Patterico's Pontifications

3/7/2022

Russians Drink the Kool-Aid Too

Filed under: General — Patterico @ 8:29 am



You know your crazy uncle — the guy who says Bill Gates is trying to implant microchips in everyone through the vaccines and that Donald Trump won the election? The guy who leaves all these opinions in the comment section of Patterico.com? That guy exists everywhere — including Russia. The New York Times reports:

Four days after Russia began dropping artillery shells on Kyiv, Misha Katsurin, a Ukrainian restaurateur, was wondering why his father, a church custodian living in the Russian city of Nizhny Novgorod, hadn’t called to check on him.

“There is a war, I’m his son, and he just doesn’t call,” Mr. Katsurin, who is 33, said in an interview. So, Mr. Katsurin picked up the phone and let his father know that Ukraine was under attack by Russia.

“I’m trying to evacuate my children and my wife — everything is extremely scary,” Mr. Katsurin told him.

He did not get the response he expected. His father, Andrei, didn’t believe him.

“No, no, no, no stop,” Mr. Katsurin said of his father’s initial response.

“He started to tell me how the things in my country are going,” said Mr. Katsurin, who converted his restaurants into volunteer centers and is temporarily staying near the western Ukrainian city of Ternopil. “He started to yell at me and told me, ‘Look, everything is going like this. They are Nazis.’”

In a recent article about unseen footage in a documentary about Roger Stone, the Washington Post cited “Stone’s Rules,” which the Post says is “a collection of career lessons including how voters will believe a ‘big lie’ if it is kept simple and repeated often enough.” Donald Trump knows this, because it works on your crazy uncle the Patterico commenter. And Vladimir Putin knows this, because it works on a lot of his people. Back to the Timesreport:

As Ukrainians deal with the devastation of the Russian attacks in their homeland, many are also encountering a confounding and almost surreal backlash from family members in Russia, who refuse to believe that Russian soldiers could bomb innocent people, or even that a war is taking place at all.

These relatives have essentially bought into the official Kremlin position: that President Vladimir V. Putin’s army is conducting a limited “special military operation” with the honorable mission of “de-Nazifying” Ukraine. Mr. Putin has referred to the Ukrainian president, Volodymyr Zelensky, a native Russian speaker with a Jewish background, as a “drug-addled Nazi” in his attempts to justify the invasion.

. . . .

Mr. Katsurin is not alone in his frustration. When Valentyna V. Kremyr wrote to her brother and sister in Russia to tell them that her son had spent days in a bomb shelter in the Kyiv suburb of Bucha because of the intensive fighting there, she was also met with disbelief.

“They believe that everything is calm in Kyiv, that no one is shelling Kyiv,” Ms. Kremyr said in a phone interview. She said her siblings think the Russians are striking military infrastructure “with precision, and that’s it.”

She said her sister Lyubov, who lives in Perm, wished her a happy birthday on Feb. 25, the second day of the invasion. When Ms. Kremyr wrote back about the situation on the ground, her sister’s answer via direct message was simple: “No one is bombing Kyiv, and you should actually be afraid of the Nazis, whom your father fought against. Your children will be alive and healthy. We love the Ukrainian people, but you need to think hard about who you elected as president.”

Similarly, This American Life did a segment last week on the Russian people’s views of Putin. The correspondent, Charles Maynes, had a problem: people in Russia are often understandably afraid to speak their minds. After all, their president has declared war on “Fake News” such as calling the war in Ukraine a war, and the punishment can be as much as 15 years. His solution: speak to a woman named Oleg Sergeevna whom he has known for years, who hosted him when he was an exchange student. She had always been honest and forthright with him. What she had to say was representative of what Trump cult members say here. The leader is awesome. The bad stories about him are Fake News. Maynes says:

For Olga Sergeevna it wasn’t just that Putin made the country better. It was that he could do no wrong.

Olga Sergeevna Dmitrieva
I love Putin.

Charles Maynes
Why?

Olga Sergeevna Dmitrieva
[SPEAKING RUSSIAN]

Charles Maynes
Because he’s smart, intelligent, cultured, athletic, she says. He’s even a musician, plays and sings.

. . . .

When it comes to the bad things Americans hear about Putin– that he’s corrupt, that he’s secretly one of the world’s richest men, or that he’s meddled in the American elections– Olga Sergeevna says that’s all lies perpetuated by Western journalists, people like me.

Ira Glass concludes the segment by saying:

This past week, he phoned Olga the day that Moscow invaded Ukraine to find out what she thought. She thinks Putin made the right call, that he was going in to help the separatists in Eastern Ukraine who’ve declared themselves independent of Ukraine and pro-Moscow. She believes Ukrainian authorities were going to attack people in that territory with arms they got from the United States.

The President of Ukraine, Zelensky, she told Charles he’s a clown. Biden’s a dope. Putin, still the smartest of the pack.

Putin is the smartest of them all, believe me, and he alone can fix it.

123 Responses to “Russians Drink the Kool-Aid Too”

  1. This is why I became an Independent for five years, to get out from under that propaganda yolk. I don’t regret it for a minute.

    Paul Montagu (5de684)

  2. I saw one of those “person(s) on the street interviews from somewhere in Russia, probably Moscow
    (Looked for it to link but can’t find it now)

    The reporter asked about the invasion and people said things like “I support Putin”
    When asked if they’d look at pictures from the Ukraine, they acted like the phone was about to squirt polonium. “no,no,no,no”
    The most honest guy said something like: I have to be careful with my words because it is not good to be on the television and mistakenly saying the wrong thing

    steveg (e81d76)

  3. Damn, I’ve been found out.

    Kevin M (38e250)

  4. cuz bin laden analogies don’t have that zing anymore

    JF (ccced3)

  5. There’s that old Groucho line about what to believe, “you, or my own two eyes.”

    Kevin M (38e250)

  6. This is why I became an Independent for five years, to get out from under that propaganda yolk.

    “Meet the new boss, same as the old boss.”
    “[A] man hears what he wants to hear and disregards the rest”

    There’s propaganda everywhere, even among “Independents.” All you get is a free choice of which lie you want to believe.

    Kevin M (38e250)

  7. Comrades who say different get fifteen years in gulag.

    nk (1d9030)

  8. This is because id the censorship, and because of things like:

    Many state television correspondents are embedded in eastern Ukraine, and not in the cities being pummeled by missiles and mortars. Recent news reports made no mention of the 40-mile-long Russian convoy on a roadway north of Kyiv.

    so they think that the Donbass region of eastern Ukraine is where the war is.

    Eben when they discount the official news as propaganda, they don’t discount it enough.

    It’s not “Triumpph of the Will” – it’s “1984”

    They’re so used to following the news, they can’t imagine how big a lie it is. But the result is, they stick closer to what the “news” is and don’t believe members of their own family (like as if members of their family were telling them what they think is happening somewhere else and their opinion could be wrong.)

    Eventually, it will penetrate though.

    Sammy Finkelman (46ec7d)

  9. Kevin M @5:

    There’s that old Groucho line about what to believe, “you, or my own two eyes.”

