Patterico's Pontifications

4/21/2021

Face It: Big Media and Social Media Have Combined to Stoke a Moral Panic About Police Shootings and Race

Filed under: General — Patterico @ 8:29 am



Yesterday, a Columbus police officer shot and killed a teenage girl who was in the process of attacking another girl with a knife. The police department rushed out the bodycam footage and presented it at a press conference:

Typical of the media coverage of the incident was this Washington Post story: Ohio police fatally shoot Black teenage girl just before Chauvin verdict:

Police said at a late news conference on Tuesday that the girl had threatened two others with a knife before the shooting, playing segments of body camera video that showed the victim lunging toward someone in a driveway before an officer fired four shots. A knife is visible in the driveway next to the girl as police perform CPR on her.

You would never know from reading the story that the girl had the knife in her hand and was in the process of attacking the girl in pink when she was shot. But that is clearly what happened if you watch the video.

That story is not an isolated example.

Why would a newspaper not report the clear evidence that the girl was attacking another girl with a knife that was visible in her hand for all the world to see? Why would newspaper headlines make this about race?

Donald Trump poisoned media criticism; even when the media misbehaved, calling it out always fed into a narrative that protected an administration fueled by lies.

But it’s time to call this what it is: media malpractice. This intense hyperfocus on race is spurring a moral panic, causing presumably otherwise rational people to jump to conclusions and trumpet them far and wide.

So far online the reactions I am seeing include:

  • The police should never kill anyone under any circumstances.

    • Why not shoot her in the leg, ar only shoot once? Or shoot the knife out of her hand?

  • Knife fights with girls happen; what’s the big deal?

The widespread insanity inherent in these reactions, to me, is the kind of thing you see in a moral panic. And the media is stoking it by constantly playing up the racial angle, and failing to give statistics that might provide context to what we are seeing (such as noting the disproportionate number of police killed by black shooters, a fact that would contextualize the disproportionate number of blacks killed by police; or noting the currently uncovered examples of police shootings of white people). It’s malpractice and it’s creating a frenzy.

Something has to give.

113 Responses to “Face It: Big Media and Social Media Have Combined to Stoke a Moral Panic About Police Shootings and Race”

  1. Yes, something will give. Society. Because the media isn’t being held accountable by the only people who can – Democrats.

    Democrats and the media will portray this knife-wielding attacker as the victim until one of the intended targets steps forward and shames both.

    Until that happens, the lies and narrative will continue.

    Hoi Polloi (093fb9)

  2. Remember – while the media peddles this lie, they refuse to admit their other more recent whoppers:

    – Putin offering bounties! Trump briefed and did nothing!
    – Officer Sidenick attacked with a fire extinguisher and died after suffered massive head injuries!

    The media is never held accountable. In fact, they are empowered. Make crap up, whatever it takes to drive the Narrative. It was easy to look the other way when the Narrative was “Resist Trump” or “Get Rid of Trump.”

    Not so easy now…

    Hoi Polloi (093fb9)

  3. The pushback needs to come from the City of Columbus. The mayor, the city council, and the police brass. If they softsoap and placate, instead of giving the officer a medal for saving the real victim’s life, then … like whatever, man.

    nk (1d9030)

  4. The only question would be whether or not a taser shot would have been warranted….but obviously the girl in pink was in imminent danger. [The idea of shooting the knife out of her hand is laughable as if real life was an arcade game]. Certainly the media reports are either intentionally dishonest or horribly ignorant. With video so prevalent, media has to do a better job or suffer more loss of legitimacy. It’s like journalism has died and been replaced by ideological emoting….both sides

    AJ_Liberty (ec7f74)

  5. “Police should not be killing anyone.” Right, they should just stand by and watch while others do the killing.
    What frightens me is that such idiocy seems to be gaining ground, and is encouraged by an unreflective media narrative that is only interested in sensationalism.

    Roger (e34354)

  6. There is always a “but”. This would have been a much more evenhanded statement without it. The “but” implies doubt about whether the cop really needed to take action to protect the young girl. It also serves to fuel the outrage that many are feeling [as the story has been framed as a racial issue]:

    Columbus Mayor Andrew Ginther called Tuesday afternoon’s events a “tragic day.”

    He said, “We know based on this footage, the officer took action to protect another young girl in our community. But a family is grieving tonight.”

    Dana (fd537d)

  7. Democrats can change it? No they can’t, only the public can by not giving them attention. The media is the way it is because it’s in the business of drawing eyeballs and this is a popular dramatic narrative at the moment. It is the way it is because it is in capitalistic competition with fiction and because the human brain likes exciting stories. It’s also why fox “news” is the way it is, they provide a compelling divisive and exciting narrative. Journalistic ethics are not rewarded in the current environment because they are not exciting and the American people like it to be exciting.

    Nic (896fdf)

  8. Why not shoot her in the leg, ar only shoot once? Or shoot the knife out of her hand?

    I mean, The A Team ran for five whole seasons on ABC and they were always able to apprehend the suspects without killing them. We need more cops like George Peppard and Mr. T.

    JVW (ee64e4)

  9. I pity the fool who couldn’t make that shot

    AJ_Liberty (ec7f74)

  10. An economic incentive for media: headlines that get clicks.
    Another economic incentive for media: getting the story out quickly to get clicks.
    A reputation incentive for media: not literally making things up so as to be able to claim honesty.
    Not an incentive for media: reflecting reality by giving nuanced headlines, providing context, etc.
    Another reputation incentive for media: not inadvertently wrongly blaming a 16 year old who is now dead.

    Given these incentives, are these headlines the least bit surprising?

    Also, when you try to get into nuanced analysis there is a chance your nuanced analysis is dead wrong. For instance, Pat, how sure are you that the girl with the knife was the initial aggressor? That she wasn’t trying to protect herself? Because a media outlet that (trying to be quick) puts in exactly what you’ve asked for them to put in but it turns out they misjudged the situation is going to get crucified rightly if they incorrectly suggest a 16 yo dead girl was to blame for the situation. She may be, but I am not yet convinced and I suspect you aren’t sure either.

    nate (1f1d55)

  11. People all over the Internet are pointing out that NPR, supported in part by our tax dollars, chose a headline of “Columbus Police Shoot And Kill Black, Teenage Girl.” They could have chosen “Police Shoot and Kill Knife-Wielding Teen” or “Police Shoot and Kill Black Teenage Assailant” or some other construction, yet they chose to go with the race/age/sex angle. And in their original story, it took them until paragraph eight to acknowledge that the girl was indeed attempting to stab her antagonist with a deadly weapon. They also appended an incredible note to the end of the story acknowledging that they would be reporting allegations well before they were confirmed:

    This is a developing story. Some facts reported by the media may later turn out to be wrong. We will focus on reports from police officials and other authorities, credible news outlets and reporters who are at the scene, and we will update as the situation develops.

    This is a pretty remarkable data point in the slow death of the traditional media. We’ll frankly learn more reading hot takes on Twitter than we will waiting for these nimrods to convey actual facts.

    JVW (ee64e4)

  12. But a family is grieving tonight.”

    Because their chances of winning the ghetto lottery (a fat settlement from the city) like the Floyd family did, are on the low side. Low, but not impossible. If they get a city hall-connected lawyer to get them a sweetheart payoff.

    nk (1d9030)

  13. the girl was in foster care

    maybe the grieving family can explain further

    JF (e1156d)

  14. The media is the way it is because it’s in the business of drawing eyeballs

    You can draw eyeballs with the police cam footage and not have to lie about it.

    I mean, The A Team ran for five whole seasons on ABC

    A-Team was awesome. But I believe NBC carried it; ABC carried [trigger warning] Dukes of Hazzard.

