Patterico's Pontifications

9/9/2008

Obama’s “Macaca Moment” (Updated)

Filed under: 2008 Election — DRJ @ 7:06 pm



[Guest post by DRJ]

An Instapundit reader described today’s Obama comments — comments that arguably compared Palin to a pig and McCain to an old fish — as Obama’s Macaca Moment.

That reminded me of a February 2007 Rolling Stone profile that was published before Obama announced he would run for President. In the article, chief political adviser David Axelrod wondered aloud how Obama would respond to a presidential race:

“Look, there’s no real preparation for a presidential race,” says David Axelrod, Obama’s chief political adviser. “Hillary Clinton, there’s no question, she’s played the course, she knows the sand traps and the lie of the greens. McCain’s been through it once before, too. My feeling about this is, we don’t know exactly how Barack will respond. I’ll be really frank with you: Barack doesn’t know exactly how he’ll respond.

Obama’s comments today may have been scripted for his supporters’ benefit but somehow I doubt this moment was the one David Axlerod hoped for 19+ months ago.

UPDATE: The Washington Post reports former Massachusetts Republican Gov. Jane Swift responded that Obama had made “disgusting comments, comparing our vice presidential nominee, Sarah Palin, to a pig,” and notes this emailed response from Obama adviser Anita Dunn:

“Dunn said, “This phony lecture on gender sensitivity is the height of cynicism and lays bare the increasingly dishonorable campaign John McCain has chosen to run.”

I love the irony of the Obama campaign lecturing the McCain campaign for being too sensitive on a diversity issue.

— DRJ

125 Responses to “Obama’s “Macaca Moment” (Updated)”

  1. The Obama Campaign via politico.

    Enough is enough. The McCain campaign’s attack tonight is a pathetic attempt to play the gender card about the use of a common analogy – the same analogy that Senator McCain himself used about Senator Hillary Rodham Clinton’s health care plan just last year. This phony lecture on gender sensitivity is the height of cynicism and lays bare the increasingly dishonorable campaign John McCain has chosen to run.

    jharp (ef54fc)

  2. This is getting overblown and will end up making Palin defenders look ridiculous. We need to drop it and keep talking about issues.

    Don’t overplay the stop beating up Palin card.

    Amphipolis (e6b868)

  3. Really? You’re going to pretend that saying what Obama said is like George Allen saying “macaca”? I’ve heard plenty of people say “You can put lipstick on a pig… etc.”, just in the run of things. I’ve never heard anyone say “macaca”, at a black person, on accident.

    Would anyone be complaining if Obama had said what he said about McCain, instead of Palin?

    Sexists.

    (By the way, Hunter S. Thompson did put lipstick on a pig, as part of an elaborate – and rather disturbing – prank)

    Leviticus (41975c)

  4. And I forgot to add. Looks like things are getting a pretty desperate. Seriously, is this all they’ve got. I’m sure some high school dropout trailer park resident will buy it. But hardly enough to make an impact.

    As a matter of fact more of the brighter undecideds will probably see through and solidfy votes for Obama.

    Wait til you see the one on Obama and sex education.

    I smell fear and lots of it.

    jharp (ef54fc)

  5. This is hilarious. The reality is that this shows just how Obama is far from as smart as his cultists want to pretend. Off teleprompter, the guy is an idiot. Probably why he picked Joe Biden, he didn’t want a VP nominee who was smarter than he.

    SPQR (26be8b)

  6. jharp, the fear you smell is your own.

    SPQR (26be8b)

  7. This brings to mind something that I first understood about Pres. political campaigns in 2000.

    I saw Pres. Bush give a campaign speech in Sept of that year, and again about 6 days before the election.

    His comments were nearly word-for-word the same in each appearance. Yet he gave it with a sense of spontaneity each time. I was impressed by his ability to do that — something I think Bill Clinton excelled at as well — and I really gained an appreciation for what was called a “stump speech.”

    Only later did I understand why that talent is so important — it prevents inadvertant gaffes like this by Obama. Obama is clearly free-lancing here with this pig/lipstick reference. I know exactly what he meant, and I don’t think he’s talking about Palin. But if he had run this particluar line by any of his advisers they would have said “That’s dangerously close to Palin’s speech, and its going to sound to some like you are calling her a pig.” Under that scenario, I’m sure he wouldn’t have said it.

    But he did say it, which tells me he isn’t sticking to his stump speech on the road. If he keeps it up, there will be more moments like this.

    WLS (26b1e5)

  8. Don’t overplay the stop beating up Palin card.

    Comment by Amphipolis — 9/9/2008 @ 7:13 pm

    Good advice

    What has been impressive about the Palin effect is the positive enthusiasm shown by so many. The party that acts most like adults will probably do the best in the election.
    Obama won’t or can’t control the far left — if the right starts to behave similarly in petty attacks the Palin effect will be blunted.

    voiceofreason2 (e094d2)

  9. WLS, it shows clearer than anything else that the worst person to be fooled by the nonsense about how smart Obama is, is Obama himself. He believes his own propaganda – and that is the quickest way to failure.

    SPQR (26be8b)

  10. The desperation and panic level on the left is high. Why else do you think jharp and JAR are hanging around so much?

    I’m having fun reposting some of jharp’s nastier and loonier comments elsewhere and saying they are from somebody in the Obama campaign. Big fun.

    Thanks for the help morons.

    daleyrocks (d9ec17)

  11. Leviticus,

    I think there are moments in every campaign that fairly or unfairly define the participants. George Allen’s macaca comment was one of those moments. Gerald Ford’s debate claim that “There is No Soviet Domination of Eastern Europe” was another, and there are countless more. I think Axelrod knows that. Will this be a similar moment for Obama? I have no idea.

    FWIW, the same thing happens in trials. There are rarely moments where someone breaks down on the stand and admits wrongdoing or concedes to the other side. However, there are moments in retrospect where you realize that was when one side tipped the scales to win and the other lost.

    DRJ (7568a2)

  12. “Today at an event in Virginia, Barack Obama mocked the McCain-Palin ticket’s notion that they will change Washington. He didn’t refer specifically to Gov. Palin, he didn’t refer to the line she used in her convention speech about hockey moms and pit bulls. He simply used a common idiom.”

    And daleyrocks I thought the name calling was against the rules.

    Oops. My bad. I forgot that it’s OK if you’re a republican.

