Patterico's Pontifications


Climategate II: Like Jaws II or The Wrath of Khan?

Filed under: General — Aaron Worthing @ 11:19 am

[Guest post by Aaron Worthing.  Follow me by Twitter @AaronWorthing.]

I can’t post on this in detail right now, but there has been a new dump of apparently real emails taken from various Global Warm-mongers.

Of course a reasonable question can be raised about whether they are genuine, but I think the evidence Watts Up With That? has gathered is getting reasonably strong.  It mainly amounts to dogs not barking when you would expect them to, but I am provisionally convinced.

Expect the next spin to be “but these are stolen!”  Which is irrelevant.  We are not the police who are forbidden from considering ill-gotten evidence.  As long as the method of obtaining the evidence doesn’t compromise its veracity, it doesn’t matter.

Next expect people to try to claim it is not saying what it plainly says.  Mind you, sometimes I think there is truth to that.  Like the word “trick” in the infamous phrase “nature trick” may very well have been used to describe a way of fooling the computer into doing what you wanted it to, rather than an attempt to deceive any human being.  But you can’t explain away the phrase “hide the decline.”  There should not be any hiding of anything in science.

And related, people will say that it doesn’t really reveal very much.  Which means we all need to dig in and see what it does reveal.

So time will tell whether this will be a good sequel (Superman II) or a bad one (Superman III and IV).  In the meantime pull up with a bag of popcorn and enjoy the fireworks.

[Posted and authored by Aaron Worthing.]

106 Responses to “Climategate II: Like Jaws II or The Wrath of Khan?”

  1. What it does is further confirm what we already knew … that the hockey stick team knew how dishonest their work was, how they are manipulating and corrupting the scientific procee and discrediting the AGW hypothesis.

    SPQR (d54ee3)

  2. Why the deliberate drip,drip here?

    Your link leads to this link:

    Sammy Finkelman (d3daeb)

  3. Sammy

    i am giving watts the traffic, such as it is, because he has worked so hard on this and knows so much.

    > Why the deliberate drip,drip here?

    I think it is for the same reason that breitbart/o’keefe did with Acorn. they know they have the dirt on them and they want to maximize the damage.

    Aaron Worthing (e7d72e)

  4. B-but teh science is settled.

    /Charles ”Meatballs” Johnson

    DohBiden (ef98f0)

  5. If Joe had to go at PSU, why not Mann? It’s for the children, after all.

    dfbaskwill (ca54bb)

  6. Climategate II: Eclectic Bugaboo

    malclave (4f3ec1)

  7. Climategate II like a fraud or the biggest ponzi scheme ever.

    Seems like a better headline but who am I to judge?

    DohBiden (ef98f0)

  8. WikiLeaks, and how that info was accepted by the Left, has put (or should have) the stake through the heart of the “But, it’s stolen” defense.

    AD-RtR/OS! (031141)

  9. Not “defense”, but “deflection”.

    AD-RtR/OS! (031141)

  10. 😆

    DohBiden (ef98f0)

  11. AD at #8: excellent point.

    Aaron Worthing (e7d72e)

  12. Deniers!!!!

    JD (62da1e)

  13. Wikileaks………I thought that was a name of a drink that how helps you go pee.

    DohBiden (ef98f0)

  14. I take pride in denial.
    Sunday, it was miserable and raining.
    Yesterday, it was just cold…and miserable.
    Today, the Sun is out and it might get into the high-60’s.
    I’ll settle for a day or two of Global Warming, especially since they say another storm is due this weekend courtesy of Sarah Palin
    (she is responsible for whatever happens in Alaska, isn’t she?).

    AD-RtR/OS! (031141)

  15. This post is not helping teh cause.

    The science is settled if you ignore the science.

    daleyrocks (bf33e9)

  16. “I thought that was a name of a drink that how helps you go pee.”

    Doh – I think that’s winkieleaks.

    daleyrocks (bf33e9)

  17. Heh.

    DohBiden (ef98f0)

  18. Hide the Decline!!!

    /Chuckie Meatballs

    DohBiden (ef98f0)

  19. Obama-Raising taxes is evil except when their raised on the rich

    Sheeple-I agree yayness.

