Was Russia the Reason for Rexit?
I’m not suggesting Russia was actually responsible for Tillerson’s exit, of course. After all, Russia would never try to interfere with the U.S. President’s pick for Secretary of State!
But perhaps Rex Tillerson’s aggressive response to Russia’s attempted assassination of Sergei Skripal and his daughter, Yulia was the last straw for our Putin-loving President.
Let’s review the bidding, including the incident and the different responses from Tillerson and the rest of the administration.
Skripal, recall, was a double agent who betrayed Russia, was convicted of treason, and was traded as part of a swap of traitors. He had been poisoned with a nerve agent that very few possess. Putin is among that very few, and the use of the agent is Putin sending the message that, while he will publicly deny it, he is the one behind the attack.
Theresa May has said it is “highly likely” Russia was behind the attack:
The PM said it was “highly likely” Russia was responsible for the Salisbury attack.
The Foreign Office summoned Russia’s ambassador to provide an explanation.
Mrs May said if there is no “credible response” by the end of Tuesday, the UK would conclude there has been an “unlawful use of force” by Moscow.
May’s only caveat was that maybe Russia lost control of the nerve agent: “Either this was a direct action by the Russian state against our country, or the Russian government lost control of its potentially catastrophically damaging nerve agent and allowed it to get into the hands of others.”
Meanwhile, our boy Vlad is just laughing it off, smirking as he responds to questions about it.
For the most part, the Trump administration has been curiously silent about responsibility for the attack. Just yesterday, Sarah Sanders refused to go as far as Prime Minister May, and reporters noticed:
White House press secretary Sarah Sanders stopped short of blaming Russia for a poison attack Monday, shortly after British Prime Minister Theresa May said it was “highly likely” Russia was responsible for the incident in southwest England.
“The attack was reckless, indiscriminate, and irresponsible,” Sanders said at the daily White House press briefing.
But when pressed on responsibility, Sanders said only: “Right now we are standing with our U.K. ally. I think they are still working through even some of the details on that.”
Note that I said that the Trump administration had been silent about responsibility “for the most part.” Guess who wasn’t silent at all? If you said Rex Tillerson, you get the kewpie doll. Yup: Tillerson, uniquely among Trump administration officials, had already placed the blame squarely on Moscow:
“We have full confidence in the UK’s investigation and its assessment that Russia was likely responsible for the nerve agent attack that took place in Salisbury last week,” Tillerson said in the statement.
He continued, “There is never a justification for this type of attack — the attempted murder of a private citizen on the soil of a sovereign nation — and we are outraged that Russia appears to have again engaged in such behavior. From Ukraine to Syria — and now the UK — Russia continues to be an irresponsible force of instability in the world, acting with open disregard for the sovereignty of other states and the life of their citizens.”
The State Department’s position on the attack appears [to] be much stronger than the White House’s response.
White House press secretary Sarah Sanders called the attack “reckless, indiscriminate and irresponsible,” but stopped short of blaming Russia.
Unlike Sanders, Tillerson did not mince words:
Speaking to reporters while traveling in Africa, Tillerson said the attack “clearly came from Russia” and would “certainly trigger a response.”
If you believe the White House’s timing, Trump told Tillerson on Friday that he was going to be replaced. If true, that would tend to undercut the notion that the ouster was over the response to Russia’s evident assassination attempt. Prime Minister May’s direct accusation came just yesterday — supposedly long after Trump had made his decision.
Then again, that means the news wasn’t leaked for the entire weekend — an amazing job of secrecy from a White House not known for keeping such things under wraps. And then there’s this:
W.H. claims Trump asked Tillerson to step aside on Friday. Rex was in the middle of a week-long Africa trip.
State Dept claims the two men never spoke. No mention of Friday call.
Which side is telling the truth?
— Brian Stelter (@brianstelter) March 13, 2018
Hmmmm.
Also, while May only yesterday directly pointed the finger at Russia, Skripal was poisoned on March 4, and it was immediately evident who the prime suspect was. Perhaps T Rex and Trump were already having disagreements about how to handle it.
This controversy is hardly the only issue Trump has had with Tillerson, of course. Trump has publicly identified the Iran deal as a point of contention, and always lurking in the background was Tillerson’s continual refusal to deny that he had called Trump a “f***ing moron.” The writing has been on the wall for a while.
Still: the timing of all this is, shall we say, interesting. My guess is that we have not heard the last of it.
UPDATE: Tillerson called Trump a “f***ing moron” and not a “f***ing idiot.” I have fixed the post to reflect the correct insult.
[Cross-posted at RedState and The Jury Talks Back.]
Always trust Stelter content.
Colonel Haiku (f0e797) — 3/13/2018 @ 9:14 amIt is entirely possible that 1)Trump had told Tillerson it was about to time to go, in general terms, but not pointing to a specific date, or even specific week
kishnevi (bb03e6) — 3/13/2018 @ 9:21 amand
2)Tillerson made his Monday comment knowing he could basically say whatever he wanted to say because he knew he was being ousted. IOW, had Tillerson thought he was staying on as SoS he might not have been so forthright in pointing to Russia.
this had nothing to do with Russia
the Kushner-led initiatives with Saudi Arabia and Israel meant there was no constructive role for a jew-hating Iranian sympathizer like Tillerboobs
happyfeet (28a91b) — 3/13/2018 @ 9:23 amanyone else notice how CNN fake news propaganda slut Brian Seltzer is vastly more curious about who tried to kill some sleazy Russian dude than who *actually* succeeded in greasing Seth Rich
happyfeet (28a91b) — 3/13/2018 @ 9:27 amTillerson made his Monday comment knowing he could basically say whatever he wanted to say because he knew he was being ousted.
it’s definitely very easy to see a bitter and petulant Tillerboobs working with deep state John Brennan CIA trash to lob a stink bomb on his way out the door
the man has no integrity
happyfeet (28a91b) — 3/13/2018 @ 9:35 amOfficials: White House fires top Tillerson aide who contradicted account of secretary of state’s dismissal.
happyfeet (28a91b) — 3/13/2018 @ 9:36 amhere’s more of the story
happyfeet (28a91b) — 3/13/2018 @ 9:38 amI think being a top Tillerson aide might have more to do with Goldstein going than any statement he made: preplanned housecleaning.
kishnevi (bb03e6) — 3/13/2018 @ 9:42 amSteven (Steve) Goldstein official bio
happyfeet (28a91b) — 3/13/2018 @ 9:43 amyes yes Mr. kishnevi
trustworthiness is at a premium in Washington now
happyfeet (28a91b) — 3/13/2018 @ 9:44 amIf you believe the White House’s timing, Trump told Tillerson on Friday that he was going to be replaced. If true, that would tend to undercut the notion that the ouster was over the response to Russia’s evident assassination attempt. Prime Minister May’s direct accusation came just yesterday — supposedly long after Trump had made his decision.
and remember that a now-robustly healthy Tillerboobs took a “sick day” on Saturday
happyfeet (28a91b) — 3/13/2018 @ 9:47 amThis Goldstein fellow sounds like a real Jew-hater to me if there ever was one.
nk (dbc370) — 3/13/2018 @ 9:52 amHe’s probably one of the Tatars Putin accused of meddling in our elections.
nk (dbc370) — 3/13/2018 @ 9:53 amThey’ve reach full yeargh:
narciso (d1f714) — 3/13/2018 @ 9:59 amhttp://powerlineblog.com/archives/2018/03/how-the-democrats-will-respond-to-pompeo-and-haspel-nominations.php
This Goldstein fellow sounds like a real Jew-hater to me if there ever was one.
wheels within wheels my friend
happyfeet (28a91b) — 3/13/2018 @ 10:03 amWhy would Trump nominate a “jew-hating iran sympathizer” to begin with?
Davethulhu (fab944) — 3/13/2018 @ 10:03 amWhy would Trump nominate a “jew-hating iran sympathizer” to begin with?
Tillerboobs obfuscated his Persian sympathies at his hearing:
turns out this was the apex of Tillerboobs’ enthusiasm for a “full review” of the Iran deal
happyfeet (28a91b) — 3/13/2018 @ 10:10 amHe same recommended by Powell and rice, yes I didn’t think that was swift
narciso (d1f714) — 3/13/2018 @ 10:10 amDemocrat Talking Points — right on time.
shipwreckedcrew (56b591) — 3/13/2018 @ 10:38 amCould have been written as follows:
According to CNN, the house organ for NeverTrumpers worldwide, “The State Department’s position on the attack appears [to] be much stronger than the White House’s response.”
Accuracy counts.
shipwreckedcrew (56b591) — 3/13/2018 @ 10:40 amTillerboobs said:
As you can see, Tillerboobs stopped short of actually blaming Russia for doing poison all up in it.
reading! it’s the most important meal of the day!
happyfeet (28a91b) — 3/13/2018 @ 10:46 amTrump said:
As you can see, Trump stopped short of actually blaming Russia for doing poison all up in it.
Davethulhu (fab944) — 3/13/2018 @ 10:53 amthe important thing Mr. thulhu is that Leggy Meggy didn’t get any poison all up in it and remains a sturdy and reliable breeding vessel
happyfeet (28a91b) — 3/13/2018 @ 10:57 amWhy can’t you talk like a normal human being?
Davethulhu (fab944) — 3/13/2018 @ 11:00 amWhat I don’t understand is that the left in this country has been giving the Russian commies head since 1917 even calling Stalin a great man and covering up at least two genocides. Now suddenly the Red Diaper Left is staunch anti Russian. Other than Trump kicking their a$$ and becoming president what has changed?
Rev.Hoagie (1b0402) — 3/13/2018 @ 11:01 amRussia wasn’t the reason for Tillerson’s sacking.
Tillerson taking it upon himself to make a statement about Russia in his capacity as SOS likely played a role in the timing.
Because that wasn’t his statement to make. He rightfully supported the position of our ally. He should have left it at that.
The State Dept has no independent means to itself validate the conclusions of the the British. That is a role that should have been left to the CIA. They have the clandestine service and analysts to evaluate the information gathered by the Brits — as well as the intelligence gathered by their own efforts.
The State Dept has none of that.
So Tillerson — not for the first time — stepped out on his own to make an official government statement when he wasn’t authorized to do so.
shipwreckedcrew (56b591) — 3/13/2018 @ 11:06 am23, you must really want a Calico king or queen. You would need something like what happened over the Hudson River a couple days ago to take out the William brood.
urbanleftbehind (5eecdb) — 3/13/2018 @ 11:10 amRev. Hoagie, Russia may still have vestiges of the Soviet communist regime, but its gone everyway wrong from other leftists tenets – oligarchic wealth, pro-breeding, anti-Islam (Greeks and Eye-talians even get beat up on the streets), anti-gay, pro-Christian et al
urbanleftbehind (5eecdb) — 3/13/2018 @ 11:13 amWhy can’t you talk like a normal human being?
Davethulhu (fab944) — 3/13/2018 @ 11:00 am
Filed under, “Kettle? This is Pot, you’re black”…
Colonel Haiku (f0e797) — 3/13/2018 @ 11:16 amTrump is Putin-loving? How so?
He has said that he respects Putin as a leader, but that doesn’t mean he loves, or even likes him. Putin took a chaotic, dysfunctional country where theft was the main industry and turned it around to a great degree. That DESERVES respect. Sure, he’s also a megalomaniac dictator who kills dissidents, but everyone has flaws.
I’m only half kidding here. Trump has never said that he thinks Putin’s goals are in line with America’s, only that he’s a real leader that the US has to consider and contend with. I really don’t get the snark.
Kevin M (752a26) — 3/13/2018 @ 11:21 amI knew Tillerson was going when Trump announced his agreement to meet with Kim without telling Tillerson first. The problem was lining up the ducks to replace him.
Kevin M (752a26) — 3/13/2018 @ 11:23 amWas a stiff neck the real reason Dick York left Bewitched? We may never know.
Pinandpuller (16b0b5) — 3/13/2018 @ 11:25 amWas a stiff neck the real reason Dick York left Bewitched? We may never know.
I heard he had a terrible recurring nose itch.
Kevin M (752a26) — 3/13/2018 @ 11:27 amI believe that its 100% true that this change has more to do with wanting Pompeo as SOS than wanting to fire Tillerson.
Pompeo has been a cabinet superstar from day 1. He’s pretty much the smartest guy in every room he enters, he’s done flawless work taking over the CIA from the contemptible John Brennan.
The lack of direct criticism aimed at Pompeo from Brennan — who has not been shy about criticizing anything else — pretty much shows without a doubt that Brennan realizes he’d be over-matched. Same for Clapper’s lack of criticism aimed at Pompeo.
The Dems will try to go after Pompeo in his confirmation hearing, but there isn’t a Dem Senator on the Foreign Relations Comm that can touch him. He’s going to make them look like fools.
shipwreckedcrew (56b591) — 3/13/2018 @ 11:40 amBut but but he TORTURED innocent Muslims!
Kevin M (752a26) — 3/13/2018 @ 12:01 pm1. He sounded shaken.
Patterico (8bf811) — 3/13/2018 @ 12:26 pm2. He found out only today.
3. He did not thank Trump.
And you skipped it! From the post: Tillerson said the attack “clearly came from Russia.” I even put him it in bold and everything for those who, like you happy, have trouble processing information that does not benefit Trump.
Patterico (8bf811) — 3/13/2018 @ 12:28 pmhe’s probably lying though
it sounds like he was told Friday that he was gonna be replaced and what he didn’t know was that was going to happen today
happyfeet (28a91b) — 3/13/2018 @ 12:28 pmThe half of you that is not kidding needs to pay more attention to the other half.
Patterico (8bf811) — 3/13/2018 @ 12:29 pm“clearly came from Russia”
oh my goodness this is not the same as saying that the Russian government is at fault
and if I’m not mistaken what he’s referring to is the poison that was itself, not “the attack” per se
those who, like you happy, have trouble processing information that does not benefit Trump
I love him and you can’t come between us no matter what you say
happyfeet (28a91b) — 3/13/2018 @ 12:31 pmDesperate argument is desperate.
Patterico (8bf811) — 3/13/2018 @ 12:32 pmoopers
what he’s referring to is the poison
happyfeet (28a91b) — 3/13/2018 @ 12:32 pmthat wasitselfDesperate argument is desperate.
nonono the dirty propaganda sluts at the Associated Press are trying to obfuscate:
(notice how that’s not even actual english)
this report clarifies what Tillerboobs said:
as you can see, Tillerboobs limited his statement to saying that the poison itself came from Russia
happyfeet (28a91b) — 3/13/2018 @ 12:37 pmBritain needs to screen assassins like they screened Martin Sellner, Britanny Pettibone and Lauren Southern.
Pinandpuller (16b0b5) — 3/13/2018 @ 12:42 pmhere’s what seems to have happened:
1. sleazy nasty Tillerboobs finds out Friday he’s gonna be canned
2. Saturday he calls in sick and spends the day scheming with some dirty CIA ass-pansy like John Brennan – they decide that Tillerboobs will throw up a Russian stinkbomb as he exits
3. they also coach their media how to spin this (hence the curiously edited stories from CNN Jake Tapper fake news and the dirty Associated Press propaganda sluts)
4. Dirty swamp-condom Steve Goldstein issues a statement saying Tillerboobs was blindsided
5. nevertrump runs the ball downfield for them
happyfeet (28a91b) — 3/13/2018 @ 12:43 pmAs you can see, Trump stopped short of actually blaming Russia for doing poison all up in it.
