Patterico's Pontifications

6/26/2011

JohnReid9 Would Like to Answer More Questions

Filed under: General — Patterico @ 9:48 pm



JohnReid9 previously answered questions, here. If he skips your question, consider the possibility that it is a duplicate.

By giving you this opportunity, I express no opinion regarding JohnReid9 and do not vouch for him. As I always say, I tell you what I know and what I don’t. But his answers to questions are news.

Speaking of news, today’s news will likely prompt a new round of questions regarding Jennifer George.

So ask him whatever comes to mind.

256 Responses to “JohnReid9 Would Like to Answer More Questions”

  1. Ask him anything you like, about Jennifer George, his view of Weiner, or anything else that comes to mind!

    Patterico (135ea8)

  2. Do you, your wife and daughter have the same political views? If not how do they differ from each other?

    tier (4a939c)

  3. How did you decide to have a completely fake profile pic and other details for Nikki?
    Did you communicate with Marienela or did she just coincidentally also decide to use a fake profile picture?
    Why did Nikki lie about the dog?
    Why did Nikki only follow celebrities and people who Weiner were following?
    Did Nikki actually know Juan?

    AJS (2419b3)

  4. How will you like cleaning toilets or picking up trash by the side of the road in an orange vest (after your two – for weeks in jail)?

    Sarahw (af7312)

  5. Did you file a police report in the last few days?

    Paul (7d6791)

  6. Tell me about The Buckley School.

    MayBee (081489)

  7. You say you are doing all of this (releasing info) because the NYT is lying about your family. What do you say to the fact that no one knows your (or your daughter’s) real identity?

    Kristina (0ca6be)

  8. I just want to throw this out there, John. Someone has filed a police report that just about every sane person who is aware of this story realizes is false. While this doesn’t involve you, as far as I know, there is that theory that this Jennifer is actually a puppeteer, with your persona and a few others as her various roles.

    I realize this probably comes across as a bit insulting after you’ve answered several questions to try to establish you exist, but one thing I think would really help is if you went on the record and condemned filing false police reports or otherwise trying to deceive people.

    And, assuming you are legit, you’re one of the greatest victims of the aura of distrust and conspiracy theorizing someone like Jennifer appears to be responsible for (by filing a false police report). Even if Lee Stranahan is wrong about everything, he hardly deserves something like that.

    Can you explain how you feel about that? It would help me get a feel for who are you, given your recent ordeals.

    Thanks.

    Dustin (c16eca)

  9. Did you/your daughter start out being all that interested in Anthony Weiner? Or were you/she pushed?

    MayBee (081489)

  10. John,
    Why did Lee Stranahan just post the title of tonight’s radio show “Betty Calls The Police”?

    http://bit.ly/mdBxXz | 1 AM ET. 10 PM PT.
    (basically right now)

    Isn’t that a strange title for a show?

    koam (7c1f46)

  11. JohnReid9,
    Please help me to fully understand what is going on. So many responses from you and others are extremely cryptic. Why not just tell it like it is, or at least how you believe it is. This “beating around the bush” only prolongs the situation. Wouldn’t you prefer to just get it over with and and go back to whatever it was you were doing before this started?

    Thank you in advance.

    Leonardo DaFinchi (5db456)

  12. Anyone outside of LA & Seattle involved to begin with?

    Rocks (5241c6)

  13. Oh yeah, and John, do you or your family know Jennifer?

    Dustin (c16eca)

  14. @JohnReid9

    Your daughter, known here as Nikki, appears to have communicated with Gennette Cordova using the twitter account starchild111. That Twitter account appears to have been opened by someone named Jenny George. Can you explain this? Is your daughter Jenny George? If not, have you ever met or do you know a person named Jenny George?

    lamchops (a91fe8)

  15. John Reid – what did GennetteC do to cause your consternation with her? Does your spouse still stand behind her letter?

    Comment by JD — 6/26/2011 @ 9:27 pm

    JD (318f81)

  16. And I apologize for adding an and where only one and should be.

    And no more.

    Leonardo DaFinchi (5db456)

  17. When did Nikki start/create(date/month year fine)her Twitter accnt?

    What do you make of the fact that someone has claimed to creating your daughter’s starchild111 account? That there is a record of a “jenay” and a “JG” initials name associated with the account
    Nikki used? Is this accurate representation?

    az5thdstrct (e76e6a)

  18. I just want to throw this out there, John. Someone has filed a police report that just about every sane person who is aware of this story realizes is false. While this doesn’t involve you, as far as I know, there is that theory that this Jennifer is actually a puppeteer, with your persona and a few others as her various roles.

    I realize this probably comes across as a bit insulting after you’ve answered several questions to try to establish you exist, but one thing I think would really help is if you went on the record and condemned filing false police reports or otherwise trying to deceive people.

    And, assuming you are legit, you’re one of the greatest victims of the aura of distrust and conspiracy theorizing someone like Jennifer appears to be responsible for (by filing a false police report). Even if Lee Stranahan is wrong about everything, he hardly deserves something like that.

    Can you explain how you feel about that? It would help me get a feel for who are you, given your recent ordeals.

    Thanks.

    Comment by Dustin — 6/26/2011 @ 9:56 pm

    Hi Dustin thanks for your question. Of course we don’t agree with filing of false police reports of any kind.
    We do not know any JG and actually feel sorry for anyone else dragged into this.
    I’m sure the authorities will handle any false or real reports and will resolve it.

    John Reid (af3c93)

  19. Did you, or anyone you, know comment here and at other blogs as ‘seattle545’ before establishing a dialogue with Patterico?

    tier (4a939c)

  20. I don’t think it’s Patriot. No way.

    And glad you’re laying off the poor kitty video lady, Lee.

    koam (7c1f46)

  21. Lee, what is the main idea?

    koam (7c1f46)

  22. Why did you your family initially tell Tommy that Breitbart and Loesch behind getting Bornfree to Manufacture evidence? Do you have evidence or did Nikki/girls lie about that? Or did Tommy misreport this?

    Why were there significantly more DM’s between Nikki and Rep. Weiner than what Mother and “you” claimed in your statement to Tommy?

    az5thdstrct (e76e6a)

  23. Did you, or anyone you, know comment here and at other blogs as ‘seattle545′ before establishing a dialogue with Patterico?

    Comment by tier — 6/26/2011 @ 10:07 pm

    No that was not us.

    John Reid (af3c93)

  24. Would you and Gennette agree to have a conversation, moderated perhaps by Patterico?

    She never seems to come around when you are here, but maybe Patterico could work something out.

    MayBee (081489)

  25. Thank you for replying to my question, John which yeah, I grant is of an “of course” variety.

    I feel sorry for anyone dragged into this too, but if JG has filed a false police report, she will face justice for that. And I only say ‘if’ for sentence structure. I think she’s done so.

    OK. I won’t threadjack on that point.

    Dustin (c16eca)

  26. You were hard on the case of the kitty video girl… very convinced.

    koam (7c1f46)

  27. No that was not us.

    Comment by John Reid — 6/26/2011 @ 10:11 pm

    Do you think it was Gennette? Who else do you think had access to make those screenshots?

    tier (4a939c)

  28. John Reid – what did GennetteC do to cause your consternation with her? Does your spouse still stand behind her letter?

    Comment by JD — 6/26/2011 @ 9:27 pm

    Unfortunately my wife does not stand by her letter. It was actually Patterico’s story on Ethel that caused us to question our daughter’s claim of only 2 DM’s between her and Rep Weiner.
    After Patterico’s story uncovered the discrepancy of Ethel saying there were 2 DM’s when later on it turned out to be 5 or 6, my wife and I questioned this.
    Thanks to Patterico, we realized we were in the same situation as Ethel and her parents. There were more DM’s that Nikki did not want us to see. We gave Rep Weiner the benefit of the doubt at the time when my wife wrote her statement.
    Now we are disturbed about some of the content. Although we don’t want to jump to any conclusions. Since so many people have jumped to conclusions throughout this ordeal, it wouldn’t be fair.

    John Reid (af3c93)

  29. Would you and Gennette agree to have a conversation, moderated perhaps by Patterico?

    She never seems to come around when you are here, but maybe Patterico could work something out.

    Comment by MayBee — 6/26/2011 @ 10:12 pm
    I would agree to that. Sure.

    John Reid (af3c93)

  30. Hi John

    Are you busy listening to Stranahan on Blog Talk Radio?

    Johnny 5 is alive (5ccc5e)

  31. John Reid: Why do you think Gennette spends so much time on this website monitoring what is going on here?

    Kaisersoze (c86eb0)

  32. Oh yeah, and John, do you or your family know Jennifer?

    Comment by Dustin — 6/26/2011 @ 10:00 pm
    We do not know this person.

    John Reid (af3c93)

  33. John – Do you know Bree Avery? She suffered a lot of people saying she was fake a few years ago! And she even posted video of herself!

    milowent (0f8248)

  34. Did you/your daughter start out being all that interested in Anthony Weiner? Or were you/she pushed?

    Comment by MayBee — 6/26/2011 @ 9:57 pm

    My daughter considers him a hero. She admires him. My wife and I admire his politics. We think he is a great Congressman and should not have had to retire. Whatever he did or didn’t do had nothing to do with his work as a Congressman.

    John Reid (af3c93)

  35. How did you find out about the extra DM’s? Through Nikki or by going through her account? Are you now satisfied that you have found all their correspondence or is there possibly more that might be denied and lost that needs to be released by twitter?

    tier (4a939c)

  36. How about a livechat?

    Auntie Social Disorder (e71ad9)

  37. I’m trying to think if I’ve ever my whole life admired someone’s politics

    happyfeet (3c92a1)

  38. JohnReid9,
    Please help me to fully understand what is going on. So many responses from you and others are extremely cryptic. Why not just tell it like it is, or at least how you believe it is. This “beating around the bush” only prolongs the situation. Wouldn’t you prefer to just get it over with and and go back to whatever it was you were doing before this started?

    Thank you in advance.

    Comment by Leonardo DaFinchi — 6/26/2011 @ 9:58 pm

    I’m not sure what your asking. I’d be happy to answer a specific question or questions. Please follow up

    John Reid (af3c93)

  39. How about a livechat?

    Comment by Auntie Social Disorder — 6/26/2011 @ 10:29 pm

    Sure, I’d do that.

    John Reid (af3c93)

  40. Why do you think Gennette spends so much time on this website monitoring what is going on here?

    Kaisersoze (c86eb0)

  41. How did you find out about the extra DM’s? Through Nikki or by going through her account? Are you now satisfied that you have found all their correspondence or is there possibly more that might be denied and lost that needs to be released by twitter?

    Comment by tier — 6/26/2011 @ 10:28 pm

    After Patterico’s story we were suspicious and asked Nikki. She revealed a few more DM’s but not all. As I was sending what I had to Patterico, Patterico suggested from his experience with Ethel that my wife and I should go and do some checking. It turns out he was right. We asked Nikki and there were more DM’s she was keeping from us it turns out. So it’s a good thing that Patterico had insight into that.

    John Reid (af3c93)

  42. John would you call into Stranahan’s show and tell your side of the story? (347) 945-5235

    Paul (7d6791)

  43. Do you think it was Gennette? Who else do you think had access to make those screenshots?

    Comment by tier — 6/26/2011 @ 10:14 pm

    I will refrain from speculating who I think released those screenshots. But there were 2 other people outside of our family who had access to the screenshots. I will leave it at that because I don’t think it’s fair to falsely accuse someone. I do know it was not us, that is why we decided to speak out because we did not want unauthorized info coming out. And we definitely did not authorize those screenshots to be released. Thanks for asking.

    John Reid (af3c93)

  44. Hi John

    Are you busy listening to Stranahan on Blog Talk Radio?

    Comment by Johnny 5 is alive — 6/26/2011 @ 10:25 pm

    Hi Johnny no I am not listening. I am busy here answering as many questions I can. Do you have any more questions? Thanks.

    John Reid (af3c93)

  45. Thank you, John for your answers. I want to repost the second part of my question again as I am interested in your answer.

