Patterico's Pontifications

8/1/2012

Chick-Fil-A Bomb Threat; UPDATE: Chick-Fil-A Appreciation Day Draws Large Crowds

Filed under: General — Patterico @ 5:24 pm



This is not the way to win an argument.

I keep telling myself that actions like this are not a reason to oppose gay marriage. But note: I have to keep telling myself that.

A tipping point may arrive: where I decide that the need to oppose terrorist tactics outweighs my desire to seek social justice.

I’m not there. Yet. But does the fringe of this movement really want to keep pushing me that direction?

And do you think I’m the only person having thoughts like this?!

BONUS: Michael Hiltzik wants Chick-Fil-A to shut up and sell chicken.

Guess what? I want Michael Hiltzik to shut up and . . . well, truth be told, I just want him to shut up.

Apparently he’s not going to. Maybe Chick-Fil-A doesn’t have to either, Mikekoshi.

UPDATE: Chick-Fil-A Appreciation Day appears to have drawn significant crowds.

Apparently I’m not the only one put off by the thug tactics after all!

UPDATE x2: Video of the lines:

They had a record sales day.

178 Responses to “Chick-Fil-A Bomb Threat; UPDATE: Chick-Fil-A Appreciation Day Draws Large Crowds”

  1. Looking at all the pictures of all the long lines at all those Chik-fil-a’s made me realize something: the turn-out in November is going to be phenomenal.

    Am I fooling myself to think that people are buying chicken sandwiches today because they can’t vote against Obama yet?

    Pious Agnostic (ee2c24)

  2. They are intolerant of intolerance.

    JD (cfef43)

  3. There is a sh*t-stormfront forming that will leave the Democrats crying for mercy on November 7th.

    Colonel Haiku (bfc615)

  4. PA–

    Despite the brou ha ha with Rahm and the creepy alderman there are two Chick Fil-a restaurants already open in and around Chicago. The lines around the block and the people who with patience and good humor endured long waits to be served here made both the local and national news. Two different customers who were interviewed said versions of the same message, “My being here has nothing to do with gay marriage. This is not about chicken for lunch. This is not about religion. It is about standing for free speech.”

    elissa (1e3ef8)

  5. UPDATE: Chick-Fil-A Appreciation Day appears to have drawn significant crowds.

    Apparently I’m not the only one put off by the thug tactics after all!

    Patterico (8b87cf)

  6. JDThey are intolerant of intolerance.

    Well said!

    herddog505 (a3b483)

  7. “My being here has nothing to do with gay marriage. This is not about chicken for lunch. This is not about religion. It is about standing for free speech.”

    Comment by elissa

    You omitted the “and Rahm Emanuel is an assh*le” from at least one of the comments, elissa.

    Colonel Haiku (bfc615)

  8. Calling in a bomb threat is completely and utterly inappropriate and bizarre; I hope the people who did it are found and prosecuted.

    aphrael (24797a)

  9. Pious,

    Beldar thinks this could be a watershed election. The nationwide response to Chick-Fil-A Appreciation Day makes me think he’s right.

    DRJ (a83b8b)

  10. I am waiting for that idiot writer to tell Hollywood actors to shut up and do their job without telling us about their political beliefs.

    AZ Bob (1c9631)

  11. Greetings:

    When you say “social justice” do you mean like:

    Lenin and Stalin brought to Russia;

    Hitler brought to Germany;

    Mussolini brought to Italy;

    Mao brought to China;

    Castro brought to Cuba;

    Ho brought to Viet Nam;

    Pol Pot brought to Kampuchea;

    or something somewhat different ???

    11B40 (34fcb0)

  12. A tipping point may arrive: where I decide that the need to oppose terrorist tactics outweighs my desire to seek social justice.

    Patterico — I crossed that line a few years ago. The Maoist “self-denunciation sessions” over Prop 8. The Illinois “civil unions and religious freedom act” that’s since been used to punish Catholic charities. The Arizona photographer sued for declining to photograph a gay wedding.

    Acceptance and tolerance, apparently, aren’t enough. Celebration — forced, if necessary — is what they want.

    For “civil rights activists”, these people sure act more like Maddox and Connor than King.

    Rob Crawford (d8dade)

  13. I have to keep telling myself that.

    Tell me about it. I voted against Prop 8. I voted against its predecessor (don’t remember the initiative number, sorry). If there was an initiative to define marriage in California as being between two people regardless of gender, I’d vote for it.

    But some of the behavior from the pro-gay-marriage crowd would tempt me, if not to change the way I vote, to at least skip that line on the ballot.

    malclave (1db6c5)

  14. Well said, Rob Crawford.

    The Emperor (62c93e)

  15. Comment by Pious Agnostic — 8/1/2012 @ 5:30 pm

    I agree. It’s going to blow their minds. The Left has no idea what’s coming.

    rrpjr (789c84)

  16. I’m going to be a bit of a blowhard here, so get ready tye.

    I have no real objection to gay marriage. I simply don’t understand why gays want the government to be involved in their private lives. By the same token, I think there should be a mechanism to allow gay couples to be able to have the same legal opportunities as hetero couples. In other words, it’s none of my business, nor is what private people do the business of the government.

    Regardless, I have a lot of liberal friends who think Chick-fil-A is the evil in their book because the owner of the company said he what he said (look it up).

    I don’t have a problem with Cathey’s (if I misspelled that, sorry) beliefs either. It’s his religious belief and it is shared by several religions including Christians, Muslims and some Jewish sects, among others.

    Yet my liberal friends make a big show of how “intolerant” one Christian is, without addressing the intolerance of other beliefs. One Facebook, one good friend of mine even called the people who went to Chick-fil-A today “neanderthals.” I didn’t correct him on usage.

    Here’s my deal, though, also from Facebook: “I struggle to understand why people who oppose homosexuality stand up and declare it regularly. Isn’t it enough to just not participate?”

    So, apparently, shut up. That makes no sense to me.

    Ag80 (b2c81f)

  17. @Pious, bear in mind that a lot of Democrats who will vote for Obama are on that long line trying to buy from that shop. Just saying.

    The Emperor (62c93e)

  18. Ag – I think it is cute how they conflate opposition to redefining traditional marriage to opposition to hohosexuality.

    JD (318f81)

  19. On Facebook, not “One Facebook”

    Ag80 (b2c81f)

  20. “hohosexuality” is a pretty good typo. The left might adopt it.

    “We’re not homosexuals, we’re hohosexuals. Join the fun.”

    Ag80 (b2c81f)

  21. Better than my typos, by the way.

    Ag80 (b2c81f)

  22. Ag80, you will not be racist towards Santa Clause! I condemn you for repeating it!!! JD is permanently condemned, and since he knows it, no sense in wasting space.

    reff (4dcda2)

  23. what’s a hohosexual?

    The Emperor (2fabb9)

  24. This just in over at Hot Air. Rick Warren posted a tweet taht according to a message he received from Cathy, CFA has set a record for highest sales day, with stores still open for another 304 hours here on the West Coast..

    the bhead (a31060)

  25. Emperor, you are condemned too!!! Racist!

    reff (4dcda2)

  26. 3 to 4 hours…sorry.

    the bhead (a31060)

  27. “what’s a hohosexual?

    If you have to ask, you’re missing out. It’s all the rage these days.

