Patterico's Pontifications

10/1/2008

Joe Biden’s lousy answers to Couric’s Court questions

Filed under: 2008 Election,Current Events,Media Bias — Karl @ 6:12 pm

[Posted by Karl]

CBS’s Katie Couric asked Vice-presidential nominees Sarah Palin and Joe Biden their views on the Supreme Court’s decision on Roe v. Wade and whether there were other Supreme Court decisions with which they disagreed:

The proggosphere focuses on Palin’s non-answer to the follow-up question. Fair enough; it’s a non-answer and not even a good non-answer of the sort Allahpundit formulates.

However, Biden fares little better. He filibusters the follow-up, complaining about the Supreme Court decision invalidating part of the Violence Against Women Act. He does not actually name U.S. v. Morrison, which raises the question of whether he remembered it only because of his direct involvement in drafting the part of the law the Supreme Court invalidated. (Ironically, the ACLU opposed the original version of the VAWA on the ground that it allegedly violated the right to privacy.)

Worse, in the first question, Biden lectures Couric about the trimester framework of Roe, which he calls as close to a consensus as America can get. In reality, the Supreme Court ruled signaled that the trimester framework had “proved to be unsound in principle and unworkable in practice” in the 1989 case of plurality opinion in Webster v. Reproductive Health Services.* The trimester framework has been bad law for 19 years.

Palin, having spent her days dealing with state issues as Governor of Alaska, might be expected to stumble over these sorts of questions, which is probably why Couric asked them. Biden has been on the Senate Judiciary Committee for decades — what’s his excuse?
—-

Update: Here’s video of Palin disagreeing with the Supreme Court’s opinion reducing the punitive damages awarded in Exxon Shipping Co. v. Baker.

–Karl

UPDATE BY PATTERICO: Sorry, but this is just embarrassing. I’ve become far less confident over the past few days that Palin is up to the job; much of the interview with Gibson could be explained away as the product of distorted editing, but this is a bit much. That said, in the videos I’ve seen of her interviews and debates before the 2006 Alaska gubernatorial election, she was impressive. I wonder which Sarah Palin we’ll see tomorrow.

She had better do well — and then, she had better get out there and start engaging with journalists. If this doesn’t happen, in a decisively impressive way, you may be adding me to the ranks of the Kathleen Parkers and David Frums of the world.

UPDATE BY KARL: I don’t disagree much with Patterico on Palin’s answer — which is why I linked to criticisms of it from the Left and Right. But inasmuch as the criticism of Palin is already widespread, I thought it worth noting what others were not — i.e., that Biden was not called on his babbling about the legally discared trimester framework of Roe, just as he was not savaged by the MSM for babbling about FDR being president and on television in 1929, exaggerating his adventures in Afghanistan and Iraq, and so on, as SPQR notes in the first comment below.

97 Responses to “Joe Biden’s lousy answers to Couric’s Court questions”

  1. Slow Joe’s excuse is the same as always – he never gets called by the MSM on how dumb he is.

    SPQR (26be8b)

  2. Anyone who has watched Biden’s performance in the Judiciary Committee is not surprised by his lack of understanding of Supreme Court decisions. Just about the easiest time conservative nominees have before the Judiciary Committee is when Biden has the microphone.

    WLS (26b1e5)

  3. So her one notable Supreme Court disagreement is with a Souter opinion limiting billions in extra-compensatory punitive damages against an oil company for an accident impacting the Alaskan environment?

    Hope she brings that up tomorrow, to solidify the base.

    Aplomb (b6fba6)

  4. Biden has been on the Senate Judiciary Committee for decades — what’s his excuse?

    There’s a reason why they call him slow Joe. This is the guy who, against the will of Iraqis wanted to partition Iraq. He would have turned low level, and containable, sectarian violence into a full scale civil war.

    Incidentally there were 6 combat deaths in Iraq in September. And Obama wanted to concede Iaq to al Qaeda.

    Biden and Obama. Unfit and Even More Unfit.

    Terry Gain (aab754)

  5. “So her one notable Supreme Court disagreement is with a Souter opinion limiting billions in extra-compensatory punitive damages against an oil company for an accident impacting the Alaskan environment?”

    You know better than to misrepresent, Aplomb. Calling the linked video “her one notable … disagreement” is not what was written.

    SPQR (26be8b)

  6. Fair enough SPQR, just thought it funny of all available Sup. Ct. cases we can find on the internet where she spoke articulately and reasonably was that one. Meant it as a joke considering the context, didn’t mean to misrepresent.

    Aplomb (b6fba6)

  7. You’re funny Karl.

    Good one. Making an issue of Biden’s response to Couric’s question….

    When Palin’s son Trig could have answered more intelligently than Palin did to Couric’s questions..

    jharp (2282bb)

  8. jharp

    Unlike Obama, Trig is not in favor of conceding Iraq to al Qaeda.

    Unlike Biden, Trig is not in favor of partitioning Iraq against the will of Iraqis and plunging the country into a civil war.

    6 combat deaths in Iraq in September. You concern yourself with trifles. You are cluless about the big picture.

    6 deaths as compared with al Qaeda having a safe heaven in oil rich Iraq. Checkmate.

    Terry Gain (aab754)

  9. The trimester framework was fatally undercut on the same day Roe was announced in the companion case of Doe v. Bolton, 410 U.S. 179 (1973). An second- and third-trimester exception for the mother’s mental health — which can include “It will make me very blue unless I can murder my baby” — as a practical matter swallows any state regulation even of otherwise viable fetuses.