    Hoi Polloi (093fb9)

  15. This is a developing story. Some facts reported by the media may later turn out to be wrong.

    You know, I continue to be fixated on this. By definition, facts can’t be wrong. What NPR is saying is that they are happy to run with wild unconfirmed speculation and apparently present it as the truth, and if it later on turns out to be completely bogus, well, they did warn us that this might be the case. It’s astounding that they are acknowledging how shoddy they are willing to allow their reporting to be in order to compete with the social media mobs. I can’t believe we continue to fund this wretched organization.

    JVW (ee64e4)

  16. I can’t find anything to disagree with in this post. You’re right. This appears to be an appropriate use of force. The city released all the pertinent information promptly and afaik fully.

    The reporting has been terrible and if I didn’t know better I’d think the commentary was intended as parody. But I do know better. Crazy people believe it.

    Time123 (f5cf77)

  17. JVW, If NPR reports the fact that a Police Dept. Spox said XYZ or witnesses described ABC it may turn out that they were wrong. But it’s still a fact that they said it, and if newsworthy it should be published.

    Time123 (f5cf77)

  18. @HP@14 She was black, she was a teenager, she was a girl, she was shot by the police. None of that is a lie. It places emphasis on a certain narrative in order to cater to a particular zeitgeist, but it isn’t a lie. In the 90s it would’ve been framed as out of control black teenagers, possible drugs, possible gangs, because that was what was selling then.

    Nic (896fdf)

  19. “Tragedy: Police Fatally Shoot Teen To Save Other Teen’s Life”

    “Tragedy: Teenage Girl Fatally Shot By Police To Save Other Teenage Girl’s Life”

    “Tragedy: Police Compelled To Shoot Girl In Order To Save Other Girl”

    There were any number of available options that could’ve been used by media outlets that would not have been inflammatory or intentionally misleading. There were so many options that would not have cruelly exploited the tragic death of a teenager for political gain. Shame on everyone involved in doing just that.

    Dana (fd537d)

  20. It’s a two-pronged moral panic, combining police shootings with active shooters, and the common denominator is “wouldn’t it be great if we could round up all the guns?”

    With far fewer guns, no active shooters and no criminals with guns, see?

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  21. And in fact, the news (and other) media gaslights everyone. It’s just that “everyone” doesn’t know the truth about more than a few things, and nod their heads about those things that it doesn’t have a firm grasp of.

    Which is how the media gets away with it. We lurch from one panic to the next. The Population Bomb. McMartin Preschool. Child-rapers on the Internet. Terrorists under every bush. Etc. It all glues eyeballs to the screen. You may know that some of these are bullspit, but they just get you with something else.

    It really hasn’t changed much since the Palmer raids.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  22. I mean, The A Team ran for five whole seasons on ABC

    Grey’s Anatomy has been running for 17 years.

    *mike drop*

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  23. 4. AJ_Liberty (ec7f74) — 4/21/2021 @ 9:27 am

    The only question would be whether or not a taser shot would have been warranted…

    He was too far away for a taser to prevent it, but tasers are used too little – and what about tranquilizer darts?

    If you go over it, I can see a few things:

    1) The warning from the policeman wasn’t sharp enough, if it amounted to a warning. He just said, “Hey, hey, get down.” It wasn’t even clear it was meant for the girl in black. He didn’t shout loudly enough, nor emotionally enough to indicate this was an extreme situation. He didn’t tell her that the next thing he would do is shoot her. She’d probably done worse before the policeman got there.

    2) Maybe fewer shots would have worked. Not necessarily to stop her, but to get her to back off. It might have been better to fire one shot sooner, and see what happens, than to fire several shots in quick succession with no pause between them in what he thought could be the nick of time.

    3) The girl in pink wasn’t that afraid. She actually got closer to the girl in black. The girl in black had possibly been pulling the knife before on some people and hadn’t yet actually stabbed anyone.

    4) They must have had bad boyfriends.

    but obviously the girl in pink was in imminent danger.

    No. There had been a report of some girl(s) pulling a knife but the policeman who shot and killed her saw no stab victims or people running away. Instead people were still near her! The policeman didn’t understand he didn’t get there right at the beginning of the incident but he acted like he had.

    If she had pulled a gun on other people, and had been holding that gun for some time, would he have shot her just because she had a gun? A gun can be fired quicker than a knife can be used.

    The girl in black was apparently bluffing or was afraid the girl in pink might have a knife. Of course there was a possibility that now she might really stab someone.

    Sammy Finkelman (51cd0c)

  24. I mean, The A Team ran for five whole seasons on ABC and they were always able to apprehend the suspects without killing them. We need more cops like George Peppard and Mr. T.

    Hawaii Five-0 ran for 10 years, and not only did they shoot everyone, but they questioned suspects in a secret basement room without any lawyers.

    So, 5 years vs 10, and no killing vs lots. Clearly the Hawaii Five-0 approach is better.

    Never mind that the average show had more murders than happen in Hawaii in a year.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  25. I watch that video and the thing that stands out to me is the fraction of a second in which the officer had to act.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  26. JVW, If NPR reports the fact that a Police Dept. Spox said XYZ or witnesses described ABC it may turn out that they were wrong. But it’s still a fact that they said it, and if newsworthy it should be published.

    Not to be overly-pedantic, Time123, but if NPR reports the “fact” that a police spokesman said XYZ, then that “fact” should never have to be revoked unless it turns out that the reporter was using second-hand information that turned out not to be true. I think it’s clear that what NPR is acknowledging is that they are happy to report unconfirmed tidbits and present them as gospel until they later learn more.

    Maybe I would be more accepting of that if they showed a bit more reticence in accepting the woke-endorsed version of events and added subtle disclaimers such as “onlookers who claim to have witnessed the event said. . .” or “[some civil rights huckster who rushed to the scene to get his name in the news] allege that the victim was unarmed, though it is not yet clear upon what knowledge he is basing that claim.” But no; NPR has pretty much announced that they will run with the juiciest allegations right away, then only debunk them as they are forced to do so, and then rather quietly and as a gentle aside.

    JVW (ee64e4)

  27. They don’t challenge or correct the people they interview either.

    Yesterday, on CBS after the verdict someone was talking about Dwayne Wright and the person being interviewed said he ran because he was afraid of (being killed by) the police. Norah O’Donnell (I think) it was, just let that pass. She didn’t ask him: How did he know that?

    In actuality he was quite calm until she asked him to go out of the car or something like that. He was afraid of being arrested and having his bail revoked for a serious crime where he had not known up in court (according to Bill O’Reilly, he was out on $100,000 bail)

    His alleged crime? As I piece it together, assuming a few details, he and a friend had attended some kind of apart in December, 2019, pre-Covid. They went to the home of two girls (roommates) while there they heard that one of the girls was going to go the bank the next morning ad withdraw $820 and give it to the other girl to pay for the rent. So they made up some excuse not to leave at 2:30 am. The next day, one of the girls goes to the bank, withdraws the money, gives it to the other one, who “hides” it in her bra and leaves for work. Then Dwayne Wright and his friend demands the money.

    The woman says “Are you kidding?” He tells her he’s not kidding. He says he knows she has the money. He chokes her for a second. His friend tells her if she gives them the money they will leave. He chokes her again. Then she reaches into her bra and gives them…everything but the cash, which is still in her bra. They leave in a Mercedes. She calls the police. She probably has either the license plate numbers or their names. They get arrested.

    Now Kim Potter probably had no good reason to tell Dwayne Wright to hang up his cellphone which he had previously pt down (his mother was on the other end, which she probably didn’t know, and there was a girl with him in the car. Now she must have done that because she was about to arrest him. So much for saying she would tell him later why she wanted him out of the car.

    Sammy Finkelman (51cd0c)

  28. @27-
    Tell us how you really feel. Insulting the host of this blog is good way to get banned.

    [Yeah, I’m going to 86 that comment and ban the commenter because there truly is such a thing as being too much of an asshole troll for even my tastes. – JVW]

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  29. 25. Kevin M (ab1c11) — 4/21/2021 @ 10:54 am

    I watch that video and the thing that stands out to me is the fraction of a second in which the officer had to act.

