Weinergate: Someone Smarter Than Me: Explain Why This Is Not Possible
The person claiming to be “Jennifer George” who called Lee was a hoaxer.
There really was a person who threatened the real Jennifer George, and that person pretended to be Lee Stranahan.
That person hates Lee, and Breitbart.
I have been very busy and probably don’t know all the reasons why this couldn’t possibly be the case. So tell me.
UPDATE: Point #1 could be wrong, and the theory still holds.
UPDATE x2: I’m feeling better about the theory with each passing second.
Hi, Neal!
Maybe Neal Rauhauser could come explain to me why this could not be possible.
Patterico (135ea8) — 6/30/2011 @ 8:51 pmIt seems like you are poking a very vile cretin.
JD (318f81) — 6/30/2011 @ 9:00 pmVile cretins sometimes poke others and assume they will not be poked back.
Patterico (135ea8) — 6/30/2011 @ 9:01 pm“Vile cretins sometimes poke others and assume they will not be poked back.”
Patterico – I seem to recall several examples of such behavior here.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 6/30/2011 @ 9:04 pmNeal does have all kinds of charts at his disposal.
goatsred (b20383) — 6/30/2011 @ 9:04 pmSo what about this theory?
Patterico (135ea8) — 6/30/2011 @ 9:04 pmHe is a pox on Champaign Urbana. And just generally a pox. A festering rectal fistula on the cornhole of humanity.
JD (318f81) — 6/30/2011 @ 9:07 pmVery nice profile of vile cretin
http://theothermccain.com/2010/10/09/twittergate-update-neal-rauhauser-switches-account-to-protected-status/
goatsred (b20383) — 6/30/2011 @ 9:07 pmCould hear a pin drop.
bmertz (d77c52) — 6/30/2011 @ 9:08 pmNo one could find the real JG to threaten her.
Molon Labe (cd5a15) — 6/30/2011 @ 9:11 pmIs it just me, or does Neal look like Q in Star Trek the Next Generation?
bmertz (d77c52) — 6/30/2011 @ 9:13 pmIs there a specific reason to suspect Rauhauser? Don’t get me wrong, I wouldn’t put this past him and his colleagues in the “Beandog” troll posse, but I’m just asking if there is any specific reason to suspect him.
Robert Stacy McCain (04f24a) — 6/30/2011 @ 9:14 pmInteresting post, Patterico, But…
What does this mean:
Was a hoaxer means that that the person calling Lee was not Jennifer George? How do you know this? Do you know who this person is?
Regarding the “real Jennifer George” you refer to here; Is this the jenny George in Boston? Is this the Jenny George that set up the starchild111 account?
Oh yeah, do you know this as a fact? How?
lamchopsl (a91fe8) — 6/30/2011 @ 9:16 pm“No one could find the real JG to threaten her.”
Molon Labe – Correction – Nobody has admitted to finding the real JG to threaten her. A big difference that you and Lee cannot seem to grasp.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 6/30/2011 @ 9:16 pmIsn’t Neal the one that proved that Weiner was hacked by goatsred?
JD (318f81) — 6/30/2011 @ 9:17 pm12. He’s been very interested in Weinergate, Stacy.
Plus note his email to the California JG:
http://www.jennifergeorge.com/weiner.html
(scroll down … )
Why’s he so interested in what is a dead story, according to him?
Miranda (4104db) — 6/30/2011 @ 9:19 pmWho said they suspect Rauhauser? I just thought he might want to explain this all to me.
Patterico (135ea8) — 6/30/2011 @ 9:21 pmIf I were a betting woman I’d bet that someone who knows something (like maybe a known expert on Weinergate) is ratting out Neal.
elissa (f08e75) — 6/30/2011 @ 9:22 pmElissa – he is a Weiner expert.
JD (318f81) — 6/30/2011 @ 9:25 pmEveryone is getting threatened these days. What’s the world coming to? :(((((
Ms. Alicia Pain (4f8afb) — 6/30/2011 @ 9:26 pm18. elissa
Like maybe Ron Brynaert?
Ron has been accusing Neal Rathauser of threatening his family as of late.
lamchopsl (a91fe8) — 6/30/2011 @ 9:26 pmPreston called the CA JG a week before anybody else noticed the Jenay thing, right?
MayBee (081489) — 6/30/2011 @ 9:26 pmelissa
bmertz (d77c52) — 6/30/2011 @ 9:26 pmEspecially if that person had been receiving threats from Neal
Elissa,
Threats like these from Neal: Ron’s tweets
Ron claimed Neal was threatening his family.
bmertz (d77c52) — 6/30/2011 @ 9:28 pmI absolutley love the detective work you guys! In fact, I just got through watching an episode of Columbo with my wife. It was the episode with Richard Kiley, who plays the police chief who kills his wife after he covers for another neighbors murder. It was interesting in that most of the episode was filmed in downtown LA and Hancock Park, very little sound stage stuff. Coincidentally, it was directed by Ben Gazzara, one of Peter Falks(R.I.P.) best friends. What precisely are you trying to uncover with the emails?
The Tamandua (4de175) — 6/30/2011 @ 9:29 pmLots of threats going around in this non-story. I wish we could find out who threatened Ginger Lee.
MayBee (081489) — 6/30/2011 @ 9:29 pm15.Isn’t Neal the one that proved that Weiner was hacked by goatsred?
goatsred (b20383) — 6/30/2011 @ 9:30 pmJD and Mr.McCain—Yes, and he proved ,or ,put me on the “short list, of people who he knows,stalked Rep.Weiner.
Does Weiner still have people working on this story?
MayBee (081489) — 6/30/2011 @ 9:30 pmDoesn’t Neal have Ginger Lee on his list too?
bmertz (d77c52) — 6/30/2011 @ 9:32 pm28.Does Weiner still have people working on this story?
Comment by MayBee
No MayBee, his people are trying to figure out where the hell HUMA went to.Antonee cant buy gwoceries without her check.
goatsred (b20383) — 6/30/2011 @ 9:34 pmWonder who threatened Patterico and Ace?
Ms. Alicia Pain (4f8afb) — 6/30/2011 @ 9:35 pm@goatsred Who leaked all that stuff to the Smoking Gun about you? Patriot?
Ms. Alicia Pain (4f8afb) — 6/30/2011 @ 9:36 pmHey guys, gimme a little taste(a brief rundown) of all this “intrigue”. I am coming into this a little late, but I am genuinely enthralled. Sometimes I feel like a sly little elf, who should be sitting under his own private little toad stool. C’mon indulge me!
The Tamandua (4de175) — 6/30/2011 @ 9:39 pmI’m so confused I don’t know what I think.
It all stopped making sense after Weiner resigned. I can’t figure a coherent strategy for the sock puppets, even with three layers of mis-direction laid on top.
Since you propose a coherent theory for at least the answering machine death threats, I shall fall upon it with a glad cry and clutch it to my bosom.
Dianna (f12db5) — 6/30/2011 @ 9:40 pmAn excellent question, addressing my deep confusion.
Dianna (f12db5) — 6/30/2011 @ 9:43 pm29. bmertz, yes, Ginger Lee, Meagan Broussard Mike Stack & the real person behind Dan Wolfe – if you’re referring to NR’s email to JG.
What Neal did on Twitter yesterday was refer to Ron’s family – as if they’d been talking to him:
“Your judgment is impaired, Ron. Friends & family have said as much to you.” and
“Your family is well aware of your distress, Ron.”
I didn’t see any threats. Just sounded to me as if Simon Sinister was deliberately screwing with Ron. I was reading his tweets after seeing his email to JG on her site.
Now he’s been tweeting about Twitter etc – he’s not his usual obnoxious self. Interesting.
Miranda (4104db) — 6/30/2011 @ 9:43 pmMiranda Neal or Ron is tweeting ?
btw, if anyone is interested about the nickname for Neal aka Simon Sinister
bmertz (d77c52) — 6/30/2011 @ 9:49 pmThere is no need for that.
JD (318f81) — 6/30/2011 @ 9:52 pmMiranda
What do you make of this claim? Could Neal pull that off?
bmertz (d77c52) — 6/30/2011 @ 9:52 pmTamandua–see, it’s like this. Patterico has a lot of different sandboxes that people can choose to play in (or not play in) at his site. Not everybody is interested in every topic. You pulled this snarky crap on another thread yesterday, and trust me, you’re not as subtle or clever as you may think you are. You are welcome to avoid the “detective” threads you find so annoying. Nobody is forcing you to read about Weinergate if you find it all so terribly, terribly silly and amusing, you know. Or, is it an act to hide that you’re actually very interested in Weinergate?
elissa (f08e75) — 6/30/2011 @ 9:54 pm#38 – Nasty. That’s just sick and stupid and wrong.
Dianna (f12db5) — 6/30/2011 @ 9:54 pmBreitbart tweeted to Neal that he knew he was Dan Wolfe and that Neal should just go ahead and admit it.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 6/30/2011 @ 9:55 pmah ha
bmertz (d77c52) — 6/30/2011 @ 9:57 pm#41 – elissa – lovely smack down.
I’m reading as much as I can, and have decided that all I can do is plaintively ask if there’s a coherent story, yet. I wish I had any clues.
Dianna (f12db5) — 6/30/2011 @ 9:57 pmI think Neal is trying to make his presence known
bmertz (d77c52) — 6/30/2011 @ 9:57 pmWhoa! Really?!
Dianna (f12db5) — 6/30/2011 @ 9:58 pmHey, my friend, I am curious. I don’t enter this blog “bad-mouthing” people because they have an opinion different than my own. I try to practice charity, and though you may not approve of my somewhat off center posts, I like to think I am an interesting fellow, with something to share. I know you may not approve of me(for whatever reason) as you see everything as so dire, but trust me, lighten up just a little my friend, you may cultivate some friends down the road, (as difficult to fathom as it may seem, in your case).
The Tamandua (4de175) — 6/30/2011 @ 9:58 pm#38 – Nasty. That’s just sick and stupid and wrong.
It is a public record. It’s not sick, nor stupid, nor wrong.
Ms. Alicia Pain (4f8afb) — 6/30/2011 @ 9:59 pmRon must have outed Neal
bmertz (d77c52) — 6/30/2011 @ 9:59 pm37. bmertz, those were Neal’s tweets, about 2 pm or so yesterday.
http://twitter.com/#!/NealRauhauser
You can read twitter msg’s even if you don’t have a twitter account, bmertz. I don’t have one either. I think you had mentioned before that you didn’t have one.
Miranda (4104db) — 6/30/2011 @ 9:59 pmI think this is more germane question, is the Jen George in Boston who got the death threats, the Jenny George who set up the starchild111 account, used as Jenay for some time, and then changed the moniker to Nikki to punk A. Weiner’s twitter followers?
As far as I can remember the only evidence connecting the Boston Jen George to the Jenny George= Jenay=Nikki account is the Massachusetts accent Lee noted. I just checked Lee’s notes and there wasn’t anything else that tied the phone call to the Boston Jen George? It certainly is possible that the Call to Lee claiming to be Jenifer George was someone else trying to divert and discredit Lee. And to that end Lee’s caller may have also called the Boston Jen George and threatened her.
So I guess it is possible that the Boston Jen George is not associated with the starchild111 account, but for some reason was threatened by someone wanting to hurt Lee.
When Lee heard of the police report from the Boston Jen George, he appears to have jumped to the conclusion that she was the person who called him and was trying to derail his investigation by falsely accusing him.
lamchopsl (a91fe8) — 6/30/2011 @ 10:00 pmOh, you may not think that was not wrong, but you would be wrong.very wrong. Aggressively wrong.
JD (318f81) — 6/30/2011 @ 10:00 pmNo Elissa, the only people in this hemisphere that are as remotley enthralled with the “tragic and pathetic” mumbo-jumbo you call “Weinergate” are you and a few other cybernerds!
The Tamandua (4de175) — 6/30/2011 @ 10:01 pmTamandau – nobody is forcing you to read or comment, no?
JD (318f81) — 6/30/2011 @ 10:02 pm#48
It’s none of your business, you nasty little perv, nor anyone not needing to have the information for law enforcement or credit purposes, come to think of it!
Dianna (f12db5) — 6/30/2011 @ 10:03 pmMiranda
bmertz (d77c52) — 6/30/2011 @ 10:06 pmThank you. I think that is the link you gave me earlier. I did go to the link you gave me. Ron sounded so frantic that I copied all his tweets into one list, and posted them onto one of the threads here. He was also offering to give a tell-all DM to any major blogger that contacted him. It looks as though he contacted Patterico.
It’s none of your business, you nasty little perv, nor anyone not needing to have the information for law enforcement or credit purposes, come to think of it!
Comment by Dianna — 6/30/2011 @ 10:03 pm
It is my business, the guy is tweeting some pretty outrageous stuff, his criminal record is a public record. I did leave out the address.
Ms. Alicia Pain (4f8afb) — 6/30/2011 @ 10:07 pm#48 Many things will be public record soon.
Crispian (70c05e) — 6/30/2011 @ 10:07 pmI can and will comment, the fact that YOU don’t approve of me is irrelevant JD. Your friend Elissa took it upon herself to start taking swings, so she gets a “haymaker” back. Quid pro quo..
The Tamandua (4de175) — 6/30/2011 @ 10:07 pmyes, thanks for explaining (elissa too). I was missing most of the conversation happening off the blog. I appreciate the explanation.
bmertz (d77c52) — 6/30/2011 @ 10:08 pmAlicia- what is he tweeting that you find outrageous?
MayBee (081489) — 6/30/2011 @ 10:08 pm“Alicia” is yet another sick twist. Just like Rauhauser.
JD (318f81) — 6/30/2011 @ 10:09 pm#48 Many things will be public record soon.
Comment by Crispian — 6/30/2011 @ 10:07 pm
Your point being?
Ms. Alicia Pain (4f8afb) — 6/30/2011 @ 10:09 pmThanks for removing #38. Clearly posting stuff like that doesn’t help…but I suppose that’s the point.
Dana (4eca6e) — 6/30/2011 @ 10:10 pmDianna and bmertz – I think I got Breitbart’s reference mixed up in #46 above. He was referring to Ron:
AndrewBreibart Andrew Breibart
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 6/30/2011 @ 10:11 pm@
@NealRauhauser @ronbryn robyn, we already know ur dan wolfe, enough with the sock charade.
29 Jun
in reply to ↑
Neal Rauhauser
@NealRauhauser Neal Rauhauser
@AndrewBreibart Beauty! Do another!!!
Alicia = Neal
bmertz (d77c52) — 6/30/2011 @ 10:11 pmI neither approve or disapprove. Elissa nailed you, and now you are predictably lashing out at everyone else. If you don’t like the topic, go on to the next one.
JD (318f81) — 6/30/2011 @ 10:12 pmI deleted a comment that purported to post personal information for Ron Brynaert.
For some reason the whole thing reminded me of the way The Smoking Gun treated Mike Stack.
All public record to be sure.
Hi Neal!
Patterico (135ea8) — 6/30/2011 @ 10:15 pmdaleyrocks
AB is not sending it to Neal? It reads as though he is receiving it too. Or both?
bmertz (d77c52) — 6/30/2011 @ 10:16 pmThe Tamandua – Did you just follow your anteater nose to this blog? What brought you here?
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 6/30/2011 @ 10:16 pmJD, I have caught your pathetic, mealy-mouthed little act on this and other blogs, you are a blight and crap stirer from way back. The only reason you hack on Yelverton so much is because he has twice the education and smarts than you will ever have. Your pathetic jealousy of him is almost embarassing to witness.
The Tamandua (4de175) — 6/30/2011 @ 10:17 pmPat,
There’s nothing inherently impossible about your line, but it does seem a far less likely explanation. Why? Because it postulates unknown additional people, whereas Lee’s theory goes to one known person who had a motive to act as Lee suspects she did.
The most powerful piece of evidence on the table is Lee’s history of the starchild111 twitter account. That history demonstrate or strongly suggest:
(1) That the original creator of the account was the same person who later gave herself out as Nikki Reid
(2) That the creator changed the account’s appearance in an attempt to get to Weiner, including using the fake avatar.
(3) That the creator is older than Nikki gave herself out to be (due to early celebrity follows that are out of the era of a 16-year-old girl).
(4) That the conversations with Marianela only began after the account’s purpose had been shifted to Weiner-seeking and therefore are suspect.
That much is established.
Now, Jenny G. filed the police report as it became evident that Lee was closing in. So there is an actor and a motive.
Your line, other the other hand, while it does preserve the independence and integrity of John Reed, falls short by postulating additional actors with speculative motives.
Look Pat, if Lee’s right, this person is big time into misdirection. Wasn’t it convenient that the whole John Reid twitter war with the NYT came up when it did, just as Lee was announcing his grand unified sock puppet theory? What better to discredit the theory than a real live John Reid?
If there’s one puppeteer, all the motives and actions fit – Reid’s outburst, Alicia Pain, Jenny’s police report – they’re all increasingly desperate attempts to evade a closing net.
What have you got? No good explanation for the starchild111 history, and a bunch of hypothetical actors driven by highly speculative motives.
John Reid’s integrity is already suspect, why fight so hard to preserve it?
Nathan Wagner (01c83e) — 6/30/2011 @ 10:19 pmNeal was attempting to make a point and a threat of course.
bmertz (d77c52) — 6/30/2011 @ 10:19 pm“AB is not sending it to Neal? It reads as though he is receiving it too. Or both?”
bmertz – I found it in Neal’s twitter stream. Andrew addressed it to both Neal and Ron, Neal first. What I missed before was the second reference to Ron, or Robyn, as Breitbart misspells Ron’s handle.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 6/30/2011 @ 10:19 pmComment by The Tamandua — 6/30/2011 @ 10:17 pm
Geez, is anyone surprised? Very unoriginal, pedestrian and just as boring as ever.
Dana (4eca6e) — 6/30/2011 @ 10:19 pmGee Daley, I didn’t know it was your and JD’s personal blog.
The Tamandua (4de175) — 6/30/2011 @ 10:20 pmI’m assuming the twitter account with Andrew’s picture on it was real. Andrew may have just been kidding around with the message. Who knows.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 6/30/2011 @ 10:20 pmNonsense. And, though (fortunately!) your nasty little post is gone, the address was there.
Nasty little perv!
Dianna (f12db5) — 6/30/2011 @ 10:21 pmAnyone who likes Yelverton is an abject jackass. He has an education in the piccolo or some crap like that.
And JD is a very smart and funny guy, and it’s challenging to debate him if he is inclined to take you seriously. The reason lefties think he’s unserious is simply because he doesn’t take trolls very seriously.
Tam, were all your other comments just fabrications? Is that what all the stupid quotations marks and effusive compliments were about?
Because you weren’t satirical or witty there, if so.
Dustin (b7410e) — 6/30/2011 @ 10:21 pm“Gee Daley, I didn’t know it was your and JD’s personal blog.”
The Tamandua – I have made no such claims. For a Truman Democrat you have very thin skin. Are you short as well?
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 6/30/2011 @ 10:22 pmThis is the truth. I recall it as well. I don’t know what this Alicia is, or if it’s the same one or merely a diversion, or if it’s Neal or yet another diversion. All I know is that it’s desperate for attention and unable to work up a better way of getting any.
Dustin (b7410e) — 6/30/2011 @ 10:23 pmLook Daley, I likened myself to an elf. You tell me..
The Tamandua (4de175) — 6/30/2011 @ 10:23 pmI’m getting an idea where this is going… oh boy
bmertz (d77c52) — 6/30/2011 @ 10:25 pm#81 – Dustin – much calmer than my response. Sorry about getting a bit over-wrought. Bad day, and way too much drama.
Dianna (f12db5) — 6/30/2011 @ 10:26 pmPlease, tell me! I’m completely at sea.
Dianna (f12db5) — 6/30/2011 @ 10:27 pmI think Neal was trying to jerk our chain. How old is this guy?
bmertz (d77c52) — 6/30/2011 @ 10:27 pm17?
Nathan Wagner,
This theory need not *necessarily* relate to JohnReid9 in any way. That may have been a sting operation, or it may be a real person who is what he says. I offer no opinion, as is my habit.
But everything you said about the timing can be explained by hoaxers. Everything.
This theory does something I have seen no other do: explain the political motivation part. Because that part has confused me up until now.
Patterico (135ea8) — 6/30/2011 @ 10:28 pmI missed where I claimed this was my blog. But that comment at 10:17 was epic funny.
JD (318f81) — 6/30/2011 @ 10:29 pm“Look Daley, I likened myself to an elf. You tell me..”
The Tamandua – So you are Yelverton!
What brought you here?
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 6/30/2011 @ 10:30 pmI think you were fine. Whoever did that is a nasty person. Sorry you had a bad day. I’ve had a few lately, but today was great.
Sock#3 (b7410e) — 6/30/2011 @ 10:30 pmPatterico, how many hoaxers are we talking about?
To categorize, are we talking “internet fun” or “Holy Blood, Holy Grail”?
Granted, that’s one to ten, but I’m trying to set some mental boundaries.
Dianna (f12db5) — 6/30/2011 @ 10:30 pmDiana.. go read Ron’s tweets and his offer
bmertz (d77c52) — 6/30/2011 @ 10:31 pmCould be..
Dustin, your credibility is as vapid as JD’s when you resort to hacking on this guy Yelverton the way you do. I have yet to hear “him” say the outrageous and uncharitable things that you two hurl at him, and many others. Are you so incapable of having a spirited debate without attempting to humiliate this guy, and everyone else. Anyone who reads these posts, would think that you both are consumed with envy toward this man. It is totally disproportianate man!
The Tamandua (4de175) — 6/30/2011 @ 10:31 pmWho knows? Could be one. Three. Five.
Why do you ask?
Patterico (135ea8) — 6/30/2011 @ 10:34 pmTammy, I don’t know why in the blue hell you want to talk about that complete nutcase, Yelverton. No one on this planet cares about that loser. He trolls blogs a lot. I got him to slip up once and admit he was the troll.
But stop talking about how much you hate JD, me, Elissa. No one gives a crap about that. Come on. Is this the best thing you can think of to contribute?
Dustin (b7410e) — 6/30/2011 @ 10:34 pmOK, I’ll try to follow the link and make sense of it. He seems even more over-wrought than I am, though.
Dianna (f12db5) — 6/30/2011 @ 10:34 pmPatterico,
Quote:
Well,
1. Lee was not leaning that way based on the timing of the call he received from the person claiming to be Jenny and owning the Starchild111 account but claiming no knowlege of the Weiner story. I would have to look back at the timing but I thought Lee felt it was the correct person based on the timing of her call in relation to an email that he sent.
2. This one is still open since we don’t know yet if Jenny is still claiming it was Lee that make threats or one of his “followers”. The whole police report needs to be confirmed. Did Lee get a copy since it involves him?
3. Not clear that this matters since I have not seen the alleged threats against Jenny tied back to Breitbart. Well, unless we want to assume that Breitbart is a “follower” of Lee’s 🙂
Summary, follow the sockpuppet trial until we get some additional facts on Jenny and the police report.
Joe
Joe Smith (54c0c1) — 6/30/2011 @ 10:34 pmPatterico,
I get the sense that whoever is at the center of this is now circling the drain and will be apprehended soon. And then any rats in his ship will happily squeal rather than be charged as accessories. It would certainly behoove those people to step forward now rather than face that situation.
Crispian (70c05e) — 6/30/2011 @ 10:36 pmPure, hopeless confusion. If I can start to whittle the player down to a nice, coherent list (lacking at this point, possibly because I’m reading too many sources with slightly conflicting views of events), I may begin to feel I have some sort of handle on this tale.
Presently, it’s like a very bad post-modernist novel, complete with mis-spellings and random occurences one is supposed to regard as amusements.
Dianna (f12db5) — 6/30/2011 @ 10:38 pmRave on Dustin, the only people who would believe or subscribe to your juvenile diatribe is JD and a couple of other sycophants on this blog. Look in the mirror ..
The Tamandua (4de175) — 6/30/2011 @ 10:39 pmYou are clearly trying to threadjack.
Dustin (b7410e) — 6/30/2011 @ 10:41 pmWhy are you apparently so obsessed with me?
JD (318f81) — 6/30/2011 @ 10:41 pm____________________________________________
That person hates Lee, and Breitbart.
I’ve long suspected that the hoaxers or sock puppets were leftists who got into the Weinergate game in order to poke at, aggravate or mock Republicans/conservatives. Or perhaps the hoaxers got involved because they wanted to create a diversion or smokescreen for Weiner so that he’d come out of the scandal looking as good as possible.
The possibility they were of the right didn’t seem as likely to me, if only because they, unlike many liberals, probably perceived the basic misbehavior of Weiner as being so trashy — or already pathetic enough — that any piling on wouldn’t have been considered necessary. IOW, they wouldn’t have felt a need to create additional “gotcha!” moments.
Mark (411533) — 6/30/2011 @ 10:42 pm*snicker* nailed it!
bmertz (d77c52) — 6/30/2011 @ 10:43 pmSpoken like a true narcissist JD.
The Tamandua (4de175) — 6/30/2011 @ 10:45 pmBINGO
bmertz (d77c52) — 6/30/2011 @ 10:45 pmLike I said before, this moved beyond surreal when Rauhauser got involved. Add that to the ronbryn meltdown …
JD (318f81) — 6/30/2011 @ 10:45 pmThere has been a blizzard of asshattery recently.
JD (318f81) — 6/30/2011 @ 10:47 pmJD – The Anteater sounds similar to Christoph to me. He was on a couple of Lee’s recent podcasts stirring sh*t about Dustin and there is no love lost between you two. He sounded like a young, fast talking, weenie boy, not like his tough commenting persona. I LOL’d.
One of Christoph’s favorite tactics is to accuse you of what he was actually doing.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 6/30/2011 @ 10:48 pm@ 65 that Twitter account is AndrewBreibart (minus the T). It is someone trolling around not the real Andrew B.
Noodels (3681c4) — 6/30/2011 @ 10:49 pmHeh. I think I heard his voice on one of those.
I’ll check.
Patterico (135ea8) — 6/30/2011 @ 10:50 pmOK, I am going to bed in aid of my goal of being a good worker in the morning.
If anything really great breaks overnight, here’s hoping it shows up as a “breaking!” headline somewhere.
Thanks, Patterico, for putting up with my chatter.
Dianna (f12db5) — 6/30/2011 @ 10:50 pmDaley, you are either delusional or pathetically trying to save face for Dustin and JD. Which is it?
The Tamandua (4de175) — 6/30/2011 @ 10:51 pmDaley – it is sad that the likes of whoever it is simply must continue to hide behind multiple names, changing ID’s, etc … They are cowardly and pathetic.
JD (318f81) — 6/30/2011 @ 10:51 pmThe @andrewbreibart account was started on May 15. It is designed to fool people into thinking outrageous things were said by Andrew Breitbart.
Check out the followers and following.
Yuh-huh.
And the style? Getting normal people angry at someone on the right by pretending to be someone on the right, and doing something outrageous.
Now what was the theory of my post again?
Yuh-huh.
Hi Neal!
Patterico (135ea8) — 6/30/2011 @ 10:52 pmNoodels – Thanks. Missed that. I heard somebody was faking an account for him. I did not pick up the spelling error.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 6/30/2011 @ 10:52 pmYour politically motivated actor hates Lee and Breitbart. So he calls in a death threat to Jenny pretending to be Lee? That’s awfully late in the game to do that as a first action, and it explains very little of this whole saga, so you must suspect more of him – running the sock puppets as a sting. That puts us back to one actor with some misdirection by a hoaxer phoning Lee.
Okay, that’s better.
I’m still inclined doubt it, though, and here’s why. It’s provable Lee didn’t make that call. Trying to get at Lee that way is a boneheaded thing to do, because if you’re caught, you’re in trouble. But if you threaten yourself, the worst (practically speaking) is that you’re taken as a metal case. Less risk, greater payoff if the misdirection succeeds.
As long as we’re speculating here, I’ll run with another line, but in a separate comment.
Nathan Wagner (01c83e) — 6/30/2011 @ 10:53 pmJD,
I think the guy was really scared of Neal.
(Now speculating on the possible post-modern plot bunny) :
Ron was drawn into some sort of plot (probably the sockpuppets) and then ended up being discarded by Jen Preston. Ron blows up on twitter, threatens to talk ,and then Neal tells him to shut up or face the consequences. Ron goes to Patterico
bmertz (d77c52) — 6/30/2011 @ 10:54 pm“Daley, you are either delusional or pathetically trying to save face for Dustin and JD. Which is it?”
The Tamandua – Your style is familiar and your mask is slipping. What names have you commented under here before. You can tell us. Lighten up, we’re your “new” friends after all.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 6/30/2011 @ 10:55 pmYeah. True enough.
And I hope whoever did it DOES get in trouble. If they did.
I have to say I find your reasoning highly, highly unpersuasive, for reasons I can’t get into right now.
To me, this theory is highly satisfying on several levels.
Patterico (135ea8) — 6/30/2011 @ 10:58 pm“Daley, you are either delusional or pathetically trying to save face for Dustin and JD. Which is it?”
The Tamandua – The above is not a denial. Nice try.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 6/30/2011 @ 11:00 pmDaley – it’s attacks on Dana were way out of proportion, and show a complete lack of character and basic awareness on it’s behalf.
JD (318f81) — 6/30/2011 @ 11:01 pmSo here’s the other speculative line, developing the theory Lee’s hinted at.
Politicians attract acolytes. Some of them can be obsessive and dangerous. Suppose the woman behind starchild111 was so to Weiner long before Weinergate started. Suppose she was rebuffed. Unable to follow him in her own person, she goes for the avatars, hoping to meet him for an affair or to exact revenge.
Can we find out whether there were restraining orders against anyone following Weiner, or if security knew of any such person?
Nathan Wagner (01c83e) — 6/30/2011 @ 11:02 pmSo Patterico,
The new working assumption is that someone on the left was running a sockpuppet honey pot to catch Breitbart but it turned out the Rep Weiner really was engaging in risky internet behavior and got caught up in the honey trap?
So then the sockpuppets had to switch plans and run a cross to drag Lee into some accused / alleged threats against someone that he appeared unable to find?
I am truly lost on this holiday weekend. I was hoping for your latest data dump that might provide us some additional data on the who / what / when / where / why of the Reids… ;-(
Joe
Joe Smith (54c0c1) — 6/30/2011 @ 11:04 pmAll right, Pat. I’ll defer to your greater evidence.
Nathan Wagner (01c83e) — 6/30/2011 @ 11:04 pmThat one was on my top of the list ie The 800 pound lady that goes into a romance chat room
bmertz (d77c52) — 6/30/2011 @ 11:05 pmNathan, I think the identify of restraining order ‘victims’ is often confidential.
Dustin (b7410e) — 6/30/2011 @ 11:06 pmGleen Grenwald talked about himself in third person better than Yelverton the Whiner does in his thread-jacks here. Even John Hitchcock knows that.
John Hitchcock (9e8ad9) — 6/30/2011 @ 11:06 pmThis situation is too fascinating. I can’t leave
bmertz (d77c52) — 6/30/2011 @ 11:07 pmHitch – it is always amusing when it goes all gender-bender too.
JD (318f81) — 6/30/2011 @ 11:09 pmOkay, I have followed this from the beginning but had never heard of this Neal guy except I had read some of his tweets lately on Twitter.
After much internet sleuthing (see Google search)he sure seems to fit the MO of someone who would be involved in something like this (see paid internet troll).
Noodles (3681c4) — 6/30/2011 @ 11:11 pmWas Dustin right? Is it a piccolo? For some reason my recollection is that it was a flute of some sort.
elissa (f08e75) — 6/30/2011 @ 11:12 pm“Daley – it’s attacks on Dana were way out of proportion, and show a complete lack of character and basic awareness on it’s behalf.”
JD – Exactly. If anybody’s gonna attack our womynfolk it should be us. Not that they can’t defend themselves. Heh.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 6/30/2011 @ 11:12 pmWhere is Underdog when you need him?
bmertz (d77c52) — 6/30/2011 @ 11:14 pmI’m taking notes for Maybee and Sarah daley!
bmertz (d77c52) — 6/30/2011 @ 11:14 pmGoodnight, racists.
JD (318f81) — 6/30/2011 @ 11:15 pmI resemble that remark!
John Hitchcock (9e8ad9) — 6/30/2011 @ 11:17 pm#129, me too, bmertz!
It is ‘funny’ that because of the internet, a handful of crazed individuals can have such an effect. They would otherwise be so irrelevant. I suppose that is exactly the kind of person that desperately lashes out on the internet – the otherwise irrelevant.
Crispian (70c05e) — 6/30/2011 @ 11:19 pmWow. I feel kind of dumb for not knowing about “Twittergate”. I will have to read more on that tomorrow.
Noodles (3681c4) — 6/30/2011 @ 11:20 pmCrispian
bmertz (d77c52) — 6/30/2011 @ 11:23 pmThe nature of the net changes status, just as it changed elections, and fortunes. The net magnifies the power of the few.
Surreal
or is it more like a Séance? I’m waiting for the rapping on the table to begin.
bmertz (d77c52) — 6/30/2011 @ 11:26 pmWill Neal choose someone to start channeling to us?
bmertz (d77c52) — 6/30/2011 @ 11:27 pmPatterico
bmertz (d77c52) — 6/30/2011 @ 11:36 pmWas Wagner =Neal too?
Neal Rauhauser’s tweets are now protected, I suspect his blender to be the culprit.
Crispian (70c05e) — 6/30/2011 @ 11:38 pmThe haunted blender? oh the horror
bmertz (d77c52) — 6/30/2011 @ 11:40 pmwell, this has been fascinating. But i have a life tomorrow. Goodnight all.
bmertz (d77c52) — 6/30/2011 @ 11:41 pmPerhaps. I don’t want to libel his blender. Not after the way Weiner’s blender was accused. But Weiner’s blender appears to have been the only innocent party implicated in the whole affair.
Crispian (70c05e) — 6/30/2011 @ 11:43 pmNight, I’ll be in search of one as well.
Crispian (70c05e) — 6/30/2011 @ 11:43 pmCrispian,
The blender was never guilty. It was only accused of being the next likely failure.
Joe
Joe Smith (54c0c1) — 6/30/2011 @ 11:59 pm“Was Dustin right? Is it a piccolo?”
elissa – It’s definitely smaller than a normal skin flute. His inbreeding, doncha know.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/1/2011 @ 12:00 amJust a warning, we are about T-minus 18 hours before we hit then next weekend to have a Twitter Hack, Hoax or what not as we head into the July 4th weekend.
Place your bets early for your favorite Sockpuppets NOW.
Joe
Joe Smith (54c0c1) — 7/1/2011 @ 12:19 amI suspect the answer to your post is that it is eminently possible and there aren’t any good arguments, given what little I’ve seen of the details so far, to show the theory is not possible.
But statement one and statement two don’t necessarily require any coordination or relationship between the actions. They are incidents that may or may not be related (other than a similar name being involved) but assuming a relationship without more information may well be misleading. The alleged threats against “the real Jennifer George” could be based on little more than the information on Lee’s site and this site, possibly with the sole purpose of smearing Lee, Breitbart and Patterico. By allegedly naming Lee in such a threat, the smear would have wide-ranging effects.
Sue (24e46b) — 7/1/2011 @ 12:21 amplease note that the AB listed is misspelled and is a sock in those tweets. Notice no “t” in Brei”t”bart.
freedom_costs (51c21c) — 7/1/2011 @ 2:06 am109. JD
That is Ann Coulter’s definition of a Democrat.
lamchopsl (a91fe8) — 7/1/2011 @ 4:46 amThis theory is stupid.
The woman calling lee were lying, an innocent JG wouldn’t do that.
So assume that the caller was a hoaxer, why not lead Lee directly to JG in MA?
Why would an innocent JG in MA first accuse Lee for the threats and then change it to “Lee follower”.
Was the police report also filed by the hoaxer?
That’s a crime, and now the hoaxer has showed herself to the police.
And why tone it down just to “lee follower” if it was a hoaxer doing the filing?
This is like the first weiner defense “Breitbart hacked me”.
Breitbart was the one asking for a full investigation.
If there’s someone that really threatened JG , Lee is the person who’s the most interested to see who’s behind that.
If there’s a third person or group out there threatening people , every honest person want them caught.
Temper Tantrum (02fe1b) — 7/1/2011 @ 4:49 am32.@goatsred Who leaked all that stuff to the Smoking Gun about you? Patriot?
Comment by Ms. Alicia Pain — 6/30/2011 @ 9:36 pm
Things that were leaked lead to me to certain people.But that’s a thing of the past.
goatsred (b20383) — 7/1/2011 @ 4:52 amHaving just read through these comments, flame wars, misattributed quotes and conflicting recaps I’m more confused than ever. When did Ron Brynaert get involved in this?
My gut says:
NH = AP. Possibly more. NH seems to be the guy who pointed Smoking Gun at DW and Mike. It fits his MO.
This post-Weiner saga will be tied up by the end of next week IMO. Certain previously-involved-in-sock puppet-Twitter-scandal people aren’t as smart as they think they are. That’s their undoing. I’m calling it now.
coondawg68 (5fad4e) — 7/1/2011 @ 4:58 amsimple neal marry
ColonelHaiku (e761c8) — 7/1/2011 @ 5:20 amhis sister aunt pain and mom
marry his uncle
Drat
Blackburnsghost (2ffb0c) — 7/1/2011 @ 5:34 amDefinitely on the wrong schedule for this but it makes great coffee reading
Tarantella ? Tarantula?tabula rasa? They make pills for that.
A pain? Rock. On. Don’t forget to use the kiddie scissors
John Hitchcock @ 11:06 pm wins the thread, I think.
Chris Chittleborough (34e482) — 7/1/2011 @ 5:48 amLee on Stage Right w/ Larry O’Connor. Lee starts after minute 100
http://www.blogtalkradio.com/stage-right/2011/07/01/dick-fking-according-2-msnbc-hate-2night
koam @wittier (62b38e) — 7/1/2011 @ 6:21 am157 coondawg68
who is NH?
koam @wittier (62b38e) — 7/1/2011 @ 7:14 amhttp://oi54.tinypic.com/fdt3yg.jpg
Max Henry (9347d9) — 7/1/2011 @ 7:21 am97 Joe
1) The timing of the call Lee received was 15 to 20 mins after Lee had sent an email with his phone number to the other JG in CA saying “please call me about @starchild111.” He soon gets a call “Hi Lee, this is JG and I started @starchild111” He first took that to mean that JG in CA had received his email and called him, a logical conclusion at the moment. He said this on the radio. post hoc ergo propter hoc. He then went into detail about why this proved (90%) it was JG CA…. but that was all mistaken. He has clarified that it was not JG CA afterward a number of times. But you have to listen to his radio shows a number of times to figure out what he thought at one moment and how that changed over time.
Turns out to have been a coincidence.
koam @wittier (62b38e) — 7/1/2011 @ 7:29 amIf anyone can provide a soup-to-nuts time line or cast list for this melodrama? I’d appreciate it.
RCJParry (625550) — 7/1/2011 @ 7:31 am“The woman calling lee were lying, an innocent JG wouldn’t do that.”
Temper Tantrum – Why make those assumptions?
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/1/2011 @ 7:51 amcoondawg68 – You are thankfully unaware of our serial sockpuppeting visitor who has been a plague to this site.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/1/2011 @ 8:04 am166. Deception indicates…a deceiver.
SarahW (af7312) — 7/1/2011 @ 8:09 amWe can explain anything with “that one was a fake person” (without proving that assertion) and “here’s what s/he said: these things that were true (because they fit my theory) and these things that were obviously lies (because they don’t fit my theory)”
Thing is, truth and lies are things to be confirmed with evidence, testimony, contrary facts, conflicts, corroboration, etc., not merely with whether they fit the analyst’s current beliefs or not.
koam @wittier (62b38e) — 7/1/2011 @ 8:14 amkoam @wittier – Are you suggesting we should modify Lee’s proof by proclamation or it’s true because you can’t prove me wrong standards? Seriously?
That’s crazy talk!
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/1/2011 @ 8:18 amI know no one’s seen the BPD report filed by JG MA.
But in the conversations with the detective, or on the call from JG to Lee, is it evident that the 2 messages left on JG’s answering machine were from a male?
Lee, when detective calls you, do you discuss what JG’s story at her home was relative to the “answering machine” messages left for her?
koam @wittier (62b38e) — 7/1/2011 @ 8:19 amA few questions of my own:
Where is the police paper work, has there been any attempt to retrieve it.
There would be reports, plural – the original, attached to the follow up interviews.
At what stage of progess is the investigation into threats against P., threats against Ace, and Mike Stack (an perhaps others unknown to me).
Do these investigations provide any additional standing to affected persons to collect information about threats received by others?
*************
The report would have some description of the woman making the complaint.
I’m not sure how redacted the reports would be – but to a detective or attorney or prosecutor seeking relevant information that could pertain to similar threats they are investigating, perhaps the reports would be available in their entirety and the Detective (Thornton?) would be willing to discuss the particulars.
*****************
The UCLA professor who runs writing seminars has been used as a sort of reference by Lee’s Caller/report-maker He has spoken to him, and so has Jan Preston.
It seems logical to me that if the prof were kind enough to speak to Lee about his student JG, that he would be glad to help rule out a poser.
Has Lee attempted to re-contact the professor?
(I doubt)
Has anyone asked Jan Preston if the prof more clearly established his pupil and the Boston caller are one and the same person that the information Lee has given us?
She shouldn’t be trusted to be telling the truth on that point, ever, until there is more solid confirmation.
Even if she is innocent and lying without need of lying, she IS a liar. So, no trust.
SarahW (af7312) — 7/1/2011 @ 8:22 amTemper Tantrum – I believe Lee is Dan Wolfe. I have seen no direct evidence to contradict this fact therefore it is proven.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/1/2011 @ 8:22 amAlso, who has an answering machine anymore? Most people use voicemail.
Younger people usually don’t even have landlines.
SarahW (af7312) — 7/1/2011 @ 8:23 am170 daleyrocks.
I enjoy all that as part of the mix. It’s part of our challenge to discern facts & testimony from enthusiasm for theories. It’s all good. Gives us something to do. But you’re right, “it’s true because you can’t prove me wrong” is what we grapple with.
But when there’s a list of notes on a particular event, you have to take each item and either support or refute it with other actual evidence from stated sources. This analysis may also be flawed but at least you’ve done the work.
koam @wittier (62b38e) — 7/1/2011 @ 8:24 am“The report would have some description of the woman making the complaint.”
SarahW – If somebody is actually in touch with that woman, perhaps she could be persuaded to release a copy of the police report.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/1/2011 @ 8:25 am“Also, who has an answering machine anymore? Most people use voicemail.”
Guilty!
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/1/2011 @ 8:27 am165. If anyone can provide a soup-to-nuts time line or cast list for this melodrama? I’d appreciate it.
Maybe we can set up a wiki. One person starts, lists a few things and other people add or correct things.
Find old messages and posts.
Reading this over and over leads to new insights, and that should be done. It is important to go over and over all of this again and again. If you missed something after 100 times, you might gain an insight on the 101st time, especially if you now have new information.
While doing this, you might want to temporarily assume various things and see where this gets you.
Maybe you could get a Talmudic scholar or a Ph.D in history to take a shot at solving this.
One thing:
There have to be at least 3 hoaxers, for two separate reasons:
1> At one point, Nikki, Marianela, and John2487 (whi was renamed to Juan_Dodgers) held a twitter conversation about a baseball game. (This needs verification)
Q. What baseball game and who else was talking about that baseball game at the same time?? Does anyone have them?
As a start, my speculation would be that JANE AUSTEN (the person who originally established the starchild111 account, but turned it over to LILY sometime around the time OPERATION WEINER SCHNITZEL was conceived) keyboarded Marianela, LILY was Nikki, and I would guess that REMBRANDT (aka seattle545?) was John2487.
REMBRANDT was the “painter”, but not necessarily the uploader, and certainly not the original author, of the fake twitter messages between RAW (Weiner) and SNOOPY.
SNOOPY is the person now trying to find out the true identity of John Reid, whom she thinks is the RED BARON, but may really only be SOCKREID.
Earlier, before the scandal broke, SNOOPY was trying to uncover who really was starchild111 and in general, determine what was going on.
2> The second set of screencaps that seattle545 posted (on June 20) don’t make too much sense unless you assume at least three people were involved:
1) An original author – who wrote and emailed in or faxed the dialogue.
2) A screen painter, who got started the wrong way.
3) The screen painter’s boss, or his bosses’s boss, who got the screen painter to post them before they were ready and while they were in a completely wrong and mixed up order (which he did not know.
I can’t think that all this has been done by one person, and there is at least one female voice involved. Could one person have done both the JG threat, and Mrs. Patricia Reid? Did anyone speak to both of them?
Perhaps any males may be afraid their voice(s) might be recognized, especially if taped and widely circulated.
Sammy Finkelman (907727) — 7/1/2011 @ 8:30 am174 SarahW
(I get my voice messages transcribed by google voice into emails and text messages, so I hardly have to even listen to them, unless I need to clarify something that the transcription got wrong)
Yes I agree and we were discussing “who still has answering machines?” earlier. Someone who lives with mom & dad, maybe?
It could have been a paraphrase by JG or Lee. “Playing Telephone” as it were. If JG’s early 20s then maybe the term “answering machine” is more hardwired into Lee’s brain (device that came of age in his generation) and it’s just his default term for anything that records messages. But it could be either or neither.
Or maybe there’s an answering machine (or voicemail). If so, a record. We need that.
If she got 2 death threats and deleted them and then went to cops, well then she deserves not to be believed. But no one has told us if that’s what happened or not.
koam @wittier (62b38e) — 7/1/2011 @ 8:31 amkoam @wittier – There you go with that generation bashing stuff. I’m just too old to understand this stuff, I guess. Heh.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/1/2011 @ 8:38 amdaleyrocks, you’re just BS:ing right.
If someone really were threatening JG why would she call Lee first before she even called the police, and lie to him.
Temper Tantrum (02fe1b) — 7/1/2011 @ 8:39 amPoints to note – who has talked to people on phone?
Who else has talked to people on phone? (Pat?, Mike?…not to our knowledge. Ron? anyone?)
koam @wittier (62b38e) — 7/1/2011 @ 8:44 amMore:
koam @wittier (62b38e) — 7/1/2011 @ 8:47 am“daleyrocks, you’re just BS:ing right.”
Temper Tantrum – Using established Stranahan standards of proof, I believe Lee is Dan Wolfe. There is no direct compelling evidence proving otherwise. Prove me wrong.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/1/2011 @ 9:01 amKoam , didn’t Tommyx just talk to the “mother”?
Temper Tantrum (02fe1b) — 7/1/2011 @ 9:05 amLee, what is the timing of these events?
In short, how much info, if any, was out there on your radio show and online from you regarding the JG call you received before the real JG MA filed the report at BPD?
koam @wittier (62b38e) — 7/1/2011 @ 9:20 amWhich lies that Lee attributes to his JG MA caller are concretely lies, supported by facts?
So which are the JG MA lies that are proven by facts rather than assertions?
koam @wittier (62b38e) — 7/1/2011 @ 9:22 amI have an answering machine! It just seemed easier when we moved to deal with that than to figure out who to do what for whichever phone bundle we were going to purchase. I hardly get any calls on my landline that are worth any effort.
MayBee (081489) — 7/1/2011 @ 9:26 am185. Temper Tantrum
Tommy did describe talking to the mom, Patricia Reid. In supposedly clarifying follow up articles, Colby Hall, Tommy’s editor, says that Tommy had extensive email and telephone contacts with these sources (Patricia, Nikki, & Marianela).
I don’t believe that it clear from the phrasings in the Colby/Tommy “we were fooled, but that’s ok, we’re not stupid” articles whether Tommy feels like he talked to more than one female or not,
koam @wittier (62b38e) — 7/1/2011 @ 9:30 am181. temper
We need a more solid timeline of those events. The sequence in which we all learn of events isn’t necessarily the sequence of when they happened.
The Detective called Lee some days after the report was filed at the precinct.
koam @wittier (62b38e) — 7/1/2011 @ 9:35 amGaaah!
I spent some time yesterday trying to draw the scenario that if a professor of mine was called long distance by a policeman or by a journalist and was asked if he had ever had an elissa as a past student–the prof would say truthfully, “why, yes I did”. But in no way would the prof’s statement prove that the person standing in front of the policemen, or the person who had called the journalists claiming to be elissa was the same real elissa person the prof actually had taught in class.
Ergo, unless a picture identification of some sort was shared and compared between the policeman and the prof (or better yet with the school’s repository of student ID photos), then the prof’s statement is utterly meaningless. If such an ID comparison DID take place then that needs to be stated as fact–as evidence. Was it? I think this point is a question many people have but is a question that never quite seems to get answered. Knowing this would surely help in determining with more certainty what lies “JGMA” is/is not telling.
elissa (961c7a) — 7/1/2011 @ 9:44 amkoam, I think one reason Lee got this “single person sock puppet master” theory is because he only heard about one woman talking to Tommyx, the “mother”.
Temper Tantrum (02fe1b) — 7/1/2011 @ 9:48 amIf there were many women ( real ones on phone ) behind those twitter identities , it would falsify his theory.
It would also make it less plausible that it’s a conspiracy.
Koam…
Tommy only spoke to Patrica Reid by phone according to John Reid’s answer:
“There were phone calls with Tommy and my wife, there were emails with Tommy and Nikki andTommy and my wife, There were twitter DM’s with Tommy and Nikki. Other media tried to contactNikki but Tommy was a good hearted person, we trusted him.”
Which correlates to NYT fake ID story
az5thdstrct (e76e6a) — 7/1/2011 @ 9:50 amhttp://nyti.ms/iGUfHt
elissa- I agree
MayBee (081489) — 7/1/2011 @ 9:53 am“koam, I think one reason Lee got this “single person sock puppet master” theory is because he only heard about one woman talking to Tommyx, the “mother”.”
Temper Tantrum – Exactly why it would be helpful to diagram who has communicated with whom and via what medium, phone versus electronic. Saying the same person talked to Jen Preston adds nothing if we don’t have verified ID.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/1/2011 @ 9:53 amThrowing out an idea:
Sherlock (d77c52) — 7/1/2011 @ 9:55 amCould Neal be the Sockpuppet master?
What about the possibility that the different sockpuppets were members of the Bean Posse Trolls? J in MA could be a member. Records show that NR had women among his attack troll staff. He could still be the Sockpuppet Master playing personalities, but he had minions to draw from as well. At least to provide a female voice.
Temper Tantrum – Lee may get upset with people here questioning his conclusions, but I don’t think he has been writing here long enough to understand that among the regulars, and certainly I see it with some of the newcomers, there are people with experience and skills with which he is unfamiliar in investigating fraud and other activities or just logical ability that are not convinced he’s got everything pinned down.
It’s not a slam on Lee, it’s a function of experience. Lee has been incredibly doggedf and patient in pursuing this story.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/1/2011 @ 10:02 amdaleyrock, my feeling is that Tommyx and Jen aren’t very cooperative, or worse. They hoped for the VRWC to show up.
Temper Tantrum (02fe1b) — 7/1/2011 @ 10:04 amElissa, and Maybee it is a loose end and one that’s been driving me to distraction, not because I’m set on some theory that JGcaller is not JGstudent.
All I get in response to questions about it is “who would do that” and circular logic as proof.
SarahW (af7312) — 7/1/2011 @ 10:09 am#195
From what I can recall:
Eliminating JG-CA phone calls and regarding phone calls
– LG with MA accent spoke with Stranahan and preston
– Patricia Reid Spoke with Tommy
Personally, more revealing at this stage for me to keep track of those “involved” that have not spoken on the phone:
-Nikki
-John Reid
-Marianela
-Marianela’s parents (don’t recall ANY contact)
-Alicia Pain (obviously)
-Seattle545
-Patriot
May have missed some
az5thdstrct (e76e6a) — 7/1/2011 @ 10:17 amSarahW , the reason I think JG caller is JG student is because she was making evasive lies talking to Lee, because she got something to hide.
Temper Tantrum (02fe1b) — 7/1/2011 @ 10:19 amAgreed, Sarah. It’s an excellent thing to be distracted about.
“Who would do that?” always seems like such a logical way to think, except people do really nonsensical things all the time.
MayBee (081489) — 7/1/2011 @ 10:20 amOf Course, also Gennette has spoken on phone and “interviewed” in person
And of course the weiner sexting woman that have come forward have as well
az5thdstrct (e76e6a) — 7/1/2011 @ 10:21 amTemper Tantrum @198 – Agreed. Lee is also being overly defensive of JP and Tommy X IMHO.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/1/2011 @ 10:24 amMaybee and SarahW–thank you. Yes, we (and others too) have been bringing up this issue in various ways and on multiple threads for days now. Part of what has been so frustrating about it for me is that I still cannot tell if the question/concern/logic about ID verification is just not getting through–or whether it is purposely being ignored for some reason.
elissa (961c7a) — 7/1/2011 @ 10:24 amI know I keep harping on this, but for all the deviousness there really didn’t seem to have been much of a strategy.
MayBee (081489) — 7/1/2011 @ 10:24 amMaybee, but the person who called Lee had some very specific information.It would make the story even more complex.
Temper Tantrum (02fe1b) — 7/1/2011 @ 10:25 amElissa, the police who filed the report should have a verified identity.Dont know if that’s public information.
Temper Tantrum (02fe1b) — 7/1/2011 @ 10:27 am208. TT
koam @wittier (62b38e) — 7/1/2011 @ 11:02 ampresumably 1 of at least 2 police who met JG MA in person confirmed that she is who she says she is via license or address info, etc.
199 SarahW
see my 187. I’m not saying “who would do that?” I agree with you: we need to know what lies are proven in JG call. Lee labels half of conversation as lies. But we need harder evidence that some of them are actual, proven lies.
koam @wittier (62b38e) — 7/1/2011 @ 11:05 am“I know I keep harping on this, but for all the deviousness there really didn’t seem to have been much of a strategy.”
MayBee – That is the strategy.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/1/2011 @ 11:10 amOn Lee’s Blog talk Radio show last nite he said:
To me, the important information here, which I had not heard before, is that Preston called and talked to the Boston Jenny George. That discussion is where Lee got the contact info for the UCLA Professor. Many of the facts garnered by Jen Preston in her conversation with JG coincide with the information provided by the person claiming to be Jenny George that called Lee. Such that the accent Lee noted and her claim that she was originally from Massachusetts was consistent with the fact that Preston called a Jenny George in Boston; the spelling of the first name, Jenny; the connection to the UCLA screenwriting program.
To me, it is very likely that the person who called Lee claiming to be the Jenny George who set up the starchild111 account, is the same person that Jen Preston called in Boston- Maybe Lee can provide even more corroborating evidence. This makes Patterico’s first hypothetical- The person claiming to be “Jennifer George” who called Lee was a hoaxer- very unlikely. I think it is very reasonable to conclude at this point that the Boston Jenny George set up the starchild111 account and is Jenay=Nikki=JohnReid9 , among others (The Sockpuppet posse).
Lee also appeared last nite on Larry O’Connor Stage Right Show. O’Connor said, ” … that Content of death threats to Jenny George sounded almost identical to death threats to Patterico.” This I had not heard before. The threats to the Boston Jenny George were reported to Lee by her in her call to him, but not detailed, yet the threats to Patterico were made after JG’s call to Lee. There was no public knowledge of the details of both threats until JG filed her police complaint. If O’Connor is correct in his characterization that both threats sounded almost identical, that means the same person made both threats. At this point I believe that there is not enough evidence available to this forum to even suggest whetehr JG made the threats to herself and to Patterico, or someone else made the threats to both Patterico and JG- of course there seems to be other facts floating around that people have not yet disclosed.
If it were JG making threat to herself and Patterio, that would tie things up into a nice neat package. If it were someone else, that creates the problem, noted earlier by Nathan Wagner, of introducing an additional actor. It also creates a motive problem. That is, Patterico and the commenters on his forum seem to be moving towards unmasking the Boston Jenny George as the Sockpuppre Posse. That makes JG and Patterico antagonists. Why would someone be threatening them both?
lamchopsl (a91fe8) — 7/1/2011 @ 11:10 am“To me, it is very likely that the person who called Lee claiming to be the Jenny George who set up the starchild111 account, is the same person that Jen Preston called in Boston”
lamchopsl – I don’t believe anybody has been disputing this. Did not Lee encourage Boston Jenny to call Jen Preston? It proves nothing. Same person or hoaxer talked to both Lee and Jen. So what?
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/1/2011 @ 11:16 amI concur with daleyrocks.
So far about the JGMA person it sounds like we only have Stranahan’s say-so. I am absolutely not saying he is lying. But until that person’s identity is independently confirmed – not via phone without reference to a face by both sides – I don’t treat it as the unadulterated truth.
And we have Preston apparently saying the professor is fake? Have we confirmed that not to be the case? I don’t think Preston would need to make that up merely to get out of investigating.
Again, all due respect to Stranahan, but we need to get concrete verification. At the moment, the identity of JG does not conflict with Patterico’s theory.
Crispian (70c05e) — 7/1/2011 @ 11:34 amI haven’t followed comment threads closely enough to be sure no one has proposed this, but wouldn’t a simple explanation be that there are two separate sock-puppet masters, each with different agendas?
1. JG in Mass creates Starchild account to follow and try to get attention from various celebrities. She becomes interested in Weiner because she sees him on television, changes Starchild to Nikki account to try to get his attention just because he’s a minor celebrity and she likes him. She fishes for Genette, who, being more internet savvy, realizes Nikki is fake but goes along (normal way to try to get attention from someone on Twitter or FB is to try to work up ladder of friends). She’s not trying to get Genette to give away anything about sexting, because she doesn’t suspect it, but just wants attention from minor celebrity Weiner.
When scandal hits, she wants to help out “her” guy and realizes that a high-school girl who can testify to Weiner’s being a gentleman is useful. She invents the whole Reid family, etc., and is trying to support Weiner until she realizes she is in over her head.
2. Patriot is a sock for someone who is wants to trap the “right” into something stupid. He’s hoping to get Breitbart to bite on a manufactured story about Weiner that can then be turned into an embarrassment.
Why Weiner? Because people reading his tweets / following on FB realized he followed attractive young women. JG (as Nikki) wants to be one of them. The bornfree crew thinks he’s a sleaze. Patriot thinks that the right wing has gone overboard and sees an opportunity to set a trap for overzealous right wing.
This all gets so complicated because it turns out the Weiner actually _is_ sexting people.
(maybe Weiner’s tweet to Genette wasn’t because he mistook @ for D, but rather that he was chatting with 2 people at once and put the dick-pic in the wrong tweet. The tweet to Genette was intended to be public but include no pic–just letting everybody know he’s on TV, but in “modest” way. The dick-pic was intended to go into a different chat window to other sexting partner).
I’m sure there are flaw with this line of reasoning, but it does seem like a simpler story line than some being proposed.
Wondering (cf5138) — 7/1/2011 @ 11:35 amWell said, Crispian.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/1/2011 @ 11:36 am213. daleyrocks
It was my understanding that Jen Preston called and verified Jenny George’s identity separately. Keep in mind that the JG who called Lee claimed she lived in CA and the JG Preston spoke with was confirmed to be in Boston.
lamchopsl (a91fe8) — 7/1/2011 @ 11:38 amI think that’s possible, but doesn’t change how to proceed in confirming that theory. The most dangerous thing would be to assume veracity of facts that would limit how to proceed (eg assuming JG is exactly who she is claimed to be).
Crispian (70c05e) — 7/1/2011 @ 11:39 amdaleyrocks , if the police has verified an Id and address, it should be possible to unravel this.
Temper Tantrum (02fe1b) — 7/1/2011 @ 11:40 amIf JG MA is innocent , it should be possible to trace the threats.
Who sent the gym photos to the NE?
SusanT (355042) — 7/1/2011 @ 11:44 amlamchopsl,
I missed that part where Lee said Jen Preston tried to shut down the investigation, she was looking for the VRWC so she probably didn’t like what she heard.
If Preston verified JG MA:s ID, I understand how Lee can be so sure.
Temper Tantrum (02fe1b) — 7/1/2011 @ 11:46 am215. Wondering
Re: #2., if Patriot was trying to punk the right, why did he send the dicpic to Breitbart, destroying A. Weiner?
lamchopsl (a91fe8) — 7/1/2011 @ 11:46 amlamchopsl,
Might depend on Gennette’s honesty in this affair. Perhaps the “best laid plan” wasn’t realistically conceived.
Crispian (70c05e) — 7/1/2011 @ 11:50 am221. Temper Tantrum
Lee seems to be insinuating that Preston has ulterior motives. I think he said as much on O’Connor’s show. He’s suggesting that the NY Times and Preston don’t want to let the story get out if it shows that A. Weiner was done in by a liberal woman. Plus, preston and the NY Times have already declared the Weiner grinders to be part of the VRWC.
lamchopsl (a91fe8) — 7/1/2011 @ 11:52 amNumber 212:
On Lee’s Blog talk Radio show last nite he said:
‘NY Times reporter Jen Preston talked by phone with the Boston Jenny George and got the name of the screen writing professor from her. Preston called him and talked to him and his wife. At that point Preston tried to shut down the whole investigation, claiming the professor’s website was faked and he may have been related to the Sockpuppet posse….
Well, it is an obvious suspicion that the Profeessor could be a KAOS agent. Now Jennifer Preston is saying that.
Sammy Finkelman (d3daeb) — 7/1/2011 @ 11:57 amThe professor isn’t fake. She thought his writer-colony website might have been a phony.
Hoax websites have bindun so, the obvious questions is what might Jan Preston know that I don’t that tipped her to a hoax site.
The profs site is old though. Really old, at least ten years old, and in the wayback, and the contents have evolved very gradually and it is still essentially the same (with updates) as it has been in recent years.
In other words, the only way it is fake is if it has been hijacked, and there is no sign of that. The prof is still living. He can be contacted through UCLA for confirmation, too, (which I wish someone would do – though I won’t be doing it) and his phone numbers haven’t changed over the years
His website is an external source on his wiki page, and just a cursory check of Wikipedia updates show that same site was linked on the wiki at LEAST as far back as 2006 when an update to its formatting on the wiki page was done.
The who is conceals the owner of the site, and it was recently updated, but one is common and the other necessary to keep the domain name. And the site hasn’t changed in any significant way, not that I can detect.
So he’s real and his website it real.
Someone should talk to him in person, in the flesh, or through UCLA, just in case he’s in Europe and has mischievious house sitter taking his calls.
SarahW (af7312) — 7/1/2011 @ 11:57 amOutside of Lee’s jilted lover theory- and going back to the theory on Weiner’s future NYC democratic opponent . Some democratic group could be ridding themselves of their future opponent, OR someone in the Democratic party saw Weiner as a future MESS that would eventually explode and hurt their party. The info on Weiner was already out there, so there was going to be some sort of scandal. So why not do a controlled explosion before the NYC election for mayor?
bmertz (d77c52) — 7/1/2011 @ 11:58 am==It was my understanding that Jen Preston called and verified Jenny George’s identity separately==
Lamchops–Do you have any insight you can share with us as to exactly how and who Jen Preston called and “identified Jenny Goerge’s identity separately”? If so, please share it.
elissa (961c7a) — 7/1/2011 @ 12:03 pmlamchopsl,
Ulterior motives explains tommyx and Jen Prestons behavior. Why dont these “big J jornos” follow up on this story , it’s intriguing, but they just dropped it.
Temper Tantrum (02fe1b) — 7/1/2011 @ 12:05 pm@Sarah
When professors leave town for a sabbatical to go out of the country they will often do a house trade with another professor needing a temporary house. Sometimes they just switch houses from their different locations while they conduct research,
OR
They ask a graduate student to house-sit for them.
Trivia info if you are interested.
bmertz (d77c52) — 7/1/2011 @ 12:05 pmCrispian – Thanks. Remember, Boston Jenny called Lee on a blocked number and the big deal Lee and others have made about nobody being able to track her down. JP did not call Boston Jenny. It was the reverse at Lee’s suggestion if I am recalling correctly. If Boston Jenny kept her story straight between the two calls, it adds nothing to our body of information.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/1/2011 @ 12:05 pm201. TT, that doesn’t follow. Yes, JGcaller/threatreporter is a liar. It does not then follow that she is JGstudent, one does not suggest the other.
In fact, the lying and sock-tropes employed by JGcaller are what makes the claim of identity even more suspect.
A poser, who lies, and forged bios and even ID, would not have a lot more compunction about using someone else’s identity as a screen.
SarahW (af7312) — 7/1/2011 @ 12:07 pmIt was my understanding that Jen Preston called and verified Jenny George’s identity separately.
lamchopsl – Remember the PROOF nobody can find Boston Jenny? No sale.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/1/2011 @ 12:07 pm“Lee seems to be insinuating that Preston has ulterior motives.”
SHOCKA!!!!!!!!!!!!
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/1/2011 @ 12:11 pm“They ask a graduate student to house-sit for them.”
bmertz – Yup, you had to there. Hahahahahaha!!!!!!!!!!
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/1/2011 @ 12:13 pm228. elissa
None, other that the way Lee characterized the conversation between Preston and JG. But…
Lee had no way of knowing JG lived in Boston, in fact she told him she lived in CA.
lamchopsl (a91fe8) — 7/1/2011 @ 12:22 pm233. daleyrocks
It is my understanding that the Boston police department took a complaint and interviewed Jenny George, in Boston.
lamchopsl (a91fe8) — 7/1/2011 @ 12:26 pmlamchopsl,
Yes, that is all of our “understanding.” But our understanding is not proof.
We’re still waiting on verification of JG’s identity.
Crispian (70c05e) — 7/1/2011 @ 12:30 pm238. Crispian
This is Lee’s description of his interaction with the Boston Police detective:
http://leestranahan.com/jenny-george-files-police-report-accusing-me-of-making-threats-against-her
What exactly do you consider to be, “verification of JG’s identity”?
lamchopsl (a91fe8) — 7/1/2011 @ 12:36 pmWho else has talked to people on phone? (Pat?, Mike?…not to our knowledge. Ron? anyone?)
Nobody…Tried to get Patriot on the phone many times to no avail.
goatsred (c1f2f8) — 7/1/2011 @ 12:43 pmI mean, who she is, not just that she exists. We can assume that the police confirmed her identity. Sounds like a reasonable assumption. But beyond that we really don’t know. She is appparently not the JGCA with a background as described by JGMA on the phone to Lee. So who is she? Beyond a name on a police report?
Crispian (70c05e) — 7/1/2011 @ 12:46 pmdaleyrocks,
We dont know what type of information Preston got from JG to ID her. Lee’s challenge to find her was very early , there was a blog where her name was published , I dont remember what’s it called.
Temper Tantrum (02fe1b) — 7/1/2011 @ 12:48 pm240. goatsred
My hypothesis is that the reason Patricia Reid spoke with Tommyx on the phone is that the Sockpuppet Posse Master is a woman. She couldn’t represent herself as John Reid. If the person behind Dan Wolfe is a woman, then she cannot talk with anyone on the phone with out revealing her gender.
lamchopsl (a91fe8) — 7/1/2011 @ 12:51 pmI am sorry if it looks like I’m singling out specific individuals who I’m sure are commenting here in good faith just so I can try to make this point–again– but statements like:
“Lee characterized…”
“…it was my understanding that..”
“the police who filed the report should have a verified identity”
“presumably 1 of at least 2 police who met JG MA in person confirmed..”
just are not all that helpful in moving the story forward at this stage of the game when actual, irrefutable facts are what people are really looking for.
elissa (961c7a) — 7/1/2011 @ 12:57 pm232 SarahW. But I dont see the need for a ID thief to be evasive. Why lie you’re in CA if you’re a sock but give the real professor?
Temper Tantrum (02fe1b) — 7/1/2011 @ 1:02 pm244. elissa
I understand your frustration, but there are no irrefutable facts. period. Not in this universe. There are only degrees of certainty.
Maybe Lee made that Boston detective story up from whole cloth. Even if it was confirmed by someone else, maybe they are conspiring with Lee. It happened to Tommyx. Someone created the JohnReid9 account and the Mark Alecia account 30 minutes apart and 24 hours after the Weiner story broke. Within a few hours these two accounts were used to punk Tommy by seemingly confirming each other’s story.
lamchopsl (a91fe8) — 7/1/2011 @ 1:09 pmneal is from iowa. the fbi just raided the home of another iowan, suspected of being a lulzsec member. that person, laurelai bailey also goes by wesley baily and is a pre-surgical transgender. could neal know laurelai? laurelai is a male going female and may sound female on the phone. just a weird iowa coincidence perhaps.
nancydrew (448ba9) — 7/1/2011 @ 1:14 pmnancy drew–
interesting. link?
elissa (961c7a) — 7/1/2011 @ 1:17 pmLast Night’s Radio Stranahan
you can skip the first 20 mins to get to the Jen Preston discussion.
So the question is does Jen Preston really entertain the idea that Lew Hunter is a fake person with a fake website? Or has she crafted this excuse just for Lee in hopes that he’ll bite at the story? (To his credit, Lee laughs at the contention.) Does it say what she thinks of Lee? Is Jen Preston spinning false tales to the bloggers now (we’ve seen how she schmoozes her interview candidates) …or does she really buy into the conspiracy theories? (Not that there couldn’t be some conspiracy…but Lee is correct that Lew Hunter isn’t a fake person with a fake website, a fact that should be very obvious to the “NY Times reporter on Technology, Social Media in Politics, Government – and real life”) Did Lee get her drift or not get her drift…was she giving him codewords and hints for his safety?
koam @wittier (62b38e) — 7/1/2011 @ 1:24 pmWhy did she want him to back off so badly?
@daleyrocks
Right. They have been hit up to walk dogs and serve the bar too. lol
Or, help them set up their web pages
I caught part of a discussion about hijacking web pages /kidnapping?? theory. I didn’t read enough to understand the entire meaning, so I may have misunderstood. It triggered this thought ( you’ll have to forgive me, I have a tendency to toss ideas around ) :
In that sort of trading houses/house-sitting situation, not only would another professor or a grad student have access to the home, if they are hackers they could also gain access to the desktop computer left at the house. A number of older professors still use desktops and are not computer or web savvy. There is well-known dinosaur that still uses a typewriter and hand writes his notations.
Ok getting back to the point, if the UCLA professors were out of town, that would also allow their house-sitter to answer the phone to speak to a reporter.
bmertz (d77c52) — 7/1/2011 @ 1:26 pmhttp://gawker.com/5816291 Here’s just one link. I googled both neal and laurelai bailey and discovered the iowa links. they are both in the same business, both ruthless, both extreme leftist and seems like a “fixer” might be in sync ideologically as someone who is part of anonymous and the more militant lulzsec. they see themselves as fixers too. Iowa isn’t that big to have so much internet hacking talent on such an epic scale as these two.
nancydrew (448ba9) — 7/1/2011 @ 1:38 pmdaleyrocks
bmertz (d77c52) — 7/1/2011 @ 1:43 pm#250
That was in reference to SarahW’s comment that someone needed to verifiy if the UCLA couple were actually in town and at their home. It is summer.
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2011/06/02/981419/-Bringing-Breitbart-%28And-Thomas%29-To-Justice-%28Action-Alert!%29
Speaking of Neal- he does love him some hacker stories…
surreal (7a67da) — 7/1/2011 @ 1:44 pmafter reading the lee/jen convo, my suspicions of a link grow more credible. Neal is a very bad and dangerous man. he’s worked on many democrat campaigns and refers to himself as a fixer. maybe he’s part of anonymous too.
nancydrew (448ba9) — 7/1/2011 @ 1:46 pm249. koam @wittier
Great job with that transcript. I was way too lazy to do that. You are a better man than I- even if you happen to not be a man.
It’s possible Preston is dumb enough to think she could convince Lee that it was a “fake” website, but I consider it unlikely. I consider it much more likely that she was told to back of by her editor. And not for some vast death-hacker threat to the safety of the solar system, but because the editor and the Times do not want to spend any resources pursuing a story that will refute a previously made perfectly good smear against the Right, while at the same time show that A. Weiner was laid low by a liberal woman. I think the editor told her to back off, and like a good little minion, she backed off.
lamchopsl (a91fe8) — 7/1/2011 @ 1:47 pmread up on neal as much as you can. i think he’s the guy making all of the threats and has told jen to shut it down or else. he’s always referring to his connections. go read RonBryn’s twitter. Wow….
nancydrew (448ba9) — 7/1/2011 @ 1:48 pm@surreal#253 re: Neal’s Hitlerian Rant
LMAO Is he serious?
bmertz (d77c52) — 7/1/2011 @ 1:50 pmI mean..if hillary and bill are as close to weiner as has been described, don’t you think they are the best folks to know a well known democrat fixer like neal, to fix weiner’s problem? Maybe thats why weiner was reported to have called bill – to apologize to bill??? Hah! think not…it was to get a fixer hired. Wallah! the fake story to tommy xtopher, the fake story to jen and the NY times…Bill and Hill know a lot of fixers and lots of democrats are on record as having hired neal. Hmm? Perhaps? that would be pretty dangerous to unearth wouldn’t it?
nancydrew (448ba9) — 7/1/2011 @ 1:53 pm255 lamchopsl
GenderAnalyzer said that i’m 93% man, fwiw.
koam @wittier (62b38e) — 7/1/2011 @ 1:57 pmI encourage you to read the link to the daily kos above. that article was written by neal. he included language that anonymous uses to threaten. It is their code. neal said he was given this language to pass along. Then, look at the picture attached. It’s anonymiss, as in female. Is that laurelai bailey helping neal write that aricle?
nancydrew (448ba9) — 7/1/2011 @ 2:07 pmthat article makes it clear that at least neal was following weiners project to destroy justice thomas. were they working together? looks like neal was trying to create plausible spin, to FIX weiners problem. i hope lee does not back down on this. could be another big scandel worthy of a book. very spy novelish.
nancydrew (448ba9) — 7/1/2011 @ 2:09 pmCould that article at Kos be what JP@NYT is running scared from/by?
surreal (7a67da) — 7/1/2011 @ 2:15 pm251. nancydrew
LOL! best laugh I’ve had today. Although I hope for your sake that the intrepid Iowahawk does not get wind of your sentiments.
On a related topic, I noticed that Neal RAThauser (AKA Simon Sinister) made his twitter feed protected this morning. it was not so last nite.
http://twitter.com/#!/NealRauhauserhttp://twitter.com/#!/NealRauhauser
How delicious it would be if the FBI swooped in and arrested him for all these death threats. But alas, life never seems to turn out so perfectly.
lamchopsl (a91fe8) — 7/1/2011 @ 2:15 pmoh and then you get to the bottom and see that neal ratted by lying on the innocent goatsred. he gives himself away as a fellow traveller of anonymous. i think this is a very big deal. what else is neal up to? he’s close to weiner which puts him close to hillary, the secretary of state, and bill, a former, yet discredited president, who likely still can be blackmailed over post whitehouse behavior. just speculatin..not good. The real scandal on weinergate was the potential to compromise the secretary of state.
nancydrew (448ba9) — 7/1/2011 @ 2:18 pm257.LMAO Is he serious?
Comment by bmertz — 7/1/2011 @ 1:50 pm
Truthfully, I have no idea. But I think *he* takes it seriously, for whatever that’s worth.
There’s a thin line between dedication, and obsession, IFYWIM.
surreal (7a67da) — 7/1/2011 @ 2:20 pmI read iowahawk. He’s hysterically funny…I’m one myself. That’s why the iowa connection between the two caught my eye and I decided to see if some dots could be connected. I think those dots are now pretty well connected.
nancydrew (448ba9) — 7/1/2011 @ 2:20 pmHis level of hate raises the eyebrow:
DK:
Neal’s Rant on Punishing Breitbart’s Enablers
I read about what Sinister did to those poor guys on the article link someone posted today. How did he not end up in jail? No one did anything about it?
His hate/lust relationship with danaloesch is rather disturbing too. Stalker material in fact. Move over Voldermort, you have competition
bmertz (d77c52) — 7/1/2011 @ 2:26 pmHis level of hate raises the eyebrow:
DK:
Neal’s Rant on Punishing Breitbart’s Enablers
I read about what Sinister did to those poor guys on the article link someone posted today. How did he not end up in jail? No one did anything about it?
His hate/lust relationship with danaloesch is rather disturbing too. Stalker material in fact. Move over Voldermort, you have competition
bmertz (d77c52) — 7/1/2011 @ 2:26 pm“We dont know what type of information Preston got from JG to ID her. Lee’s challenge to find her was very early”
Temper Tantrum – By very early do you mean 6/24 or later, the date of the Nikki Revealed BTR show?
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/1/2011 @ 2:26 pmI don’t know how that double posted, My apologies. My server has been refusing to refresh and to post since yesterday.
bmertz (d77c52) — 7/1/2011 @ 2:33 pmI don’t really understand all the different theories you all have but I thought it important to add that my Twitter account was hacked back around 6/11. (which is why I closed my Clay_Arts account)Not only were people being randomly unfollowed, messages that I had deleted more than a year prior were showing up as originating in the wrong accounts. Someone else was controlling my account.
Stillconfused (786412) — 7/1/2011 @ 2:35 pmgoatsred – Serious question. I understand why you are PO’d at PatriotUSA, but in the time you guys were fooling around together as bornfree or whatever, did you ever have any indication that he was not a conservative or that he was a sock.
I ask, because I find most liberals cannot successfully impersonate a conservative for any length of time because they just don’t understand how we think. You see it with liberal trolls on blogs attempting to fool people. They invariably slip up because they are idiots or too indoctrinated with liberal Kool Aid about conservatives they put their feet in their mouths.
Did you see any hints of that with your interactions with Patriot to justify all the suspicion being cast his way?
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/1/2011 @ 2:35 pmI should clarify…. DM’s were showing up that had been deleted more than a year ago.
Stillconfused (786412) — 7/1/2011 @ 2:36 pmlive by the sword, die by the sword. Delicious karma on it’s way to neal. hoisted on his own petard. two clever by half? reading his own words in so many different forums you get the idea that he’s the smartest guy out there so you better watch out…and then he ends up leaving too many clues behind and he’s done. Not so smart afterall eh? Anyway, did they ever find the white house travel office manager that disappeared??? I always wondered what happened there.
nancydrew (448ba9) — 7/1/2011 @ 2:42 pmclay arts…i read about you in some twitter posts on ronbryn…different accounts and things. can you refresh my memory so I dont’ have to go read through them again? One of the things neal is really good at, it seems, is finding idle twitter accounts and taking them over. He talks about handing over control of various twitter accounts to someone else. It looks like his speciality is creating sock puppets and then working them like sockpuppet sim city. I wonder if one of the JG’s was just an innocent person with an idle twitter account that got hacked by neal or laurelai and they took it over for a while. maybe? Allegedly?
nancydrew (448ba9) — 7/1/2011 @ 2:51 pmI think i decided during my research today that patriot usa is likely neal. thus, goatsred got really had. I hope he pursues some legal remedies. I’m thinking you may have a case, goatsred. Ask Patterico.
nancydrew (448ba9) — 7/1/2011 @ 2:53 pm@nancydrew Do you want my whole story? Or just from the unfortunate day I read one of Ron’s tweets?
Stillconfused (786412) — 7/1/2011 @ 2:53 pmnancydrew, I will disagree about Patriot. I have talked to him, and I think he is exactly who he says he is. Just my opinion.
Stillconfused (786412) — 7/1/2011 @ 2:55 pm@251 nancydrew.
bmertz (d77c52) — 7/1/2011 @ 2:57 pmInteresting story about Laurelai Bailey and the revenge of her ex-hacker associates. I see what you meant about why JenP might be afraid of Sinister – re: the article’s description about that hacker group forging a document about LB’s involvement. End Game, she loss her job. Real life but another potential movie plot.
http://the-classic-liberal.com/democratic-consultant-neal-rauhauser-pedophilia-themed-tea-party/ An example of the charm of neal, who I am sure is a graduate of the Bill Obama school of Civility.
nancydrew (448ba9) — 7/1/2011 @ 3:06 pmNeal is trying to scare people that HE is ‘Anonymous’. He is trying to use their rep as his own personal army. Anonymous is not coordinated. It is any one who says they are. Maybe JP is scared of all that but no one investigating this should be.
Yes, he might have some trolls helping him etc. but he the funny thing he isn’t even anonymous in the regular sense of the word never mind the group.
Noodles (3681c4) — 7/1/2011 @ 3:06 pmPeople have accused me over and over of being this person or that person but the last straw was being accused of being the person who sent death threats. I guess if I had jumped on the “hate Dan” bandwagon, no one would have said a word to me. As it is, I am guilty just because I believe what Dan has said. I am a friend to someone who desperately needed one. That’s it. This should have been investigated by law enforcement from the beginning and we really don’t know that it isn’t. I hope so because the things being written as fact are hurting innocent people.
Stillconfused (786412) — 7/1/2011 @ 3:08 pmhow do you know?
nancydrew (448ba9) — 7/1/2011 @ 3:09 pmSorry for that poorly written post! =/
Anyway, my main point it Neal is a troll. It would make sense why all this hasn’t ended yet (if he is involved) and why the socks didn’t just disappear into the night. Trolls live for this sort of drama (never mind if there is money involved).
Noodles (3681c4) — 7/1/2011 @ 3:10 pmI keep reaching this point, and realizing that we do not know that the woman who called Lee and the woman who filed the report were the same woman.
The timing appears to be very close.
However, if the woman who called Lee was related to the person who called in the threats, then she would know about the threats, and could muddy the waters, thoroughly, with that phone call.
I am not saying this is what happened. I am saying that if the scenario is played this way, then the woman who filed a police report is not a liar, or even involved in this increasingly murky matter.
Dianna (f12db5) — 7/1/2011 @ 3:13 pmNoodles
bmertz (d77c52) — 7/1/2011 @ 3:17 pmCertainly, commenters are too small of fish to worry about it. We aren’t a big threat. But Jen Preston would become one if she went after the story. Lee has made himself into a threat as well. Captain Obvious says: hence he got the phony phone call. You would not think that he would be dumb enough to threaten Patterico and Ace, but apparently his ego is bigger than common sense.
Why does The New York Times want bloggers to stop looking into the Weiner case?
koam @wittier (62b38e) — 7/1/2011 @ 3:19 pm266. nancydrew
Neal does fancy himself a computer-network expert, and if he really believes that nonsense he writes, it is so far left he borders on anarchism- which is where those cyber-warfare groups habituate. BTW, I think he does believe it because of the obsessive compulsive nature of his style. Neal, in his mid 40’s, is a bit older than Laurelai Bailey, who is 29, and they hark from Davenport and Graettinger which aren’t that proximal, though I suspect Neal left Iowa for Chicago many moons ago.
If Neal is connected to these hacker groups, his political connection may save his hide- I remember Andrew Sullivan having his marijuana possession case dropped by prosecutes over the objection of the presiding judge- but if he is behind the death threats the weight of evidence collected at the lower levels of the FBI may be so great that political intervention is too risky and he may be cut lose by the political powers in the justice Department.
lamchopsl (a91fe8) — 7/1/2011 @ 3:19 pm280. Comment by nancydrew — 7/1/2011 @ 3:06 pm
Just watching this vid, and something popped out at me- at 5:09 into the vid, one of the tweets says “@GregWHoward my clients, only 10% of which you see are delighted 😉 ”
Didn’t the threatening letter to Patterico include the term “clients”?
I’m reaching, I know, I know…
surreal (7a67da) — 7/1/2011 @ 3:22 pmStillconfused..
Clarify please: I will disagree about Patriot. I have talked to him,
On the phone, twitter?
az5thdstrct (e76e6a) — 7/1/2011 @ 3:23 pmSpot on! (Ahem! Sorry for the Britishism – it just fits.)
Part of why it’s so confusing is that none of this seems to be aimed in one direction!
Dianna (f12db5) — 7/1/2011 @ 3:24 pm@az5, Twitter but I don’t ask him any questions. I am just there to be his friend.
Stillconfused (786412) — 7/1/2011 @ 3:25 pmI lol @ his association with ‘hacker groups’. The public buys into this fear and nonsense. He is a troll. That is all. Maybe a good one. Maybe a paid one. But just a troll.
I could make a YT video calling Neal out as Anonymous if I wanted to. I could start trolling him if I wanted to. Anonymous would then be trolling Anonymous (or someone who paints an association with them) . My point is guys like him use the rep of some members of Anonymous to scare people from even getting involved.
Noodles (3681c4) — 7/1/2011 @ 3:27 pmStillconfused
You changed your twitter accnt at least 3 times correct? from clay_arts to _clayarts to current? Or not correct?
az5thdstrct (e76e6a) — 7/1/2011 @ 3:27 pmTake that back, I did ask him why in the hell he was talking to Ronbyrn. I tell you one thing, I wasn’t find of journalists before this, but I will never trust another one after this. They will sell their souls for a story.
Stillconfused (786412) — 7/1/2011 @ 3:28 pmlamchops!
I noticed he put CNN on the hit list of enemies of the people for the crime of hiring DanaL. Sinister does strike me as someone with the POV “I am a god”, generalized contempt, and so on.. I’m not claiming the training to determine what precisely is the nature of his problem. But, I think there is a serious one. His focus on DanaL is nothing short of creepy.
His personality flags remind me of two of our sockpuppets.
bmertz (d77c52) — 7/1/2011 @ 3:29 pmAz, see my above post. Yes, I changed again because my account was doing the same thing it was before. Not immediately, but it did. After I realized someone was trying to find out my name, this whole thing changed to me. I have done nothing wrong and I have especially done nothing to warrant anyone trying to find me. I have had a stalker once. I do not want another one. Before all this, I didn’t hide my name. Now, I don’t trust that some insane person won’t knock on my door. People took my protecting my safety as my being guilty. I will say, I have never experienced such blind-hatred. This has changed me.
Stillconfused (786412) — 7/1/2011 @ 3:34 pmStillconfused
Just asking to understand if the current is really original clay_arts and why change accnt the 2nd time.
az5thdstrct (e76e6a) — 7/1/2011 @ 3:36 pmOn the phone at the Nordstrom cafe andhubs wants his phone back…… Pardon twit speak if I lapse into it.
Thanks loam for giving us context of jan prestons convo with lee. Makes a heck of a lot more sense now.
Prestons caution to Lee is just that, a caution and not a dismissal. Anon style punks can go deep and she is trying to check things out. She is not declaring the website fake but allowing it might be until confirmed otherwise. I made a similar cautionary plea around the same time , and had a devil of a time making it clear this was not a preferred alternative theory, but one that needed proper consideration when evaluating personas , claims, methods and motives.
Follow up and nailing down loose end will push the case in The right direction whatever the reality is
Sarahw (d233ce) — 7/1/2011 @ 3:40 pmAZ. I would like to change my name back to _ClayArts but I don’t dare because I know how you will all react.
Stillconfused (786412) — 7/1/2011 @ 3:40 pmI have seen the worst in people.
Do you mean people here confused? Or on twitter ?
I'm Getting a Headache (d77c52) — 7/1/2011 @ 3:53 pm
koam @wittier (62b38e) — 7/1/2011 @ 4:01 pmtestingHeadache, I don’t comment here enough to feel a lot of hatred but there are people who comment here who state suspicions as fact. People will take your words and use them against you not matter how innocent you are. I learned the hard way that if someone wishes you to be guilty, they will find a way. I see Ronbryn compare Dan to Jared Loughner, tell him how horrible I thought that was, he pretended to be my friend then the next thing I know, he is accusing me of horrible things that shocked me. I got involved to be a friend to Dan. I will follow that through as long as he needs me to but after that, I will leave politics in my past.
Stillconfused (786412) — 7/1/2011 @ 4:08 pmThinking out loud:
Assume JG MA is a real person who created @starchild111 in 2009 or 2010.
She used it as a fan of celebs because she heard that you can directly get response message by celebs on Twitter. (& you can…people used to write fan mail and hope for a reply, same thing.)
She didn’t keep using it because none of her friends used it and she didn’t get much satisfaction from celebrities she tracked, primarily the Kardashians and some Latinas, including J-Lo. Mostly about pretty actresses & models.
She was also a fan of the UCLA writers program. She either attended that program or knew of it because she’d taken one of the writing retreats with Lew Hunter, a UCLA prof, in the past.
To clarify, while it’s been reported as a lie that she went to UCLA, the Writers Program is an extension program. You can take courses online.
http://twitter.com/#!/writersprogram
http://www2.uclaextension.edu/writers/detail.php?sID=aboutwr
It’s not only for screenwriting, and Lew Hunter isn’t listed as one of the instructors. Lew is a professor emeritus at UCLA in screenwriting.
http://www.tft.ucla.edu/faculty/lew-hunter/
Also if she were studying at UCLA on campus, she could be home in Boston for the summer. Who knows?
So if she dropped her Twitter account, who’s to say that one of the bad guys (I won’t name names but you’ve been discussing them) couldn’t have just picked up her Twitter account after noticing that it was girly and evidently abandoned…and she’s a patsy? Why not? Maybe she just had a guessable password – we read that most people use “password” “123456” “qwerty” and similar stupid things as passwords..why wouldn’t the Kardashian fan be one of them? Twitter’s not important, why use a strong password that’s hard to type and remember?
She knows nothing about Weiner, has nothing to do with Nikki, etc.
She gets 2 threatening calls out of the blue.
Who made the calls?
The calls are either made by people who want to put a stop to “the Reids” …and researching the starchild111 account find that it was opened by Jenny George. (it was, so it must be a findable fact one way or another…on twitter records…how much money would it take to get someone inside twitter to give up or confirm her identity?) They assume she is behind all this (like many do) and try to scare her.
Or
The person/people behind The Reids makes the call to her to make it seem like she’s the one behind the socks.
She gets the calls, she looks up what is this about, finds Lee and calls him, scared and worried. She has now seen his lovely, comforting pictures and heard his soothing voice and the cat of satan in the background. Do you think he calmed her down much? No. She think’s he or his fans could be behind this. (Look at some of the wackos we have commenting here.)
She’s still panicked and goes to the BPD.
She’s a patsy.
Just thinking out loud.
koam @wittier (62b38e) — 7/1/2011 @ 4:14 pmSo it’s Friday, and I’m not going out shooting with my boyfriend.
This being the case, does anyone think we’re going to get this solved tonight? Is more information coming?
Dianna (f12db5) — 7/1/2011 @ 4:14 pmThinking out loud:
Assume JG MA is a real person who created @starchild111 in 2009 or 2010.
She used it as a fan of celebs because she heard that you can directly get response message by celebs on Twitter. (& you can…people used to write fan mail and hope for a reply, same thing.)
She didn’t keep using it because none of her friends used it and she didn’t get much satisfaction from celebrities she tracked, primarily the Kardashians and some Latinas, including J-Lo. Mostly about pretty actresses & models.
koam @wittier (62b38e) — 7/1/2011 @ 4:15 pmThinking out loud: part 2
She was also a fan of the UCLA writers program. She either attended that program or knew of it because she’d taken one of the writing retreats with Lew Hunter, a UCLA prof, in the past.
To clarify, while it’s been reported as a lie that she went to UCLA, the Writers Program is an extension program. You can take courses online.
http://twitter.com/#!/writersprogram
http://www2.uclaextension.edu/writers/detail.php?sID=aboutwr
It’s not only for screenwriting, and Lew Hunter isn’t listed as one of the instructors. Lew is a professor emeritus at UCLA in screenwriting.
http://www.tft.ucla.edu/faculty/lew-hunter/
Also if she were studying at UCLA on campus, she could be home in Boston for the summer. Who knows?
koam @wittier (62b38e) — 7/1/2011 @ 4:15 pmShe was also a fan of the UCLA writers program. She either attended that program or knew of it because she’d taken one of the writing retreats with Lew Hunter, a UCLA prof, in the past.
To clarify, while it’s been reported as a lie that she went to UCLA, the Writers Program is an extension program. You can take courses online.
It’s not only for screenwriting, and Lew Hunter isn’t listed as one of the instructors. Lew is a professor emeritus at UCLA in screenwriting.
Also if she were studying at UCLA on campus, she could be home in Boston for the summer. Who knows?
So if she dropped her Twitter account, who’s to say that one of the bad guys (I won’t name names but you’ve been discussing them) couldn’t have just picked up her Twitter account after noticing that it was girly and evidently abandoned…and she’s a patsy? Why not? Maybe she just had a guessable password – we read that most people use “password” “123456” “qwerty” and similar stupid things as passwords..why wouldn’t the Kardashian fan be one of them? Twitter’s not important, why use a strong password that’s hard to type and remember?
Most Common Internet Passwords
She knows nothing about Weiner, has nothing to do with Nikki, etc.
She gets 2 threatening calls out of the blue.
Who made the calls?
The calls are either made by people who want to put a stop to “the Reids” …and researching the starchild111 account find that it was opened by Jenny George. (it was, so it must be a findable fact one way or another…on twitter records…how much money would it take to get someone inside twitter to give up or confirm her identity?) They assume she is behind all this (like many do) and try to scare her.
Or
The person/people behind The Reids makes the call to her to make it seem like she’s the one behind the socks.
She gets the calls, she looks up what is this about, finds Lee and calls him, scared and worried. She has now seen his lovely, comforting pictures and heard his soothing voice and the cat of satan in the background. Do you think he calmed her down much? No. She think’s he or his fans could be behind this. (Look at some of the wackos we have commenting here.)
She’s still panicked and goes to the BPD.
She’s a patsy.
Just thinking out loud.
koam @wittier (62b38e) — 7/1/2011 @ 4:16 pmYes, koam? Go on.
Dianna (f12db5) — 7/1/2011 @ 4:16 pmconfused,
This blog has a number of unfriendly and even malicious
sockpuppets visit it, no? It is not personal, you are just an unknown.
So you meant people were attacking you on twitter? Do you know Ronbryn that well? he was getting aggressive and accusing you..?That sounds like a personal attack.
Ronbryn does sorta lose it, frequently 🙂
I'm Getting a Headache (d77c52) — 7/1/2011 @ 4:21 pmI had the worst time posting that…the system was not showing my full post..evidently the links I had related to the UCLA program and Prof Lew Hunter were being rejected. In any case they show that the Writers Program is an extension program and that Lew is Prof Emeritus and that the WP is still on Twitter, I follow it.
So…Why not accept that JG in Boston is a patsy? Some bad guys found her abandoned twitter account and it seemed opportune to make into a teen girl’s as a fake Weiner fan?
koam @wittier (62b38e) — 7/1/2011 @ 4:22 pmYou’ll have to ask him Headache. I didn’t know he existed until I saw that Loghner statement.
Stillconfused (786412) — 7/1/2011 @ 4:27 pmI don’t know him confused. But I don’t understand why he would go after you
I'm Getting a Headache (d77c52) — 7/1/2011 @ 4:29 pmNor do I headache. As I said, you’ll have to ask him that.
Stillconfused (786412) — 7/1/2011 @ 4:29 pmDon’t know him. I don”t tweet, and if I did I don’t think I’d be sending tweets to guy I didn’t know without a good reason.
I think everyone in the known universe read his tweets this week. He’ll never them down. Another reason to not tweet. Sooner or later youll lose your temper and show your underwear in public. Whoops that was Anthony not me.
I'm Getting a Headache (d77c52) — 7/1/2011 @ 4:34 pmI don’t know why he lost it unless he was pissed that I REALLY DON’T know anything about all of this.
Stillconfused (786412) — 7/1/2011 @ 4:37 pmHave a good night
Sure confused. take care and don’t take everything so hard. It’s not your fault he’s lost it. k?
I'm Getting a Headache (d77c52) — 7/1/2011 @ 4:39 pm308. koam @wittier
So far, all the evidence indicates that JG Boston is Jenay=Nikki= etc.
At this time none of the evidence indicated JG Boston is an innocent bystander.
Other than that, the theory that JG Boston is a Patsy is rock solid.
BTW, Why not accept that JG Boston is Elvis Presley, having returned on his flying saucer from a distant galaxy to retrieve Lee’s cat?
lamchopsl (a91fe8) — 7/1/2011 @ 4:41 pm“So far, all the evidence indicates that JG Boston is Jenay=Nikki= etc.
At this time none of the evidence indicated JG Boston is an innocent bystander.”
lamchopsl – Those conclusions are as firm as the evidence that Lee is not Dan Wolfe.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/1/2011 @ 4:53 pmWWOD?
Lee Stranahan (708cc3) — 7/1/2011 @ 4:56 pmInteresting tidbit that popped out at me from neals smear of me at KOS from link posted (#253, surreal)
goatsred (b20383) — 7/1/2011 @ 5:01 pmHushmail account mentioned–“And one final thing … the person or persons behind the hushmail account that knew so much about Mike Stack?”
The left hate the truth like they hate bush.
DohBiden (15aa57) — 7/1/2011 @ 5:05 pmComment by nancydrew — 7/1/2011 @ 2:18 pm
Yes,he certainly was cocky to ascertain that the FBI would swoop in on me because he said I tampered with AW’s social accounts.
goatsred (b20383) — 7/1/2011 @ 5:06 pmIt was also against the law to utter a false document and to post it there making it seem like I had committed a felony.
if someone was presurgical transgendered, would that make more or less likely that the person had some emotional issues….like JG from Boston perhaps? Just askin…don’t know.
nancydrew (448ba9) — 7/1/2011 @ 5:18 pm318. Interesting tidbit that popped out at me from neals smear of me at KOS from link posted (#253, surreal)
When I listened to Mr. Stranahan’s radio show talking about JP@NYT and how she was trying to deflect away from the topic, this whole Kos diary came back to me- so I hunted it down. Re-reading it, it amazed me at all the dots it could potentially connect.
All of this made me break down and get a twitter acct, for the love of…*sigh*. Not that I know what to *do* with it lol
surreal (7a67da) — 7/1/2011 @ 5:25 pmThe calvary to the rescue!!!
Lee, I have been defending your sorry arse for the better part of this afternoon.
There seems to be an element here that believes the Jenny George in Boston may not be the person who called you.
Did Jen Preston independently confirm that the Jenny George she talked to lives in Boston? Did that person Preston talked to admit that she set up the starchild111 twitter account?
From reading your blog, and listening to your broadcasts, it appears to me that you take this as fact.
You could certainly cut through a whole bunch of chatter here if you could just definitively clear up this one question.
lamchopsl (a91fe8) — 7/1/2011 @ 5:27 pm@Mike#318, 320
Playing fair does not seem to be in his vocabulary. He has judged and
convictedslandered you in front of a huge crowd of people. I think you need to talk to Patterico or some of the other lawyers here about that action. He can get away with it when its directed at Breitbart, but you are not a public figure. He’s raising up a vigilante gang.What made this guy so angry? You can be committed to a cause without wanting to burn the world down.
@surreal
bmertz (d77c52) — 7/1/2011 @ 5:28 pmI am glad that you found it. It tends to make the picture snap into focus. It may not answer all the questions about Jenny but it certainly makes me believe neal has his hands in this mess somewhere.
318. goatsred
I noticed that also. I had never heard of Hushmail before these death threats, but then I am not a professional blackmailer.
lamchopsl (a91fe8) — 7/1/2011 @ 5:30 pm@nancydrew #321
Where did you get that rumor?
bmertz (d77c52) — 7/1/2011 @ 5:35 pm320. goatsred
If Neal Douchehauser has publicaly defamed you, can’t you sue him for libel? Discovery in a civil lawsuit could be a bitch for him. I’m sure there are Right leaning lawyers who would be tripping over themselves to handel such a case, pro bono.
lamchopsl (a91fe8) — 7/1/2011 @ 5:36 pm“There seems to be an element here that believes the Jenny George in Boston may not be the person who called you.
Did Jen Preston independently confirm that the Jenny George she talked to lives in Boston? Did that person Preston talked to admit that she set up the starchild111 twitter account?”
lamchopsl – To be fair, there are a number of claims which you have been attempting to defend, not limited to the above, which are not actually supported by evidence apart from statements by one or more players involved at this point. With no disrespect, your difficulty seems to be in comprehending what constitutes independently verifiable evidence as opposed to hearsay.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/1/2011 @ 5:38 pmLamchopsl, I am wondering if the Jenny George who called Lee is the same Jenny George who filed a police report.
If I understand the timing (and I’m not sure I do), it is possible (not at all a certainty) that the woman who called Lee and identified herself as Jenny George knew of the threats because she’d been part of making them.
Which would at least cut out one tangle in this mess of action and interaction, people, threats, puppets and possible lies.
Again, this is not certainty. It’s a possibility, and one which makes the field a little less messy.
Dianna (f12db5) — 7/1/2011 @ 5:43 pmI’ve yet to see which alleged lies in the JG call to Lee are proven by actual evidence.
koam @wittier (62b38e) — 7/1/2011 @ 5:44 pm326. no rumor. Laurelai is a self confessed transgenered person who is presurgical. Don’t get the reason for your question.
nancydrew (448ba9) — 7/1/2011 @ 5:44 pmOops, I left out the rest of it – the woman, JG, who received the threats and went to the police, is a bystander.
It cuts the risky behavior factor quite sharply.
Dianna (f12db5) — 7/1/2011 @ 5:45 pmWe still don’t have the times of these events:
– The 6/19 teary call Lee received from a JG
koam @wittier (62b38e) — 7/1/2011 @ 5:47 pm– That same JG has call(s) with Preston at Lee’s suggestion
– Lee’s 6/20 radio show in which he describes call details (probably right after midnight)
– Any internet posts, comments, tweets etc. that Lee or others made regarding receiving call from JG
– A real JG from Boston files police report at BPD precinct.
Are we going to have another Séance to contact Neal tonight? I’m still waiting for the rapping on the table and rattling of pans to begin. Another document flash of somebody’s driving records.
bmertz (d77c52) — 7/1/2011 @ 5:49 pmlamchopsl – Have you also been commenting as Temper Tantrum today?
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/1/2011 @ 5:49 pmNancydrew, because before you mentioned this person, no one had mentioned him/her at all.
Dianna (f12db5) — 7/1/2011 @ 5:50 pm“Are we going to have another Séance to contact Neal tonight?”
bmertz – I think I still have a Magic 8 Ball around someplace if that would help.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/1/2011 @ 5:50 pmbmertz, if we do, do you want to sit next to me?
Dianna (f12db5) — 7/1/2011 @ 5:51 pmdaleyrocks, we could probably create a makeshift ouija board out of random tweets, or something.
Dianna (f12db5) — 7/1/2011 @ 5:52 pm“So it’s Friday, and I’m not going out shooting with my boyfriend.”
Dianna – Have him tweet you his junk instead. Anthony Weiner told me chicks dig that stuff.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/1/2011 @ 5:53 pmComment by nancydrew — 7/1/2011 @ 5:44 pm #331
We had a miscommunication Nancy. I thought you were referring to Jenny. Obviously to have access to that sort of knowledge would be rather significant here. 🙂
Your article is the first time I have been introduce to Lorelai. I don’t know a great deal about her outside of what I read.
bmertz (d77c52) — 7/1/2011 @ 5:54 pm328. daleyrocks
Thanks for clearing this point up for me. Since I had no reason to believe otherwise, I was assuming that your questions regarded facts, evidence and logical conclusions.
But you make no counter arguments nor cite no evidence, you merely make general personal accusations against me.
When I ask Lee to clear up one of your central objections, you, before even hearing Lee’s response, reject as insufficient to clear my reputation.
Now that it is clear that you seem to want to simply attack me personally, I will henceforth ignore you.
lamchopsl (a91fe8) — 7/1/2011 @ 5:55 pmDianna
bmertz (d77c52) — 7/1/2011 @ 5:55 pmYes, I’m scaaarrred of ghosties
goatsred – Serious question. I understand why you are PO’d at PatriotUSA, but in the time you guys were fooling around together as bornfree or whatever, did you ever have any indication that he was not a conservative or that he was a sock.
I ask, because I find most liberals cannot successfully impersonate a conservative for any length of time because they just don’t understand how we think. You see it with liberal trolls on blogs attempting to fool people. They invariably slip up because they are idiots or too indoctrinated with liberal Kool Aid about conservatives they put their feet in their mouths.
Did you see any hints of that with your interactions with Patriot to justify all the suspicion being cast his way?
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/1/2011 @ 5:56 pmAnyone want to volunteer to start channeling Neal? anybody? anybody? No volunteers?
sigh
bmertz (d77c52) — 7/1/2011 @ 5:58 pmThere, there! You can hold my hand, then.
G. K. Chesterton, when asked if he believed in ghosts, replied, “No; but I’m scared of them!”
An eminently sensible answer.
Dianna (f12db5) — 7/1/2011 @ 5:59 pm“But you make no counter arguments nor cite no evidence, you merely make general personal accusations against me.”
lamchopsl – Please point out a personal attack or accusation other than what I tried to explain in #328.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/1/2011 @ 5:59 pmMy brain is quite an odd enough place already, thank you.
Dianna (f12db5) — 7/1/2011 @ 6:00 pm“nor cite no evidence”
lamchopsl – If there is no evidence to cite, that’s a problem, isn’t it? You are really not paying close enough attention to what I have actually said.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/1/2011 @ 6:02 pmJG from Boston and Laurelai? Hmmm….just curious.
nancydrew (448ba9) — 7/1/2011 @ 6:03 pm“I will henceforth ignore you”
Does that count as a flounce? Anybody?
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/1/2011 @ 6:03 pmI think everyone is so stressed out and tired from working on this investigation (for weeks) that it is beginning to take its toll between people who normally have a lot in common. I’ve noticed that people sound frustrated and appear worn to the bone. I think this mystery will be cracked if we can be patient with each other. Meanwhile some of you need to get away from the computers and go do something fun to kick off the stress. Insight breaks lose with you aren’t so wound up.
========End of bmertz’s unsolicited advice ========
bmertz (d77c52) — 7/1/2011 @ 6:10 pm335. daleyrocks
347. daleyrocks
Since you don’t seem to grasp what I am talking about here, let me make this as clear as possible:
Fuck You.
Got it?
lamchopsl (a91fe8) — 7/1/2011 @ 6:12 pmDianna
I am glad to know that when times are truely dark, you will be there to stand beside me
I am honored and touched
bmertz (d77c52) — 7/1/2011 @ 6:13 pmsniff
No, it wasn’t “goodbye, cruel blog! You have abused me for the last time! You will regret it, when I am gone, just see if you don’t!”
It was purely someone who’s not happy with you, today.
Dianna (f12db5) — 7/1/2011 @ 6:14 pm@Nancydrew
bmertz (d77c52) — 7/1/2011 @ 6:19 pmWho was that interesting visitor earlier. She/he made some Very intriguing comments about patriot in the thread.
Lamb — I gave a long answer. It’s here.
http://leestranahan.com/weinergate-where-in-the-world-is-socky-puppet
Lee Stranahan (708cc3) — 7/1/2011 @ 6:25 pmdaley-Excuse me for inserting myself into the fight. I was trying to help calm everyone down, not upset you more. I have noticed an increase of tension among all the commenters and it concerned me.
bmertz (d77c52) — 7/1/2011 @ 6:26 pmFrom Lew Hunter’s website:
In North Dakota.
MayBee (081489) — 7/1/2011 @ 6:30 pm329. Dianna
I hear you. I think Lee has been kind of sloppy as he tries to flesh out this story. His use of language is somewhat imprecise, he tends to jump around and digress onto tangents and he either intentionally or unintentionally doesn’t put out all the facts, even when they aren’t any kind of big deal.
He does, however, seem to be responsive to the comments on this site. I’ve found he often address these these questions on his radio blog. Here’s to hoping he clears up these simple points.
lamchopsl (a91fe8) — 7/1/2011 @ 6:31 pmSorry. In Nebraska.
MayBee (081489) — 7/1/2011 @ 6:31 pmMayBee – Hunter lives in Nebraska, where the N on the Cornhusker football helmets stands for Nowledge!
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/1/2011 @ 6:37 pmLee has been more than responsive, and I’m not criticizing him or anyone.
Dianna (f12db5) — 7/1/2011 @ 6:38 pmMayBee? That is…interesting. Have you put it over on Lee’s blog? He has a new post up, and it might make it easier for him to see it.
Dianna (f12db5) — 7/1/2011 @ 6:39 pmSo….
There’s a real UCLA prof’s website, and a sock UCLA prof for JP and LS to speak to on the phone? Why is the same not true for JG– a real person, but not the person who’s spoken to LS and JP. Who else is real but faked? The Boston detective?
This is not normal sockpuppet stuff. They are being careful to find somebody real they can co-opt before putting themselves out there. Doing so gives them cover for a while before everyone sorts out the mess. That implies the availability of resources to employ for this purpose.
CausticConservative (b29599) — 7/1/2011 @ 6:40 pmkoam started to talk it out.
Suppose JG, a real person, has an unused starchild111 account that gets co-opted and contains some personal information that makes it possible for an identity thief to impersonate her.
Is it possible no one has spoken to the ACTUAL JG who created the account yet? To ask if her account has seen activity unknown to her?
CausticConservative (b29599) — 7/1/2011 @ 6:45 pm357. Lee Stranahan
Thanks for taking the time to make this clear.
It seems to me that the detective’s reference to the Mrs. Hunter means the Jenny George he spoke with is the one both you and Jen Preston talked to.
The Dan Wolfe Massachusetts connections are one more weight toward the Jenny George=Patriot conclusion. That seems to be getting closer every day.
lamchopsl (a91fe8) — 7/1/2011 @ 6:48 pmThe site for Lew Hunter’s intensive course says he’s in Nebraska.
For some reason, I was thinking Prof. Emeritus Hunter was in Southern California.
Having read the site at least once before, how come I didn’t notice that?
Dianna (f12db5) — 7/1/2011 @ 6:49 pmMaybe I’ve been watching too many spy thrillers. It’s obvious we are being screwed with, just would be nice to know who and why.
Although we might discover that the who and why to be totally unsatisfying in the end.
It’s been interesting to follow.
CausticConservative (b29599) — 7/1/2011 @ 6:50 pmI phoned Lew Hunter in Nebraska.
Who is Caustic Conservative? Can anyone vouch for them?
Lee Stranahan (708cc3) — 7/1/2011 @ 6:52 pmWe have four people who are real and identified beyond any reasonable doubt — Jenny George, Lew Hunter and his wife, and Detective Thornton.
But Caustic Conservative seems to want to convince people that these real people are (somehow) fake.
So I ask — who is CC and why do they want to foist this lunacy on people?
Lee Stranahan (708cc3) — 7/1/2011 @ 6:55 pm345. Comment by bmertz — 7/1/2011 @ 5:58 pm
Anyone want to volunteer to start channeling Neal? anybody? anybody? No volunteers?
I’ll have to take a pass. I may be from the Lunatic Lair, but, there are some flavors of lid flippage that go beyond Beyond, right smack into Over Yonder. Ol’ Sinister lands square in BFE.
surreal (7a67da) — 7/1/2011 @ 6:56 pm#370 – Lee – It’s more that we’ve started to doubt the reality of anyone who isn’t sitting in the family room with us at this exact instant.
I’m not entirely kidding.
Dianna (f12db5) — 7/1/2011 @ 7:01 pmWHO ARE YOU, Caustic Conservative!!!
All who doubt must be outed! All who doubt must have aspersions cast upon them!
The Freaking Mob (b7410e) — 7/1/2011 @ 7:02 pmWho is ‘The Freaking Mob’?
Lee Stranahan (708cc3) — 7/1/2011 @ 7:05 pm“We have four people who are real and identified beyond any reasonable doubt — Jenny George, Lew Hunter and his wife, and Detective Thornton.”
Lee – Respectfully, I disagree.
We have a person claiming to be Jenny George that you and Jen Preston have spoken with.
We have a Jenny George that Det. Thornton interviewed in response to her complaint.
Where is the hard evidence establishing they are the same person? We have no physical descriptions. We have professors remembering a JG but no assurance it is the same person. Could they have taught more than one JG? Was that question asked?
I’m not asking to create “lunacy”. Just remember that TommyX got punked with fake ID. I’d rather have it nailed down than leap to conclusions.
I’m also missing that Nikki/Patriot connection you see lurking.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/1/2011 @ 7:05 pmLOL.
I’m nobody.
Just a random Patterico reader who seldom posts.
I don’t read the entire threads all the time. I don’t follow twitter at all, so I am missing a bunch of details apparently.
Didn’t mean to throw you off the trail!
