Patterico's Pontifications

10/25/2021

More Low-Hanging Fruit: MAGAland Mocks Alec Baldwin After Tragic Film Set Incident

Filed under: General — Dana @ 4:04 pm



[guest post by Dana]

This low-hanging fruit is an important reminder to non-MAGA Republicans: This is today’s Republican Party. MAGA Republicans know that these attacks will play well with their base. And that’s precisely the point.

As you are certainly aware by now, actor Alec Baldwin fired a prop gun (or perhaps real gun) on the set of his new movie after he had been told that it was a “cold gun” (no live rounds), subsequently killing the film’s director of photography and injuring the director. Pouncing on the horrific film set tragedy to score MAGA points, these t-shirts are currently being sold on Donald Trump Jr.’s website:

Untitled

And then there’s this from Rep. Lauren Boebert, who tweeted just hours after the announcement of the incident:

J.D. Vance, currently an Ohio candidate for the US Senate, also jumped on the bandwagon. (The capitulation of Vance to Trumpism has been especially disappointing.)

So, you get the picture. In the name of payback and scoring political points, MAGA Republicans are roundly attacking a celebrity who accidentally shot and killed an individual all because he is fiercely anti-Trump and equally fierce in his advocacy for gun control.

Once upon a time, there would have been an outcry against those exploiting a tragedy like this for their own gain, or their tribe’s gain. Instead, such an incident would have elicited sympathy for all parties involved. But those days are long gone. Social media has made it incredibly easy to shed civility and basic good manners. In the name of politics (and vengeance on behalf of one’s tribe), compassion is now for losers. When tragedy strikes, an obligatory pounce by one or the other side of the aisle is commonplace. Does anyone even cringe at the vulgarity? Polarization and tribal allegiances have begotten a cheapened people, a crass people, and a people who believe that common decency is to be mocked. And the worst part of it all is the bleating attempt to justify such behavior. I think the word I’m looking for is reprehensible.

–Dana

144 Responses to “More Low-Hanging Fruit: MAGAland Mocks Alec Baldwin After Tragic Film Set Incident”

  1. Hello.

    Dana (174549)

  2. Of course, the tragedy is all part of a conspiracy.

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  3. Load the weapon yourself.Unloaded many rounds in my life and never had anyone else mess with loading ammo into the chamber.
    Hollyweed people need a new set of rules.

    mg (8cbc69)

  4. Better link to the conspiracy.

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  5. Bad black powder blank, mg. .45 Colt or .38 something. The crimp separated and it was enough to slice the poor lady’s jugular just by the clavicle. A guess on my part, but a good guess. I’m also guessing that the gun was an Italian-made replica. They basically have a monopoly on Old West movie guns of any kind.

    And, no, on a movie set, the ventriloquists’ dummies do not load the guns themselves. Not ever. The armorer is supposed to, and from what I’ve also read, and Dana wrote, a prop assistant passed this one out as a “cold gun” meaning no blank.

    But the bottom line is that Baldwin was playing with the gun while the cinematographer (that’s the dead lady) and the director (wounded) were still lining up the camera (I don’t want to say “shot”). Thumb on hammer, finger on trigger, something like that, while practicing his cross draw. If you believe Hollywood reporters. That was the proximate cause. A doofus.

    nk (1d9030)

  6. Branca looks at NM law re: felony involuntary manslaughter.
    https://youtu.be/upDuj8EcYeg

    ColoComment (905a46)

  7. I don’t imagine that there is a dearth of “I didn’t know the gun was loaded” precedents.

    nk (1d9030)

  8. mark the date

    october 25 2021: partisan vileness hits twitter

    JF (e1156d)

  9. It was, possibly, a real gun:

    Souza explained Baldwin pointed the gun directly at the camera and fired, striking him in the shoulder and Halyna Hutchins in the chest. Souza says he had a vague memory that Hutchins was complaining about her stomach and grabbing her midsection. He says she then began to stumble backward and was assisted to the ground. He says he was bleeding from his shoulder and could see blood on Halyna…

    Steve Wolf, a special effects coordinator and theatrical firearms safety expert, told CNN there were 3 errors committed that resulted in the tragedy — using a real gun rather than a prop gun, having a live round in the gun and having people stand behind the camera in the “line of fire.” He also said the assistant director should not have been the one to clear the gun before the incident … that should have been the armorist’s job.

    Dana (174549)

  10. In the parlance of happyfeet, “what even is a jd vance”

    Leviticus (315227)

  11. More from the victim of so-called “payback”:

    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=6IL4sMC_XBE

    Poor guy…

    BuDuh (e64291)

  12. I just don’t understand Hollyweed and the rules they set for themselves. I do understand gun safety. And they don’t. Rest in Peace, ma’am.

    mg (8cbc69)

  13. I am not a Trump follower but in 2019 Alec Baldwin attacked Liz Cheney for her father’s gun accident. Pay backs hurt. He is also the arrogant man that exploded over a parking space. Elite hypocrisy in

    Michael Harris (aa45c6)

  14. Conservative pundit Candace Owens attacks Alec Baldwin over accidental shooting calling it ‘poetic justice’ for his previous criticism of Donald Trump
    ………
    The conservative pundit, 32, has since deleted her provocative tweets and Instagram posts after criticizing Baldwin over the shooting that killed cinematographer Halyna Hutchins.

    Owens wrote: ‘Alec Baldwin spent 4 years dedicated to painting Donald Trump and his supporters as evil murderers.

    ‘What has happened to Alec would be an example of poetic justice if it weren’t for the actual innocent people that were murdered by him. Pray for their families. So sad.’

    The right-wing talk show host then added: ‘Will correct that last tweet to say Alec Baldwin *killed* someone- not murdered someone, as murder carries a different legal definition.

    ‘Literally not one single thing that Alec Baldwin has said about Donald Trump and his supporters is going to age well.’
    ……..
    One person called the commentator (a coward and) ‘spineless’ and said the tweets were ‘below her’.

    Another wrote that her response to the tragedy was ‘tasteless’, saying Baldwin’s politics had no bearing on the shooting.
    ……..
    CO’s tweets won’t age well if she keeps taking them down-it makes her look weak by not having the courage of her convictions. She should ask “What would Donald do?” Trump certainly wouldn’t remove his tweets.

    Rip Murdock (893091)

  15. Legal Analysis: Alec Baldwin Situation Beginning to Look a Lot Like Manslaughter
    The more we learn about the facts of this case, within the context of New Mexico criminal law, the more this shooting looks increasingly like a crime—specifically, felony involuntary manslaughter

    https://legalinsurrection.com/2021/10/legal-analysis-alec-baldwin-situation-beginning-to-look-a-lot-like-manslaughter/

    Spoiler alert: Branca doesn’t dive into the “mean t-shirt” angle.

    BuDuh (4a7846)

  16. With his comment about police officers – ” what does it feel like to shoot someone” now you know, Mr. pompous.. He is responsible. He pulled the trigger. One learns that in 6 th grade gun safety class.

    mg (8cbc69)

  17. #13 – Still and all, exploiting a woman’s tragic death to make money is gross.

    Turning it into a morality tale about the great sinfulness of criticizing Donald Trump is insane.

