[guest post by Dana]
Here we go again. Top-tier debate tonight on Fox Business Network.
If you don’t have cable, the NYT has provided a list of other options available.
What to look for? Other than Trump-Cruz, heck if I know. I imagine hope this evening will be the last hurrah for a number of contenders. You know who they are. And then we can really start to get down to it.
–Dana
Pronounced "Patter-EE-koh"
E-mail: Just use my moniker Patterico, followed by the @ symbol, followed by gmail.com
Disclaimer: Simpsons avatar may resemble a younger Patterico...
The statements made on this web site reflect the personal opinions of the author. They are not made in any official capacity, and do not represent the opinions of the author's employer.
| M | T | W | T | F | S | S |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| 1 | 2 | 3 | ||||
| 4 | 5 | 6 | 7 | 8 | 9 | 10 |
| 11 | 12 | 13 | 14 | 15 | 16 | 17 |
| 18 | 19 | 20 | 21 | 22 | 23 | 24 |
| 25 | 26 | 27 | 28 | 29 | 30 | 31 |
Powered by WordPress.
Let the games begin.
Dana (86e864) — 1/14/2016 @ 4:46 pmlink
mg (31009b) — 1/14/2016 @ 4:56 pmlet’s play heidi the sausage was it just a filing error
no it was illegal it was against the law it was pure lawlessness like what we have with food stamp
what’s up with these one term senators
so embarrassing
happyfeet (831175) — 1/14/2016 @ 4:57 pmI kind of feel like Hillary’s going to win regardless of who the nominee is. So these debates are full of sound and fury signifying nothing.
Gerald A (949d7d) — 1/14/2016 @ 5:05 pmThe first one of the candidates that makes mention or any kind of deal about Cruz and his loan that the NYT and the usual suspects are trying to make a big deal out of gets a big black mark. And so do any others that mention it. Cruz reported it in one filing and not in another, which he’ll lake care of and amend… Now that bothers these liberals. But the Clinton’s influence peddling and lawbreaking while raking in tens of millions of dollars doesn’t even rate a mention.
Horsesh*t.
Colonel Haiku (2601c0) — 1/14/2016 @ 5:05 pmQuite a link there, mg. I followed it to the right and it pointed me right to the kitchen!
Colonel Haiku (2601c0) — 1/14/2016 @ 5:06 pmAmen coronello.
narciso (732bc0) — 1/14/2016 @ 5:09 pmlie down wif a goldy sacky dawg
you are get fleas!
happyfeet (831175) — 1/14/2016 @ 5:15 pm2001 Big Space Baby
pdbuttons (8668a1) — 1/14/2016 @ 5:21 pmmr. buttons!!!! how are you is good to see you
happyfeet (831175) — 1/14/2016 @ 5:23 pmwe’re having an election!
there’s all these different candidates and they all have different names
happyfeet (831175) — 1/14/2016 @ 5:24 pmCruz’ll get hit over no-nothing stories, but it gives him a chance to shine and crush those distractions. I’ve criticized him as a squish for his witless strategy to suck up to Trump supporters by going along to get along, but this week may have finally put the fire in his belly. He can out-debate anyone on the stage if he wants to.
Rubio’ll get hit for all sorts of reasons (most likely Christie, who wants that establishment lane), but like Cruz, he could get a breakout moment. Frankly, I’m waiting for him (or someone else) to hit Christie on glad-handing Obama in 2012. Listening to Christie try to present himself as a born again conservative while trashing others is annoying, so I’d very much like someone to deliver a verbal smackdown.
Trump will say very little because, oh yeah, he doesn’t have the substance to back up his policies or details. (He’d get hammered by someone like Cruz face-to-face; that’s why he hides in his safe spaces.) Trump’s a buffoon, but he’s smart enough to realize he’s out of his weight-class when it comes to his principal opponents; that’s why he picks on Jeb instead.
Kasich will continue to be the race’s equivalent of an old man yelling at you to get off his lawn.
Jeb will jump up and down, shouting, “I’m still here!”, but no one will notice.
Carson will have dignity, but nothing else to suggest that he should be the nominee.
tops116 (d094f8) — 1/14/2016 @ 5:29 pmCould’ve been worse. Could’ve been like those Occupiers and gotten ringworm.
tops116 (d094f8) — 1/14/2016 @ 5:30 pmAn election happens every four years. Fortunately, a doctor’s prescription is not necessary to facillitate one!
Cruz Supporter (102c9a) — 1/14/2016 @ 5:32 pmYes, yes, yes, Goldman Sachs is immoral capitalist oppressor. Come the Revolution, it will be run by special komissariat and all dividends will be distributed to workers and not blood-sucking bourgeois shareholders.
nk (dbc370) — 1/14/2016 @ 5:34 pmThe world is on fire, and we’re talking campaign contribution reform.
Cruz Supporter (102c9a) — 1/14/2016 @ 5:42 pmIt should be pointed out that most carriers are unbundling FBN for the evening, since it us often on a extra-price tier.
Kevin M (25bbee) — 1/14/2016 @ 5:43 pmShould we have a pool on how long it takes Jar Jar Kasich to rant about how the rest of the field are Republicans?
Kevin M (25bbee) — 1/14/2016 @ 5:45 pmMr. Trump will know what to do
he’s sassy!
happyfeet (831175) — 1/14/2016 @ 5:46 pmI can just see this Cruz vs Hillary and the DoJ comes down on Cruz for a technical violation while doing nothing about Ms CoinOp.
Kevin M (25bbee) — 1/14/2016 @ 5:47 pmthe worlds fires
mg (31009b) — 1/14/2016 @ 5:57 pmpee on it
rubio reminds me of alfalfa
mg (31009b) — 1/14/2016 @ 6:04 pmIt would be awesome if Rand Paul were on the debate stage. And it would be double-awesome if RON Paul were there, too. They could each explain how a muscular American foreign policy only makes us weaker. And then they could explain how we can totally count on the Seychelles Islands Navy to thwart China, Iran, and North Korea.
Cruz Supporter (102c9a) — 1/14/2016 @ 6:05 pmep 1 of that mtv shannara thing you can watch for free on the amazon
happyfeet (831175) — 1/14/2016 @ 6:06 pmGood on Cruz re sailors and Iran. Someone needed to say it.
Dana (86e864) — 1/14/2016 @ 6:08 pmKeep going after the democrats, boys.
mg (31009b) — 1/14/2016 @ 6:25 pmFiorina should be on stage instead of boosh,kasich and heres johnny.
No Snow White. No want see seven dwarfs.
nk (dbc370) — 1/14/2016 @ 6:32 pmCruz is rockin’ and a-rollin’… Yes!!!
Colonel Haiku (2601c0) — 1/14/2016 @ 6:42 pmTrump is an asshole but he is entertaining.
Colonel Haiku (2601c0) — 1/14/2016 @ 6:44 pmThis back and forth on Cruz’s citizenship is a riot.
Colonel Haiku (2601c0) — 1/14/2016 @ 6:45 pmBut go after Democrats!
Colonel Haiku (2601c0) — 1/14/2016 @ 6:46 pmI hope that was jeb’s retirement speech.
mg (31009b) — 1/14/2016 @ 6:46 pm“Speaking of drunks, Hillary Clinton’s campaign continues, like her liver, to weaken and deteriorate.”
Colonel Haiku (2601c0) — 1/14/2016 @ 6:48 pm– Ace of Spades
kasich must have been a judo man in a previous life. hiya
mg (31009b) — 1/14/2016 @ 6:49 pmDon’t fall for being turned against the other – Neil Cavuto, you’re better than that – and talk about the issues, challenges and opportunities!
Colonel Haiku (2601c0) — 1/14/2016 @ 6:51 pmC’mon, Christie… go after the common enemy. Do it like yer going for the last jelly donut.
Colonel Haiku (2601c0) — 1/14/2016 @ 6:53 pmTime for the boys to ignore the questions and give the democrats some diarrhea.
mg (31009b) — 1/14/2016 @ 6:53 pmBartiromo is a Hillary Clinton donor. She shoul’ve recused herself.