    And I’m around because I have a few days of leisure. You can do that when you work for yourself.

    jharp (ef54fc)

  13. “You can put lipstick on a pig, but it’s still a pig” is an old line, and quite appropriate for the McCain campaign at this point with his choice of Palin energizing Republicans. If they’re getting off of “Palin Palin Palin” and back onto “this is more of McSame” they just might pull out of this hole they’ve dug themselves.

    The right response for McCain/Palin? Prove they aren’t the same. This warm-and-fuzzy-all-over, populist, “government will protect you” conservatism they’re selling so far really is the same “compassionate, no-child-left-behind” conservatism that Bush snowed America with before them. Except they’re propping it up next to a pretty lady. Let’s see if they can do better.

    Or they can play victim and say “Obama called Sarah a PIG!” See how far that gets them.

    Phil (3b1633)

  14. I would tend more to give an Obama a pass since it may have been ad-libbed except for the “old fish” comment that immediately followed. That is, the two taken together seems a lot like a parallel construction against the Republican ticket.

    jim2 (03b0ae)

  15. “I’m having fun reposting some of jharp’s nastier and loonier comments elsewhere and saying they are from somebody in the Obama campaign. Big fun.”

    I’m not sure but I suspect what you are doing is against the law.

    jharp (ef54fc)

  16. jharp, yes, you are not sure. That’s the most correct statement you’ve ever made.

    SPQR (26be8b)

  17. I think that Obama is still smarting from the ego puncturing stiletto that Palin wielded at the convention and wanted to land a couple of his own zingers. He just has no clue how to do it.

    Randy R (c6f42e)

  18. daleyrocks, frankly I’d buy stock in keyboard manufacturers because jharp and JAR are frothing so much that they’ll short out three or four this week.

    SPQR (26be8b)

  19. “And daleyrocks I thought the name calling was against the rules.”

    jharp – I didn’t call you any names.

    You, however, in virtually every comment insult and name call the opposition as if the insults were being given away for free.

    I thought you were living off your investments instead of working? Can’t you make up your mind?

    daleyrocks (d9ec17)

  20. “I’m not sure but I suspect what you are doing is against the law.”

    jharp – Dude, I’m making you famous, a celebrity just like Obama. People love you already.

    daleyrocks (d9ec17)

  21. If Barry was improvising, it’s quite a coincidence that Plugs Biden used the same “Pigs & Lipstick” phrase earlier in the day.

    Barry is not allowed to improvise for obvious uh-uh-uhbama disastrous reasons. He has a script and mangles it up occasionally with his attempt at folksy “authenticity” – but it’s still a script.

    This issue wouldn’t be worth pursuing so aggressively, except that Barry has already proven that he can’t take a punch and melts under adversity. As a tool to turn up the pressure cooker and steer him off message, it will be superbly effective.

    Pedro (00b4f0)

  22. Jesus, Republicans are stupid. He was obviously referring to John Kerry.

    Like, duh.

    SEK (072055)

  23. Jake Tapper

    Last October, asked about Sen. Hillary Clinton’s health care plan, Sen. John McCain, R-Ariz., was blunt.
    McCain said Clinton’s proposal was “eerily” similar to the ill-fated plan she devised in 1993.

    “I think they put some lipstick on a pig,” he said, “but it’s still a pig.”

    A common expression, right?
    McCain surely wasn’t calling Clinton a pig.
    After all, McCain’s former press secretary, Torie Clarke, wrote a book called “Lipstick on a Pig: Winning in the No-Spin Era.”

    Elizabeth Edwards told some health journalists that McCain’s health care plan was like “painting lipstick on a pig.”

    Tonight Sen. Barack Obama, D-Ill., said of McCain painting himself as a change agent, “You know, you can put lipstick on a pig, but it’s still a pig.”
    The crowd rose and applauded.

    There’s more.

    whatever (6b0755)

  24. DRJ — I’m changing my vote. This may be a Macaca moment.

    You should update your post to add everyting McCain said — he not only made the pig/lipstick comment, he added “You can wrap and old fish in newspaper, but its still going to stink.”

    Why use two metaphors? Why does one metaphor turn on something being old, and the other turn on lipstick — and it not be a perfectly plausible conclusion to draw that he’s talking about the 72 year old Pres. candidate and the female VP candidate from the other party.

    I think this was very well thought out, and he meant exactly to make an indirect reference to McCain and Palin in a manner in which he could later deny having done so.

    I can’t understand why he would do it, but it seems pretty clear to me it was an attack on them.

    WLS (26b1e5)

  25. “You can wrap an old fish in a piece of paper called “change.” But its still going to stink.”

    WLS (26b1e5)

  26. “I smell fear and lots of it.”

    What you characterize as fear is actually a latent bowel movement in your pants. If your earlier claims about having a family are true, no doubt they’d appreciate your quick extraction of said emanation.

    Dmac (e639cc)

  27. WLS, especially since Palin had just last week made a speech where she referred to herself as a hockey mom, and made a joke about the difference between a hockey mom and a pit bull being –> lipstick.

    SPQR (26be8b)

  28. “There’s more.”

    You’ve already posted this twice on other threads, whateverthehellyouare – try to come up with something just a little more original.

    Dmac (e639cc)

  29. WLS,

    I didn’t include the quotes but I did reference the pig and the fish analogies, so I’m willing to let people draw their own conclusions. What struck me is the fact Obama thinks he has to say this like this now.

    DRJ (7568a2)

  30. How is talking about a pig/lipstick talking about THE ISSUES? Isn’t that what Barack ‘Change’ Obama claimed he was going to talk about in this campaign?

    liontooth (0edfdb)

  31. So, not only does he think Sarah should be barefoot in the kitchen, taking care of those 5 kids, but he thinks that old folks stink up the place with their oldness.

    A twofer.

    Kevin Murphy (0b2493)

  32. What struck me is the fact Obama thinks he has to say this like this now.

    Now is the perfect time to say this. As I said in the other thread — Palin is the lipstick. Democrats need to start treating her as such. “Yeah, she’s attractive, articulate, inspiring. Sure. But she’s not the one running for president. It’s still McCain – don’t let the lipstick fool you.” If they do that, they’re getting back in the game.

    Phil (3b1633)

  33. The important thing is to continue to talk about it. That’s what finished Allen and that’s what will turn this into one of those thousand cuts which will finish off the shady, shoddy machine pol from Chicago. It’s not a cut that draws arterial blood – it’s just another little venous bleeder that needs to be rubbed a bit in order to keep it open.

