President Donald J. Trump Encourages Supporters to Commit Felony Voter Fraud
When all you have is a hammer, every problem looks like a nail. When you’re a criminal, every problem looks like something that could be solved by committing a crime:
President Donald Trump suggested that people in North Carolina should vote twice in the November election, once by mail and once in person, escalating his attempts to cast confusion and doubt on the validity of the results.
“So let them send it in and let them go vote, and if their system’s as good as they say it is, then obviously they won’t be able to vote. If it isn’t tabulated, they’ll be able to vote,” Trump said when asked whether he has confidence in the mail-in system in North Carolina, a battleground state.
“If it’s as good as they say it is, then obviously they won’t be able to vote. If it isn’t tabulated, they’ll be able to vote. So that’s the way it is. And that’s what they should do,” he said.
It is illegal to vote more than once in an election.
It’s not just illegal. It is a felony.
People still drink bleach at higher numbers than in the past after Trump suggested that injecting disinfectant could fight COVID-19, and some undetermined number of people will follow Trump’s advice and vote twice, subjecting themselves to felony prosecution and possibly throwing the counting of votes into turmoil in a battleground state.
There are two ways to change government: through peaceful elections that the nation can trust, and through violence. Trump is doing his level best to make the former impossible, and he doesn’t seem to care about where that might lead.
But hey when doesn’t a president tell people to do a felony amiritePatterico (115b1f) — 9/2/2020 @ 6:08 pm
Mr. Trump has consistently been claiming that the election will be rigged. All he’s doing is trying to prove it.John B Boddie (bfc42b) — 9/2/2020 @ 6:08 pm
Trump is the most grotesquely unfit person ever to inhabit the White House. Everything else is commentary.lurker (d8c5bc) — 9/2/2020 @ 6:10 pm
Let him prove it by him voting twice, or 10 or 20 times. Don’t ask his supporters to take the risk if he won’t take it first.
Of course, he could pardon himself but let’s see if the GOP endorses that.DRJ (aede82) — 9/2/2020 @ 6:30 pm
And his cultists will now defend him for suborning voter fraud.Dave (1bb933) — 9/2/2020 @ 6:37 pm
At this point in time, I think I would actually be surprised if he *didn’t* tell people to break the law to help him win the election. It’s awful to think there will be some who see him as the great last white hope and follow his directive. They really believe he cares about them. They don’t seem to be able to grasp that only a self-consumed conman would ask people to break the law on his behalf.Dana (292df6) — 9/2/2020 @ 6:42 pm
All that’s demonstrated here is the umpteenth example of media bias:
President Donald Trump suggested that people in North Carolina should vote twice in the November election, once by mail and once in person, escalating his attempts to cast confusion and doubt on the validity of the results.
No, he didn’t. Source? The same NBC report:
“President Trump encourages supporters to vote absentee-by-mail early, and then show up in person at the polls or the local registrar to verify that their vote has already been counted,” Trump campaign official Tim Murtaugh said. “It’s amazing that the media can go from insisting that voter fraud doesn’t exist to screaming about it when President Trump points out the giant holes in the Democrats’ voting schemes.”
The same “real conservatives” who fought motor voter and for voter ID laws now cheer for near universal mail in ballots.
If Trump wins, let’s see who will cast “confusion and doubt” on the results. The example was set four years ago by the Dems, the media and their new “conservative” allies. If Trump loses, he should let that example guide him.beer ‘n pretzels (4bef1a) — 9/2/2020 @ 6:48 pm
Reading comprehension is not very clear is ot, nor is understanding of ballotinh procedures.Bolivar di griz (7404b5) — 9/2/2020 @ 6:51 pm
It is illegal to vote more than once in an election.
It’s also illegal to not tabulate a person’s vote. I’m guessing it’s a felony, too.beer ‘n pretzels (4bef1a) — 9/2/2020 @ 6:52 pm
No, he didn’t. Source? The same NBC report:
“President Trump encourages supporters to vote absentee-by-mail early, and then show up in person at the polls or the local registrar to verify that their vote has already been counted,” Trump campaign official Tim Murtaugh said.
Oh! Okay, then! Mr. Trump dindunuffin! It’s not a mugging, it’s a drug deal gone bad. He borrowed the wallet by accident.nk (1d9030) — 9/2/2020 @ 6:55 pm
This is interesting from William Barr:
No comment from the Attorney General of the United States on the President of the United States suggesting voters break the law on his behalf? Sadly, it sounds about right.Dana (292df6) — 9/2/2020 @ 6:56 pm
Um, beer ‘n’ pretzels, the fact that some dishonest flack uncharacterized what Trump said doesn’t change the fact that Trump said it.
He is saying people should vote, and go to the polling place and try to vote again, and if they have not yet taken the voter’s name off the rolls, he wants them to vote again.
That’s what he said, and no amount of characterization by a talking head can change it.Patterico (115b1f) — 9/2/2020 @ 6:58 pm
Writing comprehension is not very clear is ot?Patterico (115b1f) — 9/2/2020 @ 6:58 pm
If I remember enough of what most people said about what Trump would do, if he were elected President, then maybe I can now say to both his supporters and his detractors: Trump has exceeded you expectations, hasn’t he?felipe (023cc9) — 9/2/2020 @ 7:02 pm
If it isn’t tabulated, they’ll be able to vote,” Trump said
Exactly. If it isn’t tabulated, why is that? I suppose we should trust our vote was counted nonetheless, or will be counted eventually. Sorry, no. No way.beer ‘n pretzels (4bef1a) — 9/2/2020 @ 7:03 pm
Patterico’s conclusion is right. If we keep destablizing this country’s democracy, we will have more violence on the streets and be a weaker people. That’s probably at the very top of Russia’s motivations in supporting Trump.
We are at a crucial point in American history. Our founders would have recognized Trump for what he is, and recognized no piece of paper they write could do much about it. We are getting the government we deserve, one way or the other.
