Patterico's Pontifications

3/25/2017

Sanctuary Cities Prevent Wealthy Communities From Becoming Paralyzed And Stuck With Dirty Houses

Filed under: General — Dana @ 11:35 am

[guest post by Dana]

The once truly Golden State has descended to this:

State Attorney General Xavier Becerra has filed a brief in in support of a lawsuit filed by Santa Clara County challenging President Donald Trump’s executive order targeting sanctuary cities.

The amicus brief filed Wednesday says Trump’s order threatens to withdraw federal funds from states and cities that don’t help the federal government enforce immigration laws.

Santa Clara County last month asked a federal judge to block Trump’s executive order threatening the loss of nearly $1.7 billion in federal funds to local governments.

Becerra says he has a responsibility to protect state laws and policies that ensure public safety and protect the constitutional rights of residents.

He adds that Trump’s attempt to “hijack” state and local resources to do the Trump Administration’s bidding raises serious constitutional questions.

Becerra conveniently ignores that it is the law that the Trump administration seeks to enforce, not a whimsical, willy-nilly, pull-it-out-of-your-hat bidding. Becerra certainly does have a responsibility to protect state laws and policies that ensure public safety and protect the constitutional rights of residents, so why is he selectively exercising that responsibility to benefit just 6% of the state’s population? Where does that leave the rights and safety of the other 94%?

Anyway, to pile onto the absurdity, the uber-wealthy beach community of Malibu has jumped on the state’s sanctuary movement. Spearheading the effort is none other than onetime president – on television anyway – Martin Sheen. (The last time we saw Sheen was during the election when he channeled President Bartlett from the West Wing, and implored Republican members of the Electoral College not to vote for Donald Trump.)

Ah, yes, nothing says solidarity quite like the wealthy 1% desperate to maintain their lifestyles of luxury and ease:

The discussion inside Malibu City Hall over whether to become a sanctuary city last week bore the usual hallmarks of the heated national debate over illegal immigration.

While some residents praised the proposal, others blamed those who are in the country illegally for crime and called the move a thinly disguised rebuke of President Trump.

But it being Malibu, there was a celebrity twist. The idea was inspired by one of the town’s many famous residents: actor Martin Sheen. In December, he grabbed the lectern during a City Council meeting and — as if conjuring his inner President Josiah Bartlet from “The West Wing” — urged the city to become a sanctuary city.

Like many sanctuary city resolutions, Malibu’s is largely symbolic. Backers said the move, which passed on a 3-2 council vote, is a chance for Malibu’s privileged to stand up for the city’s vulnerable population.

Malibu is about 92% white and one of L.A. County’s wealthiest cities. Everyone agrees the city has workers who are not authorized to be in the United States, and they tend to serve the food at upscale eateries, clean the beachside mansions, look after children and keep the landscaping looking lush.

And confirming just how utterly out of touch with the every-man the uber-wealthy residents of Malibu are, Mikke Pierson, a supporter of the resolution, commented:

[I]t’s hard to imagine a Malibu without the many immigrants who toil there. That why expressing support for people who are in the country illegally is so important, he said.

“Heck … we would be paralyzed and no one’s houses would be cleaned,” the former surf shop owner said.

Paralyzed!

In a city where the median price of homes currently on the market is nearly $3.9 million, quite obviously illegal immigrants working in Malibu are compelled to make long commutes to the beach community from places like South Los Angeles and Compton where they can afford to live.

Juan Lopez, who works in Malibu, is quoted:

Most immigrants just want to work, and they end up doing jobs that hardly anyone else, let alone most Americans, want to do.

In each house, there’s one immigrant here. You see Spanish speakers taking care of babies in every house. They help people here.

Gosh, one might suppose that Malibu seeks to protect its own little service industry because the city would come to a grinding halt if residents had to do their own yard work, take care of their own children, and cook their own meals. Obviously, hiring those who are here legally and without fear of being reported would come at a much higher price than the wealthy residents of Malibu are willing to pay.

Self-serving elitism is never an attractive look – no matter how expensive the rags. And given that it has been the residents of Malibu who have worked exceedingly hard to keep illegal immigrants and other non-residents off their the public beaches in Malibu, that they now deem themselves a “sanctuary city” is spectacularly rich, indeed.

(Cross-posted at The Jury Talks Back.)

–Dana

135 Responses to “Sanctuary Cities Prevent Wealthy Communities From Becoming Paralyzed And Stuck With Dirty Houses”

  1. These people.

    Dana (023079)

  2. It’s watching the kiddies, cooking the meals, waxing the Beemer and wielding the leaf-blowers/toilet brushes that they want them in town for, not enjoying the beach.

    harkin (517285)

  3. Self-serving elitism is never an attractive look – no matter how expensive the rags.

    I dunno, it seems to attract a lot of practitioners.

    CayleyGraph (353727)

  4. A friend of mine has been the Mayor of Malibu a number of times over the years. The last time I saw her was last fall before the election and immigration and Trump did not come up. I don’t know if she is Mayor again. Nope, just checked.

    Mike K (f469ea)

  5. If you want to actually impact illegal immigration, resources would be far better spent on penalizing those who hire them.

    Davethulhu (7d4953)

  6. Cheap labor that can’t write a book about them.

    Rae Sremmurd (2fd998)

  7. Lol putting forward Trump as a paragon of family values.

    Davethulhu (7d4953)

  8. Barbra Streisand –Her Toilets and Her Pancakes–At Dios Mio!

    By Rosita Von Bismark

    Rae Sremmurd (2fd998)

  9. resources would be far better spent on penalizing those who hire them

    people forget slave labor wasn’t free per se

    there were food costs and upkeep and maintenance associated with slave ownership

    just like there are costs associated with the cheap exploited labor what keeps Malibu humming along

    so in lieu of cracking down on employment we’d be far better off

    a. building a wall and enforcing border security

    b. finding gainful employment for these illegals in non-service industries

    by employing illegals in manufacturing, agriculture, and industry, we can help bid up the cost of employing illegals for domestic services, which would allow the good citizens of Malibu to make an even greater contribution to the welfare of our illegal friends

    happyfeet (28a91b)

  10. Every Californian should seek sanctuary in Malibu.

    Vast swathes of the Golden State are merely shaky, parched, ant-infested earth, ribboned by freeways in disrepair, peppered with clusters of overpriced, tile-roofed, stucco-clad dwellings connected by countlessly similar and uninviting strip malls, cornered by bland, fast food franchises between gated fortresses of affluent communities walled off from the riffraff. And Disneyland.

