Patterico's Pontifications

5/16/2024

RNC Co-Chair Provides Trump With Excuse to Back Out of Debate

Filed under: General — Dana @ 2:24 pm



[guest post by Dana]

We now know that President Biden and Donald Trump have agreed to participate in two debates. The first will take place on June 27, with CNN’s Dana Bash and Jake Tapper moderating the event. Surprisingly, the debate will take place without an audience in attendance. I don’t see this as being the best steup for Trump. He thrives on bullshit, and he thrives on bullshitting an audience. As for President Biden, he can easily lose his train of thought, so we’ll see what happens. But I suspect this will be more to Trump’s disadvantage. You can read CNN’s qualifying requirements here.

Here’s how the contenders responded to the debate invitation:

“It is my great honor to accept the CNN Debate against Crooked Joe Biden,” Trump posted on his Truth Social site. “Likewise, I accept the ABC News Debate against Crooked Joe on September 10th.”

“Trump says he’ll arrange his own transportation,” Biden wrote on X. “I’ll bring my plane, too. I plan on keeping it for another four years.”

Two rich, old white guys with memory issues trying to best each other might be entertaining if the stakes weren’t so high. But fighting for the presidency isn’t a laughing matter, despite what Mitt Romney said about the old coots:

With that, here’s a sound observation:

The swiftness with which the matchups came together reflects how each of the two unpopular candidates thinks he can get the better of his opponent in a head-to-head showdown. Trump and his team are convinced the debates will exacerbate voters’ concerns about Biden’s age and competence, while Biden’s team believes Trump’s often-incendiary rhetoric will remind voters of why they voted him out of the White House four years ago.

It sure didn’t take long for RNC co-chair Lara Trump to complain that the debate is rigged against Trump:

It’s rigged so heavily in Joe Biden’s favor, but everything always is! You’ve got Hollywood against Donald Trump. You’ve got the music industry against Donald Trump. Mainstream media. Despite that and even the judicial system at this point, he is beating Joe Biden in every poll out there. It’s amazing to see. So, if Joe Biden shows up on June 27th and doesn’t come up with an excuse like he has to wash his hair or something, I have full confidence that Donald Trump will outperform him.

What’s funny is, it’s Lara Trump who has provided an excuse for Trump to either bomb or back out. If he bombs, it was a rigged debate! If he backs out, it was a rigged debate!

So. I think if anyone is going to be washing their hair on the 27th, it’s not going to be the guy who hardly has any left.

P.S.

–Dana

101 Responses to “RNC Co-Chair Provides Trump With Excuse to Back Out of Debate”

  1. Ugh.

    Dana (8e902f)

  2. Both candidates may back out as CNN is going to allow RFK Jr into the debate if he polls high enough.

    Kevin M (a9545f)

  3. What I am hoping for is that one or both of these poor excuses for candidates really, truly blows it. Maybe the DNC will replace JRB. I wish we could replace DJT.

    But the cleaner version of my father’s adage about wishing, from Frank Herbert’s “Dune,” applies:

    “If wishes were fishes we would all cast nets.”

    Sigh.

    Simon Jester (c8876d)

  4. “It’s a pity they can’t both lose”

    –Henry Kissinger, on the Iran-Iraq War.

    Kevin M (a9545f)

  5. What both campaigns did with this is that they cut out the Commission on Presidential Debates, which both were anxious to do so in a palatable manner..

    Lara Trump is not looking for an excuse for Trump to back out (if he wants an excuse Donald Trump can invent his own) but to either be able to say Trump had a handicap and so that he did especially well if he comes out OK or to explain away a bomb.

    Mark Simone speculated that one reason the Biden campaign wanted a debate so earl is that in case Biden bombs he has time to recover, and in case he really really bombs they could substitute some other candidate at the convention (not Michelle Obama!)

    CNN so far appears not to want to share its video elsewhere (audio might be different) but ABC intends to make available for free to any other service or network.

    RFK Jr can’t possibly get on enough state ballots by June 27 to qualify

    Sammy Finkelman (e0dccb)

  6. See the PS just added to post…

    Dana (8e902f)

  7. Dana, WTF is the point of this post? You hate Trump whether he debates or not.

    Furthermore, what will you say when *Biden* is the one making excuses to postpone or cancel?

    Sick to death of this irrational hatred of Trump. Almost every criticism that can be made of the BOAR, can also be made of the drooler.

    qdpsteve again (8d496a)

  8. The Republicans withdrew from participating with the Commission on Presidential Debates two years ago.

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  9. qdpsteve again,

    Only one of these men attempted to overturn legitimate election results and fomented an insurrection at the U.S. Capitol. Only one has been found liable for sexual assault. Etc., etc. I don’t believe Trump is fit for office. When Biden does the same, I’ll sound off on him too.