    The problem is, they do believe what their own eyes see (on television, or from the sum total of official Russian media, even discounted somewhat, versus what their family members tell them.

    Sammy Finkelman (46ec7d)

  10. Sammy – Here you go.

    (I thought it was Groucho, too.)

    Jim Miller (406a93)

  11. This post made me chuckle. I wonder if any of the crazy uncle types are going to get made and declare they won’t comment here anymore.

    Time123 (eb65d0)

  12. Love The Daily Beast’s coverage of Kremlin TV. I haven’t seen anyone else providing such detailed coverage of what the Russians are seeing (a lot of clips from Fox News!).

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  13. BTW, I do have an uncle like that. An 80yo former Marine LtCol, who is the Trumpiest Trumpster I personally know. He sends me email of the “Who killed Vince Foster?” sort.

    Kevin M (38e250)

  14. Russian gymnast with ‘Z’ symbol on podium next to Ukrainian faces long ban

    Gymnastics’ governing body has condemned the “shocking behaviour” of the Russian gymnast Ivan Kuliak, who now faces a lengthy ban for wearing a symbol in support of the invasion of Ukraine on the medal podium of a World Cup event.

    After winning bronze in the parallel bars final at the Apparatus World Cup in Doha, Kuliak taped the letter “Z” to the front of his outfit before standing next to the gold medallist, Illia Kovtun of Ukraine, for the national anthems.

    The “Z” is regarded as particularly incendiary given it has been seen daubed on Russian tanks and vehicles in Ukraine and has come to symbolise support for president Vladimir Putin and the invasion.

    Kuliak, 20, was unable to wear the Russian flag as it had already been banned by the International Gymnastics Federation (FIG).
    …….
    When asked about the sort of potential sanctions the Russian could face, the FIG referred the Guardian to article 42.3 of its 2022 statutes regarding “the disciplinary measures which can be imposed amongst others on a Federation, on a legal entity or on an individual”.

    Such measures include “the cancellation of results of a competition”, which leaves open the possibility that Kuliak could lose his bronze medal, and “the proscription to take part in the FIG events and other international events for one given or unspecified duration” – in other words, a potential lengthy ban.
    …….
    Kuliak is not the first Russian gymnast to publicly support Putin’s war in Ukraine. Last week Svetlana Khorkina, who won seven Olympic medals between 1996 and 2004, shared the “Z” symbol online with the caption: “A campaign for those who are not ashamed to be Russian.”
    ……..
    The good news is that he is available for military service in Ukraine.

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  15. I guess you could call this info on the 1936 Soviet constitution historically on topic.

    Jim Miller (406a93)

  16. In the United States, people have to isolate themselves.

    Neither “side” is correct. For instance, Joe Biden never said, as Miranda Devine repeats in today’s New York Post, that he withheld $1 billion in aid unless the Ukrainians first fired the prosecutor who was investigating his son. He never said he was investigating his son or that he wanted to stop and investigation, And if you thought about it, and tried to check into it, you would realize that Joe Biden lied about his being responsible for firing the prosecutor, and that there was no flabbergasted U.S. Ambassador (per the transcript of his interview with the Atlantic magazine – additional material for its Aug. 2016 issue) nor a cancelled press conference (per the Q^A session at the Council on Foreign Relations, January 23, 2018)

    It’s true enough that Obama never signed on to supplying Ukraine with any lethal aid in the first place.

    Sammy Finkelman (46ec7d)

  17. The Kool Aid has been around since we as a species learned how to talk and write. We hear about it more now thanks to the efficiency and ubiquitous nature of stove piped mass communication.

    Hoi Polloi (15cfac)

  18. Just a reminder…

    “Appearing on NBC’s Today show for a live interview Monday morning to promote his new book, former Attorney General Bill Barr called out the left-wing media for pushing the “lie” that the Trump campaign colluded with Russia to steal the 2016 presidential election. He also defended his decision to accurately summarize the nothing-burger findings of the Mueller investigation in 2019 regarding the “phony scandal.”

    “You decided when Robert Mueller chose not to analyze whether there was criminality on obstruction, you decided, ‘I’m attorney general, I’m going to make the decision,” co-host Savannah Guthrie lamented as she pressed Barr on the now-debunked Trump-Russia collusion narrative. The anchor whined: “And you acknowledge in the book, you thought it was a phony scandal. So you took that decision upon yourself. Why did you do that?”

    Barr responded by ripping the dishonest premise of the investigation: “Well, it is a phony scandal. And people, in talking about the big lie after the election, forget that there was a big lie before – you know, at the beginning of the Trump administration.”

    As Guthrie continued to bemoan Barr’s rejection of the Mueller probe, he pointed out how political it was from the beginning: “The reason he [Mueller] was selected by Rod Rosenstein was to give the appearance that there was no partisanship and then he went out and hired a lot of partisan Democrats. And so half the country didn’t have confidence in what was going on.”

    Following Guthrie’s complaint that Barr behaved like a Trump “defense lawyer,” the former attorney general hit back hard: “It was a lie. It was a lie which the media pushed. It was a feeding frenzy that hobbled the administration and was unfair to the President and I dealt with it accordingly.”

    The live interview on Today followed a one-hour taped special aired on NBC Sunday night in which Barr was interviewed by Nightly News anchor Lester Holt in a similarly contentious exchange.

    Holt touted how “controversial” Barr supposedly was by playing liberal media soundbites. Barr hit back: “The narrative – and we live in the age of narrative, not facts. The narrative was I was a toady to Trump and I would do Trump’s bidding. And the media constantly went out with that story.”

    Talking about the Mueller investigation moments later, Holt wailed:

    But critics say Barr essentially did exonerate the President. He said Mueller’s evidence did not establish that Trump committed a crime. What Barr left out of his four-page letter, Mueller’s description of multiple acts by the President that were capable of exerting undue influence over law enforcement investigations. Mueller cited the President’s effort to have the special counsel removed, his attempts to limit the scope of the probe, as well as his public attacks on the investigation. Mueller’s full report would not be released for nearly a month, Trump’s voice filled the vacuum.

    Turning to Barr, the anchor fretted: “This four-page letter, this summary, was immediately met with wide criticism that it didn’t really accurately reflect what Mueller was saying.” Barr shot back: “That’s not true. What it was, was a tantrum by the people who were hoping that Mueller would be able to bring down Trump.”

    https://www.newsbusters.org/blogs/nb/kyle-drennen/2022/03/07/barr-tells-nbc-mueller-investigation-was-lie-which-media-pushed

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  19. One thing that most Americas do not know about Ukraine: It is a huge area with a huge population.

    The land area is slightly less than the state of Texas, with slightly more people than California (43 million), the most populous US state.

    Kevin M (38e250)

  20. Jim Miller (406a93) — 3/7/2022 @ 10:56 am

    (I thought it was Groucho, too.)

    I think it may have been used later any number of times, with an indication it was Groucho. It was in a Marx Brothers movie, but it was Chico. Perhaps pretending to be Groucho. I don’t think I ever saw the original.

