Patterico's Pontifications

3/8/2021

Trump Strikes Out, And The GOP Has Some Decisions To Make

Filed under: General — Dana @ 5:02 pm



[guest post by Dana]

While Trump claimed that post-election lawsuits would result in a reversal of the 2020 election, it appears that the plan to overturn a legitimate election wasn’t quite the winning strategy he had envisioned:

Former president Donald Trump has officially lost all of his postelection legal challenges in the US Supreme Court, after the court announced Monday that the justices had refused to take up his final case out of Wisconsin.

Trump and his Republican allies lost more than 60 lawsuits in state and federal courts challenging President Joe Biden’s wins in Wisconsin and a handful of other key states. They petitioned the Supreme Court to hear a small number of these cases, and the justices either rejected them right away or didn’t take any action before Biden was sworn in on Jan. 20, a clear sign that they wouldn’t interfere.

The justices didn’t address any of Trump’s arguments — either on the substance of the challenge or his arguments for keeping it alive after Biden took office — in Monday’s order, simply including it on a long list of cases that they were declining to hear.

Most telling:

Trump and his allies had used postelection legal challenges to promote lies about widespread voter fraud, and they denounced the judicial system, including the Supreme Court, as biased when they repeatedly lost. Judges at every level — including some who were nominated by Trump — concluded that these cases were either procedurally deficient or, after reviewing the evidence, meritless. The only case Republicans won, in Pennsylvania state court, involved a small number of absentee ballots that arrived in Pennsylvania after Election Day and were nowhere near enough to change the results.

Trump has been a polarizing figure throughout his tenure, certainly, but there can be no doubt that his post-election actions only served to further polarize the nation. However, another thing the post-election chaos served to accomplish was to force the hand of Republicans so that Americans could see where they stood on Trump. In turn, it also served to expose how much influence and power the former president has in the Party. Since the waning days of his second term, we’ve seen Republicans break ranks and vote their conscience to impeach the former president, followed by other Republicans voting to convict him. Those same independent-minded individuals were then rebuked by their fellow members for going against Trump. They chose to look out for their own political futures by determining that supporting Trump by censuring his opponents was the more profitable route to take. With that, there are now six Republican senators that have announced their retirements, thus giving the Democrats potential openings in certain states. Just today, Sen. Roy Blunt announced that he was retiring:

In announcing his retirement, Blunt joins GOP Sens. Rob Portman of Ohio, Pat Toomey of Pennsylvania, Richard Shelby of Alabama and Richard Burr of North Carolina, all of whom opted against seeking reelection in 2022. Sens. Chuck Grassley of Iowa and Ron Johnson of Wisconsin have yet to reveal their plans.

Blunt’s decision opens the door for a Trump-aligned candidate to win the seat given that Missouri continues to be Trump country. Trump easily won the state in both elections. After the election, Blunt declined to address Joe Biden as the president-elect and instead sent Trump a congratulatory telegram. He later voted to acquit Trump in February.

Anyway, the retirees (as it stands) will have some level of influence within the GOP and the options are open:

…Senate Republicans not seeking reelection could set up contested primaries highlighting divisions between far-right, Trump-aligned Republicans and the old guard of the party.

No matter who the “old guard” candidates might be, it’s guaranteed that they will face a full-throttle crazy train boring down on them in an effort to run them right off the tracks:

Blunt and other retiring Republicans avoid a congressional election in which ex-President Donald Trump plans to a major role, forcing GOP candidates to take a stand on his divisive presidency.

Republican strategist Liz Mair said there a “trend” of mainstream conservative Republicans “walking away from an environment in which traditional conservatism has been little rewarded, but jumping on crazy trains has been.”

The result, she said, could be a series of elections “that pit diehard liberals against a nuttier, and often deeply un-conservative and ethically-compromised, breed of Republican.”

All aboard!

–Dana

105 Responses to “Trump Strikes Out, And The GOP Has Some Decisions To Make”

  1. Hello.

    Dana (fd537d)

  2. Choo choo!

    norcal (72c45c)

  3. So, one party controls the country by the slimmest of margins, to the point where Senators may be forced to return to Washington to satisfy a quorum and the Democrats intend to nuke the last vestiges of the old republic, along with the filibuster. We are now told that it isn’t really that bulwark of Democracy it was in 2017, but the last vestige of slavery.

    The other party? I guess it depends on how much you renounce Trump and all his works. To many Republicans he is the leader of the opposition. The Chief Dissenter. And his access to the public media is shut off by government-permitted monopolies.

    Am I the only one who finds this a very dangerous precedent. If you do not defend the speech of the one you most hate, you do not defend any speech.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  4. tl;dr Doesn’t Biden look a lot like Palpatine?

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  5. The GOP-anon wing is assuming Trump won’t be under indictment in 2022. And that he hadn’t gone bankrupt.

    Appalled (1a17de)

  6. The GOP-anon wing is assuming Trump won’t be under indictment in 2022. And that he hadn’t gone bankrupt.

    That may be, and I would much rather he was convicted for treason.

    But when the entire “independent” communications and web oligarchy bans him from the public square right after it’s clear that the new administration would really like that to happen, one wonders what we have become. Voltaire is rolling over in his grave.

    And when the people cheer this uncivil behavior call others “fascists” I wonder if they own mirrors.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  7. whew, was worried we’d stop talking about Trump

    JF (3efb60)

  8. whew, was worried we’d stop talking about Trump

    JF (3efb60) — 3/8/2021 @ 7:09 pm

    JF, unfortunately Trump is very much a part of the Republican Party, and clearly has power and influence in the path it chooses to take. Let alone the candidates he will push. And unfortunately, until he is excised from the Party or they decide to pull away from him, he will continue to be a part of the political landscape. Are we to not speak about him in light of that?

    Dana (fd537d)

  9. No matter who the “old guard” candidates might be, it’s guaranteed that they will face a full-throttle crazy train boring down on them in an effort to run them right off the tracks

    That;s projecting more than a year in advance and many more things besides an indictment or trial could cause this not to happen. Losing elections can, but are there some elections before most of them happen?

    Sammy Finkelman (09d1ac)

  10. Not that I ever will, but should I ever want to, I can call Rosie O’Donnell a slob and a fat pig all by myself. I don’t need Trump to be my voice.

    What on Earth are you going on about, Kevin? What sane person would want Trump to be their “chief dissenter”? The sonofab!tch is the reason the GOP is a spark away from extinguishment in national politics.

    nk (1d9030)

  11. One of the falsities that Trump is promoting is that he doesn’t harm the chances of a Republican wining a general election for the House or Senate, but helps it.

    Sammy Finkelman (09d1ac)

  12. Twitter and Facebook etc. didn’t just say “we won’t let him use our platforms because we hate him.” Some people at those companies thought he was getting more indulgence than an ordinary person would get. He was banned only after he had used those platforms to threaten the peaceful transfer of power. There was good reason to fear that he would continue to be a public menace.

    He wasn’t some poor rube who couldn’t get his voice heard. He was the most powerful person in the land, and he abused his power. Actions have consequences–or they should, though Trump has usually found a way to slither out of accountability. But he can still go on his favorite TV and radio shows. He hasn’t been totally banned “from the public square.”