    According to the 911 report, she or someone else had already pulled a knife several times without stabbing anyone – and he could see the people around her were not too afraid.

    Sammy Finkelman (51cd0c)

  30. Tell us how you really feel. Insulting the host of this blog is good way to get banned.

    It’s been banned hundreds of times under hundreds of pseuds. Keeps coming back with VPN.

    nk (1d9030)

  31. He was too far away for a taser to prevent it, but tasers are used too little – and what about tranquilizer darts?

    I think the solution is to train each and every police officer in martial arts and then issue them throwing stars. They can use the throwing stars against a suspect, striking the suspect’s hand with pinpoint accuracy, forcing them to drop their weapon. Once the suspect sees what the police officer can do, they will surely stop. Because you can’t stop a martial artist with throwing star. Fact.

    Hoi Polloi (093fb9)

  32. 28. I left out: Dwayne Wright and his friend also had a gun.

    And still he only faced a maximum of one year in jail.

    The shooting in Columbus Ohio was probably legal, but it was a sub-optimal outcome to the situation.

    Sammy Finkelman (51cd0c)

  33. JVW, Here’s the link to the NPR story. https://www.npr.org/2021/04/20/989342784/16-year-old-black-girl-who-called-for-help-fatally-shot-by-police-ohio-family-sa

    Your summary of their statement is incomplete. The full disclaimer is below.


    This is a developing story. Some facts reported by the media may later turn out to be wrong. We will focus on reports from police officials and other authorities, credible news outlets and reporters who are at the scene, and we will update as the situation develops.

    But rather then focus on what their disclaimer means let’s focus on their reporting.

    You said: “NPR has pretty much announced that they will run with the juiciest allegations right away, then only debunk them as they are forced to do so, and then rather quietly and as a gentle aside.”

    Their description of the shooting is below. It seems correct and fair based on what I know. What about their report do you find biased, sensational, or poorly done?

    Body camera footage shows an officer getting out of his patrol car as he responds to a commotion on the driveway of a home.

    As he approaches a group of people standing and shouting on the driveway, he asks, “What’s going on?” Seconds later Bryant and another girl begin fighting in front of the officer.

    Bryant can be seen pushing the girl to the ground. She then approaches a second girl and throws her against a car parked on the driveway. The officer shouts “Get down!” three times, pulls out his gun and shoots in Bryant’s direction at least four times and she falls to the ground.

    As the officer approaches her, a knife can be seen close to her.

    I think you’re way off base on this one. NPR wrote a lengthy and detailed report that included statements from the police, city, witnesses, and family. They fairly summarized the video, while letting readers know they hadn’t seen all of it. They ended with a disclaimer that we might learn more about this as time goes one and made it clear what sources they would focus on.

    Time123 (66d88c)

  34. Honestly the Fox pc about NPR is pretty misleading and seems to be guilty of the sensationalism you accuse NPR.

    Time123 (66d88c)

  35. Let me offer you some actual wisdom from someone who isn’t wishcasting, coping with the brute facts, or trying to curry media favor:

    “Post-Chauvin” cops are just gonna turn-up when someone has a deadly weapon, light them up, and then fill-out the paperwork. Chauvin’s problem was that the arrest itself became a public spectacle and the bodycam footage was not the version of events most people saw.

    All the controversial shootings & deaths in past year have involved botched arrests (Kenosha, Atlanta, and Brooklyn Park all involved attempted use of tazers).

    Upper-class Democrat lawyers and the compliant media, who by temperament and life history all HATE HATE HATE the police and their traditional job of protecting the normal middle-class from their opportunistic mayhem, made yuuuuge deals out of those situations because they offer the most opportunities to question officer judgment. They’ve been constantly trying to erode any special protections officers have in using force to detain someone.

    THEREFORE, officers who don’t make the donut shop their new home are MORE likely to use deadly force:

    1. Fewer points-of-contact for a worthless liberal prosecutor to second-guess decisions.
    2. Takes less time, so a crowd can’t gather and film it.
    3. The news won’t show any footage.
    4. These situations are easier for juries to understand because they share a similar set of assumptions to regular self/other-defense situation as opposed to the murky area of laying hands on someone and dragging them off. This also makes it harder for the DA to just invent charges.

    All of this is just downstream of their unforced error of insisting on bodycams for everyone during BLM 1.0:

    They thought it would cut-down on police brutality, but really it just made juries much more sympathetic to cops.

    That’s why most of these “flashpoint cases” involve prolonged-encounters where 3rd parties can gather, film and distribute incomplete footage of events that can be selectively edited.

    Officer of Correctness (1bb067)

  36. @35, I hope you’re wrong that the police will start killing people unnecessarily. If you’re correct about that it would be a reason to believe that the abolish the police crew have a point.

    Time123 (f5cf77)

  37. Officer, let me make sure I’m understanding you correctly:

    You think Chauvin’s mistake was… not just coming up and shooting the potential counterfeiter, and instead giving the public the chance to film his murder? And it’s your belief that other officers will take away that lesson?

    That’s a radically different take than the standard “kneeling on a guy’s neck who says he can’t breathe for 9 minutes was a bad idea.”

    nate_w (1f1d55)

  38. It would be a real irony if the girl who was killed was the same one who called the police.

    Sammy Finkelman (51cd0c)

  39. Time123:

    1. I quoted the same NPR disclaimer that you did.

    2. You sure are putting a lot of faith in NPR’s use of the word “focus,” and you appear to be taking it to mean exclusivity. And what exactly is the use of saying “the Columbus Dispatch is reporting. . .” if you don’t independently corroborate it? Once upon a time, that was considered to be an important part of journalism. Did you see the movie Richard Jewell? I watched it last week and I am fixated on the scene where the unethical Atlanta Journal-Constitution reporter pretty much lies to her editor and tells him “every other media outlet is about to run with this story and everyone will wonder how we let ourselves get scooped.” I think an awful lot of that goes on these days.

    3. Are you comfortable with the tidbit about Miss Bryant wielding a knife only being divulged in the ninth paragraph of the story? Don’t you think it’s a bit more salient than its placement, maybe even enough to qualify for the lede paragraph? The NPR story seems obsessed with the idea that Miss Bryant is the one who called the police to come to the scene, but pray tell exactly how the officer arriving on the scene was supposed to know which one of the combatants she was?

    Sorry, but I think the NPR story is deliberately written from the provocative angle of “yet another cop callously cuts down a young, black life” — at least as much as NPR felt they could get away with it — and given that the taxpayer is helping pay for this shoddy coverage I think they should be held to a higher standard. I can imagine an alternative universe where the cop did not shoot Miss Bryant right away and today’s headlines are instead “Cop stands by and watches as black teen is stabbed to death in fracas.”

    JVW (ee64e4)

  40. https://www.nytimes.com/2021/04/20/us/columbus-ohio-shooting.html

    “No matter what the circumstances, that family is in agony and they are in my prayers,” Ned Pettus Jr., the public safety director for the city of Columbus, said during the news conference.

    What family? She was in foster care.

    Well, she has an aunt:

    A woman interviewed by The Columbus Dispatch identified the victim, who was Black, as her teenage niece. The woman, Hazel Bryant, told the newspaper that her niece lived in a foster home and got into an altercation with someone else at the home…

    Sounds from the interview, that people think that the girl who was shot thought she was defending herself.

    Rayshawn Whiting said…“I’ve got daughters…And I’m tired of it. I feel like a polar bear with the ice caps melting. We have nowhere to run. If we protect ourselves, we go to jail. If we don’t, we die.”

    Chris Roberts said in an interview that he was in his backyard with his twin daughters when he heard the gunshots from just a few yards away. He said they ran in the house and called 911. Since the shooting, he said, his daughters did not want to be alone.

    “How do I teach my daughters when you call for help, and you expect help to come, you could be on the other side of the gun?” he said.