    Dana (8e902f)

  10. RFKJr. can dream all he wants about participating in the debates, but CNN and other news organizations are protected by the First Amendment from being forced to invite him. He will be on the outside looking in, like a kid at the candy store.

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  11. Sick to death of this irrational hatred of Trump.

    As Dana pointed out in post 9, it’s not irrational.

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  12. Dana: which is why I said *almost every criticism.* Try reading more closely next time.

    How the [deleted] do Trump’s bad actions in any way excuse Biden’s absolutely horrible performance as president?

    NOTHING Trump has done has any bearing on how unfit Biden is.

    qdpsteve again (8d496a)

  13. https://hotair.com/jazz-shaw/2024/05/16/romney-biden-should-have-pardoned-trump-n3788501

    Whether Romney is correct or not, I have no idea.
    But it will be interesting to see the usual suspects around here suddenly go from praising Mitt to calling him a stooge of the BOAR.

    qdpsteve again (042fff)

  14. How can RDK Jr claim he will poll over 15%? He may be able to claim he will be on the ballot in enough states whose total Electoral votes are 270 – but it remains to be seen. It could be in litigation.

    Sammy Finkelman (e0dccb)

  15. Almost every criticism that can be made of the BOAR, can also be made of the drooler.

    qdpsteve again (8d496a) — 5/16/2024 @ 3:29 pm

    I wouldn’t say “almost every”, but I would say “many”. The ones between “many” and “every” happen to be very consequential.

    norcal (add8fc)

  16. Biden is slumping in the pols because he gives the impression of not knowing what he is doing.

    Sammy Finkelman (e0dccb)

  17. norcal, I can respect that difference.

    Also, believe it or not, there’s a difference between *irrational* hatred of Trump (or anyone) and *rational* hatred, if that makes any sense at all (and I personally believe hatred is always irrational, but that’s a whole ‘nother discussion).

    Examples:
    – you hate what was done and how Trump behaved on Jan 6, and feel it’s a dealbreaker for ever voting for him again. Rational.
    – you hate that Trump is agreeing to debate because “you just know” he’ll find some poor excuse to weasel out, when Biden is just as likely to do so. Irrational.

    qdpsteve again (042fff)

  18. The problem with Dana’s calculus is that Biden also “attempted to overturn legitimate election results” (by supporting Gore and Hillary) and “fomented an insurrection of the U.S. Capitol” (by helping to inspire the Kavanaugh protesters).

    So your rationale for believing Biden is fit for office boils down to … he corrupted the Justice Department to such an extent as to prosecute his political enemies?

    SaveFarris (a1c3bb)

  19. SaveFarris, exactly.

    Dana seems to believe that, because Trump is *bad* (and he is in fact bad on a large number of things), that somehow *erases* the bad actions of Biden and his admin.

    Let’s be honest: there’s no even semi-rational reason to vote for Biden this year instead of Trump, except that you want to stick your finger forcefully and painfully in the eye of BOAR and his supporters.

    qdpsteve again (042fff)

  20. And before someone else brings it up:

    No, I am not arguing that a vote for Trump is somehow rational. In a rational world, neither of these people would be allowed anywhere near the WH.

    Remember my acronym, BOAR (Big Angry Orange Revenge)? That’s the #1 reason a lot of Trumpies will be voting for him. They want revenge and don’t care how they get it, constitutionally or otherwise. If they could explode DC with an ICBM, they would do so.

    When the time comes to vote, I will leave my choice for POTUS blank.

    qdpsteve again (042fff)

  21. When the time comes to vote, I will leave my choice for POTUS blank.

    qdpsteve again (042fff) — 5/16/2024 @ 4:21 pm

    Ditto.

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  22. Claiming Trump fomented insurrection is a joke as is claiming the farce of a trial where he allegedly committed sexual assault was a civil trial where the state changed the law just to get him.

    The nonsense of 2 minutes of hate has gone on for 7 years now while the left has actively worked to destroy the nation.

    NJRob (e46acb)

  23. The problem with Dana’s calculus is that Biden also “attempted to overturn legitimate election results” (by supporting Gore and Hillary) and “fomented an insurrection of the U.S. Capitol” (by helping to inspire the Kavanaugh protesters).

    LOL! Show your work.

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  24. News coming out that if/when Biden loses, VP Harris will simply run for governor of CA.

    qdpsteve again (042fff)

  25. Dana, WTF is the point of this post? You hate Trump whether he debates or not.

    Furthermore, what will you say when *Biden* is the one making excuses to postpone or cancel?