Davethulhu (fab944) — 3/13/2018 @ 10:53 am
Stopping short? That’s Frank Costanza’s move.
Pinandpuller (16b0b5) — 3/13/2018 @ 12:48 pmRex Tillerson found a Trump Derangement Support Idol in Africa and put it in his suitcase and from that moment he was cursed.
Pinandpuller (16b0b5) — 3/13/2018 @ 12:51 pmin Tillerboobs’ official statement is another example of how he fails to state clearly and unequivocally that Russia was to blame
In actuality, there’s really no daylight between what Sarah said and what Tillerboobs said.
This is fake news.
happyfeet (28a91b) — 3/13/2018 @ 12:52 pmThis Goldstein fellow sounds like a real Jew-hater to me if there ever was one.
nk (dbc370) — 3/13/2018 @ 9:52 am
They say it starts in the home, mr nk.
Pinandpuller (16b0b5) — 3/13/2018 @ 12:53 pmThere might be many more Frank Costanzas in the offing – dont forget what language he picked up and where he gave his platoon food poisoning.
urbanleftbehind (5eecdb) — 3/13/2018 @ 12:53 pmJust for the sake of clarity when Stetler says,
… by State Dept claims the two men never spoke. Brian Stetler meant Steve Goldstein, the undersecretary of state for public diplomacy and public affairs, who was then escorted from the building for impersonating a State Department. [YouTube]
Putting it in the record.
papertiger (c8116c) — 3/13/2018 @ 12:58 pmRobert Mueller said the anthrax attack clearly came from Steven Hatfill.
Pinandpuller (16b0b5) — 3/13/2018 @ 1:01 pmPutin’s enemies are dropping like flies…
Putin enemy found dead in London
“Unexplained” Heh.
Dave (e82498) — 3/13/2018 @ 1:06 pmUndersecretary is what guy’s like Steve Goldstein want as their COD.
You can’t have secretary without “secret”. Or secrete.
Pinandpuller (16b0b5) — 3/13/2018 @ 1:11 pmAs Steve Martin learned you have to get the oil cans away from the assassin’s bullets so maybe stay away from London people. How about Skyfall?
Pinandpuller (16b0b5) — 3/13/2018 @ 1:13 pmWho’s Killing the Great Spies of Europe?
Pinandpuller (16b0b5) — 3/13/2018 @ 1:15 pmStill: the timing of all this is, shall we say, interesting. My guess is that we have not heard the last of it.
Really?? A “collusion!” inference has legs? What a bold prediction.
random viking (6a54c2) — 3/13/2018 @ 1:16 pmI tire of all this nonsense.
Wishful thinking about Trump erasure and a clean field for your favored candidate is not going to happen, and you will never make anything about any sort of “timing” because, no, it is not interesting, and Tillerson was going before anyone told him to be gone.
Yes, Putin’s a monster.
No, that doesn’t mean you don’t have to deal with the other realities attending his existence.
(Which won’t be much longer is my decided view and prediction, in contrast to what I just said about the other guy.)
SarahW (3164f0) — 3/13/2018 @ 1:33 pmTheresa May is considering military action against Russia? Now who’s the one talking sh*te?
Pinandpuller (16b0b5) — 3/13/2018 @ 1:40 pm2. He found out only today.
Says someone who regularly admonishes commenters who draw conclusions in the absence of evidence.
random viking (6a54c2) — 3/13/2018 @ 1:41 pmLook, the problem with Putin is that, after rescuing Russia from the Interregnum, he’s gotten these expansion ideas that could get him in trouble. If Hitler had gone home to Bavaria in 1937, he’d still be on stamps in Germany. But no. Putin may be following the same career path, but his accomplishments in turning Russia into a country again are not insignificant.
Kevin M (752a26) — 3/13/2018 @ 1:43 pmTillerson was CONSTANTLY surprised by foreign policy developments. The system (State, IC, White House, etc) had been working around him for months. Particularly on North Korea. The substitution of Pompeo means that NK gets one last chance when Trump meets Kim, then KERPOW. After that, we won’t HAVE to change Iran policy — the Iranians will be stopping their program toot suite.
Kevin M (752a26) — 3/13/2018 @ 1:48 pmShe;s not going to let Putin get away with claiming Russia had nothing to do with this.
The nerve gas agent was Novichok, or rather a variant of that. It is 5 to ten times more lethal (per milligram) than VX. Novichoik was developed by the Soviet Union in the the 1980s and was revealed by some dissident scientists in 1992, after the fall of Communism. The manufacturing plant was in Uzbekistan and was dismantled by the United States in 1999. Russia was not supposed to have retained any of that (or manufacture it again)
Meanwhile another Russia was found dead in London Monday, Nikolai Glushkov, who was once business partners with Boris Berezovsky – whose death by the way, may also have been murder, albeit done more carefully than the last attacks. Glushkov and others accused Putin of murdering Berezovsky.
Sammy Finkelman (02a146) — 3/13/2018 @ 1:56 pmI would be surprised to see the Iranians pull back.
Colonel Haiku (f0e797) — 3/13/2018 @ 1:56 pm62. Kevin M (752a26) — 3/13/2018 @ 1:48 pm
It really does. It might stretch out for a while if theer are no furtehr tests either of missiles or bombs.
Sammy Finkelman (02a146) — 3/13/2018 @ 1:58 pmMaybe the motive is to prevent them from accusing Putin of other murders.
If that is Putin’s motive, there might not be an easy end to that.
Sammy Finkelman (02a146) — 3/13/2018 @ 2:00 pm46… good stuff! Frank Costanza is one of the all-time Franks.
Colonel Haiku (f0e797) — 3/13/2018 @ 2:00 pmSo what “foreign policy developments,” other than President Dennison’s unhinged tweets and insane rantings in front of the cameras, was Rex surprised by?
Are you faulting him for not knowing the dates and times of Nork missile tests in advance?
Dave (445e97) — 3/13/2018 @ 2:03 pmCharlemagne was a great Frank.
Pinandpuller (16b0b5) — 3/13/2018 @ 2:04 pmTillerson’s missile alarm warning was on island time, Dave Brah!
Pinandpuller (16b0b5) — 3/13/2018 @ 2:06 pmI was thinking it’s because they are expecting some kind of crackdown/mass expulsion in the coming days, as retaliation for Skirpal, that will make it harder for them to conduct assassinations in the near future. So take out everyone you can while you can.
Dave (445e97) — 3/13/2018 @ 2:09 pm45. happyfeet (28a91b) — 3/13/2018 @ 12:43 pm
He didn’t. Trump says he decided on Friday, but all that Tillerson was told by chief of staff John Kelly (he didn”t speak to Trump) was taht he should cut his trip to Africa short. That would reasonably have been seen as related to North Korea. Kelly also told him “You may get a tweet.”
https://www.nytimes.com/2018/03/13/us/politics/trump-tillerson-pompeo.html?mtrref=www.google.com
He may have decided to continue speaking about matetrs that seemed to be left to him, like Russia.
Tillerson says he was called by Trump from Air Force One just after noon to inform him personally of the dismissal, and maybe to discuss details. This was more than three hours after Trump had tweeted the news:
Now Tillerson says he plans to immediately step aside from his post at the end of the day turning over all responsibilities to John J. Sullivan, the Deputy Secretary of State. But he will not officially end his service until midnight March 31.
Sammy Finkelman (02a146) — 3/13/2018 @ 2:11 pm71. The poison must already by in Britain.
Sammy Finkelman (02a146) — 3/13/2018 @ 2:11 pmI was thinking of the overall motive for these assassinations.
Sammy Finkelman (02a146) — 3/13/2018 @ 2:12 pmSo what “foreign policy developments,” other than President Dennison’s unhinged tweets and insane rantings in front of the cameras, was Rex surprised by?
Are you faulting him for not knowing the dates and times of Nork missile tests in advance?
Dave (445e97) — 3/13/2018 @ 2:03 pm
More a case of “foreign entanglements”, such as you with the poultry. Surprised, that you can’t let it go. Amused when it can’t let go of you, ConDave…
Colonel Haiku (f0e797) — 3/13/2018 @ 2:17 pmPour encourager les autres…
Dave (445e97) — 3/13/2018 @ 2:18 pmI was thinking of the overall motive for these assassinations.
Sammy Finkelman (02a146) — 3/13/2018 @ 2:12 pm
Let’s play stump teh Sammy! We are talking Putin, right? What does Putin enjoy more than topless, bareback horsey rides?!?! Let’s see… oh yeah, killing people.
Colonel Haiku (f0e797) — 3/13/2018 @ 2:21 pmthis is a feckless little country what imports entire gaggles of muslim terrorists every week plus god help them Leggy Meggy
they really need to learn to pick their battles
happyfeet (28a91b) — 3/13/2018 @ 2:25 pmI’m curious. Who do you think killed more people, Putin with poison or Hussein with drones?
Rev.Hoagie (1b0402) — 3/13/2018 @ 2:26 pm2. He found out only today.Don’t think so. Several news outlets (ABC, CNN, etc.,) report Rex got the word Friday while overseas (on that ‘sick day’) rom a WH ‘official’– reportedly Kelly, that he was on the outs- well before May went public and addressed Parlement.
DCSCA (797bc0) — 3/13/2018 @ 2:29 pmHe found out only today.Don’t think so.
Several news outlets (ABC, CNN, etc.,) report Rex got the word Friday while overseas (on that ‘sick day’) rom a WH ‘official’– reportedly Kelly, that he was on the outs- well before May went public and addressed Parlement.
DCSCA (797bc0) — 3/13/2018 @ 2:29 pmSorry- duplicate comment- sneezed.
DCSCA (797bc0) — 3/13/2018 @ 2:31 pmThis is a UK security issue anyway. The Brits have been taking in Rooskie ex-pats in spy swops and defections for decades. Hell hath no fury like a woman scorned, hence ‘traitors’ to Mother Russia should know they’re walking targets by now.
DCSCA (797bc0) — 3/13/2018 @ 2:42 pmI know this is an old story but it’s funny plus it ties in a little with the way the UK treats non traditional media people and the State Department
Three Playboy models are still stuck in Mexico after wrongfully being detained by Mexican authorities who believed the three girls were “working” without a visa at a party for Playboy Music Fest on June 30.
Although the three Playboy bunnies have been released from their holding cell, they were forced to remain in Mexico over Independence Day weekend where they are still waiting to meet with immigration officials to get their passports back, according to Fox News.
A State Department spokesperson confirmed to The Daily Caller they are aware of the situation, but could not comment on the matter.
“We are aware of those reports. Due to privacy considerations, we have no comment. The Department of State takes its obligation to assist U.S. citizens abroad seriously,” the spokesperson said.
Smokeroom
Pinandpuller (16b0b5) — 3/13/2018 @ 2:49 pmIt’s been a while since I watched Munich but did the countries where Israel assassinated terrorists threaten military action against them?
Pinandpuller (16b0b5) — 3/13/2018 @ 2:50 pmSurprised, that you can’t let it go. Amused when it can’t let go of you, ConDave…
Colonel Haiku (f0e797) — 3/13/2018 @ 2:17 pm
Three French Hens or two London Birds.
Pinandpuller (16b0b5) — 3/13/2018 @ 2:52 pmI’m curious. Who do you think killed more people, Putin with poison or Hussein with drones?
Rev.Hoagie (1b0402) — 3/13/2018 @ 2:26 pm
Doctors, without borders.
Pinandpuller (16b0b5) — 3/13/2018 @ 2:56 pmAnd a freakin’ partridge in a pear tree…
Colonel Haiku (f0e797) — 3/13/2018 @ 2:58 pmLittle Charlie and The Nightcats
You Got Your Hooks in Me
Pinandpuller (16b0b5) — 3/13/2018 @ 2:58 pmBig Bird…Little cloaca
Partridge…All cloaca
-The Birdman of UC Irvine
Pinandpuller (16b0b5) — 3/13/2018 @ 3:05 pm
Rev.Hoagie (1b0402) — 3/13/2018 @ 3:09 pmFunny thing, they don’t exist any more. Not since the opening of Lawyers without borders.
The nor piece, I linked last night, says novichok was used in Malaysia, by north Korea last year.
narciso (d1f714) — 3/13/2018 @ 3:10 pmhttp://freebeacon.com/national-security/tillerson-fired-rogue-bid-save-iran-nuke-deal
I was thinking of the overall motive for these assassinations.
The killing of Nikolai Glushkov may have been accelerated by a possible expulsion of Russian diplomats in the coming days (the UK probably won’t go that far) but that can’t be the reason.
Maybe more like this:
Some people who reported about Chechnya were killed because they accused the Russian government of doing terrible things.
Alexander Litvinenko was probably killed because he accused Vladimir Putin of having been responsible for the Moscow apartment building bombing (which had a great role in leading to Yeltsin picking him as a successor) which had bene blamed on Chechens.
That could undermine Putin’s claim to power and even get him in trouble.
Sergei Magnitsky was killed because he was threatening to expose some big corruption.
Boris Berezovsky was killed because he accused Putin of murdering Sergei Magnitsky
Nikolai Glushkov was killed because he accused Putin of murdering Boris Berezovsky.
Sergei Skripal’s son and wife were killed to prevent them from later accusing Putin of murdering
Sergei Skripal.
Sergei Skripal and his daughter was attacked to prevent some other accusation. Putin attempted to kill his entire immediate family to prevent an accusation of killing Sergei Skripal.
A lot of these murders were done because Putin thought he could get away with it, and maybe wouldn’t even be accused.
Don’t forget the Cahrlie Hebdo attacks!
I think maybe Putin was responsible.
He’s that cynical.
https://www.thesun
Pou
Sammy Finkelman (02a146) — 3/13/2018 @ 3:15 pmDave (445e97) — 3/13/2018 @ 2:18 pm
So what “foreign policy developments,” other than President Dennison’s unhinged tweets and insane rantings in front of the cameras, was Rex surprised by?
Such as saying, at length, just before Trump announced meeting with Kim, that Trump would not meet with Kim. But I assume you think that Trump announcing a meeting with Kim as an unhinged tweet, so I guess you win.
Kevin M (752a26) — 3/13/2018 @ 3:15 pmHow much rent is Trump paying Dave for that space in Dave’s brain?
Kevin M (752a26) — 3/13/2018 @ 3:17 pm91. Syria, with Russian support and advice, attacks doctors and hospitals. Although considering doctors helping people an act of rebellion really started with Bahrain.
Sammy Finkelman (02a146) — 3/13/2018 @ 3:17 pmLawyers without borders.
I thought it was Headloppers without Borders.
Kevin M (752a26) — 3/13/2018 @ 3:18 pm95… it’s rent-free and he’s lovin’ It, Jerry!
Colonel Haiku (f0e797) — 3/13/2018 @ 3:18 pmIn important news… http://ace.mu.nu/archives/374306.php
Colonel Haiku (f0e797) — 3/13/2018 @ 3:19 pm79. Putin has on;y killed a few people with poison. Each time because he thought the poison would go undetected.
