Patterico's Pontifications

10/21/2019

President Trump: We May Have To Get In Wars While We Pull Out Of Wars

Filed under: General — Dana @ 5:42 pm



[guest post by Dana]

The Pentagon is prepping a “just in case” plan with regard to U.S. troops currently in Afghanistan:

The Pentagon recently began drawing up plans for an abrupt withdrawal of all U.S. troops from Afghanistan in case President Donald Trump surprises military leaders by ordering an immediate drawdown as he did in Syria, three current and former defense officials said.

The contingency planning is ongoing, the officials said, and includes the possibility that Trump orders all U.S. troops out of Afghanistan within weeks. Officials cautioned, however, that the planning is a precaution and there is currently no directive from the White House to pull U.S. troops out of Afghanistan.

One of the officials called it “prudent planning.”

Another official described the president’s current approach to Syria as “a dress rehearsal” for what could happen in Afghanistan.

While President Trump has reiterated his goal of bringing U.S. troops home, his re-deployment of troops from Syria to Iraq, as well as sending more than 1,000 troops to Saudia Arabia, undermine his pledge.

The President said today that while he was trying to get the U.S. out of wars, we may, nonetheless, have to get involved in wars:

President Donald Trump on Monday offered a confusing description of his foreign policy priorities as commander in chief — insisting that he was working to bring home American soldiers while warning the U.S. may soon enter into new military conflicts.

“I’m trying to get out of wars. We may have to get in wars, too. OK? We may have to get in wars,” Trump told reporters at the White House.

“We’re better prepared than we’ve ever been,” he continued. “If Iran does something, they’ll be hit like they’ve never been hit before. I mean, we have things that we’re looking at.”

With that, there is an eye-opening report out about President Trump’s first Pentagon meeting with then- Defense Secretary James Mattis, wherein Mattis attempted to help Trump understand foreign policy and the big world picture. Much to his frustration however, the President was more interested in a big, flashy military parade:

Mattis, for whom I was working as chief speechwriter, had hoped the briefing would educate Trump on the United States’ longstanding commitment to the rest of the world. That is not at all what happened.

Instead, the president burst out in the middle of the meeting.

“I just returned from France,” he said. “Did you see President Macron’s handshake?” he asked no one in particular. “He wouldn’t let go. He just kept holding on. I spent two hours at Bastille Day. Very impressive.”

A pause.

“I want a ‘Victory Day.’ Just like Veterans Day. The Fourth of July is too hot,” he said, apparently out of nowhere. “I want vehicles and tanks on Main Street. On Pennsylvania Avenue, from the Capitol to the White House. We need spirit! We should blow everybody away with this parade. The French had an amazing parade on Bastille Day with tanks and everything. Why can’t we do that?”

[…]

It was far from what Mattis had expected as he prepared meticulously for the meeting just hours before.

As the seconds ticked down, Mattis’ nervous energy had been palpable. Unusually so. Normally stoic and deliberate with his movements, this morning he was electrified. He was pacing in his office in the Pentagon, moving from a standing desk that faced the Potomac to the small circular table and back again. He shuffled his notes, putting them into a nondescript dark blue folder, pausing for a few seconds in hesitation before pulling them out again to rearrange their order. Things needed to be perfect.

I understood why he was nervous. We all did. At any time, this briefing would be a big deal for the department, regardless of the president. But in Trump’s case, the briefing had a heightened importance.

[…]

They felt incredible pressure to educate the president, believing that if only Trump could be made to recognize the value of American allies and the stability afforded by the presence of our troops, he’d reconsider and alter course.

If anyone could change the president’s mind, it was Mattis.

Unfortunately, he couldn’t. It’s a fascinating, behind-the-scenes look at the effort made to educate Trump about U.S. foreign policy and the impact it has on the rest of the world, as well as our relationship with other nations. It’s written by Guy Snodgrass, former chief speechwriter for Defense Secretary Jim Mattis. I’m linking to it because it offers a view into why the President’s “foreign policy” is so “hazy”.

–Dana

132 Responses to “President Trump: We May Have To Get In Wars While We Pull Out Of Wars”

  1. I would like to give Trump the benefit of the doubt and say that what he *meant* to say was, if Iran strikes the U.S. directly, we would go to war, but he has not historically given me much reason to give him the benefit of the doubt.

    Dana (05f22b)

  2. Er, there’s no link to the Mattis story.

    Kishnevi (356aa4)

  3. I think Trump’s statement is another example of his use of that old military veteran General Bluster to help him out.

    Kishnevi (356aa4)

  4. Linked.

    Dana (05f22b)

  5. Thanks.

    Kishnevi (356aa4)

  6. Damned Politico is getting all sorts of respect around here now… what has changed?

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  7. Well politico is the den of villainy from wence times reporters (martin
    haberman) journal (lee,) and others arise

    https://election.ctvnews.ca/results

    narciso (d1f714)

  8. Wars occur when the aggressor perceives the other side as being weak. The whole world now knows Trump is weak. All bluster and babble; no guts, no brains, no principles. Our enemies are strengthening themselves regionally in preparation for attacking us directly. If God loves America, He will have removed Trump by then, one way or another, but it may still be too late.

    nk (dbc370)

  9. Of course Trump’s foreign policy is “hazy” – he said it during the campaign when asked about his simple and easy plan to defeat ISIS, you don’t reveal your plans to your enemies, you always keep them guessing and you catch them by surprise. The thing you have to realize is that everybody is the enemy as far as Trump is concerned. He has no allies, no advisors, no trusted friends. Everybody hates Trump because they’re insanely jealous of his fantastic, historic and unprecedented wealth, power, wit, charm, charisma, intelligence, wisdom, good looks, athleticism, taste and – above all – his humble humility. Trump is a veritable god and yet he knows if he lets his guard down for a single moment, shows one little sign of weakness, somebody will swoop right in and steal his strawberries.

