Patterico's Pontifications

12/14/2013

Denver Post Stealth-Edits Article to Remove Description of Colorado School Shooter As “Socialist”

Filed under: General — Patterico @ 5:58 pm

Version 1:

Thomas Conrad, who had an economics class with the gunman, described him as a very opinionated Socialist.

No, that won’t do.

Version 2:

Thomas Conrad, who had an economics class with Pierson, described him as very opinionated.

There. Much better.

75 Comments

  1. mao tse tung said change must come

    Comment by happyfeet (8ce051) — 12/14/2013 @ 8:04 pm

  2. Must not imply he’s just another violent LWNJ.

    Comment by daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 12/14/2013 @ 8:18 pm

  3. They did leave in the Keynesian part, because everyone knows what that is,

    Comment by narciso (3fec35) — 12/14/2013 @ 8:23 pm

  4. Plus strong opinions on gun rights – they just didn’t say opposing them.

    Comment by daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 12/14/2013 @ 9:48 pm

  5. The Denver Post editor defended the change, claiming the kid quoted might not know what a socialist really is.

    What a hack.

    Comment by Estragon (19fa04) — 12/14/2013 @ 10:02 pm

  6. It probably doesn’t need to be said, but this stealth editing job is the process by which academia rewrites history so that national socialists become right wingers.

    Comment by Steve57 (137dd8) — 12/14/2013 @ 10:44 pm

  7. Denver Post lying hack.
    FIFY

    Comment by SPQR (768505) — 12/14/2013 @ 11:49 pm

  8. lying liars lie…

    unexpectedly.

    film @ 11

    Comment by redc1c4 (abd49e) — 12/15/2013 @ 1:16 am

  9. mary just don’t give a damn no more

    Comment by happyfeet (8ce051) — 12/15/2013 @ 1:52 am

  10. The non progressives of Colorado know which way the wind blows.
    Trust me-They are well armed.

    Comment by mg (31009b) — 12/15/2013 @ 2:05 am

  11. Karl Pierson, a very opinionated young socialist, cared so very much about economic equality that he bought a new shotgun and concocted a few Molotov Cocktails before he went looking for the high school’s debate coach to settle old scores. But, upon learning his target was too smart to wait around to get gunned down in cold blood, the very opinionated young socialist decided to shoot a beautiful 17 year old girl in the face instead. That’s Karl’s own special way of winning debates.

    Next, Karl squeezed off a few rounds to celebrate economic equality right before he made damn sure he sure as hell wouldn’t be around to answer any pesky questions or explain how his deep commitment to socialism brought him armed and on the prod to high school on that frosty fateful morning.

    Socialism, at least in this insane little bastard’s case, means never having to say you’re sorry. And, Karl can count, if he was still here to count, on fellow socialists at the Denver Post to cover for the motivating ideology behind his peculiar vision of economic equality. Socialists really do care about the welfare of their perverse ideology, not so much about pretty 17 year old girls though.

    Comment by ropelight (6a844e) — 12/15/2013 @ 4:11 am

  12. Power grows out of the barrel of a gun.

    Comment by Colonel Haiku (1be04f) — 12/15/2013 @ 5:20 am

  13. A left-leaning kid using Joe Biden’s weapon of choice to critically injure someone in a school.
    Spin like the wind, DP. Spin it until you can win it.

    Comment by Icy (6e1280) — 12/15/2013 @ 6:10 am

  14. 11. Don’t forget – this murderer was a strong proponent of gun control.

    This presented a contradiction for teh denver Post, so they ignored it.

    It sounds like he wasn’t really being honest in his arguments. He was arguing to make himself important, not because he believed in anything – unless this was “propaganda of the deed.” (in other words: “I’ll kill people with a gun. Now you have to agree with me that guns shouldn’t be readily available..)

    Comment by Sammy Finkelman (ca4c0f) — 12/15/2013 @ 6:21 am

  15. Oh – the girl he shot in the head is still alive.

    He just killed himself.

    Comment by Sammy Finkelman (ca4c0f) — 12/15/2013 @ 6:26 am

  16. And according to the cops, he shot himself 80 seconds after he shot the girl. I doubt that it was because he was afraid of the cops’ “quick response”. We’ll never know, but I think it was because he realized what a monstrous thing he had just done, and how monstrous his plan had been.

    Comment by nk (dbc370) — 12/15/2013 @ 7:13 am

  17. Last night I was asked by a friend, while participating in a Live Nativity scene, why I carry concealed–even at church.

