Patterico's Pontifications


Two Noted Feminists And Scholars Ignored By Female Democrats Respond To Reader Questions

Filed under: General — Dana @ 11:41 am

[guest post by Dana]

Last week I posted about a Senate Homeland Security and Governmental Affairs subcommittee hearing in which two of the four witnesses invited to testify about political Islam were female scholars with unique insights and real-life experiences to offer: Ayaan Hirsi Ali and Asra Nomani. This in spite of New Republic’s Sarah Jones notifying readers from her perch that they were unreliable witnesses and should be disqualified from giving testimony. When the hearing was held, it was clear that the two women of color, Ayaan Hirsi Ali and Asra Nomani, in a “strategy of deflection and demonization,” were pointedly ignored by the four female Democratic senators, and instead chose to turn their attention to the two white males on the panel.

Given that the report in the New York Times about this generated an unbelievable amount of comments, Ayaan Hirsi Ali and Asra Nomani have responded to a few of the many questions posed by readers. Both women noted, after not being asked relevant questions about political Islam, that it was “an experience…emblematic of a troubling trend among progressives to overlook the brutal reality of Islamist extremism”.

Perhaps Kamala Harris, one of the four Democratic women who ignored Ali and Nomani, and who has fundraised off her belief that women, herself included, are unable to be simultaneously courteous and courageous, might want to take note of the elegant display of both courtesy and steely resolve in Ayaan Hirsi Ali’s and Asra Nomani’s interaction with readers.

FDR ASKS: Fellow progressives, hear me out …

These ladies have a point. The left in general has given a pass to Islamism. We need to be able to criticize Islam’s worst without fear from political correctness. We need to demand from Muslim friends and colleagues the same, as well as verbal acceptance of basic Western and Enlightenment values such as women’s equality. Let’s recapture the discourse and this banner from the right.

I think this is a good way to approach the subject of Shariah and in particular the attitudes of many Muslims to the rights of women, the L.G.B.T. community, blasphemy laws, apostasy and dissent.

First, what is needed is critical self-reflection on the morals and agenda to which people on the left say they are committed. Look squarely at the real consequences of that agenda, both good and bad. Second, apply the idea of equality to all individuals regardless of their identity. Human rights are universal. And human rights are held by individuals, not by groups. The left today has a growing tendency to prioritize group rights over individual rights, partly driven by “intersectionality.” This is often what gets them in a moral bind. The rights of individual human beings should always come before those of the tribe or the collective.

If one finds white male sexism intolerable, then one should by definition find all male sexism just as intolerable. Excusing men of color, Muslims, immigrants or men living in non-Western societies for bad behavior toward women is an expression of the bigotry of low expectations.

The result of this mindset is that Christianity — still “the white man’s religion” in the eyes of many — is criticized for every misstep against women but Islam is protected from the glare of scrutiny. In its extreme form, relativism excuses Muslim men from universal standards because they are said to be victims of colonialism and of recent military invasions; because they are new immigrants who face cultural alienation; and because they cannot be deprived of their last source of pride: their domination over their women in their communities. I reject this line of reasoning. Anyone who believes in human rights should too.

In Europe, and in the United States, we need to defend universal women’s rights. Thorny religious and cultural problems need to be addressed, and discussed openly. There is no reason why this should be, or be viewed as, a partisan issue.

I have taught English in Brooklyn for a number of years to immigrant women from all over the Muslim world, and I have ties to the community. So I was bothered by your article. Progressives abhor those abuses of women — F.G.M. (female genital mutilation), honor killings, etc. — that you mention. However, what Americans are fighting against here is the blanket vilification of Islam by everyone from the president to Republican congresspeople. None of us progressives favor extremes of Islam, or of any other religion for that matter. In this country (and in Congress) we have extreme right-wing Christians who want nothing more than to take away the rights of women. Don’t make the mistake of thinking you have allies in Republican men (or women). You don’t.

