Patterico's Pontifications

10/1/2019

Trump Congratulates China on 70 Years Of Communist Party Rule Hours After Hong Kong Freedom Fighter Takes A Bullet To The Chest

Filed under: General — Dana @ 8:07 am



[guest post by Dana]

Good morning from the President of the United States:

Trump tweeted his congratulations just hours after a young freedom fighter in Hong Kong was shot by authorities with live ammunition:

Hong Kong police have shot a protester with live ammunition for the first time in four months of demonstrations, marking a major escalation in the use of force on a day when China celebrated 70 years of Communist party rule with a triumphalist military parade.

Protests called to mark a “national day of grief” drew tens of thousands of people on to the city’s streets, across six areas, in the most widespread show yet of public anger towards Beijing.

Some gathered in central Hong Kong, while others met up across the harbour in Kowloon or the New Territories beyond. Initially peaceful, the demonstrations turned into running battles. Authorities shut down nearly half the city’s metro stations in an attempt to contain the violence.

Police in full riot gear used water cannons and barrages of teargas, while protesters threw molotov cocktails, built barricades, attacked metro stations and set fires in the street.

The scenes, though extremely violent, did not mark a departure from previous protests until mid-afternoon, when a policeman drew his gun and fired a bullet into an 18 year-old high school student’s chest in Tsuen Wan district.

Images shared by local media showed the protester lying on the ground begging for help as he bled from his injury. “Send me to hospital, my chest is hurting. I need to go to hospital,” he said.

Anchee Min was born in Shanghai, and was nine years old when the Cultural Revolution began: As a child, she was a member of the Little Red Guards and was made to report her favourite teacher, who was an anti-Maoist, to the authorities, and when Min was 17, she was sent to a collective farm… where she endured horrific conditions and worked 18-hour days. Min would later be chosen by party officials from the Shanghai Movie Studios to play Mao’s wife in propaganda films, which eventually provided an opportunity to flee China, and make her way to the U.S. She tells her painful, yet victorious story in her haunting memoir, Red Azalea. During an interview a number of years ago, Min talked about surviving the religion of Mao:

I was taught to write, “I love you, Chairman Mao” before I was taught to write my own name. I never thought I belonged to myself. It was never “I love you, Papa” not “I love you, Mama.” It’s always “I love you, Communist Party of China,” “I love you, Chairman Mao.” What I want to say is that Mao was our religion.

[…]

“When I was seventeen, life changed to a different world. The school’s vice principal had a talk with me after his talks with many others. He told me that he wanted to remind me that I was a student leader, a model to the graduates. The policy was there, as strict as math equations. He told me that I belonged to one category, the category of becoming a peasant. He said it was an unalterable decision. The policy from Beijing was a holy instruction. It was universally accepted. It was incumbent upon me to obey.”

[…]

We were taught if you can sacrifice your loved ones, if you can denounce your parents, if you can denounce your favorite teacher, you are capable of greater love for the humanity. Because the smaller love you feel this person, if this person is proven to be American spy, and your parents is proven to be the enemy of our society, and then it’s always like good battles the evil and we want the good to win. It’s such a grand disguise and things got messed up. And in the meantime, as the executor of such greatness, I didn’t feel good. I was crying when I was denouncing my favorite teacher. It was tearing myself apart.

On coming to America:

You asked me how I changed. I think coming to America plays a big part. If I were in China, I would die in confusion because this problem that’s the mental knot. I couldn’t unknot it, and I couldn’t do anything about it. And I was too close, I didn’t have a perspective, couldn’t see. So coming to America, I think, what the moments that struck me was that, you know, my daughter was in the nursery school. First thing she was taught was love…And also the incredible moment I share with other immigrants and the day that we accepted as American citizens in the big hall in LA with 40,000 people, which is so ridiculous. You know, it was like we’re all prepared, you know, different languages, struggle, try to get the English right. When the music comes on, “Oh, say” — we all couldn’t finish the first sentence, just broke down crying. And we laugh, smiling and crying and looking at each other. We know what it’s like to be American. It was to be allowed to be human, to be ourselves.

