The story is a couple of days old, but voter fraud is always timely.
[Video removed as it disables comments. Please view it here.]
But who would have ever guessed it possible that illegals might be engaged in voter fraud???
Oh, right. Me. And pretty much all of you too.
UPDATE BY PATTERICO: Comments should be working again now that the embedded video is off the post. Sorry for any problems.
Pronounced "Patter-EE-koh"
E-mail: Just use my moniker Patterico, followed by the @ symbol, followed by gmail.com
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DRJ (a83b8b) — 2/6/2012 @ 10:31 amHey, it’s working?
Karl (f07e38) — 2/6/2012 @ 10:40 amAlrighty, I’ll wait a couple of hours for a new post, to give folks time to comment.
Karl (f07e38) — 2/6/2012 @ 10:41 amOnly a bunch of moss-back, racist, xenophobes would belive in this.
AD-RtR/OS! (b8ab92) — 2/6/2012 @ 10:41 amI appreciate how eager they are to participate but really what they’re doing is disenfranchising for reals Americans.
This is why everyone should have to show an id to vote.
happyfeet (a55ba0) — 2/6/2012 @ 10:46 amGreetings:
So, can we call illegal immigration a “gateway” crime now ???
11B40 (29c18b) — 2/6/2012 @ 10:49 amracist!!!
i denounce you!
(and twice for keeping me from being “first!” %-)
redc1c4 (403dff) — 2/6/2012 @ 10:52 amI agree, Mr. Feet. And you should hear what I get called when I suggest this on campus.
In fact, I seem to remember some folks here who felt it was unnecessary, and split hairs like crazy (when I pointed out you could not cash a check at a bank without ID, rent a car, etc, they replied they certainly could).
Personally, I think that only people with ID and who can answer questions about politics to the level of “Schoolhouse Rocks” should be allowed to vote.
But you know what that thinking gets me called.
Simon Jester (eeefa4) — 2/6/2012 @ 10:53 amVoter fraud has never been proven and it is racist to suggest that it could even happen and even if it does happen it is not as widespread or relevant as you make it out to be and all of this is just codeword dog whistling for suppressing the votes of minorities and liberals.
JD (04b6ef) — 2/6/2012 @ 11:01 ampeople need to have faith in their institutions Mr. Jester… I don’t see how they can have faith in the votings if we have non-citizens voting all willy nilly
happyfeet (a55ba0) — 2/6/2012 @ 11:02 amJD, that is exactly the style I encounter—except you need to breathe out most of your air first, for the desperate, sing-song delivery of Absolute Truth.
Mr. Feet, indeed. I agree with you on this topic as much as I enjoy table-made guacamole. Which is a lot.
Simon Jester (eeefa4) — 2/6/2012 @ 11:06 amNext thing we know, they’ll institute “intelligence tests” to make sure a potential voter actually knows what some obscure clause in the Constitution (like one of the more convoluted ones like the 2-A) really means.
If they do that, how will we get people to run for Congress, for Heaven’s Sake?
AD-RtR/OS! (b8ab92) — 2/6/2012 @ 11:07 amI kind of wonder, AD, how well government would work if Congress was *not* present?
Well, if no politicians were present…
Simon Jester (eeefa4) — 2/6/2012 @ 11:14 amI remember, way back in the day before I understood what Bradblog was really all about, leaving a comment there discussing vote fraud listing out the couple dozen of ACORN election fraud convictions, elections where more votes were cast than legally possible, etc. I provided links and what I was saying was clearly true.
The reply was that I will be banned if I continue to present disinformation.
Seems like a common tactic from the goons these days. Denial/projection.
Illegals voting is something I seem to recall some claiming they are entitled to do. We will see more and more of this as the government needs newer sources of votes to promise goodies to. They are running out of money, and the former goodie voters are waking up.
That said, the GOP has no credibility on this because of its shameful conduct in VA, violating the constitution to keep the process changing and complex, with predictable anti-outsider results (As intended, I assume).