    This is the sort of distinction I don’t expect non-lawyers to necessarily know — even well educated non-lawyers. Lawyers who are members and former chairman of the Senate Judiciary Committee and who tout themselves as being constitutional law teachers, however, can’t possibly be excused from knowing this.

    Beldar (732de3)

  10. Beldar — what’s a “trimester”?

    WLS (26b1e5)

  11. 6 combat deaths in Iraq in September.

    6 deaths as compared with al Qaeda having a safe heaven in oil rich Iraq.

    Comment by Terry Gain — 10/1/2008 @ 7:10 pm

    That is 6 too many. And $12 billion dollars too much. And al Qaeda wasn’t in Iraq pre invasion nor will they take hold after we leave.

    It is you who hasn’t a clue.

    jharp (2282bb)

  12. jharp, you’ve had your backside spanked on those false claims of yours month after month.

    And yet you repeat them.

    Says a lot about you.

    SPQR (26be8b)

  13. Too bad she didn’t name Raich.

    Soronel Haetir (644722)

  14. Um, why didn’t Palin

    cite this ?

    It happened a *lot* more recently than the issues Joe Biden was involved in.

    Whatever (f2e733)

  15. Terry – Don’t puncture jharps bubble with facts.
    He will vote for Democrats in November.

    He will formulate an opinion regarding every political event along the way, regardless of the resulting inconsistency, to agree with that decision.

    Apogee (366e8b)

  16. WLS,

    Trimester = 3 months. Three trimesters in a typical pregnancy.

    Aplomb,

    She also disagrees with Roe, which I think is notable, though you somehow missed it.

    Karl (1b4668)

  17. As for Exxon, regardless of the merits, I think the court got it right as a matter of law. Maritime has long been an odd place in the law.

    Soronel Haetir (644722)

  18. For the first 4 years of the Iraq war Biden appeared on the Sunday morning news talkies and stressed the importance of succedding in Iraq. Granted he had not a clue as to how to succeed and his prescriptions would have made matters worse, but he did understand the serious damage to America that faiure would entail.

    Then, when the administration implemented the Surge Biden grew silent. He ends up as running mate for a guy who saw the war only an opportunity to further his political ambitions, not something the country needed to win.

    If the McCain cmapaign has not schooled Palin on Biden’s “Iraq war history” they have not done their job. He is ripe for the taking.

    Terry Gain (aab754)

  19. Apogee

    My comment was not for jharp but about him and his candidate. Trolls like jharp keep the conversation going and give us ample opportunity to demonstrate the idiocy of the left.

    The jharp’s of this world make it much easier to convince those who are on their way to getting it.

    Terry Gain (aab754)

  20. When Palin’s son Trig could have answered more intelligently than Palin did to Couric’s questions..

    Once again harpy goes for the hackneyed phrase du jour. Brilliant, harp – do you know any jokes by Henny Youngman?

    Dmac (e639cc)

  21. Dmac, Henny Youngman? When jharp can make fun of Down’s Syndrome sufferers?

    SPQR (26be8b)

  22. jharp keep the conversation going and give us ample opportunity to demonstrate the idiocy of the left.

    The jharp’s of this world make it much easier to convince those who are on their way to getting it.

    Comment by Terry Gain — 10/1/2008 @ 7:33 pm

    Yes. The GOP has done so well for us the past 8 years. Pissed away $1 trillion in Iraq, getting ready to hand over another 700 billion to Wall Street to prevent complete economic ruin, and another 4 trillion pissed away for nothing.

    Good God. How in the hell could anyone possibly defend W and the GOPers?

    Uninformed and being misled is no way to go through life, GOP apologists.

    jharp (2282bb)

  23. When jharp can make fun of Down’s Syndrome sufferers?

    Comment by SPQR — 10/1/2008 @ 7:39 pm

    Hey SPQR,

    Go fuck yourself. I did no such thing and don’t appreciate being accused of it.

    jharp (2282bb)

  24. Biden a Victim of Abuse?

    Why is Biden so… neurotic about the Violence Against Women Act?

    Perhaps it’s because the vociferous former stutterer was beaten with impunity by his sister as a youth. He described it in a Senate hearing.

    Here’s the transcript. (see p. 171-172)

    http://thenononsenseman.com/Media/BidenViolenceSenateHearing_1990.pdf

    HumanRights101 (ea2952)

  25. “That is 6 too many. And $12 billion dollars too much. And al Qaeda wasn’t in Iraq pre invasion nor will they take hold after we leave.”jharp

    Dumber than dumb. You exepct to defeat al Qaeda without casualties? Where you born yesterday- late in the day.

    It’s true that al Qaeda may not take over Iraq when we leave but that’s because of the shit kicking they’ve taken over the last 21 months. But you don’t know aanything about that.

    If Obama’s 16 month plan had been followed in January 2007 instead of the Surge al Qaeda would now have their save haven and AAmerican soldiers would have been sitting ducks while they tried to retreat.

    Clueless indeed. And intellectually dishonest.

    Terry Gain (aab754)

  26. jharp – getting ready to hand over another 700 billion to Wall Street to prevent complete economic ruin,. . . Good God. How in the hell could anyone possibly defend W and the GOPers?

    You should ask Obama, as he is doing just that. Of course, since you’re voting for Democrats no matter what they do, all this talk is really just rationalization.

    Apogee (366e8b)

  27. You should ask Obama, as he is doing just that.

    jharp is not too bright.

    I do wonder what would happen if Obama and McCain fail to make the case to the American people that the bailout is at least, the best of bad choices. They are on the griddle now on this issue, and they will have to sell this bailout to their respective supporters.