    But WOW, what weather!!!

    DCSCA (797bc0)

  11. ant-infested?

    happyfeet (28a91b)

  12. Seems to me if you have one prosecutor put one famous person in jail for hiring an illegal babysitter, the rest of Malibu will clean up in a hurry, falling all over themselves to adjust to the new reality.

    papertiger (c8116c)

  13. My favorite fun fact about Malibu is that many of the multi-million dollar houses are connected to septic tanks like your average AR trailer park.

    Pinandpuller (16b0b5)

  14. I think it’s wonderful that the rich people of Malibu want to shelter poor destitute immigrants. What’s wrong with you all, sneering at such selfless charity? Instead of Trump taking away federal money, he should put federal money in Malibu for facilities for any poor immigrant who needs a place to sleep and a soup kitchen for a meal, and he should pass the word all down California and Mexico about Malibu’s welcoming attitude and open-handedness.

    nk (dbc370)

  15. “Vayan a Malibu, compadres!”

    nk (dbc370)

  16. #trumpishi+ler

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  17. I’m with Papertiger. They should put a couple A-listers in the slammer with hefty fines for hiring illegals. We also need a law firm to take cases of people robbed or injured by illegals and sue the town and the mayor for dereliction of duty.

    Rev. Hoagie® (785e38)

  18. “by employing illegals in manufacturing, agriculture, and industry, we can help bid up the cost of employing illegals for domestic services”

    Nice idea, only thing is that’s what has been happening since Reagan granted amnesty, and instead of domestic services bidding up, all blue collar work has been stagnant for 25 years. And an illegal housekeeper is still half the price of an on the books worker that has to be covered by all the costs and regulations under California law.

    But hey, with smart ideas like that, you should work for the Chamber of Commerce!

    Leon (168f33)

  19. nantucket is having issues with island hopping crimaleins – breaking in and stealing, living in vacation homes, gotta love sanctuary progressive islands.

    mg (31009b)

  20. well duh it only works if you conjoin it with a wall and for reals border security

    happyfeet (28a91b)

  21. “Well if you got all that, there shouldn’t be hardly any illegals, otherwise what’s the point?

    Leon (168f33)

  22. Or you could just penalize employers. That way you don’t have to spend billions on a wall. You can even make money with fines.

    Davethulhu (7d4953)

  23. Meesees Broleen. Meesees Broleen. We needs more Reed-ex for thee sheeeter.

    Pinandpuller (16b0b5)

  24. i want a wall

    end of discussion

    happyfeet (28a91b)

  25. Withold money from sanctuary states/cities, you could save billions…

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  26. Build walls around the sanctuary cities.

    mg (31009b)

  27. Becerra conveniently ignores that it is the law that the Trump administration seeks to enforce, not a whimsical, willy-nilly

    A federal law, that the state has nothing to do with. And even the federal policy is not to demand every bit of co-operation they could theoretically ask for. For instance, they don’t demand entry into schools or hospitals.

    We don’t have the equivalent of of the Fugitive Slave clause in the constition with immigration , and states resisted that. Returning slaves was a black letter obligation in the constitution and yet they resisted that. What right does the federal government have to demand anything here?

    Now what the Trump Administration is doing is trying to condition federal aid on something Whether they can or not depends upon what Congress has authorized.

    The argument about policies that ensure public safety is that bringing immigration status into the equation would damage public safety, by causing some crime victims and witnesses to avoid contact with the police, and to avoid having people arrested, and the wrong people will fill the jails because they can’t be bailed out. ICE agrees they should not go into public schools and hospitals, the state argues it is just as important to avoid using the state law enforcement as any kind of a tool.

    Sammy Finkelman (bd89d5)

  28. After all, if those folks in the Malibu colony had to pay for Americans to clean their houses, do their shopping, and walk their children and dogs, it would bankrupt them.

    Kevin M (25bbee)

  29. If you want to actually impact illegal immigration, resources would be far better spent on penalizing those who hire them.

    It would be far cheaper to make renting to an illegal, hiring an illegal, or generally harboring an illegal subject the property/business concerned to local police seizure.

    Draconian, sure. But it would have a big effect and not cost a dime. Of course, they’d call Trump a Nazi if he did it.

    Kevin M (25bbee)

  30. I was being snide with my earlier comment but let’s be real. What skin is it off your noses if all the Mexicans in America moved into Malibu? And who would you rather have as neighbors and fellow Americans? Hard-working Mexicans or Hollywood floozies and fairies?

    nk (dbc370)

  31. Hard-working Mexicans get my vote. Floozies and fairies is what got us in this mess.

    mg (31009b)

  32. Hard working Americans get mine. Why were we excluded?

    Rev. Hoagie® (785e38)

  33. As with so many political issues, I loath both sides of this debate. The anti illegal immigrant side spouts trash uncomfortably like the crap leveled at the Irish immigrants of the late 19th century. OTOH, the pro side is all virtue signaling and breezy bullshit.

    The core problem, to my mind, is that unenforced or selectively enforced immigration laws create a grey subculture of people who can be pressured and exploited, and among which much worse things than Hispanic lawn care teams can hide. If the laws are bad (which it seem to me that they are) then they should be changed, not enforced selectively by local whim.

    It doesn’t help that Mexico is a failed state, or at least plays one on TV. It is one of many reasons I find it tempting to reexamine the current prejudice against 19th Century colonialism.

    C. S. P. Schofield (99bd37)

  34. You just illustrated the fallacy of binary choice. Keep “Rev’in”, on a Sunday no less.

    urbanleftbehind (847a06)

  35. No Pepsi? No chips?

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  36. Kevin M (25bbee) — 3/25/2017 @ 11:53 pm

    if those folks in the Malibu colony had to pay for Americans to clean their houses, do their shopping, and walk their children and dogs, it would bankrupt them.

    And a lot of the work wouldn’t get done.

    Sammy Finkelman (bd89d5)

  37. http://www.nbcnews.com/politics/donald-trump/gov-jerry-brown-trump-you-don-t-want-mess-california-n738636

    …You don’t want to mess with California because you’re going to mess with the economy, and that could blow up in your face in a gigantic recession, and roll the Republicans right out of this town.”