If Trump’s talking about cancelling elections, asking his fans to cheat, he’s not going to accept a loss. We should all consider what that means, stock up on food and first aid and maybe other things. Look to what’s happened in other countries whose democracies Russia was able to destroy, how they made it or didn’t.
Perhaps put this guy back up for impeachment 2. Obviously telling people to vote twice is a high crime. Give Lindsey Graham and Ted Cruz more opportunities to tell us who they really are.Dustin (5418f4) — 9/2/2020 @ 7:04 pm
If a ballot hasnt been counted on election day, you admit theres a problem.Bolivar di griz (7404b5) — 9/2/2020 @ 7:09 pm
@15 The instructional part of the directions is, “So let them send it in and let them go vote.” Everything else is flavor text. He is instructing them to commit a crime. “Oh, but they were just testing the system” isn’t an excuse. If I go to rob a jewelry store and get caught, telling the cops I was just testing the security system isn’t going to cut it.Nic (896fdf) — 9/2/2020 @ 7:10 pm
First daughter-in-law Lara Trump was sent out today to campaign for Laura Effing Loomer. So, loyal Trumpist Republicans, your GOP is now proudly the party of QAnon. If the Deep State hasn’t stolen all your mirrors, look into one. That’s who you are now. How’s that feel?lurker (d8c5bc) — 9/2/2020 @ 7:13 pm
@17 No. States have a deadline for counting ballots and it isn’t election day. In Texas, for example, the last day to count ballots in specific circumstances is November 16th.Nic (896fdf) — 9/2/2020 @ 7:17 pm
No its the party of we want to defend ourselves against these well funded terrorists, organized and trained by a terrorist, its not about police reform or any of that garbage, they want to erase america aa weve known wipe out the washington monument by hook or by crookBolivar di griz (7404b5) — 9/2/2020 @ 7:17 pm
3.Trump is the most grotesquely unfit person ever to inhabit the White House.
You must be young.
Listen to the Nixon tapes.
All of them.
Then listen to LBJ’s tapes.
All of them.DCSCA (797bc0) — 9/2/2020 @ 7:19 pm
Exactly, the Republican party, Donald Trump, and the white supremacists supporting them, plus their Russian handlers and funders.Colonel Klink (Ret) (305827) — 9/2/2020 @ 7:20 pm
Ballots are counted after the polls close. That’s one.
Now, here’s two. About three days after I dropped my first-class postage-prepaid ballot in the mailbox, I got an email from the Chicago Board of Elections: “Your ballot has been received and will be counted.”
But criminal-mindedness and ignorance go hand in hand, and Trump’s and his supporters’ more than most.nk (1d9030) — 9/2/2020 @ 7:21 pm
@21 You realized that it is a central tenet of democracy that people you disagree with will sometimes win and that that is, in fact, the point of democracy, right?Nic (896fdf) — 9/2/2020 @ 7:21 pm
The Lyndon Johnson tapes: Richard Nixon’s ‘treason’ – BBC News
By the time of the election in November 1968, LBJ had evidence Nixon had sabotaged the Vietnam war peace talks – or, as he put it, that Nixon was guilty of treason and had “blood on his hands”.DCSCA (797bc0) — 9/2/2020 @ 7:22 pm
There were 1900 bombings in the first four years of the nixon administration, i would find it hard to keep a civil tongeue under those circumstances.Bolivar di griz (7404b5) — 9/2/2020 @ 7:22 pm
Nixon and LBJ were bad, but they did not stand before the nation and tell fans to vote twice if they can, nor did they say maybe the election should be cancelled.
We’re are a turning point. Trump’s gotta go. It will be hard to deal with the biden admin sometimes, but Trump has gotta go.Dustin (5418f4) — 9/2/2020 @ 7:23 pm
@27. Not counting Hanoi. 😉DCSCA (797bc0) — 9/2/2020 @ 7:24 pm
Now the blackfish project funded by bloomberg has its stated goal to delegitimize the election by using voter fraud
I wouldnt be surprised these terrorist would attack polling places in red states like they have in south america and the middle east.Bolivar di griz (7404b5) — 9/2/2020 @ 7:27 pm
WTF? Nixon? LBJ? Helloooo! It’s September 2, 2020! Never mind Trump and Biden. Could you guys pass a cognitive test? The first question they ask is “What is today’s date?”nk (1d9030) — 9/2/2020 @ 7:27 pm
@28. Listen to the tapes. All of them.
‘Treason’ alone make The Big Dick a pretty big dick. They weren’t serving Big Macs on Hamburger Hill, either.DCSCA (797bc0) — 9/2/2020 @ 7:28 pm
@31. Reaganclocktics, nk: there’s no expiration date on referencing “the most grotesquely unfit person ever to inhabit the White House” as mentioned up thread, nk.DCSCA (797bc0) — 9/2/2020 @ 7:33 pm
The president, today, not 50 years ago, but right now, the president of my family and my country, wants people to vote twice for him if they can, will cancel the election and cheat any other way he can. And he’s gotta go.
Richard Nixon was a bad president up to the point where he resigned before impeachment knocked him out of office. That he was not completely above the law distinguishes him from Trump, who is above the law if he is in office. History is good to learn from, it is not good if it’s endless fodder for ‘Trump’s not that bad, because LBJ leaned aggressively and Biden was a plagiarist’. Learn from history. What happens if a powerful criminal keeps office against the consent of the governed?Dustin (5418f4) — 9/2/2020 @ 7:35 pm
DCSCA – Cheersmg (8cbc69) — 9/2/2020 @ 7:36 pm
These people don’t realize what’s going on.