    Sick to death of this irrational hatred of Trump. Almost every criticism that can be made of the BOAR, can also be made of the drooler.

    qdpsteve,

    As a commenter who has been banned before, what makes you think you can insult Dana like this without consequence?

    You’re moderated until I feel like unmoderating you.

    Patterico (1e086a)

  26. Let’s be honest: there’s no even semi-rational reason to vote for Biden this year instead of Trump, except that you want to stick your finger forcefully and painfully in the eye of BOAR and his supporters.

    I will be voting for Biden. I consider my reasons eminently rational. In fact, only a troll would tell me my reasons are irrational.

    Patterico (1e086a)

  27. RFK Jr can’t possibly get on enough state ballots by June 27 to qualify

    Maybe the Libertarians will nominate him. It’s not like they have any principles any more.

    Kevin M (a9545f)

  28. I don’t believe Trump is fit for office.

    Neither one is fit for office. Neither is RFKjr.

    And yet we are here.

    Kevin M (a9545f)

  29. When the time comes to vote, I will leave my choice for POTUS blank.

    George Will has suggested that many people should do that, to make a point about the ridiculous “choice.”

    Kevin M (a9545f)

  30. After only 20 seconds of Googling, here’s the most succinct reason I can find for your reason for voting for Biden (appropriated via a Kevin Williamson quote):

    Trump’s problem is not etiquette: It is dishonesty, stupidity, and incompetence, magnified by the self-dealing and cowardice of the cabal of enablers and sycophants who have a stake in pretending that this unsalted s*** sandwich is filet mignon.

    https://patterico.com/2020/10/27/kevin-williamson-on-voting-for-trump-hell-no/

    Is that a fair assessment of your reasoning?

    SaveFarris (d5f64d)

  31. When has a Trump debate not become a weird parody of a Presidential debate? SNL would struggle to create a more absurd event. Trump performs…because he doesn’t especially know facts or care about the truth. He cares about Trump. Two hours of that should be enough for people to understand why he’s unfit. Biden isn’t inspiring and the older he gets, the creepier he seems…but he won’t break the system to get what he wants.

    AJ_Liberty (c76b5b)

  32. Living in a state (Washington) which will certainly vote for Biden, I will, as I have before, write in the name of some decent, rational Republican. (Perhaps Liz Cheny or Nikki Haley, this time.) Were I in a swing state, where my vote could, conceivably, make a difference, I would vote, unhappily, for Biden.

    (If you would like to think more rationally, let me suggest that you read Thinking, Fast and Slow. Nate Silver’s The Signal and the Noise is a good introduction to Bayesian reasoning.

    Lincoln learned some formal logic from the study of Euclid.)

    Jim Miller (4b1927)

  33. @9 “Only one of these men attempted to overturn legitimate election results and fomented an insurrection at the U.S. Capitol. Only one has been found liable for sexual assault. Etc., etc.”

    It seems to me Biden is granting Trump legitimacy by seeking to debate him. Why is Biden even considering debating someone he believes belongs in prison?

    lloyd (60115f)

  34. Can trump debate from a jail cell? The jury will decide on what ever they want to decide on and I have said this from the beginning. Sammy the fish alito may have hang his american flag upside down again!

    asset (78e213)

  35. Can Biden debate from a hospital bed or memory loss facility?

    lloyd (9f3531)

  36. One, Gore conceded the day after the USSC ruled against him.
    Hillary conceded the day after Election Day.
    There’s no comparison to Trump’s continuous non-concessions, his Big Lie that he will never back away from.

    Two, screaming non-violent women at a Senate hearing was no insurrection.

    Paul Montagu (d52d7d)

  37. With RFK Jr., my expectation is that the debate will morph from clown to full-blown circus.

    Paul Montagu (d52d7d)

  38. My calculus is that with Trump, the media will investigate him and his administration 6 ways from Sunday. If every i isn’t dotted and every t isn’t crossed, all the networks and newspapers will raise holy hell and will tear at the story like an unfed rabid dog. Every single reporter on the beat will spend 25 hours a day investigating Trump and his team looking to be the one that takes him down and wins all the Pulitzers. Mountains will be made out of molehills and Everests will be made out of ordinary mountains.

    If Biden is elected … we’ll continue the same silent treatment we’ve been getting for the last 4 years. Biden and his team will continue to act with impunity knowing no one other than Peter Doocy will call them on their BS. Glenn Kessler and Daniel Dale will continue their Biden-long vacation from ever fact-checking anything of consequence that leaves Biden’s lips.

    I’d rather have the nation’s watchdogs awake and pathologically searching for scandal. That way I know if there’s any governmental misdeeds, someone’s getting held to account.

    SaveFarris (3e16a1)

  39. “Hillary conceded the day after Election Day.”

