Patterico's Pontifications

2/12/2021

Weekend Open Thread

Filed under: General — Dana @ 7:53 pm



[guest post by Dana]

Here are a few news items to chew over. Feel free to include anything you think might interest readers. Please remember to include links.

First news item

The character of the Republican Party:

In an expletive-laced phone call with House Republican leader Kevin McCarthy while the Capitol was under attack, then-President Donald Trump said the rioters cared more about the election results than McCarthy did.

“Well, Kevin, I guess these people are more upset about the election than you are,” Trump said, according to lawmakers who were briefed on the call afterward by McCarthy.

McCarthy insisted that the rioters were Trump’s supporters and begged Trump to call them off.

Trump’s comment set off what Republican lawmakers familiar with the call described as a shouting match between the two men. A furious McCarthy told the President the rioters were breaking into his office through the windows, and asked Trump, “Who the f–k do you think you are talking to?” according to a Republican lawmaker familiar with the call.

Rep. U.S. Representative Jaime Herrera Beutler confirms the call between McCarthy and Trump:

But of course Trump didn’t want to stop the melee. Why would he? He got the ball rolling, egged on his loyal MAGA supporters, and incited the resulting and deadly chaos at the U.S. Capitol on Jan. 6. No way was he going to put a stop to it.

And yet, just a few weeks after the attempted insurrection at the Capitol:

Untitled
I caption this photo: Proverbs 26:11 (As a dog returns to his vomit, so a fool repeats his folly)

Second news item

Foul birds of a feather flock together:

President Trump’s impeachment defense lawyers said on Friday that Trump was unaware Vice President Mike Pence had been evacuated from the Capitol on Jan. 6 when he sent a tweet attacking Pence. In response to a question submitted by Sens. Mitt Romney (R-UT) and Susan Collins (R-ME), Trump’s lawyer said “at no point” was he aware “that the vice president was in any danger.”

But, Sen. Tommy Tuberville (R-AL) said on Wednesday that he phoned Trump, at around 2:15 p.m., and informed him, in real-time, that the VP was being whisked away by Secret Service. “They just took the vice president out, I’ve got to go,” Tuberville says he told Trump. Footage of violent Trump supporters storming the Capitol, where Pence was presiding over a joint session of Congress, was also being widely aired by that time. Nevertheless, at 2:24 p.m., Trump tweeted that Pence didn’t have “the courage” to overturn a legitimate election result.

Trump knew what he was doing:

Third news item

The NY Post broke this story, but it’s odd that the New York Times, that enormously far-reaching “newspaper of record” sitting right in Cuomo’s backyard, didn’t know this before the Post did. Or did they know it and chose to sit on it because Cuomo:

Gov. Andrew Cuomo’s top aide confessed privately this week that the administration suppressed the true COVID toll in the homes. She also offered an apology — not to the thousands of New York families who needlessly lost loved ones thanks to her boss’s mismanagement but to Democratic lawmakers put in a difficult “political position with the Republicans” by the coverup.

Melissa DeRosa, secretary to the governor, made the stunning statement on a video call with Democratic state lawmakers as she “explained” why the administration ignored since August their demands for nursing-home death data. It began when then-President Donald Trump “directs the Department of Justice to do an investigation into us,” she said. “And basically we froze.”

“Because then we were in a position where we weren’t sure if what we were going to give to the Department of Justice, or what we give to you guys, what we start saying, was going to be used against us while we weren’t sure if there was going to be an investigation,” she said.

In an awful bit of irony, Cuomo was crusading for transparency in government per his memoir American Crisis, which was published October 2020:

“As of this writing, we do not know what the CDC and NIH knew about COVID and when they knew it,” Cuomo points out. “We do not know the source of information to the White House in January 2020 that led Peter Navarro, a senior aide to the president, to write a memo suggesting apocalyptic consequences from COVID-19. We must demand answers to these basic questions to understand why such an early warning by a senior administration official was ignored at the highest level of the federal government.”

Fourth news item

Waste not, want not. Even more so during a pandemic:

A Houston doctor was fired and charged with stealing ten doses of the ModernaCovid vaccine after rushing to administer the doses before they were about to expire. Dr Hasan Gokal was let go from the Harris County Public Health department and charged with the theft at a total value of $135, a charge that was later dismissed as groundless by a judge.

In late December, Dr. Gokal had to find 10 eligible people to vaccinate as a vial of the Moderna vaccine had been opened and had to be used within 6 hours before it expired. He told people to come to his house outside Houston, Texas. He also drove around and vaccinated acquaintances and complete strangers.

One of the receivers was a bed-bound person past 90 years old. Another was a woman with dementia in her 80s. A third was a mother in her 40s whose child is on a ventilator. After midnight, minutes before the vaccine was about to become unusable, Dr Gokal gave the last dose to his wife, who has a lung disease.

Dr. Gokal said that the guidance from state health officials was to vaccinate people in the eligible categories but after that, the advice was: “Just put it in people’s arms. We don’t want any doses to go to waste. Period.”

A Harris County public health official gave him the okay to find 10 people for the remaining doses to avoid having them go to waste in the evening of 29 December. About the people he initially reached out to, Dr Gokal said they were, “No one I was really intimately familiar with. I wasn’t that close to anyone”.

Apparently, the problem was that too many brown people received the soon-to-be-expired vaccine. Wait, isn’t that a good thing:

After filing the paperwork for the inoculations, he was asked a few days later by a supervisor and the human resources director if he had given the vaccines outside of the scheduled event on 29 December where the vial had been opened and the clock had started ticking.

He said he had and was immediately fired. He was told he had violated protocol and should have returned the doses to the office or thrown them away.

The “equity” of the people Dr. Gokal had vaccinated was questioned by one of the officials. Dr Gokal said he asked: “Are you suggesting that there were too many Indian names in that group?”

Exactly, was the response he said he got.

It should be noted that the CDC has said that the vaccine should not be wasted:

The CDC says vaccine providers should avoid wastage and disclose when it happens.

“If there is excess vaccine, clinic staff should do everything possible to avoid wasting the dose…,” said CDC spokeswoman Kristen Nordlund…

In the meantime, federal officials have begun to urge that priority guidelines not get in the way of using vaccines. “It’s more important to get people vaccinated than to perfectly march through each prioritized group,” Alex Azar, secretary of health and human services under President Donald Trump, said at a briefing on Jan. 6.

This means that a pharmacist should use a dose that’s about to expire on any available person — even someone who isn’t in a priority group — rather than letting it go in the trash. “There’s always someone in line. The whole nation is in line,” said Lori Freeman, chief executive officer of the National Association of County and City Health Officials. “There’s no reason for any vaccine to go to waste.”

Fifth news item

President Biden’s promise on Jan. 20, 2021 :

“But I am not joking when I say this, if you are ever working with me and I hear you treat another colleague with disrespect… talk down to someone, I promise you I will fire you on the spot,” the 46th president of the United States said on Wednesday. “On the spot. No ifs, ands or buts. Everybody… everybody is entitled to be treated with decency and dignity. That’s been missing in a big way the last four years.”

What happened:

[White House Press Secretary Jen] Psaki’s deputy TJ Ducklo threatened Politico reporter Tara Palmeri when she looked into his relationship with Axios reporter Alexi McCammond. Ducklo, Ecarma writes, “tried to intimidate Palmeri by phone in an effort to kill the story,” threatening her by saying ” “I will destroy you,” and accused her of being jealous that 1) “an unidentified man in the past had ‘wanted to fuck’ McCammond ‘and not you”; and also said Palmeri was “’jealous’ of his relationship with McCammond.”

Was the employee, TJ Ducklo, fired for his obvious disrespect, and failure to treat a colleague with decency and dignity, as well as threatening her? Not exactly:

Jen Psaki said Friday that one of her deputies, TJ Ducklo, had been suspended for one week without pay after a Vanity Fair story revealed Ducklo had threatened a reporter who was working on a story about his romantic relationship with another reporter.

“This in our view was an important step to send the message that we don’t find this acceptable,” Psaki told reporters at the White House press briefing

Politico Editor in Chief and Editor released a statement in response to the kerfuffle:

We raised our concerns about the incident directly with the White House at the time. No journalist at POLITICO – or any other publication or network – should ever be subjected to such unfounded personal attacks while doing their job…

Say what you mean, and mean what you say, President Biden. If you’ve changed your policy in less than a month’s time, I would like to know what your new policy is. Because if Ducklo didn’t meet your stated criteria for termination, then I don’t know what would.

P.S. Oh. Ducklo has stage IV lung cancer. I am reading that perhaps this is why Biden decided not to fire him.

Sixth news item

Welcome to the Thunderdome:

Last April, Alain Finkielkraut—one of France’s leading public intellectuals and a member of the prestigious Academie Française—was invited by a student group to give a lecture on “modernity, heritage and progress” at the elite Paris university Sciences Po. Mr. Finkielkraut, who has forcefully defended Western traditions and criticized cultural relativism, drew the wrath of far-left activists who denounced him as “profoundly reactionary,” a “racist and misogynist” whose ideas “put our own existence in danger.”

In response, his lecture was first canceled and then surreptitiously rescheduled, to mislead the protesters who wanted to disrupt it. “When P.C. culture arose in the U.S., I thought it would always remain specifically American. Now I have to observe that France is also contaminated by it. Many students have adopted the posture of cancel culture, preventing people they don’t agree with from speaking,” Mr. Finkielkraut told me last month.

Now…go have some fun:

–Dana

UPDATE BY PATTERICO: The Dr. Gokal story will be a major focus of my newsletter tomorrow; I thank Dana for bringing up this important topic. Also, I think part of the weekend discussion has to revolve around the disgraceful decision of the Democrats not to call Jaime Herrera Beutler as a witness in the trial, choosing instead to read her statement into the record. They have made former president Trump a very happy man with that decision. Shouldn’t that tell them something?

346 Responses to “Weekend Open Thread”

  1. I’m putting this up tonight so I can sleep in tomorrow morning!

    Dana (fd537d)

  2. Look at all the rats fleeing the Grifter Project. And the excuses they are making are Lifetime movie quality. Tom Nichols was the most recent to head for the hills.

    NJRob (eb56c3)

  3. Does anyone here really believe that the president is not notified when the Secret Service declares an emergency with the VP?

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  4. Cats, otoh, have no wish to go out in the snow. Or touch it for that matter.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  5. I’m pretty sure that it IS the procedure to toss out doses that cannot be given to those with priority numbers. And the reasons are not all stupid.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  6. The lincoln project founders have been discredited. The opposition to trump in the republican party is falling apart. Economic libertarian free trade conservatism has the wealthy and their running dogs in the think tanks and media and little else. Most working class republicans are populists. Remember mark levin was for free trade ted cruz and panned trump’s populism until the 2016 indiana primary. The opposition to trump is a collection of desperate dilettantes from pedophiles to wealthy libertarians and those who prey on their wealth who had turned the republican party into a hollow shell yelling god, guns and gays to get the social conservatives to vote against their best interests. This is laid out in the book what is the matter with kansas.

    asset (384c2b)

  7. NJRob, it was a group run by republicans. Not unexpected for them to be grifters and perverts.

    Time123 (9f42ee)

  8. I am curious if any reporting has put a time stamp on the McCarthy phone call. If people were breaking into his office it would seem to be some time after the Tuberville call. But it’d be nice to know more clearly.

    So of course it would be nice if there were actual witnesses at the trial, but my sense is Senators, on both sides, are scared of such a thing.

    I thought one of the last questions last night was interesting, why isn’t it enough that Trump could be prosecuted for a January crime? Setting aside the argument that not all impeachable behavior is criminal (which is something people go around and around about), there’s the other point that if Congress really thinks there should be political consequences, it should do it on its own steam, and not rely on a Department of Justice to initiate prosecutions, which for a variety of reasons it may not want to. It’s one more example of Congress abdicating its own responsibility.

    Victor (4959fb)

  9. Nothing better than dogs

    AJ_Liberty (a4ff25)

  10. Labs like cold, rain, and snow. They’re the elements they were bred for. They suffer in the summer.

    nk (1d9030)

  11. On the Ducklo matter, I really hate how a society it’s a become a badge of honor to take scalps and kick people while they are down. We should judge people and judge them harshly by their body of work not their worst day. The fact that Ducklo is probably going under chemotherapy on hormones, etc. Who amongst us having lost it in some situation? Apologies are more important than mistakes.

    tla (34ebeb)

  12. tla,

    I get where you’re coming from. I felt the same thing after reading that he has stage IV cancer. Clearly, he needs medical insurance and is under a unique amount of stress. This is why I think that Biden (or any president) shouldn’t make these blanket proclamations right out the gate. Inevitably, it will be tested and come back to bite them. My questions would be: Was Biden involved in any way in the decision making, or was it left to Psaki and “senior White House staff” to do the dirty work (which simply ended up being a weeklong suspension)? If so, how does she justify not fulfilling Biden’s mandate because it puts her clearly at odds with him? Further, I think Biden needs to come out and clear the air. Finally, it wasn’t just an off day for Ducklo. He intimidated and threatened a reporter for doing her job.

    Dana (fd537d)

  13. Dana Bash tweeting just now:

    Collins, Murkowski and Romney have all voted yes for witnesses. Looks like its going to happen.

    Good.

    Dana (fd537d)

  14. @12 I agree with the blanket proclamation. Every circumstance is unique. I don’t understand why politicians want to remove their abilities to make individual judgements.

    tla (34ebeb)

  15. Postmaster general’s new plan for USPS is said to include slower mail and higher prices
    ………
    (Postmaster General Louis) DeJoy, with the backing of the agency’s bipartisan but Trump-appointed governing board, has discussed plans to eliminate a tier of first-class mail — letters, bills and other envelope-sized correspondence sent to a local address — designated for delivery in two days. Instead, all first-class mail would be lumped into the same three- to five-day window, the current benchmark for nonlocal mail.

    That class of mail is already struggling; only 38 percent was delivered on time at the end of 2020, the Postal Service reported in federal court. Customers have reported bills being held up, and holiday cards and packages still in transit. Pharmacies and prescription benefits managers have told patients to request medication refills early to leave additional time for mail delays. The agency has not disclosed on-time scores yet in 2021.
    ……..
    The plan also prevents first-class mail from being shipped by airplane, said the two people, who spoke on the condition of anonymity to discuss confidential conversations, forcing all of it into trucks and a relay of distribution depots.

    The operational shifts would coincide with a push for significantly higher postage rates — which DeJoy has said was “imminent” — after the agency lost $9.2 billion in 2020 due to steep, pandemic-related declines in mail volume. It also has $188.4 billion in liabilities, the bulk of which is tied to pension and retiree health care obligations. Leaders have long sought to raise new revenue and, in 2021, are expected to pursue the first big postage rate increase in more than a decade, which could add up to a 9 percent jump compounded annually.
    ………
    Mail industry experts say the postal economy runs on a system of elasticity, where the Postal Service relies on large injections of first-class mail volume from large clients to support its hulking national infrastructure and keep prices low for residential customers who increasingly have less use for the mail service.

    The delivery slowdowns coupled with price increases, mailing industry officials say, could threaten that system by driving commercial mailers to cut costs and pull more volume out of the mail stream. In the long run, that could force the Postal Service to increase postage rates on the customers left in the system — including small businesses, seniors and people with disabilities — or to further cut service.

    A former Postal Service executive, who spoke on the condition of anonymity because they still work in the mailing industry, said it was unclear how much the agency could recoup by eliminating air transport for first-class mail, because the savings would depend on how much additional volume its trucking operation could handle without additional cost.
    Millions of Christmas presents may arrive late because of Postal Service delays.

    But even a 50 percent savings may not be enough in the long term to offset lost revenue from continuing volume declines made worse by the service cuts, the person said. The agency will continue to contract with air traffic vendors to transport packages and priority mail.

    “The savings they’re going to get out of this isn’t a lot compared to what they’re going to do to customers,” the person said, “and that’s assuming they implement everything right, which they never do.”
    ……..
    No (De)Joy at all.

    Rip Murdock (cc5a6a)

  16. Ducklo should be fired immediately and his benefits terminated. There is no excuse for threatening someone’s livelihood, no matter how ill you are. He would be terminated in the private sector.

    Rip Murdock (cc5a6a)

  17. ->; they killed a cop.

    I thought CNN debunked that fake news.

    According to one law enforcement official, medical examiners did not find signs that the officer sustained any blunt force trauma, so investigators believe that early reports that he was fatally struck by a fire extinguisher are not true.
    https://www.cnn.com/2021/02/02/politics/brian-sicknick-charges/index.html

    BillPasadena (5b0401)

  18. NJRob, it was a group run by republicans. Not unexpected for them to be grifters and perverts.

    The irony, Time, is that the only Republican principal in the Lincoln Project was Weaver. The rest were either independents or they switched to the other side when they started their operation.
    It’s accurate to say they’re a Democrat fundraising operation, and Biden wasn’t the only Democrat they endorsed.

    Eh, McConnell announced that he’ll acquit, but it sounds like they may call some witnesses.

    Paul Montagu (77c694)

  19. NJRob, it was a group run by republicans. Not unexpected for them to be grifters and perverts.

    Time123 (9f42ee) — 2/13/2021 @ 2:33 am

    No it wasn’t. It was a group of mobys who pretended to be Republican, then supported every leftist running for office when they realized that’s where their money spigot opened.

    NJRob (eb56c3)

  20. Rip Murdock,

    I think the optics of firing an individual and leaving him with no health insurance would be seen as a black eye for the Biden administration rather than drawing a clear line in the sand and following through on a promise. Especially during a pandemic. People are naturally sympathetic toward anyone with cancer, and they would absolutely be squishy about that sort of thing. Nonetheless, at the very least, Biden needs to explain the decision for a mere weeklong suspension, and either rescind his proclamation, or tell us what the policy is now, and why he made the change. Full transparency is in his best interest, I think.

    Dana (fd537d)

  21. https://nypost.com/2021/02/11/cuomo-aide-admits-they-hid-nursing-home-data-from-feds/

    And the biggest ongoing political story is how much will the left and media continue to protect Cuomo as his actions deliberately led to the death of thousands and he lied and covered it up till a whistleblower revealed the truth.

    NJRob (eb56c3)

  22. >; they killed a cop.

    I thought CNN debunked that fake news.

    According to one law enforcement official, medical examiners did not find signs that the officer sustained any blunt force trauma, so investigators believe that early reports that he was fatally struck by a fire extinguisher are not true.
    https://www.cnn.com/2021/02/02/politics/brian-sicknick-charges/index.html

    BillPasadena (5b0401) — 2/13/2021 @ 7:54 am

    So to claim it’s debunked that a cop was killed, you post a link that he wasn’t killed by a fire extinguisher. But he’s dead, and he wouldn’t be if the violent mob of Trump fanatics hadn’t sacked the capitol, trying to stop the electoral count because they lost, hurting hundreds of cops, 140 of them seriously.

    So you’re a liar. The cop was killed by Trump’s riots. Several people were.

    This ‘achtually, here’s the real truth’ infowars gooblegook has gobbled your mind.

    Dustin (4237e0)

  23. No it wasn’t. It was a group of mobys who pretended to be Republican, then supported every leftist running for office when they realized that’s where their money spigot opened.

    NJRob (eb56c3) — 2/13/2021 @ 8:00 am

    Pretty much this is true. They did a great job posing as the real conservatives, had some excellent ads bashing Trump, but their strategy was to promote the more lefty outcome, far beyond the scope of defeating Trump.

    Before 1/6 I really had a problem with them. After it’s hard to care, because right now the GOP Senate is such a terrible disgrace. In fact, maybe I was wrong, and a hope the GOP keep some power was naive, the party is too diseased.

    It is also amusing that all these scandals that hurt Team D could have come out before the election, but were saved. This kind of stuff fuels the idiotic infowards deep state paranoia. There is no integrity in journalism, and that’s one reason Trump was possible.

    Dustin (4237e0)

  24. And this officer would likely not have committed suicide had it not been for actions of the mob:

    A Washington, DC, cop who committed suicide after the US Capitol breach was struck in the head with a metal pole during the deadly siege — and was never quite the same, his wife said in a report Friday.

    Capitol Police Officer Jeffrey Smith, 35, suffered the blow while defending the building on Jan. 6 at 5:35 p.m. when a rioter tossed the object, hitting his face and helmet, according to the Washington Post.

    After enduring the injury, Smith was placed on sick leave and suffered constant pain before killing himself roughly a week after the building was breached, his wife Erin Smith, told the paper.

    “He wasn’t the same Jeff that left on the sixth [of January]… I just tried to comfort him and let him know that I loved him,” she said. “I told him I’d be there if he needed anything, that no matter what we’ll get through it. I tried to do the best I could.”

    Smith, who was ordered back to work on Jan. 14, shot himself in the head the next day, inside his Ford Mustang near a scenic overlook of the Potomac River, the paper reported.

    Heartbreaking.

    Dana (fd537d)

  25. No it wasn’t. It was a group of mobys who pretended to be Republican.

    Lies. I said above there’s only one Republican, there are two.
    George Conway became an Independent in 2018.
    Schmidt became an Independent in 2018 and switched to Democrat last December.
    Rick Wilson left the GOP in 2016.
    Jennifer Horn left in 2020.
    Ron Steslow, SAM Party since 2018
    Reed Galen has been an independent since at least 2018
    Mike Madrid, still a Republican along with Weaver.
    Tom Nichols is one of their more prominent contributors, and he left the GOP in 2018.

    Paul Montagu (371355)

  26. Dana @21-
    There’s always COBRA. He would also be eligible for Obamacare. Sorry, threatening someone’s livelihood by a government employee should be a firing offense.

    Rip Murdock (cc5a6a)

  27. The alt-right will engage in violence whether Trump is acquitted or convicted. The Proud Boys, Oathkeepers, Three Percenters, etc. will feel emboldened by an acquittal or they will continue their assault on the government in retaliation for Trump’s conviction.

    It’s a win-win for the alt-right.

    Rip Murdock (cc5a6a)

  28. So you’re a liar. The cop was killed by Trump’s riots. Several people were.

    What was the cause of death?

    BillPasadena (5b0401)

  29. Anne Applebaum

    McConnell decided impeachment would be held after Trump left office – and has now decided there can’t be an impeachment because Trump left office. Coward’s logic.

    Tim Miller

    How many capitol police officers needed to die because of Trumps lie for Mitch’s conscience to tell him to convict? 3? 5?

    What if all 100+ who were injured died? Could we have convicted trump then? Or would it still have been a close call?
    @LeaderMcConnell

    Paul Montagu (77c694)

  30. What was the cause of death?

    We don’t know, because they’re withholding the autopsy, but that doesn’t absolve Trump of his responsibility for Sicknick’s death and it doesn’t absolve the rioters who fought Sicknick.
    If Trump didn’t call for his devotees to show up on that day and time, and if he didn’t incite them with his Big Lie over a two-month period, if he and his co-speakers (who spoke incendiary words with his tacit approval) who shared the stage with him didn’t agitate the crowd with his lies, then those seven dead Americans would be alive today.

    Paul Montagu (77c694)

  31. Rep. Marjorie Taylor Greene threatens Rep. Herrera Beutler: ‘The Trump loyal 75 million are watching’
    Rep. Marjorie Taylor Greene (R-Ga.) threatened Rep. Jaime Herrera Beutler (R-Wash.) Saturday after the Senate voted 55-45 to call witnesses, telling her that loyal Trump voters “are watching.” Herrera Beutler may be subpoenaed as a witness soon in Trump’s second impeachment trial.
    …….
    “First voting to impeach innocent President Trump, then yapping to the press and throwing @GOPLeader under the bus, and now a tool as a witness for the Democrats running the circus trial,” Greene tweeted. “The Trump loyal 75 million are watching.”
    ……..
    GOP Rep. Adam Kinzinger (Ill.), who also voted for Trump’s impeachment, fired back at Greene in defense of Herrera Beutler.
    “She has about 40 times the honor of you,” Kinzinger tweeted. “Maybe you’re more famous though, which is all you want. Also ‘yapping to the press’ is telling truth, something you should try to your loyal Q base.”