    I asked him if he ever read the news. Ever.

    Comment by Virtual Insanity (1fcfe5) — 12/15/2013 @ 7:25 am

  18. If only he had been a tea bagger–everyone knows what that is.

    Comment by Patricia (be0117) — 12/15/2013 @ 7:55 am

  19. Senior Chris Davis, 18, was among many students Saturday trying to make sense of Pierson’s shooting rampage.

    “He was a weird kid,” Davis said. “He’s a self-proclaimed communist, just wears Soviet shirts all the time.”

    Comment by Colonel Haiku (1be04f) — 12/15/2013 @ 8:18 am

  20. Greetings:

    And here I thought that “All the news that fits” referred to the printed sheet.

    Comment by 11B40 (acfcf6) — 12/15/2013 @ 8:34 am

  21. ‘Every Communist must grasp the truth, “Political power grows out of the barrel of a gun.” ‘

    - Mao Tse-tung from “Problems of War and Strategy” November 6, 1938

    Comment by Colonel Haiku (1be04f) — 12/15/2013 @ 8:35 am

  22. I guess the entire Denver Post newsroom objected to connecting Socialism with murder. Or at least non-mass murder.

    Comment by Kevin M (536c5d) — 12/15/2013 @ 8:36 am

  23. After all, Socialists believe that “a single death is a tragedy.”

    Comment by Kevin M (536c5d) — 12/15/2013 @ 8:37 am

  24. It sounds like he wasn’t really being honest in his arguments. He was arguing to make himself important, not because he believed in anything – unless this was “propaganda of the deed.”

    Sammy, that reminds me of your argument that Obama isn’t intrinsically, emotionally of the left.

    I have a hunch you’re still bothered by the idea that liberal biases can be a surprisingly contradictory and corrupt (and even disgusting) quality in people. That studies and surveys which reveal the ass-backwards reality of liberalism and liberals really do manifest themselves, time and time again.

    For example, the tax returns of a majority of Democrat presidents or candidates over the past few decades revealing them to be cheapskates in their charitable giving, while the opposite has been true of most Republican presidents or candidates.

    I recall your stating that the bigotry of Woodrow Wilson was a residue of his Southern upbringing, presumably surrounded by the darlings of the Confederacy. Okay. But when one notes the similar bigotry of big-time Yankee/northerner Franklin D. Roosevelt — a New Yorker through and through — then what?

    Comment by Mark (58ea35) — 12/15/2013 @ 8:41 am

  25. I guess the entire Denver Post newsroom objected to connecting Socialism with murder. Or at least non-mass murder.

    “A single death is a tragedy, a million deaths are but a statistic.”

    Comment by askeptic (2bb434) — 12/15/2013 @ 9:08 am

  26. @24

    Sammy actually tried to argue that Obama is not a lefty?

    Holy crap, that is some serious stupid (on Sammy’s part, not yours Mark)

    Comment by kinlaw (db8bae) — 12/15/2013 @ 9:14 am

  27. Why would the Denver Post assume that an outspoken, opinionated, political high school student wouldn’t understand the label Socialist?

    Comment by Dirty Old Man (1dd208) — 12/15/2013 @ 9:41 am

  28. They assumed the high schooler understood Keynesian , but socialist was a bridge too far.

    Comment by JD (5c1832) — 12/15/2013 @ 9:45 am

  29. After the fact excuse making. The Denver Post deserves no benefit of the doubt.

    Comment by SPQR (768505) — 12/15/2013 @ 10:06 am

  30. 24. Comment by Mark (58ea35) — 12/15/2013 @ 8:41 am

    I have a hunch you’re still bothered by the idea that liberal biases can be a surprisingly contradictory and corrupt (and even disgusting) quality in people.

    The shooter, Karl Pierson, was a member of the high school debate team! Members of a debate team don’t argue for what they really believe!

    He also sometimes called himself a Communist. One student says he wore a T-short or something emblazoned with the word Communist (?) “to confuse people.”

    There seems to be some unclarity about exactly what had happened to him. The general impression students had was that he had been bounced from the debate team, but there is another report that the discipline (for making threats) was something less, and happened back in September.

    He went gunning for the school librarian, Tracy Murphy, who doubled as the speech and debate faculty adviser and coach, who saw him coming, and he fled, together with a janitor.

    I suppose he might have shot the student because she told him he had left (and was too obviously happy about it) or maybe to make Mr. Murphy feel guilty for leaving. If he couldn’t kill him, maybe he’d give him pangs of guilt. Or maybe it was because someone was closing in, and if he didn’t shoot somebody, he’d wind up doing nothing.

