Sockpuppet Friday (UAW Bailout Fact-Checking Edition)
[Posted by Karl]
As usual, you are positively encouraged to engage in sockpuppetry in this thread. The usual rules apply.
Please, be sure to switch back to your regular handle when commenting on other threads. I have made that mistake myself.
And remember: the worst sin you can commit on this thread is not being funny.
—
Yesterday, WaPo “fact checker,” Glenn Kessler, evaluated Pres. Obama’s claim that “some wanted to let the auto industry die.” After wryly noting that Obama has “a fondness for using rhetorical straw men in his speeches,” he awards the president a mere two Pinocchios.
Kessler somehow manages to get through the column without mentioning the Ford Motor Company, which afaik is part of the auto industry. Nor does he mention the other members of the auto industry aside from GM and Chrysler who manufacture and otherwise employ folks here in the US. Granted, we tend to think of a company like Toyota as “foreign,” but Chrysler was sold to Fiat, so the nationalism card should not be in play from a fact-checking standpoint.
Indeed, Kessler also writes “a credible case can be made that an auto industry bankruptcy likely would not have been possible in November or December of 2008 (when Romney and other Republicans pushed for it) because there was no bank financing available.” If we want to talk about “cases,” a case can be made that a regular bankruptcy would have yielded about the same number of continuing jobs at GM as the taxpayer-funded bankruptcy. And a case easily could be made that a GOP administration could have come up with a bankruptcy deal that would have looked a lot more like a normal proceeding than a politicially-motivated bailout of the United Auto Workers. But a “case” is not a fact.
In short, it’s another example of Kessler, like other establishment media operations, pretending political debates are much simpler questions of fact. And this is a particularly bad example of the genre:
Okay, out of 300 million Americans, maybe there were “some folks” who felt the auto industry should die. But Obama appeared to be suggesting that GOP lawmakers were willing to let the auto industry collapse. On that basis, the evidence is not very strong. The quotes we received — and others we researched — were mostly questions of tactics.
As the administration’s internal debate suggests, the answers were not clear. Certainly, some top administration officials thought at least one car company should die.
From the left, I can argue that Kessler concedes the vague “some” is almost undoubtedly true, meriting no Pinocchios. From the right, I can note that Kessler came up with zero examples of Obama’s GOP critics wanting the US auto industry to die, which is the politically salient claim. Indeed, Kessler notes the GOP’s real problem was with the UAW, while largely avoiding the fact that the Obama adminsitration’s maneuver here was mostly about bailing out the UAW’s unsustainable pension and healthcare benefits.
As Kessler seems bent on keeping this up, it is again time to note the WaPo fact-checker blog was on hiatus from the last day of the 2008 election campaign through January 9, 2011. When the federal government was run entirely by a supermajority of Democrats, there was no need for fact-checking. In an election year, there is a demand for media spin of Obama’s rhetoric.
–Karl
Ding!
Karl (8cdbad) — 2/3/2012 @ 7:23 amMiss me now?
Jimmy Hoffa (1c9631) — 2/3/2012 @ 7:29 amKessler’s cluelessness is a bug not a feature
http://www.mtholyoke.edu/acad/intrel/bush/kessler.htm
john studebacher (87e966) — 2/3/2012 @ 7:34 amI’m gonna be the worlds number 1 Romney fluffer and that is final.
Daleykos (ef98f0) — 2/3/2012 @ 7:42 amI’m going to get married three times so I can be like my hero Newt.
DullBiden (1129cb) — 2/3/2012 @ 8:14 amFor GM to survive the UAW has to die. Good luck for Chrysler in getting their next bailout from the italian government.
cubanbob (ad2274) — 2/3/2012 @ 8:31 amI still think Chrysler should have died. If that had happened a year earlier, GM might not have had to be bailed out. Why we subsidized a foreign takeover is beyond me.
Also, why does Obama so hate white-collar workers to have screwed them over so badly in the bailout?
