Patterico's Pontifications

9/6/2009

Silly Stuff (Updated)

Filed under: Dog Trainer,Media Bias,Obama,Politics — DRJ @ 3:22 pm



[Guest post by DRJ]

Recently, White House Press Secretary Robert Gibbs had this to say about objections to President Obama’s speech to students:

“I think we’ve reached a little bit of the silly season when the president of the United States can’t tell kids in school to study hard and stay in school.”

Similarly, Education Secretary Arne Duncan said the furor over Obama’s upcoming speech to the nation’s school children is “just silly.”

Meanwhile, in March, Obama appointed Van Jones to serve as his Special Advisor for Green Jobs, Enterprise and Innovation (the Green Jobs Czar) despite the fact that Jones became an avowed Communist in the aftermath of the 1992 Rodney King incident and founded an activist group called STORM that is based on Marxism and Leninism. More recently, Jones reportedly signed a 911 Truther Statement in 2004 and in February 2009 referred to Republicans (without abbreviation) as “a-holes.”

And the Obama Administration thinks conservatives are silly.

— DRJ

UPDATE: The LA Times Tim Rutten goes beyond silly to paranoia:

“Anxiety over the speech seems particularly high in Texas, where many districts are offering parents involved in the boycott movement the option of taking their children out of class. (Whoever thought we’d see Texas treat advocacy of personal responsibility like sex education?)

The irony wasn’t lost on everybody in the state. Puzzled Texas education officials told the Houston Chronicle that students often watch presidential speeches broadcast during school hours and that, in 1989, President George H.W. Bush specifically spoke to students about drug abuse. “It’s hard to imagine anything more ridiculous than attacking the president of the United States for talking to students about the importance of getting a good education and being a good citizen,” said Kathy Miller, president of a statewide school monitoring group. “I wish our elected leaders were responsible enough to denounce this kind of wild-eyed paranoia. But the problem is too many of them are actually feeding this kind of nonsense — like when the governor flirts with secessionists and state Board of Education members say the president sympathizes with terrorists.”

Miller has identified precisely the process at work in the healthcare hysteria and, increasingly, elsewhere where the GOP thinks it can shove the Obama administration into a ditch. Republican officials such as the Florida state chairman are playing a dangerous game with an unhinged segment of public opinion that regards Obama not as an elected official with whom they disagree, but as an illegitimate usurper of the presidency.

That paranoid fantasy is what’s really behind the “birther” movement and the allegations that the president is — take your pick — a secret Marxist or a secret Muslim.

It’s the kind of fanciful anxiety that produces comments like this, posted on a conservative website this week: “Barack Obama and his left-wing Chicago machine regime are putting into place laws and institutions which will insure that there will never again be free elections in America.”

These are the people who are stockpiling ammunition and keeping their children at home next Tuesday.”

So Rutten thinks conservatives are “unhinged” and into “hysteria” and “fantasy”? How “normal” of him.

By the way, I blogged about Miller’s statement before. In addition, Miller’s biography indicates she is a community organizer and former public affairs director for Planned Parenthood of Austin. She has an agenda that the Houston Chronicle and Tim Rutten of the LA Times apparently didn’t want to share with readers:

“Kathy believes in the tremendous strength of the grassroots and has spent her career focused on mobilizing support for important issues such as women’s reproductive freedom, children’s health care, public education and ending partner violence. Kathy has trained thousands of individuals from Texas and across the nation on media relations, grassroots organizing and mobilizing to combat radical-right political extremism.”

— DRJ

121 Responses to “Silly Stuff (Updated)”

  1. Yeah, how silly is it of us to have problems with a Free Mumia activist on the government payroll?

    The silly Dana (474dfc)

  2. I’ve been a little behind the curve on this “green energy” business. Having reviewed the Green for All site, which I think is a Van Horn creation, it seems clear enough that “green technology” is a highly sophisticated process for transferring green. Basically, it’s just “reparations” program in stealth modality. Some interesting euphemisms on the site, like “court-involved youth,” one of the beneficiaries of this “initiative.”

    Flint (6fdd8d)

  3. I saw James Carville on some network program yesterday, he wasn’t willing to admit that the whole letter writing exercise was just an unforced error, without which this whole address would likely be viewed much differently

    Once again it shows Obama as an “I” kind of person, rather than ‘You”.

    Soronel Haetir (2b4c2b)

  4. Speaking of silly, the headline over at DailyKos may be the best ever…..

    http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2009/9/6/777880/-Send-Me-Everything-You-Can-Find-About-Glenn-Beck

    harkin (ccb9c1)

  5. We spent 40 years fighting communism. John McCain was held as a POW by Communists. Now we have them in the White House.

    Dennis D (ae900a)

  6. I updated the post with some thoughts by Tim Rutten.

    DRJ (3f5471)

  7. Tim Rutten is a silly douchenozzle. Prolly hangs out with DSCSA, the International Man of Parody.

    JD (224d7d)

  8. Eight years of treating the occupant of the white house as an “illegitimate usurper of the presidency,” but nine years is too much.

    Jim (582155)

  9. That we shouldn’t worry about what a guy in the WH who has surrounded himself with Communists, Marxists, and other scum of the earth, says to our kids is the heighth of hypocracy.

    Joseph Brown (ff6241)

  10. I have a paranoid fantasy that anything bad – anything at all – might could happen to our little country. A 9/11 or a Hurricane Katrina or a piggy piggy pig flu or any of various and sundry mundane calamities. If this anything were of any consequence whatsoever – our little country and its third world Barack Obama finances absolutely could not handle it in any way imaginable. And our enemies know this. They know this very well.

    Little girls like Tim Rutten what want to squeal about paranoid fantasies are choosing to go out on a limb for a dipshit dirty socialist Chicago street trash pezzydent what has painted a big cherry red target on our little country’s ass. But it’s more than that. What dirty socialists like Tim Rutten seem rather anxious about accomplishing as quickly as possible is to develop and market a compelling portrait of domestic enemies.

    Domestic enemies.

    In context I think it’s the anxieties of dirty socialists like Mr. Rutten that are going to be far far more fateful for what happens to our little country and how.

    happyfeet (6b707a)

  11. You know that “the silly season” is century old expression, right?

    SEK (9e7eee)

  12. ohnoes I think I got filtrated again. I don’t know why this happens to me so much I’m a good person.

    I recycle stuff and also I share.

    happyfeet (6b707a)

  13. “…take your pick — a secret Marxist or a secret Muslim.”

    He’s made a secret out of being a Marxist?

    Darth Venomous (98ca48)

  14. SEK:

    You know that “the silly season” is century old expression, right?

    No. So Gibbs’ statement was even more dismissive than I realized? Thanks for letting me know.

    DRJ (3f5471)

  15. It’s the kind of fanciful anxiety that produces comments like this…., ”

    Now, whenever I think of Tim Rutten, I will always think of him as Mr.Fanciful. It just seems to fitting.

    Dana (863a65)

  16. So Gibbs’ statement was even more dismissive than I realized?

    Journalists and those who work around them talking about “the silly season” is about as dismissive of as a baseball fan begging off a chore because of “the pennant race”: it characterizes a particular period of time, and in this case, quite accurately. A Presidential admonishment to school children on the first day of school is a non-story — especially when that President, to many of them, has allowed them to truly believe the formerly charmed lie that “Anyone can grow up to be President of the United States.” If outrage over the President telling students to study hard and stay in school isn’t a non-story of the sort that typifies “the silly season,” then nothing is.

    SEK (9e7eee)

  17. And if the use of false premises in an effort to make an argument isn’t highly common in today’s liberal media, liberal education camps, liberal government, then nothing is.

    John Hitchcock (3fd153)

  18. Jumped ahead of myself, ital was supposed to be for SEK post time.

    John Hitchcock (3fd153)

  19. Anyone who nuzzles George Soros’s scrotum just so can grow up to be pezzydent of the United States.

    Charming.

    happyfeet (6b707a)

  20. SEK,

    Assume you have an embattled President who campaigned on bipartisanship — yet can’t even keep moderate members of his own Party in line for health care reform, let alone get support from members of the opposing Party — who schedules a series of public townhall meetings and speeches to push his expansive health care agenda. In the heat of that effort when his poll numbers are at their (then) lowest point, the President schedules a speech to be broadcast to every student in America. Meanwhile, the President’s Education Department asks teachers to instruct students to write letters outlining how they can help the President, a letter that teachers are to check later to confirm that students followed through on what they wrote.

