Patterico's Pontifications

7/9/2016

Obama: “It’s Very Hard to Untangle the Motives” of Dallas Shooter

Filed under: General — Patterico @ 1:38 pm



It’s almost as impenetrable a mystery as the motives of the Orlando shooter who said he did it for ISIS.

I actually thought this had to be a joke when I first read about it. I had to watch the video to be convinced it wasn’t from the Onion.

209 Responses to “Obama: “It’s Very Hard to Untangle the Motives” of Dallas Shooter”

  1. TFG

    Patterico (86c8ed)

  2. food stamp says we need a federal police force

    you know

    like the fbi

    *giggle*

    happyfeet (28a91b)

  3. One of my co-workers was more worried about the wisdom of using the robot to take out the murderer. “I sort of like the idea of letting a judge and jury decide….” Good thing I was not looking directly at him or I may have caused a conflict with my expression…perhaps a microagression even…

    vor2 (494009)

  4. That’s our Barack!

    Cruz Supporter (102c9a)

  5. It’s gonna be a long six months, ten days, nineteen hours and ten minutes, and what’s coming is is in no way an improvement.

    nk (dbc370)

  6. “… but I’ve got Joe Biden working on the case, and he’s bound to unravel that skein!”

    CayleyGraph (353727)

  7. The robot thing worries me a little bit, but ultimately it is clearly better than allowing a guy more chances to kill people. I understand the concern, though.

    Patterico (86c8ed)

  8. I’m surprised he didn’t say “The shooter was simply celebrating his 2nd Amendment rights just like the NRA said he should.”

    Kevin M (25bbee)

  9. what’s coming is is in no way an improvement.

    But it will be worth it so the toothless knuckle-draggers can act out their temper tantrum between now and November.

    Kevin M (25bbee)

  10. “Leave It To ‘Bammy”, starring Hillary Clinton as Junebug, Joe Biden as Ward, Van Jones as Wally, and Barcky Obama as teh ‘Bammy.

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  11. Untangling the motive of the Dallas shooter is no more difficult than untangling Hillary’s motive in deleting her emails, or Obama’s motive in refusing to turn over Fast-n-Furious documents, or Director Comey’s motive in refusing to refer Hillary for prosecution, or Susan Rice’s motive in lying to the nation, or any other ‘inexplicable’ act of criminal desperation by the Obama Administration.

    ropelight (596f46)

  12. the Associated Press says some of Mr. Trump’s hats have parts what aren’t necessarily made in America

    happyfeet (28a91b)

  13. In an attempt to resolve the differing statements, the AP sought the help of a forensic textile analyst.

    happyfeet (28a91b)

  14. It’s gonna be a long six months, ten days, nineteen hours and ten minutes, and what’s coming is is in no way an improvement.

    That’s what’s so depressing. I remember how much I looked forward to the day when this chump got out of office. Now my reaction to that is “meh.”

    Patterico (86c8ed)

  15. Pray for an intervention.

    Kevin M (25bbee)

  16. the Associated Press says some of Mr. Trump’s hats have parts what aren’t necessarily made in America

    happyfeet (28a91b) — 7/9/2016 @ 2:39 pm

    Can’t blame Hilda for that one. Naw. That’s Bill’s fault. Those Chinese can make dog food cheaper.

    papertiger (c2d6da)

  17. Great, now we have Obama undermining confessions. Thanks, Obama.

    Dejectedhead (d243ce)

  18. Yes, pray for intervention.

    MD in Philly (f9371b)

  19. One thing’s for sure, Barack’s motives are not difficult to untangle.

    Cruz Supporter (102c9a)

  20. Funny. TFG always knows the motives of Republicans, the NRA, conservatives, pro-lifers, etc.

    But when it’s a leftist darling like BLM or occupy or Muslims he just can’t figure it out.

    Even when they tell him.

    Steve57 (a8355f)

  21. Because he’s their counsel of record, and you don’t dime out your client.

    narciso (732bc0)

  22. Thirty minutes after Skip Gates was detained by the Cambridge Police, Barack knew that they had acted stupidly!
    Come on, guys, there isn’t a single student from the Poli Sci department at Columbia who recalls having this doofus in any of their classes, but he’s still The Smartest Man of All Time. We shouldn’t discount his intuitions or his untanglings!

    Cruz Supporter (102c9a)

  23. Does anybody else get the feeling they’re living in a Nancy and Sluggo cartoon? I remember the zany horrified hissy fits when Reagan tried to claim ketchup was a vegetable. That’s freakin’ Plato compared to this noise.

    hunson abedeer (80144e)

  24. “Thirty minutes after Skip Gates was detained by the Cambridge Police”

    Please don’t call him Skip. It gives that joker too much dignity.

    hunson abedeer (80144e)

  25. The Obama Countdown Clock in the Windows Store.

    Jim (98dd1a)

  26. Dear God please to help Mr. Trump intervene on stinkypig. I know stinkypig is one of your creatures but she sucks balls and I hate her stupid face.

    Amen

    happyfeet (28a91b)

  27. Tomorrow we’ll find out that there were 911 calls made by the shooter, but so much was garbled. He kept using words like “wyatt” and “hunky” and “hofey” that made no sense in context.

    Kevin M (25bbee)

  28. Obama says he is unsure of the shooter’s motive(s). Hillary says that the best way to improve race relations is for white people to change the way they think about blacks. And the leader of BLM says that while he does not condone the murders of the Dallas police officers, he “understands” the motive(s) behind them.

    Folks, we are in a war. Pretend that we are not at your own peril.

    Deuce Frehley (73c323)

  29. Does anybody else get the feeling they’re living in a Nancy and Sluggo cartoon?

    Nothing so sophisticated. Although Thomas Nash would feel right at home.

    Kevin M (25bbee)

  30. yes, haven’t a clue,

    http://www.fireandreamitchell.com/2016/07/08/micah-johnsons-alias-was-fahed-hassen/?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter

    don’t know the derivation but it appears like a battle name (kunya)

    narciso (732bc0)

  31. Has anyone heard whether robocop came through OK? I assume it used a directional blast but I haven’t read whether it was destroyed along with the murderer.

    Rick Ballard (ddb240)

  32. that’s michelle malkin he’s sourcing I’d take her with a grain of salt

    the snippet she references from the report doesn’t say that fahed hassen was his alias

    Police said in a statement that Johnson’s Facebook account: “included the following names and information: Fahed Hassen, Richard GRIFFIN aka Professor Griff, GRIFFIN embraces a radical form of Afrocentrism, and GRIFFIN wrote a book A Warriors Tapestry.”Police said in a statement that Johnson’s Facebook account: “included the following names and information: Fahed Hassen, Richard GRIFFIN aka Professor Griff, GRIFFIN embraces a radical form of Afrocentrism, and GRIFFIN wrote a book A Warriors Tapestry.”

    happyfeet (28a91b)

  33. except we would know if prof griff, had adopted it, of course public enemy was known for it’s anti jewish and anti gay tirades, sound like anyone in the news lately,

    narciso (732bc0)

  34. “There is something wrong with our country.”

    — Hillary Clinton

    7.5 years of this dogsh*t, we don’t need another 4 to 8.

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  35. Captain Obvious calling the dimwit-in-chief.

    He probably hurt his brain trying to figure out why Lynch and Clinton met….

    WarEagle82 (5bf75f)

  36. I see I crossposted with Narciso.

    kishnevi (7c7aed)

  37. meanwhile the dallas pd is in lockdown, I’m sure it’s nothing.

    narciso (732bc0)

  38. meanwhile it’s Taste of Chicago but i didn’t go today cause of i’m not in the mood for soros’s hyperdramatic blm losers plus I think I already tasted everything

    happyfeet (28a91b)

  39. It was not Robocop, youse guys. Not the Terminator or Wall-E, either. It was an RC (for remote controlled) which was guided to the shooter the way a kid guides an RC car up and down the sidewalk. A Hellfire or Stinger missile, which has some “smart” capability to independently track its target after launching, is more of a robot than the Dallas bomb disposal whatsis.

    nk (dbc370)

  40. I am eager to see if anyone sees stuff to corroborate or disprove the assertions from Conservative Treehouse about the details of the MN shooting.

    Also, I heard something about Soros donating 12 million dollars to the people behind BLM, anybody see that verified?

    Thanks.

    MD in Philly (f9371b)

  41. We had a neighborhood fair. With music, and food, and booths from the Secretary of State and the Chicago police, and PONIES!1!!!

    nk (dbc370)

  42. pony lives matter

    happyfeet (28a91b)

  43. I am not protesting the manner in which he was apprehended,
    but I imagine they could make a RC device which fires a taser first and detonates as a backup,
    now that this needed to be used.

    MD in Philly (f9371b)

  44. The Chicago police did not shoot the ponies, not even once.

    nk (dbc370)

  45. well he wouldn’t surrender, and the ed 209s are on back order, btw, the new robocop, stunk on ice,

    narciso (732bc0)

  46. Thanks narciso,
    there is a reason I come here.

    MD in Philly (f9371b)

  47. “I don’t know why all these dogs are swarming me” he said as the dog whistle hung from his lips.

    jcurtis (00837a)

  48. As I understand it, this was improvised from a bomb disposal trick of disabling bombs with a smaller bomb (fratricide?) which separates the firing mechanism from the main explosive charge. I have seen other remote-operated mini-tanks, equipped with battering rams, used against barricaded suspects. The thing is that ditches and fence posts and bump-guards can stop these things the way trenches and “dragons’ teeth” stop tanks.

    nk (dbc370)

  49. BTW, MD, I saw your question on the other thread, I just don’t have a good answer.

    nk (dbc370)

  50. I have this pet unproven theory (though my success rate is pretty durn respectable) that you can get a fairly accurate rough judgment of a person’s intelligence by looking into their eyes for about ten seconds.* Stupid people and smart people just have a different way of focusing their eyes. I was watching a YouTube clip of Trey Gowdy questioning Hillary Clinton (WHY isn’t THIS GUY president?!?), and to my mind it was incontestable who was the sharper knife in the drawer, and it wasn’t Her Madame Inevitableness. You can get a similar read by looking at Sarah Palin’s eyes: she’s clearly not as stupid as her ludicrous enemies make her out to be, but she’s also clearly not Nobel Prize material. Smarter than the average bear, I’d say, and given her background she gets extra points for sheer acumen and determination, but still not in the swishy set.

