Patterico's Pontifications

2/28/2022

In Appreciation of the Ukrainian People

Filed under: General — JVW @ 4:53 pm



[guest post by JVW]

The Ukrainians people and their leaders appear to be facing the Russian attack with great bravery and fortitude. And the neighboring nations are doing their part in taking in Ukrainian mothers and children who have fled for safety. We can all only hope that the defenders of their homeland can hold out long enough for the pressure on Vladimir Putin, both from inside and outside of Russia, to become so bad that he is forced to reverse course. The recent resolve shown by Europe — a development the likelihood of which I pooh-poohed last week — has been most welcome, though it’s entirely fair to wonder if Europe’s commitment to the cause will hold out. Over at Hot Air, Allahpundit has a great piece discussing whether this heralds a new age of Europeans taking a greater role in protecting their continent or if Uncle Sam is quietly pulling the strings behind the scenes.

If Vietnam was the network news war and the First Gulf War was the CNN war, then this Ukrainian-Russian War has become the first TikTok war. I’m not a fan of TikTok since I see it as an incursive and malevolent creation of the Chinese, and it would seem that it is contributing mightily to the shortened attention spans and mindless narcissism of the social media generation. That said, though, TikTok videos posted by Ukrainian soldiers and citizens are giving us a valuable insight into what is going on thousands of miles from our safe perch here, though at the same time it is also unsurprisingly spreading its share of misinformation and garbage.

But I feel a whole lot better today about the prospects for a Russian defeat, certainly diplomatically and perhaps even militarily, than I did last week. And I think the Russians need to figure out that when the country you invade has cute young social media influencers who are willing to make TikTok videos on how to operate an abandoned Russian tank, why then you may have bitten off substantially more than you can chew.

– JVW

114 Responses to “In Appreciation of the Ukrainian People”

  1. For whatever reason I just love the idea of the Ukrainian social media influencer teaching her countrymen and countrywomen how to operate abandoned Russian tanks. With a fighting spirit like that, hopefully they simply cannot lose.

    JVW (ee64e4)

  2. I started paying more attention to Ukraine during the Sochi Olympics, when the Maidan protests were at their most intense. I even wrote on 2/22/2014 (http://www.theforvm dot org/ukraine-venezuela-round-updated) that the “mostly pro-Russian Crimea may be the next hot spot” and, sure enough, Putin’s “uncontested arrival” happened six days later.
    Since then, I’ve been condemning Putin and defending Ukrainians, who’ve been the real victims, militarily and by Putin’s scuzzy information warfare.
    Thankfully, they’re winning the information battlespace this time around. Ukrainians have been adept and Putin has fortunately been tone-deaf.
    It’s also a big deal that Zelenskyy submitted a formal application to the EU.

    Paul Montagu (5de684)

  3. Just as the leadup to WWII was a slow burn, this too has had a buildup. I agree with Faith Hill that this has been WWIII for a while now, whether we like it or not. I always envisioned WWIII as a nuclear holocaust, but that’s not necessarily the case.

    Complacency, thy name is The West. The democratic West just can’t conceive of the evil that lurks in the hearts and minds of these despots. We always bring flowers to a knife fight.

    And both sides of the political aisle do it. Obama preferred a good zinger in a debate to taking Russia seriously. Hillary, for all her posturing, was an utter fool with her “reset” button. And, has Trump denounced Putin yet?

    I wonder if Americans these days are capable of sacrificing like the WWII generation did, because this could get very ugly.

    norcal (5948da)

  4. Please excuse me. I meant Fiona Hill, not Faith Hill, although she perhaps agrees with Fiona!

    norcal (5948da)

  5. The other thing is going to happen, comrades, is proletariat will stop talk about Siege of Stalingrad and start talk about Siege of Kiyv. Make ghost of Comrade Koba very sad.

    nk (1d9030)

  6. I wonder if Americans these days are capable of sacrificing like the WWII generation did, because this could get very ugly.

    JVW- Was thinking exactly the same thing as I was going through the parents and grandparents things this past year now that they’ve all passed. Found some interesting stuff from daily life; their food and gas ration books, War Bond savings books from school- still w/some stamps in them- photos of them as kids on scrap metal drives and tilling victory gardens; some diaries with stories of saved bacon grease; baked bean sandwiches for dinners; mended clothes, treasured pairs of silk stockings; re-soled shoes, bald tires on an old car… even a jar full of steel pennies… some war time radio guides– several newspapers w/war news; even my mother’s original piano sheet music of Disney’s ‘Der Fuhrer’s Face.’ Lots of patriotic pins, flags, toy soldiers, blood drive info and so on… even some Civil Defense kitch my grandfather wore keeping Pgh., suburb Carnagie, PA safe from the Axis– and the telegram from the War Department notifying him his brother had been wounded in France. They did without a lot by our standards and made do with what they had.

    It’s a different time now and doing concerts to raise cash and tying yellow and blue ribbons ’round the ol’TV is quaint but sort of meaningless and not really a sacrifice. The gadgets and speed information moves should enhance communicating and end modern warfare faster. But it only brings it into your hand-held gadget faster.

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  7. i haven’t seen much written about some of the craven responses in the corporate world

    the huge multinational company i work for (who has offices and personnel in both countries) put out a tepid statement that treats this brutal war as if it’s just a temporary misunderstanding, no one’s to blame, stuffy stuff is bad, and anyway did you see our great new ad on tv?

    the ukrainian employees were having none of it, and some of them were so riled up with their comments on the company site i thought they risked getting fired

    this is the same company that was rah rah BLM and virtue signaling to no end about the georgia voting law and the bathroom bill in north carolina

    JF (e1156d)

  8. Please excuse me. I meant Fiona Hill, not Faith Hill

    Well, I was wondering. Last I saw her, she was in Montana in 1883.

    Kevin M (38e250)

  9. It would be good to stop Cold War II right at the beginning.

    Kevin M (38e250)

  10. Time to go reread “Red Storm Rising”

    Kevin M (38e250)

  11. But I feel a whole lot better today about the prospects for a Russian defeat, certainly diplomatically and perhaps even militarily, than I did last week.

    Russians seriously underestimated Ukrainian resistance and did not have good logistics in place. I can hope the Ukrainians adjust and adapt as the Russians revamp their strategy.

    Hoi Polloi (998b37)

  12. Hope those weapons were given to the proper citizens.

    mg (8cbc69)

  13. Our Russian tank expert, Nastya Tynam, or, in cyrillic, Настя Туман, actually has a really awesome Instagram page. It would appear that she is a gear-head of sorts, since most of her posts have to do with the automotive world. How come Ukraine gets her as an influencer and we get stuck with various Kardashians? Seems unfair to me.