This week, there was a report that organ harvesting of persecuted religious and ethnic minorities was taking place in China. Specifically, the Uigher Muslims and Falun Gong members:

The China Tribunal, a group that’s investigating the organ harvesting, said at a tense meeting of the United Nations Human Rights Council that the Chinese government was taking hearts, kidneys, lungs, and skin from groups including Uighur Muslims and members of the Falun Gong religious group.

The China Tribunal describes itself as an “independent, international people’s tribunal, and was backed by the International Coalition to End Transplant Abuse in China, an Australian human rights charity made up of lawyers, academics, and medical professionals.

China has denied carrying out mass harvesting of organs in any circumstance.

Addressing UN representatives, a lawyer for the China Tribunal, Hamid Sabi, said the group had proof of the organ harvesting.

Sabi said the group had found that China was committing “crimes against humanity” by harvesting organs from religious minorities like the Uighurs and members of Falun Gong, which has been banned and widely persecuted by the Chinese government.

Meanwhile:

UN experts and activists say at least 1 million ethnic Uighurs, and members of other largely Muslim minority groups, have been detained in camps in the vast western [Xinjiang] province.

Beijing describes the camps as vocational training centres to help stamp out religious extremism and teach new work skills.

Although a senior official claims that the majority of detainees have been released from the camps and “returned to society,” the U.S. State Dept. says there has been no such evidence to support this assertion.

Moreover, this claim contradicts what Uigher family members are saying:

Nicholas Bequelin, Amnesty International’s Asia regional director, said the claims were “deceptive and unverifiable”.

“We have received no reports about large-scale releases,” he said. “In fact, families and friends of people who are being detained tell us they are still not able to contact them.”

And to this ruling party, President Trump, on behalf of the United States of America, offered congratulations.

(Cross-posted at The Jury Talks Back.)

–Dana

87 Responses to “Trump Congratulates China on 70 Years Of Communist Party Rule Hours After Hong Kong Freedom Fighter Takes A Bullet To The Chest”

  1. Good morning. I know, he is just trying to get a deal done with China and I’m just too unsophisticated to understand the nuances of diplomacy, blah, blah, blah. But you know, he could’ve just kept his yap shut. That was a viable option, no?

    Dana (05f22b)

  2. You forget how stable a genius he is.

    Appalled (1a17de)

  3. Reminder: Tens of millions killed during the Great Leap Forward.

    Dana (05f22b)

  4. I don’t recall Trump saying Word One in defense of the freedom-seeking people of Hong Kong or anything about the Uighers, where around a million are in “re-education” camps. I’ll take Trump’s tweet as sincere, repulsively sincere.

    Paul Montagu (a882b9)

  5. 1.

    That was a viable option, no?

    I think you spelled “better” wrong.

    Gryph (08c844)

  6. I accidentally published on top of Patterico’s new post, so please make sure you read it and leave a comment!

    Dana (05f22b)

  7. Trump tweets congratulations to China? What?? This gets me —argh— so darn angry, I’m going to whip out my China made PC/handheld and write a post/comment about how —argh — just how darn angry I am!!

    Munroe (53beca)

  8. @7 LMAO that’s actually a really funny response. Unless you weren’t trying to parody Trump supporters. In which case it’s just sad.

    Time123 (457a1d)

  9. The shooting, was a bit more nuanced than posted:

    https://www.nytimes.com/2019/10/01/world/asia/hong-kong-police-shooting-national-day.html?smid=tw-nytimes&smtyp=cur

    In a video circulating online, an officer is seen firing a handgun at close range at a protester wearing a black T-shirt and a pink gas mask.

    In the video, the protester who was shot is first seen joining a black-clad mob of people who chase a riot officer and tackle him to the ground. They kick him and beat him with what appear to be metal pipes.

    At one point, the protester approaches a second police officer who is standing nearby with a handgun drawn. Just after the protester hits the officer with the pipe, the officer fires at the man at point-blank range.

    A few seconds later, a gasoline bomb thrown from offscreen — presumably by a protester — lands at the feet of the officer who fired the shot. In another video, the protester who was shot is seen being treated by paramedics.

    The video of the shooting was filmed by a reporter from Campus TV, a student-run television station at the University of Hong Kong, and provided to The New York Times by another reporter at the station.

    Not saying that it was all unicorns and fairies leading up to this… And others have been gravely injured and killed/died in Hong Kong without being shot.