    Michael Ejercito (a757fd)

  28. Of course, since you’re voting for Democrats no matter what they do, all this talk is really just rationalization.

    Comment by Apogee — 10/1/2008 @ 8:01 pm

    And you know of this how?

    I’m voting against the guy who voted with Bush 90% of the time and opted for the most ridiculous and absurd VP choice is the history of the United States.

    jharp (2282bb)

  29. Jharpy – Ansar Al Islam. Thoughts?

    You made fun of Trig. Own it.

    JD (5f0e11)

  30. The most ridiculous VP choice remains Biden.

    SPQR (26be8b)

  31. I’m voting against the guy who voted with Bush 90% of the time and opted for the most ridiculous and absurd VP choice is the history of the United States.

    And I am voting against a guy who voted against self-defense.

    Michael Ejercito (a757fd)

  32. and making fun of Down’s Syndrome sufferers is all in a day’s work for a Democrat.

    SPQR (26be8b)


  33. …the most ridiculous and absurd VP choice is the history of the United States.

    Who, by any objective measure, will (regardless of the election outcome) still go down in history as far more appreciated and beloved than any preening stalinist troll could ever hope for.

    qdpsteve (64c4ed)

  34. When Palin’s son Trig could have answered more intelligently than Palin did to Couric’s questions..

    Comment by jharp — 10/1/2008 @ 6:58 pm

    Above is my post, SPQR.

    Are you a pathological liar or are you really that stupid.

    It was Governor Palin’s idiotic response to Couric’s question that I was making fun of.

    Things getting a little desperate, huh?

    jharp (2282bb)

  35. “Who, by any objective measure, will (regardless of the election outcome) still go down in history as far more appreciated and beloved”

    Pretty funny stuff here tonight. She’s sinking what little chance the GOPer’s had and she’s beloved.

    She’s a loser and taking McCain down.

    Though I guess I can appreciate what she’s doing.

    Finishing the destruction of the GOP.

    jharp (2282bb)

  36. Bullshit harptard. You knew exactly what you were saying. Lying your DNC-owned ass off doesn’t change a thing.

    qdpsteve (64c4ed)

  37. And you know of this how?

    Because every response and assertion that you make, regardless of the subject, is straight down-the-line Democrat party ‘talking point’, with no concern whatsoever to the consistency of your statements.

    Just in your number 28, you belch out the 90% lie and make a statement regarding Palin that is so contrary to the stated intent of the Obama campaign’s ‘fresh’ and ‘beyond politics’ appeal that you just can’t help but reveal yourself to be completely dishonest.

    Apogee (366e8b)

  38. Honestly harptard, how much does the DNC pay you in foodstamps and Thunderbird to spew your hate?

    qdpsteve (64c4ed)

  39. Palin’s son Trig could have answered more intelligently than Palin did to Couric’s questions..

    Comment by jharp — 10/1/2008 @ 6:58 pm

    America, I give you … the typical anti-Palin punk.


    Dmac, Henny Youngman? When jharp can make fun of Down’s Syndrome sufferers?

    Comment by SPQR — 10/1/2008 @ 7:39 pm


    Hey SPQR,

    Go fuck yourself. I did no such thing and don’t appreciate being accused of it.

    Comment by jharp — 10/1/2008 @ 7:42 pm

    It doesn’t matter what you appreciate. You did.

    The shoe fits. Wear it as soon as you get your foot out of your mouth, jhackass.

    L.N. Smithee (fb4c08)

  40. Bedtime for me.

    A great week. Obama lengthens his lead and I made some significant money.

    Time for a little golf and then watch Palin completely humiliate herself and the GOP tomorrow.

    Life is good.

    jharp (2282bb)

  41. Good stuff, L.N.

    Oh and harptard: after you remove said foot, go sit your sore- and pus-encrusted ass down on a wet electrified buttplug.

    Stalinists like you need and deserve to have your precious little feelings hurt. Preferably devastatingly and constantly.

    qdpsteve (64c4ed)

  42. Jharp Iagree with you .these conservatives are crazy and desperate at this point.what they need to do is get on board with all of the swing states (he is ahead at least 8 points in swing states)wake up and realize the inevitable.Obama/biden will win the election.put our economy on track go get the guys that got us(alqaeda)

    lrhar (f7890a)

  43. Bedtime for me.

    And jharp, the coward, runs away.

    Apogee (366e8b)

  44. A great week. Obama lengthens his lead and I made some significant money.

    All of which will be long gone on hookers, booze, sextoys and cocaine by November 4.

    qdpsteve (64c4ed)

  45. lrhar, if Obama knows how to do that, why has he been keeping that secret so far? Instead of doing all those great things, he’s been loafing in the Senate doing zip.

    SPQR (26be8b)

  46. SPQR-Did it come as a shock when harpy made fun of Trig?

    JD (5f0e11)

  47. UPDATE BY PATTERICO: Sorry, but this is just embarrassing

    We were right. Us liberals, that is. Sure, we’d have been unlikely to like whoever MCCain picked, but my reaction to Tim Pawlenty would have been basically to pay him no attention whatsoever. I have no beef with Tim Pawlenty. Even Mitt Romney – yes, a hypocrite, but a pragmatist.

    I didn’t have anything against picking a small-town mayor, per se, off the bat. Experience really can be overrated. But knowledge, and the ability to be interested in it, is *not* overrated.

    So if Sarah Palin had been Rameesh Ponuuru in the woods, I would have come to view her with loathing, contempt and a certain degree of fear.