    Rip Murdock (cc5a6a)

  32. Memo to President Plagiarist ‘resting’ at Camp David this weekend while a Chinaman eats our lunch–

    Meanwhile, the REAL world yesterday:

    Delivery Shortfall of COVID-19 Vaccines to Impact Availability in San Diego County -source,NBC7anDiego.com

    Where’s our vaccine; where’s our $2000- or is it $1400– emergency Covid relief checks, Scranton Boy– or is it Wilmington this week? In a sack behind the high school gym with your boxing gloves, you useless, lying ‘shut-it-down-vial-of-Delaware-Dupont-chemical-pollutant?

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  33. Sen. Mike Lee turns over phone record to House impeachment managers, Trump defense
    Sen. Mike Lee (R-Utah) on Saturday gave House impeachment managers and former president Donald Trump’s defense attorneys a copy of a log from his cellphone, which shows that as the Jan. 6 riot unfolded, he received a call from the White House at 2:26 p.m. that lasted for four minutes, a spokesman for the senator said.

    The document sheds new light on a key moment when Lee has said that Trump called his cellphone — apparently believing that he was calling Sen. Tommy Tuberville (R-Ala.). ……..

    According to Lee’s office, the log shows that Lee received the call from 202-395-0000, a main White House switchboard number, just 13 minutes after Vice President Mike Pence was hustled from the Senate floor at 2:13 p.m. and Senate action was halted, as insurrectionists stormed through the Capitol building. Lee has said that when he realized Trump’s confusion, he handed his phone to Tuberville.

    Tuberville has said that during the brief call, he personally informed Trump that Pence had just been evacuated from the Senate floor. “I said: ‘Mr. President, they’ve taken the vice president out. They want me to get off the phone, I gotta go,’ ” Tuberville said Friday.

    That account — and the new phone record — strongly undercuts a claim from Trump’s lawyers on the Senate floor on Friday that “at no time” had Trump been informed that Pence was in danger during the hours-long riot, as well as their complaints that accounts of the phone call presented at trial were mere “hearsay.” It also demonstrates that as rioters forced a halt in the counting of the electoral college votes, Trump was focused on finding additional ways to delay the process; Tuberville was at the time taking a lead in objecting to votes confirming Biden’s election win.
    ……..

    Rip Murdock (cc5a6a)

  34. 32.Rep. Marjorie Taylor Greene threatens Rep. Herrera Beutler: ‘The Trump loyal 75 million are watching’

    Pfft. Golly. Viewers ‘threaten’ METV: “The ‘I Dream of Jeannie’ Barbara Eden loyal millions are watching.”

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  35. Classic, that Raskin and the Democrats caved on witnesses, shirking their own responsibilities to conduct a real trial with real witnesses. Jonah

    Yup. If the violence was shockingly unintended and undesired, Trump would have reacted very differently. If you intentionally start a fire, you watch it burn. If you accidentally start one, you try to put it out immediately.

    Paul Montagu (77c694)

  36. Democrats abandon plan to call witnesses in Trump trial, clearing the way for closing arguments
    ……..
    In a surprising turn, Rep. Jamie Raskin (D-Md.) asked that a statement from Rep. Rep. Jaime Herrera Beutler (R-Wash.) be admitted into the record rather than she be subpoenaed for testimony.
    ……..

    Rip Murdock (cc5a6a)

  37. ‘According to Lee’s office, the log shows that Lee received the call from 202-395-0000, a main White House switchboard number…’

    Is it?

    “…the phone number in question, (202) 395-0000, is a generic phone number that is also linked to the White House political affairs office, and the U.S. Trade Representative’s offices, according to The WSJ, which obtained the phone number from sources familiar with the impeachment report.”- source, WSJ

    ‘About this number. (202) 395 is a landline based telephone number operated by Verizon Washington, Dc Inc. and is located in zip code 20005 in the city of Washington, Washington DC, which is in District Of Columbia County, and is in the South. It has a Number Planning Area (NPA – also known as an Area Code) of 202 and Network Numbering Exchange (NXX – also known as a prefix) of 395.’

    White House | USAGov

    http://www.usa.gov/federal-agencies/white-house

    White House . Contact: Contact the White House . Main Address: 1600 Pennsylvania Ave., NW Washington, DC 20500. Phone Number: 1-202-456-1414 (Switchboard) 1-202-456-1111 (Comments) TTY: 1-202-456-6213. 1-202-456-2121 (Visitor’s Office) Government branch: None. Popular Services from White House. Petitions . Related Agency

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  38. @38-
    Did you try dialing it?

    Rip Murdock (cc5a6a)

  39. “The Trump loyal 75 million are watching.”

    And therein lies the biggest problem of all: the 75 million (like Trump himself) are loyal to a corrupt individual, not the Constitution.

    Dana (fd537d)

  40. I thought CNN debunked that fake news.

    So, maybe it was a bowling ball. Does it matter? Even if he fell down and hit his head rushing to the melee, it is still homicide.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  41. Raskin and the Democrats caved on witnesses

    No one wanted this to go on for weeks. If they had, Trump’s protective detail would ahve made good witnesses.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  42. Where’s our vaccine; where’s our $2000- or is it $1400– emergency Covid relief checks, Scranton Boy– or is it Wilmington this week? In a sack behind the high school gym with your boxing gloves, you useless, lying ‘shut-it-down-vial-of-Delaware-Dupont-chemical-pollutant?

    DCSCA (f4c5e5) — 2/13/2021 @ 10:00 am

    Trump voter’s mad?

    Now that’s glorious!

    I hear Melania is mad too.

    Roll up them sleeves if you need $1400, and if you need a vaccine, Texas has given millions of them already. Trump totally failed at his roll-out but now my county has much more notice and reliability and can schedule things properly.

    Dustin (4237e0)

  43. As for the Congressfolk who voted for denying the certification AFTER being attacked by the nation’s domestic enemies, I suggest they “adher[ed] to their Enemies, giving them Aid and Comfort.”

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  44. @42. No one in the Senate does.

    But Ol’Nancy would love it to go on for months and over play her hand. It’s political propaganda on the taxpayer dime an doesn’t cost her party a penny.

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  45. And therein lies the biggest problem of all: the 75 million (like Trump himself) are loyal to a corrupt individual, not the Constitution

    Nor to the principles of honesty or decency. Millions of Americans (though not the whole 75 million) have put a sociopath at the heart of their moral code.

    Radegunda (20775b)

  46. Biden, which the media has told me was a great football player in his day, sure knows how to spike the political football.

    Rumor is Biden’s pledge to “open the schools” means opening them one day/week.

    Hoi Polloi (139bf6)

  47. There is no integrity in journalism, and that’s one reason Trump was possible.

    It certainly gives Trumpers a pretext to argue that every unflattering thing reported about Trump is a lie. But it doesn’t explain the fanatical devotion that was brewing in the 2015-16 primary season when he was getting preferential MSM attention over all other GOP candidates (whom the Trumpers loved to trash), nor why Trumpers demand that we disregard what our own ears and eyes tell us directly. The weirdest thing is that people who decry “dishonesty” in the media revere someone of such conspicuous mendacity.

    Radegunda (20775b)

  48. I would like to hear from lawyers, and particularly those involved in criminal law: Given the evidence presented to the Senate, could Trump be convicted in federal court on incitement? What about insurrection, sedition or treason?

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  49. nor why Trumpers demand that we disregard what our own ears and eyes tell us directly. The weirdest thing is that people who decry “dishonesty” in the media revere someone of such conspicuous mendacity.

    Radegunda (20775b) — 2/13/2021 @ 11:18 am

    It’s a pretext, a clever deception, to use ‘fake news’ to defend the things Trump does right before us. He clearly wanted the riots to get Mike Pence as well as prevent the electoral count, and he clearly wanted Georgia to reverse the election outcome.

    But in this mess of screaming pundits, die hard democrat journalists, facebook lies, bots from Russia, it is merely possible, not necessary to work through this information and realize, oh that liberal media AND oh that corrupt republican, at the same time.

    Dustin (4237e0)

  50. The sub-story that is buried in the story about Mr. Ducklo’s dustup with Ms. Palmeri is that obviously the Democrats are back in the White House. How do we know? Because once again we have situations where a White House operative (Ducklo) is romantically involved with a media member assigned to cover his boss (Alexi McCammond of Axios). Apparently upon learning of this relationship, Axios showed how ethically soundly their editorial team operates by immediately switching Ms. McCammond from covering Joe Biden’s Presidential campaign to covering Kamala Harris’s Vice-Presidential campaign. Because, yeah, that makes a huge difference in terms of letting the public know that reporters give us nothing but the unvarnished truth, without spinning it or positioning it in a favorable light because they are sleeping with (or are blood relatives of) various Administration staff.

    So get used to this, folks: Just as in 2009-17, we’re back to the DC media being quite literally in bed with the Democrat Administration.

    JVW (ee64e4)

  51. Imprisoned ex-FBI agent who worked with Bulger seeks release
    The former FBI agent serving a 40-year prison sentence for alerting Boston mobster Whitey Bulger that he could be implicated in a murder is seeking to be released from prison on medical grounds.

    The Florida Commission on Offender Review will hear the request Wednesday from John “Zip” Connolly (80), and who is being held at the Reception and Medical Center in Lake Butler, Florida.
    ……..
    “He has multiple melanomas and pretty bad diabetes. Two serious illnesses,” (Connolly’s Cambridge lawyer, Peter) Mullane said.

    Connolly, who was James “Whitey” Bulger’s FBI handler, was convicted in 2008 of second-degree murder after a mob hitman killed World Jai Alai President John Callahan in Fort Lauderdale in 1982. Trial evidence showed Connolly tipped Bulger that Callahan was about to implicate the gang in another killing.

    Separately, Connolly served nearly 10 years in prison after being convicted in 2002 of racketeering and obstruction of justice for protecting members of Bulger’s Winter Hill Gang from prosecution and tipping them about informants in their ranks.
    ……….
    No.

    Rip Murdock (cc5a6a)

  52. BREAKING- Trump acquitted. 57-43 in favor of conviction. Ten votes short.

    As expected, a complete waste of time.

    Jeff Lebowski (e6e054)

  53. The Boogaloo Bois have guns, criminal records, and military training. Now they want to overthrow the government
    ………
    Researchers say the movement began coalescing online in 2019 as people — mostly young men — angry with what they perceived to be increasing government repression, found each other on Facebook groups and in private chats. In movement vernacular, Boogaloo refers to an inevitable and imminent armed revolt, and members often call themselves Boogaloo Bois, boogs or goons.

    In the weeks since Jan. 6, an array of extremist groups have been named as participants in the Capitol invasion. The Proud Boys. QAnon believers. White nationalists. The Oath Keepers. But the Boogaloo Bois are notable for the depth of their commitment to the overthrow of the U.S. government and the jaw-dropping criminal histories of many members.
    ……..
    In its short existence, the Boogaloo movement has proven to be a magnet for current or former military service members who have used their combat skills and firearms expertise to advance the Boogaloo cause. Before becoming one of the faces of the movement, Dunn did a brief stint in the U.S. Marines, a career he says was cut short by a heart condition, and worked as a Virginia state prison guard.

    Through interviews, extensive study of social media and a review of court records, some previously unreported, ProPublica and FRONTLINE identified more than 20 Boogaloo Bois or sympathizers who’ve served in the armed forces. Over the past 18 months, 13 of them have been arrested on charges ranging from the possession of illegal automatic weapons to the manufacture of explosives to murder.

    Most of the individuals identified by the news organizations became involved with the movement after leaving the military. At least four are accused of committing Boogaloo-related crimes while employed by one of the military branches.

    Examples of the nexus between the group and the military abound.
    ……..
    …….. [M]ilitary officials at the Pentagon told ProPublica and FRONTLINE that they have been concerned by a surge in extremist activity. “We are seeing an increase in concerning behavior,” said one official, stressing that military leaders are “very actively” responding to tips and are thoroughly investigating service members linked to anti-government groups.

    Experts worry about people with military training joining extremist groups.

    Boogaloo Bois with military experience are likely to share their expertise with members who’ve never served in the armed forces, building a more effective, more lethal movement. “These are folks who can bring discipline to a movement. These are folks that can bring skills to a movement,” said Jason Blazakis, director of the Center on Terrorism, Extremism, and Counterterrorism at Middlebury Institute of International Studies at Monterey.

    Though some Boogaloo groups have made spectacular blunders — among them, sharing information with undercover FBI agents and using unencrypted messaging services to communicate — the movement’s familiarity with weapons and basic infantry techniques clearly poses serious challenges for law enforcement.
    ……..
    The marriage of extremist ideology and military skill was apparent in an alleged plot last year to attack police officers at a racial justice protest.
    …….
    According to the prosecutor, the men intended to join a protest over the death of George Floyd and hurl firebombs at police, and they had made plans to bomb an electric power substation and a federal building, actions they hoped would spark a wider anti-government uprising.

    “They wanted to damage or destroy some sort of government building or infrastructure to get the response of law enforcement and, hopefully, the overreaction of the federal government,” (federal prosecutor Nicholas) Dickinson told the court.
    …….
    The military is clearly worried about Boogaloo Bois training up civilians. Last year, the Naval Criminal Investigative Service, the law enforcement agency that investigates felony-level crimes involving sailors and members of the Marine Corps, circulated an intelligence bulletin.

    Called a threat awareness message, the bulletin detailed the arrests of Lynam and the other men in Las Vegas and noted that Boogaloo followers have engaged in discussions about “recruiting military or former military members for their perceived knowledge of combat training.”

    NCIS concluded the bulletin with a warning: The agency couldn’t ignore the possibility that individuals involved with the Boogaloo movement were serving throughout the military. “NCIS continues to emphasize the importance of reporting suspected boogaloo activity through the chain of command.”
    ……..
    On an hourlong podcast posted in May 2020, two Boogaloo Bois discussed, in detail, how to do battle with the government.

    One of the men, who dispenses combat advice online using the handle Guerrilla Instructor, said he had enlisted in the Army but had eventually grown disenchanted and left the service. The other man, who called himself Jake, said he was currently serving as a military police officer in the Army National Guard.

    Traditional infantry tactics wouldn’t be particularly useful during the coming civil war, opined Guerrilla Instructor, arguing that sabotage and assassination would be more helpful for the anti-government insurgents. It was simple, he said: A Boogaloo Boi could just walk up to a government figure or law enforcement officer on the street and “shoot them in the face” before fleeing.
    ……..
    About three weeks after the podcast was uploaded to Apple and other podcast distributors, a security camera tracked a white Ford van as it moved through the darkened streets of downtown Oakland, California. It was 9:43 p.m.

    Inside the vehicle, prosecutors say, were Boogaloo Bois Steven Carrillo, who was armed with an automatic short-barreled rifle, and Robert Justus, Jr., who was driving. As the van rolled along Jefferson Street, Carrillo allegedly flung open the sliding door and unleashed a burst of gunfire, hitting two federal protective services officers posted outside the Ronald V. Dellums federal building and courthouse. The barrage killed David Patrick Underwood, 53, and wounded Sombat Mifkovic, whose age has not been released.
    …….

    Rip Murdock (cc5a6a)

  54. See also-

    Senators killed measure to combat violent extremism in military

    About a month before rioters, including some with U.S. military training, stormed the Capitol on Jan. 6, lawmakers deleted from the annual Pentagon policy bill language that would have explicitly made violent extremism a crime in the military code of justice.

    The provision in the defense bill, which the House had agreed to, would have barred violent acts that are either motivated by bigotry or designed to “influence, affect or retaliate against the policy or conduct of the government of the United States.” It would also have criminalized attempting to commit such acts, soliciting others to do them or conspiring to accomplish them.
    ……..
    “The Senate eliminated it from the final National Defense Authorization Agreement, claiming they were trying to avoid a veto from President Trump. We all know how that turned out,” (Democrat Jackie) Speier said in a statement to CQ Roll Call. “If it had been included in the NDAA, it would be law and apply to current servicemembers and even some military retirees who attacked the Capitol on January 6.”
    ………

    Rip Murdock (cc5a6a)

  55. UPDATE BY PATTERICO: The Dr. Gokal story will be a major focus of my newsletter tomorrow; I thank Dana for bringing up this important topic. Also, I think part of the weekend discussion has to revolve around the disgraceful decision of the Democrats not to call Jaime Herrera Beutler as a witness in the trial, choosing instead to read her statement into the record. They have made former president Trump a very happy man with that decision. Shouldn’t that tell them something?

    Patterico (115b1f)

  56. Well this is fun. Mitch also thinks Trump should have been impeached, though only about a month ago. Now, it’s just too late. Darn.

    Victor (4959fb)

  57. Feds Arrest Two Militia Members Associated With The Boogaloo Bois

    John Subleski, age 32, of Louisville, Kentucky, and Adam Turner, age 35, also of Louisville, Kentucky, were arrested by the Louisville Division of Federal Bureau of Investigation today, announced Acting United States Attorney Michael A. Bennett.
    …….
    Subleski was charged in a criminal complaint with a violation of 18 United States Code, Section 2101, for using a facility of interstate commerce to incite a riot and committing an act of violence in furtherance of a riot. The complaint against Subleski alleges that he was a member of the militia known as the United Pharaoh’s Guard (UPG) who define themselves as Boogaloo Bois. “Boogaloo” is a term referencing a violent uprising or impending civil war. The complaint further alleges that on January 6, 2021, contemporaneous with the Capitol riots, Subleski incited a riot in downtown Louisville, Kentucky, through the use of social media and other electronic communications, and while inciting individuals to riot, he communicated through social media that it was “Time to storm LMPD.”
    …….
    Turner was charged in a criminal complaint with communicating a threat in interstate commerce in violation of 18 United States Code, Section 875(c). The complaint against Turner alleges that he identifies himself as a member of the United Pharaoh’s Guard and the Boogaloo Bois. The complaint further alleges that on December 25th, 2020, Turner while participating in a protest caravan driving through St. Matthews, confronted St. Matthews Police Officers following a traffic stop of the caravan and that during the confrontation Turner was openly carrying an AR-pistol and an additional hand gun. According to the complaint, Turner was eventually arrested for menacing and resisting arrest. Following the arrest, Turner made a number of Twitter and Facebook posts threatening police officers.
    ……
    If convicted at trial, both Subleski and Turner face a maximum of 5 years imprisonment, a $250,000 fine, and a 3-year term of supervised release.
    ……..

    Rip Murdock (cc5a6a)

  58. R.I.P. Rowena Morrill, she was a fantastic cover artist for SF/Fantasy books from the mid-70’s to the early 2000’s

    Icy (6abb50)

  59. Here are the courageous: Richard Burr, Bill Cassidy, Susan Collins, Lisa Murkowski,Mitt Romney,Ben Sasse, and Pat Toomey. Ten short isn’t unexpected but it’s still better than a complete party line vote.

    McConnell: “They did this because they had been fed wild falsehoods by the most powerful man on Earth. Because he was angry. He had lost an election. Former President Trump’s actions preceded the riot were a disgraceful, disgraceful dereliction of duty,……There’s no question — none — that President Trump is practically and morally responsible for provoking the events of the day. No question about it. The people who stormed this building believed they were acting on the wishes and instructions of their President”

    Still, he couldn’t pull the trigger. History will wonder what exactly it would have taken to get his vote. I suppose more death and destruction….not a great day for the GOP. But the 74M did not demand banning….right wing media did not demand exile of Trump….the Senators mostly just reflected the ethical principles of those in their Party….hopefully this is the final step in the wrong direction….

    AJ_Liberty (ec7f74)

  60. The reason that the have the rules that Dr Gokal broke is so that people don’t intentionally do what he claims to have done unintentionally — open vials and have no one to inoculate. If it was commonly allowed to do what he did, there would be lots of “oopses” of that sort and friends and family would be jumping the line. As his superiors thought was happening in his case.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  61. So that waste of time is over. Now can we move on to impeaching all the members of Congress who steal from the public and incite violence. Can we move on to recalling Newsom and impeaching Cuomo?

    NJRob (00fa60)

  62. They did this because they had been fed wild falsehoods by the most powerful man on Earth. Because he was angry. He had lost an election. Former President Trump’s actions preceded the riot were a disgraceful, disgraceful dereliction of duty,……There’s no question — none — that President Trump is practically and morally responsible for provoking the events of the day. No question about it. The people who stormed this building believed they were acting on the wishes and instructions of their President”

    So, how the F does this exonerate Trump rather than condemning him? He’s trying to have his cake and eat it, too. Had he gone for conviction he would have brought some votes with him. Maybe not 10, but maybe so.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  63. Go here to see the Trumpist reaction on the fascist “Instapundit” blog.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  64. Glenn Reynolds will not survive this. NExt time he does anything that is out of line, his university will boot him.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  65. ……. I think part of the weekend discussion has to revolve around the disgraceful decision of the Democrats not to call Jaime Herrera Beutler as a witness in the trial, choosing instead to read her statement into the record. They have made former president Trump a very happy man with that decision. Shouldn’t that tell them something?

    It wouldn’t have made any difference, and the House managers knew it. Besides reminding the American people what occurred on January 6, 2021, the best thing that came out of this impeachment is that it reaffirmed the principle that a former official, including the President, can be tried after they left office. It also didn’t improve Trump’s reputation among the general electorate.

    A negative consequence is that it will encourage violence by Trump supporters and anti-government groups to affect political change.

    Rip Murdock (cc5a6a)

  66. Now can we move on to impeaching all the members of Congress……

    Members of Congress cannot be impeached.

    Rip Murdock (cc5a6a)

  67. So McConnell spent 20 minutes of throat-clearing, even saying that Trump “provoked” an insurrection but didn’t “incite” it, but voted “not guilty” with the lame 30-second jurisdiction excuse. Note that he never said “disqualification”. His words stopped at “remove”.

    Paul Montagu (77c694)

  68. recalling Newsom

    One candidate who thinks he can win:

    Richard Grenell, a fierce ally of former President Donald Trump and a fixture in MAGA politics, is interviewing campaign strategists and laying groundwork for a potential run for California governor if the bid to recall Gov. Gavin Newsom goes forward, according to a Republican strategist who has spoken with Grenell about his plans.

    The strategist said Grenell, the former ambassador to Germany and acting director of national intelligence in the Trump administration, told him he plans to announce his campaign once the recall effort qualifies for the ballot, as appears increasingly likely.

    https://www.politico.com/news/2021/02/12/grenell-california-gubernatorial-run-468881

    This is how the dying CA GOP thinks it will recover: tying itself to a boat anchor that lost by 30% in the last eledtion.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  69. So that waste of time is over.

    Not a waste of time. We now know that the GOP refuses to save itself. The next election will be like 1974 for the GOP.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  70. “2of4:#Trump used a violent response to peaceful protestors for a law & order campaign moment. He made calculated efforts to play up the Antifa/Law & Order narratives last summer. There were WH mtgs where it was discussed how violence/show of force would help his re-election…”

    Whine whine, complain complain. There were absolutely and unequivocally similar discussions on the Democratic side about how supporting the BLM effort would help Biden’s election. These were the Joe Biden 2020 riots, full stop.

    BLM was consistently lionized and defended by Congress even when they were burning down half of Washington DC, most of Kenosha, Minneapolis for like the third or fourth time, and other cities around the country. BLM was lionized by Congress even when we have long-confirmed reports that all cities that received BLM’s guidance and blessing had increased murder rates after their voices were heard.

    Antifa literally occupied territory and declared its independence, while murdering a young black kid with machine guns whose only crime was joyriding his way into the CHAZ/CHOP.

    All those who publicly supported antifa and BLM, all those who repeated their obvious and hysterical lies about our American institutions, all those who supported their agenda in order to get elected, all those who fed their hysterical, lawless and untrue narrative about the fascist police force and the supposed white supremacists at all levels of policing, especially those in power, deserve to experience its violence and terror of insurrection for themselves. At least it won’t be artificial or contrived anger, like the obviously false claims of Black Lives Matter and Antifa!

    Artificial politics are politics of the Democrat intelligentsia-politics of abstraction and technocratic assumption. They are politics that are filtered through layers and decades of managerialism, and therefore contain all the false assumptions that develop under managerialism. They are also the politics of the lobbyist, who makes arguments he doesn’t believe because he’ll benefit personally if other people believe them. The coronavirus reaction has been the epitome of this artificiality: keep testing (even though the tests are unreliable), keep isolating (even though the effects of this have caused enormous damage), and keep “science-ing” (this has no actual meaning, it’s just a political buzzword they like to repeat to feel good about themselves).