    Is that a “silly season” story?

    DRJ (3f5471)

  21. Let’s save SEK, Rich Puchalsky, and Karl Steel (aka Dr. Porn) the effort and note for the record that they will call you racists without any basis, and we will note that they are dishonest douchenozzles.

    JD (c40e14)

  22. Hey Assholes, the President wants to talk to your kids, but he wants you to shut up.

    Silly season written all over that one. I feel you.

    daleyrocks (718861)

  23. Anyone who nuzzles George Soros’s scrotum just so can grow up to be pezzydent of the United States.

    …whether he be black or white or black and white. You don’t need me to tell you this, ‘feets, but I don’t think some people out there realize how bitter a pill to swallow that “Anyone can grow up to be President” line was in non-white communities.

    Assume you have an embattled President who campaigned on bipartisanship — yet can’t even keep moderate members of his own Party in line for health care reform, let alone get support from members of the opposing Party — who schedules a series of public townhall meetings and speeches to push his expansive health care agenda. In the heat of that effort when his poll numbers are at their (then) lowest point, the President schedules a speech to be broadcast to every student in America.

    …on the first day of school, which happens to be in September. I think his decision to talk to students on the first day of a long school year has less to do with poll numbers and more to do with it being the first day of a long school year. You know what I do on the first day of class? I give inspirational speeches — I tell the students that I’m tough, but fair, but if they work hard, any of them can earn an “A” in my class. That’s what you do on the first day of school. It is, in fact, rather silly that it’s been cast as such an ominous and underhanded deed.

    Meanwhile, the President’s Education Department asks teachers to instruct students to write letters outlining how they can help the President, a letter that teachers are to check later to confirm that students followed through on what they wrote.

    Of course, you have absolutely no idea what it is he wants them to do, so you’re working from a position of profound suspicion and absolute ignorance. If he asks them to read a book a week, and the teacher charts that on the wall, the complaints about indoctrination will sound, yes, silly. Of course, if he does that, the goalposts will shift and focus on which books he wants them to read, because no matter what he says, it will be interpreted in the most uncharitable way possible. If he wants Caldecott Medal winners, I’m going to have to listen to conservatives complain that the ALA is a communist/socialist/Marxist/Stalinist front, etc.

    If Obama talks about service — even if it be as innocuous as asking students to plant trees on Arbor Day — I promise some conservative will mention Hitler Youth, Glenn Reynolds will link to it (“Interesting.”), and it’ll work its way around the conservative blogs. But you know what? That’s damn silly, and this is the season for it.

    That said, given the manufactured outrage of the past eight months and the continued popularity of Glenn Beck, I can actually see the silly season extending well into 2012.

    SEK (9e7eee)

  24. That said, given the manufactured outrage of the past eight months

    Let me assure you that there is plenty enough outrage of the non-manufactured variety in existence.

    Patterico (cc3b34)

  25. Of course, you have absolutely no idea what it is he wants them to do, so you’re working from a position of profound suspicion and absolute ignorance.

    But aren’t you also working from a position of profound support and absolute ignorance because you seem to stand on this point, “If outrage over the President telling students to study hard and stay in school isn’t a non-story of the sort that typifies “the silly season,” then nothing is.?” because you nor anyone else knows what he will say.

    You are more prone to giving him the benefit of the doubt. Others, not so much.

    Dana (863a65)

  26. Manufactured outrage, SEK? Now you are repeating the White House falsehood that the Tea Party people are astroturf? What’s been “manufactured” is any sense that there is any popularity for Obama’s policies, as the administration uses funds from coopted pharmaceutical industry to run ads, and union thugs to try – and fail – to drum up support and intimidate opponents.

    SPQR (26be8b)

  27. SEK:

    Meanwhile, the President’s Education Department asks teachers to instruct students to write letters outlining how they can help the President, a letter that teachers are to check later to confirm that students followed through on what they wrote.

    Of course, you have absolutely no idea what it is he wants them to do, so you’re working from a position of profound suspicion and absolute ignorance.

    You’re aware that this is what the President’s Education Department instructional materials told teachers to do, right? You act like I just made this up.

    DRJ (3f5471)

  28. Well said, SEK (#23).

    Leviticus (f0edf9)

  29. SEK,

    You also know the Obama Administration staffers helped write the instructional materials, don’t you?

    “Presidential aides also acknowledged to the newspaper that they helped the U.S. Education Department write the suggested assignments.”

    DRJ (3f5471)

  30. Obama’s done enough real crappy stuff that it is indeed silly for people to hem and haw about something so innocuous as trying to get students engaged with the idea of self-governance. I mean, is there anything Obama could do at this point that y’all wouldn’t scoff at as “dirty socialist antics” or something of the sort?

    Leviticus (f0edf9)

  31. SEK says we conservatives are operating from “absolute ignorance”. As if we didn’t read the Education Department memo before the ‘how can I help the President’ self searching was purged.

    It is SEK that is willfully ignorant in his/her posting. Ignorant of the importance of ‘service’ in fascist governments. Ignorant of the ‘service’ that our dear leader described ‘a force as well funded as the military’.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tt2yGzHfy7s

    Barack Obama will require you to work said Michelle.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g0Gl8aMOpcg

    Ignorant of the history of the brown shirts the bolsheveks.

    Ignorant of what keeps us free.

    But its a good thing you are here SEK. This will give you knowledge.

    red (56520f)

  32. SEK is falling back in his pattern of asserting something over and over again as a fact, when it is simply not. This is not the first day of school. It may be in your local K-12 district, but ours is beginning its 4th week of classes.

    And we know for a fact that they wanted said letters written, as it was included in the original DOE suggested peripherals to go along with the speech. It should take about 10 minutes to tell them to place great importance on their education, to read, and listen to their teachers and parents. What are the other 50 minutes?

    JD (c40e14)

  33. And keep in mind that in many areas (if not most) this is far from the first day of school. My son started August 7th… that’s a month ago.

    Stashiu3 (ed6467)

  34. Leviticus:

    I mean, is there anything Obama could do at this point that y’all wouldn’t scoff at as “dirty socialist antics” or something of the sort?

    Yes. He could keep his campaign promise to send more troops to Afghanistan.

    DRJ (3f5471)

  35. Okay JD, stop copying me before I type… it’s annoying. 😉

    Stashiu3 (ed6467)

  36. If Obama talks about service — even if it be as innocuous as asking students to plant trees on Arbor Day — I promise some conservative will mention Hitler Youth, Glenn Reynolds will link to it (”Interesting.”), and it’ll work its way around the conservative blogs. But you know what? That’s damn silly, and this is the season for it.

    That said, given the manufactured outrage of the past eight months and the continued popularity of Glenn Beck, I can actually see the silly season extending well into 2012.

    Comment by SEK —

    I can see the silly season continuing until you admit there are reasons why Americans don’t trust this president and they have nothing to do with his skin color. If you think seven thousand people showing up at a city council meeting or a Congressional town hall is astroturf, you have a lot to learn.

    I don’t think you’ll ever learn it.

    MIke K (4baa9f)

  37. School here started August 24, but whatevs.

    daleyrocks (718861)

  38. Obama’s done enough real crappy stuff that it is indeed silly for people to hem and haw about something so innocuous as trying to get students engaged with the idea of self-governance.

    If, it is true, as you say it is, and I fully agree it is, that Obama’s done “enough real crappy stuff” that history is proof enough that Obama cannot be trusted. And why should parents trust him with their kids? Like he demanded of the media, huge numbers of parents are demanding of him: Leave my children alone!

    John Hitchcock (3fd153)

  39. You are all just a bunch of silly paranoid racist manufactured astrotwoofers.

    JD (c40e14)

  40. Great minds, Stashiu ….

    JD (c40e14)

  41. There have been too many bait-and-switch programs that were described one way and turned out to be something else entirely. The complaint that some of us automatically assume the worst has some validity… that doesn’t mean it’s unjustified. I’m tired of letting people get in the first shot and having to recover before even starting damage control. Eventually, you start looking for where the punch is coming from no matter who it is.

    Politicians need to stay the hell away from my kids. I’d like them to stay away from me too, but that’s not going to happen until we get rid of a lot of the sleazy incumbents. So until that happens, I’m going to be suspicious of everything they say, everything they do, and everything they even think about touching. I don’t trust any of them anymore. Not any. I’m fed up with business as usual and “Go along to get along” politicians.

