Patterico's Pontifications


Sarah Palin Hints Again at 2012 Run As Christie Emphasizes the Need to Attack Entitlements

Filed under: General — Patterico @ 6:01 pm

Tomorrow morning, John Hawkins will publish a flash poll of conservative bloggers on their presidential favorites. I voted for Chris Christie. Why? Because a) he’s walking the walk in New Jersey, and b) man, he can talk the talk:


[T]he irony of Christie’s rise to superstardom is that, for all the goofing we do on Democrats and their “messaging” obsession, that’s really his key selling point. Messaging. It’s not that his solutions to Jersey’s budget problems are somehow novel or ingenious, it’s that (a) he’s willing to back the obvious solutions to the hilt, no matter the political risk, and (b) he has a genuine gift for persuading people that this is the right thing to do, notwithstanding the sacrifices involved. And of course, the second point affects the first one: It’s because Christie can sell fiscal conservatism, red in tooth and claw, like virtually no one else that the political risk to him is less than it is to anyone else.

Meanwhile, it’s clearer than ever that Sarah Palin is running:

Escalating speculation about a possible presidential run, Sarah Palin offered a teasing hint Thursday of the type of candidate she would like to see in 2012: a multi-tasking mother with experience at the state and local level who has already been a vice presidential nominee.

. . . .

“I look at those poll numbers and I say, ‘If I’m going to do this, I obviously gotta get out there and let people know who I am, what I stand for, and what my record is,’ ” said Palin, adding that prospective candidates need to get into the contest “soon” so that voters can begin to take their measure.

I know that, until Christie gets the nod from the big-time talk show hosts, certain folks among the “staunch conservative” crowd will continue to run him down, and go with Palin as their preferred candidate. But I think Ann Coulter showed clear thinking when she said that, if we don’t run this guy, and we go instead with another candidate (whether it be Mitt Romney, Sarah Palin, or, God help us, Mike Huckabee) we’re going to lose. None of them can make their points the way Christie does in the clips above.

I wish Palin could, because I think physical attractiveness counts a lot in a presidential election, where huge numbers of low-information voters cast their ballots according to the silliest criteria possible. She has that attractiveness, and Christie doesn’t.

She also has the right ideas. On fiscal issues, which I think weigh most heavily on us right now, so does Christie. The difference is not the ideas. It’s the presentation. It’s the confidence you feel that the person standing in front of you has a clear vision and a spine and a way to articulate their vision.

Palin may have the first two. But she has not mastered that last skill.

If she’s our nominee, I’ll support her. But right now, while nobody has yet announced, I’m throwing myself in with Ann Coulter. We have to draft this guy Christie somehow.

UPDATE 2-18-11: Christie has won Hawkins’s poll.

288 Responses to “Sarah Palin Hints Again at 2012 Run As Christie Emphasizes the Need to Attack Entitlements”

  1. There is a lot I admire about Chris Christie but he’s still a bit too east coast for me. Especially on gun control issues.

    But he’s in my top two or three.

    SPQR (26be8b)

  2. I disagree with him on many issues. But I think the fiscal ruin we are facing is so dire, I am willing to throw my support to the one person who actually seems like they might do something about it.

    Patterico (c218bd)

  3. I can’t recall Ann’s exact words, but I caught a bit of her on Hannity (purely by accident), and they were to the effect of “I don’t care if he WANTS to run, we need to MAKE him run. He is our only chance.”

    And frankly, I think she’s right.

    I don’t agree with everything he has to say, and maybe he WOULD back a couple of tougher gun laws…

    But I have to wait 7 days instead of 3 or 5, I’m willing to make that trade. I would make that trade every day of the week.

    Scott Jacobs (98018d)

  4. I’m still thinking Kasich myself. Have to watch his term in Ohio some more.

    SPQR (26be8b)

  5. Annnd the door is open

    Christie wont run neither will Palin, Perry maynot run either

    Like I’ve said Ad Naseum, Palin’s tax record was unknon because her taxes – just went into effect when she as nominated – now those “achievements” are touted as the worst legislation and out of control spendng is the debate in Alaska and rhe revolt of the oil companies

    Palin showed herself beyond doubt to be a bigger spender and taxer than Obama

    Christie is too soft on social issues and immigration to win the nomination – I hope thats not the case but – if he ran against Perry he wouldnt win

    EricPWJohnson (be6834)

  6. Palin showed herself beyond doubt to be a bigger spender and taxer than Obama

    You’re f**king high. Or re*arded. Or both.

    Scott Jacobs (98018d)

  7. The debt bomb is what matters most. Other issues, even dear issues, do not matter as much. That’s what a crisis is all about. And thankfully, my right to bear arms is politically stable and more legally protected than any other time in my life.

    Gov Christie, Gov Walker, Gov Daniels, and Rep Ryan all get that this must be priority one. It’s not time for a conversation or a pretend reform… it’s time for decisive action. Gov Christie , Rep Ryan, and Sarah Palin have actually been out there on the front lines, fighting the policy battle. And lastly, Gov Perry and Gov Daniels have the experience to do the job. This last part is extremely important to me, and why I prefer Daniels to Christie.

    However, winning the election itself is absolutely critical now. Obama’s pushed the debt bomb a lot farther than I dreamed possible (and I am a big dreamer).

    I like Palin a lot, and wish all Republican notables had been out there making arguments with her vigor. That’s what Christie brings to the table.

    I will be pleased if our nominee is Daniels, Christie, or Ryan, though the latter two aren’t running. I’ll fight like hell for Palin, but I think it’s just too easy to beat her in swing states.

    Dustin (b54cdc)

  8. Daniels was my second choice.

    Patterico (c218bd)

  9. BTW, it isn’t possible for the GOP to win via slurring Gov Palin.

    That path leads only to division, because the right feels sympathy for Gov Palin being the victim of one unfair attack after another. Even though she wasn’t perfect, she was actually a terrific governor who pleased her state before the presidential circus swept her up.

    EPWJ’s claims are better understood in a context where many argue the oil companies got an unfairly good deal out of corrupt lawmakers prior to Palin, who corrected the situation. Much as GE barely pays any taxes today, and perhaps some reforms would cause them to suffer a tax increase, it’s not always a black and white situation where spending is bad and taxing is bad. We need leaders who are honest.

    Palin’s a great person who lived up to her moral ideals and withstood so much hatred, and anyone who gives her any grief will be unable to win a general election. That’s why I think she’s going to win the nomination, unless we see strong stalking horse efforts (which could lead to a Perot situation, albeit with someone like Rand Paul rather than Sarah Palin).

    That’s a disaster for our country.

    It’s up to the other candidates to positively justify why they should be the nominee. Saying they will fare better than Palin in the general makes sense to me, but it’s not enough.

    Dustin (b54cdc)

  10. The debt issue is important, but lets face it, this administration will bequeath a tornado of devastation, in practically every policy area, judicial, foreign policy, as well as economic policy

    narciso (e694f9)

  11. Note, I realize Patterico isn’t even remotely slurring Palin. If we pay attention to 2010, we see there’s a weakness in her voting bloc in a lot of states. It’s really unfortunate that this is the case, because America should be wide awake now and never elect a Murkowski or a Reid, but that’s the reality we have to deal with.

    I think EPWJ is too hard on her, and am speaking generally about other candidates and their supporters.

    Dustin (b54cdc)

  12. Dustin

    Corporations have a voice in this election – I can asure you they will absolutely make sure Palin’s true story gets told in living color…

    Christie they are also soft on, Perry they Like, Romney they like, its all about early funding, and the media

    Palin has other problems that are going to come to light and she just can’t handle the press or questions about her record, her sketchy personal life, was Todd a failed union organizer and/or a member of the communist party at one time in Alaska etc..

    christie is a master at handling the Press, but they will jsut minimize his exposure and edit out his best moments, Christie still has ot cut taxes in NJ, he has reduced spending, but can he turn Jersey around?

    Perry on the other hand has done these things – the press AVOIDS Perry because after having their a$$ handed to them by him numerous times they just snipe at him from hundreds of eekly editorials that have no effect

    EricPWJohnson (be6834)

  13. Another inequality in American life and politics: a lack of attractiveness in men is far more tolerated than it is in women so I don’t think it’ll be that great of a drawback for Christie.

    So while Palin might be more pleasant to the eye as well as be able to use that power in a way that Christie wouldn’t, the fact still remains that she does not have the ability to articulate and convince voters of her viability. Without that firmly in place, nothing else really matters.

    Dana (8ba2fb)

  14. Dustin

    Also the Republicans are distancing themselves from Palin in Alaska – her record is clear now and the only people wanting to keep her taxes are those same Democrats who all voted for them and tried to get her out on ethics at the same time

    Palin, is not the conservative she was made out to be in the careful packaging and the paid for politics appearances to the tune of over 20 million dollars – she was a moderate – a member of the Murkowski machine until she was passed over.

    You can look at what politicians say or what they do. Based upon what she says – she’s the most conservative leader since lincoln, based upon what she did – Obama would be a better choice

    EricPWJohnson (be6834)

  15. EPWJ, it’s one thing to criticize Palin, but it doesn’t seem constructive sometimes. And people will have a visceral reaction to it.

    Instead, argue for your preferred candidate, if that’s Perry or not. Yeah, some Palin fans will freak at that too, but it’s just the better way to go, IMO.

    And please, let’s all just agree to ignore Romney. Please.

    Dustin (b54cdc)

  16. Dana

    I agree, I think Hillary lost because her looks faded and Obama was younger

    EricPWJohnson (be6834)

  17. Christie does a good job talking tough because he looks like a bouncer. In successfully talking tough he has already staked out his position. But other than being serious about fiscal responsibility, I know very little about him. I know there has been something about a regional “cap and tax” program that NJ is in with NY and others, but more than that I don’t know.

    I’m sure he has already attracted the ire of many a Dem character assassin and nobody has had anything that’s even made the news as a discounted rumor, which is good.

    Christie, like Palin, has more executive experience than the one, but I would like to see someone who has more than 2 years as governor.

    I still wonder and wish Jindahl was on the national scene as people predicted a few years ago.

    Christis for Pres taking care of domestic, John Bolton for VP for foreign policy. That’s a bold in your face for ya.

    MD in Philly (3d3f72)

  18. Dustin

    I really dont care – you can try and say characterize its personal – its not – I only look at peoples records and actions – thats just the way I am, I also am impressed wth Bachmann who is a far greater conservative than Christie or Palin and a far more substantial person, Christie has some lingering problems that dont matter much but really matter to me – because leadership of the free world is more than cutting a budget – and spending – its the will the perception of strength and resolve that is projected abroad as well.

    EricPWJohnson (be6834)

  19. Really, history would indicate he hasn’t been subjected to 1/100th of the possible scrutiny,
    and the truth is not an obstacle for them.

    narciso (e694f9)

  20. I’ve been thinking about Christie’s CPAC performance all day, and your post here is a convenient place to drop my thoughts:

    There’s a lot of folks calling for Christie to run for President in 2012, despite his saying, repeatedly and forcefully, that he wants to finish what he started in NJ (which probably means at least finishing out his term, and seeing the effects of some of the changes he’s made).

    I think he’s right not to run, and frankly, I don’t know that I want him to be President (although for sure he’d be far better than the current occupant).

    What Republicans should be learning from Christie is not that he himself should run. Rather, they should be figuring out that Christie is a good model. We don’t necessarily want Christie in the White House, we want someone like him. Someone with his clarity and force.

    Republicans should be learning that we have finally learned Goldwater’s lesson: extremism in defense of liberty is no vice. They should be picking up his boldness, his strength, his firmness.

    I hope the Republican candidate can also broaden his (or her) brush, looking at issues like the right to arms, border control, and national defense.

    But the main thing is to be a strong Republican, like Christie, rather than a weak Democrat.

    DJMoore (dfc510)

  21. Dustin

    I meant THEY can try and say its personal in my comment on 18.

    You re right buts its exactly that emotional personal viseral reaction that Palin is carefully cultivating and using first to enrich herself personally on something thats supposed to be a civic duty, and second use it to stay in the limelight for personal and political gain.

    Obama will lose to anyone with an R – the only way he can win is if the Tea Party decides again that their personal agenda means more than whats best for the country

    EricPWJohnson (be6834)

  22. It’s up to the other candidates to positively justify why they should be the nominee. Saying they will fare better than Palin in the general makes sense to me, but it’s not enough.
    Comment by Dustin

    I think that’s absolutely true.

    I mean, once it comes out that Todd Palin was really born in Siberia and raised by a stepfather on an island off of N. Korea and has a Birth Certificate signed by Kruschev, and whose mentor as a teenager was Mao, and that he’s known John Kerry ever since they met in Paris when Palin was with the North Vietnamese delegation, well, they won’t even have to get into the rumors that he turns into a bear-wolf every 3rd full moon, and that’s why the rest go hunting, so they have enough wild game to keep him fed so he doesn’t eat the children.

    Yeah, better not let Palin run, they might look into her private life and hack into her emails or something…

    MD in Philly (3d3f72)

  23. Yes, EPWJ, ad nauseaum is correct.

    SPQR (26be8b)

  24. Holy Jeebus. This topic is like a dog whistle for epwj lies and idiocy. Give me a effing break.

    JD (d4bbf1)

  25. Eric, I like Bachmann a lot too. She’s grown on me a lot as I’ve seen her handle a lot of jerk interviewers very intelligently.