    But don’t want the fog of, what is becoming, war to be the excuse for what follows. A lot of people may die in the near future in Hong Kong. I have no idea if this will move the HK issues forward, or simply cement the PRC position of power… But it appears that the clashes will be one sided as thing progress.

    BfC (5517e8)

  10. thing=>things

    BfC (5517e8)

  11. Adults in the room, 2016: “Trump is needlessly provocative, lacks judgment, and will get us into wars!”

    Same Adults, 2019: “Why is Trump being polite to the largest nation on earth! He should posture on the side of 7 million people who live in an area ceded to China, and who we cannot help, and reinstitute the Cold War!”

    Harcourt Fenton Mudd (0c349e)

  12. Regardless of how nuanced the shooting was, Trump could have just kept his mouth shut, like I do during Kwanzaa.

    Failing that, he could have talked about the need for multi-party election in China and wondering why they can’t do that, even after 70 years. I wonder how they heard that in Taiwan.

    Kevin M (19357e)

  13. I’m going to whip out my China made PC/handheld

    Not all phones are made in China.

    Kevin M (19357e)

  14. Red-letter-day, eh, Captain, sir?!

    DCSCA (797bc0)

  15. 12.

    Sir:

    And Nixon could have skipped going to China after Mao’s horrific actions in the 60’s. Nixon upset all the National Review types when he did that: They were still smitten with Madame Chang (and expecting, of course, that everyone but them would go into any combat). The rest of the US thought it was a prudent thing to do.

    Taiwan? Seriously? Do you think its defensible? By who? At what cost? And why? What US city should be at risk for Taiwan? (the rich classes of Taiwan will leave with their portable assets long before US marines go in).

    China leaves Taiwan in the dust numerically and otherwise: “Its air force now has more fourth-generation fighter jets than Taiwan has military aircraft.” https://www.foreignaffairs.com/articles/taiwan/2019-09-17/taiwans-defense-strategy-doesnt-make-military-sense

    Taiwan has no claim on us: Japan and Australia do, but Taiwan? How many troops did this so-called ally send to Iraq for combat purposes?

    You have to be realistic. The people who fled to Taiwan lost mainland China. They’ll lose Taiwan too by 2049, when China expects to take it. Its as gone as Hong Kong.

    Harcourt Fenton Mudd (0c349e)

  16. Trump is a loony, out of control. Non compos mentis. You can’t make sense out of anything he does, because there is no sense in anything he does.

    nk (dbc370)

  17. Adults in the room, 2016: “Trump is needlessly provocative, lacks judgment, and will get us into wars!”

    Same Adults, 2019: “Why is Trump being polite to the largest nation on earth! He should posture on the side of 7 million people who live in an area ceded to China, and who we cannot help, and reinstitute the Cold War!”

    Harcourt Fenton Mudd (0c349e) — 10/1/2019 @ 9:13 am

    He went from saying wildly provocative things to saying wildly obsequious things. Example is below.

    Trump in 2017

    “They will be met with fire and fury like the world has never seen,” he said, with his arms crossed as he addressed reporters.

    Time123 (ea2b98)

  18. 16: the world was so much saner, safer and governed so much better by the non-loons before 2016. NoKo had no nukes; China smiled at everyone; the US balance of payments and debt in check, etc.

    Harcourt Fenton Mudd (0c349e)

  19. 17. A threat is sometimes good to a wacko in NoKo unaware of consequences in an insular place, but not as to China unless you mean it. Nuance I think it could be called.

    Harcourt Fenton Mudd (0c349e)

  20. Take a pipe and start hitting a police officer with gun already drawn anywhere in the world, I think you can predict what Will happen.

    BfC (f67dd5)

  21. Probably a provocateur, the hong kong police were making excuses yesterday,

    Narciso (37bd1e)

  22. Trump tweet…. “Congratulations to President Xi and the Chinese people on the 70th Anniversary of the People’s Republic of China!”

    This is the kind of mind that our intelligence services try so hard every day to keep far away from the White House.

    noel (f22371)

  23. Can you get a security clearance saying sh!t like that?

    noel (f22371)

  24. 23. You can if you can get enough people to vote for you.

