I have tried to be an optimist. At least through tomorrow’s election.
I’m sorry. Explain how I am supposed to be an optimist.
I give up.
UPDATE: Moment of weakness from a really, really bad poll. I have no idea what we do now, and I am pessimistic about the election, but no giving up.
Pronounced "Patter-EE-koh"
E-mail: Just use my moniker Patterico, followed by the @ symbol, followed by gmail.com
Disclaimer: Simpsons avatar may resemble a younger Patterico...
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It’s not a good look for me anyway.
Patterico (805eed) — 5/2/2016 @ 11:26 pmNo poll has ever been that wrong.
Patterico (805eed) — 5/2/2016 @ 11:27 pm34 points in Kah-lee-fornia.
34 points.
I hear Dandy Don singing Turn Out the Lights.
Patterico (805eed) — 5/2/2016 @ 11:41 pmEven if you think this poll is an outlier, the average is over 26 points.
Patterico (805eed) — 5/2/2016 @ 11:42 pmThe Republican Party has decided to kill itself. This will be the greatest defeat in the party’s history — an election that was a slam-dunk win, betrayed by people who ought to be horsewhipped.
All so that they could flip off America.
Kevin M (25bbee) — 5/2/2016 @ 11:58 pmIs this the place where I write that the final Cruz rally in Indianapolis did not attract anything near the support he received in Iowa at his final appearance?
The truly scary part for me is that even if Ted somehow manages to prevent an outright 1,237 delegate commitments for Trump after all the primaries, he will need to claim something like 75-80% of the unbound delegates to prevent a first-ballot Trump win. I checked this math with a Cruz operative I met (not my guy John) and asked him to tell me my math was wrong. Assuming a split of California (best case scenario at this point) the Cruz guy said, “I can’t.”
Ed from SFV (3400a5) — 5/3/2016 @ 12:04 amI am far less interested in Cruz being the nominee than I am in Trump not being nominated. The GOP can go into the election with nearly any other candidate and have a decent chance. But Trump cannot get more than 30-35% of the vote. TOPS. The rest of the country hates him. It’s not like anyone likely to vote doesn’t have an opinion by now, and the media is not going to let Hillary be painted in a bad enough light to make any difference.
This was the GOP’s election to lose, and if it nominates Trump, it has lost it, and is probably dead as a party.
Kevin M (25bbee) — 5/3/2016 @ 12:11 amThe day that Trump is nominated, I will change my registration to No Preference. I still hold out some hope that the RNC does not chose suicide, but they’ve been so completely feckless so far, so I doubt it.
Kevin M (25bbee) — 5/3/2016 @ 12:25 amtrump wins crud loses you are crud losers. trump our next president! leading slimy hillary in lates rasmussen poll 41=38%
indiana next (77ae47) — 5/3/2016 @ 1:02 amDon’t give up. If you can’t win, make the enemy’s victory sour. So all that he’ll remember from it is the hurt. Scuttle the ships. Blow up the munitions. Burn the wheat fields. Leave him only scorched earth.
nk (dbc370) — 5/3/2016 @ 1:09 amStill over a month to go, and as HRC has proven–leads can evaporate rather quickly when a candidate starts messing up. If Trump wins by a significant margin in Indiana, it’s probably over. If Cruz pulls it out, expect an epic tantrum by Trump and the game will change significantly.
M. Scott Eiland (9fd59f) — 5/3/2016 @ 1:23 amthe GOPe has no one but themselves to blame for this…
starting with Jeb! the Inevitable and then Speaker Ryan (AKA “Boner Junior”)giving Obola the Dimwitted everything he wanted, when there was a GOPe majority in both houses since the 2014 elections.
RINO’s gotta RINO.
redc1c4 (018028) — 5/3/2016 @ 1:50 amAssuming he loses Indiana tomorrow, Ted should do the honorable thing and drop out.
Boris (77667e) — 5/3/2016 @ 2:07 amthere’s always the possibility that Trump gets the nomination and beats Shrillery in November.
maybe you shouldn’t be taking so much counsel from your fears?
redc1c4 (018028) — 5/3/2016 @ 2:09 amAss-u-pulling, Boris.
nk (dbc370) — 5/3/2016 @ 2:10 amGive it up, nk. It’s all over and you know it.
Boris (77667e) — 5/3/2016 @ 2:12 amHey, Boris, is it true that in New Zealand a sheep can sponsor an immigrant for a fiance visa?
nk (dbc370) — 5/3/2016 @ 2:24 amthere’s always the possibility that Trump gets the nomination and beats Shrillery in November.
maybe you shouldn’t be taking so much counsel from your fears?
Twas in the bleak November,
nk (dbc370) — 5/3/2016 @ 2:32 amAnd the robo calls all said “Remember,
To go out and vote” like a chump.
To which I replied,
“My anger has not died.
Never Trump!”
… and then Captain Stompy McStompyfoot grabbed his ball and went home.
papertiger (c2d6da) — 5/3/2016 @ 2:40 amThank you republicans for bringing the lying, traitorous republican party to ashes. The best part about no republican party is we will not have to listen to saps like romney, rove, boehnor, ryan and all of their desperate republican minions. Lock and load and become friends with a coal miner.
mg (31009b) — 5/3/2016 @ 2:48 amResearch your own wedding arrangements, nk.
Boris (77667e) — 5/3/2016 @ 2:51 amWHY? Why would California vote decisively for someone who promises to build a wall?
https://patterico.com/2016/05/01/here-we-go-again-2/
papertiger (c2d6da) — 5/3/2016 @ 2:54 amOh, I’ll still vote, papertiger. Maybe even volunteer. But not for Trump, God forbid. Leaning for the Senator most likely to vote to impeach him. That’s really the only office that’s up for grabs where I’m at.
nk (dbc370) — 5/3/2016 @ 3:00 amMr M wrote:
Not to pick on Mr M, but his comment seems pretty much in line with most of the commenters here. How many people here have scorned the GOPe, a code for the Republican Party “establishment,” and yet are hammering the GOP because the actual voters have chosen someone no one ever thought could be a serious candidate?
Let’s be honest here: Senator Cruz had his chance, had a fair shot, had the support of a lot of conservatives, but still couldn’t win. The voters went just as anti-establishment as our host would have liked, but went anti-establishment in a completely different direction.
I do not blame Marco Rubio for staying in it too long; he was simply exercising the same right as Mr Cruz to run for office. I do not blame the over-large Republican field, because all seventeen of them were doing the same thing, taking a long-shot chance.
The only one to blame for Senator Cruz losing the nomination is Senator Cruz. He put himself before the voters, was given a fair chance to make his appeals, and he failed to persuade enough of them to vote for him.
I agree with most of the commenters here: the nomination of Donald Trump will almost certainly be a disaster. But Mr Trump will be the nominee because he went out and actually won primary elections.
The coldly realistic Dana (f6a568) — 5/3/2016 @ 3:18 amI could explain it but you’d dismiss me as a Jesus freak.
The reverence and gentleness part still escapes me.
http://drillinstructorstories.com/
All I can say is, welcome to the party, pal.
http://www.blackfive.net/photos/uncategorized/2008/02/18/drill_inst_2.jpg
My friends.
Steve57 (412496) — 5/3/2016 @ 3:38 amyou have to cast a wide net like jesus
advantage: Mr. The Donald
happyfeet (831175) — 5/3/2016 @ 4:34 amhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ajY1R7FsxVg
Casting just a wee tad wide of a net.
Steve57 (412496) — 5/3/2016 @ 4:40 amSadly, the California Republican Party has been a broken, inept shell for two decades now, as the repeated re-election of the profoundly incompetent Barbara Boxer to the Senate has demonstrated most eloquently. I fear a lot of Republican voters there are desperate enough for any win that they will be quite vulnerable to the siren song of the squirrel scalped huckster from New York.
M. Scott Eiland (9fd59f) — 5/3/2016 @ 4:45 amAt 3:25 Don starts into delivering discussion on the glancing blow with the splitting maul to her skull.
I love that part.
Steve57 (412496) — 5/3/2016 @ 4:52 amIf you have not already, figure out a way to pay as little tax as possible to the coming Hillary! administration.
As a resident of an offshore jurisdiction, I welcome (licit) American investment.
JP (bd5dd9) — 5/3/2016 @ 5:45 amnk, the original title comes to mind: “De Civitate Dei contra Paganos.”
The Visigoths may well sack Rome. But we cannot give in to despair. It only makes us reflect on what we believe, why we believe it, and how we conduct our lives.
Simon Jester (0e9cb0) — 5/3/2016 @ 5:57 amUPDATE: Moment of weakness from a really, really bad poll. I have no idea what we do now, and I am pessimistic about the election, but no giving up.
Patterico (6467ac) — 5/3/2016 @ 6:43 amWheaties!!! Breakfast of Champions!