    Sammy Finkelman (51cd0c)

  41. Trump is irrelevant to the problem and bringing him up just gives the media a crutch they don’t deserve

    steveg (ebe7c1)

  42. Time123:

    2. You sure are putting a lot of faith in NPR’s use of the word “focus,” and you appear to be taking it to mean exclusivity. And what exactly is the use of saying “the Columbus Dispatch is reporting. . .” if you don’t independently corroborate it?

    to provide credit and clarity about where information is coming from. The Dispatch gets credit and the reader knows where it came from

    Once upon a time, that was considered to be an important part of journalism. Did you see the movie Richard Jewell? I watched it last week and I am fixated on the scene where the unethical Atlanta Journal-Constitution reporter pretty much lies to her editor and tells him “every other media outlet is about to run with this story and everyone will wonder how we let ourselves get scooped.” I think an awful lot of that goes on these days.

    The rush to be first does lead to a lot of errors.

    3. Are you comfortable with the tidbit about Miss Bryant wielding a knife only being divulged in the ninth paragraph of the story?

    It’s the 8th paragraph and 9th sentence. I don’t think they hid it at all. Especially since they spend a lot of time on the facts around that.

    Don’t you think it’s a bit more salient than its placement, maybe even enough to qualify for the lede paragraph? The NPR story seems obsessed with the idea that Miss Bryant is the one who called the police to come to the scene, but pray tell exactly how the officer arriving on the scene was supposed to know which one of the combatants she was?

    The NPR piece makes it very clear that she was attacking at least 2 other girls with a knife. They have a subheading Footage reveals fight before shooting Other then the fact that you didn’t like the lede what was shoddy about their article? What facts did they get wrong? What have they not told the reader?

    Time123 (66d88c)

  43. Wanted to add, I think the article would have been better if they’d opened the way you suggest. But that’s a far different criticism then what you accused initially.

    Time123 (66d88c)

  44. What the 911 call said: (a second call came as the police car arrived) The caller was young *referred to a grandma)

    https://news.yahoo.com/columbus-ohio-police-released-911-181327227.html

    Paul Squire,Charles Davis

    Wed, April 21, 2021, 2:13 PM

    Police in Columbus, Ohio, on Wednesday released the 911 call that ultimately led to a police officer shooting and killing 16-year-old Ma’Khia Bryant a day before.

    In the call, a woman can be heard telling the dispatcher an address, angry voices in the background, and pleading for police to “come over here.” People, she said, are “over here trying to fight us, trying to stab us, trying to put hands on our grandma.”

    The woman did not respond when asked a number of times whether she saw any weapons.

    “We need a police officer over here now. We need a crisis officer over here now,” the woman said before hanging up moments later.

    Another woman also called 911, but by the time they were able to speak to an operator police were already arriving.

    Those were the only two calls placed in regard to the incident, interim Police Chief Michael Woods said at a news conference on Wednesday. A criminal investigation is underway, he said.

    Sammy Finkelman (51cd0c)

  45. It’s going to take at least another 6 to 12 hours for the facts to become clearer.

    Sammy Finkelman (51cd0c)

  46. I think you’re way off base on this one. NPR wrote a lengthy and detailed report that included statements from the police, city, witnesses, and family. They fairly summarized the video

    They did not fairly summarize the video. When I watch the video, I see Bryant lunging at another female with a knife, with the other female pinned against a car with no room to escape or evade.

    Hoi Polloi (093fb9)

  47. “How do I teach my daughters when you call for help, and you expect help to come, you could be on the other side of the gun?” he said.

    Easy. Once the cops are on the scene, drop the knife and comply by letting the cops handle it.
    We’ve got one kid coming in for a stomp right in front of a cop and another big powerful looking girl lunging with a big knife in front of a cop. Show your kids the tape and say: Don’t do this here and don’t do that either.

    steveg (ebe7c1)

  48. It was her aunt who said the first 911 caller was the girl who was killed. She also has cousins, one of whom is a former city council member and a mother whom she loved very much (according to the former city council member cousin)

    Sammy Finkelman (51cd0c)

  49. The police arrived 12 minutes after the first 911 call.

    In another video, a police officer is shown bringing witnesses to police vehicles while taping off the crime scene. One witness says: “She came after me with a knife so he got her.”

    Sammy Finkelman (51cd0c)

  50. @46, You left out the part where she threw another girl to the ground. NPR put that part in as well as making clear she was attacking a 2nd girl with the knife.

    Time123 (66d88c)

  51. Governor of Ohio soeaking more generally about what he’s done to cut down on police shotings:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CK-qx_UeeF4

    One commet on that YouTube page says:

    They said the girls she had tried to stab had come to her house to fight her. Four against one. She was the one who called police I heard. Tragically she ended up getting shot.Wheather justified or unjustified tragic none the less. Parents need to be held accountable. Big dude needs to be charged.

    Sammy Finkelman (51cd0c)

  52. Q. How many knives were there there? Just one?

    Sammy Finkelman (51cd0c)

  53. Sammy, it was a house with a kitchen. lots of knives

    Time123 (66d88c)

  54. Was her grandmother the person who was getting money for providing foster care?

    Sammy Finkelman (51cd0c)

  55. Please add the Biden White House to Team Inherent Insanity and Malpractice.

    “White House Press Secretary Jen Psaki, for some reason, left out the fact that Ma’Khia Bryan was armed with a knife and literally lunging at another girl when she was shot and killed by a Columbus, Ohio police officer on Tuesday”

    https://twitchy.com/gregp-3534/2021/04/21/press-sec-jen-psaki-left-out-one-tiny-detail-when-speaking-of-the-police-shooting-of-makhia-bryant/amp/?__twitter_impression=true

    Obudman (a5ef55)

  56. For instance, Pat, how sure are you that the girl with the knife was the initial aggressor? That she wasn’t trying to protect herself?

    I am sure of what I need to be sure of because I watched the video, and the fact that you are asking these questions strongly suggests to me that you haven’t yet. I think you should.

    More specifically, you have asked two different questions. I have no idea who the “initial aggressor” was and I don’t much care. Let’s say the girl in pink, five minutes earlier, had punched our knife-wielding teenager for no reason. She would have been the initial aggressor. That would still not legally justify what I see in the video.

    As for the notion that the decedent was protecting herself: um, no. Just no. Seriously, watch the video. You’ll see what I mean.

    Patterico (0d5408)

  57. [Yeah, I’m going to 86 that comment and ban the commenter because there truly is such a thing as being too much of an asshole troll for even my tastes. – JVW]

    What did I miss?

    Patterico (e349ce)

  58. how sure are you that the girl with the knife was the initial aggressor? That she wasn’t trying to protect herself?

    It’s axiomatic that when an officer uses force against a black person the use of force was wrong an motivated by race.

    Axioms are accepted truths that aren’t proven.

    Time123 (66d88c)

  59. Her mother, Paula Bryant, says her daughter Ma’Khia Bryant was an honor roll student and a sweet child. It is confidential why she was in foster care (even if by her grandmother) Her name has been spelled more ways than one.

    It was initially reported (based on an aunt?) that she was 15 years old but now all reports seem to agree she was 16 years old.

    Sammy Finkelman (51cd0c)

  60. Found it. Reeks of Steppe Nomad.

    Patterico (e349ce)

  61. What did I miss?

    I think I marked the comment as Spam rather than trashing it, so you can go in and read it if you want.

    JVW (ee64e4)

  62. ‘Why would a newspaper not report the clear evidence that the girl was attacking another girl with a knife that was visible in her hand for all the world to see? Why would newspaper headlines make this about race?

    Donald Trump poisoned media criticism; even when the media misbehaved, calling it out always fed into a narrative that protected an administration fueled by lies.’

    No.

    Speaking as a career alumnus of big, eyeball-and-ratings-chasing-corporate-print-and-broadcast ‘media elite,’ Trump, a media-created creature himself, nailed the industry cold with its own tools. He pinpointed a criticism, albeit with the very carpet-bombing flamboyance big media is always drawn to- and though not new, it has been long overdue in this era.