    Comment by Sammy Finkelman (9fe80b) — 12/15/2013 @ 10:19 am

  31. Sammy, you are back to building speculation upon your speculation.

    Comment by SPQR (768505) — 12/15/2013 @ 10:30 am

  32. I don’t think Karl Pierson was any kind of liberal or radical. I think he just was a liar, and ambitious.

    For some reason, he thought his life was over, because when he went in there it was almost certainly with the idea he would die. He probably did not want to get arrested.

    Comment by Sammy Finkelman (9fe80b) — 12/15/2013 @ 10:33 am

  33. What i have said is taht Obama associated with people not because in what they said, but because they could advance his career, and in fact he tried to moderate them.

    I think Obama is more a cynic than a leftwinger.

    Now a certain amount of conscience would cause someone to want to find merit in the things he supported, and the easiest way to do that is not to have much intellectual curiosity, and basically Obama wasn’t and isn’t very curious.

    He always voted at his partry’s call, and he never thought of thinking for himself at all!!

    I think this entirely accounts for his positions on the social issues.

    He sentimentalizes the struggle for civil rights legislation and labor union supported legislation. Another cause he endorsed, without ever analyzing anything or thinking for himself at all, was national health insurance. All he wanted was some kind of a law.

    He has some devotion to “legality” especially international law regarding war.

    Most other things are pure expediency.

    Comment by Sammy Finkelman (9fe80b) — 12/15/2013 @ 10:41 am

  34. 31. I am not sure it’s too mucxh speculation.

    By the way, the New York Post has a story today about the secret 28-page (of 800 pages = about 7,200 words) appendix to the report of teh 9/11 commission.

    It looks like Prince Bandar had something to do with the 9/11 hijackers.

    Comment by Sammy Finkelman (9fe80b) — 12/15/2013 @ 10:44 am

  35. Members of a debate team don’t argue for what they really believe!

    Nice try, Sammy.

    nydailynews.com: Adding to the shock of Pierson’s sudden meltdown was the fact he once cracked wise about Republican opposition to gun control. Prior to that terrifying day Pierson, described by students as having communist views, hinted he felt strongly about curbing gun violence.

    On his Facebook page, he chided members of the GOP, writing “You republicans are so cute,” along with an image that read: “The Republican Party: Health Care: Let ’em Die, Climate Change: Let ’em Die, Gun Violence: Let ’em Die, Women’s Rights: Let ’em Die, More War: Let ’em Die. Is this really the side you want to be on?” The Denver Post reported.

    ^ Pierson’s mindset suddenly reminds me that of the ex-LA cop who went on a deadly rampage earlier this year and, as with Pierson, also had liberal or leftwing views. Most particularly, he also supported gun-control laws.

    The irony is so thick it can’t be cut with even the sharpest of knives.

    When you nonchalantly and easily described conservative commentator Pat Buchanan several months ago as loving blood and violence, you perhaps weren’t projecting characteristics of the left onto others?

    Give it up, Sammy. It’s now time to enter hard, cold reality.

    Comment by Mark (58ea35) — 12/15/2013 @ 10:44 am

  36. “I think Obama is more a cynic than a leftwinger. ”

    No, he is a cynical self promoting left winger, but I repeat myself.

    Comment by MikeK (cd7278) — 12/15/2013 @ 10:46 am

  37. Mark: For example, the tax returns of a majority of Democrat presidents or candidates over the past few decades revealing them to be cheapskates in their charitable giving, while the opposite has been true of most Republican presidents or candidates.

    But that’s logical, since they already gave to the IRS, and state and local governments, while conservatives don’t think of taxes as a form of charitable giving.

    I recall your stating that the bigotry of Woodrow Wilson was a residue of his Southern upbringing, presumably surrounded by the darlings of the Confederacy. Okay.

    People don’t know this, but he was not from Virginia. Maureen Dowd recently wrote a column about him

    http://www.nytimes.com/2013/12/08/opinion/sunday/woodrow-wilson-stud-muffin.html

    …and did not know that he really grew up in Georgia and was 5 1/2 years old when Sherman was marching through it. She writes:

    As the world mourned Nelson Mandela, Berg had to agree that the Virginia-born Wilson was a racist, even if he was “a centrist” for his time.

    Virginia-born yes, but Georgia raised. Even A. Scott Berg, the author of book she talks about called “Wilson,” didn’t know that or didn’t communicate that.

