Patterico's Pontifications

10/8/2013

Obama Faces Zero Questions on Glaring Issues at Presser

Filed under: General — Patterico @ 5:54 pm



So armed park rangers are threatening senior citizens with arrest if they “recreate” in a national park. And the rollout of ObamaCare is a joke, with perhaps a few thousand people (if that) having enrolled in the entire country, and a Web site that experts say is clunky and unprofessional.

Obama does a press conference and is asked about neither.

Really?

Even I, a hardened cynic about Big Media, am mildly surprised.

107 Responses to “Obama Faces Zero Questions on Glaring Issues at Presser”

  1. Ding. Everything is going according to plan.

    Ag80 (eb6ffa)

  2. I think its time to organize some larger protests.

    SPQR (768505)

  3. Dave Weigel says no they can’t ask because there’s a SHUTDOWN and all other national subjects are CLOSED.

    Except for Citizens United questions, those are ok.

    Also, his Obamacare responses would have all been “road tested” and boring.

    Which thank goodness explains all those orange cones.

    Sarahw (b0e533)

  4. compares his opponents to hostage-takers and deadbeats

    That’s what he said to his mom when she took away his leaky Stretch Armstrong and didn’t even get him a new one.

    Sarahw (b0e533)

  5. It is almost as though the questions and questioners were vetted.

    Kevin M (bf8ad7)

  6. The Mooch must be nagging him for another $25 million Thanksgiving break for her and the kids, already.

    nk (dbc370)

  7. People will enroll into Obamacare only when they actually need a doctor. No prohibition against preexisting illness was a great idea.

    AZ Bob (c99389)

  8. Well, Obama would know about deadbeats. It should be interesting in a week or so when he has to really slash the government so the bond payments can be met.

    Although I expect he won’t.

    Kevin M (bf8ad7)

  9. 7. The Mooch must be nagging him for another $25 million Thanksgiving break for her and the kids, already.

    Comment by nk (dbc370) — 10/8/2013 @ 6:15 pm

    Great, he can go back to Hawaii and shut down all the charter businesses there.

    It dawned on me that this isn’t the first time he’s shut down the ocean. He does it every time he rents the imperial beach house.

    Steve57 (234b9e)

  10. What a link, narcisso. Thank God for British media.

    Dana (1d2551)

  11. All the questions are pre-screened by Carney, and it’s hard for some of these journo’s to talk-down that far.

    askeptic (2bb434)

  12. I just talked to an old friend (dating back to high school) who got married and moved from SoCal to Colorado in the early 80s. He was telling me how terrible Congress is and how Obama is not so bad… I told him that I haven’t been a big fan of Congress for a number of years but that if he didn’t understand how big a sh*theel Obama was and how he was damaging the country, he just wasn’t paying attention. I then turned our conversation to happier topics… Lake Powell houseboat trips and music.

    Colonel Haiku (f416ac)

  13. He coulda been a member of the WH press corpse!

    Colonel Haiku (f416ac)

  14. But, isn’t the CO River closed?

    askeptic (2bb434)

  15. Past vacation trips… But yeah… He said if you were out on a houseboat right now you were SOL… every marina closed no fuel, no supplies…

    Colonel Haiku (f416ac)

  16. My wife had a hilarious conversation with a friend of hers yeesterday. Her friend was opining to her how this was all the GOP trying to embarrass Obama. Conspiracy theory about the Obamacare websites followed. My wife, knowing she had no insurance, said “speaking of which you know you will have to buy insurance soon or be fined, right?”

    Shock. Dismay. Did not realize that penalty would apply to her !

    Talk about low information voter.

    SPQR (768505)

  17. Was Obama reading from a Carney-approved list?

    JD (8935bd)

  18. LA Times’ Noel Shepard proves he doesn’t understand science at all; science proceeds through the ideas of those who are not part of the majority in authority, not through the echoing of that crowd’s understanding. “The science is settled” is a profound statement that the speaker does not understand science at any level higher than a parrot repeating what it’s been taught.

    htom (412a17)

  19. Where are the houseboats emptying their holding tanks?

    htom (412a17)

  20. Jonah Goldberg made a great point today – calling the systemic flaws of ObamaCare glitches is just wrong. A glitch is when your windshield wipers are working properly, it is not a glitch when the car doesn’t start. It is a failure.

    JD (8935bd)

  21. Question for those who know more-
    I thought there was approval for the Immigration gathering today in DC, but I see something about Congressmen getting arrested-

    any explanations?
    Was there no approval?
    Was there approval and the Dem Congresscritters did something extra to get arrested to pull attention away from the unequal treatment of illegals and WWII vets?

    MD in Philly (f9371b)

  22. I guess his MFM sycophants did not ask him about his refusal to negotiate? I suppose the MFM did not ask him about his bipartisan civility claims while he was likening his opponents to terrorists, kidnappers, hostage takers, and deadbeats? I suppose they did not ask him why Obama 2006 says Obama 2013 is demonstrating his failure of leadership?

    JD (8935bd)

  23. It was something extra, MD. They broke off from the main group and blocked one of the streets and refused to disperse to show that they were “willing to do anything”.

    nk (dbc370)

  24. MD: As near as I can tell, there was a separate protest in areas away from the immigration rally that several Dem Congressmen used to get arrested for TV time.

    Those areas remained closed and the DC police actually tweeted to Congressional staff to “not go there,” since the area was closed. It’s on Twitchy.

    Ag80 (eb6ffa)

  25. I don’t think it was to draw away attention from the disparity in treatment but, rather, that they suspected they would get no attention from the fawning media which would not want to air the disparity at all in order to protect iBambi, so they threw a tantrum difficult to ignore.

    nk (dbc370)

  26. MD, the congressmen weren’t arrested on the mall; they were arrested when they deliberately occupied 1st St NW, blocked traffic, and refused to let drivers through. Let nobody ever say John Lewis is a hero. I don’t care what he did in the ’60s, he’s a dick.

    Milhouse (3d0df0)

  27. I do have to give the Democrats credit for one thing: They have so confused all of their crises to the point that no one knows what the heck is going on.

    It’s all a big, cluster rope-a-dope depending on media distraction.

