Patterico's Pontifications

9/15/2021

The Must-Watched Cable News Anchor Has Issued This Correction Regarding the Vaccine and Swollen Testicles

Filed under: General — Patterico @ 8:29 am



In case you missed it, Tucker Carlson has issued this important correction:

Thank God the record has been set straight. But let this be a lesson to us all: we must all be more careful to check our facts. The rumor that Nicki Minaj’s cousin’s testicles were swollen by the vaccine traveled around the world many times, while the truth that her cousin’s friend’s testicles were swollen by the vaccine was still tying its shoelaces.

225 Responses to “The Must-Watched Cable News Anchor Has Issued This Correction Regarding the Vaccine and Swollen Testicles”

  1. You want to know what it takes to sell real estate? It takes vax-swollen balls to sell real estate.

    Patterico (e349ce)

  2. Norm MacDonald has passed. I need to do a proper post noting this tragedy. Hopefully I will have the time tonight.

    I wonder what Norm would have said about the vax-swollen balls of Nicki Minaj’s cousin’s friend. Now we’ll never know.

    Patterico (e349ce)

  3. You want to know what it takes to sell real estate? It takes vax-swollen balls to sell real estate.
    Patterico (e349ce) — 9/15/2021 @ 8:32 am

    Always be vaxxin’

    Hoi Polloi (2f1acd)

  4. It’s not the vaccine, Nicki, it’s the strange bedfellows. You and Carlson Tucker? Ew, girl! Grotty to the max!

    nk (1d9030)

  5. “Cracka gon make me go live”

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  6. Both Tucker C and Ted C have weird crushes/obsessions.

    urbanleftbehind (b7ca9d)

  7. A political party which in the last ten months traversed the gamut of “rigged election” to “the Covid vaccine causes swollen balls” has no right to exist.

    nk (1d9030)

  8. @2

    Norm MacDonald has passed. I need to do a proper post noting this tragedy. Hopefully I will have the time tonight.

    I wonder what Norm would have said about the vax-swollen balls of Nicki Minaj’s cousin’s friend. Now we’ll never know.

    Patterico (e349ce) — 9/15/2021 @ 8:34 am

    You’d know he’d jump on that subject with aplomb.

    The other thing that amazes me about Norm is that he died of a 9year cancer fight… and he didn’t publicized it. He never stuck me as a “woe is me” type of celebrity and those are getting rare.

    whembly (0ae2ca)

  9. Minaj will forever be known as the gal who “reported” on her cousin’s friend’s swollen gonies, but they’re nowhere near as large as Carlson’s swollen ego.

    Paul Montagu (5de684)

  10. A political party which in the last ten months traversed the gamut of “rigged election” to “the Covid vaccine causes swollen balls” has no right to exist.

    nk (1d9030) — 9/15/2021 @ 8:57 am

    I didn’t know Tucker Carlson officially spoke on behalf of the GOP. Has he been elected as a GOP party official and I missed it?

    But back to your point – Nicky Minaj is a Democrat. So why are you pinning her story in the Republican party?

    Hoi Polloi (2f1acd)

  11. Tucker Carlson Admits He Sometimes Lies On His Show
    …….
    The Fox News host admitted his relationship with the truth sometimes wavers as he was interviewed by fellow conservative media host Dave Rubin on Monday.

    It happened after Rubin asked Carlson how CNN employees like Chris Cuomo and Brian Stelter “live with themselves … when they just lie again and again and we have the internet to expose the lies.”

    Carlson seemed to take the question personally, to the point where he made this confession about his own relaxed relationship with factual accuracy.

    “I mean, I lie if I’m really cornered or something,” Carlson admitted. “I lie. I really try not to. I try never to lie on TV. I just don’t ― I don’t like lying. I certainly do it, you know, out of weakness or whatever.”
    ……..
    I’m shocked!

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  12. Michael Avenatti couldn’t be reached for comment…

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  13. But back to your point – Nicky Minaj is a Democrat. So why are you pinning her story in the Republican party?

    He’s aware that people NEVER associate testicles – swollen or otherwise – with the Democrat party.

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  14. Hoi Polloi, if you’re going to tell me that Carlson Tucker (sic) is not the foot valet of the GOP and he did not report on what Nicki Minaj said on his show, I’ll give it all due consideration. As for the lady being a Democrat, I figure that’s included in “strange bedfellows” (but it’s by no means all the strangeness).

    nk (1d9030)

  15. Tucker Carlson Admits He Sometimes Lies On His Show

    “Everyone Lies”

    –Gregory House, M.D.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  16. It must be the vax. It couldn’t possibly be all that fried chicken.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  17. I think we should start teaching logic and falacies (e.g. Post hoc) in 3rd grade, so that people like Mr Carlson have an opportunity to be exposed to them.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  18. The most popular conservative commentator on the most popular conservative network ran this in prime time. I really feel like reality has made my urinal cake joke seem too restrained. It’s amazing that a movement so focused on not being disrespected has this come from one of their leaders.

    Time123 (54e6d2)

  19. Now don’t anyone make fun of anti-Vaxers who are just worried their balls will swell up. Be respectful. Lmao

    Time123 (54e6d2)

  20. ice and elevation

    mg (8cbc69)

  21. I think it would be prudent for a male to check into claims that a vaccine might make the testicles swell up. The key though is in the marketing. Say that the vaccine enlarges testicles and infer that maybe other parts get bigger too and some of the vaccine reluctant might drop in for a free chance at enlargement.
    I realize some men will get multiple “booster” shots too but let them do it. We need the data

    steveg (2c7127)

  22. @19 get that squirrel, Time123!

    JF (e1156d)

  23. Kevin M (ab1c11) — 9/15/2021 @ 9:37 am

    It must be the vax. It couldn’t possibly be all that fried chicken.

    Fried chicken? How did fried chicken get into this? Oh, wait, I see now.

    frosty (f27e97)

  24. Nicky Minaj is a Democrat celebrity. Who cares? It’s just fodder (like the attention Matt Gaetz, MTG and Ted Cruz have paid to Britney Spears’ conservatorship) for our celebrity-obsessed culture. Tucker is using her celebrity to bolster his anti-vax campaign.

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  25. Least Trusted: Tucker Carlson – 21%

    Among television news viewers who said they defined themselves as Republicans, Tucker Carlson held the top spot as their favorite news anchor on TV. But when asking all respondents, Carlson did not receive as much praise. In fact, 21 percent of people said that they do not trust Carlson at all. Despite that low score, Carlson is enjoying some of the highest ratings on all of Fox News Channel. In the second quarter of 2020, 4.331 million viewers tuned in to see Carlson take on some of the most powerful politicians in the world.

    https://www.icepop.com/most-least-trusted-news-anchors-television/

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  26. Hoi Polloi, if you’re going to tell me that Carlson Tucker (sic) is not the foot valet of the GOP

    I’m not telling you anything. I’m asking if he’s an elected GOP politician or official. If he’s an unofficial mouthpiece of the GOP, taking their orders behind the scenes, I’d love to see the evidence.

    Hoi Polloi (2f1acd)

  27. @24 way to call out our host, Rip

    if you don’t like the post, you’re free to spam another blog

    JF (e1156d)

  28. @24 way to call out our host, Rip

    if you don’t like the post, you’re free to spam another blog

    I was quoting Hoi Polloi at #10. Our host didn’t mention party affiliation.

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  29. And I was commenting on Carlson’s fascination of whatever Nicki Minaj (a celebrity) said, which is completely unimportant (except for demonstrating what Carlson considers important).

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  30. JF (e1156d) — 9/15/2021 @ 2:00 pm

    Wait. This is a rare comment that isn’t a copy/paste of a chopped up clickbait article. Let’s not scare it away.

    frosty (f27e97)

  31. Quick… screenshot!

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  32. LOL!

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  33. My “clickbait articles” (otherwise known as news stories) are certainly more coherent than some of the freelancing posts here. And lot of them are far longer than anything I have posted.

    I won’t name names.

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  34. And a number of the freelancing posts are fact-free, without sources, so it’s like they were pulled out of someone’s whatever.

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  35. There was no call out to the host. To Carlson Tucker’s (sic) picayunishness, yeah!

    nk (1d9030)

  36. But we should thank JF for his concern. Thank you, JF!

    nk (1d9030)

  37. This clown makes a fortune off of clueless cable subscribers.

    mg (8cbc69)

  38. These Einstein’s behind the mike will look you in the eyes and tell you what you want to hear, just like Mcconnell and every other republican.

    mg (8cbc69)

  39. Genital elephantiasis can also be caused by bacterial sexually transmitted diseases, specifically lymphogranuloma venereum (LGV) and donovanosis. The bacterium that results in LGV, Chlamydia trachomatis serovar L1-L3, damages the lympathic system resulting in lymphatic obstruction in the genitals. Chronic obstruction eventually results in genital elephantiasis. Donovanosis is caused by the bacterium Calymmatobacterium (Klebsiella) granulomatosis. Donovanosis causes genital elephantiasis because the body’s immune system response to the bacterium causes inflammation and narrowing (constriction) of the lymphatic vessels.

    Strange bedfellows. Read the whole thing here. Why should you, you ask? Because one form of elephantiasis is caused by parasites and may be preventable with Ivermectin.

    nk (1d9030)

  40. Understand, we now have a former major party thoroughly in the control of a mob that gets its information from hucksters. Donald Trump and Larry Elder are the pinnacle of what we should expect.

    Even Nixon stands head and shoulders above the new GOP. I tell you it is time to start a new party, but I am a bit concerned that it will get hijacked too. Gresham’s Law applies to people, too.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  41. Kevin, the things you dislike are features to Maga base. They view loud noises as “fighting”, empty promises as a “leadership” and hypotheticals as “accomplishments”.

