Patterico's Pontifications

6/15/2020

You Think Those Protests Are Free?

Filed under: General — JVW @ 8:19 pm



[guest post by JVW]

Well, this is one way to defund the police. Per Bill Melugin of Fox News Los Angeles, here is a message that was allegedly sent to members of the LAPD earlier tonight by their chief:

LAPD message

I’m sure that deep down inside the LAPD rank-and-file knew they would be made to suffer for the sins of law enforcement against the Forces of Woke, but being told that $40 million in overtime compensation is going to be converted into future time off has to be a slap in the face. Yes, LAPD cops still have it better than a lot of workers who have lost their jobs during the entire COVID-19 scare, yet somehow I don’t see this move (combined with Mayor Garcetti’s earlier announcement that around $150 million would be moved from the LAPD budget to some nebulous community services fund) engendering much good will between Spring Street and First Street. Indeed, Mr. Melugin goes on to inform us that officers are reacting kind of how we might expect them to react:

No more overtime for the Human Trafficking Taskforce? Yeah, that won’t come back to haunt them down the road.

– JVW

29 Responses to “You Think Those Protests Are Free?”

  1. Goodbye coronavirus, hello Blue Flu.

    JVW (ee64e4)

  2. I don’t suppose that anyone else has an issue with the idea that normal, essential policing services are being covered by overtime to start out with? Yes, I know that many police officers prefer to do overtime and earn more money, but they work in a high stress job and I do not believe that having stressed out police who are overworked and short on sleep is a good idea. Maybe that’s part of the problem, you know?

    Nic (896fdf)

  3. cantafordya

    mg (8cbc69)

  4. I don’t suppose that anyone else has an issue with the idea that normal, essential policing services are being covered by overtime to start out with?

    I think there’s a lot to be said for the idea that far too many police officers are working overtime for often questionable reasons, but it seems like in this case these officers were specifically called in because of the demonstrations/riots over the past couple of weeks. At least that’s how I read this. Short of having little to no police presence at these events, I don’t know what else could have been done.

    JVW (ee64e4)

  5. Nic @2,

    That is an excellent point. Unfortunately, there are many government agencies where there is a “culture” of overtime. It’s like a built-in, assumed benefit.

    When I was an Immigration Inspector at a port-of-entry in the 1990s, we had two days off per week. Sunday, and another day that would rotate. If we worked Sundays, we got doubletime pay. The vast majority of my co-workers would work on Sundays, which left them only one day off a week. Once they got addicted to that gravy train, it was hard to stop.

    I was one of the few exceptions who didn’t volunteer to work on Sunday. Time off was more important to me. The only time I had to work on Sunday was Super Bowl Sunday, because so many people wanted it off. It even trumped Christmas and other holidays!

    norcal (a5428a)

  6. @4 I didn’t actually mean the OT due to the protests, I meant the overtime due to administrative tasks and on the various task forces mentioned. Administrative tasks and task force work are part of regular police duties and should not be overtime positions, IMO. Emergency situations are a different story. Sorry I wasn’t clear.

    Nic (896fdf)

  7. Overtime is cheaper than more employees. No FICA, no pension, no workmen’s comp, no health insurance, no liability insurance. Donut shops suffer most.

    nk (1d9030)

  8. nk,

    Donut shops suffer most.

    You too funny, mr. nk.

    norcal (a5428a)

  9. Thank you, norcal.

    nk (1d9030)

  10. @7 It looks cheaper at a shallow level, but stressed out tired officers might very well be costing us in other ways far more than the benefits and pensions would run to.

    “Donut shops suffer most.” 😛

    Nic (896fdf)

  11. Overtime is cheaper than more employees.

    I dunno, you’ve got LAPD paying about $170 million in overtime in 2019 (and LA Fire paying an additional $190 million). I think they could at least use some of that to hire more rookie officers to work 40-hour weeks at $75k plus benefits rather than paying some veteran cop $150k (thanks to time-and-a-half and double-pay) to work the same hours.

    JVW (ee64e4)

  12. What’s really pernicious is if overtime pay is part of the calculation for the amount of the pension.

    norcal (a5428a)

  13. @12 That would be… very sneaky.