The GOP is merely a lot less bad.
Dustin (401f3a) — 2/6/2012 @ 11:17 amJD – quite the contrary! The Secretary of State of Indiana was just convicted of felony voter fraud.
aphrael (5d993c) — 2/6/2012 @ 11:46 amDid crappyfete call us racist?
Dohbiden (ef98f0) — 2/6/2012 @ 11:54 amNo?
Well I think your a bunch of racist hipity hoppy doodooheads.
/Happyfeet impersonation off
Dohbiden (ef98f0) — 2/6/2012 @ 11:55 amI am aware of that, aphrael. Though it was about voting in the wrong precinct during the course of a divorce.
JD (04b6ef) — 2/6/2012 @ 12:00 pmI also couldn’t save a comment. I didn’t knowq where the problem was.
No problem really, as it gives me a chance to revise and extend my remarks (I saved them)
Sammy Finkelman (d3daeb) — 2/6/2012 @ 12:06 pmDid you go to the Super Bowl, JD?
DRJ (a83b8b) — 2/6/2012 @ 4:41 pmThe key question, here, though, is if it was actually these people who registered, or if someone ELSE registered them and voted in their place.
That may quite well have happened, too.
I Got Bupkis, Fomenter of "small-l" libertarianism (8e2a3d) — 2/6/2012 @ 5:25 pmWhaddya mean, “these days”. The libtard idiots have been pulling that kind of crap for decades now, possibly longer. With the internet it’s just now practical to fact check their asses and put the data in their face, forcing them to be overt about it, rather than subtle.
I Got Bupkis, Fomenter of "small-l" libertarianism (8e2a3d) — 2/6/2012 @ 5:28 pmIt’s called “warm body” democracy. Or in Chicago, “room temperature+ body” democracy.
Smock Puppet, 10 Dan Snark Master (8e2a3d) — 2/6/2012 @ 5:30 pmIf I recall my Kirkegaard correctly faith isn’t supposed to be based upon reason.
If you can reason it out, what do you need faith for?
Steve (475035) — 2/6/2012 @ 6:17 pmUPDATE BY PATTERICO: Comments should be working again now that the embedded video is off the post. Sorry for any problems.
Patterico (d508e7) — 2/6/2012 @ 6:17 pmHell… just give ’em in-state tuition and a path to citizenship. What’s all the fuss?
Colonel Haiku (dc1b32) — 2/6/2012 @ 6:37 pmThat’s what Johannas Climacus, Kierkegaard’s sockpuppet name (heh) discussed in his “Concluding UNscientific Postscript to the Philosophical Fragments”, which he properly called a “leap of faith”.
You are exactly right about what he was saying. He’s also explaining what truth is, and doubts all factual truth as we conventionally understand it.
This material is incredibly good, though dense. The pseudonym was meant to suggest he’s not necessarily convinced of the things he’s saying so much as exploring them from the frame of mind of this Climacus.
Dustin (401f3a) — 2/6/2012 @ 7:28 pmThe tactic used down here is they’ll register a whole bunch of people at parking lots and vacant lots and such, all with the same p.o.box. then they pick up a busload of bums, give themfood and some money and they drive them around to the early voting locations and hand each of them a voter id card and a list of people to vote for. Then they load em up and drive to the next location to do it again with a different set of cards. True the vote found lots of instances of six or more people registered to these vacant lots in Sheila Jackson Lee ‘s district…
Rorschach (d62b54) — 2/6/2012 @ 7:58 pmFaith that flies in the face of Evidence, Reason, and Observation is in for an uphill battle, however.
It can still win out, but it’s not in for an easy ride.
Smock Puppet, 10 Dan Snark Master (8e2a3d) — 2/6/2012 @ 8:18 pmI was discussing a faith for which evidence is lacking. Not a faith that flies in the face of it.
Steve (475035) — 2/6/2012 @ 8:20 pmYeah, I concede the point.
Things are actually better now than they were before in many ways. Truth can travel faster.