    JVW (ee64e4)

  14. The first social media war.

    mg (8cbc69)

  15. That’s not a tank, that’s an armored personnel carrier, basically an extended Humvee, demilitarized (did you see any weapons?), and surplused out to some amusement park, recreation center, or museum. The local police, too, I suppose, we do that here.

    nk (1d9030)

  16. Here’s another reason to like the Ukrainians.

    Bloody hell. Looking at a message from the Ukraine Library Association concerning the cancellation of their forthcoming conference. It basically says “We will reschedule just as soon as we have finished vanquishing our invaders”. Ukrainian Librarians, I salute you.

    Even their librarians are badass.

    Paul Montagu (5de684)

  17. @17. Still, Paul, here’s the best reason to like Ukrainians to surface all day:

    Ukrainian Man Partially Sinks Yacht of Russian CEO ‘Selling Weapons’

    https://www.newsweek.com/ukrainian-man-partially-sinks-yacht-russian-ceo-selling-weapons-1683067

    Have you heard this one before?:

    ‘Sink the yacht. Take the cannoli.’ 😉 😉 😉

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  18. @14. JVW: Da! Da!

    Quite a ‘site’ to behold! Sensing a little Tulsi nostalgia. 😉

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  19. Have you heard this one before?:

    Yes, I posted it earlier today.

    Rip Murdock (d67a00)

  20. Fiona Hill:

    …… If anybody thinks that Putin wouldn’t use something that he’s got that is unusual and cruel, think again. Every time you think, “No, he wouldn’t, would he?” Well, yes, he would. And he wants us to know that, of course.

    Rip Murdock (d67a00)

  21. It’s hard for me to be cheery about this (or any) war. Russia has a very large military force, and its leader does not strike me as reluctant to spill blood. Cities are full of non-combatant civilians, and these non-combatants have fared poorly in modern wars. We may get the chance to see what it was like to be a civilian in Warsaw in 1944, in Berlin 1945, in Saigon in 1975, or pick your own favorite example played out on our iPads. I wish there were alternatives. Kyiv has nearly three million inhabitants. We’ll be lucky if fewer than 25,000 are killed in the next two months. It’s monstrous and ugly.

    Fred (618546)

  22. Oh my. Me thinks the Chicken Kyiv is cooked:

    Ukraine: 40 mile-long Russian convoy heading to Kyiv twice as long as previously thought

    https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/russia-ukraine-war-kyiv-maxar-b2025365.html

    Let’s hope gearhead hottie Nastya Tynam is, ‘westbound and down; loaded up and truckin’…’

    _______

    First Biden betrayed the Afghans. Now he’s thrown Ukraine to the wolves.

    https://hotair.com/headlines/2022/02/27/first-biden-betrayed-the-afghans-now-hes-thrown-ukraine-to-the-wolves-n451573

    If it was under the bus instead, ‘gearhead Nastya’ might have come in handy helpin’ 18-wheeler Joe out of the ditch…

    “Because Putin knows if I am president of the United States, his days of tyranny and trying to intimidate the United States and those in Eastern Europe are over. I’m going to stand up to him. He’s a bully…” – Joe Biden.

    =sigh= That went well, didn’t, Joe.

    _______

    Per Reuters today, Joe told Americans not be worried about nuclear war– the day after Russian President Vladimir Putin put Russia’s nuclear deterrent on high alert amid Moscow’s ongoing invasion of Ukraine.

    Recall what Bob Gates said.

    BTW, big sale on bomb shelters, kids: https://www.safecastle.com/pages/falloutshelters

    _______

    Remember when everyone was focused on 7.5% inflation, $5/gal., gas, $5 /lb., hamburger, masks battles and Covid….. only last week?!

    … and Biden smiled.

    “Duck and cover!” – Archer Productions, 1952

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  23. Yahoo News Poll: Ahead of State of the Union, 61% of Americans say Biden hasn’t kept most of his promises

    https://news.yahoo.com/poll-ahead-of-state-of-the-union-61-of-americans-say-biden-hasnt-kept-most-of-his-promises-214744986.html

    He lucked out: no Ukranians were polled.

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  24. Sigh. I guess, however obscure the necessity, Putin shills have to live, too.

    nk (1d9030)

  25. Putin is losing allies he only has belarus and tucker carlson left. Lebron James they don’t sell my sneakers in russia do they?

    asset (44da98)

  26. Tokyo Tucker

    norcal (5948da)

  27. With masks disappearing in Congress, at the White House and as the taverns are filling again, this should start a healthy, getting-back-to-normal-barfight:

    62 percent of voters say Putin wouldn’t have invaded Ukraine if Trump were president: poll

    A majority of American voters say that Russian President Vladimir Putin would not have invaded Ukraine had former President Trump still been in office, according to a new survey released on Friday [Feb., 25.] A new Harvard Center for American Political Studies (CAPS)-Harris Poll survey released Friday found that 62 percent of those polled believed Putin would not be moving against Ukraine if Trump had been president. When looking strictly at the answers of Democrats and Republicans, 85 percent of Republicans and 38 percent of Democrats answered this way. However, 38 percent of all Americans polled believed that Putin would have invaded Ukraine even if Trump had been president.

    https://thehill.com/homenews/administration/595919-62-percent-of-voters-say-putin-wouldnt-have-invaded-ukraine-if-trump

    “What a revoltin’ development this is!” – Chester Riley [William Bendix]’The Life Of Riley’ NBC TV, 1953-58

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  28. 62 percent of voters say Putin wouldn’t have invaded Ukraine if Trump were president: poll

    Putin would have invaded anyway. The difference is that Trump would have criticized our NATO allies before criticizing Putin.

    Has Trump said anything derogatory about Putin since the invasion? I mean calling Putin out personally.

    Anyone who criticizes Biden over Putin has a warped view of the world.

    Trump is a laughingstock, and the only thing preventing more people from recognizing this truth is ego. It just won’t do to admit error. The psychological pain must be daunting.

    norcal (5948da)

  29. @29. Guess that puts you in the 38%, norcal.

    But does this body blow hurt the mind– or the ego?!?!:

    Russia President Vladimir Putin stripped of taekwondo black belt in the wake of Ukraine crisis

    https://economictimes.indiatimes.com/magazines/panache/russia-president-vladimir-putin-stripped-of-taekwondo-black-belt-in-the-wake-of-ukraine-crisis/articleshow/89915024.cms

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  30. The difference is that Trump would have criticized our NATO allies before criticizing Putin.

    norcal (5948da) — 2/28/2022 @ 11:29 pm

    Respectfully disagree. The difference is that if Trump had been reelected, NATO might not even exist right now, and certainly wouldn’t be as functional as it has proven to be in these first days of the Ukraine crisis.

