single payer was blocked instead of foisting this crap, when people died from lack of healthcare they should of arrested republicans for their deaths and try them for their deaths. Democrats were to soft until AOC and the squad came along.

    asset (03f304)

  269. norcal (d04a50) — 8/7/2023 @ 6:31 pm

    I didn’t mean to put words in your mouth, but I do see how you might have thought that.

    Rip Murdock (bac490)

  270. Rip Murdock (bac490) — 8/7/2023 @ 11:42 pm

    No hard feelings.

    I usually agree with you on politics. We can agree to disagree on this one.

    norcal (c976b4)

  271. Kevin M 267,

    That is an example of the thought process that got the Republicans where they are now.

    DRJ (51bb15)

  272. Ditto asset 271 and the Democrats.

    DRJ (51bb15)

  273. Ken White follows up, driving a stake through Andy McCarthy’s defense of his “it can’t be fraud!” claim which we’ve discussed here. Here’s Ken’s meta-argument:

    There are two ways to be a public legal commentator. One is to describe, to the best of your ability, what you believe the state of the law is, how and where courts might agree or disagree with you, and how your view of what the law should be differs from how courts currently interpret it. That’s what I aspire to. I fall short all the time, I’m sure.

    The other way to be a public legal commenter is to be an advocate pretending to be a fair reporter — to take what you think the law should be based on your sympathies or politics and present it deceitfully as what the law inarguably is. I’ve often criticized Alan Dershowitz for doing this — for instance, for telling the public “you can’t convict someone of lying to the federal government if the federal government knew they were lying,” even though every modern court to consider that argument has rejected it.

    Andrew C. McCarthy and the Editors of the National Review are choosing the Alan Dershowitz path of legal commentary. Well, at least it’s an ethos.

    […]

    Here’s how Mr. McCarthy could make his point honestly: “Jack Smith has charged Donald Trump with conspiring to defraud the United States in violation of 18 U.S.C. section 371. I think that charge is unsound because Smith doesn’t claim, nor could he, that Trump was trying to defraud the government out of money or property. Though the Supreme Court and other courts historically said that’s not a requirement under Section 371, I think that rule is undermined by more recent Supreme Court cases interpreting the mail and wire fraud statutes. No court has agreed with me — indeed, the First Circuit rejected my argument! — but I think my argument is the better one and the Supreme Court should eventually adopt it. Let me explain why.”

    That would be honesty to National Review’s audience, instead of being an advocate with pretenses to honest legal commentary.

    […]

    I share Ken’s dismay over the too common inability/refusal to distinguish between what the law is and what one wants it to be.

    Ken’s legal argument is in the first ellipses. By now much of it should be familiar.

    lurker (cd7cd4)

  274. ellipsis

    lurker (cd7cd4)

  275. One last shot at Kevin’s “populism”. I will not do this in seriatem as we have a fundamental problem that over-rides his details. Kevin described Lincoln, FDR, and Reagan as “populists”. This does not seem consistent with how poltical scientists use the word. Kevin picks some of the most popular and successful presidents in history and then says that they are populists, ergo populism is great. I’ll ride with the political scientists on this one.

    I’ll crib from the following bbc article as many of its observations and quotes are consistent with more scholarly efforts, yet more digestible
    https://www.bbc.com/news/world-43301423

    Populism pits “the people” against “the elites” where the people are pure and the elites are corrupt. Populists tend to lower the quality of discourse, perpetuate a state of crisis, are more against things than for others, dislike institutional constraints, and believe in their own infallibility. None of this sounds at all like Lincoln, FDR, or Reagan.

    If we go to the definitive source, wikipedia, and examine populism in the U.S.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Populism_in_the_United_States#:~:text=In%20American%20political%20rhetoric%2C%20%22populist,the%20left%E2%80%93right%20political%20spectrum.
    there seems to be some agreement. We see Andrew Jackson, William Jennings Bryant, George Wallace, Huey Long, Ross Perot, Bernie Sanders, and even a mention of little old Sarah Palin.

    But alas none of the heavy hitters like Lincoln, FDR, or Reagan. It’s probably not to say that each may employ elements of populism in some of their rhetoric, but that none of them have enough of the above common traits that social scientists would ascribe to populism. So going through point by point Kevin’s defense is useless if we are simply talking about different things.

    AJ_Liberty (ad7611)

  276. As to soccer, here is Forbes list of the 50 most valuable sports teams:
    https://www.forbes.com/sites/mikeozanian/2022/09/08/the-worlds-50-most-valuable-sports-teams-2022/?sh=54a2f05a385c

    The highest rated soccer club, Real Madrid, checked in at #13 at $5.1B. The Cowboys were #1. Interestingly the Bears checked in at #6, so I’m not sure how correlated value is to winning anything. To futher make the point, the lowly Houston Texans sit at #17, where uber successful Manchester City sits at #24.

    Football being so valued might only indicate that it wins the popularity contest in the most economically successful country in the world. The US has the most money and we love our football. I think if we took a vote of 7.88B people in the world, soccer wins hands down. Heck even more kids in the US play soccer versus tackle football. Sure it’s lower cost and safer, but if it was so lame, you wouldn’t see the participation.

    Now the USMNT then also confronts the problem that because we are such a wealthy nation, we have a lot more money chasing our sports. Athletes have far more sports to choose from: football, basketball, baseball, hockey drawing a lot of talent. Brazil doesn’t have the same dynamic. England maybe cricket. The best athletes across the world tend to be playing soccer, yet the USMNT team ranks 11 in the world. And players like Christian Pulisic are in demand in the top European leagues. The idea that “we suck” really depends on perspective. I think the quality of US play has improved a lot over the past 30 years, and we win more…justifying the ranking. Winning it “all” is a very tall ask.

    Markets set pay. I get that the women’s team generate a lot of attention during the Olympics and World Cup and have been extremely successful. But that does not change the economics of how many people watch women’s soccer versus men’s soccer. Even look at attendance at the women’s league games versus MLS. If women’s soccer was so popular that really hasn’t translated into soccer league attendance. That should tell us something. Nationalism loves a winner but I doubt Rip is spending his money going to NWSL games.

    AJ_Liberty (ad7611)

  277. I’m no swimmer, but were she slimmer, I might have saved Clementine.

    The Bobby Darin version of My Darling Clementine, just for something completely different.

    nk (92d3fc)

  278. My older sister had this Bobby Darin 45 record. It’s still kinda catchy.

    Switching gears, this graph on on Chinese net investment is a repudiation of Chairman Xi.

    Paul Montagu (d52d7d)

  279. I usually agree with Jack Goldsmith, but not here. The “terrible consequences” already happened, when Trump repeatedly broke the law after the November election. The unprecedented criminal indictments are happening because of one person’s unprecedented criminal behavior. If anything, Garland left out a set of crimes: Trump’s proven obstruction of justice in office, as documented in the Mueller report.

    The GOP argument at the impeachment trial was that, instead of being convicted in the Senate, he could be tried in criminal courts, but now the complaint is that he’s being indicted in criminal courts now that his presidency is over.

    Paul Montagu (d52d7d)

  280. I share Ken’s dismay over the too common inability/refusal to distinguish between what the law is and what one wants it to be.

    We see a lot of that here also.

    Rip Murdock (bac490)

  281. @237

    So you draw the line at murder, even though Trump has said he could murder someone and still be elected, and I believe him.

    I don’t.

    Don’t you think Trump and his family have taken and/or would take bribes?

    DRJ (3e213e) — 8/7/2023 @ 2:55 pm

    Possibly?

    But, as investigated the Trumps are, I’m curious why the FBI didn’t find any. As public knowledge goes, nothing the Trumps have done comes close to the blatant influence peddling/bribes that we seeing with the Bidens.

    whembly (db54cc)

  282. @243

    I know Trump is willing to bribe for personal gain. He did it with Ukraine. It stands to reason he is open to being bribed.

    So, really, there is no crime Republicans won’t tolerate.

    DRJ (2e4ac4) — 8/7/2023 @ 4:18 pm

    I see you’ve made up your mind.

    Ok.

    I. Don’t. Want. Democrats. In. Power.

    That’s my line.

    I realize that we have to do better in nominating better GOP candidates, but Democrats are destroying this country in ways that may be impossible to address.

    So, until then, I’m #NeverDemocrats.

    This is how someone like Pinonchet rose to power.

    So, if you want better GOP candidates, do the hard work and campaign for better candidates.

    whembly (db54cc)

  283. @258

    Republican legislature emergency election tomorrow in ohio to raise ballot measure passage from 50% to 60% of vote for abortion rights protection as rethugliKKKans know they will lose other wise. This is why I say they are evil.

    asset (03f304) — 8/7/2023 @ 6:33 pm

    Evil?

    How ’bout good governance?

    Every other state in the nation are at least 60%. (I can’t find any states with less than that other than OH).

    Asset, the language you use is telling that you’re a Marxist adherent and it’s the same language that bolsheviks, nazis and commies used to justify their actions.

    whembly (db54cc)

  284. My comments weren’t about whether Trump should be President, whembly. My comments were about Republicans that still support Trump. No crime will change their minds because, as you say, they will always see Democrats as worse.

    DRJ (51bb15)

  285. “but Democrats are destroying this country in ways that may be impossible to address”

    Destroying? You might want to flush that out a bit. I’m no fan of Obama or Obamacare…and most of Democrat identity politics and income redistribution is nauseating…but it’s a far cry from destroying anything. Most legislative stuff can’t get passed, provided our politics retains the filibuster. Even executive over-reach…like the big company vaccine mandate and Biden’s unilateral renter protection order…are cleaned up by the courts. Judicial appointments are problematic and will always argue for Republicanism…but if we had a more functional legislature, it would minimize the impact of the court.

    Democrats are your neighbors, your family members, your co-workers, and the guy in the next pew. We have far more that unites us than should divide us. There is no existential doom lingering, except maybe national debt….which has become as bipartisan as anything. Neither side chooses to deal honestly about it. In the GOP field, only Trump and Ramaswamy are bad choices in my estimation. The rest would be improvements over Biden, more competent than Harris, and less obnoxious than Newsom.

