Amnesty Declared for Banned Commenters
Were you ever banned here? You may now once again comment.
All I ask is this: just don’t deliberately antagonize people.
Don’t panic. It’s not as crazy as it sounds.
I’m dissatisfied with the way discussions go here and I want to do some things to shake things up. One of the problems I see is a lack of dissent — in part because I think people jump down dissenters’ throats.
So I am welcoming dissenters. Including anyone who has been banned.
Now: nobody has ever been banned for dissenting. By and large, they have been banned for behavior that should not be tolerated on a civil blog. However, because of the nature of the Internet, I recognize that there is an overlap between those who are uncivil and those who dissent. What’s more, I’m not entirely sure that the fault lies entirely with the banned people. I am often concerned that dissent sparks a chorus of accusation that causes people to be defensive and thus uncivil.
Here is the key: I don’t intend to allow anyone to deliberately antagonize people for the sake of antagonizing them. If a previously banned commenter tries to do that, those comments won’t appear.
I should also add that I am not yet comfortable with the idea of dropping my “moderate” list. Because the previously banned do tend to make comments that should not appear on the blog.
But if they make non-antagonistic comments, why shouldn’t those comments appear? And if you were previously banned and you behave, I will undo your moderation status. Just make a couple of non-antagonistic comments to show your good faith, and then ask to be unmoderated.
So: everyone who has ever been banned on this blog is once again welcome. That includes Christoph, and start-a-blogfight Joe, and Brad Friedman, and Jeff Goldstein, and actus, and AF/blah/etc., and Ed from PA together with the millions of other names he has used, and that guy who wanted me to die in a one-car crash, and a bunch of other people I can’t even think of.
I’m also tired of grudges, and I think sometimes grudges are rooted in part in people being banned. So if I can work to eliminate grudges by unbanning everyone, great.
Do I think all those people, or most of them, will come back and comment here? Nah. It might make no difference at all. Want to declare that you would never come back here regardless? Fine. Go nuts.
But what the hell. I’m looking for a change.
PERHAPS MORE IMPORTANT STILL: I would like to ask people to start trying to be more charitable. Even when dealing with someone whose history you don’t like, try to see the good faith in their arguments if possible. If someone says something that is factually wrong, don’t accuse them of lying right off the bat. Provide the true facts and gauge their reaction.
I very often see a lot of bitter back-and-forth between people whom I like to some degree. If I can see the good in both parties, why can’t you?
99% of all Internet debate is bullshit — people responding to strawmen and otherwise ignoring or distorting valid opposing arguments. Let’s see if we can create a place where the percentage is a little smaller than that.
P.S. In other words, my amnesty is not designed to lower the quality of argumentation. Far from it. I’m hoping to improve it — and I think accommodating more viewpoints is important to that goal.
“This will get out of control, real fast, and we’ll
ian cormac (6709ab) — 9/2/2010 @ 6:50 pmbe lucky to make through with our lives” name the film, without going to IMDB
And it would be nice if the thread didn’t start with a bunch of sniping, of the sort that permeates the thread about how discussion on the Internet sucks. (Although it was nice to see my point proved so nicely.)
Patterico (c218bd) — 9/2/2010 @ 6:51 pmWow, Patterico. Your blog. But there is a difference between honest disagreement and nastiness. As I suspect you may see. If I am wrong, how wonderful.
Some of those banned folks weren’t simply disagreeing.
Eric Blair (46847d) — 9/2/2010 @ 6:52 pmDid you know you can cook your own popcorn in a microwave with just a paper bag?
Dustin (b54cdc) — 9/2/2010 @ 6:54 pmSteve Spurrier’s team looks strong. And I cannot stand the ole ballcoach.
JD (8ded14) — 9/2/2010 @ 6:58 pmI guess I could complain. After all, I’m the dick who isn’t being charitable.
But the comments are too stale lately and I hope this all works out. I won’t be a dick to the white supremacists, commies, and mobies.
Dustin (b54cdc) — 9/2/2010 @ 7:00 pmYou suck
/
Mr. Pink (bb8267) — 9/2/2010 @ 7:05 pmA noble experiment, for which I commend you.
htom, not a professional politico (412a17) — 9/2/2010 @ 7:06 pmthat’s the coolest idea ever Mr. Patterico… people change and there’s been no lack of catalysts
happyfeet (19c1da) — 9/2/2010 @ 7:07 pmhtom – Careful. Politico.com might sue you.
JD (8ded14) — 9/2/2010 @ 7:08 pmfor reals you just throw popcorns in a paper bag nuke it?
happyfeet (19c1da) — 9/2/2010 @ 7:14 pmColonel denounce all
ColonelHaiku (5d380f) — 9/2/2010 @ 7:14 pmpast posts and he know when wife
say jump! ask how high?
Hells to the yeah, Happyfeet. About 6 tablespoons and 1:30 on high power.
Dustin (b54cdc) — 9/2/2010 @ 7:15 pmGood idea. I like what you’re doing, Patterico, and I like that you want this blog to have a higher level of discourse than other places. The key, though, is going to be a concerted effort on the part of all the regulars to passively raise the level of discourse by refraining from actively dragging it down.
Leviticus (30ac20) — 9/2/2010 @ 7:15 pmthat is so cool probably not something you do on a first date though
happyfeet (19c1da) — 9/2/2010 @ 7:16 pmAnd I am SO psyched that its college football season again.
Leviticus (30ac20) — 9/2/2010 @ 7:16 pmI vowed to only call crissyhooten and EPWJ lying douchenozzles once a day.