    He also hasn’t shown himself to be a great champion of free speech if it disfavors himself. He has complained about what he thinks the media shouldn’t be allowed to say. He wanted to make it easier to sue reporters, and he’s known to require very strict NDAs. Now he has ordered GOP organizations not to use his name or image for fundraising. So he’s not a compelling poster-boy for victims of “censorship.”

    Radegunda (f4d5c0)

  13. @10

    How dare you? Trump supporters are no more insane than your average cult member.

    norcal (01e272)

  14. And unfortunately, until he is excised from the Party or they decide to pull away from him, he will continue to be a part of the political landscape.

    And so long as he is excised from the public square, people will remember the best and never hear the worst. Loose the Kraken! Let Trump be Trump[!

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  15. 74,000,000 trump voters say byb bye! Don’t let the door hit you on the way out corporate shill roy blunt. Populism not free trade conservatism now is in charge of the republican party. 74,000,000 voters have decided its trump’s party now. You may think populists are rinos but you are the rinos now. The GOP doesn’t have a decision to make they have already made it and you know it. What part of NO! don’t you understand?

    asset (0b6b00)

  16. @15

    There have been periods of populism throughout our nation’s history. They don’t last long.

    Populism is one of those things that people look back on and say, “Well, it sure sounded good at the time.”

    norcal (01e272)

  17. @15

    800 people stormed that capital. They didn’t want populist goals. They weren’t asking for a higher minimum wage, or stronger unions, or a ban on imported electronics.

    They wanted to hang mike pence for certifying a fair election. Fly confederate flags.

    They’re not populists. They’re conspiracy theorists and white nationalists

    Time123 (9f42ee)

  18. He was banned only after he had used those platforms to threaten the peaceful transfer of power. There was good reason to fear that he would continue to be a public menace.

    I. Don’t. Care. Unless he advocated the violent overthrow of the US Government, or the assassination of officials, he has the same right to blovate on the Internet as you or I do.

    But to say this is “just because of this or that”, Google shows 214,000 hits for “Truth about 9/11″ on Facebook alone. Over 2200 pages still lament Florida 2000.

    And that’s fine. People get to speak. Even people like Donald Trump. How can someone, on the one had say that they defend everyone’s right to speak and then watch as someone [they despise] has that right stripped from him. Oh, but he can buy newspaper ads (no, he can’t) or set up a soapbox in Central Park (fine, but no bullhorn, and someone would sue him for hurting their feelings and win).

    I very much doubt he could even set up a website and not have {Google, Microsoft, Amazon} pull the plug. We have never had the leader of a major party unable to address citizens with methods available to nearly everyone else. It. is. a. disgrace. More of one than Trump is.

    Some day, when folks like Patterico are barred from the Net, I’ll be able to say “I told you so when…” but of course I won’t be able to either.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  19. Vae victis!

    nk (1d9030)

  20. Now he’s taking steps to reduce funding to the GOP. Surely he’ll use the money to help advance policy goals and drive a broad victory. Lmao

    Time123 (9f42ee)

  21. I. Don’t. Care. Unless he advocated the violent overthrow of the US Government, or the assassination of officials, he has the same right to blovate on the Internet as you or I do.

    And Twitbook has the same right to kick you off their platform as they did him. That’s the beauty of this Constitutional Republic in which we live.

    Colonel Klink (Ret) (1367c0)

  22. Your points are causing me to think, Kevin. I hate it when that happens! (j/k)

    Twitter and Google are between a rock and a hard place. Let a cult leader use their bullhorns, or refuse speech they don’t like. I can see bad outcomes with either choice.

    They do seem like virtual monopolies. I’m willing to listen to arguments in favor of breaking them up so that there is healthy competition.

    norcal (01e272)

  23. @16. There have been periods of populism throughout our nation’s history. They don’t last long.

    Long enough.

    Populism is one of those things that people look back on and say, “Well, it sure sounded good at the time.”

    Reaganomics, Reaganoptics, Reaganaurics. 😉

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  24. How dare you? Trump supporters are no more insane than your average cult member.

    Pierre Delecto.=mike-drop=

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  25. Reaganomics, Reaganoptics, Reaganaurics. 😉

    DCSCA (f4c5e5) — 3/8/2021 @ 8:20 pm

    What’s the deal with you and Reagan? Did he not pick you to be on his dodgeball team?

    norcal (01e272)

  26. You can’t claim monopoly and then list a bunch of different companies are a monopoly, or are they a keiretsu, a cartel? Also, editorial control is unrelated to any practice defined under the Sherman act, Clayton act, or the Robinson-Patman act. Words have meaning, monopoly doesn’t have any context in this discussion, in any way.

    You can’t just complain about thing 1 and equate it to thing 2. Different things are…different.

    Colonel Klink (Ret) (1367c0)

  27. > Am I the only one who finds this a very dangerous precedent.

    It is ABSOLUTELY a very dangerous precedent.

    One of the things I’ve said continually since the summer of 2016 is that part of the problem Trump presents is that he would create situations where both letting him do his thing *and* trying to stop him would involve a trade-off between different things, both of which cause serious damage to the republic.

    It’s a dangerous precedent.

    But letting him tweet is *also* dangerous.

    We have to pick our poison, here. There are no options which are not poisonous.

    aphrael (4c4719)

  28. If these social media giants were Trump supporters, and wouldn’t let any speech from Trump’s biggest opponent appear on their platforms, would that be okay? I shudder at the thought of it, because I hate Trump.

    norcal (01e272)

  29. Having sworn an oath to preserve, protect and defend the Constitution, he transmitted a message saying “We love you” to a fascist mob attacking our nation’s capital to reverse the outcome of a fair election and install him as dictator.

    There is nothing “dangerous” about silencing him, but molten lead would have done the job better.

    Dave (1bb933)

  30. “Reaganomics, Reaganoptics, Reaganaurics.”

    DCSCA: 831,143 Windmill: 0

    AJ_Liberty (a4ff25)

  31. Kevin, if you go into some other privately owned building and scream rude things at people, they will removed you from the building. I am more sympathetic to the idea that Amazon controls such a large number of servers that host public websites that they might count as a public utility (far more likely IMO than either twitter or facebook). Trump happens to like twitter, but that doesn’t remove twitter’s right of free association (or non-association in this case).

    Nic (896fdf)

  32. Amazon hosts less than 2% of web endpoints, and less than 1% of internet traffic traverses it’s network. Verizon, AT&T, etc control orders of magnitudes more of the infrastructure of the internet.

    Colonel Klink (Ret) (1367c0)

  33. Having sworn an oath to preserve, protect and defend the Constitution, he transmitted a message saying “We love you” to a fascist mob attacking our nation’s capital to reverse the outcome of a fair election and install him as dictator.

    Look, I realize we all got the same false dichotomy of “fascism is the polar opposite of communism” political calculus chart in middle school, but that doesn’t make it so.

    Factory Working Orphan (f916e7)

  34. Kevin,

    You keep implying that Democrats claimed the filibuster was the Bulwark of Democracy in 2017. What’s your evidence for that? They used the tool available to slow down the crap being shoveled their way. But I don’t recall very many, if any, proudly defending it as democratic. Mostly you got the older D senators saying it was part of the tradition of the Senate.

    I look forward to the day, (hoping Manchin’s recent remarks mean something) when the filibuster is rarely used because the minority actually has to put some work into blocking legislation advocated by the minority.