    Time123 (78eca7)

  42. Don’t listen to them Rip. You make some good points.

    Time123 (78eca7)

  43. OT-
    SpaceX’s Inspiration 4 has a successful launch.

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  44. Make sure you include the clip that has trans advocates saying ‘good riddance’ re Norm MacDonald.

    He said the term ‘cis-male’ was a way of marginalizing a normal person.

    https://youtu.be/BHxmMbeZlAM

    Obudman (90b76a)

  45. Congratulations to SpaceX Inspiration 4 and crew, for making use of the taxpayer funded and built LC 39A, where Apollo 11 was launched to the moon in 1969, now leased to you at NASAs Kennedy Space Center, for getting on orbit to spend three days going in circles, no place fast. Gemini 4 did that 56 years ago– w/a spacewalk, too.

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  46. @44. If only he’d been funny. But then, Lucy wasn’t funny either.

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  47. Kevin, the things you dislike are features to Maga base. They view loud noises as “fighting”, empty promises as a “leadership” and hypotheticals as “accomplishments”.

    Of course, the Democrats are little better, regarding investigations as “fighting”, press conferences as “leadership” and international conferences and communiques as “accomplishments.”

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  48. @44. But you know what is funny— OJ still lives.

    Comedy is not pretty. 😉

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  49. This clown makes a fortune off of clueless cable subscribers.

    Not to mention the Swanson TeeVee Dinner Salisbury Steak w/gooey gravy, warm peas, whipped mashed potatoes and apple cobbler!

    Yum! Tuck-er- in!

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  50. taxpayer funded and built LC 39A and rusting away like the rest of NASA.

    FIFY. SpaceX should have billed NASA for all the upgrades. Toured Johnson SFC a number of years back and the most memorable thing I saw were the star-shaped french fries in the “food” place. The tour guide never mentioned that they had an actual Saturn V to view up close. TBF, she may not have known what it was.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  51. NASA delenda est, and that comes from a JPL family member.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  52. Jim Breuer appeared on Carlson’s show this evening… a very funny man!

    The Minaj story was also talked about. I don’t see anything untoward being said, no disinformation being spread… just some valid points being made.

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  53. The moth joke… https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jJN9mBRX3uo

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  54. 52 “The Minaj story was also talked about. I don’t see anything untoward being said, no disinformation being spread… just some valid points being made.”

    If they wanted to address a ridiculous news story it would have been about Rolling Stone shooting itself in the face or the LA Times implying that Larry Elder had slapped a woman.

    And the guy who the Never-Trumpers voted for just referred to the Australian PM as ‘that guy down under’.

    Obudman (90b76a)

  55. Off topic, but important: Another one bites the dust.

    French President Emmanuel Macron said on Wednesday that French military forces had killed Islamic militant Adnan Abu Walid al-Sahrawi, the leader of Islamic State in the Greater Sahara.

    “It’s another major success in our fight against terrorist groups in the Sahel,” Macron said in a tweet, without disclosing the location of the operation.

    The French owed al-Sahrawi one: “Sahrawi personally ordered the killing of six French charity workers and their Nigerien driver”.

    As always, I hope they were able to collect intelligence information during the operation.

    Jim Miller (edcec1)

  56. If they wanted to address a ridiculous news story it would have been about Rolling Stone shooting itself in the face or the LA Times implying that Larry Elder had slapped a woman.

    Where’s the fun in that?

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  57. NASA delenda est, and that comes from a JPL family member.

    ROFLMAOPIP never bite the hand that feeds you: the ‘Jet Propulsion Laboratory’ was a DoD test bed; w/o NASA it was dead.

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  58. @50. TAXPAYERS financed SpaceX for the upgrades. FIFY.

    Your ignorance of how Musk operates through government financing is bliss. Stay happy.

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  59. BREAKING: LA County to issue new health order that will require proof of vaccination for all customers and employees in indoor bars, wineries, breweries, nightclubs, as well as for outdoor mega-events — including Dodgers, Rams and Chargers games.

    https://www.foxla.com/news/la-county-to-require-proof-of-vaccination-for-indoor-bars-nightclubs-outdoor-sports-games

    Segregation, you voted for it, you got it.

    Obudman (90b76a)

  60. @61. Strike the king and miss– expect retributions.

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  61. And the guy who the Never-Trumpers voted for just referred to the Australian PM as ‘that guy down under’.

    Hey, maybe trying to jam Trump down everyone’s throats was a bad idea. But, being insane, you guys will try it again, expecting different results.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  62. Your ignorance of how Musk operates through government financing is bliss. Stay happy.

    NASA couldn’t do it with 100 times the money. Still can’t.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  63. require proof of vaccination

    Also, indoor hospital beds.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  64. @64. Actually, Kevin, the four slices of spam in a can couldn’t have gotten off the ground w/o NASA; and are merely along for the ride in a capsule under complete ground control– just like Yuri Gagarin in 1961– comrade. Hopefully they’ll have better luck getting back than Laika- or Komarov did. Unless the power gets cut in Hawthorne, California.

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  65. Of course, the Democrats are little better, regarding investigations as “fighting”, press conferences as “leadership” and international conferences and communiques as “accomplishments.”

    Kevin M (ab1c11) — 9/15/2021 @ 5:37 pm

    Kevin, if have gone with writing on dresses as “leadership”. Keep it topical.

    Time123 (78eca7)

  66. OT: I made an interesting choice of switching ON Hannity last night (yeah yeah, I know, what was I thinking…)….as I was curious about what constituted “news” these days. The monologue focused on General Milley and the Woodward book claims about calls to the Chinese. Rather than pose serious questions as to why the Chairman of the Joint Chiefs would fear that the President would make an pre-emptive military strike on China or why he would be concerned about unchecked control of the nuclear arsenal….Hannity prattled on about Milley giving the “enemy” heads up about the attack….and communicating classified information…..as if a sneak attack on China is simply up to the discretion of the President. I mean Hannity is a Trump puppet…all in….but this was simply mind-numbingly stupid. Milley called his Chinese counterpart two days after the Capitol siege….to assuage fears of a wag-the-dog moment or that a right-wing coup was in the making. Reasonable or treacherous? Hannity is unsure.

    OK, I lasted the 10minutes before heading over to the DVR to find something that didn’t hurt my brain. Now there are millions of people out there fully misled about the seriousness of a potential unprovoked attack on a nuclear super-power. I used to think that maybe….just maybe….FNC was recoverable….redeemable…..but this was embarrassing….and the network needs a full reboot. Not only is it foolish analysis…but it’s dangerous and has to stop. We get January 6th’s because of silliness like this…..and guys like Hannity have got to go…..

    AJ_Liberty (a4ff25)

  67. The Tater Principle.

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  68. The Joint Chiefs of Staff have no operational authority. They’re outside the chain of command, mere consiglieri de la familia to the President and his Caporegime of Defense. If I know that, the Chinese know that. So this was more along the lines of giving away family secrets than any kind of promise the Chinese could count on.

    Trump appointed this righteous bushwacker on October 1, 2019, it’s a four-year term, and Biden is stuck with him for another two years.

    nk (1d9030)

  69. PS But as long as we’re talking about how he gossiped about Trump to the Chinese, we’re not talking about how McKenzie killed seven kids for Biden.

    nk (1d9030)

  70. Biden could fire him. But some of the reporting on Miley has been that it was a large call with multiple agencies and the details were briefed out after the fact to keep everyone aligned.

    If I only get my news from Trump’s press releases I know
    1. He had no plan to attack China.
    2. China knew he wasn’t going to attack them.
    3. Miley told China trump wasn’t going to attack them.
    4. Miley assured Chinese military officials that he would personally let them know if that changed. (An assurance with the paper it’s written on)

    From Trump’s summation it sounds like Miley was reinforcing Trump’s communicated intention to not attack China. This supporting message was probably necessary because Trump was an erratic nut job who was under pressure because some of his supporters had violently attacked the US capital in an effort to prevent the peaceful transfer of power to the winner of the 2020 election.

    Time123 (8d5347)

  71. AJ_Liberty (a4ff25) — 9/16/2021 @ 4:48 am

    You know there was no potential unprovoked attack and no unchecked control of the nuclear arsenal? This was no more likely than a leprechaun showing up at the White House and turning over his pot of gold for the national debt.

    frosty (f27e97)

  72. Along these same lines, I’m inclined to believe Trump and not Milley that Trump did not ask Milley to lead a military coup for him. The only troops Milley could command would be his secretary and his driver and I’m not even sure about them. Now, Christopher Miller, the acting Secretary of Defense, he would have been a horse of a different color.

    nk (1d9030)

  73. NK, why would you assume Trump knows that?

    Time123 (8d5347)

  74. milley should’ve put a call in to that aid worker and his family before he lit them up to save biden’s azz

    not surprising there are commenters here who think he’s level headed and anyone questioning that hurts their brain

    JF (e1156d)

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    zacharyif16 (14918b)

  76. Clean up on aisle 77 please.

    felipe at a different terminal (084d77)

  77. This talk of testicles and tying shoelaces is making me think Carlson must have a very weird way of putting on shoes.

    john (cd2753)

  78. JF (e1156d) — 9/16/2021 @ 7:09 am

    Even if someone accepts the idea that the US executive branch and military chain of command was so screwed up that a random attack was a thing how is telling the Chinese that responsible in any way. Follow up question, did Milley do anything to fix the problem other than call the Chinese?

    This is the plot of a Jack Ryan novel but even in the novel this was in response to a nuke going off at the Super Bowl.

    frosty (f27e97)

  79. Milley issues a carefully worded non-denial denial through a spokeshole.

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  80. Fruit Salad Milley

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  81. @80 if milley tacked on a request to his chinese counterpart to help quell the capitol rioters i think the same commenters would be down with it

    JF (e1156d)

  82. Frosty, stipulating your premise the thought would be that Miley and the others on the call used their credibility to help convince the Chinese that no such action was imminent. Since Trump said he wasn’t planning such an attack and the Chinese knew that they were reinforcing the official and communicated US strategy.