It was detected, and then pointed squarely at the Russian state because the posion was so obscure, rare, difficult to hsndle, and expensive.
Sammy Finkelman (02a146) — 3/13/2018 @ 3:19 pmAnd he’s never ever killed someone with poison when it’s been undetected?
Kevin M (752a26) — 3/13/2018 @ 3:24 pmnarciso – where do have alink sowing North Korean use.
If North Korea had it, it would have gotten it or instructions, from Russia, it could evne be an alibi.
Russia hacked the Winter Olympics but tried to blame North Korea
Sammy Finkelman (02a146) — 3/13/2018 @ 3:25 pmGlushkov, was a former aeroflot manager who had been detained by putin,
narciso (d1f714) — 3/13/2018 @ 3:27 pmLugovoy one of litvinenkos assassins, had tried to ingratiate himself with berezovsky suggesting a plan to spring him (re Amy knight, orders to kill)
Rev. Hoagie, http://www.msf.org/ suggests that doctors without borders still exists, your impression notwithstanding.
aphrael (e0cdc9) — 3/13/2018 @ 3:31 pm101. Kevin M (752a26) — 3/13/2018 @ 3:24 pm
Maybe he has, where the poison killed someone before they saw doctors.
But he has other methds of killing people.
Here’s a story about Boris Berezovsky.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/mar/27/boris-berezovsky-inquest-open-verdict-death
Sammy Finkelman (02a146) — 3/13/2018 @ 3:31 pmIn other news:
https://www.forbes.com/forbes/welcome/?toURL=https://www.forbes.com/sites/heshmatalavi/2018/03/13/new-round-in-irans-nationwide-protests/&refURL=https://t.co/I6OsMnvkY2&referrer=https://t.co/I6OsMnvkY2#65f79ebc2414
narciso (d1f714) — 3/13/2018 @ 3:34 pmThe tick-tock on this firing is all over the deck. But kudos to Rex for rising to run Exxon-Mobil, a virtual nation-state in its own right. Still, calling your boss a ‘=bleeping= moron’ wasn’t exactly a display of skilled diplomacy for the nation’s top diplomat even if it was and remains true. An experienced executive of his caliber should have known better. Rex was a living advertisement for the ‘Walking Dead’ from that moment forward. Our Captain and several of his officers aboard the ship of state are learning the hard way that government is not a business.
____
Catch the video of our Captain ‘shopping’ for walls in San Diego today; then imagine Nixon browsing to buy tape recorders.
DCSCA (797bc0) — 3/13/2018 @ 3:38 pmwhy can’t Tillerboobs just leave right now
some people just can’t take a hint
happyfeet (28a91b) — 3/13/2018 @ 3:56 pmaphrael @ 104. Anybody can start up a phony web site. But you do realize I was kidding, right? I was suggesting Lawyers without borders had sued Doctors without borders out of existence. T’was a joke.
Rev.Hoagie (1b0402) — 3/13/2018 @ 4:09 pmI was trying to make this point earlier:
http://powerlineblog.com/archives/2018/03/tea-for-the-tillerson-2.php
narciso (d1f714) — 3/13/2018 @ 4:09 pmAnd he’s never ever killed someone with poison when it’s been undetected?
That was rhetorical.
Kevin M (752a26) — 3/13/2018 @ 4:12 pmDaniel Drezner has a scathing review of Tillerson’s tenure:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/posteverything/wp/2018/03/13/five-thoughts-about-the-firing-of-rex-tillerson/ (paywall)
Kevin M (752a26) — 3/13/2018 @ 4:20 pmI don’t underestimate putin, but neither do compare him with his soviet predecessors:
https://www.commentarymagazine.com/politics-ideas/the-socialist-temptation/
narciso (d1f714) — 3/13/2018 @ 4:35 pmso ladyboy mattis is gonna tap out?
oh that’s so sad
bye
happyfeet (28a91b) — 3/13/2018 @ 4:36 pmOne can only hope:
narciso (d1f714) — 3/13/2018 @ 4:37 pmhttps://babalublog.com/2018/03/13/will-trumps-firing-of-rex-tillerson-finally-actually-cancel-obamas-cuba-policy-as-promised-by-trump-during-his-miami-speech-back-in-june/
95… it’s rent-free and he’s lovin’ It, Jerry!
Colonel Haiku (f0e797) — 3/13/2018 @ 3:18 pm
It’s the Kenny Rogers Chicken sign that keeps him up all night.
Pinandpuller (16b0b5) — 3/13/2018 @ 4:41 pmAnybody who is not willing to say straight out that only Putin could have poisoned Sergei Skirpal ans his daughter is a f’king moron.
nk (dbc370) — 3/13/2018 @ 4:41 pmyou can say the same thing about Hillary Clinton and Seth Rich
happyfeet (28a91b) — 3/13/2018 @ 4:43 pmWas Seth Rich killed with a Clinton-Fosbery in .666 Arkansas caliber?
nk (dbc370) — 3/13/2018 @ 4:46 pmIts most likely, the target of the Salisbury plain is particularly interesting. Of course the may govt much like the Aberdeen cabinet inthe 1850s has focused on the wrong targets
narciso (d1f714) — 3/13/2018 @ 4:50 pmSo this sterling fellows departure annoyed drezner:
narciso (d1f714) — 3/13/2018 @ 4:52 pmhttps://babalublog.com/2018/02/02/obama-state-dept-holdover-tom-shannon-announces-retirement-dictatorships-in-cuba-and-venezuela-will-not-be-happy/
this is so exciting can you even imagine how powerful this will be???
this is the sort of exciting commercial breakthrough that was never possible before our president, President Donald Trump, rolled back the regulations that prevented this kind of bold collaboration
#beauty #trump #thermalwaterseffyeah
happyfeet (28a91b) — 3/13/2018 @ 4:53 pmWas Seth Rich killed with a Clinton-Fosbery in .666 Arkansas caliber?
there was never an investigation
happyfeet (28a91b) — 3/13/2018 @ 4:54 pm107… you should just have the dead president exhumed and consummate your relationship, ASPCA. You are obviously pining for him.
Colonel Haiku (2601c0) — 3/13/2018 @ 4:59 pmAnd yet, just like Manafort, Flynn, Priebus, Spicer, Scaramucci, Bannon, Price, Porter and McEntee, to name just a few others who were fired or resigned in disgrace (and tack on Sessions and McMaster, who are rumored to on their way out the door soon, if you like), this “incompetent” failure was somehow appointed by the Greatest Manager Who Ever Lived.
Does President Postliterate, at any point, ever deserve to be held accountable for appointing a seemingly limitless number of incompetents and crooks to positions of high responsibility?
Dave (445e97) — 3/13/2018 @ 5:00 pmThat’s considering crossing the streams pikachu,
narciso (d1f714) — 3/13/2018 @ 5:02 pmI don’t know that Tillerson was a bad SoS at all. I’m not stuck on him, he was a stranger to me before his appointment, but when a man has both WaPo and happyfeet badmouthing him, he’s gotta be doing something right, I think.
nk (dbc370) — 3/13/2018 @ 5:08 pmoh goodness i’m not badmouthing him I’m sorry if I gave that impression
he’s just really not a good person and he sucked as secretary of state and his disgustingly pendulous man breasts are kinda nasty
happyfeet (28a91b) — 3/13/2018 @ 5:14 pm@124. =Haiku= Gesundheit!
Clean your trifocals, Colonel; our Captain is the New Nixon.
DCSCA (797bc0) — 3/13/2018 @ 5:20 pmSo why did President Trump, whose judgment and vision about all things are infallible, appoint him?
Could he have been attracted to the man boobs?
Dave (445e97) — 3/13/2018 @ 5:20 pmoh my goodness don’t be like those people what try to build themselves up by tearing other people down Mr. Dave
take the high road!
happyfeet (28a91b) — 3/13/2018 @ 5:24 pmDoes President Postliterate, at any point, ever deserve to be held accountable for appointing a seemingly limitless number of incompetents and crooks to positions of high responsibility?
Every four years.
random viking (6a54c2) — 3/13/2018 @ 5:25 pm@128. …’he sucked as secretary of state…’
A SoS projects the position of the CiC to the world. If one sucks, the other blows, Mr. Feet.
DCSCA (797bc0) — 3/13/2018 @ 5:26 pmWe actually have constitutional term limits for the presidency. Sorry to disappoint you, random Viking.
Leviticus (924d70) — 3/13/2018 @ 5:28 pm
Rev.Hoagie (1b0402) — 3/13/2018 @ 5:28 pmAre you saying that Trump will open North Korea like Nixon opened up China? That’s one wild thought, DCSCA but you may be on to something.
@127. I don’t know that Tillerson was a bad SoS at all.
As CEO of Exxon-Mobil– virtually a nation-state on its own- he was essentially their ‘SoS’ to the world– and profited from his tenure.
DCSCA (797bc0) — 3/13/2018 @ 5:31 pmFrom what I garner from the DNC propaganda organs dancing on his pink slip, “what he did wrong” is he took the Deep State meme seriously and threw out hundreds of Ambassador Bloodblisters and Undersecretary Magnans.
nk (dbc370) — 3/13/2018 @ 5:32 pmLeviticus is a sudden fan of the Constitution, for a few precious minutes at least.
random viking (6a54c2) — 3/13/2018 @ 5:34 pmNot that we have that many Ambassadors and Undersecretaries — Bloodblisters and Magnans are a type of career bureaucrat diplomat, emphasis on the bureaucrat.
nk (dbc370) — 3/13/2018 @ 5:35 pm135… no way, Hoagie, far more likely that a zombie Nixon would open ASPCA like a Christmas gift.
Colonel Haiku (2601c0) — 3/13/2018 @ 5:35 pmIf one sucks, the other blows, Mr. Feet.
you’re overthinking it
happyfeet (28a91b) — 3/13/2018 @ 5:38 pmGood grief – give it a rest, will ya?
British – “highly likely” Russia was responsible for the Salisbury attack. “Either this was a direct action by the Russian state against our country, or the Russian government lost control of its potentially catastrophically damaging nerve agent and allowed it to get into the hands of others.”
Sanders “The attack was reckless, indiscriminate, and irresponsible” and “Right now we are standing with our U.K. ally. I think they are still working through even some of the details on that.”
Tillerson: “We have full confidence in the UK’s investigation and its assessment that Russia was likely responsible for the nerve agent attack that took place in Salisbury last week” and “we are outraged that Russia appears to have again engaged in such behavior. From Ukraine to Syria — and now the UK — Russia continues to be an irresponsible force of instability in the world, acting with open disregard for the sovereignty of other states and the life of their citizens.”
I defy you to explain the difference there except in your own imagination. If anything Tillerson may be a bit ahead of the curve – the correct response is we stand with the UK. They are working through the details, and whatever they decide, we stand with them. Tillerson went from “likely” to more definitive in once sentence, something even the UK didn’t do. But seriously, they are not more than an inch apart.
And what would you prefer happen? Trump to talk over May? Perhaps a little saber rattling toward Russia? What is the correct response?
George Orwell's Ghost (a815b9) — 3/13/2018 @ 5:38 pmMy bad, Colonel. I just thought DCSCA stumbled upon an interesting idea.
Rev.Hoagie (1b0402) — 3/13/2018 @ 5:38 pmNow, Pompeo, he went on SeeBS radio (I heard him with my own ears) and said there’s no such thing as Deep State. That was on the same Sunday where Paul Rand reviewed the Wolff book. DC’s gotta love him for that.
nk (dbc370) — 3/13/2018 @ 5:39 pm
Rev.Hoagie (1b0402) — 3/13/2018 @ 5:40 pmGo to DEFCOM ONE and make the leftists go wee-wee.
@140. =Haiku!= Gesundheit!
And a Reagan clone would be Easter Sunday all year round! If only conservatives believed in science; it would have been tanned, rested and ready by 2024!
DCSCA (797bc0) — 3/13/2018 @ 5:45 pmOff-topic: Here’s The Upshot’s prediction needle for the PA-18 special election tonight. Results are starting to come in.
Allahpundit calls this election “the most important election in our lifetimes (since the last one).”
Trump and his cultists are reportedly ready to dump all over the GOP candidate if/when he loses, because bad stuff happening is never, ever Trump’s fault.
Dave (445e97) — 3/13/2018 @ 5:49 pmWhen Rex Tillerson agreed to be Trump’s Secretary of State, I am certain that Tillerson had an absolutely accurate assessment of Trump. It was surely clear to Tillerson before he took the job that Trump is, indeed, a moron, a serial and shameless liar and oath-breaker, a chaos agent, a man-baby whose every action is explained by narcissism. Accepting any subordinate role to such a principal is almost assuredly going to end badly for the subordinate. Today was always foreordained.
So why would Tillerson, the CEO of one of the world’s premiere businesses, jump on that hand grenade?
The obvious answer, consistent with his entire life history (of which I know quite a bit through close mutual friends and family), is:
Duty.
He kept us out of war for an entire year of a Donald Trump presidency — at least, any new wars. If you’d asked me a year ago, I’d say that was a pretty fine goal all on its own for anyone taking that job under that POTUS.
He executed a cut-throat downsizing of the Department of State, which won him very public and fierce opposition from the bloated career bureaucracy at Foggy Bottom — which is to say, he was a point man for Trump’s “drain the swamp” promise at that particular executive agency.
He is a serious man, an accomplished man respected in both business and political circles. His selection was serious business that gave the Trump Administration credibility early on.
Tillerson is a serious man, an accomplished man respected in both business and political circles, and his selection as part of Trump’s initial cabinet was serious international and political business that gave the Trump Administration credibility early on. Almost his entire service to the POTUS and the nation was undertaken behind closed doors, and without his taking any personal credit whatsoever. Yet even from what was apparent to the public — the stage-managed kabuki shows that comprise most of international diplomacy’s public face, which only partly corresponds with actual diplomacy — he was nothing remotely like the international embarrassment to this country and its reputation as were his two immediate predecessors, John F’in Kerry and Hillary Rodham Clinton.
Rex Tillerson took the job in the hope that whatever good he could do to the country, during whatever interim he had before Cadet Captain Bonespur inevitably had some random-@ss hissy fit and fired him, would be worth the inevitable humiliation of being mistreated by this sad, disgusting, and categorically unfit individual whom fortunes have made the 45th POTUS. For that, I’m grateful to him, and I salute Rex Tillerson.
Beldar (fa637a) — 3/13/2018 @ 5:50 pm(Apologies for the repeated sentences in that last, editing error.)
Beldar (fa637a) — 3/13/2018 @ 5:51 pmWell said, Beldar.
nk (dbc370) — 3/13/2018 @ 5:53 pm2016: Tillerson hiring proof Trump is doing Russia’s bidding.