JD (8ded14) — 9/2/2010 @ 7:16 pm*it’s
Leviticus (30ac20) — 9/2/2010 @ 7:16 pmbig deal dustin you
can pop corn while still in field
my Kentucky home
http://www.wkyt.com/home/headlines/102066688.html
ColonelHaiku (5d380f) — 9/2/2010 @ 7:16 pmI have long argued against banning, but we can expect, and it would be patently silly to expect anything better, a flurry of BUNNIES and thinkregress talking points, and overall bad faithed behavior, the type of behavior that resulted in their being banned in the first place.
But what do I know, since as EPWJ pointed out, my comments put Patterico in legal risk.
JD (8ded14) — 9/2/2010 @ 7:18 pmWelll…
OK, that’s worth a salute, Patterico. Let’s hope the good faith is returned by the previously banned.
no one you know (6631bc) — 9/2/2010 @ 7:19 pmColonel extend hand
ColonelHaiku (5d380f) — 9/2/2010 @ 7:19 pmof friendship to hooten but
he may yet taste blade
Maybe, but if everyone ignores it it won’t affect the quality of the surrounding discourse. The discussion will just flow around the driftwood.
Leviticus (30ac20) — 9/2/2010 @ 7:20 pmPatterico, c’mon, man. This is only gonna work if you immediately give out an assignment: –a topic– a thread–a challenge–a subject–a thought-provoker –with which to experiment upon. An open thread that’s trending to popcorn?–not so much!
elissa (72cba6) — 9/2/2010 @ 7:21 pmThe Hunt for Red October
Didn’t look.
John P. Squibob (882a08) — 9/2/2010 @ 7:23 pmIt’s Fred Thompson’s line, right?
Leviticus (30ac20) — 9/2/2010 @ 7:23 pmI have an air popper I use sometimes with the spray on olive oils what comes in a can. I’ve never had an air popper with an off switch though. Stupid china.
happyfeet (19c1da) — 9/2/2010 @ 7:24 pmOK, that’s pretty freaky, Colonel. I blame racism. I mean, it’s Kentucky.
Dustin (b54cdc) — 9/2/2010 @ 7:24 pmpeople not know word “amnesty” formed by joining two words, as a “portmanteau”, as in “am you gonna behave, or will you keep acting nesty?”… am*nesty
ColonelHaiku (5d380f) — 9/2/2010 @ 7:25 pmI like popcorn with olive oil (or truffle oil and some kind of stanky cheese).
I almost had a freaking heart attack running with my dog this afternoon, so I probably need to stay away from the butter (I am exaggerating).
Dustin (b54cdc) — 9/2/2010 @ 7:26 pmThat is, of course, not true.
However: as much as I enjoy your putdowns, JD, I have enjoyed your comments even more when the putdown is accompanied by facts that show the person is lying.
And not everyone is lying all the time. EPWJ, I thought, distorted some things that Dustin said. And he has said silly things about JD. But there also was, I thought, an overabundance of jumping down his throat and declaring him a Moby and such.
I don’t want to damn anyone by omitting them, but just as no one you know is a great model for a conservative commenter, I think, of all my commenters, aphrael and Leviticus are among the top, and they are both lefties. The thing is, it takes either a saint or a professional annoying person around here to survive commenting as a lefty. Those of you on the right are mighty quick to reach for the “you’re lying!” accusation. I believe that many lefties hold their views in perfectly good faith. Let’s try to give them more credit for that.
My time is limited, but I hope to try to monitor things for a few days to ensure some sort of change. I can’t do it alone. Leviticus is right, though. If everyone ignores what I am saying, nothing will change.
nk, by the way, had some valid complaints along these lines. He defended a couple of people who were getting regularly dogpiled, and he had a point.
Patterico (c218bd) — 9/2/2010 @ 7:28 pmColonel may reach out
TimesDislaiku (bb25d4) — 9/2/2010 @ 7:28 pmwho knows where that hand has been
with blade ‘womb to tomb’
elissa – How about we discuss how left wing violent rhetoric leads to incidents like what happened yesterday at the Discovery Channel.
JD (8ded14) — 9/2/2010 @ 7:28 pmJD,
That sounds good. In fact, I have a post planned re how Weigel distorted Allahpundit’s comments about that guy.
Patterico (c218bd) — 9/2/2010 @ 7:33 pmYou are a “good man”.
Mr. Pink (bb8267) — 9/2/2010 @ 7:34 pmI have topic:
Every time you buy a corporate product or service – a computer from Hewlett Packard, a cell phone from Verizon, cereal from Kellogg, jeans from Levi Strauss, cosmetics from Liz Claiborne, or medicines from Merck – you also feed the Professional Left. All of these, and most other big companies have donated to leftist groups and causes, as well as conducted “progressive” seminars with employees – paying Professional Left instructors. This money is included in the price of their products and services.
The same goes for your investments and saving deposits. JP Morgan, Chase, Wachovia, Bank of America, US Bank, Citibank, PNC Bank, Provident Bank, and others have been giving money – voluntarily or otherwise – to ACORN and other branches of the Professional Left’s ideological-industrial complex.
Discuss…
ColonelHaiku (5d380f) — 9/2/2010 @ 7:36 pmPatterico – Point taken. Brevity does not always lend itself to that on a CrackBerry.