    Time123 (8d5347)

  83. You know there was no potential unprovoked attack and no unchecked control of the nuclear arsenal?

    Not according to the intelligence they were hearing from the ChiComs. Hence the calls. It’s not “treason” to tell your geostrategic adversary that we don’t intend to launch a first strike.

    Paul Montagu (5de684)

  84. Paul, Mostly true, could be treason if there was a plan to use the threat such an attack in some way. But Trump has stated he wasn’t planning to launch a sneak attack and that the Chinese knew that.

    Time123 (8d5347)

  85. Meanwhile, there are thousands – 3000 or so – Americans sitting in Afghanistan who were told fairly early on by the State Dept. (another revelation out in the last 48 hours) that they are on their own if they want out of Afghanistan.

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  86. ‘Former acting Secretary of Defense Christopher Miller, who led the Pentagon from the period after the 2020 election through Inauguration Day, said that he “did not and would not ever authorize” Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff Gen. Mark Milley to have “secret” calls with his Chinese counterpart, describing the allegations as a “disgraceful and unprecedented act of insubordination,” and calling on him to resign “immediately.”

    In a statement to Fox News, Miller said that the United States Armed Forces, from its inception, has “operated under the inviolable principle of civilian control of the military.”

    “The Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff is the highest-ranking military officer whose sole role is providing military-specific advice to the president, and by law is prohibited from exercising executive authority to command forces,” Miller said. “The chain of command runs from the President to the Secretary of Defense, not through the Chairman.”

    “If the reporting in Woodward’s book is accurate, it represents a disgraceful and unprecedented act of insubordination by the Nation’s top military officer,” Miller said, adding that if the story of Milley’s “histrionic outbursts and unsanctioned, anti-Constitutional involvement in foreign policy prove true, he must resign immediately or be fired by the Secretary of Defense to guarantee the sanctity of the officer corps.”

    “Pursuit of partisan politics and individual self-interests are a violation of an officer’s sacred duty and have no place in the United States military,” Miller said, adding that “a lesser ranking officer accused of such behavior would immediately be relieved of duty pending a thorough and independent investigation.”

    “As secretary of defense, I did not and would not ever authorize such conduct,” Miller said.’

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  87. “What if the roles of Milley and Gen. Li Zuocheng of the Chinese military were reversed? That is, imagine the outcome if Li called Milley without telling Xi Jinping, and then Xi found out? Li would never be heard from again because the Chinese take these security issues seriously.”

    —- R.C.Belaire

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  88. CH, Why do you object to the Head of the joint chiefs reinforcing the President’s publicly stated and already communicated policy to a strategic adversary?

    Time123 (8d5347)

  89. @90 this is a joke, but plausible that you’re actually serious

    that should worry you, but probably doesn’t

    JF (e1156d)

  90. As Chairman of the JCoS, Milley’s job was to advise the President on military matters. Milley was not authorized to execute policy or command.

    If Milley believed the ChiComs were getting nervous and therefore possibly trigger-happy, his job was to so advise the President and recommend what should be done. It was NOT Milley’s job to relieve the ChiComs of whatever distress they supposedly felt. That’s the President’s call to make.

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  91. Paul Montagu (5de684) — 9/16/2021 @ 8:15 am

    Not according to the intelligence they were hearing from the ChiComs. Hence the calls. It’s not “treason” to tell your geostrategic adversary that we don’t intend to launch a first strike.

    According to this version of events, the CCP called up Milley and said we think you’re going to attack us please make us feel better about the situation or we will attack you?

    Can anyone point to any actual “intelligence” of any sort of kinetic operations afoot that doesn’t involve “BuT tRuMp” fever dreams?

    frosty (f27e97)

  92. “”BREAKING: Our drone is back over the international bridge in Del Rio, TX. Per source, the number of migrants waiting to be processed has now swelled to approx 8,200. It was 4,000 yesterday AM. Doubled in one day. BP overwhelmed, & I’m told situation is “out of control””

    A recent post suggested the Capitol Police will be ‘better prepared’ to control insurrectionists.

    Maybe they could give the BP a few pointers.

    https://www.foxnews.com/politics/texas-bridge-migrant-numbers-double-out-of-control

    Obudman (90b76a)

  93. JF (e1156d) — 9/16/2021 @ 8:52 am

    I’m curious how people can see anything remotely Russian as evidence of collusion but think keeping the Chinese happy and updated on US strategic thinking is patriotism.

    Remember when trying to deescalate with NK was adoration of dictators? Anyone noticed there are indications of new activity at Yongbyon?

    frosty (f27e97)

  94. @68. OT: I made an interesting choice of switching ON Hannity last night (yeah yeah, I know, what was I thinking…)….as I was curious about what constituted “news” these days… Not only is it foolish analysis…but it’s dangerous and has to stop. We get January 6th’s because of silliness like this…..and guys like Hannity have got to go…..

    ‘Hannity’ is an opinionator and acknowledges his ‘conservative’ POV right up front; he is not a news source. The silliness is believing an opinion program as a news source to begin with. ‘And that’s the way it is, Tuesday, September 16, 2021… ;-)’

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  95. Mark Milley’s crisis
    …….
    In mid-October 2020, top Pentagon officials grew concerned about intelligence they’d seen. It showed the Chinese were consuming their own intelligence that had made them concerned about the possibility of a surprise U.S. strike against China, three sources familiar with the situation tell Axios.

    One of the sources said: “I think they [the Chinese] were getting bad intelligence… a combination of ‘wag the dog’ conspiracy thinking and bad intel from bad sources.”

    Then-Defense Secretary Mark Esper worried the Chinese were misreading the situation and that their misperception could lead to a conflict nobody wanted.

    Esper directed his policy office to issue a backchannel message to the Chinese to reassure them the U.S. had no intention of seeking a military confrontation. The message: Don’t over-read what you’re seeing in Washington; we have no intention to attack; and let’s keep lines of communication open.

    These backchannel communications were handled a couple of levels below Esper, one of the sources said. U.S. officials involved thought the Chinese received the initial message well. Milley followed up later in the month with a call to his Chinese counterpart to reiterate the message, two of the sources confirmed.

    It’s unclear whether anyone at the Pentagon told President Trump or the White House what they were doing.
    …….
    One source familiar with Milley’s conversations with his Chinese counterpart would only broadly characterize them as Milley saying something to the effect of: “We’ll both know if we’re going to war… there’s not gonna be some surprise attack and there’s no reason for you to do a pre-emptive strike.”
    ……

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  96. “If we’re going to attack, I’m going to call you ahead of time. It’s not going to be a surprise.”

    i wonder if that’s how the 13 marines died

    a phone call giving a heads up to our taliban friends

    any american combatant in an attack on the chinese or any adversary would be smart to mull it over

    JF (e1156d)

  97. According to this version of events, the CCP called up Milley and said we think you’re going to attack us please make us feel better about the situation or we will attack you?

    Um, no.
    The CCP didn’t call Milley, per Axios.

    In mid-October 2020, top Pentagon officials grew concerned about intelligence they’d seen. It showed the Chinese were consuming their own intelligence that had made them concerned about the possibility of a surprise U.S. strike against China, three sources familiar with the situation tell Axios.

    • One of the sources said: “I think they [the Chinese] were getting bad intelligence… a combination of ‘wag the dog’ conspiracy thinking and bad intel from bad sources.”

    Then-Defense Secretary Mark Esper worried the Chinese were misreading the situation and that their misperception could lead to a conflict nobody wanted.

    • Esper directed his policy office to issue a backchannel message to the Chinese to reassure them the U.S. had no intention of seeking a military confrontation. The message: Don’t over-read what you’re seeing in Washington; we have no intention to attack; and let’s keep lines of communication open.

    Do you have another “version of events”? As for your second question, I don’t have the security clearance to know what the actual intel was, and wouldn’t tell you if I did.
    This is not the first time an authoritarian communist regime operated in an echo chamber and got paranoid about a nuclear strike. A similar thing happened during the Reagan era, and it started a backchannel communications effort that Milley became a part of.

    Paul Montagu (5de684)

  98. It would be good if some of dis “stray voltage” could be harnessed and applied to some of the hebetudinous commenters here, much as is done with minks.

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  99. @97 the left has found a narrative

    JF (e1156d)

  100. Milley was not authorized to execute policy or command.

    He was authorized to contact the ChiComs by the SecDefs.

    Paul Montagu (5de684)

  101. Milley’s office defends call with Chinese official against Trump’s ‘treason’ allegations
    ………
    In a statement Wednesday, Joint Staff spokesperson Col. Dave Butler suggested that there had been nothing improper about Milley’s actions.

    “General Milley continues to act and advise within his authority in the lawful tradition of civilian control of the military and his oath to the Constitution,” Butler said.

    He said the chairman “regularly communicates” with his counterparts around the world, “including with China and Russia. These conversations remain vital to improving mutual understanding of U.S. national security interests, reducing tensions, providing clarity and avoiding unintended consequences or conflict.”

    “His calls with the Chinese and others in October and January were in keeping with these duties and responsibilities conveying reassurance in order to maintain strategic stability,” Butler said, adding that the “meeting regarding nuclear weapons protocols was to remind uniformed leaders in the Pentagon of the long-established and robust procedures in light of media reporting on the subject.”
    …….
    I’m surprised everyone believes what Bob Woodward says as if it is the unvarnished truth.

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  102. There’s a hold-up with the shots;
    Kabul’s ended freedom flights;
    There’s a border glut in Texas;
    That’s backed up all crossing sites;
    Hunter’s hooker dropped a child;
    His laptop videos are wild;
    Joseph Robinette Biden where are you?