2018: Tillerson firing proof that Trump is doing Russia’s bidding.
http://thefederalist.com/2018/03/13/media-cant-figure-out-if-tillerson-proves-or-disproves-russia-collusion/#.WqgjRLyBkZI.twitter
harkin (df3a15) — 3/13/2018 @ 5:58 pmI this k the fundamental problem with the state department, is it has no real allegiance to united states so they more often than not took saddams or the soviet’s or more recently hezbollahd side, that’s also true of the company, how else do you explain John brennan or Paul pillar before him?
narciso (d1f714) — 3/13/2018 @ 5:59 pmAce is fairly well spun up on all of this, and he goes after several people who he claims have bought into the “Washington Consensus” a be-hairplugged Jonah Goldberg sputtered about yesterday… http://ace.mu.nu/archives/374303.php
Colonel Haiku (2601c0) — 3/13/2018 @ 6:00 pmTillerson generally seemed to be one of the few adults in the Trump cabinet, giving him, as Beldar says, a very limited shelf-life.
But he was a truly bizarre choice to begin with.
Dave (445e97) — 3/13/2018 @ 6:00 pmdisgusting anti-semite Rex Tillerboobs coddled Iran, and he coddled Cuba, and he tried to force us to stay in a specious prosperity-raping Paris Agreement that was never even presented to the senate for ratification, and all of this he did so with open disdain for the will of the people who voted for the Trump agenda
he was in way over his head and it was merciful of our president, President Donald Trump, to put an end to his pathetic flounderings
happyfeet (28a91b) — 3/13/2018 @ 6:01 pmTrump and Tillerson did not agree on anything, from all reports.
Colonel Haiku (2601c0) — 3/13/2018 @ 6:01 pm
Rev.Hoagie (1b0402) — 3/13/2018 @ 6:02 pmWhere did you hear/see that bit of interesting news reported, Dave? I’ve been flipping channels so I may have missed it stuck here in Abington, Pennsylvania we don’t get the Big City news.
It was in axios, from the aussie import from downunder Jonathan swan
narciso (d1f714) — 3/13/2018 @ 6:05 pmI predict that the Senate will not confirm Gina “Torquemada” Haspel. Good for at least four episodes on Days Of Our Covfefe.
nk (dbc370) — 3/13/2018 @ 6:05 pmYou can start with the piece by Allahpundit that I linked.
Trump disrespected him even during the rally in PA.
Dave (445e97) — 3/13/2018 @ 6:06 pm“Mollie Hemingway comments:
Just last night I was told on national television that the general consensus in D.C. is that Russia is bad but that Trump and Russia didn’t collude. That a treasonous collusion narrative isn’t even “remotely” the general consensus. Someone might want to tell… everyone in the media who has been pushing it non-stop for more than a year no matter the facts on the ground.
As the media reaction to Tillerson’s nomination and firing show, we’re witnessing the Unified Theory Of Russia Collusion at work. If it’s true that the “general consensus” in D.C. is nothing remotely near the idea that Trump and Russia colluded to steal the 2016 election, people should stop pushing the theory. Better yet, if they buy into the theory — as so many of our supposed media elites obviously do — they should start to be more specific about the theory. And if they don’t, they should not nibble around the margins of the theory.
Hear, hear. Less “Just Asking Questions” about whether fire can really melt steel, and more straightforward declarative assertions about what Trump either did do or did not do.
There is a game in politics. The Truthers played this game; some politicians hoping to curry favors with the Truthers played it. Like John Kerry.
The game goes like this: While not explicitly endorsing a conspiracy theory for which there is no evidence, you sort of talk it up to maintain its viability as a political attack point. You don’t say definitively you believe it — you just say, as Patterico says today, it raises “interesting” questions.
You keep your “Clean Skin” as far as being a Conspiracy Theorist, and yet you do all you can to suggest to the conspiracy-minded that the conspiracy is All Too Real.
It’s a way to speak as Yasser Arafat did, to two different audiences telling two different stories. You encourage conspiracy theorizing, while (mostly) not committing yourself to any particular version of the conspiracy theory.
Just Askin’ Questions, you know.
It’s one thing for politicians to do this — they lie.
But pundits and analysts and “thinkers” and “experts” are supposed to tell you exactly what they think.
If Jonah Goldberg, for lo these many months (sixteen or thereabouts) has known that the “Washington Consensus” was actually that there was no collusion between Trump and Russia, why did he keep that on the Q.T. and the D.L.?
Why didn’t he tell people?
Why did he enable a conspiracy theory he’s now telling us that those In-the-Know always knew was pretty much bullshit?
It’s the equivalent of a guy who never quite declares that “Bush knew” that the 9/11 attack was coming but let it happen anyway to enable the PNAC warplan but who is careful never to pour cold water on such conspiracy theories to keep #TheResistance agitated and animated.
You are paid, supposedly, for the truth, and what you know, and what you don’t quite know but think to a reasonable certainty.
If Jonah Goldberg is claiming that there is no, and was no, “Washington Consensus” about the Manchurian Apprentice conspiracy theory, why has he been so shy about saying so?
And why is he not throwing cold water on the various members of the Washington Consensus — such as Patterico, Erick Erickson, Bill Kristol, and of course various and sundry members of the legacy media — currently spinning out new conspiracy theories about Tillerson’s long-expected firing?
If you don’t believe in the Conspiracy Theory, then say so firmly.
And if you do believe in it — then say that too. Do not hide your beliefs with equivocation, evasion, and insinuation.”
Colonel Haiku (2601c0) — 3/13/2018 @ 6:06 pmthe CIA’s a hot dirty sleazy mess no matter if you have some hot to trot torture trollop running it or someone less openly evil
you just need a warm body to blame when the nasty cia poofterboys get caught out doing their usual criminal and/or treasonous shenanigans
and Gina has a very warm body
happyfeet (28a91b) — 3/13/2018 @ 6:10 pmSo what good are they, this a body that confirmed John brennan, and he was two scoops of traitor.
narciso (d1f714) — 3/13/2018 @ 6:10 pmCould be. The authorities have never reported what type of gun killed him.
Probably was a .666 Arkansas special. Smelled of Ben Gay and sulfur.
papertiger (c8116c) — 3/13/2018 @ 6:11 pm“Mollie Hemingway comments:
Just last night I was told on national television that the general consensus in D.C. is that Russia is bad but that Trump and Russia didn’t collude. That a treasonous collusion narrative isn’t even “remotely” the general consensus. Someone might want to tell… everyone in the media who has been pushing it non-stop for more than a year no matter the facts on the ground.
As the media reaction to Tillerson’s nomination and firing show, we’re witnessing the Unified Theory Of Russia Collusion at work. If it’s true that the “general consensus” in D.C. is nothing remotely near the idea that Trump and Russia colluded to steal the 2016 election, people should stop pushing the theory. Better yet, if they buy into the theory — as so many of our supposed media elites obviously do — they should start to be more specific about the theory. And if they don’t, they should not nibble around the margins of the theory.
Hear, hear. Less “Just Asking Questions” about whether fire can really melt steel, and more straightforward declarative assertions about what Trump either did do or did not do.
There is a game in politics. The Truthers played this game; some politicians hoping to curry favors with the Truthers played it. Like John Kerry.
The game goes like this: While not explicitly endorsing a conspiracy theory for which there is no evidence, you sort of talk it up to maintain its viability as a political attack point. You don’t say definitively you believe it — you just say, as Patterico says today, it raises “interesting” questions.
You keep your “Clean Skin” as far as being a Conspiracy Theorist, and yet you do all you can to suggest to the conspiracy-minded that the conspiracy is All Too Real.
It’s a way to speak as Yasser Arafat did, to two different audiences telling two different stories. You encourage conspiracy theorizing, while (mostly) not committing yourself to any particular version of the conspiracy theory.
Just Askin’ Questions, you know.
It’s one thing for politicians to do this — they lie.
But pundits and analysts and “thinkers” and “experts” are supposed to tell you exactly what they think.
If Jonah Goldberg, for lo these many months (sixteen or thereabouts) has known that the “Washington Consensus” was actually that there was no collusion between Trump and Russia, why did he keep that on the Q.T. and the D.L.?
Why didn’t he tell people?
Why did he enable a conspiracy theory he’s now telling us that those In-the-Know always knew was pretty much bull[schiff].
It’s the equivalent of a guy who never quite declares that “Bush knew” that the 9/11 attack was coming but let it happen anyway to enable the PNAC warplan but who is careful never to pour cold water on such conspiracy theories to keep #TheResistance agitated and animated.
You are paid, supposedly, for the truth, and what you know, and what you don’t quite know but think to a reasonable certainty.
If Jonah Goldberg is claiming that there is no, and was no, “Washington Consensus” about the Manchurian Apprentice conspiracy theory, why has he been so shy about saying so?
And why is he not throwing cold water on the various members of the Washington Consensus — such as Patterico, Erick Erickson, Bill Kristol, and of course various and sundry members of the legacy media — currently spinning out new conspiracy theories about Tillerson’s long-expected firing?
If you don’t believe in the Conspiracy Theory, then say so firmly.
And if you do believe in it — then say that too. Do not hide your beliefs with equivocation, evasion, and insinuation.”
Colonel Haiku (2601c0) — 3/13/2018 @ 6:12 pmWas Seth Rich killed with a Clinton-Fosbery in .666 Arkansas caliber?
nk (dbc370) — 3/13/2018 @ 4:46 pm
He actually was alive till he got to the hospital and we’re back at doctors again.
Pinandpuller (16b0b5) — 3/13/2018 @ 6:14 pmI wish Mike Pompeo the best. He’s already atop a different hand grenade, so as with the Kelly reshuffle, he may actually end up extending his own shelf life.
Beldar (fa637a) — 3/13/2018 @ 6:17 pm@148. Don’t overlook Tillerson’s wife played a role in urging him to take the gig to begin with. Still, medals from Putin weren’t really badges of honor. All the same, Tillerson deserved a more prrofessionl adieu– but when you call your boss a ‘f–king moron’ you shouldn’t expect respect.
_____
In other news, Fred Gregory, NASA’s first black shuttle commander said Friday he is resigning as the space agency’s deputy administrator after a 31-year career. FWIW, if you’ve seen video of Mission Control just after Challenger exploded, Gregory was on console, hands to his eyes, weeping.
And Captain Comic Book discussed creating a ‘space force’ after wall shopping while addressing Marines at Miramar who cheered his line, ‘fake news.’
DCSCA (797bc0) — 3/13/2018 @ 6:17 pmPaul Krugman (who may not be particularly honest) had an Op-ed article today entitled Springtime for Sycophants. (written before this firing became known)
https://www.nytimes.com/2018/03/12/opinion/trump-trade-peter-navarro.html
.
Sammy Finkelman (a3d36d) — 3/13/2018 @ 6:19 pmDoes France have one of those, too?
Dave (445e97) — 3/13/2018 @ 6:20 pmThis gets my vote for “understatement of the millenium”.
But Navarro is a complete putz too.
Dave (445e97) — 3/13/2018 @ 6:23 pm@169. Belgium has Tintin — close enough for government work. 😉
DCSCA (797bc0) — 3/13/2018 @ 6:29 pmVATs are not across the board, or equal across the board. My understanding is that they’re heaviest on “luxury” durable goods which, coincidentally, are predominantly imports.
nk (dbc370) — 3/13/2018 @ 6:38 pmIn France, when I lived there, I’m pretty sure the VAT was universal.
Dave (445e97) — 3/13/2018 @ 7:06 pmWell, a rare visit to Ace of Spades sees Ace hating on this post.
And we see the Colonel quoting the rant at #161.
Good work, P. You’re doing something right.
Demosthenes (09f714) — 3/13/2018 @ 8:13 pmMr. Ace is a good pickle who loves America and I like that about him
happyfeet (28a91b) — 3/13/2018 @ 8:15 pmChurchill is quixotic
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/Jeremy_Corbyn/12104079/Jeremy-Corbyn-says-he-would-keep-submarines-patrolling-the-world-without-any-nuclear-weapons.html
narciso (d1f714) — 3/13/2018 @ 8:16 pm175… yes, I did quote it, madam. I think it’s hilarious.
Colonel Haiku (2601c0) — 3/13/2018 @ 8:18 pmI wouldn’t have guessed “hilarious” would be your reaction. Hmm. Oh, well.
Demosthenes (09f714) — 3/13/2018 @ 8:34 pmIn so far as we’ve wasted a year and half on this silly hrishenko snipe hunt.
narciso (d1f714) — 3/13/2018 @ 8:37 pmNo. 142 George Orwell’s Ghost
Thank you. Said it very well.
Bored Lawyer (998177) — 3/14/2018 @ 7:13 amVATs might not be across the board, but they are stiff for everything (good and services) in Sweden. The lowest is 6% for things you actually have to have, a confiscatory 12% for things you shouldn’t go without, and 25% for every other single thing.
That’s on top of rather brutal income tax.
SarahW (3164f0) — 3/14/2018 @ 7:20 amnk was pointing out that the VAT level is different for different goods. I don’t think that’s quite an argument that a higher VAT is an tariff. Even if maybe everything of that nature is imported.
Sammy Finkelman (02a146) — 3/14/2018 @ 2:03 pmThere is a game in politics. You pay Brett Kimberlin money, as Ace did — and then you pretend to be a Tough Guy.
Patterico (115b1f) — 3/14/2018 @ 9:08 pmIt’s on!!! May the best ruffian win.
Colonel Haiku (2601c0) — 3/14/2018 @ 9:11 pmNow this game has turned lethal, while Louise munch was going all crazy in the tines like a character from 12 monkeys, the whole garbage about trolls and Russian hacks seems kind of obscene.
narciso (d1f714) — 3/14/2018 @ 9:17 pmCommenters at Ace’s blog are opining that I decided to stop standing up against the left because I was SWATted by Brett Kimberlin.
It’s in the thread that the Colonel helpfully decided to quote here.
I went over there to explain about who gave Kimberlin money and who didn’t.
Since I was getting attacked as someone who refuses to fight and all.
Patterico (115b1f) — 3/14/2018 @ 9:20 pmMr. Ace is a good person he’s a light in the darkness
a shiny light!
he abjures nevertrump and his voice is ofttimes heartening
he’s a stalwart and true american
happyfeet (28a91b) — 3/14/2018 @ 9:21 pmThe comments won’t last long, but for now you can read them here.
http://acecomments.mu.nu/?post=374303
Comments 565 and 566.
The Colonel doesn’t really care who actually fights the left. He just likes a guy who talks a big game.
And if you talk a big game, even if you cravenly give a terrorist money that he can use to harass good people, the Colonel will spread your BS far and wide.
Patterico (115b1f) — 3/14/2018 @ 9:22 pmSweet! But truly disappointing, as it sounds like it ended in the 1st round with a thunderous haymaker.
Colonel Haiku (2601c0) — 3/14/2018 @ 9:22 pmWho paid money to Brett Kimberlin.
Patterico (115b1f) — 3/14/2018 @ 9:22 pmThat raises some interesting questions…
Colonel Haiku (2601c0) — 3/14/2018 @ 9:23 pmIt will disappear before you can blink. If there’s one thing Ace won’t tolerate, it’s the mere mention of Brett Kimberlin on his blog, however obliquely it is done.
Patterico (115b1f) — 3/14/2018 @ 9:23 pmwell so did Barbra Streisand and she sings like an angel!
PAPA CAN YOU HEAR MEEEEE
happyfeet (28a91b) — 3/14/2018 @ 9:24 pmi’m curious what happens to disgraced FBI lickspittle Andre McCabe
happyfeet (28a91b) — 3/14/2018 @ 9:29 pmoops *Andrew* McCabe I mean
happyfeet (28a91b) — 3/14/2018 @ 9:30 pmMy favorite part is Ace telling people like me about how we should be “ashamed” of ourselves.