    It was either as intentional as the finger and shoulder brush to Clinton or Obama is much dumber than his blind followers have been lead to believe. He may have just been trying to fire up an audience which, lets face it, looked like they were at a wake. Allen was just trying to kid with that camera man, too. Stupid move on his part, to be sure. So, was Obama just clumsily stupid or is he too arrogant to be able to control himself?

    I tend to lean toward uncontrollable arrogance matched with an intellect that is much lower than advertised.That and the fact that he’s never been in a tough campaign spells lots more trouble ahead. He may nick an artery all on his own.

    Rick Ballard (14757e)

  34. Why use two metaphors? Why does one metaphor turn on something being old, and the other turn on lipstick — and it not be a perfectly plausible conclusion to draw that he’s talking about the 72 year old Pres. candidate and the female VP candidate from the other party.

    Paging Dr. Freud. Paging Dr. Freud. You’re needed in the comments section immediately.

    SEK (072055)

  35. daleyrocks,

    “I thought you were living off your investments instead of working?”

    I am not sure where you came up with that. I have never claimed such and it is not the case.

    I’m still at it.

    jharp (ef54fc)

  36. jharp – I have not been posting your comments anywhere else. As far as I know you are not famous, only infamous on this blog.

    Can you prove you are not working for the Obama campaign though?

    daleyrocks (d9ec17)

  37. WLS –

    On your #24, you wrote:

    “You should update your post to add everyting McCain said — he not only made the pig/lipstick comment, he added “You can wrap and old fish in newspaper, but its still going to stink.” ”

    I think you meant “Obama”.

    jim2 (03b0ae)

  38. The age joke about McCain is just as offensive, as the Democrats have been demonstrating their bigotry on that issue for some time.

    SPQR (26be8b)

  39. Obama’s “Macaca Moment”

    You guys are truly something. A U.S. Senatorial candidate refers to a journalist if Indian descent, actually calls him it to his face, as Macaca.

    And you compare that to telling an audience Tuesday that GOP presidential nominee John McCain says he’ll change Washington, but he’s just like President Bush.

    “You can put lipstick on a pig,” he said. “It’s still a pig.”

    Give me a break.

    jharp (ef54fc)

  40. ROTFLMAO!!!!!! Keep it up Dems, please keep it up! Based upon the Palin “Hockey Mom v. Pit Bull” difference being “lipstick” how could one not take this as a direct slam on Palin? At least the crowd with the Obamessiah sure did. Women, I can’t speak for you, but if I were a woman I’d be pissed off at the Chosen One right now – my wife, my daughter, and my mother sure are. He is what he is, an elitist, biggoted, sexist, arrogant, self-centered pig. Put lipstick on that O Obamessiah. Thank you Obama, Thank you. Please keep it up. McCain-Palin in a freakin landslide I tell you, a landslide!

    J. Raymond Wright (0440ef)

  41. “Can you prove you are not working for the Obama campaign though?”

    I doubt it. I guess you’ll have to take my word for it. If you have a suggestion as to how I can prove it please share.

    I don’t want to reveal too much personal info but I’m just a regular dude.

    Self employed. 47 yrs old. Never have worked for any political campaign. Married with 2 kids. And live in Indiana.

    And you?

    jharp (ef54fc)

  42. I’ve updated the post to add comments by Massachusetts Governor Jane Swift and an Obama campaign adviser.

    DRJ (7568a2)

  43. Team Obama can’t take a punch and is predictably back on its heels . . . again. For the next week, Barry will be uber-calculating every word he says and his stump speeches will be filled with incomprehensible uh-uh-uh’s, er-erm’s, and d-du-duh-d’ohs.

    Put on your grown up pants and take it like a man, Barry.

    Pedro (00b4f0)

  44. How is talking about a pig/lipstick talking about THE ISSUES? Isn’t that what Barack ‘Change’ Obama claimed he was going to talk about in this campaign?

    Comment by liontooth — 9/9/2008 @ 7:56 pm

    Take a listen. It went like this. Obama’s campaign has been to change the failed policies of the GOP the last 8 years.

    McCain is trying to claim he is the candidate of change.

    Obama pointed out that by McCain trying to put lipstick on who he is does not change him into the candidate of change. It’s still the same old failed policies.

    It’s a metaphor for Christsakes.

    He wasn’t calling anyone a pig.

    jharp (ef54fc)

  45. “The Washington Post reports Massachusetts Republican Gov. Jane Swift”

    Don’t you mean former governor.

    And I’ll bet you Rush Limbaugh finds fault with the comment also.

    You guys are hopeless. Really is quite amusing to me.

    This is all you’ve got? Har Dee Har Har. Too funny.

    [Swift is the former Governor of Massachusetts. Thank you and I’ve corrected the Update. — DRJ]

    jharp (ef54fc)

  46. For the scoffers trying to defend O!, watch the video. O! uses the phrase deliberately, pausing right after the “lipstick on a pig” line in order for the audience to catch up with an “oh ..OH YEAH, WE GET IT!!!” then guffaws, snickers and applause start rolling as O! finishes with “but its still a pig“.

    Couple that with Biden’s oblique slam against Palin about how only people who fully support embryonic stem cell research REALLY care about special needs kids and you have the Chicago machine pulling that smear lever for new lows every day.

    Though, I’m loathe to point it out, cuz for every “pig” “sweetie” “the baby is a PR stunt” line, hundreds of women decide they are no longer voting for Obamessiah.

    Darleen (187edc)

  47. O! is a sexist coward. And it shows more each day.

    Darleen (187edc)

  48. People love you already.

    Is that what the emotion I feel towards jharp is?

    Huh…

    And I think we take Obama’s comments to be about Gov Palin because of the Hockey Mom/Pitbull joke…

    And jharp’s a tool. Just wants to toss that out there…

    Scott Jacobs (d3a6ec)

  49. jharp, still smelling your own fear I see.

    Darleen, exactly. He knows he is telling a joke, and is pausing to let the audience catch up.

    It is no accident no matter how much the Obama cultists want to pretend otherwise.

    SPQR (26be8b)

  50. For the next week, Barry will be uber-calculating every word he says and his stump speeches will be filled with incomprehensible uh-uh-uh’s, er-erm’s, and d-du-duh-d’ohs.