Kevin M (563f77) — 2/3/2012 @ 8:32 amYou just hate capitalism, M.
Icy (563f77) — 2/3/2012 @ 8:33 amAnd you’re racist.
Brother Bradley J. Fikes, C.O.R. (1129cb) — 2/3/2012 @ 8:40 amI’m gonna get married 100,000,000 times so I can be better than Nazi Newt.
Daleykos (ef98f0) — 2/3/2012 @ 8:40 amKeep up the good work!
Gary Johnson (1129cb) — 2/3/2012 @ 8:42 amDear xxxxxx,
At a time when we need to be focusing on creating jobs and growing the economy, partisan extremists in Richmond have a very different agenda: right now they’re ramming through a series of bills that are deliberately designed to disenfranchise Virginia voters. If passed, these measures will make it much harder for many minorities, seniors, low-income populations, [dead,] and disabled Virginians to cast their ballots.
It’s a page that comes straight from Karl Rove’s playbook in the 2000 Presidential election – and it’s outrageous. People died for the right to vote in this country, and we have to protect it [for all dead people].
I’m asking for your help to put the pressure on our legislators and our Governor. We need to make our voices heard before it’s too late.
Click here to sign the petition and tell your representatives that we need to stop this assault on voting rights.
One of the reasons I got involved in politics is that I love getting people engaged in the democratic process. The only way our system works is if we make sure people aren’t denied a chance to participate. That’s just one of the reasons that in the wake of the problems we saw in Florida during the 2000 election, I founded the Voting Rights Institute when I served as chair of the Democratic Party – so we could take action against intimidation [against Democrats], election errors [against Democrats], and disenfranchisement [of Democratic votes].
Voter suppression wasn’t right in 2000 [even though we tried hard] and we cannot allow it to happen again. There is just too much [pilaging] on the line.
It’s time to stand up and speak out for the rights of all Virginians [dead and alive] to exercise their fundamental right to vote.
Click here to add your voice right now by signing the petition – and then ask 5 friends to do the same. {And so on, and so on, …]
Thanks for your help
Terry
[P.S. Pay no attention to Crawford v. Marion County Election Board, 553 U.S. 181 (2008). In a 6-3 decision in 2008, the Supreme Court upheld the constitutionality of the photo ID requirement, finding it closely related to Indiana’s legitimate state interest in preventing voter fraud, modernizing elections, and safeguarding voter confidence. ]
Ronald (d1c681) — 2/3/2012 @ 8:45 am“I was against Romneycare before I was for it.”
(Coulter thought bubble: “That sounds so familiar. Where did I hear that before?”)
Ann Coulter-rabid columnist (7051ab) — 2/3/2012 @ 8:47 amhttp://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/right-turn/post/romney-a-wild-week/2012/02/02/gIQAvEualQ_blog.html
john studebacher (87e966) — 2/3/2012 @ 8:48 amEWhat could possibly go wrong;
http://www.miamiherald.com/2012/02/03/2622773/muslim-groups-plan-rally-after.html
john delorean (87e966) — 2/3/2012 @ 9:10 amDo I know you guys?
John Bigboote (563f77) — 2/3/2012 @ 9:48 amYes, I remember you.
john Smallberry (87e966) — 2/3/2012 @ 9:50 amGive me back my overthrustor Bigboote
SPQR (26be8b) — 2/3/2012 @ 9:51 amI’m going to get married three times so I can be like my hero Newt.
Comment by DullBiden — 2/3/2012 @ 8:14 am
Can you marry your mom three times?
Law-checker (dbb3da) — 2/3/2012 @ 10:15 amDid you see how Mitt had to spend SO much money in order to kick my ass in Florida?
I’m telling ya now, Obama would have to spend ALL of that billion-dollar war chest to beat me in the general. It’s on, baby!
Whooooo!!!
Somebody Neuter That Thing! (dbb3da) — 2/3/2012 @ 10:23 amWhat do you mean, “can you play Dueling Banjoes?”