    Oppose them all. If they do nothing for the rest of the year it will be a vast improvement.

    Stashiu3 (ed6467)

  42. Get ’em while they’re young, is the communist plan. The cabal in the white house and both houses of congress have been brainwashed by our school system taken over by progressives, and he leftist Department of Education is responsible. It is full of leftist civil service workers that need to be fired to trim the federal budget. Of course, this is a “silly” idea, is it not?

    Rick (f2566c)

  43. Just remember the saying (with some exceptions (EB being one such exception)):

    BS
    MS (more of the same)
    PhD (piled higher and deeper)

    John Hitchcock (3fd153)

  44. how bitter a pill to swallow that “Anyone can grow up to be President” line was in non-white communities.

    But now it’s a tasty pill and Barack’s speech will for reals not make it any more tastier. Its tastiness all derives from its non-bitter properties, if you follow.

    I think you underestimate how bitter a pill it is to swallow when you’re a kid of any sort of coloration and some foo on the tv tries to play you and you have to just sit there and watch cause you’re not allowed to make choices about watching or not watching.

    I think it would be neato mosquito if we lived in a world where the careful application of pezzydential rhetoric made kids better people but we don’t. Well, in Japan, maybe. But not here.

    brb I have another comment what I want to make Mr. SEK and I will go get the links and things for it cause it’s a point I haven’t seen anyone make yet and I think it’s important

    happyfeet (6b707a)

  45. “Well, in Japan, maybe.”

    In Japan don’t they have an Empress who was abducted by aliens? So at least that would be interesting to talk to kids about. She was on Venus.

    daleyrocks (718861)

  46. Aliens. Just so.

    ok hi Mr. SEK I am back.

    Here is what I want you to consider.

    You said these thingers… this one…

    Of course, you have absolutely no idea what it is he wants them to do, so you’re working from a position of profound suspicion and absolute ignorance. If he asks them to read a book a week, and the teacher charts that on the wall, the complaints about indoctrination will sound, yes, silly.

    and before that one you said…

    If outrage over the President telling students to study hard and stay in school isn’t a non-story of the sort that typifies “the silly season,” then nothing is.

    Well Mr. SEK there’s a tension between these two statements because you have no idea what the scary man’s gonna say or ask the poor children to do either.

    But I do.

    It’s changed though now that he got cold busted getting all propagandy with the chilrens.

    Cap’n Ed did a dealio yesterday that confuzzled people I think. I don’t think he started this little meme but I blame him anyway… cause he’s Cap’n Ed and his shoulders are wide and his back is strong by golly. Here’s what he said:

    The failure to check with school districts on start dates before scheduling a national address to “schoochildren” is not an isolated fumble by the administration headed by the novice executive. It’s becoming a pattern of incompetence, which can be seen at all levels:

    Well, that’s just stupid. There was no scheduling incompetence… the speech was part and parcel of the gayification of September 11 … and he was darn well going to talk to these poor chilrens about service this and service that. It’s the theme of the freaking week and this week is the culmination of a whole entire community organizey gayification of September 11 campaign.

    Getting September 11 all gayed up is a big big deal for these ones and Barack Obama especially wanted to use all of his resources to make it happen, cause of Daddy Soros would be so very pleased.

    I think it’s a lot disingenuous, I really do, to pretend not to see how these community organizey people think. It’s pretty clear how they think, and it’s very clear what our goof-ass community organizer pezzydent was all about come Tuesday. Now we’ll just have to see what rewrite came up with.

    happyfeet (6b707a)

  47. Let me assure you that there is plenty enough outrage of the non-manufactured variety in existence.

    I don’t doubt that — but the anger over Obama talking to students doesn’t fall into that category. The fact that conservatives are worried that the President of the United States is going to tell students to worship Karl Marx is an indication that we’re in the silly season. If someone thinks that anything Obama’s proposed is sanctioned by Marxism, Stalinism, or communism, they’re reacting to outrage that’s been manufactured.

    But aren’t you also working from a position of profound support and absolute ignorance because you seem to stand on this point

    The difference is, my common sense is still intact. I’ve read the boilerplate statement to teachers of K through 6 and you know what? I recognize that it’s a boilerplate statement, not the second coming of The Communist Manifesto. As a teacher, I assure you that I get similar documents any time any government official interacts with students. All the language that has conservatives apoplectic is part of a very familiar template that’s wholly and utterly innocuous. The problem is, conservatives aren’t familiar with that material, so they’re reading nefarious intentions into it. I suppose I can understand why: when you’ve been in power for eight years, someone else’s agenda is difficult to stomach . . . especially when those eight years pushed government policy so far to the right.

    I’m not saying this to be contentious. I’m just concerned that conservatives are mistaking the perfectly normal and natural reaction to having been voted out of power for the advent of a neo-Stalinist regime. As someone who’s actually on the left, I’m going to have to agree (in a way) with DRJ and say that I’m disappointed that the public option might be off the table because that means Obama’s putting his weight behind a fundamentally centrist plan.

    Obama’s a centrist. Stop. End of story. He only looks like a radical extremist because the country listed so far to the right the past eight years.

    Now you are repeating the White House falsehood that the Tea Party people are astroturf?

    First, that wasn’t what I was talking about. Second, if you don’t believe that the outrage coming from both sides of the aisle is the concerted product of well-oiled political machines, you’re an idiot. I mean that. If someone defends their side as being organic, they’re not worth talking to. Both sides loosed their dogs this August. Stop. End of non-story.

    You’re aware that this is what the President’s Education Department instructional materials told teachers to do, right? You act like I just made this up.

    No, I don’t. See above. That said, even those materials don’t indicate what exactly he’s going to say, and that’s something that I indicate — check out all those conditionals in my comment — but you don’t.

    Ignorant of the importance of ’service’ in fascist governments. Ignorant of the ’service’ that our dear leader described ‘a force as well funded as the military’. Ignorant of the history of the brown shirts the bolsheveks.

    C’mon red! You’re one step away from fulfilling the prediction I made in my previous comment. In case you need reminding:

    If Obama talks about service — even if it be as innocuous as asking students to plant trees on Arbor Day — I promise some conservative will mention Hitler Youth…

    The fact that Kennedy used the same language to sell the country on the Peace Corps, or that Nancy Reagan used the same language to sell us on her “Just Say No” initiatives, doesn’t register for some reason. The concept of public service must be rooted in fascistic logics because, well, because you don’t like the current President.

    I can see the silly season continuing until you admit there are reasons why Americans don’t trust this president

    And there are reasons I didn’t trust the last President, but you know what? That’s because the party that better represents my principles wasn’t in power. Stop. End of story. Being out of power isn’t the end of the world. As Karl will tell you (again and again and again and again), the party of the sitting President always loses seats in the next Congressional election. Right now, that’s a point of hope for conservatives, but I guarantee you that some conservatives will be calling it a clear referendum come 2010 and forget all about the fact that it always happens.

    School here started August 24

    The date he chose corresponds to when the last of the public school systems open for business, if I recall correctly.

    There have been too many bait-and-switch programs that were described one way and turned out to be something else entirely.

    Shall we begin with “compassionate conservatism” and an opposition to nation-buildling, or does your memory only go back eight months or so. Yes, I’m being flip; but yes, I’m also making a serious point about what it’s like to be out of power. You know what? You’ll learn to live with it. You’ll learn how to be in the opposition party and stop screaming like a maniac every time the current POTUS does something that’s utterly predictable of people from the other side of the aisle.

    Believe me, I’ve got eight years experience in this regard.

    Just remember the saying…

    I’m sure your knowledge about the incorporation of non-Darwinian evolutionary theory in turn-of-the-last-century novels and popular culture far outstrips mine, but you know what? That doesn’t matter because I’ve never claimed that my professional expertise matters one whit when I’m talking about contemporary American politics.

    SEK (9e7eee)

  48. The date he chose corresponds to when the last of the public school systems open for business, if I recall correctly.

    This is all kinds of not true but others have already done the work on this. But for reals, what does the date he chose correspond with? No fairs peaking at #46.

    happyfeet (6b707a)

  49. (happy, you posted while I was rambling, so I didn’t see your comment until I posted mine. However, I’ve got to go finish dinner, so I can’t reply until tomorrow. I hope you’re not too terribly offended, but damn it, I’m hungry.)