I also think the smears and lies can travel faster, and the liars have MUCH more ability to spread lies. Sure, the guys with the printing press probably lied more than their share fifty years ago, but there are some real psychos out there today who have the ability to reach out and ruin your name if they want to.
It’s the price of the information age. If I were to look at this dispassionately, maybe I’d say it was worth it, but I don’t look at it that way.
Dustin (401f3a) — 2/6/2012 @ 8:30 pmWhy that’s mighty sexy of you.
Dohbiden (ef98f0) — 2/6/2012 @ 9:37 pmIf I had a nickel for every time someone told me that…
Dustin (401f3a) — 2/6/2012 @ 9:53 pmYou’d now have a nickel? 😉
Stashiu3 (601b7d) — 2/6/2012 @ 9:57 pm😉
What if hybrid cars explode will the left see the errors of their way?
Dohbiden (ef98f0) — 2/6/2012 @ 10:14 pmNice to see a movie portraying the military in a positive light.
Dohbiden (ef98f0) — 2/6/2012 @ 10:39 pmillegals voting for liberals….
they’re just doing the j*bs Americans don’t want to do.
redc1c4 (403dff) — 2/6/2012 @ 11:56 pmPretty much.
Dustin (401f3a) — 2/7/2012 @ 4:13 amHere’s an even better story: INDIANA’S GOP SECRETARY OF STATE GUILTY OF THREE COUNTS OF FELONY VOTER FRAUD
tadcf (ead2bd) — 2/7/2012 @ 8:56 amhttp://www.bradblog.com/?p=9105
🙄 Please kill yourself hypocrite.
Dohbiden (ef98f0) — 2/7/2012 @ 9:10 am“tadcf” hearts bradblog, and domestic terrorists.
JD (e6fe35) — 2/7/2012 @ 9:15 amVoter fraud by either party is totally unacceptable.
It’s time for Voter ID, so we can disenfranchise fake voters and restore some democracy.
And never forget the dozens of election fraud convictions ACORN was responsible.
since Brad Blog was mentioned, I am compelled to note that Brett Kimberlin has recently committed perjury. He has also already been convicted of perjury in the past. He also had his parole revoked because he refused to pay the family of the deceased victim of his bombings (eight bombs, btw). He’s also the subject of Citizen K, an amazing story about a drug running con artist who lies and lies and lies and lies. One of his pals forgives this as “wink, for the good guys” (the lies were about the GOP presidential ticket).
This person has a story to tell, oh what a story, about how he has been secretly exonerated for his violent crimes. He has a secret excuse for why this exoneration is not on the public records (his convictions are, instead) but boy, he promises he was secretly exonerated “and that’s all I can tell you about that”.
Why do I mention that? That’s Brad Blog’s partner, and the man behind velvet revolution.
I hope liberals and conservatives who find voter fraud outrageous recognize that such a noble cause should be be usurped by evil people.
BTW, what did y’all think of that Breaking Bad plotline where Walter launders his ill gotten cash with microtransactions to a charity? I thought it was oddly familiar.
Dustin (401f3a) — 2/7/2012 @ 9:40 amVideo removed as it disables comments.
I’m not sure that was exactly the cause of the problem. It was still here when I left a comment yesterday. And I still have to work on my remarks.
But every single person found by NBC2 must have had ID. They were people who got jury duty notices and returned them.
Sammy Finkelman (d3daeb) — 2/7/2012 @ 10:34 amWhat a great point!
The fact is that anyone lacking ID needs to get one, but this horde of voters lacking ID is a fiction.
Dustin (401f3a) — 2/7/2012 @ 10:36 amTadcf hearts Jeremiah Wright.
Dohbiden (ef98f0) — 2/7/2012 @ 11:20 amThis is why everyone should have to show an id to vote.
Comment by happyfeet — 2/6/2012 @ 10:46 am
— Democrats show an “id”; Republicans show an “ego”.
[Ahh, Freud jokes. That one killed ’em at the analyst’s convention.]
