Patterico's Pontifications

1/6/2021

When Will Republicans Figure Out What They Have Done to Themselves?

Filed under: General — Patterico @ 8:29 am



Last night, Democrats retook the Senate, and it’s crystal clear why: because Donald Trump and his superfans pushed the notion that the presidential election in Georgia had been rigged. As many of us predicted, this depressed Republican turnout — which was high, but nowhere near as high as that of the Democrats.

Donald Trump owns this defeat.

If Trump had simply accepted his loss, there would be no grandstanding by Hawley and Cruz. There would have been no rallies with Lin Wood telling a huge crowd of Trumpers to stay home from this election. It is as certain as anything in politics that Trump caused the GOP to lose the Senate.

From what I am seeing from Trump superfans this morning, they refuse to acknowledge this. Well of course they do! What is Trumpism about, if not denying reality? For five years, this guy has made the stupidest pronouncements possible — that Obama had tapped his phones; that COVID would just disappear; that this election was stolen from him — and a machine of disinformation has kicked into gear to try to find evidence to back up whatever stupid thing Trump said. Why should the disinformation stop now?

And the culmination of all of it was last night. Trumpers stay home in Georgia, while Trumpers in D.C. fought in the streets with police:

And meanwhile, Donald Trump handed the Majority Leader title to Chuck Schumer. And today, we will see more of the same, with the clownish spectacle of Josh Hawley and Ted Cruz and the rest of the coup caucus standing to degrade democracy while they faux-piously and very insincerely claim they are trying to save it. Jonathan Rauch put it well in a piece for Persuasion:

For four years, President Trump has made Russian-style “firehose of falsehood” disinformation tactics a staple of his governance. After the election, he and his allies have taken those tactics to a new level, deploying lies and lawsuits to convince tens of millions of Americans, and half of all Republicans, that the election was rigged. Having turned courts into propaganda channels, they will do the same to Congress on Wednesday, using the final stage of the presidential-selection process—the heart of America’s constitutional order—as a disinformation platform.

Meanwhile, we have two competing narratives as to what Mike Pence thinks his role is. First, we have that of the Fake News; namely, Maggie Haberman at the New York Times:

Vice President Mike Pence told President Trump on Tuesday that he did not believe he had the power to block congressional certification of Joseph R. Biden Jr.’s victory in the presidential election despite Mr. Trump’s baseless insistence that he did, people briefed on the conversation said.

. . . .

Even as he sought to make clear that he does not have the power Mr. Trump seems to think he has, Mr. Pence also indicated to the president that he would keep studying the issue up until the final hours before the joint session of Congress begins at 1 p.m. Wednesday, according to the people briefed on their conversation.

One option being considered, according to a person close to Mr. Trump, was having Mr. Pence acknowledge the president’s claims about election fraud in some form during one or more of the Senate debates about the results from particular states before the certification. Mr. Pence will preside over those debates.

Then we have the exact opposite from Donald J. Trump:

This is the rare instance where we get to immediately find out who’s telling the truth: the Fake News or Donald Trump? When Pence delivers his horseshit speech about election fraud, but does nothing about it because he can’t, you think he is going to explain that he has no power to do anything? I sure do.

Well, Trumpers? It’s Fake News vs. Donald Trump, and the answer comes today. Who wants to put any money on it?

Nobody will take me up on it, because deep down, you know I’m right. You don’t want to admit Trump cost you guys the Senate, but he did. You don’t want to admit that he actually lost the election, but he did. You don’t want to admit that the New York Times is right and that Trump is lying about what Pence believes his powers to be, but deep down you know it’s true, and by the end of today the facts will have proved your gut-level suspicions to be right.

It’s not too late to reject Soviet-style disinformation. But it’s gonna take you time. A lot of time.

169 Responses to “When Will Republicans Figure Out What They Have Done to Themselves?”

  1. Hi NHRob! Hi harkin! Hi beer b pretzels! Who’s lying? Trump or Maggie Haberman? Y’all want to get on record with your opinion?

    LOL. Of course you don’t. You’ll talk about anything else under the sun but that. Prove me right in 3…2…1…

    Patterico (115b1f)

  2. Patterico:

    You are relying on Pence to do what he is legally obligated to do. He will not be successful in the GOP primary in 2024 if he does that. Proud Boys will visit his house if he does that. Trump will tweet mean if he does that.

    You are putting your money on an abject toady failing to toady. I wouldn’t do that, if I were you.

    Appalled (1a17de)

  3. I do love a very quick resolution to disputed facts.

    nate_w (1f1d55)

  4. Appalled,

    What do you think Pence will do?

    johnnyagreeable (041dc0)

  5. I was going to publish a post but just saw that this was up. In my post, I also made the point that Trump owns it all:

    Trump owns it. All of it. We are where we are at today solely because of his efforts to overturn a legitimate election with baseless lies and accusations. Sixty-two times the courts said “no” to him, and still, he refused to accept the election loss. This whole debacle, including today’s proceedings, is on him. And as for Vice-president Mike Pence, he should have known it would eventually come down to this. He has seen the same writing on the wall that we have. Even more so. When you choose to sign away your reputation and integrity for someone like Trump, you will, inevitably, find yourself in the vice-grip quandary of having to again prove your loyalty to him or find yourself under the wheels of a bus if you choose to do make the only right and lawful choice.

    But until Trump superfans admit this and accept their role in the demise of the Party over the last four years, nothing will change on the right side of the aisle. In fact, it will become even more fractured and weakened by the division. And yet Trump, of course, will never see nor ever admit that the wreck that we see today is the result of his delusional behavior.

    As usual, Mitt Romney cuts through Trump’s fever dream with the blunt truth:

    “President Trump has disrespected the American voters, has dishonored the election system and has disgraced the office of the presidency. I’m confident we’ll proceed as the Constitution demands and tell our supporters the truth, whether or not they want to hear it.”

    Dana (cc9481)

  6. Sorry, Dana. I usually check to see if anything is in the pipeline but I was in a hurry and angry; bad combo. You can see the post is kind of a stream of consciousness.

    Patterico (115b1f)

  7. Patterico:

    You are relying on Pence to do what he is legally obligated to do. He will not be successful in the GOP primary in 2024 if he does that. Proud Boys will visit his house if he does that. Trump will tweet mean if he does that.

    You are putting your money on an abject toady failing to toady. I wouldn’t do that, if I were you.

    I trust the NYT over Donald Trump. Pence is a toady — and he will make that clear by praising Trump, claiming there was fraud with no evidence, etc.

    But he’s not stupid. When it comes down to it, he can’t do anything, he knows he can’t do anything, and I predict he will explicitly say he can’t do anything. He would steal the election if he could! But gosh darn it he just can’t.

    Patterico (115b1f)

  8. Republicans turn on Trump after Georgia loss
    ……
    “Trump is the cause of this, lock, stock and barrel,” said one Republican strategist. “But when you’re relying on someone to win you a Senate race that also lost statewide eight weeks prior, you’re not in a position of strength.”