    Ag80 (eb6ffa)

  28. The Mooch must be nagging him for another $25 million Thanksgiving break for her and the kids, already.

    Jokes aside, one has to wonder what’s going on behind the scene between him and her. After all, she created a minor diplomatic flap last year when she avoided attending a major state dinner for China’s president based on the flimsy pretext that she had to stick around the homestead because it was the kids’ last week in school. Then — prior to that, and more tellingly — her daughters’ father vacationed with his “body man” in Florida, while she vacationed in Colorado with the kids.

    He was telling me how terrible Congress is and how Obama is not so bad…

    Talk about low information voter.

    Such people remind me of a woman interviewed for an article published this past week on Venezuela’s current president, who’s turning his nation into an even bigger cesspool than what his ultra-liberal predecessor managed to do. The woman admitted that her life had gone downhill under years of socialism, yet she apparently remains emotionally beholden to the late Hugo Chavez and his successor.

    Call it “Detroit Syndrome” or a case of “no bigger fool than a liberal fool.”

    Mark (58ea35)

  29. Thank you folks for your comments.

    Conclusion, they went out of their way to get arrested, but whether it was just to preen their own feathers, or hijack the narrative to avoid the issue being that the WH allowed an Immigration reform on Tuesday but didn’t allow WWII vets to gather on wed (and perhaps arrest gop Congresscritters on Wednesday???), or yet some other reason, we don’t know.

    MD in Philly (f9371b)

  30. MD:

    I can tell you what I saw with my own eyes, edited by Fox News. I was watching Megyn Kelly’s show for the first time. She was interviewing some sort of documentary filmmaker about what he saw on the mall.

    Regardless, he was complaining about the immigration rally while the mall was closed. But, Fox also showed an interview with some sort of veteran — recorded by the same documentary guy –complaining about the memorial being closed.

    Yet, right behind the complaining veteran were people walking around the WWII memorial.

    All I can conclude is that the NPS opened the memorials on the mall during the protest. I can’t know because Kelly never asked the obvious question.

    Ag80 (eb6ffa)

  31. Obama says Jay Carney decides who gets called on at each press conference. I’d like to know whether Carney talks to the reporters before deciding who to call on. After all, he has to make sure they agree to stay on script.

    DRJ (a83b8b)

  32. No emptying of tanks, htom. I imagine its the same situation at every nat’l park w/houseboats. Democrats are polluting our pristine waterways!!!

    Colonel Haiku (101cd9)

  33. What DRJ said.

    JD (8935bd)

  34. So we can take it that Jay Carney does not decide who gets called on. The obvious question, then, is who’s the decider?

    htom (412a17)

  35. Teh White House Press Corpse…

    Colonel Haiku (101cd9)

  36. No one asked Obama about his prior no vote on raising the debt ceiling either. Obama is the Lane Kiffin of presidents – always attaining positions above which he is qualified in terms of intellect or experience.

    In other news, Pelosi thanked Obama for “enabling” the immigrant rally to continue and for protecting the veterans ability to see memorials.

    Ratbeach (f5aad4)

  37. This cartoon pretty much sums up my sense of what the US is all about in 2013.

    Ugh and peeuw.

    Mark (58ea35)

  38. In Mark’s cartoon, there’s also a “Gay Mafia” bike behind that sign.

    All jokes aside, though, I actually basically completely agree with Mark’s cartoon. (Take that, Hemingway).

    Leviticus (6a67b8)

  39. The MFM is at least as in over its head as President Ladies Tee.

    Dirty Old Man (4bf1c0)

  40. as long as they don’t send the National Park Service gestapo we have a fighting chance

    happyfeet (8ce051)

  41. When we make the media useless, president pretend will crumble.

    mg (31009b)

  42. National Soros Radio’s been working overtime carrying water for food stamp through this whole silly shutdown episode

    NPR’s Mara Liasson said Obama’s comments during the news conference “moved the needle a little bit.”

    hey park rangers stop bogarting the lemon penis it’s Mara’s turn

    happyfeet (8ce051)

  43. 38. No one asked Obama about his prior no vote on raising the debt ceiling either.

    Comment by Ratbeach (f5aad4) — 10/8/2013 @ 8:51 pm

    Since the MFM praetorian guard isn’t going to raise the question, it’s time for the GOP to stop being shy and point that out. His rank hypocrisy is mind bending. When did Senator Obama Candidate Obama stop knowing that raising the debt ceiling showed a lack of leadership on the part of the President, and was irresponsible and unpatriotic.

    When did President Obama arrive at the opposite conclusion?

    He says we will be a deadbeat nation. Point out we will be if he keeps running up the Bank of China credit card every time we raise the limit.

    You probably need to poll test the message but Obama talks to the American people in what he thinks is kitchen table talk. He does it so badly, though. How does the GOP can’t keep letting him get away with it.

    They can’t outflank this guy? He attempts to explain how raising the debt ceiling is like paying down your car loan.

    “This is important,” Mr. Obama said. “Raising the debt ceiling is not the same as approving more spending, any more than making your monthly payments adds to the total cost of your truck.”

    Plowing ahead, Mr. Obama said, “I — you don’t say, well, I’m not going — I’m not going to pay my — my — my bill, my note for my truck because I’m going to save money. No, you’re not saving money. You already bought the truck, right? You have to pay the bills. You — you are not — you’re not saving money.”

    Read more: http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2013/sep/20/obama-struggles-debt-talk-ford-plant-if-we-dont-ra/#ixzz2hCIxEehw
    Follow us: @washtimes on Twitter

    How hard would be be to explain that apparently Prom Queen (I’d poll test this before I used; I wouldn’t use this exact language) represents all that’s wrong with Wasthington. If you’re paying down your car loan, you don’t need a higher borrowing limit from your bank.

    But you do if you also want to buy a boat behind that truck, which is why Obama wants a higher debt limit from the Bank of China.

    I expect this stupidity from Obama. So I’m more disappointed with the GOP these days. They act like someday someone in the MFM is going to ask the right question. Or they’ll help Boehner get his message out. They need to start running adds against Obmacare and the debt ceiling.

    It’s not hard to do. President Mean Girl has already said everything you need to make the case against both of them.

    Steve57 (234b9e)

  44. The GOP isn’t in a good place on the shutdown. But neither are the Dems or the Preezy. These numbers are really better than the GOP deserves because while they have the better case they’re just not making it.

    http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2013/10/07/cnn-shutdown-poll-plenty-of-blame-to-go-around/

    CNN Shutdown Poll: Plenty of blame to go around

    …According to the poll, 63% of those questioned say they are angry at the Republicans for the way they have handled the shutdown.