    I’m a hohosexual, she’s a hohosexual, wouldn’t you like to be a hohosexual, too?

    Ag80 (b2c81f)

  28. I think I’m going on Friday AND Saturday. I like the chicken and I am a big fan of traditional marriage…

    WarEagle82 (0bcfe5)

  29. Comment by The Emperor — 8/1/2012 @ 6:35 pm

    Sometimes, I just like to look at the nuts in the asylum and laugh. Its a well known Victorian amusement, and I’m an old fashioned guy.

    SPQR (26be8b)

  30. @reff.. a badge I wear so proudly.. :)

    The Emperor (2fabb9)

  31. Patterico:

    If the events of this last week have not convinced you that supporting gay marriage is the antithesis of being a conservative, then I believe there is no hope for you. The atheists, statists and Marxists are at war with Christianity, which is THE basis of all our liberties in this country. Our enemies know the key to destroying this country is to handcuff and marginalize Christianity. Legalizing gay marriage is the primary method they are using to do just that. Wake up and get on the right side of this crucial issue!

    PaddyORyan (d731f1)

  32. Haven’t eaten there in about seven years because it is too delicious for my pants. But I’ve been thinking about it.

    SarahW (b0e533)

  33. That is a bit hyperbolic, Paddy.

    JD (318f81)

  34. At times like this I just need someone to Monica my Lewinsky… 😉

    The Emperor (2fabb9)

  35. @paddy, political correctness needs to be maintained while we keep not taking a position on an issue we know the right answer to but can’t say it cos we don’t wanna hurt them gays. Haven’t you heard that Anderson Cooper is openly gay and he’s not gonna take your chivalrousness. Mum is the word. Or should I say dad? Heck they could be listening to us now!

    The Emperor (b45a1d)

  36. Paddy:

    What the left is doing is trying to distract. They are trying to divide the conservative movement on social issues so we forget about the most important point: the economy.

    That is the only point. If we don’t ignore the distractions and concentrate on that point, we all, liberal and conservative, will be lost is a morass,

    Ag80 (b2c81f)

  37. I agree with Patterico that this is no way to win an argument. I am also, suddenly, reminded of the Reichstag fire. How do we know it was from a SSM supporter?

    nk (875f57)

  38. It could have been from a neighboring McDonald’s or KFC. 😉

    nk (875f57)

  39. @Ag, are there female hohos for heterosexuals? Like a female hot, sexy santa?

    The Emperor (d0252a)

  40. Somebody gave me a great line today:

    Hatred: It used to be called “Disagreement”

    Truer words were never spoken.

    Chuck Bartowski (99415f)

  41. Comment by SarahW — 8/1/2012 @ 7:07 pm

    My daughter, into eating healthier, was quite impressed with the pamphlet listing all of their nutritional information, so you might want to risk it. (But not for a lg milkshake which we picked up tonight, 750 Cals- but split 3 ways.)

    At 9:30 pm the drive in was long so we went in. Quick at the checkout counter, waited 10 minutes for our shake. Several people we knew from various places. I don’t know if this was part of why Huckabee suggested today, but it is a Wed and lots of churches have midweek services…

    MD in Philly (3d3f72)

  42. Everyone remember how “the Mosque at Ground Zero” was actually facillitated/funded by Sharia compliant individuals who inevitably support some rather draconian attitudes toward same-sex marriage—and some rather draconian attitudes toward opposite sex marriage, for that matter !

    The point is, all these lefties who are currently “outraged” by Dan Cathay’s remarks were actually in favor of that mosque moving into town—despite the prevailing attitudes toward same-sex marriage by the guys spearheading the mosque.

    I just can’t figure out why the people who talk tough against Chick-fil-A are so “chicken” when it comes to engaging Sharia compliant Muslims about their attitudes towards same-sex marriage.

    I wonder what the X factor might be…

    Elephant Stone (65d289)

  43. Took 45 minutes to get to the front of the line today at Chick-Fil-A today in NJ, but it was definitely with it. The First Amendment is not to be trifled with.

    NJRob (1f9215)

  44. UPDATE x2: Video of the lines:

    They had a record sales day.

    Patterico (8b87cf)

  45. If it’s foreign born, preferably from the Middle East, as Steyn has pointed out in his native Canada, the likes of Imam Rauf and Quaradawi are ok, to the left,

    narciso (ee31f1)

  46. Nice to see Hollywood doesn’t appreciate bullying and strong arm tactics. Protestors against Chick Fil A were out in full force, of course. All five of them.

    Dana (292dcf)

  47. I pretty much agree with Patterico — I favor gay marriage, but despise the thuggishness some Chick-fil-A opponents exhibit.

    Some of my media colleagues have given up on any attempt to be fair. Wrote one:

    “I have never felt so alien in my own country as I did today while covering the restaurant’s supporters. The level of hatred, unfounded fear and misinformed people was astoundingly sad. I can’t even print some of the things people said . . It was like broken records of Sean Hannity and Rush Limbaugh and a recitation of half-truths and outright lies.”

    Wrote one of the commenters: “I suggest going into Chic Fil A buy a large coke, dump it on the floor, say oops and leave.”

    Lovely.

    Brother Bradley J. Fikes, C.O.R. (d064f4)

  48. the only reason i didn’t go to a Chick-fil-A today was that i didn’t feel like driving to Hollywood or the other end of the Valley.

    next time i’m near one will have to do.

    redc1c4 (403dff)

  49. PS: the reaction to the Prop 8 election results permanently ended the support of the two voters in my household for any future propositions along the same or similar lines.

    if you can’t act in a civilized fashion, you should not expect support from people who do. the gay protestors are as useless in my eyes as the occutards.

    redc1c4 (403dff)

  50. The Democrat politicians [Emanuel, Merino, Quinn] who want to put someone out of business in their Democrat cities {Chicago, Boston, New York] because of the businessman’s beliefs about same-sex marriage have welcomed Muslims, who want to stone/kill homosexuals, into their cities. Thus, this isn’t about same-sex marriage. It’s about traditional Judeo/Christian values, which are anathema to Democrats [the Democrats don’t challenge Muslims for two reasons: 1) they believe that the enemy of my enemy is my friend; and, 2) they’re afraid of what will happen to them if they do challenge Muslims]. The Democrats cannot abide traditional Judeo/Christian values and will not be satisfied until these values are not only driven out of the public square, but also from public discourse.

    Walter Cronanty (749763)

  51. My daughter, into eating healthier, was quite impressed with the pamphlet listing all of their nutritional information, so you might want to risk it.

    I’m trying to limit my calories too. The spicy chicken sandwich (regular size, not delux) is pretty filling at only 490 calories. You can pair it with a side of fruit at 100 cals and have a pretty decent lunch. That is what I had today. Having the regular size waffle fries costs you somewhere near 400 calories.

    JVW (edec8d)

  52. Brother Bradley – I call BS on that author you mentioned. He is simply making that up.

    JD (318f81)

  53. ==“I have never felt so alien in my own country as I did today while covering the restaurant’s supporters…==

    Wow, Brother Bradley, your colleague must not get out much if that is the top of the mountain for him! Drama Queen much?

    elissa (1e3ef8)

  54. I have never felt so alien in my own country as I did today while covering the restaurant’s supporters. The level of hatred, unfounded fear and misinformed people was astoundingly sad. I can’t even print some of the things people said . .