    Another thing, about half of Princeton’s students at the time Wilson went there, and later taught, came from the south.

    She writes:

    When he was president of Princeton, Wilson worked to curb elitism, trying to get rid of eating clubs, but he did not work to curb racism. When a poor student at a Virginia Baptist college wrote beseeching to come, Wilson answered “that it is altogether inadvisable for a colored man to enter Princeton.”

    But the thing is, Princeton was different than Harvard or Yale. It was almost a southern institution.

    But when one notes the similar bigotry of big-time Yankee/northerner Franklin D. Roosevelt — a New Yorker through and through — then what?

    No, it wasn’t similiar. Franklin Delano Roosevel was affected by the argument for quotas limiting Jews to their percentage of the population, but that’s about it.

    Comment by Sammy Finkelman (9fe80b) — 12/15/2013 @ 10:48 am

  38. 36. I don’t think Obama has really very many sincerely held left wing beliefs.

    Comment by Sammy Finkelman (9fe80b) — 12/15/2013 @ 10:50 am

  39. “Members of a debate team don’t argue for what they really believe!”

    35. Comment by Mark (58ea35) — 12/15/2013 @ 10:44 am

    Nice try, Sammy.

    Well, you quote, from his Facebook page:

    The Republican Party: Health Care: Let ’em Die, Climate Change: Let ’em Die, Gun Violence: Let ’em Die, Women’s Rights: Let ’em Die, More War: Let ’em Die. Is this really the side you want to be on?” The Denver Post reported.

    Would you call that person a Socialist or would you call him a highly partisan Democrat?

    And which do you think came first, his positions on health care, climate change, guns, “Women’s Rights” and war, or his support of the Democratic Party???

    I think his use of guns indicates that it was his support of the Democratic Party (trying to join something big, that is) that came first, and not his position on guns and all the rest of that.

    It’s not the causes he cared about.

    It’s himself, and his prospects he cared about.

    Which he seems to have convinced himself, the school librarian/debate coach had wrecked. I don’t know, was the librarian threatening to take some action against him?

    Comment by Sammy Finkelman (9fe80b) — 12/15/2013 @ 11:00 am

  40. 37. Correction. Woodrow Wilson was 7 1/2, not 5 1/2 years old, when General Sherman was marching through Georgia. He grew up in the deep south.

    Everybody makes this mistake, and associates him with Virginia, because his birth place is listed in almanacs.

    Winston Churchill made the same mistake in one little piece of alternate histoiry he wrote.

    Comment by Sammy Finkelman (9fe80b) — 12/15/2013 @ 11:08 am

  41. 36. I don’t think Obama has really very many sincerely held left wing beliefs.

    Comment by Sammy Finkelman (9fe80b) — 12/15/2013 @ 10:50 am

    Sammy… really? You can review his appointments and nominations and write those words with a straight face?

    Comment by Colonel Haiku (d46dd6) — 12/15/2013 @ 11:18 am

  42. Would you call that person a Socialist or would you call him a highly partisan Democrat?

    Sammy, Pierson leaned left. The shooter of the Congresswoman from Arizona leaned left. The ex-LAPD officer who killed innocent people leaned left. Why you hesitate to admit that is due to what?

    Franklin Delano Roosevel was affected by the argument for quotas limiting Jews to their percentage of the population, but that’s about it.

    Your making that claim is revealing even more of your true MO, your own left-leaning instincts. You know full well that FDR said that Jews were to blame for rising anti-Semitism in 1930s Europe, that he supported quotas to restrict the numbers of Jews in organizations and government, that he said he was proud of the purity of blood of certain Americans, that the offspring of white/Asian couples were unfortunate.

    But you really gave away your MO several months ago when you breezily said that Pat Buchanan loved blood and violence. I’ve never observed you giving such little (or lack of) benefit of the doubt to any person of the left.

    Comment by Mark (58ea35) — 12/15/2013 @ 11:18 am

  43. http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2523597/Debate-coach-praised-leading-Arapahoe-High-School-shooter-Karl-Pierson-outside.html

    Hero debate coach praised for trying to lead the Colorado high school shooter out of the building to avoid the disgruntled student from harming others ….

    Pierson, 18, feared the demotion would threaten his plans to attend the Air Force Academy and sought Murphy out with a shotgun on Friday

    It seems like rather recently he was not only demoted, but suspended.

    The cause of the disciplinary actions was that Pierson had threatened to kill Murphy.