    Here it is:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cHxGUe1cjzM

    Yes, Chico pretending to be Groucho. I think Groucho may also have used that line, or alluded to it, on an episode of “You Bet Your Life”

    Here sis someone delivering a lecture – he doesn’t even have it right because he says that black and white movies – he doesn’t use the word talkies were made in the 1920s and 1930s – O think the first Marx Brothers movie might have been made in 1929.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XGEq0PDBWu8

    mitation

    Sammy Finkelman (46ec7d)

  21. Repeated from the SOTU open thread:

    Senator Moynihan said something best paraphrased as:

    “Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but nobody is entitled to his own facts.”

    Vladimir Putin is acting like he’s not really entitled to his own opinion – he agrees with most of us – for instance that indiscriminate attacks on a city shouldn’t be done for instance, but he is entitled to his own facts. He is entitled even to say it is not a war.

    Sammy Finkelman (46ec7d)

  22. “In an Oval Office meeting in February 2018, Trump told McGahn to “correct” a New York Times story that reported Trump had earlier instructed McGahn to fire Mueller. Trump also asked why McGahn had told Mueller’s investigators about the directive to remove Mueller. McGahn told Trump he had to tell the investigators the truth.”

    Yeah no evidence of obstruction. How willfully obtuse.

    AJ_Liberty (ec7f74)

  23. No overt act.

    Sammy Finkelman (46ec7d)

  24. The tiny radio station broadcasting Russian propaganda in D.C.
    ……..
    WZHF, a former Spanish-language station 11 miles east of the White House in Maryland’s Capitol Heights, is the flagship of Russian President Vladimir Putin’s effort to harness America’s radio airwaves to sell the Kremlin’s point of view. Despite periodic legal and political challenges, and the imposition of sanctions against Russia for its invasion of Ukraine, the station has stayed on the air, broadcasting its Kremlin-approved message.
    ……..
    Sputnik’s talking heads have tended to justify Russia’s invasion of Ukraine, alleging Ukrainian “crimes” against its Russian-speaking population and “encroachment” on Russia from the NATO alliance. They typically describe the invasion as “a military operation” or “an intervention,” echoing Putin’s framing. There’s plenty of whataboutism: A Russian commentator on Friday fretted that the United States could give nuclear weapons to Ukraine. “We cannot be confident that America will be a responsible member of the international community,” he said.
    …….
    Sputnik doesn’t own WZHF, nor could it under federal regulations that bar foreign governments from controlling U.S. broadcast licenses. The decades-old prohibition was driven by concerns that hostile foreign powers would use American radio and TV stations to broadcast propaganda. But the Kremlin found another way to get on the air.

    WZHF has been licensed to a New York company, Way Broadcasting, since 2001, according to FCC records. But Way appears to be a largely passive owner. In 2017, it agreed to lease the station’s airtime to a second party, RM Broadcasting of Jupiter, Fla.

    RM, in turn, sold all of the station’s airtime to Rossiya Segodnya and Sputnik. RM made a similar deal in 2020 with Alpine Broadcasting to place Sputnik’s programs on Alpine’s three stations in the Kansas City area.
    …….
    “RM Broadcasting stands with Ukraine and victims of oppression and aggression worldwide,” (wrote RM’s owner, Arnold Ferolito in an email). “One of the fundamental rights that Ukraine is fighting for is freedom of speech and freedom from censorship, and RM is dedicated to the unfettered exchange of information and ideas.”
    ……..

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  25. How dare you, Col.

    mg (8cbc69)

  26. Vast Majority Of Americans Say Ban Russian Oil, Quinnipiac University National Poll Finds; Nearly 8 In 10 Support U.S. Military Response If Putin Attacks A NATO Country
    …….Americans say 71 – 22 percent that they would support a ban on Russian oil even if it meant higher gasoline prices in the United States, according to a Quinnipiac University national poll of adults released today. Democrats (82 – 12 percent), independents (70 – 22 percent), and Republicans (66 – 30 percent) all support banning Russian oil.
    …….
    There is broad support (79 – 14 percent) for a U.S. military response if Russian President Vladimir Putin goes beyond Ukraine and attacks a NATO country.

    Americans think 60 – 28 percent that Putin is willing to use nuclear weapons against NATO countries.
    ………
    Americans are divided on Joe Biden’s handling of the response to Russia’s invasion of Ukraine with 42 percent approving, 45 percent disapproving, and 13 percent not offering an opinion. This compares to a week ago when 39 percent approved, and 47 percent disapproved.
    ……..
    Nearly two-thirds of Americans (64 percent) have a favorable opinion of Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky with 29 percent saying they haven’t heard enough about him, and 6 percent having an unfavorable opinion.
    …….
    ………Americans were asked what they would do if they were in the same position as Ukrainians are now: stay and fight or leave the country? A majority (55 percent) say they would stay and fight, while 38 percent say they would leave the country. Republicans say 68 – 25 percent and independents say 57 – 36 percent they would stay and fight, while Democrats say 52 – 40 percent they would leave the country.
    ……….

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  27. Well it appears that for some of the Russkis at least, Putin is a stud muffin. And when you have a sycophantic press, then you can lead a country to believe almost anything.

    I say almost anything. Despite the best efforts of the MSM, CNN and MSNBC, there are still a few people in the USA who don’t believe that Biden is competent.

    GlendaleGreybeard (443593)

  28. Why Biden is getting some praise from Republicans on his handling of Ukraine

    It is hard to figure out what critics would have done differently (short of committing US troops) regarding the run up and post invasion Biden policies. No political critic is saying we are doing too much (except possibly Rand Paul or Bernie Sanders, who has been very quiet lately). There is carping about banning Russian oil, which is really a silly idea, as it will be sold elsewhere in the world, and it is such as small amount of total US imports. It does show, however, that Congress is “doing something” even if is ineffectual.

    No critic is advocating a no-fly zone or any other military intervention. Even Lindsey Graham called for Putin’s assassination not by the West, but the Russians themselves.

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  29. Russian spy chief: The liberal fascists in the west are trying to “cancel” us!
    ……..
    The Kremlin must be stunned by the unanimity of opposition in the U.S. to Putin’s war. They had reason to suspect that a fully Trumpified GOP would be no worse than ambivalent about a Russian adventure in Ukraine, particularly given Republicans’ electoral incentives to undermine Biden before the midterms. If everything had broken right for Moscow, there’d be a strong isolationist push happening now among the louder and more influential members of America’s populist right. That push might have led swing voters to question whether the U.S. should be involved in punishing Putin, giving Democrats cold feet. And that skepticism might have steered the White House towards pulling its punches on sanctions. It’s anyone’s guess whether Europe would have responded to Russia as strongly as it has if the U.S. had moved cautiously.

    But it didn’t break that way. By some measures, the Republican base wants more punishment for Putin than Biden’s Democratic voters do. The president has every electoral incentive he needs to project strength in containing Russia. Putin and his cronies must be flabbergasted.

    So here comes (Sergei Naryshkin, head of Russian foreign intelligence) to remind America’s conservative culture warriors that they’re supposed to be allies. Putin’s the guy standing up for Christianity (by bombing Ukrainians into dust), remember? He hates NATO more than Trump does. And now he’s being canceled, just like so many American martyrs to woke-ism have been.
    ……….