I would point out, in my defense, that EPWJ is a douchenozzle, so there is that. But, I think aphrael and Leviticus would also note that, to the best of my knowledge, I have never called them liars. pretty much because they don’t, they aren’t, and they come in good faith, which clearly separates them from most.
SEC sucks.
JD (8ded14) — 9/2/2010 @ 7:37 pmThat’s true, he has not (to my knowledge).
Leviticus (30ac20) — 9/2/2010 @ 7:39 pmWeigel distorted what someone else said? Nooooooooooooooo. In other news, water is wet.
JD (8ded14) — 9/2/2010 @ 7:40 pmDon’t lie, Leviticus š
JD (8ded14) — 9/2/2010 @ 7:41 pmJD, that would be a good one. I’m game. But, it’s Patterico’s blog and I think Patterico should be the one to decide what will constitute the first-time theme and therefore be better able to adequately monitor the results of the hope and change experiment.
(Ducks for cover while protecting the glass of Johnny Walker and ice.)
elissa (72cba6) — 9/2/2010 @ 7:41 pmOr, we could talk about how the Dems, all of a sudden, are talking about cutting taxes for businesses and some taxpayers, just prior to the mid-term elections. Shameless vote buying, given what they have done over the last 18+ months.
JD (8ded14) — 9/2/2010 @ 7:45 pmBruised egos and pissing contests make for an unpleasant comment section as the piling on appears a desperate manuver having little to do with substance of the argument of lies being refuted. And everyone ends up looking like idiots.
That being said, people are free to leave if they don’t like the rules. Play nice is all Patterico asks. It’s not that hard.
Colonel Haiku, leave Liz Claiborne cosmetics out of this!
Dana (8ba2fb) — 9/2/2010 @ 7:45 pmIt’s all good as long as we don’t have Illinois Nazis commenting.
I hate Illinois Nazis.
Jake Blues (940075) — 9/2/2010 @ 7:45 pmYou are a āgood manā.
Mr. Pink:
It’s funny: your reference (whether you recall or not) is rooted in a post whose premise was similar to that of this one: that people who disagree about the direction of this country need not make the disagreements personal.
It’s not always a popular stance, and I recognize it’s not popular with you, Mr. Pink. However, I stand by it, because I believe it — and why run a blog if you’re not going to write (and stand by) the things you believe, whether popular or not?
Well, for the money, I guess. If you get money from it. That sure as hell isn’t why I do it.
Patterico (c218bd) — 9/2/2010 @ 7:46 pmJD, just because the SEC has dominated College Football for two decades doesn’t mean you get to abuse them here….Patterico is allowing douchnozzles to return, and the SEC is king…
Allah be praised!!!!
reff (176333) — 9/2/2010 @ 7:46 pmWhat’s really going to blow your mind is that I’m the moby democrat. I’m just really awful at it. Mr Axelrod is only paying me like six grams of crack rock a day.
That stuff doesn’t go very far sprinkled over a bag of popcorn.
Dustin (b54cdc) — 9/2/2010 @ 7:47 pmAll of these, and most other big companies have donated to leftist groups and causes, as well as conducted āprogressiveā seminars with employees ā paying Professional Left instructors.
I’ve noticed that, and it annoys the —- out of me. And in supposedly nonpolitical magazines like Smithsonian and National Geographic.
Dunno if any of my meds come from Merck, but at least I buy them at Walmart, one place a doctrinaire lefty wouldn’t go to.
Brother Bradley J. Fikes, C.O.R. (fb9e90) — 9/2/2010 @ 7:47 pmEPWJ is a douchenozzle . . .
I don’t think he is. I think he’s a decent guy. He has been annoying at times, and he has said some silly and some untrue things about people — at times, I think, while smarting from a dogpile of the sort I discuss in the post.
We’re none of us perfect.
Patterico (c218bd) — 9/2/2010 @ 7:48 pm“Well, for the money, I guess. If you get money from it. That sure as hell isnāt why I do it.”
– Patterico
Mega-zing.
reff: and how the hell is UNC ranked higher than LSU, anyway?
Leviticus (30ac20) — 9/2/2010 @ 7:49 pmI am not perfect. I have very hard edges. And I am a Democrat shill. It is true.
JD (8ded14) — 9/2/2010 @ 7:51 pmIt is shameless. But the economy is hurting badly enough, and it’s been doing so for a long enough time, that I’ll be happy with such a tax cut, especially a payroll tax cut, just because it’ll really help the nation.
And, by George, the dems are falling into the RINO trap. RINOs can’t outpromise goodies, compared with democrats. They always promise better goodies. Democrats probably can’t bring themselves to promise tax cuts and spending cuts that will match what the GOP is going to promise.
The entire calculation has flipped, and either way, policies are hopefully going to get a little saner.
How they explain a return to ‘the failed policies of the Bush administration’ is going to be interesting.
Dustin (b54cdc) — 9/2/2010 @ 7:52 pmLeviticus – After 47 of the UNC players are suspended, they will not even be able to be ranked in the Top 20 of the NAIA. If they avoid too much trouble, they have one of the best defensive lines and linebacking corps in the entire country.
JD (8ded14) — 9/2/2010 @ 7:52 pmEPWJ has said some awfully wrong things. Perhaps those wrong things are a reflection of his work in the Arab world, where he feels the need to conform.
Brother Bradley J. Fikes, C.O.R. (fb9e90) — 9/2/2010 @ 7:54 pmDustin – Don’t get me wrong, I am glad they are talking about it. I was just pointing out how shamelessly they are hypocrites, and how the MFM will cover for them.
