A Woman’s Nation
[Guest post by DRJ]
California recently hosted an extravagant Women’s Conference that is all about women changing the world:
“Under the direction of First Lady Maria Shriver, last week’s conference was a two-day extravaganza, a Technicolor version of the event of old. Much of the focus was “The Shriver Report,” a collaboration between Shriver and a Washington think-tank, which declared two weeks ago that we have become “a woman’s nation.”
But the heart of the conference occurred at lunch on Day 2, when Shriver, her voice breaking, for the first time publicly reflected on her mother’s recent death. Her words brought thousands to tears in a silent arena.
It was hard to imagine the same personal scene at a conference of men. But that was part of the point, for the theme of the conference might well have been: We still want to change the world. We just want to do it on our terms.
***
In her report, Shriver declared the battle of the sexes to be over, replaced by negotiation. Translation: In all the difficult decisions of daily life, the things that get us from here to there, much still needs to be worked out.”
Apart from the fact I wouldn’t waste my time attending a conference where the highlight is crying, this sounds like an excuse to whine about how hard women have it and that men don’t do enough to help them … with a dash of we’re so helpless or fragile thrown in.
Is this the era of independent women or isn’t it? Independent women can handle things without whining or crying and, if a women’s conference that celebrates women is such a good idea, then let men have a men’s conference where they are allowed to celebrate being … men.
There’s another double-standard highlighted here: At a conference where the theme is supporting women, why aren’t more California women supporting politicians like Meg Whitman and Carly Fiorina? The article suggests it’s because the pressure is off:
“There are now enough women in high-ranking positions that it is harder to invoke the passions that led to firsts, like election nationwide of several women senators in 1992 or Hillary Clinton’s close second in last year’s presidential contest.”
I think there’s a simpler answer that explains why some women are more equal than others. I’ll let Victor Davis Hanson explain it in a slightly different context (H/T Eric Blair):
“What if you took everything Yale Law School Hillary has said abroad the last week [in Pakistan] and put it into the mouth of Idaho BA Sarah Palin?
The press would have gone ballistic about her ignorance of the Middle East, her sermonizing, her scapegoating, her factual errors, etc. (What is it about Palin that drives the elite, especially elite women, crazy? Great looks? That Middle-America accent? The 5 kids and he-man husband? The lack of a powerful father or spouse who could jump-start her “feminist” career with money, contacts, and influence? That Idaho BA? The wink? The charisma and, indeed, sensuality so lacking in her angry critics?)”
Of course, what does Victor Davis Hanson know? He’s just a man.
— DRJ
Victor, you hit that one clear out of the park…
sam (fa6f62) — 11/1/2009 @ 5:17 pmBut that was part of the point, for the theme of the conference might well have been: We still want to change the world. We just want to do it on our terms.
IOW, the further emasculation of the American male.
Dana (e9ba20) — 11/1/2009 @ 5:20 pmThere is a conference where men are able to change the world on their terms. It is called a gun show. Women are invited, but only if they can act sane, which means, as men.
Don Meaker (9ceac6) — 11/1/2009 @ 5:24 pmI suspect that I would not have been able to sit through more than 15 minutes of that conference.
JD (b292bd) — 11/1/2009 @ 5:26 pmI’m raising two wonderful little boys. I worry about their future, to say the absolute least.
em (11cf60) — 11/1/2009 @ 5:33 pmThe reality is that not only are women “equal” but men are on the verge of becoming the oppressed minority.
The recent recession hit men more than women and Women are outnumbering men in college education.
SPQR (26be8b) — 11/1/2009 @ 5:51 pmWas O!prah there?
JD (b292bd) — 11/1/2009 @ 5:51 pmComment by SPQR — 11/1/2009 @ 5:51 pm
On the plus side lots and lots of them are in questionable majors.
Soronel Haetir (2b4c2b) — 11/1/2009 @ 6:08 pmI’m positive that high on the list of things Ms.Shriver would change when she’s in charge will be the
AD - RtR/OS! (57758f) — 11/1/2009 @ 6:23 pm“No driving with a hand-held cell-phone” and have all of those red-curbs painted out.