That takes some real chutzpah.
I had told him years ago, on the phone, that I wasn’t going to make a big thing out of his settlement because we were friends. But obviously he doesn’t consider me a friend anymore. OK. That street runs two ways.
Patterico (115b1f) — 3/14/2018 @ 9:34 pmWhen have you ever seen a bureau agent who committed political malpractice be held accountable, eickenrode, Mary beth kepner, felt and miller, it soesnt happen
narciso (d1f714) — 3/14/2018 @ 9:36 pmIsn’t Ace the one who on more than one occasion has admitted that he has been less than truthful in order to support the GOP? Usually, the admissions come with a long screed on why he is done with them because of their constant betrayals. Then, he gradually (or not so gradually) shifts back to supporting the GOP again, only to scream betrayal again and admit he was covering for them… BUT NO MORE!
Yeah, that Ace.
Stashiu3 (466cdf) — 3/15/2018 @ 12:45 amIf, after hearing so many times your neighbor say he will no longer carry a certain someone’s water, you see him walking up a hill away from the lake carrying two full buckets while next to that certain someone, he says, “I’m just thirsty. Nothing to see here.” you might be forgiven for doubting his word on most anything.
Call me doubtful.
Stashiu3 (466cdf) — 3/15/2018 @ 4:09 amPatterico’s posts were still up there late last night, but are they still there… yes they are… and now the dowdy School Marm has taken him to task, but he’s countered with a good old-fashioned b*tchslap…
Colonel Haiku (2601c0) — 3/15/2018 @ 4:34 amHello Stashiu3.
Ace talks a big game but settled when times got tough. I get that. Most of us would do that. It’s hard to be a fighter like Patterico. That’s why there aren’t many Pattericos in the blog world or the real world.
DRJ (15874d) — 3/15/2018 @ 6:46 amthe important thing is Mr. Ace does so much for America
people forget how important it is to nurture and maintain his kind of independent pro-American voice
this is why everybody loves Mr. Ace
happyfeet (28a91b) — 3/15/2018 @ 7:07 amAnd they are still up… some additional underlings are taking keyboard kommando shots at El Jefe… that is all…
Colonel Haiku (33b771) — 3/15/2018 @ 7:15 amPoint taken, but in the ewoks defense (how many moons on ceti alpha 6?) This nut has killed and,maimed people, he felt confident enough to go after a prosecutor, like the cartels do in Mexico, because he knew he would not be prosecuted for it.
narciso (d1f714) — 3/15/2018 @ 7:17 amI have not gone to Ace of Spades for many, many years. It’s a superstition with me, now — I don’t click any links to specific posts, either.
nk (dbc370) — 3/15/2018 @ 7:18 amI know, happyfeet. But we have a lot of people — online and in real life — who talk big and cave when times get tough. Fortunately we have people like Patterico who fight and win when times get tough.
DRJ (15874d) — 3/15/2018 @ 7:19 amAnd they each still provide links to each other’s sites, so this is a Cold War… each has a finger near the launch button… one with prosecutorial powers, the other with his gainzzz… NORAD on high alert…
Colonel Haiku (33b771) — 3/15/2018 @ 7:21 amThe money thing is a Kimberlin elision.
SarahW (3164f0) — 3/15/2018 @ 7:24 amSome gave BK money. Not everybody gave Kimberlin money.
Patterico, I am sorry that Ace caved. And that would be okay, if he didn’t talk all tough.
But as we see everywhere, posturing is more important than deeds. We live in a weird bumper sticker world.
You stood up for me when I needed it. You and JD both. I remember that, and I keep that in mind.
Simon Jester (ca9668) — 3/15/2018 @ 7:31 amKristol excuse is he is part of a deep state network with ties to Steele back in 2008 at least, mcmuffin comes poached, Erickson well you know how I feel about him.
narciso (d1f714) — 3/15/2018 @ 7:32 amthere’s probably a lot of context we just don’t know about
recently i wanted to donate for Mr. L’s baby girl but that wouldn’t have been responsible cause of I have a friend doing a legal battle and he kinda needs all my resources on that right now
so you have to make hard choices sometimes
and this was particularly awkward cause i just had a super-fun vacation but I’d committed to that before I really knew what i was in for with this legal stuff
so I would give Mr. Ace every benefit of every doubt
this is because he’s been a very good picklehead not just recently but for many many moons and we don’t even agree on everything! he’s all anti-abortion and I’m not comfortable with that cause i like abortion all up in it but you know what?
you know what?
i’d rather read about that stuff from a stalwart and true American like Mr. Ace than a weirdo pug-faced fascist freak like Lila Rose that’s for sure
so all in all I have a special place in my heart for Mr. Ace plus I appreciate his support for our president, President Donald Trump
happyfeet (28a91b) — 3/15/2018 @ 7:48 amLila is the Taylor swift of the pro life doodle set pikachu,
narciso (d1f714) — 3/15/2018 @ 7:51 amyes yes we have to shake her off
happyfeet (28a91b) — 3/15/2018 @ 7:53 amI don’t read here much anymore. When did Stashiu3 come back (yay!), and when did narciso become happyfeet?
DRJ (15874d) — 3/15/2018 @ 7:56 amNever mind. It’s a waste of my time to read this.
DRJ (15874d) — 3/15/2018 @ 7:58 amyou should read here more DRJ and do your comments all up in it
it’s such a fun time to be an American (especially relative to the sucky bushobama time)
happyfeet (28a91b) — 3/15/2018 @ 7:58 amAsk governor greitens how he becomes a,target without apparent evidence
narciso (d1f714) — 3/15/2018 @ 8:00 amAnd this you know how?
Patterico (115b1f) — 3/15/2018 @ 8:10 amHave any of his backers like Streisand wised, the nazgul you finally chased out, what touting breitbart unmasked links, ridiculing what you went through.
narciso (d1f714) — 3/15/2018 @ 8:26 amIf I recall, Ace caved because he wanted to keep his anonymity and Kimberlin was trying to get his real name in every court document.
In this day and age where we see the left using SWATting (as you well know Patterico) as well as trying to get every conservative fired for their politics, that’s a legitimate concern.
You also know that scum like Kimberlin use google alerts to monitor any use of his name and if the settlement said that Ace would avoid mention of him, you’re trying to use your posts in a rather cruel and vindictive manner.
I’m glad you took him on, but you are already a public figure. You are an experienced prosecutor. You had the time and a great team to help you. And you took risks. I commend you for all of those things.
But to attack someone who chose differently, but still fights? I disagree.
NJRob (b00189) — 3/15/2018 @ 8:26 amI gave Ace the benefit of every doubt until he began attacking me personally. We were friends, once, but the lure of praise from Trumpers overcame his loyalty to me as a friend. So I owe him no duty to refrain from criticizing his decision to remove criticism of Brett Kimberlin from his blog (which he did) and possibly give Kimberlin money (and if he didn’t then let him say so).
You don’t get to go on personal attack and claim immunity for your own transgressions. He forfeited his claim to my reticence when he publicly said I should be “ashamed” of myself.
And believe me: I understand the need to make tough decisions. But if you cave, don’t go around beating your chest pretending to be the tough guy, and personally attack your friends who didn’t cave the way you did.
That would be my advice to Ace.
Patterico (9622fb) — 3/15/2018 @ 8:34 amIs he really attacking you, or taking issue with what he considers an illconsidered strategy, dana ward ridicules you, and what you have gone through.
narciso (d1f714) — 3/15/2018 @ 8:37 amIf he didn’t write a whole post comparing me to a 9/11 Truther and saying people like me should be “ashamed” of ourselves, we would not be having this discussion, NJ Rob. But the Colonel was kind enough to bring Ace’s personal attack to my attention. And so here we are.
Note that I didn’t say anything for months, or even years. Not until he tried to personally attack my character on his blog.
Patterico (9622fb) — 3/15/2018 @ 8:38 amWhen someone compares me to a 9/11 truther and says I should be ashamed of myself, I see that as an attack.
Patterico (9622fb) — 3/15/2018 @ 8:39 amFine ignore what dana ward has done, and probably will continue to do.
narciso (d1f714) — 3/15/2018 @ 8:41 amSometimes it really feels like groundhogs day
https://www.nationalreview.com/2017/06/jeff-sessions-recusal-unnecessary/
narciso (d1f714) — 3/15/2018 @ 8:44 amDana Ward is gone. What more do you want?
Patterico (9622fb) — 3/15/2018 @ 8:44 ammaybe this is one of those things where a quick phone call could go a long way
happyfeet (28a91b) — 3/15/2018 @ 8:48 amI suppose he is wrong too:
https://www.nationalreview.com/2018/03/russia-collusion-real-story-hillary-clinton-dnc-fbi-media/
narciso (d1f714) — 3/15/2018 @ 8:56 amHi DRJ,
I never really left, just read the posts and occasionally lurked the comments. This was really the only blog I read and I didn’t have the energy to engage. A medication change has made a world of difference, so I started commenting a few weeks ago.
Stashiu3 (466cdf) — 3/15/2018 @ 9:12 amPatrick:
In the early days of the blogosphere, back in September 2004, I was writing a post on my own blog that eventually appeared under the title “Some credentials for the lawyer-bloggers who are prosecuting Dan Rather in the blogosphere,” the point of which was that in addition to blogging in our pajamas, many of us had better educational and professional credentials than the Bush-derangement-syndrome toadies who were defending Rather:
I had you on the list as “Patterico,” without your name, but after some email correspondence with you, I added it with your permission. I thought at the time: Here’s a mensch, a man who publicly stands behind what he publishes. That was a choice I had pondered myself, and resolved in the same way, when I began blogging. I respected you for it then.
I just want to say: I still respect you for it.
As for those who continue to hide behind their blogging pseudonyms all these years later: Not so much.
Beldar (fa637a) — 3/15/2018 @ 9:17 amAnd yet Dan rather is still around, Hes the new face of young Turks, the thornburgh report whiffed on the conclusions, crowdstrike that botched the Sony hack was given greater authority, and Charles Johnson went crazy.
narciso (d1f714) — 3/15/2018 @ 9:26 amwhat is the moral of the story?
Beldar,
You live in the friendly confines of Texas where radical leftists are without power. No so much for those of us in communist states. Each has a right to make their own choices regarding anonymity unless you think everyone here who uses an alias is a coward.
NJRob (61402e) — 3/15/2018 @ 9:41 amA minute or so after Mr. FOIA released the climategate emails an aquantance who goes by the name “Elmer” (not his true name) posted a satire song making fun of the warmers in general, but Prof. Michael Mann of Penn State in particular.
“Hide the Decline” became a big hit online, so much so that Prof. Mann, through the power of frivolous lawsuit (just like Kimberlin) forced Elmer to take the video down. For a month or so it disappeared, but other people posted copies. Too many for Mann to target.
But Elmer himself never put it back up because for him it was a matter of standing on principle or continuing to eat. He didn’t have money to fight a lawsuit which on the otherside is bankrolled by a crooked political party.
I don’t judge him harshly for bowing out.
That’s the way I see it with Ace versus Kimberlin.
papertiger (c8116c) — 3/15/2018 @ 9:53 amIt’s not just the settlement and it’s not just the attack on me. It’s the two together. He’s attacking me for going soft on the left after himself giving in to a leftist terrorist. That doesn’t fly.
Patterico (9622fb) — 3/15/2018 @ 12:40 pmOne of his commenters who hates me because I criticize Trump said I had it coming. He says I brought on some of the stuff with Kimberlin myself.
Some Trumpers are JUST LIKE the left.
Patterico (9622fb) — 3/15/2018 @ 12:42 pmbut even if he did a settlement all up in it that doesn’t give you the immunity idol to go soft on the left
does it?
seems like these two things are separate like when you order a curry and you ask for the rice on the side
happyfeet (28a91b) — 3/15/2018 @ 12:46 pmOn a day he should have been congratulating me he was instead comparing me to a 9/11 Truther and saying I should be ashamed of myself. NJ Rob and happyfeet and papertiger and his other defenders studiously ignore this. Sucking Trunp’s junk is more important to them than basic human decency. Now I know that about them. It’s always nice to know where you stand with people.
The Trump phenomenon has revealed very neatly who my real friends are — and aren’t.
Patterico (9622fb) — 3/15/2018 @ 12:48 pmNope. Of course I am doing no such thing. I just don’t get on my knees for a Trump like you do.
Patterico (9622fb) — 3/15/2018 @ 12:49 pmI think you are confusing adherence to conservative principles, which I show, with a desire to perform sexual acts on Donald Trump, which you show. They are different things.
Patterico (9622fb) — 3/15/2018 @ 12:51 pmi didn’t read that stuff at Ace’s per se or maybe i just skimmed it but I do think you’ve changed and i will tell you the lens through which I see a certain newfound “softness”
and that’s your eager adducings of so many fake news “narrative” articles from unserious sources like the washington post and, like in todays’s new post, the new york times
i know you know better than this (you’ve demonstrated a proper sort of skepticism many many times)
it’s very jarring when this happens (the dissonance is highly cognitive) because your brand had become so synonymous with hard-hitting critiques of trashy leftist media
happyfeet (28a91b) — 3/15/2018 @ 12:58 pmalso what President Trump and I have is special it transcends sexuality
it’s more like we’re one spirit united in our believes that America can be made more prosperous
Americans more free
that a shiny sparkle golden tomorrow is possible for us all, and that together we can make this happen
i feel like bursting into song
happyfeet (28a91b) — 3/15/2018 @ 1:01 pmI’ve thanked you and wished you well for taking on the evil Speedway Bomber Brett Kimberlin. I asked if that jerk has been labeled a vexatious litigant yet so he cannot harm anyone else.
I mentioned, rather evenhandedly, that Ace’s reasons for his decisions are different than your own. And for that, you smear me with vile remarks about fellatio.
What the heck is wrong with you?
NJRob (61402e) — 3/15/2018 @ 1:31 pmMaybe we should start calling them “Stormy Daniels Conservatives”.
Dave (445e97) — 3/15/2018 @ 1:34 pmI already explained this. Ace attacked me first, and you studiously ignore that, dishonestly pretending as if I were the one who went on the initial attack.
And why do you employ such intellectually dishonest tactics on behalf of Ace? Because Ace gobbles Trump’s knob and I don’t.
It’s as simple as that. If I were the knob-gobbler and Ace were the Trump critic, you’d be ten shades of outraged over his settlement and will subsequent smear of me as something akin to a 9/11 Truther who should be “ashamed” of myself.
Your integrity on how you approach an argument is for sale to the one who praises Trump with the most gusto. Were it otherwise, you’d criticize him for attacking my character. Instead
If you want to get huffy about how I am attacking your character — and I am — stop, take a deep breath, and ask yourself how you think I feel to have MY character attacked, not in comments but in a post, on a far more popular blog, by someone who is just masquerading as a Tough Guy. And how it feels to have you pointedly ignore the fact that he attacked me first.
If you don’t like having YOUR integrity attacked, then take up for me when Ace does it to me. Otherwise GFY.