    Are you now satisfied that you have found all their correspondence or is there possibly more that might be denied and lost that needs to be released by twitter?

    tier (4a939c)

  46. John would you call into Stranahan’s show and tell your side of the story? (347) 945-5235

    Paul (7d6791)

  47. When you say two other people had access to the screenshots, where they in the same town as you or some other area?

    Kaisersoze (c86eb0)

  48. John, is your daughter still allowed to use the computer without any supervision into what she’s accessing?

    Susie Q (653074)

  49. Are the two other people outside your family in possession of the actual DMs or was the access you speak of to the (captured) screenshots themselves? Heh. I guess I’m wondering if you think the leak came from your families documents or if it could be the other parties of those actual DMs?

    tier (4a939c)

  50. “We think he is a great Congressman and should not have had to retire. Whatever he did or didn’t do had nothing to do with his work as a Congressman.”

    “There were more DM’s that Nikki did not want us to see.”

    Can you explain the discrepancy here (at least the one most reasonable parents would see)? You seem to have found the secreted DMs disturbing but say you think Weiner is fit to serve as a representative.

    If any congressman is sending inappropriate messages (perhaps not even explicitly lewd), a parent must have a screw lose to think that congressman is fit to serve. Obviously mental faculties and political acumen are not necessarily compromised if he is pursuing minors, but maintaining political support for that person does appear to exalt political concerns above that of integrity and parenting – even if the Congressman doesn’t strictly have to resign based upon notions of political competence…

    Crispian (70c05e)

  51. Thank you, John for your answers. I want to repost the second part of my question again as I am interested in your answer.

    Are you now satisfied that you have found all their correspondence or is there possibly more that might be denied and lost that needs to be released by twitter?

    Comment by tier — 6/26/2011 @ 10:38 pm

    Hi Tier, sorry I didn’t mean to ignore that part of your question. I’m trying to answer these as fast as possible.
    Good question. After Patterico’s insight into this based on his experience with Ethel and him telling us what happened there, he suggested we ask Nikki again. And again she revealed more DM’s.
    So at this point we are worried that there could be more. We hope there aren’t any more but we are worried there could be more.

    John Reid (af3c93)

  52. When you say two other people had access to the screenshots, where they in the same town as you or some other area?

    Comment by Kaisersoze — 6/26/2011 @ 10:41 pm

    In other areas/towns.

    John Reid (af3c93)

  53. John -third request- would you call into Stranahan’s show and tell your side of the story? (347) 945-5235

    Paul (7d6791)

  54. Have you looked into contacting Twitter and asking them to release her accounts deleted material?

    tier (4a939c)

  55. John, is your daughter still allowed to use the computer without any supervision into what she’s accessing?

    Comment by Susie Q — 6/26/2011 @ 10:42 pm

    Good question, Susie. No, she is not allowed to use the computer and is not allowed to use twitter or facebook anymore. Especially where she has been keeping these messages from us. We thought we had things under control with the computer as parents. Now we realize there is so much we missed and feel like we failed her. Thanks for your question.

    John Reid (af3c93)

  56. John is there a reason you refuse to call in and even refuse to answer my question?

    Like so many other aspects of this story, your refusal to answer will be viewed by many as you wanted to hide your voice.

    Paul (7d6791)

  57. Comment by Crispian — 6/26/2011

    The thing that, I think, most people don’t get is that when a representative does something this foolish, it can become a means for blackmail. Given Weiner’s adament lying initially there should be no doubt that the man would have been susceptible to blackmail. That is a very dangerous position for a rep to put himself in. For that reason alone, anyone that thinks he was a good rep and should not have resigned does not see the danger he could have put this country in. It is totally reckless and unprincipled.

    Susie Q (653074)

  58. Have you spoken on the phone with Patterico? Are you willing to?

    tier (4a939c)

  59. Oh, I have a fairly trivial question: why the pseudonym John Reid? Was that derived from anything?

    Dustin (c16eca)

  60. “We think he is a great Congressman and should not have had to retire. Whatever he did or didn’t do had nothing to do with his work as a Congressman.”

    “There were more DM’s that Nikki did not want us to see.”

    Can you explain the discrepancy here (at least the one most reasonable parents would see)? You seem to have found the secreted DMs disturbing but say you think Weiner is fit to serve as a representative.

    If any congressman is sending inappropriate messages (perhaps not even explicitly lewd), a parent must have a screw lose to think that congressman is fit to serve. Obviously mental faculties and political acumen are not necessarily compromised if he is pursuing minors, but maintaining political support for that person does appear to exalt political concerns above that of integrity and parenting – even if the Congressman doesn’t strictly have to resign based upon notions of political competence…

    Comment by Crispian — 6/26/2011 @ 10:45 pm

    Hi Crispian, thank you for your question. We can agree to disagree here. Rep Weiner has not been charged or convicted with any crime. Whether or not we think this is inappropriate is different from a crime being committed. We don’t know that a crime was committed.
    We believe he was an effective public servant. Did he make mistakes? Yes. But there have been other members of Congress convicted of crimes that were never forced to resign. This is unfortunate.

    John Reid (af3c93)

  61. John is there a reason you refuse to call in and even refuse to answer my question?

    Like so many other aspects of this story, your refusal to answer will be viewed by many as you wanted to hide your voice.

    Comment by Paul — 6/26/2011 @ 10:55 pm
    Sorry Paul, not refusing to answer your question, I’m trying to refresh and the questions are coming in fast. I’m just trying to keep up. I apologize.

    John Reid (af3c93)

  62. Have you spoken on the phone with Patterico? Are you willing to?

    Comment by tier — 6/26/2011 @ 10:56 pm

    Have not spoken on the phone with him yet. We are working on setting up a video chat with the entire family.

    John Reid (af3c93)

  63. ok then, would you take the time to answer?

    Paul (7d6791)

  64. Have you looked into contacting Twitter and asking them to release her accounts deleted material?

    Comment by tier — 6/26/2011 @ 10:50 pm

    Have not looked into it but it is a great idea and I will start the process now that you mention it. I didn’t realize that was possible. Thank you.

    John Reid (af3c93)

  65. John, do you not understand that what Weiner was doing could have made him susceptible to blackmail, and considering the committees he was on where he was briefed on sensitive and classified information, he could have put this country in danger? That does not a good Congressman make.

    Susie Q (653074)

  66. ok then, would you take the time to answer?

    Comment by Paul — 6/26/2011 @ 11:02 pm

    Sure, Paul. What would you like to know?

    John Reid (af3c93)

  67. We are working on setting up a video chat with the entire family.

    Comment by John Reid

    That sounds great, John.

    Dustin (c16eca)

  68. >We are working on setting up a video chat with the entire family.

    I’ll FedEx you a laptop with a webcam and skype pre-installed.

    Paul (7d6791)

  69. Have not spoken on the phone with him yet. We are working on setting up a video chat with the entire family.

    Comment by John Reid — 6/26/2011 @ 11:01 pm

    Oh! Well stop chatting to us and figure it out, please. Not that some of us do not appreciate the answers but I know most of us will give your answers more credence if we know that you are a real family who just wants your privacy from the public.

    tier (4a939c)

  70. For the fourth time, John, I wanted to know why you just didn’t call into Stanahan and tell your side of the story.

    Paul (7d6791)

  71. Why should any of us trust you or believe what you’re saying? You (and your daughter) have repeatedly lied (sent false ids, etc) and insist on staying anonymous. Isn’t it reasonable for people to distrust someone who has done those things?

    Kristina (0ca6be)

  72. 30. John Reid

    If anyone didn’t read 30, above, read that. It’s new info from Reid.

    koam (7c1f46)

  73. Why do you think Gennette spends so much time on this website monitoring what is going on here?

    Comment by Kaisersoze — 6/26/2011 @ 10:32 pm

    I have theories. I think she fears truth coming out. I think she first says she’s not going to talk and then she’ll come out when Patterico or someone else confronts her with something. But then she’ll only give carefully worded answers and half-answers. She is not open to answering all questions as shown by the many people who have tried here to ask her about DM’s, the Seattle hash tag, the contradictions and changing her story a few times, never answered. But she will answer anything you need to know on teen behavior and teen slang. She’s an expert there.

    John Reid (af3c93)

  74. So am I supposed to google twitter.com/starchild111 to look for the latest webcache or google twitter.com/@starchild111?

    I see now why Jen Preston must have thought that tweets started in March instead of April!

    What do you think John? Which one should we use?

    ltw (370236)

  75. Paul, he’s already got a computer, obviously, and a webcam is only a few bucks, if he doesn’t already have one.

    This video chat would be an awesome way of handling this controversy. Of course, now that it’s on the table…

    Dustin (c16eca)

  76. A philosophical question Mr. Reid. What, if anything, has this experience taught you?

    Wondering (786412)

  77. For the fourth time, John, I wanted to know why you just didn’t call into Stanahan and tell your side of the story.

    Comment by Paul — 6/26/2011 @ 11:05 pm

    Paul, I promised Patterico I would give him that exclusive. It wouldn’t be fair to go back on that word. Thanks for the question.

    John Reid (af3c93)

  78. Have not looked into it but it is a great idea and I will start the process now that you mention it. I didn’t realize that was possible. Thank you.

    Comment by John Reid — 6/26/2011 @ 11:02 pm

    I don’t use twitter and don’t know. But myspace gives parents the ability. So I’d definitely look into it if I were you.

    tier (4a939c)

  79. John Reid – what did GennetteC do to cause your consternation with her? Does your spouse still stand behind her letter?

    Comment by JD — 6/26/2011 @ 9:27 pm

    Unfortunately my wife does not stand by her letter. It was actually Patterico’s story on Ethel that caused us to question our daughter’s claim of only 2 DM’s between her and Rep Weiner.
    After Patterico’s story uncovered the discrepancy of Ethel saying there were 2 DM’s when later on it turned out to be 5 or 6, my wife and I questioned this.
    Thanks to Patterico, we realized we were in the same situation as Ethel and her parents. There were more DM’s that Nikki did not want us to see. We gave Rep Weiner the benefit of the doubt at the time when my wife wrote her statement.
    Now we are disturbed about some of the content. Although we don’t want to jump to any conclusions. Since so many people have jumped to conclusions throughout this ordeal, it wouldn’t be fair.

    John Reid (af3c93)

  80. Comment by Susie Q — 6/26/2011
    &
    Comment by John Reid — 6/26/2011

    Good point, Susie Q.

    Congressmen who pursue minors shouldn’t be considered the uncle to stay away from but still invite them to all the family gatherings. Obviously all of us don’t know if/what Weiner might have said. Mr. Reid, you appear troubled by the DMs.

    I must say we do disagree, Mr. Reid. Whether law proscribes the behavior or not should not determine our personal feelings, morals, values, ethics, what-have-you. Criminality of an action does not make it objectively bad. And there are plenty of bad behaviors that are not criminalized (perhaps you’d have sympathy for references to legal greed resulting in economic troubles?).

    You don’t know if a crime was committed. Perhaps because a crime wasn’t committed, and perhaps because you do not adequately understand the law. I will let your argument stand for itself. But as for my disagreement, the current state of criminal statues will not determine whether I think someone is for office – especially with regard to behavior toward any child of mine.

    Crispian (70c05e)

  81. cassieiswatching johnreid9

    jackwinderberry (0f8248)

  82. A philosophical question Mr. Reid. What, if anything, has this experience taught you?

    Comment by Wondering — 6/26/2011 @ 11:08 pm

    Thanks for your question. Well, it’s taught us that in this world, it’s possible to overestimate how someone will behave and wind up sorely disappointed. And the reverse is true, it’s possible (but more rare) to underestimate how someone will behave and wind up pleasantly surprised. People can be cruel. But those rare times that people surprise you with their generoisty and kindness. Like many of the people here in these comments, I thank you for your kindness.

    John Reid (af3c93)

  83. john when is the webchat with the whole family scheduled for?

    Paul (7d6791)

  84. Dustin I’m just always willing to help. 😉

    Paul (7d6791)

  85. Congressmen who pursue minors shouldn’t be considered the uncle to stay away from but still invite them to all the family gatherings. Obviously all of us don’t know if/what Weiner might have said. Mr. Reid, you appear troubled by the DMs.