    Jerryskids (702a61)

  10. After 18 years and the govt holds less territory than in 2002, you have to consider the success of the mission.

    narciso (d1f714)

  11. Then you look at what happened to the senior chief to lorrance to goldsteyn , this is how we treat soldiers on the front line?

    narciso (d1f714)

  12. What no pithy comeback, no preprinted slogan to wave?

    narciso (d1f714)

  13. 10… yes, it was all going so swimmingly well, narciso.

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  14. The Pentagon recently began drawing up plans for an abrupt withdrawal of all U.S. troops from Afghanistan in case President Donald Trump surprises military leaders by ordering an immediate drawdown as he did in Syria, three current and former defense officials said.

    Will the white flag factory be up and running and all our tanks have rear view mirrors (so they can see the enemy) installed on time?

    nk (dbc370)

  15. It seems to me that France’s parades is not the only thing that Trump wants to emulate. What does is seem like to you, comrades? The world’s most powerful military preparing for a surprise withdrawal order from their commander-in-chief?

    nk (dbc370)

  16. 14… given all the planning these folks are responsible for, it’s surprising they didn’t have one already prepared.

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  17. @14.The Pentagon recently…

    Just “recently?” Speaks volumes.

    How many decades were the generals planning on ‘playing army’ over there?? Time to come home kids- Daddy’ home and dinner’s ready!

    DCSCA (797bc0)

  18. They arent letting black face trudeau are they, again?

    narciso (d1f714)

  19. Goes to look…at the moment, the Liberals seem to have 1 seat won, the other 337 seats undecided.

    Kishnevi (356aa4)

  20. A bit more red there, like the old pre 2000 color scheme

    narciso (d1f714)

  21. Teh Womyn of NeverTrump… https://twitter.com/hollandcourtney/status/1185712633934036992

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  22. Wolfowitz appointment during booooshes wars has to be right up there as one of the worst hires in presidential history. Globalist dopes.

    mg (8cbc69)

  23. never seen stars so saggy, Col.

    mg (8cbc69)

  24. You should put a warning there coronello

    narciso (d1f714)

  25. It ain’t helping their libido, mg…

    My apologies, narciso.

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  26. How do you prepare your Pierre?

    Well done Lucky; medium rare Cardin or Delecto raw.

    DCSCA (797bc0)

  27. Impeachment may be the only way to salvage face.

    Kevin M (19357e)

  28. Holy crap #9 is a genius post.

    JRH (52aed3)

  29. Just “recently?” Speaks volumes.

    How many decades were the generals planning on ‘playing army’ over there?? Time to come home kids- Daddy’ home and dinner’s ready!

    DCSCA (797bc0) — 10/21/2019 @ 6:37 pm

    Actually makes sense. Obviously Trump’s fans can’t admit this, but there’s no need for the military to plan for such a hasty bizarre retreat except that the president is a coward taking his orders from our enemies.

    We need a plan for all kinds of crazy things happening, but if we leave Afghanistan, we’d want to do so with a proper plan, talking to our allies and protecting our secrets and equipment. I am sure they had such a plan before we got there and update this one all the time.

    It’s the OMG leave now I’m so scared! Turkey/ISIS hugging Trump plan they didn’t have yet. But they do now, so you can smile with Putin.

    Dustin (6d7686)

  30. Vote for Trump = Vote for Free ISIS

    Dustin (6d7686)

  31. @31. Actually makes sense.

    Except it doesn’t.

    Planning for all contingences does.

    DCSCA (797bc0)

  32. Everybody wants to do the same thing that hasnt worked in 17 years, now you want to chalk it to corruption diversion to the other front,

    narciso (d1f714)

  33. 31. Huge surprise! Trump has just now talked about ending the endless military acions.

    If your version of “just now” is June of 2015. Or more accurately November 2016, but
    for sure, January 2017. Some big surprise.

    iowan2 (9c8856)

  34. Ending endless wars does not equal cutting and running.

    Kishnevi (1a529d)

  35. “Obviously Trump’s fans can’t admit this, but there’s no need for the military to plan for such a hasty bizarre retreat except that the president is a coward taking his orders from our enemies.”

    On one hand, yes, but on the other hand, we’ve had 3 years of Trump being an impulsive moron, so maybe they should have sketched this one out.

    Davethulhu (fe4242)

  36. 33… DCSCA is right, of course. Plans for all scenarios.

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  37. 35… you can’t make this up. You have to pay attention to have a clue about events.

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  38. @31 What if we needed the troops in AF someplace in a hurry for a non-Putin related reason? Or is that inconceivable?