    And yes, the filibuster has a racist history. Are you denying it, or simply choosing to claim that racism stopped somewhere in the 70’s?

    Victor (4959fb)

  35. @30 :) Good one.

    norcal (01e272)

  36. I saw an interview with Adam Kinzinger last night. He’s a true and authentic conservative. When asked if he was worried about being primaried or losing in the midterms, his answer was impressive. He spoke of soldiers in the military putting their lives on the line on the battlefield in the fight for freedom. He had joined the Air Force and became a pilot after 9-11, and he still flies for the National Guard, while serving in the House. Then he said, “When you’re willing to put your job on the line, you’re free.”

    He’s not afraid of losing an election, because he’s well liked in his district, which he won by 8 more points than Trump in the last election. He stands for what he believes in and wants to return the Republican party to its original core principles. The state party in Illinois censured him for voting to impeach Trump. There are only a handful of representatives and senators like him in Congress, and we need more of them.

    The Grotesquely Obsequious Party has lost its way under Trump. Not one Republican voted for Biden’s corona virus relief bill, not one. The Democrats had to pass it on a strict party line vote. I think the Republicans will come to regret that, because the bill had overwhelmingly widespread bipartisan support among the American people, millions of whom are suffering in this pandemic.

    That’s why I believe the luster will fade off the gilded Trump rose over the next year or so, especially as the state prosecutions and civil lawsuits make their way through the courts. Yeah, he’s got a lot of money in his PACs and joint Super PAC with the RNC, hundreds of millions, but even the RNC is tired of his act.

    I found it hilarious that the RNC laughed off his cease and desist letter on not using his brand name or image in their advertisements and campaigns. He guards his name and image with extreme jealousy, because they’re all he really has left.

    https://www.politico.com/news/2021/03/08/rnc-trump-cease-and-desist-474412

    It’s ridiculous. Who does this guy think he is, a golden boy? Orange is not gold. He’s a fat, bald, old man with a bad toupee, on the verge of bankruptcy for the fifth time. Besides, he already gave the RNC chair permission to use his name and image in the midterms and the next election.

    Trump is a bad joke. Oh, he’ll donate to his loyalists and hold rallies for his cult followers in the midterms, but I doubt that will have the intended effect. He will be forever remembered as a one term loser, and a sore one at that.

    Gawain's Ghost (b25cd1)

  37. Are we to not speak about him in light of that?
    Dana (fd537d) — 3/8/2021 @ 7:29 pm

    Of course you can. But there is a lot going on in the world that does not involve Trump and if you aren’t careful, you’ll miss it.

    Hoi Polloi (b28058)

  38. There are only a handful of representatives and senators like him in Congress, and we need more of them.

    Yeah, we need more like him, who whined last fall about Trump’s effort to pull out troops out of Afghanistan after nearly 20 years, claiming that it was “weak” to give “our enemies” a withdrawal date. For someone who flies for the Air Force, you’d think this dingus would know about SOFAs, such as the one Bush signed before he left office that had a hard withdrawal date of our troops from Iraq.

    Or ones like Liz Cheney, who actually voted to block the funding to make it happen. Support Da Troopz! by keeping them deployed in a place where our real, actual mission there was accomplished nearly ten years ago.

    Not one Republican voted for Biden’s corona virus relief bill, not one. The Democrats had to pass it on a strict party line vote. I think the Republicans will come to regret that, because the bill had overwhelmingly widespread bipartisan support among the American people, millions of whom are suffering in this pandemic.

    Huh, are we running this line that a bill which gave the Gates Foundation $3.5 billion was somehow a victory for “the people”?

    Factory Working Orphan (f916e7)

  39. What do you think the Gates Foundation will do with the money? The type of charitable ventures they’ve done so far, or to buy yachts for the Gates?

    Victor (4959fb)

  40. Why does a foundation run by a billionaire need Congressional funding?

    Factory Working Orphan (f916e7)

  41. Fair’s fair. Trump got all the credit for the first stimulus, up to and including having his name on the checks, so it was only fair that the Senate Republicans, every single one of the political dunces, should entirely oppose this one and let Biden have all the credit.

    nk (1d9030)

  42. Now it’s up to the Republican voters. They should also stand up for their principles and send that $1,400 check back or, at the very least, refrain from donating a penny of it to the Republican Party or any Republican candidate or PAC.

    nk (1d9030)

  43. #43

    OK, so the elites are using selective enforcement to abrogate the law. What would you do about it? (And if your answer comes back to Trump, just note that he kind of did this too.)

    Appalled (1a17de)

  44. Do you suggest denying federal funding to all foundations, or only those begun by billionaires?

    Apparently Trump is determined to divert all that fine GOP cash into his own pockets. Instead of donating your 1,400 check to the Republican party, you are directed to send all money directly to Trump himself who, will certainly, use it for good purposes.

    Victor (4959fb)

  45. Regarding Blunt… he telegraphed his potential retirement a loooooong time ago, nearly after his last re-election. So, in this case I don’t think it has anything to do with the direction of the party in the future.

    While there’s plenty of “Trumpy” candidates in MO, the one to keep an eye out is the current AG Eric Schmitt. He gained national attention when intervening the Kim Gardner v. McCloskey ordeal.

    The WTF pick is Eric Greiten who does have has fans in MO, is sending trial balloons for the US Senate, but I’m not sure how he’d do since he’s nuked his relationship with much of MO state politics. (sidebar: if you want a naked carpetbagging politician, he’s your man.)

    But the darkhorse, my pick in fact, is Ann Wagner. She’s well established in the state/national party and while not a full-on bandwagon populist, she’s do fine with the MAGA-voters in MO.

    whembly (ae0eb5)

  46. I agree with Mair’s observation about traditional, conservatives leaving the Republican party, resigning or decided not to run for re-election, because the environment is inhospitable to them. But I wonder of she gets the reference that those who may replace them prefer jumping on “crazy trains.”

    It’s from Ozzy Osbourne himself.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FVovq9TGBw0

    Black Sabbath was my favorite band when I was young. I was in the seventh grade, visiting with a friend on the weekend, when his older brother came in and said, “Guys, you’ve got to listen to this.” Black Sabbath, Master of Reality. I had never heard anything like it before, and it blew my mind.

    People call it heavy metal, but actually it’s heavy jazz. Anthony Iommi had been trained as a classical guitarist. When a circular saw accidentally cut the tips of his right hand fingers off, on his last day of work at the steel factory, he designed rubber caps to put over his fingertips, because he wasn’t about to give up on playing the guitar and forming a band. These caps allowed him to form a new sound with heavy distortion.

    Black Sabbath is one of the most misunderstood bands. Did you know they are all Catholics? Yeah, the primary lyricist, bassist Terrence Butler, had been in seminary school studying to be a priest, but he dropped out to join Iommi in forming a band. Their rhythms and leads are extraordinarily complex. Originally to be named Earth, they switched to Black Sabbath. That’s why their songs are more appropriately called apocalyptic, with dark religious overtones. Iron Man, for example is really a song about the Second Coming, Judgement Day, on a Black Sabbath.

