Patterico's Pontifications

7/20/2020

Missouri Governor: Your Kids Need To Be In School, And Yes, They’ll Get The Virus But They’ll Get Over It

Filed under: General — Dana @ 12:25 pm



[guest post by Dana]

Certainly not the best way for Gov. Mike Parson to endear himself to parents and teachers:

Parson indicated both certainty and acceptance that the coronavirus will spread among children when they return to school this fall. The virus has killed 1,130 people in the state despite a weekslong stay-at-home order in the spring that helped slow the virus’ spread — and the state set a record on Saturday with 958 new cases.

Parson’s comment on the coronavirus signaled that the decision to send all children back to school would be justified even in a scenario in which all of them became infected with the coronavirus.

“These kids have got to get back to school,” Parson told Cox. “They’re at the lowest risk possible. And if they do get COVID-19, which they will — and they will when they go to school — they’re not going to the hospitals. They’re not going to have to sit in doctor’s offices. They’re going to go home and they’re going to get over it.”

Dr. Alex Garza, incident commander of the St. Louis Metropolitan Pandemic Task Force, summed up what he refers to as a “Gordian knot”: the question of when and how to reopen schools:

While it is important for children to be in school, he said, and it is true that they do not typically get seriously ill from COVID-19, “we worry about those in school who are not children — teachers, support staff and volunteers. Many of those people will have a much more serious response to the virus and that is what we want to avoid. These children could also come home and spread the virus to others in their household who could also be at a greater risk of a serious outcome.”

You can read the tentative plans for St. Louis area schools here.

–Dana

61 Responses to “Missouri Governor: Your Kids Need To Be In School, And Yes, They’ll Get The Virus But They’ll Get Over It”

  1. I just don’t see his comments as either helpful, or persuasive (to parents and teachers and staff).

    Dana (25e0dc)

  2. Well, he’s right about the kids. For them, it’s like measles before the vaccine. Hardly any of them will die, and it was REALLY important to get it over with because after puberty measles was a problem.

    Problem is, in this situation, no one has immunity and those kids may get it, but that means that their parents and, well, everyone will get it and MANY of those people will NOT have a good time of it at all. England tried this for about 30 seconds, before it became clear what a TERRIBLE idea it was (and Boris Johnson getting Covid was Karma itself).

    The best response to this governor is: “You first.”

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  3. The more reasonable argument is to observe that schools have not been shown to be a transmission point, and that kids out of school are more likely to congregate in uncontrolled ways.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  4. This is not the reassurance parents/teachers/staff are not only looking for, but nee to convince them that returning to in-person classes will be safe.

    Dana (25e0dc)

  5. On the other hand, I wonder if it has dawned upon the public education bureaucrats that they are asking taxpayers (at least in California) this fall to raise taxes on commercial property owners and in some cases raise their own property taxes in order to provide more money for the schools. All this while the teachers and students are staying at home. And to compound the problem, the state has decreed that no teacher and almost no public school employee can be laid off before April 2021. So this November there will be millions of voters who have lost their jobs or otherwise had their livelihoods greatly impacted by the pandemic being asked to tax themselves to protect a bunch of people who have been working from home at great inconvenience to the public and whose jobs are protected. I think they might be in for a rude surprise.

    JVW (ee64e4)

  6. Albert Shanker smiled.

    And so do the medicare for younger / early retirement advocates.

    urbanleftbehind (fd4b58)

  7. A recent report out of South Korea apparently shows that children over 10 spread just as well as adults, under 10 less so.

    And this whole thing about Covid being harmless for children seems really optimistic. It’s a new virus that’s been around 6 months and is known already to have serious long term effects for lots of adults it doesn’t manage to kill. We don’t really know what the long term effects on children are.

    Some governors and American presidents really don’t seem to grasp the idea of accepting short term pain for the purpose of long term gains.

    Victor (0301a3)

  8. Positions of become so hardened because of the incompetence of so many government officials that no one listens to reasoned arguments anymore. It won’t matter what a governor says, trust in government has completely disappeared.