    But she wasn’t just from out of DC. She was – this was made clear within a week of reading news reports – an opportunistic hypocrite with no real principles and a scary upbringing. As a mayor, she was a vindictive control freak with a penchant for personal grudges and a three-second attention span. Other than being pro-life and wild about Jesus, she has no governance philosophy at all – she’s practically a Democrat in her economic governance, albeit in some of the worst ways. She was all about, as the Exxon Valdez thing demonstrates, sucking as much money off the federal government as possible, and she was unusually good at that.

    And I’d actually respect that, if she stood up for economic centrism – but she doesn’t. Instead, she mouthes all the b*llshit GOP talking points, while her record indicates she cares nothing for them.

    She’s a terrible pick, and her inability to master basic talking points in an interview is only one example of this.

    You can tie yourself in knots about Barack Obama’s scary preacher, but it’s not merely Palin’s history that scares me. Unlike BO, she genuinely has no position on anything. Combine that with a predisposition to ignorance and malice, and you have a code-red clusterf*ck.

    And no, it’s not all media bias. Palin’s press has been *much worse* than John McCain’s. Some teeny bit of that – hate to be the last to clue you in folks – might relate in some way not just to predispositioned media agendas, but also that when they went looking for dirt, they found a a lot of dirt.

    glasnost (a51fd8)

  48. I would have come to view her with loathing, contempt and a certain degree of fear.

    I mean, would not have.

    glasnost (a51fd8)

  49. Karl, DRJ, WLS or Patterico, would you please check if ‘glasnost’ has a similar IP address to any other trolls in this thread?

    qdpsteve (64c4ed)

  50. glasnost, all the “dirt” that’s been found has been fabricated from whole cloth by Democrats, like the lies about charging for rape kits, the lies about book banning, and the lies about Buchanan.

    SPQR (26be8b)

  51. jharp, pretending you weren’t making fun of Trig is just calling more attention to it. You’re probably aware of it and trolling and laughing that so many people are reacting to you.

    But if you’re not, admit that it was a stupid and ugly thing to say and move on. Saying that someone is so stupid, even the retard kid is smarter, is insulting the ‘retard’. This isn’t very complicated.

    Juan (4cdfb7)

  52. And jharp, the coward, runs away.

    Actually after giving it some thought, don’t go so hard on harptard. The homeless shelters are closing their doors earlier and earlier in the evening these days.

    qdpsteve (64c4ed)


  53. This isn’t very complicated.

    Juan, I hear ya, but actually it is complicated… to someone whose ‘livelihood’ (i.e., foodstamps and liquor) depends on inner-city DNC operatives.

    qdpsteve (64c4ed)

  54. There is certainly no evidence that jharp is as much smarter than either Trig or Sarah as he thinks he is.

    I’ve no doubt however, that Trig is going to have a lot more character than jharp.

    SPQR (26be8b)

  55. The clip weakens her in general. On one hand the interview weakens whatever pro-choice credentials she had — she repeats that she wants states to regulate abortions, rather than devolving it to individual women. On the other, it also weakens her pro-life credentials — she doesn’t know the code word case, dred scott, and doesn’t know about other abortion / privacy jurisdprudence, like Griswold and Casey.

    Boy people must really envy her for what she’s done.

    imdw (57ace9)

  56. Just for the record. The trimester system was dismantled by Casey, not Webster. One would put a little more faith in your legal analysis if you gave some small impression that you knew what you were talking about.

    Thanks.

    [Webster: “We think that the doubt cast upon the Missouri statute by these cases is not so much a flaw in the statute as it is a reflection of the fact that the rigid trimester analysis of the course of a pregnancy enunciated in Roe has resulted in subsequent cases like Colautti and Akron making constitutional law in this area a virtual Procrustean bed. Statutes specifying elements of informed consent to be provided abortion patients, for example, were invalidated if they were thought to “structur[e] . . . the dialogue between the woman and her physician.” Thornburgh v. American College of Obstetricians and Gynecologists, 476 U. S. 747, 476 U. S. 763 (1986). As the dissenters in Thornburgh pointed out, such a statute would have been sustained under any traditional standard of judicial review, id. at 476 U. S. 802 (WHITE, J., dissenting), or for any other surgical procedure except abortion. Id. at 476 U. S. 783 (Burger, C.J., dissenting).

    Page 492 U. S. 518

    Stare decisis is a cornerstone of our legal system, but it has less power in constitutional cases, where, save for constitutional amendments, this Court is the only body able to make needed changes. See United States v. Scott, 437 U. S. 82, 437 U. S. 101 (1978). We have not refrained from reconsideration of a prior construction of the Constitution that has proved “unsound in principle and unworkable in practice.” Garcia v. San Antonio Metropolitan Transit Authority, 469 U. S. 528, 469 U. S. 546 (1985); see Solorio v. United States, 483 U. S. 435, 483 U. S. 448-450 (1987); Erie R. Co. v. Tompkins, 304 U. S. 64, 304 U. S. 74-78 (1938). We think the Roe trimester framework falls into that category.” — Sorry, Miles. Part II-D of Webster was a plurality, but the O’Connor and Scalia concurrences put the writing on the wall well before Casey sealed the deal formally. Smarter folks on the Left always understood this. –K]

    Miles Archer (ae2fdf)


  57. I’ve no doubt however, that Trig is going to have a lot more character than jharp.

    Good point SPQR. But then I think anyone who could truthfully claim he wasn’t raised under a freeway overpass would also likely have more character.