    The immediate recrimination is emblematic of the complicated GOP dynamics that have emerged after Trump’s loss in the November election. Fissures are forming as Republicans decide whether it’s useful to cling to Trump — even as he tries to subvert an election — or to distance themselves. And if the Georgia races are any indication, it appears Republicans are willing to turn on Trump if he can’t reliably turn out the vote for candidates in the months and years ahead.

    When asked why Republicans didn’t prevail on Tuesday, a senior Senate Republican aide simply said: “Donald J. Trump.”
    ……
    Even at a Monday rally designed to drum up voting for Loeffler and Perdue, the president obsessed over his own political grievances, swiping at lawmakers from his own party, including Georgia Republican Gov. Brian Kemp.

    The behavior left Republicans shaking their heads Tuesday night, incensed that it might have cost them two critical races.

    They ticked off a variety of reasons why Trump was to blame, even offering conflicting theories. For instance, while some Republicans wished Trump had been more involved in the races, others argued he should have actually excised himself from the situation.

    “He is the Dems’ best base animator,” said one GOP strategist involved in the Georgia races. “Look at how high turnout was on their side compared to historical trends. Look at how much their candidates raised. He steps back after Election Day and denies them that oxygen. He didn’t.”
    …..
    Far-right corners of the party only contributed to voter skepticism and confusion. At one point, pro-Trump attorneys Lin Wood and Sidney Powell held a rally in Alpharetta, Ga., where they encouraged voters to boycott the runoff elections unless Raffensperger changed the state’s election process.

    “Why would you go back and vote in another rigged election?” Wood asked the cheering crowd.

    “I would encourage all Georgians to make it known that you will not vote until your vote is secure,” said Powell, who pushed false conspiracy theories about state voting machines being corrupted by the dead Venezuelan dictator Hugo Chavez.

    The suggestion prompted the president to pick up the phone and ask Wood to “knock it off.”

    But the damage may have already been done.

    “Turns out if the leader of a party spends two months actively delegitimizing elections and saying voting doesn’t matter, voters listen,” said a Republican who worked on the runoff races. “There was one decisive factor in Georgia and anyone who says otherwise is probably sharing substances with Lin Wood.”
    ……

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  9. Biden to nominate Merrick Garland as AG. I’m sure he was waiting on the Georgia Senate results.

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  10. #8

    He might do that. He might also convince himself that the courts will save him the trouble of doing something brave. Guess we will know soon.

    Appalled (1a17de)

  11. Todd Herman substituting for Rush Limbaugh, says there is a rumor, which seems to be true, that Kevin McCarthy is going to “cave” to Liz Cheney and give Republicans who don’t want to reject the electors, speaking time – and the Republican side won’t be all in favor of rejection.

    Sammy Finkelman (fac2c6)

  12. Patterico,
    Good post but you missed putting in the numbers to show the changes in turnout. What we can see from the numbers is that GOP turnout dropped slightly more, and the more ‘Trumpy’ Candidate did worse. Bottom line, Trump is killing the GOP. Which he might be fine with. If he can force people to kiss his butt under threat of turning his dim witted horde on them he can maintain what he loves most; empty praise.

    Got This from the AP today, so values might change.

    3-Nov
    Trump 2,461,854
    Biden 2,473,633

    Jan 5 runoff
    Perdue 2,195,532 votes and 89.2% of Trump’s vote total in general.
    Ossoff 2,213,099 votes and 89.5% of Biden’s vote total in general

    Loeffler 2,176,999 votes and 88.4% of Trump’s vote total in general
    Warnock 2,231,738 votes and 90.2% of Biden’s vote total in general

    Time123 (f5cf77)

  13. Todd Herman substituting for Rush Limbaugh, says there is a rumor, which seems to be true, that Kevin McCarthy is going to “cave” to Liz Cheney and give Republicans who don’t want to reject the electors, speaking time – and the Republican side won’t be all in favor of rejection.

    Sammy Finkelman (fac2c6) — 1/6/2021 @ 9:38 am

    smart move, if rather minor. Wake me when the GOP starts stripping the anti-american loons like Cruz of their seniority and committee seats.

    Time123 (f5cf77)

  14. Donald Trump addressed a rally today. At least he didn’t blame his loss entirely on cheating – or he wanted to use two arguments. He also said it was because they didn’t want to give people $2,000 to “let them live” a little. “Live” used in the sense of enjoy life. But then he alsoremembered to include cheating.

    Trump is said to have conceded to three Republicans that he knows he really lost.

    Sammy Finkelman (fac2c6)

  15. @10

    Biden to nominate Merrick Garland as AG. I’m sure he was waiting on the Georgia Senate results.

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8) — 1/6/2021 @ 9:34 am

    I really find this facinating.

    What would motivate an Appellate Chief Judge to give up a lifetime term for a 4 year (maybe 8 year) term?

    He’s not a spring chicken (68 yo now) and I expected Garland would be the next scotus pick.

    whembly (c30c83)

  16. It’s a low bar and a low Barr, but I’m confident Mr. Garland will be a much better AG than his predecessor.

    Paul Montagu (77c694)

  17. @16-
    To stick it up McConnell’s a@@ for denying him a SC seat. It also allows Biden to fill his court seat with someone younger. He still could be nominated to the SC at some point, but the trend is to nominate younger persons as justices.

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  18. Today’s Republican Party: Convinced that they are right, and telling crowds that both he and the President are willing to stake their um, reputations on it, Rudy Guiliani just said to an enthusiastic crowd in D.C.: “Let’s have trial by combat”.

    Dana (cc9481)

  19. Trump effect:

    At a press conference this morning, Gabriel Sterling, voting system implementation manager for the Georgia secretary of state’s office, said the Republican candidate for the Georgia Public Service Commission ran about 30,000 votes ahead of the Republican Senate candidates.

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  20. What would motivate an Appellate Chief Judge to give up a lifetime term for a 4 year (maybe 8 year) term?

    Freedom to form policy and procedure. From executions to immigration to anti-trust to civil rights to all the other things the DOJ has its fingers in down to FBI agents wearing bodycams. I imagine. I do not belong to the Inner Party. I am only a prole.

    nk (1d9030)

  21. It’s supposed to be starting about now, isn’t it?

    nk (1d9030)

  22. Assuming the Dems hold the Senate through Biden’s first term, I expect Garland will fill the next Supreme Court vacancy. This job will be a nice placeholder for him until that happens. They’re already hinting that 82-year Breyer should think about retirement soon.
    I’m terrible at predictions, but I’m guessing that Pence will make some speechy noises about fraud and such before he settles down and does his Constitutional duty of opening envelopes and doing arithmetic.

    Paul Montagu (77c694)

  23. Yes. Streaming on CBS News for me.

    nk (1d9030)

  24. Looks like Haberman doesn’t have a “very good relationship” with Trump, so that’s why she didn’t “tee up” that story with the administration.

    Thankfully we’ll have the next four years of the press teeing up stories for the regime, blacking out Hunter scandals, suspending opposition media Twitter accounts, so we we can avoid this nasty “Soviet-style disinformation” stuff. Democracy Dies in Dissent.