    1DaveMac (16cd0f)

  9. *waves*

    Hi… I’m a Missourian parent of 2 highschool boys with numerous family members working as teachers or school administrative staff.

    Gov. Parson has my support for saying this and, anecdotally of course, every family member working for these schools believe we can manage re-opening the schools without resorting to full shutdown.

    I haven’t checked recently, but about a month ago the flu viruses was still much more deadly to school kids than covid19.

    Of course, kids whom are compromised should (and in MO it is an option) consider virtual-only classes.

    My kid’s school district…the current plan is a hybrid: 2 or 3 days in-school and 1 day virtual, with classes staggered to mitigate overlaps.

    whembly (c30c83)

  10. Whembly,

    Curious to know your town’s population, or how many primary and high schools you have?

    Dana (25e0dc)

  11. @7

    Some governors and American presidents really don’t seem to grasp the idea of accepting short term pain for the purpose of long term gains.

    Victor (0301a3) — 7/20/2020 @ 1:27 pm

    By far, the vast majority of us don’t need hospitalization if infected. We can walk and chew gum at the same time.

    Now is the time to strategically open things up, and be willing to adapt and overcome without destroying the economy/workforce.

    A total shutdown of the schools will cause long term issues as well.

    Waiting for vaccines to reopen things back up is NOT the panacea folks seem to think it will be.

    Of course, those whom are immuno-compromised or high risk need to take proper mitigation steps to avoid the disease as feasibly possible.

    Consider this. On a GOOD YEAR, Flu vaccines are about 40% effective. Some years it ranges from the mid-20 to mid-30 percent effective range.

    By all indications, we’re using the same strategies to develop covid19 vaccines in the same manner as we do for Flu. (the variance of this is how covid19 mutates in comparison to the other flu family)

    So, it’s a bit misguided to argue that the only way forward is to wait for the vaccine.

    Don’t forget, we’re also exploring numerous treatment plans to fight the infections.

    I’ll try to find the study, but remember early shutdown that there was a weird anomaly that smokers didn’t seem as impacted as non-smokers? (not that the medical profession was advocating to start smoking! lol!) Research found a particular ingredient (nicotine? Or something of the like?) in tobacco products actually inactivated the virus. So, they are developing a nasal-spray to coat the sinus tissue of this ingredient. I’ll try to post that old study and the current one if I get a chance.

    whembly (c30c83)

  12. @10

    Whembly,

    Curious to know your town’s population, or how many primary and high schools you have?

    Dana (25e0dc) — 7/20/2020 @ 1:44 pm

    County population just over 400,000
    88 public schools serving about 60k students
    49 private schools serving about 12k students

    whembly (c30c83)

  13. 7. That also depends on what your idea of “short-term” is. Those who think closing schools and businesses is no big deal, seem to have the least to lose for keeping them closed. If you’re professional life comes to a grinding halt because you have to stay home with the kids, or the business you remortgaged the house to start isn’t making any money because of government diktats, it doesn’t take much to cross from “short-term pain” into Whiskey Tango Foxtrot territory.

    Gryph (08c844)

  14. It may not be as safe as staying home in the short term but that doesn’t make it wrong. Most people can’t stay home forever and I think each State should decide when and how to reopen.

    I was looking at the State Covid stats at this website. I know Covid will wax and wane, perhaps for years. I hope we find some of the promising treatments and vaccines work but in the meantime, it seems like States that get or surpass 2,000 cases per 100,000 residents (2%) — such as New York, New Jersey, and Louisiana — are closer to flattening the curve than other States.

    I read we need to get to 70% infected to get herd immunity and this is not even close to that, but it could be that those States have more infected — maybe 20% or as high as 30% — and maybe that helps. If so, it would be interesting to watch what happens in Arizona, and Rhode Island and Florida, that are approaching 2%.

    DRJ (aede82)

  15. Vermont and Connecticut may be special cases because they are so small and, according to what I have been told, have shut down more than most places. Kudos if that works for them but I don’t think it works in bigger States or for the long term.