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  30. Putin’s the guy standing up for Christianity (by bombing Ukrainians into dust), remember?

    It’s his opposition to gay rights etc that he bases this on.

    Sammy Finkelman (02a146)

  31. 28. Before Feb 24 Zelensky was urging sanctions now – not later. (just like the Afghan government wanted sanctions on Pakistan)

    Now he says arms should have been sent before.

    Sammy Finkelman (02a146)

  32. This is Armenian Radio; our listeners asked us: “What is the difference between the Constitutions of the USA and USSR?” Both guarantee freedom of speech.”

    We’re answering: “Yes, but the Constitution of the USA also guarantees freedom after the speech.”

    nk (1d9030)

  33. if ukraine doesn’t lose it wins and if russia doesn’t win it loses. The british found out the hard way in the american revolution. America found out the hard way in vietnam war. We never lost a battle ;but saigon is now called ho chi minh city. Kabul soon osama bin ladin city? In vietnam war gen. westmorland said we will kill 10 vc and nva for every draftee we lose. When told of westmoreland’s statement gen. giap said sounds like a fair trade to me! Gen. Washington said about the same thing.

    asset (a85bb9)

  34. Why Biden is getting some praise from Republicans on his handling of Ukraine

    Heck, I’ll give him a B, maybe even a B+. I think that Putin will lose in the long run. Between sanctions, an exhausted military, the inevitability of the truth coming home, and the impossibility of garrisoning Ukraine for any length of time, he has only bad options.

    Two months from how, Putin will have a decision to make: a humiliating withdrawal or doubling down. That’s my main quibble with Biden — he’s treating that second option too lightly. We should have the XVIII Airborne Corps in Germany, just in case.

    Kevin M (38e250)

  35. @33: Dien Bien Phu is closest I think. Or maybe Kahrtoum.

    Kevin M (38e250)

  36. Before Feb 24 Zelensky was urging sanctions now – not later.

    Had we done that, Putin could have backed down while playing the victim. Now, he can’t. If you are trying to defend Ukraine, Zel3ensky was right. If you are playing for all the marbles, Biden was right as now Putin has only bad choices.

    Kevin M (38e250)

  37. We should be bringing every soldier home from Germany. We don’t know how to defeat an enemy. Send your family. Enough of mine have paid the price. American military is a losing farce. Im with Cindy.

    mg (8cbc69)

  38. Before Feb 24 Zelensky was urging sanctions now – not later.

    36. Kevin M (38e250) — 3/7/2022 @ 9:42 pm

    Had we done that, Putin could have backed down while playing the victim. Now, he can’t.

    The premise here is that Putin was intent on war or making unacceptable demands but might not have started a war if sanctions were imposed or started and might have demobilized. The sanctions couldn’t even be considered for removal without him demobilizing. But in any case Biden only wanted multiparty sanctions.

    If you are trying to defend Ukraine, Zel3ensky was right. If you are playing for all the marbles, Biden was right

    Biden always goes for hope the least bad outcome regardless of how that aaffects the probabiliy of what happens later.

    as now Putin has only bad choices.

    Aside from how it might affect his personal future, it would be quite bad for Putin to back down in the face of sanctions. Not worse than backing down in the face of military stalemate, except that it would not be obvious that he had attempted anything.

    Sammy Finkelman (46ec7d)

  39. The ex-KGB people around Putin are called the ailoviki

    They unavoidably probably go down with Putin.

    Sammy Finkelman (46ec7d)

  40. We should be bringing every soldier home from Germany.

    I am so glad that Trump lost.

    Kevin M (38e250)

  41. 29

    * ailoviki should be siloviki

    Sammy Finkelman (46ec7d)

  42. Bombs away, Kevin M.
    Didn’t losing to the Cave dwellers teach you anything?

    mg (8cbc69)

  43. Bombs away, Kevin M.

    mg (8cbc69)

  44. Over 200 Companies Have Withdrawn from Russia – But Some Remain

    Since Putin’s devastating invasion of Ukraine began, 250 companies have announced their withdrawal from Russia in protest.

    Nevertheless, some western companies have continued to operate in Russia undeterred; we identify several dozen companies with particularly significant exposure to Russian markets. In the days since we initially published our list, many of the “remain” companies have responded to public backlash and decided to withdraw, and we are continuously revising our list to reflect these decisions as they are made.

    The full, current list of companies that have curtailed operations in Russia as well as those that remain, as of March 8, can be seen below.
    ………
    Discover credit cards are not currently accepted in Russia, and they have “suspend(ed) efforts to establish a Russian presence.”

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  45. I think Americans might make good soldiers if led by Ukrainian officers, mg.

    nk (1d9030)

  46. Headline below the fold on the front page of today’s printed paper:

    Cutting Off News From West, Putin Claims a Monopoly on Truth

    Censorship in Russia is Reminiscent of the Soviet Era

    Online headline: With New Limits on Media, Putin Closes a Door on Russia’s ‘Openness’

    https://www.nytimes.com/2022/03/07/world/europe/russia-ukraine-putin-media.html

    One of the paradoxical things about Vladimir V. Putin’s increasingly authoritarian rule of Russia was how relatively open society always remained.

    For all the state’s control of media, people could read or watch what they wanted, including foreign newscasts like BBC and CNN. The internet was largely unfettered, a portal to the rest of the world. Unlike, say, China, you could criticize the president with some assurance that the police would not knock at the door.

    Until now…..“Just two weeks ago it was not possible to imagine how quickly most of it would get closed,” said Nina L. Khrushcheva, a professor of international affairs at the New School in New York City and the great-granddaughter of the Soviet leader Nikita S. Khrushchev. “And yet it is.”

    Beyond the immediate impact on Russians’ ability to learn about the war next door, Mr. Putin seems to have crossed a threshold in the country’s history. He is sequestering Russian society to a greater extent than at any time since the last Soviet leader, Mikhail S. Gorbachev, launched a policy in 1986 called glasnost, which became known as “openness” but more precisely means “the act of giving voice.”

    Sammy Finkelman (46ec7d)

  47. Bombs away, Kevin M.

    We’re already at war with Russia. But stick with your isolationism, pretending that the world cannot come to you. All you have to do it be nice to Putin, and he’ll be nice to you.

    Kevin M (38e250)

  48. Two Days of Russian News Coverage: An Alternate Reality of War
    ……..
    “It is not a war on Russian TV,” said Stanislav Kucher, a veteran Russian television host and former member of the presidential Council for Civil Society and Human Rights. Mr. Kucher moved to the United States after his shows were repeatedly shuttered.

    “You will not see explosions, you will not see strikes on neighborhoods where civilians live, you will not see a lot in terms of troops, soldiers, heavy armored vehicles or anything like that,” he added.
    …….
    News bulletins are fairly uniform from one television channel to the next. The “operations” in Ukraine are basically described as a peacekeeping mission by the military to rescue the Russian-speaking residents of the breakaway regions of Donetsk and Luhansk from the terrible war crimes perpetuated on them by the Ukrainian government. The West is described as completely unsympathetic to their plight.
    …….
    The 2 p.m. News on Saturday on Channel One, one of the two most popular channels along with Rossiya-1, was typical in this tale of two wars.