    About this singular issue about one conversation that could’ve been interpreted in multiple ways, is it possible to not care?

    beer ‘n pretzels (042d67)

  25. Gosar is the first fascist to object, and the fascists in the chamber are clapping.

    Paul Montagu (77c694)

  26. @21

    What would motivate an Appellate Chief Judge to give up a lifetime term for a 4 year (maybe 8 year) term?

    Freedom to form policy and procedure. From executions to immigration to anti-trust to civil rights to all the other things the DOJ has its fingers in down to FBI agents wearing bodycams. I imagine. I do not belong to the Inner Party. I am only a prole.

    nk (1d9030) — 1/6/2021 @ 9:54 am

    I imagine that you’re right.

    Garland has history working for the DOJ and by all accounts has a stellar reputation as a prosecutor, so Biden should be able to get this nomination through w/o much fanfare (other than GOP getting a promise to let Durham complete his investigation and make public his report).

    whembly (c30c83)

  27. Looks like Pence has released a letter that supports the NYT summary of what was said.

    Once again Trump is shown to be a liar and the people that believed him are shown to be fools.

    Time123 (f5cf77)

  28. 16. whembly (c30c83) — 1/6/2021 @ 9:43 am

    He’s not a spring chicken (68 yo now) and I expected Garland would be the next scotus pick.

    He will be, if Biden gets to pick one.

    Sammy Finkelman (fac2c6)

  29. Objection to Arizona. Expected. Recess. Debate. Pence has followed procedure punctiliously so far.

    nk (1d9030)

  30. Pence’s statement: “It is my considered judgment that my oath to support and defend the Constitution constrains me from claiming unilateral authority to determine which electoral votes should be counted and which should be not.”

    Paul Montagu (77c694)

  31. Republicans in Georgia Stayed Home
    …..The Democrats won because Republicans did not show up. Democrats turned out at rates near their general election turnout. Republicans did not.

    The black vote crushed it. Black pastors and Stacey Abrams deserve some credit here. But the reality is the GOP did not perform. To the extent the election was stolen, the GOP stole it from itself. To the extent there was malfeasance, the President running ads on Atlanta radio this very week that the election was stolen is the malfeasance, not local boards of elections. To the extent there is misfeasance, the state GOP chair in Georgia attacking the Republican Secretary of State and lying about what happened in November is the misfeasance, not local boards of elections.
    …….
    The President ran ads over the past week telling Republicans that the Georgia election was stolen. He came in the night before the election and spent most of his time attacking the GOP. He too helped suppress the vote. His voters did not vote. Yes, the President deserves some blame here.

    The Georgia congressional delegation also told everyone Georgia and its Republican Secretary of State were collaborating with Democrats to steal the vote. So Trump voters did not show up. They took the my way or the highway approach. The area of state that saw the GOP mostly like to stay home is the area of the state with the QAnon Congresswoman who has vocally complained the election was stolen and everything is rigged.
    …….
    …….The area of North Georgia where Donald Trump went on Monday night turned out at a lower rate than the rest of the state. That area also has a QAnon Congresswoman now who very vocally has been claiming the Democrats were stealing the election.
    ……
    It turns out when the President, the congressmen, and the Georgia GOP State Chairman all tell Republicans that their votes don’t matter because the Democrats are stealing everything, those voters won’t show up. They suppressed their own vote and handed the Democrats the House, the Senate, and the White House for the first time since 2009.
    ……

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  32. Major Garrett of CBS thinks there is a question “whether the Republican Party survives.”

    Sammy Finkelman (fac2c6)

  33. About this singular issue about one conversation where the president tried to get the vice president to help him stage a coup that could’ve been interpreted in multiple ways, is it possible to not care?

    beer ‘n pretzels (042d67) — 1/6/2021 @ 10:07 am

    For you? sure. For people that care about American democracy? Somewhat less so.

    Time123 (f5cf77)

  34. @25 “…is it possible to not care?”

    Of course it’s possible. Your posting shows that you do care, doesn’t it?

    Roger (782680)

  35. Hi P!

    When will Republicans who voted Biden/Harris figure out what they have done to the country?”

    Fyp

    Take ownership bro and continue to ignore the sh*tstorm to come.

    What’s the over/under on the day you feel actual shame for your vote?

    And I didn’t vote for Trump but nice try.

    And LOL at framing this like there is no such thing as fake news.
    _

    harkin (933076)

  36. I did a slightly different calculation last night than you, Time123, and what I am estimating is that Perdue will end up receiving about 250,000 fewer votes than he did in November, but Ossoff will only receive about 150,000 fewer. Let’s assume that there are not a significant number of voters who switched votes from November to yesterday, and let’s assume that on balance the lazy voters who voted in November but didn’t bother to vote yesterday are balanced out evenly between the two parties. This would mean that approximately 100,000 Republican voters actively chose not to vote yesterday, presumably because they were so dispirited by either Trump’s nonsense over the last 60 days or because they swallowed his horsepucky that the Dems were going to steal the election by manufacturing votes anyway.

    I still read Powerline regularly, but it has undergone an interesting metamorphosis over the past four years. Two of the bloggers, John and Scott, largely became Trumpers while Paul remained suspicious of him and Steve played his cards very close to his vest and mostly blogged about other topics. The commenters on the blog came to be absolutely dominated by Trump diehards, to the degree that any criticism of Trump was considered cuckness if not outright treason. I note today, though, that both John and Scott have taken a very critical tone towards Trump’s shenanigans since Election Day and how that doomed the GOP candidates in Georgia. Naturally, the Trumpers are all up in arms at the betrayal by those two men.

    Anyway, I mention this because I think the Powerline commentariat might end up being a pretty good gauge to judge Trump’s short- and long-term effects on the GOP. If two years from now the Powerline commentariat has moved on and his searching for the next conservative savior then the GOP might just have a solid rebound. But if they are still stewing in their bitterness over how “the GOPe” treated their hero, then the Republican Party may be screwed for some time.

    JVW (ee64e4)

  37. Of course it’s possible. Your posting shows that you do care, doesn’t it?

    I was called out in the post. I wouldn’t care otherwise.

    So glad we’ve determined a politician can’t be trusted, and a partisan hack reporter can. Have you thought of trusting neither?

    beer ‘n pretzels (042d67)

  38. The win/lose margins in Georgia are so thin. Had McConnell ceased the ideological game playing of foot-dragging and immediately embraced President Trump’s call for $2000 emergency Covid relief to American citizens in a simple, clean, stand-alone vote, Georgia might still be red as the clay in its ground and the Turtle still Majority Leader. But no. Too many years of games; too clever by half. The Turtle brought tipped over the kettle of hot soup– on himself.

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  39. Ok Ok, always trust content from Patterico…Can I say I am glad to be wrong? Maybe Pence prayed on it and got an answer.