    …But the governor said that he doesn’t want his relationship with the federal government to be all about battling — bringing up a few issues where he thought they could find common ground.

    “I’m willing to work with the president,” he said. “I certainly think collaboration, diplomacy, after all, we work with Russia, we work with China, we certainly can work with our own president within our own country.”

    “I want to work with him where there’s something good. But I’m not going to just turn over our police department to become agents of the federal government as they deport women and children and people who are contributing to the economic wellbeing of our state, which they are.” </blockquote.

    Sammy Finkelman (bd89d5)

  38. 34, we had our chance on this particular one; one set of people did not want to deal with another set of colored peoples and the other did not want to bargain as to which former provinces would be slave or free.

    urbanleftbehind (847a06)

  39. God forbid wealthy people in Malibu should have to hire black Americans to clean their houses.

    Anything but that.

    Sammy Finkleman wrote: “And a lot of the work wouldn’t get done.”

    You might think it’s cute to crap on lower-income and unemployed Americans, but I don’t.

    We should make it a tort to hire an illegal – the illegals could sue their employers for penalty of $100/hour for every hour worked. But they only keep 25%, then 25% goes to illegal’s attorney, and 50% goes to rebuilding our inner cities. That would shut down hiring of illegals. Who could afford to hire an illegal if they could come back and sue you like that? Work for some rich butthole for a year or two, then sue them and retire to Mexico. It would suck the money out of wealthy liberals, and suck illegals back to Mexico (by filing the suit, they would be identifying themselves, so staying in the USA wouldn’t be an option), without the cruelty of forced deportations.

    We can solve all of America’s problems, if we pay for the solutions by seizing the wealth of wealthy leftists.

    Really, isn’t our main problem that among us there are leftists with money?

    Daryl Herbert (7be116)

  40. The anti illegal immigrant side spouts trash uncomfortably like the crap leveled at the Irish immigrants of the late 19th century.

    Yes, but

    1) The Irish immigrants all came with permission.
    2) Many people who are upset with the illegals doe not mind the legal immigrants from the same groups.

    It would probably help a lot if our immigration laws weren’t designed to favor dependents and keep workers out.

    Kevin M (25bbee)

  41. Malibu like OC is that first wave that got spooked by the 1965 Watts Riots. Once that wave does out…maybe, but AB 109 ain’t helping.

    urbanleftbehind (bec4e2)

  42. The powers doing the importing of these people see no appreciable difference between us and the hordes. They are bringing in our replacements. Or don’t you guys see that yet because you’re afraid of being called a racist?

    Rev. Hoagie® (785e38)

  43. “Hard-working Mexicans get my vote.”

    Thing is, the Mexicans (the illegal ones) aren’t the neighbors, they can’t afford Malibu, so they live elsewhere. Elsewhere is easy to find; look for lots of gang graffiti, trash in the streets, ditches and yards, roads full of drivers that can’t read the signs, even if they weren’t covered by gang graffiti, and are terrible drivers in any case, pit bull dogs tied to junk cars on the front lawn, rooster coops in the back, with laundry hanging from the fences, and blaring Cucaracha music pouring from everywhere.

    I doubt you want to live in that neighborhood.

    Leon (168f33)

  44. 2) Many people who are upset with the illegals doe not mind the legal immigrants from the same groups.

    I have never met a single conservative or anyone else who is against illegal immigration who believed it would be okay if we were importing 20 million Englishmen instead of Mexicans, have you? Not that there might not be some but I’ve never heard of it. I think that’s something leftist racists make up to project their own bigotry on others.

    They are Fake Americans. Use that on a lefty and watch him explode: #FakeAmericans.

    Rev. Hoagie® (785e38)

  45. You need a happy medium which tends to be only in the Midwest and decidely a #3 to the black populations #2 in terms of pop. %, in CA particularly the Valley of VDH lore, the shame factor is long gone.

    urbanleftbehind (bec4e2)

  46. Mr. Sheen, photo shopped for your pleasure.

    http://patriotretort.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/03/Martin-Sheen-hypocrite.jpg

    Rev. Hoagie® (785e38)

  47. We can solve all of America’s problems, if we pay for the solutions by seizing the wealth of wealthy leftists.

    Why do you believe that only leftists hire illegals? Do you think that only leftists run construction, agriculture, or hotel businesses? I’ll bet you that Trump has employed more illegals than 100 Martin Sheens.

    Davethulhu (7d4953)

  48. We are either a nation of laws or we aren’t. Illegal immigration is not fair to those who have been patient, followed our laws and The Rules.

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  49. End the Hollywood tax breaks.

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  50. People who can afford private schools for their children are not affected by illegal immigration. People who live in wealthy coastal communities do not have their hospitals affected by emergency room visits by illegal immigrants. Etc., etc.,

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  51. Davehulhu, you do realize with the exception of the last few years Trump has spent his entire life a liberal New York billionaire, don’t you. We got pictures of his friends if you doubt us. He was even at Hillary fundraisers and Chelsea’s wedding.

    Rev. Hoagie® (785e38)

  52. 49.We are either a nation of laws or we aren’t. Illegal immigration is not fair to those who have been patient, followed our laws and The Rules.
    Colonel Haiku (2601c0) — 3/26/2017 @ 1:51 pm

    Colonel, you know my wife is one of those who followed our laws. But that’s not my priority regarding illegal immigration. IT’S NOT FAIR TO US AMERICANS!!! It’s the most vulnerable of OUR people who loose their jobs. It’s OUR lower and middle class who fork over tax dollars to support illegals that should be spent on their own families.

    Rev. Hoagie® (785e38)

  53. “The powers doing the importing of these people see no appreciable difference between us and the hordes.”

    Or, they are replacing us precisely because of the difference. They don’t like the way we think and the way we vote.

    That is what Trump meant by: this election is our last chance.

    Daryl Herbert (7be116)

  54. Hard working mexicans that I work with in the trades are all legal and want the wall built.

    mg (31009b)

  55. Davehulhu, you do realize with the exception of the last few years Trump has spent his entire life a liberal New York billionaire, don’t you. We got pictures of his friends if you doubt us. He was even at Hillary fundraisers and Chelsea’s wedding.