    It started with the anchor quoting Mr. Putin, saying that the “special operation’’ was proceeding as planned. The destruction of the military infrastructure will be completed soon, he added.

    It blamed extremist Ukrainian forces for dynamiting a building in the port city of Mariupol on top of 200 people sheltering in the basement, but there was no footage.

    Denis Pushilin, the head of the Donetsk People’s Republic, one of the rump states created by Moscow after the 2014 invasion, complained in an interview that civilians did not use the humanitarian corridor meant to reach the Russian-controlled east, but risked danger by heading west. Ukrainian officials said they could not use the corridor because Russian forces were shelling it.
    ……..
    ……..Some of the more prominent Kremlin cheerleaders have been targeted by Western sanctions. Italy, for example, seized the nearly $9 million dollar Lake Como mansion owned by Vladimir R. Soloviev, a prominent talk show host.
    …….
    To try to reach the younger generation, both the Ministry of Enlightenment and the Ministry of Education in Russia have produced videos detailing the official explanation for the war; they were mandatory viewing in schools.

    Novaya Gazeta, an independent newspaper whose editor, Dmitri Muratov, shared the Nobel Peace Prize last year, has tried to follow the new guidelines. In stories where people interviewed said “war,” for example, there are ellipses and the phrase “word prohibited by the Russian authorities.”
    ………
    Ministry of Enlightenment-how Orwellian.

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  49. Kevin M:

    I responded to your post regarding the President’s “unilateral” authority to launch nuclear weapons on the SOTU thread. He does have such authority.

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  50. https://www.nytimes.com/2022/03/07/world/europe/russia-ukraine-putin-media.html

    Those who watch Russian television instead see the country’s troops taking part in a largely bloodless “special military operation,” to protect Ukrainian civilians from a neo-Nazi government. In this alternate reality, Russian troops are distributing aid to civilians or helping evacuate them to safety; Ukrainians are fabricating reports about Russian military setbacks — or even shelling their own cities.

    Sammy Finkelman (46ec7d)

  51. The president does have authority, but in the real world, there is the possibility of ignoring such an order, on the grounds maybe that it is a mistake, or a crime. It wouldn’t happen unless there were good rounds for saying that, and the fact that it is not laid out anywhere in the regulations tends to insure that people wold only stall if there was a reason to.

    Sammy Finkelman (46ec7d)

  52. “One thing that most Americas do not know about Ukraine: It is a huge area with a huge population.

    The land area is slightly less than the state of Texas, with slightly more people than California (43 million), the most populous US state.”

    Putin seems to be at work changing those facts.

    He’s embarked on an “F” the collateral damage drive, and will reduce the population somewhat. Every day they hold out and humiliate Putin is a day he probably wants to kill all these impudent Ukrainians

    He doesn’t seem too interested right now about much to the west of the Dnieper but looks like he’d like to take and colonize 1/4 of the land formerly Ukraine.

    Ukraine is probably taking a hard line in negotiations. Stop. Leave.
    Once the poofters at State Dept and the various EU diplomat corps get involved they’ll want concessions and appeasements…. from Ukraine. Watch.

    steveg (e81d76)

  53. I read an interesting article on Bellingham about how in 2020 Ukraine was said to have interfered in the Belarus elections.
    What Ukraine actually did was to try to conduct a sting on Wagner mercenaries that had committed crimes in 2014 and onward.

    https://www.bellingcat.com/news/2022/02/27/follow-the-russia-ukraine-monitor-map/

    That link is to a map to verified war events.
    The article I mentioned is off the home page

    steveg (e81d76)

  54. PepsiCo Explores Options for Russian Business as Ukraine Crisis Deepens
    ………
    ……. . PepsiCo is reluctant to shut down its Russian unit—which includes a large dairy business it bought for about $5 billion a decade ago—because tens of thousands of Russians depend on the company for their livelihoods and for daily essentials like milk and baby formula, the people familiar with the matter said.

    Revenue from PepsiCo’s Russian unit was $3.4 billion in 2021, making it the third-largest market for the company after the U.S. and Mexico. The impact of writing off the Russian unit would be minimal because it contributes little to PepsiCo’s earnings, some of the people said.
    ……..

    McDonald’s Will Temporarily Close Russian Locations

    The chain said it would continue paying the 62,000 people it employs there. McDonald’s said it couldn’t yet determine when it might reopen the restaurants in Russia, and will consider whether any additional steps might be required.
    …….
    McDonald’s owns and operates 84% of its restaurants in Russia, with the rest run by franchisees, serving millions of customers daily, the chain said. The company said that both company and franchised restaurants will temporarily shut down in the country.
    ……….
    Headline six months from now: “Russian People Healthier After Skipping American Fast Food”

    Rip Murdock (32617c)

  55. @54 I think the mormon church owns a lot of pepsico.

    asset (d65f7e)

  56. @54 I think the mormon church owns a lot of pepsico.

    I doubt as the Pepsi contains caffeine.

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  57. Here’s a briefing item Trump might be out loud envious of:

    On Friday, Putin signed into law a bill that introduced jail terms of up to 15 years for intentionally spreading “fake” or “false” news about the Russian army, forcing many Russian and international outlets to cease their coverage of the events.

    Doesn’t mean Trump would do it, but I’m sure he has looked around at the press in the room and had thoughts

    steveg (e81d76)

  58. Here is an exhaustive list of the Mormon Church holdings as of the date noted.
    In case you want to start your own Mormon Church tracking portfolio.

    https://www.scribd.com/document/450143097/Ensign-Peak-Advisors-Stock-Holdings#download&from_embed

    steveg (e81d76)

  59. Forgot to say its searchable and no Pepsi, no Coca Cola

    steveg (e81d76)

  60. Gold/oz: $2,056.90 ▲ $61.00 so far today; March 8, 4:11 PM EST
    Oil (BRENT CRUDE ) $128.92/bbl., +$4.55 so far today; March 8, 04:06:00 PM EST

    https://markets.businessinsider.com/commodities/oil-price

    The average price for a brand new electric car is roughly $55,000. [Check your local electric rates, too.]
    https://walletgenius.com/money/save-money/electric-car-vs-gas-costs-which-truly-saves-you-the-most-money/

    50 years of government domestic and international experience: “Attaboy, Joe!”

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  61. Mormons do own a lot of Yum!Brands which was spun off from Pepsi and maintains a lifetime contract with Pepsi.

    steveg (e81d76)

  62. Chinese journalists embed with Russian Army in Ukraine

    https://twitter.com/i/status/1501280406770835458

    steveg (e81d76)

  63. Isolate the southern and northern borders along with every port with tanks, armor and every soldier we currently have overseas.
    And flip everyone the bird trying to illegally enter America.
    Isolate/2024

    mg (8cbc69)

  64. Interesting thread on how the death of a Russian General was confirmed.

    “The idiots tried to use the Era cryptophones in Kharkiv, after destroying many 3g cell towers and also replacing others with stingrays. Era needs 3g/4g to communicate.
    The Russian army is equipped with secure phones that can’t work in areas where the Russian army operates.”