    We need to start a game like 6 degrees of Kevin Bacon but with Putin and we can make the starting point anything. Vanilla ice cream, go. Ice cream is a dairy product, dairy comes from cows, cows are herded by men on horses, Putin has been seen on horseback. Eating vanilla ice cream means you’re a Russian asset, I did it in 4.

    Frosty, Fp (f27e97)

  39. There’s some Hillary in all of them.

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  40. Thirty five or so years ago, they gave most of the money to sayyaf hekmatyar khalis et al thats where the talibam ams al queda came from.

    narciso (d1f714)

  41. On one hand, yes, but on the other hand, we’ve had 3 years of Trump being an impulsive moron, so maybe they should have sketched this one out.

    Davethulhu (fe4242) — 10/21/2019 @ 8:38 pm

    Well said, but a proper plan to leave afghanistan will have to take more time than Trump and Putin are going to give us. This is why an intel trove full of our stuff was the pride of those Russian PMC guys.

    It’s very easy for the chickenhawk crowd to assume the military is basically magical, but logistics operations for leaving a place like Syria or Afghanistan require the kind of plans they had for over a decade… that’s not how Trump works though, so I suppose they need plans for blowing our stuff up first and foremost.

    Don’t trust guys who act like they know all about the military but were conveniently in Paris or had bone spurs or something when the nation actually asked them to serve. They are the very kinds of folks who screw things like our sweet deal in Syria up. They don’t really mind that we’ll be back in a more costly way, because hey, they want to win some dumb partisan thing.

    Dustin (6d7686)

  42. What if we needed the troops in AF someplace in a hurry for a non-Putin related reason

    We have over a million people in the military.

    Dustin (6d7686)

  43. From “whatabout” to “whatif”. You Trump-supporting gentlemen are all stable geniuses. You should all be nominated for several Nobel prizes.

    The documented reason is not

    “What if we needed the troops in AF someplace in a hurry for a non-Putin related reason?”

    The documented reason is

    “The Pentagon recently began drawing up plans for an abrupt withdrawal of all U.S. troops from Afghanistan in case President Donald Trump surprises military leaders by ordering an immediate drawdown as he did in Syria, three current and former defense officials said.”

    That’s what we’re talking about. A loose cannon that the military does not know when it will go off and in what direction it will be pointed when it does. An orange cannon. But by all means, adhere to the canon.

    nk (dbc370)

  44. Also what Dustin said. We cross-posted.

    nk (dbc370)

  45. Except it doesn’t.

    Planning for all contingences does.

    DCSCA (797bc0) — 10/21/2019 @ 8:13 pm

    What branch did you serve in? Anyone who served as an E1 overseas will know that we obviously have always had a withdrawal strategy in Afghanistan. We’ve had multiple evac routes. Plans for if we have this or that enemy. Etc.

    But no, we did not have a plan for our president being intimidated by every dictator with a GDP of 76 goats, or flinching whenever Putin looks him in the eye. USA hasn’t generally needed a plan for if our president is a total coward who frees ISIS.

    The same crowd of shills is saying the same sort of stuff. I see they are throwing in a little Hillary love to be obnoxious (cause Trump gets away with promoting Hillary so heavily). Believe it or not, the reason ISIS is free and our troops are in greater risk is not a failure of our military planning.

    A vote for Trump is a vote for freeing ISIS. Plain and simple.

    Dustin (6d7686)

  46. @44 And they are all magically interchangeable and the magic logistical problems of getting any of them from point A to point B would always be more efficient than moving troops in AF to point B. Of course there’s also nothing more important than staying in AF that might cause a rapid withdrawal. And it’s totes unreasonable for there to be any sort of plan to blow stuff up as part of a withdrawal.

    I can admit that my hypothetical is unlikely and contrived. Can you admit that it’s inconceivable? That’s it’s so inconceivable that only Trump being a Russian agent is the simplest possible explanation for how it could ever happen. And before you answer I’ll remind you that Trump being erratic is a simpler answer that is much more likely than OMG leave now I’m so scared! Turkey/ISIS hugging Trump.

    Also, who was in Paris? Did I miss a memo?

    Frosty, Fp (f27e97)

  47. Isis was in the counter terror section of the police, in the internalecurity at bnd probably in mi 5, the colombo bomber had come back by raqqua at the beginning of 2016, but they were focused on other pursuit

    narciso (d1f714)

  48. But no, we did not have a plan for our president being intimidated by every dictator with a GDP of 76 goats …

    That is hilarious, Dustin.

    DRJ (15874d)

  49. Or tragic, but in an hilarious way.

    DRJ (15874d)

  50. I think Romney had student deferments and was on a Mormon mission in Paris during Vietnam.

    DRJ (15874d)

  51. Also, who was in Paris? Did I miss a memo?

    Frosty, Fp (f27e97) — 10/21/2019 @ 9:31 pm

    I was insulting Romney to poke fun at how fickle GOP fandom is.