Colonel Haiku (2601c0) — 5/3/2016 @ 6:46 amSorry. I Just have to laugh.
https://otrwjam.files.wordpress.com/2012/03/pancho-villa2.jpg
Steve57 (412496) — 5/3/2016 @ 6:49 amI blame the voters. This thing where we blame the candidates sounds nice and all, but the utter and transparent fraudulence of Donald Trump reveals very clearly where the main failing lies, and it is with an electorate that chose a con man over constitutionalism. Did Cruz make mistakes? Sure, everybody does. But he ran a good campaign. He spoke articulately and effectively in favor of the free market and limited government. Anyone who chose Trump over him simply is uninformed or doesn’t care about the stated principles of the party.
It is the voters’ fault, and ours for not recognizing the danger of a system that allows snuggle-toothed chuckleheads so much power over our personal lives, through their ill-considered votes for charlatans who favor a slightly different flavor of big government.
Patterico (6467ac) — 5/3/2016 @ 6:57 amTed Curz is losing because he undermined his own biggest attribute. He proudly paraded the mantel of a principled conservative yet his underhanded vote and delegate grubbing tactics repeatedly called his integrity into question.
His expedient treatment of Ben Carson in Iowa started the narrative, the in-your-face Colorado delegate grab advanced the narrative, and his Arizona strong-arm tactics cemented Cruz’s reputation for behind the scenes cheating. Also, the deal with Kasich didn’t help either.
Now, Cruz is grasping at straws to keep his candidacy afloat. His popularity is tanking, his negatives now exceed his positives, he’s way behind in the polls both in Indiana and in California. His only dim hope now is to keep Trump from winning on the first ballot – which is every day less likely to save Cruz’s bacon.
The fat lady hasn’t started singing yet, but she’s in the building, dressed, ready and waiting for her curtain call.
ropelight (5c7740) — 5/3/2016 @ 7:03 amI blame the voters. This thing where we blame the candidates sounds nice and all….
—Patterico
The time to give up was after the electorate returned Obama for a second term. By then, the voters knew what they were getting.
AZ Bob (d6a3a9) — 5/3/2016 @ 7:07 amThere is plenty of blame to go around
There usually is
Yes, blame the voters
But they have had a lot of help to get where they are
All suffer when the judgment comes
I still don’t know what will happen
MD in Philly (062f39) — 5/3/2016 @ 7:10 amI know the forces at work
And I know how it comes out in the end
But the near term is unclear
I may not be optimistic about Cruz’s chance to be the nominee but I think Cruz did well. I doubt anyone believed he could win one state before this started but he ended up with several wins, impressive fundraising and debates. He was a dedicated campaigner and he outlasted all of the mainstream candidates.
But voters wanted something else, especially in the SEC states where Cruz had to win but didn’t. Desperate voters don’t want measured, thoughtful candidates.
I think Republicans should be very concerned about their Party. Whether Trump wins or loses, is there any doubt the GOP will return to the moderate candidates we used to call Rockefeller Republicans? If so, it will be a long time before the GOP wins the White House again, or the Senate, and the Court is gone. Trump has done to the GOP what he did to Trump steaks, vitamins and casinos.
DRJ (15874d) — 5/3/2016 @ 7:11 amI blame the voters. This thing where we blame the candidates sounds nice and all, but the utter and transparent fraudulence of Donald Trump reveals very clearly where the main failing lies
Agree with this. But I blame as well the conservatives who cannot get outside their bubbles and engage with people outside their worlds. Many of the LIV’s that are constantly derided here and elsewhere in conservative-bloggo-land have the same capacity to be conservatives as anyone who spends gobs of their time b*tching on blogs. There is, and has been for decades now, a serious need for, lacking a better word, evangelism of free market ideas, an evangelism of how individual freedom is good for the individual. How the only thing the individual has to fear is fear itself…to borrow from a man who knew nothing about economics but did know how to connect with people. But it needs to be worked out on a small scale, not via slogans, nor rhetoric, nor quotes of the founding fathers, nor obscure historical or even constitutional facts*. Though there is a more general need for Americans and even many conservatives to understand that our constitution does not grant us rights, but recognizes that we as sovereign individuals are endowed by our creator with those rights. That our system works because it is grounded in that recognition of reality. There is no way you can get 150 million people on the same page on issues like this by changing laws, be they changes for good or ill. There are good people struggling to make it in this country but they don’t understand how to create wealth. This cannot be imposed by “taking back our country” or any other such dwelling on politics as the solution. Politics is the problem.
*I think this is one of the reasons Cruz works so well in small groups and one-on-one but fails to connect well on a broader platform.
WTP (8894aa) — 5/3/2016 @ 7:18 amAs for who is to blame, there are many reasons Republican voters are desperate – especially the Obama Administration’s damaging policies and a complicit Republican Congress.
But voters made this choice and this is on them. I hope it works out better than I fear
DRJ (15874d) — 5/3/2016 @ 7:21 amit will, but making excuses for them is not helpful. Voters are adults and part of heing an adult us taking responsibility for the choices you make.
Ted, for all his virtues, would have been just another polite loser who refused to go on the attack in the general. Mr. Trump will go for the jugular in a way Ted could not have done.
Boris (77667e) — 5/3/2016 @ 7:29 amI don’t particularly enjoy fencing with the most ill tempered ropelight, but this needs a response:
So, Trump has paraded his dishonesty, vulgarity, and hypocrisy (he openly stated he never complained about the system when it worked in his favor). And trumpkins are complaining that Cruz not having integrity?
Con man over conservatism. Clearly the twitterfication of the electorate is complete: people just care about slogans, not policies. Bumper sticker politics.
Simon Jester (2708f4) — 5/3/2016 @ 7:30 amA monster 👾 has been created that cannot be controlled.
Even the Dems are fracturing their alliance of the aggrieved.
Many Bernie supporters will not back HRC,
Obama has led a leftward drift too far for many Dems.
The Republican establishment ignored a large part of their constituency and took them for granted so long that they lump Cruz in with the rest of the Republicans.
The media is still thinking they are controlling the narrative, but they aren’t as much as they think.
MD in Philly (062f39) — 5/3/2016 @ 7:37 amBoris,
Ted uses reason and Trump relies on emotion, as does Hillary. A Hillary-Trump race is frightening because neither one uses reason to make decisions.
DRJ (15874d) — 5/3/2016 @ 7:38 amSimon,
MD in Philly (062f39) — 5/3/2016 @ 7:38 amJust perform a fleche’ and get it over with.
he was way too santorum in a year where nobody gives two craps about silly santorum issues
i tried to warn him
happyfeet (a037ad) — 5/3/2016 @ 7:39 amSorry, my French is bad.
MD in Philly (062f39) — 5/3/2016 @ 7:41 amhttps://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fl%C3%A8che_(fencing)
giving Obola the Dimwitted everything he wanted, when there was a GOPe majority in both houses since the 2014 elections.
That’s why I think it’s painfully naive to assume that Hillary being in the White House will be a good thing (or have a silver lining) because the Republicans in Congress therefore will at least put up a good fight against her.
If anything, the predicted loss of the Republican Party in November will be a message by the US electorate that it does want, in effect, the third term of “Goddamn America,” causing anything a bit right of center to feel — at least unconsciously — that it has to be squishier than ever before. Staunch conservatives, in turn, will look so marginalized, many of them will want to throw in the towel and rely not on the importance of voting at the ballot box, but voting with their feet and moving van.
Mark (fb60e8) — 5/3/2016 @ 7:42 amA JFK-Cruz conspiracy theory promoted by Trump that ropelight will believe.
DRJ (15874d) — 5/3/2016 @ 7:42 amBlame the voters for what? Choosing the candidate they think best to lead the country? Some Americans consider that a fundamental right, and don’t take kindly to those who call them names or talk down to them.
Cruz and his supporters had plenty of opportunity to persuade voters to support his candidacy. But, judging from my experience here, Cruz’ supporters spent their time savaging anyone who wouldn’t immediately bow down to their presumed omnipotence. Rather than persuasion they chose personal insult.
If you’re looking for someone to blame I’d take a look at the hate mongers like Cruz Supporter, nk, Kevin, Hitchcock, Beldar, et al. They’re the name callers, the holier than thou types, the agents of political dogma. Have they succeeded in bring any voters to the Cruz camp, or have their efforts alienated potential supporters? You make the call.
ropelight (5c7740) — 5/3/2016 @ 7:44 amActually feets
MD in Philly (062f39) — 5/3/2016 @ 7:44 amThe Santorum issues are the ones people care about the most in a consistent fashion
No sane person wants their daughter in a bathroom with a man.
I blame open primaries. Why do non-republicans get to vote for who the Republican Party runs for president?
Tanny O'Haley (c674c7) — 5/3/2016 @ 7:45 amI also blame the dishonest media.