Thank you for your service helping immigrant women build their bridges to the United States. Just as you speak so passionately about the threat of “extreme right-wing Christians,” we argue that progressives would be well-served to be equally passionate about “extreme right-wing Muslims.” As long as progressives refuse to isolate “extreme right-wing Muslims,” as readily as we do “extreme right-wing Christians,” we will continue to face a situation in which the ill-informed will conflate “extreme right-wing” Muslims with those who are not. In the same way that we should not judge all Muslims by the actions of extremist Muslims, it’s not appropriate to judge Republicans by the actions of the far right. If progressives truly want to challenge the “blanket vilification” of Muslims, it would be helpful to rip off that blanket and differentiate “extreme right-wing Muslims” from those who are not. Just as we oppose white supremacists, we should oppose Muslim supremacists.

Please take the time to read the rest of the Q&A’s. They are insightful and provocative.

Perusing Twitter responses to Ayaan Hirsi Ali and Asra Nomani’s writing in the NYT, I thought this, albeit sadly, and yet amusingly sums up the idiocy. And this coming from a woman who describes herself as a filmmaker for a “more just society for women”:


Thankfully, there are those willing to gently correct such ignorance:


(Cross-posted at The Jury Talks Back.)


74 Responses to “Two Noted Feminists And Scholars Ignored By Female Democrats Respond To Reader Questions”

  1. Good morning.

    Dana (023079)

  2. kamala looks like a skanky wound-too-tight courtroom extra on one of those Law & Order shows I think

    any post about her should use her picture

    hoochie does NOT wear well

    happyfeet (28a91b)

  3. “Over green tea, we found a lot of common ground,” coos interviewer Dana Perino, former press secretary to President George W. Bush. “After just an hour, I joined her fan club. And I desperately want her wardrobe.”

    San Franciscans know the backstory about our former district attorney, but there are some new tidbits to be gleaned from the magazine profile.

    She loves to cook, visit farmers’ markets and pore over cookbooks. She loves “My Cousin Vinny.” She loves her Chanel Executive bag. She loves her Manolos.

    great pic at the link

    happyfeet (28a91b)

  4. chanel executive bag $3400 retail

    happyfeet (28a91b)

  5. Sharmern is more woke than most, but as a apostate Hirsi Ali might as well. Be a witch.

    narciso (d1f714)

  6. Dana, thank you for your time and trouble posting and describing this topic. Hirsi Ali is very brave.

    Simon Jester (b4684a)

  7. She has actually spoken out against honor killings, so it’s odd how she reactwd

    Boris grishenko (c038fd)

  8. Former President Barack Obama’s top intelligence official at the Pentagon said Saturday that the Russian interference in the 2016 elections was “the political equivalent of 9/11.”

    Michael Vickers, who served as Obama’s undersecretary of defense, said in an interview with NBC News that there’s little evidence of a response from the Trump administration to protect the next election.

    “This attack is really the political equivalent of 9/11 — it is deadly, deadly serious,” Vickers said.

    too funny

    these special forces/cia nutjobs are so out of touch with reality it’s a wonder they get past breakfast every day

    happyfeet (28a91b)

  9. Betty Friedan was absolutely right about the Lavender Menace.

    Today it’s all about wimyns hating women.

    ThOR (c9324e)

  10. Vickers career highpoint was in the 80s, when he ran the pipeline to the mujahadeen most of the weapons were sent to clients of general intelligence and the isi, the lattervprovided a life line to the talibanbans aq to the present day.

    Boris grishenko (c038fd)

  11. sweaty-thighed power-suited kamala only ever got married a couple years ago after daddy soros decided she’d be a perfect “tranny obama” puppet to install in the white house

    i think she likes the womens just fine

    happyfeet (28a91b)

  12. Seriously though, they should be allies but they are not ayaan likely thinks the system is contaminated with SalAfi thinking that it’s unreformable.

    narciso (c038fd)

  13. Is Dana Perrino’s opinion of Kamala Harris important?

    nk (dbc370)

  14. not in the sense that kamala probably has better uses for Dana’s mouth

    happyfeet (28a91b)

  15. Seriously though, they should be allies but they are not ayaan likely thinks the system is contaminated with SalAfi thinking that it’s unreformable

    Nomani is a believing Moslem, Ali is an atheist, isn’t she?
    Nomani is trying to reform from within. Allying with Ali would probably harm her efforts, not help them.

    kishnevi (ab2b70)

  16. I am really impressed that the NYT opened up comments directly to the two women. Discussion, dialogue, compromising, even thinking, are all part of our Enlightenment heritage, and we have had quite enough of the “smash the patriarchy” screeching from the left. I don’t want to be here for what’s left after they smash it.