    If harptard were 1% as successful as he lies that he is, most likely he wouldn’t give enough of a flying leap to argue with people who disagree with him politically. They have these weird traits called manners, self-respect and self-esteem, which are of course obviously foreign to these libtrolls.

    qdpsteve (64c4ed)

  58. “Time for a little golf”

    Watch out for those windmills, jharp.

    Gary Rosen (cb9651)

  59. “Unlike BO, she genuinely has no position on anything”

    Very much unlike BO (appropriate intitials!) who has two positions on everything – the Wright/Ayers positions he held for years and the “moderate centrist” ones he’s trying to fake his way through the election with.

    Gary Rosen (cb9651)

  60. glasnost – within a week of reading news reports – an opportunistic hypocrite with no real principles and a scary upbringing.

    Which would indicate a bias, as it’s the opposite of what 80% of Alaskans think about her. The other 20% are her political opponents and their supporters. It is this 20% that the MSM singled out to interview.

    glasnost – as the Exxon Valdez thing demonstrates, sucking as much money off the federal government as possible, and she was unusually good at that.

    I thought that money was coming from Exxon? Good to know, glasnost, that you’re also in the tank for Big Oil. Here’s the quote:

    Governor Sarah Palin responded today to the announcement that the U.S. Supreme Court has handed down its decision in the Exxon Valdez case. The Court awarded no more than $507.5 million in punitive damages to the plaintiffs, or about 10 percent of the jury’s original award.

    “I am extremely disappointed with today’s decision by the U.S. Supreme Court,” Palin said. “While the decision brings some degree of closure to Alaskans suffering from 19 years of litigation and delay, the Court gutted the jury’s decision on punitive damages.”

    She added, “It is tragic that so many Alaska fishermen and their families have had their lives put on hold waiting for this decision. My heart goes out to those affected, especially the families of the thousands of Alaskans who passed away while waiting for justice.”

    Palin noted that the decision today undercut one of the principal legs of deterrence for those engaged in maritime shipping in Alaska waters. She called on state and federal agencies to be vigilant and firm in regulating such activities.

    So we now have you on record on the side of Exxon/Mobil in the Valdez spill. Still want to spin?

    Palin’s press has been *much worse* than John McCain’s. Some teeny bit of that – hate to be the last to clue you in folks – might relate in some way not just to predispositioned media agendas, but also that when they went looking for dirt, they found a a lot of dirt.

    Actually, when they went looking for ‘dirt’, they found ‘rumor’, and printed it as though it was ‘fact’.

    She’s a terrible pick, and her inability to master basic talking points in an interview…

    Shows her to be someone ‘outside’ politics, who isn’t all about ‘talking points’ and has a ‘fresh’ and ‘post-partisan’ view for America. In other words – Palin is what Obama pretends to be.

    You don’t have to like her, but your brush-off of her accomplishments that even Democrats admire and phony belittlement is telling in its dishonesty.

    Apogee (366e8b)

  61. jharpo marxist bleated:

    Good God. How in the hell could anyone possibly defend W and the GOPers?

    Uninformed and being misled is no way to go through life, GOP apologists.

    Blah, blah, blah. Whatever, dude.

    Let’s get serious: There are two choices this time around: Bad and worse. We’ve been here before, most recently in 1976. America punished the GOP for Watergate and Ford’s pardon of Nixon by narrowly electing Jimmy Carter, who shared Obama’s tendency (as stated in the first debate) to reject the idea of backing a dictator (The Shah of Iran then, Pervez Musharraf recently) in the hopes that a more dangerous enemy might be kept in check. Carter, the so-called man of peace, ushered in the era of state-sponsored terrorism when his diplomats mistakenly thought Ayatollah Khomeini was a Muslim version of Gandhi.

    Oops.

    There is a lot not to like about George W. Bush. Very few if any Republicans will defend him as a great President on January 21, 2009, just as few said that of Gerald Ford before his passing recently. But one thing that can be said of him is that he kept this nation secure when it appeared on the morning of September 11, 2001 that there would be a steady stream of attacks that would cripple the nation and its economy. I can perceive no indication that faced with the same challenges, Barack Obama would be emotionally equipped to make the hard choices that would protect this nation if it upsets the rest of the world.

    Once again, as in 1976, the Democrat party is appealing to the electorate by asking, “Vote us in! Could it possibly get worse than this?” I believe that answer is yes.

    L.N. Smithee (fb4c08)

  62. “Shows her to be someone ‘outside’ politics, who isn’t all about ‘talking points’ and has a ‘fresh’ and ‘post-partisan’ view for America.”

    There’s a lot of people in this country who fit that criteria. And articulate it just as well as Palin. I believe Palin calls them ‘joe six pack’.

    I think her economic decisions, including on earmarks, is similar to Bidens: she’s a home state cheerleader. Biden on the bankruptcy bill? Clearly favoring a home state industry. Same with Palin’s economics so far. She knows to deliver the goods.

    imdw (57ace9)

  63. Gee, sorry I missed the party now that jharp has gone beddie-bye.

    It is unfortunate that he has failed to learn the first rule of polite political debate: Spouses and kids are off limits, unless (of course) they are campaigning themselves.

    Then, we get the usual BS about no AQ in Iraq pre-war, denying the presence of AQ operatives living in Baghdad under Hussein’s protection, and the documented contacts between AQ and SH’s Gov’t.

    I really do want to watch him pull that foot out of his mouth, particularly since he has his head up his ass – it must be extremely painfull.

    AOracle (ec995e)

  64. imdw – She knows to deliver the goods.

    To her constituents.