    I must say we do disagree, Mr. Reid. Whether law proscribes the behavior or not should not determine our personal feelings, morals, values, ethics, what-have-you. Criminality of an action does not make it objectively bad. And there are plenty of bad behaviors that are not criminalized (perhaps you’d have sympathy for references to legal greed resulting in economic troubles?).

    You don’t know if a crime was committed. Perhaps because a crime wasn’t committed, and perhaps because you do not adequately understand the law. I will let your argument stand for itself. But as for my disagreement, the current state of criminal statues will not determine whether I think someone is for office – especially with regard to behavior toward any child of mine.

    Comment by Crispian — 6/26/2011 @ 11:11 pm

    I respect your right to disagree. Thanks for taking the time to comment and ask questions and thanks for being civil about it, Crispian.

    John Reid (af3c93)

  86. john when is the webchat with the whole family scheduled for?

    Comment by Paul — 6/26/2011 @ 11:13 pm

    We are working these details out and will not be commenting on it in public until it has taken place with Patterico. That’s all we will be saying on that matter until it’s over. Thanks, Paul.

    John Reid (af3c93)

  87. Have not looked into it but it is a great idea and I will start the process now that you mention it. I didn’t realize that was possible. Thank you.

    Comment by John Reid — 6/26/2011 @ 11:02 pm

    I don’t use twitter and don’t know. But myspace gives parents the ability. So I’d definitely look into it if I were you.

    Comment by tier — 6/26/2011 @ 11:09 pm

    Thank you, Tier. That’s great information to have. Will be looking into it.

    John Reid (af3c93)

  88. John

    Thanks for answering my question but I do have another one. In regards to comment #30 above, why are you not jumping to conclusions? You’re the person with all the information. That sentence comes across as if you’re like us just trying to figure out what happened but have little to no access to the people involved. Which clearly isn’t the case, why is that?

    We can’t just confront Nikki because she doesn’t live in our house under our roof. She does live in your house. You say they look disturbing but you don’t want to jump to conclusions? Have you not been paying attention to what Weiner has been sending out to other people? I know he’s your hero and for what ever reason you stand by him no matter what he’s doing but these two differing sentiments are at odds with each other.

    I would think most parents jump to the you better not be sending this kind of crap to my daughter conclusion.

    Thanks again.

    Johnny 5 is alive (5ccc5e)

  89. #

    A philosophical question Mr. Reid. What, if anything, has this experience taught you?

    Comment by Wondering — 6/26/2011 @ 11:08 pm

    Thanks for your question. Well, it’s taught us that in this world, it’s possible to overestimate how someone will behave and wind up sorely disappointed. And the reverse is true, it’s possible (but more rare) to underestimate how someone will behave and wind up pleasantly surprised. People can be cruel. But those rare times that people surprise you with their generoisty and kindness. Like many of the people here in these comments, I thank you for your kindness.

    Comment by John Reid — 6/26/2011 @ 11:12 pm
    _________________________________________

    Thank you sir. While I am not certain how I would react if a much older married man contacted my daughter in his official capacity, I am fairly certain I wouldn’t be happy about it. Isn’t some part of you angry that he took advantage of his political position?

    Wondering (786412)

  90. John, do you not understand that what Weiner was doing could have made him susceptible to blackmail, and considering the committees he was on where he was briefed on sensitive and classified information, he could have put this country in danger? That does not a good Congressman make.

    Comment by Susie Q — 6/26/2011 @ 11:02 pm

    Hi Susie and I’ll also include Crispian, these are all good points. Let me say this, we are constantly re-evaluating our positions. We are open minded. You have to understand that it is because of Patterico that we now have many of these DM’s so we are still a bit in shock. We are trying to react as best we can. Right now this is how we feel but you both raise good points. We are not saying we will forever have this position. Just think of times in your life when you’ve re-evaluated based on new information. That’s where we are right now. Thanks for your comments and questions.

    John Reid (af3c93)

  91. Thank you, Mr. Reid.

    After the curtain is raised, I hope there is a curtain call with all the various actors taking their bows. Certainly we’re into the third act by now.

    Crispian (70c05e)

  92. Mr. Reid, I hope that you do decide to do the video chat with Patrick. He did stories on my situation in the past and I found him to be very thorough and even handed. He has great integrity.

    Anita Busch (a025dd)

  93. Thank you sir. While I am not certain how I would react if a much older married man contacted my daughter in his official capacity, I am fairly certain I wouldn’t be happy about it. Isn’t some part of you angry that he took advantage of his political position?

    Comment by Wondering — 6/26/2011 @ 11:19 pm

    Hi again, Wondering. Thanks for your questions/comments. Again, more good points. See #93 for more insight into state of mind. We are re-evaluating our thoughts on this. It’s hard to have all of this come at you in such a short span of time. It turns everything you thought was true on its head. So yes, you do raise valid points. It isn’t appropriate for an older man married or single to contact and chat with an underage girl, we agree on that. We have personal feelings on this that are frustration, anger, shock, fear, sadness, and hope that it isn’t as bad as it could be. So there are many mixed emotions here.

    John Reid (af3c93)

  94. And, I would like to add, that in reading this thread, you are answering all the questions with forethought and grace.

    Anita Busch (a025dd)

  95. Mr. Reid, thank you for answering our questions, and I look forward to everything coming to light. Your planned video chat with Patterico will put much to rest.

    Again, thank you.

    Susie Q (653074)

  96. Thank you, Mr. Reid.

    After the curtain is raised, I hope there is a curtain call with all the various actors taking their bows. Certainly we’re into the third act by now.

    Comment by Crispian — 6/26/2011 @ 11:23 pm

    Hi Crispy, I don’t know what you mean by that. But if it’s meant to be rude/uncivil, please know that I came here to answer questions in a civil way. I think so far I’ve been fair. No need for this.

    John Reid (af3c93)

  97. When the Dregs of Humanity band was found out to be fake in 1984(?) the band was reported to have driven off a cliff in a tragic accident, and no (fake) band members survived. this solution might also work here.

    milowent (0f8248)

  98. And, I would like to add, that in reading this thread, you are answering all the questions with forethought and grace.

    Comment by Anita Busch — 6/26/2011 @ 11:26 pm

    Hi Anita, thank you for your kind words. We are trying. There are many for whatever reasons who are ready to attack right out of the gate.

    John Reid (af3c93)

  99. John, thanks for stoping by to answer questions.

    Could you address why you did not go public after Rep. Weiner admitted his behavior? Mike Stack, and a couple of the other Rep. Weiner victims and even including Gennette Cordov more public attention due to your families behavor.

    You could have provided a single interview to a media outlet of your choice and reduced the media crazy chase for you and your family.

    Joe

    Joe Smith (54c0c1)

  100. Thank you sir. While I am not certain how I would react if a much older married man contacted my daughter in his official capacity, I am fairly certain I wouldn’t be happy about it. Isn’t some part of you angry that he took advantage of his political position?

    Comment by Wondering — 6/26/2011 @ 11:19 pm

    Hi again, Wondering. Thanks for your questions/comments. Again, more good points. See #93 for more insight into state of mind. We are re-evaluating our thoughts on this. It’s hard to have all of this come at you in such a short span of time. It turns everything you thought was true on its head. So yes, you do raise valid points. It isn’t appropriate for an older man married or single to contact and chat with an underage girl, we agree on that. We have personal feelings on this that are frustration, anger, shock, fear, sadness, and hope that it isn’t as bad as it could be. So there are many mixed emotions here.
    ___________________________________
    I understand. I have tried to put myself in your and your wife’s position and I came to the conclusion that if this has happened to my child, I would have contacted the authorities. I just feel that he abused his power. With all of that said, parenting is never the same each day and I am sure you are doing what you feel is best for your child. I commend you for continuing the dialogue with us. I know this can’t be easy. So, thank you for being so forthcoming. I wish you and your family all the best sir.

    Wondering (786412)

  101. I have been there myself. Just keep your wits (as you are doing), tell the truth and you will be fine. My mantra was, “maintain your integrity even when everyone else around you is failing miserably.”

    Anita Busch (a025dd)

  102. John

    Thanks for answering my question but I do have another one. In regards to comment #30 above, why are you not jumping to conclusions? You’re the person with all the information. That sentence comes across as if you’re like us just trying to figure out what happened but have little to no access to the people involved. Which clearly isn’t the case, why is that?

    We can’t just confront Nikki because she doesn’t live in our house under our roof. She does live in your house. You say they look disturbing but you don’t want to jump to conclusions? Have you not been paying attention to what Weiner has been sending out to other people? I know he’s your hero and for what ever reason you stand by him no matter what he’s doing but these two differing sentiments are at odds with each other.

    I would think most parents jump to the you better not be sending this kind of crap to my daughter conclusion.

    Thanks again.

    Comment by Johnny 5 is alive — 6/26/2011 @ 11:17 pm
    Hi Johnny, well please see comments addressing this #93 and #96. We are re-evaluating our thoughts as I mentioned. We are not the type of people that immediately believe the worst in others. Of course it is not appropriate for a grown man to chat with an underage girl. But we don’t want to take this to the level of accusing a person of anything criminal because there is no proof of that (and we hope there isn’t proof of that coming, God we really hope there isn’t). But, yes the chatting alone is wrong and we do not approve.

    John Reid (af3c93)

  103. I have been there myself. Just keep your wits (as you are doing), tell the truth and you will be fine. My mantra was, “maintain your integrity even when everyone else around you is failing miserably.”

    Comment by Anita Busch — 6/26/2011 @ 11:34 pm

    That’s a very nice mantra, Anita. Thank you.

    John Reid (af3c93)

  104. I understand. I have tried to put myself in your and your wife’s position and I came to the conclusion that if this has happened to my child, I would have contacted the authorities. I just feel that he abused his power. With all of that said, parenting is never the same each day and I am sure you are doing what you feel is best for your child. I commend you for continuing the dialogue with us. I know this can’t be easy. So, thank you for being so forthcoming. I wish you and your family all the best sir.

    Comment by Wondering — 6/26/2011 @ 11:33 pm

    Thank you for your kind words, Wondering.

    John Reid (af3c93)

  105. Repeating my earlier question.

    Why should any of us trust you or believe what you’re saying? You (and your daughter) have repeatedly lied (sent false ids, etc) and insist on staying anonymous. Isn’t it reasonable for people to distrust someone who has done those things?

    You said “There are many for whatever reasons who are ready to attack right out of the gate.” Maybe because you lie repeatedly about numerous things?

    Kristina (0ca6be)

  106. John, do you have any particular question(s) you want to ask Gennette? Or anything you want to say to her after reading her comments the last few days?

    tier (4a939c)

  107. Mr. Reid,

    Not at all. I am referring to the whole affair. The threats against Patterico and Ace, the apparent complaint against Stranahan. Any DMs to minors. Patriot76. All the motivations of all the characters involved. While obviously all very serious, it is also confusing from this vantage point. No need to take offense, I didn’t mean the statement to directly address anything you’ve said.

    But one more thing, and perhaps you answered it already, why take time to answer questions on a site that is less than sympathetic to Weiner and your political persuasions? What do you hope to impress upon the public about this affair?

    Crispian (70c05e)

  108. Why did you your family initially tell Tommy that Breitbart and Loesch behind getting Bornfree to Manufacture evidence? Do you have evidence or did Nikki/girls lie about that? Or did Tommy misreport this?

    When did Nikki start/create(date/month year fine)her Twitter accnt?

    az5thdstrct (e76e6a)

  109. If I sent an email to the address that Nikki used to contact me will she get it?

    Gennettec (0c9fb8)

  110. John, thanks for stoping by to answer questions.

    Could you address why you did not go public after Rep. Weiner admitted his behavior? Mike Stack, and a couple of the other Rep. Weiner victims and even including Gennette Cordov more public attention due to your families behavor.

    You could have provided a single interview to a media outlet of your choice and reduced the media crazy chase for you and your family.