    Russians had to use unsecured lines to call FSB to report the loss

    steveg (e81d76)

  65. If democrats are so opposed to fossil fuels, why do their kids work for Ukraine oil companies?

    mg (8cbc69)

  66. Doesn’t mean Trump would do it, but I’m sure he has looked around at the press in the room and had thoughts

    I’ll bet even Jimmy Carter did at times.

    Kevin M (38e250)

  67. Let’s suppose, just for a simple exercise, that the US/Canada border is 3,000 miles long. (It’s actually considerably longer, but let’s keep this simple.) To guard it with just one man per mile would take 3,000 men. Except the men have to sleep and eat, so having 1 man on duty continuously would require 4 men per mile, or 12,000 men all together. To have ten men per mile continuously would require 120,000 men. But that would require each man to guard 528 feet, leaving a large gap any time a man so much as took a coffee break. So, you would probably want more. And, you would need support troops, perhaps 80,000 for each 120,000, to bring them supplies, and so forth.

    Oh, and as most of you know, much of the Canada/US border is forested, so in many places a guard could see at most 50 feet before his view was blocked by trees. So you would need even more guards for those sections of the border.

    And, of course, such a solution would do nothing to stop illegals from coming in on legal visas and over-staying them.

    Strengthening E-Verify would be more practical.

    (Please don’t anyone tell mg how long the borders of Alaska are. Or what they are like in places.)

    Jim Miller (406a93)

  68. Lets guard someone else’s border and pay for it, ok, Einstein.

    mg (8cbc69)

  69. The “Z” is regarded as particularly incendiary given it has been seen daubed on Russian tanks and vehicles in Ukraine and has come to symbolise support for president Vladimir Putin and the invasion.

    Wonder how long until “Zorro” is considered Russian propaganda.

    Factory Working Orphan (2775f0)

  70. Then there’s the film “Z” which is about fighting a fascist dictatorship.

    Kevin M (38e250)

  71. Trump had a point about Putin that got lost in the “Trump supports Putin” narrative.
    The Poles are trying to gift us the hot potato of MIGs to then regift to Ukraine as if that would give everyone legal cover. US says no no no wait a minute, but Putin would have just run with that weak lie and defied everyone to say different.
    Putin is using strength of nukes to bluff. “You don’t want to make me turn this card, it could be nukes” and no one has the cojones to call his bluff.
    Everyone in power would love to be allowed to play a similar card… Putin can do it, but the American President can’t, AND the press won’t allow the American President to call the bluff. (but would let Putin call bluff)

    steveg (e81d76)

  72. Even funnier to Putin would be that NATO would think that international law legalese would prevent retaliation by Russia for a obvious gift of further lethal weaponry from a NATO country to the Ukraine which at this point is a lethal enemy of Russia.
    A strong leader would just do it and say pound sand, Putin.
    Instead Putin will bully his way into getting something that is not his and he will not use nuclear weapons*

    *this time

    steveg (e81d76)

  73. Then there’s the film “Z” which is about fighting a fascist dictatorship.

    Nope. Investigating an assassination carried out by agents of the royal household. Think Jamal Khashoggi and Mohammed bin Salman.

    It was one of the “grievances” (as in our Declaration of Independence grievances) against the King — the Palace exercising “para”-Constitutional power against its political opponents — which led to the 1967 military coup and the Constitutional abolition of the Monarchy in 1974.

    The Greek letter Z is actually pronounced Zeta when reciting the alphabet. When pronounced Zee, the American way, it sounds the Greek word Ζη which means “He lives”.

    nk (1d9030)

  74. We can call Putin’s “Z” a Zwastika.

    Paul Montagu (5de684)

  75. There is no letter Z in the Russian alphabet. The Z sound is represent by “3” in differing sizes for uppercase and lowercase. So, yeah, it is a zwastika, a random rune.

    nk (1d9030)

  76. @73: Costa-Gravas’ movie (1969) was about the murder of a pro-democracy politician during the period leading to the Greek junta taking power. It was quite anti-fascist and had little to do with the King, who attempted a counter-coup later and was forced to flee the country.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Z_(1969_film)
    https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0065234

    Kevin M (38e250)

  77. King Constantine wasn’t an issue in “Z” and his unworthiness IRL was independent of the coup, which used him as a figurehead.

    Kevin M (38e250)

  78. I see. You were talking about the movie and I was talking about the real events of 1963. King Paul was still the king then, BTW, not Constantine. Wikipedia calls the movie a thinly-fictionalized account, I would call it highly-fictionalized from the Wikipedia description of it.

    nk (1d9030)

  79. Quite right nk. What a dichotomy of thought, to reference a movie instead of an historical account – although, I concede the existence of those accounts that share the characteristics of the periodical section rather than the historical. I’ll call it “history with a fashion sense.”

    felipe (484255)

  80. On Friday, Putin signed into law a bill that introduced jail terms of up to 15 years for intentionally spreading “fake” or “false” news about the Russian army, forcing many Russian and international outlets to cease their coverage of the events.

    It might never have come to that if only there had been a private way to silence all those dissenting voices. Better still, how to get the media to carry his water? In a way, the polite silence* (if you can’t say something nice…)of the media is enough for Putin to work with.

    * I wanted to type, “pestilence.”

    felipe (484255)

  81. A retired General I play golf with told me the other day the military has gone all out KLINGER.
    He retired when the clintons rode into town.

    mg (8cbc69)

  82. That’s what I’ve always been saying, but compared to the Russians we’re seeing they’re Homeric heroes, our military I mean.

    Those stories about the heroic Russian defense of their homeland in WWII? That’s because for every company of Russians that bravely fought the Germans, there was a platoon of NKVD machine gunners behind them who would mow them down if they did not.

    nk (1d9030)

  83. #68 mg – Thanks for the compliment, but being willing to do some simple arithmetic doesn’t make me an Einstein. (I don’t know why so many people aren’t willing to do arithmetic, even simple arithmetic.)

    Jim Miller (406a93)

  84. I saw that Joe went to the Saudi’s and the UAE for more oil and they said bugger off.
    Trump made a deal with the devil by overlooking the Khashoggi dismemberment and accepting the Saudi’s word that they’d found who did it and handled it in return for continuing the Abraham Accord.
    Biden has to play to the press and for some reason the Iranians which means Biden is funding the Houthi rebellion and attacks on the Saudi’s.

    Weird.
    Some oilmen in Texas need to get off their butts and go buy some of Hunter’s paintings to at least get a seat at the table with international luminaries like Venezuela and Iran

    steveg (e81d76)

  85. Great post. I got most of the Trump-Putin (and gullible American-Russian) similarities but I probably missed some. I bet there are a lot more we don’t know about.

    DRJ (02d0b8)

  86. King Paul was still the king then, BTW, not Constantine.

    But he was when the coup happened. My take on “Z” is a distant memory from college, where I had seen and discussed it with a coupe of Greek friends, one from Athens and one a Greek Cypriot who was pissed off at the just-collapsed junta for other reasons.