    Do you think he’s stopped? More illegals are visa overstays than cross over the border. Guess what the mar-a-lago staff consists of.

    Davethulhu (7d4953)

  56. The hard working Mexicans I work with in the trades all speak Spanish and I don’t have a clue if they want the wall built because I don’t speak Spanish.

    Most of the people I say that to say I should learn to speak Spanish.

    Because assimilation. Mine.

    Leon (168f33)

  57. Guess what the mar-a-lago staff consists of.

    When I was there the “Hispanic” help was of Cuban origin. The ones I saw were legal refugees from a communist state. But I haven’t been to Mar-A-Lago in about six years.

    Most of the people I say that to say I should learn to speak Spanish.

    Because assimilation. Mine.
    Leon (168f33) — 3/26/2017 @ 3:11 pm

    And take Arabic as a second language. And the Salah (salat) so you can pray in public. It’s not optional.

    Rev. Hoagie® (785e38)

  58. 54… Yes, Hoagie, you are correct, I think I end up leaving that unsaid and a given. Furthermore, I will never understand why so many in our black communities seem to fail to understand or acknowledge the effects of unfettered immigration – in particular, illegal – on jobs and suppression of wages. It’s a quality of life thing. We can’t be used by other countries to solve their social and economic problems in their own countries. No one has a right to come here or stay here and a citizenry that doesn’t understand what a privilege it is to be citizens of this country and that a nation or its leaders that do not hold the long term best interests of the country as of paramount importance does not deserve a viable or sustainable nation.

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  59. When I was there the “Hispanic” help was of Cuban origin. The ones I saw were legal refugees from a communist state. But I haven’t been to Mar-A-Lago in about six years.

    Unlikely. Cuban refugees aren’t H-2Bs.

    http://www.mypalmbeachpost.com/business/trump-again-hires-foreign-workers-for-mar-lago-little-change-pay/NtHozFcFMZXQWVkErxSdhM/

    While Mar-a-Lago asks the federal government for dozens of H-2B visas every tourist season, the private club has asked CareerSource for help finding a local employee only once in the past decade, Veenstra said. That was a 2015 request for a single banquet server.

    Davethulhu (7d4953)

  60. “CLARICE FELDMAN: Obama Did Wiretap Trump: It’s Like Putting Together a Russian Nesting Doll.”

    https://pjmedia.com/instapundit/260863/

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  61. Part of the American Job Center Network, created by Barack Obama and just another highly politicized entity, Dave teh Squid. I call bull sh*t.

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  62. Created in 2012.

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  63. You guys have to be the most gullible people alive.

    Here’s a link from the Haiku a mere 3 days ago.

    ““The intelligence is said to leave no doubt the Obama administration, in its closing days, was using the cover of legitimate surveillance on foreign targets to spy on President-elect Trump, according to sources. The key to that conclusion is the unmasking of selected U.S. persons whose names appeared in the intelligence, the sources said, adding that the paper trail leaves no other plausible purpose for the unmasking other than to damage the incoming Trump administration.”

    — James Rosen

    http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2017/03/23/potential-smoking-gun-showing-obama-administration-spied-on-trump-team-source-says.html
    Colonel Haiku (2601c0) — 3/23/2017 @ 7:16 pm

    From the beginning of the article:
    “Republican congressional investigators expect a potential “smoking gun” establishing that the Obama administration spied on the Trump transition team, and possibly the president-elect himself, will be produced to the House Intelligence Committee this week, a source told Fox News.”

    It’s Sunday, where’s the smoking gun?

    Davethulhu (7d4953)

  64. It’s in the SCIF. Patience, Grasshopper

    crazy (d3b449)

  65. “Domestic communications can be intercepted under two circumstances: in the first instance to protect us against sabotage or international terrorism or sabotage. In such a case, when authorized by the president through the attorney general, it can be done without a court order provided that it is for only one year and only to acquire foreign intelligence information and there is real likelihood that a U.S. person is a party to the communication. Even then it must be done in such a way to minimize the impact on the U.S. person. The attorney general must report such surveillance under seal to the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Court and report their compliance to both the House and Senate Intelligence Committees.

    Surveillance can also be done on a court order from FISA when the attorney general persuades the court that there is probable cause (i.e. a reasonable suspicion) that the target is a “foreign power” or an “agent of a foreign power” and the minimization requirements for information pertaining to U.S. persons will be followed. Such orders may be approved for 90 days,120 days, or a year.

    FISA court authorization is almost always granted. Reliable reports indicate that the Obama administration sought authorization in July of last year when Trump appeared a likely opponent (the application is still secret) and it was denied. These reports also state that a pared-down application was sought in October and granted by the court. We have no idea on what basis the Department of Justice sought these warrants nor who the purported target was.

    From the chairman of the House Intelligence Committee, Devin Nunes, we learned this week that Trump team’s conversations were caught in the surveillance, that for over nine months this was never reported to his committee. Moreover, it is public knowledge that three days before the inauguration in January, for no legitimate purpose, President Obama authorized wide distribution of the surveillance reports to 16 other agencies, the names of U.S. persons involved in the conversations were not redacted, the contents were of no intelligence value and they were widely leaked — a perfectly predictable consequence of spreading the raw data so widely in contrast to normal redaction and dissemination patterns. Suspicious minds like mine think may well be to further hamper the incoming administration by leaks designed to embarrass members of his team. Nunes also reported the post-election spying “had nothing to do with Russia.” By January 20, for example, the New York Times reported that Trump had been wiretapped.

    We learned this week from Nunes’ work that the investigation is continuing.

    On his own Mike Rogers, head of NSA, met privately with Trump shortly after the inauguration. We have no details of their discussion, but my guess is he told him what had happened and how. At the moment, Rogers appears to be the sole white hat in our intelligence network. But he may not be the only one, which, I think, would mean a number of former Obama officials have to be looking for lawyers.

    Tom Lipscomb, a former reporter and online friend, thinks the white hats in the intelligence community fed the truth about the wiretapping directly to Trump so he could weed out from their ranks the Obama confederates. Like him, I think the Trump tweet that he was wiretapped was smart. He’s giving “fair warning to what is coming,” and the claims that Trump was engaged in some “crazy conspiracy” are evaporating just as had the earlier nonsense that he and the Russians were conspiring via Wikileaks.”

