Patterico’s Pontifications » On TBogg’s Self-”Outing”

8/3/2006

On TBogg’s Self-”Outing”

Filed under: General — Patterico @ 6:55 am

TBogg is claiming I “outed” him. Actually, he outed himself — and clearly wanted to do it. Good on him and more power to him.

Here’s how this came to pass.

In June, an anonymous individual calling himself “Retardo” wrote a post, favorably linked by Glenn Greenwald, calling Jeff Goldstein a “douchebag.” (I’m not linking the post.) He also called Goldstein a “talentless hack,” “cretin,” “jerk,” “weenie,” and “stupid,” and claimed that Jeff has an “adenoidal, wimpy” speaking voice. His post included a photoshop of Goldstein naked, with a towel covering his privates. Another depicted Goldstein as “Count Cockula,” a term that a deranged woman has adopted as she has stalked Goldstein across the Internet.

And this anonymous person called Goldstein a “chickenhawk coward” — from behind his pseudonym.

It’s gotten me a little upset. Jeff Goldstein is out there issuing opinions under his true name every day. For people to be that nasty while hiding behind the veil strikes me as disgusting.

In that frame of mind, I toddled over to the site of one “TBogg” last night. Where I saw, from the poisonous pen of Mr. TBogg, this lovely little screed about Michelle Malkin:

Jesus. Fucking. Christ. In the history of big steaming loads disgorged from the gaping maw of Michelle Malkin what could be more absurd than hearing this professional rage artist complain about racism, the very basis of her crapulent bottom-feeder career? This is the kind of shit that Malkin lives for: manufactured outrage. Because as she has metastasized from failed journalist to disgraced fake historian to her current incarnation as braying white supremacist in brown face.

…she will take anything and try and make a mountain of a molehill because that’s all she’s got. It’s not that she a second rate thinker, it’s just that she can’t think at all so she throws shit against the wall and her readers (and what a braintrust that group is) run with it.

Oh, and there were unflattering frozen images from TV appearances, and then more:

This is what she is.

This is what she does.

This is why you never see her anywhere except on Fox with her fake outrage peers O’Reilly and Hannity. Because she can’t handle being called on her shit without pouting and over-dramatizing like a 14 year-old who just found out the last pink Razr was sold. She’s a professional smear merchant who runs away from conflict to the safety of her commentless blog. And she can say anything and lie about anything because nobody expects anything better out of her which makes her perfect for joining up with all of the other Lieberman supporters.

All from behind his veil of a pseudonym.

And with the background of the Goldstein affair, I got upset.

I learned that Mr. TBogg has chosen to associate the e-mail address on his site with his true name. You simply plug his e-mail address into Google, and up pops a name that is obviously his — his moniker is a combination of his first initial and the first four letters of his last name. If he were actually trying to hide it, he could — but evidently he wasn’t.

I had no plan to actually “out” the guy, but — angry over his trashing of Malkin — I wanted to rattle his chain. So I left some obscure comments on the Malkin post, needling him. It was the kind of hints he would understand but his commenters wouldn’t:

Stop them before they mock people with real names again!

Someone should sign a petition.

Because his name is associated with his e-mail in an online petition. Then I said:

And they should include their e-mail address.

In the petition.

Searchable, as e-mail addresses often are, by Google.

That’s about the sum total of my “outing” of the guy. You can read the whole thread here.

His commenters weren’t getting it, because the hints were very oblique. If TBogg hadn’t come along, that would have been it. But up popped TBogg in the comments, saying:

One of these day Patterico is going to actually string one thought together without going, “Fuck! I should have said…”

I asked him if he really wanted me to string that particular thought together. He responded by posting a quote from me about pseudonyms, in which I reveal my true name. He further antagonized me and finally said:

What Patterico is saying is that he found out my real name and he wants to out me but he wants to have plausible deniability and claim, “Well, it was just out there on the internet.”

Which it is. But he has a shred of conscience that he is currently wrestling with wondering how other bloggers will feel about him afterwards, particularly when he has left a virtual trail of thought regarding anonymity.

TBogg didn’t feel “outed” yet. And I took no further steps to out him. I told him I thought he could be less of an asshole, and asked him if he was proud of his post about Malkin. He said:

As a matter of fact…I am.

You’re really finding it hard to take that big step aren’t you?

He still didn’t feel outed, and I still took no further steps. He was clearly goading me to out him, but I had no intent of doing it and said so:

I’m not outing you, tbogg.

and again:

You seem to think there’s a big step to take.

I’m not taking it.

But I think you’re a gutless coward for hiding behind your little pseudonym.

and again:

Not at all.

In fact, I’m not outing you at all. I said quite clearly that I’m not.

But it sounds like you have done it yourself — or you want to. Maybe you’ll be a more responsible commenter as a result.

I doubt it. But it would be nice.

and again:

Review the chronology:

“You’re really finding it hard to take that big step aren’t you?”

I.e. you are not outed.

“I’m not outing you, tbogg.”

I.e. I’m not going to.

I think you’ve decided you want to do it, and you’re going to make a big martyr out of yourself.

Go ahead. Have fun.

and again:

I can’t make it any clearer, TBogg. You want to out yourself, fine. Go ahead.

I’m not doing it.

By that time, I figured he was already typing up his big “martyr” post complaining about how I “outed” him — by running a search on his e-mail address and looking at a name that popped up with a first name beginning with “T” and a last name beginning with “Bogg.” And then teasing him about it in a way that was confusing his commenters until he drew attention to it and made it clear for them.

I could tell he was writing that post. And he was. And here it is.

I read through the first 45 comments or so, and most of his commenters said: Duh. You didn’t really try to hide it. Your moniker is basically your name.

So the martyr thing isn’t really working out too well for him.

But if you see a big influx of angry lefty trolls, now you’ll know why.

258 Comments

Repeated rhetorical question alert.

Are there no adults left on the American Left?

Comment by Darleen — 8/3/2006 @ 7:29 am
Wow, how desperate do you have to be to tell a lie in the very first sentence of your post?

Go back and find the part where TBogg is “claiming you outed him.” Go on. I want you to find the exact quote where TBogg accuses you of having done this.

[Try the headline of his post. -- P]

Comment by Doug — 8/3/2006 @ 7:31 am
I really think there is only one thing to say about this…

Jesus. Fucking. Christ. In the history of big steaming loads disgorged from the gaping maw of TBogg what could be more absurd than hearing this professional rage artist complain about outing, the very basis of his crapulent bottom-feeder career? This is the kind of shit that TBogg lives for: manufactured outrage. Because as she has metastasized from Cash Register Attendant to partisan internet commentor to his current incarnation as something involving womens underwear.

…she will take anything and try and make a mountain of a molehill because that’s all she’s got. It’s not that she a second rate thinker, it’s just that she can’t think at all so she throws shit against the wall and his readers (and what a braintrust that group is) run with it.

…

This is what she is.

This is what she does.

This is why you never see him anywhere except on sadly, no! with his fake outrage peers Greenwald and Sullivan. Because she can’t handle being called on his shit without pouting and over-dramatizing like a 14 year-old who just found out the last pink crotchless panties was sold. She’s a professional smear merchant who runs away from conflict to the safety of his echo-chamber blog. And she can say anything and lie about anything because nobody expects anything better out of him which makes him perfect for joining up with all of the other Lamont supporters.

I’d like to thank tbogg for this comment.

Comment by Some Guy in Chicago — 8/3/2006 @ 7:32 am
Keep telling yourself that. I’m sure it makes you feel better. That and the Xanax.

Comment by crack — 8/3/2006 @ 7:33 am
see, and I was trying to strike the ’s’ in “she”…I picked a bad time to stop huffing glue.

Comment by Some Guy in Chicago — 8/3/2006 @ 7:33 am
oh grow up

Comment by cleek — 8/3/2006 @ 7:40 am
You sir, are a dick.

All your retorts will not change that fact.
Deal with it.

Comment by Guy — 8/3/2006 @ 7:43 am
Not for nothing, but TBogg was also ‘outed’ by accident a couple of months back on Flickr in the comments of a Popular Lefty Female Blogger’s pictures from YKos. You can go check, if you’d like.

While Tom’s downplaying the state secret aspect of his pseudonymity, the fact is that he makes fun of people quite a lot based on substantial things like their appearance.

Which is made funnier since that snark comes from an old(er) guy who looks like metrosexual version of McCloud.

Comment by preferably anonymous — 8/3/2006 @ 7:46 am
I want you to find the exact quote where TBogg accuses you of having done this.

It’s in the headline, Doug. Read much?

Comment by Pablo — 8/3/2006 @ 7:47 am
Well, I’m not sure this counts as “serious,” as we were discussing on S,N, so I’ll come back later.

[No, it is rather silly. Please do come back. -- P]

Comment by John Protevi — 8/3/2006 @ 7:47 am
The lefties are really big heros hiding behind their fake e-mail addresses and pseudonyms. Over at Kevin Drum’s blog some dope offered to pay my way to France if the Democrats won Congress. Since I was just on my way over the following week and have considered moving there at various times for years, I offered to take him up on his offer. Silence. I checked his e-mail address (required to comment) and it was, of course, fake. What a bunch of broad chested heros!

Comment by Mike K — 8/3/2006 @ 7:47 am
Patterico -

I appreciate your help in identifying TBogg. I’ve been looking for photos of the legendary Mrs. TBogg with no success, and this should help a lot.

Thanks for outing him -

FS

Comment by FS — 8/3/2006 @ 7:49 am
Congrats, P, you’re Eschaton’s “Wanker of the Day” for August 3rd! And you know what? You really deserve it.

Of course you didn’t really out TBogg. What makes you a wanker was thinking that it mattered. That and your coy little flirtations with the Truth - you know, wink wink nudge nudge.

KV

Comment by Ken Verybigliar — 8/3/2006 @ 7:59 am
“I wanted to rattle his chain.”

I engage in this type of behavior on comment boards as well, trying to get a reaction from people.

I realize it is childish behavior.

Clearly, you do not.

Comment by Tyrion — 8/3/2006 @ 8:00 am
Of course you didnt really out TBogg. What makes you a wanker was thinking that it mattered.