    Dustin (6d7686)

  52. @47

    Anyone who served as an E1 overseas will know that we obviously have always had a withdrawal strategy in Afghanistan. We’ve had multiple evac routes. Plans for if we have this or that enemy. Etc

    We’ve always had a plan for evac? So, this isn’t a recent plan is what you’re saying?

    we did not have a plan for our president being intimidated by every dictator with a GDP of 76 goats

    How is a plan for evac because of 76 goats functionally different from a regular evac plan for non-goat related reason? I mean sure, it would have a section for killing as many of those goats as possible on the way out but other than that what else? Granted, taking the non-goat plan and reusing it to make the goat plan is how a sharp E1 could make E2 but it stills seems like the beginning, middle, and end would basically be the same, except for the goats.

    Frosty, Fp (f27e97)

  53. Yes they killed 2700, and injured 20,000, harmless goat herders

    narciso (d1f714)

  54. It did not seem likely that America would need to plan for the immediate pull out of troops from areas where the President and military, working together, could deal with the existing threats.

    But now that Trump is President, obviously the military must now plan for the possibility of Spontaneous Surrender.

    DRJ (15874d)

  55. Ewe goat to be kidding me.

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  56. Yes they killed 2700, and injured 20,000, harmless goat herders

    narciso (d1f714) — 10/21/2019 @ 9:52 pm

    No doubt, ISIS and Al Qaeda must be taken seriously. I joke about Putin a lot, but it’s incomprehensible that Trump let those guys free.

    before the World Trade Center the tallest, and and then when they built the World Trade Center it became known as the second-tallest, and now it’s the tallest

    That a guy bragging about that hours after those people died would be elected to any office is also incomprehensible.

    That’s the one thing you Trump fans have over me. I don’t get why things are the way they are. I freely admit that it confuses me that Trump got a single vote. He shouldn’t even be voting for himself.

    Dustin (6d7686)

  57. @56 The real question is do we need more than 1 plan. You’re saying we need a plan for spontaneous surrender but do we also need one for spontaneous surrender to goats? Do the number of goats matter? Do we need ones for other farm animals common to the ME and Asia?

    I wonder if some intrepid journalist can find 3 pentagon officials who can answer a question like that?

    Frosty, Fp (f27e97)

  58. No taliban and al queda, so tell me the plan

    narciso (d1f714)

  59. @58 I agree. The world is very confusing and there are a lot of things that don’t make any sense.

    Frosty, Fp (f27e97)

  60. We cant the leave the way we came in, thats uzbekistan,cant go west thats iran.

    narciso (d1f714)

  61. Yes they killed 2700, and injured 20,000, harmless goat herders

    narciso (d1f714) — 10/21/2019 @ 9:52 pm

    That’s why the cheezeburger loving surrender monkey shouldn’t, you know, surrender. ISIS isn’t defeated, he wanted to bring the Taliban to Camp David to have a sit down, did you forget that, it wasn’t that long ago!!! Plus letting Putin, Kim, et al play him like a cheap fiddle.

    He’s a waste of air.

    Colonel Klink (Ret) (6e7a1c)

  62. fiddle, without the hyphen.

    Colonel Klink (Ret) (6e7a1c)

  63. mr. president donald who is president donald trump the president who is president of the united states has sacrificed 2 million or 5 million goats to be president and is even donating his salary which is 400,000 goats or over 450,000 goats because he does not care about goats but only wants to make america great and it’s all very unfair that people are picking on him and don’t allow him to run the country the way he wants and look out for that sippy cup
    https://www.foxnews.com/politics/trump-unloads-over-controversies-the-president-of-the-united-states-should-be-a-to-run-the-country

    nk (dbc370)

  64. I love nk’s comments lately.

    He expected nothing of Donald Trump and he’s still disappointed. It’s how my dad feels about me every time I supersize his combo on the sly but forget the Sweet and Sour sauce.

    Dustin (6d7686)

  65. Canadian vote projections indicate Trudeau will lead minority government
    Prime Minister Justin Trudeau has survived scandal and missteps to win a plurality of seats in Parliament in Canada’s federal election, news media here projected, but he failed to retain his majority, leaving his government dependent on the support of smaller parties to advance his agenda.
    Trudeau’s Liberal Party has won more seats than Andrew Scheer’s Conservatives, the Canadian Broadcasting Corp. and CTV News projected shortly after polls closed Monday night, but fell short of the 170 needed for a majority in the 338-seat House of Commons. As of late Monday night, preliminary results from Elections Canada indicated that the Liberals were leading or had won 155 seats — down from the 184 they won in 2015. The Conservative Party was in second with 122 seats, but led in the popular vote. …..

    Both the third-place separatist Bloc Quebecois and the fourth-place New Democratic Party appeared to have enough seats to help the Liberals stay in power.

    Rip Murdock (d93e1f)

  66. Lets see:

    We’ve been in Afghanistan for 15 years with “victory” nowhere ins sight.
    Trump has been saying he wants out of Afghanistan for 3 years

    And the Pentagon is only NOW making up plans to get out. Incredible.

    rcocean (1a839e)

  67. Amazing how people can write “orange man bad” in the comments, day after day, month after month, year after years. It takes a certain kind of mind. I’d get bored, but liberals and their friends like chanting party lines.

    rcocean (1a839e)

  68. As for General Matis, he’s like many of these Generals, a massive ego and likes to talk. I think Trump learned a lot about them, and being POTUS has changed his mind about them. He thought they just smart patriots who wanted to salute and carry out orders, and he found they’re mostly prima donnas with large sensitive egos who can’t wait to run to the press and tell them they disagree with the President. Like some in the FBI/CIA, these top military leaders don’t understand they aren’t in charge. Trump sets policy in Afghanistan – not the Generals. Trump has given them 3 years and they haven’t “Won”.

    rcocean (1a839e)

  69. @47. Wave the flag over the graves: billions spent and wasted on a military with no plan for an attack from within by 20 guys swiping planes and slamming into the WTC or the Pentagon, either– doing more damage to America proper than any Russian or Axis power ever did. The failure of creative thinking; to plan for the unexpected is expensive; cost lives and property.