    Read more: http://www.americanthinker.com/articles/2017/03/obama_did_wiretap_trump_its_like_putting_together_a_russian_nesting_doll.html#ixzz4cTbhOQ6c

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  66. Poe from Texas departs from the koch bros house freedom klutzes.
    Who’s next?

    mg (31009b)

  67. Read it and weep, Squid.

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  68. Career Source of Palm Beach… part of the American Job Center Network, created by Barack Obama in 2012 and just another highly politicized community organizing entity.

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  69. CareerSource Palm Beach County is chartered by the state of Florida to work with Palm Beach County businesses to provide job placement, recruitment assistance and funds for skills training.

    are you feeling ok? I don’t even know what argument you’re making. Are you saying that Trump doesn’t rely on H-2Bs to staff mar-a-lago? are you saying that CareerSource is lying, and he actually made an effort to hire locally?

    Davethulhu (7d4953)

  70. 60.When I was there the “Hispanic” help was of Cuban origin. The ones I saw were legal refugees from a communist state. But I haven’t been to Mar-A-Lago in about six years.

    Unlikely. Cuban refugees aren’t H-2Bs.

    Don’t tell me “unlikely” wingnut. You don’t know who I met there. For 15 years I had a winter home in Boca and we dined with and met friends for drinks all the time at either Mar-A-Lago or The Breakers. I knew many of the wait and bar staff and they were from Cuba.

    And we were discussing illegal aliens, not H-2B visa temps. Or is this your way of making it about Trump and putting him in a bad light? That’s okay, but it’s a different subject.

    Unlikely, indeed.

    Rev. Hoagie® (785e38)

  71. Coronello, inspector gadget doesnt even know which argument he is making at any one.

    narciso (d1f714)

  72. “CLARICE FELDMAN: Obama Did Wiretap Trump: It’s Like Putting Together a Russian Nesting Doll.”

    https://pjmedia.com/instapundit/260863/

    Garbage:

    By January 20, for example, the New York Times reported that Trump had been wiretapped.

    No it hadn’t. There was a headline on January 20 that said: “WIRETAPPED DATA USED IN INQUIRY OF TRUMP AIDES.” Nothing in the article said Obama wiretapped Trump, or that Trump had been wiretapped. Clarice Feldman made that part up.

    Patterico (699618)

  73. I’m serious now. Do you not understand how laws are created? The American Job Center Network was created by https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Workforce_Innovation_and_Opportunity_Act which was authored by Rep. Virginia Foxx (R-NC). It passed the house 215-202 by pretty much a party line vote. http://clerk.house.gov/evs/2013/roll075.xml

    You literally have no idea what you’re talking about.

    Davethulhu (7d4953)

  74. nopers

    Obama tipped off that he knew the corrupt nsa/cia/fbi spytrash were wiretapping Trump when he signed the order making it ridiculously super-easy to unmask Americans caught up in surveillance so their identities and conversations could be leaked to the propaganda slut media

    happyfeet (28a91b)

  75. Clarice who in her previous life saw how the intelligence community covered up inconvenient facts say with the Nazis when she worked CSI cases still has many contacts from that period

    narciso (d1f714)

  76. CSI, the Nazi hunting unit if justice, intercepts wee the other word on their platform.

    narciso (d1f714)

  77. putin lovin erdogan butt snuffling moles have no right not to be unmasked

    nk (dbc370)

  78. i’m shocked to hear you say that mister

    happyfeet (28a91b)

  79. Clarice/Judge Piro/ 2020

    mg (31009b)

  80. 73… it is a creation of Obama and has barely been in existence for 5 years, not a decade, Squid. And if it’s an Obama creation, it is highly politicized, just like you used it, Sparky.

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  81. I can put some trust in Clarice Feldman, who has the intelligence contacts and a wealth of experience. She certainly doesn’t deserve to be dismissed out of hand, but YMMV…

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  82. 73… it is a creation of Obama and has barely been in existence for 5 years, not a decade, Squid. And if it’s an Obama creation, it is highly politicized, just like you used it, Sparky.

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0) — 3/26/2017 @ 5:01 pm

    No it’s not, and I’ve given you links to prove that it’s not.

    Davethulhu (7d4953)

  83. For a guy who uses garbage can CNN as a “go-to” as often as you do, Patterico, I’d think some humility would be called for once in a while.

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  84. Glass houses

    Davethulhu (7d4953)

  85. I have found many of these programs like the predecessor jttpa, very week tea.

    narciso (d1f714)

  86. “… The President’s proposal also calls for the creation of an American Job Center network to unify all Federally-supported One-Stop Career Centers and electronic resources. Currently, names for these nearly 3,000 federally funded employment centers vary widely from state to state, or even from town to town, and electronic tools are spread across many disconnected websites. As a result, jobseekers often do not understand what employment and training resources are available, or where to go to for additional help. Businesses that are well-connected to the workforce system in one state are too often unaware that the same services are available to them elsewhere, under a different name. Workers and businesses should have an easily-identifiable source for the help and services our workforce system provides. The President’s Budget proposes a $50 million investment to improve and expand these workforce centers, and the President will launch part of this effort through executive authority.

    These proposals build on the President’s commitment to creating an economy that’s built to last by training workers in skills that lead directly to high-quality jobs. Last month, the President announced a new Community College to Career Fund to help forge new partnerships between community colleges and businesses to train 2 million workers for jobs in high-growth and high-demand industries. The President will continue to take every measure to build an economy where everyone has opportunities to advance, hard work pays off, and responsibility is rewarded.”

    https://obamawhitehouse.archives.gov/the-press-office/2012/03/12/white-house-announces-details-president-s-plan-provide-americans-job-tra

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  87. Straight from the White House, not wiki, Squid.

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  88. More from the White House link, Squid…

    “Universal Displaced Worker Program. The Universal Displaced Worker Program in the President’s Budget will help provide displaced workers, who lose their job when their employer closes down or eliminates their position or doesn’t have enough business to keep them employed, with the skills and reemployment services they need through a universal suite of services.

    • Reemployment services for every displaced worker: Every displaced worker will receive proven job-search assistance to provide everything from work-search plans to assessing skills to determining whether and what kind of training makes sense.