    “But the Democrats are not getting off scot-free. Fifty-seven percent of Americans are also angry at the way the Democrats are dealing with the shutdown. And a 53% majority say they are also angry at President Obama,” says CNN Polling Director Keating Holland. “It looks like there is more than enough blame to go around and both parties are being hurt by the shutdown.”

    Obama has OFA to do his ad blitz. And Sebelius has arm twisted the companies she regulates to spend $1B selling Obamacare, the program the GOP is fighting Obama over.

    What’s the GOP been doing to move the polls in their favor? The GOP has hired two new people to do media outreach to the black press.

    http://nationalreview.com/corner/360696/rnc-makes-two-hires-outreach-black-media-katrina-trinko

    Oh, yeah, that will move those numbers. The GOP still thinks a hostile media will get their message out.

    Steve57 (234b9e)

  45. Comment by DRJ (a83b8b) — 10/8/2013 @ 8:22 pm

    Truth IS stranger than fiction….

    My comment about Carney vetting the questions beforehand was pure snark….now confirmed by Obumble.

    Best of hands and all that.

    askeptic (2bb434)

  46. Something in the news about another Head Start program place being closed – without notifying the parents. It’s taking them a couple of days to “realize” things should be closed.

    Sammy Finkelman (056225)

  47. 46. Comment by Steve57 (234b9e) — 10/8/2013 @ 10:00 pm

    They need to start running adds against Obamacare and the debt ceiling.

    They don’t [articularly need to start running ads against Obamacare – of they had a good plan to replace it, it would be nice maybe too run ads about that – and they need to run ads explaining why it is absolutely necessary to raise the debt limit – if it is not raised, you get a shutdown to beat all shutdowns. The public right now does nort understand that the debt limit is not, and cannot be, a method of controlling debt. It can only be a method of forcing or attempting to force changes in law, and that only because it is playing chicken.

    It could be helpful to explain that in the Democats are contriving to make the consequences of not raising the debt limit much worse.

    Also that the budget process doesn’t work.

    Sammy Finkelman (056225)

  48. * They don’t particularly need to start running ads against Obamacare – if they had a good plan to replace it, it would be nice maybe to run ads about that.

    None of their proposals, I think, would help anybody now about to lose their health insurance, or ahve it greatly change..

    Maybe they could try a law extending all insurance policies , and provider contracts, 6 months, or making it very easy to do so.

    Sammy Finkelman (056225)

  49. Comment by Steve57 (234b9e) — 10/8/2013 @ 10:00 pm

    When did President Obama arrive at the opposite conclusion?

    January 20, 2009 at the latest.

    Sammy Finkelman (056225)

  50. And going to a Ford plant, that didn’t take the bailout, is facepalm worthy.

    narciso (3fec35)

  51. I heard an interview of Brit Hume by Hewitt. Hume said that the press conference was one of the most pathetic things in journalism he had ever seen.

    And that he had never seen the kind of vindictive direct attacks made by a president before like Obama routinely does.

    And that the Dems hated Nixon more “on a personal basis” than repubs dislike for Obama.

    MD in Philly (f9371b)

  52. Comment by MD in Philly (f9371b) — 10/9/2013 @ 4:26 am

    It is starting to look like Boehner might have to quietly threaten the impeachment option to get Obama to negotiate.
    Obama brought Doris Goodwin and several other historians to meetings early in the admin to lay groundwork for his “legacy” in the history books.
    Sadly, his concerns about that may be the only thing that will get him to act like a leader. The idea of being the bookend of two asterisks surrounding George Bush may be more than he can bear….

    vor2 (37e26e)

  53. Comment by vor2 (37e26e) — 10/9/2013 @ 4:50 am

    It is starting to look like Boehner might have to quietly threaten the impeachment option to get Obama to negotiate.

    If he has enough votes for impeachment – at least for actual removal – then he has enough votes in the Senate to override a veto. (You only need a majority in the House to create an impeachment case in the Senate, but you need a reason.)

    Getting 2/3 in the Senate should be more difficult than getting 2/3 in the House, so if you’ve got the votes in the Senate, you surely have in the House, and votes to override a veto, or a series of vetoes, are surely easier to get than votes to remove the president.

    So he should only be removed if he’s really totally rotten and malevolent, in a way you would not expect his vice president to be.

    There may be some other ways to start facing disgrace. You’re not after all, actually talkingof remiving him.

    Now if he deliberately does not pay the debt when due, there might be some grounds for beginning a case, and that might enough too bring him around.

    Sammy Finkelman (2b1acb)

  54. Comment by MD in Philly (f9371b) — 10/9/2013 @ 4:26 am

    And that the Dems hated Nixon more “on a personal basis” than repubs dislike for Obama.

    That’s right. This is not personal. Obama goes out of his way to avoid such a thing.

    Sammy Finkelman (2b1acb)

  55. Sammy… Obama goes out of his way to vilify anyone who holds different views and who refuses to acknowledge his self-perceived greatness. It’s very much “personal”.

    Colonel Haiku (86ce72)

  56. He always says his opponents have a point – they just disagree – he will listen to anything reasonable.

    And whenever he names someone he makes “excuses” for them, and says he hopes and expects them to go along.

    He says people are extreme or going along with something extreme, but does not accuse them of being evil for that reason.

    Sammy Finkelman (2b1acb)

  57. Obama doesn’t accurately state his opponents’ arguments. Instead, he sets up strawman arguments and debunks them. That’s the opposite of good faith and being reasonable. It’s bad faith.

    DRJ (a83b8b)

  58. Let’s look:

    http://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/transcript-president-obamas-oct-8-news-conference-on-the-shutdown-and-debt-limit/2013/10/08/866088c0-3038-11e3-8906-3daa2bcde110_print.html

    There is alot about how he’s reasonable. And he does make excuses for them – it’s a tough vote..they don’t get politically rewarded a lot for being seen as negotiating with him.

    There are enough reasonable Republicans and Democrats in the House who are willing to vote yes on a budget that the Senate has already passed….But as I said, it’s always a tough vote. People don’t like doing it, although it has been done 45 times since Ronald Reagan took office….I will sit down and work with anyone of any party, not only to talk about the budget; I’ll talk about ways to improve the health care system.