CausticConservative (b29599) — 7/1/2011 @ 7:07 pmOMG.
It just occurred to me that maybe…
I’M
NOT
ME!
CausticConservative (b29599) — 7/1/2011 @ 7:10 pm371. Lee Stranahan
Gennette Cordova
At least knowing she is real separates her from the Sockpuppet Posse, making it one less problem to solve.
lamchopsl (a91fe8) — 7/1/2011 @ 7:11 pmI think Lee’s theory is probably the most accurate. Plus, he he has the most solid leads (police report) to follow up on.
This Neal guys possible involvement is troubling but maybe he is just trying to be a headache to those trying to break the story wide open.
Noodles (3681c4) — 7/1/2011 @ 7:12 pmNeal is an idiot.
But Neal is not Nikki / Patriot.
Lee Stranahan (708cc3) — 7/1/2011 @ 7:17 pmDaley,
The evidence is in commonality of the statements from the woman who I spoke to and the woman who the police spoke to.
Lee Stranahan (708cc3) — 7/1/2011 @ 7:18 pmLee,
From what I’ve seen the threatener may be a completely separate story. She could be JG threatening herself and everybody else, but s/he could also be somebody else? Any insight?
lamchopsl (a91fe8) — 7/1/2011 @ 7:23 pmLee? Is the commonality more than Prof. Hunter and his wife? And UCLA? (Which, by your account, is a lie).
Dianna (f12db5) — 7/1/2011 @ 7:25 pm384. Dianna
If I may presume to interject.
The fact that JG mentioned the Hunters to Jen Preston and to the detective is the argument. What are the chances that the real JG would mention the hunters to the detective and someone else falsely claiming to e JG would mention the Hunters to Jen Preston?
lamchopsl (a91fe8) — 7/1/2011 @ 7:34 pmlamb is correct…
Plus other elements of the story — the mention of me. Of ‘followers’ — a fake JG would change her story to ‘followers’, why exactly?
Seriously — this isn’t rocket science. It’s not weird. The simple answer is simple — the woman on the phone filed the police report.
Has anyone contacted me to clear it up?
Just think this stuff through…what are the logical consequences?
Lee Stranahan (708cc3) — 7/1/2011 @ 7:38 pmAlso — the detective is closing the case as ‘unfounded’ he told me.
What does that tell you?
I mean — “nothing” if you want to believe the exceptionally complicated conspiracy theory.
But it’s sure consistent with the story I’m telling.
BTW – has anyone asked Patterico if he heard the hoaxster theory from Reid or Wolfe?
Lee Stranahan (708cc3) — 7/1/2011 @ 7:40 pmLee says John Reid is fake and JG is real.
Pat says JG is fake and John Reid is real.
Any wonder why random comments thread readers might get a little confused?
CausticConservative (b29599) — 7/1/2011 @ 7:49 pmIt seems to me that unless JG decides to come clean the only way this whole intrigue will be resolved is if JG is the threatener and law enforcement unravels it with subpoenas of twitter and ISPs. If it turns out that someone else is the threatener, we may never definitively know who Dan wolf is,
lamchopsl (a91fe8) — 7/1/2011 @ 7:50 pm“The evidence is in commonality of the statements from the woman who I spoke to and the woman who the police spoke to.”
Lee – I agree there is wicked commonality, I am just looking for more than commonality. The AGW fanatic believe correlation equals causation. I think they’re full of sh*t because they don’t fully understand our climate system and expect more evidence before sending our economy back to the stone age.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/1/2011 @ 7:52 pmAnybody know if Pattero or Ace have filed criminal complaints over the threats. Once it goes across state lines the FBI comes in, if I am not mistaken. Then it becomes a federal case.
lamchopsl (a91fe8) — 7/1/2011 @ 7:54 pm“Also — the detective is closing the case as ‘unfounded’ he told me.”
Thanks. More new information.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/1/2011 @ 7:54 pmYou are taking Preston’s remarks to Lee out of context if you think she was trying
to persuade
him Hunter’s website was fake. that’s not what she said or meant at all.
She was warning him of the possibilites of an anonymous- style punk. She didn’t say the website was fake or appeared to be fake, she said she did not [at that moment] take for granted it was genuine. A prudent reservation that was, considering what has been going on with socks and the natural history of Encylopedia dramatica hijinks. This is not the stuff of black helicopters, it’s more a suspicion that silly drama is afoot.
Lees caller is a liar, check; lees caller is or is not a Jenny George known by lew hunter, claimed but not double checked.
That checking needs to happen
Sarahw (af7312) — 7/1/2011 @ 8:10 pm“The fact that JG mentioned the Hunters to Jen Preston and to the detective is the argument.”
lamchopsl – Can you please refresh my memory where the Hunter/Detective connection was discussed?
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/1/2011 @ 8:11 pm“Lees caller is a liar, check; lees caller is or is not a Jenny George known by lew hunter, claimed but not double checked.
That checking needs to happen”
SarahW – I don’t understand why that is such a stratospherically difficult concept for some people to understand, but it apparently is, because they accuse you of fomenting lunacy when you raise it.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/1/2011 @ 8:14 pm“Once it goes across state lines the FBI comes in, if I am not mistaken.”
I think it gets even worse if a telephone was used. And with people being able to use telephones to send email/tweet, they have to be really careful. A lot of people don’t realize that the laws can be different if a phone is involved.
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/1/2011 @ 8:32 pm393. Sarahw
The Boston detective spoke to JG.
Lee said, “The Detective also mentioned to me that he had spoken to Mrs. Hunter”:
http://leestranahan.com/weinergate-where-in-the-world-is-socky-puppet
During their phone call, the person claiming to be JG referred Jen Preston to the Hunters. Jen later gave the hunters number to Lee and he called them also.
What are the chances that the real JG would refer the detective to the Hunters and that a person falsely claiming to be JG would refer Jen Preston to the Hunters?
Ergo: JG Boston set up the starchild111 account as she claimed and as was indicated by the account name.
lamchopsl (a91fe8) — 7/1/2011 @ 8:38 pmThis isn’t really anything but there is a starchild111 Youtube account. Looks abandoned.
There is also a one for user/jennifergeorge subscribed to UCLA but I think that is the wrong ones channel.
No user/jenaygeorge
Noodles (3681c4) — 7/1/2011 @ 9:00 pmOut of all the people in all the world she could have picked–why do you suppose Boston JG chose the Hunters–the out of state Hunters– to be the ones that she referred several perfect strangers to for an endorsement? Did she warn/alert the Hunters ahead of time I wonder? And what arrangements had she made with them to give them permission to discuss her, or what explanation did she give the Hunters for needing this service, I wonder.
elissa (961c7a) — 7/1/2011 @ 9:08 pm“The Detective also mentioned to me that he had spoken to Mrs. Hunter, so I believe that reference must have come from Ms. George.”
Thanks. Unless I am mistaken, this is more new information revealed today. That establishes a good connection.
Again, stuff like this would have made a stronger case earlier. Why hold back on it?
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/1/2011 @ 9:12 pmI’m just sleuthing (see Google) and see she won some MA film thingie. Says she’s from Quincy, MA.
Noodles (3681c4) — 7/1/2011 @ 9:13 pm“And what arrangements had she made with them to give them permission to discuss her, or what explanation did she give the Hunters for needing this service, I wonder.”
elissa – More interestingly, why was it necessary to have the police call anybody on her behalf?
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/1/2011 @ 9:14 pmIdk, maybe that’s the one with the Twitter account maybe? Is she the suspect or some other Jennifer George?
Noodles (3681c4) — 7/1/2011 @ 9:17 pmNoodles — I saw that but there are 8 Jennifer Georges around Boston
Lee Stranahan (708cc3) — 7/1/2011 @ 9:17 pmNo, Preston clearly thought that the website and Lew Hunter and his wife were all possibly fake. We argued about this point, which I was stunned by.
Lee Stranahan (708cc3) — 7/1/2011 @ 9:19 pm==there are 8 Jennifer Georges around Boston==
Oh good allah.
elissa (961c7a) — 7/1/2011 @ 9:20 pmNew Braintree and Andover, MA look like the closest in age (if that is correct).
Noodles (3681c4) — 7/1/2011 @ 9:25 pmI’m not going to hypothesize on women who live in or near Boston.
The Police have her address. That works for me.
Lee Stranahan (708cc3) — 7/1/2011 @ 9:49 pmRadio show — 1e 12c 11m 10p
So, 10 minutes from now.
http://tobtr.com/s/2050777
Lee Stranahan (708cc3) — 7/1/2011 @ 9:51 pmLee,
I have to agree with you on the recent odd behavior of Jennifer Preston. It should be very easy to verify the Lew Hunter aspect. Just a quick look at his web site provides lots of clues that he appears to be a real money making individual.
He just completed a retreat on June 24 so maybe we can get someone to verify that he was seen there in Superior NE.
JP should have the resouces to verify Lew in less than 30 minutes.
With your latest Blog Talk show, I am now updated on your views concerning Jenny George. I still don’t see the upside to her or anyone filing a Police report in Boston. It just up’s the story rather then hoping it just dies quietly on the internet.
So that leaves me with the question: What is the next step when you turn on your phone after a good weekend rest?
Joe
Joe Smith (54c0c1) — 7/1/2011 @ 11:13 pmAs long as a bunch of commenters I never heard of before agree, that is what matters.
Pay no attention to the way an alternate theory explains everything.
Hi, Neal!
Patterico (5e9aee) — 7/1/2011 @ 11:24 pmPatterico , how does your theory explain everything?
Temper Tantrum (02fe1b) — 7/2/2011 @ 12:17 amLee left us a rabbit hole to search based this tweet:
Is this the face of Qritiq?
http://www.flickr.com/photos/28747007@N00/
Joe
Joe Smith (54c0c1) — 7/2/2011 @ 2:07 amThere is a real ball of socks in this dresser drawer!
Patterico’s theory is that 1) Lee’s hysterical caller was a hoaxer claiming to be Jennifer George (MA). This hoaxer may or may not be in league with 2) A male hoaxer who threatened the real JG MA and claimed to be Lee.
Real JG MA calls the police and Lee gets a call from them.
Points against #1 seem to be that Lee is fairly certain that hysterical caller is the same as JG MA, due to “commonalities” that seem indicative but not dispositive. But as Patterico says, even if #1 is wrong, #2 is not dependent.
#2, that somebody actually threatened JG MA and claimed to be Lee (or one of his “followers”…all hail Lee!!!) is a hypothesis that yields a lot of good areas of thought.
First off, if there had been no threats made against JG MA, and yet she still filed a police report (which I assume Patterico has verified), then she’s engaging in very risky and stupid behavior. I think it makes much more sense that a threat was actually made.
If a threat was made, we know it wasn’t Lee (all hail Lee!!!) so it must have been an imposter, some sort of political shit-stirrer. And the primary suspect seems to be “Neal”, a shit-stirrer with a long reach and a short stick.
The email threats to Ace and Patterico made by Alicia Pain may be related, of course, but Ace and Patterico are wisely maintaining radio silence on what is an ongoing police investigation, so lets leave this out for now.
Now, on its face, this is two or three levels removed from the dicpic, but considering all the socks it may not be. These two narratives (hysterical caller is a phony / real threats by phony Lee) are just two pieces in the puzzle.
Patterico, have I restated your post back to you correctly?
Pious Agnostic (6048a8) — 7/2/2011 @ 4:22 amThe date on that post was intentionally wrong.
Lee Stranahan (708cc3) — 7/2/2011 @ 4:38 amPatterico has not said that John Reid is real.
slp (f9a160) — 7/2/2011 @ 4:59 am404
Yes, Lee, she thought them all possibly fake, as she should have with the amount of information she had. Failing to check would be inexcusable, but circumspection at first very reasonable.
You were certain all was resolved, she was not. Some loose ends remain.
If you really spoke to the person who took classes from Lew hunter, I will think it.ll but reolved myself, but I don’t know whether the woman in Boston is actually a foamier screenwriting student.
Sarahw (af7312) — 7/2/2011 @ 5:35 amThis story has now officially transcended the realm of the mundane political conspiracy theory tinged with sinister overtones of of death-hackers like Anonymous and the Yes men. It is now firmly ensconced in bizarre and inscrutable hyper-real metrocosm of Van Nuys:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Van_Nuys_Boulevard_Street_Scene.JPG
My proof, you might ask? Consider the fact that Lee ‘s twitter account has been co-opted. By a banker!
http://twitter.com/#!/Stranahan
Be afraid. Be very afraid, my friends.
lamchopsl (a91fe8) — 7/2/2011 @ 5:50 amThat’s putting too dark a facetious spin on it, Lamchop1.
SarahW (af7312) — 7/2/2011 @ 6:12 amLulz can be “deadly” I guess but mainly its just making fools of people.
“Foamier screenwriting student”
I hate you, Ipad auto-correct.
SarahW (af7312) — 7/2/2011 @ 6:13 amPlease take a look at this blog post that Lee posted earlier today.
http://qritiq.wordpress.com/2010/06/30/look-a-likes/
I don’t know yet how he came across it.
The top photo is a match for a Jennifer George, Boston facebook profile
http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1104744369
While the 2nd and 3rd are Nikki Reed the actress (it says) and J-Lo, both of whom have rich histories with @starchild111.
The home page for the qritiq blog has a weather widget with ZIP 11576, Roslyn, NY (a suburb of NYC on Long Island). Other stories in the blog are related to NYC and Long Island.
The page notes: “Look-alikes?” (sic) “Is it just me or do these ladies look somewhat similar?” (for Jennifer George, Boston and Nikki Reed, actress) and “Maybe more like this:” for Jennifer Lopez.
This is dated June 30, 2010 and filed under “politics.”
How darn odd is all that?
Thoughts?
koam @wittier (62b38e) — 7/2/2011 @ 6:20 am418. sarahw
Too dark a facetious a spin?!??
This from the author of, “Foamier screenwriting student”?
lamchopsl (a91fe8) — 7/2/2011 @ 6:22 am414. Lee
What do you mean by that and how do you know?
Can wordpress dates be faked?
koam @wittier (62b38e) — 7/2/2011 @ 6:29 amUpdate: WordPress dates can be modified.
So this qritiq is possibly just someone spoofing.
koam @wittier (62b38e) — 7/2/2011 @ 6:32 am#344. Daleyrocks I did not see anything to make me believe that he was anyone other than who he said he was. Of course, I have always used Twitter to post political stuff and my opinions so I only interacted with people on that basis.
goatsred (b20383) — 7/2/2011 @ 6:34 amI only noted one strange thing: He would never post articles/links. It would always be Weiner news or a reply to something I tweeted.Or a “hello” to everyone RT’d a million times.
So, I guess the answer is no. I took him at face value, considering that I had no interaction with him in “real life”. And I never studied his “act” then. Now I’m more discreet,obviously.
I was very ignorant to this world up until this event took place. It never seemed to be a place where this stuff happened,or somewhere I could get myself embroiled into a scandal like this.
There was a person in our group for awhile, and I’ll leave his name out for right now,who followed our group and RAW. I told Patriot and passed word around to block him. We did but this person does not appear to be a sock,because he still posts and doesnt follow me.If he follows the rest of the group,I do not know but will check.
You can DM me , or I will email Sarah W with the name and you can check him out yourself until we think it’s right to post his name here.
Hope that adds some clarity. If not, fire away .
goatsred@423 – Thanks for the response. Some people just don’t know how to post links, but who knows. Hopefully my question my sense to you.
I’m not on twitter, but thank you for the offer.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/2/2011 @ 6:46 am396 – You presume too much. lchop.
First, I do not dislike Lee’s theory at all and think it is a simple explanation for convoluted shenanigan. If it even matters, I’ve been saying so for some time. However, I think a solid case stands all the kicking you can give it.
Checking would only strengthen, if all is as it seems.
If all is not as it seems, checking could reveal it.
I am saying something different about JG than you seem to be hearing, I think.
I’m saying Lee’s caller, the report-maker, could be a poser.
A poser who refers people to Lew Hunter.
The value of a Lew Hunter reference depends on the strength of certainty that she hasn’t directed people to an accomplice(s)
and that she is actually the student, not jut someone purporting to be.
It means little for [verified] Lew Hunter to say “yes, I know a Jenny George of MA. She has attended my seminars” unless he provides information that Lee’s caller is THAT PARTICULAR Jenny George, as opposed to someone pretending to be that former student.
I would do two things to cross-reference and double-check.
I would contact (If I were going to contact anyone, which I am not) Lew Hunter through his UCLA contact information.
If he were willing to provide himself as a reference for Lee’s caller, (which he might not be) he CAN provide more than information that JG exists.
He might confirm anything from an address from his records to a birthmark on her shoulder; basically any kind of detail that would tie Lee’s caller to Lew’s student.
If LewH is verifiably the speaker and his student verifiably Lee’s caller, then Lee I believe has got at least one party to the hoaxing and probably all of them- all the socks.
If LewH turns out to have been in Argentina the day of Preston/lee’s calls I think that might be significant and imply another hoaxer is in on the game.
At this point it is more difficult to establish that Lee’s caller is really Lew’s student and not just posing as the Jenny George who went to his seminars. Jenny might have cooperated with a request for identifying detail ( if really the student), and the professor might have cooperated more readily before being exposed and worried about implying a student is a fruitcake.
Now, general physical description, sending him a picture, matching up of addresses, the sort of thing available from the detective or the police report, is all that will be obtainable.
But it ought to be checked.
You might think it absolutely outlanding that Lee’s caller would be bold enough to fake being someone else to the point of filing a police report, and meeting an officer at the address she gave.
Take nothing for granted, though, trust no one, because even if it isn’t, the situation has all the hallmarks of an Encyclopedia Dramatic magnet, especially confused and hidden and faked identities. These have already happened, be on your guard for more.
Doesn’t mean there are any, just that double checking is prudent.
SarahW (af7312) — 7/2/2011 @ 6:49 amSarahW – Stop personally attacking lamchopsl. Heh.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/2/2011 @ 6:59 amI don’t post much because you guys are just much better at this than I. That said.
Blackburnsghost (2ffb0c) — 7/2/2011 @ 7:09 amGoatsred and daily rocks
I’m sure you had no reason to doubt patriot until this why would you. So please DO NOT take this next comment as questioning that. You have been through more than enough.
Just a thought I had yesterday after reading the old DM btwn Patriot and that film guy.
As conservatives or whatever do any of you rant like that? I mean he used the word hate like 50 times? I don’t know it just sounded like someone who thinks they know that conservatives are filled with hate. Patriot wasn’t even in AW district right? I lived in NY, I’ve met his wife (very nice) and I never hated him. More like an annoying fly.
I thought it sounded much more like Simon Sinister.
haha how funny is it every time Patterico says “Hi Neil”
Lambchopsl is smart and cool.
SarahW (af7312) — 7/2/2011 @ 7:18 amBlackburnsghost – Your powers of observation seem strong enough to me.
No it is not normal. It’s a tell – a put-on of rage. Overdoing it, protesting too much, is a feature of the sockwriter and one reason the sockwriting sucks so badly.
SarahW (af7312) — 7/2/2011 @ 7:24 am@Stranahan It just occurred to me that you and @JohnReid9 now agree about Preston. She’s as bad as JR9 says. Interesting.
koam @wittier (62b38e) — 7/2/2011 @ 7:31 amBlackburnsghost – That conversation just looked to me like somebody who was accustomed to communicating by IM or tweet.
Also you have to remember the insulting crazy crap personal theories floated about him by people like Stranahan and how he could not possibly been in a position to have been in a position to see Weiner’s tweet which turned out to be absolute BS. Yeah, so I understand the rage.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/2/2011 @ 7:39 amlamchopsl – Lee admitted on BTR last night that he had not documented things in this story because he had wasted time going down rabbit holes and getting yelled at. It’s a piss poor excuse, but the lack of documentation is what the bulk of bitching is about in this thread and Lee fans it himself when he asks questions people if you think there’s a problem, what’s an alternate explanation. You have a persistent inability as SarahW and I have both pointed out to understand this concept.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/2/2011 @ 7:44 amLee – Since you mentioned it on BTR last night, can you be specific about anything that the Reid personas have done that is anti-Weiner? How does that fit with Jenny in Boston being Nikki and being very liberal?
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/2/2011 @ 7:47 am426. SarahW
OK, so you are acknowledging that Lees caller, the person that Jen Preston talked to and the person who filed the police report and later spoke to the Boston detective are the same person? Do you acknowledge that this person is named Jenny George?
lamchopsl (a91fe8) — 7/2/2011 @ 8:29 amLee,
I’m listening to your extended Blog Talk Radio show from last night and have reached a point of confusion on what you’re saying that Preston’s position on why to not pursue the person behind the call you received from Jen George in Boston (who Preston has talked to several times):
1) You said earlier that Preston said that Prof Lew Hunter’s site may be a phony and the prof may have punked Preston/you.
– You disagree. You think Hunter is real and was truthful.
2) You said last night that Preston said that Jen George in Boston’s @startchild111 twitter was hacked so that JG is not responsible for the Weiner activity of Nikki. Preston: “Lee there’s nothing to tie JG into that Nikki Reid account.”
– You disagree. (I don’t think Pru proved that the account was hacked or not hacked. Either could be the case) but you say it was not hacked. You say that Preston buys JG’s story that the account was hacked, “absolutely, hook,line and sinker.”
So in case 1) you say Preston is saying that JG’s evidence (the prof) is fake….so Preston won’t pursue (this goes too deep, she warns you)
And in case 2) you say Preston is saying that JG’s story is true….so Preston won’t pursue.
So I don’t understand how you say Preston both incorrectly disbelieves JG’s story and simultaneously incorrectly believe’s JG’s story.
The only consistent parts are 1) you disagree with Preston on the conclusions to be drawn from the evidence, and 2) Preston is not pursuing the case, no matter what excuse she gives.
Isn’t that a bit messed up?
koam @wittier (62b38e) — 7/2/2011 @ 8:29 amThank you SarahW. I don’t know who the heck Patriot is but it just sounded so “over the top”. Not unlike JReid was so “under the top” *trademark BGhost 🙂
Blackburnsghost (2ffb0c) — 7/2/2011 @ 8:30 amFor example I have a legitimate reason to be pissed as hell because my community is being systematically
destroyed RIGHT NOW, I literally cried at a recent local parade and I still have never spoken like that. I just went and checked some sites/commentors I follow just to double check the temperature and people are incredulous about various issues but they have a fantastic sense of humor and they are intelligent. Not “I’m not a bright guy” slobber/burp that Patriot also said about 50 times. Ewww I just remembered he kept going on and on about his daughter being a victim even AFTER the film guy told him to stop. Twice.Ugh what? I’m sorry if you are a real person patriot I really am but I can’t help wonder.
Daleyrocks like I said just thinking out loud. I don’t communicate via DM or IM or whatever so I don’t know.
Blackburnsghost (2ffb0c) — 7/2/2011 @ 8:32 amThis whole thing is nuts and again if he is a real person I’m sorry for his trouble.
I am dubious about Lee’s theory of separating motives between the personal and the political. For the left, the personal and the political are inseparable, they define people. Just try to have a rational discussion about politics with a liberal and see how personal it becomes for them.
I think it is also a mistake think Lee has been correct or even consistent on his thinking about Dan Wolfe during the course of this story. He has not. I’ll be happy to document it when I return later.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/2/2011 @ 8:41 amComment by lamchopsl — 7/2/2011 @ 8:29 am
Who doesn’t acknowledge that the hoaxer(Lee’s Caller) claims to be Jenny George?
Or that (assuming he really spoke to the real Lew Hunter) Lew Hunter had a student named Jenny George?
SarahW (af7312) — 7/2/2011 @ 9:01 am440. SarahW
I am not asking if she claimed to be Jenny George. I am asking you if you acknowledge that that person is named Jenny George. That is, did she identify herself to the detective an Jenny Goerge and the detective confirmed that he was speaking to the person named Jenny George that filed the complaint?
lamchopsl (a91fe8) — 7/2/2011 @ 9:11 amKoam, I can’t speak for Preston, but I do think she was misunderstood by Lee (as I was).
My read: She was saying she’s not ready to make any declaration of what’s going on based on the information she has.
Not following up with the prof would be inexcusable.
Not getting hold of her personal info from the Police report and checking in to see if the [verified] prof to see if matches his records is another.
Not speaking to the detective would be inexcusable.
Maybe Preston knows something we don’t, and it shapes her opinions. If she doesn’t, maybe general interest in the story has faded so ar he doesn’t want to put in the effort.
Is she the only person in the world who can investigate and gather information and report it?
No. So find out if the story is dropped like a hot potato, if so, stop worrying about what she thinks or does.
SarahW (af7312) — 7/2/2011 @ 9:11 amLamchopsl, I don’t know if she is Jenny George or someone posing as her.
SarahW (af7312) — 7/2/2011 @ 9:13 am“they define people. Just try to have a rational discussion about politics with a liberal and see how personal it becomes for them.”
Blackburnsghost (2ffb0c) — 7/2/2011 @ 9:17 amTruth
Could we not take that link to the qritiq blog that Lee posted earlier (top photo,unlabeled is same photo as a Jen Preston from Boston on a private Facebook profile) and send it to Prof. Lew Hunter and ask,
And send the same thing to the Detective in Boston?
well, I guess we cannot because that page has now been removed from qritiq. http://qritiq.wordpress.com/2010/06/30/look-a-likes/
but we could use the photo from the facebook profile page (woman in business attire, yellow blouse, under dark jacket, leaning forward into camera, hands on desk)
koam @wittier (62b38e) — 7/2/2011 @ 9:27 amlamchopsl,
I don’t understand your insistence upon treating “understandings” and “acknowledgments” as truth. In pressing SarahW to “acknowledge” certain propositions you are merely insisting she has the same “understanding” as you when the facts are not iron-clad.
As SaraW points out, nobody is saying a police report wasn’t filed or that the person Lee spoke with didn’t claim to be Jenny George. It’s a matter of corroboration. And no, the professor’s phone acknowledgment is not good enough.
We all know who JGCA is. She has a website, a twitter, can be easily contacted, and has a work history that can be verified. And the only reason she is caught up in this is because of the ghost of JGMA (beyond a name, we do not know who she is). How do we know the professor didn’t have JGCA in mind when he verified her existence?
Crispian (70c05e) — 7/2/2011 @ 9:33 amkoam,
I still see the picture in google cache. Was that page created by Ms. Lipton? Despite the nearly exactly one year ago date on it, the picture caption is “JG?” and is tagged as “politics.”
Crispian (70c05e) — 7/2/2011 @ 9:35 amAnybody out there please correct me if I am wrong, but when you walk into a police station and say, “Hello, my name is Daffy Duck, and I’d like to file a complaint against Lee Stranahan for threatening to kill me.”
The Desk Sargent politely replies, “We’d be happy to take your complaint Mr. Duck, if you would please just fill out this form. Oh, and by the way, may I see your identification?”
And when the decetive goes out to interview the person making the complaint, he also asks for identification to ensure he is talking to the person who made the complaint.
So here’s my next question: if you believe the person who called Lee and Jen Preston and filed the police complaint and then spoke with the detective isn’t really named Jenny George, then isn’t it reasonable to assume that this person has some sort of serious identification, such as a drivers license or passport, that identifies her as Jenny George?
lamchopsl (a91fe8) — 7/2/2011 @ 9:36 amlamchopsl,
It’s reasonable to assume, but I’m sure one doesn’t need identification. (“Sorry ma’am, I don’t care what crime you want to report, no ID, no investigation.”)
But again, it’s a matter of knowing it was the same person that Lee spoke with and if it was, then determining who that person is beyond a mere name.
Crispian (70c05e) — 7/2/2011 @ 9:42 amAt work bored.
Blackburnsghost (2ffb0c) — 7/2/2011 @ 9:56 amJust read this http://www.dailykos.com/story/2011/06/28/989469/-Disingenuous-Chart,-Dishonest-DA-(Weinergate)?via=search
Stranded Wind=Marooned Fart? High and dry gas bag?
Again just thinking out loud…whistling minding my own business.
446. Crispian
There are no iron-clad facts. There are only degrees of certainty. JGCA could be an elaborate hoax also. You cannot be 100% certain that the person standing in front of you in the grocery store check out line isn’t a visitor from another space-time continuum.
The reason I am using words like acknowledge is I am trying to find out the level of certainty that is required for someone with whom I am talking to say something is, as you say, an iron-clad fact.
If the guy in line behind me in the grocery store check out line starts asking me to prove that I am not a visitor from another space-time continuum, I might rightfully expect that men in white coats toss a butterfly net over him. And if people on this forum start contacting people to exclude extremely unlikely conspiracy hypotheses, they might expect the same response.
If you read JGCA’s Weinerpage she seems to think everybody on this forum is a crazy conspiracy theorist. I would argue that she is wrong, some people on this forum are not.
lamchopsl (a91fe8) — 7/2/2011 @ 10:04 am448 lamchopsl
that sounds right.
koam @wittier (62b38e) — 7/2/2011 @ 10:07 am447 Crispian
You’re referring to my 445.
I don’t know who Ms. [redacted] is.
The qritiq blog page was, Lee says, intentionally mis-dated a year earlier. I tested and you can mis-date posts on wordpress.
So its value is much less if it was just posted yesterday with some photo found online by searching “jennifer george boston” ( I found same photo a week ago that way). If it had really been posted a year ago on same page with Nikki Reed and J-Lo then that was gonna be big news. Lee spread it, not sure why. but he was asking who owned the blog…so perhaps the blogger was up to a little misdirection because of that fake date.
The blog has a weather widget with the ZIP for Roslyn, NY (long island).
The photo I would consider entirely random, one of many candidates. It could be emailed to Prof and Detective for some level of corrobroation…so if another photo of same lady shows up elsewhere we will know we are looking at the one who took courses and/or filed police reports. That would be real information.
But in the interim
koam @wittier (62b38e) — 7/2/2011 @ 10:13 amPlease take a look at this blog post …http://qritiq.wordpress.com/2010/06/30/look-a-likes/
Geez, all this time, and no one ever once mentioned that she was a babe. I might have actually paid attention.
Jenny, if you’re out there, I’ve got Sox tickets. We’ll get some Fenway franks and forget about the whole Weinie thing. Later we can help Norm tweet random body parts to strangers. It’ll be fun.
You know where to find me. (The place where every one knows – oh wait, never mind that part).
Cheers,
Sam Malone (f24ed2) — 7/2/2011 @ 10:24 amSammy
witter,
You mean this picture?
http://profile.ak.fbcdn.net/hprofile-ak-snc4/23073_1104744369_8766_n.jpg
The link for this FB page was sent to Lee on June 27 by @lanelipton on twitter
Joe
Joe Smith (54c0c1) — 7/2/2011 @ 10:27 am420 kill me now.
SarahW (af7312) — 7/2/2011 @ 10:31 amName goes with the blog. Was she just guessing? Seems so. Wouldn’t be terrible to show the detective, however.
SarahW (af7312) — 7/2/2011 @ 10:32 amThis is a bit of an aside but has anyone looked at RBrynaert twitter today? So weird
Blackburnsghost (2ffb0c) — 7/2/2011 @ 10:36 amalso I’m not getting the connection with this picture?
If you don’t think some caution about JGMA’s identity is necessary in a context where it is supposed the hoaxer (lees caller) is a liar, and a liar who fakes identities and identification documents, you are silly.
SarahW (af7312) — 7/2/2011 @ 10:39 amIf you don’t think some caution about JGMA’s identity is necessary in a context where it is supposed the hoaxer (lees caller) is a liar, and a liar who fakes identities and identification documents, you are silly.
Yes, it’s entirely possible that JGMA is just a victim. And if that’s the case then JGCA’s point about “veering into potential vigilantism” is really not that far off the mark. In any case, caution certainly can do no harm.
It’s entirely possible that JGMA is:
1) The person in the writing class
2) The person who filed the police report
But is NOT:
1) The person who called Lee
2) The SockPuppeteer
3) Alicia Pain, (et al.)
It’s also possible that she could even be the SockPuppeteer (which may be marignally unethical, but is certainly not illegal) and still be in no other way involved.
piglet (1bb7dc) — 7/2/2011 @ 11:03 amA)I believe the woman who called Lee on 6/19 claimed to be Jenny George. I do not believe Lee lies.
B)I believe the woman filing a police report in Boston some time between 6/19 and 6/26 claiming she had received death threats from Lee Stranahan also claimed to be named Jenny George.
lamchopsl A therefore = B
Daley, SarahW, koam show your work to prove claim A=B
Stranahan on BTR radio last night – I have been too busy going down rabbit holes and getting yelled at to document my work.
lamchopsl A=B
Shoot me now.
Stranahan – If you don’t think I’ve proved my conclusion, suggest an alternate rational explanation.
Stranahan – Why are you people suggesting crazy alternate scenarios?
Stranahan
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/2/2011 @ 11:06 amThe order at the end got a little garbled there.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/2/2011 @ 11:07 am458. Blackburnsghost
I noticed the same thing earlier but got sidetracked. Pure paranoia, plus it looks like people are eschewing him. That’s understandable given his recent strange behavior. He seem to be lashing out at everybody trying to get anybody to contact him. If it isn’t drug induced, it’s classic clinical.
lamchopsl (a91fe8) — 7/2/2011 @ 11:12 amAny metadata in those pics that might offer clues?
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/2/2011 @ 11:12 amWell, one obvious sign that the blog post dated 6/30/2010 is suspect relates to the filename of the Jennifer Lopez image:
But all that dated filename proves is that the post has been edited after or around April 2011. Has anyone else found any other indicators for that post’s actual date?
h2u (0025d1) — 7/2/2011 @ 11:20 amh2u
It is a blatant misdate. Most probably only the year is changed from 2011 to 2010. Biggest clue as to the lacking merit is that the person used “JG?” as the picture’s title (when you hover over it). Clearly the person isn’t sure and may have just found the picture in the same manner as koam a week ago.
Crispian (70c05e) — 7/2/2011 @ 11:26 amCrispian, I am absolutely convinced you’re correct — but this whole investigation has been marred by the lack of convincing proof for a significant amount of “known facts.” The more clear-cut evidence we have, the better.
h2u (0025d1) — 7/2/2011 @ 11:28 amI have been following this story more closely in the last few weeks than I’d admit to anyone outside the circle of this readership. The story and sleuthing by Lee et al brought me to this blog which I didn’t read otherwise. I am intrigued as much by the characters and dynamics as the motivation and actions. I can’t wait to get home and see what happened while I was gone. “Yes,” I whisper, “I am a weineraholic.”
I’ve spent the last few days trying to get the story and mystery clear in my head—no easy task when post comments hit the 400+ mark. I am sketchy on some of the conversations and who did what as weinergate was unfolding so perhaps amid work this holiday weekend, I’ll jump back and refresh myself. I am not sure there are answers there but I fear my addiction will force me to return. Until then.. I have defined for myself what I care about.. and what I don’t.
Here are the questions that I don’t find relevant to my understanding:
1.Is the professor/Lew Hunter real? – or more accurately is he who/what he’s presented as. First of all, I find it odd that a character (or real person) would offer up a professor as verification of his/her authenticity. I was pretty close with a handful of my professors and advisors—in very small schools/programs and never would it occur to me, even while enrolled, to use a professor to say I am who I say I am. When I need to prove I am who I say I am, I use proper ID– a DL, a passport. My bank isnt likely to take the word of my professor, my friend or my own mother. They want real identification to link my person to my action.
Secondly, he’s not really provided any real information. Perhaps some insight—but even if he is real and does know the same JG who is believed to have been operating the Nikki Reid accounts, who contacted Lee and who reported death threats to BPD, his impression is still subjective and based on limited interaction. We’re not talking an old family friend here—we’re talking a professor—a leader of a workshop. Where he would be of great value is if someone had a photo of the JG who made the police report—or of screen capture of a skype convo JG as she was talking to Lee. That photo doesn’t exist as far as I know. It’s in the “wouldn’t it be great if we had … “ bucket. Without it– LH serves no purpose.
OK.. there was only one. It feels like there should be more that doesnt matter.
eman (0c693d) — 7/2/2011 @ 11:35 amI agree h2u. I think every bit of evidence needs to be taken with a grain of salt as any piece can be misdirection by a troll. That is why so many of us are skeptical about the identity of JGMA. Even assuming Lee is absolutely right that JG is JG is JG…is she relevant to the story or not? Why aren’t we finding that that out if we know who she is?
I think there is a split between those who think this mystery can be solved in a linear fashion, taking evidence at face value; and those of us who are happy to leave everything up in the air until it all snaps into place, letting any extraneous bits of information then fall away.
I’m a mere spectator but it does seem wise to follow the latter route. But in any event, both Poirot and Scooby Doo solved mysteries in their own way – even though the latter sometimes involved pulling off mask after mask.
Crispian (70c05e) — 7/2/2011 @ 11:44 am461. daleyrocks
Would be great to have the actual timing of the list of events that I posted earlier.
Evidence that A=B might include that JG gave JP the name of Prof Lew Hunter and also gave that to Detective (perhaps to desk sergeant?) but without timing, we don’t know if she could have learned of the Lew Hunter referral from Lee online before naming Lew Hunter to BPD.
Same goes for other things Lee said JG said on phone, all learnable online and coulda been parroted by a 2nd JG who went to police.
However we believe the JG who went to police is very likely the real JG as it’s been deduced that she must have had to verify her identity to BPD more than once and that they likely do independent verification on claimants.
We need the timing.
koam @wittier (62b38e) — 7/2/2011 @ 11:45 am465 h2u
why does date of post matter now? as long as it’s not really a year ago, then we know that it was intentionally mis-dated to mislead us. And now it’s gone.
koam @wittier (62b38e) — 7/2/2011 @ 11:48 amThe JGMA who went to Boston PD is real. No question. I just wonder if it is necessarily true that the JG that called Lee is the same person.
If JGMA had an old twitter account that included personal information, and it was co-opted by someone who later contacted her making threats as “Lee’s follower,” wouldn’t the person making the threats to JGMA be able to impersonate her well enough in a call to Lee?
1. They would have enough personal information about her to identify themselves as that person on a call to Lee.
2. They would have the details about the threatening call, since they were the one that made it, including what JGMA would likely report to police.
If I don’t have all the details and there is more to it, fine, but from what I have read here, just because a JGMA says similar things to the Boston PD as Lee’s caller doesn’t necessarily make them the same person.
Considering we have been dealing with fake personalities for weeks I think better verification is necessary.
CausticConservative (b29599) — 7/2/2011 @ 11:54 amI’m skeptical of just about every single “fact” asserted by Stranahan or Preston… There has not been nearly enough verification to warrant many of the statements uttered by both.
h2u (0025d1) — 7/2/2011 @ 11:55 am474 eman
the reasoning wanders from “Is Lew Hunter real?” to “why would she use Lew Hunter as reference?” to “it doesn’t matter what Lew Hunter says.”
1) Lew Hunter is real. It’s possible, but very unlikely that both Lee and Preston talked to a fakey Lew Hunter and Mrs. Lew Hunter.
2) To students, famous professors are the most prominent people they deal with on a regular basis. Just because you wouldn’t use a professor as a reference, doesn’t mean this woman in her early 20s wouldn’t. I certainly used professors as references all the time at that age. The professors liked me and their prominence added credibility for me.
3) Lew Hunter can confirm that there is a real JG and some factual and subjective info about JG. It doesn’t prove that the caller was the real JG. The caller could have been someone with knowledge of JG’s life pretending to be JG and also running the starchild account. But it’s more likely that she is just JG.
koam @wittier (62b38e) — 7/2/2011 @ 11:57 amI’m honestly just interested in cementing down as many facts as possible regarding the timing involved in this entire affair. In this particular instance, I’ve seen numerous assertions that the post is misdated but I’d really like to see the evidence verifying that.
Right now the only factual evidence I’ve seen is the date of the J-Lo photo. And all that can actually prove is that the post was *edited* sometime after April 2011. There are other clues that suggest the post was created with the back-date of June 30, 2010, but I’d like to see the facts.
What else do we have?
h2u (0025d1) — 7/2/2011 @ 11:59 amh2u,
I have to run, but I saw that “Hover” as well. I thought it an interesting notation of some kind.
Gennette was/is claiming to be searching for the identities. It is still not clear if she was working with others. Some suggest RAW himself.
Could the people here be covering ground that someone else has aready covered?
cap'n john's nephew (d29614) — 7/2/2011 @ 12:06 pm“Yes,” I whisper, “I am a weineraholic.”
hahaha I think I peed my pants…so.funny.
lambchps
Blackburnsghost (2ffb0c) — 7/2/2011 @ 12:11 pmIt’s scary and sad
Just thinking out loud. I found it intriguing.
cap'n john's nephew (d29614) — 7/2/2011 @ 12:12 pmThat is all.
Oh, and Blackburnsghost, I haven’t forgotten your questions to me. I havn’t been ignoring you.
Not sure of branches, but the connection would have to be long before.
Ok, I’m leaving for now… Really!
cap'n john's nephew (d29614) — 7/2/2011 @ 12:16 pmkoam 477
1. I am not asking the question is LH real. I am saying I dont think the question is relevant. I have no reason to doubt he’s real.. however, some here have questioned whether he’s who we think he is. JP definitely questioned that according to Lee.
2. While I surely used professors as references for jobs, credibility in my field, applications to grad schools, I wouldn’t have offered one up to the police. I surely wouldn’t have used a professor who ran an out-of-state WORKSHOP. He wasnt her advisor.. or even someone she took many classes with. She stayed at his home while taking a seminar. Perhaps they are now best buds. Perhaps that would change my mind. The fact remains, I find it odd.
3. Agreed. LH did provide some facts and some subjective info about a woman who took his workshop. He can’t, however, confirm the link from his student to the JGMA who is starchild111 or who called Lee or who filed a BPD report. LH can’t prove anything of value.
eman (176a86) — 7/2/2011 @ 12:17 pmSo now Lee is trolling everyone following this to prove a point? Great.
Noodles (3681c4) — 7/2/2011 @ 1:58 pmThe arguments are getting more ridiculous each hour.
koam @wittier (62b38e) — 7/2/2011 @ 2:00 pm326,27,28,29…I do not know why he has a problem with me. He wants a sacrificial lamb and figures that I will sit back and take it. Posting that he knows that I ” did this and that and he knows it” just makes him look stupid. Based on his history and him calling Greg Howard’s children ” F–k–le”during “Twittergate”proves that he has some issues.
goatsred (b20383) — 7/2/2011 @ 2:29 pmIm just sitting back and watching him self destruct.
==There are no iron-clad facts. There are only degrees of certainty==
Congrats Crispian– you just received the same sermon I got 24 hours ago. In fact (as you are acutely aware) a few of us have been discussing the same basic issue about proof and verification on this same thread for almost 36 hours now. Crazy!
As an aside, most everyone (I think) recognizes that good people can have different mental processes that guide their lives and thought patterns. Some us us are detail oriented–some are more oriented to the big picture. Some tend to be more trusting, some people even can be considered gullible– others are more leery by nature, some people are suspicious to a fault. Some people are convinced through linear logic–other folks are inspired by stream-of- consciousness creativity. Some people see humor almost everything–others have just had a more serious and sensitive side probably since birth. All of these traits have been exhibited at various times by various commenters on this blog. Great. Shows we’re human and are engaged in this story.
That said, what I just don’t get is this, though: As far as I can see from reviewing the comments nobody really is telling lam (or Lee or Temper) to change their minds about their theories or demanding they accept other storyline possibilities. Yet lam, for instance, seems focused, intent, dare we say obsessed, in trying to get other commenters (including daily, SarahW, you, me, Maybee) to accept his (Lee’s) version exclusively without respecting whatever verification any of us individually might feel we need in order to comfortably do so. Why? Even if lam is satisfied and does not himself feel any need for more background verification, why is he apparently so personally offended if others see loose ends they’d still like to tie down?
Bottom line–What is the end game? What if every single commenter here in unison said of Lee’s (not fully fleshed out in writing) Weinergate sock theory, “The Science is Settled!” Then what would happen next? Is there a next step? Does it involve light bulbs and energy credits?
elissa (27a5d6) — 7/2/2011 @ 2:58 pmI cant know if Lee’s theory is the right one, but it’s the most or only plausible one right now in my view.
Time will tell.
The contradiction between Lew H “She’s very liberal politically” and the JG who called Lee “I’m just into reality shows, I know nothing about politics” tells us they’re not coordinated/co-conspirators.
Temper Tantrum (02fe1b) — 7/2/2011 @ 3:13 pm“Why?”
elissa – [Using my James Earl Jones voice] What are you trying to say, my dear?
I just figured we have new bunch of Obama voters commenting, which is a good thing, but that we have not dumbed down the content of comments far enough to where they can comprehend them.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/2/2011 @ 3:28 pmWhy would some hoaxer use a real identity ( JG ) behind the twitter starchild , to later change it to Nikki reed?
Temper Tantrum (02fe1b) — 7/2/2011 @ 3:30 pmWhy would that hoaxer be prepared to release very specific information on JG ( Lew H connection ) ?
Was this planned by the hoaxer that someone would track back the starchild account to JG by first finding out the jenay name and the connection to JG?
When did the hoaxer plan to frame JG?
487 elissa.
“Conjecture is over.”
koam @wittier (62b38e) — 7/2/2011 @ 3:40 pmElissa , someone could ask Lew H what JG looks like ,and ask the same to the police who saw JG MA and filed the report.
Temper Tantrum (02fe1b) — 7/2/2011 @ 3:46 pm487. elisia
I am not personally offended by others’ opinions. I am typically responding to other people who are challenging mine. I usually don’t comment on the comments advocating extreme due diligence. That’s OK by me. I do feel when everybody is doing it on this fourm, it starts to make it look a little kooky. But I don’t feel I have to advertise my point of view, or continually harp on the subject. And I have not accepted Lee’s conclusions as facts. But i do think he has a reasonable approach to distinguishing the sublime from the absurd.
lamchopsl (a91fe8) — 7/2/2011 @ 4:06 pmWe need to refute questioned testimony with specific evidentiary facts.
That someone’s statements don’t fit the popular theory isn’t what makes them lies.
We also have to remember that we are getting a lot of testimony second-hand. Someone saying what someone else said or meant. This can be misleading.
koam @wittier (62b38e) — 7/2/2011 @ 4:41 pmWhen Patterico was pushing on JR, the walls started shaking, ghosts flew out of the closets, and the Devil himself appeared. Everody ran to the rabbit hole, while Pat stayed with the source.
cap'n john's nephew (28dda5) — 7/2/2011 @ 4:58 pm“The Science is Settled!” Then what would happen next? Is there a next step? Does it involve light bulbs and energy credits?
Oh how I love this comment. With my entire stash of incancesdents.
Blackburnsghost (2ffb0c) — 7/2/2011 @ 5:14 pm“The Science is Settled” That’s hilarious.
First it was the Koch brothers circle of crazy fun and now we’ve got AGW. That’s two awesome loops in leftie craziness. Bulging briefs cause global warming AGW Anthony’s Global Warming. We might be on to something here as the conspiracy heads out for another lap.
Johnny 5 is alive (5ccc5e) — 7/2/2011 @ 5:31 pmComment by Blackburnsghost — 7/2/2011 @ 9:56 am
I took your lead and went over there and looked at all of those articles and my name being in all of them.It has just made me more aware of all of the defamation that Neal “Stranded Wind” is causing to be attached to my name I want to thank you for pointing this out to me. I have been staying away from the Commie Rag he spews his hate in because I have just experienced his lies and slander for two months now.
goatsred (b20383) — 7/2/2011 @ 6:08 pmHe is an evil organism.
Do you think he’s Sourshoes’ brother?
koam @wittier (62b38e) — 7/2/2011 @ 6:19 pmA question here as to motive for followers of Patterico’s theory. It is at least the case that the starchild111 account owner who, writing under a false avatar, went to lengths to get Weiner to follow him/her is the same person who tried to have it reported that Breitbart was asking him/her to lie.
Clearly this person does not like Breitbart, but how does obsessing over Weiner under false pretenses fit the theory of a sting on Breitbart? All of that effort just to be able to seem to have the goods? And the seeking Weiner campaign began when Weiner was following fewer than 100 people. Weiner does not look like a means to an end for starchild111 – he looks like the end itself.
So again, what motive do you see behind the sweep of starchild’s actions from the start of his/her pursuit of Weiner?
Nathan Wagner (39d8fb) — 7/2/2011 @ 7:28 pm“Clearly this person does not like Breitbart, but how does obsessing over Weiner under false pretenses fit the theory of a sting on Breitbart?”
Nathan – If the purpose of the sting is to embarrass Breitbart by getting him to bite on a false smear of Weiner, I don’t follow the rest of your comment. The account was only speaking with Ginger and Gennette about politics for a couple of months before Weiner outed himself with the dic pic.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/2/2011 @ 7:37 pm@500 Nathan Wagner
Love for Weiner and hatred of Breitbart isn’t mutually exclusive nor do I think starchild111’s initial motives were to destroy Breitbart, but rather, to get close to Weiner. Breitbart was only accused when starchild felt that a politician he/she beloved was being brought into negative limelight unnecessarily by Breitbart. Only when Weiner confessed and Breitbart was vindicated did the Reid’s story begin to change.
rogerthat (f5aad4) — 7/2/2011 @ 7:47 pmThe account was speaking with ginger and genette precisely because they were being followed by Weiner. I want you to tell me how you read the motive for that.
Nathan Wagner (2d2146) — 7/2/2011 @ 7:51 pmRogerthat, I agree. But in that case the starchild Weiner seeking was not part of a sting on Breitbart. Isn’t that contrary to the theory Pat hints at?
Nathan Wagner (2d2146) — 7/2/2011 @ 8:03 pm#487 – elissa, you wrote:
It’s been a busy day, but coming in where I left off last night, you seem to have it right.
At some point, there has to be a way to settle if JG who called Lee is identical to JG who filed the police report (investigation dropped, I see) or not. Just as a for-instance.
It’s gotten crazy, all right.
Dianna (f12db5) — 7/2/2011 @ 8:13 pmNikki was following GC, GL AND Ethel. All three Discussing weiner. All initiated by Nikki
az5thdstrct (e76e6a) — 7/2/2011 @ 8:26 pmwow.
Patterico is still on this?
The Wingularity is near.
wheeler's cat (e1af5e) — 7/2/2011 @ 8:29 pm@506 – Yes, precisely. Motive?
Nathan Wagner (bc92ce) — 7/2/2011 @ 8:31 pm“The account was speaking with ginger and genette precisely because they were being followed by Weiner. I want you to tell me how you read the motive for that.”
Nathan – To me, the DM’s speak for themselves – How did you get Weiner to follow you?, etc. Build credibility before the sting. No mystery. TommyX bought that they were real people.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/2/2011 @ 8:31 pmdaleyrocks, let’s talk about this. I realize these are basic questions, but (1) what credibility? and (2) how is the sting intended to go down?
Nathan Wagner (bc92ce) — 7/2/2011 @ 8:35 pm#508
Should be fairly obvious. Nikki’s twitter account as it went from starchild in name to Nikki Reid in name was GL. (march)
March is when GL started DMing with wiener. Nikki followed GL and tweeted GL about weiner.
az5thdstrct (e76e6a) — 7/2/2011 @ 8:35 pmLeft out…
Nikki’s FIRST NEW twitter FOLLOWER on her account as it went from starchild in name to Nikki Reid in name was GL. (march)
az5thdstrct (e76e6a) — 7/2/2011 @ 8:37 pmaz5thdstrct,
Nathan Wagner (bc92ce) — 7/2/2011 @ 8:40 pmOkay, so are you saying the purpose of the account was to establish a relationship with Weiner – or was the purpose something larger?
Gennette, while doing an investigation, felt something was up with Nikki, then conversed with Nikki for a considerable period of time. Gennette claims that during those conversations, Nikki never brought up Weiner. So, Gennette brought up Wiener to Nikki first, eventually encouraging Nikki to contact Weiner and ask him to follow.
cap'n john's nephew (28dda5) — 7/2/2011 @ 8:41 pm#513
I’m saying to gather info on Weiner. With the info dumps from JR9, there’s info on weiner, right?
Much of it not positive. Supposed GC/AW flirting that GC explains. More DM’s with cursing to Nikki etc
az5thdstrct (e76e6a) — 7/2/2011 @ 8:47 pmOkay, az5thdstrct, gathering info on Weiner for what purpose?
Nathan Wagner (bc92ce) — 7/2/2011 @ 8:49 pm#516
I have my theory. If you want to continue to discuss yours, I’ll read it
az5thdstrct (e76e6a) — 7/2/2011 @ 8:50 pmMy point, here, is that I have a hard time with Pat’s theory – which I understand to be that the account was intended as a sting to get Breitbart.
But if Pat’s theory is correct, it seems to me that the Weiner obsession tail is wagging the Breitbart sting dog.
Nathan Wagner (bc92ce) — 7/2/2011 @ 8:54 pm2. While I surely used professors as references for jobs, credibility in my field, applications to grad schools, I wouldn’t have offered one up to the police. I surely wouldn’t have used a professor who ran an out-of-state WORKSHOP
Yes, the idea of JG having offered her workshop professor as a reference to the police really makes no sense at all. (And on all kinds of different levels).
Surely the police would not normally ask for references from someone reporting a crime (especially in the South End of Boston).
And surely if the victim of an alleged threat were to give the police the name of someone to vouch for their credibility, the police would not normally give that person’s name to anyone they called in the course of their investigation.
If the professors name was mentioned by JG, the only thing that makes sense is that it was mentioned as part of the events surrounding the incident. For example, she may have mentioned (if she was aware of it) that the twitter account opened under her name had been connected to her via the fact she was following the professor Hunter’s writing program. Or perhaps (if she was aware of it) that LS had contacted this professor about her.
Of course, not everything in this story _does_ make senses, so who knows – maybe she just mentions his name to everyone she meets. It would certainly be odd for the police to do to same though.
Johnathan Creek (1bb7dc) — 7/2/2011 @ 8:56 pmNathan – Motive – Sting Breitbart with false Weiner smear. Am I going too fast?
I sting going to be more credible coming from admitted Weiner fans and correspondents who are disappointed in his conduct or from rabid conservatives? Am I going too fast?
“Much of it not positive.”
az5thdstrct Lee kept making references to negative info. Can you elaborate?
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/2/2011 @ 9:00 pm#487 elissa,
Well said!
Crispian (70c05e) — 7/2/2011 @ 9:05 pmdaleyrocks, your pace is just fine. So the account owner’s plan is supposed to go down like this:
(1) Establish account under false pretenses (i.e. pretend to be high school girl)
(2) Develop relationships with women Weiner follows in order to find out how to get Weiner to follow the account.
(3) Get Weiner follow.
(4) Go to Breitbart with fake dirt.
(5) Reveal it was a farce after Breitbart publishes.
Is that it?
Nathan Wagner (bc92ce) — 7/2/2011 @ 9:08 pmDaleyRocks
Not stating all negative, but some. If you have time, go back thru the info dump with negative in mind. Maybe you’ll see more/less than I did. IMO, it’s masked at times because it was presented with a focus towards GC.
JR9 did not have a context of the GC/Weiner DM’s that “appear” to be flirty DMs. GC claims she was suspicious of Nikki, so she presented flirty in that context.
without that context via JR9, flirty was flirty and a supposed DM convo with GC/AW flirting. At least via GC with multiple DMs
There was the discovery of more than just two DMs between AW/Nikki. In fact, many more. Including cursing to a supposed minor.
There was JR’s answer regarding wife’s statement:
Unfortunately my wife does not stand by her letter. It was actually Patterico’s story on Ethel that causedus to question our daughter’s claim of only 2 DM’s between her and Rep Weiner. After Patterico’s story uncovered the discrepancy of Ethel saying there were 2 DM’s when later on itturned out to be 5 or 6, my wife and I questioned this.Thanks to Patterico, we realized we were in the same situation as Ethel and her parents. There weremore DM’s that Nikki did not want us to see. We gave Rep Weiner the benefit of the doubt at the time when my wife wrote her statement.Now we are disturbed about some of the content. Although we don’t want to jump to any conclusions.Since so many people have jumped to conclusions throughout this ordeal, it wouldn’t be fair.
az5thdstrct (e76e6a) — 7/2/2011 @ 9:26 pmNathan @522 – Did not 1-4 happen, with an intermediary in #4?
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/2/2011 @ 9:31 pmaz5thdstrct – I completely discount JR9 statements since they were made after dic pic appeared.
I don’t really care about GC’s impression of Nikki either.
I’m looking for negative stuff about Weiner from Reids prior to dic pic appearing. Dic pic was a game changer. I’m not recalling negatives but will look.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/2/2011 @ 9:38 pmMistakes were made.
And possibly the single biggest mistake (except, of course for the actual dic pic tweet) was whoever had the brilliant idea for the bizarre pro Weiner-anti Breitbart contact by “Betty’s mom” which resulted in the first Tommy Christopher article on June 3. That was both a huge mistake and a big tell as to motive. At that point you will recall that Weiner was still denying all, was swinging from interview to interview and was getting strong support from the progressive blogosphere. So, for a couple of days it looked like Betty’s mom had further shored up AW’s reputation as an innocent, involved, misunderstood social media aficionado who had somehow gotten pranked. So far, so good. Right wing internet “harassers” and Breitbart are still in the bullseye even though Tommy did play down that angle.
But all that fell apart just a couple days later. When Weiner tearfully admitted much (but not all) on June 6, the Betty mom story suddenly started to look ridiculous and kind of hokey to just about everybody– people started sniffing around–and Tommy eventually had to admit he’d been had. Then, even more damaging pictures came out and Weiner finally announced his resignation.
From that point on almost all that has happened has revolved around the mysterious starchild and its relationship with Gennette and others. It appears to be about backpedaling and finessing to cover or explain away its role in the whole Betty mom fiasco with Tommy, including the falsified documents and false personas. The death threats add drama when people start digging too deep.
Just think. Had “Betty’s mom” not voluntarily come forward with her crazy “IT’s all lies–LIES I tell you!”story, Tommy would probably not have written his infamous story. Or, if he had done basic journalistic research which might have taken a few more days, his Betty mom story might have still been in his computer, and would not already have been out there to cause trouble when Weiner confessed.
Would very many of us, besides Lee and Goatsred, still be talking about multiple socks and hacks and fake dogs and sinister theories and twitter meltdowns and ancient professors had “Betty’s mom” just kept her damn mouth shut? I kind of doubt it. Good job there, Mrs. Reid whoever you are.
Happy fireworks and picnics and freedom, everybody.
elissa (27a5d6) — 7/2/2011 @ 9:38 pmDaleyrocks
If you look at #515, I’m making it clear I’m referring to info dumps
az5thdstrct (e76e6a) — 7/2/2011 @ 9:45 pmdaleyrocks, thanks for your patience. I’m going to let loose with my thoughts, now.
In direct response to your #524 – If (4) happened, it happened only after Weinergate broke.
But more broadly, I wanted to hear you actually lay the theory out and think about the motives, both so that I was clear on what you believed the plan was and so that we could discuss some of the steps directly.
I find the theory to be far-fetched. I think that the theory’s Breitbart-sting tail is wagging the evidence’s Weiner-obsession dog. A few points:
(A) If the bait is to be ostensible inappropriate DM’s between Weiner and a young woman, you need to set things up to protect Weiner. If Weiner falls into this and he believes the girl to be in HS, then, even if Breitbart is stung, it can still look bad for him – all the more so since his other follows will be examined closely. To protect Weiner, you need at least to chose a more innocuous persona. starchild111 did not.
(B) Because some of Weiner’s behavior is already questionable – following GL – a sting on Breitbart will shine a spotlight on it. There’s too much uncomfortable truth in the matter to make this a politically wise sting operation.
(C) starchild111’s interest in the women Weiner followed seems well beyond the purpose of the proposed plot. She wanted details of what they were talking about – real, not fake, dirt. But for the sting, the only thing starchild111 would have needed to be interested in is how to be followed by Weiner.
(D) Just generally, the starchild111 pattern looks like the pattern of someone obsessed with Weiner. It does not look to me as if Weiner was merely a means to end for starchild111 – it looks to me like Weiner was the main event. To make Breitbart the focus of all of this is, it seems to me, to take the evidence of starchild111’s purpose in a direction it does not point.
Take that for what it’s worth.
Nathan Wagner (bc92ce) — 7/2/2011 @ 10:13 pm“If you look at #515, I’m making it clear I’m referring to info dumps”
az5thdstrct – I was not trying to be critical. Sorry if you interpreted tone that way.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/2/2011 @ 10:15 pm“In direct response to your #524 – If (4) happened, it happened only after Weinergate broke.”
Nathan – Thanks for the replies. #4 did happen and is documented. I need to refresh myself on the timeline.
We will have to disagree on the rest.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/2/2011 @ 10:21 pmI have a new post up about not making assumptions.
I’m seeing a lot of careless assumptions lately. And a lot of “I don’t need to see the evidence because I know everything” sort of attitudes.
I happen to be trained in sticking to the evidence. So if you see anyone making a claim about what I supposedly think, I ask you to consider: does Patterico ACTUALLY think that? Or is someone simply CLAIMING that he thinks that?
I have been quite clear about what I think. There have been sock puppets mimicking me and people trying to put words in my mouth. Don’t believe them. Be skeptical.
For example, I hear that Neal Rauhauser is shopping around claims about me based upon the word of Brett Kimberlin, a convicted bomber who blew off a man’s leg who later committed suicide.
Well, you might be inclined to disbelieve Neal, but you might be inclined to believe someone else who says: “Oh, I privately heard Patterico say x, y, or z.” Because maybe you think that person is trusted by me.
Well, you don’t know who I trust. So please. Don’t make assumptions.
Hi, Neal!
Patterico (f724ca) — 7/3/2011 @ 1:11 amI have one thing to add.
Even hackers are “real” people.
They may impersonate people on the Internet. They may lead a shadowy existence. They may mimic others; provide fake identification; tell lies; spoof phone numbers . . . all sorts of things.
But they are real people. They are not Martians. If they commit crimes, and you catch them, there will be a flesh and blood person behind bars.
I would caution anyone interested in this story (and public about their interest) to exercise caution. Assume there may be hackers who want to target you. This is not paranoia. It is basic safety.
Patterico (f724ca) — 7/3/2011 @ 1:17 amOkay helping a bit along the way to 1,000.
Mike Myers (0e06a9) — 7/3/2011 @ 3:22 amAn update to my previous post:
UPDATE: Lee Stranahan may be completely right about his theory that a woman with the initials “JG” is behind everything that has happened. He really may. But I have been reading his posts, and listening to his radio show with the yowling cat, and I know he has been saying and implying things about me that are simply not accurate. I have tried to remain silent about this, but I am listening to his radio show from last night and hearing how he misrepresents my position on all of this, and I can remain silent no longer.
I disabled his account here at patterico.com on Thursday night, after I read this post of his, in which he ridiculously accused me of providing JohnReid9 with an uncritical platform to spout lies:
The implication that I have been somehow supportive of JohnReid9 is totally false. I have been publicly agnostic on JohnReid9 for my own reasons. For Lee to insinuate that I am a dupe, in the manner of a Tommy Christopher, was absurd and false. I was shocked and appalled to see such an accusation from someone with access to post on my blog. So I disabled his account.
I decided to remain silent about it, until I fully listened to his latest radio show, where he discussed private communications with me, and continued to portray my positions in a misleading fashion.
I’m not going to say more, as I have a feeling that I would regret anything else I said.
Patterico (f724ca) — 7/3/2011 @ 3:51 amIt’s bad enough to have a Neal Rauhauser go around acting like I am “falling for” something that I EXPLICITLY DISCLAIMED any vouching for. To have it said by someone who was a guest blogger here — it just didn’t work.
Patterico (f724ca) — 7/3/2011 @ 3:54 amI’m still listening to this show. This, compared with some other things that happened tonight . . .
Yeah, I’m really tempted to say something I regret. So I won’t.
Some people think they’re really, really smart, and don’t realize how they have been played. We’ll leave it at that. There will be documentary proof at the appropriate time.
Patterico (f724ca) — 7/3/2011 @ 3:59 amLee clearly doesn’t understand the concept of giving someone enough rope to let him to hang himself with.
Andy (6ba927) — 7/3/2011 @ 4:34 amI’ve been following this site everyday since the wiener scandal but this is my 1st time to comment. I have listened to Lee’s show and found it interesting but I also feel he is “locked into” his own theory. Things seem to be changing everyday and I am impatiently waiting to see what comes about with the police reports. Let’s get this thread to 1,000.
Happy Trails (f63b95) — 7/3/2011 @ 4:41 amlamchop@451-
I can’t speak for larger agencies, but in small towns an ID is requested just to make taking the report easier to initially fill in all of the little boxes (i.e. it is easier to copy info from the ID rather than keep asking, “How do you spell that?” and, “What is your…?”). Reports can and have been taken when ID is unavailable for some reason or another (otherwise you’d never be able to report your wallet stolen).
In the 35 yrs I worked for a small town agency, we never initially demanded an ID before a report was initiated. Identities were confirmed through law enforcement computer systems if nothing else was available.
roy in nipomo (bca582) — 7/3/2011 @ 4:49 amElissa–I am a little slow, and all due respect, I cannot totally grasp the context of this sentence. Can you just explain my part in it??
“Would very many of us, besides Lee and Goatsred, still be talking about multiple socks and hacks and fake dogs and sinister theories and twitter meltdowns and ancient professors had “Betty’s mom” just kept her damn mouth shut? I kind of doubt it. Good job there, Mrs. Reid whoever you are?”
goatsred (b20383) — 7/3/2011 @ 5:35 amStranahan’s petulance has become obvious in the past few days.
Birdbath (19803d) — 7/3/2011 @ 5:36 am(540)Because I am far from “sockpuppeting” anyone.
goatsred (b20383) — 7/3/2011 @ 5:38 amI know the very real people that I am dealing with. Believe me.
Oh boy, is this great! -Flounder
Tutu (54ce64) — 7/3/2011 @ 5:43 amLee is somewhat of a loose cannon.
As many have noted, he is disorganized and has difficulty identifying for the reader and listener the difference between established facts and his speculations.
I am still very interested in the story. I am just waiting for Pat, Lee, and others provide credible evidence concerning the identities of Jennifer, Nikki Reid, JohnReid9, Marinela Alicea, @PatriotUSA76, Dan Wolfe, Alicia Pain, et al.
slp (f9a160) — 7/3/2011 @ 5:44 amI’m beginning to think that this entire opera is being orchestrated by the guys who produce and direct Damages. Quirky characters, great scripts, and some of the best acting I’ve ever seen on television.
Old Coot (b14047) — 7/3/2011 @ 5:50 amRegarding rift between Pat & Lee:
Sad news. I think Lee accused Pat of saying things Pat didn’t say. Lee has way of turning his own theories into hard facts in his own mind. There is real value in having a neutral platform where the John Reid documents can be exposed and roundly investigated, and criticized, as each one has been, and, as many have said, including Pat, that Reid can be given enough rope. What could be more valuable than the open interviewing thread mode for John Reid, including the chorus of criticism in the comments? Pat deserves credit for obtaining that. I have been posting for a long time that it’s valuable to have both Lee’s impassioned take on this and Pat’s methodical take and to have critical and productive interaction between them. Both have done very hard work on this. The record shows that Lee escalated the accusations and emotions, as is his way of doing things. I’ve asked Lee publicly in many comments not to estrange Pat in this way as it could remove that great “two-sides-of-the-same-coin” dynamic that we’ve enjoyed. Pat being so busy with his job and not posting as much has left a vacuum in which Lee has kept thinking that Pat is against him, like when the wife goes to Vegas with the girls and doesn’t return phone calls, the imagination wanders. Pat’s not against Lee and he’s not against finding the real truth, backed by evidence.
Let’s hope this is temporary and they can work it out.
koam @wittier (e74ff0) — 7/3/2011 @ 5:52 amTypical Lee post: I’m right, I know stuff that you don’t, which I’m not going to tell you about, and you’re wrong.
Sorta pointless after a while.
Tutu (54ce64) — 7/3/2011 @ 6:03 am547 Tutu
You noticed that ?
koam @wittier (e74ff0) — 7/3/2011 @ 6:05 amkoam @wittier – I think I can also point to at least three socks in these threads pushing Lee’s POV.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/3/2011 @ 6:06 amThere’s no evidence that the very smart Patterico entertains Ron’s thoughts for one second. That would be totally out of character for Pat.
I don’t buy the Patterico theory at the top of this thread that the JG who called Lee was a hoaxer. Lee would have a better sense for that and Lee’s not saying she was a hoaxer. It seems to me like it’s the real JG MA who called Lee and talked to Preston several times.
I also don’t buy Lee’s theory that the JG MA who called him is the sock puppet mistress, because I don’t think it’s proven with facts. (It might someday be, but has not been at all yet.) I question the components of that call that Lee has labeled as lies because he doesn’t distinguish between factual lies (proven wrong by evidence, not opinion) and “it doesn’t fit my theory” “lies” (which aren’t lies by my standard).
I think we still need to consider an innocent JG scenario and then try to poke holes in that based on facts.
So if an innocent and truly scared JG called Lee, fearing for her life, do you think she hung up feeling better about the situation, or a whole lot worse? And after talking to Preston, does an innocent JG, who is scared of Lee, feel safer regarding Lee or Lee’s followers? Lee with the blogs and radio show saying JG is guilty every day because he’s known it all along and the story has leaked that JG may be “troubled”? Do you think Preston made an innocent JG feel better about Lee? We know now how the Lee-Preston relationship has turned out.
And then what does the scared JG do? She goes to the cops.
So we need to take that JG story and see what just cannot be true (based on hard facts) about it and whether those issues make us not believe her at all. Then, in that case, is she a fake or is she behind some or all of the alleged socks.
koam @wittier (e74ff0) — 7/3/2011 @ 6:22 amYeah, koam, if it’s 2 sides of the same coin, Pat’s is worth 23¢ and Lee’s side is worth 2¢. For what it’s worth.
Tutu (54ce64) — 7/3/2011 @ 6:25 amWell, there is evidence Patterico is buying into Rons theory .. Read the theory here and read Patterco’s entusism for it .
Then, go talk to Ron about it.
Same theory. QED
Lee Stranahan (708cc3) — 7/3/2011 @ 6:26 amIt is very hard for me to keep track of the facts as opposed to the speculations and those offering the false trails and rabbit holes.
I would ask that all the sock puppets who have posted in this thread identify yourselves and state your real name.
slp (f9a160) — 7/3/2011 @ 6:26 amSee, when you explicitly state that you’re not presenting a theory, just making some true statements or asking pointed questions to let others draw conclusions or discuss… that means you are buying into and espousing a particular theory. Logic is not what some people believe it to be.
Of course, disagree with Lee or ask for proof and you’re told you don’t know what it’s like to work a big blog story. I gave Lee the benefit of the doubt in my earlier comments on another thread. I assumed he was making valid connections based on knowledge I didn’t have and just couldn’t/didn’t want to share at the moment. My bad. Won’t happen again.
Stashiu3 (44da70) — 7/3/2011 @ 6:51 amThis very post has Patterico espousing a theory.
Lee Stranahan (708cc3) — 7/3/2011 @ 6:54 am552. Lee
I haven’t called Ron. Don’t need to open that can. You’re braver than I am.
But I would think that Ron’s current ranting suggest that he thinks there’s a real JG who’s scared. I think his assertions about you are vastly overstated and largely unfounded. In Ron vs. Lee, I’m with Lee, if that makes you feel any better. But if there’s a real JG who’s scared and innocent, I can see why she’d find you scary. If she’s fake, then to hell with her.
But are you, Lee, saying that Ron is saying that the real JG never called you on 6/19, Lee? That she never talked to Preston?
Because that’s point #1 of the trial balloon that Pat has at the top of this (that Pat’s not saying is true but is asking us to poke holes in)
koam @wittier (e74ff0) — 7/3/2011 @ 6:59 amThis is getting very tiresome.
Lee,
Give us the facts and the evidence to back up those facts.
slp (f9a160) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:01 amAsk Ron. read his tweets
Lee Stranahan (708cc3) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:04 amI have a theory: smoke from Alder wood, when applied to pork, makes for some seriously good BBQ. I am currently testing this theory with 6 slabs of ribs, and 3 pork butts. If this doesn’t sound good to you, remember, I know some things about BBQ that I can’t tell you right now. Later in the day, though, you will discover that I am right, and you are wrong. Gotta crack open a beer…suggest you all do the same.
Tutu (54ce64) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:15 amEspousing
1. to make one’s own; adopt or embrace, as a cause.
Synonyms
1. support, champion, advocate.
Reading comprehension is your friend. Embrace it.
Stashiu3 (44da70) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:16 amUPDATE x2: I’m feeling better about the theory with each passing second.
Lee Stranahan (708cc3) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:17 amGoatsred@540–
I don’t quite know how to respond to your question. I can tell you feel dissed and for that I feel very bad as that was certainly not my intent. As I reread the quote I don’t quite see why you thought I dissed you or where you thought I accused you of sockpuppeting. But if you read it that way then perhaps others did too. That suggests my late night writing was unclear and for that I heartily apologize–and I welcome the chance to try to clear it up.
My intended point in the whole overly-long comment I posted was to say what a clusterfark the Betty mom/Tommy chapter was, and how it had (probably unintentionally on the part of the perpetrators) called big attention to slimy behind-the scenes aspects of the case which continue to intrigue a lot of people who might otherwise have just stopped caring once Weiner confessed and resigned. By mentioning your name I meant to show that as someone who had skin in the game because of the way you had been used, you would likely have been one of the very few people still front and center asking questions and seeking answers after most others of us had fallen away and moved on to other things.
elissa (fe7129) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:23 am560 Stashiu3 – Yesss!
Tutu (54ce64) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:25 am“someone-smarter-than-me-explain-why-this-is-not-possible” – Pat’s title
most of the comments think this trial balloon doesn’t fly.
the facts of the call and the facts before and after the call are not consistent with the 6/19 JG caller to Lee being a hoax.
What’s more likely is that the calls JG reportedly received are a hoax, if she did receive calls, intended to falsely implicate and confuse.
koam @wittier (e74ff0) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:28 am“feeling better” falls far short of espousing or embracing.
Take a step back, a deep breath, and collect yourself. Jumping is good exercise, jumping to conclusions… not so much. Credibility is a difficult thing to recover when you ignore the first rule of holes.
On a tangent (to revisit your comments on that other thread I mentioned), did you ever get more information about who DRJ is to this site? If so, feel free to look at her comments again and see if you might reconsider your responses. Or you can continue to blindly stumble from conjecture to conjecture, claim others just don’t get it or would agree if they had your special information, and essentially complete your beclowning. Your choice.
Stashiu3 (44da70) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:29 amCongrats to MAYBEE…Nice shoutout here from PajamasMedia.com
http://www.americanthinker.com/2011/07/the_community_organizer_who_would_be_king.html#disqus_thread
goatsred (b20383) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:29 am“with each passing second.”
If you want to pretend that’s not advocating a theory, go ahead.
Lee Stranahan (708cc3) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:32 amComment by elissa — 7/3/2011 @ 7:23 am
I did not fell dissed in any way whatsoever…I did not understand the context. After reading all of these comments, sometimes my mind just freezes.It then goes into anti-Weinergate mode. Thanks for the explanation and please understand that this group here has never inferred or outright stated one negative thing about me.
goatsred (b20383) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:35 amIt’s hard for me to follow all thats going on here.
Is feeling comfortable with a theory the same as advocating a theory? I don’t think so.
Tutu (54ce64) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:37 amIt’s not pretending, it is called reading what is written. You’re still not exercising, despite all the jumping.
Friendly advice of the day: Give up trying to spar with me and consider what people are saying instead. Hard-headed and hysterical is a bad combination. Besides that, you’ll lose. Trust me, I have special information.
Stashiu3 (44da70) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:41 amWho are you?
Lee Stranahan (708cc3) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:41 amAnd if you have special information, present it or STHU.
I believe you have special information like I believe John Reid doing a video chat.
Lee Stranahan (708cc3) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:42 amJust shows you haven’t gone to the archives as I suggested. Pity.
Stashiu3 (44da70) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:43 amBlah blah. Pity.
Lee Stranahan (708cc3) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:45 am572 Lee – Ditto
Tutu (54ce64) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:45 amStashiu3 and Tutu, various numbers,all have good words to say here today.
Pat’s not a liar. Disagreeing with someone or misunderstanding someone doesn’t make someone a liar. It’s time to walk it back and say that there are disagreements on 1) theories, 2) process, 3) some reported facts, but that doesn’t make either of you or most of the commenters here liars. You’re both very valuable and both are more valuable with each other in the discussion, challenging each other, constructively, entertainingly. Walk it back. Sleep on it. Come back another day and reconcile.
koam @wittier (e74ff0) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:46 amAsk a question, Tutu. Waiting…
Lee Stranahan (708cc3) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:46 amWhere did I say he’s a liar?
Lee Stranahan (708cc3) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:47 amTutu, he was saying the theory had yet to be exposed as wrong. which was his way of goading people to work harder on seriously debunking it. At the time he posted it, a lot of comments were just saying ‘prove it right! Of course it’s wrong!’ instead of seriously looking at it.
When you’re initially told you’re obviously completely wrong, and over time no one is able to actually show that, of course that’s going to lead to a ‘I’m feeling better’ type statement.
However, it’s dishonest to claim Patterico isn’t also saying things like
He’s got an open mind. It’s that simple. That’s all there is to it, and if you take some of his statements of open mindedness and omit others, I can make Patterico look like he’s 100% on board with one side or I can make him look 100% on board with the other side.
Selective reporting is the very heart of how media mistakes happen. Everyone reporting Patterico’s statements about how he’s not disclaiming one direction should be willing to report the converse statements. If they aren’t, it’s going to get on everyone’s nerves eventually.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:48 ambtw, my comment isn’t critical of Tutu. Quite the opposite.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:49 amStashiu,
no one you know (136b86) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:49 amFinally have some time today to catch up on the post-resignation Weiner stuff here (which am looking forward to being less confused about) but could you just point me to the thread you’re referring to where DRJ and Lee had the conversation you mention above. Thanks much–
I’m “feeling better” about the Yanks winning the World Series. I’m also not betting my life on it.
It doesn’t make anyone who says “Phillies” or “Sox” a liar, no matter the outcome in October.
koam @wittier (e74ff0) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:50 amI spoke to Patterico a few hours ago and he was arguing adamantly for this theory, with no evidence whatsoever. It’s what he believes.
Does he say that the obvious truth MIGHT be right? Sure.
And that’s the problem. He believes a wacky theory. He believes it MORE than a simple, provable theory. And when challenged, he bans people.
Lee Stranahan (708cc3) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:52 am581 no one you know
Is this it?
koam @wittier (e74ff0) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:54 amGeez Lee, I liked it better when it was just Gennette getting pissed at me. I really started out liking all your reporting on this, and still am OK with you, but my question would be simply…when will you give us all the information that you have, so that we can support, or refute your claims?
Tutu (54ce64) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:54 amQuick question, Lee. Have you released all the information regarding weinergate? If not, why?
∅ (e7577d) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:55 amAhh… the magic words “STHU”. I don’t think so bub.
I don’t have anything on Weinergate, if that’s what you’re assuming I meant. On this site however, different story. Special information is sort of a hobby. The only one who can tell me to shut up here and make it stick is Patterico.
Stashiu3 (44da70) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:55 amLee, did you give Pat evidence that the JG who called you was also the real JG who went to police?
If so, what evidence? Did you pick the most persuasive concrete evidence?
(And I’m on your side on this question)
koam @wittier (e74ff0) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:56 amNo, I just told you. See — I’ll do it. You’re blowing hot air. STHU. (That means ‘heck’ btw.)
Lee Stranahan (708cc3) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:57 amHere is it noyk… glad to help.
Lee, who got banned for challenging Patterico? Doubt it. Strongly.
Stashiu3 (44da70) — 7/3/2011 @ 8:01 am581 no one you know
Is this it?
Comment by koam @wittier — 7/3/2011 @ 7:54 am
It sure does look like it, and thanks very much. (PS I really don’t think “Paul” on that thread is the same Paul who used to post here a few yrs ago. Wow.)
no one you know (136b86) — 7/3/2011 @ 8:02 amI’ll eat Patterico’s hat if this is true.
Don’t pretend Patterico is viewpoint discriminatory.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/3/2011 @ 8:03 amComment by Stashiu3 — 7/3/2011 @ 8:01 am
Whoops, we cross posted. Thanks to you too. *goes to read a buncha posts with Diet Coke in hand*
no one you know (136b86) — 7/3/2011 @ 8:03 amI chose to ignore Paul that day. Others didn’t. I say, “don’t feed ’em.”
koam @wittier (e74ff0) — 7/3/2011 @ 8:04 amSee? That reading-comprehension problem will get you every time. The key words were “and make it stick“. Try that on for size.
Stashiu3 (44da70) — 7/3/2011 @ 8:06 amWhen responding to questions or posts, it helps to use the post number and commenter’s name in the first line. That way the readers know which question is being answered or which comment is being replied to or commented on. (as we approach #600)
koam @wittier (e74ff0) — 7/3/2011 @ 8:07 amStashiu3 – 1
Lee – 0
(I’ll keep a running score. We’ll start there or you’d already be down too far to ever make it back.)
Stashiu3 (44da70) — 7/3/2011 @ 8:08 amOf course, you already are and just don’t know it.
Stashiu3 (44da70) — 7/3/2011 @ 8:11 am@ 577 asked my question, Lee…waiting…
Tutu (54ce64) — 7/3/2011 @ 8:13 amIt’s not. Good call.
Stashiu3 (44da70) — 7/3/2011 @ 8:16 amTutu,
What information do you think I’m holding back?
Answer is — nothing that Patterico isn’t holding back. In fact, I’m holding back a LOT less than Patterico is.
Lee Stranahan (708cc3) — 7/3/2011 @ 8:17 amHmmm… I can still comment. Guess I’ll keep that point. Heh.
Stashiu3 (44da70) — 7/3/2011 @ 8:18 amYet Patterico is not making assertions without evidence like you do. Want to bet there’s a connection there?
Stashiu3 (44da70) — 7/3/2011 @ 8:19 amNow, who got banned for challenging Patterico? Or were you just blowing hot air there?
Stashiu3 (44da70) — 7/3/2011 @ 8:22 amI am still waiting for someone to back up the claim Patterico banned people merely for challenging him, Charles Johnson style.
Do we get to just assert whatever the F we want and then refuse to back it up with evidence?
Also, why would someone boast they are holding back a ‘lot’ of information? Seems like something to be ashamed of.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/3/2011 @ 8:23 amCross posted with Stashiu. But yeah, that’s a serious accusation against a blogger.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/3/2011 @ 8:23 amYour claims are much more assertive, Lee. In any case, if anyone is holding back info, don’t expect that I shall believe your claims, because you say I should. And, seriously, you are holding back a lot less…does not make you a lot better.
Tutu (54ce64) — 7/3/2011 @ 8:27 amNo worries Dustin. Lee succeeded in (slightly) annoying me and destroyed most of his credibility with me in the process. If he wants to dance, set the music.
“I’m your Huckleberry”
Stashiu3 (44da70) — 7/3/2011 @ 8:28 amHe’s no daisy, Stashiu3.
Good to see your posts, even if the reasons are due to irritation.
Simon Jester (e07fe9) — 7/3/2011 @ 8:34 amPatterico is the one holding back a lot of info — not me.
Lee Stranahan (708cc3) — 7/3/2011 @ 8:34 amI still read every comment on every thread and occasionally work behind the scenes when things are hectic. Got a lot of other things going on IRL right now though, so following through with conversations is usually spurred by passion. Unfortunately, annoyance is a passion. 😉
Stashiu3 (44da70) — 7/3/2011 @ 8:38 amthe facts of the call and the facts before and after the call are not consistent with the 6/19 JG caller to Lee being a hoax.
Sorry, I’m totally missing this one. What’s inconsistent in facts with the call being a hoax ? The fact that the caller got some of the information wrong (such as claiming a CA address seems supportive of it being a hoax). So does blocking the number.
JP – who talked to the same person- seemed to think the caller was, if not a hoax exactly, at least of questionable veracity. (Yeah, she thinks that about everyone, but still).
The only information I’ve seen that supports the JG caller being the same as police-report-JG (who we assume is real) is the alleged mention of the professor in both cases. But I don’t think that indicates they are the same person at all. The only reason she would mention the professor to the police is if he was part of the story connecting LS and her. (I.e. someone claiming to be her called LS who called her professor).
Johnathan Creek (1bb7dc) — 7/3/2011 @ 8:39 amYeah, I stand corrected, Lee. I apologize.
/see how easy that was for me?
And I think Patterico should explain what he is holding back, or at least tell us if it’s ‘a lot’ as you say and some generalized explanation for why it’s being held.
Same for you. Whatever you’re holding back should be revealed at some point. Whatever you know or don’t know should come out.
If we throw it all out there my guess is we’ll be forced to admit we don’t know the answers for sure right now. Maybe we never will.
Anyway, I’m not comfortable with everyone but Patterico vaguely painting a picture of what P knows. For all I know, it’s just enough to punch a whole in our preconceptions.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/3/2011 @ 8:39 am99 bottles of weinergate on the wall, 99 bottles of weinergate. You take one down, pass it around, 100 bottles of weinergate on the wall.
oneisnotprime (c491ed) — 7/3/2011 @ 8:40 amI meant “HOLE” ARGH
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/3/2011 @ 8:40 amHe’s also not making assertions based on that info. Take a lesson young man. Learn how it’s done from someone smarter and wiser.
Stashiu3 (44da70) — 7/3/2011 @ 8:40 amIs the goal to garner 1,000 comments, or do the comments have to be pertinent to the subject?
Alan Kellogg (43c76b) — 7/3/2011 @ 8:42 am“And when challenged, he bans people.”
This seems particularly strange as it is made in the comments of the site that is said to have banned him? Perhaps I have a different meaning for the word.
Lee,
I don’t really care about these theories but when you question Patterico’s integrity you lose all benefit of a doubt with me. He has earned an enviable reputation on that score over years of exposure on this site. Stashiu3 and DRJ are two of the most respected contributors on this site and again have earned that respect over years both here and on other sites, so you just kind of double down on fail with that.
You don’t know me so this means nothing to you but I have known Stashiu3 for years online and in real life and while we don’t always agree, his honor and honesty are well established and he has earned and deserves the high esteem in which he is held. Good luck telling him to shut up.
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/3/2011 @ 8:42 amDustin,
Have you learned nothing from Breitbart my friend? Hold your cards close to your chest and never interrupt someone making a mistake. Be patient or you’ll tip the mark.
Stashiu3 (44da70) — 7/3/2011 @ 8:42 amYes. 😉
Mac!!
Stashiu3 (44da70) — 7/3/2011 @ 8:44 amStashiu3, you are one of the good guys, as I know from experience.
Lee, you should keep that in mind. Stashiu3 is honest, and has (for the several years I have followed his posts here) always stood up for what is right.
He’s like Patterico that way.
Simon Jester (e07fe9) — 7/3/2011 @ 8:44 amWhat Machinist wrote.
Simon Jester (e07fe9) — 7/3/2011 @ 8:46 amI wish I had the ability to play things out like that. If P is playing that kind of card game, I guess he’ll have to withstand my impatience until things reveal themselves.
But it’s been ongoing for a while. And while I realize most didn’t take it seriously, I felt a lot of people were suspicious of me for really quite unfair reasons, so I have an additional interest in the truth being completely exposed at some point.
At any rate, thanks for the hint as to what’s going on. And it’s great to see you comment once in a while. Hopefully DRJ will return when the dust settles too.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/3/2011 @ 8:47 amGood to see you my friend.
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/3/2011 @ 8:47 amI’m out.
Not my site and I’m outnumbered.
I’ll answer questions on Twitter or my site or the radio show or wherever. I’ve answered more questions than anyone on what they believe and I’ve answered them honestly.
Lee Stranahan (708cc3) — 7/3/2011 @ 8:48 amgoatsred @566 – Thanks for the link. Clarice and MayBee are both great. The movie of that Kipling story, with Sean Connery and Michael Caine, was great, IMHO.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/3/2011 @ 8:48 amNobody puts Baby in a corner!
(I’m in old-movie mode I guess.)
By the way, more than one person has said that Patterico and I sound almost exactly alike too. First time I talked to him on the phone was weird. Then I heard him on an online radio show and it was even worse. He sounds better though somehow.
Stashiu3 (44da70) — 7/3/2011 @ 8:50 amIt’s like rain on your wedding day.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/3/2011 @ 8:51 amNotice no mention of who got banned. Shall I take a point? I shall!
Stashiu3 – 2
Stashiu3 (44da70) — 7/3/2011 @ 8:52 amLee – 0
Stashiu3 and Machinist – Good to see you.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/3/2011 @ 8:53 amAlright, now that you’ve admitted to holding back information, can you tell us why?
∅ (e7577d) — 7/3/2011 @ 8:53 am“…I’m outnumbered.”
What’s that saying about sitting down when everyone tells you you’re drunk?
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/3/2011 @ 8:55 amI haven’t followed this whole thing as closely as many others on here have, but I was always suspect of Lee’s suddenly believing the left was wrong about anything, even before the Weiner escapade. Hasn’t he proven the liberals is always right and will never accept another opinion? I didn’t listen to any of the radio shows, but my question about the cat yowling: was it for real or part of the act to make it sound like he was actually at home?
Sorry, I’m too fearful of liberal wolves suddenly in conservative sheep’s clothes.
Not much of a comment but hope it helps your goal.
PatAZ (efd43b) — 7/3/2011 @ 8:55 amMentions of “giving someone enough rope to hang themselves” understandably makes me a bit nervous, but no one can dispute it’s appropriateness in this context. Just sayin’
ropelight (8ea8ac) — 7/3/2011 @ 8:55 amStashiu3, and I’ve missed you too my friend.
SPQR (26be8b) — 7/3/2011 @ 8:55 amLee,
Your problems don’t have anything to do with the site you’re on bub. At least you finally admit it’s what you “believe”, not what you “know”. That’s progress. Look back and you’ll see that nearly every challenge you received was based on you making assertions of fact without evidence. Asking you for evidence is not calling you a liar. We’re a “trust, but verify” crowd here.
I gave you the benefit of the doubt for a long time, even though you were getting snippy about being challenged. I believe you’re honest. Now, I also believe you’re stupid. Don’t let the door…
Stashiu3 (44da70) — 7/3/2011 @ 9:00 amThanks guys… as I said, I’ve been around. I just get caught up in chunks rather than following in real time now. Too tiring otherwise. Good to see y’all too. 🙂
Stashiu3 (44da70) — 7/3/2011 @ 9:04 amHeh, he said chunks.
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/3/2011 @ 9:06 amThat was a pre-submit edit. Not sure you want to hear the word I first used. Heh.
Stashiu3 (44da70) — 7/3/2011 @ 9:07 amSparing my tender sensibilities. What a gentleman!
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/3/2011 @ 9:10 amTried to post something and it wouldn’t “take.”. Hmmm
Simon Jester (e07fe9) — 7/3/2011 @ 9:13 amSeriously though, I hinted and then flat-out told the man he should check himself. No insight whatsoever. Believes what he believes, no matter what. I don’t expect him to have a prosecutor’s mindset, but how many times can you tell a person their logic is faulty before you have to conclude they’re just too stupid to understand? What’s really sad is that the left will never accept him back, and the right will if he can just keep his facts separate from his opinions. So far, I haven’t seen anything to indicate he can do that.
Stashiu3 (44da70) — 7/3/2011 @ 9:13 amPatterico is very lenient with commenters, so accusing him of banning for an opinion is just crazy.
Stashiu3: love your smackdowns. You say so much in so few words.
PatAZ (efd43b) — 7/3/2011 @ 9:13 amI think I understand the pressures that Lee is under and so I’m a bit sympathetic.
But its a shame that he decided to be antagonistic to Patterico.
SPQR (26be8b) — 7/3/2011 @ 9:19 amNow I’m blushing… no really, redness in the face. Fact, not opinion. Looked in the mirror, took a picture, showed it around to several folks to see if they agreed it looked like a blush, verified the definition of blushing in the dictionary, then compared photos tagged as blushing on google to ensure consistency.
Well, maybe it is just opinion since I didn’t really do all that. (What were you saying about “so few words”? lol)
Stashiu3 (44da70) — 7/3/2011 @ 9:22 amI went to bed confused. I am waking up discombobulated (I like that word). I haven’t yet listened to Lee’s shows, so I don’t know what he said.
Summary version, please? Or shall I read all the comments?
Dianna (f12db5) — 7/3/2011 @ 9:22 amWow, I go to the store, and when I get back, Lee has taken his ball and gone home.
Tutu (54ce64) — 7/3/2011 @ 9:22 amStashiu3, I don’t know you, but I love you, man.
Tutu (54ce64) — 7/3/2011 @ 9:25 amPatterico, is it true that you got the information for your story on “Ethel” from John Reid?
Secondly, if this is true, shouldn’t you have disclosed this?
Thirdly, again, if true, doesn’t that mean when you said that you were not being used by John Reid to disseminate information, that you were not being truthful?
Woodshedder (44e97d) — 7/3/2011 @ 9:26 amComment by Stashiu3 — 7/3/2011 @ 9:22 am
Just for verification: it’s not blushing till at least one side of your neck turns red. /evidentiary
PatAZ’s comment reminded me of the smackings you used to give Emperor/love2008. Wonder what happened to him/her that he lost interest (still not convinced Emperor wasn’t female).
no one you know (136b86) — 7/3/2011 @ 9:26 amI think it stopped being a shame when he shared behind-the-scenes information that Patterico was not sharing publicly. Correction: the shame just changed location.
Stashiu3 (44da70) — 7/3/2011 @ 9:27 amStashiu3, I was trying to be understanding but that is a major judgment fail.
SPQR (26be8b) — 7/3/2011 @ 9:29 amLovey was/is female. Along with her socks from Nigeria and elsewhere.
Stashiu3 (44da70) — 7/3/2011 @ 9:30 amComment by Dianna — 7/3/2011 @ 9:22 am
Discombobulated is a fantastic word. Practically an onomatopoeia since even sounds disorganized. 😉
Have been busy w/ IRL stuff lately so after Weiner resigned I didn’t follow much of any of it. But I’ve liked Lee’s stuff and was surprised today to see that his account has been disabled. So am going to review the post-resig posts, and probably some comment threads too, to see what’s going on w/ the calls and death threats (!) etc. It’ll probably make sense after that but it sure doesn’t now.
no one you know (136b86) — 7/3/2011 @ 9:31 amI know SPQR, but Lee has torpedoed all credibility with me. You’re kinder than I am in this.
Stashiu3 (44da70) — 7/3/2011 @ 9:33 am“Thirdly, again, if true, doesn’t that mean when you said that you were not being used by John Reid to disseminate information, that you were not being truthful?”
Woodshedder – Lee took a phone call from lying liar Jenny George in MA. Is he being used by her? Just askin’.
Who are you?
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/3/2011 @ 9:38 amReal-life beckons… be well.
Stashiu3 (44da70) — 7/3/2011 @ 9:39 amI’m just here to help us get to 1000.
Go Patterico!
Pious Agnostic (6048a8) — 7/3/2011 @ 9:41 am“Lovey was/is female. Along with her socks from Nigeria and elsewhere.”
Stashiu3 – That was always my take.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/3/2011 @ 9:41 am1st!
Blackburnsghost (2ffb0c) — 7/3/2011 @ 9:45 amSounds like a very particular bit of info. And I know what it’s like when someone gets a very very specific bit of info that has been ripped from context, so I’m very suspicious how you heard this.
Did Patterico verify the Ethel bit? I mean… you know, how Fox News and the police confirmed some contact between them, and there was online records of it? If John Reid fed Patterico a host of information, and Patterico reported the aspects he was able to verify as verified, and the aspects he couldn’t verify as unverified, what’s the problem, anyway?
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/3/2011 @ 9:45 am#653
So far, this post-Weiner story has made very little sense.
I was fond of one theory – that the manipulator of sock puppets had been involved in the threats, and a by-stander (JG in MA) had gotten involved by accident – but since the police seem (according to last night’s information?) to have dropped the investigation, I may be wrong.
I ran across comments between Daleyrocks and someone else (sorry for not remembering!) somewhere back in the 500’s in which Daley laid out a theory I thought was pretty convincing, but the other party pointed out its main problem – “the ‘Breitbart sting’ tail wagging the ‘Weiner obsession’ dog.” (That really is a quote).
The thing everyone would like to know is Who is Who?
Dianna (f12db5) — 7/3/2011 @ 9:48 amholy hellacious
ColonelHaiku (822dce) — 7/3/2011 @ 9:48 amposts batman colonel leave for
day all hell break loose
Dianna – I don’t view it as a problem with the theory. Think it through again ignoring the post dic pic distractions which derailed it.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/3/2011 @ 9:52 amwho are you, who who, who who, I really want to know!
Tutu (54ce64) — 7/3/2011 @ 9:53 amDianna – It’s par for the course with progressives inserting plants at tea party rallies, which I have witnessed first hand, fake videos from Think Progress, and other vile disinformation campaigns.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/3/2011 @ 9:55 amI am Spartacus!
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/3/2011 @ 9:56 am#663 – Daleyrocks
I like your theory. It’s been my working assumption from the start.
However, the behaviors displayed by the ‘starchild111’ and ‘Nikki Reid’ accounts in the six weeks to two months before the infamous tweeted dicpic don’t quite fit.
And who – unless we’re going to posit some disturbed person with absolutely no connection to any of our real people, sock puppets, investigators or anyone at all – is issuing threats?
Dianna (f12db5) — 7/3/2011 @ 9:58 am#664 – Tutu – LOL! Right! Rock on!
#665 – Daleyrocks – I know. Which is why I said that your theory matches my working assumptions.
Maybe it’s all gotten bogged down in the undergrowth of misdirection and sock puppetry.
Dianna (f12db5) — 7/3/2011 @ 10:00 amHere is yet another comment on the way to 1000. It is sad when we can’t get along and agree to disagree without being disagreeable. I did not read all the comments, but sometimes it feels like we’re going down a rabbit hole after the rabbit has been eaten by a stoat.
Jeff Mitchell (481f2a) — 7/3/2011 @ 10:02 am@ 506 Nathan Wagner
My apologies for the late reply. My point is that I don’t believe Weiner was used as a set up for Breitbart, but rather starchild wanted to get close to Weiner. But once everything hit the fan, starchild used that opportunity to protect Weiner and throw Breitbart away. Perhaps starchild was set up as a high school girl because of the success of Ethel. That still makes point 2 and 3 valid, I think. But is anyone sure at this point? I’m not, unfortunately…
On Patterico and Lee
I was surprised when I’ve seen the posts from Lee the past few days. They were disrespectfully critical of Patterico and I assumed (my fault on making assumptions) that the two had agreed to disagree. But, Lee crossed the line when speaking for Pat. Pat has been very clear from the beginning that he is neutral on a lot of this until more facts come out which is a position that a lot of commenters here have also taken. I think most of us agree that we have theories, but until the facts come out we don’t know for certainty. As for Pat giving JR his time here, I thought Pat was being fair and allowing JR to give his side (but not endorsing him or discrediting him). We allowed GC to give her case, but vetted her when flaws appeared. JR was also vetted and rightfully so. Pat and the commenters here deserve kudos for still investigating this when others have abandoned it.
rogerthat (f5aad4) — 7/3/2011 @ 10:06 amNO JUSTICE, NO PEACE!!!!!!!!
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/3/2011 @ 10:25 amFor the love of God and all that is holy, give it a rest.
Country goin down the tubes- discuss
Jones (0a69fd) — 7/3/2011 @ 10:27 amIt’s like rain on your wedding day.
“It’s the good advice that you just didn’t take”.
(Ironically, just helping to get to 1,000)..
piglet (1bb7dc) — 7/3/2011 @ 10:32 amPatterico, I don’t think you know the definition of “uncritical”. Hint: it does not mean “supportive”.
Molon Labe (dc676c) — 7/3/2011 @ 10:42 am(Prefaced before I put this out there – I have only read this thread up to comment 600 or so, so if there is evidence that contradicts this I have not seen it.)
In response to some comments about the “@Weinergate: The Death Threat Black Hole” post I went back and read that post and its comments in one sitting (for the first time.)
Some brief thoughts on that thread and its dynamic.
Did any one else find interesting the fact that Paul and one other major contibutor to the conversation never posted at the same time period?
That this other contributor made an unnecassary and odd reference when rejoining the conversation after Paul had been extremely active?
That Paul unflinchingly supported this contributors every comment and theory?
That this contributor referenced Paul several times but never directed a comment to him?
That Paul effusivly praised the contibutor and his theories but never addressed a comment to him directly?
That Paul shared several times this contributors typing gaffes: leaving out words, leaving extranous words in after editing statements, etc.?
That Paul and this contibutor seem to have shared (sometimes irrationally) feelings and opinions toward and about other commentors?
That Paul attacked commentors who questioned this contributor as though he himself had been attacked, and this contributor attacked those who questioned Paul (even going after a blog stalwart (who admittadly had not been around lately))when that person questioned Paul?
I am now more than a half hour late leaving for work so I will have to let that be that.
I bring up these questions with no feeling of vindication as I have supported this contributor and his unique work in the past.
(Sorry for typos- I have less than no time to go back and proofread.)
Have Blue (dbbcd4) — 7/3/2011 @ 10:45 amThe fact is, some people just don’t get it and just don’t have it. It = integrity.
Anitabusch (a025dd) — 7/3/2011 @ 10:49 amIt’s been always clear to me that Patrick is using a Socratic method in his posts. He’s trying to draw the participants out and assemble the stories so he can compare them. When he asks why a certain scenario can’t be true, he’s acting in that fashion. He wants to hear all the arguments.
Patrick did this a while back with
Brother Bradley J. Fikes, C.O.R. (62e76d) — 7/3/2011 @ 10:53 amglobal warmingclimate changeclimate instability, although I missed what he thought of those arguments.I think that both Lee and Patterico have made good points as this story unfolds.
It was my understanding that John Reid proivde the context on the tumbler post. However there was a screen cap of “Ethel’s” tumbler page posted by goatsred on yfrog quite some time ago.
Patterico also did not just post the informtion / lead from JR but was able to verify the information from at least one additional source or sources.
Lee has also focused on the motives of the various sockpuppets and players in this very odd story of how Twitter has become relevant!
Joe
Joe Smith (54c0c1) — 7/3/2011 @ 10:56 amHave blue – Oh, There are commenter socks all over the place. I suppose it is part of the entertainment value of this to spot them, a kind of Where’s Waldo, although more conspicuous than Waldo.
SarahW (af7312) — 7/3/2011 @ 10:57 amSarahW – Commentor socks are one thing (especially if they are inended only to be funny or insulting), this is a whole ‘nother animal entirely!
Have Blue (dbbcd4) — 7/3/2011 @ 11:01 amSarahW, Shari Lewis would be so proud of this thread.
Tutu (54ce64) — 7/3/2011 @ 11:06 amUPDATE x2: My decision has been vindicated by Lee’s latest post at his site, in which he displays in spades his recent tendency to a) disclose private conversations that he should know good and damned well I would not want him to discuss, and b) get what I said in those discussions wrong.
Again: Lee seems to be unable to distinguish between a theory and a fact. He is also apparently unable to distinguish between someone advancing a theory and claiming a fact as true. This leads him to put words in my mouth that I didn’t say, or to misunderstand what I have said. Asking someone to consider evidence, and to consider how that evidence might support a possible theory, is not the same as declaring that possible theory is true.
Lee is again portraying me as gullibly accepting the views of people whose views (I assure you) I am not gullibly accepting. Neither am I publicly denouncing those people. I am taking in information. Lee used to understand that.
Incidentally, I have not “banned” him but simply disabled his account to “no role on this blog.” He still has the ability to comment, although if he comes on here and misrepresents the nature of our private communications, or even discusses them, that may change. There is simply too much at stake to dick around.
I do not want to be in a fight with Lee, but I strongly encourage him to stop spilling the private details of every conversation he has with people onto the Internet. There is a reason I feel I cannot talk to him any more, and why I consider it a huge mistake that I even tried last night.
You may comment on this post here.
Patterico (f724ca) — 7/3/2011 @ 11:07 amTutu – I thought ShariLewis was having a Temper Tantrum?
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/3/2011 @ 11:16 amPatterico: I feel that there is a subtext here that most of us don’t “get” (I know: duh!). I can’t wait for the real story to emerge from all of this. As for Mr. Stranahan, the situation reminds of the story I tried to post this morning…which the site wouldn’t “take.” It was in reference to Stashiu3’s attempts to get Mr. Stranahan to not act reactively.
My father spent many years working in the oilfields of Southern California among Texans, who had a wide variety of pungent and evocative aphorisms. My father picked them up, and often used them. For a good taste, check out the long out of print “Texas Crude.” Not all of the sayings are family friendly, as you might imagine.
Anyway, I used to play poker with my father fairly often. I would try to bluff him, and he would grin, move his ever-present toothpick from one side of his mouth to the other, and drawl “Son, you don’t want to let your mouth write a check you ain’t prepared to cash.”
Patterico understands this. I have this feeling that Mr. Stranahan doesn’t “get” that what he is doing now works against what he would like to achieve.
But that’s his business, not mine.
Patterico, hang in there. It sucks to trust someone and find out that you shouldn’t.
Simon Jester (2df2ee) — 7/3/2011 @ 11:18 amThe most mysterious thing to me is why Patrick wants this thread to reach 1,000 comments. He normally goes for quality, not mere quantity. Regardless, I’m happy to help out.
Brother Bradley J. Fikes, C.O.R. (62e76d) — 7/3/2011 @ 11:21 amI can’t help it. When Lee first started posting on PP, I kept getting somewhat of a queasy feeling. It was strangely similar to reading posts on Huffpo. That, and his inability to string several sentences together in a post without spelling or grammar problems, even though he supposedly was a “professional” journalist.
I have mostly been a daily lurker here for many years. Lee just did not appear to have the sufficient ethical capacity for this site.
Leonardo DaFinchi (29a763) — 7/3/2011 @ 11:23 amPoor story, killed by the death of a thousand hits.
Cmate (525edc) — 7/3/2011 @ 11:27 amSee? There you go.
How many problems are there with this?
Arguing for a theory does not mean I believe it. Refusing to listen to a person’s evidence does not mean the person has “no evidence whatsoever.” Talking about private conversations without permission is never great; doing so and getting them wrong is worse; doing so and getting them wrong in an environment when threats have been made and law enforcement is involved is reckless.
I can’t talk to Lee Stranahan again until all this is sorted out. Until then, as I have said, if he makes a claim that I said something, do not assume his claim to be true.
Patterico (f724ca) — 7/3/2011 @ 11:28 amThe answer is simple: we’re getting closer!
I’ll take the quality too.
Patterico (f724ca) — 7/3/2011 @ 11:30 amMrs. P. says I haven’t explained it well enough.
If it reaches 1000 comments, I can say: hey, look at that! A thread with 1000 comments!
Patterico (f724ca) — 7/3/2011 @ 11:31 amI suspect perhaps the drive to be the first to solve the great mystery and have the feather in his cap might be a strong motivating factor.
Unfortunately, this can cause writers/reporters to become sloppy, and play fast and loose with necessary rules for maintaining integrity.
Eventually if the need to have the recognition become so great, small compromises make themselves known. And worse.
Dana (4eca6e) — 7/3/2011 @ 11:33 amAnd some Scooby Snacks. Lots of Scooby Snacks.
Scooby-Doo (b29599) — 7/3/2011 @ 11:38 amOne thing I don’t want to have happen is for this to turn into the “pile on Lee” thread. I still want to like him and I don’t want to burn bridges.
Patterico (f724ca) — 7/3/2011 @ 11:39 am#687 Patterico –
OK.
BTW, I get a feeling that Lee is sleep deprived (or, more accurately, looking at times of posts and so on, I’m not sure when he’s sleeping). No one thinks clearly in that condition.
Dianna (f12db5) — 7/3/2011 @ 11:42 amHave I missed a step? I was skimming the comments since I signed off yesterday evening, and I didn’t see anything explaining “Dan Wolfe” (and I will not type “Worf” any more).
Has that discussion point been set aside as not productive?
Dianna (f12db5) — 7/3/2011 @ 11:44 amSomeone smarter than me, please explain why this is not possible:
Patrick and Lee’s rift is actually a carefully planned maneuver to expose the true conspiracy.
*Lee, breaking off with Patrick, will be able to infiltrate circles closed off to our esteemed host.
*Lee will secretly relay information to Patrick, and they will co-author a damning post exposing the machinations.
*The post will be published here, on Lee’s site, and on Breitbart’s site, because this has been a Breitbart investigation from the beginning.
STUNNERS: Preston will be revealed as starchild111; Pinch Sulzberger as Betty, and Veronica as Eric Boehlert.
The aim of the conspiracy was to entice as many conservative politicians as possible into compromising relationships with transvestite, transsexual Transylvanians. They also tried to get the Koch Bros. with a superspy clone of Ayn Rand.
Instead, a lot of lefty politicians took the bait. (The expose will name names). Soros is mad and won’t write any more checks for these stings by Media Matters.
Brother Bradley J. Fikes, C.O.R. (62e76d) — 7/3/2011 @ 11:45 amSince I have family in the Los Angeles attorney world, albeit not in the criminal side of the business, and used to live there, I have been following Patterico’s blog quietly for some time now. Always interesting; often controversial. Thanks for taking the trouble to maintain it!
No Mutant Enemy (6e23c7) — 7/3/2011 @ 11:46 amPatterico @#693,
I was not attempting to pile on Lee w/#691, but rather was making a larger observation about basic human nature, its weaknesses, and certain temptation. All of us are susceptible, all of us stumble, and all of us have to figure out how to get back up when those times happen. My best wishes for Lee.
Dana (4eca6e) — 7/3/2011 @ 11:47 amI’ve been a regular reader and sporadic commenter for many years. I was pleased to see Lee begin posting here, as I think he brings a useful and interesting perspective.
I’ve followed the Weiner story since it broke, and have read most of the posts and comments. It’s mind blowing and interesting and puzzling and fun.
Every time I think I might have something to offer, I realize that someone else has made the point better than I could, and I refrain.
And in this current contretemps between Lee and Pat, well, neither needs me to jump in and be a white knight. Pat has his reasons and he’s the boss around here. So, there’s really no reason for me to comment on that either.
Then I think, how does this attitude get us to 1000 comments on this thread? It doesn’t.
Pious Agnostic (6048a8) — 7/3/2011 @ 11:47 amI have no quality to add, so I’ll just add quantity. I read daily, but comment (very) rarely.
Darin H (07889f) — 7/3/2011 @ 11:48 am1. I am not going to say where I got anything from anyone. Where did you get the idea that your assertion #1 was true?
2. The information I published about Ethel was based on publicly available information.
3. Clearly JohnReid9 has used this site to disseminate information. Have I ever claimed otherwise? He/she/they sent me a bunch of information; I stated about 1000 times that I don’t vouch for it but it’s news whether it’s genuine or coming from a sock puppet; and then I published it. What I deny is that I ever vouched for anything he said.
Patterico (f724ca) — 7/3/2011 @ 11:48 amAnd just where is GennetteC of late? She being the one out of all of us who most wants to find out who is behind the socks. Curious time to disappear, hmmm?
Tutu (54ce64) — 7/3/2011 @ 11:50 amscience yay
happyfeet (3c92a1) — 7/3/2011 @ 11:51 amscience yay
happyfeet (3c92a1) — 7/3/2011 @ 11:51 amI vouch that Patterico never vouched for anything that Lee Stranahan vouches is false. 299 to go!
starboardhelm (e93080) — 7/3/2011 @ 11:52 am“I spoke to Patterico a few hours ago and he was arguing adamantly for this theory, with no evidence whatsoever. It’s what he believes.”
I am patiently awaiting the evidence on the spurned lover/sexter theory, which I am reliably informed is not at all bizarre, but in the interim, I do like the Boston song “More Than A Feeling.”
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/3/2011 @ 11:56 amHopefully, GenetteC is off doing something nice and completely non-Weinergate related for her Fourth of July weekend.
Or better yet, studying.