    But I don’t think she can win swing states either, and she lacks executive experience. We do not need an inexperienced leader in the oval office. It’s just too damn complicated a job.

    I’m not trying to antagonize you or characterize your Palin criticism in a rude way, but come on. It’s hard to hear over the broken record sometimes. There’s a lot of context to how you’re describing her tax hike, and it’s pretty clear you’re more interested in this oil tax break she ended than 99% of folks out there. She didn’t put any oil companies out of business, by any stretch. When you say Obama would be better conservative than Palin, it seems like you’re just coming at this from an unusual POV that divides.

    Let’s hear your argument for someone you like. We could do a lot worse than Gov Perry.

    Dustin (b54cdc)

  26. Daniels is toast.

    JD (d4bbf1)

  27. Shush, MD, that was supposed to be a secret.

    narciso (e694f9)

  28. I mean, once it comes out that Todd Palin was really born in Siberia and raised by a stepfather on an island off of N. Korea and has a Birth Certificate signed by Kruschev, and whose mentor as a teenager was Mao, and that he’s known John Kerry ever since they met in Paris when Palin was with the North Vietnamese delegation, well, they won’t even have to get into the rumors that he turns into a bear-wolf every 3rd full moon, and that’s why the rest go hunting, so they have enough wild game to keep him fed so he doesn’t eat the children.


    Well done.

    Anyway, you mention those emails, and I think it’s important for conservatives to respect the fact that they dug and dug and dug into Palin. They stripped her of any semblance of privacy or respect. And yet… no scandals. That’s freaking amazing. If someone hacked my email, they could probably find at least something really rude I wrote.

    I would give my right arm for Palin to be our president. It’s with a lot of regret that I concede, thanks to 2010, that her coalition is not enough, and that’s before Obama plays the ‘vote present’ card, and a lot of people are lulled to slumber on his 2008-2009 policies.

    We need someone who can win the support of the party, and there’s no way to do that without giving Palin the respect she didn’t get in 2008 (or since).

    We will know much more about this after the debates.

    Dustin (b54cdc)

  29. #

    Daniels is toast.

    Comment by JD —

    He’s just trying to dance between flying under the radar and making points about the debt crisis. He’s going to have some serious support early on.

    Dustin (b54cdc)

  30. Dustin,

    I know its a broken record but when someone is something that they are not, trying at every opportunity to suck the life out of the room, has done horrible things to America and grossly enriched herself and her family in the most breathtakingly brazen manner, and is still being touted as a front runner when America is in a time of greatist need – you cant mention it enough

    Perry hsd electability problems, he’s from Texss, he hates unions, he hates spending, he hate criminals, he think the press is something thats to be backhanded brutally, he has no room for liberals, and he’s extremely sympathetic to the plight of the poor and appreciates what hispanics have done for the country especially their massive service in out armed forces – Perry’s old school he told me personally that anyone who defends his family in a far away place has his undying support –

    He means what he says and says what he means

    people just aren’t really ready for that

    EricPWJohnson (be6834)

  31. Well, narcisco, EPWJ keeps doing everything but spill the beans amd I’m gettin’ tired of it, so let’s get it out in the open.

    Besides, as he says, she got a taste of that fancy wardrobe and now just wants to milk the public and get stinkin’ rich anyway.

    Michelle Bachmann- hasn’t she helped raise a platoon’s worth of foster kids and helped found and run some kind of residential program? Anybody who has run a household of 10 or more people has enough executive experience (as long as they still have hair and didn’t pull it all out).

    Just one thing-

    She needs a VP running mate named Turner.

    MD in Philly (3d3f72)

  32. the only way he can win is if the Tea Party decides again that their personal agenda means more than whats best for the country

    What kind of incoherent comment is that, EPWJ? “Personal agenda” ?

    SPQR (26be8b)

  33. And another point: only true believers are going to be moved by an argument of ‘So and so has more experience than Obama did in 2008’.

    That’s some kind of call to political tit for tat, but the reality is that Obama will have 4 years of the most difficult executive experience in the world when the election rolls around. No, he hasn’t done very well with his time, but this is a fundamental difference from the guy who ran in 2008. In exchange for a real record and experience he traded away the blank slate, so all is not lost.

    But even most Governors will have inferior resumes.

    Dustin (b54cdc)

  34. And their campaign anthem will be “Takin’ Care of Business”

    MD in Philly (3d3f72)

  35. Sarah Palin hates big oil. Epwj said so. She has also done horrible things to America. And she made money. GASP!

    JD (d4bbf1)

  36. MD in Philly

    All you have to do is google Alaska oil debate – hit the news button ans see that the Democrats are defensing Palins tax increases and the Republicans are trying to repeal them

    Nothing hurts worse than the truth – Spending has risen alonst 100% in Alaska since Murkowski left office – Parnell is getting holy hell for trying to put the breaks on it

    Palin won’t ru – these statements by her are just to keep the speech checks rolling in

    EricPWJohnson (be6834)

  37. Here’s an article – its an opinion piece

    Palin said that “President Reagan would be so proud of the conservative movement today.” But it is awfully hard to imagine today’s conservative movement even including someone like Reagan.

    Today’s conservative movement, reanimated by the tea party, has fought to defeat prominent Republicans for being insufficiently conservative. Endorsed by Palin, many of this year’s GOP nominees — in California, Delaware, Nevada, Colorado, Minnesota, and elsewhere — fell short in statewide general elections more moderate Republicans might have won. As one conservative House committee chairman complained, “Sarah Palin cost us control of the Senate.” The former Alaska governor stood by her picks, saying she supports “pro-life, pro-Second Amendment … conservatives who have never voted for a tax increase.”

    But those criteria would mean rejecting Reagan.

    As governor of California, Reagan spoke out against “welfare bums” and big government, attacked the Democratic legislature, and sent National Guard troops to crack down on Berkeley protesters — just as Republicans remember. But he also signed the law that legalized abortion in California, signed the law that allowed no-fault divorce for the first time, and championed and approved the largest tax increase in state history (an increase that represented 30 percent of the state general fund). He raised sales taxes, corporate taxes, inheritance taxes, liquor taxes, cigarette taxes, and the top income tax rate. Under Governor Reagan, the California Air Resources Board (so-called “command and control” environmental regulation) was founded, and real spending increased almost 13 percent — more than under his Democratic successor, Jerry Brown. Reagan even signed the Mulford Act, “prohibiting the carrying of firearms on one’s person or in a vehicle, in any public place or on any public street.”

    EricPWJohnson (be6834)

  38. SHOCKA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Epwj is pushing the same memes as the MFM and the Left.

    JD (d4bbf1)

  39. JD

    Google is your friend – all you have to do is WANT, repeat WANT to see what’s happening ad see whats going on instead of trying to divert attention away from her record

    Sure – I’m a leftist communist media sympathizer – but Palin’s record is still out there

    Unchallenged and she has to make a decision – lose an election and 10 to 20 million a year or keep on with the easy life

    EricPWJohnson (be6834)

  40. The first two pages of Google on Bachmann include lists of her worst quotes, mocking her for saying CO2 is a natural byproduct, and listing her among prominent racists and homophobes.

    So it sounds like she has started being “Palinized”. Next thing you know, EPWJ will be complaining about her fiscal and tax policy.

    MD in Philly (3d3f72)

  41. SPQR

    Its understood that purity is personal – its hard to have to compromise and exert leadership for the greater good, a personal agenda is to do what you want and not what the party or the people want

    Its what the Tea Party is about – they want their way or its no way

    EricPWJohnson (be6834)

  42. MD

    I have supported Bachmann, and until she decides that raising taxes on corporations, trying to turn internal family problems into a political tool, decides that she is entitled to millions in speaking fee’s and book deals, doesn’t claim to be a victim when others are shot dead – she has my support

    EricPWJohnson (be6834)

  43. Well it is a natural byproduct of breathing, and most other human endeavors, we surpassed dependence
    on ‘renewables’ about 300 years ago, around the
    time of the Industrial Revolution

    narciso (e694f9)

  44. Now you are just spitting out vile lies, epwj. Typical.

    JD (d4bbf1)

  45. He’s starting to get on my nerves.

    It’s becoming too much about him.

    I loved the guy until a couple of days ago.

    It would be nice in the face of all the turmoil overseas and in the Midwest to get a uniter amongst Republicans-and what does Christie do?

    He says he’ll take time off from the job he was entrusted with-to run against other republicans.

    He’s getting too big for his britches-and I mean that in the ego sense.

    It reminds me of McCain for some reason.. It’s the same formula -become the media darling by taking shots at your fellow travelers.

    In the face of Obama could we find someone above all that.

    How about if Christie is going to take time off-he go and help republicans who are getting it done?

    Scott Walker-hell Kasich for that matter.

    And, really I like to satirize the guys at Althouse when I pretend to oooh and aaah over male politicans-I don’t think they even get what I’m doing but it annoys them like I’ve been annoyed by their Palin fever for what seems like years now.


    Trust me looks don’t get my vote I voted for Perot. I must be a floozy for charts!

    Having said all that….

    Thune-holy hubba….

    [Ya I’m a hypocrit –please.]

    madawaskan (fd190b)

  46. JD

    Again – prove it?

    Did she parade her family out as an intergral part of her role in the campaign?

    Did she raise taxes and spending more than any other governor?

    Does she make millions upon millions in book deals and speaking engagements that are political in nature?

    Oh, and did she decide to whine excessively on a day of remembrance concerning the people who were shot dead?


    EricPWJohnson (be6834)

  47. madawaskan, you voted for Perot, but Christie shouldn’t campaign against Republicans who are pro-huge-debt?

    It’s important for Republicans to draw a line in the sand at some point, and for Christie and Daniels and Palin, that line has something to do with ridiculous spending in DC. I think we should all seek better candidates (who can win general elections) than any Republican who is part of the spending problem.

    I like Christie more for showing leadership on the national stage, and saying he’ll be a thorn in the side of corrupt Republicans. Hell, that’s basically the main thing I like about Palin, too, for that matter.

    Dustin (b54cdc)

  48. Not in the manner you describe, no. No, she did not raise taxes more, nor spend more than any other Governor. Yes she is making millions, congrats to her. You said entitled. You are being dishonest again. No, she did not decide to whine excessively. She responded to bei savagely libeled by the MFMF, leftists, and your ilk. Next.

    JD (d4bbf1)

  49. Oh, and did she decide to whine excessively on a day of remembrance concerning the people who were shot dead?

    You remain despicable, EPWJ.

    SPQR (26be8b)

  50. the Palin does not understand what her poll numbers mean. She wants another do-over?? For reals? She bailed on her job thinking she could turn those poll numbers around when everybody “got to know her,” and she’s only made herself more polarizing and her negatives keep climbing and climbing higher and higher. Someone needs to explain to the poor lady what it means when you have poll numbers like hers.

    happyfeet (ab5779)

  51. If I lived in New Jersey I would not be happy at the prospect of a Christie candidacy.

    happyfeet (ab5779)

  52. Additionally-it demonstrates a tactical, strategic and/or diplomatic error.

    Makes me believe he really doesn’t want it. It’s an age old mistake, the shorthand for it is-

    borrowing enemies.

    Let him play hard to get.

    Meanwhile Scott Walker is getting it done, more action, less talkie-talkie.

    madawaskan (fd190b)

  53. SPQR and JD

    Again, she raised taxes and spending more than any other Governor – when this year her tax policy stay in effect Alaska may have 13 billion to 14 billion to spend thats a 100% increase in taxation in three years – please show me any state – including new york that raised corporate taxes 33% a year for three years or doubled spending in three years or revenue

    Also compare and contrast that with Patterico looking for someone (as are most of us) who can cut taxes and spending and create jobs

    I’ll be waiting

    And yes its generally understood that she whined excessively (profitably as well) about being the victim, unshot as it seems, unfair attacks happen all the time – just not as profitably for some

    EricPWJohnson (be6834)

  54. EPWJ, she was accused of being responsible for murders and you call it “whining too much”.

    Just when I think you can’t sink lower in my opinion, you prove me wrong.

    SPQR (26be8b)

  55. Damn it!

    It was my first vote evah-and I’ve rued it ever sense.


    There is usually three kisses of death for a candidate, too much exposure and love by the main stream media, everyone on the internet loves him-think Fred Thompson


    National Review’s editor is drooling over him.

    Mitt Romney.

    madawaskan (fd190b)

  56. Daniels may be toast but if Mr. Christie doesn’t run then Mitch has a duty to run I think. Christie is very confused on some issues but he gets the thing about the spending, and he’s not a pandering squack.

    happyfeet (ab5779)

  57. CPAC picks you could be the fourth kiss of death.

    Let me just throw that out there without even researching it.

    madawaskan (fd190b)

  58. It is not generally understood. It is asserted by you and the leftist scum that made those smears against her. The economics you assert have been refudiated ad nauseum. Yet you continue to puke out the same drivel.

    JD (d4bbf1)

  59. He says he’ll take time off from the job he was entrusted with-to run against other republicans.


    I don’t care if it costs up control of Congress, Republicans need to get the f**king message that fixing the National Debt and the Federal Deficit are THE number 1 priority at this moment. Failure to attack those items that are the biggest issue means they fail to understand that.