    Joe

    Joe, thanks for your question/comments. I have to agree to disagree here. Whether or not we came out, Gennette was an actual recipient of the lewd picture so she was in this story regardless. That’s not going to change if the Reid family comes in. Everyone wanted to interview Gennette and everyone STILL does. So I’m sorry, I think you are misguided there. As for Mike Stack I don’t think our family had bearing on his involvement. The bornfreecrew was involved independent of us. So again, our involvement would not have changed interest in his story or the stories of the bornfreecrew. I think you are giving us way too much credit/blame.
    But I would like to take this opportunity to send a message to the bornfreecrew, my wife and I are now re-evaluating their role in this. We think it was not harassment by patriot or goatsred or any of the others in the bornfreecrew. Again, if you are going to jump in and say it is our fault they got that label, please save it. Look to Gennette, Ginger who also said the same about the bornfreecrew. We weren’t the only ones that said they harassed.
    But I think we are the only ones who have come out and said we are re-evaluating their role in this and would like to apologize to them for saying they harassed Nikki. We didn’t have all the information and that is what it appeared to be to us.
    Ironically the same thing that is being done to us-the judgements by others without them having all the information-is what we also did to the bornfreecrew. And we are sorry. Have others apologized to them yet? I don’t think so. But they should.

    John Reid (af3c93)

  111. I have talked to Mr. Reid many, many times about doing even a short phone call. That has not happened. He has talked about doing a video chat but it has not happened. He says it will happen tomorrow. I hope it does.

    Patterico (135ea8)

  112. It occurs to me that you reacted with a tremendous amount of anger toward Gennette and the NYT’s Jen Preston. You even said that Gennette didn’t merely stab Nikki (your daughter) in the back – she stabbed her in the front.

    In fact, you exhibited much, much more anger, passion, even rage, than anything you’ve shown towards Anthony Weiner. If any 46-yr old man did anything like Weiner did with my daughter, I’d be absolutely furious. I would NEVER express support for such a freak. That man is a sick, disgusting predator, and your excusing his behavior isn’t something a loving parent would do.

    Obviously what Anthony Weiner did was tremendously worse than anything Gennette & Jen Preston may have done.

    Can you explain what appear to be your inappropriate levels of emotion?

    Miranda (4104db)

  113. I have expressed to Mr. Reid many times how helpful it would be for him to simply call me, for 3 minutes. And even more helpful for the family to video chat.

    So, we’ll see.

    Patterico (135ea8)

  114. If I sent an email to the address that Nikki used to contact me will she get it?

    Comment by Gennettec — 6/26/2011 @ 11:45 pm

    If this is really Gennette, chances are yes she will get it.

    John Reid (af3c93)

  115. Mr Reid,

    Do you, or have you ever, lived in Boston? How about Oregon (maybe as a kid)?

    Kristina (0ca6be)

  116. John thanks for answering my questions.

    Is it fair to say that your opinion of AW is literally changing as you answer these questions?

    I can appreciate you trying to be fair minded and giving someone the benefit of the doubt but you seem to think that he shouldn’t have resigned. What do you think is rises to the level of resign worthy when it comes to being a representative of the people?

    Did you ground Nikki for being dishonest?

    Thanks again.

    Johnny 5 is alive (5ccc5e)

  117. It occurs to me that you reacted with a tremendous amount of anger toward Gennette and the NYT’s Jen Preston. You even said that Gennette didn’t merely stab Nikki (your daughter) in the back – she stabbed her in the front.

    In fact, you exhibited much, much more anger, passion, even rage, than anything you’ve shown towards Anthony Weiner. If any 46-yr old man did anything like Weiner did with my daughter, I’d be absolutely furious. I would NEVER express support for such a freak. That man is a sick, disgusting predator, and your excusing his behavior isn’t something a loving parent would do.

    Obviously what Anthony Weiner did was tremendously worse than anything Gennette & Jen Preston may have done.

    Can you explain what appear to be your inappropriate levels of emotion?

    Comment by Miranda — 6/26/2011 @ 11:46 pm

    Miranda, again please see #93, #96. Let’s not get this all out of context now. As I have stated here multiple times, we did not find out about many of these DM’s until the aftermath. And the twitter anger was in response to two things, the NYT false story and Gennette stabbing us in the back. To address Weiner, he would need to be there. Was he there? No. Jen Preston and Gennette were there. You get me Weiner and we will address him. Let’s not be silly now.

    John Reid (af3c93)

  118. Mr. Reid, you would be wise at this point to talk to Patrick and/or do the video chat. I hope you decide to do it … if you are being honest, there is just no downside.

    Anita Busch (a025dd)

  119. Mr Reid,

    Do you, or have you ever, lived in Boston? How about Oregon (maybe as a kid)?

    Comment by Kristina — 6/26/2011 @ 11:50 pm

    Never to both of those. Cheers.

    John Reid (af3c93)

  120. crickets …. the jig is up …..

    Miranda (4104db)

  121. Someone left a comment as “Patterico.” That was NOT me and I am not happy. Whoever did that is obviously subject to being banned.

    Patterico (135ea8)

  122. Patrick, if Mr. Reid will not get on the phone with you or video chat with you, something is seriously amiss.

    Anita Busch (a025dd)

  123. John, why can’t you pick up the phone right now and call Patrick?

    Paul (7d6791)

  124. Okay, it’ll be within the hour.

    Gennettec (0c9fb8)

  125. Mr. Reid, just do an on video camera or over the telephone interview. Can’t you see by the comments you are getting how things are spiraling out of control? If you are being honest, there is just no downside.

    Anita Busch (a025dd)

  126. Mr. Reid

    How were you aware if Gennette “stabbed Nikki in the back” if it wasn’t until Patterico convinced you to check again for more DM’s?

    What was timing of Patterico’s suggestion to double check and the NYT story?

    az5thdstrct (e76e6a)

  127. ohn thanks for answering my questions.

    Is it fair to say that your opinion of AW is literally changing as you answer these questions?

    I can appreciate you trying to be fair minded and giving someone the benefit of the doubt but you seem to think that he shouldn’t have resigned. What do you think is rises to the level of resign worthy when it comes to being a representative of the people?

    Did you ground Nikki for being dishonest?

    Thanks again.

    Comment by Johnny 5 is alive — 6/26/2011

    Hi Johnny, thanks again for questions. Well, yes it is fair to say there are a lot of mixed emotions here. As for resigning, that is a heavy concept. I understand for some this is cut and dry. We have mixed emotions. The facts are still coming in for us. I think if we looked into the bedrooms of every Congressman and Senator and Judge and President we’d probably be disgusted by the majority of what we find. Would that leave us 2 or 3 out of all of those currently serving? I doubt it would even be that many left if that were the standard. We are fooling ourselves if we think they are all nuns and monks. They’re not. These are just the ones that got caught. So that is why I and my wife are torn on this one. Shouldn’t there be one standard for all? Should it just be the poor suckers that get caught that get thrown out? It’s not really fair. He did his job from our perspective and committed no crime. So that’s our belief. This has been a debate for as long as there were politicians and it will continue to be a debate. You and I aren’t going to resolve it here tonight. But it’s a healthy debate and I welcome it. Thanks for your civility.

    John Reid (af3c93)

  128. Gennette, why don’t you ask your questions of John Reid right here?

    Why bother sending an email within the hour, as you just stated?

    Just ask John Reid whatever you want. He’s certainly been civil & polite here.

    Miranda (4104db)

  129. @ Gennette what’s this with in an hour send it now let’s find out for sure. Just send a code word to the same email address and send one to Patterico as well he can confirm the messages authenticity.

    Is Mr. Reid still here or was the Cheers a good bye from the thread? If you are still here I’d rather you answered my question in # 119 not the are you still here question 😉 Thanks.

    Johnny 5 is alive (5ccc5e)

  130. Mr. Reid

    How were you aware if Gennette “stabbed Nikki in the back” if it wasn’t until Patterico convinced you to check again for more DM’s?

    What was timing of Patterico’s suggestion to double check and the NYT story?

    Comment by az5thdstrct — 6/27/2011 @ 12:11 am

    We were aware she stabbed us in the back FROM the NYT story. I think that’s pretty obvious. Gennette has nothing to do with the DM’s that Patterico’s work with Ethel helped us find. You are confusing two separate issues.

    John Reid (af3c93)

  131. did you your family initially tell Tommy that Breitbart and Loesch behind getting Bornfree to Manufacture evidence? Do you have evidence or did Nikki lie about that? Or did Tommy misreport this?

    When did Nikki start/create(date/month year fine)her Twitter accnt?

    az5thdstrct (e76e6a)

  132. This is the 10 minute warning folks. I’d love to stay but bed calls. Get your questions in now and I’ll answer those I can within 10 minutes. For the rest, it will have to be tomorrow. I think that’s more than fair. Considering there have been many others in this mess of a situation that have not subjected themselves to answering more than a few questions at their own whim. Thank you.

    John Reid (af3c93)

  133. Anything I send will be to Nikki only. They can choose to make it public if they want.
    Hopping off the blog now. Night.

    Gennettec (0c9fb8)

  134. Night, Mr. Reid (and everyone else). I think we’ve all been fair to you and hope you are able to speak to Patterico by voice in the near future, to continue the fair and civil dialogue.

    Crispian (70c05e)

  135. did you your family initially tell Tommy that Breitbart and Loesch behind getting Bornfree to Manufacture evidence? Do you have evidence or did Nikki lie about that? Or did Tommy misreport this?

    When did Nikki start/create(date/month year fine)her Twitter accnt?

    Comment by az5thdstrct — 6/27/2011 @ 12:16 am

    No. This has been mis-reported and is another lie. Marianela told Nikki this lie about Breitbart and Dana. Nikki trusted her friend was telling the truth. When Tommy showed Nikki the DM’s between Marianela and Mike Stack Nikki was surprised and her emails to Tommy will reveal that. I will release those to Patterico. Nikki immediately told Tommy that she NEVER authorized Marianlea to speak for her and also sent a warning to Gennette not to talk to Marianela. Nikki never pushed any story about Breitbart or Dana. This was Marianela that was unauthorized to speak to Mike saying she was speaking for Nikki. I hope this false/misreport will stop being perpetuated. It only serves to stoke misconceptions. If you are in the business of misconceptions, then more power to you. I’m not. We’re not.

    John Reid (af3c93)

  136. John, Gennette just said she would email your 16-yr old daughter directly.

    I thought you supervise her computer use now very strictly. Do you read all your daughter’s emails? Aren’t you going to read Gennette’s email to Nikki? If not, why not? Especially after you’ve accused Gennette of backstabbing your own daughter, and stabbing in the front too.

    Miranda (4104db)

  137. Thanks for answering that John and you’re welcome.

    I think we should have some level of decorum. It’s the lack of standards that leads to bad representatives. What do they have to fear anymore? I agree that there are many others in congress that probably shouldn’t be there as well. Personally I hope they get caught and they get booted and shamed out of congress. That goes for any side of the aisle.

    Again thanks for taking the time to answer my questions. I really hope you follow through on the video chat it will add a whole new element to this saga.

    Johnny 5 is alive (5ccc5e)

  138. It is super-damn silly that Gennette would ask if Nikki gets emails via Patterico’s discussion thread.

    Why wouldn’t she just email Nikki and ask her to confirm she got the message? She’s establishing that she got in touch, for some future purpose.

    Or she’s silly.

    Dustin (c16eca)

  139. And let me further clarify. Tommy did not report that Nikki told him this and that’s that. Anyone who talks to Tommy or reads his work will see Tommy makes the distinction that Marianela was troubled and lied to Mike about this without authorization from us or Nikki. So please do not twist Tommy’s words. He made a clear distinction. You are choosing not to report that/see that. That’s your choice. It’s wrong and I have to believe a purposeful choice with malicious motives.

    John Reid (af3c93)

  140. John, Gennette just said she would email your 16-yr old daughter directly.

    I thought you supervise her computer use now very strictly. Do you read all your daughter’s emails? Aren’t you going to read Gennette’s email to Nikki? If not, why not? Especially after you’ve accused Gennette of backstabbing your own daughter, and stabbing in the front too.

    Miranda

    Nikki is banned from the computer. We will read the email for her and see if it is a message we want delivered to her. It is odd that Gennette cannot say what she has to say in public. But then everything about her has been odd.

    John Reid (af3c93)

  141. Thanks to those who came here tonight with civility for your questions and comments. For those that did not, you did not detract from this so you failed.
    Thank you to Patterico for calling out the person that posted under his name falsely. Good luck to that person because I hear you’re going to be banned.
    Will answer more questions when I have more time. And yes, I will send Gennette’s newest email to Patterico if it’s something he wants to see.