    Real politics confront reality and are unconcerned with partisan ideology. The reality is that large waves of immigration demanded by business create serious long term problems. The reality is that infinite growth is an impossibility, either economically or demographically, and that scale effects created by growth promotion lead to unforeseen problems. The reality is that consumerism has evolved from a pleasurable add-on to a debilitating (physically and mentally) addiction. The reality is that Americans are too fat and sick from their own doing to be outraged that Trump hasn’t somehow saved enough people from a modestly harmful virus that primarily kills people you thought were already dead.

    Trump tried to be realistic. His foreign policy in particular was a paragon of realism: stop breaking stuff, patch up adversarial relationships that are primarily inherited, and work on logical (as opposed to fanciful) relationships and alliances. His economic policy has mainly been to relieve pressure on middle class labor. His social policy was non-existent, beyond vocal opposition to burning down cities (you would think this would catch on; but at this point, given the behavior of the city-dwellers lately, part of you hopes it doesn’t). He has also resisted the contrived neoliberal triangulation on social conflict: no, ‘Critical Race Theory’ is not only wrong, but needs to be actively resisted.

    He was the realest President we ever had, and now as Trump the Twice-Exonerated, he can continue to be so.

    Chief Watabout (0f607d)

  71. but voted “not guilty” with the lame 30-second jurisdiction excuse.

    No one who makes that excuse has any business in government service. Jamie Raskin’s masterful exposition of this should have put that to rest. Anyone who thinks differently either wasn’t listening, is dumber than rocks, or is so committed to their Fuhrer that they’d believe anything he said.

    Here, too: https://www.politico.com/news/magazine/2021/02/11/donald-trump-impeachment-ex-president-founders-468769

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  72. He was the realest President we ever had, and now as Trump the Twice-Exonerated, he can continue to be so.

    You will hate his treason trial then.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  73. So McConnell spent 20 minutes of throat-clearing, even saying that Trump “provoked” an insurrection but didn’t “incite” it, but voted “not guilty” with the lame 30-second jurisdiction excuse. Note that he never said “disqualification”. His words stopped at “remove”.

    That’s the difference between “being wrong” and a “knowing lie.”

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  74. The Instapundit comment section is on fire for the “hateful” seven….a complete lack of introspection. They even want to kill off McConnell who voted to not convict. We have a long way to go….time will help…..but Trump obviously has a next play that will be designed to titillate the masses….and make them squeal for joy. Hopefully more opposition voices will emerge….

    AJ_Liberty (ec7f74)

  75. Grenell becoming the poster child for the recall effort is the best thing that could happen to Newsom.

    aphrael (4c4719)

  76. #69 Kevin M (ab1c11) — 2/13/2021 @ 1:57 pm

    In addition to Grennell, John Cox (who lost to Newsom by 23 points last time around), Kevin Faulconer (former San Diego mayor), right-wing provocateur Mike Cernovich are running.

    Faulconer’s problem is he has flipped flopped his opinion about Trump:

    In 2016, he said he could never support the then-GOP nominee because “his divisive rhetoric is unacceptable.” But he said last month that he voted for Trump in 2020 because he thought the president was best-suited to restore an economy ravaged by the pandemic.

    Trump is deeply unpopular in California and lost the state in November by 29 percentage points to Joe Biden.
    ……
    Cox and Cernovich also previously backed Trump, a point Newsom’s campaign will use against them if the recall qualifies.

    For me the single most important question is what would they done differently to reduce the impact of the pandemic in California. Just not being Newsom is not enough.

    Rip Murdock (cc5a6a)

  77. Trump, and every bootlicking fascist who voted to acquit him, should hounded into exile, or to the grave.

    Dave (1bb933)

  78. And so, our ‘hero’ beats the rap. Again.

    Uninvited, angry, literally hyperventilating and vindictive Nancy bigfoots House impeachment manager presser. Says her grandchildren are sad. Wht? Not playingvideogames instead?

    How much did this cost taxpayers, Nancy? How may more Americans died of Covid this week, dear? There’s a lot of the Trump in you, isn’t there, dear.

    Now why don’t you get the boys some coffee do some work this weekend while the citizen who pay your salary take Monday off.

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  79. You will hate his treason trial then.

    At best it would be sedition, which won’t happen either. Trump didn’t commit treason.

    Rip Murdock (cc5a6a)

  80. Murdock,

    They can be kicked out by a vote. Same difference.

    NJRob (02da8a)

  81. 78.Trump, and every bootlicking fascist who voted to acquit him, should hounded into exile, or to the grave.

    ROFLMAOPIP “I’ll vote to acquit.” – Kentucky Turtle

    “Doctor Stone, there’s a fire.” – ‘The Andromeda Strain’ 1971

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  82. Trump acquitted. 57-43 in favor of conviction. Ten votes short.

    These are the Republicans who voted to convict: Richard Burr of North Carolina, Bill Cassidy of Louisiana, Susan Collins of Maine, Mitt Romney of Utah, Lisa Murkowski of Alaska, Pat Toomey of Pennsylvania, and Ben Sasse of Nebraska.

    Today’s vote served to confirm to everyone that the GOP has indeed become the Republican Party of Trump.

    Dana (fd537d)

  83. ’75.The Instapundit comment section is on fire for the “hateful” seven….’

    Two retirees, four old farts w/re-election long off, or plans not to run again — and Pierre Delecto, the Running Scared Frog.

    “It ain’t easy being green.” – Kermit the Frog.

    Or yellow, eh Pierre…

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  84. O.M.G.– Stupid heart-shaped signs on WH lawn behind TV press site. More Carteresque than yellow ribbons circa 1979.

    We are so fvcked w/this twit as CIC.

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  85. You’re well named, Chief.

    Let’s be clear about McConnell. He wanted to delay receipt of Article, and then complained that it wasn’t valid because it was delayed. It was one of the most disingenuous and specious excuses I’ve heard. Tim Miller is right, and it speaks to how corrupted and cowardly my party has become.

    I’m also not pleased with Raskin’s excuse about witnesses. Schumer-McConnell could have easily negotiated the number of witnesses that each side could introduce. Three per side would’ve been nice, which means the Democrats could’ve called McCarthy, Pence and maybe Meadows to the stand, while the Republicans could’ve brought forward Pelosi, Hillary and an Antifa to be named later. It would’ve taken a week and more relevant information would’ve gone into the record.

    The closing argument by the defense team, especially van der Veen was singularly terrible, too awful to count the ways. He may well be a top-flight bus-stop-sign attorney, but a terrible advocate for an impeachment trial.

    Paul Montagu (77c694)

  86. FWIW I lived a mile away from CHOP last summer and visited it often. When trigger happy people shot the guy in the car, the portion of territory occupied by antifa consisted mostly of sidewalks on two sides of the abandoned police station. The park was primarily occupied by people who could be charitably described as homeless and drifter trying to take advantage of the situation.

    Why a protest that was allowed to continue for a while on a few blocks by some dithering city officials despite increasing incidents of violence has anything to do with the concerted attempt by the president to overturn an election result by encouraging a mob he gathered to march on the Capitol is beyond me.

    Victor (4959fb)

  87. By the way, Burr surprised me. I didn’t see that coming.

    Paul Montagu (77c694)

  88. O.M.G.– Stupid heart-shaped signs on WH lawn behind TV press site.

    We’ve been told ad nauseam for the past 4+ years that only a snobby elitist would criticize a president’s “style.”

    Ordinary Americans generally like Valentine hearts. So if you ridicule them, you must have “contempt for ordinary Americans.”

    Radegunda (20775b)

  89. it speaks to how corrupted and cowardly my party has become.

    The descent into Hell began January 20, 1981…

    Hosea 8:7: “For they have sown the wind, and they shall reap the whirlwind.”

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  90. @89. It’s the sort of thing you’d expect from a kindergarten teacher… on the taxpayer’s time and dime:

    Jill Biden has giant cartoon hearts installed on White House Lawn…

    http://www.bostonglobe.com/2021/02/12/nation/jill-biden...

    Jill Biden has giant cartoon hearts installed on White House lawn bearing calls for unity, hope By Associated Press Updated February 12, 2021, 12:33 p.m.

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  91. Why a protest that was allowed to continue for a while on a few blocks by some dithering city officials despite increasing incidents of violence has anything to do with the concerted attempt by the president to overturn an election result by encouraging a mob he gathered to march on the Capitol is beyond me.

    Ditto. It’s shocking that so many people either think there’s nothing wrong with that gross abuse of presidential power, or believe that it’s not serious enough to punish in any way. But in truth, most of them are really thinking It’s not wrong when our side does it. Or some are thinking, It was really bad, but the Trumpists will take revenge if I say so publicly. The whataboutisms are an attempt to give moral cover to their cynicism or cowardice.

    Imagine what the same people would be saying if any Democratic president did half of what Trump did following the election–and beforehand, when he systematically prepared the “fraud” narrative.

    Radegunda (20775b)

  92. You know it’s bad when a hyperpartisan doink like Schiff is made to look prophetic.

    “What are the odds if left in office that he will continue trying to cheat? I will tell you: 100 percent,” he said. “A man without character or ethical compass will never find his way.”

    Paul Montagu (77c694)

  93. And so, as more Americans face certain death from Covid inaction and financial ruin due to same, the Senate now goes on vacation and won’t be back until Feb., 22/23.

    Why? Is this how you ‘shut down the virus’ President Plagiarist???? “C’mon, man,” show us the savvy swamp creature with half a century of senate slime on your fake resume, call them back into session, President Plagiarist.

    No wonder you had Churchill’s bust removed from the Oval- ‘Action this day’ was his motto; yours– a nap a day.

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  94. DCSCA — the President has no control over the Congressional schedule.

    aphrael (4c4719)

  95. It’s an old saying among attorneys. When you can’t argue the facts, argue the law. When you can’t argue the law, argue the facts. Question: What do you do when you can’t argue the law or the facts? Answer: You lie. Denial, misdirection and misinformation, that was Trump’s legal team’s defense of the indefensible.

    In fact, one lawyer, Shoen, wanted to quit, because of some dispute over video clips. But just when he thought he got out, Trump clawed him back in. (Classic Godfather III reference. Except Donald Trump is hardly a Michael Corleone–he’s much more of a Fredo. From Godfather II, in paraphrase and from memory. “You’re my younger brother, Mike, and I was passed over! I’m not dumb like everybody says. Fredo do this, Fredo do that. I’m smart, and I want respect!”)

    The House impeachment managers put up a powerful and compelling case for conviction. They were prepared, and the evidence they presented was damning. Not that it matters. Not when Senate Republicans (jurors) were doodling, playing games on their cell phones, not paying attention. They already made up their minds to acquit, before the trial started.

    Thus, the House impeachment managers didn’t really present their case to the Senate; they presented it to the American people. So now it doesn’t matter if Trump is acquitted or convicted. What matters is that he’ll never be elected to office again, no matter how much sway he has over the QOP. In the eyes of the public, he’s guilty of insurrection and several high crimes and misdemeanors.

    https://www.nytimes.com/2021/02/12/opinion/trump-impeachment-guilty.html

    I don’t know how many of you watch CNN, but honestly their prime time lineup of Anderson Cooper, Chris Cuomo and Don Lemon has been on a roll this last week. Interesting reporting, insightful commentary, and great guest interviews, particularly with Tom Friedman of the NY Times, former Trump spokesman Anthony Scaramucci, historian Doris Kearns Goodwin, and the lawyer for the QAnon Shaman.

    Friedman noted that the most telling portion of the rally preceding the riot was not Trump’s incendiary speech, but rather Donald Jr.’s proclamation that “this isn’t their party. This is Donald Trump’s party!” Friedman warned Republicans that if they didn’t excise Trump from the party, he would have a homecoming after the impeachment, regardless of the outcome. This is true. Trump has been putting tens of millions in his PACs and joint Super PAC with the RNC. While he can’t legally use those funds to run his own campaign in 2024, he can certainly use them for travel, rallies, and contributions to loyalists and opponents of disloyalists in the midterms of 2022 and the election o2024. Stripped of social media platforms like Twitter and Facebook, Trump will go around the country giving speeches, because he craves the adulation of his cult, spreading lies, false claims of voter fraud and election theft, making accusations and petty insults, pretty much what he’s been doing for the last several months and years. He will be an albatross around the neck of Republicans for at least the next two election cycles. And he will get media attention, particularly from FOX, OAN and Newsmax, probably others, especially talk radio. He is not going to go gently into that good night. Friedman asked, what are elected Republicans going to say when asked, do you agree with this, do you agree with that? Their silence will be deafening.

    Scaramucci, on the other hand, said he doesn’t think Trump will run in 2024. I never really liked the guy, but he made some valid points. He basically said, look, Trump lost the House, the Senate majority and the Presidency, all in one term. Beside the fact that he stoked and incited a violent insurrection against the US Capitol, Congress (a separate but equal branch of government), in which people were killed–five on the scene of the assault, two others committed suicide afterwards–Trump is unelectable. That’s why he won’t run for president again, Scaramucci said, because Trump doesn’t like losing. But there is a lot of damage he can do to the party between now and then.

    Goodwin quoted from Lincoln. In paraphrase, she said “If you lose the sentiment of the American people, you lose everything.” This also is true. When you have lost the sentiment of the people, you’ve lost everything. Trump has lost everything.

    The lawyer for the Q Shaman delivered a dictated notice from the Shaman himself to Cuomo, which he read aloud. Essentially, the Shaman said he was deeply disappointed in Donald Trump, in that he had let down peaceful protestors. And that he, the Shaman, was sorry for the events on Jan. 6th.

    Oh, so now he’s contrite. Yeah, I suspect that facing criminal charges for unlawful entry, criminal trespass, vandalism of federal property, and conspiracy to commit insurrection (which is a serious charge, a felony in fact), he finally got his mind right. Sorry, pal, but just saying “I’m sorry” after the fact doesn’t excuse from federal prosecution. This guy is facing serious jail time, as should all the others.

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2021/02/12/once-impeachment-is-over-threat-trump-shifts-real-courtrooms/

    I am sick and tired of this political disruption. It must stop, if the republic is to survive.

    Gawain's Ghost (b25cd1)

  96. Pat, I’d like to see a collumn on “Why Mitch McConnell is a Lying Sack of S*it”, but I don’t have the $100.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  97. By the way, Burr surprised me. I didn’t see that coming.

    Burr, like Toomey, is retiring. I get the feeling from McConnell’s attempt to have it every which-way that he tried to get 9 more votes for conviction, but could not, and did not want (or did not have the balls for) the party leader to go rogue.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  98. Diogenes would have given the Senate a hard pass.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  99. For me the single most important question is what would they done differently to reduce the impact of the pandemic in California. Just not being Newsom is not enough.

    Also:

    Traffic, traffic and traffic
    Crowding, infill and the war against single-family housing
    The fricking train; kill it already
    Water, both getting and storing, and diverting water for the Delta smelt
    Electricity, brownouts and how are you going to power electric cars?

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  100. I am sick and tired of this political disruption. It must stop, if the republic is to survive.

    Trump must go to prison if the republic is to survive. He committed actual treason: he fielded an army and waged war against the United States, in order to maintain power.

    St Helena, not Elba, please.

    As for his followers, he betrayed them utterly. Not only did he not march with them as promised, but he had 2 weeks to pardon the lot of them and did not. “Suckers!”

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  101. Trump may not run again, but he’s got to keep the scam running to cover his business losses. His travel and entertainment empire has not done well in the pandemic (and I think this is the main reason he wanted to play it down, for the same reason as the Jaws mayor did). He’s looking at actual BK in all those lines with only his real estate empire still afloat (ant that’s not doing great either).

    So, I expect he’ll be passing the hat around some more, until he’s forced to stop. Life in prison might have that effect.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  102. For me the single most important question is what would they done differently to reduce the impact of the pandemic in California. Just not being Newsom is not enough.

    Also:

    Traffic, traffic and traffic
    Crowding, infill and the war against single-family housing
    The fricking train; kill it already
    Water, both getting and storing, and diverting water for the Delta smelt
    Electricity, brownouts and how are you going to power electric cars?

    LOL! A Republican governor and a Democratic legislature-that’ll work. We’ve seen this movie before.

    Rip Murdock (cc5a6a)

  103. @95. Ol’Swamp-Savvy can call them back. At least make the public effort.

    He’s useless.

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  104. @95. Article II, Section 3 of the U.S. Constitution grants the president the power to convene a special session of Congress on “extraordinary occasions.”

    A pandemic is a pretty damned ‘extraordinary occasion.’

    Th boob barked “shut down the virus” — which doesn’t mean taking a break for a week after you were off just a month ago for weeks through the holidays.

    This is what waters the tree of populism and becomes a rationale for citizens to storm the Capitol.

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  105. I’m open to the recall of Newsom, in a way I wasn’t six months ago; while he did a good job in the spring and summer, we experienced a disaster in the late fall and early winter.

    But given the rules for a recall — a single jungle election ballot with all candidates from all races, with a plurality victor — if there are enough candidates, it’s possible for someone to win with less than 20% of the vote. That’s potentially the road to a Trumpist governor.

    So my instinctive reaction is to resist because the replacement could easily be worse.

    aphrael (4c4719)

  106. Except Congress is already in session.

    Idiot.

    Dave (1bb933)

  107. TJ Ducklo has resigned.

    Rip Murdock (cc5a6a)

  108. I will only link the Google search.Whether you click the links is your business and your lookout.

    And please accept my apology.

    nk (1d9030)

  109. I’m in favor of anything that delays Biden’s agenda.

    Rip Murdock (cc5a6a)

  110. @107. HE CAN CALL THEM BACK.

    IDIOT.

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  111. 110.I’m in favor of anything that delays Biden’s agenda.

    Daily naps do that.

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  112. @107. ‘Truman got his back up and cut short Congress’ vacation at a crucial moment in 1948.’ -source, NYT

    IDIOT.

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  113. That’s potentially the road to a Trumpist governor.

    In 2003, the recall had 156 candidates. The top three were Arnold, Bustamante and trailing a distant third, Tom McClintock. Fourth place was peter Camejo, Green Party with 2.8%. everyone else (including my brother-in-law at the time, who was trying to get press for TSOL) under half a percent.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2003_California_gubernatorial_recall_election

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  114. White House deputy press secretary resigns after threatening reporter over story about him
    White House deputy press secretary TJ Ducklo, who threatened a reporter who asked about his relationship with another reporter, has resigned said his boss, White House press secretary Jen Psaki, Saturday night.

    “We accepted the resignation of TJ Ducklo after a discussion with him this evening. This conversation occurred with the support of the White House Chief of Staff,” Psaki said in a statement.

    Ducklo released a statement on Twitter saying, in part, “I know this was terrible. I know I can’t take it back. But I also know I can learn from it and do better.”

    Multiple White House officials described the situation as untenable, because they believed a one-week suspension was insufficient, a sentiment that was made clear to the White House press shop in several stories about the incident..

    Psaki said Ducklo apologized to the reporter he threatened, Politico’s Tara Palmeri, over the incident. ……
    ……..
    He was a dead man walking, professionally speaking.

    Rip Murdock (cc5a6a)

  115. In short, electing a whackjob isn’t likely, and even if so, the legislature doesn’t change.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  116. @114-
    I voted for Angelyne.

    Rip Murdock (cc5a6a)

  117. This lazy-azzed putz of a plagiarist POTUS with the half century of swamp soggery dripping off him best start getting into his sweats and take-’em-behind-the-gym-mode and start kicking azz w/his old Congress buddies and tellthe missus to knock it off with the kindergarten valentines stuck on the WH lawn on taxpayer time and dimes. Leave the yellow ribbon crap to the Carter years.

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  118. aphrael,

    In the 2003 recall there were only three viable candidates. A centrist Republican, a conservative Republican and the Democratic Lt Governor. Even if the GOP cannot settle on one candidate they are unlikely to run 5, nor are the Democrats.

    At worst you would get a centrist Republican like the SD mayor, a Trumpist, a big-name Democrat, and maybe a Squadish Dem. People will vote for the center because most everyone is IN the center. The people who want the fringes are not all that prevalent, and certainly not in California.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  119. I voted for Angelyne.

    I thought she’d do better. She had a couple of powerful messages.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  120. 116.In short, electing a whackjob isn’t likely, and even if so, the legislature doesn’t change.

    The core of his sales pitch was he was one of the swamp creatures- a half century of buddies [though always managed to list the ones now long dead]– an if he can’t kick azz now in the ‘honeymoon’ days he’s only going to get weaker and older.

    My guess is a clean, younger GOPer attractive ideas -and looks- breaks through w/some broke field running and repackaged ideas for 2024 to beat the incredibly lucky Kamala– [expect Plagiarist POTUS to be out o the picture by then]… ‘Haley To The Chief’– likely Nikki. She’s naturally tanned, reasonably rested and ready for all points of the compass. Bob the hair, a touch of gray and keep wearing dresses a la Thatcher and she’s ready-made for the emerging era of the mid 21st century.

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  121. People will vote for the center because most everyone is IN the center. The people who want the fringes are not all that prevalent, and certainly not in California.

    If this were accurate, then we wouldn’t have a super-majority of Democrats with a majority of Sacramento progressives in the mix..

    Dana (fd537d)

  122. California’s Gavin Newsom Will Likely Face A Recall Election — But He’ll Probably Survive It

    California Gov. Gavin Newsom has been in office for just two years, but there have already been five failed attempts to force a statewide recall election on whether to remove him from office. That itself is not unusual — California has some of the most permissive recall requirements in the country — but what is unusual is that the sixth attempt (which is currently underway) appears to be gaining some serious traction.
    ………
    ……..[T]he recall might have gone nowhere had it not been for a judge’s decision to give organizers almost double the normal amount of time to collect signatures in light of the difficulties posed by the pandemic. And it looks like that extra time has made a big difference. As of Nov. 17, the original deadline for collecting signatures, the campaign told The Daily Caller it had collected fewer than 750,000 signatures out of the 1,495,709 necessary to trigger an actual recall election. As of this past Sunday, they claim to have collected more than 1.4 million. (Of course, the state still needs to verify that all those signatures are valid, but 410,087 of the 485,650 that the state has checked so far are indeed valid. At that validation rate of 84 percent, organizers need only to submit 1.8 million signatures or more before the new deadline of March 17 — an easily attainable goal.)

    But we wouldn’t bet on this recall actually removing Newsom from office — not yet, anyway. …… California’s current political landscape is also pretty different from conditions in 2003, when it last saw a gubernatorial recall on the ballot, which is important as it makes a successful recall of Newsom even less likely.

    First off, California may have been Democratic-leaning in 2003, but it has a notably deeper shade of blue today, which will make it more challenging for Newsom’s opponents to engineer his ouster. ……. Newsom also won far more support in his 2018 election win (62 percent) than Davis did in 2002 (47 percent).1 Correspondingly, far fewer Californians call themselves Republicans now. Just before the 2020 election, 46 percent of California voters were registered as Democrats while just 24 percent were registered as Republicans. By comparison, at the time of the 2003 recall, 44 percent were registered as Democrats and 35 percent were registered as Republicans. Independents in California lean somewhat Democratic today, too.
    ……..
    Second, at a similar point in the recall calendar, Davis was more unpopular than Newsom currently is. The recall campaign against Davis stopped gathering signatures in mid-July 2003, and the measure qualified for the ballot later that month. Just before that time, surveys by the Public Policy Institute of California and the Field Poll found Davis’s approval rating in the low 20s and his disapproval in the high 60s or worse among voters. By comparison, Newsom’s ratings are far better, if not especially great. Morning Consult found 51 percent of California voters approved of Newsom’s performance over the past month compared to 39 percent who disapproved, while in January PPIC found 52 percent approved versus 43 percent who disapproved………

    We don’t yet have much polling on a Newsom recall, but at first blush it also looks better for him than it did for Davis in the summer of 2003. The recent poll from Berkeley IGS found that 36 percent of registered voters would support recalling Newsom while 45 percent would oppose it (the breakdown was 36 percent to 49 percent among likely voters). By contrast, support for recalling Davis was more or less reversed, as surveys found around 50 percent backed the recall while around 40 percent opposed it. …….
    ……….

    Rip Murdock (cc5a6a)

  123. So my instinctive reaction is to resist because the replacement could easily be worse.

    aphrael (4c4719) — 2/13/2021 @ 4:54 pm

    Same. Still.