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  103. milley should resign, and a court martial should follow

    that’s for afghanistan

    but we’re not even talking about afghanistan

    the left just loves this guy

    JF (e1156d)

  104. Wo ist mein treuer Heinrich? This was a Trump appointee, under Trump’s watch, let’s not forget.

    The Officer Corps! Bah! They go to the academies where they learn to salute and use a knife and fork but they still need to count “left, right, left, right …” to themselves to walk across a room. We give them trillions of dollars’ worth of high-tech weapons when they could not learn to operate the French-fry fryer at a McDonald’s. I never went to the academy, but I know how to make French fries.

    nk (1d9030)

  105. The U.S. military has been seriously debased by this group of sh*t weasel leaders.

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  106. The U.S. military has been seriously debased by this group of sh*t weasel leaders.

    Welcome to 1968.

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  107. Who do you think AOC is going to nominate to the military academy?
    Tlaib? Omar? Bernie Sanders?

    steveg (b86430)

  108. None of the above. Given her politics, she will probably not nominate anyone.

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  109. 104… oooh! oooh!

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  110. As usual the outrage from CH, JF and Frosty depends on ignoring contradictory information and dismissing alternative explanations as a “narrative”.

    Time123 (8d5347)

  111. But, unless the Biden Junta is setting Thoroughly Discredited Milley up for a fall, of course he’ll hang on to his job… and why wouldn’t he. To hear some of these Lefty Leaning Right (snort!) commenters, the man saved us from nuclear war with the ChiComs and was in charge of the smoothest withdrawal/evacuation evah!

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  112. Milley’s office defends call with Chinese official against Trump’s ‘treason’ allegations

    Yet another instance where Trump distracts everyone from his own side’s message.

    #self-squirrel

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  113. 112… for those following with a scorecard, ignoring and dismissing bullsh*t is a more honest description.

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  114. I hear two things here.

    1. Esper was worried about what the Chicoms were telling themselves and sought to alter their narrative. He had some officials under him make contacts and reassure the Chinese.

    2. Independent of this, Milley — fearing for the sanity of a president he didn’t much care for — did not go to Esper with his concerns, or even discuss this with Trump. Instead, he called the service cheifs in to lecture them on chain-of-command; this was odd since Milley was not in that chain-of-command. He then took it upon himself to make contact with the Chinese military boss to advise him that no plans to attack were in place and that he [Milley] would advise the Chinese if such plans surfaced.

    There is no issue with what Esper did. Milley lecturing the service chiefs was pompous and partisan, but it didn’t amount to anything more than a self-clowning. Maybe even the call to the Chinese general could be defended, up to a point.

    But the charge that he told the Chinese that he would warn them if an attack was pending was flat-out treason, or at least a promise of treason. And for that, Milley needs to resign, be fired, or be charged with a crime.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  115. OK, maybe not technially “treason”, but something pretty damn close.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  116. @112 assuming all aspects of the contradictory narrative are true, this justifies giving a direct adversary a heads up of a surprise attack

    this is what you believe, without embarrassment

    JF (e1156d)

  117. =ring-ring= ‘Hello, Erwin? It’s Dwight. Just a head’s up to let you know we’ll be attacking Normandy on the 5th or 6th– depending on the weather… No, Calais is a gotcha… oh, probably around dawn most likely… Don’t worry, enjoy your wife’s birthday– best to her… Kay and Mamie send their love, too… bye!’ =click=

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  118. Paul Montagu (5de684) — 9/16/2021 @ 9:43 am

    Do you have another “version of events”?

    Nope, I’m asking you what yours is. I don’t see a substantial difference between how I described your version and the version you cited from Axios as your version. Except that you’re confident “intelligence they’d seen” didn’t involve a call and you want to make that very clear.

    As for your second question, I don’t have the security clearance to know what the actual intel was, and wouldn’t tell you if I did.

    Whew! I hate for someone to have to kill me if you did.

    frosty (f27e97)

  119. 18 Wheeler Joe hasn’t mention Afghanistan in 2 weeks…

    There’ are 13 reasons why. He’s droning on about more taxes now—this from an old Irish fart who, amidst a windstorm, abandoned taxpayers and $85 billion worth of equipment to an enemy.

    Storm the castle.

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  120. “Pay your fair share.” – Squinty McStumblebum

    So you can abandon $85 billion worth of weapons and another $64 million in aid to the Taliban?

    Joe! That’s Reaganomics!

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  121. “Where is it written that all the tax breaks go to the top?”- Squinty McStumblebum

    In the tax code.

    IDIOT.

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  122. Again, I am surprised everyone assumes that Woodward and Costa’s account is accurate. Why?

    It should be an interesting September 28th.

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  123. “I’m trying to preserve an economy that hasn’t worked very well for Americans for a long time.” – Squinty McStumblebum

    Huh?

    Idiot.

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  124. Time123 (8d5347) — 9/16/2021 @ 10:25 am

    As usual the outrage from CH, JF and Frosty depends on ignoring contradictory information and dismissing alternative explanations as a “narrative”.

    I’m not ignoring alternative explanations. Either it happened or it didn’t. If we find out it didn’t then all the better. But this

    Milley, Fearful of Trump’s Rhetoric, Called China to Promise US Wouldn’t Strike

    is seems like a plausible headline to work from. Yes, I’ve got an issue with “Fearful of Rhetoric” and “Called China to Promise US Wouldn’t Strike”.

    Here are some other items I have an issue with:

    Milley, according to the book, called the admiral overseeing the U.S. Indo-Pacific Command, the military unit responsible for Asia and the Pacific region, and recommended postponing upcoming military exercises.

    and

    He also asked senior officers to swear an “oath” that Milley had to be involved if Trump gave an order to launch nuclear weapons, according to the book.

    Let that last one sink in for a bit and then get back with me on who’s “ignoring contradictory information”.

    It should tell you something that Kevin M and I both have issues with promising to let the Chinese know about future kinetic attacks. You understand that this isn’t about nuclear attacks right? The reference to kinetic operations is double-speak for anything dangerous that might result in people getting killed.

    frosty (f27e97)

  125. @124 are woodward and costa saying something embarrassing happened in afghanistan under milley’s command and you don’t believe it?

    and who do you think will be tossing milley beachball lobs at his hearing?

    JF (e1156d)

  126. Speaking of swollen testicles, Vice President Kamala Harris Emhoff tweeted:

    Our Administration will always fight to defend the right of women to make decisions about their own bodies. It is non-negotiable.

    A screen capture is included in this tweet, in case she deletes it.

    If women have a right to take decisions about heir own bodies, wouldn’t that include any cockamamie vaccine mandate?

    The libertarian, but not Libertarian, Dana (fed7b0)

  127. But the charge that he told the Chinese that he would warn them if an attack was pending was flat-out treason, or at least a promise of treason. And for that, Milley needs to resign, be fired, or be charged with a crime.

    Kevin, What he told the Chinese was in line with Trumps stated policy that Trump assures us had already been communicated to Chinese leadership. How is that criminal? Promising to give them a heads up before an attack would be Treason only if he actually did so.

    Time123 (acc2eb)

  128. I don’t see a substantial difference between how I described your version and the version you cited from Axios as your version.

    You said the “CCP called up Milley”. That wasn’t what Axios reported, hence my question to you about “your version”.

    Paul Montagu (5de684)

  129. @124 are woodward and costa saying something embarrassing happened in afghanistan under milley’s command and you don’t believe it?

    I don’t believe much of what Woodward says. Like his visit to Bill Casey’s hospital bed. If he has recordings corroborating Milley’s words (like he had of Trump for “Rage”), he should release them.

    and who do you think will be tossing milley beachball lobs at his hearing?

    The outrage on Capitol Hill is pretty bipartisan over the Afghanistan debacle (I can’t think of any one who has endorsed the Administration’s withdrawal strategy), and Republicans will certainly go after Milley over the “Peril” quotes, so I don’t think there will be many lobs.

    But we shall see.

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  130. Rip Murdock (d2a2a8) — 9/16/2021 @ 11:22 am

    Again, I am surprised everyone assumes that Woodward and Costa’s account is accurate. Why?

    Sounds like the narrative, she is a-changing.

    Does anyone else think this was supposed to be a “Milley was one of the adults in the room that saved us from Trump” story and was trying to shore up the “Don’t worry about Biden being senile we’ve got adults in the room” story?

    It’s a good thing the whole deep-state thing is just a conspiracy theory.

    frosty (f27e97)

  131. Again, I am surprised everyone assumes that Woodward and Costa’s account is accurate. Why?

    LOL ‘Follow the money.’ 😉 As all bookpeddlers say.

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  132. Again, my apologies for an off-topic comment. But the news is even better than I said in my earlier comment.

    Special forces hit positions based on information from two captured Islamic State members close to Sahrawi. Drones and fighter jets killed about a dozen militants, while 20 soldiers stormed a hideout in a forest near the border, said Gen. Thierry Burkhard, the French army’s chief of staff.

    A chain-of-command diagram behind Burkhard shows five top ISIS leaders killed, two captured. And the chances are good that the hideout had information that might lead to other successes.

    This terrorist group has killed “around 2,000 to 3,000 civilians”, most of them Muslim — and, in 2017, four US soldiers.

    Jim Miller (edcec1)

  133. Paul Montagu (5de684) — 9/16/2021 @ 12:03 pm

    You said the “CCP called up Milley”. That wasn’t what Axios reported, hence my question to you about “your version”.

    My version is simply based on the quotes here and the few articles I’ve read. I linked an example above that used the phrase “Milley Called China” as opposed to your phrase “they were hearing from the ChiComs”.

    So, back to my original question that I will try to rephrase. Do you think Milley was responding to China’s fears but was not himself concerned, i.e. the primary “fear” was China’s? This seems at odds with the reporting, other than this Axios article.

    If the worry was China’s “fears” do you have any thoughts about calling up U.S. Indo-Pacific Command and asking them to not conduct exercises because of what “they were hearing from the ChiComs”? What about those oaths? Were those part of promises to China?

    frosty (f27e97)

  134. 135 has a flowchart that is worth your time!

