Patterico's Pontifications

7/15/2019

TrumpThink

Filed under: Politics — DRJ @ 2:39 pm



[Headline from DRJ]

President Trump has doubled and tripled down on an argument that unites the Democrats against him when they were divided. Trump is doing this on purpose.

Trump wants the House to impeach him and soon, if not already, there will be no way for Pelosi to stop it:

Houston Congressman Al Green announced he plans to bring a vote to impeach President Trump to the House of Representatives by the end of the month.

In a press conference Monday, Green said he felt compelled to lead this effort because of recent demeaning statements President Trump made.

Trump knows the Senate will not convict him — notice how few Republican Senators are condemning him — and he doesn’t care what he has to do to get re-elected. With the Mueller Report over, Trump could run against the media but that might not be enough. Impeachment is the best way to create an US VS THEM election, and Trump likes the binary choice model.

— DRJ

165 Responses to “TrumpThink”

  1. ‘… he doesn’t care what he has to do to get re-elected…’

    … and Nixon smiled.

    DCSCA (797bc0)

  2. Trump likes the binary choice model because it worked for him once. And it may very well work for him again.

    Gryph (08c844)

  3. @2. It’s a page right out of the Nixon play book.

    DCSCA (797bc0)

  4. The Democrats picked up a lot of purple and even slightly red seats in 2018 by presenting themselves as the voice of reason and moderation. Two years on, after the Green New Deal, after passing NO bills, after doing utterly nothing but investigating Trump, they are now going to impeach.

    Karl Rove could not have come up with a better plan to win back the house. All they had to do was be calm and wait for a Democrat Senate and WH and their dreams could come true. But no, like lemmings they are headed for the same cliff the GOP jumped off in 2016.

    Kevin M (21ca15)

  5. All they have to do is not act crazy, but that’s impossible.

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  6. “America sucks” is not a message.

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  7. History rhymes:

    ‘The Great Silent Majority’ is watching.

    And listening.

    And white.

    DCSCA (797bc0)

  8. Picture yourself as Harley Rouda (CA_48), having defeated Dana Rohrabacher in 2018 on an anti-Trump sweep aided by surprise ballot harvesting. The district is R+4 and is unlikely to warm to whomever the Democrats nominate. He will be challenged by Chris Cox, who formerly represented the area for 18 years.

    How keen do you think he’s going to be to vote on impeachment? It’s lose-lose.

    Or Katie Porter (CA=45) or Mike Levin (CA-49) or Gil Cisneros (CA-39) or Katie Hill (CA-25), all freshmen Democrats in seats long held by the GOP.

    Kevin M (21ca15)

  9. I’m shocked at the backlash to Trump. Many Democrats are calling him racist while the NYT and WaPo have called him unfit to be POTUS. And get this, National Review has attacked him!

    The walls are closing in on trump.

    rcocean (1a839e)

  10. I don’t think it matters to Trump whether the Democrats in the House have enough votes to actually impeach him. All he cares about is that they try.

    DRJ (15874d)

  11. meanwhile the folks at buzzfeed want to dox carpe donkum’s whole family,

    narciso (d1f714)

  12. If the d’s try to impeach, I hope the R’s have to brains to not vote. Let the vote will be 230 D’s plus Amash to zero to impeach. Then everyone will see its a partisan clown show. The R’s should simply boycott the whole thing. Of course, the R’s have nothing to do either, so they’ll be tempted to keep busy.

    rcocean (1a839e)

  13. If the d’s try to impeach, I hope the R’s have to brains to not vote. Let the vote will be 230 D’s plus Amash to zero to impeach. Then everyone will see its a partisan clown show. The R’s should simply boycott the whole thing. Of course, the R’s have nothing to do either, so they’ll be tempted to keep busy.

    rcocean (1a839e)

  14. @8. Better still, picture yourself as Sam Abed, a defeated California mayor, known for praising Trump in the WH- challenging Duncan Hunter.

    DCSCA (797bc0)

  15. Trump at his press conference looks like he has the winning line of atttack:

    Well, I don’t mention — I didn’t mention names. And I didn’t do that. But I will tell you, with our country — and I think everybody in this audience, these are great manufacturers, great workers in our audience too; they brought a lot of their workers here. If you’re not happy here, then you can leave. As far as I’m concerned, if you hate our country — (applause) — if you’re not happy here, you can leave. And that’s what I say all the time. That’s what I said in a tweet, which I guess some people think is controversial. A lot of people love it, by the way. A lot of people love it.