JD (8ded14) — 9/2/2010 @ 7:56 pmI still like cooking popcorn on the stovetop. With jalapenos. And Thai red chiles.
JD (8ded14) — 9/2/2010 @ 7:57 pmAnd I am a Democrat shill. It is true.
That was very silly indeed.
Patterico (c218bd) — 9/2/2010 @ 7:58 pmFor the Colonel’s money, the best band of the 70’s… please listen and share your opinion…
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fEOlTZGuLKM
ColonelHaiku (5d380f) — 9/2/2010 @ 8:01 pmIt is true, Patterico. After years here, I have managed to suppress my liberal instincts, and fool all of you.
JD (8ded14) — 9/2/2010 @ 8:02 pmMr Axelrod is only paying me like six grams of crack rock a day.
That’ll add some sizzle to yo jizzle, Dustin… good gosh almighty!
ColonelHaiku (5d380f) — 9/2/2010 @ 8:04 pmColonel Haiku,
I was happy to see the guys at Powerline remembering it’s Van Morrison’s 65th birthday today and they posted a clip of him at The Band’s last concert in 1976. Van and The Band in Scorsese’s gorgeous valentine of a concert film, The Last Waltz – fabulous.
Dana (8ba2fb) — 9/2/2010 @ 8:06 pmThe Feat, the Band and Steely Dan were the cream of the crop back in the day, Dana.
And it seems like only yesterday, to me.
ColonelHaiku (5d380f) — 9/2/2010 @ 8:12 pmAnd Van the Man’s more recent stuff has a mature, spiritual groove to it. Great music!
ColonelHaiku (5d380f) — 9/2/2010 @ 8:13 pm“Can’t we all just get along?”
Quote from a pcp/angel dust intoxicated serial felon and poster boy (is that raaaaacist?) for the reason why calling off pursuits in L.A. when a fleeing driver is not suspected of having committed a capital crime is a good idea.
Come’on guys, technology is such that the cops should be able to tag a vehicle and follow from a distance (perhaps thus exposing OTHER miscreants and ne’er do wells in the process) and arrest them under the Police’s selected time and place.
jakee308 (e1996a) — 9/2/2010 @ 8:13 pmMaybe we should invite the regulars from thinkregress to come visit and have a discussion about a current event.
JD (8ded14) — 9/2/2010 @ 8:14 pmDana and Colonel–
Van Morrison Tupelo Honey. Yeaaaah! One of the sexiest songs, evah. And his appearance with the Band. Simply awesome.
elissa (72cba6) — 9/2/2010 @ 8:17 pmelissa, I saw The Band in concert once, and have seen Van more times than I can recall in the past 35 years… amazing songwriter/singer, and of course back then, Robbie Robertson, fron tman for The Band, was considered mighty, mighty fine.
Dana (8ba2fb) — 9/2/2010 @ 8:20 pmbut i always dissent.
wheeler's cat (5a429c) — 9/2/2010 @ 8:21 pmand i have never been banned.
i need to be more annoying i guess.
otoh Goldstein frequently banned me and deleted my comments.
im so confused.
Leviticus….no one in the real world thinks that the LSU QB, Jordan Jefferson, will be successful enough to carry the Tigers to a high ranking….we’ll see….I’m of the belief that he will not be successful enough either, but, I hope I’m wrong…UNC has a great defense (if they play) and the ACC is so bad this year that they might still finish in the money without their defense…..LSU has to deal with Alabama, Florida, Auburn, Georgia, a surging Mississippi State, Ole Miss….four losses wouldn’t be too bad….I’m hoping for two….
JD is a Democratic SEC hater shill for the Congressional Black Caucus….
reff (176333) — 9/2/2010 @ 8:23 pmelissa….just had VM on the youtube with that one, and Crazy Love, and my personal favorite….
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OP0uPNfPJJE
When the Leaves Come Falling Down….
reff (176333) — 9/2/2010 @ 8:25 pmI don’t hate the SEC, reff. I just like poking fun at them, and do sometimes get tired of hearing how awesome they believe themselves to be. Thank Allah that Teblow is gone, so I don’t have to listen to the incessant blathering and tongue baths from the networks.
JD (8ded14) — 9/2/2010 @ 8:25 pmI was being ironic, I’ve seen what these amnesties
ian cormac (6709ab) — 9/2/2010 @ 8:27 pmdevolve into, on a number of blogs I’ve frequented, where we assume good faith and they don’t end well
JD, it’s not a belief….I love the simple thought that the Big 10 (12?…can they even count in the Midwest?) and their ESPN shills think they can compete…..if you think the SEC fans are bad, you should try listening to Herbstriet kiss the little 10’s ass about how good OSU and Penn State are….and of course, how Tyrell Pryor will win the Heisman….
reff (176333) — 9/2/2010 @ 8:29 pmian cormac:
Where have you seen a similar amnesty? On what blog?
I’m not really assuming good faith. I’m going to be cautious about unmoderating people. But I just unmoderated wheeler’s cat, whom I moderated for saying some crazy thing or other, and I plan to unmoderate anyone else who seems to be trying to show good faith.
And I intend for people to be more civil to the dissenters, which I hope will help.
Patterico (c218bd) — 9/2/2010 @ 8:35 pmPryor is that good, reff. He is freakishly talented. I would think that a football fan would be able to recognize that. ESPN is a Big 10 shill? Good Allah. I know what Urban Meyer and Nick Saban and Les Miles had for breakfast this morning.