The Washington think-tank that funded Ms. Shriver’s report was the Center for American Progress, which of course is headed up by none other than John Podesta. Valerie Jarrett was also in attendance at the women’s conference. I’m sure a good time was held by all victims in attendance.
jcp370 (f5203c) — 11/1/2009 @ 6:38 pmToo many female elementary and high school teachers see their contribution to the women’s movement as holding back boys, belittling their achievements, and discounting their thoughts and opinions.
The teachers want to make sure girls are nurtured and encouraged. Which in and of itself is fine, the problem is teachers can’t figure a way to do it without disparaging boys.
But the boys aren’t stupid, they see it, and they come to know and expect second class status. So they don’t go to college because it’s just more of the same short shrift. So, why bother?
Have you noticed that violence against women is up? Ever wonder if there’s a correlation?
ropelight (2f5f37) — 11/1/2009 @ 6:40 pmCenter for American Progress…
AD - RtR/OS! (57758f) — 11/1/2009 @ 6:47 pmanother George Soros funded front.
I remember the Promise Keepers meetings a few years ago that were for men and their sons. And I’ve heard a couple stories that were kinda like (and this isn’t a quote):
Wife: Honey, you go to Promise Keepers and take our son, or it’s to the couch with you.
Equality does not mean sameness, and many people on both sides of the XX/XY aisle understand this. My daughter understands this. But people like Ms Shriver do not.
John Hitchcock (3fd153) — 11/1/2009 @ 6:50 pmThe menfolk just have to work double hard to keep their sweeties in bon bons and Jimmy Choos and send them to conferences like this.
daleyrocks (718861) — 11/1/2009 @ 6:52 pmThen I would venture to guess that those would be some of those emasculated men, daley. 🙂
The speaker’s list is amusing…just a few to note: Katie Couric, Kate Gosselin (dragging her 8 children through a nasty divorce on her TV show), Elizabeth Edwards (perhaps an encouraging “How to Survive Public Humiliation” instructive talk), Eve Ensler (Vagina Monologues), and of course, Arianna herself. How funny, no Sarah Palin though…
Dana (e9ba20) — 11/1/2009 @ 7:13 pmI’ve watched the changes in medical education as women came to dominate the student body. I taught first and second year students for 10 years (not the past two) and I would also get the students who were problems. Several were repeating the first year; a couple had attitude problems. I finally figured out that I was the only one (or maybe one of a very few) who would clamp down on BS and unhelpful attitudes. One student I had for two years and he later told me I was the only reason he got through medical school. That made it worth it. I had to kick his ass for the first four months.
Anyway, the therapeutic culture is now firmly in control of medical education. One time I had to be out of town and I arranged a substitute instructor. When I came back, the entire group asked me not to do that anymore because he had spent the entire four hours psychoanalyzing them. I saw lots of instructors who would spend the entire semester having never gone to the hospital and whose students had never examined a patient. I suspect a couple got teacher of the year awards because it fits with the new culture but I may be paranoid.
There is a study showing that one-third of new cardiology fellows cannot hear systolic heart murmurs. These are graduate MDs who have chosen cardiology as a specialty. The systolic murmur is the easiest to hear.
My point is that education is changing and the dominance of women may be related; I’m not sure as cause or effect. Men can see that a lot of this is BS and tend to say “I say it’s spinach and I say the hell with it.” They just don’t keep coming. There are requirements, even at Dartmouth, for a women’s studies class for all men. Some of them have to sit there for a semester and watch lesbian instructors show slides of vaginas (Yes, at Dartmouth).
A little of that goes a long way. I have my last child in college and have grave doubts about the whole thing. She is pretty level headed although not much of a serious student. I don’t think it is worth the money and we are going to talk about it at the end of the year.
Mike K (2cf494) — 11/1/2009 @ 7:17 pmI should add that the class was on how to take a history and do a physical exam on patients. The first year was history, mostly, and the second physical. We had annual evaluations and I think they chose to have more patient contact (County Hospital) over more BS and I like to think I showed them why. The women were just as motivated for the hard stuff as the men. They wanted substance not fluff but they get a lot of fluff as a result of theory.