Icy (83a940) — 2/7/2012 @ 1:29 pm6. Greetings:
So, can we call illegal immigration a “gateway” crime now ???
Comment by 11B40 — 2/6/2012 @ 10:49 am
— Greetings!
Yes, you may.
Icy (83a940) — 2/7/2012 @ 1:31 pmPersonally, I think that only people with ID and who can answer questions about politics to the level of “Schoolhouse Rocks” should be allowed to vote.
— IOW, you want only LEGAL immigrants, who (unlike public school graduates) are required to learn these things in order to obtain citizenship, to be allowed to vote.
I choose Craig Ferguson as my designated elector!
Icy (83a940) — 2/7/2012 @ 1:37 pmI don’t see how they can have faith in the votings if we have non-citizens voting all willy nilly
— True . . . it’s bad enough that citizens vote all willy-nilly.
Icy (83a940) — 2/7/2012 @ 1:40 pmThat said, the GOP has no credibility on this because of its shameful conduct in VA, violating the constitution to keep the process changing and complex, with predictable anti-outsider results (As intended, I assume).
— The GOP violated the Constitution of the Commonwealth of Virginia? Quick, somebody call the AG!
Icy (83a940) — 2/7/2012 @ 1:44 pm16. Did crappyfete call us racist?
Comment by Dohbiden — 2/6/2012 @ 11:54 am
— No, just you. Try not to get all butt-hurt about it.
Icy (83a940) — 2/7/2012 @ 1:45 pmI also couldn’t save a comment. I didn’t knowq where the problem was.
No problem really, as it gives me a chance to revise and extend my remarks (I saved them)
— Problem.
Icy (83a940) — 2/7/2012 @ 1:47 pmIf you can reason it out, what do you need faith for?
— The NEA should sell T-shirts bearing that slogan.
Icy (83a940) — 2/7/2012 @ 1:55 pmTrue the vote found lots of instances of six or more people registered to these vacant lots in Sheila Jackson Lee‘s district…
— And they all receive guvmint benefit checks.
Icy (83a940) — 2/7/2012 @ 1:59 pm37. illegals voting for liberals….
they’re just doing the j*bs Americans don’t want to do.
Comment by redc1c4 — 2/6/2012 @ 11:56 pm
— Thread winner!
Icy (83a940) — 2/7/2012 @ 2:02 pm39. Here’s an even better story: INDIANA’S GOP SECRETARY OF STATE GUILTY OF THREE COUNTS OF FELONY VOTER FRAUD
Comment by tadcf — 2/7/2012 @ 8:56 am
— Careful, dude! You might have just trapped yourself in one of those Catch-22 thingies, wherein you will have to admit that voter fraud actually exists. Your advocation FOR voter ID laws will commence in 3 … 2 … 1 …..
Icy (83a940) — 2/7/2012 @ 2:05 pmIf I were to look at this dispassionately, maybe I’d say it was worth it, but I don’t look at it that way.
— Clarity, at last!
Newt is SO the candidate for you.
Icy (83a940) — 2/7/2012 @ 2:06 pmI think you’ve got a point there.
Voter fraud is wrong no matter who does it. Everyone should be in favor of some common sense reforms like voter ID and strict prosecution of anybody who breaks the faith of the Republic.
I do want to explain something about Charlie White (this indiana sec state) did.
He lied about where he lives while campaigning for a statewide office. He did not lie about what state he lives in, either.
He did not stuff ballot boxes. He did not destroy ballots. He did not falsify a bunch of registrations. He lied about what part of Indiana he’s living in.
He committed perjury, a serious crime, and he deserves to pay the penalty for that. A real penalty.
But comparing this to Voter ID laws, as has been the norm from the left, is pretty much bonkers.