    DohBiden (ef98f0)

  20. There are a lot of very cynical cynics commenting here today. Just sayin’.

    elissa (70e5de)

  21. Were the documents stolen? I thought they were acquired via something akin to the FOIA in the UK?

    n0mad (a8146b)

  22. This is apparently what East Anglia is now setting into motion as their official response(observant readers will recall this as a rehash of their response to the original leaked emails):

    1) These were hacked from our server — for shame!

    2) Hey, come to think of it, we can’t validate the authenticity of these emails.

    3) If they are authenticated, they don’t really say what you think they say; you just don’t understand the various intricate nuances of climate science.

    I note that the response already has the preemptive “this has been thoroughly studied and every respectable climate scientist agrees with the data” meme front and center. Doesn’t that sound a bit like “the entire Penn State football coaching staff agrees that this is a witch hunt”?

    JVW (4d72aa)

  23. The CPUSA must approve of mother Gaia boiling peope alive for their treachery.

    Too bad the CPUSA is not illegal.

    DohBiden (ef98f0)

  24. The 6 separate investigations into the original climategate found no scientific fraud or misconduct, but did criticize them for their lack of transparency and ‘bunker mentality.’ I wonder what more leaked emails will do for this tendency.

    carlitos (49ef9f)

  25. carlitos

    those investigations were a plain whitewash. those charts were of massaged and missing data. we know that as a fact. that is misconduct per se.

    Aaron Worthing (e7d72e)

  26. carlitos, get serious. “Investigations”?

    SPQR (26be8b)

  27. Yes the BBC for instance doesn’t reveal Roger Harrabin’s receipts of tens of thousands from the said unit, but they were very circumspect about which emails they examined, sort of the Attorney
    General’s report on ACORN, which ‘unexpectedly’
    chipped in to the Gubernatorial race,

    narciso (ef1619)

  28. Comment by SPQR — 11/22/2011 @ 2:33 pm

    Well, they sent Phil Jones an email asking him if his research was accurate, and he replied: Yep!
    Then they emailed Michael Mann, and his reply was: What he said!

    What more evidence do you need?

    Case Closed.

    AD-RtR/OS! (031141)

  29. You skeptards are not Helping The Cause!

    Mitch (341ca0)

  30. America is no longer the kind of country what can take the lead on a big project like changing an entire planet’s climate

    it can’t even pass a budget for christ’s sake

    happyfeet (a55ba0)

  31. We could nuke the polar ice caps, that would be a start, cheer up, pikachu.

    narciso (ef1619)

  32. feets, good point on priorities.

    carlitos (49ef9f)

  33. It is a wee bit unfortunate that one of the six investigations was conducted by Penn State. 🙂

    carlitos (49ef9f)

  34. Yep, carlitos, and it will be interesting to see what falls out from Chris Horner’s lawsuit demanding FOIA from Mann’s email acct.

    SPQR (26be8b)

  35. Why would they have credibility issues,

    narciso (ef1619)

  36. Anthony Watt excerpts an email where Michael Mann discusses smearing McIntyre with his “unexplored fossil fuel connections” … meanwhile we learned recently that James Hansen is making millions of dollars hawking AGW.

    SPQR (26be8b)

  37. 🙄 Michael is not a mann.


    DohBiden (ef98f0)

  38. Hansen making “millions” is a stretch. On his 2010 financial disclosure report, he’s got exactly one item that that’s over $100k in income, the “blue planet prize.”

    carlitos (49ef9f)

  39. SPQR #36 – why do you think that Mann gets on so well with the Projective Party (aka the Dems) ?

    Alasdair (ea7ef3)

  40. SHOCKA!!!

    DohBiden (ef98f0)

  41. Maybe some year Louis Freeh will get to investigate mann, after he finishes with sandusky, etc.

    MD in Philly (3d3f72)

  42. If only.

    DohBiden (ef98f0)

  43. Sandusky could turn out to be the “Valery Plame” investigation of PA-ST;
    long after everyone has a pretty good idea at what happened, the investigation will drag on and on.
    They’ll probably dig up some incriminating emails connecting it to Santorum:
    I mean, you can’t have a scandal if it isn’t connected to a GOP Pol., can you?