Mike K (2cf494) — 11/1/2009 @ 7:21 pmKate Gosselin?
Really?
Really?!
em (11cf60) — 11/1/2009 @ 7:22 pmDana – I hope you’re commenting from your kitchen computer. Heh.
daleyrocks (718861) — 11/1/2009 @ 7:24 pmI agree, Mike K. I think part of the reason is because competition is a bad thing in today’s world, especially in the schools. This contributes to why men are disadvantaged and why students don’t work as hard — students (especially men) work harder with incentives like competition because it results in peer approval and recognition for the winner. Educators seem to prefer negotiation and consensus but IMO those qualities don’t lead people to achieve as much as competition does.
DRJ (dff2ca) — 11/1/2009 @ 7:30 pm#11
100% truth
I work for a school district.
You forgot the valueless awards for competing ( merely being there) in a mandated made up “competition”
Angelo (5df281) — 11/1/2009 @ 7:32 pmI heard a radio blip about Shriver’s crying; made my opinion of her drop further. And I’m female.
CardioNP (b2c072) — 11/1/2009 @ 7:35 pmdaley, I had permission to leave the kitchen for a quick minute but only because the pumpkin pie is still in the oven…
To piggyback onto the issue of competition, what’s so ironic is that competition comes naturally to most males, starting when they are boys, and yet the move is afoot to stifle it or portray it as a negative. It’s the same thinking behind why boys are not allowed to be boys who rough house, wiggle, and have ants in their pants to get outside and use up all that energy. Instead, put them on Ritalin, or something else to control inclinations (broad brush, yes).
Dana (e9ba20) — 11/1/2009 @ 7:38 pmDRJ…you wrote:
Um. I have a great deal to say about that, but I don’t have time. Academics do NOT want negotiation and consensus, or more accurately, they want a particular world view to dominate and will do nearly anything to minimize or remove dissent.
Just my opinion, based on some tales that have happened to a wide number of academics of my acquaintance.
Eric Blair (0b61b2) — 11/1/2009 @ 7:40 pmEric,
If the focus is negotiation and consensus instead of competition, then the least judgmental view will always win. And that’s the point.
DRJ (dff2ca) — 11/1/2009 @ 7:42 pmDana – My oldest was labeled in that antsy disruptive crowd fairly early on. We didn’t know how to work the system yet so it led to multiple evaluations, special classes, ritalin, etc. He tested off the charts but teachers just wanted everybody to conform. As parents we eventually learned how to push back for him but he had really soured on school by middle school unfortunately.
He’s back in college, though, and had his first “white privilege survey” as a homework assignment last week. I was soooooo proud!
daleyrocks (718861) — 11/1/2009 @ 7:47 pm“daley, I had permission to leave the kitchen”
Dana – As long as you had permission I guess its OK.
daleyrocks (718861) — 11/1/2009 @ 7:50 pmdaley, that’s wonderful news about your son. And I certainly sympathize with the struggles.
It was similar with our younger son. It hit in high school. He was smart, well rounded but could not sit still nor focus. When the doctor suggested Wellbutrin, he told the doctor he liked himself just the way he was. And he followed that up with, How many 16 year olds do you see that like themselves? The doctor said not many at all. My son didn’t want to take meds and didn’t want to be something different than who and what he was. He was also smart enough to connect the dots: the ants-in-his-pants was precisely what contributed to him being an excellent drummer and as long as he has the healthy outlets (drumming, cycling, and rock climbing), he’s good. He has had to work to overcome the academic obstacles but that’s what life is all about anyway.
Dana (e9ba20) — 11/1/2009 @ 8:11 pmArtsy Dana, I hope, for your sanity, that his drum-set is in the (detached) garage.