Colonel Haiku (2601c0) — 1/14/2016 @ 6:57 pmSo how did that stuff about Cruz’s citizenship come off, do you guys think?
Patterico (86c8ed) — 1/14/2016 @ 6:59 pmI did not think Donald Trump won that exchange, but I am admittedly biased.
Patterico (86c8ed) — 1/14/2016 @ 7:00 pm“You’re from New York so you might not.” Great line.
Patterico (86c8ed) — 1/14/2016 @ 7:02 pmNOT A LOT OF CONSERVATIVES COME OUT OF MANHATTAN. I’M JUST SAYIN’.
HAHAHAHAHAHAHA
Patterico (86c8ed) — 1/14/2016 @ 7:04 pmI don’t like it when Cruz compares his situation to McCain’s. Not really a valid comparison. The comparison to George Romney is more valid however. I don’t have a problem with Cruz though, just that I think this is a valid issue. My concern is to through my support behind Cruz and somehow the courts determine he isn’t eligible. You sir, are the legal expert and I do “always trust content from Patterico” so anyway, I think they are all excellent candidates… except for Trump.
G (6a553a) — 1/14/2016 @ 7:06 pmI do think Trump probably won that New York values exchange though. It’s not generally good for a presidential candidate to write off a large group of people.
Patterico (86c8ed) — 1/14/2016 @ 7:06 pmThe citizenship was hilarious. I say Ted is 100% American. But I have no clue.
mg (31009b) — 1/14/2016 @ 7:10 pmI thought Cruz won the birther exchange. He had a response for every point Trump brought up and stayed pleasant and funny during the exchange.
Dejectedhead (2bc11a) — 1/14/2016 @ 7:10 pmCruz won the birther thing… Hands down. And did it with humor.
Colonel Haiku (2601c0) — 1/14/2016 @ 7:17 pmWait until people find out that Barry Goldwater was born in a United States territory, rather than a United State.
Cruz Supporter (102c9a) — 1/14/2016 @ 7:20 pmI don’t think there are many Americans who actually like folks from NYC or what they represent. I didn’t feel that way 10 years ago, but I sure do now. Arrogant, self-absorbed, leftwing pricks and prickettes for the most part.
Colonel Haiku (2601c0) — 1/14/2016 @ 7:20 pmColonel, the men and women who rushed into the Twin Towers to rescue those trapped inside those infernos deserve to be singled out as brave Americans. They deserve it.
ropelight (b71ffb) — 1/14/2016 @ 7:23 pmTrump winning himself some NY voters.
Dana (86e864) — 1/14/2016 @ 7:25 pmOh shut up, John Kasich.
Dana (86e864) — 1/14/2016 @ 7:25 pmTrump is a German guy from Queens, not some Manhattan fancy Bloomberg type. Might be very wealthy and live on 5th Avenue these days, but he still is more outer boro than society swell.
Bugg (fa64ec) — 1/14/2016 @ 7:26 pmYes, that’s why I put a timestamp on it, ropelight. I hold them in the highest esteem. But I have no regard for most of the rest of NYC peeps…. have the same feelings for them as they seem to have for folks in the other 49 states
Colonel Haiku (2601c0) — 1/14/2016 @ 7:31 pmboosh hurts my ears.
mg (31009b) — 1/14/2016 @ 7:33 pmSHUT-UP
Trade deficits are good things. I have a trade deficit with Costco.
Donald Trump is a pandering idiot.
Patterico (86c8ed) — 1/14/2016 @ 7:35 pmShut up Kasich.
Patterico (86c8ed) — 1/14/2016 @ 7:35 pmThe buyer pays the tariff. — Rubio
Tell that to your sugar pals, Marco.
Patterico (86c8ed) — 1/14/2016 @ 7:36 pmColonel, I know you have your priorities right. And, I almost always agree with your points. Please don’t assume I was taking a cheap shot. I just want to point out that not all New Yorkers are leftist idiots.
ropelight (b71ffb) — 1/14/2016 @ 7:39 pmAbolish the IRS. Music to my ears.
mg (31009b) — 1/14/2016 @ 7:44 pmTed Cruz doing fine tonight.
When you have a trade deficit, your country’s consumers are buying all kinds of things that make their lives better.
Patterico (86c8ed) — 1/14/2016 @ 7:45 pmIs it my bias or does jeb look frail and the most afraid man on stage?
mg (31009b) — 1/14/2016 @ 7:48 pmYou can put a fork in Jeb, Kasich, and Ben Carson, and the Jersey Pumpkin is teetering on the edge. The real candidates are Trump, Cruz and Rubio. At best, the others are also rans.
ropelight (b71ffb) — 1/14/2016 @ 7:53 pmDid anyone understand what Trump proposes to do on China trade? Something about Carl Icahn. Otherwise I have no idea.
Gerald A (949d7d) — 1/14/2016 @ 7:55 pmBTW isn’t Icahn a really BIG Wall Street big shot?
Gerald A (949d7d) — 1/14/2016 @ 7:56 pmGerald, pull my finger.
ropelight (b71ffb) — 1/14/2016 @ 7:58 pmHahahaha I hadn’t even seen this when I told him the same thing.
Patterico (86c8ed) — 1/14/2016 @ 8:00 pmShut up again, Kasich.
Patterico (86c8ed) — 1/14/2016 @ 8:05 pmOh, Kasich, really?? “The country needs heal.”??? Ack!
Dana (86e864) — 1/14/2016 @ 8:08 pmOkay, Marco, convince me you’re not for illegal immigration. Go ahead.
Dana (86e864) — 1/14/2016 @ 8:08 pmCostco is not using that surplus to build up it’s fleet and army, and create artificial islands at key checkpoints.
narciso (732bc0) — 1/14/2016 @ 8:11 pmThis particular presidential debate needs to be over.
Ag80 (eb6ffa) — 1/14/2016 @ 8:15 pmGong boosh
mg (31009b) — 1/14/2016 @ 8:16 pmthanks, chuck b.
Closing statements are boring, so basically it’s over.
Who won?
Patterico (86c8ed) — 1/14/2016 @ 8:16 pmWhen you have a trade deficit, your country’s consumers are buying all kinds of things that make their lives better.
Patterico (86c8ed) — 1/14/2016 @ 7:45 pm
Wonderful point. As you admit you have a trade deficit with Costco, I have a similar trade deficit with Burger King. By that token, we need to keep the international shipping lanes (south China Seas) open, and we need to keep our domestic roads and highways open—beecause I need unencumbered access to my Whoppers!
Cruz Supporter (102c9a) — 1/14/2016 @ 8:16 pmNope, rope light, didn’t take it that way at all. That day will always be with me for many different reasons. The first responders were the best of the best.
Colonel Haiku (2601c0) — 1/14/2016 @ 8:16 pmI like Cruz , but I would take any of these folks over a Democrat, even the weenie Kasich.
Colonel Haiku (2601c0) — 1/14/2016 @ 8:18 pmI don’t think this moved the dial for anyone. Cruz, Rubio, Trump. Clearly Rubio had been saving up a big load of ammo to dump on Cruz when the opportunity presented itself. It was effective. But Cruz seems the more serious candidate. I think Marco’s youthful appearance is working against him. He and Cruz are almost the same age, but Rubios good looks and youth reinforce his shallowness.
Dana (86e864) — 1/14/2016 @ 8:21 pmJohn Kasich, I’m not voting for you, so stop trying to make me.
Dana (86e864) — 1/14/2016 @ 8:22 pmBen Carson: you’re just too nice a guy to play politics.
Dana (86e864) — 1/14/2016 @ 8:24 pmI would say Trump won because he did nothing to alienate his supporters. Carson, Kasich, Jeb! are probably done. I thought Rubio did pretty good. I thought Christie did pretty good. I thought Cruz was very good.
I did dislike Cavuto and Baritomo trying to start fights, but it was more entertaining than I expected. So, Ailes should be happy. I didn’t see anything that will move the polls very much.