    Over the wishes of her own political party and some of the most powerful corporations in the world.

    At great career risk.

    With the result of 80% approval.

    That is quite a superior record to that of Joe Biden.

    Apogee (366e8b)

  65. And another reason why commenting on SCOTUS decisions is not the deal breaker that some think:
    She’s not a lawyer, and a large part of the electorate likes that fact!

    AOracle (ec995e)

  66. She’s not a lawyer, and a large part of the electorate likes that fact!

    So do many commenters here, which is strange for a site like this.

    Apogee (366e8b)

  67. glasnost wrote:

    You can tie yourself in knots about Barack Obama’s scary preacher, but it’s not merely Palin’s history that scares me. Unlike BO, she genuinely has no position on anything. Combine that with a predisposition to ignorance and malice, and you have a code-red clusterf*ck.

    I am dead serious about this, glas — Given the way he has, with the assistance of the MSM, obscured his pre-political existence with radicals, tell us: What does Obama stand for?

    (“Change,” “Hope,” and “against everything the GOP is” are NOT answers.)

    I’m really interested in knowing your thoughts about this. Don’t chicken out.

    L.N. Smithee (fb4c08)

  68. “At great career risk.”

    Ah you forget this is Alaska, where everyone is on welfare and gets a check just for being there — Palin having made that bigger. Where a guy under indictment wins the GOP senate primary thanks to his delivering the goods. Career risk? Its how careers are made there — bring in the free money.

    “She’s not a lawyer, and a large part of the electorate likes that fact!”

    “What does Obama stand for?”

    I was curious about his technology policy so I read his webpage. Your mileage may vary.
    I hope being able to mention more than one supreme court opinion you dislike isn’t how you detect lawyers from non-lawyer.

    imdw (57ace9)

  69. oops my responses got mixed up to those last two.

    imdw (57ace9)

  70. Career risk? Its how careers are made there — bring in the free money.

    Except that she didn’t run on ‘more free money’. She ran on transparency and anti-corruption, and as much as you’d like to belittle it, your implication that she was ‘politics as usual’ simply doesn’t jibe with the facts.

    Her resignation from the Oil Commission and her actions regarding the big oil contracts after attaining her position do not fit with someone who is doing anything ‘as usual’. She had no reason to buck the system for the Gas Pipeline contract after attaining office. She could have simply procured more federal and Oil hush money. She did not take that route.

    Traditional politicians side with the powers that be to step on the reformers. . .

    Just like Barack Obama did when he stepped in to campaign against his ‘friend’ Forrest Claypool, who was running for office under a reform ticket in a tight race. Thanks to Obama, Claypool lost.

    Apogee (366e8b)

  71. Ah you forget this is Alaska, where everyone is on welfare and gets a check just for being there — Palin having made that bigger.

    imdw – It’s not welfare if everyone gets it, is it? Calling the state distributions welfare is just liberal spin. Isn’t welfare typically needs based?

    daleyrocks (d9ec17)

  72. SPQR wrote: lrhar, if Obama knows how to do that [“get Al-Qaeda”], why has he been keeping that secret so far? Instead of doing all those great things, he’s been loafing in the Senate doing zip.

    This is reminiscent of John Kerry’s refrain that he knew how to get other nations on board in the WOT, but that he wasn’t going to reveal how unless he was elected.

    What a patriot.

    L.N. Smithee (fb4c08)

  73. imdw: Either take hits off the bong OR post comments. Don’t do both.

    L.N. Smithee (fb4c08)

  74. “I hope being able to mention more than one supreme court opinion you dislike isn’t how you detect lawyers from non-lawyer.”

    Biographies and familiarity with the candidates is the usual way, imdw.

    daleyrocks (d9ec17)

  75. “Except that she didn’t run on ‘more free money’. She ran on transparency and anti-corruption, and as much as you’d like to belittle it, your implication that she was ‘politics as usual’ simply doesn’t jibe with the facts.”

    I think her economics are usual for Alaska and many other politicians would act similarly in favor of their home state. Its what the home state wants and I think a politician is wrong to ignore what its people would like and would be benefited by.

    Which is not to say that she hasn’t found other ways to distinguish herself, both negatively and positively. But this does explain why she doesn’t seem to have a straightforward GOP ideology on economics.

    “imdw – It’s not welfare if everyone gets it, is it?”

    If you say so. I think economists call it a transfer payment, rather than welfare. I don’t see a need for it to be needs based.

    imdw (57ace9)

  76. “The clip weakens her in general. On one hand the interview weakens whatever pro-choice credentials she had — she repeats that she wants states to regulate abortions, rather than devolving it to individual women. On the other, it also weakens her pro-life credentials — she doesn’t know the code word case, dred scott, and doesn’t know about other abortion / privacy jurisdprudence, like Griswold and Casey.”

    omdw – From tour #55 – You persistently misrepresent what Palin says. She wants the people of individual states to decide whether and how to regulate abortion, a Federalist position. Since that is a departure from the staus quo you view that as anti-choice. That’s your perspective, but that’s not what she is saying. Try to get it right.

    daleyrocks (d9ec17)

  77. Apogee wrote: Actually, when they went looking for ‘dirt’, they found ‘rumor’, and printed it as though it was ‘fact’.

    True dat. Burned-out train wreck and rabid Obama worshipper Jann Wenner’s Us Weekly mag created a cover for the next edition accusing Gov. Palin of “lies” and “scandal,” but when challenged by Fox News’ Megyn Kelly, the editor suggested that the “lies” they referred to were the lies being told about her.