    SEK (9e7eee)

  50. That’s ok thanks for telling me cause I have to do some errand things and I should take sleeping pills soon cause I want to go to the office early.

    happyfeet (6b707a)

  51. John, re your #43: you sure don’t hear me disagreeing with you. I’m on campus every day.

    Eric Blair (721b15)

  52. SEK,

    Good thing no one other than rabid conservatives is taking this silly stuff seriously.

    Remember that YouTube video with Ashton Kutcher and other celebrities? One Utah principal decided to show it to an assembly just days before Obama’s speech. Think there could be a connection?

    A school principal has apologized for showing a video at an assembly that a politically conservative group leader is calling “radical, leftist propaganda.”

    Children at Eagle Bay Elementary School in Farmington were shown a short video called “I pledge” on Aug. 28. The video opens with an image of President Barack Obama and part of a speech in which he says, “Let us summon a new spirit of patriotism, of responsibility where each of us resolves to pitch in and work harder and look after not only ourselves but each other.” The video then features celebrities making pledges about how they will help the president and the world — and that’s where some say the problem lies.
    ***
    Gayle Ruzicka, president of conservative Utah Eagle Forum, said the video was blatantly political. She said other offensive pledges included, “I pledge to be of service to Barack Obama,” “I pledge allegiance to the funk, to the united funk of funkadelica,” and pledges to not use plastic grocery bags and not flush the toilet after urinating.

    “It’s very inappropriate to show a radical, leftist propaganda piece that political to children,” Ruzicka said. “If parents want their children to learn about those things and do them in the home, wonderful, fine, but it’s not the place of the school to show a one-sided propaganda piece to children without parents knowing about it.”

    Ruzicka said she contacted local media about the video after receiving complaints from several parents. Ruzicka said she worried the video’s messages would confuse children whose parents might choose to use plastic bags when shopping or who want their children to flush the toilet after every use. Also she said she didn’t like a pledge “to be of service to Barack Obama” as he is here to serve Americans, not the other way around.

    DRJ (3f5471)

  53. oh. here is the link for Cap’n Ed for #46…

    happyfeet (6b707a)

  54. I don’t doubt that — but the anger over Obama talking to students doesn’t fall into that category.

    Sure it does. The specter of lesson plans telling students they should want to “help the President” doesn’t sit well with me — or with Erwin Chemerinsky, that liberal hack, who expressed his reservations on Hugh Hewitt’s show. He said he would be disturbed whether it was George H.W. Bush (who did something similar) or Obama — and I feel the same way.

    The fact that conservatives are worried that the President of the United States is going to tell students to worship Karl Marx is an indication that we’re in the silly season. If someone thinks that anything Obama’s proposed is sanctioned by Marxism, Stalinism, or communism, they’re reacting to outrage that’s been manufactured.

    Entertaining strawman, Scott. Now let’s deal with reality. I don’t want my kids thinking about how they can help the president, because I think what the president is doing is counterproductive. I want to help the country, and by *not* helping Obama, I think people will be helping the country.

    Obama wants to bury us in debt. I do not want to help him do that. And I do not want my kids told that they should want to help him do that.

    Patterico (cc3b34)

  55. oh. and this is a slightly better link for the “summer of service” that culminates next week

    happyfeet (6b707a)

  56. SEK:

    I’ve read the boilerplate statement to teachers of K through 6 and you know what? I recognize that it’s a boilerplate statement, not the second coming of The Communist Manifesto. As a teacher, I assure you that I get similar documents any time any government official interacts with students. All the language that has conservatives apoplectic is part of a very familiar template that’s wholly and utterly innocuous.

    I’m sure this is true, and the fact that you don’t see any problem with this is part of the problem.

    DRJ (3f5471)

  57. So is The One going to tell the children to stay in public school and they will be like him? because he certainly had the BENEFIT of private schools which his and his Democrat party is DENYING those children of color in DC. It is always the way with liberals that they want you to do it their way even though they do it differently and always better for themselves.

    Jaded (2dcf17)

  58. Ever notice, Patterico and DRJ, that members of the Left aren’t always very careful to consider how what they write might sound to people with whom they disagree—yet they themselves are exquisitely sensitive to a number of issues in the other direction?

    I believe that this is because they genuinely believe that they are correct in some cosmic sense. Thomas Sowell’s books come to mind. Oh well.

    Eric Blair (721b15)

  59. “I don’t doubt that — but the anger over Obama talking to students doesn’t fall into that category.”

    SEK – Here you go again with your condescending mind reading parlor tricks. How the fuck do you dare to speak about the anger out there if you are not angrt yourself? How the fuck do you dare declare the outrage manufactured when you are a supporter of the president.

    You are once again acting from the morally and intellectually superior lecturing position of someone who really does not understand who they are talking with but is all the more offensive by taking the position that they do. The “bow down before your elite liberal superiors” posture that you effect when you make appearances here is patently offensive to normal people. Your problem is that you do not see its offensiveness because you live in a bubble.

    daleyrocks (718861)

  60. The difference is, my common sense is still intact

    You’re a “lefty” and you have some common sense in that brain of yours? Miracles do happen!

    However, to give “progressives” like you a bit of leeway, I did watch a video of CNN’s Anderson Cooper challenging — rather convincingly — a Republican spokesman from Florida about his concern over Obama giving a speech to students. I also saw some articles from 2001 regarding George Bush going to a public school and asking kids to give him suggestions about managing the country.

    But just when I thought that giving some benefit of the doubt was a bit appropriate, DRJ comes up with text from a source that I also recall running across a few days ago. IOW, Obama and his ilk (who really are ultra-liberals) have such a sorry track record, that cynicsm and skepticism towards anything they have done or WILL DO is not a case of “silly” but a matter of common sense.

    I pledge to be of service to Barack Obama,” “I pledge allegiance to the funk, to the united funk of funkadelica,” and pledges to not use plastic grocery bags and not flush the toilet after urinating.

    Mark (411533)

  61. SEK does not see a problem with this stuff, and sees it as boilerplate, because it is in academia. Note how SEK’s rationale on the selected date is “evolving”, as opposed to admitting it was asspulling.

    Now, the shorter version of SEK would be STFU loser racists.

    JD (524c3d)

  62. That someone can say Barcky is a centrist without their head assploding is a testament to how far out on the Left someone is.

    JD (524c3d)

  63. ok ick.

    Ok that raises the bar for condescending tacky terror kitsch.

    This is overkill since we all already gots the Two Towers Franklin fucking Mint plate hung on our wall next to the Confederate flag don’t you think?

    happyfeet (6b707a)

  64. oh. filtrated again … I used a no-no word but it was very a lot warranted I thought and Mr. P used one today so I thought it would be okay

    happyfeet (6b707a)

  65. oh. there it is – just general site weirdness I guess –

    happyfeet (6b707a)

  66. SEK – You claim that the meme “anyone can grow up to be President” used to be a lie but is now truth due to Obama’s election.

    This is manifestly stupid. Obama’s election proves that it was the truth all along. Those that claim it is or was a lie are small minded bigoted idiots (of the liberal persuasion).

    Have Blue (854a6e)

  67. SEK – That is a very dishonest and insulting comment at #47. Usually you try to do better.

    The difference is, my common sense is still intact. – That’s right, nobody here has any common sense compared to you. Thank you for pointing it out. Except it’s plain from you comments you have not been following the evolution of the school talk debate as closely as others, with the deletions made to the original proposed content. Your definition of common sense, given that you consider Obama a centrist, is definitely suspect.

    The fact that Kennedy used the same language to sell the country on the Peace Corps – Dude, can’t you stick to Obama here. Focus. Alright, how nany people were in the Peace Corps at it’s peak? Compare that to Obama’s goal for a national service corps as big and as strong as the military. How do they compare? That’s crazy, right! He did drop the word mandatory from his discussion of the concept after the first time he brought it up because it sounded so extreme, so you have to give him credit for that.

    There have been too many bait-and-switch programs that were described one way and turned out to be something else entirely.

    Shall we begin with “compassionate conservatism” and an opposition to nation-buildling, or does your memory only go back eight months or so. – No, let’s not and just try to stay focused on Obama. You have resentments about Republicans and that’s your issue, deal with it. We’re talking about Obama here.

    Another evening of polysyllabic profundity and progressive (because he’s better than you) mind reading games with SEK. It’s like he thinks he’s inside the heads of conservatives or something! Wow! Step right up and watch and read in amazement.

    daleyrocks (718861)

  68. A plurality of the Dem base considers Dem officials the same as them, not more liberal and not more conservative.

    Democrat Base

    Republican Base

    Those two links say a lot. Doesn’t help much, but says a lot.

