Patterico's Pontifications

2/20/2009

With Apologies to Instapundit

Filed under: Obama — Patterico @ 11:18 am



They told me that if I voted for John McCain, corporate fat cats would get tax breaks worth billions of dollars. And they were right!

45 Responses to “With Apologies to Instapundit”

  1. This is such old news.

    AD - RtR/OS (809bad)

  2. To fix America, the super keen minds of the Democrat party give us $8 to $10 per week, and they give billionaire Paul Allen another billion.

    Thanks Democrats!

    Perfect Sense (0922fa)

  3. Good news….
    Gold bid over $1K today!

    AD - RtR/OS (809bad)

  4. Sorry, Drew. I can barely keep up sometimes.

    I’m off today, but I’m usually working.

    Patterico (cc3b34)

  5. Meet the new boss / Same as the old boss….

    Eric Blair (ec334b)

  6. Have a great day off, Patterico. Me, I have to go teach some students….

    Eric Blair (ec334b)

  7. Tax cuts for the rich!

    Damn you George Bush!

    daleyrocks (5d22c0)

  8. Nevermind

    daleyrocks (5d22c0)

  9. P: your line is misleading, the tax break is not worth ‘billions of dollars’, at least not to Allen; the value is the present value of the investment income he could receive on the $1 billion for the time he doesn’t have to pay it in income taxes. and it also should be noted that the impetus for this was not billionaires like Allen but rather homeowners who would otherwise pay tax on the amount of any forgiven mortgage debt… now maybe the tax writers were lobbied to not cap the break or to not limit the break to mortgage debt, but I’m not going to begrudge Allen because tax bill writers are basically incompetent; in fact, I cheer anytime someone gets to keep a larger percentage of the money they’ve made, and no matter how much they may have in their bank account.

    steve sturm (369bc6)

  10. Excellent point, Sturm.

    SPQR (72771e)

  11. Of course, Allen won’t have to go out to buy a third yacht, since the larger of the two he owns (the black-hulled one) has a “tender” that runs about 80-feet that is berthed within the stern of the “mother ship”.

    I’m quite sure the Dems now approve of “trickle down” econ, considering how many people were put to work in designing, building, staffing, and servicing these yachts? But, then again, they wouldn’t be Democrats if they weren’t stupid.

    AD - RtR/OS (809bad)

  12. Correction….
    the “tender” (one of seven) is only 63ft.
    Google “Octopus yacht” for details.

    AD - RtR/OS (809bad)

  13. “P: your line is misleading, the tax break is not worth ‘billions of dollars’, at least not to Allen; the value is the present value of the investment income he could receive on the $1 billion for the time he doesn’t have to pay it in income taxes.”

    steve – If Allen has other income to shelter elsewhere isn’t this a real cash savings to him. Is the forgiveness provision written as a permanent difference or a timing difference? Your comment suggests a timing difference, which would not make sense for homeowners. Are you suggesting if they sold their properties for more than the restructured debt they would owe the original lender some of the proceeds instead of Uncle Sam, or perhaps a combination?

    daleyrocks (5d22c0)

  14. P: your line is misleading, the tax break is not worth ‘billions of dollars’, at least not to Allen

    I didn’t say it was worth billions to Allen. According to the linked article, it’s worth a billion to him. I said it would be worth billions to corporate fat cats. I based that judgment on the evidence at the link that it’s worth a billion to one particular corporate fat cat.

    If you are arguing that it’s worth a billion to one man, but that it won’t be worth another billion, collectively, to any other set of corporate fat cats taken together, make your argument. Tell me why one guy will save one billion dollars, but the collective benefit to all other corporate fat cats in the country will be worth less than another billion.

    Patterico (cc3b34)

  15. Actually, it is worth $1B to Allen, and another $3B to the other partners in that partnership, and countless dollars more to others in the same financial situation throughout the economy; it’s just we know about Allen now.

    AD - RtR/OS (809bad)

  16. Now, if Allen were truly concerned about his public image over this matter, he might pledge that $1B to some charity (the Bill & Melinda Gates Foundation?) to buy himself some “good will”.

    AD - RtR/OS (809bad)

  17. daleyrocks #14: the article suggests it is only a timing difference, and yes, that doesn’t seem to make a lot of sense for homeowners. And I don’t think that homeowners are going to be able to later sell their property for more than the restructured debt, as the restructuring usually accompanies the homeowner selling the house. And this isn’t a deduction that offsets other income, this is ‘just’ a delay in the time that Allen has to declare the income relating to the forgiven debt. And as this is just a timing difference, the benefit to Allen can be measured as about $210 million – what he would receive at 3% over the average of 7 years until the taxes were paid. Not bad, but not billions.

    And P, I didn’t say your line was incorrect, just that it was misleading, as a reader might expect to click and see a story of A corporate fat cat receiving a break of billions of dollars… or at least one reader did.

    steve sturm (369bc6)

  18. Whew, I’d hate to see another American be reduced to only one yacht!

    Patricia (89cb84)

  19. A couple of years ago, Pres. Clinton gave a speech in which he bemoaned the fact that thanks to “George Bush’s tax breaks for the rich” he kept so much more of his income. An audience member pointed out that the IRS would gladly accept payment of more than the tax due under the Code, and even had a form to allow taxpayers to do just that. Steve Sturm is right insofar as the bill’s language may not have been drafted for Paul Allen’s benefit, but Mr. Allen could “be patriotic” (thanks VP Biden) and not accept the tax break.

    kyle (9d9e73)

  20. “Whew, I’d hate to see another American be reduced to only one yacht!”