    Kevin M (38e250)

  87. I see. You were talking about the movie and I was talking about the real events of 1963.

    Me: “Then there’s the film ‘Z'”

    Why was that unclear?

    Kevin M (38e250)

  88. I have never seen the movie and I assumed that it was about the 1963 events and not merely containing a plot loosely based on them.

    nk (1d9030)

  89. Grisham was Trump’s press secretary. She also sees the similarities between Trump and Putin.

    DRJ (03cb91)

  90. The West Texas Pilsen are drilling like mad. I see it daily.

    DRJ (03cb91)

  91. Oilmen not Pilsen. Autocorrect keeps correcting oilmen.

    DRJ (03cb91)

  92. Here’s how honest these Congress critters, NeverTrumpunkins and our national media are about 1/6/21:

    Rosenberg: “It was like, me and two other colleagues who were there [January 6] outside and we were just having fun!”
    Rosenberg: “I know I’m supposed to be traumatized, but like, all these colleagues who were in the [Capitol] building and are like ‘Oh my God it was so scary!’ I’m like, ‘f*ck off!'”

    Rosenberg: “I’m like come on, it’s not the kind place I can tell someone to man up but I kind of want to be like, ‘dude come on, you were not in any danger.'”

    Rosenberg: “These f*cking little dweebs who keep going on about their trauma. Shut the f*ck up. They’re f*cking b*tches.”

    Rosenberg: “They were making too big a deal. They were making this an organized thing that it wasn’t.”

    Rosenberg RESPONDS: “Will I stand by those comments? Absolutely.”

    NYT National Security Correspondent Matthew Rosenberg

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  93. “Gullible” doesn’t apply. More like lying, corksoaking bearers of false witness.

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  94. I think we are talking about different people, Haiku. My guess is you mean the media. When I talk about gullible people, I mean Americans that believe Trump and Russians who believe Putin.

    DRJ (03cb91)

  95. FLASHBACK (Not too far back, 3 weeks ago):

    Frackers Hold Back Production as Oil Nears $100 a Barrel

    Three of the largest shale companies, Pioneer Natural Resources Co., Devon Energy Corp. and Continental Resources Inc., this week reported their highest annual profits in more than a decade for 2021. The companies said they collected record amounts of extra cash by hanging on to the money they earn selling oil and natural gas and reinvesting only what they needed to keep output roughly flat. All three said they would continue to limit production growth this year.

    They are pledging austerity despite a tightening oil-market supply. ……
    ………

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  96. Drill Baby Drill

    mg (8cbc69)

  97. Russian Agent Maria Butina Tells BBC Ukrainians Are Killing Themselves
    …….On Thursday, convicted Russian agent and Donald Trump enthusiast Maria Butina tried to convince BBC Radio host Nick Robinson that it was Ukraine’s own military raining bullets and mortars over the country, not Russian troops. When asked if the war was going to plan, she said, “Yes absolutely. I do trust my president as well as the majority of Russians do.” When asked if she thinks Ukrainian President Zelensky—who is Jewish—is a Nazi, she said, “According to his actions, absolutely.” Robinson then countered, “He’s Jewish, his great-grandfather died fighting the Nazis as part of Russia, I put it to you again that he’s a bit of an unlikely Nazi.” Butina replied, “You know I do believe that Nazism is not about just one nation, it’s about killing, murdering, torturing, alienation, based on their race, their gender, their nationality, country of origin and what we see today.” Robinson shot back then that by that definition, Putin is a Nazi. “Russia is not bombing citizens,” she countered. “Russian military troops actually are having humanitarian corridors.”

    The two bantered again about who is bombing Ukraine, and Robinson, clearly aghast, pushed further, as Butina insisted Russia was not bombing civilian targets….
    ……
    Audio at link.

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  98. Drill Baby Drill

    mg (8cbc69) — 3/9/2022 @ 11:49 am

    From the linked article in post 95:

    Ben Dell, managing partner at Kimmeridge Energy Management Co., an investor and advocate for oil companies to keep pumping flat and return cash to shareholders, said there is no reason to stray from that strategy.

    “The only question investors should ask is why on earth would they want any U.S. [oil producer] to grow?” Mr. Dell said. “The sector has been working. Cash flow is getting returned. This is not the time to change the [new] business model.”

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  99. 95. The frackers promised that in earnings calls with stock analysts.

    Behind that is the possible future political success of climate based production restrictions.

    Sammy Finkelman (46ec7d)

  100. I don’t see why there is any special to hold to flat production unless this is something like dollar cost averaging – profit averaging?

    Sammy Finkelman (46ec7d)

  101. It’s what oligopolies do, Sammy. I believe the oldest is the diamond trade. They keep supply limited to keep prices high and costs low.

    American producers are in an especially privileged position because they will not be faced with an exigent need to sell more oil. They will not need to rebuild their armed forces because of a war or buy food because of a bad harvest or build more hospitals because of an epidemic or buy an Aegean island as a wedding present for the Emir’s daughter.

    nk (1d9030)

  102. Federal mineral leases and permits should include a “use them or lose them” period. A short one. We can’t let the profiteers just sit on them like dogs in a manger.

    nk (1d9030)

  103. I haven;t studied the way those leases work.

    Sammy Finkelman (46ec7d)

  104. This should be the motto for negotiating with Russia now:

    <b< Verify, but don't trust.

    You can add: You can take a guess, occasionally, but learn from experience.

    Sammy Finkelman (46ec7d)

  105. Verify, but don’t trust.

    And we should try to get Vladimir Putin miscalculates, in the way the British got the Nazis to miscalculate. The kind of miscalculation in which he fears we will do something that we are not ready to do. Biden has been relieving all these fears.

    Of course you sometimes don’t want the other type of miscalculation sometimes – where he thinks we will not do something that we will.

    Sammy Finkelman (46ec7d)

  106. I do know that oil leases here need the ten years because even at ten years, the lawyers for the environmentalists will try to run out the clock.
    Getting a permit to drill in SB County takes a crate of paperwork to simply get a hearing. A hearing where the first ten answers will be “No”. This goes on for several years and eventually you may get your permit to cut your trail and drill.
    Assuming you’ve hit oil, they will deny you the right to frack and the process continues through to transportation rights where they won’t allow you to connect to a pipeline or to use truck transportation

    steveg (e81d76)

  107. There’s apparently no pipeline for natural gas to New England.

    Sammy Finkelman (46ec7d)

  108. Russian economy has been paralyzed since the sanctions. WTF is our economy paralyzed for without sanctions?

    mg (8cbc69)

  109. Our economy is under sanction: “A threatened penalty for disobeying a law or rule.”

    Withheld sanction: “Official permission or approval for an action”

    steveg (e81d76)

  110. The U.S. economy is not paralyzed, but it is suffering from inflation. The best way to handle this is to let an expansion (eventually) allow supply to rise to meet demand. There’s no point in doing the opposite – reducing demand. That’s called a recession, and it will not stabilize prices because inventory control is too good. While in an expansion it’s impossible to control inventory because it’s coming from multiple companies.