    Dana (fd537d)

  124. So I just looked at photos of Jill Biden’s hearts on the WH lawn. What’s the big deal? They’re benign sentiments that make an appearance every year at this time. I don’t see why anyone would object. I like seeing something normal there.

    Dana (fd537d)

  125. If this were accurate, then we wouldn’t have a super-majority of Democrats with a majority of Sacramento progressives in the mix.

    That’s the demographics of the population centers. SF, LA… there are pockets of opposites but no enough to tumble a shift– at least in CA. And so many are crooks– Republicans Hunter and Cunningham for instance. It is getting worse in California– and both these political parties have done so much damage to the state literally from the ground up that it’s going to take a lifetime of a concerted effort to root them out. At best, all you can hope for in years to come is containment.

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  126. What’s the big deal?

    Smarter question: what did it cost?

    Yellow ribbons were stupid, too. So are kiddie hearts.

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  127. @120-
    True story. Twenty plus years ago my then girlfriend and ran into Angelyne as she was coming out of a late night diner in West Hollywood as we were going in. I have also seen pink Corvette occasionally in Hollywood. The billboards are gone, though.

    Rip Murdock (cc5a6a)

  128. 2003 played the way it did because Arnie cleared the field. Without someone of similar stature, there’s a real risk of a low-plurality victor.

    aphrael (4c4719)

  129. @123. He was tone deaf; stupidly did that $$$ dinner and when he does his pressers they’re virtually incoherent w/lockdown zone prattle, too long– and he talks like a Ken doll w/a button on his azz.

    He’ll get recalled.

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  130. Dana, at 122 — ‘center’ means something different from population to population. So, too, do the fringes.

    A centrist viewpoint in California might well be a fringe viewpoint in Kentucky. On the other hand, a centrist viewpoint in Texas could well be a fringe viewpoint in California.

    aphrael (4c4719)

  131. DCSCA, the recall is clearly going to qualify. I’m not sure yet which way the election is going to go. Certainly being able to sell it as a Trumpist stunt, which Grenell’s candidacy will help, will be to Newsom’s benefit.

    aphrael (4c4719)

  132. Darling Nikki is politically no different than the other DC swamp inhabitants, gender and ethnicity notwithstanding.

    Rip Murdock (cc5a6a)

  133. If you want to win the hearts and minds of the angering, rising tide of populists, knock off the useless Valentine’s Day yard and ‘I got a plan or that’speches and demonstrate action; ‘action this day’, a la Churchill.

    So far, we ain’t seen much aside from a lot of EOs signed.

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  134. @132. He ain’t too popular in the business community– particularly in the SD area. A lot of businesses have shuttered for good– they need financial relief– and these lockdown rules have them gong crazy… and vaccine is delayed. He may end up being the fall guy- a victim of circumstances–people are tired, pissed– and looking for some one to blame– and he’s a ripe target.

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  135. @133.She ain’t no fireplug in a pants suit; looks a helluva lot better that Ted Cruz does in a dress, too.

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  136. “Why a protest that was allowed to continue for a while on a few blocks by some dithering city officials despite increasing incidents of violence has anything to do with the concerted attempt by the president to overturn an election result by encouraging a mob he gathered to march on the Capitol is beyond me.”

    Obviously, they have nothing to do with each other.

    The first was a transparent and highly-publicized violent and seditious escalation in the ongoing Antifa rebellion supported by leftist bankrollers of the then popular “Defund the Police” campaign meant to drive turnout among the crazier and more conspiratorial members of the Democrat electorate. Apparently they were planning on using the inevitable law enforcement crackdown to put the local police and their unions in one of those typical legal no-win situations where they get blamed both for using too much force and too little. And if the police actually did get defunded, well, that’s no skin off the lefties, who mostly can afford their own security guards. Like small businesses, police mainly help the middle class, so they were acceptable losses.

    The second was a spurious accusation hatched by those same Democrats and their lefty funders that the Great Dr. President Donald John Trump was just officially exonerated of. Believing it at this stage is as much evidence of a weird religious ‘conspiracy mindset’ as believing in ‘spontaneous demonstrations’, the Mueller report, the Lincoln Project, or ‘the fundamental integrity of our electoral system’. As usual, the Democrats always accuse others of what they’ve already been guilty of. Best to hound them out of the legal system and the government just to be safe.

    Tom Aloysius Brady (9f388f)

  137. @137, tell me more about the teaching of Q…

    Time123 (398843)

  138. Heh! It often is impossible to distinguish the real Trump supporters from parodies, but the “Great Dr. President” is a clue.

    nk (1d9030)

  139. It should also cheer up certain incels thrown into surly depression by St. Valentine’s Day.

    nk (1d9030)

  140. https://freebeacon.com/national-security/biden-makes-history-first-president-in-40-years-to-punt-on-contacting-israel/

    President Joe Biden is the first American leader in 40 years not to contact Israel’s leaders as one of his first actions in the White House, setting up what could be four years of chilly relations between America and its top Middle East ally.

    Biden has already phoned multiple world leaders, including Russian president Vladimir Putin and Chinese president Xi Jinping, but during his 23 days in office has yet to speak with Israeli prime minister Benjamin Netanyahu—making Biden the first president in modern history to punt on bolstering U.S.-Israel relations during his initial days in office. Every president going back to at least Ronald Reagan in 1981 made contact with their Israeli counterpart within a week of assuming office, according to a review of news reports.

    Congressional foreign policy leaders slammed Biden’s Netanyahu snub, prompting a flurry of questions for White House press secretary Jen Psaki, who has declined to disclose when or if Biden will call the Israeli leader. Psaki also said on Friday the White House would not list Israel as a U.S. ally when asked about the relationship during her daily press briefing.

    Modern presidents going back to Reagan made calls or overtures to Israel during their first days in office, sending a message the United States would continue to stand for the Jewish state’s security. Biden’s diplomatic slight comes as Israel faces encroaching terrorist threats and the danger of a nuclear-armed Iran. He also has hired several individuals with a background in anti-Israel activism, including Maher Bitar, a top White House National Security Council official who spent his youth organizing boycotts of the Jewish state. The State Department’s Iran envoy, Robert Malley, also has been a vocal critic of Israel.

    Well it’s what many voted for, abandoning Israel and supporting Iran.

    NJRob (eb56c3)

  141. https://reason.com/2021/02/11/biden-administration-suspends-rule-protecting-businesses-from-banking-discrimination/

    The Biden administration has rolled back a Trump-era regulation meant to protect politically disfavored businesses, like gun manufacturers and cryptocurrency exchanges, from being categorically denied banking services.

    In a statement released January 28, the Office of the Comptroller of the Currency (OCC) said that the move will allow the new comptroller to review the rule and public comments the office had received. The OCC still suggests that banks not terminate broad categories of customers without assessing individual risk.

    The Fair Access Rule was established in the last weeks of the Trump administration and was set to go into effect on April 1. It stated that “banks should conduct risk assessment of individual customers, rather than make broad-based decisions affecting whole categories or classes of customers when provisioning access to services, capital, and credit.”

    This regulation was meant to shield politically unpopular but otherwise legal companies from banking discrimination, following Operation Chokepoint, a program initiated by President Barack Obama’s Justice Department. While ostensibly designed to combat fraud, in practice, Reason writers have observed, it empowered the government to target unfavorable industries, such as payday lending and pornography, by “coercing private businesses in an attempt to centrally engineer the American marketplace based on its own politically biased moral judgments.”

    “Officials at both the Comptroller of the Currency (OCC) and the Federal Deposit Insurance Corporation (FDIC) threatened banks with regulatory pressure if they did not bend to their will,” wrote former U.S. Attorney Frank Keating for The Hill. “Gun and ammunition dealers, payday lenders and other businesses operating legally suddenly found banks terminating their accounts with little explanation aside from ‘regulatory pressure.'”

    In 2017, Trump’s Department of Justice ended the program, calling it “misguided,” stating that “law-abiding businesses should not be targeted simply for operating in an industry that a particular administration might disfavor.”

    Trump’s Fair Access Rule went a step further by prohibiting financial institutions from discriminating against entire industries. Andrea O’Sullivan, director of the Center for Technology and Innovation at the James Madison Institute, has argued here at Reason that Trump’s rule would’ve protected unfairly targeted businesses.

    Unfavored people can just build their own banking system.

    NJRob (eb56c3)

  142. > prohibiting financial institutions from discriminating against entire industries

    except, of course, the medical and recreational marijuana industries, which financial institutions are required by law to discriminate against. oh, and the gambling industry.

    there’s a general process in place across the administration where all last-minute regulations adopted by the outgoing administration have been suspended for review. this is done because *until they’ve been reviewed*, it’s impossible to tell which regulations were good and which regulations were last-minute attempts to slide something bad in and lock it in place.

    a rounding error of every administration this century has done something similar.

    this is a good regulation. my hope is that, upon review, the administration decides to proceed with it. and if they end up not, and someone brings it to my attention, i’ll denounce them for that decision. *but* the fact that it got caught up in a general suspension of midnight regulations is not a sign of nefarious behavior, nor is it even a sign that the regulation won’t be kept in place.

    aphrael (4c4719)

  143. Aphrael,

    please let me know when Biden revises his decision. I will give a small cheer. Till then he gets a Bronx one.

    NJRob (eb56c3)

  144. “tell me more about the teaching of Q”

    They won’t talk to you, you should probably ask John Weaver or Steve “I missed figuring out John Weaver was a p*do because I was touched by Gay Ray the Boy Scout Medic as a young lad and that’s what led me to every bad decision since then” Schmidt about whether the government is infested with pedophiles in high positions.

    To be fair, I can’t say that they’re officially Satanic pedophiles, since while they may sympathize with Satanic principles I can’t officially say whether they’re card-carrying members of the Satanic party. Q gets the broad strokes right, but can be frustratingly vague on the details. Obviously if we can’t find their Malebolgia Membership Cards this means we can dismiss all concerns outright.

    But we can still safely say that the most prominent NeverTrump organizations were simply pedophilic protection grifts.

    Gay Ray (cf0e51)

  145. I vaguely remember that a couple of people in the same line of work as Stormy Daniels had their bank accounts canceled by some major bank some time back when? Maybe there’s a movie in it: “Nude Stoners With Stoners“?

    nk (1d9030)

  146. 101. Kevin M (ab1c11) — 2/13/2021 @ 4:06 pm

    Not only did he not march with them as promised,

    He didn’t promise to march with them; it only sounds that way because Trump spoke somewhat awkwardly, as he usually does, and because most people are unaware of the second rally.

    http://web.archive.org/web/20210106005050/https://wildprotest.com

    (or try tinyurl.com/y5pakdpg)

    Where he would have spoken.

    but he had 2 weeks to pardon the lot of them and did not. “Suckers!”

    Who, if anyone, gave them the idea he would pardon them?

    They were expecting, if anything, not to be prosecuted.

    Sammy Finkelman (00fff5)

  147. 47. Hoi Polloi (139bf6) — 2/13/2021 @ 11:02 am

    Rumor is Biden’s pledge to “open the schools” means opening them one day/week.

    That’s not rumor, that’s an on the record statement last Tuesday by White House Press Secretary Jen Psaki. And Jen Psaki explained that when Biden said “most schools”. that meand 50% plus 1.

    And the kicker is, that’s a goal that’s already been met. Before the election.

    https://www.foxnews.com/politics/psaki-white-house-goal-over-50-percent-in-person-school-one-day-week

    Press secretary Jen Psaki first announced the plan on Tuesday, after months of Biden promising to have schools open within 100 days, or by April 30. The administration had not previously specified how many days per week. The plan asks for a “majority” of schools to be open at least one day per week, meaning over 50%.

    But according to Burbio’s school reopening tracker, that goal was reached months ago — about 64% of schools already offer some sort of in-person learning.

    See

    https://info.burbio.com/school-tracker-update-feb-8

    But this is entirely consistent with the Biden Administrations stated goal to underpromise and overdeliver.

    https://abcnews.go.com/Health/wireStory/bidens-early-approach-virus-underpromise-overdeliver-75437468

    — It’s a proven political strategy: Underpromise and overdeliver.

    Now one erson thinks that could turn into underpromise and underdeliver. (but probably more than he said)

    Sammy Finkelman (00fff5)

  148. https://www.commentarymagazine.com/noah-rothman/underpromise-and-underdeliver

    Except for things way past his term. There he will overpromise. Like 100 percent “clean” power generation by the year 2035.

    The CDC is reverse engineering its guidance, I think, so as to not say that what any school district is doing is wrong. They still have this terrible overemphasis on cleaning and tend to ignore air quality, according to some real experts.

    They are not wrong on the statistics, but of course, people over 13 pr 19 who attended school can still die, but I’m thinking maybe school or people not wearing masks isn’t really the cause.

    https://www.nytimes.com/2021/02/10/obituaries/helen-etuk-dead-coronavirus.html

    But Ms. Etuk never got that far. She died of complications of the coronavirus on Jan. 12 at a hospital in Arlington, Texas, where her family lives, her mother, Ellen Clinton, said in a phone interview. Ms. Clinton said her daughter had also had lupus, a chronic disease of the immune system, and had been experiencing pain in her joints. She was 20.

    Ms. Etuk was studying at the University of North Texas in Denton and going to in-person classes. Her mother said that even though Ms. Etuk had worn a mask and had tried to maintain distance from other people, she developed a bad cough that turned out to be a symptom of Covid-19.

    “She blamed herself, saying she made a mistake in going back to school,” Ms. Clinton said. “She said that sometimes students pull their masks down, so they cover their mouths but not their noses.”

    Her daughter was hospitalized for almost three months before she died.

    The medicine given in lupus cases that partially suppresses the immune system may have helped but she could have gotten infected almost anywhere, not just near people not wearing masks right.

    Sammy Finkelman (00fff5)

  149. Trump should sue Congress to have his record expunged for this unconstitutional trial!

    No, I don’t believe that it was unconstitutional, but Trump does stupid legal things and this would at least get the Supreme Court on record.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  150. If this were accurate, then we wouldn’t have a super-majority of Democrats with a majority of Sacramento progressives in the mix..

    The CA media has convinced the voters that the Democrats ARE the center and those gay-hating, white-supremacist Republicans want to put women back in chains.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  151. Until JVW posts another anti-Newsom manifesto (it feels like we’re overdue…) I remain unclear what Newsom did that merits recalling him.

    Of course, his infamous dinner party was a colossal political blunder, but it had zero practical effect on the state’s 40-million residents. And he admitted his mistake and apologized for it – a rare occurrence in politics these days.

    Trump headlined numerous larger and more dangerous public events in violation of social distancing every day for months, and oddly, none of the people calling for Newsom’s blood seem to have cared a whit. And most of the Republicans likely to run against him are probably on record calling the whole pandemic a hoax, at some point.

    Dave (1bb933)

  152. Trump should sue Congress to have his record expunged for this unconstitutional trial!

    Wrong! The impeachment was a legally-binding declaration that Trump is still President, what in law is called a judicial admission, and now that he has been acquitted he is still President and will resume the office on March 4, the legal Inauguration Day under the Constitution, and all patriots should be in Washington DC on that day to celebrate.

    nk (1d9030)

  153. Now that the impeachment trial is over, maybe it’s time for the media and federal politicians and DOJ to turn their sights to a politician whose deeds cost thousands of citizens their lives…Gov. Cuomo.

    Nah. Won’t happen.

    Hoi Polloi (139bf6)

  154. Cuomo is a “look over there”. The corrupt criminal traitor Trump, in collusion with Putin to destroy the economies of the United States, China, and Europe, has murdered 488,000 Americans to date. Now that the politicians have had their circus, they should step out of the way and let the professionals of law enforcement, counter-intelligence, and criminal justice try him, convict him, and apply the appropriate penalties.

    nk (1d9030)

  155. ->“On the spot. No ifs, ands or buts

    Yet Biden only suspended him?

    Thankfully TJ Ducklo resigned so Biden is not on the spot to keep his word.

    BillPasadena (5b0401)

  156. Kevin M (ab1c11) — 2/13/2021 @ 10:20 am

    So, maybe it was a bowling ball. Does it matter? Even if he fell down and hit his head rushing to the melee, it is still homicide.

    In the case of Sicknick, yes it matters. If you have no idea why he died then you’ve got no reason to link it to the riots. Paul and Dustin in their comments are making statements that are simply not true. I’m assuming they truly believe what they’re saying for whatever reason. But there are numerous articles saying the DOJ can’t link his death to the riots.

    This isn’t much different from D’s during the impeachment simply making false statements.

    frosty (f27e97)

  157. As with Newsom, there seem to be a few steps missing in the indictment of Cuomo. I admit that I haven’t followed it in Finkelman-like detail, since the ones making the most noise have so little credibility on COVID-related subjects, but I’m open to factual evidence presented in good faith.

    The charge against Cuomo, as I understand it, is that his order (was it, in fact, an order binding on hospitals, or simply a recommendation?) to free up hospital space by transferring nursing home residents recovering from the virus back to their long-term care facilities exposed other residents to infection, and for some, death.

    To lay those deaths at Cuomo’s feet seems to me to require some additional evidence I haven’t seen (but which may exist):

    1) Did Cuomo come up with the idea on his own, or was it recommended by public health experts whose judgment he had no reason to doubt?

    2) If he came up with the idea on his own, was there a consensus of public health experts against it?

    3) Did he have credible information showing that his decision would lead to a significantly worse outcome than the alternative (letting hospitals fill up and having to turn people away)?

    More generally, where is the mens rea here? If, in an unprecedented crisis, with incomplete and often inaccurate information coming in from many sources, where all possible outcomes were bad, Cuomo’s job was to try to bring about one of the least bad outcomes, holding him culpable seems to require showing that he knew, or should have known, that there was a clearly better alternative. Otherwise, it’s Monday-morning quarterbacking and cynical political theater.

    Dave (1bb933)

  158. Gawain’s Ghost (b25cd1) — 2/13/2021 @ 3:44 pm

    The House impeachment managers put up a powerful and compelling case for conviction. They were prepared, and the evidence they presented was damning.

    You mean the video where they edited out the peaceful comment? Or the doctored tweets? They didn’t argue the law or facts. They spent all their time telling you about their feelings and it made them look weak. So, now they’ve got weak and dishonest going for them.

    It’s not a good week to be a D.

    frosty (f27e97)

  159. if there were no democrats over there, there would be no mr. great dr. president donald john trump, mr. Dave

    democrats are to blame for everything

    never forget that

    nk (1d9030)

  160. Dave (1bb933) — 2/14/2021 @ 8:10 am

    That isn’t the charge against Cuomo now. The current charge against him is that his staff, with his knowledge, lied about the nursing home deaths to avoid a federal investigation and oversight by the NY legislature. Members of his staff have admitted this.

    We’re past the watergate break in and we’re at the coverup stage.

    I admit that I haven’t followed it in Finkelman-like detail, since the ones making the most noise have so little credibility on COVID-related subjects, but I’m open to factual evidence presented in good faith.

    You don’t have to go full Sammy. There’s this thing called google, if you type in something like “Cuomo lied nursing home” you’ll get all sorts of links to articles from different sources. Or don’t. Willful ignorance is a good look.

    frosty (f27e97)

  161. Far-right movements including QAnon, virus skeptics linked to Newsom recall
    …….
    …….[A] Times investigation found that recall campaign leaders, seeking to capitalize on the darkening public mood, allied with radical and extreme elements early on to help collect signatures. Those included groups promoting distrust of government, science and medicine; peddlers of QAnon doomsday conspiracies; “patriots” readying for battle and one organization allied with the far-right extremist group, the Proud Boys.

    The recall gave those fringe factions a higher profile and a shared villain. They helped energize the campaign with large and often inflammatory rallies over masks, in support of Trump and against the election they falsely say was stolen from the former president — ripe venues to harvest petition signatures.

    Many supporters of the recall are not extremists and may not be aware of the far-right groups involved with the effort…….

    “Do we have to denounce everybody that is involved to move it forward?” the official proponent of the recall drive, a retired sheriff’s sergeant from Yolo County named Orrin Heatlie, asked The Times.

    “Or do we just move forward and ignore those other elements?”

    ………The Times found:

    >Hardline activists from the anti-vaccination movement. Two leaders, Denise Aguilar and Tara Thornton with the Freedom Angels, organized and participated in numerous rallies at the state Capitol that promoted the recall effort. At these events, speakers denounced vaccines and health orders. The Proud Boys, who have been involved in protest violence, from street brawls in Sacramento to the incursion of the nation’s Capitol, are also often present. Aguilar has said they provided security.

    >The recall campaign itself provided a safe harbor for the propaganda and violent rhetoric that riled the Republican voter base and spilled over into the Capitol riot. An organizer in El Dorado County is a Three Percenter — an anti-government extremist movement, according to the Anti-Defamation League. Until social media crackdowns and questions from reporters at The Times, the recall’s ostensibly bipartisan Facebook pages repeated the surreal conspiracies of QAnon as fact and asserted the national election was rigged despite all evidence to the contrary. Those pages have also likened the daily disruptions of COVID-19 to the Holocaust and the governor to Hitler, framing their struggles as if they were on par with the massacre of 6 million Jews.

    Recall officials ……all said it is unfair to hold the campaign accountable for the individual actions of its volunteers and supporters, and they are unable to monitor where signatures are gathered.

    “You cannot control a movement,” said Randy Economy, a veteran political consultant who is the recall’s senior advisor and chief publicist. “It’s not our job to manage what somebody says about the recall at a public event.”
    ……..
    Heatlie also said he monitors all of his organization’s Facebook pages and has rules forbidding posts about federal politics or personal views, though The Times found multiple examples of such messaging across groups. Some included misinformation from QAnon — a nonsensical mythos that Trump was fighting a secret war with deep state occults who traffic children, and would declare martial law with executions.

    These include posts from San Diego that carried the QAnon motto, W1GWGA (where one goes, we go all). Other posts depict Newsom as Adolf Hitler and compare pandemic restrictions to the rise of the Third Reich.
    ………
    Strident language has become more common in the recall as the pandemic progresses, with the Freedom Angels one group turning up the temperature. The group first gained prominence in California opposing laws that require vaccinations for public school attendance, which they claim is an overreach of government authority. With the pandemic, two leaders of the Freedom Angels splintered off to join those opposed to COVID-19 closure and stay-at-home orders.

    The splinter group also recently started an all-female militia, and advertises seminars on social media on how to target local health department officials, including staging nonviolent actions at officials’ private homes.
    ………
    Heatlie said he became concerned about the Freedom Angels in May, after an unruly Capitol rally in which 32 people, including Aguilar and Thornton, were detained by the California Highway Patrol. But despite his misgivings, Heatlie agreed to appear on a Freedom Angels webcast in June, on the day the Secretary of State’s office approved his petitions for circulation. And later in the month, Heatlie’s recall campaign called on supporters to attend a Freedom Angels rally at the Sacramento courthouse to support those who had been arrested during demonstrations.
    ……….
    Heatlie said he cut formal ties with the Freedom Angels in July, but acknowledged that signature gatherers continue to frequent events featuring or arranged by the group.
    ………
    Robin McCrea, chief financial officer for the recall and one of its founding members, posted memes and comments on a personal social media page disputing the election. “PEVERT (sic) Quid Pro Joe Corrupt Beijing Biden will NEVER be the President of Patriots…NEVER,” she wrote in one. Later that day, she posted false assertions that the Jan. 6 riot at the Capitol was the work of anti-fascist activists, another conspiracy theory that quickly took hold after the insurgency.

    McCrea said via email that she stands by her views.
    ………
    …….[O]ne prominent Republican analyst said few should be shocked that the recall has extremists and conspiracy theorists.

    “That’s become mainstream Republican politics,” said Mike Madrid, a former state Republican Party political director who co-founded The Lincoln Project, a political action committee of Republicans aligned against Trump.

    “It used to be low taxes,” Madrid said. “It is now white grievance.”

    Rip Murdock (cc5a6a)

  162. I will probably start becoming political again, registering voters and getting them to the polls, for the democrats. I’ve worked elections outside of Texas, but never in. I still support Abbott, but I want to get invovled with the Democrat primaries so they don’t run a bozo like Beto for Senate.