    Uh huh.

    Methinks that they bought hook, line and sinker the crapola about Trig being her grandchild rather than hers, and created the cover hoping to fill in the details later…except that there were no details. Oh well, some damage was done, and that was their intention.

    As recently as yesterday, the Boston Globe (parent company: NYT) was still pawning off the rape kit lie as truth despite there being a complete absence of evidence backing the story Tony Knowles (The Dem Palin defeated and Obama supporter) told the scandal-seeking succubi.

    L.N. Smithee (fb4c08)

  78. “If you say so. I think economists call it a transfer payment, rather than welfare.”

    imdw – I think it does make a difference with liberals playing up Alaska as the biggest welfare state in the country to diminish her conservative credentials. What they ignore is the federal ownnership of the natural resources and difference between the “dividend” programs in Alaska and more traditional “Big Society” vote generating but failed welfare programs that liberals resist reforming.

    So yes, it does make a difference how the programs are framed.

    daleyrocks (d9ec17)

  79. I think her economics are usual for Alaska …”

    That’s a pretty strong statement for someone who knows didly about Alaska; but then, no one here is surprised by this.

    AOracle (ec995e)

  80. The Obama supporters turn incredibly weak when confronted by Palin’s record of transparency, anti-corruption and fair-market rules.

    Apparently, if it isn’t a smear-based rumor, there is simply no interest whatsoever from the left.

    Yet they claim to applaud the very kinds of actions that Palin has already taken – Open bids for a gas pipeline contract that was awarded fairly and that allowed what had been a stalled project (due to a large extent to the opacity of the pre-Palin process) to continue.

    Apogee (366e8b)

  81. I said this on the day they picked her – Sarah Palin’s only problem is Sarah Palin. She’s a high achiever, and she’s psyched herself out due to the lightning acceleration to national politics combined with her self-expectations.

    I support her because of her accomplishments, and because I want someone in DC with that kind of sensibility. Throughout history, a great orator isn’t great just because of their words, their greatness must also emanate from their deeds.

    Great leaders get it, and Sarah Palin gets it. The pressure she places on herself is why she’s an achiever, and handling it is her greatest obstacle.

    Apogee (366e8b)

  82. Damn, I wondered where Harpo has been hiding the past couple of months. He used to be a regular troll at Riehl World View. His drunken rants there are legendary.

    I guess he got a little tired of the regulars bashing him for being a plaugerist and rehashing the Top Ten Moonbat Talking Points ad nasium!

    Harpo I guess after being bitch slapped there for so long you turned to Patterico for your lingering troll fix.

    The sheer number of posts there have dropped like a rock without his dozens of snippy little three line posts. And he never provides a link to anything! Like his hero Biden he just helps himself to someone else’s work and makes it his own!

    Harpo, are you still hooking the ball? We can’t have you moonbats hitting it to the RIGHT can we?

    SacTownMan (ae11ba)

  83. Bush is the worst two-time President we have ever seen (an indictment of not only him but his electorate as well). Pallin is the worst VP candidate we have ever seen. She would be fine as a VP if not for the fact that the VP is next in line to be Prez.

    Terry Gain, who also seems to have run away, puts forth quite a bit of wishful thinking spoken as fact.

    pd (f4a8b8)

  84. Biden, Kerry and Edwards are simply idiots. Obama is a Marxist flipflopping to disguise his thug and terrorist connections. McCain is good (not great) on defense and the WOT and pathetic on free speech, liberty and capitalism. Hillary’s only qualification and justification was being the long-suffering wife of a serial-philandering president.

    Sarah Palin looks awfully good by comparison to all of the above. Tonight’s debate ought to be a lot of fun because Joe Biden is a dependable fool AND detestable. A 4 point Gallup lead for Obama on October 2 is very likely a 4 – 6 point win for McCain on November 4, in which case we will need huge sanitariums in every major city to hold all the P.E.S.T. sufferers in the Democrat party after that.

    If Obama does win, watch for the worst backlash against the Dems the following 2 – 4 years that we have seen in our lifetimes. Just the view from a female conservative and former lefty Dem.

    Peg C. (48175e)

  85. Terry Gain, who also seems to have run away, puts forth quite a bit of wishful thinking spoken as fact.Comment by pd — 10/2/2008 @ 2:53 am

    Run away? Are you always this stupid? I was in bed, long before 2:53 AM.

    Run away from what? No one responded substantively or otherwise to my last comment, so only a liberal moron would suggest I’ve run away.

    And pd you haven’t posted one fact or reason why my thinking is wishful. This is ironic for someone who supports a candidate who believes you can simply walk away without devastating repercussions from a war with Al Qaeda – who declared war on the United States in 1996, and has waged war ever since.

    But then, Obama doesn’t understand this war, as he proved with his position on The Surge, and his position that he’s going to persuade the Euroweenies to put their lives on the line in Afghanistan.

    Obama is so clueless about this war that he doesn’t understand that al Qaeda hass been dealt a devastating and demoralizing defeat in Iraq. And its reputation among Muslims is now in the tolet as a result of its strategy of attempting to drive the United states out of Iraq by the mass killing of innocent Iraqis.

    And if they had not been fighting the United States in Iraq the past four years al Qaeda would have been fighting the United States in Afghanistan.

    It was Al Qaeda, that couldn’t fight a two front war with the United States. Obama didnt merely take his eye of the ball. He doesn’t even know what the ball is.