    I’ll talk about ways that we can shrink our long-term deficits. I’ll also want to talk about how we’re going to help the middle class strengthen early childhood education and improve our infrastructure and research and development. There are a whole bunch of things I want to talk about….

    ….And by the way, if anybody doubts my sincerity about that, I’ve put forward proposals in my budget to reform entitlement programs for the long haul and reform our tax code in a way that would close loopholes for the wealthiest and lower rates for corporations and help us invest in new jobs and reduce our deficits. And some of these were originally Republican proposals, because I don’t believe any party has a monopoly on good ideas. So I’ve shown myself willing to go more than halfway in these conversations, and if reasonable Republicans want to talk about these things again, I’m ready to head up to the Hill and try. I’ll even spring for dinner again…..

    ….I mean, the truth is, is that the parties are pretty divided on a whole big — bunch of big issues right now.

    Everybody understands that. And by the way, voters are divided on a lot of those issues too. And I recognize that there’s some House members — Republican House members where I got clobbered in the last election. And you know, they don’t get politically rewarded a lot for being seen as negotiating with me. And that makes it harder for divided government to come together….

    ….So, you know, I will not eliminate any topic of conversation. And I’ve shown myself willing to engage all the parties involved, every leader, on any issue…..

    Sammy Finkelman (2b1acb)

  59. ….what we’re asking of the Republicans right now is to keep the government open at funding levels that Democrats think are very harmful to the economy and inadequate to make sure that the economy is growing faster, more people are put back to work and the middle glass is growing. We’re willing to pass at least a short-term budget that opens up the government at current funding levels. It doesn’t even address the harm that’s been done because of sequestration….Because of sequestration, because of the meat cleaver cuts that have been taking place over the course of this year, thousands of families have lost Head Start slots for their children…..the government shutdown means several thousand more are going to be losing their slots…

    ….when they hear members of the Senate and members of Congress saying maybe default wouldn’t be that bad, I’ll bet that makes them nervous. It makes me nervous. It should make the American people nervous, because that’s irresponsible. It is out of touch with reality. It is — it is based on a flawed analysis of how our economy works. You cannot pay some bills and not others and think somehow that the fact that you’re paying some bills protects you from a loss of creditworthiness….

    [This is flat out wrong. Only cash equivalents matter in this way. It’s so wrong he has to know it is alie, but here are a lot of lies and misleading half truths in here]

    … a lot of the strategies that people have talked about — well, the president can roll out a big coin and — or, you know, he can — he can resort to some other constitutional measure — what people ignore is that ultimately what matters is, what do the people who are buying Treasury bills think? And again, I’ll — I’ll just boil it down in very personal terms.

    If you’re buying a house, and you’re not sure whether the seller has title to the house, you’re going to be pretty nervous about buying it. And at minimum, you’d want a much cheaper price to buy that house because you wouldn’t be sure whether or not you’re going to own it at the end. Most of us would just walk away because no matter how much we like the house, we’d say to ourselves the last thing I want is to find out after I’ve bought it that I don’t actually own it.

    Well, the same thing is true if I’m buying Treasury bills from the U.S. government, and here I am sitting here — you know, what if there’s a Supreme Court case deciding that these aren’t valid, that these aren’t, you know, valid legal instruments obligating the U.S. government to pay me? I’m going to be stressed, which means I may not purchase. And if I do purchase them, I’m going to ask for a big premium.

    [What kind of acase would there be? In any case, what president and Congress would decline to pay debt that had been thouht to be authorized? And a trillion dollar coin, and premium bonds are specifically devices to avoid incurring more debt. And if Treasury debt traded on the open market is prioritized, what would be the case? I guess you could argue that could be changed by anotehr presdident. In any case Obama should be reasuring the market, not scaring it with not just unlikely, but impossible, scenarios]

    Sammy Finkelman (2b1acb)

  60. … there are no magic bullets here. There’s one simple way of doing it, and that is Congress going in and voting. And the fact that right now there are votes, I believe, to go ahead and take this drama off the table should at least be tested. Speaker Boehner keeps on saying he doesn’t have the votes for it, and what I’ve said is, put it on the floor. See what happens. And at minimum, let every member of Congress be on record. Let them — let them vote to keep the government open or not, and they can determine where they stand and defend that vote to their constituencies. And let them vote on whether or not America should pay its bills or not. And if, in fact, some of these folks really believe that it’s not that big of a deal, they can vote no.

    And that’ll be useful information to — for voters to have.

    And if it fails and we do end up defaulting, I think voters should know exactly who voted not to pay our bills, so that they can be responsible for the consequences that come with it….

    …A big chunk of the Republican Party right now is — are in gerrymandered districts where there’s no competition and those folks are much more worried about a tea party challenger than they are about a general election where they’ve got to complete against a Democrat or go after independent votes. And in that environment, it’s a lot harder for them to compromise….

    …Republicans wouldn’t negotiate about taxes despite the fact that taxes actually went up anyway even though they refused to negotiate, and they could actually have gotten some things from us that they wanted if they had been willing to engage in normal negotiations.

    So we’ve got to keep — we got to stop repeating this pattern. I know the American people are tired of it. And to all the American people, I apologize that you have to go through this stuff every three months, it seems like. And Lord knows I’m tired of it.

    But at some point we’ve got to kind of break these habits and — and get back to the point where everybody understands that in negotiations, there is give and there is take, and you do not hold people hostage or engage in ransom taking to get a hundred percent of your way, and you don’t — you — you don’t suggest that somehow a health care bill that you don’t agree with is destroying the republic or is a grand socialist scheme….
    …You know, if you disagree with certain aspects of it, tell us what you disagree with, and let’s work on it. You know, if you’re concerned about long-term debt, that’s a good thing to be concerned about, but don’t pretend as if America’s going bankrupt at a time when the deficits have been cut in half…..

    …I may, I have flaws. Michelle will tell you. One of them is not that I’m unwilling to compromise. I’ve been willing to compromise my entire political career.

    And I don’t believe that I have the answers to everything and — and it’s my way or the highway….

