Patterico's Pontifications

10/1/2017

Trump Tweets, Undercuts Tillerson And Sows Confusion. It’s All Part Of A Unique Master Plan, Right?!

Filed under: General — Dana @ 10:16 am

[guest post by Dana]

Yesterday:

The Trump administration acknowledged on Saturday for the first time that it was in direct communication with the government of North Korea over its missile and nuclear tests, seeking a possible way forward beyond the escalating threats of a military confrontation from both sides.

“We are probing, so stay tuned,” Secretary of State Rex W. Tillerson said, when pressed about how he might begin a conversation with Kim Jong-un, the North Korean leader, that could avert what many government officials fear is a significant chance of open conflict between the two countries.

“We ask, ‘Would you like to talk?’ We have lines of communications to Pyongyang — we’re not in a dark situation, a blackout,” he added. “We have a couple, three channels open to Pyongyang,” a reference to North Korea’s capital.

The report goes on to clarify that North Korea is not interested in any negotiations if they include a requirement to disarm, and that President Trump is unwilling to make any concessions. Tillerson’s spokesperson, Heather Nauert, offered this:

Despite assurances that the United States is not interested in promoting the collapse of the current regime, pursuing regime change, accelerating reunification of the peninsula or mobilizing forces north of the DMZ, North Korean officials have shown no indication that they are interested in or are ready for talks regarding denuclearization.

Cue President Trump’s morning tweets:

Untitled

Untitled2

Okay. I give. Clearly, I’m too ignorant to understand how comments like these reflect a clever and brilliant strategy. You, who have tapped into President Trump’s unique genius, are going to have to enlighten me. How are veiled threats and threats of annihilation helpful? It appears I’m not the only one confused:

North Korean officials are reaching out to Republican analysts in Washington, DC, in an effort to see what’s up with President Trump and his ​caustic ​comments about ​regime leader ​Kim Jong Un, according to a report Tuesday.

“Their number one concern is Trump. They can’t figure him out,” the Washington Post reported, quoting a person aware of the country’s reaching out to Asia experts with GOP connections.

And while the North Korean operatives have an “encyclopedic” understanding of what Trump tweets about Kim, they can’t get a fix on what makes the president tick.​

Evans Revere, a former State Department official who routinely had contact with North Korea, participated in the meeting in Switzerland and has his own opinion about what the operatives are up to.

“My own guess is that they are somewhat puzzled as to the direction in which the US is going, so they’re trying to open up channels to take the pulse in Washington,”​ ​he told the newspaper. “They haven’t seen the US act like this before.”

Maybe it’s a simple strategy of being so erratic and unpredictable that North Korea is kept off balance:

Some Trump aides have said that the discordant foreign policy voices emanating from the administration are intentionally out of sync — that Trump likes a set up where some officials use harsher, tougher rhetoric than others. It’s a good cop-bad cop routine that, administration officials say, is designed to keep enemies on their toes. Besides Trump, the U.S. ambassador to the United Nations, Nikki Haley, has often employed harsher language than Tillerson.

Or maybe there is no real strategy involved. Maybe we are just witnessing the ongoing reflexive reactions of an impulsive man who likes to punch back 10 times harder.

Exit question: Does Tillerson become the next cabinet member to resign?

–Dana

99 Responses to “Trump Tweets, Undercuts Tillerson And Sows Confusion. It’s All Part Of A Unique Master Plan, Right?!”

  1. Twitter foreign policy is a thing. Who’da thunk…

    Dana (023079)

  2. President Trump’s done more to frame the North Korea issue in an honest and serious way than any member of the filthy Bush family ever did, or any member of the idiotic and corrupt clinton clan.

    to say nothing of captain food stamp, who never even mustered up an opinion on the matter

    happyfeet (28a91b)

  3. Retired Gen. Colin Powell is less worried by North Korea’s nuclear program than he is by the surge of populism around the globe he said on Monday. He attributed blame chiefly to the changing nature of media and the growing influence of the Internet.

    this sleazy useless uniformed jackass actually said this out loud

    powell doctrine lol

    happyfeet (28a91b)

  4. New day, sos…

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  5. Now the “right?” Trump diss has found its way into the thread title!

    harkin (be4c6e)

  6. And what exactly did Evan revere get fro. His talks with north Korea, like with sue mi Terry, what did we get from the framework talks in 94, or the subsequent ones on 99

    narciso (d1f714)

  7. What did five years of talks in Paris with the Vietnamese dud, except 25,000 more casualties, how about the vaunted opening to Mao, that enabled pol pot in Kampuchea.

    narciso (d1f714)

  8. I assure you, harkin, that is not in the least how the word “right” was intended.

    Also, I’m still unclear exactly what is the strategy behind the President’s tweets?