JD (8ded14) — 9/2/2010 @ 8:35 pmi need to be more annoying i guess.
wheeler’s cat:
I will take that as a joke. If you’re serious, it does not bode well for your comments appearing in the future.
Patterico (c218bd) — 9/2/2010 @ 8:36 pmWheeler/nishi isn’t just occasionally krazy, she is full blown whack job psycho 110% of the time. She would not know good faith if it whacked her in the forehead.
JD (8ded14) — 9/2/2010 @ 8:37 pmnishi!!! I have a musics for you
two
actually
happyfeet (19c1da) — 9/2/2010 @ 8:41 pmEmbryonic stem cell research
JD (8ded14) — 9/2/2010 @ 8:41 pmShe was once a conservative
Demographics
Wedge Theory
SCIENCE!
Deniers
Conservatives hate science
short side of Bell Curve
repeat ad nauseum …
at the very least you get the satisfaction of banning people again.
Good idea.
papertiger (daf467) — 9/2/2010 @ 8:42 pmWell, JD, you may be right, but let’s let her prove it here. Or, preferably, not. (I.e. let’s hope she comments but not in the manner you predict.)
I don’t really know her, so I don’t really have much of an opinion. Clean slate for me, or close to it.
Patterico (c218bd) — 9/2/2010 @ 8:42 pmClean slate for me then too, Patterico. I love saying I told you so š
JD (8ded14) — 9/2/2010 @ 8:43 pmI may have to ban any happyfeet comment with a link to YouTube, though.
(I kid, I kid.
Sort of.)
Patterico (c218bd) — 9/2/2010 @ 8:43 pmGad, the first one was pretty bad, happyfeet. You did much better with Mumford and Sons.
Dana (8ba2fb) — 9/2/2010 @ 8:45 pmyou should see the ones I don’t link
happyfeet (19c1da) — 9/2/2010 @ 8:45 pmJD – You forgot:
euthanasia
christianists
two digits
and more
daleyrocks (940075) — 9/2/2010 @ 8:47 pmtwo digits is a lot if you work them
happyfeet (19c1da) — 9/2/2010 @ 8:48 pmI can’t commit to a chat because I have to work now that the kids are in bed, but this comment thread has more of the friendly feel of a chat than many have lately. I’d like to keep that tone going.
Patterico (c218bd) — 9/2/2010 @ 8:50 pmAnd don’t forget her recent tongue-bathing of John Cole.
Mike LaRoche (bfac0f) — 9/2/2010 @ 8:55 pmhere’s mumford & sons again if anyone missed em… they’re gonna be famous like Kurt Cobain or Greg Brady
happyfeet (19c1da) — 9/2/2010 @ 8:59 pmI got nuthin’
gp (ba49cb) — 9/2/2010 @ 9:03 pmUSC is good.
JD (8ded14) — 9/2/2010 @ 9:15 pmEugene Robinson just called America a bunch of spoled brats who are throwing a temper tantrum. “In a mood to hold their breath until they turn blue.” Inspiring stuff, I tell ya.
http://www.realclearpolitics.com/articles/2010/09/03/our_quick-fix_electorate_106996.html
elissa (72cba6) — 9/2/2010 @ 9:22 pmEugene is a racist.
JD (8ded14) — 9/2/2010 @ 9:25 pmGood Allah, he wonders why we don’t like him.
JD (8ded14) — 9/2/2010 @ 9:29 pmSomehow I just knew Eugene would yank your chain with this article, JD. “Good Allah” is right. He admits that calling the electorate stupid is generally not considered wise, but then he goes ahead and does it anyway.
And, his referring to “the nation’s income” indicates just a tiny, wee little disconnect with the way most Americans think about their wages, salaries, and other sources of their personal money supply, don’t cha think?
elissa (72cba6) — 9/2/2010 @ 9:43 pmWell, thank you.
I think it’s funny that I rated not just personal mentioning, but mentioning first.
To everyone — including daleyrocks and DRJ — I hope you’re having a great day and are thoroughly enjoying this election cycle.
Christoph (8ec277) — 9/2/2010 @ 9:59 pmChristoph,
Welcome back. I’ll try to find your information and take it out of the moderation filter.
Don’t let it go to your head. Someone had to be first in the list. And it’s not like I’m declaring my love for the banned commenters.
You know, I totally forgot even to mention that little shit Levi.
Try to remember the rules, OK, Christoph? You’re a smart guy. You have a lot to say. I don’t want to see comments that are just antagonism. OK?
Patterico (c218bd) — 9/2/2010 @ 10:14 pmI would vote for cap n trade pansy Mike Castle from Delaware just cause Chris Christie said so cause Chris Christie is super awesome and not a morbidly obese sycophantic Jersey trash dork at all.
happyfeet (19c1da) — 9/2/2010 @ 10:16 pmi pulled my 4.01K a week ago, before it could become a 0.401K, and because it was obvious it would be the only income i’d see this year, tax wise…. if Soros is out of the stock market, who am i to stay in?
with my new strategy, i’m investing in brass, copper, lead and the CMP, so how is it i’m feeding the professional left?
just curious.
š
resident bitter clinger (fb8750) — 9/2/2010 @ 10:22 pmYou’re on the internet somehow. I suspect you’re contributing in some way.