    These well meaning liberals have been so exquisitely sensitized to even a whiff of racism that they explode with outrage at even a hint of such; that a radical Islamist is the same as their nice, moderate Muslim friend. Of course not! They react like PTSD victims rather than reasoned people. So this is an important first step to healing their neurosis and getting on with the true battle against those who kill Muslims as well as the rest of the West.

    Patricia (5fc097)

  17. No obaid chinoy and Hirsi ali (pronoun trouble)

    narciso (d1f714)

  18. Had to Google Chinoy…. actually the observation applies even more to her, since she lives in Pakistan. In a conservative culture, the simple fact that a known non-conservative advocates something is itself seen as a reason to reject what that person advocates, no matter how reasonable or grounded in tradition the idea is.

    This phenomenon of course does not happen only in Islam.

    kishnevi (ab2b70)

  19. Its not unique to Doha they learned it from riyadh and to a lesser extent a u dhabi

    narciso (d1f714)

  20. PC has morphed into such a frenzy of delusion, hate and projection that cannibalism is occurring.

    “In a 1945 essay, Notes on Nationalism, George Orwell described a rumour among leftists that the real reason American troops had been brought to Europe was to suppress English communism, not fight the Nazis.

    One has to belong to the intelligentsia to believe things like that,” Orwell famously noted. “No ordinary man could be such a fool.”
    Even by Orwell’s high standards, those words have aged extremely well.

    Tell an ordinary Canadian schlub that white people aren’t allowed to quote Beyoncé, and he will be smart enough to laugh in your face. Dress down a superbly intelligent Peace and Conflict Studies PhD candidate for the same act, and she will fall over herself with apologies.”

    harkin (209597)

  21. Someone ought to film Iranian public hangings of gays and put it up on the Internet for all progressives to see. This isn’t an act of “extremists” the is the consensus belief of Shi’a in action.

    Kevin M (752a26)

  22. Greetings:

    Philosophers and other deep thinkers often over think things in ways those born in the Bronx don’t. So, here it comes.

    Islam is the millstone. it is nothing more than the globalization of 7th Century (A.D. that is) predatory Arab tribal culture under a thin veneer of religion. And if your plan doesn’t include constraining, undermining, or eradicating Islam, you don’t have a plan. What you have is a hope.

    More good news. Islam has a doctrine within its ideological basement called “istifihad” or some such which forbids any sort of adjustments after the 12th Century (A.D.) so there is no picking and/or choosing in it. Not now, not ever and those who dare to find themselves designated apostates or takfiris or some such most of which disqualifies one for even term life insurance.

    I can appreciate the work these ladies are trying to do. Normalization of dysfunction is a Seinfeld “thing” in this 21th Century, (A.D. again) but their pleasing words are a follow on to 1400 years of kuffaro and associated phobias. Some babies deserve to go out with the bathwater.

    11B40 (6abb5c)

  23. 11- Happy, Soros’ counterpart on the other side probably told Sen. Tim Scott of SC the same thing, lest Lindsay disease was color blind.

    urbanleftbehind (847a06)

  24. Islam has a doctrine within its ideological basement called “istifihad” or some such which forbids any sort of adjustments after the 12th Century (A.D.) so there is no picking and/or choosing in it.

    There is plenty of picking and choosing even within those limits. And plenty of legalistic maneuvering to fit modern life. The same regime that executes gays and Baha’is also subsidizes sex change operations. How do you fit that into a medieval point of view.

    I am Jewish. Which means that (in theory at least) I live by a set of rules that was officially finalized in the sixteenth century but built on a bedrock set in place during the heyday of the Roman and Parthian Empires. Many of its features were in place before Christianity (they are mentioned in the Gospels, for instance.)

    So what do we do now? We pick and choose and try to fit modern life to that system. And some parts of modern life we reject–but even then there is wide variance, and those that choose against change do so because they are against change, not because Judaism is against change.

