Legal Genius Nancy Pelosi: You Can’t Yell “Wolf” In A Crowded Theater
This is possibly the most entertaining political mangling of a famous quote since Dubya’s “won’t get fooled again” gaffe. Watch bubblehead Nancy give her vacant stare as she tries to defend denying a permit to organizers of an alt-right rally at Crissy Field in San Francisco. In the clip, which is from an interview done yesterday, Pelosi says that she is going to encourage the Park Service to deny a permit to the organizers. The permit has since been approved, and the rally will take place on Saturday. Enjoy some true Pelosi brilliance as Pelosi is asked how the Park Service could deny the permit, given the barrier of First Amendment:
INTERVIEWER: How could the Park Service justify denying that organization their free speech rights?
PELOSI: Because the Constitution does not say that a person can shout, yell wolf in a crowded theater. You are endangering people, then you don’t have a constitutional right to do that.
This clip came to me via Ken White at Popehat, who has spent a lot of time exposing the fundamental dishonesty of the actual phrase Pelosi was struggling to articulate: that you can’t yell fire in a crowded theater. In this post, for example, Ken describes the famous statement by Oliver Wendell Holmes as “the most famous and pervasive lazy cheat in American dialogue about free speech.”
The argument Pelosi is trying (and failing) to make is that violence will result from the alt-right rally. But the mere possibility that people on either side of an issue might get passionate at a rally, and that those passions could spill over into to violence, is not a valid reason to deny a permit.
Pelosi is, um, crying wolf here.
P.S. My constitutional law professor at U.T. Austin, Jack Balkin (now at Yale) once told our class that he had, in fact, yelled “fire” in an actual crowded theater. Nothing came of it.
UPDATE: On Twitter, someone pointed out to me that the group in question denies it is alt-right. The Mercury News article linked in this post says:
Previous events organized by the same Portland-based group, Patriot Prayer, have attracted white nationalist contingents and devolved into violence.
The leader of the group is a Trump supporter. I called the group “alt-right” because to me, groups led by Trump supporters whose rallies attract white nationalists tend to be alt-right. But given that the leader of the group has actually denounced Neo-Nazis and white supremacists, even according to the usually quick-to-label-everyone-hateful SPLC, calling the group “alt-right” might be a case of guilt by association.
[Cross-posted at RedState and The Jury Talks Back.]
Technically, though, she’s right, you know.
It doesn’t say that.
Patterico (63e824) — 8/24/2017 @ 3:31 pmIt reminds the statement: every Napoleon has a Watergate.
Raul Alessandri (610346) — 8/24/2017 @ 3:42 pmI think under Brandenburg v. Ohio you can shout “She’s a witch!”, as long as you don’t also shout “Burn her!”
Although she sounds like she’s already “burned” here.
nk (dbc370) — 8/24/2017 @ 3:43 pmdemocrat-run cities in democrat-run states sure do seem to have a lot of white supremers lately
where as republican-run cities in republican-run states seem to have a notable paucity of white supremers
that’s kooky huh
happyfeet (28a91b) — 8/24/2017 @ 3:50 pm*whereas* i mean
happyfeet (28a91b) — 8/24/2017 @ 3:50 pmbtw you not suppose to yell in theaters at all
it’s the rules
happyfeet (28a91b) — 8/24/2017 @ 3:51 pmShe mixing up the boy who cried wolf with the person who shouted fire ina crowded theatre.
Sammy Finkelman (02a146) — 8/24/2017 @ 3:54 pmCrying wolf and shouting fire are both false reports.
Now I think the Democrats are doing that.
They may be crying wolf about white supremacists and shouting fire about Donald Trump. Maybe not teh latter. Tey just want shunning because the evil of Donald Trump is contagious. And they won’t even criticize where he is truly evil except by misreprentation.
Sammy Finkelman (02a146) — 8/24/2017 @ 3:58 pmPatterico:
It’s not 1919 any more.
People no longer report fires by shouting. And they didn’t any more even before cell phones./
They had in the past, over 100 years ago:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shouting_fire_in_a_crowded_theater
The last case seeems to be 1913.
A modern example would be Shouting “Gun” in the presence of policemen.
Sammy Finkelman (02a146) — 8/24/2017 @ 4:02 pmIf Pelosi is hammered enough and amends her fascism several days, can she Trump her way back?
Ben burn (b3d5ab) — 8/24/2017 @ 4:07 pmseveral days from now..
Ben burn (b3d5ab) — 8/24/2017 @ 4:08 pmWhat if the theater is full of sheep?
kishnevi (35d300) — 8/24/2017 @ 4:09 pmBetter New Deal beats Repeal and squeal.