Dianna (f12db5) — 7/3/2011 @ 11:56 am“Ethel” was publically exposed, re Weiner, on May 30, I believe. She wasn’t ID’d as “Ethel” at that time, that “nom” came later, but ….. A quick look at her facebook, given other info that came to light, …..
MDr (fd1f4b) — 7/3/2011 @ 11:56 amIf eating a slice of watermelon causes an erection lasting more than four hours…
Tutu (54ce64) — 7/3/2011 @ 11:57 amEating too much watermelon has a laxative effect as well. For what that’s worth.
Simon Jester (0f751a) — 7/3/2011 @ 11:58 amI don’t want it to be a “contretemps.” I really don’t.
Patterico (f724ca) — 7/3/2011 @ 11:58 amIndeed – it’s got at least some plausibility, but I’m not seeing solid evidence, either.
Aside from the particularly horrible Steely Dan video, I’ve liked most of the Weinergate music. I don’t believe I’d heard “Christine” since I stopped listening to alternative radio back in the 90’s some time.
One more comment to the 1,000 total!
Dianna (f12db5) — 7/3/2011 @ 11:59 amEr, “towards” the 1,000 total.
Dianna (f12db5) — 7/3/2011 @ 11:59 amI’m hoping for that double-punk fake fight theory.
That would be too much fun, a surprise pony, champagne spray and confetti everywhere at the denouement.
When everything is all over, pretend that’s what happened, I insist. I will be your willing dupe. We can invite Tommy to report on it.
SarahW (af7312) — 7/3/2011 @ 12:00 pmStranahan’s cat favors dance music I see.
SarahW (af7312) — 7/3/2011 @ 12:03 pmMr. Feets – How about eating some Official Fish of Patterico’s Pontifications, the tasty sammin which comes in number of different varieties pleasing to the palate, in honor of our humble nation’s founding tomorrow?
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/3/2011 @ 12:03 pm“Sooner or later, whether consciously or subconsciously, a man will always bare his true character.”
Anitabusch (a025dd) — 7/3/2011 @ 12:03 pmI spent many a day here a while back. Never once have I even thought that Pat was inclined to be unfair or that he would ban someone for presenting an opposing viewpoint.
He is among the best and the brightest on the blogosphere.
This other character I don’t know much about. I find Pat trustworthy and a very solid critical thinker.
This other character, I don’t know much about.
Pat has a proven track record on a number of issues, a very stable hand on the rudder of his opinions, does not leap to conclusions and usually carefully crafts his point of view.
This other character, I don’t know much about.
Pat has shown he has enormous character. Therefore, I stand behind him completely from a guy with an amount of character…I don’t need to know much more.
cfbleachers (fb9900) — 7/3/2011 @ 12:04 pmIs this why we came down from the trees?
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/3/2011 @ 12:06 pmHe criticized me for allowing JohnReid9 INTO COMMENTS without calling him a liar.
That would be like if I allowed a leftist on here to praise Obama, and someone said I had provided an “uncritical” platform for someone to support Obama without challenging them whatsoever.
I have no duty to challenge commenters, including those who are at the center of a story, and whose words are of great interest to many people. If I wish to invite them on, and let the COMMENTERS be critical, I have every right to do that without having someone imply I am agreeing with that person.
I never vouched for JohnReid9, but in giving Lee a platform here, I could be seen as vouching for him generally. When I saw him misrepresenting my position, I decided I could no longer give him that position, where someone could claim I was vouching in some sense for what he was saying — including about me.
Patterico (f724ca) — 7/3/2011 @ 12:06 pmDoes that mean we’ll get “All that she Wants (is another baby)”? I hope so! It’s got a great beat.
Dianna (f12db5) — 7/3/2011 @ 12:06 pmMr. Feets – You could whip yourself up a nice, cold, healthy, sammin shake, uses the whole fish, no wasted parts. I saw Mr. Dan Ackroyd demonstrate this wif a bass in the 1970s. Looked delicious.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/3/2011 @ 12:07 pmKeep fighting the good fight, Patrick.
Anitabusch (a025dd) — 7/3/2011 @ 12:07 pmcfbleachers – It’s nice to see you back here. I was out of town when you returned.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/3/2011 @ 12:09 pmNo, that was so we could invent pedicures with parrafin and hot basalt massages.
Or maybe it was barbeque.
Dianna (f12db5) — 7/3/2011 @ 12:09 pm___________________________________________
Incidentally, I have not “banned” him but simply disabled his account to “no role on this blog.”
I hope Lee is brought back here. It’s always interesting seeing POVs from various angles, although I am puzzled why people after a certain age (say, around 30 to 40) remain tied to a philosophy they probably favored in their younger years.
As for reaching 1,000 posts, whoever designed this forum interface needs to have their eyeballs examined and then poked out. I don’t know of any other message board on the internet whose format lacks horizontal lines that separate one poster’s text from the other. It’s like looking at huge chunks of sentences that lack paragraph breaks.
In regards to the players in Weinergate, I admit to being curious less about the specifics and details of such people, real or phony, than whether they were or are shills for the Democrats/left and the ex-Congressman. But to help this blog entry reach that 1,000 mark, here’s my contribution.
Mark (411533) — 7/3/2011 @ 12:10 pmPatterico,
Aren’t you supposed to tell us all what to think???
Letting us hear other points of view is so tiring and dangerous.
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/3/2011 @ 12:11 pmDoing my part to get to 1,000 …
IMO Patterico’s John Reid posts have tried to develop new facts — not push an opinion regarding what’s true or what the facts are — and he has repeatedly said he can’t vouch for John Reid.
I know Lee understands the difference between theories and facts because he made that distinction in this June 1, 2011, post he wrote early in the Weinergate story:
As I recall, Lee pushed this theory hard during the early days of Weinergate, but at least he seemed to realize his theory wasn’t the same as fact. What I don’t understand is why Lee can’t seem to make that distinction when it comes to Patterico’s discussions and posts as the post-Weinergate sockpuppet story has unfolded.
I’m not saying this to pile on to Lee. Instead, I wish he would try harder to do what he did in the beginning of this story: Distinguish between what he thinks is true and what he can prove is true. Because, frankly, he’s been known to guess wrong.
DRJ (fdd243) — 7/3/2011 @ 12:11 pmdaley@705,
Brother Bradley J. Fikes, C.O.R. (62e76d) — 7/3/2011 @ 12:12 pmHere you go!
Dianna,
Nobody gets near my feets with hot anything.
I don’t like BBQ (but don’t tell my fellow Texans!!)
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/3/2011 @ 12:14 pmDRJ,
Would you please email me at bradleyfikes (at) gmail (dot) com?
I’ve been working on a Texas-related journalism/political post that has gotten lost in this kerfuffle. It’s got some timeliness.
Thanks,
Bradley
(And another comment toward the 1,000 mark!)
Brother Bradley J. Fikes, C.O.R. (62e76d) — 7/3/2011 @ 12:15 pmWhen Pattrico’s on the prod, he’s like a one-eyed cat peepin’ in a seafood store.
ropelight (8ea8ac) — 7/3/2011 @ 12:16 pm___________________________________________
That’s because scientists say watermelon has ingredients that deliver little blue pill-like effects to the body’s blood vessels
Definitely an appropriate tidbit in light of a thread about a guy like Weiner who apparently was obsessed with the size and condition of his package.
Mark (411533) — 7/3/2011 @ 12:17 pmComment by DRJ — 7/3/2011 @ 12:11 pm
A great treat to see you here, Ma’am.
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/3/2011 @ 12:17 pm“Is this why we came down from the trees?”
Machinist – Have you been spying on me?
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/3/2011 @ 12:18 pmIs this why we came down from the trees?
Comment by Machinist — 7/3/2011 @ 12:06 pm
What a piece of work is man
SarahW (af7312) — 7/3/2011 @ 12:18 pmAnother in a sad history of firsts for this blog over this whole pathetic saga
Violating Pats privacy is a deal breaker regardless of your stance on issues privcy is universally regarded as an issue of trust
oh well, bye Lee. You should apologize to Pat, hire a lawyer, and
EricPWJohnson (2921b6) — 7/3/2011 @ 12:19 pmHow did 135 more comments get posted while I was staring at TweetDeck? This is crazy.
koam @wittier (e74ff0) — 7/3/2011 @ 12:19 pmPatterico@710–
I’d much rather have a denouement than a contretemps today. Perhaps some fromage and a glass of Bordeaux would help.
elissa (fe7129) — 7/3/2011 @ 12:20 pmhttp://prudencepaine.com/2011/07/02/more-for-weinergate-addicts/
Blackburnsghost (2ffb0c) — 7/3/2011 @ 12:20 pmsorry hit send before I was finished
hire a lawyer, and review with them all your legal exposure to reassure yourself you are fine, perhaps then you will be more at ease
Also report any and all death threats to police immediately
EricPWJohnson (2921b6) — 7/3/2011 @ 12:20 pmmake that #712. darn numbers keep achangin’
elissa (fe7129) — 7/3/2011 @ 12:22 pmTutu,
rogerthat (f5aad4) — 7/3/2011 @ 12:25 pmI’ve found GennetteC’s disappearance weird, especially given that her last comment was telling JR that she was going to email Nikki. Her supposed exit comment was hilarious, though. Credit where it is due.
My previous comment should say
@ 703 Tutu
Sorry.
rogerthat (f5aad4) — 7/3/2011 @ 12:26 pmI feel like I’ve gotten to the party late. We’ve almost got a full blown blog war going on. Almost that is.
Why does everyone keep talking about “high stakes?” What are the stakes here?
Someone further up mentioned what I’ve been wondering all along if Patterico was providing a venue of “rope” for many of the participants to go and try and “hang themselves” with. I never mentioned it before because it seemed to be working pretty well on both GC and JR.
Johnny 5 is alive (5ccc5e) — 7/3/2011 @ 12:26 pmelissa@740,
Excellent suggestion, and it inspired me. I don’t have any fromage or Bordeaux handy at the moment, but I do have a Charles Shaw Merlot that I’ve just uncorked.
It helps pass the time while reading this thread and watching my NiMH batteries cycle in my smart charger.
Brother Bradley J. Fikes, C.O.R. (62e76d) — 7/3/2011 @ 12:28 pmI noticed “Paul” used the words, “might could” in a sentence . That combination is found in areas such as eastern Kentucky and somewhat in western Virginia.
Meh (f72fb5) — 7/3/2011 @ 12:29 pmDoes that mean we’ll get “All that she Wants (is another baby)”? I hope so! It’s got a great beat.
Comment by Dianna — 7/3/2011 @ 12:06 pm
Love that song. So here’s another excuse for a comment toward 1000.
no one you know (136b86) — 7/3/2011 @ 12:30 pmWe’ve got a nice little spread out, including a domestic camembert and a zippy little petite sirah. Lots of fruit and both red and white sangria, some mac salad, bbq’d pork, and green salad for the sit-down portion of the meal. We are certain this will refresh us and our neighbors.
Dianna (f12db5) — 7/3/2011 @ 12:30 pmI was fond of one theory – that the manipulator of sock puppets had been involved in the threats, and a by-stander (JG in MA) had gotten involved by accident
For what it’s worth, I’m still quite fond of that theory. And for those who alternatively think that JGMA is the lone sockpuppeeter, doesn’t it seem odd that the puppeteer seems to operate on west coast time ?
For example, in the new bunch of captured starchild tweets Prudence Paine posted, the puppets are still tweeting at 3:52 AM EDT. Sure, it’s _possible_ that someone in Boston could stay up all night generating inane tweets. On the other hand could someone in MA have done the May 14th tweets about the Dodgers game ? While the Redsox were playing the Yankees ? That I find that hard to believe.
piglet (1bb7dc) — 7/3/2011 @ 12:32 pmAnd another dance tune, in happyfeet’s honor (I know he likes the artists and this is a great song)
(applicability to current situation only semi-intended)
no one you know (136b86) — 7/3/2011 @ 12:32 pm“…some mac salad…”
0.0
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/3/2011 @ 12:32 pm#749 – Whee!
Dancing!
Dianna (f12db5) — 7/3/2011 @ 12:33 pmGood points, piglet. I tend to agree.
DRJ (fdd243) — 7/3/2011 @ 12:33 pmWhen you lay down w/ dogs …..
Just sayin’
MDr (fd1f4b) — 7/3/2011 @ 12:34 pm@744- rogerthat I still think she holds a lot of the keys to the puzzle. When her BS stopped working, she disappears.
Tutu (54ce64) — 7/3/2011 @ 12:34 pm**separated comment to add to total count**
BTW have liked Lee’s stuff since he’s come here and am happy to see Patterico not wanting this to turn into burnt bridges. I truly hope it can end in, as elissa put pretty well, a denouement instead.
no one you know (136b86) — 7/3/2011 @ 12:36 pmIt will all come to brawling and requests to lower volume
SarahW (af7312) — 7/3/2011 @ 12:37 pm#751 – piglet
Indeed, and thank you! I’ve been wondering if I’d fallen off the roof (gone irrational) with that theory.
Dianna (f12db5) — 7/3/2011 @ 12:38 pm#744 roger
Meh (f72fb5) — 7/3/2011 @ 12:40 pmShe still reads and pops up to fuss a to make a short fuss.
Probably. Unless someone proclaims an open-flame-war thread. Though that doesn’t always work, either.
Dianna (f12db5) — 7/3/2011 @ 12:42 pmTyping from phone and I can’t catch edit mistakes . Arghh
Meh (f72fb5) — 7/3/2011 @ 12:42 pmStolen from Stranahan’s cat
SOCK PARTY! (Anthem)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8MUAnfEaqug
SarahW (af7312) — 7/3/2011 @ 12:43 pmTears before bedtime!
(More towards 1,000 comments)
Dianna (f12db5) — 7/3/2011 @ 12:43 pm#748, Meh, “might could” can also be found in current use both in Oklahoma and among the State’s peripatetic brethren relocated to California’s San Joaquin Valley.
ropelight (8ea8ac) — 7/3/2011 @ 12:44 pmsummer solstice!
here you click you see is beautiful!
happy floating polish lanterns!
Mr daley did you not hears????
I am boycotting the tasty tasty sammins cause of America’s fascist and anti-science sammin policies
all that’s about is Alaska’s corrupt representative Don Young preventing competitions – he’s a sick sick anti-American loserdouche
happyfeet (3c92a1) — 7/3/2011 @ 12:45 pm________________________________________
he’s like a one-eyed cat peepin’
Speaking of one-eyed, here’s a fitting tribute to Anthony Weiner, symbolizing about all the seriousness and respect he deserves.
BTW, the character of “son” or “Johnson,” referring to actor Clint Howard (aka Ron Howard’s brother), is a rarity in Hollywood: He’s a conservative.
Mark (411533) — 7/3/2011 @ 12:45 pm631 ∅
Lee says he has law enforcement involved and being helpful but can’t say more about that yet. Don’t know what else, now that he’s cut confidences with Preston (a good thing!)
koam @wittier (e74ff0) — 7/3/2011 @ 12:47 pmTime to pump up the jam!
Brother Bradley J. Fikes, C.O.R. (62e76d) — 7/3/2011 @ 12:48 pmoooh piglet EXCELLENT catch!
Blackburnsghost (2ffb0c) — 7/3/2011 @ 12:48 pm633. PatAz
I took Lee’s frustration with the left’s positions on this story to be evidence of thinking, change, and generally positive. I’m not at all skeptical of it as it makes total sense. I think he’s a straight shooter & I disagree with him on lots of things, and agree on lots of others.
koam @wittier (e74ff0) — 7/3/2011 @ 12:49 pm#769 koam – Well, he was accused of making (or inspiring) threats. I’d want my name cleared PDQ.
I still don’t quite understand what’s up with Ms. Preston.
Dianna (f12db5) — 7/3/2011 @ 12:50 pmRope, Did not know that speech pattern had spread . Lucky them. 😀
Meh (f72fb5) — 7/3/2011 @ 12:54 pmThe whole situation is easy to understand: Karl Rove is behind it to totally discredit the Democratic Party.
Cheney helped.
roy in nipomo (bca582) — 7/3/2011 @ 12:54 pmOf course koam, you asked the one question that Lee could not answer. Amazing, that.
Tutu (54ce64) — 7/3/2011 @ 12:54 pmThat little Weiner dude thinks he’s got a big rod? He don’t know what big is!
Tachyglossus aculeatus (62e76d) — 7/3/2011 @ 12:56 pmNot clicking that for anything!
Dianna (f12db5) — 7/3/2011 @ 12:57 pmNot having paid attention to the extended version of the Wiener twitter story I can’t comment on it. I will say my money is with Patterico. Not because I am trying to win a Patterico poney or anything. Patterico is one of only a few sites I have the linked or read on a daily basis. The storys are alway well reasoned, insightful and painstakingly detailed. If only our ‘real’ news sites could have the same standards. There I did my part for the 1,000.
deadserfs (bb89f9) — 7/3/2011 @ 12:59 pmDianna@778,
Tachyglossus aculeatus (62e76d) — 7/3/2011 @ 1:02 pmRelax, it’s not a David Ehrenstein-type link. But it is animal porn – specifically, monotreme porn. That’s the best kind!
Now interrupting your regularly scheduled programming.
FYI grilling wieners isn’t green.
http://michellemalkin.com/2011/07/01/4th-of-july/
Comedy gold
Blackburnsghost (2ffb0c) — 7/3/2011 @ 1:07 pmIs this the best representation of the tweet timeline?
http://www.soundbitten.com/
CausticConservative (b29599) — 7/3/2011 @ 1:10 pm@cfbleachers … couldn’t agree with you more about Patrick’s character. A man of high integrity and very fair.
Anita Busch (a025dd) — 7/3/2011 @ 1:12 pmUnlike the Los Angeles Times.
Brother Bradley J. Fikes, C.O.R. (62e76d) — 7/3/2011 @ 1:15 pm“Mr daley did you not hears????”
Mr. Feets – No I had not heard. Thanks for the heads up. Go with the bass shake instead.
Damn Luddites!
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/3/2011 @ 1:16 pm#781 – Ha!
And the plum and ricotta tart is cooling, while I’ve set a bottle of muscat to chill.
Dianna (f12db5) — 7/3/2011 @ 1:16 pmIs watermelon a racist fruit?
PatAZ (efd43b) — 7/3/2011 @ 1:16 pmHappyfeet
Meh (f72fb5) — 7/3/2011 @ 1:16 pmSpectacular! Thanks for sharing
Bass-A-Matics are very reasonable these days.
PatAZ (efd43b) — 7/3/2011 @ 1:18 pmOk Dianna now you’re getting just mean.
Meh (f72fb5) — 7/3/2011 @ 1:19 pmTorture me no more.
I sponsor a household of gustatory evil. If I weren’t watching my cholesterol, I’d be in a coma from eating by now.
Dianna (f12db5) — 7/3/2011 @ 1:22 pmDianna: Your meal sounds absolutely delicious, but is it approved by Michelle’s food police?
PatAZ (efd43b) — 7/3/2011 @ 1:23 pmMy contribution to a 1000 posts.
I tend to think Lee’s theory is the most plausible. (omg! omg! some sock account thinks Lee might be right!)
That doesn’t mean I think Patterico’s strategy is for not. I actually can’t wait to read Pat’s theory on all this when it’s laid out.
I kind of thought they were just playing good cop/bad cop. Who knows? It will be fun to finally find out what really went down.
Noodles (3681c4) — 7/3/2011 @ 1:26 pmPatterico, at comment 649, I asked this: Patterico, is it true that you got the information for your story on “Ethel” from John Reid?
You asked where I got that idea from (I think, I’m lost with almost 800 comments to peruse). Well the idea came from Lee’s post where he says this:
“A few days ago, Patterico told me that the source of that information. Sock puppet “John Reid” told Patterico about the Ethel Tumblr page and the “Large. In Charge” comments.”
Woodshedder (44e97d) — 7/3/2011 @ 1:26 pmAnd the plum and ricotta tart is cooling…
Dianna,
Do you have proof of your FLOTUS pie waiver for this?
Dana (4eca6e) — 7/3/2011 @ 1:27 pmNo; in fact, it’s so incorrect that I’m thinking of writing it up and sending it to her office.
Dianna (f12db5) — 7/3/2011 @ 1:30 pmIf I eat Dianna’s tart in the Internet, but no one hears it. Does it exist?
Meh (f72fb5) — 7/3/2011 @ 1:32 pmIf I had one, I’d ceremonially hand it over to one of the grill-meisters for fire-starting duty.
Did I mention that there’s also gourmet ice cream? Two flavors: chocolate cherry and coconut.
I can’t have ’em, but they’re there for everyone else!
Dianna (f12db5) — 7/3/2011 @ 1:33 pmYou BAKED. A. PIE. In an OVEN. Shame on you
Blackburnsghost (2ffb0c) — 7/3/2011 @ 1:34 pmcrying/laughing
My mom called yesterday when I was reading that and she said “So I’ve got hot dogs and sausages I made potato salad and baked beans and I think your grandmother baked a pie”
“gustatory evil” indeed. It’s time to stop the madness.
I’ve put my foot down and told my 92yr old grandmother that I cannot sponsor her pie in my home.
Remember the good old days? When Patrick was 24/7, fisking LAT? Wait! Did I say that? Why yes, I did.
I condemn myself. It’s much, much better now, ie Patterico’s posts.
MDr (fd1f4b) — 7/3/2011 @ 1:34 pmIf I eat Dianna’s tart in the Internet, but no one hears it. Does it exist?
Surely it must because my mouth is watering already!
Dana (4eca6e) — 7/3/2011 @ 1:35 pmFaithful reader. I have never commented before. Just trying to help out and get to the magic number of 1000.
Constance Bartl-Luthi (0f2e6e) — 7/3/2011 @ 1:39 pmI can’t believe I’ve mentioned baking tarts, and no one’s quoted Lewis Carroll yet!
Dianna (f12db5) — 7/3/2011 @ 1:39 pmWhoo-hoo! We’ve broken 800!
Dianna (f12db5) — 7/3/2011 @ 1:39 pmEnjoy your Independence Day watermelon without undue concern. It’s and equal opportunity fruit which originated in Southern Africa and quickly spread throughout the African continent, to China, Europe, and eventually to the New World. (Slave traders packed stores of local foods like black-eyed peas and okra with which the slaves were already familiar to help keep them calm on the long voyage across the Atlantic.)
Incidentally, archaeologists found numerous watermelon seeds in King Tut’s tomb.
ropelight (8ea8ac) — 7/3/2011 @ 1:42 pmAll this pie talk reminds me of that Obama speech about pies. You would think I would have forgotten about that but it was so weird I still think about it sometimes.
Noodles (3681c4) — 7/3/2011 @ 1:43 pmQuestion. Do we get another post after 1000. Pwease?
Blackburnsghost (2ffb0c) — 7/3/2011 @ 1:44 pmI am the original Alice, but I was attempting to be modest. Have some tea?
Meh (f72fb5) — 7/3/2011 @ 1:46 pm806 #
Meh (f72fb5) — 7/3/2011 @ 1:49 pmyes He was beyond strange. I kept wandering if he wS speaking in code
Lift and load. Lift and load. One for little Adolph. And one for the road.
From a movie on WWII, very under appreciated. Not the movie, but the effort of those, without which, the War in Europe, may have taken a decided turn for the worse.
Rememeber all our veterans on the Fourth.
MDr (fd1f4b) — 7/3/2011 @ 1:50 pm@809
I agree. It was another weirder than weird thing he has done that no one explains. I swear this guy does the weirdest stuff and no one says a word about it.
Of course if Sarah Palin had…ah…you get the picture. =)
Noodles (3681c4) — 7/3/2011 @ 1:55 pmSadly, I have lost so much respect for Patterico in this. I am a relatively new reader and after this a former reader. The non weiner posts are well done and interesting. (Thank you Aaron Worthing, I hope you find a site that is worthy of you!) I do find the weiner story interesting but all the nonsense surrounding it has become ridiculous. I don’t for a second believe that Patterico isn’t sure of exactly what happened and who everybody is. Finishing the story and putting it all out there would result in a lot less attention for him now, wouldn’t it? All a lot of dramatic nonsense to get you all worked up. Go Go 1000 posts. Ick!
Amanda Lynn (d3e2bd) — 7/3/2011 @ 1:56 pmThank you, MDr. We always do, here.
I read a suggestion that a reading of the Declaration is an appropriate start to dinner.
Dianna (f12db5) — 7/3/2011 @ 1:58 pmThe WeinerGate plumbers.
Think about it.
MDr (fd1f4b) — 7/3/2011 @ 1:59 pmWe have seen entirely too much of Weiner’s plumbing.
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/3/2011 @ 2:02 pmComing in at 812 with a bullet, Amanda Lynn.
Tutu (54ce64) — 7/3/2011 @ 2:06 pmI remember when Congressmen mailed out pictures of themselves shaking hands with the President and such rather than sending pictures of their genitals or of themselves naked in the House showers to young women.
Does that date me?
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/3/2011 @ 2:06 pm“We have seen entirely too much of Weiner’s plumbing.”
Hmmmmm. Most “plumbing” I’ve seen is a wee bit bigger. Now maybe if Swift is the standard, ie lilliputian …..
MDr (fd1f4b) — 7/3/2011 @ 2:09 pm#802
Faithful reader. I have never commented before. Just trying to help out and get to the magic number of 1000.
Comment by Constance Bartl-Luthi — 7/3/2011 @ 1:39 pm
Ditto. I must add, I’m totally lost on weinergate, and have lost many hours reading about tarts and anteaters!
Amy Shulkusky (f1ee33) — 7/3/2011 @ 2:11 pmHaving read both Stranahan and Patterico, I have two points to make, one long, one brief.
Long point. It is very hard to take Stranahan seriously. He cannot present a narrative clearly; indeed he sometimes seems unable to write English. He (perhaps legitimately) withholds information, but then expects people to accept his only partially suppported arguments. He does not reason; he pronounces.
I must admit that, based on what I have read so far, what seems most plausible is that JG MA is the one and only puppeteer. But I have not seen proof. Stranahan seems to believe that his failure to threaten JG MA proves that she is lying so desperately that she must be the arch-deceiver. As Patterico, however, points out, it is possible that someone did threaten her (just not Stranahan).
It is also possible that JG MA may in fact have subjectively felt threatened by Stranahan. His recorded conversation with the JG CA was very odd. He bugs JG CA to communicate with him, says virtually nothing after communications are established, asks her if she wants to ask him anything, and then intimates that she must prove to him a negative and that she is guilty in his eyes until proven innocent. That conversation was odd enough to create an impression of threat that was not intended.
JG MA’s subjective feeling that Stranahan threatened her might have been (probably was) wholly made up, but it might possibly have been true, particularly if she is indeed the puppeteer. I simply cannot assign any probative value to the conjunction of the two facts that (1) she alleged being threatened, and (2) Stranahan did not intentionally threaten her.
Short point. Lay off Stranahan’s cat. I have never heard a cat do a better broadcast. If your cats are superior performers, let’s hear them.
JeffM (d78fd0) — 7/3/2011 @ 2:13 pmAll I know is, I used to read this blog religiously–checked it several times a day. After Lee Stranahan showed up, I just quit reading it. I’d check every great once in a while, but that was all. It was like the character of the blog changed, and not for the better. It sounds like the blog will be going back to the way it used to be–I like that, and will be checking it more often again.
Barbara Oakley (a19e30) — 7/3/2011 @ 2:14 pmOkay, I need to finish getting the yard ready, etc. for tomorrow. When I get back I expect Lee or Patterico to have broken this case wide open!
Noodles (3681c4) — 7/3/2011 @ 2:16 pmI am stepping out for some time with boyfriend and guests. And to evict the cat that’s hanging out in the kiddie pool I set up for my dogs; the dogs won’t go near it.
Dianna (f12db5) — 7/3/2011 @ 2:22 pm“All I know is, I used to read this blog religiously–checked it several times a day. After Lee Stranahan showed up, I just quit reading it.”
I was just as shocked, ie giving a leftist, keys to the car. Yet one more example that, the enemy of my enemy, is a friend, doesn’t always work out so well.
MDr (fd1f4b) — 7/3/2011 @ 2:24 pmJust helping to get to 1000.
Oh, an observation…Lee is still much too close to the left side of the political sphere to trust anything from him as fact. Of course, that’s just my opinion, because I never trust anything from anyone on the left. They lie with much too much ease.
Susie Q (a6955c) — 7/3/2011 @ 2:25 pm676 have blue
just say what you mean. who has time to go figure out your riddle?
koam @wittier (e74ff0) — 7/3/2011 @ 2:25 pmWhen did Weiner announce he had legal counsel, and a security firm to investigate? How many days before that announcement had he procured same? When did the sock puppets and threats start to escalate/grow?
What we need – an investigation headed by Ben Veniste
MDr (fd1f4b) — 7/3/2011 @ 2:31 pmThis is getting a little in the weeds, maybe a new thread, re Volokhs’ analysis of Judge Graham,
ian cormac (d380ce) — 7/3/2011 @ 2:32 pmWill a glittery ball drop at 1000?
Blackburnsghost (2ffb0c) — 7/3/2011 @ 2:36 pmI sure hope so or else I’m going to feel like a fool with this top hat and noisemaker.
Speaking of cats, and to add my one-thousandth, let me pose a question. Is a single man with a cat a turnoff to potential dates, as in not very manly?
My boss (a woman) says it is, but she is a dog-lover. I also love dogs, but am considering getting a cat because they are easier to leave alone when I am at work or traveling.
I wonder what others think.
norcal (c37272) — 7/3/2011 @ 2:38 pm@Amanda Lynn: Since you are relatively new reader, let me tell you that you are mistaken. Patrick is not one to jump to conclusions or head into anything with a pre-conceived notion. He gathers information and looks at it and let the evidence itself lead to the conclusion.
Anita Busch (a025dd) — 7/3/2011 @ 2:38 pmI’ve been trying (unsuccessfully) on Twitter to get someone to lay out for me a unifying theory of what’s going on here. My guess is that it’s just too complicated for that venue, so I thought I would try here. The closest I can come is the idea that this whole thing is masterminded and created by a single entity as a screenplay/performance art piece. Maybe that’s what Lee is proposing, although he never really comes out and says it. If so, who is the real person behind it all? And if this isn’t the best/most reasonable/most widely held theory, then what is.
If nothing else, this will help get to 1000.
PS – I admire Patterico for bringing Lee on. The idea clearly was that Lee was seeing things from a different perspective, but that he saw that the right wasn’t as nasty as the left. I believe Lee was correct (although I am guessing he doubts it now). In any case, this feels like one of those “It seemed like a good idea at the time” things. The issues that I (and I think Patterico as well) have with Lee have nothing to do with his political positions. Sometimes things just don’t work out the way we want them to.
Jan (fd5949) — 7/3/2011 @ 2:38 pmSometimes I get the impression that Stranahan is part of the very smokescreen is claims to be trying to cut through.
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/3/2011 @ 2:39 pmPlease cancel my subscription to Sports Illustrated.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/3/2011 @ 2:40 pm#824, MDr and #825, Suzie Q: My thoughts exactly from both of you. I felt at the beginning of the whole Weiner escapade, Lee seemed to want Weiner to be innocent and set up by his enemies so badly. Even after Weiner confessed, Lee still didn’t seem to be satisfied. Lee may be able to see bias from the left, but he is nowhere near changing sides.
PatAZ (efd43b) — 7/3/2011 @ 2:41 pmJan @832
Maybe there ISN’T a grand unifying theory. Maybe we have a case of really different individuals doing different things for different reasons. Or maybe more than one person can use an account so maybe for some sock puppets, it isn’t just one person tweeting in that name. To assume anything at this point is the road to folly.
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/3/2011 @ 2:44 pm829 – @RepWeiner is arranging for the glittery ball(s).
Jan (fd5949) — 7/3/2011 @ 2:46 pm834 – Cancel your own damn subscription! (HT to William F. Buckley)
Jan (fd5949) — 7/3/2011 @ 2:48 pm“Sometimes I get the impression that Stranahan is part of the very smokescreen is claims to be trying to cut through.”
Which sparks, a completely unrelated, cross neuronal, contamination.
All the original Journolistas were never identified. Who believes they haven’t resurrected themselves? Who are they? Any doubts they may have insinuated themselves into this very negative Dem story. To salvage what they can.
MDr (fd1f4b) — 7/3/2011 @ 2:50 pm#830 norcal –
I take to guys with pets. Or I used to, anyway. Cats are perfectly acceptable in a single guy in an apartment, and anything but unmanly.
Dianna (f12db5) — 7/3/2011 @ 2:52 pmGeneral feelings:
I never knew who Stranahan was before the Weiner scandal led me from Ace’s site to Patterico. Stranahan does appear to have difficulty clearly explaining what he knows and why. That was my impression when he first declared certainty about JG (“Conjecture is over”). The proof was that he talked to her on the phone and he talked to her alleged professor. But the proof wasn’t enough to show it was not a hoaxer, especially after what happened with Tommy Christopher.
In a recent post, Stranahan wrote: “Alicia Pain and John Reid have been working behind the scenes trying to get other people to reveal (alleged) information on Rep. Weiner and underage women.”
Okay. Um, how does he know this? Or is it conjecture?
I think most of Stranahan’s theories and conjectures are reasonable. But he does seem to go overboard and submit them as verified fact.
Patterico’s theory could be totally off the wall but I have never taken his theories as his definitive conclusions. I thought giving JR a platform was a good idea. But it was clearly never an endorsement by Patterico.
In my view Patterico is more Poirot and Stranahan more Scooby Doo. Patterico is more methodical and uncertain, testing his theories. Stranahan declares the identity of the monster based on gut feeling and a handful of facts (the problem is that there is often another rubber mask yet to be removed).
Crispian (70c05e) — 7/3/2011 @ 2:53 pmCrosspatch 836 – I didn’t mean to suggest that there was just one. I’m trying to understand what Patterico, or Lee, or somebody else actually thinks happened. I’m not assuming anything. I do believe tho that some people have a picture in their mind of what transpired, by whom, and for what purpose, but nobody seems to want to lay it out for “peer review”. I don’t want anybody to put their reputation on the line. I’d just like to get an understanding of what they think the overall picture is based on what they know at this point.
Jan (fd5949) — 7/3/2011 @ 2:54 pmMaybe you need a homicide detective to solve this.
Sammy Finkelman (6f74ae) — 7/3/2011 @ 2:54 pm#832 – Somewhere in the early hundreds of this monster thread, I asked Patterico if we were talking about a Glenn Greenwald-style “fun on the internet” hoax (a sock puppet or two) or “Holy Blood, Holy Grail” scale hoax. I’d still like to know.
Dianna (f12db5) — 7/3/2011 @ 2:55 pmYou know, Weiner was blackmailed – in 2009. The New York almost flatly reported it then.
Sammy Finkelman (6f74ae) — 7/3/2011 @ 2:56 pmWeiner was blackmailed? For what? Did an errant wiener pic show up in someone’s inbox?
Mike Myers (0e06a9) — 7/3/2011 @ 2:58 pmDitto.
And why would he not say, “Publish and be damned!”? He wasn’t married, then, and it would take more than some sexting by a single guy to make a serious scandal.
Dianna (f12db5) — 7/3/2011 @ 3:01 pm“Maybe you need a homicide detective to solve this.”
You’re a little too late with your request.
Columbo RIP
MDr (fd1f4b) — 7/3/2011 @ 3:02 pmAbsolutely true. I noticed this during his discussions with Ace. He’s got no sense of the difference between possibility and probability; thus, anything that is possible is regarded as probable depending upon utility in the moment.
rdbrewer (f628a1) — 7/3/2011 @ 3:02 pmAnyone know if Weiner’s blackberry was confiscated while he is in rehab?
PatAZ (efd43b) — 7/3/2011 @ 3:05 pm#840 Dianna
Thank you for your response. I have a house rather than an apartment, but I’m assuming that wouldn’t change your answer about a single guy with a cat.
norcal (c37272) — 7/3/2011 @ 3:07 pmrdbrewer, I have asked him questions, and I thought his responses indicated that he’d made up his mind.
Dianna (f12db5) — 7/3/2011 @ 3:08 pm#851 norcal – Not at all.
I’m a fanatic, which is why I could have dogs and cats while single. It’s hard. Single people usually stick to a cat, and I don’t blame them.
Dianna (f12db5) — 7/3/2011 @ 3:09 pmFolks what you have here is two people who go about this in very different fashions. I am dismayed by Lee posting that article the other day about Pat putting JohnReid9 on this site. I never once felt pat was giving Reid a pass. In fact I go the feeling that Pat was giving US the chance to grill JohnReid9. Many of you asked some great questions. Now go back and look how many REALLY tough ones he did not answer. Also compare his writing style to others in this scenario, like Patriotusa76 and any other of the purported Sock Puppets. Plenty of tweets out there on scribed and such. As far as the feud. Not sure who pissed on whose cornflakes first but accepting the method of investigation should be the priority. I don’t think Pat feels Lee is right and up until now he has never said that. But Lee did Publicly.
As for me. I find Lees analysis interesting. But much of what he does is supposition and in the world that Pat lives in supposition can get you hammered. Fact is what matters.
I am a trained interviewer and without giving away too much I will say I knew EXACTLY what Patterico was doing letting JohnReid post freely.
As far as Lee’s assumptions they too serve to challenge the reader to dig deeper. Lee is begging people to look into things.
Everyone is a suspect until they can be rules out. That is done by questioning and evidence gathering. But without a subpoena we only have what we have on Twitter and these few pages that still talk about this story.
Who got hurt?
Who benefited?
When did they give information?
How did they know it?
These are the questions I am trying to answer.
What are yours?
mikemadden59 (3cb7fd) — 7/3/2011 @ 3:10 pmEven someone not at all involved in journalism knows you don’t prove you cannot be trusted then wonder why people stop talking to you.
StillConfused (786412) — 7/3/2011 @ 3:15 pmHey Still do I know you?
mikemadden59 (3cb7fd) — 7/3/2011 @ 3:33 pmTotally understand why Patterico gave the floor to JR9, don’t understand why that was a problem in anyones mind. I get Lee’s assertion that fake people are spreading lies behind the curtain and those lies should not be promulgated but Patterico lifted the curtain. Didn’t write the script and was clear he was “agnostic”
Blackburnsghost (2ffb0c) — 7/3/2011 @ 3:37 pmI don’t know sometimes I think Lee confuses me lately more than anything in this entire drama. sorry?
Just so I can be even more cheesy and theatrical
“Me thinks thou doth protest too much”
#837 Jan. Shiver, Gag
Blackburnsghost (2ffb0c) — 7/3/2011 @ 3:37 pmHey Still do I know you?
Comment by mikemadden59
My statement was a general one mikemadden59. I don’t know you.
StillConfused (786412) — 7/3/2011 @ 3:37 pmI hope we get to 1,000 soon and Patrick publishes his magnum opus that explains everything Weiner.
Brother Bradley J. Fikes, C.O.R. (62e76d) — 7/3/2011 @ 3:37 pmObsession is not just a perfume.
Huey (ddf1a4) — 7/3/2011 @ 3:38 pmIsn’t Obsession a cologne? And what’s the difference?
*Doing my bit for 1,000 comments!
Dianna (f12db5) — 7/3/2011 @ 3:42 pmJeffG, LGF, and now Patterico. You will respect my authority!
Boogity Boogity Boogity (b12543) — 7/3/2011 @ 3:43 pmRemember when this was just about a perv with a God-complex?
StillConfused (786412) — 7/3/2011 @ 3:48 pm#851 norcal
I have a dog however cats are not at all feminine for a single guy to have. Unless you have a lot.
Frankly I think people who HATE cats are a little irrational. Although this attachment makes me question that.
http://ace.mu.nu/archives/getoverit.gif
Blackburnsghost (2ffb0c) — 7/3/2011 @ 3:48 pm864 Yeah, good times.
Sarahw (af7312) — 7/3/2011 @ 3:55 pmI think cats are marvels of nature, but they don’t really serve the kind of functional and companionship role that a dog can. My dog guards my house. She protects my home and family.
Can she gracefully fall to her feet? No. Cats are amazing. But boy do I wonder how a person could choose a cat over a dog for a pet, unless they don’t really want the work of a pet.
Plus dogs don’t use the facilities in your home unless you are a failed owner.
Admittedly, my episode was minor, but the similarity is impossible to miss.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/3/2011 @ 3:58 pmI prefer drakkar noir. Whatever happened to Canoe? As far as obsession goes, I’ve read shrink babble explaining that Nobama is a classic narcissist. Cracks me up so many Jewish people here in Palm Beach co. continue to think he is god and weiner’s internet play was his own private life. But of course the evil Bushitler remains the cause of all our present woes because Obama needs more time. One twat even insists we should re-elect duh won in 2016. God save us from idiotic bastard’s children assclowns.
Calypso Louie Farrakhan (40c5f4) — 7/3/2011 @ 3:59 pm@Crispian #841 … “In my view Patterico is more Poirot and Stranahan more Scooby Doo.”
Great analogy. I have felt the same way.
Anitabusch (a025dd) — 7/3/2011 @ 4:01 pmOh yes, it is just lovely to listen to some little yapping mutt carry on at all hours of day and night incessantly barking. That said, just watched episode of Sleeper Cell wherein dirtbag Muslim terroists kills a bunch of dogs while testing some deadly gas phosgene. He says next time we test it on two-legged creatures. Would love to see it used on terrorists. can some libtard here tell me why I should have any sympathy for the religion of peace or the permanent widdle refugees Palistineans? Israel could nuke Iran’s nuke facilities or even Mecca and I would say good on them. Of course the UN and Euroweenies would be upset but why should I care?
Calypso Louie Farrakhan (40c5f4) — 7/3/2011 @ 4:05 pmAnita, You’re strong and brave, and I’m glad to see you’re still standin’ up and talkin’ back.
ropelight (8ea8ac) — 7/3/2011 @ 4:06 pmWhile we’re on the road to 1,000 comments, here’s a PSA for those of us in California:
Some CA retailers still charging repealed sales tax
. . .On 1 July (the date the lower rate became effective), my son Steve and family went to lunch at “On the Border,” a nationwide restaurant chain with about 15 locations in CA. When the bill arrived, it included the outdated 8.75% San Diego sales tax. My son (at spouse Ingrid’s insistence) informed the manager of the change. The manager quickly contacted the regional office, and apparently this resulted in the entire chain becoming aware of the update. Steve scored a free meal out of it, and the restaurant was definitely pleased he brought it to their attention.
In the only retail transaction I made on 1 July, I found that I had to correct an auto shop bill that included the wrong 8.75% sales tax. The garage was an independent — not a chain. As always, caveat emptor. . .
Brother Bradley J. Fikes, C.O.R. (62e76d) — 7/3/2011 @ 4:07 pmBradley have you sent your story to Aaron, too? Unfortunately, DRJ doesn’t blog here (Though I’m sure she could if she wanted… and I know I’d love to read her stuff).
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/3/2011 @ 4:10 pmPat: When we hit 1,000 will you post the final, comprehensive explanation of the Weinergate sockpuppet universe?
slp (347e33) — 7/3/2011 @ 4:10 pmNow Patterico feuds with Jeff Goldstein, Radley Balko, and Lee Stranahan. At some point Patterico should think whether the problem is with all of these other people or himself.
I knew it wouldn’t last between him and Stranahan. Patterico is as thin skinned as they come…he can’t take any criticism no matter how light. And despite him talking a good game about being civil, he still flings out unprovoked attacks against those like Balko and Goldstein.
With all the talk of bannings and sock puppets, this place reads more like 4chan than a respectable conservative blog. Just Sayin.
JustinSayin (9eb0fa) — 7/3/2011 @ 4:12 pm“You know, Weiner was blackmailed – in 2009. The New York almost flatly reported it then.”
Mike “The Big Nanny” Bloomberg apparently threatened to expose what a major horndog Weiner was if he threw his hat in the mayoral race. I believe the Post wrote about it.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/3/2011 @ 4:12 pmDustin,
Brother Bradley J. Fikes, C.O.R. (62e76d) — 7/3/2011 @ 4:13 pmDRJ emailed me immediately afterwards, and it’s in her capable hands. My issue isn’t as huge as Weinergate, but it’s still worth some attention, I think. I had emailed Patterico and Aaron earlier, but Weinergate has pre-empted everything else with their blog time.
JustinSayin – That.Is.Exactly.What.Happened.
Outlaw!
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/3/2011 @ 4:15 pmPatterico provided a forum for
LeeJohnReid to say what he wanted to say and present what evidence he wanted to present.Patterico has been pretty scrupulous to say that he didn’t necessarily agree with what
LeeJohnReid had to say, nor that he endorsed whatLeeJohnReid said as true.It seems to me that if Patterico, after making honest attempts put aside any biases and disagreements with what
LeeJohnReid said on his blog, feels that he is being misrepresented byLeeJohnReid, he has every right to stop allowingLeeJohnReid access to post information on his blog.Just a thought.
Pious Agnostic (6048a8) — 7/3/2011 @ 4:18 pmJustinSayin:Did someone make you come here to read? JustAskin
PatAZ (efd43b) — 7/3/2011 @ 4:21 pmWhen we get to posting 999, nobody make a post. Lets just let it hang there for a while.
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/3/2011 @ 4:22 pmWhen is JohnReid9 going to show up and do a video chat with Patterico?
He answered some questions in comments for several days and then disappeared.
He needs to keep his promise to Pat and do the video chat.
slp (347e33) — 7/3/2011 @ 4:25 pmcrosspatch,
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/3/2011 @ 4:26 pmYou’re just trying to set up a prisoners dilemma, aren’t you?
#880 crosspatch
Blackburnsghost (2ffb0c) — 7/3/2011 @ 4:26 pmSockkk!
re: comment 871:
Here’s a very handy document for determing your updated local tax rate:
http://www.boe.ca.gov/pdf/pub71.pdf
h2u (0025d1) — 7/3/2011 @ 4:27 pmI do.
You might ask yourself: when is the last time JohnReid9 posted on this blog? When is the last time I stated that JohnReid9 had misrepresented my private communications with him? These are questions you might want to ask yourself.
Patterico (f724ca) — 7/3/2011 @ 4:28 pmAnd as a concerned Christian conservative, you just had to speak up?
Dianna (f12db5) — 7/3/2011 @ 4:29 pmFunny you should say this. I was sitting here wondering if JohnReid9 was in moderation or something….
Asking myself isn’t working; there’s only a handful of people who could answer this question.
Pious Agnostic (6048a8) — 7/3/2011 @ 4:34 pm#874, JustinSayin, Patterico’s not all that thin skinned. He takes his share of hard knocks here, some on target and some wide of the mark, and he doesn’t pull rank.
But, yes, he can also be prickly at times. On balance though, for the most part, he’s hard working, fair, and patient.
Check out the most recent Sockpuppet Friday post, there are several shots aimed directly at him.
ropelight (8ea8ac) — 7/3/2011 @ 4:35 pmOn the contrary, Dustin, cats CAN use the facilities indoors, and that is a distinct advantage, even when they forget to flush.
What’s the saying? Dogs have owners, cats have staff. I guess that is true, but hey, free mice.
Sarahw (af7312) — 7/3/2011 @ 4:36 pm“I know SPQR, but Lee has torpedoed all credibility with me. You’re kinder than I am in this.
Comment by Stashiu3 — 7/3/2011 @ 9:33 am”
I’m sure its a phase that I’ll grow out of in a minute or two, returning to my usual asshole self … and sure enough, I just did.
SPQR (26be8b) — 7/3/2011 @ 4:37 pmInteresting that JustinSayin lumps Jeff, Lee, and Radly in the same group. I don’t think Patterico ever said such a thing.
Patterico has been very tolerant of disagreement on his blog for years, but he debates in a principled manner and he does take exception to his positions and arguments being misstated and distorted and to private discussions being published without permission and in many cases without much attention to accuracy. Is that what JustinSayin is saying these people have in common?
I don’t think that reflects badly on Patterico.
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/3/2011 @ 4:38 pmCats rule!!
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/3/2011 @ 4:40 pmI would not be surprised if Lee or others have asked people to comment on here against Patrick.
Those of us who know Patrick, know better. The rest is just an ill attempt at defamation of character by people who have an agenda … and very transparent.
Anita Busch (a025dd) — 7/3/2011 @ 4:45 pmI think we should start taking bets on what time 1000 will appear. (although I suppose someone could take the fun out of it and type “I Win” a hundred times.
StillConfused (786412) — 7/3/2011 @ 4:45 pmI’m taking 6:59 pm
norcal 830, 851
IMO a man who does what he wants despite what “people” will think is most attractive. Less attractive is thinking that we women all think alike. 😉 Get a cat if that’s what fits your lifestyle best. If you lose out on a date because of it … well, aren’t likely missing out on much.
Dustin, 867 Agreed.. although I had a 120 lb rottweiler who could (until I caught her) jump into the kitchen sink to perch in the window with the grace of a cat. Straight up– without a running start.
eman (0e848b) — 7/3/2011 @ 4:46 pmThis site is starting to remind me of LGF, unfortunately.
oldirishpig (e7adde) — 7/3/2011 @ 4:46 pmWhen your comment disappears, I’ll believe you.
Pious Agnostic (6048a8) — 7/3/2011 @ 4:49 pmMachinist – JustinSayin mentions Patterico and JG have gotten in spats. JG has pissed everybody off over the years. For some reason JustinSayin feels this reflects more on Patterico.
I know, I know, Intentionalism!
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/3/2011 @ 4:51 pmComment by Pious Agnostic — 7/3/2011 @ 4:49 pm
Good point! Nicely put.
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/3/2011 @ 4:54 pmThis might be good time for me to bring up my new product line.
Blackburnsghost (2ffb0c) — 7/3/2011 @ 4:55 pmTHE SOCKPUPPET 2000! ©
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“But, yes, he can also be prickly at times. ”
Just don’t make him have to repeat himself.
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/3/2011 @ 4:56 pm901?
slp (347e33) — 7/3/2011 @ 4:56 pmdaleyrocks,
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/3/2011 @ 4:57 pmThe people he mentions tend top take disagreement as attacks and fly off the handle. I would resent being lumped with some of those.
I meant to be 901 when I wrote “901?”
Will this post be 902 or a later post?
slp (347e33) — 7/3/2011 @ 4:58 pm902 – I have see a few “don’t make me have to repeat myself” comments here and on twitter. I thought it was interesting at the time.
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/3/2011 @ 4:58 pmApproximately 93 comments to go! Excelsior!
Dianna (f12db5) — 7/3/2011 @ 5:00 pmMillenarianism can be fun!
Mokum (20a906) — 7/3/2011 @ 5:03 pmBoxers or briefs?
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/3/2011 @ 5:05 pmBack in high school, I started a great fight by laying out the argument for post-tribulationism, nearly provoking a fist-fight between two of the youth.
Dianna (f12db5) — 7/3/2011 @ 5:05 pmHere’s another 0.1%
Pious Agnostic (6048a8) — 7/3/2011 @ 5:10 pmSpeaking of the various tribulationisms, what if that idea was planted on purpose so we won’t be all that afraid when some alien race comes to collect us for food? Lee, thoughts?
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/3/2011 @ 5:15 pmOk, gonna take the kids to the pool. Have fun!
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/3/2011 @ 5:15 pm@ #900
Will there be a special om Sockpuppet Friday?
Bill M (25d866) — 7/3/2011 @ 5:16 pmI had to look it up. Apparently, “post-tribulationism” is the belief that after this thread reaches 1000 comments, there will be a period when loyal Patterico readers will remain, wandering about aimlessly, until such time when another post is, uh, posted.
Pious Agnostic (6048a8) — 7/3/2011 @ 5:17 pmTempus fugit.
roy in nipomo (bca582) — 7/3/2011 @ 5:24 pmEDF scares children and small animals.
StillConfused (786412) — 7/3/2011 @ 5:24 pmPretty accurate, Pious Agnostic!
Dianna (f12db5) — 7/3/2011 @ 5:28 pm“When your comment disappears, I’ll believe you.
Comment by Pious Agnostic — 7/3/2011 @ 4:49 pm”
It isn’t so much a case of you believing me, because I do feel that way, but more a question of your agreement, wouldn’t you say? But once the disappearances start (not saying they will, mind you), it will be too late, lol.
Still, I take your point. Well said.
oldirishpig (e7adde) — 7/3/2011 @ 5:29 pm776. Tutu
thanks
koam @wittier (e74ff0) — 7/3/2011 @ 5:30 pmSOCKPUPPET FRIDAYS! © Why didn’t I think of that!
Blackburnsghost (2ffb0c) — 7/3/2011 @ 5:33 pmWhat’s the topic again?
Mrs. Ed (a91fe8) — 7/3/2011 @ 5:34 pmit’s “smoked sausage”…
ColonelHaiku (822dce) — 7/3/2011 @ 5:36 pm820. JeffM
Excellent points about how JG MA may have perceived Lee interaction.
I asked Lee to list everything he said to JG MA and he hasn’t responded. I don’t know if he saw my question or not.
koam @wittier (e74ff0) — 7/3/2011 @ 5:37 pmnuttin’ from nuttin’
ColonelHaiku (822dce) — 7/3/2011 @ 5:38 pmbut Barry the Destroyer
he just gotta go
this just in to desk
ColonelHaiku (822dce) — 7/3/2011 @ 5:41 pmweiner caught snortin’ some tweet
off his blackberry
Ponder the meaning of post No.925
Cmate (525edc) — 7/3/2011 @ 5:41 pm#926 – I am awestruck.
Dianna (f12db5) — 7/3/2011 @ 5:42 pmI’m not going to go back and re-read all 900+ comments.
Did we decide that Patterico’s theories, (you remember, the topic of this post) were plausible and/or realistic?
Patterico said in UPDATE X2 that he was feeling better “with each passing second.” A lot of seconds have passed since then. I note, also, that good feelings can be generated by having a disturbing theory disproved, so don’t assume, as some have done, that this means he really likes these theories.
I seem to recall that #1 was generally not supported, while #2 was generally rebutted with “meh.”
Right? Wrong? Indifferent?
Either way, closer to our true goal.
Pious Agnostic (6048a8) — 7/3/2011 @ 5:45 pmcolonel’s lost brain cells
ColonelHaiku (822dce) — 7/3/2011 @ 5:46 pmcome back to haunt him BIGTIME
but he got rhythm
PA,
Brother Bradley J. Fikes, C.O.R. (62e76d) — 7/3/2011 @ 5:47 pmPatterico wrote: “I’m feeling better about the theory with each passing second.” (emphasis added)
Come on 1000…
(Just trying to help)
RB (382560) — 7/3/2011 @ 5:49 pmPatterico’s theories
1. False
2. True
3. True
slp (347e33) — 7/3/2011 @ 5:51 pmOn the other hand, the evidence to date supports the following answers:
1. False
2. False
3. False
slp (347e33) — 7/3/2011 @ 5:53 pm#930 Brother Bradley J. Fikes, C.O.R.
Ah, good point. I guess that an average person would interpret that to mean that the course of the discussion made him more inclined to think the theory sound.
I’m hardly an expert of Intentionalism (what I know I’ve learned here) but I know that an average person’s interpretation is a powerful argument, absent any other way of determining what an author intended.
Pious Agnostic (6048a8) — 7/3/2011 @ 5:54 pmPious Agnostic,
That’s what I think as well. It may also be a goad to those who think the theory wrong to speak up. He’s carefully withheld an ex patterica pronouncement on the theory’s validity.
Brother Bradley J. Fikes, C.O.R. (62e76d) — 7/3/2011 @ 5:58 pmLOVE it! 🙂
Pious Agnostic (6048a8) — 7/3/2011 @ 6:02 pmIs this the ONT?
MDr (fd1f4b) — 7/3/2011 @ 6:06 pmVery clever, Bradley, and I think your theory may be right, too.
On another topic, did John Reid ever explain how Jennifer George’s Twitter account changed into Nikki Reid’s? I’ve read so much stuff that I can’t remember if that’s been answered.
DRJ (fdd243) — 7/3/2011 @ 6:10 pmDragging this thread across the 1000 comment line is like going to Branson. It isn’t all that interesting or enlightening, but when it’s over, you can say you did it once.
CausticConservative (b29599) — 7/3/2011 @ 6:13 pm#938 – I cannot recall, either, and it’s a good question.
Dianna (f12db5) — 7/3/2011 @ 6:13 pmPatterico=Patrick Frey=Idiot Prosecutor
Once this post is deleted, it will screw up whoever gets Post 1000!!
mr mister (3eb1d0) — 7/3/2011 @ 6:14 pmWhen you’re transitioning from dyed in the wool “Crooks & Liars is teh bomb” to neo-conservative (a la neo-neocon), there are bound to be stumbles along the way, and a great many growing pains. It is possible Stranahan stumbled painfully.
But I have also found times where I felt the need to fire my 16-inch main battery at Patterico. (What can I say? I’m a former member of the Teufel Hunden.)
John Hitchcock (9e8ad9) — 7/3/2011 @ 6:16 pmOh, and mr mister is just a moron sock for some other moron who has been here before and got banned for being a moron.
John Hitchcock (9e8ad9) — 7/3/2011 @ 6:17 pmMr. Mister … assassinate character much? And anonymously, too. Means you have an agenda to defame. What a despicable act.
Anita Busch (a025dd) — 7/3/2011 @ 6:20 pmThis comment thread is running on fumes now. It’s going to be an empty victory for Patterico!
CausticConservative (b29599) — 7/3/2011 @ 6:26 pmTake
Pious Agnostic (6048a8) — 7/3/2011 @ 6:26 pmThese Broken Wings
And Learn To Lie Again
Learn to Live Unfree.
Throw us a bone so we can go for 2K!
CausticConservative (b29599) — 7/3/2011 @ 6:28 pm16 inch guns are sweet.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-5ATYPrZnSQ&feature=related
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/3/2011 @ 6:30 pmBite your tongue! Or rap your own knuckles with a pencil!
I can blather with the best, but that’s too much to ask.
Dianna (f12db5) — 7/3/2011 @ 6:30 pmWhen we get to 1,000 do we get Teh Rapture or Teh Zombie Apocalypse?
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/3/2011 @ 6:31 pmThere is a story that I hate.
It is this thing called “Weinergate.”
We always knew he was a loser.
Why must he dominate my Google newser?
Wouldn’t want to speculate*
But maybe he’s a boozer.*
http://hotair.com/archives/2011/06/02/a-poem-my-take-on-weinergate/
MDr (fd1f4b) — 7/3/2011 @ 6:33 pmFour dozen doughnuts.
Imagine four boxes of doughnuts, somebody brought them into the office.
Everybody takes one. They, they are all gone.
That’s how many comments we have left. Take one.
Pious Agnostic (6048a8) — 7/3/2011 @ 6:34 pmSock puppets and threats,
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/3/2011 @ 6:38 pmPictures we don’t want to see,
A dirty business.
Like some arguments,
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/3/2011 @ 6:40 pmThose doughnuts have holes in them.
And they are messy.
A cinnamon roll,
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/3/2011 @ 6:42 pmIs better than two doughnuts,
But counts only once.
Quantity from me,
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/3/2011 @ 6:44 pmQuality from other folks,
With more agile minds.
I think we all should understand that there is a or several criminal forces at work here … People have gotten threatened for looking into a news story.
I experienced this myself first-hand.
The criminal/s behind these threats is/are domestic terrorists and should be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law.
These tactics are not unfamiliar. They are similar to what “Sineater” pi Anthony Pellicano (who worked to discredit Gennifer Flowers and Monica Lewinsky for Bill and Hillary Clinton) worked — threaten and defame.
FACTS: Lesbian rumors surfaced in Sept. 2007 about Huma and Hillary and the very next month, the NY Post posted a gossip item about Huma’s romantic interest in Anthony Weiner. Bill Clinton officiated at their wedding.
Pellicano was thrown in prison for 15 years. I can only hope whomever is behind these criminal threats ends up with a similar fate.
They are the scum of the Earth.
Anita Busch (a025dd) — 7/3/2011 @ 6:45 pmIt’s late for me, so this’ll be my last until tomorrow.
Take it on home, Machinist!
Pious Agnostic (6048a8) — 7/3/2011 @ 6:46 pmPious Agnostic,
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/3/2011 @ 6:49 pmGood night and sweet dreams to you,
We will carry on.
Comment by Anita Busch — 7/3/2011 @ 6:45 pm
I could not agree more, but it will be hard to make progress with this. The left is too dependent on it as a tactic.
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/3/2011 @ 6:51 pmNeal Rauhauser’s Linked-In profile says “Hitman for the Lesbian Mafia” underneath his name.
Anita Busch (a025dd) — 7/3/2011 @ 6:52 pm@Machinist — Politics is a dirty business and has been throughout history, but don’t kid yourself. It goes on on BOTH sides. Remember Watergate?
Anita Busch (a025dd) — 7/3/2011 @ 6:54 pmAgreed. But let’s hope they’re not thrown in a California prison, or “15 years” might well turn into 90 days, measured as 5 8-hour days a week, making a calendar week turn into 4 weeks and a day of prison time.
John Hitchcock (9e8ad9) — 7/3/2011 @ 6:58 pmGratuitious shot at post 1000!
Kaisersoze (c86eb0) — 7/3/2011 @ 6:59 pmThat is one of gaping holes in JohnReid9’s story. As Lee demonstrated, it was simple for Jennifer George to change the name on the account from starchild 111 to Nikki Reid. His demonstration is on his site.
http://leestranahan.com/
slp (347e33) — 7/3/2011 @ 6:59 pmThis still going on? Perhaps Patterico play the Palin Card; that’s good for at least 40 PDS-inspired comments.
Hope you get to 1K, seriously.
Simon Jester (2df2ee) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:01 pmLee Stranahan has a new post up saying he will stop commenting on Weinergate, as it is in the hands of law enforcement. I am in total agreement, as I say here.
This is still the relevant comment thread and will remain so.
Patterico (f724ca) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:01 pmYou guys are lagging, my post 964 should have been 1000.
A couple of random thoughts –
I like Lee but he lost me when he posted that we had all “gone off the rails on the crazy train” by “pretending” JReid was real.
On the big picture, I still think the story is coordination by Weiner and his staff to cover things up and we still have some big trees that shouldn’t be missed for this forest –
1 – Gennette was involved and was frantically trying to gather information here.
2 – The blizzard of sockpuppetry by the various players
3 – The appearance of Dem Operative Neil, who could conceivably be exactly the type of guy a Dem congressman would bring in for sub rosa work and then deny knowing later.
Kaisersoze (c86eb0) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:02 pmLee has stopped talking publicly but I’ll be on TMZ tomorrow. Stay tuned, lots of news to come!
Strahahan's Cat (c86eb0) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:05 pmThat Jennifer George in Massachusetts created Nikki Reid, JohnReid9, Marinela Alicea, Mark Alicea, PatriotUSA76,and Alicia Pain is more likely scenario than starchild111 was hacked and taken over by someone else.
slp (347e33) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:07 pmI like the way you think KaiserSose.
CausticConservative (b29599) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:07 pmAlicia Pain is not necessarily in the same category as the rest.
I mean nobody is NECESSARILY in the same category, but she especially is not.
Patterico (f724ca) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:08 pm951.When we get to 1,000 do we get Teh Rapture or Teh Zombie Apocalypse?
Oooh, tough choice. Canz I haz both please?!?
Hopefully, Pat will have the updated post he has been hinting at.
Bill M (25d866) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:09 pm“It’s in the hands of law enforcement at this point.”
Is there an active investigation by law enforcement?
oldirishpig (e7adde) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:09 pmI don’t plan to do a post about this, but I have a couple of rhetorical questions:
1) Who first mentioned JG to Lee?
2) Who first brought Marianela Alicea tweets to Tommy Christopher’s attention?
3) What is the relationship of this person to Andrew Breitbart?
Chew on all that for a while and get back to me.
And yeah: I came up with that ALL ON MY OWN! So don’t ask me who tipped me off.
Patterico (f724ca) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:10 pmWhere is JohnReid9?
When is he going to do the video chat with Patterico?
slp (347e33) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:10 pmNo comment.
Patterico (f724ca) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:11 pmDang. Lee’s big book/movie deal must be on hold then. *cry (ugh)
StillConfused (786412) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:13 pmIt looks like Lee is taking a break from the story, that’s probably wise. This story seems to carry with it a Mummy like curse. The more involved you get the madder you become.
Johnny 5 is alive (5ccc5e) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:13 pmAt post 1000, I don’t have to worry about putting gas in my car anymore or paying my mortgage. At post 1000 Obama does it for me!
Kaisersoze (c86eb0) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:15 pmI’ve been wondering who brought up the JG name in general I believe the story is that St. Louis Activist Hub brought up the name Jenny George in CA initially. Beyond that I don’t know where the name came from.
Johnny 5 is alive (5ccc5e) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:15 pm“It’s in the hands of law enforcement at this point.”
It could be worse.
TSA
MDr (fd1f4b) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:15 pmSorry. I am not paying close enough attention to all the players.
slp (347e33) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:17 pmDoes the TSA CHeck SOCKS?
mikemadden59 (3cb7fd) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:17 pmI was way off. I said #1000 would be 6:59pm
StillConfused (786412) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:17 pmI can’t believe I’m sitting here refreshing my screen until the magic number appears.
Bill M (25d866) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:17 pmI am now officially laughing until I cry. I have no idea what’s going on, I cannot make head nor tail of which sock puppet belongs to whom.
I don’t even know if John Reid9 explained anything or not.
Dianna (f12db5) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:18 pmThis whole episode should put to rest how in lockstep conservatives are. Contrary to popular leftie myth most people on the right for better or for worse think for themselves.
Johnny 5 is alive (5ccc5e) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:18 pmFACTS: Lesbian rumors surfaced in Sept. 2007 about Huma and Hillary and the very next month, the NY Post posted a gossip item about Huma’s romantic interest in Anthony Weiner. Bill Clinton officiated at their wedding.
Comment by Anita Busch — 7/3/2011 @ 6:45 pm
Anita – Weiner’s behavior would make a lot more sense if he was a beard for Huma. Very good point.
Kaisersoze (c86eb0) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:18 pmI agree 100% with what Johnny 5 said.
mikemadden59 (3cb7fd) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:20 pmThe true sockpuppet is Clinton’s dead caat, Socks.
And it lives with Lee.
Bill M (25d866) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:20 pmba-da-bing!
MDr (fd1f4b) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:20 pmPatterico do threats that cross state lines necessarily involve the FBI?
Johnny 5 is alive (5ccc5e) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:20 pmLee should dedicate his Weinergate book to Shari Lewis.
slp (347e33) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:20 pmYou answered #1.
On to #2!
Hint: you answered #2.
Patterico (f724ca) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:20 pmSo who the heck is Dan Wolfe anyway?
CausticConservative (b29599) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:21 pm#1000 FTW!
Johnny 5 is alive (5ccc5e) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:21 pmFor all of the socks out there. Your official mantra:
http://www.hark.com/clips/wvqgqrzhrx-if-im-not-me-who-the-hell-am-i
goatsred (b20383) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:21 pmWhat 991 said. I’m down.
MDr (fd1f4b) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:23 pmOh my. History
MDr (fd1f4b) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:23 pmSo then who is St. Louis Activist Hub? My only knowledge of it is from the mentions by Lee.
Kaisersoze (c86eb0) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:23 pmShould old acquaintance be forgot,
and never brought to mind ?
Should old acquaintance be forgot,
and old lang syne ?
CHORUS:
For auld lang syne, my dear,
for auld lang syne,
we’ll take a cup of kindness yet,
for auld lang syne.
And surely you’ll buy your pint cup !
and surely I’ll buy mine !
And we’ll take a cup o’ kindness yet,
for auld lang syne.
We two have run about the slopes,
and picked the daisies fine ;
But we’ve wandered many a weary foot,
since auld lang syne.
We two have paddled in the stream,
from morning sun till dine† ;
But seas between us broad have roared
since auld lang syne.
And there’s a hand my trusty friend !
StillConfused (786412) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:23 pmAnd give us a hand o’ thine !
And we’ll take a right good-will draught,
for auld lang syne.
“Alicia Pain” is the name/pseudonym attached to threats made to Patterico, Ace, and possibly others.
Dianna (f12db5) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:23 pmHey, look, a thing!
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:24 pmAdam Shriver was the guy Tommy Christopher credited with bringing details about Veronica (Marianela Alicea.)
CausticConservative (b29599) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:24 pmI know I said I don’t plan to talk about it, but . . . well, I might. A bit.
Like just now.
But mostly not. Is what I meant.
Patterico (f724ca) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:25 pmWhere’s the kaboom? There was supposed to be an earth-shattering kaboom!
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:25 pmHas anyone figured out where St. Louis Activist Hub got the name Jenny George? To me, if the name is correct, somebody who knows Jenny George threw her under the bus. Which would mean somebody knew what Jenny George was up to. Which leads to the idea that she could possibly have an accomplice. dun dun dun DUN!
Johnny 5 is alive (5ccc5e) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:26 pmIs who on Twitter?
Patterico (f724ca) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:26 pmThis is all still quite rhetorical.
Patterico (f724ca) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:26 pmOn to 2000!
Patterico (f724ca) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:27 pmWell that was rather anti-climatic. Shall we go for 2000?
StillConfused (786412) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:27 pmSo who the heck is Dan Wolfe anyway?
Comment by CausticConservative
I sure don’t know. Sometimes, it seems to me that he’s just a sensible person keeping his head down; other times, I wonder if he isn’t the perfect sock, the instigator of trouble and all our current evils.
Dianna (f12db5) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:27 pmYou can keep talking, I suppose, if you want. Just please don’t attribute opinions or theories to me, thanks.
AArrgh! Does this mean no Zombie Apocalypse?
Bill M (25d866) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:27 pmDammit, Janet! I missed it!
Tutu (54ce64) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:29 pmBless you! I love it!
Dianna (f12db5) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:29 pmI do like mysteries,but was hoping we would get the answers at 1,000.
PatAZ (efd43b) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:29 pmSecond # 1016
Bill M (25d866) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:31 pmOn to 2000!
Comment by Patterico
I’ve done my bit.
My confusion is only slightly less, mostly because I’ve more or less given up.
Oh, well, Happy 4th of July, Patterico!
Dianna (f12db5) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:31 pmSt. Louis Activist Hub posted on his blog a search he had done on 123 dot com. Using Jennifer George as search criteria. Vaguely, described how he found Jennifer George tied to 1/2011 “Jenay” starchild cache page revelation.
On 123 dot com, there is a reference to “Jennifer George” associated with starchild111 accnt
az5thdstrct (e76e6a) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:32 pmHow can this caper ever be solved with Columbo dead?
Johnny 5 is alive (5ccc5e) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:33 pmSo, comments to 1000 was used as an incentive to what? Say nothing else is going to be written about any of this?
Well, that’s teh suck.
Susie Q (a6955c) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:33 pmThe issue with Starchild111 and how it could get from JG to a fake Nikki Reid is still a major item that needs furher discussion.
Lee and Patteric need to continue to focus the Sockpuppets.
Joe
Joe Smith (54c0c1) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:35 pmHere’s the link where Shriver introduces the world to Jennifer George:
http://stlactivisthub.blogspot.com/2011/06/is-starchild111-actually-jennifer.html
CausticConservative (b29599) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:36 pm“AArrgh! Does this mean no Zombie Apocalypse?”
Keep the faith. Rumors has it that Mila already has it in the can, and Patrick will be showing a sneak preview after #2000
MDr (fd1f4b) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:38 pmPeople have abandoned my questions.
Hint.
I don’t know what any of it means, but I find it interesting.
Patterico (f724ca) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:38 pmEnough for now. Gonna celebrate the 4th by participating in a 4th of July Parade and help turn more youngsters into vile Republicians. Always a worthwhile endeavor.
Happy 4th to one and all.
Bill M (25d866) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:38 pmPatterico,
Both you and Lee were so deep into the weeds on this twitter-fake-ID thing, reaching the 15th level of self-referentiality while simultaneously speaking of pseudo-pseudo-fake characters, all the while portentously telling us that something BIG was just around the corner – and the whole time, maybe 3 people knew what the hell you were talking about.
And now you somewhat pompously act like we were the ones with the problem, and you’re moving on, but we can keep talking about it if we want. But it’s you and Lee who were the super-freaks on this, not us. Maybe you were adopting fake identities and threatening each other the whole time!
Brian (01bc92) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:39 pmRead through the activist hub and you see that Shriver has big issues with Dana Loesch, including a number of confrontations. Loesch works for Breitbart’s Big Journalism. I don’t know if Shriver has had any interaction with Breitbart, however.
CausticConservative (b29599) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:41 pm1009, my guess would be stlactivisthub
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:45 pmAnd now you somewhat pompously act like we were the ones with the problem,
Comment by Brian — 7/3/2011 @ 7:39 pm
He says in a thread with a thousand comments….
Kaisersoze (c86eb0) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:45 pm@ Patterico,
I haven’t abandoned your questions I’ve tweeted Brietbart to find out how he feels about Adam from St. Louis Activist Hub.
Johnny 5 is alive (5ccc5e) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:49 pmAnyway, yesterday, someone tweeted an interesting
link that showed that one of the girls, @starchild111, who throughout #weinergate was thought to be named “Nikki”, originally had the name “Jenay.”
Who tweeted Shriver’s “interesting link?” I cannot access itwith the link provided. It does read like a set-up in hind sight.
CausticConservative (b29599) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:51 pmShriver. 31. doctoral student. At 31! Still. Professional student. Wash U. Starting to make sense.
MDr (fd1f4b) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:53 pmHmm, never saw this blog before:
http://danabusted.blogspot.com/2010/09/adam-shriver-pwns-dana-loesch-stl.html
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:55 pmDoes anyone else have posts disappear into the ether here from time to time? I’ve had two that after posting never showed up. Perhaps the comment section is feeling a little taxed today.
Johnny 5 is alive (5ccc5e) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:55 pm820 JeffM
And I’m a fan of Lees and interact with him all the time, and while I’m not in fear of him, per se, I do consider how I’m going to approach him so as not to rub him the wrong way.
koam @wittier (e74ff0) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:56 pmpoor lee stranahan
ColonelHaiku (822dce) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:57 pmhe try to leave leftwing Hell
keep pulling him back
http://danabusted.blogspot.com/search/label/Adam%20Shriver
so yeah, looks like Shriver tweets under stlactivisthub
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:58 pm#1031
That was me. “Anyway, yesterday, someone tweeted an interesting”
I had sent the 1/2011 Jenay cache page to Stranahan. I guess STLA saw my tweet/mention to Stranahan. Or, Lee had nearly immediately posted the Jenay page find and STLA may have seen it that way. Don’t know for sure.
When STLA made initial post on JG 123 dot com find. He tweeted it out and copied me on his tweet. He did because the original post included my actual handle name on post as submitting the Jenay cache page (which I did to Stranahan only).
I had no idea of the 123 dot com reference before STLA has posted. When STLA updated his post, he redacted some names including my handle.
az5thdstrct (e76e6a) — 7/3/2011 @ 7:59 pm825 Susie Q.
I’m relatively new here and only know of Pat & Lee re: Weinergate revelations.
I never got the liberal vibe from Lee on this story.
koam @wittier (e74ff0) — 7/3/2011 @ 8:01 pmIt does feel like a let-down but I think we need to keep in mind that both Patterico and Lee have agreed to stop blogging because “It’s in the hands of law enforcement at this point.” That strikes me as significant.
DRJ (fdd243) — 7/3/2011 @ 8:04 pmSo LE is now involved because of the threats I take it? Good. Hopefully they can help get to the bottom of this.
Noodles (3681c4) — 7/3/2011 @ 8:10 pmWe are practically to the point of this episode where someone emerges in handcuffs and exclaims, “And I’d have gotten away with it too. If it weren’t for you meddling kids!”
That’s the payoff I’m looking for here. Anything else will be a disappointment.
CausticConservative (b29599) — 7/3/2011 @ 8:10 pmIt is just impossible for people to write about this without making assumptions, isn’t it?
Patterico (f724ca) — 7/3/2011 @ 8:13 pm841 Crispian
Well-said.
koam @wittier (e74ff0) — 7/3/2011 @ 8:13 pm842. Jan.
I could be mistaken, but I think Lee thinks all socks (all the Reids, Marianela, very probably Dan/Patriot, and possibly more characters according to lee) could be one person, the JG MA who called him, and the motive is she was into Weiner, but then turned on him. Ex-lover/crush revenge. JG MA started Starchild and kept it all along. It was never taken over by anyone else. She’s a very liberal person, who will play any part to get the ultimate revenge on RAW.
Apologies to Lee if I got this wrong.
koam @wittier (e74ff0) — 7/3/2011 @ 8:18 pm“Come, Watson, come!” he cried. “The game is afoot.”
slp (347e33) — 7/3/2011 @ 8:22 pm854 mikemadden59
Great thinking.
koam @wittier (e74ff0) — 7/3/2011 @ 8:23 pm1044 Koam
“Ex-lover/crush revenge.”
Of Huma or Anthony?
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/3/2011 @ 8:25 pmPatterico, what else is worth law enforcement’s interest? I am not a lawyer, or anything like one, but I don’t see what else is of the vaguest interest.
I know I could be missing something, and you may think I’m thick, but really, how is an internet hoax of much interest to the law?
Dianna (f12db5) — 7/3/2011 @ 8:29 pm@ Patterico
Good God man. Is this a comment section of a blog or are we all detectives/socks/and suspects? My statement was my own opinion of what I think is going on.
Noodles (3681c4) — 7/3/2011 @ 8:29 pmPosted below the headline for the Overnight Open Thread over at Ace’s HQ:
Got your nick, tracing your ip address…
Perhaps closure is actually….close.
CausticConservative (b29599) — 7/3/2011 @ 8:31 pm@ Patterico
My last post may have come out as harsh (not how I intended it). I just don’t get why everyone gets this feeling that everything we type is part of the story or whatever. I see it as commenting on a blog.
Noodles (3681c4) — 7/3/2011 @ 8:39 pmOkay, I’ve compiled this to make it easier (for me, at least). Patterico asked the following questions, albeit rhetorically…
1) Who first mentioned JG to Lee?
#981 Johnny 5 is alive answers that it is St. Louis Activist Hub. #1020 az5thdstrct finds that they found this information through a people search website and #1023 CausticConservative gives the link to Adam Shriver’s post which explains his findings.
2) Who first brought Marianela Alicea tweets to Tommy Chris?
#1009 Patterico says Adam Shriver who is a blogger at St. Louis Activist Hub wrote the post for the link I gave above. Patterico gives further proof in #1025 that Adam is an author for St. Louis Activist Hub by linking here.
3) What is the relationship of this person to Andrew Breitbart?
#1028 CausticConservative determines a Dana Loesch connection. Loesch is the editor for Breitbart’s Big Journalism.
#1033 and #1036 crosspatch gives links to the DanaBusted blog here and here, which show the animosity between Adam Shriver and Dana Loesch. Both the liberal Shriver and conservative Loesch are involved in St. Louis politics and are apparently rivals.
My question: is Adam Shriver trustworthy or is he leading us down the rabbit hole? I can see how this would fit with the possibilities Patterico outlined in this blog post.
rogerthat (f5aad4) — 7/3/2011 @ 8:42 pmIP address traces often don’t mean much these days.
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/3/2011 @ 8:43 pmDianna,
You’re just going to have to trust me.
Patterico (03ef17) — 7/3/2011 @ 8:48 pmTo comment 2,000 and beyond, I guess.
I’m curious. Very, very curious.
Dianna (f12db5) — 7/3/2011 @ 8:54 pm957, 989.
Very interesting, along my way of thinking. I’m very critical of timing of pregnancy news, plus the ho-hum reaction for a young bride (with strong Muslim upbringing) subjected to international humiliation. I wouldn’t be shopping with him or eating with him. And I wouldn’t accept those crummy, ugly flowers. Would anyone but me be not suprised if the Mrs. returned from her trip to the spa sans baby? Very evil thought, but I wouldn’t put anything past the Clintons, et. al.
gobblemom (706d9f) — 7/3/2011 @ 9:00 pm“Where’s the kaboom? There was supposed to be an earth-shattering kaboom!
Comment by crosspatch”
You mean it wasn’t as good for you as it was for me?
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/3/2011 @ 9:08 pm“My question: is Adam Shriver trustworthy or is he leading us down the rabbit hole.”
rogerthat – I don’t know anything about rabbit holes, but a quick glance at the absolute bilge and propaganda that fills his blog posts shows he is not trustworthy.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/3/2011 @ 9:11 pm1057 – Well, let me just say that I didn’t need a cigarette after.
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/3/2011 @ 9:12 pm“So, comments to 1000 was used as an incentive to what?”
Susie Q – I got a new toaster. Didn’t you register for a prize?
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/3/2011 @ 9:13 pm1058 daleyrocks:
What disturbs me more than the content of the postings is the people who follow him. I mean, are some of these people *really* interested in that vitriol?
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/3/2011 @ 9:14 pm1008 J5A
The name Jennifer George appears on 123people.com search tool with the twitter nickname “@starchild111”
koam @wittier (e74ff0) — 7/3/2011 @ 9:28 pmOkay, so Adam Shiver did those & is antagonistic to Andrew Brietbart. What does it mean? Also how the hell did Shriver get Alicea’s DMs anyway?
RocksEm (5241c6) — 7/3/2011 @ 10:25 pmHmm, Charles Johnson seems to pop up a lot as I dig around.
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/3/2011 @ 10:33 pmI believe someone got the screenshot out of Stack’s yFrog account, where he had placed them by mistake.
Patterico (f724ca) — 7/3/2011 @ 10:34 pmBack to the initial propositions:
1. The person claiming to be “Jennifer George” who called Lee was a hoaxer.
2. There really was a person who threatened the real Jennifer George, and that person pretended to be Lee Stranahan.
3. That person hates Lee, and Breitbart.
Along with 200,000 other people, Adam Shriver fits items 2 and 3.
slp (347e33) — 7/3/2011 @ 10:48 pmWhich of those 200,000 other people first ID’d Jennifer George as the owner of the starchild111 account, and tipped off Tommy Christopher as to alleged DMs from Weiner to Nikki Reid (per Marianela Alicea DMs to Mike Stack).
The answer is zero of those 200,000 people.
But thanks for posing the question so fairly!
Patterico (f724ca) — 7/3/2011 @ 11:18 pmRauhauser’s post calling me a “Dishonest DA” is no longer available to anyone without permission.
Good thing I screenshotted the whole thing before he took it out of public view.
Hi, Neal!
Patterico (f724ca) — 7/3/2011 @ 11:21 pm“But thanks for posing the question so fairly!”
Hey, slp has been nothing if not fair in helping to achieve the 1,000 comment goal if you ignore the content of the comments.
“Sorry. I am not paying close enough attention to all the players.
Comment by slp”
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/3/2011 @ 11:27 pmOther than koam at 826 and SarahW at 680 no one else picked up on my questions in 676.
Have Blue (dbbcd4) — 7/3/2011 @ 11:28 pmI will do a more in depth analysis if anyone is interested. (Talking about internal as opposed to external sock puppets.)
“Along with 200,000 other people, Adam Shriver fits items 2 and 3.”
slp – I think Lee claims to get along well with Shriver, contradicting your #2.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/3/2011 @ 11:29 pmIs is POSSIBLE that once conservatives found out about Weiner’s inappropriate sexual comments with adult females (long before it was published) that someone on the right tried to set Weiner up to show that he would ALSO do the same with underage females and created fake underage girl or girls?
I mean it wouldn’t be a stretch.
quickquestion (a025dd) — 7/3/2011 @ 11:37 pm1020 Az
123people.com
koam @wittier (e74ff0) — 7/3/2011 @ 11:50 pmand the image he used was from
123people.fr, though I don’t know why the French site’s screencap was used.
I have been following Weinergate fairly closely, but doing my comments from memory without having made any charts or notes.
At the time of the post, I recalled Alicia Pain had made threats and assumed that she was part of the Nikki Reid sock puppet cabal.
I am eagerly waiting for Patterico to lay out the facts and the supporting evidence.
slp (347e33) — 7/3/2011 @ 11:54 pmJust because Lee claims to get along well with Shriver, does not exclude Shriver from being the person who threatened the real Jennifer George and pretended to be Lee Stranahan.
Since Lee has been posting Weinergate stories on the Bigs, it may be that Shriver has taken Lee off his good guy list.
slp (347e33) — 7/4/2011 @ 12:01 amSo what is the other Jennnifer E George ( the one that did NOT call Lee) doing tracking Jennifer Preston’s twitter cleanup using searchtastic.com?
Joe
Joe Smith (54c0c1) — 7/4/2011 @ 12:19 am“Just because Lee claims to get along well with Shriver, does not exclude Shriver from being the person who threatened the real Jennifer George and pretended to be Lee Stranahan.”
No sh*t?
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/4/2011 @ 12:27 amPatterico,
Yes, for example the goatsred aka Mike’s yFrog link was visible in a screen cap that was posted in a couple of blogs early in the Weinergate story.
It was very easy to find the “real” names for Betty / Veronica and even Ethel.
It even happened yesterday over on Lee’s blog where a screen shot was posted that showed Ethel’s twitter name before it was redacted on his blog post.
Joe
Joe Smith (54c0c1) — 7/4/2011 @ 12:43 am1079 1081 slp daleyrocks
IIRC, Lee clearly states that he and Adam Shriver do not like each other at all. But Lee is proud not to let that fact get in the way of reporting on info. He doesn’t not listen to people just because he doesn’t like them.
Of course this was in audio somewhere on BTR, not written up. Thanks, Lee.
Correct me if I’m wrong.
koam @wittier (e74ff0) — 7/4/2011 @ 12:43 am“He doesn’t not listen to people just because he doesn’t like them.”
koam @wittier – He also claims he doesn’t hold grudges, likes old people and puppies.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/4/2011 @ 1:07 amWittier,
Jennifer George aka JG first came up based on a 123.com search and a refernce to Jennifer George and Starchild111 just like was posted.
Joe
Joe Smith (54c0c1) — 7/4/2011 @ 1:09 am1084 daleyrocks
Yes, but in this case what I wrote is what Lee said and did.
The implication is that perhaps his unbiased policy didn’t serve him well in this case?
Lesson: If you know someone’s an a*#*##, maybe don’t listen to them?
Not that I really understand the insinuations about what STLAH posted from 123people and if it’s right or wrong.
We know “Jenay” was the name on @starchild111 in its earlier days.
Question: When did the full name Jennifer George first come up?
koam @wittier (e74ff0) — 7/4/2011 @ 1:13 amIt was posted on June 19 and that is what lead to everyone being an internet detective and reaching out to any and all Jen… Georges that they could find.
This led to the Jennifer E George in CA being contacted by many individuals so she started posting the communictions.
One or more Jennifer Georges contacted St. Louis Activist Hub and asked for their data to be removed from the blog.
Joe
Joe Smith (54c0c1) — 7/4/2011 @ 1:15 am1085. Joe
That’s different from what I remember.
We had the name “Jenay” and “@starchild111”
I don’t recall having the name “Jennifer George”
But at the STLAH post, Adam Shriver says he learned of the name “Jenay” and then revisited some search results.
The example of a search he posts from 123people is a search for “Jennifer George” on the UK site. He also attaches a screen capture of the search results for “Jennifer George” from the French version of 123people. In the image, you can read the URL which shows that he searched for “Jennifer George”
So the search is “backwards.”
I’m asking where the name Jennifer George came from in the first place.
If he had searched for “Jenay” and “@starchild111” and the result was “Jennifer George” I would understand the direction of the information flow.
But he didn’t do that. And I can’t get to “Jennifer George” as a result by searching for “Jenay” and/or “starchild” or “starchild111”
He started with the name Jennifer George.
Where did the name Jennifer George first come from?
koam @wittier (e74ff0) — 7/4/2011 @ 1:37 amI didn’t realize the name Jenay was short for Jennifer either. I thought Jen was short for Jennifer.
Hopefully LE can get to the bottom of this at some point. I guess we’ll find out when the search for the threat makers reaches it’s conclusion. Have a great Independence Day everyone!
Johnny 5 is alive (5ccc5e) — 7/4/2011 @ 2:20 amI figured out a path to the 123people results without knowing the full name “Jennifer George”
We knew “@starchild111” and “Jenay”
Make the guess that “Jenay” is a “Jennifer.”
Google “@starchild111 Jennifer” and, to be fair, set the search dates to end 06/18/2011, the day before we think the Jennifer George name went public (so that search is hopefully not influenced by our chatter, post-STLAH)
I got to http://www.123people.de/s/george+jennifer
the German site for 123people
If you don’t put the date params in, you can get to the UK 123people site for the search for “Jennifer George”
Note that I didn’t use the name “George” in my Google searches (I “didn’t know George” and I guessed “Jennifer” from “Jenay”), but that searching for “@starchild111 Jennifer” took me to 123people pages as if I had searched for “Jennifer George”.
koam @wittier (e74ff0) — 7/4/2011 @ 2:31 amAnd this fits with what I now recall from that day.
So, I’m guessing that STLAH made the same guess that I had to. You have to drop Jenay and guess Jennifer to get to Jennifer George in 123people by way of Google. STLAH just didn’t say what he’d done (at least in the version shown as of today…maybe he did in an earlier version).
koam @wittier (e74ff0) — 7/4/2011 @ 2:45 amWitter,
It started with the Jenay name attached to @Starchild111. I think we then had the George part based on a Jenay George in FB which when entered in Google, Google offered a possible search of Jenny George.
Once you entered Jenny George, you also got results of Jennifer George and then when you add UCLA you got JG for Los Angeles who everyone started emailing….
That also resulted in the Jennifer George and Starchild111 hits in 123people.ca, 123people.uk, 13people.fr…. yet another rabbit hole looking for the sockpuppets.
Joe
Joe Smith (54c0c1) — 7/4/2011 @ 2:55 amIf you look at the time stamps, I think you will see that Adam got his clue from this site, Patterico.com.
That was another very busy weekend.
Joe
Joe Smith (54c0c1) — 7/4/2011 @ 2:57 amOpps, forgot to mention that UCLA clue came from the follow of the UCLA writting group by the @Starchild111 twitter id that showed the Jenay name.
Joe
Joe Smith (54c0c1) — 7/4/2011 @ 3:04 amKoam , that is good lead to trace down.
It would be very important to know how and when 123people search engine associated the name Jennifer George with the starchild111 twitter.
Was it a slip up by the creator of the account?
That would support lee’s theory
Was it injected by a hoaxer in some way?
Temper Tantrum (02fe1b) — 7/4/2011 @ 4:25 am1092 Joe
Your “George” appears without explanation. You don’t say where “Jenay George” in facebook comes from.
I laid it out in 1090.
koam @wittier (e74ff0) — 7/4/2011 @ 5:29 am1095 TT.
If Jennifer George created @starchild111 on facebook, as the caller Jennifer George from MA says, then it’s not much of a mystery. I’d expect some kind of internet search to find that info if the 2 names were associated in the past. We don’t have cached screen caps, but maybe the account was labeled “Jennifer George” prior to it being labeled “Jenay”.
A web crawler at some previous time might have taken every twitter name it could find and associate each with a first & last name on the account and made a note of it.
koam @wittier (e74ff0) — 7/4/2011 @ 5:33 amHai Guyz! What’s happening on this thread?
Pious Agnostic (6048a8) — 7/4/2011 @ 6:35 am“What’s happening on this thread?”
Uh, well, it looks like koam @wittier does not sleep. AT ALL.
Anita Busch (a025dd) — 7/4/2011 @ 6:43 amaz5thdstrct, I came across your work. Highly respected.
koam @wittier (e74ff0) — 7/4/2011 @ 7:02 am1099. Anita Busch
Tell me about it.
Are you following on Twitter?
koam @wittier (e74ff0) — 7/4/2011 @ 7:06 amJim, I think it’s dead.
MDr (fd1f4b) — 7/4/2011 @ 7:08 am#1102 Mdr
Don’t count on it. Once people wake up and have their 2nd cup of coffee, those neurons and Google-searches will be firing on all cylinders.
Suppositions! Assumptions! Allegations! Implications! Inferences! Sly remarks! Knowing winks!
Ooh boy, there will be fireworks on this thread, I assure you!
Pious Agnostic (6048a8) — 7/4/2011 @ 7:20 amThe “Jenay” cache is old. Wouldn’t that tend to point to an old association of a Jennifer with the starchild111 account? – I realize that is not dispositive, but it is suggestive.
SarahW (af7312) — 7/4/2011 @ 7:37 am1092, that’s exactly right.
SarahW (af7312) — 7/4/2011 @ 7:41 am“Hai Guyz! What’s happening on this thread?”
Pious Agnostic – G’day. Happy 4th!
What’s happening? Pushing for 2,000 comments.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/4/2011 @ 7:43 am1105. SarahW
1090 explains where “George” came from using Google search.
koam @wittier (e74ff0) — 7/4/2011 @ 7:52 am“If you look at the time stamps, I think you will see that Adam got his clue from this site, Patterico.com.”
Joe Smith – Shriver’s post was on 6/19.
Stranahan’s BTR on Betty and Veronica Mystery solved was on 6/20.
I don’t know the date az5thdstrct claims to have tweeted his key info to Lee which he believe Shriver used to write his post.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/4/2011 @ 7:56 amDo me a favor? Someone please tell me: Beyond all the sock puppetry, fake accounts, death threats and whatever else may or may not have been going on…
What was the point? Who was the target?
oldirishpig (e7adde) — 7/4/2011 @ 8:01 am
koam @wittier (e74ff0) — 7/4/2011 @ 8:02 amclaims to have1109. oldirishpig
Hard to say, but I still think that the target could have been #bornfreecrew directly, and right-leaning journalism, indirectly.
Several people see Weiner being cyberstalked (to put a bad spin on it) or observed (to neutralize) as he actively engages with attractive women who are his political fans online.
Those who empathize with Weiner see this as right-wing dirty tricks against a guy on their side. So they create a sting operation. Create some girls with whom Weiner can interact — of course he won’t do really anything wrong with them, these people think. But we know he’s being watched and it will be noticed if he “follows” them, etc. Then we’ll trump it up to make it look like maybe he’s crossed the line.
The evil right-wingers will seize on that and publicize it by going to Fox or Brietbart, Bloggers or other outlets. Then, after the media have committed to it, we’ll whisper to someont to reveal that the interaction was harmless (embarrassment #1) and that the girls weren’t real (embarrassment #2). Making #bornfreecrew and any media that picked up the story look like total idiots who were persecuting the innocent Weiner.
The thing no one bet on was that Weiner was way more guilty than anyone could have guessed…and he mistakenly sent that pic to everyone.
And that’s just one theory. I’m not saying its true.
koam @wittier (e74ff0) — 7/4/2011 @ 8:12 amkoam @wittier
That was me. “Anyway, yesterday, someone tweeted an interesting”
I had sent the 1/2011 Jenay cache page to Stranahan. I guess STLA saw my tweet/mention to Stranahan. Or, Lee had nearly immediately posted the Jenay page find and STLA may have seen it that way. Don’t know for sure.
“When STLA made initial post on JG 123 dot com find. He tweeted it out and copied me on his tweet. He did because the original post included my actual handle name on post as submitting the Jenay cache page (which I did to Stranahan only).
I had no idea of the 123 dot com reference before STLA has posted. When STLA updated his post, he redacted some names including my handle.
Comment by az5thdstrct — 7/3/2011 @ 7:59 pm”
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/4/2011 @ 8:20 amOpen quotes were mine and in wrong place in 1112.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/4/2011 @ 8:21 amkoam @1111 – That is my theory. The wild card was nobody counted on Weiner self-destructing.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/4/2011 @ 8:23 am1109 That is the mystery that identifying the real actor(s) might resolve.
SarahW (af7312) — 7/4/2011 @ 8:24 am“That is the mystery that identifying the real actor(s) might resolve.”
SarahW – I have information that would help crack that mystery wide open, but sacred honor prevents me from revealing it.
I just wanted to say that, you know, to see how it felt. It makes me feel like a BLOG GOD, but not a Capital J journalist.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/4/2011 @ 8:30 am1114 daleyrocks
And that “meddling” Gennette, who was watching the watchers and suspicious of Nikki, tipping off Weiner, while lying to Nikki & pretending to be her pal. She may have inadvertently helped to botch a plan by those who actually were on her side, because she suspected they might have been working for the other side.
Why was Gennette also the intended target of the DM dic pic that went out as a public tweet instead? Just ironic? What could have been going on there?
koam @wittier (e74ff0) — 7/4/2011 @ 8:37 amJustsayin, you seem to be willfully dishonest.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/4/2011 @ 8:44 amAnd happy Independence Day, everyone.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/4/2011 @ 8:47 amHappy independence day, all, alright can we move onto another conspiracy, th rabbit chased the gopher into the tunnels under the NY subway
ian cormac (d380ce) — 7/4/2011 @ 9:02 amI came on to check if the 1000 was reached and what the answers to Weinergate were. Reread and saw that I had made an assumption that at 1000 I was going to get something. (Good lesson about assuming) Thanks for the toaster, LOL!! Have the last documents been dumped? I haven’t found them. Anyway here is my part towards the 2000 and above. Thank you Patterico for your continued work, I must say that I agree with you about your commentors. Time to get the bbq up and running, so to all Happy Independence Day!!!!
freedom_costs (51c21c) — 7/4/2011 @ 9:13 amWas there even a “bornFreecrew” to meddle with before the Weiner-watching began, at Patriots instigtion?
SarahW (af7312) — 7/4/2011 @ 9:42 amObviously this whole law enforcement thing is just misdirection by Pat and Lee. They’ve been tag-teaming with different theories designed to get the various shadowy players sucked in – you know, the old good cop, bad cop routine – and now they’re playing up the LE angle to scare the Reds into damaging counter moves. I fully expect the conspiracy to break under the pressure.
One of the puppeteer’s multiple personalities will turn state’s evidence.
Nathan Wagner (01c83e) — 7/4/2011 @ 9:48 am1.) I still want to know what Tommy Christopher knows about Weinergate.
2.) I still want to know why Tommy Christopher was “the chosen”.
3.) I still want to know who chose him and how the contacts really worked or were set up for him.
4.) I still want to know how his “collaboration” with NYT Jen came about, and when, and why her.
5.) I still want to know why TC doesn’t outwardly appear to mind having been punked, or be pissed about it, or be very curious about it. (Which is why I kind of bet he already knows most of the answers –and truth– behind items 2,3, 4,and 5.)
And, friends, that is why I believe the rest of the world gaining knowledge of the full answer to #1 would be quite useful. Tommy’s a real person–a public person. Obviously he had to have been interacting with at least one other real person who posed as and represented other (fake) people in order for him to have multiple communications with those fakes. What does TC know and when did he know it?
elissa (4a1b75) — 7/4/2011 @ 9:53 amI have nevar seen Jenay used as an alternative for Jennifer. More likely an alternative of Janae.
Then again, I suppose someone with half a brain could pronounce Jenna as “jen – ay”.
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/4/2011 @ 9:58 amForrest Gump pronounced Jenny as Jenay, did he not?
elissa (4a1b75) — 7/4/2011 @ 10:02 amSo Jennay is quite an unrelated name to Jennifer.
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/4/2011 @ 10:04 amHappy Independence Day to you and yours
RR
Reaganite Republican (c90bca) — 7/4/2011 @ 10:09 am1126 elissa
That’s one thing I was thinking about a week ago. Someone mispronouncing someone’s name. That would connect back to the whole Jenna/Nikki porn thing. (Jenna Jameson and Nikki Tyler who were friends and lived together for a while).
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/4/2011 @ 10:11 am1111, except, Patriot fomented that Weiner-watching activity, and by my observations “Patriot” has long revealed his persona is as phony as any of the socks.
The Nikki sock and Patriot socks are in league if not the same person.
Why would THAT be so? I guess this matters, as I asked before: was there even a “bornFreecrew” to meddle with before the Weiner-watching began?
Punking a pack of right-wing twitterers might be amusement enough for some, but it’s playing with fire to ignite a scandal about a specific politician when his bad habits are real and supsected if not known. It would draw down attention, unflattering attention on Weiner and potentially draw out women like Broussard and the Vegas chick and lord knows who else, but even more dangerous, his penchant for chatting up sweet young things (to the exclusions of other followers and fans) who idolize him, whom he has no business talking to privately except in the most general way.
One inference that can be drawn from that high risk scenario is that the hoaxer(s) wanted attention drawn to Weiner’s habits.
This might be to immunize Weiner against such attention by inventing a scandal that is later to be discredited. But that still seems incredibly risking and not worth the benefit of making Breitbart ridiculous, or someone like Mike Stack.
What is more likely in my view is that the hoaxer wished attention to be focused on his bad habits, to GET THE STORY OUT.
This could be a scheme of political enemies (even some from his own party)or a kind of personal revenge, jealousy or anger about another follower (Ginger lee has a stalker, BTW) or a way of some random Weiner sextress making her story/pics gain value for sale, or otherwise enriching or promoting its teller. And I’m sure there are motives for getting the story out I have not considered.
********
The hoaxer(s) clearly had some plan develop for watching Weiner and gaining access to him and his doings through his other female followers – attempts to befriend and obtain an exchange of confidences.
I’m thinking the story was offered to Breitbart less to punk him, than in the misguided notion he would publish anything, in hopes he would bite, and generate interest in Weiner’s habits.
After all, everything the Marianela sock offered Stack really existed and was actually in the sock’s possession.
When Breitbart passed, they went to Tommy to get an untrue story about Breitbart out. I see a deliberate attempt to game Tommy the way they thought they would game Breitbart – offer him a story he couldn’t refuse, that is exactly what he would believe and want to publish.
The Tommy approach was a second try – this was post Breitbart saying “thanks but no thanks.”
The nikki sock then gets caught in spectacular lie about the Breitbart is making us lie angle – and backs off that story in full reverse, though all that Marieanela sock had offered Stack was available.
By this time Weiners pic has made his habits famous, the now more valuable stories of other women emerge, and Weiner’s contact with other minors is very helpfully being put forward by the Reidsocks.
Mission accomplished?
Suspicion is also thrown Mike Stack’s way, as potential penis pic hacker – deliberately by the socks. Is this pure misdirection resulting from the sock(s)’ fear of being caught out as Weiner’s exposer?
A plan to punk anyone possible to punk is a hallmark of Anonymous-style operations. Is that the explanation for seemingly contrary goals –
Perhaps this was a directed attack at Breitbart it failed in some ways and got out of hand, and switched them to simply yanking people around for lulz? I am not sure I can articulate why but I’m actually thinking NO on that.
Is “get the story out, by any means necessary, without being identified” the goal? <– this one I am partial to.
Did Anonymous-types simply join in the afterparty?
This is a light entertainment for me at this point. It's, as I told Patrick, a guilty pleasure, my Jersey Shore.
No matter who or why the motives, Weiner got caught being who he really is and that can't be undone. Even people who wold rather support him, in their hearts of hearts, know he would always be a looming liability to his own friends and own party. He's creepy and immature on his good days.
So if it was a Breitbart sting, fail.
SarahW (af7312) — 7/4/2011 @ 10:11 amIf it was a get paid for my own pictures scam – win
If it was an "expose Weiner" plot – win
If it was screw with people plan, win win win.
That is what I thought too. In fact, that was my first impression, that “Jenay” was from Forrest Gump, so Jenay = Jenny = Jennifer didn’t bother me one bit.
Does this have any significance? I have to imaging not. I could see a girl growing up, her friends calling her “Jenay” from the movie, and her using that as a Twitter handle, no problem.
Pious Agnostic (6048a8) — 7/4/2011 @ 10:14 amHappy Birthday, USA!
PatAZ (efd43b) — 7/4/2011 @ 10:15 amThe Forest Gump thing would have another interesting twist for someone trying to burn Weiner (stupid is as stupid does).
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/4/2011 @ 10:16 amI tweeted Jenay cache on 6/18
STLA hub post 6/19
http://twitter.com/#!/az5thdstrct/status/82222113502666752
az5thdstrct (e76e6a) — 7/4/2011 @ 10:19 am#1134
While I can see your tweet, the link in the tweet comes up “forbidden” for me.
http://bit.ly/lMRuCE
Anybody else?
Pious Agnostic (6048a8) — 7/4/2011 @ 10:24 amPatterico, my impression of shanahan was that he was inexperienced. He could do with a class in logic and also on how to keep personal and public opinions separate in his mind. A lot of his schtick is very high standards for other people, very low standards for himself.
jd2 (cdceb5) — 7/4/2011 @ 10:27 am1124 elissa
Do you think JP / NYT told TC to shut it, like Lee was told?
Or do you think whatever higher power that got JP spooked (unless that was an act) also got to Colby / Tommy?
Do they send people in to deliver a “national security” or other type of hush order?
Total conjecture, of course.
But remember the takeaway from the blowup between Lee and JP.
My post to Lee from July 1
koam @wittier (e74ff0) — 7/4/2011 @ 10:30 amhttp://leestranahan.com/weinergate-gosh-what-the-heck-happened#comment-6300
That says more about JP than Lee.
Mistrusting Lew H but trusting the rest of JG:s story is crazy, his site has been online for years. JP could also check his ID easily, if she wanted to.
Temper Tantrum (02fe1b) — 7/4/2011 @ 10:41 amMy Forrest Gump comment above was purely pop culture observation, BTW. I personally have a singular disinterest in the whole Jenny Jenay angle.
That said, one of the interesting observations about human psychology that can be made about the various threads (Patterico and Stranahan and Ace and Pru) on Weinergate is how different commenters and theorists latch on to the particular aspects of the hunt that they find particularly intriguing or to which their education/training points them as being the more relevant.
elissa (4a1b75) — 7/4/2011 @ 10:42 am#1134
Sometime over the last week or so. Yahoo “blocked” that 1/2011 Jenay cache page.
If you look at multiple postings of the Jenay cache you can see it came from Yahoo top right corner. Including STLA post
screencap he used:
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-kN06BxQQIqo/Tf5cIF3BUII/AAAAAAAACOQ/_oOav941hF0/s1600/jenay.png
Don’t know why Yahoo “blocked”.
But at time I also found on Bing and had resumbitted this last week to Stranahan:
So here you go.
http://cc.bingj.com/cache.aspx?q=http://twitter.com/starchild111&d=4738964055069054&mkt=en-US&setlang=en-US&w=103056d3,77902c9f
az5thdstrct (e76e6a) — 7/4/2011 @ 10:44 amThing is, someone relaying information verbally might find the information at the receiving end different from information relayed in written format. Same holds for someone trying to recall something from deep in the past (e.g. “dang, what was that actresses name … it was jen-something … Jenay, yeah, that must be it”)
Other thing is, when people pick aliases, they often pick names close to their own or maybe with the same initials as their own. So a Jennifer picking a Jenay might not be so unusual. But then changing it to Nikki is kindof unusual. Why that particular name? That’s when I remembered the Jenna / Nikki connection and thought maybe someone was playing off that, considering the whole porn star angle going on with one of Weiners follows.
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/4/2011 @ 10:53 amFYI, this from the Associated Press:
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/4/2011 @ 10:56 amCrosspatch, how come?
Sarahw (af7312) — 7/4/2011 @ 11:03 am“By this time Weiners pic has made his habits famous, the now more valuable stories of other women emerge, and Weiner’s contact with other minors is very helpfully being put forward by the Reidsocks.”
SarahW – I’m a little confused on the dates and timing you are referring to here, particularly with respect to the Reidsocks providing information before or after Weiner fesses up to tweeting his meat, which I view as the game changer and a signal for a jail break for all involved.
We’ve got the dic pic late on 5/27.
Betty’s mom strident defense on 6/3
6/6 Weiner press conference about tweeting his meat
6/8 X-Rated Weiner picture leaked.
6/11 N.Y. Post publishes story saying Ethels mom says Weiner only sent two emails.
6/11 Patterico publishes post saying Weiner sent Ethel five emails.
Hopefully I got the above right.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/4/2011 @ 11:04 amSarahW,
I appreciate the theorizing as I think it could be helpful to have smart people like you talking about the possibilities.
It seems pretty obvious to me that whoever Wolfe is, he was trying to get the story out about Weiner.
If Reid is Wolfe — and I take no position on this — he was also against Weiner from the beginning and posed as pro-Weiner. If Reid is not Wolfe, Reid could have been a) basically what he says or b) part of a punk Breitbart and Wolfe operation or c) Lord knows what else.
Alicia Pain and any other threateners/criminals may or may not be the same people. Frankly, that’s all I care about.
The key to the interface between those two groups are the alleged threats coming from Lee. Lee says the only possibility is that she made them up. I say maybe the Alicia Pain hackers and punkers impersonated Lee to JG. There is evidence supporting that theory beyond what we have discussed.
Patterico (f724ca) — 7/4/2011 @ 11:06 am==Comment by koam @wittier — 7/4/2011 @ 10:30 am==
Quite honestly I have absolutely no conjecture to offer– or deeper thoughts about the TC/NYT thing beyond the series of questions I posted @1124. These questions have been plaguing me because I have felt the initial Mediaite story TC published was off in several respects and that much about his “followup” and other behavior since then has been rather strange. For someone, a journalist, who seems to have been purposely inserted into the story and then seemingly removed from it as opposed to reporting it, Tommy appears to be getting a pass from appropriate levels of scrutiny for some reason.
elissa (4a1b75) — 7/4/2011 @ 11:09 am1141 if one goes with the frustrated screenwriter angle, Nikki wasn’t meant be an alias, so much as a distinctly drawn character.
Sarahw (af7312) — 7/4/2011 @ 11:10 amHi Neal!
Ticks are teh suck, literally.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/4/2011 @ 11:14 amI am of the opinion JG caller, JG MA & Alicia Pain are all the same person & unrelated to Weinergate. Just a crank latching on for attention. I thought the call to Lee & Preston by JG was a punk job & told them so at the time.
RocksEm (5241c6) — 7/4/2011 @ 11:15 am1145 Patrick
Leads me to (continue to) think that:
– JG MA is real person.
– JG MA started @starchild111.
– JG MA was broadly truthful in call to Lee.
– Is generally who she says she is
– Did get scary calls
– Was genuinely uninvolved in case
– Someone else took over @starchild111 at a later time & created Nikki.
– JG MA went to BPD in good faith.
But what of the contention that Lee put out that the JG MA report was being dismissed?
– I understand if Lee has been exonerated (good) but BPD wouldn’t close case just because caller wasn’t Lee or Lee-related if there still were scary calls to JG MA.
koam @wittier (e74ff0) — 7/4/2011 @ 11:20 amSarahw, apparently so they can get it somehow integrated into Google+ is the speculation.
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/4/2011 @ 11:20 amIn her circle of friends it’s very likely there was more than one “Jennifer” since it’s such a common name.
Hence she acquired a nickname for whatever crazy reason you get a nickname. Maybe Gump reference, maybe her middle initial is A.
All I know is when I saw “Jenay” I immediately thought “Jennifer”.
Molon Labe (dc676c) — 7/4/2011 @ 11:22 amContentions that Lee puts out are worth the documentary evidence backing them up.
Patterico (f724ca) — 7/4/2011 @ 11:23 amAs far as the “Punking Breitbart” rationale goes, keep in mind that when PatriotUSA76 saw Weiner’s May 27 tweet, Patriot retweeted it to many media outlets, including Breitbart, Politico, Fox News, New York Post, Glenn Beck, and the Huffington Post.
Breitbart and his editors were the ones to respond, no doubt in part because they already had info from an intermediary of Meagan Broussard that had established that Weiner was sexting women via social networks. (On one of Stranahan’s radio shows, Breitbart himself stated that he’d been approached by this intermediary on May 18.)
Greg (bc8186) — 7/4/2011 @ 11:24 amTo paraphrase Mark Twain, the difference between conjecture and reality is that conjecture must make sense.
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/4/2011 @ 11:25 amThe thing that seems weird is the whole going under cover with the Nikki thing and the swiping of pictures to create a false personna.
That is my primary curiosity.
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/4/2011 @ 11:28 amAs far as the Jenay = Jenny goes I’m just pointing out assumptions that I initially just accepted but now wonder about because on closer inspection they don’t make sense.
@ az5thdistrc I see you keep saying you were the one who initially tracked down the starchild111 account? So you actually led St Louis Activist Hub and Stranahan to that tid bit?
If that’s the case and from what I’ve seen here and on Lee’s BTR show that az5thdistrc is a trusted conservative blogger, then who initially came up with the name is solved. So someone from our team came up with the name Jennifer George?