    Also, there are essential services everywhere in which people are going to work. IMO it is not fair to ask them to work month after month to serve the rest of us while we stay home. At some point, we are all in this together in fact and not just in spirit.

    DRJ (aede82)

  16. Kevin M (ab1c11) — 7/20/2020 @ 12:30 pm

    Well, he’s right about the kids. For them, it’s like measles before the vaccine. Hardly any of them will die, and it was REALLY important to get it over with because after puberty measles was a problem.

    Except that, as you move to older people, it becomes a problem much more slowly than in the case of measles, and this epidemic may largely be over in less than a year.

    There will be a cure by late September or October, but the only problem with that is there won’t be enough medicine to go around (there in fact already is a cure – convalescent fluid – but it is not 100% recognized, and there’s a really limited supply of it)

    https://www.wsj.com/articles/antibodies-can-be-the-bridge-to-a-vaccine-11593969735

    One promising option is monoclonal antibodies—lab-produced molecules engineered to mimic antibodies that occur naturally in response to an infection or vaccine. Like natural antibodies, the lab versions bind to the virus and prevent its spread. Regeneron, Vir, Eli Lilly and others are developing this class of drugs for Covid. Several are in clinical trials.

    The trick will be producing them at scale….the problem is the limited capacity to make enough product to meet demand during a pandemic. A recent report by the Duke Margolis Center for Health Policy estimates that it would take at least 25 million doses of antibodies to give the therapies to symptomatic people and their close contacts over the next year, assuming the number of cases holds roughly steady to the levels of mid-June. That’s about half as many antibodies as the U.S. produces each year in supplying the 100 different antibody products approved for a range of other diseases.

    Operation Warp Speed focuses on finding and making vaccines. The government should set up a parallel effort for antibodies, as even a limited supply could save many lives. Government should work with drugmakers to free up domestic manufacturing plants to start making more of these antibody drugs even before the FDA approves them.

    Two weeks later, July 19, 5:24 pm ET https://www.wsj.com/articles/behind-the-hhs-cdc-disagreement-11595193843

    Meanwhile, therapeutic antibodies, which are in advanced development by four different manufacturers, could serve as both a treatment and a prophylaxis to prevent infection in those at highest risk. But there isn’t enough U.S. manufacturing capacity to produce these drugs in the quantities needed to use them as a stopgap if a vaccine is delayed, and it’s probably too late to ramp supply
    significantly for this year.

    It’s going to have to be prioritized and rationed.

    Sammy Finkelman (e5fb44)

  17. Trump announces he’s reviving the virus daily briefing as cases continues to surge.
    ……
    With cases and deaths on the rise, Mr. Trump told reporters that he would probably hold the first of the new series of briefings on Tuesday at 5 p.m. He attributed his decision to revive them not to the increasing threat of the virus, but to the fact that the briefings had high television ratings.

    “I was doing them and we had a lot of people watching, record numbers watching in the history of cable television. There’s never been anything like it,” Mr. Trump told reporters in the Oval Office during a previously unannounced meeting with congressional Republicans. “It’s a great way to get information out to the public as to where we are with the vaccines, with the therapeutics.”
    ……
    Comedy gold for Sarah Cooper.

    RipMurdock (d2a2a8)

  18. In both Israel and India they ignored the fact that lockdowns only froze the situation, and perhaps rolled the clock back a few days or a week or two. In India, migrant workers going back to their home provinces spread the disease.

    Sammy Finkelman (e5fb44)

  19. Da troof is 1) what JVW said at his Comment 5, that these babysitters with teaching certificates need to justify their existence; and 2) that fewer than half of them could, or could be taught to, conduct any kind of online/computerized teaching, and even if they could, who’d do the babysitting; and 3) forget 2, K-12 schools babysit more than they teach, so it’s all about the babysitting, and they need to do it if they want the taxpayers to keep on paying them for it.

    nk (1d9030)

  20. The virus appears to have caught up with the Villages, one of the biggest U.S. retirement communities.
    …..
    Since the beginning of July, hospital admissions of residents from the Villages have quadrupled at University of Florida Health The Villages, the hospital’s critical care doctors said. As of last week, the hospital admitted 29 Villages residents, all of them with the virus, said Dr. Anil Gogineni, a pulmonologist and critical care doctor there.