    Demosthenes (3fd56e)

  31. I’m afraid you’re correct, Demosthenes. I went too easy on the Orange Gaslighter. 🤦‍♂️

    norcal (5948da)

  32. Meh. We all make mistakes. 74 million people voted for the prick, after all. And 81 million voted for Biden. By my count, that’s 155 million mistakes right there.

    Demosthenes (3fd56e)

  33. Trump would have had us talking about his own new crimes and new outrages and the Ukraine invasion would have been on Page 5.

    nk (1d9030)

  34. “62 percent of voters say Putin wouldn’t have invaded Ukraine if Trump were president: poll”

    Trump’s comments to senior administration officials that he would pull us out of NATO and disengage with S. Korea in a 2nd term ….tells me that he’s with Putin and Kim. It’s only speculation as to why and to what level, but absent an otherwise clearly articulated rationale, how can someone view those positions as wise or tenable? The sad part of our current political discourse is that if we are confronted with an uncomfortable position/policy from our team, too many just flitter over to the next outrage and nothing is ever thought through. It’s not just mean Tweets….wake up. How many warnings are required…..

    AJ_Liberty (3cb02f)

  35. 33-
    🍻

    mg (8cbc69)

  36. Anyone who criticizes Biden over Putin has a warped view of the world.

    Trump is a laughingstock, and the only thing preventing more people from recognizing this truth is ego. It just won’t do to admit error. The psychological pain must be daunting.

    I’ve been wondering: Were those people always morally warped? Or did they just make a serious error of intellectual judgment when they decided to lionize a deeply selfish, amoral person as a hero and their savior from the Americans they hate?

    When people say things like “You can’t make me hate Putin more than I hate the left” — i.e. their fellow Americans who disagree with them on many things but would not go around wantonly killing people — I’m assuming “always morally warped.”

    Radegunda (c970ff)

  37. The Ukrainians should be looking at Idlib and Chechnya to see what the next phase of the Russian campaign will look like. Indiscriminate and massive bombing and artillery fire against large urban cities.

    Hoi Polloi (093fb9)

  38. Trump
    s status within the Republican Party is something very unusual.

    The Democratic Party is ignoring resigned Governor Andrew Cuomo. Now he’s running some television commercials, using some of his leftover campaign funds, (not that big a buy and he doesn’t seem to be running for anything this year) saying how bad it they lost a leader, who has now been exonerated.

    https://www.nytimes.com/2022/02/28/nyregion/andrew-cuomo-tv-ad.html

    According to AdImpact, an ad tracking firm, Mr. Cuomo’s still-active campaign account began spending $369,000 to air a television advertisement across the state — a media blitz designed not to support or attack a political candidate or even to apologize to New Yorkers, but to brazenly recast himself as the victim of politically motivated “attacks.”

    The 30-second spot that began running Monday on broadcast and cable splices together recent news snippets in an attempt to misleadingly convince New Yorkers that the entire misconduct case assembled by the state attorney general, Letitia James, against Mr. Cuomo had crumbled since he left office in August.

    “Political attacks won,” the advertisement concludes. “And New Yorkers lost a proven leader.”

    Also, the lead item here:

    https://www.nytimes.com/2022/03/01/nyregion/cuomos-tv-ads.html

    Sammy Finkelman (46ec7d)

  39. DCSCA (f4c5e5) — 2/28/2022 @ 8:31 pm

    First Biden betrayed the Afghans. Now he’s thrown Ukraine to the wolves.

    He’s tried to negotiate with the Taliban, offering to lift (some?) sanctions and in fact doing so, but the Taliban have only doubled down in restricting freedom.

    https://www.nytimes.com/2022/02/25/us/politics/us-sanctions-afghanistan.html

    The Biden administration moved on Friday to relax sanctions that have contributed to the collapse of Afghanistan’s economy since the Taliban takeover in August, issuing a measure that makes clear that people can lawfully engage in transactions with the Afghan government in most circumstances…In a statement, Wally Adeyemo, the deputy Treasury secretary, portrayed the move as part of a larger effort by the United States to not just support the flow of humanitarian aid to Afghanistan, but also to facilitate commercial and financial activity there that could allow the economy to function — without directly benefiting Islamist extremists….

    https://www.whitehouse.gov/briefing-room/press-briefings/2022/02/26/background-press-call-by-senior-administration-officials-on-u-s-support-for-the-people-of-afghanistan

    Our goal here is to make sure that we do everything we can to make sure that money is flowing to the Afghan people to help alleviate the humanitarian crisis that they face, but also to allow the commercial activity in Afghanistan to happen in order to build a (inaudible) cycle that will reinforce the livelihoods of the Afghan people.

    In order to do this, it’s critical that Afghan institutions be put in a position where civil servants are allowed to function, including at the central bank, where we have made clear that in order for the international community to engage with the central bank, it’s important that it establishes independence, bring in a third party to validate that independence, and get the kind of technical assistance that is needed to ensure that they are able to put in place basic standards for the prevention of illicit finance, similar to what was done prior to August of 2021.

    he Taliban said Sunday that Afghans would not be allowed to leave the country without special permission (I think that’s been the rule anyway – they need to give a reason – business can be a reason) and that women would not be allowed to travel without a male escort.

    They got some pushback from the USA and the UK so it seems to have been retracted:

    https://www.brecorder.com/news/40157950/taliban-row-back-comments-saying-afghans-barred-from-leaving

    Sammy Finkelman (46ec7d)

  40. Bolton pushes back on the claim that Trump was very tough on Russia and that’s way Putin didn’t launch his invasion before.

    Radegunda (c970ff)

  41. The New York Times, thinking about the 500,000 or so Ukrainians who have left or are leaving the country, decided to run an article on what people take with them when they have to leave suddenly. So they interviewed a dozen Afghans.

    It was mostly what they had with them.

    https://www.nytimes.com/2022/02/28/world/asia/afghan-evacuation-kabul.html

    Sammy Finkelman (46ec7d)

  42. More on how tough Trump was on Russia:

    Bolton: Trump tried to block sanctions against Russia for the Skripal poison attack in Britain, then instructed Pompeo to blame “some bureaucrat” for Lavrov.

    He later “stopped an anodyne statement criticizing Russia on the tenth anniversary of its invasion of Georgia.”

    Radegunda (c970ff)

  43. By my count, that’s 155 million mistakes right there.

    Indeed. Too bad Mitt Romney never got the job.