John Hitchcock (3fd153) — 11/1/2009 @ 8:15 pmDana – That’s great. Mine enjoyed jousting with the doctors but was convinced the teachers were out to get him.
daleyrocks (718861) — 11/1/2009 @ 8:16 pmThat is because women work cheaper than men. Studies have shown that women make seventy-one cents for every dollar a man makes. Thus, the gender that gets hired first and fired last is…
Michael Ejercito (6a1582) — 11/1/2009 @ 8:18 pmEven if the teachers are well-meaning, they are pressured to make kids conform to a sit-still-and-learn-for-hours mentality. Typically, girls can do this better than boys so it resulted in far more boys being held back than girls — and that also contributed to boys tuning out on school.
DRJ (dff2ca) — 11/1/2009 @ 8:22 pm“That is because women work cheaper than men. Studies have shown that women make seventy-one cents for every dollar a man makes. Thus, the gender that gets hired first and fired last is…”
Please cite this statistic. I’m 59yo and as long as I have been working, a woman has made the same wage as a man in the same job…..from blue collar to white collar
Angelo (5df281) — 11/1/2009 @ 8:28 pmJust noticed….hey Patterico, your clock isn’t updated
Angelo (5df281) — 11/1/2009 @ 8:31 pmMichael Ejercito, part of the lower wages women make is due to the lesser “time-in-service” women have, on average. The TIS difference is due in part to many women taking large segments of time out of the employment cycle to raise families. Thus, they don’t have the TIS raises their male counterparts do.
John Hitchcock (3fd153) — 11/1/2009 @ 8:31 pmNevertheless, they get paid less, and as such, all other things being equal, if businesses had to choose between expensive labor and cheap labor…
Michael Ejercito (6a1582) — 11/1/2009 @ 8:33 pmThe seventy-one cent statistic was debunked long ago, Michael. Its nonsense. The differences disappear when you correct for seniority, equivalent experience and the fact that women tend to prefer lower-paying career choices.
SPQR (26be8b) — 11/1/2009 @ 8:34 pmMichael, do you refer to a job=job basis or overall earnings male vs female acroos the totality of wages earned?
Angelo (5df281) — 11/1/2009 @ 7:38 pmacross
Angelo (5df281) — 11/1/2009 @ 7:38 pmI’ll have to fix the time later tonight when there aren’t as many commenters, because it will mess up the order of the comments if I do it now.
DRJ (dff2ca) — 11/1/2009 @ 8:42 pm—The differences disappear when you correct for seniority, equivalent experience and the fact that women tend to prefer lower-paying career choices.—-
The diferences are further explainable when you control for number of hours worked per week. And ever further explained by women taking off time for raising children.
But hey – thanks for playing Mikey boy!!!!
red (7b5f67) — 11/1/2009 @ 8:45 pmOn topic, it’s gotta be a phase of the moon thing, with all these women being women, because I’ve also been feeling unwelcome in my house today.
nk (df76d4) — 11/1/2009 @ 8:48 pmSo Mike….will you agree with Red or will you answer my question?
Angelo (5df281) — 11/1/2009 @ 8:51 pmI don’t think roses will do it. I think I need to buy her some pearls.
Angelo, you’re gay, right?
nk (df76d4) — 11/1/2009 @ 9:01 pmAngelo, you’re gay, right?
Comment by nk — 11/1/2009 @ 9:01 pm
Hardly. Halloween is a big thing with the wife and my daughters are home from college because of it. I’m trapped in a house with frisky women and I’m just tired
Angelo (5df281) — 11/1/2009 @ 9:05 pmMichael Ejercito – If you sincerely believe that gender difference is there and hasn’t been sued away in the workplace, why don’t you suggest wage controls, sort of like the price controls you like so much, on mens salaries to even things out?
daleyrocks (718861) — 11/1/2009 @ 9:09 pmnk, piffle on the roses and pearls…too easy… woo her instead. Nothing like those whispered declarations to turn a girl’s mood around.
Dana (e9ba20) — 11/1/2009 @ 9:10 pmDRJ wrote:
By “California recently hosted,” does that mean “California recently paid for?”
John Hitchcock has a story on his blog (and on mine 😉 ) noting how Californians are going to be subjected to 10% higher state income tax withholding, as the Pyrite State takes an interest free loan from the taxpayers. If California is having to resor to such things, would the state have any business at all in paying a single penny for such a conference?