    And if they fail to understand that, they need to be out of Congress. If that means removing EVERY incumbent, then so be it.

    Scott Jacobs (d027b8)

  60. I don’t know, South Carolina ended up picking McCain, did that show any better judgement than
    Thompson, the pickings were quite slim the last time around.

    narciso (e694f9)

  61. It was my first vote evah-and I’ve rued it ever sense.


    fair enough, fair enough. Nobody’s perfect.

    Dustin (b54cdc)

  62. And yes its generally understood that she whined excessively (profitably as well) about being the victim, unshot as it seems, unfair attacks happen all the time – just not as profitably for some

    This is amazing. I saw that speech a few times, because I was around people who wanted to see it again (I know how geeky this makes me come across), and that speech was not whining.

    It was a discussion of free speech, and barely referenced the Palin bashing directly. She handled that in a way that was stoic, not whiny. I don’t care if EPWJ’s source, whatever that is, generally accepts something that isn’t true. Anyone can watch the speech and see that she was not whining. She was making a positive and constructive case for free speech.

    Also, she was silent for days despite the bashing. She doesn’t owe us silence when Obama is remembering victims, and they had real memorials later… that memorial was a national disgrace full of obnoxious hooting and cheering and hippie pablum.

    Palin handled that situation beautifully. Like I keep telling people, you have to make a positive case, instead of a negative one, to be viable with the right. People want a leader who stands tall and has a plan, not just the guy who points and frowns.

    Dustin (b54cdc)

  63. narciso

    Huge retired military community in South Carolina , I think at the time McCain was the only “security” candidate and the rest competed for the same votes.

    IIRC, Guiliani stayed out of S.C.



    Ya I might be the only person that didn’t like that.

    I want to stay focused on attacking Democrats.

    Divide and conquer is how Democrats win concessions from Republicans before the even hit the playing field.

    The way it’s sizing up now, Republicans are making cuts in their departments, and the Democrats haven’t ceded a damn thing.

    And I’m beginning to think the whole high speed rail is a damn red herring.

    Republicans will think they got a big victory defeating that, meanwhile the Democrats really don’t give up a damn thing their constituents want-none of them have frickin’ high speed rail now.

    Obama went swinging for high speed rail, but he won’t be embarrassed much by the defeat.

    One thing Democrats know about their electorate-they don’t pay attention to the speeches and they have the memory span of knats.

    So who might be upset by the loss? The unions? Who are they going to vote for-Republicans?

    madawaskan (fd190b)

  64. Crap.


    Basically that’s my cue to exit-stage right.

    madawaskan (fd190b)

  65. Palin needs Huckabee in the race for so she can stand next to him and look serious. She needs Romney out of the race cause of he’s prettier than she is.

    happyfeet (ab5779)

  66. People want a leader who stands tall and has a plan, not just the guy who points and frowns.

    I’m wrong. We’re totally dysfunctional. We frowned and pointed and thumbed down a lot of great candidates, winding up with the frowniest, whose coalition was simply not built on conservatism.

    That’s how we wound up with Mccain instead of oh-so-many better options, none of which were excellent, and thus all of which failed with the right.

    Dustin (b54cdc)

  67. They are products we can ill afford now, we have the experience of the rail system, passed under Chairman Lehman, that is a white elephant down

    narciso (e694f9)

  68. projects, well you know what I meant.

    narciso (e694f9)

  69. OT: Nice to see the Public Sector Unions toning down the rhetoric in Wisconsin!

    Torquemada (2a42d3)

  70. I want to stay focused on attacking Democrats.

    And a Republican that won’t go after entitlements as part of a fiscal strategy is exactly as worthless as a Dem.

    Repeat after me: “Nothing is as important that fixing the Debt and Deficit. No other issue has the consequences as those two items. Those two issues alone can and will bring about the complete ruin of this nation, and anyone who will not focus on them is unwilling to work to save this country.”

    Repeat that until you know it by heart.

    It must be our mantra.

    Scott Jacobs (d027b8)

  71. Sarah Palin will never be president. But, God bless her, I am glad I have been honored to walk the Earth as her contemporary.

    Not just because of her ability to short-circuit every lefty in America, but because she is a role model for young women for withstanding misogynist attacks based on beliefs.

    Every lefty or righty should be ashamed for the vile attacks on her simply because they don’t like her. What kind of example does that set for parents trying to raise strong women?

    Ag80 (7a9f97)

  72. Christie is articulate. He has command of his speech and thoughts….something that Palin and Obama both clearly lack. Lately when President Obama speaks I cringe, as he makes many clipped ambiguous truisms…over-generalizations. Palin never met a malapropism or corny shallow statement (signifying nothing) that she wasn’t gushy over. Mama grizzly? That actually means what, quit governorship to wax confusedly about….?

    Christie is a softy on illegal immigration; this is not good. But his persona, viability and consistent logical/verifiable rhetoric are winners. The flap over his wife’s funds are over and out in the open. He is firm and likable. *Never, ever expected to agree with Ann Coulter!

    dudeabides (d9f7cf)

  73. It really is a waste of time, arguing here, sometimes, yes she’s enthusiastic about somethings, when one feels that everything that has been fought
    and died for in this country, is being shredded, wouldn’t you be. I don’t really see that urgency in Christie or Daniels, who have such a narrow view
    of what that office entails, THey are often too willing to discard principles to the wind, to curry favor with the MFM, which is either too stupid or too craven slavish; it’s a contest which applies from day to day.

    narciso (e694f9)

  74. That is a scurrilous untruth, narcisco. Daniels has not discarded any principles, and certainly has not tried to curry favor with the MFM.

    JD (d4bbf1)

  75. Not a Palin fan but she is no less vacuous and empty as Obama.

    Both are lightweights IMHO.

    Torquemada (2a42d3)

  76. Mr. narciso what victories in Indiana can you point to what the evil minions of Satan have won under Mr. Daniels’ watch?

    happyfeet (ab5779)

  77. I like Chris Christie for his success with the unions and his dem legislature. Don’t like some his liberal views such as with judges; said Kagan was a perfectly fine nominee and that the R’s were stonewalling on a good choice. Guns, again very northeast attitude.

    Bigger concern: not vetted. Media will launch search & destroy after the honeymoon.

    Another concern: was a little too starry-eyed when speaking of his Obama invite for red Chinese dinner. One McCain was enough for me.

    Potentially biggest hurdle: said he’s ok w/ Obamacare, in part or in theory. Will he buckle to pressure or follow thru with repeal?.

    Not sure but he might be a great regional leader, a la Giuliani. Not my 1st choice, but his deficit skills are certainly appealing.

    Vermont Neighbor (6d8a47)

  78. His undercutting of the effort to repeal Obamacare, by assuming there could be an understanding with Sibelius, is one note, his disdaining oof death panels are another, that’s just recently

    narciso (e694f9)

  79. oh. Mr. narciso I have anudder question which representatives or senators are less likely to vote for repeal of obamacare cause of Mr. Daniels?

    happyfeet (ab5779)

  80. Good Allah.

    JD (d4bbf1)

  81. Well that’s more in the purview of the Atty General,
    rather than the Governor proper, not all can be like Bondi or Cucinelli, more are akin to Goddard
    in Arizona, or the Zombie from the Eight Track Era
    Jerry Brown.

    narciso (e694f9)

  82. i will say that christie is beginning to look like the best of a weak field.

    and i think the guy really could be the one to take logic on entitlements. he is a person who is very good at thinking plainly and making his argument cogently.

    Aaron Worthing (73a7ea)

  83. narciso, I don’t see Daniels as lacking urgency. I think that’s just a misunderstanding.

    A lot of people on the right are saying Daniels is out, not in virtue of his position on anything, but simply because he loudly and firmly says we have to build a powerful and large coalition for getting the budget out of this crisis. There’s a larger number of people who agree on this thing than this thing and DADT and gay marriage, and this thing is much more important, so we need to prioritize and work together.

    That’s urgency, in my view. It’s also not well understood and I think we need to note Daniels has had a little difficulty communicating this stuff, though as far as I can tell, this is because he takes the debt issue to be extremely important and doesn’t have patience for people who are playing games with our nation’s looming problems.

    Potentially biggest hurdle: said he’s ok w/ Obamacare, in part or in theory.

    That’s not acceptable, but I didn’t think this was the case. Any candidate who isn’t opposed to Obamacare is DOA. But at any rate, he really isn’t running, and I suspect some are cleverly using Christie as a way to illustrate something about our primary.

    Dustin (b54cdc)

  84. Where the rubber meets the road, it’s less about choosing a President than it is about choosing Team Red, good on business and leftie head explosions, or Team Blue, A++ for effort and it would be judgemental to make a deeper assessment, to run things. And maybe there’s a third team, Team Tea, now too.

    East Bay Jay (19f566)

  85. Any person OK with Obamacare has very little concern of the constitution but worse yet, no understanding of micro-economics or consumer behavior.

    That legislation does nothing to address the concerns over tightening supply, exploding demand and Gov.t desire to manage both sides of it (ROFLMAO!).

    Torquemada (2a42d3)

  86. Christie’s not running is the deal though. He’s said so unequivocally. A huge huge part of his appeal is that when he says stuff unequivocally he means it.

    So, there’s that.

    happyfeet (ab5779)

  87. like when Christie says hey everybody let’s go to Olive Garden you can take it to the bank that this is a man what is going to Olive Garden

    happyfeet (ab5779)

  88. JD

    Like I said I encourage you to research her actual record – compare and contrast it against th most spending states like IL, NY, MA and see – now I DONT DOUBT that NY has any less spending morals than Palin – just the democrats in NY just dont have the balls to tax the only industry in their state more than anywhere else in the world

    and get away with it

    EricPWJohnson (be6834)

  89. said Kagan was a perfectly fine nominee and that the R’s were stonewalling on a good choice.

    That is less than encouraging…

    MD in Philly (3d3f72)

  90. Agreed, MD.

    Dustin (b54cdc)

  91. SPQR,

    So was I BTW, and Bachmann, Hannity, OReilly – none of them including me, released press statements on the day of rememberance –

    She’s working hard at being the victim – its pays real well

    EricPWJohnson (be6834)

  92. EPWJ-

    You’ve long ago lost credibility. I wouldn’t take your word that the sun was going to rise in the morning (metaphorically, of course). So if you have something worthwhile to say, I’m going to need to wait until somebody else says it.

    MD in Philly (3d3f72)

  93. Well, I do agree that Ocare needs a definite clarification from the Double C. If the gov would commit to full repeal and then talk about the necessity of tort reform and health care accounts and such… he could isolate the Progs right out of the debates. It wouldn’t be a flip-flop so much as adopting a national platform.

    Vermont Neighbor (352bcf)

  94. Dustin,

    Daniels is th new Huckabee – cant win, won’t win – if the media glom on to a meme that Obama could beat him – watch for 100 to 200 million dollars worth of free publicity in the form of informational articles about th miracle in indy and the hoosier state has it’s time come and comparisons to that HAckman movie exposes’ in the very best marketing spirit of wag the dogs

    Daniels will be touted as our only choice until he gets the nomination and get barely beaten by Obama

    Daniels is a no one, so is his state – its unfortunate – but Indiana is like South Dakota

    EricPWJohnson (be6834)

  95. So, I guess Bobby Jindal is right out then. That’s too bad.

    I don’t think Palin will make it out of the early primaries. She may do well in Iowa, but New Hampshire may prove very tough for her.

    That said, if all of the primaries are front loaded again, she may carry a lot of primaries just on name recognition alone. Though, maybe the states learned from Pennsylvania in the last primary cycle. Being a big state later in the primaries may mean that you may play an important role.

    Just to say something about some earlier comments about Hillary Clinton losing because her looks had faded. She was not much of a looker to begin with. And she lost because her team was horrible and Obama had a fantastic ground support team (which are now looking much C.R.E.E.P.ier than they did during the 2008 election). If you remember, Hillary’s people didn’t know that the Democrats had proportional primary elections, not winner-take-all like the Republican primaries.

    Xmas (f72f61)

  96. And for the Hoosiers out there – sorry, love the state, buts its like Arkansas who would ever,,

    never mind

    EricPWJohnson (be6834)

  97. Exhibit A., EPWJ-

    Neither you, nor I, nor SPQR, nor Bachmann, Hannity, or O’Reilly had been singled out as having a web site that motivated the shooting. To overlook that fact in order to make the claim Palin knows how to play the victim is a lack of knowledge or intellectual dishonesty.

    MD in Philly (3d3f72)

  98. Sometimes I think they don’t pay attention to the subjects actual statements, how could one possibly
    support Kagan if one know their record, for that matter, one shudders to think what the next nominee
    will bring. Now Daniels has had more than a few tries at the apple, and he still fails to allay
    people’s concerns, by seemingly misunderstanding how the left works. They recquire nothing less than
    full fledged acceptance, not mere tolerance of their ideological predilictions, regardless of the cost.

    narciso (e694f9)

  99. Indiana is like South Dakota like Ronald Reagan is like Sarah Palin.

    happyfeet (ab5779)

  100. MD

    Credibilty I dont need – all anyone else has to do is google the debate going on right now in Alaska, and see who is defending Palins spending and taxing and who is for cutting

    Yes, I am a cupcake eating sexist, racist, lefty, Palin smearing, moby, dopey, bad student, muslim apologist, terror enabler, and to top it all off – I’m left handed as well, and failed my lutheran confirmation class.