    Kevin M (38e250)

  44. This is good:

    Former Russian foreign minister calls on Russian diplomats to resign in protest of Putin’s war

    Yesterday I saw a post saying that substantial numbers of lower-level Russian government employees were resigning.

    Radegunda (c970ff)

  45. There is comedy in tragedy:

    When asked about his good get w/Zelinsky, a CNN reporter said on air, “We interviewed President Zelinsky in a secret location– at his underground bunker somewhere in the center of Kyiv.”

    =rimshot=
    ____

    When asked in the interview what President Biden should say in his State of the Union speech this evening, Zelinsky responded, “Something useful.”

    =rimshot=

    Once a comedian; always a comedian.

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  46. Ukraine has offered 5 million rubles (now about $47,000) to any Russian soldier who defects.

    Sammy Finkelman (46ec7d)

  47. Even money that the classified material that Trump took to Mar-a-Lago to sell to our enemies included information about Ukraine’s armaments and defenses.

    nk (1d9030)

  48. I don’t think he had that idea in mind. A lot of little things are classified.

    Sammy Finkelman (46ec7d)

  49. I read somewhere that some are so classified that the National Archives which is going through them is not allowed to even say what they are.

    nk (1d9030)

  50. Michael McFaul noting that some “tough on Russia” actions were actually against Trump’s will.

    Radegunda (c970ff)

  51. 44. Kevin M (38e250) — 3/1/2022 @ 9:50 am

    . Too bad Mitt Romney never got the job.

    Romney is dumb, and didn’t have anybody around him who could clarify matters for him.

    He ever figured out that the Obama Administration had “unlearned” that the attack in Benghazi was a
    terrorist attack as the week on which it happened went on (Hillary knew better, but didn’t say a word or prptest at the talking points)

    Romney still thinks that Trump withheld aid from Ukraine because he wanted Zelensky to carry out a political investigation on his foe. The truth is, the aid was withheld because Putin, acting through informants of Giuliani, had poisoned Trump’p s mind against some people associated with the new Ukrainian government, and the linkage was only made at the beginning of September, by EU Ambassador Gordon Sondland, with the possible advice of Mick Mulvaney, and Zelensky had indicated he might be amenable to an investigation (of Burisma) in that July 25 phone call and would appreciate any information the US had. And as far as Trump knew, the Ukrainiains had no idea the aid was on hold.

    Sammy Finkelman (46ec7d)

  52. because Putin, acting through informants of Giuliani, had poisoned Trump’p s mind against some people associated with the new Ukrainian government,

    Ah, so Trump really was easily manipulated by Putin. Got it!

    But you’re suggesting that Trump really cared about corruption in Ukraine, and was in no way acting in his own self-interest.
    I really don’t comprehend what the motivation could be to keep trying to portray Trump as a much better person than the one he regularly presents to the public. Is he really worth that much effort to defend?

    Radegunda (c970ff)

  53. Because Hillary Clinton kept most of her interactions with other people at the State Department off the record, I don;t think anyone can prove that Hillary had any advance knowledge of the tslking points, even though they ran them by the Sate Department (the State Department only objected to the mission in Benghazi being called a consulate)

    Everyone in the State Department knew there had been no demonstration outside the mission where the ambassador was staying but it was a surprise attack.

    Hillary probably knew or sspected that the head of Saudi intelligence, Prince Bandar bin Sultan was probably bwehind the attack (because the US objected to sending weapons to the Syrian rebels) Ambbassador Stevens was in Benghazi to try to stop a ship from sailing to Turkey (he didn’t but the weapons lzter stayed in Turkey)

    I think a problem for her was that President Clinton had forgiven Prince Bandar, then the Saudi Ambassador to the United States for killing Vincent Foster, nd agreed to cover it up, when he
    rushed to the White House on July 20, 1993. (Foster had tried to blackmail him for money so he could hire the lawyers he wanted because he thought thinggs were coming unglued after the FBI Director was fired.)

    Sammy Finkelman (46ec7d)

  54. nk (1d9030) — 3/1/2022 @ 11:34 am

    I read somewhere that some are so classified that the National Archives which is going through them is not allowed to even say what they are

    That would be nothing special, since the essence of a secret can sometimes be summed up in a sentence.

    They did sy Trump had the original letters to and from Kim Jong Un,.

    Sammy Finkelman (46ec7d)

  55. Turtle McConnell on Ukraine: “We need to give them as much as possible.”

    Give them??? Give, give, give… WTF. An added expense to Americans, he suggests, on top of the existing DoD budget. This is a Republican who routinely whines about adding to America’s debt and deficits. How much has it cost to deploy and maintain U.S. troops and aircraft from the continental U.S. as well as from bases in Western Europe to locales in Eastern Europe, Mitch?

    These old, swamp-creatured-slimeballs never get around to addressing the costs- especially when they’re spending OTHER PEOPLE’S MONEY. Are you going to issue Ukranian Freedom Relief War Bonds, Mitch? Or just charge a few more billion dollars to Uncle Sam’s credit card, financed on borrowed bucks from China…

    … and the MIC smiled.

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  56. 62 percent of voters say Putin wouldn’t have invaded Ukraine if Trump were president: poll

    Putin would have invaded anyway. The difference is that Trump would have criticized our NATO allies before criticizing Putin.

    Why would Putin invade while Trump was doing the dirty work of delegitimizing Ukraine for him?

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  57. @57. Check the corruption index; They’ve been doing it to themselves- they’re nearly as corrupt as Russia. So you’ve got Capone and Moran shooting it out w/o the help of a Don. 😉

    https://www.transparency.org/en/cpi/2020/index/ukr

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  58. Five vile things Trump did to Zelensky and Ukraine that you forgot about

    1. Spread propaganda about Ukrainian interference in the 2016 election
    ……..
    2. Ousted the well-regarded U.S. ambassador to Ukraine
    ……..
    3. Froze military assistance to Ukraine
    ……..
    4. Withheld a White House meeting from Zelensky
    ……..
    5. Turned Ukraine policy over to Giuliani
    …….

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  59. @59. See #58. Ukraine is in the corruption neighborhood with Mexico– and Russia.

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  60. You know, this forum is much better when you block DCSCA.

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  61. Hunter Biden could paint you a picture about all things Ukraine… but the tempermental ‘artiste’ is surprisingly unavailable for comment.

    😉

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  62. @57 putin should’ve attacked two years ago

    but life just isn’t fair

    JF (e1156d)

  63. @63. Have you seen how many times Vlad’s been to France in the past 8 years?? Especially to hob-knob w/Macron?