    Q: What — (off mic) — legal liabilities– (off mic)? What is your legal advice, that foreign creditors must be paid first, particularly as it’s a sovereign credit issue, or —

    PRESIDENT OBAMA: Richard, you know, what I’m going to do is I’m going to let Jack Lew, the secretary of the Treasury, make a formal presentation on Thursday before the Senate committee because this is obviously sensitive enough and I think people would be playing close enough attention that details count. And I think prepared remarks from Secretary Lew on that topic would probably be more appropriate.

    But as I indicated before, we plan for every contingency. So obviously, you know, worst-case scenario, there are things that we will try to do. But I will repeat, I don’t think any option is good….

    Sammy Finkelman (2b1acb)

  61. Finkelman Flak Attack, so clutter the skies a carrier pigeon cannot pass, we need storm petrels to carry a line, perhaps two, between commands.

    gary gulrud (dd7d4e)

  62. the bottom line is either you’re having good faith negotiations in which there’s good — give and take, or you’re not.

    Now, there is already a process in place called the budget committees that could come together right now….

    …What has changed, or what seems to be motivating the idea that we have to have a new process, is Speaker Boehner, or at least some faction of the Republicans in the House and maybe some in the Senate, are holding out for a negotiation in theory, but in fact basically Democrats give a lot of concessions to Republicans, the Republicans don’t give anything, and then that’s dubbed as compromise….

    …. I don’t know why Democrats, right now, would agree to a format that takes off the table all the things they care about, and is confined to the things that the Republicans care about. So again, I don’t know that that’s exactly what’s being proposed. My simple point is this: I think Democrats in the Senate and in the House are prepared to talk about anything. I’m prepared to talk about anything. They can design whatever format they want….

    Sammy Finkelman (2b1acb)

  63. Sammy,

    Obama claims he wants to talk about shrinking the deficit but it has ballooned on his watch. Do his words match his actions?

    What Republican entitlement reforms and tax code changes has Obama adopted, as he claims?

    Obama claims he will talk about any issue while refusing to negotiate with Republicans. Does that make sense to you?

    The most charitable thing I can say is that Obama flip-flopped on the debt limit. Maybe that makes him principled in your world. It certainly doesn’t in mine.

    DRJ (a83b8b)

  64. The public right now does nort understand that the debt limit is not, and cannot be, a method of controlling debt.

    Sure it is. Congress just doesn’t borrow the money, and then it isn’t available for the President to spend, no matter how many laws tell him to spend it. Force majeure.

    Milhouse (3d0df0)

  65. …Q: — hey, I want some budget process reform before I approve another trillion dollars in debt.

    PRESIDENT OBAMA: Yeah, yeah, what — what — which is fine. And so if they want to do that, reopen the government. Extend the debt ceiling. If they can’t do it for a long time, do it for the period of time in which these negotiations are taking place…..

    ….The Republican Party says it’s the party that looks out for farmers. I happen to disagree. I think we — farmers have done real good under my administration. But having said that, why would you keep the government shut down and those farmers not getting their loans while we’re having the discussions that you just talked about?….

    … the Republicans say they’re very concerned about drilling. They say Obama’s been restricting oil production, despite the fact that oil production is at its highest levels that it’s been in years and is continuing to zoom up. But they say, you know, the Democrats are holding back oil production in this country. Well, you don’t — one of the things that happens when government’s shut down is new drilling permits aren’t processed. So why would the Republicans say to the folks who are interested in drilling for oil, sorry, we can’t let those things be processed until we have some negotiations and we have some cover to do what we’re supposed to be doing anyway? That doesn’t make sense….

    This completely ignores the Republican willingness – and desire – to pass bills exempting anything and everything Democrats complain about from the shutdown. Obama, of course, knows about that.

    It turns out that the reporters don’t completely
    fall down on the job. He does get asked a question precisely about that

    Here’s how he deals with it:

    Q: Mr. President, while you’re waiting for the shutdown to end, why is it that you can’t go along with any of the bills the House is passing funding the FDA and FEMA, where you were yesterday, and veterans benefits and Head Start? You’ve got to be tempted to sign those bills and get funding to those programs that you support.

    PRESIDENT OBAMA: Of course I’m tempted, because you’d like to think that you could solve at least some of the problem if you couldn’t solve all of it.

    But here’s the problem. What you’ve seen are bills that come up where wherever Republicans are feeling political pressure, they put a bill forward. And if there’s no political heat, if there’s no television story on it, then nothing happens. And if we do some sort of shotgun approach like that, then you’ll have some programs that are highly visible get funded and reopened, like national monuments, but things that don’t get a lot of attention, like those SBA loans, not being funded.

    And you know, we don’t get to select which programs we implement or not. You know, there are a whole bunch of things that the Republicans have said are law that we have to do.

    And I don’t get a chance to go back and say, you know what, this cockamamie idea that this Republican congressman came up with I really don’t like, so let’s not — let’s not implement that. Once you have a budget and a government with a set of functions, you make sure that it’s all operating. We don’t get to pick and choose based on which party likes what. So you know, that’s where the budget discussions take place.

    Now, if there’s some things that the Republicans don’t like, they should argue for eliminating those programs in the budget, come up with an agreement with the Democrats. Maybe the Democrats will agree and those things won’t be funded. But you don’t do a piecemeal approach like that when you’re dealing with a government shutdown, OK?

    So don’t fund what you notice becayse maybe there’s something important that you don’t notice. And don’t let things get cut oor eliminated because there are not enough Republican votes for it.

    That’s not holding things for ransom???

    Sammy Finkelman (2b1acb)

  66. Sammy #65,

    I can’t tell if you are quoting someone or stating your own opinion but there seems to be a disconnect between what you see and reality. Obama and the Democrats aren’t talking about anything. They are refusing to negotiate.

    DRJ (a83b8b)

  67. Some really intersting things in this press conference could be missed because Im posting so much of it.

    But none of it is actually personal attacks. He always says he understands they have political difficulties.

    He says he doesn’t say he’s always right and it’s his way or the highway, but that’s kind of false.

    He’s redefining what is no compromising.

    Sammy Finkelman (2b1acb)

  68. … I’m happy to talk to any of them individually and walk them through exactly why it’s irresponsible..[not to pass a debt ceiling increase with no conditions attached, or suggest an option to mitigate it.]

    I’m happy to sit down with them for as many hours as they want. I won’t let them gut a law that is going to make sure tens of millions of people actually get health care, but I’m happy to talk about it….