    John Reid (af3c93)

  142. Mr. Reid.

    I hope I’m not twisting words. I was referring to this article perhaps you have not read from Mediaite/Colby Hall. Regarding follow up to Tommy’s initial post. I interpreted from Colby’s post that ‘seem’ to indicate it was Nikki discussing Breitbart and Loesch to Tommy.

    “When Betty first approached Christopher (first via Twitter, then email), she said her primary concerns were the actions of the online group, led by @PatriotUSA76. She made the allegation that this group had approached her and Veronica on behalf of Andrew Breitbart and Dana Loesch to manufacture evidence against Rep. Weiner. When Christopher discovered a screenprint of Direct Messages between Veronica and Mike Stack, a member of that group, that showed Veronica actually offering such evidence, all three of these sources explained that Veronica had been lying to everyone in a misguided bid for attention.”

    http://www.mediaite.com/online/mediaites-sources-on-weinergate-betty-and-veronica-turn-out-not-to-be-who-they-claimed/2/

    az5thdstrct (e76e6a)

  143. Yeah, send it on.

    Patterico (135ea8)

  144. az5thdstrct,

    Isn’t that explained by Marianela lying to Nikki, as she later said she had?

    Patterico (135ea8)

  145. Patterico

    Think Tommy/Colby would be best position to answer for sure.

    I read it as Nikki initial contact with Tommy was her concern That AB/DL behind getting bornfree to manufacture. Mike Stack been clear on denying this.

    Then when DM’s from Marianela appeared ‘offering’ actual evidence (of not being manufactured), tommy confronted Reid’sthen claim to Tommy of Marianela’s lying.

    My question if of Nikki telling Tommy this initially. Tommy/Colby sure can clear up rather quickly

    az5thdstrct (e76e6a)

  146. Patterico

    One is allegation to manufacture evidence and another

    of actually having evidence (marianela to stack). The only thing I see on record from Tommy and tonight John Reid is marianela lying about having actual evidence. This is not my question. This as John Reid points out accurately in outlined in Tommy’s initial post.

    Initial allegation to tommy of AB/DL involvement is my question.

    az5thdstrct (e76e6a)

  147. Patriots back and he’s pissed…again.

    http://joe.wireupdate.com/post/6967114161

    Johnny 5 is alive (5ccc5e)

  148. Lingering questions:

    1. Incivility means questioning what? Parenting, values, and honesty (not authenticity, mind you) were questioned by several people in varying degrees. Mr. Reid took offense at a metaphorical statement I made, though he protested confusion before taking offense.

    2. What does Mr. Reid think the uncivil people were trying/failing at? Why so very defensive on only that count?

    3. Why such enjoyment in someone getting banned for offending, primarily, Patterico?

    4. Why the constant praising of civility and fairness, keeping Patterico on the edge of his seat?

    5. Related to previous points, the unnecessarily dramatic assertiveness of:
    “If you are in the business of misconceptions, then more power to you. I’m not. We’re not.
    “I think so far I’ve been fair. No need for this.

    6. And still possibly related to previous questions, why the unnecessary conflation of Nikki’s feelings and Mr. Reid’s?

    I believe a 16 year old isn’t “in the business of misconceptions” but she isn’t the one here answering questions nor do I think a 16 year old came to this story with an agenda. There was also the “Gennette stabbed Nikki in the back”; Gennette “stabbed us in the back” phrasing. If the twitterings were all by/between Nikki, how would anything Gennette have said on the matter have “stabbed” unknown parents in the back (it may have been offensive or hurtful, but how a betrayal?) It’s quite possible I missed that angle. But these are the honest, fair, and civil questions I have.

    Hopefully a conversation between Patterico and Mr. Reid will clear them up.

    Crispian (70c05e)

  149. #151

    “I hope this false/misreport will stop being perpetuated. It only serves to stoke misconceptions. If you are in the business of misconceptions, then more power to you. I’m not. We’re not.”

    Perhaps Add to your comments a context that it is written from a “family where daughter and mother” that submitted false ID’s. Including a state drivers license. A “friend” that submitted a false school ID, and now a father that uses a false name on Twitter.

    az5thdstrct (e76e6a)

  150. az5thdstrct,

    We’ve stayed after the lights were shut off and the microphone silenced, but we’ll see what tomorrow brings.

    Crispian (70c05e)

  151. I couldn’t help but notice that the change in attitude towards Weiner seemed to be literally evolving as the thread went on. I don’t know if that was a genuine realization in the moment or realizing that characters weren’t acting like they should. Kind of like strumming a guitar and not getting the chord right so you try again and it sounds a little better but it’s still not right so you try again and get closer and then you finally get it.

    I don’t know to many fathers that are so understanding of older men being that forward with their teenage daughters. I guess they’re out there but I just can’t shake the feeling that I’m not listening to a father defend his daughter. It feels like I’m listening to someone try and figure out how a father should sound defending his daughter from a potential predator.

    This is all just conjecture on my part I’ll happily change my mind when I see or hear proof that these people exist. I hope they do the video chat but I’m not holding my breath.

    Johnny 5 is alive (5ccc5e)

  152. I know a few liberal parents who don’t mind their older teenagers (16+) talking to men who are overly familiar as long as they (the men) are ‘nice’ about it.

    What is jarring to me though is that John Reid seems much more conservative in tone than liberal. Especially compared to Mrs. Reid. I wish he had answered my question at #2.

    tier (4a939c)

  153. No one is that consistently formal, patient, and on message besides trained politicians, public relations people and lawyers.

    Just saying.

    JR has also picked up the Weiner-gate lingo, posting skills (quotes, bolds, calling out # of previous comments) flawlessly.

    There are people who comment at this blog daily who don’t post multiple replies with out error.

    Just saying

    coondawg68 (5fad4e)

  154. I am not buying it. JR’s cryptic comments and continued evasion of an public airing of his side of events tells me we are not getting the whole story. We don’t even trust the names of the people involved, with false ID’s being employed almost instantly as the story broke to provide cover for those involved.

    This thing stinks to high heaven.

    CausticConservative (b29599)

  155. A lot of “re-evaluating” going on every step of the way. Every hour, or so it seems.

    goatsred (b20383)

  156. Based on his chat/rant with Joe Brooks, lots of new stuff pops into my mind. Will be willing to share this afternoon.

    goatsred (b20383)

  157. If one crazy person were supposedly playing so many characters, wouldn’t that person also play one or more of the frequent commenters & questioners here?

    Not that I believe that, but wouldn’t they almost assuredly do that?

    koam (7c1f46)

  158. Stark inconsistencies and story-juggling right in this very thread.

    I’d very much like to see this “character” in jail, at least for a few days, for the threats and false report, and take pleasure imagining this malicious thing in an orange vest, if not jumpsuit, picking up cigarette butts at a Massachusetts intersection.

    They are likely as, Stranahan hint, terribly proud of their work,which in hindsight to all and now to many will be declared Leonard Pith Garnell bad – and monumentally ill-advised.

    I don’t meant to discourage or judge anyone who takes pleasure in their conversation with the sock, but I can’t fake it anymore. I miss the fun. All the fun I have left is thinking of this person getting their just desserts.

    SarahW (af7312)

  159. You know what’s the worst/creepiest part of this part of the story? That John Reid, the entire Reid family, GNC, etc. all parrot the same mindless mantra re: Weiner… “He’s a good Congressman, I support his policies, this was a personak matter…”. It’s all garbage. Weiner was nothing special, except in his flamboyant dishonesty and willingness to stage emotional outbursts for the partisans in the cheap seats. He voted the straight Party line and never introduced any legislature of any import. Those who like him know full well that they’re the “attracted to shiny objects”-types and are just too embarrassed to admit it. So they claim admiration for things the man has never done or ever been. Zombies.

    Lincolntf (85daa5)

  160. Y’all have really taken the weiner fascination down all the rabbit holes. Congrats.

    stone (e9ef3a)

  161. Nobody forces you to be here, stone/imdw. In fact, you have been banned under multiple names.

    JD (306f5d)

  162. Yes, JD. So what is the pathology with continuing to post and puppet?

    Simon Jester (a9dd5a)

  163. Amen, lincolntf.

    MayBee (081489)

  164. It would be really nice if I could get some picture of what the heck is going on with this story without having to read through 100s of comments, or listen to Lee on the radio during the middle of the night.

    deanna157 (f211d6)

  165. Until all the the information is released, and everyone goes on the record, I don’t see how any accurate conclusions can be drawn except that they all seem pro-Wenis.

    ∅ (e7577d)

  166. So, GennetteC encourages Nikki to connect with Weiner via Twitter, thus exposing a minor child to what her very liberal parents consider disturbing, private communication from said congressperson.

    Hadn’t GennetteC been warned by others on Twitter that the congressperson was a perv before encouraging Nikki to connect with him?

    Do I have this right?

    Ms. Trish (d3022f)

  167. Sarah, Lincoln… part of the problem, imho, is the near-suspension of disbelief as we civilly question puppets. The higher purpose of ‘play the game by the rules’ conflicts with the impulse to ‘go tourette’s’ on them. Our false solicitude makes my head want to explode.

    jeffeneff (707f3d)

  168. Comment by ∅ — 6/27/2011 @ 8:30 am

    I have a contrary opinion, obviously. There is ample evidence that Reid is a sock and always has been, along with the other miserable cavalcade of socks.

    I can’t even undestand why this is a question for anyone anymore, it’s THAT clear from available information. I’ve never troubled to lay it all out, but I can rest easy that hindsight evaluators will do it all for me.

    SarahW (af7312)

  169. SarahW, so are you saying that Pat is being duped? I don’t believe ANYONE involved in this has been completely truthful, and why, if they all agree that Rep Wenis is basically a good guy with some quirks, not release all the DMs, instead of the cryptic bs.
    Judging from the amount of questions directed at JohnReid9, I don’t feel that I’m alone. Your powers of deductive reasoning are better than mine, and I have no problem admitting that.

    ∅ (e7577d)

  170. Comment by SarahW — 6/27/2011 @ 9:06 am

    Sarah, I too think there’s a lot of sock business going on.

    My #169 was just exploring the possibility that GC could have a serious legal problem if the Reid family is real. GC had been warned about Weiner before encouraging underage Nikki to connect with him. Hence GC’s need to change the narrative from “I received warnings” to “I was being harassed.”

    Oh well, at this point I say, “A pox on all socks!”

    Ms. Trish (d3022f)

  171. 162. Lincolntf

    While I never was a Weiner supporter and was shocked at the way he was arrogantly denying this in week 1, I differ with you on my opinions of his fans.

    Yes they were followers. He has considerable communication skills and a self-confidence that is unusual. People say Obama speaks well. Obama has been known to deliver a speech well in front of an adoring crowd. Very well. But RAW is way ahead of O in the verbal skills & “raw” passion dept. (Even if you disagree with his policy and arrogance, he has a gift for it.)

    What’s more, RAW directly played to his followers’ contempt for their political opponents in a way that many pols just don’t do…and almost none do “as well” as he does. (It’s Keith Olbermann (or the anti-Mark Levin) with a congressional seat.) Even in his 2 pressers, he had a way of carrying himself in his darkest hours that is worthy of note. (and I understand that it can be called psychotic, or whatever)..but what I’m saying is that I can understand why his followers had passion for him that didn’t fade quickly.

    I directly questioned John Reid about his family’s continued support for Weiner even after what we all now know about RAW in general (the predation, and the arrogance of defense – how he could not see that accusing others wrongly for his own crimes and being indignant with every member of the press would permanently compromise his credibility, and what we all now know about how RAW interacted with Nikki (The Congressman’s to 16-year-old Nikki DM “I love f***ing with them” came out days ago…from JR9 himself). And JR9 stuck with Weiner for a few more days.

    That is to say, Weiner could have perhaps survived the sex stuff (if it didn’t go as far as it did with Ethel, etc.), but he could not survive his reaction to it. Coverup trumps crime (possibly…we don’t know all yet).)