    A similar dynamic applies in Islam.

    kishnevi (0cb353)

  25. Tangential

    I never heard of this band. Any of you have heard of them. They do seem to dress like refugees from 1970.

    kishnevi (0cb353)

  26. See if this works

    narciso (d1f714)

  27. Works. But being featured in the Brooklyn Vegan suggests I am not the only person who never heard of them before.

    kishnevi (0cb353)

  28. Kishnevi, you’re an ass hole.

    Rev.Hoagie® (630eca)

  29. A Jew hating Jew,

    Rev.Hoagie® (630eca)

  30. An American hating American.

    Rev.Hoagie® (630eca)

  31. Arabs take their faith more seriously than we do, therein lies the differencem

    narciso (d1f714)

  32. 30–no
    29–that is a possibility.

    kishnevi (0cb353)

  33. 31
    Definitely not.

    Now please do something to lower your blood pressure. Nothing here is important enough to get apoplexy about it.

    kishnevi (0cb353)

  34. Hoagie, what is wrong with you?

    DRJ (15874d)

  35. I know you are sick. Are you ok?

    DRJ (15874d)

  36. That was over the line and I apologize. And I mean that with all my heart. I should never have commented like that. I am so sorry and so embarrassed. Please accept my deepest apology, kishnevi. That was not called for.

    Rev.Hoagie® (630eca)

  37. We all do things we regret. I hope you are ok.

    DRJ (15874d)

  38. Accepted most readily. I do know your medical problems must put you under a lot of stress. And frankly, I can be a “rectum” at times.

    kishnevi (0cb353)

  39. 39. At some point, one of these bands who loudly doesn’t toe the line is gonna be found out as fakers. What happened to that chick who wore the trump dress to the Grammy?

    urbanleftbehind (847a06)

  40. Hang in there, Hoagie. You have a lot of folks pulling for you and reading your words of wisdom.

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  41. Dana Perino – boosh league

    mg (31009b)

  42. The Arab world has a political problem because it has a religious problem.

    mg (31009b)

  43. I notice one questioner, a “brown woman”, referred to the widespread violence against brown people in this country since Trump was elected.
    Do they believe this nonsense, or do they hope somebody, somewhere, will be fooled?

    Richard Aubrey (a09608)

  44. Yes they did believe it sadly, this is how they’ve been conditioned

    narciso (d1f714)

  45. narciso,
    That’s too bad. I hate to put our late Golden Retriever in such company, but…no matter how many times she didn’t get struck by lightning, thunder storms always freaked her out.
    And for these fools, no matter how many times nothing happens, it’s always “widespread and unprecedented”.
    So either they’re as dumb as a pretty bright Golden Retriever, or they’re lying like rugs.

    Richard Aubrey (a09608)

  46. 45/ Maybe that woman might beleive it, but somebody’s got to be lying. Probably with phony statistics, and lying about what the statistic is on top of that. (like the time period)

    It ould also be singling out a case or two, and lying that it is new.

    Sammy Finkelman (f61675)

  47. “Do they believe this nonsense, or do they hope somebody, somewhere, will be fooled?”

    Hit the rewind button for a fifty year setback and ask the same question as you watch Black Panther and SDS idiots spouting the same crap. The level of gullibility may be slightly higher but the same propaganda was eliciting the same emotional responses from the same strata of simpletons on the same campuses and plantations.

    Rick Ballard (5397ef)

  48. dana perino
    gum wrapper is her bathrobe
    and she loves the dogs

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  49. This response is revealing: “In this country (and in Congress) we have extreme right-wing Christians who want nothing more than to take away the rights of women. Don’t make the mistake of thinking you have allies in Republican men (or women). You don’t.”

    It’s clear that large segments of the left view the US right (or even US non-left) as more of a threat – indeed, the real threat – than Islamic extremism (if they even view that as a danger). If you recall during the Cold War there was the anti- anti-communist left. They viewed anti-communists and their acts as the real danger both to liberals(“McCarthy was worse than Stalin!”) and to the America they wanted to create. So their energies were directed at stopping the anti-communists and not the communists. The latter were just “liberals in a hurry” and anyway, their aggression was caused by the anti-communists.