    Sammy Finkelman (2b1acb)

  69. Actually, DRJ, the interesting part is here:

    “… You know, there are a whole bunch of things that the Republicans have said are law that we have to do.

    And I don’t get a chance to go back and say, you know what, this cockamamie idea that this Republican congressman came up with I really don’t like, so let’s not — let’s not implement that. Once you have a budget and a government with a set of functions, you make sure that it’s all operating. We don’t get to pick and choose based on which party likes what. So you know, that’s where the budget discussions take place.”

    Um. This President has done precisely that, over and over again, with laws that he wanted passed. When there was a part of the law (again, that he wanted passed) that were inconvenient, well, boy howdy, it doesn’t get implemented.

    I think whenever the President says “implement” in reference to a law, I will refer him to Inigo Montoya.

    As for Sammy, well…I suspect he believes he is being fair, not a tool.

    Simon Jester (c8876d)

  70. That is interesting, Simon. I also agree Sammy wants to be fair but that doesn’t make him logical. I do wish he would edit his comments to make pithy points, rather than spam the comments.

    DRJ (a83b8b)

  71. My concern with the concept of fairness is that it doesn’t exist in a vacuum. In our current society, the media covers up and obscures problems on the Left (think looking through Mr. Magoo glasses), while problems on the Right are put under an electron microscope.

    The role of the press is to be adversarial, not a cheerleader.

    So with that in mind, fairness is a myth. It’s very, very similar to the arguments the Left makes about affirmative action and power structures, when you think about it.

    As always, nice to see your reasoned and thoughtful commentary.

    Simon Jester (c8876d)

  72. I read it over. The thing here that could be a Supreme Court case over is issuing debt over thd debt limit, citing the 14th amendment. That’s not what any Republican in Congress has proposed.

    That, in fact, would be invalid debt. He’s picking the most legally questionable way of dealing with reaching the debt limit as the prime alternative to consider.

    A lawyer arguing a case does that kind of thing. A serious executive holding public office should not. And all he is, is a lawyer arguing a (specious) case.

    Sammy Finkelman (2b1acb)

  73. Comment by DRJ (a83b8b) — 10/9/2013 @ 7:44 am

    Obama claims he wants to talk about shrinking the deficit but it has ballooned on his watch. Do his words match his actions?

    He’s quite willing to talk about anything, but not make any significant concessions, although he talk about concessions in theory, and probably has certain prepared “concessions” in mind.

    He has indeed proposed debt reduction, but one thing he wants is “tax reform” that is not revenue neutral, and the Republicans want to rule that off the table at the start. He characterizes that as not willing to consider closing corprorate loopholes. (A loophole closing , I suppose, does not need any countervailing tax reduction)

    What Republican entitlement reforms and tax code changes has Obama adopted, as he claims?

    Oh, he has toyed with raising the retirement age or the age for Medicare and other things that adversely affect individuals – even if they are not really Republican proposals.

    I don’t know where he claims he has adopted anything.

    Sammy Finkelman (2b1acb)

  74. DRJ: Obama claims he will talk about any issue while refusing to negotiate with Republicans. Does that make sense to you?

    He says he won’t negotiate under a deadline.

    So he was asked, at the end, isn’t there still a deadline?

    He had, I think, a little trouble with that.

    I don’t think a Supreme Court Jjustice would be impressed by that kind of answer in oral argument.

    But then, this is a jury case!

    Q: (Off mic) — if you enter into a series of short-term funding bills or a debt ceiling bill, you would be back in the same place, presumably, with these — the same members of Congress.

    PRESIDENT OBAMA: Again, I think —

    Q: So what has changed in the political dynamic if you do the short-term — (inaudible) —

    PRESIDENT OBAMA: Well, I think — I think what has changed is they’re aware of the fact that I’m not budging when it comes to the full faith and credit of the United States, that that has to be dealt with, that you don’t d– you don’t pay a ransom, you don’t provide concessions for Congress doing its job and America paying its bills.

    And — and I think most people understand that. I mean, you know, I — I was at a small business the other day and talking to a bunch of workers, and I said, you know, when you’re at the plant and you’re in the middle of your job, do you ever say to your boss, you know what, unless I get a raise right now and more vacation pay, I’m going to just shut down the plant; I’m not going to just walk off the job, I’m going to break the equipment — I said, how do you think that would go?

    They all thought they’d be fired. And I think most of us think that. You know, there’s nothing wrong with asking for a raise or asking for more time off. But you can’t burn down the plant or your office if you don’t get your way. Well, the same thing is true here. And I think most Americans understand that. All right?

    Thank you very much, everybody.

    Who’s breaking any equipment?

    And if he means not damaging the credit of the United States, wouldn’t the McClintock bill would do that?

    I suppose you could say:

    Government shutdown = walking off the job.

    Not raising the debt limit = breaking the equipment, burning down the plant.

    Sammy Finkelman (2b1acb)

  75. DRJ:

    The most charitable thing I can say is that Obama flip-flopped on the debt limit.

    He definitely has, except that he never was serious in the first place, and now seems to have put that into the memory hole.

    Maybe that makes him principled in your world. It certainly doesn’t in mine.

    When did I ever say he was principle, or honest about public issues? I just said he’s not personal, or tries to avoid encouraging personal hatred of Republicans, and that’s very important to him. Even in election campaigns he limits it, and especially wants to avoid characterizing peole as evil..

    Sammy Finkelman (2b1acb)

  76. More from Obama:

    …In 2011, I entered into good faith negotiations with John Boehner.

    He had just won the speakership. It was at a time when because we were still responding to the recession, deficits were high, people were concerned about it and I thought it was my obligation to meet him halfway, and so we had a whole series of talks. And at that point, at least, nobody had any belief that people would come close to potential default. I don’t regret having entered into those negotiations, and we came fairly close. And whenever I see John Boehner to this day, I still say, you should have taken the deal that I offered you back then, which would have dealt with our long-term deficit problems, would not have impeded growth as much, would have really boosted confidence. But at that time, I think, House Republicans had just taken over. They were feeling their oats and thinking, you know, we don’t have to compromise. And we came pretty close to default, and we saw the impact of that.

    I would have thought that they would have learned the lesson from that as I did, which is we can’t put the American people and our economy through that ringer again. So that’s the reason why I’ve been very clear we’re not going to negotiate around the debt ceiling.