    In Sumter County, where part of the Villages is located, there were 270 cases last week, up from 68 in the first week of June, according to the county’s health department.
    …..

    RipMurdock (d2a2a8)

  21. Guess what, kids? It’s been two weeks and two days.

    Gryph (08c844)

  22. “It’s a great way to get information out to the public as to where we are with the vaccines, with the therapeutics.”

    Trump’s nonsense needs to be tape delayed and edited to expunge quackery and disinformation.

    Dave (1bb933)

  23. Kevin M:

    Problem is, in this situation, no one has immunity and those kids may get it, but that means that their parents and, well, everyone will get it and MANY of those people will NOT have a good time of it at all.

    With the caveat that actually about 40% at least of the population effectively has immunity, owing to having been previously infected by the cowpox version of the coronaovirus (one of the four known coronavirus common cold viruses) there is some truth to that.

    Scott Gottlieb was interviewed yesterday on Face the Nation:

    https://www.cbsnews.com/news/transcript-scott-gottlieb-discusses-coronavirus-on-face-the-nation-july-19-2020

    MARGARET BRENNAN: Well, that [test results delayed beyond 48 hours] has consequences, obviously, for bringing anyone back into an office, into a school. What do you think is about to happen given what we’re seeing with the trend of infection rates among children? Do we know yet how this virus affects young people?

    DR. GOTTLIEB: Well, we know that children are less likely to get infected, and when they do get infected, they’re less likely to be symptomatic. That seems to be accepted based on the literature.

    What we aren’t sure about is what their propensity is to spread the virus once they do get infected, and particularly when they’re symptomatic. They do appear as likely to spread the virus when they develop symptomatic illness. And that might be because they shed as much or because of their behaviors, that a child’s more likely introducing it into the home because you’re going to hug your child even- even when they’re sick. [Not that. A parent will wash the child or dress the child -SF]

    Now, the literature on outcomes in kids is scant. And there was one study, one reliable study out of China that looked at 2,100 kids who developed symptomatic illness and about 5% developed severe disease requiring oxygenation. [that’s 5% of those who got ill enough for it to be noticed, as Scott Gottlieb shortly notes] And about 0.6% percent developed very severe disease, [about 12% of that number[ requiring admission to an ICU, so multi-organ failure, acute respiratory distress syndrome and shock. That’s the one reliable study.

    Now, that said, children are far less likely to develop symptomatic illness, and this just looked at the percentage of children who did develop symptomatic disease. But what it suggests is that when kids do get sick, they have a propensity to get very sick, albeit in a small proportion relative to adults.

    MARGARET BRENNAN: But then we’ve also seen these syn- syndromes that happen after the virus, the Kawasaki effect I’m thinking of there. Given the infection rates going up among kids, does that mean we will soon see Kawasaki to be more prevalent?

    DR. GOTTLIEB: That’s right. So multi-system inflammatory syndrome [He gives it its official name] is currently being investigated. It does appear to be a post viral syndrome, some kind of immune related phenomena in children similar to Kawasaki disease. [this actually also happens in people who are not children, but sometimes while they are still in the hospital battling the original illness – I think this could be identical to the “cytokine storm” – and sometimes later after getting out of the hospital but sooner and probably more frequently than in children. But with children it can happen without their ever having become sick with the original disease! It’s easily treated with steroids if caught in time. SF]

    The one good study that came out of the CDC estimated that it occurred about 25 days after the onset of symptoms for kids who were symptomatic. But it also occurred in a lot of kids who had asymptomatic illness, and the median age was about eight years old. And so given the fact that we’ve seen a spike in infections among kids, we would expect in about two or three weeks we might see a surge in these kinds of cases getting reported. That will be right about the time that we’re looking at sending kids back to school. [But this immune response is not contagious. – SF]

    So that could cause a lot of districts to become wary. Remember when these symptoms first emerged, when the syndrome first emerged over the summer, we were- we were just ready to start opening camps and sleepaway camps. And when these cases started to emerge, that caused a lot of camps to make the decision to shut down. So we do have to try to get kids back into school.