    The Froggies could have jjumped on this; they’ve had plenty of opportunities to solve this problem for the world…

    “You must understand that this is a once-in-a-lifetime job, whoever does it can never work again…” – The Jackal [Edward Fox] ‘The Day Of The Jackal’ 1973

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  64. Walker won’t go to Marjorie Taylor Greene event after she spoke at pro-Putin rally
    U.S. Senate candidate Herschel Walker pulled out of a weekend event organized by U.S. Rep. Marjorie Taylor Greene after she spoke at a white nationalist rally where attendees cheered Russia’s invasion of Ukraine and chanted Vladimir Putin’s name.

    Walker had planned to speak Saturday at Greene’s “Second Amendment and Freedom Rally” in Rome alongside U.S. Rep. Matt Gaetz, strategist Stephen Bannon and other far-right figures.
    ……..
    U.S. House Minority Leader Kevin McCarthy, U.S. Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell and other top Republican figures have condemned her decision to speak at the America First Political Action Conference, a group organized by white nationalist Nick Fuentes.

    McCarthy said Greene should have ditched the event as soon as Fuentes introduced her Friday by urging the crowd to give a “round of applause for Russia,” triggering an ovation and a boisterous chant for Putin.
    ……..
    (Former U.S. Sen. David) Perdue, who is challenging Gov. Brian Kemp, said through a spokeswoman that he would attend to highlight the “need to protect the Second Amendment and expand our God-given right to bear arms.”

    “Given the invasion in Ukraine, we see the need to protect it now more than ever,” Perdue campaign spokeswoman Jenni Sweat said.
    …….
    So the threshold limit for McCarthy is a pro-Putin chant, and not the anti-Semitism of the America First Political Action Conference and the holocaust denial (among other views) of Nick Fuentes. And apparently Perdue fears an invasion from Canada.

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  65. President of mexico will not support world sanctions on putin and says is drug cartel banks are open for business with russia.

    asset (3d4b83)

  66. @66. The top five sources of U.S. total petroleum (including crude oil) imports by share of total petroleum imports in 2020 were:

    Canada 52%
    Mexico 11%
    Russia 7%
    Saudi Arabia 7%
    Colombia 4%

    http://www.worldstopexports.com/crude-oil-imports-by-country/

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  67. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_international_presidential_trips_made_by_Vladimir_Putin

    “The first time I ever saw a jet, I shot it down.” – Chuck Yeager

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  68. I read that Russian oil imported into US primarily goes from Russia’s Pacific sources to Alaska and Hawaii.

    steveg (e81d76)

  69. The real war crimes will start when the Chechens arrive in town.
    There is a podcast over on War on the Rocks
    https://warontherocks.com/2022/02/interpreting-the-first-few-days-of-the-russo-ukrainian-war/

    The main thrust of it is that Russia is not fighting the Russian way yet. No huge sustained artillery barrages, no crushing use of bombers, etc. The podcast mentions that if NATO were to be involved, that would be expected.

    Russia may still decide to teach Ukraine a lesson about who is bigger and badder

    steveg (e81d76)

  70. That girl is better looking than Jeremy Clarkson… thanks to God for that, but he’d have at least tried find an old Trabant to crush.

    steveg (e81d76)

  71. California leads the way!!!

    Kamala Harris to black radio host:

    “Ukraine is a country in Europe. It exists next to another country called Russia. Russia is a bigger country. Russia decided to invade a smaller country called Ukraine so basically that’s wrong.”

    FFS. I suppose this isn’t racist because she is black, but its condescending as hell.

    steveg (e81d76)

  72. “Ukraine is a country in Europe. It exists next to another country called Russia. Russia is a bigger country. Russia decided to invade a smaller country called Ukraine so basically that’s wrong.”

    Can she see it from her house?

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  73. Putin’s strongman ally may have accidentally shared a map of Russia’s Ukrainian-invasion plans

    ‘Belarusian dictator Alexander Lukashenko may have accidentally shared Russia’s invasion plans for Ukraine on live television.

    A short video shared by the Belarusian journalist Tadeusz Giczan on Twitter showed Lukashenko pointing to a map of Ukraine that shows it segmented into four parts. Giczan called it “what looks like an actual invasion map.” Lukashenko is an authoritarian and longtime ally of Russian President Vladimir Putin.’

    https://www.businessinsider.com/belarus-lukashenko-revealed-map-russias-ukrainian-invasion-plans-2022-3

    “Oops!” – Rick Perry, November, 2011

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  74. Chechen hit squad sent to kill Zelensky ‘neutralized’

    Members of an elite Chechen death squad dispatched by Vladimir Putin to assassinate Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky were killed or captured Tuesday, according to a senior Ukrainian official.

    Oleksiy Danilov, Secretary Ukraine’s National Security and Defense Council, said on Ukrainian TV Tuesday that two Chechen units that “came to kill our president” had been “eliminated,” according to a report in The Telegraph.

    Danilov said one unit had been captured, and the other was engaged by Ukrainian forces.

    It was not immediately clear how close the failed assassins were able to get to Zelensky.

    nk (1d9030)

  75. POC are used to being bombed and shelled, white people are not. Most black people are more concerned about racism in this country then what is happening to white people in the ukraine.

    asset (4b823a)

  76. @76 Virtually every black person in Africa would trade places with American blacks in a heartbeat.

    norcal (5948da)

  77. 76. Is that the politically correct version of “tight pussy, loose shoes, and a warm place to sh!t”?

    nk (1d9030)

  78. @76 would they trade places with the black men in prison or county jails? Rikers island or arkansas prison farms ?

    asset (4b823a)

  79. @79 Of course not, but I suspect they would be too busy taking advantage of all the legal opportunities to get ahead in the U.S., and have neither the time nor the inclination to commit the crimes that would land them in prison.

    Blacks from the Caribbean and Africa who immigrate to the U.S. tend to prosper because they don’t walk around with a racial chip on their shoulders.

    norcal (5948da)

  80. But do their kids or more likely their grandkids pick up that chip?

    urbanleftbehind (1bfbc5)

  81. Unfortunately, the victim/grievance cult does get to them sometimes, ULB.

    norcal (5948da)

  82. Shades of the Battle of the Bulge:

    Originally ran in the New York Post.

    There’s a word that Russians can;t pronounce right:

    https://www.newsbreak.com/news/2528537281595/bewildered-russian-soldiers-paranoid-ukrainians-on-the-ground-in-a-war-zone

    SOMEWHERE IN UKRAINE — None of the taxi apps on my phone work right now, understandably.

    The only way to travel is to hire a taxi at train stations. I proceeded to ask a local woman for directions. The combination of my accent and my clearly foreign dress sense had set her on edge. She asked me to pronounce the word “Palyanitsa” — the Ukrainian word for a traditional loaf of bread — three times. The word is composed of sounds that native Russian speakers cannot pronounce correctly. It has emerged as a shibboleth in this war. Which I knew having spent that morning watching the social media videos of alleged Russian saboteurs being taken by Ukrainian men at gunpoint in Kharkiv.

