Patterico's Pontifications

7/12/2022

Republicans And Democrats: Give Us Better Candidates

Filed under: General — Dana @ 9:29 am



[guest post by Dana]

Bad news for the top 2024 wannabes.

Looking where former President Trump is at with Republicans:

Nearly half of all Republican primary voters want a candidate other than former President Donald Trump as president in 2024, according to a New York Times/Siena College poll released on Tuesday, the latest sign the former president’s grip on the Republican party may be slipping as the January 6 committee continues to spotlight bombshell revelations about Trump’s actions during the Capitol riots.

Nearly two-thirds of Republican voters under 35 as well as adults with at least a college degree said they would not vote for Trump in a presidential primary, according to the poll, which was conducted from July 5 to 7.

Roughly 16% of GOP voters said they would support Democratic President Joe Biden, a third party candidate or would abstain from voting altogether if Trump were the Republican nominee, in what would be a jump from 2020, when 9% of R

Republicans voted for a candidate besides Trump, according to AP VoteCast.

[…]

The poll is the latest indication Trump’s sway among the Republican party may be weakening. It comes after several Congressional and gubernatorial candidates endorsed by Trump have lost to their non-Trump-backed opponents—at times, by a landslide—though Trump has seen some wins among endorsees. The survey also follows six public hearings from the House panel tasked with investigating the January 6 riots.

Besides his preferred candidates’ losses and some shocking allegations made at the Jan. 6 Committee hearings, another reason why Trump’s influence and popularity may understandably be waning is that he has simply exhausted Americans with his endless drama and non-stop lies about the 2020 election.

As for President Biden, well, yikes:

President Biden is facing an alarming level of doubt from inside his own party, with 64 percent of Democratic voters saying they would prefer a new standard-bearer in the 2024 presidential campaign, according to a New York Times/Siena College poll, as voters nationwide have soured on his leadership, giving him a meager 33 percent job-approval rating.

Widespread concerns about the economy and inflation have helped turn the national mood decidedly dark, both on Mr. Biden and the trajectory of the nation. More than three-quarters of registered voters see the United States moving in the wrong direction, a pervasive sense of pessimism that spans every corner of the country, every age range and racial group, cities, suburbs and rural areas, as well as both political parties.

Only 13 percent of American voters said the nation was on the right track — the lowest point in Times polling since the depths of the financial crisis more than a decade ago.

[…]

[O]nly 26 percent of Democratic voters said the party should renominate him in 2024.

President Biden has a number of issues confronting him that he just can’t seem to get a handle on. A lack of solid response to the abortion issue is frustrating his supporters, as well as concerns about the economy, high gas prices, crime, etc. And then there is the plain fact that many young voters think that Biden is just too old to run again:

“I’m just going to come out and say it: I want younger blood,” said Nicole Farrier, a 38-year-old preschool teacher in East Tawas, a small town in northern Michigan. “I am so tired of all old people running our country. I don’t want someone knocking on death’s door.”

Ouch!

So, who’s in the wings? Well, setting Trump aside, Gov. DeSantis is polling at the top for the GOP – and by a longshot. But on the left side of the aisle, it’s anybody’s guess. Vice-president Kamala Harris said recently that she will be Biden’s “ticket-mate” in the 2024 election. However, if Biden opts out and Harris herself runs for the presidency, she’ll likely have an uphill battle, given her unpopularity. So, who might be itching to take get an early foothold on the Democratic ticket? I don’t know, but I do know that Gov. Newsom of California isn’t trolling Florida’s Gov. DeSantis of Florida just for the fun of it.

A sampling of other possible candidates whose names are being bandied about: Ted Cruz, Mike Pence, Kristi Noem, J.B. Pritzker, Gretchen Whitmer, and…Bernie Sanders (he would be 83 by Inauguration Day 2025!).

–Dana

93 Responses to “Republicans And Democrats: Give Us Better Candidates”

  1. Hello.

    Dana (1225fc)

  2. If the Democrats want to field a winning candidate, they should look at Larry Hogan.

    John Boddie (3f90ad)

  3. Would be great to have better choices.
    But I doubt Trumps ego will permit anyone else on the GOP ticket and Biden is the incumbent president so it will likely be another opportunity to pick the least bad alternative.

    Time123 (08d0ae)

  4. A Sanders-Trump match-up in two years is exactly what America deserves after lousing everything up for so long.

    JVW (020d31)

  5. Yes please. The last two elections were “1”s versus “2”s. As if both parties were intellectually bankrupt.

    Kevin M (eeb9e9)

  6. A Sanders-Trump match-up in two years is exactly what America deserves after lousing everything up for so long.

    Why not AOC-Trump? Sanders is too likeable.

    Kevin M (eeb9e9)

  7. #4

    And DCSCA smiled.

