Patterico's Pontifications

9/11/2008

Charlie Gibson, Probably Innocently, Distorts Palin’s Prayer

Filed under: 2008 Election,General — Patterico @ 6:53 pm

In the first segment of his interview with Sarah Palin, Charlie Gibson seriously distorted the meaning of a prayer Palin said about Iraq. I don’t blame Gibson for this; I believe he reasonably relied on an Associated Press story that cut off Palin’s quote in a highly misleading fashion. I hope that Gibson will go back and look at Palin’s original remarks, and clarify the record in a future segment.

Here’s the relevant exchange:

GIBSON: You said recently, in your old church, “Our national leaders are sending U.S. soldiers on a task that is from God.” Are we fighting a holy war?

PALIN: You know, I don’t know if that was my exact quote.

GIBSON: Exact words.

PALIN: But the reference there is a repeat of Abraham Lincoln’s words when he said — first, he suggested never presume to know what God’s will is, and I would never presume to know God’s will or to speak God’s words.

But what Abraham Lincoln had said, and that’s a repeat in my comments, was let us not pray that God is on our side in a war or any other time, but let us pray that we are on God’s side.

That’s what that comment was all about, Charlie.

GIBSON: I take your point about Lincoln’s words, but you went on and said, “There is a plan and it is God’s plan.”

This is a distortion of what Palin said. Palin didn’t say the war was a task from God. She said: pray that the war is a task from God. She didn’t say the war was God’s plan. She said: pray that it is God’s plan. In other words, pray that we are carrying out God’s will.

Here’s the accurate quotation, from the Huffington Post, complete with a clip:

“Pray for our military men and women who are striving to do what is right. Also, for this country, that our leaders, our national leaders, are sending [U.S. soldiers] out on a task that is from God,” she exhorted the congregants. “That’s what we have to make sure that we’re praying for, that there is a plan and that that plan is God’s plan.”

Just as Palin said in her interview with Gibson, Palin is clearly praying that the U.S. plan is God’s plan. In other words, as she said to Gibson: “let us pray that we are on God’s side.”

As Hot Air pointed out last Thursday, however, the Associated Press quoted Palin’s prayer this way:

Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin told ministry students at her former church that the United States sent troops to fight in the Iraq war on a “task that is from God.”…

“Our national leaders are sending them out on a task that is from God,” she said. “That’s what we have to make sure that we’re praying for, that there is a plan and that plan is God’s plan.”

Allahpundit explained the problem:

What’s missing from the AP’s version? Right — the beginning of what she said, the part that makes clear she’s not asserting that we’re doing God’s will but simply praying that we are. It’s the difference between me saying “McCain will win” and “I pray McCain will win.” The first is an assertion of fact/secret knowledge, the second is an expression of desire/hope. The AP actually stoops to picking up the quote mid-sentence to make it better fit the stereotype of the holy-roller yokel claiming divine inspiration for Bush’s Crusade.

As I have pointed out, Palin’s prayer was in the tradition of speeches by past leaders, such as FDR during World War II. This is still a largely religious country, and a leader praying that we carry out God’s will is simply not startling at all. Claiming that Iraq is a “task from God” would be different — but Palin didn’t do that. Gibson suggested she did — but she didn’t.

Readers may not be as charitable as me, but I’m going to give Gibson the benefit of the doubt and assume that he didn’t know he was distorting Palin’s prayer. You have to have been paying attention pretty closely to know what the AP did; if you weren’t reading Hot Air or a similar site, you could easily be misled by the AP spin. I can’t tell you how many friends of mine have misunderstood what Palin said, and have told me that they were disturbed that Palin was claiming that Iraq was a task from God.

She didn’t. Yet Charlie Gibson has, in effect, told the country that she did.

I sincerely hope that Gibson will go back and look at the original language Palin used, and will correct the record, so that the AP‘s distortion of Palin’s prayer is not compounded by its repetition in what is sure to be one of the most widely watched programs of the campaign.

UPDATE: I have now watched the segment and part, but not all, of the relevant quote from her statement in church is set forth. It’s cut off, however, at the end of the phrase “on a task that is from God.” Thus, it omits the context showing that the phrase about “God’s plan” was a prayer — not a statement — that we are carrying out God’s plan. The net effect is wholly unfair and should really be corrected.

UPDATE x2: Every single observation in this post was made first by Allahpundit. I’m just highlighting this one because I think it deserves highlighting.

UPDATE x3: Via Ace we learn that ABC edited out a) Palin’s objection that Gibson’s initial quote was incorrect, and b) Gibson’s riposte: “Exact words.” They also (as I noted in my first update) included the full “Task from God” quote. I just went back and looked at the tape, and this is true.

But it doesn’t correct Gibson’s misleading quote: “I take your point about Lincoln’s words, but you went on and said, ‘There is a plan and it is God’s plan.’” That was left in, and it was wrong. She said: “That’s what we have to make sure that we’re praying for, that there is a plan and that that plan is God’s plan.” Very different.

161 Responses to “Charlie Gibson, Probably Innocently, Distorts Palin’s Prayer”

  1. All I know is if Andrew Sullivan is saying this:

    I just read it. I’m not sure how to respond because I believe the entire last two weeks have been a farce, and ABC News is now an integral, enabling part of that farce. It’s also unfair to judge a partial interview, because Gibson has so far asked no questions about her record as governor or mayor, and none of the tough questions that a press conference would ask.
    Maybe that is to come. So I will reserve judgment until I’m able to watch and read the entire interview. All I have learned thus far is that a McCain administration would be prepared to go to war with Russia over Georgia and will never, ever criticize or oppose any decision made by the government of the state of Israel. And I knew that already. http://andrewsullivan.theatlantic.com/the_daily_dish/2008/09/the-gibson-inte.html

    Then Sarah Palin had a pretty good night.

    Oh yeah, McCain is a shameless liar according to Sully. I guess it takes one to know one.

    Joe (8102a5)

  2. Patterico – I am not as magnanimous as you. He followed up his original misquote with “exact quote”, referencing his truncated and out of context quote. It was predictable. Damn godbothering the-neo-cons.

    JD (6a8c0a)

  3. What happened to Charles Gibson’s layers and layer of fact-checking? Too good to check?

    If indeed his mistake was innocent, it also bespeaks what a bubble he lives in, that not a single person in his circle knew enough to inform him of the truth beforehand.

    ras (fc54bb)

  4. I’d just like to get Palin to acknowledge that this war might NOT be god’s plan. She keeps insisting she’s not saying it IS God’s plan. I’d like her to tell us whether she can admit the converse — that it might not be. Just because she and McCain are always so cock-sure that we have to have “victory.” What if “victory” isn’t part of God’s plan?

    Phil (3b1633)

  5. I’m going to give Gibson the benefit of the doubt and assume that he didn’t know he was distorting Palin’s prayer.
    .
    He seemed completely sure of himself. “Exact words,” he asserts. And why ask the question in the first place? His phrasing comes off as though he assumes she has asserted “The US is on a mission from God.” Starting with that assumption, what should his research duty consist of? Just accepting an AP report as complete? He’s not that stupid, to trust an AP report as complete, including all relevant context.
    .
    I’m not giving him the benefit of the doubt. He’s counting on the public to remain ignorant of the full context, etc. He may admit he’s been criticized for parts of how he handled the interview, but I doubt he’ll make a point of a full and direct correction – and why should he? [he may reason] Palin corrected him in the course of the broadcast interview.

    cboldt (3d73dd)

  6. “I sincerely hope that Gibson will go back and look at the original language Palin used, and will correct the record… The net effect is wholly unfair and should really be corrected.”

    I hope you’re not holding your breath waiting for this to happen. Just as street hookers charging $20* and call girls getting $1,000 an hour* are both prostitutes, while Charlie Gibson may not be as bad as some other reporters, he is still a member in good standing of the MSM and, as such, is genetically incapable of playing it fair with GOP candidates.

    * so I’ve been told.

    stevesturm (b68da4)

  7. IMHO, if it was innocent, it will get corrected by Gibson, and prominently, in an on-the-air apology.

    If Gibson and ABC remain silent or give it some sort of Page 19 style correction, I feel we can reasonably conclude that it was less than innocent.

    jim2 (03b0ae)

  8. I thought it was a real sneer-a-thon. It was like a high school history teacher grilling an F student. And today a big article in TNR on what a hero Biden is to women!

    I would tell the media to all go to hell, but nobody cares what they say, anyway.
    Biden article

    Patricia (ee5c9d)

  9. Patterico,

    Generosity is a virtue, but I agree with JD and cboldt. Gibson was not as generous in listening to Palin protest as you are with him.

    MD in Philly (3d3f72)

  10. I only saw part of it and my g/f saw all of it and she hates Sarah more than ever for her aggressive, warlike tendencies. The part I saw showed her as a pitbull with prickliness. Not a very nice person.

    And really she meant ‘God’ was on her side with the emphasis. No one prays for something they don’t believe in already.

    Her handlers need to calm her down. McCain actually did much better than her on CNN. And Obama was relaxed and funny too.

    datadave (eb12a5)

  11. datadave, nice misrepresentation of the interview.

    SPQR (26be8b)

  12. I don’t think it was at all innocent. The whole interview struck me as a series of (unsuccessful) attempts by Gibson to elicit gotchas.