    Radegunda (7f4ba9)

  18. @14 we’re learning alec is the real victim

    JF (e1156d)

  19. Why cant conservatives play by the lefts rules? Baldwin is a prick and would be dishing out hate if the tables were turned. He is the moron who didn’t check his gun for proper ammo. Idiot ended up taking a life and not his.

    mg (8cbc69)

  20. Yeeeaaah I tend to agree. If you even hold a gun without personally checking to see if it’s loaded you are … responsible. Don’t even touch it if you aren’t going to figure out whether it’s loaded.

    Leviticus (315227)

  21. #19 — Because gleefully exploiting someone’s untimely death to score cheap political points or boost a weird personality cult is callous and amoral. So is exploiting it to make money.

    What is the righteous goal that’s being served by trying to out-ugly “the left’s rules” in this particular case? What policy or moral purpose does it advance? Is this how “real conservatives” go about restoring the “values” they claim to be so concerned about?

    Radegunda (7f4ba9)

  22. I think there’s enough fault to go around on this one. Everyone who touched that gun has a share in the blame.

    Nic (896fdf)

  23. Boo hoo to you preachy conservatives.

    mg (8cbc69)

  24. What many people are describing as humor directed at Alec Baldwin for his monumental ignorance and recklessness is actually just people pointing out a mountain of irony.

    Baldwin is a fervent anti-2nd Amendment zealot with almost zero knowledge of guns and apparently even less of gun safety.

    He has multiple tweets declaring that people he disapproves of need to be ‘shot’, some ‘in the face’.

    He even tweeted that he wondered how it must feel to accidentally shoot someone, I guess he now knows.

    According to reports, there had already been at least two gun accidents in the week before the fatal incident. The producer (guess who) made no attempt to replace an obviously incompetent set armorer.

    Union crew had complained about working conditions, being rushed, gun safety and other issues to the point of walking off. The union members who sought to stay on the job were ordered off the property by police called by the producer.

    Now it’s being reported that the same real gun that fired the fatal shot was being used by cast/crew for recreational target shooting on breaks.

    All signs so far point to extreme criminal negligence and to use the justified response to this accidental death that never should have happened as just another excuse to attack ‘MAGALand’ is a very curious line to take.

    Obudman (ff7852)

  25. You pull the trigger, you get the crow bar hotel. Unless you are a left wing acting shooter…..

    mg (8cbc69)

  26. Baldwin is a prick and would be dishing out hate if the tables were turned.

    And we should lower ourselves to Baldwin’s level because why?

    Paul Montagu (5de684)

  27. He won’t do a day, just like the lefty who murdered Ashley Babbitt.

    mg (8cbc69)

  28. 26- Its how the game has changed, bub .

    mg (8cbc69)

  29. Go be a priest.

    mg (8cbc69)

  30. It’s in poor taste, however deserving Baldwin is of any opportunity to mock him.

    “The gun isn’t loaded” is one of those things you are never supposed to accept without looking.

    But still, someone died and it’s poor form to make the funny.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  31. This illustrates the real problem with MAGA: It is relentless preaching to the choir with little or no care what the other 80% think.

    TL;DR: cult.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  32. And the solid base of Donald Trump knows they are right. Freak flag flying they will march onward, never understanding what utter fukking fools they are.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  33. They actually had a guy who was supposed to be checking ammo, in fact he was supposed to in charge of all guns and never put real ammo in them. Then he put some guns out on a table — apparently without checking — and some gofer told Baldwin “here’s a cold gun.”

    This was gross negligence on a half a dozen people’s part (including Baldwin of the deep pockets) and the really terrible thing is that it wasn’t the first accidental discharge that day.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  34. felony involuntary manslaughter

    Yes, but it’s the armorer who falls first. I’m going to bet he was drunk.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  35. If baldwin was practicing his draws, what was he doing pointing the gun at someone? You never point a gun at anyone, let alone pull the trigger. That is unacceptable behavior.

    mg (8cbc69)

  36. Lock him up

    mg (8cbc69)

  37. Yes, but it’s the armorer who falls first. I’m going to bet he was drunk.

    24-year old woman, according to CNN. This was her second gig as head armorer.

    What is dishonest is the “prop gun” malfunction meme starting with the 9/11 call. And that the victims were struck with “debris”. Hollywood assholes!

    nk (1d9030)

  38. Its how the game has changed, bub.

    Correction. That’s how your game is played, not mine, and I don’t have to be a priest either.
    BTW, Ashli Babbitt wasn’t murdered. She was a fool who so believed Trump’s lies that she chose to be break the law and riot the Capitol.

    Paul Montagu (5de684)

  39. Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.

    Leviticus (315227)

  40. @34 more like on the ganja!

    asset (bafbe0)

  41. The Left always speaks and acts with proper decorum.

    Sarcasm off.

    DN (181662)

  42. He won’t do a day, just like the lefty who murdered Ashley Babbitt.

    Kaitlyn Jenner and the woman he (sic) rear-ended into oncoming traffic is a better example.

    nk (1d9030)

  43. Deserve’s got nothing to do with it. There isn’t a right or a norm, constitutional or otherwise, that survives if we reserve them for people we think deserve it. If you’re good with that race to the bottom, don’t be surprised when those of us who still value civilized society judge you accordingly.

    lurker (59504c)

  44. There seems to be some implication that someone put a live round into the weapon after they had been set out, unloaded, but were apparently not continuously watched. A “joke” gone wrong?

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  45. Leviticus !

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  46. He won’t do a day, just like the lefty who murdered Ashley Babbitt.

    Policemen are lefties now?

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  47. Policemen are lefties now?

    Kevin M (ab1c11) — 10/25/2021 @ 11:56 pm

    There’s nobody so far right (or left) that there isn’t someone fringier willing to excommunicate them for their apostasies.

    Today’s case in point, Newsmax declares Fox News “woke.”

    lurker (59504c)

  48. nk

    24-year old woman, according to CNN. This was her second gig as head armorer.

    No, it was the assistant director, unless they are the same person. The assistant director was the one who handed him the gun and told him it was a cold gun.

    From this and other things it sounds like there was a lot of confusion or disorganization on the set, and of course this had to be the result of people not talking to each other and assuming things.

    Some people had earlier decided to engage in some target shooting, probably without permission and therefore without telling anyone, and left a bullet or blank in at least one gun.

    Sammy Finkelman (c49738)

  49. Frank Marano on WABC said he thought there was almost never bad humor. SNL made jokes about J Simpson and Robert Blake.

    But those were already big things anyway – I don’t know – it feels different. Perhaps because the focus is not so much on Alex Baldwin and he’s not lying.

    Sammy Finkelman (c49738)

  50. What a sad, tragic, accident.

    Time123 (f95a66)

  51. “24-year old woman, according to CNN. This was her second gig as head armorer.”

    Imagine this being the person in charge of your film set firearms:

    https://twitter.com/teresafreethink/status/1452003565090783235?s=21

    But the important thing is to chastise anyone pointing out the lunacy.

    Obudman (9c9c0c)

  52. When they say low-budget production, they mean low budget production.

    When Clint Eastwood, who is not anti-gun, made The Outlaw Josey Wales, he had hard rubber (actual prop gun) copies of his Colt Walkers for carrying and waving around. I know that as reported. He would also have had semi-shootable Walker replica cartridge conversions designed to fire only theatrical blanks with the internals of a starter’s gun. If he had any faithful shootable percussion replicas for verisimilitude at all, they would have been filmed only for close-ups and spliced in.

    nk (1d9030)

  53. Dana:

    Where were you when Kathy Griffin was traipsing about with the mock severed head of Donald Trump?
    Liberty & Truth require constant vigilance. GLZ.