    We need to be mindful that we may see a wave of these post-viral syndromes happening right when we’re trying to do that. Finally, we still don’t know what the denominator is. So we don’t know how many kids have been infected. But this does appear to be a rare consequence.

    I don;t see why multi-system inflammatory syndrome should be a problem for schools.

    Sammy Finkelman (e5fb44)

  24. I think the reason a lot of pediatricians want schools to re-open is that admission to school is the lever used to get parents to give children other vaccines. If so, this is shortsighted.

    This situation won;t last long enough for that to really matter,.

    Sammy Finkelman (e5fb44)

  25. No context provided and source is Anti-Republican media outlet so there’s that. But even with that said, the Governor is correct. Notice the news article gives the total number of deaths, but NO breakdown by age, and then gives the number of cases without noting that while 602 new cases yesterday, it had 2 – count them TWO deaths.

    Do i have to remind everyone that 7,000 people in the USA die EVERY DAY. Or that approximately 60,000 die every year in Auto accidents and from homicide? Yet, we’re supposed to cry and get hysterical because TWO people die a day in Missouri from CV-19.

    rcocean (fcc23e)

  26. 27. Covid is currently the third highest cause of death in the United States, after cancer and heart disease and above accidents. Missouri’s current seven day rolling average of daily deaths is 7/day, a rate that has stayed steady for the last three weeks.

    Do people cry and get hysterical when other people die? Why yes, actually they do.

    Victor (a225f9)

  27. BTW, Calf has 7,694 deaths from CV-19. NOT ONE Person under 17 has died. Zero. Go look it up.
    That despite 35,000 cases under Age 17. And there has been 240,000 cases 18-49 with deaths of 600 deaths. That’s 1 death per 400 cases of CV-19. How many of those had serious medical problems? Probably most or almost all.

    To repeat this is a dangerous disease for the very old and the very sick. Not young people and not healthy middle-aged people. Quit the hysteria!

    rcocean (fcc23e)

  28. Do people cry and get hysterical when other people die? Why yes, actually they do.

    You’ve convinced me, Victor. We should ban red meat and fatty foods, require daily exercise, and change the hwy speed limit to 25.

    We should also adopt the expert mindset of education bureaucrats, who know that if kids aren’t in school, they certainly won’t be out playing and commingling with other kids.

    beer ‘n pretzels (1e5b3c)

  29. Table 1 has Covid deaths by age, rcocean.

    DRJ (aede82)

  30. If working from home is wrong, I doan wanna be right…

    Colonel Haiku (3c8e87)

  31. Here’s what that media outlet should have reported about Missouri. Yes, there have been 1,132 deaths, but ONLY ONE (1) death has been under Age 17! That’s it folks ONE. In fact, only thirteen (13) CV-19
    deaths under the age of 40.

    So to repeat: 1,132 CV-19 deaths in Missouri of which 13 were under the age of 40. So who’s dying of CV-19 in Missouri? Old People. 870 over the age of 70. That means 80% of the CV-19 are older than 70.

    rcocean (fcc23e)

  32. You’ve convinced me, Victor. We should ban red meat and fatty foods, require daily exercise, and change the hwy speed limit to 25.

    The biggest cause of death in the United States right now is Trump. Throw some bleach on the mother figure!

    nk (1d9030)

  33. Between hysterical KARENs, Democrats’ warm embrace of socialism, riots, looting and playing funding games with law enforcement, 2020 has been a strange year.