The truth never matters to leftards. For instance, what does it matter when a gaggle of wankers doing their daisy chain bit calls you “Wanker of the Day”? It smacks of envy, and of the crushing weight of perpetual loserhood. And of sticky furniture.

OPEN THREAD!

[I take it as a badge of honor. -- P]

Comment by Pablo — 8/3/2006 @ 8:04 am
Moronic brownshirt fucks… jesus, you pricks are pathetic.

Comment by dave — 8/3/2006 @ 8:13 am
Congratulations, P2! You’ve managed you contribute nothing to the conversation. Honey, we’re so proud of you! USA! USA! USA!

You’re right. It doesn’t matter that P didn’t actually out TBogg. That’s not what makes him a wanker.

Comment by Ken Verybigliar — 8/3/2006 @ 8:14 am
No adults on the American Left, huh darleen?
A sober, responsible rhetorical question to be sure.

This whole outing/non-outing pas de deux is disgusting, and both the left and right blogospheres should really ask themselves what they’re preoccupying themselves with. How many circle-jerks of “leftard vs. wingnut,” “coward vs. hero” insults can one participate in before it becomes clear that the real debates have been abandoned in favor of a relatively narrow repertoire of snarks, insults and epithets (including the exasperation over “childishness”). There are people across the political spectrum who are aching for something more substantial. I just hope we find each other in time.

Comment by Silone — 8/3/2006 @ 8:14 am
Patterico adds “gutless hypocrite” to “moron” and “quibbler” titles…

It’s certainly been quite a week for Stuperico, getting his ass handed to him for not knowing a gun from a rocket, and now TBogg exposes Patrick Frey for the hypocritical and gutless little asshole he is, whereupon our favorite rightwing dolt i…

Trackback by Martini Republic — 8/3/2006 @ 8:15 am
Yuck.

Despicable, Patterico.

Comment by m.croche — 8/3/2006 @ 8:15 am
The lefties are really big heros hiding behind their fake e-mail addresses and pseudonyms

says the guy with a single-letter for a last name, and no email or URL.

Comment by cleek — 8/3/2006 @ 8:17 am
No offense, Silone, but I think you’re in the wrong neck of the woods if you think you’re going to get substantial debate around here, or on TBogg’s site for that matter.

KV

Comment by Ken Verybigliar — 8/3/2006 @ 8:17 am
Wow. Just, wow.

How’d you get that law degree from junior high school?

For the record, TBogg wasn’t being a martyr so much as exposing you as a puerile bully, and pre-empting your little reindeer game of “I’ve got oppo research on you, buddy!”

Please Google my email, which you require for commenting, so you can do the same to me in my comments. It’d be a hoot!

Comment by dday — 8/3/2006 @ 8:22 am
You wanted to out the guy, but didn’t have the balls to do it.

Be a man, brother. Maybe you need to watch some wrestling, or go bike riding with Floyd Landis to get that testosterone up. If you’re going to do something, come right out and do it.

Comment by In Vino Veritas — 8/3/2006 @ 8:25 am
Ah, Patterico, you sly jackass, you. Up to your old tricks again, I see.

Comment by The Liberal Avenger — 8/3/2006 @ 8:26 am
KV gets it exactly right. Patterico thought he could be an online tough guy by threatening to out someone who didn’t really care. He got called on it and now looks stupid for his petty internet bullying. It’s not that Patterico outed him that’s lame, it’s that he tried to threaten TBogg with outing because his panties were in a bunch.

Comment by lakema — 8/3/2006 @ 8:26 am
Shit - TBogg does look an awful lot like McCloud.

Comment by The Liberal Avenger — 8/3/2006 @ 8:29 am
Ahh, and the trolls show the sum of their I.Q.s to be 3.

Comment by sharon — 8/3/2006 @ 8:30 am
Hey, Sharon, that’s not nice. Pablo’s a very smart guy!

KV

Comment by Ken Verybigliar — 8/3/2006 @ 8:31 am
Yes, you’re the ‘tard, Ken.

Comment by Pablo — 8/3/2006 @ 8:35 am
HOW DARE YOU MAKE TBAGG OUT HIMSELF WHICH HE WANTED TO DO ANYWAY YOU BROWNSHIRT CHICKENHAWK!!!

Does that sum it all up for you, leftards?

Comment by Pablo — 8/3/2006 @ 8:36 am
Defending Self Hating Brown Person Mme. Malkin and the Paste Eating Turtlefucker by threatening to spread around TBogg’s real name?

Priceless.

Comment by HeavyJ — 8/3/2006 @ 8:39 am
Well that was a total waste of energy!

Curious too why one would “hide” behind a “transparant psuedonym” too.

“It just means if I thought someone was a shitbag, and I knew who they were and they deserved to have the world know who they are, I might clue the world in.”

But you never got around to explaining why you thought he was a “shitbag”. Other than the fact that you obviously didn’t like his post on Malkin.

Pointing out innacurracies in the post would have been productive. But apparantly required too much effort (or was impossible).

But I’m curious, is it only the non defense defense of Malkin that causes you to have such a potty mouth? Because seriously I thought at any minute you’d use your new Googled information to hop on a bus and go slap your penis against TBogg’s face!

Comment by Davebo — 8/3/2006 @ 8:40 am
Ooh, “tard”. Nice one honey, nice one. But if Sharon’s gonna leave a sentence open like that, I’m gonna finish it. I’d think you’d approve, but then, what do I know about the workings of your mighty mind?

As for summing it up, how’s this for clarity:

P: “I know who you are!”
T: “Yeah, duh. I’m not really trying to hide it.”
P: “Yeah, but I know who you are!
T: “Yeah, and I don’t care.”
P: “But I know who you are!”
T: “And you’re too big a pussy to actually post it.”
P: “I’m not a pussy!”
T: “Whatever, pussy.”

So explain, P2, how P doesn’t come off looking like a pussy?

KV

Comment by Ken Verybigliar — 8/3/2006 @ 8:44 am
(and I mean that with all due respect, Tom… Dennis Weaver was a handsome man in his day, if a bit red-necky…)

Comment by The Liberal Avenger — 8/3/2006 @ 8:44 am
One additional bonus aspect of this controversy that you wingnuts seem to be missing is why would anyone want to defend Michelle Malkin in the first place? Doesn’t the fact that Patterico admits to being “upset” at TBogg calling Malkin a racist put his general critical thinking skills into question?

Seriously.

Comment by The Liberal Avenger — 8/3/2006 @ 8:47 am
Liberal Avenger, P2 wasn’t defending Malkin at all. Aparantly he couldn’t. And that really pissed him off.

And when you’re pissed, but there’s absolutely nothing you can do about it, well, that’s what Google is for right?

Comment by Davebo — 8/3/2006 @ 8:49 am
So now that TBogg “revealed” his “ultra secret” identity, does that mean pattynico will address actual facts and issues, or will he find some other straw-man to distract from what’s important and relevant?

I find this whole situation quite hilarious. As poster Ken V. pointed out above in his excellent cliff’s notes version of events, it is pattynico who comes out looking like the junior-high malcontent in this whole non-affair.

Ahh well, on to the next straw-man, right patty?

Comment by John in Chicago — 8/3/2006 @ 8:52 am
What, exactly, did TBogg say that was untrue about Malkin?

Comment by John Dillinger — 8/3/2006 @ 8:52 am
Boy did that bring out the lefty trolls ! Good work. Nice to see them parading around.

Comment by Mike K — 8/3/2006 @ 8:57 am
What, exactly, did TBogg say that was untrue about Malkin?

Letsee. That she’s racist, a white supremacist, a failed journalist, and can’t think. Oh yeah, and that she “manufactures” rage over the stupid worse-than-junior high garbage the left puts out, most lately in the form of a photoshopped blackface political candidate.

Because *you’re* too stupid to know the photo was offensive, anybody who thinks it offensive must be “manufacturing” their offense. Riiiiiight.

Comment by Anwyn — 8/3/2006 @ 9:01 am
The key thing is, you only post someone’s name if you want bad things to happen to them professionally when they get linked pseudonym to real name. If you discover the name of another blogger, it’s common courtesy not to post it, unless it turns out that he’s actually, oh, Mary Rosh. Or the other way around. You only post someone’s name, or threaten to post it, because you want to hurt them.

That’s why it’s a dick move, man. Threatening it, not very obliquely either, is a pretty dickish thing. I don’t think you really need to apologize, but Jesus, you should at least admit it to yourself there’s no way that’s cool.

Comment by Stu — 8/3/2006 @ 9:02 am
I, for one, enjoy the Oak Ridge Boys.

Comment by Jeff G — 8/3/2006 @ 9:03 am
John D., I just realized something - P was engaged in some of the same activities Mz. Malkin was perpetrating on that Hardball segment!

Of course, Mz. Malkin wasn’t saying that John Kerry shot himself to get the Purple Heart, she was just reporting that other people were asking about it (wink wink). And P wasn’t posting TBogg’s name, he was just saying that he “think(s) you’re a gutless coward for hiding behind your little pseudonym.”

So, Mr. P. Malkin, do you still think TBogg’s a gutless coward?

KV

Comment by Ken Verybigliar — 8/3/2006 @ 9:03 am
Malkin is convinced that Qana was faked.

Comment by The Liberal Avenger — 8/3/2006 @ 9:06 am
You only post someone’s name, or threaten to post it, because you want to hurt them.

So, Tbogg wanted to hurt himself? I suppose I can understand that.

Comment by Pablo — 8/3/2006 @ 9:06 am
You come off badly in this, Patterico. It’s toolish to play the “I know who you are” game, and justifying it by appeal to how mad you are about someone else saying mean things about Jeff Goldstein or Michelle Malkin is just silly.

(Malkin and Goldstein both deliberately antagonize people– this can be a fun schtick, sure, but you can’t get too upset when people are antagonized by it. It’s the nature of the game they play.)

Comment by FL — 8/3/2006 @ 9:07 am
I remember TBogg making disgusting racist comments about Malkin a couple of years ago on Kevin Drumm’s blog.

Comment by sam — 8/3/2006 @ 9:09 am
Now that people know who TBogg is, maybe one of them can go over and Jeff Goldstein him in the face.

Comment by John Dillinger — 8/3/2006 @ 9:13 am
Malkin and Goldstein both deliberately antagonize people…

BS. Pure, unadulterated BS.