    Gary L. Zerman (a1521c)

  54. Civility Bullschiff.

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  55. Gaslighting and dishing out disrespect has been THE go-to behavior exhibited by the left for many years. Accompanied by whining/calls for civility when it is employed against them and their ridiculous Bullschiff.

    Alec “Schweddy Balls” Baldwin… your poultry is coming home… to roost.

    He should receive the same treatment and standards the average citizen gets.

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  56. Gary L. Zerman,

    Right here, buddy.

    Dana (174549)

  57. This response from MAGA makes sense. Lashing out at slights is a main part of the movement. Someone being tragically killed doesn’t register as important.

    Time123 (f95a66)

  58. It was not an accident. He was given a gun, he didn’t check it, he pointed it at a person, and he pulled the trigger. Being told it was a “cold gun” doesn’t change that.

    I don’t know that a “prop gun” is an important distinction. When the trigger was pulled it functioned as a gun. It was a gun used as a prop.

    This was negligence. Someone died. He should be held accountable. So should others to the degree they were responsible. I don’t know the murder laws specific to the location. But I’d call this manslaughter.

    On the other issue of dunking on him. That is just obnoxious. Someone died.

    frosty (f27e97)

  59. @57 in a post about the response not about the tragic death

    JF (e1156d)

  60. equally fierce in his advocacy for gun control.

    Are you really anti-gun when you profit off movies glorifying gun violence?

    BillPasadena (76dc69)

  61. So, according to the LA Times, I was not confabulating:

    Baldwin removed the gun from its holster once without incident, but the second time he did so, ammunition flew toward the trio around the monitor. The projectile whizzed by the camera operator but penetrated Hutchins near her shoulder, then continued through to Souza. Hutchins immediately fell to the ground as crew members applied pressure to her wound in an attempt to stop the bleeding.

    It could still turn out to be a blank whose crimp separated and not a bullet, Faux News “experts” arguing with passionate sincerity notwithstanding.

    nk (1d9030)

  62. Are you really anti-gun when you profit off movies glorifying gun violence?

    Right on! I consider John Wick III the most pornographic movie I have ever seen. Mind-numbing!

    nk (1d9030)

  63. From CNN:

    Crew members on the set of “Rust” used guns with live ammunition and engaged in a pastime called “plinking” hours before Halyna Hutchins was killed, founder and CEO of The Wrap, Sharon Waxman, told CNN’s Don Lemon Monday night, citing information from an individual with knowledge of the set.

    One of the guns used was later handed to actor Alec Baldwin, who fired the shot that killed Hutchins, 42, and injured director Joel Souza, The Wrap reported.

    There’s this pastime that crew members sometimes do, it’s called ‘plinking,’ and they go out into the rural areas and they shoot at beer cans. This is with live ammunition. We learned that this happened the morning of the day that Halyna Hutchins was killed,” Waxman said.

    Dana (174549)

  64. #56 Dana – Gary L. Zerman,

    Right here, buddy.
    Dana (174549) — 10/26/2021 @ 7:40 am
    ____________________

    Here is how your 6/2/17 post began:

    It’s Friday, so you’ll have to cut me slack for posting about such absurd happenings. But honestly, this fairly defines the absurd culture in which we find ourselves currently flailing about. I studiously avoided posting about the Kathy Griffin debacle when it happened because yawn, but now it’s gotten so ridiculous that it demands its own separate post. …
    ________________________

    You admittedly did not say squat about the Kathy Griffin event (which was first posted on 5.31.17), until 6.2.17) – when it was by your own term then ‘low-hanging fruit’, as Griffin had then been largely condemned and the water was now safe for your belated post.

    So, yawn – back at you buddy.

    Liberty & Truth require constant vigilance. GLZ.

    Gary L. Zerman (a1521c)

  65. Who died on Kathy Griffin’s set? I forgot.

    nk (1d9030)

  66. Nk, what she did was crude and insulting. I’m glad she was fired.

    Plus she hurt the feelings of the most sensitive group of people our country has ever known.

    Time123 (f95a66)

  67. @53: People go to lengths like that for a reason. Eastwood probably had seen enough gun-surprises in his career.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  68. Plus she hurt the feelings of the most sensitive group of people our country has ever known.

    A group known especially for its sensitivity towards others. Or is that Others?

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  69. Hey, Zerman, where is YOUR post on Kathy Griffin? Guess what. No one here is obligated to talk about what you think they should talk about, although Patterico has a standing offer if you give him $100.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  70. #68 — If by others, you mean Donald Trump and some of his family.

    Appalled (1a17de)

  71. @70 the thread is going around in circles

    let’s level set:

    vile nevertrumper commits manslaughter and it’s about how trumpers hurt your feelings

    JF (e1156d)

  72. That makes even less sense then your typical comment.

    But good job communicating your resentment. That parts clear.

    Time123 (f95a66)

  73. But good job communicating your resentment.

    Trump’s people are very good at that, along with assigning blame.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  74. https://twitter.com/JavierBlas/status/1452234951420780547

    For the first time in a long time, all US state have an average retail gasoline price above $3 per gallon (even Oklahoma and Mississippi which traditionally enjoy the lowest average prices). California’s average is now above $4.5 per gallon (according to
    @AAAnews
    data) #OOTT

    Congratulations to those of you that voted for this. More poverty, more suffering. But no mean tweets.

    NJRob (eb56c3)

  75. All petroleum prices are on the rise — natural gas has doubled, propane is way up. This is a known effect of the futures market. When future supplies seem constrained (like when the government bans new fracking), people with active wells slow their production hoping for higher prices later. Similarly, when there is a relaxation, and the prospect is of future abundance, well owners ramp up production to sell before the price drops.

    It’s been seen time and again. Biden knows this — he WANTS fossil fuels to have high prices. It’s also why the Greens and the oil companies are in cahoots in California.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  76. https://therightscoop.com/hidden-video-from-murphy-campaign-reveals-nj-governor-will-mandate-vaccines-after-he-wins-election/

    If this type of fascism was so popular, he’d run on it instead of hiding it till after the election.

    NJRob (eb56c3)

  77. Yes Kevin they are drastically on the rise. It’s an intentional tax on the populace and living wage decrease forced upon us by leftists in government.

    NJRob (eb56c3)

  78. These days its not an accidental discharge, its a negligent discharge.
    Once the gun is in your hands, it doesn’t matter what anyone elase has said or done.
    Its your responsibility to check for yourself.
    Baldwin has been told that you are to treat the gun as if it is loaded regardless of what anyone says, so he’s negligent

    Plus the big question. Why would anyone point it at the Associate Producer? Sounds likea Baldwin style dick move
    No reason for that at all.

    steveg (e81d76)

  79. NJRob is on a thread hijacking roll.

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  80. #71 —

    @70 the thread is going around in circles

    let’s level set:

    vile nevertrumper commits manslaughter and it’s about how trumpers hurt your feelings

    Actually the post is about how Trumpers never let a good schadenfreude go to waste and Donald Jr. literally profiting on the misery of someone else.

    It’s not my favorite kind of Dana post because this seems to be a nearly daily event in Trumpworld and it gets a little monotonous to notice it.

    Appalled (1a17de)

  81. You admittedly did not say squat about the Kathy Griffin event (which was first posted on 5.31.17), until 6.2.17) – when it was by your own term then ‘low-hanging fruit’, as Griffin had then been largely condemned and the water was now safe for your belated post.