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  135. You know there was no potential unprovoked attack and no unchecked control of the nuclear arsenal?

    Not according to the intelligence they were hearing from the ChiComs. Hence the calls. It’s not “treason” to tell your geostrategic adversary that we don’t intend to launch a first strike.

    Paul Montagu (5de684) — 9/16/2021 @ 8:15 am

    Back to the original question; do you think there was a potential for the US to attack China as some ploy by Trump to stay in power? Do you think the nuclear arsenal was “unchecked”?

    It’s a little hard to unwind this because it sounds like you’re saying the Chinese were feeding Milley reliable intelligence that the US was going to attack and it caused Milley to make them promises.

    frosty (f27e97)

  136. “no plans to attack were in place and that he [Milley] would advise the Chinese if such plans surfaced”

    I think interpreting that as treasonous is bizarre to me. He’s not telling him, I will phone you and notify you of an attack. That’s silly. He’s saying that world conditions will clearly indicate when an attack might be forthcoming. That is, it will be obvious when diplomatic relations have degraded to the point where war was possible.

    But this situation is exactly why Trump should not be in the Oval Office (ever again). His ham-fisted undisciplined language is not always accompanied by a Trump-decoder ring. And when he issues hyperbolic statements about elections being stolen…..and pressuring his own VP to not certify an election…that people can misinterpret messages. One has to wonder what else Milley might have been privy to where he was so concerned about Trump’s willingness to escalate actions? Is it possible that Milley over-reacted? Sure, but it’s all possible that he was privy to some spit-balling from Trump and/or his advisers about possible military operations. One big candidate that he was reported to be especially intrigued by was attacking Iran. Not an immediate nuclear threat, has some plausible rationale, and creates the chaos that might rationalize delaying a transition of power. But this is the danger….having a Presidency even contemplating wagging the dog. The usual suspects yawn….

    AJ_Liberty (ec7f74)

  137. Frosty, the answer to your question in 139 is in Paul’s comment. See below.

    According to this version of events, the CCP called up Milley and said we think you’re going to attack us please make us feel better about the situation or we will attack you?

    Um, no.
    The CCP didn’t call Milley, per Axios.

    In mid-October 2020, top Pentagon officials grew concerned about intelligence they’d seen. It showed the Chinese were consuming their own intelligence that had made them concerned about the possibility of a surprise U.S. strike against China, three sources familiar with the situation tell Axios.
    • One of the sources said: “I think they [the Chinese] were getting bad intelligence… a combination of ‘wag the dog’ conspiracy thinking and bad intel from bad sources.”

    Then-Defense Secretary Mark Esper worried the Chinese were misreading the situation and that their misperception could lead to a conflict nobody wanted.

    • Esper directed his policy office to issue a backchannel message to the Chinese to reassure them the U.S. had no intention of seeking a military confrontation. The message: Don’t over-read what you’re seeing in Washington; we have no intention to attack; and let’s keep lines of communication open.

    Do you have another “version of events”? As for your second question, I don’t have the security clearance to know what the actual intel was, and wouldn’t tell you if I did.
    This is not the first time an authoritarian communist regime operated in an echo chamber and got paranoid about a nuclear strike. A similar thing happened during the Reagan era, and it started a backchannel communications effort that Milley became a part of.

    Paul Montagu (5de684) — 9/16/2021 @ 9:43 am

    Time123 (147b1a)

  138. AJLiberty, What do you mean over reacted? Miley didn’t tell them anything Trump says was inaccurate. He reinforced Trump’s already communicated policy.

    Time123 (147b1a)

  139. Milley has a pained expression like his dominatrix spanked his scrotum a little too vigorously, which would also explain Nicki’s friend of a friend anecdote.
    It would be tough to have to explain a dominatrix related cause of impotence to most fiance’s

    steveg (b86430)

  140. @140 yeah, it’s silly

    and it’s exactly what milley said

    and what’s even more silly are the strained attempts to rationalize it away

    JF (e1156d)

  141. Didn’t Truman can MacArthur for breaking the chain of command?

    mg (8cbc69)

  142. The cellar dwelling dum dum has yet to give the chicoms our weapons, as he did in Afghanistan.

    mg (8cbc69)

  143. Didn’t Truman can MacArthur for breaking the chain of command?

    For talking to the Chinese, too.

    There’s a chink in Milley’s armor; fire him.

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  144. ““We were happy to see that Biden’s COVID plan announced last week included a 50% increase in monoclonal antibody deliveries to states this month,” DeSantis Press Secretary Christina Pushaw told The Daily Wire in a statement.

    “So it’s surprising and deeply disappointing that the Biden Admin would break this promise just a week later and cut MAB allocation to Florida, so they aren’t even providing half of the doses of life-saving treatment that COVID patients in Florida will need. But Governor DeSantis is committed to ensuring that everyone who needs the treatment will be able to get it, even if we can’t count on the Biden Administration.””

    Biden Claims GOP Governors Undermining ‘Life-Saving Requirements’ While He Limits Antibody Treatments

    https://www.dailywire.com/news/biden-claims-gop-governors-undermining-life-saving-requirements-while-he-limits-antibody-treatments?%3Futm

    Obudman (90b76a)

  145. Texas man arrested for killing woman who voted for biden. He also shot her husband for voting for biden. (tyt)

    asset (c99f12)

  146. Time123 (147b1a) — 9/16/2021 @ 1:49 pm

    This

    I don’t have the security clearance to know what the actual intel was, and wouldn’t tell you if I did

    isn’t an answer to the question I asked. That’s an evasion. Is there another answer somewhere in there that I didn’t notice?

    frosty (f27e97)

  147. AJ_Liberty (ec7f74) — 9/16/2021 @ 1:49 pm

    I think interpreting that as treasonous is bizarre to me. He’s not telling him, I will phone you and notify you of an attack. That’s silly. He’s saying that world conditions will clearly indicate when an attack might be forthcoming. That is, it will be obvious when diplomatic relations have degraded to the point where war was possible.

    Here is what has been reported:

    I want to assure you that the American government is stable and everything is going to be okay

    We are not going to attack or conduct any kinetic operations against you.

    If we’re going to attack, I’m going to call you ahead of time. It’s not going to be a surprise

    Either these are accurate quotes or they aren’t. Why would he need to tell a Chinese general something that would be “obvious”?

    Treasonous may or may not be hyperbolic but are you saying these quotes aren’t accurate? Or are you saying they are but mean something other than the most obvious meaning?

    frosty (f27e97)

  148. The first two are the us policy at the time. Reiterating official policy isn’t Treason. The third is an assurance of the first two, or a promise of future action on his part; also not treason.

    Time123 (acc2eb)

  149. Time123 (acc2eb) — 9/16/2021 @ 3:45 pm

    Here’s the Chairman of the Joint Chiefs doing his best to make Li happy:

    Milley promised him: “We are 100 percent steady. Everything’s fine. But democracy can be sloppy sometimes.”

    Let that one sink in too. The Chairman of the Joint Chiefs apologizing to China for democracy being sloppy. He needs to be sacked just for that.

    I can’t help but notice you drove by @126. You’re good with that too? The oath swearing thing?

    frosty (f27e97)

  150. We may be missing the forest for the trees here.

    Mr. President Donald Trump surrounded himself only with the best and most serious people.

    He promised he would, and he never lied.

    The so-called General Milley we are talking about is not anyone President Trump would have appointed.

    It is obvious to me that the real General Milley appointed by Mr. President Trump was at some point kidnapped by Illuminati time commandos from the year 2202 and replaced with a replicant.

    Do we have anybody who knows the Voight-Kampff test?

    nk (1d9030)

  151. Off-topic: Judge refuses to order Kentucky hospital to administer Ivermectin

    The judge minced no words.

    “As a Registered Nurse, I demand my husband be administered ivermectin whether by a Norton physician or another healthcare provider of my choosing including myself if necessary,” Angela Underwood wrote in the complaint filed last week, asking the court to designate the unproven treatment as “medically indicated.”

    But a judge denied her emergency order request Wednesday in a scathing ruling that called out people who have promoted and supported ivermectin as an effective treatment for covid-19. Jefferson Circuit Judge Charles Cunningham, who said the court “cannot require a hospital to literally take orders from someone who does not routinely issue such orders,” noted in his ruling how the Kentucky Supreme Court “only allows admission of scientific evidence based on sufficient facts or data.”

    “Unfortunately, the Internet has no such rule. It is rife with the ramblings of persons who spout ill-conceived conclusions if not out-right falsehoods,” Cunningham wrote in an order obtained by The Washington Post. “If Plaintiff wants to ask the Court to impose her definition of ‘medically indicated’ rather than the hospital’s, she needs to present the sworn testimony of solid witnesses, espousing solid opinions, based on solid data.”

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  152. Regardless of how one perceives Trump as CinC, he was CinC. For an advisor — not even in the chain of command — to be giving orders instructing other officers not subordinate to him to ignore orders that DID come through the chain-of-command is absolute crap. That he presumed that the President, SecDef and service chiefs would all go along with first use of nukes in peacetime is so utterly unbeleivable that his sanity is in question.

    Sure, I get it. Trump is a dumb-ass and prone to rage. Etc. But it is not the job of a mere advisor to take hold of presidential power because he’s afraid.

    However he leaves is unimportant but this is far worse that Petraeus telling his mistress some secrets.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  153. #154
    Is that the one where you were supposed to turn your head and cough?
    Trump did at least one thing right with Generals. The last being getting the logistic branches of the military involved in COVID. Milley looks good on paper, but every General does because they spend their careers checking off boxes.

    Another Trump loser pick is Christopher Wray. His testimony and work covering for the agents involved in the Gymnast scandal show he is more interested in protecting the FBI than the people of the US. I think he is a Comey clone. Protect the FBI because the institution and its highly principled personnel must not be questioned

    steveg (b86430)

  154. R.I.P. Jane Powell, 92

    Totally heartbroken.