Comment by Robert Crawford — 8/3/2006 @ 9:15 am
Well, you have to admit, if Google starts picking up things like “Tom B_________ is a racist”, or “Tom B_________ hates brown people and fat women and is a misogynist fuck who pens nothing but attack posts on people he’s never met — often about their appearance,” he probably won’t like it much.

And it might suck that his family has to see it.

And it might suck that his professional contacts have to see it.

Which is precisely what this guy does to other people all the time.

Me, I’m not interested in posting his name just now, though I’ve known it for some time. But will I be upset if all the garbage he appends to the names of others comes back home to attach itself to his name? Well, to be honest, probably so — but only because he kids will see it.

Which is too bad.

— Though maybe when they ask him about it later on, he can change the subject and tell them about the racist slanty-eyed failed journalist Michelle Malkin — and how Daddy was only protecting America from a “White Supremacist in brown face” who was threatening the Republic by, uh, acting like a 14-year old, is it?

I get confused by the nuance sometimes.

Comment by Jeff G — 8/3/2006 @ 9:20 am
Has anyone else noticed that the left is now completely incapable of any argument whatsoever without inserting “But, what about Malkin?!?”

She must be tremendously effective to instill so much fear in you Kooky Klownish Kids.

Comment by Pablo — 8/3/2006 @ 9:21 am
As a Tbogg reader for about four months, I know:

1. What his wife looks like
2. What his dog looks like
3. What his daughter looks like
4. Where he lives, generally
5. Various jobs he’s held
6. His degree of educational attainment
7. Occasionally, when he will be commuting to other parts of the state

Thanks to Patterico, I know not only know his name, I know I could have found out before Tbogg mentioned it… if I’d cared. Don’t really care about the above stuff, either, but he shared it with me.

Now, I can tag his writings in my brain not with “Tbogg” but with Tom… um… Bogglio… Boggio….

Wait, hold on. Lemme look again. I’m *so bad* with names.

Look, as a lefty troll, I’ll say it: the photo (can we get back to that? please?) was offensive. I read FDL and it pissed me off that they’d use it. Go read the HuffPo comments if you don’t think that’s the consensus opinion. This other crap is just noise.

Comment by whetstone — 8/3/2006 @ 9:27 am
I told him I thought he could be less of an asshole.

Your first mistake; a bad premise.

Comment by Gordon — 8/3/2006 @ 9:28 am
Heck, P2, I was just pointing out an interesting little correspondence. There’s nothing wrong with P being as coy and flirtatious as Mz. Malkin was. I don’t condemn him for employing the “I know a secret!” tactic, and, frankly, I think it’s wrong for you to condemn him. Anyway, the dude’s your friend!

By the way Mr. P. Malkin, I’m still waiting to hear if you still think TBogg’s a gutless coward.

Comment by Ken Verybigliar — 8/3/2006 @ 9:32 am
Goldstein comments at 9:20.

Pablo comments at 9:21.

Jesus, Pablo, your need for validation from Jeff is really getting out of hand.

Comment by Stephen Den Worste — 8/3/2006 @ 9:32 am
Of course, Mz. Malkin wasn’t saying that John Kerry shot himself to get the Purple Heart, she was just reporting that other people were asking about it…

Is there anybody over there literate enough to understand a self-inflicted wound doesn’t necessarily mean he shot himself?

Comment by B Moe — 8/3/2006 @ 9:42 am
Patterico,

Here’s a standard reply to Duncan Black and his merry band of followers:

http://blog.rjwest.com/?p=2763

Comment by RW — 8/3/2006 @ 9:42 am
Holy Mother of Moonbats, Retardo and the boys are comparing themselves to Publius now! LMFAO! I don’t think I can handle it.

Comment by B Moe — 8/3/2006 @ 9:54 am
Oh, my apologies BM. You’re right - Mz. Malkin wasn’t necessarily implying John Kerry shot himself on purpose, she could have simply been implying he shot himself on accident. But she didn’t come right out and say it, because she’s a coy little minx.

Of course, I say “necessarily”, because neither of us actually know what she intended to imply. She was merely flirting with the Truth, much like that cocktease P.

Um, Mr. P. Malkin, do you think TBogg is a gutless coward?

Comment by Ken Verybigliar — 8/3/2006 @ 9:54 am
I guess I’m pretty stupid, but I confess to not understanding the significance of, and to not being able to force myself to care about, Patterico’s feuds with TBogg and Greenwald. My eyes are reading “blah, blah, blah,” and my brain comprehends “nyah-nyah-nyah-nyah-nyah-nyah.”

It’s your blog, Patterico, and you can, of course, blog about whatever interests you. But I’m tellin’ ya, of late, I find myself awaiting your next posts less eagerly than before.

P.S. Finally sold my house in Fort Worth! But don’t get me started on how the hearing before the Tarrant Appraisal Review Board went.

Comment by Diffus — 8/3/2006 @ 9:56 am
Is there anybody over there literate enough to understand a self-inflicted wound doesn’t necessarily mean he shot himself?

Obviously not - nor will they admit the only one that even mouthed the words “Kerry shot himself” was Matthews himself.

Comment by bains — 8/3/2006 @ 9:59 am
Jesus, Pablo, your need for validation from Jeff is really getting out of hand.

OH MY GOD! THAT WAS JEFF GOLDSTEIN?!?

And lemme guess, SDW is Gleen Greenwald, right?

I’ll never wash this keyboard again.

Comment by Pablo — 8/3/2006 @ 10:01 am
Patterico, it was probably not the best use of your time. Seixon’s plight is much more important. However, the exchange was entertaining, especially TBogg’s lame attempt at self-victimization.

Comment by Bradley J. Fikes — 8/3/2006 @ 10:05 am
You are playing silly games if you refuse to admit that Malkin was most definitely pushing the “Kerry shot himself” meme.

Comment by The Liberal Avenger — 8/3/2006 @ 10:06 am
What’s funniest of all is to think that you would get upset about anyone criticizing Malkin. She’s everything TBogg says and more.

Comment by Elle — 8/3/2006 @ 10:06 am
You’d be foolish not to question “news” out of Lebanon.

Hezbollah follows the tradition of other tyrants who set up / kill civilians to exploit them as “victims” before a world of willing dupes - blaming, of course, their stronger, more decent neighbors for the killing they staged. Saddam did it. Hamas does it. Mugabe does it. Castro did it. Arafat did it. Stalin, Mao, Che did it. The cruel will always exploit the weak in an attempt to tear down the strong and usurp what better men and women build.

Lying to infidels to further jihad is a duty of Islamofascists, just as truth is a bedrock Judeo-Christian value.

CAIR doesn’t care what infidels think about what they want for America.

As an Israeli I’m sorry for the fact that we keep our weapons above ground and our civilians in the bunkers, while Hizb’allah keeps it’s civilians above ground and it’s weapons in the bunkers. - Manker

Comment by g.a. — 8/3/2006 @ 10:15 am
I wonder how many posting in this thread, specifically the ones whose vocabulary needs to make prominent use of profanity to make their points, have children older than 10.

I was (and am) more than a bit annoyed that the typical language of 14 and 15 year olds today is worse than what I routinely heard in college, especially when my two oldest began using the same language.

I do not know if any eminent social scientist has studied to see if there is an inverse correlation between foul language and the ability to critically think, but I think there probably is. The rise of foul language at least temporally coincides with the inability to reason logically. Many attempts at a logical argument that I see or hear today would have a hard time getting out of the “C” range in my sophomore (high school) speech class. The real shame is I don’t know how many people realize that.

“What do they teach in schools these days?”

Comment by MD in Philly — 8/3/2006 @ 10:19 am
Funny, no one yet has addressed Tbogg’s original post about Malkin, wherein Tbogg ventured that:

1) Malkin is a failed journalist, backing that up with a link to Niewert who was in Seattle when Malkin started her trade. Malkin was known then to be loose with the facts, with one article prompting “…a letter from the state Attorney General’s office pointing out that Malkin failed to even contact that office before attacking it (which those of us in the business knew constituted a Journalism 101 violation of basic ethics). It also pointed out several major errors of fact.

The latter column brought a lively response from her intended victim at the news-talk show, also pointing out the Malkin’s version of “facts” are not always aligned with reality.”

Malkin left Seattle for D.C. after, ending her career as a journalist and embarking on one as a professional pundit.

2)Malkin is a disgraced fake historian, linking to Muller’s devastating 29 part series challenging almost every historical fact Malkin pulled out of her ass in a book defending the internment of Japanese Americans and advocating the same for Arab Americans today. Muller’s systematic refutation of the very premise for Malkin’s book is seen today as a highwater mark for the blogosphere and caused Ed Cone to famously remark, “[Malkin's] contempt for people who disagree with her turned into hubris: she knows she’s right, and they’re wrong, so the facts will obey her commands. But facts are stubborn things.”

3)Malkin is a white supremacist in brown face, linking to BOP News article deconstructing Malkin’s career and backing and training from such right wing institutions as Regnery Books and the Heritage Foundation. The basis for Malkin’s alleged white supremacist inkling comes in part from the fact the Regnery is linked with the John Birch society, and that Malkin pens a regular cloumn for white supremacist site vdare.com.

Instead of defending Malkin by addressing each of these (well sourced) claims by Tbogg, Patterico instead chooses to attack Tbogg’s anonymity by passively-aggressively outing Tbogg. One can only assume that this tact by Patterico means Patterico had no real rebuttal to the claims made against Malkin, and had to resort to schoolyard bullying tactics.

Comment by In Vino Veritas — 8/3/2006 @ 10:20 am
g.a.: quick question

If Qana was a hoax,

1)Why has Israel apologized for it?
http://www.nytimes.com/2006/07/31/world/middleeast/31scene.html?_r=1&oref=slogin

2) Why dis the IDF change its initial story on the strike?

“The Israel Defense Forces had said after the deadly air-strike that many rockets had been launched from Qana. However, it changed its version on Monday.