    Gryph (08c844)

  25. https://2009-2017.state.gov/secretary/20092013clinton/rm/2011/09/174821.htm

    China’s National Day
    Press Statement
    Hillary Rodham Clinton
    Secretary of State
    Washington, DC
    September 29, 2011

    On behalf of President Obama and the people of the United States, I congratulate the people of China as you celebrate your National Day this October 1.

    From the official state visit of President Hu Jintao in January, to the very successful third round of the U.S.-China Strategic & Economic Dialogue in Washington in May, the United States has shown a deep commitment to this important relationship. Together, our two countries are seizing this moment in history and developing the positive, cooperative, and comprehensive relationship envisioned by our presidents. The United States is committed to the success of China, because a thriving China is good for America and a thriving America is good for China. Our two peoples are known for their hard work and ingenuity, and it is clear that by working together we can find solutions to our most pressing global challenges.

    On this 62nd anniversary of the founding of the People’s Republic of China, whether you celebrate with family, friends, or loved ones, know that the United States stands with you as a committed partner and friend. I hope all Chinese people everywhere have a safe and joyous holiday.

    PRN: 2011/1633

    BfC (66795c)

  26. Harcourt Fenton Mudd (0c349e) — 10/1/2019 @ 11:16 am

    I agree we shouldn’t threaten China. Trump doesn’t: he’s the one who threatened them w8th trade wars.

    More to the point, threatening China may be a bad thing, but it’s possible to not threaten them but also not congratulate them on 7 decades of success as a totalitarian regime.

    Kishnevi (8d5c75)

  27. BfC (66795c) — 10/1/2019 @ 2:10 pm

    We already knew Hillary was a jackass of the first order.

    Kishnevi (8d5c75)

  28. OT, this might blow minds on both sides, personally I might view this the same way the Reagan administration viewed Iran vs. Iraq: http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/elections/2019/10/01/elizabeth-warren-hits-back-facebook-mark-zuckerberg-after-leaked-audio/3828532002/

    urbanleftbehind (5be418)

  29. well I saw the social network, so I know the guppy shark in a turtle neck, then again red squaw, has been an utterly loathsome since 1986

    narciso (d1f714)

  30. “This is the kind of mind that our intelligence services try so hard every day to keep far away from the White House.”
    noel (f22371) — 10/1/2019 @ 1:06 pm

    Wow, that’s quite an admission. Welcome to our side, noel!

    Munroe (53beca)

  31. now Kissinger, was hiding the big reveal, many powers including germany, france and the soviet union, with a smaller contribution from the us and uk, were backing Iraq, against iran,

    narciso (d1f714)

  32. there is a cult of technocracy, which Zakaria and freedman,

    narciso (d1f714)

  33. I don’t trust the intelligence community either

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Predictions_of_the_dissolution_of_the_Soviet_Union

    The Central Intelligence Agency also badly over-estimated the internal stability of the Soviet Union, and did not anticipate the speed of its collapse. Former DCI Stansfield Turner in 1991 wrote in the US Journal Foreign Affairs, “We should not gloss over the enormity of this failure to forecast the magnitude of the Soviet crisis . . . Yet I never heard a suggestion from the CIA, or the intelligence arms of the departments of Defense or State, that numerous Soviets recognized a growing, systemic economic problem.”[8]

    BfC (66795c)

  34. Wow, that’s quite an admission. Welcome to our side, noel! says Munroe

    Cheerleader for communists? That side?

    noel (f22371)

  35. The bidens prefer to take the money and run!

    lany (40337a)

  36. no this nothing like the quota system, why do you ask,

    https://www.powerlineblog.com/archives/2019/10/affirmative-action-forever-harvard-edition.php

    narciso (d1f714)

  37. I remember the day when the vast majority of my fellow Republicans would have been horrified by that congratulatory tweet from ANY American politician. Hanoi Jane has nothing on Donald.

    Those were the days.

    noel (f22371)

  38. Twitter wasn’t around when Nixon embraced Mao, so you’ve covered your bases there noel.

    Munroe (53beca)

  39. Nixon’s name is going to be invoked a lot in the coming months.

    noel (f22371)

  40. I added a section to the post that I neglected to insert this morning before publishing. Apologies for my inefficiency:

    This week, there was a report that organ harvesting of persecuted religious and ethnic minorities was taking place in China. Specifically, the Uigher Muslims and Falun Gong members:

    The China Tribunal, a group that’s investigating the organ harvesting, said at a tense meeting of the United Nations Human Rights Council that the Chinese government was taking hearts, kidneys, lungs, and skin from groups including Uighur Muslims and members of the Falun Gong religious group.