    • $4,000 training awards: Displaced workers will be eligible for training awards of up to $4,000 per year for up to two years. This funding ensures that workers who need to pursue longer-term training in technical fields to learn skills for new industries can do so. Workers would be referred to training based on assessments at local American Job Centers.

    • Support to pursue training or look for work: To ensure that workers have the support they need while pursuing training, the program would provide a weekly stipend for childcare, transportation and other expenses of $150, ranging up to $300 for low-income workers, for up to 78 weeks, in addition to 26 weeks of UI benefits, . To assist with relocating for job opportunities in other cities and states, and to supplement their job-search, the program would provide workers job search and relocation allowances of up to $1,250 each.

    • Wage insurance for older workers: To support older workers returning to work, eligible workers age 50 or older who obtain new, full-time employment at wages of less than $50,000 may receive wage insurance for up to two years to partially offset earnings losses in new jobs that pay less than their previous jobs.

    • Investing in Proven and Effective Training: To build accountability into our training system and ensure that that workers are directed to the most effective training in high-growth fields, the President’s proposal will include: increased investment in counseling and case management services to give participants better information about training programs that are effective and have good track records; incentives and performance standards for both participants and training providers; and robust evaluation of what works.

    American Job Center Network. Every person seeking job assistance or business looking for skilled workers should be able to physically or virtually reach an American Job Center and tap into the nation-wide, Federally-funded system of job search assistance and information, training, and other supports.”

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  89. if dollar-signs-for-eyes trump’s pole dancer daughter’s lawyer had not put up a wall, where the nsa and the cia and the fbi could not tell each other what they heard foreigners talking about over international telecommunications, we would not have had 9/11, and probably not trump neither

    nk (dbc370)

  90. 59: “N. A. L.”

    I thought you’d have heard that long ago or its guey/cabron pidgin spanish equivalent, unless your in-laws are as “coconut” as both my sides of the family, Colonel.

    urbanleftbehind (847a06)

  91. One discovers that the BBC and CNN, not to mention Carlos slims cannot be relied upon to reconstruct a narrative.

    narciso (d1f714)

  92. American Job Centers (also known as One-Stop Centers are designed to provide a full range of assistance to job seekers under one roof. Established under the Workforce Investment Act, and reauthorized in the Workforce Innovation and Opportunities Act of 2014, the centers offer training referrals, career counseling, job listings, and similar employment-related services. Customers can visit a center in person or connect to the center’s information online or through kiosk remote access.

    The American Jobs Center System is coordinated by the Department of Labor’s Employment and Training Administration (ETA). ETA’s Web site provides a clickable map of American Jobs Centers’ web sites for each state and a list of state, regional, and local center contacts. You can also find a center by calling ETA’s toll-free help line at (877) US-2JOBS (TTY: 1-877-889-5267).

    DOL Web Pages on This Topic
    Career One StopFind One-Stop service in your state or local area and learn more about One-Stop services and activities.

    Laws & Regulations on This Topic
    Laws

    Public Law 113-128
    Workforce Innovation and Opportunity Act of 2014

    https://www.dol.gov/general/topic/training/onestop

    Actual government website

    Davethulhu (7d4953)

  93. Yes gorelick formalized an informal partition that extended back to how Er/donovan days (wedge, mark Riebling*) she subsequently used thud knowledge she gained on the commission, to defend a party to the civil law suits re 9/11. I recall beldar had a post out it.

    *Almost two decades later, he brought up new research re a spy ring pope pius ran against the Nazis.

    narciso (d1f714)

  94. Other contributors on that outlet were not discerning enough to ignore the most recent ‘plastic Turkey’ incident

    narciso (20d182)

  95. American Job Center Network was created by the Obama Administration in 2012, as described on the White House website, as linked in the post, as excerpted in the posts…

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  96. “This is historical material “frozen in time”. The website is no longer updated and links to external websites and some internal pages may not work.”

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  97. That would be that apocryphal ‘check’ that trump asked of merkel.

    narciso (20d182)

  98. “But, to be clear, I did not say on this segment that I have any confirmation that he is actually cooperating or that I have talked to anyone ”

    — Juliette Kayyem

    That’s how fake news is initiated and spread, narciso.

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  99. You should get in touch with the department of labor, tell them to fix their website. They think it was created by an act of congress.

    https://www.dol.gov/ajc/

    Davethulhu (7d4953)

  100. She’s like Elaine (of seinfeld’) dimmer sister, the fact she was anywhere near homeland is not reassuring inn the least.

    narciso (20d182)

  101. You should do some research, Squid… Obama bragged about it, it was his creation, his proposal.

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  102. Camillieri, notes on his late inspector montalbano mystery, the way Berlusconi still occupied spaces in his skull, rent free.

    narciso (20d182)

  103. You should do some research. I don’t think you understand how government works.

    Davethulhu (7d4953)

  104. White House website, captured from March of 2012 for posterity…

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  105. Obama’s idea, proposal, and like everything else he touched, highly politicized .

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  106. Actual webpage of the organization…

    Actually, this whole argument is dumb. You win. I’m not going to respond any further on this topic.

    Davethulhu (7d4953)

  107. “The White House
    Office of the Press Secretary
    For Immediate ReleaseMarch 12, 2012
    White House Announces Details on President’s Plan to Provide Americans with Job Training and Employment Services

    In his State of the Union address, the President laid out a blueprint for an economy built to last. A key part of getting more Americans back to work and strengthening the middle class is the President’s comprehensive plan to get Americans the skills they need for the high-demand jobs of today and tomorrow through major investments in job training. As part of this plan, today the Administration is unveiling details of the President’s proposal for a streamlined re-employment system that will reach up to a million displaced workers a year and better connect all workers and businesses with employment services in their communities.

    “Americans looking for work shouldn’t have to go through a complex administrative process or navigate multiple websites just to figure out how to get the services and training they need,” President Obama said. “It’s time to modernize the system. Anyone who has lost a job, no matter what the circumstances, deserves the same support to get back on their feet – and today’s announcement will help make sure they get it.”