    Seriously? Doing a write-up a few days after an event occurred, and on a blog where I am not compensated, is an indicator that I was waiting until it was “safe”? You have got to be kidding. At any rate, I’m with Kevin M: where is your post on the subject?

    At any rate, direct any complaints to the boss: patterico@gmail.com.

    Dana (174549)

  82. @ Appalled,

    It’s not my favorite kind of Dana post because this seems to be a nearly daily event in Trumpworld and it gets a little monotonous to notice it.

    They’re not my favorite posts either. However, I think they’re important as the Republican Party seems set on backing Trump in 2024. They provide an insight into the GOP as they are yet more reminders of how Trumpism is today’s Republican Party. That impacts everyone who holds to a right-of-center view. IOW, collectively, these are all red flags, to one degree or another, and we are foolish people if we don’t acknowledge them and see them for what they are, and the potentially disastrous impact they have as they speak to the MAGA base and that base coalesces around Trump even more.

    Dana (174549)

  83. NJRob: “Congratulations to those of you that voted for this. More poverty, more suffering. But no mean tweets.”

    Isn’t demand for a lot of stuff going up as people have gotten vaccinated and there is more economic activity around the country and the world? Supply can’t meet demand and prices rise. The price of oil has gone way up…the price at the pump will track this. I wonder if Trump would have been able to mean-tweet basic economics away. But for some, everything is about the 2020 election and politics. Rob has not convinced me that Trump is any more ethical…any more knowledgeable….and more competent….by pointing out Biden’s bad policy, reasoning, or mental state. Talk about supply and demand, how about demanding that the GOP field better candidates that can start winning back the votes driven out by Trump? It makes me wonder if Rob (and mg) could even imagine a better candidate…

    AJ_Liberty (ec7f74)

  84. Donald Jr. literally profiting on the misery of someone else.

    He’s following the social media model for getting rich.

    Hoi Polloi (ade50d)

  85. 63.

    There’s this pastime that crew members sometimes do, it’s called ‘plinking,’ and they go out into the rural areas and they shoot at beer cans. This is with live ammunition. We learned that this happened the morning of the day that Halyna Hutchins was killed,” Waxman said

    And they undoubtedly did it without telling the person who was in charge of the guns, secretly “borrowing” it, and secretly returning it.

    The gun was probably last checked the previous night.

    Sammy Finkelman (c49738)

  86. Please cite actual historical examples within living memory, preferably by a prominent conservative doing something halfway as reckless with consequences half as terrible.

    I can think of one just as reckless with the same consequences, and the person skated:

    South Dakota Attorney General Avoids Jail Time for Fatal Crash

    Jason R. Ravnsborg, the South Dakota attorney general who struck and killed a man while driving home from a Republican Party dinner last year, pleaded no contest on Thursday to two misdemeanor charges he faced in connection with the case, his spokesman said on Thursday.

    A plea deal allowed Mr. Ravnsborg to avoid a trial that had been scheduled for Thursday. He was fined $500 for each of the two misdemeanors, plus court fees, and a third misdemeanor charge was dropped, according to the spokesman, Michael Deaver.

    Mr. Ravnsborg, a Republican, had been charged with careless driving, using a mobile electronic device while driving, and failing to stay in his lane on the night of the crash, which killed Joseph Boever, a 55-year-old pedestrian, on Sept. 12. The careless-driving charge was dropped.
    ……..
    In the first video, from Sept. 14, Mr. Ravnsborg told investigators that he had been driving home alone from a Republican Party dinner on the night of Sept. 12 and that after passing through the town of Highmore, he had accelerated to about 67 miles per hour on U.S. Highway 14.

    “And then, quite frankly, wham,” he said. “I hit, the incident happened. I never saw anything until the impact.” He said he had jumped out of the car and called 911. He then hung up, used his phone’s flashlight and looked around the highway and the ditch.

    “I am thinking it is a deer at this point, but I did not see anything,” he told two investigators during the interview, adding that he did not see blood or fur from the impact, just debris from his car.
    ……..
    When told by investigators in the first interview that they had found a broken pair of eyeglasses in his car, Mr. Ravnsborg could not say whether they belonged to him, even though he said he did not wear glasses.

    In the second interview, on Sept. 30, Mr. Ravnsborg was told that the eyeglasses belonged to Mr. Boever. “That means his face came through your windshield,” one of the investigators said.

    Mr. Ravnsborg maintained that he had not seen Mr. Boever that night.
    …….

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  87. 76. Kevin M (ab1c11) — 10/26/2021 @ 9:21 am

    . Biden knows this — he WANTS fossil fuels to have high prices.

    But not now, like St. Augustine.

    Although they say, he meant that as parody….. but he was describing what he thought in the past.

    https://faculty.georgetown.edu/jod/texts/sundayheraldreview.html

    Those words do appear – as da mihi castitatem et continentam, sed noli modo – in book eight, chapter seven of Augustine’s Confessions but, as O’Donnell explains, so expressed as to parody “his commonplace adolescent dithering between libido and restraint”. Not for nothing does O’Donnell preface one chapter with a passage from Mark Twain, who we sometimes like to pretend invented the unreliable narrator….

    Sammy Finkelman (c49738)

  88. AJ_Liberty (ec7f74) — 10/26/2021 @ 11:05 am

    The price of oil has gone way up…the price at the pump will track this. I wonder if Trump would have been able to mean-tweet basic economics away.

    Biden’s energy policy is worse than Trump’s. That’s not just basic supply and demand at work.

    Biden has intentionally hobbled our energy policy. His most recent response is that he could release some of the strategic reserve and it might drop prices. And he did a good cornholeio impression.

    frosty (f27e97)

  89. There were four people who could have checked the gun: The key grip, the armorer, the assistant director, and Alec Baldwin.

    And, of course, the people who took the gun(s) to play with, and put them back, without letting the armorer know….

    Sammy Finkelman (c49738)

  90. Sammy Finkelman (c49738) — 10/26/2021 @ 11:54 am

    And they undoubtedly did it without telling the person who was in charge of the guns, secretly “borrowing” it, and secretly returning it.

    The gun was probably last checked the previous night.

    Every time anyone picks up/is given/etc a gun they are responsible for checking whether it’s loaded. If you have a gun in your hand you are responsible for knowing whether it’s loaded. There are no exceptions. There are no excuses. If you haven’t checked you assume it’s loaded. It’s easy to check it.

    frosty (f27e97)

  91. Biden wants at least a basic agreement on the bills (that they will be set on the course to passage) by the end of this week, because he wants to be able to go to the summit in Glascow and to be able to announce there that the United States of America will cut carbon dioxide emissions by some incredible ercent by the year 2030 or 2035 or whatever, so that then, he thinks, he can get other countries to make the same commitment, because he knows it would be useless if the United States alone does it. Biden is really interested in the “climate” provisions of his Build Back Better bill.

    Of course, none of this makes any sens, even if you believe the climate models. They’ve picked an arbitrary amount to reduce carbon emissions by, which they didn’t get from any of their models.

    Reducing carbon emissions is a tired old idea, that slumbers underground during the years nothing happens, and you might be forgiven for thinking it is politically dead, but to use a phrase that Noam Chomsky coined;

    Colorless green ideas sleep furiously.