    The China Tribunal describes itself as an “independent, international people’s tribunal, and was backed by the International Coalition to End Transplant Abuse in China, an Australian human rights charity made up of lawyers, academics, and medical professionals.

    China has denied carrying out mass harvesting of organs in any circumstance.

    Addressing UN representatives, a lawyer for the China Tribunal, Hamid Sabi, said the group had proof of the organ harvesting.

    Sabi said the group had found that China was committing “crimes against humanity” by harvesting organs from religious minorities like the Uighurs and members of Falun Gong, which has been banned and widely persecuted by the Chinese government.

    Meanwhile:

    UN experts and activists say at least 1 million ethnic Uighurs, and members of other largely Muslim minority groups, have been detained in camps in the vast western [Xinjiang] province.

    Beijing describes the camps as vocational training centres to help stamp out religious extremism and teach new work skills.

    Although a senior official claims that the majority of detainees have been released from the camps and “returned to society,” the U.S. State Dept. says there has been no such evidence to support this assertion.

    Moreover, this claim contradicts what Uigher family members are saying:

    Nicholas Bequelin, Amnesty International’s Asia regional director, said the claims were “deceptive and unverifiable”.

    “We have received no reports about large-scale releases,” he said. “In fact, families and friends of people who are being detained tell us they are still not able to contact them.”

    And to this ruling party, President Trump, on behalf of the United States of America, offered congratulations.

    Dana (05f22b)

  41. Just read that tweet. Jesus help us.

    noel (f22371)

  42. Xi’s background is a little complicated

    In 1963, when Xi was age 10, his father was purged from the Party and sent to work in a factory in Luoyang, Henan. In May 1966, the Cultural Revolution cut short Xi’s secondary education when all secondary classes were halted for students to criticise and fight their teachers. Student militants ransacked the Xi family home and one of Xi’s sisters, Xi Heping, was killed. Later, his mother was forced to publicly denounce his father, as he was paraded before a crowd as an enemy of the revolution. His father was later thrown into prison in 1968 when Xi was aged 15 and would not see his father again until 1972. Without the protection of his father, Xi was sent to work in Liangjiahe Village, Wen’anyi Town, Yanchuan County, Yan’an, Shaanxi, in 1969 in Mao Zedong’s Down to the Countryside Movement. After a few months, unable to stand rural life, he ran away to Beijing. He was arrested during a crackdown on deserters from the countryside and sent to a work camp to dig ditches.

    One might think his career is a mixed blessing,

    narciso (d1f714)

  43. @11: Well, I can’t speak for others, but THIS “adult in the room” in 2016 was saying, “Trump’s an incompetent progressive court jester and a puppet of Mitch McConnell’s GOP establishment who will speak loudly and carry a tiny white flag as he kowtows to every global tyrant he admires and praises for being (as he sees it) all the big, strong things he pretends to be on TV for his cultish fans.”

    Show me where I was wrong. That tiresome “The establishment hated Trump” schtick was old before it was out of the box. The establishment chose and created Trump, as their best weapon for undermining and ultimately “crushing” (McConnell’s word) their real enemy, constitutional conservatives.

    Daren Jonescu (2f5857)

  44. This is an AP alert coming on the anniversary:

    China’s military displays hypersonic ballistic nuclear missile believed capable of breaching U.S. anti-missile shields.

    Dana (05f22b)

  45. 15.

    Taiwan has no claim on us: Japan and Australia do, but Taiwan? How many troops did this so-called ally send to Iraq for combat purposes?

    You have to be realistic. The people who fled to Taiwan lost mainland China. They’ll lose Taiwan too by 2049, when China expects to take it. Its as gone as Hong Kong.

    I don’t know about the Iraq war, but Taiwan did help the U.S. in Vietnam. Taiwan has a similar claim on us as Japan. Both Japan and Taiwan could easily develop nukes, but instead are trusting the U.S. to help defend them.