    And at first John Reid said that his family continues in their position of support for Rep Weiner. But, as of last night, he said that he and his wife have moved on that point, given that they learned there was more interaction between RAW and Nikki that Nikki hadn’t revealed to them at first.) Pretend, for a moment, that this is true…it’s understandable as it takes time for people to accept that their beliefs have been shattered.

    koam (7c1f46)

  172. 169. Trish

    No, GC has clearly stated that she always knew that NR was a fake identity. GC thought NR was working with #bornfreecrew in order to try to entrap RAW. GC says the friendship with NR was fake all along.

    GC admitted that she brought up AW with NR after NR would only talk teen girltalk with her for weeks. (GC got tired of waiting for NR to bring up the topic of AW).

    GC says she warned AW that NR was fake when NR started that prom campaign.

    koam (7c1f46)

  173. We do have to suspend disbelief, which sucks, but the exercise isn’t totally useless (pretty close, though). Even if we’re conversing with a sock (JG from MA) half the time, there are still real people out there adding dribs and drabs of information for us to bounce around.
    Maybe all moot if this JG from MA gets “busted” by a journalist or ‘fesses up to whichever LE agency ultimately gets involved. Oh, and I do see that she went in person to a Boston police station, so that weighs against her being from my neck of the woods. I was hoping that by some amazing coincidence she was a moonbat that I personally knew or knew of. I’ve run into some real doozies, but I don’t think any of them are this nuts.

    Lincolntf (85daa5)

  174. Regarding JG from MA and the cops.

    I just don’t get why a supposed criminal goes to the cops.

    Either 1) it’s a total breakdown (she is a criminal, there was no threat, and wants to be caught), 2) she’s crazier than anyone thinks (she is criminal, there was no threat, & has true multiple personalities, one of which believes she is being persecuted, perhaps the reason for all this?), or 3) she’s NOT a criminal (and a sick “follower” of this story DID deliver a threat to her). That third one would be very sad indeed. If she were telling the truth in her call to Lee and she were telling the truth in her report to the cops. Just horrible.

    But, if 4) she’s the criminal AND she received a sick threat from some really bad follower (someone who comments here?), why does she call the cops and risk exposure. This must have been some kind of threat.

    (I will trust Patrick’s preliminary assessment that the cop report thing legitimately happened.)

    koam (7c1f46)

  175. To Comment by ∅ — 6/27/2011 @ 9:20 am

    If Patrick thought JR9 was “real”, of course I think he’s being duped. And yet, I do not think Patrick is being duped.

    SarahW (af7312)

  176. Trish, Gennette has no such worry. She is in the clear on that point.

    SarahW (af7312)

  177. Lincolntf – Agreed there is utility in it – if only to reveal the nature of the sock.

    – Then there is the strict entertainment value of messing with a sock, and eventually even those who don’t think they have enough to spot a sock will be much better at it in the future, once all is resolved to their satisfaction.

    I am cool with Patrick “wasting my time”, because he is not – less so the sock. Hope she’s in handcuffs soon and suffers a little for the worst of her hijinks – the threats and false reports.

    SarahW (af7312)

  178. If Patrick thought JR9 was “real”, of course I think he’s being duped. And yet, I do not think Patrick is being duped.

    Why do you think Patrick is encouraging JR9 to answer questions on this blog if he thinks JR9 is a fake?

    ∅ (e7577d)

  179. Koam:

    GC has clearly stated that she always knew that NR was a fake identity. GC thought NR was working with #bornfreecrew in order to try to entrap RAW. GC says the friendship with NR was fake all along.

    GC admitted that she brought up AW with NR after NR would only talk teen girltalk with her for weeks. (GC got tired of waiting for NR to bring up the topic of AW).

    GC says she warned AW that NR was fake when NR started that prom campaign

    Comment by koam — 6/27/2011 @ 9:29 am

    Interesting point, which makes me wonder: If Gennette has always known Nikki Reid was fake, why would she ask John Reid if Nikki will get her email if she emails her now?

    This suggests Gennette now thinks Nikki is real. And even if she initially thought Nikki was fake, maybe she realized Nikki was real after contacting and investigating her.

    Or maybe she never thought Nikki was fake. After all, Gennette’s youthful appearance (in her online photos) and familiarity with teen slang/culture may have been what made Weiner interested in her, and perhaps she knew that. Maybe she saw Nikki and Marianela as competition for Weiner’s interest.

    DRJ (fdd243)

  180. why does she call the cops and risk exposure. This must have been some kind of threat.

    Because there was a threat – several in fact. My understanding is that Ace, at minimum, had contacted police. The heat is on.

    Making the threat (in her weak mind) is a counteroffensive designed at least in part to shield her from the terror of what is coming next for herself. She thinks the best cloak is to be victim herself.

    Now, she is liar, a proven liar. It’s still possible for a wolf crier to see a wolf, though.

    It is remotely possible that someone discovered her (though very unlikely) and took control of this wannabe-screenwriter’s old Twitter, and who is now wreaking havoc over the sockpuppet land as Nikki. I suppose she could have an even crazier brother or associate. She could also be in league with someone else willing to issue threats to anyone if it should help the story.( An anonymous-style griefer).

    What is NOT possible is that Lee issued any threats, and the simplest solution is that she is trying to cloak her own misdeeds.

    SarahW (af7312)

  181. Comment by ∅ — 6/27/2011 @ 9:54 am

    I am not going to put any words in Patrick’s mouth. But I think you can figure that one out without help from me.

    SarahW (af7312)

  182. koam and Sarah, thanks for the replies. Think I’ll just sit back and see how it all plays out.

    Ms. Trish (d3022f)

  183. John Reid,

    If you are still reading, please consider the advice from Anita Busch (earlier in this comment thread) that you can trust Patterico.

    Here are the opening paragraphs in a New York Times article on what Ms. Busch faced:

    LOS ANGELES — The long series of events leading to the trial of the Hollywood private investigator Anthony Pellicano on charges of racketeering and wiretapping began on June 20, 2002, when a journalist, Anita M. Busch, found a note saying “Stop” taped to her car, a fish and a rose in a tin tray on the hood, a bulletlike hole piercing the windshield.

    Nearly six years later, Ms. Busch will finally take the witness stand to tell her side.

    Once a star reporter for Variety, later editor of The Hollywood Reporter and a freelancer for The New York Times, Ms. Busch, 46, had kept silent as an investigation into accusations that Mr. Pellicano wiretapped stars, moguls and castoff spouses transfixed Hollywood. But in her first interview before giving her coming testimony, she recounted her gradual transformation from byline to headline and how it derailed her career.

    More here.

    Most of the media ignored Ms. Busch’s claims but Patterico gave her a fair hearing. (Examples here, here and here.) I suspect that’s part of why she still reads and comments here.

    DRJ (fdd243)

  184. 183 DRJ

    I just took GC’s request of JR9 as temporarily accepting the “rules of engagement” for discussion in this context. Though mind-twisting, as everything else is. She’s hoping for a NR reply to her email. It’s correct to question why she didn’t just send the email without raising this issue.

    See my next post on this in a broader sense. (coming soon, below)

    koam (7c1f46)

  185. ==This suggests Gennette now thinks Nikki is real. And even if she initially thought Nikki was fake..==

    Best to keep in mind that even as a “fake” persona, as a character, Nikki and others always did have a real live person behind them creating the character, setting up accounts, making up the lines, manipulating, tweeting and emailing.

    Gennette’s request to contact Nikki last night and asking if it was still the same address as before struck me as more of a threat or warning or last ditch effort at damage control by Gennette.

    elissa (5e485d)

  186. 183. SarahW

    Most of us, of course, never believed Lee would have issued threats.

    He updated, however, to clarify that the follow-up interview by Detective determined that the report misstated the source of the threat as Lee. JG (MA) clarified that it was (or that she believed it was) a follower of Lee’s, not Lee.

    koam (7c1f46)

  187. I’d respectfully disagree that GC thinks the Reids are now real.

    I think Gennette is just trying to test out whether or not the John Reid commenting here, is actually John Reid father of Nikki Reid. In one of the other threads GC started saying that many of the DM’s John released were fake.

    So much sock puppetry so little time.

    Johnny 5 is alive (5ccc5e)

  188. That’s a good theory, J5.

    Dustin (c16eca)

  189. G (MA) clarified that it was (or that she believed it was) a follower of Lee’s, not Lee.

    She’s an awful liar who tends to walk it back right away when cornered.

    Did she really get misreported? Or did she go too far and realize it, and helpfully “clarify” the next day?

    SarahW (af7312)

  190. She’s an awful liar who tends to walk it back right away when cornered.

    Yeah. That’s the only way I can interpret it. She was trying to screw Lee, and backed down as soon as she was cornered. In my mind, this is probably the same person who backed down when Ace called her on her threats.

    Even if by some miracle it is not, it’s the same nasty and blame avoiding attitude. But mostly nasty. That detective didn’t call Lee on accident. And it’s just not possible to be that confused about who threatened you.

    I think Lee has successfully gotten under the skin of a very bad person.

    Dustin (c16eca)

  191. I mean, she must have figured out a false report, that Lee could prove false, would get her convicted of a class 1 misdemeanor.

    A lot on the line unless she could wriggle out of it.

    SarahW (af7312)

  192. NOt saying that’s what happened but I certainly suspect it.

    SarahW (af7312)

  193. Also, none of “Lee’s followers” would have had the least idea how to reach her.

    SarahW (af7312)

  194. 190, Actually, Gennette might have been trying to suss out a griefer interloper, but I don’t think she believes there is any “real” john Reid at all.

    SarahW (af7312)

  195. Surely if a detective talked to her about this, there was plenty of time to specify ‘and you’re sure it was Lee’? Somehow. I have a hard time just letting that kind of attack go. If she contradicted what she told the detective, she should face justice.

    Dustin (c16eca)

  196. Johnreid, here are some early Starchild111 tweets to Gennette:

    05/05/11: Starchild111 tweets Weiner follower Gennette Cordova at least three times. At 2:13 pm, she tweets, “I’ve always wanted to read that one. Any good tips?” At 2:44 pm, she tweets, “If you want we can DM each other and trade techniques! LOL I have a bunch. I’m sure you do too.” At 7:07 pm, she tweets, “@GennetteNicole is the coolest ever!” (Source: Google cache 1, Google cache 2, Google Cache 3)

    What book is she referencing in her first tweet?

    Greg (bc8186)

  197. I think we should all reserve judgment on Mr. Reid until the evidence rolls itself out, which is slowly happening. Patience, in this case, is a necessity.

    Anitabusch (a025dd)

  198. And, what I mean by that is — the judgment about someone’s veracity does not directly correlate with the timing of the rollout of information.

    All it means is that the time it takes to peel back layers of the onion of information to figure it all out is not on YOUR (te reader’s) timetable.

    Anitabusch (a025dd)

  199. 198 Dustin

    Indications are that lady strolls into PD and duty officer takes statement, fills out form, perhaps asking no questions other than the next blank on the form. Days later, real Detective pays lady a visit to get the details, asking questions, etc. Hence the discrepancy between Lee and “follower.”

    koam (7c1f46)

  200. 198 Dustin

    Lady isn’t Victoria Kennedy, so it just gets put into the normal process…not rushed to the top of BPD priority list.

    koam (7c1f46)

  201. Thanks, Koam.

    I must admit, part of my problem is that I keep buying into some of the attempts to establish a narrative that might be sensationalized. My impression was that a detective had a clearly identified Lee as a threatener (which obviously would be a seriously f’ed up lie).

    I do think, before Lee was called by a detective, it would make sense to make sure he’s the accused. I guess I’ll have to wait on more details, but Sarah’s point that Lee’s audience don’t really even have a way to contact this ‘victim’ (let alone Lee, IIRC) is a strong one.

    perhaps asking no questions other than the next blank on the form.

    I suppose the process is something I’m not knowledgeable about. This isn’t what I had imagined. Not saying you’re wrong. You probably aren’t.

    Dustin (c16eca)

  202. this seems to be the most active thread on this subject, so i’ll post this here…

    does everyone realize why dan was so mad the night joe brooks was exchanging DMs with him? because LEE LIED! stranahan purposefully told people that he hired PIs to get a reaction from dan. well, he got it. WTF else did he expect?

    then he continued his deception that night by lying to/about me. http://www.blogtalkradio.com/stranahan/2011/06/22/weinergate-more-midnight-betty-john-reid-is-wicked-mad

    razor419 (04364e)

  203. Here we go again ….

    How many socks are there? I’ve lost count.