    Appalled (b2203e)

  8. I’m hoping the GOP litmus test in 2024 is “will you pardon Trump?”

    Kevin M (eeb9e9)

  9. Or, better yet, “Where should Trump be buried?”

    Kevin M (eeb9e9)

  10. Hawley asking simple questions is now deemed “violence”:
    https://twitter.com/abigailmarone/status/1546892242899668992

    whembly (b770f8)

  11. “Why not AOC-Trump? Sanders is too likeable.”

    Likeable… heh… that’s what some used to say about Lavrentiy Beria.

    Colonel Haiku (cd2af6)

  12. I agree with the preschool teacher. Candidates under 60 might be nice.

    Nic (896fdf)

  13. Assuming Trump runs, the GOP will need to figure out how not to dilute the field too much….because that will be the express lane to more Trump. There are some who can wait and others who their time has probably passed. I want a smoke-filled room to eventually decide the small collective who will test the waters and who will then arrive at the 2 or 3 that can go the distance. I like governors and hope to see some good alternatives from that pool.

    And even though there are loyal Democrats talking up Biden, I doubt anyone is excited about running him again. It would almost be elder abuse to put him out there…..and there simply shouldn’t be the need. It’s embarrassing that the Democrat pool is so shallow that it’s either octogenarians, shifty VP’s, or Twitter influencers (a bit exaggerated, but not by much). The DEMs can’t make Biden a lame duck yet…but I expect him to bow out sometime after the midterms, giving enough time for a field to assemble.

    AJ_Liberty (ec7f74)

  14. I thought Democrats were going to push Liz Cheney. They’re certainly funding her current race.

    DeSantis is an acceptable compromise for most of the Republican party. For those who say he is unacceptable, I would say that I don’t think they are part of the party.

    NJRob (eb56c3)

  15. I’m predicting Ron DeSantis VS Pete Buttigieg in 2024.

    Mattsky (144617)

  16. Let’s not forget that Kasich stayed in the race to block Cruz and get Trump the nomination in 2016. He was trying to block conservativism more than win election.

    NJRob (eb56c3)

  17. I agree with the preschool teacher. Candidates under 60 might be nice.

    No. More. Baby Boomers.

    [Yeah, technically Joe Biden, born 1942, isn’t a boomer. And neither is Bernard Sanders (1941). But Donald Trump (1946) is, as are Hillary Clinton (1947), Elizabeth Warren (1949), Larry Hogan (1956 – sorry John Boddie), Greg Abbott (1957), Mike Pence (1959), Amy Klobuchar (1960), and some others of note. If we can disqualify all of them, I’m willing to take my chances with the remainders.]

    JVW (020d31)

  18. John Kasich, born 1952, is right out.

    JVW (020d31)

  19. Sorry, Michelle Obama (born January 17, 1964), if you were born before the Beatles first played on The Ed Sullivan Show (February 9, 1964) then I consider you a Boomer.

    JVW (020d31)

  20. She’s not a Boomer JVW.

    Generation Jones 1954 to 1965 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Generation_Jones

    I was born in 1963 and have never felt I fit in with Boomers.

    Mattsky (144617)

  21. Likeable… heh… that’s what some used to say about Lavrentiy Beria.

    When my daughters were dating and my wife would talk about the guys in question, she would be often say something to the effect that they were “nice guys”. My response was simple, “So was Ted Bundy”

    Horatio (e4f2d8)

  22. I was born in 1963 and have never felt I fit in with Boomers.

    Sorry Mattsky, but I’m a stickler about these things and have a pretty unbendable criteria. Boomers were born nine months after the first waves of U.S. servicemen started returning from World War II (the first troops left Europe in May 1945), and that generation extends right up until the Beatles played Sullivan. Everyone born between February 10, 1964 and the day Ronald Reagan was inaugurated is Gen X. I simply don’t recognize Generation Jones, because then the Baby Boom generation is the briefest generation in our history (eight years) and it would be harder for me to indiscriminately hate on as many people.

    There are some — alas, not me — who peg the end of the Baby Boom as the day John F. Kennedy was shot, so if you were born after November 22 of 1963 then I know in certain quarters you can claim to be part of Gen X. I get that you don’t feel that you fit in with the Boomers, but hey, lots of people born on December 20 don’t feel Sagittarian, even though they technically are.

    JVW (020d31)

  23. I would say that I don’t think they are part of the party.

    I would say that anyone who doesn’t believe in the big tent should be kicked out of the party!

    Kevin M (eeb9e9)

  24. Sad but true, Horatio.

    Colonel Haiku (cd2af6)

  25. Dana, per your NYT link, even though Biden’s approval ratings are an abysmal 33%, he still beats Trump 44-41.
    If that’s not a reason to jettison Trump and nominate a different Republican, I don’t know what is.