Dustin (b54cdc) — 9/2/2010 @ 10:32 pmA subscription site I joined to get podcasts has a blog, which because of the fee is solely conservative commenters. It is very boring to see everyone agree, 2 or 3 comments. But the absence of vitriol is nice – nice, bland, boring. Hope it works out.
jodetoad (7720fb) — 9/2/2010 @ 10:42 pmHowdy Christoph – This election cycle is simply fabulous so far. I’m looking forward to November.
daleyrocks (940075) — 9/2/2010 @ 11:13 pmIt was hardly a compliment, so don’t worry about it.
Christoph (8ec277) — 9/2/2010 @ 11:51 pmI have never been banned here, but I was banned at LGF by Mr. Johnson. I wonder if you could suggest he provide an amnesty too. Charles did not look kindly upon my criticisms of his religion of global warming and badmouthing (not pottymouthing) his Mann prophet. ric
ric (acac5f) — 9/3/2010 @ 12:56 amJust wanted to say this is a really classy post. I’ve been called a “drive-by troll” here, but certainly never intended to be such. And I know most haven’t taken me as such. But allowing dissent and not knee-jerkingly calling it trolling is what makes this blog a cut above.
I say this as (I hope) a friend who disagrees with Patrick’s political POV 90% of the time.
LYT (08fc97) — 9/3/2010 @ 1:54 amIt’s the form that some of the dissent takes that is the problem; the insinuation (written in the form of a question, supposedly to disguise the accusation) that conservatives simply hate/distrust ALL Muslims, made by “geoff” in the GZM thread(s) being a perfect example. Reasoned debate, people! Explain your opinions; convince us that you are correct, rather than just accusing us of being wrong.
I agree with JD; annoying as some of them could be, I never wanted any of them banned — with the exception of the aforementioned Levi.
Icy Texan (01c5c3) — 9/3/2010 @ 5:52 amThat there’s a money quote.
Tully (62151d) — 9/3/2010 @ 6:25 amI would vote for cap n trade pansy Mike Castle from Delaware just cause Chris Christie said so cause Chris Christie is super awesome and not a morbidly obese sycophantic Jersey trash dork at all.
Feets, this perfect is the enemy of the good stuff is beneath you, I think. If we want to turn this country around we have to take some folks who may not be perfect, but will get us to where we want to go. The goal here is TO WIN, not punish those who don’t agree with us 100% of the time. Don’t you remember Reagan’s “Big Tent” strategy? How’d that play out?
Dmac (d61c0d) — 9/3/2010 @ 7:45 amGood luck on that exchange, Dmac. POE.
Eric Blair (58b0cf) — 9/3/2010 @ 7:57 amthis time the trust is gone Mr. Dmac – when the Team R pansies win back the House what will the first order of business be?
Handing the gavel back to feckless loser John Boehner as if his feckless leadership had no responsibility for the voters handing Team R their ass in 2006.
It’s deeply uninspiring and if even someone like Chris Christie can’t draw a line between himself and the most craven and cowardly elements of Team R then there’s something very wrong and very corrupt at the very heart of Team R I think.
happyfeet (19c1da) — 9/3/2010 @ 8:12 amin that video Chris Christie looks you right in the eye and … he lies to you. He says cap n trade pansy Mike Castle will help Team R shrink government.
LOL.
That’s a lie. That’s a corpulent jersey trash lie, Mr. Christie. No wonder you see no problem with building a victory mosque on the remains of murdered Americans. You have no honor.
happyfeet (19c1da) — 9/3/2010 @ 8:18 amBoehner as Speaker would be terribly disappointing. Kasich winning in Ohio for Gov is a very cool thing. He was one of the few congresscritters I liked.
JD (0d0a58) — 9/3/2010 @ 8:21 amOh brother – biting your nose off to spite your face. Not quite a winning electoral strategy, is it? So the guy’s on the wrong side of one issue, so you throw him on the trash heap. Who do think is going to replace him in NJ if he doesn’t run again? Someone like Whitman? Ugh. Corzine? Double ugh with a cherry on top. Look, you can either be pragmatic about it and look at these electoral wins as baby steps for those states steeped in socialistic management and a win for the greater good, or be dogmatic and lose, lose, lose. Thereby ensuring that this administration’s dismantling of the last great tenets of this country are carved in stone. No thank you.
Dmac (d61c0d) — 9/3/2010 @ 8:23 amIt’s nice to see Kasich back.
happyfeet (19c1da) — 9/3/2010 @ 8:24 amThat’s our mad mogwai for you, look he’s better than Whitman, and Kean, who carries the Alamoudi bags very well on the board of Amerada Hess, the
ian cormac (6709ab) — 9/3/2010 @ 8:30 amstate could’ve had a contender with Schundler, instead it descended in the Boschian landscape of McGreevey and then Corzine, which will be hard to dig out from under
Mr. Dmac maybe if I were a little more clear on the decisive blow for individual liberty and freedom it would be if we empower the cravenly cowardly party what just tried to foist Meghan’s cravenly cowardly daddy on our little country as president no less I could see your rah rah Team R ideas in a different more favorable light but honestly the way Mr. Rubio’s radio address was so widely ignored is extremely disheartening to me.
Mr. Rubio is the guy what told McCain super bff Crist that no you are not worthy to sit in our little Senate.