    Sammy Finkelman (2b1acb)

  77. 77. “He says he won’t negotiate under a deadline.”

    The Most Transparent Administration Evah has finally met their contract.

    Unvarnished transparent horsesh*t is their output of late. Even if their supporters refuse to attend, their critics can no longer avoid the obvious.

    Our enemy is on the march.

    gary gulrud (dd7d4e)

  78. Obama says, that in the past, they were only pretending to negotiate over the debt limit, but really that was a budget negotiation, and they just stuck in it.

    And by the way, you know, I often hear people say, well, in the past it’s been dealt with all the time. The truth of the matter is, if you look at the history, people posture about the debt ceiling frequently, but the way the debt ceiling often got passed was, you’d stick the debt ceiling onto a budget negotiation once it was completed because people figured, well, I don’t want to take a bunch of tough votes to cut programs or raise taxes and then also have to take a debt ceiling vote; let me do it all at once.

    People posture about the debt ceiling frequently.

    Does he include himself, when he was a Senator, in that category?

    Sammy Finkelman (2b1acb)

  79. Comment by gary gulrud (dd7d4e) — 10/9/2013 @ 8:21 am

    has finally met their contract.

    Do you mean to say “met their match” They haven’t. It just keeps going, for now.

    Unvarnished transparent horsesh*t is their output of late. Even if their supporters refuse to attend, their critics can no longer avoid the obvious.

    That he’s speaking Unvarnished transparent horsesh*t?

    Maybe.

    Sammy Finkelman (2b1acb)

  80. I mean maybe people who oppose him politically realize that. The people dealing with him, surely do.

    Sammy Finkelman (2b1acb)

  81. Sammy #76: “I don’t know where he claims to adopt anything.”

    Your comment #61 quotes Obama claiming that he adopted Republican entitlement reform and tax code changes in his proposed budgets. Do you read your own comments, let alone think about them in any serious way? It looks like you are copy and paste whatever you happen to read that might be related.

    DRJ (a83b8b)

  82. I’m sorry, Sammy. You drive me crazy but I know it’s not intentional. I won’t interrupt you again.

    DRJ (a83b8b)

  83. Wow, Sammy:

    “…I just said he’s not personal, or tries to avoid encouraging personal hatred of Republicans, and that’s very important to him…”

    You might want to ask Jack Ryan about that, just for starters. The man is all about personalizing and polarizing his opponents (my, where is that phrase from?).

    More:

    http://www.americanthinker.com/2009/08/insulterinchief.html

    http://www.nationalreview.com/articles/281286/obama-s-target-list-victor-davis-hanson

    More interesting quotes here:

    http://townhall.com/columnists/johnhawkins/2012/09/18/the_25_most_obnoxious_quotes_from_barack_obama/page/full

    You can be fair, Sammy, but this is not a very pleasant man. He is indeed personal, and insulting, toward people who do not agree with him.

    Now I need to go eat my waffle.

    Simon Jester (c8876d)

  84. What Simon sez… heh!

    If calling opponents “kidnappers, hostage takers” and worse isn’t personal, Sammy, what the Hell is!?!?

    Colonel Haiku (a8bbc8)

  85. Heck, Colonel, I don’t like Republicans calling Cruz names. What the heck is wrong with our society?

    Simon Jester (c8876d)

  86. It occurs to me that Sammy may not realize how devious, snide and sarcastic Obama’s statements are. I often miss sarcasm online and there are others who miss it in real life. Maybe that’s the case here.

    DRJ (a83b8b)

  87. 86. Denial is a river in Egypt.

    “They are like one who looks at their reflection in a mirror, and then turning away, forgets what they saw.”

    gary gulrud (dd7d4e)

  88. 89. Certainly, Sammy is unsoiled by the devious manipulations of cunning.

    gary gulrud (dd7d4e)

  89. and a Web site that experts say is clunky and unprofessional.

    An expert, Ted Nugent is not.

    hubnub (29b511)

  90. L’ enfant terrible will have his cake, and will eat it too.

    gary gulrud (dd7d4e)

  91. What I think some people don’t realise about the debt limit is that it’s not just a cap that Congress has put on the president’s borrowing power, which would make it just another law, ranking equal with all those laws that demand spending of all kinds. Rather, the president has no power to borrow money at all. Ever. Even expenditures that are constitutionally required, such as the salaries of Congress, the president, and Article III judges, or that are absolutely necessary such as servicing the debt and paying the troops, if there’s no money in the till and Congress hasn’t borrowed any, then those expenditures just can’t be made. The president can’t spend money that doesn’t exist, and can’t borrow anything on the credit of the USA, any more than you or I can.

    It’s Congress that has the power to borrow money. And really Congress is supposed literally to borrow it and then give it to the president to spend. Except that in modern times Congress has delegated the actual borrowing to the president, authorizing him to borrow in its name up to a certain limit. Beyond that Congress hasn’t authorized him to act in its name, so he’s stuck. Borrowing beyond the limit wouldn’t be breaking a law, it would be a legal nullity. And since it would tend to call into question the validity of the USA’s actual debt (because one bond looks much like another), it would probably break the 14th amendment. It would certainly be an offense worthy of impeachment.

    Milhouse (3d0df0)

  92. and a Web site that experts say is clunky and unprofessional.

    An expert, Ted Nugent is not.

    Who said he was? Who mentioned him in the first place?

    Milhouse (3d0df0)

  93. 92. Google is your friend.

    The ‘contractors’ have reset all passwords, hoping to stem a tide, undoubtedly, of uncoordinated fixes.

    If one has ever updated a website via ftp one is aware that fixes can overwrite each other when performed roughly simultaneously.

    The Panic Button is sat upon.

    gary gulrud (dd7d4e)

  94. 87. Comment by Colonel Haiku (a8bbc8) — 10/9/2013 @ 8:40 am

    If calling opponents “kidnappers, hostage takers” and worse isn’t personal, Sammy, what the Hell is!?!?

    It’s a metaphor! Nobody could take that literally.

    The worst thing he calls them is “irresponsible”

    He even says:

    I’m happy to talk to any of them individually and walk them through exactly why it’s irresponsible to not raise the debt ceiling, which he calls not paying our bills on time.