The site was included in an IAF plan to strike at several buildings in proximity to a previous launching site. Similar strikes were carried out in the past. However, there were no rocket launches from Qana on the day of the strike.”

http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/745185.html

Comment by In Vino Veritas — 8/3/2006 @ 10:27 am
It’s interesting to note that Patterico’s first thought when angered by TBogg’s comments about a third party was to track down his real identity. Why did that even occur to him? Curiosity? The only reasonable answer is that Patterico was looking for a way to harm TBogg in retaliation for his comments bout Ms. Malkin. TBogg’s real identity doesn’t help Patterico make a counter-argument or dispute the (admittedly crude) gist of TBogg’s comments. All it does is provide Patterico with the means to intimidate TBogg into silence. In the context of the decision by Patterico’s compadre Jeff Goldstein to step away from blogging following the unhinged behavior of a commenter, it is hard to see his actions any other way. Patterico got mad and decided the best way to respond was by attempting intimidate the object of his anger into silence.

I never want to here about online civility from this quarter again.

Comment by Singularity — 8/3/2006 @ 10:29 am
VV:

Israel also initially apologized for the death of Muhammad al Dura, before a number of studies by independent suggested that the IDF was not responsible.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muhammad_al-Durra

Comment by aunursa — 8/3/2006 @ 10:39 am
I always thought Michelle Malkin’s penchant for antagonism and hate speech was why the Right like her; she and others like her (Coulter, Savage) are willing to say things most wingnuts don’t want to be caught dead saying on record.

And Tbogg’s real name is actually “Mangrove Throatwarbler”. Boy did he fool you guys…

Comment by Samurai Sam — 8/3/2006 @ 10:42 am
[Try the headline of his post. — P]

What, five clearly sarcastic little words that on their own didn’t even constitute a complete sentence? You’re really stretching if you think that qualifies as an accusation on TBOGG’s part. Yet not exactly surprising given the gymnastics you’ve already undertaken to try and defend Goldstein as mentally balanced.

But please, don’t let me deter you from your ongoing identity-revealing crusade. I’m sure somebody somewhere thinks it’s important.

Comment by Doug — 8/3/2006 @ 10:43 am
What, five clearly sarcastic little words that on their own didn’t even constitute a complete sentence? You’re really stretching if you think that qualifies as an accusation on TBOGG’s part.

He called it an outing. You said Patterico lied by saying that Tbogg claimed to have been outed. Tbagg called it an outing. What part of that confuses you?

Yet not exactly surprising given the gymnastics you’ve already undertaken to try and defend Goldstein as mentally balanced.

I’ll thank you to provide a link to where I’ve ever said that Goldstein is mentally balanced. I know you won’t find one.

But please, don’t let me deter you from your ongoing identity-revealing crusade.

My identity revealing crusade? WTF are you talking about? I’m no tbagg, thank heavens.

Comment by Pablo — 8/3/2006 @ 10:53 am
Vino Veritas-

If people wished to present information as you do in post #69 instead of spending time practicing profanity, then maybe we could get somewhere. The information you present can be investigated, and even if all true, does not explain the need to use the kind of rhetoric that “TBoggs” used, which was the original issue, I believe.

I actually thought “TBoggs” referred to a baseball fan who liked Wade Boggs, and was himself a T-ball coach. I don’t want anyone using that language to be a T-ball coach for my kids (younger, that is). In fact, until Dan Rather announces who “TBoggs” is, I’m sticking to my version.

Comment by MD in Philly — 8/3/2006 @ 10:53 am
Darleen: I consider myself to be on the American Left, and I believe I have demonstrated myself to be an adult. You are, of course, free to disagree.

Comment by aphrael — 8/3/2006 @ 10:55 am
Ken: I’ve found myself engaged in substantial debate here numerous times. Of course, I also tend to be very moderate in the tone of my comments, and think about what is being said on the other side before responding; many of the frequent leftish commentators here decline to do either.

Comment by aphrael — 8/3/2006 @ 10:57 am
Doug is talking about Patterico, not you, Pablo. The subtle tip-off was that he quoted Patterico, not you.

Comment by Josh — 8/3/2006 @ 10:58 am
Singularity says:

All it does is provide Patterico with the means to intimidate TBogg into silence.

Is that what it did? How can you tell? When does the silence begin?

In the context of the decision by Patterico’s compadre Jeff Goldstein to step away from blogging following the unhinged behavior of a commenter, it is hard to see his actions any other way.

If by “stepping away from blogging” you mean “updating his blog daily” that’s exactly right. What are we supposed to see in that again?

Patterico got mad and decided the best way to respond was by attempting intimidate the object of his anger into silence.

Or into outing himself, or something. When does the silence part start, again?

Comment by Pablo — 8/3/2006 @ 10:58 am
FWIW,

Not all who are more conservative than Joe Lieberman appreciate Mr. Savage or Ms. Coulter. Just as I know there are some more liberal than Mr. Lieberman who don’t really think Fahrenheit 911 was 100% verifiable.

Comment by MD in Philly — 8/3/2006 @ 10:58 am
Doug is talking about Patterico, not you, Pablo. The subtle tip-off was that he quoted Patterico, not you.

If by “he quoted Patterico” you mean “He quoted you, Pablo” that’s exactly right.

You kids are such fun. I might have to hit Pat’s tip jar for this level of entertainment.

Comment by Pablo — 8/3/2006 @ 11:01 am
Malkin deserves every bit of aspersion she gets. She has made a career out of being hated, and she therefore must suffer the ill-effects of her hate-mongering. Even the darkest of hearts must ache at night as she reflects on all the hate she brings to the world.

Comment by Jason — 8/3/2006 @ 11:02 am
Dude, you are one sad, sad POS. Really, slink back to the rock that crawled out from under and leave the adults alone.

Comment by The Real Sharon — 8/3/2006 @ 11:03 am
Whoa. I knew Pablo had an unhealthy obsession with Patty/Goldstein, but until now I figured it had just been one of those desperate-for-attention, “Look at me! I love you! Pleeeeease give me your approval!” low-self-esteem-having-child-type things. I didn’t know it had blossomed into full-blown Single White Female conflating-your-identities-with-others psychosis.

But anyway, Pablo, this is a long-winded way of saying that yes, I was, as Josh pointed out, quoting Patterico, not you. Read much?

Comment by Doug — 8/3/2006 @ 11:04 am
“I do not know if any eminent social scientist has studied to see if there is an inverse correlation between foul language and the ability to critically think, but I think there probably is. The rise of foul language at least temporally coincides with the inability to reason logically. Many attempts at a logical argument that I see or hear today would have a hard time getting out of the “C” range in my sophomore (high school) speech class. The real shame is I don’t know how many people realize that.”

Outstanding job of logically stringing together completely unfounded speculations and hearsay. I wonder how your sophomore (high school) speech teacher would grade that?

Comment by whetstone — 8/3/2006 @ 11:11 am
Jeez, P2, this blog is going to need some fumigating. Try Troll-Away(TM). But seriously, TBogg’s racist attacks on Malkin shows he’s not up to learned debate and civil discourse. It’ll eventually bring him down, pseudo- or not. His “martyrdom” supposedly at your hands is just one more absurdity to get some attention without posing any substance. Siccum, trolls.

Comment by Monsoon — 8/3/2006 @ 11:13 am
) Malkin is a failed journalist, backing that up with a link to Niewert who was in Seattle when Malkin started her trade. Malkin was known then to be loose with the facts, with one article prompting “…a letter from the state Attorney General’s office pointing out that Malkin failed to even contact that office before attacking it (which those of us in the business knew constituted a Journalism 101 violation of basic ethics). It also pointed out several major errors of fact.

Quick question: Did the paper publish a retraction?

The latter column {ed: column? I thought you were holding Malkin to journalist standards, not editorial columnist standards. For a discussion of the difference between columnists and journalists see the lefty Attytood blogger/columnist} brought a lively response from her intended victim at the news-talk show, also pointing out the Malkin’s version of “facts” are not always aligned with reality.”

Hmmmm, so Malkin wrote an editorial column and her version of ‘facts’ didn’t align with “reality”. I’ll alert Maureen Dowd, Frank Rich, Paul Krugman, Molly Ivins, and Trudy Rubin.

Malkin left Seattle for D.C. after, ending her career as a journalist and embarking on one as a professional pundit.

so she changed jobs or took an offer or had some life circumstance that made working in D.C. Probably for more money. This is bad….. how?

2)Malkin is a disgraced fake historian, linking to Muller’s devastating 29 part series challenging almost every historical fact Malkin pulled out of her ass in a book defending the internment of Japanese Americans and advocating the same for Arab Americans today.

This warrants an ‘okay, so what?” response.

For her part Malkin responded to most, maybe all, of Muller’s 29 part series. Which I read at the time and didn’t consider Muller’s critique so much as ‘devestating’ as ‘jealously protecting academic turf’. Which was an opinion shared by other 3rd party actual-real historians.

Also, out of curiousity, didja like ‘Fahrenheit 911″? What academic credentials does Michael Moore bring to the table when looking at historical events?

Or, maybe, you’re simply against freedom of speech?

Your choice.

Muller’s systematic refutation of the very premise for Malkin’s book is seen today as a highwater mark for the blogosphere and caused Ed Cone to famously remark, “[Malkin’s] contempt for people who disagree with her turned into hubris: she knows she’s right, and they’re wrong, so the facts will obey her commands. But facts are stubborn things.”

Well, that’s an interesting choice as a ‘highwater mark’ for the blogosphere.

3)Malkin is a white supremacist in brown face, linking to BOP News article deconstructing Malkin’s career and backing and training from such right wing institutions as Regnery Books and the Heritage Foundation.

Okay, so rightwing institutions like Regnery and Heritage are white supremacist organization? Is that the allegation or is it stated somewhere in their literature? Could you or DWeav provide some proof that either named organization supports a white supremacist policy?

Or not?

The basis for Malkin’s alleged {ed: alleged? why back off the charge now?} white supremacist inkling comes in part from the fact the Regnery is linked with the John Birch society, and that Malkin pens a regular cloumn for white supremacist site vdare.com.

Because that isn’t proof.

LibAv, I read through your 2004 take on this and, still, I find the allegation silly.

Malkin writes a syndicated column for which VDARE pays Creators Syndicate money to publish it on their site. Her work is also syndicated to Jewish World Review - is there some white supremacist/JEW group out there we should know about?