    DCSCA (797bc0)

  70. The Democrats sure do love wars. They used to be the peace party, but if Trump wants to “Bring the boys home” the D’s want them to stay “Over there” forever.

    rcocean (1a839e)

  71. @68. That’s because conflict is their business. They’ll drag it out as long as they can. For example, the U.S. established airbases in Britain, an “ally” in WWII — in 1942. They only finally shuttered several– 40 years after Germany was defeated – and a few years after the Berlin Wall was dismantled– in the 80’s and into the early 90’s — yet still, 77 years later, long after victory over the Nazis, maintain USAFE ops at RAF Lakenheath among a few other installations. You know, keeping Great Britain safe from Hitler’s tyranny in 2019– make your checks payable to Pentagon, Inc., c/o Xi Jinping.

    DCSCA (797bc0)

  72. The Lost Art Of Exiting A War

    Specifically: para heading- ‘Without An Exit Strategy, The Right Conditions For Withdrawal Are Never Apparent’

    “The recommendation of not planning for withdrawal invites with enthusiasm the exact mechanism that leads to indefinite military interventions, the meandering of political objectives from what they were when the war was initiated. U.S. soldiers in Syria soon found themselves a tempting tool to be used by civilian and military leaders in search of new monster to destroy. They were then intended to counter Iranian, Russian and Syrian regime influence in the region, objectives that most certainly could not be achieved within acceptable costs (especially with the limited resources committed). Now as troops in Syria are being withdrawn, politicians and analysts are warning abut the gains that will be made by Russia and Iran as the United States vacates. This was not the purpose of their involvement in the first place, and shouldn’t be their purpose now.”

    https://www.warontherocks.com/2019/10/the-lost-art-of-exiting-a-war/

    DCSCA (797bc0)

  73. You know, keeping Great Britain safe from Hitler’s tyranny in 2019

    Yes, force projection and training with allies is a truly demented aspect of US military deployment.

    JP (7a537c)

  74. mittens reminds me of Neville Chamberlin

    mg (8cbc69)

  75. Thumbnail

    mg (8cbc69)

  76. As for General Matis, he’s like many of these Generals, a massive ego and likes to talk. I think Trump learned a lot about them, and being POTUS has changed his mind about them. He thought they just smart patriots who wanted to salute and carry out orders, and he found they’re mostly prima donnas with large sensitive egos who can’t wait to run to the press and tell them they disagree with the President. Like some in the FBI/CIA, these top military leaders don’t understand they aren’t in charge. Trump sets policy in Afghanistan – not the Generals. Trump has given them 3 years and they haven’t “Won”.

    rcocean (1a839e) — 10/21/2019 @ 11:46 pm

    Trump sets policy.
    The generals bring back proposals to enact that policy and highlight the costs, befits, risks and potential downsides.
    Trump hasn’t endorsed any proposal. Part of this is push back from within his political coalition. Bob Woodward’s book had a lot of detail about that.

    Now they’re making plans for the president issuing an off the cuff order and how to adjust to that. Smart on their part. Unfortunate that it’s happening this way. Complicated situations are rarely improved by knee jerk decisions.

    Time123 (797615)

  77. How many broken campaign promises will it take before the Trump humpers decide they don’t like him anymore?

    Gryph (08c844)

  78. I wouldn’t worry about our soon-to-be-former alliances too much. Trump has fixed it so that no putative ally is going to trust a bunch of red-white-and-blue, yellow-bellied, backstabbers to fight by their side anymore. They’re going to look for other ways to defend themselves, and tell the American troops stationed on their soil to go back to America and complete their sex changes. The coubnries where the Trump-Kushner crime family has investments and construction contracts might hold on a little, while knowing that they will also be sold out to a higher bidder or when the crime family’s profits drop.

    nk (dbc370)

  79. Near complete equivalence. A bisexual California first-term Representative in menage a trois with her husband and a girlfriend equals Trump and Russian hookers. I would say totally complete instead of near complete if I didn’t strongly suspect that one of the Russian hookers was a male hooker.

    nk (dbc370)

  80. there’s actual evidence in the first case, there’s none in the latter, I imagine a lot of alcohol was involved,

    narciso (d1f714)

  81. yes the brits fought the first afghan war in 1837-1841, it ended with a slaughter, dr. Bryden was the only survivor among 10,000, the second war in 1876-1880, is the one where Watson got the jezail grapeshot, most familiar to kipling’s memory, the third happened after the first world war, but there were some assorted 60 military expeditions from buner 1859, after the Indian Mutiny, to malakand 1897, (where Churchill made his debut) so to the search for the fakir from 1914-1941 (spoiler he died at home, away from any brits,) so you tell me there is a majic formula we can employ, and I have to use a Spanish cognate,

    narciso (d1f714)

  82. @82

    If the Breitbart pc is accurate (and it appears to be substantiated) she should resign. If she refuses to do so she should be impeached and removed from office.