    AD-RtR/OS! (031141)

  44. Hi narciso. “More than a million” doesn’t equal “millions” in my book.

    The only thing in your link that doesn’t jibe with what I posted was the Sophie Prize. Was that 2010 for sure? If so, it’s a big omission from his disclosure form.

    carlitos (49ef9f)

  45. We’re not focusing on just one year, the Don David
    prize was just as much.

    narciso (ef1619)

  46. Plus, carlitos, he has failed to disclose his travel and lodging expenses that were paid by outside groups.
    Any bets on whether he travels Economy, and stays at Motel-6?

    AD-RtR/OS! (031141)

  47. If he failed to disclose it, that’s bad. Mrs. carlito got used to sitting up front in the plane, and if you’re crossing an ocean, it’s the way to go. So, I’m not holding that against anyone.

    But, given that the vast majority of scientists, most notably climatologists, believe that man is warming the planet, I just have to wonder.

    What’s more likely? A vast conspiracy of the entire global scientific establishment? Or that AGW is real.

    carlitos (49ef9f)

  48. science by consensus, that worked for a while, till Galileo,

    narciso (ef1619)

  49. carlitos #48 – even more likely is a petty-spirited projective coincidental consensus of statist control-freaks – who just happen to believe that Anthropogenic Global Cooling{oops}WarmingClimate Change is a Serious Threat To Which Our Government Must Respond Quickly And Forcefully ! (for the children, dontchaknow)

    Alasdair (ea7ef3)

  50. de verdad, que no se que mas se tiene hay por decir
    (Really, what else is there to be said)

    narciso (ef1619)

  51. “The 6 separate investigations into the original climategate found no scientific fraud or misconduct”

    Heh. Those “investigations, were they the ones that did not include any investigators or witnesses skeptical of the AGW theories?

    Badges, we don’t need no stinking badges, Move along. Delete your files.

    daleyrocks (bf33e9)

  52. Interestingly, many of the “climate scientists” are not climate scientists:

    Dr. James E. Hansen

    Affiliation: National Aeronautics and Space Administration

    NASA Goddard Institute for Space Studies


    B.A., Physics and Mathematics, 1963, University of Iowa
    M.S., Astronomy, 1965, University of Iowa
    Ph.D., Physics, 1967, University of Iowa

    Is there a “Climate Scientist” (hard, not Arts) degree program somewhere?

    They all seem to be like this from

    The need for professionals who understand the links between climate and society is acute, and grows ever more so as human activity alters the global atmosphere. The Columbia M.A. in Climate and Society gives you the knowledge and skills to meet this need.

    Columbia University is home to leading researchers in the fields of climate change, climate prediction, and earth and atmospheric sciences. We have unparalleled experience in training policymakers, leaders, and thinkers in the heart of New York City, home to the United Nations and the seat of world politics.

    Not saying J.H. is dumb… But if you are going to argue from authority, it would be interesting where that “authority” derives.

    BfC (2ebea6)

  53. Daley, using your logic. Only non christians can inestigate catholic sexual molestation claims?

    carlitos (49ef9f)

  54. Carlitos – given their demonstrated track record, why would you trust them to investigate themselves? Why in the world would they get the benefit of the doubt?

    JD (10025c)

  55. BfC, given how often the AGW crowd attacks skeptics on their credentials, you make a good point.

    SPQR (26be8b)

  56. carlitos, why is it that you are behind the news on Hansen? Why snark at me, when you are in fact the one not following events?

    SPQR (26be8b)

  57. Hey spqr,

    It’s true that I’ m not following. I’m predisposed not to believe in conspiracy theories, so that’s my motivation. Will look into this further tomorrow.

    carlitos (49ef9f)

  58. carlitos, seriously guy, do you think I make things up?

    SPQR (26be8b)

  59. Hansen, has gone so far as to encourage violence against powerplants, and urge the delay if not canceling of the Keystone Pipeline, all as a NASA employee, he compares the latter to a heroin needle.

    narciso (ef1619)

  60. im”science settled”dw wil be along any minute to teach us all
    the error of our ways.

    Icy (61f618)

  61. Spqr, respectfully, if if i say that i’m going to look into something, that’s all it means. I won’t take your word or anyone else’s. I’m skeptical about this conspiracy theory, but i will look into it.




    carlitos (49ef9f)

  62. Hansen is a victim of a mccarthyesque witch hunt!!!Eleventyone!!!

    DohBiden (ef98f0)

  63. Frankly, what is coming from climate scientists would get the average engineer laughed out of the profession…

    Predigesting the data, then running the models (which are based on curve fitting history instead of fundamental physical/chemical/structural principles). And for civil engineering projects, and other engineering disciplines, there is the whole Professional Engineer Licensing scheme. With real legal consequences if something goes wrong with their work (building/bridge falls down, customer electrocuted, etc.).