    Dana (023079)

  9. maybe the tweeter strategy is similar to the one what brought the dirty america-hating NFL pedophile league to its knees

    happyfeet (28a91b)

  10. Good cop Bad cop.
    Tillerson speaks softly, Trump offers big stick

    Tillerson can now go into any meeting with the NORK’s and tell them that the President thinks this is a waste of time, but Tillerson believes that more talks will pay off for both countries, ratcheting down tensions. And woe to anyone who thinks Trump is bluffing.

    steveg (e8c34d)

  11. A realization, that little will come from these negotiations from a regime that will starve its own people in order to keep its military, including its nuclear program afloat

    narciso (d1f714)

  12. Actually the “master plan” is all on the left.

    Last night on SNL Trump was called a bitch and a cheap cracker for not falling for the San Juan mayor’s agitprop.

    No need to help them out though….

    harkin (be4c6e)

  13. China is backing Burma with the genocide being committed against the Rohingya people, probably because they want to desensitize people to mass murder in the hope we may tolerate the use of an atom bomb somewhere too.

    And then they can threaten to nuke Taiwan.

    I think they probably still need North Korea to get away with use of an atomic bonb first fr this plan to have achance of working, but in the meantime supporting getting away with mass murder whereever they can can’t hurt China;s foreign policy goals. China was behind the RWanda genocide, also – the hatchets were made in China.

    We’ll see if policy in China changes after Oct 18 – if nothing changes with regard to Myanmar and North Korea we can be assured that Xi Jinping is behind it and not some faction in the Chinese military. China is just trying to hold off U.S. military action against North Korea (or possibly economic action against China) but it doesn’t want to end the North Korean threat. And it probably wants it even to be more than a threat when the time is ripe.

    Tillerson really undermining Trump with his negotiations, but it probably doesn’t mean anything,

    By the way, they’ve been violating the genocide treaty in Myanmar/Burma for years, because they forbade Rohingya from having more than two chidren, and that kind of forced birth control (with or without forced abortions) is included in the definition of genocide. Taht may, in fact, be the reason that China never applied its 1-child policy to language minority groups. Whatever was going on in the secret deliberations of the government of China, I think somebody decided that they didn’t want to get hit later with that possible accusation, and there was no actual real benefit to China from doing this. We are talking about relatively small minority groups. But what China does inside China is different than what China might support or encourage in other oountries.

    Sammy Finkelman (a784d8)

  14. He works for albright who was enchanted by the older Kim:
    http://www.albrightstonebridge.com/team/evans-revere

    Humility should have told him to keep his mouth shut.

    narciso (d1f714)

  15. If it’s good cop-bad cop, then that assumes that Tillerson knew in advance something like this would be coming as it was part of a plan. But knowing what an evil lunatic Kim is, how does Trump personally attacking him, mocking him before his people, and making veiled threats against NK ratchet down tensions? How can he be sure this doesn’t have the opposite effect: provoke Kim into doing something dangerous, rash and impulsive? What makes you think that this is a winnable strategy?

    Dana (023079)

  16. If you want a patalel, consider china dealings in darfur, and their tacit support of the janjaweed as in exchange for the oil of that region, steinhauers milo weaver tales dabbles in that association

    As related in the weekly standard north Korea made all sorts of excuses to avoid signing the bone proliferation treaty, then their subsequent submissions to the iaea were woefully inadequatr

    narciso (d1f714)

  17. to say that President Trump “undercut” Rexy Tillerboobs in some way

    this implies that negotiating with North Korea is a serious foreign policy that should be on the table

    and of course we’re not even sure if that was what Tillerboobs has been doing or trying to do

    maybe Tillerboob’s just ronery

    but the idea that negotiations with North Korea have value?

    that’s profoundly ahistorical

    happyfeet (28a91b)

  18. Any dictator who ignores what happened to Muammar Qaddafi and Saddam Hussein when they gave up their nuclear weapons programs does not deserve to be a dictator.

    nk (dbc370)

  19. Not to mention the Ukraine.

    nk (dbc370)

  20. Although the Ukrainians would have probably sold theirs.

    nk (dbc370)

  21. oops i should have said maybe maybe Tillerboobs *is* just ronery

    tricksy punctuate are confounding

    happyfeet (28a91b)

  22. Actually the “master plan” is all on the left.

    Last night on SNL Trump was called a bitch and a cheap cracker for not falling for the San Juan mayor’s agitprop.