    And it’s barely half over…

    Colonel Haiku (3c8e87)

  34. 8 deaths in New York State up from a low of 0 earlier this month.

    There are some problems with Covid tests. Heard on the radio (not closely enough to get details)

    1. Some place or other was reporting 100% positive.

    2. Some place people stood on line for four hours and gave up. They later got positive test results even though they had not actually been tested!

    3. Someone in a study who gets regularly tested got a positive test result. She didn’t believe it. Demanded other tests. Had a hard time but got two since – both negative. Then her state tells her to quarantine 14 days. Phone connection was somewhat bad so talk show host didn’t let her explain what happened after that.

    Sammy Finkelman (e5fb44)

  35. New York is a co-morbidity. And we went and infected the White House and consequently the whole country with it, along with a strong secondary infection of Florida Man disease.

    nk (1d9030)

  36. I think a slogan of What’s a Little More Death, You’re All Going to Die Someday Anyway, and Really it’s Mostly Just Old People, Who Don’t Count, is going to be a winning slogan for the GOP and I heartily encourage them to adopt it. I also suggest Everything Considered You’re More Likely to Die of Cancer.

    On another note, it’s interesting the people who seem to think the choices are Death or Sniffles Followed by a Life Just as Healthy as it was Before. There’s a fair amount of data now showing that for many of those who don’t die, they get seriously, seriously ill and suffer long term effects.

    Speaking by the way of old people who don’t count, I myself am so old I can remember when the Republicans, including St. Sarah of Alaska, were decrying the Death Panels and the fiendish schemes to pay doctors to talk to old people about end of life care. But I guess if it’s an uncontrolled virus doing the killing, and not something that can be blamed on Democrats, then it really doesn’t matter.

    Victor (a225f9)

  37. #36 Some caller on the radio said she had been found positive, believed it was wrong and went back and got tested twice and was negative both times. However, the Health department didn’t want to change her diagnosis! She’s probably still listed as a Case.

    Which is another question. Why are tens of thousands of cases in NY still listed as positive and ‘active’ when they were discovered to be positive weeks ago. These people aren’t in the hospital, they aren’t dead, and they are obviously recovered. So why are they still listed as “active”?

    rcocean (fcc23e)

  38. I think Rush’s trial balloon of Covid is Like the Donner Party, Sacrifices Must be Made could be a real winner as well.

    Davethulhu (05bf21)

  39. There’s a fair amount of data now showing that for many of those who don’t die, they get seriously, seriously ill and suffer long term effects.

    Seriously, seriously ill with spongiform encephalopathy and long-term side effects such as registering as a Democrat voter, I would imagine…

    Colonel Haiku (3c8e87)

  40. long-term side effects such as registering as a Democrat voter, I

    No that happens to the dead ones

    Dustin (064e00)

  41. schumer who enabled madoff and weinstein, nadler who pushed to release susan rosenberg, weiner who was a character on house of cards,

    narciso (7404b5)

  42. As I said, the governor did not do anything to help the cause of getting kids back to school. If he had been more thoughtful about it, he could have reassured parents with the safety precautions that will be in place at all sites, and all grade levels. That would have been Politics 101. Instead, he was flippant about *their* kids.

    I think that every state is trying to make their own decisions about re-opening schools. I don’t think that’s the problem. The problem is the state-by-state stakeholders who are at odds about what the best option is, what the current infection rates look like, and how well prepared each state is to receive an influx of patients, should that occur. No easy solutions, certainly. From what I’ve read, most states are opting to do virtual learning, or a combination of virtual learning/in-person attendance a few days a week, and on a staggered schedule. No matter what any state decides, there are going to be pros and cons, and unhappy parents/staff.