    You could also say that the U.S. should not be supporting Israel or South Korea, because “there’s nothing really in it for us”. If the U.S. adopts the attitude that small democracies should fend for themselves against bigger authoritarian countries, because these small countries don’t really affect our bottom line, the U.S. would lose moral authority, and the world would be in serious trouble.

    norcal (eec1aa)

  46. By the way, Dana, I have read Red Azalea. Wonderful book. I love the way the author uses the literal English meaning of people’s Chinese names instead of just the Romanized Chinese. I remember one person whose name was Space Conqueror.

    norcal (eec1aa)

  47. The Uighurs were released to where? A mass grave? Or maybe to the next level of Chinese re-education hell.
    The US plays the same kinds of word games, but so far the stakes are not quite as high as they are in China

    steveg (354706)

  48. Arguably enbracing china in the 70s was a mistake, giving them entry to the wto aftet they stole the w 88, after loral provided them advanced targeting info even more so.

    Narciso (a4d5d7)

  49. So, Trump is the first POTUS to congradulate the Chinese Leaders on the 1949 Revolution? You’d better check the history books. Look up Nixon, Ford, Reagan, Clinton, Bush, Bush II, and Obama. So, what should have Trump have done? Say, I hate you, I hate you, I hate you?

    Of course, this just an excuse to attack trump. And if it isn’t and you want to put pressure on China, why are you against any kind of Tariff on Chinese goods? How else would we pressure China? Write them nasty notes?

    rcocean (1a839e)

  50. Well we saw what the last russian test resulted in:
    https://www.foxnews.com/tech/air-force-arms-b1-b-bomber-with-hypersonic-weapons

    Narciso (a4d5d7)

  51. One minutes its “OMG, Trump is starting a Trade War with China, our relationship with China is doomed!!!” now its OMG, Trump is cozening up to the Chinese, we’re getting too friendly!!”

    If only we had a Never-Trumper POTUS who would yell loudly and carry a small Stick, everything would be A-0K in the world. Thank God Trump is in charge. No wars, and a strong military. And a POTUS who wants trade deals that are good for the USA.

    rcocean (1a839e)

  52. Nixon’s love affair with Mao was really weird, but it seems Bush I (ambassador to China) felt the same way. Its not just that Nixon went to China, the guy was writing Mao public love notes till the day Nixon died.

    You’d think Nixon would’ve remember the 25,000-50,000 (depending on who/what you’re counting) or so Americans killed in the Chinese-american war November 1950-June 1953, which we label “The Korean War”. But Nixon seems not to have cared.

    rcocean (1a839e)

  53. One minutes its “OMG, Trump is starting a Trade War with China, our relationship with China is doomed!!!” now its OMG, Trump is cozening up to the Chinese, we’re getting too friendly!!”

    You understand Trump is an actual person, and he is doing both of these things himself, no one is forcing him. It’s almost like he doesn’t know what he’s supposed to be doing, so he’s just throwing the spaghetti-o’s on the wall, because it’s pretty; he doesn’t care what sticks, got to own them libs, or repubs, or conservatives, or for the lulz.

    I’m assuming that “cozening” isn’t some porn thing you’re sneaking in and I don’t know what it means.

    Colonel Klink (Ret) (6e7a1c)

  54. norcal,

    I’m so glad to hear you’ve read it. It is an amazing and heart-wrenching story of sheer survival. IIRC, Space Conqueror was her younger brother. Her father named him that because he loved astronomy and anything to do with space. I think too it had something to do with Mao saying China would be in space soon (this was in 1960 or so).

    I was trying to remember a portion of the book – and perhaps you remember it more clearly – where she is working gruelingly long hours every day of the week digging up sweet potatoes in the camp where they were still starving, and she had a epiphany as she realized this “holy call” in service to Mao and the State never changed the fact that they had to dig in the dirt, all day, every day, to eke out some food. The futility of it all hit her as both a slow revelation and like a ton of bricks.

    Dana (05f22b)

  55. @18 Fond of the Clinton era, were you?

    Nic (896fdf)

  56. So, what should have Trump have done? Say, I hate you, I hate you, I hate you?

    Of course, this just an excuse to attack trump.

    He should have just kept his mouth shut. This isn’t hard.