    The ‘folks’ who poisoned the media well in this era are the media themselves. That, and that alone is the ‘media malpractice’ to weep over. The ‘thirtysomething’ news directors and editors, caught in a profit-driven ratings race, driven by management to make a buck or by themselves to make a career. And, “if it bleeds, it leads” still reigns. 5,000 planes landing safely isn’t news; 1 crashing is.

    That’s all it is: entertainment killed news; film at 11. So Patrick, who is not alone in this and who I generally agree with on this issue- is ‘mad as hell and not going to take it anymore?!’ 😉

    Start by abandoning Twitter; there was life on Earth before it. Bodycams/smartphone videos and such are ubiquitous these days, turning the editorless, average Joe into an untrained street reporter on social media; an unpaid stringer; a cost-effective source for content using a technology still largely limited by the very medium itself. It’s like observing the world through a straw. This same observation -and criticism- was raised during the riots and protests of the 1960s. And critics claimed field reporters, editors, film and sound crews who brought the carnage of the Vietnam War into American living rooms every night accelerated the end of that wasteful conflict. And why, during the Gulf War, the Pentagon imposed the tightest restrictions on battlefield press coverage in American military history.

    Strongly recommend all armchair ‘media critics’ watch- several times if necessary- the prescient, 1976 film ‘Network’ to educate themselves on the whys and ways things are today. You can’t follow the play by play unless you know the rules of the game. Crafted as satire by experienced media talents of their time- [not all that long ago BTW]- ‘Network’ has grown to become a dark blueprint for how the modern media landscape was constructed and operates- as seasoned media people know all too well. It is quite accurate, too; I have met and worked with the sort of characters depicted in that flick.

    News divisions were once loss leaders; operating as a ‘public service’ to meet license renewal particulars. They did not make money; Bill Paley famously quipped the entire annual CBS News division budget was paid for by the profits from one entertainment program: ‘I Love Lucy.’ It wasn’t until the 1980s that news divisions were pushed to be profit centers [as ‘Network’ predicted] by stockholders as the corporate takeover era took root which coincided w/sports and entertainment production techniques successfully bleeding into news coverage– as the rise of ABC News, a perennial third place news source, demonstrated — [thank you, Roone Arledge.] Cable, a much less regulated platform than broadcast, allowed Ted Turner’s cable TV experiment, “CNN” to successfully make ‘news’ a programing package to sell ads around, 24/7–worldwide, no less. The coup de grâce was the Reagan Administration killing the Fairness Doctrine.

    ‘Sybil The Soothsayer;’ ‘Vox Populi’ … ‘Mata Hari and her Skeletons In The Closet’… it’s all a fiction that’s very real now. And there are Howard Beales on every news outlet, every night. Personally, I get the bulk of my ‘news’ now from the BBC. The newscablers are merely for amusement viewing…

    Because the audience– Americans– don’t want to be governed–they wish to be entertained.

    “You know, Barbara, the Arabs have decided to jack up the price of oil another 20%… uh, the CIA has been caught opening Senator Humphrey’s mail… there’s a civil war in Angola… another one in Beirut… the, uh, New York City’s still facing default… they finally caught up with Patricia Hearst… [a helicpoter flew on Mars]… and the whole front page of the “Daily News” is Howard Beale.” – Diana Christensen [Faye Dunaway] ‘Network’ 1976

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  63. One thing that really bothers me about this is that I think there’s a good point about the need to do a better job holding public officials accountable, police included. The fact that people are treating this one in a dishonest way and not acknowledging the city did what they’re supposed to in being transparent really diminishes their credibility. I’m glad that there are some people updating their statements and reporting when details become public (NPR, Balko) but it’s far too few.

    Time123 (66d88c)

  64. I’m glad that there are some people updating their statements and reporting when details become public (NPR, Balko) but it’s far too few.

    I continue to assert that NPR is being deliberately provocative and is chasing clicks by staying with their original headline, “Columbus Police Shoot And Kill Black, Teenage Girl.” If you go to that article, there is plenty of room in the headline to include the words “Wielding Knife” at the end. They could also provide a direct link in their article the exact same YouTube video which Patterico has embedded in this post, yet for whatever reason they do not do that, they only link to another news source who has embedded the video.

    And the full URL of the NPR piece ends with “16-year-old-black-girl-who-called-for-help-fatally-shot-by-police-ohio-family-sa” which again, even though it’s just a URL is needlessly inflammatory.

    Finally, given the debate we had over their disclaimer, I think they owe it to readers to provide a list of all earlier information they have given out which has turned out to be incorrect. For instance, I seem to recall that early on they told us Miss Bryant is currently in foster care, yet the article as it is up now includes interviews with her aunt and mother. What gives? With whom was Miss Bryant residing? Also, we still don’t have clarification with respect to who exactly called the police. They continue to tell us in the lede that Miss Bryant herself made the call, but several paragraphs down the caller suddenly becomes “an unidentified woman” and Sammy provided us with a news item in which the aunt was named as the caller. We are also told that the caller claimed that the other girls instigated the melee, but we have no information as to whether they were placed under arrest.

    So sorry, I’m not going to give NPR very much credit for filling in the holes; I think they published their click-bait story with the provocative headline and are pretty much content to leave it at that.

    JVW (ee64e4)

  65. @64.You’ll never see this:

    “Nameless Black Capitol Cop Shoots And Kills White Woman Ashli Babbitt.”

    Especially if it’s true: it doesn’t fit the narrative.

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  66. Pat, I’ve seen the video. I believe I watched her push another girl down (and not stab her), and I see her rushing at the other girl, but it’s not at all clear to me she’s going to stab her, but even if she is going to, I still want to know if she was the initial aggressor because (and I may be ignorant here) that seems like it would matter:

    If she’s at HER house, in a a recently stand-your-ground-law state, and those girls came to HER house to attack her and her family, then correct me if I’m wrong, but she is within her rights to try to chase away people from her home, even if with a knife, without being shot for doing so.

    Now, I certainly think she handled it badly, but I’m not ready to condemn the media for not painting the dead girl as a villain and the police officer as (at least partially) the hero of the situation. It may be my ignorance of what rights stand-your-ground confers to her, but my question of who the “initial aggressor” was matters to me (admittedly possibly because I’m ignorant).

    I understand that I may be completely wrong here and I welcome those who are more knowledgeable about the law (and specifically Ohio law) to relieve me of my possible ignorance.

    nate_w (1f1d55)

  67. JVW, I think we just disagree on the NPR piece. I too would like them to make their corrections and updates clear. But as it stands now it’s a thorough summary of what happened that requires reading all of 9 sentences to learn the deceased was wielding a knife. If they made mistakes early on (and I don’ know that they did as i haven’t seen the original) they’re fixing them as they learn new information, but the should be making those mistakes clear to the reader. At least they’re not ignoring them or doubling down.

    Time123 (66d88c)

  68. Chauvin and the arresting officers should have made this calculation: better for Floyd to ‘accidentally’ get shot

    What a vile thing to say.

    Alas, the calculations he made were professional (get control of the situation) rather than political (protect myself from department retribution). And thanks to that, the careerist prosecutors, police chiefs, and USE OF FORCE EXPERTS all testified against him, though perhaps some were under duress,

    Cool conspiracy theory.

    Just when I’m annoyed that people with a point I agree with are hurting their credibility you come along and remind us all that there are even worse people out there.

    Time123 (66d88c)

  69. President Plagiarist and Kamala the Wonder Nurse are ‘stoking racism.’

    He is truly a very bad and evil man.

    America is not systemically racism.

    If it was, the Obama/Biden ticket would never have been elected… twice. Nor would a brain damaged Irish-Catholic with a VP running mate, an African American woman w/South Asian heritage in 2020.