Ben burn (b3d5ab) — 8/24/2017 @ 4:10 pmI think all the prophylactic antibiotics, antivirals and antiretrovirals she needs to be on in order to shake hands with her constituents have done something to her brain.
nk (dbc370) — 8/24/2017 @ 4:14 pmimagine the spew that comes out of her mouth off camera
mg (31009b) — 8/24/2017 @ 4:17 pmGreetings:
Me, I’m thinking “Frisco’s that kind of town.”.
But seriously, all these elected officials coming out against conservative free speech and assembly whether for reasons of “hate” or worse, “public safety” needs some kind of national investigation. When those who have control or influence over the compulsive power of the state, local or otherwise, try to scare or dissuade others from the exercise of their Constitutional rights, we have clearly entered the era of the Progressive Jim Crow. I see so little difference between these folks and George Wallace of ‘don’t’ stand in the doorway, don’t block up the hall” Alabama fame.
11B40 (6abb5c) — 8/24/2017 @ 4:24 pmThe press has a great time trying to diagnose various mental/emotional deficits in the President, but has no interest in politely inquiring whether the 77 year old Pelosi is showing signs of dementia.
There have been several recent video clips of her having great difficulty articulating relatively straight forward policy positions that in the past have never given her any problems.
She has maintained her grip on the Minority Leader’s post by virtue of the fact that out of 194 Democrat members in the House, 40 are from California. To oust her, a challenger would need to get to get 98 of the remaining 154 votes.
Combine that huge advantage with the fact that she is far and away the leading fundraiser for Dems in Congress because of the proximity of her district to Silicon Valley, and the ultra-rich ultra-liberals in San Francisco, and she basically buys the Minority Leader position in each new Congress.
But she’s well on her way to being the Dem version of Strom Thurmond.
shipwreckedcrew (99f654) — 8/24/2017 @ 4:36 pmJack Balkin (now at Yale) once told our class that he had, in fact, yelled “fire” in an actual crowded theater. Nothing came of it.
Bet he jaywalks, too— until the time he’s hit.
DCSCA (797bc0) — 8/24/2017 @ 4:45 pmadding Mr. Balkin to prayer list
happyfeet (28a91b) — 8/24/2017 @ 5:09 pmWas there a fire being shown on the screen at the time?
Anon Y. Mous (19e1f2) — 8/24/2017 @ 5:14 pm@17. But she’s well on her way to being the Dem version of Strom Thurmond.
More like Dr. Zaius reciting the Sacred Scrolls.
Some know when to leave gracefully. Some don’t. Others just get the hook– or the axe.
“Remember, never trust anybody over 30.” – George Taylor [Charlton Heston] ‘Planet Of The Apes’ 1968
DCSCA (797bc0) — 8/24/2017 @ 5:36 pmWhat about a lone wolf?
crazy (11d38b) — 8/24/2017 @ 5:41 pmI remember reading about Pelosi’s daddy who – as Democrat mayor of Baltimore – dedicated two Confederacy-related monuments. Funny, not a peep out of her about that.
Colonel Haiku (2601c0) — 8/24/2017 @ 5:47 pmAnd when I go to teh movies this weekend, i’m going to make it a point to stand up during a slow spot in the movie and yell “WOLF!!!” to to show that, by God, I do have that constitutional right!
Colonel Haiku (2601c0) — 8/24/2017 @ 5:52 pmWhat if wolf blitzer is in the theater?
narciso (d1f714) — 8/24/2017 @ 5:57 pmThere’s also this:
https://mobile.twitter.com/iowahawkblog/status/900840619744124929?p=v
narciso (d1f714) — 8/24/2017 @ 6:01 pmIt won’t be a RomCom, so that would be impossible, narciso.
Colonel Haiku (2601c0) — 8/24/2017 @ 6:02 pmI hope they have an intermission, cuz I’ll be hungry like teh wolf…
Colonel Haiku (2601c0) — 8/24/2017 @ 6:04 pmWell it wAS funnier than the pods take
narciso (d1f714) — 8/24/2017 @ 6:08 pmIIRC the whole “yelling fire in a crowded theatre” deal was a horrible analogy used to argue that rabbis handing out pamphlets discouraging young men from registering for the draft in WW1 should go to jail.