    AJ_Liberty (5f05c3)

  286. No other State has made representative democracy as meanigless as Ohio has, with gerrymandering, mis-apportionment, malapportionment, and outright packet boroughs. Only a state-wide election allows one person-one vote.

    nk (92d3fc)

  287. Whembly says:

    “As public knowledge goes, nothing the Trumps have done comes close to the blatant influence peddling/bribes that we seeing with the Bidens.” ([sic]. The only peddling we have been seeing is Hunter Biden.)

    Thing is, Trump, by faling to divest out of his hotels, was always vulnerable to this charge:

    https://www.marketwatch.com/story/documents-detail-big-foreign-government-spending-at-trump-hotel-01668472156

    How soon we forget…

    Appalled (03f53c)

  288. @287

    My comments weren’t about whether Trump should be President, whembly. My comments were about Republicans that still support Trump. No crime will change their minds because, as you say, they will always see Democrats as worse.

    DRJ (51bb15) — 8/8/2023 @ 8:04 am

    That’s why I’ve been so adamant, and agitated that we must pull behind a candidate that can beat Trump in the primaries. Even if that person isn’t your 1st choice… to me, the only criterion is who can beat Trump.

    whembly (db54cc)

  289. I share Ken’s dismay over the too common inability/refusal to distinguish between what the law is and what one wants it to be.

    It’s possible it’s the law that is the ass.

    Kevin M (ed969f)

  290. That is an example of the thought process that got the Republicans where they are now.

    Perhaps. But the thought process that suggests that any of our leaders feel bound by the Rule of Law is what got the country here.

    Kevin M (ed969f)

  291. It’s possible it’s the law that is the ass.

    Kevin M (ed969f) — 8/8/2023 @ 8:30 am

    That may be, but it is the only law we’ve got. Those who oppose whatever law they disagree with should advocate that it be changed to reflect their preferences.

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  292. @290

    How soon we forget…

    Appalled (03f53c) — 8/8/2023 @ 8:26 am

    Were they at risk?

    Sure.

    But, SCO / Congress / State AG hasn’t found any chargable instances… right?

    Don’t you think if it existed, they would’ve charged the Trumps by now?

    whembly (db54cc)

  293. whembly,

    In fairness, they have been busy. You know, investigating January 6 and all that. There also was a conscious decision to not charge Trump in the first two years of the Biden administration.

    Also, is influence peddling really a crime? I’m not sure it is. H Biden’s offense was not registering as a foreign agent and paying his taxes. It’s not sitting on Burisma’s board.

    Look, the Clinton foundation (and its ilk), enormous advances for bad books or bad artwork, and prominent hotel stays are all ways to pass money from a rich guy to a President or their relatives. It’s a bi-partisan problem that nobody is interested in solving.

    Appalled (03f53c)

  294. Every other state in the nation are at least 60%.

    Not true.

    Every state but Delaware requires legislature-crafted amendments to be approved by voters. ……

    Most states permit voters to ratify legislature-crafted amendments by a simple majority vote. But three states set a supermajority threshold — a two-thirds vote in New Hampshire, a three-fifths vote for most amendments in Florida, and a 55-percent threshold for most amendments in Colorado. Four states — Hawaii, Minnesota, Tennessee, and Wyoming require amendments to be approved by a majority of voters in the entire election; in these states, voters who abstain from voting on an amendment essentially count as no votes. Illinois combines these approaches to voter ratification, allowing amendments to be approved if they are supported either by three-fifths of voters on the amendment or by a majority of voters participating in the entire election.

    Seventeen states currently provide another path for enacting amendments: via citizen-initiative processes. …….
    ………
    Once citizen-initiated amendments qualify for the ballot, they generally have to be ratified in the same fashion as legislature-referred amendments, by a simple majority of voters in most states and by a supermajority of voters in several states. ……..

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  295. Kevin picks some of the most popular and successful presidents in history and then says that they are populists

    All of them were thrust into power by populist movements. The point I was trying to make is that the MOVEMENT is what is populist, not the politician.

    Lincoln most of all. If you read about his road to the nomination, and the groundswell that led to the Republican Party and Convention of 1860, this will be more than obvious. It was the peak of a sea-change of popular opposition to slavery, not some carefully nuanced retuning of political thought.

    Similarly, FDR came to power at the from of popular anger at the economic power structure of the times, and the catastrophe of the Great Depression.

    Reagan was elected due to the failures of the Great Society, the overbearing regulation of everything, the inability of the government to deal with the Soviets, Iran or nearly any other foreign actor in the wake of Vietnam. It was probably the only moment he could have been elected.

    It’s not about the person who fills the role, it’s about the popular movement that brings these people to the fore. It did not have to be Trump in 2016. But no one else stood up to lead the movement that was there. How an opportunist like Ted Cruz missed it is a wonder.

    Kevin M (ed969f)

  296. Also, is influence peddling really a crime?

    If you mean that offering, giving, receiving or soliciting anything of value to influence the process of procuring goods or services, selecting consultants, or executing contracts, then yes. If simply lobbying someone, then no, unless the lobbyist is representing someone covered by the Foreign Agents Registration Act..

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  297. @297:

    It should be noted that initiative amendments usually have much higher signature requirements than initiative statutes. There are also limitations that doe not apply to amendments that come out of the legislature (e.g. California’s “single-issue” rule, or its ban on large rewrites).

    Considering that a constitutional amendment is hard to later amend, despite later popular will, the requirement of a 60% vote doesn’t seem unreasonable. California would have profited by such a rule.

    Kevin M (ed969f)

  298. The failure of Trump to divest himself of his hotels isn’t influence peddling, but was probably a violation of the Domestic Emoluments Clause (a.k.a. the Presidential Emoluments Clause) (Article II, § 1, Clause 7) and possibly the Foreign Emoluments Clause (Article I, § 9, Clause 8) the Constitution:

    In terms of the persons to whom they apply, the scope of the Domestic Emoluments Clause …….is clear from the Constitution’s text: The Domestic Emoluments Clause applies to the President…….

    The scope of the Foreign Emoluments Clause is less clear. By its terms, the Clause applies to any person holding an “Office of Profit or Trust under” the United States. The prevailing view of the Clause is that this language reaches only federal, and not state, officeholders. According to the Department of Justice’s Office of Legal Counsel (OLC), which has a developed body of opinions on the Foreign Emoluments Clause, offices “of profit” include those that receive a salary, while offices “of trust” are those that require discretion, experience, and skill. There is disagreement, however, over whether elected federal officers, such as the President, are subject to the Foreign Emoluments Clause. …….

    However, the court cases brought by various parties against Trump were all dismissed due to lack of standing. It appears the clauses are enforceable only through impeachment.

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  299. Considering that a constitutional amendment is hard to later amend

    In California constitutional amendments are amended at the drop of a hat.

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  300. Hi Rip,

    IANL so I use “infuence peddling” the way an average guy would describe it; not in the way DOJ would prosecute it. If Saudi Arabia rents the super-duper suite at a Trump hotel, or buy Hunter Biden’s “art”, they are doing it to make a statement to the guy they want to influence.

    Appalled (03f53c)

  301. but was probably a violation of the Domestic Emoluments Clause (a.k.a. the Presidential Emoluments Clause) (Article II, § 1, Clause 7) and possibly the Foreign Emoluments Clause (Article I, § 9, Clause 8) the Constitution:

    Emoluments are an old way of saying “tips” or payments for favors. Normal business transactions are not the same thing. George Effing Washington had many business dealings, often with government, as did a number of other well-heeled presidents in the 19th century.

    I’ve said before, and will say again: any interpretation of the Constitution that deters wealthy people from seeking high office is a mistake. Sure, some divest, but it cannot be made a qualification for a Constitutional office.

    And if we must, let’s start with Congress.

    Kevin M (ed969f)

  302. In California constitutional amendments are amended at the drop of a hat.

    Name the last one.

    Kevin M (ed969f)

  303. Morning Consult Republican Primary Tracking Poll 8/8/23

    ……….
    The bulk of the GOP’s electorate (59%) would back Trump if the primary or caucus were held in their state today, compared with 16% who would support DeSantis.
    Ramaswamy is backed by 8% of the party’s potential voters, followed by former Vice President Mike Pence (6%), and former South Carolina Gov. Nikki Haley, South Carolina Sen. Tim Scott and former New Jersey Gov. Chris Christie (each tied at 3%). Former Arkansas Gov. Asa Hutchinson is backed by 1% of the GOP’s expected electorate. (The rest of the field is at 0%.)
    ………
    Far more of Trump’s supporters (14%) than DeSantis’ (6%) are uncertain about where their loyalties would fall if their first choice weren’t in the race.
    ……….
    Hypothetical head-to-head matchups show Biden leading Trump by 1 point and DeSantis by 5 points among the general electorate. Voters are slightly more uncertain who they would support or say they would opt for “someone else” when Biden is matched up against DeSantis.
    ………
    Trump is popular with 81% of the party’s potential electorate, while 17% view him unfavorably. His net favorability rating has improved 16 points since mid-July.
    ………
    Christie’s net favorability rating is 18 points underwater, with 45% of potential GOP primary voters holding unfavorable views.
    ……..

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  304. An example of an “Emolument” was the $20 million the Saudis gave to Secretary of State Clinton’s foundation after she did them a solid.

    Kevin M (ed969f)

  305. @306:

    When the dam breaks wrt Trump (assuming it ever does), all this will be forgotten. Singularities are like that.

    Kevin M (ed969f)

  306. @296

    whembly,

    In fairness, they have been busy. You know, investigating January 6 and all that.

    I don’t think that’s fair.

    I’m sure they looked for instances of bribery but the simply fact of how zealous these prosecutors are.

    There also was a conscious decision to not charge Trump in the first two years of the Biden administration.

    Yeah, for political reasons. 😉

    Also, is influence peddling really a crime? I’m not sure it is. H Biden’s offense was not registering as a foreign agent and paying his taxes. It’s not sitting on Burisma’s board.

    Influence peddling isn’t a crime in a vacuum. The connecting thread that WOULD make it a crime, I think, is if it impacted public polices for corrupt purposes. (ie, I give you $5 million for you to do “x” for me).

    Look, the Clinton foundation (and its ilk), enormous advances for bad books or bad artwork, and prominent hotel stays are all ways to pass money from a rich guy to a President or their relatives. It’s a bi-partisan problem that nobody is interested in solving.