Saying that Malkin ‘pens a regular column for VDARE’ implies that she creates original content specifically for that site. She doesn’t.

Her agreement with VDARE people on issues (the Sailer piece) is less than what you made it out to be.

The statement that Malkin’s a white supremacist in brown face is, frankly, stupid whether you or the guy who never learned to shave as a cowboy thinks she is.

But, please, tell us how the Maglagang and ping pong ball stuff used by her detractors isn’t race baiting. That’d be nice.

Comment by preferably anonymous — 8/3/2006 @ 11:14 am
But anyway, Pablo, this is a long-winded way of saying that yes, I was, as Josh pointed out, quoting Patterico, not you. Read much?

Ah, I missed Patterico’s edit, Doug. Mea culpa. But my point stands. Tbagg called it an outing, yet you called Patterico a liar for pointing that out.

You, sir, are a goon.

Good DAY!

Comment by Pablo — 8/3/2006 @ 11:20 am
So basically, the “moonbat left” is here making perfectly reasoned arguments and bringing up perfectly relevant points.

As is par for the course, all that the slime-merchants of the right can come up with is “stop being so mean and using those bad words” or “lookit all the lfty lunatics”.

These are the types of people that are running the country now, sadly. These are the types of people that have sent our troops off to die for a pile of lies, profits and strange imperialistic dreams.

One day our 12-year national nightmare of heavy GOP influence over this (once) great nation will end — and on that day, there will be much rejoicing, if it isn’t already too late to save the country, and the world.

Comment by John in Chicago — 8/3/2006 @ 11:22 am
“I do not know if any eminent social scientist has studied to see if there is an inverse correlation between foul language and the ability to critically think, but I think there probably is. The rise of foul language at least temporally coincides with the inability to reason logically. Many attempts at a logical argument that I see or hear today would have a hard time getting out of the “C” range in my sophomore (high school) speech class. The real shame is I don’t know how many people realize that.”

Outstanding job of logically stringing together completely unfounded speculations and hearsay. I wonder how your sophomore (high school) speech teacher would grade that?

Comment by whetstone — 8/3/2006 @ 11:11 am

She would first read it and understand it. She would realize that I already acknowledged that two things being temporally related does not necessarily mean any true relationship, and she would agree that all of my points were correct:
1. Language is more foul than it used to be.
2. People can not follow a make a logical argument as well as days past, or Dan Rather would never have put that fake document forward.
3. They have occurred in the same time frame, FWIW.

To the degree there is a connection, I recall the point being made that foul language was resorted to when someone didn’t have better language skills to express themselves. Poor language skills and inability to think logically probably have some degree of interrelationship.

Comment by MD in Philly — 8/3/2006 @ 11:26 am
So basically, the “moonbat left” is here making perfectly reasoned arguments and bringing up perfectly relevant points.

Those arguments and points would be your posts featuring the word ‘patty’, John?

Comment by preferably anonymous — 8/3/2006 @ 11:27 am
I am about to get his ass reamed repeatedly by the “blogofascists” of the left. I hope I remembered to douche.

Comment by Patthettico — 8/3/2006 @ 11:35 am
Well well well, look at that. I go away for a few hours to do some work and when I get back what do I find? Discussion of the relative merits of Mz. Malkin’s style of “debate”. Oh you kids! You’ll be the death of me. That’ll teach me to do work.

Not that anyone needs to be reminded, but Mz. Malkin is immaterial to the matter at hand; to whit:

1) P takes offense at something TBogg said about Mz. Malkin.
2) P’s first response is to go a-huntin’ up TBogg’s real name.
3) Since TBogg never really tried to hide his name, P finds it rather easily.
4) P attempts to threaten (quite lamely, one might add) TBogg with an outing if he doesn’t stop saying mean things about Mz. Malkin.
5) TBogg says, in effect, “Bring it on, chump.”
6) P demurs, thinking it gives him some moral cover (it doesn’t.)

There you go; there’s everything in a nutshell. P comes off looking like a sadsack for doing the research to out TBogg but not having the, shall we say, “generative fortitude,” to pull the trigger. He comes back here, licks his wounds, but can’t stop picking at that scab; “How’d it go wrong? Why wasn’t he intimidated?” “Did I screw it up?”

Yes, P, you screwed it up. You come off looking like the worst kind of character assassin - one who can’t follow through.

By the way, you still haven’t answered my question - do you still think TBogg is a gutless coward?

KV

Comment by Ken Verybigliar — 8/3/2006 @ 11:37 am
Jeez Patterico. Did you kick over a rock here or what.

Comment by Dwilkers — 8/3/2006 @ 11:46 am
Actually, to get back to MD:

I teach junior and senior high school. I do not allow any vulgar language, incluing the commonly heard words, “sucks” and “crap.” If a students slips and says one or the other, I say, “Please don’t use that word; it’s so vulgar.” They always honor my request.

And that’s the point: many kids use words becuase they hear them in music & movies, and even in public, but NO ONE calls people out on it. In order to teach civility, adults have to model civility, and I make sure that I do.

Comment by goddessoftheclassroom — 8/3/2006 @ 11:49 am
Hey, Rico, (can I call you Rico?), that’s really powerful work, dude. At least for a member of the intellectually challenged and morally bereft right-wing gasbags.

Thanks, Rico. I’ll be back when I need a good laugh.

Just so you know…I’m

T. McTighe
P. O. Box 725 (we don’t have mailboxes)
Sullivan’s Island, SC 29482

Comment by Thomas — 8/3/2006 @ 12:04 pm
“preferably anonymous” no likey allegations from the left that Malkin has ties to VDare.com, and by extension, white separatism.

Malkin links to VDare in her blogroll. VDARE’s mission statement is here and is indisputably oriented towards white supremacy/separatism.

I myself have written about Michelle’s enthusiastic defense of Steve Sailer of VDARE - the racial IQ proponent.

Juan Mann writes for VDARE - and he writes for Michelle’s immigration blog. (He also operates a cheerful site called “DeportAliens.com”).

Malkin’s name appears on the VDARE front page six times at the moment. There is a permanent link to her “archive” on the front page.

Is VDARE not a racist entity? Is Malkin not tied clearly to VDARE?

Comment by The Liberal Avenger — 8/3/2006 @ 12:20 pm
the fact is people on the left hide behind fake names because some person/s from the right will send viruses, spam and thier acolytes to try to harm the person from the left. i am not saying only people on the right do this but more from the right then the left do it.
more to the point tbogg is right on about michelle malkin.

Comment by jim — 8/3/2006 @ 12:23 pm
Jim,

You got some stats to back up that assertion that people from the right “send viruses, spam and thier (sic) acolytes to try to harm the person from the left”? I mean, sorta like the lefty idiots on this thread, the ones with the collective I.Q. of 3 I referenced earlier?

Sure, it’s all those people from the right who make racist remarks, right? I mean, it’s all those right wingers who call Michelle Malkin all sorts of racist names, not those oh-so-tolerant leftwing batshit crazies. Or those 3d grade taunts about Patterico not outing an idiot lefty blogger who hides behind a pseudonym while castigating Michelle Malkin (real name) and Jeff Goldstein (real name).

Comment by sharon — 8/3/2006 @ 12:35 pm
Ah, I missed Patterico’s edit,

Not just once, but again, even after I was so kind as to point out your error in a generous effort to spare you further embarassment. And not even a word of thanks for my trouble!

Comment by Josh — 8/3/2006 @ 12:47 pm
Help me Rhonda,

So, again, we see the Left on display. Bad manners, dirty mouths, racist bigots, cowardly appeasers, and crazy as outhouse rats. Steeped in illusions, marinated in mendacity, filled with hate, and blind as Moonbats, these unemployable nincompoops out themselves like Pavlov’s dogs and then whine someone else made them do it. Sheesh!

Comment by Black Jack — 8/3/2006 @ 12:47 pm
LibAv -

That part where I said - “I read your 2004 post about this {Sailer}”, what I meant to say was “I read your 2004 post about this {Sailer}”, but thanks anyway for sending me the link to the post you wrote in 2004 about this.

I also read the post Malkin wrote which you linked. That post had nothing to do with your topic, it had to do with hispanics and their impact on voting. So, you bait and switched at the link, imo.

If you’re going to say “Nothing Steve Sailer can ever be used or thought of seriously by non-racists” then go ahead and say that.

You seem (to me) a bit hysterical with regard to VDARE. They may be the Klan with nice ties

I also read the SPLC article, here:

http://www.splcenter.org/intel/intelreport/article.jsp?pid=285

And, I think there’s a central problem with the issue with border control and immigration being equated specifically with racism.

One - having control of your borders and a plan for immigration seems to be a pretty good idea for all countries, including the US.

Two - the population growth among non-whites is higher than whites, which sort of diminishes the ‘White Power’ side of the equation. I didn’t catch the part where VDARE advocates sterilizing the brown people for the good of the white people.

I’m no fan of VDARE, I thought the ‘Heather Locklear’ stuff he wrote was sort of odd. If Adrian Zmed had some Lubbe blood in him, that would be kind of cool.

I understand that you’re fully invested in this “Malkin, because VDARE mentions her and publishes her stuff, is some self-loathing white supremacist” .. have at it.

Just don’t mind my rolling my eyes every once in a while.

Comment by preferably anonymous — 8/3/2006 @ 12:49 pm
Not just once, but again, even after I was so kind as to point out your error in a generous effort to spare you further embarassment. And not even a word of thanks for my trouble!

Tell you what, Josh. I’ll thank you for jumping in to the conversation as soon as you address the point at hand. Was Doug right to call Patterico a liar, or is he indeed a doodyhead?

Comment by Pablo — 8/3/2006 @ 12:50 pm
sharon,(how do we know it’s your real name?)
#1 Michelle malkin published the names and adresses of a group of peaceful protesters who showed up at a army recruiting center.
#2 republicans who suggested Max Cleland blew off his own limbs during the vietnam war
#3 republicans who suggested John Mccain abused his adopted daughter.
#4 the fact karl rove is a right winger.
#5 the viruses i recieved for a month the day after i sent the folks at powerline a note telling them how much i appreciated what they offer to political discourse in america.
#6 some person sharon who assaults people on the lefts iq, calls them idiots and then says i said things i didn’t.
why don’t you ask goldtein, malkin et al if they are recieving monies to spout thier rhetoric, you might be surprised.
although i must agree on one thing with you, as much as i believe the following it should be doubted unless proof is offered
“In 1984 I watched George W. Bush enthusiastically and expertly perform a homosexual act on another man, one Victor Ashe.”