    Then he says it funny (or hard to understand) Not evil, funny. He’s puzzled by them:

    And it’s particularly funny coming from Republicans who claim to be champions of business. There’s no businessperson out here who thinks this wouldn’t be a big deal, not one. You go to anywhere from Wall Street to Main Street, and you ask a CEO of a company, or ask a small-business person whether it’d be a big deal if the United States government isn’t paying its bills on time. They’ll tell you it’s a big deal. It would hurt.

    And it’s unnecessary. That’s the worst part of it. This is not a complicated piece of business.

    Sammy Finkelman (2b1acb)

  95. Sammy,

    Many people have been murdered, maimed, and traumatized by actual terrorism. And actual terrorist acts ruin the lives of the victims’ survivors.
    As a result, it is downright evil of President Obama and his aides and allies in Congress and the media to imply that Obama’s political opponents are terrorists, arsonists, hostage takers, and kidnappers simply because there is a budget disagreement.

    The irony is that Obama refuses to call actual terrorists, terrorists.

    Elephant Stone (6a6f37)

  96. 94. Comment by Milhouse (3d0df0) — 10/9/2013 @ 9:01 am

    What I think some people don’t realise about the debt limit is that it’s not just a cap that Congress has put on the president’s borrowing power, which would make it just another law, ranking equal with all those laws that demand spending of all kinds. Rather, the president has no power to borrow money at all. Ever.

    A lot of the news media is getting this wrong. TIME Magazine did. I did see one publication that got this right.

    The president can’t spend money that doesn’t exist, and can’t borrow anything on the credit of the USA, any more than you or I can.

    It’s not a difficult question, although the presdident wants to treat that as the only possible to evade the debt ceiling, and one of questionable, but not absolutely absent, legality.

    You wouldn’t need a Supreme Court ruling to tell you that. The 14th Amendment doesn’t give the president any authority to borrow.

    Sammy Finkelman (2b1acb)

  97. There are, however, other ways to deal with reaching the debt ceiling.

    In fact, the Treasury has been using some standard gimmicks now 4 and half months.

    And there’s more.

    What Obama is not talking about is prioritizing payments, (except maybe Treasury Secretary Jack Lew will claim, after all, that there may be some authority to prioritize payments, at least to favor foreign creditors.)

    Obama claims not paying any bill is the same thing as not paying principle and interest on the publicly traded debt. Which is not true. That’s already happened anyway with the shutdown.

    He has a modified way of describing that. He claims the creditworthiness or trustwirthiness could still be affected. But, really, it’s not similar the way a mortgage, a car note and a student loan are similar. This is more like being slow on a payment for shoes, or the electric or phone company (if they don’t report it to a credit bureau) or a payroll. Publicly traded debt is a thing onto itself.

    Obama never mentions the McClintock bill, which directs the Secretary of the Treasury to always pay the debt first, and gives him authority to choose whatever else to pay or not pay. He could even not pay just for things only the Republicans like.

    Obama dismisses the trillon dollar coin by trying to lump it in together with other things.

    Premium bonds (high interest, low face value) don’t get a mention at all.

    Sammy Finkelman (2b1acb)

  98. You wouldn’t need a Supreme Court ruling to tell you that. The 14th Amendment doesn’t give the president any authority to borrow.

    Obviously, being the Constitutional Scholar that he is, he does need to be slapped down by the Nine Robed Wonders on occasion.

    askeptic (b8ab92)

  99. Obama claims not paying any bill is the same thing as not paying principle and interest on the publicly traded debt. Which is not true. That’s already happened anyway with the shutdown.

    More than that. He’s not just claiming that not paying current bills is defaulting on the debt (which is a plausible position), he and his supporters are claiming that all payments and expenditures mandated by any law (including the ACA) are debts of the USA, which must be either paid or defaulted on. And that’s just too absurd for anyone to actually believe.

    Milhouse (3d0df0)

  100. It’s Congress that has the power to borrow money. And really Congress is supposed literally to borrow it and then give it to the president to spend.

    Well, in the same sense as Congress can “collect” taxes.

    It used to be that every issue of debt was authorized by a bill in Congress.

    Borrowing beyond the limit wouldn’t be breaking a law, it would be a legal nullity.

    Which Obama perfectly understands. But he’s holding this out, or somebody is, as the number one alternative, and at the press conference he tried to imply that the trillion dollar coin has the same problems – that all strategies have the same defect. (to do that, he’s actually got to minimize the problems with the so called 14th amendment solution.)

    Bonds could be issued, but they wouldn’t be legal obligations of the United States unless and until Congress made them so.

    Sammy Finkelman (2b1acb)

  101. SF: “You wouldn’t need a Supreme Court ruling to tell you that. The 14th Amendment doesn’t give the president any authority to borrow.”

    Comment by askeptic (b8ab92) — 10/9/2013 @ 9:42 am

    Obviously, being the Constitutional Scholar that he is, he does need to be slapped down by the Nine Robed Wonders on occasion.

    But in this case actually he knows. He’s pretending something that’s black letter law is questionable, but only to put forth this idea as the number one strategy for reaching the debt ceiling, in order to link it togetehr with all others.

    For that reason he makes it merely questionable.

    Sammy Finkelman (2b1acb)

  102. What else could he do?

    There is prioritizing, and if the law does not cirrently allow the Secretary of the Treasury to do anything when he sees a default coming, the House has passed a bill that would give that authority.

    And there is the possible issue of low face value, but extremely high interest bonds (currently not allowed by Treasury regulations, but the preident can change them.) Ths would have the effect of appearing to increase the annual deficit.

    And there is the trillion dollar coin. (the possible objection to that it might be bad monetary policy, and it puts control of monetary policy in the hands of the Secretary of the Treasury)

    And undoubtably he knows of other ways to deal with this.

    He’s just pretending.

    Pretending, among other things, that October 17 is a drop dead date.

    Sammy Finkelman (2b1acb)

  103. I question the accuracy of the 10/17 date.
    The fact that the Treasury hasn’t reported any movement of the National Debt for weeks/months leads me to believe that they have already exceeded their statutory limitation, and they need the cover of an increase to paper over this transgression.

    askeptic (b8ab92)

  104. askeptic, many in the industry believe that the Treasury department has illegally exceeded the ceiling. It is part of why the markets are so jittery about the debt ceiling but unconcerned about the faux shutdown.

    SPQR (95c543)


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