Tanny O'Haley (c674c7) — 5/3/2016 @ 7:46 amFor choosing an obvious charlatan when we finally had a chance at electing a real, principled, limited government conservative.
This is not the country that declared independence in 1776. It is no longer special. It was once. Not any more.
Patterico (86c8ed) — 5/3/2016 @ 7:47 amYou think Trump is really going to be popular with those who were voting for “Lyin’ Ted”?
Really???
Leviticus is close to getting his multi party
MD in Philly (062f39) — 5/3/2016 @ 7:47 amOf course, I’m on the record for wanting a 4 way general.
I’m not giving up, but it is increasingly likely Trump will win the nomination. Then welcome President Hillary Clinton.
I blame the voters too, but the media and the establishment didn’t help. Trump got $2 Billion of free ads via the media, and of course the establishment created the conditions for Trump to rise.
But in the end the voters, like ropelight, care more about “tough talk” than actual principles. They will be disappointed when either Clinton gets elected (most likely) or when Trump does and instead of doing what he said (because he’s a con man), he sells out to the establishment. Its too bad they cannot recognize this, but its hard for people to admit they are wrong.
I’ll probably be voting for Johnson in the general, because in good conscience I cannot vote for a liberal, liberty-hating, Democrat.
Patrick Henry, the 2nd (ddead1) — 5/3/2016 @ 7:53 amropelite, do you have any more developments into the Cruz family’s possible involvement with Oswald in the JFK assassination? What about the disappearance of the Lindbergh baby?
Cruz Supporter (102c9a) — 5/3/2016 @ 7:53 amThe problem with large numbers of candidates, of course, is someone winning with 32% or so of the electorate.
Simon Jester (2708f4) — 5/3/2016 @ 7:54 am“… But the near term is
unclearnuclear”FIFY, MD.
Colonel Haiku (1ec93b) — 5/3/2016 @ 7:56 amOur esteemed host wrote:
I have this image in my mind about the sales manager who says to the CEO, “Look, we had an excellent product, and our sales staff presented it well in almost every case. It’s the fault of the customers for not buying our products!”
To say that Senator Cruz “spoke articulately and effectively in favor of the free market and limited government” is simply wrong: he may have spoken articulately, but it’s clear that he didn’t speak effectively, or he’d be the winning candidate.
The coldly realistic Dana (f6a568) — 5/3/2016 @ 7:57 amThe Santorum issues are the ones people care about the most in a consistent fashion
that’s not what these primary results are telling us Mr. Dr. it’s just not
happyfeet (a037ad) — 5/3/2016 @ 7:57 amI blame all the people throughout the US who have given the current occupant of the Oval Office higher approval ratings (particularly during his last term in office—but also well before then) than it gave to his predecessor (who sunk to the mid-30s in Gallup), and who for over 20 years have chosen Hillary as one of the women they most admire.
“Decadent” sounds like such a fire-and-brimstone word, but I can think of no other adjective that better suits the US (and the Western World in general) in the 21st century.
Mark (fb60e8) — 5/3/2016 @ 8:04 amjeb bush gets a lot of credit – a LOT of credit – for this outcome
his ridiculously foppish candidacy eroded any patience people had left with establishment trash like himself
people are done and done with that nonsense, and thank God Mr. Trump was there to provide a real alternative
i think people were really naive to think that in this climate people would embrace a hyper-ideological harvardtrash government apparatchik like ted
that flavor it has no muy sabor
happyfeet (a037ad) — 5/3/2016 @ 8:04 am…when we finally had a chance at electing a real, principled, limited government conservative.
Yeah, one who wasn’t eligible for the US presidency because he was born in Canada to Cuban father? Ted Cruz isn’t a natural born American citizen and as such is ineligible for the presidency.
I’m fully aware the issue has been glossed over and counter arguments have been made, and that the issue has been swept under the rug, but the simple truth is the founding fathers would be appalled at the prospect of Ted Cruz as Commander-in-Chief of US forces.
How conservatives can claim adherence to the Constitution and approve of a foreign born citizen of Canada as a candidate for the US presidency is absurd. And, they know it in their hearts, even if they refuse to allow the truth to pass their lips.
ropelight (5c7740) — 5/3/2016 @ 8:05 amI have this image in my mind about the sales manager who says to the CEO, “Look, we had an excellent product, and our sales staff presented it well in almost every case. It’s the fault of the customers for not buying our products!”
Except that the sales staff in this case, failed. One could argue that the customer base is too ignorant to understand the product and what it can do for them. But whose responsibility, within the context of the analogy, is that? Or one could argue that the customer base looked at customers who had bought the product and recoiled at being like them. If you’re a Windoze user, how you view Mac users. If you’re a Mac user, well come up with your own f’n analogy. You’re all think yourselves as being so damn “smart”.
WTP (8894aa) — 5/3/2016 @ 8:06 ambut it’s clear that he didn’t speak effectively,
He regrettably doesn’t have a dulcet voice. But neither does Hillary. But many people — for various reasons — naturally, unconsciously give the benefit of the doubt to a left-leaning public figure, even one as corrupt as she is.
Mark (fb60e8) — 5/3/2016 @ 8:09 amNo one liked it when the former Speaker of the House, John Boehner, said about Mr Cruz “I get along with almost everyone, but I have never worked with a more miserable son of a bitch in my life.” Don’t forget, Mr Boehner won a bunch of elections, and his House colleagues liked him. While a lot of people like the fact that Mr Cruz didn’t go along to get along, we have to consider the possibility that Mr Cruz isn’t the most likable guy around, and that’s part of the reason that he didn’t win.
And, too often ignored, is the fact that Donald Trump has charisma. Now, don’t ask me, I sure can’t see it and can’t understand it, but it is obviously there, the evidence being that so many people like him. We appreciated the greater charisma that George Bush had over Al Gore and John Kerry, and noted that that helped him in his campaigns.
In the end, only one thing counts: results.
The very coldly realistic Dana (f6a568) — 5/3/2016 @ 8:17 amI just don’t get that poll. I would have thought all the dormant Repubs in this state would choose Cruz. Yet only The Donald robo-called me to register to vote for him. Did Cruz just give up?
Patricia (5fc097) — 5/3/2016 @ 8:17 amRopelight,
You lie,
And I am tired of it.
Nothing has been glossed over or swept under a rug.
Yes, there is a very real disagreement,
But people disagreeing with you is not the same as ignoring it or hiding it.
Some people should know better, and know the difference between discussing facts and spinning narratives.
MD in Philly (062f39) — 5/3/2016 @ 8:20 amSo, what am I lying about MD?
ropelight (5c7740) — 5/3/2016 @ 8:24 amWhat Cruz says is not necessarily what people hear,
What gets played is what they hear
All day yesterday Fox plays the interchange between Cruz and the Trumpist and states it was a draw,
And today Fox says 9/10 Republicans will vote for Trump.
Now Fox is touting the voter ID is racist meme.
MD in Philly (062f39) — 5/3/2016 @ 8:26 am(Yes, with my father, not my choice).
ropelite, you asserted a couple days ago that a “majority” of GOP primary voters have chosen Trump. That’s yet another lie.
Cruz Supporter (102c9a) — 5/3/2016 @ 8:28 amWe appreciated the greater charisma
There are visceral and non-ideological reasons behind the way just about every person out there deals with another person, public figures included.
A photo of Ted Cruz is currently posted at the drudgereport and it evokes why some people have compared his face with that of the actor (Al Lewis) who played Grandpa on the 1960s TV show “The Munsters.” It’s not fair that he therefore won’t receive the emotional boost that the main Democrat candidate in 2008 received from Republicans like Peggy Noonan (or quite a few others who lean right), but that’s human nature, foolish or otherwise.
Mark (fb60e8) — 5/3/2016 @ 8:31 amMr Supporter wrote:
Overall, you are correct, but the primaries are a winnowing out process, and as the candidates got winnowed down to 3 — or maybe 2½ — Mr Trump did start winning primaries with absolute majorities.
The Dana who can count (f6a568) — 5/3/2016 @ 8:34 amDana, thanks for your efforts at reason and truth, but that’s not what these guys are about – it’s all gotcha games. They’re gutter snipes and cheap shot artists. The kind of people your mother wouldn’t let in the front door.
ropelight (5c7740) — 5/3/2016 @ 8:39 am61
To say that Senator Cruz “spoke articulately and effectively in favor of the free market and limited government” is simply wrong: he may have spoken articulately, but it’s clear that he didn’t speak effectively, or he’d be the winning candidate.
This is unreasonable. Sometimes circumstances are against you and you have no path to victory no matter how good a race you run.
James B. Shearer (1f62d7) — 5/3/2016 @ 8:43 amMr Light, I can recognize what’s happening, even if I don’t like it. I despise Donald Trump, and will not vote for him in November, but I can still see that he has won this nomination.