    But then Palin’s record is still there though…

    EricPWJohnson (be6834)

  101. EPWJ, you’re anti Daniels too?

    Jeez. You’re entitled to your opinions, but who in the hell do you like, man?

    Dustin (b54cdc)

  102. to pass Lutheran confirmation class alls you got to do is say by grace alone just 3 little words easy peasy

    happyfeet (ab5779)

  103. MD

    Oh I was publically denounced on the Radio as causing it. In more than one state and over here

    EricPWJohnson (be6834)

  104. Tim Pawlenty is starting to look more and more like the real thing. As a Minnesotan who hasn’t lived there for decades, my initial reaction was “Oh, sure,” but if the nomination goes to the last man standing it could well be him. And he is certainly the anti-Obama style-wise. People could find him sound and safe.

    Mahon (42e313)

  105. To make it even more accurate – they accused me of formenting revolution et al and was a overseas leader of the Tea Party

    Go figure that huh?

    Me a Tea PartyLeader – you can almost hear the combined wretching of Tea Party Organizers everywhere…

    So Palin was falsely and wrongly accused

    Where do we write the check?

    EricPWJohnson (be6834)

  106. Pawlenty is like the real thing like Indiana is like South Dakota.

    happyfeet (ab5779)

  107. Dustin

    I’m not anti Daniels – he knows he cant win,
    I know he can’t win – so ask him why he thinks he can win? (hint why is he running?)

    EricPWJohnson (be6834)

  108. Now Daniels has had more than a few tries at the apple, and he still fails to allay
    people’s concerns, by seemingly misunderstanding how the left works.

    It’s hard for me to understand this point.

    Daniels is not failing. He’s a very successful governor whose state was like its neighbors, but now has improved and is better, because government got out of the way. He’s living proof.

    Now, I would have agreed to your point if you said “how the right works”. I think Daniels’s approach is the perfect one to fight the left on our budget crisis. The perfect answer to the division on 90% of issues is to say “hey, this is all a load of nonsense meant to divert attention from the huge crisis our government has created, so let’s fix that right now”

    Dustin (b54cdc)

  109. I was publically denounced on the Radio as causing it.

    Somehow I missed that.

    Without credibility I have no reason to bother with your suggestion of researching the internet.

    MD in Philly (3d3f72)

  110. EPWJ, Daniels is a strong campaigner, and while he is certainly not a sure bet of the nomination, he would win the general election because he would win the swing states against Obama’s unemployment record.

    He’s actually quite a good candidate. So tell me, why is he running? To stalk horse, a la Giuliani? If so, then he’s doing it for Palin, which doesn’t make any sense.

    Perhaps things are a little simpler. He’s a good governor who has cared deeply about this issue for 16 years, has a lot of experience at the highest levels of federal government, and lots of successful executive experience.

    I’m not sure who you think can win, if you don’t think Daniels can.

    Dustin (b54cdc)

  111. Dustin,

    You have to be able to win though, thats the point, Reagan was a national figure therefore a moderately successful president – both Bushes were not national figures, neither was Clinton, or Carter, Pelosi was more the President than Obama from the agenda side of the government and she was an established national figure.

    We need a national figure someone who can combine the workable side of the TEA Party in who doesnt care about what people say about them or their family, or worry excessively about how history will treat them.

    Seeing Bachmann, Perry, Thompson as the only one’s so far that meet that criterian – perhaps Jindal – Jindal has his ups and downs the spill thing didnt cover him in glory

    EricPWJohnson (be6834)

  112. Might I ask who you do support, EPWJ?

    If you’re just hopeless about the GOP slate, then that’s fine too, but I’m curious where you’re coming from on this.

    Dustin (b54cdc)

  113. Carry on, Dustin, I’m off to bed.

    MD in Philly (3d3f72)

  114. Eric, remember too that AK owns its natural resources. I think the govt owns the production.. not the black gold.

    Vermont Neighbor (352bcf)

  115. Jindal has his ups and downs the spill thing didnt cover him in glory

    What the f**k are you talking about?

    He was the only one trying to actually DO anything.

    Scott Jacobs (d027b8)

  116. I think it’s simply wrong, EPWJ, to suggest Bachmann and Thompson are more electable than Daniels. I’m not sure about Perry. He’s got some pluses and minuses… depends on how much more impressive Texas governorship is than Indiana (I say it’s less impressive, since it is less responsibility, but I realize most people don’t understand how Texas’s governor is not as significant as the Lt Gov).

    Dustin (b54cdc)

  117. Come on Dustin ever since Perot ran and was given unprecedented news coverage and free TV time in debtes – “also rans” like Daniels, Guiliani have it great – they dont really need to raise money, they dont really need to expend effort – they get free face time which in this day of Palinized Profit Politics – means cash

    Sure Daniels did good things so did many other governors – like every single Kansas and Oklahoma, Alabama, Mississippi governor for the past eons – they cant win and wont win but just are not willing to seek “look at me look at me” attention

    They are people of substance

    If Daniels was serious he would be campaiging raising money in a serious fashion

    So is he?

    We’ll find out soon

    Bachmann’s campaigning for votes BTW not TV time – just to point that out – so is Perry

    EricPWJohnson (be6834)

  118. Honestly if feels like we’re talking to ‘Otto’ from a ‘Fish called Wanda’ who had to be remind, that ‘Aristotle wasn’t Belgian, and the London Underground wasn’t a political Movement’ words don’t mean anything to him. Indiana, an industrial midwestern state is of course important in the scheme of things, that’s why the behavior of Lugarand Bayh has been distressing of late.

    narciso (e694f9)

  119. Scott

    Jindal was talking about wanting a 100 billion from all the oil companies – then quickly shut up about it – but that disturbed me

    What people dont know is about 55,000+ barrels are spilled DAILY into the gulf from thousands of wells each leaking 5 to 10 a day you know there are no rubber stoppers in god’s kingdom if you stick a whole in the earth its going to ooze

    He should have known that – also where’s the spill?

    Gone now

    EricPWJohnson (be6834)

  120. Pappy Bush was a national figure, he was Reagan’s veep.

    Vermont Neighbor (68ff46)

  121. narcisco

    Like I said I’m an Otto, I’m a cousin of DeeDee, I’m a Kennedyby marriage, an Pelosi enabler, a lefty – well it is true in a sense – a smear merchant, a liar and a thief

    But Palin, still has a record as governor which is 180 degrees from her book tour speech band wagon rhectoric than has earned her 8 large heading for 9 figures – not bad

    EricPWJohnson (be6834)

  122. On behalf of the Hoosier State, we would like to encourage Eric to stay the hell away from our State.

    The State of Indiana (d4bbf1)

  123. Thanks pat for the post – I was having trouble keeping control 🙂

    EricPWJohnson (be6834)

  124. I’m a conservative who outright refuses to vote for Palin. God help our country if she is nominated.

    [This is not the real JD.]

    jd (10b9bb)

  125. Too late Hoosiers – actually the Party want me to run there in a few years

    I’ll give you guys a 2 years heads up so you can either be

    Ready for me


    I’d put the sarc tag in but that woud imply that it wasnt true…..

    you never know..

    EricPWJohnson (be6834)

  126. And CIA director, and UN Ambassador, and party chief
    and envoy to China, but the media didn’t think that
    very significant did they, they slighted his war record too, and they played up Kerry’s, if they didn’t have double standards, they would have none at all.

    narciso (e694f9)

  127. Goodnight JD,

    Sorry – carry on with the Palin worship

    Sarah is my shepard – I shall not want (well, in Alaska anyway)

    She makes me lieth down with happy thoughts

    Yeah though some people say mean things about her, she shall have her rebuttal

    And will write checks to her – its America that politicians should acept large cash fee’s for making public appearances

    EricPWJohnson (be6834)

  128. also, x2 @ everything said in post 50.

    To add to that: she has no gravitas. none. neither did o’donnell. or anyone else who lost in the recent elections and ran under the tea party platform.

    [This is not the real JD.]

    jd (10b9bb)

  129. @ Eric: i’m a different JD than above. same initials i guess?

    Sarah Palin would make a great cheerleader and base rouser. But nothing more. She wouldn’t make a good class president, and having quit student council, it’s hard to think she’ll ever be taken seriously again.

    I take her about as seriously as a fly-by-night successful author and lecture series participant.

    My ideal selection would be Christie/Rubio or Christie/Daniels. I’d like to see Ryan and West take a shot down the road, too.

    [This is not the real JD.]

    jd (10b9bb)

  130. _____________________________________

    I wish Palin could, because I think physical attractiveness counts a lot in a presidential election

    I saw the interview Palin did with Barbara Walters several weeks ago and Palin — for reasons that have nothing to do with ideology — didn’t come off well. Of course, I’d favor her or, for that matter, anyone else who tilts to the right over the current occupant of the White House. But there’s too much of a happy-talk, local-news-anchor demeanor about Palin that to my way of thinking undercuts her seriousness. Of course, this really wouldn’t bother me all that much if there weren’t so many squishy, much less flat-out leftwing, voters throughout America.

    Mark (3e3a7c)

  131. smallcapJD

    that’s okay I understand it wasnt the JD Large

    Just to avoid confusion – on earlier threads I have other names which is an intersting combination of Feminine hygiene products and garden hoses

    EricPWJohnson (be6834)

  132. Rubio,

    Been awful quiet since CPAC/past

    EricPWJohnson (be6834)

  133. @ Mark:

    to borrow from Niall, Sarah Palin is a “happy-clappy republican”

    [This is not the real JD.]

    jdsmallcaps (10b9bb)

  134. Please no Palin. As we have so painfully learned with obama, having a crush on the candidate is no reason to vote for the candidate

    I like Palin, she’s hot, she’s fresh, she’s right on the issues, but it’s Her vs The World if she runs


    pardon mon capslock

    BDJ (72b0ed)

  135. Epwj – I have asked you, repeatedly, to lay out my position on Palin. You cannot, because that would show how vacuous your claims of Palin worship are.

    I think everyone is curious to find out what party is encouraging you to run for office in Indiana in 2 years. You are approaching International Man of Parody status.

    JD (d4bbf1)

  136. So we are straight, this does not strip unions of collective bargaining. It just removes benefits from that. Salary is still included in collective bargaining, tied towards the CPI. It also would make the unions collect their own dues, not the government, and it would make the union members rectify the union annually. GASP. Oh, and contribute less than 6% towards their pension, and 12% towards their health insurance. Quelle horror’!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! No wonder poopypants came here throwing feces. The facts don’t match up with the hysteria from the unions and their leftist allies. Cowards.

    JD (d4bbf1)

  137. Now why doesn’t Daniels lead with this, as his campaign plank, mystifying really, For someone who says that he sees the influence of Christianity being agressively supplanted, you fall for their post modern premises, rather easily Mark.

    narciso (e694f9)

  138. My dream ticket would be Christie/Rubio 2012.

    Y-not (45d6ad)

  139. I’m ready for people to announce they’re in… not a one of them is getting any fresher they need to get crackin’

    happyfeet (ab5779)

  140. chop chop

    happyfeet (ab5779)

  141. Great idea. We should totally nominate the gun-grabbing, pro-amnesty, guy…’cause nothing could go wrong with THAT formula!

    (And since when is granting citizenship to 20M low-skilled workers, with back-dated medicaid and socsec eligibility, a fiscally wise idea?)

    BobInFL (bae5a3)

  142. We tried that in 1987, just created a ‘moral hazard’ problem when the next wave arose in 1994,
    after the peso collapse,

    narciso (e694f9)

  143. immigrants are friends not food

    happyfeet (ab5779)

  144. The Christie detractors would get more traction with me if they would cease with the hyperbole. Christie’s comments on immigration struck me as (1) very lawyerly and (2) pretty standard stuff. When asked about AZ’s law he focused (like a lawyer) on the roles of the federal vs state governments, including criticizing Obama for not taking the lead on this issue. He is not an open-borders guy. He did say the standard “path to citizenship” stuff… which most of them seem to do, including Palin.

    Christie, circa June 2010, on immigration:

    “What I support is making sure that the federal government [plays] each and every one of its roles: Securing the border, enforcing immigration laws, and having an orderly process — whatever that process is — for people to gain citizenship.”

    He added: “It’s a very easy issue to demagogue and I’m just not going to participate in that.”

    Christie said more resources — specifically, “money” — were needed to support federal law enforcement and border security, along with “having a clear understandable law that people can follow.”

    “Until you have both of those…you’re not going to fix the problem,” he said.

    Christie also said he thinks state and local law enforcement don’t have appropriate training to enforce immigration laws, and that it can distract from their overriding goal of keeping the public safe

    Y-not (45d6ad)

  145. Yes, that’s the excuse they all use, to avoid enforcement, yet the Feds don’t do that job either.

    narciso (e694f9)

  146. All of you Christie and Daniels partisans, are going to have to develop a tough skin, because
    not only statements that candidates have said, butthings that were never intended, will be brought up
    against your person, the experience of Jeb, Romney, W, McCain, et al, is instructive

    narciso (e694f9)

  147. What’s the tactical wisdom of picking a guy who works well with the oppostition, like Christie or to a lesser extent, TPaw, when our pick will likely have both houses behind them?

    Scott Walker just did what Christie is pretending to rescinding collective bargaining from state employees.