Patterico (115b1f) — 3/15/2018 @ 6:44 pmI always enjoy it when cult members try to act like they’re thinking people for 30 seconds. Hilarballs.
Patterico (115b1f) — 3/15/2018 @ 6:45 pmQuote:
Yeah, yeah, yeah, Ace. God Damn me. OK. Fine.
So I’m either a coward or I should be ashamed of myself.
Still didn’t pay Brett Kimberlin a cent.
Patterico (115b1f) — 3/15/2018 @ 6:49 pmBecause louise mensch seems to be more trusted than Lee Smith, Because fusion gps who has spilled for planned parenthood for the ranks, for a certain middle East sheikh is a critical source of intelligence, this is the issue.
You were fine with ace, when it came to destroying Christine O’Donnell life for what reason now
narciso (d1f714) — 3/15/2018 @ 6:54 pmWith Rex Tillerson we have a guy with every resource and reason to fight the climate fraud tooth and nail, bowing down and letting Gore run rough shod over the entirety of human existence.
I hated that pick from the beginning. Remember when Trump was pandering to corn syrup ethanol during the Iowa caucus? Cost him at the poll. Gave Cruz the early advantage. Rightly so. Trump deserved to lose Iowa. He earned every inch of the thumping he took from Pat and others.
Giving an inch to the institutionalised malthusian extinction agenda means buying the theory in it’s entirety.
Then Trump is elected and hires a climate change believer like Tillerson. Fortunately he hired Pruitt to head the EPA to mitigate the damage of Tillerson as SoS.
If I were writing your blog the headline would have been “Glory Halleluya! SoB Tillerson is out.” above the fold in bold type, with “Trump finally extracts head from spincter.” in smaller print below.
Don’t ask me to get misty over Tillerson leaving. Can’t spare a tear.
papertiger (c8116c) — 3/15/2018 @ 8:12 pmI didn’t defend Ace’s comments about you at all. So you’re attacking a strawman. I reiterated that Ace has his reasons for settling and you had your reasons for standing your ground when it came to Kimberlin. I applauded and congratulated you for doing that. I didn’t see or discuss whatever he said about you at all.
Ace was a Trump critic all during the campaign as was I. I still do when it’s warranted. But you really seem to treat everything so personally that you lash out when people disagree with you especially when it comes to Trump. Think about that.
What did I say that was so offensive other than not insulting Ace? Is that what you’re demanding of people? That we insult others who get into disputes with you?
I didn’t do that when you and Goldstein had your dispute years ago and I won’t do it now. I stay out of other people’s arguments, especially when it’s 2 people I respect.
But you’ve made it clear you feel otherwise. So be it. Your site. Your rules.
NJRob (b00189) — 3/15/2018 @ 8:59 pmYou called my comments about him an “attack” when I was just defending myself.
Patterico (115b1f) — 3/15/2018 @ 9:12 pmIf you want to stay out of it, don’t claim I attacked him.
You took sides.
Fine.
Patterico (115b1f) — 3/15/2018 @ 9:12 pmTaking sides.
GFY.
Patterico (115b1f) — 3/15/2018 @ 9:13 pmHe attacks me, you say nothing.
I defend myself, you jump down my throat and call it an attack.
Why? Because Ace gobbles Trump’s junk and that’s what you like.
You lease your integrity to the guy who praises Trump the most.
So now I know. Now I know where you stand.
“So be it.”
Patterico (115b1f) — 3/15/2018 @ 9:17 pmAnd if you don’t like your integrity being attacked, then now you know what it feels like.
And maybe you understand why I didn’t like it.
Patterico (115b1f) — 3/15/2018 @ 9:19 pmYour opinion on the rest of my comments?
Go scan Ace’s site for my name. You’ll find it about 10 times in 10 years. I don’t post there because it’s mostly noise and impossible to have a real discussion. This site has been known as a good place for that kind of give and take. Do you agree?
Yes I used the word attack. I clearly meant it in a peaceful way trying to stop you 2 from getting into a destructive action. I also didn’t even notice that I used it.
I still don’t get the use in trying to tear each other down. But that’s your own fight. Good day.
NJRob (b00189) — 3/15/2018 @ 9:27 pmI did. And it felt like an attack on me.
Patterico (115b1f) — 3/15/2018 @ 9:31 pmIf someone attacked Trump and he responded you would not call it an attack. You would call it fighting back.
Double standard.
Patterico (9622fb) — 3/15/2018 @ 9:33 pmDepending upon what day you check, Saudi Arabia or Russia is the number one, and two importer of fuel oil to the world at large.
So if Teresa May is at leave to make a snit over an attack on a former Russian intelligence officer, after all the treasure expended on the global warming folly, that liberty in large part is due to the efforts of my little friend Elmer, I commented about above, pushing back against Gore, the Dem and their phalanx of anti-humans.
At any moment, if Putin felt the urge to further rub England’s nose in it, he could cut back production and leave Britania shivering in the cold.
If May has leeway it’s because of the exertions of Elmer, Mr. FOIA, Steve McIntyre, Anthony Watts, and hundreds of others, (including btw Ace of Spades – he was in that trench too), Obama didn’t have the political capital to enter the USA into a Copenhagen Global Warming Treaty. America in the wake has became a net exporter of energy.
Obama had to settle years later for a back door, hind tit, un approved by Senate, mother may I, EO #metoo signing statement on a watered down Paris Accord (It’s not a treaty. It’s a joke.)
papertiger (c8116c) — 3/15/2018 @ 9:43 pmIt wasn’t intended as such.
I ignore most attacks on Trump as they aren’t pertinent to my life and don’t affect me either way. Do I watch CNN so i can see them attack Trump all day or do I just ignore it? No. I’d rather read in my leisure time.
So no, I really don’t care. I don’t see the benefit of someone who is anti-communist attacking President Trump and ignoring when he does well because the left will double down and lie simply because he’s their enemy. Just like every previous President that wasn’t a leftist.
Do I approve of his adultery? No.
Do I approve of his narcissism? No.
Do I approve of his tariff scheme? Yes, with conditions. That it is used to leverage other nations back into conducting real free trade and not just manipulating industries to gain control over them. Trade should benefit us, not just temporarily give us cheap, disposable goods.
And on and on.
BTW, I haven’t posted much lately other than to thank Staishu for coming back because life is busy and I don’t have anything to add when I’m around. I still take the time to read your posts.
So now I’ve taken time to explain myself. Have a good night.
NJRob (b00189) — 3/15/2018 @ 9:46 pmThe stories across the pond, are just as useless with a few exception, granted the mandate by brexit, they seem to do everything in their power to squander it.
narciso (d1f714) — 3/15/2018 @ 9:54 pmWonder what the status of that neither confirmed nor denied ‘Tillerson-Mnunchin-Mattis-suicide-pact’ is now that Rex has been canned. Better to jump than be pushed.
DCSCA (797bc0) — 3/16/2018 @ 3:58 amHow long has England been around and how long has Gazprom been around? Russia needs foreign cash more than England and Western Europe need Putin’s gas. Or the Russians can return to the days, not that long ago, when they were not exporting it, and Putin can see how popular he remains then.
nk (9651fb) — 3/16/2018 @ 4:34 amFacts not in evidence as shown by my comments about Trump right above. That you cannot see that speaks more about you thank about myself.
NJRob (9736c6) — 3/16/2018 @ 9:20 amYou would never ever ever call Trump or Ace defending themselves against a bullshit attack an “attack” yet you use that word to describe my self-defense. Then when I repeatedly point that out you repeatedly ignore it. Again and again and again, yammering about shit that does not address what I said.
It is having my central points repeatedly repeatedly ignored that causes me to accuse you of intellectual dishonesty. It is your hallmark. You will never change. So stop pretending to be an honest broker, NJ Rob. You’re not, and I am calling you out for it.
Please come do your innocent wide-eyed “what did I do” act again. And ignore what I just said yet again. At this point I just enjoy showing everybody else exactly how you pull this off. Do it. Professed innocence plus yet again ignoring my point, this is your job, do it now: go.
Patterico (9622fb) — 3/16/2018 @ 9:21 amWhen is self-defense an attack? When a Trump critic defends himself. That is the point you will ignore again.
Patterico (9622fb) — 3/16/2018 @ 9:23 amI notice you give that same advice to Trump when he responds to attacks on him. Oh wait you don’t, you praise it as punching back twice as hard.
I notice you went over and told Ace to stop tearing me down in his comments. Oh wait you didn’t. Your criticism was expressed at me and me only.
Almost like you apply a blatant and perfectly obvious double standard. Hmmm.
Patterico (9622fb) — 3/16/2018 @ 9:28 amAnd now we return to our regular programming… “The Plains of teh Serengeti”…
Colonel Haiku (33b771) — 3/16/2018 @ 9:29 amIt would be good if one of us who posts over there would do that. It should be said.
Colonel Haiku (33b771) — 3/16/2018 @ 9:31 am1. Ace says Patterico is a coward and should be ashamed of himself for acting like a 9/11 Truther.
2. Ace’s commenters pile on and say I became soft on the left because I was SWATted. (?!?!?!)
3. I point out that Ace paid off Brett Kimberlin and took down content, so maybe he could lay off calling me a coward and trying to shame me.
4. NJ Rob toddles over and identifies the real culprit here: Patterico, for “attacking” Ace.
And everyone just stands by and acts like this is normal and makes perfect sense.
Again: it is painfully clear who my friends are — and aren’t.
Patterico (9622fb) — 3/16/2018 @ 9:32 amIt has long been so, Pattetico. Stay strong.
Simon Jester (c8876d) — 3/16/2018 @ 9:35 amIf you read the comments there, I am obviously the instigator here (even though he directly attacked me in the post as a coward or someone who should be ashamed) and also I went soft on the left because I was SWATted.
And NJ Rob piles on here. And nobody says a word in my defense in either place.
Bizarroworld.
Patterico (9622fb) — 3/16/2018 @ 9:36 ama cup a cup a cup a cup a cup
happyfeet (28a91b) — 3/16/2018 @ 9:37 amI understand why you want to tell yourself that it’s easier for Patterico and for Texans to stand up and be brave, but it isn’t true. Furthermore, Patterico is not a public figure and he has had no help beyond the generous assistance from volunteer lawyers. He lives in California and, as we all know, he and his family have been mercilessly targeted by the left for years.
Isn’t Ace in a red state? Under the commenter’s theory, Ace should have a much easier time standing up to leftist attacks, but he chose not to. I don’t blame him for his choice but it’s cowardly to use the internet to shame people who actually do have guts.
DRJ (15874d) — 3/16/2018 @ 9:43 amI read the comments made over there thru the early evening yesterday. Patterico recounted what had transpired and it should be obvious to all that he shouldn’t have been included with the likes of Goldberg, Kristol, etc.. I agreed with Ace’s basic point about the “Washington Consensus”. My $.02…
Colonel Haiku (33b771) — 3/16/2018 @ 9:47 ami thought Mr. Ace lived in NY like Monica and Rachel and Joey
happyfeet (28a91b) — 3/16/2018 @ 9:47 amNever for an instant have I thought you went soft on the lefties after you were swatted. I admire the path you and your lawyers took. Kimberlin should be in jail.
mg (9e54f8) — 3/16/2018 @ 9:52 amThank you for saying so, mg.
Patterico (9622fb) — 3/16/2018 @ 9:57 amPatterico, of course I thought you had stayed true to your principles. I will bet you many, many of your readers think so. What you get, sadly, are some loud voices that are, um, less than intellectually honest from time to time.
The volume of their caterwauling drowns out what most people think.
And I’ll tell you what else: I believe what I wrote even when I don’t agree with some of your points, or the way you express yourself. You have proven your bona fides, repeatedly. You stand up for what you believe far more often, and eloquently, than I do. And with much more consistency.
Simon Jester (c8876d) — 3/16/2018 @ 10:01 amIf Ace is in New York then that could be why he can’t stand up to Trump. It’s harder to stand up to real pressure in real life.
DRJ (15874d) — 3/16/2018 @ 10:01 amAnd thank you to DRJ for saying something about it in Ace’s sewer of a comments section.
Patterico (9622fb) — 3/16/2018 @ 10:02 ami could be wrong that’s just what i’ve thought for years, that he lived in the city
happyfeet (28a91b) — 3/16/2018 @ 10:02 amI don’t want to talk about where he is, but he’s not in NY. We’ll leave it at that.
Patterico (9622fb) — 3/16/2018 @ 10:03 amMahalo, Patterico.
mg (9e54f8) — 3/16/2018 @ 10:03 amI don’t comment at Ace’s. Period. He’s an admitted liar and hypocrite, carrying water for the GOP while pretending to be the brave outsider. If he called Patterico a coward (I haven’t gone over to check, but I’m sure it’s true) he is dead to me. Patterico is 10x the man Ace wants to be.
Responding to an attack on your character is self-defense. Acknowledging that point should be universal. Patterico is perfectly capable of defending himself, so I’ve been largely quiet. Everyone should know however, in my opinion Ace should apologize and then keep Patterico’s name out of his f*ckin’ mouth
Stashiu3 (466cdf) — 3/16/2018 @ 10:04 amLet’s be absolutely clear: Brett Kimberlin’s scare tactics and lawfare abuse, this soft terrorism of doxxing and hassle, only work if we let it work by giving in. And Ace of Spades, among others, gave in, making it harder for those who did not give in.
This is a bit beyond politics as Patterico’s family was impacted very seriously.
Ace of Spades has always had a bit of a sell-out vibe to his strident tone and tendency to flip flop, but ever since he basically was hannitized into being Trump’s most stalwart defender, his blog is nearly unreadable. I used to love it because he challenged my point of view, but now he doesn’t. He just insists everyone who disagrees with him is a horrible horrible person. This defense mechanism keeps him from actually considering the other point of view. It’s not strength to be a huge dick to those who disagree with you. It’s weakness.
And it’s a stab in the back to some folks who have often been pretty helpful to Ace’s blog.
I don’t comment online much because it’s become pointless. I don’t have a political party and internet comments are just crowded with fakes and trolls and nuts. But I second MG’s comment. Patterico saw the fight with BK through to the bitter end, and he won with help of some great people. Ace once said that not facing Kimberlin was like being the coward dying every day. Of course he deleted that post when BK threatened to dox him. I imagine there is something really dark in Ace’s heart about how he let his friends down when he was asked to stay strong. Easier to brush these friends aside as ‘nevertrumper’ unpersons.
Sad, as Ace is incredibly smart acting dumb, and I want to read a smart perspective on Trump’s side instead of the crap.
Dustin (ba94b2) — 3/16/2018 @ 10:05 amWill Stormy make a move on Donny Jr.?
mg (9e54f8) — 3/16/2018 @ 10:05 amI would defend you to my dying breath; the reason I didn’t do so in this case is the same reason I’ve never done so in other similar cases – you have proven amply capable of defending yourself, and I fear it would be presumptuous and unseemly to try to fight your battles for you.
Rob’s characterization of your defense as an attack was a very poor choice of words, and it’s obvious why it is offensive. With that said (and nobody will ever mistake Rob and I for buddies) I doubt he intended to show disrespect, even though he did, and his attempt to apologize – while falling short of Canossan abasement – seemed sincere to me.