There’s a great video somewhere of Christopher Hitchens stating what a horrible argument it was. I think he was debating Shasi Tharoor about offensive speech and the Danish cartoons.
harkin (74754c) — 8/24/2017 @ 7:00 pmAnd speaking of………
“Today, with our nation beset by subversive groups and propaganda which seeks to destroy our national unity, we can look for inspiration to the lives of Lee and Jackson to remind us to be resolute and determined in preserving our sacred institutions……
…….We must remain steadfast in our determination to preserve freedom, not only for ourselves, but for the other liberty-loving nations who are striving to preserve their national unity as free nations.
…….In these days of uncertainty and turmoil, Americans must emulate Jackson’s example and stand like a stone wall against aggression in any form that would seek to destroy the liberty of the world.”
Rep. Thomas D’Alesandro Jr., speaking in Baltimore in 1948 at the dedication of a monument to honor Confederate generals Robert E. Lee and Thomas “Stonewall” Jackson.
Oh yeah and he was Nancy Pelosi’s father.
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2017/08/24/nancy-pelosis-father-helped-dedicate-confederate-monument.html
harkin (74754c) — 8/24/2017 @ 7:08 pmI guess she would agree:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/yvette-felarca-neo-nazi-fascism_us_59949dece4b0d0d2cc83d266?ncid=tweetlnkushpmg00000067
narciso (d1f714) — 8/24/2017 @ 8:18 pm23 Colonel Drunku: Yeah, ’cause in your drunken state, you’re dumb enough to think that everyone’s a carbon copy of their parents. Look up Ronald Reagan’s son and lay off the sauce a while.
Tillman (a95660) — 8/24/2017 @ 9:11 pmYes Thomas Dodd was a cold war liberal, the same for papa vanden heuvel who helped find diem in a Maryland seminary
narciso (d1f714) — 8/24/2017 @ 9:18 pmWith her utter contempt for the First Amendment and the rest of the Constitution, it’s easy to understand why Donald Trump wrote her campaigns so many checks.
Dave (445e97) — 8/24/2017 @ 10:55 pmDo NOT shout to find Wolf Blitzer in a crowded theater.
Lyrics Don't Matter (f80109) — 8/25/2017 @ 7:02 amI don’t understand why the founding fathers wouldn’t write these kinds of details into the Constitution. I mean, it makes perfect sense.
Legislative branch and their powers outlines, Executive branch and their powers outlined, Judicial branch and their powers covered, and the right to shout “wolf” in a crowded theater. It fits right in like a puzzle piece to complete a jig-saw puzzle.
Lyrics Don't Matter (f80109) — 8/25/2017 @ 7:05 amMay one yell “Stage Play!” in a crowded fire station?
The Gentle Grizzly (f02a5f) — 8/25/2017 @ 7:14 amI actually did that. All the firemen laughed, and then they beat the carp out of me – they said it was “traditional.”
felipe (b5e0f4) — 8/25/2017 @ 7:18 amPelosi has always been an unsettling individual to me. Back when SNL was periodically funny, I remember this (from 2006).
http://www.nbc.com/saturday-night-live/video/nancy-pelosi/n12084?snl=1
Simon Jester (82e4e0) — 8/25/2017 @ 7:46 amRe the use of the term alt-right, the AP has weighed in:
I like the term alt-left. Most national Democratic leaders are alt-left these days, or at least want their identity groups to think they are.
DRJ (15874d) — 8/25/2017 @ 9:39 amBut AP needs to define the identity groups associated with alt-left. For starters, I suggest Black Lives Matter, Antifa, Communists, and some illegal immigrant support groups.
DRJ (15874d) — 8/25/2017 @ 9:42 amPelosi also shouldn’t cry “fire” after every one of Trump’s inflammatory tweets.
WarrenPeese (ce3c8b) — 8/25/2017 @ 10:06 amUPDATE: On Twitter, someone pointed out to me that the group in question denies it is alt-right. The Mercury News article linked in this post says:
The leader of the group is a Trump supporter. I called the group “alt-right” because to me, groups led by Trump supporters whose rallies attract white nationalists tend to be alt-right. But given that the leader of the group has actually denounced Neo-Nazis and white supremacists, even according to the usually quick-to-label-everyone-hateful SPLC, calling the group “alt-right” might be a case of guilt by association.
Patterico (63e824) — 8/25/2017 @ 10:08 am30. Rabbis? This was done by generally atheistic socialists.