    Yeah

    lloyd (60115f)

  40. Hillary continued to call Trump illegitimate.

    https://abcnews.go.com/theview/video/hillary-clinton-calls-donald-trump-illegitimate-president-66010832

    (And Biden still says Bush 43 was illegitimate.)

    https://www.usatoday.com/story/theoval/2013/06/12/biden-gore-george-w-bush-2000-election/2414933/

    They weren’t as crass about it as Trump, but the message was the same and just as damaging to democratic norms. Even moreso because people such as yourself see nothing wrong with their subversion while it was easy to see and dismiss Trump’s a mile away.

    Screaming “non-violent women” were way more insurrectiony than grandmas taking selfies and overgrown frats being escorted around by capital police. And yet few if any of the Kavanaugh women were ever charged, unlike any registered Republican who set foot on the Capital grounds on 1/6.

    If one is an insurrection, than so is the other. Popular opinion has decided that 1/6 qualifies. Therefore, the Kavanaugh protests do as well.

    SaveFarris (3e16a1)

  41. @35 we should be so lucky!

    asset (78e213)

  42. Living in a state (Washington) which will certainly vote for Biden, I will, as I have before, write in the name of some decent, rational Republican. (Perhaps Liz Cheny or Nikki Haley, this time.) Were I in a swing state, where my vote could, conceivably, make a difference, I would vote, unhappily, for Biden.

    Jim Miller (4b1927) — 5/16/2024 @ 7:28 pm

    I don’t have that luxury, because I am in a swing state.

    Like you said, I am voting, unhappily, for Biden. It will be the first time I have ever voted for a Democratic Presidential nominee.

    norcal (9370be)

  43. With RFK Jr., my expectation is that the debate will morph from clown show to full-blown circus.

    Paul Montagu (d52d7d)

  44. RFK Jr. strikes me as a decent guy who’s very misguided.

    Some commenter at The Dispatch said he was Connor Roy from the TV show “Succession”. So funny! I’m currently watching that show, so I got the full impact of the humor.

    norcal (3a285b)

  45. lloyd (60115f) — 5/16/2024 @ 9:15 pm

    The one thing that Hillary had in common with your boy Trump is that they both whined about losing, but Trump whined about it more, a lot more, orders of magnitude more, every single day and then some on his social media platform.
    Also, Hillary conceded her loss, while Trump never did.
    Hillary didn’t allege “massive fraud”, but Trump did, incessantly and dishonestly.
    Hillary didn’t file over five dozen lawsuits after challenging her loss, but Malevolent Orange did.
    Hillary didn’t invite her most rabid supporters to a rally on J6 to protest her loss, but Trump did.
    Hillary didn’t attempt a coup by forcing VP Biden to violate the 12th Amendment and Electoral Count Act, but Trump did when tried to strong-arm his VP into acquiescing.
    Hillary didn’t let an insurrection unfold do nothing to stop it for 3-plus hours, but Sleepy Don did.

    Is this a defense of Hillary? No, it’s a pure condemnation of my party’s corrupt criminal fraud nominee.

    Paul Montagu (d52d7d)

  46. Paul Montagu (d52d7d) — 5/16/2024 @ 11:05 pm

    Well-stated, Paul. However, I don’t think the tribalists appreciate distinctions like that. They’re passionate and dug in. It would amount to a crisis of faith to change course.

    norcal (9370be)

  47. @42 I live in a swing state the former republiKKKan fascist police state of az, until california democrats moved here along with latinx demographic. I am a democrat for 55 years and voted for George McGovern former B-24 pilot in WWII. I voted Ralph Nader 1996/2000/2004. Jill Stein in 2016 Bernie Sanders in the primarys and wrote in green party candidates in 2020. Unlike conservatives here who will vote for biden. I will vote for RFK jr. or jill stein and have no problem doing it. I vote down ballot democrat. Every time hillary clinton thinks about Jill Stein costing her Mi, Pa. and Wi. I wish my vote had cost her Az! Why do you think these two corrupt parties try to do every thing they can to keep third parties off the ballot and out of the debates. Voting for the two parties lesser of two evils only encourages them to continue this sliming us.

    asset (78e213)

  48. Voting for the two parties lesser of two evils only encourages them to continue this sliming us.

    asset (78e213) — 5/17/2024 @ 3:04 am

    I seldom agree with asset, but imo this statement is spot on.

    Chris (fb727a)

  49. Everyone sees the same thing, but everyone interprets what they see using their a particular lens. Some construct their own lens while others use a lens constructed for them (nothing wrong with not being able to construct a lens). Let me suggest just one alternate take:

    Hillary [couldn’t] allege “massive fraud”, but Trump [could], incessantly and [earnestly].
    Hillary [didn’t have the balls to] file over five dozen lawsuits after challenging her loss, but [persistent] Orange did.
    Hillary [couldn’t] invite her most rabid supporters to a rally on J6 to protest her loss, but Trump [could].