    The nation is changing, and Trump’s four year hissy fit didn’t change that. Conservatives should try to find their place. It’s not in the GOP. Making the democratic party more moderate is more impact than conservatives have had in the GOP. Trump’s fans are gloating, even though Biden is president and Trump is a defendant. They probably are getting sick of all this winning.

    Hope everyone’s staying warm today!

    Dustin (4237e0)

  163. I’m open to factual evidence presented in good faith.

    Willful ignorance is a good look.

    Open, and still waiting.

    I did actually read about what you call a lie about nursing home deaths. In fact, New York reported everyone who died in a nursing home as … dying in a nursing home … and reported everyone who died in a hospital as … dying in a hospital. There was also no “cover-up” because the state’s website with the information always made clear that the reported number did not include people who died outside of a facility.

    The state did not keep official statistics on whether someone who died in a hospital was originally infected in a nursing home, and it was only after months of research (by Cuomo’s administration) that the corresponding numbers recently became available. It showed that the previous estimate was low by about 30% (or, equivalently, the actual number was 43% higher than previously estimated). There was no “undercount” of the total number of deaths, only a difference in the fraction attributed to nursing homes.

    So to summarize what I’ve learned: The original political attacks against Cuomo were baseless. In response, he defended his policies by accurately citing the best available statistics tabulated by the state, until his administration compiled more accurate numbers through extensive research and interviews, and released them a couple weeks ago.

    Dave (1bb933)

  164. Paul and Dustin in their comments are making statements that are simply not true.

    What did I say that was “simply not true”, frosty? Are you seriously claiming that his death on January 7th had nothing to do with his physical confrontation with MAGA domestic terrorists the day before? That it was all a big coincidence? If you are making that claim, then I’ll just that that’s simply not true.

    Paul Montagu (77c694)

  165. with mr soon to be president again even though he technically still is donald winning is winning and losing is winning too because he says so

    thats the beauty of it mr dustin

    Dave (1bb933)

  166. You are right, Dave, Cuomo is a true hero. He sent the COVID-infected elderly back to their nursing homes to be comfortable and spread the virus before they died. But he didn’t report it accurately because he was just following the rules, probably set up by a Republican governor years ago and enforced by a conservative state bureaucrat.

    He deserves the Emmy and more for bringing to light how all of the deaths and under-reporting and coverups were Trump’s fault.

    Hoi Polloi (139bf6)

  167. Frosty doesn’t get a lot of responses, so he stamps his feet to get responses. I guess saying something interesting is hard for him.

    Dustin (4237e0)

  168. Are you seriously claiming that his death on January 7th had nothing to do with his physical confrontation with MAGA domestic terrorists the day before? That it was all a big coincidence? If you are making that claim, then I’ll just that that’s simply not true.

    From what I have read, investigators have not determined his cause of death. So why don’t both sides calm down and let science figure it out.

    Hoi Polloi (139bf6)

  169. with mr soon to be president again even though he technically still is donald winning is winning and losing is winning too because he says so

    thats the beauty of it mr dustin

    Dave (1bb933) — 2/14/2021 @ 9:34 am

    The nursery rhymes about Trump in 100 years will be hilarious because of this stuff. He will probably be remembered for centuries for the lessons he offers toddlers.

    Dustin (4237e0)

  170. From what I have read, investigators have not determined his cause of death. So why don’t both sides calm down and let science figure it out.

    Hoi Polloi (139bf6) — 2/14/2021 @ 9:35 am

    You’re saying the riots that brutally harmed hundreds of officers might not have anyting to do with this one cop’s death. I hope you’re not one of these Trump fans who pisses yourself about antifa all the time. I thought you were one of the smart people I just happened to disagree with, but this line of reasoning is beyond stupid, and is simply cheapening a human life in service to a loser politician who despises you.

    Dustin (4237e0)

  171. They didn’t argue the law or facts. They spent all their time telling you about their feelings and it made them look weak.

    Frosty, apparently we were watching two different presentations. I agree the one you describe sounds terrible, but as a Democrat I’m happy that wasn’t the one I saw in the real world. I do note the curious Trumpian obsession with not looking “weak”

    And now for something more amusing, cats singing about impeachment:

    https://youtu.be/Dc09A6BKxhs

    Victor (4959fb)

  172. Also, this.

    Although the text does not explain how Sicknick died, Ken Sicknick is certain that his brother perished protecting the Capitol that day.

    “He spent his life trying to help other people,” Sicknick’s brother insisted. “This political climate got my brother killed.”

    “This political climate” being Trump’s assembly of his devoted followers and his provoking this domestic terrorist attack that Sicknick was charged with defending.

    Paul Montagu (77c694)

  173. You mean the video where they edited out the peaceful comment?

    Do you mean the rant where Trump said “fight” 20 times, mostly after the once-used word “peacefully”? The rant where he exhorted people to “fight like hell” near the end?

    The video “edited out” a lot of incendiary things that Trump said on January 6, and before that.

    I think it was Michael Cohen (who knows Trump very well) who said that putting in the word “peacefully” is the kind of thing Trump does to give himself cover later on. The Trump apologists fell for it, or else they’re pretending to be gullible, because the whole weight of evidence against Trump is so damning, including two months of riling up outrage and bringing the mob to D.C. on the day the election was to be certified, and interfering with the rally permit that was supposed to be for the Ellipse only, not a march to the Capitol.

    The mob heard everything. They didn’t cherry-pick and decide that one utterance of “peacefully” canceled out everything else. They knew that the opportunities for “peacefully” objecting to the election were already past.

    If Trump had sincerely wanted nothing but a “peaceful” rally, he would have appealed to his mob to stop the violence once it began. He would have authorized more security a lot sooner. He wouldn’t have praised the rioters and justified their actions subsequently. He would later, on reflection, have exhibited some remorse or at least regret about what happened when his fans took his words seriously. He has not done so.

    Radegunda (20775b)

  174. Radegunda – thanks for taking the time to make that reply.

    Victor (4959fb)

  175. If Trump had sincerely wanted nothing but a “peaceful” rally, he would have appealed to his mob to stop the violence once it began.

    Instead he had scheduled a riot watch party and all his family were dancing around, totally shocked that the people Trump told to come stop the steal were trying to stop the elector count by sacking the building Trump ordered them to go to. And then Trump started naming Pence for retribution. Go get ‘im!

    It’s pure trolling to even suggest Trump didn’t do it. The GOP’s defense was that he can’t be held accountable anymore, not that he didn’t do it.

    Dustin (4237e0)

  176. As COVID variants spread, Florida refuses to release data
    …….
    Since Jan. 7 — one week after a COVID variant first found in the United Kingdom was detected in Martin County — the Florida Department of Health has ignored repeated inquiries about which other counties had confirmed the presence of the strain.

    During that time, reported cases of the mutation spiraled to 347 as of Friday — over twice as many as the next closest state, California, which has 159. And the secrecy has continued without explanation, despite ongoing updates from the federal Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, which has reported state-by-state totals for much of the nation.
    ………
    Florida health officials have made much of the data surrounding COVID-19 public from almost the start, including daily case numbers, deaths and the percent of COVID tests that turn up positive.

    “On the one hand, I think it’s very impressive the amount of data and the speed at which the data is released every single day,” said Dr. Mary Jo Trepka, who chairs the Department of Epidemiology at Florida International University. “They process, literally, hundreds of thousands of pieces of data.”

    But the DeSantis administration has at times worked to prevent the release of important public health information, including, initially, the list of nursing homes where residents had died from COVID-19. And it took a lawsuit filed by attorneys for the Orlando Sentinel to force the release of weekly reports sent to Florida from former President Donald Trump’s White House Coronavirus Task Force.

    One of those reports, dated Jan. 17 but not released for more than a week, warned that the U.K. variant was likely more widespread than data would suggest and that Florida officials should take action immediately — “before an increase in hospitalizations is seen” — including through a campaign with retailers reminding customers to wear masks and “substantially” curtailing or closing public indoor spaces where masks can’t be worn continually.

    The state did not adopt the recommendations, and DeSantis has rejected any attempt to further curtail business or tourism, instead focusing on getting everyone 65 and older vaccinated.
    ……..
    Looks like DeSantis has his own COVID coverup going on.

    Rip Murdock (259fcd)

  177. Sicknick obviously died “with” the riot, not “of” the riot.

    Davethulhu (6ba00b)

  178. He will probably be remembered for centuries for the lessons he offers toddlers.

    And rightfully so!

    He was the most powerful toddler in history, after all.

    Dave (1bb933)

  179. https://legalinsurrection.com/2021/02/no-one-is-good-enough-for-the-left-week-in-higher-education/

    While those on the left continue to try and distract and make everything about the last President, real harm is being done to our society.

    According to the campus left, the niece of Dr. Martin Luther King Jr. is guilty of wrongthink.

    Students at Catholic Georgetown U. Protest Appearance by MLK’s Pro-Life Niece
    Meanwhile…

    Middlebury College Hosts Event to ‘Demilitarize White Bodies’ to Make Them ‘Human’
    Elon U. Hosts Whites-Only Caucus to ‘Process Their Awareness of and Complicity’ in Racism
    California Proposed Ethnic Studies Curriculum A Subterfuge For Anti-American And Anti-Zionist Activism

    This ideology is not seeking to coexist. It wants to supplant.

    New Report Says Boise State University is Being Overrun by Social Justice Ideology
    Cancel culture is part of the plan.

    Cancel Culture Has Now Come to the U.S. Naval Academy
    Student Activists Target DePaul University Prof for Cancellation
    U. Tennessee Grad Student Fights Back After School Tries to Expel Her for Social Media Posts

    You guys are going too far left, says… France.

    France sees foreign threat: “out-of-control woke leftism of American campuses and its attendant cancel culture”
    Compare and contrast.

    Former U. Florida Researcher Indicted for Hiding Alleged Ties to Government of China
    University of Michigan Demanding $1,200 in Fees for China Related Research Documents
    Biden Administration Drops Trump Plan to Track Campus ‘Confucius Institutes’

    We demand that you make us do something.

    Students at Harvard’s Kennedy School Demand Mandatory Anti-Racism Courses
    The cause is a real mystery.

    Remote Learning Reportedly Leads to Spike in Cheating

    All links are at Legal Insurrection.

    NJRob (eb56c3)

  180. @155

    Cuomo is a “look over there”. The corrupt criminal traitor Trump, in collusion with Putin to destroy the economies of the United States, China, and Europe, has murdered 488,000 Americans to date. Now that the politicians have had their circus, they should step out of the way and let the professionals of law enforcement, counter-intelligence, and criminal justice try him, convict him, and apply the appropriate penalties.

    nk (1d9030) — 2/14/2021 @ 7:09 am

    Trump’s not in office anymore.

    If there are state/federal crimes, of course those should be pursued. (I mean, NY was supposed to have a sh!tload ready to go… where are they?)

    However, Cuomo is still in office and should definitely face accountability.

    Just was we must focus our energies to rightly oppose any wacked things the Biden administration does.

    whembly (c30c83)

  181. It’s pure trolling to even suggest Trump didn’t do it.

    I would say it’s “blithely waving away substantive facts with sheer effontery.” (H/T to Victor)

    Radegunda (20775b)

  182. @107

    Are you seriously claiming that his death on January 7th had nothing to do with his physical confrontation with MAGA domestic terrorists the day before? That it was all a big coincidence? If you are making that claim, then I’ll just that that’s simply not true.

    From what I have read, investigators have not determined his cause of death. So why don’t both sides calm down and let science figure it out.

    Hoi Polloi (139bf6) — 2/14/2021 @ 9:35 am

    The ME report is under wraps at the moment.

    However, there’s no further investigation, unless there are some videos they haven’t discovered yet because he’s already cremated.

    whembly (c30c83)

  183. That should be @170 not @107.

    whembly (c30c83)

  184. https://fee.org/articles/david-mamet-explains-what-happens-when-the-experts-fail/

    “What happens when the most respected authorities get it wrong and ruin lives and economies?” he asks.

    The answer? Not much.

    Mamet traces the history of several powerful people―from Frederick Lindemann, a key advisor to Winston Churchill, to Trofim Lysenko, Joseph Stalin’s science advisor―whose decisions led to catastrophe.

    Lysenko, for example, believed plants could be re-educated, just like people. He believed that peas and wheat could be grown in the harsh Eurasian winters, and his ideas—tragically—were eventually adopted by the Soviet Union.

    “The Soviet ministry of agriculture, acting on Lysenko’s bogus theories, managed to ruin crops all over Eurasia and starve as many as 10 million people,” Mamet writes. “Later his ideas influenced agriculture policy in Mao’s China and killed several million more.”

    Despite the atrocity, Lysenko was not banished, imprisoned, or executed (as one might expect in the USSR in the 1920s and 1930s). Instead, he thrived.

    By 1940 Lysenko was the director of the Institute of Genetics at the USSR’s Academy of Sciences, where he’d use his political power to suppress dissent and imprison his critics. By 1948 Lysenko was “the total autocrat of Soviet biology” and his ideas had become scientific dogma, even as they got crazier.

    “[Lysenko] claimed that wheat plants raised in the appropriate environment produce seeds of rye, which is equivalent to saying that dogs living in the wild give birth to foxes,” notes Britannica Online. “His fundamental, continuing argument was that theoretical biology must be fused with Soviet agricultural practice.”

    Despite the lunacy of his ideas, which resulted in millions of deaths, Lysenko outlived Stalin and held power throughout the reign of Nikita Khrushchev.

    Read the rest and how it ties in to today’s society.

    NJRob (eb56c3)

  185. @NJRob@181 Most those are basically OTHER PEOPLE THINK DIFFERENTLY THAN ME AND I HATE IT!!! which is the exact same thing the articles are criticizing the students, etc for.

    Nic (896fdf)

  186. He sent the COVID-infected elderly back to their nursing homes to be comfortable and spread the virus before they died.

    False. His order didn’t “send” anybody anywhere. And the people who returned to nursing homes were certified medically stable by their doctors before they did so, and didn’t die. It seems you can’t even state the most basic facts honestly.

    But he didn’t report it accurately because he was just following the rules, probably set up by a Republican governor years ago and enforced by a conservative state bureaucrat.

    False. The number of deaths in nursing homes, and the total number of deaths, were both reported accurately.

    He deserves the Emmy and more for bringing to light how all of the deaths and under-reporting and coverups were Trump’s fault.

    Cool story.

    The two months Trump and his knob-polishers wasted by lying to people about rainbows and unicorns (remember, Woodward caught him on tape admitting that his public assurances were intentional lies) undoubtedly cost more lives than anything Cuomo did.

    I’m genuinely curious what compels you to lie so much.

    Dave (1bb933)

  187. @188 Dave, there are oodles of reports that “…the governor’s top aide admitted that data was withheld on nursing homes, where more than 10,000 New Yorkers have died during the pandemic.”
    https://www.nytimes.com/2021/02/12/nyregion/new-york-nursing-homes-cuomo.html

    I dunno about you, but indicative that something stinks and we need answers.

    whembly (c30c83)

  188. Until JVW posts another anti-Newsom manifesto (it feels like we’re overdue…) I remain unclear what Newsom did that merits recalling him.

    Maybe you should ask people outside your immediate circle.

    Among other things he has been erratic in his ukases, ignored the rules himself, lied about ignoring the rules himself, and really cannot show any noticable results for the pain he demanded others accept.

    And he hasn’t cancelled the money-pit train. Just think what $100 billion might have done for places with actual transit problems instead of this “pretend we’re Europe” boondoggle in search of a mission.

    The only reason the incompetent Democrats control California is that the GOP is both worse and incompetent.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  189. https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021-02-14/biden-calls-on-congress-to-enact-commonsense-gun-law-reforms

    President Joe Biden called on Congress to move forward on gun-reform legislation, including a ban on assault weapons, in a bid to help prevent another mass shooting in the U.S.

    “I am calling on Congress to enact commonsense gun law reforms, including requiring background checks on all gun sales, banning assault weapons and high-capacity magazines, and eliminating immunity for gun manufacturers who knowingly put weapons of war on our streets,” Biden said in a statement issued by the White House.

    It’s what many voted for, right? Destroy businesses that produce weapons for self-defense so we can all be meek and docile and live under the Democrat regime forever.

    NJRob (eb56c3)

  190. If Trump had sincerely wanted nothing but a “peaceful” rally, he would have appealed to his mob to stop the violence once it began.

    I think it’s more than that. If Trump wanted a “peaceful” rally, he would not have spent the prior two months ginning up more anger from an already angry base by manipulatively feeding them non-stop lies about how the election was stolen from him *and them* and how it was up to the Trumpers to “save America” and “stop the steal”. No, if he wanted to ensure a peaceful rally, he would have appealed to his mob two months earlier. He used that time to ramp up the anger and vitriol, and belief that Trumpers had been intentionally and deceptively lied to about the election.

    Dana (fd537d)

  191. The charge against Cuomo, as I understand it

    You don’t understand it. The charge is that, AFTER Covid patients were transferred to nursing homes, the death rates there skyrocketed and he covered it up. Bad as they were as reported, they were far worse in actuality.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  192. Most those are basically OTHER PEOPLE THINK DIFFERENTLY THAN ME AND I HATE IT!!! which is the exact same thing the articles are criticizing the students, etc for.

    Nic (896fdf) — 2/14/2021 @ 11:22 am

    Mao thanks you for supporting his American branch of the Red Guard.

    NJRob (eb56c3)

  193. It’s not a good week to be a D.

    It’s a worse week to be a apologist for treason.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  194. Looks like DeSantis has his own COVID coverup going on.

    For the time being I will accept his “incompetence” defense.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  195. Jake Tapper’s interview with CDC chief Dr. Rochelle Walensky and this have got to be so frustrating for parent and student alike.

    Dana (fd537d)

  196. I have no interest in defending Cuomo. He’s just another New York sewer rat to me. I only object to using him as a squirrel for Trump’s crimes.

    nk (1d9030)

  197. And he hasn’t cancelled the money-pit train. Just think what $100 billion might have done for places with actual transit problems instead of this “pretend we’re Europe” boondoggle in search of a mission.

    Because the “train to nowhere” was established by the legislature, Newsom doesn’t have the authority to end it unilaterally. So even if he is recalled and Richard Grennell is elected, the project will survive.

    Rip Murdock (259fcd)

  198. Agree that Cuomo should be held accountable. And that has nothing to do with him being in office today. No one would even bring that up except the gop is pretending this is an element of all admin crimes now.

    None of y’all said Lois Lerner or Hillary should get a pass if they retire.

    We’ll see how bad this week was for the gop in the next election. So far Biden is not a great leader… Only good in comparison. But that old binary choice ain’t no joke.

    Dustin (4237e0)

  199. Paul Montagu (77c694) — 2/14/2021 @ 9:30 am

    What did I say that was “simply not true”, frosty? Are you seriously claiming that his death on January 7th had nothing to do with his physical confrontation with MAGA domestic terrorists the day before? That it was all a big coincidence? If you are making that claim, then I’ll just that that’s simply not true.

    I’m claiming we don’t know the cause of death because we don’t have an official cause of death and I’m claiming that anyone “claiming” otherwise is making things up to fit the reality they want. Do you have any actual evidence his death was related to anything that happened on the 6th? If so the DOJ would like your help because they’re having trouble building a case.

    frosty (f27e97)

  200. Far-right movements including QAnon, virus skeptics linked to Newsom recall

    Hard-left movements, such as A.N.S.W.E.R., and anything AOC is involved in, are linked to Democrat Party. It’s just what happens.

    The Newsom recall has been run by people like Carl DeMaio, a moderate (and gay) Republican from San Diego, who sadly came in third in the 2020 House jungle primary.

    https://timesofsandiego.com/politics/2019/03/15/recall-gov-newsom-carl-demaios-reform-california-pac-seeks-funds-for-poll/

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  201. While those on the left continue to try and distract and make everything about the last President, real harm is being done to our society.

    Holding the last president accountable for trying to force his way into a second term after being voted out by the American people — and sending a clear message that it would be wrong for someone else (including a president you dislike) to try the same in the future — is not making everything about the last president.

    But it’s a shame that a vindictive sociopath with an overtly self-centered moral code was made the public face of resistance to the noxious elements of left-wing identity politics — which has made it much harder to claim the moral high ground for the resistance. Many of the people who decry “cancel culture” have spent the last 4-5 years constantly defending someone who believes that any criticism of himself is morally wrong and that any unflattering reporting about him is “fake news,” and who has boasted about the very stringent nondisclosure agreements requires people to sign. (Even hospital personnel who treated him for Covid.)

    Every principle that the people at Legal Insurrection (or Power Line, etc.) claim to stand for is now wrapped in the image of Donald Trump. And that’s not a good look.

    Radegunda (20775b)

  202. I only object to using him as a squirrel for Trump’s crimes.

    Pretty sure that no one in NY or elsewhere (other than those who have “Trump 2024” on their bumpers) find the two cases too much to handle separately. Maybe they can be cellmates.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  203. Because the “train to nowhere” was established by the legislature, Newsom doesn’t have the authority to end it unilaterally.

    He should talk to Obama, who had no problem “waiving” legislative directives. “Emergency Covid funding requirements” for example. Of course, someone could have put cancellation on the ballot, so there’s that.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  204. @198

    I have no interest in defending Cuomo. He’s just another New York sewer rat to me. I only object to using him as a squirrel for Trump’s crimes.

    nk (1d9030) — 2/14/2021 @ 11:39 am

    Trump’s been through 2 impeachments, lost an election, lost a lot of money on his family business, facing criminal inquiries from the States, and maybe go through another congressional hearing for sedition. To say that he hasn’t faced any accountibility is a stretch. Whether he learns/adapts post-sanctions I wouldn’t bet money on that.

    However, Cuomo really hasn’t faced any sort of accountability here and for most of the last year, he was herald by the media as some savior. Which is just as much as an indictment of the media as it is for Cuomo.

    whembly (c30c83)

  205. trying to force his way into a second term after being voted out by the American people

    Had he succeeded, I would hope the military would have intervened. “All enemies, foreign and domestic.” It was that terrible.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  206. @206.

    This.

    Trump may yet face federal criminal charges in DC. Insurrection, sedition and treason are all federal crimes.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  207. However, Cuomo really hasn’t faced any sort of accountability here and for most of the last year, he was herald by the media as some savior. Which is just as much as an indictment of the media as it is for Cuomo.

    whembly (c30c83) — 2/14/2021 @ 11:49 am

    Not unfair at all (seriously).

    Dustin (4237e0)

  208. Looks like DeSantis has his own COVID coverup going on.

    For the time being I will accept his “incompetence” defense.

    Deliberately withholding data isn’t incompetence, it’s deliberate. And then there is his vindictive persecution of whistleblower Rebekah Jones, who refused to manipulate Florida’s COVID-19 data.

    Rip Murdock (259fcd)

  209. @NJRob@194. Ooooo, the communism words. I should be super scared you used the communism words. Those are the best words to use when you have no counter because they were super scary 50 years ago. Ooooo.

    Nic (896fdf)

  210. What happens when the most respected authorities get it wrong and ruin lives and economies?” he asks.

    Read the rest and how it ties in to today’s society.

    In today’s society, a large portion of the people saying “The experts are wrong!” are the same people who’ve been saying we should trust … Donald Trump. Or they’ve been presenting their own personal wisdom in general-purpose punditry (perhaps fortified by a law degree) as more trustworthy than the particular knowledge of epidemiologists on a contagious disease.

    When those pundits are soon shown to have been spectacularly wrong in their predictions, while the epidemiologists were pretty close to the mark, do the pundits then admit their own error?

    No, they just move on to a new installment of the “experts are wrong!” series. Unlike the experts, they don’t have to be right. They only have to grab attention.

    Radegunda (20775b)

  211. It’s what many voted for, right? Destroy businesses that produce weapons for self-defense so we can all be meek and docile and live under the Democrat regime forever.
    NJRob (eb56c3) — 2/14/2021 @ 11:29 am

    Remember when Joe advised Americans to protect themselves by firing a shotgun through their closed front door to keep out an intruder?

    Good times…

    Hoi Polloi (139bf6)

  212. You’re saying the riots that brutally harmed hundreds of officers might not have anyting to do with this one cop’s death. I hope you’re not one of these Trump fans who pisses yourself about antifa all the time. I thought you were one of the smart people I just happened to disagree with, but this line of reasoning is beyond stupid, and is simply cheapening a human life in service to a loser politician who despises you.