    Comment by Sammy Finkelman (9fe80b) — 12/15/2013 @ 11:21 am

  44. Comment by Mark (58ea35) — 12/15/2013 @ 11:18 am

    Sammy, Pierson leaned left. The shooter of the Congresswoman from Arizona leaned left. The ex-LAPD officer who killed innocent people leaned left. Why you hesitate to admit that is due to what?

    I think the connection would be that left-wingism offers more of a justification for breaking normal rules of morality, and also carries the impression of being bigger.

    You know full well that FDR said that Jews were to blame for rising anti-Semitism in 1930s Europe,

    Because too many were professionals (causing other people to be jealous?) – that’s what he wrote.

    that he supported quotas to restrict the numbers of Jews in organizations and government

    But that’s as far as he went, and this actually did not extend beyond colleges.

    that he said he was proud of the purity of blood of certain Americans, that the offspring of white/Asian couples were unfortunate.

    And that’s as far as you can take it.

    But you really gave away your MO several months ago when you breezily said that Pat Buchanan loved blood and violence. I’ve never observed you giving such little (or lack of) benefit of the doubt to any person of the left. I think this is true of Pat Buchanan, and I also that’s giving him the benefit of the doubt.

    Comment by Sammy Finkelman (9fe80b) — 12/15/2013 @ 11:27 am

  45. “I don’t think Obama has really very many sincerely held left wing beliefs.”

    Comment by Colonel Haiku (d46dd6) — 12/15/2013 @ 11:18 am

    Sammy… really? You can review his appointments and nominations and write those words with a straight face?

    That’s patronage and networking, not any kind of cogent sincerely held belief. And you know, he was pretty slow about this.

    Comment by Sammy Finkelman (9fe80b) — 12/15/2013 @ 11:30 am

  46. And that’s as far as you can take it.

    “And other than THAT, Mrs Lincoln, how was the play?”

    Sammy, if you at least admit that your gut instincts are of the left, the rather transparent way you reveal that in general when you’re trying to sound objective and sophisticated won’t seem quite so underhanded or disingenuous.

    The next step then will be getting you to at least admit that left-leaning emotions in reality can nurture or trigger just the opposite of what the biggest adherents of liberalism most fancy about themselves.

    Comment by Mark (58ea35) — 12/15/2013 @ 11:38 am

  47. 34. Correction: “By the way, the New York Post has a story today about the secret 28-page (of 800 pages = about 7,200 words) appendix to the report of the 9/11 Commission.” a 2002 report by a Congressional committee: the Joint Inquiry Into Intelligence Community Activities Before and After the Terrorist Attacks of September 11, 2001.

    Comment by Sammy Finkelman (9fe80b) — 12/15/2013 @ 12:13 pm

  48. This morning, on CBS’ Face the Nation, over and over again, Thomas L. Friedman of the New York times kept on saying “Soviet Union” when he meant Russia. He even corrected himself one time, and then he went back to it.

    I think the reason is, that back in those days when he, and others, said “Soviet Union”, they meant Russia. “Soviet Union” was just a word for nuclear armed Russia.

    Comment by Sammy Finkelman (9fe80b) — 12/15/2013 @ 2:01 pm

  49. I don’t think Obama has really very many sincerely held left wing beliefs.

    Like most dilettantes, he actually has sincerely held sophmoric beliefs, some of which are breathtaking in their vacuity. Particularly in fields that require math.

    Comment by Kevin M (536c5d) — 12/15/2013 @ 2:02 pm

  50. 44. …I think the connection would be that left-wingism offers more of a justification for breaking normal rules of morality, and also carries the impression of being bigger.

    Comment by Sammy Finkelman (9fe80b) — 12/15/2013 @ 11:27 am

    Finally, you stumble across a truth. Leftists hold their opinions because superior people hold leftist opinions. Any leftist can tell you that.

    Since liberals hold superior positions, or in other words they “gave at the office” by voting to take money from some people to give to others and call that generosity, they can be just plain nasty in their personal life. They’re more likely to lie, cheat, or steal because it isn’t what you do that matters to liberals, it’s how you vote.

    http://www.amazon.com/Makers-Takers-conservatives-generously-materialistic/dp/038551350X/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1212101444&sr=1-1

    In Makers and Takers you will discover why:

    * Seventy-one percent of conservatives say you have an obligation to care for a seriously injured spouse or parent versus less than half (46 percent) of liberals.