    Next to join was drummer William Ward. He plays a Slingerland Octoplus, one of the most complicated drum sets there is, with two bass, a snare and five drums, high hat and multiple cymbals, a cow bell, wood tom-toms, and dangling chimes. Ward is an incredible drummer, and his style fits perfectly with Iommi’s and Butler’s.

    Last but not least came vocalist John Osbourne. Iommi actually recommended him, because they new each other from school. Butler thought Iommi was out of his mind–that guy is not a singer–but when heard Ozzy’s mournful wail, a new band with a new sound came into being.

    I saw the original lineup perform in three concerts, and they were unbelievable, so heavy, so dark, so ominous, so foreboding. Needless to say Ozzy is the wildest front man I’ve ever seen.

    As all great bands do they eventually broke up, because of creative differences. Iommi wanted to take a more jazzier approach, but Ozzy wanted to go heavier. So he left the band and went solo. Iommi, Butler and Ward, brought in Ronnie James Dio, who is a gifted singer. I saw that tour as well, and it was excellent but different.

    Ozzy has a knack for finding extremely talented guitar players, and Randy Rhodes was phenomenal. Like Iommi, he also was trained in classical guitar, but took a different approach to his style and invented neoclassical metal. Of course, Ozzy’s themes and lyrics in his songs were markedly different than Black Sabbath’s, reflecting more his insanity than anything else, as the title of his first solo album, Diary of a Madman, suggests.

    I never got to see Ozzy perform with Rhodes, though I did see Rhodes earlier in his career, when he was with Quiet Riot. His end is a tragic and cautionary tale. Ozzy and the rest of the band where riding the tour bus, while Rhodes and a pilot were flying in a small single-engine plane overhead. Rhodes thought it would be fun to buzz the bus, but the pilot lost control when the wheels struck the top of the bus, and they crashed and died.

    That accident practically destroyed Ozzy psychology, and he was never the same again artistically, until he rejoined Black Sabbath. Damn right I saw their reunion tour, and they were just as great as ever. I saw them for the last time in San Antonio, the day Katrina devastated New Orleans. Now, that was scary. My brother and I were watching all this destruction and devastation in the hotel room on TV, and when we got to the open air stadium, there large, dark and ominous storm clouds, thunder and lightning in the background. It was the perfect setting for a Black Sabbath concert, so apocalyptic.

    Anyway, that’s the story of Ozzy, Rhodes and “Crazy Train.” Notice in the official video link above, it’s a song about madness and insanity, tempting fate and courting death.

    That’s what these Trumpublicans are doing on their crazy trains.

    Half a dozen Senate Republicans have announced they’re retiring or decided not to run for re-election in 2022. A few more may follow in the coming months. House Tumpublicans see this an their opportunity to seek higher office, a Senate seat or a governorship.

    https://www.politico.com/news/2021/03/09/trump-allies-congress-474509

    They believe they can take back Senate majority, because Trump awards loyalists and punishes perceived enemies. They think they can win, because Trump will help them with campaign donations, rallies filled with cultists, and MAGA commercials. That’s why he sent the cease and desist letters to the RNC and committees controlled by Republicans. He wants to be large and in charge of the party, that Republicans cannot win without him.

    It’s delusional. And I don’t think it will work, because the Trump brand is tarnished.

    Gawain's Ghost (b25cd1)

  47. Bill and Belinda Gates had put $36 billion dollars of their own money into their foundation as of its last known tax return. Did I say billion? Yes, I said billion. 36 billion. How much of his own money did the corrupt orange criminal Kremlin stooge put into his phony-baloney foundation?

    nk (1d9030)

  48. Gawain’s Ghost (b25cd1) — 3/9/2021 @ 7:09 am

    It’s delusional. And I don’t think it will work, because the Trump brand is tarnished.

    I don’t know if it delusional.

    It might be what he regards as his best chance at being a very important VIP.

    If Trump can’t be president, he’d at least like to be the Leader of the Opposition.

    How is it better for him for a non-Trump, or even anti-Trump, Republican to be elected president?

    Sammy Finkelman (3997eb)

  49. nk @48.

    How much of his own money did the corrupt orange criminal Kremlin stooge put into his phony-baloney foundation?

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Donald_J._Trump_Foundation

    Until 2015, Trump contributed $5.5 million to the Trump Foundation, including money from his book, while outside donors contributed an additional $9.3 million.[30][31] His final payment to the foundation was $35,000 in 2008.[5]

    Sammy Finkelman (3997eb)

  50. GG:

    What I would add to Sammy’s thoughts is this — Trump has successfully bullied the GOP into doing what he wants since 2016. Until a lot of somebodies push back, or show that they want to push back, and have some success with that strategy, he’ll continue doing what works for him.

    A party cowed by Trump is a lot easier to keep in line. I think the McCarthys of the world like this new, cowed party, even if they have to deal with Trump’s whims from time to time.

    Trump has vulnerabilities, sure. But its lawyers and bankers that will bring him down. Not GOP politicians.

    Appalled (1a17de)

  51. Sammy,

    And how much did Trump take back out of his Foundation for personal purposes? I just know that among Clinton, Gates and Trump, only of the foundations was found to be operating illegally and shut down.

    Victor (4959fb)

  52. Trump I think would at least like to be another Andrew Jackson, wiith regard to his influence over his political party.

    https://www.history.com/topics/us-presidents/james-polk

    …. In Congress, Polk was a protégé of America’s seventh president, Andrew Jackson (1767-1845), a fellow Democrat and Tennessean who was in the White House from 1829 to 1837…

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_K._Polk

    …Another concern was the third-party candidacy of President Tyler, which might split the Democratic vote. Tyler had been nominated by a group of loyal officeholders. Under no illusions he could win, he believed he could rally states’ rights supporters and populists to hold the balance of power in the election. Only Jackson had the stature to resolve the situation, which he did with two letters to friends in the Cabinet, that he knew would be shown to Tyler, stating that the President’s supporters would be welcomed back into the Democratic fold. Jackson wrote that once Tyler withdrew, many Democrats would embrace him for his pro-annexation stance. The former president also used his influence to stop Francis Preston Blair and his Globe newspaper, the semi-official organ of the Democratic Party, from attacking Tyler. These proved enough; Tyler withdrew from the race in August.[101][102]

    …He consulted Jackson and one or two other close allies, and decided that the large states of New York, Pennsylvania and Virginia should have representation in the six-member Cabinet, as should his home state of Tennessee….Polk’s choices met with the approval of Andrew Jackson, whom Polk met with in January 1845 for the last time, as Jackson died that June.[116]

    Sammy Finkelman (3997eb)

  53. Trump runs for the nomination… and DOESN’T win??

    Damn, that would be fun to watch.

    noel (9fead1)

  54. He was banned only after he had used those platforms to threaten the peaceful transfer of power. There was good reason to fear that he would continue to be a public menace.

    I think Twitter indicated it was because his tweets were being subjected to exegesis. A tweet that h would not attend the inauguration was being interpreted, both on and off Twitter, as a signal to attack on January 20 and that won over Jack Dorsey to make the ban permanent and irrevocable because Twitter has never un-banned anyone. People at Twitter (acting as conspiracy theorists) were probably saying that this was intentional.

    Sammy Finkelman (3997eb)

  55. They better pull that scab off soon. Trump thought he had a right to win the general election. The primary? Just try denying it to him two years from now.