Ag80 (eb6ffa) — 1/14/2016 @ 8:26 pmSure enough, the first thing Megyn Kelly goes to after the end of the debate is the NYC/Cruz moment. This moment was the central event of the debate?! I keep telling you Rupert Murdoch and his network, are devoted to killing Cruz. This is twice in a row that Kelly first went after Cruz on her show. She got her lunch handed her the last time on her “facts.” This time, she and Fox News are on “touchy-feely” ground. Memo to Kelly: The cops and firefighters are NOT Manhattanites.
Luntz tweeted that Cruz won his focus group. Let’s see how this is shaped to indicate something different.
Ed from SFV (3400a5) — 1/14/2016 @ 8:35 pmI didn’t see the New York values thing as that big of a deal. Everything that Cruz mentioned, I bet most New Yorkers would emphatically agree with.
Trump did a good job of deflecting it by invoking 9/11, but it’s kind of a little ironic seeing Trump claiming something is “offensive”.
Dejectedhead (2bc11a) — 1/14/2016 @ 8:41 pmTrump is an idiot on trade, but his supporters won’t notice, or care, so he didn’t really do himself harm there. Matter of fact, Trump could call for banning chocolate and his supporters would find reasons to agree.
Rubio and Cruz both had good nights. And wounds they got came from each other.
Christie played his hand pretty well, but it’s a weak hand.
Bush dialed it up to tepid, but kept stumbling all over his planned lines. Another ho-hum debate for Bush.
Carson got lost in Fast Forward on my DVR. Kasich got both Mute and Fast Forward (cannot be too careful).
Kevin M (25bbee) — 1/14/2016 @ 8:43 pmThe NY values thing is a case of “fish don’t know they’re wet.”
Kevin M (25bbee) — 1/14/2016 @ 8:45 pmBush dialed it up to tepid
Heh.
Dana (86e864) — 1/14/2016 @ 8:46 pmHow about some side debates:
Kasich-Christie.
Bush-Carson.
(but not in the same place, current would flow.)
Ir maybe just Trump-Cruz-Rubio. We may get there soon.
Kevin M (25bbee) — 1/14/2016 @ 8:47 pmWow. Rubio is a gr8 dissembler. If not on Christie, then Jeb; if not on Jeb, then on Cruz. Sad he only tells half truths.
jb (8a9f1d) — 1/14/2016 @ 9:00 pmI wonder why Cruz, or the others jockeying for the Republican nomination or, for that matter, in the media too, haven’t made more of an issue of Trump’s very ideologically un-tethered past, particularly his cozying up previously to horrific Hillary or sleazy Bill? It’s odd whenever an elephant standing in the corner of the room is ignored or forgotten until the last minute or even indefinitely.
Mark (f713e4) — 1/14/2016 @ 9:11 pmMy favorite line was Christie hoisting Rubio by his own petard by harking back to Rubio’s response to Jeb in a prior debate “Somebody told you that attacking me would help you.”
With the possible exception of Rubio, who got caught dissembling a bit too often, I thought all the main stage candidates did okay (as in, better than prior debates).
The one other observation I have is one I really can’t put my finger on a reason for; I found Kasich grating at times – the least interesting to listen to.
Arizona CJ (da673d) — 1/14/2016 @ 9:13 pmI dunno, part of me says if you’re going to espouse big government policies, might as well be a Democrat so you have to own it.
The Court is the only thing that makes me slightly agree.
Not to worry; it won’t be Kasich.
Patterico (5a5600) — 1/14/2016 @ 9:13 pmSheesh, someone like happyfeet who adds such seriousness and maturity to these threads posts endlessly and voluminously without a care in the world, while others are placed in moderation.
SMH.
Mark (f713e4) — 1/14/2016 @ 9:14 pmYou know what, so did I.
All times.
Patterico (5a5600) — 1/14/2016 @ 9:15 pmThe bottom line is that Cruz retired the birther issue. He also came on as a solid foreign policy guy, which is something the “smart guys” have been whispering about as his Achilles heel. Name me the candidate who came out better than Cruz on international issues tonight? Remarkable given that it is legitimately the area in his professional career which he has devoted the least energy, time, and attention.
From where we started with the first debate where he was genuinely lost among the “others” and placed on the outside of the stage, he won the Luntz group decisively tonight and he is the true conservative front-runner overall. He is against ethanol subsidies and he is going to comfortably win Iowa.
This was a very bad night for everyone else not named Rubio, and it was not so great a night for him as the media and the establishment would have you believe.
Ed from SFV (3400a5) — 1/14/2016 @ 9:19 pmTell me that you understand why you are in moderation and you will avoid such comments, and I’ll take you out.
Respond to this comment by repeating the sort of argument that has landed you in moderation, and I’ll leave you in.
The keys to your jail cell are in your hands.
Patterico (5a5600) — 1/14/2016 @ 9:24 pmPatterico:
I don’t think so, sice the next onew will be in exactly two weeks, and before the Iowa caucuses. Huckabee will probably drop out after Iowa.
Sammy Finkelman (dbec95) — 1/14/2016 @ 9:41 pmThat didn’t seem to be of any help.
The New York Times said it would be on the Fox radio network, but Fox radio network station finder seemed to find very few stations that carry it.
But about halfway into the debate, I discovered that the debate was being broadcast on WOR – 710 AM – which has maybe the strongest radio signal in New York. If you want to know what that station is, Rush Limbaugh is now on that station – he moved over from WABC 770. The Fox radio network will cover it again in two week’s time.
I also saw later that someone wrote that the Fox Business live stream was missing some of the debate, because it stayed on the break for too long.
http://jaltcoh.blogspot.com/2016/01/live-blogging-republican-debate.html
Sammy Finkelman (dbec95) — 1/14/2016 @ 9:49 pmSammy,
Dana wrote the post.
Patterico (5a5600) — 1/14/2016 @ 9:50 pmPatterico:
Not one of the other candidates made that point.
Some made the point that cheaoer goods are better at least in reverse – that tariffs would raise living costs.
Sammy Finkelman (dbec95) — 1/14/2016 @ 9:55 pmWhen I saw the posters for that I was astonished. I can’t understand why anyone would waste money, time, and perfectly good film or videotape to film that piece of dreck. The Shannara books exist for one specific market — people who’ve read Lord of the Rings so many times that it no longer does it for them. (That is the exact phrase I heard from a SF publishing insider who shall remain anonymous.) They need something that’s exactly the same, only new, and never mind that it has none of the original’s depth or quality, they’re not in it for that. So OK, that explains the books, but why would anyone want to film them?
Milhouse (87c499) — 1/14/2016 @ 11:29 pmNot going to happen. We just got through establishing that the eligibility clause is not justiciable. There’s no way the courts are going to reverse themselves in the very next election, especially when the challeged candidate is of the opposite party.
Milhouse (87c499) — 1/14/2016 @ 11:32 pmThat was never an issue. Arizona was an incorporated territory, and thus just as much a part of the USA as any state.
Milhouse (87c499) — 1/14/2016 @ 11:34 pmI found Kasich grating at times
Only times the mute and FF buttons slipped.
Kevin M (25bbee) — 1/15/2016 @ 1:08 amWhy hasn’t anyone taken Trump to task for supporting Obama in 2008? If I were there, I would end every comment with: And Trump supported Obama (apologies to Cato the Elder).
Kevin M (25bbee) — 1/15/2016 @ 1:11 amI am amused by Trump 1) quoting Lawrence Tribe, and 2) trying to school Cruz on the law.
Cruz jammed the whole thing down his throat. But the problem is there’s a Gresham’s Law in politics, where stupid ideas drive out good ones, and Trump is a prime example.
Kevin M (25bbee) — 1/15/2016 @ 1:15 amGreat night to witness boosh blowing tommy Donahue and the chamber of hate american commerces money.
mg (31009b) — 1/15/2016 @ 2:12 amIf you’re thinking of the 343 FDNY firefighters who were killed went up the stairs to fight those infernos and rescue whoever were trapped, none were women. All were men.
The Bolshevik urge to rewrite history has been a pet peeve of mine since being lectured about the “men and women” who served in the USS Constitution back in the day when it was a bonafide warship.