    Christie would be a fabulous Press Secretary if he were not otherwise better employed.

    gary gulrud (790d43)

  148. In stumping for the “Great Fat Hope” I suspect Coulter is trying to wakeup streets Wall and Broad to the effete flaccidity of their fave, whom they intend to bankroll with 100s of millions.

    Outside NH, UT, AZ, NV and ID, possibly MO, MI and at the outside MA can uberDIABLO carry anything? Can he win the nomination?

    gary gulrud (790d43)

  149. JD

    I’m not stating your positions, and yes several prominent Republicans have asked when I will be back in Indiana, I’ve told them I have no plans to ever run for office except may locally – and I am permanently stationed in Texas and Tennessee.

    We have a large family, some of my relatives – a large group of my relatives live in Indiana

    EricPWJohnson (be6834)

  150. JD Et al

    Also I will find out in a few weeks if we are moving to Asia, which is looking more and more a likelihood which at that point will cease blogging because of the time difference and the fact where I will be is closely monitored

    EricPWJohnson (be6834)

  151. Gary,

    “Fat white Hope?”

    EricPWJohnson (be6834)

  152. UPDATE 2-18-11: Christie has won Hawkins’s poll.

    Patterico (c218bd)

  153. “if we don’t run this guy, and we go instead with another candidate (whether it be Mitt Romney, Sarah Palin, or, God help us, Mike Huckabee) we’re going to lose”

    A completely unwarranted conclusion on the spare evidence provided by Coulter as to her considered electoral calculations.

    Three somewhat non-intersecting constituencies the totals for which are unexamined.

    A little thought should reveal that two thirds of the Right will not willingly vote Romney and will write-in if necessary.

    gary gulrud (790d43)

  154. > moving to Asia

    Will you be fund-raising for Obama?.

    Vermont Neighbor (ae55d7)

  155. Vermont

    Why of course right after I donate 50,000 to the defenders of Kimberland and bequeath my homes to PW’s resident evil.

    You’re based in Signapore right?

    EricPWJohnson (be6834)

  156. 151.“Fat white Hope?”

    I stand corrected, but the point remains-not an entirely ingenuous compliment.

    Whether the irony detracts from the “pillars” of the GOP or from Christie’s candidacy is uncertain. The ambiguity is likely intentional.

    Whatever else we might think of Coulter, straightforward is seldom apt.

    gary gulrud (790d43)

  157. Hey, I’m still paying down the $300M that we borrowed to get Obama elected. Just trying to cut back now on incidentals (vacations, golf, kobe beef, jewelry). The weekly superstar concert series may have to go too. Times are tight on the old plantation.

    Vermont Neighbor (352bcf)

  158. On page 1,997 of Obamacare. A new law that turns the Lincoln bedroom into a small office for Acorn.

    Vermont Neighbor (af7a3a)

  159. Exhibit A., EPWJ-

    Neither you, nor I, nor SPQR, nor Bachmann, Hannity, or O’Reilly had been singled out as having a web site that motivated the shooting. To overlook that fact in order to make the claim Palin knows how to play the victim is a lack of knowledge or intellectual dishonesty.

    Comment by MD in Philly — 2/17/2011 @ 8:53 pm

    Hear hear.

    See how easily your fatuous arguments are demolished EPWJ?

    You just keep lowering my opinion of you with every comment.

    SPQR (26be8b)

  160. @ Gary:

    “A completely unwarranted conclusion on spare evidence” is considerably more evidence than your magical “thought exploration”.

    I stand by my point about Palin: she’s a happy-clappy republican.

    As for “fat white hope” – if we’ve come to a point where identity politics matter, perhaps this isn’t such a bad thing in the US?

    jdsmallcaps (776c36)

  161. Prominent people are recruiting him to run for office, SPQR. It is true.

    JD (d4bbf1)

  162. Really, I see too many candidates, willing to ignore the ‘fundamental tranformation’ of this country,that is being attempted. Christie and Daniels only talk aboutmoney, not the loss of our god given and hard fought freedoms, you’d think Coulter would care about that.

    narciso (e694f9)

  163. All of you Christie and Daniels partisans, are going to have to develop a tough skin, because
    not only statements that candidates have said, butthings that were never intended, will be brought up
    against your person, the experience of Jeb, Romney, W, McCain, et al, is instructive

    Comment by narciso

    True. Vet them hard. However, do not reject someone just because there is a reason to reject them. Pick the most conservative guy who can win.

    Otherwise, we wind up with the guy whose constituency is not built on conservatives, and in this case, that is Huckabee. If we just reject candidate after candidate, we wind up with something poor.

    Dustin (b54cdc)

  164. Any stumped candidate has two gaunlets to run: one for the nomination another for the office.

    To which is Coulter referring, both?

    Of the 52% Strap-on won he’s bled 10% of the total for good–a ham sandwich can lose the Kosher and Falafel crowd and still beat AntiMessiah.

    The Kosher vote goes to the RINO third party candidate, the Falafel vote to Nor Luap.

    So the first gauntlet is the important one.

    gary gulrud (790d43)

  165. JD


    Still waiting for you to say anything…

    EricPWJohnson (be6834)

  166. SPQR

    Sure, but Palin’s record as a taxer and spender is still out there though…

    EricPWJohnson (be6834)

  167. Keep waiting, clown. I am laughing at you.

    JD (d4bbf1)

  168. Well Coulter, as well Rush, Hannity, Beck, all supported Romney,who left them in the lurch in February 2008, the same stampede that one sees toward Christie now, any way that’s the way it seems. But forget about my view, I’m nobody in the big scheme of things.

    narciso (e694f9)

  169. @ Narciso: “oh oh oh! forget about what everyone else says….believe MEEEEEEE!”

    will take you up on your offer to ignore you.

    jdsmallcaps (776c36)

  170. jdsmalls, who do you support? Make a positive case. Let’s not just bash Palin. It strikes many as unfair to rudely attack her, despite her flaws, because she’s taken too many hits like that. Make a positive case that someone specific would make a better candidate.

    Perhaps you’re like EPWJ, and think Bachmann should be president.

    Dustin (b54cdc)

  171. So Jan. 2012 begins the series of caucusses, open and closed, primaries, open and closed, winner-take-all and proportional representation.

    Inotherwords, a battle for electors as well as the electorate.

    Who’s strong with GOP electors in place outside their home state? In some sort of order, Romney, Barbour, Palin, Huckabee, Pawlenty, Christie, Gingrich.

    Anyone else?

    gary gulrud (790d43)

  172. 160. “happy-clappy”

    Sorry if the argument is elliptic, “spare evidence” pertains to the conclusion that Coulter regards Christie, over his remonstrations to the contrary, is draftable and surmounting that hurdle, electable.

    gary gulrud (790d43)

  173. “It costs nothing for the taxpayers of NJ to join the other states challenging Obamacare. All he needs to do is add his name on behalf of NJ to the other states. He didn’t take the lead and now he won’t bring up the rear. And just because Corzine ducked doesn’t mean he has to. For all the loud bravado, on this hugely important issue he’s a wimp. While others are doing all they can to kill Obamacare, spending the time and effort in federal court trying to protect the citizens of their states, Christie does nothing.”

    “Keep in mind that Obamacare creates massive new expenses for states via Medicaid. It’s fiscally irresponsible for Christie to sit on his butt and do nothing. Is this what they mean by frank talk? Maybe his supporters inside the beltway can help us better understand while they’re touting him for president.”

    Viator (c5da79)

  174. Electors are honor bound, often legally, to first-ballot support of the candidate.

    The play 2010 side-liners like Daniels or Thune have is the Knight-Astride-Charger gambit of a brokered convention.

    A play, but not a good one, although this could well be the first brokered convention in an age.

    gary gulrud (790d43)

  175. Huckabee garnered 21% of the votes last time(not sure whether electors or electorate). While his constituency is invisible the question is how pliable might his electors be at a brokered convention.

    Would they tip for the RINO, some or all?

    gary gulrud (790d43)

  176. Gary, of course they would tip to a RINO from my definition of a RINO. My head can’t even compute any possible way Huck isn’t a RINO.

    Just understand what happened in 2008. The guy whose constituency relied least on conservatives was best able to weather the storm of conservatives rejecting a slate where every candidate was flawed. Rudy grabbed guns, Romney… lol, Fred wasn’t charging hard,

    I see the same pattern emerging. Any candidate has major problems with conservatives, but we need to accept the most conservative, on the budget crisis, who can win. If we can’t build a coalition around that, we’ll wind up with Huckabee or Palin (who is conservative, I realize).

    Dustin (b54cdc)

  177. Isn’t this electability argument that got us McCain, he was strong on the budget issues, and national security, but was anathema on a whole host
    of issues

    narciso (e694f9)

  178. 176. Perhaps, or only a fiscal hawk’s blind spot, perceiving a so-con callous disregard for one’s core concerns as inconstancy?

    Have they not their own arcane issues?

    Anyway, after SuperTuesday only a half-dozen survivors soldier on.

    gary gulrud (790d43)

  179. At the end, narciso, after the right had rejected everyone but Mccain, Romney, and Huck, yes, Mccain won on electability.

    But we should pick the most conservative who can win instead of rejecting all the conservatives and realizing a few candidates have strong support without conservatives, and now we get to pick one of those losers.

    Dustin (b54cdc)

  180. @ Dustin:

    It’s only ‘unfair’ and ‘rude’ when liberals attack her. For the most part, their attacks are about as baseless as their political beliefs. I’ve seen valid criticisms though. Take from that what you will.

    But when a conservative attacks her…it’s ‘unfair’ and ‘rude’? All I have seen so far is non-stop genuflection to her political denomination that she has manufactured over the past two years (past two years meaning she was, in all seriousness, a political nobody until McCain chose her). It closely parallels the cult-ish devotion lefties have for Obama.

    I refuse to imbibe that kool-aid.

    Her flaws aren’t minimal by the way. They’re actually very significant. And very worrisome to me, as a citizen and as a conservative. I would vote for the collective conscience of a pool full of manatees over Obama, but a pool full of manatees does not, I submit, make a good executive. This coming election is not just about beating Obama, but it is about competent and effective leadership.

    To suggest that “she’s taken too many hits like that” is to suggest those who see her for what she is, a cheerleader, may not maintain their objections against her and support other more ideal, more qualified, more tried-and-tested-and-verified candidates (or, shall I say, ‘possibilities’).

    We do not need a cheerleader for this country. Nor do we need a third-string punter like Obama.

    Right now we have some very serious heavy hitters in the republican party, and though it’s getting late in the 4th quarter there is still enough time on the clock to do what is necessary.

    Sarah Palin is NOT the solution. She SHOULD have turned down McCain’s request. And she SHOULD contemplate what grave risk her actions now will have on the field down the road. As should those who have been lapping the kool-aid since they saw her pretty face at the end of August, 2008.

    jdsmallcaps (776c36)

  181. @ Dustin: 2012 is the GOP’s election to lose. I think they can lose by picking Palin, Jindal, Romney, or Huckabee.

    Seriously though, if Palin ran with McCain as her selected VP, would she still win? No. No she would not.

    I could l

    jdsmallcaps (776c36)

  182. er not sure why that was posted above, but whatever. It’s there. Was going to continue that I could list two dozen conservative-minded friends who were TOTALLY turned off of Palin and either chose not to vote, or voted Barr.

    Why? She’s like the University of Phoenix candidate. No gravitas. No substance, all bulletpoints. And terrible diplomat.

    About the only thing you could really count on her to do right is to pick Supreme Court Justices. But who knows, we might end up with another Harriet Miers situation. (Koz ftw in my book)

    jdsmallcaps (776c36)

  183. Here are Hawkin’s results for the 2008 field:

    Net Score For The 2008 Nominees (Positive Minus Negative)

    10) Ron Paul (-65.5)
    9) Alan Keyes (-41.5)
    8 John Cox (-38.0)
    7) Tom Tancredo (-15.5)
    6) John McCain (-13.0)
    5) Mike Huckabee (24.5)
    4) Mitt Romney (25.0)
    3) Rudy Giuliani (33.0)
    2) Duncan Hunter (37.5)
    1) Fred Thompson (72.0)

    madawaskan (fd190b)

  184. So, at convention, who is in position today, to play-apart from the frontrunners?

    Barbour, Nor Luap, maybe TPaw if a miracle happens.

    Yeah, Christie could carry a few Blue states by write-in: NJ, NY, DE. Let’s not count them in our Electoral College totals, ok?

    gary gulrud (790d43)

  185. is my comment not going to be posted?

    jdsmallcaps (776c36)

  186. Comment by madawaskan

    Thanks for that info, which puts the meaning/importance/predictive value of this poll in limbo.

    Though it has been said before, I’ll say it here again. There are may people who have some respect for Palin who will be happy to vote for someone else, but the way to get that to happen is to be positive about the alternative candidate, why they would be better. The people running will get enough character assassination from others.

    Personally, I will not give any credibility to Palin Bashers who claim to be Repubs or conservatives. Feel free to prefer others, feel free to even not like Palin, but be it Palin or any other possibility lets try to keep the discussion on why someone is better.

    I think a big issue will be how many people have figured out Obama and will want almost anyone else, as opposed to people who still think he is a good guy. There will be a third who will vote for Obama no matter what.