That makes him way the coolest guy this election cycle, and he should be a lot more celebrated I think. Not Mike freaking Castle.
happyfeet (19c1da) — 9/3/2010 @ 8:36 amAgreed, but Rubio’s going to win and he’s going to be a star, no matter what the MFM thinks about him at the moment. So if we get both Rubio and Castle elected (in a ridiculously Democratic state, like NJ), everyone wins in the end. I forget what famous General said this of war, but it was something like “you go into the battle with the troops you have, not the troops you want,” and that’s what we’re facing today. BTW, don’t automatically assume that someone like Boehner will assume the head of the Senate if the GOP wins, just because it’s based on tradition. I don’t particularly care for McConnell, but he’s sensing big trouble regarding his assension to the House Chair if they win, primarily because his blatantly – backed candidates have lost, repeatedly. He could lose his perch, so that’s another reason why you should want to win the whole shebang, regardless of a particular candidate’s failure to toe the line on all of your issues.
Dmac (d61c0d) — 9/3/2010 @ 8:51 amāyou go into the battle with the troops you have, not the troops you wantā
that doesn’t mean you can’t pout and otherwise carry on
but a congressional leadership change would brighten my outlook immensely I think… it would suggest Team R was serious about moving in a more better direction.
happyfeet (19c1da) — 9/3/2010 @ 8:54 am“…that doesnāt mean you canāt pout and otherwise carry on…”
And don’t forget: pile on with personal insults, then get all nelly when insults are heaped on people you like.
Purity of Essence = four more years of BHO. Thanks!
Eric Blair (c8876d) — 9/3/2010 @ 9:05 amplease, be careful with me
I’m sensitive
and I want to stay that way
happyfeet (a55ba0) — 9/3/2010 @ 9:47 amAbsolutely. It’s going to take bruising some egos on the hill to convince the public that the GOP was serious about their ‘contract with america 2’ we’ll see in a few weeks.
That’s not to say the Majority leader should be a fire breather. Maybe they should be coalition builders. But big changes are needed.
Dustin (b54cdc) — 9/3/2010 @ 10:20 am–Mr. Rubio is the guy–
Not all of us have Mr. Rubios running in our states. And not all our states have the electoral/demographic composition of Florida. State by state, we do the best we can with what we have under the circumstances in which we live. On a personal level I get highly irate when people who live in one bankrupt state like Cali have the nerve to preach to those of us who live in other, and often blue, bankrupt states (like Illinois and NJ)– and criticize and pretend to know more than we do about our situational dynamics and who is doing a good job and who is electable in our states. That preaching and harping is the type of arrogance and “I know better than you do what’s good for you and our country” that I typically associate quite unfavorably with liberals.
As far as I am concerned, cutting off the blood supply of the Dem congress and the Dem statehouses is job 1 in Nov. 2010. After the primaries have narrowed the field, that means electing every damn team R person possible this year no matter how perfect or imperfect they are. With few exeptions, and with an incredible minority in numbers, team R came together admirably as the “party of no” in those times when it has really counted so far in the 111th congress.
elissa (5953ce) — 9/3/2010 @ 10:29 amRubio was a congressional leader before, too. I think that’s a great choice, elissa.
I think he can build coalitions, without looking like a bowl of oatmeal.
Dustin (b54cdc) — 9/3/2010 @ 11:09 amGuaranteed somebody gets themselves banned before the end of the thread. Don’t make me a liar, people.
Birdbath (8501d4) — 9/3/2010 @ 1:40 pmI’m going to take a wild guess here and speculate that this comes down to the exchanges between Dustin and myself
I’ll pledge to turn the other cheek a little more often, though not indefinitely.
Subotai (a935a0) — 9/3/2010 @ 2:24 pmOne exchange I had here is why I generally don’t post anymore. But if it can be a little more civil, perhaps I will. We’ll see. Appreciate the effort to bring the level of discourse up though. It’s not something I see often from the conservative side of the aisle.
Russell Miller (40d446) — 9/3/2010 @ 3:10 pmRussell Miller,
I’ve commented on a few ‘liberal’ blogs, and been banned instantly, or nearly instantly.
I have found civility on the left to be extremely poor, but would love to find an actual democrat politics blog that was as civil as this one.
If you could point me in the right direction, I’d be happy to comment there. I know left leaners like Kos, Huffpo, bradblog, LGF all prove to be pretty ridiculous, but it’s a huge internet.
I’d appreciate it if left leaners would show me a left leaning blog that is a good example of the civility they would like to see here.
Dustin (b54cdc) — 9/3/2010 @ 3:32 pmComment by Russell Miller
IIRC, you’re the guy who started out claiming to be a moderate disgusted with both parties, and latter admitted that you disliked the Dems because you found them too right-wing.
Being upfront with people about where you are coming from can head off a lot of problems.
Subotai (a935a0) — 9/3/2010 @ 3:41 pmdustin, I don’t visit left leaning blogs for that reason. I visit right leaning blogs because even though I don’t agree with 90% of it it’s not good to live in a vacuum.
Subotai, you have a long memory. Too bad it wasn’t correct then, either… you insist on seeing things through a prism of left and right, and to me it’s much more nuanced than that. There are some things I lean to the right on. Just not socially.
Russell Miller (40d446) — 9/3/2010 @ 3:47 pm… and I should clarify that just a bit in saying that I *visit* blogs on both sides, and some that don’t even fit a side. I very rarely comment, for that reason. I insist on civility – not agreement, but civility. I very rarely get it.
Russell Miller (40d446) — 9/3/2010 @ 3:51 pmSubotai, you have a long memory. Too bad it wasnāt correct then, eitherā¦
This isn’t a thread for arguing about it. But no doubt at some future date we’ll revisit the matter and see if I’m correct or not.
Subotai (a935a0) — 9/3/2010 @ 3:59 pmRussell,
I get where you’re coming from, then.