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  70. ^racism = racist

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  71. @23 (Sammy) “No. There had been a report of some girl(s) pulling a knife but the policeman who shot and killed her saw no stab victims or people running away. Instead people were still near her! The policeman didn’t understand he didn’t get there right at the beginning of the incident but he acted like he had.”

    Imminent was referring to the picture posted in the article where the girl in black was literally swinging a knife toward the girl in pink who was lifting her leg in self defense…the moments before the shots. If that isn’t imminent danger of significant injury, then I have no idea what is

    AJ_Liberty (ec7f74)

  72. Now, I certainly think she handled it badly, but I’m not ready to condemn the media for not painting the dead girl as a villain and the police officer as (at least partially) the hero of the situation.

    Let me suggest this, nate_w: Under normal circumstances we might be more forgiving of the media for not highlighting the fact that Miss Bryant was wielding a knife, and it might not matter as much if the story was slanted in a way so as to suggest that the officer had overreacted. But this story broke on the very same day as the Derek Chauvin verdict was announced (in fact, I believe within one hour of that verdict), so I would submit to you that of all days for this to happen the media had a much more urgent obligation to avoid sensationalism in their reporting of Miss Bryant’s tragic death, yet they unsurprisingly utterly failed to rise up to the occasion.

    JVW (ee64e4)

  73. @73 JVW, I hadn’t considered how the days events made accuracy there even more important then usual. that’s a very good point I should have considered.

    Time123 (66d88c)

  74. I’ve just sent two comments to the spam file.

    Dana (fd537d)

  75. Who is this guy that keeps chiming in under different names with his all capital outbursts?

    norcal (01e272)

  76. JVW (ee64e4) — 4/21/2021 @ 1:36 pm

    I seem to recall that early on they told us Miss Bryant is currently in foster care, yet the article as it is up now includes interviews with her aunt and mother. What gives? With whom was Miss Bryant residing?

    My guess would be her grandmother and one or more siblings, and her grandmother was being paid to do that. Interestingly, a cousin used to be on the City Council.

    Also, we still don’t have clarification with respect to who exactly called the police. They continue to tell us in the lede that Miss Bryant herself made the call, but several paragraphs down the caller suddenly becomes “an unidentified woman” and Sammy provided us with a news item in which the aunt was named as the caller.

    No, I believe the aunt named her niece as the caller.

    It’s still a bit unclear, I’m not sure her aunt has her facts straight and maybe reporters got what she told them wrong.

    She is reported to have said the girl who was killed was 15 years old but she seems to have been 16. The aunt is also now maintaining that the girl dropped the knife before she was shot or did yesterday.

    https://www.dispatch.com/story/news/crime/2021/04/20/one-person-killed-officer-involved-shooting-east-side/7309088002

    Hazel Bryant told The Dispatch that she is the aunt of Ma’Khia Bryant. The girl lived in a foster home there on Legion Lane and got into an altercation with someone else at the home, she said.

    Bryant said her niece had a knife, but maintained that the girl dropped the knife before she was shot multiple times by a police officer.

    Sammy Finkelman (51cd0c)

  77. https://www.thedailybeast.com/columbus-police-fatally-shoot-a-person-as-derek-chauvin-guilty-verdict-comes-down

    Bryant said her niece had been living in a foster home on the east side of Columbus, where the fatal shooting took place. She said several adult women had come to the foster home and started an altercation with the teenager, who called police, and her biological father and grandmother for help. She grabbed a knife to defend herself, Bryant said.

    Bryant, who said she had been told of the events by Ma’Khia’s grandmother and father, said Ma’khia was in front of the house fending off a physical assault when police arrived.

    “The police are going to lie. I’m so thankful that someone from the family was actually on the scene,” Bryant said before the release of the bodycam footage.

    So now here her grandmpther and father were called to the scene before the police.

    Sammy Finkelman (51cd0c)

  78. I’m impressed with the officer’s accuracy. The girl with the knife was very close to the girl in pink.

    norcal (01e272)

  79. https://meaww.com/who-is-hazel-bryant-ma-khia-bryant-aunt-says-adults-came-to-fight-niece-16-at-foster-home-shooting

    …According to the victim’s aunt, several adult women had come to the foster home and started an altercation with the teenager, who had then called the police, her biological father as well as her grandmother for help…Franklin County Children Services (FCCS) released a statement saying that Bryant, 16, was a foster child who was under the care of the Franklin County Children Services…

    [Hazel Bryant is very prejudiced against the police]

    There’s another family member yet in the picture:

    In an interview with The Daily Beast, Bryant’s great-grandmother Ila compared Ma’Khia’s death to that of Breonna Taylor, who was shot and killed during a no-knock raid on her apartment last year. “It looks to me like that’s what the police wanted to do, to kill her. I’m just trying to figure out why,” Ila Bryant said. “We have to remember that we should love each other.”

    Sammy Finkelman (51cd0c)

  80. https://www.wlwt.com/article/columbus-officials-urge-the-public-not-to-rush-to-judgment-in-officer-involved-shooting/36191952#

    Woods said he could not confirm Bryant lived in the neighborhood where she was killed, but a woman who answered the door told WLWT she was Bryant’s foster mother. She declined to comment further.

    So in foster care but in contact with her family, (except maybe her mother?)

    Sammy Finkelman (51cd0c)

  81. Foster home, my aunt. Dollars to donuts it’s a group home or halfway house for unmanageable minors. I lived across one for boys for a while. Every weekend, almost on a schedule, one of them would go gonzo and be taken away kicking and screaming by police and paramedics. The usual suspects passing by would pause and whip out their phones in case something happened interesting enough to put on YouTube.

    nk (1d9030)

  82. A brief aside on how family foster works (at least in my experience with kids):

    When things are bad and a parent recognizes it and realizes they can’t take care of their kids, a lot of times they will voluntarily give either temporary or permanent custody to a relative or friend. This isn’t foster care, it’s giving up custody.

    Sometimes they don’t recognize it or don’t want to give up custody and things get so bad that the state steps in. The state’s preference is for family foster. Generally speaking, the state prefers (all things being equal) that the kid remains with their biological family. Also people are more willing to become foster parents to their family than to random strangers, so it expands their foster parent base and leaves more options for kids who don’t have family who can/will foster them.

    In my experience this happens most with addiction issues or sometimes with a parent whose significant other is abusive and they have chosen the significant other over the kids (OMG it makes me so mad when I run into that situation). The state appears to be more willing to permanently remove parental rights and move a child to the adoption group if the parent themselves is abusive.

    A family foster may also be less likely to push for removal of parental rights because it could be more disruptive of the family (sometimes they are more likely, though, because they too have been dealing with that parent).

    So, while yes, they are being paid, a stranger foster would also have been paid and it is not, generally speaking (and again in may experience) not usually the motivator for taking in the child.

    Nic (896fdf)

  83. Unbelievable…..

    Murkowski bucks her party to back Biden’s pick for DOJ No. 3

    Sen. Lisa Murkowski voted Wednesday to confirm Vanita Gupta to the No. 3 position at the Justice Department (associate attorney general), blowing up her party’s effort to make Democrats solely own the confirmation.

    Senate Republicans have spent weeks speaking out against Gupta, describing her as a “radical” who would defund the police. They’ve also criticized her past statements on decriminalizing drugs and heavily signaled that their entire 50-member conference would stay unified against her. …..

    But Murkowski, who voted to convict Donald Trump in the former president’s second impeachment trial, had other plans. During floor remarks ahead of a final vote, the senator said that after meeting with Gupta, she was impressed by “the passion that [the nominee] carries with her with the work that she performs” and said Gupta is “deeply committed to matters of justice.”
    ……
    Gupta had unanimous support from Senate Democrats, who praised her credentials and were quick to note her endorsements from several law enforcement groups, including the Fraternal Order of Police, which endorsed former President Donald Trump twice. Gupta also has backing from Grover Norquist and Bill Kristol.
    …….