    SteveMG (ea62d2)

  50. women are so pitiful

    if failmerica’s fascist congress or its sleazy corrupt john roberts supreme court ever made abortion illegal i’d just go get an abortion anyway

    but women just sit in a puddle of their own useless victimhood and whine

    it’s pathetic

    happyfeet (28a91b)

  51. ooh look at me i’m a pitiful downtrodden handmaid

    oh for the love of 5-egg omelettes zip your piehole man up and get on with your life

    happyfeet (28a91b)

  52. there’s one blog at least what understands how the treasonous FBI is a bona fide threat to American democracy

    Why was the FBI meddling in a U.S. presidential election? Partisan interference in the election by public agencies like the FBI and major news sources like NBC are far more worrisome than anything Russians allegedly might do from afar.

    i’m proud of my fellow american Mr. John Hinderaker, attorney at law

    courageous and stalwart

    he sets the integrity bar high, that one

    happyfeet (28a91b)

  53. Make Europe Great Again

    The European Union announced this week that it would begin proceedings to punish Poland, Hungary, and the Czech Republic for their refusal to accept refugees and migrants under a 2015 scheme the E.U. commission created. The mission’s aim was to relieve Greece and Italy of the burden from migrant waves arriving from the Middle East and Africa, largely facilitated by European rescues of migrants in the Mediterranean.

    The conflict between the EU and these three nations of the Visegrád Group is not just about the authority the EU can arrogate to itself when facing an emergency (one largely of its own making), but about the character of European government and society in the future. It is hard not to conclude that the dissenting countries are correct to dissent. Hungary, the Czech Republic, and Slovakia had voted against the 2015 agreement. Poland’s government had supported it then, but a subsequent election saw a new party come into power that rejected the scheme……..”

    ………..But the EU’s plan to impose sanctions on Eastern Europe has been met by unusually frank talk from dissenters there. Mariusz Błaszczak, the interior minister of Poland, said in an interview that taking in migrants would be worse than facing EU sanctions. “The security of Poland and the Poles is at risk” by taking in migrants, he said, “We mustn’t forget the terror attacks that have taken place in Western Europe, and how — in the bigger EU countries — these are unfortunately now a fact of life.”

    harkin (209597)

  54. #53 Funny how old news is being revisited.

    From the second Crowdstrike and Fusion GPS were fingered I knew Russia was a DNC Hoax.

    And I do believe Seth Rich gave that data up to Wiki and was killed for it.

    Blah (44eaa0)

  55. National Soros Radio takes a touching look at the impecunious and luckless native americans who were so viciously raped by barack obama’s heartless anti-coal policies

    key takeaway:

    There is hope in those places and on the Northern Cheyenne Reservation that President Trump and his push to do away with Obama-era environmental regulations will stop the bleeding and help bring the coal economy back.

    happyfeet (28a91b)

  56. Going back to the original article: Did “Susan” actual ask a question or just recite a screed at the two women who answered back with an abundance of patience?

    MrScience_ (aebf61)

  57. BasicaLly the former, this was more ‘have you stopped beating —–” type question, or just abut up like with peter kings hearings into Islamic redicalization

    narciso (d1f714)

  58. One has to ask, what is the point of these heating if the deems will filibuster them ad infinitum, like steyns hearing before Cruz’s subcommittee.

    narciso (d1f714)

  59. Hmmmmmm

    “The FBI received a copy of the Democrat-funded dossier in August, during the heat of the campaign, and is said to have contracted in October to pay Steele $50,000 to help corroborate the dirt on Trump — a relationship that “raises substantial questions about the independence” of the bureau in investigating Trump, warned Senate Judiciary Chairman Chuck Grassley, R-Iowa.

    Senate investigators are demanding to see records of communications between Fusion GPS and the FBI and the Justice Department, including any contacts with former Attorney General Loretta Lynch, now under congressional investigation for possibly obstructing the Hillary Clinton email probe, and deputy FBI director Andrew McCabe, who is under investigation by the Senate and the Justice inspector general for failing to recuse himself despite financial and political connections to the Clinton campaign through his Democrat activist wife. Senate investigators have singled out McCabe as the FBI official who negotiated with Steele.”

    harkin (209597)

  60. happy@53

    The Powerline boys have done a commendable job, unimpaired by their lack of enthusiasm for DJT.