    Nic (896fdf)

  14. What’s really pernicious is if overtime pay is part of the calculation for the amount of the pension.

    All the stories I’ve heard make it likely that it is. The way the stories go is that the pension is based on the last year’s salary or wages and that the employee tries to put in as much overtime as he can in that year to boost it up.

    nk (1d9030)

  15. If protest is truly the height of patriotism, and if police are the problem, then everybody should be thrilled by a national police strike.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  16. Dear officers: While many of you have accumulated several months of comp time already, we cannot allow it to be taken at this time and the 60 hour weeks will continue. Do be sure to react appropriately at all times; behavior to be stated later will not be tolerated.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  17. the employee tries to put in as much overtime as he can in that year to boost it up.

    Accumulated vacation or comp time can be converted to “pay” for these purposes in some jurisdictions (LAPD?). Then there are DROP payments which can be huge.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  18. All the stories I’ve heard make it likely that it is. The way the stories go is that the pension is based on the last year’s salary or wages and that the employee tries to put in as much overtime as he can in that year to boost it up.

    They supposedly tightened that up during the pension spiking reforms of a few years ago. Instead of the pension being based upon the final year’s wages, it was supposed to be based upon an average of the final three years’ wages, and they had allegedly limited how much overtime could be calculated into the final determination. But for all I know, those reforms were somehow undermined in the final version of the bill; I can’t vouch for it.

    JVW (ee64e4)

  19. Or gutted by some judge somewhere.

    Kevin M (ab1c11)

  20. There is already an economic issue going on throughout the nation just prior to when COVID hit for a number of city/county/state governments that had huge budgetary shortfalls due to unfunded liabilities and shrinking tax bases from a number of reasons (transportation being hit hard due to smaller gas taxes for example, tight property markets making it harder to have new homes). I know where I live in one of the many towns that is part of the Seattle-Tacoma Megalopolis region. Our school district reported that due to a number of reasons, there was going to be a huge budget short fall to the tune of about $70M. Our mayor just killed a number of job openings all throughout city government due to COVID budget crisis planning. That was about 3 new fire fighters, 4 new police officers and about 20 different staff personnel in various roles. The press report had it that they were also going to allow for a few offices to see attrition reduce personnel levels and look at consolidating a couple of offices in various departments. The budget forecasts for the last quarter of 2019 and into 2020 looked rough, it is the start of the terrible 20’s economically.

    So it isn’t any surprise that LAPD (and I would bet most other larger Megalopolis or cities are doing the same) are asking for unpaid comp time up to the maximum for the police responding to the riots and protests. That is only going to make the defense of larger budgets for things like social services only more complex, since a political type will have to either sell it as cutting some where else or raising taxes. I don’t know what it is like in the LA Basin area, but up here; even among the most ardent pro-government progressive voters there is a growing streak of “we are paying a huge property tax bill for what exactly” and that is leading towards a growing movement out of the most populous counties into other areas (which have lower property costs and with telecommuting being viable). It will only make budget issues harder on a number of governments. I fully suspect that the voters of the nation are going to have a wake up call soon. I just wonder which dominoes will start to fall at the city/county/state level first and which will be right behind them.

    Charles (8ffdf1)

  21. Don’t drink the shakes at shake shack!

    asset (f238e0)

  22. In his excellent biography of the greatest Plantagenet king, Edward III and the Triumph of England, Richard Barber describes in vivid detail, full of pageantry, ceremony, heraldry, and chivalry, the war that made England the most formidable military force in all of Europe.

    Very basically, and roughly paraphrasing here, what happened was Edward had married this young woman and made her his queen. But she had been promised to another duke in an arranged marriage. So the King of France summoned Edward to court to explain himself.

    Edward replied, “I’m the King of England, and I don’t respond to your summons.”

    The King of France said, “You may be the King of England, but you’re still the Duke of Normandy, and as long as you’re the Duke of Normandy, you will respond when your King summons you.”

    And Edward said, “Well, then I’m not the Duke of Normandy anymore. Oh, and by the way, I declare war on France!”

    He then assemble the largest military force ever at the time, not just from Britain–England/Wales/Scotland/Ireland, but from numerous other countries and duchees.

    Medieval warfare was slow and arduous, because the troops had to carry their supplies and weaponry with them in caravans of horse or ox drawn wagons. They could only travel about twenty or thirty miles in a day, before they had to stop and encamp, build a fire, forage for food, hunt for game, eat, drink, sleep, then pack it all up the next day and move on.