    Moreover, this isn’t an excuse to attack Trump. Trump invited the criticism by congratulating a country and ruling party that continue to participate in some pretty atrocious abuses of their own people.

    Dana (05f22b)

  57. Trump-haters seem to want the following:

    Talk tough and be hostile towards: Saudi Arabia, Turkey, Russia, Philippines.
    Cozy up to and let them do anything they want: Israel, Ukraine, Cuba, Venezuela, Georgia
    Talk tough but let them do anything they want in trade: China
    Talk tough (but not too much!) but let them do anything they want: North Korea and Iran
    Stay in their country and fight forever: Syria and Afghanistan.

    Like I said. Thank God, Trump is in charge.

    rcocean (1a839e)

  58. “He should have just kept his mouth shut. This isn’t hard.”

    Heads of State congratulate other countries on the anniversary of their founding. Everyone does it – all the time. Does that shock you?

    rcocean (1a839e)

  59. Foreign policy isn’t about Feelings and striking poses. Unless you’re John McCain (may be RIP) or Hillary Clinton. Or a Trump hater.

    A failure to congratulate china on their 70th “Birthday” would’ve been taken as an insult. Just as failing to congratulate them on their 50th anniversary or 60th Anniversary would’ve been. That’s why Bush in ’89, Clinton in ’99, and Obama in ‘2009 sent their congratulations. Its called DIPLOMACY.

    rcocean (1a839e)

  60. Dana,

    I read the book about 15 years ago, so I don’t remember the details of her epiphany. What I do recall is how the author was so emotionally expressive. I saw her on a TV program once–she’s also a very impressive speaker.

    Another book that I loved was Life and Death in Shanghai by Nien Cheng. I loaned both books to a co-worker. My co-worker relished Red Azalea, but not Life and Death in Shanghai. I guess that is a testament to how well Anchee Min writes.

    norcal (eec1aa)

  61. The situation in Hong Kong is tragic. So tell me what the USA should do about it? Lets hear you game plan. Other than, Orange man bad.

    rcocean (1a839e)

  62. Of course, this just an excuse to attack trump.

    Everything Trump does or says is just an excuse to attack Trump. It’s so unfair!!

    Radegunda (13e3ce)

  63. Thatcher sold out hong kong as she did the matabele in zimbabwe, mugabe was a blood thirsty thug whose zanus outrages outlined in rhat memoir by missionaries i referenced were ignored by carter and callaghan

    Narciso (a4d5d7)

  64. Never met a dictatorship he didn’t like.

    Dave (1bb933)

  65. 4: so maybe its a good idea to support someone who supports our military, and does not content himself with futile gestures and snubs?

    Maybe a good idea to support someone who will support the west coast ICBM interceptors that have been on again, off again since the Clinton years?

    Harcourt Fenton Mudd (0c349e)

  66. US economy $20,000 Billion. US export trade with China $350 billion. Do the math.

    rcocean (1a839e)

  67. 55: no. Mocking the supposition that all was well before Trump, or that he has done anything to make things worse.

    Harcourt Fenton Mudd (0c349e)

  68. 66: Ah. So we should have just left it as it was, running trade imbalances, then?

    Harcourt Fenton Mudd (0c349e)

  69. “Trade war fallout: U.S. manufacturing index falls again, down to lowest level since 2009 recession”
    Dave (1bb933) — 10/1/2019 @ 5:48 pm

    Bush is the nadir by which all other presidents get measured? Was that your point?

    Munroe (53beca)

  70. You can leave out those last three zeroes,

    Narciso (a4d5d7)

  71. 66: Ah. So we should have just left it as it was, running trade imbalances, then?

    Yes.

    Dave (1bb933)

  72. Maybe a good idea to support someone who will support the west coast ICBM interceptors that have been on again, off again since the Clinton years?

    OK, who is that, because it isn’t Trump.

    Colonel Klink (Ret) (6e7a1c)

  73. “The situation in Hong Kong is tragic. So tell me what the USA should do about it?”
    rcocean (1a839e) — 10/1/2019 @ 5:26 pm

    China must not be really all that bad, because it’s not on California’s boycott list like Iowa snd Texas.