    So long as it’s all consenting adults, free from coercion, I don’t care who sleeps with who. But it’s hard to justify consent when we’re talking about a 22 year old who works for you. That’s why we have ethics rules against it. Oh, when the sexual behavior stands in stark contrast with their public policy position I think that’s pertinent. If you want to codify your moral positions into law you should adhere to them yourself. But I feel less strongly about the second one.

    Time123 (797615)

  83. @82
    I don’t see how this has any meaningful connection to the Steele dossier. Not sure why you view it otherwise.

    Time123 (797615)

  84. that was alleged kompromat, provided by a burnt british spy, who moonlit for oligarchs like deripaska, who were useful to the us govt, when they were looking for levinson, the ex company operative in iran, I conjectured, that deripaska, was upset that his business partner, manafort was sitting pretty while he was taking a bath with depressed aluminum prices, so he lent his contacts to steele, and then the borscht thickened,

    so you have a magic answer to the insoluble problem of the ghazi, the 19th century term for jihadist

    narciso (d1f714)

  85. I don’t see how it’s going to undermine the impeachment, either. Talk about grasping at straws.

    And whatabout Duncan Hunter spending campaign money on his lobbyist paramour? He’s a big Trump butt gerbil, isn’t he? Is that going to shore up the impeachment?

    nk (dbc370)

  86. Man, Hunters to the left, Hunters to the right, people Biden their time to play the Trump card ….

    nk (dbc370)

  87. @88
    You’re a smart guy, but the leap from the beginning to the end of that comment is just weird. Is it a separate and unrelated question or is that intended to follow logically from the first part?

    Also you’re not really explain why the Hill accusations have anything to do with the steele dossier.

    Time123 (daab2f)

  88. I don’t see how it’s going to undermine the impeachment, either. Talk about grasping at straws.

    It doesn’t need to have anything to do with impeachment. It’s unethical behavior and should be dealt with accordingly.

    Time123 (daab2f)

  89. yes he stands up for the servicemen that the jag’s feed to to the maw, as we’ve seen with lorrance, it’s not a one off, now the Palestinian red diaper baby is who they penciled for that district,

    narciso (d1f714)

  90. going back to the point, you have an answer, the brits spent at least a century in the northwest frontier, from Elphinstone to Lawrence,

    narciso (d1f714)

  91. It’s California. There’s probably some anti-discrimination law that makes it a crime to refuse to participate in a bisexual threesome. A hate crime.

    nk (dbc370)

  92. I’m not all that foreign policy savvy, but I heard someone compare us in NE Syria to the dutch boy with his finger in the dyke. We had ISIS pretty much contained, and were maintaining a presence in a effed up region rife with enemies. We were the big dog. No one was going to f*** with us. Iran, China, Pakistan… Who dares f*** with us? Nobody. Enter Trump. The big dog turned tail and ran. We are showing how weak we are, willing to be toyed with and slapped around. You guys ok with the American military being slapped around? That really surprises me. If we exit Afghanistan, someone will move in to fill the void, count on it. Probably China.

    JRH (52aed3)

  93. northeast Syria is idlib province, that’s where al queda’s affiliate, is ensconced, yes the Syrian army with their delicate touch, does keep the latter bottled up, stop removing all doubt,

    narciso (d1f714)

  94. Completely OT but: 3,000 seat Megachurch demolished *mid-worship service* in China. Pastors detained. Remember that next time you hear champion of religious freedom Trump praise Xi or congratulate him on Communist Party rule. Or praise, Putin for that matter, where evangelism is against the law.

    https://www.chinaaid.org/2019/10/megachurch-demolished-pastors-detained.html

    JRH (52aed3)

  95. Putin, *who made evangelism against the law.

    JRH (52aed3)

  96. and Afghanistan is a brushfire compared to major conflict like china, of course they have been waging full spectrum warfare probably since 1999, when those two colonels wrote that paper, they took the money from the industrial base they methodically stripped, built up their missile force with the targeting data loral aerospace provided, other operations like costind their version of darpa, which was in partnership with Hambrecht and quist, that provided capital to salon around 1997, the hacking of 20 million confidential files from the opm, the artificial islands they started building since 2013, why is that date important, cgn’s traffic in nuclear secrets, who worked for cgn, and who was he in partner with, allen ho, with devon archer, partner in Rosemont Seneca,

    narciso (d1f714)

  97. @97 In the dutch boy story with the dike, I don’t think he was the big dog. Although you may be thinking of a different story.

    Iran and China have been messing with us since long before Syria. I don’t think much will change with Pakistan. I think to focus on this move in Syria as the thing that now causes America to shift from no one f’s with status to everyone f’s with status is giving it too much credit. You also need to remember that in the next five minutes Trump could do something else and then what would you do other than say “I didn’t think Trump could do more to make it worse but he did”. Didn’t something already happen in Finland that caused the US to lose it’s don’t f with status?