Steve57 (17e737) — 1/15/2016 @ 2:20 amSo OK, that explains the books, but why would anyone want to film them?
i only got ten or so minutes in
you can tell they spent some money
but if there’s an x factor to it what’s gonna elevate it in some way or make it “relevant” i’m not seeing it yet
John Rhys-Davies is just sort of a banality in this kind of material anymore so that’s no help
my sense is this is basically game of thrones meets vampire diaries with magic pebbles
happyfeet (831175) — 1/15/2016 @ 2:43 amChinese home appliance maker Haier Group has reached a deal to buy General Electric Co.’s appliance business for $5.4 billion.
what *can* failmerica make anymores?
poop!
happyfeet (831175) — 1/15/2016 @ 3:40 amohnoes celine’s dad died
happyfeet (831175) — 1/15/2016 @ 3:41 ambat guano and worm castings rule.
mg (31009b) — 1/15/2016 @ 3:46 amWinston Churchill’s mummy was an American.
nk (dbc370) — 1/15/2016 @ 5:22 amFrom New York.
A socialite.
Very rich.
But he never claimed his American citizenship.
He preferred his British lordship.
Or is that cadetship?
But maybe he got some of grand-papa Jerome’s money?
Anyway.
He could have come to America and run for President.
But the Roosevelts would have kicked his butt.
interesting lil puka shell this Mr. Rhys-Davies
and here this is perspicacious too
he said that in 2004
happyfeet (831175) — 1/15/2016 @ 5:53 amTolkien was not the first.
nk (dbc370) — 1/15/2016 @ 5:56 amNor the best.
He just gathered a big constituency.
A lot of people did High Fantasy.
And Heroic Fantasy.
And Sword and Sorcery.
Before him and after him.
Robert E. Howard did it before and better.
Jack Vance did it after and better.
Roger Zelazny was a in a class by himself.
And there were lots of lesser lights.
Terry Brooks is not in the class of any of the aforementioned, that’s true.
But that’s Hollywood.
There’s no originality.
It’s best, The Princess Bride, first a book by William Goldman, was a ripoff.
Or a pastiche.
Or a parody.
Or all of the above.
Of several generations of fantasy.
And swashbucklers.
But McDonald’s became wildly successful.
And Bud Lite is drunk everywhere.
Coke.
Starbucks.
Americans have very low tastes.
Way low.
Dreck.
Mr. rr martin does a nice job of it i think
happyfeet (831175) — 1/15/2016 @ 6:00 ammaisie took a selfie!!!!
happyfeet (831175) — 1/15/2016 @ 6:02 amStopped reading him in the ’90s. Too sado-masochistic; not gay enough.
nk (dbc370) — 1/15/2016 @ 6:03 amhe tries SO hard to bring the gay
happyfeet (831175) — 1/15/2016 @ 6:04 amSo I heard that Rubio got a bit hot and bothered at times (couldn’t watch the debate).
How did that go over?
JP (56a147) — 1/15/2016 @ 6:12 amAnyone who thinks Ted Cruz is eligible for the presidency has their account in the wrong bank. He doesn’t qualify – he’s an American citizen alright but not a natural born citizen.
Pretending the two are the same is tantamount to whistling past the graveyard. A smooth or humorous response during the debates no more resolves the issue in his favor than the claim AGW is settled science. Cruz has a monkey on his back, or rather an 800 pound gorilla.
Hillary’s damaged goods and can’t win, Bernie Sanders hasn’t got a chance in hell. Cruz has a fatal flaw. Rubio’s an also ran. The next president is most likely Donald Trump.
ropelight (e4137c) — 1/15/2016 @ 6:13 amand poor deluded food stamp just gave his lil poofter speech where he said the economy was teh awesome?
pathetic
happyfeet (831175) — 1/15/2016 @ 6:15 amsell sell
sell everything
happyfeet (831175) — 1/15/2016 @ 6:15 amI got a rhyme that ends in a riddle
Colonel Haiku (a81cba) — 1/15/2016 @ 6:15 amWhat’s round on the ends
Hi in the middle?
oHIo
and John Kasich blows
lol bloomberg propaganda hooch “sho chandra” makes a funnie
happyfeet (831175) — 1/15/2016 @ 6:18 amdear god she’s rolling
now it’s warm weather’s fault?
happyfeet (831175) — 1/15/2016 @ 6:20 amYou know who’s good, of the present breed? Mark Hodder’s Burton and Swineburne books, if you like Steampunk. And Jonathan L. Howard’s Johannes Cabal books, if you like necromancy and neck-romance (one brother is a necromancer and the other a vampire).
nk (dbc370) — 1/15/2016 @ 6:23 ami put those in my folder for when i need more kindles
happyfeet (831175) — 1/15/2016 @ 6:25 amHoward’s also got a modern day cthluthu tale.
narciso (48ecae) — 1/15/2016 @ 6:28 amWell he did do a McCain fundraiser.
narciso (48ecae) — 1/15/2016 @ 6:32 amDavies was indy’s pal, and that character from the rings.
If you haven’t read Jack Vance’s Lyonesse Trilogy, do those first. The only danger is that every other Fantasy, High or Heroic, you read after that will be like eating a Big Mac after you’ve had filet mignon and lobster tail.
nk (dbc370) — 1/15/2016 @ 6:34 amCarter & Lovecraft. I just read it, narciso. Just before what I’m reading now. It’s good. I recommend it.
nk (dbc370) — 1/15/2016 @ 6:37 amnk, it seems as if you and I share literary tastes!
I actually enjoy GRRM’s science fiction. The funny part? He used to joke about “thud and blunder” novels. Now it’s his livelihood.
Zelazny was my favorite for many years.
I get very, very tired of Charles Stross’ preening personality, but his Laundry Files novels are fun. H.P. Lovecraft meets Tech Support.
But I will bet you enjoyed Tim Powers’ “Declare.” That is a fine novel. His “Anubis Gates” is one of my favorite novels.
Thanks for the smile this AM.
Simon Jester (9ded1b) — 1/15/2016 @ 6:56 amThe following excerpt is from the latest Reuters poll, article 1/15/16 by Ginger Gibson.
ropelight (e4137c) — 1/15/2016 @ 7:01 amfor to be against him just cause of he’s canadian is prejudice
happyfeet (831175) — 1/15/2016 @ 7:03 amMilhouse #101,
Right, I was just being tongue-in-cheek about Goldwater and Arizona.
Cruz Supporter (102c9a) — 1/15/2016 @ 7:11 amThe Panama Canal Zone was American soil at the time that John McCain was born at a US military installation, yet people have argued that doesn’t “count” as American soil.
Think again stinkyfeet, prujudice is holding preconceived opinions that are not based on reason or on actual experience. Adherence to the principles of the US Constitution isn’t prejudice, it’s the law of the land.
ropelight (e4137c) — 1/15/2016 @ 7:11 amhappyfeet, you should never underestimate how many Americans dislike hockey. And William Shatner.
Cruz Supporter (102c9a) — 1/15/2016 @ 7:13 amClaiming Cruz is ineligible because he was physically born in Canada is in no way adherence to the Constitution.
JD (97a3e4) — 1/15/2016 @ 7:28 amBig Tim Powers fan, Simon. Read everything except his latest. I liked Declare and the Anubis Gates, but On Stranger Tides really buttered my turnips. Pirates, sailing ships, swords, sorcery! It even had cooking! 😉 Hint: If you make a pirate gumbo, and you want to include rice, cook plain rice separately, Chinese takeout style and add it to your serving at the table. If you put it in the pot, leftovers won’t keep — the rice will swell and turn it all to mud. 😉
nk (dbc370) — 1/15/2016 @ 7:35 amThe keys to your jail cell are in your hands.
And, Patterico, the keys belonging to the regular I mentioned previously somehow often always fit because they at least conform to serious, mature discussions in these threads? As for the purpose of the last sentence of your post, that’s well above and beyond a schoolyard taunt or, at best, an adult dealing with another adult as though he’s a child?
I didn’t expect or actually want my previous post to be screened through here, just as I don’t expect or want this post to get through your filter. I also didn’t expect or want a reply to that previous post, or this one, to be publicly aired.