    And we see what happens–It looks like a bunch of tenured professors in the sociology department at a Christmas dinner getting wasted on company time–with all of the poor behavior to boot.

    From Aaron’s original link:

    Best email till now, from Phil:

    Here are a few other thoughts. From looking at Climate Audit every few days, these people are not doing what I would call academic research. Also from looking they will not stop with the data, but will continue to ask for the original unadjusted data (which we don’t have) and then move onto the software used to produce the gridded datasets (the ones we do release).

    CRU is considered by the climate community as a data centre, but we don’t have any resources to undertake this work. Any work we have done in the pastis done on the back of the research grants we get – and has to be well hidden. I’ve discussed this with the main funder (US Dept of Energy) in the past and they are happy about not releasing the original station data.
    Some of you may not know, but the dataset has been sent by someone at the Met Office to McIntyre. The Met Office are trying to find out who did this. I’ve ascertained it most likely came from there, as I’m the only one who knows where the files are here.

    You ready to spend 10’s of trillions of dollars on what came out of that “academic research” Clown College?

    Go read the Climate gate 1.0 and 2.0 emails [again]… There are collusion and conspiracies all well documented (remember the controlling of who gets published in [what turned out to be worthless] peer reviewed articles?).

    Hell, even the wire, fuses, and integrated circuits that went into our products had 1,000x the pedigree (UL Listing/Traceability, Company Data Sheets which, when wrong, cost the vendor a whole bunch of money) of that sausage making machine called Climate Sciences.

    BfC (2ebea6)

  64. After listening to this global warming, AGW, climate change crap for more than 20 years — and not seeing any of the dire warnings come to pass — I can only come to one conclusion: Scientists have taken a hell of a lot of money and don’t want the cash cow to stop.

    I mean, I believe that the scientific method is valid. I have seen over the course of my life the wonderful things science has produced. I know science works.

    I simply cannot understand why scientists would squander the work of all scientists to promote a hypothesis as fact when the world as it works will eventually prove them wrong.

    They can’t win. Suckers may be born every day, but they grow up. When every year is the tipping point to disaster, after awhile, when the disaster doesn’t strike, people stop paying attention. They lose faith in the doomsayers.

    When all is said and done, how can we continue to respect what scientists say when they place politics before method?

    This is important — vitally important.

    Ag80 (ec45d6)

  65. Carlitos, the conspiracy is not vast; the vaunted consensus of scientists that you cite all rests on the word of a tiny group of people who all know each other and have already been proven to conspire together to lie to the public. All the other scientists who say they believe in AGW are relying on the data produced by this tiny group of conspirators. If you ask them how they know, they won’t tell you they researched it themselves, they’ll tell you they assume that there can’t be some vast conspiracy to lie about it…

    Milhouse (ea66e3)

  66. It’s not science, something more akin to alchemy, they take what is real cyclical patterns in climate, and then endeavor out of arrogance,
    to believe we have anything to do with it,

    narciso (ef1619)

  67. I think AG80 is exactly right.

    There are honest suckers in this scam, but it’s largely a scam. They just don’t want the gravy train to stop.

    It seems like a lot of these little scams are starting to blow up, and those still running them at this late date are forced to be extreme to squeeze a little bit more out before the party is over.

    how can we continue to respect what scientists say when they place politics before method?

    Well, this is healthy at least. We shouldn’t respect them for their authority as science. Either they can present their evidence in a way we can understand, test, and repeat, or we don’t believe them.

    No ivory tower PHD should get to just assert things. Society is learning that’s not a reliable type of source.

    Dustin (cb3719)

  68. “Daley, using your logic. Only non christians can inestigate catholic sexual molestation claims?”

    carlitos – Not really, just someone not in the inner circle where the alleged abuse occurred, but nice try.

    Let us know how the looking into thingy goes.

    daleyrocks (bf33e9)

  69. “the vaunted consensus of scientists that you cite all rests on the word of a tiny group of people who all know each other and have already been proven to conspire together to lie to the public. All the other scientists who say they believe in AGW are relying on the data produced by this tiny group of conspirators.”