    Enjoy:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PYobT21oJbQ

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  155. Petraeus stepped aside. Swalwell ran for President

    steveg (b86430)

  156. KM @155-

    Brutal takedown. Ouch!

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  157. Do you think Milley was responding to China’s fears but was not himself concerned, i.e. the primary “fear” was China’s? This seems at odds with the reporting, other than this Axios article.

    The reporting seems pretty straightforward, frosty, and it was Esper who tasked Milley with the call. I don’t know why you find Milley’s emotions to be relevant, and I wouldn’t know them anyway.

    If the worry was China’s “fears” do you have any thoughts about calling up U.S. Indo-Pacific Command and asking them to not conduct exercises because of what “they were hearing from the ChiComs”? What about those oaths? Were those part of promises to China?

    To your first question, my guess is that Esper was attempting allay ChiCom paranoia, which I surmise is the same reason for Milley’s call. I don’t know what the “oaths” have to do with it (I assume you’re meaning the “oaths” that Milley got from whatever persons on 1/8). It seems like you’re conflating two separate issues.

    Paul Montagu (c3380c)

  158. Back to the original question; do you think there was a potential for the US to attack China as some ploy by Trump to stay in power? Do you think the nuclear arsenal was “unchecked”?

    To be clear, there are two separate issues involving Milley, frosty. The first was Milley’s phone calls to his ChiCom counterparts to allay their paranoia, which were appropriate. The second was Milley going around the room and asking personnel to keep him in the loop on whatever Trump had up his sleeve, which exceeded his authority.
    To answer your questions more directly, my answer ranges from “no” to “I don’t know” about what Trump would do. I don’t what thoughts were banging around in his head or what he was considering wrt China but, at the same time, he was trying to work the second phase of his trade deal. We’ve seen enough of the kiss-and-tell books and such to know that he’s a glandular seat-of-the pants decision maker and unhinged enough to trial balloon some dangerous options. Example:

    “Several months ago, a foreign policy expert on the international level went to advise Donald Trump. And three times [Trump] asked about the use of nuclear weapons. Three times he asked at one point if we had them why can’t we use them,” Scarborough said on his “Morning Joe” program.

    To your second question, you can google “nuclear football” just as easily as I can.

    Paul Montagu (c3380c)

  159. It’s a little hard to unwind this because it sounds like you’re saying the Chinese were feeding Milley reliable intelligence that the US was going to attack and it caused Milley to make them promises.

    Nope, that’s not what I’m saying at all, frosty. I’ll refer you back to my Axios link. I made no comment, directly or indirectly, that communicated that “the Chinese were feeding Milley reliable intelligence that the US was going to attack and it caused Milley to make them promises.” I’m at a complete loss as to how you could come up with that.

    Paul Montagu (c3380c)

  160. This

    I don’t have the security clearance to know what the actual intel was, and wouldn’t tell you if I did

    isn’t an answer to the question I asked. That’s an evasion. Is there another answer somewhere in there that I didn’t notice?

    It was an answer, an admittedly flippant answer to what I thought was an unserious question.

    Paul Montagu (c3380c)

  161. @161 and @162 – That is a long way to say no you don’t think Trump would have nuked China to somehow remain POTUS even after the election. And then to turn around and say that you do think it was a reasonable fear.

    That’s a magic cake that is both edible and still around to look at.

    It cracks me up that we had several years of the “I’m not saying it’s aliens” meme and that morphed into “but Trump”. And you guys make fun of the conspiracy nuts?

    frosty (f27e97)

  162. I think my answer was pretty clear, frosty, which was “no” to “I don’t know”. The “I don’t know” part leaves open the possibility that Trump could do something rash and stupid.

    Paul Montagu (c3380c)

  163. @165, conspiracy theories should be mocked. As should your bad faith “interpretations” of Paul’s comments.

    Time123 (acc2eb)

  164. Either way, you have a President out of control. If not of himself, then of his war machine, oblivious to what it was doing right under his nose.

    nk (1d9030)

  165. Paul Montagu (c3380c) — 9/16/2021 @ 6:51 pm

    I’m at a complete loss as to how you could come up with that.

    Here is the original exchange.

    You know there was no potential unprovoked attack and no unchecked control of the nuclear arsenal?

    Not according to the intelligence they were hearing from the ChiComs. Hence the calls. It’s not “treason” to tell your geostrategic adversary that we don’t intend to launch a first strike.

    Paul Montagu (5de684) — 9/16/2021 @ 8:15 am

    I say there was no potential for an attack. You say according to intelligence from the ChiComs there was the potential for an attack. This was obviously intelligence they thought reliable enough to take action on even though it was from the CCP about themselves. If the intelligence from the ChiComs is not reliable why the need for any communication? If the ChiComs didn’t think we were going to attack why the need to go to this degree to restate what everyone already knew? If it was going to be obvious, due to a degraded diplomatic situation, that an attack was imminent why the need to communicate?

    On the other hand, if this was about CCP fears, we’re dealing with Milley thinking the CCP would launch a first strike against the US based on their own disinformation. And he thought that intelligence from the ChiComs was reliable enough to act on.

    And he did more than calm the fears of the Chinese. He wanted people within the military chain of command to swear to him it couldn’t happen with him being in the loop. Why do that if was just an effort to help the CCP improve their read on the situation? This last part is what tells you he thought the CCP might be right.

    I can understand, and see the value in, officials at multiple levels of the political and military branches of countries communicating with each other for a variety of reasonable reasons. This is beyond that. This is senior political and military leaders out of touch with reality.

    I’m getting the sense that for some people “bad for Trump” will excuse anything.

    Nothing about this makes sense even if I accept your interpretation of these events.

    frosty (f27e97)

  166. Time123 (acc2eb) — 9/16/2021 @ 7:39 pm

    @165, conspiracy theories should be mocked. As should your bad faith “interpretations” of Paul’s comments.

    There are some pretty obvious holes in your and Paul’s interpretations of these events. I’m guessing you’re starting to see them and that’s why you’ve stopped answering questions about the holes and switched to accusations of “bad faith”.

    What I’m wondering is why you guys are so committed to defending Milley’s actions. Any thoughts on that?

    frosty (f27e97)

  167. RIP Rickie Lee Reynolds (72). Founder and guitarist of Black Oak Arkansas.

    Rip Murdock (0aa613)

  168. #169
    Damned if you do, damned if you don’t.
    If Trump fired Milley, he’s suddenly best General ever, a bulwark against Trump running amok and bombing the Malay’s for consorting with the Chinesers, or for going berserk and trying to extort Greenland from the Danes

    steveg (b86430)

  169. Frosty, despite you never responding to any of the points I made I still think they’re correct. I don’t see any reason to respond to questions about things I didn’t say.

    Paul’s original link to the Axios story provides the answers to your questions in comment 171.

    Time123 (acc2eb)

  170. SteveG, Yes, at that point Trump had no good choices left. His erratic behavior and dishonesty had left him without any good options.

    Time123 (acc2eb)

  171. Uh-uh! Trump says he didn’t know about it till just now, when the media reported the story in the book. That makes him a complacent c**kold.

    nk (1d9030)

  172. Time123 (acc2eb) — 9/16/2021 @ 8:32 pm

    despite you never responding to any of the points I made

    Please see @153, @150, and @126 as direct responses to you. I’ve also responded to your “it was just the official position” point in several different comments. Did I miss any questions you asked me? You’ve been hanging you hat on “it’s not treason” and ignoring the other problems with this. I’ve even responded to that.

    I have responded, and with the exception of a little snark, I’ve responded reasonably. You just don’t like the response.

    I don’t see any reason to respond to questions about things I didn’t say.

    Are you thinking @72, @84, @90, @142, and @152 isn’t defending Milley? This is part of your “he did the responsible thing” theory correct?

    frosty (f27e97)

  173. I say there was no potential for an attack.

    Why? This would imply that you believe that the intelligence the IC received was not credible, therefore no calls or outreach need have been made. What information is in your possession that was not available to IC?

    And he did more than calm the fears of the Chinese. He wanted people within the military chain of command to swear to him it couldn’t happen with him being in the loop. Why do that if was just an effort to help the CCP improve their read on the situation? This last part is what tells you he thought the CCP might be right.

    That is a fair point. However, we don’t know what exactly was said in the phone calls, but I doubt the flow of information was in one just direction. The Chinese may well have received intel from TrumpWorld that they perceived was a threat, whether true or not, and that was communicated to Milley, but that’s speculative. Personally, I think that is exactly why those phone calls were necessary, don’t you think?
    Also, the January 8th call was two days after an insurrection that Trump helped trigger, so context matters. There didn’t need to be a Chinese “threat” for Milley to want the people around him to keep him in the loop, for whatever seat-of-the-pants thing that Trump may do.

    Paul Montagu (5de684)

  174. “That fella down under…” – President What’s-His-Name 9/15/21

    Referencing:

    [ ] Scott Morrison

    [ ] Paul Hogan

    [ ] Beau

    Choose.

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  175. Paul Montagu (5de684) — 9/16/2021 @ 9:13 pm

    I think that is exactly why those phone calls were necessary, don’t you think

    Ref my other comment

    I can understand, and see the value in, officials at multiple levels of the political and military branches of countries communicating with each other for a variety of reasonable reasons. This is beyond that. This is senior political and military leaders out of touch with reality.

    No, I don’t think “these” calls were necessary anymore than I think it’s necessary for Milley to tell the Chinese there isn’t an impending asteroid impact that could wipe out all life on earth or that scientists at a secret research lab didn’t open a hole to a parallel reality with demons pouring out of it.

    This would imply that you believe that the intelligence the IC received was not credible, therefore no calls or outreach need have been made. What information is in your possession that was not available to IC?

    Common sense and the fact there has been no evidence of this potential attack other than “but Trump”. The logic here is that it could have happened because Trump is just that crazy and the military chain of command would have gone along with it but for Milley’s actions. I ask why would an attack keep Trump in power? Do you have anything better than it doesn’t have to make sense because Trump?