    Paul Montagu (5de684)

  26. I agree with the preschool teacher. Candidates under 60 might be nice.
    Nic (896fdf) — 7/12/2022 @ 10:41 am

    i hope it’s biden versus desantis, if only to illustrate how vapid these pronouncements are

    JF (bb1686)

  27. I was born in 1963 and have never felt I fit in with Boomers.

    Technically, Boomers are 1946-1965, but my feeling has always been that if your childhood doesn’t include knowing where you were when you heard that JFK was killed, you aren’t a Boomer. It deeply affected us all.

    As much a defining moment as 9/11 was for Millennials.

    Kevin M (eeb9e9)

  28. Ford And Chevy: Give Us Better Cars

    DCSCA (8471ce)

  29. No problem w/a boomer POTUS. We need one who knows 1968 was a year, and not the price of a filet mignon.

    DCSCA (8471ce)

  30. I commented several months ago:

    Trump’s phenomenal energy for a man his age is going to run out. Trump may have a major health issue. Trump may not be alive in 2024. No one defeats Father Time.

    And people are getting tired of his act.

    DN (f72143)

  31. @30. “The people” are his act.

    He’s merely the current flag bearer for the swelling ranks of populism. When he moves on, another will pick up the standard.

    DCSCA (8471ce)

  32. JVW I was born before November 22 of 1963 but even if I wasn’t I don’t feel I fit with the Gen X either. Somebody born in 1946 had the Vietnam war and the draft. That was a very different dynamics then what I had. I was in college from 1981 to 1985. Nobody protested anything. The invasion of Grenada was over before most people figured out where it was. I was most concerned about where my next beer was coming from. I’d be willing to start Generation Jones in 1956. That gives you 10 years of Boomers to hate.

    Mattsky (a91d0d)

  33. “And people are getting tired of his act.”

    Yes, some may be. But you may be missing the point: a great many Americans have developed an intense dislike for Democrats… much stronger than any affection for Donald Trump.

    Colonel Haiku (cd2af6)

  34. I wish someone would run on ridding American taxpayers of the baseline accounting system. Or a budget. It is pathetic mitch and his band of thieves have not delivered a budget in all these years.
    We deserve worse than Trump.

    mg (8cbc69)

  35. The POTUS and the government around the office simply needs to keep pace with the increasingly accelerating changes of a relentlessly progressing society, the technologies that move it along and the attitudes of those living with it.

    For the apes who cling to the Sacred Scrolls, keep in mind that the average life expectancy in the America of 1787 was about 36 years or there abouts for a white male. The minimum age for a POTUS, inked w/a goose quill on parchment– is 35.

    http://www.legacy.com/life-and-death/the-liberty-era.html

    DCSCA (8471ce)

  36. I’d be willing to start Generation Jones in 1956. That gives you 10 years of Boomers to hate.

    It’s a tempting offer and I am inclined to give it serious consideration, but there are just far too many worthy targets I would have to let off the hook: Barack Obama, Kevin Spacey, Xavier Becerra, Madonna, to name but a few. It would be really, really difficult.

    JVW (020d31)

  37. Mattsky:

    So are we really generation Animal House?

    Appalled (b2203e)

  38. Nearly half of all Republican primary voters want a candidate other than former President Donald Trump as president in 2024, according to a New York Times/Siena College poll released on Tuesday, the latest sign the former president’s grip on the Republican party may be slipping as the January 6 committee continues to spotlight bombshell revelations about Trump’s actions during the Capitol riots.

    MAGAWorld is not amused.

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  39. “He’s merely the flag bearer for the swelling ranks of populism. When he moves on, another will pick up his standard.”

    Which I am perfectly aware of. I voted for Trump twice. I now want him to shut up and go away.

    Trump won the 2016 nomination because the establishment types (the Bushes, Cheneys, McCain, Romney, Ryan, etc) had refused to address the concerns of rank and file Republican voters.

    DN (f72143)

  40. @39. If memory serves, should he run and win again, he can only serve one term– so who he selects as VP is likely more important for this cycle as the next standard bearer.

    _____

    And lest the D’s & R’s forget, HRC is forever tanned, rested and ready since her national debut in LIFE from June, 1969, 30 days before the first moon landing 53 years ago this month. If the party calls, she will answer, of course. Not as POTUS, but VPOTUS. Being named Joe’s VP at the convention, after giving Kamala the Eagleton bum’s-rush, is a bird fueled on the pad ready to launch. The ‘ultimate trip’ into the Oval for her w/a heavy resume compared to lightweight Kamala, no campaigning, no fundraising and a POTUS w/one foot out the door and a pine box in his future.