    Milhouse – Exactly. A small incestuous core that created a huge gravy train for thousands.

    daleyrocks (bf33e9)

  70. Aren’t you all supposed to be prosecutors?

    We need charges that can be nailed to Micheal Mann’s heiny. Or any one of the other assholes featured in these emails.

    Is it not illegal to run scams against the public? Why is Berney Madoff in jail?

    These guys are 1,000 times the crook Madoff is.

    Here’s your evidence. Make the case, councilor.

    papertiger (e55ba0)

  71. Mass delusion is a scary phenomenon.

    MD in Philly (3d3f72)

  72. paper

    patrick is a prosecutor, but in cali. so i doubt he has jurisdiction and i have heard he works in the gang unit.

    and i am just a corporate counsel, a private civil attorney.

    But it raises a good point. you know if anyone in the AGW community wanted to, they could actually file what is known as a qui tam suit under the federal false claims act. And that could be REALLY lucrative to them.

    sadly we in the public can’t file the suit–it has to be a person who has access to info not available to the public at large. but if anyone who has non-public information on this hoax is reading this, you should talk to a lawyer. you could get very rich off of this (if everything works out).

    Aaron Worthing (e7d72e)

  73. he works in the gang unit

    some would say that is very appropriate. what universities are in his jurisdiction? USC? UCLA? anybody with AGW ties??

    As i said before, maybe louis freeh will go after mann after he finishes with the sandusky case…then again, maybe h— will freeze over before that investigation is finished…

    MD in Philly (3d3f72)

  74. Let us know how the looking into thingy goes.

    Comment by daleyrocks — 11/22/2011 @ 9:16 pm

    I have officially dropped this topic from “things I want to learn about” after some internet reading. My brain hurts. Apologies for any offense.

    carlitos (49ef9f)

  75. So Carlitos, what would you do?

    Ready to spend trillions of dollars based on the results of their research?

    BfC (2ebea6)

  76. Based on the new Climate Email Dump, Register UK:

    “I can’t overstate the HUGE amount of political interest in the project as a message that the Government can give on climate change to help them tell their story,” a civil servant wrote to Phil Jones in 2009. “They want the story to be a very strong one and don’t want to be made to look foolish.”

    “The science is being manipulated to put a political spin on it which for all our sakes might not be too clever in the long run,” laments one scientist, Peter Thorne. While Professor Jagadish Shukla, a lead IPCC author, IGES founder, and one of the most senior climate experts writes that, “It is inconceivable that policymakers will be willing to make billion-and trillion-dollar decisions for adaptation to the projected regional climate change based on models that do not even describe and simulate the processes that are the building blocks of climate variability.”

    To their credit, some of the climate scientists realised the dangers of the selective approach politicians demanded, which meant cherry-picking evidence to make it suitably dramatic, and quietly hiding caveats. “We need to communicate the uncertainty and be honest,” pleads Thorne, in another email from 2005. Thorne noted that a telltale “signature” of greenhouse gas warming was absent. “Observations do not show rising temperatures throughout the tropical troposphere unless you accept one single study and approach and discount a wealth of others. This is just downright dangerous.”

    BfC (2ebea6)

  77. “Apologies for any offense.”

    carlitos – Thanks, but not necessary. Some here have been following this crap pretty closely.

    Sorry if I came across as touchy.

    You want I should have a priest call you about the brain hurt? Heh.

    daleyrocks (bf33e9)

  78. hey daley,

    I can acerbic at times, but I like to acknowledge when I’m wrong (or at the least, ill-informed).

    Despite my current religious status, we still volunteer at a Catholic food pantry, and I will be seeing a few priests tomorrow. I’ll commune with them over a little wine, and all will be well. 🙂

    carlitos (49ef9f)

  79. “be” acerbic. And then some.

    carlitos (49ef9f)

  80. Is it not illegal to run scams against the public?


    Why is Berney Madoff in jail?

    Because he stole people’s money. Not because he lied to them.

    Milhouse (ea66e3)

  81. Wow! Cleanup on aisle 83. These spambots are getting vaguer and more generic all the time.

    Milhouse (ea66e3)

  82. Sorry, just illustrating how little science means to the likes of chris huhne.

    narciso (ef1619)

  83. Why is Berney Madoff in jail?

    Because he stole people’s money. Not because he lied to them.