    But if you’re not happy in the U.S., if you’re complaining all the time — very simply, you can leave. You can leave right now. Come back if you want; don’t come back. It’s okay too. But if you’re not happy, you can leave. (Applause.)

    rcocean (1a839e)

  16. It’s a binary choice whether there’s impeachment or not, so the Dems would be better off doing what they believe is right instead of worrying about poll numbers. Given the 2016 results, it’s not like they’re good at predicting the future. Also, Al Gore lost two years after the president in his party was impeached.

    Paul Montagu (7d1213)

  17. you mean cutting defense department support accounts, that’s awfully brave of them

    http://meaninginhistory.blogspot.com/2019/07/briefly-noted-actual-news-re-carter.html

    narciso (d1f714)

  18. 15, I recall Trump saying bad things about our country when he wasn’t president. By his telling, we were an international joke until he took the helm and made all things great. Why didn’t he leave if the thought things were so awful?

    In his statement today, Trump pretends that he didn’t casually assume that the people in question had come from other countries — that they couldn’t really be Americans.

    His defenders ignore the point because facing it requires admitting that he was making a race-based judgment.

    Radegunda (f133c3)

  19. Please.

    This stuff is tame. It only seems outrageous because it’s in the ‘here and now’ of a tweet. Not in the ‘hear and wow’ of a recording– listen to a few day of the Nixon tapes for an earful of racism and bigotry. And The Big Dick won a landslide re-election in ’72.

    DCSCA (797bc0)

  20. I find it doubtful, that ambassador was doing more than repackaging guardian clips, but there you are,

    the earlier link was how carter page was reluctant to go to Russia, initially, so much for the big conspiracy garbage,

    narciso (d1f714)

  21. 21 – I don’t think race and ethnicity should make people immune from criticism. I also don’t think people should be presumed to be foreigners on the basis of ethnicity.

    And it’s worth nothing that a lot of Trump fans apparently believe it’s unpatriotic and anti-American to criticize Donald Trump.

    Radegunda (f133c3)

  22. Pictured: a bunch of activists, one flying the flag of a foreign country, who clearly need to go back to where they came from

    https://i.imgur.com/4Ij9WXh.jpg

    Davethulhu (fab944)

  23. “America sucks” is not a message.

    “This country is a hellhole.” – Donald Trump, May 2015

    Dave (1bb933)

  24. 22. Besides, how do you get to “Make America Great Again” without opining that it sucks now and you can do better?

    Gryph (08c844)

  25. Picture yourself as Harley Rouda (CA_48), having defeated Dana Rohrabacher in 2018 on an anti-Trump sweep aided by surprise ballot harvesting. The district is R+4 and is unlikely to warm to whomever the Democrats nominate. He will be challenged by Chris Cox, who formerly represented the area for 18 years.

    That district (where I lived at the time) went for Clinton in 2016.

    How keen do you think he’s going to be to vote on impeachment? It’s lose-lose.
    Or Katie Porter (CA=45) or Mike Levin (CA-49) or Gil Cisneros (CA-39) or Katie Hill (CA-25), all freshmen Democrats in seats long held by the GOP.

    Clinton won every one of those districts in 2016 too. The only Southern CA districts Trump won in 2016 were the 42nd (Devin Nunes) and 50th (Duncan Hunter). Several of the reps managed to carry their districts despite the Trump albatross in 2016, but they couldn’t pull it off in 2018 even without Trump on the ballot.

    Being admittedly biased, perhaps I’m wrong, but I sense nothing like a Trump groundswell here. He is not popular with the Latinos, for obvious reasons, nor with the educated. Who does that leave?

    It’s certainly true though that incumbents are most vulnerable in their first re-election bid.

    Interesting that Cox is running. Back when he represented the area, I met him once when he came to the University to discuss a national laboratory proposal we were putting together. He impressed us all, even my colleagues of the Democrat persuasion said so afterward. Hopefully he’ll speak out forcefully against Trump so I’ll be able to support him.