    MD in Philly (3d3f72)

  187. MD is extremely reasonable, and I agree with his gut reaction to people who are bashing Palin. I know in my head that some of them are sincere conservatives who take electability seriously, or simply insist on more experience in a President. I do too. But Palin is one of the good guys, and if you’re not at least personally sympathetic to her, it’s going to undermine your points with most GOP voters.

    That is very tricky. Well… not really. I like Palin and regret she wouldn’t win the general in a landslide against Obama. It’s crazy.

    Dustin (b54cdc)

  188. @ MD in Philly:

    Let’s lay it out:

    Palin vs. Daniels

    Daniels wins on experience
    Daniels wins on track record
    Daniels wins on fiscal issues
    Daniels wins on deep-seeded understanding of conservative issues.
    Daniels wins. With Gravitas

    Palin wins on… being more excited.

    Palin vs. Christie:

    Christie wins on experience
    Christie wins on results
    Christie wins on the message
    Christie wins on gravitas
    Chirstie wins on attitude

    Palin wins on…sex-appeal.

    So, to keep it ‘positive’, palin offers a few minimal things to the table. She’s appealing to the eyes. She’s more excited about America.

    “Let’s keep this positive” = “Let’s keep this civil” (according to the Democrats).

    JareD (776c36)

  189. @ Dustin – tell us what Palin would NEED to actually win in the general.

    (please please don’t say another book deal, another TLC show, another tv show…)

    JareD (776c36)

  190. I agree with you JareD.

    What Palin would need to win the general is another several years of experience in a high office. Also, it’s a little more dynamic to express what she needs to win swing states. 1 part politics shifting, 2 parts her image changing. I dunno. It’s hard for me to say because I admire her, but saw the 2010 election with Palin’s faction falling short of where they ought to be compared to the Murkowskis and Reids.

    Dustin (b54cdc)

  191. Still, JareD, there is being right, and there is convincing others you are right. The latter is simply not going to happen for those who are gratuitous about the Palin bashing. Don’t shoot the messenger.

    Dustin (b54cdc)


    Here is someone I can support as well, a great American

    EricPWJohnson (be6834)

  193. 184. Daniels and Christie have a deeper beauty than the merely superficial, one that abides.


    gary gulrud (790d43)

  194. @ Dustin: I’m intrigued by your fascination with Palin. Because while I can acknowledge that she’s a significant player in expressing general conservative messages, I can’t put her up there as someone who substantially represents a somewhat ideal candidate. I can speak about her in a positive light, but that completely neglects why she’s not a satisfactory candidate for the office of the president of the united states.

    Likewise, I can explain obamacare in a positive light, but that completely neglects why it is a terrible bill much less in blatant disregard to the commerce clause.

    Equally so, I could illuminate the ideas of why the recent egyptian revolution is a good thing while ignoring the very grave problems that will arise as a result of this.

    Here’s the rub: when most people are making judgments on anything, they’re going to have a pro and a con list. Who in their right mind would not consider the cons?

    I imagine that if I had starry eyes for ron paul, i’d probably only want to talk about his positive aspects and not his negative ones.

    JareD1 (776c36)

  195. Well no, because people are willing to back Christie, because of a few speeches and a little
    over a year in office, they are willing to back
    Daniels, even though he seems to have forgotten
    some fundamental principles along the way. Every single time she is ridiculed for being out ahead
    of the crowd, she is proven right. Those that voted mfor the Consumer agency, the Food Security Bill, New START, they are not hammered with 1/100th for the crippling effect of their ignorance, which will linger long after the name of Obama is an unpleasant memory. The current budget, shows what a sham the little patch on
    the tax system really was. We see in Madison, and elsewhere, how the most narrow reforms are met with cries of total war, whereas the consequences
    of not acting, are really downplayed.

    narciso (e694f9)

  196. I can speak about her in a positive light, but that completely neglects why she’s not a satisfactory candidate for the office of the president of the united states.

    See, I say I admire her tenacity, her ability to walk through hellfire, and her support for her values, while noting she lacks the experience and the pull in difficult states to win.

    How have I neglected anything? Anything that matters, anyway. But I just plain like her, viscerally.

    hey are willing to back
    Daniels, even though he seems to have forgotten
    some fundamental principles along the way

    What principle did he forget? It’s not like he said we should be liberal on social issues. He simply noted the truth. We have a specific crisis that requires us to put aside other dear issues because that builds a coalition to solve the debt bomb. DADT or whatever is not as important. People who react to Daniels’s point by saying he is abandoning core values or something like that don’t seem to appreciate how serious our situation is.

    That said, he needs to do a better job communicating this if he’s going to have a chance in hell of a nomination. I think he’s the most conservative who can win.

    Dustin (b54cdc)

  197. I think admiring Palin’s “tenacity” this late in the game is itself an admirable exemplar of tenacity.

    happyfeet (a55ba0)

  198. Jared, a couple of other things I like about Palin are that she proved honest. She took on her own party’s corruption instead of becoming part of it as soon as she had a real chance to. She has been scrutinized to the level of hacking into her emails, and she’s actually honest. That goes a long way for me.

    She also has been able to criticize Obama pretty damn effectively over the past couple of years. I like her as a pundit, but her honesty and leadership are needed in a position of more trust. That said, the Presidency requires so much more leadership experience to be good at it… no matter how innately gifted someone is.

    I hope to see Palin in the Senate or even somewhere in the administration, and I don’t mean that as a consolation prize or an effort to get her fans to support my guy. We actually need honest clear thinking people, and Palin does have great experience at various levels of government that easily justify all kinds of high offices.

    Dustin (b54cdc)

  199. I think admiring Palin’s “tenacity” this late in the game is itself an admirable exemplar of tenacity.

    Comment by happyfeet —


    But think about it. She’s is smart and honest. She’s also a great way to shape the debate. I wish she had run for Senate.

    Dustin (b54cdc)

  200. Dustin,

    Quitting to enrich herself, leaving a job she swore an oath to perform? Walking through Hellfire?

    What about insisting on six figures to attend political rallies and give speeches?

    EricPWJohnson (be6834)

  201. Quitting to enrich herself, leaving a job she swore an oath to perform?

    She did not actually swear an oath to complete her office, but rather swore to serve her state and uphold its laws. She did a much better job of that than Murkowski did. Agreed?

    I agree, finances played into her quitting her job. So? She was broke and unable to support her family, thanks to the hordes of corruption suing her baselessly.

    Anyone who changes jobs in order to remain financially viable is OK in my book. I agree with you, EPWJ. Alaska needed more of Palin’s leadership. But it just couldn’t happen. It was either Palin with the title, and no real governor, thanks to the constant lawfare, or Palin upholding her oath and protecting her family’s finances.

    I fail to see what your point is, actually.

    Dustin (b54cdc)

  202. Well,

    “She was broke and unable to support her family”

    no, she had a pac raising 100,000 a pop to defend her..

    As far as the rest, well its spin – she walked away because she created a mess and didnt want to deal with it

    EricPWJohnson (be6834)

  203. “Let’s keep this positive” = “Let’s keep this civil” (according to the Democrats).
    Comment by JareD

    Puhleease…You must not frequent here if you are equating me with a Democrat

    Dustin is not “fascinated” by Palin, nor is anyone else around here that “supports” her to any degree.

    Palin came onto the scene as an extremely popular governor (80%+) who had defeated both Democrats and entrenched republicans to get where she was. Her story was one of an everyday person who stood up to do what she thought needed to be done, first at the school board, then as mayor, then as gov. after a stint on some commission dealing with the oil and energy business in Alaska. Though not experienced as a gov., she had more executive experience than Obama or Biden, and certainly more functioning brainpower than Biden.

    She was the subject of more scrutiny and character assassination than anyone else that I’ve seen, and instead of caving in and disappearing from public life she has gone forward.

    In doing that she has become well known in a vaccuum. No one else has been as prominent as a critic of Obama or championed the concerns of the “typical American who is fed up”.

    Does that make her an ideal or even good candidate? No, but it means any one else will need to eclipse her. If someone overtakes her by pulling her down, that person will have alienated a significant number of very active and enthusiastic voters. I think that would be stupid to do. So anybody who wants to move forward by stepping on Palin lacks both respect and brains.

    That’s all.

    I’ve never heard Daniels speak and I’ve only heard Christie on chopping spending. They may both be better candidates. On the other hand, a NJ Repub and Indiana repub are two different things. If Christie really has been in favor of one or both of Obama’s Supreme Court nominees, that would be a problem, same if he supports ObamaCare or Cap and Tax.

    MD in Philly (3d3f72)

  204. I’ve never heard Daniels speak and I’ve only heard Christie on chopping spending. They may both be better candidates. On the other hand, a NJ Repub and Indiana repub are two different things.

    You, like many, will have an open mind when we have debates, and hear the candidates argue their POVs.

    I don’t know why I even respond to gratuitous Palin bashing. The only conceivable point of that stuff is to ruin threads or rub egos. If it’s politically motivated, it’s meant to undermine a positive discussion of people like Daniels and Christie rather than rob Palin of support (the idea these claims would hurt Palin more, here, is silly).

    Dustin (b54cdc)

  205. Dustin

    as opposed to gratuitous Palin spinning 🙂

    I must admit that was the smoothest spin for someone who ran away from her responsibilities for cash

    EricPWJohnson (be6834)

  206. I agree she should have stolen Lisa’s cookies

    happyfeet (a55ba0)

  207. @ Dustin: oh now you’re just granting her character waivers. And when you’re on the defensive like that, you’re waging a losing battle already.

    She needed to quit because she had to make money on Fox News? Sell and write books? You said she went through hellfire. Maybe i’d grant you that if she had held through her governorship. But going through ‘hellfire’ is par for the course for anyone. Maybe you’d be willing to say Obama is going through hellfire too? Really, there’s no basis for that but to paint her as a joan of arc type.

    @ MD in Philly: you’re right i’m new here. And as such, you should know that I wasn’t calling you a democrat, but you’re simply using their tactics. Capice?

    And to say she has more executive experience than Obama or Biden in 2012 is utterly ignorant. Indeed, she “had” more. And do you know why she’s a prominent critic? Because the liberals WANT her to be the chosen candidate. And so they’ll give her as much room as possible to speak. And they’ll mow her down with alinsky-speak.

    And so I think it’s laughable that you think it is THIS that requires any other contender to ‘eclipse her’. What you’re essentially saying is that she should be untouchable and that anyone who can’t eclipse her without pointing out why he/she is better than her is going to alienate all the palin-supporters (who, i assume you believe are incapable of supporting any other conservative?). The fact is, there are a good handful of way-more-qualified persons than Palin.

    “So anyone who steps on Palin lacks respect and brains.” Well, if her supporters are incapable of supporting some other candidate….!

    If you haven’t heard Daniels speak, I highly recommend hunting down his CPAC speech. It is far and above any speech I’ve ever heard Palin give (and I’ve heard 2 in person).

    @ Dustin again: you don’t respond to “palin-bashing” because of cognitive dissonance. To suggest that anyone who takes a negative view on palin and expresses him or herself is here to ‘ruin threads’ (ruin the purity of palin support?) or rub egos (much like those who like to rub egos by unquestionable support of her?) is absurd.

    “if it is politically motivated” – it’s not. it’s more fundamental and substantive than mere politics. and to ‘rob’ palin of support? well if you don’t think it really matters ‘here’, then why object? because “it is here to undermine a positive discussion of Christie and Daniels”? Er, no.

    I’m wondering: can anyone here who thinks Palin would make a great President of the United States make a case that Herman Cain is more qualified than Sarah Palin?

    JareD1 (776c36)

  208. MD in Philly

    There are may people who have some respect for Palin who will be happy to vote for someone else, but the way to get that to happen is to be positive about the alternative candidate.

    That’s a really good suggestion. I think it’s probably hers if she wants it. Iowa and South Carolina are tailor made for her, and she supposedly has a real strong network of supporters set up already in Iowa. She probably has more than enough funding.

    However,I am not looking forward to the Republican primary. I’ve got a feeling it’s going to get ugly-particularly online.

    I don’t think people come to online discussions undecided. It’s polarizing as all get out.

    I really loathe fragging-drives me absolutely up the wall, and it’s sizing up to be one hell of a -shootin’ circle.

    madawaskan (fd190b)

  209. I think it’s probably hers if she wants it.

    I agree. The fact is that a lot of people recognize that she is serious and trustworthy. They mostly know about her flaws, but since they also don’t know for sure if they can trust anyone else, they will stick with Palin anyway. She’s going to win primaries in a lot of blue states.

    I’ve got a feeling it’s going to get ugly-particularly online.

    It’s going to be terrible.

    Dustin [aka DRJ's Evil Twin] (b54cdc)

  210. if I may add, at the end of the situation in Madison Wisconsin, I think we’ll be able to count Walker as a person who has 1) gone through hellfire, 2) lived through personal attacks and did not quit, 3) has tenacity, 4) has stood up to Obama in both the state and national level of political discourse, and 5) won such fight (because I think he will).

    Not to threadjack here, but I’m wondering if anyone here has thought that it might be more important to retake the senate and bolster the margin in the house?

    I need to check out what races are up in 2012 and how it could be the ultimate game-changer…

    JareD1 (776c36)

  211. @ DRJ’s Evil twin:

    Yeah it’s gonna get real ugly. It’ll be nonstop Palin support except in the Ron Paul forum. I suspect a hint of Huckabee, a pinch of Pawlenty, and a dash of Daniels but nothing more….