    John Hitchcock (3fd153)

  69. Obama’s a centrist. — Comment by SEK

    OMG. Hilarious! I just noticed that comment from SEK, and here I thought I was being too snarky when questioning his or her common sense.

    One has to be either dishonest or deluded (or both), and therefore painfully devoid of common sense, to look at all the particulars of Barack “Goddamn America” Obama and conclude he’s a centrist. That would no less inaccurate and dishonest as my characterizing George Bush or Ronald Reagan (or Rush Limbaugh) as “centrist,” even more so when the center of the sociopolitical divide has shifted left — but not as far left as Barack “I-love-Jeremiah-Wright, I-love-Van-Jones” Obama — over the past 50 years.

    Mark (411533)

  70. GWB is center-right and definitely not a conservative. He is more centrist than conservative.

    John Hitchcock (3fd153)

  71. “SEK – Here you go again with your condescending mind reading parlor tricks. How the fuck do you dare to speak about the anger out there if you are not angrt yourself? How the fuck do you dare declare the outrage manufactured when you are a supporter of the president.”

    – daleyrocks

    I’m angry – I’m pissed off at Obama, his advisors, and everyone in Congress (D or R). And I’m not a supporter of the president – I voted for him, but in hindsight I should’ve given pragmatism the bird and voted for Zombie Eugene V. Debs. I won’t make that mistake again.

    And, in light of that… this “outrage” strikes me as a truckload of manufactured BS.

    Whatever, though – it’s just the blind leading the blind, at this point. I don’t know why we even bother arguing about these things anymore… but I suppose I’ll keep at it until I come up with some kind of answer.

    Leviticus (f0edf9)

  72. He is more centrist than conservative.

    In the context of the 1950s or certainly 1940s that may have been closer to the truth or more accurate. But not today.

    The sociopolitical line between left and right has gotten so sloppy and broken-down over the past several decades, that to be a good liberal in today’s era requires one to, for example, support same-sex marriage. Over 40 years ago, to have been a good “progressive” required one to be a bit vocal over the ostracization of — and not even the outlawing of (since it no longer was a legal issue) — mixed-race couples.

    That’s why I don’t think I’m being too flippant when I theorize that in the future, centrists will be either docile or happy about the concept of same-sex marriage, while liberals — in order to earn their seal of approval — will have to be promoting the legalization and social acceptance of polygamy or open marriages.

    Mark (411533)

  73. “I’m angry

    And, in light of that… this “outrage” strikes me as a truckload of manufactured BS.”

    Leviticus – You’re in the SEK camp. Any anger which is not yours is not authentic and manufactured BS. Good position.

    daleyrocks (718861)

  74. Can I ask how one 10-15 minute speech is going to undermine everything you’ve taught your kids for years? You must think Obama has some amazing power.

    JEA (41f3a8)

  75. #28 Leviticus:

    Well said, SEK (#23).

    No, it wasn’t. It’s just SEK pulling crap out of his ass again and trying to serve it up as “sweet reason.”

    Barack Obama has, in an extremely short time in office, shown an utter disregard, a contempt rather, of the Constitution and the founding principles of the nation whose highest office he has been elected to. For SEK to characterize the reaction of the American (“a position of profound suspicion and absolute ignorance,”) as silly and unfounded is disingenuous dismissal of a host of well founded concerns.

    Further, the motivations of Presidents Bush and Obama are clearly different in addressing the nation’s students. For all of his shortcomings, President Bush was engaged in public service, recognizing that as his responsibility as an elected official; while President Obama is manifestly pushing the responsibility of public service off on others…in this case, on school children who are incapable of any meaningful contribution other than to massage his own ego.

    The moral difference between the two men is striking, and extremely unflattering to Obama.

    EW1(SG) (edc268)

  76. #74:

    You must think Obama has some amazing power.

    He has the bully pulpit of the Presidency of the United States.

    That is an amazingly powerful position of authority, enough so that a parent’s authority can be called into question when used to undermine that parent’s credibility with their children.

    However, it isn’t the single speech of a Marxist communist intent on undermining the foundations of our nation that are troubling, but the totality of influence wielded by such people in positions of power and perhaps more importantly, the useful idiots like you who have no ability to discern the importance of standing up for what is right.

    EW1(SG) (edc268)

  77. #75 EW1: That would be~

    characterize the reaction of the American public

    EW1(SG) (edc268)

  78. JEA decided to celebrate Labor Day by being a disingenuous twat. Have you read the speech? Do you know it is only 10-15 minutes, or have you joined SEK in progressive asspulling?

    I always giggle when I read JEA’s Leftist apologia, since it also likes to rail against partisan discourse, but only against one side.

    JD (0e5260)

  79. #28 Leviticus:

    Well said, SEK (#23).

    No, it wasn’t.

    EW1(SG) – It was well said, but you have to unpack it to realize that it is just the usual unsupported hyperpartisan lefty bullshit. Just sayin’.

    daleyrocks (718861)

  80. I was referring to SEK’s overall style, not the specific comment.

    daleyrocks (718861)

  81. As a teacher, I assure you that I get similar documents any time any government official interacts with students.

    Every time I read the manifesto from this “teacher” it gives me the creeps. No bias or thought- control tendencies from this one, eh?

    Dmac (a93b13)

  82. #80 daleyrocks:

    I was referring to SEK’s overall style, not the specific comment.

    I always find SEK’s style reminiscent of an AMC Gremlin all dressed up in lots of chrome and lights.

    EW1(SG) (edc268)

  83. “I always find SEK’s style reminiscent of an AMC Gremlin all dressed up in lots of chrome and lights.”

    EW1(SG) – Heh! Made on that highly efficient two story assembly line they used to have in Kenosha, Wisconsin.

    daleyrocks (718861)

  84. #83 daleyrocks:

    Heh! Made on that highly efficient two story assembly line…

    I suppose that those kinds of efficiencies are to be expected again, now that we have a “manufacturing czar.”

    I should also clarify that the Gremlin I picture under the chrome and lights has quite a number of miles on it. Rather like SEK’s tired old arguments that he attempts to trot out in new clothes.

    EW1(SG) (edc268)

  85. Paranoia: A psychological disorder characterized by delusions of persecution or grandeur. Reminds me of a group I know.

    The Emperor (0c8c2c)

  86. “Second, if you don’t believe that the outrage coming from both sides of the aisle is the concerted product of well-oiled political machines, you’re an idiot.

    Frankly, I long ago figured out who the idiots are. Repeating the White House’s falsehoods isn’t likely to cause me to exclude you from the list.

    SPQR (26be8b)

  87. “…trying to get students engaged with the idea of self-governan trying to get students engaged with the idea of self-governance…”

    How about this for a welcome change,
    one that would re-enforce the concept of a self-governing REPUBLIC:
    Each Monday Morning, they read from The Federalist Papers!

    It would be a new and unique experience, both for the students, and the instructors.

    AD - RtR/OS! (fad78f)

  88. But now it’s a tasty pill and Barack’s speech will for reals not make it any more tastier.

    Actually, it’s now more realistic because someone other than a white guy is in the White House. I’d wager that there are still many women who see that unbroken line of males and feel a pang or two when told they can grow up to President some day, Hilary or no.

    I think you underestimate how bitter a pill it is to swallow when you’re a kid of any sort of coloration and some foo on the tv tries to play you and you have to just sit there and watch cause you’re not allowed to make choices about watching or not watching.

    How is this different from every other exercise in an elementary, middle, or high school? They don’t want to be there when the police department comes to tell them how to safely cross the street, or when a local politician comes to talk to them about the importance of selling chocolate bars to help out the homeless shelter.

    Mr. SEK there’s a tension between these two statements because you have no idea what the scary man’s gonna say or ask the poor children to do either.

    There is; however, I’m not the one asserting that the President is going to say something terribly objectionable to political opponents. Not, as I noted earlier, that his political opponents won’t find something objectionable in it, but that’s because they were going to do that no matter how anodyne his statements were. (“He wants students to read more books?” “The libraries are full of communist propaganda!”)

    And I see now that I was correct.

    It’s the theme of the freaking week and this week is the culmination of a whole entire community organizey gayification of September 11 campaign.

    I don’t see AmeriCorps the way you do. Here are my local projects:

    Intern and Leader positions that focus on environmental education, watershed and trail restoration, volunteer outreach and management, and community stewardship.