More to the point, he will win this nomination, rather than Ted Cruz having lost it. The man has been absolutely brilliant when it comes to getting free publicity, to drawing crowds, and to making this whole nomination about him.
The Dana who will be voting third party in November (f6a568) — 5/3/2016 @ 8:43 amActually, the esteemed Beldar took ropelite to the woodshed in an infinitely more convincing way than I’m capable of when he addressed ropelite’s disregard for basic arithmetic the other day,
A particularly dishonest Trumpkin shill lied, again, at #68 above when he wrote that “the majority of GOP voters agree” upon Trump.
In fact, candidates other than Trump have won over 14 million votes (Cruz 6.9M, Rubio 3.5M, Kasich 3.7M), compared to Trump’s 10.0M.
Trumpkins shills like this one lie reflexively, all the time, and they count on their lies being accepted as truth simply because the Trumpkins repeat them so frequently. They’re completely unreliable, and unhinged from reality.
Cruz Supporter (102c9a) — 5/3/2016 @ 8:43 amBeldar (fa637a) — 5/1/2016 @ 12:21 pm
I’m all about reason and truth,
Cruz could have ran a destroy Trump campaign,
Like will be done in the general if he is the nominee.
Stealing private land with government help
Hundreds of lawsuits
Hiring illegals to run his businesses
But he didn’t
MD in Philly (062f39) — 5/3/2016 @ 8:45 amAnd Trump gives us “Lyin’ Ted”
Mr Shearer wrote:
What measure for effectiveness is there but results?
The production-oriented Dana (f6a568) — 5/3/2016 @ 8:47 amMake that the once, but no longer esteemed Beldar…
FIFY
ropelight (5c7740) — 5/3/2016 @ 8:49 amIf Trump wins, it will be for the simple reason that more than 1/4 or Americans (1/2 of 1/2) are sick of PC language and can /need to get no farther than that.
That will not win the general election.
HRC will be the target of all kinds of things Sanders refused to bring up.
Even Sanders Dems are saying they are tired of voting for the least of bad choices.
If a two person general, record low turnout and HRC wins.
Four person general, record turnout, not sure how it turns out.
It could be the soul of the nation is at stake,
MD in Philly (062f39) — 5/3/2016 @ 8:52 amOr perhaps is on display.
You called me a liar MD. I’m waiting for you to back down or back it up.
ropelight (5c7740) — 5/3/2016 @ 8:53 amYou’re all think yourselves as being so damn “smart”.
WTP (8894aa) — 5/3/2016 @ 8:06 am
==============================
Yur work here are dun.
Colonel Haiku (1ec93b) — 5/3/2016 @ 8:54 amHow many states that will vote Republican in the general have voted 50% or more for Trump in the primary?
MD in Philly (062f39) — 5/3/2016 @ 8:54 amHow does that look as a measure of the strength of his support?
I gave the info in the same post,
MD in Philly (062f39) — 5/3/2016 @ 8:55 amOthers added other examples
With few exceptions the Trumpers who post here lie a lot and/or say stuff like Cruz is a transvestite. Sometimes they keep repeating a lie after it’s been refuted. I take it for granted that such people aren’t persuadable, and were not alienated by Cruz supporters. Some of the Trumpers posting here have clearly been hostile to most tenets of conservatism. One particularly obnoxious person comes to mind. I take it for granted that such people aren’t persuadable as well. Some may be Democrats pretending to be for Trump, but in any case they aren’t persuadable.
Then there’s the ones who say their objective is to destroy the Republican party.
There’s also at least one person whose only identifiable argument for Trump has been that he’s going to win the nomination.
I recall that at least one Trumper was under the impression that Cruz and conservatives generally are for open borders and that Cruz took up the issue after Trump entered the race. It was pointed out to him that’s not the case. No one called him names. Was he persuaded? No.
Bottom line: I don’t believe any Trumpers here were alienated by Cruz supporters.
If I was to draw conclusions about Trump based on his supporters, or at least those who post here, I wouldn’t touch him with a ten foot pole.
Gerald A (945582) — 5/3/2016 @ 8:55 amI resent not making the list. Not to brag, but I think Kevin and Beldar will admit I’ve made the hard slog.
Steve57 (412496) — 5/3/2016 @ 8:56 amI love how ropelite smears the Bush family and the Hinckley family with crackpot conspiracy theories about their collusion to have President Reagan assassinated, then he turns around and pontificates about the importance of having fidelity to truth, reason, and evidence.
Cruz Supporter (102c9a) — 5/3/2016 @ 8:57 amSad!
You keep lying about Cruz’s natural born citizen status, ropelength. Alla damma tima. For starters.
nk (dbc370) — 5/3/2016 @ 8:59 amBottom line: I don’t believe any Trumpers here were alienated by Cruz supporters.
No, of course not, because otherwise you’d have to take responsibility for alienating potential Cruz voters. The shoe fits because it’s on of yours.
ropelight (5c7740) — 5/3/2016 @ 9:00 amMr. Trump will forgive you Mr. 57
he’s got a heart as big as a sasquatch heart
that’s how big it is
happyfeet (a037ad) — 5/3/2016 @ 9:01 amI did read, somewhere, the expression “Branch Trumpidians.” 🙂
The wryly amused Dana (f6a568) — 5/3/2016 @ 9:02 amSteve, you weren’t named but you are included in the et al category. The content of your comments hasn’t risen to the point of individual acknowledgment.
ropelight (5c7740) — 5/3/2016 @ 9:04 amI’ll sooner believe the crackpot conspiracy theory than the it’ll impress Jodi Foster story.
That one always smelled of fish.
papertiger (c2d6da) — 5/3/2016 @ 9:04 amOur Windy City barrister wrote:
Given that “natural born citizen” isn’t actually defined in American law, it can reasonably be argued that Mr Cruz isn’t one. I believe he is, but it is also true that he is the son of one American citizen, not two, and he was born in a foreign country.
Heck, Barack Hussein Obama was at least born in the US!
We’ll never persuade the birthers, many of whom assert that to be a natural born citizen one must be not only born in the United States, but also be the child of two American citizens. Saying that the light at the end of his rope is lying is to assert that he knows that his opinion is incorrect.
The Dana who isn't an attorney (f6a568) — 5/3/2016 @ 9:06 amKeep your powder dry and keep squeesin’ those sour grapes. I’m going out for a booze and BBQ run, gotta stock up the party cart. It just might turn out to be a fun celebration tonight at Casa ropelight.
ropelight (5c7740) — 5/3/2016 @ 9:09 amDana,
What I object to is not the difference in opinion,
but the claim that those who disagree with him are “sweeping it under the rug” or other such phrases.
The issue has been out in the open in the middle of the floor for some time now.
MD in Philly (062f39) — 5/3/2016 @ 9:12 amKeep partying through the burning of Rome, ropelight.
MD in Philly (062f39) — 5/3/2016 @ 9:13 amWhat comments prevented you from switching to Cruz? I don’t expect an answer, other than a non-answer answer.
Gerald A (945582) — 5/3/2016 @ 9:16 amCursed darkness!!! Damn you!!! Damn you to hell!!!!
WTP (8894aa) — 5/3/2016 @ 9:20 am68.No one liked it when the former Speaker of the House, John Boehner, said about Mr Cruz “I get along with almost everyone, but I have never worked with a more miserable son of a bitch in my life.” Don’t forget, Mr Boehner won a bunch of elections, and his House colleagues liked him. While a lot of people like the fact that Mr Cruz didn’t go along to get along, we have to consider the possibility that Mr Cruz isn’t the most likable guy around, and that’s part of the reason that he didn’t win.
All candidates have strong points and weak points. Obviously Cruz would have done better if he didn’t have any weak points but a cause that can only prevail if it is advocated by a candidate with no weak points isn’t a very good bet.
All campaigns have to make decisions where any choice has advantages and disadvantages. Cruz made a strategic decision to go against his Republican colleagues in Congress. This had advantages but also an unavoidable downside. It does seem to me that Cruz could perhaps have mitigated the damage better.
In the end, only one thing counts: results.
Finishing second in the Republican primary isn’t that bad of a result.
James B. Shearer (1f62d7) — 5/3/2016 @ 9:23 amI split a bottle of whiskey with a Sasquatch back on Kodiak during the late ’80’s. Most people don’t know this. I tend to shut up as strippers were involved.
Steve57 (412496) — 5/3/2016 @ 9:23 amBut I’ll let YOU know this, hf, because I trust you.
Steve57 (412496) — 5/3/2016 @ 9:26 amTrumpkins are easily identifiable by their aggressive dishonesty and outright projection.
JD (34f761) — 5/3/2016 @ 9:28 am81What measure for effectiveness is there but results?