    No need to help them out though….

    harkin (be4c6e) — 10/1/2017 @ 11:41 am

    As I have already made very clear, harkin, the title of this post does not refer to what you believe it does, nor is it in any way related to that. And I heartily reject your implication that I am “helping them out” when referring to SNL’s unsurprising denigration of the president as they exploit a natural disaster and its cruel aftermath to further their lefty politics.

    Dana (023079)

  23. maybe

    brb i have to go get more cream for tomorrow’s tasty frappe

    happyfeet (28a91b)

  24. @5.New day, sos…

    =Haiku= Gesundheit!

    Morse code is old school.
    ____________

    The ‘master plan’ has a masterful distraction: The Juice is loose. Freed as America slept.

    DCSCA (797bc0)

  25. Never mind North Korea. Let’s say it’s just you and Donald Trump on a desert island. Donald Trump has a big stick and you have a rock. Would you give up your rock if he asked you to?

    nk (dbc370)

  26. the first thing i’d do is make my president a hearty island soup

    perhaps a chowder of some kind

    happyfeet (28a91b)

  27. @26. Kadaffi Island.

    DCSCA (797bc0)

  28. New day, sos…

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0) — 10/1/2017 @ 11:02 am

    Is there any subject we can discuss in which we question the president? We sure didn’t have a problem doing so with President Obama, but we sure seem to with this president.

    I honestly have no clue what the tactics are here, or if there are any. So I’m asking you, Col, help me understand.

    Dana (023079)

  29. Under Powell and even rice, we abided by the framework, and look what happened.

    http://www.weeklystandard.com/cheney-was-right/article/2009894

    That’s a lesson for the rhodes road show (the Iran deal)

    narciso (d1f714)

  30. Trump is letting Tillerson try, but he’s announcing in advance he doesn’t expect it to succeed. he’s interested in maintaining his own credibility both with the public later and with Kim Jong Un now.

    He’s trying negotiations, only because the prospect of military action is so high.

    He’s doing this the way Bush II did with Iraq in 2002 and early 2003. Although Bush didn’t make a big public declaration that he doesn’t expect it to work! He just let people think that it probably wouldn’t work.

    I suppose you could argue that declaring that this won’t work enhances the possibility that it will work.

    Again, this is happening because an attack on North Korea, or some other extreme action, like cutting off all economic ties with China, is probably much closer than most people think. Like around November 19. And then maybe we can celebrate Thanksgiving – or not.

    The decision may depend on time (i.e. how much time can the North Korean atomic bomb program be allowed to go on?) or it may depend on Kim Jong Un doing one more thing to render his threats to attack the United States – and that includes Guam – more credible.

    Sammy Finkelman (a784d8)

  31. What will we get out of this, except time for north Korea to build longer range missiles,

    narciso (d1f714)

  32. @ Sammy,

    Trump is letting Tillerson try, but he’s announcing in advance he doesn’t expect it to succeed. he’s interested in maintaining his own credibility both with the public later and with Kim Jong Un now.

    So then, Trump is undercutting Tillerson. And self-interest and concern about his image are driving this, regardless of the greater risk involved?

    Dana (023079)

  33. More nearly the reverse is true, tillerson is undercutting trumps support for the alliance

    narciso (d1f714)

  34. if america wanted to beg and plead and wheedle and deedle with North Korea they would have elected stinkypig

    what happened

    happyfeet (28a91b)

  35. nk (dbc370) — 10/1/2017 @ 11:55 am

    Any dictator who ignores what happened to Muammar Qaddafi and Saddam Hussein when they gave up their nuclear weapons programs does not deserve to be a dictator.