    Because we all know how circumspect the left is when it comes to reporting on uncouth language and shocking ideas from the right. I agree with JD — this guy is clearly fabricating the alleged hate.

    JVW (edec8d)

  55. And I agree with elissa too; he has drama queen written all over him. He must have gone home and drawn a hot bath with scented bath salts and made himself a nice cup of chamomile tea after he was done with those nasty, brutish right-wingers.

    JVW (edec8d)

  56. News flash- idiots are still doing stupid things.

    Wake me up when you are outraged at abortion clinic maniacs with pipe bombs, dogs and screaming nutcases targeting women in crisis. Just for instance.

    Jamie (ee4a20)

  57. elissa,
    Drama Queen much?
    More than a soupçon of DQ there . . . his unverified word isn’t acceptable.

    He may be technically a journalist, but I don’t consider him much of a “colleague.” People like that give reporters a bad name.

    Brother Bradley J. Fikes, C.O.R. (d064f4)

  58. Jamie is a douche. Consistently.

    JD (318f81)

  59. Wake me up when you are outraged at abortion clinic maniacs with pipe bombs, dogs and screaming nutcases targeting women in crisis. Just for instance.

    Because in your world it is still 1993?

    JVW (edec8d)

  60. Ridiculous article in the LA Times. No one needs a direct line to the medulla oblongata of God to pronounce homosexual acts to be wrong. It’s not a matter of discerning God’s mind; it’s simply a matter of believing the Bible to be God’s instructions. And the Bible very cleary pronounces homosexual acts to be displeasing to God. See Leviticus 18:22, written by Moses; see John 5:46-47, where Jesus Christ endorses every scripture written by Moses; and see Romans 1:27, where Paul agrees with Moses.

    Christianity is a religion of both hate and love. God hated Esau and loved Jacob. Christians are supposed to hate evil actions, and love people. I hate drug addictions, but love drug addicts. I hate homosexuality, but love people who are afflicted by homosexuality. Many people may not like that terminology, but they will not change my mind by calling me a hater.

    MKS (62961f)

  61. Walter Cronanty,

    Your post was very well stated.

    Rahm Emanuel, Joe Biden, Ed Schultz, Bob Beckel, Keith Olbermann…the list is endless of these swaggering left wing guys who affect a “I’m a tough guy, don’t mess with me, or I’ll show you how the blue collar longshoremen down on the waterfront settle their differences with guys like you !” kind of attitude.

    But they never look to “take it out to the parking lot” with the guys yelling, “Allah Akbar !”

    And as you say, it’s not so much that they sincerely support same-sex marriage as it is an opportunity to devise a wedge issue. And they do this with so many other issues as well.
    The lefties go after Clarence Thomas, Michael Steele, and Herman Cain, but if we question Obama, we’re guilty of “hating blacks.”
    The lefties go after Michelle Bachmann and Sarah Palin, but if we question Hillary, or Janet Napolitano, or Barbara Boxer, then we’re guilty of “hating women.”
    The lefties go after Romney’s tax returns, but if we ask to see Obama’s college transcripts, his thesis, his medical records, his paperwork for purchasing the property in Hyde Park that convicted felon Tony Rezko was involved in, et al, then we’re guilty of “putting our nose in his personal business.”

    The list goes on and on.

    Elephant Stone (65d289)

  62. “The Bible” has been redone more times than Debbie has done Dallas. It’s a beautiful work of poetry and wisdom. Human wisdom.

    nk (875f57)

  63. The Business Insider website says that many Wendy’s franchises across the country also supported Chick Fil-A today. They have a photo of a signboard outide one Wendy’s that simply says “We stand with Chick-Fil-a”. Knowing a little about their culture and the history of the now deceased founder of Wendy’s, Dave Thomas, that is not really surprising.

    elissa (1e3ef8)

  64. Elissa – go to twitchy and see how that played out today. Not so good, for Wendy’s.

    JD (318f81)

  65. No, it isn’t 1993. These thing still happen. (Granted, pipe bombs filled with nails at clinics haven’t since back ‘when. But don’t look too hard, you might see targeted assassination, acid attacks and various forms of property destruction, put aside the legal attacks. And the dogs are a neat trick. Nice thing to put a woman in crisis through.)

    I am not defending bomb scares. That’s. Bullshit, straight up. You don’t do that. Not cool.

    I would, however, appreciate a sense of perspective.

    Jamie (ee4a20)

  66. Comment by Jamie — 8/1/2012 @ 8:59 pm
    News flash- idiots are still doing stupid things.
    — What? I don’t believe you!

    Wake me up when you are outraged at abortion clinic maniacs with pipe bombs, dogs and screaming nutcases targeting women in crisis. Just for instance.
    — Did you really just write this?

    Okay, NOW I believe you.

    Icy (5fefc2)

  67. Jamie, go troll somewhere that cares what you think.

    SPQR (26be8b)

  68. _________________________________________

    I want Michael Hiltzik to shut up

    I’m so sick of the LA Times, but not just because all of their columnists — certainly the major, news-oriented ones — are of the left, but because the paper is too lazy and so damn narrow-minded to incorporate any writer who at least is a true centrist, much less a staunch conservative.

    I used to glibly say that it wouldn’t be so bad if that newspaper lost so much economic strength (eg, from advertising) that it would just whither away and close up shop. However, since I know there are a few good things that a quality paper can provide to a community, I’d muse about that with more flippancy than seriousness. But now I’m so tired of all the leftism of the MSM, particularly at a big mouthpiece like the LA Times, that I find myself really wanting to make a voodoo doll out of that newspaper and stick big needles into it.

    Mark (70c729)

  69. _______________________________________________

    UPDATE: Chick-Fil-A Appreciation Day appears to have drawn significant crowds.

    If there was a franchise of that company near me, I’d be patronizing it right now, even though I’m not sure if their food is good or so-so. But even if I didn’t find it to my liking, I’d still go back tomorrow and order up the same items all over again.

    Mark (70c729)

  70. That’s too bad, JD. Looks like corporate over-rode the franchise owner of a bunch of Wendy’s stores. I wonder if it was before or after they learned what a busy and successful day Chick Fil-A corporate had.

    Today really reminded me how much I despise political correctness and how different and freer we all were just a few short years ago before the thought police and lawyers took over all the corporate marketing and PR departments.

    elissa (1e3ef8)

  71. Whatever. If you want to hang your politics on a fry-pot franchise, not my business.

    But do note- other than the predictable kooks, nobody is trying to shut the religious nuts up. Sure, Emmanuel and Bloomberg puffed their chests out. But they caved. That is what they do. Kinda like most politicians, like Jindal and Bush. (I’d like to mention Romney, but he seems to have no balls, so I can’t.)

    Everyone is still entirely free to enjoy bigot-chicken to their heart’s content. Meanwhile, people are dying for lack of natal care because Olanned Parenhood is shutting down. Hey, maybe Chik–Fill-A Could offer pap smears with a value meal? Win-win!

    Jamie (ee4a20)

  72. Sure, Emmanuel and Bloomberg puffed their chests out. But they caved.

    They caved because of the backlash they received for their totalitarian tactics, but then you complain about the backlash. Having it both ways, aren’t you Jamie?

    JVW (edec8d)

  73. And it was Menino, not Bloomberg who joined Emmanuel, along with whichever idiot currently runs San Francisco. Amazingly enough, Bloomberg decided not to play Emperor of the Earth this time around.