They need a shampoo and a blowmg (8cbc69) — 9/2/2020 @ 7:36 pm
drymg (8cbc69) — 9/2/2020 @ 7:37 pm
And that was a bogus exercise, payback for yncovering their golden boy hiss, they nwvwr forgave him for that. He didnt become rich in office like lbj, was he wrong on economic policy, was embracing mao criminally atupid probablyBolivar di griz (7404b5) — 9/2/2020 @ 7:38 pm
Please no saben donde estan parado, they dont even know where they are standing. Amd the media is largely responsible. The schools have been derelict in transmitting values and traditions, and you see the scorched results on major cities.Bolivar di griz (7404b5) — 9/2/2020 @ 7:41 pm
If kennedy hadnt stolen the election in 60, much of the stupid policy decisions of the next decade wouldnt have happened.Bolivar di griz (7404b5) — 9/2/2020 @ 7:42 pm
I agree with Narciso that a president enriching himself with his office has gotta go. We do not have to go back 50 years to find a good example.Dustin (5418f4) — 9/2/2020 @ 7:43 pm
I’m on the undergraduate curriculum committee for my department, and we had a meeting this week on the approaching start of classes (we don’t begin until October 1). The election falls during week 5 of our 10-week quarter, right at the usual time of midterm exams. We are encouraging faculty to plan ahead for the possibility of election, pandemic and/or anti-racism related disturbances interrupting or even prematurely ending the quarter. For instance, there should be frequent low-stakes evaluations rather than basing most of the grade on high-stakes midterm and final exams that might have to be cancelled.
Overall, the mood was one of impending doom…Dave (1bb933) — 9/2/2020 @ 7:44 pm
nk- “grotesque and unfit”—
“The Amos ‘n’ Andy radio show (WGN, Chicago); [Reagan hero] President Calvin Coolidge was said to be among the show’s most devoted listeners.” – source, wikiPhilcobeehive
WGN then ain’t WBLM today.DCSCA (797bc0) — 9/2/2020 @ 7:45 pm
40.If kennedy hadnt stolen the election in 60, much of the stupid policy decisions of the next decade wouldnt have happened.
If Marina had rolled over all of the stupid policy decisions of the next decade wouldn’t have happened.DCSCA (797bc0) — 9/2/2020 @ 7:46 pm
In America, that’s the job of the family and the community, not the government.Dave (1bb933) — 9/2/2020 @ 7:46 pm
Nope. Ballots will not necessarily have been counted by election day. So you could walk into a polling place, not have your ballot counted yet, and following Trump’s advice you will vote again and thereby commit a crime.
Naturally people here will defend literally anything. It’s what Trumpers do. It’s what causes me to despair for this country.Patterico (115b1f) — 9/2/2020 @ 7:47 pm
Well postponing election is what chinas puppet jacinta arden is doing, her policies worked so well, an expanded mail vote will extend the election by weeks if not a monthBolivar di griz (7404b5) — 9/2/2020 @ 7:47 pm
Bringing up LBJ and Nixon is ridiculous. How about dealing with the here and now, and admitting that Trump is wholly corrupt and once again has evidenced just how corrupt. It’s not that hard given the evidence. It’s only hard if you have placed you faith in him.Dana (292df6) — 9/2/2020 @ 7:49 pm
That is really interesting to think about. I agree the end of the semester this year is probably going to be a period of craziness. Could be pretty bad. If Biden overcomes the margin of fraud, Trump will be the most dangerous lame duck.Dustin (5418f4) — 9/2/2020 @ 7:51 pm
gotta love the hate- vote huh/2020mg (8cbc69) — 9/2/2020 @ 7:52 pm
I for one do not understand why you’re wasting your time with this fake scandal when William Marbury still doesn’t have his judicial commission thanks to those D-RINOs.Dustin (5418f4) — 9/2/2020 @ 7:55 pm
@40 Kennedy won 303 to 219 electoral votes. He didn’t steal the election even if you believe the Illinois theory because Kennedy still would’ve won without Illinois.
@41 I think we could probably look back to whenever the last time Trump stayed at Mara Lago and charged the US government a bazillion dollars for rooms for the secret service.
@45 This.Nic (896fdf) — 9/2/2020 @ 7:58 pm
You wanted the democrats in power, having seen what they have done so far, you want more of it, the marquis de sade would be puzzled.Bolivar di griz (7404b5) — 9/2/2020 @ 7:58 pm
“What you’re seeing and what you’re reading is not what’s happening.”
– Donald J. Trump, 2018
“The party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command.”
– George Orwell, 1984
#MakeOrwellFictionAgainDave (1bb933) — 9/2/2020 @ 7:59 pm
@53 I’ve seen Trump in power and 186,000 people died, there was rioting in the streets, and more people in his administration were indicted for a crime than any other modern presidential administration. His picture should be in the dictionary next to the definition for “Charlie Foxtrot.”Nic (896fdf) — 9/2/2020 @ 8:03 pm
FUBAR too.nk (1d9030) — 9/2/2020 @ 8:05 pm
Oh the russian and chinese spies getting away with murder doesnt concern you.Bolivar di griz (7404b5) — 9/2/2020 @ 8:07 pm
@45. In America, that’s the job of the family and the community, not the government.
In 2014, Ferris Bueller’s Day Off was selected for preservation in the National Film Registry by the Library of Congress, being deemed “culturally, historically, or aesthetically significant.” -source, wikiBuellerBuellerBueller
“Oh, he’s very popular… The sportos, the motorheads, geeks, sluts, bloods, wastoids, dweebies, dickheads – they all adore him. They think he’s a righteous dude.” – Grace [Edie McClurg] ‘Ferris Bueller’s Day Off’ 1986DCSCA (797bc0) — 9/2/2020 @ 8:07 pm
The burning of any city at random, that doesnt affect you either.Bolivar di griz (7404b5) — 9/2/2020 @ 8:08 pm
Ah ferris bueller such an innocent time, its also a great showcase for chicagoBolivar di griz (7404b5) — 9/2/2020 @ 8:10 pm
The fugitive probably less so, batman beginwas probably too close to the vest
https://mobile.twitter.com/davidharsanyi/status/1301349679100293122Bolivar di griz (7404b5) — 9/2/2020 @ 8:12 pm
Oh the russian and chinese spies getting away with murder doesnt concern you.