    You look at Barry’s eyes and you can just tell that he isn’t a Super Genius. I’ve known super geniuses, I know what to look for.

    hunson abedeer (80144e)

  51. she didn’t pretend to be a rocket scientist, just one person with ‘a servant’s heart, with the ability to distinguish right from wrong, with integrity and love of country, not like say mssr, gowdy, who greenlight the operation to supply the libyan rebels, this is why he slow walked this inquiry, from day one, and judicial watch has been doing all the heavy lifting,

    narciso (732bc0)

  52. I assume that out of the many cops out there, quite a few should be doing something else, just like doctors and nurses and lawyers and judges and presidents and such,
    but after the Brown and Martin fiascos, I await further data.

    MD in Philly (f9371b)

  53. it’s ironic, no they went through darren wilson with a fine tooth comb, found nothing, zimmerman actually campaigned to get rid of the previous regime, no good deed goes unpunished,
    this shred of human debris, who apparently harassed a woman, yet got off with an honorable discharge, (who does that sound like recently) chose to become judge, jury and executioner,

    narciso (732bc0)

  54. Isn’t it about time for Hillary to roll out some of her oh-so-convincing black dialect? Can’t really bait ’em if they don’t understand what you’re saying.

    WX0RG (c30f41)

  55. Watch Obama, Biden, Clinton – and all of these Democrats who could be doing so much to promote understanding and bring people together in times like these – watch how they throw fuel on the fire. These people are wicked people and it’s about time they get called on it.

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  56. My understanding is that the Dallas shooter was sent back to the USA with a recommendation for a Less than Honorable Discharge. I might be interesting to find out who upgraded him and why. There’s also a code on the DD-214 for suitability for re-enlistment. That too is worth looking into.

    ropelight (596f46)

  57. “There is something wrong with our country.”

    — Hillary Clinton

    “Maybe we should make it great again.”

    – James Taranto

    We’ve got Taranto. Who’s having more fun?

    papertiger (c2d6da)

  58. Such a dark mood today (especially me). How about something that will make you laugh and laugh hard:

    The Rules: Street Boners – What to do and what to DON’T do

    http://americandigest.org/mt-archives/bad_americans/on_tattoos.php

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  59. “There is something wrong with our country.”
    — Hillary Clinton

    It’s this whole poorly, inaccurately defined “our” word-thingy is that is causing so much stickiness.

    Confucius had some interesting, rather tartly-phrased things to say on the subject. So did the Chinese Legalists. So, for that matter, did the Taoists, tho’ what they said would surprise the living ***t out of a well-meaning lying leftist liberal.

    hunson abedeer (80144e)

  60. Poor Barack is still trying to untangle Bill Ayers’ motives.

    Cruz Supporter (102c9a)

  61. you know how ridiculous that sounds, this ridiculous,

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B3KBuQHHKx0

    narciso (732bc0)

  62. I saw a tiny Confederate flag sown on the sleeve of his dashiki. No other explanation!

    Mike (88372b)

  63. I went python, because you can’t take him at face value, next the dead parrot sketch,

    narciso (732bc0)

  64. He knows what every successful politician and traveling medicine show knows: “You don’t have to fool all the people at any one time. Just enough.” Abraham Lincoln’s epigram sounds nice and epigrammatic but it has no empirical support.

    nk (dbc370)

  65. @ Patterico (#7), who wrote:

    The robot thing worries me a little bit, but ultimately it is clearly better than allowing a guy more chances to kill people. I understand the concern, though.

    I don’t believe I do understand the concern about the robot thing. How would it best be articulated?

    I suppose I’m open to being concerned, if I understood at all what I was supposed to be concerned about. But I genuinely don’t, not yet at least.

    Beldar (fa637a)

  66. I think he’d make one helluva Robot Overlord for Leviticus.

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  67. heh, may be they should cut down on the fosters’

    http://blogs.news.com.au/dailytelegraph/timblair/index.php/dailytelegraph/comments/slower_than_a_sermon/

    narciso (732bc0) — 7/9/2016 @ 6:40 pm

    Don’t tell the average Australian that. Foster’s- it’s Australian for really crappy beer, mate.

    Bill H (971e5f)

  68. Number 56,

    During the 1992 campaign, Hillary spoke with a Southern accent. Upon her husband’s election, the Southern accent disappeared never to return.

    DN (1da183)

  69. touchy crowd, I was trying to be amusing, and ironic since they probably ridiculed us over the hanging chads,

    narciso (732bc0)

  70. In an attempt to answer my own question, I’m so far persuaded that there’s not a “robot problem” here.

    From CNN, in an article titled Police used a robot to kill — The key questions:

    Why is this being reported as a big deal?

    This is the first use of a robotic system by the police in a deliberately lethal manner.

    This to me is blather. “Robotic system”? If that implies that the control of the robot, including its movements and its detonation, were being done robotically, that’s horsecrap: There was a human operator the whole time.Clickbait and technophobia, IMHO — which it basically admits, if you keep scrolling:

    How does this link to the “killer robots” debate?
    While there are links to the discussion on the future of killer robots, known as LAWS (lethal autonomous weapons systems), there are also three important differences to keep in mind. First, this was not an autonomous robot; both the robot and the explosive were remotely operated. Second, this was not a designed weapons system. There are many ground robots under development that are armed with weapons like machine guns and missile launchers, from the prototypes of the US MAARS to the Chinese Sharp Claw. But this was the case of using an older robot designed for something else. And, third, the concerns driving the “killer robots” debate center on whether we can prevent the unleashing of self-operating robots on the battlefield, for which militaries around the world are beginning to establish plans and doctrines. The debate is driven by a concern that such a future might cause both greater civilian harm and a lack of accountability.

    By contrast, this was an ad hoc use, just like the case in Iraq. There is no doctrine that planned this out, no training manuals that police were following, nor development programs for this use. It also doesn’t appear to have risked civilian harm or raised accountability concerns of the kind that motivate the killer robots debate. There are links to that debate but they are more about the many different directions robot use might go to next.

    So this was kinda sorta like the future autonomous killer robots we’re worried we might not be able to prevent on the battlefield, except this wasn’t an autonomous robot, or a killer robot. It was a robot carrying a killer Claymore mine, used in controlled, directed lethal explosions whenever we need controlled, directed lethal explosions, which is mostly in the military, yeah, but unfortunately not always.

    If a SWAT sniper had shot the guy, he’d be equally as dead. Ethically there’s no difference between the guy controlling the robot pushing a button and the guy behind the rifle scope pulling the trigger. (The guy behind the rifle scope may be using aiming devices with its own powerful microprocessors; big deal.) I haven’t seen a good reason to second-guess the judgment call that it was time to end the dangerous standoff. I don’t see any reason to second-guess the judgment to do that using a robot and a Claymore mine, instead of a bullet.

    Beldar (fa637a)

  71. @ Patterico (#7), who wrote:
    The robot thing worries me a little bit, but ultimately it is clearly better than allowing a guy more chances to kill people. I understand the concern, though.
    I don’t believe I do understand the concern about the robot thing. How would it best be articulated?

    I suppose I’m open to being concerned, if I understood at all what I was supposed to be concerned about. But I genuinely don’t, not yet at least.

    Beldar (fa637a) — 7/9/2016 @ 8:08 pm

    I’m not so sure there should be a concern. This was a unique event, and I’m not unhappy with how this unfolded. There was a knock-down, drag-ot shootout going on, and the police were concerned that dude would not give up and take the opportunity to kill more officers. I’ll agree with this shouldn’t be the go-to solution, but this one time, I really don’t have a problem with it. Something many aren’t considering: he may have had explosives on him, ready to go.

    Bill H (971e5f)

  72. She is in all ways tahred…

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  73. Sneaking around the comment filter with other links about this robot (note, I’m not vouching for any of these sources in particular): Gizmodo; The Verge; Popular Science.

    Particularly overwrought: Fusion.net: “The rules of police engagement might have just changed forever.” Umm, no, I think most of the time police forces are going to stick with police officers, not Claymore-mine bearing remote-controlled mobile robots. The Singularity isn’t quite that close.

    Beldar (fa637a)

  74. A Claymore mine? That earns style points.

    Bill H (971e5f)

  75. wait till they hear of the yellowjacket, the microexoskeleton in ant man,

    narciso (732bc0)

  76. I’m sort of confused about the whole explosive-robot thing. On the one hand, I can see the material interest in stopping the guy from killing more people. On the other hand I can see the legal and judicial interest in taking the guy alive so they could figure out what it was all about. i.e. why wasn’t tear gas used &c. &c.

    Can anybody here provide a rational timeline that explains what was going on and why the decisions were made, with respect to these questions?

    hunson abedeer (80144e)

  77. When they start putting lasers on sharks — then I’m going to worry.

    Beldar (fa637a)

  78. “When they start putting lasers on sharks — then I’m going to worry.”