    Community Alliance with Family Farmers works to educate the public about family farmings important role in society.

    VISTA helps implement our Community Based Mentoring Program, matching youth, aged 6- 18, with a caring adult mentor one on one.

    Bridging Borders involves 77 students and community members in service to immigrant communities focusing on the educational needs of students through literacy tutoring support.

    More than 200,000 CA children of prisoners are waiting for caring, adult mentors. Meet this need by serving as a VISTA member with the CA Statewide Mentoring Collaborative.

    I’m sure I’m just missing the nefarious there, but as these were programs that pre-date the Obama administration, I’m not sure why encouraging students to participate in them has anything to do with Washington-type politics. Not that I can’t anticipate the objections: “environmental education” is just another way of saying “going down on Al Gore,” but honestly, it’s not like the Forest Service’s outreach programs sprang into existence last January.

    The specter of lesson plans telling students they should want to “help the President” doesn’t sit well with me — or with Erwin Chemerinsky, that liberal hack, who expressed his reservations on Hugh Hewitt’s show.

    Now everyone’s concerned about a “specter”? The content doesn’t actually have to be objectionable so long as it’s haunted by the possibility that it might could be interpreted as such? Truth be told, that does accurately describe what went on here.

    I don’t want my kids thinking about how they can help the president, because I think what the president is doing is counterproductive.

    That depends on what he wants them to do. If it was “make good grades and read more books,” all you’re objecting to is a phrasing.

    I’m sure this is true, and the fact that you don’t see any problem with this is part of the problem.

    I got them when Bush was in office, DRJ, and you know what? They weren’t problematic then either.

    Here you go again with your condescending mind reading parlor tricks. How the fuck do you dare to speak about the anger out there if you are not angrt yourself? How the fuck do you dare declare the outrage manufactured when you are a supporter of the president.

    As to the first point, that’s plain silly: I’ve read what the angry people have written, so I understand why they’re angry. Reading what people write isn’t “mind reading” or a “parlor trick,” and refering to what people have written isn’t “condescending.”

    As to the second point, well, that’s plain silly too: I’ve read what the outraged people have written, and I understand why they’re outraged. I’ve been forwarded hundreds of emails from outraged conservatives that have made the rounds through church listservs — I’ve even heard one such email read aloud by a pastor in church — and that’s what they call “whipping people into a frenzy,” a phrase which suggests that they weren’t already as frenzied as they now are, i.e. their outrage has been manufactured.

    The “bow down before your elite liberal superiors” posture that you effect when you make appearances here is patently offensive to normal people.

    If by “bow down before your elite liberal superiors” you mean, “discuss disagreements in a calm fashion with people who are yelling and cursing,” then I suppose you’re correct. Of course, I always try to discuss disagreements with everyone in a calm fashion, because I don’t think yelling and cursing is all that productive. I take it you’re not offended because I’m not offended, or maybe you would rather I just yell and curse more?

    You’re a “lefty” and you have some common sense in that brain of yours?

    And it turns out my common sense was, in fact, common sensical. Funny how that works.

    Obama and his ilk (who really are ultra-liberals)

    Finally, someone seems able to tell the difference between ultra-liberals and socialists, communists, Marxists, and Stalinists. Someone needs to go tell Jonah, stat!

    SEK does not see a problem with this stuff, and sees it as boilerplate, because it is in academia. Note how SEK’s rationale on the selected date is “evolving”, as opposed to admitting it was asspulling.

    If it was boilerplate during the Bush years, I’m not sure how it can be typical of academia. Care to explain your “logic” here, JD?

    As to the date, the kids in my apartment complex certainly aren’t back in school yet, and I don’t start teaching until September 24th, and I know we get a late start. So yes, it seemed logical to me that it was the first day of school. That’s a minor point, I’ll concede I was wrong, and agree with you that it’s truly evil for Obama to be delivering this speech at the beginning of a long school year instead of the first day of school. Evil, I tell you, evil!

    You claim that the meme “anyone can grow up to be President” used to be a lie but is now truth due to Obama’s election. This is manifestly stupid. Obama’s election proves that it was the truth all along. Those that claim it is or was a lie are small minded bigoted idiots (of the liberal persuasion).

    I worded that a little oddly, but my general point remains: when black kids from the inner cities were told that they could grow up to President, it was met with rolled eyes and people muttering “bullshit” under their breath. When a half-white, half-black President with a funny name says, it’s going to sound different then when yet another wealthy white guy did.

    One has to be either dishonest or deluded (or both), and therefore painfully devoid of common sense, to look at all the particulars of Barack “Goddamn America” Obama and conclude he’s a centrist.

    From the far right, even the centrists look like pinkos. Doesn’t mean they are. Like I said, if you think that a technocratic pragmatist is (or even can be) anything other than center-something, you’ve got a problem with your perspective.

    SEK (9e7eee)

  89. Obama is not a technocratic pragmatist. Obama is not a pragmatist. Obama is a theocratic* idealistic history-denying ego-centrist. And that’s as close to centrist as he’ll ever get.

    *Obama-worship is a theocratic position, after all.

    John Hitchcock (3fd153)

  90. You see, SEK, beginning an argument with a false premise makes the entire argument unsound. You might want to try beginning an argument without your false premises some day.

    John Hitchcock (3fd153)

  91. there are still many women

    oh. That’s just the endless recursion of teh bitter. It’s a trap what ensnares many promising young progressives. Don’t let this happen to you.


    How is this different from every other exercise in an elementary, middle, or high school?

    I’m not defending public schools, but I think you should ask Mr. Barack Obama how his exhortations bring anything new to the table? Is the subtext of his speech that omg you suck you pathetic losers and need some pezzydential talking to Barack Obama style and if that don’t do the trick then I don’t know what’s to be done with you wankers? I think it might could be. Barack needs to fill in the blank of what the purpose of this nonsense was and what he hoped it would achieve.

    Benchmarks would be nice.

    I’m sure I’m just missing the nefarious there

    You’re missing my point on purpose Mr. SEK. My point is that the Obama was planning on using his captive little audience as an extension of his national service campaign for this week cause it’s the anniversary of September 11 and he wants that day to become synonymous with dirty socialist community organizing. It was a bad call and doofus got popped on his dirty socialist nose with a rolled up copy of Worker’s Daily and so he had to change the plan and go with the pablum they published today.

    oh. Good luck with the trail restoration. That’s so important to have good trails while your little country devolves into a vastly expanded coast to coast dirty socialist authoritarian version of Boys and Girls Clubs of America.

    oh. Personally I think electing a black person was neat and I’m glad we got that out of the way, but this particular one is very socialist and kind of stupid. My dream is that in my lifetime we’ll live to see the election of a not dirty socialist person of color what is smart. ooh. I’ve got that cool sorta sexy dreamy faraway look in my eyes I wish someone was here with a camera.

    happyfeet (6b707a)

  92. SEK:

    I’m sure this is true, and the fact that you don’t see any problem with this is part of the problem.

    I got them when Bush was in office, DRJ, and you know what? They weren’t problematic then either.

    It’s not about Bush or Obama or Clinton or Bush. It’s about a a President who thinks having inspiring teachers is more important than having teachers who know their subjects.

    It’s about an admissions-related test that devalues critical thinking and values a wrong answer that is well written. And, yes, I know teachers don’t like tests but the SAT and high school GPAs remain good indicators of college performance. If you want to challenge the SAT, there are similar or even better reasons to challenge high school GPAs — a result that would leave us solely with subjective impressions and diversity to govern college admissions.

    And it’s about an educational system that has presided over a towering decline in educational ability among its students. Here’s one opinion why this has happened that makes sense to me:

    For starters, can’t we all agree that genuine experts, making a sincere effort, would have our schools functioning at a higher level? Why, oh why, don’t our educators do a much better job?

    In the interest of brevity, let me just list the three most common answers given to that question:

    1. Our educators mean well but they get caught up in fads.
    2. Our educators have a lot of bad luck. Who could guess that all their wonderful ideas would have so many unintended consequences?
    3. A harsher theory is that our educators, alas, are nitwits. (Smart people, it’s often remarked, don’t go into Education.)

    The problem with all these theories is that, if true, we would see a greater range of outcomes. After all, there are thousands of these people. Now and then they’d have to get lucky; the law of averages would have to have its day. There’s only one problem with this: there are, it seems to me, no successful results, and no good ideas. All we see is a grinding mediocrity.