    Meanwhile the bill may pass, partially funded by an unconstitutional and unrealizable tax (forcing stock sales will reduce the price of Amazon and Tesla stock, and if it at all fair, the next year the Treasury would be writing billions dollar plus checks to Jeff Bezos and Elon Musk.)

    But all that counts is the CBO score the bill gets, and Joe Manchin’s and Kyrsten Sinema’s votes.

    chin;s and

    Sammy Finkelman (c49738)

  92. Aj,

    That’s the leftist spin on things, but it 8snt reality. Demand is not up. Supply is way down. But you can continue to promote the spin if you’d prefer.

    NJRob (435b38)

  93. Bring back the misery index.

    NJRob (435b38)

  94. 92. frosty (f27e97) — 10/26/2021 @ 12:19 pm

    Every time anyone picks up/is given/etc a gun they are responsible for checking whether it’s loaded. If you have a gun in your hand you are responsible for knowing whether it’s loaded. There are no exceptions. There are no excuses. If you haven’t checked you assume it’s loaded. It’s easy to check it.

    Now all they have to do is take fingerprints on the shell casing (r maybe DNA?) to find out put the bullet in the gun. But that may not be the person who returned the guns, and left a booby trap.

    It’s like digging a pit in a street and covering it up.

    Sammy Finkelman (c49738)

  95. Sammy Finkelman (c49738) — 10/26/2021 @ 12:35 pm

    Now all they have to do is take fingerprints on the shell casing

    I wondered about that too. It’d be interesting to see if they can do that.

    frosty (f27e97)

  96. Sammy Finkelman (c49738) — 10/26/2021 @ 12:35 pm

    It’s like digging a pit in a street and covering it up.

    But it’s not like digging a pit and covering it. There is no excuse for not knowing whether a gun you’ve got in your hand it loaded. If it’s possible, there is less than no excuse for pointing a gun at someone and pulling the trigger when you haven’t checked that it’s unloaded.

    frosty (f27e97)

  97. “There is no excuse for not knowing whether a gun you’ve got in your hand it loaded. If it’s possible, there is less than no excuse for pointing a gun at someone and pulling the trigger when you haven’t checked that it’s unloaded.”

    What if it’s a movie gun with bullets with the powder removed? I’m thinking specifically of the Brandon Lee incident, but I imagine that it’s fairly common to have real appearing bullets in the gun but they aren’t “live”, or aren’t supposed to be.

    Davethulhu (9ab4fa)

  98. @99 blank rounds don’t look like real bullets

    the gun used by baldwin was a revolver, making even easier to check

    https://www.quora.com/What-is-the-difference-between-blank-rounds-of-bullet-and-live-rounds

    JF (e1156d)

  99. Davethulhu (9ab4fa) — 10/26/2021 @ 1:37 pm

    What if it’s a movie gun with bullets with the powder removed? I’m thinking specifically of the Brandon Lee incident, but I imagine that it’s fairly common to have real appearing bullets in the gun but they aren’t “live”, or aren’t supposed to be.

    I’m not 100% on the Lee incident but my understanding is that a previous round was a hang-fire or squib round that got stuck in the barrel and wasn’t cleared. Then the load-out was changed to a round that had the ability to dislodge the stuck round as a fatal projectile. In that case I think the person using the weapon, both times, knew that the weapon was loaded. The negligence there was not clearing the stuck round and the question is what is reasonable for the various people who handled the weapon to have done based on what they knew or should have known. In that case it is easier to argue a mistake of fact. I’d want to know more details.

    I was taught to do several things when first taking a weapon and I was also taught to immediately clear any misfire, hang-fire, etc. I was never taught to look down the barrel of a gun to make sure it’s clear before using it except with a breech-loading shotgun and that’s the only time that’s really feasible. I personally wouldn’t leave a jammed weapon unattended because that is negligent by itself.

    frosty (f27e97)

  100. I still want to know why Balwin was pointing the gun at the lady.
    Was Baldwin trying to bully her?
    Maybe he was just waving it around with his finger on the trigger like an idiot, but bullying is also in his repertoire.
    NSFW Pulp Fiction accidental discharge
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9TdLrloGeXw

    steveg (e81d76)

  101. RIP Mort Sahl (94).

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  102. @101 from what I’ve gathered they were talking about a scene, he said something to the effect of “what about this”, and he moved through the scene. When he pulled the trigger I’m guessing he expected a click.

    At some point after that he’s supposed to have said “who gave me a cold gun”. If that’s true that tells me his state of mind. That’s why I’m saying manslaughter.

    frosty (f27e97)

  103. https://law.justia.com/codes/new-mexico/2016/chapter-30/article-2/section-30-2-3/B.

    Involuntary manslaughter consists of manslaughter committed in the commission of an unlawful act not amounting to felony, or in the commission of a lawful act which might produce death in an unlawful manner or without due caution and circumspection.

    https://law.justia.com/codes/new-mexico/2016/chapter-30/article-7/section-30-7-4/30-7-4.

    A. Negligent use of a deadly weapon consists of:
    (3) endangering the safety of another by handling or using a firearm or other deadly weapon in a negligent manner;

    nk (1d9030)

  104. The rules only apply one way. This weekend cartoonist Gary Truedeau mocked the death of several conservative radio hosts for dying from COVID, even though they opposed mandatory vaccination. But basic human decency only works one way. Nope, I’m done. They made the rules, now I get to play with them.

    coregis (638b71)

  105. #103
    My wife has an AR replica airsoft rifle that has a full auto setting so she can chase off crows.
    I’d never point it at a person even if I was acting. I would also never have my finger on the trigger during a “what about this” session. Its unnecessary and a very bad habit.
    I think it is very clear deep pockets Baldwin was comfortable slinging the gun around with his finger on the trigger and having his finger on the trigger during a demo scene is stupid and arrogant (I don’t need to follow basic safety rules, because I am the talent).

    I’m hoping Baldwin decides to fight in court rather than pay everyone off as long as they sign an NDA

    steveg (e81d76)

  106. @106 Don’t point a gun at something you don’t intent to destroy was a rule I learned at the same time as check that it’s loaded. Keep your finger off the trigger was as well.

    I’ve got no sympathy for Alec.

    I hope he has to fight this as a criminal issue and that’s something an NDA won’t help him with.

    frosty (f27e97)

  107. 106. steveg (e81d76) — 10/26/2021 @ 7:09 pm

    I think it is very clear deep pockets Baldwin was comfortable slinging the gun around with his finger on the trigger and having his finger on the trigger during a demo scene is stupid and arrogant (I don’t need to follow basic safety rules, because I am the talent).

    No, I don;t need to follow that rule of never pointing a gun at a person because this is a movie, and it would be impossible to shoot this scene, and practice for how to photograph it, if we didn’t point guns at people and fire them. Instead, we’ll use other rules, like having some protocols in place to prevent firing a real gun at someone.

    Sammy Finkelman (c49738)

  108. This “rule” of never pointing a gun at someone you don’t intend to shoot or justifiably threaten to, is not a legal requirement, I think. It’s a safety rule.

    Now there were three or four people who had an opportunity yo check to see if the gun was not loaded: the armorer, the key grip, the assistant director, and the actor. The actor (Alec Baldwin, who’s no gun expert) relied on what he was told by the assistant director, the assistant director probably relied on what he was tld by the key grip, the key grip relied on what he or she was told by the armorer, and the armorer probably relied on the fact that she’d checked all the guns maybe the previous night and they were where she left them..