    Dave (1bb933)

  26. Ballot harvesting, theft made legal.

    Narciso (7adc33)

  27. “I recall Trump saying bad things about our country when he wasn’t president. By his telling, we were an international joke until he took the helm and made all things great. Why didn’t he leave if the thought things were so awful?”
    Radegunda (f133c3) — 7/15/2019 @ 4:16 pm

    And go where?

    The wonderful thing about wanting to change the country into Somalia is that you have the option of getting instant gratification by simply moving to Somalia.

    Munroe (0b2761)

  28. Didnt they blame him for the subprime collapse at the sec.

    Narciso (7adc33)

  29. This is heartening:

    Member of Senate GOP leadership says Trump tweets are racist

    Senate Republican Conference Vice Chairwoman Joni Ernst (R-Iowa) said Monday that she thinks President Trump’s tweets suggesting that minority Democratic lawmakers “go back” to the countries they came from was racist.

    Ernst was pressed by reporters about Trump’s tweets from the weekend when she walked into a weekly leadership meeting in Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell’s (R-Ky.) office.

    Asked if she thought Trump’s comments were specifically racist, Ernst acknowledged, “Yeah, I do.”
    She reiterated that view when asked on another occasion by a CNN reporter if she found Trump’s comments racist.

    “Uh, yeah. They’re American citizens,” she said, referring to Trump’s suggestion that Reps. Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez (N.Y.), Ilhan Omar (Minn.), Rashida Tlaib (Mich.) and Ayanna Pressley (Mass.), who all identify as racial minorities, go back to the counties they’re from.

    Well done, Joni.

    Dave (1bb933)

  30. “He is not popular with the Latinos, for obvious reasons, nor with the educated. Who does that leave?”
    Dave (1bb933) — 7/15/2019 @ 5:36 pm

    They’re Latino-Americans, Dave. Americans, got that?

    And many of them are educated — despite your suggestion otherwise.

    Shame.

    Munroe (0b2761)

  31. “He is not popular with the Latinos, for obvious reasons, nor with the educated. Who does that leave?”
    Dave (1bb933) — 7/15/2019 @ 5:36 pm

    Wow. Just wow.

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  32. Meanwhile down in Puerto Rico, Gov rossello seems to have kicked a black cat, through a mirror.

    Narciso (7adc33)

  33. And many of them are educated — despite your suggestion otherwise.

    If I said he was not popular with blacks and not popular with women, would I be “suggesting” that black women don’t exist?

    Don’t play dumb – obviously demographic groups are not mutually exclusive.

    Dave (1bb933)

  34. Here’s text of the Dem resolution condemning Trump.

    It quotes Ben Franklin, FDR, JFK and Ronald Reagan (at great length).

    The business part of the resolution says:

    Resolved, That the House of Representatives—

    (1) believes that immigrants and their descendants have made America stronger, and that those who take the oath of citizenship are every bit as American as those whose families have lived in the United States for many generations;

    (2) is committed to keeping America open to those lawfully seeking refuge and asylum from violence and oppression, and those who are willing to work hard to live the American Dream, no matter their race, ethnicity, faith, or country of origin; and

    (3) strongly condemns President Donald 12 Trump’s racist comments that have legitimized and increased fear and hatred of new Americans and people of color by saying that our fellow Americans who are immigrants, and those who may look to the President like immigrants, should ‘‘go back’’ to other countries, by referring to immigrants and asylum seekers as ‘‘invaders,’’ and by saying that Members of Congress who are immigrants (or those of our colleagues who are wrongly assumed to be immigrants) do not belong in Congress or in the United States of America.

    Dave (1bb933)

  35. Well it’s not as bad as the anti semitism resolution that pointed didnt refer to omar.

    Narciso (7adc33)

  36. @28. Day-late-dollar-short-Joni; get that gal a calendar watch.

    DCSCA (797bc0)

  37. I agree with Robert A. George, ex-immigrant and current US citizen. In short, racist is too limiting in describing Trump’s words and acts over the years, not when terms like nativist bigot, or xenophobic bigot, or Islamophobic bigot, or anti-American bigot, or just plain bigot can also fit the bill, depending on the situation.
    I also agree with Kellyanne Conway’s husband, born on American soil, with a mom came to the US from the Philippines.