Johnny 5 is alive (5ccc5e) — 7/4/2011 @ 11:29 am1154 Greg
Breitbart was already on the Weiner is a perv thing..but Weiner himself made it a big news story, all on his own, that very night. Weiner, a US Concressman, said his facebook / twitter accounts had been hacked and someone else had done bad things with his account.
That is news no matter whether Weiner ever did a pervy thing in his life or not. Congressman’s accounts hacked is a big news story by any measure.
koam @wittier (e74ff0) — 7/4/2011 @ 11:29 am1157 J5A
AZ correctly stated a number of times that he tweeted the image of the old starchild cached page with the name “Jenay” on it to Lee.
That AZ tweet was a step on the way to finding the name “Jennifer George”. AZ did not find the name “Jennifer George”. As far aw we know, STLAH found that name as described above and as detailed in 1090.
koam @wittier (e74ff0) — 7/4/2011 @ 11:32 am1157 J5A
STLAH is a hard-core lefty and he came up with the full name Jennifer George, as far as we know, using Google and a clue courtesy of AZ via Lee. STLAH also would have had to guess that Jenay stood for Jennifer and have used Jennifer @starchild111 in his google search. See 1090.
koam @wittier (e74ff0) — 7/4/2011 @ 11:34 amIs there any possibility that Lee is a puppet of Neals? Sorta feels like a disinformation game is going on with Lee at this point. Lee’s stuff just isn’t holding up at this point. Why did it start to diverge so much from Patterico’s?
nancydrew (448ba9) — 7/4/2011 @ 11:41 amSo Jennifer George uses the starchild111 twitter account to create the Nikki person and begins to attempt to befriend follows of Weiner. But apparently just a young female followers who had been openly “flirty”. I haven’t seen anyone say that starchild111 ever contacted any male follows of Weiner.
I mean, it isn’t like I have a lot of twitter accounts lying around that I use for creating false personnae but I suppose I shouldn’t project my thought processes onto other people.
So. this starchild111 is some sort of a throwaway twitter account. Just how many accounts does Jennifer have? Or better, maybe Jennifer did create the account but maybe “donated” it to someone else to use (lesbian mafia?). She doesn’t deny owning the account, but she has never said she sent any of those tweets either.
Someone who engages in crap like this often would need a lot of “cut out” twitter accounts they either create themselves or that they get other people to create for them and give to them.
Just too weird.
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/4/2011 @ 11:41 am1150 1145
If what I’ve laid out above is remotely correct, then these are some really evil socks because they not only would have stolen an innocent person’s twitter account to conduct this fraud, but later would have allegedly called her with death threats and simultaneously tried to implicate a prominent blogger as the reported maker of the calls.
On top of that the Alicia Pain threats to other bloggers, and reported threats to Ginger Lee, and perhaps others who haven’t gone public ….all of which we haven’t even gone deep on yet.
We can see why people are getting more grave in tone about this at times.
koam @wittier (e74ff0) — 7/4/2011 @ 11:41 am1163
I left out Mike as one who received a threat.
koam @wittier (e74ff0) — 7/4/2011 @ 11:42 amI honestly do not understand how anyone can subscribe to this theory.
1) Why not just create an account from scratch?
2) Requires the unlikely guessing of the account password.
3) Most importantly, it requires that the original account owner ignores the email that Twitter sends to the formerly registered email address warning them that their email address has changed!
It looks like this and I have tested it:
Molon Labe (dc676c) — 7/4/2011 @ 11:43 amWell, if we’re all going to talk about what we think instead of what we know, here’s what I think:
1. The bornfreecrew and Dan Wolfe were a group of people, probably conservatives, who were alarmed at what they saw Weiner doing and concerned about the young girls he might be contacting. Wolfe disappeared because he wanted to avoid publicity and attention after Weinergate broke.
2. I’m leaning toward believing John Reid, family and friend (Veronica and Betty) are real. Alternatively, if they aren’t, they are liberals (see below) who wanted to punk Breitbart, Lee because he helped Breitbart with Pigford, and any other conservative bloggers or journalists who attacked Weiner.
3. Gennette C is real and dedicated to helping Weiner.
4. The other women who came forward publicly are real, and they have generally made their feelings and allegiances known. Ethel is also real. The only question mark for me is Jennifer George.
5. Most if not all of the other characters are fakes — I’ll call them sockpuppets — whose goal is targeting Breitbart and conservatives who support him. The sockpuppets chose to involve themselves in the Weiner controversy because he was their outspoken political hero. Not only did they truly believe Weiner was the victim of a hoax, they also knew he would not back down until the hoax was exposed.
6. Once Weiner admitted the truth and resigned, the sockpuppets remained involved to target Weiner’s attackers as revenge.
DRJ (fdd243) — 7/4/2011 @ 11:44 am@ Nancy Drew….you better leave this to the Hardy Boys 😉
Andrew Breitbart will vouch for Lee. Lee writes for Big Government. He’s done extensive research on the Pigford settlement case. Lee is on youtube and does Blog Talk Radio. He leaves his phone number everywhere for anyone to contact him.
Lee is real person and known.
Johnny 5 is alive (5ccc5e) — 7/4/2011 @ 11:46 amDRJ!
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/4/2011 @ 11:55 am#1157.
I only responded to an earlier question when someone wondering who STLA was referring to in tweeting Jenay cache page. That’s it.
I responded for purpose of transparency so no one thought a conspiracy or go down a mystery tweeter rabbit hole.
I’m not a blogger. I would not consider myself on a “team”.
I did not come up with JG name. I was copied on a tweet from STLA’s initial JG post. I assume he did so because he initially had referenced me in initial post.
When I received the tweet from STLA, I read post and quickly sent link to Stranahan if he had seen the post yet. Stranahan hadn’t and then he did. That’s why Stranahan’s comments on radio show 6/19 how JG could have been called so quickly stating she had received 2 phone threats when the STLA JG post had only come out few hours earlier. Coupled with claiming she lived in CA not MA.
1st tweet (last) I had ever exchanged with STLA was his copy to me of his JG post.
az5thdstrct (e76e6a) — 7/4/2011 @ 11:57 amAnd point 4: Why use a hijacked account which has a discoverable past history inconsistent with your sock?
Molon Labe (dc676c) — 7/4/2011 @ 12:03 pmThe other thing I noticed being on twitter is that a guy usually ends up collecting a bunch of what I believe are fake female follows that attempt to get them to click on links to see naughty pictures and stuff. You can usually spot these as people who have eleventy zillion follows, few followers, and only tweet links to naughty pictures of themselves.
I call them Twots (TWitter bOTS but sounds like what they are putting themselves out there as). An example would be @Ramsey_2731 or @BluEydGrl4im or @ThedaSexton23 or Prince_354 or @stegghnilqly or @powerfulloudmou or @amelia1066 or @jaguar7686 or @cute_serra or @gAgtTJ or @Anononomol57503 or a zillion others.
Now if she did “donate” the account, she might want to protect who she donated it to if it is a “cause” she believes in.
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/4/2011 @ 12:03 pmHAPPY INDEPENDANCE DAY, everyone!
BTW, if any of you have Pandora on your PC, you could do worse than selecting “John Phillip Sousa” for a ‘radio station’ for the day.
AD-RtR/OS! (d3e560) — 7/4/2011 @ 12:04 pmIt’s like sitting on the curb while the marching bands go by.
I believe either JG created Nikki or “gave” the account to someone else who did but not unknown to JG. I think she is upset because maybe she didn’t figure the account would ever be traced back to her real name. She might be even more upset if she gave that account to some other entity that she might not want her association with to be known.
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/4/2011 @ 12:08 pm1165 Molon Lake
Not proven by any means but certainly possible.
koam @wittier (e74ff0) — 7/4/2011 @ 12:11 pm@wittier
Thanks for clearing up that section of the info line.
OK so it was STLAH where the name Jennifer George originated. I guess the next question becomes motivation. Was STLAH in pursuit of Jennifer George to try and out conservative sock puppets in an effort to clear Weiner name. Or were they trying to deflect a legitimate inquiry down the wrong path by throwing out a name. Which would indicate they were in on it to some extent because all the caches would have to have already existed for people to check on. There had to be some clues/bread crumbs for people to follow to engage in the Jennifer George lead.
I still don’t know because that theory gets really complicated with a lot of hoops to jump through.
Johnny 5 is alive (5ccc5e) — 7/4/2011 @ 12:12 pm“1) Why not just create an account from scratch?”
Because if you need several such accounts, that makes for problems. You might be able to get dozens of people all around the country/world to create “cut out” accounts that you can use when you need them. If someone digs deeply enough they all trace back to different places with seemingly nothing in common. More smoke.
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/4/2011 @ 12:13 pmI didn’t say Sock puppet. I said puppet. He is a leftie..maybe he’s an undercover puppet. Have you seen his anti-pain you tube videos? A sleeper cell so to speak. It fits with the Neal m.o. The anonymous m.o. the lulzsec m.o. Might be nothing, might be something.
nancydrew (448ba9) — 7/4/2011 @ 12:14 pmI believe that is a valid possibility.
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/4/2011 @ 12:14 pm#1173 To what end? What is the advantage to “donating” an account in lieu of simply setting up an account?
It takes two minutes to create an account. And if you create it from scratch, you can give it whatever backstory you want with no risk of colliding with or revealing a former account owner.
Why is it necessary to postulate all these multiple-actor theories when there is absolutely no basis for them?
Molon Labe (dc676c) — 7/4/2011 @ 12:16 pmWouldn’t a very scared and worried girl who had received threatening calls from strangers want to not reveal her current location when she called to inquire about it with Lee & then Preston?
So saying she’s in California at first makes sense if she doesn’t know if she should be very afraid of Lee or not.
If your goal is to not get killed before sundown, misdirection on your location is a good idea until you are confident you’re not spilling the beans that could cost you your life.
(Speculating what would be in an innocent JG MA’s mind at time of call to Lee on 6/19. Not saying Lee called to threaten her, of course. But she may have not been calmed by her phone experience until Jen Preston perhaps schmoozed her and calmed a bit and gave her some breathing room. Speculating.)
koam @wittier (e74ff0) — 7/4/2011 @ 12:20 pm#1176 Oh so now it’s a conspiracy of dozens of people all over the world. JFC.
Molon Labe (dc676c) — 7/4/2011 @ 12:20 pm1179 Molon Labe
A sock wants to have an account with some backstory that fits the persona she is trying to portray.
The existing starchild account went back to the prior year or earlier and was all “girl talk” “fan of pretty girl celebrities” “talking makeup bags” “you’re the prettiest star” type of stuff. It was a good fit with the desired “I’m a teen girl who’s starstruck” persona that the sock wanted.
Sock doesn’t start a new account in this case because a new account is obviously new. If it starts March 1 and starts going after Weiner girlfriends March 8, it look suspicious..oh this account was just created to stalk Weiner / Weiner girls. If the account has girly history for many months back, it looks more real.
Sock kept a bunch of the history and deleted some too.
that’s why.
koam @wittier (e74ff0) — 7/4/2011 @ 12:24 pm1175 AZ5
I see no evidence to suspect wrongdoing on STLAH’s part. It was an easy google search as I demonstrated on 1090, once you used Jennifer + @starchild111 and are looking for which Jennifer. You and I both confirmed the same back at that time and again today. I’m not suspicious of STLAH just because he’s a pinko. If there’s other reason to be suspicious, I’d want to hear it.
koam @wittier (e74ff0) — 7/4/2011 @ 12:28 pmNo, it isn’t a conspiracy by dozens of people all over the world.
Take for example a group such as “anonymous”, they might say “hey, we need a bunch of twitter accounts, can you guys create some phoney ones and send us the credentials” so their loyal minions do so and are glad to help.
It isn’t so hard. It is “crowd sourcing” twitter accounts. Or maybe it is done word of mouth by people who know each other (I keep using the lesbian mafia as an example but only for convenience). Maybe Jenny has a friend who expresses a need for such an account and Jenny says she can use this old one she once created but doesn’t use.
There are a lot of liberals, conservatives, people of all sorts of causes who might not mind helping out one cause or another just to feel like they are being a part of the game. But when something gets traced back directly to them, the game becomes completely different.
It’s all fun and games until someone loses an eye, then its just games.
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/4/2011 @ 12:29 pmIt isn’t “conspiracy by dozens of people” any more than all of this going on here is a conspiracy by dozens of people. It is more like stone soup. Lots of different people putting in what they can to make a bigger something.
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/4/2011 @ 12:34 pmenjoying the pool
ColonelHaiku (822dce) — 7/4/2011 @ 12:37 pmweiners on the barbeque
right where they belong
#1182 Oh yeah, it’d be really suspicious if a high-school aged girl had a new twitter account. Cause we’re all born with twitter accounts ya know.
The “history” on the account was 7 tweets, and included discoverable information at odds with Nikki persona.
Molon Labe (dc676c) — 7/4/2011 @ 12:38 pmWhat was the elapsed time between the creation of the starchild111 account and the changing of the name to Nikki?
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/4/2011 @ 12:41 pm1175 1183 AZ
On second thought, I think we were being given some hints about this last night. So I will have to revisit and think about it.
koam @wittier (e74ff0) — 7/4/2011 @ 12:42 pmProbably pointed out somewhere along the way, but regarding the leap from “Jenay” to “Jennifer,” it’s worth remembering that early Starchild111 had quite an interest in Jennifer Lopez. As of the 1/1 snapshot, several of her 11 follows and all but one of her tweets involved Lopez-related individuals.
Greg (bc8186) — 7/4/2011 @ 12:43 pmComment by Patterico — 7/4/2011 @ 11:06 am
I have been worried about caller ID spoofing and use of Spoofcard or phonegangster because of the voice changing Lee remarked on at one point.
Some versions of these services permit spoofing of caller ID, (and you pick your own number) – i think Ispoofcard does not but you can change your voice and block your number.
Lee’s caller appears to be the same person as the one making the report.
If this is so, I do not see how (unless she is in league with other hoaxers) this caller is somehow distinct from the one who was interviewed by police.
How would an outsider target such an individual – someone actually claiming ownership of the account?
SarahW (af7312) — 7/4/2011 @ 12:43 pmWhich reminds me, maybe I should create a phony Twitter account now and make some innocuous tweets from time to time in case I ever need it in the future for something.
😉
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/4/2011 @ 12:45 pm1188 crosspatch
Date of creation of Starchild111 is said by JG in call to Lee as 2009. See Prudence Pain’s blog for step-by-step detailed analysis of transition.
koam @wittier (e74ff0) — 7/4/2011 @ 12:47 pm1190 Greg
I was thinking that perhaps Jennifer G used “Jenay” so that she could talk with Jennifer Lopez without it being, “Hi Jennifer, it’s Jennifer.”
koam @wittier (e74ff0) — 7/4/2011 @ 12:49 pm“It’s all fun and games until someone loses an eye, then its just games.”
crosspatch – I’m playing Jarts, too! Blow some sh*t up later.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/4/2011 @ 12:50 pmGoogle Voice lets you pick a phone number of your choice. You can route it to where ever you want to. It would take a subpoena by a law enforcement agency to track it down. You can place calls from that number using other tools such as gtalk.
http://www.google.com/support/forum/p/voice/thread?tid=7c20fa7523a13c63&hl=en
Also, people that have access to certain VOIP systems can make their caller ID appear to be whatever they want. That also applies to PBX systems used by businesses. What they can’t change is the billing information. The billing information is separate. If you have a PBX and change the caller ID and call a toll-free number (e.g. 800 number) the recipient will get the real line address and not the programmed caller-id. A person with a regular line will see only the caller ID.
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/4/2011 @ 12:52 pm1191 SarahW
Not sure I follow but if JG is an innocent J-Lo/Kardashian fan who started the twitter account and then abandoned it, she called Lee with *67, no voice morphing, called Preston, walked in to BPD, was visited by BPD detective, all as herself.
koam @wittier (e74ff0) — 7/4/2011 @ 12:53 pmIf you have questions about VOIP, ask Neal R. He is a VOIP expert.
Patterico (f724ca) — 7/4/2011 @ 12:55 pm1196 crosspatch.
JG called Lee with a blocked number (*67). What is the need for false numbers? I’m not following.
koam @wittier (e74ff0) — 7/4/2011 @ 12:55 pmHere’s what you have to believe to buy the hacker theory:
1) Hacker searches all over Twitter to find an inactive account, with no followers who might be suspicious of a hack, and who only followed people unlikely to want to contact them lest the hack be exposed, and whose twitter image comported with a high school girl. (Try it yourself, prolly take you a month to find that profile.)
AND
2) Hacker knows he can guess the password on the account within whatever number of attempts Twitter allows before a warning email is sent or account is locked.
AND
3) Hacker knows the original account owner will ignore warning notification from Twitter that account email has changed.
AND
4) Hacker doesn’t care or realize (some hacker!) that internet preserves information contradicting his new sock’s persona. (i.e., the effing name on the effing account).
From the point of view of the “hacker” let’s consider the alternative
1) Hacker just creates a fucking account to begin with in two minutes.
Or from the POV of reality:
1) The person who created starchild111 is the one who impersonated Nikki Reid. Period. End of story.
Molon Labe (dc676c) — 7/4/2011 @ 12:55 pmSo basically, we have IP proxies that can cloak IP addresses and make them untraceable without a subpoena. We have voice proxies that can cloak a phone number and make them untraceable without a subpoena. We have voice changers that make those unrecognizable.
Modern technology, gotta love it. You can’t be sure anyone who calls you is who they say they are.
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/4/2011 @ 12:56 pmIn case anyone missed 1145, it may be an important one to read.
koam @wittier (e74ff0) — 7/4/2011 @ 12:57 pmTo make someone think it’s a particular person calling?
Patterico (f724ca) — 7/4/2011 @ 12:59 pmthey had to destroy
ColonelHaiku (822dce) — 7/4/2011 @ 12:59 pmweiner to save the weiner
tweets to contrary
huma gave weiner
ColonelHaiku (822dce) — 7/4/2011 @ 1:01 pmpink slip now he look for some
other place to park
1199 — if someone were to call JG pretending to be Lee and they had a voice number from something like Google Voice in the same location where he lives it could look very much like a phone number from the same location with a voice having frequency characteristics much like Lee’s voice. Get a capture of Lee’s voice, use a spectrum analyzer program to display the frequency distrubution, do the same with your own voice, now run that through what amounts to a graphic equalizer to make the spectrum of your voice close to Lee’s and there you go. Through in a few mannerisms and his cadence and stuff, and to someone who has never talked to Lee or heard him before, it could sound a lot like Lee if they were to hear his voice again later. Particularly so if something is said to frighten them and screw with their memory of the moment a little.
Just saying that it isn’t all that hard for someone who does something like … is a music dj at parties or something. They would probably have all the required equipment and the knowledge to do it.
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/4/2011 @ 1:01 pmhuma abedin
ColonelHaiku (822dce) — 7/4/2011 @ 1:02 pmMister Ed ever been seen
together? think NOT!
Just saying that any sort of “hacker mafia” with political goals would easily have the resources required to pull something like this off and it gets easier if they have minions to toss in little bits of help here and there.
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/4/2011 @ 1:03 pmhuma and weiner
ColonelHaiku (822dce) — 7/4/2011 @ 1:05 pmdid Arab and Jooo ever
not come together?
alicia pain
ColonelHaiku (822dce) — 7/4/2011 @ 1:07 pmreid JG Lee a job for
inspector Clouseau
And considering how politically active certain Google employees have been in places like the White House, Egypt and Althouse, one might find themselves with some pretty high-powered help on a mission with a political agenda in their spare time. Same goes for any number of high tech business operations with people who have a political agenda and some technical know how operating in their spare time to “make a difference”.
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/4/2011 @ 1:09 pmMolon Labia
ColonelHaiku (822dce) — 7/4/2011 @ 1:10 pmbet you go through a lotta
Chapstick®… just sayin’
and NOTE that I am only advancing possibilities, not saying that I believe any of those things necessarily happened. Saying that until there is some real evidence, the possibilities are practically boundless. Getting someone’s IP address is useless. Getting someone’s phone number is useless … if they trace back to something that hides the real origination. Trying to recognize someone’s voice is useless.
Someone who has had a few years to set up a network of “hacktivists” ( http://www.thehacktivist.com/whatishacktivism.pdf ) can accomplish quite a bit particularly when combined with crowd sourcing.
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/4/2011 @ 1:14 pmonce had job as an
ColonelHaiku (822dce) — 7/4/2011 @ 1:16 pmundercover puppet hand
up ass blew cover
and I’m spent… you can thank colonel later
ColonelHaiku (822dce) — 7/4/2011 @ 1:17 pmBut my curiosity goes back to why the change to Nikki and why the focus on female follows of Weiner. The primary question I would have directly for Jenny George is if she personally ever tweeted as Nikki on the day Weiner sent that picture.
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/4/2011 @ 1:18 pm“Here’s what you have to believe to buy the hacker theory:”
Nope.
Hacker has hacker friends and friends of hackers who created cut-out twitter accounts long ago and have them on the shelf ready to use for stuff like this and are available for the asking.
Hactivism becomes much more effective when networks of people become involved.
Have a look at this list, for example:
http://twitter.com/#!/Dobroyeutro/hacktivist/members
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/4/2011 @ 1:24 pmThe Lee Stranahan posted three IP addresses that he suspected were from Patriot. Two of them traced back to WiTopia IP cloaking services, one of them traced back to a server that is or has been used for a porn site.
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/4/2011 @ 1:28 pmAs Patterico intimated, perhaps we should be prepared for the possibility that the Pain/death threats to JG are completely different people than the Reid/Wolfe sock puppets. LE may only solve a piece of the puzzle… for now.
Doug in oregon (a9a03f) — 7/4/2011 @ 1:29 pm#1217 The end result of a donated off-the-shelf account is an account controlled by the “hacker” (i.e., with a registered email under the hacker’s control).
Hacker could achieve that result himself simply by creating the account to begin with.
What is the point in having off-the-shelf accounts? Especially when said account has a DISCOVERABLE HISTORY contradicting your sock’s persona.
Molon Labe (dc676c) — 7/4/2011 @ 1:29 pmColonel seem to have
no need of blue pill to get
his juices flowing
(artistic ones I mean) Thank you, Colonel.
elissa (4a1b75) — 7/4/2011 @ 1:31 pmIf the UCLA Professor is Lew Hunter, he moved to Superior, Nebraska in 1999 or earlier, and his writers colony is held at his home, for two weeks, twice a year.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4EN3qtpPtCM&feature=related
(Excerpt of TV news program, uploaded August 28, 2007, claims he moved to Nebraska “8 years ago”)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lew_Hunter
A Wikipedia article claims:
“Every winter, Hunter returns to UCLA to teach his Screenwriting 434 course to graduate students in the screenwriting MFA program, the modern form of which he helped create.”
That sentence was added to the article on 13:16, 15 October 2006. There seems to be a note there about a different change that person made:
(Hunter’s Colony program grads did not write 9 of the top 10 grossing films. That was grads of UCLA’s screenwriting MFA program. (This was verified by him. I’m in the program and Lew is my professor.))
In the next edit “in the winter quarter” was put in the same sentence, but then taken out the next day probably by the same person. Five edits were made October 15 and 16, 2006. The IP addresses were 68.183.1.259, 65.39.101.101, and 68.183.31.112, (3 times in the morning of Oct 16, undoubtably in the same session)
Now a circa 2008 documentary about Lew Hunter does indicate he travels – so he could be there, but he probably doesn’t maintain a home in Los Angeles. On the other hand, he could still have a telephone number with LA Area Code – that’s been easy to do since 2003 and wasn’t impossible before. But the number on the website is a 402 number, which is the area code for eastern Nebraska. (there is now actually an overlay 531 area code as of March, 2011, but no numbers have apparently yet been assigned although they went to 10 digit dialing)
His wife’s name is Pamela if that’s any help.
Sammy Finkelman (6f74ae) — 7/4/2011 @ 1:32 pmJG called Lee with a blocked number (*67). What is the need for false numbers? I’m not following.
To make someone think it’s a particular person calling?
Comment by Patterico — 7/4/2011 @ 12:59 pm
Anyone can use Spoofcard. I know some of the aps don’t let you spoof caller ID anymore. But they do let you block, and have a voice-changing feature.
Not all *67 calls are perfectly blocked (800 numbers can see you despite) so spoofing can conceal your number.
Someone spoofing as Lee to JG could cause confusion, but I wouldn’t know if anything like that happened, it was just a concern.
SarahW (af7312) — 7/4/2011 @ 1:37 pm“Especially when said account has a DISCOVERABLE HISTORY contradicting your sock’s persona.”
Molon Labe – You keep saying this but offer no specifics.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/4/2011 @ 1:38 pm“Hacker could achieve that result himself simply by creating the account to begin with.”
But that is more difficult. If he collects accounts from people pretty much at random, he gets a accounts that were created at random times and random places and if they are traced back, they go to random people. No trail leads back to the hacktivist actually using the account except information that requires a subpoena to get and even then, maybe some that wouldn’t be available even if a subpoena is obtained.
Retention requirements expire after a certain time. I doubt Twitter would have any records of what IP address created an account that is more than 2 years old. A newly created account would likely have information such as the IP address that was used to create it and possibly other information. Information that is old is likely no longer retained.
So the last thing I am going to want to do is mess with someone using a twitter account that I myself recently created.
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/4/2011 @ 1:38 pmNo, koam (@wittier) — that caller is a hoaxer. There is a negligible chance the caller not involved in the hoaxing.
Her actions and story make no sense, she told lies, and outlandish stories.
In fact I will PRONOUNCE – hear me pronouncing- NO WAY IN HELL is the caller on the level.
SarahW (af7312) — 7/4/2011 @ 1:41 pmI’m trying to remember if there was an episode where a twitter account was hacked by someone trying to trap and tarnish the name of a hated right wing journalist (Breitbart). While at the same time other socks “inadvertently” released a scandalous dicpic in the middle of the reverse sting. I’m writing Burn Notice right now to sell this plot for a new episode.
I’m still leaning towards jilted ex-cyber-lover but I’m truly hoping it turns out to be a bunch of left wing activists who had their plans blow up in their faces on an epic level.
Hears to hoping! Happy Independence Day!
Johnny 5 is alive (5ccc5e) — 7/4/2011 @ 1:42 pmMolon Labe – ALL CAPS CONVINCE PEOPLE MORE BETTER
BOLD ALL CONVINCE PEOPLE EVEN MORE MORE BETTER
Why are you trying so hard?
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/4/2011 @ 1:43 pm@ SaraW
Wasn’t it already proven that JG in MA was in fact “not on the level” about some things?
Johnny 5 is alive (5ccc5e) — 7/4/2011 @ 1:45 pm#1224 Daley for crying out loud we have a google cache image of the starchild111 account with name “Jenay”.
If we have it, how would the hacker know going in that his target wouldn’t find it also?
Molon Labe (dc676c) — 7/4/2011 @ 1:47 pmHillary Clinton has a LOT of friends in the gay community. There were even rumors of a “thing” between Hillary and Huma. If Weiner were messing around on Huma, a lot of people might be sympathetic and it is possible could look into things on their own. It might be that this same group is also sympathetic to left wing causes, but the two interests might not be related in this case. If Weiner were seen as a scumbag by a “true believer” progressive who was hurting a close friend of Hillary, all bets are off.
Who knows what the motive was. I just want to know if it was Jenny tweeting as Nikki or not. If it was, then a lot of this goes out the window. If it wasn’t, then anything is possible.
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/4/2011 @ 1:47 pmActually, if it was Jenny tweeting as Nikki, my followup question would be if anyone was “helping” her with the tweets. Did she have a “handler”.
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/4/2011 @ 1:49 pmAnd the answer to the first question should be verifiable. The second question would be harder to know for certain.
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/4/2011 @ 1:50 pmOh god, I better spell it out for you Daley.
Daley for crying out loud we have a google cache image of the starchild111 account with name “Jenay”.
And that is discoverable information that contradicts the persona of Nikki.
Molon Labe (dc676c) — 7/4/2011 @ 1:51 pmcrosspatch – you make some good points but keep in mind that when the Twitter account was being switched over from Jennifer/Jenay to Nikki, the future was unknown. Your extraordinary measures would have required extraordinary reasons… and they didn’t exist then. Which is why I think simpler explanations are sometimes more logical.
Doug in oregon (a9a03f) — 7/4/2011 @ 1:52 pmNo Doug,
That Weiner would screw up and tweet something in the open was clearly unknown. That is a total screwup on Weiner’s part. But if the intention was to get Weiner to tweet then a pic in private and then take that to Hillary/Huma in private … who knows.
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/4/2011 @ 1:55 pmOr maybe even use it to blackmail Weiner. Anything is possible.
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/4/2011 @ 1:56 pmWhen exactly did the account switch to Nikki? I must have missed in in this torrent of comments.
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/4/2011 @ 1:57 pmNot offering an opinion on the specific issue you are discussing, but I have a problem with the “Occam’s razor” method of reasoning when there are hoaxers involved, or at least potentially involved.
Occam’s razor tells the mark in a three-card monte scam that, after having correctly identified the card the last three times, he will be able to do it again, now that his own money on the line. Occam’s razor! Supposing that the previous bettor was a hoaxer in on the scam is a CRAZY theory supported by absolutely no evidence! Extraordinary claims require extraordinary proof! Etc.
And you can think that . . . right up until the time that you lose all your cash.
Occam never met a hoaxer.
Patterico (f724ca) — 7/4/2011 @ 1:58 pm“And that is discoverable information that contradicts the persona of Nikki.”
WTF are you talking about?
This is not new information.
Are you mentally challenged?
Discoverable information contradicting the persona would be the the twitter personality taking positions or interests contrary to Nikki. Do we have it? No.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/4/2011 @ 2:02 pmSo basically everyone could be right but for the wrong reasons. Maybe STLAH saw Nikki’s actions as possibly someone attempting to get Weiner to screw up and was correct on that count, but then assumed that Nikki was some right-winger and got the motivation wrong. Maybe a lot of people got different pieces of the picture correct but then filled the rest of that picture with different conjecture.
Everyone touching a different part of the elephant.
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/4/2011 @ 2:03 pmDaley, if you were a l33t hacker member of a global conspiracy trying to trap Weiner into sending you a dic-pic, don’t you think you’d avoid using an account which a simple google search reveals had a different name in the past?
If you were not so sophisticated – say just for kicks a jilted 20-something sexting partner – don’t you think that concern would escape your grasp?
Cause there certainly is a lot that escapes your grasp.
Molon Labe (dc676c) — 7/4/2011 @ 2:08 pmYou know, Weiner was blackmailed – in 2009. The New York almost flatly reported it then.
Comment by Sammy Finkelman — 7/3/2011 @ 2:56 pm
Weiner was blackmailed? For what? Did an errant wiener pic show up in someone’s inbox?
Comment by Mike Myers — 7/3/2011 @ 2:58 pm
He was blackmailed into not running for Mayor in 2009.
It was gradually escalated, and something may have been communicated privately too
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/07/12/nyregion/12wolfson.html?sq=abedin%20wolfson%20mayor&st=cse&scp=1&pagewanted=all
For his part, Mr. Sheekey, who once accused Mr. Wolfson’s firm of having “corrupted” the political process with its relentless attacks on the mayor, said in an interview that he would rather have Mr. Wolfson working for him than against him.
“I have both respected and feared Howard from probably the first day I met him,” he said, adding: “Howard coming to work for Mike Bloomberg is no different than Hillary Clinton going to work for Barack Obama: Think of all the nasty things that Hillary Clinton said about Barack Obama.”
Mr. Wolfson claimed his first Democratic scalp in May, as Mr. Weiner — once a close ally in the Clinton campaigns — dropped out of the mayoral race amid a Wolfson-led behind-the-scenes campaign to force him to do just that.
Working with a local press corps he had cultivated for years, Mr. Wolfson and his team dug up and then pushed a steady stream of politically damaging tidbits about Mr. Weiner, giving the congressman an early taste of what he might face come the fall.
In one instance, Mr. Wolfson’s team discovered that Mr. Weiner had introduced a bill making it easier for foreign-born fashion models to work in the United States. In New York’s tabloid news culture — one Mr. Wolfson navigates well — the discovery produced unflattering news stories packaged with photographs of the congressman and sultry exotic models.
No matter that Mr. Weiner was someone Mr. Wolfson dispatched frequently as a surrogate against President Obama during last year’s primaries, or that Mr. Weiner’s fiancée, Huma Abedin, is a confidante of Mrs. Clinton’s whom Mr. Wolfson once considered a friend.
But Mr. Wolfson said that it was a fair fight and that he relished what he had accomplished. His team commemorated Mr. Weiner’s departure from the race by tacking on a wall in their office a photograph of the congressman in his goalie uniform during a pickup hockey game, with a caption quoting him as saying, “This is not a time for playing games; it’s a time for problem-solving.”
Sammy Finkelman (6f74ae) — 7/4/2011 @ 2:09 pmI am still digging through Prudence Pain’s blog attempting to find the timeline where Jenay becomes Nikki. (A link to the posting would have helped) but one thing I noticed is that as of a cache dated May 14, starchild has made 60 tweets. Not a lot since 2009.
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/4/2011 @ 2:12 pmAnd you can think that . . . right up until the time that you lose all your cash.
Point taken.
Doug in oregon (a9a03f) — 7/4/2011 @ 2:13 pmWhich is why I never, ever gamble.
Ok, so as of Jan 1, 2011 the account was still Jenay with no location specified. Following 16, 11 followers.
On April 6 it says just “starchild” with the name Jenay removed. 7 tweets total on the account. Now following 26, still 11 followers. Account is being scrubbed and becoming more active.
On April 16 it now has the name Nikki Reid 11 tweets, following 45, 22 followers. In that 10 days the number of following/followers have just about doubled.
http://prudencepaine.com/2011/06/29/for-weinergate-addicts-only/
So the account became Nikki (claiming to be in Los Angeles ) does the tweet pattern line up with Eastern time or Western time? Hard to tell because the screen shot will show the timestamp in the timezone of the person doing the browsing, not he person doing the tweeting.
But anyway, there is nothing going on with that account that isn’t consistent with the person doing the tweeting wanting to create a false personna.
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/4/2011 @ 2:22 pmI don’t really see showing your political opponent what they are in for is really blackmail.
RocksEm (5241c6) — 7/4/2011 @ 2:28 pmre: 1243
So it looks like a lot of people were aware that Weiner was a slimeball.
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/4/2011 @ 2:28 pmThat’s just exactly the sort of politician the mob LOVES to have in office at the local level and our enemies love to have at the national level.
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/4/2011 @ 2:29 pmAnd get this: Elite hacker cabal goes to all the trouble to hijack account and create fake Nikki persona, then does such a ham-fisted oafish job of it that a 19 yr old journalism student spots them as fakes immediately.
Molon Labe (dc676c) — 7/4/2011 @ 2:34 pmI don’t think anyone had to hijack anything.
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/4/2011 @ 2:42 pmPatterico @1239
The Sting. Now that was a cool movie.
elissa (4a1b75) — 7/4/2011 @ 2:43 pmHeck, for all I know, Jenny might be a friend of Huma’s and let her use the account to nab Weiner herself.
It could have been all Jenny, but if that is so, why would she go so far to hide her true identity? Why wouldn’t she have kept the name Jenay on the account? Whoever was communicating with Weiner’s follows wanted to appear to be someone they weren’t. It wasn’t innocent following of someone/infatuation, followed by a mistaken tweet. This was a concerted effort befriend his follows and then him by someone who wanted their real identity not to be known.
I believe Jennifer George created the Starchild111 account. I do not have enough information to believe that she was the one using that account on the day Weiner sent the picture.
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/4/2011 @ 2:46 pmMore importantly why hide the name Jenay but not the starchild111 name?
Notice about the only tweets on the account were from late last year to entertainment personalities.
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/4/2011 @ 2:49 pm“Molon Labe”
If I have an old twitter account lying around that I created more than 2 years ago and have never really used and if I were to email or IM you the password on that account and you use it, is that “hijacking”?
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/4/2011 @ 2:51 pmTurn it around:
CP: ML, do you have an old twitter account I could have?
ML: Why don’t you just create one?
CP: Ummm, just send the username and password.
ML: Well, I sorta use that password for other things, don’t really want to give it out. Say, why don’t you just create an account? Takes 2 minutes.
CP: Not good with computers. Blah blah.
Molon Labe (dc676c) — 7/4/2011 @ 3:13 pmAnd the word “hack” does not mean to break into, steal, or hijack. To the “hacker”, hacking means to use their skills in computing to do something. It actually refers to “hacking” on a keyboard as someone “hacks out code” or “hacks out a website” or “hacks the Linux kernel”. The word “hack” means different things to different people. To some people, being a “hacker” is someone who spends a lot of time at a computer keyboard producing something. It might be bad, it might be good.
A “hacktivist” would be someone who uses their computing skills to advance their agenda. It doesn’t mean they break into anything or hijack anything, but they might.
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/4/2011 @ 3:16 pmI’m aware of the definition of hacker as a skilled programmer, and I am using it in that sense.
The person acquiring the account would obviously have to be someone with skilz – even if it were a donated account from some mad hacker cabal.
Enough skills, at any rate, to realize that his sock was compromised from the very beginning by the presence of contradictory information easily accessible on the net.
And his socking was so poor that it was unmasked as fakery almost immediately.
Hence, there was no third party hacker/donatee or anything of the like.
Molon Labe (dc676c) — 7/4/2011 @ 3:23 pm“Molon Labe”
No, it goes more like this:
A few years back, someone puts out on a hacktivist mailing list that they would like people to create some twitter accounts and just put them on the shelf later. It is sold as an easy task that many of the minions could perform to “help the cause”. Then in 2011 someone asks for one or more of those accounts to use for a “project”. In fact, such “projects” probably come up from time to time.
To directly answer your question:
They don’t want to create a new account because that new account will have a lot of information about its creation retained by Twitter. Twitter probably doesn’t keep logs for more than a year or two. They want an account that was created a long time ago and even if it can be traced to the creator, it can’t be traced to the user of the account.
So it goes like this:
CP: Hey, you guys, create twitter accounts we might be able to use for projects. Don’t use them for anything “real” but it is okay to engage in some innocuous chitchat, maybe follow some popular celebs as cover.
ML: I created one, let me know if you ever want to use it.
…. many months elapse
CP: Hey, ML, can you send me the password of that twitter account you created? We need to use it for a project.
ML: Here ya go.
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/4/2011 @ 3:24 pmSo Jenny creates Starchild111 and it changes to Nikki Reid. Jenny (I believe) has admitted to creating the account (right?).
Now why all the antics by “John Reid”?
JG has admitted to creating the account and that pretty much exposes everything JR said was baloney. Why the smoke screen? Didn’t JR disappear right about the time JG admits creating the account?
Is JR really the people who were using the account attempting to create a cover story and that got blown by JG’s admission?
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/4/2011 @ 3:31 pmI believe JG created the account.
I believe JR9 is associated in some way with the person or persons using the starchild account when Weiner tweeted the pic. Might even be the very same person(s).
I don’t know for sure if JG is the person using the account when Weiner tweeted the picture.
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/4/2011 @ 3:34 pmI just don’t recall how the word got out about JG admitting to creating the account (nor am I sure she actually did, that’s just what I *think* I remember in this smoke-filled episode). Now if it was Stranahan that let that cat out of the bag … I can see why P would be annoyed.
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/4/2011 @ 4:06 pmYes, Lee announced JG had admitting creating account in call to him.
RocksEm (5241c6) — 7/4/2011 @ 4:12 pmshot out of cannon
ColonelHaiku (822dce) — 7/4/2011 @ 4:19 pmalways better than being
squeezed out of a tube
Here is Lee’s blog post concerning the Sunday, June 19 call with a JG.
http://leestranahan.com/weinergate-notes-on-my-619-jenny-george-call
Joe
Joe Smith (54c0c1) — 7/4/2011 @ 4:22 pmSir, not trying to say I “KNOW” all, just that I have been reading all about weinergate and have a pretty good handle on why the info is at a standstill. LE etc… was just trying to stop the crap and was pretty sure you were going to have to be the bigger man and let it go. Those of us that read you, know you are not a patsy. I doubt he will say sorry, and may not stop, but I tried. Sorry I stepped in and made you angry, not my intention at all. I love reading your blogs, sorry you are so busy at work. Have a great evening!
freedom_costs (51c21c) — 7/4/2011 @ 4:37 pmWhy did Reid and Wolfe stay in the game so long? Especially after Weiner quit. They kept saying that they didn’t want the media to come after them, so why not just totally go silent? Couldn’t be political at that point and sounds personal on some level. But to what purpose? Just to screw with us? For fun? They have to have know that the more times they post, the longer the forensic trail. Doesn’t seem smart and they don’t seem dumb. What end game are they shooting for?
Doug in oregon (a9a03f) — 7/4/2011 @ 4:53 pm1203 Patrick
Didn’t Lee say several times that the call came in on a blocked number? That’s achievable from any number if you dial *67 first. I don’t see need for VOIP or caller ID spoofing as Lee said no number came up on the incoming call.
koam @wittier (e74ff0) — 7/4/2011 @ 5:07 pm1206 crosspatch
Is there some discussion that JG received a call from a caller ID that matched Lee’s and that there is tape of a voice that sounds like Lee’s on JG’s answering machine?
koam @wittier (e74ff0) — 7/4/2011 @ 5:09 pmNow my question is why Lee would want to protect that network. Because by letting that information out and forcing JR9 to ground, he basically said “hey, if she told me that, then she probably told someone else that, too” and forced JR9 to shut up before he could be exposed. In effect, Stranahan acted in a way that protected whoever is behind Nikki Reid, intentionally or not.
Why is Lee trying so hard to put all the focus on JG? Why is Lee doing things to force JR9 to shut up?
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/4/2011 @ 5:10 pmkoam
not that I am aware of. I was saying that if you know where someone lives, it is pretty easy to get a phone number in their general area and make your voice sound like them, though.
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/4/2011 @ 5:12 pm1229 J5A
What is proven except that JG who called Lee, scared, said she was in CA but was in MA?
Wouldn’t a scared woman not tell the truth about where she was and use a blocked caller ID to avoid being located?
Apparently after some interaction with Preston, perhaps she fessed up about location after feeling more comfortable that Lee wasn’t the one who called her with threats? Why not?
koam @wittier (e74ff0) — 7/4/2011 @ 5:22 pmkoam- I believe there was just some speculation of how easy it would be to spoof Lee’s number and/or voice on JG’s phone if she did indeed get a death threat.
Doug in oregon (a9a03f) — 7/4/2011 @ 5:23 pmHe also insulted Reid saying he was going to jail, leaving the comment under my name. (He had admin access and if he logged in under the admin could leave a comment that looked like it was coming from me.)
And he said I said Reid was my source for a story that I never said Reid was a source for. And that he was not a source for.
All actions that might drive Reid underground.
Patterico (b1e9c9) — 7/4/2011 @ 5:24 pmTo protect JG? If they did use an account that belonged to her, maybe they felt a need to pay “rodeo clown” and attract some attention toward them to keep people from digging into the account history and discovering JG. Kindof a panic move. I don’t think JG would do that AND tell Stranahan that she created the account herself if she were following the whole thing because she would have known Stranahan and Patterico were collaborating on the story. Telling Stranahan would be telling Patterico and appearing on his website answering questions would be lunacy.
It is like telling Stranahan “JR9 is a fake” and then going on Patterico answering questions as JR9.
Looks to me like Stranahan is now in a mode where he is, intentionally or not, covering for whoever JR9 is. At this point the game would be “sacrifice the lesser asset (JG) to protect the larger asset (the JR9 net)” and you have Lee standing in the intersection as traffic cop waiving everyone toward JG.
JG is probably really pissed at someone and I don’t think it is P. If someone else was using that account, maybe they are going to throw her under the bus to protect themselves and Stranahan looks like he’s helping.
Questions for Twitter: Did the password on the starchild account change between October 2010 and the time Weiner’s wiener showed up on teh interwebz and if so, how many times and when? From where did those password requests originate, if any.
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/4/2011 @ 5:25 pm“All actions that might drive Reid underground.”
Not the actions of a polite guest blogger.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/4/2011 @ 5:27 pm#1166 DRJ
I tend to agree with all points you made in that post.
And if the main characters are real, and if Gennette did email Nikki after asking JR9 if the address she had was still correct, it could be possible that she apologized(or something) to Nikki and everything was smoothed over with them. Hence, the sudden silence. Have been wondering about the silence.
Lots of ‘ifs’ there, but seem to have seen a few others thrown out here also!
jmel44 (7e725f) — 7/4/2011 @ 5:27 pm@1274 – Similar to insults, threats and slurs leveled at Wolfe by Lee from Day 1.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/4/2011 @ 5:34 pm1261 crosspatch
JR9 is definitely connected to the controller of starchild111 (Nikki) during the Wenier era (early to mid 2011.)
koam @wittier (e74ff0) — 7/4/2011 @ 5:38 pm1262 crosspatch
Lee got a call from JG saying she had created the starchild111 account. Lee reports it right away to all of us. That wouldn’t be a reason for Patrick to be upset. That was an important event.
koam @wittier (e74ff0) — 7/4/2011 @ 5:39 pmI gotta get the kids ready for fireworks. Been an interesting day. I think I have a better handle on the situation, or at least the parts of it that seem interesting to me.
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/4/2011 @ 5:40 pm1267 Doug
koam @wittier (e74ff0) — 7/4/2011 @ 5:42 pmAgree with most of that but don’t see why it’s not political and only personal. That’s just one theory.
1280 koam
It would be a reason for P to be annoyed, I think, but I can’t speak for how he felt about it. It would have certainly annoyed me.
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/4/2011 @ 5:42 pmI have been having trouble catching up with all the posts. Sorry for the late entry. Grats on the number of comments!
On 6/19/11, I searched for “starchild111” and was simply checking what came up. You didn’t have to have the “Jennifer George” name to start; you only had to have the patience to sit and keep on looking at the results, looking for a name to show up somewhere in connection with the phrase. That’s all I did.
I mentioned the oddity I found at: https://patterico.com/2011/06/18/timing-weinergate-nikki-reid/comment-page-5/
comment number 185.
But let me ask a related question… When I searched for “Jennifer George” there were tons of them… So how did the field narrow down to JGCA and JGMA? I actually had guessed in a completely different direction when I was playing with the searches. Was there evidence that narrowed the field?
I don’t Twitter or Facebook, so I have been learning as I followed you folks discussing all these bits of information. It may be that the link was in research others could do that I couldn’t since I don’t do those things.
Also, how did the discussion apparently end up assuming that the point of the account was definitely some kind of sting against either Weiner or Breitbart? There are other possibilities for “misdirection” as far as the purpose of the account goes.
People lie or “misdirect” for many reasons. What evidence is there that the JG account holder became Nikki as a sting?
Sue (24e46b) — 7/4/2011 @ 5:47 pm1270 crosspatch
don’t follow
Please use post numbers and please use nouns not pronouns so we can follow your meaning.
1271 crosspatch
please use post numbers. i’m trying to follow you and there are obviously many questions floating at the same time.
I gather that you’re responding to 1269.
Lee received call from JP that was “private number”
I understand your response. Does this have to do with the call that JG received from someone claiming to be Lee or Lee-related?
koam @wittier (e74ff0) — 7/4/2011 @ 5:47 pm1272 doug
thank you to you and crosspatch
it’s very confusing as lee just said jg was lying about everything and he didn’t give all the details.
koam @wittier (e74ff0) — 7/4/2011 @ 5:49 pmcorrection 1273 doug thanks
koam @wittier (e74ff0) — 7/4/2011 @ 5:49 pm1274 pat
holy hell
koam @wittier (e74ff0) — 7/4/2011 @ 5:50 pm1274 Patrick
Holy holy hell
koam @wittier (e74ff0) — 7/4/2011 @ 5:56 pm1285 koam
I was referring to something someone else said about the threatening call JG got claiming to be from Lee. Not about the call to Lee from JG.
I was saying that it is possible to create a phone number just about anywhere and place calls that appear to come from that number when you aren’t even using a telephone. The call would trace back to google and it would require a subpoena to google to find out where the call actually originated from.
The conversation also says that one can make caller ID anything they want it to be in some cases. So if I have access to the right sort of phone equipment, I can call someone and make it look like the call came from you and I can make my voice sound somewhat like yours. Heck, a little sulfur hexafluoride from a welding supply shop and I can make Sarah Palin sound like Barry White.
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/4/2011 @ 6:03 pm1283 crosspatch
If you want to see part of what annoyed P, see 1274
I’m still in shock.
koam @wittier (e74ff0) — 7/4/2011 @ 6:07 pm@ koam @wittier
I don’t understand what JG/MA motivation for calling Lee is at all in this story. Unless she feels like she’s about to be found out and irrationally hopes she can talk Lee out of pursuing the story. Or it was a hoaxer trying to push people further down the wrong path. While not impossible it requires more explanation than just an irrational jilted lover does.
On I side note I can’t help but notice that the Weinergate cease fire didn’t last more than a day.
Did Lee accidentally post under Patterico’s name here in regards to the comment directed at JR9 or would he have to do it intentionally? I was pretty shocked when I read that and held back responding to it for just long enough to find out it was someone who’d borrowed Patterico’s name.
If it was intentional that’s low and makes me lose a lot of respect for Stranahan. The irony of it isn’t lost on me either though.
Johnny 5 is alive (5ccc5e) — 7/4/2011 @ 6:08 pmIf I were P, I would want to keep JR9 coming back as much as possible. Having Stranahan blow that would have annoyed me.
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/4/2011 @ 6:16 pm1284 sue
great. see also 1098 and 1090
Lee was focused on JGCA after reading her resume and he focused in her job at Reason Mag as a fundraiser. He called this “doing political work.” He emailed her with his phone number and sent her a facebook request on 6/19. Minutes later he gets a call from a JG saying she had been threatened and who said she was scared and worried. The call was from JG MA but Lee assumed it was JG CA calling an dlying. Lee said he was 90% certain JG CA was the target person because of this. The timing of the emails and the calls was “coincidental” relative to pointing toward JG CA.
He later backed away from JG CA entirely and repeatedly. JG CA wasn’t involved.
So I believe he found JG CA through that sequence of events and the 123people. Info that JG MA gave him (UCLA) was coincidental to JG CA’s background. That was also a mistake. But the mention of UCLA prof by JG MA, the caller, made Lee more sure it was JG CA who was calling at the time. A “Comedy of errors”.
koam @wittier (e74ff0) — 7/4/2011 @ 6:17 pmBut oddly, Stranahan’s pattern of actions are like someone who is protecting JR9. Like he wants to shut JR9 up. Like he is taking extraordinary active measures to do things to shut JR9 up.
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/4/2011 @ 6:19 pmDid Lee accidentally post under Patterico’s name here in regards to the comment directed at JR9 or would he have to do it intentionally? I was pretty shocked when I read that and held back responding to it for just long enough to find out it was someone who’d borrowed Patterico’s name.
If it was intentional that’s low and makes me lose a lot of respect for Stranahan. The irony of it isn’t lost on me either thoug
I read that thread and was blown away when I saw that comment labeled “Patterico” which wasn’t him obviously. That post was very clearly intentional, I don’t see any scenario where it wasn’t since it so clearly lines up with Lee (and his tantrum of calling people crazy and pretenders) and is so far afield from what Patrick has been doing.
Kaisersoze (c86eb0) — 7/4/2011 @ 6:19 pmI should clarify I was shocked when I saw “Patterico’s” the cops are on their way comment. I thought it was the most awesome reveal ever if it was true but at the same time wondered about it. I intentionally waited to respond to it for quite a while and I’m glad I did because not to long after that he posted that it wasn’t him that had posted it.
I’d be stunned to find out that Stranahan did it on purpose.
That really can’t be the case that a sock puppet investigation turns into a blog interview coup d’état sock puppet style.
Johnny 5 is alive (5ccc5e) — 7/4/2011 @ 6:23 pm1292 J5A
JG MA if innocent calls Lee to find out what the hell is up. She’s not reassured and winds up at BPD.
JG MA if not innocent is trying to pin hoax threat calls she says she received on Lee? I dunno. I’ve been assuming an innocent JG MA based on blurbs I’ve read here from important, careful participants.
I concur that 1274 is another shocking post. I don’t know about accidental vs. intentional. At this point I don’t think I’d just flatly grant the benefit of the doubt. But P is heated today (see twitter) so this is either the reason or a side-effect (not giving Lee the benefit of the doubt). I hope it was accidental but we’ll have to see.
koam @wittier (e74ff0) — 7/4/2011 @ 6:24 pmSeems more like “double agent” to me.
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/4/2011 @ 6:25 pm1293 crosspatch
the word evil comes to mind.
koam @wittier (e74ff0) — 7/4/2011 @ 6:26 pm1296 kaisersoze
It’s a disgusting development.
koam @wittier (e74ff0) — 7/4/2011 @ 6:28 pmNew idea.
It has been referenced in this thread that Cong. Weiner had been subjected to an attempted blackmail earlier.
Isn’t it possible that starchild111 was a cover for someone watching the Congressman to see if the people he contacted online were OK, and not attempting to harm him in some way?
Starchild was a twitter account used to get background information on the young ladies who Wiener was interested in. To see if they were trustworthy or not. Which is why her tweets were always probing what GL and GNC were talking about with the Weenie.
Patriot/Dan Wolfe was probably a similar persona used to burrow into accounts of conservative critics to see what they were up to.
It explains the ready availability of fake ID’s and complicated personas with backstories without a whole lot of detail to back them up.
CausticConservative (b29599) — 7/4/2011 @ 6:29 pmHeck, who else has admin, how do we know P even posted that most recent comment?
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/4/2011 @ 6:30 pm1302, that idea has been brought up before. That starchild was used to “vet” Weiners follows.
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/4/2011 @ 6:31 pm1282 koam
Political passions run hot so, of course I won’t rule them out. I just haven’t seen a target being aimed at. Seemed to be only JR9 and Wolfe defending themselves and attacking critics. Don’t understand the MO from them. I DO believe they have been doing this for a reason, whatever that may be.
Doug in oregon (a9a03f) — 7/4/2011 @ 6:34 pmI admit, I believe they are sock(s); not absolutely sure about JG MA (who called Lee) but probably.
@ Kaisersoze
Yeah I’ve never run or owned a blog so I don’t know if one wrong click and you’re posting a comment like the owner of the blog or not. If it was intentional I’m shocked that Patterico is even on speaking terms. That’s some seriously dishonest sabotage.
I kind of wonder if some level of jealousy has crept into this entire processes. I can’t help but notice that none of the sock puppets/people of interest want to talk to Lee.
I’ve noticed him go on and on on twitter about everyone that’s speaking to JR9/Nikki/USAPatrio76/Gennette to make all their private convo’s public. Which ironically enough when one was happening that he could have been involved in he sabotaged it.
Johnny 5 is alive (5ccc5e) — 7/4/2011 @ 6:35 pm1304 If that was their purpose, who were they? FBI/CIA backgrounders, looking for potential national security weaknesses in the Congressman’s contact list?
Or a private firm hired by Wiener to “help” him out of sticky situations when he finds himself in them? Keep in mind, Weiner is close to the Clintons, and B&H had people with a similar job description working for them in the White House.
What was that guys name again? It was so long ago…
CausticConservative (b29599) — 7/4/2011 @ 6:37 pmI can see someone “forgetting” for a moment that their comment would post as coming from the blog owner. But one would expect that upon seeing that they would pipe up with “that wasn’t Patterico, that was me” from Stranahan but no such thing happened.
I’m not saying 100% that he did it intentionally to start with, but it didn’t appear that he took any action to correctly note who the comment came from, either.
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/4/2011 @ 6:39 pmI don’t really buy the vetting for Weiner idea. Gennette said she informed AW about the possibility of them being sock puppets to begin with. That he was aware of it and they were both “intentionally” screwing with them. Which doesn’t make any sense if that person was actually trying to vet others. Unless they were actually vetting Gennette.
You’d think if the federal government was trying to probe/vet what ever they’d be able to pull of a better background than borrowing someone else twitter account. I’d imagine they wouldn’t make mistakes about teenage pop culture either.
Johnny 5 is alive (5ccc5e) — 7/4/2011 @ 6:43 pmThat would be where the notion was going when I brought it up a few days ago.
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/4/2011 @ 6:45 pm@ crosspatch
I was thinking the same thing, there should have been an “oops” post shortly there after. Patterico actually posted next to clarify the situation.
Johnny 5 is alive (5ccc5e) — 7/4/2011 @ 6:48 pm1309
Federal govt? No, they would be better than that, I think, and would already have a stack of twitter accounts and wouldn’t need to worry. They could make them look pretty real. Hacktivists or some third world intelligence operation, maybe not.
If you are a member of Congress on the Internet, you are going to have all sorts of people watching your every move. China will be watching, Iran will be watching, heck, the Zetas will be watching looking for an opportunity. You don’t have to worry just about political enemies, you have to worry about enemy enemies.
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/4/2011 @ 6:48 pmWeiner is just an idiot. It looks a lot like someone was positioning themselves into trying to get some dirt on him. Dirt can be pretty valuable. The possible motivation for it spans the spectrum. I’d like to talk to whoever was at the keyboard as JR9
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/4/2011 @ 6:51 pm@ crosspatch #1311
Those questions could be answered if someone just asked the woman who came forward. Was Nikki and company following the LV blackjack dealer? Or the other woman who was on Hannity? This story seems to just revolve around a handful of people.
If it was vetting it was incredibly sloppy. If you are in the business of gaining a strangers trust online for the explicit reason of getting information out of them Nikki and company was terribly at it. So terrible that it “supposedly” made Gennette suspicious.
Johnny 5 is alive (5ccc5e) — 7/4/2011 @ 6:51 pm*terrible at it…like my proof reading.
Johnny 5 is alive (5ccc5e) — 7/4/2011 @ 6:54 pmI am not saying it was vetting, just saying the thought crossed my mind.
I think JG had very little to do with this aside from creating a twitter account that was eventually used with regard to weiner. Thats all I am prepared to state with any certainty and even that is suspect because all I have is Stranahan’s word on the matter.
Though the fact that JR9 shut up immediately after seems to indicate that might be the case.
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/4/2011 @ 6:55 pmThe trouble I have with this entire story is I think just about all the main players are lying in one way or another. It’s tough to figure anything out when everyone is being duplicitous.
If JG in MA is actually unstable then things start to make crazy-logical sense.
Johnny 5 is alive (5ccc5e) — 7/4/2011 @ 6:58 pm1312 crosspatch
Agreed
koam @wittier (e74ff0) — 7/4/2011 @ 6:58 pmIf someone called JG claiming to be Lee, someone could have called Lee claiming to be JG.
We really don’t have anything other than some phone calls and what Stranahan says.
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/4/2011 @ 6:58 pm1319 crosspatch
Well we always had to wonder about Lee’s concept of “proof” but now 1274 puts everything into question.
But if we accept that Lee was just old Lee and was trying to find the truth and told us the truth, then JG called him, I think because she also talks to Preston a few times and then goes to the BPD. The discussion of continuity in her dealings on the phone and with BPD made most of us think it’s the same JG. And BPD would have verified that she’s a real person.
koam @wittier (e74ff0) — 7/4/2011 @ 7:04 pm1306 –
If it was intentional I’m shocked that Patterico is even on speaking terms. That’s some seriously dishonest sabotage.
Comment by Johnny 5 is alive — 7/4/2011 @ 6:35 pm
I liked Lee and listened to some of those blog radio shows (cat and all) and I don’t dislike him, but I really don’t get him making pronouncements of certainty based on a few data points. Patrick has done some serious biznitch-slapping of him on Twitter and I get the feeling it takes a lot to get Patrick to that level of action.
Also on somewhat of a tangent, reading his comments to JG of California I can see where Lee could makes comments a little stronger than that and the person could take it as a threat. At this point I think Patrick’s scenario has to be the most likely since he is posting it and hinting he has evidence of it that isn’t public.
Kaisersoze (c86eb0) — 7/4/2011 @ 7:05 pm# 1320
I used to think that too but Lee clarified that the Detective that spoke with JG MA also mentioned Prof Hunter. So unless the JG hoaxer knew that JG would use the prof as a personal reference to Lee that line of the conspiracy has to go another layer deeper.
Which would be that a hoaxer did call Lee but JG in MA is a willing accomplice of sorts and they worked out this little tid bit ahead of time. Which begs the question why wouldn’t she just call Lee and tell him what she wanted to tell him. What was the purpose of the hoaxer JG?
Johnny 5 is alive (5ccc5e) — 7/4/2011 @ 7:07 pm1317 – If JG in MA is actually unstable then things start to make crazy-logical sense.
Comment by Johnny 5 is alive — 7/4/2011 @ 6:58 pm
A huge amount of this is hidden and overlapping weirdness obviously, but some threads of it seem to make sense if you follow these theories:
1 – Gennette was sexting Weiner and coordinated with him afterward on covering it up, as seen in the NY Post article.
2 – Some of the Nikki Reed, et all accounts were from a young girl that was sexting him also, and coordinated with him afterward as seen in the Tommy Christopher “my mom vouches for it” article.
3 – Neil Rauhauser was either brought in to help with the coverup or did it on his own, employing some of the underhanded/illegal tactics we have seen from the sockpuppets. Nikki gives account password to Weiner staffer who passes it on to operative Neil isn’t out of the question.
All theories of course and I’m sure most are wrong, but it makes sense with what we have seen from Patrick and Gennette here. I could also see the JReid9 account and the Nikki Reid account being a troubled young liberal girl that did the Tommy Christopher stuff to protect Weiner, then came to this site out of spite for Gennette when she found out Gennette was playing her, or a bigger object of Weiner’s affection than she was, or whatever was rattling around her head at the moment.
Kaisersoze (c86eb0) — 7/4/2011 @ 7:15 pm@ Kaisersoze
Yeah, I’ve been following Lee since he started reporting on the Pigford case. I’ve listened to his BTR as well. I’m not sure that I dislike him now but to sock puppet the owner of a blog and potentially chase off the very person the owner brought on to answer peoples questions seems really, really odd. It makes me question what his intent is at this point.
Clearly Patterico is still chasing something down. Perhaps Lee has hit a dead end and feels that any speculation beyond his conclusion hurts his case. Or he’s offended that not everyone has just accepted his version of things. He does misrepresent some theories as fact though. All that being said I still think his explanation makes the most sense.
It’s just the more he gets angry about it the more I have to wonder why? Perhaps he’s just as impatient as the rest of us are for the final chapter.
Johnny 5 is alive (5ccc5e) — 7/4/2011 @ 7:18 pm@ Kaisersoze
Thanks for laying out the Neil angle. I hadn’t actually heard the theory from anyone. I know everyone keeps dropping the “Hi Neal” comments here and at Ace of Spades HQ but until now I wasn’t really seeing how he was involved.
That theory actually makes quite a bit of sense as well. At this point I guess anything is possible and only time and LE will tell. Of course that doesn’t mean it isn’t fun to keep poking hole in random theories. Who is Neil posting under in this thread?
Johnny 5 is alive (5ccc5e) — 7/4/2011 @ 7:26 pmKaisersoze: There was no Nikki Reid if what Stranahan says is the truth. I mean, there was certainly someone posing to be a Nikki Reid and snatching photos off of Facebook to create a personna of Nikki Reid, but the account was created by Jenny George or so Stranahan says the person who may or may not have called him said.
Someone named Jenny George obviously called BPD to complain about a threat that claimed to come from Stranahan. Is that *the* Jenny George and *a* Jenny George, who knows.
The detective apparently mentioned some professor … according to Stranahan. Stranahan is the source of practically everything we have.
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/4/2011 @ 7:28 pm1274. Patterico
Pat, izzat you? If so, you’ve been generous in your restrained response. Are you sure it had to be Lee? Does your blog protect use of your name?
jeffeneff (707f3d) — 7/4/2011 @ 7:30 pmWhere is false post under Patterico name?
RocksEm (5241c6) — 7/4/2011 @ 7:31 pmAnd maybe Neil’s minions were in on it from the start, not “brought in” if the deal was to protect Huma from a philandering Weiner.
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/4/2011 @ 7:32 pmjeffeneff here, conducting test.
Patterico (707f3d) — 7/4/2011 @ 7:33 pm1328. Patterico removed the false post
jeffeneff (707f3d) — 7/4/2011 @ 7:33 pm1327 jeff
koam @wittier (e74ff0) — 7/4/2011 @ 7:34 pmI’d be very disappointed if Pat assumed Lee did it without checking IPs or other verification.
1325 – Thanks for laying out the Neil angle. I hadn’t actually heard the theory from anyone.
Comment by Johnny 5 is alive — 7/4/2011 @ 6:58 pm
From what you read of his past (if accurate) this kind of stuff seems to fit a pattern and Mike has posted here that Neil threatened him by saying he had proof he had hacked Weiner, etc. He also brags on Twitter about having worked for Democratic campaigns sub rosa, it wouldn’t be a surprise to me if it turned out to be true.
Kaisersoze (c86eb0) — 7/4/2011 @ 7:35 pmkoam, likewise, but i showed you don’t need admin access
jeffeneff (707f3d) — 7/4/2011 @ 7:36 pm1326 – Kaisersoze: There was no Nikki Reid if what Stranahan says is the truth.
Comment by crosspatch — 7/4/2011 @ 7:28 pm
Sorry, I meant the Twitter account labeled Nikki Reid. There is a huge amount of sockpuppetry and misdirection in this story obviously, sorry I wasn’t clear.
Kaisersoze (c86eb0) — 7/4/2011 @ 7:36 pm“Patrick has done some serious biznitch-slapping of him on Twitter and I get the feeling it takes a lot to get Patrick to that level of action.”
Kaisersoze – You are correct in the above assessment.
I cannot recall the date of the errant comment, but could it have been a sockpuppet Friday name change snafu between threads?
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/4/2011 @ 7:38 pmtest [edit — since Molon Labe doesn’t make it clear, this was not me, but Molon Labe conducting a test]
Patterico (dc676c) — 7/4/2011 @ 7:45 pmGuess I have admin status. Good grief what a tool.
Patterico (dc676c) — 7/4/2011 @ 7:46 pmIf Patterico is coming out an saying that Lee did that he must have double checked IP addresses. One thing I’ve noticed about Patterico is he’s very specific in his statements and has something to back them up with.
Johnny 5 is alive (5ccc5e) — 7/4/2011 @ 7:47 pmIt’s so simple, even a lib could do it.
It’s me, crosspatch.
Patterico (6adcc9) — 7/4/2011 @ 7:48 pmI asked Lee on twitter if he did it accidentally or intentionally and never heard back from him. That would seem like something if you didn’t do it you’d adamantly deny. Gotta love the irony of it though.
Johnny 5 is alive (5ccc5e) — 7/4/2011 @ 7:50 pmHave fun folks, we’re going out to our neighborhood park to watch the fireworks. Hope everyone on the East coast had a great 4th.
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/4/2011 @ 7:52 pmdaley testing
Patterico (bf33e9) — 7/4/2011 @ 7:54 pmif patterico goofed, he’ll own it.
jeffeneff (707f3d) — 7/4/2011 @ 7:58 pmTime to repeat the rally music!
Plodding on to 2,000.
Patterico (bf33e9) — 7/4/2011 @ 8:00 pmOops, that was me.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/4/2011 @ 8:01 pmRe: #1294 koam @ wittier
Sue (24e46b) — 7/4/2011 @ 8:06 pmThanks for the clarifications.
So, Lee was going through JG’s and spotted someone with a background that fit some ideas he had and made direct inquiries? Then a person self-identifying as JG called him at a point where he assumed it was a direct response to his inquiries? Was/is there any evidence going from the account forward, or was it all the “Comedy of errors” and coincidence suggesting that this person was the account holder? In other words, aside from contacts leading to assumptions about the account holder’s identity, is there evidence going from the account to a specific JG person? I guess the related question there is this: the caller reportedly said they had opened the account but denied any connection to Weiner. As I understand it, the account didn’t have much in it to identify, so what evidence is there that the caller actually was the account creator? Is there anything that might lead elsewhere?
On twitter Lee says it was an accidental posting.
Stranahan Lee Stranahan
Yes, a few days ago during one of the JohnReid Q&A sessions I made a comment that went up under Patterico’s name.
Stranahan Lee Stranahan
Johnny 5 is alive (5ccc5e) — 7/4/2011 @ 8:07 pmThis happened because I was logged in as an Admin. I was logged in as an Admin because Patterico had asked me to read a draft of something.
Those tests don’t have much meaning.
I really think Pat knows how this works.
koam @wittier (e74ff0) — 7/4/2011 @ 8:08 pm“Those tests don’t have much meaning.
I really think Pat knows how this works.”
koam – Yes, but all the commenters don’t.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/4/2011 @ 8:10 pmHave a great Independence Day crosshatch! Happy 4th of July!
Johnny 5 is alive (5ccc5e) — 7/4/2011 @ 8:10 pmHappy Fourth of July! 😀
Sue (24e46b) — 7/4/2011 @ 8:11 pmI’m going to have to quit for tonight, but I have stray curiosity type questions.
Despite the assertions of GC that she “knew” Nikki was fake and that is why she flirted, etc., that seems to be an assumption and/or possible misdirection.
What if GC knew exactly what the account holder was, and the changes were implemented for some purpose other than “catching” Weiner? What if Weiner also knew?
Sue (24e46b) — 7/4/2011 @ 8:18 pmThe blog owner can match IP addresses from people who post here. If I suddenly change my name and post under someone elses name he’d be able to match up my IP address.
It was Lee that posted under Patterico’s name. He said it was on twitter and explained how it happened.
Johnny 5 is alive (5ccc5e) — 7/4/2011 @ 8:19 pmHackers comandeered –and bragged about it–a Fox News political twitter account earlier Monday. False tweets claimed Joe Biden now president. Scary stuff out there.
Twitter is the devil. Why sane people use it and trust it is hard for me to understand.
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/07/05/business/media/05fox.html?_r=1
elissa (4a1b75) — 7/4/2011 @ 8:25 pmBy the way, I am waiting (reasonably patiently) for the end of the story… in the meantime, I am enjoying the wonderful discussions here… 😉
Sue (24e46b) — 7/4/2011 @ 8:25 pmLeee’s contention was that if Niiki Reid was fake then John Reid was her fake father and anything he provided would be subject to that same view.
“What is his true motive, what is real vs fake”.
However, JR9 did not run away because of Lee in my view but because of GC. The first parts of his doc dump look legit and GC confirmed many aspects but then he or someone provied additional items that GC claimed were false and after she asked if the emaile for Niiki was still good, well then you know the rest of the the JR9 story.
Joe
Joe Smith (54c0c1) — 7/4/2011 @ 8:26 pmI’m really hoping an alien theory comes out at some point. Just because I really enjoy the Sci Fi genre. 😉
Johnny 5 is alive (5ccc5e) — 7/4/2011 @ 8:32 pmhttp://swiftread.blogspot.com/2010/10/desperate-democrats-hire-progressive-e.html
Desperate Democrats Hire Progressive E-Thugs
Yes, Neal uses the term clients to describe his former employers who hired him to “handle their social media needs, specifically on twitter” PPST = Progressive Political Strategy for Twitter”
In a recent article he said he had “44 clients in total” – only 15 were listed on PPST. And Greg & I are so discredited that Rauhauser lost every single “public” election that he worked on.
And while some like McCain question whether there was proof of Rauhauser’s involvement – the above article provides more than enough proof for those willing to read it. Including Rauhauser’s own words from Daily Kos.
“Twittergate” was not done by Greg nor I. It falsely assumed Neal was linked to Tea Party Tracker, funded by the NAACP. The producer of that video jumped our investigation and went off on a tangent. Why? Because the “beandogs” harassed them & put her reaction on the teaparty tracker hash tag.
IN fact, Rauhauser was linked to Democrat Political Campaigns – as the above title says. Not the NAACP.
SwifftRead (8612d7) — 7/4/2011 @ 8:35 pmhttp://swiftread.blogspot.com/2010/10/democrat-cyber-stealth-revealed-neal.html
“Democrat Cyber Stealth Revealed”
Details more research on Neal, using his own online footprint. And how he hid the identities of foreign entities who interfered in our election process. Neal was reported to the FBI, but I never filed charges on him. And for the record, he never worked in Washington DC – he just had a cell phone that pointed here.
SwifftRead (8612d7) — 7/4/2011 @ 8:39 pmhttp://swiftread.blogspot.com/2010/10/hank-gilbert-texas-ag-candidate-hires.html
Last bit of research on Rauhauser. This reveals how far left Rauhauser really is, including his endorsement of Perma-Culture, which lays way to preserving the world’s food supply and social engineering.
There’s some more to it. If you’re interested in Neal’s twitter tactics, simply look at the below photo album. Neal& his people making death threats are nothing new to twitter.
http://swiftread.blogspot.com/2010/10/slide-show-progressive-psts-neal.html
SwifftRead (8612d7) — 7/4/2011 @ 8:44 pmhttps://patterico.com/2011/03/25/patterico-and-lee-stranahan-to-quit-blogging-at-huffington-post/
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lNVit7cesj8
vor2 (a0843a) — 7/4/2011 @ 8:50 pmyes, VOR2, at that point, I had a very high opinion of Lee.
Unfortunately, I think Patterico was too busy with work to carefully consider my concerns about Lee when I realized there might be a problem with the way this person handles private communication or the way he selects which detailed to bring forward.
Seeing what I’ve recently noticed, where Patterico is upset that Lee is asking critical questions he already knows the answer to, regarding Patterico’s ‘follow up’ reminds me of how Lee handled an issue with me.
I had recently gotten frustrated with how Lee handled one of his PatriotUSA suspects, and how he admitted to lying, and then issued what Lee has described to me as an apology, but clearly was the opposite of an apology… it was a rationalization. But people offer fake apologies all the time, and I just wanted to make clear I wasn’t able to count on his word, especially on this story, until he’s shown he’s worth trust again.
Later, I explained I was deleting a joke twitter account meant to show some support for PatriotUSA76 because Lee informed me he was being threatened (at that point he made it sound like violent threats, but I’m not sure if that’s accurate). I explained I couldn’t support that sort of behavior, but Lee omitted that explanation and conveyed the twitter account deletion as though it was linked to whatever the news of the day was with John Reid. I think Lee thought he had John’s IP address (maybe he did… I don’t know or care). I found the way he cleverly mentioned some detailed to be extremely dishonest, and even a bit scary, because it linked me to characters I think are unsavory. Soon, I learned Lee had been telling his ‘radio’ audience he had some awful secret about me, as in “Dustin” (which is my name). When I challenged Lee directly, he had nothing of the sort (that I already knew). He was relying on something I had confided to him, but spinning it ridiculously. All he knew was that I had this particular twitter account.
So he was spinning the same fact in two completely opposite directions at the same exact time. On the one hand, this twitter account’s deletion was spun as though it was linked to John Reid (again, he knew it wasn’t… he knew it was me and he knew it was removed to avoid being associated with someone Lee was having a serious problem with). On the other hand, the account was spun as a secret proving I’m dishonest (nothing I said on the account was different than what I’d say here).
I know this is a minor issue. But he certainly didn’t make it sound minor, and some of his loyalists soon showed just how seriously they took his stupid commentary.
So I explained to Patterico my concerns, and he wanted us to deal with the issue on our own (which is perfectly fair, but I worried he was not grasping my complaints at the time as a word of caution).
Anyway, Lee has it in him to be an awesome journalist, but when he’s challenged or frustrated, his doesn’t handle it well. It was clear at the time that how he was treating me was intended to be a response to the fact I had challenged his integrity, linking specific grounds that didn’t make him look so great. Instead of showing me I was wrong, he showed me I was right. Since then, he’s moved on to ticking a lot of other people off in ways that make my complaint seem even smaller than it did then.
But still, the fact is that he was unable to maintain a confidence between us, he was willing to selectively provide details in a harmful way, and he was reckless with someone’s reputation in the context of a matter he acts as though he takes seriously.
Hopefully he learns his lesson, but I wouldn’t bet on it.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/4/2011 @ 9:12 pmNo. Not really. Some providers use NAT meaning that thousands of users may appear to come from only a few IP addresses. Others might use proxies that make for the same problem. Or the IP address you appear to come from might change every time you connect to the Internet. Or you might be using a VPN which masks your IP address.
IP address means very little these days.
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/4/2011 @ 10:17 pmWell, I will qualify that. For SOME people the IP address can be traced back to at least their ISP and sometimes to them. Others can be much more difficult.
It just isn’t the same in all cases so it isn’t safe to make assumptions that you can track someone’s IP address back to them.
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/4/2011 @ 10:40 pmAnyway, Lee has it in him to be an awesome journalist, but when he’s challenged or frustrated, his doesn’t handle it well.
Comment by Dustin — 7/4/2011 @ 9:12 pm
Agree, I know its petty but the point of him calling Patterico posters “crazy” and “pretending” about JReid9 was pretty annoying to me. Its funny too that we are all crazy if we didn’t accept his statements on Nikki/John Reid as gospel but now his story on his post that set Patrick off is “Oh, I forgot I was logged in as an admin, though I had posted under my own name dozens of times already”.
He is also on Twitter asking why JReid would be giving info to a conservative blog as if there is only one answer (his). Here is another possible answer – because this is the blog Gennette was posting on and the aim of that person was to get back at Gennette. And why would they post one of the liberal blogs when they were either ignoring the story or still on the “Breitbart hacked Weiner” meme?
Kaisersoze (c86eb0) — 7/4/2011 @ 11:04 pmYeah, this all sounds familiar. Every word of it.
Patterico (f724ca) — 7/4/2011 @ 11:22 pmI don’t think anyone would want to “get back” at Gennette. I mean, if JG created the account then Nikki Reid doesn’t exist. The Nikki Reid name was added to an account and pictures were swiped off of Facebook to create a persona. JG has allegedly admitted that she created Starchild111. Who is “getting back” at Gennette?
This smells to me like someone was just trying to keep people off of Jenny George’s scent. I think the notion being that once they appeared to be a normal American family with an infatuated daughter, things would settle down, attention would focus back on Weiner and the heat would be off. Except someone made a Jenny George connection and then Stranahan says she admitted to creating the account. That blew JR9’s attempt at damage control out of the water.
JR9 put enough stuff out there to show that he had access to some stuff that the owner of the account would have access to. Find out who JR9 is and my guess is you find out who was tweeting as Nikki or are very close to finding that out.
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/4/2011 @ 11:28 pmYou guys are correct. You don’t have to have admin status to post a comment claiming to be me.
If you do so, however, without making it clear it’s not me, you are subject to being banned.
I found out about the Patterico comment from JohnReid9. I was appalled. As I always am when I see a comment on my site under my name that is not from me.
Please stop doing it, even as a test. I don’t like it.
Patterico (f724ca) — 7/4/2011 @ 11:42 pmWhat I love is the position: JohnReid9 should not be given any voice at Patterico. We know that because he is a liar. Why, some of the proof we have that he is a liar is from information he provided because he had a voice at Patterico!
I do not publicly subscribe to the position that JohnReid9 is a liar, by the way. I will say that even though he has apparently disappeared completely and is giving me no more information or emails. I will simply repeat what I have said perhaps a hundred bajillion times: whether he is really a father of a child improperly approached by Weiner, or a hoaxster (JG or someone else), his views, statements, and information are NEWS.
And as long as those views, statements, and information are presented by someone who REPEATEDLY AGAIN AND AGAIN AND AGAIN says he is not vouching for JohnReid9, I don’t see what the possible harm is. If he is a huge liar, the commentariat will see it.
And if he says something in public at odds with what he says in private, I can pounce. Of course, with people committing crimes right and left, I may choose to leave that information to law enforcement instead of a bunch of blog speculation. But as always, my devotion will be and will always remain to the truth.
Patterico (f724ca) — 7/4/2011 @ 11:56 pmDid JR9 traffic originate from the LA area? That is where Nikki claimed to live.
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/5/2011 @ 12:17 amBut that might not mean much.
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/5/2011 @ 12:20 amThat is not the kind of question I am going to answer.
If he is an innocent man, he does not deserve to have that revealed.
If he is not — if he is, in fact, Jennifer George or Neal R. or Patriot or all or none of the above, but/and/or somehow complicit in criminal activity — I am sure law enforcement can figure it out.
So why discuss it on a blog?
Patterico (f724ca) — 7/5/2011 @ 12:20 amFrom Lee’s twitter feed a few hours ago:
“@Stranahan Lee Stranahan
And the day I need to show ‘self restraint’ to protect a liar trying to bring down my friends is the day I quit. So I did. @cshenkel”
Protecting journalist or blogger friends is more important than revealing truth in the story is what I believe Lee is really saying there.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/5/2011 @ 12:24 amNo, daley, I think he is making some obscure point about not humoring JohnReid9.
Patterico (f724ca) — 7/5/2011 @ 12:36 amOk, I wasn’t looking at it from a criminal perspective and in that light, yeah, that changes things. I was looking at it from a different, more social perspective.
We have a conflict. We have a person who says he is Nikki Reid’s father and she was using the Starchild account who claimed to be in LA (though a person can claim to be from anywhere on a Twitter account).
We also allegedly have someone on the opposite coast that says she created the account. I wasn’t looking for anything too exact, just wondering from which coast the traffic came.
It was one of those “if you want people to believe you, some parts of what you say need to check out or at least some parts of what the other person claims needs to be shown to be false”. Not in a court of law, mind you, but from a more informal social setting.
Any time one views a website, they must certainly know that the owner of the site potentially has an IP address where the traffic appears to originate (that isn’t always accurate but it is usually close, same coast, same continent, same country).
Its ok, it was just a question I had in my mind.
Trying to figure out which one is lying.
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/5/2011 @ 12:38 am“No, daley, I think he is making some obscure point about not humoring JohnReid9.”
Patterico – I understand that and don’t that point is all that obscure. He feels that giving JR9 a platform helps bring down his friends in some way, but there was nothing, unless you two had an agreement, to prevent Lee from asking JR9 questions or challenging him while JR9 was commenting on your blog.
As another commenter mentioned earlier, giving the participants enough rope to hang themselves, in this case exposing lies or contradictions in their own stories or those of others, is a time honored strategy.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/5/2011 @ 12:44 amEveryone should go read Neal Rauhauser’s latest.
Apparently, my wife is now a suspect, per Neal.
Then again, Neal is relying on the word of . . . drumroll . . . Brett Kimberlin, Speedway Bomber.
Go ahead. Google it.
That is Neal Rauhauser’s big source. A guy who went to federal prison. Apparently Neal thinks that gives him credibility.
Which I find . . . interesting.
Hi, Neal!
Patterico (f724ca) — 7/5/2011 @ 1:00 amIt can’t be said enough:
“Brett Kimberlin, Speedway Bomber.”
Put those words into Google, and marvel at the source Neal Rauhauser is using to slander me.
“Brett Kimberlin, Speedway Bomber.”
Patterico (f724ca) — 7/5/2011 @ 1:17 amOver/under on how long it will take for that post to go private?
Patterico (f724ca) — 7/5/2011 @ 1:22 amPatterico,
Do you have any dogs? If you do, they just might be suspected of being Nikki’s sockpuppy…odd things I ponder ; )
ppk_pixie (7a67da) — 7/5/2011 @ 1:31 amI’m at a loss to figure out why Lee is so opposed to letting JR9 potentially hang himself by screwing up and saying something that can be shown as factually wrong.
There are so many ‘private conversations’ spoken about that I can’t help but wonder why bringing some of them into the light creates so much consternation for Lee.
Johnny 5 is alive (5ccc5e) — 7/5/2011 @ 2:25 am“In journalism it is simpler to sound off than it is to find out. It is more elegant to pontificate than it is to sweat.” -Harold Evans
QuoteOfTheDay (786412) — 7/5/2011 @ 4:13 amre 1309/@crosspatch and others talking about Lee “seeing” the comment:
Hope Lee doesn’t mind me pointing this out, but he doesn’t “see” well these days. He is visually impaired.
Forgive me if someone has already pointed this out. I have not read all the comments.
Lizbuddie (133456) — 7/5/2011 @ 4:16 am“Every journalist who is not too stupid or too full of himself to notice what is going on knows that what he does is morally indefensible. He is a kind of confidence man, preying on people’s vanity, ignorance, or loneliness, gaining their trust and betraying them without remorse.” -Janet Malcolm
QuoteOfTheDay (786412) — 7/5/2011 @ 4:24 am“The journalists have constructed for themselves a little wooden chapel, which they also call the Temple of Fame, in which they put up and take down portraits all day long and make such a hammering you can’t hear yourself speak.” -G.C. Lichtenberg
QuoteOfTheDay (786412) — 7/5/2011 @ 4:26 am“In the real world, nothing happens at the right place at the right time. It is the job of journalists and historians to correct that.”- Mark Twain
QuoteOfTheDay (786412) — 7/5/2011 @ 4:32 am“If, for instance, they have heard something from the postman, they attribute it to a semi-official statement; if they have fallen into conversation with a stranger at a bar, they can conscientiously describe him as a source that has hitherto proved unimpeachable. It is only when the journalist is reporting a whim of his own, and one to which he attaches minor importance, that he defines it as the opinion of well-informed circles.”- Evelyn Waugh
QuoteOfTheDay (786412) — 7/5/2011 @ 4:34 am“If it is not right, do not do it. If it is not true, do not say it.” -Marcus Aurelius
“Beware of anyone who says they know. Trust me, they don’t, or they wouldn’t have to say they did.” -Harvey Fierstein
QuoteOfTheDay (786412) — 7/5/2011 @ 5:42 amJanet Malcolm’s name has crossed my mind more than once of late.
koam @wittier (be5afd) — 7/5/2011 @ 6:31 amStran…
Stran -ahan…
Stran -ded Wind…
See? I’m as good a detective as Neal!
koam @wittier (be5afd) — 7/5/2011 @ 6:35 amThis thread is starting to look like day six of a lost weekend.
Kinda whiffy too.
Pious Agnostic (291f9a) — 7/5/2011 @ 6:38 amNeal uses the word of bomber who tried to kill people over a person who puts criminals in prison to make life safe so Neal can live in safety to safely smear those who make him safe
EricPWJohnson (2921b6) — 7/5/2011 @ 6:42 amPat,
It is no excuse for Lee’s revelations of information you told him in confidence, but consider for a moment the public/private aspects of this kerfuffle.
Unfortunately in blogs, the general consensus of the comments section can come to define reality – or at least define reality as conventional wisdom sees it. Lee had a theory that was opposed to the conventional wisdom on this blog. I think his theory is a better and more elegant fit to the public evidence than any other theory on the table. But Lee’s best efforts were unable to move the needle on conventional wisdom as defined by your commenters. He was, even prior to all the nastiness, roughly handled.
Lee was concerned that you were being carried off into la-la land. He’s entitled to that opinion, and, if he holds it, it’s legitimate for him to try to persuade you that your line of thought is nuts. The harsh message, “Explain to me how I know that a normally rational person hasn’t been kidnapped and had their blog account taken over by conspiracy theorist?” is a perfectly fine thing to say to a friend – in a private email. Lee’s error was to do this all this publicly.
Why do it publicly? Well, his posts are aimed, it seems to me, at breaking the conventional wisdom in the comments section of this blog. Why? Because the commenters’ conventional wisdom seems to define reality. Because getting through to the commenters became synonymous with getting through to you. I think that if the situations were reversed you can see the ease of the mistake – Lee headed, you think, off the deep end, helped on his way by an crowd of approving yes-men. Break the consensus of the crowd and maybe you get through to Lee.
It was a mistake, an error of focus. He should have been as harsh as he wanted in private emails to you, made his case in measured tones on this blog, and sucked up his failure to persuade the commenters. A step as drastic as the one he took may have been called for if you were at risk of doing yourself serious injury – not if you were merely at risk of being wrong about the identity and motive of sock puppets.
You have been unfailingly respectful towards Lee and had every right to expect that he would take the same line towards you. But it is far easier to be magnanimous when the world is on your side.
I’m not saying that Lee’s error of focus should be excused – I’m just saying that it was an easy one to make.
Nathan Wagner (01c83e) — 7/5/2011 @ 8:21 amNathan Wagner – People are still waiting for the evidence dump on Lee’s elegant spurned lover/sexter theory or a rational explanation of the harm done by allowing JR9 to comment here. So far, crickets.
Care to address?
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/5/2011 @ 8:27 amdaleyrocks,
Lee’s theory is speculative. There is no direct evidence for that specific motive – any more than there is direct evidence that the whole thing was a sting on Breitbart. However, Lee’s theory does, to my mind, do the best job of explaining starchild111’s single minded (and I think malevolent) pursuit of Weiner on one end, and the same person/group’s attempt to trick Breitbart after the scandal broke. A purely political motive does not explain the malevolence both toward Weiner and toward Breitbart. But we’ve discussed this before.
I disagree with Lee as to allowing JR9 to comment here. I could understand the concern if Lee was afraid Pat was buying swallowing JR9’s line whole, but Pat’s theory required – if anything – that he be even more cautious in dealing with JR9 than he should have been if the puppeteer was a woman with personal motives. Lee felt that Pat was at risk. The more I think about it, given Pat’s theory, the less that makes sense.
Nathan Wagner (01c83e) — 7/5/2011 @ 8:49 amTo nathan wagner in #1396 the harm done is in credibility. Pattericos, the posters here and by association Lee’s. Believe me. It is gone. To anyone outside, you all have become ridiculous. Lee included for his reaction to your nonsense. And to those who are all wah wah he scared “John Reid” off. Really? Not the demands for phone calls and video of him or her in the same strings of comments? Has Lee completely lost his mind and perspective? yep! But so have most of you! You should all read Krauthammer’s take on Occam’s Razor.
Amanda Lynn (d3e2bd) — 7/5/2011 @ 8:50 amNathan @1397 – So while Lee advanced theories with evidence, Patterico remained agnostic, preferring to let events develop, yet you choose to find fault with Patterico’s approach. You have a right to your opinion. Lee was not universally criticized on the threads here and a wide variety of theories have been discussed. The most frequent criticism of Lee’s work was for not documenting his conclusions, which he himself admitted to doing, so don’t find fault with the commenters. Point your finger back at Lee.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/5/2011 @ 9:07 am1395 1397 Nathan
We’re all entitled to having different theories about what happened, motives, etc.
But you’re advocating that some parties, if they think they are thinking more clearly than other parties, should intervene and take actions beyond just expressing their opinions, respectfully.
We don’t need people jumping in and doing things for each other, because they think they know better.
Opinions yes, actions, no.
koam @wittier (be5afd) — 7/5/2011 @ 9:13 am1395 Nathan
There were plenty of posters here and elsewhere who agreed with Lee’s POV re: JR9 disclosures, theories, etc. People both pro and con to Lee’s theories and opinions existed every day. One of the most common was, “Lee, I can see your theory may be right, but you mix up what you consider to be proof. Sometime’s it’s factual proof but other times it’s ‘well it agrees with my theory so it’s true – or it doesn’t so it must be a lie’ as proof. And many participants didn’t like agree second standard for proof.
koam @wittier (be5afd) — 7/5/2011 @ 9:19 amdaleyrocks,
I don’t fault Patterico’s approach at all, nor was I trying to assign blame to the commenters. My purpose was only to say that Lee’s mistake – I’ll call it that – to aim at the commenters was an understandable one to make.
Nathan Wagner (01c83e) — 7/5/2011 @ 9:20 amkoam,
To be clear, I believe Lee’s public harshness and revelations of private communications were errors.
Nathan Wagner (01c83e) — 7/5/2011 @ 9:26 amAmanda Lynn, The problem here is that someone has to be lying. There can’t both be a real Nikki Reid using the starchild account AND the account belonging to Jenny George.
So someone has to be telling a fib. Now the fact that the Nikki Reid personna was bolstered by photographs stolen from people’s facebook profile just ads to the mystery. Why did someone go through so much trouble to fake that?
I am not interested in burning anyone or defaming anyone, I am interested in finding out who the heck was using the starchild111 account just to set the story straight.
This could, I believe, had been cleared up quickly and easily via private conversations with P without anything being made public. But it hasn’t. That keeps open the possibility that there is some reason why the people in involved in this appear to not want to be known by anyone.
That there is deception and people aren’t being forthcoming increases the curiosity.
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 7/5/2011 @ 9:27 am“To be clear, I believe Lee’s public harshness and revelations of private communications were errors.”
Nathan – Then what is all the other BS in 1395?
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/5/2011 @ 9:33 amdaleyrocks,
The point was perspective – was to say to Pat that Lee’s errors were easy errors to make. Nothing more.
Nathan Wagner (01c83e) — 7/5/2011 @ 9:39 am“The point was perspective – was to say to Pat that Lee’s errors were easy errors to make. Nothing more.”
Nathan – My take on it was to slam the comment section here for being an echo chamber on this story, which it has demonstrably not been. You may want to consider revising and extending that comment.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/5/2011 @ 9:43 amWho always wanted Lee & Pat to be against each other?
koam @wittier (be5afd) — 7/5/2011 @ 9:47 amCertainly it wasn’t an echo chamber, but here’s Patterico @414:
Patterico was discounting the dissent as not coming from the regulars. I understand Lee to have wanted to crack the consensus of the commenters Patterico would have felt had more sway.
Nathan Wagner (01c83e) — 7/5/2011 @ 10:00 amHave a good day, gentlemen. I’m off to other things.
Nathan Wagner (01c83e) — 7/5/2011 @ 10:02 amNathan @1395-
I think many of the points you make show good insight about blog dynamics in general and about the current Lee/Patterico dynamic in specific. Thank you. That such a promising venture – opportunity- relationship-collaboration- (whatever you want to call Lee’s guest posting on Patterico’s site) went so wrong muchly because of private confidences which were breached and tweet blasts that were made and exchanged in anger, is quite sad.
Just another example of why I think twitter is the devil! Because without the availability of twitter much of the ugliness would have taken place and been ironed out over a private phone call or a private email between Lee and Pat (and Jen and Tommy and Ron, etc.). Instead, it was all out in the open for both friend and foe to see. Twitter just makes it way too easy for folks in the heat of emotion to dig and taunt and choose sides and retweet and draw deep lines in sand that are hard to be erased later. Twitter makes it just way too easy for people to embarrass themselves and reveal themselves in uncomfortable ways. With a mere slip of the tweet, twitter makes it too easy to create enemies both personally and professionally.
The last thing I want to mention is I’ve found most commenters on Patterico to be smart and interesting and fair. There’ve been countless occasions where people have voluntarily corrected the substance of an incorrect statement they have made previously, or apologized for a comment that was misunderstood. I never viewed there to be any “conventional wisdom” on this blog that needed to be overcome by Lee. Maybe that’s because I guess I never saw the questioning of aspects of Lee’s theory by some commenters to be a rejection of it as much as a plea for more info or proof to help solidify it. I was one of them because I am a person who demands verification and facts before I sign on to almost anything in life. I look at the Weinergate “investigation” and sharing of info among the blogs and blog readers to be both a process of elimination and a journey to get to a solution–not a win/lose battle between clear cut and fully formed theories (because there are no fully formed solutions yet as far as I can tell.) Again, Nathan, thanks for pointing out how Lee may have taken this far differently (as an attack on him.)
elissa (fb4a7e) — 7/5/2011 @ 10:24 amAttention Regular Commenters:
Which of you were
1) sticking up for the bulk of Lee’s theory in general (JG=Reids=Patriot=probably spurned female liberal fan/follower/adorer of AW, now seeking revenge on AW as main motivation),
and/or
2) were openly critical of JR9’s docs being published here and Patterico’s stance as neither confirming or denying the veracity of docs or belief in JR9.
(One or both of the above would suffice, just say which.)
Thanks
koam @wittier (be5afd) — 7/5/2011 @ 10:31 am1395 –
He was, even prior to all the nastiness, roughly handled.
omment by Nathan Wagner — 7/5/2011 @ 8:21 am
If being “roughly handled” means a failure of posters here to fall on their knees and worship him as a God among Men, then yes – he was roughly handled.
Failing to agree 100% is not the same thing as “rough handling”, especially on the Internet
Kaisersoze (c86eb0) — 7/5/2011 @ 11:20 am1412 – Which of you were
1) sticking up for the bulk of Lee’s theory in general (JG=Reids=Patriot=probably spurned female liberal fan/follower/adorer of AW,
Yes
now seeking revenge on AW as main motivation),
No, I think there are a dozen things that could be that person’s motivation
and/or
2) were openly critical of JR9′s docs being published here and Patterico’s stance as neither confirming or denying the veracity of docs or belief in JR9.
Nope.
Kaisersoze (c86eb0) — 7/5/2011 @ 11:25 amKoam @1412
Weinergate is above my pay grade.
Brother Bradley J. Fikes, C.O.R. (a18ddc) — 7/5/2011 @ 11:54 am1414. kaisersoze
Thanks for your reply to 1412 and for explaining.
koam @wittier (be5afd) — 7/5/2011 @ 12:04 pm“Patterico was discounting the dissent as not coming from the regulars.”
Nathan – I disagree. I think Patterico was disagreeing with commenters telling people to shut up because there was no room for theories other than Lee’s and it was a waste of time to give JR9 a forum.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/5/2011 @ 12:14 pm“Attention Regular Commenters:
Which of you were”
koam @wittier – Witch hunt?
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/5/2011 @ 12:15 pmThat’s an accurate sum-up, Daleyrocks.
It got old seeing the exact same lines parroted from one new commenter after another. Also, it really seemed like all these people made similar errors in describing what was going on with interacting with JR.
Anyhow, when someone notes a theory is unproven, and can show a plausible alternative, it shouldn’t upset people so much.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/5/2011 @ 12:18 pm1418 daleyrocks
There was talk that most supporters of Lee’s positions here were random new people and that the regulars weren’t showing him any support. I see you are addressing that in 1417.
My thought is that there were regular commenters who both agreed with Lee’s positions (prior to the bigger rift) and those who didn’t. Some leaned toward Lee’s conclusions, if not his support for those conclusions.
koam @wittier (be5afd) — 7/5/2011 @ 12:23 pmI think that’s fair, Koam. I think a lot of regulars here didn’t want to give JR the time of day, and very few, if any, were outright disclaiming Lee’s scorned woman possibility.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/5/2011 @ 12:25 pmkoam @1420 – Let me ask you a question. You appeared out of nowhere here on this story. I find no history of you commenting under your nick on blogs.
Where did you come from and who are you?
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/5/2011 @ 12:39 pmI could make a similar comment about many of the other newcomers who became active on threads here.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/5/2011 @ 12:42 pm1422 daleyrocks
I think my comments speak for themselves. I hadn’t heard of Pat & Lee & Ace before but I saw the Weiner story getting more involved and this is where it moved to a few weeks ago, so here I am.
koam @wittier (be5afd) — 7/5/2011 @ 1:40 pmelissa @1411
Thanks much for your comment. I can see that I’ve riled people up here, which was not really my intent. You write:
That’s probably the way most of the other commenters viewed it as well, legitimate probing. My impression was that Lee felt his theory – or at least the part of it which said the Jenny who called him and the Jenny who filed the police report were the same person – ought to have been viewed as inherently more likely than theories invoking suppositional hoaxers to explain away the phone call he received. Requesting hard proof of the identity of the (real) Jennys while appearing to be more lenient toward the notional hoaxer theory seemed to Lee not to be good sense. And it bothered him that he could convince neither Pat nor the commenters in general that it was not good sense.
I don’t think the teasing apart of Lee’s evidence and his theories was out of line at all. I do think that doing so in service of a theory with greater evidentiary deficiencies is to apply an unbalanced scrutiny. (Patterico says he has evidence we haven’t seen, and I admit that may change the picture.)
Lee would have helped himself to speak more in probabilities.
Finally – to all – I’ll offer an apology. My remark in 1395 intended to describe Lee’s impression, “a crowd of approving yes-men,” was a rhetorical flourish I should have avoided. I’ll stand behind “a majority especially of regulars more critical of the less hypothetical explanation.” That’s as far as I should have gone.
Nathan Wagner (e017b3) — 7/5/2011 @ 4:20 pmI’m not a regular commenter really (came here from Aces site). I have stated that I think Lee’s theory is the most plausible. Mostly because the police report seems like such a crazy development.
I am/was not critical of the JR stuff because I believe them to be a sock (however you see the motivations)and think it’s interesting insight into what is/was going on.
I follow this story because the mystery etc. is interesting to me. I don’t pretend to think I know every in and out of this story. Patterico is just as likely to be right. I just think Lee’s scenario seems more plausible.
Noodles (3681c4) — 7/5/2011 @ 4:49 pmWow. Just wow.
Blackburnsghost (2ffb0c) — 7/5/2011 @ 4:51 pmI knew that if you even questioned the left you are labeled, tagged and hung out but wow. Scary,sick, sad stuff.
Does anyone know why the heck he posted the email exg w lee? What was the point of that all he said was “Doesn’t bother me”
daleyrocks — 7/5/2011 @ 12:39 pm
I’ve come over from Twitter – I have to admit some puzzlement at the Koam j’accuse. I thought
everyone knew.
I thought it was obvious and in the open. I’m surprised at the apparent surprise.
Koam stands for “King of All Media” – and he had a tweet list of all Stern people.
–FWIW, I’ve been operating under the assumption that he was {certain name}Stern guy. I didn’t think it was hidden.
It’s been so long since I looked up Koam
SarahW (af7312) — 7/5/2011 @ 5:43 pm{certain name}do you mean Benjy?
I’m just a fan. I don’t work there or anything.
Benjy is the guy who was at the two press conferences. His twitter is @Bronk.
koam @wittier (be5afd) — 7/5/2011 @ 5:47 pm1428. Point of minor interest, J’accuse is the defense, not the accusation.
jeffeneff (707f3d) — 7/5/2011 @ 5:54 pm“I’ve come over from Twitter – I have to admit some puzzlement at the Koam j’accuse. I thought
everyone knew.
I thought it was obvious and in the open. I’m surprised at the apparent surprise.”
SarahW – Sorry, not obvious to me at all. After all, we’ve had socks supporting the posts of socks in the past. What caused me to question koam this morning was his incredible comment on the Rauhauser thread wondering why anybody should be spending any time looking at him at this point.
There are a number of folks here with no history I find. Does that mean new nicks or new twitter a/c’s for this story? You tell me.
I did subsequently find info on Koam.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/5/2011 @ 6:00 pm“Point of minor interest, J’accuse is the defense, not the accusation.”
jeffeneff – Correction. “J’accuse” is french for “I accuse” or a denunciation. You may be thinking of Emile Zola’s 1898 letter in which he ACCUSED the french military of covering up the mistaken conviction of Dreyfus. In that manner it was a defense of Dreyfus, but an accusation of the military.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/5/2011 @ 6:06 pm1430 It means literally “I accuse”, but yeah it was an accusation Zola leveled against the imprisoners of Dreyfus.
It’s seems to me Koam was being accused
SarahW (af7312) — 7/5/2011 @ 6:09 pm@ daleyrocks
I’m new commenting here as well. I’ve commented a lot at I Own The World blog some at Dummie Funnies and Lee’s Blog. My name has morphed from Johnny 5 is alive to Honey Badger DGAS. Although I just started out on Twitter which is where I’ve been spending most of my time. It’s like mainlining the news.
Johnny 5 is alive (5ccc5e) — 7/5/2011 @ 6:15 pm1432, 1433 right, i just felt that it was a reversal of sorts of the analogy at hand.
jeffeneff (707f3d) — 7/5/2011 @ 6:19 pmDaleyrocks,
Was that a rhetorical “you tell me”?
Because if I told you I’d say there are and have been for some while, concerned and interested trolls and socks playing around in the mix of newer commenters. I just try to step over them really.
Koam is new in his way, but I didn’t think his identity or connection to Stern was any secret. His FB is even linked to his twitter which I don’t even know how to do.
SarahW (af7312) — 7/5/2011 @ 6:24 pmPlease note that my view of 1) the value-benefit ratio of giving “John Reid” a forum of any kind and 2) of working on outside chance alternate theories changed significantly after I found out that JG had gone to the Boston police and filed charges naming me, in addition to trying to get the police to stop me from talking about JG. The whole story entered a new phase for me at that point.
Discussing things like whether I ACTUALLY talked to a planted JG who was part of Neal’s army of female hackers isn’t just a novel concept to banter about, it’s now potentially a confusing element that could slow the investigation and apprehension of a person who exists in the real world and is intent on causing real harm to me, my family and my friends.
Lee Stranahan (708cc3) — 7/5/2011 @ 6:35 pmI googled
koam site:patterico.com – 1,290 results
@wittier site:patterico.com – 590
koam @wittier site:patterico.com – 572
koam site:leestranahan.com – 171
etc.
Way too many, I know, I know.
koam @wittier (be5afd) — 7/5/2011 @ 6:36 pmLee
Blogging and police investigations – they don’t mix
disclosing confidential conversations – and trying to garner sympathy – ditto
making claims about those conversations that are contrarian – well you know…
look – this may not be the forum to discuss this – it seems you are seeking a negative reaction for some validation – whih – rarely happens on the internet as well
EricPWJohnson (2921b6) — 7/5/2011 @ 6:41 pmJohnny 5 is alive–
I’ve enjoyed seeing your comments both here and at Stranahan’s blog, and definitely hope you stick around. But why do people keep ignoring my good advice? Twitter is the devil! 🙂
elissa (fb4a7e) — 7/5/2011 @ 6:42 pmThis place needs some testosterone.
YeahIwentthere (786412) — 7/5/2011 @ 6:46 pmTwitter sucks, I agree, but it has become a necessary evil. I use tweetdeck but even with lists i can’t see most of what i want in just a few columns. I can’t see my own tweets unless I include @mention of someone else who is covered in another column. Maybe I just don’t know how to manage TweetDeck correctly. I certainly have to pop open new tabs at Twitter to follow certain conversations.
koam @wittier (be5afd) — 7/5/2011 @ 6:47 pmelissa – I’m inclined to agree wrt Twitter
Nathan Wagner (e017b3) — 7/5/2011 @ 6:47 pmWeiner sucks BIG Time
ColonelHaiku (822dce) — 7/5/2011 @ 6:52 pmThere… I said it and the same
goes for skipper wife!
“Was that a rhetorical “you tell me”?”
SarahW – No it was not.
I was attempting to explain myself.
Does something remain unclear?
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/5/2011 @ 6:53 pmI am not engaging in tit for tat.
Lee Stranahan (708cc3) — 7/5/2011 @ 6:53 pmelissa – Not on twitter or Facebook. I refuse.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/5/2011 @ 6:53 pmLee,
I sincerely hope you two can bury the hatchet sooner rather than later.
Nathan Wagner (e017b3) — 7/5/2011 @ 6:57 pmNo, it is actually worse than that.
Scott Jacobs (6ab327) — 7/5/2011 @ 7:00 pmI’m not at all criticizing you – I hope that’s clear. Was just puzzled about the Koam thing.
SarahW (af7312) — 7/5/2011 @ 7:02 pm“in addition to trying to get the police to stop me from talking about JG.”
Lee, did she specifically ask police to get you to stop talking about her? (As opposed to that being an imputed motive of her police report.)
SarahW (af7312) — 7/5/2011 @ 7:05 pmI like Koam. I have no idea where he’s from, but he has no idea where I came from either.
I thought Daley was making a sarcastic reference to the level of mistrust we’re all dealing with.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/5/2011 @ 7:07 pmThanks elissa,
I’d have to agree twitter is evil but it’s the fastest way to find out what’s going on in the blog-o-sphere and news-o-sphere. So many links to so many stories pop up there. I quit FB more than a year ago, it is indeed the devil.
Johnny 5 is alive (5ccc5e) — 7/5/2011 @ 7:07 pmThe detective told me that when he interviewed her, she wanted the police to get me to stop talking — to which he replied “First Amendment”
Lee Stranahan (708cc3) — 7/5/2011 @ 7:08 pmLee
I thought you were not going to talk about this unless it was being resolved or almost resolved
how many
EricPWJohnson (2921b6) — 7/5/2011 @ 7:10 pmdayshours did that last?Dear Eric,
Thanks for your comment. Our entire staff here at the Criticize Everything Lee Says Or Does department really appreciates your feedback. We have noted your complaint and want to you know that we have passed it on to management. Please don’t hesitate to contact us again the next time you have another helpful remark!
Best Regards,
Lee Stranahan (708cc3) — 7/5/2011 @ 7:15 pmJohn Smith
Customer Relations at C.E.L.S.O.D.
Bangalore, India
Lee – Yay police.
SarahW (af7312) — 7/5/2011 @ 7:16 pmA flame war might get this thread to 2000! 🙂
Johnny 5 is alive (5ccc5e) — 7/5/2011 @ 7:22 pmComment by koam @wittier — 7/5/2011 @ 6:47 pm
OK, buddy. You do what you gotta do. But remember that using twitter is like standing nekkid in the middle of Times Square. Not to mention that managing tweetdeck is a whole lot of frustrating hard work, and confining thoughts to 140 characters makes it real easy to be misunderstood. Be careful out there and don’t say you were not warned! 🙂
elissa (fb4a7e) — 7/5/2011 @ 7:25 pmRe: Flame war
Okay, I’ll start. Johnny 5, your eyeshades are crooked, your wiring is off, and your cultural references are so ’80s.
Nathan Wagner (e017b3) — 7/5/2011 @ 7:26 pm@ Nathan
You don’t know Jack…Wagner and your hair looks like a Flock of Seagulls.
Johnny 5 is alive (5ccc5e) — 7/5/2011 @ 7:31 pmLee–
I’m glad you’re here. I have a question if you feel comfortable answering it–and if you don’t, I understand. Do you think the same person who called you and then went to the police about you is the same person who sent death threats to Ace and Pat?
elissa (fb4a7e) — 7/5/2011 @ 7:34 pm“I’m not at all criticizing you – I hope that’s clear. Was just puzzled about the Koam thing.”
Sarah – I know, I tried to explain where it came from.
When we get inundated with new commenters and you don’t know who is who, it is sometimes very easy to check where they have been active before. With this group, no such luck in most cases.
Does that tell me they are disguising identities to comment here, using new nicks, or what? koam dropped something from his handle which made it easier to identify him. Others, who knows where they have come from.
koam’s comment this morning threw me for a loop. Perhaps it is lack of familiarity with Kimberlin/Friedman story, but after Swiftread links last night, the idea that nobody should have an interest in stepped up Rauhauser involvement in this story is laughable.
No mystery here.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/5/2011 @ 7:37 pmLee – Call Neal Rauhauser
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/5/2011 @ 7:38 pm1463. daleyrocks.
You realize that not everyone has read everything that you read last night.
koam @wittier (be5afd) — 7/5/2011 @ 7:46 pmLee
Okay then – here we go – you I am not criticising you just pointing out the obvious
You wrote on July 3rd this on your own blog:
annnd now you are talking about it….
And of course there’s all that twitting nonsense too
please spare us the melodrama
we are not the enemy and I never questioned anything you said until you disclosed confidential information and conversations in writing
So go ahead and be sarcastic – but I cannot see anyone ever EVER engging you when you resort to this level of childishness – its breathtaking, really – if you want a career in blogging – violating your for s better word “benefactors” trust and confidentiality – this might be a deal breaker
EricPWJohnson (2921b6) — 7/5/2011 @ 7:49 pmelissa, if it makes you feel better, I’ve had your ‘twitter is the devil’ comments in mind as I’ve decided not to bother with it anymore. Aside from trying to follow updates. It’s kinda a cop-out. You can state your conclusion, and because it’s twitter… no room for a fleshed out argument. They might as well limit users to emoticons.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/5/2011 @ 7:50 pm“You realize that not everyone has read everything that you read last night.”
koam – Why not? If they haven’t, they should!!!!
Does this stuff need to be spoon fed to you people? Heh.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/5/2011 @ 7:51 pm@daleyrocks
I would be an example of a new commenter.
I’ve been reading Patterico for several years now.
cap'n john's nephew (28dda5) — 7/5/2011 @ 7:52 pmSix years would be about right. I’ve also read your comments on a few other blogs. I’ve been a lurker for all these years. This story drew me in. I’m sure it was the same for a few others.
1466. Eric
Lee’s been through a lot. I’d cut him some slack about whether he wants to participate or not.