    JVW (edec8d)

  74. Jamie @ 70,

    For not caring (“Whatever”), you seem to care very much.

    Meanwhile, I don’t see where people are dying for lack of “natal care” but I do see where people are losing their homes as they face massive layoffs due to the economic quagmire our country is in under the Obama administration. Unemployment is stuck at 8.2%, and isn’t that the real shame? To think, there are people who cannot even go to their local Chick Fil A and get some of that yummy chicken – even to help our sluggish economy.

    Dana (292dcf)

  75. tye became jamie. Lovie’s off shift.

    Three trolls assigned to you, Patterico. Plus a moby, WarEagle. You’re coming up in the world.

    nk (875f57)

  76. I wish Chick-Fil-A were kosher, so I could try some. But then if it were kosher it would be a different kind of company, wouldn’t it.

    I was at this comedy show tonight, and the host had some rather uncivil things to say about Chick-Fil-A. Nothing truly hateful, at least compared to some of the tweets Patterico showed us a few days ago, but certainly more negative than anything Dan Cathy said. There were also nasty things said about Michelle Bachmann and her husband, which I didn’t mind because she’s nuts, but also about Santorum, which I thought was uncalled for. I’ve never heard him say anything bad about gay people, and from what I understand he’s a wonderful person even if his political views aren’t mine. Thankfully they didn’t say anything about Sarah Palin, or I’d have been sorely tempted to walk out.

    Milhouse (15b6fd)

  77. Elissa #3, spelling nitpick: “brouhaha” is one word, not three.

    Milhouse (15b6fd)

  78. I don’t defend Bloomberg, etc – they were, and are, wrong. We all share the right to be as stupid as we like. I don’t live in NYC anymore, but reserve the right to think, how the hell do these People get elected in one of the most difficult places in the world to live? But I digress.

    @Dana,

    I have now idea what the mortage crisis has to do with a fast food joint being bigoted, but sure. It sucks, Obama could have done better. Should have. I’m not his defender. The Fed actually is to blame in my view, with an assist from Republicans blocking any bill they could, but, yes, whatever. What is done is done. You live forward, or resentments eat you.

    If you are actually interested, I can put you in touch with a family member who deals with Medicaid patients in the south, and can talk much better than I can about the burden the loss of PP is creating.

    Jamie (ee4a20)

  79. Bright shiny object.

    Dana (292dcf)

  80. Apologies, I’m using an iPad, which thinks it knows what I’m typing far too much. But I think the idea came through.

    Jamie (ee4a20)

  81. Hey, Dana.

    Over there.

    Jamie (ee4a20)

  82. I agree with Patterico that this is no way to win an argument. I am also, suddenly, reminded of the Reichstag fire. How do we know it was from a SSM supporter?

    The Reichstag fire was not lit by the Nazis. That was a communist canard, probably to cover up their own involvement.

    Milhouse (15b6fd)

  83. Were you there, Milhouse, so you know that for sure?

    The significance of the Reichstag fire, apologist, is that it helped give Hitler 93% of the vote for Fuhrer.

    nk (875f57)

  84. But I think the idea came through.

    so many lies in such a short sentence.

    redc1c4 (403dff)

  85. “The Bible” has been redone more times than Debbie has done Dallas.

    I read the original, which is exactly the same as it was 3282 years ago when it was written.

    Milhouse (15b6fd)

  86. Wake me up when you are outraged at abortion clinic maniacs with pipe bombs, dogs and screaming nutcases targeting women in crisis. Just for instance.

    It is an outrage for people to bomb abortion clinics and it happens more than I realized. A quick search reveals a couple of cases this year alone.

    I wonder if some of the violence is pent up because of the total inability to effect change at the ballot box — thanks to an illegitimate decision from a lawless Supreme Court.

    Be that as it may, the violence cannot be excused.

    Patterico (8b87cf)

  87. No way that was Patterico.

    nk (875f57)

  88. Were you there, Milhouse, so you know that for sure?

    Were you? The arsonist was caught, and the evidence against him was strong. He was not a Nazi. By claiming that they did it you were repeating Communist propaganda; are you an apologist for communism?

    The significance of the Reichstag fire, apologist

    Apologist?! I demand an apology!

    , is that it helped give Hitler 93% of the vote for Fuhrer.

    So? How does that justify your use of it? BTW I’m still waiting for your evidence that the Nazis punished soldiers who refused to shoot Jews, or that there were Einsatzgruppen on the Western front, or that there were no innocent Germans (which would of course contradict the first claim, since if there were no innocent Germans then there’d be nobody for them to punish).

    Milhouse (15b6fd)

  89. Patterico, would you be against bombing Auschwitz too? How is this different? Why is violence to save lives, when all other means have failed, not justified?

    Milhouse (15b6fd)

  90. I’m betting it’s some Stormfront sissy-boy like WarEagle. Or some f*ga*s like Random and Jamie.

    nk (875f57)

  91. BTW I’m still waiting for your evidence that the Nazis punished soldiers who refused to shoot Jews, or that there were Einsatzgruppen on the Western front, or that there were no innocent Germans (which would of course contradict the first claim, since if there were no innocent Germans then there’d be nobody for them to punish).

    Comment by Milhouse — 8/1/2012 @ 11:42 pm

    Luv dem Nazi-luvers.

    nk (875f57)

  92. No, it sounds like Patterico

    Milhouse (15b6fd)

  93. Luv dem Nazi-luvers.

    Do you? Why? Is this some love-the-sinner thing? But doesn’t that make you a Nazi-luver-luver?

    Milhouse (15b6fd)

  94. Happy dreams of Obama’s behind, Milhouse.

    nk (875f57)

  95. Happy dreams of Obama’s behind, Milhouse.

    That would be a happy dream; Jan 20, 2013, 0bama’s behind as he walks dejected into obscurity.

    Milhouse (15b6fd)

  96. Milhouse was sane once, wasn’t he? That’s my recollection.

    Random (dd401a)

  97. Is there a full moon out there?

    nk (875f57)

  98. I’m just as sane today, arsehole.

    Milhouse (15b6fd)

  99. And yes, full moon was a mere 3.5 hours ago. Are you the kind of superstitious idiot who thinks that has any kind of effect on people’s sanity?

    Milhouse (15b6fd)

  100. And yes, full moon was a mere 3.5 hours ago. Are you the kind of superstitious idiot who thinks that has any kind of effect on people’s sanity?

    Were you always that pedantically literal?

    Random (dd401a)

  101. Yes.

    Milhouse (15b6fd)

  102. Fair enough.

    Random (dd401a)

  103. 90 miles is a bit far to drive for chicken.
    This reminds me of my first Tea Party.
    God Bless America.

    mg (44de53)

  104. 70- bigot chicken is jd’s favorite.

    tye (b89df5)

  105. A co-worker took his wife to lunch at the Chick-fil-A at the Long Beach Towne Centre here in SoCal, and it took them an hour in the Drive-Thru line.
    I left work at 4:30, and rode the new “scooter” down there, and got in the walk-in line for some “take out”: One Hour from kick-stand down to kick-stand up!
    They were very busy ALL day.
    At least the West Coast stores had some warning as to what kind of day it was going to be – stores on the East Coast opened blind.