    All the dirty little secrets that Republicans have on him, better come out soon. We know the unethical and illegal stuff that he has done in public so just imagine what he has done behind the scenes. Do it now, while you still can.

    noel (9fead1)

  56. He was banned only after he had used those platforms to threaten the peaceful transfer of power. There was good reason to fear that he would continue to be a public menace.

    I. Don’t. Care. Unless he advocated the violent overthrow of the US Government, or the assassination of officials, he has the same right to blovate on the Internet as you or I do.

    But to say this is “just because of this or that”, Google shows 214,000 hits for “Truth about 9/11″ on Facebook alone. Over 2200 pages still lament Florida 2000.

    And that’s fine. People get to speak. Even people like Donald Trump. How can someone, on the one had say that they defend everyone’s right to speak and then watch as someone [they despise] has that right stripped from him. Oh, but he can buy newspaper ads (no, he can’t) or set up a soapbox in Central Park (fine, but no bullhorn, and someone would sue him for hurting their feelings and win).

    I very much doubt he could even set up a website and not have {Google, Microsoft, Amazon} pull the plug. We have never had the leader of a major party unable to address citizens with methods available to nearly everyone else. It. is. a. disgrace. More of one than Trump is.

    Some day, when folks like Patterico are barred from the Net, I’ll be able to say “I told you so when…” but of course I won’t be able to either.

    Kevin M (ab1c11) — 3/8/2021 @ 8:04 pm

    I’m really open to the absolute free speech argument and think things would be better if that was a more universally valued principle. I will say that their decision not to let him use their platform was based on exactly the use case you found palatable; advocating the overthrow of the US government.

    Time123 (b4d075)

  57. Victor (4959fb) — 3/9/2021 @ 7:56 am

    And how much did Trump take back out of his Foundation for personal purposes? I just know that among Clinton, Gates and Trump, only of the foundations was found to be operating illegally and shut down.

    He didn’t take much out of it but it was run far too irregularly. No active Board of Directors. No listing, (or rather, re-registering) in New York State as a “7A level charitable organization”

    He bought a painting of himself for $20,000. Objectionable, at least. He, at least twice, for a total of $258,000, used foundation money to settle legal disputes where, as part of the settlement, he agreed to make a charitable contribution. You’re not allowed to do that because then it is considered a personal benefit by the IRS.

    He coordinated a charitable donation with his political campaign. Ditto.

    In a flaw of a different kind, he also promised to make charitable donations which he never made from the foundation.

    The foundation once donated $25,000 in support of Pam Bondi’s election campaign for Florida attorney general. but that was probably mainly carelessness. Any idiot who was paying attention would know a charity can’t make a political donation, and he wasn’t short of money. But nobody was paying enough attention as to which bank account the money was coming from. According to a Trump Foundation attorney, somebody mixed up two different organizations with a similar (or the same?) name.

    “the [$25,000] contribution was made in error due to a case of mistaken identity of organizations with the same name.”

    After this came out, Donald Trump reimbursed his foundation for the $25,000 and the foundation paid a $2,500 fine for violating an IRS rule.

    It also hosted a fundraiser for Bondi at his Mar-a-Lago resort at a fee well below his normal market rate.

    Sammy Finkelman (3997eb)

  58. Huh, are we running this line that a bill which gave the Gates Foundation $3.5 billion was somehow a victory for “the people”?

    Factory Working Orphan (f916e7) — 3/9/2021 @ 5:55 am

    Source?

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  59. The Senate should go back to the original filibuster, ala “Mr. Smith Goes to Washington,” rather than merely threaten a filibuster. Make them talk.

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  60. Samuel,

    Thanks for reminding me of the details. To be honest I am surprised he even put 5 million into his foundation. This is not a man happy to let a penny fall from his grasp.

    Victor (4959fb)

  61. Huh, are we running this line that a bill which gave the Gates Foundation $3.5 billion was somehow a victory for “the people”?

    Factory Working Orphan (f916e7) — 3/9/2021 @ 5:55 am

    Source?

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8) — 3/9/2021 @ 9:13 am

    I’ll accept it as true, but I want the problem actually described. The fact that the charity was endowed by a very wealthy man doesn’t mean it’s not doing charitable work or that a government partnership with them is corrupt. The Catholic church has a lot of financial resources but it still makes sense for governments to partner with them in many areas.

    Time123 (306531)

  62. To be honest I am surprised he even put 5 million into his foundation. This is not a man happy to let a penny fall from his grasp.

    It was a tax dodge and money laundry. He recouped part from his tax obligations and part from converting it back to his use and may have still come out ahead even after the State of New York made him fork over a $2 million fine when it caught up with him.

    nk (1d9030)

  63. Do you suggest denying federal funding to all foundations, or only those begun by billionaires?

    Why does a foundation run by a billionaire need Congressional funding?

    Factory Working Orphan (f916e7)

  64. Some comrades flap their yaps without knowing what they’re talking about. Most government grants are administered by non-governmental organizations.

    nk (1d9030)

  65. D

    o you suggest denying federal funding to all foundations, or only those begun by billionaires?

    Why does a foundation run by a billionaire need Congressional funding?

    Factory Working Orphan (f916e7) — 3/9/2021 @ 10:52 am

    Lot’s of reasons are possible, in this case it appears that congress wants to partner with the Gates foundations to get COVID vaccines to poor parts of the world where the foundation has built up the infrastructure to service.

    Trump had previously promised 1.6 billion for this but the money was never allocated.

    I can understand someone not wanting to use US funds to help poor people in other countries, but what’s your hang-up about a public / private partnership?

    Bill Gates isn’t making money from this. If helping vaccinate the 3rd world is a policy goal of the US why does partnering with a charity that has built the infrastructure to do that create a problem? Do you have similar objections to partnering with Catholic charities for adoption or medical care for the poor?

    Time123 (306531)

  66. Some comrades flap their yaps without knowing what they’re talking about. Most government grants are administered by non-governmental organizations.

    nk (1d9030) — 3/9/2021 @ 11:00 am

    Ah, yes, that “principled conservatism” in action where billionaires get government cheddar for their pet projects.

    Factory Working Orphan (f916e7)

  67. Another thing Trump did was issue a conservation easement, (agreeing not to develop property) usually when a plan for developing something failed to gain approval.

    That counted as a deductible charitable deduction, because it reduced the theoretical value of his property, and probably also reduced his local property taxes.

    Sammy Finkelman (d9efdf)

  68. Source?

    Page 622.

    Some comrades flap their yaps without knowing what they’re talking about. Most government grants are administered by non-governmental organizations.

    If it has billionaire funding, it can get $3.5 billion internally.

    I can understand someone not wanting to use US funds to help poor people in other countries, but what’s your hang-up about a public / private partnership?

    The site ate my response, but what exactly is the point of providing a fund sourced by billionaires $3.5 billion in additional government debt? If this bill was designed to help “the people,” why do “the people” get a pittance of the actual spending? If the Democrats are so determined to add $1.9 trillion in spending, they could have given every US citizen $5,000 each and STILL spent less. Why is all this pork necessary?