    Appalled (03f53c) — 8/8/2023 @ 8:46 am

    Yup.

    We get the politicians we deserve.

    whembly (db54cc)

  307. @297 Rip Murdock (d2a2a8) — 8/8/2023 @ 8:48 am
    Rip, your google-fu is on point here. Thanks.

    whembly (db54cc)

  308. Now you are on the “any crime” bandwagon, too, Kevin?

    DRJ (51bb15)

  309. What makes the Rule of Law work is people obeying the law. Deciding the law doesn’t always work or issues are more important than holding people accountable is why we have chaos.

    DRJ (51bb15)

  310. Name the last one.

    Kevin M (ed969f) — 8/8/2023 @ 9:24 am

    November 3, 2020-Proposition 16: Allows Diversity as a Factor in Public Employment, Education, and Contracting Decisions, which would have repealed Proposition 209 passed in 1996. It failed.

    November 8, 2022-Proposition 1: Constitutional Right to Reproductive Freedom. It passed.

    The next constitutional amendment will be on the March 5th Presidential Primary Ballot-Assembly Constitutional Amendment No. 5—A resolution to propose to the people of the State of California an amendment to the Constitution of the State, by repealing and adding Section 7.5 of Article I thereof, relating to (marriage equality) rights. This would repeal Proposition 8, a citizen initiative constitutional amendment passed in 2008.

    Here is a summary of constitutional amendments considered by California voters 1974-2020. During that period, 64 elections were held with a total of 209 constitutional amendments. Of the 64 elections, only three didn’t have at least one constitutional amendment on the ballot, either placed by the legislature or by citizen initiative.

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  311. @312 Here’s my over-arching issue….

    We have a problem if the same zeal and gusto isn’t applied to Democrats like, *cough*HRC / Joe Biden*cough*, as it was applied to Trump.

    Rule of law matters diddly if there’s a 2-tier justice system.

    THAT’S why there’s chaos here…

    whembly (db54cc)

  312. Everyone thinks their concerns and their issues are too important to give up on. Environmentalists think they are saving the world, so they see breaking rules as noble. So do Trump supporters. (Trump does, too, albeit not for issues but for himself.) That is not how governing by agreement, as opposed to force, works.

    DRJ (51bb15)

  313. But as long as you put your issues first, whembly, get used to chaos.

    DRJ (51bb15)

  314. Rip, your google-fu is on point here. Thanks.

    whembly (db54cc) — 8/8/2023 @ 9:30 am

    Living in California, I knew your statement was incorrect (see post 313 above).

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  315. Rip, your google-fu is on point here. Thanks.

    whembly (db54cc) — 8/8/2023 @ 9:30 am

    The Internet is your friend.

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  316. @316

    But as long as you put your issues first, whembly, get used to chaos.

    DRJ (51bb15) — 8/8/2023 @ 9:52 am

    Oh, I’m willing and able to. 😉

    whembly (db54cc)

  317. Now you are on the “any crime” bandwagon, too, Kevin?

    Hardly. I’m just suggesting that the powers that be are. Except when it suits their purpose.

    The whole idea of “discretion” in executing the law seems to be contrary to the promise to “faithfully execute the law.” For the executive to pick and choose what parts of laws to follow makes legislative decisions are compromise immaterial, and makes a mockery of the Rule of Law.

    For me to point out that mockery is not to express a preference.

    Kevin M (ed969f)

  318. * AND compromise

    Kevin M (ed969f)

  319. @318

    The Internet is your friend.

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8) — 8/8/2023 @ 9:58 am

    If you knew what I do for a living… no, the internet is NOT my friend.

    whembly (db54cc)

  320. But, perhaps, there is a point where one is a schmuck to fight by the Rules when your opponent keeps punching you in the nuts.

    “Gentlemen don’t read other gentlemen’s mail”

    Kevin M (ed969f)

  321. Question: How would Congress pass a compromise immigration reform law when the Executive feels able to ignore parts of it? The necessary tradeoffs that comprise such compromises rely utterly on the expectation that each section will be followed.

    But what we have now is presidential preference substituted for large portions of the current law, and candidates compete on how they would substitute different preferences.

    Kevin M (ed969f)

  322. whembly (db54cc) — 8/8/2023 @ 7:49 am

    This is how someone like Pinonchet rose to power.

    Pinochet rose to power in Chile because he was the only high ranking military figure who pretended to support Salvador Allende.

    Allende ws ruinig the economy of Chile.

    What killed democracy i Chile was oone-time six-year presidential term, plus the legislature ignoring the provision that when a candidate for president got too small a percentage of the vote (I forgot whether it was 40% or 50%) the legislature picked.

    They agreed they should pick the plurality winner (Allende at about 35%) rather than the Condercet choice.

    We have the same problem with major party candidates for president,

    The system of not having the convention choose one of the also rans or someone else altogether when no one has a majority on the first ballot is what has given us rotten presidential candidates: McGovern, Carter, Clinton and Trump.

    So, if you want better GOP candidates, do the hard work and campaign for better candidates.

    Sammy Finkelman (67b38b)

  323. @326

    So, if you want better GOP candidates, do the hard work and campaign for better candidates.

    Sammy Finkelman (67b38b) — 8/8/2023 @ 10:59 am

    Yes. Absolutely this.

    Because if we fail, we deserve whomever is elected.

    whembly (5f7596)

  324. Question: How would Congress pass a compromise immigration reform law when the Executive feels able to ignore parts of it?

    As the Supreme Court has recognized most recently in US v. Texas (2023), Congress has continually failed to provide the necessary resources to completely enforce current immigration laws:

    ……….
    Article II of the Constitution assigns the “executive Power” to the President and provides that the President “shall take Care that the Laws be faithfully executed.” U. S. Const., Art. II, §1, cl. 1; §3. Under Article II, the Executive Branch possesses authority to decide “how to prioritize and how aggressively to pursue legal actions against defendants who violate the law.” TransUnion LLC, 594 U. S., at ___ (slip op., at 13); see Lujan, 504 U. S., at 576–578; Allen, 468 U. S., at 760–761.
    ………
    ………(T)his Court has declared that the Executive Branch also retains discretion over whether to remove a noncitizen from the United States. Arizona v. United States, 567 U. S. 387, 396 (2012) (“Federal officials, as an initial matter, must decide whether it makes sense to pursue removal at all”). In addition to the Article II problems raised by judicial review of the Executive Branch’s arrest and prosecution policies, courts generally lack meaningful standards for assessing the propriety of enforcement choices in this area. After all, the Executive Branch must prioritize its enforcement efforts. See Wayte v. United States, 470 U. S. 598, 607–608 (1985). That is because the Executive Branch (i) invariably lacks the resources to arrest and prosecute every violator of every law and (ii) must constantly react and adjust to the ever-shifting public-safety and public welfare needs of the American people. This case illustrates the point. As the District Court found, the Executive Branch does not possess the resources necessary to arrest or remove all of the noncitizens covered by §1226(c) and §1231(a)(2). That reality is not an anomaly—it is a constant. For the last 27 years since §1226(c) and §1231(a)(2) were enacted in their current form, all five Presidential administrations have determined that resource constraints necessitated prioritization in making immigration arrests.

    In light of inevitable resource constraints and regularly changing public-safety and public-welfare needs, the Executive Branch must balance many factors when devising arrest and prosecution policies. ……..
    ………

    My emphasis.

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  325. , Congress has continually failed to provide the necessary resources to completely enforce current immigration laws:

    And they don’t want to.

    Sammy Finkelman (1d215a)

  326. So, if you want better GOP candidates, do the hard work and campaign for better candidates.

    This was from
    whembly (db54cc) — 8/8/2023 @ 7:49 am a quote I forgot to delete

    No, if you want better GOP candidates, try to get candidates to campaign to change the rules.

    Sammy Finkelman (1d215a)

  327. take what you think the law should be based on your sympathies or politics and present it deceitfully as what the law inarguably is.

    Yes, they do this.

    Sammy Finkelman (1d215a)

  328. Someone argues (at least in part) that high interest rates cause and do not stop inflation:

    https://www.wsj.com/articles/how-high-mortgage-rates-fuel-inflation-construction-sticky-fine-tune-3e40677d

    The rate hikes since March 2022 may be raising rather than lowering measured housing costs by having unusual effects on supply and demand. Housing prices are trending upward this year, partially because rate hikes suppress the supply of housing as well as the demand. Some 40% fewer existing homes are for sale than before the pandemic. That’s because about 90% of outstanding mortgages are financed at fixed low rates. No wonder owners don’t want to sell.

    When rate hikes lower supply more than demand, it raises rather than lowers housing prices. Meantime, as higher prices and financing costs deter would-be home buyers, rental demand and prices have increased as well. As a result, rate hikes may be inflationary rather than deflationary for 40% of core CPI….

    Given that housing prices are up for 2023, housing-cost inflation is forthcoming, as it is positively related to such prices with a lag. This suggests a continuation of sticky core inflation. But fighting it with more rate hikes may make it even stickier.

    The reverse of these arguments is also true—rate cuts in 2024 could lower housing prices. When the mortgage penalty for selling gets cut, supply may come back more than demand. Housing construction could thus take a hit from future rate cuts.

    Because the rate hikes were so rapid, credit-based industries such as housing and cars may not be as rate-sensitive, and may even operate in the opposite direction for a time. This adds to the general argument that well-intentioned bureaucrats can’t easily forecast or fine-tune our unpredictable economy.

    The bottom note reveals he was a Trump appointee:

    Mr. Philipson, an economist at the University of Chicago, was a member of the White House Council of Economic Advisers, 2017-20, and its acting chairman, 2019-20.

    I never said that Trump wasn’t a better bet on some issues (but a cynic on immigration). But Trump didn’t entirely listen.

    Sammy Finkelman (1d215a)

  329. https://www.nytimes.com/2023/08/04/opinion/us-economy-debt-crisis.html

    Deficits, which lead to more debt, increase the numerator of that ratio. But inflation and economic growth increase the denominator, which, other things being equal, reduces the ratio. Do a bit of algebra, and you get this expression for debt dynamics:

    Change in debt/G.D.P. = primary deficit/G.D.P. + (r-g)*(debt/G.D.P.)