    Don’t get your undies in a twist. The autopsy shows know signs of blunt force trauma, so the story that he was bludgeoned with a fire extinguisher is false. The current story is that his death came from being exposed to bear spray. We will have to wait for the facts to come out if this is true as well.

    I always thought you were somewhat smart. Sounds like you are not, as you are ready to run to court and charge anyone and everyone with the officer’s death, even though we don’t know how exactly he died.

    In fact, you sound quite…political.

    That usually doesn’t go so well in court.

    Hoi Polloi (139bf6)

  213. 151. Kevin M (ab1c11) — 2/13/2021 @ 11:26 pm

    The CA media has convinced the voters that the Democrats ARE the center and those gay-hating, white-supremacist Republicans want to put women back in chains.

    No, it’s not women they want to put back in chains. It’s illegal immigrants. And not just illegal immigrants, but people whose parents were, or are, illegal immigrants even if they themselves were born in the United States. Their friends, their classmates, their co-workers, their fellow church go-ers, their faithful employees, and old people who have lived decades in the United States.

    And the mainstream media doesn’t need to say that – the Republicans themselves shout it from the rooftops, as does right wing talk radio.

    Now to this will be added Republicans not willing to be honest about elections or trusted not to help Republicans cheat.

    And then the Democrats say the Republicans want to take away people’s ability to vote.

    And they accuse Republicans of racism, when it is really geographicalism. Because they don’t want to come out against geographicalism, they misrepresent it. and the Republicans don’t want to say:

    “We’re not racists! We’re something similar, but different.”

    Suffice it to say: The Republican Party is ballot box poison, and getting worse all the time, but won’t go away.

    Sammy Finkelman (00fff5)

  214. In other news, the little Pollois told me Disney fired an actress from The Mandalorian because Disney didn’t like her tweets.

    I find this a bit odd as Disney gave a shout-out to the Chinese Communist Party for allowing Disney to shoot their Mulan reboot in western China. The same province when Uighurs are living in camps.

    Strange.

    They care more about one actress than millions of lives. I can’t imagine the actress tweeted anything worse than what the Chinese are doing to the Uighurs.

    Hoi Polloi (139bf6)

  215. Kevin M (ab1c11) — 2/14/2021 @ 11:31 am

    It’s a worse week to be a apologist for treason.

    This is just hyperbole and it doesn’t suit you. Do you expect anyone to take this sort of backhanded insult seriously?

    Who’s being an apologist? Is calling that clown show of an impeachment hearing a joke being an apologist? If that’s the best we can get from D leadership we’re all doomed. If you want to be mad be mad at people who couldn’t do better than lie and hide information during an impeachment hearing.

    frosty (f27e97)

  216. Do you have any actual evidence his death was related to anything that happened on the 6th?

    I’ve already said once that we don’t know what’s in the autopsy, but I don’t accept that it was a coincidence that he died the day after the riot. Occam’s Razor and all that, and the bear spray shot into face didn’t spray itself. Bottom line, no invite by Trump, no violent insurrection, no dead Sicknick. Even his brother said something to that effect.
    This meme has been percolating in the right-wing comment sections for weeks, that, because he wasn’t hit in the head with a fire extinguisher, Trump and his MAGA terrorist gang are blameless for his death. I call bullsh-t on that. It’s an excuse to absolve Trump and his rioters’ from responsibility for his death. IMO, they are responsible, especially Trump. They’re complicit.

    Paul Montagu (77c694)

  217. I heard someone say today that the worst thing Cuomo may have is misled federal communicable disease officials, causing them perhaps not to issue good warnings, but I don’t know if he did.

    There was some talk in Albany (by Republicans) of impeaching Cuomo but more likely is that his emergency powers may be reduced, if they can figure out just how to do it.

    Sammy Finkelman (00fff5)

  218. What I don’t understand is what, under the best possible argument for Trump, his speech to the crowd, and his urging them to walk to the Capitol was supposed to accomplish? Is the theory that he really wanted them to just gather quietly on the other side of the meager barrier on the hill and yell impotently at the Capitol where Congresspeople in soundproofed chambers would have continued on, oblivious? His claim was that they were there to “stop the steal” and that this could actually be accomplished. There is no way to square that goal with a peaceful bit of distance yelling. The insurrection was deranged but at least it had a weird pathway to success. A “peaceful” protest would have meant nothing.

    Given how stupid, reckless and short sighted Trump is, the real answer probably is that he just knew that if set chaos loose, he might somehow benefit, and would be at least better off than he was. Not much of an argument for his qualities as president.

    As for one more reason to keep Republicans out of power, the lickspittle Graham is darkly warning that the moment they get back in power there will be various forms of deranged payback:

    “And if you use this model, I don’t know how Kamala Harris doesn’t get impeached if the Republicans take over the House,” Graham said.

    “Because she actually bailed out rioters and one of the rioters went back to the streets and broke somebody’s head open. So we’ve opened Pandora’s Box here and I’m sad for the country.”

    While Harris tweeted support of the Minnesota Freedom Fund in June, there is no evidence that she bailed anyone out.

    In addition, while Graham dangled the idea of impeachment for Harris because of her tweet, he insisted that Trump bore no responsibility for his actions on Jan. 6 that led a mob to storm the U.S. Capitol to stop the certification of President Joe Biden’s election victory.

    https://www.thedailybeast.com/lindsey-graham-predicts-kamala-harris-impeachment-if-gop-retakes-house?ref=home

    Victor (4959fb)

  219. Deliberately withholding data isn’t incompetence, it’s deliberate.

    Can you show that he has it?

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  220. This is just hyperbole and it doesn’t suit you. Do you expect anyone to take this sort of backhanded insult seriously?

    Trump raised an army, fielded it on Jan 6th and sent it to attack the US Congress. That is waging war against the country and its constitution and it is quite literally TREASON.

    It’s not hyperbole at all.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  221. Because the “train to nowhere” was established by the legislature, Newsom doesn’t have the authority to end it unilaterally.

    He should talk to Obama, who had no problem “waiving” legislative directives. “Emergency Covid funding requirements” for example. Of course, someone could have put cancellation on the ballot, so there’s that.

    I have no quarrel with you regarding high speed rail, it is a solution in search of a problem. However, comparing it to the pandemic is silly, and presidents have different authorities than governors. The last attempt to repeal high speed rail failed in 2018. It was part of the failed attempt to repeal the gas tax increase. Carl DeMaio headed that too.

    As an aside, the Republican governors of Florida and Texas appear not to have a problem with high speed rail (though it looks like the Texas project won’t be running any time soon).

    Rip Murdock (259fcd)

  222. …Cuomo… He’s just another New York sewer rat to me. I only object to using him as a squirrel for Trump’s crimes.

    Speaking for myself, but I am able to focus on more than one thing/person at a time.

    Dana (fd537d)

  223. Kevin M (ab1c11) — 2/14/2021 @ 11:52 am

    Trump may yet face federal criminal charges in DC. Insurrection, sedition and treason are all federal crimes.

    I hate to pour cold water but this is a pie in the sky wish. This idea that there’s still one more thing that will “get Trump” is starting to sound like “trust the plan” Q nonsense.

    You’d be better off going back to the original tax fraud stuff.

    frosty (f27e97)

  224. @121-
    Read the article. The state is not providing what should be a public record, is the state providing it to counties.

    Rip Murdock (259fcd)

  225. That should be #221 Kevin M (ab1c11) — 2/14/2021 @ 12:15 pm.

    Rip Murdock (259fcd)

  226. Kevin M (ab1c11) — 2/14/2021 @ 12:17 pm

    Trump raised an army, fielded it on Jan 6th and sent it to attack the US Congress. That is waging war against the country and its constitution and it is quite literally TREASON.

    It’s not hyperbole at all.

    This is pure fantasy. Putting it in all caps doesn’t help it look more reasonable. So, yes, it’s not hyperbole at all, I suppose. It’s something else entirely.

    frosty (f27e97)

  227. @Sammy@215 I have no evidence I have any undocumented students. I’m sure they are all documented. And that is what I would say to anyone who wanted me to report undocumented students to ICE, as has been suggested in the past. You can’t win an argument that rests on the idea that teachers need to report children to the police.

    @Hoi@216. Please. Disney doesn’t actually care about politics, they care about money. The Chinese government allows them to make a very large amount of money from Chinese citizens, so they aren’t against them. They fired the actress from the Mandalorian because they thought she’d cost them money more than keeping the character would make them. It’s all financial.

    Nic (896fdf)

  228. Paul Montagu (77c694) — 2/14/2021 @ 12:11 pm

    I’ve already said once that we don’t know what’s in the autopsy,

    Bottom line, everything after this is speculation and opinion.

    IMO, they are responsible, especially Trump. They’re complicit.

    Exactly, in your opinion.

    frosty (f27e97)

  229. As an aside, the Republican governors of Florida and Texas appear not to have a problem with high speed rail (though it looks like the Texas project won’t be running any time soon).

    High-speed rail between LA and Las Vegas might have made sense, but the LA-SF transportation market is saturated already and the land in between isn’t empty. California’s environmental laws make any large project hideously expensive anyway, feeding legions of consultants and/or political clients.

    Texas might benefit, depends on the cities. Don’t know about Florida. Problem is that self-driving electric cars are a better solution, at least for the traveler, and will be a reality before any such project is done.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  230. This is pure fantasy.

    OK, denier, not apologist. Which part of “Trump raised an army, fielded it on Jan 6th and sent it to attack the US Congress” do you think is false?

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  231. Bottom line, no invite by Trump, no violent insurrection, no dead Sicknick.

    You can’t say that. If he had an underlying condition – say a cardiac one – getting out of bed too fast could have killed him. But we don’t know. And we won’t know until the exact cause of death is determined. Until then, it’s speculation.

    Hoi Polloi (139bf6)

  232. @217

    Kevin M (ab1c11) — 2/14/2021 @ 11:31 am

    It’s a worse week to be a apologist for treason.

    This is just hyperbole and it doesn’t suit you. Do you expect anyone to take this sort of backhanded insult seriously?

    Who’s being an apologist? Is calling that clown show of an impeachment hearing a joke being an apologist? If that’s the best we can get from D leadership we’re all doomed. If you want to be mad be mad at people who couldn’t do better than lie and hide information during an impeachment hearing.

    frosty (f27e97) — 2/14/2021 @ 12:11 pm

    Eh… I prefer this level of incompetency from the Democrats. Way better than a fully operational and compentent D leadership. 😉

    whembly (c30c83)

  233. Nic (896fdf) — 2/14/2021 @ 12:30 pm

    You can’t win an argument that rests on the idea that teachers need to report children to the police.

    Is there a limiting principle here? Should kids be reported to the police for threatening teachers or other students? What about bringing a gun to school or selling drugs?

    frosty (f27e97)

  234. This is Trump’s heaping list of legal problems post-impeachment

    ……..
    Out of office and without the protections that the presidency afforded him, Trump is now facing multiple criminal investigations, civil state inquiries and defamation lawsuits by two women accusing him of sexual assault.
    ……
    Georgia election results

    Georgia officials announced that the former President faces two new investigations over calls he made to election officials in an attempt to overturn the state’s election results.
    ……

    Business dealings in New York

    Trump also faces a criminal investigation in New York where the Manhattan District Attorney’s office is looking into whether the Trump Organization violated state laws, such as insurance fraud, tax fraud or other schemes to defraud. The scope of the investigation is broad, with prosecutors looking into, among other things, whether the Trump Organization misled financial institutions when applying for loans or violated tax laws when donating a conservation easement on its estate called Seven Springs and taking deductions on fees paid to consultants.
    …….
    New York State Attorney General Letitia James’ office is conducting a civil investigation into whether the Trump Organization inflated the values of his assets in order to secure favorable loans and insurance coverage.
    ……..
    The insurrection in Washington, DC

    In Washington, federal prosecutors investigating the January 6 insurrection at the US Capitol have signaled that no one is above the law, including Trump, and have stressed that nothing is off the table when asked if they were looking at the former President’s role in inciting violence.
    ……..
    One (defamation lawsuit) was filed by E. Jean Carroll, a former magazine columnist who accused him of rape, and another by Summer Zervos, a former contestant on “The Apprentice” who claims the President sexually assaulted her in 2007. Both women say he defamed them by saying their claims were lies.

    Carroll is seeking to depose Trump and obtain a swab of his DNA. The case was moving forward until the Justice Department under Trump attempted to intervene in the case.

    A federal judge denied the effort, and lawyers for Trump and the Justice Department appealed the ruling. It is not clear if the Biden administration will continue the appeal.

    The Zervos lawsuit, which was filed in 2017, has been on hold since last year. Trump’s lawyers had argued the US Constitution barred a sitting president from being sued in state court.
    Last week, Zervos’ lawyers filed a motion asking the appeals court to dismiss the appeal “as moot” and allow the lawsuit to move forward.
    …….
    Related:
    New York Prosecutors Investigating Trump’s Manhattan Properties
    New York prosecutors are investigating financial dealings around some of Donald Trump’s signature Manhattan properties, extending the known range of the criminal probe of the former president and his company, according to people familiar with the matter.

    The people said Manhattan prosecutors are examining loans Mr. Trump took out on his flagship Fifth Avenue building, Trump Tower; 40 Wall St., an art deco skyscraper in New York City’s Financial District; Trump International Hotel and Tower, a hotel and condominium building at Columbus Circle; and Trump Plaza, an apartment building on Manhattan’s East Side.
    ………
    In addition to the Manhattan properties, prosecutors are examining Seven Springs, a 213-acre Westchester, N.Y., estate owned by the Trump Organization. At that property, prosecutors have subpoenaed information that relates to its valuation, which has varied widely.
    ……….

    Rip Murdock (259fcd)

  235. Dave, there are oodles of reports that “…the governor’s top aide admitted that data was withheld on nursing homes, where more than 10,000 New Yorkers have died during the pandemic.”

    If you read the rest of the article, the woman who said that went on to explain:

    Early on Friday, Ms. DeRosa, the top nonelected official in the state, sought to clarify the context for her remarks. She described the administration’s delays in getting information to state lawmakers as a kind of triage, because it had needed to prioritize a response to federal authorities.

    “I was explaining that when we received the D.O.J. inquiry, we needed to temporarily set aside the Legislature’s request to deal with the federal request first,” she said. “We informed the houses of this at the time,” referring to the upper and lower chambers of the Legislature.

    She said that the administration was “comprehensive and transparent in our responses to the D.O.J., and then had to immediately focus our resources on the second wave and vaccine rollout.”

    “As I said on a call with legislators, we could not fulfill their request as quickly as anyone would have liked,” she said.

    So, in other words, they focused on responding to the Feds’ demands first.

    I dunno about you, but indicative that something stinks and we need answers.

    It helps to read the whole article and not just the click-bait.

    If Cuomo did anything illegal, he should be held accountable. Haven’t seen any credible suggestion of that yet though.

    Dave (1bb933)

  236. Kevin M (ab1c11) — 2/14/2021 @ 12:35 pm

    Which part of “Trump raised an army, fielded it on Jan 6th and sent it to attack the US Congress” do you think is false?

    Phrases like “raised an army”, “fielded it”, and “sent it to attack” mean things that aren’t supported by any facts we have. They’re very colorful and might work as a literally flourish to a well told tale but that’s all they are.

    So, all of it. They are words of fantasy and fiction. They are not grounded in reality.

    I’d also point out that you might want to pick a story and stick with it. This claim runs counter to the “incitement” claim. Now that that has gone nowhere it makes sense to switch to another claim but having laid the foundation for “incitement” you’ll need to lay a different foundation for “raise an army” before you can just start pedaling it.

    frosty (f27e97)

  237. California’s environmental laws make any large project hideously expensive anyway…..

    Most mega-projects get legislative environmental waivers, like So Fi Stadium or the proposed Clippers arena.

    Rip Murdock (259fcd)

  238. Is there a limiting principle here? Should kids be reported to the police for threatening teachers or other students? What about bringing a gun to school or selling drugs?

    I would agree that teachers should report any threat or actual violence, or conduct that threatens the health or safety of others. However, inquiring about someone’s immigration status does not rise to that level. The Fed Gov is responsible for immigration enforcement, not teachers.

    Rip Murdock (259fcd)

  239. The ol’GOP revealed: attention NeverTrumpers Shoppers in love w/posting their videoclips– clean-up on aisle Lincoln Project. Grab your mop, Davey.

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  240. Trump raised an army, fielded it on Jan 6th and sent it to attack the US Congress. That is waging war against the country and its constitution and it is quite literally TREASON.

    It’s not hyperbole at all.

    Indeed: it’s fiction.

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  241. No, DCSCA, that’s reality. You like fiction a lot and like to call it glorious when terrible things happen to this country, but it’s real. Stack this on the pile of excuses you’ve got though.

    Dustin (4237e0)

  242. DCSCA, you are the GOP. Like most of them, you’re ashamed to admit it.

    Dustin (4237e0)

  243. Frosty @ 235,

    California school employees are not required to inquire/report the immigration status of students. But children residing in the state are required to attend school, regardless of their status:

    Current law states that school-age children who reside in California must not be denied a free public education based on citizenship status. Resident students are required by statute to attend public school from ages six to eighteen.

    Whether it’s a school district’s Registration Center or at the actual sites, no one is required to ask about or report any registering student or family’s status. I have watched agents arrest undocumented parents inside of, and in front of school offices before as well as then having their children called out from class to meet them in the office. It’s traumatizing for the families, as well as those witnessing the event.

    Dana (fd537d)

  244. Remember when Joe advised Americans to protect themselves by firing a shotgun through their closed front door to keep out an intruder?

    More concerning- does he remember? His flip-flop memory on China, from no threat good guys to lunch eaters is classic, slippery, swamp creature dialogue as well.

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  245. Trump raised an army, fielded it on Jan 6th and sent it to attack the US Congress. That is waging war against the country and its constitution and it is quite literally TREASON.

    It’s not hyperbole at all.

    Indeed: it’s fiction.

    DCSCA (f4c5e5) — 2/14/2021 @ 1:12 pm

    DCSCA, persuade us or stop peddling your particular brand of “fiction”.

    Dana (fd537d)

  246. @243/244. No, Dustin. ‘Recruitment’ began January 20, 1981.

    Deal w/it.

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  247. @Frosty@235 Generally speaking, as a group teenagers are idiots. They are endearing idiots and individually they may not be idiots, but as a group they are idiots and we don’t generally report them to the police for making bad decisions. Students are almost never reported to the police for threatening teachers or other students. They are not reported for minor vandalism or other minor crimes. They are often not reported for physically fighting (parents can choose, the school mostly doesn’t report them). The school does not report them just because we know they use drugs outside of school, or even for being drunk or high at school, we don’t report them for hunting or fishing without the right licenses. We do not report their parents, even if we are pretty sure they are using or selling drugs. If they themselves commit an actively chosen significant crime that is actively harmful, on campus, such as sell drugs at school or bring weapons to school then they are reported.

    And I think you know the difference between those things and having been brought to the US as a child.

    Nic (896fdf)

  248. @DCSCA@248 Everybody has an excuse.

    Nic (896fdf)

  249. @247. What’s to persuade; Trump didn’t create the swelling ranks of populism. The slow burning fuse was lit under that fire January 20, 1981- – the caldron began boiling from Buchanan to giat-sucking-sound-Perot to lip-stick-Palin and finally boiled over w/Trump. He took advantage of it and won.

    These lower and middle class Americans were lied to, used, ‘Newtly’ seduced and abandoned by the GOP for decades just to win cycles as their small towns and cities decayed and their jobs vaporized…and they finally found a champion to carry their flag and win. They’ve tasted victory- and spilled blood and defeated removal from office by impeachment- twice by scarng he hellout f old guard Republicans. And they’re not going to disappear- as the fearful Senate votes showed– and their ranks will likely grow as the aging President Plagiarist stumbles.

    Trump will milk the populists for $ as the next flag bearer curries favor; he will be the kingmaker next cycle- the GOP winner will repackage herself just enough to ride his wave. A youngish, confident Nikki looks swell in a dress- bet she fills out a conservative, one-piece bathing suit nicely, too.

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  250. @250. This just doesn’t stat overnight nor wilit be quelled in one cycle. The latest outbreak of populism was seeded 1/20/81. Today, the smart party will be the one which knows how to service it just enough to harness their energy and ride to victory. 20th century Reaganomics is the stuff of the glue factory for the mid-21st century. Bet on Nikki.

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  251. Dana (fd537d) — 2/14/2021 @ 1:22 pm

    persuade us or stop peddling your particular brand of “fiction”.

    Persuade you? Why? It seems better to encourage people who believe this stuff to speak out loud and proud.

    frosty (f27e97)

  252. It’s not hyperbole at all.

    Except it is. 74-plus million have told you; the same 74-plus million GOP senators fear will vote them out of their jobs. You’re no going to quell this tidal wave of populism overnight; it has been building for decades– and the party that services their anger just enough is the one with a future. The old GOP is not it..

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  253. “They care more about one actress than millions of lives. I can’t imagine the actress tweeted anything worse than what the Chinese are doing to the Uighurs.”

    Disney cares about making money. Anything else they “care” about is in service to that. When you realize this, their actions become clear.

    Davethulhu (6ba00b)

  254. Disney cares about making money.

    Hollywood’s Golden Rule: ‘They who have the gold, rule.’

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  255. Disney cares about making money. Anything else they “care” about is in service to that

    Kind of like Deutsche Bank in 1940.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  256. Exactly, in your opinion.

    Yes, frosty, you’re wrong when you said “simply not true”. Meantime, keep on pretending that Sicknick’s combative participation in a riot and his death the following day are unrelated. If you want more opinion, I don’t call your position defensible or honest.

    Paul Montagu (77c694)

  257. You can’t say that. If he had an underlying condition – say a cardiac one – getting out of bed too fast could have killed him.

    Yeah, I can say that, Hoi, because I just said it. You’re taking the same indefensible position that Trump partisans took when they claimed that only 6% of reported COVID deaths were actually COVID deaths.

    Paul Montagu (77c694)

  258. Kind of like Deutsche Bank in 1940.

    Or Ford and IBM.

    Rip Murdock (259fcd)

  259. Corporations, for the most part, don’t have ethics, they have financial calculations.

    Nic (896fdf)

  260. Trumpers: When you criticize Trump, you’re attacking everyone who voted for him! You’re trying to silence 75 million people! You’re showing contempt for the American People!

    Also Trumpers: You can’t prove that the death of a healthy young police officer shortly after he had to fight off insurrectionists in the Capitol was in any way related to that event, so you’re being dishonest to say it was!

    Radegunda (20775b)

  261. Paul Montagu (77c694) — 2/14/2021 @ 2:35 pm

    Yes, frosty, you’re wrong when you said “simply not true”. Meantime, keep on pretending that Sicknick’s combative participation in a riot and his death the following day are unrelated. If you want more opinion, I don’t call your position defensible or honest.

    I didn’t say they were unrelated. That’s you imagining something I didn’t say. I said you don’t know the cause of death. How is that dishonest when it’s the literal truth?

    But you are welcome to prove me wrong instead of calling me dishonest. Post a link that gives a cause of death. Provide more than speculation that they are related. Backup your claim with actual evidence.

    frosty (04c14b)

  262. Paul Montagu (77c694) — 2/14/2021 @ 2:42 pm

    Yeah, I can say that, Hoi, because I just said it. make up stuff if I want it to be true

    FIFY. In this case I really didn’t have to fix much. Your version said the same thing and was shorter.

    frosty (04c14b)

  263. Trump’s populism doesn’t work without right wing media enabling it. This whole exercise has exposed how entertainment-news controls the GOP. Much of Trump’s 2016 rhetoric was pulled straight from angry radio….ridiculous and hyperbolic….but plausible enough sounding. It was inevitable that it would then morph into the QAnon garbage…just how real news gets distorted and sensationalized by the National Enquirer. Where else did this extreme “liberals are trying to fundamentally change the country” meme come from. This is manufactured fear, anger and hate….creating an enemy…exaggerating their power….and complaining that no one is doing anything about it. Up rises the “outsider” meme….only the untested and bold-speaking outsider can fix it all!