    The point being that the elite left isn’t angry because of what Trump did do, but what Trump could do* – that they couldn’t. It could also be argued that they are envious of his very real “freely-given” popularity – as opposed to a “bought and paid for” popularity.

    That’s just one alternate take which holds the same water as yours- and I pulled it out of my nether regions in the time I took to type it.

    * conversely, Trump couldn’t marshal the media nor “his” establishment party, as either of his two opponents could – so there’s that.

    felipe (599ae5)

  50. @48, the problem is that one of those two WILL be President.

    I wholeheartedly agree that the major parties need a wakeup call. They need to change. They’re not serving the public interest. I think the primary process needs to be rethought as it’s not finding the best and brightest….but the most craven and entertaining.

    But at its core, the biggest problem is a people problem. We have so much information and so many venues to share information that we can create our own reality bubbles of half-truths and misinformation.

    We encourage simplistic conclusions to avoid the hard work of deeply studying a topic and perhaps coming to the uncomfortable conclusion that there’s nuance that doesn’t nicely fit into partisan buckets. Real problems…like the national debt….are complicated and require difficult choices. You want smart people of character making those choices. Instead we have reality tv entertainers and old men way past their prime.

    Our media is broken too. There are few shared facts which we then bury them under a mountain of spin and opinion. Some people think chat sites are the same as professional journalism. And this is how people are trained to think. For nine years, we’ve avoided simple truths about Trump by spinning off wild narratives. And it does not appear that we can stop. We’re trapped in a cycle of nonsense. Again, the only way people learn is by having their comfortable lives disrupted. We’re heading for a rude awakening….

    AJ_Liberty (c76b5b)

  51. The only thing I have decided for certain is that I would never in a million years vote for a sociopath like Trump. But beyond that, I’m still undecided. Should I hold my nose vote for Biden, whom I detest, just to keep Trump out of the White House? Should I leave the line for POTUS blank, as some here have suggested? The election could very well end up being decided electorally, and since I live in Illinois (which is sure to go to Biden), my vote might not mean anything anyway. I soooo wanted to see Nikki mop the floor with Trump. Maybe I’ll just write her in.

    Roger (dddfb7)

  52. In my opinion if you are voting against Trump you may as well vote for Biden no matter what. Using the Electoral College as a “my vote doesn’t count” excuse doesn’t work this time. The GOP has screwed this up big time and writing in the name of someone they already know can’t win doesn’t send any message other than you are Charlie Brown to their Lucy’s football.

    It is time to overwhelmingly vote against the party that fostered all this mayhem no matter which state you live in, if that is your conviction. This is why I respect Pat’s declaration while I choose a different path.

    If you don’t want Trump, there is only one vote that can eliminate him as well as teach the party a lesson. Otherwise you are engaging in the same kind of compromise that this lousy party will continue to exploit.

    BuDuh (4214e4)

  53. Biden has what he wants with the CNN and ABC debates — Trump’s ability to disrupt the debate muted. So, unless he is truly non compos mentis, he is not pulling out.

    I don’t have any insight into what Trump will do. The things he promises to do aren’t constraints. If he’s truly ahead by a lot, I think he will not debate. I am curious how he handles RFK Jr. — ordinarially, he would want him there to gang up on Biden. But RFK likely takes votes from the Trump curious populist Democrats. In a world where the candidates will not be able to interrupt each other, putting him up there likely does not help Trump.

    Appalled (309913)

  54. Sure, felipe, Trump could do it. The issue is should, and he shouldn’t have, and he’ll go down in history not only as a fascist, but as the whiniest and sorest loser in the presidential annals.

    Paul Montagu (895dc0)

  55. Trump’s problem is not etiquette: It is dishonesty, stupidity, and incompetence, magnified by the self-dealing and cowardice of the cabal of enablers and sycophants who have a stake in pretending that this unsalted s*** sandwich is filet mignon.

    But then Biden’s problem is not etiquette either: It is dishonesty, stupidity, and incompetence, magnified by the self-dealing and>/s> cowardice of the cabal of enablers and sycophants who have a stake in pretending that this unsalted s*** sandwich is filet mignon.

    Biden leaves the self-dealing to his son.

    Kevin M (a9545f)

  56. Mulligan.

    Trump’s problem is not etiquette: It is dishonesty, stupidity, and incompetence, magnified by the self-dealing and cowardice of the cabal of enablers and sycophants who have a stake in pretending that this unsalted s*** sandwich is filet mignon.