    Munroe (53beca)

  74. States are not allowed to boycott foreign countries. That is strictly a federal power and it has been strictly enforced by the federal government. (I cannot say that it “is” strictly enforced for one obvious reason.)

    nk (dbc370)

  75. Why don’t the states boycott anyway and get a judge in Hawaii to block Trump?
    Seems to be the avenue of choice.

    steveg (354706)

  76. Never forget: Trump has Chinese ties; Macy’s used to sell’em.

    DCSCA (797bc0)

  77. Heads of State congratulate other countries on the anniversary of their founding. Everyone does it – all the time. Does that shock you?

    I must have missed the annual congratulations on the Fourth of July from the Peoples’ Republic of China.

    Rip Murdock (31088f)

  78. Speaking of communists, Bernie Sanders is literally damaged goods.

    Paul Montagu (f74687)

  79. Tangential to another thread, #74-Munroe, China helps out with the UCs and CSUs, paying full freight per each foreign students.

    urbanleftbehind (5eecdb)

  80. But will there be Bernie face or Bernie waving hands t-shirts should things turn for worst?

    urbanleftbehind (5eecdb)

  81. 3. Dana (05f22b) — 10/1/2019 @ 8:17 am

    Reminder: Tens of millions killed during the Great Leap Forward.

    Andc that was well <b before the Cultural Revolution. Half a decade or more.

    They ony go back to the Cultural Revolution. Nobody talks about how they took over China in the first place.

    One million people were arrested in one day in 1951. (they had amodel – in places recently taken over they ruled much more mildly)

    You need to go back all the way to 1944 (and earlier)

    1944 was when they developed the system of control, they later used.

    What Xi is doing now is trying to use technology to mimic the old Maoist system a little bit. The era when people couldn’t speak the truth to their famly, and when they had to denouunce people ended shortly after Mao’s death. It all fell apart after he near overthrow of the government in April, 1976.

    One thing that Mao didn’t have though, that they had later, was the 1-child policy.

    Sammy Finkelman (bcd7c8)

  82. There was a book published in 1963 (it was a Reader’s Dogest Condensed ook too) Escape From Red China. It should be required reading.

    Sammy Finkelman (bcd7c8)

  83. It could be worse:

    9.

    In another video, the protester who was shot is seen being treated by paramedics.

    At least they didn’t stop that, or punish the doctors.

    China has denied carrying out mass harvesting of organs in any circumstance.

    It depends what you mean by mass.

    Because of organ harvesting, China is not engagng in mass executions. They only kill someone when there’s an organ match and that means most of the prisoners are kept alive for a long time.

    Sammy Finkelman (bcd7c8)

  84. 11. Harcourt Fenton Mudd (0c349e) — 10/1/2019 @ 9:13 am

    and who we cannot help,

    We can help them by making this part of the complaints against China. Of course you can overplay your hand.

    Sammy Finkelman (bcd7c8)

  85. and reinstitute the Cold War!”

    And just what was wrong with the Cold War??

    I think we won the Cold War in the end. The constant opposition certainly helped in the fall of Russian Communism.

    Reagan referred to the Soviet Union as the “Evil Empire.”

    Just what would be the practical difference if an American president gave that appelation to The People’s Republic of China?

    Maybe we’d be more on guard. That’s a bad thing?

    Sammy Finkelman (bcd7c8)

  86. Trump promised Xi US silence on Hong Kong democracy protests as trade talks stalled

    The remarkable pledge to the Chinese leader is a dramatic departure from decades of US support for human rights in China and shows just how eager Trump is to strike a deal with Beijing as the trade war weighs on the US economy.

    And like other calls with the leaders of Ukraine, Russia and Saudi Arabia, records of Trump’s call with Xi were moved to a highly-classified, codeword-protected system, greatly limiting the number of administration officials who were aware of the conversation.

    Trump’s commitment to China had immediate and far-reaching effects throughout the US government as the President’s message was sent far and wide.

    In June, the State Department told then-US general counsel in Hong Kong, Kurt Tong, to cancel a planned speech on the protests in Washington because the President had promised Xi no one from the administration would talk about the issue.

    Tong was also slated to speak at a Washington-based think tank in early July but the State Department asked for that event to be canceled as well. That speech was ultimately rescheduled for after Tong’s scheduled retirement later that month meaning he eventually had the opportunity to speak about Hong Kong but as a former official.

    Dave (1bb933)


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