    Don’t you love how someone who’s thoughtful and speaks well but punctuates his speech with meaningless linguistic tokens* is being attacked by people who support a party whose President is barely even functionally literate? I do.

    *It’s not like he’s saying, you know, “like” and “you know.” As I tell my students, the ultimate sign of stupidity is the inability communicate at all. They want to say X, but can’t say X, so they say it’s like X. But they’re not even bright enough to produce an illuminating analogy, so they’re forced to ask their if, you know, their audience already know what they’re talking about. Often as not — because their audience is about as bright as they are — their audience has no clue, but picks up on the signals and is all like, “You know, it’s like I see what you’re saying.” Most of them get the point and spend the rest of the quarter eliminating Valley Girlisms from their speech.

    SEK (072055)

  51. “I thought you were living off your investments instead of working?”

    jharp – My apologies. It is JAR who makes that claim.

    daleyrocks (d9ec17)

  52. Let’s be realistic, SEK. Most of them aren’t listening.

    DRJ (7568a2)

  53. SEK

    President is barely even functionally literate

    Why are you lying?

    Darleen (187edc)

  54. George Bush is DUMB!!!11!!eleventy!!11

    He can’t talk – He says nukear!!!1111

    O!

    daleyrocks (d9ec17)

  55. Don’t you love how someone who’s thoughtful and speaks well but punctuates his speech with meaningless linguistic tokens* is being attacked by people who support a party whose President is barely even functionally literate? I do.

    Don’t you love how people who’ve been ripping the bark of GWB for eight years about his lack of speaking ability, idolize a guy who thinks we have 57 states, including New Pennsylvania, mutters mindless inanities such as “above my pay grade” and is a daily gaffe machine when he is separated from his beloved teleprompter. I do.

    Pedro (00b4f0)

  56. Personally, I don’t give a darn that BHO “went there.” However, anything that gets an undecided voter to see that BHO is a fraud and not a “new” pol, is cool with me.

    Ed (f35a20)

  57. Regarding his concept of the “fear” he appears to smell from Republicans, Our Harpster needs to re-watch “The Princess Bride,” and recall the response of Inigo Montoya to Vizzini’s use of the word “inconceivable.”

    Maybe the Harpster will prove correct. Maybe not. With or without calling his opponents names. We will know, soon enough.

    There will plenty of crow to be eaten by someone, after the election.

    Eric Blair (36c1a9)

  58. Pedro, he can’t even avoid um’s and ah’s when he’s READING the teleprompter…

    How the hell smart can this guy be? Christ, *I* could do better with a prepared speech, an dthere are days when *I* am barely literate…

    To be fair, though, it’s usually after a night of heavy drinking…

    Scott Jacobs (d3a6ec)

  59. SEK, why is your lie about the President such a popular lie among Democrats? Democrats for years have pretended that George W. Bush is uneducated or dumb when it turned out he had better grades that Al Gore the supposed genius. Not mention actually finished a post graduate degree.

    SPQR (26be8b)

  60. I think Obama was not comparing Sarah to a pig but this is not the subject they wanted on the next news cycle. That’s what a gaffe is. They tried to use Sarah’s comments about Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac as a slip but it didn’t work. The bridge-to-nowhere story was another attempt to make her look bad but that isn’t working either. The problem is that the bridge didn’t get built and there is no deeper story there because the Anchorage Daily News coverage at the time doesn’t support their theme. Then they will try the religion story but the pastor’s have been interviewed and that doesn’t have any legs either. This is a series of attempts at discrediting her and they aren’t working either.

    This is what desperation looks like. The WaPo story today won’t do it either. Her per diem allowances are less than her predecessors. So far they have drawn blanks.

    Mike K (2cf494)

  61. Every now and then SEK startles me with a bald-faced bit of bigotry.

    I have a background in theatre and public speaking. I’ve been tapped time and again, usually on short notice, to head seminars and training sessions … because I am as comfortable in front of a hundred people as I am in front of one or two.

    But I’ve also seen people … bright, warm, articulate, funny … absolutely freeze if they have to stand before an audience, even with a prepared speech. I’ve been with people in the bathroom trying to be encouraging while they puke their lunch before having to make a speech.

    It’s one of those things that you can hone as a skill, but basically one’s nature will out.

    No one, but no one who knows President Bush on a personal level says he is “stupid” or doesn’t know how to communicate. But he’s one of those people who is uncomfortable in a formal setting before huge groups. O! is the opposite. He can give a sterling speech, but he can barely muddle through any one on one interview or conversation. And his long pauses are a “poker tell” … he has no real answer. He is still in his journey of personal discovery so he spends half his time refereeing an internal dialogue as to get a consensus within himself on the best line to deliver based on what the listener wants to hear.

    O! is just not the real deal.

    Darleen (187edc)

  62. test?

    [I’m not sure why it went there but I found your comment in the filter. — DRJ]

    Darleen (187edc)

  63. Every now and then SEK startles me with a bald-faced bit of bigotry.

    I have a background in theatre and public speaking. I’ve been tapped time and again, usually on short notice, to head seminars and training sessions … because I am as comfortable in front of a hundred people as I am in front of one or two.

    But I’ve also seen people … bright, warm, articulate, funny … absolutely freeze if they have to stand before an audience, even with a prepared speech. I’ve been with people in the bathroom trying to be encouraging while they puke their lunch before having to make a speech.

    It’s one of those things that you can hone as a skill, but basically one’s nature will out.

    No one, but no one who knows President Bush on a personal level says he is “stupid” or doesn’t know how to communicate. But he’s one of those people who is uncomfortable in a formal setting before huge groups. O! is the opposite. He can give a sterling speech, but he can barely muddle through any one on one interview or conversation. And his long pauses are a “p0ker tell” … he has no real answer. He is still in his journey of personal discovery so he spends half his time refereeing an internal dialogue as to get a consensus within himself on the best line to deliver based on what the listener wants to hear.

    O! is just not the real deal.

    Darleen (187edc)

  64. You can take what Obama said anyway you want. This was no mistake at all. I think the subtext was certainly Palin and McCain and I say bravo.

    After the nasty belittling repulsive crap the Republican’s pulled at the RNC this is the least they deserve in return. I think Americans want to see someone fight back and well…notice has been given. Republicans can’t complain about an environment they created part and parcel. Personally, I eagerly look forward to watching a writer rip Twiddle dee and Tweedle dum a new hole.