    But then Biden’s problem is not etiquette either: It is dishonesty, stupidity, and incompetence, magnified by the self-dealing and cowardice of the cabal of enablers and sycophants who have a stake in pretending that this unsalted s*** sandwich is filet mignon.

    Biden leaves the self-dealing to his son.

    Kevin M (a9545f)

  57. Two hours of that should be enough for people to understand why he’s unfit.

    His performance at the first 2020 debate made that clear to me. But Biden isn’t the same man he was in 2020. They may both demonstrate unfitness. Neither one will be the actual nominee at that point.

    Biden isn’t inspiring and the older he gets, the creepier he seems…but he won’t break the system to get what he wants.

    He will break it in parts, and has, or tried to. Debt forgiveness and the southern border come to mind. Commanding large economic changes from on high are not far behind.

    Kevin M (a9545f)

  58. I don’t think the tribalists appreciate distinctions like that. They’re passionate and dug in. It would amount to a crisis of faith to change course.

    This election will not be decided by the tribes, of which there are two. It will be decided by the persuadables who have not yet joined a tribe.

    Kevin M (a9545f)

  59. If I vote for Trump, he will see it as a mandate for his agenda.
    If I vote for Biden, he will see it as a mandate for his agenda.

    You cannot vote for either one and not be accepting the consequences.

    Kevin M (a9545f)

  60. I think the primary process needs to be rethought as it’s not finding the best and brightest….but the most craven and entertaining.

    The real problem is that the voters don’t pay enough attention. Ideally, they’d be voting for a single delegate to the party convention. Our government is built on representation, not direct democracy, and I think we can all see why.

    Kevin M (a9545f)

  61. A vote for Biden is a vote for international socialism. That is what you are supporting comrade.

    NJRob (eb56c3)

  62. It’s been 41 months. I’ve seen incompetence, feebleness and poor decisions, but not this “international socialism” phenomenon spreading across the country.
    Did Biden take ownership or control of the US means of production somewhere?

    Paul Montagu (895dc0)

  63. Did Biden take ownership or control of the US means of production somewhere?

    Outside of energy & transportation anyway?

    Kevin M (a9545f)

  64. I find it funny that people who stridently attack Trump for, well everything they can think of, deny they belong to a tribe.

    Kevin M (a9545f)

  65. Did Biden take ownership or control of the US means of production somewhere?

    Tried to manufacture an incandescent bulb recently?

    SaveFarris (79ab12)

  66. SaveFarris (79ab12) — 5/17/2024 @ 9:25 am

    Tried to manufacture an incandescent bulb recently?

    The original As it us, in the meantime LEDs got good,law prohibiting tham (setting impossible standards) was passed in 2007 and signed by President George W. Bush, They can still be found. I saw 100-watt bulbs made in China for sale the other day (but not 75s) I used to see a few halogen made in Hungary.

    Joe Biden is into electric cars. He subsidizes them and then, by imposing tariffs, tries to prevent China from capturing the market.

    Sammy Finkelman (c2c77e)

  67. A vote for Trump is a vote for domestic fascism. That is what you are supporting mein herr.

    Was that persuasive? If so, I will have to do that more often.

    Appalled (309913)

  68. Tried to manufacture an incandescent bulb recently?

    Compact fluorescent bulbs sucked (and did not save all than much energy). But LED bulbs are excellent and use less than 15% the electricity of that old incandescent. Even though they cost more to buy, 2 months of use and you are ahead in money. They also last much longer.

    Only a complete fool still uses incandescents.

    Kevin M (a9545f)

  69. Did Biden take ownership or control of the US means of production somewhere?

    The modern communist doesn’t WANT to “own” those things. You can’t tax them if you own them. Instead they just regulate them to a degree that “ownership” is academic. If I tell you what to do with the things you “own” do you really own them?

    Kevin M (a9545f)

  70. Kamala Harris agreed to debate on CBS with Republican vice presidential candidate to named later on either July 23 or August 13.

    Sammy Finkelman (c2c77e)

  71. Harris may be the presidential candidate by then.

    Kevin M (a9545f)

  72. A vote for Trump is a vote for domestic fascism. That is what you are supporting mein herr.

    I take it you subscribe to the idea that only the Right can be fascist. And

    …[A] dictatorial leader, centralized autocracy, militarism, forcible suppression of opposition, belief in a natural social hierarchy, subordination of individual interests for the perceived good of the nation and/or race, and strong regimentation of society and the economy…

    cannot happen on the Left as well?

    (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fascism)

    It just has a different hierarchy and perceived good.

    Kevin M (a9545f)

  73. @44

    RFK Jr. strikes me as a decent guy who’s very misguided.