    Xrlq (62cad4)

  13. I’d just like to get Palin to acknowledge that this war might NOT be god’s plan. She keeps insisting she’s not saying it IS God’s plan. I’d like her to tell us whether she can admit the converse — that it might not be. Just because she and McCain are always so cock-sure that we have to have “victory.” What if “victory” isn’t part of God’s plan?

    Comment by Phil — 9/11/2008 @ 7:18 pm

    I hope you are smart enough to be able to parse the actual quote:

    “Pray for our military men and women who are striving to do what is right. Also, for this country, that our leaders, our national leaders, are sending [U.S. soldiers] out on a task that is from God,” she exhorted the congregants. “That’s what we have to make sure that we’re praying for, that there is a plan and that that plan is God’s plan.”

    The key is the word “Pray: – i.e., she does not the intention of God or what his plans are.

    Also read the last sentence of her full quote, try not to move your lips too much, and there’s your answer.

    Dr. K (5139b5)

  14. datadave needs to calm down but maybe his talking points don’t have the words right. Maybe it’s an innocent mistake. Riiiight !

    I think Gibson is honorable and will correct it in the next interview. He has been banished by the Democrats for showing how ignorant Obama is on capital gains taxes so he has nothing to lose.

    I do think he is showing his bias in asking her about whether she is ready.

    Mike K (2cf494)

  15. Phil – She never said it was God’s plan. But you choose to ignore that, being easier to argue against something she did not say.

    JD (6a8c0a)

  16. To Gibson’s “exact quote” punchback, Palin should have punched back again, “no, it isn’t.” Challenge him. Why not? What a miserable performance by a major network anchor.

    Anyone who thinks the entire MO of this, or any network interview, is anything but a “Palin takedown” is deluded.

    And if one-half of the American audience is one-tenth as sick of the pathetically, churlishly, condescendingly, arrogantly, irremediably biased media as I am, this election could be a watershed.

    rrpjr (fb0748)

  17. datadave is a full-on howl-at-the-moon barking twatwaffle.

    JD (6a8c0a)

  18. Phil – She never said it was God’s plan.

    No, JD, she didn’t say “this war is God’s plan.” She said “Pray this war is God’s plan.”

    Because, you know, she doesn’t want God to have some OTHER plan that doesn’t include a war. That wouldn’t be any fun.

    Phil (3b1633)

  19. Phil – When you argue in good faith, I will be happy to engage you. Until then, we will all be killing, torturing, jailing or oppressing minorities.

    JD (6a8c0a)

  20. We lurvs us some war, Phil.

    JD (6a8c0a)

  21. “First off, we’re going to continue good relations with Saakashvili there. I was able to speak with him the other day and giving him my commitment, as John McCain’s running mate, that we will be committed to Georgia. And we’ve got to keep an eye on Russia. For Russia to have exerted such pressure in terms of invading a smaller democratic country, unprovoked, is unacceptable and we have to keep…

    GIBSON: You believe unprovoked. ”

    anyone who knows the situation knows that the Georgians provoked this and the US did too. We’re in the Russian’s backyard and of course they are provoked. S. attacked the separatists like the Serbs attacked Kosovars. And Putin came to the Russian ethnic’s rescue as expected. Palin doesn’t know the history or have the depth to deal with this….

    She comes across as crazed and nasty with her repetitions of “I will not blink.” She’s only shot mooses, wolves and bears and such which don’t have nucs to fire back. A bully is all I see.

    Gibson was picked as the lightest weight of interviewers out there. Pretty tame performance. I like that Gibson did notice her obstrufication….”that was a blizzard of words there” “is that a yes?” so at least he’s trying to be a journalist. Haven’t even dealt with the Bridge to Nowhere yet??

    Sarah granted is never for a lose of words.

    just to give an opposition view of this for later discussion….

    datadave (eb12a5)

  22. jd, go back to bed with Goldstein will ya…outta our face with your lack of depth and need for insults.

    datadave (eb12a5)

  23. I’m sure Gibson will get to her kids – or grandkids – soon.

    steve miller (dcbd46)

  24. Patterico,
    I have the same contempt for Charles Gibson and ABC that you have for the LA Times. I give Gibson no benefit of the doubt. His misuse of “exact quote” is either intentional or negligent. Either way wrong. Mainstream media are on the way out.
    Infidel

    Infidel (56a0a8)

  25. datadave, you are quite wrong. The Russians provoked the incident, not Georgia and not the US. South Ossetia is not in Russia’s backyard. It is in their neighbor’s backyard. And Russia does not have any legitimate reason to invade Georgia. And there is no moral reason to claim that Russia was in the right, which is why Palin – who has far superior moral sense than you – did not.

    SPQR (26be8b)

  26. Folks, you will enjoy datadave. He will give you a lesson on Russia, class warfare, and basic socialism. Then, he will start drinking. Hilarity ensues.

    JD (6a8c0a)

  27. FWIW – datadave managed to get himself banned at PW, which is no small feat. That puts him in pretty select twatwaffle company.

    JD (6a8c0a)

  28. I don’t like Putin.. a man GW said he had a special relationship with and I am sure the Russians are doing detestable things like “Ugly Russians do”. … but Georgia except for a few years in the 1920s had been a province of Russia for nearly two centuries. The two places contested in Russia are almost exclusively inhabited by Russians and I know from experience that Russians have been dealt with badly by the new ‘stans’ after the breakup of the USSR. For many reasons the Russians can’t leave their homes in the newly minted ‘Georgia’ and since they are the dominate ethnic there why should they…so they wish to do a Kosovar thing.

    We encouraged the breakup of Yugoslavia…so why shouldn’t the Russians defend their own in Georgia’s ‘breakaway provinces’…

    Let them go. We’re for Balkanization aren’t we?

    datadave (eb12a5)

  29. Going by their comments, the trolls are drowning their election sorrows early tonight, so I guess that means Palin did well. Sleep it off, trolls, sleep it off.

    ras (fc54bb)

  30. West Coasters are reporting that the ABC broadcast out there did not include the Gibson follow up question, including his claim that those had been her exact words.

    So, they know now that they were busted.

    What will they do?

    jim2 (03b0ae)

  31. jim2 – Straight down the memory hole with that one.

    JD (6a8c0a)

  32. datadave,

    Russia provoked the invasion. They are past masters of maskirovka, and this is just another example. Most of the early reports came from Russian sources and have been retracted or disproven. There was no “genocide” or “ethnic cleansing” as they claimed as part of their justification. The attacks began two days before Georgia moved into S Ossetia to try to block the tunnel. The Russian forces HAD to be preplaced to come through that tunnel on the schedule they did.

    And there has been a recent quote out of State that we knew in before the “invasion” (probably back on day -2) that it was coming.

    Give our media a choice of getting their story from DC or Alaska and they choose DC every time. Make that choice between Moscow and Tblisi and do the math. Georgia is flyover country too.

    Dan S (ca8a95)

  33. McCain did go on tonight about American Exceptionalism. Sarah is exactly that: no empathy for anyone other than herself or the other white Christians in the new Private Idaho where large families can live off the Oil money at 3200 a head per year. Sarah’s family gets 22400 a year just for being there..and land and housing costs are pretty cheap in Wasilla. At least McCain’s done some living outside the box…or in the box rather in ‘Nam.

    She can see Russia from an island in Alaska she said……whoa, that’s ‘understanding’. I will admit Sarcasm as this a pro-Sarah site so I must be empathic. I like that she exercises regularly and looks good doing it along some lake near her home.

    We must not blink!

    datadave (eb12a5)

  34. Wow, if this troll doesn’t get attention soon, he’s gonna chew his own leg off. No feeding, guys!

    ras (fc54bb)

  35. Yeah, if you don’t blink, eventually your eyes dry out completely and you go blind.

    Phil (3b1633)

  36. Why can’t we defend the southern Sudanese, who are often Christians from devastation. Again ‘flyover’ country?

    Why Georgia? Because we want war? It seems so as one of McCain closest advisors is a registered lobbyist for ‘Georgia’.

    Again, no one is looking at this from a Russian viewpoint. We are sticking a needle in their eye yet again with the several billion in military aid to a nation that’s run by some hubris-filled self important ‘elite’ who’s human rights record according to human right’s activists is only slightly better than Putins.

    Let them be like the Sudanese…or is it the oil pipeline we are defending??

    datadave (eb12a5)

  37. But we can talk to each other about the trolls, right in front of them, as if they don’t even matter. Drives ‘em crazy.

    Narcissistic little buggers, ain’t they?

    ras (fc54bb)

  38. “Wow, if this troll doesn’t get attention soon, he’s gonna chew his own leg off. No feeding, guys!”

    thx.

    I wanted to end with a yahoo waving the white flag as it gets tiring laying your arguments to bed.

    back to P’s original idea.

    IMO “Pray” isn’t in the crucial middle sentence “Charlie” quoted. She did say the ‘war’ is God’s plan as our leaders said it was. Nuance it all you want with her first and third inclusion of ‘pray’ but no one prays for a unasked question she was praying for the troops to win this thing!! So be it. I hope so. Allah be blessed. Or Mars bestows his blessings upon the MIC.

    g’nite. Nuance, more nuance…and it’ll be like Obama.

    datadave (eb12a5)

  39. Just watched the Palin “interview”.

    Frighteningly pathetic.

    Did it make every feel confident with her being Pres?