Surveys indicating people of the left compared with the right are more likely to want to censor or facebook-unfriend people they disagree with or who challenge them obviously are based on percentages and not absolutes. But those percentages are why I’m never surprised by outcomes in various elections, by a variety of rulings from the court, by the way the Constitution is or isn’t interpreted.
I’ve appreciated your blog for helping open my eyes in various ways, this thread included.
Mark (f713e4) — 1/15/2016 @ 8:02 amropelight-
Maybe you already answered this and I missed it.
If you did, feel free to disregard me.
I think by the standard rules of logic and grammar,
the term “natural born citizen” is meant to make a distinction in regard to someone who is not a “natural born citizen”;
someone who is not a “natural born citizen” would be a citizen who was not a citizen by birth,
not a “natural born citizen”,
but a “naturalized citizen”.
Now, in one way that is all beside the point,
MD in Philly (not in Philly at the moment) (deca84) — 1/15/2016 @ 8:16 ambecause we are talking about legalese definitions and usage,
which may or may not resemble reality [ 😉 ]
but those are my thoughts on the matter,
FWIW
JD, granted Ted Cruz was born in Canada to a Cuban father and an American mother. If that makes him eligible to be an American president doesn’t it also make him eligible for prime minister of Cuba?
ropelight (e4137c) — 1/15/2016 @ 8:32 amI kind of resent that implication that we’re bigots, xenophobes and racists if we question Cruz’s and Rubio’s pedigrees, too. We got enough of that with the hippie-Kenyan-Indonesian-Communist-Muslim. There’s nothing wrong with wanting the President of the United States to be as American as possible in every possible respect. Just exactly what makes Cruz indispensable, anyway? What’s so great about him that he must be President, now or ever? Why can’t he be content with his daughters being President? Or his grand-daughters?
nk (dbc370) — 1/15/2016 @ 8:43 amMD, the Constitution’s reference to a natural born citizen derives from a note John Jay sent to George Washington during the Congressional Convention:
The mechanism for keeping foreigners (and foreign influence) out of our government is to insist that only the offspring of American citizens (born or naturalized) are eligible for our highest offices.
I fully understand the urge to ignore the Constitution’s exclusionary provisions in the case of clearly loyal and otherwise fully qualified individuals – Ted Cruz is an excellent example, and I believe he’d make a superior president. But, as good as Cruz is, he isn’t above the law – he’s not a natural born citizen. He’s an American citizen but he’s not eligible for the presidency.
That’s were I’m coming from and that’s the way I see it.
ropelight (e4137c) — 1/15/2016 @ 8:48 amMD, make that the Constitutional Convention. George Washington was presiding officer and Jay’s note was dated 25 July 1787.
ropelight (e4137c) — 1/15/2016 @ 9:00 amthe stock market is screaming in agony like clarice’s lambs
happyfeet (a037ad) — 1/15/2016 @ 9:18 amet tu citibank
happyfeet (a037ad) — 1/15/2016 @ 9:19 amI’ll just say that such a mechanism has done a very poor job,
MD in Philly (deca84) — 1/15/2016 @ 9:38 am(not that I agree with your definition of the distinction)
I think there are a number of Hungarian statesmen that have been more true to the rule of law, the rule of constitutional government, the protection of rights given to men and women by their Creator, all part of protecting the interests of the US of A,
than Obama, Clinton I and wanna be II, all of the nationally known Dems, at least 1/2 of the nationally known Repubs,
and Trump.
Trump is for Trump to a fault.
Which is better than the Dems, but by no means a statesman worthy of the presidency of the US,
as fault-riddled we may be.
To be direct, I do not see that statement clearly and necessarily in contradiction to my explanation of the terms.
MD in Philly (deca84) — 1/15/2016 @ 9:40 amBut my opinion is based on standard use in 2016,
not legalese of the 1780’s.
If Trump was only out for himself he’s already on easy street. He doesn’t need a job. He’s got the bucks, the babes, the perks, accomplished children, friends in high places, you name it he’s already got it – worldwide. If he wanted the Swedish Bikini Team he’d send his jumbo jet, if he wasted a new car one phone call and it’d be delivered. If he wanted Chinese it’d be sent up to his penthouse from the hotel kitchen.
If Trump was out for Trump he’d never have thrown his hat into the ring. Why ask for trouble?
ropelight (e4137c) — 1/15/2016 @ 9:48 am51. Dana (86e864) — 1/14/2016 @ 7:25 pm
No, just Cruz losing them. (not that he had so many, anyway)
And not just New York. The entire Northeast. I don’t think that is going to do him so well in New Hampshire.
Now about not too many conservatives coming out of New York – that, of course, is not an argument that any particular person (like Trump) is not a conservative or a social conservative. There are not too many Republicans either. Would that mean that Donald Trump cannot be a Republican? You could look at the person’s history, of course, but if the idea is that fact alone means that he is not, because every single person is not, it fails.
Donald Trump, mentioned William F. Buckley. That’s probably because he’s not that familiar with people and no other names quickly came to mind. While, indeed, William F. Buckey once ran for mayor (in 1965) and wrote a book about it called “The Unmaking of a Mayor”) he was actually from Connecticut. That’s true even though his brother was elected Senator from New York in 1970 (in a 3-way race. James Buckley was also really from Connecticut.)
Now a point Donald Trump could have mentioned, if he had had the wit to do so, was the addresses of ted Cruz’s contributors included in his campaign financial disclosure forms. There are probably a lot from New York, and from Manhattan and even the Upper West side.
Trump went into a lomng discourse praising the values of New Yorkers, or people from the New York metropolitan region, in connection with September 11th.
Sammy Finkelman (dbec95) — 1/15/2016 @ 9:49 amMD, that’s called presentism and it’s considered wrongheaded.
ropelight (e4137c) — 1/15/2016 @ 9:49 amMaybe you meant Donald Trump winning New York voters wit is praise? No, this is a platitude.
Sammy Finkelman (dbec95) — 1/15/2016 @ 9:51 amWhen Trump wants a neighbor’s property so he can turn it into a parking lot, he gets it. He uses eminent domain.
Cruz Supporter (102c9a) — 1/15/2016 @ 9:52 am“Retail collapsing”… Yes, all is well, Barcky Obama.
Colonel Haiku (cc8f3a) — 1/15/2016 @ 9:58 amTrump can’t use eminent domain, that’s a function for the municipal authorities.
ropelight (e4137c) — 1/15/2016 @ 10:07 amRopelight – whether or not he is eligible to be PM of Cuba is both a silly comparison beneath you, and utterly irrelevant.
JD (34f761) — 1/15/2016 @ 10:09 amThe way I see it:
All the definitions of “natural born” citizen given in the 18th century are really definitions of who is it who does not need to be naturalized. But “natural born citizen” itself simply means anyone who did ot need to be naturalized.
If we did use the old criteria, than Ted Cruz would not be eligible for the presidency of the United states, because at that time (and until May 24, 1934 – made retroactive sixty years later in 1994) citizenship only descended through the father.
http://www.americanlaw.com/citabrd.html
(And a wife automatically took on the citizenship of her husband – I am sure exactly when that was changed, but it was ssomewhere around the 1920-1935 period. It may have only been enacted in the frst place in 1907 with the Expatriation Act of March 2, 1907)
http://www.state.gov/documents/organization/104346.pdf
Also, on the same page
The constitution did not change in 1907, 1922 , 1931 1934 or 1994, but who would be a “natural born citizen” did, and some of the changes were retroactive..
Sammy Finkelman (dbec95) — 1/15/2016 @ 10:15 amropelight, as a zillionaire developer, Trump has influence with local government. And he’s used it to facilitate eminent domain. Keep in mind, Trump is the guy who has boasted that politicians and government do what he asks of them.
Cruz Supporter (102c9a) — 1/15/2016 @ 10:17 amTongue firmly in cheek, JD. Just pointing out that if Cruz’s mother makes him eligible for the American presidency wouldn’t his father provide the same qualifications in his native country?
The question isn’t beneath me, it’s valid on its face, albeit theoretical.
ropelight (e4137c) — 1/15/2016 @ 10:19 amSo, CS, you admit you lied?
ropelight (e4137c) — 1/15/2016 @ 10:19 amYou think being the leader of the free world is not a feather in the cap of a capitalist narcissist?