    Miranda (4104db)

  204. While this JR9 spotlight at Patterico.com is admittedly unorthodox, it has already proven to be highly valuable.

    No matter what you believe to be the true nature of “The Reids,” the following has happened since JR9 sprang to life on Twitter early last week:

    1) JR9 is clearly linked to Nikki.
    2) JR9 has produced documents that we have not seen before.
    3) Documentation is going to tell more of this story than we know already.
    3) Many of these documents have been verified by other principals, such as GC.
    4) We have learned that MSM reports are demonstrably misleading regarding this case, independent of whether NR & MA represent real girls.

    Does this provide a platform for JR9, if inauthentic, to release further documents that are not real? Yes. That’s a risk. But there will be no shortage of skeptics to analyze all docs, real and fake here. We can be sure of that.

    If we could get people to accept simple “rules of engagement” (and we won’t, but ideally) there would be two discussions:

    • One “room” would have discussions based on accepting the premise of the Reids’ & MA’s existence, merely for the sake of argument to facilitate more disclosure of actual documents and discussion of their implications.

    • The other “room” (and the rest of the entire Internet, for that matter) would be free to explore all potential possibilities for the truth behind these sources.

    A case can be made for this for at least two reasons:

    1) Weiner was known to have engaged with underage fans (e.g., Ethel) at some level that many (but not all) parents and voters would regard as highly objectionable.

    (For example, he sent a known, real high-school girl a message that contained a word you can’t say on TV. He used verbal tactics with Ethel that he had previously used with adult fans with whom he was having highly explicit exchanges over long periods. And there was a pattern to his grooming. His known behavior with Ethel fit the pattern.)

    2) If there were other underage fans with whom Weiner was communicating, it is plausible that their families would fiercely defend the families’ privacy in the hope that girls may have somewhat normal futures. If this Nikki (and her friend, Marianela) exist, however remote you believe the possibility to be, we don’t know the full scope of their interactions with a known bad actor. Who says she didn’t actually engage in naughtier content? Her father claims that she didn’t give him full disclosure for an extended period of time. These girls, for the sake of argument, are 16 and risk becoming 21st-century Monica Lewisnkys for life because of this, if exposed.

    Even if we only accept a very small chance of the girls being real, wouldn’t we want to defend them like Tommy actually did?… like Breitbart & Loesch actually did by not printing reports about them? … the way #bornfree crew actually did by warning them and others of Weiner’s pattern of behavior?

    And even if we don’t buy their existence at all, isn’t the release of confirmed documents related to the principal players’ interactions in this mystery worth obtaining?

    It’s just one “room” on the entire internet where we’d suspend disbelief and accept the premise that the girls’s identity is worth protecting and the discovery of new information that results from that will shed light on the facts and the situation that arose.

    koam (7c1f46)

  205. Miranda, razor’s not a sockpuppet.

    He’s also telling the truth in his last sentence.

    I can’t speak to the motivations behind PatriotUSA76 being furious, but insofar as he’s been threatening people, that’s not acceptable. Even if the point was to provoke him, he owns his choices anyway. Just as much as you own yours to
    ‘just ask questions’ about Razor being a sockpuppet when he’s the guy who calls in from an unblocked number, and you (like me) are much more anonymous.

    Again, Miranda, I’m not trying to fight with you. I just think we should try to understand Razor’s POV. I can’t think of any choices Razor’s made that I wouldn’t have made.

    Dustin (c16eca)

  206. It’s just one “room” on the entire internet where we’d suspend disbelief and accept the premise that the girls’s identity is worth protecting and the discovery of new information that results from that will shed light on the facts and the situation that arose.

    Comment by koam — 6/27/2011 @ 1:29 pm

    You’re right. It’s actually really cool, IMO.

    I had my doubts, and frankly I was chuckling at Sarah’s refusal to play along because frankly, she’s almost certainly right, but we’re learning things anyway.

    I also think it’s worth noting that this is not exactly the biggest story in the universe. But it’s interesting, and a great laboratory for different approaches because a lot of people will take part. Really, if this approach is determined to be a total failure (And it won’t be) then that’s no big deal. Compared to the NYT’s way of doing things, I think this one only moves the messy nature of sorting out conflicting stories into the open.

    Dustin (c16eca)

  207. Well, I would ask:

    1) Did you read all the messages your daughter was sending, and after how much of a delay?

    2) When did you know about the request for Anthony Weiner to be here prom date?

    3) Did you approve, disapprove, or have no great concern about that?

    4) Was the prom real?

    Sammy Finkelman (d3daeb)

  208. Can you explain how to read the time stamps on the various documents you uploaded? Are they all UMT (aka GMT) or Pacific time, or what?

    Sammy Finkelman (d3daeb)

  209. You’re entitled to your opinion Dustin.

    Have you met “razor419”? Have you spoken to him via telephone or Skype?

    How do you know that the person who posted comment #205 above is the same person who called in to Lee’s show the other night?

    As I said, you’re welcome to your opinion, but that’s just what it is – an opinion. Just as I have my own opinions – as do all the other commenters.

    Now, it is interesting to me that we’ve had one angry woman call Lee, and one angry man calling Lee, both accusing him of lying etc. But there may be some voice disguising going on too.

    Just sayin’.

    Miranda (4104db)

  210. I am hoping against hope, Koam, that the truth will be revealed before Patterico has to set up different chat rooms.

    Now, “John Reid” continued to answer questions last night, despite the unfortunate comment by the fake Patterico. So he does have some interest in revealing more of the story. He has answered several of my questions.

    It will be interesting to see how the video chat goes tonight. Or will “John Reid” back out of that as well?

    Miranda (4104db)

  211. both accusing him of lying etc.

    Um.

    What?

    click Razor’s link and see why I think this is not a fair summary. It’s not an accusation when the ‘accused’ admits it and then rationalizes it.

    Listen, Miranda, it would be much easier for me to ‘take it easy’ on Lee if you didn’t summarize things in a way that just begs me to correct.

    As I said, you’re welcome to your opinion, but that’s just what it is – an opinion.

    No, it’s not. It’s a fact. If you can prove it, it’s not an opinion.

    But there may be some voice disguising going on too.

    I don’t know if this is possible. Listen to Razor’s link. He sounds like a real guy to me. If that’s some computer voice disguising it’s extremely advanced superspy level stuff.

    Do you have any basis for asserting that razor is a sockpuppet? The evidence seems to suggest otherwise, so I have basis to say he isn’t one.

    Anyway, let’s put all that aside for a second. Your comment had no meaning beyond simply discounting Razor’s argument, and it’s an ad hominem. He provided an argument.

    1: he thinks PatriotUSA76 has been provoked.

    2: he has proven Lee was unfair to him (Razor).

    You treated him much as you did me, dismissing with an ad hom. I think there is a better way to react to Razor.

    Like I did. I dispute that PatriotUSA76’s being provoked justifies his fury. I say he’s still responsible for his choices, and if he’s threatening people, the fact someone’s called a PI, or pretended to, doesn’t justify it.

    I also dispute that Lee’s behavior towards Razor relates or justifies PatriotUSA76’s behavior.

    So actually, Miranda, we’re basically on the same side of this argument to some extent. I just caution you, again from a position where I don’t want to be your enemy, against dismissing ‘sockpuppets’ unless you have a good reason to think someone is a sockpuppet. Argue against arguments with arguments.

    it is interesting to me that we’ve had one angry woman call Lee, and one angry man calling Lee,

    Me too. Why anyone would call in to a program like that is 100% beyond me. It’s not neutral ground, it’s combative, it’s kinda ugly. And you get less info in an hour than you get in 3 minutes reading a blog. Why do they bother? That wasn’t meant to be an insult to Lee, BTW. I just think radio programs are drastically inferior to text on the internet for informing people.

    I still think it’s essential that John and perhaps his family appear on video or call Patterico or even Lee.

    I hope you can tell that I’m trying to explain myself to you in good faith, and that I’m also going out of my way to ‘take it easy’.

    Dustin (c16eca)

  212. It will be interesting to see how the video chat goes tonight. Or will “John Reid” back out of that as well?

    Comment by Miranda

    I’m going to go out on a limb and guess he backs out, because he is, in fact, a sockpuppet. You are 100% right about this.

    Dustin (c16eca)

  213. dustin, thank you for your support. i would point out that dan’s threats to lee were that he would “ruin him” “career wise”. dan never made any threats of physical violence towards lee. and if lee wants to suggest otherwise, i’m sure dan would be more than happy to splice statements to show who is the one making the more poignant allegations.

    as for you miranda, i talked to breitbart on the phone for 15+ minutes on 6/2. i phoned into lee’s blogcast and spoke for 20 minutes. i followed that up with an hour+ long conversation with lee. i’ve posted my correct email when making comments on leestranahan.com, patterico.com, verumserum.com and ace of spades. i can go on… but i don’t think anyone but you would be interested.

    razor419 (04364e)

  214. You seem to be very invested in Razor, Dustin. Is he a friend? Someone you know well?

    Now, if you re-read my comment #206, I’m assuming (yes, assuming), you’ll notice that I didn’t accuse Razor419 of being a “sockpuppet” – which is what you stated. I’m afraid you really jumped to a conclusion I never made. Why is that? After you assumed I was talking about Razor419, then I asked you why, at #212, you thought he was the same person who called in to Lee’s show.

    Originally I had just made a general observation, which perhaps you don’t share. For all I know, you might think that Nikki, and Nikki’s mom, and John Reid, and Marianela Alicea, and Patriot, and many more personas – are all real people.

    Maybe they are. What do you think?

    Miranda (4104db)

  215. Moreover, I could sign in as “Donald Trump”, but obviously – that means nothing.

    And I’ve noticed there are plenty of new commenters lately.

    The fact is that there has to be at least one real person who is behind all the sockpuppetry. One person, or two people, or five – who knows. Certainly someone who sets up numerous Twitter & Facebook & email accounts is capable of making a phone call or two.

    So who really knows?! Now, I can’t wait for John Reid’s next appearance. I need to get my next set of questions ready.

    Miranda (4104db)

  216. I think we should all reserve judgment on Mr. Reid until the evidence rolls itself out, which is slowly happening. Patience, in this case, is a necessity.

    Comment by Anitabusch — 6/27/2011 @ 12:44 pm

    I think it has rolled out, and if you haven’t seen it, you either aren’t paying attention or don’t realize what it is you’ve seen.

    SarahW (af7312)

  217. Or, in the alternative, Anita, very invested in not seeing and/or in having others not see.

    SarahW (af7312)

  218. And I’ve noticed there are plenty of new commenters lately.

    No disrespect intended, but one of them is named Miranda. This is an interesting story that deviates from the typical topics on this blog, so of course a lot of people are coming here lately, who are new, and yet, like you, they are here in good faith.

    Imagine how bonkers I would be if I claimed you were a sockpuppet.

    That said, Miranda, sure… don’t trust any of these tweeters. But that’s a great reason to rely on arguments themselves instead of trying to figure out which person behind them is right.

    Assuming for the sake of argument that John is a sockpuppet: he or she might still have a very important and truthful thing they want to say about Congressman Weiner. Some think that’s exactly what we are headed towards.

    Dustin (c16eca)

  219. Temper, temper, Razor!

    Oh, I’m so disappointed. I was hoping to see you, in person, at youtube.

    Now, I’ll repeat what I said to Dustin – I made a general observation at #206. It was Dustin who assumed I was speaking of you. And now you’re mad at me – for what, exactly?

    This is so confusing. Please help me to understand, Razor.

    What exactly do you want from Lee? An apology? Your own radio show? Seriously, what exactly do you want? Or are you content to post comments about how Lee “lied” (#205)?

    Miranda (4104db)

  220. Paranoid Schizophrenia:
    A form of schizophrenia characterized by persistent preoccupation with illogical, absurd, and changeable delusions, usually of a persecutory, grandiose, or jealous nature, accompanied by related hallucinations. The symptoms include extreme anxiety, exaggerated suspiciousness, aggressiveness, anger, argumentativeness, and hostility

    MeninWhiteCoats (786412)

  221. I’ve got the shoes right here. Who’s ready to try them on?

    MeninWhiteCoats (786412)

  222. hey miranda, i’ve got a new theory… are you lee stranahan? Heyo!