    Good God! Holy bejesus!

    Embarrassing to our great country. Thoughts?

    jharp (a28e4a)

  40. I am livid!

    There has been plenty of time for ABC to post a retraction and apology by Gibson, written AND in video form.

    Given how lightning quick news cycles are, the correction can’t wait for the next sunrise.

    She spoke a profound prayer and was mocked by Gibson. Ignorantly or not, he mocked her. By this time, it is no longer in ignorance. It is a willful distortion.

    The campaigns need to come out with both friggin’ barrels blazing! To me, this is worse than what that tramp Fowler in SC said yesterday. At least we all know her bias. Gibson and ABC claim none. He/they took a side.

    Ed (f35a20)

  41. Look, the trolls are starting to squirm already! Good attention, bad attention, it’s all the same to a troll … but no attention at all is the worst thing we can hit them with. It’s like withdrawal to a junkie.

    ras (fc54bb)

  42. Never forget that ABC is as far left and anti-american as any network other than NBC and NBC hides a lot of their anti-american talking heads and outright communist on other outlets, PMSNBC and the like. I locked ABC out on my TV and would lock NBC out if not for the local news/sports.

    What happened to the drive of American women who demanded equal rights including the right to rear a family and work any job at equal pay? I guess that now only applies to some women have equal rights. I think I have listened to a bunch of lying equal rights women for the past 25 years, so now we can ignore them and hire who we want and most of the time it won’t be a female higher than secretary based on how they treat Sarah Palin. They want to fight about it just point out their actions against a well qualified woman entering national politics. Even the good old boys in Alaska didn’t try to destroy her (other than the sore losers she showed the door) like the left wing females in the lower 48 have, but accepted her for the job she had done and approve of her at over an 80% rate. Woman right groups will do little damage to Palin but are destroying themselves for the next 50 years. This will come up in the future. Why would we now accept them as equals in anything. We can adapt Hussein O’s Islamic teachings (faith admitted on national TV) and never show respect for any female and start changing laws to take away their rights.

    Scrapiron (c36902)

  43. ras – It really is an entertaining troll. It will keep ramping up teh krazy. It will declare itself a victor in a debate that was only going on in his head.

    She did say the ‘war’ is God’s plan as our leaders said it was.

    Yet another demonstrable lie.

    JD (6a8c0a)

  44. Just watched the Palin “interview”.

    Frighteningly pathetic.

    Did it make every feel confident with her being Pres?

    Good God! Holy bejesus!

    Embarrassing to our great country. Thoughts?

    Thoughts? I though that I was not the least bit surprising that you would describe it as frighteningly pathetic, or embarassing. Pray tell what led you to such a learned reasoned position.

    JD (6a8c0a)

  45. Thoughts? I thought that I was not the least bit surprised … sorry for the typos.

    JD (6a8c0a)

  46. Scrapiron,

    I suspect that for the current crop of self-described feminists, they’re just in it to condemn others and thereby proclaim their own superiority; any old excuse will do and if not feminism then something else would suffice. Much like trolls, actually.

    I blame the unearned self-esteem movement. It teaches a false confidence, a narcissistic mask, rather than genuine effort and accomplishment. Kinda like junk food for the soul, it forces the good stuff out.

    ras (fc54bb)

  47. As the open thread has gone off-topic, I’ll cross-post:

    A few more interviews like that and she may end up where Dan Quayle did… which I’m pretty sure was an office in the White House.

    Mostly because swing voters ultimately don’t vote based on a VP pick, and certainly not based on a single interview on a single network. Conservatives will still love her, Libs will will still hater, same as before. Most mushy middle people won’t have seen it or will have moved on well before Nov.

    In the meantime, let’s burn a few more news cycles on Palin and the relative experience of Obama, please. Because that’s been workin’ really well for Camp Obama.

    Karl (1b4668)

  48. JD,

    Please don’t feed the trolls. And besides, you will learn *much* more about them by joining me in my latest “ignore them” campaign. And by understanding them better, you can defeat them more easily.

    Talk about them, but not to them, if you would. Thx.

    ras (fc54bb)

  49. Thoughts? I though that I was not the least bit surprising that you would describe it as frighteningly pathetic, or embarassing. Pray tell what led you to such a learned reasoned position.

    Comment by JD — 9/11/2008 @ 8:39 pm

    The question about the Bush doctrine.

    she had no idea what it was, meant, or whether she was for it or against it.

    A national embarrassment. And a dam poor choice for VP

    Get real. Was this really the most qualified candidate?

    jharp (a28e4a)

  50. The rabid attack Palin Press corps has a new name:
    Liberal Fascist Journalistic Nazi Stormtroopers. Charlie Gibson might be well refined, but he is still a Liberal Fascist Journalistic Nazi Stormtrooper. His whole attitude was “how can you be serious lady.” He was trying as hard as he could to get a “gotcha” moment. When he asked her about the Bush Doctrine I also wondered what aspect of it he was referring to, his question was too general. All in all chalk one up for Sarah Palin, she looked strong and confident. Don’t hold your breath for a correction on Charlie’s misquote — even if he wants to, his Field Marshall producers vill say NEIN! NO CORRECTION. The quote vas accurate (even though ve cut out de prelude dat puts it all into focus, zee qvote vas accurate! Zieg Heil Punch S.

    J. Raymond Wright (0440ef)

  51. See! It needs to proclaim its superiority by denigrating others. If it doesn’t get a reply, how can it tell you even noticed? This is textbook narcissism.

    I also sometimes wonder, and maybe some of you have more background than I, if a borderline personality is just a “failed” narcissist, one who tries to live behind a narcissistic mask, but where the mask fails from time to time and the guilt/shame overwhelms them. Any ideas? Intermittent serotonin uptake, perhaps?

    ras (fc54bb)

  52. ras

    The question about the Bush doctrine.

    she had no idea what it was, meant, or whether she was for it or against it.

    Do you know what the Bush Doctine is?

    I wonder if the Dems thought that Baracky was the most qualified Presidential candidate? Or if Joey Hairplugs was the best VP candidate.

    JD (6a8c0a)

  53. Innocent is the wrong word. This is gross negligence.

    ABC probably has a dozen interns who read left-wing blogs. They can’t hire one intern who reads right-wing blogs, to fact-check them from the other side of the political spectrum? This is Gibson’s own fault for wearing partisan blinders.

    Daryl Herbert (4ecd4c)

  54. jharp,

    I’m glad she can speak in complete sentences … unlike, well, uh, you know.

    DRJ (7568a2)

  55. Treacher has a sneak peek at the next segment of the interview.

    Karl (1b4668)

  56. For those who are upset about Charlie Gibson’s interview, why not go to his blog and leave a polite comment?

    DRJ (7568a2)

  57. um … well … gazes towards the heavens … um … you know … um … DRJ … you know … that was pretty damn racist of you.

    JD (6a8c0a)

  58. DRJ,

    You’re feeding it. Tough to break the habit, I know, but it’s for the best. Even negative attention is still attention.

    I’ve done this before. If we all stop, the trolls get more and more reasonable until you can even – well, sometimes – have a proper conversation with them. But till then, we mustn’t be enablers.

    ras (fc54bb)

  59. Solid performance for Governor Palin. Charlie botched the prayer question – he should have stayed away from that one since it was obvious he didn’t do his homework.

    Considering that over the past year, Senator Obama has considered invading Pakistan, talking to Iranian leaders without preconditions, issued confusing statements regarding Russia’s invasion of Georgia, whether Jerusalem should be undivided and whether the surge constituted a miliarty success, I’d say everyone in this election is getting up to speed over issues that McCain already understands.

    rick (60d341)

  60. Hell, I’ve been getting the (mimeo) newsletter for years now, and I still don’t know what the “Boosh Doctrine” is.

    Did I miss a mimeo somewhere?

    EW1(SG) (993079)

  61. My 2 cents,

    Obama made a brilliant pick with Biden for VP.

    Qualified? Yes/ Appeal to the independants? yes.

    And best of all

    It induced McCain to pick a completely unqualified running mate to try to woe the Hilliary voters.

    Excellent work. President Obama!

    jharp (a28e4a)

  62. “Pray that our side has a clue” ≠ “Our side is on a Mission From God

    Al (b624ac)

  63. Gibson was attacking her. He doesn’t care what the facts are. Didn’t he do a primary debate and asked one of these dem yahoos a semi hard question and he was almost driven out of business? I think he is trying to redeem himself from that debacle. And just wait for the debates. The moderators are going to try to tear McCain and Palin to shreds. Obama and Biden will need all the help they can get. And another thing I’ve noticed. Obama always saying something outrageous just to keep crap flying and to NOT talk about what’s important the issues. The day after the lipstick to do the NYT had a column about the Annenberg Challenge coverup. But I haven’t heard anyone talking about that at all. It did put Obama and Ayers in bed together. We conservatives have to watch for these tricks. We should have been talking about that a bit more than the lipstick thingamagig. I just hope we don’t go down that route. I’m sort of getting sick of the put downs all away around to tell you the truth. I want McCain to fight and fight hard but I don’t want to woller in the pig crap with Obama.

    hogtrrashhd (b09745)

  64. DRJ – I went there. Thanks a lot. Moonbats are moonbats, regardless of the website. Good Allah.

    JD (6a8c0a)

  65. #55, heh. Love that Treacher.