    The primary deficit is the budget deficit, not counting interest payments; r is the interest rate on government debt; and g is the economy’s growth rate. You can get a debt spiral if r is significantly larger than g. In that case, rising debt leads to faster accumulation of debt, and we’re off to the races.

    But a few years ago, Olivier Blanchard, one of the world’s most respected (and, dare I say, respectable) macroeconomists, gave a presidential address to the American Economic Association in which he showed that historically, r has generally been less than g. Hence, no debt spiral.

    Sammy Finkelman (1d215a)

  330. Everybody on every side keeps on saying that Joe Biden got rid of a Ukrainian prosecutor but there is no corroboration for any of his story.

    Joe Biden was not put in charge of Ukrainian policy. He was not supposed to announce loan guarantees His visit to Kiev (n December 2015) did not take place any time close to when the prosecutor was voted out (in March, 2016) , and that wasn’t close in time to the granting of the loan guarantee (in June 2016) and it was announced it would be held hostage in November 2015 and not by Joe Biden by surprise. The firing was not a key requirement. It was a loan guarantee, not a loan.

    Sammy Finkelman (1d215a)

  331. We see a lot of that here also.

    Rip Murdock (bac490) — 8/8/2023 @ 6:55 am

    That was much of my intended implication.

    lurker (cd7cd4)

  332. That may be, but it is the only law we’ve got. Those who oppose whatever law they disagree with should advocate that it be changed to reflect their preferences.

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8) — 8/8/2023 @ 8:34 am

    Exactly. And if my representatives won’t change the laws I hate, I should vote them out and elect ones who will. And if I can’t persuade my fellow constituents to do that, maybe it means they don’t share my hostility to the laws I want changed. This is after all a democracy.

    Regardless, the only thing misrepresenting laws as what I’d like them to be does is spread ignorance and misplaced outrage. And as we’ve seen too often recently, telling people their laws, norms and institutions are unworthy of respect invites extremists on both sides to burn the village to save the village. Suddenly every incel with a ski mask and a baseball bat thinks he’s Sam Adams. Demagoguery has costs.

    lurker (cd7cd4)

  333. “Joe Biden was not put in charge of Ukrainian policy. He was not supposed to announce loan guarantees His visit to Kiev (n December 2015) did not take place any time close to when the prosecutor was voted out (in March, 2016) , and that wasn’t close in time to the granting of the loan guarantee (in June 2016) and it was announced it would be held hostage in November 2015 and not by Joe Biden by surprise”

    Which brings up the obvious question of how Joe knew how to insert himself as the hero of this story he knew nothing about. Possibly suggesting that though Joe’s timeline is off, but he actually did insert himself into something that was “none of his business, but maybe his sons business”? This could easily be taken as evidence that the only reason Joe Biden became involved was because Hunter was talking to him, needing Joe to make some noise. The common elements in this huge coincidence are Joe and Hunter

    steveg (33ddec)

  334. It’s going to take awhile before we know the true extent of the damage caused by the Maui wildfire, but we’re feeling it because there’s nothing left of Mrs. Montagu’s family’s museum but embers and ash.

    Paul Montagu (d52d7d)

  335. steveg (33ddec) — 8/8/2023 @ 5:36 pm

    Possibly suggesting that though Joe’s timeline is off,

    Joe didn’t give a timeline. Everybody at first thought it was March, 2016, but then they discovered that the last time Joe Biden visited Kiev before the firing or what could be called the firing, was December, so the Washington Post moved the story to December, 2015.

    but he actually did insert himself into something that was “none of his business, but maybe his sons business”?

    He inserted himself into an event he had nothing to do with…it’s a total lie, whose apparent point is that he was a vice president with superpowers.

    https://www.wsj.com/articles/impeaching-a-trump-impeachment-hunter-biden-partisan-investigation-ukraine-gop-election-847d972

    Let the partisan spittle fly, as it did during the first Trump impeachment. Who sacked Ukraine’s prosecutor general in 2016 and why? This question is back thanks to congressional testimony by former Hunter Biden partner Devon Archer.

    Whatever happened, it wasn’t what Donald Trump said happened. It also wasn’t what Joe Biden said happened. His claim to have arranged the firing of prosecutor Viktor Shokin with an ultimatum to then-President Petro Poroshenko was just another Joe tall tale. Mr. Shokin’s dismissal came months later at the behest of several Western governments.

    But Mr. Archer’s testimony puts the kibosh on the simple tale told by Trump partisans that Mr. Shokin was canned to protect Joe and Hunter Biden. According to Mr. Archer, Mr. Shokin was valued by Ukraine’s leadership precisely because he kept a lid on the long-running investigation of Burisma, a gas company on whose board Hunter sat.

    This accords with my take at the time. Mr. Biden didn’t need to do anything. In fact, he was free, along with the European Union and other donors, to strike an anticorruption pose over Mr. Shokin because he knew Ukraine had every incentive to protect the Bidens.

    Not sure I understand that last sentence.

    Sammy Finkelman (1532a3)

  336. Joe Biden actually told two different versions of hos he caused the firing..

    Homan Jenkins doesn’t realize this

    Sammy Finkelman (1532a3)

  337. Badge-heavy thugs. There was no need to SWAT him. They had talked with him earlier and knew he was an old man. They could have waited him out and talked him down.

    nk (df56ed)

  338. They could have waited him out and talked him down.

    nk (df56ed) — 8/9/2023 @ 6:14 pm

    Mormons often have a year’s supply of food and other things necessary for survival. 🤨

    norcal (bc0bb5)

  339. Paul, I’m sorry about the loss of your wife’s family’s (ancestors’?) home. I hope that’s all that was lost, and that any family still on Maui are personally safe.

    lurker (cd7cd4)

  340. @341. They’d been talking to him since at least March. Instead of knocking it off, he increased his threats. His family should have intervened. He was clearly not well. But there was plenty of time for him to come to his senses, if he had any. Most of these cases (and there are lots of them for every President) end with people stopping making threats.

    JRH (afc554)

  341. But ugh it is sad. I do get the point. I wonder if they tried getting some family members on the scene to talk to him? If not they should have.

    JRH (afc554)

  342. @337 I am sorry too. I read a little about that church online. Sounds like an incredible legacy.

    JRH (afc554)

  343. Badge-heavy thugs. There was no need to SWAT him.

    He had threatened to shoot at the FBI if they returned. He may have been Mormon, but I suspect copious amounts of alcohol were involved.

    Kevin M (ed969f)

  344. Badge-heavy thugs. There was no need to SWAT him.

    His online posts included photos of him displaying his weapons. Old men can still shoot.

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  345. Felony complaint against Craig Deleeuw Robertson, including the specific threats.

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  346. he knew Ukraine had every incentive to protect the Bidens.

    To protect Burisma or Zlochevsky. Or that’s what Burisma’s lawyers were telling people.

    George Kent complained to Vice President Biden personally that Hunter’s presence on the Burisma board was interfering with the U.S. government’s anti-corruption efforts.

    Sammy Finkelman (1532a3)

  347. Felony complaint against Craig Deleeuw Robertson, including the specific threats.

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8) — 8/10/2023 @ 9:27 am

    Thank you for that, Rip. Mr. Robertson was an even bigger piece of work than I thought.

    norcal (290511)

  348. He may have been Mormon, but I suspect copious amounts of alcohol were involved.

    Kevin M (ed969f) — 8/10/2023 @ 8:27 am

    I doubt that very much.

    https://www.abc4.com/news/central-utah/neighbors-speak-about-the-provo-man-killed-by-the-fbi/

    1) He was a church-going Mormon.

    2) He was the financial clerk for his congregation.

    3) He lived in Provo, which is Mormon Mecca (much more so than Salt Lake City). Your neighborhood IS your congregation. My mother lives in Provo. Her sister used to live next door. A rumor started in the neighborhood that my aunt was Catholic because she wore a cross on a necklace! Gladys Kravitz types abound.

    That made him all the more scary, in that he was almost certainly doing it sober. It appears to me he was a man of low education and strong emotions who consumed nothing but MAGA propaganda.

    I don’t blame the authorities for showing up SWAT style.

    norcal (290511)

  349. 337. here’s a somewhat poor quality video with unnecessary music of the interior of the Baldwin Museum

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=znp32_Yr3o4

    Sammy Finkelman (1d215a)

  350. Giuliani is an idiot:

    https://people.com/rudy-giuliani-audio-transcripts-sexual-assault-lawsuit-7569212

    Put it this way:

    He even had a theory that Jewish men had to remain faithful to their wives, and that reduced their sexual performance (because presumably they got less practice) while Italian men did not.

    He also did not like the fact that Jews were still celebrating Passover after 3,000 years (I would guess because it made some people temporarily unavailable to him)

    Now it’s not tapes that have been submitted to a court, but transcripts.

    Sammy FInkelman (1d215a)

  351. And all these things were said to a woman.

    Sammy FInkelman (1d215a)

  352. From Sammy’s link:

    Dunphy’s lawsuit also alleges Giuliani was selling presidential pardons for $2 million.

    nk (b85928)

  353. From Sammy’s link:

    Dunphy’s lawsuit also alleges Giuliani was selling presidential pardons for $2 million.

    nk (b85928) — 8/10/2023 @ 4:07 pm

    Well, Rudy sure wasn’t going to earn anything by endorsing a hair dye company.

    norcal (290511)

  354. https://www.powerlineblog.com/archives/2023/08/epa-tries-to-destroy-the-grid.php

    The Environmental Protection Agency is proposing a new rule limiting CO2 emissions from fossil fuel-fired (coal and natural gas) power plants. As you might expect, given the ideological bent of EPA, the rule is a Trojan horse, the real purpose of which is to induce the nation’s coal plants and some natural gas power generation to shut down under the increasing weight of federal regulations.

    Center of the American Experiment is sounding the alarm on EPA’s rule. Our energy team was hired by the State of North Dakota to model the EPA proposal to determine whether it could supply reliable electricity to the 15 states on the MISO (Midcontinent Independent System Operator) grid. Our team found that the grid implied by the EPA rule, heavily dependent on sporadic wind and solar power, would result in devastating blackouts. They further calculated that if the grid were to be made mostly (but not entirely) immune to blackouts, while still complying with the EPA rule, another $246 billion would have to be spent within the MISO system alone. That public comment is embedded below.