    * Conservatives have a better work ethic and are much less likely to call in sick than their liberal counterparts.

    * Liberals are 2½ times more likely to be resentful of others’ success and 50 percent more likely to be jealous of other people’s good luck.

    * Liberals are 2 times more likely to say it is okay to cheat the government out of welfare money you don’t deserve.

    * Conservatives are more likely than liberals to hug their children and “significantly more likely” to display positive nurturing emotions.

    * Liberals are less trusting of family members and much less likely to stay in touch with their parents.

    * Do you get satisfaction from putting someone else’s happiness ahead of your own? Fifty-five percent of conservatives said yes versus only 20 percent of liberals.

    * Rush Limbaugh, Ronald Reagan, Bill O’Reilly and Dick Cheney have given large sums of money to people in need, while Ted Kennedy, Nancy Pelosi, Michael Moore, and Al Gore have not.

    * Those who are “very liberal” are 3 times more likely than conservatives to throw things when they get angry.

    The American left prides itself on being superior to conservatives: more generous, less materialistic, more tolerant, more intellectual, and more selfless. For years scholars have constructed—and the media has pushed—elaborate theories designed to demonstrate that conservatives suffer from a host of personality defects and character flaws. According to these supposedly unbiased studies, conservatives are mean-spirited, greedy, selfish malcontents with authoritarian tendencies. Far from the belief of a few cranks, prominent liberals from John Kenneth Galbraith to Hillary Clinton have succumbed to these prejudices. But what do the facts show?

    Peter Schweizer has dug deep—through tax documents, scholarly data, primary opinion research surveys, and private records—and has discovered that these claims are a myth. Indeed, he shows that many of these claims actually apply more to liberals than conservatives. Much as he did in his bestseller Do as I Say (Not as I Do), he brings to light never-before-revealed facts that will upset conventional wisdom.

    Conservatives such as Ronald Reagan and Robert Bork have long argued that liberal policies promote social decay. Schweizer, using the latest data and research, exposes how, in general:

    * Liberals are more self-centered than conservatives.
    * Conservatives are more generous and charitable than liberals.
    * Liberals are more envious and less hardworking than conservatives.
    * Conservatives value truth more than liberals, and are less prone to cheating and lying.
    * Liberals are more angry than conservatives.
    * Conservatives are actually more knowledgeable than liberals.
    * Liberals are more dissatisfied and unhappy than conservatives.

    Schweizer argues that the failure lies in modern liberal ideas, which foster a self-centered, “if it feels good do it” attitude that leads liberals to outsource their responsibilities to the government and focus instead on themselves and their own desires.

    Comment by Steve57 (96df60) — 12/15/2013 @ 2:14 pm

  51. Folks are still trying to debate with Sammy F, the Master of the Universe?

    I laughed and laughed regarding his comments about people not believing in things and spouting empty words. It’s pure projection.

    Sammy is just a contrarian trying to feel important. And I don’t think he has a femtogram of empathy for any human being. It’s all about posturing toward some false ideal of fairness.

    Me, I’m sad for the folks who went through the shooting. And the families of the dead.

    Comment by Simon Jester (30bc70) — 12/15/2013 @ 2:36 pm

  52. Sammy, high school debate team members have to be able to argue for and against the question they’re debating, and do so persuasively. If you can only argue one side well, you will frequently lose. (Or at least they used to, back in the day; we didn’t know which side we had until the judges told us, we’d get a five or ten minute prep time.) Which might be why he was “demoted”; he was letting his personal beliefs get in the way of his debating.

    Comment by htom (412a17) — 12/15/2013 @ 2:45 pm

  53. #6 It probably doesn’t need to be said, but this stealth editing job is the process by which academia rewrites history so that national socialists become right wingers.

    Comment by Steve57 (137dd8) — 12/14/2013 @ 10:44 pm

    That is also how Abe Lincoln became a democrat

    Comment by joe (93323e) — 12/15/2013 @ 5:48 pm

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  55. The spammers make more sense than the Denver Post.

    Comment by SPQR (768505) — 12/15/2013 @ 6:05 pm

  56. The AP dispatch, in my fishwrap, left in the part about his Communist view, that’s going to warrant a doubleplusungood, if not a full crime think.

    Comment by narciso (3fec35) — 12/15/2013 @ 6:11 pm

  57. “‘Every Communist must grasp the truth, ‘Political power grows out of the barrel of a gun.’”

    - Colonel Haiku, quoting Mao

    At least we can all agree on one thing, then.