    Factory Working Orphan (f916e7)

  69. Covid vaccines in poor parts of the world are pork? The word really has expanded its meaning.

    Victor (4959fb)

  70. @30/@35. Better one:

    “For they sow the wind, and they shall reap the whirlwind.” – Hosea 8:7

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  71. We have always had populism, not from time to time. The wealthy establishment spends most of its time surprising it. Andrew jackson and to a lesser extent thomas jefferson supported populism. William jennings bryan and some radical republicans including teddy roosevelt. FDR and huey long fought over how much populism there was to be. LBJ and tricky dick nixon fought over control of populism and reagan pretended to be a populist with their southern strategy. Bubba was another phony populist. Then came the tea party and trump. 74,000,000 voted for trump and many of the 80,000,000 were bernie supporters who held their nose and voted for biden. By the way the bernie sanders supporters just took over control of the nevada democratic party.

    asset (53b4ef)

  72. The site ate my response, but what exactly is the point of providing a fund sourced by billionaires $3.5 billion in additional government debt? If this bill was designed to help “the people,” why do “the people” get a pittance of the actual spending? If the Democrats are so determined to add $1.9 trillion in spending, they could have given every US citizen $5,000 each and STILL spent less. Why is all this pork necessary?

    Factory Working Orphan (f916e7) — 3/9/2021 @ 11:29 am

    Again, the purpose of that money is to provide vaccinations to third world countries. It’s about double what Trump had suggested. It’s funneled though the gates foundation because they have the delivery infrastructure in place and it would cost more to build that from scratch. Bill gates doesn’t make money on this.

    Do you object to the goal of vaccinating the 3rd world? To public private partnerships? Or to working the gates foundation specifically?

    Time123 (306531)

  73. Do you object to the goal of vaccinating the 3rd world? To public private partnerships? Or to working the gates foundation specifically?

    Time123 (306531) — 3/9/2021 @ 12:55 pm

    If the Democrats are so determined to add $1.9 trillion in spending, they could have given every US citizen $5,000 each and STILL spent less. Why is all this pork necessary?

    Factory Working Orphan (f916e7)

  74. Covid vaccines in poor parts of the world are pork? The word really has expanded its meaning.

    Victor (4959fb) — 3/9/2021 @ 12:12 pm

    If we have to go in to debt to do it, then yes.

    If the Democrats are so determined to add $1.9 trillion in spending, they could have given every US citizen $5,000 each and STILL spent less. Why is all this pork necessary?

    Factory Working Orphan (f916e7)

  75. @FWO@75 Because it’s in our national self-interest and isn’t pork. If the disease continues to spread rampantly in the 3rd world even after we’ve mostly controlled it in the 1st world nations it will continue to mutate and will sooner or later (at the speed this one seems to travel, probably sooner) mutate into a form that is not affected by the vaccine and we’ll have to do this whole miserable and costly process all over again. It’s spending 3 billion now to save 4 Trillion later.

    Nic (896fdf)

  76. I get it. Spending you don’t like is “pork”, particularly if it doesn’t take the form of direct cash payments to each American. You should have made that clear at the beginning.

    As for the money given to Americans, the extension of unemployment checks is an additional chunk of cash, not included in the 1400. Of course it would have been more but you can thank Manchin and 50 Republicans that it’s not.

    For that matter bailing out the pension funds of approximately 10 million American workers is also money for Americans. Do you include that as pork?

    Victor (4959fb)

  77. Do you object to the goal of vaccinating the 3rd world? To public private partnerships? Or to working the gates foundation specifically?

    Time123 (306531) — 3/9/2021 @ 12:55 pm

    If the Democrats are so determined to add $1.9 trillion in spending, they could have given every US citizen $5,000 each and STILL spent less. Why is all this pork necessary?

    Factory Working Orphan (f916e7) — 3/9/2021 @ 1:14 pm

    I get where you’re coming from and I’ll take your word that you’re sincere. But too many of the GOP budget hawks went silent when Trump ran up to the budget for me to have any faith that fiscal discipline is a goal of the GOP.

    I would say this, giving more to every american citizen wouldn’t have done much to prevent COVID outbreaks/mutations from starting in unvaccinated areas. I don’t know is this is a reasonable worry, or a this spending is a good solution. But it strikes me as a different thing then typical pork barrel spending where we send money back to the district.

    Time123 (b4d075)

  78. I get it. Spending you don’t like is “pork”, particularly if it doesn’t take the form of direct cash payments to each American. You should have made that clear at the beginning.

    As for the money given to Americans, the extension of unemployment checks is an additional chunk of cash, not included in the 1400. Of course it would have been more but you can thank Manchin and 50 Republicans that it’s not.

    For that matter bailing out the pension funds of approximately 10 million American workers is also money for Americans. Do you include that as pork?

    Victor (4959fb) — 3/9/2021 @ 1:31 pm

    My spending priorities are prudent and needful.
    Yours are waste that’s blowing up the deficient.

    😉

    And bailing out worker pensions is pure populism. No place for that in the GOP. 😉

    Time123 (b4d075)

  79. @FWO@75 Because it’s in our national self-interest and isn’t pork. If the disease continues to spread rampantly in the 3rd world even after we’ve mostly controlled it in the 1st world nations it will continue to mutate

    Coronaviruses mutate constantly. That’s why there’s no cure for the common cold. These arguments use the same logic as the ones that have kept us in the Middle East for the last 30 years.

    I get it. Spending you don’t like is “pork”, particularly if it doesn’t take the form of direct cash payments to each American. You should have made that clear at the beginning…For that matter bailing out the pension funds of approximately 10 million American workers is also money for Americans. Do you include that as pork?

    I get it. You like simping for billionaires if it means a “win” against the Republicans. There’s that “principled conservatism in action again! And those pension funds were specifically cornholed because Democratic state governors in particular led the charge to put a bullet in the heads of their own economies. Why should they get bailed out for their bad economic choices? Let them raise income taxes on their wealthiest citizens some more to cover the shortfall.

    I would say this, giving more to every american citizen wouldn’t have done much to prevent COVID outbreaks/mutations from starting in unvaccinated areas.

    Considering coronaviruses constantly mutate, preventing outbreaks is ultimately an exercise in futility. Either people adapt to the virus, or the virus mutates to a less lethal form and becomes just another mild common cold variant. The “War on COVID” is turning out to be almost as expensive as the “War on Terror” has been.

    Factory Working Orphan (f916e7)

  80. @FWO@80 That’s very fatalistic of you, but the last time we had an epidemic like this was 100 yrs ago. If we can stop this particular more deadly coronavirus it won’t mutate into a more deadly or more contagious or equally deadly and contagious form that doesn’t respond to the vaccine. So this particular danger will be significantly reduced. Maybe we get another 100 yrs before it happens again, instead of 5.

    Not all dangers are equal and not all dangers are equally unpreventable. People die in car crashes, but people wearing seatbelts die less. Paying for a seatbelt isn’t a waste of money.

    Nic (896fdf)

  81. What on Earth are you going on about, Kevin? What sane person would want Trump to be their “chief dissenter”? The sonofab!tch is the reason the GOP is a spark away from extinguishment in national politics.

    He got 75 million votes. 3/4s of the GOP love him. I know it’s crazy, but this is where the country is right now. To actually suppress the speech of the leader of one of the major parties is a Rubicon we should not cross. But we have, and those that hate him get all self-righteous about it.