    Appalled (1a17de)

  40. U.S. Senate runoffs poised to hand Georgia Democrats historic win
    ……
    As of Wednesday morning, Warnock held about a 53,000-vote lead over Loeffler. ….. (and) Democrat Jon Ossoff held a slim 16,000-vote lead over Republican Sen. David Perdue in Georgia’s other Senate runoff. …..
    …….
    There is one bright spot for Republicans, though: Lauren “Bubba” McDonald, who is running for reelection in Georgia’s lower profile runoff for the state Public Service Commission, held about a 69,000-vote lead over Democrat Daniel Blackman as of Wednesday morning. McDonald is the Republican candidate with the most votes, in spite being in the third race down on the ballot.
    …….
    A lot of Republicans voted for “Bubba” but didn’t vote for Perdue/Loeffler.

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  41. What does “Fyp” mean, harkin?

    Paul Montagu (b3a6f0)

  42. For you? sure. For people that care about American democracy? Somewhat less so.

    The president you wanted takes office in two weeks, no matter how the conversation gets interpreted or who was right about it. He’ll hold the levers of power for the next four years. I dunno, maybe focus on that.

    beer ‘n pretzels (042d67)

  43. Fixed your post

    Time123 (9f42ee)

  44. “I was called out in the post.”
    _

    Your posting shows that you do care, doesn’t it” about replying to being directly called out takes ‘thick’ to a new level.

    But he did an aces job on finding out Kamala Harris is a soulless power-hungry wraith…..now.
    _

    harkin (933076)

  45. Well at least the Republicans can start complaining about the debt and the size of government again now that they are out of power.

    kaf (87f0c4)

  46. What does “Fyp” mean, harkin?”

    Seriously?

    https://www.allacronyms.com/FYP/Fixed_Your_Post
    _

    harkin (933076)

  47. @38 “Have you thought of trusting neither?”

    Of course. I think of that possibility all the time, and there are many instances when I do not trust either. But if I am really indifferent about an issue, I don’t post about it, even if I’m “called out.” It’s also always possible just to ignore something.

    Roger (782680)

  48. Well, Trumpers? It’s Fake News vs. Donald Trump, and the answer comes today. Who wants to put any money on it?

    Welp, now we have Pence’s statement on the matter:

    Pence breaks with Trump on Electoral College role

    Vice President Mike Pence on Wednesday publicly broke with President Donald Trump, the boss he’s served obsequiously for four years, saying in a letter to Congress that he cannot submit to demands he overthrow the results of the election.

    Pence formalized his views in a letter to lawmakers, declaring he has no “unilateral authority to decide presidential contests” and could not change the results of the election.

    “It is my considered judgement that my oath to support and defend the Constitution constrains me from claiming unilateral authority to determine which electoral votes should be counted and which should not,” he wrote.

    It was the final word from Pence before he presided over a joint session of Congress to tally the Electoral College votes.

    It’s unimaginable, but it sure seems that Donald Trump has been caught in a lie!

    Dave (1bb933)

  49. harkin, it’s an interesting question as to whether Trump lost because he was stabbed in the back by GOP voters. Here’s a breakdown of the percentages of votes by Republicans in the past several elections:

    2020: Trump 91%, Biden 8%
    2016: Trump 90%, Clinton 7%
    2012: Romney 93%, Obama 6%
    2008: McCain 90%, Obama 9%
    2004: Bush 93%, Kerry 6%
    2000: Bush 91%, Gore 8%

    If Trump had hit the 20-year high mark of 93% of GOP voters that Romney and Bush achieved, that would likely have given him an overall greater share of the vote somewhere around .67% and .8% depending upon the state (this assuming that the party affiliation this year generally broke 1/3 Democrat, 1/3 Republican, 1/3 Independent, give or take; naturally it varies state by state). Under that scenario Trump wins Arizona and Georgia, and maybe Wisconsin by a whisker, but he still loses Pennsylvania, Michigan, and the split district covering Omaha, and we thus have a glorious 269-269 Electoral College tie, which is exactly what we deserved in this stupid election season.

    In any case, Patterico left the GOP four years ago, and he votes in hyper-leftist California, so blaming him for Trump’s loss is crazy.

    JVW (ee64e4)

  50. There’s some of The Donald in the beardd monkeyshines of Canadian Cruz; he wants those simmering Trumpsters to rally to him for 2024.

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  51. Vice President Mike Pence on Wednesday publicly broke with President Donald Trump, the boss he’s served obsequiously for four years, saying in a letter to Congress that he cannot submit to demands he overthrow the results of the election.

    How typically snide of CNN to toss in the word “obsequiously.” If Pence were a Democrat, the word used would of course be “loyally.” That network is just chock-full of a-holes, isn’t it?

    JVW (ee64e4)

  52. Trump set to be first president since 1932 to lose reelection, the House and the Senate

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8) — 1/6/2021 @ 10:42 am

    1932 wasn’t a good time for people in general. Nor was the next decade and a half for that matter.

    But we will be getting $2000 thanks to the voters of Georgia. So we have that going for us…which is nice.

    Hoi Polloi (093fb9)

  53. A lot of Republicans voted for “Bubba” but didn’t vote for Perdue/Loeffler.

    Man, who wouldn’t vote for a woman who goes by “Bubba”? I say we nominate her for President in 2024.

    EDIT: Aw hell, it’s a “he.” Never mind. Man, these Southern men with feminine names: Lindsay, Lauren, Rand. No wonder they lost the damn war.

    JVW (ee64e4)

  54. I’m not convinced that Garland is the next pick,and I’m confident that he should not be. Appointing him would almost certainly guarantee that he couldn’t be replaced by a Democrat.

    It’s been more than half a century since a majority of supreme court justices had been appointed by democrats. I’d expect after Trump that there would be some attention paid to that, and that means appointing young turks, not old hands.

    aphrael (4c4719)

  55. It’s unimaginable, but it sure seems that Donald Trump has been caught in a lie!

    Noooo! Say it ain’t so, Dave!

    nk (1d9030)

  56. 44.

    Trump set to be first president since 1932 to lose reelection, the House and the Senate

    Ford did also in 1976. So did George Bush the Elder in 1992.

    But in 1980, the Democrats still retained the House.

    Sammy Finkelman (fac2c6)

  57. Ford did also in 1976. So did George Bush the Elder in 1992.

    The argument made in the piece, Sammy, is that prior to Trump, only Herbert Hoover assumed office with his party holding the House and Senate and left after one term with both of them gone to the other party.

    JVW (ee64e4)

  58. Donald Trump owns this defeat.

    Nah. This is Mitch’s baby; an obtuse, game-playing ideologue who tried to be too clever by half– and finally tripped and fell on his own sword.

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  59. @54. But we will be getting $2000 thanks to the voters of Georgia. So we have that going for us…which is nice.

    Except surely the Never Trumpers will send it back to the Treasury in grand defiance of all things Trump, right? 😉

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  60. I’d expect after Trump that there would be some attention paid to that, and that means appointing young turks, not old hands.

    Agreed, aphrael. Obama’s picks were 54-year-old Sonia Sotomayor and 50-year-old Elena Kagan. No President will ever again pick a Supreme Court justice whom they don’t believe will serve at least 20 years on the Court.