    This seems to be the same high level reasoning that backed up the whole “maybe this pee tape is real” and “Trump is a russian mole” and “let’s open an fbi investigation into stories told by HRC about her political opponents”.

    But even if it made sense to call the Chinese it doesn’t make sense to promise to warn them of any potential attacks or apologize for democracy being messy or ask senior military officials to swear anything in addition to their existing oaths.

    frosty (f27e97)

  176. No, I don’t think “these” calls were necessary…

    And that’s where we diverge. Is not more communication better than less? There was an Able Archer exercise in the Soviet era that started these backchannels in the first place, to avert a potential escalation. There’s enough messaging in a comment thread that’s misinterpreted, how much more relevant when involving two superpowers with arsenals of atomic bombs. And like I said, you don’t know exactly what Milley said or what the ChiComs said. Just because you don’t like it that it could be “about Trump”, doesn’t mean those communications weren’t necessary.

    Paul Montagu (5de684)

  177. Paul Montagu (5de684) — 9/16/2021 @ 10:36 pm

    I have said this exact thing about communication between countries more than once. There’s no reason for you to misinterpret my comments on this.

    You aren’t addressing any of the issues with the reported content of these calls. Content that no one is denying by the way and that in fact is being defended. I asked you if you had anything better than “but Trump” and you gave me a different version of “but Trump”.

    More good communication is better than less. More bad communication is worse than less. And based on the reporting, there is a lot of bad communication from Milley.

    frosty (f27e97)

  178. Didn’t trump nuke n. korea? No. The worse than Trump dolts said he was going to. The worse than Trump dolts are getting old and stupid.

    mg (8cbc69)

  179. Frosty, I missed some of your comments. Sorry about that. Let me be clear on my thinking of this issue.

    Miley didn’t commit treason. The US policy was not to launch a surprise attack against China. Trump has recently stated that he had no intention of doing that and that he felt he Chinese leadership knew that. Our intelligence told us that the Chinese were starting to think that we were considering it. This isn’ to say the Chinese were correct. We believed that they had bad Information.

    Miley had a call with his counterparts in the Chinese military to assure them that we were not considering an attack. This call was at the direction of the Secretary or Defense Mark Esper. As appropriate there were multiple people in the room during the call and the details of the call were communicated to others after the call was made.

    This is not treason and misrepresenting it that way is silly

    Time123 (9f42ee)

  180. https://www.americanthinker.com/articles/2021/09/why_is_covid_natural_immunity_being_ignored.html
    Is having natural immunity worse than Trump?
    Guilty, I’m proud to be.

    mg (8cbc69)

  181. Here’s what I’ve seen regarding the oath.

    In response, Milley took extraordinary action, and called a secret meeting in his Pentagon office on January 8 to review the process for military action, including launching nuclear weapons. Speaking to senior military officials in charge of the National Military Command Center, the Pentagon’s war room, Milley instructed them not to take orders from anyone unless he was involved.
    “No matter what you are told, you do the procedure. You do the process. And I’m part of that procedure,” Milley told the officers, according to the book. He then went around the room, looked each officer in the eye, and asked them to verbally confirm they understood.
    “Got it?” Milley asked, according to the book.
    “Yes, sir.”
    ‘Milley considered it an oath,’ the authors write.

    I don’t like this. It defensible because Miley was insisting that they follow the defined process for a nuclear launch. But its still clear that he wanted to be involved because. He was afraid that Trump would use misuse nuclear weapons. That’s not really his call to make which is what I don’t like. It could be argued that he was concerned about an illegal order and wanted to be aware of that. But that case would depend on information we don’t have. While i troubled by this I don’t it’s treason or a coupe.

    Time123 (9f42ee)

  182. “That fella down under… you know … liddle kangaroo man.”

    nk (1d9030)

  183. Far-right groups tell supporters planned Washington rally is a government ‘trap’

    Across rightwing social media platforms, “most people who are talking about the event in any capacity are telling people to steer clear of DC,” Cassie Miller, a senior research analyst at the Southern Poverty Law Center, said. “Any extremist group that’s talking about it is warning people against attending.”

    The common narrative in rightwing forums is that the rally is “a trap that’s been set by federal authorities” that will leave participants vulnerable to “surveillance and arrest”, Miller said.
    ….
    Fox News host Laura Ingraham called the rally “stupid” and told her viewers she had never heard of it before she saw a report about it on CNN.

    “Many people” see the protest as “even a false flag operation”, Ingraham warned on 10 September. “Have any big-name conservatives signed on? Of course not. Obviously there’s nothing legitimate about it.”
    ….
    Some prominent Republican members of Congress who have defended the Capitol rioters as political prisoners, including Marjorie Taylor Greene and Madison Cawthorn, told Politico a week before the protest that they would not be attending.

    nk (1d9030)

  184. No word on whether Nicki Minaj and Mark Milley will perform at the event.

    nk (1d9030)

  185. If it’s not treason, not a coupe…

    Sedan Delivery! https://youtu.be/HkEXfVsQpUQ

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  186. You aren’t addressing any of the issues with the reported content of these calls.

    What’s to address, frosty? You and I don’t know what exactly caused the ChiComs to be alarmed, we don’t exactly what was said between the parties, we don’t know exactly what assurances Milley gave to the ChiComs, we don’t know Trump’s state of mind or what he was saying to the people around him as it relates to China or other matters (we do know his unhingedness about his Big Lie), we don’t know exactly what motivated Milley (except for the insurrection) to get “oaths” from the people around him. There’s a whole realm of possibilities, but I don’t see a real benefit in speculating and spitballing.

    Paul Montagu (5de684)

  187. Paul, the reporting I’ve seen of the book is that he asked for a commitment that the procedures (which included him) would be followed and he ‘considered’ the responses an oath. From that, and reporting about the order to pull out of Afghanistan in Jan, it’s reasonable to conclude he was concerned that orders would be given that circumvented his staff and / or the chain of command.

    I don’t know if his concern was reasonable. I don’t want military leadership making policy decisions about what the military will do. But I know Trump is nuts and at that time was looking for tools to circumvent our democratic process. It’s not a good situation.

    Time123 (9f42ee)

  188. Paul Montagu (5de684) — 9/17/2021 @ 5:48 am

    The reporting on this is pretty explicit and uses a lot of direct quotes. The substance of the reporting has been defended by people there who would deny it if it were false.

    Do you think that reporting is inaccurate? If so why isn’t Milley saying that? Not something we can speculate on?

    If you consistently applied the reasoning you’re using here you wouldn’t be in a position to comment about much.

    frosty (f27e97)

  189. Frosty, what specific content of the calls do you object to and why?

    Time123 (9f42ee)

  190. The good news is that British bettors think the odds are against either Biden (just a 20 percent chance) or Trump (just a 17 percent chance) winning the 2024 presidential election.

    (Yes, Smithson’s headline is misleading.)

    The bad news is that each is leading his party.

    And you have to get all the way down to Nikki Haley (5 percent) before you find someone who is qualified to be president.

    (For the record: In my opinion, the odds on Biden seem too low, the odds on Trump too high. The bettors are giving too much weight to claims of Biden’s poor health, and too little weight to Trump’s increasing legal problems. And the legal problems of his supporters.)

    Jim Miller (edcec1)

  191. Jim, Trumps legal problems have been over sold for years.

    Time123 (9f42ee)

  192. Trump appointee, on Trump’s watch.

    How many times during the Trumpency did we hear “I am the President, everything I do is Presidential”?

    Trump never rose to the standards demanded of a President, he lowered the standards to fit in them.

    So we got sub-standard after half-assed after incompetent after failure after scandalous after down-right illegal for four years, and Milley is but a milligram of it.

    nk (1d9030)

  193. #185

    https://www.americanthinker.com/articles/2021/09/why_is_covid_natural_immunity_being_ignored.html
    Is having natural immunity worse than Trump?

    Would you be willing to take a blood test to demonstrate natural immunity?

    I have a feeling if Biden factored in natural immunity in his EO, people would be complaining about any testing requirements or immunity cards that would be part of such a process. Frankly, something like that would be even more intrusive then just going to the Walgreens and getting the jab.

    It’s not a bad argument you are making here. But would such a policy really be ok with you?

    Appalled (1a17de)

  194. #196 Time123 – I am not a lawyer, but I can understand a statistical argument: There are so many cases — and potential cases — that he is bound to lose some of them, especially if the juries are chosen in NYC or DC. And even in the cases that he wins, he is likely to get a little more unfavorable publicity.

    Here’s an example.

    A federal judge Wednesday denied a request by a lawyer for former President Donald Trump to continue pausing a lawsuit that accuses him of defaming writer E. Jean Carroll after she claimed he raped her decades ago in New York City.

    And you probably have heard about Roger Stone getting served papers while he was in a conversation on a radio show.

    (Will his enemies cut some legal corners as they go after him? Sure. Will this still result in rough justice, considering his legal shenanigans? Opinions will differ.)

    Jim Miller (edcec1)

  195. Natural immunity from Covid infection would fall under medical objection, and medical objection is included in Biden’s EO. But bring your positive Covid test, and not that you had a fever and cough that you got over back in January.

    nk (1d9030)

  196. traveled around the world many times,

    Much like most of the fake news by the media.

    The fake gets widely known and the correction, well, it’s not as important.

    BillPasadena (5b0401)

  197. Are you anti-anti-Trump?

    In the later years of the Cold War, there was increasing criticism of the United States and our allies for our anti-Communist policies. Some came from those on the far left, but some came from people who were not Communists, or close to them, but routinely attacked anti-Communists.

    And so some began to describe those people as “anti-anti-Communists”. They were defined, not so much by what they favored, but by who they opposed. (Many of the attacks on “neoconservatives” came from such people.)