    It goes beyond a failure to find ideas that increase education; many have embraced ideas that are clearly destructive. Our experts really don’t seem all that interested in education as most people understand this term. Reading, writing, arithmetic, and geography, for example, don’t seem to be priorities. What we see in education makes sense only if we assume that our educators have an agenda we don’t know about, or that they are malevolent, or both.

    So what agenda, you’re wondering, are they actually focused on? What’s the answer to the mystery? Here is my deduction: that those at the top of the Education Industrial Complex, since the time of John Dewey, have been collectivists first, and educators second or third. The goal of creating an educated child was too often superceded by the goal of creating a cooperative child.

    DRJ (3f5471)

  93. DRJ, definitely #3. The easiest and most valueless doctorate is the education doctorate.

    SPQR (26be8b)

  94. SEK – That is just indicative of how fundamentally dishonest, racist, and sexist you routinely are. In your prior positions, you stated that it was the first day of school, and used that as a basis to justify Barcky giving the speech. Now, the very facts you made up, complete asspulls, are deemed minor and inconsequential, when they were previously a numerously stated justification for your own position. And, you are a disingenuous douchenozzle. Go back to Rich and Nurse Steel, who will unfailingly tell you how not dishonest you are.

    JD (329841)

  95. Here are six different links to my website which explain why I have no faith in Obama, liberals in general, the public indoctrination system in general, or the liberals who control the public indoctrination system.

    If you don’t want to follow each link from here but are interested, going to my site and entering “education” in my search bar will provide those links and others.

    And I suspect I’ll have to be like happyfeet and mourn over the temporary relegation of my comment to the spam-filter perdition.

    John Hitchcock (3fd153)

  96. Anxiety over the speech seems particularly high in Texas

    My friend what works in Kyle, Texas, which is fairly conservative, says at her elementary school where her son goes only 4 people opted out of the dirty socialist propaganda session what Barack Obama is going to do on them. They were given forms to send back if they didn’t want their kids messed with by Barack Obama.

    Four. That’s not very many.

    happyfeet (71f55e)

  97. While I was in school, “permission slips” changed over to “non-permission slips” where with the former, students were excluded from material if the parents did not give explicit approval, and with the latter, students were required to attend if the students never got the slips home to their parents.

    Minor change, huge difference. HUGE DIFFERENCE.

    John Hitchcock (3fd153)

  98. good point … the stupid Kyle school system of course had to choose to opt into dirty socialist propaganda power hour … so it might be that parents just aren’t sending their kids that day. I know I’d be pissed if my school system voluntarily chose to participate in a dirty socialist propaganda session. That’s really nasty and third worldy I think.

    In Texas parents are a lot aware that when your kid doesn’t show up, the school, which in this case is the dirty socialist Kyle school district, gets dinged on the money it gets. Cause of something I think they call average daily attendance is how schools get their monies.

    happyfeet (6b707a)

  99. That’s just the endless recursion of teh bitter. It’s a trap what ensnares many promising young progressives.

    It’s not endless, though, as you admit when you acknowledge that huge chunk of unrepresented folk no longer feel that resentment so strongly anymore.

    I’m not defending public schools, but I think you should ask Mr. Barack Obama how his exhortations bring anything new to the table?

    Again, I think you underestimate Obama’s appeal as a figurehead in minority communities. I’ve met countless people who disagree with Obama’s policies but can’t help but like what he represents as a measure not of theoretical progress–we could’ve had a black President for some time now–but tangible, I-can-see-it-on-my-television progress. Seeing a black man stand before the Presidential Seal is a powerful image for people who don’t belong to the group that every other President ever has belonged to. I don’t think you should underestimate the power of that appeal to motivate students.

    My point is that the Obama was planning on using his captive little audience as an extension of his national service campaign for this week cause it’s the anniversary of September 11 and he wants that day to become synonymous with dirty socialist community organizing.

    I don’t know, nor do you, what he was going to say. I assumed it was always going to be a bromide of this sort, but neither you nor I can claim that we know what he really was going to say before last week. I’d contend it was always this and you’d contend that it was something far more devious, I get that, but neither of us have evidence to stand on in this case. That said, the reason I listed the actual initiatives that the AmeriCorps are working on is precisely because they’re not socialist, crypto-socialist, or backdoor-socialist–they’re the sort of community programs that have been implemented for years on end, and they’re not the sort of stuff that most people find objectionable.

    I mean, I think I know you well enough to say that you wouldn’t object to students helping mentor and tutor the children of people currently incarcerated.

    That’s so important to have good trails while your little country devolves into a vastly expanded coast to coast dirty socialist authoritarian version of Boys and Girls Clubs of America.

    I don’t think that’s what’s going to happen. In fact, I’m not sure exactly how that even could. What sort of initiative do you think would inspire that, or is it just the notion of service itself? Because if you lived somewhere like, say, Israel, you’d have to do service as a teen, then military service as a young adult, and I don’t see many conservatives claiming that that’s some sort of proto-Nazi program.

    Obama is not a technocratic pragmatist.

    Yes, he is. Every overly cautious step he’s taken in his career proves as much. Put differently: I don’t doubt for a second that he approves of gay marriage, but because he’s a pragmatist, he’s not going to say that until it’s safe to do that; and because he’s a technocrat, he can console himself with the knowledge that the courts may work this through to his liking before he needs to take a public stance on the issue. That’s but one example among many.

    Obama-worship is a theocratic position, after all.

    People don’t worship Obama. The majority of actual leftists is, in fact, legitimately upset with him for having waffled on the public option. People may worship angry gods, but angry people don’t worship timid ones–which means that the only people deifying Obama are those on the right who are doing so on behalf of a leftist camp that doesn’t actually exist.

    It’s not about Bush or Obama or Clinton or Bush. It’s about a a President who thinks having inspiring teachers is more important than having teachers who know their subjects.

    The goalposts, they are a-shifting. Look, your complaint was about the language of the original guide sent out by the Obama administration. I pointed out that the language wasn’t one whit different than what went out when Bush was in office, and now it’s not about the language of the guide, but about this other thing that you’ve found to complain about. Which is all well and good–there are a million reasons to bemoan the state of the educational system in the US, but that wasn’t your original point. You seem to want to engage me in a completely different and only tangentially related argument, and I’m fine with that . . . but I’d like you to admit that so as to not provide ammunition to some of the lesser lights that stalk this place.

    That is just indicative of how fundamentally dishonest, racist, and sexist you routinely are.

    I’d like an antecedent for your “that,” JD. I’m not seeing where it’s coming from. Actually, I’ll make this into a challenge for you: I want you to find examples of the racist and sexist statements that I’ve made, and post links to them here. If you fail to do so, I’ll repeatedly link to this comment, and your failure to produce evidence of your insults, every single time I interact with you, just so people can see how baseless your characterization of me is. I wait, with baited breath, your list of indictments.

    In your prior positions, you stated that it was the first day of school, and used that as a basis to justify Barcky giving the speech. Now, the very facts you made up, complete asspulls, are deemed minor and inconsequential, when they were previously a numerously stated justification for your own position.

    I admitted I was wrong–something, I should add, I don’t think I’ve ever seen you do–and explained why I thought that. If you want to insist that my admission was part of some plan, and is indicative of a larger dishonesty on my part, I’m more than happy to leave that up to the jury. There was nothing malicious about my mistake–it was, plain and simple, a mistake based on what I understand about the schools over in my neck of the woods. That said, please, hammer away at me for all the awful things I’ve never said about you; for all the times I haven’t insulted you; for all the times I’ve given you the benefit of the doubt despite the fact that anyone who reads what you routinely write about me would rather I punched you in face, figuratively speaking . . .

    And, you are a disingenuous douchenozzle.

    Like, for example, right there.

    SEK (9e7eee)

  100. SEK:

    Seeing a black man stand before the Presidential Seal is a powerful image for people who don’t belong to the group that every other President ever has belonged to. I don’t think you should underestimate the power of that appeal to motivate students.

    You are so entertaining and I mean that sincerely, SEK. I’ve never seen anyone behind that Seal that looks remotely like me.

    DRJ (3f5471)

  101. I had to get a signed permission slip to watch “Romeo and Juliet” in school because there was a scene that showed Romeo’s butt and Juliet’s boobs. The next year, I had to get a signed non-permission slip to skip out on a health class covering “breast cancer awareness” because it showed boobs. I got the signed permission slip for the first, but the second never made it home.