    Neither of these two had a way of threatening the United States, or important U.S. interests without an atomic bomb. But North Korea can threaten Seoul and US. troops. I mean what’s the reason we didn’t attack North Korea till now? We didn’t even invade Cuba, after Cuba got rid of its atomic weapons.

    The purpose of this bomb is not to maintain the status quo in theKorean peninsula.

    North Korea raising the threat level is like you’re in a hostage situation and there is a standoff, and the hostage takers slowly begin building a weapon that can take out more police or maybe apirtion of the city. Let’s say they begin preparing a poison gas attack and you know it. Would you let them proceed? If they disarmed would you attack them if you didn’t attack them before they did this?

    Sammy Finkelman (a784d8)

  36. The comment script is not perfect in one sense — when blocked individuals get quoted in other comments. But I notice that reading comments from those people is not frustrating when they are quoted in comments that respond to them. It’s reading them on their own, and feeling the need to respond to them myself, that is the annoying part.

    As my list grows I am also adding people whose comments I regularly skip anyway because a) they are too frequent and/or voluminous and/or b) I get nothing out of them.

    I have blocked people on Twitter for ages now, on the principle that life is too short. I was reluctant to ban people here because, unlike Twitter, a ban deprives other people from hearing the viewpoints. It’s nice to have this middle ground, where I can ignore the dross while not feeling responsible for taking away those people’s voice on this site entirely.

    Patterico (115b1f)

  37. The annoying part is having to click the bookmark every time I load a page. But I’m getting used to it. Once it becomes habit it is not so bad.

    Patterico (115b1f)

  38. Getting NK to give up nukes is probably hopeless. The last 3 or 4 Presidents failed in this endeavor. But, if there is any hope, I think it would take NK being seriously frightened that the US was going to attack. Trump’s comment can only help to worry NK, which is a positive step.

    David in Cal (2b55d5)

  39. Yes, Sammy. That’s what we told Hussein, Qaddafi and the Ukrainians, too.

    nk (dbc370)

  40. Economic war with China is the answer.
    His cabinet sucks.
    Let Bannon negotiate with the chicoms.

    mg (31009b)

  41. 34. Dana (023079) — 10/1/2017 @ 12:09 pm

    So then, Trump is undercutting Tillerson. And self-interest and concern about his image are driving this, regardless of the greater risk involved?

    I think Trump’s primary concern here is his image, but it could be argued this helps Tillerson, small as the chances fof reaching an agreement are.

    The on;y reason Kim Jong Un would agrtee is if he thinks the chances of an attack are greater with an atomic bomb than without it. Which actually happens to be the truth.

    Now Kim Jong Un may not believe this any more than Saddam Hussein did that Bush being convinced he didn’t weapons of mass destrcution would reduce <b? the possibility of an attack by the United States. Saddam Hussein believed the opposite. He tried to convimve people he didn't have chemical weapons, but he tried (bu not vo-operating with the inspectors) to convince Bush and Rumsfeld that he did, counting on the Turkish Parliament to pull the rug from under Bush at the last moment. (Bush couldn't attack when the weather got too hot for soldiers to do much while wearing chemical warfare gear, and Bush had postponed things for the last minute) )

    The Turkish parliament behaved as expected but Bush didn't.

    Trump will either start an all out economic war against China in an attempt to to force it to cut all ties with North Korea or better yet topple the government or hw will launch a decapitation strike. By about November 19 I think. Could be mid-December, too, maybe. But he'll wait to see waht happens with the 19th National Congress of the Communist Party of China first, so it won't be October.

    If it all works well, North Korea will collapse as fast as the Incas did when the Inca was captured.

    Nobody in the North Korean army will fire a shot without orders and they won't get any.

    Sammy Finkelman (a784d8)

  42. The Ukrainians never had an atomic bomb. Just dangerous plutonium. Russia had all the locks and codes.

    Sammy Finkelman (a784d8)

  43. 29… Dana… I’m going to take a different tack here… from now on, if I have nothing positive to say, I will cease and desist from posting. Have a great Sunday!

    Colonel Haiku (43fb26)

  44. President Trump is smart that’s for sure

    i’m glad he’s made this a priority

    and I send a prayer up to God that someday we can bring our forsaken tatters home from kimchi peninsula, and there will be much rejoicing (pet videos)

    happyfeet (28a91b)

  45. Kim Jong Un is Cleavon Little holding a gun to his own head. Although SK might be considered his Siamese twin, if you will. Or maybe he’s China’s fetus in fitu.