    Finally. The fight Republicans thought Democrats didn’t have in them….

    Peter (e70d1c)

  65. I agree with #39 Rick Ballard — maybe he was just trying to fire up his crowd and himself.

    I’ve been watching the audiences at Obama’s rallies, trying to gauge the enthusiasm. Since the Convention, O’s crowds look glum and bored. Like they were bussed in to fill a seat, you know, good little union folks. Certainly a marked contrast to McCain/Palin crowds since the convention. Obama doesn’t look much better — frowning, furrowed brow, body language of a loser, weak defensive speeches.

    His “pig” comment succeeded in waking them up and maybe himself too. Macaca or not, he’s still a projecting a loser persona.

    capitano (211a15)

  66. Why are you lying?

    I’m lying? Don’t see that. I see someone who talks to hundreds of undergraduates every year and has a fairly well-calibrated bullshit generalization detector. When my undergrads start arguing that freedom’s good because free people love freedom, or ask rhetorically “What is our children learning?” I give them the what-for. I’m not holding extemporaneous speakers up to high standards here — I’ve taught journalism and know how transcripts are scrubbed — it’s just that there’s a difference between people who appeal to oversimplified abstractions and those who stumble over their own words.

    Put another way: the student who repeats back to me what he thinks I said smoothly doesn’t earn my respect; the student who muddles a bit trying to express a thoughtful, idiosyncratic view gets the benefits of all my entire doubt.*

    Don’t you love how people who’ve been ripping the bark of GWB for eight years about his lack of speaking ability, idolize a guy who thinks we have 57 states, including New Pennsylvania, mutters mindless inanities such as “above my pay grade” and is a daily gaffe machine when he is separated from his beloved teleprompter.

    I think teleprompter proficiency should be the defining factor of this election, my friends. My friends, I think elections shouldn’t be built on cheap rhetorical appeals to conciliation, my friends. My friends, I don’t think we should, my friends, think, my friends, about, my friends, anything but, you know, you, my friends. GOD BLESS AMERICA!

    SEK, why is your lie about the President such a popular lie among Democrats? Democrats for years have pretended that George W. Bush is uneducated or dumb when it turned out he had better grades that Al Gore the supposed genius. Not mention actually finished a post graduate degree.

    I forgot it was all about how much you value postgraduate degrees. If you have a postgraduate degree, you must be smart … which is why people take my every word as gospel. I must be smart, by your logic, because I have a postgraduate degree. Granted, you don’t actually believe that — Darleen certainly doesn’t, her tsktsking notwithstanding — but I suppose it works for GWB, because, you know, you like him and all. That said, I don’t think his verbal miscues are evidence of stupidity per se. If he’d said something else remotely intelligent in the past eight years, I’d forgive him his linguistic trespasses.

    *Amazing, ain’t it? I don’t reward people for repeating back to me what I’ve said. It’s almost like liberals can, you know, like they can be teachers. If you don’t believe me, you can ask our esteemed host. He tried to read my terrible dissertation chapter last night and I don’t think he spid any liberal indoctrination-type nonsense. (Nonsense nonsense, however, he found in abundance. And rightly so.)

    SEK (072055)

  67. You might have been trying to indoctrinate people, for all I know. I had no idea what you were talking about!

    Patterico (cc3b34)

  68. SEK, oh I get it. When you said “barely even functionally literate”, you instead really meant “I don’t think his verbal miscues are evidence of stupidity per se.”

    I guess I know who is “barely even functionally literate” now, SEK. Glad you are able to find employment regardless.

    SPQR (26be8b)

  69. “What is our children learning?”

    Christ, and these are college students?

    I don’t care WHO wins this election, this country is FUCKED…

    Scott Jacobs (d3a6ec)

  70. No one, but no one who knows President Bush on a personal level says he is “stupid” or doesn’t know how to communicate.

    Um, what? I can think of no greater evidence that you haven’t read anything even remotely uncomplimentary to Bush. Many, many, many people have spoke to his sense of privilege and attendant stupidity. Starts way back with his Arbusto friends and snakes forward through his Ranger days right up into his time in Austin. If you haven’t encountered this material, well, it’s because you haven’t been looking.

    SEK (072055)

  71. OK, be nice to SEK. Don’t call him a liar and don’t call him a bigot. Please.

    SEK, you’ll invite less of that reaction if you exaggerate less, I suspect.

    Patterico (cc3b34)

  72. #62 Darlene

    He can give a sterling speech, but he can barely muddle through any one on one interview or conversation.

    Hmm..so curious the way he shone in the Democratic debates and out debated and out maneuvered Hillary Clinton.

    And his long pauses are a “p0ker tell” … he has no real answer. He is still in his journey of personal discovery so he spends half his time refereeing an internal dialogue as to get a consensus within himself on the best line to deliver based on what the listener wants to hear.

    I agree that it’s an internal dialogue, but I don’t attribute the projected manipulativeness you attach to it. Maybe he really wants to properly articulate and communicate what is in his mind. I’ve seen brilliant people pause in discussion all the time. It’s natural. It’s even a good thing if it improves the quality of one’s speech, but even the best speaker is going to have trouble if he knows he’s got 30 seconds to express a complex idea in a way that will be understood.

    Obviously Obama has done that extraordinarily well.

    O! is just not the real deal.

    Perhaps you could also explain McCain’s used car salesman technique for speaking to crowds. Is he the real deal?? Could McCain speak to 85,000 people the way Obama did?

    Personally Obama is one of the few people who when he speaks I think, this is a real person with a real core. When I hear most other politicians speak including McCain I’m hearing a mask speak.

    As for Palin, she’s an actress. She went out there and did her impression of a rootin tootin’ gee golly whilker ain’t I got spunk little lady.

    Phony as a three dollar bill and just as unsubstantive. She’s just your everyday sociopathic alpha female from a small town.

    Peter (e70d1c)

  73. You might have been trying to indoctrinate people, for all I know. I had no idea what you were talking about!

    Liberal AWESOMENESS — but I cleverly hid it beneath all those references to old books.

    When you said “barely even functionally literate”, you instead really meant “I don’t think his verbal miscues are evidence of stupidity per se.”