    Was this baked in from Reagan? Only if you think conservatism itself is a joke. That federalism, capitalism, limited government, a strong military, and individual responsibility are meaningless concepts….or that Reagan’s appeal was only smoke and mirrors….with no substantive or intellectual appeal. To me, this falls flat. Buchanan’s isolationism had little to do with Reagan’s optimism. Pat quickly fell from view and in 2000 polled at less than 1%. Some populism. Sarah Palin was pulled out of obscurity by McCain…only to implode and fall out of political relevance…..not even talk show worthy. Some inevitable populism. Right wing media talked itself into a corner and was stuck with Trump. The question is where it goes from here….is one of their own next? Tucker Carlson maybe? The Right needs more optimistic ideas…less fear, anger and hate….

    AJ_Liberty (a4ff25)

  264. I didn’t say they were unrelated.

    You refused to acknowledge that they were related, frosty. I really don’t know why you trying to pick a fight with me and say that my words were “simply not true” when I said that Trump and his terrorist followers are not absolved from seven American deaths, Sicknick included.

    Paul Montagu (9c9155)

  265. Oh, and I don’t like it when adversarial commenters try to cram their words down my throat. It’s not honest or civil.

    Paul Montagu (9c9155)

  266. @243/244. No, Dustin. ‘Recruitment’ began January 20, 1981.

    Deal w/it.

    DCSCA (f4c5e5) — 2/14/2021 @ 1:23 pm

    That’s not the GOP. That was a reaction to Jimmy Carter being an idiot.

    Similarly, the democrats aren’t the party they were in 1963. 1981 was a very large fraction of American history ago. Trump hated Ronald Reagan as you do. Which makes sense I guess.

    You are the Trump voter, laughing about how glorious the consequences are, telling us it’s everyone’s fault but yours, that reality is fiction (basically you absorbed a lot of Russian propaganda and don’t understand the world very well).

    I don’t think you’re a bad person by any stretch at all, but come on.

    Dustin (4237e0)

  267. Yeah, I can say that, Hoi, because I just said it. You’re taking the same indefensible position that Trump partisans took when they claimed that only 6% of reported COVID deaths were actually COVID deaths.

    You are correct. You can say it. You just can’t prove it. I assume you also agree that Cuomo’s position is indefensible if the Trumpers’ position is also indefensible.

    Hoi Polloi (139bf6)

  268. I don’t think you’re a bad person by any stretch at all

    Textbook sociopath. He regularly expresses open contempt for the notion of morality.

    He took to Trump as eagerly as a fly takes to sh*t, and for the same reasons.

    Dave (1bb933)

  269. Paul Montagu (9c9155) — 2/14/2021 @ 3:52 pm

    Oh, and I don’t like it when adversarial commenters try to cram their words down my throat. It’s not honest or civil.

    That’s an interesting claim after you imagined I said something I clearly didn’t say. I also notice that you’re still trying the ad hominem instead of providing any evidence to support your claim.

    Paul Montagu (9c9155) — 2/14/2021 @ 3:50 pm

    You refused to acknowledge that they were related, frosty.

    Because there is no evidence they are. Do you think you have any? If so link it. All you’ve said so far is that they have to be because one thing followed the other thing.

    Why would I pretend a thing has been proven when it hasn’t? Why would I acknowledge something for which there is no evidence? Why would you?

    Are you seeing the pattern? All you have to do is provide some sort of tangible evidence that his death was related to injuries sustained. Not vague statements by the capital police or his brother. It’d be a good start to prove he sustained any injuries on the 6th at all. The capital police have claimed he died from injuries sustained but can you name a single injury? If this is as obvious as you claim why can’t you name one? If you can’t name one how can you claim he died from them?

    I’ll help you out. Here is a video of CNN discussing recent information. You’ll notice a couple of things. They do not state any specific injury he actually sustained. They’re having trouble building a murder case because they don’t have any evidence he was murdered. They haven’t acknowledged having any video or audio of Sicknick being attacked. They play audio on that link but they don’t allege that Sicknick actually came in contact with bear spray. At best they can say “probably”. The “bear spray” theory is relatively new and it came up after the blunt force trauma theory didn’t hold up.

    We may eventually learn Sicknick’s cause of death and more about this case. But it’s not accurate to say, based on what we know now, his death was caused by the riot. When we get evidence I’ll reevaluate.

    frosty (f27e97)

  270. Dustin (4237e0) — 2/14/2021 @ 4:41 pm

    telling us it’s everyone’s fault but yours, that reality is fiction (basically you absorbed a lot of Russian propaganda and don’t understand the world very well).

    This has to be a thread winner, if not top contender, for least self aware comment.

    Have you found those concentration camps Trump helped the Chinese hide? Now that Trump isn’t ruining literally the whole world what’s your plan for Putin? Are you going to organize for D’s who will do something about him beyond bringing him a staples reset button?

    frosty (f27e97)

  271. Also Trumpers: You can’t prove that the death of a healthy young police officer shortly after he had to fight off insurrectionists in the Capitol was in any way related to that event, so you’re being dishonest to say it was!

    One of the reasons I never bought “accidental death” insurance is that if you were in a plane crash, but died a day later in hospital, they won’t pay up with bs arguments like that one.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  272. Radegunda (20775b) — 2/14/2021 @ 2:52 pm

    Also Trumpers: You can’t prove that the death of a healthy young police officer shortly after he had to fight off insurrectionists in the Capitol was in any way related to that event, so you’re being dishonest to say it was!

    Young is relative. He was 42. I wouldn’t try to pretend he was in his 20’s or something. Do you know he was healthy? I guess we shouldn’t be too picky with these sort of gotcha games.

    It’s always interesting seeing what needs evidence and how much.

    frosty (f27e97)

  273. It is obvious that the Rothschilds’ death ray was malfunctioning.

    nk (1d9030)

  274. Kevin, Frosty — My point was that Trumpers have made sweeping moral accusations against other people, but when Trump or his fanatical supporters are under examination, then they insist on scrupulous proof and fine slicing and dicing in casting blame or else it’s very very unfair and mean.

    Radegunda (20775b)

  275. You are correct. You can say it. You just can’t prove it. I assume you also agree that Cuomo’s position is indefensible if the Trumpers’ position is also indefensible.

    The unreleased autopsy is proof, Hoi. I will conclude that Sicknick’s death was caused by the insurrection until it’s shown to me otherwise, because of Occam’s Razor and I don’t believe in coincidences such as when police are engaged in combat on one day, die the next, and the combat having nothing to do with the death.
    As for Cuomo, he bears responsibility for the nursing home disaster and for covering up the disaster by misreporting what happened. He should be held be accountable.

    Paul Montagu (77c694)

  276. Your parsing is exhausting, frosty. You crossed out my words and replaced them with your own. I’ll say again, not honest or civil.

    As for Sicknick, I’m aware that you and I don’t know the contents of the autopsy. That doesn’t prevent me from making conclusions based on the situation of him being in combat one day and dying the next, and I’ll hold onto those conclusions until new facts emerge. Again, I really don’t know why you’re being so argumentative about this, except for the sake of being argumentative.

    Paul Montagu (77c694)

  277. 220. Victor (4959fb) — 2/14/2021 @ 12:13 pm

    What I don’t understand is what, under the best possible argument for Trump, his speech to the crowd, and his urging them to walk to the Capitol was supposed to accomplish?

    That is a very good question.

    I think Trump thought they would sway votes in Congress. And that their numbers would be far higher.

    https://factba.se/transcript/donald-trump-speech-campaign-rally-the-ellipse-january-6-2021

    … when I turned on today, I looked, and I saw thousands of people here. But you don’t see hundreds of thousands of people behind you because they don’t want to show that. We have hundreds of thousands of people here [!!?] and I just want them to be recognized by the fake news media. …

    ….n, we’re going to walk down — Anyone you want, but I think right here, we’re going to walk down to the capital and we’re going to cheer on our brave senators and congressmen and women, and we’re probably not going to be cheering so much for some of them.

    Because you’ll never take back our country with weakness. You have to show strength and you have to be strong. We have come to demand that Congress do the right thing And only count the electors who have been lawfully slated, lawfully slated. I know that everyone here will soon be marching over to the Capitol building to peacefully and patriotically make your voices heard.

    Today we will see whether Republicans stand strong for integrity of our elections. But whether or not they stand strong for our country, our country.

    Sammy Finkelman (00fff5)

  278. What’s wrong with this picture?

    Hint: Uniontown, PA weather.

    Ahh, LA Times! You haven’t changed, have you?

    nk (1d9030)

  279. Is the theory that he really wanted them to just gather quietly on the other side of the meager barrier on the hill and yell impotently at the Capitol where Congresspeople in soundproofed chambers would have continued on, oblivious? His claim was that they were there to “stop the steal” and that this could actually be accomplished. There is no way to square that goal with a peaceful bit of distance yelling. The insurrection was deranged but at least it had a weird pathway to success. A “peaceful” protest would have meant nothing.

    The alternative idea is that maybe he wanted to force Congress to recess. But that doesn’t have a good endgame, too.

    And he had already arranged to have up to 12 hours of debate (there was less because some objections were cancelled.

    Given how stupid, reckless and short sighted Trump is, the real answer probably is that he just knew that if set chaos loose, he might somehow benefit, and would be at least better off than he was. Not much of an argument for his qualities as president.

    This is assuming alot.

    Actually once Mike Pence refused to go along with him, he had no strategy. The demonstration was to make Republicans afraid of a primary challenge.

    And you have to get your people to fight. And if they don’t fight, we have to primaried the hell out of the ones that don’t fight. You primary them. We’re going to — We’re going to let you know who they are. I can already tell you frankly…

    Now the problem here is that even if every Republican member of Congress went along, he didn;t have enough Republicans to stop the Electoral vote from resulting in a 306-232 win for Biden. Unless maybe Mike Pence went along and they needed majorities in both chambers to accept the votes rather than to reject them.

    None of this stuff was going to work.

    As for one more reason to keep Republicans out of power, the lickspittle Graham is darkly warning that the moment they get back in power there will be various forms of deranged payback:

    “And if you use this model, I don’t know how Kamala Harris doesn’t get impeached if the Republicans take over the House,” Graham said.

    I think Lindsey Graham is trying to make Trump feel good. He claimed his possible impeachment rgroumds would be identical. It’s not.

    Sammy Finkelman (00fff5)

  280. Again, I really don’t know why you’re being so argumentative about this, except for the sake of being argumentative.

    Paul Montagu (77c694) — 2/14/2021 @ 7:29 pm

    He’s lonely and people don’t pay attention when he’s not trolling. It’s not something to make fun of. I regret engaging these guys so much.

    Dustin (4237e0)

  281. Brian Sickick was able to walk away from the event, and that means it is probably not murder unless you can causally tie the two events together.

    It might have been caused by a Covid related heart attack. Covid perhaps was going around.

    There were really severe injuries suffered by different police officers. It was said this day had the most injuries suffered by policemen in a single day since Sept. 11, 2001. But there’s no good word on why Brian Sicknick collapsed and became bran dead.

    Sammy Finkelman (00fff5)

  282. Paul Montagu (77c694) — 2/14/2021 @ 7:29 pm

    Again, I really don’t know why you’re being so argumentative about this, except for the sake of being argumentative.

    You made a claim that isn’t supported by evidence, when I pointed it out you called me dishonest, but I’m being argumentative?

    I get that you want to come here and commiserate with like-minded people. You may need a safer space.

    frosty (f27e97)

  283. Sammy Finkelman (00fff5) — 2/14/2021 @ 7:55 pm

    I’ve also read speculation that he had a stroke and there’s a COVID blood clot relationship.

    frosty (f27e97)

  284. What autopsy? What kind of hick hospital did they take the poor guy to? We have X-rays, CT scans, MRIs, and angiograms these days. They should already know exactly what the insult to the brain was.

    nk (1d9030)

  285. nk (1d9030) — 2/14/2021 @ 8:46 pm

    We should but we don’t. The AP has claimed that anonymous police sources reported he was beaten with a fire extinguisher. This is a false claim.

    His death is being used for political gain and the cause of death is most likely an impediment to that.

    frosty (f27e97)

  286. Well, an epidural hematoma manifests just like what happened to Sicknick and typically they’re due to cranial injury, so I also suspect a head injury. My gripe is that the medical detective work should already be done and what’s missing is the detective work on the ground.

    nk (1d9030)

  287. nk (1d9030) — 2/14/2021 @ 9:52 pm

    Except it’s already been reported that the ME found no blunt force trauma. The medical detective work has been done unless anyone thinks unknown was listed as the cause of death on his death certificate.

    It’s more likely that they have a cause of death that can’t be easily explained by injuries sustained during the riot. My gripe is that the cause of death hasn’t been made public and people continue to assume they know what it was.

    I suspect the detective work on the ground falls into the same category, i.e. they don’t have any evidence.

    If they had evidence linking his death to violence on the 6th we would know about it.

    frosty (f27e97)

  288. https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9257395/Pentagon-admits-testing-wreckage-UFO-crashes.html

    The Pentagon has admitted to possessing and testing out wreckage from UFO crashes, with the researcher who found the startling news hypothesizing that the debris may be from the famous Roswell, New Mexico, crash in 1947.

    Researcher Anthony Bragalia made the revelation on his blog UFO Explorations, sharing that he secured more than 150 pages from the US Defense Intelligence Agency (DIA) after the agency responded to a three-year Freedom of Information Act (FOIA) request he submitted.

    ‘Although much of the reports’ details are redacted, what can be gleaned is that these technologies represent a literal quantum leap beyond the properties of all existing material known to man,’ Bragalia wrote in his blog.

    How about something a little more fun than the normal politics? I’m shocked Jazz on Hot Air hasn’t written pages about this yet.

    NJRob (eb56c3)

  289. FWIW, Allahpundit made a somewhat speculative, but plausible, argument last week that Sicknick was killed by the after-effects of being attacked with bear spray.

    Dave (1bb933)

  290. I’d also point out that you might want to pick a story and stick with it. This claim runs counter to the “incitement” claim. Now that that has gone nowhere it makes sense to switch to another claim but having laid the foundation for “incitement” you’ll need to lay a different foundation for “raise an army” before you can just start pedaling it.

    frosty (f27e97) — 2/14/2021 @ 1:00 pm

    When you say that incitement has gone no where, do you mean that he didn’t direct the rioters to attack the capital or that he did and the GOP doesn’t care? Because the former seems contrary to facts.

    Time123 (306531)

  291. Looks like Biden followed through on his commitment that he won’t employ people who don’t treat those around them respectfully.

    “We accepted the resignation of TJ Ducklo after a discussion with him this evening,” said Jen Psaki, the White House press secretary, in a statement. “This conversation occurred with the support of the White House chief of staff.”

    Good for them. Given the complications (TJ has stage 4 cancer) it didn’t even take them too long to do the right thing.

    Time123 (89dfb2)

  292. Dave (1bb933) — 2/15/2021 @ 12:01 am

    The article tells you what the family was told

    the family got word that Brian Sicknick had a blood clot and had had a stroke

    and presumably that is the official cause of death since the family would have the death certificate. But that just doesn’t have the same mythological appeal as the hero who dies at the gates defending democracy.

    frosty (f27e97)

  293. You made a claim that isn’t supported by evidence, when I pointed it out you called me dishonest, but I’m being argumentative?

    Yes.
    What I originally said, what apparently caused you to say “simply not true” was that it “doesn’t absolve Trump of his responsibility for Sicknick’s death and it doesn’t absolve the rioters who fought Sicknick.” I stand by that.

    Paul Montagu (77c694)

  294. Time123 (306531) — 2/15/2021 @ 6:57 am

    When you say that incitement has gone no where

    I mean that D’s impeached to no effect so now the story is shifting. The argument for “incitement” hasn’t been made. If you can’t “prove” a thing when you don’t have a legal standard, due process is whatever you say it is, and the jury are the victims you don’t have much of an argument.

    Because the former seems contrary to facts.

    You’ve jumbled up a lot of ideas to get to those “facts”. You’re commenting on my comment that has directed to a claim of treason. Are you jumping on the idea that he both incited a mob and, referring to the same people and incident, also raised an army and ordered them to attack?

    frosty (f27e97)

  295. Good for them. Given the complications (TJ has stage 4 cancer) it didn’t even take them too long to do the right thing.

    The right thing? I don’t think so. Caesar’s wife, that’s all. Hopefully, his connections will not abandon him and he’ll land another job.

    nk (1d9030)

  296. I’ll also note, frosty, that you’re mindreading, which is an intellectually lazy and dishonest practice, about my motives for being here, that I “come here and commiserate with like-minded people.” That doesn’t seem like something a person who’s nitpicky about evidence would do.
    It also doesn’t explain why I frequent pro-Trump places like Hotair and Townhall, so I’ll say your own commenting is speculative and not honest.
    Odd word, “commiserate”, that I’m here to “express or feel sympathy or pity”, as the word is defined. I’ll just say your mindreading exercise is false and leave it at that.

    Paul Montagu (77c694)

  297. Frosty, I was coming in late, and a discounting some of the word choices as puffery. I mostly just wanted to understand what you were saying.

    As a counter point to this

    If you can’t “prove” a thing when you don’t have a legal standard, due process is whatever you say it is, and the jury are the victims you don’t have much of an argument.

    I’ll point out that in the this case the GOP senators would bear a significant political price by voting to convict.

    How’s it go, A man will believe many amazing things so long as his paycheck requires them to be true?

    Time123 (89dfb2)

  298. 285. frosty (f27e97) — 2/14/2021 @ 8:21 pm

    I’ve also read speculation that he had a stroke and there’s a COVID blood clot relationship.

    I think I heard a stroke. Could be astroke or a pulmonar embolism.

    Now this couldbe brought on by the fighting and being pepper sprayed. Higher blood pressure, maybe cramped knees or something. Whatever the doctors know, medical records are normally confidential and nothing offcial has been released. he leadership of the House would know more, but we can’t trust the Speaker of the House that it was likely murder. It was too useful to her party to have a police victim who was, so to speak, on their side (his personal political beliefs don’t affect that) Now they could show that siding with Republicans was anti-police. They went so far as to have him lie in state, and he was buried in Arlington cemetery (probably because of some prior military service.)

    The fire extinguisher story was not repeated by the House managers but they did mention a heart attack, which may however, be somebody else. Two police were maimed and I don’t want to describe it..

    The fire extinguisher story was linked to some video, showing fire extinguishers being thrown into 3 policemen, one without any helmet, but those were Metropolitan (Washington, D.C.) police officers.

    Sammy Finkelman (00fff5)

  299. 289. frosty (f27e97) — 2/14/2021 @ 10:15 pm

    If they had evidence linking his death to violence on the 6th we would know about it.

    Not everything is on video. He said he was pepper sprayed twice. and they have not released video of that. He could have hit his head on something maybe. Or banged into another police officer.

    They probably did test him for Covid while he was in the hospital.

    Sammy Finkelman (00fff5)

  300. Paul Montagu (77c694) — 2/15/2021 @ 7:25 am

    You don’t know the cause of death and you can’t link it to anything that happened on the 6th. This is a textbook Post Hoc fallacy. Pointing out that you are standing by an unproven claim isn’t being argumentative.

    Why do you need that to be true so badly? You’re biggest complaint seems to be that I wouldn’t acknowledge something to be true that hasn’t been established. Is it really that hard for you to even consider that you’ve been lied to and manipulated about Sicknick? Is it that much of a challenge to consider that you really don’t know why he died? Are you that invested in the idea that Trump is responsible for his death? Why? Other officers were injured that we have evidence of. Why isn’t that enough? Why create a false narrative?

    frosty (f27e97)

  301. “Good for them. Given the complications (TJ has stage 4 cancer) it didn’t even take them too long to do the right thing.”

    Yikes, the guy has the odds stacked against him to have his cancer cured or for it to go into remission, but we should applaud him losing his job so Biden can be seen as “consisent” to his word? He messed up….he owes the reporter a massive apology….maybe this isn’t a great time for him to be in a stressful high-visibility position anyways….but, let’s err on the side of not making him part of our political entertainment….

    AJ_Liberty (a4ff25)

  302. I don;t see how Biden was not following through on his promise:

    “But I am not joking when I say this, if you are ever working with me and I hear you treat another colleague with disrespect… talk down to someone, I promise you I will fire you on the spot,” the 46th president of the United States said on Wednesday. “On the spot. No ifs, ands or buts. Everybody… everybody is entitled to be treated with decency and dignity. That’s been missing in a big way the last four years.”

    Another colleague.

    But whom did TJ Ducklo threaten?

    A reporter.

    Reporters were not covered by his pledge, especially reporters threatened before January 20, 2021. Biden’s pledge, after all, was present or future oriented and did not cover past conduct.

    I don’t see how people missed that.

    Sammy Finkelman (00fff5)

  303. Q: Can Lindsey Graham be more of a [censored]?
    A: Yes! Yes, he can!

    nk (1d9030)

  304. frosty (f27e97) — 2/15/2021 @ 7:54 am

    You don’t know the cause of death and you can’t link it to anything that happened on the 6th. This is a textbook Post Hoc fallacy.

    A better example of a post hoc ergo propter hoc fallacy is the one linking of Trump’s speech to the rampage at the Capitol.

    Is lawyers played other instances of politicians using similar words. Now there was an attempt to distinguish them by saying, say that the other instances of politicians saying the word “fight” weren’t followed by anything..

    The point being made though was, that just like the other speeches didn’t cause anything, neither did Trump’s speech. It had other causes and was in fact pre-planned.

    (Now Trump might have caused it or conspired to cause it in other ways. But he also might have been used by extremists. He was going to speak also at the Capitol rally.)

    Other officers were injured that we have evidence of. Why isn’t that enough?

    I don;t know. In American culture, only deaths count. We don’t talk much about the people suffering long term effects from Covid, either. Just deaths.

    Sammy Finkelman (00fff5)

  305. Sammy #304.

    You sound like that guy who always reads the website’s terms and conditions in full and all the privacy disclosures (and then sends the copy to a lawyer for vetting…)

    In any event, per what I have seen, the threats were made Inauguration Day. The Vanity Fair article I consulted was not clear on whether the call was made in the morning before Biden took the oath.

    As for the colleague issue — most harassment policies do encompass contacts with vendors, customers, and other members of the public. Biden is speaking generally — so he has not had the lawyer vet every single word. I suppose his administration could have said “we didn’t mean reporters”, but how good does that sound?

    Appalled (1a17de)

  306. Sammy Finkelman (00fff5) — 2/15/2021 @ 8:00 am

    You’ve missed the most glaring problem.

    if you are ever working with me and I hear you

    Based on Biden’s wording it only applies if he hears it as it happens and Biden is working with you at the time. Biden is a standup guy that way.

    frosty (f27e97)

  307. I think Mr. Ducklo should consider himself lucky that Biden did not “take him behind the gym and beat the hell out of him”.

    Comrades, comrades, comrades! Let us not lose sight of the reality that only Donald Trump could have gotten Joe Biden elected President.

    nk (1d9030)

  308. “The point being made though was, that just like the other speeches didn’t cause anything, neither did Trump’s speech. It had other causes and was in fact pre-planned.”

    Doesn’t Trump’s inaction while the riot escalated and people were getting injured show that the rioters had not misinterpreted Trump’s message or had not otherwise gone off script? He had the power to immediately call in the National Guard and chose not to. He had the ability to use any level of media to definitively call for the rioters to stop and clearly call out the bad behavior during its most heated time, but instead stayed silent. He could have gone down to the Capitol and personally and directly spoke to the rioters but chose to watch the drama unfold instead….and elevated his rhetoric toward Pence instead. The incitement had been going on for weeks….by Trump purposefully giving pliable people bad information about the “steal”. Sorry but his inaction…as the Commander In Chief and chief law enforcement officer…and someone who pledged an oath to uphold the Constitution…shows me that he was willing to recklessly gamble with people’s lives on January 6th….when he had the power and duty to intervene. Absent other facts, the inaction goes to intent…or dereliction…..take your pick….

    AJ_Liberty (a4ff25)

  309. Lindsay Graham looked worse in giving the wrong time of Trump’s anti-attack cops tweets (2:28 instead of 2:38) But I think maybe Trump had that conversation with House Minority Leader Kevin McCarthy after that tweet

    U.S. Representative Jaime Herrera Beutle, after all, says that conversation took place

    when McCarthy finally reached the president

    That indicates it took some time. (So here is a reason to subpoena McCarthy – at least nail down the time of that call – what phone and then get the phone records. It might also be gotten from the White House or maybe the National archives, at least once you know on what phone Trump was reached)

    According to a Jan 15 New York Times timeline

    https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2021/01/15/us/trump-capitol-riot-timeline.html

    About 2:15 p.m.