    Sammy Finkelman (c49738)

  109. @108 and @109

    It’s an issue of the standard of care and negligence.

    A reasonable standard of care involves not pointing guns at people and pulling the trigger and checking whether the gun is loaded. This is basic firearms safety.

    If you are going to point a gun at people and pull the trigger you should be operating at a higher standard of care. Alec didn’t meet the normal standard and he certainly didn’t operate at the level he should have been.

    frosty (f27e97)

  110. I think Alec Baldwin didn’t understand what was necessary to make sure a gun is not loaded. He didn’t have a good natural sense of safety. He thought he could take care of it by asking someone. But there were too many people around.

    It’s like working with electricity. Before tampering with the wires, you need to make doubly sure the wires are not live. Most people don’t trust themselves to know what to do, though and leave that to a professional electrician or someone who’s done this kind of work before.

    A difference here between electricity and a gun is that, in the case of electricity, it’s usually the person who makes the decision it is OK – who touches the wires – who is the one who will get hurt if he;s wrong. his maybe tends to make people more careful.

    Sammy Finkelman (c49738)

  111. I think also it was maybe not necessary for that bit of practice for the director of photography to be positioned just where she was. She could have been some place, where, if by some law of Murphy, the gun was loaded, it wouldn’t hurt her.

    Sammy Finkelman (c49738)

  112. Sammy Finkelman (c49738) — 10/27/2021 @ 9:05 am

    I don’t understand your point Sammy.

    Just from what you’ve said I think there are a couple of people with civil liability and Baldwin is criminally liable.

    Are you saying something else?

    frosty (f27e97)

  113. I guess you missed the 10/24/2021 Doonesbury comic strip mocking the deaths of conservative radio hosts from COVID. But we’re supposed to play nice? I’m tired of two sets of rules in political (and social) engagement that demeans me for doing with regressives are already doing.

    coregis (638b71)

  114. The question is, how reasonable was it that Baldwin thought it was a prop gun? Second, why would an unsupervised “real” gun be placed on set? Are actors trained to first inspect a weapon….or is this the responsibility of the armourer….and the director/studio operator to ensure that everyone followed clear rules? Baldwin’s liability…in my opinion….depends on what rules were in place and what was a reasonable assumption. If there were only ever prop guns on set….and he was told it was a prop gun….and there was little expectation of there being a real gun…his liability would seem to be reduced. It will be more difficult to excuse the armourer (THIS is literally her job)….and the rules put in place by the studio (if there was a general cavalier attitude about discharging weapons). I’m no fan of Baldwin…he comes across as more than an a$$….but we shouldn’t assume conclusions

    AJ_Liberty (ec7f74)

  115. @115 no, that’s not the question

    prop guns can be lethal

    you don’t point a gun at others, even if it’s a prop gun

    “There’s basic safety measures on every set,” said Mike Tristano, an armourer who has worked with Alec Baldwin in the past.

    “You never point a gun, even if it is not a firing gun, at anyone else. I’m at a loss how this could have happened and how it could have done that much damage.”

    https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-59006905

    JF (e1156d)

  116. @115

    All people should be expected to check a weapon before pointing it at someone and pulling the trigger. This is a very reasonable standard. It is also a standard that is easy to meet. If Baldwin would have done that this person would still be alive.

    By his own prior statements Baldwin knows that guns are dangerous. He knows that he can kill someone if he points a loaded gun at someone and pulls the trigger. He knows or should know how to handle them safely if he is going to handle them. Isn’t an accidental killing the plot of the movie? Doesn’t the story involve killing people with guns?

    Baldwin is also the producer of the film. He knows or should have known what type of guns were on set. He knows or should have known the rules. He is part of the chain responsible for putting effective rules in place and making sure they are followed.

    There have been other allegations of the guns on set being a safety issue on earlier occasions. He knew or should have known about those safety issues if they existed.

    There’s no evidence that he was told it was a “prop gun”. He was told it was a “cold gun”. There is no evidence there is anything but real guns on set.

    What is the reasoning behind him not needing to check that the gun was loaded? It takes a couple of seconds. It’s easy. It’s a matter of life and death.

    frosty (f27e97)

  117. I have read more and I got some guesses about the details wrong, and some details aren’t being clearly talked about. All the usual protocols about guns weren’t followed. The armorer is supposed to personally hand over the gun to the talent, and not the assistant director, who is also the chief safety officer.

    When it is handed over, it is supposed to be checked in front of the actor, who should know what it is.

    The assistant director picked one of three guns to hand to Alec Baldwin so the armorer probably wasn’t even there.

    Against that, Alec Baldwin probably didn’t even know what the standard safety protocols used now in the movie industry were supposed to be, although he apparently hired people for all the standard safety jobs. They must have had a list.

    There are details about the guns and ammunition found by the search warrant. They are trying to determine all sorts of things.

    The gun is being called a prop gun. It was a genuine standard but antique gun that fit the time period of the movie. Hollywood is good (avoiding anachronisms) about pictures; not about characters, plot and dialogue.

    Sammy Finkelman (c49738)

  118. There should NEVER be a live round on set. Period. The lady was killed by a live round, not some sort of prop round. I agree that Baldwin should have clearly understood what would happen when he pulled that trigger…live round or not (or dummy cartridge)…but this is a question of law and most likely a prop round…or whatever Baldwin reasonably thought would discharge or wouldn’t discharge….would not have been lethal (the gun that killed Brandon Lee was supposed to have a deactivated cartridge but the primer was not de-activated). Obviously his jeopardy increases if he reasonably knew any sort of higher velocity projectile was coming out of that gun. The point is, what was the expectation? Was the expectation that this would be a cap gun that just made a sound or not? What can be proven.

    The armorer and prop master are responsible for the gun handoff…and the assistant director enforces safety rules. This asst director was known to be lax about safety rules. A live round being on set was gross negligence….there’s no excuse.

    AJ_Liberty (ec7f74)

  119. @119: “There should NEVER be a live round on set. Period.”

    You should NEVER point a gun at another person. Period.

    You should NEVER assume a gun in your hand is “cold” without checking it yourself. Period.

    the armourer, AD, producers and the shooter exhibited negligence and a lack of due caution and circumspection. See @104

    i really don’t understand this effort to absolve the shooter

    JF (e1156d)

  120. Alec Baldwin pointed the gun at the camera.

    But there were people in the line of fire behind the camera.

    Alec Baldwin thought he knew something he didn’t.

    JF (e1156d) — 10/27/2021 @ 12:12 pm

    i really don’t understand this effort to absolve the shooter

    Because it was clearly not intentional, or even intentionally careless.

    Sammy Finkelman (c49738)

  121. every effective safety protocol involves layers of safeguards, so that if one fails the others ensure a safe outcome

    those putting the blame on the armourer are expecting he/she to never make a mistake

    it appears she was negligent, but the other safeguards failed too

    the assistant director negligently didn’t confirm the gun was cold

    the shooter negligently didn’t check the gun, and negligently pointed the gun at others

    if any one of them exercises basic due diligence, the tragedy doesn’t happen

    JF (e1156d)

  122. @121 sammy, not checking the gun yourself and pointing the gun at others is intentionally careless

    probably every drunk driver never intended to mow their victims down

    so what?

    negligence has nothing to do with intent

    JF (e1156d)

  123. You should NEVER point a gun at another person. Period.

    The script called for the gun to be drawn and aimed at the camera. The victims were behind the camera. The rest of it is negligence, but Badwin was actually blameless on this part.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  124. Anyone who put a live round in a set gun is more than negligent. If the armorer allowed people to use the guns for target shooting, I’d call that “reckless disregard.” If someone put a live round in there intentionally, it’s a whole different matter.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  125. ABQ Journal story today:

    Affidavit: Gun not properly checked before fatal movie set shooting

    Assistant director David Halls and armorer Hannah Gutierrez had a ritual on the set of “Rust.” Halls told deputies he would check the gun barrel for obstructions, Gutierrez would spin the cylinder to check the revolver for ammunition and – if determined safe – he would say “cold gun on set.”