Frankly, I’m glad to hear what’s going on.
koam @wittier (be5afd) — 7/5/2011 @ 7:52 pmOh, and by the way! A heads up. I wouldn’t get into a discussion with EPWJ. He doesn’t argue in good faith.
cap'n john's nephew (28dda5) — 7/5/2011 @ 7:56 pmLee, I am sorry you are going through what you are. As a victim of crime, I completely understand how hard it is. I hope law enforcement gets to the bottom of it.
Anita Busch (a025dd) — 7/5/2011 @ 7:57 pmThumbs up for KOAM ( I like the King Of All Media Ref) Stern fan since 1986.
goatsred (b20383) — 7/5/2011 @ 7:58 pmMany faves and smart/knowledgable people on this site.
I like to eat like a rainbow
Blackburnsghost (2ffb0c) — 7/5/2011 @ 8:02 pmKOAM
I dont think so, it seems to be some good old self serving pity party blog style
He described a guy who has too look at cases every damn day of wrecked families victims and lives and dral with it and then just asks – asks that you not
A. post crap in his name
B. Violate his confidentiality
And then he gets into it with a woman on twitter who is a professional researcher for the most prestigious firms, someone who has overcome poverty, illness, hardships upon hardships and gets ugly with her as well
yeah cry a river
boo hoo
EricPWJohnson (2921b6) — 7/5/2011 @ 8:02 pm@ Dustin you nailed it about Twitter. I like it for the access to what people blogging think or discover in real time but the 120 characters isn’t conducive to a conversation.
Johnny 5 is alive (5ccc5e) — 7/5/2011 @ 8:03 pmPat and Lib chick deserve better than that
EricPWJohnson (2921b6) — 7/5/2011 @ 8:04 pm==Comment by cap’n john’s nephew — 7/5/2011 @ 7:56 pm==
You have just distinguished yourself, sir. (P.S. Enjoy your comments and hope you get drawn into other stories and threads here often.)
elissa (fb4a7e) — 7/5/2011 @ 8:08 pmcap n john
yep I’m mean, nasty, use facts and figures – pesky things like court testimony, citations
I rarely use op ed pieces authored by people who have an agenda or no qualifications in what they are talking about
Go for yourself and look at the twitting flitting by lee w/ people who are WAY above his pay grade
things like this:
and there’s more, much more
EricPWJohnson (2921b6) — 7/5/2011 @ 8:10 pm“I wouldn’t get into a discussion with EPWJ. He doesn’t argue in good faith.”
“I’ve been reading Patterico for several years now.”
cap’n john’s nephew – Your keen powers of observation have convinced me. Heh.
I am not trying to create a litmus test or anything. Nathan jumped on a comment Patterico made. I gave my interpretation of it. The obvious involvement of sockpuppets in this story has people wondering where people are coming from. When you recognize names, even if you have tangled on opposite sides, that gives you a sense that you know who somebody is. One of the whole discovery issues in the story has been about the date of creation of accounts. If commenters have no discernible history anywhere, who are they?
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/5/2011 @ 8:17 pm@1470 Koam
Compared to some, he’s been through very little regarding this whole thing.
As much as it pains me, I’m going to have to take Eric’s side in this, for a number of reasons I can’t talk about.
Suffice it to say, Lee really should follow his own advice and shut up.
Scott Jacobs (6ab327) — 7/5/2011 @ 8:23 pmI was off the internet all day today (again!). Is there a summary?
Dianna (f12db5) — 7/5/2011 @ 8:30 pmLee, I see that you’re exasperated, but some of what you’re saying is new to me.
So don’t get irritated about this question: Did JG want you to stop talking about her, or about Weinergate, or just everything?
Dianna (f12db5) — 7/5/2011 @ 8:34 pmI like and respect both Patterico and Mandy. I hope any disagreements are resolved as soon as possible. I believe all of us are working towards this goal, even if the method is something as simple as the decision not to launch or rekindle attacks.
To the extent I may have failed to have taken this advice myself, I apologize.
Outside parties fanning the flames does nothing productive or helpful to anyone involved.
Lee Stranahan (708cc3) — 7/5/2011 @ 8:35 pm==Is there a summary?==
you silly wabbit
elissa (fb4a7e) — 7/5/2011 @ 8:36 pmAgreed.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/5/2011 @ 8:37 pm/nothing sarcastic or ironic implied. He’s right.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/5/2011 @ 8:37 pmPlease spoon feed me. I am in internet hell. I couldn’t get to any sites today, and I was sent a very young technician with whom I had great difficulty communicating. Yesterday I had housework and guests.
Please, venture forth with a baby spoon. I shall imitate a baby bird.
Dianna (f12db5) — 7/5/2011 @ 8:38 pmI hope you ALL get to the bottom of this. I hope there is an investigation that points to the culprit/s and they he/she/they are arrested for domestic terrorism, which is what it is.
Anita Busch (a025dd) — 7/5/2011 @ 8:38 pmCan I graduate to “wascally wabbit”?
Dianna (f12db5) — 7/5/2011 @ 8:39 pmDustin, understand when I say that my nature’s one Better Angel is really fighting a losing battle here regarding Lee and his behavior.
Scott Jacobs (6ab327) — 7/5/2011 @ 8:43 pmAgreed, Scott.
Anita Busch (a025dd) — 7/5/2011 @ 8:45 pmScott, I understand. I’ve also been fighting that battle in this thread, though I’m doing a better job than usual resisting the impulse to really dish it out.
We’re on the same page.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/5/2011 @ 8:46 pm1473 goatsred
Mike, 1986?! me too. 25 years. I was at MSG for the premier of Private Parts & sat with wack pack….never went to any other events, tho.
koam @wittier (be5afd) — 7/5/2011 @ 8:49 pmNice try at deflecting – you described a guy – who BTW – for you and me – gives up a cool 6 figures a yr in the private sector or more – by serving us unselfishly – as someone irrational and emotional
annnd I’m fanning the flames?
Lee, I’m speechless
EricPWJohnson (2921b6) — 7/5/2011 @ 8:58 pmNo flame war?
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/5/2011 @ 9:01 pm1500 looms
koam @wittier (be5afd) — 7/5/2011 @ 9:02 pmHi Sal! I love you, Fred!
koam @wittier (be5afd) — 7/5/2011 @ 9:03 pm“Touche, Dr. Moriarty. You got me.”
koam @wittier (be5afd) — 7/5/2011 @ 9:05 pmDaley = I’m done – Lee got the msg
EricPWJohnson (2921b6) — 7/5/2011 @ 9:08 pmThis thread is great fun and all but is there going to be further JR docs published. I realize JR has bugged at this point but I believe there were things which were pending at the time.
Thanks
Rocksem (5241c6) — 7/5/2011 @ 9:09 pmWell, Johnny and I started a flame war, but he was so insulting I’ve just been sulking.
Nathan Wagner (e017b3) — 7/5/2011 @ 9:09 pm1501 Rocksem
Great question. I dunno. Pat has said his commitment is to publish all unedited. I doubt JR’s going silent would make Pat want to not publish.
But 2 other things. Patrick’s busy with that trial, and they keep mentioning law enforcement getting involved. I wonder if LE could have an impact on whether documents are coming out or not.
koam @wittier (be5afd) — 7/5/2011 @ 9:15 pmKoam.
Rocksem (5241c6) — 7/5/2011 @ 9:21 pmIf he can’t or has reasons not to that’s fine. I just would like to know. This thread has denigrated into I don’t know what and I rather not even check it if there is no reason to. But this seems the only place Patterico even mentions the topic.
Way back in the mists of the early 1,000s, Patterico said something about being patient.
I keep losing the thread, though.
Dianna (f12db5) — 7/5/2011 @ 9:25 pmMaybe off topic but Jen P’s twitter is up to some weird stuff. Phone numbers, “outing” people, etc. Just wondering what any of you think it going on?
Noodles (3681c4) — 7/5/2011 @ 9:25 pm#478 Elissa
Thank You, Elissa. The pleasure of your mind has been all mine. The same goes for so many of the new commenters.
#480 daleyrocks
I don’t believe, for a minute, this story is over. In fact, I think we are enjoying a brief
interlude here.
@Koam
May I have a copy of your book when it is published?
cap'n john's nephew (28dda5) — 7/5/2011 @ 9:25 pmI don’t know, pretty weird. Looked more like vindictiveness then investigation to me. I’m thinking the person who wrote the HuffPo column Koam criticized is probably a close friend or old college buddy.
Rocksem (5241c6) — 7/5/2011 @ 9:31 pm@1508 (Rocksem) Ah, maybe that’s it. I read it as she “knows what’s really going on”. Which (from the outside looking in) seems laughable. Who knows.
Noodles (3681c4) — 7/5/2011 @ 9:37 pmOr she is not currently in control of the account.
Scott Jacobs (6ab327) — 7/5/2011 @ 9:40 pmOh I’m sure she knows way more than we do but I’m also sure she would never share it on Twitter. If she really thought Koam was a player in this she wouldn’t be giving his personal info away. She’d be using it to get to him and get him on record.
Rocksem (5241c6) — 7/5/2011 @ 9:41 pm@ Scott Jacobs “Did you use VPN/proxy to access Patterico? Why?”
Just kidding! I wanted to pretend I was a hard hitting journalist for a second. lol
Noodles (3681c4) — 7/5/2011 @ 9:44 pmYou forgot to publicly suggest that I am either a sockpuppet, or one of the masterminds behind something related to WeinerGate.
Scott Jacobs (6ab327) — 7/5/2011 @ 9:46 pmYeah, it appears Ms Preston is openly speculating about Koam, and yet unable to back up this speculation with a shred of justification.
It’s the same jerk behavior I’ve seen from others (cough cough) to harm the reputation of an honest critic.
If Ms Preston has a reason to associate Koam, by his real full name, with this scandal, let’s hear it. Otherwise, she looks terribly petty. And unreasonable, too, given her claim she can’t understand why someone would want anonymity while she trashes someone she was able to out. Yeah, I know, she’s ‘just asking questions’.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/5/2011 @ 9:48 pm@ Scott Jacobs Are you a sockpuppet or one of the masterminds related to Weinergate?
Also, do you like mudkips? =)
If it weren’t for all the death threats, criminality, etc. involved in this I would be very tempted to pull her chain. (and I’d actually be behind 7 proxies!) lol
Noodles (3681c4) — 7/5/2011 @ 9:51 pm==Otherwise, she looks terribly petty. And unreasonable==
Oh, I believe you must be mistaken, Dustin. Jen is a journalist with a capital J. She would be above all that nonsense.
elissa (fb4a7e) — 7/5/2011 @ 10:01 pmNoodles @1515 beat me to it.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/5/2011 @ 10:05 pm1516. Hahah Elissa.
jeffeneff (707f3d) — 7/5/2011 @ 11:09 pmI can see Prestion getting excited when she discovered any (presumed) pranky Stern types contributing – even heavily-, to weinergate comment threads.
It’s just that the Stern connection wasn’t ever hidden. IRL name and everything – not hidden. It was right out there in the open. I can’t understand how this is news to her, or why Preston thinks this would be news to me or most other regulars here.
SarahW (af7312) — 7/6/2011 @ 6:48 amPrestion? This day starts with new words!
SarahW (af7312) — 7/6/2011 @ 6:51 amCongrats, SarahW on the neologism and portmanteau. Witty or inadvertent…it doesn’t matter anymore. Own it!
_________
This made me think of what happened with Lee and the editing of his radio show, under pressure and that quote: “Lee, you have no idea how deep this goes.” Context: A lot of fresh info had been coming out in the middle of the night on Lee’s radio show. Most nights, Lee wouldn’t write up a summary, let alone the details, of what he said on the show; so the info was in audio format only. Lee isn’t just an opinionator. He, like other writers, are part of the story. So those of us trying to figure out what it all meant had to replay the show (sometimes several shows) to hear details. (I and others asked him to write up because there would be so much confusion about the details when a group of people were trying to figure out what was real, vs. what was not, what was claimed vs. what was assumed, etc.)
For this show, I tried to transcribe an interesting part the next day. This was pretty hard to do because Lee says about 4 words per second.
My transcript of Lee’s BTR show about his convos appears above at comment #249 in this same thread (nearly 1300 comments ago).
https://patterico.com/2011/06/30/someone-smarter-than-me-explain-why-this-is-not-possible/comment-page-61/#comment-814237
apologies for the typos and editing errors. They’re unintentional. The whole first sentence “According to Lee,…” is in the wrong place…my error. so some of it is out of sequence….attributable to typing long things in this little box on the blog page instead of doing it the right way in Word. (I would have, but in Word you have to type in the HTML tags manually..I was lazy in that regard) The whole show is here “My Last Blogtalk Radio Show Ever? – Radio Stranahan” for reference. I posted the same thing on Lee’s but it’s all “stuck in moderation” probably because of too many links included.
The show starts with @FilmLadd calling in and then Angelia (or something)…go to minute 20 for the salient part.
It would be possible to excerpt from it right here and poke fun, (I mean I could say some pretty funny things) but I’m not here to confuse anyone, as most of you know very well. (Look up all my comments and tweets and take them as a whole.) So better to just read (or listen to) the whole thing and try to figure what it means.
Also,
This post (go to #440 on this same page) also asked some puzzling questions about what points Lee and JP agree and disagree on. I’m still confused.
And this Radio Stranahan show “@Weinergate Post Modern Yellathon” on July 2 in which Lee explains how much he got yelled at because of the July 1 show (above). Take a guess as to who was yelling.
koam @wittier (d56dc1) — 7/6/2011 @ 7:55 amI am suspicious of the idea that a Stern fan could be so organized, thorough and logical. Koam, would you be willing to submit to some questions to demonstrate you’re really a Stern fan?
jeffeneff (707f3d) — 7/6/2011 @ 12:32 pmjeffeneff – The absence of profanity or misogyny is also a dead giveaway the commenter is a fake.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/6/2011 @ 12:44 pmlamchopsl wrote in comment 212 Series 1 at 7/1/2011 @ 11:10 am
On Lee’s Blog talk Radio show last nite he said:
‘NY Times reporter Jen Preston talked by phone with the Boston Jenny George and got the name of the screen writing professor from her. Preston called him and talked to him and his wife. At that point Preston tried to shut down the whole investigation, claiming the professor’s website was faked and he may have been related to the Sockpuppet posse and possibly the Yessmen or Anonymous. So Lee decided to call the professor and claims “everything checked out,” relating to the professor’s legitimacy and what he said about the Boston Jenny George….
I can’t find a source closer to the original.
Now wait. There have to be some mistakes here.
Jennifer Preston talked to the California Jenny George. How could she have talked to the Boston Jenny George? Nobody has her phone number.
The California Jenny George says:
http://www.jennifergeorge.com/weiner.html
from Jennifer George jennifer.e.george@gmail.com
to “Preston, Jennifer”
date Sun, Jun 26, 2011 at 2:50 PM
subject Re: New York Times reporter
…..
“I’m not sure if you’ve seen it, but commenters on at least one site are now talking about approaching one of their targets directly, in person. It appears someone has contacted one of her professors about her. She has been identified by name and publicly described as “unstable,” and people are speculating about her love life.”
So who supplied the name of a professor? And WHAT WEB SITE?
Sammy Finkelman (d3daeb) — 7/6/2011 @ 4:44 pmHeh. Fire away w ?s. I’m good.
koam @wittier (39aadc) — 7/6/2011 @ 4:49 pmOnly prob today is power out and phone is nearly dead battery. Hard to type too.
some one help Sammy . I’m on a phone. It was jg. Ma who talked to jp and lee. Prof is lew Hunter
koam @wittier (0f7e57) — 7/6/2011 @ 5:39 pmSammy lee had jg ma talk to jp. Huge mistake but he did.
koam @wittier (1ff170) — 7/6/2011 @ 7:09 pmRe: 1526 koam @ wittier
Save your phone battery. I am not sure any of this is going to be answered very quickly.
I think Sammy’s comment at 1524 is interesting. I also had seen comments saying that no one had found JG/MA’s phone number and had kind of assumed that someone must have had it since both Jen Preston and Lee reportedly had spoken to her. And the common link of the professor apparently reinforced the idea that they had spoken to the same person.
So did JG/MA call Lee and he told her to also call Preston? If so, what evidence is there that the caller actually gave them both the exact same information? Did either one, or both, get a callback number for her? Have Jen Preston and Lee matched up the contacts they received/made regarding the professor? It is certainly curious that Jen Preston and Lee came to such opposite opinions about Professor Lew Hunter’s information.
Note to Lee, and anyone who is involved in mysteries like this: toll-free numbers are not that expensive to have these days, and you get the number that called you even if it’s blocked.
Sue (24e46b) — 7/6/2011 @ 7:37 pmSammy,
Witter is correct as that is what Lee shared on his BTR program.
After JG in MA spoke to Lee on June 19, she also spoke to Jennifer Preston at NYTimes. I think lee spoke to Jennifer Preston both before JG called her and after the two women spoke.
JG in MA provided the Lew Hunter reference.
Joe
Joe Smith (54c0c1) — 7/6/2011 @ 7:37 pmSammy,
Opps, I forgot the website that was referenced on June 19 by JG was the STLA site and the blog post by Adam. There is even a post on the blog entry that appears to be from at leas one Jennifer George asking Adam to remove some informaiton.
This is from another Jennifer G in CA ( yes, this is the Jennifer with the posts of Weiner related emails to document her involvement. So I dont’ see her making calls as then she would not have a record to post. This Jennifer George was also contacted by Jennifer Preston with a very misleading email.
Here is the post on STLAH
source: http://www.jennifergeorge.com/weiner.html
Joe
Joe Smith (54c0c1) — 7/6/2011 @ 7:49 pmSue,
JG called Lee and Jennifer Preston. As Lee indicated she was using a blocked number when she called him.
Joe
Joe Smith (54c0c1) — 7/6/2011 @ 7:52 pmThanks, Joe. I haven’t been able to keep up with all the ins and outs of this story. I appreciate the details.
Sue (24e46b) — 7/6/2011 @ 8:24 pmAt the source page you give for JG/CA’s roundup of her involvement or lack thereof, in her July 1 update, she states that she “did not author that comment” on the STLA Hub site. Since the comment said the commenter was “Jennifer George from Los Angeles” that seems to add a bit to the confusion, too.
I’m looking forward to the future Clif Notes for this entire escapade. 🙂
Joe, for clarity’s sake, JG “of California” has made plain she did not make that comment. That comment was likely left by Lee’s caller.
That is the woman who has identified herself as JG, who has claimed threats, and also claimed to live in LA after moving from Boston in childhood, and claimed to be living there at present (To Lee and Preston). However, she later proved to be in Boston.
SarahW (af7312) — 7/6/2011 @ 8:30 pmSue & SarahW,
Correct, at one point we had two Jennifer George individuals claiming to be in CA.
Only later after the police report was filed in Boston that one JG was determined to be in MA, she claimed to have attended some type of screenwriting sessions with Lew Hunter which again tied back to CA and UCLA.
That is the one thing, “UCLA” thread that both JGs had in common and keeps confusing this part of the story.
Joe
Joe Smith (54c0c1) — 7/6/2011 @ 8:56 pm1524 Sammy … is very confused. just ignore.
1533 SarahW is correct.
1534 Joe is correct in 1534
All of this is according to Lee’s radio broadcasts/podcasts: http://www.blogtalkradio.com/stranahan
So what we know is what Lee has told us.
In short, Az5 found a screen cap of @starchild111 that had the name “Jenay”
STLAH then Google searched “Jennifer starchild111” (asuming that Jenay was a form of Jennifer) and found 123people.com had a “Jennifer George with a nickname of starchild111 on Twitter.” It didn’t say which JG that would be though. There are hundreds of JGs.
Lee started looking at JGs and found one (JG CA) who had done “some political work” (according to Lee). She had worked as a fundrasier for a political magazine. (She has a wide-open online presence (blogs, linkedin, facebook, personal website, lots more) – the first clue that she probably isn’t a sneaky sockpuppet.) Lee thought this might be a lead and sent her an email with his phone number and a friend request on facebook. (As it turns out, JG CA reports that JP had emailed exchanges w/ her prior week. We don’t know how JP found JG CA, but it may have been same way as Lee did, perhaps with Ron’s research? (speculation))
Shortly (minutes) after sending email to JG CA, (timing was a coincidence) Lee got the teary call from JG…but this was not JG CA, it was JG MA, who says she has been receiving threats, google searched, found Lee and called to ask what is going on. This JG (MA) says she did own the starchild111 twitter account but had abandoned it and was not involved in the Weiner story. (among other details reported by Lee). JG MA says she can give a prof at UCLA who can verify who she is. (timing of call, CA claim, and UCLA prof are all coincidences w/ other JG, which further confuse Lee temporarily) Lee has this woman call Jen Preston…in fact he sets it up while JG is still on the phone. So JGMA calls Preston. Preston calls prof. Preston calls Lee and says she thinks Prof is a fake (Prof is Lew Hunter, prof emeritus UCLA who runs seminar writing retreats in Nebraska at his large home, where, it seems, JG MA met him and his wife). Lee thinks this is very very strange because prof seems very very real. (Lee seems right on this and the claim by Preston is strange. JP apparently also said same to Ron, if Ron’s posted DM from her is true.) Lee & JP didn’t call Prof using a fake number given by JG MA. Lee & JP looked up prof’s website and used his number there. It is an extensive website with a long history dating back years. Lee calls Prof back and reconfirms with Prof & wife that they know JG MA. JP & Lee didn’t have JG MA’s number, as far as we know. She called Lee on a blocked caller ID. Presume same for JP.
This is pieced together largely from listening to Lee’s radio and reading posts online from Lee, JG CA, and others.
koam @wittier (234826) — 7/7/2011 @ 5:10 amRe: 1535 koam @ wittier
Thanks again! That is the best summary I’ve seen.
I assume your power is back on. Hope your day is a good one.
Has Jen Preston actually discussed what she saw/heard that made her think the Prof was fake (other than generalities and mentioning Anonymous, etc.)? I am intrigued by the variance in the responses that Lee and JP had, apparently to the same website and the same people. Has Lee revealed any more of the reasons for his certainty for his position?
P.S. I’m sure you have better things to do than to satisfy my curiosity. You don’t need to continue if you don’t want to, obviously. But thanks for the time and effort already given.
Sue (24e46b) — 7/7/2011 @ 7:53 am1536 Sue
Thanks. To answer your question, I don’t know that JP has said anything about Prof publicly. Her accounts come from Lee, primarily and Ron, secondarily. You can find the link Ron published himself to a blogspot page that presumably he owns and read his many tweets. No idea whether any of it’s real. Impossible to tell, but it sort of meshes with what Lee has said.
It puzzles me why JP would say to Lee (and, it appears, to Ron, according to his blog), that she suspected they’d been “punked” by a fake Lew Hunter. According to Lee, both JP & Lee were given the name “Lew Hunter, Prof at UCLA” by JG MA. According to Lee, they didn’t just take a phone number from JG MA, (where she might have set up an actor, as has been speculated) but that they googled Lew Hunter, found him on UCLA’s site, and found his own site and looked up his phone number for themselves, speaking to Lew and Mrs. Hunter directly. (As far as I know, Lew is an older prof emeritus. He teaches one “keystone” type prestigious seminar for screenwriting grad students in the Winter when the weather is lovely in LA and pure crap in Nebraska, where he lives with his wife and holds writing retreats at their home. I believe there are 2 old mansions on his compound so it’s like going to a B&B where you are taught and work together with other writers for a week or 2 – held a couple of times a year. Evidently this is where JG MA knew Lew from, according to Lee.)
Lee makes perfect sense that Lew Hunter is a well-known guy in the film biz who moved into being a prof a long time ago. Why JP would say to Lee that she suspects that they’d been punked is for sure puzzling. From transcript of Lee’s radio show about it:
Further, I believe Lee said that the BPD Detective also called Hunter (I have to check when he may have said that. If I’m wrong he’ll let me know).
So Hunter, by any reasonable assessment, unless JP has info that she hasn’t revealed, is a real dude.
It calls for speculation, but either JP believes/believed what she told Lee (and possibly Ron too) …that Lew is fake and this is some wild , much deeper plot..scary stuff… (perhaps her powerful position allows her to have more info.)
or
that she was playing them both with a crazy theory that she thought they might run with (and get off the scent?) (dunno) Her saying to Lee that he should call Lew is kind of opposite to that but doesn’t rule it out. (Lee can and will do what he wants in any case.) Think of other reasons that she might say it to Lee if she didn’t really believe it. She allegedly wrote to Ron in a Jun 25 DM on that blog that she thinks Lee is trying to screw her and associate her with his BS jg story. Who knows if that is a real email or not, of course. It it were real, which part of Lee’s JG story was considered BS? We know that after Lee talked about what he said JP said that the Prof said about JG’s mental condition, that JG called Lee and asked him to remove those comments from his radio show. She went directly to Blog Talk Radio CEO and had him edit out 20 seconds of Lee’s show. Lee complied with this but said he didn’t think it was necessary. Lee documented it in a statement on his blog and in a subsequent radio show. Lee also said he got an earful from the reporter over all this in the end.
So it remains a mystery why someone would think that there was a fake Lew website and fake Lew & Mrs Lew on the phone, other than an actual belief that some evil hackers & conspirators are capable of anything, or it was a tactical misdirection on her part. I am confused by this.
Other possibilities? Anyone?
koam @wittier (234826) — 7/7/2011 @ 9:58 amYes thanks koam. That really helps clarify the timeline etc. I didn’t know people were still over here 🙂
Blackburnsghost (2ffb0c) — 7/7/2011 @ 10:08 amKoam, given how she initially contacted JG CA, under false pretenses, and how she tried to intimidate you (my interpretation), I wouldn’t rule out tactical misdirection on Preston’s part. Perhaps she thinks throwing BS out there will keep others off the scent of her leads, so she can be the reporter with the best chance of getting to the root of this issue?
Or perhaps she’s an airhead who, like many, has said stupid things that aren’t logical, simply in an effort to remain relevant.
Anyhow, by casting that degree of doubt on Hunter, she did a big favor for those who want doubt to surround every aspect of this scandal. In this topsy turvy story, that could curry favor with a lot of potential sources. Even JGMA, in a backwards fashion.
All I know is that Preston is totally unreliable.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/7/2011 @ 10:17 amFurther it’s possible that these incidents give certain indications.
– 1) JG MA is a real JG in MA who’s
– 2) not involved w/ Nikki activity.
Some observations point to 1) others point to both 1) & 2).
Pro:
Con:
koam @wittier (234826) — 7/7/2011 @ 10:33 am1539 Dustin
I agree.
When that JG CA disclosure page (brilliant) very first went up, I went out and asked in comments or twitter about the approach that JP took to JG. (Note: Ron later said that approach was semi-genuine, I think.)
But I asked if approaching in such an indirect, misleading, and flattering way would lead to JG CA clamming up when it got to the real questions at hand. That is, if JP wanted JG CA to tell a full story, that she was less likely to get that from her when it came down to the interview because of the approach. (Of course we were assuming that the name JG was potentially associated with the starchild111 handle so that such a JG would be a possible prime candidate to be the real “Nikki.”)
I was told by several people who are experienced commenters and who likely know more about reporting that I do that it was a perfectly respectable approach. I took that as a lesson that I was somehow naive about how the sausage gets made. And I am.
But JG CA’s subsequent comments about it indicate otherwise. (Even though JG CA is uninvolved, she bristled at being schmoozed and misled. JP probably doesn’t like that Lee landed on the same JG and tipped her hand.) We’ve seen the “much respect” type schmooze laid on others who are commenters on this story as well. I think JP may be off the Nikki story (scared? directed off?) and onto the post-story about the online collaborative/confrontational investigation by independent people.
koam @wittier (234826) — 7/7/2011 @ 10:47 amMe too, btw. But you know, I think these sausage making journalists who eventually have to reveal to their sources they were being dishonest… before they get their info… they may not be going about this correctly. There’s too much room for mistakes, bias, and outright deception.
For all the frustration of Patterico just letting his source say whatever s/he wanted to, and letting us think for ourselves, I see that approach as far superior to trying to trick folks the way Preston (And perhaps many other journalists) would.
Anyway, here’s the bottom line:
So who is naive? Her methods failed.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/7/2011 @ 10:53 amI have an odd potentially stupid question, forgive me if it has been answered. What if the Tweet that shows Jenay on the starchild account that was found was actually the fake. Not that the person who found it faked it. I don’t know very much about twitter and how you find lost tweets and that account was closed when it was found right?
Blackburnsghost (2ffb0c) — 7/7/2011 @ 11:07 am1543. Blackburnsghost
Do you know what a Tweet is? because your question suggests otherwise.
It was a screen capture from a Google or Yahoo cache of what the starchild111 twitter account page looked at on a specific day in the past. A snapshot from history.
You can find this documented earlier on this site with links.
When a piece of evidence is found by someone, it inherently means that others can go find the same thing. If others didn’t find the same thing we’d have heard about it loud and clear.
If you want to suspect that that was faked and somehow inserted into the Yahoo database, go right ahead.
But first go back and see it for yourself.
koam @wittier (234826) — 7/7/2011 @ 11:40 amHere is a link to the account page from twitter ( as reported ) via confirmed spider cache searches.
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-kN06BxQQIqo/Tf5cIF3BUII/AAAAAAAACOQ/_oOav941hF0/s1600/jenay.png
Note: the actual cached results are expirining on may artifacts relating to this story. This screen shot shows the name assigned to the starchild111 on that date ( 1/1/2011 ).
Joe
Joe Smith (54c0c1) — 7/7/2011 @ 12:09 pmGeez I said it was a stupid question because no I really don’t know what a tweet is. I am trying to figure that all out. I had another twitter account for my business which I have not been able to use because I don’t get it. That’s why I started the other one to try to figure it out without looking like an abject fool to my customers.
I also did not know about the history of Twittergate etc. I am educating myself on a lot of things.
Sorry I’ll keep to myself. This is just making a bad day worse.
Thanks Joe
Blackburnsghost (2ffb0c) — 7/7/2011 @ 12:22 pmI like it! On to 2000.
Who has a synopsis of what is undeniably known? The minutia in brackets.
Next a synopsis of what is not undeniably known, but beyond reasonable spin. If that’s too broad, well, I think you know what I mean.
An abbreviated updated timeline, incorporating the above, would be nice.
I’m not knockin’ it, this pursuit of the truth. It’s just that my RAM and hard drive (brain) are very limited these days …….. I really hope any and all of the perps are exposed, at least, if not prosecuted, where applicable.
MDr (fd1f4b) — 7/7/2011 @ 12:46 pm1547 MDr
I’ve summarized all over the place here and in previous articles. There are a lot of arms and legs to this. There is no one summary and any statement of facts often assumes that you trust who’s told that part of the story. And certainly new stories have on a regular basis invalidated old stories. So understanding who believed what at a specific time (even if they were wrong) is permanently part of the story. It will never be simple.
koam @wittier (234826) — 7/7/2011 @ 1:04 pmThanks again for the wonderful info. 🙂
I have to say that I don’t understand Twitter either. I have never used it myself and I don’t do Facebook, either. I wondered how folks were researching some of this and I appreciate your insight on what it is and how that was done.
I had gotten as far as opening Twitter windows on my computer to try to follow some of the discussions, but it moves pretty fast for me. And Lee’s radio shows aren’t very easy for me to go back over when I get confused (not like written info I can review).
Blackburnsghost, hang in there. We can learn together, courtesy of the folks who understand it better than we do.
I was realizing, as I tried to wrap my head around some of this, that part of my viewpoint is that of a person who is reasonably private and who doesn’t use all the media. So it didn’t seem that surprising to me that it would be hard to locate someone. And it didn’t seem surprising that someone might prefer not to be “outed” in real life. I guess if someone was trying to figure me out, they might suspect a “sock” simply because I usually lurk and only comment on occasion. As a matter of fact, I think this is the most I have commented on any thread. 🙂
Thanks to all for helping me understand.
Sue (24e46b) — 7/7/2011 @ 1:08 pmSue,
Your comments hit the mark and your recent comment about someone be outed would be what Jennifer Preston did to Witter.
I don’t know all the details but it looked like JP tried to get information from Witter but he did not play her game so she felt it was proper to publish his anme and even the name of his dog.
Not sure what her “news” purpose was but that is bad Big J in my book.
Joe
Joe Smith (54c0c1) — 7/7/2011 @ 3:10 pmJoe and Sue, Thank you and ditto.
After reading all the stuff I read today this is WAY above my techno pay grade, after reading about the previous twittergate thing I thought anything was possible re: faking things online etc. That’s where my spot on/brilliant idea came from.
Anyway I will enjoy reading the comments and looking forward to progress if any.
Koam is doing a bang up job of keeping up on this I think.
Blackburnsghost (2ffb0c) — 7/7/2011 @ 3:49 pmCheers to that!
Thanks.
I just saw this today…just a side note
http://qritiq.wordpress.com/2011/07/03/suspect-reporter/
but this blog is where Lee had pointed out that a temporary and fake posting from a year ago (fake date) that had pics of the actress Nikki Reed (not Reid) and J-Lo and commented that these ladies looked like a pic of a Jennifer George which is available on a facebook profile for a JG in Boston.
I have no idea why that fake posting was there. Lee said that he didn’t know that it was fake at the time that he posted it. If it had been real, then it would have linked a pic that is associated with a JG in Boston who has a fb profile with this story. The Nikki Reed & J-Lo thing would have been the giveaway. However Lee then said that the date was fake…and the post was removed later on.
It was a waste of time, proof that there are people screwing with us (I think)..or just a joke for insiders..but still a waste of time for me.
I kinda think I know who this is, but I haven’t asked her yet. If it’s the same person, she thought it was important for me to answer suggestive questions put to me recently. I don’t know why that happened either. It’s not terribly important but a strange loop in affairs to have someone possibly posting fake, year old, incriminating blog posts, and then that same person would get inquisitive with what were obviously retribution questions?
koam @wittier (234826) — 7/7/2011 @ 4:14 pmAnyway, no need to follow up. Just interesting.
Witter,
I posted a number of links over on Lee’s blog that related to that fake blog post you referenced above dated June 30, 2010. They got stuck in moderation.
Lee received the link from @lanelipton.
She tweeted a facebook link to Lee on June 27 that she indicated was a picture of Jennifer George on FB:
http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1104744369
This URL also appears on the blog Lee tweeted about looking for an owner:
: http://qritiq.wordpress.com/2010/06/30/look-a-likes/
Note: This was before the look-a-likes blog post was deleted and then replaced with the current puppy picture.
The first picture on the blog post has the same FB URL in the source code while the real image is at http://profile.ak.fbcdn.net/hprofile-ak-snc4/23073_1104744369_8766_n.jpg
I also found something very intersting on Lane Lipton’s blog, on her about page…. she is a writer in New York.
http://lanelipton.wordpress.com/about/
The image at the top is very interesting ( star map )
http://lanelipton.files.wordpress.com/2009/07/cropped-hubble1280x800.jpg
Joe
Joe Smith (54c0c1) — 7/7/2011 @ 4:45 pmWell yes that’s where I think I was going with that, even without knowing someone was asking questions of you.
Blackburnsghost (2ffb0c) — 7/7/2011 @ 4:53 pmI guess I thought well hmm we are all looking at JGMA and were looking at JGCA all due to a single cache found with the name jenay and I thought perhaps that could be created. To send us all on a long strange trip.
:./
Blackburnsghost,
Sorry but Jennifer George was already know to the press and they were contacting Jennifer George ( CA ) as early as June 14!
Joe
Joe Smith (54c0c1) — 7/7/2011 @ 4:59 pmSorry again. I need to learn to read links before post
Blackburnsghost (2ffb0c) — 7/7/2011 @ 5:06 pmI’m getting hammered today on all fronts. 🙂
#learning
Blackburnsghost,
No attempt to hammer you 😉
Just tyring to keep the facts straight and try to reduce confusion. Stay with us and the facts will drip out slowly.
Joe
Joe Smith (54c0c1) — 7/7/2011 @ 5:25 pmNo it’s fine, I’m a big girl. Clearly an amateur detective with a dime store monocle.
Blackburnsghost (2ffb0c) — 7/7/2011 @ 5:43 pmI’m starting to think this thread might actually reach 2000.
Pious Agnostic (6048a8) — 7/7/2011 @ 5:51 pmRe: 1558 Pious Agnostic
Sure, why not? As long as no one minds a slower commenter like me? 🙂
I think there are enough questions in this story to keep us going…
Sue (24e46b) — 7/7/2011 @ 6:01 pm@koam in #1537 “Other possibilities? Anyone?”
koam, I don’t know Preston or her work and can only speculate by projecting. But I don’t think Preston doubts Lew Hunter exists, I think she probably just believes as I do that his use as proof of identity by the woman claiming to be his ex-student was an indication that the phone call she got was phony, and Lew Hunter is irrelevant to the Weiner saga outside the fact that bringing him into it offers yet another totally pointless diversion in a story already riddled with manufactured red herrings.
JPreston likely doesn’t much care one way or another about the authenticity of the Lew Hunter she’d spoken to,since he couldn’t possibly prove anything about anything to her other than the fact that he had a student at one time who went by the name of Jennifer George – just as have probably hundreds of other teachers elsewhere had students who’ve gone by that rather common name.
Whether or not Lee or JP or the BPD or anyone else could satisfy themselves that the Lew Hunter with whom Lee & JP spoke about the former student named JG is the real Lew Hunter who teaches a scriptwriting class at UCLA Extension is a completely irrelevant sidebar since, genuine or not, Hunter has absolutely no way of positively identifying without having directly seen her do it her that either the person who called Lee & Preston or the one who allegedly filed a police report also claiming to be a JG was the JG who was his student anyway, right?
I took a couple of courses during my academic career with a well-known Prof or two who’d probably remember me too since I’ve kept in contact. If somebody else who knows (even second or third-handedly) that I took those courses with one of those guys, could he get his girlfriend to call up Jen Preston insisting that she was me and offer as proof of her “leilani-hood” that I once took a course with him?
Of course not. Even more, it would certainly set off alarm bells to me – and I speculate Preston as well – that an obscure relationship like that was even being offered as proof of ID by someone, so I’m thinking Preston’s probably as perplexed as I am that anybody’s even discussing Lew Hunter as anything OTHER than a neon-flashing red herring which was intentionally thrown out by someone else as chum to further obfuscate the already deliberately muddied sock water.
Preston says that the woman claiming to be “a” Jennifer George on the phone to her couldn’t even remember where in Mass. she went to elementary school, so the the film instructor reference the woman claiming to be named JG volunteered to Lee & JP as her means of supposedly confirming her “jennifergeorge-ness” is important only in that it justifiably helped heighten JP’s suspicion that the person to whom she was speaking was probably masquerading as someone by that name and didn’t know much else at all about the Jennifer George she was pretending to be.
In fact, let’s face it, it’s really the kind of strange reference which somebody might offer as ID only if they didn’t know the person whom they were purporting to be very well at all and perhaps knew ONLY that a memorably eccentric woman named Jennifer George took a UCLA film class with Lew Hunter once – a fact possibly even gleaned through a third party if her name had been bandied about in conversation, isn’t it?
Say somebody (we’ll call him Nool Roohooser), sees/plants the JG item at SLAH, wants to establish a quickie fake persona to punk someone on the phone with and puts out feelers among his peeps. “Anybody know someone named Jennifer George?” Someone pipes up: “Yeah, my sister took a UCLA Ex class with one from Massachusetts a few years ago. She was supposed to be a real character” And viola, ya got yourself an instant fake Jennifer George bio.
Except somebody forgot to do their homework on basic stuff like where she went to elementary school before they talked to the New York Times and JP’s caller flunked the basic ID test that any journalist worth even half his or her salt would put an unseen interview subject through to prove they are who they say they are.
I’m assuming that’s why Preston doesn’t want anything to do with a JG ‘theory’, particularly one which advances Lew Hunter the real-life man as having any relevance whatsoever to the Weiner story other than the fact that he was suspiciously the only detail proffered as ID confirmation by somebody obviously trying to send everybody on silly wild goose chases.
In other words, Lew Hunter was once important to this story at all only insofar as the very fact he was used as an ID reference in the first place pretty much ‘outed’ Jennifer Preston’s phone caller as a fake to her.
As well it should have, IMHO.
But (and this is a very big but): Preston was waaaaay out of line if it’s true that she outed your real name on twitter, as I just read here, koam.
Seriously, that’s some deeply weird &*%$. Scary-weird. And by a woman who was supposedly so offended that all these various & sundry Jennifer Georges were getting needlessly drawn into this whodunit?
Ruh-roh. Not gonna look good for ya defending yourself in a civil suit if one of the other Jennys decides to seek redress, Ms. P. Shows a pattern of reckless disregard for people’s privacy, doesn’t it? Tsk-tsk.
leilani (ccfc7e) — 7/7/2011 @ 6:30 pm1560 leilani
Thanks for responding.
Your first paragraph says that you don’t think that JP doubts Lew’s existence. But that is exactly what Lee said she said. See the transcript or listen to his show. Ron posts something similar, in his blog, allegedly from JP, and you can make your mind up about whether you want to believe Ron’s blog or not.
But your argument is not with what JP believes, it’s with what Lee said she said. I believe Lee would tell the truth about what she said, so the question is, did she believe it or was she trying to trick Lee?
As for whether a real Lew & wife can confirm whether the real JG MA who they know is the one who called Lee & JP, well there would have to be some kind of specific verification. Lee & JP are smart enough to know that a person may not be the same person. So if that was their fear, they would have keyed into it. I agree that they would need some kind of photo or additional info. I sort of expect that with the BPD triangulation, there must have been something. Let’s ask Lee, if he’ll discuss it.
But to recap Lee:
I think you get into speculation as to why a prof wouldn’t be a good reference. I think it’s irrelevant. It’s who the woman chose. At that age, I did often rely on profs as my references.
The point is what JP said to Lee. That Lew’s web site is fake. Not a real person. She didn’t say what you said, which is, a real Lew knew a real JG from MA, but the real JG from MA is not who Lee & JP talked to. JP is capable of saying that. Instead she said to Lee (and reputedly to Ron) that Lew is not a real person…with a fake web site. (Research has been done to show the web site has been around a long time. It’s not fake). Let’s not make excuses for her unless you are saying Lee is lying about it or that a hacker got into Lew’s web site and changed the phone numbers and email addresses.
As for the JG not saying where she went to school, and at first lying that she was in CA. Those can be explained by a real JG, who’s innocent, who wants to remain unfindable by Lee who she’s afraid of until she is more comfortable with talking with JP. I can believe that.
koam @wittier (234826) — 7/7/2011 @ 6:59 pmGiven how difficult it has been to get Lee to provide details and specific facts for his conclusions, are you certain Lee was quoting Jennifer Preston or is it possible he was interpreting what he thought she meant?
DRJ (fdd243) — 7/7/2011 @ 7:03 pm1562. DRJ
Am I certain of something Lee said? I’m quoting what he said and I said we should ask him again. He certainly repeated it. Weinergate Post Modern Yellathon But you’re right that if we can’t trust what Lee said to be quotes (rather than just his inferences or interpretations, which I challenge regularly), we have a lot of problems understanding what’s going on in general. Lee delivered this story with quotes. I can’t tell you if it’s real, just what we heard him say. Lee help us out.
Corroboration, if you will, is at Ron’s blog.
koam @wittier (234826) — 7/7/2011 @ 7:35 pmRe: 1560 Leilani
I had seen someone mention before that JG/MA couldn’t name the elementary school she went to.
It is details like that that makes it very clear to me that I have a slightly different viewpoint. I remember the school I went to (just one, K-6), but my adult son doesn’t; he went to four different ones and would be hard put to name any of them (moving is hard on a kid). There are sometimes valid reasons why you can’t name the school you attended.
But your description of the possible chain of events leads me to wonder: if JP was asking questions that may have had simple, but slightly different, answers (like my son’s inability to name his elementary school), then what kinds of questions would a journalist end up asking in order to identify someone? And if you don’t want to detail your life history and have a journalist act like it isn’t enough to convince them, what do you offer up? In a strange way, I can imagine that it is possible for the conversation to become one of scrounging around for an authority figure of some kind – like a well-known professor – in an attempt to find something to point to that might fit the journalist’s expectations and end any further probing. So was the professor offered as an ID proactively, or was it perhaps offered out of exasperation since JP perhaps was refusing to accept someone’s other statement? Only JP and JG/MA know the rest of the context of the conversation.
But I will also add that since Jen Preston has published koam’s real name, it seems possible that she may have been overly aggressive in other contexts as well; so the idea that JG/MA may have felt pushed and that she may have thrown something out as authoritative and been deliberately misleading due to possible discomfort with JP’s attitude remains a possibility, in my opinion.
For the record, if any reporters want to know where I went to school, the answer is, “None of your business”. And if you want to think I’m a fake as a result, have fun. 🙂
Sue (24e46b) — 7/7/2011 @ 7:54 pmI don’t think Lew Hunter was or is a fake. He also is not key this case.
If JG(MA) was or is fake it would be easy to dismiss Lew. Again, his only role is to confirm JG is JG.
JP or any other mainstream press group should be able to determine if JG is real using other methods.
Joe
Joe Smith (54c0c1) — 7/7/2011 @ 7:59 pmApologies, that last comment of mine was pretty flippant. Sorry.
Sue (24e46b) — 7/7/2011 @ 8:25 pm1564 Sue
Interesting story about your son.
If we are to believe what Lee says happened, JG called him, very, very scared that someone was threatening to kill her. (He thinks she’s lying) But in an attempt, I assume, to have a second person corroborate the call and also, possibly to add some legitimacy to himself, he has JG call JP, who, it is easy to document, works for NYT. Lee is an independent with some pictures of himself on his page that maybe a girl afraid for her life wouldn’t really want to see. (Tough guy, scowling photos)
If JG is really that scared, I wouldn’t blame her for fibbing about where she was and some details that she is giving up in her confused state to strangers. Why not lie about your location if you are scared someone’s coming to kill you?
Now if the point of having JG call JP was to help reassure JG that Lee is not a killer, we can all see how that turned out. JG went right to the police.
And on Ron’s blog, we can see how JP allegedly talks about Lee. Pretty rough stuff…(if Ron’s blog is to be believed.)
koam @wittier (234826) — 7/7/2011 @ 8:26 pmRon’s blog is not to be believed,even if it’s gospel truth. He’s not in a right frame of mind at present, and caution should be exercised there.
Sarahw (af7312) — 7/7/2011 @ 8:41 pmSue, without offering any specific citation this minute, it is strangely the case that women have a distinct superiority in retention and recollection of detailed childhood memories, places, and events; a difference that may in part be due to measurable differences in the brain structures linked to these memories ( their hippocampuses). Men seem to have more childhood amnesia compared to women.
JGma also lied about where she went to high school to lee and Preston and only admitted this when caught. She also filled her story with outlandish details, and used the same confidence games the socks used.
Sarahw (af7312) — 7/7/2011 @ 9:00 pmThe whole mysterious JG tracking down and phoning Lee scared to death–Lee’s having JG call Preston– and the entirety of the bizarre Lew part of it– has never made any sense to me. I am not saying those things didn’t happen in some form or fashion, nor am I calling anybody a liar. But those pieces of the puzzle just do not fit right, yet. Some of those pieces just smell funny and have always seemed false flaggy to me (at least with the info presented publicly so far). To me, it feels like a poorly shot photo that is not in focus, but still intrigues because there are outlines and shadows. And that may be precisely the master plan.
elissa (c14551) — 7/7/2011 @ 9:46 pm1568 Sarahw
Yes, well, you know the salty talk made me suspicious. She wouldn’t, right?
koam @wittier (234826) — 7/7/2011 @ 10:21 pm1569 Sarahw
Fair enough. But all that adds up to JGMA is a sock, not Lew. JP doesn’t say JGMA is a sock.
In fact, she has Lee’s radio show edited ostensibly to remove a potentially slanderous remark (we’re guessing) about JG (the sock?) that slipped out in which she’s the reported transmitter of a notion.
That and other things point to JGMA being real, and possibly innocent.
see #1540 from this morning.
koam @wittier (234826) — 7/7/2011 @ 10:30 pm“Given how difficult it has been to get Lee to provide details and specific facts for his conclusions, are you certain Lee was quoting Jennifer Preston or is it possible he was interpreting what he thought she meant”
DRJ, is there any reason to believe Lee’s assertions about alleged private conversations?
Random (4dc233) — 7/7/2011 @ 10:30 pmSarahW, so there were a lot more than just one or two problems with the discussion between JP and JG/MA. That makes more sense. Thanks.
Elissa, I like the description of “a poorly shot photo that is not in focus”. So is this art, or accident? I wonder if we will ever know.
Koam, it does seem odd to me that JG/MA called Lee, then goes to the police. It’s out of order. But a lot of this story seems that way.
Thanks to all. I have a lot to think about and wonder about until tomorrow. Sweet dreams to all.
Sue (24e46b) — 7/7/2011 @ 10:42 pmSue,
Lee mentioned on his BTG radio program on 6/20/2011 that JG(MA) asked Lee if she needed to call the Police or the Campus police next. She was asking Lee for his feedback before contacting the Police. So this odd cycle has been out there since June 20.
Joe
Joe Smith (54c0c1) — 7/7/2011 @ 11:37 pmRandom,
Yes there is reason to believe Lee is speaking the truth. The best example is the request from Jennifer Preston have the BTR recording edited to remove a comment abot JG.
It is a clear example that JP and Lee spoke to the same person and JP thinks she is real. Why else request something be removed from the mp3?
Joe
Joe Smith (54c0c1) — 7/8/2011 @ 9:04 amkoam, #1561 Hi, thanks for the reply, sorry I’m late. Lunchtime!;-)
You said: “As for the JG not saying where she went to school, and at first lying that she was in CA. Those can be explained by a real JG, who’s innocent, who wants to remain unfindable by Lee who she’s afraid of until she is more comfortable with talking with JP. I can believe that.”
So you speculate she was lying about where she studied in Massachusetts because she was scared but she was telling the truth about studying with Hunter in California because she was …what? Experiencing a brief unexplained burst of uncharacteristic confidence thanks to the salubrious effects of the SoCal sunshine? If she doesn’t want to be found & isn’t the least bit interested in proving she is who she says she is in a way that passes even the mildest smell test and can confer upon what she says any validity o credibility at all, then why is she calling in the first place?
Sue in #1564 offers the suggestion that perhaps the caller claiming to be named JG can’t correctly tell Preston where she went to elementary & high school is because she might have moved a lot & attended many schools, a scenario created out of the blue & without any foundation at all simply to justify the caller’s wild contradictions and her inability to pass Preston’s Journalism 101 scammer screening questions, never mind that it would help contradict the caller’s own story of growing up in Massachusetts.
But we could just as easily concoct another scenario which has it that the caller couldn’t remember because she didn’t attend school at all & was in fact home-schooled by tutors in Buckingham Palace back in her Princess days, couldn’t we?
I mean, as long as we’re inventing scenarios out of whole cloth to force-fit this caller into serving as the sole culprit in the Unisock Theory, we might as well go all out, no?
Similarly, we are asked to accept that Lee’s caller must be telling the truth that she started the starchild account yet was suffering from a sudden onset of intermittent dishonesty when she says her account was abandoned &/or hacked and she herself had nothing to do with the Nikki tweets because…er, why?
Why, simply because that wouldn’t fit the unified sock theory either, it seems.
So we’re bending over backwards to engage in the rawest of meandering speculation in order to create justifications for her when she says stuff that doesn’t fit she was the lone perpetrator in the Unisock Theory, but we’re incongruously taking completely at face value anything she says that does fit the theory. Suddenly no extenuating explanations & fancifully speculative excuses are required for that.
But using the Koam-Stranahan method of cherry-picking evidence and concocting selectively operable explanations without any foundation to mitigate all the contradictions in logic & to allow us to jettison the inconvenient stuff that doesn’t fit, we can speculate until the cows come home.
Inded, as I said, we could make an equally compelling case for the claim that the woman who called Preston & Stranahan was the Queen of England, but what would be the point of it?
You’re not going to end up with a provable theory that passes muster with anybody whose capacity for reason requires real evidence to make logically sound deductions, all you’ll end up with is, well, a fairy tale, won’t you? A fun & fanciful diversion maybe, but in the end an utter waste of time – just as Jennifer Preston (and the BPD?) have themselves evidently concluded.
leilani (ccfc7e) — 7/8/2011 @ 9:55 amOops forgot to address this, also from koam in 1561: “But your argument is not with what JP believes, it’s with what Lee said she said. I believe Lee would tell the truth about what she said, so the question is, did she believe it or was she trying to trick Lee?”
Wait, what? Even Jennifer Preston’s story has to go through the same selectively applicable process of acceptance into the body of evidence now?
If she publicly says the story offered by the self-proclaimed JG she spoke with didn’t hold up under even the minimal scrutiny to which she subjected it and she can’t subscribe to Lee’s theory with a straight face, she might not be telling the truth because according to Lee she may have told him something vaguely different in private?
But we have seen that quite a few others have objected to the way Lee has misunderstood &/or mischaracterized their own private conversations with him and have suggested he has a distressing habit of selectively hearing &/or cherry-picking their words to substantially distort what they’ve said.
Yet we’re supposed to take at face value the iffy hearsay contention that JenP says in private something completely different than what she herself says directly in public – i.e., that the woman who called her was obviously a fake in her best judgement as an experienced journalist (who btw, just like cops, are required to adopt some tricks of the trade to ferret out imposters on the phone if they’re ever to get any work done at all since they are routinely the targets of attempted punkings) and she’s concluded that pursuing the woman who made that call would be a time-wasting wild goose chase.
But why the heck should we? Toward what end?
If you persist in selectively choosing only that which fits the theory and are simultaneously required to adopt a completely contradictory rationale to discount everything else which doesn’t fit it, what you end up with is not a theory, but a fantasy, koam, which is exactly why so many have heretofore declined to embrace Lee’s single sock solution.
[And btw they’re declining to embrace his theory not because they ‘hate’ him as he suggests or even that they distrust him necessarily. It’s simply because they can’t subvert their intellects & subjugate their requirement for logical consistency in order to make sound rational deductions, therefore they can’t just take a leap of blind faith to arrive at the same unfounded conclusions at which he’s arrived. His very vaguely articulated & selectively chosen evidence happens to be singularly unpersuasive to people’s intellects. It’s not the skeptics’ fault they were born with fully-firing synapses.]
leilani (ccfc7e) — 7/8/2011 @ 10:05 amJGma also lied about where she went to high school to lee and Preston and only admitted this when caught. She also filled her story with outlandish details, and used the same confidence games the socks used. – Comment by Sarahw — 7/7/2011 @ 9:00 pm [emph., mine]
Ahhh. Exactly! Now we’re talking, Sarah.
The Hunter factoid in particular was a completely extraneous & irrelevant one which suspiciously served – and still serves – as the typical time-honored con artist’s distraction device which in turn helps to obscure the fact that there was no more substantial evidence to make the case that the caller was the twitter user who posted as Nikki than there was to make the case the caller was Prince William’s granny.
In other words, the hoaxer wants Jen Preston – and the rest of us – to believe that just because everyone can confirm that there exists a screenwriting instructor named Lew Hunter who had a student named JG, everything else the caller is saying must ipso facto be true. But Lew Hunter tells us no more about the caller’s ID than would a claim by the caller that she owns Corgis have given the Royal Dog Trainer license to confirm that the person Preston was speaking to is the Queen of England and everything she might say thereafter that is true.
The mere fact that the caller tried to pull off that slight of hand – one of the most notorious tricks of the con artist trade – to establish her bona fides with Preston, was itself a pretty good indicator along with all her other contradictions and evasions that this self-proclaimed JG was bogus and no matter what Lee may or may not think she said to him in private, it’s pretty obvious that Jen Preston wasn’t buying the ruse, thanks to the tricks of her trade which lets journalists & cops determine whether the unseen people they’re speaking to on the phone are who they say they are.
leilani (ccfc7e) — 7/8/2011 @ 10:15 am1576 Joe
correct
koam @wittier (234826) — 7/8/2011 @ 10:23 am1577 leilani
I have tried to identify what was speculation, when I can. If I forget to, please always correct me. I’m not calling speculation a fact.
I guess the driving force is that JG MA goes to the police and subjects herself to interrogation by detectives, as she said she was going to do. So if her story on the whole is utterly fake, I would expect it to be found out professionally. That’s why I was trying to infer what her intent would be in statements she made – not saying it’s true, just a what-if.
What I’m not doing is calling statements lies that are not proven to be lies. I’m giving all the benefit of the doubt on general thruthiness until proven otherwise by facts.
I think the hyperbole is fun, but not terribly relevant. I’m not offended.
I don’t get the comment about force-fitting into the Unisock Theory, as I don’t think I’ve been reasoning or speculating in that direction. Lee is going in that direction, I take it. Lee doubts most of what JG said. I was saying it needs to be proven if certain parts are to be called false. So I don’t get what you’re saying.
1578
Where does JP say that JG is not legitimate? I may have forgotten. You’ve written quite a lot based on this. I know that one assertive follow up was to have Lee’s radio program censored after the fact.
The snarkiness aside, do your comments allow that Lee and I don’t necessarily agree on this in general? I still don’t get it.
The hyperbole and sarcasm can muddy the clarity of your purpose, which is what I’m interested in.
1579
So you’re with Pat’s theory (his hypothetical). OK. Why didn’t you just say that?
Are the caller JGMA and BPD JGMA the same person and how are they related, or are they just new, unrelated players intent on pranking? Why does a new player with no stake take this to the police? Is she planning to vanish if BPD wants to take her to task for a false report?
koam @wittier (234826) — 7/8/2011 @ 10:47 am1577 Leilani
I didn’t say JG MA told the truth about studying with Hunter in CA. I don’t recall for sure if JGMA said that the study with Lew was specifically in CA. I don’t think that was specified, just assumed. Lee says JGMA said she was in CA and attends/attended UCLA. Hunter only teaches once a year at UCLA now. Lew’s semi-retired (my wording) as a Prof emeritus. She told Lee she attended the UCLA Creative Writing Program. The Writer’s Program at UCLA that starchild111 linked to on Twitter is an extension program, with online courses, so that can be confusing to figure out.
I believe that Hunter said that he knew JG MA from his teaching retreats in NE. I don’t recall if Hunter denied or ever addressed having taught JG in CA as well. (This may be claimed somewhere).
One reference is Lee’s notes on JG call. He posted these June 30 (call was June 19) after several asked him to put the info in writing. Prior to that it was all on podcasts…extremely hard to review and discuss. Also look at Lee’s posts before and after this for other parts of the story, as well as his radio podcasts.
koam @wittier (234826) — 7/8/2011 @ 11:39 amby all that holy
ColonelHaiku (822dce) — 7/8/2011 @ 11:44 amconspiracy buffs have lots
of stamina, damn!
Neal is just the sort of person to scare Jenny with a fake Lee or Lee-fan issuing a fake threat.
But I’m not sure Lee was aware that such an explanation existed at the time he interpreted the fake threat the way he did (as a sign Jenny is lashing out and trying to stop him). I interpreted it the same way Lee did before I really looked into what Neal was capable of.
Knowing now that Neal could easily do exactly what appears to have happened, my guess is that someone did scare the hell out of Jenny, mainly in an effort to screw with Lee, but also because he wants to establish something about the bloggers and commenters who have been pursuing this story. He consistently manufactures theories of stalking and cyber crimes that didn’t exist in order to present himself as the good guy.
Obviously I am speculating, but it fits the facts well. Just keep in mind that someone is doing all they can to manipulate folks like Lee and us.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/8/2011 @ 11:47 am1584 Dustin.
In which case there is a scared JG MA.
What do you make of claimed lies that JG MA may have told Lee and/or JP? Don’t lies or inconsistencies prove that JG MA is not a real person? (Not my assertion, but see 1577)
koam @wittier (234826) — 7/8/2011 @ 11:56 amThey prove she has been deceptive. And frankly, I would be deceptive if I were in her shoes.
Yes, if I’m right, Jenny is a victim, and collateral damage of someone willing to exploit innocent people if he thinks it will harm the reputation of his enemies.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/8/2011 @ 11:58 am1586 Dustin.
That’s what I was sayin’.
I was roundly roiled for postulating that today.
What do you think might have happened to @starchild111 then?
koam @wittier (234826) — 7/8/2011 @ 12:06 pmHell if I know. The problem with this story is that I know someone is trying to manipulate me, but I also know some aren’t. It’s impossible to select an appropriate degree of paranoia and trust right now.
All I know is that I don’t know, brother.
I’d say join the club, but you’re a charter member.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/8/2011 @ 12:23 pmI mean… once you cross this threshold of possibility, you quickly realize we could (are) dealing with some tremendously awful characters. And yes, I do recall Koam making this observation well before I did.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/8/2011 @ 12:28 pmHit Parade Time…..Flashback
So what of this?
koam @wittier (234826) — 7/8/2011 @ 12:37 pm1589 Dustin
I did? I’m late to the Neal stuff. I know the chatter but haven’t focused on it really. But I often forget what I’ve said earlier…so if you come across something, lemme know.
koam @wittier (234826) — 7/8/2011 @ 12:39 pmLast time I checked in that thread the take-away was Nixon’s the one. Or a gang rapist, I couldn’t quite make it out.
SarahW (af7312) — 7/8/2011 @ 12:57 pmI don’t know what’s real anymore.
SarahW (af7312) — 7/8/2011 @ 12:58 pmYeah, you mentioned the general point that some of the possibilities here would mean we’re dealing with some monstrous people. I’ve been reflecting on that as I learn more about Neal and his work with Mr Kimberlin.
I actually thought you were pretty specifically talking about the possibility Jenny is a literally discrete person who was being manipulated into thinking she was threatened by Lee/Lee supporters. But that may just be my imagination combined with my thoughts on this.
RE your 1590, that’s probably not related to what we’re talking about. Other than it appearing that someone was being manipulated by someone they shouldn’t trust. I think Patterico was trying to make a specific point to someone, rather than giving us clues of tremendous importance.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/8/2011 @ 12:59 pmYeah, it’s quite the trainwreck.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/8/2011 @ 1:02 pm1595 Dustin
You’re right.
See 1146, 1151, 1164.
Really evil to make a pawn/patsy of an innocent JGMA, then threaten her life, and falsely implicate Lee in doing so. On that call, Lee thinks she’s behind it all and she thinks he’s the one. And neither are.
Noticed that a deleted post here and there has screwed up the reference numbers in places.
koam @wittier (234826) — 7/8/2011 @ 1:18 pmEveerybody seems to be assuming this all began sometime early this year or late last year. I think that’s causing some of the confusion.
I don’t understand why nobody seems to be considering the following theory:
JG in Massachusetts is an alias. This alias was adiopted quite some time ago, maybe just for limited purposes. JG/MA sought to create some confirmation of this name and found a JG in California. She went a class in Nebraska where basically she pretended to be JG/CA. She then had a reference.
The Boston police may not be like the police in Cambridge Massachusetts. Maybe they don’t ask for ID or state ID. n any case if she is associated with the Reeds, there is a known abaility to forge although mayeb teh faxed IDs weren’t good forgeries.
JG/MA created the starchild account and later turned it over to some other people she was associated with,.
Sammy Finkelman (d3daeb) — 7/8/2011 @ 2:44 pm1597 Sammy
Why didn’t we all think of that?
koam @wittier (234826) — 7/8/2011 @ 3:19 pmCurious and contorted tale in’it?
Maybe deputy da here should bring in Darryl Issa
(CA) and sinlinlin (NJ) in for some questioning
Dem blokes didn’t bark!
JennyFTB (d143f7) — 7/8/2011 @ 4:31 pm1599 JennyFTB
made ya look…
we’re at 1600
koam @wittier (234826) — 7/8/2011 @ 4:52 pmkoam–
I’m curious about something if you’d care to comment–
You are obviously one of the people on this site who is most deeply engaged in the Weinergate mystery. You’ve taken lots of notes, interviewed people, done internet research, followed twitter fights, explained things, and transcribed Lee’s radio shows. All very helpful. So here’s my question: If, in your mind, you were to go back, say two weeks to June 24, have you changed, enlarged, subtracted, been surprised by, or revisited, any aspects of the SSS (single sock solution) during that time? More simply, is your theory today basically/exactly the same as it was two weeks ago or have you honed it or perfected it in any way that you are aware of? This is not a trick question BTW.
elissa (157504) — 7/8/2011 @ 5:23 pm1590 koam
Ron says it ain’t him on Twitter.
koam @wittier (234826) — 7/8/2011 @ 5:47 pmwtf?
elissa (157504) — 7/8/2011 @ 5:59 pmHoot WTF indeed but interesting.
Blackburnsghost (2ffb0c) — 7/8/2011 @ 6:16 pm1602 elissa
I haven’t interviewed anyone or done more than read the blogs, comments, tweets, and do google searches for old info. There are a dozen others who have done as much…they’re just smart enough to take some time off while, um, nothing’s happening. And I’ve tried to either stay out of the disputes among commenters (see how I don’t usually bite back when mocked), or I’ve tried to smooth things over between others. and I have a lousy memory for what happened when and would have to go through and see what developments happened since June 24.
I don’t know for sure what I thought on that date. Maybe I didn’t know what I thought then either. I think that at some earlier time was more down with Lee’s assessment of his JG call from June 19. (but not entirely by any means). I think Lee concluded that JGMA was the big kahuna, the real queen of all socks. For a while he was 90% sure (his words) that JG CA was the real caller. I was never there, and I tried to poke a little fun at the notion, calling her Cute Kitty Video Blogger. That theory was like “Deep Throat” from Watergate turned out to be Mary Richards (or Ted Baxter.) But I never held with Lee’s outright suspicions about most of what JGMA told him, because I thought the labeling of those things as lies lacked concrete proof.
As time has progressed, I think there’s more evidence (circumstantial and logical) for a real JG MA who’s a patsy.
OK, you made me look. June 24 is day of Lee’s follow-up radio show about JG MA call “Nikki Revealed for Real” “Conjecture is over.” after having confirmed JG MA ID w/ Prof Lew Hunter & wife.
In fact, I did a summary there, at comment #91, in which I took Lee’s statements and sorted them into claimed facts and inferences. Here’s the list:
Since then, we got Lee to document the call himself, and he labeled all the things JGMA said as either truths or lies.
http://leestranahan.com/weinergate-notes-on-my-619-jenny-george-call
I still have big doubts about most of the things Lee decide were lies. He specifically declined to give reasons for each of those conclusions. I also have a huge doubt, shared with Lee, about Preston’s conclusion that Hunter is a phony guy with a fake web site who “punked” her and Lee.
I think now more than back then, I accept the concept of a real JG MA who’s a patsy. She was called and threatened, not by Lee, of course, but by whoever’s behind all this. She did start Starchild111 and she did abandon it. Someone took it over – there are a thousand ways for that to happen, not the least of which is that most people use lousy passwords. The reality of JGMA is strongly underscored by her going to BPD. Lee’s statement about BPD closing the case is likely indicative of his exoneration. The threat callers were just pinning it on Lee, so the case is still open. I think the calls happened. This is just a theory. I can’t prove it all, but I think it’s a better theory than others.
More that we’ve learned since June 24 points to a real, innocent JGMA. I’m more in that camp now than I was back then.
I don’t think JR9 was Dan Wolfe. I did a detailed comparison of the two (because I think I was among the first of many to see similarities, including the idea that they could be women) and concluded that they’re not the same person.
One question, can anyone figure out if JR9’s twitter stream from June 21 was written on a computer, phone, etc? I’ve seen where twitter shows certain apps where tweets originated. How do we find that for Reid’s initial Twitter awakening?
koam @wittier (234826) — 7/8/2011 @ 6:40 pm1604 elissa
see 1590. Hit parade…flashback
koam @wittier (234826) — 7/8/2011 @ 6:42 pmWhat’s WTF worthy about that? Are you guys just not following what he meant? He’s not saying his twitter comments aren’t his. He’s saying he wasn’t part of this conversation. His comment about going to jail is not related to anything specifically happening to him, but rather just noting his devotion and … dramatic tone (I’m trying to be charitable to him).
Ron’s simply noting that he wasn’t part of that conversation. I totally believe him.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/8/2011 @ 6:44 pmI’m talking about Ron when I say “he” in 1608. Koam cross posted on the more general topic when I typed it.
BTW, good thinking, Koam.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/8/2011 @ 6:46 pm1609 Dustin
Yes Ron’s denying he wrote that clue that Pat dropped a few weeks ago (ref 1590)
koam @wittier (234826) — 7/8/2011 @ 7:06 pm–Sorry, Dustin @1608– The “if I go to jail” thing that was printed in bold just looked like a very strange thing to say. If it was on here before and explained, I apparently missed it. It still doesn’t make any sense but I’ll take your word for it.
–koam @1606–thanks. When I asked my question I did not intend for you to have to go to all that much work, but it was interesting. I’m afraid I cannot assist you with your inquiry about JR9’s twitter feed, though, because I treat twitter as the devil.
elissa (157504) — 7/8/2011 @ 7:13 pm1611 elissa
koam @wittier (234826) — 7/8/2011 @ 7:29 pmre: 1608, oh not that strange
Re: 1577 leilani
My apologies if I wasn’t clear.
For the record, I don’t ascribe to any theory and am mainly intrigued with the processes and approaches of those trying to unravel this entire set of mysteries. I am interested in how someone gets to a conclusion from a given bit of information, and what data is available to help sort it all out (since much of this story involves media that I don’t use). I am occupying my spare time learning by observation while I await the end of the story.
I was not trying to justify the caller in any way. I don’t know the extent or content of the conversation between JP and JG/MA and have simply been trying to understand the pieces of the story that I have caught. Some of the commenters here have been kind enough to try to help me catch up.
I had seen the reference to the caller’s inability to identify her elementary school and I know from personal experience that such inability can exist for perfectly valid reasons. So invalidating someone’s story – IF it was done primarily on the basis of that one point – and sometimes that seemed to be the implication – seemed like jumping to conclusions. However, another commenter set me straight and indicated that there were several other points in the conversation that added to credibility concerns. (Thanks to SarahW.)
I never went to “Journalism 101” and don’t know what would be in the textbook regarding “scammer screening questions”. Can they sometimes result in “false positives”? Perhaps you would be willing to help me understand those issues better?
Please and thank you.
Sue (24e46b) — 7/8/2011 @ 7:41 pm… Rosebud…
http://www.nationalreview.com/sites/default/files/nfs/uploaded/u12/clapping.gif
ColonelHaiku (822dce) — 7/8/2011 @ 7:59 pmwe had to kill the thread to save the thread…
ColonelHaiku (822dce) — 7/8/2011 @ 8:01 pmend at 1616?
ColonelHaiku (822dce) — 7/8/2011 @ 8:01 pmClonelHaiku,
I don’t think so, we have not resolved the initial assignment from Patterico.
Joe
Joe Smith (54c0c1) — 7/8/2011 @ 8:26 pmExcellent point, Joe.
Sue (24e46b) — 7/8/2011 @ 8:48 pmDid someone provide a theory explaining the impossibility of the propositions? My impression is that most of the theories and information discussed suggest the propositions are possible.
Have I missed a disqualifier?
So ends a long day
Confusion remains unsolved
Morning seeks anew.
Dear ColonelHaiku, my poor effort is intended as a compliment to your skills, which I have enjoyed.
Sue (24e46b) — 7/8/2011 @ 9:10 pmI’m not wedded to any particular theory in this affair, and I’m not sure who all the players are, but I believe the players all thought discovery would drop as soon as AW resigned. Nobody expected Patterico and Lee to stay with it. But, when they kept right on going, it threw the players into a panic, causing them to act on damage control.
Patterico was contacted by JR (sock or not), so he worked that angle. In pressuring JR, NR appeared suddenly. I actually wondered if NR was
a frustrated NR coming out from behind the screen. I believe NR is one of the significant players.
After the frustrated NR arrived on the scene, the death threats began. Yet none of the initial threats threw anybody off the case. Then, after
a couple of days, this JG call comes up, and she just happened to have started the Starchild 111 account.
Now I’m not saying ths development to be insignificant, I rather see it as just one aspect of the whole. And, I can’t get by the feeling that this development was a diversion. It needed to have some significant truth in it for the ploy to work.
You will notice how JR is no longer on the scene. What happened to him? Where did he go?
Further, I still have significant questions about the role Gennette played in this. I keep wondering what she felt she saw that drew her into it? What was her relationship to AW? And,
why she felt she needed to stick with Nickii for so long? Last but not least, why did she suddenely encourage Nikii to contact Weiner when she did?
I guess what I’m trying to say is, why aren’t we discussing and inquiring into the various aspects
cap'n john's nephew (d29614) — 7/8/2011 @ 9:26 pmof this story? JG is far from the only loose end.
Perhaps, we need other puzzle pieces before the whole picture will be understood.
OK, I’ll grant it’s a strange thing to blurt out, Elissa. No, I have seen no explanation for that. I mean… he’s referencing the excerpted conversation talking about fighting a court order to reveal a source (Ron is saying he would keep the identify of PUSA76 a secret, even if held in contempt). But this is not a necessary observation, since that’s not the confidentiality being discussed in the email.
Anyway, I guess I have to confess I’m used to Ron being… dramatic, so I didn’t see that as anything special.
His denial of that excerpt didn’t even seem necessary to me.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/8/2011 @ 9:27 pmThanks for your kind words, Sue. With all the deep thinkers at Patterico, I’ve found that if I can’t dazzle them with brilliance, I can certainly baffle ’em with BS!
ColonelHaiku (822dce) — 7/8/2011 @ 9:29 pmSue,
The original as offered by Patterico while plausable adds a layer of complexitity to what might be a very simple story. However, this entire #Weinergate has been more complex with many unexpected twists and turns.
I don’t see the need for the hoaxter to hate Lee or Breitbart. Just a need to direct attention away from real trail to help provide cover.
If Niiki Reid is fake, then John Reid is fake. I am still not sure that I agree that JG created starchild111, had someone else take it over “as-is” and then spend 5 months slowly switching the persona to Nikki Reid.
Only “public” ties between any JG is the cache search results. We still don’t know why JP was trying to contact JG(CA) as early as June 14.
The June 19th JG(MA) call claimed that she had created the startchild111 id but since she lied about many items as Lee documents
http://leestranahan.com/weinergate-notes-on-my-619-jenny-george-call
Joe
Joe Smith (54c0c1) — 7/8/2011 @ 11:27 pm1620 capn
After Patterico contact w/ JR, “NR appeared suddenly”
Nikki Reid and Neal Rauhauser share initials. Presumably you mean Neal.
Can we all please use Neal & Nikki in lieu of NR going forward?
Did the threats not start before Neal became publicly involved by writing at Kos?
Do you have some ideas about Gennette’s role?
koam @wittier (234826) — 7/9/2011 @ 4:35 am1618 Sue
(If this is what you meant by “propositions.”)
This is false. Pat may have thought it was possible on June 30, but since then the players have indicated that the JG MA who called Lee is real and have been circumspect about discussing her, indicating she’s real, she’s filed a police report, and that they don’t want to say too much in that regard.
koam @wittier (234826) — 7/9/2011 @ 4:42 amTweet from Patterico last night
koam @wittier (234826) — 7/9/2011 @ 4:45 am#625
Your right about the initials Koam, sorry if I confused you. Perhaps that was a type of slip. The possibility that neal could have been both Nikii and John is one of the scenerios my mind is open to. At least, he may have used the sock on occasion.
This not to say I believe neal was a lone wolf. This was a group of people acting as a team. Some amongst us may be leaning to a theory that JG was the team leader, while others lean towards neal (neal is certainly an alpha personality). I tend to lean towards neal at this time, but I am open to other possibilites. The operational organization structure of this team is another area that needs further fleshing. If John Reid and family are socks, it provides structural information.
Gennette claims she noticed Starchild/Nikii’s activities on tweat, and that is what drew her in.
If that is true, I would love her to explain what is was in the Starchild/Nikii account behavior that caught her eye. She said Nikii’s attention to Weiner, but I’m having difficulty buying that.
I mean, so what if somebody was following Weiner.
What specifically made Nikii’s activity different from others?
There are other hanging chads surrounding Gennette that deserve closer examination, as well.
After all,she was having phone conversations with Wiener. How did that come about? Gennette seemed to indicate that it had to do with her little investigation. An investigation she wanted us to help her with, yet was far from forthcoming with details that would help.
So, like yourself, I would like to hear people’s thoughts.
cap'n john's nephew (d29614) — 7/9/2011 @ 6:49 amRe: 1627 — Cordova’s involvement with Starchild111 stems from the fact that Starchild111 contacted her on 05/05 and immediately began trying to strike up a friendship.
At that point, Cordova already knew a group of people were monitoring both her and Weiner’s twitter streams, because the group had already singled her out in multiple tweets.
If you want more specifics on what happened when, up until June 7, here’s a timeline I’ve been maintaining.
Because Google has at least temporarily removed its Realtime search functionality, some of the links no longer work.
Greg (e0d909) — 7/9/2011 @ 8:12 amI guess I didn’t code the link correctly. Here’s the timeline.
Greg (e0d909) — 7/9/2011 @ 8:14 amGreg, that must have taken a lot of work. Thanks for linking it. You might even want to link it to your name (throw the URL in the website block).
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/9/2011 @ 8:50 am1627 capn
I think GC’s story is that she got a follow or tweet from Nikki, wondered who Nikki was, and noticed that Nikki was following/tweeting other online GFs of Weiner. This made GC suspicious of Nikki’s motives. (Presumably, Girls who love Weiner, follow Weiner, not other Girls who love Weiner. With #bornfreecrew already out there, GC, smart lady she is, is suspicious of Nikki…she says from the get-go.)
If I have that wrong, someone please let me know.
Gennette, you’re the source, so please feel free.
koam @wittier (234826) — 7/9/2011 @ 8:53 am1627 capn
1638 greg
We should also note that #bornfreecrew , while portrayed as some kind of secret, sneaky right-wing hacker-ish society if you only read MSM, was, evidently, doing its observation and finger-pointing very openly on a day-to-day basis, for all to see. They were out there warning young girls about Weiner’s pattern of socializing online with other young girls. And this was public.
Gennette, a fan and friend of Weiner, thought this #bornfreecrew activity was suspicious, harassment and somehow nefarious. Weiner played as if it were too. Other girls commented that they were opposed to being talked to by #bornfreecrew and its allies (moms, etc.) who warned them. Instead they defended Weiner as a hero. (JR9 said as much. In that case, it may be an act. Who knows?)
But now we know what Weiner was actually up to with his camera, twitter, facebook, email, and phone and a bevy of young ladies.
And we know that the warnings from #bornfreecrew to young ladies, particularly, Ethel, who is a real high school girl, were admirable warnings.
The papers didn’t really cover it that way.
koam @wittier (234826) — 7/9/2011 @ 9:19 am#628
Greg, Thank you for straightening me out on that key point. Not certian how I go turned around on that point. I appreciate it very much.
I’ve tooke the time to read through your entire timeline, and I can’t say enough how helpful it is.
Thank you for sharing your extensive work.
Now, I’m going to read it again, and think this thing through again.
cap'n john's nephew (d29614) — 7/9/2011 @ 10:10 amWow! How did *taken* morph into “tooke” ?
cap'n john's nephew (d29614) — 7/9/2011 @ 10:14 amWittier,
I asked Gennette about her communcation with Rep. Wiener before the May 27 package tweet when she was here on the blog pushing the JR thread.
She was not intersted in “her” but wanted to focus on finding JR. Again part of my theory of individuals with an agenda trying to direct focus away from them.
I personally don’t see her as a true victim, she was active in the communication with Rep. Weiner before the May 27 tweet heard round the world. She continues to play a victim but there are many missing facts to support her as a true random victim of the package tweet.
Joe
Joe Smith (54c0c1) — 7/9/2011 @ 12:37 pm1635 Joe
I don’t understand.
First sentence OK.
2nd: Gennette didn’t want to answer your questions about her communications history with Weiner prior to the 27 photo tweet. Is that what you are saying?
In what way is this a response to my posts 1631 & 1632?
I understand you have a theory about Gennette’s history. I don’t think I referred to any of that in my recent posts. I’m just trying to follow the flow here.
If we want to shift to what you’re discussing, my observed pattern for GC is that she tries to answer truthfully when she chooses to chime in and can add value. She doesn’t feel it’s her obligation to tell all, and certainly not here where she hasn’t been consistently treated with deference and respect. This is neither for nor against her; just my observation.
I asked if she’d like to chime in on my summation in 1631 in response to cap’n’s 1627, to indicate if I made any errors in recollection. I don’t expect GC to come forth with more info about what transpired privately between her and AW.
But maybe she’ll surprise us all.
koam @wittier (234826) — 7/9/2011 @ 2:42 pmKoam,
I agree, Gennette could shed considerable light.
I also agree with Joe’s point. IF her desire for the discovery of JR and others were sincere, she would be willing to pitch in. Short of that, I’m not sharing as high a regard for her as you do.
My mind is open though.
I, like others, have many questions concerning many facets of this story. And, while I may focus on this one or that one at any given time, I don’t want ot loose the big picture.
As to what I feel about the JG/Hunter connection:
The way JG uses Hunter as a reference is quite odd. Also, that Hunter would feel the need to suggest JG is liberal, AND a little off, sets off many red flags.
How much do we know about Hunter? I mean really know.
Also, what are your feelings and instincts concerning JP insiting to Lee that this goes
cap'n john's nephew (28dda5) — 7/9/2011 @ 4:10 pmtoo deep?
1637 cap’n
GC & JR are potential sources of information, so I figure until we know more, I don’t need to judge them – or they’ll clam up. I think GC got more than she bargained for multiplied 10,000 times. Whatever she was doing wasn’t so bad. She evidently talked to JP and JP spun a story in GC’s favor. (for example, the story doesn’t state the key fact that GC is the one who brought up the topic of AW with Nikki. Yet the NYT story says Nikki is the obsessed one….but fails to mention that she never broached the topic with GC for a month. It’s not all that important, but there was a choice in how it could have been reported. We had to wait for JR9 to show up here and release documents for GC to tell that side of it.)
I don’t think an innocent JG using Hunter as a reference is strange in any way. Others disagree. Look: She’s scared. She calls Lee. He says, “Call my friend JP of the most prestigious name in news, the NYT. She’ll tell you I’m no killer. See, I have friends at NYT who know something about this case too. I’m not dangerous.” JP asks JG for some info about her, and a reference. JG’s not supposed to give a friend or relative, who are not impartial. JP asks, “do you know anyone who’s got a public background, or who’s verifiable as an independent party.” At that age I would have given a professor’s name as well. 100% sure I would have. Hunter has a long history and is a known person. If what Lee and Ron say that JP said about Hunter is true (that, is, if she actually said Lew’s a faker and this goes way deep), I think that’s crazy talk. Whether she meant it or not is another thing altogether. She has been known to say things to try to get what she wants. (Her approach to JC CA, is an example…of course, in both cases, she didn’t get what she seemed to want and was lightly ridiculed by both Lee & JG CA.) And, certainly, JP could know things that we haven’t been told yet.
Perhaps it goes deep. I dunno. But doesn’t go deep on the back of Lew Hunter being a phony, based on what I’ve seen.
koam @wittier (234826) — 7/9/2011 @ 4:35 pm1639 koam
1639 is a scenario based on cap’n’s question of what could have happened. The quotes are conjecture about how it may have gone down, given that we’re not being told the details.
koam @wittier (234826) — 7/9/2011 @ 5:48 pmRe: 1626 koam @ wittier
Sue (24e46b) — 7/9/2011 @ 6:02 pmOk, thanks. That explains the Update.
Let me ask, though, whether it has been established that the person who called Lee is the same person who called the police? (Is it not possible that one person could have called Lee and another person could have been threatened and called police?) It seems like a reasonable assumption that there was only one person, but this story seems to involve so many reasonable assumptions that somehow go awry, that I am fascinated by the twists and turns. Please note that I am not suggesting anything or accusing anyone; I am just curious about what links have been resolved and to what extent and in what manner.
Re: 1630 Greg
Sue (24e46b) — 7/9/2011 @ 6:04 pmThanks for the timeline. It is very helpful for someone like me that needs to go back and see it in writing a few times.
I want to thank you, Koam, for all the hard work you have done on this, as well as, the patience to put up with questions from people like myself.
It is appreciated. I’ve been trying to catch up, and keep up on all the details in between life.
I finally did some reading about Mr. Hunter, and I don’t think him involved, at all.
In contimplating your take on JG, I’m wondering
of the people surrounding JG. Somebody close enough to use, assume, or steal her twitter account.
Sue’s question is a good one also.
So many details, so much verification needing pursuit, and so few new revelations.
Regardless, this story wouldn’t be where it is without your steadfastness, Koam.
cap'n john's nephew (28dda5) — 7/9/2011 @ 6:37 pmRe: 1636 Joe
Sue (24e46b) — 7/9/2011 @ 7:56 pmGennette may have already answered this elsewhere and I’m sorry if I missed it and am going over old ground. But what reason does Gennette give for wanting to “focus on finding JR”?
I also want to thank you, koam, for the transcriptions and responses and other notes and summaries you have provided. They are wonderful aids and much appreciated.
My thanks to all the commenters here who have been so patient and informative.
Sue (24e46b) — 7/9/2011 @ 8:09 pm1641 Sue
I think this has been discussed. I think the JG MA who went to the police also discussed Hunter, but not sure where that’s cited. Since Lee believes almost nothing about this JG, he’d likely have thought that it could be a different person and have gone into that. Her report & interview must have included mentions of calling Lee & Preston. Lee would have to have said that to the detective. Pat tweeted last night about a rude & unhelpful Boston detective, but don’t know if it’s the same one or not.
Here’s Lee’s first writeup about police calling him.
http://leestranahan.com/jenny-george-files-police-report-accusing-me-of-making-threats-against-her
Detective Thornton
koam @wittier (234826) — 7/9/2011 @ 8:57 pmhttp://www.bpdnews.com/2010/03/18/detective-ellis-thornton-awarded-a-commissioner%E2%80%99s-commendation/
Sue & Wittier,
No there has been no conformation that the JG(MA) that called Lee is the same actual person that filed the police report in Boston.
That is part of Patterico’s set of assumptions on this blog entry. There could have been a Hoaxser on the phone and a real JG(MA) that received a threat or threats from a “Fake” Lee or “fake” Lee followers.
Joe
Joe Smith (54c0c1) — 7/9/2011 @ 9:47 pmSue,
Back to Gennette not answering my questions:
In this blog thread: https://patterico.com/2011/06/26/a-couple-of-random-quotes/ GC was active so I asked a key question about her communication with Rep. Weiner.
Her response was:
We now know that she was DMing Nikki and actually got the communication going between Nikki and Rep. Weiner based on the JR doc dumps. So her involvement is much earlier than the May 27 package event. She is a key player in the “entire” event!
Joe
Joe Smith (54c0c1) — 7/9/2011 @ 10:03 pmThank you all for the help and clarifications.
Sue (24e46b) — 7/10/2011 @ 6:47 pmI am going back through the timeline and notes and summaries and hoping for inspiration to strike… 🙂
I hope everyone stays safe and I will look forward to more information to come out soon.
Thanks again.
Call the time patrol:
I discovered an anachronism:
The comment that was NOt left by Jennifer George on the St Louis activist website;
http://stlactivisthub.blogspot.com/2011/06/is-starchild111-actually-jennifer.html
That goes:
Excuse me could you please provide a contact number? I am Jennifer George from Los Angeles and I am getting calls now because of your blog. I’d like you to take this down. I have nothing to do with your ridiculous story. I will be calling the police as I am getting threats due to this. What is your number?
June 19, 2011 5:11 PM
Was NOt theer ion June 19. I saved the text of taht page on June 21, and although all the updates are there, and teh Seattle545 comment, that is not theer.
Sammy Finkelnan (d3daeb) — 7/11/2011 @ 10:06 am1650 sammy
Old news.
JG CA has said she did not leave that comment on STLAH. She specifically denied leaving that comment already, a long time ago, after she was directly asked about it. This is documented on her own site on July 1.
That comment on STLAH’s blogspot is apparently mischief.
koam @wittier (234826) — 7/11/2011 @ 10:23 amAt around 3:40 PM Eastern Daylight time on June 21, 2011, the Jennifer George comment on the STLA website that is dated June 19, 2011 5:11 PM (just three minutes after the post by Anonymous) was NOT there. Not there.
It *was* there in the printout of the page I made on July 7 and it still there now. But it was not there on June 23!!
June 23 was already after there had been two updates, and even after teh second update was updated with the words “So far, it is not entirely clear whether that exdplanation is even possible” crossed ouyt and presumably the words “Sounds like Twitter does make accounts available after 30 days of deactivation, so this story is possibly true” added.
Just like now, there were 3 comments to that post. But the first comment was one dated June 19, 4:48 PM, that said that there was someone in Canada who had used the username starchild111, with links included. This has disappeared.
The third comment link, when I saved the contents of the page was the seattle545 comment dated
June 20, 2011 2:26 AM with the fake Weiner-Gennette DMs that “reveal” that Gennete controls the Nikki account and 4 overlapping starchild111 scvreencaps of public tweets posted in mixed up order – probably coming from two widely different time periods, with the transitiion in the middle of of one of teh screen caps. What seattle545 postyed was piosted before it was really ready.
It doesn’t say it is from seattle545. All comments on the STLA website except maybe from
people who registered are posted as comming from Anonymous. But that’s the second mass commenty posting by seattle545. You apperently don’t need to supply a name on the STLA website. Anyway that’s the third one.
The second one on June 23 is now the first, and INSERTED IN THE MIDDLE after June 23, 2011
3:40 pm is:
“Excuse me could you please provide a contact number? I am Jennifer George from Los Angeles and I am getting calls now because of your blog. I’d like you to take this down. I have nothing to do with your ridiculous story. I will be calling the police as I am getting threats due to this. What is your number?
June 19, 2011 5:11 PM”
Shall we say that Adam copied soemthing over from private mail?
But “Jennifer George” says she doesn’t have a contact number! That sound slike maybe she has no way to leave a message. I haven’t studied the STLA website so maybe itcould have been a private comment.
Interestingly it doesn’t appear AFTER the June 20 comment, but right in time order.
Sammy Finkelman (d3daeb) — 7/11/2011 @ 10:35 amSammy,
Wittier is quite correct. JG(CA) denied leaving the message on the STLA Adams blog post. She also posted the twiter exchange with Lane Lipton @lanelipton on her page: http://www.jennifergeorge.com/weiner.html and she answered Lane Lipton @lanelipton on twitter again denying that she had authored that anon message.
Just an attempt at more misdirection by someone…
Joe
Joe Smith (54c0c1) — 7/11/2011 @ 10:51 amI see that there is a sidebar on the STLA page that says: (I didn’t capture that part)
Anonymous tips? Send email to stlactivisthubtips@yahoo.com
So the fake Jennifer George *could* have emailed it less than 2 hours after Adam posted his message at Posted by Adam at 3:16 PM – BTW, two hours after and she’s already getting calls and threats?
But getting it in email doesn’t explain why, if Adam transfereed it over later from email to the public comments – sometime after 3:40 PM June 23 EDT – it appears BEFORE the seattle545 comment left on June 20, 2011 2:26 AM.
I don’t know – maybe the website software automatically adjusts position.
The real Jennifer George of California said on June 30 – she wasn’t asked about it until June 30 – a further indication that it appeared on the website later than when it is dated – that would be why she wasn’t asked about it before – that she did not author that comment:
http://www.jennifergeorge.com/weiner.html
UPDATE, JULY 1, 2011: NEW CORRESPONDENCE.
7:25 pm, June 30, 2011
[http://twitter.com/#!/LaneLipton/status/86621368833155072]
From: @LaneLipton Lane Lipton
I’m curious if @blogarsay authored this comment: tinyurl.com/3cjt5ys & if so, why she thought story was “ridiculous” Or was it impersonator?
9:36 pm, June 30, 2011
[http://twitter.com/#!/blogarsay/status/86654278915194880]
From: @blogarsay Jennifer George
@LaneLipton I did not author that comment.
10:01 pm, June 30, 2011
[http://twitter.com/#!/LaneLipton/status/86660562049695746]
From: @LaneLipton Lane Lipton.
@blogarsay that makes sense – thx J
The tinyurl.com/3cjt5ys gets you right to the spot in the STLA webopage where the comment appears.
Another thing I don’t necessarily find suspicious that the search that turns up Jennifer George already has Jennifer George in the search. He says he looked at old searched and it is posisble and even likely a variety of seasrch terms were used and he;’s just finding it again.
Sammy Finkelman (d3daeb) — 7/11/2011 @ 10:57 amPerhaps all the comments were in moderation? That’s one way to account for the odd-date comment. Perhaps Adam put that one up some days after it was submitted?
Who knows. Clearly someone wanted to point at an LA JG. Ms. BostonJG (lee’s caller) seems to have dissembled about her residence in LA.
I’m bored of idiot trolling by now.. I’m not sure I care anymore.
SarahW (af7312) — 7/11/2011 @ 11:01 am1652 – 1655 Sammy, Joe, Sarah
What if it were JGMA who left that message on STLAH blogspot?
Good thought by Sarah that comments could’ve been in moderation. Also JGMA was on that day saying she was in LA (possibly because she feared the threats & wanted to divert people from her real location, or possibly because she’s full of it).
Does anyone know if there’s a way to manipulate the dates on comments left on blogspot? From that incident where a certain blogger mentioned in this exchange posted a faked wordpress post falsely dated a year ago, so as to appear momentarily to be highly scandalous, we learned that the owner, at least, of a wordpress blog can slap whatever date s/he wants on it. I doubt that works for outside commenters, haven’t tried.
As for the “quick response” to the discovery of the name, things were moving quickly then, right? I think the day before (June 18) is when az5thdstrct circulated the starchild111 screen cap with “Jenay”. Then June 19 was both the STLAH “Is StarChild111 Actually ‘Jennifer George?'” post and also when Lee got the call. I don’t know if we know the date that JG MA allegedly received the threatening calls. Do we know if she has said that they were received after this STLAH item went up or after Lee was talking about it?
Sammy, good thought on how JG (false LA) comment on STLAH didn’t appear at the time stated and how she wasn’t asked about this or it wasn’t discussed until much later. (Moderation, tampering, Adam catching up, who knows?)
Is STLAH the type to have his fingers in this to a greater extent than has been discussed? Certainly he has a confrontational past (“archenemy” of Dana Loesch, it would seem, from their heated exchanges caught on video. He also said at one point that accusations against DL & AB (e.g., that they had hacked Weiner’s accounts) were overstated in this case ).
We now have two events tied to STLAH – the “discovery” of the JG name and the appearance of this comment (“I’m JG LA and I’ve been threatened. What’s your number?”) after the fact, which is possibly within the control of STLAH. Has he been asked about why it appeared at a later date anywhere (or do any of his notes explain why)?
By the way, I figured out that one way that STLAH could have organically figured out the JG name was to assume Jenay stood for Jennifer, then search on Google for Jennifer @starchild111. (“Jenay + Starchild111” don’t get you to JG name. You have to make the assumption that Jenay is really a Jennifer.) There are other ways as well, and these were available on June 18. STLAH didn’t specify the method used to find the full JG name.
Background post by STLAH on Weiner & Breitbart/Loesch
koam @wittier (234826) — 7/11/2011 @ 11:43 amSTLAH archives on Weinergate. Used “Weinergate” tag provided by STLAH.
koam @wittier (234826) — 7/11/2011 @ 11:48 amSammy,
Your are correct that Adam has edited the blog entry and the comments are slightly different.
I would suggest you ask Adam why he made the canges but the content remains consistent.
Also thr same poster 545inSeattle Posted by: seattle545 at June 20, 2011 03:14 AM (NUnGN) over on Ace’s blog: http://minx.cc/?blog=86&post=317751#c13441264 ( look near the bottom of the thread, Post #270 ).
Also on Lee’s blog on June 20 here at patterico.com: https://patterico.com/2011/06/20/betty-veronica-solved/comment-page-1/#comment-806864
Joe
Joe Smith (54c0c1) — 7/11/2011 @ 11:58 amAgain, don’t forget that Jennifer Preston was looking for Jennifer George on June 14, well before she wrote the article on June 17 and the follow on find of the cached Jeany / starchild tweet data.
Joe
Joe Smith (54c0c1) — 7/11/2011 @ 12:10 pm1659 joe
I lost you after “June 17.”
koam @wittier (234826) — 7/11/2011 @ 12:15 pm1659 joe
I wonder what Ron knows about that June 14 reach out by Preston – how it originated, who found the JG name and how they did so? I think I saw Ron explain that JP was interested in the story pretense that she used to reach out to JGCA but that if she got her foot in the door would have brought up AW. I think I read Ron saying something along those lines, but it might have been someone else commenting. Not sure where that was, would have to research to confirm. It was a semi-rationalization for the approach to JGCA under those pretenses, but it made clear that the underlying purpose was to talk Weiner.
koam @wittier (234826) — 7/11/2011 @ 12:26 pm1659 joe
I wonder if Lee ever asked Preston how she got JG name days before he did. They were still pals at one point.
koam @wittier (234826) — 7/11/2011 @ 12:31 pmand how she landed on the same, incorrect, JG (CA) or if she emailed every JG she found (or at least more than that one).
koam @wittier (234826) — 7/11/2011 @ 12:34 pmWittier,
Ok, Jennifer Preston sent an email to Jennifer George on June 17 with a vauge story line about doing a social media story.
The JP story on June 17, exposes the starchild and mariannela twitter ids as sock puppets. On June 19, AZ finds the startchild cache with Jenay and and then the 123people.com searches turn up a connection between Jennifer George and starchild.
Then a JG(MA) calls Lee on June 19 claiming to be JG(CA) but having nothing to do with Rep. Weiner sting other than creating the starchild twiter id back in 2009.
She also claimes to be a student in LA and that someone was able to find her in the UCLA directory. ( appears to be a lie since she is really in Boston when she files police report ).
However nobody seems to be able to find her phone name and the JG(CA) denies the whole situation.
The JP article runs June 17: http://www.nytimes.com/2011/06/18/nyregion/fake-identities-were-used-on-twitter-to-get-information-on-weiner.html
So how was Jennifer Preston onto any Jennifer George as early as June 14!
Joe
Joe Smith (54c0c1) — 7/11/2011 @ 12:38 pm1664 Joe
first date you meant to type was June 14, date of Preston email to JG CA
_________________________
On June 19, JGMA calls Lee. JG MA is not pretending to be that specific JGCA. The Cali & UCLA connections were merely coincidental between the 2 JGs. JGCA is a decade older than JGMA (we deduce). I don’t see JGMA as trying to point Lee to JGCA. JGMA didn’t know that Lee had just emailed JGCA. That was all a coincidence. It wouldn’t have made sense for JGMA to try to pretend to be that JGCA as JGCA is clearly not the person who JGMA described herself to be on the phone with Lee and JP. In fact JGMA tells JP who she is by referring JP to Lew Hunter. Lew is not going to say that she is JGCA. He doesn’t know JGCA. JGMA was just trying to not say where she really was – she was afraid of being killed that day (or she was making the whole thing up, but not pointing attention toward innocent JGCA).
_____________
I think Preston had researchers (Ron says he was doing research for JP and I think Ron says he may have been involved in researching the false IDs from the Reids. I think Ron may have said that he had some knowledge of the nature of the reach out on June 14, but I’m not sure if it was him or where I read it (I haven’t looked for it.))
koam @wittier (234826) — 7/11/2011 @ 12:57 pmCorrection to 1652, 1654.
The way I had it in Number 1650 (shows as 650) is correct.
I saved the file of the text cature of the StlA post on June 21 at 3:40 PM, and at that time it did not contain the “Jennifer George” comment complaining about the post linking starchild11 to the name Jennifer George.
Sammy Finkelman (d3daeb) — 7/11/2011 @ 2:43 pmYou know Koam, I think I disagree with that assessment, at least in part.
JGMA was deliberately misdirecting, and I think deliberately creating ambiguity.
The history of the sudden appearance of the comment may have a simple explanation, but I would like to hear it.
SarahW (af7312) — 7/11/2011 @ 3:07 pm1667 SarahW
I know you have a different idea.
But Lee had fed us JG CA on a 90% sure platter. The call came in 15 minutes after he emailed JG CA. So he was convinced, and stayed convinced for days. But it was a coincidence.
There is a JG MA who did take Lew Hunter’s course in Nebraska. Lew Hunter also teaches at UCLA. JG CA went to UCLA some decade + ago. JG CA also did work at UCLA on staff a year or two ago. She’s not in LA anymore. She hasn’t been a student for over a decade. JG MA told Preston that she knew a famous UCLA prof named Hunter. Preston called Hunter, confirms. Lee called and confirmed. Hunter knew JG MA was from MA. JG CA is not from MA.
If JG MA wanted to pretend to be JG CA, she would have just given info that was much closer to JG CA’s info, which is there for all of us to see. Why would JG MA say she’s a student at UCLA now if JG CA hasn’t been one for a decade +? If JG CA is erroneously still in the staff directory at UCLA, and JG MA is pretending to be JG CA, why not say she’s a staffer, rather than a student? What’s the point of pretending to be JG CA and getting all the info wrong?
It’s a coincidence.
koam @wittier (234826) — 7/11/2011 @ 3:29 pmSomeone should ask Adam if he knows why the 6/19 comment from the fake JG CA showed up on STLAH at a later date.
Has anyone tested to see if comments on that site go to moderation automatically? It would seem reasonable to guess that it might be the case as he probably has enemies and might want to filter them out as needed.
koam @wittier (234826) — 7/11/2011 @ 3:32 pm==It’s a coincidence==
Koam, there are coincidences and then there are ultra super duper coincidency coincidences. I don’t know the answer and I have no grand theory to offer. But you still have a hard sell convincing me that the mere 15 minute differential between Lee’s email to JGCA and his receipt of a call from JGMA is not related in some way or other. We just don’t yet fully understand how it was related, IMO.
elissa (686a5f) — 7/11/2011 @ 3:56 pm1670 elissa
The email was sent to JG CA. Another JG called. Why is that not a coincidence? The name Jennifer George was in the mix, on the table, publicly discussed. What does the email have to do with the call? nothing.
koam @wittier (234826) — 7/11/2011 @ 4:44 pm1670 elissa
I’m still confused. Is Lee’s email being monitored so someone could see when he sent something to JG CA? Or did he tell someone that he was sending the email and that person somehow knew to alert JG MA to make the call? Or are we back to JG CA is a suspect?
koam @wittier (234826) — 7/11/2011 @ 5:17 pmHow come just after I mentioned Ken Danieli aka Koam aka Wittier connections to Kiva, Twitter went down?
Do any other socks also work with them?
Ron Brynaert (5e3edf) — 7/11/2011 @ 6:45 pmI’m a longtime reader of this site, but I’ve never commented here before.
And I sure am confused by this story.
As far as I can gather, Koam or Wittier and Lee Stranahan and Neal R. and thugs from Daily Kos did something or really didn’t because they like to play games instead.
Maybe there’s more information to be gathered on why so many “liberals” spent July 4th menacing innocent people in these links:
http://kdanieli.com/id1.html
http://www.crainsdetroit.com/article/20110703/SUB01/307039980/microloan-website-funds-five-startups-after-launching-in-detroit
Ron Brynaert (5e3edf) — 7/11/2011 @ 6:47 pmHi, Ken!
INFILTRATION MARKETING. Danieli pioneered a bold, new, grass roots approach to forging powerful consumer relationships with trademarks. Created for Josta, spanning from the street to the Internet, Danieli’s strategy has been expanded become an integral part of the company-wide Pepsi marketing approach: to drive emotional connections with consumers for the Flagship Pepsi and Mountain Dew Brands and new products like Sierra Mist Lemon-Lime and Mountain Dew Code Red, in North America and Internationally.
Ron Brynaert (5e3edf) — 7/11/2011 @ 6:48 pmI find my stuff from digging, not getting tip sheets from strandedwind etc.
Wittier:
Graduated in Top 1% of Class. Deans List. President, Lock Honorary Service Society. Beta Gamma Sigma-National Management Honor Society. Scholarship.
Wow, impressive resume, Ken. Too bad instead of doing good, you decided to rewrite crappy Superman 3.
Ron Brynaert (5e3edf) — 7/11/2011 @ 6:49 pmthe long slog to post
ColonelHaiku (f2ed50) — 7/11/2011 @ 6:50 pmone six seven five blocked by
one six seven four
Does any silly socks want to ask me questions?
Like how does it feel to be menaced for weeks when you don’t work for a media organization and are only trying to protect scared sources?
Ron Brynaert (5e3edf) — 7/11/2011 @ 6:51 pmdamn you ron brynaert
ColonelHaiku (f2ed50) — 7/11/2011 @ 6:52 pmyou have effed it all up now
better waich your back
and then watch it, too.
ColonelHaiku (f2ed50) — 7/11/2011 @ 6:54 pmI always watch my back, cowards.
But can any sock tell me if it’s just a coincidence or a prank that my landlord has the same name as this guy:
http://www.linkedin.com/pub/dir/Vito/Conigliaro
Vito Conigliaro
Ron Brynaert (5e3edf) — 7/11/2011 @ 7:09 pmMr at Sviluppo Italia Sicilia
Palermo Area, Italy | Information Technology and Services
Is the Chris Ceriello on my Facebook the same one I went to high school with…or is he this guy:
http://dya1700ny.tripod.com/id1.html
Antpharm team manager
Ron Brynaert (5e3edf) — 7/11/2011 @ 7:11 pmChris Ceriello: When Louis first told me about DYA, I just started cracking up. until he told me he was serious. so I did’nt even care because when Louis told me about them, they did’nt even seem like competition. They just seemed like a couple of losers looking to chase an impossible dream. DYA isn’t even a team, to me it looks like a freak show or a mental institution. So before anyone calls DYA and Antpharm a rivalry, think about this. In order to have a rivalry, you have to have some competition. DYA is not our competiton, DYA are our bitches.
Maybe you stupid haiku socks used your unAmerican censorship hacker tricks to block this last time, try again:
I’m a longtime reader of this site, but I’ve never commented here before.
And I sure am confused by this story.
As far as I can gather, Koam or Wittier and Lee Stranahan and Neal R. and thugs from Daily Kos did something or really didn’t because they like to play games instead.
Maybe there’s more information to be gathered on why so many “liberals” spent July 4th menacing innocent people in these links:
http://kdanieli.com/id1.html
http://www.crainsdetroit.com/article/20110703/SUB01/307039980/microloan-website-funds-five-startups-after-launching-in-detroit
Hi, Ken!
INFILTRATION MARKETING. Danieli pioneered a bold, new, grass roots approach to forging powerful consumer relationships with trademarks. Created for Josta, spanning from the street to the Internet, Danieli’s strategy has been expanded become an integral part of the company-wide Pepsi marketing approach: to drive emotional connections with consumers for the Flagship Pepsi and Mountain Dew Brands and new products like Sierra Mist Lemon-Lime and Mountain Dew Code Red, in North America and Internationally.
Ron Brynaert (5e3edf) — 7/11/2011 @ 7:16 pmSeriously, though, you guys might as well ban books.
Using cretin hackers to block tweets and make comments disappear is Stalinesque.
Ron Brynaert (5e3edf) — 7/11/2011 @ 7:21 pmColonel Haiku: I think we need a Rod Serling inspired haiku regarding the last few posts. Brrrr.
Simon Jester (1d2f37) — 7/11/2011 @ 7:26 pmIs that the best you got, Simon Jester? Don’t you have any socks that can improvise?
Ron Brynaert (5e3edf) — 7/11/2011 @ 7:30 pmIs everybody involved – the so called performance artists, mainly i mean – in the smear campaigns against journalists who critique Markos just an utter criminal?
Or do they get shown out of context quotes that make them decide that helping to menace people who don’t say things they agree with is the right thing to do?
Ron Brynaert (5e3edf) — 7/11/2011 @ 7:34 pmHow many Billionaires for Bush are involved?
Ron Brynaert (5e3edf) — 7/11/2011 @ 7:34 pmhttp://youtu.be/SdQLCdeksiA
Simon Jester (1d2f37) — 7/11/2011 @ 7:35 pmI can’t think of a more “wretched hive of scum and villainy” then the one I jostled seven years ago. You Daily Kos thugs are scoundrels and should go form a communist simpleton anarchist jerk nation in a galaxy far far away.
Ron Brynaert (5e3edf) — 7/11/2011 @ 7:40 pmAs if I would click on anything you post, hacker Simon Jester…
Ron Brynaert (5e3edf) — 7/11/2011 @ 7:41 pmHi Ron,
Did you discover the Jennifer George name for Preston? If so, how did you figure out the name?
Did you select the JG in Cali for Preston to email on June 14, days before STLAH (supposedly) figured out the Jennifer George name?
koam @wittier (234826) — 7/11/2011 @ 7:49 pmI also find it interesting that my landlord, Vito Conigliaro is on twitter and is following an obvious spammer bot, too.
http://twitter.com/#!/vito_120689/followers
Here’s the followers of only follower of guy with same name as my landlord:
http://twitter.com/#!/Ariana_LE/followers
And here are that spammer is following
http://twitter.com/#!/Ariana_LE/following/people
I like the whole global thing, you hackers got going on…it’s really precious. Nothing like celebrating July fourth week with anarchist hackers from around the world.
BUT WAIT NOTHING TO LOOK AT HERE REAL PEOPLE AND SOCKS:
I read on Huffington Post it’s really the government that assumes fake identities, harasses and stalks people, so it must be the truth:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/03/17/online-persona-management_n_837153.html
Ron Brynaert (5e3edf) — 7/11/2011 @ 7:50 pmHi, Ken,
I don’t reveal sources to journalists or clowns or thugs or hackers.
Besides, all you do is manufacture evidence and fool stupid journalists. You are clowns.
Ron Brynaert (5e3edf) — 7/11/2011 @ 7:52 pmAre you that delusional, that any women you’ve harassed, Ken, and it’s mostly you doing the harassing here and on twitter, would believe your stupid misdirection and lies?
Ron Brynaert (5e3edf) — 7/11/2011 @ 7:54 pmDo you think anyone truly believes Jen Preston at The New York Times outed you? You did that yourself, obviously, you clown.
Ron Brynaert (5e3edf) — 7/11/2011 @ 7:55 pmBut I’m more curious about this whole ridiculous Chinatown scam y’all are pulling now, anyway.
Forget Weinergate.
Any hackers want to brag about that?
Ron Brynaert (5e3edf) — 7/11/2011 @ 7:57 pmRon,
And why do you think Preston told both you and Lee that she figured out that Lew Hunter had “punked us” and that Lew’s web site was fake? Does that make sense or was Preston working some angle?
koam @wittier (234826) — 7/11/2011 @ 7:57 pmgive it a rest, idiot, you guys make prank calls, and fake tweets, and fake facebook postings, and you terrorize countless people across countless sectors of american life
you’re the howard stern kevin smith crazies working the angles? we’re trying to be serious people and report news….you are hoods.
Ron Brynaert (5e3edf) — 7/11/2011 @ 8:01 pmi have close to ten sources…..i also have close to 30 stupid sock sources…i also know of well over ten people you’ve victimized in just this part of your marketing campaign.
Ron Brynaert (5e3edf) — 7/11/2011 @ 8:02 pmThis thread is surreal. Is ronbryn crazy, or just acting?
JD (e0b833) — 7/11/2011 @ 8:03 pmHow much are you getting paid, Ken?
You guys spend close to 18 hours a day conspiracy theorizing, menacing and hacking?
Did you learn it at Lee’s Horror Film Boot Camp?
http://www.dreadcentral.com/news/36381/want-make-a-horror-film-attend-horror-film-boot-camp
Ron Brynaert (5e3edf) — 7/11/2011 @ 8:04 pmJD,
You’re never funny. I mean seriously, goofballs, who do you think you are fooling? You are menacing punks.
I disagree profoundly with almost every conservative that posts at this site, but you guys are unamerican sickos for hurting people and shutting them out and menacing and thugging.
You make the Al Capone and Tammany Hall scandals look angelic because at least they didn’t delude themselves into thinking they were doing right and they had the guts to use their hands instead of moronic simpleton wit.