    People voting for Democrats will be so surprised when the grid fails and if you are lucky enough to occasionally have power your rates will skyrocket.

    But it’s about abortion and putting those hicks in their place.

    NJRob (fcb94c)

  355. https://twitter.com/TuckerCarlson/status/1689783814594174976

    @TuckerCarlson
    Ep. 15 Former Capitol Police Chief Steven Sund reveals what really happened on January 6th. Our Fox News interview with him never aired, so we invited him back.

    O.o

    Unlike his previous interviews, Tuckers just let the interviewer talk, only asking simply questions.

    This is the first I’ve been in contact from Chief Sund’s perspective…which is probably the number 1 guy you’d want to interview to determine what, exactly, happened in J6. That tells me, that there had to be concerted efforts to minimize this individual’s testimony.

    Evidently, he has citations, from government testimonies, GAO, J6 committees to back up his perspectives and assertions. So, I’m curious about his book.

    Has anyone really taken in what Chief Sund be articulating?

    whembly (5f7596)

  356. He testified before Congress.

    DRJ (eae79e)

  357. January 6 may have been orchestrated by the government, not necessarily President Trump’s government, just, you know, the government, and, anyway, nobody told Sund anything, so he never knew and he still does not know, but you have to suspect that it was for political purposes.

    What? What did you expect from Tucker Carlson? An Inquiry into the Nature and Causes of the Wealth of Nations?

    nk (9fd2b3)

  358. @361

    He testified before Congress.

    DRJ (eae79e) — 8/11/2023 @ 6:28 am

    Yes, he did, but Chief Sunds explained here that J6 committee wasn’t all that interested from his perspective.

    But, I would implore you, please stop treating J6 committee as the end-all-be-all determination of all the things we need to know about J6. Because, if you’re honest, you’d realize that J6 committee was more about setting a political narrative, rather than a good faith investigation as to what happened that day.

    So, please, if you have time, watch that interview and let me know what you think.

    whembly (5f7596)

  359. I don’t need no DC bureaucratic clock watcher (literally, Sund can tell you how long he was “denied access to National Guard troops”, it was 71 minutes) to tell me what happened on January 6. I know what happened on January 6.

    Trump spent two months before the election telling his wackos that it was going to be rigged and stolen. Then he spent two months after the election telling them that it was rigged and stolen. Then he gathered the most agitated ones in Washington DC, pointed at the Capitol, and said “Sic em, Fidos!”

    That’s what happened.

    nk (9fd2b3)

  360. https://twitter.com/ChiefSund/status/1689642969153101825

    @ChiefSund
    On January 6, even while we’re under attack, I was restricted by federal law (2 U.S. Code § 1970 Assistance by Executive departments and agencies) from bringing in federal assistance, to include the National Guard, without FIRST obtaining approval from the House and Senate Sergeants at Arms. (Irving was the House SAA. Stenger was the Senate SAA)

    Courage Under Fire p. 137: “Between 12:58 and when I finally receive approval for the National Guard at 2:09, I have made thirty-two calls to coordinate response support for my officers, including at least eleven calls to the sergeants at arms regarding my request for the National Guard.”

    Image from 2021 Congressional report:

    whembly (5f7596)

  361. @364

    nk (9fd2b3) — 8/11/2023 @ 6:51 am

    Tell me your spirit animal is a sheep, without telling me.

    whembly (5f7596)

  362. https://twitter.com/ChiefSund/status/1687589523104862208

    So if the Department of Defense, which makes up nine of the eighteen Intelligence Community (IC) agencies, had such damn concerning intelligence regarding violence against lawmakers and my officers on Capitol Hill on January 6, why didn’t they implement a Duty to Warn as required by the Director of National Intelligence’s Intelligence Community Directive 191. J6 COULD HAVE BEEN PREVENTED!
    https://www.dni.gov/files/documents/ICD/ICD_191.pdf

    whembly (5f7596)

  363. https://twitter.com/ChiefSund/status/1687546983630675968

    Chief Steven Sund
    @ChiefSund
    Excerpts from my book, Courage Under Fire:

    “Department of Defense organizations make up half of the intelligence community’s eighteen agencies. It is now apparent that both Miller and Milley had significant concerns regarding upcoming events at the Capitol on January 6. The question that needs to be asked is, if Miller and Milley had such significant concerns, why weren’t those concerns pursued or shared with the appropriate authorities?”

    p. 313: “Only the chief of Capitol Police, not the DoD, can revoke permits on Capitol grounds, yet neither man reached out to me to discuss these concerns. Was this because they knew that if they informed me, I would immediately notify the two sergeants at arms and demand military support to protect my officers and perimeter on January 6? Milley has stated he feared that Trump was seeking a “Reichstag moment” in which he could invoke the Insurrection Act. But instead of notifying the chief on the Hill regarding the threats of violence, SECDEF Miller and SECARMY McCarthy implemented unprecedented restrictions on military assistance to law enforcement.”

    whembly (5f7596)

  364. https://twitter.com/ChiefSund/status/1687539433979969546

    Chief Steven Sund
    @ChiefSund
    Now that you’re listening, let’s go over the facts:

    Excerpts from my book, Courage Under Fire…
    p. 280-281: “Later on the fourth, during an interagency conference call, Miller and General Milley both raised their growing concerns about violence. Specifically, they were concerned about the demonstration permits that had been issued at the US Capitol. According to Miller’s testimony, their concern about the permitted groups at the Capitol was so great that both Miller and Milley inquired about the ability to revoke the permits. They must have known that was an overreach, but the mere fact they were discussing the possibility of revoking permits for First Amendment activities on Capitol grounds should give everyone pause. During the call, General Milley also suggested locking down the city to control the violence that he believed to be coming. For the highest-ranking military officer in the country to recommend locking down the nation’s capital in order to control violence, they must have had some pretty damned concerning information!”

    whembly (5f7596)

  365. Now I’ve posted excerpt from Chief Sund’s twitter page about his perspective, because I don’t know if some of ya’ll would go to Tucker and watch his interview. I get that, Tucker is polarizing.

    But, take a look at Sund’s own twitter feed.

    I’m not here to defend Trump and those who participated in the riot. I don’t care about that right now.

    What this guy is saying, as THE person responsible for the security of Congress… is saying something very hinky was going on from his perspective.

    Lastly, @DRJ, if you hadn’t watch Tucker’s interview, Chief Sund answered:
    When asked if the January 6 Committee addressed any of these issues, failures, or questions, Sund replied, “No, sir.”

    whembly (5f7596)

  366. Whembly —

    Congress was unprepared to be stormed by angry people and the military should have known and was slow about it. Congress has not fixed the problem and indeed seems unconcerned.

    Ok. I understand it’s important, but why does it supplant (because that’s what makes Tucker concentrate on this) the legal culpability of Trump for what happened?

    Appalled (2ea132)

  367. Whembly, I agree. The fact that administration officials were concerned about violence from
    Trump supporters and didn’t share that concern with the DC police is a dereliction of duty. They appear to have been more concerned about angering their boss or giving him a pretext to violate the constitution. The way they handled that concern is appalling.

    Time123 (7e08b7)

  368. Blowing smoke. It sells.

    nk (9fd2b3)

  369. Example:

    “Department of Defense organizations make up half of the intelligence community’s eighteen agencies.

    Water makes up 60% of human body weight. So what? Is this clown actually claiming that the military is conducting law enforcement surveillance, on Americans, in America, outside of military bases and reservations?

    nk (9fd2b3)

  370. @371

    Ok. I understand it’s important, but why does it supplant (because that’s what makes Tucker concentrate on this) the legal culpability of Trump for what happened?

    Appalled (2ea132) — 8/11/2023 @ 7:35 am

    Trump’s culpability is a separate question and being worked through.

    We’ve yet have had a full accounting on J6, that’s what I’m focusing on. Especially now that we know that the J6 committee explicitedly refused to investigate Pelosi. It was only a CYA and narrative setting event.

    There’s too many unanswered questions.

    whembly (5f7596)

  371. @372

    Whembly, I agree. The fact that administration officials were concerned about violence from
    Trump supporters and didn’t share that concern with the DC police is a dereliction of duty. They appear to have been more concerned about angering their boss or giving him a pretext to violate the constitution. The way they handled that concern is appalling.

    Time123 (7e08b7) — 8/11/2023 @ 7:41 am

    This is bothering me quite a bit.

    J6 has been used to tar not only Trump and his supporters, but to tar Republican voters as well.

    I can sorta understand the initial hesitancy (though I don’t agree with it) of NOT providing NG units with Capitol police on J6 due to “optics”. But, the absolutely refusal to approve additional resources when requested by THE CHIEF OF CAPITOL POLICE is downright appalling and to be fair, feeds this narrative that some in leadership wanted SOMETHING bad to happen that day.

    I don’t know how else one could explain it? Can you come up with a rational explanation of the systemic failures?

    whembly (5f7596)

  372. Zero chance whembly. Too many are to invested in the narrative to change their opinion or even objectively read contrary information. It’s become religion to some.

    NJRob (a8aa4c)

  373. NJRob,

    What does the contrary information actually change? Contributory negligence in keeping the rabble out is important — why? Our country had it coming to us because madam liberty was wearing her dress too short?

    Appalled (ca26e7)

  374. “Stop me before I insurrect more!” Yeah, “some in leadership wanted SOMETHING bad to happen that day”. Their names are Donald, John, and Trump.

    nk (9fd2b3)

  375. Here’s what some British bettors are saying about our upcoming presidential election.

    Jim Miller (301a58)

  376. @378

    “Stop me before I insurrect more!” Yeah, “some in leadership wanted SOMETHING bad to happen that day”. Their names are Donald, John, and Trump.

    nk (9fd2b3) — 8/11/2023 @ 8:52 am

    Are you sure you’re not asset?

    Did you forget to sign into the right account?

    whembly (5f7596)

  377. What does the contrary information actually change?

    I am not sure if either you or I understand your question but I will attempt an answer to what I think you are concerned about.