How’s that for an attention-grabbing opener? These words come to us by way of Nevada gubernatorial candidate Leola McConnell, who would have my vote if I lived in the state of sin.

Comment by jim — 8/3/2006 @ 12:52 pm
Comment by sharon — 8/3/2006 @ 12:35 pm

Ya know what? Michelle Malkin is an advocate of torture, internment camps and genocide.

You think she deserves tolerance, ya schlep?

Fuck her, and fuck everything she stands for. And Sharon, you and the other reich-wing troglodytes are a bunch of sick, twisted wanna-be fascists for even CONSIDERING not only being tolerant of a torture-apologist like Malkin, but actually defending that waste of a person.

I just love how the reich-wingers, when all else fails, complain about how “the left is supposed to be tolerant, so why aren’t they tolerant of my fascist pig heroes?” Pathetic.

The so-called “tolerance” of the left is something that has to do with not taking away people’s rights, or not being discrimatory against people based solely on their religious beliefs, sexual orientation, race, etc.

The left’s “tolerance” never was, and never will be extended to “being tolerant of war criminLs and their enablers and apologists”. So in other words, we’ll never be like you, and thank God for that.

Comment by John in Chicago — 8/3/2006 @ 12:53 pm
This is how you respond to my acts of Christian charity? One who makes boneheaded errors is in no position to demand answers of the one who corrects said errors. Even the crassest urchin understands that you first thank your benefactor for what he has provided you already before extending your grubby paw for more.

Comment by Josh — 8/3/2006 @ 12:55 pm
“Help me Rhonda,
So, again, we see the Left on display…. blah blah blah I cant address the issues so I’ll just throw out a bunch of baseless attacks”

Is that all you got, wannabe fascist?

Comment by John in Chicago — 8/3/2006 @ 12:55 pm
Is Malkin not tied clearly to VDARE?

If VDARE is paying her syndicate to run her columns, and that means Michelle is tied to VDARE, that means that when I go to the grocery store and buy some Ben and Jerry’s which I then offer to my guests, Ben and Jerry are tied to me.

They’re swell guys, I’m sure, and the ice cream rocks. But I don’t think any of us would be willing to consider ourselves tied together because of it.

Can’t we just agree that they don’t enjoy a Jane Hamsher/Ned Lamont sort of relationship?

Comment by Pablo — 8/3/2006 @ 12:55 pm
Hey Josh? Blow me, loser.

Comment by Pablo — 8/3/2006 @ 12:56 pm
The anger and obscenity on the left is amazing. I don’t think it is necessarily evidence of inability to think. That is sufficiently explained by their politics. I think the use of obscenity is to make them sound more manly. That applies to the “girls” too. The moonbat eruption here is awesome. I expect a cold summer next year just due to the amount of crap in the air. I expect we will see record levels by the November election.

As for Regnery, I also am a small publisher and envy the commercial success that Regnery has had taking stuff that the main stream publishers, with left wing editors making value judgements, have passed up. Maybe that’s why there is such a high failure rate in publishing these days. The LA Times and NY Times have shown the way and the lemmings followed.

Comment by Mike K — 8/3/2006 @ 1:00 pm
#1 Michelle malkin published the names and adresses of a group of peaceful protesters who showed up at a army recruiting center.

Ah., those were organizers of a protest against the US ARMED FORCES and it was at UC Santa Cruz that they chased American servicemen off the campus. The information Malkin posted was that contained in their PRESS RELEASE, which she found posted at their website.

Here’s Michelle’s post.

When your first fact is so blatantly wrong, one has to wonder if you’re simply misinformed or maliciously lying.

Which is it?

Comment by Pablo — 8/3/2006 @ 1:02 pm
#4 the fact karl rove is a right winger.

All the proof I need!

Cordially…

Comment by Rick — 8/3/2006 @ 1:05 pm
“The anger and obscenity on the left is amazing”

Yep, and the actual, physical destruction of life, environment and the middle-class by the right is something that actually matters and is relevant in the world we live in.

Want a tissue, Mikey?

You destroy our country and we’re supposed to be polite about it? Fuck off.

Comment by John in Chicago — 8/3/2006 @ 1:05 pm
Pablo,

The facts of the Malkin post don’t matter; only of fact of “karl rove’s” right winger-hood. Sure, listed as #4, but #1 in the left’s pounding hearts.

Cordially…

Comment by Rick — 8/3/2006 @ 1:07 pm
“The so-called “tolerance” of the left is something that has to do with not taking away people’s rights, or not being discrimatory against people based solely on their religious beliefs, sexual orientation, race, etc.”

Really? I thought it was about intellectual discourse. But judging from your venom, that would be impossible. Not interested in taking away people’s rights? I guess you’re against campus speech codes and all the other BS the left, the supposedly TOLERANT left, talks about ad nauseam. You’ve done a terrific job of advertising here for your causes. Congratulations!

Comment by sharon — 8/3/2006 @ 1:08 pm
#2 republicans who suggested Max Cleland blew off his own limbs during the vietnam war

Max Cleland blew off his own limbs during vietnam. It was an accident, but it did happen that way via a wayward grenade. That is part of the historical record - and from his own words - and I’m quite surprised that anyone knowing who Cleland is would not know that fact.

BTW, #5 makes you appear quite the crank. Unless Powerline replied to your ‘note’ with an attachment that you unwittingly opened which contained a virus, the Powerline guys would have no way of infecting your computer. I’ve seen some doozies, but blaming Powerline for your computer viruses?

Comment by RW — 8/3/2006 @ 1:09 pm
Blow me, loser.

Such a witty rejoinder! Feeling a bit thin-skinned after learning that Patterico thinks you are an anonymous coward?

Comment by Josh — 8/3/2006 @ 1:09 pm
VDARE - the organization named after Virginia Dare - the first European born on the American continent - who was stolen and raped by savage redskins and was magically turned into a white deer - is a website that has nothing to do with white supremacy and the fact that Malkins’ columns run there means she has absolutely nothing to do with it whatsoever.

OK.

Comment by The Liberal Avenger — 8/3/2006 @ 1:12 pm
Sharon,

allow me to jump in with respect to #116.

I am, and always have been, torn on the subject of campus speech codes and “political correctness” more generally. I don’t like the idea of *rules enforced by the campus authority* which require that you speak in particular ways; on the other hand, I find that much of what is covered by campus speech codes is in some way or another *rude*, and is speech that I would expect civilized adults to not engage in.

Which is to say: I don’t support the rules, but I think the people violating the rules are by and large jerks with a chip on their shoulder about how they’re being oppressed because people won’t let them be jerks.

Comment by aphrael — 8/3/2006 @ 1:13 pm
Liberal Avenger,
David Ehrenstein called J.C. Watts a “house nigger” and is still actively linked by atrios (who knows all about it, and replied “David has earned the right to say whatever he wants”) and blogs for the huffingtonpost. Neither of those two would I consider racist, even though they’re rather icky, they just are affiliated in some way with someone who uses racist language.

Just a lesson in “guilt by association can sometimes be tricky, which is why it’s often not a legitimate debating point”.

Comment by RW — 8/3/2006 @ 1:17 pm
“Really? I thought it was about intellectual discourse”

Well excuse you for being a dumb ass. Look up the word tolerant, and tell me where it mentions intellectual discourse. And then tell me where I can find an intellectual on the right.

“I guess you’re against campus speech codes and all the other BS the left, the supposedly TOLERANT left, talks about ad nauseam.”

Hmm. Ad nauseum? I guess that would mean the left always talks about it. Which is odd, since I don’t see the left always talking about it. Whats that? Oh its just another one of your irrelevant straw man attacks?

That’s a fucking fringe issue, and you know it twit. In fact, outside of campus not tolerating rascist and religious slurs or bigotted speech, I don’t know WTF youre even talking about. Which is strange, since you baselessly claim that this is something the left “always talks about”…

What matters is you and your ilk propping up a government that starts wars based on false pretenses. Get with the program. OR, so maybe you’ll think I’m more “MANLY”, I’ll rephrase that and say get with the fucking program, ya dumb ass.

I’m not here in an attempt to engage in “intellectual discourse’ with the wannabe fascist crowd. You all know the facts, and you still insist on living in your reality-addled bubble of disinformation. I’m here to just observe what type of American it takes to watch as their country is flushed down the shitter while they cheer it on, and I pretty much have seen what I expected to see.

Comment by John in Chicago — 8/3/2006 @ 1:18 pm
hey pablo,
it was a recruiting post set up at uc santa cruz.
is your army not part of your armed forces?
the names and adresses were on a press release and were not to be part of the public domain,it is for journalists if they need to follow up. that is why you don’t see the name and address of every spokesman for every group who is quoted in the papers
given your little rant and obvious inaccuracies one has to wonder if you are simply misinformed or are maliciously lying.
please provide a url or screen capture of the press release from thier website.

Comment by jim — 8/3/2006 @ 1:18 pm
Feeling a bit thin-skinned after learning that Patterico thinks you are an anonymous coward?

You should have seen me when the Earth expolded the other day. Man, was I ever peckish!

Doug tells me he’s next, Josh, so don’t bother getting up.

Comment by Pablo — 8/3/2006 @ 1:19 pm
LibAv -

I checked. That wasn’t VDARE’s mission statement, or even part of the FAQ.

If you’re going to substitute your Greater Understanding of a group like VDARE’s purpose for theirs, go ahead. Just declare your perspicacity when doing so.

It’s polite.

Cheers.

Comment by preferably anonymous — 8/3/2006 @ 1:19 pm
Jim, it was a job fair, you dumbass. Read the post.

Comment by Pablo — 8/3/2006 @ 1:19 pm
GA:

Your link about Muslims lying to infidels is the most racist piece of shit that has been bandied about here today. You should be ashamed to have brought it up - and Patterico should be ashamed to have you as a guest here on his site.