Ron Brynaert (5e3edf) — 7/11/2011 @ 8:06 pmUm, Ron? I’m not a nefarious sock puppet of some scheming evil genius. You certainly seem…excitable. The link, by the way, was to a Rod Serling youtube video.
I wish you well, and peace.
Simon Jester (1d2f37) — 7/11/2011 @ 8:08 pmRon Brynaert, I’d advise going to your pantry and throwing out any coffee you see that is not labeled “DECAF”.
Immediately.
SPQR (26be8b) — 7/11/2011 @ 8:11 pmSimon,
I sincerely apologize. I realize now you are a genuinely nice person. Could you please provide an email address or phone call so I could contact and apologize personally to you?
Ron Brynaert (5e3edf) — 7/11/2011 @ 8:12 pmthis is someone doing performance art, correct? Or is this what paranoia looks like?
JD (e0b833) — 7/11/2011 @ 8:12 pmSPQR, that made me laugh—it could have led to keyboard damage, but I am careful about drinking and reading these days.
Patterico, is this person for real?
JD, I don’t know.
Simon Jester (1d2f37) — 7/11/2011 @ 8:13 pmRon – Simon is one of the kindest peole you will ever encounter, and yu sole to him like the Rowhowser’s of the world deserve to be spoken to. Why in the world, after reading this thread, would h give out his phone or email address to you? Or, are you another one of those Neal R puppets?
JD (e0b833) — 7/11/2011 @ 8:15 pmJD, have twitter?
koam @wittier (234826) — 7/11/2011 @ 8:15 pmUsually, Simon Jester says something nasty like calling someone he disagrees with a “bitter and highly medicated little poseur.” But sometimes he pretends to be human not reading a script that’s meant to smear people as crazy:
https://patterico.com/2011/05/28/woman-who-got-photo-in-weinergate-story-wrote-newspaper-article-on-meetings-stars-via-twitter/#comment-797250
Ron Brynaert (5e3edf) — 7/11/2011 @ 8:16 pmNope, twitter is of the Devil.
JD (e0b833) — 7/11/2011 @ 8:17 pmokay, sock puppets, can you please do me one favor…and make me the fall guy in all your Weinergate theories:
I’m all the socks. I’m all the hackers. Or it’s all in my crazy imagination.
Just stop terrorizing everyone else.
Pick on me instead, and if you ever want to come say “hi” to me in real life, you know where i live…plus all the addresses I used to live, it seems.
Ron Brynaert (5e3edf) — 7/11/2011 @ 8:18 pmWhy do you think there are sockpuppets here, Ron? Is it because Lee posted here or something else?
DRJ (fdd243) — 7/11/2011 @ 8:22 pmI can haz puppets?
JD (e0b833) — 7/11/2011 @ 8:24 pmReal people don’t spend all of July 4th conspiracy theorizing at a conservative website because they get off in a sick way by mocking people they disagree with and scaring innocent women.
Do you ever stop playing games?
Ron Brynaert (5e3edf) — 7/11/2011 @ 8:24 pmronbryn Ron Brynaert
I left a few comments here starting at #1673 just now, that is if the hacker haven’t hidden them all yet with code: patterico.com/2011/06/30/som…
I saw this at Twitter…
Ron Brynaert, I don’t believe there is any code here. The commenters that have responded to you are long-time commenters. I think most of us are at a loss to understand why you’re thinking those who have responded are socks.
Dana (4eca6e) — 7/11/2011 @ 8:26 pmBrynaert, evidently making up stuff amuses you.
SPQR (26be8b) — 7/11/2011 @ 8:27 pmHey, Koam, did you used to post as danthrax at Daily Kos, just a wild guess is all…
Ron Brynaert (5e3edf) — 7/11/2011 @ 8:29 pmI love games. I heart them. Especially football games. And basketball. I truly hope you find the help that you appear to need.
JD (e0b833) — 7/11/2011 @ 8:30 pmOr is danthrax just a friend of yours…since i see both your names in this forum:
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=373002
Ron Brynaert (5e3edf) — 7/11/2011 @ 8:30 pmthat’s kind of a sick thread, koam, do you like young child stars?
Ron Brynaert (5e3edf) — 7/11/2011 @ 8:32 pmBrynaert, sock? You need to get your s**t in a sock. That’s the only relevant use of the noun here.
SPQR (26be8b) — 7/11/2011 @ 8:33 pmHey, Ken,
Maybe you can add a picture to this post, soon:
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=383990
Ron Brynaert (5e3edf) — 7/11/2011 @ 8:35 pmCoo coo. Coo coo.
JD (e0b833) — 7/11/2011 @ 8:36 pma fifth dimension
ColonelHaiku (cc5c75) — 7/11/2011 @ 8:38 pmbeyond that which is known to
man there dwells Brynaert
Koam’s helpful hacking tips in forums:
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=189381
“Pretty simple instructions, unlocks the iphone 100% (with 1.02 firmware), works with any GSM provider.
Finally i can buy an iphone!!”
http://www.broadbandreports.com/forum/remark,2107736
“If there are 1,000 ways to hack past a router, let’s try and implement just one of them. I don’t have an opinion as to whether it can be done.”
Ron Brynaert (5e3edf) — 7/11/2011 @ 8:39 pmWhat would make someone say Lew Hunter’s site is fake and that its fakeness suggests that this whole thing goes way deep (suggesting powerful, scary, ruthless, etc. actors behind it)?
http://lewhunter.com/
She said it to two of her allied journalist/researchers, perhaps in confidence, and then they each let it out that she’d said it.
But why would she say that to each of them?
Maybe she didn’t say it. Maybe she believes it. Maybe she doesn’t believe it; maybe she’s not nutty, but says nutty things to them, sort of knowing that they’d let it out that she’d said it, marginalizing them in the process?
Why?
koam @wittier (234826) — 7/11/2011 @ 8:40 pmtwelve dancing rabbits
ColonelHaiku (cc5c75) — 7/11/2011 @ 8:40 pmsing about toilet paper
I give you Brynaert
Brynaert, are you utterly ignorant of the fact that unlocking one’s own phone to use it on other carriers, (or with Android phones, to install other versions of Android) is not exactly a moral turpitude offense?
Grow up.
SPQR (26be8b) — 7/11/2011 @ 8:41 pmthere are weapons that
ColonelHaiku (cc5c75) — 7/11/2011 @ 8:42 pmare simply thoughts and then there’s
Mister Ron Brynaert
Re: 1678 Ron Brynaert
Sue (24e46b) — 7/11/2011 @ 8:44 pmI understand you have been trying to protect scared sources, so may I pray for you and those you have been working to protect, sir?
This is interesting post by Koam:
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=418145&page=41
“Why does the OP say she died when CNN just posted this: http://www.cnn.com/2011/CRIME/01/09/…ex.html?hpt=T1 saying that she’s communicating now.
….
Did you call NPR or other media sites and spread misinfo after the shootings like what seems to be going on now, Ken?
Ron Brynaert (5e3edf) — 7/11/2011 @ 8:45 pmTime is one-way street
ColonelHaiku (cc5c75) — 7/11/2011 @ 8:47 pmThere is madness in town square
Do NOT panic, Ron
Brynaert, you’ve spammed the thread with links to someone named “koam” discussing the perfectly legal act of unlocking a cellphone, and discussing the potential threats to his own router/firewall.
If the purpose of your useless spam was to somehow imply that the koam above is a person with criminal tendencies, you have in fact only established that you are an ignorant moron.
SPQR (26be8b) — 7/11/2011 @ 8:47 pmpray for the colonel
ColonelHaiku (cc5c75) — 7/11/2011 @ 8:50 pmpicture the future robots
can be most helpful
Anyone with the starchild111 phrase and a bit of patience could link the JG name to it. A simple Google search for “starchild111” brought up the 123people page and if you looked to see where starchild111 was on the page, it showed as a Twitter Nickname for JG. All that was needed to get that far was Google, the starchild111 handle, and opening links and looking. (So when did Jen Preston and her researcher(s) know “starchild111”?) But how does one get from JG as a name to JG/CA in particular? There are a lot of JG’s out there, so why center down on just one or two? I am guessing it must have taken some inspired search techniques or special contacts, perhaps.
Sue (24e46b) — 7/11/2011 @ 8:53 pmwhat’s that I hear now?
ColonelHaiku (cc5c75) — 7/11/2011 @ 8:53 pmone seven three nine unless
I am late to game
Damn!
ColonelHaiku (cc5c75) — 7/11/2011 @ 8:54 pmRon seems to have no ulterior motives whatsoever. I will for sure click every link he offers at least two times. =)
Noodles (3681c4) — 7/11/2011 @ 8:55 pmKen Danieli aka Koam aka Wittier liked this article on Facebook: “Outlaw Justice: When Hackers Retaliate Against Cyber Security”
http://www.politicsdaily.com/2011/03/10/outlaw-justice-when-hackers-retaliate-against-cyber-security/
http://www.facebook.com/pages/Politics-Daily-Investigations/301319910700
Ron Brynaert (5e3edf) — 7/11/2011 @ 8:56 pm1737 Sue
Please demonstrate your Google search and just how simple it was. Please do the actual search, starting with “starchild111” only, dated prior to June 18, and show how you get to the name.
koam @wittier (234826) — 7/11/2011 @ 9:00 pmSo the point of your spamming, Brynaert, really is to make yourself look like a moron?
SPQR (26be8b) — 7/11/2011 @ 9:00 pmSorry i don’t know the difference between legal and illegal or immoral hacking (although i think hacking government agencies qualifies as the last).
So help me.
Why is Ken’s name on this? What does it mean?
http://www.attackvector.org/enumerating-email-addresses-using-search-engines-the-return/
Ron Brynaert (5e3edf) — 7/11/2011 @ 9:00 pmBrynaert, yes, you are indeed succeeding at making yourself look like a moron spamming away like a meth head begging for quarters.
SPQR (26be8b) — 7/11/2011 @ 9:03 pmattack vector and
ColonelHaiku (cc5c75) — 7/11/2011 @ 9:04 pmwhiskey tango foxtrot ron
what you want from me
Is this the same Ken?
http://www.yatedo.com/p/Ken+Danieli/normal/086cad25a4cf5a085bb268d5f958005a
Do you live in Canada or work for Pepsi or ride in a small car with 30 hacker clowns, Ken?
Ron Brynaert (5e3edf) — 7/11/2011 @ 9:06 pmBrynaert, you seem to be the clown here. A spamming clown. Time to grow up.
SPQR (26be8b) — 7/11/2011 @ 9:09 pmWho is Ron Brynaert? Why is he involved in this? Is someone paying him? Is he a dupe? Stayed Stuned…dun dun dun.
Noodles (3681c4) — 7/11/2011 @ 9:10 pmoh can’t wait…is the velvet revolution paying me or italian fascists or russian television?
LOL
anyway, just leave my sources and THE INNOCENT WOMEN ALONE!!!
Ron Brynaert (5e3edf) — 7/11/2011 @ 9:14 pmRon, are you related to the Petranos?
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/11/2011 @ 9:16 pmOh, no! Not the dreaded ALL CAPS attack!
SPQR (26be8b) — 7/11/2011 @ 9:16 pmWho are the Petranos, silly sock daleyrocks?
Ron Brynaert (5e3edf) — 7/11/2011 @ 9:18 pmRon – Do your own research, sockpuppet.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/11/2011 @ 9:20 pmI lol’d @ silly sock daleyrocks! hahaha
Ron, you must just be trying to play some kind of angle right?
From what I have gleaned from all your posts (and JP’s) is that you guys suspect someone like Rocksem or Wittier as the culprits of all this. Is that right? Did you or her come up with that theory? Both maybe?
Noodles (3681c4) — 7/11/2011 @ 9:23 pm1749 Noodles – if you’re really asking what he has to do with this:
Jennifer Preston is the NYT Reporter who wrote the article revealing that Tommy Christopher’s sources, “Betty & Veronica, & Betty’s mom” (Nikki, Marianela, & Patricia) had submitted fake IDs to Tommy.
You can look up the person you’re asking about, who reports that he was doing research for Preston on this story. He also said that JP promised payment to him, but he didn’t get paid. (She said she’d ask about at at NYT, I think.) He may have done some work on researching those fake Cali IDs and he may have done some work on figuring out the Jennifer George name for Preston, although I’m not sure exactly.
He published some of Preston’s DMs & emails to him to document this on his Twitter (click his name and scroll back through 6000 tweets or do a good google or twitter search) and on a blog.
http://whyareweback.blogspot.com/
koam @wittier (234826) — 7/11/2011 @ 9:24 pmBrynaert, accusing people of being sockpuppets is actually a vio of Patterico’s rules. Especially since you have no evidence and likely don’t even know what you are accusing people of, given your abject ignorance of all things internet.
SPQR (26be8b) — 7/11/2011 @ 9:28 pmThanks Koam. I was semi-serious. Really just trying to figure out what his angle is now. It seems very suspicious to me.
Noodles (3681c4) — 7/11/2011 @ 9:29 pmSPQR you might just be the only non sock here, aside from me, so perhaps you need the coffee.
Ron Brynaert (5e3edf) — 7/11/2011 @ 9:30 pm“I’m a longtime reader of this site”
Ron, I’m not feeling it.
“but I’ve never commented here before.”
Popping your cherry doesn’t have to be this painful, embarrassing or long lasting. Just sayin’.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/11/2011 @ 9:31 pmIt has always seemed to me that Pat and Lee were playing good cop bad cop and so were JP and Ron.
Noodles (3681c4) — 7/11/2011 @ 9:31 pmHe is probably Huma Weiners sockpuppet.
DohBiden (15aa57) — 7/11/2011 @ 9:31 pmBrynaert, you don’t even know what “sockpuppet” means. there are several regulars here and you continue to demonstrate that you are not the sharpest knife in the drawer.
SPQR (26be8b) — 7/11/2011 @ 9:32 pmSPQR – He’s definitely a few cans short of a six pack.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/11/2011 @ 9:34 pm1758 Noodles
koam @wittier (234826) — 7/11/2011 @ 9:34 pmI don’t think that’s doable or valuable
daleyrocks sock,
i was mocking 100 comments left by your friends, above, as you well know…everything is a game.
and SPQR, again, instead of fighting with a probable friend, do a search on the name of the socks you’ve aligned with on this page and every other one since June and mark the times they speak nonsense and contradict and take turns defaming all the people who run this website.
Ron Brynaert (5e3edf) — 7/11/2011 @ 9:36 pmBrynaert, oh no, I’m fascinated at the idea that you think that unlocking a phone is a moral turp offense to discredit someone.
That one will have me all atwitter for days, I assure you.
SPQR (26be8b) — 7/11/2011 @ 9:38 pmI’m hoping that for your next trick, you’ll call for my arrest and prosecution for rooting my phone and installing cyanogenmod on it.
SPQR (26be8b) — 7/11/2011 @ 9:40 pmHey, Brynaert, anyone in this screen cap remind you of yourself?
SPQR (26be8b) — 7/11/2011 @ 9:42 pmMy gut tells me Ron just wants some “socks” to click his links and see what he can see. Which would seem to say that he has no clue what’s going on. Of course I could be wrong. I have been many times before.
Noodles (3681c4) — 7/11/2011 @ 9:42 pmIs there an explanation for the above … besides the obvious: that Brynaert’s pharmacy is out of stock ?
SPQR (26be8b) — 7/11/2011 @ 9:55 pmhttp://www.facebook.com/PoliticsDaily/posts/156413591082977
Ken Danieli
Ron Brynaert (5e3edf) — 7/11/2011 @ 9:55 pmI can relate to your repo job. One of my first jobs in HS was sales at Hahne’s dept. store (now Lord & Taylor), where there were no cash registers and all sales were written up on slips by hand. We had terminals, the size of small calculators, on which we’d obtain authorizations for purchases on the store’s credit card. (Dept stores didn’t take Amex, MasterCharge, etc. back then.) The terminals went down frequently. I “hacked” (cracked) the code system so that I could predict the authorization code with 100% accuracy. So when terminals were down I could render a sale “approved” (even though it hadn’t really been and it was a small risk to the system if the customer turned out to be a deadbeat or the card was stolen). (The proper method would have been to phone in the sale for an auth #. But, of course, all the phone lines would be tied up when the credit terminals were down so the customer might have to wait for 20 mins while a sales associate was on hold waiting for the auth.) So the cracked code made for a lot happier customers and all of my older coworkers were pretty amazed that, at 17, I could figure out the right code. They’d all come to me for the digits rather than wait on the phone as they were supposed to.
Brynaert, now you are going to prove that you don’t understand credit card processing networks too?
You really shouldn’t trouble yourself, we could have guessed easily.
By the way, Brynaert, do you know how magnets work?
SPQR (26be8b) — 7/11/2011 @ 9:57 pmThis could very well be the real Ron Brynaert from what I can tell. It’s not his first comment here, although he may not remember commenting a long time ago. Just so you all know. If it is, my considered opinion is that he should seek immediate help. If I had a patient in this state, I’d make sure a doc 1013’d him ASAP as a potential danger to himself and/or others.
Stashiu3 (44da70) — 7/11/2011 @ 9:59 pmSo … Stashiu3 … you are thinking something stronger than caffeine, eh?
SPQR (26be8b) — 7/11/2011 @ 10:02 pmAnd I snag the DOI comment.
SPQR (26be8b) — 7/11/2011 @ 10:04 pmWhatever the cause, he’s even more unhinged than his ranting tweets about not getting paid. There’s not enough caffeine in the world to explain this.
Stashiu3 (44da70) — 7/11/2011 @ 10:10 pmRon – You’ve been tweeting that you need help for weeks. Ask Larisa Alexandrovna. She’s bug nucking futs for conspiracy theories and creative writing. She’ll help a colleague out!
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/11/2011 @ 10:11 pmRon – Scary Larry Johnson is also probably available.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/11/2011 @ 10:13 pmhttp://www.facebook.com/pages/Gary-Tuchman/28262511963?sk=wall
Ken Danieli
Gary…Ken from Myles at BU (’79-’83)… congrats on the reporting on CNN page that Obama’s COLB “is a computerized abstract of his birth information.” This is the first mainstream media report in which the nature of that 2007 document is accurately described. What I’d ask someone in the Obama campaign is why they had that document printed out in 2007, 8 months before they published it in response to questions. It seems convenient and prescient to have had that version on hand when the question arose. What was up with that? Best, Ken
April 26 at 10:41am · Like · Comment
Ken Danieli reference: http://ac360.blogs.cnn.com/2011/04/25/trump-claims-obama-birth-certificate-missing/
Ron Brynaert (5e3edf) — 7/11/2011 @ 10:17 pmApril 26 at 10:41am
That’s not helping, Brynaert.
SPQR (26be8b) — 7/11/2011 @ 10:20 pmhttp://www.facebook.com/notes/tea-party-patriots/demand-to-defund-npr-grows-as-newly-released-video-confirms-bias/10150111036788823
Ken Danieli
Remember that all the things that NPR’s Ron Schiller said about the Republican Party (white, conservative, un-Christian-Christians, middle-American, gun-toting, racist, xenophobes) …secretly caught on tape…were the same things Obama said about blue-collar Democrats who were voting for Hillary Clinton in droves….secretly caught on tape at a small private fundraiser with wealthy San Franciscans.
Ron Brynaert (5e3edf) — 7/11/2011 @ 10:20 pmOh, wow, Brynaert, that one … that’s the smoking gun.
SPQR (26be8b) — 7/11/2011 @ 10:21 pmyep, koam aka wittier is a staunch republican..hey, whomever’s paying, he’ll support, i guess:
http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=2208286653&v=wall&viewas=0
Ken Danieli Help Hillary Clinton get VP nod:
There is currently a poll on the WSJ – Wall Street Journal that asks which person Obama should pick for VP.
Hillary is currently #1 with 27% of vote out of 7 candidates.
We can help build her lead!
http://online.wsj.com/public/resources/documents/info-flash08.html?project=OVOTE08
Ron Brynaert (5e3edf) — 7/11/2011 @ 10:22 pmJuly 26, 2008 at 6:12pm · Like · Comment
Brynaert, next you should search this website for any signs of koam.
SPQR (26be8b) — 7/11/2011 @ 10:23 pmLarisa and Larry are not my friends, sock puppets. Everyone who knows me personally knows about the former, and my attacks on larry johnson are all over the net:
http://whyareweback.blogspot.com/2006/06/defending-howard-kurtz-part-1001.html
Ron Brynaert (5e3edf) — 7/11/2011 @ 10:24 pmhttp://www.boomantribune.com/story/2006/6/21/32418/6117#18
Me to Larry Johnson:
Your comment was despicable.
And it’s not just right wingers who have criticized you.
Rove-like tactics, my ass. You used Coulter-like tactics. Rove isn’t dumb enough to sign his name next to his hate.
Ron Brynaert (5e3edf) — 7/11/2011 @ 10:27 pmIs Socrates really Neal R or just connected?
Here’s him sliming me:
Regular blogger? I had like five posts in the history of brad blog….and he tried to sucker me into doing his blog for free in march..
http://allaircraftarenotinvolved.freeforums.org/fintan-hertzberg-kos-du-brad-bev-and-the-raw-story-t160-30.html
There was a regular blogger during BradBlog’s early days. Apparently he had the scoop on Jeff Gannon. His name is Ron Brynaert. Guess where he works now? At the Raw Story with Larisa Alexandrovna he is the executive editor. It now appears that convicted bomber Brett Kimberlin bankrolled both Raw Story, BradBlog, and AfterDowningStreet. We have Burch stalking a sex therapist and messing around with Wikipedia.
Ron Brynaert (5e3edf) — 7/11/2011 @ 10:30 pmRe: 1742 koam @ wittier
I don’t know how to do a search prior to a particular date, sorry.
On the morning of June 19th, I had heard about the “starchild111” name. I don’t do Twitter or Facebook, but out of curiosity, I did a Google search. I only entered “starchild111”; that was all the information I had. I opened each link that came up and did a Command F for “starchild111” to see where it was on the linked page. There were some UFO related things. And there was a 123people page, specifically when I clicked the link it took me to http://www.123people.ca/s/jennifer+george and if you go down to IMs/Microblogs, there is a Twitter entry showing Jennifer George with Nickname: starchild111. But the Twitter page was gone when I clicked the link on the page.
I mentioned it in comment 185 at 11:03 am on 6/19/2011 on https://patterico.com/2011/06/18/timing-weinergate-nikki-reid/comment-page-5/
By then the name “Jenay” was being mentioned, so I speculated that maybe “Jenay” was perhaps “Jen(nifer) A.” or something similar.
I also mentioned it in comment 1285 of this thread on 7/4/2011 at 5:47 pm.
I discovered later that the 123people.com page had the same Twitter link for the JG name. http://www.123people.com/s/jennifer+george under IMs/Microblogs on page 3. I will note that the JG/CA @blogarsay Twitter name shows up separately in those lists.
But all I started with on June 19th was “starchild111” entered in a Google search and a bit of methodical curiosity. I assume if someone else knew the handle earlier on, as they very likely did, then they could have done the same.
What I still don’t understand is how we got from Jennifer George, which has a great many search results across the country, to one or two or even a few possible choices for the owner of “starchild111” Twitter account. I understand that JG/MA told Lee that the account was hers (past tense). However, I don’t understand the link that led anyone to JG/CA, or anywhere else in particular, for that matter. I kind of assumed I missed the clues because I don’t Twitter or do Facebook, and maybe there was something there that others picked up on.
Sue (24e46b) — 7/11/2011 @ 10:31 pm“Larisa and Larry are not my friends”
Hah! A diversionary comment. Create the illusion of dissent.
We are on to your game Ron.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/11/2011 @ 10:34 pmyou slime have tarnished my name with jason leopold’s for years…he was fired by raw story…and i have publicly battled him for years…and when i took over raw story…i began freezing LA out partly because she supported bullshit “rove indicted” story and is tight with larry johnson and other freaks in vr.
I do admit not realizing that brad was just as slimy as the rest…but anyway…they’re all working with you guys anyway….so you can slime good journos…peace, losers….
http://newsbusters.org/node/6563
Ron Brynaert (5e3edf) — 7/11/2011 @ 10:36 pmRon – Raw Story is a cesspool of conspiracy theories. You teethed on stories like Weinergate.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/11/2011 @ 10:37 pmWhy is Ron harassing our sources?
LEAVE OUR SOURCES ALONE!!!
Noodles (3681c4) — 7/11/2011 @ 10:38 pmdaley, go have some more beers with liberty chick and keep thinking you can sell me as some kind of larisa bad journalism accomplice.
i have tons of IMs, emails, etc that show the truth.
i never would have posted any docs at bradblog, anyway, suckers, because i didn’t at raw story…
i shut out two Democratic campaigns for giving me phony stories….huff ran them instead.
Ron Brynaert (5e3edf) — 7/11/2011 @ 10:38 pmbye, socks, you all sound rather disjointed, get back on script and i’ll see you in my philip k dick dreams!
Ron Brynaert (5e3edf) — 7/11/2011 @ 10:40 pmWhy is Ron spending July 12 outing sources? Does he not know on this day in 1984 Walter Mondale announced that he had chosen Representative Geraldine Ferraro of New York as his running mate?
Sounds kind of unpatriotic to me.
Noodles (3681c4) — 7/11/2011 @ 10:41 pmMr. Brynaert, I am praying for you and for those you are trying to protect. Take care, sir, and best wishes to you.
Sue (24e46b) — 7/11/2011 @ 10:43 pmRon- I don’t know you and I don’t know your circumstances, but the way you sound online is very similar to people I’ve known who were having manic episodes. Have you ever been diagnosed with such a condition?
MayBee (081489) — 7/11/2011 @ 10:55 pmI think we could understand you better if you could just rest and then comment.
If this is not the case, I apologize. We all need a little help sometimes, no?
Maybee, I thought you weren’t a sock. Guessed wrong.
Anyone else borderline want to comment on my mental condition – which is straight from strandedwind script – when confronted by a critic?
Thank you, so much, Sue. There are tons of commenters that have been mocked and intimidated off this website. I can’t wait until they can all come back someday.
Ron Brynaert (5e3edf) — 7/11/2011 @ 11:01 pmSue,
Everyone locked on to Jennifer George in CA becuase of the UCLA follow on the Jenay twitter screencap.
Once you got to the jennifer+george+ucla JG(CA) is the first name that Google returns.
The bigger question why was JP contacting JG(CA) on June 14!
Note for Wittier: the Google search results have expired but on June 19 at 12:30 PM ET, I was able to find hits only with starchild111. There were hits in 123people.fr / .de / .ca ( multiple countries ).
Joe
Joe Smith (54c0c1) — 7/11/2011 @ 11:10 pmMaybee’s not a sock, or perhaps you don’t really know what the word means. Also, I’ll comment on your mental condition. You have one. Get help.
No charge.
Stashiu3 (44da70) — 7/11/2011 @ 11:23 pmMayBee, you are far too kind. I’m still not sure if this is performance art or not. But I tend to trust Stashiu3’s opinion on this kind of thing.
Later, we all getting together for the Trilateral Commission meeting, right? What was the password, again?
Sorry.
Simon Jester (1d2f37) — 7/11/2011 @ 11:28 pmyawnnn,,,
starchild111 (5807dc) — 7/11/2011 @ 11:36 pmMaybee’s right that his ranting is consistent with someone in a manic phase, whatever the underlying diagnosis might be. He’s also shown significant paranoia, delusional thinking, perseveration (combined with tangential thinking… not an easy thing to do), and grandiosity. How much is from a pathological process and how much springs from an underlying personality disorder would be a lively debate among professionals.
The bottom line is that he really needs to seek help, get properly diagnosed, and started on treatment. He sounds ready to implode and quite possibly become dangerous to himself and/or others. I’m not kidding or taunting him when I say that. I’ve seen worse, but they were already inpatients.
Stashiu3 (44da70) — 7/11/2011 @ 11:39 pmSock, using an anonymizer. Yawn indeed.
Stashiu3 (44da70) — 7/11/2011 @ 11:42 pmron dear,
being unemployed takes it’s toll on people and those unemployment checks run out. however, the government pays well if you can show you have some mental disorder or appear to.
luv starchild111
starchild111 (5807dc) — 7/11/2011 @ 11:48 pmActually, Sue, if you’re the same one that left all the above comments, obsessed with a woman people keep smearing who has nothing to do with any of this…and who lol is pushing the nonsense that Preston outed koam (instead of you hackers hacking her account)….i take that back.
Your role is to appear reasonable once in a while…but you socks are silly if you think the harassed woman in california is going to blame anyone more than Lee for harassing her. And every time one of you chuckleheads refers to her it’s harassment since she has nothing to do with this.
And um my saying leave her alone is not pulling her into this.
See you later, Andrew Breibart aka Andrew Breitfart aka ?
Ron Brynaert (5e3edf) — 7/11/2011 @ 11:49 pmIn normal society, people don’t mock anyone for being crazy.
So if I were unfortunate enough to be suffering from some mental illness, no one reasonable would take the word of people who mocked me.
And, um, only Kos peeps would be mocking here, now, since there isn’t any conservative with a real name attached attacking me.
Ron Brynaert (5e3edf) — 7/11/2011 @ 11:52 pmHappens all the time in normal society, it’s just not nice.
“If” seems to have been passed about 20 posts ago. It has reached the point of “what type?”.
Finally, I am a conservative and have a real name here. It’s just not the one on my birth certificate. There are reasons for that. My online persona is a pretty accurate reflection of my real-life persona… about 90% “okay-guy”/10% ass (okay, maybe 60/40, I wouldn’t quibble over anything in between.)
Seriously, get help.
Stashiu3 (44da70) — 7/11/2011 @ 11:59 pmRon, do you smoke a lot of weed?
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/12/2011 @ 12:10 amsmoking weed can make peas look really really tasty
happyfeet (3c92a1) — 7/12/2011 @ 12:19 amThis keeps getting more and more surreal!
Ron, I’m sure your research skills are teh bomb, but don’t you think that commenting now just drives the story even more?
∅ (e7577d) — 7/12/2011 @ 3:11 amand Pat was thinking – hey – lets have a monster thread – what could go wrong?
EricPWJohnson (a60276) — 7/12/2011 @ 3:21 am1773. “do you know how magnets work?” made me laugh out loud.
Cleanup in aisle three. Cleanup in aisle three, please. Holy @#$%buckets. I think for a small while, Ron convinced Jen Preston that she might not even be Jen Preston, that everything she knew was wrong, and she communicated that to Lee. The other possibility is that she just doesn’t want people to know what she knows.
Ron is either
1) acting, which I doubt, but if he is, he’s doing a heckuva good job.
2) having some kind of paranoid meltdown
3) has been getting spun in a million directions by some evil players who have sent him into a paranoid meltdown.
Ron, for what it’s worth:
1) Not every KOAM on the Internet is KOAM/Wittier.
2) His name emerging from a harvester script that uses Pepsi as an example is hardly noteworthy.
3) Not every Ken Danieli will be KOAM/Wittier
4) If it is him, showing an interest in hackers is not such an outlandish thing.
5) If it is him, having supported Hillary Clinton is not such an outlandish thing.
6) If it is him, jailbraking an iPhone is hardly an outlandish thing.
I’m sure there’s much more as I stopped reading halfway through.
Remember how in A Beautiful Mind, John Nash has filled a room with yarn connecting a million things he’s pasted to the wall? Spiderwebs of information, all seemingly connected, but the guy is stark raving bonkers.
Seriously Ron, you seem like a good guy operating on information overload, and possibly cracking under the weight of some people trying to spook the @#$% out of you. I’ve given you a share of crap, which you probably deserve, but I don’t like to see you going over the edge.
Even if you are privy to real clues of What This Is All About (which I doubt, but must allow the possibility), in the state your in, you’re in no position to unravel them.
I can see where a campaign to drive you bonkers (a short ride?) would be attractive to players out there, be they politically motivated, or just in it for the lulz.
If you’re being threatened, call the police. If others tell you they are threatened, advise them to call the police. Then take some deep breaths and disengage, at least until you can distinguish signal from noise.
Summary: I think Ron is KOAM.
jeffeneff (707f3d) — 7/12/2011 @ 4:00 amRon,
I really don’t know you. If you are the guy I spoke with on the phone, then you have been responsible about certain information, which I appreciate. If you’re on the up and up, it sounds like people have been messing with you. That has apparently made you overly suspicious, to the point where you think longtime commenters here are sock puppets, or that I was an imposter when I last called you.
Stashiu3 has a background in treating those with mental health issues. I don’t mean to insult you when I say that if he says you should get help, you might consider it. Which is not to say there aren’t sock puppets on Twitter, email, and perhaps your phone who are messing with you. My guess is that is happening.
Patterico (f724ca) — 7/12/2011 @ 4:39 amI admit I wanted to get to 2000 comments, but this wasn’t really the way I wanted to do it.
Patterico (f724ca) — 7/12/2011 @ 4:41 amPat
I was trying to be funny I guess the operative word was trying..
EricPWJohnson (a60276) — 7/12/2011 @ 4:53 am1789 Sue
1800 Joe
Google lets you search using a specified date range. This lets you search as if it were an earlier date so that the results aren’t impacted by what has gone on since that date.
On the Google page on your search results, look in the left column for setting dates. You can then set a Custom Range to end on June 17. For “starchild111” I get 10,600 results. Where does 123people come up in those 10,000+ results? And you made it to page 3 of the results at 123people?
If you have “Jennifer” (not “Jenay”) and “starchild111” you can find it easily. With “starchild111” only prior to June 18, it’s very difficult, I think, to find Jennifer’s name.
We don’t know how Preston focused in on JG CA. Maybe her researchers know.
We know how Lee focused in on JG CA. Lee had the 123people page and went through the links to several of the JGs there. JG CA has a detailed background online and Lee though her work at a magazine was of interest. That’s why he says he emailed her. But perhaps Lee was in contact with others in figuring this out too? Hard to say.
koam @wittier (60c14e) — 7/12/2011 @ 5:06 amStashiu
Dont diagnose people on the internet or try to use you unverified status as a health care professional to make judgements
We all dont know who you are – and I refuse to accept the premise that a sock which BTW you certainly are – which anyone who is blogging anom is – nothing more than a sock – is some kind of expert without verification – can legally dispense medical advise on a thread
You’vr made way to many mistatements about me on this blog for anyone to take you seriously
EricPWJohnson (a60276) — 7/12/2011 @ 5:08 amYeah Stashiu, only scientist and lawyers have valid opinions. Get with the program!
Click.
∅ (e7577d) — 7/12/2011 @ 5:17 amCheck.
Click.
o
Stashiu is a best a troll who makes ugly statements and cant handle discussions
he’s the last person I would allow or take any medical advise or any advice from
EricPWJohnson (a60276) — 7/12/2011 @ 5:21 amFirst an attack on DRJ, then this.
And there have been other problems too.
It’s too much.
I have placed your IP in moderation while I think about what to do. Eric, you’ve been personally very kind and supportive. But you’ve gotten on the wrong side of my most trusted commenters. Your comments will be in moderation for a while, while I think about what to do about this.
I don’t like banning people and this is not a ban — at least, not yet. But honestly, you need to think long and hard about how it is that you are at odds with people as solid as Stashiu and DRJ.
Patterico (f724ca) — 7/12/2011 @ 5:33 amBy the way, Stashiu hasn’t diagnosed anyone. He has said that Ron needs to get help and GET a diagnosis.
I don’t mean to insult Ron when I say Ron should at least consider it.
Patterico (f724ca) — 7/12/2011 @ 5:38 amEric,
You’re a good guy and Patterico knows it.
Ron Brynaert (5e3edf) — 7/12/2011 @ 5:39 amIgnore these trolls…and thanks.
Ron,
Last comment and then off to work.
I just placed Eric in moderation for calling two longtime commenters “trolls.”
With you, I’ll let you go for a while because it’s interesting in a weird sort of way and nobody is taking your accusations seriously. But if you’re not some kind of jokester yourself — a possibility I do not entirely discount — then I ask you to take a deep breath and reflect on what has been said.
Off to work. Have a nice day.
Patterico (f724ca) — 7/12/2011 @ 5:43 amI admired Stash’s piece about Gitmo, and his general comportment on this site. But dispensing unsolicited professional medical advice in the comments section of some dark corner of the internet isn’t defensible. I’m not saying Brynaert doesn’t appear to be having a weird internet- induced psychosis. But I’m rocking back and forth sitting in a bowl of butterscotch pudding flipping cards into an old bowler hat wearing one sock and an old robe, so what do I know? Oh, and I, for one, will not miss EPJW.
Birdbath (19803d) — 7/12/2011 @ 6:07 amYour characterization of my blog as “some dark corner of the Internet” factors in to my assessment of your comment’s credibility.
Patterico (7f0df6) — 7/12/2011 @ 6:31 amBirdbath – I’m just sitting in a lawn chair in front of my computer only wearing two tone underwear, yellow in front, brown in back, sipping a few beers. I may decide to shower today, then again I may not. A/C’s only been busted a few days. Nothing wrong with me.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/12/2011 @ 6:42 am1789 Sue
The starchild111 handle was well-known long before June 18-9.
Even though Tommy had redacted the names in his original stories, because he believed that these were actually teenagers and that they were using their real names, the unredacted versions were out on other blogs and lots of people were already discussing that name. The fact that some people didn’t try to protect the “girls” by blocking out their names was a point of controversy at the time. However starchild111 was easily findable because she had tweeted back and forth with GC, GL, etc. and that had been discussed going back to the first weekend after the AW photo tweet (and of course discussed publicly by #bornfree crew prior to that.)
koam @wittier (60c14e) — 7/12/2011 @ 6:59 amRon- I do think you are doing a good job with research and I believe you that some people have been horrible to you. I’m just such a mom, I mother everybody.
MayBee (081489) — 7/12/2011 @ 7:03 amMayBee – Mom, you dressed me funny.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/12/2011 @ 7:05 amThat was effing funny, birdbath. This thread is surreal. Scratch that. Surreal is a gross understatement.
JD (b98cae) — 7/12/2011 @ 7:15 am==Ron,…but don’t you think that commenting now just drives the story even more? Comment by ∅ — 7/12/2011 @ 3:11 am==
Why yes. Interesting observation that.
elissa (a3e02f) — 7/12/2011 @ 7:19 amNot a fan of Birdbath, but I did enjoy this:
But I’m rocking back and forth sitting in a bowl of butterscotch pudding flipping cards into an old bowler hat wearing one sock and an old robe, so what do I know?
SPQR (26be8b) — 7/12/2011 @ 8:28 amPatterico– Judge my credibility by whatever standard you choose. My apologies for insulting your blog. It was not intended.
Birdbath (19803d) — 7/12/2011 @ 8:36 amRon, as someone who has been very interested in whether you’re just a victim of these bastards or not, and coming at this in good faith, please consider taking a couple of weeks break from this story.
I don’t have much knowledge of mental illness, but I think normal people can have issues, get rattled and simply look much worse than they really are online.
You come across, online, as grandiose. You respond to people in a way that suggests at the very least, a damn irritating unfairness. At the same time, like EPWJ, sometimes when you’re not being unfair it really does appear that your heart is in the right place.
The way you’re trying to dig up KOAM’s private details seems ridiculous when considering his level headed analysis of the facts and his opinions. He just doesn’t have that coming to him. Your claim about Socrates is horrible and unfair, given how Neal has treated his IRL name’s reputation.
And ignoring that, there’s the issue of your timing, which hypes up the story when it subsides, and also your timing behind the scenes (Ron and I have never been in contact, and I’m not talking about his timing with me). That and your affiliation with Larissa and Leopold’s website is sufficient for you to want to be more careful. You should behave in a way that shows you recognize these factors, instead of acting like it’s awful to have common sense about them.
I’m not trying to attack you… I just think you should consider how you come across. I’d be an idiot to trust Raw Story content. It was a con artist’s tool, associated with scumbags, and then suddenly it turns over a new leaf? Isn’t that what a con artist would say?
So while I can’t pretend to know that you’ve got any mental issues, Ron, and I do find it entirely plausible that you are being screwed with by these bastards (Neal et al) I think you are overwhelmed. I can’t blame you. This stuff ticks me off, and I’m not a player. Spend some time away from the internet.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/12/2011 @ 9:01 amThis is a bit of a non-sequitor, but I thought I would share this bit of local comely coed sock-puppetry.
Congressmen, beware.
http://www.wtvr.com/news/wtvr-james-dollins-facebook-porn-arrest-20110711,0,7150460.story
SarahW (af7312) — 7/12/2011 @ 10:55 amDustin,
Could you please forward your name, address and phone number to Patterico so my lawyer can get in contact with you at a future date for this smearing comment you left on July 5th:
https://patterico.com/2011/07/05/neal-rauhausers-new-friend-brett-kimberlin-speedway-bomber/#comment-816283
A bogus arrest that was expunged, I’ll add. After the website owner removed the Alicia Pain illegally obtained expunged police record, your job was to make sure others read about it.
No one is fooled by your act anymore, Dustin. You socks have been on this forum for years, and smart conservatives misled into defending you will google your conflicting, smearing comments.
later, socks!
Ron Brynaert (5e3edf) — 7/12/2011 @ 11:19 amUm, the comment you left is the truth. Someone named Alicia Pain did in fact leave a comment with your personal information. I emailed Patterico and asked him to delete it, which I believe is how he discovered the comment initially.
Read about what? That someone was trying to give inappropriate information about you? I didn’t mention what the information was. And everything I said was the truth. If you are threatening to sue me for telling the truth (that someone did post information about you) then you are a scumbag, Ron. You are threatening to sue people in order to strategically prevent people from criticizing you.
Please sue me. I am entitled to attorneys’ fees, court costs, and punitive damages against the party that filed a strategic lawsuit against public participation. Fortunately, the law in my jurisdiction protecting me from thugs like you came into effect a mere three weeks ago. Saved by the bell!
I haven’t tried to smear you, Ron. You probably know that. If you don’t, then you’re an idiot.
There’s the comment you’re saying was my smear of you. Where’s the smear? That really happened.
So why, Ron, are you lying about me and trying to shut me up? I think we both know exactly what.
My advice: get a good lawyer before you sue me.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/12/2011 @ 11:57 amExcuse me, I meant to say the comment I left was the truth.
When I said ‘the comment you left was the truth’ that suggests Ron is accurate, when in fact, he’s completely wrong.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/12/2011 @ 11:58 amBTW, it’s important to me that none of these idiots get my phone number. Those who know it are asked to keep that to themselves.
Why would Ron want to know my phone number? He doesn’t need it to sue me.
/things that make you go hmmmmm
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/12/2011 @ 12:00 pmLee on radio says, “police involved now. Weinergate became a personal problem… nothing else to say”
so he took a week off radio because of pressure..but now he’s back
http://www.blogtalkradio.com/show3.aspx?userurl=stranahan&year=2011&month=07&day=12&url=technology-creativity-jobs
koam @wittier (60c14e) — 7/12/2011 @ 12:03 pmHe says you aren’t allowed to call him about Weinergate. 🙁
347-945-5235
koam @wittier (60c14e) — 7/12/2011 @ 12:04 pmWhy is Ron threatening people here?
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/12/2011 @ 12:07 pmKoam, if you were to ask Lee about Weinergate, what would you ask him?
I have heard a lot of wild accusations about this guy (and believe me, he and I are not pals), but is there anything he knows that we don’t also know? Asking him to explain his certitude seems like a stale query.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/12/2011 @ 12:08 pmYou may contribute to my legal defense fund here.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/12/2011 @ 12:10 pmWell I’m trying to listen to his self-invented economic theory right now. (He’s convinced himself, but he doesn’t have it right. But, suffice to say, he thinks Obama has it right…on economics.)
And the sound is messed up. So I’m trying to think and listen. Blowing my bandwidth.
koam @wittier (60c14e) — 7/12/2011 @ 12:13 pmDustin, Naughty!!
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/12/2011 @ 12:13 pmIn threatening to sue Dustin, Ron takes a page from the Kimberlin/Rauhauser playbook.
Patterico (678ac7) — 7/12/2011 @ 12:16 pmWhat I mean is I’m trying to think seriously about your question, while listening too.
What would we want to ask Lee?
I’ve asked most of the questions before, so searching back would be the best method.
But a couple of questions I remember are:
What’s the timing of the events around JG MA’s call to him and the filing of the police report?
Please list everything he said to JGMA on the call, June 19.
What have the police told him?
And that’s not dialing it back to the biggest or most important questions, just naming a few that I know are out there.
koam @wittier (60c14e) — 7/12/2011 @ 12:20 pmWhile it is nice to have a short break from someone’s lies and BS while they are in moderation, this thread has certainly shown there are plenty of people ready to step in and keep things interesting.
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/12/2011 @ 12:20 pmKoam, yeah, to say the least, I don’t agree with his view on how technology is ruining our economy.
Technology creates wealth. Some don’t really grasp how that could be. They think it’s a zero sum game out there. If you replace 18 tellers with one machine, why, all that wealth just concentrated in the ATM company’s hands.
But in reality, we simply made manpower more valuable.
For example, Ron probably spent less than 30 seconds thinking about whether to try to be thug to me, issuing a stupid legal threat. In the old days, it would take much more time, and someone like that wouldn’t even be capable of getting the job done. Technology makes everyone richer.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/12/2011 @ 12:24 pmI grant this. I just wonder if it’s productive to keep asking them.
Yes, some details would be nice. I’ve also asked Lee for details and shown frustration when he hasn’t offered them easily. To say the least.
Anyway, he’s already saying he refuses to talk about this, and frankly, I do not think he’s mistaken to leave this to law enforcement.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/12/2011 @ 12:26 pmAnthony Weiner deserves to be ran out of town on a rail.
DohBiden (15aa57) — 7/12/2011 @ 12:29 pmMachinist, aw shucks, you are just saying that to make me blush.
SPQR (26be8b) — 7/12/2011 @ 12:30 pm“Koam, yeah, to say the least, I don’t agree with his view on how technology is ruining our economy.”
Dustin – There are actually more bank tellers today than there were 15 years ago, so Obama’s analogy was hosed from the start, but not many people are pointing that out. They are instead going with the gut intuitive sense the argument makes without examining the underlying facts, which Obama got dead wrong.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/12/2011 @ 12:40 pmNever trust Obama on economics is the real lesson.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/12/2011 @ 12:41 pm1853 Dustin
Unfortunately for those of us following this, several people who are known to have info have quieted down of late.
We know how people become so convinced of certain deductions that they call them facts.
I hope that anyone who’s talking to the police reflects before telling them that certain things are facts. The police aren’t going to really help if they can’t discern facts from beliefs.
And, based on the tweet that Pat put out a couple of days ago, we have to wonder if the police are still pursuing this with effort or not.
Another question:
koam @wittier (60c14e) — 7/12/2011 @ 12:42 pmWhat was he thinking taking the biggest call of his life and going to Preston with it? We can see how that turned out. (JG goes to cops. JP tells Ron Lee’s trying to screw her, according to http://whyareweback.blogspot.com/)
Was Preston punking him on the “Hunter is fake” thing?
Why didn’t Lee just go to cops after JG MA called?
1856 daley
koam @wittier (60c14e) — 7/12/2011 @ 12:43 pmis there a source for that stat? send it to Lee.
koam – I don’t plan on communicating with Lee.
I forget whether I heard it on Rush or Medved while I was in my car. One of those two I believe, more likely Medved.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/12/2011 @ 1:03 pmkoam #1859:
In response to President Obama’s recent claim that ATMs have replaced bank tellers, The Economist provided these stats:
Is that the stat you were asking about?
Also, this is my minor contribution to get comments to 2000.
DRJ (fdd243) — 7/12/2011 @ 1:06 pmDaley, DRJ, I had no idea Obama was wrong on the facts about tellers too. I just thought he was being a unfair about productivity itself.
That he’s doubly wrong is pretty hilarious.
I’m not really worried about Lee’s take on it, though. I am ‘saying nothing at all’ rather than saying something not nice.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/12/2011 @ 1:19 pm1861 DRJ
very interesting, thanks. hope someone makes a 1-minute video of this starting and ending with the President’s quote.
sorry, all of this is off topic, but I thought people might want to tune into Lee while he was on the air in case he broke his promise and started talking weiner. That was the reason for my original posts about his radio show being on live, and rather unexpectedly.
koam @wittier (60c14e) — 7/12/2011 @ 1:19 pmFolks, with Teh Narrative, it is NEVER about facts. It is about feelings.
So the details aren’t important to the Left.
Which is why Gitmo isn’t as important as it once was. Same dealio.
Simon Jester (c8876d) — 7/12/2011 @ 1:24 pmIf you listened, did Lee talk about Weinergate?
DRJ (fdd243) — 7/12/2011 @ 1:25 pmDRJ – The BLS reported in 2010 that banks employed 536,380 tellers. My guess is that figure is down from yours due to the bank closures and mergers since 2008.
http://www.bls.gov/iag/tgs/iag522.htm
The year 2000 total was 492,250 assuming I have the equivalent category.
http://www.bls.gov/oes/2000/oes433071.htm
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/12/2011 @ 1:25 pmkoam – Repeat after me, never trust Obama on economics.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/12/2011 @ 1:30 pmYou know? If this trend continues, Lambchops will be sueing Kermit over copyright infringement.
cap'n john's nephew (d29614) — 7/12/2011 @ 1:30 pm1865 DRJ
I captured most of what he said above.
The rest was about how Obama’s right about the economy and why Lee has to homeschool his kids.
koam @wittier (60c14e) — 7/12/2011 @ 1:51 pmOf, I see Ron has been talking about me on his twitter account. Apparently I’m a liar for noting Obama was an ACORN lawyer or something. (the link Ron provides to explain that Obama was not an ACORN lawyer includes this fact: “Obama and two other attorneys represented ACORN in a 1995 federal civil lawsuit against the state of Illinois”) I think Ron was too stupid to read his own link. Obama was an ACORN lawyer, and yes, ACORN had a hand in the mortgage bomb.
Also, he’s noting I criticized Jeff G in March as evidence I’m not a legitimate conservative. It’s true, I have disagreed with Jeff G, RSM, and even Patterico and Aaron here upon occasion. I disagree with people all the time.
And Ron’s threatening to sue me. Actually, he’s not threatening. He insists this is his intention. If he does not, Ron is a liar. If he does, I will have some interesting discovery and some of Ron’s money. Either way, Ron is a thug and a failed bully.
Funny, this started when I noted Ron’s timing and affiliation with the Larissa and Leopold blog.
Of course, just because I’m sideways with someone doesn’t mean they are part of a grand conspiracy. Only idiots and cons say stuff like that, Ron. You are one of those two.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/12/2011 @ 1:54 pmkoam,
Are you referring to “… police involved now. Weinergate became a personal problem … nothing else to say”? That’s probably a good idea.
DRJ (fdd243) — 7/12/2011 @ 1:55 pm1871 DRJ
That was most of it. I summarized there. If you listen to the first 5 minutes, that would likely cover all Weiner mentions. It wasn’t much.
koam @wittier (60c14e) — 7/12/2011 @ 2:09 pm1870. Someone who would rickroll a person is capable of almost anything.
jeffeneff (707f3d) — 7/12/2011 @ 2:16 pmYeah, I really appreciate that Lee has seen the bigger picture. I don’t mind if he wants to promote Obama’s ideology. I mean… by all means disagree, but if he’s not talking about Weinergate, I’m not going to push him on that.
I understand Koam’s desire of details. I found Patterico’s tweet regarding that rude officer disturbing. But Lee’s got a good reason to move on to other stuff.
—
BTW, I’m struck by how Ron is complaining about his personal details being broadcast, and in the same breath, he demands personal details be broadcast. It’s as though he’s learning all the wrong lessons from these thugs, and merely trying to play their game too.
Is there any doubt Ron wouldn’t do to me what ‘Alicia’ (Neal, I assume) did to him? Of course, I have no criminal record. That’s part of why he would try to bully me. Some people react to my attempts to be polite as sign of weakness. Hence his much harsher reaction to me, a person who simply asked him to take a break, compared to his reaction to people who simply assert he needs to get help for his mental state. That’s why he’s not filing to discover who Alicia Pain is, but rather suing the person who actually tried to help him.
It’s been a consistent theme for a long time in my interactions with folks like Ron. They will turn on someone who is trying to help them, because in their warped minds, being genuinely nice is a sign of weakness.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/12/2011 @ 2:18 pmWell, I want to make clear how seriously I take Ron’s threat.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/12/2011 @ 2:18 pmI don’t know if the comment numbering 1K problem has been fixed and then unfixed, or if it only works on some computers.
I was seeing the first digit 1 on a different computer. It isn’t here now. After 999 I see 001 to 099 and then 100.
Sammy Finkelman (d3daeb) — 7/12/2011 @ 2:28 pm1876 Sammy
What computer?, what browser?, any interesting plugins?, try a different browser on the same computer?
koam @wittier (60c14e) — 7/12/2011 @ 2:33 pm1877 Sammy
What operating system?
On my Dell Vostro , Windows 7 64-bit, I tried it on 4 browsers. All show the 4-digit post numbers.
Browsers: Chrome, IE 32-bit, IE 64-bit, Firefox
koam @wittier (60c14e) — 7/12/2011 @ 2:35 pmA standalone home Macintosh using Firefox and oS/10 showed all 4 digits.
A networked Windows computer running Internet Explorer did not. I am not sure of the version number.
Sammy Finkelman (d3daeb) — 7/12/2011 @ 2:42 pmProlly shouldn’t be using IE anyway (no offense intended).
The numbers look good to me.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/12/2011 @ 2:44 pmIf I use direct deposit for my paycheck will I take away a job from a hard working American? Because I’ll quit before I do that.
Birdbath (19803d) — 7/12/2011 @ 2:45 pmFor many browsers, right click on the page, view source. If the four digits show, and I’d be floored if they didn’t, it’s likely some quirk in the way your browser processes the margins of the page.
jeffeneff (707f3d) — 7/12/2011 @ 2:46 pm1882 jeff
In View Source in Chrome, I see the post numbers that are 6-digits, starting with 81…like we see in the URLs
koam @wittier (60c14e) — 7/12/2011 @ 2:50 pmThis is a great comment thread. I’ve read books that weren’t this long or this interesting.
DRJ (fdd243) — 7/12/2011 @ 2:51 pmRon’s threat to sue Dustin comes off like the Jerky Boys ‘Hurt at Work’ bit. “I’ll sue you, I’ll sue everybody!” (Not to diminish the threat, Dustin)
Birdbath (19803d) — 7/12/2011 @ 2:53 pmDRJ, like car crashes, whacky manic crash-n-burn behavior has a fascination to the human mind.
SPQR (26be8b) — 7/12/2011 @ 2:54 pmNo offense intended, of course, and I would appreciate if Ron would be a man and apologize for his threat, which to be honest I am not losing sleep over, but was extremely unfair.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/12/2011 @ 2:55 pmintended=taken
I’m just not typing what I’m thinking today.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/12/2011 @ 2:56 pmComment by Dustin — 7/12/2011 @ 2:18 pm
People like DRJ and Stashiu3 have fine reputations for honesty and integrity because they have earned then by their consistently honorable conduct over years both here and elsewhere online.
Some people such as myself recognize that we will never have such reputations because we just don’t have the strength of character to measure up. We are inspired by their example to try and be better to be the best we can be. I think there are a number of examples of that type of person in the commenters here.
Others are consumed with envy and jealousy because they so crave this kind of reputation but they see they have so damaged their credibility with their lies and hypocrisy over the years that they will never be able to earn that kind of reputation and respect, even if they clean up their act. Their reaction is to try to smear the best amongst us to try to bring their reputation or image down closer to theirs. We have seen those too, both here and on the left, where they attack the military heroes or honorable leaders who their own people can’t live up to.
Remember how different the character of the Whitehouse was when Bush replaced Clinton? Imagine how different it will be when Obama is replaced. The difference between these Democrats and the Republicans that replace them is not the difference of their views but the difference in their characters and integrity.
Perhaps this might suggest a reason for some of the reactions you encounter?
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/12/2011 @ 3:13 pm“I’m just not typing what I’m thinking today.
Comment by Dustin — 7/12/2011 @ 2:56 pm ”
If I typed what I thought I would be in so much trouble, assuming anyone could even understand it.
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/12/2011 @ 3:15 pm1883. Koam, yeah, I see now that the whole thing works by some sort of function I don’t quite understand, probably some javascript function pulling the thread comment # from a database.
jeffeneff (707f3d) — 7/12/2011 @ 3:34 pm“If I typed what I thought I would be in so much trouble, assuming anyone could even understand it.”
Machinist – I know what you mean. Some days I just gotta wrap my head in yellow caution tape to prevent strange spillage.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/12/2011 @ 3:35 pmIt’s not like I even have that much going on in there.
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/12/2011 @ 3:37 pmIt probably does.
Though I don’t want to flatter myself. For one thing, I was much nicer and more fair to Ron than he deserved. It’s no point of pride for me.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/12/2011 @ 4:15 pm1884: This is a great comment thread. I’ve read books that weren’t this long or this interesting.
Comment by DRJ — 7/12/2011 @ 2:51 pm
I haven’t said half the things I want to yet.
Sammy Finkelman (d3daeb) — 7/12/2011 @ 4:44 pmDustin,
I’m sorry you’re lying and smearing me and spreading misinfo that my vow to sue you for mentioning my name and an illegally obtained police report in the same sentence is any kind of a threat.
I’m sorry you fooled Aaron and Pat for years at this site, when they can easily google your comments and see that your job is to create division by smearing their critics… Your motives are more transparent than anyone else’s, almost every comment you leave is the “good cop” portion of the smear campaign.
Ron Brynaert (5e3edf) — 7/12/2011 @ 5:04 pmLike a dog returning to his own vomit.
SPQR (26be8b) — 7/12/2011 @ 5:09 pmOne last question to all friends of Wittier…
Did any of you ever work with Ken Danieli in real life? You know, when he had that job where he hacked/cracked authorization codes so that people can use stolen credit cards at the department store he worked at…
Because that most definitely is a crime. Usually, credit card thieves pay a percentage of their stolen good booties to friendly cashiers like that.
And actions like that, even if you aren’t working with the thieves, it still hurts consumers because it makes it harder to stop fraudulent credit card use.
My comment is still up there even though ken quickly deleted his comment.
https://patterico.com/2011/06/30/someone-smarter-than-me-explain-why-this-is-not-possible/#comment-818600
Ron Brynaert (5e3edf) — 7/12/2011 @ 5:20 pmcolonel rise work hard
ColonelHaiku (cc5c75) — 7/12/2011 @ 5:30 pmcome home after long, long day
and Brynaert still rant!
where is the justice?
ColonelHaiku (cc5c75) — 7/12/2011 @ 5:32 pmEnergizer Bunny got
nuthin’ on Brynaert
gonna party like
ColonelHaiku (cc5c75) — 7/12/2011 @ 5:38 pmit one nine zero one peeps
can I get amen
Colonel,
Some think, according to the Mayan Calander, twenty-twelve is supposed to be the end-times.
cap'n john's nephew (d29614) — 7/12/2011 @ 5:56 pmI have my doubts.
if Jon Cusack could
ColonelHaiku (cc5c75) — 7/12/2011 @ 6:04 pmtime travel Mayans would cut
head off for acting
It’s a legal threat.
Obviously.
Jackass.
And yes, you have vowed to sue me. Do it. In my jurisdiction, I am entitled to damages for what you are saying you are doing.
And yes, I mentioned that someone named Alicia posted personal information about you. That’s about as detailed as I got in public, but I could legally spell out everything I read on that report if I wanted to. There’s nothing wrong with that. It’s no smear to tell the truth. The only reason I’m not doing that is because I think it would be wrong.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/12/2011 @ 6:06 pmAnd let the record here reflect how Ron behaves towards people like me who have tried to help him repeatedly.
He treats them to ridiculous legal threats the moment he hears a whisper of criticism. Ron feels he has the right to promise lawsuits against anyone who participates in free speech in a way Ron doesn’t like. He complains about smears, but he’s going on and on about how he knows I’m a sockpuppet, working with Neal Rauhauser. I don’t know if Ron is hiding something important, or just a thug for petty reasons.
Everyone out there interested in giving Ron the benefit of the doubt, as I have, should be aware that he has promised to sue me at the drop of a hat.
This is the comment he is claiming he wants to sue me for, but that comment was in no way critical of Ron. I didn’t even remember his last name when I wrote it.
No surprise that he had no problem with this comment until immediately after I criticized him about a completely different matter.
Again, Ron, while I do feel law suits are painful and expensive, and they do naturally inhibit my desire to participate in discussions about public events and politics, I have faith in the legal system, and the SLAPP provisions of my jurisdiction, and feel I could have your lawsuit dismissed, and with costs and damages against you. I feel it’s important that we all stand up against bullies like you, Ron. I don’t even know if I should hope you’re working with Neal (which would be terrible, but speaks poorly for his efforts) or against him (in which case, he is no doubt laughing at this pathetic BS on your part).
But like I said, you’re with Raw Story.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/12/2011 @ 6:34 pmand
So Ron will have a month to prove a prima facie case that I am somehow doing whatever he’s claiming I’m doing, or I get some of his money.
If anyone would like to opine on this, let me know, but of course, I would need to hire a professional to file the motion to dismiss. Apparently I will not get more than limited discovery (which I don’t see how I’d need much of).
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/12/2011 @ 6:53 pmI’m not with Raw Story, and any reasonable person knows that…and you’re just being incredibly silly after menacing me and my sources, Dustin.
(There were over 1,500 comments in this thread before i said a word, many by you, many mocking me, many espousing conspiracy theories, many pretending to back Patterico against Lee.)
You kids and horrible howard stern addicted adults just have no morality. Even when it’s obvious you’ve been exposed, you continue to play games.
The police record was expunged. It was illegally obtained by your hacker friends, but you were dumb enough to attach your name to the smear, Dustin, so until I know who Alicia Pain is, you are the first hacker sock fool I’m suing.
Ron Brynaert (5e3edf) — 7/12/2011 @ 7:28 pm“No surprise that he had no problem with this comment until immediately after I criticized him about a completely different matter.”
Another lie, Dustin, since you watch my twitter and Patterico’s and you know darn well I complained to him about it the other day. I’m still a little miffed it hasn’t been removed, but I’ll only be suing you over that particular comment.
Ron Brynaert (5e3edf) — 7/12/2011 @ 7:38 pmI just saw that Richard Cohen, Opinion Writer for The Washington Post, has an article entitled “Anthony Weiner, victim of a digital mob”.
I can’t think of an appropriate comment.
Sue (24e46b) — 7/12/2011 @ 7:41 pmActually, this is basically all I know about you, other than the fact you’re promising to sue me.
I don’t know who your sources are. If I’ve menaced them they deserved it. I probably didn’t menace them, though. If you’d like to link wherever I menaced them, go ahead. I’m guessing you are again lying about me. You say a lot of things about me that simply aren’t true, while whining that I’m smearing you. That’s called projection.
Like that. What basis do you have to suggest that I’m friends with anyone involved with reporting your police record?
So you’re asserting I’m a sock, and a hacker, and you have no evidence for that, other than the fact I criticized how crazy you sound and that you clearly need some time off.
I don’t actually want to be sued, obviously, and it doesn’t escape me that I’m a very loud critic of Brett Kimberlin, repeating many of the claims Socrates made, and that Brett and friends sued him, learned his name, and then broadcast lies about this innocent man, claiming he is a cyberstalker.
But there’s nothing I can do about it. Either I let you bully me out of my freedom to discuss the Anthony Weiner scandal and Brett Kimberlin, as well as your behavior, or I prepare myself to be sued, and face the suit head on.
Thankfully, my jurisdiction offers me very strong protections against bullies like you.
You, Ron, are a bully who won’t get me to shut up.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/12/2011 @ 7:45 pmFrom 200 posts ago, I give you Brynaert– “…you’re the howard stern kevin smith crazies working the angles? we’re trying to be serious people and report news…”
This ‘trying to be serious people’ seems to have run aground.
Birdbath (19803d) — 7/12/2011 @ 7:45 pmForget it Sue, it’s Crazytown.
SarahW (af7312) — 7/12/2011 @ 7:46 pmI think we discussed integrity earlier. Generally that requires a degree of courage and a belief in taking the high road.
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/12/2011 @ 7:50 pmBrynaert, well you’ve succeeded in making yourself look like a blustering moron. Demonstrating your utter ignorance of so many things, and showing that while you don’t actually know what defamation is, as a tort, you can commit it.
SPQR (26be8b) — 7/12/2011 @ 7:50 pmFormer Congressman Anthony Weiner is no longer relevant. The new headline is, “Digital Mob, Victim of Digital Mob”.
Birdbath (19803d) — 7/12/2011 @ 7:54 pmRe: 1912 SarahW
Sue (24e46b) — 7/12/2011 @ 7:57 pmDid someone hand out confusion pills without proper labels or something? The MSM news is contradictory lately, too.
Well, actually, I have found the MSM news to be contradictory most of the time, so maybe that’s not a recent change. 🙂
Sue (24e46b) — 7/12/2011 @ 7:59 pmMy link above failed.
Anyway, suffice it to say the reason I associate Ron with the extremely disreputable Raw Story, website I believe was founded in party by Brett Kimberlin, is because Ron is or at least very recently was affiliated with Raw Story.
As I am not an idiot, I do not follow Raw Story or Ron’s daily dramatics very closely, so if Raw Story actually fired Ron, or Ron quit Raw Story, I have yet to hear of it. Not that I care.
Brett’s playbook is to threaten or file lawsuits. I’m one of Brett’s louder critics, following many of the points raised by the guy Brett recently sued. While I can not the case would be bogus, I can’t entirely laugh off the potential a violent criminal involved with Raw Story will learn my name because of the bullying tactic of Ron Brynaert over someone divulging some of Ron’s history.
Also, I want to add that the reason I notified Patterico of Alicia’s comment about Ron was because it had his address and phone number. And possibly his DL, though I’m not sure. I do think it’s scummy to bring up unrelated crimes from long ago, but Ron screaming that it’s illegal to obtain or discuss this doesn’t ring true to me. They screwed Mike Stack this way too. It’s a low blow, but I don’t think it’s illegal in the slightest.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/12/2011 @ 8:05 pmTwo words my friend: Diminished capacity.
Not a fan of the concept in general, but it may apply.
Stashiu3 (44da70) — 7/12/2011 @ 8:07 pmPardon my typos.
Anyway, is it true that Brett Kimberlin helped found Raw Story? I know Larissa Alexandrova wrote there.
I really don’t pay attention much. I figure even scumbags and con artists have the right to free speech. If they want to spread insane theories about Republicans, I’m not going to stop them.
But I’m also not going to trust anyone affiliated with Raw Story, especially those threatening to sue Brett Kimberlin’s critics.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/12/2011 @ 8:07 pmIt’s not like I would go after the guy. But I really have no choice if he sues me but to hire an attorney and aggressively ask for what I’m entitled to.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/12/2011 @ 8:08 pmRon – Are you still a 9/11 Truther?
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/12/2011 @ 8:11 pmDustin,
Respectfully, I think you tried to reason someone out of a position they didn’t reason themselves into. Whether this is calculated or compulsive, taking him seriously isn’t worth your time. Either he is intentionally provocative and won’t actually file anything, or he’s delusional and it won’t go anywhere since you’re clearly in the right.
I lean towards the latter, but that may be due to my own biases. I think anyone actually trying to be this incoherent would do a better job of it.
Stashiu3 (44da70) — 7/12/2011 @ 8:16 pmOkay, roughly 75 to go until 2000 comments. I don’t expect bells, whistles, or fireworks… or even some tremendous revelation, but if Patterico says, “Now, let’s go for 3000!!”, well, it won’t be pretty. 😉
Stashiu3 (44da70) — 7/12/2011 @ 8:20 pmThe words “spittle flecked” do come to mind when I see his comments.
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/12/2011 @ 8:24 pmThe voyage to 2,000 has certainly been colorful. The road to 3,000 might just take us through the Twilight Zone.
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/12/2011 @ 8:27 pmSorry, wrote my 8:16pm comment before I read yours. I didn’t mean to imply that you shouldn’t protect yourself, just that you:
Stashiu3 (44da70) — 7/12/2011 @ 8:27 pm1. won’t get much, if anything (he’s unemployed).
2. probably won’t ever see him actually file because he either knows it’s frivolous or is too disorganized to follow through.
Thanks for the insightful comment, Stash. I admit I do not really know what to make of Ron.
I don’t think even this is sufficient to accuse him of being a serious player in these events.
Anyway, I just want it known that I’m not like Socrates. I will actually deal with this directly and actively. I may not be rich, but I can certainly afford a lawyer to file a motion to dismiss. I know that is the only way to react to this. And for the record, legal threats like this do cause me some concern for whether I should continue openly discussing the Anthony Weiner scandal or Brett Kimberlin or this petty jerk Ron. But I just refuse to shut up.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/12/2011 @ 8:28 pmThat’s probably true. But I’ll cross that bridge when I get there. Hopefully I won’t.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/12/2011 @ 8:31 pmI seriously find it simultaneously sad and unnerving to witness Ron Brynaert apparently coming undone. I also confess it has a bit of the train wreck effect: can’t look, can’t look away.
Heading toward 2,000.
Dana (4eca6e) — 7/12/2011 @ 8:31 pmThe new season of Warehouse 13 started on Hulu. Talk about truth being stranger than fiction. That was completely believable compared to this story.
Stashiu3 (44da70) — 7/12/2011 @ 8:32 pmHey, Stashiu3? You like “Warehouse 13”? It reminds me of that old “Friday the 13th” series (the one with the cursed antiques). “Warehouse 13” is lighter and certainly funnier. I wish I had a Tesla pistol.
I am fond of “Justified,” as well.
Simon Jester (d2d83b) — 7/12/2011 @ 8:35 pmI’ve only posted maybe…I think…about 4 times (please don’t hold me to that number, its in the single digits, I’m sure)…once under this name, the rest under Surreal (stopped using that…since this nick is the one I have on the Bigs and now twitter)
But, the reason I’m commenting…I know mania. The barrage of words, ideas…hop, skip, jump from one concept to another.
I read this and all that’s going through my mind is “damn…is that what it looks like from the outside?” My husband must be a saint…
That’s all. Just my.02 contribution to the almighty 2000.
ppk_pixie (7a67da) — 7/12/2011 @ 8:36 pmDefinitely funnier, and the new agent (Jinx?) had me cracking up. We could sure use him here, eh?
“That’s a lie!”
🙂
Stashiu3 (44da70) — 7/12/2011 @ 8:37 pmI like Eureka better, but Warehouse has its charm,
ian cormac (d380ce) — 7/12/2011 @ 8:39 pmIf you haven’t seen “Justified,” you might like it. Do check out the pilot. Worth your time.
Simon Jester (d2d83b) — 7/12/2011 @ 8:39 pmIs that “ppk” a Walther reference?
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/12/2011 @ 8:40 pmI think this thread, has gone clear past ‘the Mutaran nebula’
ian cormac (d380ce) — 7/12/2011 @ 8:41 pmSimon Jester,
Hulu only has clips, no full episodes. I haven’t checked cucirca or tvshow7, but I’ll look around. We haven’t had cable for years, so I have to find shows I like online.
Stashiu3 (44da70) — 7/12/2011 @ 8:44 pmRon, someone I care about has a mental problem, and was blessed with a family that has been supportive. This person is doing very well now. What once seemed like a permanent and huge problem is now just a fact of life that is easily dealt with on a daily basis with tremendous success. And happiness.
You will probably interpret this as some kind of veiled insult, but I am compelled to try to help you.
You probably qualify for MetroPlus. Their number is 800-303-9626. One with financial challenges in need of mental health care (which I don’t think is something to be ashamed of) could call that number and arrange a diagnosis.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/12/2011 @ 8:44 pmYou’re a good man Sir.
Stashiu3 (44da70) — 7/12/2011 @ 8:48 pmYes.
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/12/2011 @ 8:51 pm1944 was a very good year!
And that is my contribution towards 200.
jmel44 (d9a8f5) — 7/12/2011 @ 8:52 pm1937. Is that “ppk” a Walther reference?
Machinist- yes, Walther .380, a mother’s day gift from my son.
ppk_pixie (7a67da) — 7/12/2011 @ 8:53 pmDarn. Missed by 1 and also meant 2000.
jmel44 (d9a8f5) — 7/12/2011 @ 8:54 pmNice son. 🙂
Stashiu3 (44da70) — 7/12/2011 @ 8:56 pmThank you kindly, Stashiu…I’m sorta fond of the boy 😉
ppk_pixie (7a67da) — 7/12/2011 @ 9:04 pmRe: 1944 ppk_pixie
Sue (24e46b) — 7/12/2011 @ 9:06 pmI agree with Stashiu3, “Nice son.” Also, intelligent and thoughtful. You are well blessed. 🙂
And, clearly, so is he… 🙂
Sue (24e46b) — 7/12/2011 @ 9:08 pmSue, what a lovely thing to say- thank you!
And yes, I am blessed, in my family, my life. They keep me well grounded.
ppk_pixie (7a67da) — 7/12/2011 @ 9:14 pmThank you, Ma’am. That does sound like a great gift and implies a wonderful relationship.
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/12/2011 @ 9:29 pmDustin, a lot of people falsely believe that “expungement” means that information disappears from the public domain. It does not.
SPQR (26be8b) — 7/12/2011 @ 9:44 pmYeah, that would be strange, actually. Why would the courts get to order the public to never again mention something someone did or was accused of? I can certainly understand of Ron was actually innocent and didn’t want to be associated with something he didn’t do (note that this is not at all what he’s claiming… he clearly did the crime).
But it’s not like I’m running around broadcasting any of his personal information. Though I’m tempted to. I just remember that this is what they did to Mike Stack, and how unfair I felt it was. Ron’s offenses, whether he’s guilty or not, have no bearing. I simply wanted to make sure when someone said NancyDrew had left that information that I corrected the record.
But it’s not like Ron had the slightest problem with my doing so until I criticized his later behavior. This is simply he best attempt to find something to shut me up with.
I might be a blowhard, but I stand by the things I’ve said. Ron has tested my patience, though.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/12/2011 @ 9:50 pmAnd when I say I’m tempted, I only mean the crime. Not his contact info, which should be off limits. When someone makes this big a deal out of their ‘expunged’ record, and how they will sue someone for the most tangential relationship to it being discussed, it’s like he’s begging for it to be discussed again.
I see no legal reason not to, and really no moral one, either. But it’s a low blow.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/12/2011 @ 9:53 pmI’ve never regretted taking the high road. I have regretted not doing so too often.
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/12/2011 @ 10:26 pmYeah, you’re right. I appreciate your comments, btw.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/12/2011 @ 10:29 pmWeiner is a democrat so it is impossible.
DohBiden (15aa57) — 7/12/2011 @ 10:31 pmI’m up waiting for the results of the Janice Hahn election, btw.
Somehow, for reasons I simply cannot fathom, she will probably win.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/12/2011 @ 10:31 pmMissed my birthday year comment by 1 year! 1958 was a very good year.
My contribution to the bimillennial comment.
Brother Bradley J. Fikes, C.O.R. (8bc067) — 7/12/2011 @ 10:41 pmBrother Bradley,
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/12/2011 @ 10:48 pmKeep going and maybe you can catch it in base 11.
I thought they said there wasn’t going to be any math. 🙁
Stashiu3 (44da70) — 7/12/2011 @ 10:49 pmWow,
What a side trip. Now can we get back to the thread topic.
It seems that everytime we make a little forward prograss on the real players, someone tries to sidetrack the thread.
Joe
Joe Smith (54c0c1) — 7/12/2011 @ 10:50 pmJoe Smith,
I would contend this thread was zombified long ago. Without new information, we’d just be rehashing what’s already been said. I applaud your focus and thank you for all you’ve added. Sorry if the silliness got annoying, we do that now and then.
Be well my friends, I’ve been up far too long.
Stashiu3 (44da70) — 7/12/2011 @ 10:59 pmJoe, last thing I want to do is distract from getting to the bottom of the threats and manipulations. I honestly have no idea where to proceed.
Neal is posting more insane crap about Patterico.
He again asserts Socrates was behind it too, with no evidence. He just wants to throw the name in there as many times as he can, I guess because he’s a thug.
He claims this:
Which at this point should require tremendous evidence, given Weiner claimed exactly this and then admitted he lied about it. The idea he was telling the truth and then said he was lying in a way that ended his term of office is so implausible as to be amazing. I am simply amazed Neal expects his audience to accept this. Yet I think they do.
He then links this complaint from Brett Kimberlin, which is ridiculous but amusing to read just how angry Brett is that ACORN was busted.
At any rate, here’s Neal’s smear:
He then goes on to demand prosecuting Clarence Thomas’s wife for being a lobbyist.
All this from a guy who admits to being a liar for political ends, and has backed up the claims of a proven con artist and violent felon, Brett Kimberlin. And I guess I should throw on that Neal is actually associated with hackers and sockpuppets. I know Ron baselessly threw that charge out in a way that muddied the waters, but I’m not doing so baselessly.
Neal says in that link
That’s a group of hackers.
I don’t know why Ron would throw these charges at me so unseriously if he’s interested in getting to the bottom of what’s going on . Ron knows just how serious these people are. Why treat this issue so recklessly? The people behind the actual crimes here deserve to go to prison, and throwing baseless charges is a smokescreen that protects them.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/12/2011 @ 11:16 pmGood night, Sir.
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/12/2011 @ 11:19 pmOops! My error Brother Bradley. Base 11 is the wrong way but 2,615 is 1958 in base 9. Only 650 to go in base ten.
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/12/2011 @ 11:28 pmNeal also links a torrent tracker including hashes for emails and passwords of tens of thousands of military members. Any script kiddie can get a program that can break the kind of hash they are talking about, so this is a major think Neal is helping along.
He claims to be working with politically oriented hackers on the one hand, and publicizes this kind of ‘booty’ found by politically oriented hackers like he’s just passing along the news with sadness.
It’s too cute by half.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/12/2011 @ 11:37 pmThirty four comments,
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/13/2011 @ 1:51 amSo little yet so many.
It waits for morning.
Two thousand he says,
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/13/2011 @ 1:53 amWe are almost there tonight.
What dark paths await?
Almost four AM,
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/13/2011 @ 1:56 amDark thoughts scamper through the mind.
A state we know well.
To sleep, perhaps dream,
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/13/2011 @ 1:59 amIn the bed or in the chair.
Keyboard embossed face.
Thirty more Haiku?
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/13/2011 @ 2:04 amThat would be unprincipled,
and way too much work.
Meandering thread
jeffeneff (707f3d) — 7/13/2011 @ 4:49 amslouches toward two k and
asks, “Who is John Reid?”
Neal Rauhauser
Patterico (f724ca) — 7/13/2011 @ 5:34 amHas a new post. In comments
Talks about my house
There is no New Rule
Patterico (f724ca) — 7/13/2011 @ 5:39 amThat comments must be haikus
Though it might seem so
We will never get
Patterico (f724ca) — 7/13/2011 @ 5:45 amTo two thousand comments if
Y’all keep writing poems
That’s funny; I was just gonna ask if there was a new rule.
koam @wittier (68bbff) — 7/13/2011 @ 5:48 amGood Morning!
Did anyone send for the police report from Boston?
cap'n john's nephew (28dda5) — 7/13/2011 @ 5:54 am1977 cap’n
Good question. You’d think Lee would have.
And did anyone ask Adam at STLAH about that fake JGCA comment that only showed up days after it’s date-stamped?
koam @wittier (68bbff) — 7/13/2011 @ 6:05 amCrickets…………too early in the morning, I guess
cap'n john's nephew (28dda5) — 7/13/2011 @ 6:05 am1977 cap’n
If that “order it for yourself for $5” info was real and, if so, if it would have given you the full report without deleting important info.
If there were a crime with a victim filing a report, is that public info? Would it be in victims’ interests in general to have every report go public while cases are still open? Does anyone know if you could really get a recent report like this released?
koam @wittier (68bbff) — 7/13/2011 @ 6:20 amI was thinking about it, but felt like I would be prying into someone else’s business at the time.
cap'n john's nephew (28dda5) — 7/13/2011 @ 6:21 amNot being a journalist or investigator, it felt awkward to me.
a new day dawning
ColonelHaiku (cc5c75) — 7/13/2011 @ 6:52 amdoes colonel have time for cup
and scrambled Brynaert?
Colonel,
I was hoping to be around for the 2000 moment, but I’ve got to leave for the day. So, I will
leave you with this question:
Three socks in a laundry basket – What did they say?
cap'n john's nephew (28dda5) — 7/13/2011 @ 6:59 amPatterico #1973…. He seems pretty careful about what he says. But what he is doing is facilitating and encouraging nonsense suits against you. It’s all about the Alinsky approach, sadly.
What to do? Bosely indeed.
Simon Jester (d2d83b) — 7/13/2011 @ 7:47 amif socks could talk the
ColonelHaiku (cc5c75) — 7/13/2011 @ 7:56 amtales they’d tell after many
miles in moccasins
1984 Simon
GA pegs it as 63% Likely Male,
koam @wittier (68bbff) — 7/13/2011 @ 8:00 amFWIW.
Simon – Neal fails to mention the connection between Patterico and Socratease was so tight that a judge refused multiple motions in Kimberlin’s ridiculous suit to compel Patterico to divulge any information he had about Socratease. THEY.WERE.JUST.THAT.CLOSE.
Kimberlin’s suit and its motions make interesting reading. Classic stair-stepping your way into making a suit through the discovery process. Nothing there except unsupported allegations in the initial filing. Nothing.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/13/2011 @ 8:03 amI think the goal is to harass opponents so much that they go away, Alinsky style.
Simon Jester (d2d83b) — 7/13/2011 @ 8:07 amif neal rauschnauzer
ColonelHaiku (cc5c75) — 7/13/2011 @ 8:08 amdon’t mind his p’s and q’s he
will be neutered dog
Countdown mood music.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/13/2011 @ 8:08 am“I think the goal is to harass opponents so much that they go away, Alinsky style.”
Simon – Yes and they went nuts when they saw the U.S. Chamber of Commerce potentially taking a similar course. Irony, it’s what’s for breakfast.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/13/2011 @ 8:11 amI like the comment over there that AW’s tweets to teen gals were AOK.
No mention that Weiner used the s-word in message to (real-) teen Ethel in the same manner that he used it with his naughtiest (so far) GF (the blackjack dealer, who’s closer to his age), and
AW used the f-ing-word in DM to (now allegedly fake-) teen Nikki (whose profile said teen & who was asking him to prom), according to docs her “dad” released on these pages.
koam @wittier (68bbff) — 7/13/2011 @ 8:16 amNo doubt that’s a big part of it. But I think Brett is beyond ideology, and motivated by revenge.
It’s pathetic. You’d think after so much time being a BSer he’d have a better read on how not to sound like an obvious liar. But no, there’s really very little indication he’s a successful liar just because he’s been lying for a generation or more. One might think he’s a master of fooling, but that’s just because the internet makes it possible to attract very special groups of people. In this case, true fools who would believe 9/11 was an inside job and Iranian hackers are stealing city council elections and Weiner was hacked into admitting he wasn’t hacked. He’s a master of finding nuts and telling them what they want to hear.
Has anyone ever corroborated a single Kimberlin conspiracy theory? Neal’s been asked repeatedly to back up his claims about Seth being involved, and he simply ignores that and repeats the ‘may be involved’. But no, he obviously wasn’t involved. The creeps picked a name out of a hat and smeared it.
Anyway, I asked earlier if it was true that Brett Kimberlin co-founded Raw Story. Anyone have any idea about that?
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/13/2011 @ 8:21 amWhy can’t you tell jokes about the Jonestown Massacre?
The punchlines are too long
/get it? The meta irony? Did it change your life?
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/13/2011 @ 8:29 amHighly Scandalous:
qritiq (1440aa) — 7/13/2011 @ 8:32 amhttp://wp.me/p6l52-fa
1994 Dustin
Reminds me of Powers Boothe as “Dad,” Freaky movie; he did a great job, though.
koam @wittier (68bbff) — 7/13/2011 @ 8:37 amPoetry with my breakfast? Delightful! 🙂
Sue (24e46b) — 7/13/2011 @ 8:39 amkoam, good documentaries are my favorite entertainment.
Sad story.
So here’s another meta joke:
Two nuts took a walk in the park.
One was a salted.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/13/2011 @ 8:41 amComments go astray
Sue (24e46b) — 7/13/2011 @ 8:46 amThen return as they may choose
Two thousand beckons…
and we’re on it
ColonelHaiku (cc5c75) — 7/13/2011 @ 8:47 amCongratulations!
Sue (24e46b) — 7/13/2011 @ 8:48 amtwo thousand and one
ColonelHaiku (cc5c75) — 7/13/2011 @ 8:49 ama space odyssey not this
time my cheeky friends
I heard Neal Rauhauser eats his own poop.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/13/2011 @ 9:02 amThat would explain how he’s full of it
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/13/2011 @ 9:08 amcoprophilia
ColonelHaiku (cc5c75) — 7/13/2011 @ 9:15 amand ten tabs of Dulcolax®
rilly ring neal’s bell
mister rauschnauzer
ColonelHaiku (cc5c75) — 7/13/2011 @ 9:17 amenema of the people
think he real hot poop
off to a bad start
ColonelHaiku (cc5c75) — 7/13/2011 @ 9:19 amgo all scatological
must get my sh*t straight
Neal, and his like-minded fellows, are simply evil. Not wrong-headed or misguided. Evil.
Stashiu3 (44da70) — 7/13/2011 @ 9:55 amThis ungodly hour,
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/13/2011 @ 11:14 amFinds comments have passed the mark.
Congratulations.
Rauhauser means rabid ankle-biting rat dog in Austrian.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/13/2011 @ 11:15 amThe One isn’t fluent in Austrian.
koam @wittier (68bbff) — 7/13/2011 @ 11:18 amSo you have Kimberlin, Ayers, add this fellow to the panoply:
Pursuant to an FBI investigation, Creamer in 2006 was indicted for bank fraud and tax evasion. During his trial, he received some 200 letters of support from such notables as Richard Durbin, Carol Browner, Jesse Jackson, and David Axelrod. Creamer ultimately was sentenced to five months in federal prison plus eleven months of house arrest. Upon his sentencing, he publicly pledged: “For the rest of my life I will continue to do whatever I can to work for social and economic justice.”
While incarcerated — or on “forced sabbatical,” as he called it — Creamer wrote a 628-page political manual titled Stand Up Straight! How Progressives Can Win (published in 2007). In the Acknowledgements section of the book, Creamer stated that his political views had been deeply influenced by “the legendary community organizer” Saul Alinsky
ian cormac (d380ce) — 7/13/2011 @ 11:23 amian – Creamer’s wife is Crazy Rep. Jan Schakowsky.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/13/2011 @ 11:32 amBeen trolling everyday but I will have to say that this gets stranger and stranger to read.
Thanks to Dustin and to Wittier for the public record remarks.
There is a reason why they are called “Public Records”, Ron. I don’t have a problem with you in the least, but I think you should take a break from this stuff. I have, and feel much better about it.
goatsred (b20383) — 7/13/2011 @ 2:47 pmWe’re just simply putting our ducks in a row.
Wondered at comment,
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/13/2011 @ 5:38 pmtwenty twelve would the World end?
Mayans missed this time.
out of gas people?
ColonelHaiku (cc5c75) — 7/13/2011 @ 5:46 pmweinerfest memorable
give it all you got!
I’m waiting for the Unified Field Theory that pulls all these pieces together into something I can understand…
Anyone have any suggestions?
Sue (24e46b) — 7/13/2011 @ 6:01 pmjust me and you Sue
ColonelHaiku (cc5c75) — 7/13/2011 @ 6:09 pmthey’re gone arrivederci
goodbye muchachos
–Comment by Sue — 7/13/2011 @ 6:01 pm–
Good Scotch.
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/13/2011 @ 6:13 pmLagavulin? 🙂
Sue (24e46b) — 7/13/2011 @ 6:18 pmI normally drink Chivas but I was given some Johnny Walker Blue Label and it was very smooth, though too rich for my budget. I prefer blended Scotch, single malts are a bit aromatic for me. Of course many prefer them.
I am saving the last bottle of Blue Label for a special occasion, maybe a conservative sweep or the recovery of our economy (I can dream).
Lagavulin is new to me but looks to be a fine choice for what you asked.
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/13/2011 @ 6:27 pmI had a chance to try some Laphroaig once and it may have been the nastiest thing I have ever tasted. I was wondering if Scotch could spoil but people with more educated taste assured me it was supposed to be like that.
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/13/2011 @ 6:31 pmI guess I just have plebeian taste.
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/13/2011 @ 6:32 pmLagavulin is also too rich for my budget, but I know someone who enjoys it and has occasionally indulged me. It is definitely a rich and intense flavor, almost appropriate for dessert on its own.
Here’s hoping you don’t have to save that bottle of Blue Label for too long!
Sue (24e46b) — 7/13/2011 @ 6:33 pmI’ve never tried Laphroaig…and now am glad I have not *snort*
But the worst liquor I’ve had was Ouzo…brought back from Greece…ye suffering gawds…
I’m from the south, ‘shine is not..umm…unusual..but Ouzo…ick.
ppk_pixie (7a67da) — 7/13/2011 @ 6:43 pm–Comment by Sue — 7/13/2011 @ 6:33 pm–
Thank you. I hope so too for all our sakes.
–Comment by ppk_pixie — 7/13/2011 @ 6:43 pm–
I am notorious for not being adventurous. It sounds like you have more courage than I do in trying new things.
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/13/2011 @ 6:46 pm–Comment by ppk_pixie — 7/13/2011 @ 6:43 pm–
You have a way with words and wonderful style, Ma’am. I am LOL.
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/13/2011 @ 6:49 pmAdventurous..I like that! Sounds ever so much nicer than the usual “foolhardy”, “impulsive”, and the ever popular “wench done lost her mind”.
Looking before you leap is always a better trait, Machinist…always. That and you don’t end up making Mr Yuk faces as often 😉
ppk_pixie (7a67da) — 7/13/2011 @ 6:50 pmI haven’t tried Laphroaig either. Thanks for the tip, Machinist.
Sue (24e46b) — 7/13/2011 @ 6:54 pmppk_pixie, I agree that Ouzo isn’t worth the glass to pour it into. Of course, the guy I knew that thought it was wonderful usually didn’t bother with a glass and simply drank from the bottle. I guess that should have given me a clue, huh?
My wife has a certain exasperated look she gets when she wants me to try something new and I am being stubborn. I know this look quite well.
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/13/2011 @ 6:54 pmLaphroaig seems to be an acquired taste. I just don’t think I want to taste things I might have to to develop an appreciation of it. I suspect it might include things like haggis or kidney pie (((shudder))). 🙁
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/13/2011 @ 6:58 pmMy theory is…if it tastes like black licorice…its from the devil. I swore Ouzo was the bastard child of Jaggermeister.
Of course, my husband says there’s not a 4 year old born that’s a pickier eater than me, sooo…haggis..yeah, don’t think so. Organ meat is for my dogs, not me LOL
Sue- he drank it from the bottle? He was either showing off, trying to consume quickly before the taste made him do Mr Yuk, or had never been introduced to these instruments we commonly call…glassware. You got that clue loud and clear…he, on the other hand, well…not everyone answers the clue phone when it rings…and rings..and…
ppk_pixie (7a67da) — 7/13/2011 @ 7:09 pmBut I like black licorice! Oh well, I told you I was a peasant.
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/13/2011 @ 7:16 pmThanks to you gentle ladies I have a fresh pot of coffee brewing and I am sitting here with a glass of Chivas. Life is good. Thank you.
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/13/2011 @ 7:17 pmppk_pixie, I noticed very quickly that the “gentleman” – was no such thing. And when I encountered Ouzo in other settings, I still wasn’t impressed, at all. You’re right that “not everyone answers the clue phone” – and then there are some people who answer it in an unknown language, too. 🙂
Sue (24e46b) — 7/13/2011 @ 7:18 pmMachinist, anyone that has sense enough to have a pot of coffee brewing and a glass of Chivas and to know that “Life is good” is no peasant and never will be. 🙂
Enjoy! Breathe! Life is good as it is given and tomorrow beckons…
Sue (24e46b) — 7/13/2011 @ 7:22 pmMachinist- you’re no peasant. My husband *adores* black licorice. I watch him eat it and make faces for him. That’s how good a wife I am. (yes, I typed that with a quasi-straight face..practice) But now I’m thinking that I might be a peasant…I don’t drink coffee… LOL
Sue, I’ve found that those that do not answer the clue phone, sometimes need the handy-dandy clue bat. Might not help them get the clue per se, but it sure makes you feel better.
ppk_pixie (7a67da) — 7/13/2011 @ 7:30 pmMy wife makes those faces about black licorice as well. She calls it “plastic candy”.
I did not like milk and started on coffee very young. I really learned to live on it when working in restaurants starting at 15. The good part is I learned to like plain institutional coffee. Fancy and expensive coffees taste like instant or freeze dried to me. Cheap tastes are handy. I used to drink over six pots a day but now I am down to two or less. One gets old. 🙁
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/13/2011 @ 7:36 pmThree cheers for the proper application of the clue bat! It is, indeed, most excellent for keeping my blood pressure low… 🙂
Sue (24e46b) — 7/13/2011 @ 7:39 pmSue,
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/13/2011 @ 7:39 pmI am commenting on a classy site like Patterico’s with two charming and eloquent ladies. How could life be better?
That was sweet Machinist 🙂
But my inner smarta$$ said “obama-free?”
I should have jumped in commenting sooner, truly I should have. I love Breitbart’s boards, but here…y’all dig for that info, you hash it out. There you spend a day, maybe two at best, and a new story…and off you go.
You all are impressively good, intelligent…fun people. Thanks for letting to join in.
ppk_pixie (7a67da) — 7/13/2011 @ 7:45 pmI am so hoping you will join in often. You are a prize. I will certainly be looking for your comments.
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/13/2011 @ 7:47 pmletting me to ….blah blah yada yada
damn typoglycemia…
ppk_pixie (7a67da) — 7/13/2011 @ 7:47 pmThank you, Machinist. You are a true gentleman. 🙂
Sue (24e46b) — 7/13/2011 @ 7:54 pmPlease, I have a reputation to consider.
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/13/2011 @ 7:59 pmMac is easier to type if you prefer.
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/13/2011 @ 8:00 pmI have to say that I rarely commented before, although I read a great deal and have enjoyed Patterico’s site for some time. I am most impressed with the people here and have ended up being drawn into the discussion to an extent quite beyond my custom. I am rather surprised at the number of comments and discussions that I have felt comfortable posting here. It is because of the high quality of the people, I think. There is such a wonderful diversity of opinion, and a level of mutual respect in spite of difference.
Sue (24e46b) — 7/13/2011 @ 8:01 pmI came here when Stashiu3 posted his series on his time at Gitmo. I knew him from another forum. I was very impressed with Pat’s honesty and integrity. I think he has created a unique site here and I am hooked. As you say, it is a diverse and interesting group of commenters. I almost never comment or read the comments at Ace of Spades, though I read it regularly, but this is a great place with some great people.
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/13/2011 @ 8:07 pmSue, I have been seeing your comments lately and hoped you would join in more. You are always interesting and thoughtful.
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/13/2011 @ 8:08 pmLadies,
When Mac tells you he has a reputation, he’s right… just not the one he implies, heh. I can tell you he is just as charming and honorable in real life as he is online.
Also, if you want this thread to hit 3,000 just get him talking about guns again. I’m not sure how he was distracted when you brought it up before (I think maybe the Ron Brynaert ranting may be responsible), but the man has forgotten more than I’ll ever know. Of course, that goes for many topics when it comes to him.
He has a known flaw however. The shameful secret is he has been known to taunt others for liking either Buffy the Vampire Slayer or Tron. Yes, it’s true. A scar on an otherwise perfect character.
Hi Mac! 😛
Stashiu3 (44da70) — 7/13/2011 @ 8:19 pmDo you prefer Mac or Machinist?
Sue (24e46b) — 7/13/2011 @ 8:20 pmSue, either is fine. I used Machinist because I am a retired machinist and loved machining. Many people shorten it to Mac.
Don’t pay attention to Stashiu3, he is politely saying my memory is going. He is getting back at me for calling him a Buffy Bunny. He deserved it for sending me Dr. Horrible or some such thing. He also is obsessed with The Princess Bride. Ask him about Inigo Montoya and you will see what I mean. 😉
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/13/2011 @ 8:32 pmGood evening, Sir. How are you?
Are we heading for 3,000?
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/13/2011 @ 8:33 pmAce of Spades is what I call “a guilty pleasure”…makes me laugh body parts off. But I don’t comment there By the time I think of something to say, its either been said, something said better, or its been a bazillion hours (technical term).
What made me comment here was I remembered reading on Kos about Neal/StrandedWind and thought it was an interesting link. The twists this story has gone through has been nothing short of phenomenal (hmm..that sooo doesn’t look like its spelled correctly, but I digress) And what made me finally continue to “run my mouth” (and gawd help y’all) was the mania I was witnessing. And it is manic-like. I don’t know this person, but I don’t wish anyone to suffer through it. If he really is manic, these things he’s saying- he believes them- wholeheartedly. I pray for peace for him.
And Mac..you are a gentleman…but if it helps, I’ll swear that you kick puppies and shoved my granny off a cliff *innocent look*
ppk_pixie (7a67da) — 7/13/2011 @ 8:33 pm“Inigo Montoya and you will see what I mean”
I swear, I almost said in response to your “reputation” remark about being a gentleman “you keep using that word…”
Wish I had now LOL
ppk_pixie (7a67da) — 7/13/2011 @ 8:35 pmI was shocked that just this evening my youngest could not name “The Princess Bride” as my all-time favorite movie. I swear… this was not more than 30 minutes ago. Now Mac brings it up. Hmmm….
Stashiu3 (44da70) — 7/13/2011 @ 8:36 pmI think Stash has every line memorized! And is just looking for an excuse. 0.0
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/13/2011 @ 8:38 pmIt may be a defense mechanism kicking in. 😉
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/13/2011 @ 8:41 pmWe sadly quote, or find reasons to quote…gawd…I’m admitting this…Spaceballs.
We live in the country..its boring *snort*
ppk_pixie (7a67da) — 7/13/2011 @ 8:42 pmPerish the thought. (shudder) The substantive content level has already dropped below critical levels. You want to break the blog?
Stashiu3 (44da70) — 7/13/2011 @ 8:44 pmI have not seen that Ma’am, but I have heard of it. I am a bit out of date on popular culture.
I moved to Texas four years ago and love it. We are not in the country. I would love that but my wife would not. The edge of suburbia seems to be the right compromise for us.
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/13/2011 @ 8:47 pmThank you for the compliments. I have certainly commented more here than ever before. I seem to be hooked, too. I like the fact that there is a real discussion, not just poking around at each other or flaming. That is much of what led to my commenting. Folks were actually looking at the possibilities and sharing ideas and thinking about things. And I could learn about the things I hadn’t done (like Twitter) and the folks here were patient about my questions. I’m pretty sure that Stashiu3 and you, Mac, were among the ones that were willing to help me out. There were many who answered me. Thanks to all. 😀
Sue (24e46b) — 7/13/2011 @ 8:47 pm–“You want to break the blog?”–
I haven’t already?
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/13/2011 @ 8:48 pmI do have every line memorized. I usually tell people to say a line from the movie (which I then correct because they make a minor misquotation somehow), then rattle off the next two or three lines. It’s been a while though.
And who sent me “Forever Knight”? Answer me that Sir.
Stashiu3 (44da70) — 7/13/2011 @ 8:49 pmDo I need more Haiku?
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/13/2011 @ 8:50 pmI think I only sent one year, didn’t I. I have all three.
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/13/2011 @ 8:52 pmSoothing glass of Scotch
Lullaby murmurs softly
Poster sleeps ‘til dawn…
Good Night, All. Sleep Well.
Sue (24e46b) — 7/13/2011 @ 8:52 pmI’ve enjoyed our discussion immensely. Thanks very much.
roses are red
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/13/2011 @ 8:52 pmviolets are blue
this thread is too short
we need more haiku
Why did I know you would bring that up?
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/13/2011 @ 8:52 pmGood night, Sue. Thank you.
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/13/2011 @ 8:53 pmDustin!
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/13/2011 @ 8:54 pmGood night, and thank you Sue for the wonderful conversation and laughter 🙂
ppk_pixie (7a67da) — 7/13/2011 @ 8:55 pmDustin joins the fun,
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/13/2011 @ 8:55 pmwhere will the conversation go?
It’s anyone’s guess.
Okay…is it…bad…that I’ve never seen an episode of Buffy?
ppk_pixie (7a67da) — 7/13/2011 @ 8:56 pmOops! -Where will conversation go?-
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/13/2011 @ 8:56 pm-Comment by ppk_pixie — 7/13/2011 @ 8:56 pm-
I would say normal. Neither have I.
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/13/2011 @ 8:57 pmI can only do “caveman interpretive” haiku-
(holds up five fingers)
ppk_pixie (7a67da) — 7/13/2011 @ 9:01 pm(then holds up seven fingers)
(repeats the five fingers)
ppk_pixie,
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/13/2011 @ 9:02 pmA fresh voice, brimming with charm.
Wit and humor, fused.
aww hell..and got it wrong too
(repeats five fingers)
*sigh*
ppk_pixie (7a67da) — 7/13/2011 @ 9:03 pmThat reminds me Mac… serious recommendation. “Being Human”, the BBC version. Only three seasons (they call them series) and definitely something you’d like to watch. One of my son’s friends recommended it to me.
Of course, another of his friends recommended “Pretty Little Liars”. Probably not your style. Just sayin’ 😉
Goodnight Sue and thanks.
Stashiu3 (44da70) — 7/13/2011 @ 9:03 pmThat was wonderful, Mac! The last time anyone used my name in poetry…oh, wait…never mind.
(couldn’t resist)
Gotta run to work (I hate 3rd shift) might pop back on in a few- but if not…thank you again 🙂
ppk_pixie (7a67da) — 7/13/2011 @ 9:05 pmFine and gentle Stash,
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/13/2011 @ 9:05 pmRespected and admired here.
An inspiration.
wow… so what are we talking about at 2000 comments?
Aaron Worthing (73a7ea) — 7/13/2011 @ 9:06 pmppk_pixie,
An honor and a pleasure, Ma’am. Good night.
I loved night shift.
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/13/2011 @ 9:08 pmStash,
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/13/2011 @ 9:09 pmI’ll look for it. I recently got the series “House of Cards” and the two sequels. I just rewatched all 12 episodes. Great.
–wow… so what are we talking about at 2000 comments?
Comment by Aaron Worthing — 7/13/2011 @ 9:06 pm–
I barely know what I’m talking about now. I was enchanted by the ladies.
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/13/2011 @ 9:11 pmWas that really twelve hours ago????
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/13/2011 @ 9:13 pmWell, there’s a nice commenter named Sue, and someone wants to sue me. Also, Machinist likes guns and Texas.
I really wanted to live out in the hill country around Bastrop. I probably eventually will, but right now we’re similarly situated on the edge of a very fast growing suburbia in Texas. Basically a compromise much like what yours sounds like.
We love it here too. But Texas is seeing so much growth I know I will be in the middle of suburbia pretty soon.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/13/2011 @ 9:14 pmI feel the same way. I am in McKinney but really closer to Frisco. It was the outskirts when we moved but things are filling in fast.
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/13/2011 @ 9:18 pmHaving come from CA I truly appreciate Texas. I only met people like these in very small towns in CA. It is so refreshing and nice.
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/13/2011 @ 9:21 pmThe hour grows late,
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/13/2011 @ 9:41 pmThe conversation cools down.
Quiet settles in.
Flaccid Wiener?
DohBiden (15aa57) — 7/13/2011 @ 9:44 pmAnd all through the house,
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/14/2011 @ 1:32 amNot a creature was stirring.
Echos in huge thread.
I do have every line memorized. I usually tell people to say a line from the movie (which I then correct because they make a minor misquotation somehow), then rattle off the next two or three lines. It’s been a while though.
Comment by Stashiu3 — 7/13/2011 @ 8:49 pm
Awesome. 🙂 For some reason I never stopped to figure out, that movie has more quotable lines applicable to all sorts of situations than any other one I know. A couple of friends can insert multiple Princess Bride quotes into any conversation effortlessly and they fit. And they’re funny there too.
no one you know (b4310d) — 7/14/2011 @ 3:48 amFlashback
Was TC’s unnamed “one blogger” ever identified?
Tommy’s first Betty & Veronica piece (June 3, Updated/annotated after NYT June 17)
koam @wittier (68bbff) — 7/14/2011 @ 5:52 amtwenty nine five you
ColonelHaiku (cc5c75) — 7/14/2011 @ 6:28 amrascal you not so hard to
get there if you try
There are times that this chase down th gopher hole,
ian cormac (d380ce) — 7/14/2011 @ 6:38 amhas ‘become more and more selective,’ over time, but
then Neal and co, keeps ‘Dialing up to Eleven’
This would be a good time to reflect on Howie Kurtz’s outstanding investigative journalism on this story.
HowardKurtz on Twitter, May 30
Oops.
Makes Hall & Christopher look like Woodward & Bernstein.
/sarcasm
koam @wittier (68bbff) — 7/14/2011 @ 8:13 amDoes anybody here know anything about Jimmy Siegel, the genius ad-man who worked for Howard Wolfson on the HRC ’08 campaign? (Weiner’s main competition for nyc mayor’s race was Wolfson, and I think someone up above (somewhere!) in these comments said Wolfson was known to have used some “dirty tricks”-type political propaganda against Weiner in the past. photo/my thoughts on it here:
qritiq (1440aa) — 7/14/2011 @ 9:07 amhttp://t.co/u0fnPWP
Thanks for naming who you were talking about qritiq. I had asked you at your blog, but then forgot the URL to it.
I do find that theory plausible for one part of this scandal. I still think Neal is involved with the part that actually matters now, but that doesn’t make your theory any less interesting.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/14/2011 @ 9:13 amOh, I see Qritiq doesn’t answer me on his/her blog, actually.
I think it’s an interesting theory, but find it strange this person ignores relevant questions. It’s a little creepy to post people’s personal information, dig up photos, etc. Too much of that going on for my taste. Too many people are so desperate to guess correctly first that they are just throwing out anything they can come up with. And then there are the real creeps, who are putting out personal information and screwing with people just because they are thugs.
In that environment, I think it’s particularly weird to ignore a question of ‘what makes you say that?’
What basis do you have to say this Jimmy Stengel knows about Weiner’s behavior? If you do have evidence he did, and that Wolfson is a dirty tricks politician, and that they are working together, I think you’ve found a very good theory. I just need to see you show your work. Instead of ignore questions.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/14/2011 @ 9:19 ambtw, in reading Q’s blog, I get the impression she (forgive me if you’re not a she) is discussing all this in good faith. And I would LOVE it if her theory is correct.
But come on… don’t hide the ball.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/14/2011 @ 9:46 amThe notion that Wolfson would be a viable candidate, after Bloomberg, ‘winning’
ian cormac (d380ce) — 7/14/2011 @ 9:55 amSure, Ian, you’re probably right. But that was actually my initial guess as to why Tommy’s source was anti Weiner and then anti Breitbart.
I dunno, though. Don’t assume NYC will have a decent candidate for mayor. Weiner could be the next one, for all we know.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/14/2011 @ 10:03 amRadio Stranahan live NOW at 2PM ET, 11AM PT
Call in number to speak with the host, Lee Stranahan
koam @wittier (68bbff) — 7/14/2011 @ 10:59 am(347) 945-5235
He’s complaining that one of his friends is playing Xbox (I assume he can see this from his own Xbox’s friends list) instead of offering him legal assistance (suing me?) and he’s complaining that his other friends from years past must be working with Neal because they don’t introduce Ron to their girlfriends, and they are financially successful.
Ron, listen, Neal is a scumbag, but I think you’re being paranoid. perhaps Neal is playing off your paranoia and screwing with your particularly hard in hopes no one believes you. That sick idea seems possible, and damn him if that’s the case. But on the other hand, you aren’t doing yourself any favors talking about your friends (whom I do not know) this way.
I tried to help you and got threatened with a lawsuit for nothing. Your closer friends will be even angrier than I am.
If your friends have stopped returning your calls that you claim you are making 15 times in a row from payphones, maybe you just need to take a break. I am sincerely worried that you, some guy I do not really know, are not in control of yourself.
I know you read that earlier. Google Metroplus. It’s just a health care program for people in the NYC area. It covers mental health. Email one of your real life friends or family and ask them what they think. You can either reflect on how you’re acting and move forward, or you can continue down this path, which clearly is making you miserable.
Even if you assume I’m the superhacker mastermind (I am not, btw) that doesn’t mean you don’t need a little help. Even just talking to a therapist about what you’re dealing with would seem really helpful to you. If you’re 100% right about all your friends (which I sincerely doubt) you still need someone to talk to about it.
Seriously, take a few days off the internet and consider what I’m telling you.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/14/2011 @ 11:27 amGod. Why would a woman pose as your girlfriend and pretend to give you Jon Stewart’s pants?
Ron, think about it. What reason would anyone spend years and zillions of dollars on an army of actors to play all your friends and girlfriends just to manipulate a Raw Story blogger (ex or not)?
think about it. Is Neal really capable of that kind of conspiracy? I think he’s good at twitter trolling and much worse hoaxes. I think he’s capable of hurting people, too. But one thing you are doing is undermining a real discussion of the things he’s really doing. You are doing Neal a favor.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/14/2011 @ 11:36 amLeft out the link.
And sorry for the repeat posts, but I want this in the thread.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/14/2011 @ 11:39 amYou’re giving good advice, Dustin.
Kudos to you for offering Ron such productive options.
In the beginning, I thought his nuttiness was amusing.
Auntie Fraud (2f38aa) — 7/14/2011 @ 12:41 pmNow it’s just really unfortunate.
I know sanity is not a prerequisite for working on Raw Story, it’s like the ‘Lone Gun Men’ for real,
ian cormac (d380ce) — 7/14/2011 @ 12:57 pmbut sheesh.
Ron does not seem to like me.
I’ve never actually shared anything private about Ron. I explained that I do not see what would be wrong with noting what crimes he’s committed. I was both talking about a general principle of my freedom of speech, and also talking about the natural reaction I have to Ron threatening to sue me. And remember, he didn’t threaten to sue me for sharing his information. He threatened to sue me for saying that Alicia rather than Nancy had done so, because someone was mistaken on this point.
Ron actually threatened to sue me because I explained just how suspicious and strange his behavior is. He is trying to silence his critics. He even demanded my private information be broadcast the way his was. There’s no principle behind his behavior.
What does Ron mean by ‘he can come here anytime’? Obviously Ron means we can have a physical fight.
Ron, I am not going to come to New York and fight you. I’m a grown man with a life. I just want you to talk to someone you trust about seeking help.
You’re obviously trying to provoke me, but I just don’t have an interest in agitating a person already making themselves miserable. I don’t want you to commit suicide or hurt your ex girlfriend or other friends you keep accusing of being in on the conspiracy.
I used your location to research how an unemployed person in your area could get help. You make so secret of your general location anyway. I called a hospital and they explained this isn’t an uncommon issue.
You qualify for a local health care program, Metroplus, and I’ve provided you with the phone number. You’d impress a lot of people by showing us you can ask for help.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/14/2011 @ 3:19 pmDustin – Watching Ron talk to himself on twitter is very strange. He claims his laptop is busted so maybe he can’t play solitaire or something. Maybe we are witnessing stream of consciousness Capital “J” Journalism, but I doubt it.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/14/2011 @ 5:26 pmI also did not know Patterico’s twitter was hacked. Maybe Ron should inform Patterico.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/14/2011 @ 5:27 pmweinerrauschnauzer
ColonelHaiku (cc5c75) — 7/14/2011 @ 5:30 pmgo ahead punk make my day
brynaert mania
I have seen people have psychotic breaks from smoking too much weed. I asked Ron about his smoking habits here the other day but did not receive an answer. Apparently he is restricting his communications to 140 character twitter messages and pay phones.
Maybe we can all chip in and buy him a cone of silence so socks and hackers can’t listen to what he is saying.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/14/2011 @ 5:39 pmYeah, that was pretty funny. It’s clear Patterico’s twitter hasn’t been hacked (though I realize no one needed me to explain that).