    The woman looked me in the eyes and asked me directly if I was an infiltrator. I barely passed the test, but my American passport and press credentials helped. As did the fact that I had an Odessa-born wife. Her own husband was from the Odessa region and I knew his home town.

    Sammy Finkelman (46ec7d)

  83. Kyiv was said by the mayor the other day to be surrounded, but later it was taken back – by two different people. But western military experts do expect it to be surrounded and after that they could hold out 30 or 40 days.

    Sammy Finkelman (46ec7d)

  84. In a Senate hearing, lawmakers debate whether U.S. intelligence forces should be sent into Ukraine.
    ……..
    Using American covert intelligence operations to assist Ukraine was first raised at a hearing of the Senate Armed Services Committee by Roger Zakheim, the Washington director of the Ronald Reagan Presidential Foundation and Institute. Mr. Zakheim, a former general counsel for the House Armed Services Committee, said that the United States should use intelligence agency assets to covertly advise the Ukrainian military and help them destroy the troops moving on Kyiv.
    …….
    The idea caught the interest of several lawmakers, including Senator Joe Manchin III, Democrat of West Virginia.

    “You said we must stop that convoy from getting to Kyiv,” Mr. Manchin said. “OK, there’s only certain ways we can stop that convoy. Can you be a little bit more explicit on how we should be doing it?”

    Mr. Zakheim responded that the United States should use intelligence forces to “sabotage the roads” using either people on the ground or unmanned drones.
    …….
    Senator Tom Cotton, Republican of Arkansas, said that the United States should provide intelligence to help Ukraine strike at Russian forces, but suggested it should be American operatives working near or alongside the Ukrainian military rather than officials in Washington.
    ………
    To destroy the convoy (which apparently has stalled, running out of fuel and food, I guess shortages are everywhere) there eere is no substitute for the Warthog.

    Rip Murdock (d67a00)

  85. Drone strikes by “Ukrainian” drones might work. A10s require training.

    Kevin M (38e250)

  86. That’s real covert, alright. In the New York Times. F***ing lawyers!

    nk (1d9030)

  87. They said “covert” not “clandestine.” The clandestine stuff they’ll announce later.

    Kevin M (38e250)

  88. Ukraine credits Turkish drones with eviscerating Russian tanks and armor in their first use in a major conflict

    As Russia pounded Ukraine in the opening days of its invasion, the defenders credited a new piece of equipment with helping them fight back — the Bayraktar TB2 drone.

    Videos shared by the Ukrainian military showed at least one strike appearing to tear apart a column of Russian tanks and armored vehicles.
    ……..
    “Bayraktars at work,” the caption for the same video posted on an official military Facebook page said. “Be afraid, enemies, there will be no peace for you in our land.” The operators can be heard cheering in the video after the strike lands.
    ……..
    The Russian invasion of Ukraine represents the first outing in a major conflict for the Bayraktar, an armed drone with a 12-meter wingspan and a distinctive triangular tail section.

    It is produced by the Turkish weapons manufacturer Baykar, which says the drones can reach altitudes of 25,000 feet and fly for 27 continuous hours, operated remotely from up to 300 km away. Each one can carry up to four laser-guided bombs or rockets, for an estimated total payload of 150 kilograms.

    The Bayraktar is showing the effectiveness of small drones like this to unleash havoc on invading columns of vehicles. A US MQ-9 Reaper, by comparison, has a 20-meter wingspan and can carry up to 1,701 kilograms of ordnance.
    ………
    In a widely shared video of an unnamed Ukrainian soldier mocking the Russians, the drones’ power was a key point: “Is everything OK with you, dudes? How do you like our Bayraktars? What do you think — oh, what’s that flying over you right now?”
    ………

    Rip Murdock (d67a00)

  89. Is there any escalation that the Russians could do that would get US forces openly supporting Ukraine?

    Indiscriminate use of artillery against civilian areas?

    Firebombing cities?

    Is there anything that Putin might order that his own army would refuse?

    There are so many ways for this to go bad.

    Kevin M (38e250)

  90. The clandestine stuff they’ll announce later.

    Heh!

    nk (1d9030)

  91. Speaking of appreciation, Zelenskyy accepted Germany’s offer of joining the EU, only to have it yanked away.

    Paul Montagu (5de684)

  92. Good news from the Ukrainian IRS: If you take possession of a tank or other Russian assets, you don’t have to declare them as income on your tax return. I hope TurboTax updated their software accordingly.

    Paul Montagu (5de684)

  93. Is there any escalation that the Russians could do that would get US forces openly supporting Ukraine?

    Using tactical nuclear weapons against a city?

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  94. Kevin M (38e250) — 3/1/2022 @ 11:57 pm

    Is there any escalation that the Russians could do that would get US forces openly supporting Ukraine?

    Indiscriminate use of artillery against civilian areas?

    Firebombing cities?

    No, but they might do so covertly. To a limited degree. A possibility might be to declare an (imperfect) protective zone.

    Is there anything that Putin might order that his own army would refuse?

    They have already done so.

    https://www.nytimes.com/2022/03/01/world/europe/russia-troops-pentagon.html

    Plagued by poor morale as well as fuel and food shortages, some Russian troops in Ukraine have surrendered en masse or sabotaged their own vehicles to avoid fighting, a senior Pentagon official said on Tuesday.

    We don’t really know the extent of this and if it can apply to the more specialized and skilled units.

    Sammy Finkelman (46ec7d)

  95. More:

    Some entire Russian units have laid down their arms without a fight after confronting a surprisingly stiff Ukrainian defense, the official said. A significant number of the Russian troops are young conscripts who are poorly trained and ill-prepared for the all-out assault. And in some cases, Russian troops have deliberately punched holes in their vehicles’ gas tanks, presumably to avoid combat, the official said.

    The Pentagon official declined to say how the military made these assessments — presumably a mosaic of intelligence including statements from captured Russian soldiers and communications intercepts — or how widespread these setbacks may be across the sprawling battlefield. The official spoke on the condition of anonymity to discuss operational developments….

    …But U.S. analysts have been struck by the “risk-averse behavior” of such a large force, the Pentagon official said. Russia launched an amphibious landing to seize Mariupol, a pivotal port city on the Sea of Azov, but landed forces around 40 miles from the city. That allowed the Russians extra time and space to mount an invasion, but also gave the city’s defenders time to prepare.