    For one, if Sund was able to stop the riot well before the perimeter of Congress, the objections to the election would have continued to have been stated and debated by congressional members, instead of being cut off. And secondly, had the riot been quelled in its infancy, there would have been a real lack of precedent for the charges that are necessary to keep Trump out of office for the rest of his life.

    Even favorable ”fact-checks” make the point:

    …. Biden said: “We just have to demonstrate that he will not take power by, if we, if he does run. I’m making sure he, under legitimate efforts of our Constitution, does not become the next President again.”…

    …As the footage and transcript show, the discussion was couched firmly in conversation that referenced the January 6 Capitol attacks.

    Referencing the riots, Biden said that “nothing like this has happened since the Civil War” and leaders had asked him the question whether the U.S. was “the same democracy we’ve always been”….

    But DRUMPH!!! and TUCKER!!😡🤬!!!

    BuDuh (4214e4)

  378. Are you sure you’re not asset?

    Did you forget to sign into the right account?

    Try the blocking script. I only see his poo flinging when it gets quoted by someone else. There is no serious conversation with nk like there is with DRJ.

    BuDuh (4214e4)

  379. I get it. It’s the agent provocateur scenario that won’t get Sund and Carlson sued by Ray Epps.

    nk (9fd2b3)

  380. Or, to credit asset since you mentioned him, is it “some in leadership” gave the January 6 rioters the rope by which they would hang themselves?

    nk (9fd2b3)

  381. Does it seem strange that Garland appointed the same guy, Weiss, who approved the sweetheart deal with Hunter Biden to now be the special counsel for Hunter Biden?

    whembly (5f7596)

  382. People voting for Democrats will be so surprised when the grid fails and if you are lucky enough to occasionally have power your rates will skyrocket.

    If you think you will get by with your own rooftop solar, know that most areas require that the solar array not provide power to the house (and therefore the local grid) if the grid is down for safety reasons. To get around this, you have to have full separation from the grid, which means that you have to provide your own battery storage for nighttime use.

    Kevin M (ed969f)

  383. I mean, thinking about some more, this is quite literally the exact opposite of independence and accountability.

    Talk about brazen.

    Joe Biden be better off to simply pardon Hunter.

    whembly (5f7596)

  384. nk (9fd2b3) — 8/11/2023 @ 6:51 am

    Indeed. But as Sammy will point out, he also said “Don’t be violent!” so it’s not his fault.

    Kevin M (ed969f)

  385. I get it. It’s the agent provocateur scenario that won’t get Sund and Carlson sued by Ray Epps.

    The only agent provocateur in this was Donald Trump. At best you can argue that the Deep State allowed things to proceed so that Trump would be discredited. But it was still Trump who encouraged the Proud Boys and their ilk to show up, and who sent them down to the Capitol, knowing full well their intentions. It’s not like they hid that gallows under their coat.

    That Sund was not aware was on Sund. It should have been obvious and he cannot both claim it was not and that everyone else knew. He got fired over it and now he’s pissed.

    Maybe they should have prevented it from happening, but exposing Trump and his plot was important, too. Hard on the Capitol Police, of course, but Sund is partly responsible for that.

    Kevin M (ed969f)

  386. whembly (5f7596) — 8/11/2023 @ 8:04 am

    But, the absolutely refusal to approve additional resources when requested by THE CHIEF OF CAPITOL POLICE is downright appalling and to be fair, feeds this narrative that some in leadership wanted SOMETHING bad to happen that day.

    No, I think the planners of the storming of the Capitol had at least one mole in the Capitol police, because the intelligence assessment was altered after Jan 3 to the point of even casting doubt on whether the rally at the Ellipse was going to take place!

    It’s on page 45ff of the Senate report (which doesn’t say there was a mole but give the explanation by the Capitol Police that only one person wrote that ne

    https://www.documentcloud.org/documents/20801778-report-examining-the-jan-6-us-capitol-attack

    Here’s another Senate report:

    https://www.hsgac.senate.gov/wp-content/uploads/230627_HSGAC-Majority-Report_Jan-6-Intel.pdfw intelligence assessment.

    No member of Congress would have risked someone getting hurt – it had to be a mole.

    And the Democrats on the Hill have covered that up (because they must have figured it out) to protect themselves and also because they want to blame Trump personally for the riot – and the only way they could do that was to claim that Trump’s speech caused it (while we know from many sources that it was planned in advance and besides which it’s impossible for his speech to have had that result.

    I don’t know how else one could explain it? Can you come up with a rational explanation of the systemic failures?

    Sammy Finkelman (7eb214)

  387. Does it seem strange that Garland appointed the same guy, Weiss, who approved the sweetheart deal with Hunter Biden to now be the special counsel for Hunter Biden?

    I’m confused. It seems like just yesterday Weiss was the victim of DoJ interference, who was forced to agree to this deal by his bosses and the stacking of his office with Bidenista underlings.

    If they had appointed someone else (a Democrat, of course) it would take months for him to get up to speed and the assumption would be that he was a shill anyway.

    Kevin M (ed969f)

  388. Meanwhile, Trump is going to have speech restrictions regarding J6 going forward.

    Kevin M (ed969f)

  389. As I recall, it was already established that the intelligence community under Trump failed to adequately brief Capitol Police on the potential for violence and rioting…

    The report says the failures leading up to Jan. 6 were “not failures to obtain intelligence, noting that the FBI and the Department of Homeland Security Office of Intelligence and Analysis obtained numerous tips “in the days and weeks leading up to the attack that should have raised alarms.”

    “Rather, those agencies failed to fully and accurately assess the severity of the threat identified by that intelligence, and formally disseminate guidance to their law enforcement partners with sufficient urgency and alarm to enable those partners to prepare for the violence that ultimately occurred,” the report states.

    The report casts the agency’s actions as a “failure of imagination”, fueled by a “bias toward discounting intelligence that indicated an unprecedented event.”

    The report says intelligence analysts and leaders “failed to sound the alarm about Jan. 6th in part because they could not conceive that the U.S. Capitol Building would be overrun by rioters.”

    The Capitol Police Board took responsibility and resigned, and did Mr. Sund. The rioters are also being held to account through the judicial system. What’s left are the parties who brought them there with the tease that it would be “wild”, who fomented a riot with warm-up acts such as the guy who said “trial by combat” and another who said “today is the day American patriots start taking down names and kicking ass”, and the Main Event guy who said “And we fight. We fight like Hell and if you don’t fight like Hell, you’re not going to have a country anymore,” and then didn’t lift a finger after three-plus hours of fighting.

    Paul Montagu (d52d7d)

  390. Kevin M (ed969f) — 8/11/2023 @ 10:00 am

    But as Sammy will point out, he also said “Don’t be violent!” so it’s not his fault.

    It’s not his fault because Trump wanted to go the rally in person and he would not have had he thought he would be in the middle of a riot.

    At the time of the second impeachment they were saying that Trump lied when he said he would be there but the Jan 6 committee proved that that was not true – he had to be tricked and stopped by aides from going to the Capitol.

    The request to be peaceful is a weak defense. More to the point is that word “fight” as used in political speeches. was not meant, and is never meant, literally.

    There’s NO WAY his speech could have caused that, and that is contradicted by the fact it was planned in advance, and if you want to say it could be anticipated why did no one watching anticipate that and warn the Capitol Police to get ready because they’re coming??

    Incidentally, my second link above should be:

    https://www.hsgac.senate.gov/wp-content/uploads/230627_HSGAC-Majority-Report_Jan-6-Intel.pdf

    Sammy Finkelman (7eb214)

  391. Finally, Garland came around to Montagu’s thinking on the subject. It was about time.

    Paul Montagu (d52d7d)

  392. Paul Montagu (d52d7d) — 8/11/2023 @ 10:22 am

    What’s left are the parties who brought them there with the tease that it would be “wild”,

    That’s not Trump, even though weeks before, the promoters of the protest got Trump to use the word “wild” in a tweet.

    who fomented a riot with warm-up acts such as the guy who said “trial by combat”

    That was Giuliani just being incoherent and using the wrong words. He meant like David and Goliath – let just two people argue, as is clear from the context.

    and another who said “today is the day American patriots start taking down names and kicking ass”,

    That was not said at the Ellipse.

    and the Main Event guy who said “And we fight. We fight like Hell and if you don’t fight like Hell, you’re not going to have a country anymore,”

    They went through that the second impeachment and showed how often the word fight is used metaphorically

    and then didn’t lift a finger after three-plus hours of fighting.

    That’s a lie. He lifted a finger before that. He called on them to not attack the police,

    He just wasn’t ready yet to ask them all to leave.

    Sammy Finkelman (7eb214)

  393. And maybe people are slowly c=beginning to come around to what I said about Joe Biden having told a tall tale when he claimed to have been instrumental in the firing of a Ukrainian prosecutor. (Putin must have thought there was no way Biden could wriggle out of that.)

    I don’t know if Joe Biden an survive politically if people realize that — and I think a lot of Democrats protected him too.

    Sammy Finkelman (7eb214)

  394. Taking down names doesn’have to mean attack them,and certainly not immediately.

    Sammy Finkelman (7eb214)

  395. It’s the Democrats who have been promoting this narrative about a three hour gap till Trump lifted a finger. In reality, he lifted a finger maybe an hour earlier. He was told that’s not enough and he has to tell them to disperse

    Sammy Finkelman (7eb214)

  396. That Sund was not aware was on Sund.

    Telling me you didn’t watch the interview…

    BuDuh (743b2f)

  397. That’s not Trump…

    It was Trump’s tweet, Sammy, under his name. He owns it.

    That’s a lie. He lifted a finger before that. He called on them to not attack the police,

    Trump was the singular person who could’ve stopped the riot, Sammy, without the National Guard going in and cracking skulls, and he fell way short until his tweet video, three-plus hours later.

    “I’m leaning more and more to Garland appointing a Special Counsel, Kevin. There’s always one more revelation that keeps coming out. Most of them don’t hold water (like Comer’s ridiculous claim that DOJ was going to jail Archer to prevent him from testifying, or anything from Comer for that matter), but there are enough to justify a more independent look-through.”
    –Paul Montagu, 7/31/2023

    Paul Montagu (d52d7d)

  398. it was already established that the intelligence community under Trump failed to adequately brief Capitol Police

    The intelligence community that has “six ways from Sunday at getting back at you”?