The blogger Dana (474dfc) — 11/1/2009 @ 9:13 pmPlease accept my apology, Angelo.
(Good-looking) Dana, I’ve been with this lady for nineteen years and, to hear her say, I have never done one thing right yet.
nk (df76d4) — 11/1/2009 @ 9:15 pmOur Windy City barrister wrote:
Try three girls, 21, 18 and 17, all in the house, all day long. 🙁
The outnumbered Dana (474dfc) — 11/1/2009 @ 9:16 pmBlogger Dana,
Your last comments prove how out-of-touch you are with Women’s Conference values.
DRJ (dff2ca) — 11/1/2009 @ 9:17 pmNK, accepted :)…..please note you said 19 yrs….she obviously likes you hence 19 yrs
Angelo (5df281) — 11/1/2009 @ 9:19 pmI don’t mean to be difficult here, DRJ, but I was struck by this comment of yours:
Um. “The least judgmental view.” So there is a great deal of support, for example, for acceptance of religious students and their activities on campus? Or funding for conservative speakers? Or a willingness to include “right of center” controversy in the classroom, as opposed to “left of center” controversy (say, a discussion on Gitmo human rights versus the treatment of women in Islamic societies)?
Perhaps we are speaking at cross purposes. If you replace “negotiation and consensus” with “conformity,” we will be in complete agreement.
Eric Blair (dd11cc) — 11/1/2009 @ 9:19 pmThis is likely true, Dana.
JD (be8dcd) — 11/1/2009 @ 9:19 pmDana… a 56yr old and two 19 year olds…..”Daddy, Daddy! for 3 effing days!
Angelo (5df281) — 11/1/2009 @ 9:21 pmDemocrats will have to run a female for president. All the democrat men have lost their balls or have them in each others hands. The women have all the balls in the democrat party and you only have to look at 99% of them to see who has to shave twice a day.
Scrapiron (4e0dda) — 11/1/2009 @ 9:22 pmThe much better looking Dana wrote:
It seems to me that girls are just as competitive, but in different ways. In my admittedly narrow view, boys seem to be competitive to be better at whatever than the next guy, while girls are too often competitive to put down other girls.
The Dana who notices these things (474dfc) — 11/1/2009 @ 9:22 pmBlogger Dana,
I read somewhere that the Women’s Conference is actually a non-prof group and the conference is underwritten by a slew of businesses (Lean Cuisine, Target, Wells Fargo, etc) and corporate sponsors. I can’t remember where I read that but there you go.
Dana (e9ba20) — 11/1/2009 @ 9:24 pmEric,
You’re defining non-judgmental as a process but liberals define it by its result.
DRJ (dff2ca) — 11/1/2009 @ 9:24 pmDana,
Girls are sugar and spice and everything nice, except when they’re mean-spirited little pills.
DRJ (dff2ca) — 11/1/2009 @ 9:28 pmI won’t argue you with any more, ma’am. You certainly have your right to an opinion.
But calling any campus (from elementary school on up) in this nation “non-judgmental” is a remarkable statement indeed. Ditto the “negotiation” proposition. The comment that made me raise my eyebrows until they hit the back of my shirt collar was: “…then the least judgmental view will always win…”
Um. Not so much.
I know this from experience, and you have seen evidence of the non-judgmentalism of academics on this website.
Eric Blair (dd11cc) — 11/1/2009 @ 9:31 pmplease note you said 19 yrs….she obviously likes you hence 19 yrs
Comment by Angelo — 11/1/2009 @ 9:19 pm
I dunno. She can throw me out of the house but she knows I get to take half of everything with me. And that are two divorcees just down the street. And in my next life, I’m going to be gay.
nk (df76d4) — 11/1/2009 @ 9:31 pmAngelo wrote:
Well, let’s see: PFC Pico came home for the weekend, so that’s the 21 year old. The younger Miss Pico 18 was there, and the “spare” daughter (17) was here all weekend.