    Russia’s vaunted air force has yet to gain air superiority over Ukraine, with Russian warplanes thwarted by Ukrainian fighter jets and a surprisingly resilient and potent array of air defenses, from shoulder-fired Stinger antiaircraft missiles to much larger surface-to-air weapons, the Pentagon official said.

    They ignored mobile air defense and bombed old air defense sites – that had been air defense sites,

    Russia-Ukraine War
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    Russia-Ukraine War
    Some Russian troops are surrendering or sabotaging vehicles rather than fighting, a Pentagon official says.

    March 1, 2022, 12:32 p.m. ET
    March 1, 2022, 12:32 p.m. ET
    Eric Schmitt and Julian E. Barnes
    Pro-Russian troops in the separatist-controlled settlement of Mykolaivka, Ukraine, on Tuesday.
    Pro-Russian troops in the separatist-controlled settlement of Mykolaivka, Ukraine, on Tuesday.Credit…Alexander Ermochenko/Reuters
    WASHINGTON — Plagued by poor morale as well as fuel and food shortages, some Russian troops in Ukraine have surrendered en masse or sabotaged their own vehicles to avoid fighting, a senior Pentagon official said on Tuesday.

    Some entire Russian units have laid down their arms without a fight after confronting a surprisingly stiff Ukrainian defense, the official said. A significant number of the Russian troops are young conscripts who are poorly trained and ill-prepared for the all-out assault. And in some cases, Russian troops have deliberately punched holes in their vehicles’ gas tanks, presumably to avoid combat, the official said.

    The Pentagon official declined to say how the military made these assessments — presumably a mosaic of intelligence including statements from captured Russian soldiers and communications intercepts — or how widespread these setbacks may be across the sprawling battlefield. The official spoke on the condition of anonymity to discuss operational developments.

    But taken together, these factors may help explain why Russian forces, including an ominous 40-mile convoy of tanks and armored vehicles near Kyiv, Ukraine’s capital, have come to a near crawl in the past day or two, U.S. officials said.
    Besides dealing with shortages of fuel, food and spare parts, the Pentagon official said, Russian commanders leading that armored column toward Kyiv may also be “regrouping and rethinking” their battle plans, making adjustments on the fly to gain momentum for what U.S. intelligence and military officials say is an inevitable push in the next several days to encircle and ultimately capture the capital.

    “They have a lot of power available to them,” said the Pentagon official, adding that 80 percent of the more than 150,000 Russian troops amassed on Ukraine’s borders have now joined the fight.

    But U.S. analysts have been struck by the “risk-averse behavior” of such a large force, the Pentagon official said. Russia launched an amphibious landing to seize Mariupol, a pivotal port city on the Sea of Azov, but landed forces around 40 miles from the city. That allowed the Russians extra time and space to mount an invasion, but also gave the city’s defenders time to prepare.

    Russia’s vaunted air force has yet to gain air superiority over Ukraine, with Russian warplanes thwarted by Ukrainian fighter jets and a surprisingly resilient and potent array of air defenses, from shoulder-fired Stinger antiaircraft missiles to much larger surface-to-air weapons, the Pentagon official said.

    For Russian forces coming out of Belarus, logistics problems have proved stubborn, a European official said on Tuesday.Ahead of the invasion, U.S. and British intelligence had raised questions about the supply chain for the Russian troops in Belarus. During military exercises there, some of the soldiers were getting inadequate supplies of food and fuel, according to independent analysts. But American officials told allies that the Russians had fixed those problems by mid-February, which was one reason that American warnings about the invasion intensified in the middle of last month, according to the European official, who spoke on the condition of anonymity to discuss operational developments.

    That could be why initially no Russian troops seemed to be coming from Belarus. I thought Putin would find all sorts of things didn’t work – nothing ever works on the first try – that’s why they do exercises – and he would have to postpone his invasion, if he hadn’t baked that in already, but he didn’t — much.

    Sammy Finkelman (46ec7d)

  96. Is there any escalation that the Russians could do that would get US forces openly supporting Ukraine?
    Indiscriminate use of artillery against civilian areas?

    Firebombing cities?

    No, but they might do so covertly……

    How would indiscriminate use of artillery against civilian areas and firebombing be done covertly?

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  97. Oops. On another matter, ERdigan had talked to Putin himself and believed that there would be no big opeation and so did not evacuate Trukish diplomats and citizens from Kiev. He changed his mind late Wednesday night February 23 their time (which seems to be about the time the United States determined it is really going ahead – and sent two planes to evacuate diplomats from Kiev but too late.

    They got stuck at the airport about 18 miles east of Kiev and are parked at the far end of the airport. The second plane was travelling when Ukrainian airspace was closed by the Ukrainian government, and started to turn back but then decided it was better to proceed to the airport. The planes are still there.

    https://www.nytimes.com/2022/03/01/world/europe/ukraine-russia-turkey-putin-erdogan.html

    …Mr. Erdogan and Mr. Putin spoke on the telephone on Feb. 23, hours before the start of the invasion. Mr. Erdogan repeated his offer of mediation between Russia and Ukraine and reiterated his invitation to Mr. Putin to visit Istanbul for a meeting with Ukraine’s president, Volodymyr Zelensky.,,,

    ….But there is a sense of anger in Mr. Erdogan’s presidential circle that Mr. Putin lied to them about his intentions in Ukraine, Ms. Aydintasbas said.
    “Turkey was late in taking action and evacuating its people,” Ms. Aydintasbas wrote in a text message, adding, “They never believed the U.S. scenario of a full-scale invasion and dismissed U.S. warnings.”.

    “I suspect Erdogan trusted his relationship with Putin and thought it would be a minor incursion,” she added. “Turkey also failed to evacuate its citizens based on that belief. That’s proving to be a huge miscalculation.”

    The situation seemed to have inspired a shift in Turkey’s stance toward Russia on Sunday, when both the Turkish foreign minister and head of presidential communications described Moscow’s intervention against Ukraine for the first time as an act of war….

    Sammy Finkelman (46ec7d)

  98. Rip Murdock (d2a2a8) — 3/2/2022 @ 9:47 am

    How would indiscriminate use of artillery against civilian areas and firebombing be done covertly?

    Just like it is being done now, no announcements.

    Sammy Finkelman (46ec7d)

  99. Rip Murdock (d2a2a8) — 3/2/2022 @ 9:47 am
    How would indiscriminate use of artillery against civilian areas and firebombing be done covertly?
    Just like it is being done now, no announcements.

    That’s hardly the definition of “covert”: not openly shown, engaged in, or avowed

    The indiscriminate bombing and shelling is certainly “openly shown”, whether it is acknowledged or not.