I am not sure you are being straight up about this, I would expect even a person for Trump would readily observe the personal gain of being president even if one doesn’t need the job.
In our current context, the things that make most people seek the job are what should disqualify them,
MD in Philly (not in Philly) (deca84) — 1/15/2016 @ 10:28 amAnd most of those who would do a good job have great reason to avoid it.
It is a rare person (and their family) who is willing to seek the job and be trusted with it.
Maybe Cruz is one such person.
Maybe Carson would be after being in high executive circles for awhile.
Now that the feds are pushing this program where they determine regional housing development,
MD in Philly (not in Philly) (deca84) — 1/15/2016 @ 10:30 amWho knows what Trump would do…
It would be different than what Obama or Hillary would do, I’m sure,
But that is not saying much.
ropelight, Trump is on record defending the Kelo Decision. Here’s a column written several years ago by Michelle Malkin about Trump’s love affair with eminent domain.
Cruz Supporter (102c9a) — 1/15/2016 @ 10:31 amhttp://www.creators.com/conservative/michelle-malkin/donald-trump-s-eminent-domain-empire.html
Please, MD, we’ve been on the same page for quite a while. Don’t insult me with cheap shots like even a person for Trump… or do you actually consider support for Trump evidence of disingenuousness?
Maybe if Ted Cruz (and his supporters) had the country’s best interests at heart he’d face the eligibility issue straight up. Instead of ducking and dodging, pretending it’s already a settled issue.
Look at the results of the Reuters poll at #133. About 1/4 of Republicans and Independents think he should be disqualified. Less than half think he’s eligible.
This isn’t going away. If Cruz doesn’t address it head on, it’ll sink him and maybe the GOP too. It’s the only hope Dems have. Only a fool would leave a loaded gun on the table.
ropelight (e4137c) — 1/15/2016 @ 10:47 amCS, you can’t lie your way out. You spent comment after comment accusing me of being a liar when it was you all the time that wrote Cruz = Hillary and tried to put it on me. You tried every low-brow, scumbag misrepresentation in the book. Now your chickens have come home to roost.
So, how does it feel to have the same dirty trick thrown right back in your face? Payback’s bitch, and you earned it, asswipe.
ropelight (e4137c) — 1/15/2016 @ 10:48 am“If you liked what happened to the country over the last 7 years and want more of the same, vote for Hillary, Cruz, or Rubio. It just doesn’t make much difference.”
– ropelight
“CS, you can’t lie your way out. You spent comment after comment accusing me of being a liar when it was you all the time that wrote Cruz = Hillary and tried to put it on me.”
– ropelight
Leviticus (efada1) — 1/15/2016 @ 11:05 amropelight,
Donald Trump has a history of using eminent domain. The facts are facts.
Secondly, a few days ago you wrote the following;
If you liked what happened to the country over the last 7 years and want more of the same, vote for Hillary, Cruz, or Rubio. It just doesn’t make much difference.
ropelight (b8c6e5) — 1/12/2016 @ 10:32 am
You were not only saying that Hillary, Cruz and Rubio would give us the same as Obama, but that Cruz and Rubio would not be much different than Hillary.
Cruz Supporter (102c9a) — 1/15/2016 @ 11:06 am“If Trump was out for Trump he’d never have thrown his hat into the ring. Why ask for trouble?”
– ropelight
Power, obviously. As Obama demonstrated, the President can kill American citizens he doesn’t like without being tried like Robert Durst. That’s a power that I think Trump would love to have.
Leviticus (efada1) — 1/15/2016 @ 11:08 amPlus, the power of the Executive Branch will give Trump a leg-up as an otherwise incompetent businessman.
Leviticus (efada1) — 1/15/2016 @ 11:12 amropelight (e4137c) — 1/15/2016 @ 10:47 am
No, I do not consider support for Trump evidence of being disingenuous,
I can see and understand why people are for Trump without problem at all,
but I do find suspicious ignoring the possibility that Trump is in it largely for his own ego, outweighing any noble concern for the country,
whether he “needs a job” or not.
FWIW, I had actually used harsher rhetoric in the post before I edited it.
and more FWIW, there are very, very few people who comment here that I would assume they would never be disingenuous,
and if I found them to be,
I would be stunned.
Unfortunately manipulation rather than communication seems to be the norm rather than the exception these days, at least on the net.
That is not meant to be condemning of anyone, just an observation.
And I realize that people are welcome to be as suspicious of me as they want.
And only God knows how much of Cruz’ (or Carson’s, or anybody’s) desire to be president is out of a noble desire to serve and stand for principle,
I certainly don’t,
and Cruz himself doesn’t even know.
But some things are warning signs
MD in Philly (deca84) — 1/15/2016 @ 11:23 amI haven’t bothered counting, has anyone looked at how often Trump says “I” compared to Obama?
“I will make Mexico pay for the fence” is not as bad, but getting close, to the idea that people will begin to heal (only, finally) after Obama becomes president.
et tu Leviticus? I notice you failed to include the context of the comment, the same dirty MO as CS, although you didn’t apply the lie as often as he did, but you do share his guilt both then and now.
The context was the general damage to the country when the president harbor’s divided loyalties. Barack Obama being the example of the evils which can befall the nation when an individual or an ideology at odds with American traditions occupies the White House.
In my comment I named Hillary as having an anti-American ideology, and Cruz and Rubio both having birth issues which conflict with the natural born citizen requirements in the Constitution.
I never said that Hillary, Cruz, and Rubio were one and the same. I said Hillary suffered from divided loyalties and that both Cruz and Rubio suffered from the potential for divided loyalties.
That you, Leviticus, bring the same old lie up again puts you in the same liar’s category as CS.
I’m not surprised that CS did it again, and again, and again. He’s so far out on a limb now he can’s even lie his way out. All he’s got is repetition and bluster, and lots of egg on his face.
As for your other quips and jibes, who cares? Trump has already won the game of life. Attacking him might make you feel superior for a few minutes but come-on. You’re an insignificant pipsqueak and he’s about The biggest Alpha Dog on the planet.
But, go ahead, take a few more cheap shots, it only exposes your empty soul.
ropelight (e4137c) — 1/15/2016 @ 11:29 amI don’t know about “I” and “me”, but here’s a mashup of Trump saying “China”: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RDrfE9I8_hs
nk (dbc370) — 1/15/2016 @ 11:31 ami think it was very thoughtful of Mr. The Donald to go out of is way like this to try and help
thank you Mr. The Donald
you’re a very good person especially compared to Hillary
not even failmerica deserves a president *that* skanky i’m sure you agree
happyfeet (a037ad) — 1/15/2016 @ 11:31 amThe following excerpt is from The Dallas Morning News January 15, 2016, article by Bobby Blanchard.
ropelight (e4137c) — 1/15/2016 @ 12:02 pmWell, nk, I did not find that particularly illuminating,
MD in Philly (deca84) — 1/15/2016 @ 12:11 pmbut there was an option to the right of “Chuck Norris kicks everything”
that was enjoyable.
Now I know what to do if anyone ever tries to deliberately run me down with a car.
ropelight,
Telling me and Leviticus that we’re basically the worst persons on the planet still doesn’t change your quote from a few days ago.
And thank you to Leviticus for also citing your quote.
By the way, a case can be made that Trump’s the one with these so-called “divided loyalties” that you’re obsessing about. I mean, Trump was a Democrat for such a long time, and now he’s flipped over to the Republicans. (LOL)
Cruz Supporter (102c9a) — 1/15/2016 @ 12:17 pmropelight, I’m curious about the “divided loyalties” issue you have with Cruz and Rubio. What is it that you fear will come out of it? Do you believe Cruz would conduct foreign relations differently with Canada, than, say, Chris Christie or Jeb Bush would? And how do you believe Cruz or Rubio might conduct foreign relations with the Castros?