Dustin (401f3a) — 2/7/2012 @ 2:11 pmI don’t understand how that relates to my point, which was that there is a case to be made that smear artists having more power to smear in this age is worth the advantages the information age brings, but because I know the people being smeared lately, I cannot take such a long and dispassionate view.
newt actually is only someone I’m settling for, and I’ve been upfront about his limitations, as well as why Romney is inferior for the priorities I have. Replacing Obama is not as important to be as balancing the budget, and the last time we balanced the budget, a democrat was the president, but he faced a GOP that lost a presidential election because the conservatives refused to unify.
It actually worked out BETTER that the GOP lost, since my priority is results rather than winning the white house. At least if we confine the discussion to reform on spending.
It’s a lot more complicated than that, but I don’t think you’re really doing my arguments justice to combine them.
Dustin (401f3a) — 2/7/2012 @ 2:14 pmBut frankly, for some time I’ve granted that there is no truly good choice left. Good people will reject any of these three for good reasons, none of them measure up, and that’s just the way it is.
I do have a very strong view that Romney is the wrong guy, but I don’t pretend there is some Mr Wonderful to replace him with. It comes down to what we’re willing to compromise.
for me, in this primary at least, I will not compromise that the nominee I support must be a reformer who can win fights against democrats. There’s no reason to leave this hill, because if we don’t do that, I don’t think the rest of this presidential election matters nearly as much.
Dustin (401f3a) — 2/7/2012 @ 2:20 pmIt comes down to what we’re willing to compromise
— It ALWAYS does.
Icy (83a940) — 2/7/2012 @ 2:52 pmKing of the Ant Hill.
Colonel Haiku (a3006f) — 2/7/2012 @ 2:55 pmPatience, Icy. When all else fails, there’s always that well-worn 2X4.
Colonel Haiku (a3006f) — 2/7/2012 @ 2:57 pmIcy was dropped on his head when he was a baby.
Dohbiden (ef98f0) — 2/7/2012 @ 3:04 pmDustin, I was trying to make the point, respectfully, that when it comes to the issue of “smears” you might be allowing your passion to outweigh a sense of pragmatism about it.
When confronted by smears, George W. Bush was/is pragmatic. Newt is not.
Modern technology spreads the rumors, innuendos, etc. faster and wider, but it’s still up to the individual to decide whether or not they believe it. As Craig Ferguson says (two cites in one thread!) “If it’s on the Internet it MUST be true!” Unfortunately, his sarcasm is lost on too many uneducated idiots, but that’s the way of the world.
Icy (83a940) — 2/7/2012 @ 3:05 pmAnd I’ve always said that. But the GOP was useful in the 1990s only because Conservatives drew a line in the sand and said “no farther”. and guess who wound up compromising? The liberals.
Dustin (401f3a) — 2/7/2012 @ 3:08 pmHomer: D’oh!!!
Icy (83a940) — 2/7/2012 @ 3:11 pmLisa: A deer!
Marge: A female deer!
No disrespect was taken.
Interesting comparison. For the most part, you’re right, though I question whether Dubya’s approach worked, long term, given where we are right now. (of course, Newt’s approach led here too, in a real way).
Oh. Now I get where you’re coming from. Point taken. I do think my view of Romney is pretty accurate, but there is a lot of static out there. The fact is, I don’t like either of these guys very much, and I think there are really good reasons for this, yet I have to pick someone and I do hope Obama loses his reelection.
I also am not too intense about that part, because I think the GOP is really screwed up.
Dustin (401f3a) — 2/7/2012 @ 3:11 pmI agree that the GOP is screwed up. In my case, this is why — despite being solidly conservative in my views — I have barely even considered joining the Republican Party.
Registered Independent for life!!!
[There might be a pun/double meaning there.]
Icy (83a940) — 2/7/2012 @ 3:24 pmContraception is not in the constitution arsewipes.
Dohbiden (ef98f0) — 2/7/2012 @ 3:36 pmThanks, Icy, for endeavoring to have a productive conversation, which takes effort and is valuable to the conservative cause, in my opinion.
Dustin (401f3a) — 2/7/2012 @ 3:41 pmIcy: “Endeavoring to Persevere”.