Mrs Pico had to work Saturday, all day, where I got home at 1500. There was a chorus of three girls, Daa-ad! You should take us to the bookstore.
“And why should I do this?” I asked.
“Because you’re glad that your girls like to read instead of getting into all kinds of trouble.”
This was logic with which I couldn’t argue, so it was get the truck and head for Barnes & Noble.
“Daa-ad! It’s raining outside, so you should go get the truck and drive it around front and pick us up so we won’t melt.” I caved.
These girls are texting each other, all in the truck at the same time, like they don’t know how to actually talk. Then I was regaled with stories about geeky boys in high school, watching two of them attached to the third’s iPod to listen to some stupid song.
I swear, their mother wasn’t like this when she was 19.
The proud (?) daddy Dana (474dfc) — 11/1/2009 @ 9:33 pmnk wrote:
Do I really need to tell you what that great American philosopher, Sam Kinneson, said about that?
The amused Dana (474dfc) — 11/1/2009 @ 9:35 pmI spent 4 hours on Saturday at the spa with Better Half and my 2 little angels. I never knew what went on while getting your hair done, nails, etc … My life was fine without knowing.
JD (dda36c) — 11/1/2009 @ 9:39 pmI’m proud to report my daughter turned out far more independent and far less afraid of a little water. 😛 Of course, she has that male-ness of being highly competitive (PT stud, SOM, SOQ, all-conference in cross country as a 13-year-old HS student) so she doesn’t count as a girl, right?
John Hitchcock (3fd153) — 11/1/2009 @ 9:39 pmnk – You obviously married well. It’s too bad I can’t say the same for your wife.
daleyrocks (718861) — 11/1/2009 @ 9:40 pmYou dads out there bemoaning your chattering daughters making Dad a two syllable word (Daa-ad!), might one day miss that. My husband certainly does. Because one day they graduate college and fall in love and marry and turn all that girlish silliness toward their husbands (as they should), and it’s an adjustment and it leaves a small ache in the heart where memories are solidly housed but the day to day experience isn’t there any longer. But when she calls and comes home, Daa-ad thrills to the sound of her voice and delights in all the chattering.
Dana (e9ba20) — 11/1/2009 @ 9:42 pmI first knew I liked girls when I was five. And then I got hit by a thunderbolt when I was thirty-four.
nk (df76d4) — 11/1/2009 @ 9:42 pmOh, they’re not afraid of water, at least not to judge by how long they can tie up the shower. But getting rained on, as in messing up their hair?
The befuddled Dana (474dfc) — 11/1/2009 @ 9:43 pm#63
Angelo (5df281) — 11/1/2009 @ 9:44 pmYes! The texting! The constantly busy fingers. One daughter is glued to her HS boy friend who actually kicked into gear to follow her to her univ ( really good kid, BTW)…he is here and they text while they are inches apart!
I just saw my daughter last weekend as she was in town on a 14-day leave. She bought me dinner as my Mom, sister, nephew went along and ate dinner at a nearby restaurant. That day, I spent 8 hours in her company, the first 8 hours since roughly this time last year. It was nice while it lasted.
John Hitchcock (3fd153) — 11/1/2009 @ 9:46 pmThe befuddled Dana — 11/1/2009 @ 9:43 pm
Even the most perfect outfit becomes irrelevant if the hair isn’t just right.
Dana (e9ba20) — 11/1/2009 @ 9:46 pmWell …
If this going to be about daughters, and not wives …
I have to go sleep, anyway. Good night, all.
nk (df76d4) — 11/1/2009 @ 9:52 pmDana – a reasonably gifted amateur, I’ll admit … I have 4 daughters (with #4 we found out what was causing it) … I am the only unfixed male in the house … can you say “household of raging progesterone ?