    Comment by Leviticus (d7fc0e) — 12/16/2013 @ 6:11 am

  58. Comment by joe (93323e) — 12/15/2013 @ 5:48 pm

    Abe Lincoln became a democrat

    Not Abraham Lincoln. Thomas Jefferson. It’s true Thomas Jefferson was allied with Aaron Burr, who made 10-year old Tammany Hall into a political organization in 1799, but they had a falling out.

    It’s si also true that everything from 1824 on could be said to eb a splinter of Jefferson’s “Republican” Party. The republican Party i 1854 took its name from the original name of Jefferson’s party.

    Comment by Sammy Finkelman (9fe80b) — 12/16/2013 @ 6:23 am

  59. Northeastern Illinois University has a bronze plaque from around 1905 that says “Abraham Lincoln Democrat”, as the dedication of a building on its campus, Sammy. That’s the stealth rewriting.

    Comment by nk (dbc370) — 12/16/2013 @ 6:28 am

  60. “‘Every Communist must grasp the truth, ‘Political power grows out of the barrel of a gun.’”

    - Colonel Haiku, quoting Mao

    At least we can all agree on one thing, then.

    Comment by Leviticus (d7fc0e) — 12/16/2013 @ 6:11 am

    Only on how the left thinks. “The ends justify the means.”

    Comment by Tanny O'Haley (c0a74e) — 12/16/2013 @ 6:42 am

  61. 59. Comment by nk (dbc370) — 12/16/2013 @ 6:28 am

    Northeastern Illinois University has a bronze plaque from around 1905 that says “Abraham Lincoln Democrat”, as the dedication of a building on its campus, Sammy.

    Did anyone ever attempt to explain that plaque?

    http://www.thecollegefix.com/post/15283/

    http://urbanlegends.about.com/od/government/ss/University-Building-Dedicated-to-Abraham-Lincoln-Democrat.htm

    The plaque was there when the building, originally known as the Abraham Lincoln Center, was dedicated in 1905. Northeastern Illinois University didn’t purchase it until 1969.

    Jenkin Lloyd Jones

    The Abraham Lincoln Center was the brainchild of Unitarian minister Jenkin Lloyd Jones, who envisioned it as part church, part community center (Jones used the then-current term “settlement house”), offering both religious and social services to local residents….

    Statement released by Northeastern Illinois University, Nov. 4, 2013:

    ….According to building archives, the word democrat was used because Lincoln was an advocate for democracy—the political or social equality of all people. The word was not chosen to reflect a political affiliation…..According to documents by Frank Lloyd Wright’s son, John Lloyd Wright, the building was named for his father’s hero.

    http://www.franklloydwrightinfo.com/shaking.html

    The great “why” of Wright’s life, the why of his life’s struggle to create a “Democratic American Architecture,” is “Why become an architect?”

    http://www.savewright.org/index.php?page=3

    His mission was to create a truly American architecture, one appropriate for free citizens that would reflect the democratic values of this great country in which he so firmly believed. In creating what he called an “architecture for democracy,” he redefined our concept of space as he sought to make the common man uncommon by offering everyone the opportunity to live and grow in nourishing environments, connected physically and spiritually to the natural world.

    Maybe it was a reference to architecture?

    Comment by Sammy Finkelman (9fe80b) — 12/16/2013 @ 6:50 am

  62. Let the Democrats have Lincoln, he fits right in with other Democrat war-mongers like Woodrow Wilson who campaigned on the slogan He kept us out of War, and then once safely re-elected sent 4,355,000 Americans to fight in The War to End All Wars. (116,516 boys never came home, with 323,018 dead or wounded)

    Or FDR, who campaigned for a 3rd term presenting himself as firmly against war and promising No US involvement in foreign wars! Pre-election Gallup Polls found up to 88% opposed to the war in Europe. Consequently, FDR’s stump speech usually repeated his confirmation, I have said this before, but I shall say it again and again: Your boys are not going to be sent into any foreign wars. (405,399 never came home, with 1,076,245 dead or wounded)

    Then there’s LBJ who reversed Kennedy’s decision to recall all American troops from South East Asia (SEA) by the end of 1965 with the first 1000 troops to be home for Christmas of ’63. But, his murder in Dallas Texas changed all that. LBJ escalated the Vietnam war only one day after JFK’s funeral, prior to that fateful day US policy in SEA was withdrawal, after JFK was buried US policy suddenly became total commitment. (58,209 boys never came home, with 211,454 dead or wounded)

    So, let the Democrats claim Lincoln, his 750,000 estimated dead qualifies him for membership in Democrat ranks. They can have the Illinois rail splitter, and good riddance. the GOP will gladly take the author of the Declaration of Independence in fair exchange.