Comment by The Liberal Avenger — 8/3/2006 @ 1:21 pm
Your sister is named Doug? That’s odd.

Comment by Josh — 8/3/2006 @ 1:22 pm
Jesus. Fucking. Christ. In the history of big steaming loads disgorged from the gaping maw of Michelle Malkin what could be more absurd than hearing this professional rage artist complain about racism, the very basis of her crapulent bottom-feeder career?

I haven’t seen anything racist on Malkin’s blog. I did see something racist and disgusting from Jane Hamsher yesterday. I’m not one to loosely throw around the racist label, but yup, that was racist. Were we not supposed to notice?

This is why you never see her anywhere except on Fox with her fake outrage

Oh, it was a genuinely outrageous picture for Jane Hamsher to post. I know you don’t like that Malkin is ripping her a new one over it but maybe down the line you’ll realize Hamsher is getting what she deserves. Couldn’t happen to a nicer woman…..

As far as why Malkin is only on the most-viewed cable news channel instead of the news channels with no ratings…isn’t she under contract with FOX?

I’m too tired to go through all that happened between Patterico and TBogg (maybe when I’m buzzed I’ll go through it…). I’m not familiar with TBogg, and if defending the injection of racist imagery into a political campaign is what he’s about then I don’t think I’ll be familiarizing myself further.

Comment by LoafingOaf — 8/3/2006 @ 1:23 pm
John — William F. Buckley is clearly an intellectual, and is clearly on the right. You lose this point.

Also, Dictionary.com’s *first* definition for ‘tolerance’ is “The capacity for or the practice of recognizing and respecting the beliefs or practices of others.” While this doesn’t say anything about intellectual discourse per se, intellectual discourse is the exchange of ideas and beleifs, and having the capacity to recognize and respect the beliefs of others is a prerequisite to a fruitful intellectual discourse.

Comment by aphrael — 8/3/2006 @ 1:23 pm
Josh, don’t you call my sister a liar.

Comment by Pablo — 8/3/2006 @ 1:25 pm
Pablo — i’m somewhat shocked that the students at UC Santa Cruz have been turning violent over this; when *I* was there, protests were peaceful. We did sometimes have debates about whether or not to be peaceful, but the peaceful protest crowd always won.

That said, the army deciding to send recruiters to a job fair at UC Santa Cruz doesn’t appear to be one of their brighter decisions: the left-wing, anti-war tenor of the campus population has been well known for two decades now. Yes, the military has the *right*, enshrined in law, to send recruiters to said job fair; and yes, violently ejecting them from campus is both immoral and illegal; and deciding to go there in the first place wasn’t the most prudent of decisions.

Comment by aphrael — 8/3/2006 @ 1:25 pm
If Malkin and VDARE aren’t racist, what are they then?

Do they say nice things about people of other races? Do they embrace multiculturalism? Are they proponents of tolerance? Do they teach brotherly love?

Comment by The Liberal Avenger — 8/3/2006 @ 1:25 pm
bwahahahahahaha!

So when african-american David Ehrenstein calls african-american J.C. Watts a “house n****r”,
that somehow makes african-american David Ehrenstein a racist in your humble opinion?

Put down the crack pipe RJ West. You\’re insaneeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee!

Comment by bwahahahahahaha — 8/3/2006 @ 1:26 pm
John in Chicago,

You’ll have to trust me here that I’m not being snarky or otherwise malicious when I tell you this. Any rational observer looking in on this blog from the outside could not read your last few posts without concluding you’ve completely lost your mind.

Read what you’re writing here! You have built up this demonized boogyman of reich-wingers that you’re convinced are actively trying to persecute you, take away your rights, or put you in a gulag.

You respond to this completely imaginary threat by behaving precisely like the monster you’ve created in your mind. I have no doubt, based on your outrageous paranoia and anger, that if you were in a position to really do anything in the public sphere you would do all those evil things you believe Rethuglicans are doing or are trying to do.

Comment by Bill B — 8/3/2006 @ 1:27 pm
LoafingOaf says:

I haven’t seen anything racist on Malkin’s blog.

You’ll find that in the posts where she shares the email she gets from the inclusive, tolerant left. In spades!

Comment by Pablo — 8/3/2006 @ 1:27 pm
Y’know, piling on Greenwald for the sock puppet thing made sense. It spoke to larger issues. And the way the lefties circled the wagon was just dumb, considering what they were defending.

But this? What are you, twelve?

You’re a sniveling little bitch, Frey.

Comment by Clarke — 8/3/2006 @ 1:27 pm
Oh, and Liberal Avenger - they simply disagree with you on policies. I realize in your world that means they’re racist.

Comment by Bill B — 8/3/2006 @ 1:28 pm
So you feel the need to be a rabid bitch’s knight in shining plastic. Fine, make a fool of yourself. But your penile conniptions about this shrew are wasted because thousands think equally to TBogg about her. Me included, obviously.

Comment by Lesley — 8/3/2006 @ 1:28 pm
So when african-american David Ehrenstein calls african-american J.C. Watts a “house n****r”,
that somehow makes african-american David Ehrenstein a racist in your humble opinion?

Words mean things.
“Racist language” means racist language, such as calling someone a “house nigger”, as Ehrenstein did.
“Racist” means someone who believes that one race is inherently superior to another race.

Your ridiculous (yet oft repeated notion) that someone of a particular race cannot therefore be racist is duly noted, however. And, btw, quite comical considering the subject at hand.

Comment by RW — 8/3/2006 @ 1:30 pm
“John — William F. Buckley is clearly an intellectual, and is clearly on the right. You lose this point.”

Cuz starting a magazine that, in its infancy, railed on the “negro problem” is certainly something that qualifies you as an intellectual, right?

But I know the man is very educated, so I guess that would fit a narrow definition of the word. But I wasn’t trying to “win” anything anyways, it was more or less a joke, at the rights expense — because you have to be pretty fucking dumb to buy into today’s right wing vision of the world.

“and having the capacity to recognize and respect the beliefs of others is a prerequisite to a fruitful intellectual discourse.”

I recognize that Malkin is a rascist pig.

I do not respect it. therefore, I am not tolerant of her.

Like I said, the so-called “tolerance” of the left doesn’t mean that since we don’t discriminate against people merely because of what they do in their own provate lives, or the race, or their religion, it certainly doesn’t mean we have to be tolerant of those who enable and support war criminals.

I’ve never understood why the right can’t get that through their head, but I think it’s because they don’t care if it makes any sense or not, they just cannot address the actual relevant facts so they resort to critiquing the left’s choice of verbiage.

Which is, to say, a fucking morally bankrupt way of engaging in any kind of discourse, let alone intellectual discourse.

Comment by John in Chicago — 8/3/2006 @ 1:31 pm
hey pablo you fucking retarded monkey
what do you think a job fair is?
i know you don’t know because you probably never held a job in your life, you’re too busy holding your tiny dick between your hands and someone else’s between your lips.
next time you want to resort to name calling give your little pea brain a shake.

Comment by jim — 8/3/2006 @ 1:31 pm
Yes, the military has the *right*, enshrined in law, to send recruiters to said job fair; and yes, violently ejecting them from campus is both immoral and illegal…

apharel, as far as I’m concerned you can stop right there. I have no use for a “but” following that.

If the pukes can’t control themselves, they should be locked up. That’s why we have laws. And for them, and the rest of the left, to then claim victimhood when other people express themselves is garbage.

Comment by Pablo — 8/3/2006 @ 1:31 pm
and i know you have a use for a butt

Comment by jim — 8/3/2006 @ 1:32 pm
“Read what you’re writing here! You have built up this demonized boogyman of reich-wingers that you’re convinced are actively trying to persecute you, take away your rights, or put you in a gulag.”

Bill, for one I don’t give a shit what your perception of how others might perceive my comments here to be indicitive of. I really, honestly don’t. Get it?

For two, I didn’t conjure up any boogymen. They conjured up themselves. I haven’t alluded to any kind of conspiracy theories or anything of the sort.

I refer only to the factual, documented actions of the criminal Bush Administration. Starting wars based on false pretenses, propping up fascist regimes in the middle east (like Saudi Arabia), enriching the rich at the expense of the middle class and working poor, whipping the entire population into a fear frenzy whenever they need to be distracted from the matter(s) at hand, etc. etc. No boogyman there. Unless of course you consider the concept of REALITY to be a “boogyman” (it does have a well know liberal bias, so I can understand if you do).

Never mentioned the anyone taking away my rights, putting me in a gulag, or any of that other straw man bullshit you came up with in your feeble attempt to attempt to appear as the “voice of reason” or whatever the fuck you fancy yourself to be.

Comment by John in Chicago — 8/3/2006 @ 1:37 pm
as for what john in chicago said,
If the right had any intellectual honesty they would come right out and state what they stand for.
war for resources
white is right
greed is good
everybody else knows it is what they stand for

Comment by jim — 8/3/2006 @ 1:42 pm
John in Chicago,

I’m not trying to be the voice of anything. I’m making an observation of you behavior. My honest opinion is that you suffer from profound paranoia. You can take that or leave it.

It would be helpful, perhaps, if you’d step back and take a look at what you say and realize you’ve let yourself become just like your enemy, regardless of your protestations of the contrary.

Comment by Bill B — 8/3/2006 @ 1:42 pm
So as a prosecutor I take it that if someone is charged with walking up to someone and hitting him and his claim is the after I got in the other guys face, the other guy dared me to hit him and called me a pussy, so I hit him, I take it that as a prosecutor you would not press charges.

You are a thug in your private life. I suspect you are a thug in your professional life as prosecutor. You are absolutely not what our legal system needs.

Go fuck yourself.

Comment by jerry — 8/3/2006 @ 1:44 pm
John — as a leftist, I take issue with your description of the tolerance of the left.

*My* tolerance is to recognize that people walk down different paths and have different experiences, and that there is beauty in their paths and experiences just as their is beauty in mine. It is to understand that there is value in us each exchanging the wisdom we have gained through our experiences. It is to acknowledge that, likely as not, if I’d walked down the same path as another person, I would see the world much as they do; and to try to find a way to couch my view of the world in terms which I think would be understood by the person I am talking to.