    And I think we can all understand that these anti-anti-Communists were acting more out of a tribal feeling than from deeply reasoned principles.

    Jim Miller (edcec1)

  198. Milley: Calls to China were ‘perfectly’ within scope of job
    …….
    n his first public comments on the conversations, Gen. Mark Milley said such calls are “routine” and were done “to reassure both allies and adversaries in this case in order to ensure strategic stability.” The chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff spoke to The Associated Press and another reporter traveling with him to Europe.
    …….
    Milley on Friday offered only a brief defense of his calls, saying he plans a deeper discussion about the matter for Congress when he testifies at a hearing later in September.

    “I think it’s best that I reserve my comments on the record until I do that in front of the lawmakers who have the lawful responsibility to oversee the U.S. military,” Milley said. “I’ll go into any level of detail Congress wants to go into in a couple of weeks.”

    Milley and U.S. Defense Secretary Lloyd Austin are scheduled to testify Sept. 28 before the Senate Armed Services Committee, in what initially was going to be a hearing on the U.S. military withdrawal from Afghanistan and the chaotic evacuation of Americans, Afghans and others from that country.

    Now, however, Milley is expected to face tough questioning on the telephone calls……
    …….
    Milley’s office, in a statement this week, said the calls were intended to convey “reassurance” to the Chinese military and were in line with his responsibilities as Joint Chiefs chairman.

    The statement from Milley spokesman Col. Dave Butler also said that the calls were “staffed, coordinated and communicated” with the Pentagon and other federal agencies.
    …….

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  199. Natural immunity from Covid infection would fall under medical objection, and medical objection is included in Biden’s EO

    No. Bring your doctor’s statement that you have medical reasons not to get a shot. Don’t expect some nurse or bureaucrat to look at your medical data and come to a reasoned conclusion, even after you explain your Constitutional Rights to them.

    Of course, with the “natural immunity” claim you may have to shop a few doctors.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  200. If you consistently applied the reasoning you’re using here you wouldn’t be in a position to comment about much.

    I’m trying to answering the “reasoning” you’re offering, frosty, but you seem to have it in for Milley, never mind that he was operating under two SecDefs and wasn’t the only person in the room when he called his counterparts. It appears you want me to come to your negative conclusions about him and the calls, but I’m not going there because I think they were appropriate.

    Paul Montagu (5de684)

  201. From that, and reporting about the order to pull out of Afghanistan in Jan, it’s reasonable to conclude he was concerned that orders would be given that circumvented his staff and / or the chain of command.

    I agree, Time. Tom Nichols also acknowledges that Milley crossed the line, that he was close to pulling a “Schlesinger”, but he was in a situation that he never should have faced. In a nutshell, that was the problem with working under Trump, you either have to resign when a line gets crossed (like Gen. Kelly) or you stay and try to deal with an unhinged, unfit boss who is in charge of “the nuclear”. But if you stay, you’ll either sell your soul and knuckle under (like Cohen or Meadows) or be insubordinate in the efforts to stem his stupider or more dangerous decisions (like Milley and others).

    Paul Montagu (5de684)

  202. #200 —

    The Biden mandate to employers is merely a statement in a White House release that OSHA will be issuing a rule on the issue that provides that an employee must be vaccinated or tested weekly. There isn’t anything formal yet, though that’s expected next week.

    Your expectation that the OSHA guidance will cover people who have had COVID is possible but not explicit. Such people would likely have to present an antibody test that meets certain standards.

    Appalled (1a17de)

  203. Question regarding natural immunity:

    If someone survived the alpha variant, do those antibodies also provide natural immunity to other COVID variants, such as Delta?

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  204. @206 milley was stemming a stupid and dangerous decision that was a figment of yours and his imagination

    what’s actually stupid and dangerous is your notion that the precedent milley is setting will find adherents only when trump is president

    JF (e1156d)

  205. what’s actually stupid and dangerous is your notion that the precedent milley is setting will find adherents only when trump is president

    I’ve already said more than once that Milley crossed a line, JF. There was so much stupid and dangerous coming from Trump that you could hardly keep track.

    Paul Montagu (5de684)

  206. Milley’s another Westmorland.

    Save lives; dump him.

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  207. Natural immunity creates different antiboies, by and large, than vaccine immunity, which is only against the pike protein, which is essential for the virus to function. When the mri infects a cell, it causes it to produce spike proteins but not the rest of the virus. I don’t know – I have never read any account whatsoever that even attempted to deal with this – what happens when the spike proteins invade a cell, but even if this destroys a second round of cells, that’s the end of it. It cannot create a Covid infection.

    They can tell if somebody has immunity because of the virus or because of the vaccine, or a combination of both. They just generally don’t do that outside of scientific studies.

    You may think it easier for someone to get a possibly unnecessary vaccine than to go through a free blood test, but offering this blood test would make people less reluctant – some people are afraid of getting too strong immunity.

    The virus can mutate most around the monoclonal antibodies, which are limited to one or two specific antigens located near the essential part of virus.

    Delta infects cells easier but the immunity is not affected. Natural immunity might be to a part of the virus that changes, but that change would have little benefit to the virus. Natural immunity, as well as vaccine immunity, is antibodies against more than one spot on the outer coat of the virus – and different in each person.

    The Covid vaccine is like what the flu vaccine should be – to an essential part of the virus. Flu mutate s faster a the vaccines are always to a non essential part of the virus. They just don;t want to change anything. It is time consuming and expensive to do so.

    Sammy Finkelman (51cd0c)

  208. The blood test to detect antibodies to Covid is not free now, I think, to most people, but it should be.

    It is inconsistent to argue that a third shot is not needed in most cases but to also say you don;t distinguish between people with antibodies and people who do not have them.

    Bill Gates says that to avert future pandemics we need or should have the ability to come out with a vaccine in 100 days and get it out into production in another 100 days. Not with our current vaccine approval we can’t. It is literally mathematically impossible. You can’t do six months of followup in less than 100 days

    Maybe two months of followup after a single dose vaccine provided you didn’t spend time reviewing the data.

    And, by the way, the state of knowledge now is such that it probably should take no more than 2 to 4 weeks – maximum – to devise a vaccine to any ne virus and you could maybe do it as fast as Dr. Leonard McCoy on Star Trek.

    The rest is bureaucratic and legal obstacles.

    Testing and approval. Some testing may be necessary, but they were not trying to shorten it in 2020 – they were trying to lengthen it so that no vaccine or good treatment got approved even for emergency use before November 3, 2020 (Election Day – they were not taking account of early and absentee voting) and the companies knew it and didn’t try ad the Trump Aministration was not successful in advancing the date, although Regeneron made an exception for President Trump himself (and some other VIPs) when he got sick in early October with Covid, since they didn’t want him to die because approval was delayed. Trump then promised to get it out to other Americans, but he encountered push back and gave up.

    Now it is finally standard treatment, especially in Florida and maybe Texas.

    Dr. Scott Gottlieb wrote a book in which he criticizes the CDC – not so much the FDA which he once headed. According to the reviews, the most notable criticism he has is with the CDC stranglehold on Covid testing at the beginning of the epidemic in the United States.

    Sammy Finkelman (51cd0c)

  209. Pompeo’s likely planning a run for ‘something.’

    He’s lost a lot of weight- usually a signal– or he’s just ill.

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  210. Trump was not going to attack China. Iran was more of a possibility.

    Sammy Finkelman (51cd0c)

  211. Biden is strengthening the alliance with Australia – and to some degree Britain – while weakening the alliance with France, so much so that France cancelled a joint celebration of a crucial French naval victory in 1781, 240 years ago.

    Joe Biden decided it was important to deter China, but little threats like by terrorists could be taken care of by over the horizon methods.

    Sammy Finkelman (51cd0c)

  212. 2024: The Big Muddy

    Trump/Haley vs. Harris/Castro

    The Big Question: location of the Biden Presidential Library

    [ ] Scranton strip mine

    [ ] Wilmington Amtrak station

    [ ] MBNA safe deposit box

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  213. Biden is strengthening the alliance with Australia

    Doesn’t help when he can’t remember the name of ‘the fella down under.’

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  214. 70. nk (1d9030) — 9/16/2021 @ 5:43 am

    The Joint Chiefs of Staff have no operational authority. They’re outside the chain of command, mere consiglieri de la familia to the President and his Caporegime of Defense.

    They are staff, not line. Names sometimes give a person a clue.

    Trump appointed this righteous bushwacker on October 1, 2019, it’s a four-year term, and Biden is stuck with him for another two years.

    He could remove him if he wanted to.

    Sammy Finkelman (51cd0c)

  215. [√ ] Wilmington Amtrak station

    That would be nice, but you can’t do it, unless the station is closed. But maybe it could be made a national landmark.

    Sammy Finkelman (51cd0c)

  216. 200. A positive Covid test could produce varying levels of immunity. They need an antibody test. It should be an option. Maybe even it is, at least if the infection was within the last 90 days.

    Sammy Finkelman (51cd0c)

  217. How about don’t be a bully? How about not wishing people dead?

    “I hope you die!” will not convince anyone.

    Miller Smith (ff188f)

  218. BREAKING- FDA PANEL VOTES 16-2 AGAINST PFIZER BOOSTER SHOTS

    Kills the WH booster rollout plans for next week. This on top of the DoD admitting drone-killing 7 kids and 3 adults by mistake in Kabul and 11,000 illegal clustered to flood into Texas across the border.

    Just isn’t your day, eh Joe– who is already hiding in his bunker.

    Incompetent idiot.

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  219. DCSCA wrote:

    The Big Question: location of the Biden Presidential Library

    [ ] Scranton strip mine

    [ ] Wilmington Amtrak station

    [ ] MBNA safe deposit box

    Having lived in New Castle County, Delaware, I can tell you: you don’t want to be in the neighborhood of the Wilmington Amtrak Station.

    The libertarian, but not Libertarian, Dana (fed7b0)


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