The Russian and Chinese spies, right now, are in the White House, they have murdered 186,000 Americans to date, and it concerns me very much.nk (1d9030) — 9/2/2020 @ 8:15 pm
Oh, well …. Good post, Patterico. I’m sorry it went to the squirrels.nk (1d9030) — 9/2/2020 @ 8:16 pm
48.Bringing up LBJ and Nixon is ridiculous.
No. It’s not- particularly when referring to a posted comment condemning Trump as “the most grotesquely unfit person ever to inhabit the White House.”
Don’t miss the Friday night body count tallies from Vietnam by Walter Cronkite; nor pretty much every major city across America in flames; or shooting students at Kent State; or a war in my living room every night; or assassinated leaders every few months.
Don’t miss ‘The Brady Bunch’ either.DCSCA (797bc0) — 9/2/2020 @ 8:18 pm
Trump is telling us to vote twice. No president has ever stood before America and told us to cheat at the election.Dustin (5418f4) — 9/2/2020 @ 8:20 pm
I’ve seen Trump in power and 186,000 people died.
He didn’t kill them. If he told you a cure for Covid-19 was to jump off a bridge, would you do it? There’s a certain serenity and comfort in knowing you – as a citizen- are smarter than the Captain on the bridge; that you didn’t eat the strawberries… and there is no key to the food locker.DCSCA (797bc0) — 9/2/2020 @ 8:24 pm
@59 etc Who is the President currently? Do you know who the President currently is? There is a President, currently, do you know who it is? What is the name and party affiliation of the current President? Can you name the current President?Nic (896fdf) — 9/2/2020 @ 8:24 pm
@35.LOL yep, mg.
Back at you.DCSCA (797bc0) — 9/2/2020 @ 8:26 pm
@66 There is no comfort in knowing that I am smarter than the Captain on the bridge. The Captain on the bridge is the one controlling the boat while I work in the learning by correspondence office.Nic (896fdf) — 9/2/2020 @ 8:27 pm
Yes that feltercarb (does that get oast the filter) the only administration thats actually confronted putin in deed, not ridiculous words is this one. From the javelins to the dead russian mercs etc,Bolivar di griz (7404b5) — 9/2/2020 @ 8:29 pm
You were expecting KFC on Hill 937 instead?DCSCA (797bc0) — 9/2/2020 @ 8:30 pm
All this whining about some bedraggled soy boy brat gets pinched, the flatlinr was a stupid move it killed the economy and didnt do much to slow the spread but you want more that.Bolivar di griz (7404b5) — 9/2/2020 @ 8:35 pm
@70 Only if you call “Hey did you do this thing? Oh? No? Well OK then, lets be bed-buddies.” confrontation.Nic (896fdf) — 9/2/2020 @ 8:35 pm
The Captain on the bridge is the one controlling the boat while I work in the learning by correspondence office.
No. The crew runs- o controls- the boat [or ship of state of you like.] It’s easy to ignore the Captain when he goes into a ‘bomb-the-Brookings-Institution-rage’- until you don’t; see Watergate for details.DCSCA (797bc0) — 9/2/2020 @ 8:36 pm
Expectation and awareness aren’t the same thing.Dustin (5418f4) — 9/2/2020 @ 8:36 pm
@74 the instances of the crew removing a crazy captain are far far rarer than the instances of having a crazy captain and following orders.Nic (896fdf) — 9/2/2020 @ 8:38 pm
The captain sends his son-in-law to tell you that you can’t turn a battleship around overnight. And 16 million  swallow it whole.nk (1d9030) — 9/2/2020 @ 8:41 pm
60.Ah ferris bueller such an innocent time, its also a great showcase for chicago
And a yuuuuge business boost for Abe Froman, the sausage king of Chicago, too. 😉DCSCA (797bc0) — 9/2/2020 @ 8:41 pm
@77. Wind, speed, tides. It’s all a complex mess. Speaking of which, then the son-in-law stop by same and takes another helping of ice cream and strawberries up to the bridge for Captain.DCSCA (797bc0) — 9/2/2020 @ 8:44 pm
https://www.answers.com/Q/How_long_does_it_take_to_turn_a_battleship_aroundnk (1d9030) — 9/2/2020 @ 8:45 pm
http://www.battleshipnc.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/05/Steering-the-Battleship-North-Carolina.pdfnk (1d9030) — 9/2/2020 @ 8:46 pm
76. It’s easier to ignore him. Until you don’t. Then you’re left to ‘twist slowly in the wind.’DCSCA (797bc0) — 9/2/2020 @ 8:47 pm
The conservative movement really could use the cleansing fire of a humiliating defeat. The hard question is how much of the country you’re prepared to burn down to get that.
Remember the conservative movement’s humiliating defeat of 1964? Cleansing! Meanwhile, the Great Society monstrosity became law. (Oops!) It’s one thing to deal with defeat, but to wish for it, to believe that the light at the end of the tunnel is not a freight train, you lost me.
Kennyharkin (cd4502) — 9/2/2020 @ 8:48 pm
“Every statue and street building has been renamed, every date has been altered. And the process is continuing day by day and minute by minute. History has stopped. Nothing exists except an endless present in which the Party is always right.”- ‘1984,’ George Orwell
JFK: election-fixing philanderer
LBJ: pathologically narcissistic liar with creepy dominance fetish
Nixon: paranoid, conspiratorial, power-abusing bigot
Carter: feckless whiner
Clinton: lying, corrupt, sexual abuser
Bush: incompetent bad English talker
If the geniuses at NASA, Disney Imagineering and Marvel Comics put their heads together to build an uber-anti-President from parts of previous flawed presidents, whose sole mission was to undermine the power, dignity and moral authority of his office and ultimately the country, they couldn’t do better than Donald Trump. And that’s without even considering the compensating virtues of his predecessors, of which Trump has none.lurker (d8c5bc) — 9/2/2020 @ 8:48 pm
Putin has been capping Trump’s T from Day 1.nk (1d9030) — 9/2/2020 @ 8:49 pm
@80. But America is a fully loaded supertanker.DCSCA (797bc0) — 9/2/2020 @ 8:50 pm
If the geniuses at NASA, Disney Imagineering and Marvel Comics put their heads together to build an uber-anti-President from parts of previous flawed presidents, whose sole mission was to undermine the power, dignity and moral authority of his office and ultimately the country, they couldn’t do better than Donald Trump.