    But Sunday left no doubt. Naivete, resentment and outright racism, roiled in a toxic mix, have given us a racist president. Trump could have used vile slurs, including the vilest of them all, and the intent and effect would have been no less clear. Telling four non-white members of Congress — American citizens all, three natural-born — to “go back” to the “countries” they “originally came from”? That’s racist to the core. It doesn’t matter what these representatives are for or against — and there’s plenty to criticize them for — it’s beyond the bounds of human decency. For anyone, not least a president.
    What’s just as bad, though, is the virtual silence from Republican leaders and officeholders. They’re silent not because they agree with Trump. Surely they know better. They’re silent because, knowing that he’s incorrigible, they have inured themselves to his wild statements; because, knowing that he’s a fool, they don’t really take his words seriously and pretend that others shouldn’t, either; because, knowing how damaging Trump’s words are, the Republicans don’t want to give succor to their political enemies; because, knowing how vindictive, stubborn and obtusely self-destructive Trump is, they fear his wrath.
    But none of that is good enough. Trump is not some random, embittered person in a parking lot — he’s the president of the United States. By virtue of his office, he speaks for the country. What’s at stake now is more important than judges or tax cuts or regulations or any policy issue of the day. What’s at stake are the nation’s ideals, its very soul.

    It’s really that bad.

    Paul Montagu (fc91e5)

  38. And go where?

    “Back” to the country from which he “originally came.” Which is not America, if we follow the rule he applied to others.

    Why is it okay for Trump to call America a “hellhole” when he’s not a change, and then turn around and suggest that others who criticize America should get the hell out? Is it simply the Universal Trump Exemption?

    Radegunda (f133c3)

  39. Oh, and the timing of this judgment seems apt.

    Paul Montagu (fc91e5)

  40. “and he doesn’t care what he has to do to get re-elected. With the Mueller Report over, Trump could run against the media but that might not be enough. Impeachment is the best way to create an US VS THEM election, and Trump likes the binary choice model.”

    Wow, that sounds harsh, dude. Maybe you and your little Democrat lawyer friends shouldn’t have made it very clear over the past three years that your party would throw out centuries of agreed-upon laws, traditions, policies, and procedure to take a guy out on false charges no matter what the cost.

    Now please, get on with starting your highly advisable little antifa-led civil war so Trump can fulfill his Lincolnic destiny to suspend habeas corpus and give the lawless, vile, lying, sanctimoinious, warmongering propagandists the punishments they have so richly deserved and so loudly asked for.

    Somali Enterprise Zone (a11044)

  41. By virtue of his office, he speaks for the country.

    This point has been quite lost on those who keep saying “Don’t listen to what he says; watch what he does,” or “We don’t give a flying fig what he tweets. It’s actions that count.”

    As if no one else will pay any attention to the president’s words and assume that they reveal something about what motivates his actions, including actions that aren’t all publicly visible. As if the president we elect were in no way an indication of who we are as a people.

    Radegunda (f133c3)

  42. throw out centuries of agreed-upon laws, traditions, policies, and procedure

    That’s funny, because I remember lots of Trumpsters, beginning in the primaries, looking forward to seeing Trump “blow the whole thing up” and “burn the place to the ground.” He was supposed to be the great destroyer, demolishing the whole eeevil Establishment.

    But now everyone else is supposed to honor those long-established traditions, procedures etc. so as not to hurt poor Donald Trump.

    Radegunda (f133c3)

  43. I suspect that Somali Enterprise Zone is not long for this blog.

    Demosthenes (7fae81)

  44. The structures that give us McCain and Romney and would have given us jeb, who are silent basenghi when it comes to the left,

    Narciso (7adc33)

  45. 41,

    Did that sound harsh to you? If I’m right, what you call “harsh” is Trump’s plan. I thought that is what his supporters liked about him.

    DRJ (15874d)

  46. It’s a bunch of lies and evasions,

    Narciso (7adc33)

  47. They want illegal immigrants, or those like Omar that wont assimilate

    Narciso (7adc33)

  48. #41 urges us:

    Now please, get on with starting your highly advisable little antifa-led civil war so Trump can fulfill his Lincolnic destiny to suspend habeas corpus and give the lawless, vile, lying, sanctimoinious, warmongering propagandists the punishments they have so richly deserved and so loudly asked for

    And tells us all we need to know about the poster at #41. I always wonder about the aspect of Trump praise that depicts him as the castor oil needed for the body politic, and holds him out as a necessary punishment for naughty behavior.