    Pinandpuller (16b0b5)

  46. Col,

    If you have some insight as to the strategy Trump might be employing here, I’d sure like to hear it because I’m clueless. I can only surmise based upon what we’ve seen of the kind of man Trump is. But of course, if you just see this post as yet another attack on Trump, then I guess there’s not much I can do about that. Vigorous debate isn’t about saying nice things. To me, it’s about exchanging ideas, challenging one another, offering insights, and refuting and establishing views by way of substantative dialogue.

    You have a great Sunday as well.

    Dana (023079)

  47. @45. I’m going to take a different tack here…

    =Haiku!= Gesundheit!

    Sailing into the wind gets you no place, fast.

    DCSCA (797bc0)

  48. The mayor of San Juan should be tapped to coordinate the evacuation of Seoul and then we can proceed.

    Pinandpuller (16b0b5)

  49. Dana, recall what Nixon did to Rogers; our Captain is telegraphing Tillerson to abandon ship before he’s ordered to walk the plank.

    DCSCA (797bc0)

  50. Nikki’s gonna get Rex’s gig.

    DCSCA (797bc0)

  51. i will do vigorous debate with you Dana ok number one these are just tweets

    they’re kinda like those individually-wrapped fun-sized chocolate confections from mars or hershey (except these are from the president)

    my suspicion what i suspect is you look at President Trump’s tweeter a lot cause of the CNN Jake Tapper fake news propaganda slut media doesn’t really try very hard anymore to do serious discussions of things like North Korea

    for example you quote the very unserious new york times fake news saying this:

    The Trump administration acknowledged on Saturday for the first time that it was in direct communication with the government of North Korea over its missile and nuclear tests, seeking a possible way forward beyond the escalating threats of a military confrontation from both sides.

    but click through and read read read

    there’s no quote from Rexy Tillerboobs what supports the contention that he is “seeking a possible way forward beyond the escalating threats of a military confrontation from both sides”

    this is a wholly unsupported contention

    he could just be asking lil kimchi what he’d like for a last meal

    or trying to figure out exactly what sort of torture they did on that American college kid

    new york times fake news is no good

    but when President Trump tells me he told Rexy that he’s wasting his time trying to negotiate with lil babby rocket boy, I believe him – cause even if he never actually told Rexy that, the tweet counts as saying it anyways doesn’t it

    bottom line is that President Trump’s tweets fill what would otherwise be an informational fake news vacuum

    he does this for us – he doesn’t have to do this by law or anything

    but he does it anyway

    he tells us what’s going on so we know someone’s looking out for America

    happyfeet (28a91b)

  52. @48 Dana

    We have a case of two men who were left poverty ridden tenants and slums by their dads but one man rose above it.

    Pinandpuller (16b0b5)

  53. President Trump’s tweets fill what would otherwise be an informational fake news vacuum

    He gives us fake news when the media doesn’t?

    Not that I blame him. Something has to distract us from asking how many yen the Chinese are stuffing into Ivanka’s g-string this week.

    nk (dbc370)

  54. she’s very good at what she does

    happyfeet (28a91b)

  55. The north wants to reinufy theenisula, humiliate Japan the colonizer power and us by proxy, do we understand what we want, certainly revere doesnt

    narciso (d1f714)

  56. If you have some insight as to the strategy Trump might be employing here, I’d sure like to hear it because I’m clueless. I can only surmise based upon what we’ve seen of the kind of man Trump is. But of course, if you just see this post as yet another attack on Trump, then I guess there’s not much I can do about that. Vigorous debate isn’t about saying nice things. To me, it’s about exchanging ideas, challenging one another, offering insights, and refuting and establishing views by way of substantative dialogue.

    You have a great Sunday as well.

    I did not read Colonel Haiku’s comment, but I have noticed that there is a contingent of people who can’t seem to abide any criticism of Trump. I find those people boring and no longer wish to interact with them.