    DCSCA (8471ce)

  41. Hi DN —

    Maybe you’ve addressed this somewhere else, but why do you want Trump to retire?

    Appalled (b2203e)

  42. Mattsky:

    So are we really generation Animal House?

    Appalled on the first anniversary of John Belushi’s death there was a food fight in the college’s dining commons. My frat some how got blamed for it. I remember the President of my fraternity telling the Dean of Students: “Why don’t you just put us on double secret probation and move on.” We were told that Animal House was a bad template to operate from.

    I think you may be on to something.

    Mattsky (a91d0d)

  43. Musk fires back: Trump’s too old and creates “too much drama” for 2024
    ……..
    Trump ripped Musk over the weekend for allegedly sucking up by privately claiming to have supported Trump in 2020, after which Musk declared that he’d never voted for a Republican this year. “So he’s another bull**** artist!” Trump declared, and, um … he should know. Musk responded overnight in tweets that never quite add up to a denial (via Twitchy):
    ……..
    When it comes to trolling, Trump is clearly the winner here. Although in politics, especially these days, being called a “bull**** artist” isn’t an insult, it’s a qualification — as Trump and Joe Biden know all too well.

    However, when it comes to an actual argument, Musk may come out on top:
    ………
    [Drama and age] are two of the main three arguments Trump will have to answer if he launches a run at the GOP presidential nomination. Drama can be useful, but it requires a deft and disciplined touch to keep it from destroying your own edifices. Trump used drama effectively until the pandemic, when he failed to realize that the American public wanted calm and cool leadership in a real crisis. That exposed his lack of discipline and political foresight and cost him the election to the barely-moving Biden. It then got exponentially worse when Trump tried to use chaos and drama to force states to reconsider their election results. The resulting riot on January 6 shows the danger of undisciplined drama and chaos.

    Second is Trump’s age, and there’s no getting around that. It’s true that Trump is far more energetic and vital than Joe Biden, but that’s a very low bar, too. Trump will turn 78 in 2024, and the risks of age-related infirmities increase by the day. Why put the Oval Office at risk in that manner, especially when other alternatives are at hand, such as Musk’s suggestion of Ron DeSantis? Especially when Trump carries enough baggage from the past six years that could easily be avoided with a fresh-start candidate?
    ……..
    Finally, although Musk doesn’t mention this, Republicans will have to consider a third problem with a Trump nomination. He would only be constitutionally eligible for a single term, which means he’d be a lame-duck president almost from the moment he took office. Republicans would spend four years jockeying behind the scenes for the next presidential nomination, and likely would force another fight between the wings of the GOP that would last all through that term. Isn’t it better to have that fight now, in a shorter period of time, when the political environment for Republicans is as good as it has been in decades?

    Does Trump himself provide so much unalloyed value to the Republican Party that they’re willing to essentially toss away the opportunity for eight years of control of the White House? Before answering that, remember that the only two times in the past century that the same party kept the White House in an election while changing presidents was in 1988, when George H.W. Bush won after two terms of Ronald Reagan, and in 1928 when Calvin Coolidge demurred on re-election and Herbert Hoover won for the GOP. ……
    ………

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  44. Musk fires back: Trump’s too old and creates “too much drama” for 2024

    Drama? You launched a sports car into space, Elon.

    How’s that trip to Mars coming along? Mars, Pennsylvania awaits to take you to their leader.

    DCSCA (8471ce)

  45. 35. DCSCA (8471ce) — 7/12/2022 @ 1:20 pm

    the average life expectancy in the America of 1787 was about 36 years or there abouts for a white male.

    That’s a misleading statistic. Such astatistic includes alot of child mortality.

    Sammy Finkelman (1d215a)

  46. @46. No. it’s not.

    DCSCA (8471ce)

  47. George Washington 67

    John Adams 90

    Thomas Jefferson 83

    James Monore 73

    James Madison 85

    Benjamin Franklin 84

    Alexander Hamilton 49 (dueling)

    And on and on…It’s a misleading stastic DCSCA.

    NJRob (eb56c3)

  48. I’m with JVW and Dustin on this one.

    It’s conceivable Pence decided it would be better to accept the VP offer than to let some Trumphumper end up with it. If the decent kid takes his ball and goes home, who knows what the neighborhood ne’er-do-wells will devolve into.

    I don’t care that much about Pence remaining silent during Trump’s term, and I’m not even sure he was that silent. He may have said things to Trump that dissuaded Mr. Smack from doing even worse.

    Pence showed his mettle when push came to shove.

    If Republicans want to win in 2024, they need the votes of Trumpers and non-Trumpers alike (this should be beyond dispute), so don’t expect Pence, Desantis, Haley, Pompeo or any other serious contender to call out Trump for the con man he is.