    Dana (f3e70a)

  66. Hey – no problem with ABC not issuing an apology, they took care of it. They just edited out his “EXACT WORDS” comment, (and a little more) before showing it on the West Coast – just to attempt to make her look even more radical.

    No need to apologize, just erase anything you’re being called on. Didn’t Palin and company have their own cameras going? By the time ABC gets done editing, this will appear to be even worse than what DKos put out.

    Isn’t ANYONE going to call out ABC on what they’re doing here???

    Jinny (43ad11)

  67. Something for everyone to keep in mind.

    Totally canned “interview”. As a matter of fact someone posted something here last night about her answer to a certain question.

    As this is what she delivered?

    No matter what your position please pray to God that she doesn’t end up leading the powerful military in the world.

    Holy smokes. That was the most embarrassing and frightening display for a VP I have ever seen. I’m 47.

    jharp (a28e4a)

  68. I almost laughed when she hesistated after Gibson asked her “Do you agree with the Bush Doctrine.”

    She clearly was uncertain about what exactly he was asking her.

    Which put her in a very large group with abou 95% of the US population.

    Really — the “Bush Doctrine” means about as many different things as their are sufferers of BDS.

    WLS (26b1e5)

  69. Hindsight is always the best foresight but she would have knocked that out of the park with a “No Charlie, but as you are well aware the islamic extremists are most definitely fighting what they feel is a holy war which is why we need a strong president not afraid to address the threat…”

    And she should have been better prepped on the Bush doctrine.

    voiceofreason2 (3ec2a9)

  70. Note how the troll says anything to get a reply. It provokes because it does not know how to argue and, as a narcissist, does not truly believe it can learn. (Narcissists don’t love themselves; that’s a common misconception. What they do is hide behind a mask of some sort, playing a role and protecting an image at all costs. The original Narcissus fell in love with his image in the water, remember, then fell in and drowned).

    We must teach them that only adult-level conversation gets a response. They will learn, and maybe even learn how. And then they won’t need their mask so much.

    So please don’t feed the trolls.

    ras (fc54bb)

  71. JD,

    You’re a brave guy and I won’t ask you to do anything I won’t do, too.

    DRJ (7568a2)

  72. jharp

    Why would I keep crap – like you and your kind spew – “in mind”. And you add your age – 47 – just to prove how credible you are. Well, golly-gosh that sure makes you credible, doesn’t it?

    Nice try – take a hike, Troll…

    Jinny (43ad11)

  73. ras

    That was the most embarrassing and frightening display for a VP I have ever seen.

    What do you think would lead something to arrive at such a position?

    And she should have been better prepped on the Bush doctrine.

    VOR – What is the Bush Doctrine? I am a political junkie, and have no clue what the Bush Doctrine is. Ask 100 people, and you would prolly get 75 different answers.

    JD (6a8c0a)

  74. DRJ – I had to go jump in the pool to clean off. I blame you. And Bush. And Kyoto.

    RACISTS!

    JD (6a8c0a)

  75. JD – I didn’t know Jeff banned datadave. He must have done something really special. Sorry I missed it. He hasn’t shifted into high gear here yet at least.

    daleyrocks (d9ec17)

  76. JD,

    Is your comment 73 for me? As a Canadian, I haven’t seen the interview (read some of the transcripts, tho, and watched a bit on the PC) and Palin was fine, IMHO.

    ras (fc54bb)

  77. Just a little reminder.

    The United States is the greatest country in the world.

    We deserve way, way, way better than a hick PTA hockey Mom, small time Mayor, and even smaller time newbie Governor to be in charge of the greatest military force in the history of the earth.

    jharp (a28e4a)

  78. Sorry, ras. I was not clear. I was attempting to follow your directions, and ask you how some brain-dead lying arse-face could arrive at a conclusion that Palin proved to be frightening and embarassing in that interview.

    daleyrocks – Be patient. It will be a thing of beauty.

    JD (6a8c0a)

  79. I thought Gibson was looking for gotcha moments during the interview. The cross border raid question regarding Pakistan for one. Does Gibson seriously expect public answers on questions like that where a yes means pissing off an ally who is only sort of helping and a no makes it seem like we’re not serious? To me he looked like a total tool for not understanding that and pushing that question.

    Gibson also looked like he had some trouble mustering up a definition of the Bush Doctrine. It’s not a term that gets much usage and in my opinion was used as a gotcha question.

    daleyrocks (d9ec17)

  80. jharpy – Golf game didn’t go well, huh? I bet you are the kind that improves your lie when your partners aren’t looking.

    JD (6a8c0a)

  81. We should make it a policy that if one of the twatwaffle trolls complains that Gov. Palin did not know what the Bush Doctrine is, that they must first define said Doctrine.

    JD (6a8c0a)

  82. I think McCain and Palin are way above Smug and Plugs, the Gasbag Express. Hope is not a strategy.

    daleyrocks (d9ec17)

  83. JD,
    The Bush doctrine is simply striking before you get struck. If you get 75 different answers it must be because they are trying to give examples of a situation in which it is used.

    It is the policy that took us to war with Iraq and has some in a tizzy because we might just hit Iran to stop them from obtaining nukes.

    http://www.aei.org/publications/pubID.15845/pub_detail.asp

    has the more academic in depth description if you are interested (note the 2003 date of publication)

    voiceofreason2 (3ec2a9)

  84. JD – I think DD’s meltdown will be like the China Syndrome. I wonder whether DRJ and Patterico have ever witnessed anything like it. He’s different than the little wanker.

    daleyrocks (d9ec17)

  85. #5 “He seemed completely sure of himself. “Exact words,” he asserts.”

    Nope – no such line in the interview – because ABC has NOW EDITED THAT PART OUT. You wouldn’t believe how different the version of the interview is that is now being shown on the West Coast. And that isn’t NEARLY all of what they edited.

    This isn’t just bordering on being completely outrageous anymore – this has now completely crossed the line…

    Jinny (43ad11)

  86. JD,

    No probs. As to your q – how some brain-dead lying arse-face could arrive at a conclusion that Palin proved to be frightening and embarassing in that interview – the answer is that the troll is insecure.

    For all its bluster, it needs to constantly reassure itself that it is superior. Since it’s not, the only alternative is to tear others down. It *must* have its ego fix, rationality be damned.

    ras (fc54bb)

  87. Holy smokes. That was the most embarrassing and frightening display for a VP I have ever seen. I’m 47.

    Forgive me for not giving a shit, jharp.

    nk (d681ef)

  88. VOR – Thanks for the link. Now, what is the Bush Doctrine? As defined by whom? Charlie Gibson? Kos? manbearpig? Olberdouchenozzle? Madmax?

    JD (6a8c0a)

  89. Patterico

    Please disabuse yourself of Gibson/ABC good intentions… Gov. Palin’s questioning of the accuracy of the “quote” and Chuckie’s “exact” sneer has been edited out of the westcoast broadcase, leaving the initial, edited quote UNCHALLENGED. Ditto a clip of the interview running on Yahoo’s front page.

    Also, compare the staging of the interview with Gibon’s interview of Barry earlier this year — Note:

    1. The men have some distance and a table between them
    2. The long shots (fully body) emphasize their relative “equaliness”
    3. closeups of Barry are always 3/4
    4. shots of Gibson over Barry’s shoulder keep their heads at relatively the same height

    Now, with the short segments of Palin:

    1. Gibson and Palin are placed much closer together, no table between. Emphasizes Gibson’s size as more “dominate” over Palin
    2. the “full body shots” are closer in, again emphasizing Palin as “the little woman”
    3. Close ups of Palin’s are more full face or profile, not as many 3/4.
    4. Shots of Gibson over Palin’s shoulder show her head barely to Gibson’s chin, like a little girl being lectured by daddy

    Not to mention how chopped the editing was of the interview … it appeared several times that Palin’s answers were cropped.

    Where is the whole interview?

    Darleen (187edc)

  90. Note my update regarding the editing.

    Patterico (cc3b34)

  91. Jinny,

    According to Ace, ABC has edited out their error on all feeds now.

    So who won? Palin! ABC’s the one erasing the evidence.

    ras (fc54bb)

  92. People who believe in creationism believe everything is God’s plan. That includes the Iraq war amongst other things.

    That being said, there is nothing wrong with Gibson holding her to that statement about “praying for God’s plan” and the war being a “task from god” considering her strict core fundamentalist beliefs.

    He asked her a question, she responded and “clarified.” I think she was full of it myself, but most of you folks are incensed that Gibson would even dare to challenge her a slightly complicated question and for the record, he had the quote exactly right.

    [Patterico interjects: for the record, he most certainly did not. ABC is apparently so embarrassed they edited out part of the interview. -- P]

    I despise Gibson, but it’s about time someone begins to ask this woman some damn important questions and hold her to her actions and words.

    It will be a queasy experience to hear how she distorts the space time continuum in order to defend her serial lies about the Bridge to Nowhere(tm) that she fully supported, until it was no longer politically feasible, yet took the federal money anyway. But she said she told the feds: Thanks, but no thanks.

    I greatly doubt Gibson has the integrity to do anything like a real probing report on her so relax folks, she’s got another week to cram to be Vice President of the United States, otherwise known as the person who takes the place of the most powerful man in the world if he (or she) should shuffle off this mortal coil.

    Also, she needs to sit up straight.