    If you used to hang out with Mr. Handey, THEN you should worry.

    hunson abedeer (80144e)

  79. Or “I didn’t cause a race war” when of course that’s exactly what he has done.

    He’s always looking for that “root cause” that will blame the Republicans or this nation of cowards or the patriarchy or some other BS.

    He has been our most destructive president in my lifetime.

    Patricia (5fc097)

  80. The robot thing doesn’t bother me unless the robot is autonomous.

    Kevin M (25bbee)

  81. Timeline, from WFAA in Dallas. Like most such I’ve seen, it’s relatively thin on specific details between 1:47 a.m. (when the fifth officer was killed) and 3:06 a.m. (when the device was detonated). But TV reports during that time were that the shooter was continuing to threaten to himself detonate bombs, that he was continuing to fire at targets even while the “negotiations” were taking place, and that he was vowing to go out in a blaze of glory, taking as many more victims with him as possible.

    When it’s obvious that the shooter is only using the “negotiation” as a media/fame tactic, has no intention of surrendering, and remains an on-going threat which can’t be completely mitigated or contained, then law enforcement authorities have to make these kind of judgment calls. Here, I’ve yet to see any reason to doubt this one.

    Beldar (fa637a)

  82. Beldar,
    Your point about it being equivalent to a “true” sniper taking him out to end the standoff is a good point.
    I think the idea is that if he was contained, no one was an exposed target, why decide to “arbitrarily” end it in killing him. But he was talking about having planted bombs, etc., it’s not like he might have been found innocent at trial, he confessed to the shooting and wanted to do more.

    Between this guy and Obama, Lynch, and Clinton they are making efforts at making Manson’s dream come true. And way too many people who should know better are falling for it.

    MD in Philly (f9371b)

  83. and apparently he was planning a larger attack, which suggests he had accomplices,

    ready for a hot take from saletan, no me neither,

    narciso (732bc0)

  84. Do you think they took his body away on a gurney or in plastic bags? In a previous thread I predicted that this being Texas he would “be on a gurney within seven years” and I hate being wrong.

    Robots, shmobots. He killed five innocent people from ambush. M’kay?

    nk (dbc370)

  85. I agree, they had been trying to negotiate, it broke down, he remained hostile and threatening, and he had already shot 11 people, 5 fatally. He was given a much fairer chance than he gave.

    MD in Philly (f9371b)

  86. Maybe he had accomplices,
    maybe he was planning a bigger attack himself but the opportunity arose with the protest before he had everything ready.

    MD in Philly (f9371b)

  87. so if they are, who are they, just like the men, who one witness told the mail, that the orlando shooter was visiting up in palm beach, what happened with that,

    narciso (732bc0)

  88. Shooting 12 policemen, at least to my mind is provocation.

    papertiger (c2d6da)

  89. Maybe WE can try to figure out what this poor mistreated Black man’s motive/s was/were.
    Should we attempt???

    I’ll go first.

    JIM CROW laws.

    GUS (30b6bd)

  90. Hello MD in Philly. It’s ALWAYS about what we DON’T KNOW. The blowed-up perp, was SAID to have EXPLOSIVE DEVICES within the building. All bets are off. Surrender, or GO BOOM.

    GUS (30b6bd)

  91. MD, his confession, his guilt — totally irrelevant to this decision. This decision was: Is he “contained” or not?

    Mind you, at 3 a.m. he’s still taking shots and threatening to blow up bombs. He may be “under effective cover.”

    And this is downtown Dallas. The skyscraper adjacent to the parking garage is a building in which my firm had its Dallas offices, and I used to work there frequently; our health club was at the top of that garage. In the middle of the night, the Dallas P.D.’s cordons had managed to keep targets out of his sights for a couple of hours. But dawn on a Friday approached; chances of him being able to multiply his already-abundant body-count would skyrocket with that, even if you’re willing to shut down downtown indefinitely.

    If, say, at 2:45 a.m., he’d managed to kill or wound one more person, which he was apparently still making every effort to do — the question today would not be “police robot bomb?” but “Why’d they wait so long?”

    All these details will be investigated thoroughly, by official and unofficial sources; there will inevitably be, at a minimum, civil litigation out of all of this, in which busy lawyers with subpoenas will probe and point fingers. I’m still curious about more details; I don’t know enough to say with certainty, “Yup, this was a righteous use of deadly force by law enforcement.”

    But I don’t see anything yet to make me doubt that either.

    Either way, I don’t see anything to be especially concerned about that’s specifically related to the use of the remote-controlled robot and remote detonation of an explosive device. If they’d had a more conventional alternative with comparable risks and benefits, surely they’d have used that. But there are no reports of unanticipated collateral injury or damage, and they would certainly have wanted a guaranteed lethal solution if they were worried about him detonating bombs elsewhere.

    Now, there’s a separate debate — with nothing specific to do with robots — about the pros and cons of local police departments becoming “overly militarized,” or appearing that way. I’m not terribly bothered by those risks, but I acknowledge that’s a legitimate topic for debate.

    But this wasn’t that. If you ever can justify “special weapons and tactics” in a civilian setting, it’s surely a situation like this one.

    Beldar (fa637a)

  92. Beldar, this shyte is pretty easy for anyone with logic, morality, leadership, and 2 testicles.
    We try to make logical, rational, moral and very difficult decisions and arguments.
    The CRAZED, INFLAMED, NUT CASES on the LEFT…….DO NOT.
    Our nation has been radicalized, dumbed down, and propagandized from kindergarten to the FOOD STAMP lines of adulthood, and the PARENTS healthcare policy at 27 years of age.
    NOT BY ACCIDENT. The FREE SHYTE ARMY is all in.

    GUS (30b6bd)

  93. Argle bargle, I mis-edited that. Let me try again:

    This decision was not: Is he “contained” or not? The decision was: Is he still an active threat?

    Mind you, at 3 a.m. he’s still taking shots and threatening to blow up bombs. He may be under effective cover, but with no one to shoot at. The police containing him after 1:47 a.m. (when the last officer was killed) were presumably under effective cover themselves while containing him. But that doesn’t mean the situation, or area, were safe — even apart from the threats of remote bombs.

    There, that’s what I wanted to say. I confess to being no more than an armchair tactician. But that’s how I’m guessing the Dallas PD’s rationale went, approximately.

    Beldar (fa637a)

  94. Plus it being in a concrete parking lot dug into the landscape, you don’t have the concern about blowback, debris, or excessive damage. You get a guy in there with a pressure washer and another guy with some filler puddy. Good as new. Maybe even better once the commemorative plaque is in place.

    Might become an urban shrine of sorts.

    You wouldn’t want to be setting claymores off in a residential area.

    papertiger (c2d6da)

  95. Beldar (!! heh, I know the ref all too well), thanks for your informed thoughts. I’m too clueless to have a justified opinion one way or another, but I appreciate your knowledgeable thoughts.

    hunson abedeer (80144e)

  96. Papertiger. You’re one of the best armchair POLICE/STRUCTURAL engineers I’ve ever witnessed!!!!
    I loved the part about….”dug in”.

    GUS (30b6bd)

  97. Maybe it’s just that, historically, we’ve had a high tolerance for robot cops in both Houston and Dallas.

    Beldar (fa637a)

  98. From the Dallas Morning News, How and why Dallas police decided to use a bomb to end the standoff with lone gunman. This purports to give details about how the decision got made, by whom, and when.

    If this story is right, the device was actually detonated earlier than I thought — around 1:30 a.m., which is about when the WFAA timeline reported that a “flash-bang” grenade had been detonated. So that whole timeline may be off. I’m sure in due course, there will be time-stamped logs of radio calls, etc., from which the entire sequence will be rigorously re-examined.

    Also, this story reports that it was a one-pound brick of C4, not a Claymore mine.

    I’m thinking the Claymore report may be based on an assumption that the Dallas PD was using the same gear that had been used by the U.S. military with remote-controlled robots in Iraq, where they did indeed use Claymores.

    Beldar (fa637a)

  99. You think I’m a good armchair engineer on day two, just wait til next week, I’ll be really good.

    papertiger (c2d6da)

  100. I’m not so sure there should be a concern. This was a unique event, and I’m not unhappy with how this unfolded. There was a knock-down, drag-ot shootout going on, and the police were concerned that dude would not give up and take the opportunity to kill more officers. I’ll agree with this shouldn’t be the go-to solution, but this one time, I really don’t have a problem with it. Something many aren’t considering: he may have had explosives on him, ready to go.

    Bill H (971e5f) — 7/9/2016 @ 8:36 pm

    I concur entirely, with one tiny addition. He had, according to DPD Chief Brown, said that he wanted to kill white cops in particular. But he wanted to kill white people.

    He told police he had planted bombs all around the downtown. He wouldn’t have had to necessarily left his sanctuary to have triggered them. It’s not hard to modify a cell phone and use it to trigger a bomb.

    I hesitate to link to any information on the cell phone as a remote triggering device as I don’t need a visit from the FBI. But it’s old information. They’ve been widely used worldwide for well over 10 years old. The bombers on the Madrid subway in 2004 and London subway in 2005 used cell phones to trigger their bombs. So it’s something that terrorists have known for a long time. But it’s also something cops have known for a long time. Which is the only reason I’m mentioning it. It had to be a concern to them.

    This guy had just shot 11 people and killed 5. I think if the Dallas police ever had to take anyone’s threats about bombs seriously, it’s this mass murderer. So he still was an active threat.