    For political junkies like us, the easiest political game to play is Spot the Truest and Most Principled Conservative. Unfortunately, that isn’t the only consideration when it comes to deciding on a candidate. One has to weigh the climate of opinion, and then support the best politician who has a chance of winning.

    Never let the perfect be the enemy of the good.

    norcal (da5491)

  49. Larry Elder Is Considering a Presidential Run in 2024

    Yes, let’s take California Republicanism national! Just when you thought you’d escaped Trump, we get “worse than Trump.”

    Kevin M (eeb9e9)

  50. It’s conceivable Pence decided it would be better to accept the VP offer than to let some Trumphumper end up with it.

    It could have been Giuliani.

    Kevin M (eeb9e9)

  51. @51 Yes. One of the very select Trumphumpers.

    norcal (da5491)

  52. Bush vs Gore
    Bush vs Kerry/Edwards
    McCain vs Obama
    Obama vs Romney
    Trump vs Clinton
    Biden vs Trump

    I like GWB but to be honest everyone on the list above is/was mediocre at best. I chose to put the whole Kerry/Edwards ticket on the list because they were 2 spectacular phonies that combined into the equivalent of 3 megatons of phony

    steveg (01d7be)

  53. @53 Romney was mediocre? Maybe at campaigning, but not as a man.

    norcal (da5491)

  54. That dumbass marched in Provo with BLM, norcal. He’s an idiot.

    Colonel Haiku (cd2af6)

  55. @55 Marching to protest the killing of George Floyd does not equate to supporting the whole BLM agenda, just like my vote for Trump in 2016 did not mean I supported everything he said and did.

    norcal (da5491)

  56. Apologies to all for my off-topic comment at 49.

    My computer was stuck in some previous dimension.

    norcal (da5491)

  57. 56… if that’s what you need to believe, go with it. All those cities aflame, people killed, police injured in the summer of 2020 by BLM/Antifa… can’t say I remember Romney denouncing any of that, maybe I missed it though…

    Colonel Haiku (cd2af6)

  58. @54 romney would’ve put george floyd on his car rack

    JF (715830)

  59. @59 😁

    I’ll bet Floyd would have taken that deal.

    norcal (da5491)

  60. @48. No, it’s not. The ‘misleading stat’ is trying to use the small pool of rich white, privileged land holders, as your base– unless you believe that’s the only pool of people worthy of POTUS potential and that’s who they quilled the minimum age for.

    DCSCA (bcbf88)

  61. C’mon man! Just because these folks flamed out in previous primaries doesn’t mean they’re done.

    Scott Walker
    Chris Christie
    Whassit name… Kaisitch.
    Karly Something — the lady CEO.
    Another forgettable princeling Bush
    [Ayn] Rand Paul
    And let’s not rule out Kushner and Junior

    On the other side we always have
    Hillary.
    Bernie.
    John Freakin’ Kerry
    lately we might see
    Michelle Obama
    Chelsea Clinton who is 40 something by now
    seriously, we ought to at least look at
    Tulsi Gabbard and/or Tammy Baldwin

    Pouncer (fe2e0d)

  62. Junior is the guy after the Dem after DeSantis. Prime beneficiary of an Agnew deal. Gravity won’t be kind to his first lady if he keeps the same one.

    urbanleftbehind (d5b707)

  63. [Ayn] Rand Paul

    Pouncer (fe2e0d) — 7/12/2022 @ 8:29 pm

    I have been blind to that connection all this time. Makes perfect sense. Ayn Rand was a libertarian, and so is Ron Paul.

    norcal (da5491)

  64. #42 asked “Why do you want Trump to retire?”

    Plenty of reasons aside from he’s too old. Trump wasn’t that effective in office anyway. He governed mainly as a vanilla Republican. He couldn’t stand up to his daughter and son-in-law.

    Trump beat “the strongest field in GOP history” for the nomination. Each one of them one at a time. Trump, as I indicated above, promised border control something we NEVER get from the establishment types of both parties. He also indicated he wouldn’t continue the endless wars.

    Trump made some sound moves, trimmed things around the edges but didn’t really follow through.

    Trump talks too much, thinks out loud, and says stupid things into an open microphone. When Ghislaine Maxwell (Jeffrey Epstein’s cohort) was arrested in 2020, Trump said, “I wish her well.” Stupid.

    Trump should have conceded the weekend after the election, taken the high road, stressed the positives. Instead he “challenged” the election, something that has never been done successfully. Trump did nothing to prevent it. A stolen election has to be stopped BEFORE it happens.

    Trump helped cause the two Senate defeats in Georgia costing the Senate. He then had the January 6 “rally,” which would change nothing. It was obvious something would happen, from agent provocateurs if nothing else. And Republicans would be blamed no matter what. Stupid. Ann Coulter has explained it best.