    But, during a rehearsal in an old church on Oct. 21, Halls couldn’t remember if Gutierrez spun the cylinder and said he didn’t check all the rounds inside the Colt .45 revolver before handing it to movie star Alec Baldwin, according to court documents. Halls told deputies, in hindsight, he should have checked.

    When Baldwin pulled the trigger, authorities say a lead projectile fired from the gun — killing cinematographer Halyna Hutchins and wounding director Joel Souza on the set at Bonanza Creek Ranch outside Santa Fe. Hall told deputies when he checked the gun after, he saw four “dummy” casings with a hole in the side and a fifth casing with no hole.

    “It was not a deliberate act,” Halls told deputies.

    Santa Fe County Sheriff Adan Mendoza said during a news conference Wednesday morning that investigators recovered the lead projectile from Souza’s shoulder and had found hundreds of rounds of ammunition at the set, including dummy rounds, blank rounds and “live rounds.”

    Mendoza said investigators suspect the round fired by Baldwin was a real one. Nobody has been charged in the incident.

    Search warrant

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  126. @124 blameless?

    i don’t believe carving out an actors’ exception to basic gun safety guidelines is a good idea

    i would expect anyone holding a gun, including actors, to recognize a dangerous situation regardless of what the script says

    otherwise, you’re removing necessary safeguards and asking for what happened

    JF (e1156d)

  127. JF @127

    i would expect anyone holding a gun, including actors, to recognize a dangerous situation regardless of what the script says

    I think the law depends on someone’s subjective frame of mind.

    It wasn’t the script – it was practicing cross draws – maybe to see how he could do it, and maybe for the camera. Alec Baldwin was rehearsing a scene in which he was pull a gun while sitting in a church pew. He was to point it at the camera.

    That rule is not the law, and he was relying on someone else in a business. He’s not alone, which is the situation for which that safety rule was created..

    They don’t quite trust the actor to check it himself anyway. I mean he could fire it while checking.

    The armorer is supposed to check it in front of the actor. The Wal Street Journal has two versions of how it is done.

    Chandler Cornblum, vice president of Movie Armaments Group based in Toronto, says they show the chamber, bore and magazine and the actor has to signal that they accept that the gun is empty. Only then do they hand him the gun.

    Another version: (from the same person)

    The armorer shines a flashlight into the gun barrel to show the actor that it is safe and what it is loaded with: Empty or blanks or dummy rounds. (I think the last two are different words for the same thing)

    Sammy Finkelman (02a146)

  128. Although people in charge were careless, somebody probably did something they weren’t supposed to do. I don;t think anybody was supposed to take the movie set’s guns and load it with their own bullets and stage acompetition in shooting beer cans. There was live ammo and blank rounds stored in the place where there had been target practce. That was probably not where the movie kept the guns.

    The interesting thing is this was the third time guns had been accidently fired on this movie set. Somebody had to know things were wrong.

    And the assistant director had been fired from a previous movie set in 2019 after another “unexpected” gun discharge.

    Some people quit or turned down the job because they were worried about safety. It was too slapdash.

    https://thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefing-room/news/578453-prop-master-says-he-turned-down-job-on-rust-because-it-was

    “I turned the job opportunity down on ‘Rust’ because I felt it was completely unsafe,” Zoromski told NBC News’s Miguel Almaguer.

    Zoromski said he became concerned when he first noted that producers of the film had combined the roles of assistant prop master and armorer, who manages firearms on set, into one position, NBC News reported.

    “I impressed upon them that there were great concerns about that, and they didn’t really respond to my concerns about that,” Zoromski said.

    Some crew members working on the film walked out earlier this month ahead of the fatal shooting, citing concerns for their safety and previous prop gun misfires.

    https://nypost.com/2021/10/26/veteran-prop-master-turned-down-rust-over-massive-red-flags/

    One of his key concerns had been that producers — who only had a budget of $7 million — refused his request to also hire both an assistant prop master and an armorer.

    Days after he turned down the job, Hannah Gutierrez Reed — a 24-year-old ex-model who’d only been armorer once before — announced she’d gotten the job as the “property key assistant/armorer,” the paper [The LA Times] said.

    Just months ago, she admitted she was scared of taking on such jobs because of her lack of experience.

    “You never have a prop assistant double as the armorer,” Zoromski said. “Those are two really big jobs.”

    Zoromski was also concerned that the prop master was being hired just two weeks before shooting started, robbing the key crew member of the months of prep time they usually get, he said.

    “In the movies, the prep is everything. … But here, there was absolutely no time to prepare, and that gave me a bad feeling,” he said.

    Sammy Finkelman (02a146)

  129. Blanks are cartridge cases with primer and powder but no bullet; dummy rounds have neither primer nor powder, only the external appearance of a cartridge, basically realistic toy “bullets” like kids have with their cowboy outfits.

    nk (1d9030)

  130. Dave Halls, the assistant director had pulled the gun off a rolling cart. It was one of three there. He’s now been fired This is apparently the persoon the script superviser complained about in a 911 call. He kept yelling about revisions – leaned over her desk.

    The people hired had also complained about long hours, wages, and the fact that they had been promised free lodging in Santa Fe but instead were given a place to stay in Albuquerque (50 miles away)

    Filming had began on October 6

    Sammy Finkelman (02a146)

  131. Whoever mixed live rounds with the props and whoever loaded a live round in the gun is guilty of murder.

    https://law.justia.com/codes/new-mexico/2016/chapter-30/article-2/section-30-2-1/
    A. Murder in the first degree is the killing of one human being by another without lawful justification or excuse, by any of the means with which death may be caused:

    (1) by any kind of willful, deliberate and premeditated killing;

    (2) in the commission of or attempt to commit any felony; or

    (3) by any act greatly dangerous to the lives of others, indicating a depraved mind regardless of human life.

    Whoever commits murder in the first degree is guilty of a capital felony.

    nk (1d9030)

  132. Find the person who brought the killing bullet on site.

    mg (8cbc69)

  133. Tit for tat is fair play. If you don’t hit back you’ll be abused over and over again.

    ingot9455 (b371f2)

  134. 153. The armorer says she has no idea where it came from,

    Which is consistent with them doing plinking behind her back.

    Sammy Finkelman (c49738)

  135. 128.

    The New York Post on Thursday had a different protocol of what was supposed to be.

    The armorer loads it and checks the gun barrel.

    When it is time to use the gun, the armorershows the gun to the assistant director and spins the barrel.

    The assistant director checks for any obstructions.

    If all is clear, he yells cold gun and hands it to thee actor.

    The asst dir said he could only remember seeing three rounds. (He didn’t check the whole barrel evidently)

    Sammy Finkelman (c49738)

  136. Whoever loaded it didn’t think he left a live round in a gun or thought it would surely be discovered.

    Sammy Finkelman (c49738)

  137. There are a number of people with civil liability. All of them should have attorneys telling them to check their insurance.