    Deadly force was entirely justified in this case. And if deadly force is justified, it doesn’t matter the means. It’s as if people are saying they wouldn’t have minded if the DPD stormed in and engaged the guy, giving him what he wanted; the chance to take more cops with him. But using a method that didn’t expose anymore cops to further danger of being shot just isn’t “fair.”

    Steve57 (a8355f)

  101. Soros, money and manipulation.

    mg (31009b)

  102. Patterico (86c8ed) — 7/9/2016 @ 2:44 pm

    I remember how much I looked forward to the day when this chump got out of office. Now my reaction to that is “meh.”

    Shouldn’t it really be: “I wish he didn’t leave so quickly?”

    A PPP poll showed a majority of the people robo-polled by them preferred Barack Obama to Donald Trump, and they didn’t even ask the question about Hillary Clinton, or dropped it from the questionairre and did it over because the results with her were so bad.

    Sammy Finkelman (c82029)

  103. @Steve57 — I’m not disputing your (or others’) sang-froid over this outcome. I wasn’t there, if the people in charge thought this was the best way to resolve the whole thing, well maybe they were right, maybe; it was after all a dangerous situation, there were lives on the line, a tough call and so forth. My question is, nobody really knew what was happening, why exactly it was happening, how many people were involved (lone weirdo vs. large well-planned group), how deep the rabbit hole actually went. Trying to take the guy alive might have clarified a few things. I’m not particularly interested in the well-being of this creature, but I would have been interested to learn what he knew or did not know.

    hunson abedeer (80144e)

  104. 52. hunson abedeer (80144e) — 7/9/2016 @ 5:28 pm

    I have this pet unproven theory (though my success rate is pretty durn respectable) that you can get a fairly accurate rough judgment of a person’s intelligence by looking into their eyes for about ten seconds.*

    I don’t know about that, but Peggy Noonan writes that you can get an idea of what Hillary Clinton looks like and sounds like when she’s lying by studying the RNC video that compared her statements with that of James Comey.

    I also think that when people are lying, or at least lying in a particular way, their defense is to say they were stupid, and they sound more shallow and stupid than they are.

    Sammy Finkelman (c82029)

  105. Not mentioned here so far:

    On his Facebook page Nicah Johnson “liked” both the New Black Panther Party and an organization formed in 2014 by someone called Mauricelm-lei Millere, who repeatedly calls for violence against police. After the killing of Laquan McDonald in Chicago he called for “death to every blue bastard, hypocrite, killer pig across the nation, according to Oren segal, the director of Anti-Defamation League’s Center on Extremism, as cited in an article by Jonathan Mahler and Julie Turkewitz on page A13 od teh Saturday, July 9, 2016 New York Times. Millere’s organization is called The African American Defense League. I wonder from where he plagiarized that name.

    Johnson used to attend anti-police demonstrations and took an extreme position.

    The New York Times article does not have that he was actually a member of the New Black Panther Party but cites the Southern Poverty Law Center as the source for the statement it wasa founded in Dallas.

    Sammy Finkelman (c82029)

  106. Agree Beldar, “active threat” or not was what I clumsily meant with “contained”

    MD in Philly (f9371b)

  107. And you made clear how he may not have been a threat to anyone at that moment because the area was cleared, but indeed he was still an active threat.

    MD in Philly (f9371b)

  108. “when people are lying, or at least lying in a particular way, their defense is to say they were stupid, and they sound more shallow and stupid than they are.”

    Well, ya know, courses for horses. I’d argue that “shallow” and “stupid” are very different qualities. They can co-exist of course, and often do. (GWB was simultaneously both shallow and stupid, and so is Barack. Trump makes himself sound both shallow and stupid, to serve his purposes, but trust me he is neither.) If you argue that feigning shallowness and stupidity is a strategy for a purpose, then I’m simply interested in the specific cases. But I think Hitlery is actually, really shallow; not stupid necessarily, knows where lots and lots of bodies are buried, but also not so terribly bright. What you watch when you see Hitlery lying, as she’s done for pretty much her entire bloody life (does anybody still remember her ridiculous Health Care Czar train-wreck, why isn’t that part of the discussion?), is a shallow person with tremendous ambition and a sort of zany way to back it up (where she got this from, and/or why she thinks it is her personal prerogative to destroy the world, is an interesting question). How this person is taken more seriously than Gamera the giant Japanese atomic turtle is a problem of continuing interest.

    hunson abedeer (80144e)

  109. Patterico:
    What’s your reaction if the Obama family boards the green helicopter and former Vice President Joseph Biden is swearing on a Bible? Biden is dumb and drunk but that might be something for certain cunning players to exploit.

    urbanleftbehind (847a06)

  110. She has low animal cunning and the trite aphorisms of the age.

    narciso (732bc0)

  111. ohnoes pervy mitt romney’s baby buttboy is in a pickle

    happyfeet (28a91b)

  112. Conservative Treehouse has a follow up post with a TV news clip where the officer’s lawyer says that he was reacting to the presence of a gun and a failure to comply with an order to “not move”,
    The claimed scanner clip of him saying he was making a “BOLO” stop has not been verified, but I think the lawyer said that the content is consistent with the officer’s story

    A caller to Rush the other day pointed out the difference in how Obama and others play it, when somebody kills 49 in a nightclub and says they are doing it because of Islam, or somebody kills 5 police officers because he hates white people,
    the message is to not overreact, it’s an isolated incident; when it is a police shooting, it is not an isolated incident, it is indicative of a broad ranging problem.

    MD in Philly (f9371b)

  113. pervy neo-nazis at pervy breitbart-in-name-only should learn how to give blowjobs from pervy milo yianopoulos

    then they should go and give one to pervy neo-nazi pervy mr. The Donald

    and to his pervy neo-nazi pervy minions

    and not put their pervy perviness on the pervy internet so much

    twoleftfeet (dbc370)

  114. Well, MD, it’s different. In the first instance, it’s Obama’s homies doing the killing. In the second instance, it’s Obama’s homies getting killed.

    nk (dbc370)

  115. True,
    I shared it because while obvious, it says a lot in a concise and objective way that I had not thought of.

    MD in Philly (f9371b)

  116. This could have delivered the one pound present to the murderous Obamason who was punching back twice as hard in Dallas. I suppose they could have ordered up a special delivery by Amazon drone as well. I find myself rather indifferent to the method used to conclude the situation once Obamason declined to surrender.

    Rick Ballard (ddb240)

  117. MD in Philly (f9371b) — 7/10/2016 @ 6:36 am

    pointed out the difference in how Obama and others play it, when somebody kills 49 in a nightclub and says they are doing it because of Islam, or somebody kills 5 police officers because he hates white people, the message is to not overreact, it’s an isolated incident; when it is a police shooting, it is not an isolated incident, it is indicative of a broad ranging problem.

    No, he said this one was an isolated incident – he said they were all isolated incidents:

    http://www.shallownation.com/2016/07/09/video-transcript-president-obama-press-conference-nato-summit-sat-july-9-2016/

    The demented individual who carried out those attacks in Dallas, he’s no more representative of African Americans than the shooter in Charleston was representative of white Americans, or the shooter in Orlando or San Bernardino were representative of Muslim Americans. They don’t speak for us. That’s not who we are.

    Sammy Finkelman (c82029)

  118. What he’s not bene treating as isolated incidents, what he’s been sayinmg is aborader problem, is police shooting black ciivilians.

    From the same press conference in Warsaw:

    …. the Dallas Police Department is a great example of a department that has taken the issue of police shootings seriously and has engaged in an approach that has not only brought down their murder rates but also drastically reduced complaints around police misconduct.

    That’s the spirit that we all need to embrace. That’s the spirit that I want to build on. It’s one of the reasons next week, using the task force that we had set up after Ferguson, but also building on it, and inviting both police and law enforcement and community activists and civil rights leaders, bringing them together to the White House. I want to start moving on constructive actions that are actually going to make a difference, because that is what all Americans want.

    So when we start suggesting that somehow there’s this enormous polarization, and we’re back to the situation in the ’60s — that’s just not true. You’re not seeing riots, and you’re not seeing police going after people who are protesting peacefully. You’ve seen almost uniformly peaceful protests. And you’ve seen uniformly police handling those protests with professionalism.

    Sammy Finkelman (c82029)

  119. When its hassan its workplace violence, even though he had a direct line to awlaki, same for San Bernardino, Boston, Orlando, Chattanooga, times square.

    narciso (732bc0)

  120. Poor Barack still doesn’t understand why Bonnie & Clyde robbed banks.

    Cruz Supporter (102c9a)

  121. This guy surrounds himself with idiots like biden and kerry and then begins to believe that everyone is that stupid.

    Jim (a9b7c7)

  122. We need to tighten up the gun laws in Texas in order to reduce the murder rate in Chicago! (LOL)

    Cruz Supporter (102c9a)

  123. 125. narciso (732bc0) — 7/10/2016 @ 7:20 am

    When its hassan its workplace violence, even though he had a direct line to awlaki, same for San Bernardino, Boston, Orlando, Chattanooga, times square.

    All the work of demented individuals, maybe something else in addirion, but still demendted individuals, according to Obama, and he didn’t want to say Fort Hood should be classified as death by enemy action.

    What’s not an isolated incident is anyone killed by a policeman. That’s a systemic problem. That, we are supposed to believe, only affects blacks – or at least principally affects blacks, and affects blacks so much we have to change the nature of policing. That is not to say that deaths can be reduced.