Results include more than simply whether you won or lost. A pitcher may pitch effectively as measured by his ERA and still have a bad win loss record. And you have to take circumstances into account, a good ERA in Coors field might be a bad ERA somewhere else.
James B. Shearer (1f62d7) — 5/3/2016 @ 9:33 amI’ll work harder, then.
Steve57 (412496) — 5/3/2016 @ 9:42 amsasquatches are quintessetnially Jacksonian in their whirl-view
damn fine americans
happyfeet (a037ad) — 5/3/2016 @ 9:48 am*quintesntissely*
happyfeet (a037ad) — 5/3/2016 @ 9:49 amMr Shearer wrote:
Only if that means you won’t get remembered as having gotten thumped in the general election. Otherwise, it’s still a loss. From Top Gun:
Remember, Germany took Second Place in World War II!
The amused Dana (f6a568) — 5/3/2016 @ 9:56 amJames – in the instant scenario, it was ineffective because he didn’t lie, smear, dramatically alter his historical positions held, and get billions of dollars of free TV due to being a celebrit@rd.
JD (52076d) — 5/3/2016 @ 9:57 amSure, Dana, go ahead and sell somebody a load of styrofoam in grey mud, telling them it’s concrete, at half the price of your concrete competitor. You were effective. You succeeded!
nk (dbc370) — 5/3/2016 @ 10:01 amMr Shearer wrote:
“We won every statistic but the scoreboard.”
On my poor site — and yes, I’m pimping my own blog here — I have an article up noting that female CEOs seem to get hired more frequently by companies that are already in trouble. The notion is somewhat interesting, but, again, no one cares — or, at least, no one should care, if Marissa Mayer is a woman; we should only care if Yahoo prospers or perishes under her leadership.
If women accept CEO positions at already-troubled companies, so what: they know what the problems are when they sign that contract. In the end, only results matter.
The blogger Dana (f6a568) — 5/3/2016 @ 10:02 amOur Windy City barrister wrote:
Actually, while I haven’t produced it, there are companies which use shredded tires and all sorts of different pellets in concrete for highway sound barrier walls. 🙂
The concrete producer Dana (f6a568) — 5/3/2016 @ 10:05 amAnger clouds judgement. The electorate is angry beyond mere words and is out for blood (the GOPe’s blood to be precise). The media wants Trump (good for business – eyeballs on screen IS their product). Media outlets treat the political season like a horse race for obvious reasons (eyeballs = ad revenue). So, the public wants angry rhetoric about burning it (GOPe / Washington) all down.
Add the fact that I believe no polls without the details (questions asked, demographic breakdown per question, sample selection methodology). Even then I am skeptical (push polls anyone?).
People want something to believe in, government isn’t it. Trump says he will do this n that. No track record of actually doing or saying the same things before he began his run for office. And lots of evidence pointing the other way. But those are facts and not relevant to “Kick those buggers where it hurts… BAD”.
We may well spend the next four years like the last 8 hearing the rubes self-identify.
Yehoodi (2dddac) — 5/3/2016 @ 10:14 amMr Shearer pointed out:
Which raises the obvious question: is the kind of conservatism championed by Mr Cruz a bad bet, is it too unpopular to be successful electorally in a democratically elected representative republic?
The philosophical Dana (f6a568) — 5/3/2016 @ 10:17 amApparently a plurality of conservatives now prefer big government authoritarianism to actual conservatism.
JD (52076d) — 5/3/2016 @ 10:22 am#50, DRJ, sorry it took me so long to respond. Who knows for sure now if Cruz the Elder was the guy photographed with Lee Oswald handing out Fair Play for Cuba leaflets in front of Clay Shaw’s Trade Mart building on August 9, 1963 in New Orleans?
Perhaps some interested reporter might ask Ted if his father was a member of DRE (Student Revolutionary Directorate) at that time.
You may recall that Oswald and Carlos Bringuier (Head of DRE in NOLA) got into a scuffle (the police identified it as orchestrated) and the 2 later debated each other on Bill Sutckey’s radio show where Oswald sheep-dipped himself as a Marxist/Leninist. Later it was revealed that Bringuier had Oswald’s Guidebook for Marines in his possession and that the leaflets were stamped 544 Camp Street, NOLA, which was the address Bringuier used as his office.
It wouldn’t hurt to ask if DRE still has membership records either. After all DRE was funded by the CIA so those records would belong to the taxpayers.
ropelight (5c7740) — 5/3/2016 @ 10:26 amLololololololololololol conspiracy theories are so effin awesome.
JD (52076d) — 5/3/2016 @ 10:30 amRopelight… Oliver Stone called and he wants his wet-brain back…
Colonel Haiku (40880a) — 5/3/2016 @ 10:58 am111Only if that means you won’t get remembered as having gotten thumped in the general election. Otherwise, it’s still a loss. From Top Gun:
Reagan finished second in 1976. It would be a mistake to conclude from that he was a bad candidate or ran a bad campaign.
Remember, Germany took Second Place in World War II!
And this wasn’t because they had bad generals or bad soldiers. Or because they weren’t extreme enough.
James B. Shearer (1f62d7) — 5/3/2016 @ 11:55 amDon’t smear ropebight with skepticism about his conspiracy theories, you haters.
nk (dbc370) — 5/3/2016 @ 11:57 amyou’ve been drinking from roger stone’s waterbottle, ropelight, it’s equally likely that oswald ‘had a relationship’ with a cuban embassy staffer, so the wife of octavio paz related, and he was run by the dgi, which was a kgb appendage,
narciso (732bc0) — 5/3/2016 @ 11:59 am117 Which raises the obvious question: is the kind of conservatism championed by Mr Cruz a bad bet, is it too unpopular to be successful electorally in a democratically elected representative republic?
True believers aren’t anything close to a majority so if they want to win they have to make alliances which will involve policy concessions.
James B. Shearer (1f62d7) — 5/3/2016 @ 11:59 amThe facts are the facts boys, even if y’all can’t see beyond the end of your noses. There was a young Cuban man photographed standing beside Oswald. Oswald did get into a scuffle with Carlos Bringuier, which the arresting officer did characterize as orchestrated.
Oswald and Bringuier did debate on Bill Stuckey’s radio show, and Oswald did identify himself as a Marxist/Leninist. Bringuier was head of the NOLA DRE, Oswald’s leaflets were stamped 544 Camp Street, Bringuier did have his office at that address. Additionally, Bringiuer did have Oswald’s Guidebook for Marines in his possession. The CIA was providing the funding for DRE.
Now, given the facts, isn’t it reasonable to ask a candidate for president if his father was a member of DRE and if so, was he handing out leaflets with Lee Oswald on that hot August day. It’s not the kind of thing one forgets.
ropelight (5c7740) — 5/3/2016 @ 12:07 pmFox is on it now.
MD in Philly (062f39) — 5/3/2016 @ 12:08 pmNames might also be in police records, there were arrests that day and taking the names of witnesses would have been standard police procedure.
ropelight (5c7740) — 5/3/2016 @ 12:10 pmYou are hysterical, ropelight.
JD (52076d) — 5/3/2016 @ 12:17 pmit was the cigarette smoking man, on his first assignment in the states, know that,
narciso (732bc0) — 5/3/2016 @ 12:18 pmI’m not hysterical, I’m accurate. You’re the one making a blithering fool of yourself.
ropelight (5c7740) — 5/3/2016 @ 12:21 pmFake, but accurate.
Colonel Haiku (40880a) — 5/3/2016 @ 12:24 pmI’m not the one kicking a dead horse, nor am I the one repeating the same idiot nonsense expecting a different result.
ropelight (5c7740) — 5/3/2016 @ 12:24 pmRopelight, are you familiar with the expression “curiosity strangled the cat”?
Colonel Haiku (40880a) — 5/3/2016 @ 12:27 pmYou are just asking the tough questions while engaging in wide reaching conspiracy theories based on nothing but insinuation. Gotcha.
JD (52076d) — 5/3/2016 @ 12:28 pmNot exactly, I’ve always heard that curiosity killed the cat.
ropelight (5c7740) — 5/3/2016 @ 12:28 pmNow, given the facts, isn’t it reasonable to ask a candidate for president if his father was a member of DRE and if so, was he handing out leaflets with Lee Oswald on that hot August day. It’s not the kind of thing one forgets.
Holy way too much antifreeze in the moonshine, Batman!
Considering that Ted Cruz was born six years and eleven months after Kennedy was assassinated, a reasonable person might want to “smear” the person who made that statement in italics above by tapping his temple and saying “Cuckoo! Cuckoo! Cuckoo!” Or possibly “f***ing lying Trumpkin shill”.
nk (dbc370) — 5/3/2016 @ 12:30 pmJust what wide ranging conspiracy theory based on nothing but insinuation am I engaging in?
ropelight (5c7740) — 5/3/2016 @ 12:30 pmnk, you’ve got your head up your ass again. As usual.
ropelight (5c7740) — 5/3/2016 @ 12:32 pmNot exactly, I’ve always heard that curiosity killed the cat.
ropelight (5c7740) — 5/3/2016 @ 12:28 pm
=====================================
God lives in the details, ropelight.