    BuDuh (743b2f)

  399. Sammy, without the National Guard going in and cracking skulls, and he fell way short until his tweet video

    See Whembly’s 7:00 AM.

    The National Guard could have done a lot. And done it sooner without skull cracking.

    Plus, who cares if a police attacking rioter gets his skull cracked?

    BuDuh (743b2f)

  400. Whembly, other rational explanations for not sharing concerns include

    -Not wanting to anger Trump or MAGA by implying they would be dangerous and violent.
    -concerns that it would be leaked to the media.
    -concerns that it would create esclation.
    -concerns about the optics of having a large force ensuring order.

    The idea that ppl wanted something to happen in order to tarnish Trump and his support isn’t supported by any evidence I’m aware of.

    Time123 (40217c)

  401. -Not wanting to anger Trump or MAGA by implying they would be dangerous and violent.
    -concerns that it would be leaked to the media.
    -concerns that it would create esclation.
    -concerns about the optics of having a large force ensuring order.

    9/11 called, they want their Truther arguments back.

    BuDuh (743b2f)

  402. To clarify my 10:55:

    “Plus, who cares if a rioter, that is attacking police, gets his skull cracked?”

    BuDuh (743b2f)

  403. To be clear, I’m not asserting any of those. I have no evidence to support them. The question whembly asked was if there were other explanations beyond what he’d suggested.

    Adding in case anyone other then Buduh was confused.

    Time123 (40217c)

  404. Trump spent two months before the election telling his wackos that it was going to be rigged and stolen. Then he spent two months after the election telling them that it was rigged and stolen. Then he gathered the most agitated ones in Washington DC, pointed at the Capitol, and said “Sic em, Fidos!”

    That’s what happened.

    nk (9fd2b3) — 8/11/2023 @ 6:51 am

    This. All day long.

    Those who place the blame elsewhere are falling prey to their own biases, and still can’t see Trump for the monster that he is. Neither can they fully appreciate the damage he has done.

    And before you accuse me of bias, note that I voted for Trump in 2016. I’ve been on both sides of the fence. How many here can say that?

    Tucker is a really good propagandist. He gets people to fall for his conspiratorial drama. That’s how he gets eyeballs. You don’t build a devoted following just talking about standard conservative fare. No sir. You need twists and hot takes, and Tucker has those in spades.

    norcal (9f3b00)

  405. And before you accuse me of bias

    Why would anyone do that?

    Tucker is a really good propagandist.

    Oh…

    Maybe Sund’s tweets and book, that are independent of your Tucker fear, will prevail to your un-biased side?

    It is a quite compelling interview but I understand the desire to not watch it while commenting about it.

    BuDuh (a33506)

  406. BuDuh (a33506) — 8/11/2023 @ 2:07 pm

    I don’t need to chase every thrown ball to know who to blame for J6.

    If you want to play fetch with Tucker, knock yourself out.

    norcal (9f3b00)

  407. And before you accuse me of bias

    *******

    I don’t need to chase every thrown ball to know who to blame for J6.

    Hmmmm.

    BuDuh (a33506)

  408. Like I said, I’ve been on both sides of the Trump fence.

    norcal (9f3b00)

  409. “There is danger for him who taketh the tiger cub, and danger also for whoso snatches a delusion from a Trumper.” — Sherlock Holmes (paraphrased)

    nk (4b634a)

  410. nk (4b634a) — 8/11/2023 @ 2:25 pm

    😂

    I used to think that “cult” was a bit strong. Not anymore.

    norcal (9f3b00)

  411. It was Trump’s tweet, Sammy, under his name. He owns it.

    The tweet was not the main thing that said something would be wild. The website was called wildprotest.com

    Sammy Finkelman (3ccf43)

  412. http://web.archive.org/web/20210106005050/https://wildprotest.com

    While it says “Capitol lawn and steps” in the explanatory portion, it says in the illustration that is supposed to be on the Northeast Drive.

    A New York Times article some time later said the rally did take place, but was dominated by anti-vaccination speakers.

    See here:

    https://patterico.com/2021/06/08/senate-report-on-jan-6-events-at-u-s-capitol-widespread-and-unacceptable-breakdowns-in-intelligence-gathering/

    This post is from the point of view that Trump was the brains behind all of that/

    Sammy Finkelman (3ccf43)

  413. There were it seems 9 permits fr=or 9 rallies each of which was supposed to have no more than 50 people there because of Covid restrictions..

    Sammy Finkelman (3ccf43)

  414. whrmbly,

    Do you think I am missing something? Maybe I am, but it seems like you and Sund believe the military knew there would be violence and hid it from Sund. That made it hard for him to respond appropriately.

    I wouldn’t argue with that, but my feeling is that the military acted that way because it’s information came from Trump and his people, not from intelligence or security sources. That would have impaired their ability to share information with anyone.

    DRJ (95ee8b)

  415. @whembly IDK of you remember, but I was extremely bothered by the lack of national guard response at the time. It was because Trump had ordered that no one but himself or the secretary of the Army could approve deploying the national guard to aid the Capitola and for some reason they were not available to take calls from the commander of the DC national guard. For some reason.

    Nic (896fdf)

  416. my feeling is that the military acted that way because it’s information came from Trump and his people, not from intelligence or security sources.

    It was because Trump had ordered that no one but himself or the secretary of the Army could approve deploying the national guard to aid the Capitola and for some reason they were not available to take calls from the commander of the DC national guard.

    The interview Whembly posted is just under an hour long.

    BuDuh (a33506)

  417. Sorry. I meant to distinguish that the quotes are from two separate commenters.

    BuDuh (a33506)

  418. The tweet was not the main thing that said something would be wild.

    C’mon, Sammy. Trump invited MAGA Nation to show up, by his own tweet, under his own name. He owns that.

    “Statistically impossible to have lost the 2020 Election,” Trump tweeted on Saturday. “Big protest in DC on January 6th. Be there, will be wild!”

    Paul Montagu (d52d7d)

  419. Be there, will be wild!

    Or “wild” like the video I posted at 10:50AM? Cause that was wild..

    BuDuh (a33506)

  420. The interview Whembly posted is just under an hour long.

    BuDuh (a33506) — 8/11/2023 @ 5:16 pm

    55 min 20 seconds. Are you suggesting I did not listen to it?

    DRJ (95ee8b)

  421. Let me be more specific in my answer.

    The people and entities that Sund complained about — the military, the national guard, the FBI — were controlled by the executive department. The White House.

    Maybe every law enforcement and military leader put their career on the line and independently decided the “optics” were bad and they would not go to the Capitol.

    But my view is that they wanted to respond, as Sund claimed they told him, but were prevented by the military UNDER THE DIRECTION OF THE COMMANDER IN CHIEF, a person who makes every decision based on “optics.” That is what makes sense to me.

    DRJ (95ee8b)

  422. FWIW I think Tucker Carlson is a good interviewer but he needs to stop giggling.

    DRJ (95ee8b)

  423. @DRJ

    If you can show me that the military was prohibited by POTUS, by all means.

    I’ve yet seen any articulable rationale that points to Trump as the reason why it took until 6pm for NG to show up on the grounds.

    None of this makes sense.

    Maybe the simplest answer is government incompetence? Maybe they were held hostage to indecision that day. But, I’m not sure I buy it though.

    Sunds was waiting for Congressional leadership authorization (Pelosi) and that took 71 minutes. During which there were shots fired (at Ashley Babbit). You’d have to think that any and all resources would be eager to go help the Capitol police by then. But, why did it take the NG till 6pm to arrive?

    Again, there’s way too many hinky crap here.

    From leadership’s apparent indecision… to WTF is the masked pipe-bomber… to how much Democrats milked the narrative that seemed overwrought.

    Hinky bidness I say… hinky

    whembly (ce9c93)

  424. @Whembly@428 Trump had direct personal command over the DC national guard. He never told them to go.

    Other than Trump, who could have told them to deploy at any time, they had to get approval from the Sec of the Army who needed approval from the SecDef. There was a conference call at 2:30 involving Sund (capitol police), Gen Walker (commander of the DC nat guard), and the mayor of DC all asking for the deployment of the national guard from the Pentagon. The Secretary of the Army left the call to go ask permission from the Sec Def and didn’t manage to convey permission for another 3 hrs.

    Major General Walker said he “just couldn’t believe nobody was saying: ‘Hey, go.’ ” He asked the generals on the other line, “‘Aren’t you watching the news? Can’t you see what’s going on? We need to get there.’ And [I was] cognizant of the fact that I’m talking to senior . . . people, but I could see what was happening . . . .” Chief Sund was “perplexed” and “dumbfounded.” “It wasn’t what I expected of, yeah, the cavalry’s coming. It was a bunch of, round-the-house, oh, hey, let’s do this, let’s do that,” he said “I was borderline getting pretty pissed off.”

    …Chief Contee then addressed the Army generals: “‘Are you guys honoring his (Sund’s) request?’ I asked them that. And they didn’t say ‘no,’ but they also didn’t say ‘yes.’ ” Chief Sund recalled it the same way. General Piatt said he was “clear in my response, ‘I don’t have any authority to deny or approve. The Secretary is getting approval.’ ”

    …In the end, “the call sort of ended very abruptly, . . . .” The DC head of homeland security and emergency management left the call thinking “that help was not coming, and—at least [not] from the National Guard.” That was Chief Sund’s belief, too. “[I]f a general (Piatt) says his troops are not coming, his troops aren’t coming,” he said.

    There was a second ongoing call among the Pentagon and Walker

    …But Major General Walker—under whom “it was actually written . . . would maintain control of National Guard forces” said he was not privy to any planning while on the call. “We were just told to hold,” he said. How long did Major General Walker hold? “Three hours and 19 minutes,” he said.

    …What did Major General Walker think was happening in those 3 hours and 19 minutes? “Delay.”

    …President Trump himself did not call. As reports of Departments of Defense denials and delay were echoing in the media, no high-level Defense official—including Secretaries Miller and McCarthy received a call from him that day. At the time, General Milley thought that was “absolutely . . . highly unusual.”

    Secretary Miller testified that he never received any order at any time from President Trump to deploy the National Guard on January 6th. “There was no direct—there was no order from the President,” he said.