    But if you want problems with police you can go to Brazil, or Kenya, or private transportation of prisoners.

    http://www.bbc.com/news/world-latin-america-33757212 / http://time.com/3983338/brazil-police-killed-civilians-rio/

    http://www.nytimes.com/2016/07/09/world/africa/kenya-police-abuse-kimani-mwenda-lawyer.html [someone suing police, and his lawyer, and the taxi driver of the taxi they took when leaving the courthouse, all were brutally murdered. The taxi driver wasn’t dead after his beating, so they hanged him.]

    http://www.nytimes.com/2016/07/07/us/prisoner-transport-vans.html

    Like dozens of states and countless localities, Butler County outsources the long-distance transport of suspects and fugitives. Mr. Galack was loaded into a van run by Prisoner Transportation Services of America, the nation’s largest for-profit extradition company.

    Crammed around him were 10 other people, both men and women, all handcuffed and shackled at the waist and ankles. They sat tightly packed on seats inside a cage, with no way to lie down to sleep. The air conditioning faltered amid 90-degree heat. Mr. Galack soon grew delusional, keeping everyone awake with a barrage of chatter and odd behavior. On the third day, the van stopped in Georgia, and one of two guards onboard gave a directive to the prisoners. “Only body shots,” one prisoner said she heard the guard say. The others began to stomp on Mr. Galack, two prisoners said.

    The guards said later in depositions that they had first noticed Mr. Galack’s slumped, bloodied body more than 70 miles later, in Tennessee. A homicide investigation lasted less than a day, and the van continued on its journey. The cause of death was later found to be undetermined.

    Sammy Finkelman (c82029)

  124. hunson abedeer (80144e) — 7/10/2016 @ 5:40 am

    I’d argue that “shallow” and “stupid” are very different qualities. They can co-exist of course, and often do. (GWB was simultaneously both shallow and stupid, and so is Barack. Trump makes himself sound both shallow and stupid, to serve his purposes, but trust me he is neither.) If you argue that feigning shallowness and stupidity is a strategy for a purpose, then I’m simply interested in the specific cases.

    I’m thinking of the time of the Soviet coup on August 19, 1991, when Bill Clinton didn’t want to say anything, and my impression of him at that time was that he was shallow. It was the first time I really paid attention to him, although I’d known he was in the list of candidates for the 1988 presidential election. Later, I researched him, helped along by some leads like a call about the March 8, 1992 Nevada caucuses I heard on a call on talk radio.

    Bill Clinton’s lies were unbelievable. He even hid the fact that he’d been once defeated for re-election as Governor of Arkansas. He claimed to come from Hope. He claimed to have supported the Iraq war (that’s Gulf War I) when he didn’t.

    Anyway, he first struck me as shallow. Shallow resembles stupid because to be shallow, you have to be a little stupid – uninterested. I concluded also, that attemoting to be ignorant makes you sound shallow. I agree stupid is a different quality, but you almost have to be stupid to be shallow. But I think Hitlery is actually, really shallow; not stupid necessarily, knows where lots and lots of bodies are buried, but also not so terribly bright. A good actress though, but needs someone else to supply her her lines. I don’t think she can really be stupid. She can discuss numerous subjects – but again, a way not to say something is to pretend ignorance.

    What you watch when you see Hitlery lying, as she’s done for pretty much her entire bloody life (does anybody still remember her ridiculous Health Care Czar train-wreck, why isn’t that part of the discussion?),

    Because nobody who knows anything about it believes any of that was hers, really – she was just Bill Clinton’s cover to justify a pre-conceived plan – manna for lawyers maybe. And people don’t really remember it also. The Democrats in Congress buried it. About all that people might remember is the individual mandate.

    They lost the 1994 election because they looked very partisan, but that was over the budget and taxes. It passed both the House and the Senate by 1 vote with no Republicans in favor, and people did not believe, as Bill Clinton intended, that the Republican Party was extremely partisan, but they correctly perceived the partisanship was among the Democrats as anything that got zero Republican votes and just enough Democratic votes to pass probably could not be justified on the merits.

    is a shallow person with tremendous ambition and a sort of zany way to back it up (where she got this from, and/or why she thinks it is her personal prerogative to destroy the world, is an interesting question).

    It’s ambition. Pure ambition. And she found her ticket up: Bill Clinton. And Bill Clinton found a woman he could trust. He needed one. Beauty was not a consideration.

    Sammy Finkelman (c82029)

  125. watch that potty mouth.

    papertiger (c2d6da)

  126. I checked the article from the New York Times of yesterday – Micah Johnson joined the Army Reserve after he had graduated from high school. So he must have graduated in January, 2009, which was probably late.

    It looks like he might have been returned early from Afghanistan because of sexual harassment charges that arose there, but I haven’t read that specifically. The army wanted to gove him a less than honorable discharge – his lawyer got a better deal for him than that. After the army he worked for ome place handling mentally disabled people.

    The reason they thought it was more than one shooter was because he moved from level to level in the parking garage. He had written about the tactic in his personal combat journal they found later.
    It was a way to avoid return fire.

    He was living with his mother. I don’t know if his younger sister was also living with his mother. She posted anti-police thoughts ut was surprised it was him.

    His parents were divorced. He had spent some time with his father and stepmother in Garland, taxes, but also lived with his mother. The house in Garland was in a neighborhood called Camelot; there was grassy knoll (or at least grassy field) across the street from the house in Mesquite; the parking gaarge was 2 blocks away from the Texas School Book Depository; his rifle could fire bullets much more quickly than that of Oswald, who had to wait more than 3 second between shots. That’s how things have changed, and not for the better.

    Sammy Finkelman (c82029)

  127. Garland, taxes. Luckily only come once a year.

    papertiger (c2d6da)

  128. The Chief drew the short straw on that one.

    Not an easy read.

    papertiger (c2d6da)

  129. @ Patterico at #14;

    Hey, if we get lucky, we might have President Trump. I don’t think he’s going to be a great President, mind (just better than Shrillary), but he’s likely to be entertaining as hell.

    C. S. P. Schofield (850e8d)

  130. It’s always hard to untangle anything if there are ends you aren’t allowed to pull on.

    C. S. P. Schofield (850e8d)

  131. Portugal vs France for the 2016 Euro Cup on ESPN at 3pm EST. Don’t miss it. This is big time Soccer, the world is watching.

    ropelight (596f46)

  132. nil chance the world is watching
    Bring on the metric system!

    mg (31009b)

  133. I don’t believe I do understand the concern about the robot thing. How would it best be articulated?

    Slippery slope concern. That, rather than arrest people, we just kill them. I think the bomb robot was appropriate in this instance. Even though he was not about to kill someone in the next moment — which is typically when lethal force is applied — I think he obviously posed a significant risk of killing more people if left alive. They tried to get him to surrender and it’s unfair to ask more people to risk their lives if they could do it the way they did.

    Patterico (86c8ed)

  134. his rifle could fire bullets much more quickly than that of Oswald, who had to wait more than 3 second between shots. That’s how things have changed, and not for the better.

    This “change” occurred long before Oswald shot Kennedy. The M1 Garand semiautomatic rifle was developed in the 1920s and 30s, and about 4 million of them were produced during WWII. They held seven rounds in their clip, and are still considered to be a decent weapon. They fire a high velocity, fairly heavy bullet with a muzzle velocity in the vicinity of 2700 fps, and are capable of aimed fire in the 500 yard range. Experts can take that out to 1000 yards. Patton called it “The greatest battle implement ever devised.” The hand held machine guns used by the Germans in WWII were shorter ranged weapons, like the allied equivalent, the Thompson .45 Caliber “Tommy Gun”.

    The AK-47 was developed following WWII by the Russians, and it ushered in the next generation of standard infantry weapons. It is capable of fully automatic fire at 600 rounds per minute, meaning it is a machine gun or assault rifle, and it has a relatively high muzzle velocity of about 2000 fps. Its magazine size, the carrying capacity of an infantryman, and over heating the barrel limits the number of rounds it can fire.

    Of course, in popular parlance in our country, any thing that looks light weight and of modern design is considered to be assault rifle whether it is capable of automatic fire or not. This is just one of many dire consequences that electing Elementary School PE teachers to the U. S. Senate and scoundrels like Nancy Pelosi to the House. Between simple stupidity and cunning self interest, reality must take a back seat.

    In gun controlled Europe, the AK-47 seems to be the weapon of choice for terrorists. The jihadist who was disarmed by three American tourists, for example, had one. This tendency to use more effective weapons in illegal activities makes economic sense because the penalties for having any gun in gun controlled societies are pretty much the same, and certainly a jihadist using faked passports must rely mainly on being beneath the authorities radar while planning his attack. This fixed cost encourages law breakers to max out on the effectiveness side of their weaponry since they don’t appear to regard their own survival as a significant concern.

    It seems to me that an over whelming number of Americans are simply ignorant of the realities that are commonplace in the rest of the world. AK-47s and hand made copies of the weapon are said to be sold at fairly low prices in every conflict region.

    BobStewartatHome (404986)

  135. Barack’s hair has become quite grey. Who knew that spending 7 1/2 yrs playing golf and entertaining pop stars at the White House could age a guy!

    Cruz Supporter (102c9a)

  136. nil chance the world is watching

    Don’t kid yourself. Worldwide audience estimated at 300 million viewers. Soccer is the biggest sport in Europe, Asia, Africa, and South America. Plus soccer is big in Canada and Mexico and growing fast in the US. Your parochial attitude is out of place.

    ropelight (596f46)

  137. food stamp says we need a federal police force

    you know

    like the fbi

    He’s probably thinking more along the lines of the Stazi.

    Kevin M (25bbee)

  138. Barack’s hair has become quite grey

    He probably dyes it grey (or stopped dying it black).