    JVW (ee64e4)

  61. Considering that the US is currently in the worst place it’s been in since the great depression, it feels appropriate. 🙂

    aphrael (4c4719)

  62. “How typically snide of CNN to toss in the word “obsequiously.” If Pence were a Democrat, the word used would of course be “loyally.”

    – JVW

    Loyalty to a maniac is obsequiousness. Loyalty should be rationally justifiable.

    Leviticus (efada1)

  63. CBS covered live the speeches of Mitch McConnell and Chuck Schumer but they cut away to report on news right before Ted Cruz was to speak.

    CBS, I think, has ended its coverage for now. NBC is reporting news. The news is what’s going on outside the building.

    There was earlier a rally outside the White House, which Trump addressed. Many of the attendees than moved toward the Capitol. There is palpable tension among the Capitol Hill police.

    The Cannon Office Building and some other buildings have been evacuated and some Trump supporters scaled the inauguration stand and placed a Trump flag there.

    They’re clearly trying to avoid anybody getting hurt, but one person was taken away in a stretcher.

    More people are making their way to the area and there have been some arrests.

    Sammy Finkelman (fac2c6)

  64. Seeing on twitter that the “mob” descendeed capital hill and bum rushed the security looking to “occupy” the halls.

    Bring out the paddywagons police… arrest them all.

    whembly (c30c83)

  65. That’s not the strongest verb available, Whembly…Karnak the Magnificent answer would be the title of Mettalica’s debut studio album.

    urbanleftbehind (20d986)

  66. They all lie, Davey:

    https://word83291.wordpress.com/2019/04/13/these-are-the-biggest-lies-told-by-other-u-s-presidents-and-how-donald-trump-compares/

    “Do the people of the South really entertain fears that a Republican administration would, directly or indirectly, interfere with their slaves, or with them, about their slaves? If they do, I wish to assure you, as once a friend, and still, I hope, not an enemy, that there is no cause for such fears.” – A. Lincoln

    ‘In Dwight D. Eisenhower’s presidency, he denied that U-2 spy planes were flying over the Soviet Union when, in fact, the were. In 1960, when the USSR shot down an American plane and captured its pilot, President Eisenhower had to admit that the CIA had been flying spy missions of the USSR for years.’ Ike lied.

    “We did not, I repeat, did not trade weapons or anything else [to Iran] for hostages, nor will we,” Ronald Reagan told the American people when suspicions started to rise. Though, a few months later, he admitted to doing just that: “A few months ago, I told the American people I did not trade arms for hostages. My heart and my best intentions still tell me that’s true, but the facts and evidence tell me it is not.” Oops goes the Ronnie.

    ‘Read my lips, no new taxes’ Pappy Bush; Clinton on Monica, Obama and doctors… and the ‘I am not a crook’ Big Dick. They all lie.

    … and Putin smiled.

    ______

    Capitol in lockdown.

    … and Putin laughed… Xi merely grinned.

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  67. Breaking-

    Capitol under police lockdown.

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  68. They’re “storming” the Capitol. No surprise; long in coming:

    “The peasants are coming with pitchforks,” [declares a chuckling Buchanan at his rallies. He compares his opponents with “knights and barons, riding into the castle, pulling up the drawbridge.”] – Pat Buchanan, 1996

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  69. The US Capitol is on lockdown during a tense situation with demonstrators outside the building, according to Capitol police officers.

    A CNN employee tried to leave the building and couldn’t because police said the building is on lockdown.

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  70. 59 JVW (ee64e4) — 1/6/2021 @ 11:01 am

    The argument made in the piece, Sammy, is that prior to Trump, only Herbert Hoover assumed office with his party holding the House and Senate and left after one term with both of them gone to the other party.

    So did Taft in 1912.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Party_divisions_of_United_States_Congresses

    Sammy Finkelman (fac2c6)

  71. CNN reporting that staff is being told to hide in place due to protestors have breached the Capitol and are on the same floor as the Senate.

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  72. Per CNN, flash bang grenades have been launched over the last hour.

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  73. Protestors are seen milling about Statuary Hall, no police around. Pence is in a “secure location.”

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  74. “Do the people of the South really entertain fears that a Republican administration would, directly or indirectly, interfere with their slaves, or with them, about their slaves? If they do, I wish to assure you, as once a friend, and still, I hope, not an enemy, that there is no cause for such fears.” – A. Lincoln

    That was the truth. But God wouldn’t let him carry it out.

    The reason the South seceded was that southern politicians would not be able to aspire to national offices because they had to defend slavery, so Abraham Lincoln’s argument was besides the point.

    Eisenhower did lie.

    “We did not, I repeat, did not trade weapons or anything else [to Iran] for hostages, nor will we,” Ronald Reagan told the American people when suspicions started to rise. Though, a few months later, he admitted to doing just that: “A few months ago, I told the American people I did not trade arms for hostages. My heart and my best intentions still tell me that’s true, but the facts and evidence tell me it is not.”

    It wasn’t sold to him as trading arms for hostages. It was sold to him as helping good guys, or better guys, in Iran gain influence.

    Sammy Finkelman (fac2c6)

  75. In any case, Patterico left the GOP four years ago, and he votes in hyper-leftist California, so blaming him for Trump’s loss is crazy.”
    __

    My vote for Biden/Harris is meaningless because location” is so pure.

    You either are willing to declare a candidate is your choice by voting for them or you don’t. I declined to vote for either knowing it meant submitting myself to the decision of Clown Team 1 or Clown Team 2.

    IOW my integrity kept me from joining either circus.

    I never once (either here or anywhere else) told anyone how to vote, only that I thought both Trump and Biden were unfit for office, this also goes for Harris because the odds of her succeeding to the office of President are obviously elevated due to Biden’s age, obvious sanity questions and some in the media openly calling for her to shove old Joe aside.

    I also went out of my way to convince conservative Never-Trumpers who thought Biden-Harris was an acceptable solution to Trump that they were delusional.

    But you’re correct that me calling P a Republican was wrong, I knew it just as I hit ‘submit’ that I should have said ‘conservative’.

    Hoping he wears his ‘CONSERVATIVES FOR BIDEN/HARRIS’ t-shirt proudly.
    _

    harkin (933076)

  76. Biden to nominate Merrick Garland as AG. I’m sure he was waiting on the Georgia Senate results.

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8) — 1/6/2021 @ 9:34 am

    Garland is a good, solid choice for AG. These kind of picks are going to be as good as one can expect from a Biden administration.

    HCI (92ea66)

  77. Debate in both chambers has stopped because the protestors have breached the building’s security.

    aphrael (4c4719)

  78. No better than Antifa. What a disgrace. Today will go down as one of the sorriest moments in history.

    HCI (92ea66)

  79. Oops, I forgot the link.

    twitter.com/RepNancyMace/status/1346890373319299073?s=20

    HCI (92ea66)

  80. DCSCA (f4c5e5) — 1/6/2021 @ 11:17 am

    and Putin laughed… Xi merely grinned.