    Appalled (d07ae6)

  49. Have anybody ever actually seen Trump tweet anything? His shorter-than-average fingers poking at an internet device of any kind? I suspect that it’s Kellyanne who is doing all the tweeting and who at 52 is at an especially “delicate” age for women. What do you all think?

    nk (dbc370)

  50. I think I’m the only first generation immigrant here, my parents waited 6 years In that communist hellhole, my grandfather 8, my father 11,all these jackalope like Abrams and gillums want to make this country just like it.

    Narciso (7adc33)

  51. Lincoln is Jackson for those who cant stand country music, but I digress.

    Nk,i always thought it was Stephen Miller tweeting…if the RedSteeze version is truly disgusted as he indicated a few posts ago, I’d pay the pay-per-view to watch a Stephen Miller^2 cage match.

    Well, if its Kellyanne, maybe George finally got off the blondes and is with tone of the squad’s B team- http://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/george-conway-trump-is-a-racist-president/2019/07/15/b13c0bd4-a740-11e9-9214-246e594de5d5_story.html

    urbanleftbehind (0adb4a)

  52. Well, you see, George Conway is one of the reasons why I thought of Kellyanne — “The George And Kellyanne Reality Show” which Beldar suggested a while back.

    nk (dbc370)

  53. Performance artist, like our pikachu, meanwhile in the real world the press covers up for a terrorist like sprousen, as does the other broke girl.

    Narciso (7adc33)

  54. That guy must have “skills”.

    urbanleftbehind (0adb4a)

  55. In Greece, Laurel and Hardy were known, officially, as “The Fat (Guy) And The Skinny (Guy)”. Univision had “El Gordo Y La Flaca” (the fat man and the skinny woman). Will George and Kellyane be “The Fat Guy And The Bony Blonde”, I wonder?

    nk (dbc370)

  56. That duo clobbered all over Hillary like jabba the hut, and all they got was a t shirt.

    Narciso (7adc33)

  57. #56

    I think the dynamic between George and Kellyanne is more Abbott & Costello (or Popeye and Bluto)

    Appalled (d07ae6)

  58. George Conway claims that he tweets about Trump because:

    “It’s so maddening to watch,” Conway said. “The mendacity, the incompetence, it’s just maddening to watch. The tweeting is just the way to get it out of the way, so I can get it off my chest and move on with my life that day. That’s basically it. Frankly, it’s so I don’t end up screaming at her about it.” 

    There are lots of married people who don’t agree on politics — sometimes the disagreements are dramatic and sometimes they are minor. If they want to publicly express their opinions but don’t want to ruin their marriages, they might choose to do it on Twitter (or even the comments at blogs) instead of at home.

    I suspect this happens all the time in DC and is the source of frequent local gossip. Obviously the Conways are unusual because they are both high-profile, but disagreements like this probably aren’t that unusual for couples who met and married in DC — let alone for couples who are members of the same political party but disagree about some aspect of their party’s policies. They might decide as a couple that one person will remain silent but political disagreements are the norm in DC.

    DRJ (15874d)

  59. Frankly, I view the Conways’ disagreement about Trump as a minor disagreement. They are both Republicans but they disagree about the usefulness of Trump. George may take a longer-term view that Trump is damaging the Party and country, while Kellyanne may view Trump as an opportunity to do something now. They don’t seem like James Carville and Mary Matalin, people who actually disagree on fundamental political issues.

    DRJ (15874d)

  60. “The mendacity, the incompetence,

    I do have to give Mr. Conway credit for being an intelligent and perceptive person.

    nk (dbc370)

  61. The Jihad Squad

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  62. plagiarizing French boot, Gerson, et al, the reign, I guess they would call teddy Roosevelt racist as well, but kamala harris, or skippy kennedy, or mayor howdy, they have no words for,

    narciso (d1f714)

  63. She is practically the only one of his close aides and advisors (outside the crime family itself) who hasn’t gotten on his bad side.

    Christie
    Flynn
    McMaster
    Mattis
    Nielsen
    Kelly
    Bannon
    Sessions
    Tillerson
    Porter
    Omarosa
    Scarmucci
    Priebus
    Spicer

    If you look at who stayed, or left without some kind of cloud:

    Conway
    Hicks
    Sanders

    Other than the obvious anatomical similarities, what do these three survivors have in common, do you suppose?