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  84. Want to make a fortune? Invent a weapon that is

    1) Non-lethal 95% of the item
    2) Easy to use, with the handling, range and accuracy of a Glock.
    3) Is guaranteed to put a 300-pound man down almost immediately if you hit him X times mid-body.
    4) Is not trivially defeated by clothing, such as leather.
    5) If automatic fire is required to accomplish these things, that’s OK.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  85. I don’t know why it’s unbelievable. The party hasn’t been particularly supportive of Murkowski in the past and she isn’t beholden to them at all, having won an outlaw 3rd party write-in campaign with zero party support. She’s free to vote her conscience (probably more free than usual if certain members are being obnoxious to her).

    Nic (896fdf)

  86. I’m impressed with the officer’s accuracy.

    Accuracy while thinking and acting fast. Compare that to the cops who killed Breonna Taylor while shooting at (and not hitting) someone else.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  87. @ Time 123 Here’s the thing about conspiracy theories. It’s all about confirmation bias and contraction denial. Once people begin or are led to believe something, they will look for any evidence, no matter how flimsy, to confirm their belief and deny any evidence, no matter how concrete, to the contrary. Any and all evidence that disproves the conspiracy is evidence of a cover up.

    That’s why you cannot reason with these people. They are going to believe what they believe, no matter what.

    I don’t know about this shooting. It appears to me that this knife-wielding woman in black was attacking this unarmed woman in pink. Therefore, the police officer was justified in the shooting, in defense of others. I don’t know and I am not on the jury, but if it were I would find this officer not guilty.

    Gawain's Ghost (b25cd1)

  88. OK, here’s my boringly both-sides take. First, I share your assessment of the police shootings you’ve been writing about, and I co-sign your contempt for the mainstream media’s failure to report them accurately, much less to contextualize them with accurate racial data. And I agree that those reporting failures are detrimental to our social fabric.

    But without contradicting any of that, there’s also compelling, data-supported evidence for racial inequities in the criminal justice system. It gets obsessively reported on by your counterparts on the defense side of the criminal bar, including someone with whom I believe you share a mutual admiration, Ken White. And now we’re getting to the source of my frustration.

    With the caveat that I don’t follow either Ken’s or your Twitter feeds diligently enough to be sure I haven’t missed something important, my impression on matters like police shootings is that you make Tweet-length arguments for the points you’ve made here and on Substack, and then you mix it up and deservedly dunk on usual suspects like certified imbecile, Seth Abramson. And Ken does the same thing from his side, likewise dunking on low-hanging-fruit a-holes like Tucker Carlson. But when you and Ken talk to each other, it’s typically to pile on to one to each other’s nutpicking. I rarely if ever see either of you confront the other’s arguments, and that’s the debate I want to see. I don’t need anyone to tell me Seth Abramson and Tucker Carlson shouldn’t be taken seriously. I do think, however, that we’d all benefit from seeing two smart, well-informed, friends grapple with the best arguments that complicate or may even somewhat undermine their positions.

    (To be fair, I think Ken’s anti-cop views are more knee-jerk and less nuanced than your pro-cop ones. As I’ve said here before, I think cops are his blind spot. But my point that both your and his readerships would benefit from you two having to respectfully confront uncomfortable realities that can’t be laughed off as when they come out of the mouths of blithering idiots stands.)

    lurker (59504c)

  89. I don’t know why it’s unbelievable. The party hasn’t been particularly supportive of Murkowski in the past and she isn’t beholden to them at all, having won an outlaw 3rd party write-in campaign with zero party support. She’s free to vote her conscience (probably more free than usual if certain members are being obnoxious to her).

    What I find really unbelievable are the “endorsements from several law enforcement groups, including the Fraternal Order of Police, which endorsed former President Donald Trump twice. Gupta also has backing from Grover Norquist and Bill Kristol.”

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  90. @Rip@89 Ah, in that case I have no idea. Maybe she seemed really honest or straight up or something in her various projects and they decided she’s the best they are likely to get? You can respect someone on the other side and maybe it’s better to have someone you respect in the job than someone you don’t? No idea really, just rampant speculation. 😛

    Nic (896fdf)

  91. Want to make a fortune? Invent a weapon that is

    Not made out of plastic or any other material that gives the same tactile sensation as a sex toy. If you know about secondary stimuli, you know what I’m talking about.

    Ditch the Glocks and Axons and issue metal and wood weapons again. Because, now, you know, that .833 of a second? when they pull the gun or Taser, they waste most of it fighting the reflex of where to stick it.

    It’s science, I’m telling you.

    nk (1d9030)

  92. For those fortunate enough to have avoided psychology, when somebody says “That looks delicious”, that’s a secondary stimulus. You can’t taste with your eyes, but you associate the look of the food with the taste of the food.

    nk (1d9030)

  93. But without contradicting any of that, there’s also compelling, data-supported evidence for racial inequities in the criminal justice system.

    All you have to know about that is: would this shooting have taken place as it did in Beverly Hills? If these were two BH housewives, one holding a knife, the other holding a barbecue fork. Would the officer be so quick to shoot?

    Officers approach a situation with an expectation, and that expectation differs by zip code. Now, maybe it’s based on the general behavior of people IN that zip code, but it’s still a bias and that bias still has consequences. Not everyone there behaves like the “average” person they’re expecting, but are they reacting to what they see, or what they expect to see?

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  94. @84. “Phasers on stun.” 😉

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  95. 75.Who is this guy that keeps chiming in under different names with his all capital outbursts?

    He outta use the handle, ‘Spanish Inquisition.’

    “Nobody expects the Spanish Inquisition!” – ‘Monty Python’s Flying Circus’ BBC TV, 9/22/1970

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  96. RIP ecdysiast Tempest Storm (93).

    “Everything you see,” Ms. Storm proudly told an interviewer in 1975, “is all mine.”

    Rip Murdock (46eeea)

  97. It would be worth your time to say a prayer for this cop who has to carry this event with him for the rest of his life. That’s a lot even without half the country deciding he is public enemy #1.

    Dustin (4237e0)

  98. #97
    Agreed
    Very thoughtful of you to bring that up. Thank you

    steveg (ebe7c1)

  99. You only like capitalism when it is on your side uncle milty would not consider you a good capitalist. Neither would ayn rand or her serial killer boy friend hickman. Start your own that is what they would tell you as the didn’t believe in monoplys being a problem.

    asset (096ec9)

  100. 76/ 77. 81. 82. I have a way of coming up with a detailed picture based on a few facts, and them when, I learn a certain fact is wrong, coming up with another detailed picture.

    I thought it was most likely that her grandmother was the person in charge of the foster care because in the 911 call (which seems to have been made by the girl who was killed in Columbus, Ohio) she says that people are “over here trying to fight us, trying to stab us, trying to put hands on our grandma.”

    Our grandma would seem to imply at least one sibling.

    But then later there is the claim that her grandmother was there (along with her biological father) because she had called them. One person said she was her foster mother but didn’t want to say anything else to a reporter.

    So this is consistent with nk’s thought that this was a group home or halfway house for unmanageable minors. We’re not getting too many facts. although the denoughment is clear.

    The policeman didn’t expect that, almost as soon as he got there, one girl would be going after the other with a knife. He didn’t have much time to plan.

    Sammy Finkelman (51cd0c)

  101. “Hero Cop Saves Unarmed Teenage Black Girl” is the only appropriate headline.

    Ryan (ac0a7f)

  102. Great post. The media and the social media mobs have been pushing this narrative for years. And the emo crowd jumps every time they are told to. Look at what LeBron James had to say about this, practically put a target on that cops back.

    Racists.

    JD (092f7d)

  103. JD!!!!

    Patterico (e349ce)

  104. Look at what LeBron James had to say about this, practically put a target on that cops back.

    Or on himself; works both ways– that is, if you’re mind-mushed enough to be swayed by someone who is an authority on running back and forth in a tank-top and shorts, bouncing a watermelon-sized rubber ball and tossing it into a peach basket. It’s not like he builds and flies helicopters on Mars.