    Peter (e70d1c)

  93. ras – Isn’t it kind of sad that a lying arse-face can only seek solace by going to a blog where he is outclassed, intellectually and rhetorically, and goes around calling people teh stoopid?

    JD (6a8c0a)

  94. he had the quote exactly right.

    No he didn’t. That’s why ABC has “disappeared” it.

    And why do you think she believes in creationism? Can you source an authoritively that she’s an “young earth” believer? Other than the “satan’s dinosaurs” satire that lefties are taking seriously and passing around.

    Darleen (187edc)

  95. Holy smokes. That was the most embarrassing and frightening display for a VP I have ever seen. I’m 47.

    You are 47 and you never saw Al “No controlling legal authority” Gore in action?
    Have you been incarcerated for 30 years?

    Perfect Sense (9d1b08)

  96. It’s obvious Peter doesn’t know anything about findamental christians except what he reads in cartoon descriptions from the left, that’s why they scare him and also why he misunderstands them, continually.

    daleyrocks (d9ec17)

  97. rrpjr #16 “To Gibson’s “exact quote” punchback, Palin should have punched back again, “no, it isn’t.” Challenge him. Why not?”

    I suppose she could try that if she could say that in confidence but S.P. has to talk to thousands of people in what, dozens? Hundreds? of speeches a year? How many? I bet she doesn’t remember the exact words she used in that speech or any of them, even AFTER reviewing the YouTube footage. Nobody would. Which is why Gotcha politics and Gotcha “journalism” and worse “analysis”, where everyone parses everyone else’s words/articles/ etc. for intention is pretty much a dipsh*t game much of the time.

    I saw the YouTube footage too and she admits that she didn’t really prepare any comments. It was obvious actually. I thought she was just doing what many evangelicals do in church which is to start speaking and let God provide the words (ie. speak the truth through them).

    This came up earlier in some church-state thread. I still think she was saying, ok at least implying, that our military is doing God’s will, but the fact that her speech was at her old High School and was basically off the cuff (in other words THE CONTEXT) makes the whole thing a sort of “so what”. She was asking for some prayers for our troops, not invoking the legions of the Godly to smite the Evil Heathen Iraqi Hordes.

    If the quotation was from Abraham Lincoln she should have cited him and then the “God’s will” quote couldn’t be put on her. A real world application of all that “don’t plagarize” stuff we learned in school!

    She even admitted it! On TV!

    Palin the Plagarist!

    Gotcha!

    EdWood (72cfe5)

  98. Peter

    You might like to start here before you start quoting Maureen Dowd.

    Darleen (187edc)

  99. He asked her a question, she responded and “clarified.” I think she was full of it myself,

    Except her “exact words” support her clarification. But don’t let the facts get in the way of Teh Narrative.

    The marching orders and talking points have been issued.

    I despise Gibson,

    All of Baracky’s minions seem to share this sentiment. Apparently asking questions about Rev. Wright and capital gains tax rates gets you despised.

    lies about the Bridge to Nowhere(tm)

    I welcome this debate. I beg of you to continue with this grade school attack. Because in the end, you will have to explain Baracky’s billions in earmarks, some of which went to his wife’s hospital, Bidens decades of earmarks. This will stand in stark juxtaposition to Sen. McCain’s spotless record on same, and the fact that Gov. Palin has never inserted one single solitary earmark in any piece of legislation. None. Zero. Zip. Nada. It ain’t happened.

    JD (6a8c0a)

  100. jharpy – Golf game didn’t go well, huh? I bet you are the kind that improves your lie when your partners aren’t looking.

    Comment by JD — 9/11/2008 @ 9:25 pm

    Thanks for asking. Played pretty poorly.

    But. A late birdie for quite a few skins helped a lot.

    Won $7 after playing almost 36 holes.(handicap is 11)

    jharp (a28e4a)

  101. And no I don’t cheat. Nor does anyone in my group. It is unthinkable and you’d not be asked back.

    jharp (a28e4a)

  102. I used to believe that anyone could be good company on the golf course. ras, I suspect that the mendoucheous one would not be.

    JD (6a8c0a)

  103. Where did you play? I played Purgatory this afternoon, and Prarie View tomorrow.

    JD (6a8c0a)

  104. ABC sucks like sucking is going out of style. That’s f*cking outrageous. To think that someone somewhere got wet pants thinking that perhaps they’d been a little too rough with little defenseless Sarah P. Barf.

    Hell, why don’t they just add some computer generated graphics of flowers floating out of her butt while they’re at it and get Steve Schmidt from the McCain campaign to do the interview himself!!

    Screw ABC and screw Charles Gibson.

    This is infuriating.

    Peter (e70d1c)

  105. JD,
    You wanted the long answer so here you go. It is a fancy way of saying hit them before they hit us as I mentioned. Surprised you never heard of it.

    [from merriam-webster.com]doctrine: a statement of fundamental government policy especially in international relation

    http://www.carlisle.army.mil/usawc/parameters/03spring/record.pdf

    The Bush Administration issued its first National Security Strategy in September 2002, a year after the 9/11 terrorist attacks on the United States by al Qaeda. The document’s Chapter V summarizes the Administration’s approach to using force, known as the Bush Doctrine. It essentially reiterates, in four pages, presidential statements made over the months following 9/11, including the President’s speeches before a Joint Session of Congress on 20 September
    2001, before the Warsaw Conference on Combating Terrorism on 6 November, his State of the Union Address on 29 January 2002, his remarks before the student body of theVirginia Military Institute on 17 April, and his address to the graduating class at the US Military Academy atWest Point on 1 June. The Bush Administration
    now has in place a clear, declaratory use-of-force policy whose objective is stated in Chapter V’s title: “Prevent Our Enemies from Threatening Us, Our Allies, and Our Friends with Weapons of Mass Destruction.”

    voiceofreason2 (3ec2a9)

  106. I don’t understand why Peter and the others are hung up on the Bridge thing. Palin has never claimed she didn’t support the bridge. She killed it. That is not in dispute. The Alaska democrats admit it. The Alaska papers admit it.

    The thanks but no thanks part is easy. The federal government approved the amount of the earmark requested for the bridge (including affirmative votes from both Biden and Obama) but didn’t want to say it was for the bridge due ro publicity it had drawn. Nod, Nod, wink, wink, Alaska, here’s your money, spend it however you want. You don’t have to spend it on the bridge, you can spend it on other transportation projects.
    Palin, thanks for the money, we don’t need the bridge, but we need other stuff.

    Easy to understand if you don’t have PDS.

    daleyrocks (d9ec17)

  107. Peter,

    Heh, we agree! She does need to sit up straighter.

    DRJ (7568a2)

  108. #94 Darleen

    And why do you think she believes in creationism?

    After all the talk about her born-again evangelism and wanting creationism to be taught in schools alongside evolution, why would you believe she isn’t a creationist?

    Or is this one of those things like the Bridge to Nowhere that she supported, but now she doesn’t and apparently never did. “Thanks, But no thanks” she told the government. And has repeated the lies more than a dozen times and counting.

    Peter (e70d1c)

  109. daleyrocks

    The MSM has been whining “where’s Palin”, then the Gov. does and interview and is looked down on as if she was something to be scraped off the bottom of Charlie’s shoe. The ABC scrubs its interview and all feeds as if Charlie’s obvious mistake never took place.

    These guys are SO in the tank for Obama while pretending to be objective.

    Darleen (187edc)

  110. #106 DRJ:

    Heh, we agree! She does need to sit up straighter.

    Eureka! Alright!

    *High Fives DRJ*

    Peter (e70d1c)

  111. Charlie’s obvious mistake

    I do not think this was a mistake. It was clearly deliberate.

    JD (6a8c0a)

  112. DRJ

    I think that may have been part of the staging I had earlier. The set was staged so she felt the need to ‘lean into’ her answers to counter the dominating, attempt-at-intimidation posture of Charlie. She might have been less inclined to naturally go that way if there had been a table between them.

    Darleen (187edc)

  113. I agree with JD. Charlie Gibson seems like a nice guy with a laid back demeanor but he’s risen to the top of a cut-throat profession. You don’t get that far by being some clueless guy or, if you do, you deserve to get called on it.

    DRJ (7568a2)

  114. Darleen,

    If so, hopefully she can learn not to be so easily manipulated by the staging next time.

    DRJ (7568a2)

  115. How many foreign heads of state have you met?

    Absolute bullshit gotcha question. She should have asked how many had Barack met before he announced his candidacy for presidency and how many had he met before his celebrity your this summer. How many had Jimmy Carter met before running for president or Bill Clinton. Absolute bullshit.

    daleyrocks (d9ec17)

  116. JD,
    National Security Estimate 2002. chapter V outlines the principles. By early 2003 it became commonly known as the “Bush Doctrine.”

    http://www.whitehouse.gov/nsc/nss/2002/index.html

    Try googling “Bush Doctrine” for the many news stories since early 2003 that used it.

    voiceofreason2 (3ec2a9)

  117. Where did you play? I played Purgatory this afternoon, and Prarie View tomorrow.

    Comment by JD — 9/11/2008 @ 9:49 pm

    I played Greenfield Country Club (or Golf Club) today.

    Played Prairie many times but haven’t yet played Purgatory (I hear it is quite nice).

    To me the crown jewel of Central Indiana is Otter Creek (Columbus).