    Xi seems to be more afraid of something that could happen in Hong Kong (like a leak?) than of a Cold War with the United States – or maybe he already expects it.

    https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-china-55555299

    https://www.nytimes.com/2021/01/06/world/asia/china-hong-kong-arrests.html

    Within a few hours on Wednesday, the Hong Kong police had arrested 53 people, searched 76 places and frozen $200,000 of assets in connection with an informal primary for the pro-democracy camp — all under the auspices of Beijing’s new national security law. In one swoop, the authorities rounded up not only some of the most aggressive critics of the Hong Kong government but also little-known figures who had campaigned on far less political issues, in one of the most forceful shows of power in the Chinese Communist Party’s continuing crackdown on the city.

    The message was clear: Beijing is in charge

    https://www.wsj.com/articles/hong-kong-police-arrest-dozens-of-opposition-politicians-over-alleged-subversion-11609895177

    Sammy Finkelman (fac2c6)

  81. Capitol police are requesting additional reinforcements and donning riot gear. The entire portico is occupied. This was entirely predictable.

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  82. The corrupt criminal orange sewer rat painted a target on Pence’s back:

    Donald J. Trump
    @realDonaldTrump
    Mike Pence didn’t have the courage to do what should have been done to protect our Country and our Constitution, giving States a chance to certify a corrected set of facts, not the fraudulent or inaccurate ones which they were asked to previously certify. USA demands the truth!

    nk (1d9030)

  83. Considering that the US is currently in the worst place it’s been in since the great depression, it feels appropriate.

    Courage, aphrael. I think we were in a lot worse shape from 1968-74. At least we don’t (as of yet) have bombings and assassinations.

    JVW (ee64e4)

  84. https://twitter.com/RepDeanPhillips/status/1346903927619510275?s=20 says that congressmen on the floor have been instructed to take cover and get gas masks ready.

    aphrael (4c4719)

  85. Looks like trump’s superfans are storming the capital buidling.

    Time123 (69b2fc)

  86. It’s a shame that today’s mostly peaceful protests have given way to a few bad actors who are anarchists and criminals unaffiliated with the cause.

    I mean, that’s how the mainstream media has taught us to think of these sort of things over the past eight months, isn’t it?

    JVW (ee64e4)

  87. This is a disgrace. And this orange motherf***er is the one his leg-humpers like NJRob, beer ‘n pretzels, and harkin, want to be sworn in to take care that the laws are faithfully executed?

    nk (1d9030)

  88. Here’s another Trump supporter who stormed the Capital assaulting the police.

    Time123 (69b2fc)

  89. @84: Gee, sounds “mostly peaceful” to me. So, when do we call the capitol police response “fascist”?

    Only 180 more nights like that and it might start looking like Portland.

    beer ‘n pretzels (042d67)

  90. nk @75: Video is from earlier today.

    It stars=ts with C-Span II showing Kimberley G.. and the cut away to the Senate with Mike Pence presiding.

    https://www.c-span.org/video/?507698-2/senate-debate-arizona-electoral-challenge-part-1

    This is running speeches from the beginning. The length is 44:33

    Thus is probably better than live.

    Sammy Finkelman (fac2c6)

  91. and Putin laughed… Xi merely grinned.
    Xi seems to be more afraid of something that could happen in Hong Kong (like a leak?) than of a Cold War with the United States – or maybe he already expects it.

    Xi is too busy burying Jack Ma’s body and confiscating his fortune to really care.

    Hoi Polloi (093fb9)

  92. @84: Gee, sounds “mostly peaceful” to me. So, when do we call the capitol police response “fascist”?

    Only 180 more nights like that and it might start looking like Portland.

    The media coverage of the damage caused by the riots in Portland and Minnesota is shameful. But to me, the key is that Biden hasn’t done anything to encourage such violence and has spoken out against it, whereas Trump IMO has a pretty direct connection to this.

    johnnyagreeable (041dc0)

  93. Yeah, asshole, because Congress certifying the Electoral Vote is just like Portland on Saturday night.

    nk (1d9030)

  94. senator Cruz begins at 19:38

    Sammy Finkelman (fac2c6)

  95. Not you, johnnyagreeable. beer ‘n trump’s salad.

    nk (1d9030)

  96. ‘@84.This was entirely predictable.’

    Yes.

    By Pat Buchanan 25 year ago. This has been building for decades.– and ‘rightly’ so.

    “Senator, don’t piss down my back and tell me it’s raining.”- Fletcher [John Vernon] ‘The Outlaw Josey Wales’ 1976

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  97. Crus is for door number 3.

    Sammy Finkelman (fac2c6)

  98. Armed standoff at House front doors.

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  99. i don’t know how to upload it here but a friend of mine sent me a still from an end of one of these videos showing people BUILDING BARRICADES INSIDE THE HOUSE CHAMBER

    aphrael (4c4719)

  100. House members issued gas masks.

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  101. 90.This is a disgrace.

    No. It’s magnificent. And long overdue; wholly avoidable thanks to the obtuse ideologues of both parties.

    If only Mitch had put America first and allowed angry,desperate Americans to get $2000 emergency Coivd $ rather then sending $ to Israel and Pakistan first.

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  102. @104. After breaking wind there for decades, do they need them? Besides, they’re supposed to all be wearing masks already.

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  103. Trump needs to be arrested, tried, and executed for treason.

    nk (1d9030)

  104. So far it is mostly peaceful. It’s only some of Trump’s followers that chose to storm the Capital and stop Congress from confirming that Biden won the election.

    But you don’t care.

    Time123 (69b2fc)

  105. @107. Very George III of you. LOL

    Wow. Americans in the Senate chamber. Pshaw.

    Glorious.

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  106. There’s no way this can end well. It’s baffling that they were allowed to get into the capital, this is a massive security screw up. How could you not have seen this coming?

    Manotaur (0c90cd)

  107. Well, this solves the Trump problem nicely. His trial for treason and/or sedition should be followed shortly thereafter by his public hanging on the steps of the Capitol.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  108. I’m watching the coverage on CBS. It seems obvious that the media is doing everything they can to create the perception that what is happening is far worse that what our eyes are witnessing. That this particular group of the governed have no right to protest, whereas all the rioters over the Summer where important and needed. I just heard a talking head actually say that the protest of the past Summer where all conducted “within the law.”

    felipe (630e0b)

  109. @110, Trump appointees are in many cases in charge of the security. He told them to go to the capitol to stop Congress. This is a coup attempt. It might be a badly planned and lead coup attempt but right now that’s what it looks like.

    Time123 (69b2fc)

  110. @108. You have it backwards; THEY don’t care.

    THEY never missed a paycheck. THEY play the ideological games; THEY wait to the last minute to do legisltion and run out of town and screw over citizens who pay their salaries; These

    Congresscritters are long overdue for a real world spanking.

    But not to worry; the plagiarist-elect will ‘bring us together’– a line plagiarized from The Big Dick himself, circa 1968.