    Trump is a disaster, but that does not mean we should compound it by destroying the freedoms we claim to hold.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  82. That a majority of the public now thinks that “hate speech” should be suppressed, that some politicians should be silenced by the government and its catspaws, and that those who support said politicians will take this calmly and civility is a fearsome miscalculation. I don’t know which way this will break, but I don’t see it going well either way.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  83. And Twitbook has the same right to kick you off their platform as they did him. That’s the beauty of this Constitutional Republic in which we live.

    And you cheer. Unbelievable.

    Facebook is no more independent of the government than the Post Office. Any day the government decides to break up Facebook, it can do so easily. A point not lost on them, both while Trump had the power, and later when he didn’t.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  84. But letting him tweet is *also* dangerous.

    If he conspires to overthrow the government, letting him speak in public is far less dangerous than him speaking in private.

    If Trump is a traitor, a seditious conspirator, an inciter to rebellion, fine. Try him for it. I think he’s guilty, so why not? But we are apparently as done with the Rule of Law as Trump is, and are using extrajudicial methods instead.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  85. Amazon hosts less than 2% of web endpoints, and less than 1% of internet traffic traverses it’s network. Verizon, AT&T, etc control orders of magnitudes more of the infrastructure of the internet.

    That’s just silly. You have no idea WTF you are talking about. 99% of the “end-points” are users. That’s like saying that MLB doesn’t control baseball because 99% of the people buying tickets don’t work for MLB.

    Amazon and Cloudflare each control 30-35% of cloud-based content. Google and Microsoft combine for another 20%. Everyone else fights over the other 15%.

    Sure, Trump could set up a server in his bathroom but it wouldn’t work very well due to bandwidth issues, data limits and general ISP bullsh1t. That the equivalent of pointing out that free speech still lives on at Speaker’s Corner.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  86. Anyway, I’ve made my feelings clear.

    The current situation, where a handful of people can decide who speaks in the political arena, and who does not, is intolerable. Sure, Trump is a terrible person and I wish he WOULD shut up. But, absent a criminal conviction, MAKING him shut up is an abrogation of all the things we seek to keep safe from him.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  87. @85 The problem with Trump is that he’s smart enough to incite insurrection without meeting the legal definition. For example, he threw in one “peacefully” to go with all his false and inflammatory words on January 6th. He knows all the dog whistles, code words, and innuendo that get his cult members marching.

    (Trump isn’t stupid. Lazy and preening, yes. But not stupid.)

    Hence the predicament.

    norcal (01e272)

  88. @FWO@80 That’s very fatalistic of you, but the last time we had an epidemic like this was 100 yrs ago

    Yeah, and it basically burned itself out, even with the mask rules, quarantines, and gathering restrictions that were put in place to varying degrees. 600,000 people died, and then it petered out to being just another flu bug.

    If we can stop this particular more deadly coronavirus it won’t mutate into a more deadly or more contagious or equally deadly and contagious form that doesn’t respond to the vaccine

    Coronaviruses mutate *all the time.* Again, that is why there’s no cure for the common cold. It’s why the flu still manages to kill between 25,000-60,000 people a year, even with a “vaccine” that’s basically an educated guess on what will be the most prevalent strains. You simply cannot stop them, period.

    Factory Working Orphan (f916e7)

  89. Facebook is no more independent of the government than the Post Office. Any day the government decides to break up Facebook, it can do so easily.

    Heck, the government is the reason Facebook became as big as it did, and is likely why it will remain so, on the level of long-time global megacorps like Procter and Gamble or the Big 5 defense contractors. The government is quite literally invested in its long-term stability.

    If you want to go down a rabbit hole, start doing research on In-Q-Tel, the CIA’s tech investment arm, going back to the late 90s during the dot-com boom when it was called In-Q-It. The government has had its tentacles in Big Tech for over 20 years, if not longer. We actually deluded ourselves into believing that they would develop something with the application potential of the Internet and release it into the wild without keeping a firm grip over the whole thing. What Edward Snowden revealed should have broken us of these delusions, but they persist.

    The mythology is that Facebook was this quirky start-up in a college dorm that became the world’s largest social media network through nothing but pluck and initiative. The truth is that Facebook was nothing more than a crummy MySpace clone for college campuses, and didn’t hit the big time until it got the attention of Peter Thiel and James Breyer. Thiel and Breyer have long-time links to the feds–Thiel received VC through In-Q-Tel for his Palantir start-up, while Breyer is a long-time associate with the CIA, DARPA, and the DoD, who used Accel Partners as a front group for various projects. After that angel investment, Facebook suddenly acquired the code for a cutting edge user interface and data mining capability. MySpace didn’t collapse due to competition, it went down because it didn’t have Zuck’s connections to the government’s clandestine organizations.

    It’s also why these guys getting subpeonaed for Congress is nothing more than kabuki theater; they’re a convenient scapegoat for our “representatives” to look good for the hype-tainment media, but Facebook is untouchable and they know it.

    Factory Working Orphan (f916e7)

  90. He knows all the dog whistles, code words, and innuendo that get his cult members marching.

    If you know what a dog whistle sounds like, that means you’re a dog.

    This isn’t “Winter Soldier” where Blonard Blumph says a few key phrases and people mindlessly execute his orders. Most of Trump’s supporters come from working-to-middle class backgrounds. They tend to not have a college degree and are in blue-collar professions.

    The irony is that you’re accusing Trump of using the same mind-control techniques and buzzwords that Democrats have basically accused the Republicans of using to brainwash their own voters going back to Nixon. It’s why “voting against their own interests” was such a popular, go-to catch-phrase amongst the bourgeoisie left during the 2000s and Thomas Frank was asking “What’s the Matter with Kansas?”. They had to use the “low-information” excuse because they weren’t insightful or self-aware enough to examine why exactly they’d been rejected by formerly loyal voters.

    I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again–populism doesn’t gain broad support in stable, secure, high-trust societies. It emerges when the existence of mass corruption and collusion by establishment elites to maintain their sinecures, at the expense of ordinary people, can’t be suppressed any further, OR the elites can’t distract the proles with sufficient bread and circuses.

    Factory Working Orphan (f916e7)

  91. He who pays the piper calls the tune! True then true now. Parler is doing it the right way.

    asset (6246f5)

  92. I don’t see evidence that income is a good predictor of supporting Trump. Some of those who came to The Capitol to riot on 1/6 flew in with private jets. The theory that with trump it’s the poor against the rich, and trump is the tribune of the poor or working class, besides being completely inconsistent with his entire history, doesn’t really have a good basis. Except of course on a cultural level. Trump supporters like to think of themselves as blue collar working class, regardless of their real situation.

    And also by the way, 10 million working class Americans who belong to unions should appreciate that their pensions will now actually pay them when they get old.

    Victor (4959fb)

  93. The current situation, where a handful of people can decide who speaks in the political arena, and who does not, is intolerable.

    The current situation, where a handful of people *can’t* decide who speaks in the political arena, is an innovation of the last 20 or 25 years. And I would say the jury is still out on whether it’s an improvement.

    But I also think your concerns are overwrought. Trump could very easily provide for himself the services that Twitter et al. decided to stop providing gratis. And it would pay for itself and more. A certain segment of the population can’t get enough Trump, and he has a monopoly position to sell it to them. A TrumpWorld blog, QAnon tie-ins, maybe a chain of theme-parks – it’s a license to print money.