    Terry Gain (aab754)

  86. Power Line has a very nice video of the real Sarah Palin. Congratulations to the Huffington Post for demonstrating some objectivity. If this link doesn’t work, the video may be seen at Power Line or presumably accessed at YouTube.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UYaJkWUBP3s

    Terry Gain (aab754)

  87. Wow, the link works. Pretty good for a 61-year-old. And to think I was a leftist into my early 30s.

    Of course it’s pretty easy when the smart host gives us a link icon. Much easier than trying to figure out how to HTML the url.

    Terry Gain (aab754)

  88. “. She wants the people of individual states to decide whether and how to regulate abortion, a Federalist position. Since that is a departure from the staus quo you view that as anti-choice.”

    I view it as anti-choice because she’d take choice away from women and give it to state governments. “pro-choice” doesn’t mean states get to choose, doesn’t mean the governments or elections choose. It means each individual chooses. No matter how much she uses the word “choice,” if she doesn’t support a woman’s right to choose, she’s not pro-choice.

    I really don’t see why this is controversial. She was in part picked by, and people on the base are excited about, her pro-life anti-choice credentials. Its nothing to hide.

    “What they ignore is the federal ownnership of the natural resources and difference between the “dividend” programs in Alaska and more traditional “Big Society” vote generating but failed welfare programs that liberals resist reforming.”

    So correct me if I am wrong: In Alaska, they take federal resources and spread them to Alaksans only. In the rest of the US, we take money from all of the US and spread them to all of the US.

    imdw (438d74)

  89. Folks – imdw was saying that Palin was pro-choice in a prior thread. Today, anti-choice.

    So correct me if I am wrong: In Alaska, they take federal resources and spread them to Alaksans only. In the rest of the US, we take money from all of the US and spread them to all of the US.

    Would you care to expand on this, or should we just take your idiocy at face value?

    JD (f7900a)

  90. “Folks – imdw was saying that Palin was pro-choice in a prior thread. Today, anti-choice.”

    I said I was open to her being pro-choice. We are finding out about her, after all. I have an open mind and if she’s pro-choice then I’ll accept that. Someone posted her using a lot of pro-choice language… talking about wanting women to choose a certain way, etc… So I figured she was pro-choice. I accepted it because after all, y’all wouldn’t lie to me.

    But then I realized she supports states having the ability to regulate abortions. Which is not pro-choice.

    imdw (23c2b4)

  91. You can try to spin it however you like, imdw/Bob. The simple fact is that there is no evidence that Gov. Palin has taken no steps to take away this choice from women.

    JD (5f0e11)

  92. Comment by imdw — 10/2/2008 @ 5:37 am

    The Oil Dividend is derived from the extraction of crude from State Lands. Therefore, that oil is quite properly the property of the citizens of Alaska, and the funds derived from it is disbursed to those citizens.
    The fact that the Federal Government owns 2/3rds or more of all of the land in Alaska, which is not available for taxation, underpins the Oil Dividend program, so that Alaska’a citizens, who must fund state and local programs absent any property tax receipts from their largest property owner, are compensated for the high level of property taxation that must be levied to fund state and local activity.
    Of course, the concept of a State trying to live within its’ means, and only doing those things that truely need doing, is anathema in today’s political climate.
    Go, Alaska!

    AOracle (0e000d)

  93. AOracle – Your response will either be summarily ignored, or the response will be wildly off topic.

    JD (f7900a)

  94. Even if the voters of a state decide there should be virtually no restrictions on abortion, that is anti-choice to imdw, because it is different than the judicially imposed mandate we have now. The problem is that she is afraid of what voters actually think of her radical agenda. It is similar to how Massachusetts and California got gay marriage, through juducial fiat rather than through the will of the people. Ballot measures for gay marriage to date have failed everywhere they have failed. Saying allowing the people of a stste to decide is anti-choice is just a giant red herring to protect the status quo.

    daleyrocks (d9ec17)

  95. imdw wrote:

    I said I was open to her being pro-choice. We are finding out about her, after all. I have an open mind and if she’s pro-choice then I’ll accept that. Someone posted her using a lot of pro-choice language… talking about wanting women to choose a certain way, etc… So I figured she was pro-choice. I accepted it because after all, y’all wouldn’t lie to me.

    Maybe if I smack my forehead on my desk a couple of times, that will begin making sense.

    But then I realized she supports states having the ability to regulate abortions. Which is not pro-choice.

    No, it is not “pro-choice.” It’s pro-Constitution.

    L.N. Smithee (b048eb)

  96. Hmm. In response to 44…. I think it is hilarious that only the leftists get accused of soliciting prostitution.

    paul s (c313be)

  97. tell us: What does Obama stand for?

    Expanded healthcare coverage, subsidized for those who can’t afford it. Drastic overhaul of the private health insurance system. Domestic spending on clean renewable energy and mass transit. Renewed competition through antitrust work and regulation in broadband and other high-tech service industries.
    A sane counterterror strategy with a realistic understanding of the limits of hard power. The willingness to raise taxes on those who can afford it to plug the gaping holes in our fiscal system, and the concurrent promise to avoid gutting social security and medicare like flopping fish.

    See, you swim around in this echo chamber of half-truths, cherry-picked misinterpretations, and endless sarcastic worst-case evaluations of Obama and everyone like him, you actually come to believe your own bullsh*t stereotypes. You *really* think liberals everyone can’t name something Barack Obama stands for? Do you ever test this out by talking to liberals in the real world? The kind of poo-flinging fights you have down here do not count.

    Now, what does Sarah Palin stand for – in terms of policy changes? Please name three. Hell, name two. I’d be impressed with one.

    glasnost (a6ffe0)


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