    Some commenter at The Dispatch said he was Connor Roy from the TV show “Succession”. So funny! I’m currently watching that show, so I got the full impact of the humor.

    norcal (3a285b) — 5/16/2024 @ 11:03 pm

    Same.

    I think he’s wrong on most issues… but he strikes me as someone who’s genuine and is an overall “good egg”.

    Can’t say the same for both President Pedo and BOAR.

    whembly (86df54)

  74. The greatest trick the Left ever pulled was to convince the world only the Right can be evil.

    Kevin M (a9545f)

  75. @59

    If I vote for Trump, he will see it as a mandate for his agenda.
    If I vote for Biden, he will see it as a mandate for his agenda.

    You cannot vote for either one and not be accepting the consequences.

    Kevin M (a9545f) — 5/17/2024 @ 8:40 am

    For me, I will absolutely accept the consequences of a 2nd Term.

    IF you cannot bring yourself to voting for Trump… I would simply ask you to leave the field blank, and vote GOP downticket.

    But I truly believe it’s a civic disaster to vote for Biden for another term.

    whembly (86df54)

  76. I think he’s wrong on most issues… but he strikes me as someone who’s genuine and is an overall “good egg”.

    Hmmm. I think that Biden is wrong on most issues as well. Where do the all fall on an alignment chart?

    If “good” and “evil” represent overall policy agreement, then maybe

    Trump: Chaotic Good
    Biden: Lawful Evil
    RFKJr: Neutral Evil

    Kevin M (a9545f)

  77. The modern communist doesn’t WANT to “own” those things. You can’t tax them if you own them. Instead they just regulate them to a degree that “ownership” is academic.

    That’s why I said “or control”, Kevin.

    Paul Montagu (6a638f)

  78. TO those #NeverTrump folks here.

    I know some of you said as much, but do you think it’s worth trying to get momentum amongst your peers to leave the field BLANK for POTUS as a way to signal both parties that these two candidates are unacceptable?

    Regardless who wins… a massive “blank” vote counts would be a huge story.

    whembly (86df54)

  79. “He will break it in parts, and has, or tried to. Debt forgiveness and the southern border come to mind. Commanding large economic changes from on high are not far behind.”

    A President has no power to command large economic changes. Where in the Constitution is this power?

    Total student loan debt forgiveness is a bad idea….and it will likely cost Biden as many votes as he buys. But it doesn’t threaten our democracy or erode the institutions designed to protect it. It’s dumb, expensive, and has perverse incentives…and that’s what you run elections on…and why you need conservatives in Congress.

    The border comes closer until you look at the number of unfilled jobs we have in this country
    https://www.uschamber.com/workforce/understanding-americas-labor-shortage
    We DO need workers, but we have no sensible way of getting them into the country and tracking them. We’ve been talking about this issue since the 90’s. Biden is a mess on border security until we see what it means to have mass deportations, detention centers, and the military getting involved. You want a recipe for anarchy…put Stephen Miller in charge of the border.

    AJ_Liberty (5f05c3)

  80. #72

    Take a look at NJ Rob upthread and note the simiarity in sentence structure. 🙂

    Appalled (309913)

  81. RFK Jr is not a “nice guy”. At least his ex and deceased wives didn’t think so.

    https://people.com/books/robert-kennedy-jrs-troubled-marriages-detailed-in-new-book/

    He was also the earliest “stolen election” conspiracy guy (back in 2004).

    Also, I have the same opinion of anti-vaxxers that whembly has of open border types. They get people killed.

    Appalled (309913)

  82. That’s why I said “or control”, Kevin.

    That’s why I brought up transportation and energy. Do you assert that Biden is not trying to control those industries in fundamental ways?

    Kevin M (a9545f)

  83. Take a look at NJ Rob upthread and note the simiarity in sentence structure.

    Hunh?

    Kevin M (a9545f)

  84. Or the internet and flow of information. Does anyone deny that the Biden administration threatened social media organizations who didn’t play ball with his administration’s demands?

    Those who control the past controls the future. Who controls the present controls the past.’

    NJRob (eb56c3)

  85. He’s just saying he copied my post and replaced it with “trump” and “fascist” Kevin.

    Just tit for tat not realizing what he’s actually supporting by voting for Biden.

    NJRob (eb56c3)

  86. I still wish DeSantis could be the candidate, but the bottom line is Trump will be kept on guardrails. The establishment will be against him. The media will be against him. The left is against anyone that prevents their agenda.

    You cannot say the same with Biden.

    NJRob (eb56c3)

  87. #85

    Nope. I am illutrating it is just empty rhetoric, NJ.