Actually, Warner Bros., has:
Jack Nicholson, ‘President James Dale,’ Mars Attacks! 1996
Based on the Topps trading card series. And BTW, 50% of Topps is owned by… Disney.DCSCA (797bc0) — 9/2/2020 @ 8:57 pm
Great movie, but Trump makes Dale look like George Washington.lurker (d8c5bc) — 9/2/2020 @ 9:02 pm
@36/37 ROFLMAOPIP — her head had just come out of the “bowl.”
‘Spare’ me, Nancy. 😉DCSCA (797bc0) — 9/2/2020 @ 9:05 pm
That’s it. I’m not voting for Trump. Floating the idea of an election postponement should have been enough for me, but I was too forgiving. Not this time. Even if Trump walks back this voting twice notion, the damage has been done.
Don’t get me wrong. I’m not voting for Biden, either. Bad policy. Harris? Even worse. She supports bail for the rioters and an executive order to ban “assault” weapons.
A pox on both tickets. (I’m sorry, Mike Pence. You’re collateral damage.)
I’ll either vote third party or make no selection for President. If my decision to ditch Trump results in Biden getting elected, so be it, but at least Biden won’t be getting a “mandate” from me.norcal (a5428a) — 9/2/2020 @ 10:43 pm
I’m still voting Republican in other races. Divided government and all that.norcal (a5428a) — 9/2/2020 @ 10:47 pm
When Maddow opens her MSNBC program more or less echoing P’s post, you know we’re deep into Looking Glass Times.
“Are you kidding?” – Alice Hyatt [Ellen Burstyn] ‘Alice Doesn’t Live Here Anymore’ 1974DCSCA (797bc0) — 9/3/2020 @ 1:17 am
we must do voter fraud all up in it if thats what it takes to reelect mr donald j trump
he alone can prevent everything bad that happened while he was president
you just need to trust him on this oneDave (1bb933) — 9/3/2020 @ 2:06 am
R.I.P. Tom Seaver
No miracle is coming. It already arrived… in 1969.DCSCA (797bc0) — 9/3/2020 @ 4:15 am
So, loyal Trumpist Republicans, your GOP is now proudly the party of QAnon
So, loyal NeverTrumpers and Demcrats, your Democrat Party is now proudly the party of Antifa. Why? The Biden/Harris campaign is bailing out Antifa rioters from jail.Hoi Polloi (dc4124) — 9/3/2020 @ 5:04 am
Lie.Dave (1bb933) — 9/3/2020 @ 5:08 am
When Project Veritas caught Scott Foval and Alan Schulkin explaining how they routinely committed voter fraud, NeverTrumpers and the media said there was no problem of voter fraud.
Trump throws out a hypothetical and now NeverTrumpers and the media are going apoplectic.
Explain to me, NeverTrumpers, how Democrats bragging about their voter fraud is no big deal while this is?Hoi Polloi (dc4124) — 9/3/2020 @ 5:12 am
https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/biden-staffers-bailout-fund/Hoi Polloi (dc4124) — 9/3/2020 @ 5:14 am
Thank you for posting evidence that proves your claim was a lie.Dave (1bb933) — 9/3/2020 @ 5:23 am
Anyone bragging about Voter fraud is a problem. The fact that Foval was fired is a good thing. I don’t know if he broke the law, but he’s scuzzy, so I’m glad he got fired.
I guess your question is just another example of Tump First. Voter fraud is bad unless it helps trump and then it’s OK.Time123 (306531) — 9/3/2020 @ 5:24 am
“However, no evidence exists to suggest that donated funds came directly from the campaign.”Dave (1bb933) — 9/3/2020 @ 5:24 am
Yeah, Trump’s wrong here. When you participate in mail-in voting process, you also sign an affidavit that you are casting your vote. You cannot “vote again” later in the same election by a different means.
I mean, there are problems with mail-in votes… REAL problems. Just go back to every election and there are ALWAYS problems with the military votes overseas which are mostly mail-in voting.
But, Trump is wrong with his statement (I’ve only read it, but can’t foresee any other context that would change it) and he should recant this.whembly (2900b2) — 9/3/2020 @ 6:28 am
You know how many provisional ballots i had to authorize for reasons, mail vote is a whole nother animal.Bolivar di griz (7404b5) — 9/3/2020 @ 6:30 am
I think you know that this statement of Trump’s isn’t some kind of foot fault. This gets at the heart of whether an election is fair or not.
When does it get to be too much for you?Appalled (1a17de) — 9/3/2020 @ 6:42 am
Foval got away after he orchrstrated the j 20 riots, but they got roger stone thats w hat mattersBolivar di griz (7404b5) — 9/3/2020 @ 6:46 am
This is my opinion.
This isn’t Trump stepping all over his dick moment… this is Trump literally running his mouth without really vetting his thought process. This is one of his major character flaw… his mouth is disconnected from his brain sometimes. I get that he doesn’t have any legal background that could adulterate is mouth a bit…but, he should know not to opine on something that he doesn’t fully understand. Its the same way he’ll blabber on during his COVID taskforce meetings, he’s listening to his people and regurgitating it without fully understanding the full scope of the issue at hand. It shows.
But it’s not coming out of malice or desire to break laws. It’s coming from his narcissistic need to be the center of the attention.
I don’t think his point is to truly advocate his supporters to commit voter fraud. I think it’s a bit inane to hold that view.
I think his point is to highlight the problems with mail-in votes with a dumb argument.
He should clarify today that he’s not advocating for folks to commit voter fraud.
As for “When does it get to be too much for you?”