    Baldwin is criminally liable. There should be charges and he should have a criminal defense attorney preparing him for a guilty plea.

    frosty (f27e97)

  138. The odds of killing anyone were probably under 2%

    Is that murder?

    1. There might not be a bullet left in the gun.

    2. It might be discovered

    3. The gun might not be used

    4. The gun might not be aimed at someone when a bullet was fired (this hapened two times on the set)

    5. It might not kill or severely injure someone.

    Sammy Finkelman (c49738)

  139. It’s still an unlawful killing. It’s not premeditated 1st degree murder, but it isn’t “oops” either. Drunk driving doesn’t have a high probability of killing someone each and every time, but it happens and when it does it is at least manslaughter.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  140. Kevin M (ab1c11) — 10/29/2021 @ 3:03 pm.

    Drunk driving doesn’t have a high probability of killing someone each and every time, but it happens and when it does it is at least manslaughter.

    I don;t know. They usually require two separate acts of negligence to prosecute, even if it’s not legally required.

    The worst mistake was taking that gun secretly, using it, and putting it back. Especially after a gun had gone off two times before, which I read in a news story (no details) I don’t think there’s any way of finding out who exactly left that bullet in that gun. Of anyone knows, they’re not telling. And you could also blame anyone who kept the secret of the gun being borrowed” (unless this was known) and didn’t tell the armorer.

    Also Alec Baldwin because he could know that “Cold gun” wasn’t necessarily accurate.

    Sammy Finkelman (c49738)

  141. Hannah Gutierre had two jobs. That probably didn’t let her babysit the guns, at least noot after the day started. Now she’s blaming the producers for an unsafe set. (or rather, her lawyers are)

    https://www.yahoo.com/entertainment/rust-armorer-hannah-gutierrez-reed-breaks-silence-153507790.html

    “First, Hannah would like to extend her deepest and most sincere condolences to the family and friends of Halyna,” the statement from Gutierrez-Reed’s legal team began…

    ,,,The statement went on to “address some untruths that have been told to the media, which have falsely portrayed [and] slandered” Gutierrez-Reed.

    “Safety is Hannah’s number one priority on set,” the statement says. “Ultimately this set would never have been compromised if live ammo were not introduced. Hannah has no idea where the live rounds came from.”

    It continued, “Hannah and the prop master,” previously identified as Sarah Zachry, “gained control over the guns and [Gutierrez-Reed] never witnessed anyone shoot live rounds with these guns and nor would she permit that,” it said. “[The guns] were locked up every night and at lunch and there’s no way a single one of them was unaccounted for or being shot by crew members.”

    [But did anyone else have a key or know the combination?]

    Gutierrez-Reed seemingly confirmed reports there were two accidental discharges prior to Baldwin — who was rehearsing a scene with what he had been told was a “cold” gun — shooting Hutchins.

    “Hannah still, to this day, has never had an accidental discharge,” the statement said. “The first one on this set was the prop master and the second was a stunt man after Hannah informed him his gun was hot with blanks.”

    [The second one did not involve nt knowing what was in the gun, but what about the first?]

    Gutierrez-Reed claimed the independent film set was “unsafe,” but said it was not because of her.

    “Hannah was hired on two positions on this film, which made it extremely difficult to focus on her job as an armorer,” the statement said. “She fought for training, days to maintain weapons, and proper time to prepare for gunfire but ultimately was overruled by production and her department. The whole production set became unsafe due to various factors, including lack of safety meetings. This was not the fault of Hannah.”

    Gutierrez-Reed’s attorneys, Jason Bowles and Robert Gorence, “will address more of these rumors and the whole incident” next week.

    She was also careless. At her previous movie, in August, in Montana, which was her first, she got actor Nicholas Cage angry because she fired off a gun – twice – without announcing it. He screamed, using vulgarity, that it hurt his hearing. Then he found out it was her first job as armorer. I suppose she learned not to do that.

    I’m not sure much of that training she claimed was missing would be relevant to the question of this gun being loaded.

    There’s another thing, which may not be relevant. Her boyfriend had a DWI conviction and was required to only operate vehicles with a breathalyzer. Last November, they and a male friend of theirs was drinking at some event. She gave her boyfriend the keys to her motorcycle and the two men drove off aand their fiend got killed – that’s how we know about it.

    Sammy Finkelman (c49738)

  142. Updates:

    Alec Baldwin was even more careless than you might think. He was not about to test shoot a scene when he picked up that gun:

    https://nypost.com/2021/11/01/halnya-hutchins-last-words-revealed-after-being-shot-by-alec-baldwin

    A few moments earlier, Baldwin had been preparing for a shootout scene inside a church by making sure the camera crew got its angles right for the cross draw with the FD Pietta .45-caliber Colt revolver, the newspaper reported.

    “So, I guess I’m gonna take this out, pull it and go, ‘Bang!’” he said as he gripped the holstered handgun, which was supposed to be loaded with dummy rounds, according to the report.

    Instead, a live bullet flew out the barrel of the firearm, which the actor had been told was a “cold gun,” referring to a production term that means the weapon doesn’t contain live rounds and is safe for rehearsal, the LA Times said.

    The mortally wounded Hutchins stumbled backward and fell into the arms of the chief electrician on set as blood poured out of her chest. Meanwhile, director Joel Souza, who was reportedly struck by the same round, also dropped to the ground.

    “What the f— was that? That burns!” Souza yelled, the paper reported.

    Baldwin put the gun down on a pew and repeatedly said, “What the f— just happened?”

    “Medic!” someone shouted amid the pandemonium as crew members rushed to the stricken Hutchins. One of them, a boom operator, looked into her eyes and said, “Oh, that was no good,” the LA Times said.

    “No, that was no good. That was no good at all,” she replied.

    Within a few hours, she was pronounced dead.

    Baldwin just picked up the gun and pulled the trigger, unexpectedly. Halnya Hutchins had no chance to get out of the way, and if this hasd been prepared she might have gone off to a side, just as an extra precaution.

    Sammy Finkelman (02a146)

  143. Now the armorer may not have closely examined the buullets she put in the gun

    https://nypost.com/2021/11/03/hannah-gutierrez-reeds-attorney-suggests-rust-crew-sabotaged-set

    Hannah Gutierrez-Reed, 24, loaded the gun Baldwin used on the set of “Rust” from a box of ammo that should have been only dummy rounds, her attorney, Jason Bowles, told the “Today” show.

    “We know there was a live round in a box of dummy rounds that shouldn’t have been there — at least one live round,” said Bowles, a former federal prosecutor.

    “We’re assuming somebody put the live round in that box — which, if you think about that, the person who put the live round in the box of dummy rounds had to have the purpose of sabotaging the set,” he claimed in the sensational interview.

    “There’s no other reason that you would do that — that you would mix that live round in with a dummy round,” he said.

    I can think of a simpler reason.

    Just like they borrowed and returned the guns, they borrowed bullets. At fist thinking they were real, orgood enough to use to play at shooting beer cans.

    Then they put them back – but put at least one live round. The container probably was full so it had to be fillled up.

    I don’t know hwo they are going to find out who did it.

    It’ll have to come from a confession.

    It would take a Lt. Colombo to solve this mystery.

    Sammy Finkelman (02a146)


Powered by WordPress.

Page loaded in: 0.6152 secs.