Things are quieter now – daughters are ages 27, 25, 22, and 17 … yup still enjoying a 12th grader … (anyone got any pull at Stanford?) … So far, we have graduates from Columbia, Northeastern, and UVA (Charlottesville) …
On a different note, back last century, the Clerical Workers’ Union back in Scotland (very majority female) go worked up because the comparatively few male clerical workers seemingly got paid more than the female ones … so the Union leaders agitated and agitated until the ‘problem’ was studied – all in the name of gender equality and pay equality …
The result ? The study found that, when you take pay and benefits combined (things like so many weeks guaranteed paid maternity leave and so on), the women were overpaid by comparison with the men … since it’s sorta hard to cut pay for clerical workers, the men got a raise to bring them up to parity with the women … need I say that the Union leaders were NOT happy campers ?
Alasdair (205079) — 11/1/2009 @ 9:54 pmDiscuss away, Eric. I like a good discussion and you make valid points and have first-hand experience to back them up.
FWIW I think we agree overall but differ in how we define the terms judgmental and non-judgmental. My guess is you view non-judgmental as the opposite of the lifestyle and thought conformity you see at college. On the other hand, I think liberals and conservatives should be judgmental and persistent about their ideas. The problem conservatives have with today’s college comes from our willingness to let liberals take over education and define its goals. We defaulted to the liberal view that consensus and negotiation are higher values than the vigorous competition of ideas, and now we’re paying the price for that default.
DRJ (dff2ca) — 11/1/2009 @ 9:55 pmThere’s a lot more feminine knowledge here than I realized if you count all the fathers of girls.
Goodnight, nk. We can talk about wives tomorrow if you still feel like it.
DRJ (dff2ca) — 11/1/2009 @ 9:59 pmAlasdair,
That’s funny about the Scottish clerical workers. Of course maternity leave is still relatively new but obviously it pays to do one’s homework before making one’s complaint public.
Btw, Wiki says the UK gets a very generous maternity leave. Wow.
Currently 39 weeks paid, rising to 52 weeks paid from April 2010 (6 weeks at 90% of full pay and remainder at a flat rate (as of 2009 = £123.06) or 90% of your salary if that is less than the flat rate)
Dana (e9ba20) — 11/1/2009 @ 10:15 pmDana – the study I was talking about was actually back in the 1970s as I recall … and, yes, UK maternity leave is not stingy …
Alasdair (205079) — 11/1/2009 @ 10:17 pmMy three daughters are all different but they never change with regard to Dad. I really can’t imagine them at Women’s nation. The oldest carries a gun in her purse but I’m not supposed to say why. The second is back in grad school and scared me this weekend because she was really sick for a couple of days. The third is still in college and our communications are limited to occasions when her bank account is having trouble.
I can’t visualize any of them wimping out like Maria.
Mike K (2cf494) — 11/1/2009 @ 10:19 pmWay, way back in the day, my maternal grandmother rode in a wagon from Central Texas to East Texas with her new husband.
Her husband had lost two brothers to influenza. She had lost the same.
My grandfather was a log-hauler and school bus driver. He worked hard, every day.
So did my grandmother. She worked hard, day in and day out, to provide a home and a family life to her children. Her first-born, a girl, died shortly after birth, at home.
But she went on and birthed three more children, the last was my mother, whom she named after her first.
Every single day of my grandmother’s life, as a young woman, was a struggle.
She made sure her children went to school. She plowed and she sowed to provide food. She sewed feed sacks to make clothes. She drilled wells for water and dug ditches for toilets. She worked and worked and worked and gave up her youth so that her children would have the opportunity to find something better.
She made black-eyed peas and cornbread for her children and grandchildren.
She wept when her husband died after more than 40 years of marriage.
And she never complained.
She was born in 1897. She died in 1982.
I don’t doubt that tears were shed for the tribulations of Maria Shriver Schwarzenegger’s family. Justifiably so.
Women today work hard for their families. They sacrifice to make things better. Maybe they want to change the world. Good for them. I applaud the ones at this conference for the strength they derived from Shriver’s experience.
But, Linnie Louise Cobb Droddy didn’t want to change the world. She only wanted to change the part that she could.
So, I applaud her.