Dave (2a9848) — 3/16/2018 @ 10:05 amI can’t comment at Ace’s. Been banned for years now because I asked Ace why he deleted his BK posts.
Dustin (ba94b2) — 3/16/2018 @ 10:06 amNo, dry as a prosecutor, you would think the bureau would have been concerned when an officer of the law was attacked, specially with this thugs trackrecord but not apparently.
Furthermore having been through an arduous lawfare campaign you would think there would be recognition of the criminal malpractice on Mueller comey, strzok page baker et al
narciso (d1f714) — 3/16/2018 @ 10:06 amWhat Dave said. (And no, I didn’t expect to ever write that)
Stashiu3 (466cdf) — 3/16/2018 @ 10:08 amI don’t care where Ace lives, but I think this is true no matter where someone lives: You don’t get to settle when the going gets tough and also be the person that decides who has character.
DRJ (15874d) — 3/16/2018 @ 10:11 amDustin always says everything so well. And I appreciate very much Stashiu3’s comments and am very pleased to have him back. I wish we saw more of Dustin around here too. The place just seems more sane and centered when people like you guys are around.
And having DRJ in the regular comments is a blessing.
Patterico (115b1f) — 3/16/2018 @ 10:11 amscare tactics and lawfare abuse, this soft terrorism of doxxing and hassle, only work if we let it work by giving in.
this describes pretty much the sum total of Sarah Palin’s political legacy
happyfeet (28a91b) — 3/16/2018 @ 10:14 am289, Donny Jr. should go marry a Boer’s farmers daughter after his next hunt, bring her and the whole family the day before the chain migration cuts get put in place.
urbanleftbehind (5eecdb) — 3/16/2018 @ 10:14 amLike you, I understand why he did what he did. I didn’t say a word about it until after he started going after my character hammer and tongs on the front page of his blog. And frankly, I don’t want to make a huge thing of it. I’m not writing posts about it and I don’t really intend to. But yes: while I understand (but disagree with) his settlement, the combination of settling and then publicly taking me to task in a harsh way for either cowardice or shameful behavior was a bit much to let pass without comment.
So I have said my piece. The Ace commenters and the NJ Robs of the world can act like I started this fight. They can pretend like this is all about his settlement even though I said nothing about it since it happened (and knew about it before it happened). I know the truth, and I appreciate a few good people standing with me and saying they know it too. That’s good enough for me.
Patterico (115b1f) — 3/16/2018 @ 10:15 amThe curse for smart people, like Ace, is that they think they’re smart about everything. This is the delusion that actors, politicians, economists, even people like Hawking, are prone to. The problem is, when they talk about things outside their expertise, they can be just plain dumb as anyone else only they don’t have the insight to recognize it.
Ace talking about anyone’s courage is the delusion that he has any expertise. He doesn’t.
Stashiu3 (466cdf) — 3/16/2018 @ 10:18 amI don’t see it as a lawfare campaign. I see it as an investigation of someone who has openly bragged about carrying out lawfare campaigns before. If I believed Mueller’s investigation was a lawfare campaign, I would disapprove of it, while grimly noting the irony of a lawfare practitioner becoming a lawfare target.
Patterico (115b1f) — 3/16/2018 @ 10:19 amInsightful, Stashiu3. Arrogance often comes from talent in some area and leads smart people to be amazingly dumb. See: Alec Baldwin.
Dustin (ba94b2) — 3/16/2018 @ 10:20 ampeople are being hard on Mr. Ace for provoking this discussion but he’s always been something of a provocateur
there are so few bloggers left what have open comment sections i think we should cherish them all like precious delicate desert blossoms what bloom in the wake of ferocious late summer thunderstorms
happyfeet (28a91b) — 3/16/2018 @ 10:21 amDRJ is now trying to have a reasonable conversation in Ace’s comments with a guy who, upthread, said this about me and Kimberlin:
I suspect the effort to have that reasonable conversation will result in failure. But I salute her for trying!
Patterico (115b1f) — 3/16/2018 @ 10:23 amWhile we’re at it, I’ll quote my other favorite comment from that thread. It starts with our friend (I use the term loosely) and occasional commenter Anon Y. Mous explaining that I am “simpatico” with the cause of people who attend DC dinner parties, to which “Hikaru” adds this observation:
Just in case you thought I was making up that bit about me being accused of going soft on the left because I was SWATted.
By the way, the “He Who Shall Not Be Named” locution is because (as his commenters know) Ace does not allow Brett Kimberlin to be mentioned on his blog.
So, in summary, I went soft on the left after I was SWATted, and brought on what Kimberlin did to me myself.
All this, I suspect, because I criticize Donald Trump. That makes me now The Other, about whom it is acceptable to say such things.
Patterico (115b1f) — 3/16/2018 @ 10:27 amThis politically based tribalism is so very dangerous. For one thing, I think it creates extremist candidates. And I know that it gives more power to the folks who aren’t even elected (which is the point, I believe).
These people have regressed to middle school, Patterico. My late father told me that the quality of your character is how you treat those with whom you disagree or who have done you wrong. I fall short of my father’s standards.
But they are the standards we should aspire toward. It’s possible to disagree strongly with a policy or statement and not be a nasty bullying jerk about it. As you yourself have written, it’s possible to disagree strongly with a policy or statement and not think the person promoting it is evil.
The worst part of this new Trumpian era is how it demonstrated to me that the Right had all the problems of the Left, in terms of how it expresses itself. Like a weird funhouse mirror.
And DRJ is the real deal.
Simon Jester (c8876d) — 3/16/2018 @ 10:34 amThis is one of those areas where I disagree. To the layman (like myself, whose only legal expertise comes from watching Legally Blonde), it does look like lawfare. He gets to go anywhere, do anything, set people up to break picayune laws on technicalities, and safely ignore things he finds if they are politically inconvenient to his worldview.
Personally, I would ignore his entire existence to the point of going to jail. I would rather be jailed unjustly than be tricked into a misstatement and have to plead guilty to a technical violation of law. If the progressives (and make no mistake… Mueller and his team are doing their work) get to use special prosecutors to obstruct and harass the legally elected President of the United States and his administration, I hope a second special prosecutor is named and goes to town. Use their tactics until they scream for relief.
Whatever lawfare President Trump has in his past is fair game for comment. Using lawfare against him while he’s President is different than holding him accountable. It’s being used to hurt him, and by extension, our country. I want to see him hit back, and hit back, and hit back again… until progressives accept that being unfair only gets you pain. I don’t think it’ll happen because if they argued their position in a fair manner, they would lose. So, let them hurt forever, I don’t care.
Stashiu3 (466cdf) — 3/16/2018 @ 10:35 amThe older I get, the less willing I am to waste my time reading — let alone responding to — comments like this where the author makes no effort to communicate effectively. But I’m here so I will respond because I think these are such troublesome ideas.
First, the commenter seemingly acknowledges Kimberlin as the wrongdoer and how little help Patterico received from authorities, but doesn’t seem to give Patterico credit for following through anyway. As conservatives, we know the government won’t always be there for us. Give credit to Patterico for hanging in there.
But it is ludicrous and completely backwards to expect Patterico to use his experience as a reason to feel sympathy for Trump, et al, as they deal with federal investigations. Trump is the President and investigations are part of the job. Patterico the blogger is a private citizen and being targeted by a SWATting and lawfare is not part of blogging.
DRJ (15874d) — 3/16/2018 @ 10:35 amnow i’m super curious just cause i always thought he was a NY guy
i wonder who I’m getting him mixered up with
happyfeet (28a91b) — 3/16/2018 @ 10:41 amHe was at one point. Can we let it go, happy?
Patterico (115b1f) — 3/16/2018 @ 10:43 amHe’s trying to change the topic.
DRJ (15874d) — 3/16/2018 @ 10:45 amyes yes thank you for the clarification though – i’m glad to know i wasn’t totally nuts
happyfeet (28a91b) — 3/16/2018 @ 10:47 amDoritos Locos Tacos visionary dies at 41
and I’m just learning this now why?
happyfeet (28a91b) — 3/16/2018 @ 10:50 amI completely agree with what DRJ said, and to be clear, I support the rule of law… always. It is not inconsistent to note that if Mueller’s lawfare (to my layman’s eye) is legal, what I’m calling for is an equally legal use of lawfare in response. If they use policies against us, we should make policies (where we are in control) against them. Procedures, regulations, laws… wherever they try to circumvent conservatives unfairly we should be responding in kind.
If cities want to make progressive laws for themselves, fine. They can try to abide by them and circle the drain as consequence. It’s their trying to force everyone to abide by their virtue-signaling that I draw the line. Staying above it and losing with a grim smile of satisfaction that we stayed true to being better than them is no longer the correct path. We should be tired of losing unfairly. Tired enough to say, “Fine, if that’s how you want to play… so be it.”
Playing by one set of rules while they play by another that favors them gives us San Francisco, Los Angeles, New York City, etc…
Stashiu3 (466cdf) — 3/16/2018 @ 10:53 amThat is the point, dry, I can’t be any clearer, there should be some additional consideration for an officer of the law, I don’t know exactly what the la office of the bureau was doing, was there pressure from certain donors to lay off
You still think the flynn case is on the up and up. When colonel north was subject to lawfare, he at least could explain his reasoning, Mueller hasallowed egregious violations of due process
http://thefederalist.com/2018/03/16/revealed-peter-strzok-had-personal-relationship-with-recused-judge-in-michael-flynn-case
narciso (d1f714) — 3/16/2018 @ 10:55 amIt does seem that practically any prog figure (corzine, Liz holmes et al, not too mention the quantico cartel)
narciso (d1f714) — 3/16/2018 @ 10:59 amI’m sorry, narciso. I did not realize you were not aware of grammar, capitalization, punctuation and proofreading. I know happyfeet does not know these things but I thought this was your choice. I will avoid you both from now on.
DRJ (15874d) — 3/16/2018 @ 11:01 amThis is your way of egregious ignoring abuse of basic due process, because trump and whoever is in their circle.
narciso (d1f714) — 3/16/2018 @ 11:03 amMr. narciso’s super-smart and understands the whole framework avoiding him’s a good way to miss out on the important context
happyfeet (28a91b) — 3/16/2018 @ 11:04 amIt seems to me there is one set of laws and we should work to make both sides accountable. Stash, to the extent you are talking about the unofficial “rules” of politics, I agree.
DRJ (15874d) — 3/16/2018 @ 11:05 amI see you are both insecure so you have that in common, too.
DRJ (15874d) — 3/16/2018 @ 11:06 ami love President Trump
happyfeet (28a91b) — 3/16/2018 @ 11:08 amBut they are never accountable, and the assembly line from the law schools through Joyce brennan other foundations makes it increasingly harder every day.
narciso (d1f714) — 3/16/2018 @ 11:09 amDRJ,
Again, I unconditionally apologize for not being clear before. No excuses.
Stashiu3 (466cdf) — 3/16/2018 @ 11:11 amThey are never accountable?
We have a populist Republican President, so the voters responded to the left. It’s up to Trump and his Administration to act but he’s too inept or unwilling to do anything about it. Blame Trump, not lawyers.
As for law schools turning out liberal lawyers, that’s probably true of some but not all. And our own new lawyer Leviticus has a mind of his own, doesn’t he?
DRJ (15874d) — 3/16/2018 @ 11:13 amStrike “Again” please. I don’t recall if the previous apology was clear and unconditional. If it wasn’t, it should have been.
Stashiu3 (466cdf) — 3/16/2018 @ 11:14 amWhy apologize? We are agreeing here, aren’t we?
DRJ (15874d) — 3/16/2018 @ 11:14 amMr. Leviticus has bias on Mr. Trump
happyfeet (28a91b) — 3/16/2018 @ 11:15 amI always refrained from commenting on narciso’s grammar and spelling errors, on the off-chance that he was doing voice-to-text transcription from a Steven Hawking chair or something like that.
Leviticus (efada1) — 3/16/2018 @ 11:15 amSomeone pointed out that the words that don’t spell right often are because he’s hitting the key next to the correct key. So he’s definitely typing. There could be a physical or technological issue; I have no idea about that. What amazes me about him is that he tosses out these obscure references that I don’t usually bother to follow up on — but when I do, I see that there is something there.
Patterico (115b1f) — 3/16/2018 @ 11:18 amnumber one this is not how you treat brilliant visionaries
number two this is just stupid especially in the context of the corrupt sleazy FBI rolling out the red carpet for so many killers, terrorists, and child molesters
happyfeet (28a91b) — 3/16/2018 @ 11:18 amWe are, and we were before, but I gave you the impression that I wasn’t supporting the rule of law because I didn’t make myself as clear as I should have. Apologies, especially between friends, are still important. My mistake, so I have no excuse.
Stashiu3 (466cdf) — 3/16/2018 @ 11:19 amIn the way that Clinton can fire every us atty to get at one, whereas w tries to replace 6 and its a firing offense. investigating past malpractice because there was no accountability for Benghazi for fast and furious, the tea party proscription is nearly impossible.
narciso (d1f714) — 3/16/2018 @ 11:20 amI’ve always assumed that English wasn’t narciso’s first language, largely because so many of his comments end in a comma rather than a period. As Patterico says, there is always something there. It can be difficult to follow however.
Stashiu3 (466cdf) — 3/16/2018 @ 11:21 amnarciso has something to add but everyone does. I’m not investing time in him when he won’t invest it in us.
DRJ (15874d) — 3/16/2018 @ 11:24 amnarciso,
I didn’t mean to talk about you like you weren’t here. I’m sure there is a reason you don’t explain since you’ve been asked on more than one occasion. I’m okay with that and just accept the way you write. I appreciate your insights and the hard work you obviously perform to seek out and share links you consider topical, and which always are in some way. While happyfeet comments his way intentionally as part of his online character, I’m sure you are different. It’s not a shtick, just the way you write.
Stashiu3 (466cdf) — 3/16/2018 @ 11:28 amDRJ,
What I’m saying is that I believe narciso expresses himself as best he can. I believe he writes at a much higher level than I would on a Korean blog even though I speak, read, and write Korean at a very basic level. I would be very difficult to follow and my grammar and punctuation would be atrocious. That’s the assumption I read narcisco’s comments with.
Stashiu3 (466cdf) — 3/16/2018 @ 11:31 amnarciso is prolific… with him, to find the jewel often requires a heavy emphasis on the journey more than the destination. He leaves clues strewn along the path and you may be bouncing back and forth between languages and decades.
Sort of like putting headphones on and listening to early Santana while declining in a dark room.
Colonel Haiku (33b771) — 3/16/2018 @ 11:34 amMake that reclining
Colonel Haiku (33b771) — 3/16/2018 @ 11:35 amIn support of my theory.
Stashiu3 (466cdf) — 3/16/2018 @ 11:36 amIn my case, declining might be more appropriate. 😉
Stashiu3 (466cdf) — 3/16/2018 @ 11:36 amWhat amazes me about him is that he tosses out these obscure references that I don’t usually bother to follow up on — but when I do, I see that there is something there.
My too. It is a shame that DRJ decided to resort to insulting him.
BuDuh (bb3654) — 3/16/2018 @ 11:37 amWhat makes you think she hasn’t scored already?