    AD-RtR/OS! (2bb434)

  106. It saddens me how politicized every aspect of life has to be these days. An old friend of mine who I’ve known for 15 or so years jumped on the ChickFilA is evil bandwagon and wrote several hysterical screeds about it, writing in one how only idiots think it’s a First Amendment issue and anyone who disagrees with her should defriend her, etc. I wrote a calm, polite rebuttal laying out the reasons why it’s absolutely a First Amendment issue, asking her why it’s any different than if a socon politician in Texas refused to approve a permit for a business whose owner supports gay marriage, noted that she knows I voted in favor of gay marriage and reminded her that we’ve always disagreed about politics while still remaining friends.

    Within the hour, she had defriended me and did not respond to my message expressing my sorrow for her actions. Boom, just like that after many years of friendship. It’s just sad, and it’s really like a form of mass derangement.

    radar (257ad5)

  107. That’s sad, radar, not only for your friendship but also for her.

    DRJ (a83b8b)

  108. I had a couple friends that did a version of “if you don’t agree with me you should defriend me”. It really is sad.

    JD (cfef43)

  109. People who have undertaken this all-or-nothing mindset in regards to personal relationships baffle me. Do you really believe everyone who disagrees with you is not only mistaken but evil? Do you actually want to shut yourself into a narrow little slice of the world and demonize everyone else? It mattered not a bit to her that she knows perfectly well that I’m not bigoted against gays and that I actually am on the same side as her on the goddamned issue! I simply refuse to have my personal choices dictated to me by a mob – ANY mob, left or right. I didn’t stop buying Heinz ketchup because of Teresa Kerry, I didn’t stop watching movies because the actors in it are leftist shitheads, and I’m not letting people browbeat me into where I go for a chicken sandwich. I like ChickFilA’s food and their service in my experience has been uniformly excellent. I don’t begrudge anyone who chooses not to patronize it anymore, but don’t sit there and scream at me that I’m a hateful trogdolyte if I choose not to join your little crusade.

    I’m sorry to lose a friend, and I had serious reservations about saying anything at all on her Facebook, but my principles are my principles and if she can’t accept that, then she’s no longer the woman I befriended so long ago anyway.

    radar (257ad5)

  110. That is so frustrating when you realize a friend wasn’t really a friend. If someone can’t respect your freedom to have different, decent opinions, that’s not really friendship.

    This may just be my perspective, but it seems things have gotten much harsher as far as political differences go, so instead of expecting people to respect different viewpoints, I feel privileged when that happens.

    If people can’t even entertain other ideas, it makes it much harder to shift votes when good ideas emerge. Too many just become loyal footsoldiers, problems remain unsolved, budgeting ignored, massive corruption unexposed. All for smug self satisfaction that the boogeyman of ‘wrong opinions’ has been smote.

    Dustin (73fead)

  111. I like ChickFilA’s food and their service in my experience has been uniformly excellent.

    Yeah, it really is a much better fast food restaurant than its competitors. Its employees show much more concern for quality, the dining area is cleaner, the food is consistent. My local one even has fresh flowers (instead of dried up ketchup stains and messy napkins).

    And I imagine the employees appreciate having every Sunday off. I think many expected being closed for half of every weekend to be a mistake, but it actually works well and I imagine the employees are rarely tempted to move to competitor restaurants.

    Dustin (73fead)

  112. No way that was Patterico.

    Way.

    Patterico, would you be against bombing Auschwitz too? How is this different? Why is violence to save lives, when all other means have failed, not justified?

    I would not. It is different because I don’t see most abortion as equivalent to the murder of a live human being. I think that as the pregnancy progresses, it gradually comes to resemble murder, to the point where I see no difference between killing a nine-month-old baby moments before it exits the womb and killing it just after birth. But in no manner do I see aborting an 11-week-old fetus to be the same as walking an 11-year-old girl to her death in the “showers.”

    If you do see them as equivalent, and see the bombing of an abortion clinic as equivalent to bombing a Nazi death camp, then your only logical criticism of the pipe bombers is that they aren’t doing enough — because the carnage continues apace. I find the implications of this view disturbing, to say the least.

    Patterico (8b87cf)

  113. I keep telling myself that actions like this are not a reason to oppose gay marriage. But note: I have to keep telling myself that.
    [….]
    And do you think I’m the only person having thoughts like this?!

    That’s where I was a few years ago. As someone once said, “Liberal causes are vessels,” and that made me really question the whole thing: is the push for “marriage equality” because people so love marriage and see its importance to society that they think everyone should be involved? or is it yet another alternation to the struggling institution that “won’t affect your marriage”, but ends up putting another nail into the coffin?

    The question ultimately became this: I know why gay marriage is worth supporting, but why are its own advocates supporting it?

    bridget (862c19)

  114. why are its own advocates supporting it?

    This is a key question.

    There are some who are ‘activists’ of their own righteousness. They do not actually want to make progress on this issue, which requires the hard and patient work of persuading others, being nice, accepting the merits of the argument on the other side, etc. They just want to condemn the people who are ‘wrong’ while basking in how this makes them ‘right’ and superior.

    That’s why, if this issue were resolved, they wouldn’t be happy. They would actually rush to fill the void with something else to be outraged about.

    Dustin (73fead)

  115. And my above is apolitical. Happens on both sides.

    Dustin (73fead)

  116. 70- bigot chicken is jd’s favorite.
    Comment by tye — 8/2/2012 @ 4:06 am

    — While “jerked chicken” remains yours.

    Icy (5fefc2)

  117. Meanwhile, people are dying for lack of natal care because Olanned Parenhood is shutting down.

    Comment by Jamie — 8/1/2012 @ 10:19 pm

    I don’t get what Planned Parenthood has to do with Chick-fil-A.

    But, where are you getting information that

    1. Planned Parenthood provides natal care

    2. They are shutting down.

    3. Anyone is dying for lack of natal care.

    Gerald A (b00ac1)

  118. _______________________________________________

    Within the hour, she had defriended me and did not respond to my message expressing my sorrow for her actions.

    If she conforms to other aspects of liberals, then she’s probably also not terribly generous in donating both her time and money to worthy causes, particularly apolitical ones.

    It’s not as easy to laugh at her if she is (1) still rather young and (2) at least doesn’t buy into the notion that her leftist biases mean she’s therefore more humane, tolerant, wonderful and sophisticated than the average person.

    Investors.com, March 2012:

    Not exactly shocking news for those exposed to them for years, but the respected Pew Research Center has determined that political liberals are far less tolerant of opposing views than regular Americans.

    In a new study, the Pew Center for the Internet and American Life Project confirmed what most intelligent Americans had long sensed. That is, whenever they are challenged or confronted on the hollow falsity of their orthodoxy — such as, say, uniting diverse Americans — liberals tend to respond defensively with anger, even trying to shut off or silence critics.

    The new research found that instead of engaging in civil discourse or debate, fully 16% of liberals admitted to blocking, unfriending or overtly hiding someone on a social networking site because that person expressed views they disagreed with. That’s double the percentage of conservatives and more than twice the percentage of political moderates who behaved like that.

    The proportion jumps even higher when someone on a social site disagrees with a liberal’s post. Only 1% of moderates would block or shut out someone who dared to disagree with them, compared to 11% of liberals, whose rate was nearly three times that of conservatives.