    Comment by ropelight (4cda2c) — 12/16/2013 @ 9:05 am

  63. “‘Every Communist must grasp the truth, ‘Political power grows out of the barrel of a gun.’”

    - Colonel Haiku, quoting Mao

    At least we can all agree on one thing, then.

    it certainly explains why the government is once again interested in disarming the general population.

    Comment by redc1c4 (abd49e) — 12/16/2013 @ 10:17 am

  64. Maybe it was a reference to architecture?

    Comment by Sammy Finkelman (9fe80b) — 12/16/2013 @ 6:50 am

    Nah! Frank Lloyd Wright was from Oak Park and he hated Republicans because Ulysses S. Grant used to pants him every time he saw him.

    Yes, I made this up. But it’s as good a contortion as any.

    Comment by nk (dbc370) — 12/16/2013 @ 10:46 am

  65. Sammy, its astonishing at times how much history you know but still remain ignorant.

    FDR was the vice presidential candidate on the most racist Democratic presidential campaign in history and yet you believe that bizarre rationalization about him?

    Comment by SPQR (9c5bd8) — 12/16/2013 @ 1:18 pm

  66. Back to topic, why was this school shooting so relatively low in deaths and injuries?

    Because in contrast to Columbine, an on-campus armed officer responded quickly and turned it into a gun fight. School shooters want defenseless victims, not a gun fight. As soon as the loon realized he was in a gun fight, he shot himself. Just like when Jeanne Assam engaged the shooter at the New Life Church in Colorado Springs.

    Comment by SPQR (9c5bd8) — 12/16/2013 @ 1:20 pm

  67. Facepalm with a Ctluthu;

    http://hotair.com/headlines/archives/2013/12/16/the-fall-of-the-house-of-tsarnaev/

    Comment by narciso (3fec35) — 12/16/2013 @ 1:41 pm

  68. And if you were wondering;

    “So, why are we so mistrustful of our fellow Americans? Why, for example, do record numbers of our people–whatever their politics–believe they need to keep firearms in their homes, even though crime continues to decline nationally to nearly historic lows?”–Tim Rutten, Daily Breeze (Torrance, Calif.), Dec. 13

    Comment by narciso (3fec35) — 12/16/2013 @ 1:50 pm

  69. Why was a peaceful socialist running around with a gun ?
    Don’t those types usually just arm themselves with poems, bouquets of flowers, and gingerbread cookies ?

    Comment by Elephant Stone (6a6f37) — 12/16/2013 @ 2:03 pm

  70. 63.Comment by SPQR (9c5bd8) — 12/16/2013 @ 1:18 pm

    FDR was the vice presidential candidate on the most racist Democratic presidential campaign in history and yet you believe that bizarre rationalization about him?

    That the 1920 Democratic campaign was racist is not something I heard…oh, I see – the rumor that Harding was part black.

    Here is something about Theodor Roosevelt, in the middle of which the writer compares him favorably in contrast to FDR:

    http://www.jewishworldreview.com/1213/Teddy_Roosevelt_Menorahs.php3

    Comment by Sammy Finkelman (9fe80b) — 12/16/2013 @ 3:23 pm

  71. 66. Comment by SPQR (9c5bd8) — 12/16/2013 @ 1:20 pm

    As soon as the loon realized he was in a gun fight, he shot himself.

    He didn’t wait around for a gunfight to begin, but killed himself in advance.

    I’ve read a few things. He went in (the building?) shouting “Where’s Murphy!” He shot at Murphy and missed or maybe not. He shot at the girl froma distance or maybe point blank.

    They thought two girls were wounded, but one of them only had blood on her from the other girl. I don’t know if news has been released of the wounded girl’s condition, which may be extremely bad.

    Comment by Sammy Finkelman (9fe80b) — 12/16/2013 @ 3:26 pm

  72. FDR was the vice presidential candidate on the most racist Democratic presidential campaign in history and yet you believe that bizarre rationalization about him?

    The war against Japan involved overtly racist propaganda, not to mention the concentration relocation camps. One of the tuer defenses for the relocation policy was that the government was going to drum up virulent anti-Japanese sentiment and the camps were for their own protection.

    Comment by Kevin M (536c5d) — 12/16/2013 @ 4:14 pm

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