    That’s why I want Trump to go away.

    DN (f72143)

  65. Interesting take, DN.

    norcal (da5491)

  66. For the apes who cling to the Sacred Scrolls:

    What was life like for the average US citizen in the 1700’s?

    The men of the time would, most likely, be farming (on a small plot of land) hunting, or fishing. If they wanted chicken or pork chops for dinner, they would slaughter the animal themselves; as opposed to having someone else perform the task. Society was male-dominated in the 1700’s, so only men held political offices.

    Women in those times did their own sewing and quilting. They raised large families, prepared meals, made clothing, soap, and candles, preserved food, fetched water, and did laundry by hand. Wealthy women could sometimes own property and slaves.

    Throughout the colonies, life was centered on the family. Large families of eight or more children were common, and the children would attend a one room school house. Children also spent their time doing chores, playing, learning a craft or trade. All people worshipped in their preferred church and preferred religion.

    Medicine was poorly administered during this time. Doctors were rare and usually poorly trained, oftentimes making the problem worse through ignorant malpractice. Getting severely sick during this time would be a death sentence, and amputations of infected limbs were common. The average life expectancy of 1700’s America was only 36 years old. Child mortality rates were high, and it was common to not even assign your baby a name until they were around 2 years old because it was more likely than not that the baby would die. Drinking water quality was usually quite poor, so the average American would instead drink beer, cider, or whiskey. – https://www.quora.com/What-was-life-like-for-the-average-US-citizen-in-the-1700s

    Which should lead a keeper of the Sacred Scrolls to ask, why quill the minimum age limit to 35… but then, they know why.

    So did Taylor.

    DCSCA (bcbf88)

  67. steveg, I guess the question is, under what criteria? Certainly McCain was an imperfect candidate in a virtually unwinnable election. Housing collapse….war fatigue…..old vs charismatic…VP with sketchy qualifications….2008 required a miracle. At the time, I remember sitting in a hot tub and ticking off 10 reasons why McCain was not my favorite from the GOP field and couldn’t quite grasp how he got the nod.

    However in the intervening time as we’ve drifted into partisan obsession, I see what McCain brought. He understood that you have to be the President of ALL the people…not just the red states….and you can’t simply write off half the country as your enemy. Sure he compromised a lot, but as I see more clearly now, you do have to negotiate in good faith and I think he did.

    The same with Romney. He wasn’t the best campaigner…having his fair share of gaffes…..and missing his opportunities in the final debate, but we tend to judge these guys on the purity of their ideology versus their ability to lead. How many of our best Presidents would be effective in today’s gotcha media environment? We need smart thoughtful people who have experience with problem solving and tested character. McCain and Romney both eclipse Trump who still can’t handle the reality of an election loss….and surrounds himself by questionable influencers….from Flynn to Bannon to the Pillow Guy. It’s hard to hide from character flaws….

    AJ_Liberty (c82e21)

  68. Trump should just be glad Elon Musk isn’t eligible.

    Kevin M (eeb9e9)

  69. Trump wasn’t that effective in office anyway.

    Which would be news to NATO dead beats now coughing up their fair share. And, of course:

    -Reshaping the federal judiciary
    -Space Force
    -Tax reform (The law was the biggest overhaul to the nation’s tax code in three decades)
    -Defeating ISIS’s caliphate and killing Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi
    -First Step Act
    -Moves embassy to Jerusalem

    DCSCA (bcbf88)

  70. Dropping to 33%-30% approval numbers in 18 months is Joey’s “accomplishment.”

    Biden/Clinton 2024.

    Expect it.

    DCSCA (bcbf88)

  71. mg had the funniest pairing.

    Feinstein/commie chauffeur 2024

    norcal (da5491)

  72. With Joey hovering a 33%-30% approval numbers he heads to the Mideast; the last POTUS with those dismal numbers and dwindling political leverage to make a similar trip there was The Big Dick, weeks before he resigned.

    Attaboy, Joey.

    DCSCA (bcbf88)

  73. @AJ@68 I think McCain was very charismatic as well, but the circumstances of the country were against him and his VP pick was, er, umm. I also had concerns with his health and age. Romney felt very competent and stable to me, but he Did Not have the common touch and that hurt him a lot IMO.

    Nic (896fdf)

  74. California is now requiring gun manufactures and dealers to not sell guns to high risk individuals including insurrectionists.

    asset (6e7373)

  75. So asset,

    Your friends can’t buy guns in California anymore? Good to know.

    NJRob (eb56c3)

  76. #64 norcal: “Makes perfect sense. Ayn Rand was a libertarian, and so is Ron Paul.”

    It makes sense, but apparently it’s not true, though he may have adopted that shortened form of “Randal” as a tribute to her.