    SPQR, it’s possible to be very intelligent and functionally illiterate. Just so happens Bush ain’t that bright and barely literate. (I know, I know, he and Rove have book-reading competitions. But as credentialed military historians say of amateur military historians — nevermind, I won’t go there.)

    Christ, and these are college students?

    (Other)Scott, you’re joking, right? You do realize who said that, don’t you?

    SEK (072055)

  74. SEK, you’ll invite less of that reaction if you exaggerate less, I suspect.

    But if I don’t type VERY EXTREMELY LOUDLY, Darleen’ll secretly replace every word I’ve written with sawdust and strawmen, then complain when I decline to choke on it or them.

    SEK (072055)

  75. So I guess McCain called Hillary Clinton back in October of last year a pig as well if you use the current ridiculous argument.

    http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalpunch/2008/09/a-piggish-debat.html

    Oiram (e48982)

  76. I always enjoy these occasional lectures from the intellectual elite.

    They make me feel so….normal.

    daleyrocks (d9ec17)

  77. #75 Why thank you Daley, “Intellectual Elite” sounds nice. Don’t sell yourself so short though, perhaps your a child left behind?

    Oiram (e48982)

  78. Haw haw haw Oh man do I just LUUUUUV faux outrage. Said it before and I said it again, NOBODY does faux outrage like “conservatives”. Oh and especially like their mouthpieces in the “non-biased” “no-spin-zone” media.

    Man THIS is the first real test of the Obama campaign. If he refuses to apologize to anyone and treats all the hoopla over his comments as just another tactic (which, of course, it is)THEN he might have a chance.

    If he apologizes then he is just another Dem wimp with no spine and no-one is going to be interested in him anymore.

    If he apologizes he doesn’t deserve to be President.

    I give it a 50-50 chance.

    EdWood (4c1211)

  79. Mario,

    I have pre-refuted your silly argument.

    Short version: Palin memorably referred to her lipstick in her speech, so Obama’s reference reminds voters of it. No such parallel for Hillary. But thanks for trying.

    Patterico (cc3b34)

  80. OcirettaP
    Obama is not reminding me of Palin’s speech.

    You my friend on the other hand are reminded of Palin’s speech because you probably dream of it in your sleep.

    Refute all you want, Obama could care less about her lying sack of a speech.

    Obama used an old reference that has been used by the likes of McCain.

    What’s good for the goose must not be good for the gander

    Oiram (e48982)

  81. I found this on Professor Bainbridge’s site recently. Here is the quote I liked the best:

    Every liberal I know at one time or another has said something that betrays an underlying sense of entitlement. They think that Democrats are the natural party of government, because Democrats are smarter, nicer, better people.

    Accordingly, when they lose, it can’t be because the American people have assessed their arguments and found them wanting. Instead, it must be because of nefarious forces. Hence, we get Hillary Clinton blathering on about “the vast right wing conspiracy” and the “Religious right.”

    Liberal paternalism. The conservative’s best friend.

    Here is the link (I hope that it posts this time!).

    http://www.stephenbainbridge.com/punditry/comments/the_liberal_sense_of_entitlement/

    I think that Bainbridge stated it very nicely. And we see a lot of it right here.

    Eric Blair (36c1a9)

  82. daley, when I lecture you, you’ll know it . . . because I won’t be half so amusing and I’ll request rough drafts.

    Palin memorably referred to her lipstick in her speech, so Obama’s reference reminds voters of it.

    “Lipstick on a pig” (and slight variations a la “lipstick on that pig”) pops up 238 times on Lexis in the past six months. I’m not saying it can’t be made to refer to her — or that people who support her won’t consider it a dog whistle — just that the phrase is a favorite of Dick Cheney’s (see my link above vis-a-vis Kerry). I’m sure he could be attacking Palin, but really, if he wanted to attack her, he’d point out that as mayor she forced rape victims to pay for their own rape kits while spending millions on sports complexes.

    SEK (072055)

  83. Hmmm.

    The “gander” business shows some unbecoming sexism. But then, so does the entire Obama campaign these days!

    Eric Blair (36c1a9)

  84. Mr. Orwell, you can take that red herring to the bank, yes indeed.

    P.S. How as the weather the other day?

    SEK (072055)

  85. SEK

    You claim the President is functionally illiterate.

    Now to little old me, with just a Bachelor’s degree from a non-Ivy league school, without the years of elbow rubbing with the Beautiful People in NYC penthouses, “illiterate” means someone with little or no education, unfamiliarity with language, zip on communication skills. Outside of some public events where the President has stumbled over words in his obvious discomfort with a large public venue, not one of the points that makes for the definition of “illiterate” and thus your claim is patently false.

    You exhibit bigotry* based on regionalism and value system you don’t like. As those who slam Gov. Palin as some bimbo, airhead, eskimo-loving, hick, trailer trash do, too. She has an “R” after her name, so she isn’t mistaken, she is stupid and evil and by any means necessary she must be destroyed as a warning to any other uppity non-left woman who might leave the kitchen and try for public office.

    *apologies Patterico, but if it walks like a duck …

    Darleen (187edc)

  86. Short version: Palin memorably referred to her lipstick in her speech, so Obama’s reference reminds voters of it. No such parallel for Hillary. But thanks for trying.

    Comment by Patterico — 9/9/2008 @ 9:39 pm

    I get it now. Since Palin referred to herself as a dog it is off limits for Obama to refer to McCain try to paint himself as a candidate for change as putting lipstick on a pig.

    jharp (ef54fc)

  87. How is talking about a pig/lipstick talking about THE ISSUES? Isn’t that what Barack ‘Change’ Obama claimed he was going to talk about in this campaign?

    That’s the ENTIRE POINT THE LIBERALS HERE DON’T GET. Talk about pigs. They are stuck pigs. Squealing away. Not seeing that the offense is not against Palin or McCain but against his own self-created image of a high-road campaigner … which he is destroying.

    Obama wanted a high-minded campaign about ‘hope’ and ‘change’ where he got to define these on his terms.

    McCain stole his playbook and is running rings around him.

    Obama is reduced to calling McCain and Palin names.

    He’s got NOTHING. Nothing but WORDS that WONT WORK.

    Travis Monitor (cfa2f1)

  88. Geez, Peter, you didn’t watch much of the Democrat “You are all VICTIMS” telethon did you?

    Darleen (187edc)

  89. “I don’t want to reveal too much personal info but I’m just a regular dude.”