    I’ve played most of em around here. My favorites are the Fort, Brickyard, Trophy Club, Bear Slide.

    Among many others

    jharp (a28e4a)

  118. JD,
    Tried twice to answer your question but both didn’t pass the filter. You must have only become a political junkie in the last couple of years if you had not heard of the bush doctrine.

    voiceofreason2 (3ec2a9)

  119. For El Harpinator, the tough part about golf is the little windmill thingee.

    But when he wrote:

    We deserve way, way, way better than a hick PTA hockey Mom, small time Mayor, and even smaller time newbie Governor to be in charge of the greatest military force in the history of the earth.

    I just have to gently point out that the Harpster’s saying so merely reminds people of Senator Obama’s lack of experience.

    Call it the Boomerang Doctrine, of which most of the Left seems strangely ignorant. Why, they even claim that running for President is somehow experience for the job; something they would never, ever take from someone with an “R” after their name. Or that being a community organizer is too just as a good administrative experience as being the mayor of a small town. Looks great!

    It reveals the hypocrisy of this entire argument. So, please, keep it up. Be belittling and insulting. By all means, yammer on about Senator Palin’s corruption (Rezko), poor personal choices (Wright), or earmarks (Obama’s voting record).

    But most of all, keep on being condescending toward women. It plays so well with female voters. Especially after the brilliant move of shutting Hillary Clinton out of the VP spot.

    More to the point, Governor Palin is not running for President, much as many on the Left wish Senator McCain ill.

    They better watch that line of reasoning, or Senator McCain’s mother, in her 90s, will beat them with a stick.

    Eric Blair (36c1a9)

  120. Where did you play? I played Purgatory this afternoon, and Prarie View tomorrow.

    Comment by JD — 9/11/2008 @ 9:49 pm

    And JD,

    I’ll catch up with you later on central Indiana golf.

    I’ve got a business trip and out til late Monday,

    Maybe we’ll meet up some day.

    jharp (a28e4a)

  121. fivethirtyeight.com has McCain winning the election.

    Libruls are running scairt.

    steve miller (dcbd46)

  122. Who made this egregiously Christianist prayer?

    “And, O Lord, give us faith. Give us faith in Thee; faith in our sons; faith in each other; faith in our united crusade. Let not the keenness of our spirit ever be dulled. Let not the impacts of temporary events, of temporal matters of but fleeting moment — let not these deter us in our unconquerable purpose. With Thy blessing, we shall prevail over the unholy forces of our enemy.”

    steve miller (dcbd46)

  123. Please disabuse yourself of Gibson/ABC good intentions… Gov. Palin’s questioning of the accuracy of the “quote” and Chuckie’s “exact” sneer has been edited out of the westcoast broadcase, leaving the initial, edited quote UNCHALLENGED. Ditto a clip of the interview running on Yahoo’s front page.

    Gibson’s egregious abuse of the quote shows he didnt do his homework as well as Palin did, for sure.

    ABC News, a news chop-shop in service to the liberal Obamedia cause …. “We distort, you deride”

    Travis Monitor (cfa2f1)

  124. Darleen, #89, after watching the interview, I agree that they were too close together – it was distracting because obviously it was uncomfortable. But mostly I noticed how frequently her crossed legs were the centerpiece in her black high heels. No doubt some in the viewing audience enjoyed her great gams and that makes me think it was an even more intetional positioning – Gipson’s legs were behind hers. I tend to think the stagers intended her bare legs in heels to be part and parcel of the ‘she’s a woman‘ (feminine, provocative = weak) subliminal messaging. Artfully and slyly done.

    Dana (f3e70a)

  125. VOR – The Bush Doctrine should best be defined by President Bush, no? I have been following politics for a loooooooong time, and do not know what the Bush Doctrine is. To some, it is pre-emptive warforoil. To others, it is lying his way into an unjust war. To others, it is identifying and confrontation bad actors who pose a threat. The Bush Doctrine, so to speak, is a term that is subject to the whims of the individual, not something that is easily defined, or commonly accepted.

    JD (6a8c0a)

  126. Gipson was particularly condescending and snotty when explaining to Palin what he believed the Bush doctrine to be. Like the smug kid in class who always thinks he has the answer.

    Dana (f3e70a)

  127. JD: Because in the end, you will have to explain Baracky’s billions in earmarks, some of which went to his wife’s hospital, Bidens decades of earmarks.

    Senators are hired to get earmarks and funds for their constituents, there is nothing wrong with earmarks in and of themselves, states need earmarks dammit. The problem comes when earmarks are abused or snuck into legislation (especially at the insistence of a lobbyist) or or(pay attention) …a person claims she is anti-earmarks, yet her record speaks otherwise.

    Fact: Palin hired a lobbyist to get the achieve the highest per capita earmarks of any state in the Union.

    Fact: ALASKA is NUMBER 1 Per Capita in Earmarks.

    You can spin that any way you want, but there it is and it ain’t goin’ nowhere.

    Also going nowhere: The Bridge. Palin acts as if anyone who even dares to ask for earmarks should be tarred and feathered and hunted down like shewolf in the wild from a bush plane with a high powered rifle. Yet, she was indeed for that bridge and once she backed away from it:

    she took the money anyway.

    See a contradiction between the attitude and message?

    That’s called a lie.

    Factcheck.Org:

    Palin may have said “Thanks, but no thanks” on the Bridge to Nowhere, though not until Congress had pretty much killed it already. But that was a sharp turnaround from the position she took during her gubernatorial campaign, and the town where she was mayor received lots of earmarks during her tenure.

    Source:

    http://www.factcheck.org/elections-2008/gop_convention_spin_part_ii.html

    Peter (e70d1c)

  128. #120 Steve miller

    of temporal matters of but fleeting moment

    etc…

    FDR. Yet somehow I don’t think he thought that creationism should be taught in the schools…and get real. FDR in 2008 is Barack Obama, NOT McCAin/Palin.

    Peter (e70d1c)

  129. Good grief, is this the sum total of your factchecking?

    steve miller (dcbd46)

  130. Thanks for acknowledging that FDR spoke those words.

    Now you can go back to your hysterical smearing of Palin. Because it makes you feel so good about yourself.

    steve miller (dcbd46)

  131. Are you going to trot out the one about the rape kits now, or the book banning?

    I don’t know about you, but I’ve moved on from these exploded myths. You should, too.

    steve miller (dcbd46)

  132. Dana

    It was obviously a “gotcha” question. Gov. Palin was immediately suspicious and counter questioned him…something he did not like. His tone was so scolding I thought he was trying to provoke her. “See, women don’t have the emotional makeup to be in high office.”

    She kept her calm. Much better’n me. I would have gotten sarcastic with him and you know that would have never made the air.

    Darleen (187edc)

  133. Yes, she did stop the bridge

    Mrs. Palin used her veto pen to slash more local projects than any other governor in the state’s history. She cut nearly 10% of Alaska’s budget this year, saving state residents $268 million. This included vetoing a $30,000 van for Campfire USA and $200,000 for a tennis court irrigation system. She succinctly justified these cuts by saying they were “not a state responsibility.”

    Meanwhile in Washington, Mr. Obama voted for numerous wasteful earmarks last year, including: $12 million for bicycle paths, $450,000 for the International Peace Museum, $500,000 for a baseball stadium and $392,000 for a visitor’s center in Louisiana.

    Mrs. Palin cut Alaska’s federal earmark requests in half last year, one of the strongest moves against earmarks by any governor. It took real leadership to buck Alaska’s decades-long earmark addiction.
    Mr. Obama delivered over $100 million in earmarks to Illinois last year and has requested nearly a billion dollars in pet projects since 2005. His running mate, Joe Biden, is still indulging in earmarks, securing over $90 million worth this year.

    Mrs. Palin also killed the infamous Bridge to Nowhere in her own state. Yes, she once supported the project: But after witnessing the problems created by earmarks for her state and for the nation’s budget, she did what others like me have done: She changed her position and saved taxpayers millions. Even the Alaska Democratic Party credits her with killing the bridge. …

    In March of this year, the Anchorage Daily News reported that, “Alaska Sen. Ted Stevens is aggravated about what he sees as Gov. Sarah Palin’s antagonism toward the earmarks he uses to steer federal money to the state.”

    Maybe if the Dems had vetted Mr. Emptysuit with the Rezco pockets a bit more you all might not be in such an embarrassing position.

    Darleen (187edc)

  134. “Please disabuse yourself of Gibson/ABC good intentions… Gov. Palin’s questioning…edited out of the westcoast broadcase (sic)…..”

    Darleen,
    Maybe they edited it out becuause they realized that Gibson was wrong and they actually believe in airing questions that are factual? You know, like journalists. But hey, I like conspiracy theories as much as the next person. I bet George Soros just insisted on showing off her legs all the time and on the camera showing SP’s actual height with all those wide shots.

    Say what you want about Gibson the thing I really really really liked about his interview is that unlike all the “commentators” and “analysts” out there who can’t seem to shut up for more than two sentances so that you never actually get to hear, in unbroken form, any ideas their guests have…. (unless the guests agree with the “analyst” then they get to talk all day) he actually let Sara Palin talk, uninterrupted, before he asked the next question. Thank you Mr. Gibson and every other interviewer who can keep thier trap shut for more than 1 minute.