    Mark (70c729)

  119. While we’re on the subject of Chick-fil-A, i’d like everyone to notice that the ACLU is on Chick-fil-A’s side on this issue.

    aphrael (5d993c)

  120. It is different because I don’t see most abortion as equivalent to the murder of a live human being.

    There are many, many people who do, but do not advocate violence against abortion providers. I have never discussed it in detail with those who have thought seriously about it because my gut tells me that is not the answer so I’ve never seriously considered it.

    But if people are interested, I can ask and report back. I have a friend who has actually had long term correspondence with one convicted bomber trying to help him see the error of his ways (at least as the anti-bomber would say).

    MD in Philly (3d3f72)

  121. I reached the tipping point long ago. If gays want marriage and acceptance into the larger community, why don’t their leaders meet with leaders of traditional marriage and dialogue with each other and find common ground?

    Because it’s all part of the thuggery of the left. It became the cause du jour to weaken our social fabric. Now any self-respecting gay must say, I want marriage! Or he or she is ostracized. There was a big rally before Prop 8 near where I am. When the rally speaker asked, and who will get married then when we defeat this proposition? Not a single person raised their hand.

    But the winds of change are blowing. The Anaheim folks who are protesting the police shootings have told the leftist By Any Means Necessary to get the hell out! (See the video on OCregister.com)

    Patricia (e1d89d)

  122. Patricia, the no-on-8 campaign did a *terrible* job of reaching outside the community. It’s a lesson campaigners in other states have learned from, thankfully.

    aphrael (5d993c)

  123. ____________________________________________

    Because it’s all part of the thuggery of the left.

    This pretty much sums it all up.

    Mark (70c729)

  124. This may just be my perspective, but it seems things have gotten much harsher as far as political differences go, so instead of expecting people to respect different viewpoints, I feel privileged when that happens.

    Absolutely true in my view. Like I said, my former friend and I had always had respectful differences on politics. I was a dyed in the wool Republican then (and a libertarian now) and she’s always been a bleeding heart Dem, but we connected as individuals, not as caricatures. We didn’t argue politics because we had too much affinity and respect for each other for that, and valued each other’s company too much to jeopardize that. Now? Toe the line, or you’re indistinguishable from Fred Phelps, and she had plenty of validators cheering her on (and if she left my comment up, which I’m sure she didn’t, then I’m certain my comment drew all kinds of insults and frothing hatred from her like-minded cohort).

    I don’t know how you expect to convince anyone of your point of view when you do everything possible to demonize and antagonize them.

    radar (257ad5)

  125. The crowd yesterday at Chick-fil-A was marked by the surprising prevalence of women of all ages including lots of younger college age women, way too many to be random.

    I live in SW Florida and older retired couples are more the norm. Plus, school’s out now, so I noticed all the unexpected younger women, often in twos and threes, but also single girls, childless, smiling, and happy to be surrounded and reassured by like minded couples, older men, and married women.

    The feeling of shared values and common purpose created a warm and welcoming atmosphere, even on a day when temps hit 101 degrees and the parking lot was full and overflowing.

    ropelight (7d4de2)

  126. It’s the day after Chick-Fil-A’s record-breaking sales and Michael Hiltzik’s July 31st op-ed is especially funny. He’s the business writer for the LA Times who advised Chick-Fil-A that the way to sell chicken and make money is to shut up.

    DRJ (a83b8b)

  127. congrats to fox,cathy and huckaby for the best scam ever.Planning for such a sales scoop would have to begin 30 days in advance.Bakers,ice and drink suppliers,and all manner of support and logistic operations need to be in place.the man who planned this should be appointed FEMA head.
    Unless,of course,it just spontaneously happened
    with four day prep time.Get me on fox,im about to open a burger joint and have great opinions and
    lots of predujice.

    bobherde (dafca5)

  128. Only in America could a religious pilgrimage begin in a car and end at a fast food chain drive-thru window.

    JD (cfef43)

  129. Hey bobherde, if you try to open your burger joint and Rahm says he’ll shut you down for your political beliefs, I’ll support you too, unless your hamburgers are as stale as your rhetoric.

    Pious Agnostic (7c3d5b)

  130. nk: The Bible” has been redone more times than Debbie has done Dallas.

    Comment by Milhouse — 8/1/2012 @ 11:35 pm

    I read the original, which is exactly the same as it was 3282 years ago when it was written.

    That would have it being completed 2 years after Moses died. (I assume you are talking about the five books of Moses, and using the traditional dates)

    Sammy Finkelman (ce5e39)

  131. Actually, maybe that really should be 3,450 years ago, taking account of the 166 year (or so) error in the chronology – basically between between the first and second temples but the error basically is thinking the period of time between the 2 destructions was 490 years..

    Sammy Finkelman (ce5e39)

  132. I read the original, which is exactly the same as it was 3282 years ago when it was written.

    That would have it being completed 2 years after Moses died. (I assume you are talking about the five books of Moses, and using the traditional dates)

    The Seder Olam’s calendar starts two years after the one that is now standard. The second temple was destroyed in 3828 as the Seder Olam reckons dates, which was 70 CE, and 3830 on the modern Hebrew calendar. (If you need the technical details, the modern calendar is based on molad baharad and starts with 1, while the Seder Olam used a calendar based on molad vy”d and starting with 0.)

    Milhouse (15b6fd)

  133. Only in America could a religious pilgrimage begin in a car and end at a fast food chain drive-thru window.
    Comment by JD — 8/2/2012 @ 11:57 am

    And then have folks go into contortions trying to spin what really happened and whether the people going to Chick-fil-a were merely eaters or h8ers.

    MD in Philly (3d3f72)

  134. Besides, the drive-thru line was long, so we actually got out of the car and went inside.

    MD in Philly (3d3f72)

  135. OK prius Assnogic,my point was this was planned way in advance of mr chics appearance on fox.
    Maybe the kissin will be successful too,so be careful and dont overdraw your ckickn account.

    bobherde (dafca5)

  136. In related news, the reporter who dimwittedly posted his Chick-fil-A hate rant has taken it down, and appears to have removed his Facebook page entirely. Moreover, the paper’s editor has condemned the post as “completely inappropriate”.

    Brother Bradley J. Fikes, C.O.R. (a18ddc)

  137. Bro Bradley – that is amazing, no?

    JD (cfef43)

  138. Bobherde sees conspiracies. Apparently Cathy knew that the leftists in Boston and Chicago would attempt to punish him for protected speech and knew by giving that interview, all of this would happen.

    JD (cfef43)

  139. The former CFO of Vanta is not having a good day. Thanks, Treach!

    JD (cfef43)

  140. i’m at a payphone eating a tasty chicken sammich all of my change I spent for it

    cause of it’s so tasty and obama sucks ass

    happyfeet (a55ba0)

  141. not really I just made that up

    happyfeet (a55ba0)

  142. bobherde, your evident astonishment at the fact that Chick-fila got so much support shows that like so many leftys you don’t understand the core of Americans. Get out of the echo chamber of leftwing bile. Americans are great people who hate bullies and thugs. of all stripes.

    SPQR (695f2a)

  143. Bro Bradley, thanks for the update on the drama queen. There’s prolly going to be a lot more of these oopsies from “professional” people who forget that posting outrageous twitter and face book and Youtube rants to impress their buddies are not necessarily appreciated by employers or conducive to employment security.

    elissa (8b73eb)

  144. Comment by aphrael — 8/2/2012 @ 7:54 am

    Even a stopped clock is correct twice a day.