    More importantly, he is an odd, but not unique, form of libertarian:

    Sen. Rand Paul, R-Ky., defended a Senate aide who once espoused pro-secession and neo-Confederate views, calling him “incredibly talented” during an interview with the Huffington Post.

    The Washington Free Beacon Tuesday reported that Jack Hunter, who serves as social media director for Paul, once worked as a radio shock jock for two different stations in Charleston, S.C., advocating for secession and the Confederacy. Hunter, who helped write Paul’s book “The Tea Party Goes to Washington,” called himself the “Southern Avenger” and wore a Confederate flag mask at public appearances.

    Although Paul has mostly stayed away from his father’s open racism, he has flirted enough with it to make me wonder whether he is, at heart, a “neoconfederate libertarian”. (And yes, there are such people, for example, Lew Rockwell.)

    Paul was also a frequent plagiarist:

    In October 2013, Paul was the subject of some controversy when it was discovered that he had plagiarized from Wikipedia part of a speech in support of Virginia gubernatorial candidate Ken Cuccinelli. Referencing the movie Gattaca, Paul quoted almost verbatim from the Wikipedia article about the film without citing the source.[124][125][126] Evidence soon surfaced that Paul had copied sentences in a number of his other speeches nearly verbatim from other authors without giving credit to the original sources,[127][128] including in the speech he had given as the Tea Party rebuttal to the president’s 2013 State of the Union Address. In addition, a three-page-long passage of Paul’s book Government Bullies was taken directly from an article by the conservative think tank The Heritage Foundation.[129][130] When it became apparent that Paul’s op-ed in The Washington Times on mandatory minimums and related testimony he had given before the Senate Judiciary Committee both contained material that was virtually identical to an article that had been published by another author in The Week a few days earlier,[131] the Washington Times said that the newspaper would no longer publish the weekly column Paul had been contributing to the paper.[132] After a week of almost daily news reports of new allegations of plagiarism, Paul said that he was being held to an “unfair standard”, but would restructure his office in order to prevent mistakes in the future, if that would be what it would take “to make people leave me the hell alone.”

    A man of character wuld not blame the staff, for his thefts. Or want to be both an elected official, and left alone.

    Jim Miller (406a93)

  77. @78 Plagiarism is never a good thing. But it sounds like he would fit in as a D candidate for POTUS. Now he just needs a female VP who had an affair with a mayor.

    frosty (4a4466)

  78. The ever-relevant French explains why DeSantis is not worse than Trump, although the FL governor is more like the opposite side of the DeSantis-Newsom coin in the way they govern. In other words, DeSantis is not an unhinged unfit psycho but not terribly conservative either, given his use of the levers of power.

    Paul Montagu (5de684)

  79. McCain was very charismatic as well, but the circumstances of the country were against him

    Does anyone else live in a region where the black and white silhouette POW-MIA flag flies just below the stars and stripes in many front yards, and even at public buildings like the Post Office?

    I see it daily. And I talk to those, my age and older, who remember John McCain much the way they regard John Kerry. Veterans, it’s claimed, have a special duty to return prisoners and recover remains. And McCain — like Kerry — accused of, at best, neglecting that duty. (The extreme forms of the accusation accuse him of destroying the evidence that North Vietnam was still holding live POWs in the 1980s.)

    I’m not sure McCain ever had a chance at winning with this edge of the right wing angry or disappointed with him.

    Pouncer (1658ab)

  80. Nothing screams “neglect of duty” like being a prisoner of war, refusing to come home early when offered it because of a father’s high rank, and having captors who permanently damage one’s arms.

    norcal (da5491)

  81. @82. McCain graduated from the Naval Academy in June 1958; he was fifth from the bottom in class rank, 894th out of 899… and a lousy aviator, norcal:

    “After the third accident, you would say: Is there a trend here in terms of his flying skills and his judgment?”

    https://www.latimes.com/archives/la-xpm-2008-oct-06-na-aviator6-story.html

    But give him this- he had more balls than Pierre Delecto. McCain was the first sitting senator to host “Saturday Night Live,” in 2002. He appeared on the late-night series three times in all, once as host and two times as a special guest/cameo, notably lampooning his unsuccessful campaigns for president. Pierre, right in character, ran away from the offer to host.

    DCSCA (fb2981)

  82. Never forget these wise words:

    You need to get to go and need to be able to get where you need to go. -KH

    Yes, we need better. I’m not sure we deserve better or that we’ll get it. But we need it.

    frosty (d10448)

  83. President Biden admits he was given prepared list of reporters to call on during joint news presser in Israel

    ‘During a joint news conference with Israeli Prime Minister Yair Lapid on Thursday morning in Jerusalem, President Biden said he was “given a list” of reporters to take questions from.