    Nothing regular about falling for the worst and least qualified presidential nominee in decades and doing handstands to defend him when he makes a gaffetastic comment.

    Travis Monitor (cfa2f1)

  90. “Don’t you love how people who’ve been ripping the bark of GWB for eight years about his lack of speaking ability, idolize a guy who thinks we have 57 states, including New Pennsylvania, mutters mindless inanities such as “above my pay grade” and is a daily gaffe machine when he is separated from his beloved teleprompter. I do.”

    OBAMA IS THE NEW BUSH.

    Travis Monitor (cfa2f1)

  91. Nothing regular about falling for the worst and least qualified presidential nominee in decades

    Comment by Travis Monitor — 9/9/2008 @ 10:08 pm

    Quite the contrary. Think George Bush.

    jharp (ef54fc)

  92. SEK #81,

    Not exactly.

    DRJ (7568a2)

  93. SEK

    Did you actually, like, use that mouse thingy to click through to the original article?

    Mayor Palin didn’t force rape victims to pay for anything.

    Good lord, you guys are scared so scared of one AUTHENTIC woman you have to make up stuff from whatever dustbunnies are hiding under your beds with the EvilRethug monsters.

    Darleen (187edc)

  94. jharp

    Jhimmi Carter still has that honor. Electing O! will be Carter’s 2nd term.

    Darleen (187edc)

  95. Darleen,

    Maybe we should chip in so that Patterico can put some visqueen down in the comments section? Fear driven incontinence is going to just ruin the carpets around here – and anywhere else lefties are squatting.

    Rick Ballard (14757e)

  96. Mr. Kaufman, it is too bad that we cannot meet in an area to discuss literature rather than our views on politics, which are unlikely to mesh. I wish you well, despite our differences, and I would hope that you could avoid the trap about which Professor Bainbridge recently wrote.

    As for the name I use on the internet, well, that is hardly a surprise to many people. It does reflect my interests and background. Most of all, it helps me guard against authoritarians of any stripe (and of course they do occur on both sides of the metaphorical aisle).

    I have relatives who live near both LSU and UC Irvine. I wish you the best of luck on your thesis.

    Eric Blair (36c1a9)

  97. Palin speaks and Obama hears only “brown noise”.

    Oops. Racism alert!

    fat tony (f4f9e7)

  98. Cheezit, y’all are too generous to Obama.

    It’s not like nobody every used the phrase “lipstick on a pig” before. I think I speak for all mankind, it’s a well known trite expression.
    But here he was alluding to Palin, to disarm the vivid portrait of toughness she’s painted for herself, and I can’t believe anyone is seriously arguing otherwise.

    Also, “old fish” was an ugly reference to the feminine “change” offered by Sarah Barracuda.

    I have not been very sanguine about the choice of Palin, and didn’t and don’t have the instant love others have bestowed on her. But as a woman, I was on a gut level offended, sincerely offended. Obama’s way of dealing with the threat of her popularity is repellent.

    He got his digs in. May he enjoy all the benefits that flow his way from them.

    SarahW (a6e80b)

  99. SarahW, I posted this link in another thread, but see what you think about Camille Paglia’s view of Sarah Palin. Sure, she doesn’t like McCain. And Paglia has some…um…odd ideas.

    But I wonder if she is onto something here, regarding how Sarah Palin is viewed.

    http://www.salon.com/opinion/paglia/2008/09/10/palin/print.html

    I think, also, that guys like me aren’t the experts on how women interpreted Senator Obama’s comments. Women are, and I think we should listen to folks like you on the subject.

    Eric Blair (36c1a9)

  100. I guess Obama must be smarter than me, because he is running a campaign for President, but usually when someone who is trying to sell me something gets asked a question and they start saying “and then…” and “uh” “uh” “uh” in between spasms of glibness, I don’t interpret that as a sign of intelligence.
    My cousins from Texas would think that sumbitch is lyin, but obviously they haven’t taken the proper courses.
    I will refer them to adult ed without delay.

    SteveG (71dc6f)

  101. You can give a pig a Harvard degree,
    but it is still a pig.

    Perfect Sense (9d1b08)

  102. Leviticus wrote: I’ve never heard anyone say “macaca”, at a black person, on accident.

    Come on. You never heard anybody call anyone “macaca” ever before that incident.

    L.N. Smithee (8dbd9a)

  103. what kind of black person are we calling macaca?

    One of the first rules in insulting each other is always context.

    SteveG (71dc6f)

  104. I just want to say that I have met Anita Dunn, and in 1994 had an extensive conversation with her on the use of free media to support political campaigns.

    Let me tell all of you: This woman is despicable. She has absolutely no moral or ethical compass whatsoever, and would gladly sell her own mother to secure any political advantage, no matter how small, for the candidate she is hired to represent.

    It’s rare that you get to meet someone that, while dressed so fashionably, is truly, truly evil.

    The fact that key elements of the Democratic party — she was Tom Daschle’s press liaison before joining the Obama campaign — so enthusiatically embrace her participation is yet another indication of how utterly empty and ruthless that party really is.

    Steve Levy (2d04eb)

  105. Pedro wrote: Don’t you love how people who’ve been ripping the bark of GWB for eight years about his lack of speaking ability, idolize a guy who thinks we have 57 states, including New Pennsylvania, mutters mindless inanities such as “above my pay grade” and is a daily gaffe machine when he is separated from his beloved teleprompter. I do.

    Whoever wins will be an improvement on W, who is the worst public-speaking POTUS in the history of recorded sound (which goes back to Rutherford B. Hayes). As uninspiring as McCain can be, he at least sounds he’s taken a course at Toastmasters.

    I was delighted on that December day in 2000 when Katherine Harris certified the Florida results and Bush addressed a joint meeting of the Texas Legislature to give his victory speech. And then it occurred to me: “I’m going to have to listen to this guy for at least FOUR MORE YEARS!” Of course, that turned out to be eight, but considering the alternative, I endured it.

    Go New Penn State Nittaly Lions!

    L.N. Smithee (8dbd9a)

  106. #89

    Nothing regular about falling for the worst and least qualified presidential nominee in decades and doing handstands to defend him when he makes a gaffetastic comment.

    Honestly, the level of self delusion in that comment pretty much negates any and all that you’ve written here so far.

    Get help. You are beyond this and in some sort of fantasy world that borders on dementia.