    Kevin M (25bbee)

  139. Hey, if we get lucky, we might have President Trump

    For very small value of luck. This is like saying “if we are lucky we’ll get smallpox and not AIDS.”

    Kevin M (25bbee)

  140. Shouldn’t it really be: “I wish he didn’t leave so quickly?”

    Cue the “Miss me Yet?” posters no matter who wins.

    Kevin M (25bbee)

  141. @Sammy — thanks for your interesting thoughts. Personally I think the difference between shallow and stupid is philosophical (or maybe experiential/ontological?) in nature — I’ve known plenty of smart people who were shallow, and plenty of stupid people who weren’t. Well, “stupid” I guess is an inaccurate word, as it sometimes means “clueless” and sometimes means “somebody who, for whatever reason, didn’t do so good on the SAT.”

    Perhaps the dividing line comes down to the old Irish proverb, “Never trust a man who’s never been punched in the face.” I know ‘stupid’ people who’ve been punched in the face, and mysteriously they aren’t shallow. And I know smart people who’ve never been punched in the face, but who really, really deserve to be.

    hunson abedeer (80144e)

  142. “nil chance the world is watching”

    “Don’t kid yourself. Worldwide audience estimated at 300 million viewers. Soccer is the biggest sport in Europe, Asia, Africa, and South America.”

    He said “the world,” not Europe, Asia, Africa and South America. Nobody cares (nobody real, I mean) what Europeans, Asians, Africans or South Americans think about anything. They don’t count as “the world”. If you can’t understand baseball, your opinion is irrelevant. I might make an exception for Mr. Putin, and whichever robot is now in charge in China. As for Brussels, kill it with fire.

    hunson abedeer (80144e)

  143. “Slippery slope concern.”

    Giving a murderer the opportunity to garner publicity during a day long standoff/negotiation is also a very slippery slope. He earned and deserved his C4andygram and the method of delivery deserves no more consideration than the caliber of rifle used by Atticus Finch.

    Rick Ballard (ddb240)

  144. The Devil threatened to detonate bombs. Therefore, he deserved to be killed right on the spot.
    Why is anyone getting their panties ruffled about a robot punking his *ss?

    It’s almost a Marxist argument that The Devil ought to have had a fair shot at a live human being who was engaging him with a weapon.

    Cruz Supporter (102c9a)

  145. What else could they have done? Giving that the way the DPD handled it was good. It got the job done.

    What would have been better?

    Tear gas just seems to add ambiance to street shootouts without dousing the impulse.

    papertiger (c2d6da)

  146. What would have been better?

    Nerve gas?

    Kevin M (25bbee)

  147. #152 Kevin M,

    Like I said, why is anyone getting their panties ruffled? (LOL)

    Cruz Supporter (102c9a)

  148. The shooter’s family may have a case and likely will sue the DPD for use of excessive force. As distasteful as that is, the suspect had rights. He was cornered, wounded, with limited ammunition and weapons, massively outnumbered and surrounded by superior firepower. All the DPD had to do was maintain the isolation and simply wait him out –(or let him bleed out.) Or possibly even gas him. Instead, they blew him up like a scene from some half-assed ‘Dirty Harry’ film.

    Regardless of the grim circumstances on the minds of the DPD and the emotions of the moment, blowing up the suspect was not only unprofessional– but alarming. When the police start acting as judge, jury and executioners, it only fuels anti-police sentiments. Shade’s of ‘Magnum Force.’ Harry Callahan was make-believe. The DPD has helped make that fiction a reality. And it is truly disturbing.

    DCSCA (a343d5)

  149. @139/@7.

    “I think the bomb robot was appropriate in this instance.”

    Wounded, isolated, limited ammo, delirious, deprived of food and sleep, vastly outnumbered, surrounded and cornered on an upper level of a parking garage?

    No. See 154.

    DCSCA (a343d5)

  150. this thread has 207% more comments than the average post

    happyfeet (28a91b)

  151. We have stumbled onto the key to black killers.

    Since the robot cannot have “intent”, why not send thousands into Chicago, do some robot on black “house cleaning”, in an “excessively careless” law enforcement operation that is “convenient”, non-prosecutable and largely legal with no apparent motive the Bamster will have to fret over.

    No police officers involved, hence, no “killer cops”, the community becomes safe, law abiding and everybody is happy again…

    Pts (ce7fc3)

  152. Count on the international man of hystery (sic) to bring on the crazy. The police who kept him “contained” were in constant danger from him and they had the right to self-defense and to abate the danger.

    nk (dbc370)

  153. Frank Rizzo might have used force a bit excessively in bombing the house in Philly but serving the writ for a rat in Dallas via robot wasn’t excessive at all considering his claim of having planted bombs – with possibility of remote detonation. I doubt very much emotion played any part in the decision to minimize further risk.

    Rick Ballard (ddb240)

  154. A writ, writ for a rat, to wit a rat-writ.

    nk (dbc370)

  155. “The police who kept him “contained” were in constant danger from him and they had the right to self-defense and to abate the danger.”

    Well, just run this by Daily Kos or Huffington.

    This is a racist comment! This is disavowing the constant experience of the Black Man in America and profiling him as a “danger causing” citizen!

    You have to be a black man to understand this. Don’t you think Barack Obama notices people approaching him from down the hall in the White House grasping their purses a little closer, putting a cautious, defensive hand over their wallet pocket!?

    Do you think its easy being a Black in the WHITEY HOUSE!?

    And please don’t disgust me by saying the President of the United States is black and the Attorney General is Black and the US Ambassador to the UN is black!!!

    This is the very evidence of systemic racism we are talking about!!!

    Pts (ce7fc3)

  156. Just think of it as an extremely proactive ant-recidivism measure employed with the full knowledge of the subject who refused repeated offers of alternative measures. IOW – he signed his own writ.

    Rick Ballard (ddb240)

  157. DCSCA (a343d5) — 7/10/2016 @ 3:10 pm

    Or possibly even gas him.

    Which is what they did with a similar device in Albuquerque.

    He probably signed his death warrant with his claim to be able to set off bombs remotely (if that is what he did) The police in their statement said they didn’t say everything that he said them, but it’s been reported he said he had such bombs.

    The thing is, if that he was he did, didn’t he know that that same claim was what moved the police in Orlando to finish off Omar Mateen after a 3 hour standoff during which some people were allowed to bleed to death? (we still don’t know if some of the people in Orlando were killed by police bullets.)

    Sammy Finkelman (c82029)

  158. There is no cure for stupid. Obama is incurable.

    Bill M (906260)

  159. you look at everything that has transpired in the last eight years, from the housing bubble popping, which happened at exactly the right time, law enforcement under siege, redeployments from afghanistan and iraq, attacks on the home front, the dismantling of our health care system, and one has to conclude enemy action,

    narciso (732bc0)

  160. What would have been better?

    152. Nerve gas?
    Kevin M (25bbee) — 7/10/2016 @ 2:51 pm

    A Flame Thrower?

    Frankly I don’t care on this one. Police took the least dangerous route available to clear the situation (non one else exposed to harm). Also saved the taxpayers of Texas the cost of a trial with a foregone conclusion and years of litigation to carry out the likely sentence. Turds like this, no matter who they are, need and deserve to get their tickets punched.

    Bill M (906260)

  161. Well there’s all sorts of ways to parse this. There really are. But nobody (well, nobody serious, anyway) is “getting their panties in a twist” over the thing. It’s simply that it might have been profitable (in terms of info) to try and take him alive. Maybe that just wasn’t possible. Maybe it was too dangerous, I have no way of knowing. There were a lot of risk factors and a lot of unknowables, so maybe they evaluated the whole thing practically, and made the right call. But it isn’t screaming zany OUTRAGE! to think, if they had used different tactics, maybe they’d have a live subject and a great deal of useful information. Maybe not. But now we’ll never know.

    hunson abedeer (80144e)

  162. This is the same level of thought required to believe Superman wearing glasses rendered him impossible to perceive as other than Clark Kent.More than sad

    corwin (6d3e8e)

  163. The Dallas Police couldn’t wait until after he detonated bombs. They had to act. He already proved he was a murderer, and therefore his threats to detonate bombs were legitimate, serious, and imminent.
    This is just basic Morality 101.
    Jesus.

    Cruz Supporter (102c9a)

  164. 160. The MOVE house was not bombed by Frank Rizzo. It was Wilson Goode, Philadelphia’s first black mayor.

    Jack Klompus (d606e2)

  165. Upon further reflection,
    what they did was better than a sniper taking him out.
    Assuming the robotic device was not invisible or had a cloaking shield,
    he saw it coming and had the choice to surrender,
    unlike a bullet fired from a distance.

    I think the police were well within their responsibility.
    Though “they” may want to make a tazer-first model to take people live for questioning.

    Having killed 5 people, saying you want to kill more,
    including by detonating bombs,
    and refusing to give up,
    he had been given every chance he deserved.

    MD in Philly (f9371b)

  166. they may be needing more no. 5s in philadelphia, as well as cleveland, next month,

    narciso (732bc0)

  167. Frank Rizzo. Now there’s a blast from the past. Guy was a real pisser, lol.

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  168. Lots of dusty old Irish taprooms in Northeast Philadelphia have shrine-like photos of Rizzo on the wall behind the bar.

    Jack Klompus (d606e2)

  169. Regardless of the grim circumstances on the minds of the DPD and the emotions of the moment, blowing up the suspect was not only unprofessional– but alarming. When the police start acting as judge, jury and executioners…

    If they had line-of-sight a sniper would have shot him in the head, and no court would have let a suit go to trial.