I hope Ron has a friend out there who has thought to read this thread, and hopefully they can get over there and buy this guy a meal and get him off the internet for a while. Talk about baseball or something.
Frankly, I’m not immune to a degree of paranoia. No one is. This case is genuinely scary in some respects. We have to keep our wits about us and try to analyze the elements of our paranoia that is productive from sheer fear.
I think Ron is scared to death, and he’s scared of his own friends. We could make fun of him for that, but as I mentioned earlier, someone I care about has some problems that used to be a lot like this, and I just can’t laugh about it. It’s not funny. Ron’s probably a smart guy who is suffering. His anger at me doesn’t change that.
And while I don’t want to make this an anti-drug commercial, I do know that pot and paranoia have a relationship.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/14/2011 @ 6:03 pmRon has quite a shtick, where he criticizes what I say by claiming I have been hacked (obviously Patterico was hacked because the real Patterico would never say something so stupid as [something I actually said]). He used to edit Raw Story, which was tied to Kimberlin at the hip. I certainly cannot discount the possibility that he is simply trying to have fun with us.
Patterico (f724ca) — 7/14/2011 @ 7:48 pmHow does a guy who used to edit a reasonably well trafficked publication have over 6000 tweets and 7 followers??
Patterico (f724ca) — 7/14/2011 @ 7:55 pmFrankly, if Ron is only playing crazy, that is sick as hell.
And his pattern towards me is identical to Brett’s towards Socrates.
He’s claiming to know for sure I’m Neal. Why not threaten to sue Neal, then? Why promise to sue someone you’re sure is not even real?
I just can’t come up with a good explanation for why he’d want to pretend to be delusional. Since he’s spending all his energy attacking Brett and Neal’s harshest critics, it’s not like his credibility destroying behavior would help them. Just for the lulz? He’s too committed.
His comments about that ex girlfriend or xbox playing lawyer pal were pretty damn worrisome, too. No, I sincerely believe Ron is disturbed. In my one experience with someone like that, I was overcome with the suspicion they were making it all up. Lasted until treatment started working. Ron is probably suffering terribly with fear of practically everyone he comes into contact with. It’s a fate I wouldn’t wish on my worst enemy.
His Kimberlin association probably explains why he’s paranoid about this story, rather than why he’s acting paranoid. Hell, it’s possible they really are screwing with him because of whatever beef he has with his former pals. They might think it’s funny to turn him on their other enemies. He is very frustrating.
I know there is one additional coincidence that really tilts things towards suspicion of Ron, and it does appear my obliquely referencing it is what set him off. I can only say I’d rather be safe than sorry. If someone out there has some way of reaching out to Ron, do so. I didn’t think my doing so was likely to work, but I had to try.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/14/2011 @ 7:59 pmTwitter technical question:
If you block someone following you as spam, are they removed from your quantity of followers? He may have had tons of followers he went out of his way to exclude from recent outbursts.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/14/2011 @ 8:01 pmron smoke two joints and
ColonelHaiku (cc5c75) — 7/14/2011 @ 8:05 pmthen he smoke two joints and then
he smoke two more…yay!
Qritiq, I have launched an investigation into all of my friends who supported Hillary Clinton and drink Pepsi. I’ll have a list to forward to you. Oh, also, I have some friends who drink Coke, but drank Pepsi a decade ago. Do you think I should be looking at them, too?
But I think I see the motive… Koam was involved in the Weinergate caper, and so he came to this blog to challenge Lee’s theory of a jilted lover… in order to call attention to the larger plot that he himself was behind.
Got it.
jeffeneff (707f3d) — 7/14/2011 @ 8:38 pmLOL, Jeffeneff. Well said. If Koam is trying to hide, he’s doing a damn lousy job of it.
I don’t understand why people are so suspicious of him. He seems pretty straight. I confided a single fact to him (nothing significant anymore) and he was the only person who didn’t tell anyone (as far as I know!). I think he’s probably just like me: someone willing to opine seriously about this case, and doing nothing that reasonably justifies much suspicion.
I don’t want to fight with this Qritiq person, though. I just don’t understand where she’s coming from.
Might I add that I think HEB’s Original Cola is far superior to Pepsi or Coca-Cola.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/14/2011 @ 8:42 pmDiet Coke rules.
I do drink less now, only a can or two a day. I drink canned carbonated water mainly.
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/14/2011 @ 9:10 pmSomeone Smarter Than Me: Explain Why This Is Not Possible
Dustin, that got me to thinking… what if a reasoned, evenhanded chronicler of facts and theories is here to find out what people know?
ParanoiaRunsDeep (707f3d) — 7/14/2011 @ 9:12 pmDustin, yes. If you block a spammer, they are are removed from the list of persons following you.
SarahW (af7312) — 7/15/2011 @ 10:11 amThe best way to handle Ron is to not attempt to try to handle Ron. Leave him be. It’s the kindest thing.
SarahW (af7312) — 7/15/2011 @ 10:15 amThanks for explaining, Sarah. That’s surely how Ron keeps his followers so low. If he’s faking he’s putting a lot of work into it and deliberately limiting who can see it. I suspect he’s not faking.
For the record, I’m not on twitter. Certainly I’m not engaging Ron on there. I go several days without reading it.
But Sarah’s right. My attempts to handle Ron are counterproductive, and now he’s probably convinced I’m the Ice Truck Killer.
heh. It is pretty funny that paranoia is at the point where people wonder even about the people who act that way. But you never know. I frankly am not very worried about the Weinergate part of Weinergate.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/15/2011 @ 10:20 amThose that Flickr and Twitter might find this interesting….
Helen (7d3578) — 7/15/2011 @ 11:03 amhttp://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-2014748/Twitter-Flickr-use-Manhattan-How-social-networking-breaks-district.html#ixzz1S9rQW6v3
interesting that little buddy jeffeneff comes out fighting for koam’s honor by mischaracterizing my posting (this one: http://wp.me/p6l52-fa )
jeff – koam is a former exec and a current consultant – I’m guessing he might have the wherewithal to speak for himself.
Unlike Ron, I do not believe koam to be some criminal mastermind with a big budget. Far from it.
Also, Ron says koam is a hacker. Well, I think Ron is wrong on that count too. koam is not an IT guy, rather, koam has years of top experience in the management of creative ideas and messaging. Which I think is interesting vis-a-vis the subject at hand.
Also, as a former manager myself, I know that on occasion, the vendors and consultants that you manage offer you work.
There was a reason koam came into my field of vision and it had something to do with something he wrote about me (which is why I noticed it.) If I have time, I might write it up.
And one last note, to Dustin:
I hope you’re not intimating that I had to “dig” up a photo of Jimmy Siegel – he is a very public person who offers commentary to publications all the time. The shot I used is quite obviously a publicity shot.
Also, Dustin, I answered 3 or 4 of your questions, identified the players in question on my post, as per your request, and put that info here so you would see it – all gratis. If you require any more work from me, my special rate for you (because I like you) is $1 per word for opinion pieces, $2 per word plus expenses for research reports. (Since your IP does appear on some old proxy lists, I’ll have to require payment in advance.) Please contact me if interested.
Also – what are you basing your stated suspicion of Neal on? (I read one of his pieces and he didn’t seem to have a clue.)
qritiq (1440aa) — 7/15/2011 @ 2:54 pmI’m sure you’re right, and no, I’m not intimating anything nefarious on your part. In fact, I’ve gone out of my way to explain that I’m not claiming any kind of bad faith on your part. What is it, four times now I’ve gone out of my way to do so?
This coming from the person who rudely demanded I ‘wake the hell up’ when I asked you for some clear basis for your suspicions about Koam?
I think Liberty Chick has covered Neal better than anybody. Read up on it.
Just understand I don’t really even care about the Weinergate part of this story. I don’t care if conservatives or dirty trick liberals were playing Chris Hanson or leaking his dirty secrets. I’m not suggesting there’s something wrong with you caring about that. It’s interesting. I just am more focused on the Alicia Pain and other criminal activity. I want whoever is behind that to go to prison.
There is no conflict between my suspicion of Neal and your theories, actually. I don’t know if you’re right, and I merely asked you to explain where you were coming from.
Yes, you did. Thanks. I appreciate it.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/15/2011 @ 3:00 pmBTW, folks are a little worried about clicking odd links and shortened links. Qritiq’s blog is qritiq.wordpress.com.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/15/2011 @ 3:02 pmqritiq.wordpress.com
I screwed up the link in the prior comment. 🙁
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/15/2011 @ 3:03 pmAnd of course Neal’s theories on his Kos diary are hopelessly wrong, Qritiq.
He’s just trying to smear the good names of Brett Kimberlin’s louder critics.
That doesn’t prove he’s uninvolved. It’s not like he sincerely thinks Socrates is hacking Anthony Weiner. He’s just trying to smear the good name of anyone honorable enough to call Brett Kimberlin a violent con man. Neal showing such support for Brett is far more disturbing than any kind of Weinergate hacking. The only thing in this entire episode that is worse is the criminal behavior.
But I don’t want to kneecap those who suspect Neal of being party to the petty hoaxing on twitter. Just as I would wonder if Howard Stern have a hand in someone shouting down Weiner at his next presser, of course I’ll wonder if Neal is involved with hacking, sockpuppets, and twitter trolling a story Neal’s interested in.
What I’m more concerned about is how someone is threatening Patterico and others with relation to this story, and Neal has a record of ‘any means necessary’ activism.
There’s more to it that I’m not going to discuss openly. As I’ve said before, I don’t think it’s necessary. What Neal’s doing out in the open is already quite condemnable.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/15/2011 @ 3:35 pmI used to think Ron was acting but now I do not think that. I would like to apologize to Ron for taunting him the other day and sincerely hope he can get his life back in order.
Noodles (3681c4) — 7/15/2011 @ 5:24 pmI’m camping. Low batteries and can’t type much on phone., low signal in mountains. Will have to catch up later.
koam @witier (99ed41) — 7/15/2011 @ 6:18 pmI think Ron may have hacked my twitter and Facebook accounts even though I am not on twitter or Facebook.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/15/2011 @ 7:34 pmAnd your comments here. The real daleyrocks would never say something so stupid. To say something that stupid you would have to be Ron sockpuppeting Daley. obviously.
Patterico (e023dd) — 7/15/2011 @ 8:05 pmSock puppet theory!
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/15/2011 @ 8:52 pmWho knows what evil words spew,
from hijacked IDs,
How hard is it to hack a Twitter account, really?
Sue (24e46b) — 7/15/2011 @ 9:03 pmI was wondering about it because of this story:
http://www.dispatch.com/live/content/local_news/stories/2011/07/15/politicians-twitter-account-hacked.html?sid=101
An Ohio Congressman’s account (Republican) ended up with strange messages and the account picture was replaced with an inappropriate one. The Congressman’s spokeswoman says they are working with U.S. Capitol Police, House Information Security and Twitter to resolve it.
(Clearly, Rep. Weiner’s account was NOT hacked.)
But how hard is it to get into someone’s account and do unauthorized stuff?
Ron was a longtime commenter and guest blogger at Brad Blog, which is connected at the hip to Brett Kimberlin and Velvet Revolution. The scams promoted by Brad Friedman and convicted perjurer, drug smuggler and domestic terrorist Brett Kimberlin must not be new information to Ron and some say Kimberlin was involved in founding Raw Story, where worked for a number of years. Raw Story thrived on publishing the bizarre conspiracy theories pushed by Brad Blog and Velvet Revolution. Ron’s appearance here and his strange comments about this blog on his twitter account do not appear coincidental.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/15/2011 @ 9:19 pmThe above comment does not appear to have been made by the real Daleyrocks. I think Ron must have hacked my comments here at PP because I am much to stupid to have written something connecting dots like that, or something.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/15/2011 @ 9:21 pmSue, I believe that if you can send texts from the phone number of your target, twitter will think it’s your target making the tweet and post it to their feed.
There is a growing supply of databases of usernames and passwords out there. I commented way above that Neal linked one torrent tracker for downloading usernames and passwords of veterans.
One problem is that people use the same password for multiple services, or don’t change their password frequently, or change it in a way that is predictable.
So it’s pretty damn important that you don’t use the same password for multiple things, and that you change all your passwords regularly.
Obviously be wary of phishing (like a login page that isn’t really).
Also, depending on your browser, multiple tabs can be a major security risk. For example, if you’re in twitter and open a new tab to a nefarious site, it might be able to see more than you want it to. I don’t really worry about this unless I’m doing something related to money.
Anyway, you asked how hard would it be to do something unauthorized to someone else’s account? It is possible.
Bill Johnson’s best recourse was to report it directly to twitter (unlike Weiner, who looked guilty from the first second because he refused to do that).
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/15/2011 @ 9:32 pmThe above comment by “daleyrocks” is obviously a hacker. The previously hacked comment that was noted by Patterico was clearly too … wait, I mean Patterico’s comment by the hacker was … hold on, what I meant to say was that the hacked denial by
RondaleyrocksPattericoMachinistStashiu3Timothy GeitnerDustin, yeah, Dustin the master hacker has struck again.Glad to have cleared that up.
Stashiu3 (44da70) — 7/15/2011 @ 9:38 pmSorry guys. I just can’t help myself.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/15/2011 @ 9:41 pmI am Spartacus.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/15/2011 @ 9:47 pmThanks, Dustin.
That gives me a better idea of the nature of the problem.
I’m looking forward to seeing whether they catch someone pretty quickly or what happens. I hope the news actually reports the next part of that story.
BTW, I appreciate the feedback from the “master hacker”… 🙂
Sue (24e46b) — 7/15/2011 @ 9:53 pmAll right I’m all confuzzled, as pikachu, would say, #2138, doesn’t make sense, but most of the others do,
ian cormac (d380ce) — 7/15/2011 @ 10:13 pmian – Obviously some sockpuppet wrote #2138.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/15/2011 @ 10:19 pmronbryn Ron Brynaert
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/15/2011 @ 10:23 pmSomeone from Germany clicked on my new blog… I wonder if that’s the person who hacked Patterico.
29 minutes ago
Its like kabuki theater’s version of “who’s on first”…
I don’t think gps could get me unlost now.
ppk_pixie (6f2250) — 7/15/2011 @ 11:47 pmHelp me understand:
http://.twitter.com/#!/ethylkxa
http://aanewz.blogspot.com/
Patterico (f724ca) — 7/16/2011 @ 12:26 amJust Ron and his socks playing with twitter and a blog.
Joe
Joe Smith (54c0c1) — 7/16/2011 @ 2:20 am2153. Help me understand.
Someone used a sock-puppet creation application that takes the tweets of others, substitutes new sock/bot names. All the content and profiles of these socks are copied from real users.
The question is whether your tweets got cloned coincidentally, or if you are targeted. I suspect the latter, that someone is excited to advertise the use of this toy.
jeffeneff (707f3d) — 7/16/2011 @ 5:48 amCould be what jeff is talking about. Seems like a lot of socks are being made. St Ranahan, that Breitbart account, etc. If you did that combined with their actual tweets for a while you could fool a lot of people.
Obviously that’s not the intent here since the name isn’t similar. Maybe it’s just a test.
I guess it could be a spammer trying to look real, but it doesn’t seem that much effort is necessary on twitter to spam folks.
I’m not going to try to figure Ron out. Either he’s playing a game with us, posing as crazy, or he probably needs to be institutionalized. It’s hard to accept someone that delusional being able to make it through their day. But that remains the best explanation for his behavior.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/16/2011 @ 8:43 amNote the name. Ethyl (like Ethel) plus a disgusting word.
Patterico (f724ca) — 7/16/2011 @ 9:18 amI caught the Ethel reference, but I didn’t catch the vulgarity reference.
Obviously that reminds one of the extremely coarse twittergate trolling of the past.
I should have linked some of that stuff when Qritiq asked about it.
Definitiely not Milhouse (b7410e) — 7/16/2011 @ 9:28 am^ Dustin
(Sorry)
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/16/2011 @ 9:28 amHere is a search for the image used in that account.
Patterico (f724ca) — 7/16/2011 @ 11:31 amThe image is called “Mary_Mamba_Duquan.” Here is a search for that term.
Patterico (f724ca) — 7/16/2011 @ 11:33 am2157. Naif that I am, I don’t see see the disgusting word. “Ethyl” could possibly be coincidental when you view the enormous numbers of fakes in this labyrinthine example by clicking around on reply names. The software creating this junk could be what is used to help give people followers, (for which there is a market).
At any rate, this doesn’t seem to be that useful a tool for creating your old-style sockpuppets, the kind with the sewn-on button eyes.
jeffeneff (707f3d) — 7/16/2011 @ 12:11 pmOMG, Patterico is a woman!
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/16/2011 @ 12:13 pm==Someone used a sock-puppet creation application takes the tweets of others, substitutes new sock/bot names. All the content and profiles of these socks are copied from real users.
The question is whether your tweets got cloned coincidentally or if you are targeted.==
==If you did that combined with their actual tweets for a while you could fool a lot of people==
Why don’t you people just frickin’ quit using twitter? How is it possibly worth dealing with all of this carp? Make a public announcement divorcing twitter–sort of like they used to do in the newspaper: “From this date forward responsible for my debts only.” Then you can deny any and all hacked, sock-puppeted and fake tweeted and re-tweeted messages. Is tweeting somehow the macho electronic version of climbing Mt. Everest or something? It just seems so unnecessarily risky and fraught with personal danger.
elissa (775109) — 7/16/2011 @ 12:14 pmFrom IRAN!
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/16/2011 @ 12:14 pmelissa – Can I email you a picture of Patterico’s junk?
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/16/2011 @ 12:16 pmLagavulin on
elissa (775109) — 7/16/2011 @ 12:22 pmice only answer for this
affront to mankind
2160. Pat, at this point, it’s patterns in toast. If you click around ‘your’ example, you’ll see that a LARGE number of fake accounts have been created, all duplicating real Twitter profiles and tweets. All of them using computer-generated names. All of them employing pictures possibly picked at random.
The plausible explanation is that an application harvests the profiles and tweets and then runs them against a cache of pre-built accounts, building out these fake accounts to give them a sort of bizarro credibility.
Whether you were specifically targeted with ‘Ethyl’, I doubt there are any clues here. If you were targeted, I suspect the more you respond, the more fake clues you will be handed.
jeffeneff (707f3d) — 7/16/2011 @ 12:22 pm“Only answer” is such
jeffeneff (707f3d) — 7/16/2011 @ 12:30 pmA limiting worldview:
Sterno in the can.
I really like Elissa’s commentary. LOL.
Anyway, twitter could be the ultimate RSS feed. You get your favorite bloggers to update you, little silly quips, and interactions between then and other bloggers (and media generally).
It’s a good way for one blogger to call another blogger out in this public space.
What we often see are very abbreviated and dumbed down arguments. I tried to have a discussion of AGW, and it was just ‘no you’re wrong’ from 8 people. Very little real argumentation.
That and people talking about what Starbucks they are in, which is conceited. Why would someone think the world cares about that?
But Twitter has the potential to be a decent way for folks to interact with strangers. For better and worse.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/16/2011 @ 1:01 pm😯 What if Weiner is really an Alien from planet Mars?
DohBiden (15aa57) — 7/16/2011 @ 1:15 pm2131. Qritiq, I’m hardly fighting for anyone’s honor. I’m trying to see how your theory is anything but a higher-end version of connect-the-specks-on-the-wall a la Ron. From what I can see, you have a tenuous connection based on a less-than-tenuous theory. Have it make sense and I am happy to consider it.
Explain how calling Lee’s theory (of the lone jilted Weiner woman) into question advances the narrative of someone connected in some way to the Bloomberg-Clinton-Huma axis given the probability that if they were part of the conspiracy, they would want people to see the puppetry as the workings of one spurned off-kilter woman.
If there’s another theory, what is it?
I am glad that your experience as a former manager has given you, and then us, the insight that people sometimes hire people they’ve worked with in the past.
Your big buddy,
Jeffeneff
p.s. For someone snarking about people wanting anonymity or privacy, you seem to want the same yourself.
jeffeneff (707f3d) — 7/16/2011 @ 1:19 pmTwitter is just another medium. Lotta people think using the Internet to communicate is a bad idea. And there’s plenty of evidence they can cite to support that position.
Yet I still use it.
Patterico (f724ca) — 7/16/2011 @ 1:20 pmWeiner has been castrated.
DohBiden (15aa57) — 7/16/2011 @ 1:37 pmRe: 2171 DohBiden
Sue (24e46b) — 7/16/2011 @ 1:41 pmI doubt that Mars would claim him. Has anyone asked Pluto? 😀
Can the media stop abusing the word alledged.
I mean alleged pervert Anthony Weiner
Alleged Murderer Charles Manson.
DohBiden (15aa57) — 7/16/2011 @ 1:58 pmYeah true Sue.
Alleged*
DohBiden (15aa57) — 7/16/2011 @ 1:59 pmI had the bright idea to see who was following the Ethyl fake Patterico account. Just 1 person. I don’t want to play in the sandbox anymore.
Blackburn (2ffb0c) — 7/16/2011 @ 2:01 pmI know I said that around, what 1,000?
twenty one eighty
ColonelHaiku (cc5c75) — 7/16/2011 @ 2:10 pmyou just wait til we get past
your predecessor
twenty one eighty
ColonelHaiku (cc5c75) — 7/16/2011 @ 2:11 pmit so nice to meet you but
now I have to go
Anthony Weiner is proof that Congress needs an enema.
DohBiden (15aa57) — 7/16/2011 @ 2:14 pmtwenty one eighty
Sue (24e46b) — 7/16/2011 @ 2:19 pmand two more to stumble through
the count goes higher
Jeff is a good writer.
Welcome to twitter Jeff.
http://www.whendidyoujointwitter.com/
Twitter Username: jeffeneff
qritiq (1440aa) — 7/16/2011 @ 4:16 pmJeff Rey
Your account was created on
27 June 2011
2183. Qritic, wow, I’m new to Twitter. That is indeed suspicious. If I told you I prefer Pepsi to Coke would you believe me, or think that is misdirection? The point being is that we’re all anonymous bozos on this bus unless we want to be otherwise. Why treat people like suspects without a good reason? Have I said anything here that warrants suspicion except to oppose your point of view? Are you searching for the truth, or is it personal? Have I called you into question because you have a differing viewpoint?
So many questions!
What you’re doing is battling against the opinions of others by trying to delegitimize them through a campaign of innuendo – not a bad tactic really, when everyone is so paranoid that a whispered “boo” makes everyone jump.
For what it’s worth, you can view my particulars here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oHg5SJYRHA0
Thanks for the compliment on my writing. Do you think I could write screenplays?
jeffeneff (707f3d) — 7/16/2011 @ 5:00 pmI’m not sure why it’s odd Jeff would have joined twitter recently. He’s interested in this story, and this story is a motivator to follow twitter (which is easier if you have an account).
And yeah, if you treat everyone with the benefit of the doubt, even though we’re all strangers to some extent, that is doing a big favor for the hoaxers who will laugh and laugh. Oh well. Life’s too short.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/16/2011 @ 5:11 pmJeff
Blackburn (2ffb0c) — 7/16/2011 @ 5:16 pm“We’re all anonymous bozos on this bus” hahahahaha! (I don’t do LOL) Thank you! What a great post!
Anyone know who Peter Pavel is? LOIC is a simple flood of a server (he mentioned it derisively to Ethyl). I guess he’s mocking a script kiddie.
I already thought this whole thing was flying over my head. Sheesh.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/16/2011 @ 5:23 pmHe lives all alone in his head.
Blackburn (2ffb0c) — 7/16/2011 @ 5:28 pmIn a big creaky house with all of his socks.
He hugs them and kisses them and calls them Fred.
He really can’t even ever just go to bed.
They will take down the blocks. He and his socks.
So no one will have an opinion again.
I wonder if Twitter had an increase in new accounts as a result of all the coverage and curiosity?
Sue (24e46b) — 7/16/2011 @ 5:48 pmAnd, of course, the socks probably had unprotected “relations”… 🙂
Sue (24e46b) — 7/16/2011 @ 5:49 pmHi Patterico,
As a follow up to my post about Ron and the puppets, I checked all the @references for ethylkxa’s current tweets. All the twitter accounts were created within a single 24 hours on May 8th ( 69 days ago ).
Sockpuppet army!!!
Joe
Joe Smith (54c0c1) — 7/16/2011 @ 5:49 pm2190
Blackburn (2ffb0c) — 7/16/2011 @ 5:53 pmNo we don’t need anymore sock babies seeeriously. Latex for all socks! I think we can fit that into current debt ceiling negotiations.
2191. That date makes me lean toward thinking this coincidental, that Patrick is a drive-by in a puppetry exercise that is separate from all this. In any case, a cursory exercise of clicking the fake names in ethyl’s timeline reveals more and more socked profiles and timelines. It is someone’s exercise in building a network of socks. The value of chasing down this rabbithole is nil, imho.
jeffeneff (707f3d) — 7/16/2011 @ 6:03 pmLOL
I liked your poem too. Threadwinning material.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/16/2011 @ 6:27 pm#2189 Sue,
That’s exactly why I finally opened a silly twitter account. But its been rather boring, for the most part.
I’ve learned far more here, at any rate.
ppk_pixie (6f2250) — 7/16/2011 @ 6:30 pmRe: #2195 ppk_pixie
Sue (24e46b) — 7/16/2011 @ 6:59 pmI know, I was very tempted several times. But I am just not a very public person and it feels to me like a very public forum. Only in that forum, I can’t just say anything the way I want to; I have to do it in 140 characters or less.
In case you hadn’t noticed, I like words… 🙂
ass glued to toilet
ColonelHaiku (cc5c75) — 7/16/2011 @ 7:02 pmfolks need feedback EPIC FAIL
the world needs a tweet
gotta let me know
ColonelHaiku (cc5c75) — 7/16/2011 @ 7:05 pmshould I stay or should I go?
c’mon let me know
always please please please
ColonelHaiku (cc5c75) — 7/16/2011 @ 7:07 pmnow I’m poundin on my knees
gotta let me know
okay there it pass
ColonelHaiku (cc5c75) — 7/16/2011 @ 7:08 pmnot talkin somethin from ass
twenty two hundred!
apologize for
ColonelHaiku (cc5c75) — 7/16/2011 @ 7:09 pmscatalogical humor
or attempts therein
Speaking of being protected. My anti Virus, and spyware programs have never ever been as busy until going to twitter links. Lots of embedded stuff at twitter. Much of it having Russian origins.
cap'n john's nephew (d29614) — 7/16/2011 @ 7:10 pmI miss Joe Strummer
ColonelHaiku (cc5c75) — 7/16/2011 @ 7:11 pmbut worst show evah did see
Clash in Hollywood… June 1982
Love affair with words
Sue (24e46b) — 7/16/2011 @ 7:26 pmNot possible with Twitter
One forty too low…
I can’t find the proper thread for this:
Britain’s The Guardian newspaper has apologized to The Sun tabloid for claiming that The Sun illicitly accessed the medical records of former Prime Minister Gordon Brown’s son.
The Guardian’s initial story, which accused The Sun of accessing the files to sustain a “scoop” saying Brown’s son had cystic fibrosis, added to growing outrage in Britain amid allegations of phone hacking at another one of Rupert Murdoch’s tabloids.
ian cormac (d380ce) — 7/16/2011 @ 8:30 pmian,
I’m actually happy you brought that up. I was skimming through some British blogs, and saw there was considerable debate surrounding Rupert,
cap'n john's nephew (d29614) — 7/16/2011 @ 8:55 pmand his papers. I didn’t have the time to dig in and discover what the row was about.
Have you the backqround on the row? I thought it was broader that the specific issue you mention.
What is your take?
I imagine alot of these claims are overblown,when the circular firing squad is being drawn so tightly
ian cormac (d380ce) — 7/16/2011 @ 9:03 pmby the likes of Elliot Spitzer and Larry Flynt the whole thing has gotten out of hand, Fleet Street is not the most scrupulous sort, but as the Bishop Cranmer blog has pointed out, NewsCorp is fairly low on the totem poll in intrusions,
Can someone tell Lady Gaga Anthony Weiner wants to be her paper gangster?
DohBiden (15aa57) — 7/16/2011 @ 9:08 pmThank you ian,
Another fine example of leftist projection. They sure don’t like to have the light of truth shown on “teh narrative”.
cap'n john's nephew (d29614) — 7/16/2011 @ 9:30 pmCatch-up difficult
koam @wittier (1fd5aa) — 7/16/2011 @ 9:36 pmwhen sarcasm outweigh info
(pretend this haiku)
Agile minds can do
elissa (775109) — 7/16/2011 @ 10:10 pmmore than one thing at a time
haiku and Weiner
A little light reading for Cap’n John and others concerned with security lately.
I hope I don’t come across as paranoid… there’s too much of that going around… but indeed I’m suffering cross site scripting a lot more than I’m used to. It’s probably relatively benign privacy-disregarding ad companies, but damn.
Solutions are mentioned.
Koam, I don’t think there’s much to catch up on. Just static.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/16/2011 @ 10:22 pmIn particular, check out the ‘exploit scenario’ section and the solutions.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/16/2011 @ 10:24 pmtwenty two fourteen
ColonelHaiku (cc5c75) — 7/17/2011 @ 5:47 amcame and went without warning
first haiku new day
red sky in morning
jeffeneff (707f3d) — 7/17/2011 @ 6:48 amthere is no warning, sailor
haiku pearl harbor
“The Red Socks are coming!” The Red Socks are coming!”
Blackburn (2ffb0c) — 7/17/2011 @ 7:58 amSo through the night rode Paul Revere;
Blackburn (2ffb0c) — 7/17/2011 @ 7:59 amAnd so through the night went his cry of alarm
To every Middlesex village and farm,—
A cry of defiance, and not of fear,
A voice in the darkness, a knock at the door,
And a word that shall echo for evermore!
For, borne on the night-wind of the Past,
Through all our history, to the last,
In the hour of darkness and peril and need,
The people will waken and listen to hear
The hurrying hoof-beats of that steed,
And the midnight message of Paul Revere.
That was excellent, Dustin. Thank you. The filters I have been using are picking up several of the the nasty types that like to hyjack your computer, and I haven’t runn into these too often,
until I began going to twitter while following this story.
I miss my MAC..
cap'n john's nephew (d29614) — 7/17/2011 @ 8:06 amMorning peril lurks,
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/17/2011 @ 9:28 amas the huge thread plods along.
New nasties evolve?
Well, I am a Mac,
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/17/2011 @ 9:32 amBut some call me nasty type,
So not what you want.
Marco Polo thread,
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/17/2011 @ 9:35 amHas sure wandered far and wide,
And gone strange places.
Now two two two two,
Machinist (b6f7da) — 7/17/2011 @ 9:37 amMac claims this funny number,
for Haiku mischief.
Radio Stranahan coming up Sunday @3:30 PM ET
Call in number to speak with Lee Stranahan
(347) 945-5235
@Stranahan on Twitter
koam @wittier (1fd5aa) — 7/17/2011 @ 12:04 pmLee canceled the radio show 1 minute after it started.
Interpret that.
koam @wittier (1fd5aa) — 7/17/2011 @ 12:40 pmLee started the radio show – and then what? Did he go on just to say there wouldn’t be a show? What was supposed to be on that show? At what message number?
Sammy Finkelman (d3de3a) — 7/17/2011 @ 2:10 pmNumber 2100 qritiq: “I think someone up above (somewhere!) in these comments said Wolfson was known to have used some “dirty tricks”-type political propaganda against Weiner in the past.”
I was the one, or at least one of a few, who mentioned Howard Wolfson’s being involved in possibly blackmailing Anthony Weiner into not running for Mayor in 2009.
He even maybe did some push polling:
(Whether it is push polling or not depends on how early it is and how many people get called. If only 500 people get called, it is not push polling, it is polling. This could be the old standard Penn & Schoen type of poll where they search for ideas to include in an ads)
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/04/07/nyregion/07bloomberg.html?sq=wolfson%20weiner&st=cse&adxnnl=1&scp=3&adxnnlx=1310934106-BEZ1KIUTPgtrz29y+n8Xng
(By the way, you see in comments to this and other Weiner stories or New York Times blog posts that had comments that a lot of people didn’t like the idea of Weiner in public office. But they were individuals costing him maybe 10-15% or more of the general election vote, but that’s all. The Republican got 40% of the vote in the last election)
By RAYMOND HERNANDEZ
Published: April 6, 2009
The calls came around mid-March, even as Mr. Weiner announced he was not certain he would run for mayor.
In interviews, several people who received the telephone calls said that they were told when they picked up the phone that a survey was being conducted, but were soon asked a series of questions featuring negative information about Mr. Weiner.
The questions began benignly enough: Are you registered to vote? Do you plan to vote in the mayoral election? But then they shifted to Mr. Weiner, asking whether the person’s views of Mr. Weiner would be altered if he or she knew of certain problems involving Mr. Weiner, from missing votes in Congress to having difficulty keeping staff to accepting campaign donations from foreign fashion models.
“At first I thought it was a market research thing,” said Sandra Kane, a 67-year-old registered Democrat from Forest Hills, Queens. “As the questions got more mud-slinging, I said to myself: ‘I’m not hanging up now; I want to see where this is going.’ ”
Mr. Weiner’s camp alerted The New York Times about the calls…
…The issues highlighted in the telephone calls closely echoed negative stories that have appeared in city newspapers about Mr. Weiner, and that the congressman’s aides have accused opposition researchers from the Bloomberg campaign of planting.’
Sometime later, Weiner wrote an op-ed article that claimed in part he might be interested in starting a family and thet might a reason not to run. Most people who thought about this probably assumed he read the polls.
The New York Times, however, did some reporting a bit later:
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/07/12/nyregion/12wolfson.html?scp=4&sq=wolfson%20weiner&st=cse
In About-Face, Wolfson Now Works for Bloomberg
By JIM RUTENBERG and RAYMOND HERNANDEZ
Published: July 10, 2009
“In the city, he is credited in political circles with pressuring Representative Anthony D. Weiner, a Democrat, to quit the mayor’s race……
Earlier, I was referring to this New York Times article, written sometime after Weiner had dropped out of the race. This article in fact says the stories came from Howard Wolfson:
Mr. Wolfson claimed his first Democratic scalp in May, as Mr. Weiner — once a close ally in the Clinton campaigns — dropped out of the mayoral race amid a Wolfson-led behind-the-scenes campaign to force him to do just that.
Working with a local press corps he had cultivated for years, Mr. Wolfson and his team dug up and then pushed a steady stream of politically damaging tidbits about Mr. Weiner, giving the congressman an early taste of what he might face come the fall.
In one instance, Mr. Wolfson’s team discovered that Mr. Weiner had introduced a bill making it easier for foreign-born fashion models to work in the United States. In New York’s tabloid news culture — one Mr. Wolfson navigates well — the discovery produced unflattering news stories packaged with photographs of the congressman and sultry exotic models.
No matter that Mr. Weiner was someone Mr. Wolfson dispatched frequently as a surrogate against President Obama during last year’s primaries, or that Mr. Weiner’s fiancée, Huma Abedin, is a confidante of Mrs. Clinton’s whom Mr. Wolfson once considered a friend.
But Mr. Wolfson said that it was a fair fight and that he relished what he had accomplished. His team commemorated Mr. Weiner’s departure from the race by tacking on a wall in their office a photograph of the congressman in his goalie uniform during a pickup hockey game, with a caption quoting him as saying, “This is not a time for playing games; it’s a time for problem-solving.”
At that time Wolfson had gone to work for Mike Bloomberg. Who he intended or intends to support in 2013 I wouldn’t know yet.
Someone else in another thread had a link to a recent New York Post article I didn’t check yet that said that Kevin Sheekey (Wolfson’s colleague
boss or substitute at Bloomberg’s campaign) knew of something about Weiner – and that seemed to refer top the old college pictures that surfaced at the end..
The question of course is, was what they put in the paper the whole story? Or was Weiner with exposure of something else that didn’t make the paper because it couldn’t be verified?
Also – what was it that caused Anthony Weiner to confess something to Huma Abedin? Did he have a reason at that time to tell her about sending certain kinds of pictures to some women he connected with through the Internet? Weiner went back 3 years, though – to 2008, in his claim of
Sammy Finkelman (d3de3a) — 7/17/2011 @ 2:43 pm6 women since.
Discuss
koam @wittier (1fd5aa) — 7/17/2011 @ 5:38 pmWe know he’s a Dem but is he acting on his own or at someone else’s direction/employ?
DRJ (fdd243) — 7/17/2011 @ 5:44 pm2228 DRJ
no idea
koam @wittier (1fd5aa) — 7/17/2011 @ 5:50 pmFrom aanewz blogspot,
Neal’s apparently documenting the blogger spat.
This public row fits precisely with what @JohnReid9 seemed to want to happen on June 21 before he released any of the Nikki documents.
koam @wittier (1fd5aa) — 7/17/2011 @ 6:06 pmtwenty two thirty
ColonelHaiku (cc5c75) — 7/17/2011 @ 6:19 pmcolonel feel kinda dirty
thirty one more fun?
colonel’s haikus suck
ColonelHaiku (cc5c75) — 7/17/2011 @ 6:23 pmhe not having any luck
dem ol’ haiku blues
Another compadre in my down- with- twitter campaign! The great Matt Labash. Heh.
Here’s a cross-section from The Atlantic’s “Top 100 Figures in American History”: Herman Melville, Ernest Hemingway, Louis Armstrong, Lewis and Clark, Babe Ruth, Frederick Douglass, Jonas Salk, Ralph Waldo Emerson, Albert Einstein, Alexander Graham Bell, Mark Twain, Theodore Roosevelt, Henry Ford, Thomas Edison. All of them managed to do what they did without any assistance from Twitter.
Now here’s a cross-section of Twitter’s Top 100 Most Followed: Lady Gaga, Justin Bieber, Kim Kardashian, Ashton Kutcher, Ryan Seacrest, Charlie Sheen, Perez Hilton, Khloe Kardashian, Chris Brown, Soulja Boy, Kourtney Kardashian.
http://dailycaller.com/2011/07/13/ask-matt-labash-the-social-media-scourge-embracing-the-new-dumbness-and-keeping-america-mediocre/
elissa (d8ad26) — 7/17/2011 @ 6:34 pm2230. Koam, I think you’re giving puppets too much credit. How did Reid9 “precisely” want this? And then, how did he engineer it? I’m afraid that people are making the puppet(s) larger-than-life and endowing them with superhuman powers. After all, a fight between two bloggers breaks out every 27 seconds anyhow.
Most of the motives of suspects mentioned aren’t so controversial. But lacking evidence, most of it becomes parlor chat.
I am guessing that several people know at this point whether JGMA is in fact a real person who took screenwriting classes. That seems to be the biggest missing piece.
Jen, Patrick, Lee…? The audience is starting to get unruly. Would you throw out a few Reeses Pieces?
jeffeneff (707f3d) — 7/17/2011 @ 6:34 pmIf Reeses Pieces aren’t available, M&M’s are good, too…
Sue (24e46b) — 7/17/2011 @ 7:02 pmNikki is/was 16..
Did anyone else notice there was more than one adult after Nikki? Both male and female were in pursuit.
It’s a police and FBI investigation now, and it seems there are several who wish to pressure the story to break.
I say, let that part of story take it’s own course.
cap'n john's nephew (d29614) — 7/17/2011 @ 7:05 pmNikki is/was 16..
Did anyone else notice there was more than one adult after Nikki? Both male and female were in pursuit.
It’s a police and FBI investigation now, and it seems there are several who wish to pressure the story to break.
I say, let that part of story take it’s own course.
cap'n john's nephew (d29614) — 7/17/2011 @ 7:05 pmSorry for the double post. I’m not what I did to cause it…
cap'n john's nephew (d29614) — 7/17/2011 @ 7:07 pmok I read all the comments and
hah just kidding
happyfeet (3c92a1) — 7/17/2011 @ 7:18 pmHi, Mr. Feets!
cap'n john's nephew (28dda5) — 7/17/2011 @ 7:21 pm2234 jeffeneff
Prior to any documents being released, JR9 was focused on dividing the bloggers, on who would be jealous, and who was asking him separately (per JR9) to get access. We were told countless times not to share anything with Lee, specifically, or others. I had no idea why any of that was important to JR9, but it was clearly his focus. I didn’t say it was engineered, but it in retrospect, it seems JR9 had an understanding of the personalities and histories involved. Perhaps he pushed other buttons since then to drive up the rivalry and suspicions. Nothing would stop him from being a commenter here.
As for JGMA being a real person who attended at least one of Lew Hunter’s writing retreats, that seems verified by the accounts of Lee and actions of Preston and her intern.
I don’t know why Preston would have Lee’s radio show edited to remove the comments about JGMA’s alleged condition if she weren’t real. We understand that a JGMA went to the police and that they went to her home to interview her. Presumably BPD would go to some effort to verify that they are talking to a real person. We heard that the PBD’s Detective Thornton was also given Lew’s name for verification.
koam @wittier (1fd5aa) — 7/17/2011 @ 7:34 pmIt’s interesting how the Wiener pattern is not unlike David Garrow’s rather apologetic review of
ian cormac (d380ce) — 7/17/2011 @ 7:39 pmSallh Jacob’s bio of Barack Obama Sr. in the Washington Post, where his many personal and professional foibles are excused in some way
From the beginning, Patterico has focused on the possibility a crime was committed. It was even clear,that on having aquired some of the evidence, that Patterico was attempting to convince JR that he should pursue a criminal case. Given Patterico’s occupation, I doubt Pat would have continued with the story had the facts not supported his professional knowledge.
As to wether JR is a real person, or an activist
operative, has still not been clearly established to those of us in comment land. But, I still doubt that Patterico would have continued pursuit of JR if he felt it was all a game. He probably sees these games eevery working day of his life.
If there is a true criminal case to be made, it wouldn’t be too difficult to imagine parties of all stripes wanting to know, and I’m sure there is tremendous pressure on those with first hand knowledge of the facts.
Nothing in today’s twitter exchanges suggests anything else concerning JR.
cap'n john's nephew (d29614) — 7/17/2011 @ 8:25 pmhowdy Mr. nephew
hey if someone wanted to buy the indie film rights to this thread how much you think they’d go for?
happyfeet (3c92a1) — 7/17/2011 @ 8:41 pm2243 cap’n
What crimes do you think are related to JohnReid9?
koam @wittier (1fd5aa) — 7/17/2011 @ 8:47 pmWell, Mr. Feets, that would depend on which plot they wish to purchase.
cap'n john's nephew (d29614) — 7/17/2011 @ 8:49 pmPat’s plan was to get JR9 to give Pat as many documents as possible.
The strategy was to accept JR9’s representations that JR9 was a person and not a sockpuppet.
Its my opinion that JR9, Nikki, and several others are sockpuppets controlled by one person. Other sockpuppets may be controlled by others.
slp (347e33) — 7/17/2011 @ 8:58 pm2247 slp
The strategy was to publish all documents without editing and to not declare whether JR9 was the real person he claimed to be. Rather, the readers were free to comment on who they thought JR9 is and what his motives were — and they certainly did.
koam @wittier (1fd5aa) — 7/17/2011 @ 9:05 pmslp,
I’ve considered that, but what good are documents from a sock going to do in a court case? The judge would likely die from hysterics. I still doubt Patterico would have continued pursuit under those conditions.
cap'n john's nephew (d29614) — 7/17/2011 @ 9:09 pmwhat court case?
koam @wittier (1fd5aa) — 7/17/2011 @ 9:15 pmI acknowledge the sock theory to be plausable, but after all the years I’ve been reading Patterico, I know Pat just doesn’t have time to waste, and wouldn’t if he felt there was good reason to pursue the matter.
cap'n john's nephew (28dda5) — 7/17/2011 @ 9:20 pmI’m beginning to get sick and tired of all jews being maligned by the actions of Anthony Weiner and wealthy jewish leftys.
DohBiden (d54602) — 7/17/2011 @ 9:21 pmkoam @wittier – I’m very curious why Lee has not published anything from the Boston police report yet, especially given his claim that JG MA gave them Lew Hunter’s name for some reason.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/17/2011 @ 9:25 pmMr. Feets – I hope you did not skip over the comments where we were talking about you in this thread. I forget where those were.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/17/2011 @ 9:27 pm2243 2246 2251 cap’n
Obtaining the Nikki documents from JR9 was a publishing coup for a blogger. Pat certainly wanted them, as did other bloggers.
The value of showing the Nikki documents (DMs and emails with other key players in the case) is on its face reason enough to want to have them.
One doesn’t have to imagine an ill-defined court case to want to publish these documents.
When you write that Pat wanted to convince JR9 to pursue a criminal case, what crime? Did something happen to Nikki that would be a crime? When you’re asked about this assertion, why do you joke and become more vague rather than just say what you mean? I don’t get it.
koam @wittier (1fd5aa) — 7/17/2011 @ 9:30 pm2251 cap’n
If Rep Anthony Weiner had sent emails or DMs to Nikki, sock or not, that’s news. Same goes for GC, GL, etc.
koam @wittier (1fd5aa) — 7/17/2011 @ 9:33 pmLet’s suppose JR is actually an activist operative who had multiple socks to create a steath environment to operate out of, who’s mission was to punk the conservatives. Probable in this day and age. Certainly outing that sock patrol would be of some amusement and interest to those of us who are conservative, but beyond that, why would an excellent ADA waste so much of his time with it? There has to be better reason.
cap'n john's nephew (d29614) — 7/17/2011 @ 9:40 pmSorry Koam, I missed your previous question.
Yes, presuming JR and Nikki to be real. I certainly recall one of the adult players grooming an underage girl. Thought that proetty clear from some of the tweats. No idea what Patrick may have.
I’ll give you the blog scoop scenerio. It certainly worked.
cap'n john's nephew (d29614) — 7/17/2011 @ 9:49 pmKoam, I can’t find those tweets in this mess, but that particular adult was not as heavily discussed..
I saw it, wondered if others had, but everybody was intensly discussing something else.
I’ll see if I can find the time to dig for it tomorrow. Goodnight
cap'n john's nephew (d29614) — 7/17/2011 @ 10:21 pmKoam,
I spent some time going through the thread this morning. It does not contain the imformation I discussed last evening. It was probably on the
previous thread. I have to go, but will search the archives when I have time.
Anyway, I’m sure you have them indexed. Take a good look at the content of the communications between Nikki/starchild and the other adults.
cap'n john's nephew (d29614) — 7/18/2011 @ 5:05 amThe implications of some of the conversations with one of the people should jump out at you.
2241:
Prior to any documents being released, JR9 was focused on dividing the bloggers, on who would be jealous, and who was asking him separately (per JR9) to get access. We were told countless times not to share anything with Lee, specifically, or others. I had no idea why any of that was important to JR9,
Logically, that would be because he was telling different lies to different people.
Sammy Finkelman (d3de3a) — 7/18/2011 @ 6:57 amNot correct.
Correct.
Patterico (f724ca) — 7/18/2011 @ 7:10 am2241 koam @wittier: ‘As for JGMA being a real person who attended at least one of Lew Hunter’s writing retreats, that seems verified by the accounts of Lee and actions of Preston and her intern.’
The question Patterico has is not whether or not JG MA is a real person, but is JG MA one – or two – real persons.
We have at least 3 encounters with JG MA:
1) The person who spoke to Lee Stranahan and Jennifer Preston.
2) The person who went to Nebraska to attend one of Lew Hunter’s retreats.
(It is possible her story did not completely add up, or she changed details from time to time – and therefore people thought she had some kind of mental problems, and JG MA wanted that clue removed both from Adam Shriver’s STLA post and from the recording of Lee Stranahan’s radio show.)
3) The person who filed the complaint with the Boston police.
1 & 2 – if the professor identified her as being from Massachusetts, and /or in some other way established that she is the same person who talked to Lee Stranahan and Jennifer Preston – are probably the same person.
Jennifer Preston thought the professor must be lying – and therefore must not be a real professor – because some of the details he told her about Jennifer George didn’t jibe with what she heard from the Jennifer George she talked to.
It is quite possible that in Nebraska, JGMA appropriated some details from the life of JG CA – without actually attempting a full scale impersonation. She only wanted to steal her resume, and only for people who wouldn’t do detailed checking. She was not attempting to use her credit.
It was very important to JGMA that anything that might give people the idea she was other than truthful at any time – and especially in Nebraska – be removed from the web.
Encounter number 3 might very well be different from 1&2 but they are highly likely to be connected in some way and know each other.
In other words, the unified sock theory, if not the unisock theory.
The name “Jennifer George” is likely an alias, although not one very recently adopted. JGMA may have first found JGCA and then attended the class.
JGMA almost certainly later knew about JGCA because she pretended to be from California. Why not New Hampshire or Vermont, or New York or Pennsylvania if she’s just scared? No, she knew Lee Stranahan had located a JGCA.
The purpose of the call was to persuade him and
others that the name Jennifer George would not be a lead to whoever was using the starchild111 account in March April and May 2011. Therefore she admitted starting it but claimed she abandoned it and had no idea who might have been using it later in 2011. Therefore the name “Jennifer George” is a dead end.
Except of course, it’s almost certainly not a dead end, although one very difficult to follow up on until some other piece of information falls into your hands.
JGMA didn’t originally intend to talk to anyone else other than Lee Stranahan but she had to call Jennifer Preston since she couldn’t refuse to make the call, or Lee would ignore her entirely.
Sammy Finkelman (d3de3a) — 7/18/2011 @ 7:42 amIt is impossible to imagine the starchild111 sting being made against Anthony Weiner – it was against Anthony Weiner but whoever did it was no friend of Bereitbart – unless SOCKREID had some kind of inside information about Anthony Weiner. Now there was no record of Weiner doing anything with girls under 18, but perhaps he did not carefully avoid them. Nikki was made 16 because anything older
would not have been guaranteed to be a big scandal.
The inside information probably did not come from jilted lover. Whereever it did come from it as very important to SOCKREID – and his boss, the RED BARON – to hide where the information came from and who was doing this. This might indicate an illegal source.
Now some thing were known to some people.
From the 2004 Almanac of American Politics published I think some time early in 2003: (end of the article on the 9th CD of NY)
“..Weiner’s options for political advancement seem limited for the next several years, but he has not discouraged the notion that he is a hot political commodity–perhaps, even, a candidate for Mayor some day [he ran in 2005, and barely qualified for the runoff, getting just over 40% of the vote in the Democratic primary, but then pulled out – wait http://www.nytimes.com/2005/09/17/nyregion/metrocampaigns/17runoff.html?sq=weiner%202005%20runoff&st=cse&adxnnl=1&scp=9&adxnnlx=1311001023-4OUbBReQusp6SPIPK/qEPA – he actually stopped the vote count at a point where Ferrer was ahead]
Back to the Almanac of American Politics 2004:
“Weiner learned that the media spotlight also can bite the hand that feeds it. An article in Vanity Fair described Weiner’s night out with some Democratic colleagues at the Capital Grill on Pennsylvania Avenue when they invited three young women to join their table. One of them claimed that Weiner the next day identified himself in an email after having told her at the restaurant that he was an auto parts salesman. Other than some good-time photographs taken at the restaurant, the story identified no apparent evidence of misconduct.”
Well, it did identify him as a liar, although it’s not clear why he told that lie.
Sammy Finkelman (d3de3a) — 7/18/2011 @ 8:03 am2263 Sammy
Thanks for the 3-encounters with JGMA intro.
You wrote:
I recall that Preston wanted that assertion removed from Lee’s radio show. Lee quotes JP as saying “you can’t have that up there” (paraphrase).
Conjecture: Lew said this to JP in confidence & JP said this to Lee in confidence, and Lee said it on the radio. JP wanted it removed so that she couldn’t be sued by JGMA and/or Lew or to protect her sources for statements that may have been made off the record.
Two questions on this first part:
1) What’s the evidence that JGMA is the one who wanted that quote removed from Lee’s radio show podcast?
2) Can you please refresh my memory about what clue was on Adam’s STLAH post regarding JGMA? I don’t see how Adam’s updates here relate specifically to JGMA or what Lew may have said about her to JP as Adam’s original post was related to his alleged (and suspicious) “discovery” of the full name Jennifer George. I’m not understanding that part.
Thanks.
koam @wittier (1fd5aa) — 7/18/2011 @ 8:09 am“JGMA didn’t originally intend to talk to anyone else other than Lee Stranahan but she had to call Jennifer Preston since she couldn’t refuse to make the call, or Lee would ignore her entirely.”
Sammy – Some JGMA filed a complaint with the Boston PD. Lee contends it is the same JGMA who called him. How does that fit with your theory?
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/18/2011 @ 8:23 am2263 Sammy
I think the connection to JGCA is purely in Lee’s mind. We don’t have any evidence whether or not JGMA ever went to UCLA. She told Lee she did. It’s summer. She can be from MA and go to UCLA during the regular school year. Just because Lee says that half the things JGMA says are lies doesn’t make that true. Lee has demonstrated that his definition of a lie or truth isn’t shared by everyone. We also don’t have any evidence whether or not JGCA had anything to do with Lew Hunter. JGCA went to and worked at UCLA. Lew teaches a course in the winter at UCLA. UCLA has thousands in faculty. Most students at UCLA probably meet only 1% of the faculty. Coincidence. JGCA did not work in any capacity that’s related to Lew’s department and there’s nothing that I’ve found in her past that is related to screenwriting, which is Lew’s area at UCLA.
JGCA’s connection to this is whole thing is in Lee’s mind. He may have gotten the name of JGCA from JP or her intern, or they both may have landed on her because she simply had one of the more complete and transparent online backgrounds of anyone who fit the name. Lee was intently focused on her job at Reason Magazine (which was in fundraising) – and he was mistaken.
I still maintain that nothing that JGMA told Lee or Preston indicates that she was pretending to be JGCA. JGCA is a decade older than JGMA, allegedly. JGCA does not even live in LA anymore and hasn’t been a student at UCLA for over a decade. For JGMA to select a woman who coincidentally has the same name who went to UCLA when JGMA was in 7th grade, makes it clear to me that JGMA wasn’t trying to point Lee to JGCA. JGMA giving out the name Lew Hunter in no way pointed anyone to JGCA, except for Lee who doesn’t really look at the details (UCLA is HUGE). It seems that the UCLA coincidence was proof enough for him.
Huge school + common name = coincidence.
koam @wittier (1fd5aa) — 7/18/2011 @ 8:30 amKaus wonders:
SPQR (26be8b) — 7/18/2011 @ 8:44 amhttp://dailycaller.com/2011/07/18/weinergates-incomprehensible-afterlife/
Anthony Weiner and government are the problem and don’t answer to the people although these opponents of privatization say the government does.
DohBiden (d54602) — 7/18/2011 @ 9:30 amKoam, your 2267 makes as much sense as anything I’ve read.
Dianna (5bc608) — 7/18/2011 @ 9:33 am2267 SPQR
Thanks. I commented.
There’s a history of some tweets between @kausmickey @nyt_jenpreston on this. Kaus found that Preston’s slant on the story that alleged socks were only anti-Weiner was unproven. Importantly, the broader media certainly picked up on Preston’s lede – that this part of the story is about “anti-Weiner right-wing operatives” and that is how all the headlines went in thousands of media pickups in the days after Preston’s articles.
Patterico exposed that slant in an important pair of blog posts.
Preston admitted that she really doesn’t know who’s behind this all and that their motivations or leanings are unclear. She allegedly told her intern that they were possibly dealing with dangerous dem operatives and to not engage them. Lee says she intimated similar concerns to him. Those parts of it didn’t make it to the NYT.
koam @wittier (1fd5aa) — 7/18/2011 @ 9:35 amkoam @wittier – I have not seen Jen Preston advance the jilted lover/sexter theory, but then again I have not followed everything she has written.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/18/2011 @ 10:12 am2272 daleyrocks
I haven’t seen JP promote that theory either. Lee says that a liberal woman is behind that – so possibly of no interest to NYT.
koam @wittier (1fd5aa) — 7/18/2011 @ 10:17 am“so possibly of no interest to NYT.”
koam @wittier – Heh. Not unless they are forced into covering it if it pans out and they can find the room given all the competing demands for space in that rag and even then the political leanings of the individual will be buried or not mentioned at all.
Let’s play Name That Party!
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/18/2011 @ 10:29 am2226: thanks for Wolfson info Sammy, very interesting!
2263:
yes you’re right – and someone was trying (hard) to impersonate JGCA
also, imo, It was ultimately the Dems (Obama, Pelosi, Wasserman-Schultz, etc.) that were responsible for the endgame demise of AW
qritiq (1440aa) — 7/18/2011 @ 11:49 am2265:
I wrote: JG MA wanted that clue removed
Koam: I recall that Preston wanted that assertion removed from Lee’s radio show. Lee quotes JP as saying “you can’t have that up there” (paraphrase).
Koam: 1) What’s the evidence that JGMA is the one who wanted that quote removed from Lee’s radio show podcast?
That’s something I should have tried to get straight. What was the thing exactly that was removed? Who complained? Was taht actually soemthing that said JGCA had started starchild111? This may be wrong.
Koam: 2) Can you please refresh my memory about what clue was on Adam’s STLAH post regarding JGMA? I don’t see how Adam’s updates here relate specifically to JGMA or what Lew may have said about her to JP as Adam’s original post was related to his alleged (and suspicious) “discovery” of the full name Jennifer George. I’m not understanding that part.
Looking at it, actually what might have been removed (in both cases) was something proclaiming that JGCA might be the originator of the starchild111 account.
It says there:
“Update: I’ve removed a little bit of information that singles out particular individuals (though I should note that I never provided any information that would allow anyone to be directly contacted)..
Somewhere I read something about JGMA being “unstable” or whatever and that was not to be repeated. These two things may have nothing to do with it.
Did JGMA complain about that on the phone call?
Jennifer George CA writes to Jennifer Preston on June 26:
http://www.jennifergeorge.com/weiner.html
“I’m not sure if you’ve seen it, but commenters on at least one site are now talking about approaching one of their targets directly, in person. It appears someone has contacted one of her professors about her. She has been identified by name and publicly described as “unstable,” and people are speculating about her love life.”
Sammy Finkelman (d3daeb) — 7/18/2011 @ 1:53 pm2276 Sammy
1)
On his radio show, Lee said, that Preston said, that Lew said that JGMA might have (and I don’t have the exact wording) troubles (you know what is meant there).
On a later show (next day, I think), Lee said that Preston said, “Lee, you can’t have that up there” and Preston asked Lee to remove that comment from the audio record. Lee said that he said to Preston, “I don’t know if I know how to do that.” Lee said that Preston said, “well I know the CEO of Blog Talk Radio (Alan Levy) and I can have it done.” Lee said that Preston then called Levy. Lee said that Levy then called Lee and asked for Lee’s password. Lee said he would comply with the deletion but didn’t think it was necessary. Lee said that Levy then had the comments removed from the audio of the prior day’s radio show. Lee detailed all of this on his radio show. Lee said that he knew it would piss Preston off to tell these stories (and as a listener, it was easy to know that would be a problem for Lee) and he also reported that he spent a day being yelled at because of it.
All these quotes are my memory of Lee’s radio shows and are paraphrases. For exact wording, you can go listen to a couple hours of radio. Lee tells a good story so it might be fun to listen to. I have also written up parts of these shows in prior comments on this and other threads. So there are other sources… but this is the gist, but not exact wording by any means.
2)
JGCA, who it was never reasonable to assume was involved, commented on the targeting of JGMA at a later date.
3)
koam @wittier (1fd5aa) — 7/18/2011 @ 2:34 pmJGMA couldn’t have complained about that assertion on the call to Lee as the calls to Lew only happened in subsequent days. According to Lee, JGMA said that she called Lee in fear for her life after receiving 2 threatening calls.
An early Weinergate chronology:
http://readcontentus.wedia.fr/extractor/extract.html?url=mailto%3Agbeato%40soundbitten.com
Excerpts:
08/14/10: The Twitter account for the entity known as Starchild111 dates to at least 08/14/10.
At this point, the name associated with the account is “Jenay.” Eventually it will change to ostensible high school student “Nikki Reid.” (Source: Screen-cap.)
[link gone by now]
Notes: Starchild111’s first follow is the UCLA Extension Writers Program, which tweets stuff like “Tip of the day: ‘Writing teen dialogue can be tricky business…'” She’s also following Oprah, several members of the Kardashian clan, an inspirational website called TheDailyLove.com, Jennifer Lopez, a Jennifer Lopez fan site, and an actress/model, Natalie Martinez, who serves as the spokesmodel for Lopez’ JLo clothing line.
This cache shows seven tweets. Four are directed at Natalie Martinez (whose former Twitter handle was @Goldnd12), and two go to the Lopez fansite.
These tweets are characterized by a combination of flattery (“am a fan!” “you are very talented.” “u are also so glamorous!”) and some kind of request for more information. (“do u have a facebook page?” “could you message me?”)
While Starchild111 claims to be a “huge fan” of Martinez’, she simultaneously asks Martinez if she has a Facebook page or a Web page.
Presumably, this is information a “huge fan” would already know.
Finally, there’s Starchild111’s tweet to the Kardashian sisters, wherein she asks them about a makeup organizer they use on the show. Web searches show that this makeup organizer is a highly sought-after product that has inspired numerous knockoffs.
Given that Starchild111 consistently asks questions that she could have easily answered herself with a quick Google search, one can’t help but wonder: In her initial incarnation, is Starchild111 some kind of SEO-oriented spambot created to generate Google-food?
———————-
[Presumably not this Google Food: http://www.grimmthething.com/other/cse/googlefood.html Note: It’s not real.]
SEO stands for Search Engine Optimization.
Maybe not for Google, but for Twitter follower counts?
———————–
Back to the chronology:
04/06/11: On this date, Starchild111’s Twitter profile page includes no name other than Starchild, no location information, and no bio. (Source: Google cache of Twitter)
Notes: This snapshot shows that she has a total of seven tweets. She’s following 26 people, and Ginger Lee is her most recent follow. The earlier screencap of her page, dated 01/01/2011, also showed a total of seven tweets. Given her tweets to Ginger Lee, she should have more now — or has she already started deleting tweets?
Of the ten new people that Starchild111 is following, nine are somehow connected to the band Guns N’ Roses. (Ginger Lee is the exception.)
There’s been some conjecture about how many high-school girls in the year 2011 are huge GNR fans, but here’s an important point to remember.
Starchild111 is not explicitly a high-school girl yet. She’s just a self-described Weiner fan, and her profile isn’t necessarily designed yet to authenticate her status as a HS girl who lives in LA.
Still, these new GNR follows may be serving purpose: Guess who puts GNR on his mix tapes?
[http://readcontentus.wedia.fr/extractor/extract.html?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.wnyc.org%2Farticles%2Fwnyc-news%2F2005%2Faug%2F23%2Fa-day-in-the-life-anthony-weiner%2F – Tuesday, August 23, 2005
REPORTER: He’s in a good mood — happy with the striking full-moon that hovers just above the Brooklyn Bridge and with a CD mix that includes R.E.M. and Guns n’Roses…]
Prudence Paine analyzes Starchild111’s evolving Twitter profile here.
[This links to a ReadContent page. The origina is at: http://prudencepaine.com/2011/06/29/for-weinergate-addicts-only/ but the screencaps are more legible at Read Content]
From the apparently crucial May 16 date:
05/16/11: At 1:18 am, Gennette Cordova DMs the following message to Starchild111: “Hey did you say one of your friends was [Ethel]?” Then, in a subsequent DM, she writes, “Sorry. That was totally random but I just saw that this politician just started following her today and he follows me. Small world.”
Starchild111 replies in some fashion, then Cordova writes, “Yeah! It is. I love him. Just ask. Maybe he will, who knows? Haha. I think I’m gonna hit the sack. I have an early class. Lame:” Then, in a subsequent DM, “Oh, I just looked. He’s doing this hashtag thing and following people I guess? Idk. I never asked him to follow me.” (Source: Patterico.com)
Notes: Missing here, of course, are Starchild111’s replies. Note that it’s Starchild111 who explicitly identifies Weiner by name; Cordova never actually says Weiner’s name in any of their exchanges. Note, based on Cordova’s response that includes the phrase, “Just ask,” that it is Starchild111 who has brought up the subject if she should try to follow Weiner.
05/16/11: At 2:29 am, Starchild111 tweets, “@RepWeiner i’m kind of shy to ask this but i’ve been a fan for a while will u follow me? #WeinerYes” (Source: CSPAN Twitter feed)
Notes: Another cache of this tweet, at Google, is time-stamped May 15, 11:29 pm. The three-hour difference reflects EDT versus PDT. That is, when it’s May 16 2:29 am on the east coast, it’s still May 15 11:29 on the west coast, where Starchild111 ostensibly is.
But what is the 1:18 AM time-stamp on the Cordova DM — PDT or EDT?
If Starchild111’s account is stamping Cordova’s DM as being received at 1:18 AM PDT, Starchild111 has already asked Weiner for a follow before this conversation takes place.
If Starchild111’s account is stamping Cordova’s DM as being received at 1:18 EDT, then presumably their conversation takes place before Starchild111 asks Weiner for a follow. But why is a girl who lives in LA using EDT on her Twitter account?
Also note that the Google cache shows Starchild111 is using her hot girl avatar when tweeting her request to Weiner.
05/16/11: At 8:46 am, PatriotUSA76 tweets, “There could be some great fun on the agenda today…” (Source: Google Twitter cache)
05/16/11: Weiner starts following Starchild111. Between 9:03 am and 10:26 am, he allegedly sends her 17 DMs. In them, he makes references to “Republican trolls” and encourages Starchild111 to recruit more Twitter followers for him. (Source: Patterico.com)
Notes: These messages from Weiner have not been confirmed as genuine.
05/16/11: At 11:49 am, Starchild111 tweets, “@RepWeiner Thank you so much @GennetteNicole!!!” (Source:CSPAN Twitter feed)
05/16/11: At 12:21 pm, Goatsred tweets, “@repweiner #YesWeiner.” Eight minutes later, he realizes he mixed up the hashtag and tweets again, sending the message, “@repweiner #WeinerYes.” (Sources: Twitter, Twitter)
05/16/11: Starchild111 tweets that Weiner is following her on Twitter, announces campaign to get him to be her prom date. One of her tweets: “Follow the best progressive Congressman @RepWeiner he is a democrat who fights for us & against Republican trolls!” (Source: Patterico.com)
05/16/11: At 1:21 pm, Patriotusa76 tweets: “RT Starchild111 Please tweet and follow @RepWeiner & tell him to be my prom date>>Poor girl. We should warn her.” (Source: Daily Dose)
05/16/11: At 3:42pm, PatriotUSA75 tweets, “Well we have a good deed planned. Really we do” (Source: Google Twitter cache)
05/16/11: At some point in this day, Gennette Cordova exchanges more DMs with Starchild111. A screen-capture at Patterico.com documents three of them, time-stamped 10:47, 10:51, and 11:04, but it’s not clear if it’s AM or PM. In these DMs, Cordova talks about things she’s said to Weiner, including that she’s been “pretty obsessed with him,” that he’s “[her] idea of a perfect man,” that he “looked cute” on Rachel Maddow’s MSNBC show. (Source: Patterico.com)
Notes: Cordova says in the comments section at Patterico.com that she believed Starchild111 was “fake” at this point, and that the exchanges she described with Weiner didn’t actually take place. Instead, she suggests, she was trying to “bait” Starchild111 with these statements.
***
05/17/11: Four members of the BornFreeCrew tweet messages to Starchild111, telling her that he is “not as good as you think” and that they have “proof of what he does & worry,” and that there are “many incidents that we know of that he’s been involved in.” (Source: Google cache of Twitter)
***
05/18/11: MikeMadden59 tweets “@Goatsred Did that thing ever surface? I gotta go to work. Check back later MUCH later.” Goatsred replies, “@mikemadden59 Not yet. You will know ahead of time when it does. Promise. Talk later.” (Source: Twitter, Twitter)
Notes: When I showed Goatsred these tweets, he commented, via DM: “The Mike M thing was because we already talked about the rumor and I had no idea that it was on Patriots agenda.I just cont.to f-around”
05/18/11: A Twitter user named Frankiethadog begins to retweet some of Goatsred’s tweets. (Source: Twitter)
Notes: What is Frankiethadog’s intent? The tweets that it retweets are not ones that anyone would typically rebroadcast as they don’t immediate appeal to a wider audience. Was the account set up as a surveillance device to monitor the online behavior of Goatsred or, more generally, the BornFreeCrew? Tweetgrader shows that it was created on 01/08/10, more than a year before it begins retweeting Goatsred tweets.
05/18/11: Weiner emails Broussard grey underwear photo (2:14 pm), then talks with her on the phone (3:36 pm). Broussard sends four photos of herself to Weiner between 3:45 pm and 4:08 pm. Weiner emails erect penis photo to Broussard at 4:15 pm. Broussard emails photos of herself at 8:31 pm and 9:32 pm. (Source: ABC News)
05/18/11: An associate of Broussard’s contacts Breitbart about Broussard’s exchanges with Weiner. (Source: Lee Stranahan Blog Talk Radio show)
Sammy Finkelman (d3daeb) — 7/18/2011 @ 2:36 pmNew York Post “Page 6” article: d. 6/22/11):
Last Updated: 12:32 AM, June 22, 2011
Posted: 12:07 AM, June 22, 2011
Mayor Bloomberg’s former deputy mayor Kevin Sheekey has been boasting in political circles that he’s been onto Anthony Weiner’s kinky ways since he was a City Council member. Insiders said Sheekey claims he used the intel to discourage Weiner, who was elected to the Council in 1991, before he became a congressman, from running for the Democratic mayoral nomination in 2009. One said, “He told Weiner he knew about him and if he ran he would make it public.” Weiner’s rep declined to comment. A rep for Bloomberg LP, where Sheekey now works, said, “Untrue.”
Read more: http://www.nypost.com/p/pagesix/early_warning_YxeBHLXpLe8Awb67RnbIjI#ixzz1SVH5ubAw
It wasn’t Sheekey, apparently, it was Wolfson.
The pictured is captioned Kevin Sheeky with only 2 E’s in the name.
Sammy Finkelman (d3daeb) — 7/18/2011 @ 4:43 pm2263 Sammy
I made an error a few times in this thread, both earlier and recently. JGCA graduated UCLA 2 decades ago, not 1.
JGCA Resume
JGMA, who is in her early 20s, was not pretending to be a woman in her 40s who graduated UCLA 20 years ago by telling Lee she was currently an undergrad at UCLA.
JGMA wasn’t trying to fool anyone into thinking she was JGCA.
koam @wittier (1fd5aa) — 7/18/2011 @ 10:33 pmWittier,
No but the woman that called Lee and JP claimed to have grown up in MA for a few years and then moved to CA when she was 8-10 and that she lived in CA when she called them lsat month.
So maybe we really have three (3) Jennifer Georges.
1. Real one that tweets, went to UCLA many years ago, may have also worked at UCLA, since on is listed on the staff and holds a bachelor’s degree in English from UCLA.
2. Real on that filed police report in MA and may hvae attended writting retreats with Prof. Hunter.
3. Fake once that called Lee and JP and blended the history of two unrelated JGs.
Joe
Joe Smith (54c0c1) — 7/18/2011 @ 10:57 pm2280 Joe
JGMA who called Lee did say she was in LA. She also said she was afraid that people were coming to kill her that day. So it seems unlikely that she’d call the man she thinks might be involved and give her correct location during the first call.
Lee has the crying and extremely scared JGMA call Preston to demonstrate that he’s not a killer. In fact, he has friends who are reporters at NYT. Lee was using Preston like JGMA used Hunter – as a credentialed, well-known reference.
There’s no evidence that the JGMA who called Lee and talked to Preston was in any way pointing them toward JGCA. That idea is just silly, given that JGCA is 40+ and hasn’t been a UCLA student for 20 years. Did JGMA think she’d fool a NYT reporter by saying she’s currently a UCLA student by pretending to be a woman with whom she shares a common name and who graduated from that school when the caller was an infant? Hunter was going to verify that JGMA was 20-ish not 40-ish.
If 2 and 3 are different people, then 3 was pretending to be 2 and not 1.
JGCA was already in Lee’s head at the moment JGMA called. So his confusion about the details, his firm belief in the moment that it was JGCA who was calling him, combined with his persistent belief that he had this all figured out before anyone else, led to a lot of confusion for everyone.
JGCA is not involved, never should have been considered, and was not the object of misdirection by anyone else claiming to be JG.
koam @wittier (1fd5aa) — 7/18/2011 @ 11:13 pmJGMA was trying to impersonate JGCA:
1. by telling Lee she was in the UCLA directory when it is JGCA who is in the UCLA directory.
2. by telling Lee she lived in CA
3. and don’t forget the comment at STLAH impersonating JGCA
I wonder if JGCA would have a legal case against JGMA.
qritiq (1440aa) — 7/19/2011 @ 6:21 amFBI rounding up Anonymous “teens & early 20s”
koam @wittier (9fe39b) — 7/19/2011 @ 6:44 am16 arrests, 30 to 40 search warrants today, more arrests expected.
koam @wittier (9fe39b) — 7/19/2011 @ 1:00 pmYeah, I was reflecting on those searches and arrests myself, Koam.
Can’t find much specific on the FBI’s website. But damn there are a lot of hustlers in this country. Jeez. Reading through their local press releases is not inspiring my faith in anybody.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/19/2011 @ 1:37 pmNeal seems to be threatening me here. Comparing himself to a gang member and saying I am calling him out on his street? His evidence? Some guy named PeterPavel1, who is totally unknown to me and acting wholly without any direction from me — but whose actions apparently make Neal feel justified in threatening me with some kind of Internet harassment.
Patterico (f724ca) — 7/19/2011 @ 5:53 pmrauschnauzer throw down
ColonelHaiku (cc5c75) — 7/19/2011 @ 6:02 pmlil’ puppet? he lil’ sissy
insane in membrane
colonel got a date
ColonelHaiku (cc5c75) — 7/19/2011 @ 6:04 pmwith twenty two eighty eight
he just can’t be late
There is some discussion of Neal’s threat to Patterico in this thread.
I don’t know what about Patterico so infuriates Neal.
Brett probably worked with Ron B, and now he’s working with Neal R. Maybe he searches for mentally handicapped paranoids and fills their heads with all the evil things he can come up with?
Whatever reason Neal has to justify his behavior, he hasn’t explained it clearly. I’ve read over his strange blogging, which doesn’t have much of a coherent pattern. He’ll link lulzsec’s torrent with the troops’ passwords. Or he’ll blurt out he’s a hacker. Or he’ll talk about starving Africans. When he talks about Patterico, he asserts some kind of bad deed involving Weiner, but we know Weiner wasn’t hacked. He claims Patterico is working with someone named Seth, and never explains why he says that. He claims Seth is a stalker, but he never shows why he thinks that.
It’s quite obvious too. It’s not like he’s skipping over little details, or perhaps claiming his assumption is a fact. This isn’t like Lee’s occasional assertion of something as fact that he’s already explained why he believes. This is more jarring. He’ll lay out a case of points that don’t seem to have any basis in reality.
Either he’s crazy, or he thinks his audience if full of idiots. And either way, he is specifically extremely mad at P. He’s written several pieces showing how he’s obsessed with Patterico, and it’s getting worse.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/19/2011 @ 6:04 pmage like a fine wine
ColonelHaiku (cc5c75) — 7/19/2011 @ 6:05 pmpost twenty two eighty nine?
don’t think so Mad Dog
Dustin – I think Neal’s self-described cute butt may have led to some kind of colorful adventure, resulting in his advanced case of Lyme Disease. Some pretty interesting psychological and neurological disorders can result from untreated Lyme Disease, so there’s no telling what our boy Neal is dealing with.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/19/2011 @ 6:42 pmThose Neal pieces get very few comments over there. I wonder if more than a small handful even reads them.
koam @wittier (9fe39b) — 7/19/2011 @ 7:11 pm2291 daleyrocks
The face has that brain-damaged look.
Mandy saw the ass & declared it rancid.
koam @wittier (9fe39b) — 7/19/2011 @ 7:14 pm2292. I bet most of his readership is from here.
jeffeneff (707f3d) — 7/19/2011 @ 7:15 pm2294 jeff
koam @wittier (9fe39b) — 7/19/2011 @ 7:24 pmThat’s what I was thinking.
koam @wittier @2293 – I am happy to go with Mandy’s assessment and plan no independent verification of my own.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/19/2011 @ 7:26 pm“Those Neal pieces get very few comments over there. I wonder if more than a small handful even reads them.”
koam @wittier – Stop. You’re going to hurt Neal’s feelings, if he has any.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/19/2011 @ 7:28 pmoh Mandy you came
ColonelHaiku (cc5c75) — 7/19/2011 @ 7:39 pmand assessed without taking
made JD happy
struggle continues
ColonelHaiku (cc5c75) — 7/19/2011 @ 7:42 pmbut twenty two ninety nine
fat bastard you’re mine
and I’m spent…
ColonelHaiku (cc5c75) — 7/19/2011 @ 7:42 pm2296 daleyrocks
I guess she’s not a fan of the dingleberries.
koam @wittier (9fe39b) — 7/19/2011 @ 7:57 pmI just wanted to remind y’all, as if you needed this point, but Neal Rauhauser was demanding a photograph of Patterico’s wife.
This creepy SOB explained how he was working with felon Brett Kimberlin, and then explained he needed to see what Patterico’s wife looked like. For no logical reason. The implication was obvious.
Koam, I wanted to note that sometimes, Neal does get a lot of comments. Like this one a few months ago where he’s angry that executives at a bank haven’t been fired for the crime of donating their personal money, legally, to elect Governor Scott Walker. ‘When do we get to see their pink slips!’ he demands.
He’s a thug. There’s really no other word for him. There’s no reasoning with him. He just wants to make life horrible for people who Neal feels aren’t progressive enough.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/19/2011 @ 8:22 pmI don’t know what about Patterico so infuriates Neal.
Integrity is always a threat to dishonesty. Cockroach, Light, and all that jazz…
Dana (4eca6e) — 7/19/2011 @ 8:25 pmThis Neal guy gives me the creeps.
Noodles (3681c4) — 7/19/2011 @ 8:27 pm“I guess she’s not a fan of the dingleberries.”
koam @wittier – Prolly. I think they must be an acquired taste. Whenever Neal pull his head out he can look at them up close and personal.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/19/2011 @ 8:35 pmI don’t know how Kos works, but it sort of looks like comment(s) in defense of Pat in response to Stranded Wind have been hidden (by Neal) so that readers there are now only seeing one side of the discussion. I guess if people click the “-” next to the comment it can become hidden. I clicked the “+” (but don’t have a Kos account yet) and it showed a caption that says
Yesterday, this comment (quoted below in full) from a member, The Scyphers Murder (the moniker is a reference to a Kimberlin case which has been covered by Liberty Chick) appeared below the latest Stranded Wind post which Pat has stated includes a threat. (See comment currently numbered 2286 above.)
Another regular commenter at Kos has raised the question of whether hiding comments on your own “diary” is against Kos rules.
Here’s the full comment below. It includes a mention that TSM’s prior comment(s) may not have shown up after posting. (TSM’s prior post “What did Seth Allen fabricate?” from July 19 comes up as blank.)
koam @wittier (9fe39b) — 7/20/2011 @ 7:27 am2306 koam @wittier
Update: a few minutes ago, the link to the comment quoted in full above would show you that comment… Now it’s showing up as a blank screen.
(Yes, I know who I sound like.) I realize sometimes links stop working temporarily for no good reason.
Earlier the comment was hidden in the original Stranded Wind comments thread. Now, it shows up as a blank page when you click on it from The Scyphers Murder member page.
So if I’m not understanding how it works at Kos, please let me know.
koam @wittier (9fe39b) — 7/20/2011 @ 7:42 amFive prior comments in defense of Pat by The Scyphers Murder at Kos are currently still there.
koam @wittier (9fe39b) — 7/20/2011 @ 7:52 amAn open letter to Dan Wolfe: http://wp.me/p6l52-fr
qritiq (1440aa) — 7/20/2011 @ 8:15 amqritiq – What makes you assume there is any funding involved or that DW is not who he claims to be?
Please lay out your case.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/20/2011 @ 8:50 amqritiq – I would be very easy to write a similar open letter for the Reid socks. Why not put those up as well?
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/20/2011 @ 8:52 amThat’s really interesting, Koam. No you don’t sound like Ron at all. No offense intended to him (though I hope he gets better), but you’re showing a clear and specific basis for your concern.
Yes, Neal is apparently trying to hide those comments. What appears to set him off most is that it’s pointing so directly at the fact his claims have no basis. He’s smearing innocent people.
Brett sued his detractor, Socrates, learning his name, and since then, they have been plastering his name with accusations, but with absolutely no basis. I think the idea is that it will scare most people out of criticizing Brett. If they ever learned who The Scyphers Murder is, they would do the same to him. I saw Neal make a comment once that he has no assets, so he feels he can do whatever he wants to people (he’s resistant to a judgment).
Anyway, bottom line, this makes clear that Neal knows he’s wrong. He would answer questions like those if he could, because it would help convince his audience (any sane member of which also wonders what Neal’s basis is). Instead, he just eliminates the questions.
Might I add, be careful when clicking links on his page. Out of an abundance of caution, just in case he’s really this super hacker he’s claiming to be.
——–
Qritiq, I’ve been long wondering about something. It was said that Dan Wolfe was issuing violent threats too. When I criticized his doing so, I made the mistake of not looking for the threats first… taking the word of someone who turned out to be a little reckless about how he described things. Some folks then criticized me (justifiably), saying Dan’s threats were to ruin someone’s career, rather than anything illegal.
Since you’re following that part of the story, I was hoping you could clear this aspect up. I’ve got no ‘gotcha’ or ultimate point to this. I’m just curious what the truth of the matter was.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/20/2011 @ 9:08 amqritiq – How about an open letter to Neal Rauhauser? Kind of a put up or shut up type request. I would love to see the response to that.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/20/2011 @ 9:22 am2310. “They’re closing in on you. Quick, call the New York Times!” Critiq, you think someone is involved in illegal activity (I presume) and in over their head, and you appear to want to help them. Why would you suggest they go to a NYT reporter and not call a lawyer? Are you working for Preston or the NYT in some capacity? A simple and direct question, sparked by this dubious display of concern and other recent online activity.
jeffeneff (707f3d) — 7/20/2011 @ 9:38 amOf course, his response to the one Koam quoted was to ignore the request and remove the comment. He can’t remove the comment from this blog, but he can continue to ignore it, reasserting what he’s acting as though he knows is a lie.
—
Qritiq, is it really in Dan’s best interest to go to the press? I mean, seriously? It might be in yours and mine because we really are curious about him, but does he really want what happened to Mike Stack? Does he want Neal demanding photos of his wife, either?
And of all reporters, Preston? Why her? JGCA had her pegged, my friend.
Anyway, I am curious if anyone can clear up my question about the threats from him. I was curious, but I don’t think it relates to anything current.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/20/2011 @ 9:43 am2308 koam @wittier
2309 dustin
I kept a copy of the 5 related TSM comments from Kos that were still up after the 2 from July 19 disappeared. (just in case they too disappear) I sent a copy to Pat.
If anyone wants a copy, let me know. If you think I should just post them here, I can.
I don’t know who TSM is but you can see what other subjects s/he comments on at Kos. Seems to only be interested in Neal’s topics. Neal calls TSM a Breitbart troll in one reply.
koam @wittier (9fe39b) — 7/20/2011 @ 10:04 amFwiw, the Kos kids want to clean up their act, within limits, so as to become a more Viable Political Force. Iirc, they banned 9/11 truther posts. Which is to say, they may try to deal correctly with violations of their own rules such as burying or deleting comments, etc. Not that i’d bet on it, but for the more intrepid out there, it might be worth a shot.
I’m sort of wary of giving him more popularity by posting “back and forths”. Perhaps a stock reply, naming names, for each of his posts (if it is not spamming, by Kos rules) would be a good way to warn people without it being a total energy drain.
jeffeneff (707f3d) — 7/20/2011 @ 10:41 am2317 Jeff
Well the observation persists that the SW threads about Weinergate & Breitbart are largely ghost towns. (few member comments, few votes)
I suppose it would be easy for a few people to join and at least click “+” on comments that we don’t want to see disappear.
koam @wittier (9fe39b) — 7/20/2011 @ 10:49 am2306 koam
Neal has posted in reply to delver rootnose that comments like TSM’s should be banned from Kos in the first place. He admits his hiding the post was against the rules. He doesn’t mention if he also made it go blank or not. I don’t know how that works.
koam @wittier (9fe39b) — 7/20/2011 @ 11:00 amWow, did y’all see Neal’s post on Israel buying a proxy war by funding politicians via Citizen United? He even ties it into the Tea Party’s worry over border security. He claims Israel buying a proxy war is more of a border issue than Mexican illegal immigration.
One of his commenters notes that his example is completely inaccurate, illegal before and after Citizens United. He admits that yeah, he’s wrong, but so what? There’s an election coming!
I saw that in March he was getting 500 comments. Now he’s getting a dozen on a good day. I think admitting that his reporting is hopelessly wrong, but he doesn’t really care because he’s trying to elect democrats, undermines the value of reading his stuff.
Imagine you’re a progressive democrat, and you complained to a friend that Citizens United was bad because you’re afraid of the Jews buying a war with Iran! You would soon learn to find a better source of information.
Link, but be warned, Neal has difficultly expressing a coherent train of thought.
He acts a lot like Ron, actually. I wonder if they used similar drugs and have similar mental problems. This isn’t a joke. I really wonder.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/20/2011 @ 11:07 amThe Scyphers Murder has re-posted that comment over at Kos.
Here’s one
Here’s another new one from TSM which adresses the censorship
Reproduced in full here, before it gets censored:
koam @wittier (9fe39b) — 7/20/2011 @ 11:21 amAnd now another comment from The Scyphers Murder, reproduced in full below:
koam @wittier (9fe39b) — 7/20/2011 @ 11:25 am2322 koam
The header by TSM for the quote above was
(this header is apparently in reference to Neal calling TSM a Breitbart troll) see my comment 2319, above.
koam @wittier (9fe39b) — 7/20/2011 @ 11:28 amkoam @wittier – Ron probably views those TSM comments as threats. He seems to have problems grokking the intertubes.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/20/2011 @ 11:38 am2322 koam
delver rootnose, experienced kos member, responded to TSM’s latest posts and offered some explanation of the rules over there.
koam @wittier (9fe39b) — 7/20/2011 @ 12:46 pmOne of The Scyphers Murder’s comments on Kos from July 19 has reappeared in the SW post “Patterico’s Personal Pipsqueak” comments section. Earlier, it had been linked on TSM’s page only, but had been blank (a title only without included comments). Prior to now, it was not even showing up on the PPP page. Now it’s back:
koam @wittier (9fe39b) — 7/20/2011 @ 1:20 pmTSM responds to delver rootnose:
and
Of course I’m posting these here only because comments in defense of Patterico and in opposition to Neal have been disappearing at Kos, so better to get a snapshot posted here. One from yesterday, July 19, titled, “My comment didn’t post!” is still MIA.
koam @wittier (9fe39b) — 7/20/2011 @ 1:33 pmOf course. But it’s also helpful because it shows us what Neal most wants removed. He wants these questions erased altogether. Why?
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/20/2011 @ 2:00 pm2329 Dustin
Yes. That’s what I was thinking….out of at least 7 posts by TSM related to this, as of this morning, only 2 had been hidden from Neal’s Pipsqueak thread of July 19, and eventually went “blank” (the comments could not be seen even from TSM’s page).
So these 2 out of the 7 or more were apparently the 2 that ticked him off enough to try to wipe them out altogether, admittedly violating his home court rules in doing so.
So what is in these 2 comments (“What did Seth Allen fabricate?” and “My comment didn’t post!”) that pushed him over the kos line?
koam @wittier (9fe39b) — 7/20/2011 @ 2:20 pm“jeff” – I do not now, nor have I ever worked for The New York Times or anyone associated with it.
Here’s a simple and direct question for you: Who do you work for?
Dustin – I myself have not seen any threats of any kind coming from the material verified to be associated with the DW twitter accounts, but I have not read all of it.
Lots of speculation based on past history, but I haven’t seen anything concrete tying Neal into this. Certainly, he does understand how these operations work.
qritiq (1440aa) — 7/20/2011 @ 3:56 pm2328. qritiq, fair question back at me. I work for no one related to this matter in any way.
But seriously, if you learned someone close to you were deeply involved in some nefarious political plot, would you tell them to see the press before seeing a lawyer?
Isn’t that a little like telling a pig to visit a butcher?
jeffeneff (707f3d) — 7/20/2011 @ 4:37 pmJeffeneff,
I came across your work. Highly respected. Will buzz you in the morning.
koam @wittier (9fe39b) — 7/20/2011 @ 4:45 pmDeja vu flashback
jeffeneff (707f3d) — 7/20/2011 @ 4:56 pmI’ve seen this movie before
Don’t Answer The Phone!
Thanks. We’re in the same boat.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/20/2011 @ 5:29 pmOh yeah, and I think qritiq is wise not to assume too much of Neal’s involvement.
Perhaps Neal was trying to fool the Republicans and protect Weiner. Perhaps just saw a story rich with potential for screwing with people, and jumped in a little later.
Of course, I’m much more concerned about the threats than I am with who Dan Wolfe was and what he was trying to accomplish. That’s interesting, and perhaps related, but not my priority. And what we’ve seen from Neal, combined with the other weird threats, really does paint an ugly picture of him.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/20/2011 @ 5:34 pmLee said he had sent a private investigator after Wolfe — a claim that he later admitted on his radio show had been a lie (one of many) — and Wolfe reacted by saying that he was going to ruin Lee, and that Lee didn’t know who he was messing with.
I took it as an angry reaction to the PI lie, not as a threat.
As I said to Ron Brynaert earlier, YMMVIYI.
Patterico (f724ca) — 7/20/2011 @ 5:40 pmCan we get a sufficiently vague and redacted status report on what/which law enforcement is doing? Are they active?
koam @wittier (9fe39b) — 7/20/2011 @ 5:46 pmLaw enforcement is doing something.
Patterico (f724ca) — 7/20/2011 @ 5:55 pmgood they do something
ColonelHaiku (cc5c75) — 7/20/2011 @ 6:00 pmlong as it doesn’t involve
donuts and coffee
2335. Careful what you wish for.
jeffeneff (707f3d) — 7/20/2011 @ 6:02 pmc’mon officer!
ColonelHaiku (cc5c75) — 7/20/2011 @ 6:02 pmthey steal my spinners and tires
hamburger midnite
twenty two forty
ColonelHaiku (cc5c75) — 7/20/2011 @ 6:04 pmguard that damn corner Shorty!
joe’s name Conforte
now some contend that
ColonelHaiku (cc5c75) — 7/20/2011 @ 6:07 pmrock n’ roll good for body
and good for the soul
but bad for the heart
ColonelHaiku (cc5c75) — 7/20/2011 @ 6:08 pmbad for the mind bad for deaf
and bad for the blind
ColonelHaiku:
Stop threatening Ron Brynaert!
Patterico (f724ca) — 7/20/2011 @ 6:10 pmmake some men crazy
ColonelHaiku (cc5c75) — 7/20/2011 @ 6:11 pmsome men fools some men lazy
then they start to drool
ron ask for reason
ColonelHaiku (cc5c75) — 7/20/2011 @ 6:14 pmwhy he gotta come down feet
don’t even touch ground
Patrick- iirc, wolf also expressed the desire to punch lee hard in the face ( though he backed off about actually doing it) and sic his mob friends on Lee.. Sort of A pain style threats that hinted broadly at criminal retribution, with walkbacks.
It was that sort of in-between sort of threat, although of course it was alll a put on act anyway.
Sarahw (af7312) — 7/20/2011 @ 6:14 pmsuspicion come in
ColonelHaiku (cc5c75) — 7/20/2011 @ 6:17 pmand it ruin his mind deep
paranoia strike
wolf nothing but dawg
ColonelHaiku (cc5c75) — 7/20/2011 @ 6:19 pmsense weakness in stranahan
cuz he liberal
hey Brynaert look out
ColonelHaiku (cc5c75) — 7/20/2011 @ 6:23 pmyour window don’t first thing you
see look just like me?
don’t mean to mislead
ColonelHaiku (cc5c75) — 7/20/2011 @ 6:26 pmyou or to supercede you
time for bootheels to………… be wanderin’
That makes sense. Dan Wolfe threatens to ruin Lee’s career. Suddenly I’m making extremely pointed criticisms of Lee’s reporting, to which Lee contacts me directly to complain that I’m ruining his career. And then he starts treating me the same way he’s treated everyone he thinks could possibly be Dan Wolfe.
Makes a lot of sense if all that matters to him is finding Danny boy.
If Dan Wolfe was a political operation, funded to take Weiner down, that is damn newsworthy and I hope Lee and everyone else learns the truth. But if not… if Dan is a jilted girlfriend or a conservative playing pedo-hunter, it is pretty clear that learning who he is would be a very, very bad thing for that person. It wouldn’t be justice.
I’m encouraged to know that.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/20/2011 @ 6:30 pmCross posted with you Sarah.
Thanks for sharing this. Frankly, that kind of thing does cross the line and now I have to change my f***ing mind again. Crap. But out of simply intellectual honesty, if this guy was doing Alicia Pain style threats, that justifies Lee’s interest level (though I would still say not the collateral damage, minor as it must seem to those unaffected by it).
Dammit.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/20/2011 @ 6:32 pm2346. 2352. Alicia Paine’s fingerprints are those of one who spent some time studying the legal limits of threats (even if he got it wrong), and doesn’t fit with with anything of any Weiner puppets. Different character, different screenplay, different motive. “Hmmm”
jeffeneff (707f3d) — 7/20/2011 @ 7:04 pmI didn’t mean Dan = Alicia, Jeff.
I meant that style of conduct, where someone suggests they could punch you in the face if you don’t shut up, or your safety isn’t guaranteed if you don’t drop the subject.
Frankly, I’ve not seen it, but SarahW is quite reliable.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/20/2011 @ 7:23 pm2354 Dustin
You’re ruining his career?
koam @wittier (9fe39b) — 7/20/2011 @ 7:23 pmI’m not trying to snipe at Lee, and no, I do not think I am ruining his career. That was a point he raised to me, which if I could go back, I’d just delete and leave private.
I think it suggests some kind of consistency between Dan’s promises to ruin Lee and my criticism of Lee. Not that I’m dan, of course, but at the time, perhaps that’s something Lee was worried about. I mean… it was kinda his answer to everything.
Anyway, he was concerned my criticisms would ruin his career. But what I said was true, so if that’s correct, he did it to himself. I think that was over-dramatic though. People do not have to be perfect. They simply have to show they understand when they screw up.
Right now just doesn’t seem like a good time to instigate a fight with Lee anyway. One of my themes was that I thought Lee was willing to do anything to get an interesting story first, but in fact, he is holding off on some of this because it’s being left to law enforcement. It would be very counterproductive if Lee had to explain this in detail, so I just want to grant as much and not put him on the defensive at this time.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/20/2011 @ 7:29 pm2354. Whoops, pardon.
jeffeneff (707f3d) — 7/20/2011 @ 7:31 pmI just re-read about 60 tweets from Dan to Lee, all were Dan confronting Lee about how Lee treated Dan. No threats. Dan compliments Lee and clearly argues points. Worst thing he says is (to Ace), that “Lee can STFU.” But in a long stream of commentary, no threats, no mention of violence, nothing painful. I’m looking at Dan’s newer Twitter account. Tweets were in early June.
koam @wittier (9fe39b) — 7/20/2011 @ 7:38 pmSearched for Stranahan mentions in the Ladd interview w/ Patriot. Didn’t see violence or career threats.
When did the career thing happen?
koam @wittier (9fe39b) — 7/20/2011 @ 7:43 pmJust one point: someone could pretend to be Dan and then threaten Lee.
In fact, someone could pretend to be Lee and threaten JGMA.
Someone is actually that manipulative.
I haven’t mentioned this publicly, but someone on twitter with Lee’s avatar under the name St. Ranahan had such a clever way of screwing with me that I thought he might be Lee promising to ramp up the conduct I was complaining about (at the time were were fighting). Fortunately, I didn’t act on it and didn’t even publicly draw attention to it. In fact, I kinda backed off, unsure what the hell was going on. That doesn’t mean I’m cool with Lee’s behavior. I’m not. But I think it’s serving someone else’s purpose that Lee and others are focused on all these online threats. It pushes people to say things and have fights, and then the original BSing instigator is gone, but the fight is more real than ever. When things started to die down a little, there’s Ron fueling it. My guess is that someone was manipulating him into being very paranoid. If you look over Neal’s blogging:
Why did Neal pick this image specifically to illustrate his twitter manipulation? (note what’s highlighted)
And then this one?
My take is that he knows Ron is having trouble right now and wants his paranoia to become a weapon of chaos. Lee is an apostate liberal, so he would certainly attract a particularly vicious attitude, perhaps including a desire to set Lee up to some extent.
Granted, it’s very believable that Dan was so mad at Lee he lost control of his comments and said something really stupid. Lee’s behavior isn’t an excuse for talking about beating him up, but anyway, I don’t want to tar and feather the guy.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/20/2011 @ 8:27 pmMore twitter suckage. Don’t know if it’s a rogue twitter employee or a hacker, but:
twitter Kills the Most Important State Level Conservative Group in the Country
http://www.redstate.com/erick/2011/07/20/twitter-kills-the-most-important-state-level-conservative-group-in-the-country/
elissa (7f84b5) — 7/20/2011 @ 8:34 pmelissa, that kind of thing is almost certainly what Neal and his anonymiss friends are capable of doing.
Why do they need thousands of fake twitter bots? To pull stupid stuff like reporting conservative activists as spam so they are removed from the debate.
That’s how Neal operates when he’s off twitter, so it makes perfect sense.
I’m sorry I diverted attention to Dan. He doesn’t interest me. What Elissa’s bringing up does.
When Neal is boasting about being a hacker, what is he talking about? Twitter bots. He claims just for his ‘annoy’ feature. That’s BS.
He claimed he had a method that would have been so effective Weiner would still have his seat if he had been working with Neal. my impression was he meant he would somehow remove Weiner’s critics from twitter. (he’d have to remove Weiner too to save him, though, but I don’t know if Neal has yet figured out that Weiner sent the pic himself).
The alternative is that Twitter as a private company is actually trying to eliminate conservatives from using their service. I seriously doubt that’s what happened.
Here’s an amusing theory: Neal actually wants democrats to patronize an insane ‘I will eliminate pests from twitter’ botnet. So he creates pests to screw with everybody, even including Weiner.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/20/2011 @ 8:42 pmTSM has added 4 more comments on Neal’s Pipsqueak Post
koam @wittier (9fe39b) — 7/20/2011 @ 9:56 pm2367
now 5
koam @wittier (9fe39b) — 7/20/2011 @ 10:42 pmI have some catching up to do here.
2266:
SF> JGMA didn’t originally intend to talk to anyone else other than Lee Stranahan but she had to call Jennifer Preston since she couldn’t refuse to make the call, or Lee would ignore her entirely.”
Daleyrocks: Sammy – Some JGMA filed a complaint with the Boston PD. Lee contends it is the same JGMA who called him. How does that fit with your theory?
Initially, JGMA wanted Lee to believe that the name JG had nothing to do with the Nikki Reed use of the account. When that didn’t work, she needed to do something to slow down Lee.
Sammy Finkelman (d3daeb) — 7/21/2011 @ 4:37 pmJennifer Preston has always been more skeptical – more careful about – the identity of the people she is talking to. She doublechecked the IDs that Tommy Christopher had. No such California IDs existed. H
Here she wanted more proof as to who she was talking to and JGMA gave the name of the peofessor. Jennifer Preston then gave that name to ee Strnahan and they both talked to him. Somethinbg was awry with the story Lew Hunter told Jennifer Preston and she came to believe taht the professor was lying. (rather than that JGMA had lied in Nebraskaand adopted some of the resume of JGCA – I’;m assuming.)
Lee also said – I’ve been reading more – that JGMA explained that people had gotten her number (and were able to threaten her) from the UCLA directory which by law must default to conbtaining student;s name addresses emails etc. ‘
She claimed she had now blocked it. So Lee and JP couldn’t get it.
But she probably really wasn’t the kind of student who should have been on that directory since she wasn’t in California in spite of her initial claims that she was.
Sammy Finkelman (d3daeb) — 7/21/2011 @ 4:44 pm2370 sammy
thanks.
The whole UCLA directory thing is speculation from the start, including by JGMA.
She tells Lee she goes to UCLA.
She tells Lee she got threatening calls.
Lee says, “it doesn’t make sense that you got any calls because, well, how could anyone find you? because I’ve been looking and some very well-funded reporters have been looking (he had been talking about this earlier…that people were looking for her) and no one had been able to find you.”
JGMA tells Lee, “well they could have looked me up in the student directory”
Lee says, “well then can I look you up in the UCLA student directory to verify who you are?”
JGMA says, “no you can’t because after I got 2 threatening calls I went to the directory and made my info unlisted”
So, JGMA wasn’t trying to get Lee to verify her in the directory (or to have him find ex-staffer JGCA’s info either), otherwise she wouldn’t have said she’d removed her info.
When you go to the directory, you can find JGCA’s old listing there.
1) It was clearly a staff listing, not a student listing
2) It’s old in any case…JGCA hasn’t worked there for over a year. Her name probably should have been removed in 2010. The number associated with JGCA’s name at the time (in June, I looked it up that day and called it before business hours) was not a personal line. It rings to the department phone where she was a staffer. It doesn’t ring to a personal line of her replacement either.
So finding JGCA’s name in the directory should have meant nothing to Lee …because of the above, it was clearly unrelated to what JGMA told him. When he found that listing he should have concluded, “that’s the wrong JG.” However, Lee had already found JGCA’s name separately on 123people and was fixated on her as a suspect. So rather than see it as unconnected…he saw it as even more connected to JGCA. That was a bad idea.
FYI, the info at UCLA directory has changed for everyone since mid-June. They now publish more info on directory listings, including full student school and home addresses. The database function online has been modified in recent weeks..it has a new look and feel and more detailed info in results for both students and staff.
JGCA’s (outdated) listing reads:
koam @wittier (69a056) — 7/21/2011 @ 6:12 pm
koam @wittier – I seriously doubt a university would give out full student school and home addresses for privacy reasons today. That is nuts.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/21/2011 @ 7:15 pmSure they do, Daleyrocks. I think I posted link about what UCLA does, maybe even in this thread – though it WAS an article about how maybe availability of info should change.
SarahW (af7312) — 7/21/2011 @ 7:24 pm2372 daleyrocks
A month ago I think UCLA didn’t give all that out. Now they do.
koam @wittier (69a056) — 7/21/2011 @ 7:27 pm2372 daleyrocks
i picked a name out of the air “Robert Smith”
Name SMITH, ROBERT J
Title Student
Email smithrrrxxxx@lawnet.ucla.edu
Student Address xxxx SAWTELLE BLVD APT xxx, LOS ANGELES, CA, UNITED STATES 90066-1617
Phone 801-589-xxxx
Permanent Address 2562 N xxxx W, SUNSET, UT, UNITED STATES 84015
Permanent Phone 801-xxx-820x
I redacted some details. But it’s all on the UCLA site.
koam @wittier (69a056) — 7/21/2011 @ 7:33 pmI know that on at least one of my alumni network sites, I can put in all kinds of details about me…and then I can check or uncheck each detail to determine if it’s available to the public or to members of the site.
So some people at UCLA can choose to hang all their data out there. JGMA said she basically unchecked all her info so that it doesn’t appear.
koam @wittier (69a056) — 7/21/2011 @ 7:35 pmHi Ron – If everything around you is getting hacked, why are you still on the grid? Seriously, what’s up with that?
I am loving you calling everybody who uses a screen name a sock, even if they’ve been using the same name for years.
I love you man! Don’t ever change.
BTW, do you know what YMMV stands for? Do you know it is a popular acronym on certain conservative sites? No, I’ll bet you did not know that.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/21/2011 @ 7:39 pmSarah and koam – I am aware that alumni sites do and the ones I belong to are password protected. I’ve got my info on there and yes, I can choose to make some of it available to the public at least for the grad school stuff – like a resume extender. It’s crazy for an institution to make the info available to the public for all its undergrads.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/21/2011 @ 7:43 pm“So some people at UCLA can choose to hang all their data out there.”
koam and Sarah – Crossposted. So now the deal is it’s optional. I feel better. No guaranteed pervs or stalkers tracking coeds.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/21/2011 @ 7:46 pm2379 daleyrocks
well i’m assuming that it’s optional as some students display more details than others do…and JGMA said she went online and chose to hide her student listing, according to Lee.
koam @wittier (69a056) — 7/21/2011 @ 7:49 pmWhen the economy collapses the left will achieve their population controls.
DohBiden (d54602) — 7/21/2011 @ 8:27 pmturn your clock back ron
ColonelHaiku (4de8c2) — 7/21/2011 @ 8:30 pmwhen you see me coming down
and you know that’s cold
Weiner is limp.
Spitzer was a pimp.
DohBiden (d54602) — 7/21/2011 @ 8:31 pmWow. That was close!
My twitter and Facebook accounts were almost just hacked.
I’m not even on twitter and Facebook.
These socks are amazing!
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/22/2011 @ 9:36 amA botnet example:
https://twitter.com/#!/Treasabakj
https://twitter.com/#!/Rivkaunvd
I saw these two accounts following me, both “Icelandic” – near-identical posts, both shilling for some icelandic tv channel. Notice that it’s common for the bot username to have the botname plus a few random letters. For example, “ronbrynymmv” (it’s a j-o-k-e, Ron, don’t start Googling like crazy.)
A little searching got me to here: http://topsy.com/www.icelandictv.com/2011/06/the-state-ep-15/
There you can see them standing (large, in charge, tights and cape shit), about 40-strong, a veritable botnet of Icelandic marauders, each with maybe a thousand followers, and each hellbent on infecting us with their social-networking disease, spreading Icelandic TV humor through cultural imperialism.
Point being, there are untold numbers of these nasty things roaming Twitter.
So I did a little checking into botnets, and it gets worse.
This link alone could be the one that sends Ron over the edge: http://asert.arbornetworks.com/2009/08/twitter-based-botnet-command-channel/
Bots apparently tweeted control codes that were used to direct infected computers. This was in 2009.
By 2011, it’s gotten more sophisticated; wrap the tinfoil tighter, Ron, now the bots are sniffing out encryption credentials and starting to do real espionage dirty work:
https://threatpost.com/en_us/blogs/sophisticated-attackers-now-using-social-net-command-and-control-012711
More searches reveal the botnet software infection kit is out on the web, and that you can hire out botnets at $8.94 an hour.
http://www.securelist.com/en/blog/2163/New_tool_allows_script_kiddies_to_build_botnets_via_Twitter
“The tool, which is publically available, is called TwitterNET Builder. It only requires two mouse clicks to create a malicious program which will turn a normal computer into a node in a botnet. TwitterNET Builder will create a profile on Twitter which the infected computer will contact to receive commands and instructions.”
In other words, Neal, for all his hackbragging, could probably get his grandma to install this on his computer.
Your general protection is standard safe computing practices: “Most of these malicious tools re-use functions and code which is easy to identify by effective antivirus software. Make sure that your anti-virus software is updated and that you have installed all security patches from all third party vendors”
It is safe to assume that bad guys might try to identify your IP address by getting you to click on a link to a small-traffic website they control. “Hey Patterico, read this!: http://sniffIP.neal.com” It’s also possible that a malicious webpage could infect a computer whose browser software wasn’t up to date.
Are you paranoid yet? Relax just a little.
It’s not that easy for someone to hack your computer even if they know your IP, if your operating system amd antivirus updates are kept current. To be safer, use a website like anonymouse.org to browse ‘enemy’ webs. To do a general check on your computer’s exposure on the net, go to grc.com then ‘services’ then “Shields Up” and run the checks there. You can probably omit “scan all ports” (it might take awhile, hammer your machine slightly; if your important ports are invisible, your others probably are too). Read the disclaimers and stuff, I’m not going to list them here.
jeffeneff (707f3d) — 7/22/2011 @ 9:44 amI find it difficult to parody Ron, daley.
Do you think he’s serious? I have my doubts at this point. If it turned out he was part of the scam, it would explain a lot.
There is no doubt that he is a thug. And my take is he’s been unable to keep up the act as well as he did earlier. He used to look crazy, and now he looks like a clumsy attention whore pretending to be crazy.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/22/2011 @ 10:07 am“I find it difficult to parody Ron, daley.”
Dustin – Obviously, I don’t. He provides too much material.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/22/2011 @ 10:40 amDustin – The above was not the real daleyrocks commenting. Somebody hacked my comments. Damned socks!
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/22/2011 @ 10:42 amI would never say anything that intelligent.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/22/2011 @ 10:45 amAnd much to my delight. I don’t think he’s on the edge and needs to be coddled anymore. He’s stable. It’s just he’s stable in acting like he’s unstable.
And yes, of course someone hacked your comments. It was me. And this comment was left by you, who hacked my comments.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/22/2011 @ 10:45 amThe New York Post has a front page story today on Weiner. Weiner’s other women but then they take away the headline.
It says he (probably) is in a certain rehabilitation place used by politicians, and they’ve convinced him he has hit rock bottom and has to change because look he’s not getting the kind of job offers he expects — and that Weiner says he has to satisfy 3 women that he has changed: Huma, Huma’s mother, and Hillary Clinton.
Anthony Weiner was seen on an Delta airplane flight from Orlando to New York by a New York Post reporter (obviously only after a leak. This whole story is somebody’s leak. Now the reporter seeing some documents with Weiner – that may not have been intentional.)
He was carrying and studying several documents. They appeared to be a detailed analysis of energy issues in sub-Saharan African countries, as well as real-estate listings for two different grazing and farming properties in Kenya. (!?!)
Who could he be working for? Some job given to him by Bill Clinton, who’s hoping to surprise Obama with news oil or natural gas has been discovered on some property he’s inherited in Kenya from his grandfather or great grandfather?? Or at least that the rights can be sold? Maybe somebody is concocting a scheme to sell exploration rights? Or not even that – just to use that as a hint that something might be a good investment and that Obama maybe is interested in it??
Read more: http://www.nypost.com/p/news/local/brooklyn/weiner_is_facing_hilluva_dilemma_fARecuQmlbXsVpzca6ruDK#ixzz1SrDiyDQU
Read more: http://www.nypost.com/p/news/local/brooklyn/weiner_is_facing_hilluva_dilemma_fARecuQmlbXsVpzca6ruDK#ixzz1SrDGgwWg
http://www.theatlanticwire.com/entertainment/2011/07/new-york-times-new-dc-chief-bon-jovis-911-tribute/40288/
“Former Rep. Anthony Weiner is telling friends that he’s “started therapy for his sex addiction,” but he knows he has work left to do, especially with the women in his life. “My problem,” Weiner reportedly told a friend, “is that I have three women I have to convince that I’m cured: [Wife] Huma [Abedin], her mother — and Hillary.” Hillary is of course Secretary of State Hillary Clinton, who’s Huma’s boss. [New York Post]”
http://www.nypost.com/p/news/local/brooklyn/weiner_is_facing_hilluva_dilemma_fARecuQmlbXsVpzca6ruDK
The links don’t seem to be the same.
Sammy Finkelman (d3de3a) — 7/22/2011 @ 10:58 am2370ff What was there before was only the office addresses of faculty. But students had only one official address – their home address.
Apparently there is some kid of UCLA rule that by default all information must be put on the web.
JGMA already had the answer before she was asked the question – she was called because people found her but now had removed it from public view.
Of course only students enrolled on campus would be in that listing.
When did Lee see the listing for the other JG?
For along time anyway he was assuming there was only one UCLA connectd ZJennifer George.
Sammy Finkelman (d3de3a) — 7/22/2011 @ 11:05 amLOL. Let’s just rule that possibility out.
Why would Weiner be involved in oil speculation?
I wouldn’t put it past him to try to get into running charity work, which does involve Africa.
And I wouldn’t put it past dead tree media from New York to continue being wrong most of the time. Granted the New York Post isn’t the NYT, to its credit, but it’s still not a source I’d rely on.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/22/2011 @ 11:05 am2371 and 2377.