    Patterico (115b1f)

  57. When we started a quarter century ago, they didn’t have a workable bomb yet, now they the equivalent of the r 7 that can hit us territories like Guam.

    narciso (d1f714)

  58. President Trump’s hands-down the most conservative president we’ve had since ronald reagan

    evenings were i used to sit out on the dock and drink a beer and stare out at the gathering gloom wondering when we’d have a conservative president again to do them judges all up in it

    someone what would make that boot stop stamping on our human face (evil boot)

    but i didn’t dare hope

    and now here he is

    good golly gosh he’s not how I pictured him no sir

    he’s even better

    happyfeet (28a91b)

  59. I generally agree with this blog’s analysis, but I think dislike of Trump has caused a wrong analysis. Trump’s comment was an additional threat. Trump made it sound all the more likely that he was going to attack NK. IMHO fear and threats are the only hope of getting NK to give up nukes. So, Trump’s tweet was a positive (to the degree it has any impact at all.)

    David in Cal (2b55d5)

  60. I did read Patterico’s comment and I wish him a happy walk home with his ball.

    Colonel Haiku (43fb26)

  61. lol, Col.

    mg (31009b)

  62. You can’t make this stuff up, mg.

    Colonel Haiku (43fb26)

  63. Teh Age of Silliness.

    Colonel Haiku (43fb26)

  64. It’s always dangerous trying to divine Trump’s intent with his provocative head-scratching tweets that said I’m willing to speculate that he’s trying to flip the script on the NORKs.

    The usual pattern is for them to say or do outrageous things until we agree to give them something with the worthless promise that they’ll stop. Instead of US asking what’s it gonna take for them to stop, Trump appears to be trying to push them out of their comfort zone of acting the fool while waiting to see what we’ll give them and instead pushing them into being willing to back down to get US to stop scaring them. I’m neither optimistic that they’ll actually back down nor confident that this is the best way to get them to do it.

    The fact that the NORKs are asking for help in understanding Trump leads me to believe he’s got them thinking the usual game won’t work.

    As to the tweets themselves. Yeccch! They’re not my idea of how to conduct your presidency but as captivated as the media is with them I think the novelty of knowing the unscripted thoughts that run through Trump’s mind at all hours of the day and night is wearing off but that’s just me.

    crazy (d99a88)

  65. My head shakes daily in disbelief, Col.
    My hope is Bannon continues his assault on the establishment pricks. As well as calling out the President when he has no clue.

    mg (31009b)

  66. So all the smart people can’t figure out what he is doing with Tillerson?

    You’d think a Prosecutor knows a good copy / bad cop routine when you see it. Even if you think it ineffectual.

    #TDS is strong young paduans

    Poor Biggie (987b85)

  67. #19 Dropping some straight history right there.

    Poor Biggie (987b85)

  68. Retired Gen. Colin Powell is less worried by North Korea’s nuclear program than he is by the surge of populism around the globe he said on Monday. He attributed blame chiefly to the changing nature of media and the growing influence of the Internet.

    LOL.

    Poor Biggie (987b85)

  69. Turtledove suggests the first Korean conflict would have tyrbed nuclear, codevilla pointed out earluer that dichotomy between macarthur who had a goal and Truman who didnt, like lbj blundered in without a plan into another divided land a decade later.

    narciso (d1f714)

  70. Retired General Colin Powell should shut up and enjoy his phuckin’ retirement. He knows even less about the media and internet than he did about warfare.

    Rev.Hoagie® (6bbda7)

  71. I like Bannon, mg. I trust his judgement in a lot of areas and enjoy how he calls them as he sees them.

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  72. I have been listening and following him for some time, Col. He loves the working class and what they bring to the table. That counts for my kids future. What doesn’t help my kids future is thin skinned compassionate conservatism.

    mg (31009b)

  73. No despot will give up his weapons of mass destruction after what happened to Gaddafi.

    jcurtis (b58e3b)

  74. You’d think a Prosecutor knows a good copy / bad cop routine when you see it. Even if you think it ineffectual.

    We all recognize it. But given Trump’s incompetence and perpetual bluster–no one (including it seems the NorKs) can figure out if Trump is actually applying that strategy..or just letting his ego get in the way.

    A real solution would require the Chinese to put Kim in his place. But given that an unchained Kim is very useful to China, I’m not sure what we would need to do to get them to put Kim in his place. Barring that, Trumpian threats may be the best thing possible. Or maybe not,since I don’t really want a nuclear bomb exploding anywhere.

    kishnevi (871225)

  75. Read the weekly standard piece, north Korea has been playing for time for at least a quarter century, if not a third, since they balked at signing the not through the post framework deception

    narciso (d1f714)

  76. “If you have some insight as to the strategy Trump might be employing here, I’d sure like to hear it because I’m clueless.”