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7miRCLeFSJo

    razor419 (04364e)

  223. Now, I’ll repeat what I said to Dustin – I made a general observation at #206. It was Dustin who assumed I was speaking of you.

    Yes, I did assume this. If I’m mistaken, I apologize, but you defended this POV by noting the similarity you perceive between Razor and some woman. Anyway, sorry if I was unfair to you, but I think I wasn’t.

    Dustin (c16eca)

  224. I’m unable to make heads or tails of John yet, and remain open minded. Still there are a couple of concerns. For instance:

    On one hand, he states he is a liberal with considerable respect for AW. Yet on the other hand the “close monitoring” of his daughter seems to indicate very conservative values.

    Also, his answers and responses almost seem too good. “Too good” in the sense of a professional political handler.

    As for Gennettec, well, she is all about control to my mind. Whether Nikii was real or not, I think Gennette used her like a tool.

    Thus, the real truth of this matter is caught between people with serious control issues.

    cap'n john's nephew (28dda5)

  225. What exactly do you want from Lee?

    Miranda, he wants people to understand Lee. It’s clear from your reactions that there is still a need for the truth to be told. I don’t think Razor is jealous of those who have radio shows.

    You could ease up a little. If someone did this to you, you would obviously be upset too.

    Dustin (c16eca)

  226. No takers? I’ll be back soon.(No, I am not Elvis. Calm down. He’s dead)

    Thank ya. Thank ya verry much. (who said that?)

    MeninWhiteCoats (786412)

  227. I like Patterico’s investigation of the Reids, Gennette, et al, better than any story he’s ever done. There’s something about it that has me hooked. Maybe it’s because it’s part law-related and part mystery. It also reminds me of my parents’ and grandparents’ description of their anticipation as they waited for the next installment of a serial TV or radio show.

    DRJ (fdd243)

  228. Sorry I didn’t reply, Meninwhitecoats.

    I think your theory is strong. Someone with a severe problem could be the basis for this.

    And let me speculate a little further: if there is a crazy woman behind all this drama, Anthony Weiner knows exactly who it is, and he knows that person needs help, and his lack of intervention has made things worse, where this crazy person appears to be crossing the line into criminal behavior.

    Some might say he’s not obligated to help her, but I think he is. Anyway, this speculation. I will have a final conclusion about John Reid based on the video promised today. If there isn’t one, then that’s it for me.

    Dustin (c16eca)

  229. Apology accepted Dustin!

    You made an interesting observation at #222:

    “Assuming for the sake of argument that John is a sockpuppet: he or she might still have a very important and truthful thing they want to say about Congressman Weiner. Some think that’s exactly what we are headed towards.”

    I guess I’m a little lost. If John Reid is a sockpuppet, how can anyone trust what he says? It’s not just that he refuses to disclose his identity – it’s that he could be a persona – a character. What we want to know is the raal person behind the sockpuppets.

    Wouldn’t you agree? And what is it that you think that could be revealed about Anthony Weiner?
    I wonder where he’ll end up working. He’s certainly not ruined. People like him tend to get highly-paid jobs somewhere.

    And I wouldn’t be surprised if he started up his predatory behavior again. I hope not – but I wouldn’t be surprised.

    Miranda (4104db)

  230. Menin,

    Have you been drinking plenty of water?

    cap'n john's nephew (28dda5)

  231. . If John Reid is a sockpuppet, how can anyone trust what he says?

    If he’s lying for a reason, he will have to provide more than just his word for his motivation for all this nonsense.

    In other words, of course we can’t just trust what he says without corroboration.

    I wonder where he’ll end up working. He’s certainly not ruined. People like him tend to get highly-paid jobs somewhere.

    I think he will either be a congressman or a Mayor.

    Dustin (c16eca)

  232. I vote Lobbyist!

    ∅ (e7577d)

  233. BTW, Miranda, your reasoning is sound when you note that it is irrational to believe someone who misled us in the past.

    hint hint.

    Dustin (c16eca)

  234. #232 so totally not why we were beckoned. We got a call saying there were some outlandish accusations that may be mimicking mental illness. Our Internet Hospital is bound by the State of SnapOutOfIt to investigate amateur investigators if they veer off into insanity.

    MeninWhiteCoats (786412)

  235. Oh, Meninwhitecoats. I suspected that might be what you were talking about, but I sincerely am trying to avoid that aspect of this story for the time being. I know… I’m not doing an A+ job of it.

    Dustin (c16eca)

  236. 10-4#239

    MeninWhiteCoats (786412)

  237. Dustin, you are a good friend to Razor I see. But I’m sure he can speak for himself. He should tell us what he wants from Lee, instead of just posting “LEE LIED” statements here. Maybe you could ask him to do that.

    The truth really does set one free. I guess for some poor souls, they’d rather be pretending to be someone else, rather than who they really are.

    Now I wonder why the elaborate charade? Why not just release all the DM’s & emails etc? I guess we have a real drama queen behind the scenes.

    There’s a question for John Reid – has he released all DM’s, etc. to Patterico. And would he turn over his daughter’s computer, phone, etc to an independent computer expert for analysis & possible retrieval of deleted messages etc.

    Miranda (4104db)

  238. John -seems like- someone trying to portray a liberal transitioning into a conservative. If I saw it in a movie I’d call it a flat, one dimensional, unbelievable character. That being said, I agree with whomever said we can learn, and even find truths from prevaricating puppetry.

    jeffeneff (707f3d)

  239. Miranda,

    You are obscurring Dustin’s point with an egregious red herring — this has nothing to do with Razor, and his opinion on the subject now isn’t relevant.

    The point is, Lee admitted to lying to a source. Importantly, he extended this lie to his audience as well. He only admitted a lie to his audience after first lying to 2 back-to-back callers, and his audience. It took 2 consecutive callers challenging him on his lie for him to admit it Further, he admitted to 2 or 3 lies on this story, not just the 1. And he said he had lied on other stories in the past, and we don’t know what those lies are.

    Make sense now?

    Thanks.

    Random (8ec277)

  240. Miranda,

    You are obscurring Dustin’s point with an egregious red herring — this has nothing to do with Razor, and his opinion on the subject now isn’t relevant.

    The point is, Lee admitted to lying to a source. Importantly, he extended this lie to his audience as well. He only admitted a lie to his audience after first lying to 2 back-to-back callers, and his audience. It took 2 consecutive callers challenging him on his lie for him to admit it Further, he admitted to 2 or 3 lies on this story, not just the 1. And he said he had lied on other stories in the past, and we don’t know what those lies are.

    Make sense now?

    Thanks.

    Random (b77c1e)

  241. @SarahW

    Also, none of “Lee’s followers” would have had the least idea how to reach her.

    Comment by SarahW — 6/27/2011 @ 11:20 am

    Ran in to read over the comments and had this thought:
    What if she is referring to something she read here in the comments? I don’t think anyone threatened her. She could be translating insults into threats. This women operates outside planet Rationality.

    I had another crazy idea but it would depend on whether that one theory floated about the authorship of GC’s comments could have any connection to this women. Or perhaps that the women read comments addressed to GC as well as herself. It had to do with one of GC’s conversations here regarding Weiner and the threats made to Ginger Lee. This may be a lot of nonsense, but the women’s mind isn’t precisely stable. Would it be that big of a jump for her to take a comment referring to Weiner”s threats to G.Lee and turn that around to Lee S. and herself? Again, We are speaking of a seriously unbalanced mind.

    Any chance the loonybird took that exchange as a threat to herself? Ok, I’m going to take off before the tomatoes start flying.

    bmertz (d77c52)

  242. To Dustin, Razor419, & Random:

    Razor, you’ve claimed repeatedly that “Lee lied” and seem very angry about that.

    Please take Lee up on his offer, pick up the phone, and call him.

    Why you are trying to convince me of the righteousness of your actions is beyond me. You are the ones (however many there are of you) who have a problem with Lee. He’s offered repeatedly to you, Dustin, to call him. That’s pretty fair.

    So why not call, Random?

    Miranda (4104db)

  243. I spoke to Razor at length about this on the phone several days ago and I apologized to them privately, as well as publicly on my radio show.

    None of it relates to the story or my reporting in general — there’s no point in reporting the story where I’ve said anything dishonest.

    Here’s what I was dealing with on June 7th, when the incident where “Lee lied” happened…I was dealing
    with threats from Patriot, and I was tired of them

    http://joe.wireupdate.com/post/6967114161

    My lie? I thought Razor was Patriot or connected to them — I said that Razor sent me information. Razor hadn’t. I wanted to see Razor’s reaction.

    That’s it.

    There’s no point I reported this or made it part of the the story. It was a ruse on my part, dealing with someone saying stuff like…

    (9: 44:40 PM) dwp676740 Lee is like that
    (9: 44:46 PM) dwp676740 He twists shit
    (9: 44:53 PM) dwp676740 I’ve been on the receiving end of that
    (9: 44:55 PM) dwp676740 I know him
    (9: 44:58 PM) dwp676740 He is a snake
    (9: 45:07 PM) dwp676740 He has declared war on me.
    (9: 45:15 PM) dwp676740 He better watch his back

    So. Yep — dealing with this insanity, I tried to smoke out Razor. When I realized he was real (weeks later), I came clean almost immediately — knowing that my critics (like Patriot) would attack me.

    Razor — what more do you want at this point? You told me you understood. What do you want, exactly?

    Lee Stranahan (708cc3)

  244. Miranda,

    It doesn’t matter worth a damn whether Dustin calls Lee or not (and why should he?), Miranda. What matters is:

    Lee admitted to lying to a source. Importantly, he extended this lie to his audience as well. He only admitted a lie to his audience after first lying to 2 back-to-back callers, and his audience. It took 2 consecutive callers challenging him on his lie for him to admit it Further, he admitted to 2 or 3 lies on this story, not just the 1. And he said he had lied on other stories in the past, and we don’t know what those lies are.

    Besides, in the follow-up conversation, Lee called Dustin a liar and a punk. Maybe Dustin doesn’t feel like calling Lee.

    Journalist admits to lying 2 or 3 times including to his audience, recalls 2 of 3 lies, thinks there is probably a 3rd one he doesn’t remember, had lied with other stories … at what point does an audience member not have an obligation to call into Lee’s show if he would prefer not to?

    Address the core issue: It’s in the blockquote above.

    Random (b77c1e)

  245. I never admitted ‘lying to a source’ – Razor was never a source of mine.

    Who are you, “Random”?

    Lee Stranahan (708cc3)

  246. Sheesh. I forgot to change my sockpuppet.

    SPQR (26be8b)

  247. For the record, I didn’t hear these claims on the show because I didn’t listen to the show. I don’t think anything significant has been revealed on them, but anyway, I’m not even sure when the show comes on the air.

    I heard the one with Razor, and I heard another. Nothing about me, and frankly, I don’t see why I would leave neutral ground we both participate on, where we can argue our cases as equals, to subject myself to my opponent cutting me off, terminating my points, or going on with his response in a way I’m unable to. Nothing against Lee there… it’s just not a format presenting a fair fight.

    Anyway, I am going to withhold further comments on Lee right now. I’ve contacted him directly, 100% straight, and I want to give him the chance to reply.

    Dustin (c16eca)

  248. 246-Hey random. Are we referring to the word “lie” by its actual meaning or by JD’s meaning, which is any statement that he doesn’t agree with is a lie?

    Joonipre (d01a46)

  249. Joonipre, respectfully, click the links. You are replying to a comment with a link that proves it is correct.

    Dustin (c16eca)

  250. Just wanted a clarification. 😉

    Joonipre (d01a46)

  251. Serial mendoucheous sock puppets! As stashiu showed this one to be, are just so cute. That is not my position, therefore, that is a lie, and you are a liar. Now, crawl back under your rock/bridge/cave ….

    JD (318f81)

  252. You just proved my point.

    Joonipre (d01a46)


Powered by WordPress.

Page loaded in: 0.1945 secs.