    Displaced workers are individuals who have lost their jobs through no fault of their own, but because their employer closed a plant or division; moved or abolished their position; or simply had insufficient work for them to do. Our current worker training system does not treat these workers the same; rather, it asks how someone lost their job before deciding what support is available. Workers in trade-impacted industries are eligible for extensive income support, training, and reemployment services under the Trade Adjustment Assistance program (TAA), while workers who are displaced for other reasons receive less generous employment services and training through the Workforce Investment Act (WIA) Dislocated Worker program on a first-come, first-serve basis. In 2007, the year before the recession, these programs served about 530,000 displaced workers, and less than one third of them were able to participate in training. As part of the President’s effort to reform and modernize our training system, the President’s budget proposed to expand the availability of a universal suite of training and employment services to a broader number of displaced workers by consolidating and improving these two programs. Under the new Universal Displaced Worker Program, which the Administration released details of today, up to a million workers a year would receive high-quality job-search assistance, together with access to critical skills training for high-growth and in-demand industries or, for older workers, the option of wage insurance – a significant improvement on the current system.

    The President’s proposal also calls for the creation of an American Job Center Network to unify all Federally-supported One-Stop Career Centers and electronic resources. Currently, names for these nearly 3,000 federally funded employment centers vary widely from state to state, or even from town to town, and electronic tools are spread across many disconnected websites. As a result, jobseekers often do not understand what employment and training resources are available, or where to go to for additional help. Businesses that are well-connected to the workforce system in one state are too often unaware that the same services are available to them elsewhere, under a different name. Workers and businesses should have an easily-identifiable source for the help and services our workforce system provides. The President’s Budget proposes a $50 million investment to improve and expand these workforce centers, and the President will launch part of this effort through executive authority.

    These proposals build on the President’s commitment to creating an economy that’s built to last by training workers in skills that lead directly to high-quality jobs. Last month, the President announced a new Community College to Career Fund to help forge new partnerships between community colleges and businesses to train 2 million workers for jobs in high-growth and high-demand industries. The President will continue to take every measure to build an economy where everyone has opportunities to advance, hard work pays off, and responsibility is rewarded.

    The President’s Commitment to Get Displaced Workers Back to Work in
    High-Demand and High-Growth Industries

    Universal Displaced Worker Program. The Universal Displaced Worker Program in the President’s Budget will help provide displaced workers, who lose their job when their employer closes down or eliminates their position or doesn’t have enough business to keep them employed, with the skills and reemployment services they need through a universal suite of services.

    • Reemployment services for every displaced worker: Every displaced worker will receive proven job-search assistance to provide everything from work-search plans to assessing skills to determining whether and what kind of training makes sense.

    • $4,000 training awards: Displaced workers will be eligible for training awards of up to $4,000 per year for up to two years. This funding ensures that workers who need to pursue longer-term training in technical fields to learn skills for new industries can do so. Workers would be referred to training based on assessments at local American Job Centers.

    • Support to pursue training or look for work: To ensure that workers have the support they need while pursuing training, the program would provide a weekly stipend for childcare, transportation and other expenses of $150, ranging up to $300 for low-income workers, for up to 78 weeks, in addition to 26 weeks of UI benefits, . To assist with relocating for job opportunities in other cities and states, and to supplement their job-search, the program would provide workers job search and relocation allowances of up to $1,250 each.

    • Wage insurance for older workers: To support older workers returning to work, eligible workers age 50 or older who obtain new, full-time employment at wages of less than $50,000 may receive wage insurance for up to two years to partially offset earnings losses in new jobs that pay less than their previous jobs.

    • Investing in Proven and Effective Training: To build accountability into our training system and ensure that that workers are directed to the most effective training in high-growth fields, the President’s proposal will include: increased investment in counseling and case management services to give participants better information about training programs that are effective and have good track records; incentives and performance standards for both participants and training providers; and robust evaluation of what works.

    American Job Center Network. Every person seeking job assistance or business looking for skilled workers should be able to physically or virtually reach an American Job Center and tap into the nation-wide, Federally-funded system of job search assistance and information, training, and other supports.

    • Universal Access: State and local one-stop career centers are part of a national network of service providers for workers and businesses. Each year, more than 30 million individuals already tap into existing workforce system resources, but there are millions more who could benefit from being able to reliably find the services they need to succeed in today’s economy. As a result of this rebranding and outreach effort, every person will be able to access an online tool or a 1-800 number through which they can access upgraded and personalized services; will have access to the American Job Center Network near where they live; and will be able to access in-person consultation services and job search assistance. The Administration will build on its partnerships with state and federal agencies, libraries, community colleges, and community organizations to ensure broad access in all parts of the country.

    Online American Job Center: In the coming months, the Administration will also unveil a new, integrated online American Job Center at JobCenter.USA.gov which will provide a single point of access to resources oriented to the needs of an individual or business. This online tool will mean 24-7 access to key information to help people find a job, identify training programs, and tap into resources to gain skills in growth industries. The website, which will incorporate information from key federal programs and critical local resources, will also serve a resource for the brick-and-mortar Job Centers throughout the country.

    • Further Proposed Investments: The President’s Budget also proposes a $50 million investment to further expand connections to the American Job Center Network. This includes expansion of Center satellite programs and virtual centers in public housing, schools, libraries, and community colleges, plus the addition of mobile centers. This effort would also support greater co-location and coordination of services that Americans need to find work and access training.”

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  108. Ill be the first to admit I dont understand how government “works” these days. It seems to be some sort of bureaucracy guided by corporatist lobbyists in the interests of globalist goals, deeply corrupt and divorced from national interests, heavily invested in chaos theory with a communist veneer. But one things for sure, this ain’t America anymore.

    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=xeO3HL-_WJQ

    Leon (168f33)

  109. As David Byrne might say ‘how did we get here’ one might say Woodrow Wilson importing German progressivism in policy and scientism in economics.

    narciso (20d182)

  110. Carlos slims had a sad our neighbors to the north are finding this bet on the Syrian refugees isn’t paying off.

    narciso (20d182)

  111. Camilierri noted the bossi/fini bill in a note to one of his other tales, a rather extensive deportation measure under berlusconi

    narciso (d1f714)

  112. Patterico (699618) — 3/26/2017 @ 4:28 pm

    There was a headline on January 20 that said: “WIRETAPPED DATA USED IN INQUIRY OF TRUMP AIDES.” Nothing in the article said Obama wiretapped Trump, or that Trump had been wiretapped. Clarice Feldman made that part up.

    Somebody did. Do we know it was larice feldman who first looked at it and said 2+2=6?