You might be confusing cause and effect, divorce-wise…
Fun observation here about how Trump is at a loss when confronted someone as sleazy as he is:
Stormy Daniels is crushing President Trump at his own game
Fortunately for him, only a tiny fraction of the world can say that.
Dave (445e97) — 3/16/2018 @ 11:43 amOn November 9, 2016, a large and vocal segment of the U.S. population sighed and decided to chuck their principles out the window and spend the next few years tying themselves in ridiculous knots to defend the indefensible.
Patterico retained his principles, and vocally criticized the defenestrators. For this, he has been attacked incessantly by Trumpkin clowns who are painfully aware of the shamefulness of their supplication.
Patterico is my friend, and a good man, and a believer in adherence to principles. I respect him very much for his patience.
I don’t know anything about Ace. His blog sucks and I’ve never been able to sustain any interest in it. But to attack Patterico for being “soft on the left” is complete and shameless idiocy, with a deep underbelly of hypocrisy if Ace did in fact pay settlement money to a prick like Kimberlin.
Leviticus (efada1) — 3/16/2018 @ 11:44 amI think narciso has ups and downs, but mostly likes to hide obscure references. Thus, it’s really hard for me to read his (?) intentions directly. Heck, it’s sometimes hard to understand why he posts what he does. And that’s okay, most of the time.
But he has interacted with DRJ for a long time, and one would think he would clarify himself.
Simon Jester (c8876d) — 3/16/2018 @ 11:44 amWRT to spelling and grammar, I always thought it was due to texting while driving or in the middle of another activity, and little if anything to do with English being not his first language. While I tend to disavow one-way whataboutism, it could do much much worse without Narciso as its plumed knight.
urbanleftbehind (5eecdb) — 3/16/2018 @ 11:44 amWell stated, Leviticus.
Simon Jester (c8876d) — 3/16/2018 @ 11:45 amBut to attack Patterico for being “soft on the left” is complete and shameless idiocy
first of all “attack” is a tendentious characterization – what Mr. Ace did was to group Mr. Patterico with a loosely-defined but colloquially readily-identifiable school of contemporary thinking
number two “soft on the left” is so vague as to be difficult to dismiss as readily and comprehensively as you do Mr. Leviticus without defining the terms
exactly what softness on the left is Mr. Patterico being declared to be wholly and utterly unpossessed of?
even the most careful skimmer of this thread would not understand what this is referring to
there’s a discussion what could be had about how one best goes about delineating the fuzzy boundaries between trump haters and nevertrump and bill kristol/mitt romney democrats
but perhaps these distinctions are too much inchoate yet
happyfeet (28a91b) — 3/16/2018 @ 11:53 amSilly me, I thought it was just a way of dismissing my argument. I thought tillerson was a poor choice, because he was at odds with most of the administrations policies, which we mostly agree on. I think pompeo is a better fit.
narciso (d1f714) — 3/16/2018 @ 11:55 amI agree with you, Simon. It would have been nice for DRJ to have put it that way. Especially since her self imposed ban was a result of disgust at the lower standard being set in this comment section by all the insulting that was replacing conversation/debate.
BuDuh (bb3654) — 3/16/2018 @ 11:56 amurbanleftbehind,
I’m not sure it’s possible to speech-to-text links the way he does… hence my own assumption. I’ve asked directly and assume he has good reasons for not explaining. His choice, which I’ve accepted because he adds to the discussion.
Stashiu3 (466cdf) — 3/16/2018 @ 11:58 amBlame the tablet, when I don’t use obscure links, when I state examples clearly it appears i am being dismissed. When I warned you what a jackass Dana ward, what he did to the memory of two friends on maguires blog. I wee waved off.
narciso (d1f714) — 3/16/2018 @ 12:04 pmRe. Stormy.
the Bas (3bcea0) — 3/16/2018 @ 12:07 pmPat – while what you said about “nobody” supporting you caused me pain of regret, I am profoundly sad that you aren’t seemingly able to KNOW that the support you have is beyond anything any persons (even the mighty Beldar or the sainted DRJ!) can possibly conjure. Your constant fight/struggles to insist on higher meanings and higher-ordered lives is unquestionably blessed by the greats who came before and who, I am certain, look down with tremendous interest as our republic is crumbling. Locke, Madison, Hamilton, and on and on will be lining up to shake your hand at the end. Contemporaries like Andrew and Anton will probably beckon you over for a great meal. They will be so very pleased to be with you.
Schumer and Schiff and the statist/progressive liars are facing a much different fate. So, too, the power mad like DJT. They pretty much run our current domain. As far as I am concerned, they are welcome to it.
Please know that if you are ever really up against it and somehow you believe I may be able to help, just call. You are always in my thoughts and deep prayers. My faith informs me you are loved by God in a manner surpassing understanding. I am as certain as I can be He is pretty darn pleased with much of your life, as well. May he continue to bless you and yours abundantly.
Ed from SFV (3400a5) — 3/16/2018 @ 12:11 pmNarciso, I didn’t know a thing about “Dana Ward.” I remember the other nickname, and I checked into what you had posted. Very useful. Thank you.
Simon Jester (c8876d) — 3/16/2018 @ 12:12 pmSo it seems there is an exceptional discretion when it comes to terrorists but the lives and livelihoods of those who do the hard tasks to keep us safe, not so much. Every paper the times the post USA today used the same false account re gina haspel, as they had with deuce martinez,Mitchell and Jensen.
narciso (d1f714) — 3/16/2018 @ 12:12 pmI was confused about the references to Dana Ward until he was banned. That’s when I realized he was Ben burn. I know I wasn’t one of the ones you warned about him because I was only reading the posts and lurking the comments then, but you were right about him. He blew his second chance, so all ends well.
We’re good on my part Sir.
Stashiu3 (466cdf) — 3/16/2018 @ 12:12 pmWell said. If the support isn’t obvious, then I’ll make it clear as well. If you need something, you will get my best effort.
Stashiu3 (466cdf) — 3/16/2018 @ 12:16 pmKurt Schlichter has ingested a greater volume of Trump’s bodily fluids than Stormy herself. And enjoyed it more.
Dave (445e97) — 3/16/2018 @ 12:24 pmyou act like there’s all these fluids involved but it’s not like that
happyfeet (28a91b) — 3/16/2018 @ 12:26 pm“Schumer and Schiff and the statist/progressive liars are facing a much different fate. So, too, the power mad like DJT. […]
My faith informs me you are loved by God in a manner surpassing understanding.”
The first bit seems a tad presumptuous given the second part.
Jesus died for sinners, not the sinless, as if there was such.
Even you and Patterico fall under Romans 3:23.
Might want to brush up on Matthew 7:1-2.
the Bas (3bcea0) — 3/16/2018 @ 12:27 pmDave,
Despite our earlier agreement, you are not fit to lick Kurt Schlichter’s boots. Also, your fascination with President Trump’s bodily fluids is… odd.
Stashiu3 (466cdf) — 3/16/2018 @ 12:31 pmDave, I notice you are following the hosts practice of accusing people with different opinions of practicing sexual perversions in vulgar terms.
Kinda hard on your core criticisms of Trumps character, don’t you think?.
the Bas (3bcea0) — 3/16/2018 @ 12:35 pmJesus died for the sinners (all of us), in large part, to give them succor to repent. Those who will not are to receive severe sanction. Forever.
If you would bet on our secular leadership being blessed in this domain while they continue to mock Him and his love at every opportunity, I strongly advise you stay away from any and all wagering.
The argument is about the here and now. I will not argue, ever, that any given sinner was not saved at the very last instant. I pray we are all given that opportunity. ALL of us.
Do you have evidence of any fundamental change in human nature, Bas? Kindly present such. If you do not, kindly acknowledge this as your truth.
Ed from SFV (3400a5) — 3/16/2018 @ 12:38 pmYou go right ahead then.
Dave (445e97) — 3/16/2018 @ 12:39 pmThere was a point when California was setting up the building code to mandate the installation of a government overrided switch in all thermostats in new construction homes, and a prerequisite of the sale of all pre existing homes, like double paned windows or water meters, as a retail feature in service of the global warming fraud, to grandfather it in, make it a de facto part of the law.
Patterico stood up for my side on that issue. It was nipped in the bud during public hearings in no small part to your efforts.
God bless you for bringing that issue out into the light at the crucial hour, despite your doubts of the right or wrong minutia regarding manbearpig.
Ace promoted traffic helped legitimize the over all issue of skepticism, and how it wasn’t being applied in regard to the lack of science being pushed regarding the global warming political movement, specifically during a weblog awards where the main contest was between Steve McIntyre’s “Climate Audit” and some guy, I can’t recall the name, whose blog was about evolution versus creation, bashing Christians and the like.
Which was the best science blog of the entire English speaking world? To be determined by popular vote in an online poll at the height of Al Gore’s popularity (he had just won the Academy Award for AIT).
Climate Audit didn’t win. It had led the vote for the better part of two weeks, but at the last minute the warmers hacked the election in an obvious way so that everyone on the net could see the Democrats cheated to put the Religion bashing blog over the top after the voting period was closed.
Couldn’t have asked for a better result. Instead of winning an otherwise obscure online trophy, it highlighted the potemkin village, astroturf, win at all cost, silence your detractor with lawfare, nature of the global warming political machine.
So Pat wants me to go over and beat up Ace, in a forum where the target of his ire isn’t even going to notice my exertions, otherwise I’m not your friend?
I’m not a flying monkey. I have my own agenda.
Besides which Pat, you are trying to instigate a conflict between nuclear armed superpowers.
Not banking on you getting a result, but I prefer my planet original recipe rather than extra crispy.
papertiger (c8116c) — 3/16/2018 @ 12:44 pm“Do you have evidence of any fundamental change in human nature”
2 Corinthians 5:17 King James Version (KJV)
17 Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new.
If your faith tells you to damn sinners to hell, you’re free to do so. I’m pretty sure the Christian faith compels us to pray for them instead though.
Anyway, I’ve said my piece, carry on.
the Bas (3bcea0) — 3/16/2018 @ 12:50 pmNone of that is what I said, papertiger
Patterico (9622fb) — 3/16/2018 @ 12:53 pmThe piece you linked argues that morality is irrelevant, and that conservatives shouldn’t care about it.
According the Schlicter, it’s fine for conservatives to embrace – indeed celebrate – immorality, because liberals are immoral. Let that sink in.
Schlicter – together with Hannity – is the worst of the worst Trump apologists. The article you linked is damning, and it’s only one of many.
Dave (445e97) — 3/16/2018 @ 1:02 pmRe. Stormy.
Kurt Schlichter has ingested a greater volume of Trump’s bodily fluids than Stormy herself. And enjoyed it more.
Dave (445e97) — 3/16/2018 @ 12:24 pm
Comments like these are where ConDave reveals himself to be just another lefty tw*twaffle.
Colonel Haiku (33b771) — 3/16/2018 @ 1:09 pm*yawn*
Dave (445e97) — 3/16/2018 @ 1:16 pmHacker Adrian Lamo, who turned in Chelsea Manning, dies at 37
happyfeet (28a91b) — 3/16/2018 @ 1:27 pmSphincter, unlike many of the Noo Yawk our-timers, wasnt on board from day one, and seems to have done the well-trod Walker-to-Cruz-to-Trump journey many have done. And Dave, Saleena Zito would tell Kurt Schlichter to hold her hard cider or Mikes in that regard.
urbanleftbehind (5eecdb) — 3/16/2018 @ 1:32 pmYes, Schlichter is a true master of situational ethics.
Here’s his take on one of the early GOP debates:
“These are my principles; if you don’t like them I have others!”
Dave (445e97) — 3/16/2018 @ 1:42 pmMaybe people would have understood your warning if your comments weren’t so oblique.
I am picking on you because you have something to offer but often it’s like you are talking to yourself, not the people gathered here. Come to The Jury with me if you want a soliloquy.
I understand tablets can cause problems. I have one with a quirky keyboard that messes up every other word but it’s on me to do extra proofreading. You act like it’s our responsibility to decipher your comments. You are like the office worked who is always 15 minutes late to every meeting. Everyone wastes time waiting for that guy, just as we waste time trying to read and understand your points. It’s insulting to treat us this way and a little effort would help save everyone time.
DRJ (15874d) — 3/16/2018 @ 2:17 pmNice try, Bas.
I specifically stated I would never make a sure pronouncement on ANYONE’s soul.
You failed utterly to cite any fundamental change in human nature and you failed to acknowledge there have been none proven.
I shall not make the mistake of engaging you again.
Ed from SFV (3400a5) — 3/16/2018 @ 2:51 pmNo one stopped Obama, as he subverted every single institution he could get his hands on, he ignored injunctions intimidated the supreme court, from Ben ghazi to stoneman Douglas, every critic of note from mark steyn to bob Mcdonnell was either merely hassled or indicted, it didn’t matter that we held the house and the senate,
narciso (d1f714) — 3/16/2018 @ 3:06 pmOh noes, I’ve been judged and found wanting.
I guess I should just be glad you haven’t insisted on higher meanings and higher-ordered lives by unquestionably asserting I’m gobbling Trump’s junk.
the Bas (3bcea0) — 3/16/2018 @ 3:25 pmI can’t speak for everyone, but as far as I’m concerned your lifestyle choices are your own business.
🙂
Dave (445e97) — 3/16/2018 @ 3:42 pmSay. How many of you can say where the 2017 United Nations Climate Change Conference took place without looking?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2017_United_Nations_Climate_Change_Conference
papertiger (c8116c) — 3/16/2018 @ 3:57 pmYou’re welcome.
How many of you know who represented the United States at that conference?
papertiger (c8116c) — 3/16/2018 @ 3:59 pmFor someone who can boycott a whole commenting board because the tone is unsettling, I find it amazing you take the time to be insulted by a commenter that doesn’t conform to your rigid rules, DRJ.
Can you ignore someone that most everyone else can deal with or is it more satisfying to use Trump style attacks?
BuDuh (cf3c65) — 3/16/2018 @ 3:59 pmAnswer: Jerry Brown, Michael Bloomberg and Arnold Schwarzenegger.
A shrinking glot of scum and villiany – soon to be erased from any official capacity whatsoever.
You are welcome again.
papertiger (c8116c) — 3/16/2018 @ 4:02 pmYou are like the office worked who is always 15 minutes late to every meeting.
This sentence makes no sense. Using a tablet?
BuDuh (cf3c65) — 3/16/2018 @ 4:02 pm“These are my principles; if you don’t like them I have others!”
Dave (445e97) — 3/16/2018 @ 1:42 pm
Maybe he was brainwashed like John McCain.
Pinandpuller (0a7cbe) — 3/16/2018 @ 5:27 pmThank you Dave and thank you Staishu.
Patterico,
you didn’t start the fight. You responded. My mistake.
P.S. The world is going to hell in a handbasket.
NJRob (b00189) — 3/16/2018 @ 10:02 pmThat was a typo and thank you for pointing it out so I can correct it. I meant to say “You are like the office worker who is always 15 minutes late to every meeting.”
See how confusing one typo can be? Now multiply that by 5, 10, or more and think how confusing it is.
DRJ (15874d) — 3/16/2018 @ 10:26 pm