Cruz Supporter (102c9a) — 1/15/2016 @ 12:27 pmWouldn’t you agree that Barack Obama has been a little soft on the Castros even though he’s a natural born citizen?
china loves him
mg (31009b) — 1/15/2016 @ 12:32 pmchina,china,china
And, CS, aren’t you guilty of lying at #152, as detailed at #163. How about an apology for your underhanded name calling? What makes you obsess so single mindedly on a simple metaphor to the extent you spend days attempting to make mountains out of imaginary molehills?
Is your partisanship so blind you don’t know that Cruz is the second of most Trump supporters, and that Trump is the second choice of most Cruz supporters?
Does it penetrate your thick skull that if Ted Cruz was truly sincere he’d put the nation’s best interests above his own ambition and ask the courts to settle the natural born citizen issue before the elections. A true patriot, not an ambitious politician, wouldn’t allow the nation to be torn apart over an issue easily settled. His refusal to address the issue head on is proof he’s unfit for high office. But, you can’t see that, can you?
ropelight (e4137c) — 1/15/2016 @ 12:36 pmYou three guys have got to stop this nonsense. You’re so busy beating each other’s candidate up you’ve lost track of the target: Hillary!. Plus, we have three conservatives that are at constant odds with each other. No wonder the leftists win so often you guys can’t keep focused. If any of you believe tat people in their 40’s, 50’s and 60’s could have come this far without changing their minds, flip-flopping, saying the wrong thing or saying something wrong, doing something you won’t like or voting for something you’re against you should go discuss opera and stay away from politics. But if you’re serious about making sure the filthy, lying grifter ad he rapist husband aren’t in the White House I suggest you burry the hatchet and fight for a Republican any Republican because the next president will be picking two or three Supremes and if it’s a leftist this country is Sweden.
Rev. Barack Hussein Hoagie™ (f4eb27) — 1/15/2016 @ 12:39 pmYeah, Cruz Supporter, but Obama s also a natural born subversive and he has the friends to prove it.
Rev. Barack Hussein Hoagie™ (f4eb27) — 1/15/2016 @ 12:43 pmi think it was very thoughtful of Mr. The Donald to go out of is way like this to try and help
thank you Mr. The Donald
I not entirely sure what it says about me that I read this in the voice of the Iron Sheikh.
But I suspect it says I’m a big time jabroni.
JP (56a147) — 1/15/2016 @ 12:57 pmHoagie, I couldn’t agree with you more. CS started it by calling me a liar. I’m not going to take that crap. If he keeps attacking, I’ll keep throwing it right back in his face. I’ve not yet begun to fight.
Here’s my concern:
If Ted Cruz doesn’t settle the natural born citizen issue before the election, and somehow wins, his presidency will be plagued by lawsuit after lawsuit – the Dems will hound him unmercilessly from daylight to dusk and all night long – just like they did with Sarah Palin till they run him out of office or cause each of his actions to be scrutinized in every court run by Clinton or Obama appointed judges. We’re talkin’ gridlock like you’ve never seen gridlock.
Dems will do anything to keep Obamacare from being overturned, maintain funding for Planned Parenthood, keep the borders wide open, fund green energy projects, keep taxes high, keep mountains of regulations in place, maintain the current tax code, protect the IRS, keep the lid on Benghazi, protect Lois Lerner, Hillary Clinton, Eric Holder, Jeh Johnson, Huma Abidin, Cheryl Mills, etc.
And, since neither Hillary, Bernie, or the ghost can win, the Dems only hope is to engineer a victory for Ted Cruz so they can tie him in knots later.
However, Cruz could spare us and himself the grief if he had the guts to face the issue straight up and settle it before the elections. His selfish ambition isn’t more important than the good of the nation. If he doesn’t step up others (Dems) will force the issue. Cruz must do the right thing now or it will kill him later.
ropelight (e4137c) — 1/15/2016 @ 1:04 pmCruz would make an excellent Solicitor General or Attorney General. Just sayin’
ropelight (e4137c) — 1/15/2016 @ 1:10 pmReverend Hoagie, I’m totally board on with you about focusing on defeating Hillary.
That’s the entire point.
But when someone accuses you of lying, it is important to set the record straight.
ropelight wrote a few days ago that if you like what’s happened the past 7 years, then go ahead and vote for Hillary, Cruz, or Rubio. Even to an uneducated, empty, soulless, dummy like me, it sounds like ropelight was saying he thinks Hillary would be a third term of Obama—but so, too, would a President Cruz or President Rubio.
Some (but not all) of the Trump supporters want everyone else to sit down and shut up.
When Hugh Hewitt asked Trump on the radio what he’d do about the Quds forces, Trump obviously got confused about the question, so then he later attacked Hewitt for quoting what Trump had said in his own words.
Sounds like a familiar recipe.
Cruz Supporter (102c9a) — 1/15/2016 @ 1:32 pmropelight, if you really believe that Cruz has “divided loyalties,” then wouldn’t you also believe that these “divided loyalties” would affect his judgment and vision as a prospective U.S. Attorney General?
Cruz Supporter (102c9a) — 1/15/2016 @ 1:46 pmDerp. Don’t ask him tough questions like that, he’ll accuse you of Milhouse Something Something
Leviticus (efada1) — 1/15/2016 @ 1:52 pmYou’ve got a problem there CS, for days I told you repeatedly, maybe as many at 10 to 15 times that I thought Hillary, Cruz, and Rubio all suffered from divided loyalties or the potential for them.
You never once changed you tune, you kept accusing me of lying when all along it was you who twisted the words in my comment to a simple minded and inaccurate formula Cruz = Hillary or vice versa.
You reveled in your gotcha misrepresentation. You’re as dishonest a low down belly crawlin’ lying asshole as ever disgraced himself on this board. Even now, you pretend butter wouldn’t melt in your mouth, when all along you’re a sick jackass.
No one here or anywhere else thinks that Hillary is the same as Cruz or Rubio, yet that’s the idiot snake oil you’ve been trying to force down my throat. Well, no thanks, not today, not yesterday, and not tomorrow.
Go answer the question: Why won’t Cruz ask the courts for a declaratory judgment on the issue of his eligibility. 1/4 of GOP voters thing he’s ineligible and another 1/4 aren’t sure one way or the other. Is Cruz so selfish he puts his own ambition ahead of the interests of the nation?
ropelight (e4137c) — 1/15/2016 @ 1:52 pm#184, CS, I never said Cruz had divided loyalties. That’s another of your straw men. The Constitution attempts to preclude those with divided loyalties by imposing the natural born citizen requirement for candidates for the presidency and vice presidency. But, you’d know that if you cleared the blinding hatred from your eyes.
Candidates for SG and AG aren’t subject to the NBC stipulation.
And Leviticus, shame on you. Lawyers are held to higher standards than blowhards.
ropelight (e4137c) — 1/15/2016 @ 2:01 pmIf you fellas need a break…
mg (31009b) — 1/15/2016 @ 2:02 pmhttp://www.bing.com/search?q=inagaddadavida&form=APMCS1
Ropelight,
Maybe Cruz thinks asking for a ruling is like asking for a clearance from the police from child abuse charges,
That making the request raises suspicion.
You are condemning him because his tactical consideration is different than yours.
If I was him and wanted it resolved,
MD in Philly (not in Philly) (deca84) — 1/15/2016 @ 2:04 pmI would want someone else to raise it
Just like I wouldn’t want to go out of my way to show I had a clean record for child or spouse abuse.
good allah, this is why we’re never getting to the Luna Federation,
narciso (732bc0) — 1/15/2016 @ 2:06 pm1/2 of voters thought Obama was a good choice for president,
What do voters know….
(yes, a bit tongue in cheek)
It will need to get dealt with since it has been brought up,
MD in Philly (not in Philly) (deca84) — 1/15/2016 @ 2:08 pmBut I don’t think by Cruz
Just like Obama made people look silly by ignoring the charges of the “birthers”.
it really does boggle the mind, all the things one had to affirmatively believe to vote to reelect Obama, but Donahue, Oprah, et al, did soften up the targets,
narciso (732bc0) — 1/15/2016 @ 2:16 pmSorry if this silly brouhaha boors commenters. CS called me a liar and I refuse to put up it.