    The president made the gaffe after taking one question from an Israeli reporter. Afterwards, he was prompted to call on more reporters, when he said, “Um, sure. Uh, I was given a list here,” before reading off the name of Reuters reporter Steve Holland.

    As the conference went on, Biden repeatedly looked down at his list to call on reporters. “The next person to ask us a question, I guess, is Nadia [Bilbassy],” he said referring to a reporter for an Arabic news outlet.

    The gaffe came one day after Biden misspoke while referring to the Holocaust, shortly after landing in Israel to begin the first leg of his Middle East trip.

    “Later today, I will once more return to the hallowed ground of … Yad Vashem to honor the 6 million Jewish lives that were stolen in a genocide and continue — which we must do every, every day — continue to bear witness, to keep alive the truth and honor of the Holocaust — horror of the Holocaust — honor those we lost, so that we never, ever forget that lesson, you know, and to continue our shared, unending work to fight the poison of anti-Semitism wherever it raises its ugly head,” Biden said in comments covered by Fox News.

    This isn’t the first time President Biden has raised eyebrows for admitting to calling on a pre-approved list of reporters given to him by his staff.

    At a Russia-United States Summit in Geneva last year, the president was mocked for “saying the quiet part out loud” when he told reporters that “as usual,” he would only be calling on reporters his staff directed him to.

    More recently, Biden repeatedly referred to a list of names during a press conference in Madrid, Spain following the NATO Summit at the end of June. Looking down at his paper, he stated he was “told” to call on Darlene Superville from The Associated Press.

    According to one report, Biden’s staff avoids holding press events in the Oval Office because there is no teleprompter.

    During his first year in office, the president did far less formal sit-down interviews with journalists than his previous two predecessors. Donald Trump did 92, and Barack Obama did 156, while Joe Biden only did 22, according to data from Towson University’s White House Transition Project, Fox News reported.’ – source, FoxNews.com

    Memo to Xi: take Taiwan; he’ll never notice.
    Memo to Vlad: Computer virus Delaware banks; he’ll never notice.

    DCSCA (cffc86)

  84. For the Ds, a good question is who’s running things now? It’s not JB and it’s not KH. Maybe whoever that is could be on the ballot next time.

    frosty (90ebb8)

  85. For the Ds, a good question is who’s running things now? It’s not JB and it’s not KH. Maybe whoever that is could be on the ballot next time.

    frosty (90ebb8) — 7/14/2022 @ 2:07 pm

    Rasputin?

    norcal (da5491)

  86. Decade of Excellence: NASA Named Best Place to Work 10th Year in a Row

    For the 10th consecutive year, the Partnership for Public Service has ranked NASA the Best Place to Work in the Federal Government among large agencies.

    The rankings, announced Wednesday, reflect the agency’s continuing dedication to supporting and strengthening its workforce while also carrying out its inspirational mission of exploration and discovery for the benefit of all humanity. –
    https://www.nasa.gov/press-release/decade-of-excellence-nasa-named-best-place-to-work-10th-year-in-a-row

    Memo to Newt Gingrich: “We’re all out of corn flakes. F.U.”

    DCSCA (48d297)

  87. @87 He wouldn’t make my top 10 list. But this is a no judgment zone and there are no wrong answers.

    frosty (2e4675)

  88. @88 It’s interesting that the ranking is limited to the federal government but that needs to be broken down into large agencies and hopefully small agencies but I’ve got a feeling there are more than two categories.

    frosty (2e4675)

  89. John Bolton admits he’s helped plan coups in other countries while speaking to CNN’s Jake Tapper on live TV: ‘It takes a lot of work’

    ‘John Bolton told CNN that he’s helped plan coups in other countries. “As somebody who has helped plan coup d’état, not here, but other places, it takes a lot of work,” Bolton said. Bolton was making the case that Trump was too incompetent to have been involved in a carefully coordinated coup. John Bolton, who served in an array of key government roles across multiple Republican administrations, casually told CNN’s Jake Tapper that he’s helped plan coups in other countries.’ – businessinsider.com

    Leave it to Walrus Gumbo to gum up the narrative…

    … as Darth & Daughter Darth frowned.

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  90. John Bolton admits he’s helped plan coups in other countries

    DCSCA (f4c5e5) — 7/14/2022 @ 8:41 pm

    It’s better than planning coups in America, like Trump did.

    norcal (da5491)

  91. @92. Except he didn’t:

    Bolton denied that the Jan. 6, 2021, riots at the U.S. Capitol were a “carefully planned coup d’etat” spearheaded by Trump but claimed to have experience organizing other coups…

    https://people.com/politics/ex-national-security-advisor-john-bolton-admits-hes-planned-coups-says-it-takes-a-lot-of-work/

    DCSCA (ed173f)


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