    John Hitchcock (3fd153)

  102. Comment by DRJ — 9/7/2009 @ 7:30 pm

    More’s the pity!
    D-R-J! D-R-J! D-R-J!………….

    AD - RtR/OS! (fad78f)

  103. SEK:

    It’s not about Bush or Obama or Clinton or Bush. It’s about a a President who thinks having inspiring teachers is more important than having teachers who know their subjects.

    The goalposts, they are a-shifting. Look, your complaint was about the language of the original guide sent out by the Obama administration. I pointed out that the language wasn’t one whit different than what went out when Bush was in office, and now it’s not about the language of the guide, but about this other thing that you’ve found to complain about.

    I thought our conversation evolved into a discussion of education in general, but I’ll be glad to revisit my original point. Frankly, I never realized you were responding to it. Were you comparing George H.W. Bush’s call to students to help achieve the goals he identified to Obama’s call to help him as President? I think there is a difference — Bush identified his goals but Obama’s instructional materials were open-ended and asked how students can help him as President.

    But to the extent they were asking for the same thing, then I think both are wrong. If you think that’s okay, then I congratulate you on your trust in government.

    DRJ (3f5471)

  104. Why are you so violent, SEK?

    JD (329841)

  105. “…I congratulate you on your trust in government.”
    Comment by DRJ — 9/7/2009 @ 7:37 pm

    Damning with Faint Praise!
    I hate that.

    AD - RtR/OS! (fad78f)

  106. countless people who disagree with Obama’s policies but can’t help but like what he represents

    I don’t eat Frosted Flakes but that doesn’t mean I hate Tony the Tiger. Tony the Tiger isn’t a dirty socialist.

    I don’t know, nor do you, what he was going to say.

    The study guide was a clue … and scheduling it for the week of September 11, which is a day of Observance when America stops to remember that they should help their neighbors recycle, is very telling. I know this in my heart to be true. There’s no difference between scheduling a dirty socialist propaganda speech and any other kind of media planning, and believe you me everyone is very aware what they schedule that week.

    Obama is not a technocratic pragmatist.

    For reals Mr. SEK, I think his technocratic pragmatism takes a hit. A for real technocratic pragmatist who put his education pablum on the internet and let all the boys and girls what love him love him love him so download it and put it on their iPods so they could carry His Words with them at all times.

    But noooooooooooo…. Barack has to use the teevee and go for the Full Hugo. Ick. Televised addresses by Dear Leader are so not the future. Except for maybe in Barack Obama’s America. And Cuba. And Venezuela. oh. Probably North Korea and Iran too.

    happyfeet (6b707a)

  107. Let me proclaim very clearly on this highly-trafficked blogsite that I voted for Alan Keyes in the Ohio Republican Presidential Primary where the “get along/go along” candidate was clearly already the winner, and Keyes was clearly already a 10th-string candidate. I also voted for Buchanan when he was already the clear loser in his primary. I also voted for that TN “Law/Order” senator when he was a clear loser and also had already removed himself from candidacy.

    As I noted in “Raise Up A Child” and voluminous other occasions, “race” is a false divider of people. There is only one race, descendents all of one man and three sons. Since we are all related in one way or another, there is no such thing as “race” other than the human race. And any SEKs or lovies who claim otherwise, despite my redundant proof otherwise and despite “Black & Right” showing unassailable evidence of Democrat racism and lies, need my size-ten steel-toes to realign their teeth.

    John Hitchcock (3fd153)

  108. But more Scott is my sense of the last week or so. The dirty socialist media like the MSNBC and the CNN and the NPR were for reals seeming to be holding their breath. They would have been tipped off to some extent with respect to guidance on how best to cover Barack’s important speech to the schoolchildren … they knew this could break badly for Obama, and they didn’t know how to help him.

    Look at dirty socialist NPR

    They did ONE ohnoes story on 9/4… and then nothing until the White House gave them new talking points today… and they do SIX stories. SIX.

    My sense at the very least is that the dirty socialist media was sure as heck prepared for Obama to be cold busted getting his dirty socialist propaganda on with the kiddies. I think they knew very very well something wasn’t kosher.

    happyfeet (6b707a)

  109. I think that the subsequently removed portion of the peripheral materials provides insight as to what we could have expected from this historic and unprecedented speech had nobody objected.

    Apparently, SEK does not like the standards for calling people racists, sexists, homophobes, etc … that are employed, as a manner of routine, on his very own site. One of the threads on your site, one of the longer ones, consisted of Rich Puchalsky and Nurse Steel calling Patterico, happyfeet, and myself racists. I forget the silly word games you used, but it consisted of you saying you did not think we were racists, but wrote or said things that could be construed as racist. I truly used to enjoy and respect you, prior to that. Now not so much. If that makes you want to punch me in the face, you might consider restraining your violvent impulses.

    You asspull that Bush’s materials were no different than Barcky’s. I call asspull. Should you substantiate that, I will reconsider. People above, to all of the drive-bys that have squawked out that talking point, have demonstrated the fundamental and significant differences between Bush’s speech and Barcky’s.

    I weep that I have lost your respect. I am overcome with the vapors. What ever will I do? How will I go on?

    JD (329841)

  110. oops

    that should have been

    A for real technocratic pragmatist *would* put his education pablum on the internet…

    happyfeet (6b707a)

  111. SEK – You have an interesting definition of outrage being manufactured – a pastor increasing the level of outrage to a notch higher than it was before.

    Excuse me for presume that you were claiming it was not real, because certainly the hundreds of emails people forwarded you on church listservs must be authentic and not manufactured.

    I receive an email at least every other day from the Obama campaign, excuse now it’s the DNC, trying to stoke my outrage at the opponents of ObamaCare and various other outrages. I call that manufacturing outrage. I have received nothing from any Republican or conservative sources. But as you point out, I must be an idiot for not believing they are involved somewhere. I did not see them present at Jan Schakowsky’s town hall here in Skokie.

    I don’t believe you have disclosed having any kids, so the issue of liberal indoctrination at schools probably is not as personal to you as others here, especially with your political views. Having Junior come home and repeat lies told about George Bush and the Iraq War by his teacher at school, bullshit about global warming by nonscientist Al Gore, or the wonders of socialist Barack Obama is a deprogramming chore. Obviously you don’t see that as a problem or have not been exposed to it. I have as have many others on this blog and around the country.

    Obama was tone deaf in proposing this speech with the original lesson plan and without specifying his message. He has lost credibility with a majority of Americans. Now that he’s released the content, it seems harmless.

    daleyrocks (718861)

  112. DRJ: the gentleman doesn’t trust government. He trusts THIS one. But not to worry. People like him will be doing some very entertaining apologetics in the coming months. Think hyperintellectual limbo.

    Eric Blair (2c1e5e)

  113. Is hyperintellectual limbo anything like partisan mental contortions?

    JD (329841)

  114. “I weep that I have lost your respect.”

    JD – How will you be able to live with yourself?

    daleyrocks (718861)

  115. I am going to go take something from a neighbor, donate someone else’s money to Organizing for America, and buy some carbon offsets from algore, to see if I can get back in his good graces.

    JD (329841)

  116. #113 JD:

    Is hyperintellectual limbo anything like partisan mental contortions?

    Yeah, but I think one is more reggae than salsa/meringue.

    Not to be attempted while you are weeping, though.

    EW1(SG) (edc268)

  117. Man, the “limbo” always reminds me of an AFV “teaser” during their shows. An entertainer does the “limbo” under a lit bar, then puts out an accidentally strategically-placed fire.

    I guess that’s a fitting image for the contortions the libturds are doing.

    John Hitchcock (3fd153)

  118. “Not to be attempted while you are weeping, though.”

    If you want to weep some more, ask SEK to read some of those emails from the church listserv.

    daleyrocks (718861)

  119. RW1(SG) – Reggae? Is that a code word or something?

    Hey, did you know we had a black president?

    daleyrocks (718861)

  120. #119 daleyrocks:

    Reggae? Is that a code word or something?

    I thought it was a musical style, but who knows?

    Hey, did you know we had a black president?

    We do? Bloody hell, he seems like a Red to me.

    EW1(SG) (edc268)

  121. […] objected to Obama’s proposed speech to schoolchildren, labeling the objections as everything from silly to paranoia. Compare that to the Democrats’ after-the-fact reaction to a similar speech by President George […]

    Obama gives speech to kids: those who oppose it are insane. Bush gives speech to kids: GAO investigation and a Congressional hearing called « Are you Freaking Stupid? (88a07c)


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