    Frosty, Fp (f27e97)

  98. I agree Mr. Narciso, they are bad news.

    JRH (52aed3)

  99. @102. I was conflating ideas. We were the Dutch Boy, whom nobody dared mess with. I take your point. This isn’t the first time we’ve shown weakness. but it is a humdinger of an example, and the latest.

    JRH (52aed3)

  100. We were the 800 pound gorilla that nobody dared mess with. Then we made Fay Wray President.

    nk (dbc370)

  101. #105

    Fay Wray was hawt. Trump — no.

    Appalled (1a17de)

  102. So Katie Hill’s consenting relationship(s) means that…Trump didn’t ask Ukraine to fake some Joe Biden’s kid’s scandal to tank the father.

    That tracks in Trumpworld.

    Colonel Klink (Ret) (6e7a1c)

  103. It’s California. There’s probably some anti-discrimination law that makes it a crime to refuse to participate in a bisexual threesome. A hate crime.

    Don’t be silly. It’s a high school graduation requirement anyway.

    Kevin M (19357e)

  104. Jeebus! This is what passes for political discussion less than 3 years into the Trump era? Imagine after 8 years! Brains won’t be exploding, just rotting in the skull.

    Kevin M (19357e)

  105. Impeachment on a bogus pretext, solves everything,

    narciso (b73c0f)

  106. The one thing you never see a Trump defender do is say that Donald Trump’s specific oopsy daisy is the exact right thing to do. I mean, I long for the learned specific defense of the Fake Emoluments Clause, the letter to Turkey, the method Trump used for pulling out of Syria.

    Instead, there’s deflection regarding sex adventures of an obscure freshman legislator, obscure summaries of British failures in Afghanistan, four star general bashing, Romney bashing.

    Syria and Afghanistan are both debatable propositions, with arguments pro and con about US involvement. Only Trump, though, thought reversing course on a dime and breaking faith with the people who we promised to protect was the right way to proceed. Only Trump thought breaking faith with the prison guards who held the foot soldiers of ISIS was a good idea.

    Appalled (1a17de)

  107. He’s either a stable genius or an unstable idiot.

    There is no in between, which is why Trump is so polarizing, and there is no way to find consensus or compromise.

    DRJ (15874d)

  108. All signs point to the latter. So that must mean it’s the former, because facts and evidence are always Trump’d by the FEELZ.

    Colonel Klink (Ret) (6e7a1c)

  109. The one thing you never see a Trump defender do is say that Donald Trump’s specific oopsy daisy is the exact right thing to do.

    Maybe you’re not looking in the right places?

    Radegunda (dd98be)

  110. so you’re pretending there was this great era of strength that trump stopped, how did Islamic state rise, because your guy, appalled, pulled out all forces all the way up the Euphrates, because Afghanistan was the ‘good war’ until he undermined the two theatre commanders then he didn’t after galbraith mounted a failed takedown, of Karzai, so the Taliban rose up in strength, the segments of the old Iraqi resistance including some of the sahwa, regrouped in Syria, but those were the jv team

    now general Flynn because he had served in spec ops, and previously helped design the counterinsurgency program, recognized al queda was not dead, certainly not in Afghanistan, not in north Africa, nor the greater arabia peninsula, and he wrote the ‘Salafist principality’ memo in 2012, but ‘gm was alive, and bin laden was dead’ yadda yadda, he also sacked general mattis, around the same time, general cartwright and co, leaked every secret worth knowing, to the times, including stuixtnet, which was imperfect stopgap to what needed to be done about the Iranian nuclear program, at some point we lost the entire network in iran, considering what we discovered about narges witte, we have some notion of what happened,

    narciso (d1f714)

  111. Hey, the world leaders have agreed to a deal on Northern Syria. Erdogan and Putin have agreed to take over, including “the oil”.

    The US was not consulted directly as Vlad had already told Trump what he is allowed to say.

    Colonel Klink (Ret) (6e7a1c)

  112. @75. It is when you have to borrow $ from China to finance it.

    Image the military of a once global empire that speaks the same language needing ‘training’– the Brits can take care of themselves; ‘1066 and all that.’

    DCSCA (797bc0)

  113. 116. I don’t think Trump wants either Turkey or Syria to get those oil fiels. Turkey going that deep into Syria would pose an extreme risk to the Kurds. Trump also thinks the (or a) alternative to the Kurds is ISIS. He probably would like the Kurds to stop selling the oil to the Syrian government and wants to get American oil companies involved. He may understand on;y fragments of this.

    Sammy Finkelman (0d0ca8)

  114. 99.

    champion of religious freedom Trump praise Xi

    Trump isn’t a champion of religious freedom. Pence and Pompeo and Mitch McConnell, among others, are (at least, or especially, for Christians.)

    And to some extent it’s affecting U.S. foreign policy.

    Mitch McConnell criticized the resolution on Syria that passed the House because it made no mention of religious freedom. Also because it didn’t say what should be done now re: U.S. troops in Syria, Now maybe that’s just for partissan advantage. I think he said the Dem leadership wanted to aoid a vote problematic for some members.