    Battles were intermittent at best, but they were violent and bloody. Most town would simply acquiesce to an invading army, let the soldiers take what they needed, food, water, livestock, crops, whatever. That’s how Edward was able to conquer three-quarters of France.

    Finally, the King of France submitted, agreed to an armistice and signed a treaty. At least he got to keep his crown.

    Now that the war was over, the soldiers were no longer getting paid. Soldiers don’t fight for free, but many of them were hundreds, if not a thousand, miles from their homes. They were abandoned, without pay in a foreign country.

    So, what they did was disband and regroup into private armies, become freelancers. That’s where the term comes from. They would invade and take over towns and villages, hold the citizens for ransom, pillage and plunder, take what they wanted or needed, then after they were paid, move on to the next town or village.

    This is what happens when soldiers are deployed far away from home and left there without pay. The social order collapses, and chaos reigns.

    Edward III was a great King of England, founder of the Order of the Garter, but he left behind him a path of destruction and anarchy that ravaged Europe for decades, if not centuries.

    I’m not saying anything like that is going to happen in the here and now. But police and soldiers do not put their lives on the line for nothing and zero pay.

    2020 is the year the 20th century came to die. Underfunded pension plans, massive defits and mounting debt, rising unemployment, business closings, protests, riots, looting and arson, this country is coming apart at the seams.

    No, I don’t think police officers are going to disband, form private armies, take over towns and hold citizens for ransom, because they’re not getting paid what was promised to them.

    But I can see it happening. It’s happened before, centuries ago.

    What is happening now is the result of a complete lack of leadership at the city, county, state, and federal level. And none of it will end well.

    Edward III may have been the greatest King of England, but he ruled for too long, fifty years, and left no heir apparent. That resulted in the War of the Roses, and the Hundred Years War that tore Europe apart.

    Is that what we want?

    Gawain's Ghost (b25cd1)

  23. In New York City, I don;t know for exactly how long or since when, or if this applies to all of themm the police are in 12 hour shifts, either 5 am to 5 pm or 5 pm to 5 am. Actually those shifts are at least half an hour longer. It varies deppending on whether they are indoors or ourdoors. This from a policeman Sunday at an early voting site.

    Sammy Finkelman (71800b)

  24. The best thing about all these Democratic cities imploding under the weight of incompetence, crime, corruption and ignorance is the media blathering that the only solution is to vote Democratic.
    _

    harkin (9c4571)

  25. Richard the II was Edward III’s heir apparent, his Uncle John’s kids just didn’t like him much. 😛

    Nic (896fdf)

  26. Oh, that’s the guy who usurped his father’s throne leaving him to be murdered by his mother and her lover. No, he was not going to have a happy life, and his sins were going to be visited even unto the fourth generation.

    nk (1d9030)

  27. Shakespeare wrote a lot of plays about the War of the Roses, leading up to the ascension of Henry Tudor, Elizabeth and James.

    Curiously, he didn’t write a play about Edward III, who set the whole thing in motion.

    There is a manuscript, attributed to Shakespeare, about Edward III, but it hasn’t been validated.

    The greatest poem written about Edward III is Sir Gawain and the Green Knight. It is untitled and anonymous, but the poem speaks for itself.

    I’ve done a lot of research on this subject. My opinion is that Edward de Vere is the true poet/playwright. However, the Gawain-poet, as he is called, remains a mystery. No one knows anything about him. He was obviously highly educated and a scholar, perhaps a priest, but we will never know. There is only one manuscript, and it was found stuck between the pagas of a book in the remains of a burned library.

    We know little about Homer, a lot about Virgil, Dante, and all the rest, but we know nothing about the Gawain/Pearl poet.

    He remains a mystery. But his poetry rings true.

    Gawain's Ghost (b25cd1)

  28. Love the English history, Gawain’s Ghost!

    norcal (a5428a)

  29. John Myers Myers has a section about Sir Gawain and the Green Knight in Silverlock. Gordon R. Dickson’s “Dragon Knight” books are set in Edward III’s reign. He portrays him as a gullible old drunk who never bathed.

    nk (1d9030)


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