    It would help if you stopped with the automatic presumption that Trump is a clueless, incompetent buffoon.

    That is, if you actually want to understand things, as opposed to just presuming you are right and everybody else is wrong.

    fred-2 (ce04f3)

  77. No despot will give up his weapons of mass destruction after what happened to Gaddafi.
    jcurtis (b58e3b) — 10/1/2017 @ 6:35 pm

    Or no despot will allow American gun-running through his country.

    Pinandpuller (16b0b5)

  78. Yes we stabbed qaddafi in the back, but n korea was never going to along, considering theircobjectives

    narciso (d1f714)

  79. Interesting tweet from State Dept’s Heather Nuart:

    DPRK will not go brain a nuclear capability. Whether through diplomacy or force is up to the regime.

    Dana (023079)

  80. Heather’s correct they don’t have a nuclear capability

    so far they’ve only demonstrated the ability to nuke their own country

    but soon they’ll be able to nuke los angeles

    and soon after that they’ll be able to nuke America

    happyfeet (28a91b)

  81. So we look at the long view, has anything worked, over the period in question, we didn’t know they had a put a nuclear reactor in Syria, in close proximity to the Iraqi border, till the Israelis blew it up!

    narciso (d1f714)

  82. Heh! I was going to blame Heather Nauert’s voice recognition software, Dana, but it looks like it’s yours.

    nk (dbc370)

  83. I’ve been binge watching camillieri, the actor they chose to play montalbano has a very grounded take on the craziness in vigata.

    narciso (d1f714)

  84. Breaking News- Apparently someone is shooting more than dice in Vegas; multiple shots, multiple injuries reported along the Strip. ‘Hundred of rounds’ heard. Story developing.

    DCSCA (797bc0)

  85. @Dana: What makes you think that this is not a winnable strategy? Surely you have an onus to say why good cop – bad cop would not work. Would you think it proper for Trump and Tillerson to publish a strategy? I think you’d be very upset if they pulled down their pants that way.

    Anyway, please post ASAP your strategy for dealing with Rocket Boy. And please advise how to prosecute it without lying a lot, not in publishing your strategy, but in prosecuting it.

    @Patterico: Perhaps Trump is equally bored with your relentless criticism. Perhaps you could also post your Rocket Boy Plan.

    And D & P, please, no generalities in your strategies as in “I would seek a position of blah, blah after consulting with yadda yadda and considering bs, bs, bs”.

    Fred Z (05d938)

  86. Inspector Montalbano (TV series)

    interesting – if you scroll down to here they show you the UK ratings of each original telecast – follow the 2012-2013 series of data

    you can see this little show steadily builds audience throughout its run

    happyfeet (28a91b)

  87. The author has a certain berlusconi derangement, but it doesn’t come through in the telplay

    narciso (d1f714)

  88. In the first place, you guys obviously don’t know what “good cop, bad cop” is; and in the second place, even if it was what what you think it is, how do you expect it to work, now that you all went and told Kim Jong Un about it?

    nk (dbc370)

  89. Trump is using the standard negotiating strategy you see in every car dealership.
    It’s not quite good cop bad cop.

    It’s ‘salesman and manager.’ You only get to talk to the salesman, who says he’ll try to help you, we have these options, etc. You press on price, and he says, “I can’t approve that, I have to go to my manager and he’s a hardass.” You’re left sitting in a room, the salesman leaves, comes back, says, ‘I can only give you this, man, I really went to bat for you, but my manager has to keep the bottom line going.”

    And so on. In the great book ‘Don’t Be A Chump: The Princeton Review Guide To Negotiation,” which everyone should read, the solution is to realize that both the salesman and the manager are against you, and if it’s the manager who makes the decision, talk to him or don’t talk. But of course Kim doesn’t have the option of talking directly to Trump.