Sammy Finkelman (02a146) — 8/25/2017 @ 10:13 amthe Republican Party has a deeply rooted white supremacy problem
it’s not helpful to pretend this is something that can be isolated to a conveniently made-up segment called the alt-right
all the Rs need to check their privilege until harvardtrash Mitt Romney’s satisfied they pass the initial smell test
then we can get down to serious reeducation efforts
happyfeet (28a91b) — 8/25/2017 @ 10:16 amyou have to want to change though
yeah I’m looking at you Ben Sasse
happyfeet (28a91b) — 8/25/2017 @ 10:19 amAnti illegal immigrant groups are not racist, but they are called hate groups..
Sammy Finkelman (02a146) — 8/25/2017 @ 10:22 amNobody on the left calls themselves alt-left. There are no identity groups to which this appeals.
Davethulhu (fab944) — 8/25/2017 @ 10:23 amFor example?
Davethulhu (fab944) — 8/25/2017 @ 10:30 amIt apparently appeals to the AP.
DRJ (d18ca6) — 8/25/2017 @ 10:55 am“Nobody on the left calls themselves alt-left”
Does alt right self identify? The lines are blurry on all sides. Many don’t know what to call themselves. Very few fit all the criteria for any one category.
Ben burn (786e20) — 8/25/2017 @ 11:01 am44. By that standard, Oath Keepers may not be alt-right, especially after a recent kerfuffle when they denounced the presence of white supes/neos/nats at a Houston event. One of the neos complained that the Oath Keepers had become “Boomer Antifa” because of the preocuppation with appearing to be race neutral.
urbanleftbehind (5eecdb) — 8/25/2017 @ 11:12 am50/ Davethulhu (fab944) — 8/25/2017 @ 10:30 am
If you go by the southern Poverty Law Center – which is aquestionable authroity, they are:
https://www.splcenter.org/hatewatch/2017/03/23/hate-groups-center-immigration-studies-want-you-believe-they%E2%80%99re-mainstream
They’re actually right aboiut this When they start lying, they are ahate group. When they stop caring about people as human beings. they are ahate group.
It’s clssic hate propaganda – absolutely classic hate poroipaganda – to take example of people who committed crimes, and apply that to the whole group, and say things should be done against them because of that. And here we have a problem – a problem the democrats don’t tackle head on.
Not only has Donald Trump done that, or implied that he has set a special office to collect reports of crimes committed by illegal alines (presumably against American citiizens or permanent residents)
https://www.nytimes.com/2017/04/26/us/politics/trump-voice-immigrants-crime.html?mcubz=0
But he doesn’t seem to be interested in crimesw committed by any body else against Aamerican citizens or permanent residnets, which far outnumber them. Does this make sense. And neither is he collecting reports of crimes committed by American citiizens or permanent residents)
against illegal aliens.
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/02/16/us/16hispanic.html?mcubz=0
And all this ignores the fact I can pinpoint other categories of poeople with higher rates of crininality. If we’;re doing this, the KKK has a better case.
There is even this atrocity of the proposed “Kate’s LAw”
https://www.congress.gov/bill/115th-congress/house-bill/3004
Whose provisions aren’t limited to criminals.
Sammy Finkelman (02a146) — 8/25/2017 @ 11:19 amAntifa is the occupy movement which goes further to back to ANSWER and other syalubusr front groups
narciso (d1f714) — 8/25/2017 @ 11:20 amDon’t think the white nationalists etc don’t see the similiarity.
Sammy Finkelman (02a146) — 8/25/2017 @ 11:20 am“We’re the platform of the alt-right” – Steve Bannon, referring to breitbart.com
Noted nazi punching bag Richard Spencer originated the term.
I’m not prepared to link the various white nationalist and white supremacy sites from my work computer, but the term is popular there.
/r/The_Donald on reddit, /pol on 4chan
Davethulhu (fab944) — 8/25/2017 @ 11:22 amhttp://ace.mu.nu/archives/pantyfa.jpg
Colonel Haiku (167584) — 8/25/2017 @ 11:33 amKamala Harris also Tweeted this pearl of wisdom:
On Wiki under “Douchebag” should be her picture. What a typical leftist feel-good idiot.
Rev.Hoagie® (630eca) — 8/25/2017 @ 11:55 amshe seems like she’s been tarded more than once
happyfeet (28a91b) — 8/25/2017 @ 12:10 pmThey aren’t that smart and yet Democrats won the last Presidential election.
DRJ (d18ca6) — 8/25/2017 @ 12:31 pmIf dumb tweets had any real world implications, Donald Trump would not be president.
Davethulhu (fab944) — 8/25/2017 @ 12:46 pmNo, the last prez election was in 2016. They – to the relief of some of us – did not win.