    #86

    I think we have seen over the past year that any guardrails against Trump are pretty easily removed and he has a lot of people willing to smile and clear them out of the way. I can accept an argument that what Biden will do is worse than Trump in your view. But the idea that Trump won’t be constantly straining at the rails to go more authoritarian, and Fox News and the GOP will be fully assisting in that effort is totally at variance with what we see.

    Appalled (309913)

  88. 78
    whembly (86df54) — 5/17/2024 @ 11:18 am .

    Regardless who wins… a massive “blank” vote counts would be a huge story.

    Since there is usually a dropoff in votes the lower you go down the ballot, a dropoff is only detectable when it is massive.

    More detectable is votes in a party for the next office being more than for president. Protest votes are more noticeable, but there may not be any good ones..

    Sammy Finkelman (e0dccb)

  89. https://www.newser.com/story/350492/israel-recovers-bodies-of-3-hostages-in-gaza.html

    The Israeli military said Friday its troops in Gaza found the bodies of three Israeli hostages taken by Hamas during its Oct. 7 attack, including German-Israeli Shani Louk, who was previously believed killed in the attack. [Believed correctly that is] A photo of the 22-year-old’s twisted body in the back of a pickup truck ricocheted around the world and brought to light the scale of the militants’ attack on communities in southern Israel, the AP reports. Military spokesman Rear Adm. Daniel Hagari said the bodies were recovered in an overnight operation, reports the Times of Israel.

    Sammy Finkelman (e0dccb)

  90. That’s why I brought up transportation and energy. Do you assert that Biden is not trying to control those industries in fundamental ways?

    The federal government has always had a regulatory role over both sectors. This isn’t a new thing under Biden. My question was how this “international socialism” has spread.

    BTW, the more serious spread we’ve seen over the last decade or so has been of despotism, not socialism, and Rob’s boy Trump likes his despots.

    Paul Montagu (1e8339)

  91. I know some of you said as much, but do you think it’s worth trying to get momentum amongst your peers to leave the field BLANK for POTUS as a way to signal both parties that these two candidates are unacceptable?

    Whether a protest vote or a non-vote, either choice is a rejection of both candidates from both major parties. I’m still going with the former, like I did the last two presidential elections.

    Paul Montagu (1e8339)

  92. The notion that Trump will be confined by “guardrails” is laughable. With the backing of a Republican Congress and judiciary, there will be little he couldn’t get away with, especially with an administration that believes in the unitary executive model of governance.

    Rip Murdock (5c27ec)

  93. (And Biden still says Bush 43 was illegitimate.)

    https://www.usatoday.com/story/theoval/2013/06/12/biden-gore-george-w-bush-2000-election/2414933/

    SaveFarris (3e16a1) — 5/16/2024 @ 9:21 pm

    That quote is from over a decade ago. Anything more recent?

    Rip Murdock (5c27ec)

  94. Kevin M (a9545f) — 5/17/2024 @ 10:29 am
    I completely agree, Kevin M.

    felipe (5e2a04)

  95. whiniest and sorest loser in the presidential annals.
    Paul Montagu (895dc0) — 5/17/2024 @ 8:26 am

    I absolutely agree that this is how History will remember Trump. Well said, Paul.

    felipe (5e2a04)

  96. AJ_Liberty (c76b5b) — 5/17/2024 @ 4:58 am

    Good comment, AJ, I enjoyed reading it.

    felipe (5e2a04)

  97. #BallAndStrikeCallingPurists don’t think that crying about an election 13 years later has any merit.

    BuDuh (4214e4)

  98. @49 for conservatives not populists the lesser of the two evils is the senile old fool biden. For the leftys like me its trump who will discredit even more the donor class and corporate establishment stooges who run the democrat party to keep the left from taking over the party.

    asset (5c9343)

  99. @92

    …especially with an administration that believes in the unitary executive model of governance.

    Rip Murdock (5c27ec) — 5/17/2024 @ 2:00 pm

    You mean… a concept that every past Presidents has advocated for…

    Ya’ll act like Trump would destroy this country, while ignoring the current administration’s maladministrations.

    whembly (a43e5a)

  100. “The executive Power shall be vested in a President of the United States of America.” Article II, first sentence, of the Constitution. That’s it. Period. All she wrote.

    I don’t know who came up with the unitary executive meaninglessness. I first heard the phrase along with “Bush Doctrine” another phrase the media invented.

    Congress can name and fund agencies and departments, but they are all under the President’s authority and only with whatever “independence” the President chooses to allow them. Congress can pass laws which these departments and agencies cannot transgress any more than the President can, but it cannot make them para-executives outside the President’s authority.

    Hippies! Mein Gott!

    nk (bb1548)

  101. “Unitary Theory” was debated/discussed in various forms during the 1787 convention.

    whembly (a43e5a)

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