    Kevin M (25bbee)

  170. Considering 1. less interest in employment in law enforcement due to lowered morale; and 2. the newfound interest in robotic complements, perhaps the management-Democrat/”DLC” half of the left spectrum is in quiet support of antipolice activity if only to be free of future pension and benefit expenditures.

    urbanleftbehind (847a06)

  171. @ hunson abedeer, who wrote (#109):

    Trying to take the guy alive might have clarified a few things. I’m not particularly interested in the well-being of this creature, but I would have been interested to learn what he knew or did not know.

    This is true in every situation; we’d prefer to capture criminals alive than to kill them, for this among other reasons. The decision-makers obviously concluded that wasn’t possible, without risking more police deaths. Do we yet know all of the details they considered? No. Is it reasonable to expect that before moving to a lethal alternative involving explosives, they considered nonlethal alternatives? Yes, that’s usually part of the decision matrix. But tear gas, for example, in a parking garage whose sides are open to the breeze is not going to be an effective way to prevent someone from remote detonating bombs around downtown; rather, it seems likely to trigger more instant violence, if those threats were real. The shooter obviously intended that they be taken seriously.

    So I’ve yet to see anyone come up with a better plan than the one that was used, which worked to solve the immediate problem, even if it didn’t work in the ideal fashion like. This wasn’t a Hollywood movie; my childhood hero Roy Rogers wasn’t there to shoot the guy out of the guy’s hand. Rather, this guy wasn’t going to give up or let himself be taken, if police reports of the standoff are accurate.

    You went on to write (#):

    But it isn’t screaming zany OUTRAGE! to think, if they had used different tactics, maybe they’d have a live subject and a great deal of useful information. Maybe not. But now we’ll never know.

    No, you’re carefully avoiding seeming to be crazy or outraged. But you haven’t said how you’d have done it. Until then, I think you’re engaging in idle speculation.

    There will be an investigation to supplement in great detail everything that’s being reported in the press. But you want to seriously argue that there was some non-lethal option available, you need to at least be able to articulate what that option was and how it would have worked as well, without making things worse.

    Beldar (fa637a)

  172. And light trolling. But that’s just the vibe I’m getting. 😀

    Beldar (fa637a)

  173. coming from the fellow who fouled up the john mohammed matter, this isn’t reassuring,

    https://pjmedia.com/trending/2016/07/10/former-philly-police-commissioner-some-incident-likely-at-conventions/

    narciso (732bc0)

  174. Tranquilizer gun?….but the Wikipedia article gives the reasons against it.
    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tranquillizer_gun

    Military and police use Edit

    Tranquillizer darts are not generally included in military or police less-than-lethal arsenals because no drug is yet known that would be quickly and reliably effective on humans without the risks of side effects or an overdose. This means that effective use requires an estimate of the weight of the target to be able to determine how many darts (if any) can be used. Shooting too few would result in partial effects only, while too many can kill the target. According to James Butts, Santa Monica, CA Chief of Police, “Tranquilizing agents don’t affect everyone uniformly. Therefore you cannot predict whether or not you have a sufficient dose to tranquilize the individual. Second, any tranquillizer will take time to enter the bloodstream and sedate the individual. If someone is advancing on you with a deadly weapon or a threatening object, there’s no way a tranquillizer would take effect in the two to three seconds it would take someone to seriously injure you.”[6]

    kishnevi (b0adf2)

  175. their concern is heartfelt, shirley,

    https://twitter.com/alimhaider/status/752270690380705793

    narciso (732bc0)

  176. …Wounded, isolated, limited ammo, delirious, deprived of food and sleep, vastly outnumbered, surrounded and cornered on an upper level of a parking garage?..

    DCSCA (a343d5) — 7/10/2016 @ 3:16 pm

    And just take it on faith the mass murderer was just too nice a guy not to have planted bombs. And he couldn’t set them off he he had. No thanks.

    Also, pro tip. When deadly force is justified, as Chief Brown and Mayor Rawlings clearly had decided it was, there is no such thing as excessive force. I don’t think you understand the concept of excessive force. Excessive force is when the police use more force than is necessary to arrest someone, and they weren’t trying to arrest him.

    It doesn’t matter if you use a knife or a bomb. You can’t kill someone just a little bit, and you can’t kill them too much. There’s just dead.

    Steve57 (a8355f)

  177. … He was cornered, wounded, with limited ammunition and weapons, massively outnumbered and surrounded by superior firepower.

    DCSCA (a343d5) — 7/10/2016 @ 3:10 pm

    You have a vivid imagination. But it’s not at all how the police on the scene assessed the situation. In fact, in most respects it was the opposite. They figured he was wearing a vest, and wasn’t wounded. If he was wounded he was only wounded lightly. And they assessed he had lots of magazines left. And limited weapons? What the hey. How many weapons can you shoot at one time?

    He had plenty of weapons and ammo. All he was going to need for the last stand he was really hoping for. So, how many more dead cops would you have liked to see?

    Steve57 (a8355f)

  178. It really speaks to the infection of moral equivalency and left wing hysteria that we’re actually questioning the decision to eliminate the threat. The threat had already shot 14 people and just declared he had planted bombs and was set to detonate them. Therefore, he was asking to be eliminated PRONTO.
    When he’s announced an intention to detonate bombs, there’s no time for chat or for a Harvard Law School lecture about his civil rights.
    He’s dead. He can burn in hell.

    Cruz Supporter (102c9a)

  179. like sending this fellow to italy, I mean what has renzi ever done to deserve this,

    https://twitter.com/CounterJihadUS/status/752254084208406528

    narciso (732bc0)

  180. The question is, was there a way to rapidly incapacitate him without serious risk to the people on the scene,short of killing him?

    The people who had to make that decision thought there was not, and I see no reason to say they decided wrongly.

    BTW, this article explains why a police sniper was not the answer. Also gives reason to say he was wounded at some prior point that night.
    http://www.cnn.com/2016/07/10/politics/dallas-shooting-police-chief-david-brown/index.html

    kishnevi (7bc26d)

  181. @ DCSCA (#154), who wrote:

    The shooter’s family may have a case and likely will sue the DPD for use of excessive force.

    No, he wouldn’t.

    Beldar (fa637a)

  182. Beldar, hunson abedeer is indeed the (formerly?) banned troll Christoph.

    nk as magyardad izzyelk (dbc370)

  183. 184. You have my permission to go “Marielito” on that ingrata.

    urbanleftbehind (304501)

  184. I didn’t come through mariel, I did come down to Florida, that year.

    narciso (732bc0)

  185. well it’s about ratings or ego, or some other venal thing, coronello,

    http://www.weaselzippers.us/282751-obama-defends-black-lives-matter-by-comparing-them-to-movement-to-end-slavery/

    narciso (732bc0)

  186. Steve57 (a8355f) — 7/10/2016 @ 9:26 pm

    And just take it on faith the mass murderer was just too nice a guy not to have planted bombs. And he couldn’t set them off [if] he he had. No thanks.

    If he had bombs, why didn’t he set them off already? He wanted to kill as many people as possible – why leave them unexploded and take the chance he could be killed before he could set them off?

    On the other hand, to

    LIE

    and to say he had bombs that he hadn’t set off, but could, that would make sense to him, because it would keep the police at bay. There was a 95% chance he was lying about that. It wouldn’t have made sense for that to actually be true.

    He could also have had booby traps, or devices set on a timer. But that was maybe another reason for using a robot. And after they killed him, they probably weer careful to check for bombs.

    Also, pro tip. When deadly force is justified, as Chief Brown and Mayor Rawlings clearly had decided it was, there is no such thing as excessive force. I don’t think you understand the concept of excessive force. Excessive force is when the police use more force than is necessary to arrest someone, and they weren’t trying to arrest him.

    They wanted him to surrender. Therefore, they were trying to arrest him. But he was too dangerous to approach. Too dangerous, and too heartless for anyone to get near him. If he had decided to surrender, they’d have talked him through how to do it.

    I think they got him by surprise, by the way. Unlike teh eay md in Philly has it, I don’t think he thought that robot would explode.

    Micah Johnson had signed his own death warrant by making himself appear, or trying to make himself appear, more imminently dangerous than he was. It didn’t entirely have the effect he expected.

    Now the chief is saying he planned a more deadly attack than what he did. Contemplated is a better word I don’t think he even learned how to make explosives correctly, and he knew he didn’t.

    Sammy Finkelman (c82029)

  187. I actually thought you were an old-school “59er”, N. I think I was envisioning more the ferocity you should unleash, REBENGA! as it were, on that TV personality.

    urbanleftbehind (5eecdb)

  188. 195. What the link says is that Donald Trump did a few small acts of kindness that were not tax deductible, and not because he was asked. I don’t think you’ll find a single one with Bill and Hillary Clinton.

    Here’s the list:

    1. In 1986, he stopped the sale of a family farm after the owner commmitted suicide and offered money to the widow.

    2. In 1988, when a commercial airline refused to fly a child across the country for medical treatment because the child had a life support system, Trump used his own plane to do that. (This was around the time he has bought Eastern Airlines, if I am right, so that could be the way he got involved. His airline, if that is the case, also wouldn’t do it, so he did it with his private plane, instead of telling them to go and try somewhere else.)

    3. In 1991, some Marines who were Gulf War veterans (who had been sent to?) Camp Lejeune in North Carolina were scheduled to return home to their families, but then were told an aircraft would not be available. Trump sent his own plane and it made two trips between North Carolina and Maine.

    4. In 1995, Trump’s limo got a flat tire. A passing motorist helped him. Trump asked how he could pay him back and he was told send flowers to his wife. He did, and also paid off the man’s mortgage. Sounds like what people imagined Howard Hughes might do.