This is probably as good as it gets then, for both of us. Better if you stick around, too.
If someone else knows of a left leaner blog that is favorable to civil discussion with a conservative, I was sincerely interested in finding one.
Dustin (b54cdc) — 9/3/2010 @ 4:19 pmDustin, generally, any blog that calls itself “left” or “right” by definition aren’t. I like The Moderate Voice myself. Frum Forum is also pretty good even though they’re right leaning – there are a lot of lefties there too. I must admit to not having tried to find a left leaning blog like that… it’s just something I’m not too concerned about. My blog *used* to be but I changed focus and mostly (Mostly) stay away from politics.
Russell Miller (40d446) — 9/3/2010 @ 5:19 pmAs long as Mr Miller is expounding on his political beliefs here, I guess this is as good a place as any for this trip down memory lane.
“I am not to the left of the democrats. They are to the right of me, because I really donāt think theyāre left at all.”
Look familiar, Miller?
Subotai (a935a0) — 9/3/2010 @ 5:29 pmIt’s really hard to take back words once they are typed out, as you have proven, Subotai.
Play nice everyone. It makes for a better world. I say that as a grandma of 7.
PatAZ (9d1bb3) — 9/3/2010 @ 6:12 pmThat is the sign of a centrist moderate if I have ever seen one.
JD (8ded14) — 9/3/2010 @ 6:22 pmāI am not to the left of the democrats. They are to the right of me, because I really donāt think theyāre left at all.ā
Subotai – Is that a David Frum quote?
daleyrocks (940075) — 9/3/2010 @ 7:02 pmNo, he’s
Russell Miller (40d446) — 9/3/2010 @ 7:46 pmNo, he’s quoting me, and still managing to miss the point. (Sorry for the double post)
I am saying that I am to the left of the dems. I am NOT saying that I am so far left I’m to the left of the dems. I’m saying that they’re indistinguishable from the republicans. I do not see conflict between what I said and what I’m saying. In other words, good luck with that straw man there.
Russell Miller (40d446) — 9/3/2010 @ 7:48 pmJust because you cannot see the conflict between those does not mean it does not exist. It means you need to get your eyes checked.
JD (8ded14) — 9/3/2010 @ 7:51 pmThe Moderate Voice, is much like that line about the Japanese LDP, it is mendacious in it’s attemptto misrepresent reality, it is better than Huff Po or the Independent Soros network but that’s not saying much. The former New Majority has some good writers on occasion, Nibras Kasmi and John Rosenthal, but it is too often a crib sheet for what a friend of mine, calls the ‘clean toga’ republicans
ian cormac (6709ab) — 9/3/2010 @ 7:52 pmAww, JD you are soo thoughtful of your fellow posters. Worrying about their health care and all. And that’s so typically aweet of you, too.
elissa (5953ce) — 9/3/2010 @ 7:55 pmAnyone care to list the ways Dems and Team R are different? Do you know how far to the left you have to be to think that?
JD (8ded14) — 9/3/2010 @ 7:55 pmelissa – This is my attempt at the kinder gentler JD.
JD (8ded14) — 9/3/2010 @ 7:57 pmJD, I’m comfortable with myself and understand what I am trying to say. That’s all that matters. There is plenty of room for self-examination, but not in this particular subject.
In other words, arguing on the Internet.. you know what they say. You need a thick skin. After all, it’s a bunch of strangers who have no idea who you are and what you’re made of making snap judgements and expecting you to grovel in awed acquiescence of their awesome mental powers.
Which is why I usually don’t comment… I usually encounter people without quite the faculties required to comprehend some things and who are intent on proving that. Not a problem, I accept that. It’s the price of free speech. But I have better things to do. Seeya, and enjoy.
Russell Miller (40d446) — 9/3/2010 @ 7:57 pmNothing like declaring superiority, and skulking away. How about this? Use your superior cognitive abilities and explain why the Dems and Team R are indistinguishable, and how your being to the left of both of them does not make you on the left. I yearn for your enlightenment.
JD (8ded14) — 9/3/2010 @ 8:00 pmRussell Miller:
You say: “Appreciate the effort to bring the level of discourse up though. Itās not something I see often from the conservative side of the aisle.”
It’s not something I see often from the liberal side of the aisle.
Like Dustin, I would be thrilled to see a liberal blog that makes the same sort of efforts I am trying to make here. If someone could recommend such a place, I would go comment there tonight.
Also, I think the point Subotai and JD are making is this: when someone says they are left of the dems, and sees no difference between the dems and the reps, it makes them sound as though they are far left of the dems. Are you saying something different?
Patterico (c218bd) — 9/3/2010 @ 8:12 pmIf you have to ask, you do not possess the mental faculties to appreciate his uber-sophisticated position.
JD (8ded14) — 9/3/2010 @ 8:22 pmMiller, all I said in 129 was that you “disliked the Dems because you found them too right-wing”.
And all you have done in your subsequent post attempting to refute me is to keep repeating that you find the Democrats to be too right-wing for your taste.
I am NOT saying that I am so far left Iām to the left of the dems. Iām saying that theyāre indistinguishable from the republicans. I do not see conflict between what I said and what Iām saying.
Good, because I don’t see a conflict either. In both cases you’re saying that the Dems are too right-wing for you.
Subotai (9d5c08) — 9/4/2010 @ 11:18 amhttp://www.theseekerblog.com/?p=428
Not Russell Miller (f84358) — 9/4/2010 @ 12:08 pm