    Peter (e70d1c)

  107. #88 Darlene

    Geez, Peter, you didn’t watch much of the Democrat “You are all VICTIMS” telethon did you?

    More like you’re all empowered to take your country back from wealthy money interests that have given us a stupid war and a messed up economy and 8 years of the most disastrous petty incompentent corrupt abusive and executive branch malfeasance infested, undemocratic, Constitution disrespecting presidential admin in a century.

    And basically we’re going to kick you’re (you and the rest of the delusional schizophrenic insane Right’s) ass.

    That was what I saw.

    You must’ve been watching American Idol. Which is just fine…go back to sleep, the Republican party has your best interests in mind (not). Zzzzz….

    Peter (e70d1c)

  108. On Obama’s “pig” comment Obama is cynically manipulating all of us. He makes nasty comments like that using code words (pig, fish) that seem harmless as old phrases but phrases that have deep meaning (the fish smell). This is like his giving his finger to Hillary. I don’t think he’s coming apart at all but showing his vicious hatred of women. What strikes me as very odd is how that seems to play very well with the press and the crowds. How can all those young women support him when he shows such disrespect to them and all women. Hooray for McCain’s campaign calling on Obama’s vicious sexism. Maybe this will be the end of the “gangsta” rap candidate.

    moi61537 (1f9d81)

  109. “After the nasty belittling repulsive crap the Republican’s pulled at the RNC…”

    You mean the part where they called Obama a manwhore/trailerparktrash/unfitfather/redneck/bookburner/biblethumper? Yeah, I guess we all missed that part.

    Dmac (e639cc)

  110. #105. Exactly! He meant it just as everyone has said he meant it. He’s not a stupid man. SEK – there may be lexus nexus references but this is just the too cute by half stunt the one would pull. Just look at this cute little middle finger salute he pulled when talking about Hillary and then claimed he did not. He looks just like my brother when he thought he got away with something.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DygBj4Zw6No
    It’s just offensive.

    Robin (f8a2e9)

  111. When Obama said pig he was referring to the capitalist variety. Capitalist pit bull doesn’t have the same ring to it.

    I guess those old slogans too easily slip from the tongue.

    Amphipolis (fdbc48)

  112. “Lipstick” was clearly the talking point of the day for the Dems. They used it earlier in the day at a Biden event and Bob Beckel used it on Fox News. It was scripted and distributed for mass messaging.

    Obama, Sweetie, you can take the tail off a donkey, but it’s still an ass.

    Pedro (f8c307)

  113. The smackdown response ad:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yZd_Y_D-RaA
    “Ready to lead? No. Ready to smear? Yes.”

    Icy Truth (225b9d)

  114. http://pajamasmedia.com/blog/severe-palin-panic-strikes-democrats/
    I can’t see the video clips from work but one commenter provides two links that supposedly show Obama saying the same thing at two separate events.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UoOFp-RDpvM

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zhkq11UExcw

    voiceofreason2 (10af7e)

  115. #110
    Haw haw haw the implied innocence by that add is really really funny. Do the Reps, especially Palin really want to try and play the poor wounded widdle innocent bunnies? That isn’t her image. She seems more of a “oh yah? BRING IT B’YACH!” kinda gal. Not sure the Reps wanna go around cryin for mama.

    Besides after the “Obama wants to show rubbers and porn films to yer kids in kindergarden” smear the add you linked just seems lame. It carries with it the savage reek of hypocrisy. Sorta like old fish wrapped in newspaper.

    EdWood (c2268a)

  116. It’s interesting to note that the virulent pro-Obama posters here (as opposed to the more moderate folks who support the Senator) appear to have missed out on English composition.

    I’m just sayin’, to quote Ace.

    Eric Blair (2708f4)

  117. Racists

    JD (5f0e11)

  118. Obama isn’t apologizing (at least not YET) so he’s still in the race! Unless he apologizes. Then he’s done.

    On to the debate round!

    EdWood (c2268a)

  119. OOOPS. Obama

    Patti Edinger (1c455f)

  120. It is not fair. I think everyone is picking on him because he is half white and was raised by a white family.

    Patti Edinger (1c455f)

  121. I think that “lipstick” comment put Obama in deep Macaca! YIKES

    Patti Edinger (1c455f)

  122. How can this be a macaca moment? Obama has already spent 20 years in the church of a paranoid, racist loon and has had his children given moral instructions in a racially demented religion. A macaca moment? What, did this somehow finally tip the scales? Were things in doubt up until now? It’s like Charles Manson killing people and then you finally decide he’s a bad guy when he finally jaywalks on top of it all.

    K T Cat (ac1de3)

  123. Peter:

    “You can take what Obama said anyway you want. This was no mistake at all. I think the subtext was certainly Palin and McCain and I say bravo.”

    Andrew Sullivan:

    “We are being asked to believe that he called Sarah Palin a pig. If the people making that accusation have half a brain they know it’s not true. This is not a question of interpretation. It is a fact. So we now find out again that John McCain is prepared to tell an absolute lie – in public, verifiable, uncontestable.”

    I believe Andrew Sullivan just said Peter has half a brain and is a liar.

    Patterico (cc3b34)

  124. Patterico, lovely riposte to Peter.

    This all underscores the problems of a victicrat culture, and it goes back to Animal Farm: all animals are created equal, but some are more equal than others.

    Obama and his surrogates have worked hard to find racial “codewords” everywhere. So the “lipstick on a pig,” “old fish,” and flipping off business suddenly are harder to shrug off.

    Now they are claiming that people misinterpret Obama’s own sexist language (I’m still amazed he got a pass on the “Sweetie” business a few months ago). They actually have said that folks need to be less sensitive.

    Selecting Sarah Palin was brilliant. Almost any attack that can be made on Palin boomerangs right back onto Obama.

    Why, I actually heard a long time Leftist actress state that it was insulting to think that a woman would vote for another woman based on her gender.

    What did that make you think?

    Experience issues? Ditto.

    Earmarks? Check.

    Who knows how the election will turn out, but if nothing else, this demonstrates the hypocrisy and dishonesty behind group identity politics. Maybe we can start to look at policies and the quality of a candidate’s character.

    It’s a dream, I know.

    Eric Blair (36c1a9)

  125. Oh, and remember, Patterico:

    YOU didn’t say that about Peter.

    Andrew Sullivan did.

    See? It’s easy to think the Obama Way!

    Eric Blair (36c1a9)


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