Colonel Haiku (a3006f) — 2/7/2012 @ 3:43 pmIcy:I took an arrow to my romney.
Colonel Haiku:It’s ladies night and the feelings right.
Icy:Let’s go get drunk and eat potato sandwiches.
Dohbiden (ef98f0) — 2/7/2012 @ 3:48 pmSurely being registered as a Republican is the only way to have even a tiny impact on which way the party goes. Unless you live in one of those states that lets just anybody vote in primaries/caucuses.
Milhouse (9a4c23) — 2/7/2012 @ 7:30 pmArizona does not allow it, but I’m not registering “Republican” just for the sake of voting in the primary. Most conservatives are Republican . . . are most Republicans conservative? Don’t think so. I agree with most of the GOP platform, and can be relied upon to vote for their chosen candidate in the general.
I gave money to “Meghan’s daddy” last time out. How many party members did the same?
Icy (83a940) — 2/7/2012 @ 7:41 pmI gave him money after the NYT did the phony mistress smear piece
which, I don’t know what got into me
happyfeet (3c92a1) — 2/7/2012 @ 7:45 pmThe title of this post is a bit misleading. The term “illegals” is usually used to mean “illegal immigrant”, not “illegal (i.e. ineligible) voter”. Perhaps Patterico thought that since the context is voting, people would understand. But apparently several commenters here did not. Colonel Haiku and 11B40, for instance, seem to have thought illegal aliens had something to do with the topic. But the aliens in this story all seem to be perfectly legal, and legitimately have all the ID one could ever ask for. Which leads me to another point.
Happyfeet wrote, “This is why everyone should have to show an id to vote”. And I agree, but the point isn’t as obvious as it might appear. As Sammy pointed out, these particular aliens have proper ID, which means that if they actually voted then no ID requirement would have prevented them. It would seem, then, that this story does not bolster the case for requiring ID, and perhaps even could be said to damage it. Certainly using this story as ammunition for the cause of voter ID, without understanding the reason, can only help the other side, since if challenged one will look silly.
Nevertheless, I think this story does support the case for voter ID, because I don’t believe that all these aliens actually voted. Several of them explicitly denied having done so. Now of course they could be lying. Any alien who perjures himself in order to register to vote, and then knowingly casts an illegal vote, would surely not cavil at lying to a reporter. Lying to the press is not a crime, and is often not even unethical. So why do I believe them in this instance? Because what I think is really going on is that someone else registered these people without their knowledge, and votes in their names; since they don’t know they’re on the rolls they never show up to vote, and so never discover that they’re listed as having already voted. For electoral purposes they may as well be dead. Better, since the fraud is less likely to be discovered. And if that is indeed what’s happening, then an ID requirement would prevent it.
Milhouse (9a4c23) — 2/7/2012 @ 7:46 pmNo. Which is all the more reason to register Republican, so you can vote for the candidates who are decent and against the ones who are not. If most candidates were acceptable then your primary vote would not be needed.
Milhouse (9a4c23) — 2/7/2012 @ 7:48 pmwhich, I don’t know what got into me
— You know what got into you . . . or, rather, “who”
Icy (83a940) — 2/7/2012 @ 7:50 pmThat’s a good argument, Milhouse. I’ll consider it.
Icy (83a940) — 2/7/2012 @ 7:56 pmHere’s a good reminder on why you should register as a Republican!… my eyes!!!!!!!!!!
http://l.yimg.com/bt/api/res/1.2/cc4SZUvmccK575WMSqSpcw–/YXBwaWQ9eW5ld3M7Zmk9aW5zZXQ7aD02MTI7cT04NTt3PTM5NA–/http://media.zenfs.com/en_us/News/ap_webfeeds/b40b073da20f5603060f6a706700a971.jpg
Colonel Haiku (682705) — 2/9/2012 @ 5:33 amMajor thankies for the article. Want more.
Eleanor Hoang (a6845d) — 2/19/2012 @ 1:17 am