    EdWood (72cfe5)

  135. Ed

    they realized that Gibson was wrong

    Then a responsible NEWS organization that had previously released a transcript and aired those pieces in many markets, issues a retraction/correction/apology.

    Engaging in re-inventing the immediate past is breathtaking in its mendacious cowardice and contempt for the public.

    The public is NOT entitled to any information that the Kingmakers in the MSM say it doesn’t need. Can’t keep confusing that hick hoi poloi with thinking they actually get a CHOICE of who to vote for. And certainly not some eskimo-lover, trailer trash female who is not one of the anointed of DC/NYC/LA/Frisco aristocracy.

    Darleen (187edc)

  136. They’re right. Just watched the Interview on youtube, much different version than what was shown on the west coast.

    yoshi (63b643)

  137. Peter – That Factcheck link you include supports exactly what I said:

    “This is not the first time Palin has cited her choice to kill the bridge in 2007 as an example of her anti-waste stance. It’s true that she did eventually nix the project. But the bridge was nearly dead already – Congress had removed the earmark, giving the requested money to the state but not marking it for any specific use. Palin unplugged its life support, declaring in 2007 that the funds would not be used for the Gravina bridge.”

    It’s the following conclusion I don’t understand:

    “And even then, it’s inaccurate to say that she “told the Congress ‘thanks, but no thanks.’” Palin accepted non-earmarked money from Congress that could have been used for the bridge if she so desired. That she opted to use it for other state transportation purposes doesn’t qualify as standing up to Congress.”

    The money was given in a magically identical amount requested for the bridge, but non, nod, wink, wink, you don’t have to use it on the bridge. Am I going too fast here? That’s about as close to an earmark as you can get. Keep the dollars the same. Keep the same general purpose – transportation projects. Am I going too fast here? The money was approved before Palin became governor. After she became governor she decided fuck no, I’m not spending it on the bridge. It wasn’t about standing up to Congress on accepting the dough because Alaska already had the money. It was deciding not to build the bridge because she had more important projects. Am I going too fast?

    daleyrocks (d9ec17)

  138. Fact: ALASKA is NUMBER 1 Per Capita in Earmarks.

    Peter – How does it compare per square mile?

    daleyrocks (d9ec17)

  139. datadave -

    I only saw part of it and my g/f saw all of it and she hates Sarah more than ever for her aggressive, warlike tendencies. The part I saw showed her as a pitbull with prickliness. Not a very nice person.
    – Who do you think we’re electing, Mr. Rogers? Grow a fucking pair, already!

    And really she meant ‘God’ was on her side with the emphasis. No one prays for something they don’t believe in already.
    – Wow! Double-whammy. You know that she was lying, AND you know the essence of everybody’s prayers. Can’t wait ’til you announce your win in the Powerball.

    anyone who knows the situation knows that the Georgians provoked this and the US did too. We’re in the Russian’s backyard and of course they are provoked. S. attacked the separatists like the Serbs attacked Kosovars. And Putin came to the Russian ethnic’s rescue as expected. Palin doesn’t know the history or have the depth to deal with this….
    – Anyone who reads that paragraph will see you for the America-hating, Commie-loving, leftard that you are.

    She comes across as crazed and nasty with her repetitions of “I will not blink.” She’s only shot mooses, wolves and bears and such which don’t have nucs to fire back. A bully is all I see.
    – Funny that you put “I will not blink” in quotes, since she never said that — not even once. Kinda calls your fact-checking into question, don’t ya think? Of course you also wrote “mooses” and “nucs”, so who knows what the hell you’re talking about? Certainly not you.

    Gibson was picked as the lightest weight of interviewers out there. Pretty tame performance.
    – What an absolute fucking lie. Does lying make your datadick grow an extra millimeter? If Katie Couric had been the first to interview her you would have made the exact same ‘lightweight’ charge, and you know it.

    I like that Gibson did notice her obstrufication….”that was a blizzard of words there” “is that a yes?” so at least he’s trying to be a journalist.
    – Ladies and gentlemen, Norm Crosby! Give him a big round of applause, everybody.

    Haven’t even dealt with the Bridge to Nowhere yet??
    – OMG! Watch 20/20 tonight; maybe the lightweight will come through for you.

    Sarah granted is never for a lose of words.
    – Unlike your loss of basic grammar skills.

    The two places contested in Russia are almost exclusively inhabited by Russians and I know from experience that Russians have been dealt with badly by the new ’stans’
    – What experience would that be?

    We encouraged the breakup of Yugoslavia…so why shouldn’t the Russians defend their own in Georgia’s ‘breakaway provinces’…
    – Uh, ’cause maybe it is not the same type of situation, despite what you say.

    Sarah is exactly that: no empathy for anyone other than herself or the other white Christians in the new Private Idaho where large families can live off the Oil money
    – Anything else that you would like to make up? Anyone else you’d like to slam? Any other cards you’d like to play? Any other stereotypes (she’s tough, therefore she’s cold-hearted) you’d like to throw out there?

    I will admit Sarcasm as this a pro-Sarah site so I must be empathic. I like that she exercises regularly and looks good doing it along some lake near her home.
    – You can be sarcastic all you want, no admission necessary. You’re going to have to work on being empathic, however, since what you wrote expresses no empathy whatsoever.

    Why can’t we defend the southern Sudanese, who are often Christians from devastation.
    – Being devastated turned them into Christians? I thought it was the Jews who were used to suffering.

    Again, no one is looking at this from a Russian viewpoint.
    – Stop me if you’ve heard this, but we aren’t Russia, therefore we tend to look at this from an American viewpoint. Go figure.

    We are sticking a needle in their eye yet again with the several billion in military aid to a nation that’s run by some hubris-filled self important ‘elite’ who’s human rights record according to human right’s activists is only slightly better than Putins.
    – Just a tad partisan, are we?

    Let them be like the Sudanese…or is it the oil pipeline we are defending??
    – You can grow up any time now.

    She did say the ‘war’ is God’s plan as our leaders said it was.
    – Wrong twice over, lying piece of shit.

    Icy Truth (ef009a)

  140. I am on the West Coast and just got through the Thursday interview. In his first question, he asked her to tell America that she was ready to be President. When Palin confidently said she was, Gibson spent the rest of his time answering his own question – “No, you’re not.” Palin, who was clearly a bit nervous, could have done better, but Whole Lee Crap, the derision in Gibson’s face just dripped down like slime on Jabba The Hutt.

    Gibson seemed to embrace the Matt Damon presumption that McCain could drop dead at any moment (He had melanoma! That’s cancer!), and we need to know right NOW – are you going to cross into Pakistan without consulting the leadership? What about Israel? If they strike Iran, what are you going to do? Gibson seemed angry throughout the entire exchange, and at times it seemed he couldn’t even look at her. When they walked along the pipeline, his head was down like he was tip-toeing around land mines. Tomorrow, before checking out Part 2, look at Gibson’s sunny demeanor as he faces the camera talking about the interview, and how his face becomes like that of a Dick Tracy villain when he’s around Palin.

    I expected better of Gibson, who is still more professional than Katie Couric. I don’t know if he tops Brian Williams — I have honestly never watched NBC Nightly News since Brokaw left — but I gave Gibson credit for being the ONLY MSM daily news anchor that would regularly report that casualty numbers in Iraq dropped during the surge. But he was aggressively flat wrong on that church quote EVEN WITH VIDEO (“Exact quote,” Miami!) which the maddog producers turned into a subtext for the discussion about her readiness. Either ABC News fell for the lefty blogosphere spin, or deliberately aped it as a partner in the character assassination of Palin. Credit for Gibson? Sorry, Charlie. Credit revoked, collection agency sharks on the phone.

    Now, as for Palin: It’s got to be hard for her because she can’t be too nice or it will seem like she’s not tough enough. Then again, she can’t be too tough because she’ll look like a bitch. But she’s got to find that happy/tough medium. If I were advising her, I would have told her to reference Bill Clinton’s answer on Obama’s readiness or lack of same, and then remind the electorate that she has more executive experience. Rather than simply talk about Russia’s proximity to Alaska, express that no Governor thinks about Russia more than she has to. Instead of letting Gibson gloss over her dealings with Canadian trade officials, point out her success in the natural gas pipeline deal. Don’t let anyone talk smack about Alaska’s population; IMHO, that’s a Dem trick to make people forget it is the largest state by area, much bigger than Texas and infinitely bigger than Delaware. It would have been great if she could have taken a swipe at Nancy Pelosi, who in a recent Meet the Press interview didn’t seem to know that drilling is involved in the discovery of natural gas.

    I feel like a sports fan watching the promising rookie play his/her second game after s/he had a great debut. After an error is made, the question is, can s/he forget it and move on, or will it haunt him/her in the next game? We’ve seen what lack of confidence has done to Obama’s performance lately. Hopefully, the next interviewer who tries to sandbag her with Dowdified video will leave with barracuda teeth marks.

    L.N. Smithee (27530b)

  141. Oh Daleyrocks…give it up. Palin used government funds she’s now claiming are anathema to all she stands for.. a lie.

    Hey DRJ, my favorite part of this thread was high five-ing one another, let’s do so again.

    It’s up to people like you and me who can high five to save the country. Won’t you join me? Best. Peter

    We’ve got to keep talking and find a halfway point or we’re screwed. I know you understand what I mean.

    *High fives DRJ*

    We can do this…..