    Patricia – People need a front yacht and also a back yacht for privacy where they can entertain.

    daleyrocks (5d22c0)

  21. Whew, I’d hate to see another American be reduced to only one yacht!

    *Gasp* Oh Patricia, wouldn’t that make us like…like… a third-world country or something?

    Dana (137151)

  22. Chicago isn’t seeing the money yet, though. I laugh every time I think of those dopes celebrating Obama with their own money and thinking he was paying for it.

    Hope and change is what it is. It’s like the old joke about limited partnerships. At the beginning, the general partner has the experience and the limiteds have the money. By end, the general partner has all the money and the limiteds have the experience.

    Just think of Obama as the biggest general partner of all time.

    MIke K (8df289)

  23. It is gooooooood to be rich.

    Obama über alles!!!!! (da3d2f)

  24. Mike – I was talking to somebody who works for the state a couple of days ago and he was laughing while describing the process they are going through in making up projects (they have to be real enough geographically to be auditable) to justify use of the money. It’s a sick process.

    daleyrocks (5d22c0)

  25. “I was devastated when I was reduced to only one yacht,
    then I met a man who had no yacht.”

    AD - RtR/OS (809bad)

  26. Since St Al, as Goracle of the Cult of Global Warming, has the IndulgencesCarbon Credits business already set up, perhaps, in the current economy, it is time to set up a different Cult with its own IndulgencesPatriotic Payments

    As soon-to-be-ArchPatriarch of the Cult of Patriotic Democrats, I hereby pledge to pay 50% of whatever anyone pays me towards support of our new Cult as a Patriotic Payment on that person’s behalf to the IRS !

    (signed)

    Alasdair – ArchPatriarch of the Cult of Patriotic Democrats

    (mitre-tip to kyle)

    Alasdair (e7cb73)

  27. he was laughing while describing the process they are going through in making up projects

    And as usual, the local rubes like us are left with one hand clapping.

    Dmac (49b16c)

  28. I knew Obama would bring folks together. Tax relief for partnerships is now a bipartisan issue we can find common ground on. I just don’t know if people are all for or against it.

    imdw (c5488f)

  29. “They told me that if I voted for John McCain, corporate fat cats would get tax breaks worth billions of dollars.”

    Its also unclear how it saves him a billion. It just gives him more time to pay that billion. I guess he gets to have interest income on that billion for a while longer.

    imdw (05d41e)

  30. Exactly how is anyone being brought together, imdw? The Left screeches against “tax cuts for the rich” yet when in power, it is a good thing for them to do exactly that, and SHOCKA, one of their big donors is the recipient of same. So, either the Left has changed their position on same, or their opposition to same was disingenuous. Which is it?

    JD (e08aec)

  31. imdw is just like Hacks, just less verbose.

    JD (e08aec)

  32. “Which is it?”

    That’s what I’m asking! We’re all in agreement about the tax cuts for the rich. But are we all in favor or all opposed? But seriously this doesn’t look like that big of a cut. Not as big as it’s being advertised: It’s not 1 billion that dude is saving here.

    imdw (36ddaf)

  33. Morgan Stanley and Citigroup are about to pay out $3 billion more in bonuses from TARP money. This is totally out of control.
    Morgan Stanley and Citi to pay more bonus

    Wesson (3ab0b8)

  34. I agree – to use taxpayer monies to reward themselves for their rank incompetence is the height of hypocricy.

    Dmac (49b16c)

  35. “Morgan Stanley and Citigroup are about to pay out $3 billion more in bonuses from TARP money. This is totally out of control.”

    Bankers will be bankers. You give them money they’ll figure out a way to act like bankers with it. You want to stop that? Go swedish and put them through receivership. Then you’ll get something for your money.

    imdw (603c39)

  36. Whereas, using tax payer money to celebrate Obama’s election is creating hope and jobs at the same time. It may even leave some change.

    Mike K (f89cb3)

  37. Of course, the real question is: Since Paul Allen owns half of Charter Communications, how good is HIS cable service?

    David

    David (c6fe09)

  38. I think I’ll get a Middle Class Yacht with my $13/wk stimulus.

    Patricia (89cb84)

  39. “That’s what I’m asking! We’re all in agreement about the tax cuts for the rich. But are we all in favor or all opposed?”

    imdw – Are you a sheep? Do you need to be told what to think? Maybe that was a rhetorical question.

    Take a position!

    daleyrocks (5d22c0)

  40. He needs others to take a position first, so that he may argue against them.
    He is a proto-moderate: His mind is so open his brains fell out.

    AD - RtR/OS (809bad)

  41. Glenn has a post up at 6:59pm that kind of notes an Obama “missile gap” event, which will probably disappear down the old memory hole.

    AD - RtR/OS (809bad)

  42. Cute yacht, Patricia. Not enough room for partying though.

    BTW, do retirees get the $13/wk tax relief or whatever they are calling it this week? Or am I paying it so the real working people get it?

    PatAZ (9d1bb3)

  43. Not sure about that, PatAZ. To me, in CA, it doesn’t matter. Ahnuld is taking it back.

    Patricia (89cb84)

  44. Patricia

    I hadn’t realised the “Ahnuld” held a gun to the heads of the Legislature in Sacramento to get the budget he signed … I’m under the impression that he signed the best thing he could get from Sacramento – and his alternative was laying off how many 10s of 1000s of state employees ?

    To you, in CA, “it doesn’t matter” – is that because you support the current California Legislature’s Budget – cuz it sure isn’t “Ahnuld”‘s budget – he just signed it …

    Alasdair (54ab38)


Powered by WordPress.

Page loaded in: 0.1393 secs.