    5. In 1996 Trump sued the city of city of Palm Beach, Florida, claiming they were discriminating against his Mar-a-Lago resort club because it allowed Jews and blacks. Other clubs at the time, did not. This was appreciated by the Anti-Defamation League because it shined a light on that and caused other clubs to end that practice.

    6. In 2000, Trump was watching the Maury Povich show on which a little girl struggled with Brittle Bone Disease was featured. Trump sent a check. (maybe this one was tax deductible, bit they weren’t raising money – Trump had to contact Maury Povivh to find out where and how to send the money.)

    7. Sometime between 2005 and 2016: When Miss Wisconsin USA of 2005 was struggling with what was supposed to be an incurable illness, she received a handwritten letter from Trump, and he also gave her and her son jobs over time, so he graduated college without any debt.

    8. In 2008, when Jennifer Hudson’s family members were murdered in Chicago, Trump put her and her family up at his Chicago hotel for free, and he did that with more than usual security.

    9. In 2013, when a bus driver stopped a bus and convinced a woman not to jump off a bridge, Trump sent the driver a check because he believed he should get a reward, and that this wouldn’t happen if he didn’t do it himself. The driver had possibly even risked his job.

    10. In 2014 – now this maybe is getting into his plans for a political campaign – when Sgt. Andrew Tahmooressi was released after having spent seven months in a Mexican jail for accidentally crossing the US-Mexico border, and he got no extra compensation from the U.S. government, he spent money to help him get back on his feet.

    Sammy Finkelman (c82029)

  189. https://www.commentarymagazine.com/politics-ideas/inconvenient-attacks-vague-language/

    “I think it’s very hard to untangle the motives of this shooter,” the president told reporters at a press conference. “By definition, if you shoot people who pose no threat to you, you have a troubled mind.”

    If Obama was attempting to say that mass killers are definitionally disturbed and, therefore, we should disregard their stated motives, that’s a defensible proposition. But the president has not been consistent here….

    …Obama was, however, less cautious when addressing the motivations of Dylann Roof after he attacked churchgoers in Charleston, South Carolina. “The fact that this took place in a black church obviously also raises questions about a dark part of our history,” Obama said at the time. “This is not the first time that black churches have been attacked. And we know that hatred across races and faiths pose a particular threat to our democracy and our ideals.” Roof’s motives were explicitly racist, and it was important to hear a clear denunciation of that bankrupt worldview from the president. But why does it seem that, to the president, some motives are clearer than others?

    Sammy Finkelman (643dcd)

  190. @186: “He had plenty of weapons and ammo.”

    He had what was left of what he was carrying; was wounded and bleeding, delirious, outnumbered by a superior force and isolated on the second floor within elements of a cement parking garage. The patient, professional move by law enforcement was to wait him out- (or let him bleed out)… de-escalate the situation, arrest the suspect and let justice take it course. Instead, somebody recommended to play out a fantasy scene from a ‘Dirty Harry’ film– or more likely ‘the Hurt Locker’. It’s an alarming action. And a slippery slope. Shades of ‘Magnum Force.’ And if you’re honest with yourself, you’d see that.

    @191: “No, he wouldn’t.”

    Yes, the family could, ‘Inspector Briggs.’

    @185: “… they weren’t trying to arrest him.”

    And by acting as judge, jury and executioners– particularly in an era where police are equipped with quasi-paramilitary garb, moving around towns in war surplus armor– such actions against a civilian population only fuels anti-police sentiments.

    _______

    Most people in America– and around the world–don’t give Dallas, Texas much thought beyond the famed football team, its cheerleaders, the excess on display in the 1980s TV drama (remember who shot JR?)– and November 22, 1963.

    But for most, what Dallas means around the world is the assassination of President Kennedy, the murder of Officer Tippit, then Oswald– in police custody on live television no less. Back in 2013, on the 50th anniversary of the assassination, the mayor of Dallas made a grand speech in Dealey Plaza, proudly proclaiming how the city had finally shaken the stigma of that terrible, terrible November day. Now that half-century of progress has been blown away. And that is as tragic for Dallas as the loss of five policemen last week, and the loss of a President of the United States over 53 years ago.

    DCSCA (a343d5)

  191. It actually is hard to disentangle motive if the POTUS uses all the resources at his power to entangle the motive

    steveg (fed1c9)

  192. Black Boys VAPORIZE A Lot??? NEXT!!!

    Kell (9956e8)

  193. Since discovering the shooter was a Muslim, the motive becomes deadly clear. He was engaged in promoting the global jihad. Obammy does not want the unwashed masses to understand this. So he will obscure the issues as he usually does.

    whirlwinder (376ec6)

  194. Where did you get aht he was Muslim? He was a Black Panther. (the new group)

    Sammy Finkelman (c82029)

  195. Barack Obama gave an eulogy at a memorial servce in Dallas for five slain police officers. Mark Levin said it started out good but then took a far left turn, that he has to get his thing in.

    Obama did his usual fake moral equivalency today at the Dallas funeral in which he plays the peacemaker, in which both the people attacking the police and the people maybe defending the police have right on their side and we need to understand each other.

    And in which the feelings in the black community are based on experience. Actually the opinions and the protests are based on lies. The two incidents cited most frequently, that involving Trayvon Martin killed by George Zimmerman, and Michael Brown killed in Ferguson Missouri, are based on lies..

    You can never reform or correct lies, because people can always lie some more. You fight lies with words and not with deeds.

    And getting zero wrongdoing by police, is like getting zero car accidents and zero garbage in landfills.

    Obama talked about poverty being allowed to “fester” in black communities, but not crime being allowed to fester, which is what’s actually being allowed to fester to a greater or lesser degree. He said guns were easier for a teenager to get (possessing guns in the only crime he will acknowledge as a crime more prevalent in black communities) than a computer or even books. What?? there are no public libraries? Not the best libraries, but something. He’s talking total nonsense.

    The one thing Barack Obama won’t say is that there’s a mythology going on. Instead, he claims, it is not a mythology. This is going 180 degrees in the wrong direction. You can never resolve this by any kind of concessiopn or change in policy because it is based on lies. You can only resolve this by people realizing it is lies. Well, if the people inventing the lies will stop lying maybe you can, but they’ll do it only for lots of money and freedom for crime to fester.

    Sammy Finkelman (c82029)

  196. The truth is, there are very few people killed unjustly by the police in the United states, and when there is, most of the time no protests are needed to get an investigation and a prosecution, and when police do wrong they’re just as likely to do it to someone is not black as to do it to someone who is black.

    That was even in the New York Times.

    http://www.nytimes.com/2016/07/12/upshot/surprising-new-evidence-shows-bias-in-police-use-of-force-but-not-in-shootings.html

    They found what they thought was bias in terms of suspecting people, but not in what happened to suspects.

    A new study confirms that black men and women are treated differently in the hands of law enforcement. They are more likely to be touched, handcuffed, pushed to the ground or pepper-sprayed by a police officer, even after accounting for how, where and when they encounter the police.

    But when it comes to the most lethal form of force — police shootings — the study finds no racial bias.

    But you know, blacks are more likely to be just plain bad people. Not because there’s something inherent that should cause that, but because of a bad cultural mileau, and bad friends. Did the study consider that possibility?

    They actually overcorrect.

    officers in Houston were about 20 percent less likely to shoot if the suspects were black.

    That’s where the difference in treatment is.

    Perception based in reality? Far from it.

    Anyone that says there is much truth is what Black Lives Matter says is throing fuel on the fire.

    Sammy Finkelman (c82029)

  197. I read something in a column in the New York Daily News. I don’t even think the columnist understood what he was saying.

    http://www.nydailynews.com/opinion/errol-louis-americans-heal-thyselves-article-1.2707527

    My friend Kevin McCormack, a high school principal and Catholic deacon who is, with Rabbi Joseph Potasnik, a co-host of the “Religion on the Line” radio program, recently urged listeners to re-read the famous 1963 “Letter From a Birmingham Jail” by the Rev. Martin Luther King., Jr.

    “In any nonviolent campaign there are four basic steps,” King wrote from behind bars during one of the low points of the civil rights movement. “Collection of the facts to determine whether injustices exist; negotiation; self purification; and direct action.”

    So what’s misisng?

    Collection of the facts to determine whether injustices exist;

    They DON’T, in a general way.. Not that indidivual cases cannot exiat, not that policing cannot be improved.

    negotiation;

    You can’t correct something that doesn’t exist.

    At that time, it was stopping specific things, like segregated buses. And can anyone dream of demanding specific people be prosecuted? hat’s putting a thumb on the scales of justice.

    self purification

    That has not happened. No person Like marches, and boycotts and sit-ins.alking violence should be permitted at any demonstration. And there should also be an end to this self-righteousness.

    Only then:

    direct action

    Like marches, and boycotts and sit-ins.

    Sammy Finkelman (c82029)

  198. I have no time now, but I saw two articles, one in the New York times, one in the Daily News, both bout that TV show Obama did yesterday that can illustrate what exactly obama is up to. He is sympathetic to police, but combines that with lies.

    The number one thing he will not ccontradiuct the narrative in the black media or whereever, and attributes unwarranted suspicion of police to people’s own spontaneopus thoughts. It is not that he endorses the narrative – in fact he refused to let Eric Garner’s daughter on the air – she would have asked him questions – maybe why there was no federal investigation in his case, and the last thing Obama wants to do is utter the truth.

    Sammy Finkelman (372aad)


Powered by WordPress.

Page loaded in: 0.1938 secs.