When Democrats offer better policies than Republicans…which, as it stands it’s likely never. And me not voting is not an option, nor voting 3rd party is either (even though I did vote for Gary Johnson in ’16). As much as I want it to be otherwise, our Presidential election system is truly binary. So… I gotta make a choice. Additionally, especially these last two Presidential elections, this highlights how important it is to be engaged with the party’s primary season in nominating better candidate. Let Trump be that “lesson” in the future for voters and the parties to avoid when nominating candidates.
Trump says a lot of dumb sh!t and a lot his actions makes me cringe. Yes, it’s tiring and yes we’ll all be worn out by (if) the end of his 2nd term. However, his policies imo are pretty darned good (not great, but hella better than I ever anticipated).
Just look at this discussion forum… most of the sturm and drang against Trump is over what he says or what he’s not doing. For me, most of that are small potatoes compared to what his administration has achieved. Like I’ve argued in my previous posts, I can separate the man from his policies. By doing so, I’d argue the choice is easy when the time comes to vote for either Biden or Trump.
If you cannot separate the man from his policies, as most here on this forum, that’s fine… we’re all free enough to vote for our candidate for any reason. My only comment to those folks is simply this: Don’t be too upset when a Democrat controlled government push an agenda that you despise. Trump is a temporary pain-point as he term limited. A Democrat radical agenda of the Green New Deal, higher taxes, court-packing scheme, more Liberal SCOTUS, etc… are policies that will last generations and will take that long to unwind.
Its like this (and please, this isn’t some divine argument here, just using movie pop culture).
I know most of you have seen Indiana Jones and the Last Crusade. The chalice scene test for those seeking that Holy Grail. Every chalice, but one, are extravagant and glizty and embodies what most people would believe ought to be the holy chalice. Why wouldn’t the Holy Grail be this, clean-cut, articulate of an art piece for the Son of God? Except that the one and only ugly chalice was the true Holy Grail.
Can you separate the man from his policies and find that ugly chalice?
😉whembly (2900b2) — 9/3/2020 @ 7:26 am
It’s interesting that the New York Post ran an article about a Democratic Party operative committing systematic mail in voter fraud for years and no one here is interested. That tells me everything I need to know about how unserious the people really are about the issue. It appears to be perfectly acceptable to commit voter fraud if it gets Trump out of office. The means are justified by the ends, right.1DaveMac (4cc9b4) — 9/3/2020 @ 7:26 am
There have also been several articles about how democrats are counting on mail in ballots to overcome Trumps lead on Election Day. The blueprint for electing Biden is in place. Everyone here will be ecstatic that Trump is no longer president regardless of how many felonies democrats commit to make it happen.1DaveMac (4cc9b4) — 9/3/2020 @ 7:30 am
I don’t think voting by mail and then voting in person is illegal in New York, and in many other states. The in-person vote cancels the mail in ballot, if it arrived ur arrives by the deadline.
New York is one of those states where they are not allowed to count ballots or get them ready for counting before Election day.
The reason we got results the same day in Massachusetts in Tuesday’s primary is that Massachsetts is a “received by” state (with drop boxes)
People lost voes, though:Sammy Finkelman (b66da2) — 9/3/2020 @ 7:31 am
“ When does it get to be too much for you?”
Trump was too much for me in 2016, it’s why I declined to vote for him.
The current dysfunction/destruction/crime/ignorance/hate permeating the cities of Chicago, Seattle, Portland, DC, Minneapolis, NYC, San Francisco, Atlanta etc. are a hundred times more too much for me so I also will not vote for the party that created those sh*tstorms.harkin (cd4502) — 9/3/2020 @ 7:32 am
It’s quite possible that going to the polls to vote in person does not constitute an illegal attempt to vote twice, or that successfully voting in person nullifies the absentee ballot.
The reporters should research their facts – maybe consult an election law expert – they can find some. Reporters can consult lists of willing sources.
And Trump should stop pretending that the laws in every state are the same.
And he should stop misinforming people.
And so should the Democrats.Sammy Finkelman (b66da2) — 9/3/2020 @ 7:35 am
Have they finished the tabulation in that ny congressional race too months in.Bolivar di griz (7404b5) — 9/3/2020 @ 7:36 am
“However, no evidence exists to suggest that donated funds came directly from the campaign.”
I’ll take Money is Fungible for $100, Alex.Hoi Polloi (dc4124) — 9/3/2020 @ 7:39 am
So wait … you mean if I give my completed absentee ballot to a total stranger who I have no reason to trust, it might turn out badly?
Maybe I shouldn’t let a total stranger go to the polls and vote for me in person, either?Dave (1bb933) — 9/3/2020 @ 7:41 am
Can you separate the man from his policies and find that ugly chalice?
Can you separate the contents of a toilet bowl for undigested morsels? Just flush it!nk (1d9030) — 9/3/2020 @ 7:44 am
Words mean things.
“No evidence” means no evidence.Dave (1bb933) — 9/3/2020 @ 7:45 am
There is no evidence that the Steele Dossier was correct, but that didn’t stop NeverTrumpers and the media from saying it was true.
Unless I’ve lived under a rock and the Pee Tapes have finally been found.Hoi Polloi (dc4124) — 9/3/2020 @ 8:10 am
They are still treating danchenkos drinking game as true, soBolivar di griz (7404b5) — 9/3/2020 @ 8:13 am
84. lurker (d8c5bc) — 9/2/2020 @ 8:48 pm
…they’d have Bill Clinton.
I wrote in the Sammy Zone on 4-15-94 (17:28) (in part) that originally I had (only) thought that Bill Clinton had:
I started out the list with
With regard to hoaxes I mean that he pretended he grew up in Hope, Arkansas, instead of mob dominated Hot Springs, and he pretended that he had supported the Gulf War of 1991.
Now of all these things I think Joe Biden has only the autobiographical veracity of John F. Kennedy. His own financial probity is pretty OK, and about family members he only cares that they don’t get themselves indicted.
There’s probably been no president previously with the disregard for the truth of Donald Trump. I don’t mean that he lies more or tat lies better or tries to. It’s that he doesn’t care if what he says is not true. (but only that he has some support)
Most liars care about giving the impression that they’re telling the truth.