Ag80 (c46598) — 11/1/2009 @ 10:29 pmGenerally, management likes “Productive labor”. I have been handed a layoff/move notice, then been flown back to the old workplace by the company to train the new youngling, while working two or three other projects at the same time. The youngling is smart, smarter than I am, but not so well read just yet. The move permits management to justify my pay by working me on multiple projects.
Don Meaker (9ceac6) — 11/1/2009 @ 10:32 pmI went to it a couple of years ago, and it was like one big Oprahfied victim fest. Plus, the “ladies” were unruly and were a little scary, stampeding to get into the coolest victim sessions.
Never again.
Patricia (b05e7f) — 11/1/2009 @ 11:31 pmOk, it’s the morning after and I’m still in the doghouse. Why, I don’t know.
(Good looking) Dana, I don’t think the pearls will be enough, either. I’m sending her to Bali. (The last time was Japan.) Maybe after a week with short, dark people, she will appreciate me more.
nk (df76d4) — 11/2/2009 @ 5:48 am“…or Hillary Clinton’s close second in last year’s presidential contest.”
Um, no. I believe you can credit Hillary for second in a presidential PRIMARY. But clearly, John McCain was second in “last year’s presidential contest.”
Mike S (d3f5fd) — 11/2/2009 @ 7:03 amHe’s just a man.
I think you mean “He’s just a genetically-incomplete woman.”
Hater.
mojo (8096f2) — 11/2/2009 @ 8:43 amEveryone’s first mistake, and it is a huge one, these are NOT women, they are females of a hominid species. I know the difference. I marched and stood up for Women’s rights only to watch as the females took over: you know, the Queen Bee types. The types with $$$$ who had Dad, Uncle, Husband to fund their “success”. I sincerely apololgize to the majority of real women, like Sarah, that did it on their own!!
Sue (68bdd6) — 11/2/2009 @ 9:48 amA recent contretemps at my church involved emotional manipulation. It was politics, on the micro scale. The pastor involved was male, and the most responsive people in the congregation were male.
The capacity to be manipulated by emotion is human, though men and women may respond to different cues. I’d guess a capacity for critical thinking reduces the impact; at times I find myself responding to some idiot emotional appeal, think it through, then blow it off.
The conference sounds like torture. I’m a sucker for animal stories, though, they get me every time.
jodetoad (059c35) — 11/2/2009 @ 10:35 amI attended a conference for “Women in Technology” that sounds like the same kind of Victimfest. It was around 1989 or so and it was the most excruciating 2 days of my life. We all worked for the phone company, and we were all technicians and managers on the telecom side. I was the only female tech on my crew, but our foreman was a woman so she and I went together.
I had never been so embarrassed for my gender in my life. The whiny victim mentality was only surpassed by the stupid touchy feely pseudo claptrap you get at every company sponsored “diversity” seminar you’re forced to endure. The fact that it was all women just made it worse for me because I had no one who thought it was a stupid as I did. My boss ate it up. I just sat there and pretty much glared at everyone. I refused to participate in any of the stupid exercises.
I would rather work for and with men any day.
Jaynie59 (18e5d1) — 11/2/2009 @ 10:41 amnk wrote:
Did you ever consider asking why?
Oh, wait, I’m sorry: you wouldn’t get a useful answer anyway.
The Dana who has been married for 30 years, 5 months and 14 days (3e4784) — 11/2/2009 @ 2:09 pmWhat kind of glove do you use to catch a thrown Jimmy Choo?
AD - RtR/OS! (83414c) — 11/2/2009 @ 2:10 pmThe obviously knowing mother Dana wrote:
Most perfect outfit? It’s like a uniform with these girls: jeans, a t-shirt — almost always black — and clunky tennis shoes without the laces being tied.
The clearly clueless father Dana (3e4784) — 11/2/2009 @ 2:14 pmAD – RtR/OS! asked:
Since it’s probably been aimed at your head, I don’t think you’re intended to catch it. Man up, and take your lumps!
The Cincinnati Reds fan Dana (3e4784) — 11/2/2009 @ 2:18 pmDucks…as he reaches for that hockey helmet with full visor.
AD - RtR/OS! (83414c) — 11/2/2009 @ 2:34 pm