    Dana (25e0dc)

  43. yes victor hewitt, (the evil brother of wolverine) ezekiel emmanuel, pushed for such an instrument called the ipab through the stimulus bill, and he is chief advisor for medical ethics for biden, proof positive, new york, new jersey, massachusetts, (charlie parker has to be in on the action) maine, connecticut, michigan wisconsin, all had the ezekiel protocol as formal policy,

    narciso (7404b5)

  44. No the long term effects include blood clots, prolonged fatigue, increased risk of diabetes, heart conditions, and some possible neurological problems:

    https://www.pbs.org/newshour/health/what-doctors-know-about-lingering-symptoms-from-coronavirus

    Some of these things may only be temporary, but then again we don’t really have enough knowledge to know how it will play out in the long term.

    Victor (a225f9)

  45. Albert Shanker smiled.

    But thankfully he never got the bomb.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  46. Sammy (#17): Too bad you cut out my “On The Other Hand” to make the point that I already made.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  47. Did everyone miss the vaccine news today? The stock market didn’t.

    https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(20)31604-4/fulltext

    The US government is funding the Phase III trials, and prospective production, to the tune of $1.2 billion, and expects 300 million doses by October. Hopefully it works at least somewhat.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  48. Some of these things may only be temporary, but then again we don’t really have enough knowledge to know how it will play out in the long term.

    Well, I guess we had better do nothing at all until we know everything.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  49. 2020 has been a strange year.

    And it’s barely half over…

    The second half of 1968 wasn’t so bad. Just think if Wallace/LeMay had won.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  50. Color me optimistic, but I can’t shake the feeling this is some weird reverse psychology ploy. Teachers’ unions have been Dem strongholds for a while, and a lot of K-12 and beyond ‘education’ these days is really leftist indoctrination with a thin veneer of education over it.

    It would be very amusing to see all these folks pushing for kids to go back to school to suddenly say, ‘Welp, okay, you’ve convinced us; guess they’ll all have to be home schooled or something.’

    Capsaicin Addict (041266)

  51. Addict, I hear people say this “a lot of K-12 and beyond ‘education’ these days is really leftist indoctrination with a thin veneer of education over it.” but I haven’t really seen it for the schools my kids go to. We’ve lived in a blue state and a red state (Texas) and I honestly don’t see that leftist indoctrination is a big part of what they do. I also don’t see examples from people that claim that.

    I also don’t think forced homeschooling is a great idea. I expect there to be a difference in outcomes between someone that was motivated to home school and someone that didn’t have a choice. A good friend of mine home schools his kids, his family does a great job, but his wife puts a LOT of work into it.

    Time123 (f5cf77)

  52. I think that every state is trying to make their own decisions about re-opening schools. I don’t think that’s the problem. The problem is the state-by-state stakeholders who are at odds about what the best option is, what the current infection rates look like, and how well prepared each state is to receive an influx of patients, should that occur. No easy solutions, certainly. From what I’ve read, most states are opting to do virtual learning, or a combination of virtual learning/in-person attendance a few days a week, and on a staggered schedule. No matter what any state decides, there are going to be pros and cons, and unhappy parents/staff.

    Yes, and then add politics. Every decision will be contrasted with a state that made the other decision and the leaders will be attacked. National standards and some agreement on criteria would push a lot of that down. I’m not advocating a 1 size fits all plan for the nation. But we should be able to put guidelines around infections rates, tracing, hospital utilization etc. etc.

    We have national standards that have been developed, but they leadership around them has been really lacking.

    Time123 (f5cf77)

  53. 54. So in other words, government must do more. I respectfully disagree.

    Gryph (08c844)

  54. you bring me the (redacted) lancet as proof of anything, except probable fraud, in the case of surgisphere,

    narciso (7404b5)

  55. 39. rcocean (fcc23e) — 7/20/2020 @ 4:34 pm

    She’s probably still listed as a Case.

    In the grand total.

    Which is another question. Why are tens of thousands of cases in NY still listed as positive and ‘active’ when they were discovered to be positive weeks ago. These people aren’t in the hospital, they aren’t dead, and they are obviously recovered. So why are they still listed as “active”?

    I don’t know that there’s a list of active cases. There are just total cases since the beginning, new cases, hospitalizations and deaths.