Joe Biden imagines maybe that he has the logrolling capabilities of Lyndon Baines Johnson, and nobody but nobody has the the political cowardice of Franklin Delano Roosevelt, who didn’t even want to say who he wanted or didn’t want for for vice president in 1944.Sammy Finkelman (b66da2) — 9/3/2020 @ 8:17 am
Whembly, I agree with what you wrote here.
But when you combine it with an unwillingness to admit mistakes, a complete lack of ethics, and a narcissistic desire to put his success above all else it becomes a lot worse.Time123 (ca85c9) — 9/3/2020 @ 8:19 am
Can you separate the leadership from the leader?
Can you separate the decisions from the decider?
Can you hear someone put himself at the center of every issue and still believe he’s serving America first?Radegunda (e1ea47) — 9/3/2020 @ 8:19 am
His administration’s successes are still successes,despite his character flaws.
I care about WHAT a President does in office, not WHO a President is in office.
By all account, Obama is a great husband, father and appeared “Presidential” in office. But his policies and administration sucks ass.
Trump is the inverse of that and has literally becomes a means to an end in order to advance Republican agendas, if nothing else to stop the radical Democrat party agendas.
For me, it’s purely a transactional arraignment.whembly (2900b2) — 9/3/2020 @ 8:25 am
It’s the other way around, of course.
If they are able to vote, their mail ballot won’t be tabulated; and if they are not able to vote, their mail ballot should be tabulated. If they are not able to vote they can cast an affidavit ballot which may or may not counted.
The big question is if both votes won’t be counted.
It is probably not very easy for an average citizen to find out how things work in their state, but if you have the resources of the Republican National Committee, you should be able to find out what the situation is in each state.Sammy Finkelman (b66da2) — 9/3/2020 @ 8:28 am
@123 Sammy, are you saying that’s true in NY? If true, Trump being a NewYorker may have mistakenly believe that how it works in other states. (I’d still argue he needs to clarify is original statment, or at least couch it in terms that its legal in states that allows it).
However, I’m not finding ANYTHING on the NY Secretary of State that you can mail-in your vote AND if you want, vote in person (which should nullify the mail-in vote).
Do you have a good source?whembly (2900b2) — 9/3/2020 @ 8:32 am
Trump is trying to make something that is legal sound illegal.
Only Trump would do that.Sammy Finkelman (b66da2) — 9/3/2020 @ 8:33 am
Like accusing someone of perjury when the transcript says something different, thats what sally yates did. And youre still huying it 3 1/2 years latermBolivar di griz (7404b5) — 9/3/2020 @ 8:44 am
Sammy is imagining all that. He does that sometimes.nk (1d9030) — 9/3/2020 @ 8:49 am
The dossier was correct about the fact of Putin’s intervention in the election on Trump’s behalf (according to the GOP senate report).
is also correct.
Trump’s attempts to pursue Russian real-estate deals (which he repeatedly, and falsely, denied during the campaign, until Michael Cohen eventually revealed the truth) was also revealed in the document, including his ties to Aras Aglarov, who was implicated in the illegal conspiracy to violate election laws that culminated in the infamous Trump Tower meeting.
Elsewhere, Steele reports that former Ukrainian President Viktor Yanukovych “confided in Putin that he did authorize and order substantial kick-back payments to Manafort as alleged but sought to reassure him that there was no documentary trail left behind which could provide clear evidence of this.”
Trump campaign manager Manafort’s money-laundering and corrupt ties to Yanukovych and Putin were also proven in court, and detailed in the recent GOP senate intelligence committee report.
So the assertion that there was no accurate information in the Steele Dossier is another self-serving TrumpWorld fable.Dave (1bb933) — 9/3/2020 @ 8:55 am
@128 Dave… the problem with the dossier is that the FBI couldn’t corroborate to the degree it need to be in order to use it as justification for the FISA warrant.whembly (2900b2) — 9/3/2020 @ 9:02 am
127. nk (1d9030) — 9/3/2020 @ 8:49 am
This is what I think Trump is up to:
Hes encouraging some of his voters, even if they don’t have any worries that their mail-in ballot might not be counted (because it was mailed late, say) to go and also vote at the polls, (and tell his campaign) hoping that the state of North Carolina will count both votes.
He will then be able to use that fact to argue in court, if he loses or looks likely to lose, that ALL mail ballots should be thrown out.
He’ll argue that because absentee votes are going to be very disproportionately for Biden.
His goal will be, if he can’t get a Biden victory in North Carolina reversed, to have North Carolina (and other states Biden carried) not get ito the Electoral College, leaving him with the majority of the Electoral votes that remain!Sammy Finkelman (b66da2) — 9/3/2020 @ 9:06 am
That I agree with, Sammy. He is trying to get his supporters to cause chaos at the polls.nk (1d9030) — 9/3/2020 @ 9:08 am
I don;t think that hacking experts were recruited under duress by the FSB, at least not for the occasion. (he idea here is that the Russian government offers criminals whom it previously had no connection with an opportunity to avoid jail if they jin in. That is probably the way Putin wants us to think it works.
The Steele dossier is also correct in that there was a presidential election in the United States in 2016 and the two chief candidates were Donald Trump and Hillary Clinton.Sammy Finkelman (b66da2) — 9/3/2020 @ 9:11 am
131. nk (1d9030) — 9/3/2020 @ 9:08 am
Not at the polls.
After the polls close.Sammy Finkelman (b66da2) — 9/3/2020 @ 9:13 am
chaos…if necessary to prevent, or attempt to prevent, a Biden victory.Sammy Finkelman (b66da2) — 9/3/2020 @ 9:15 am
By “at the polls” I meant the election generally.