    AD-RtR/OS! (b8ab92)

  145. bobherde – Are you going to call you product Bigot Burgers?

    daleyrocks (bf33e9)

  146. Well, it seems like the guy who posted that video of himself harassing that girl at the Chik-fil-a got fired today by the company.

    http://www.marketwire.com/press-release/vante-of-tucson-az-regrets-actions-of-former-cfo-1686870.htm

    Vante regrets the unfortunate events that transpired yesterday in Tucson between our former CFO/Treasurer Adam Smith and an employee at Chick-fil-A. Effective immediately, Mr. Smith is no longer an employee of our company.

    The actions of Mr. Smith do not reflect our corporate values in any manner. Vante is an equal opportunity company with a diverse workforce, which holds diverse opinions. We respect the right of our employees and all Americans to hold and express their personal opinions, however, we also expect our company officers to behave in a manner commensurate with their position and in a respectful fashion that conveys these values of civility with others.

    I have mixed feelings about this. One, the guy acted like an asshat, and deserves the mockery he’s received, but I wouldn’t want to be fired for being an asshat on my own time.

    OTOH, the guy was Chief Financial Officer, and his behavior throws light on his judgement that can’t be ignored.

    I hope he’s promptly hired somewhere, that his family doesn’t suffer anything other than the same of their familiarity with him, and that he learns something about karma.

    Pious Agnostic (ee2c24)

  147. The Left will not value the expression of thoughts that conflict with theirs, and the Rights that protect those conflicting opinions, until the next Pol Pot comes marching through the Intellectual Village.

    “…then they came for me, and when I spoke up, there was no one to listen…”

    AD-RtR/OS! (b8ab92)

  148. cause of it’s so tasty and obama sucks ass

    NTTAWWT

    Milhouse (15b6fd)

  149. Even a stopped clock is correct twice a day.

    The ACLU gets things right a lot more often than that. Overall I still think it does more harm than good, but it does a lot of good.

    Milhouse (15b6fd)

  150. Pious, he’s a big bully embarrassment. He posted that himself and was proud of it! The lesson of internetz is for anyone – pick on someone your own size or rather bigger. Pick on little folks trying to be of service or to do a decent job, and act as though you are a big hero that deserves praise for bullying them – sometimes the internet doesn’t reward that in the anticipated manner.

    Also I’m guessing if he’s that big of a jerk without any comprehension of same, there were plenty of “I’m a jerk” displays in other contexts.

    SarahW (b0e533)

  151. Saraw,

    Oh, you’re probably right. Whenever I hear that someone is fired, I usually figure it’s a last-straw situation and that the “thing” they were fired over was just the latest in a string of issues. he “really” was an ass to that girl, but if he hadn’t posted it on YouTube, it would

    Pious Agnostic (ee2c24)

  152. Wow, that was total typing fail. I’m going to blame my bandaged finger, and quit while I’m behind.

    Pious Agnostic (ee2c24)

  153. Perhaps holding another position or a lesser grade job he’d have been only suspended or repremanded by Vante. But what company in their right mind would want somebody as self-unaware and narcissistic and creepy as he to be in charge of their money and financial reports. Also, there’s this about Vante:

    TUCSON, AZ–(Marketwire – Feb 13, 2012) – Vante, a leader in medical device manufacturing equipment and 2011 Small Business Administration (SBA) Arizona Exporter of the Year, will be featuring a new, dynamic, choice-focused line up of cutting edge products and services at…

    elissa (8b73eb)

  154. Anyone who saw the video of the former Vante CFO harranging that girl (and you should, it’s funny as hell) at Chick-fil-A who handled it so well, watch this commentary if you found it interesting:

    http://youtu.be/uONq8-fFaHE

    Also, Business Insider has a good article about the firing, but the above is funnier.

    Random (edf1d2)

  155. I have mixed feelings about this. One, the guy acted like an asshat, and deserves the mockery he’s received, but I wouldn’t want to be fired for being an asshat on my own time.

    I wouldn’t like it either, but if I were an employer I wouldn’t like it that my employees behaved like that. There’s no free speech issue here; it’s a private employer, and the person is not entitled to his job. If he were a public servant then firing him would be a first amendment violation.

    Milhouse (15b6fd)

  156. “I have mixed feelings about this. One, the guy acted like an asshat, and deserves the mockery he’s received, but I wouldn’t want to be fired for being an asshat on my own time.”

    He did get a free water out of the whole deal, so there’s that.

    daleyrocks (bf33e9)

  157. He did get a free water out of the whole deal, so there’s that.

    Comment by daleyrocks — 8/2/2012 @ 5:21 pm

    Not to mention the better part of 24 hours of feeling snugly self-righteous, and the happy anticipation of all the liberal accolades he was going to get for “bravely” uploading his wit and wisdom.

    Hope it was worth it, Mr. Smith.

    no one you know (7ecbf6)

  158. His previous six figure salary could have bought a whole lotta water, daley.

    elissa (8b73eb)

  159. I wonder if Hater Smith also called in the bomb threat, too.

    PCD (1d8b6d)

  160. The guy deserved to be fired. You can learn a lot about a person by how they treat someone in the service industry. Some people act terrible, and frankly this is how they likely treat anyone when they can get away with it.

    With that insight, the company not only fixed a PR disaster but was probably saving its own employees from drama as well.

    It’s amazing how simple the rule ‘be nice’ is, and its obvious merits, yet so many people think being nice is not the right path in life. It’s actually a lot easier than wasting effort on displays like the link above.

    Dustin (73fead)

  161. You can learn a lot about a person by how they treat someone in the service industry. Some people act terrible, and frankly this is how they likely treat anyone when they can get away with it.

    With that insight, the company not only fixed a PR disaster but was probably saving its own employees from drama as well.

    Perhaps:

    I just called the company and asked them if he treats their employees as badly as he treats other companies’ workers. i then suggested he get interpersonal training. the harried woman on the phone said ” HR is currently in a meeting trying to sort this whole thing out”. Made me feel downright purposeful.

    Posted by: mark c at August 02, 2012 12:11 PM

    Random (edf1d2)

  162. Thanks for sharing that, Random. I wonder how many were similarly concerned.

    This jerk could not let that hard working woman even finish a sentence without interrupting her. To tell her ‘she deserves better’. Than to have her own opinion.

    And why did he imply being gay is a bad thing? I think this exposes something central about the over the top activists. I recall years ago someone who was outspoken about affirmative action behaving paranoid about a black woman we encountered together in Anacostia (a rougher area). She was racist. I wonder how many gay rights activists are trying to cover their guilt for their internal bigotry?

    Dustin (73fead)

  163. I think this exposes something central about the over the top activists.

    Earlier today I was talking to a black friend about this Chick-Fil-A nonsense, which he hadn’t heard of. And he said that in the 2008 election he used to encounter astonishing hostility whenever he would express his opinion that it would be racist to vote for 0bama just because he’s black, and one ought to have a better reason for voting for him. He told me today that because he is black there was a limit to what people could say to him, but he was sure that if he were white he’d have caught a lot more grief for this opinion.

    Mind you this is not a partisan Republican; he’s an independent, cynical about all politicians, and I have no idea how he voted in 2008, or how he will vote this year.