    There might be somewhere a total of “recovered” cases (lately and cuulative) but that’s, I thibk, people released from the hospital.

    Sammy Finkelman (375edc)

  56. Where’d the Coronabros run off to?

    Colonel Haiku (3c8e87)

  57. 49.56. The Moderna vaccine makes many people ill. Maybe roughly 10%

    https://www.statnews.com/2020/05/26/moderna-vaccine-candidate-trial-participant-severe-reaction

    Twelve hours after receiving his second dose, he developed a fever of more than 103 degrees, sought medical attention, and, after being released from an urgent care facility, fainted in his home. He recovered within a day.

    This one could be because of a too high dose.

    More recently:

    https://www.statnews.com/2020/07/14/moderna-covid19-vaccine-first-data-show-spurs-immune-response

    The study, which was run by the National Institutes of Health, showed that volunteers who received the vaccine made more neutralizing antibodies than have been seen in most patients who have recovered from Covid-19. But a second injection, four weeks after the first, was required before the vaccine produced a dramatic immune response.

    This sounds like it could cause the Kawasaki-like syndrome. And they don;t need so many antibodies, unless they are going to take their blood for sick patients.

    Meanwhile, China has a vaccine which they are giving to soldiers, and also offering to Chinese travelling abroad on business or for the government. I think the latter is because they don’t want any new cases traced back to China.

    The Russian hackers who broke into the DNC are now stealing and attempting to steal virus research. I am not sure why anyone should complain, unless they are worried they will try to steal a patent or sabotage efforts in the future. We should want progress.

    Sammy Finkelman (375edc)

  58. From the New England Journal of Medicine:

    https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMoa2022483

    Solicited adverse events that occurred in more than half the participants included fatigue, chills, headache, myalgia, and pain at the injection site. Systemic adverse events were more common after the second vaccination, particularly with the highest dose, and three participants (21%) in the 250-μg dose group reported one or more severe adverse events.

    More:

    The mRNA-1273 vaccine induced anti–SARS-CoV-2 immune responses in all participants, and no trial-limiting safety concerns were identified.

    They an;t go ahead with the biggest dose. Sounds like the wanted to prove immunity without needing a to have people exposed to the virus.

    Sammy Finkelman (375edc)

  59. https://www.wsj.com/articles/how-europe-slowed-its-coronavirus-cases-from-a-torrent-to-a-trickle-11595240731

    ….Crucially, experts say, European countries that slowed the incidence of Covid-19 down to a trickle have all continued to ban so-called superspreading events—mass gatherings such as soccer matches and concerts that are believed to have acted as incubators for the pandemic.

    ….Even in Sweden, which never instituted a lockdown and has suffered a high mortality rate, the number of new cases has plateaued as people observe distancing rules amid a ban of large-scale events.

    The low level of new infections in Europe has freed up hospital beds and allowed public-health authorities to focus on testing and isolating virus carriers and on tracking down and testing their close contacts.

    Germany, which scaled up testing capacity to over 1.1 million tests a week, trained hundreds of people, many of them medical students, to help with contact tracing across the country. A contact-tracing mobile phone app that was launched there just over a month ago has been downloaded nearly 16 million times. The number of tests carried out varies, but on average is nearly 300,000 a week.

    In Italy, widespread contact tracing and testing means a large number of asymptomatic carriers are being identified and isolated. In fact, the majority of those who tested positive for the coronavirus in recent weeks in Italy were identified not because they developed symptoms but because they were tested as a result of contact tracing or after testing positive for antibodies….

    ….In southeastern Europe, Croatia, Serbia, North Macedonia and Bulgaria—which all had strict lockdowns that greatly reduced the number of new cases—are all experiencing a renewed surge of coronavirus infections after they abruptly lifted all restrictions. Hospitals in Serbia are nearly overwhelmed after the government allowed for mass events in the past two months, including sports games and election rallies.

    Sammy Finkelman (5b43a3)


Powered by WordPress.

Page loaded in: 0.2929 secs.