But he will cause chaos at the physical polls too. By making the lines and the waiting times to vote longer with his saboteurs who show up “only to make sure their vote will be counted” and spend fifteen minutes each arguing with the poll workers about it. Vote suppression!nk (1d9030) — 9/3/2020 @ 9:24 am
This just shouldn’t be hard: The President of the United States is encouraging a swath of the electorate to commit a felony for his sake. Everyone should be able to condemn this – if their loyalties to Trump didn’t come first. And that’s the problem. Too many have decided that loyalty to Trump supersedes all else, and that guiding principles have become superfluous to decision-making.
All one has to do in this is change Trump’s name to Obama, read the piece again, and then see what your reaction would have been. Except we already know, and it wouldn’t be to make excuses for, or attempt to justify what you know is wrong.
If anything, Trump has not only exposed so much of who we are, but has exposed the willingness of a lot of Americans to lie on his behalf. Because for him to openly suggest breaking the law on his behalf is to understand that he has no fear of backlash from supporters but rather that he knows it’s a distinct possibility that any number of supporters will actually follow through on his directive.Dana (292df6) — 9/3/2020 @ 10:02 am
this is the ‘stray voltage’ as someone here described, one needs to verify the ballot has been cast.bolivar de gris (7404b5) — 9/3/2020 @ 10:17 am
that’s another way, but what if the ballots still haven’t been counted,
https://www.ncsbe.gov/news/press-releases/2020/09/03/message-karen-brinson-bell-nc-votersbolivar de gris (7404b5) — 9/3/2020 @ 10:23 am
US trade deficit surges in July to highest in 12 years
Promises. Kept.Dave (1bb933) — 9/3/2020 @ 11:02 am
Flashback March 2013:
Cincinnati poll worker charged with voting half dozen times in November
She admitted voting twice in the presidential election last November, and now, Obama supporter Melowese Richardson has been indicted for allegedly voting at least six times. She also is charged with illegal voting in 2008 and 2011.
Richardson had admitted on camera to a local TV station, “Yes, I voted twice,” claiming she was concerned that her vote would not count. She also said there “was no intent on my part to commit any voter fraud.”Rip Murdock (d2a2a8) — 9/3/2020 @ 11:53 am
Officials charged that she voted in her own name by absentee ballot and also in person at the polls, but Hamilton County Prosecuting Attorney Joseph Deters said she also is charged with voting in the name of five other people in various elections.
Sister Marguerite Kloos also faces one count of illegal voting, for allegedly submitting an absentee ballot in the name of a fellow nun, Sister Rose Marie Hewitt, who had died before absentee ballots were sent out. She is accused of opening Sister Hewitt’s ballot, forging her signature and mailing it to the Board of Elections as a vote.
Speaking of cheating against political opponents to remain in power, Trump had this to say about Putin’s assassination attempt on his chief rival, Mr. Navalny.Paul Montagu (a2078e) — 9/3/2020 @ 12:06 pm
this is the latest victim, you were crying tears over,
rittenhouse should be given a medal,bolivar de gris (7404b5) — 9/3/2020 @ 12:10 pm
@136. Nah. Most of the electorate are finally getting the rhythm of his schtick. It’s a distraction; entertainment. Long-time Trump watchers-espcially NYers- have seen this routine since the 80’s.
You either enjoy the show or switch to another channel.
We’ll read ‘the ratings’ on Election Night.DCSCA (797bc0) — 9/3/2020 @ 12:29 pm
@136, Dana you’re arguing from principles that republicans no longer value; rule of law, leadership by example, voting integrity. Unless you’re able to frame this about the glory of trump or liberal tears you’re trying to explain the color blue to someone that can’t see.Time123 (9f42ee) — 9/3/2020 @ 12:37 pm
We’re at a turning point. Trump’s voters would have scoffed if you told them half of the problems we’ve seen these past few years, and if you told them Trump would be ordering his fans to vote twice they would say you’re insane with TDS, and the claim is proof your opinion is invalid.
Same thing now. If you associate Trump with what he is supporting from Putin, killing his opposition, that’s just TDS.
But it’s not. We’re at a turning point.
It’s not important, it’s kinda funny, don’t think too much.Dustin (825e2c) — 9/3/2020 @ 12:42 pm
It’s Episode No. 337 of “Much ado about nothing.” Althouse clarifies the “Trump” voting suggestion at her blog.
https://althouse.blogspot.com/2020/09/trump-restates-his-advice-on-how-to.htmlColoComment (9535f7) — 9/3/2020 @ 1:12 pm
A (natontionwide?) poll mentioned on the CBS Evening News tonight said that 70% of Biden voters intend to vote by mail but only 20% of Trump voters. If they follow through (in states where both methods are an option) and he vote split 50-50, about 69% of the in person votes could be for Trump and about 69% of mail-in ballots for Biden. At least the two party split. Of course a considerable number of mail in ballots, depending on the state, might be counted by the end of election day.Sammy Finkelman (b66da2) — 9/3/2020 @ 3:59 pm
North Carolina begins mailing out absentee ballots tomorrow, September 4.
Every state has different rules as to whether someone who asked for an absentee ballot can vote instead in person (or cancel or not cancel his absentee ballot)Sammy Finkelman (b66da2) — 9/3/2020 @ 4:01 pm
This is the kind of knee-jerk tribalism that’s required to support a man like Trump.
Joe Biden opposes Antifa. Neither his family nor surrogates campaign for pro-Antifa candidates. And while there’s no central Antifa to announce official positions, the unmistakable message from social media is that many if not most Antifa sympathizers consider Biden part of everything they hate.
Trump, on the other hand, not only refuses to condemn QAnon, he whispers sweet nothings about how much they love America. His daughter-in-law was just stumping for an out-and-proud QAnon candidate. And the QAnon movement couldn’t be more all-in for Trump. It’s what defines them.
One could hardly draw a starker contrast, yet you try to torture it into a laughably implausible false equivalence.
Take heart. This may all be over soon. If that happens you’ll miraculously remember how much you hate presidential mendacity, immorality, personality cults, abuse of power, budget deficits, arrogation of state authority, and so much more that Trump Amnesia Syndrome has blinded you to.lurker (d8c5bc) — 9/3/2020 @ 8:55 pm