    Sammy Finkelman (0d0ca8)

  115. 42. narciso (d1f714) — 10/21/2019 @ 8:57 pm

    Thirty five or so years ago, they gave most of the money to sayyaf hekmatyar khalis et al thats where the talibam ams al queda came from. >blockquote> Because Pakistan insisted, and Reagan didn’t understand the consequences (to the extent that he got that deep in the weeds)

    Sammy Finkelman (0d0ca8)

  116. IF Trump actually ever does get us out of Afghanistan and Syria he will have the approval of the American people forever. Its only the armchair warriors and neo-clowns who want us to stay and fight. And of course Pierre Delecto.

    rcocean (1a839e)

  117. Now un like the noi ingush kalmyk mao didnt relocate the uygurs across the territory.

    narciso (d1f714)

  118. And of course Pierre Delecto.

    Whatabout John Barron, John Miller, Carolin Gallego, and David Dennison? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pseudonyms_of_Donald_Trump Will they want to stay and fight?

    nk (dbc370)

  119. Motes and beams. (A literate person will know the reference.)

    nk (dbc370)

  120. #115

    I have no time for your collection of squirrels. I take your answer is “the alternatives to Trump are worse, because Obama”. You certainly don’t defend Trump’s actions.

    Appalled (1a17de)

  121. Well all that happened thanks to who you voted for, you want to end a war, now the only strikes against syrian regime were i. this administration the only confromtation with russian mercenaries, the only heavy weapons sold to ukraine.

    narciso (d1f714)

  122. At least every week, sometimes 2X-3X a week we get told Trump has done one of the worst things ever. After a week or less, the media is off to the next outrage and ignoring week 4’s “biggest outrage in the history of our Union”.
    I can only conclude that week 4’s outrage really wasn’t all that bad since have now we moved onto his use of the word lynching. The use of the word lynching should be buried under piles of news about the week 4 outrage, but no.

    steveg (354706)

  123. The thing is, any one of trumps many “outrages” would have meant curtains for any other President. Can you imagine Geo W Bush or Obama getting away with “grab em by the pu$$y” or meeting with Putin with just an interpreter and then confiscating the notes, or paying off pornstars or tweeting maniacally, or telling the FBI director to let an investigation go and then firing him when he failed to drop it, or putting up foreign officials at hotel properties owned by the President, or witholding aid from an ally unless they invetigate a political oponent… the list goes on. I know for a fact conservatives would be howling if Obama did any one of these things. The only reason the media moves from outrage to outrage is because the Pres. supplies a never-ending stream of them.

    JRH (52aed3)

  124. A tape that had been in the nbc vaulta which described practices at the peacock. Conaidering confidential communications with the russian ambassador had been previodly leaked.

    narciso (d1f714)

  125. A new CNN/SSRS poll on Tuesday found that only 6% of Republican voters favor Trump’s ouster — a sobering statistic for GOP lawmakers who want a long future in politics.https://www.cnn.com/2019/10/23/politics/donald-trump-impeachment-ukraine-testimony/index.html

    Sodom on the left, that would be the Democrats, and Gomorrah on the right, that would be Trump’s Republican Party, and not ten honest men to be found between them. America is lost.

    nk (dbc370)

  126. 128. JRH (52aed3) — 10/22/2019 @ 8:05 pm

    or telling the FBI director to let an investigation go and then firing him when he failed to drop it,

    Comey did let the case against Mike Flynn “go”, although his story soon was that he didn’t.

    At 6:25 am February 15, 2017, Zero Hedge has this: (that’s Feb 15 in spite of the URL
    saying Feb 14)

    http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2017-02-14/mike-flynn-may-face-felony-charges-lyin
    g-fbi

    But by 10 pm Zero Hedge reports:

    http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2017-02-15/fbi-reportedly-will-not-pursue-charges-
    against-cooperative-and-truthful-mike-flynn

    https://mobile.twitter.com/jimsciutto/status/832013379124486148?p=v

    Jim Sciutto
    @jimsciutto

    Breaking: FBI NOT expected to pursue charges against #MichaelFlynn regarding pho
    ne calls w/Russian Ambassador, reports @evanperez

    3:45 PM – 15 Feb 2017

    ———–

    Jim Sciutto
    @jimsciutto

    Replying to @jimsciutto

    More: FBI says Flynn was cooperative and provided truthful answers

    3:47 PM – 15 Feb 2017

    ————————————————————–

    Yes, it was a leak, and not an official announcement, but leaks have meaning and can’t just be waved away.

    The Senate committee evidently didn’t discover this story, or similar ones derivative of it, like my next link, nor so far has apparetntly anyone else.

    http://www.cnn.com/2017/02/16/politics/fbi-not-expected-to-pursue-charges-agains
    t-flynn/index.html

    Here’s how it appeared on the KTLA (Channel 5 in Los Angeles) website:

    http://ktla.com/2017/02/16/fbi-not-expected-to-pursue-charges-against-michael-fl
    ynn-law-enforcement-officials

    FBI Not Expected to Pursue Charges Against Michael Flynn: Law Enforcement Officials

    Later on it was revived, and the FBI agents actually had to re-write their 302 forms – months later.

    And all that is not why Comey was fired, and you’re not too much more accurate with the other things you have here.

    Sammy Finkelman (0d0ca8)

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