Colonel Haiku (40880a) — 5/3/2016 @ 12:32 pmSo, what’s your point Colonel?
ropelight (5c7740) — 5/3/2016 @ 12:33 pmHow would any of those alleged facts lead one to the conclusion that Cruz’s father was in any way likely to have been in the photograph handing out leaflets? We may as well say given those facts is it reasonable to ask if Trump’s father was on the grassy knoll, or your father, or maybe you if you’re old enough.
Gerald A (945582) — 5/3/2016 @ 12:33 pmSo, what’s your point Colonel?
ropelight (5c7740) — 5/3/2016 @ 12:33 pm
================================
Think on it for a while, I think it will become clear…
Colonel Haiku (40880a) — 5/3/2016 @ 12:35 pmof course it could have been the grays, I recall from dark skies,
narciso (732bc0) — 5/3/2016 @ 12:37 pm#142, Gerald, I believe the the National Enquirer has identified the man in the photo as Cruz Sr. He was in NOLA at the time. He opposed Castro and may well have joined ex-pat organizations.
If he was a DRE member it’s not unreasonable to ask if it was him in the pic.
ropelight (5c7740) — 5/3/2016 @ 12:40 pmIf the guy in the picture is Cruz Sr. what’s the big deal? Why make fools of yourselves attempting to deny an honest inquiry. What are you so damned afraid of?
ropelight (5c7740) — 5/3/2016 @ 12:43 pmropelight is asking a loaded question
http://www.fallacyfiles.org/loadques.html
It’s funny how much that second example resembles things ropelight says.
Gerald A (945582) — 5/3/2016 @ 12:43 pmWhat do you mean they identified him as Cruz Sr? He could only be identified by someone who was there at the time and knew him.
Gerald A (945582) — 5/3/2016 @ 12:47 pmCut the crap Gerald. What illegitimate presumption is built into the question? Or are you just trying to muddy the waters?
ropelight (5c7740) — 5/3/2016 @ 12:49 pmRead the National Enquirer article. Among other techniques, I believe they asked photo interpreters to look at known pics of Cruz Sr as a young man and compare them to the man beside LHO.
ropelight (5c7740) — 5/3/2016 @ 12:53 pmAnd this is the guy complaining that we drove him away from the Cruz camp. We didn’t drive him far enough way, the f***ing lying Trumpkin shill cuckoo.
nk (dbc370) — 5/3/2016 @ 12:55 pmThat’s just more BS, nk, I never said I was driven away from the Cruz camp. I said assholes like you and your fellow hate mongers were driving voters away from Trump. And you’re still doing it.
ropelight (5c7740) — 5/3/2016 @ 12:58 pm…driving voters away from Cruz…
ropelight (5c7740) — 5/3/2016 @ 12:59 pmThere is still a lot of time to get another major challenger on may state ballots. Most do not close until August.
In California, the easiest way to do it is to register a new party — It takes about 45,000 valid voter registration forms. The deadline in July 7. You can also, somewhat easier, requalify a party under the threshold. Such as the Reform Party which only has 17,000 members in CA.
Different states have different rules, and all are weird. While you only need 45K voter cards to start a new party in CA, if you try to get on the ballot by petition you need 750,000 signatures.
While it is probably too late to get on all 50 state ballots, and the only third parties that might do so (LP and Green) are unlikely to nominate someone of value, if you can get on enough and win some states, you can throw the election into the House where an GOPe candidate would have the edge.
Kevin M (25bbee) — 5/3/2016 @ 1:03 pmSure, Kevin, and while you’re at it put a bell on the cat.
ropelight (5c7740) — 5/3/2016 @ 1:05 pmThat’s just more BS, nk, I never said I was driven away from the Cruz camp. I said assholes like you and your fellow hate mongers were driving voters away from Trump. And you’re still doing it.
Because Nation Enquirer articles planted to “link” Cruz to Lee Harvey Oswald are pure fair play?
Kevin M (25bbee) — 5/3/2016 @ 1:05 pmRopelight and the NE cracked this vast conspiracy. Brava!
JD (52076d) — 5/3/2016 @ 1:11 pmKevin, it’s an easy question to answer: is the young Cuban standing beside LHO Cruz Sr. or not. Inquiring minds want to know.
ropelight (5c7740) — 5/3/2016 @ 1:11 pm@158 Yes, easy question to answer!
School Marm (f96753) — 5/3/2016 @ 1:16 pm#156, Kevin, I see your point but Ted Cruz isn’t responsible for something his father may or may not have been involved in prior to his Ted’s birth. No one reasonably hold his father’s youthful politics against today’s candidate.
ropelight (5c7740) — 5/3/2016 @ 1:17 pmOh look, ropelight has company in its idiocy. I’ll answer your silly stupid idiotic question, no, it is not. And you have no evidence that it is, except wild unsubstantiated insinuations and asshattery.
JD (2e3880) — 5/3/2016 @ 1:18 pmKevin – ropelight agrees this isn’t fair play, he is just interested in getting to the truth by asking the hard questions.
JD (2e3880) — 5/3/2016 @ 1:19 pmRopelight, the head in the ass is yours. You are a clown.
SPQR (a023f8) — 5/3/2016 @ 1:21 pmRopelight – what ever happened to your unsubstantiated made up rumors that Cruz was pulling out of IN in advance of the primary? I seems to recall that was a point you repeatedly made against Cruz when relying on published info from CNN, yet at the same time, have no problem doing so yourself. Hypocrisy much?
JD (2e3880) — 5/3/2016 @ 1:24 pmJD, to which wild unsubstantiated insinuations and asshattery do you refer? Mine, of course, not yours.
ropelight (5c7740) — 5/3/2016 @ 1:26 pmAll of yours, ropelight. Start at the top of any thread, and read your comments. Start with this one.
JD (2e3880) — 5/3/2016 @ 1:27 pmKevin, if fact-checking of varying veracity are to be relied upon – Ted’s dad is a commie, but Trumps dad is KKK after all. If it knocks both out, I’ll take it.
urbanleftbehind (5eecdb) — 5/3/2016 @ 1:30 pm#164, JD, I did read a quote from Cruz’s campaign manager to the effect that the campaign was pulling out of Indiana to focus on California. I commented on it here. Then nothing of the sort materialized, weather the initial info was wrong or the backlash was too severe to overcome and the campaign did an about-face, I don’t know. In any case it only reinforces the old adage not to put too much confidence into early reports. I’ll take the hit for that one. It’s on me.
ropelight (5c7740) — 5/3/2016 @ 1:32 pmMr Shearer wrote:
I did that, and look how y’all treated me!
John Boehner (1b79fa) — 5/3/2016 @ 1:36 pmStop it, Dana.
JD (52076d) — 5/3/2016 @ 1:45 pmThe kind of conservatism Ted Cruz championed is still the most powerful political force in American politics. Unfortunately, Ted Cruz is not the champion able to win the electorate to his side. He’s a flawed candidate, he’s not a natural born American citizen and he’s an imperfect vessel for carrying the conservative message to a general election.
He talks the talk but he doesn’t walk the walk, not during the campaign anyway. His opportunistic tactics doomed him. He wasn’t the man he pretended to be, and voters saw behind the mask. Delegate grubbing, back room deals, and cheap shots undermined his general appeal.
His supporters sealed the deal, they’ve been so over the top nasty, unprincipled, and mean-spirited as to drive away decent voters who don’t want to be associated with hate mongers. Cruz himself and his supporters are responsible for his loss. No one else.
ropelight (5c7740) — 5/3/2016 @ 1:55 pmCruz’s campaign focused on principles and character, but most of the electorate could care less about those things. Andrew Breitbart was right that politics is downstream from culture, but culture isn’t just about what movies we watch and how sexual we are.
Principles and character come from traditional values, and those values most commonly come from religion. You can have values without religion but it’s not easy, and it’s even easier not to have values. By nominating Trump, Republican voters have joined Democrats in rejecting principles, character and values. They want a strongman to fix their troubles for them so they can take the easy way out of hard situations.
I don’t think it will work out the way they hope no matter who wins the general election because there are no easy ways out of these problems, especially for the average Joe who is attracted to Trump’s tough talk. Most white collar workers will have to tighten their belts, take lower-paying or second jobs, forego luxuries, and spend/lose their retirement money. But the average Trump followers will be hurt the most because Hillary and Trump are crony capitalists. Neither Trump nor Hillary cares about those Americans — except during elections.
DRJ (15874d) — 5/3/2016 @ 2:01 pmAmen, DRJ
Ropelight – that last missive of histrionics and nonsense reminds me of that story about splinters and motes.