    At some point it was the SecDef who approved the Nat Guard to go and Walker was told at 5:09 PM.

    Nic (896fdf)

  425. So people appointed by and working for Trump sat on their hands while Trump’s Bubba Battalions rampaged through the Capitol, but it was a diabolical GOVERNMENT PLOT to interrupt Ted Cruz’s and Josh Hawley’s objections to the Electoral Vote Count.

    Grasping at straws? No. Running on fumes. For a long time, now, Trump and his supporters both.

    nk (91504e)

  426. If you can show me that the military was prohibited by POTUS, by all means.

    I don’t need to. All you need to know is there was NO ORDER from the Commander in Chief. It was his job, his authority, his decision, and he did not order it.

    Staff and even his family pleaded with him to stop it for 187 minutes (see where that 3 hours and 19 minutes comes from?). He would not because he was enjoying it. He was glued to the TV watching his supporters storm the Capitol, even rewinding parts to watch again and again.

    Stop supporting this evil.

    DRJ (95ee8b)

  427. My guess is he never ordered it and a military leader did it on his own. Trump would never end a good TV show about him.

    DRJ (95ee8b)

  428. In other words, while I don’t know what happened that day, I believe the information gathered by the Jan 6 committee that was based on testimony from the people who were there. I believe the SecDef issued the order without Trump’s permission as he claimed. I believe Sund and all the other law enforcement/military were pleading for help. I believe the White House sources that said Trump sat watching and enjoying the Capitol attack.

    DRJ (95ee8b)

  429. The only thing hinky that day was Trump. Everyone else was overwhelmed with an unthinkable situation — an attempted coup and a President who wanted it to happen.

    DRJ (5c122f)

  430. Hi Whembly,

    Seems like DRJ took apart your argument in the last four posts. Do you have thoughts?

    Appalled (5c57a7)

  431. I don’t know about “coup” though. “Putsch” seems more accurate. I’m more worried about the fire next time.

    Kevin M (ed969f)

  432. I believe the SecDef issued the order without Trump’s permission as he claimed.

    When the poor “l’yddle” tyke was all tuckered out from watching TV, munching M&Ms, and guzzling Diet Coke, and went for his afternoon nap.

    Excellent analysis, DRJ. I agree with everything you wrote.

    nk (91504e)

  433. I believe Sund and all the other law enforcement/military were pleading for help.

    How did Sund describe the authorization procedure for that day?

    BuDuh (a33506)

  434. Excellent analysis, DRJ. It doesn’t look like anybody is going to refute it.

    I find it so amusing that people will grasp at anything, anything, rather than place the blame for J6 where it squarely belongs.

    It must hurt too much to admit they were wrong about Trump.

    norcal (a1ddc8)

  435. Make whatever point you want to make, Buduh. I think you know I will listen to it.

    DRJ (988f2a)

  436. My view is that Sund felt the process was chaotic and he was excluded from the intelligence.

    DRJ (988f2a)

  437. Intelligence is always challenging. After the event, it’s easy to say “Here are the facts that mattered and people knew about them but we weren’t told.” It is easy to know what facts were important afterward, but taking a wealth of information and deciding what matters and what doesn’t before anything has happened is hard.

    Maybe other agencies shared important intelligence, but Sund’s intelligence people missed or discounted it. Maybe other agencies discounted the intelligence and never shared it. Maybe the Capitol Police were intentionally excluded. I can’t say. But the Capitol Police had to change its processes after Sund left:

    While far more attention has been paid to the committee looking back at the insurrection, the U.S. Capitol Police is undergoing a quieter reform process to fix its intelligence and operational failures on Jan. 6. The department is collecting more data and changing its processes for sharing and acting on information about threats.

    DRJ (95ee8b)

  438. Sund said in the Carlson interview that they thought this would be another MAGA event like past demonstrations. I think he was talking about a MAGA – BLM protest, but I am not sure. So he expected some violence but not what they got. I think that is the intelligence failure the reforms are aimed at fixing, and Sund was trying to explain.

    DRJ (95ee8b)

  439. This is what happens when the Commander-in-Chief completely checks out and doesn’t lift a finger in the middle of a riot that involved the storming of the US Capitol.

    Around 2:44, after reports that shots were fired inside the Capitol, Miller writes he saw the situation even more clearly: “The Capitol has fallen. We own this now…Let’s get forces moving towards the Capitol.” Bowser’s request came through and he “determined it was now a DoD mission” and “ordered the complete mobilization of the D.C. National Guard and movement to the Capitol of all available forces immediately. The order was issued at 3:04 p.m. We were taking over.” When we spoke, I asked Miller if these were the exact words he said to Army Secretary McCarthy, who was next in the chain of command.

    “Yeah. McCarthy and—well, I don’t know if it was McCarthy. There’s still unexplained gaps in Army response. I don’t know what they are,” Miller says. “I don’t think the 1/6 Committee did—if you read the final report, it’s still a little fuzzy. There’s still a lot of controversy about who said what to whom. Someone supporting the Army made an effort—in one of the first brushes with getting the historical record straight—to characterize me as disconnected, not knowing what was going on, kind of a neophyte. At 3:04, the order went out for full mobilization. So I just kinda wanted to beat down that narrative that somehow the Department of Defense—that I—had slow-rolled the response. There were some communication problems—I don’t know what those were.”

    The main one, based on public testimony, is that Army Secretary McCarthy took Miller’s directive to mean that the National Guard should be mobilized, but that they did not yet have his authorization to deploy to the Capitol. McCarthy has testified he believed he had to go back to Miller with a plan of action before the Guard could be deployed. (The Guard term is “employed,” but “de-” communicates things a bit better.) Miller says he takes responsibility for this miscommunication—that it could have happened—though he also writes that McCarthy and Joint Chiefs chairman Milley lost their composure on the day. (As tends to happen with these books, the author is always portrayed as the calm and rational one in the room. McCarthy and Milley declined to comment for this article.) McCarthy testified that he got approval from Miller to deploy the Guard around 4:30, which he’s said he told another general to convey to the commander of the D.C. National Guard, Major General William J. Walker.

    The chain of command is President > SecDef > SecArmy > Commander of National Guard. Because the president communicated exactly nothing to Miller or Gen. McCarthy or Walker on that day, it fell to Acting SecDef (who was “Acting” because Trump sacked SecDef Esper right after the election) to take matters into his own hands.

    Why there was so much dicking around between SecDef and SecArmy for 86 minutes during an unprecedented riot still defies explanation. Also, Miller’s mobilization order was over an hour after Sund requested NG support, but the DCNG didn’t arrive at the scene until 5:40pm, well after the worst of the violence already happened.

    Also, if the situation was so urgent, why didn’t Miller call the NG Commander directly? He’s the Secretary of Defense fer cryin’ out loud. “Disconncected” and “slow rolled” is an understatement.

    Of course, none of this would’ve happened had the Commander-in-Chief ordered the NG to deploy to the Capitol right after his speech to stop the insurrection. All this inaction and incompetence was under Trump’s watch, and therefore his responsibility, but all that happened to hold Trump to account for his shiddy conduct was a lousy impeachment, until the Jack Smith indictment.

    BTW, the latest RCP average has Trump at 54.2% for the GOP nomination. Effing A.

    Paul Montagu (d52d7d)

  440. #442

    Intelligence is always challenging. After the event, it’s easy to say “Here are the facts that mattered and people knew about them but we weren’t told.”

    Excellent point, DRJ. (Makes me wonder whether you have read this classic.)

    Jim Miller (f497eb)

  441. No, Jim, but I remember reading an excerpt in a college history course. My professor was a fan of the author and, I think, had worked with her before teaching. Not sure where.

    DRJ (95ee8b)

  442. Paul,

    This is no excuse but there may have been Chiefs of Staffs and lawyers in every office telling their bosses they couldn’t do anything without the proper orders from their superiors — all the way up the chain of command.

    DRJ (95ee8b)

  443. There may have ben special concerns about orders from an Acting Sec Def.

    DRJ (95ee8b)

  444. Trummp’s tweet:

    “Statistically impossible to have lost the 2020 Election,” Trump tweeted on Saturday. “Big protest in DC on January 6th. Be there, will be wild!”

    This tweet was sent in the early AM hours after Sidney Powell and Mike Flynn had been let in to see President Trump on December 18, 2020 and his staff argued with them.. Mike Flynn was calling for the impounding of voting machines under the guise of martial law.

    https://www.cnn.com/2020/12/19/politics/trump-oval-office-meeting-special-counsel-martial-law/index.html

    Flynn had suggested earlier this week that Trump could invoke martial law as part of his efforts to overturn the election that he lost to President-elect Joe Biden – an idea that arose again during the meeting in the Oval Office, one of the people said. It wasn’t clear whether Trump endorsed the idea, but others in the room forcefully pushed back and shot it down.

    The meeting was first reported by the New York Times.

    White House aides who participated in the meeting, including White House chief of staff Mark Meadows and counsel Pat Cipollone, also pushed back intensely on the suggestion of naming Powell as a special counsel to investigate voter fraud allegations Trump’s own administration has dismissed (or, as seems more feasible, hiring her in the administration for some kind of investigatory role). Powell has focused her conspiracies on voting machines and has floated the notion of having a special counsel inspect the machines for flaws.

    Another idea floated in the meeting was an executive order that would permit the government to access voting machines to inspect them.

    One person described the meeting as “ugly” as Powell and Flynn accused others of abandoning the President as he works to overturn the results of the election.

    It is speculated they also told him about the rally in DC Jan 6 that they wanted him to promote because he left that tweet some time after the meeting,

    They must have suggested he use the word “wild” in it.. Trump used it incoherently.

    Sammy Finkelman (7fe9a9)

  445. After the event, it’s easy to say “Here are the facts that mattered and people knew about them but we weren’t told.”

    This seems to be the case with the lack f preparation for the fire in Lahaina, Hawaii, including ignoring predictions, the general warning siren not going off despite being tested monthly, and the fire hydrants running out of water..

    It’s been said that President Biden wants to avoid calling any attention to the fire.

    I can’t see any reason except for the possibility that he appointed someone incompetent to some position for political reasons… Still the main fault would lie with the state government of Hawaii.

    :

    Sammy Finkelman (9be9b1)


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