    Comment by Milhouse

    As if the politicians are not using this scam to steal untold BILLIONS from us. Send them ALL to jail. (I actually meant another 4 letter place that ends in “l” but didn’t want Secret Service (SS) at my door for threatening politicians.)

    Jay H Curtis (804124)

  84. Dude the world can be engulfed in a new 38,000 year ice age and it will still be blamed on gorebull warming.

    Dohbiden (ef98f0)

  85. Gorebull warming can cause the earth to split into two atmospheres?

    Wow that Gaia must be real powerful.

    Dohbiden (ef98f0)

  86. And if Gorebull Warming was so bad wouldn’t the left give up their private jets or SUVS?

    Dohbiden (ef98f0)

  87. DohBiden – most of the liberals I know don’t drive SUVs and are in fact quite contemptuous of them.

    aphrael (807c84)

  88. I agree with Ag80 that this is about money.

    DRJ (a83b8b)

  89. Yeah but some are hypocrites ya know like the turd in the whitehouse.

    Dohbiden (ef98f0)

  90. BTW ag, this goes back much more than twenty years:
    Don’t forget Global Cooling (the Coming New Ice Age) in the 1970’s; followed by the great Ozone-Hole scheme to rid the world of effective mobile-system refrigerants (R-12).
    It is, it always has been, and it most likely always will be
    (unless we can figuratively, though it would be more satisfying to literally, burn these Cassandra’s at the stake)
    about funding for their little research regimes that haven’t advanced science one wit,
    but has provided them with a level of economic comfort that they could have never attained using actual scientific work and methods.
    In a previous age, such Snake-oil Salesmen were tarred-and-feathered, and ridden out of town on a rail.

    AD-RtR/OS! (e7d9c8)

  91. AD-RtR/OS!:

    In a previous age, such Snake-oil Salesmen were tarred-and-feathered, and ridden out of town on a rail.

    Good point. It’s a shame that too many of us forget what we learned in History and thus can’t relate it to today’s world.

    DRJ (a83b8b)

  92. ALAR!

    daleyrocks (bf33e9)

  93. That scam, was what gave rise to the NRDC, so who’s laughing now.

    narciso (ef1619)

  94. narciso – Some still defend it as a non-scam.

    daleyrocks (bf33e9)

  95. That’s what makes it a scam, grandiloquent claims, echoed by all the usual suspects, like Meryl Streep, and in the end, ‘it is full of sound and fury, signifying nothing’

    narciso (ef1619)

  96. 98- “Here I sit, broken hearted; came to … “

    AD-RtR/OS! (e7d9c8)

  97. Comment by DRJ — 11/26/2011 @ 11:32 am

    The tragic point that envelopes many of the social/fiscal/political problems we face today,
    is not that we have forgotten history, but for a great many of us,
    we were never afforded the opportunity to learn history,
    only tales of unicorns and pixie-dust.

    AD-RtR/OS! (e7d9c8)

  98. BTW, DRJ, are you trying to destroy the Universe?
    Isn’t comparable to joining matter and anti-matter when a Longhorn and an Aggie agree on anything?

    AD-RtR/OS! (e7d9c8)

  99. Oops…”Isn’t it comparable…”.

    AD-RtR/OS! (e7d9c8)

  100. Heh. Maybe I’m tempting fate, AD, but I agree with Aggies amd other Texans about a lot of things. Especially the ones who comment here.

    DRJ (a83b8b)

  101. I don’t know, I feel this great tearing in the force.

    AD-RtR/OS! (e7d9c8)

  102. y’all quit it. This is serious business.

    We don’t need no Aggies and Texans crossin up the streams, destroying the multiverse.

    Got enough trouble trying to get rid of these damned global warmers.


    Freedom Of Information Act – sounds chock full of legalities, and charges, and “thou shall not”‘s.

    And these Hockey guys, they broke everyone of em.

    I’m of the Rooster J. Cogburn school of justice, so I figure we shoot one of them climate scientists in the leg, leave him bleed a while, then ask him nice what the rest have been up to.

    How is that not a good plan?

    papertiger (e55ba0)

  103. Gorebull warming will cause the Polar Bears to go extinct by 2014……never mind the population is going up.

    Dohbiden (ef98f0)

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