    But hey, look on the brightside – whoever ends up beating Obama will get to say, “hey, I inherited this recession” lol

    JareD1 (776c36)

  212. Not to threadjack here, but I’m wondering if anyone here has thought that it might be more important to retake the senate and bolster the margin in the house?

    Very good point.

    In fact, that is more important in many respects. Obama’s agenda is already dead. His actions with Obamacare are serious, and cannot be reversed without a Republican in the white house, but otherwise, he is largely neutered. They always say the current election is the most significant one ever, but this election is not as important as 2008 was.

    I still say we need to win if at all possible. Nominations and undoing the damage a veto could maintain are big deals.

    Dustin [Who almost screwed up his handle AGAIN] (b54cdc)

  213. @ Dustin’s screwed up handle

    – just saw that about half the republicans voted with democrats to block an additional 22B in cuts.

    maybe winning the senate and bolstering the house is worthless….


    JareD1 (776c36)

  214. Christie would be a bad choice for president. You’ll still have an all-powerful tyrannical state that has no regard for individual rights, under guys like Chritie, it will just be one that’s fiscally “responsible”.

    What that means in practice is is that the government will confiscate all your guns, constantly tell you what you can or can’t do, but government transfer programs that benefit the poor will be shut down because they’ll be deemed to be fiscally irresponsible.

    Christie is a statist and a despot at heart, he’s not the guy who’s going to bring us individual freedom and limited government, and Palin would be a much better choice if we had a presidential election today.

    Dave Surls (6e02a8)

  215. Not to threadjack here, but I’m wondering if anyone here has thought that it might be more important to retake the senate and bolster the margin in the house?

    No the Executive in the US holds a hell of a lot of power for several reasons.


    War powers.
    Judicial appointments which are for LIFE.

    That applies not to just the Supreme Court but the Appellate Courts-again for life

    And then there is the agency appointments and power.

    Can’t get Green legislation?

    End run that-through the EPA.

    So ya-my answer is no.

    The damage Obama could do given yet another four years would take decades to turn around.

    madawaskan (fd190b)

  216. Dustin

    It’s going to be terrible.

    You know how certain that is?

    Everyone here could probably agree with that.


    madawaskan (fd190b)

  217. Christie and Ryan are the real deal. May be Daniels, couldn’t say for sure, though thet fact he was part of the Bush cabinet is not encouraging. But it has to be someone that in the middle of a debate literally calls BULLSHIT on Obama’s insane spending. It has to be fact-based,harsh, pointed and with a claw. Fear that if it’s anyone else they will pull their punches like Mccain did repeatedly. Ordinarily being a nice guy in politics is a must, but this is an extraordinary mess.

    Bugg (996c34)

  218. but you’re simply using their tactics. Capice

    No, I don’t Capice. What Dems mean by that is they get to slander Repubs but Repubs are supposed to be polite. That is intellectually dishonest and not a tactic I would use. Entiende? Verstehen Sie?

    And to say she has more executive experience than Obama or Biden in 2012 is utterly ignorant
    You are sorely provoking me to be rude in kind, but I will resist for the moment. If you reread my comment, you should understand I was retracing Palin’s path to where she is now, and where she is now is the best known Republican on a national scale who may be running for president.

    Yeah, yeah, a lot of liberals want her to run to beat up on. you’ll see who the libs want to run when we see who wins the NH primary.

    And so I think it’s laughable that you think it is THIS that requires any other contender to ‘eclipse her’. What you’re essentially saying is that she should be untouchable and that anyone who can’t eclipse her without pointing out why he/she is better than her is going to alienate all the palin-supporters (who, i assume you believe are incapable of supporting any other conservative?).

    Keep laughing. When you want to understand instead of scoff in your misunderstanding we can resume the conversation. I never said anything about Palin being untouchable or people can’t point out why another candidate is better. What I was saying is one doesn’t have to be a jackass about it. Is that a hard concept?

    Yes, Walker will stand tall if he pulls this off, but he will be in the middle of his first term. But again, I don’t know anything else about him or what he has done before. I haven’t bothered to spend time learning about “candidates” who won’t be candidates.

    MD in Philly (3d3f72)

  219. _________________________________________

    but I’m wondering if anyone here has thought that it might be more important to retake the senate and bolster the margin in the house?

    But always keep in mind that senators and representatives don’t appoint people to the federal judicial system and the US Supreme Court in particular. The president does. And from that a lot of mischief can be created well after he leaves the White House. So a variety of idiotic decisions or rulings have been handed down by judges appointed by none other than Jimmy Carter over thirty (30) years ago.

    It’s like a gift that keeps on giving.

    Mark (411533)

  220. That really was dissapointing on the vote, but not
    really surprising considering Roger, Lundgren, et al, Noem shows she really is not in the ‘momma grizzly mode;

    narciso (e694f9)

  221. You’ll still have an all-powerful tyrannical state that has no regard for individual rights, under guys like Chritie, it will just be one that’s fiscally “responsible”.

    Whether or not this is true about Christie if he were the president, it does beg the question of whether we are at the point of experiencing such economical demise that voters might be and/or are willing to sacrifice gun rights and more if it means a balanced budget and fiscal responsibility?

    Dana (8ba2fb)

  222. #216

    That’s not an issue, as far as Chris Christie goes. Chris Christie hasn’t done a blessed thing to reduce either government spending (a big problem) or government debt (a smaller problem) in New Jersey.

    Christie was elected in 2009 and state government spending has risen from $50.9 billion in 2009 to $62.2 billion in 2012 (and it’s going to be even higher in 2013).

    The state debt has risen from $56.9 billion to #71.4 billion, and it will go even higher in 2013.

    If you believe that guys like Chris Christie are going to give you less government, less taxes and less debt…you’re simply wrong.

    What you’re going to get is more taxes, more debt, more and more and more government…and you can kiss your RKBA goodbye along with it.

    Frankly, the only thing I see about the guy that I like is that he dropped a hammer on gangbangers when he worked as a federal attorney.

    Other than that, he’s useless. He’s a big government boy, he’s arbitrary and capricious in what he claims he’ll veto, and, as far as I can tell, he has no regard whatsoever for indiviual rights, and I don’t want him anywhere near the White House.

    At least that’s how it looks to me.

    Dave Surls (6e02a8)

  223. Dave,

    I hear you on Christie but in all fairness to the man, I did the same with Palin, the first year they are in office – that spending was passed under the previous administration, also there is the effect on spending of medicare and medicaid with have some state matching funds, remember inflation plus growth = budget creep

    So I would go back and back out the increases in debt from 2009 and the increases in spending from 2009 or start from 2010 – I think you will have a much smaller increment well under the 5 or 6% growth plus inflation per year

    EricPWJohnson (be6834)

  224. Nothing that you did to Palin was even remotely fair.

    Icy Texan (0428cb)

  225. Icy

    Pointing out her record and the fact she whines, well, that is unfair to point out what someone does vs what someone says for cash

    I agree

    EricPWJohnson (be6834)

  226. 1) I’m too tired to re-visit (for the umpteenth time) your false accusations about how much she allegedly raised spending.

    2) Why are you so anti-capitalist?

    Icy Texan (0428cb)

  227. 220. “Rodgers, Lundgren,…Noem”

    Yes, $22 Billion is hardly draconian. While I concede Rodgers’ point that targeted repeals of legislation abolishing programs, agencies, bureaus,…, is the real work.

    Boehner is allowing these amendments to proceed to the floor and are being passed. Let’s see the total reductions when the bill is wrapped.

    Next the Senate takes it up, and will certainly add spending. The two versions will be reconciled in committee and returned to the House.

    It will fail. We will ‘start over’. Once something finally gets through Shiva will veto.

    And we haven’t even gotten to the Debt Ceiling.

    Republicans may have started out weak to avoid shutdown but at least rolling brownouts are now assured.

    gary gulrud (790d43)

  228. PeeWee is our assigned ‘minder’. Plainly the Insurgent-in-Chief does not take our threat seriously.

    gary gulrud (790d43)

  229. 217. I had a home in Milwaukee County when a ‘Bell, CA’ style pension scandal settled out. Walker, a state legislator, was elected to clean house and performed flawlessly.

    In a couple, no one will remember Christie for all the goodness Walker produces.

    Mark the tape.

    gary gulrud (790d43)

  230. Thanks, gary, for the additional info on “Walker, Wisconsin Ranger”

    Saturday, no classes, the students will be out in full force.

    Pro-Walker people will be coming in.

    In other countries people do this at the risk of their lives to get rid of a dictator, here people do it because they don’t want to chip into their own health care and retirement…

    MD in Philly (3d3f72)

  231. Icy,

    Pseudo Political profiteering – a noble profession

    EricPWJohnson (be6834)

  232. She isn’t a pirate, Eric. People are choosing to give her money.

    Icy Texan (0428cb)

  233. Icy,

    You are right – what I’m concerned about is – are people giving her money thinking sh’s running and in that vein – is she formenting an impression that these speeches are actually quasi fund raising events instead of for profit speaking engagements

    Thats the problem

    EricPWJohnson (be6834)

  234. That is only a problem to people of your ilk.

    JD (d4bbf1)

  235. EPWJ, I refudiate your impertinent invention of the word “formenting”.

    And on a much more serious note, there is no implied contract between Palin and the people giving her money that says “renumeration in exchange of a promise to run for POTUS”. She is promoting conservatism in a manner that she sees fit to do. If anyone reads something different into it, or draws a conclusion other than what has been stated by Mrs. Palin, that is their problem — not hers.

    Icy Texan (3c774f)

  236. Icy,

    Ummm, okay what I take from your statement is a confirmation ofmy hypothesis that as long as she’s paid she will e campaigning

    a first in America – Paid politics

    EricPWJohnson (89f1cb)

  237. Campaigning for conservative candidates, and conservatism in general. IOW, doing the right thing. A lot of the money she’s receiving is being used to foment a tidal wave of anti-progressive movements.

    Sounds to me like money well spent.

    Icy Texan (3c774f)

  238. MD in Philly,

    What do you think about the doctors who are handing out medical excuses at the union rallies?

    DRJ (fdd243)

  239. Icy,

    True anyone loves their country at 20 million a pop

    EricPWJohnson (89f1cb)

  240. You are a hateful liar, epwj. There is nothing to suggest that she ever hated, or even did not like her country, though you suggest she only does so for the money. Your hatred is tiresome.

    JD (822109)

  241. JD

    I am a hateful liar and a reprobate (Bugs Bunny) but her record is still out there….

    Also there’s this – all of her confidants all of her childhood friends and biggest supporters have left her


    I guess they’re hateful liars as well – sooo many liars – people who have the audacity to ask – why all the money Sarah, are you fundraising or are you fundraising?

    She was married to a union labor organizer who was for many years a leader in a movement to leave the country – he only stopped these activities when she ran for statewide office –

    Oh, that right, its hateful lying to point out facts instead of cash paid fiction.

    People who love their country in my opinion dont pass predatory taxes more than the worst murderous despotic dictators in the world – thanks to Sarah – oil companies are again investing in Venezuela

    EricPWJohnson (89f1cb)

  242. What did I tell you, JD? I’ll bet I am correct!

    Simon Jester (c8876d)

  243. Get help, idiot. This OCD uberobsession of yours got tiresome about the 9536128432562222361289th time you trotted it out.

    JD (6e25b4)

  244. When it is not on its knees for big oil, it is practicing self-love to a picture of Palin.

    JD (0d2ffc)

  245. JD

    I know I need help – I need help geting people to understnd that this politician thinks raising taxes on corporations more than countries tht repress their people with sniper rifles and foster terrorism, is a good thing.

    People still are not getting the msg – no wait maybe they are…

    EricPWJohnson (89f1cb)

  246. DRJ-

    If they want to do it as part of their own civil disobedience, it’s on them. But I always thought civil disobedience included the willingness to take the consequences. Certifying that someone is sick, when they are not, for the sake of financial gain that one would otherwise not be entitled to (a paid sick day) sounds to me like what you lawyers call fraud. It’s not a patient committing fraud by telling the doc they’re sick when they aren’t, but it’s doctors publicly advertising to do so. They should accept censure from their employers, the state medical board, and the criminal justice system willingly. I’m not surprised at all that there are docs eager to do that in Madtown, just daring the “Neandethal” authorities to do something, but public dishonesty in a profession that requires honesty shouldn’t go without consequence.

    MD in Philly (3d3f72)

  247. Sounds right to me, MD, although it might also be patient fraud if they knowingly use medical excuses under false pretenses.

    DRJ (fdd243)

  248. You understand that he’s signed up with the bastards who ginned up those ethic complaints,
    Linda Devon, Mudflats was one of the worst of the bunch, they are the MoveOn in the state,

    narciso (28df0c)

  249. Here we have two once highly regarded and respected professions committing fraud and feeling perfectly justified with it.

    If we know anything, it’s that this whole shoddy performance is not “for the children”.

    …unless of course, it’s an unintentional lesson on adults rationalizing their lying and/or, showing them that lying is wrong unless it benefits you. And if it does, then go for it!

    No wonder kids are so utterly screwed up.

    Dana (8ba2fb)

  250. We are witnessing “Athens” in Madison, and if the Governor backs down, there will be no government to speak of in Wisconsin.