    Peter (e70d1c)

  142. Yes, I’m wasted… Errr….sorry.

    Peter (e70d1c)

  143. jharp -

    Just watched the Palin “interview”. Frighteningly pathetic.
    – That wasn’t your TV you were watching; that was you in drag, looking in a mirror. Seriously, though; the reason why you put “interview” in quotes is what?

    Did it make every feel confident with her being Pres?
    – Yep, but didn’t I already tell you once to shut up about McCain dying in office?

    Good God! Holy bejesus!
    – Goo goo goo joob!

    Embarrassing to our great country. Thoughts?
    – You are not known across the entire country. You’re more of a local embarrassment.

    The question about the Bush doctrine. she had no idea what it was, meant, or whether she was for it or against it.
    – As this site does so well, your assertion has already been discredited. The question was not specific enough; she rightly asked Gibson to clarify his question; once he did that, she did say that she is for it.

    A national embarrassment. And a dam poor choice for VP
    – An ad hominem attack. And a damn poor speller.

    Get real. Was this really the most qualified candidate?
    – Get bent. Yes she is.

    My 2 cents
    – After reading it, I’m imposing a 1000% surcharge for pain and suffering.

    Obama made a brilliant pick with Biden for VP.
    – Oh yeah. Even Biden thinks so . . . NOT!

    Qualified? Yes/ Appeal to the independants? yes.
    – MBNA’s congressional bitch? YES.

    And best of all It induced McCain to pick a completely unqualified running mate to try to woe the Hilliary voters.
    – It was Obama’s choice of Biden that brought them all of their woes. McCain had nothing to do with it.

    Excellent work. President Obama!
    – Is that what you say in your dream after he blows his load?

    Something for everyone to keep in mind.
    – You met Gary Glitter during a “business trip” to Bangkok?

    Totally canned “interview”. As a matter of fact someone posted something here last night about her answer to a certain question.
    – As a matter of real fact, someone — ME — posted something explaining how you were completely wrong. But don’t let that stop you from repeating the lie.

    As this is what she delivered?
    – Second half of sentence missing.

    No matter what your position please pray to God that she doesn’t end up leading the powerful military in the world.
    – Thank you. I will pray for John McCain’s continued good health as the 44th POTUS.

    Holy smokes. That was the most embarrassing and frightening display for a VP I have ever seen. I’m 47.
    – More frightening than Darth Cheney and Dan “punching bag for libs” Quayle? Have you been taking “disingenuous lessons” from datadave?

    Just a little reminder. The United States is the greatest country in the world.
    – That sentiment puts you at odds with your candidate.

    We deserve way, way, way better than a hick PTA hockey Mom, small time Mayor, and even smaller time newbie Governor to be in charge of the greatest military force in the history of the earth.
    – She absolutely scares the shit out of you, doesn’t she? And not because she might end up in charge of the military. It’s because you know that it’s over.

    Icy Truth (ab2f41)

  144. Peter -

    Fact: Palin hired a lobbyist to get the achieve the highest per capita earmarks of any state in the Union.

    – Fact: What you wrote is a fucking lie.

    State of the State Address, Governor Sarah Palin, PRESENTED TO THE 25th Alaska Legislature, Second Regular Session, January 15, 2008:
    We can and must continue to develop our economy, because we cannot and must not rely so heavily on federal government earmarks. Instead, let us power up and produce for Alaska and America. We can do this – we’re 50 years old now, and it’s time!

    From the March, 2008 edition of Governor Palin’s “Putting Alaska First” newsletter; within a Q&A with John Katz, Director, Washington D.C. Office of the Governor:
    This year, President Bush and the Congressional leadership have said that the total dollar amount and number of earmarks must be reduced significantly. Recognizing the Constitutional authority of Congress to formulate the federal budget, Governor Palin has responded to this direction by reducing the total number of State earmark requests from 54 last year to 31 and from $550 million to less than $200 million.

    Icy Truth (ab2f41)

  145. I should have known that this interview would have turned into a game of Calvinball; it’s only confusing because they’re not wearing masks.

    htom (412a17)

  146. Fact: Palin hired a lobbyist to get the achieve the highest per capita earmarks of any state in the Union.

    Fact: ALASKA is NUMBER 1 Per Capita in Earmarks.

    Assuming both are true, I would be interested to know what States do not have lobbyists representing them to the Federal government. You should be able to show us how Gov. Palin was acting different that every other State by hiring a lobbyist.

    Per capita is a convenient metric for you, since their population is low, and the size of their state is enormous. Everything is more expensive there.

    JD (6a8c0a)

  147. “The first thing that Misha [Mikheil Saakashvili] did was try to poke his finger in [Russian President Vladimir] Putin’s eyes as many times as possible,” Worms said, “most notably by wanting to join NATO. The West, in my view, mishandled this situation. America gave the wrong signals. So did Europe.”

    “Can you elaborate on that a bit?” I said.

    good one, Darleen. That’s what I said. Saakashvilli was a disgrace and led his people into a disaster. The Russians are threatened by Nato within their sphere of influence. The Georgians need a leader who doesn’t rely upon American military assistance so much.

    Also the info about Armenia is wrong. The Turks on both sides of Armenia have never denied their desire to eliminate all Armenians. No wonder they feel threatened by the Turkman ‘stans aligned against them.

    datadave (eb12a5)

  148. datadave – How’s that bearded lady you’re dating?

    daleyrocks (d9ec17)

  149. you don’t read so well, deranged. But I’m not surprised.

    Wanting to part of NATO isn’t a legitimate reason for Putin to re-Sovietize the area.

    But hey, to a coward like you …

    Darleen (187edc)

  150. GIBSON: And you didn’t say to yourself, “Am I experienced enough?

    No Charlie. If I used your standard for quotes, I would have to say that it was Jimi Hendrix.

    Neo (cba5df)

  151. DataDave posts the kinds of nonsensical statements that aptly portray his nickname from now own: “Double D’s (DD).”

    Just call him a graduate from the school of “hard knockers.”

    Dmac (e639cc)

  152. “I should have known that this interview would have turned into a game of Calvinball”

    htom! Haw! Brilliant description!

    EdWood (c2268a)

  153. datadave wrote: The Georgians need a leader who doesn’t rely upon American military assistance so much.

    Uh huh. And Medvedev/Putin obliged by suggesting one of their sock puppets, who won’t be threatened by the guy on the other end of the arm.

    Problem solved! :)

    L.N. Smithee (b048eb)

  154. Darleen, who’s the coward? You won’t do anything for the Christians of Sudan..but want to shot Bears out of season thru a hardwired bot named Sarah.

    Listen to the Soundtrack of Natural Born Killers sometime.

    datadave (eb12a5)

  155. Eh, Darleen, you’d better go on back to the RightWing website and find that they’re are major disagreements from more nonpartisan experts about the subject.

    datadave (eb12a5)

  156. “Fact: ALASKA is NUMBER 1 Per Capita in Earmarks. ”

    Fact: Earmarks are a creature of Congress and the House practitioner of such practice, Don Young, was OPPOSED in the primary by Sean parnell, backed by … Sarah Palin.

    The attempts to muddy the waters are once again off-target … How many earmarks did Obama ask for? I heard it was $1 billion or so.

    Travis Monitor (cfa2f1)

  157. Darleen’s got the right citation for anyone who wants to know about Russia’s bullshit in Georgia. If you haven’t read it, go read it.

    Juan (4cdfb7)

  158. Data,et al
    The claim Georgia invaded Russia seems eerily reminiscent of Finland’s invasion of Russia in WWII.And it’s amusing some of the Left are still’ useful idiots’
    PS I don’t want anyone to think I’m actually calling dataslave ‘useful”

    corwin (b49720)

  159. Gibson is disgusting in this interview. I think Governor Palin did a wonderful job in the interview. “Bush doctrine” is not a term that’s found in a history book at a high school. Also, the Bush doctrine goes like this: “If you are not with us, you are with the terrorists.” Well, in these terms, Palin answered the question pretty well. She says that we will defend America and their allies. So, the Democrats are straining at a gnat and swallowing a camel.

    GrandGizmo (b26908)

  160. This is ridiculus.

    You say Charlie Gibson was being unfair? I say every question he asked…when asked to a Gov, a VP nominee, someone who could very well be President of the U.S (IF McCain does win the election)…were very simple questions and the only arguments that should be brought up by media and americans is whether they agree with her plans and views.

    Except, the arguments i’m seeing is about how the question was “unfair”, the seating arrangements made it look like Gibson was a teacher picking on an F student, ABC edited the video to hide errors (no shit), and so on.

    It is plain obvious that she is not ready..

    Are you ready to be VP?
    –”Didn’t blink” especially, when she, in an interview before, told the reporter that she didn’t even know what the role of VP was.

    Bush Doctrine?
    –Clueless

    3 Principle changes to Bush Economy?
    –She had no straight answer whatsoever..

    Bridge to Nowhere
    –Hand caught in the cookie jar

    I could go on and on but it is seriously pathetic. I believe she is doing good for her state (that she wanted to make as its own country) but this interview along with the lies she has said on her speeches numerous times is already all coming out. She is a great person when it comes to her family but she needs to stop what she is doing with herself. She is getting played like a puppet by all the Repubs and she prefers that because she has no clue what to do.

    jan (2ac8da)


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