    There’s anotheer thing. The New York Times had an article Friday.

    They NEVER changed the headline of that article online.

    It was always that way they say (although I had the impression I had seen it the other way.

    https://www.nytimes.com/2017/03/23/us/politics/fact-check-trump-misleads-surveillance-wiretapping.html

    In this case, the article appeared in print with the headline, “Wiretapped Data Used in Inquiry of Trump Aides,” followed by two subheadlines, “Examining Russian Ties” and “Business Dealings of Campaign Advisors Are Investigated.” Online, the headline read, “Intercepted Russian Communications Part of Inquiry Into Trump Associates.”

    As the conservative publication National Review has reported and as the Wayback Machine’s archive of the 336 caches of the story shows, the web headline has remained the same from initial publication…

    See also:

    https://www.nytimes.com/2017/03/23/insider/headline-trump-time-interview.html

    Here’s Andrew C. McCArthy correcting himself:

    http://www.nationalreview.com/corner/445649/mccarthy-error-apologize-nyt-headline-not-changed

    Sammy Finkelman (95e288)

  113. Kevin M (25bbee) — 3/26/2017 @ 11:51 am

    1) The Irish immigrants all came with permission.

    At that time, Congress did not believe it had the power to prohibit. The Know Nothing party never proposed any restrictions on immigration that I know of,but only on naturalization.

    2) Many people who are upset with the illegals doe not mind the legal immigrants from the same groups.

    The same people who lobby for “enforcement” also lobby for lower immigration.

    Sammy Finkelman (95e288)

  114. Since people have been conflating since 187, they’ve lost the benefit of the doubt:

    https://mobile.twitter.com/latimes/status/846176213341261824

    narciso (d1f714)

  115. #110 dave, is that a promise?

    Cruz Supporter (102c9a)

  116. That’s not saying what you think it’s saying.

    People are afraid to report crimes, which is the reason why sanctuary cities exist.

    Davethulhu (fab944)

  117. Is Circa a lefty publication?

    I ask because that final paragraph seemed pretty open ended, and a little desperate.

    kishnevi (da982b)

  118. No, they are not, itbut they arevtrying to cover all the bases.

    narciso (d1f714)

  119. Sanctuary cities were devised to avoidvthe law innthe first play e?

    narciso (d1f714)

  120. There’s a lot of politics on all sides, but the main reason to have a sanctuary city is so that you don’t have a population that’s afraid to report crimes or use basic medical services.

    Davethulhu (fab944)

  121. The same people who lobby for “enforcement” also lobby for lower immigration.

    SOME OF …. perhaps.

    But I lobby for enforcement and I also would lobby for more legal immigration from countries that share our values (Central and South America being among these; Saudi Arabia not so much).

    So, unless you say “some of”, I’m a counter-example.

    Kevin M (25bbee)

  122. Federal job training. *sigh*

    Close down H1-B visas and tell the tech companies to invest in scholarships if they want more engineers and such.. THERE’s your job training.

    Kevin M (25bbee)

  123. 5.If you want to actually impact illegal immigration, resources would be far better spent on penalizing those who hire them.

    It’s Catch-22. You can’t hire illegals, but you can’t discriminate against someone if they’re illegal when it comes to hiring.

    Part of the regulations that need eliminating

    JH (1fc204)

  124. “The reported intelligence collection efforts raise four separate questions that are too often conflated in the commentary:

    1) Should the communications of Trump associates (all of whom are U.S. citizens, so far as we know) have been intercepted in the first place?

    2) Regardless of whether the interception was proper, should the identities of the American citizens have been “masked” in order to protect them from, among other things, being smeared as subjects of government investigations?

    3) Regardless of whether masking was called for, should the fact that the American citizens’ communications had been collected and reviewed in connection with investigations — presumably, intelligence investigations, not criminal probes — have been disclosed throughout the “community” of U.S. intelligence agencies?

    4) Should that fact have been publicly disclosed, including in leaks to the media? (Spoiler alert: As my use of “leaked” indicates, public disclosure is a major no-no. In fact, it’s a felony no-no.)”

    http://www.nationalreview.com/article/446122/fisagate-monitoring-trump-associates-was-spying-abuse-power

    Colonel Haiku (470cbb)

  125. 111. American Job Center Network

    This could easily become a boondoggle. It doesn’t sound here that results count. It’s just another case of only intentions matter. It seems to be based on the assumption that at least some of what’s being done works.

    To make results count, give people working at or with the American Job Center Network huge bonuses based on how much Social Security tax the people they helped paid in the 3rd to the 8th quarters after they counseled them, or something like that, and allow them to pick clients..

    Sammy Finkelman (8a31dc)

  126. I have never met a single conservative or anyone else who is against illegal immigration who believed it would be okay if we were importing 20 million Englishmen instead of Mexicans, have you? Not that there might not be some but I’ve never heard of it. I think that’s something leftist racists make up to project their own bigotry on others…

    …Rev. Hoagie® (785e38) — 3/26/2017 @ 1:01 pm

    I’m a mutt. Mostly Italian by bloodline. If it were Italians breaking these laws I’d be against it. Many Hispanics are just as against illegal immigration as I am. Because it’s ruining the country they or their families salvaged themselves to in order to make a better life for themselves. I served with them.

    If anyone asks I’m just an American. I’m not a hyphenated American. The only concession I make to my bloodline, other than in cooking, is when I bow my head as I pass the exit for Basilone Road on I-5.

    Because Manila John.

    http://www.marineswwii.com/john_basilone.php

    F***ing eh.

    b

    Steve57 (0b1dac)

  127. Sorry for leaving the artifacts.

    Steve57 (0b1dac)

  128. I can put some trust in Clarice Feldman, who has the intelligence contacts and a wealth of experience. She certainly doesn’t deserve to be dismissed out of hand, but YMMV…

    I’m not dismissing her out of hand as a person. I am saying that this statement of hers is utterly false and baseless: “By January 20, for example, the New York Times reported that Trump had been wiretapped.” That is garbage and should not be repeated by people who care about actual facts. But we’re at the point, obviously, where you’d rather throw in your lot with people saying provably false things as long as said provably false thing confirms your prejudices and helps your “team.” Thus you’re unwilling to discuss the actual thing she said and whether there is any basis for it. You want to make it about personalities.

    Patterico (115b1f)


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