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  111. I’m watching the coverage on CBS. It seems obvious that the media is doing everything they can to create the perception that what is happening is far worse that what our eyes are witnessing. That this particular group of the governed have no right to protest, whereas all the rioters over the Summer where important and needed. I just heard a talking head actually say that the protest of the past Summer where all conducted “within the law.”

    felipe (630e0b) — 1/6/2021 @ 12:06 pm

    as happened this summer you have 2 groups
    1. People who are peacefully protesting as is their right.
    2. People who are committing violence, in this case storming the capital while congress is in session and assaulting the police.

    The first is fine, the 2nd is criminal, and appears to be part of an attempt to prevent Biden from being confirmed by congress.

    Time123 (f5cf77)

  112. @101. ROFLMAO Let’s Make A Deal’s Monty Hall was Canadian, too.

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  113. Apparently an armed individual attempted to enter the House chamber with members present. Outcome unclear.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  114. @108. You have it backwards; THEY don’t care.

    THEY never missed a paycheck. THEY play the ideological games; THEY wait to the last minute to do legisltion and run out of town and screw over citizens who pay their salaries; These

    Congresscritters are long overdue for a real world spanking.

    But not to worry; the plagiarist-elect will ‘bring us together’– a line plagiarized from The Big Dick himself, circa 1968.

    DCSCA (f4c5e5) — 1/6/2021 @ 12:07 pm

    I’ve seen your comments for a while. I really have no idea what you think or what you support. I rarely read them because they all seem to be ‘plagiarism is bad’ wrapped in a word salad. Maybe there’s some key background or context I’m missing that would make your comments more sensical.

    Time123 (69b2fc)

  115. I will not buy into the narrative that these protestors are any worse than any other group. Simply because the protest have chosen this location. Do we remember how the occupation of Wisconsin’s Capitol was described as “this is what democracy looks like!” -really?

    felipe (630e0b)

  116. CBS-
    National Guard en route to Capitol. Mayor has requested an additional 200 troops, request “under review.”

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  117. Another picture of Trump supporters being Trump supporters.

    BNP, got any comment other then ‘whatabout portland’?

    Time123 (69b2fc)

  118. It’s baffling that they were allowed to get into the capital

    It is OUR Capitol; that We The People thingy. Frustrations have boile over; long time in coming.

    “The peasants are coming with pitchforks,” [declares a chuckling Buchanan at his rallies. He compares his opponents with “knights and barons, riding into the castle, pulling up the drawbridge.”] – Pat Buchanan, 1996

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  119. Time123 (f5cf77) — 1/6/2021 @ 12:08 pm

    I agree. Just remember that all is not as it seems.

    felipe (630e0b)

  120. Trump promised that today would be “wild.”

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  121. Too many drama queens on the TeeVee.

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  122. The federal law against seditious conspiracy can be found in Title 18 of the U.S. Code (which includes treason, rebellion, and similar offenses), specifically 18 U.S.C. § 2384. According to the statutory definition of sedition, it is a crime for two or more people within the jurisdiction of the United States:

    To conspire to overthrow or destroy by force the government of the United States or to level war against them;
    To oppose by force the authority of the United States government; to prevent, hinder, or delay by force the execution of any law of the United States; or
    To take, seize, or possess by force any property of the United States contrary to the authority thereof.

    https://criminal.findlaw.com/criminal-charges/sedition.html

    Clearly President Trump’s exhortation of these protests which predictably interfered with the Senate and House debate on the electoral vote violated the last two points.

    I wonder if Cruz and his followers will reconsider their position, or whether they will support the President and his seditious actions.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  123. Here’s what the DOJ set up for the BLM protest this summer. so they know how to do keep order through force when they want to.

    Time123 (f5cf77)

  124. Best TeeVee from Washington since 1968!

    Love it.

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  125. There’s no way this can end well. It’s baffling that they were allowed to get into the capital, this is a massive security screw up. How could you not have seen this coming?

    Without using lethal force (and a lot of it) how do you stop 10,000 people from going where they want?

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  126. Let be be clear that my gripe is with the two-faced coverage of these important events, be they civil or criminal.

    felipe (630e0b)

  127. I will not buy into the narrative that these protestors are any worse than any other group. Simply because the protest have chosen this location. Do we remember how the occupation of Wisconsin’s Capitol was described as “this is what democracy looks like!” -really?

    felipe (630e0b) — 1/6/2021 @ 12:12 pm

    I agree with you to a large degree, and everything isn’t what it seems.

    But Rioters are criminals and these particular rioters aren’t trying to make a statement by occupying the capital. They’re trying to prevent congress from Certifying the results of a fair election through the use of force.

    That changes things IMO.

    Time123 (f5cf77)

  128. Without using lethal force (and a lot of it) how do you stop 10,000 people from going where they want?

    All it would take is a few for everyone to get the message. Not that anyone wants to see that.

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  129. Let be be clear that my gripe is with the two-faced coverage of these important events, be they civil or criminal.

    Oh, I get that, and I thought that occupying the WI capitol was terrible, too. But I don’t live in Wisconsin. When I was a kid, armed Black Panthers occupied the CA Capitol. Turned out it wasn’t illegal at the time (although that quickly changed).

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  130. Any chance of McConnell showing the courage of a Boris Yeltsin and standing of the steps of the Capitol shouting STOP!?!

    Nyet.

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  131. Trump needs to be arrested, tried, and executed for treason.

    nk (1d9030) — 1/6/2021 @ 12:00 pm

    At the very least, Trump needs to be impeached and removed immediately. A few days ago, I disagreed with Patterico on that, on the basis that he only had less than 3 weeks left in his presidency, and it would be a fruitless endeavor. But given is what is happening now, I changed my mind on it. Most of us knew Trump’s post-election behavior would be abysmal. But the depths in which he chooses to sink is beyond what I expected. Patterico was right, I was wrong.

    HCI (92ea66)

  132. All it would take is a few for everyone to get the message.

    Sure, but which message? “Run Away!” or “Kill the Mofos!”

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  133. Actually, don’t ban NJ Rob, Harkin or BnP. Ban the boogaloo boy in the Roger Sterling getup (points upward)^^

    urbanleftbehind (20d986)

  134. All it would take is a few for everyone to get the message. Not that anyone wants to see that.

    We’ve seen it.

    Kent State, May 4, 1970.

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  135. I do think that if Trump were impeached today he would be convicted before the 20th. The GOP has got to have a line that he can’t cross and he’s crossed every line there is, short of tanks in the street.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  136. (points upward)^^

    I assume your are pointing above ME.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  137. I expect that those protesters that they are arresting inside the building are going to get more than a slap on the wrist. Some “protesters” are armed (which is illegal in DC, let along inside the capitol) and at least one person has been shot outside the building.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  138. Quit simping for these seditious criminals, Felipe. Wrong is wrong, yet your complaining about media coverage, which I find disingenuous given the spectacular job that conservative media has done everywhere – radio, blogosphere and cable- save VHF and public airwave since the end of the Fairness Doctrine.

    urbanleftbehind (20d986)

  139. @121: I’m waiting for you and Davethulhu to link to some police brutality videos. There’s got to be some new content since yesterday.

    beer ‘n pretzels (042d67)

  140. Yep, sorry Kev. Hopefully the DC police have better aim.

    urbanleftbehind (20d986)

  141. I am happy that so few people showed up. If this had been a crowd ten times larger it might have been hard to disperse.