    DCSCA (f4c5e5)

  105. We have the name of the foster mother – Angela Moore. Yes. she had a sibling there, a younger sister. There was a third, unrelated, child there also. (so not a group home.)

    https://www.nytimes.com/2021/04/21/us/columbus-police-shooting-bryant.html

    It was Valentine’s Day [2020, before Covid was thought to be a priblem in the United States] ,when Ma’Khia Bryant, 16, moved into the foster home where her younger sister had lived for more than a year. The girls were close, and would dance and make TikTok videos together, while Ms. Bryant nurtured a constant hope: to one day live again with her biological mother.

    “That’s all she said, was, ‘I want to be with my mom,’” said Angela Moore, who said she provided foster care for Ms. Bryant and her sister on a quiet block on the southeastern edge of Columbus, Ohio…

    In her 911 call, the caller, more than once, avoided answering a question about weapons.

    More:

    An unidentified girl appeared to fall to the grass after being attacked by Ms. Bryant and then kicked by an unidentified man.

    Ma’Khia Bryant’s father? That’s great {not] Or a boyfriend?

    The people at the scene were very surprised by the shooting.

    Another thing: The person, or one of the persons who came there was a former resident of the foster home. The initial cause of the argument is unbelievable.

    Ms. Moore said that she was at work during the shooting, but that she believed the fight began over an argument about housekeeping. She said one of her former foster children had visited the home on Tuesday and criticized Ms. Bryant and her sister for having messy bedrooms.

    “That’s where the problem came,” Ms. Moore said. “I didn’t know they had called the police.”

    Who called the police? One of the two sisters? The younger sister?

    Sammy Finkelman (51cd0c)

  106. ‘No opportunity’ to de-escalate: Use-of-force experts say Columbus officer obeyed training in shooting Ma’Khia Bryant

    An Ohio criminal-justice professor who studies the fatal use of force by law-enforcement officers didn’t hesitate to render an opinion after watching body-camera video of a Columbus police officer fatally shooting a 16-year-old girl Tuesday afternoon on the city’s Southeast Side.

    “My first impression is that the officer was legally justified in using deadly force,” said Philip Stinson, a Bowling Green State University professor who has compiled nationwide statistics on fatal shootings that have led to criminal charges against officers.

    “It’s a terribly tragic situation, and my heart goes out to the girl and her family and friends,” he told The Dispatch Wednesday. “But from looking at the video, it appears to me that a reasonable police officer would have had a reasonable apprehension of an imminent threat of serious bodily injury or death being imposed against an officer or someone else. That’s the legal standard.”
    …….
    James Scanlon, a retired Columbus Division of Police SWAT officer who spent 33 years with the division, has since trained officers, and served as an expert witness at trials in use-of-force cases, agreed with Stinson’s assessment of the video.

    “An officer is justified in using deadly force if his life or the life of someone else is at risk,” Scanlon said Wednesday. “Few would argue that there weren’t at least two lives there that were at serious risk.”

    In this case, Scanlon said, (the officer) wasn’t trying to protect himself, “but to save the life of someone he doesn’t even know. … It’s a shame that no one has recognized that that officer, in all likelihood, saved one or more lives.”
    …….
    Not when there are political points to be scored.

    Rip Murdock (d2a2a8)

  107. John Podhoretz described the video in his column in today’s New York Post:

    https://nypost.com/2021/04/21/jen-psaki-baselessly-and-disgracefully-racialized-the-killing-in-columbus

    Believe your own eyes, Jen Psaki. Watch the bodycam footage that shows 16-year-old Ma’Khia Bryant charging first one fellow teenager, then a second. The second girl was slammed against a car, at which point Bryant began to swing her right arm — with a knife in her hand.

    The police officer whose camera recorded the event had told her to “get down,” and she hadn’t done so. He had only a split second to react as she aimed the knife and readied to swing. He fired.

    Believe your own eyes. She had a knife. Had she not been stopped, that knife would have gone into the body of the girl on the car. The police officer was witness to a violent act in real time and interceded the only way he could.

    It still hasn’t been established how sharp that knife was, and maybe it will turn out to be a butter knife, but how could the officer tell??

    Sammy Finkelman (51cd0c)

  108. He goes over again:

    At the five-second mark in the video, the officer has gotten out of his car and is asking someone on the street, “What’s going on?” Two seconds — two seconds — later, the first girl being chased by Bryant falls to the ground.

    “Hey! Hey!” the cop says at the nine-second mark, as he spots Bryant turning toward the second girl. At the 10-second mark, he says with great urgency, “Get down! Get down! Get down!”

    It’s now the 12-second mark. The cop has removed his gun from his holster. At 13 seconds, Bryant’s arm is drawn. At 14, we see Bryant fall to the ground.

    This wasn’t great urgency. And he he probably wasn’t speaking to the girl with the knife, whom he considered a lost cause.

    He repeated “Get down” three times. If he meant her, he should have said something like “Let go of the knife” or “STOP” You’re going to kill her!” Or something like that.

    “Get down” sounds like advice to some other people there. That’s what someone says when they are bout to fire a gun or gunfire is coming.

    He didn’t want to hit any innocent bystanders. How does it make sense to say “Get down” to the girl with the knife, or the girl she was attacking?

    Believe your ears.

    Sammy Finkelman (51cd0c)

  109. It makes more sense for anyone there to assume “Get down” to be aimed at the girl whom Ma’khia Bryant was aiming the knife at, and that she should drop like the other girl. Which would mean he was a poor observer, (she was being cornered) and also that he wasn’t going to shoot. (because he’s telling the girl how to protect herself)

    He had also said: “Hey, hey” . That was possibly aimed at the girl with the knife. But when he said “get down” If he meant her to listen, he might raised his voice each time he repeated “Get down” or stress his words more in any other way. And

    It was not at all clear what he meant and to whom he was speaking to, and the girl with the knife seems the least likely possibility.

    You know, they’re saying that now, but I think “Get down” was addressed to all the people milling around.

    Sammy Finkelman (51cd0c)

  110. The 911 caller said “females” (according to what is likely a paraphrase by the police) not “people” were there trying to stab them and put their hands on them.

    Looking it over again, the policeman said “Hey” more than two times, and he advanced toward the conflict, so the girl who was killed had to know a policeman was there. The words “get down” appear to be addressed to a limited audience.

    Sammy Finkelman (51cd0c)

  111. I think “Get Down” is addressed to the girl in the foreground, who is blocking the view to the two girls in combat. She doesn’t stay down, but she gets out of the way, and the man who kicked her also retreats, and he shoots one girl further away.

    Sammy Finkelman (51cd0c)

  112. Last night, Rita Coaby, on WABC radio, thought the policeman said “Get it down” referring to the knife.

    No, he said “Get down” probably intending that for to any people blocking his line of sight to the girl with the knife.

    Sammy Finkelman (51cd0c)

  113. The foster mother was interviewed on CNN last night, conforming some facts we already know and adding a few new ones.

    1. Two girls who had been fostered by her came over to celebrate her birthday,

    2. The argument started when one or both of the girls complained to Ma’khia Bryant (and her sister) were keeping their bedrooom too messy, saying that “Mom” doesn’t like it that way.

    https://www.cnn.com/2021/04/22/us/ohio-columbus-makhia-bryant-police-shooting/index.html

    She wasn’t there at the time.

    You’re not the guardian of me,” Bryant replied, according to the story Moore said she was told.

    “They argue all the time,” Moore recalled, “but I never thought it would escalate like that.”
    Moore said she received a frantic call from one of the former foster children, who is seen in police body camera footage wearing pink and recoiling as Ma’Khia lunges at her with a shimmering knife.

    “Mom, get home. Where are you? They’re going crazy,” Moore said the young woman told her. “She said they shot Ma’Kiah and I said, ‘Huh?’ It was just crazy.”

    Sammy Finkelman (51cd0c)


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