    Sammy Finkelman (02a146)

  111. https://nypost.com/2022/03/11/us-blasts-russia-at-un-for-lying-about-ukraine-biochem-weapons

    Thomas-Greenfield was responding to her Russian counterpart, Vasily Nebenzya, who had accused the US of funding bioweapons research in Ukraine involving the “spreading of particularly dangerous infections using migratory birds.” [Birds!!?]

    “There was another project where the vectors or potential agents of biological weapons, bats were considered amongst priority areas for study,” Nebenzya claimed. ‘”They include the bacterial and viral pathogens that could spread from bats to people such as plague, leptospirosis, as well as … coronaviruses.”

    ….The ministry doubled down on Friday, tweeting: “Radical Ukrainian groups under the control of US special services’ representatives have prepared several potential scenarios of using of toxic #chemicals to carry out #provocations. Objective – to accuse Russia of chemical weapons use vs civilians.”

    While there is a network of biological labs in Ukraine that have received funding and support from the US since the 1990s, they are owned and operated by the Eastern European country and are a part of an initiative called the Biological Threat Reduction Program, according to the Associated Press.

    Paraphrase of quote by Daneil Patrick Moynihan:

    “Everyone is enttled to his own opinion, but nobody is entitled to his own facts.”

    Sammy Finkelman (02a146)

  112. https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2010/11/moynihan-letters-201011

    Daniel Patrick Moynihan served as an ambassador, a senator, and an adviser to four presidents. Along the way he faithfully recorded his thoughts—trenchant, frank, and often very funny—in a substantial and revealing private correspondence. A collection of these letters—Daniel Patrick Moynihan: A Portrait in Letters of an American Visionary, edited and with an introduction by Steven R. Weisman—will be published this month by PublicAffairs. Here’s an exclusive sampling.

    OCTOBER 6, 2010

    ….Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.” The words belong to Daniel Patrick Moynihan, and they have a haunting quality in our own age of poisoned public discourse.

    Sammy Finkelman (02a146)

  113. Sammy – my point is the 81 million drove us over the cliff.

    mg (8cbc69)

  114. Sammy – my point is the 81 million drove us over the cliff.

    Perhaps, but the far lesser number that picked Trump out of the lineup set the train in motion.

    Kevin M (38e250)

  115. Perhaps, but the far lesser number that picked Trump out of the lineup set the train in motion.

    Nonsense.

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  116. We can’t let the profiteers just sit on them like dogs in a manger.

    Leases are not on sure-fire wells, they are in areas that *might* have exploitable oil. One has to spend oodles of money to drill test wells in the leased area. Some hit, some don’t. And you don’t spend that kind of money when oil is at $30/bbl. Now, I guess they could have done the exploration and been sitting on capped wells, but if so those wells will produce pretty quickly.

    There are lots of areas in West Texas and East New Mexico that are government land (New Mexico is mostly US government land) and have not been drilled. One of the things about burning your inventory is that you want there to be more inventory, and with this crowd in charge, you can bet your bottom dollar there won’t be.

    Here’s the bottom line for the oil well folks: If Biden won’t issue leases in THIS situation, when do you suppose he might?

    Kevin M (38e250)

  117. Nonsense.

    As a retort, yes it is.

    Kevin M (38e250)

  118. Shorter 117:

    1) No one will have to put a gun to anyone’s head to get them to produce more oil at $130/bbl. Just about the only way to stop it would be price controls.

    2) If Biden won’t approve leases now, when might he do so? Oil companies don’t want to burn through their reserves without some hope of replacing them.

    Kevin M (38e250)

  119. 81 million gave us this economy.
    Shame on you people.

    mg (8cbc69)

  120. Lest you forget:

    Trump Orders Missile Attack in Retaliation for Syrian Chemical Strikes

    “Years of previous attempts at changing Assad’s behavior have all failed and failed very dramatically,” Trump said. “As a result, the refugee crisis continues to deepen and the region continues to destabilize, threatening the United States and its allies.” Trump called on all civilized nations to join the United States in seeking an end to the slaughter in Syria, and to end the threat terrorism poses in the blighted nation.

    https://www.defense.gov/News/News-Stories/Article/Article/1144601/trump-orders-missile-attack-in-retaliation-for-syrian-chemical-strikes/

    U.S. fires missiles into Syria in first attack on Assad regime

    ‘President Donald Trump cast the U.S. assault as vital to deter future use of poison gas and called on other nations to join in seeking “to end the slaughter and bloodshed in Syria.”

    he U.S. strikes — some 59 missiles launched from the USS Ross and USS Porter — hit the government-controlled Shayrat air base in central Syria, where U.S. officials say the Syrian military planes that dropped the chemicals had taken off. The U.S. missiles hit at 8:45 p.m. in Washington, 3:45 Friday morning in Syria. The missiles targeted the base’s airstrips, hangars, control tower and ammunition areas, officials said.

    Trump ordered the strikes without approval from Congress or the backing of the United Nations. U.S. officials said he had the right to use force to defend national interests and to protect civilians from atrocities. The U.S. assault marked a striking reversal for Trump, who warned as a candidate against the U.S. being pulled into the Syrian civil war that began six years ago. But the president appeared moved by the photos of children killed in the chemical attack, calling it a “disgrace to humanity” that crossed “a lot of lines.”

    U.S. officials placed some of the blame on Russia, one of Syria’s most important benefactors. Secretary of State Rex Tillerson, in Florida with Trump, said Moscow had failed in living up to a 2013 agreement that was intended to strip Syria of its chemical weapons stockpiles. Either Russia has been complicit or Russia has been simply incompetent in its ability to deliver on its end of the agreement,” Tillerson said.

    https://www.defense.gov/News/News-Stories/Article/Article/1144601/trump-orders-missile-attack-in-retaliation-for-syrian-chemical-strikes/

    This has been brewing for decades; the fallacy of believing a Big Mac w/fries, Coca-Cola and blue jeans would be a ‘reset button’ making “folks” abandon their rooted cultures, history and ideologies. It’s a hard lesson- as a Russian energy-dependent Europe is discovering, Hong Kong is experiencing– and Taiwan may learn soon.

    The Chinese and Russians announced their ‘New World Order’ alignment plans a while ago. This is the opening act of the road show. Never forget:

    “Because Putin knows if I am President of the United States, his days of tyranny and trying to intimidate the United States and those in Eastern Europe are over. I’m going to stand up to him. He’s a bully…” – Joe Biden.

    And today: “I’m not going to speak about intelligence, but Russia would pay a severe price if they used chemical weapons.” -Joe Biden

    Pfft. And Corn Pop smiled.

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  121. 81 million gave us this economy.

    So what!? Get over it.

    Kevin M (38e250)

  122. 81 million gave us this economy.
    Shame on you people.

    mg (8cbc69) — 3/11/2022 @ 3:10 pm

    Since I happen to believe our constitutional republic is worth keeping, I couldn’t be prouder of my vote. You’re welcome.

    lurker (59504c)


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