    In the House Chamber on the south side of the building, Ms. Pelosi is ushered off the floor. The debate in the House continues.

    About 2:15 p.m.
    Senator Tommy Tuberville, Republican of Alabama, said he told Mr. Trump on a phone call that Mr. Pence had been ushered off the Senate floor. {Chris Wallace yesterday put that at about 2:26. The difference could be between the start and the finish of the call. The New York Times has two calls to Tommy Tuberville. Do we know if there two or one?

    One long call would however, mean that Trump left that tweet about Mike Pence during the middle of that call with Tommy Tuberville – it posted at 2:24 pm. Now some people might think Trump wouldn’t keep Zommy Tuberville on hold while he typed put a tweet on his other phone in reaction to something Tommy Tuberville said. But why not? ]

    2:24 p.m.

    Mr. Trump criticizes Mr. Pence on Twitter.

    “Mike Pence didn’t have the courage to do what should have been done to protect our Country and our Constitution, giving States a chance to certify a corrected set of facts, not the fraudulent or inaccurate ones which they were asked to previously certify. USA demands the truth!”

    2:26 p.m.

    Rioters breach a second entry into the building, this time on the east side. Around the same time, Mr. Trump calls Senator Mike Lee, Republican of Utah, though he means to call Mr. Tuberville again.

    Some time in the next 30 minutes, Representative Kevin McCarthy, the minority leader, phones Mr. Trump asking him to call off the riot. (The details of the call are later corroborated by a congresswoman with whom Mr. McCarthy discusses the call.

    If it takes maybe close to half an hour for Kevin MCArthy to get Trmp n the phone, that places that conversation after Trump’s 2l38 tweet. The House wem t imto recess at 2:18 pm, went back into session at 2:26 pm. recessed again at 2:30 pm and began evacuating at 2:39. At the time of the call, McCarthy has seen rioters, or pictures of them, and knows that windows in his office are being broken.

    Trump tweeted at 2:38 pm, probably before the phone conversation wirh Kevin McCarthy

    https://media-cdn.factba.se/realdonaldtrump-twitter/1346904110969315332.jpg

    Please support our Capitol Police and Law Enforcement. They are truly on the side of our Country. Stay peaceful!

    The time you see there is UMT (Greenwich)
    https://factba.se/biden/topic/twitter

    2:18 p.m.
    The House goes into recess, and representatives remain in the chamber.

    Sammy Finkelman (00fff5)

  310. The only meaningful rebuke Trump has received has been from Jack Dorsey. Everything else has been water off a duck’s back.

    I’m still not getting Twitter, though.

    nk (1d9030)

  311. Trump gt criticized for that tweet being tooo mild, so at 3:13 he issued another tweet:

    https://media-cdn.factba.se/realdonaldtrump-twitter/1346912780700577792.jpg

    I am asking for everyone at the U.S. Capitol to remain peaceful. No violence! Remember, WE are the Party of Law & Order – respect the Law and our great men and women in Blue. Thank you!

    Jan 6, ’21 @ 3:13 pm ET

    He later made a short video, and at 6:01 tweeted something that sounds like what he said to Kevin McCarthy:

    These are the things and events that happen when a sacred landslide election victory is so unceremoniously & viciously stripped away from great patriots who have been badly & unfairly treated for so long. Go home with love & in peace. Remember this day forever!

    Jan 6, ’21 @ 6:01 pm ET

    You can find them at:

    https://factba.se/biden/topic/twitter

    Sammy Finkelman (00fff5)

  312. Sammy Finkelman (00fff5) — 2/15/2021 @ 8:00 am

    You’ve missed the most glaring problem.

    if you are ever working with me and I hear you

    Based on Biden’s wording it only applies if he hears it as it happens and Biden is working with you at the time. Biden is a standup guy that way.

    frosty (f27e97) — 2/15/2021 @ 8:16 am

    He’s gone. Biden followed through on the pledge.

    Time123 (53ef45)

  313. Time123 (53ef45) — 2/15/2021 @ 9:11 am

    Biden followed through on the pledge.

    If the pledge doesn’t cover this then is it really accurate to say he followed through with it?

    It seems more likely that Biden just caved to pressure. It’ll be interesting to watch people who criticized Trump for throwing people under the bus praise Biden for it. It was a consistent practice during the BO years and happy days are here again. This guy wasn’t even disloyal. He just made Biden look bad.

    frosty (f27e97)

  314. “working with me” means working in his administration. What I don’t see how people missed was that Biden was talking about colleagues and this was a reporter, and Biden wasn’t thinking about that.

    I do see how people missed the time element because it’s not all that clear in the news stories when he threatened the reporter.

    The thing is, of course, you don’t need an official policy to dismiss someone over egregious behavior.

    But I am not surprised it didn’t occur to them to fire him.

    Sammy Finkelman (00fff5)

  315. Egregious behavior and abusing his position.

    Sammy Finkelman (00fff5)

  316. Time123 (53ef45) — 2/15/2021 @ 9:11 am

    Biden followed through on the pledge.

    If the pledge doesn’t cover this then is it really accurate to say he followed through with it?

    It seems more likely that Biden just caved to pressure. It’ll be interesting to watch people who criticized Trump for throwing people under the bus praise Biden for it. It was a consistent practice during the BO years and happy days are here again. This guy wasn’t even disloyal. He just made Biden look bad.

    frosty (f27e97) — 2/15/2021 @ 9:29 am

    I think the people who say this wasn’t covered are just wrong. Even if Biden ever said anything about firing people the behavior wasn’t at all professional or appropriate and TJ should have been fired, a worst demoted and moved to a position with less authority where he doesn’t interact with the press. Your statement about him making Biden look bad seems to imply that his behavior in and of itself wasn’t grounds for removal / discipline.

    I didn’t follow if too closely so this may be wrong but here’s what I know

    TJ was completely inappropriate.
    It became public knowledge.
    The next day they announced he was suspended for a week.
    A couple of day’s later he resigned.

    Maybe they wanted to ride it out and instead caved to pressure.
    Maybe there was disagreement about what to do.
    Maybe they wanted to take a little time to get all the facts and think about what to do and how to do it. The fact that he has stage 4 cancer is a legitimate complication.

    seems consistent with what Biden pledged he’d do.

    Time123 (53ef45)

  317. AJ_Liberty (a4ff25) — 2/15/2021 @ 8:38 am

    He had the ability to use any level of media to definitively call for the rioters to stop and clearly call out the bad behavior during its most heated time, but instead stayed silent.

    What exactly do you envision here? Are you imagining a bunch of rioters “during its most heated time” all getting some notification on their phones of a tweet, stopping to read it, and then just walking off? Or maybe they’d get a notification of a new youtube video and during the middle of the riot, everyone would stop to watch it?

    Pick a lane. If it was a riot you’re going to need something more than a “definitive call” to stop it. If it’s something that could have been stopped by “any level of media … during its most heated time” then it’s not a riot.

    frosty (f27e97)

  318. One thing I notice about stories like the TJ thing is how little people think about similar situations they’ve been in.

    A subordinate behaves in an unprofessional way. You hear about it and need to do something because it’s serious, but not instant grounds for firing (such as assaulting a co-worker)

    You need to find out
    -What happened?
    -How badly harmed was the other person?
    -Is this part of a pattern?
    -Have things like this happened before with other people?
    -Are there extenuating circumstances?
    -Are there factors that make it worse?
    -What is the general policy for this?
    -Who are the impacted decision makers?

    Then, in the organizations I’ve worked in, you have to get those decision makers together and get everyone on the same page, and communicate what you’re doing and why.

    if you have other things going on that can take a few days.

    Firing from the hip as soon as you hear what happened makes you look short sighted and arbitrary which can hurt moral. It also leaves you open to making a mistake that needs to be corrected later.

    Time123 (36651d)

  319. You don’t know the cause of death and you can’t link it to anything that happened on the 6th.

    How many more times do I have to say that you and I don’t know the contents of the autopsy? Why does that prohibit me from concluding that his death doesn’t absolve Trump (and his faithful terrorist rioters who fought Sicknick) from responsibility? Are you that in-the-bag for Trump that you must defend him no matter what?
    This is from FoxNews–a better right-wing source than the network that hired a Russian propagandist to smear a harmless activist as an “Antifa provocateur–and they reported the following:

    Sicknick, 42, was struck in the head by a fire extinguisher while “physically engaging” with rioters at the Capitol, authorities said. He collapsed once he returned to his division and died at the hospital the next day.

    If his death was pure coincidence, unrelated to the riot he physically engaged in just hours earlier, then I’ll amend my assessment.

    Why do you need that to be true so badly?

    You’re the one who called me out, frosty. Don’t play the affronted person by switching things around.

    Paul Montagu (77c694)

  320. Time123 (53ef45) — 2/15/2021 @ 9:39 am

    I think the people who say this wasn’t covered are just wrong.

    I’m poking the bear a bit on the Biden pledge. But only a little. The guy was WH Junior Deputy Press Secretary and he was sleeping with a reporter covering the WH. That and his comments are grounds in and of themselves for removal and Biden’s pledge doesn’t need to factor into it. It’s just a rake the Biden people have stepped on. Biden deserves the whack for throwing down the rake. This is going to be a common theme though because Biden and his team just can’t help throwing down rakes.

    frosty (f27e97)

  321. What exactly do you envision here? Are you imagining a bunch of rioters “during its most heated time” all getting some notification on their phones of a tweet, stopping to read it, and then just walking off? Or maybe they’d get a notification of a new youtube video and during the middle of the riot, everyone would stop to watch it?

    Pick a lane. If it was a riot you’re going to need something more than a “definitive call” to stop it. If it’s something that could have been stopped by “any level of media … during its most heated time” then it’s not a riot.

    frosty (f27e97) — 2/15/2021 @ 9:40 am

    He could have promptly ordered the national guard to go and assist in restoring order while issuing a statement that unequivocally denounced what was happening. Such as “I’ve called out the national guard to restore order defend the capital. I hope the capital police arrest everyone that attacked the Capital. When I said we needed to fight I meant figuratively, in courts and using the political process. The people who have gone beyond that have no place in my movement and I look forward to their arrest and trial.”

    But he didn’t do either of those things, most likely because he approved of what the rioters & terrorists were doing and wanted it to continue for a while.

    To quote Mitch Mconnel; Trump was practically and morally responsible for provoking the attack.

    Time123 (53ef45)

  322. Time123 (53ef45) — 2/15/2021 @ 9:39 am

    I think the people who say this wasn’t covered are just wrong.

    I’m poking the bear a bit on the Biden pledge. But only a little. The guy was WH Junior Deputy Press Secretary and he was sleeping with a reporter covering the WH. That and his comments are grounds in and of themselves for removal and Biden’s pledge doesn’t need to factor into it. It’s just a rake the Biden people have stepped on. Biden deserves the whack for throwing down the rake. This is going to be a common theme though because Biden and his team just can’t help throwing down rakes.

    frosty (f27e97) — 2/15/2021 @ 9:54 am

    You’re probably right, Biden is a gaph machine with little regard for truth or consistency. At his best he speaks poetically and makes a lot of figurative and aspirational statements. At his worst he makes no sense.

    Time123 (53ef45)

  323. Re Ducklo, he quit before Biden could be tested on his pledge.

    Paul Montagu (c621b7)

  324. @320-
    ……. Firing from the hip as soon as you hear what happened makes you look short sighted and arbitrary which can hurt moral. It also leaves you open to making a mistake that needs to be corrected later..

    The standards are higher (or at least should be) for someone who works in the White House, Cabinet departments, or congressional offices. It was obvious to everyone (including Ducklo) that threatening to “destroy” someone else’s career (whether they actually could or not) was a serious mistake and a firing offense.

    Rip Murdock (259fcd)

  325. Paul and Rip, I agree. But based on what I know; Dude has stage 4 cancer and this wasn’t part of a pattern I’m ok with them letting him resign. Had he been in a less senior position I might be convinced that a demotion and non-public facing role might be appropriate.

    Would you have fired him before making sure you had a full understanding of what happened? Once you had that would you have wanted to review it with your boss before proceeding?

    Time123 (53ef45)

  326. I’m also certain that Ducklo’s superiors took into his cancer diagnosis into consideration with short suspension. They should have suspended him for at least a couple of months.

    Rip Murdock (259fcd)

  327. Would you have fired him before making sure you had a full understanding of what happened? Once you had that would you have wanted to review it with your boss before proceeding?

    If all I knew was that he threatened to “destroy” someone whose job was to report on my boss (the President)? There are no extenuating circumstances.

    Yes.

    Rip Murdock (259fcd)

  328. “Pick a lane. If it was a riot you’re going to need something more than a “definitive call” to stop it.”

    Please…if the President makes a passionate appeal to cease and desist….you know, rather than calling out the weakness of Pence….you honestly don’t think that the word wouldn’t have spread quickly. The absence of any message was tacit approval to continue the confrontation. If your reasoning has any basis, why did Trump later post any video calling to deescalate? He only did it because he was losing the public relations battle…and was compelled by his advisors to do something….as late…meager….and qualified….as it was

    AJ_Liberty (ec7f74)

  329. “Pick a lane. If it was a riot you’re going to need something more than a “definitive call” to stop it.”

    The “lane” is reality. There was a riot, Trump’s call to arms initiated it, it happened. Period.

    That he then didn’t do anything to stop it after the fact is completely irrelevant. Suck it up, you own it.

    Colonel Klink (Ret) (1367c0)

  330. I’m also certain that Ducklo’s superiors took into his cancer diagnosis into consideration with short suspension. They should have suspended him for at least a couple of months.

    Rip Murdock (259fcd) — 2/15/2021 @ 10:06 am

    Would you have fired him before making sure you had a full understanding of what happened? Once you had that would you have wanted to review it with your boss before proceeding?

    If all I knew was that he threatened to “destroy” someone whose job was to report on my boss (the President)? There are no extenuating circumstances.

    Yes.

    Rip Murdock (259fcd) — 2/15/2021 @ 10:09 am

    We don’t know for sure, but I think the suspension was a temporary action while the made their decision.

    Regarding the extenuating circumstances, my point is that you know what’s being reported but you don’t know what’s happened until you talk to the people who are involved. Even if you’re expecting to let them go you probably want to find out if they made a single mistake or if this was typical of how they operated when no one was looking. That would impact if you let them resign, if you fire them, if there is severance or recommendations.

    Again, my point is that they made the right decision in what looks to be a reasonable amount of time.

    Time123 (53ef45)

  331. @268. Again you need schooled; the objective was/is/remains to neuter the modern ideological conservative movement. Trump essentially accomplished this; leveraged by a simmering populism of an increasing number of credit card Reaganomics left-behinds; suckered, betrayed, seduced and abandoned by Swampland’s that truest ‘Big Lie’ since Vietnam and Watergate- foundering to survive in a caldron lit 1/20/81. The temperature rose over the decades as did the numbers falling into the pot yet still paying the freight; from Buchanan to Perot to Palin to finally boiling over w/a Trump win. And they ain’t going to just disappear. Don’t blame Jimma. But be prepared to blame President Plagiarist for more swamp talk in direct proportion to less and less action.

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  332. Colonel Klink (Ret) (1367c0) — 2/15/2021 @ 10:36 am

    That he then didn’t do anything to stop it after the fact is completely irrelevant.

    Then why all the complaints about issuing a strongly worded tweet? It looks like there are a lot of people in this thread who would disagree with whether actions after the riot started are relevant.

    Suck it up, you own it.

    Do I get a deed or a title? Some sort of bill of sale? Any sort of receipt?

    frosty (470cf8)

  333. AJ_Liberty (ec7f74) — 2/15/2021 @ 10:27 am

    I get the sense that you’re responding to me instead of the point because

    He only did it because he was losing the public relations battle

    is basically my point. Either there was a riot, hint there was a riot, and any strongly worded message is meaningless because that isn’t how you stop a riot or it wasn’t and word would have spread quickly. It can’t be both a protest where word would have spread and a riot, which is by definition out of control.

    frosty (470cf8)

  334. Lindsay Graham looked worse…

    Some day ‘folks’ are going to realize that in this era, the bad guy wasn’t Trump– he just picked up the flag and carried it– but the collection of swamp creatures like Graham who’ve fed the rise of populism by their own devious, two-faced swampolitics.

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  335. J_Liberty (ec7f74) — 2/15/2021 @ 10:27 am

    I get the sense that you’re responding to me instead of the point because

    He only did it because he was losing the public relations battle

    is basically my point. Either there was a riot, hint there was a riot, and any strongly worded message is meaningless because that isn’t how you stop a riot or it wasn’t and word would have spread quickly. It can’t be both a protest where word would have spread and a riot, which is by definition out of control.

    frosty (470cf8) — 2/15/2021 @ 12:13 pm

    The fact that he didn’t make an honest effort to stop if is evidence that he supported what was happening. I don’t say proof, but evidence.

    Time123 (b4d075)

  336. End of a career; the splitting hairs presser:

    Cuomo-ver.

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  337. Paul Montagu (77c694) — 2/15/2021 @ 9:49 am

    Why does that prohibit me from concluding that his death doesn’t absolve Trump (and his faithful terrorist rioters who fought Sicknick) from responsibility?

    It doesn’t prohibit you from concluding anything. If I said that I misspoke. But you haven’t provided any evidence for the conclusion. You shouldn’t be surprised when someone comes along and points that out.

    Are you that in-the-bag for Trump that you must defend him no matter what?

    I haven’t defended Trump. Can you point to an example of me doing that? This really seems to be the saddest NeverTrump response to criticism. Do you really expect to be immune to criticism “because Trump”? There’s some irony in you accusing me of being lazy and dishonest and then trotting this out.

    Sicknick, 42, was struck in the head by a fire extinguisher while “physically engaging” with rioters at the Capitol, authorities said.

    Is this your evidence for a linkage? How long did you have to search for an article still repeating this myth? You do know that the NY Times “quietly edited” their reporting on this? Here is a more recent FoxNews article on the Times making the update. Here is an article from FoxNews a day after the one you linked that’s shifting to the bear mace theory. I linked to a CNN video earlier that corrected this fire extinguisher claim and also reported that the ME didn’t find any blunt force trauma. The original story tracks back to an AP report based on an anonymous source, not “authorities”, in the capital police dept. There is zero evidence that he was struck with a fire extinguisher. The only actual claim we’ve got is that he was exposed to bear mace.

    If his death was pure coincidence, unrelated to the riot he physically engaged in just hours earlier, then I’ll amend my assessment.

    You have no evidence that it wasn’t.

    Why do you need that to be true so badly?

    I really don’t understand how you are misunderstanding me. I don’t need this to be true. I am telling you objective facts. I haven’t claimed either way whether he was injured at all. I’ve simply stated that there is no evidence that he suffered any injuries during the riot that caused his death. This is a known unknown. Your real question is why I won’t leave you alone to make whatever claims you want to make and live in your own bubble.

    You’re the one who called me out, frosty. Don’t play the affronted person by switching things around.

    I called you out because you are making a claim that has no evidence to back it up. Now it looks like you are retreating to the fire extinguisher claim which is known to be false. Is that your claim now? That he died after being beaten with a fire extinguisher?

    frosty (f27e97)

  338. Time123 (53ef45) — 2/15/2021 @ 10:04 am

    Biden’s pledge made the situation what it was. Since I’m a big softy, I would’ve suspended him with pay so that he could keep his healthcare, but probably for longer than a week. I probably would’ve broken the pledge, given the sincerity of his apology and the situation he was in. He made a noble decision to take himself out of the equation.

    Paul Montagu (73397d)

  339. I called you out because you are making a claim that has no evidence to back it up. Now it looks like you are retreating to the fire extinguisher claim which is known to be false.

    I don’t accept your position that no one can make judgments about a situation without complete information, so I categorically reject your premise, and I clearly said that he wasn’t killed by a fire extinguisher. We work with the best information available, and from that I concluded that Trump is responsible for his death, as are the domestic terrorists he fought with. Your conclusion is obviously something else.

    Paul Montagu (73397d)

  340. 349. Paul Montagu (73397d) — 2/15/2021 @ 1:23 pm

    He made a noble decision to take himself out of the equation.

    It’s quite possible that Biden, or someone working for him. found a campaign contributor to take care of him, and make him an offer he couldn’t refuse, (resign or no help and be fired) so it looked like he was voluntarily resigning, but he wasn’t.

    Sammy Finkelman (00fff5)

  341. 337.

    The fact that he didn’t make an honest effort to stop if is evidence that he supported what was happening.

    After the fact. He weighed the pros and cons.

    But there was no way to see it except as a negative. He tried to get the best of both worlds by limiting himself to coming out against violence and in support of the Capitol police, while trying to use the riot as an argument for not disputing the claims about the election. (i.e. arguing don’t make people angry at you.)

    Sammy Finkelman (00fff5)

  342. In conection with the publisher of the New York Times caving into “woke” members of his staff, and firing, two years after first dealing with this, someone who used a denigrating word in a question to someone who complained,it’s been pointed out that the first member of the family which currently owns the New York Times to own it, (he bought it in 1896) – his mother was a supporter of slavery, the Confederacy and the Ku Klux Klan. They just considered her crazy, though, and his father supported the Union.

    I don’t want to use the full name of the first owner in the family because his first name is one I don’t want to use.

    https://nypost.com/2020/07/18/the-family-that-owns-the-new-york-times-were-slaveholders-goodwin

    [In 1906] the Times published a glowing profile of Confederate President Jefferson Davis on the 100th anniversary of his birth, calling him “the great Southern leader.”

    Ochs reportedly made contributions to rebel memorials, including $1,000 to the enormous Stone Mountain Memorial in Georgia that celebrates Davis, Robert E. Lee and Stonewall Jackson. He made the donation in 1924 so his mother, who died 16 years earlier, could be on the founders’ roll, adding in a letter that “Robert E. Lee was her idol.”

    In the years before his death in 1931, Ochs’ brother George was simultaneously an officer of the New York Times Company and a leader of the New York Chapter of the Sons of Confederate Veterans.

    Sammy Finkelman (00fff5)

  343. Re: Stone Mountain, Georgia.

    I think opponents of the Klan successfully secretly disrupted, derailed and destroyed that project (completed work was even dynamited) in the 1920s.

    hey lured away the sculptor (I surmise the dispute didn’t just happen) and eventually got him to build Mount Rushmore instead.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stone_Mountain

    Financial conflicts between Borglum and the Association led to his firing in 1925.[17]:85 He destroyed his models, claiming that they were his property, but the Association disagreed and had a warrant issued for his arrest. He was warned of the arrest and narrowly escaped to North Carolina, whose governor, Angus McLean, refused to extradite him,[17]:89 though he could not return to Georgia. The affair was highly publicized and there was much discussion and discord, including discord between Sam Venable, the Association, and its president Hollins Randolph.[17]:103, 116–119 The face of Lee that Borglum had partially completed was blasted off the mountain in 1928.[17]:111

    Borglum’s next major project was Mount Rushmore.

    But Georgia later restarted it in 1964, after planning to do so in 1958-9.

    Stone Mountain was not built in imitation of Mount Rushmore. It’s the other way around even though Stone Mountain was completed only in 1972 and Mount Rushmore in 1941.

    Sammy Finkelman (00fff5)

  344. https://www.wsj.com/articles/the-minimum-wages-racially-discriminatory-roots-11613517678

    …What Democrats play down is that most minimum-wage earners aren’t impoverished, and most people who qualify as poor already earn more than the minimum. Poor families need jobs more than they need raises. And what teens and young adults most need are opportunities to accumulate job experience that can lead to higher pay and upward social mobility down the road. By reducing employment opportunities, minimum-wage laws can make inequality worse.

    Low-income minorities stand to lose the most from lifting the wage floor because they are overrepresented among less-skilled and less-experienced workers. Labor economists William Even and David Macpherson’s study of the impact of state minimum-wage mandates in 2007-09 found that they cost younger blacks more jobs than the Great Recession did.

    Sammy Finkelman (00fff5)


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