    ThOR (c9324e)

  61. Yes they have, following up on Paul Perry, where is everybody else are tbey asleep or merely bought off?

    narciso (d1f714)

  62. I guess its similar to when George galloway arabist stooge went after Mona king who was a black female moderate laborite. But Diane Abbott who is their Maxine waters is given free reign.

    narciso (d1f714)

  63. Ms king is now a labor lord and the direct of diversity for Youtube, but as being black and Jewish she was attacked by galloeays goings.

    narciso (d1f714)

  64. OT Maybe I read wrong but Birth Certificates are no longer birth certificates. WTF?

    Blah (44eaa0)

  65. Thanks narciso – A very good day for US security.

    We accordingly grant the Government’s stay applications in part and narrow the scope of the injunctions as to §2(c). The injunctions remain in place only with respect to parties similarly situated to Doe, Dr. Elshikh, and Hawaii. In practical terms, this means that §2(c) may not be enforced against foreign nationals who have a credible claim of a bona fide relationship with a person or entity in the United States. All other foreign nationals are subject to the provisions of EO–2….

    To be blunt, the Federal Courts usurped Executive power with regards to the intersection of Immigration Statutes and National Security, the US Supreme Court is in the process of redressing the proper exercise of authority.

    1) Factually, the EO was not on its face discriminatory
    2) as a matter of statutory interpretation, there really was no conflict between the statutory provisions – the doctrine of in pari materia requires statutory language treating the same subject be interpreted to harmonize, unless one statute expressly overrules the previous language. You are legislating from the bench, if you rule that later language implicitly renders previous statutory language null.

    Steven Malynn (d29fc3)

  66. Greetings, harkin: ( @ 54 (209597) — 6/25/2017 @ 9:56 am )

    What you addressed has been unfortunately stuck way out on my “intellectual” periphery, so I’m not all up to date on it. But what first occurred to me when I heard about the countries you mentioned was that they seemed to be the EU-borg’s Catholic East yet the Catholic nature of the countries (or at least Poland and Hungary) never seems to come up in the reportage or discussions.

    Have you come across any of that ???

    11B40 (6abb5c)

  67. Philando Castile family reaches $3M settlement in death

    happyfeet (a037ad)

  68. Yes because I’m sure minneolis is good for it, justice how does that work anymore?

    narciso (d1f714)

  69. There are 3 solid votes (Thomas, Alito, and Gorsuch) that both the 4th Cir’s constitutional argument, and the 9th Cir’s statutory argument (sorry Patrick) are both wrong.

    There are at least 2 other votes (likely Roberts and Kennedy), that both arguments are wrong, but the equities are such that people already in the pipeline to get visas based on a solid connection to the US should be allowed to do so — which basically upholds the EO because it already provided a case-by-case procedure by which individual applicants could seek a visa notwithstanding the fact that they were nationals of one of the six countries. By leaving the injunction in place with respect to those folks, the Court simply gave them a legal remedy (the ability to seek a contempt citation against the government for violation of the injunction) in the event they believe they are wrongly denied a visa under the case-by-case process.

    Between the lines you can see the Court being implicitly critical of the lower courts — IMO most notably the district courts (Hawaii in particular) — for reaching pretty much a decision on the merits of the case based on briefings that deal only with applications for TRO’s and injunctions. The Court’s order spends quite a bit of verbiage on the fact that lower courts must use their equitable power to fashion injunctive relief in a manner that does the least amount of harm to accomplish its purpose.

    The Hawaii district court’s opinion basically decided all the issues, made a merits judgment on the entire case, and then declared the State of Hawaii the winner in the way it fashioned its injunction. The Supremes basically said “Sorry Judge Watson, you don’t have that much authority.”

    shipwreckedcrew (5d48e9)

  70. Now who did read the law Clearly, well there’s dershowitz and this fellow

    I thought those amici were fairly weak.

    narciso (d1f714)

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