    AD-RtR/OS! (2a34f3)

  251. Also there’s this – all of her confidants all of her childhood friends and biggest supporters have left her … Hmmmmm……Comment by EricPWJohnson

    You know what, EPWJ? Jesus’ closest friends deserted him, and one even sold him out for 30 coins…
    That is not to say (so don’t even try it) that I’m comparing Palin to Jesus. The point is people change their alliances for all kinds of reasons. Weren’t we just talking about that with Ritter?

    MD in Philly (3d3f72)

  252. MD

    So in this scenario who are the Jews and the Romans?

    Also I missed the part about the speaking fee’s that Jesus charged, maybe he took VISA

    EricPWJohnson (89f1cb)

  253. Here’s one rather notorious example, that features
    the co-author of that tome, in a cameo spot;

    narciso (28df0c)

  254. Eric. No need to worry about the people sending in money to SarahPAC. You don’t even LIKE those people.

    She said she’d target 20 dems who voted for Obamacare. She did, and about 17 or 18 are gone. She campaigned and endorsed 90+ candidates. Seventy-plus won. Don’t you worry so much about the conservatives who bought a book or attended a fundraiser. If just for the Facebook posts and editorials and lacerating tweets, they’re more than happy that she’s spoken for so many. She’s spoken for me. She spoke before it was trendy. Whether she runs or not, your concern has less to do with greed & profit and more to do with the results of her work.

    Vermont Neighbor (ae55d7)

  255. Sarah Palin blech she has dog germs

    happyfeet (ab5779)

  256. here people do it because they don’t want to chip into their own health care and retirement…

    Actually, the reform bill does a lot more than that. It would, effectively, render the public service unions powerless–not allowed to negotiate on benefits, any negotiated wage increase that is over the CPI would have to be approved by a public referendum, and a couple of other things. It would reduce them to social clubs.

    Which is why the Democrats are acting like they are.

    I should add that as I understand it, the police unions are exempted from this bill–allegedly because they supported Walker. (I am not vouching for the truth of that.) That’s not a small thing, since the police unions are the primary reason that unless they are actually convicted of a crime, it’s nearly impossible to get a misbehaving cop off the force or to keep one from joining another police force. They are as much in need of reforming as the teacher’s unions.

    kishnevi (38f6c3)

  257. Comment by Vermont Neighbor — 2/19/2011 @ 7:33 pm

    Actually, I’ve never heard of any indication, from Gov. Palin or anyone else, that her speaking fees and book royalties are meant to be anything else than personal income, or that she is anyway raising funds for her own presidential campaign.

    kishnevi (38f6c3)

  258. Vermont Neighbor

    I dont mind the money she raises for Sarahac at all

    I dont mind her donating money

    I do mind her losing the senate though

    and the millions she pocketed while pretending to run for something

    that I do mind

    that and her ever changing stories, and her whining about being a victim, and so forth

    And her passing taxes that even twisted despotic animals in Venezuela, Bahrain, and Libya dont even charge

    other than that she’s peachy keen

    EricPWJohnson (455b20)

  259. I just had a mint julep and everything’s better. Kidding.

    Dang. Herman Cain and Breitbart are on fire. Maybe things will be okay.

    Vermont Neighbor (68ff46)

  260. How is that a bad thing? These people are paid by the, well, people. What makes them sacrosanct? Their profession? It may be good and noble, but it does not make them a protected class. What qualifies them a status above the people who pay their salaries?

    They are important, to be sure, but they are no more important than the people who afford their jobs.

    Ag80 (7a9f97)

  261. Comment by narciso — 2/19/2011 @ 8:42 pm

    Thanks for the correction. (I said I wasn’t going to vouch for the truth of that statement!)

    Some of the details of the bill, by the way, are listed on this page of their site

    They are against the bill. Whether it was just coincidence that they endorsed a lot more Democrats in last year’s election for the state legislature than Republicans, I will leave for you to decide.

    I’ll leave it

    kishnevi (38f6c3)

  262. It’s just a preoccupation that’s sort of pointless. Anyone who dislikes a particular politician shouldn’t expect that person to quit earning money. Whether it’s a personal speaking fee or setting up a political action committee, life goes on.

    John Kerry is a huge burden on my budget. I shell out both as a taxpayer and when I buy a bottle of ketchup. Jimmy Carter? He wrote a book about Miss Lillian. I paid 99 cents, but hey I don’t begrudge the guy..

    Vermont Neighbor (68ff46)

  263. Jimmy Carter? He wrote a book about Miss Lillian. I paid 99 cents, but hey I don’t begrudge the guy..

    I do. Any alumni contributions I would make to my alma mater (Emory) would be supporting him, at least indirectly, to some degree. Not that I made any big contributions, but he’s there, and while he’s there, I’m not making any.

    And at least you can buy from one of Heinz’s competitors…

    kishnevi (38f6c3)

  264. Yep, you’re right.. it’s actually good you draw the line like that. With purchases of any real impact I kind of think twice. This little throwaway book though is fun because it’s through his own lens. Interesting to see how he mentions events in regards to the mother. I don’t remember much xcept the gas lines and hostages.

    Seems mama was a real political firefly which may have opened some doors.. from nowhere to top of the heap in almost no time flat. Heavy preoccupation w/ race and identity politics, that being the South at that time.. but just lumping groups together gets a little tiring. Not compassionate or caring, just one-track and sort of manipulative.

    Anyway he is very much his mother’s son. But on a more positive note.. the peace corps and habitat work is admirable.

    Vermont Neighbor (17012e)

  265. 258. “I do mind her losing the senate though”

    Because she couldn’t stop the Huckabee/Miller confab?


    gary gulrud (790d43)

  266. No, he’s more in the Fagan/Halcro mold, although Fagan came to his senses in the end. This is what media coverage was for her in the last nine months of her term.

    narciso (28df0c)

  267. Chris Christie needs to oppose or support Obamacare.

    Yes, his words are like silk and pounding the unions warms my heart. But the left is propping him up because he’s a pretty statist guy. Leaving NJ out of the lawsuit- and supporting a nominee like Kagan- is not really a purity issue. How’s about Secretary of Labor.

    Vermont Neighbor (cae88c)

  268. You can’t vote ‘present’ in the key issue of the day, and supporting Kagan, will come back to bite
    him, in the end, as Toensing and DeGenova did with their friend Holder.

    narciso (28df0c)

  269. 268. “How’s about Secretary of Labor?”

    ‘Minister of Truth’, but Press Secretary isn’t sweet enough. Give him Attorney General and he’ll bolt NJ quicker than an Obot after free money.

    gary gulrud (790d43)

  270. EPWJ fact-check:
    She did NOT “lose” the Senate
    She has NOT ‘pretended’ to run for something
    She did NOT ‘pass’ any taxes on the oil companies

    Other than that, you’re spot-on . . . which is to say, a stain on the truth.

    Icy Texan (1fb326)

  271. 271- Once again, IT demonstrates epwj’s strange connection to reality and the truth.

    AD-RtR/OS! (08307a)

  272. Icy an AD sitting in a thread….

    Icy sur she is, in fact she was playing al coy saying she wants to see someone run who is exactly like her yada yada yada

    She isnt running – except for the cash

    EricPWJohnson (862059)

  273. Well, Mitch Daniels’s recent commentary on now not being the right time to fight government unions has really harmed my appraisal of him as a leader. Now is the perfect time. Every state should take advantage of the way the Wisconsin unions have acted and if possible push hard to ban collective bargaining for public employees.

    Waiting just lets them divide and conquer more effectively.

    If Daniels isn’t balls to the wall opposed to public sector unionization, I don’t think he’s quite enough.

    Narciso, Christie is a politician in a blue state. That he’s not bombastic about Kagan is meaningless. He has absolutely no power over federal judge approval, so he might as well not waste his political capital on it. On the issues he’s got power over, he’s doing well, and on issues he doesn’t, he acts as moderate as he can. I admit, I wish he would have a more conservative view on guns, immigration, and judges, but what’s most important is fixing the debt crisis (which is why I am seriously disappointed about Daniels’s not pressing the union issue at such a optimal time).

    Seems like every candidate has some major flaws, and the best we can hope for is that those flaws are not on fixing the budget or electability.

    Dustin (b54cdc)

  274. Dustin

    Yep, its too bad many leaders are conservative in spirit – like Palin – just when the clamor and the stress and the full weight and measure of what they are about to do sinks in (or the rubber hits the road) then they falter

    All the more reason to look for Bachmann and Perry

    EricPWJohnson (6e1632)

  275. now not being the right time to fight government unions

    oh my goodness are you some kind of Hot Air reader Mr. Dustin? Jeez make the tasty beverage and I will splain for you.

    First of all Mr. Daniels was not talking about government unions. He already accomplished what Walker is trying to do in Wisconsin… in 2005. Here is a helpful article for you: New Governor Trashes Union Rights of Indiana State Workers. Today’s subject was about “right to work” which affects the private sector, and “right to work” is not something Mr. Governor Walker is contending with: it has no direct impact on budget issues.

    Just today a bill Mr. Daniels supports passed the Senate for to kick teacher union thugs in their tiny little teacher union sensitive parts. OUCH!

    Secondly his comments were quite specifically directed to Indiana, where all the Team Rs ran on an agenda that did not include right to work. He would prefer to use the time and energies available to work on the agenda they ran on.

    That said, Mr. Daniels has not said that he’s against the bill – just the timing.

    happyfeet (ab5779)

  276. ok here are links for you cause I was getting filtrated

    here is about what Mr. D did in 2005

    happyfeet (ab5779)

  277. here is about the law the Indiana senate passed today

    happyfeet (ab5779)

  278. and here is wikipedia’s page about right to work

    happyfeet (ab5779)

  279. Whatever, pikachu, I can understand a difference of opinion with the Senate leader, but endorsing the
    tactic of the ‘Hoosier Hijackers’

    narciso (28df0c)

  280. happyfeet, thank you for clearing that up. I was actually basing that on a conversation I had (with someone who probably does read all the major right leaning sites like Hot Air).

    I should have looked into it before claiming Daniels was kicking the public union can down the road. Mea culpa x 10.

    Anyhow, I do think right to work is also a great example of something to work on ASAP, but it is not quite as critical as public unions because the urgent crisis for government right now is the series of budget busters.

    I am delighted to learn that Daniels accomplished this in 2005. I really f’ed up.

    Dustin (b54cdc)

  281. no worries Mr. Dustin

    Mr. narciso it appears you are confuzzled. Mr. Daniels did not endorse the “tactic of the ‘Hoosier Hijackers'” in any way shape or form. If you read the Allahpundit at esteemed conservative website Hot Air you will see that he carefully avoids making this scurrilous charge…

    happyfeet (ab5779)

  282. He would prefer to use the time and energies available to work on the agenda they ran on.

    This does sound like Daniels’s MO, and I just want to note that it seems to backfire on him sometimes.

    I agree completely that if there is a conflict between fixing the budget and something less important, Daniel’s instinct to kick the other issue’s can down the road is the right one. But I also think sometimes he should be careful to make sure that was necessary.

    Yes, he’s right that Indiana should focus on their campaign platform. Maybe right to work is such a major controversy that it really would derail it. If so, then Daniels made a very tough call, but it was justifiable. But he should be careful about doing this too much because it burns significant political capitol.

    On social issues, I think they waste a tremendous amount of energy and burns the coalition that is needed for the budget. Even then, I think Daniels needs to tread carefully. It’s like he’s making a list of issues for people to be ticked off at him over. I’m very big on right to work, and my friend (and then I) misunderstood this issue as related to public unions (I really feel stupid for this).

    Maybe now was a good time for Daniels to be a politician.

    Dustin (b54cdc)

  283. here is the transcript of Mr. Daniels’ remarks … notice this part carefully

    First of all, just to affirm, the activities of today are perfectly legitimate part of the process… even the smallest minority – and that’s what we’ve heard from the last couple days – has every right to express the strength of its views and I salute those who do.

    He’s endorsing the right of people to protest – he’s not endorsing the cowardly democrats. Listen to the audio it’s very clear… he criticizes the cowardly democrats as having “walked off the job.” How is that an endorsement?

    It isn’t.

    happyfeet (ab5779)

  284. I avoid that site, I’ve had to ‘decontaminate’ my
    computer, twice because of it. Why do they go the extra mile, to alienate their putative allies. An example of the judge he selected from the Missouri
    plan is yet another example.

    narciso (28df0c)

  285. I’m very big on right to work too in texas we take it for granite, which is a very very hard rock.

    happyfeet (ab5779)

  286. Are you still in Ctuluthu’s sandbox, btw, good rejoinder to that Kessler decision.

    narciso (28df0c)

  287. Sounds a lot like Walker’s statements supporting the right to protest against his platform.

    Daniels and Walker are simply being public servants. Walker in particular has been unbelievably gracious about it, considering his son’s teacher is bringing his kid into it, people are calling him Hitler, etc.

    I’m pretty sure Obama couldn’t take that from the Tea Party, and I’m glad he pretty much doesn’t have to.

    I hope and believe this union issue will become a major facet of the debates. The left’s MSM will try to use it to attack the Republican candidates, but it will help us get a good grasp on the positions of each candidate. Hopefully we pick a candidate who has done what Walker is doing and Daniels did.

    Dustin (b54cdc)

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