    Ingot (1de9ec)

  90. Yes, that sounds more like it, Ingot. It’s also Trump’s “Turkish bazaar” style. Start with extravagant promises or demands, then settle for whatever you can get.

    nk (dbc370)

  91. Dana
    One of the tweets says Trump told Tillerson…
    Trump and Mattis have gone on record saying that they are baddest cops ever.
    It would be erratic for Trump to act otherwise.
    Trump is consistent in a mad way

    steveg (d20518)

  92. I hope it’s good cop/bad cop. John Hay and Teddy Roosevelt sometimes did this. They were accused of it in the “Perdicaris Alive or Raisuli Dead” telegram:

    When Roosevelt made up his mind to accomplish an objective he did not worry too much about legality of method. Before any unusual procedure he would ask an opinion from his Attorney General, Philander Knox, but Knox rather admired Roosevelt’s way of overriding his advice. Once, when asked for his opinion, he replied, “Ah, Mr. President, why have such a beautiful action marred by any taint of legality?” Another close adviser, Admiral Mahan, when asked by Roosevelt how to solve the political problem of annexing the Hawaiian Islands, answered, “Do nothing unrighteous but … take the islands first and solve afterward.” It may be that the problem of Perdicaris seemed susceptible of the same treatment.

    The opportunity was irresistible. Every newspaperman who ever knew him testified to Roosevelt’s extraordinary sense of news value, to his ability to create news, to dramatize himself to the public. He had a genius for it. “Consciously or unconsciously,” said the journalist Isaac Marcosson, “he was the master press agent of all time.” The risk, of course, was great, for it would be acutely embarrassing if the facts leaked out during the coming campaign. It may have been the risk itself that tempted Roosevelt, for he loved a prank and loved danger for its own sake; if he could combine danger with what William Allen White called a “frolicking intrigue,” his happiness was complete.
    Next day, June 22, the memorable telegram, “This Government wants Perdicaris alive or Raisuli dead,” flashed across the Atlantic cable over Hay’s signature and was simultaneously given to the press at home. It was not an ultimatum, because Hay deliberately deprived it of meaningfulness by adding to Gummere, “Do not land marines or seize customs without Department’s specific instructions.” But this sentence was not allowed to spoil the effect: it was withheld from the press.

    At Chicago, Uncle Joe Cannon, the salty perennial Speaker of the House, who was convention chairman, rapped with his gavel and read the telegram. The convention was electrified. Delegates sprang upon their chairs and hurrahed. Flags and handkerchiefs waved. Despite Hay’s signature, everyone saw the Roosevelt teeth, cliche of a hundred cartoons, gleaming whitely behind it. “Magnificent, magnificent!” pronounced Senator Depew. “The people want an administration that will stand by its citizens, even if it takes the fleet to do it,” said Representative Dwight of New York, expressing the essence of popular feeling. “Roosevelt and Hay know what they are doing,” said a Kansas delegate. “Our people like courage. We’ll stand for anything those two men do.” “Good hot stuff and echoes my sentiments,” said another delegate. The genius of its timing and phrasing, wrote a reporter, “gave the candidate the maximum benefit of the thrill that was needed.” Although the public was inclined to credit authorship to Roosevelt, the Baltimore Sun pointed out that Mr. Hay too knew how to make the eagle scream when he wanted to. Hay’s diary agreed. “My telegram to Gummere,” he noted comfortably the day afterward, “had an uncalled for success. It is curious how a concise impropriety hits the public.”

    Hay, along with Mahan, are among the most important figures in American history that are utterly unknown to most of the American public. I think I’ve linked this here before, but if not, I highly recommend this book: :All the Great Prizes: The Life of John Hay, from Lincoln to Roosevelt. IIRC it tells this story in generally consistent, but even greater, detail. I have no illusions that Trump has anything remotely like the depth or judgment of Teddy Roosevelt, but I hope Tillerson can be our modern-day John Hay.

    Beldar (fa637a)

  93. “My father always wanted to be the corpse at every funeral, the bride at every wedding and the baby at every christening.”– Alice Roosevelt Longworth

    nk (dbc370)

  94. Narco has no problem banging his war drum. His butt is safe at home.

    https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/world/2017/sep/23/china-to-enforce-un-sanctions-against-north-korea

    Ben burn (101c24)

  95. people should sneak up quietly behind Rexy Tillerboobs and yell YOU BEEN UNDERCUT! really loud and then run away

    it could be a thing

    happyfeet (28a91b)

Leave a Reply

Comment moderation is enabled. Your comment may take some time to appear.


Powered by WordPress.

Page loaded in: 0.3885 secs.