The description of ‘tolerance’ you are espousing strikes me as being incredibly narrow and, to be honest, every bit as destructive as the intolerance you decry.

Comment by aphrael — 8/3/2006 @ 1:44 pm
Pablo: I believe there is wisdom in understanding when and where you are likely to be recieved well, and when and where you are likely to be recieved poorly; and I believe there is wisdom in acting on that.

The army, in choosing to send recruiters to this particular job fair, either failed to understand the ground in which they were recruiting, or decided to make a statement by deliberately going there.

The former, if true, is unfortunate but understandable. The latter, if true, is insane: why pick a fight when you know you don’t have to, unless your goal is to stir up public outrage?

Comment by aphrael — 8/3/2006 @ 1:45 pm
jim said: If the right had any intellectual honesty they would come right out and state what they stand for.

Has it ever occured to you, just once, that the reason the right doesn’t come right out and state those beliefs is because they don’t have them and those nefarious motives you ascribe to them exist only in your imagination?

Comment by Bill B — 8/3/2006 @ 1:46 pm
Jerry: in what possible way is ‘go fuck yourself’ conducive to a productive conversation? I mean, I guess it’s a great way to express moral outrage, but it’s a terrible way to engage someone in a discussion, don’t you think?

Comment by aphrael — 8/3/2006 @ 1:46 pm
Bill B - to be fair, I have seen many people say they believe that greed is good; greed, in their book, is what fuels economic growth.

Comment by aphrael — 8/3/2006 @ 1:47 pm
Comment by Bill B — 8/3/2006 @ 1:42 pm

Bill,

What part of “I don’t give a shit what you think the perception of my posts may be” do you not understand?

I don’t agree with you, and I don’t care to explain why because I’ve dealt with people like you who, when all else fails, emply this tired-ass tactic of “of youre so angry” in order to avoid the actual issues at hand.

I do read what I write. In fact, I read it several times over because I like it so much. You can get all hung up on my verbiage, but at the end of the day it doesn’t make me “like my enemy” no matter how much you huff and puff about it.

When I start defending and propping up people who drop bombs on civilians in the name of power and profit, then maybe you can spout your bullshit about me becoming like my enemies.

Until then, I have absolutely no interest in your baseless accusations.

Comment by John in Chicago — 8/3/2006 @ 1:49 pm
aphrael,
your position while admirable, will only get sand kicked in the face of the left and more stolen elections.
the left needs more eugene debs.

Comment by jim — 8/3/2006 @ 1:52 pm
Now you say that David Ehrenstein is racist because, you assert, he thinks african-americans are superior to african-americans? You\’re killing me here! ROTFLMAO at RJ West.

Really man, PUT DOWN THE CRACK PIPE!

bwahahahahahahaha!

Comment by bwahahahahahahaha! — 8/3/2006 @ 1:52 pm
If the right had any intellectual honesty they would come right out and state what they stand for.
war for resources
white is right
greed is good

Oh–hello there, Glenn!

How’s it hangin’? That’s some of your usual substance there, by golly for sure.

Cordially…

Comment by Rick — 8/3/2006 @ 1:52 pm
Comment by aphrael — 8/3/2006 @ 1:44 pm

Well youre a better person than me, I suppose.

Although I do agree with the basic jist of what youre saying.

On the other hand, I fail to see any redeeming qualities, or “beauty” in someone who is fully aware of the facts regarding our government, yet still decides to prop it up and decry all dissidents as traitors.

Ya know, I used to be more like you, but 10+ years of wannabe fascist rule has a way of changing one’s opinion of where my “tolerance” extends.

There’s no reasoning with these people, so I have officially abandoned the “high road” when it comes to dealing with those who enable war, poverty, racism and greed.

Comment by John in Chicago — 8/3/2006 @ 1:53 pm
aphrael, well, I’m sure all those sentiments listed by jim have been espoused by some people. But he’s got his mind set on believing everybody on the right believes those things, but won’t come out and say so…it’s all a secret, nefarious plot, ya know.

Comment by Bill B — 8/3/2006 @ 1:53 pm
bill b
hahahahahahahaha
actions speak louder than words

Comment by jim — 8/3/2006 @ 1:55 pm
John in Chicago,

On top of everything else you’re also self-rightous in the extreme. Anybody who doesn’t see the world as you do in your delusion is evil and must be destroyed. All I can say is thank goodness you don’t have any real power.

Comment by Bill B — 8/3/2006 @ 1:56 pm
er..self-righteous. Don’t want to spelling ninnies to descend on me.

Comment by Bill B — 8/3/2006 @ 1:57 pm
The latter, if true, is insane: why pick a fight when you know you don’t have to, unless your goal is to stir up public outrage?

aphreal, their goal was to do their jobs. They didn’t pick a fight. They were doing what WE PAY THEM to do. Recruit people. Which is what you do at a job fair.

Comment by Pablo — 8/3/2006 @ 1:58 pm
Well, for what it’s worth, I’d like to punch you in the face, Jerry.

Comment by Wilson — 8/3/2006 @ 2:00 pm
I’ll kick him in the ass!

Comment by Ellison — 8/3/2006 @ 2:01 pm
And I’ll give Jerry such a pinch!

Comment by Ryan — 8/3/2006 @ 2:04 pm
This too shall pass

Comment by Gbear — 8/3/2006 @ 2:06 pm
“n top of everything else you’re also self-rightous in the extreme. Anybody who doesn’t see the world as you do in your delusion is evil and must be destroyed. All I can say is thank goodness you don’t have any real power.”

Talk to me when your ready to discuss the criminal actions of those you support and enable.

For the third time, I do not care about your critiques of my posts.

But I will clarify one tidbit of misinformation you through out there:

“Anybody who doesn’t see the world as you do in your delusion is evil ”

Another baseless attack. I do not think that anybody who doesn’t see things the way I do is evil, as you are claiming. But I think anybody who actually knows all the facts about our government’s actions and the Republicans in general and still decides to support and enable them is a POS. Big difference, Elroy.

I’m pretty certain you still don’t get it (mostly because you don’t want to get it, like I said, I’ve dealt with the repug ‘voice of reason’ types before, and you all use the same tired, irrelevant, change-the-subject playbook), but whatever. I’m going home now.

Comment by John in Chicago — 8/3/2006 @ 2:06 pm
I just passed. It hurt. A lot.

Comment by Wilson — 8/3/2006 @ 2:07 pm
Aphrael, regarding your comment #150: The First Amendment confers a right on the speaker to speak and just as much of a right on his audience to hear him. The students who the recruiters wanted to talk to were entitled to make their own decisions whether to listen to the recruiters, to tell them “Thanks, but no thanks”, or simply ignore them. If Bill Gates wanted to offer you a job as his chief computer engineer, would you approve of me standing outside your house trying to keep him from talking to you?

Comment by nk — 8/3/2006 @ 2:09 pm
I’ve dealt with the repug ‘voice of reason’ types before, and you all use the same tired, irrelevant, change-the-subject playbook

This sounds strangely familiar. Hmmm.

Comment by Wilson — 8/3/2006 @ 2:09 pm
As to TBogg, I, like nearly every one of his regular readers, know his name. Part of the amusing aspect of the whole ‘nice blog you have here’ tone of ‘Six Fingers’ Patterico is that he knows so little about Tbogg and his blog that he thinks this is a site run under an alias.

THAT’s ever sadder than Patterico’s pathetic bravado.

Note to Patterico: attempt to use my IP for anything that ever impacts my daily life and I’ll be speaking to the DA’s office and the CA state bar.

Max Renn | 08.03.06 - 5:15 pm | #

Comment by Max Renn — 8/3/2006 @ 2:12 pm
John in Chicago,

And of course it never occurs to you that your facts might not be true. You’re completely incapable of recognizing that others might not see these crimes that you speak of. You believe it, and anybody who doesn’t is an enabler

I’m sorry, but anyway you parse it, you’re still left with wacko conspiracy theory. I won’t engage you anymore or try to change your mind because I know it would be like trying to talk someone out of believing in alien abductions or some such.

Comment by Bill B — 8/3/2006 @ 2:14 pm
Patterico sez:

I read through the first 45 comments or so, and most of his commenters said: Duh. You didn’t really try to hide it. Your moniker is basically your name.

Sheesh, Patterico, if you are going to lie, it’s not too wise to link to the proof that you are a liar. Most of the first 45 comments say no such thing. Some are a variation of “hi tBogg,” some are along the lines of “Patterico is an ass for doing this,” and most of the rest combine those two.

But,

Duh. You didn’t really try to hide it.

No, most of the first 45 comments say no such thing. And when you get past the sample size you describe, it turns heavily in favor of “Patterico is an ass for doing this.”

Patterico sez:

So the martyr thing isn’t really working out too well for him.

Don’t know what his motivations are–I doubt he’s looking for martyrdom since he comes out alive and healthy and, frankly, on top of you, ethically. Regardless of his aim, what I can see he is achieving is demonstrating how small of a person you are. And anyone traipsing over to those comments will see that. And when they look specifically at those fatal first 45, they will also see that you are a liar.

Cheers.

Comment by Nash — 8/3/2006 @ 2:15 pm
the first amendment says nothing about having the right to say thanks but no thanks in fact you can yell at the top of your lungs, “get out of here and go find the sons and daughters of your politicians to die.” and the first amendment also supports your right to say it as loud and as many times as you can, even until the murderer and torture recruiters leave.

Comment by jim — 8/3/2006 @ 2:16 pm
Pablo — pardon me, but that seems absurd to me. “Recruiting” people on the UC Santa Cruz campus is going to be an extremely low-yield activity. For that matter, recruiting people *in Santa Cruz* is going to be an extremely low-yield activity.

As a comparison: if I wanted to hire software engineers, I wouldn’t try to do so in an Amish community; it would be pointless. The same is true here: the overwhelming majority of UC Santa Cruz students are not going to be receptive.

Now, either the person who decided to send the recruiter knew that or he didn’t. If he didn’t, fair enough; it’s arguably part of his job to know where success is and isn’t likely, but it’s a forgivable error.

If he *did*, on the other hand … then what was the point? Why would you *try* to recruit soldiers in a venue which is actively hostile, and in which the potential yield is low?

Comment by aphrael — 8/3/2006 @ 2:16 pm