JD (52076d) — 5/3/2016 @ 2:05 pmI still figure it was the greys, or the vampire colony in seth grahame smith’s tales,
narciso (732bc0) — 5/3/2016 @ 2:08 pmropelight,
The corollary to your Cruz point is that Trump and his followers are responsible for his win and for everything that follows it. This is on you now.
Cruz and his supporters fought hard, not dirty, and we did all we could to win. Now it’s time for Trump and his supporters to step up, stop whining and be the strong men you claim to be. Can you do it? I don’t think so. At heart, you are men who always have a ready excuse for every failure. Like the Democrats you are emulating, you are always victims and victims don’t win.
DRJ (15874d) — 5/3/2016 @ 2:08 pmthe sarcasm doesn’t ring true, because that statement, would make billy madison, wince,
narciso (732bc0) — 5/3/2016 @ 2:13 pmDRJ, so your comment at #175 is an example of fighting on the up-and-up? The put-downs don’t support your contentions. You’re just an angry loser lashing out. That’s exactly the ugly behavior that drove voters away from Ted Cruz. Congratulations on helping to hand the nomination to Donald Trump.
ropelight (5c7740) — 5/3/2016 @ 2:33 pmCruz campaign should never have gotten upset when Schlafly and Palin didn’t support him. I can tell you that showed no class at all.
This criticizing people who they felt should have supported him but didn’t (and who never said a bad word about Cruz until they were attacked by the Cruz campaign), was probably his biggest downfall & showed huge character weakness. We expected it from Trump (who only got mad with those who came after him) but not Cruz. I was a supporter of Cruz during the shutdown and everything but his actions in this campaign really turned me off. My vote for Cruz would be so we don’t get Hillary.
Cruz goes from a Trump bromance to despising Trump. I have never been so turned off by a candidate in my life even though I would still vote for Cruz if he had gotten the nomination. But it is so typical for Cruz supporters that they would not vote for Trump if he gets the nomination, because their guy didn’t win. I can tell you that turned off a lot of people too and that made them vote for Trump or not at all.
well reap what you sow. reap the wild wind & don’t let the door hit you on the way out.
John (23cb03) — 5/3/2016 @ 2:40 pmDRJ – nothing can pierce their coccoon. It is hysteria, projection, and ignoring history all the way down. It is a giant temper tantrum by a plurality but minority that will foist this jackhole on the American public.
JD (52076d) — 5/3/2016 @ 2:40 pm“John” – my lack of support for Trump was never conditioned on my preferred candidates success. Your “concern”‘ simply oozes sincerity.
JD (52076d) — 5/3/2016 @ 2:43 pm“JD” I have no clue who you are and don’t care. in fact I don’t think I addressed my post to you at all.
cheers my sporty one. better “luck” “next time”
John (23cb03) — 5/3/2016 @ 2:45 pm#178 John,
Dude….Cruz supporters who say they won’t vote for Trump in November aren’t doing so because their guy didn’t win. WTF are you talking about?
Cruz Supporter (102c9a) — 5/3/2016 @ 2:49 pmRather, they’re not going to vote for Trump in November because they believe Trump is a lifelong Democrat who is unreliable, dishonest, unhinged, and unprepared to be President.
It’s about ideology—not sour grapes.
#178 Cruz Supporter
again you so prove my point perfectly.
see ya. now you don’t even have to worry about a thing. you will get what you want.
cowards.
John (23cb03) — 5/3/2016 @ 2:50 pmIt’s not about ideology. It’s about principles, or lack there of. Run along, “John”
JD (52076d) — 5/3/2016 @ 2:51 pmWhen they claim it’s about principles, it’s really about sour grapes.
ropelight (5c7740) — 5/3/2016 @ 2:52 pm“JD”
…and Cruz showed he had no principles. He came off just like a Bush or Rubio or a Boehner.
Cruz came off as if he was entitled to the nomination. Everyone has seen through him.
Run along “JD”
John (23cb03) — 5/3/2016 @ 2:54 pm#185 ropelight
so true. so true. best post I have heard in awhile.
John (23cb03) — 5/3/2016 @ 2:55 pmName the principles that Trump holds that match conservatism. Go. And after you do that, show us at what point in time those principles changed so dramatically from his previously held, diametrically opposed positions, and what caused that sea change. Go.
JD (52076d) — 5/3/2016 @ 2:57 pm“John-John,”
You’re supporting a foul, vulgar, charlatan who is being sued for fraud, and who has contributed money to the campaigns of Hillary, Harry Reid, Nancy Pelosi, and Chuckie Schumer during the past decade.
Effing billionaire The Mr Donald won’t give money to the blind children’s fund, but he’ll give money to Nancy Pelosi.
That’s beautiful!
(LOL)
And it’s suckers like you who buy into the Huey Long School of Populism.
Cruz Supporter (102c9a) — 5/3/2016 @ 3:00 pmSad!
By fighting for delegates he came off as entitled to the nomination, but your guy threatened to sue everyone in sight every time he lost.
JD (52076d) — 5/3/2016 @ 3:01 pm“JD”
what is the definition of “conservatism”?
show me where Cruz sponsored a bill that became law, that is specific to “conservatism” and the hot button issues of the campaign ie the border, jobs, military….
what has Cruz done for:
1) Americans’ job secure or increased job opportunities
2) increase border security & prevent illegal immigration (or a law he sponsored to deal with illegal immigrants on US soil)
3) get rid of or lessen debt
4) fund America’s military
5) improve veterans services
6) repeal obamacare
Go fetch.
John (23cb03) — 5/3/2016 @ 3:07 pmJD, at #184 you claimed it was about principles:
Now, you want someone else to name the principles you first raised:
When you recover from your confusion perhaps you’ll answer your own question.
ropelight (5c7740) — 5/3/2016 @ 3:10 pm“John” – you first. You won’t, because Trump does not have any underlying principles, at least not any that don’t conflict with his positions that he held before he wanted to run as a Republican. Trump could still earn my support. He could explain how his support of leftist policies; principles, and politicians changed. What caused him to change in such a dramatic manner and what caused these changes, and what principles guide his positions. When this is explained, I’ll be happy to revisit my views of him. Until then, I’ll continue to view him the way I do you.
JD (52076d) — 5/3/2016 @ 3:19 pmForget it JD, Trump doesn’t need your vote. Go cry in the dark.
ropelight (5c7740) — 5/3/2016 @ 3:21 pmI’ll cry for our once great Country, ropelight.
JD (52076d) — 5/3/2016 @ 3:25 pmIf Trump makes America Great Again you won’t have any reason to cry, except that he did it in spite of guys like you.
ropelight (5c7740) — 5/3/2016 @ 3:28 pmPatterico:
What can save the Republican Party from Trump is John Kasich winning the New Jersey primary without the distraction of Ted Cruz.
Everybody says that trump will sirely win the New Jersey primary. I don’t think it is inevitable. While New Jersey like all the east coast states that voted on April 19 and April 26, is also a closed primary state, in New Jersey unaffiliated voters can change their registration to a party registration even at the polls, according to this site:
http://voteforbernie.org/
Trump won the east coast states only because they were closed primary states with a small Republican registration. The Republican Party also isn’t so small in New Jersey. And maybe you can count on some hostility to Chris Christie.
But Ted Cruz has TO STAY OUT OF THIS AND LEAVE THE FIELD TO KASICH.
Actually, it may not be so simple to change from unaffiliated to Republican (the last day to change from Democrat to Republican in time for the primary was April 13) but apparently this can be done even on Election Day. This bears further investigation.
But opposition to Donald Trump would have to be intense and well organized.
If Kasich wins New Jersey and its 51 delegates, then it might not be so hard for Trump to be kept below 1237. He would just have to kept from winning too many California Congressional Districts.
Sammy Finkelman (643dcd) — 5/3/2016 @ 3:31 pmSammy is right. It really doesn’t matter any more how Trump is stopped. And if Kasich will not bow out then Cruz has to swallow his ego and withdraw from ALL the remaining primaries (but NOT from the race) and ask all his supporters to vote for Kasich.
Trump or not-Trump, that is the question.
Kevin M (25bbee) — 5/3/2016 @ 3:46 pmI’m not angry, ropelight. Your candidate won and congratulations. My point is that it’s up to Trump and his followers to organize to win, including mending fences if you are willing. It’s clear you aren’t.
DRJ (15874d) — 5/3/2016 @ 3:51 pm> The day that Trump is nominated, I will change my registration to No Preference.
I will change mine back to no preference the day after the election.
aphrael (e0cdc9) — 5/3/2016 @ 3:53 pmWas that comment for me, narciso 176, because I wasn’t being sarcastic.