Colonel Haiku (167584) — 8/25/2017 @ 12:53 pm62… “real world implications” is probably not a road you want to head down, Cthulhu 🐙
Colonel Haiku (167584) — 8/25/2017 @ 12:56 pmThe Democrats won the election in total votes cast, and also Trump wants to govern like a Democrat (with Democratic advisors) and seems to be doing everything he can to improve the Democrats’ chances in future elections.
DRJ (d18ca6) — 8/25/2017 @ 1:03 pmYour reply, as always, is: But we don’t have Hillary.
As good as that is, it is not enough. There are a lot of Democrats who will do what Hillary would have done, and Trump will not beat them acting like this. They won’t even have to do much to unravel his “legacy.”
DRJ (d18ca6) — 8/25/2017 @ 1:08 pmI’m just saying that there’s certain level of irony in trump supporter calling someone else’s tweets “tarded”.
Davethulhu (fab944) — 8/25/2017 @ 1:11 pmThe desperate ‘conservative’ spin noe bein ‘floated’ is to cry Trump is not a ‘Republican’ – not a ‘party of Lincoln’ man.
Except he is.
What he is not is a conservative. And neither was Lincoln. ‘Conservatives’ are discovering to their utter horror that they are not ‘Republicans’ in 2017; their hold on the party being purged at every angle after four decades of holding it hostage.
DCSCA (797bc0) — 8/25/2017 @ 1:15 pmRight they have been on that jag since Mccarthy, I referenced hofstadler name checking adorno in 1954
Meanwhile the deems are the devils advocates to criminals terrorist and the like, take the slaughter of Baxter and Howard by Ali Mohammed Ali a somelives matter supporter:
narciso (d1f714) — 8/25/2017 @ 1:28 pmhttp://freebeacon.com/politics/black-lives-matter-co-founder-trump-epitome-evil-tried-kill-communities
Texas can raise a lot of hurricane relief money on its own, without Federal aid, by simply melting down confederate statues and selling the bronze as scrap metal.
DCSCA (797bc0) — 8/25/2017 @ 1:31 pmWho wee the chief recruiter for the alt right, none other Barack Obama he and his minion, holder who insisted that race was the text nit the subtext of all of American life, that we have akwayd been an evil land, except when he granted him consent, or he pretended this was so.
narciso (d1f714) — 8/25/2017 @ 2:05 pmAh, the old “Obama made me racist” excuse.
Davethulhu (fab944) — 8/25/2017 @ 2:20 pmAnd your retort, as always, is it’s Trump’s fault. But he shares the blame with pathetically incompetent congressional leadership and this environment – a wasteland populated by malevolent nitwit media, sh*t-for-brains Democrats, pontificating NeverTrumpinistas, and craven Republicans – does not help in any way, shape, or form.
Perhaps it WILL take a Civil War.
Colonel Haiku (167584) — 8/25/2017 @ 2:23 pm45 – “Rabbis?”
You are correct (if you recall, I prefaced it with “IIRC”).
They were pamphlets written in Yiddish and I somehow construed from that that the distributors must have been anti-war rabbis.
My bad.
harkin (74754c) — 8/25/2017 @ 2:23 pm“What he is not is a conservative. And neither was Lincoln.”
Lincoln was closer to being a conservative than manifestation of liberal in the present day.
For that matter most of democrats of only three or four decades ago were closer to today’s conservative than today’s liberals.
For gosh sakes Garrison Keillor just called for a military junta.
“For the first time in our history we are looking to generals to save us from democracy.”
_____
Do you think when they made the movie they ever thought the call would come from the left…..?
“And then when this nation rejected you, lost faith in you, and began militantly to oppose you, you violated that oath by not resigning from office and turning the country over to someone who could represent the people of the United States.” – Gen. James Mattoon Scott – Seven Days In May – 1964
harkin (74754c) — 8/25/2017 @ 2:33 pmThe Wall Street Journal said in an editorial today that Trump should be treated by Republicans in Congress like a political independent.
Sammy Finkelman (02a146) — 8/25/2017 @ 2:44 pmOr then maybe the vast majority of Americans just take all of this in, shake their heads, say a prayer that sanity returns to our country and go on with their lives BAU.
Colonel Haiku (167584) — 8/25/2017 @ 2:48 pm@76. Can’t imagine why the WSJ ed. board would want to disown ‘one of their own.’
DCSCA (797bc0) — 8/25/2017 @ 3:07 pmNothing to see here;
http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/how-do-you-say-whoops-in-russian-podesta-group-retroactively-files-more-doj-disclosures-for-pro-putin-work/article/2632538
narciso (d1f714) — 8/25/2017 @ 3:15 pm