    Dave (1bb933)

  94. “where a handful of people can decide who speaks in the political arena, and who does not, is intolerable”

    Free speech isn’t the ability to compel a private business to distribute your message….without any consideration of content. Trump can go on Fox News (or OANN or Newsmax) literally any time he wants, he is free to host pep rallies any where around the country at many accommodating venues, he can distribute emails to his heart’s delight, Talk Radio would love to have him on pedaling his Schtick, he can post on his own homepage all of his thoughts and ruminations about how evil people are out to get him and how unfair it all is, right-wing publishers would crawl over each other to distribute a book that Trump wants to prmote, and if Trump wanted to give a speech on a Manhattan corner, most news organizations would crawl over each other to get their microphone or camera optimally placed.

    This is simply a really bad example of squelching free speech

    AJ_Liberty (a4ff25)

  95. So there I was with Harry Truman, just me and him, and we were frying a couple of steaks and Harry turns to me and says “nk”, he says, “it’s sure hot in Missouri in the summer” and I says to him, I says, “Harry”, I says, “if you can’t stand the heat, get out of the kitchen” and he laughs and says “nk”, he says, “that was a great idea you had to drop a couple of atomic bombs on Japan but do you think it’s fair when the Japs don’t have any atomic bombs of their own or even airplanes?” and I says, well, I don’t say anything because I can’t think of anything to say, and he goes on, he says, “We have to think of the future”, he says, “when our enemies have bombs and airplanes and we don’t and is that a precedent we want to set?”, and I still have nothing to say so I picks up that frying pan, steaks and grease and all, I just picks it up, and wallops him over the head with it and that brought him back to his senses.

    nk (1d9030)

  96. And those pension funds were specifically cornholed because Democratic state governors in particular led the charge to put a bullet in the heads of their own economies. Why should they get bailed out for their bad economic choices? Let them raise income taxes on their wealthiest citizens some more to cover the shortfall.

    The GOP isn’t populist. Populist rhetoric is just one tool they use in pursuit of political power. I can’t think of a single populist action from the GOP that doesn’t line up with this, and couldn’t just as easily be explained by nationalism.

    Time123 (235fc4)

  97. OK, so the elites are using selective enforcement to abrogate the law. What would you do about it? (And if your answer comes back to Trump, just note that he kind of did this too.)

    Secession…

    Horatio (6daad7)

  98. Anyway, I’ve made my feelings clear.

    The current situation, where a handful of people can decide who speaks in the political arena, and who does not, is intolerable. Sure, Trump is a terrible person and I wish he WOULD shut up. But, absent a criminal conviction, MAKING him shut up is an abrogation of all the things we seek to keep safe from him.

    Kevin M (ab1c11) — 3/9/2021 @ 8:59 pm

    This isn’t the case at all. Trump has been banned from 2 platforms, Twitter and Youtube. The stated reason is that his dishonest attempt to steal the election through lies and conspiracy theories.

    He hasn’t been banned from Facebook. He hasn’t been banned from Tictok, Parler, GAP, Myspace, Newmax, Infowars, Fox, CBS, NBC, ABC, NTY Axios, the list is long.

    I think they have the right to ban him. There’s no evidence they did so as part of any governmental action, unfounded theories of conspiracy aren’t evidence. I don’t think they should have done so, but his ability to get his message our it’s meaningfully different now that it was before.

    Time123 (235fc4)

  99. I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again–populism doesn’t gain broad support in stable, secure, high-trust societies. It emerges when the existence of mass corruption and collusion by establishment elites to maintain their sinecures, at the expense of ordinary people, can’t be suppressed any further, OR the elites can’t distract the proles with sufficient bread and circuses.

    Factory Working Orphan (f916e7) — 3/9/2021 @ 10:00 pm

    Populism isn’t taking over the GOP, White Nationalism is.

    Time123 (235fc4)

  100. #43

    OK, so the elites are using selective enforcement to abrogate the law. What would you do about it? (And if your answer comes back to Trump, just note that he kind of did this too.)

    Appalled (1a17de) — 3/9/2021 @ 7:03 am

    Our laws do need to be more faithfully enforced. There’s a reasonable debate to be had about discretion and application of the law. But there’s no point in having that debate with people who only care about rule of law when it supports their desired outcomes. Kurt’s not worth taking seriously on this.

    Time123 (235fc4)

  101. Populism isn’t taking over the GOP, White Nationalism is.

    Even taking this assertion at face value–considering a Biden-voting, liberal-dominated business just had its reputation dragged through the mud because your side is seeing symbols of white nationalism everywhere it looks–it might behoove you to examine the rhetoric of anti-white animus that comes so easily from the left these days.

    If I was a working-class white person, and I had university professors, media figures, and pop culture telling me on a regular basis that I was an unconscious racist and needed to be ashamed for things I never did, and that I unfairly benefitted from anything good I had in my life (while I’m struggling to keep my family fed and a roof over their heads), then I might question as to whether these people actually had my best interests in mind, too.

    Factory Working Orphan (f916e7)

  102. Populism isn’t taking over the GOP, White Nationalism is.

    Even taking this assertion at face value–considering a Biden-voting, liberal-dominated business just had its reputation dragged through the mud because your side is seeing symbols of white nationalism everywhere it looks–it might behoove you to examine the rhetoric of anti-white animus that comes so easily from the left these days.

    If I was a working-class white person, and I had university professors, media figures, and pop culture telling me on a regular basis that I was an unconscious racist and needed to be ashamed for things I never did, and that I unfairly benefitted from anything good I had in my life (while I’m struggling to keep my family fed and a roof over their heads), then I might question as to whether these people actually had my best interests in mind, too.

    Factory Working Orphan (f916e7) — 3/10/2021 @ 6:36 am

    1. They accidentally designed the stage in the shape of an obscure Nazi symbol. It’s an unfortunate coincidence for the design company, but it happened. Not sure how noticing that is ‘anti-white’ animus.

    2. Yup, that’s the GOP’s marketing pitch. ‘elites’ look down on you because you’re white. That’s not populism, that’s just identity politics. But saying we’re the white people part while Trump supporters storm the capital carrying confederate flags and wearing pro-nazi shirts is an ugly, losing strategy. So they want to lie and call it ‘populism’. I think we’re agreeing here. 😀

    Time123 (653992)

  103. Why to you think noticing the stage was shaped like an obscure Nazi is ‘anti-white aniums’? The Nazi and the Allies were both mostly white peoples.

    Time123 (653992)

  104. 1. They accidentally designed the stage in the shape of an obscure Nazi symbol. It’s an unfortunate coincidence for the design company, but it happened. Not sure how noticing that is ‘anti-white’ animus.

    When someone is determined to see Nazis everywhere (or racism, for that matter), they’re going to find it.

    2. Yup, that’s the GOP’s marketing pitch. ‘elites’ look down on you because you’re white

    Funny, I must have missed that in the official flyers.

    But saying we’re the white people part while Trump supporters storm the capital carrying confederate flags and wearing pro-nazi shirts is an ugly, losing strategy. So they want to lie and call it ‘populism’. I think we’re agreeing here. 😀

    No, there’s really nothing we agree on here at all.

    Factory Working Orphan (f916e7)


Powered by WordPress.

Page loaded in: 0.3726 secs.