Cruz wasn’t willing to be more like Trump in an election where that’s what he needed to do. In that sense, Cruz was responsible for his loss. Instead, he stayed true to his principles and who he is, even though it meant he lost. It is not Cruz’s or my job to come to Trump’s rescue or to the GOP’s.
DRJ (15874d) — 5/3/2016 @ 3:54 pmI think Hillary is the new NotTrump, Kevin.
DRJ (15874d) — 5/3/2016 @ 3:55 pm> the California Republican Party has been a broken, inept shell for two decades now, as the repeated re-election of the profoundly incompetent Barbara Boxer to the Senate has demonstrated most eloquently.
She’s retiring, and there are more than thirty candidates running to replace her. It seems *likely* that the top two will both be Democrats – Loretta Sanchez and Kamala Harris.
aphrael (e0cdc9) — 5/3/2016 @ 3:55 pmNo, Cruz does not need to bow out from those states where he is stronger than Kasich – mainly pro-gun western states. That’s the only place he’s strong.
But he should stay in Montana and South Dakota and California CDs with high gun ownership rates. Oregon and Washington and New Mexico are more or less proportional.
I tell you, I don’t even know if Cruz will win Nebraska and West Virginia. In West viorginia sources contradict themsleves, but one says 3 are decdied statewide, 3×3=9 by CD and 22 are at large, by name. Now people can vote for up to 22, but if they vote for 23 their ballot is invalid, and they cannot vote for more than 2 delegates from the same county.
In West Virginia undeclared people can vote in both primaries and it is looking more like they are more interested in stopping Hillary even though Bernie is more against coal than she is. Not more against guns, though.
Nebraska is closed and the Democrats had a caucus on March 5. It is heavily Republican though. Senator Ben Sasse is very much against Trump.
https://www.facebook.com/sassefornebraska/posts/561073597391141
So its maybe fair to assign Nebraska’s 36 delegates to Cruz (it;s winner take all statewide)
There is a chance of defeating trump in New Jersey I think. The over 50% totals he’s gotten have only bene because it looks like a 2-man race. Kasich was stronger than Cruz
But Cruz has got to stay out of winner take all New Jersey.
Sammy Finkelman (643dcd) — 5/3/2016 @ 3:59 pmSuppose, instead of making America great, Trump makes America a hellhole? There are no guarantees. The US has achieved what it has from over a century of mostly enlightened leadership. Mr Trump seems to wing it.
Trump is ignorant of history, civics, economics, law, tradition and taste. He shows no intention to learn, nor does he listen well.
When he causally talks about starting a trade war with China, or even Mexico, people who DO understand all these things worry that he will dig us all a hole he cannot get out of. Trade wars often lead to real wars, and a real war with China would be devastating.
When he causally talks about getting rid of the debt — this from a man who has taken his holdings through bankruptcy four times — people start thinking he’s repudiate the Debt. Which would cause a real war real fast, considering that the world financial system is predicated on the US Debt.
When he casually talks about deporting 15 million people, people who live in the southwest start wondering about collateral damage. Suppose those 15 million people don’t want to go? They probably have a LOT of guns. Molon labe. Could get messy and 40 million citizens of all races live nearby.
There are lots of ways things can go pear-shaped when you have an ignorant bully throwing his weight around. And never assume that his gaze won’t eventually turn to you.
Kevin M (25bbee) — 5/3/2016 @ 4:01 pmFOX NEWS calls Indiana for Trump.
ropelight (5c7740) — 5/3/2016 @ 4:01 pm198.Sammy is right. It really doesn’t matter any more how Trump is stopped. And if Kasich will not bow out then Cruz has to swallow his ego and withdraw from ALL the remaining primaries (but NOT from the race) and ask all his supporters to vote for Kasich.
Apparently the voters don’t like that sort of maneuver. It certainly didn’t work in Indiana. The polls are now closed and the networks are calling it for Trump.
James B. Shearer (1f62d7) — 5/3/2016 @ 4:05 pmI think Hillary is the new NotTrump, Kevin.
I won’t vote for Hillary, either. I want another choice. As it stands, I will be voting for Gary Johnson.
Kevin M (25bbee) — 5/3/2016 @ 4:07 pmSo, the tsunami of lemmings have won Indiana?
Congrats.
Steve57 (412496) — 5/3/2016 @ 4:10 pmThe illegitimate presumption is, first of all, that whatever Cruz’s father may have done has some relevance to Ted Cruz’s campaign. There also seems to be an implication that if Cruz’s father was connected to DRE that it was in some way nefarious – though that’s not stated explicitly -otherwise I don’t know why anyone would want him to answer that question. Classic loaded question.
Gerald A (7c7ffb) — 5/3/2016 @ 4:12 pmI would have voted for any Republican. Sadly the GOP decided to nominate a sociopathic Democrat.
Kevin M (25bbee) — 5/3/2016 @ 4:12 pmKevinM: I might consider joining you in voting for Gov. Johnson. I liked him a lot in 2012 (or was it 2008?), and I continue to have issues with electing the spouse of a former Presiddent.
It really depends on whether or not Mr. Trump seems to have a chance at carrying California – I feel required to use my vote to prevent that from happening.
aphrael (e0cdc9) — 5/3/2016 @ 4:14 pmJames B. Shearer (1f62d7) — 5/3/2016 @ 4:05 pm
In Indiana the manuever wasn’t honest, and Cruz previously had taken all votes cast for him as votes really for him. That’s what he did after Wisconsin. It has to openly be based on polls, and on whether or not second place (and even third place) matters.
Sammy Finkelman (643dcd) — 5/3/2016 @ 4:15 pmwell that’s a quixotic exercise, just for clarification though, this was tossed around awhile back,
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-fix/wp/2016/02/28/in-1927-donald-trumps-father-was-arrested-after-a-klan-riot-in-queens/?postshare=3671456694906686&tid=ss_tw-bottom
narciso (732bc0) — 5/3/2016 @ 4:18 pmFair is fair. Lot’s of peeps get arrested after Klan riots, some of whom despise the Klan.
Steve57 (412496) — 5/3/2016 @ 4:28 pmThe light at the end of his rope wrote:
And how would that explain all of those people, including me, who said that they would ever vote for Mr Trump a long, long time before the first caucuses in Iowa?
The Dana who remembers recent history (1b79fa) — 5/3/2016 @ 4:37 pmJD wrote:
And if he explained all of that, would you actually believe him? Why, for example, did he go from being not just pro-abortion, but pro-partial birth abortion, to pro-life — though one who wants to change the GOP platform! — other than a desire to run for the Republican nomination?
The suspicious Dana (1b79fa) — 5/3/2016 @ 4:42 pmSay how about that Bernie Sanders? Leading by 2K over the hildabeast.
Too close to call but gawdang. He’s got legs. Pulling away.
papertiger (c2d6da) — 5/3/2016 @ 4:48 pmRopelight – most of the people I see saying they’ll never vote for Mr. Trump opposed Gov. Romney in the primary and voted for him in the election, and many of them opposed Sen. McCain in the primary and voted for him in the general election.
So it’s hard for me to credit the notion that they’re rejecting Mr. Trump just because Mr. Trump has defeated their preferred candidate. Something else is going on – something which strikes me as being more about Mr. Trump than it is about the people in question.
aphrael (e0cdc9) — 5/3/2016 @ 4:55 pmclearly that was not the implication, the daily news intended,
narciso (732bc0) — 5/3/2016 @ 4:55 pmDana who plays devils advocate – sure, if there was some underlying incident that led to a change in philosophy, something that caused him to review his prior principles. Granted, i don’t believe that there is anything, other than his desire to run as a Relublican, but were there a tipping point that caused such fundamental transformations, I would be willing to consider it.
JD (52076d) — 5/3/2016 @ 5:06 pmaphrael – that is too much for their id minds to comprehend.
JD (52076d) — 5/3/2016 @ 5:07 pmRopelight – most of the people I see saying they’ll never vote for Mr. Trump opposed Gov. Romney in the primary and voted for him in the election, and many of them opposed Sen. McCain in the primary and voted for him in the general election.
This is a different order of things. In previous years it was a preference. We liked X more than we liked Y. Trump is simply beyond the pale. It’s like George Wallace winning the Democrat contest in ’72. “Luckily” for them, he got shot.
Kevin M (25bbee) — 5/3/2016 @ 5:11 pmIt’s also true that many Trumpers would not vote for any Republican nominee besides Trump. My guess is they outnumber those who preferred another candidate and will not vote for Trump.
Gerald A (7c7ffb) — 5/3/2016 @ 6:06 pmWrong again Gerald, your projection of the NeverTrump heresy onto Trump supporters is just an attempt to claim the other guys are just a wrongheaded as your lot.
I’ve said all along that I support Trump but that I’ll vote for the GOP nominee. If memory serves, you’re warming up to a similar position.
ropelight (ae1ce7) — 5/4/2016 @ 7:53 am