Carville (dbb3da) — 2/3/2012 @ 10:25 amNow I must confess
Colonel Haiku (dbb3da) — 2/3/2012 @ 10:38 amBeen a Moby all along
Clever dick was right
I’m endorsing Mitt because he’s the candidate most like me.
Only, people don’t hate him.
Trumpet myself at every opportunity (dbb3da) — 2/3/2012 @ 10:41 amI said you were indistinguishable from a moby.
I have no way of knowing you’re one, but in a way it’s a compliment. If you’re trying to bash Republicans while making Romney support unpalatable, you’re doing a great job. If you’re actually trying to get folks to agree with you, you’re an idiot.
Oh, but you already admitted you do not intend to persuade anyone here. So you’re here, dropping insults and attacks, but not intending to persuade anyone to favor Romney.
Why is that? It’s indistinguishable from a moby’s behavior. There is insufficient circumstantial evidence of more, but I don’t care.
Why did you say “Always remember to never forget, sock, that even though he hails from Texas, his real heritage is Middle Eastern. And if they’re not kept under your boot, they’re at your throat.” and “prawn of arab loins”?
That’s not something I hear from conservatives. It is, however, very Killgore Trout.
Dustin (401f3a) — 2/3/2012 @ 10:42 amPublishing a story about Mormons on the same day that the President stood up at the National Prayer Breakfast and declared that God wants us to pay higher taxes is just a coinky-dink.
Really.
Please believe us!
Politico (dbb3da) — 2/3/2012 @ 10:45 amI’ve met Kilgore Trout, and that’s not what he’s like at all.
Phil Farmer (dbb3da) — 2/3/2012 @ 10:49 amCease & desist!
Vonnegut (dbb3da) — 2/3/2012 @ 10:49 am‘Surely you can’t be serious’
ted stryker (87e966) — 2/3/2012 @ 10:49 amI knew Bigboote, too.
John Smith (563f77) — 2/3/2012 @ 10:52 amOkay, we confess! They threatened to pull the Internet kill-switch on us if we didn’t run the story.
BTW, did you know that Lawrence O’Donnell has been secretly named the Cult-Watcher Czar? Us either!
Politico (dbb3da) — 2/3/2012 @ 10:54 amLike shooting prawns in a barrel . . .
4th wall code-breaker (dbb3da) — 2/3/2012 @ 10:56 amHi folks, Rachel Maddow here. Did you see what I did on my show last night? No? Well then let me tell you: I did this cool hit-piece on Rick Santorum which I began by stating that he has no chance of winning the nomination, but I’m gonna bash him as an uncompassionate Chritian anyway. I even said — well, not directly, but I wasn’t exactly subtle about it — that this hit piece was in revenge for conservatives DARING to criticize the President’s ‘God wants you to pay more taxes’ comments from earlier in the day.
So I played a clip of Santorum at a town hall where a woman basically asked him why we don’t have socialized medicine, and he backed his masters: the drug companies. And I spun it and attacked not just his words but his gestures and facial expressions as well. And then I interviewed E.J. Dionne, and he said “God bless you,” to which I said “gesundheit” (because I am both funny AND disrespectful that way) and then he said “Amen,” which made me giggle like the petty, little lesbo atheist schoolgirl that I — at the very core of my being — am.
Whee! I have my own tv show!
Clever Dickette (dbb3da) — 2/3/2012 @ 11:17 amMy PhD proves that snarky nasty socialists are so much smarter than you racist troglodytic mouth breathing knuckle dragging spaghetti monster in the sky worshipping godbotherers.
Rachel MadCow (47c02a) — 2/3/2012 @ 11:20 amI did NOT resign in disgrace!
But, well . . . they didn’t want me to be Speaker anymore, so I told them, “Screw you guys, I’m taking my trophy intern and going home!”
Well, not really ‘home’. I mean, I couldn’t bloody well take me mistress to me home, could I?
Told my daughters all about it.