    Milhouse (15b6fd)

  164. Ha ha ha ha.

    Read Ace’s article, sure, but check out the poster.

    Random (edf1d2)

  165. I like that, Random.

    He’s just wasting the time and effort of a hard working woman who will proceed to continue working hard.

    If the man has any class, he has already gone back and asked to apologize to this woman and to this company for his deliberate effort to waste their money because they showed hospitality.

    Does this man contribute anything to the world that is as valuable as a free cup of ice water? That one bit of kindness alone is actually a substantial thing to those who needed it. Wasting it just makes it less likely the kindness can be made available to the person who actually is in need, but I’m guessing this won’t be a problem for Chik Fil A, which is surely not having a hard time making ends meet lately.

    Dustin (73fead)

  166. The thing is, Dustin, as big of a jerk as he was, she still agreed with him when he said he’s a nice guy, because a kind-hearted person is just who she is.

    I bet she’ll feel a little bad that he was fired too.

    Oh well. She’ll get over it and she has no reason to. Any HR manager worth their salt seeing that video will be open to hiring her for anything she’s remotely qualified at.

    Hell — if I was with Vante HR I’d be tempted.

    Random (edf1d2)

  167. Back in May, over on Popehat, they… ummmm… “came out” in favor of rejecting the law being promoted which ran counter to the GL agenda.

    I commented about it in what I believe was a reasonable way, got mindlessly insulted for it by the blog-author, then wrote a longer piece which I explained that it was hardly as simple as the blogger was trying to paint it — which was, essentially, I believe: “who does SSM harm?”

    It never appeared on the site. Assuming I’d made some error, I reposted it. THAT never appeared on the site. I have since pretty much ignored the site. I have no issue with liberals directly… I won’t tolerate intellectual dishonesty, however, in the silencing of reasonably stated opinions that go against the beliefs of the site owner.

    The topic of my response was largely the same issue this thread discusses — so I present you all with my take on the issue:
    ===================

    Bupkis, you admit that you don’t know much about North Carolina politics. That’s a start.

    Ah, so you went with the technical refutation. Well, I reply in kind: “Nanny nanny boo boo”.

    Seriously. That’s the best you could produce?

    There are two main problems with the liberal promotion of the G&L lifestyle, and one of them has as an inevitable result the production of kneejerk laws like this.

    1) Sorry, there’s a distinction between “tolerance” and “open encouragement”. One can certainly, easily, make an argument that the former social structures that treated gays as criminal, evil, sick, or mentally incapable were wrong. In essence, that tolerance is a better path. It sickens me when you think of a obvious genius like Alan Turing being hounded to death for his sexual preference. That this former attitude was wrong does not necessarily mean that the other extreme — total acceptance and even open encouragement — is societally correct, either. There’s a middle ground. It’s kind of hard to find people on the political Left who actually grasp this essential context, it’s like they insist that things are either white or black, true or false. For all their claims of “nuance”, from what I’ve seen, it’s far more a matter of nuance in rationalizations than in final outlook. I’ve rarely seen a self-proclaimed member of “The Left” who doesn’t have a strong proclivity to reduce things to On/Off.

    In obvious fact, there is an entire spectrum of acceptance between the older criminal/diseased view of G&L and the total acceptance being foist on society by gays and lesbians and their useful idiots of the Left. And yes, if you can’t, or won’t, ack that there might be some kind of appropriate middle ground, then you aren’t thinking at all and are the textbook definition of “Useful Idiot”. That’s not saying you have to agree with that middle ground. You just have to ack that it exists and that the correct answer for society MIGHT lie within it.

    2) Secondly relevant is that this issue, in most ways, isn’t ONLY about the rights of Gays & Lesbians. It’s also about the rights of individuals who interact with them, both as individuals and as groups. Yet individuals like Ken and Patrick [Note: of Popehat, not Patterico] almost always frame the matter as though no possible rational opposition or disagreement could ever exist.

    Absent this law, explain to me, please, exactly what prohibits any couple interested in having an SSM performed from demanding that a church allow them to have the marriage on their property, regardless of that specific church’s policy on the matter?

    Don’t claim the church is a private group, there are not only historical cases which make that moot — mostly involving civil rights suits — but plenty of more recent examples that could easily be extended into that realm.

    Someone’s right is going to be trampled on when two rights come into opposition.

    The question isn’t “will they be?”, it’s “whose get trampled?”

    I am willing to bet that Patrick’s[Note: again, not Patterico] friends, Elizabeth and Gale, would never be that churlish. But there’s a vast difference between claiming “most wouldn’t” and “none would”.

    Here’s a modern instance of much the same thing as I’m talking about:

    Two Southern California women filed a lawsuit Monday against a
    Hawaii bed and breakfast, saying the business denied them a room
    because they are gay.

    “Oooohhh, ooooohhh, that B&B owner — she’s being predjudiced!! We can easily ignore her intolerance, and force her to behave ‘properly‘”

    No, this IS NOT a rehash of the BLACK thing. That WAS a mindless intolerance. This is about one’s religious views.

    Like it or not, the Bible is sufficiently clear about homosexuality being unacceptable behavior. Claiming you have the right to harm someone based on it is questionable. Claiming you have the right to not allow someone to Be Together on your own private property just because you lease it out to others is another thing entirely. The woman sounded at least reasonably polite about it, from the article’s description. She politely declined. These women are the ones in the wrong here. The B&B owner’s rights — religious rights — the right to follow her religion as she professes — are being trampled here. Perhaps this DOES need to be discussed and allowed for. The real question really comes down to who is being harmed, how much, and why? It’s not like these women could not have found lodging elsewhere — at a private business that had no such religious compunctions. No, they want to ram their “rights” down this woman’s throat.

    Guess what?

    That kind of lawsuit is not happening anytime soon in North Carolina.

    And THAT is a part of why this kind of backlash is occurring. Because people of a strong religious persuasion are feeling quite beset by laws forcing them to ignore what is one of their core religious beliefs.

    Like it or not, there IS another side to this issue. If G&Ls acked this, they might actually find some middle ground that both sides are equally unhappy with.

    But if they keep pushing this without recognizing the rights of those they’re stepping on, there’s going to be a stronger backlash in far more places outside of liberal havens like NY, WI, and Cali. It could stupidly reverse all the gains they’ve made in the last 50 years. And most of that would be an undisputed shame.

    =================================
    I believe this identifies a core element of this — that it’s not a mere “who gets harmed?” matter — it is a matter of the rights of “A” vs the rights of “B”. Both are in conflict, and there needs to be a reasonable discussion of the matter, before it gets blown into a fight — because that’s a fight that the G&Ls are destined to lose, they are vastly outnumbered. If they keep on this course, they may well find themselves in a far worse position than the one they have now, with considerable sympathy towards their overall cause on many fronts. It’s time to apply some common sense.

    Oh, wait, these are liberals we are talking about… “common sense” being a thing of which they know approximately zero….

    So, by calling for a boycott, they cluelessly kicked in the Streisand Effect.

    It’s said that, at one time, there was a suggestion in Rome that the slaves should be forced to wear a particular color to identify them as different from the citizens. This was shot down by wiser heads, who pointed out that it was hardly prudent to point out to the slaves how vastly they outnumbered the citizens.

    The gays have failed to heed that — they’ve made it ardently clear to all how vastly outnumbered they are in our society with this move.

    And that’s not good for their cause… not at all.

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