I’m not satisfied with my opening sentence at #186:
It’s a little too ripe for your Procrustean proclivities. Hillary like Obama has divided loyalties, but both Cruz and Rubio have problems with the natural born citizen requirement. The 3 are similar in that limited extent only.
I do not now, nor have I ever, entertained the notion that the 3 are the same or that Cruz and Rubio are anything like Hillary other than as stipulated.
You CS and you Laviticus have tried to paint me with that absurd brush, even in CS’s case to manufacturing a wildly inaccurate formula and calling me a liar for refusing to let him put his words in my mouth.
ropelight (e4137c) — 1/15/2016 @ 2:21 pmropelight, there’s a reason your default position is to engage in foul-mouthed name-calling. It’s because you know you can’t win the argument. But don’t worry, I will continue to respond with your own quotes.
Even in the past hour, you’ve contradicted yourself.
In #182, you wrote this, “for days I told you repeatedly, maybe as many at 10 to 15 times that I thought Hillary, Cruz, and Rubio all suffered from divided loyalties or the potential for them.”
Then in #187, you completely reversed yourself and said, “I never said Cruz had divided loyalties. That’s another of your straw men.”
Cruz Supporter (102c9a) — 1/15/2016 @ 2:34 pmmeanwhile back at the ranch,
http://www.businessinsider.com/heres-the-latest-sign-of-how-bad-things-have-gotten-between-the-us-and-its-arab-allies-2016-1
narciso (732bc0) — 1/15/2016 @ 2:42 pmanother kessler special:
http://www.newsbusters.org/blogs/nb/tim-graham/2016/01/15/washpost-fact-checkers-gop-head-scratchers-or-downright-wrong-obama
narciso (732bc0) — 1/15/2016 @ 2:48 pmHaving a little trouble with reading comprehension there CS? See my comment at #193.
ropelight (e4137c) — 1/15/2016 @ 2:50 pmhttp://www.steynonline.com
mg (31009b) — 1/15/2016 @ 2:53 pmRegarding the Cruz natural-born fracas, I’m in the “grey area” camp, because while I do see possibly valid arguments pursuant to original intent that Cruz may not qualify as “natural born”, my guess is that he probably does, based on current laws and precedents.
The problem, IMHO, it that it’s not certain, and that Democrats or their stalking horses may well try litigating this to keep Cruz off a few ballots if he’s the nominee. They did, after all, make moves in that direction with McCain, who has a far stronger claim on “natural born” than Cruz. (McCain was born to two US citizens, who were deployed military (not residents) on what was then US territory).
The good news, IMHO, is that a lawsuit challenging Cruz’s eligibility has been filed.
Arizona CJ (da673d) — 1/15/2016 @ 3:05 pmhttp://thehill.com/blogs/ballot-box/presidential-races/266039-attorney-files-birther-lawsuit-against-cruz
Unless it’s dismissed on standing, IMHO this should give Cruz a definitive ruling, even if dismissed (which is also a ruling on the merits). My hope is that Cruz doesn’t make standing a centerpiece of his motion to dismiss, because this lawsuit may well turn out to be a gold-plated gift to him.
I’m getting the feeling this is deja vu all over again. Some years ago there was a obnoxious troll here with the same MO as CS. He pestered me in exactly the same way over mischaracterizating some ordinary point – making an ugly mountain of a molehill of his own imagining.
The came the accusation of lying and the nonstop misrepresentation of the dispute.
I think CS just might be the same damn jackass. If not, it’s his evil twin.
ropelight (e4137c) — 1/15/2016 @ 3:14 pmCould someone with administrative authority take a look and see if CS didn’t show up here during the last presidential primary season. I don’t want to know who he is, but I’d like to know if he’s a Democrat plant.
ropelight (e4137c) — 1/15/2016 @ 3:23 pmhow many lawsuits did berg and co, file, you want to see how quickly the Dems turn on this, like when they all of a sudden, memorized the dissent in morrison v. olson,
narciso (732bc0) — 1/15/2016 @ 3:29 pmask tom delay, whether the law availed him, ask most of the john doe targets, or the Huntress,
narciso (732bc0) — 1/15/2016 @ 3:31 pmI wonder what the judges are like up the chain in the jurisdiction where it was filed,
MD in Philly (not in Philly) (deca84) — 1/15/2016 @ 3:48 pmIs it lib or conservative home field advantage?
I’m guessing it’s lib.
194. “there’s a reason your default position is to engage in foul-mouthed name-calling. It’s because you know you can’t win the argument.”
Nice try, Nancy. Name calling simply expresses a total lack of respect for one’s counterpart.
DNF (755a85) — 1/15/2016 @ 3:51 pmwell it’s houston, which seems to have gone insane, so that’s probably right,
narciso (732bc0) — 1/15/2016 @ 3:53 pmHey, can someone make a Truther post so that we have somewhere for this endless argument to continue, for those who still think there’s some controversy?
Kevin M (25bbee) — 1/15/2016 @ 3:55 pmMaybe DRJ or Beldar can give us a scouting report.
I’m guessing that nothing will be decided one way or another before the election,
Lots of you know who type lawfare to just cause confusion for as long as possible.
If I was to place a bet (which I’m not), that is what I would predict,
MD in Philly (not in Philly) (deca84) — 1/15/2016 @ 4:02 pmSmoke and confusion….
clarifying the matter,
http://therightscoop.com/cruz-apologizes-to-new-yorkers-but-theyre-not-gonna-like-the-apology/
narciso (732bc0) — 1/15/2016 @ 4:19 pmThere is no grey area. Cruz is not a naturalized citizenship. Cruz acquired citizenship at birth. Ergo he is a natural born citizen.
http://harvardlawreview.org/2015/03/on-the-meaning-of-natural-born-citizen/
This is as settled as law can get. He was born to a US citizen in an Alberta, Canada hospital. His mother registered that birth with the US consulate. That satisfies the “natural born citizen” requirement. Cruz has never had to go through the naturalization process to get US passports, issued only to US citizens.
To those of you admitting that he’s a US citizen, but not a natural born citizen, how do you explain he acquired his citizenship? You have to invent a new category of citizen; the “unnaturally born citizen” I suppose.
If Cruz isn’t a naturalized citizen, and some are claiming he’s not a natural born citizen, please entertain us and tell us what sort of citizen he is. Really, it should be amusing.
As far as his dual citizenship goes (or went) that is an incredibly stupid thing to fixate on. Do any of you realize how many of you qualify for dual citizenship under other countries’ nationality laws and their interpretation and application of jus sanguinis? You could have been born in this country, which per the laws of this country makes you a citizen. And both your parents could have been US citizens, born on US soil. And you would still have dual citizenship depending on where your grandparents were born. Or by whatever criteria those countries chose to apply.
A great many of you commenting on this thread are also citizens of other countries, and by your imaginary standards (which are depart from the Constitution and US law) are not natural born citizens. Again, if we accept these absurd definitions, as opposed to the ones that actually exist as a matter of law.
And you guys don’t even know it.
Steve57 (17e737) — 1/15/2016 @ 4:23 pmbetter safe than sorry what if he gets elected and then goes all canada on everythibng
happyfeet (831175) — 1/15/2016 @ 4:30 pm*everything* i mean
happyfeet (831175) — 1/15/2016 @ 4:30 pmyes, it’s first world concerns, as we increasingly slide down the slippery pole down,
narciso (732bc0) — 1/15/2016 @ 4:34 pmsurprise, surprise,
https://pjmedia.com/trending/2016/01/15/lawyer-challenging-ted-cruz-eligibility-was-suspended-from-practice-of-law/
narciso (732bc0) — 1/15/2016 @ 5:13 pmCue Private Pyle…
MD in Philly (not in Philly at the moment) (deca84) — 1/15/2016 @ 6:05 pmI know what difference does it make, if it fulfills the narrative,
narciso (732bc0) — 1/15/2016 @ 6:31 pmJust watched Ted Cruz talking to Frank Luntz and members of his debate night focus group on Megyn Kelly’s show on FOX NEWS. Cruz was very impressive, kind and knowledgeable, if it wasn’t for the cloud on his candidacy he’d likely be neck and neck with Trump.
ropelight (e4137c) — 1/15/2016 @ 6:32 pm