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  100. How Putin has turned Ukraine’s cities to rubble: Before and after images show how indiscriminate Russian bombardments have obliterated populated areas

    The indiscriminate bombing and shelling seems pretty obvious without Russian acknowledgement.

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  101. It’s the KGB way.

    nk (1d9030)

  102. Attack On Europe: Documenting Equipment Losses During The 2022 Russian Invasion Of Ukraine

    A detailed list of the destroyed and captured vehicles and equipment of both sides can be seen below. This list is constantly updated as additional footage becomes available.

    This list only includes destroyed vehicles and equipment of which photo or videographic evidence is available. Therefore, the amount of equipment destroyed is significantly higher than recorded here. Small arms, munitions, civilian vehicles, trailers and derelict equipment are not included in this list. Many of the entries listed under ‘abandoned’ are currently located in no-man’s land that is neither under control of Russia nor Ukraine, and will later be captured by whoever takes control of that particular area. Anti-tank guided missiles (ATGMs) are included in the list but not included in the ultimate count. The Soviet flag is used when the equipment in question was produced prior to 1991.
    ………..

    Rip Murdock (d67a00)

  103. Mysterious comment at the end of President Biden’s “State of the Union” message. It’s not clear if he was referring to anything real, and if not, why he did it.

    God bless you all, and may God protect our troops. Thank you. Go get ’em.

    Now just where are any U.S. troops involved in combat?

    Of course, this could refer to some mission against a terrorist leader in Syria or Yemen.

    Sammy Finkelman (46ec7d)

  104. What Volodymyr Zelinksy is doing has some similarities to what Winston Churchill did and also, if it goes bad, might be to Charles de Gaulle, but he definitely doesn’t want to be like Alexander Kerensky.

    Sammy Finkelman (46ec7d)

  105. Today:

    https://www.newser.com/story/317600/just-5-countries-vote-against-un-resolution-on-ukraine.html

    Most of the world lined up against Moscow in the United Nations on Wednesday: The UN General Assembly voted to demand that Russia stop its offensive and immediately withdraw all troops from Ukraine, with world powers and tiny island states alike condemning Moscow. The vote was 141 to 5, with 35 abstentions. It came after the 193-member assembly convened its first emergency session since 1997 and just its 11th such session since 1950, reports the Guardian. The only countries to vote against the resolution were Russia, Belarus, Eritrea, North Korea, and Syria. The abstentions included China, Cuba, India, and Iran.

    TYhis is educational. I bet you weren’t too familiar with government of Eritrea – every male aged 18 or so is drafted into the army

    They don’t readily get asylum.

    And here’s a story:

    https://www.reuters.com/investigates/special-report/ethiopia-conflict-eritrea

    That month, rebellion broke out in Tigray, pitting the region’s rulers against Ethiopia’s central government. The Eritrean military sent in tanks and troops to aid its ally, Ethiopian leader Abiy Ahmed – and to settle old scores.

    Within days, truckloads of soldiers from the 35th Division of the Eritrean Army arrived at the two refugee camps, Hitsats and Shimelba. The soldiers had lists of names.

    In Hitsats, where undulating hills wrapped around the camp’s white tents and corrugated iron shacks, soldiers called refugee leaders to a meeting. The 20 or more who complied were detained, said more than a dozen witnesses, one demonstrating how the men’s elbows were pinioned behind their backs. They were held for two days at a church building in the camp, then loaded onto trucks by Eritrean soldiers and driven away, the witnesses said. Reuters has confirmed the names of 17 of the men. Their families haven’t heard from them since….

    Sammy Finkelman (02a146)

  106. This is for show:

    https://www.newser.com/story/317591/ukraine-tells-russian-moms-they-can-collect-captured-sons.html

    Ukraine’s defense ministry has told the mothers of captured Russian troops that they can have their sons back—if they come to Kyiv to collect them. In a message on the ministry’s Facebook page, authorities provided instructions on getting to the border and contacting Ukrainian officials to be taken to the capital, which is being shelled by Russian forces. The ministry urged readers to share the information with “thousands of unfortunate Russian mothers, whose sons were captured in Ukraine,” Business Insider reports. It added that Ukrainians, “in contrast to Putin’s fascists, do not make war with mothers and their captured sons.”

    Do tey think everybody is stupid? This can’t be serious.

    Not only is it dangerous to go there, it would be dangerous for soldiers to return to Russia – although maybe they might make it to Poland.

    Sammy Finkelman (02a146)

  107. There is an imaginary pilot who singlehandedly shot down many Russian planes

    https://www.nytimes.com/2022/03/03/technology/ukraine-war-misinfo.html

    The story was shared by the official Ukraine Twitter account on Sunday in a thrilling montage video set to thumping music, showing the fighter swooping through the Ukrainian skies as enemy planes exploded around him. The Security Service of Ukraine, the country’s main security agency, also relayed the tale on its official Telegram channel, which has over 700,000 subscribers.

    The story of a single pilot’s beating the superior Russian air force found wide appeal online, thanks to the official Ukraine accounts and many others. Videos of the so-called Ghost of Kyiv had more than 9.3 million views on Twitter, and the flier was mentioned in thousands of Facebook groups reaching up to 717 million followers. On YouTube, videos promoting the Ukrainian fighter collected 6.5 million views, while TikTok videos with the hashtag #ghostofkyiv reached 200 million views.

    …While there are reports of some Russian planes that were destroyed in combat, there is no information linking them to a single Ukrainian pilot. One of the first videos that went viral, which was included in the montage shared by the official Ukraine Twitter account, was a computer rendering from a combat flight simulator originally uploaded by a YouTube user with just 3,000 subscribers. And a photo supposedly confirming the fighter’s existence, shared by a former president of Ukraine, Petro Poroshenko, was from a 2019 Twitter post by the Ukrainian defense ministry.

    …When the fact-checking website Snopes published an article debunking the video, some social media users pushed back.

    “Why can’t we just let people believe some things?” one Twitter user replied. “If the Russians believe it, it brings fear. If the Ukrainians believe it, it gives them hope.”

    If the Russians believe it, it could give them the idea that all they need to do is find that pilot.

    Sammy Finkelman (02a146)

  108. I think the reason this is having amore profound impact on foreign public opinion than did Grozny or Aleppo is because foreign news media are paying more attention to this.

    That is not solely determined by the effort to keep things a secret – in 1981, the effect of martial law in Polnd was paid attention to.

    One foreign news media are determined to report a story, all efforts at suppressing the news tend to be futile, because if even a little bit gets out, and it almost invariably will, it will be enough to fill the news hole.

    Almost nothing can stop it from getting attention

    Sammy Finkelman (02a146)


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