Had to tell one of them separately. Turned out the first time it was one daughter and Callista in the room.
Hey, the lighting was poor and I didn’t have my glasses, okay?
Leroy Cartman (dbb3da) — 2/3/2012 @ 12:08 pmOK, guys–what else can we do today to make Our Guy look utterly incompetent to go along with the egomania, personal issues, and general antipathy a majority of the public has for him that we already have to deal with? Don’t be shy–sky’s the limit!
Newt Gingrich's Campaign Team (0dffce) — 2/3/2012 @ 12:18 pmOkay, you got me,
Colonel Haiku (dbb3da) — 2/3/2012 @ 1:01 pmI’m a Moby AND a troll;
I multitask, dude!
Watch out, Ricky. You have a google problem, and we are coming after you next. With haikus.
Romney (318f81) — 2/3/2012 @ 1:07 pmMmmmm . . . pond scum! *drool*
Homer Gulrud (dbb3da) — 2/3/2012 @ 1:21 pmWe were going to demonstrate our union strength and disrupt the super bowl in Indy. However, after a member headcount (given that the steel mills and auto parts plants have shut due to being uncompetative), there are no burly union people left. The only members avalable are government desk jockeys. So we will just pass out a few leaflets instead.
Nancu Guyott, IN AFL-CIO (edf506) — 2/3/2012 @ 1:49 pmPP is an abortion racket.
🙄 no doubt the baby killers will be elated that they can kill their babies.
Dohbiden (ef98f0) — 2/3/2012 @ 2:31 pmNotice how Abortion is called women’s health because those inferiors are causing women to be so unhealthy to the left.
Dohbiden (ef98f0) — 2/3/2012 @ 2:32 pmKarl, I’m sure someone else has pointed out that there was a Republican in the White House at that time. Granted, Bush was a lame duck, but Obama didn’t take office until January 20th.
Chuck Bartowski (8bd0b3) — 2/3/2012 @ 4:07 pmChuck,
There was not a Republican in the White House past January 2009. The fact checking hiatus extended to the swearing in of the GOP House in 2011.
Karl (8cdbad) — 2/3/2012 @ 4:19 pmLet me take a moment to thank all of you jews and catholics who voted for me last election. I know you will do it again in November no matter what I do sooo….
Obamaman (a1fcca) — 2/3/2012 @ 5:14 pmThanks, suckas!!
Oh, and by the way, anyone who would vote against me is a racist pig.
Obamaman (a1fcca) — 2/3/2012 @ 5:16 pmSo we caved after the nasty letter from PP. So what? Everyone does it, right? Right?
Susan G. Komen Foundation (8aabf0) — 2/3/2012 @ 5:21 pmOk Komen Foundation, bend over and squeel like a pig.
Planned Parenthood (a1fcca) — 2/3/2012 @ 6:04 pmTeh true finns are waaaaaaaaaaaaaacist right-wingers.
Charles Johnson (ef98f0) — 2/3/2012 @ 6:06 pmAny woman who has a problem with going to Planned Parenthood OUGHT to get cancer!
Nancy Peloma (563f77) — 2/3/2012 @ 7:58 pmNew slogans:
Susan G. Komen Foundation (dbb3da) — 2/3/2012 @ 9:22 pm“Race for the cure, run from the hate mail”
“Boldly saving women’s lives so they can end the lives of their children”
“Boobies YES, Babies NO!”
China is the place to be
Chairman Mao (44de53) — 2/4/2012 @ 2:47 amKilling babies is the life of glee
No more girls just us guys
Baby killers full of pride
You have to admit that my new “Bond female villan” look fits in quite well with the Obama administration. No more Miss Nice Girl! Time to go beat up the Isrealies.
Hillary Clinton (a1fcca) — 2/4/2012 @ 2:58 amThank goodness 1.2 million people dropped out of the job market, otherwise who knows what the unemployment rate would be?
Ofoodstamp sycophant (721840) — 2/4/2012 @ 9:36 am