    Now the reinforcements have arrived, dressed for the occasion. This is going to end shortly, but I expect quite a few injuries.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  142. But to me, the key is that Biden hasn’t done anything to encourage such violence and has spoken out against it, whereas Trump IMO has a pretty direct connection to this.

    What’s going on today is “an idea, not an organization.”

    Which Trump staffers have bailed out any of these goons?

    beer ‘n pretzels (042d67)

  143. Impeach, convict, arrest, try, hang.

    Then expel Hawley and Cruz.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  144. Best Law & Order President ever

    AJ_Liberty (ec7f74)

  145. @84: Gee, sounds “mostly peaceful” to me. So, when do we call the capitol police response “fascist”?

    Only 180 more nights like that and it might start looking like Portland.

    How about we not hear any more from you today.

    Patterico (115b1f)

  146. @121: I’m waiting for you and Davethulhu to link to some police brutality videos. There’s got to be some new content since yesterday.

    beer ‘n pretzels (042d67) — 1/6/2021 @ 12:28 pm

    When i see some i will. Unlike you my position isn’t based entirely on partisan outcomes.

    Time123 (69b2fc)

  147. Without using lethal force (and a lot of it) how do you stop 10,000 people from going where they want?

    Firstly, barricades, close off most of the streets to create a single corridor and create choke points where you can’t be overwhelmed.

    Second, Tear gas/bean bag rounds/non-lethal deterrents. Tear Gas is brutal, most people will cut and run immediately.

    This isn’t 100,000 hardened soldiers, it’s more like 99,000 (relatively) normal people and 1,000 crazy people. Most of them aren’t doing anything violent and could have easily been kept out of the capital. Now that they’re there they will be much harder to move then if they had been prevented in the first place.

    Manotaur (0c90cd)

  148. Time123 (f5cf77) — 1/6/2021 @ 12:18 pm

    That is absolutely correct. I side with the founding fathers that the government, and only the government, should be afraid of the governed for that very reason. This is the reason we have the right to bear arms. It is evident that this group has not monolithicly taken up arms against the congress – yet. Governments rise and fall, and ours is not immune. But we are nowhere near there, yet, all reporting notwithstanding. Are there protest at many Capitols across the country? But to listen to the talking heads the entire country is at stake today, right now.

    Sorry, but am inured against the reporting by MSM. Hah! I just heard a talking head say “where is the leadership?” Indeed, the first name that jumps to my simple mind is “Biden.”

    felipe (630e0b)

  149. As far as the “equal treatment” argument goes, it should be remembered that this insurrection was called for by the President of the United States, with the goal of overturning a lawfully conducted election. This is sedition, if not treason.

    The occupying of a statehouse, on the urging of a private citizen(s) may be reprehensible, even criminal, but it would be far different if the president (or the governor) had been the one doing the urging.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  150. I note that there are far more TRUMP flags than US flags. Fuhrerprinzip.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  151. Quit simping for these seditious criminals, Felipe.

    I am sure you think that is what I am doing, ULB, but you are mistaken.

    felipe (630e0b)

  152. Question: Will Trump attempt to flee the country before Jan 20th? Has he stashed enough cash overseas?

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  153. @154. Ever seen the flags fluttering in Washington circa 1968? NVA, Peace flags… same show, different costumes.

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  154. felipe (630e0b) — 1/6/2021 @ 12:38 pm

    I just heard a talking head say “where is the leadership?” Indeed, the first name that jumps to my simple mind is “Biden.”

    Why? What does he have to with this?

    https://www.cnn.com/politics/live-news/congress-electoral-college-vote-count-2021/index.html

    After rioters stormed the US Capitol building, Vice President Mike Pence is now calling for an end to violence and for people to respect law enforcement and leave the building.

    “The violence and destruction taking place at the US Capitol Must Stop and it Must Stop Now. Anyone involved must respect Law Enforcement officers and immediately leave the building,”

    Pence tweeted.

    He continued: “Peaceful protest is the right of every American but this attack on our Capitol will not be tolerated and those involved will be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law.”

    Sammy Finkelman (fac2c6)

  155. Why? What does he have to with this?

    Indeed, Sammy, what does the President-elect have to do with anything? Unlike Trump, we will be told that Biden has nothing to do with anything that occurs before his inauguration, or after, I guess. / do I really need the sarctag?

    felipe (630e0b)

  156. NVA, peace flags

    Admittedly, the ARVN cream and crimson is a good sight to see, even today at protests and events like M4L (fat chance that happens now, at least not in DC, sadly) and makes one rethink which of the “South”‘s we chose to prop up, Kpop, Samsung notwithstanding.

    urbanleftbehind (20d986)

  157. DCSCA (f4c5e5) — 1/6/2021 @ 12:46 pm

    I have always thought that the main privilege of being an elder was the ability to view life through a broader lens. There is no better substitute than an honest eye witness.

    felipe (630e0b)

  158. Yikes, I left out something.

    There is no better substitute [, for truth,] than an honest eye witness.

    felipe (630e0b)

  159. I will not buy into the narrative that these protestors are any worse than any other group. Simply because the protest have chosen this location.

    What’s worse is that the president has openly encouraged them.
    And they claim to be acting as they do because they’re so deeply concerned about lefties doing similar things.

    my gripe is with the two-faced coverage of these important events,

    I don’t like two-face coverage either. But if people know the MSM will be harder on Republicans, maybe they shouldn’t try to outdo Dems or lefties in horribleness.
    My dislike of two-faced coverage extends to the double standard that R’s have been applying for the past 5 years to give a blanket exemption to Trump.

    Radegunda (b6cc34)

  160. Santorum has figured it out.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  161. Ever seen the flags fluttering in Washington circa 1968? NVA, Peace flags… same show, different costumes.

    Uh, no. None of them were the flags of an individual Fuhrer.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  162. About time sweater-vest man did, though i did vote for him in the 2012 primaries.

    urbanleftbehind (20d986)

  163. > But to listen to the talking heads the entire country is at stake today, right now.

    I don’t listen to the talking heads. But the country *is* at stake. That’s been clear to many of us for months, at least.

    We’re going to win this round. But that angry mob is going to remain, and there’s no guarantee that we’re going to win the next round. And we *can’t* unless we all wake up to just how serious the danger is.

    aphrael (4c4719)

  164. What’s worse is that the president has openly encouraged them.

    Yes, it is MUCH worse!

    My dislike of two-faced coverage extends to the double standard that R’s have been applying for the past 5 years to give a blanket exemption to Trump.

    You are right, same here. All of this that is happening today could have been avoided by a simple concession speech by Trump at almost anytime. My greatest fear is that protests, not all, but those against our government will be greatly restricted resulting in unknown harm to our republic and to everyone’s freedom.

    felipe (630e0b)


Powered by WordPress.

Page loaded in: 0.3610 secs.