It may be nuts but it is apparently a fact. It’s not mandatory that all this be public, but it is the default, and lots of student have no idea.
Some lawyer probably told them they have to do things that way.
http://www.dailybruin.com/index.php/article/2011/01/uclas_online_campus_directory_undermines_student_privacy
“By default, a student’s full name, title, phone number, address and e-mail address are public in the online directory. Online directory settings can be changed on URSA, but many students neglect to do so because they fail to closely read the website. I was surprised to see my own information – which I automatically assumed was private – in the directory.
Although I’ll admit it’s kind of fun to creep out my friends, this is no laughing matter. A case of mistaken identity was caused by the campus directory, which listed a student who happened to share the same name as a suspect in the December Rose Bowl stabbing. He was contacted by a reporter because his was the one listed in the UCLA directory (the actual suspect was not a UCLA student).”
[This big LA newspaper story means SOCKREID would have known all about this.]
“The UCLA directory was created through one of the school’s privacy policies and is based on federal law. This policy allocates some of the information the law deemed public in 1974 into an online directory, which currently has information on more than 33,000 students. UCLA cannot change the default settings on URSA because that would violate UCLA’s policy, according to university registrar Anita Cotter.”
I don’t understand this, except this is clearly not federal law, but UCLA policy. Apparently, years ago, they decided that they were going to make everything public, so there could never be any issues of invasion of privacy (Because somewhere or other people were given notice)
“There is an unprecedented amount of “personally identifiable information” that is deemed public and that does not require prior consent.
Startlingly, this ranges from home address to even the height and weight of athletes.”
The last I can understand.
“Cotter also said that students who are not given a summer orientation may not know how to properly use URSA. This may have been a factor in the Rose Bowl incident – the student was not an undergraduate, but in medical school.
Although URSA has some important information about privacy settings on the site itself, it doesn’t have all the details and gives a false sense of security….”
Sammy Finkelman (d3de3a) — 7/22/2011 @ 11:21 amSammy – California is nuts.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/22/2011 @ 11:29 amwe’re not only nuts
ColonelHaiku (4de8c2) — 7/22/2011 @ 11:40 amwe are also bankrupt but
Gavin will fix it
2392 Sammy
Interesting find.
It’s difficult to tell where you are writing and where you are quoting. The blockquote command works well and adds clarity.
I don’t see how any of what happened on the call or what we know about the UCLA directory proves that the JGMA who called Lee is a sock.
Lee did not say that JGMA said that she knew for a fact where the person who called her found her number. I spelled out what Lee said earlier in 2317.
koam @wittier (69a056) — 7/22/2011 @ 3:57 pmRe: UCLA’s directory of students’ names and addresses: The University of Texas does the same thing. It even has its own Jennifer George.
DRJ (fdd243) — 7/22/2011 @ 4:33 pmHey Sammy Finkelman—
Just wanted to reach out and thank you for the hard work on the timeline and your efforts in verifying each and every fact.
goatsred (b20383) — 7/22/2011 @ 6:44 pmIt was gratifying to see the feedback I gave you about the tweet to Mike Madden get it explained like what was discussed.
Your timeline is probably the hardest researched and verified of any I have seen. And, most importantly: OBJECTIVE.
Thanks.
DRJ @2397 – UT says the directory is compiled based upon publicly available information. I did not browse student listings, but as a public university it would be interesting to view what they consider public information. It would also be interesting to cross check against some private universities.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/22/2011 @ 9:24 pmRon – I know what your voice sounds like.
I heard strange scratching noises on my phone today. Any idea where those were coming from?
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/22/2011 @ 9:25 pmOne day, we’ll all know what Ron’s voice sounds like.
Ron’s Twitters tonight sound surprisingly sane.
Guilty, yeah. But sane.
Patterico (f724ca) — 7/22/2011 @ 9:36 pmRon did sound different tonight, sort of like the noose was tightening or something, not that that was any kind of a threat or anything, just a mere figure of speech. Trying not to be too Op-Critical here.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/22/2011 @ 9:56 pm2371= how i remember it from the radio show and includes comments to radio audience as well as comments on radio reporting what was said on phone. (not direct quotes.)
you can listen for yourself here http://leestranahan.com/betty-veronica-solved#comments
or here
koam @wittier (69a056) — 7/22/2011 @ 10:46 pmhttp://www.blogtalkradio.com/stranahan/2011/06/20/weinergate-betty-veronia-solved
koam @wittier – I don’t want to dispute it. I just contend it’s a crazy policy for a university to make detailed information about its students available to the general public.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 7/22/2011 @ 10:51 pmI was just about to come here and say that. Ron suddenly has a more sober tone. Maybe a sprinkle of his hackers-everywhere act, but much less hysterical. And he sounds guilty and cautious.
When he resorts to excusing his actions with ‘I was hacked’ no one will believe him. But perhaps that’s part of the scam. Legit victims of hacking will be associated with Ron’s crazy routine.
I am pretty infuriated he spilled one of the beans, but what can you do?
—
As for Lee, he will twist anything you confide in him, and he will fabricate BS to put you on the defensive. When it’s shown he was wrong, he’s already moved on to the next act, unconcerned with his mistakes. He greatly resents being asked to take responsibility for what he did or said.
Previously, in private, Patterico took up for Lee. He didn’t take sides, but asked me to get along if possible… to take it easy on his friend as a personal favor.
Very soon after, Lee stabbed Patt in the back, pushing him into the defensive with falsehoods (he would like Patterico to reveal one piece of information, but Lee isn’t responsible enough for it). His behavior seems utterly reckless to those aware of what a big deal this issue is.
He isn’t trashing some semi-anon commenter, but his own friend… in need.
So if you’re reading this and Lee is trying to bring you into his hissy fits at Patterico, consider the pattern.
I’m struggling to tell myself liars are not necessarily part of the grander plot. In fact, dishonest and selfish men are a valuable tool of the clever hoaxer, I am sure.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/23/2011 @ 12:36 amWow @ Patterico and Ron tweets. This story is bananas!
Noodles (3681c4) — 7/23/2011 @ 1:49 am2385 jeffeneff
Very interesting post about bots & also about security. Not that I understand all of it.
koam @wittier (69a056) — 7/23/2011 @ 7:22 amFlashback: On the hunt for Betty & Veronica
June 18, before the JG name is out in public (though some Journos knew it by then), and the day before JGMA call, just about everyone’s looking for Betty & Veronica — and an animated exchange with the one guy who’d been working with them directly.
A good read. (NSFW)
http://leestranahan.com/about-mediaites-explanation-of-their-fiasco#more-1855
koam @wittier (69a056) — 7/23/2011 @ 8:43 amThe newest from Rauhauser, in which he tries to sick Anonymous on me by (falsely) claiming I post at Big Government.
And because someone at Big Government said something bad about Bradley Manning, therefore Anonymous should come after me. Or something.
[See comments below. Apparently I have had items cross-posted at Big Government. Go figure and mea culpa. — P]
Patterico (f724ca) — 7/23/2011 @ 7:34 pm2410 Patterico
It makes about as much sense as the rest of his rants. So strange.
koam @wittier (69a056) — 7/24/2011 @ 7:59 amDan Wolfe has been silent since Jun 8…until late last night.
His tweets are protected, so you have to follow him to see them. His twitter handle is probably pretty easy to find.
What got Dan (assuming it’s really still him) to talk after 6 1/2 weeks of silence?
Patriotusa76 is back on Twitter with the same profile as Dan had back in the day.
Do not click the link on Patriot’s first tweet, “Hello world”. It is linked to a malware site.
But Dan says that this new Patriot is not Dan, though it has copied Dan’s old Patriot profile exactly.
Again, don’t click the new Patriot’s first tweet link next to “Hello world”
koam @wittier (69a056) — 7/24/2011 @ 8:53 amwolfe in tweets clothing
ColonelHaiku (8a1a1f) — 7/24/2011 @ 8:57 amweiner be old broke dick by
time this thing over
I’m afraid I haven’t been able to keep up with Neal lately. If anyone sees something weird, post it here so I can catch up. And if it’s really bad, make sure you take a screenshot in case he deletes it later.
I’m just too busy with my family. Nothing bad… just having a great weekend with a lot of outdoor time.
Enjoy what’s left of Sunday, guys.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/24/2011 @ 11:31 am2414 Dustin
define “weird”
koam @wittier (69a056) — 7/24/2011 @ 1:52 pm2414. “Weird” is a little like “pornography” – difficult to define, but you know it when you see it.
ronbryn (707f3d) — 7/24/2011 @ 3:46 pm2415. whoops. screenname on 2414 was left over from sockpuppet friday. and i was warned.
jeffeneff (707f3d) — 7/24/2011 @ 3:47 pmNo, wait, I mean “Hacked!”
jeffeneff (707f3d) — 7/24/2011 @ 3:48 pmWeiner hacker.
DohBiden (d54602) — 7/24/2011 @ 3:55 pm2415 ought to be good for a few posts from Ron.
Patterico (f724ca) — 7/24/2011 @ 4:13 pmSomeone writes to say I am listed as a contributor to Big Government. OK. I don’t remember ever publishing anything there. I believe I have contributed only to Big Journalism. Maybe all contributors to any site are listed on all sites.
And, by Neal’s logic, should have Anonymous after them.
(Rolls eyes.)
Patterico (f724ca) — 7/24/2011 @ 4:27 pmThere goes that argument. I just did a search and apparently I have posted there. I found something from September of 2010. Go figure.
I guess Anonymous really should be hacking me after all!
Patterico (f724ca) — 7/24/2011 @ 4:30 pmLooking down the search I see other O’Keefe related items that they cross-posted there. I’m not sure I even realized those were all cross-posted. But it was definitely not false for him to call me a BG contributor. Mea culpa on that one.
Patterico (f724ca) — 7/24/2011 @ 4:31 pm4:34 am
Weinergate’s Incomprehensible Afterlife: A coveted kausfiles link to the first blogger (or anyone) who can explain clearly, in 500 words or less, what the fight between anti-Weinerites Patterico and Lee Stranahan is all about. I’m pretty sure it has something to do with disagreement over the identity of “Dan Wolfe,” the mysterious Web figure who caught Anthony Weiner’s errant twitter message and brought him down. … P.S.: I’m counting on you, Ace. … P.P.S.: For some reason the New York Times now seems uninterested in “Wolfe.” [Because he might turn out to not be a right-wing conspirator?-ed You said that not me]. …
Read more: http://dailycaller.com/2011/07/18/weinergates-incomprehensible-afterlife/#ixzz1T4UCUMaI
Read more: http://dailycaller.com/kausfiles/#ixzz1T4TyH0s7
ColonelHaiku (8a1a1f) — 7/24/2011 @ 5:13 pmPatterico,
Obviously Stranded Wind/Neal thinks it’s enough to tar you by saying you are a contributor at Big Government, which is another way of saying you are guilty by association. If that’s all it takes to tarnish someone then working with Brett Kimberlin should tar his associates for life. However, Neal’s post raises other questions for me:
Did Neal emerge from Twittergate with problems because he revealed a client’s name and had problems with a DBA’s expenses? I can’t tell but it sounds like it.
Neal continues:
Regarding the bolded portion of the foregoing section: Heh.
Moving on:
I agree “real journalists” would be convinced by a Gawker article — if it said what they wanted to hear.
It’s hard to successfully raise a defense to hacking by acknowledging you’re a hacker. Is that why Sony is interested in you, Neal?
I don’t know about PeterPavel1 but, frankly, Anonymous has other concerns right now.
Tommy Christopher has been complaining to Markos about Neal? Hmmm.
Has the FBI has been talking to you, Neal? Hmmm, again.
Is that a threat or a promise?
Murdoch has shut down his newspaper after a deplorable debacle but Breitbart’s stings have been vindicated. It sounds like Neal’s delight is based on silencing “opponents” rather than seeing Murdoch’s company face consequences. (Can we even call Murdoch an opponent if his News Corp employees donated more to Obama than others?) Seems Neal enjoys silencing opponents more than winning the war of ideas.
DRJ (fdd243) — 7/24/2011 @ 5:58 pmIs it safe to say Huma Weiner castrated mini-weiner her husband?
DohBiden (d54602) — 7/24/2011 @ 6:20 pmI happened upon DW today and told him my true feelings about him. He responded like he did when the heat was on: HE DISAPPEARED and then blocked me. The he said that “(to me) your DMs are very different than my public tweets”
So come on Dan, publish them like you did my letters to a NOW FORMER friend in the WH. Then you disappeared. You are the lowest. most vile piece of trash that I have ever known. And the fact that you still are hiding like a little —– but coming around here like anyone wants anything to do with you just drives the point home that you are a scumbag.
My past is out there Dan.
Challenge to you little boy–Publish those DMs if you got em. Publish them. Publish them.
goatsred (b20383) — 7/24/2011 @ 9:28 pmThen watch out for those Clintons. I hear that they’re onto you.
Over at Kos, in Neal’s new post he still insists that Weiner’s twitter account was hacked and that someone else sent that famous photo to Gennette. (You’ll recall that Weiner admitted (boo hoo) on June 6th that his account was never hacked and that he had sent that photo, like he sent other photos to other friends online).
All this in a post that’s about SW’s skill at research using new technology. (He mentions a 30-day trial on some research software).
koam @wittier (69a056) — 7/25/2011 @ 7:22 amIf you read only that paragraph, you’d think sitting Congressman Anthony Weiner never admitted the hacking AND never resigned. It’s an alternate reality this wackadoodle lives in.
Patterico (f724ca) — 7/25/2011 @ 7:43 amDidn’t Weiner admit to sending those photos? Jeez.
Simon Jester (0c87e3) — 7/25/2011 @ 7:45 am2429 Pat
2430 Simon
Wackadoodle? That’s pretty harsh. (/sarc)
How about that there are 14 commenters so far and no one mentions that Weiner admitted sending it?
(Not to mention prior SW diaries which say same thing and commenters just ignore that he still says that Breitbart team hacked Weiner’s accounts.)
So it’s a whole pack of people living in some kind of alternate reality if they consider NR/SW to be a thought leader.
Separately, would the tools he discusses be of any use to anyone here?
koam @wittier (69a056) — 7/25/2011 @ 8:09 amWhy Weinergate Is Still Important http://wp.me/p6l52-fx
Oh btw, I’m sure “jeff” will pipe up now and tell you I wrote things that I didn’t actually write, just like he always does. One has to ask oneself: “Why? What’s in it for him?” I don’t know him, so why would he possibly come out gunning for me? He actually accused me of using my twitter account for self-promotion. It has (get this) 12 followers. I mean I have to laugh.
I noticed his odd behavior, because the regulars here of course ask questions, or even say they think I’m all wet, but they don’t lie about what I’ve written – he really stuck out. The only other person here (also not a Patterico regular pre-’11) who tried to twist my actions (though admittedly not in quite a while) was koam.
I also found it interesting that when I asked if anyone here knew anything about Jimmy Siegel, suddenly the usually verbose (understatement) koam had nothing to say. Don’t have colleagues in common with the man? Don’t know nuthin about him? Really.
qritiq (1440aa) — 7/25/2011 @ 8:36 amThat was quite a righteous comment, DRJ!
Neal’s comment that Weiner was hacked (which Koam quoted) is very pleasing. This greatly reinforces the point that everything he’s saying is false and intended to smear those who are honest. It’s bad enough in this case that any sane reader would see it instantly. His audience comes across as crazy and stupid.
As I’ve said many times, the left is terrible at calling out its fringe.
Neal is in the business of lying and scamming for corrupt democrats. A list of democrats who worked with him would be very useful. Did any of them win their elections though? I’m sure any who are actually in office would be horrified to be associated with a so-called hacker who partners with a domestic terrorist.
Come election season in 2012, I will try to find out who hires Neal and write a letter to the editor of their local newspaper.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/25/2011 @ 12:02 pmHey, qritiq, can you explain what you mean by this?
I recall Lee explaining he lied about Razor in a way designed to drive Razor nuts so he would come forward. Lee explained this was justified (he calls that an apology, though I don’t recall the words “I’m sorry” or “I was wrong”. I recall him explaining the conditions under which Lee intends to lie (to his audience, about his suspected Dan Wolfes) in the future.
“Lie” is Lee’s term.
If that’s what you’re referring to, you’re wrong. Also, if you’re still relying on anything Lee Stranahan tells you, about this story or any other story, after he admits he’s willing to lie to screw with people he needs information from, well, I don’t have anything nice to say to people like that.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/25/2011 @ 12:16 pm2431. Qritiq, you tweeted:
and
And I responded:
My point is that you’re slinging a lot of unsubstantiated stuff. Care to outline your theory here? Then you wrote about me:
What lie? Your use of the word “always” implies more than one, but I’ll settle for one. Please be specific, and be able to separate an opinion I have written from a lie.
I’ll say again, more clearly; your finger-pointing and innuendo resembles a witch-hunt. Your ‘seven names’ reminds me of Joe McCarthy’s list of ‘known communists’. Do you think a person’s legitimacy follows from some sort of posting seniority? I believe it comes from what they write. By the way, were you posting here pre-’11? Do you remember what interested you enough to make your first post here? What I specifically dislike is your cutesy style of mystery and innuendo. You just seem to be casting spitballs to the wind. Write your theory here, if you actually have one. Let people have at it.
jeffeneff (707f3d) — 7/25/2011 @ 3:03 pmNobody asked me anything but I will say this about Qritiq. I like the setup of the blog and the way it lays out the “blind items”. It has people talking and if anything,maybe making a few people think twice.
goatsred (b20383) — 7/25/2011 @ 5:00 pmVery centrist and if it rattles a few cages of the many socks out there, mission accomplished.
Just sayin’
I see your point, but while you are justifiably angry at whoever is behind Dan, and we’d all like to know more, this method of casting aspersions at someone until you see if you were on the wrong track and move on to the next victim… it’s BS and it should be criticized.
I don’t see anything Jeff’s doing that’s justified the flack. And as much as I’d like to learn who Dan is, I agree with Jeff that to some, the real motivation here is not justice, but rather mental masturbation or self promotion.
Anyway, I think Qritiq is sincerely trying to figure this out (and good for him or her), but Jeff’s reactions strike me as pretty damn sincere too.
My proposal is that we not break down into infighting when folks disagree with eachother. If I don’t buy someone’s theories, that alone doesn’t justify accusing me of being in on the grand conspiracy. It’s as simple as that. And if we stir up a storm of anger at little things like disagreement, ultimately that distracts from what really deserves being discussed. Such as Neal’s behavior, what Goatsred has gone through, and Dan Wolfe’s patterns.
How many times has someone defended themselves from the criticism of ‘that assertion is unproven’ by putting their critic’s name in quotes and being rude to them? It’s getting really old.
No disrespect intended to either Qritiq or Jeff by this. It’s just pointless, though.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/25/2011 @ 5:10 pmhey qritiq… i am eagerly awaiting your response to dustin’s question in the 2433 comment. just what was your purpose of MTing a tweet i sent on may 30? obviously you took the time to read my entire feed, and this is the one tweet you thought was worthy of a MT??
you have figured out how twitter works by now, haven’t you? you do understand who i sent that tweet to, don’t you? the last tweet you sent before the MT was this…
which was an extension of this earlier tweet…
did you think my tweet was sent to dan telling him that he should have come clean from the start? am i officially one of the “7 people”? let me give you some advice… you don’t have a clue what you are talking about and you look like a fool.
as for you goatsred, i didn’t see you answer this question from dan…
yeah, i haven’t gone anywhere and neither has dan wolfe. i’m getting really tired of those who continue to trust the word of lee stranahan over that of dan wolfe. if anyone wants to compare the number of lies lee has told to the number of lies dan has told since may 27, i’d be more than happy prove my point…
razor419 (42f6c5) — 7/25/2011 @ 6:04 pmIve never argued here with anyone so I’ll make it as polite as I can with respect to Pat.
razor419-all the people who comment here-wittier,jeff,Sarah,azdist,RocksEm,and the rest,have treated me with nothing but respect.
I can give a f— what DW thinks of me.He blocked me yesterday when I challenged him to publish the DM’s he claimed that were “much different than my tweets”. Whatever the frig that means.
But, he disappeared. I never saw that tweet. But, ya know what, he whined and apologized like a little girl that he felt so bad that he hurt the group and he “wishes that he never saw that tweet”.
I know plenty about him still. And if he understood what I said, he would realize that I know he gave the emails to the Smoking Gun regarding Mr.Issa and my now EX friend that works for him.
So Dan, or **, please print the DM’s and or contact me like a man. You played me like a fool and then took off like a little b—-.
And razor:I see that you stated that You and DW are still here. I wouldn’t go around town bragging about that. I have no beef with you, but if you are buddy buddy with a nameless,faceless person,pass on this note: Man-up Dan. Print the DM’s or shut the —- up.
Razor–I’ll take you up on your offer to prove your point. Prove Lee’s lies versus Dan’s. Difference is that how can you tell what is a lie from someone that has many identities?And disappeared like a little girl when the heat was on? And bailed on the people he called his friends?
You want to see all his bawling emails and DM’s???
Yeah. That’s a great idea. To prove how truthful Dan Wolfe has been.Make a list. Please. Maybe we can make a wager on it. How do we know since you are so tight with the Man Of The Year that you are not him?
goatsred (b20383) — 7/25/2011 @ 8:22 pmStart listing away.
You’ve become DW’s lawyer now,Razor?
goatsred (b20383) — 7/25/2011 @ 8:25 pmDon’t call me out on this forum.
Especially taking Dan Wolfe’s side.
i called you out. answer his question.
razor419 (42f6c5) — 7/25/2011 @ 8:31 pmRazor, I have to agree with Goatsred to the extent that he sure as hell doesn’t owe Dan Wolfe an answer to any questions, and it’s pretty unfair to even suggest he should take Dan at his word at this point.
All Mike did was try to help get the word out that Weiner was, at best, recklessly pervy around kids. For his good deed, he was left holding the whirlwind of media BS when it was time to defend Weiner from the truth.
I don’t understand why Dan would have treated Mike like that.
I do think it would be nice to know how Dan’s emails were leaked, btw. I just don’t think Dan has any right calling Mike a liar. In fact, I think that alone says a lot about whoever it is posing as Dan, whom I’ve tried to be as fair as I possibly can be towards that character.
Mike’s gone out of his way to be fair to folks, Razor. He is pissed at Dan, and I understand you are trying to take up for Dan, but from his point of view, Dan screwed him over. If Dan wants to call someone a liar, he’s going to need hard evidence.
Much like Qritiq would need evidence you or any seven people know who Dan really is.
Not trying to instigate. I have no problem with Razor and I think Mike’s a good person who got punished because it was convenient to a democrat politician to screw him. We all differ on what the hell Dan Wolfe really is, but that doesn’t mean we should trash eachother.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/25/2011 @ 8:32 pmdo you know who told me the answer to that question? your pal, lee stranahan.
razor419 (42f6c5) — 7/25/2011 @ 8:32 pmas for you goatsred, i didn’t see you answer this question from dan…
dwp6776 DW
@goatsred Who was blackmailed into giving emails to Smoking Gun, Mike? More than one person knows that answer. Lie all you want.
24 Jul
More than one, Dan???? Sounds like what razor is crying about the “7” people?? Right razor?? Why the silence on that one? MAKE THE LIST COMPARING LIES……………Cant wait.
goatsred (b20383) — 7/25/2011 @ 8:34 pmAnd you believed him? Come on, man. What did Lee do to anyone behind their back? Sow discord. He did it to you, he did it to me, he did it to Mike, he did it to Patterico.
Anyway, I guess you’re suggesting that before Mike’s personal details were publicized, someone blackmailed him, and Mike then exposed Dan’s reason for wanting to remain anonymous? Is that the accusation?
If so, that’s a shame, but I’m not seeing any evidence it’s even true. Lee Stranahan would have reported that publicly if he had evidence for it. I wouldn’t be surprised if he simply played you off other people by saying whatever he wanted. Remember when you told Lee something I confided in you?
I told you it was no big deal because you were trying to help, and because I had already confided that very thing to Lee already. Did Lee let you know I had done that? Of course not. Because he was manipulating you.
Pushing Mike on proving himself to Dan is not going to accomplish anything but pissing Mike off. Mike’s got real skin in the game, unlike most people. This scandal has reached out and affected his life. Dan explained why he didn’t want this scandal to affect his own life, and now he’s piling on his ‘friend’ who suffered that consequence, partly because Dan stepped aside at the worst moment?
That’s messed up.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/25/2011 @ 8:43 pmbtw, not trying to pick a fight with Razor. I think Razor should understand where Mike’s coming from, is all.
At some point, we have to accept that we don’t get to get every single question answered, no matter how curious we are. The Lee Stranahans of the world are going to have to live without our personal lives being their stepping stones, and if they can’t handle that, tough.
I probably won’t get to know who Dan Wolfe is. Dan probably won’t get Mike to answer him.
Razor, if you’re feeding Dan snippets of background about people, remember that you do not know who this guy is. You could be dealing with someone who is trying to cause a huge mess. I don’t know that, but it’s certainly a possibility.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/25/2011 @ 8:49 pmThanks Dustin.
goatsred (b20383) — 7/25/2011 @ 8:51 pmWell, you can credit Qritiq with instigating the fight in this particular direction.
Is this why Dan wolfe matters? Because that’s the best way to infuriate everyone?
It seems like it’s the best fulcrum. If someone wants to stop an analysis of Neal (such as DRJ’s awesome analysis, or Koam’s hilarious quote), Neal can’t very well delete that from here like he would from Kos.
So it’s convenient to him that the subject changed to Dan. Is Dan relevant? Does he matter? As interesting as he could be, I have to say ultimately he is a side story. What really matters is who is screwing innocent people over. Who is taking this to the threat level. Why is Neal sicing people on Patterico, teaming up with a domestic terrorist, and asking for pictures of his wife? That kind of thing.
For the record, I am not saying (and do not think) Qritiq is working with Neal. Too many people make the mistake of assuming a conspiracy. I just think it’s a shame the discussion gets redirected away from the real villains. If we do it, we need a better reason than merely a rehash of suspicions. If Qritiq knows seven people in possession of Dan’s identity that’s a scoop and I hope she reveals it. I don’t think she really has that nailed down though.
Also, it really serves Neal’s interests that we show eachother as little respect as possible. Just saying.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/25/2011 @ 8:59 pmyou do remember the night i called into lee’s show, don’t you mike? do you feel comfortable that lee was using you to prove his “honesty”? keep in mind the person who has caused the biggest headaches for me, patterico, dan wolfe, dustin?, etc during this whole fiasco.
razor419 (42f6c5) — 7/25/2011 @ 8:59 pmi guess you guys are too far into the forest to see the trees with qritiq. wasn’t my initial post enough to show how clueless he is about twitter? lol i don’t care about the “7 people” because i know he has made links based on what he has read on twitter that have no substance behind them. if he thinks i’m one of the 7, it’s just another badge of honor. you guys do get quite ridiculous in jumping on the latest bit of info. what “journos” are part of the 7? give me a break.
razor419 (42f6c5) — 7/25/2011 @ 9:20 pmI don’t want to get into a thing about the specifics of what razor419 is discussing, other than to note that, while Dustin is right that we don’t know who Dan Wolfe is, I am surprised by Mike’s level of vitriol towards Dan . . . at least to the extent that the vitriol assumes the accuracy of the theories propounded by Lee. Which, as I have said all along, may be accurate but may not.
I know that has been distorted into “John Reid is the bomb and Lee is wrong about Jenny George” but that is not what I am saying nor is what I have ever said. But while I do not declare his theories are wrong, nor do I declare them right.
I do enjoy seeing razor419 around. I learned a LOT about a lot of things when he made that phone call on June 22.
Patterico (f724ca) — 7/25/2011 @ 9:47 pmRazor, like I said, I’m not trying to pick a fight with you.
It’s just very tricky to navigate these controversies without starting more fights. I think this infighting is a distraction. Do I think Qritiq’s assertions are justified? No. I’ve mentioned that a few times, though frankly I think it’s good faith guessing taken a little too far (like when Lee would say his assumptions were facts).
I challenged Qritiq on some of his/her points while trying to keep it from becoming ugly. Even if I resent throwing yet more stuff out there that isn’t established on facts, getting angry about it just makes a mess.
I just don’t see the point in fighting over Dan Wolfe, what he’s said, or who he is. I’ll be very surprised if anything useful comes of it.
By all means, take up for Dan, or at least the principle of someone remaining anonymous and not being hunted down. That doesn’t mean Mike has to like the guy. I think it’s understandable why he doesn’t.
I also think suggesting Lee gave you info that backs up your question to Mike about TSG blackmail … it’s got a bad taste, my friend. Tastes like further manipulation and rumor mongering. I don’t know what Lee’s deal is, but anyone who trusts that guy with information in the future is a bonehead.
We all have a pretty similar list of concerns, grievances, and complaints. I don’t see why you guys would be fighting.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/25/2011 @ 9:48 pmI can see justifiable pique from Mike towards Dan for disappearing when the going got tough. Then again — accepting Dan as real simply for the sake of argument — I can see why someone might WANT to disappear, given everything that has gone on.
Patterico (f724ca) — 7/25/2011 @ 9:50 pmMe too.
I don’t want to speak for Mike on this. I just think if Mike doesn’t trust Dan or feels let down by someone he thought was his friend, that’s his business. If, at this point, Mike doesn’t want to answer Dan’s questions when he chooses to exist at all, I don’t see the problem. I think Mike’s been as cool as he can be about the uglier episodes in this story, and want to cut him a generous amount of slack.
That’s all I’m saying.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/25/2011 @ 9:54 pmI totally agree with that. Never meant to suggest otherwise. I might not be as convinced as he of Dan Wolfe’s treachery, but Mike Stack is the stand-up guy in this story, IMO.
Patterico (f724ca) — 7/25/2011 @ 10:03 pmAll right…Razor, I won’t contribute to infighting here because of my feelings about DW.I have had a lot of negative feelings return in the last few days about him .
goatsred (b20383) — 7/26/2011 @ 3:53 amI am over it and will stay the course of the real topic of this thread.
I too supported you and was on the phone during your phone call that evening.
My end of this closed and I think Patterico will vouch for my mood the last couple of days.
Back to the matters at hand.
Dustin – I wasn’t thinking of Lee at all, I just thought the tweet was true and apt. Lee has moved on from this story, so I don’t understand why his name keeps coming up.
If DW starts to reveal the truth about the origins of Weinergate, you’re right, you might never know his identity. But if he continues to sit on his hands, his client will probably out him first, and he’ll be left with no credibility.
“jeff” – my saying that a person knows the truth is somehow an accusation against them? You seem confused.
Also, there’s a new feature on twitter. It’s called “Unfollow”. I think you might find it useful.
Also, a free tip from me to you: If you find a writer’s work too “cutesy”, you don’t actually have to read it.
I posted here the first time because of something koam wrote about me that seemed odd, and got my attention.
RAZR914 – wow, you saw my tweet awfully quick for someone who hasn’t been on twitter for a month. If I “don’t have a clue”, then why your histrionics?
qritiq (1440aa) — 7/26/2011 @ 9:03 amWhen my public info went up, I didn’t accuse anyone of “it being lies”. I shit my pants because it was something that I have moved on from and changed my life. But the perp of this whole thing took off leaving me holding the bag.
goatsred (b20383) — 7/26/2011 @ 10:00 amI will gladly say and prove that there are no lies whatsoever in my story. There are a very select group of journalists that vetted me like a Presidential candadiate when this first came out.
I passed and and not one thing chnged the whole time in the facts I spelled out.
I was accessable 24/7 to answer any and all questions.
If DW has accusations that I lied about anything, let him air them here, and the people who have the tweet by tweet time lines will pick those lies apart.
Yours in Solidarity.
Laying down the gauntlet .”Oh Danny Boy, the Mike is calling”
My mistake, Qritiq.
And while Lee has moved on publicly, he is in fact tied to this story because of his shameful and dishonest conduct. Not really interested in that right now, though. Thanks for answering me, again.
I’ll happily congratulate you if your theory pans out and this happens.
———
Oh, I just heard Ron is asking if I’m in Al Qaida. No, Ron, I am not in Al Qaida. Ron links a comment I left mentioning I have Muslim relatives to bolster this smear. Ron Brynaert is an ignorant bigot.
And his act is not fooling anyone. He is affiliated closely with the actual villains in this mess, and has behaved like a thug with infantile provocation techniques.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/26/2011 @ 10:05 pmWow, I missed a lot of Ron’s comments about me. He sure sounds like a guilty and stupid hustler to me.
Qritiq, he thinks you’re in Al Qaida too.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/26/2011 @ 10:22 pmThe new fake Dan Wolfe Patriot twitter account, mentioned above at #2412, which had a recent debut tweet “Hello world” linked to malware, and which got the assumed real Dan Wolfe to tweet after 6+ weeks of silence, is tweeting again.
The old malware-linked tweet was deleted and has been replaced with two tweets that are safe. You don’t have to click them on twitter, because I’ve reproduced them below. Two are to screenshots (of Mike’s comments #2438 & #2439 and a twitter exchange between Mike & the “real” Dan and one links to the same comment #2439 on this thread.)
The “real” Dan’s tweets are protected, so, in theory, you have to be an authorized follower in order to see those tweets and take that screenshot. DW has 43 followers, a lot of whom are recognizable names from this saga. Others aren’t.
So this new, fake Patriot seems to just want to stir the pot between people who don’t get along. It got Dan to come back and it upset Mike & Razor & others. It also spread a link to a site that my system knew was malware (no idea what malware — I think it was a txt file? — but maybe something that would capture a twitter password, as others have been discussing…speculation)
So just mischief?
koam @wittier (1774fe) — 7/27/2011 @ 6:29 amBe wary of the links you click at Patriot, even though all are safe at the moment (you can see what they are if you mousover… i.imgur.com is an image sharing site). There’s no telling if Patriot will add back some malware links going forward.
Good insight.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/27/2011 @ 8:13 amWe’ve seen other things posted that were just for mischief.
koam @wittier (1774fe) — 7/27/2011 @ 8:54 amNot to mention, the entire story creates feelings of suspicion and caution that can easily lapse into paranoia. Not the Ron B version of paranoia where you pose as mentally ill, but simply not knowing who to trust.
For those whose personal lives and families have been effected by this, it’s only prudent to be cautious. Combined with all the mischief, and the ambitious tabloid bloggers, it creates a powder keg.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/27/2011 @ 8:57 am2463 Dustin
Powder Keg?
You’re not threatening Ron are you? 🙂
jmel44 (d9a8f5) — 7/27/2011 @ 10:21 amOnly thing I threaten Ron with is to defend myself legally from his bogus and thuggish threats against me, which sounded very sincere at the time.
yeah I know you’re kidding and I’m responding without enough humor, but Ron is an ignorant bigot who is friends with violent criminals and swore to sue me when I tried to be nice to Ron.
Ron has consistently treated the people nicest to Ron much worse than those who aren’t nice to him. He is an utter scumbag. Pretending to be crazy is just the icing on the scumbag cake.
I am delighted that he’s obsessed with me, because that means I’ve gotten under the skin of bigot trash.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/27/2011 @ 10:27 amI’m really not interested in any of the interpersonal issues.
However, the fact that that this new Patriot account prompted Dan to make any communication after such a long time, I thought made it noteworthy.
Learning more about Dan (even if his anonymity is maintained) is, of course, a central question to this whole thing. What did he know, how and when?
koam @wittier (1774fe) — 7/27/2011 @ 11:13 amFair enough. Though I think you will change your mind on that, as far as Ron and pals are concerned, when the rest of the story emerges.
Dan Wolfe is very interesting, but minor in comparison.
Qritiq has been really clever in trying to work that out. But ultimately, I think we’re being strung along by folks with no intention of ever resolving the issue of whether he got lucky or was well informed somehow.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/27/2011 @ 12:17 pmDan Wolfe is a fraud.
Patterico (f724ca) — 7/28/2011 @ 12:14 amAnd Dan Wolfe is JohnReid9.
Patterico (f724ca) — 7/28/2011 @ 12:15 amIn my opinion.
Patterico (f724ca) — 7/28/2011 @ 12:15 amAnd Ron Brynaert is in league with them and Neal Rauhauser.
Working for Anthony Weiner, to blunt the edge of material I have not yet released, from Anthony Weiner to Nikki Reid. To sow confusion.
And do other evil things.
Dan Wolfe doesn’t care about any of that. He may not be behind the threats but he is not what he claims to be. He is a fraud.
Patterico (f724ca) — 7/28/2011 @ 12:17 amAll in my opinion.
Patterico (f724ca) — 7/28/2011 @ 12:18 am(From Twitter)
So he’s a piece of garbage.
I feel the same about anyone who has been reckless with this issue, knowing what’s happened.
I’ve long thought Ron (someone extremely reckless with this issue) probably posted his own name and address in this thread as Alicia Pain. It is particularly interesting that he claimed he thought Neal did that to him, but 99% of his hatred went towards Neal’s harshest critics such as myself.
I don’t know that they work for Weiner (it would make sense if they did, I guess, and I’m not privy to this additional Nikki material), but I do think it’s certainly meant to create confusion and complexify the issue. It’s also meant to actually hurt you and your family, Patterico.
Ron’s affiliation with these people is easy to demonstrate. I won’t comment further on him… I don’t want to screw anything up with my big mouth.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/28/2011 @ 12:32 amDid you hear Dan’s voice? I’m guessing either no or it was altered.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/28/2011 @ 12:35 am2471. That’s quite a bombshell (incoming, Ron!), Pat. Do you expect we’ll be seeing this material anytime soon?
Expectantly,
Jeffeneff
jeffeneff (707f3d) — 7/28/2011 @ 4:12 amOne reason I quoted Patterico’s corroborating tweets is that I don’t recall ever seeing his comments include a hyperlink to the blog.
I grant the hoaxers have created a sense of paranoia and confusion.
Anyway, Jeff, my impression is that no one (but Ron) wants to screw up or confuse a serious investigation. Something serious has occurred, and you’ll note that Ron is demanding a federal investigation of my powder keg comment above, trashing Aaron as a potential assassin, and just generally trying to be as stupid and hysterical as possible. Of course he doesn’t seriously mean any of that… he just hopes it helps whoever committed real crimes get away with them. Or at least that sure is how it looks to me, and nothing Ron does will stop me from saying so.
It makes me wonder if Qritiq was onto something, thinking Dan Wolfe was working with a democrat competitor to Weiner, or if somehow Dan Wolfe was just preemptive damage control for a congressman who thought he could act like a complete jackass.
Why would Dan re-tweet the offending photo if he’s working with Weiner? Do we know it’s the same Dan Wolfe now as then?
Since Neal clings to the theory it was a hacker instead of Weiner (apparently Neal is saying Weiner did something so much worse than this and he’s been blackmailed into admitting responsibility for the hack? I guess?) I guess there’s a remote change Neal was Dan, and retweeted the offending pic just to help document the hack? How hilarious if it was Weiner’s own shills who doomed him.
I’m just finding that a little too perfect to be true. Those pleas from Dan to be left alone were great. They got me very worried for him. If this is the same Dan, he’s an excellent con artist. Probably as experienced as Brett. But this is just too much speculation for me.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/28/2011 @ 4:34 am1) Why would Dan refuse to cooperate with a law enforcement investigation that I told him was serious?
2) Do I owe him any duty of confidentiality? At all?
Patterico (f724ca) — 7/28/2011 @ 6:55 amHE OWES YOU NOTHING! Or something. Also, no.
(Cas)S(and)arahW (af7312) — 7/28/2011 @ 1:02 pmRe: 2471 – just to be clear. You’re not saying Dan Wolfe is/was working for Weiner, are you? or are you?
Greg (623ddd) — 7/28/2011 @ 2:58 pm2477. My two cents:
1) Because he was a real person (played the role he represented himself as) who didn’t want to give up anonymity, or because he was a puppet and didn’t want to give up anonymity (reveal his role).
2) Did you promise him confidentiality? Has he been truthful?
This is what you said in June:
I disagree with this in the sense that it’s not about the degree of dishonesty per se, but rather if the dishonesty in question was meant to use the journalist to promulgate a false account. If his lie was incidental, to protect himself in some minor way, I could argue for his protection. Otherwise, he forfeits, screw him.
jeffeneff (707f3d) — 7/28/2011 @ 3:20 pmLastly, while his lack of concern about your situation is cold, in my mind it doesn’t get you out of the deal.
2481 Jeff
It’s Janet Malcolm all over again.
koam @wittier (1774fe) — 7/28/2011 @ 3:49 pm2480 Greg
Looks like you’re responding to 2472 Patterico (as numbered on my screen…and its neighbors 2469 through 2473, all Patterico)
Looks to me like Patterico’s concluding, or tossing out there, that:
I’m not saying I agree or understand yet.
Because if I try to make any sense of it, it says that RAW is the most twisted f in all of history.
It say that RAW not only played with GFs who were political fans online, but that he had someone create a virtual Javert, Dan Wolfe, who relentlessly pursued him, shining the spotlight on RAW’s actual dalliances. He further had the same agent create a faux teen fangirl, Nikki, who consorted with RAW’s other online GFs, and flirted with the congressman publicly & privately. The purpose of which was to have Javert catch RAW in a false tryst w/ the underaged Nikki?
The purpose of this was…to create a myth of unjust persecution around the progressive firebrand? But then the pic tweet…caught…by Dan? Why have the tweet go to Gennette, other than because she’s actually human? Why have Dan draw attention to ones own fatal flaw? All to create a fake but believable “hacked” scenario in order to suppress the inevitable bimbo eruptions?
To set up the media that might cover the fake parts of the story as insulation against the true parts?
Hard to see how it makes sense…help me out.
And if Nikki is a creation of AW’s own agent, why then do they need to blunt the edge of material created at AW’s behest by the same fictional character?
Why does the JR9 character portray the interactions between Nikki & AW as largely innocent? (although he conceded there was more, less innocent content, later on, after the first batch of documents, that he had not seen prior)
Are we about talking Dr. Jekyll & Mr. Hyde? A Weiner bent on his own destruction, rather than one bent on self-preservation at all costs?
Or are we talking about an agent engaged by RAW who, when things go awry, goes rogue and turns against his master?
Or did RAW have a wild, sinister plan that made sense at some level, but fell flat?
I’m not saying it makes sense…just trying to figure out Greg’s question about Patterico’s flurry of posts earlier.
What do you make of all this?
koam @wittier (1774fe) — 7/28/2011 @ 3:56 pmRon, what Koam means is that it’s deja vu all over again. Therefore Janet Malcolm = Yogi Berra, and this helps explain why your toaster burnt your toast this morning.
jeffeneff (707f3d) — 7/28/2011 @ 4:04 pmKoam — Something screwy with the numbering apparently, because my post, which you are referencing as 2480, reads 2479 on my screen.
i am asking Patterico if he meant to suggest that Wolfe is *now* in league with these others ostensibly working for Weiner, or if he (Patterico) believes Wolfe was always working for Weiner.
Greg (623ddd) — 7/28/2011 @ 4:12 pm2485 Greg.
Thanks. Yes, sorry for my typos above…
koam @wittier (1774fe) — 7/28/2011 @ 4:19 pmand the numbers are generated by some kind of programming (like Java, though I dunno) within the browser, so they don’t show up the same in all contexts and sometimes posts have been deleted (we think) by the proprietor, furthering our confusion. For that reason I try to use a number and a name when replying. Although I suppose the post time would help too.
thursday slow news day
ColonelHaiku (8a1a1f) — 7/28/2011 @ 4:28 pmdan wolfe in weiner’s clothing?
proof one size fits all
May I suggest the above?
😉
Numbers will change if comments are deleted or put in moderation, but deletions are rare and usually referenced by an admin. In general, unless the comment is from someone previously banned or is clearly spam, it stays.
Another reason the number may change is if a comment get caught in the moderation or spam filter and gets released into the thread. This happens more often.
I got in the habit of referencing comments as above because it can get too confusing to reference a comment number.
Stashiu3 (44da70) — 7/28/2011 @ 4:29 pmComment by Stashiu3 — 7/28/2011 @ 4:29 pm
That works, but I’d miss the numbers.
Note that Greg and I are simultaneously seeing different numbering on this thread…so perhaps a function of using different computers, OSes, browsers, settings, etc.
koam @wittier (1774fe) — 7/28/2011 @ 5:01 pmOther users were seeing three-digit post numbers earlier
koam @wittier (1774fe) — 7/28/2011 @ 5:03 pmNoted, and I don’t mind admitting I have no idea why. Just another reason to not use comment numbers. I haven’t been that deep into the admin section since one or two hosts ago. Going there now would be unwise. 😉
Stashiu3 (44da70) — 7/28/2011 @ 5:07 pmGennette so very
elissa (f66496) — 7/28/2011 @ 5:24 pmquiet off the radar screen
what is she up to?
‘Dan Wolfe is a fraud.’
Comment by Patterico — 7/28/2011 @ 12:14 am
Dan Wolfe doesn’t care about any of that. He may not be behind the threats but he is not what he claims to be. He is a fraud.
Comment by Patterico — 7/28/2011 @ 12:17 am
IMO, “Dan Wolfe” is not really ‘his’ real name. Thus by extension a fraud or not who he claims to be.
Yes, DW claimed it was his real name to JBrooks:
Online Chat Between Brooks and DW:
‘(12: 31:30 AM) joe.brooks Well Lee is making the point that you are using a fake name.
(12: 31:38 AM) dwp676740 I’m not’
But here’s where I’m not buying. DW himself in email to ABreitbart claims he does not want to talk on phone. Fearful that Ex’s would get hold of recording.
His Quote: “got a hold of a call recorded with me on it they’d have a field day with that. I want to try to avoid.”
Right! What would be on a call recording that could be used against DW? You know, if DW his real name, then I’m sure the Ex’s and their attorneys would have a field day with his twitter feed, published emails, the Chat interviews DW insisted be published. You know, under his real name. Even the ‘threats’ via Brooks he passed on to Stranahan under his “real name”. Worried about a call recording but feels secure with all the other things published?
I’m sure Ex’s attorneys read the news, Have Cable, maybe even access to the Internet.
Yes Ron, I know you’re reading. Or Dan, how about this. Why not explain OK for your name to be published multiple times not fearing Ex’s finding out. But worried about a leaked phone recording of same things you would state via twitter and interviews? Like to know.
az5thdstrct (e76e6a) — 7/28/2011 @ 5:46 pmWow 2492 comments about a guy and his flaccid dick.
DohBiden (d54602) — 7/28/2011 @ 5:51 pm2493
No, I don’t think Dan Wolfe is actually Anthony Weiner
az5thdstrct (e76e6a) — 7/28/2011 @ 5:59 pmComment by az5thdstrct — 7/28/2011 @ 5:59 pm
Why do you say that?
I think Patterico might have been saying that DW was working on AW’s behalf, not AW himself.
koam @wittier (1774fe) — 7/28/2011 @ 6:58 pmWittier, It was a joke response to #2493.
az5thdstrct (e76e6a) — 7/28/2011 @ 7:14 pmMore than a day later and not much discussion of these comments by Patterico. Perhaps because it wasn’t a new blog post, which was warranted by such a new hypothesis. But worth a discussion of what he means, what the implications are, and what’s not understood.
Looks to me like Patterico’s concluding, or tossing out there, that:
I’m not saying I agree or understand yet.
It says that RAW not only played with GFs who were political fans online, but that he had someone create a virtual Javert, Dan Wolfe, who relentlessly pursued him, shining the spotlight on RAW’s actual dalliances. He further had the same agent create a faux teen fangirl, Nikki, who consorted with RAW’s other online GFs, and flirted with the congressman publicly & privately.
The purpose of this was…to create a myth of unjust persecution around the progressive firebrand?
But then the pic tweet to GC, which (if AW commissioned the creation of DW & Nikki) we can now assume was not an error …caught…by Dan? Why have the tweet go to Gennette, other than because she’s actually human? Why have Dan draw attention to ones own fatal flaw prior to that? All to create a fake, but believable, “hacked” scenario in order to suppress the inevitable bimbo eruptions? (AW’s behavior after the hack was questioned doesn’t support this well.)
To set up the media that might cover the fake parts of the story as insulation against the true parts?
Hard to see how it makes sense…help me out.
And if Nikki is a creation of AW’s own agent, why then do they need to blunt the edge of material created at AW’s behest by the same fictional character? Why did JR9 appear on June 21 and release potentially damaging info to Patterico if JR9/DW is working with liberal activists on behalf of AW?
It’s very hard to interpret the comments above and make sense of it. Unless he’s saying that the intern is a double-agent, working both sides. Depends on the definition of “them” from “in league with them.” What also is meant by “Dan Wolfe doesn’t care about any of that.” ?
Are we about talking Dr. Jekyll & Mr. Hyde? A Weiner bent on his own destruction, rather than one bent on self-preservation at all costs?
Or are we talking about an agent engaged by RAW who, when things go awry, goes rogue and turns against his master?
Or did RAW have a wild, sinister plan that made sense at some level, but fell flat?
And where are Jennifer George & Alicia Pain?
I’m not saying it makes sense…just trying to sort out Patterico’s flurry of comments from yesterday.
What do you make of all this?
koam @wittier (1774fe) — 7/29/2011 @ 4:42 amWhat the heck: I’ll make
no one you know (325a59) — 7/29/2011 @ 6:41 amthis long thread’s comments total
no one you know (325a59) — 7/29/2011 @ 6:41 amtwenty-five hundred
no one you know, gettin' the haiku on (325a59) — 7/29/2011 @ 6:42 amI think I wasn’t entirely clear. I did not mean to suggest that Dan Wolfe was working for Weiner all along. That seems pretty clearly not to be the case.
It’s not that I think Wolfe is working consciously with Neal and Ron. Just that they are all sowing confusion and discord at the same time. If that makes sense.
Patterico (f724ca) — 7/29/2011 @ 7:07 amre duty and confidentiality:
Pat – the way I see it, your duty is to victims of any threats, over someone who has told you lie after lie. Also, of course you have to put your family first if the investigation has anything to do with you or them personally. I don’t know anything about law or jurisdictions, but as an officer of the court, possibly you don’t even have much of a choice on it.
(Why am I not surprised “jeff” comes out on the side of quashing justice.)
qritiq (1440aa) — 7/29/2011 @ 7:32 amQritiq, Pat has never said he’s had any reason to think the threats are related to Wolfe or Reids etc. Think of the damage to the concept of press confidentiality when a threat without clear connection can be used to break the confidentiality. You’re “not surprised” by my viewpoint because you have not thought things through.
When I’m not trying to quash justice, I’m busy eating babies. I also like walking in the rain.
jeffeneff (707f3d) — 7/29/2011 @ 10:39 amIn my gut, I’m very much on Qritiq’s side here. Someone is laughing at a victimized family, so that family no longer owes this someone a damn thing.
But Jeff is right. I’m glad he spoke up. It’s tricky, and I very much hope we learn who this Dan Wolfe idiot is. He begged for mercy, and then those who showed it to him don’t get any from Dan.
If you look at this mess as a major effort to create confusion that helps the guilty escape accountability, I think it’s clear that the time for stupid games is over.
Jeff, Koam, and Qritiq’s discussing of the events like adults, even in disagreement, is the last thing the criminals Brett, Neal, and Ron want.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/29/2011 @ 10:48 amGennette, thanks in advance for your answer to this:
jeffeneff (707f3d) — 7/29/2011 @ 10:49 am1) You asked John Reid whether Nikki would receive an email that you sent. If I recall correctly he said “probably” or something like that.
You could have just emailed Nikki to see what happened. Was there a specific reason you asked Reid publicly?
2) What did you want to say or ask Nikki?
Did you end up doing so?
Did you get a response?
If so, what was it?
Thanks for clarifying, Patterico.
You mentioned additional DMs from Weiner to Starchild111. Any plans to release those or other material you may have gotten from Johnreid9 and/or Dan Wolfe?
Greg (623ddd) — 7/29/2011 @ 10:52 amWhoa, just caught this tweet from qritiq:
jeffeneff (707f3d) — 7/29/2011 @ 10:53 am@GNCordova hey chick – just fyi: @jeffeneff and @wittier are NOT on your side – just be aware.
I can only say wow.
NYT reporer advises white house about twitter usage. Guess who?
http://dailycaller.com/2011/07/29/new-york-times-reporter-advises-white-house-media-staff-on-twitter/
elissa (c7ab71) — 7/29/2011 @ 11:09 am“much on Qritiq’s side”
jeffeneff (707f3d) — 7/29/2011 @ 11:12 am“the side of quashing justice”
“are not on your side”
Elissa, wow. She’s telling them to coordinate political messages instead of speak from the heart.
The NYT has long been a hack organization, though, so I guess this is a bit of a dog bites man thing.
Still, pathetic.
Jeff, it’s unfortunate Qritiq would still be attacking you, but she’s right that you’re not Cordova’s friend. It’s a little insulting to Cordova though. She’s clearly not stupid, and knows that I’m not her friend, you’re not her friend, Qritiq is definitely not her friend.
I’m not interested in discussing Cordova. Not that I can tell others what to be interested in, and not that I think she’s a saint by any stretch, but she suffers real world consequences because this is her real name associated with her mistakes. I think she was used.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/29/2011 @ 11:26 amGennette, I hope you catch this bonus question:
jeffeneff (707f3d) — 7/29/2011 @ 11:55 amYou spoke, as many here did, “as if” you were questioning NR’s dad, but I suspect you had the same doubts as others. Care to give your own opinion as to the various Reids, motivations pre and post?
Dustin, it’s also insulting to imply that I pretended in some way to be Gennette’s friend. And it’s also insulting to pretend I’m her enemy. I had politely asked her if she was willing to entertain a question. For that sin I beg a thousand pardons.
I would not expect there are any particular real world consequences to her helping satisfy my curiosity, but that’s obviously something she is free to decide.
jeffeneff (707f3d) — 7/29/2011 @ 12:18 pm2489 (I assume the lkesading digit is a 2 still)
I didn’t make time to comment, but in looking over this bthread, I noticed that somebody else before me also saw only 3 numbers. Somewhere around 1650.
Look at comment number 1634:
#628
Greg, Thank you for straightening me out on that key point. Not certian how I go turned around on that point. I appreciate it very much.
I’ve tooke the time to read through your entire timeline, and I can’t say enough how helpful it is.
Thank you for sharing your extensive work.
Now, I’m going to read it again, and think this thing through again.
Comment by cap’n john’s nephew — 7/9/2011 @ 10:10 am
“cap’n john’s nephew” doesn’t even REALIZE the number he is seeing is wrong. The ionly thing is 1628 doesn’t seem to be the message referred to since he wrote it himself:
1628:
#625
Your right about the initials Koam, sorry if I confused you. Perhaps that was a type of slip. The possibility that neal could have been both Nikii and John is one of the scenerios my mind is open to. At least, he may have used the sock on occasion.
This not to say I believe neal was a lone wolf. This was a group of people acting as a team. Some amongst us may be leaning to a theory that JG was the team leader, while others lean towards neal (neal is certainly an alpha personality). I tend to lean towards neal at this time, but I am open to other possibilites. The operational organization structure of this team is another area that needs further fleshing. If John Reid and family are socks, it provides structural information.
Gennette claims she noticed Starchild/Nikii’s activities on tweat, and that is what drew her in.
If that is true, I would love her to explain what is was in the Starchild/Nikii account behavior that caught her eye. She said Nikii’s attention to Weiner, but I’m having difficulty buying that.
I mean, so what if somebody was following Weiner.
What specifically made Nikii’s activity different from others?
There are other hanging chads surrounding Gennette that deserve closer examination, as well.
After all,she was having phone conversations with Wiener. How did that come about? Gennette seemed to indicate that it had to do with her little investigation. An investigation she wanted us to help her with, yet was far from forthcoming with details that would help.
So, like yourself, I would like to hear people’s thoughts.
Comment by cap’n john’s nephew — 7/9/2011 @ 6:49 am
1625 is about NR being the initials both for Neal Rauhauser and Nikki Reed.
Sammy Finkelman (d3daeb) — 7/29/2011 @ 2:20 pmSomeone get Sammy a Weinergate cheat sheet. Your facts are off.
Gennette (55c21d) — 7/29/2011 @ 2:27 pmOr maybe that was cap’n whoever’s comment, not sure.
Gennette (55c21d) — 7/29/2011 @ 2:28 pm2497:
PF> Dan Wolfe is a fraud.
PF> And Dan Wolfe is JohnReid9.
I’ll tell you what my baseline assumption has been:
No, John Reed is SOCKREID, who organized all the sockpuppets. Dan Woilfe/Patriotusa76 was one of them but didn’t know about the others. Therefore he was actually working somewhat at cross with purposes with starchild111.
He would sometimes get tips. It is worth trying to figure out what he might have known.
PF> And Ron Brynaert is in league with them and Neal Rauhauser.
I don’t know enough about them to figure out where
they belobng or what they were doing. I spent some time tryinmg to find out. Brett Kimberlin by the way, is the person who claimed he had sold marijuana to Dan Quayle as far back as 1972 and as late as November 1988. So you can tekll what of a political operative he is.
PF> Working for Anthony Weiner, to blunt the edge of material I have not yet released, from Anthony Weiner to Nikki Reid. To sow confusion.
????!!!!!!
Sammy Finkelman (d3daeb) — 7/29/2011 @ 2:31 pmYes Jeff, and I didn’t mean to suggest otherwise. I’d be really annoyed if she said that about me and I wasn’t trying to be ingratiating… just asking questions.
Anyway, you and Qritiq both seem like smart people with an eye for some of the salient issues. I think it’s seriously counterproductive for the adults to fight with eachother.
I really hope Qritiq makes an effort not to target people without cause, and I say that without meaning to suggest she’s a bad egg or something. I’m totally susceptible to holding little grudges online too.
This case is serious. I don’t think it’s yet understood how serious. The effort to get along with the other honest pundits is worthwhile.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/29/2011 @ 2:44 pm@Jeffeneff
I figured that the email address that “Nikki” used to talk to me was probably created just so she could talk to me, so when we weren’t talking anymore I thought it may have been abandoned. I wanted to make sure that the email was actually seen so when JR9 was answering questions on here I said that just to inform John/Nikki that I was sending it.
And sorry @SammyFinkleman for my rude comment:( I should have read your comment more closely.
Gennette (55c21d) — 7/29/2011 @ 2:48 pmGennette, ok, makes sense to me. You’re not going to tell us what you had to say to her? 🙁
jeffeneff (707f3d) — 7/29/2011 @ 4:25 pmSammy, Gennette is right, you’re all over the board. I don’t think anyone’s made the claim that Gennette has spoken to AW. Also, people can get a general feeling of a sock. They might be wrong, of course. Weiner’s chatter with NR gives certain indication that he suspects he’s dealing with a sock.
jeffeneff (707f3d) — 7/29/2011 @ 4:54 pm@Jeffeneff
Gennette (55c21d) — 7/29/2011 @ 5:19 pmI sent the email around the time that people were saying that the young JG was behind the Nikki account. In my mind, Nikki had always been fake but knowing that there was a chance that the person I had been conversing with all of this time was a young, unstable (which is how people were characterizing her) woman, made me sort of emotional.
It made me realize that they had always been really kind to me and I felt like I had to reach out and say that if this person really felt like they had formed a friendship with me and I had hurt them, that I was sorry.
I don’t feel like I actually hurt whoever was behind Nikki but just in case I had, I felt compelled to apologize.
thanks
koam @wittier (7b067e) — 7/29/2011 @ 5:32 pmStef “sums it all up”
Comments for stef?
koam @wittier (7b067e) — 7/29/2011 @ 6:04 pmGennette, JR9 forwarded Nikki’s messages using Nikki’s email address. He didn’t use his own email address at all. I can confirm her address with you privately, if you like. DM?
koam @wittier (7b067e) — 7/29/2011 @ 6:21 pmComment by koam @wittier — 7/29/2011 @ 6:04 pm
stef threatened:
Neal agrees w Stef
koam @wittier (7b067e) — 7/29/2011 @ 7:28 pmExtended discussion of Preston’s intern over there in loopy land.
koam @wittier (7b067e) — 7/29/2011 @ 10:44 pmWhat does Stef think about the bug in the snuff can? That was my favoritest Neal post yet. Makes tinfoil hats look sensible.
Patterico (f724ca) — 7/29/2011 @ 11:16 pmYou mean the snuff can owned by the homeless guy who didn’t smell enough?
koam @wittier (7b067e) — 7/29/2011 @ 11:19 pmIs Neal banned at Kos? His profile has a skull and crossbones.
Patterico (f724ca) — 7/30/2011 @ 3:19 pmThis is the link: http://t.co/mmaYwQW
Patterico (f724ca) — 7/30/2011 @ 3:23 pmActually, I can still pull up his diaries up to ‘Thrashing: Them or Us’.
If you’re banned from Kos, are your old diaries removed?
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/30/2011 @ 3:28 pmHis profile reads fine to me – maybe yoy are blocked? Is that possible?
EricPWJohnson (c5f1fc) — 7/30/2011 @ 3:33 pmDid you follow the link I provided and click on the skull and crossbones under “Mojo”.
It doesn’t make sense that he would be banned but what does that mean then?
As for the meaning of banning: dKosopedia prtcl.es/oHYGpN: Banning means that a user can no longer post diaries or comments, or give out recommends.
I doubt they would do that to him but what of the skull and crossbones? (Same status given to Brynaert and The Scyphers Murder.)
Patterico (f724ca) — 7/30/2011 @ 3:37 pmThen the best explanation is that all three were banned.
I was able to see the little skull and crossbones for Neal in a different browser. I also could see his profile, Eric, but I think they banned him (at least temporarily?).
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/30/2011 @ 3:54 pmProbably unnecessary.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/30/2011 @ 3:55 pmHis profile reads fine to me – maybe you are blocked? Is that possible?
EricPWJohnson (c5f1fc) — 7/30/2011 @ 4:41 pmDustin
One can only hope 🙂
disregard please num 2539 sent in error
EricPWJohnson (c5f1fc) — 7/30/2011 @ 4:49 pmI agree it’s a good thing in many respect, Eric. If Kos doesn’t want to affiliate with the long term scam Neal is committing against ideological opponents and their families, good.
But in another respect, it was helpful that Neal publicized his obsession and dishonesty and rage. He’s pointing a finger at himself when we ask who is responsible for John/Nikki Reid’s apparent effort to simultaneously fabricate three things: that Weiner is a great guy, that conservatives were playing a dirty trick, and that Breitbart and Loesch set this up.
That he’s particularly angry at the guy who figured out that the sockpuppet was not a right wing dirty trick is no surprise.
Initially I was curious why someone would both monitor Weiner and fabricate Breitbart’s responsibility. That’s why some have theorized it’s democrat who is competing with Weiner. But if you look over the Reid’s work, it’s clear they were not very interested in harming Weiner in any
way. They defended him.
Neal has denied his beandog activities while being unable to resist bragging about his power and success with that. The more public communication from him I’ve read, the more he’s been unable to resist bragging about, and the clearer it’s been what he’s up to lately.
So in a sense, Neal being banned does the left’s worst elements a huge favor. But at least they aren’t trashing innocent people as much. Kos is private property and if they want that stuff off their website I can’t hold it against them.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/30/2011 @ 5:04 pmThere were long-time commenters there today saying that what Neal is doing should stop…I think recommending that the related parties be banned.
They said they’d be reporting it.
(The skull & crossbones on Neal’s profile says “BANNED” when I mouseover. The old diaries are still there.)
koam @wittier (7b067e) — 7/30/2011 @ 5:31 pmDustin–#2536 Almost choked on my water when I saw that YouTube clip. Good stuff ,good times.
goatsred (b20383) — 7/30/2011 @ 5:54 pmComment by Patterico — 7/30/2011 @ 3:37 pm
I suppose congratulations are in order.
koam @wittier (7b067e) — 7/30/2011 @ 8:03 pmhttp://www.dailykos.com/comments/1000684/42621382
* [new] MB is on the scene (1+ / 0-)
One of my diaries gone, then one of Ron’s. This one liable to die in minutes, too …
Indict Andrew Breitbart
by Stranded Wind on Sat Jul 30, 2011 at 12:14:10 PM EDT
[ Parent | Reply to This | Recommend ]
* [new] Good n/t (2+ / 0-)
I know that, but I don’t believe it
by Catte Nappe on Sat Jul 30, 2011 at 12:15:41 PM EDT
[ Parent | Reply to This | Recommend ]
Good. It’s gotta stop. (4+ / 0-)
by Luthien Tinuviel on Sat Jul 30, 2011 at 12:18:49 PM EDT
[ Parent | Reply to This | Recommend ]
? (3+ / 0-)
Mojo: Banned
UID: 145682
Joined: Dec 24, 2007
” Indict Andrew Breitbart ”
“Drop the name-calling.” Meteor Blades 2/4/11
by indycam on Sat Jul 30, 2011 at 12:21:04 PM EDT
[ Parent | Reply to This | Recommend ]
Suspension until this is sorted out. n/t (13+ / 0-)
Don’t tell me what you believe. Tell me what you do and I’ll tell you what you believe.
by Meteor Blades on Sat Jul 30, 2011 at 12:29:24 PM EDT
[ Parent | Reply to This | Recommend ]
Thank you. (6+ / 0-)
These are real life beefs that could have real life consequences, too. It’s your judgment call, but I’d let them do the sorting out off-site and lock the door behind them.
Saint, n. A dead sinner revised and edited. – Ambrose Bierce
by pico on Sat Jul 30, 2011 at 02:21:48 PM EDT
koam @wittier (7b067e) — 7/30/2011 @ 9:59 pmKoam, your updates of this nature are much appreciated.
Hopefully if anyone sees where he’s posting in the future they will let us know.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/31/2011 @ 4:17 pmHappy to be of help, Dustin. Feel free to DM me.
For weeks, I avoided even paying attention to the mentions of NR, BK, etc. as irrelevant (my head in the sand, I guess) as I tried to focus on the other confusing matters at hand (what with Lee & Nikki & the JGs and all). I got the feeling that those mentions of NR & BK, etc. were related to retribution for matters in the past, which I didn’t feel the need to learn about (wasn’t there enough here to try to make sense of?) — I’m new to all this drama. But avoiding became untenable after a time, seeing how NR was lobbing threats (immersed in idiocy, such as “Weiner was hacked” as late as last week – and idiocy that, astonishingly, none of his commenters refuted) in a well-known, public forum on a daily basis. (Oh, and the one commenter who questioned SW politely on his motivations and spoke in favor of Patterico, had his/her comments hidden, removed, and has also been banned at this point — for what, I have no idea. They banned Preston’s intern too.)
Keep an eye on @p2action, just one of his aliases. And monitor Kos for any changes. I only skimmed the Kos rules, as it’s been a busy weekend. I guess the arbiter says he’s suspended until this is looked into, but the rules say,
Perhaps they don’t have a suspension mode – so that it may be “BANNED…(until review)”
I suppose it all hinges on how seriously they take their rules against threats, hints of threats, obtuse references to family members, harassing questions, etc. Given how the commenters nearly universally kowtowed to SR’s stupidity and hostility, it makes one wonder how that site is managed. I never read it until the past 2 weeks when it was necessary to understand the other half of the story and the possible source of countless socks and various threats.
koam @wittier (7b067e) — 7/31/2011 @ 6:13 pmJust tried to check twitter out. Ugh. So much drama, and it’s hopeless to keep up.
Apparently Patterico is reinterpreting Dan Wolfe’s laughter as ‘Ha ha, it’s ridiculous that you think I’m involved with X’ instead of ‘Ha Ha, X happened to you’.
Additionally, Dan Wolfe had said he was sorry to learn about that.
Patterico is suspicious of Dan Wolfe because he won’t talk to law enforcement and because he claimed his name really is Dan Wolfe. He thinks Dan is John Reid 9 (as do I). Dan says he didn’t trust Patterico because at the time he was affiliating with Lee Stranahan (I think this is very understandable). Anyway, Patterico, please be more careful! I know you’re trying to look out for your family and extremely frustrated, and I think you’re justified in being very suspicious of Dan, but this one was a pretty unfortunate mistake, my friend. Anyway, no surprise Patterico went out of his way to correct the record when he realized he was in error.
—-
Apparently there is drama from Qritiq too. Qritiq has been protective of Cordova, so in addition to her comment about Jeff mentioned here earlier, she wrote
When I read this I thought she was just joking. Obviously this sounds quite a bit like Alicia Pain’s:
Patterico replied to Qritiq with
and
This seems like a very mild and polite response from Patterico.
Somehow, Qritiq has never heard of Alicia Pain.
She isn’t acknowledging the Alicia Pain aspect and its similarity to her warnings here where she complains that Patterico took a screenshot of her comment.
Sorry, but “oh I don’t think you want to start harassing GC again. might not be prudent. nope. might not be prudent at all.” in this context obviously sounds like another creepy warning.
Not sure why Qritiq hasn’t heard of someone mentioned frequently is a thread she too has contributed to. But anyway, this seems really unfortunate and unhelpful. I’m not interested in resolving the conflict, but I think it’s important that people really look over the information before getting too involved. Qritiq’s work will be better if she understands the story and reads Patterico’s posts on it. Creepy warnings about leaving Cordova alone is a big damn toe to stomp on accidentally. It just makes things more dramatic with no real benefit.
Also, it’s stupid to issue creepy warnings in the first place. Qritiq is (unfairly) complaining that someone’s trying to stop her from talking about this story, but she’s the one warning people to stop talking about Cordova. We don’t get to control other people with veiled warnings.
Dustin (b7410e) — 7/31/2011 @ 6:27 pmComment by Dustin — 7/31/2011 @ 6:27 pm
Agreed all around.
koam @wittier (7b067e) — 7/31/2011 @ 7:12 pmDustin, KOAM — when you guys are saying you think Dan Wolfe is John Reid, you are also saying you think he was operating the Starchild and Marienela accounts too? Or not necessarily?
Greg (bc8186) — 7/31/2011 @ 8:00 pmComment by Greg — 7/31/2011 @ 8:00 pm
Greg,
I didn’t mean to say I agreed with that part. Sloppy by me. I don’t know and haven’t thought that before.
koam @wittier (7b067e) — 7/31/2011 @ 8:05 pm@Greg
Gennette (55c21d) — 7/31/2011 @ 9:50 pmWhoever was behind Nikki was also behind Marianela and who ever was behind JR9 had to be behind Nikki, right? The JR9 twitter account was used initially by “Nikki” to contact me after the scandal broke.
From another thread, a few minutes ago — but I think it fits better here:
I saw that, too. Why do you think he said this, koam?
DRJ (a83b8b) — 7/31/2011 @ 10:19 pmRE: Comment by Greg — 7/31/2011 @ 8:00 pm
I’ve believed in Dan Wolfe as a real person who has stated his motivation.
If the Reids & Aliceas are not real, then they’d likely be run by one person or a small group working closely. Their motivation is a key question. While some, Neal and his followers, & Preston, for example, think that the simplest reasoning is that Nikki existed to collect info to use against Weiner. I don’t find that reasoning simple at all. If Nikki’s not a real person then how’s Weiner going to get busted for flirting with her online? It’s not like he’s a moralist politician from a red-red district. His blue-blue district wouldn’t have demanded his resignation if Nikki wasn’t a real girl. And that says that the motivation wasn’t anti-Weiner.
That said, I don’t think it’s been proven that Nikki’s not a real girl using a fake name. It’s an alternate spelling of the name of a young, pretty actress who appeals to teen girls.
koam @wittier (7b067e) — 7/31/2011 @ 10:20 pmComment by DRJ — 7/31/2011 @ 10:19 pm
I dunno, DRJ. Maybe a moment of being fed-up. I briefly considered it was my Jetsons joke tweet, but reconsidered.
Sometimes he sees something that sets him off, but maybe he’s just punking us…or the intern. Or just exhausted.
The symptom of cute, provocative taunts has become a little contagious of late. And he’s received more than his fair share. And has sent a few too. Maybe his wife wanted him to turn off the computer and watch a movie with her. Dunno.
Believe me I’ve been refreshing to make sure he hasn’t made good on his threat.
What’s your take?
koam @wittier (7b067e) — 7/31/2011 @ 10:27 pmI would be more inclined to not think Dan was fake if he’d actually make a call to somebody… To my knowledge he has yet to do that.
Scott Jacobs (d027b8) — 7/31/2011 @ 10:37 pmHe probably just had a bad day. We all get frustrated with conflict now and then. (I’m especially guilty of that.) Also, Twitter is fun because the pithy comments can be so sharp, funny, or witty. But in the long run, I don’t think quick wit is as satisfying as thoughtful discussion.
DRJ (a83b8b) — 7/31/2011 @ 10:41 pmThanks, Gennette. What I was getting at was, does Dustin think Wolfe/JR9 acting entirely alone, or with others playing other roles? In other words, JR9 didn’t come into play until late. Perhaps Wolfe was Patriot, a colleague was Starchild111, and then when the need for JR9 arose, Wolfe plays that role too….
Greg (bc8186) — 7/31/2011 @ 10:58 pmNO JUSTICE THROUGH MUSIC
NO PEACE!!!!!
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 8/1/2011 @ 6:14 amGreg, I can’t say your ‘working together’ explanation is wrong.
I’ve found Dan to be very perplexing. Every time I’ve stuck up for him I’ve been disappointed, so I’ve stopped, and as I’ve watched the mess from a position of doing nothing I’ve seen a guy who seems to harbor a deep hostility to the good guys.
Not just someone who wants to be left alone. In fact, someone who wants attention and says a lot of things he doesn’t mean.
Gennette’s right of course. You’re right too in your reading of what I said. Just to be perfectly clear, I don’t know this to be the case. I suspect it. Whether it’s one person or more controlling these accounts, I think they are on a general mission of creating a smokescreen. And it’s clear to me they don’t like Ms Cordova very much. As I said before, she was used if I’m correct. But why would they dislike her? Not a veiled suspicion… I don’t know why.
Most haven’t managed to read all of Neal’s craziness, but in one section he discusses how he’s written software so he and his friends can control eachother’s twitter sockpuppets more easily. Also, he mentions some of his friends doing this are women. I think that some are young women. Dan may not be one person, and same for Nikki/John Reid. Maybe it takes-a-village-to-raise-a-sock these days.
Anyway, Koam’s take is usually cautious and fair, so his differing interpretation should be taken into account as a sign I could be wrong.
——-
Sometime last night my internet gateway stopped working. It’s never happened before. My router was fine.
This morning when it starts working again I have an email from Patterico notifying me that Ron is broadcasting my IP address and geographic location to the world. I have a normal firewall in place and normal security settings, though I won’t go into detail. I’m not a hacker, but I’m technically inclined and know how to stay relatively safe on the internet.
The only blog I read related to Weinergate last night was Patterico’s and Qritiq’s. I’m not sure how Ron would have gotten my IP address last night, but if he had it for a while and was patient before sharing it with the world, he may have gotten it because I’ve clicked on a few of his links. Lee Stranahan explained that he will place links and then somehow monitor them to see whose IP connects, and then share that information with the world if he’s suspicious of someone (his white whale, Mr Wolfe, of course).
Just to be clear, I don’t think Lee did this to me (he’s had my IP for ages and doesn’t care about me). He simply explained how it worked and that he did this to Dan (who, unlike me, uses a proxy). I guess this is the new ethics, though. If you’re saying something a thug doesn’t want you to say, they will root you out. Lee and Ron share that, though they are not comparable in sanity.
Anyway, unfortunately Ron’s information this time is accurate. Usually when he talks about me he’s lying, but when he’s sharing my personal info he’s somehow gotten (I don’t read his blog) he’s telling the truth.
The more I think about this, the more perplexing it gets because I thought the links I clicked (of ron’s) went to Google’s blogger and Youtube services, which do not provide IP addresses. But I’m not really hiding myself (nor doing anything worth trying to hide) so I can’t really say how he found me.
Is it realistic that someone with my IP could cause my gateway to malfunction? My gateway has been plugged in for years without problems until practically the same time Ron noted the IP.
Dustin (b7410e) — 8/1/2011 @ 7:12 amBTW, I have no idea who Clyde [I’m going to redact his last name is, but my guess is it’s someone Neal Rauhauser hates. Ron is claiming that’s my real name. I like the name Clyde, but it’s not my name.
99% of people Ron is a thug towards happen to be Neal or Brett’s enemies. Then Ron will have some lame and weak accusations of Neal to confuse the matter. For some reason he’s a lot harsher to all these other people.
Sorry Clyde, whoever you are, if my use of that image on Wikipedia as my referring address has brought you any grief. The intention was not serious, and obviously it wasn’t an effort to mask my activity (it has the opposite effect).
Dustin (b7410e) — 8/1/2011 @ 7:24 amClyde, why are you hiding behind the sock named Dustin? We need more honesty from you!
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 8/1/2011 @ 7:55 amAs funny as it seems, I am legitimately concerned for my safety. Behind the scenes, Patterico’s family has been attacked in a real way. Not just internet hassling. Stuff you can’t just turn off by getting off the internet.
They want to know my name, my real location, and are revealing my IP address to encourage people to thug against me. Obviously I am being harassed, but I have no idea what I should do about it. Would it do me any good to have my IP address changed? It’s not hard to learn the next one, once they know my ISP and location.
Any tips would be appreciated. I know this seems like an idiot on twitter doing me no real damage, but I don’t see it that way.
Again, I am sorry to Clyde if this harms him in any way. I don’t know him, and I simply linked a photo he uploaded. It was not a security measure (And anyone informed on this issue would understand it does the opposite of hiding me).
Dustin (b7410e) — 8/1/2011 @ 8:15 amClyde – F*ckwads like Ron, Neal, Brett, Brad, etc., have no scruples, a fact which has repeatedly been demonstrated at this and other blogs. They need to lift their heads to see out of the gutter.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 8/1/2011 @ 8:34 amkoam, i agree that there’s not enough evidence to definitively conclude that Starchild111 was working against Weiner. In my opinion, the most that can be reasonably stated is that she was systematically collecting info about Weiner’s private online interactions with women.
Re: your own conclusions, which I bolded in the snippet of your post I’ve excerpted above, a few questions:
1) ACORN’s staffers weren’t talking to real prostitutes/pimps. That NPR exec who called Tea Partiers racist wasn’t talking to real Muslim philanthropists, MSNBC built a TV show around busting men trying to hook up with simulated underage girls. Given all this, can you really say with any certainty that Weiner’s interactions with a presumed minor might not have proved problematic, especially if the relationship had progressed to picture exchanges, etc?
2) Are Weiner’s blue-blue constituents the only ones who could have forced his resignation? (Actual experience suggests otherwise.)
3) Was resignation the only goal that could be motivating an anti-Weiner effort? (i.e. you’re saying that because resignation would not be probable, the campaign could not be anti-Weiner. What if the goal, however, was merely to distract Weiner, erode support for him, etc.)
4) When you conclude that the motivation wasn’t anti-Weiner, are you implying that you think Starchild’s motivation was explicitly pro-Weiner? Or do you think she was, let’s say, “Weiner-neutral” and had some other agenda altogether?
Greg (bc8186) — 8/1/2011 @ 9:12 amVery good point. It does Weiner no good at all if he stupidly sent something profane to a person claiming to be a minor. ‘But I thought it was a sting operation’ won’t work. I haven’t seen anyone show he did that, though.
John Reid repeatedly boosted Weiner and never took any opportunity to implicate him at all. This is someone we know was somewhat dishonest, and yet never fabricated anything harmful to Weiner at all. In fact, the press releases were timed and written to maximize their benefit to Weiner.
And at the same time, Weiner and Neal’s argument was that conservatives are trying to frame Weiner. This wasn’t about getting Weiner. It was about setting up Dana Loesch and and Andrew Breitbart with fabricated sting operations that were more interested in being known as sting operations than they were in stinging anybody.
Whether Dan Wolfe = John Reid (and the rest of his socks) doesn’t really matter to this point.
I think you ask a good question that is difficult to answer. Was this an effort to help Weiner evade culpability for his sexting? Was it just an effort to harm the reputation of Breitbart? Some kind of mix?
That’s open to speculation.
Mike just wanted to warn people about a creepy old man. But John Reid (I’m using this as a name for all the socks related to Reid) didn’t want to erode support for Weiner. It would have been the easiest thing in the world for him to fabricate sexting with the fake minor. According to Cordoba, he’s willing to fabricate communication, too. Weiner would have been defenseless, other than to open his twitter background, which obviously he had a big reason to resist doing. It’s the most obvious dirty trick. Instead, JR9 went out of his way to explain no such sexting occurred. Hell, just saying nothing would have been worse for Weiner.
If Dan is a concerned guy who wanted to help Mike and others, his recent actions make no sense. Of course, sometimes people do things that make no sense at first glance. Dan could be what he claimed, but if so, he’s handled this without compassion for good people.
Dustin (b7410e) — 8/1/2011 @ 9:48 amIs there any evidence (screencaps, emails, etc.) that shows an intent to frame Breitbart/Loesch?
Greg (bc8186) — 8/1/2011 @ 10:47 amIsn’t it ironic…
That Qritiq is quick to point the accusing finger at others for “odd behavior”, yet when it points back at her, she is indignant, shocked?
That for all her Columbo work, she was unaware of the actual threats in the Weinergate drama, threats aimed at several bloggers including Patterico?
That after hearing about the threats, rather than taking it down a notch, she became more emboldened?
That she sees Patterico as trying to censor her because he capped her tweet… but ignores a real physical threat and its attempt to intimidate speech?
That she accuses others of stifling investigation, while repeatedly ‘warning’ Gennette not to answer questions?
That her theory contains so much certitude, yet seems to change with the wind?
That a person’s computer skills are cause for suspicion, unless that person is her?
That her dual screenname use and blog shenanigans make her a runner-up in the Weinergate puppetry competion?
That she thinks the idea of a threat is silly when uttered by someone small, female, and blonde? (http://qritiq.wordpress.com/2011/07/30/vigilant-blogger/ )
Isn’t it ironic that she knows “at least 7 people who independently know the identity of Dan Wolfe” but doesn’t know it herself?
Don’t you think?
jeffeneff (707f3d) — 8/1/2011 @ 10:54 am@Dustin #2564
It would have been the easiest thing in the world for him to fabricate sexting with the fake minor. According to Cordoba, he’s willing to fabricate communication, too… Instead, JR9 went out of his way to explain no such sexting occurred.
But, if I recall correctly, John Reid fabricated DMs making it look like there had been inappropriate communications between AW and I when there hadn’t been.
Gennette (55c21d) — 8/1/2011 @ 10:55 amFair question again, Greg. I’ll quote Lee on this:
It’s mentioned in a few other places. This John Reid sock’s initial efforts were to tell Tommy Christopher that Breitbart and Loesch were trying to frame Weiner. Tommy did not expose this information until it was too late, which is a shame, because it showed their motivation was obviously hostile towards Brietbart and Loesch. That this character also aided Weiner, including with the fawning press release, latter statements of support for him, and sharing with us only conversations suggesting Weiner didn’t do anything sexual with Nikki-the-sock actually makes for a consistent pattern.
Many have found the motives confusing because they assume JR9 was part of a sockpuppet effort to harm Weiner. None of these sockpuppets ever actually harmed Weiner, though, except for Dan’s retweeting of Weiner’s photo.
If you think Dan and JR9 are the same, this confusion returns (so I’m a bit confused) if you don’t, then it’s actually simple.
JR9 was protective of Weiner and hostile towards Breitbart and Loesch. Maybe his motivation wasn’t strictly to help Weiner, but I think the existence of worse material about Weiner, and his desperate effort to contain that story do work well with the idea of JR9.
Dustin (b7410e) — 8/1/2011 @ 10:58 amYes, that’s true.
In a sense, that doesn’t hurt him at all. You’re an adult. He’s already on the hook. And he seems to hate your guts.
He wanted us to think he was an honest dealer of facts, and he was willing to expose things that didn’t make anything worse for Weiner. If he’s willing to fabricate you and Weiner being inappropriate, why didn’t he fabricate something that would have completely changed the dynamic and harmed Weiner?
He was both laudatory or Weiner, often noting the scandal was not a big deal, and what he fabricated is easiest to understand if he’s cautious not to make things worse for Weiner.
But thanks for making this point. As complicated as this story is, it still needs to be discussed as accurately as possible.
Jeff, I certainly understand the tendency to be suspicious of Qritiq, but I think she really just made a mistake. Hopefully I’m not being naive here, but that’s my gut impression.
Dustin (b7410e) — 8/1/2011 @ 11:03 amFor what it’s worth, if I wanted to frame an opposition blogger, I wouldn’t use a sexual loose-cannon politician, as this undercuts my efforts, especially after several women can crawl out of the woodwork with dirty pics he has actually sent, and especially because it might be discovered he did have sexual communications with a minor.
I wouldn’t telegraph my effort before it was ready to go, unless I were stupid.
jeffeneff (707f3d) — 8/1/2011 @ 11:07 amDustin, my suspicion of Qritiq is about the way she operates. No inference need be drawn beyond that.
jeffeneff (707f3d) — 8/1/2011 @ 11:12 amYou’re right, Jeff.
I should add that Weiner is not a stupid or crazy man. I think he was reckless with adults. One aspect of my narrative that bugs me is the idea he would use Cordova to screw Breitbart. That just doesn’t seem like Weiner to me.
Of course, I was initially saying I didn’t believe this pic was sent by Weiner. I had an acquaintance with him years ago and he seems like a politician who wasn’t full of himself. Wrong on politics, from my view, but not an any-means-necessary crank.
However, I do think he got desperate for a while. I think his libido got the better of him, and he’s not really sure who all he shared illicit material with. I can see Neal using Cordova (getting her to document the Nikki sock), but Weiner? Maybe my measure of the man was wrong, though.
Dustin (b7410e) — 8/1/2011 @ 11:13 amThanks for the link to Lee’s post, Dustin.
In theory, if JR9 communicated anti-Breitbart intent to Christopher or anyone else, there ought to be emails, DMs, tweets, screencaps, something right? Have any ever been published? I’m not sure I’ve read all the JR9 q and a’s in Patterico comment threads, so maybe I missed something.
Greg (bc8186) — 8/1/2011 @ 11:17 am@Greg
Hmmm, I dont think its been published but I have an email from Nikki saying that Breitbart was behind the hacking (back when people believed that AW was actually hacked.)
Gennette (55c21d) — 8/1/2011 @ 11:30 amGennette, publish it in entirety, with headers, redact your own email if you need to. Thanks!
jeffeneff (707f3d) — 8/1/2011 @ 11:33 amHowever, I looked at that as someone trying to make it SEEM like Breitbart was being framed… versus someone actually trying to frame him.
Gennette (55c21d) — 8/1/2011 @ 11:35 amWhoever was behind Nikki was trying to get me to push the hacking theory but I don’t think it was for Weiner’s benefit.
Of course… what do I know?
Ha!
Not laughing at your interpretation. Just laughing at this situation.
Dustin (b7410e) — 8/1/2011 @ 11:49 amgenette, i agree with jeffeneff, if you could post that email from nikki, that would be really helpful. if not actual posting, do you have a time-stamp for it?
Greg (bc8186) — 8/1/2011 @ 12:07 pmGennette, if you suspect me of being a sock, and I say to you “Breitbart’s behind it” – and you say “Jeff’s making it look like Breitbart’s -not- behind it.” I must be missing something?
jeffeneff (707f3d) — 8/1/2011 @ 2:05 pm@Jeffeneff
Gennette (55c21d) — 8/1/2011 @ 2:18 pmSomeone WANTED me to accuse Breitbart of being behind this whole thing. They were attempting to plant that idea in my head before I had ever considered it (I actually never figured Breitbart was behind this).
I pretended to be a little ditzy and clueless with this person; they probably figured I was easy to manipulate.
I don’t believe that this person was Pro-Weiner. If they were, why would either of them (Nikki/Marianela) have come forward at all? With them coming forward they added the underaged girl element to the story.
“Yes, that’s true.”
Clyde @2569 – How do you know Gennette’s statement about JR9 faking DM’s is true? I thought she deleted all her accounts.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 8/1/2011 @ 2:22 pmdaley,
You’re right that I can’t say anything about that objectively.
I really do like the name Clyde. I’m inclined to use that for a moniker except that there is yet another real person out there being smeared simply because Ron wants to include as many people and as many lies as possible in this. I don’t want to cause that soul any problems. Apparently Ron spelled his name wrong, and I do not intend to correct it.
How pathetic that Ron threatened to sue me merely for noting Alicia, not Nancy, had revealed his private details (in a way that shared no details). Now Ron will reveal anything he knows about me while inflating it horribly with lie after lie. It’s as though Ron is somewhat projecting most of his worst sins onto others.
I guess that goes to show you. Ron has a criminal record because he commits crimes, after all.
Dustin (b7410e) — 8/1/2011 @ 2:48 pmGennette, thanks, I think I’m following you… check me… Your perception is that you were to believe, and hopefully disseminate: “Breitbart’s behind this”. At the same time, you can’t believe anyone pro-Weiner would have kept the minors in public visibility.
“Someone” and “this person” is the username “Nikki”? Or someone else?
jeffeneff (707f3d) — 8/1/2011 @ 4:24 pm@Jeffeneff
Gennette (55c21d) — 8/1/2011 @ 4:55 pmExactly. And yes, Nikki.
Go ahead and play your hacker tricks, socks, no one will believe them. This is my first comment here in weeks and will be my last.
Of course, you jerks are lying. That is not Greg or Gennette or Patterico or Goatsred leaving comments the last week…many of the things you have them say don’t even match up with stuff they’ve told me themselves. You’re a bunch of lying clowns.
I’ve refrained from commenting here again, because I assume you will sock me (but I’m copying this and adding to the end of my Dustin article, now).
Dustin smeared me by referring to an expunged police record which Patterico deleted from this website. He had no right to refer to an expunged arrest, which is illegal.
I was arrested for arguing with police in Florida who refused to investigate the abduction and rape of my sister, and charges were dropped and my record was expunged.
Dustin knows that, since I had to explain it on Twitter since he won’t stop referring to my expunged “criminal” past, but continues to call me a criminal when he’s the one going to prison.
My article is called “You Decide If Dustin Lies or Distorts” and his reaction is to open up a twitter account and lie that it contains viruses, etc:
Just like Neal Rauhauser would do….anyway….Dustin is also lying by claiming CYDE, not Clyde which was a typo as he knows, is a real name, when it’s an alias, too.
http://www.ronbryn.blogspot.com/2011/08/you-decide-if-dustin-lies-distorts.html
Read his lying tweets at http://www.twitter.com/Dust92
You guys are probably playing some kind of game by making my tweets private, because you’re Stalinist scum. I bet you delete this comments because I link to my blog which “reveals” the ip address of the thug Dustin who is sending DDOS attacks at this website.
There aren’t even any incoming links on the Wikipedia upload page, so it’s impossible for Dustin to come to this blog from that link. It is being used to DDOS attack this very site.
Ron Brynaert (3d3df5) — 8/1/2011 @ 5:19 pmThanks for telling me what that was about. Your claim that it is illegal to discuss an expunged record is simply laughable nonsense. But now that you’ve explained it to me, I’ll be able to copy it in more detail.
SPQR (26be8b) — 8/1/2011 @ 5:28 pmDustin, if you like, I will delete the link to Ron’s post. I will also consider posting his IP, as well as the expunged arrest information I previously deleted.
Patterico (f724ca) — 8/1/2011 @ 5:33 pmPatterico, you know that I was being sarcastic of course.
SPQR (26be8b) — 8/1/2011 @ 5:35 pmIf Ron gets any crazier, next thing you know he’ll be saying a homeless guy with a can of chewing tobacky is bugging him for Fox News.
Patterico (f724ca) — 8/1/2011 @ 5:44 pmBut would that homeless guy be a sock too? Or…another conspiracy…an unwashed sock, because, they have a certain smell about them.
Or so I’ve been told..no! Perhaps Dustin..aka Clyde is also DaleysRock…so, in reality *koff* he’d be a Dusty Rockin’ ClydesDale..?
Its all so confusing 😉 Where’s my vodka..?
ppk_pixie (1df0c8) — 8/1/2011 @ 5:52 pmDustin’s real name is sideways?
oof learn something new everyday
My name is really Ron, but I escaped
EricPWJohnson (4380b4) — 8/1/2011 @ 5:52 pmAnd if they don’t, it means they are bugging you for Fox News.
Patterico (f724ca) — 8/1/2011 @ 5:53 pmI gave up chew.
SPQR (26be8b) — 8/1/2011 @ 5:57 pmAnd if they don’t, it means they are bugging you for Fox News.
Comment by Patterico — 8/1/2011 @ 5:53 pm
Ohhhh…so, if Irish Spring fresh- spy, but eau de locker room equals the real deal. Got it.
I guess when Biden said “clean” it was a double entendre *snort*
ppk_pixie (1df0c8) — 8/1/2011 @ 5:59 pmRon
this is disturbing as well
A high-power task force, headed by the chief executive officer of the Qatar National Food Security Programme, will initiate and implement steps needed to make the country food secure by 2023, it was announced yesterday
EricPWJohnson (4380b4) — 8/1/2011 @ 6:04 pmThank you Patterico. And thanks for notifying me my email that Ron did this to me. And thanks a third time for your much more clever but honest initial handling of this. Jeffeneff similarly didn’t think I need to give Ron the satisfaction of confirming his disclosing my IP address accurately.
I think it’s amazing Ron would use a justification of his personal privacy to smear my good name using private information.
I never posted any private information about Ron. When I saw Ron’s private information, I emailed Patterico to complain about the comment.
The wrong commenter was accused of posting Ron’s personal info, and I explained it was Alicia Pain, not Nancy, who did so. I did not say what crime Ron committed, but it is not illegal for me to say he’s a criminal or list his crimes. Ron, you shouldn’t have violated our laws if you don’t want people to know you as a criminal. I didn’t think it was relevant, though and felt it was a dirty thing to do.
I believe you posted that information yourself as Alicia to make yourself into a victim, but I can not say this with any degree beyond sheer guess. You have been far more hostile towards me than you were towards Alicia, and Alicia helped position you as a fellow victim.
You didn’t have any problem with my defense of your privacy (which is all it was) for some time.
Then, as you were accusing many people of many things, and several were asking you to seek help because you sound like a risk to yourself and others, I criticized you and mentioned one thing obliquely that brings you under heavy suspicion. That’s when you tried to find a reason to be mad at me, and hilariously, the worst you could find was my criticism of Alicia Pain, as though I was somehow involved. Of course, this makes sense to you. You do that. You criticize Neal and Brett but you are their friends. You claim you’re Patterico’s buddy but claim everything he says came from hackers.
But I was genuine in my criticisms, and that’s obvious. Your attacks on Neal however a beandog feel to them. They are silly and unpersuasive, and so much less intense than you attacks on innocent people who are Neal’s fierce critics.
Patterico, knowing Ron’s IP would likely do me no good anyway, but I greatly appreciate that you would help me in any way you can. It’s mutual. I worry that if I know his IP he will accuse me of all manner of new crimes, and it will only be more plausible. I don’t have any use for this information. His ISP is not going to care about this.
Ron’s old crimes are not relevant either. He deserves to have them broadcast, though. I think his present activity is far more damaging to his credibility.
Obviously. Your browser sends user agent and referral data. Mine sends what I tell it to send. For some time I changed mine to claim I was referred to any page I download by a beautiful picture of the interior of St Peter’s Basilica. This is the opposite of hiding (it highlights me), but it was not a security measure. I just don’t see the point in one website knowing the last website I was at. I could just as well send the root URL of any website I visit instead (a smart setting, btw).
You already know all this. You are lying to claim you thought I was hacking you. This picture exists on two websites in identical form. Anyone can run a hash and see it’s the same file. This file is five years old. You claim it’s a sophisticated vicious file that has hacked a variety of your systems, and you are lying.
You claimed I was a terrorist because of my ethnicity and deleted that comment when I called you out, changing it to ‘I’m just inquiring if he’s in Al Qaida’. Now you say it’s clear I’m not a terrorist traitor to my country, and you offer no apology. You were lying the entire time you claimed to think I was a terrorist.
You have told lies about many people, and 99% of the reaction is that you are stupid. This is fair, but I am furious that you are helping confuse and distort this story with the intention of helping criminals (of which you are one) mask what they are doing, much as Neal masked his crimes with beandogs asserting all manner of harassment and crimes worse than he really did during the last twittergate.
I do not ask Patterico to delete anything, and I’ve never asked him to delete anything. I’ve never asked him to ban anyone. Occasionally I’ve written him to support someone who others are asking to ban, often someone I disagree with.
I’m not like you Ron. I do not try to destroy a normal dialogue.
I know you are not crazy, Ron. I know you are completely aware of just how harmful and nasty and wrong your lies are. I am proud to be your enemy.
Dustin (b7410e) — 8/1/2011 @ 6:27 pmRon, you want to point out Dustin’s location and accuse him of crimes and then be immune yourself to turnabout. I’ll say again…he referred obliquely to the posting of your info, but it was your reply to him that reiterated your police record.
It occurs to me that a form of the beandog strategy is being employed by one or more here. Try to bait people into more and more reaction, to try to make them become as unhinged as you are. Luckily, that’s too far for most of us to go 😉
jeffeneff (707f3d) — 8/1/2011 @ 6:29 pm““You can always judge a man by the quality of his enemies.”
SPQR (26be8b) — 8/1/2011 @ 6:32 pm-Doctor Who”
LOL. LOL.
I appreciate the injections of humor. As usual, my comment has a few typos.
If anyone has a sincere question about my involvement with anything, please ask directly. I am not a player in this crap aside from criticizing three of the players in this crap.
I have a question: is my concern that his posting my IP relates to my cable modem’s failure a realistic concern? I’ve been looking over the logs of my router’s firewall and software firewall and nothing seems to be happening. I can’t see the log prior to my cable modem’s problems.
How likely is it that someone could flood another user offline?
Dustin (b7410e) — 8/1/2011 @ 6:35 pmI’d just like to point out that this thread is now officially longer than War and Peace. I hope Colonel Haiku will cover 2600, which I feel compelled to point out is a number of significance to the hacking community.
jeffeneff (707f3d) — 8/1/2011 @ 6:37 pmWhoops, I win.
jeffeneff (707f3d) — 8/1/2011 @ 6:37 pmDustin, anyone knowing your IP could try to flood it. Perhaps you could ask your ISP if they see unusual activity, or just request that they change it.
jeffeneff (707f3d) — 8/1/2011 @ 6:40 pmMy expunged arrest was trying to help my sister who was abducted and raped.
Seriously, how many socks calling me a criminal for that are going to be believed? Ridiculous.
And Patterico makes a reference in this very thread about the illegality of leaking expunged arrests…and of course it’s illegal to even refer to one…and it’s unAmerican and against our entire justice system.
And what does Aaron Worthing know about my Twitter account? My tweets were fine until he made weird tweets claiming you can only read my account when unsigned out.
Aaron is playing games with hackers. And socks have stopped referring to my tweets about Neal Rauhauser because they know something funny is going on with them.
Also, Dustin keeps referring to something regarding Patterico’s family he shouldn’t even know about.
You hackers do realize that I haven’t peeped a word about the phone call only because I was asked; Much different than Lee Stranahan’s reason.
Patterico knows I am trying to help him.
Let the police figure it out, I don’t care what socks say.
Ron Brynaert (3d3df5) — 8/1/2011 @ 6:40 pmWorse is the wrong word.
Few things on twitter that I can imagine are worse than what Neal really did, which was organize some of the most awful comments, scaring people that monsters would rape their children.
Instead of worse, I wish I had typed ‘more absurd’. Things that Neal points to to laugh at the people who were not horrified by the Soros hacking their real estate crap, but by the real racism and real hatred.
It’s an infantile defense.
Dustin (b7410e) — 8/1/2011 @ 6:43 pmDustin why would I be mad at Alicia who doesn’t exist?
I believe you are Alicia, since the record was expunged and you referenced it after Patterico deleted it (any other reasonable person would assume it was you in the first place since you did that) which is why I posted your IP address.
Let the cops figure it out.
Ron Brynaert (3d3df5) — 8/1/2011 @ 6:45 pmDustin and the socks are absurd.
This entire page is full of them smearing and threatening innocent women.
I don’t know why they keep posting here since they know Patterico doesn’t believe a word they write.
Ron Brynaert (3d3df5) — 8/1/2011 @ 6:48 pmRon just look out your
ColonelHaiku (38526a) — 8/1/2011 @ 6:48 pmwindow don’t the first thing you
see look just like me?
Ronbryn is bugfucknutz.
JD (318f81) — 8/1/2011 @ 6:51 pm“And Patterico makes a reference in this very thread about the illegality of leaking expunged arrests…and of course it’s illegal to even refer to one…and it’s unAmerican and against our entire justice system.”
You keep writing things that are not true.
SPQR (26be8b) — 8/1/2011 @ 6:51 pmRonbryn is completely insane.
JD (318f81) — 8/1/2011 @ 6:55 pmRon
Dustins not a hack, Aarons not a hack
Honestly,
EricPWJohnson (2925ff) — 8/1/2011 @ 6:58 pmAnnd you thought my Palin obseesion was the new bottom of the internet didnt you JD
Come on fess up,,,
EricPWJohnson (2925ff) — 8/1/2011 @ 6:59 pmAnd people thought I was the only one who had an open velcro strap on my last bungie jump
EricPWJohnson (2925ff) — 8/1/2011 @ 7:02 pmThis will be my only response to anyone else here…but I might still defend myself against Dustin’s lies.
But SPQR, I was referring to this comment above by Patterico left LAST MONTH in a thread left open so that you hackers could dig yourselves holes.
Patterico wrote, “All public record to be sure” because I explained what the arrest was to him in our first phone call, and it was a sly reference to the record being EXPUNGED.
And, Dustin and the rest of you evil scumbags still leaving comments on this thread, did a real slimy thing by socking as Goatsred who had the same crap pulled on him.
Of course he wouldn’t defend that…and Mike, Gennette, Patrick and Greg are my friends and Dan Wolfe is my source…so stop SOCKING FOR THEM! None of them would be posting comments on this thread, especially Patterico.
https://patterico.com/2011/06/30/someone-smarter-than-me-explain-why-this-is-not-possible/comment-page-105/#comment-813886
I deleted a comment that purported to post personal information for Ron Brynaert.
For some reason the whole thing reminded me of the way The Smoking Gun treated Mike Stack.
All public record to be sure.
Hi Neal!
Comment by Patterico — 6/30/2011 @ 10:15 pm
Ron Brynaert (3d3df5) — 8/1/2011 @ 7:05 pmRon, get help, you really do need it.
And its still not illegal.
SPQR (26be8b) — 8/1/2011 @ 7:07 pmYou are a liar, Ron. Why would we believe this?
Show me some evidence. Everything you say shows you are a compulsive and amazing liar. You just can’t help but tell the most horribly dramatic lies about everything you talk about.
Would Ron make something like that up? Yes.
A reasonable person would assume I was posting information about you, and then having that information deleted. Why? To what end? I didn’t disclose that I had contacted Patterico about the comment until you claimed I left the comment.
You claim I threatened women in this thread? What in the hell are you talking about? Oh wait. You pretend I’m anything bad you see, and most of the time it wasn’t really that bad and you’re lying about it.
Just like you are about Alicia, right? You were mad that I noted a fact about you that you know was a huge mistake on your part, and then suddenly you were mad about a stale comment I made criticizing Alicia Pain. With no sane basis, you claim I’m Alicia, but I think you’re Alicia because you have made no effort to find that person. You haven’t sought the IP that left that comment and followed through with whatever proxy service they used. I bet you haven’t contacted law enforcement about this. You left that comment.
If you hadn’t left that comment, you wouldn’t be willing to blame it on me and let your enemy escape. It’s just too obvious you know you’re lying about me, yet again.
Dustin (b7410e) — 8/1/2011 @ 7:08 pmI appreciate the injections of humor. As usual, my comment has a few typos.
Comment by Dustin — 8/1/2011 @ 6:35 pm
Dustin,
My intent was to make you smile, glad I was able to. Never you mind about simple typos (or having a mild case of what I call “typoglycemia”)…someone else(ronkoffron) seems to have a virulent case of “pseudo-paranoiditis”….also referred to as “dramatica regina magnus”. The badge of “Proud Member of the Tin Foil Asshattery Brigade since 2011” stamped on his forehead is a dead give away…
ppk_pixie (1df0c8) — 8/1/2011 @ 7:16 pmDustin is really panicking because now the feds have his IP address.
Only a madman would accuse someone of lying about being arrested arguing with the police after their sister was abducted and raped.
I’ve kept that secret for over twenty years, but had to reveal it BECAUSE OF YOU…not because of Alicia Pain, since Patterico deleted her comment.
My arrests were expunged…only thugs would call someone a criminal.
I’m so honest I’m revealing that I HAD TWO EXPUNGED ARRESTS!!!
Seriously, Dustin, the feds are gonna catch you and even Neal Rauhauser wouldn’t just call me a liar for referring to my sister’s rape and abduction. You’re an animal.
Ask Liberty Chick to call the Florida police department and probe if you need to…
Ron Brynaert (3d3df5) — 8/1/2011 @ 7:17 pmIf he is, then at least I did try pretty hard to reach out to him to get help.
But I don’t think he is. When he messes up, he gets sane very quickly. He knows the things he is saying aren’t possibly true.
Ron, you are a criminal. I had no idea until you admitted your crimes were expunged, but your saying so proves they happened.
You know where I live now, little man, so call the police department and let them know I am talking about your expunged criminal record. Show them all the comments I’ve made referencing it. Hell, show them Alicia Pain’s comments too.
Of course, you know damn well you’re lying. You don’t think this is a crime. You think you’re a better con artist if people think you’re crazy. A smart con artist will want people to think they are stupid, but you’re a stupid con artist so you want people to think you’re crazy.
Dustin (b7410e) — 8/1/2011 @ 7:17 pmROFL
SPQR (26be8b) — 8/1/2011 @ 7:18 pmGennette —I think I can back up what you are saying about someone trying to push the Breitbart framed Weiner angle. ( it was used on me too) . If you want to, Patrick can be the middle man or you can follow me.
goatsred (b20383) — 8/1/2011 @ 7:20 pmLet me know….
Actually, anything very extreme that you say I’m going to assume is probably a lie. If you don’t like that, you need to back it up with evidence.
Sorry, liar, but when you lied about me 100 times I decided you do not tell the truth. Every criminal probably has some lie excuse for what they did.
And no, I’m not panicking. The idea I was hiding my IP so the feds wouldn’t find it is very amusing, considering you are the guy who proved I do not make any effort whatsoever to hide my IP. The guy who owns that IP is really named Dustin.
Please, tell me the name of a single person in law enforcement you have talked to about this. I would be overjoyed for them to get to know me.
They will not have to hear my excuse for my criminal record as I have no criminal record.
Dustin (b7410e) — 8/1/2011 @ 7:21 pmGennette, please do not let my drama with this idiot interfere with your meaningful pursuit of truth with these other good folks. People will skip over the riff raff, so don’t feel interrupted.
Dustin (b7410e) — 8/1/2011 @ 7:25 pmI spoke to Deputy District Attorney John Patrick Frey, told my lawyer to contact the police, told my listener to contact the police, and on July 7, after I realized you guys had hacked my emails, too, and panicked because I gave you the names of family members and secret sources, asked a copy shop to call the police and gave them my name, called 911 and asked to be transferred to FBI, went to a former job of mine and asked the woman behind counter to call FBI, she refused so others called 911 and I told them to tell the police my name and that they have my info because I used to work here, I also tweeted the Secret Service and on Saturday night I left my message about Neal on the website for the FBI as my laptop cache will show.
When I was waiting for a police detective from Mass to call me during the last week of June, all the cell phone coverage in my area mysteriously went out…Patterico agreed on our phone call that that might have been hackers.
My phone is hacked and so are my emails..and the haiku guy keeps leaving menacing references to watching me outside my apartment. Some of these monsters – like Jeff – have referred to killing my cat.
I am literally DYING to speak to the FBI and Secret Service and the deputy district attorney and my scared sources.
If you were able to intercept that FBI note, Dustin, it is a crime. Or somebody else did, and it’s a crime.
The Deputy District Attorney can surely have me arrested if he wants.
Eric of course isn’t leaving comments here and it’s fucking absurd you socks keep talking about following each other when even the Anonymous hackers on Twitter openly warn not to do that.
I’ll come back tomorrow and respond to more lies, Dustin, if you want, but this is my last comment here tonight.
Ron Brynaert (3d3df5) — 8/1/2011 @ 7:35 pmDustin, imo he is just trying to intimidate you. However, I can see why it would be disturbing (that’s the intent). I actually mention up thread that Ron wanted people to click his links so he could see what he could see.
If I were you I would firstly not get too worried. All they know right now is close to where you live. Secondly I would become proactive in case they find your name. Got an old Myspace that Google would bring up? Close it. Same for Flickr etc. If you have to have something up in your name change your icons if they are pictures of you.
Thirdly, use hidemyass if you absolutely want to click one of his garbage links or anyone else who posts a link you don’t trust in all this.
noodles (3681c4) — 8/1/2011 @ 7:37 pmRon, I am not your friend whatsoever. I have really had it with you and your BS. Do not talk about me in any way,shape or form.
goatsred (b20383) — 8/1/2011 @ 7:40 pmDon’t talk about any incident that you have heard about through third hand sources.
Im posting here because the only time your name is mentioned is when you show up to post. You also promised “one post only”.
So take your meds and STFU about me forever. I am not a sock, and especially NOT YOUR FRIEND. I ABHOR YOU. Spend your time out of the asylum looking for a job.
Maybe I should start tying the coincidences in my life to some of the comments you’ve just made here?
Not sure.
People need to remember that these people are trolls. They are having a blast doing this. The only end game they might have (besides possible LE interactions) is when people stop paying attention to them.
noodles (3681c4) — 8/1/2011 @ 7:42 pmIt looks like Ron has ‘outed’ two people on this thread. He outed wittier by name. And now he has outed Dustin by ip address. Outing two people that are interested in getting some answers. ?????
jmel44 (d9a8f5) — 8/1/2011 @ 7:45 pmDustin, get in touch with me…I know that you dont use Twitter so use my throwaway email account to get in touch..(if you want to)
sbgmikeytons at gmail dot com
Think it would be beneficial.
goatsred (b20383) — 8/1/2011 @ 7:49 pmGenette, you can use this one too.
thanks for the insightful tips Noodles.
I sorely wish I had not been goaded into clicking his links. Sorely sorely sorely.
I knew better. He was posting headlines about me that practically demanded I click, but I should have used something like your ‘hidemyass’ service (which I have bookmarked).
I want to highlight one thing. Ron is noting I know something he doesn’t understand how I know. But the only thing I said was there is something very suspicious about Ron. That alone is enough that he knows I’m not full of bologna. And my first saying that was the true moment he started trying to intimidate me.
It’s been effective social engineering, though crude, to accuse someone of nastier and nastier stuff until they click your link. But it’s my fault too, and if what’s happened to other families happens to mine I will know I should have been more careful if I wanted to get involved.
Mea culpa.
Dustin (b7410e) — 8/1/2011 @ 7:54 pm“My arrests were expunged…only thugs would call someone a criminal.”
Ronny – Comedy Gold coming from someone who called somebody here a terrorist based on no information.
Don’t give up your day job or lack thereof.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 8/1/2011 @ 8:08 pmMike, I contacted you at 9:58 pm with an email address beginning with a J. I took my last name off it a while back.
Yeah, I know, silly.
Dustin (b7410e) — 8/1/2011 @ 8:11 pmYeah, I know, silly.
Comment by Dustin — 8/1/2011 @ 8:11 pm
No, its not silly Dustin. But it does sadden, and hell, anger me that you felt the need to have to dance those steps- just to send a simple email.
ppk_pixie (1df0c8) — 8/1/2011 @ 8:21 pmNP Dustin. You just have to think how they will if they find your name. You can Google your name and email address to see what they will most likely see. They will Google your name and town together etc. etc. Then they will check Facebook and Myspace and any nickname associated with any of them. Then the White pages and sites like 123 or whatever it is.
There is a lot you can do now to stop some of the bleeding if it happens even if it’s just setting things you use to private.
Another useful tip for people is using your onscreen keyboard for passwords and stuff as key-loggers are often used by people like this.
noodles (3681c4) — 8/1/2011 @ 8:29 pm