    Hicks and Sanders have both admitted, under oath, lying to the American people on the president’s behalf and/or under his instructions. Conway, of course, is the original source of the phrase “alternative facts”. They all appear to be completely devoid of anything resembling a conscience.

    Dave (1bb933)

  64. Xe’s making a list and checking it twice

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  65. No bald-headed, atom-splitting, son of Wacky Jackie
    Is going to mother hubbard soft soap me
    With just a pocketful of smoke
    Money for dope
    Go blow teh Pope

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  66. Trump wants the House to impeach him and soon,

    I do’t think so.

    I think what it is s=is that Trump cares more about defending his public policy positions than anything else, and where his public policy positions are indefensible, he has to lie or make an irrelevant attack because there is nothing else he can do.

    Sammy Finkelman (dec35d)

  67. “If you can’t dazzle them with brilliance, baffle them with bullsh!t.” — Trump Family Crest

    nk (dbc370)

  68. He maybe wants to be impeached, but the Jihad Squad is setting up his Us v. Them choice quite nicely. So many he won’t have to goad them into bringing charges.

    And last I read he was up to 50% approval with Latinos. Not everybody votes with their skin color, Dave.

    Patricia (3363ec)

  69. So maybe he won’t have to….

    grrr

    Patricia (3363ec)

  70. 65. Dave (1bb933) — 7/16/2019 @ 7:30 am

    Conway, of course, is the original source of the phrase “alternative facts”.

    This has been misdescribed, and remains that way because she didn’t go on to defend herself.

    By “alternative facts” she didn’t mean an alternative version of the truth, but a;ternative things to talk about. If you go back to the source, you will see.

    Sammy Finkelman (dec35d)

  71. And last I read he was up to 50% approval with Latinos. Not everybody votes with their skin color, Dave.

    One NPR/PBS/Marist poll in January, which Trump of course promoted heavily, showed him with 50% support among Hispanics/Latinos. That poll included about 150 Latinos and was conducted only in English.

    Three other polls taken that same month showed his support among Latinos at 18%, 30% and 35%.

    In the most recent (late June) poll, conducted by the same organization as the January outlier, his approval among Latinos was 24%.

    Oddly, President Trump did not tweet about that poll, but if he did I’m sure he would call it “fake”.

    Regardless, Trump and his cheerleaders will no doubt continue to tout that one 50% Latino approval poll from now until the end of time…

    Dave (1bb933)

  72. “One NPR/PBS/Marist poll in January, which Trump of course promoted heavily, showed him with 50% support among Hispanics/Latinos. That poll included about 150 Latinos and was conducted only in English.

    Three other polls taken that same month showed his support among Latinos at 18%, 30% and 35%.”

    So it was limited to voters, amirite?!?! Yes, I’m being facetious.

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  73. The ADL points out how much actual racists and white nationalists are cheering Trump’s racist tweets on the “Squad”. This is the same ADL that criticized both Tlaib and Omar for their anti-Semitic comments.
    Regarding Rep. Pressley, the United States stopped importing slaves in 1808. This means that, assuming she had ancestors who were slaves on American soil, her family has resided in the US for two-plus centuries. Trump’s mom was born in Scotland and Trump’s granddad was born in Germany.
    Speaking of Trump’s granddad, I guess the apple doesn’t fall far from the tree. Friedrich Trump took the coward’s way out and avoided military service, getting kicked out of Germany in the process. I suppose the bone spurs excuse didn’t fly in 1905.

    Paul Montagu (fc91e5)

  74. And white.
    DCSCA (797bc0)

    A bit racialist, eh?

    Kevin M (21ca15)

  75. So it was limited to voters, amirite?!?! Yes, I’m being facetious.

    The 50% Latino approval rating number in January was for “adults”, not registered voters.

    Among registered voters, in that same poll Trump’s approval rating among Latinos was only 36%.

    There was another question in that poll Trump and his cheerleaders are so proud of:

    Thinking about the 2020 election, do you definitely plan to vote for Donald Trump for reelection as president or do you definitely plan to vote against him?

    Among Latino registered voters:

    Definitely vote for President Trump: 27%
    Definitely vote against President Trump: 58%
    Not sure: 15%

    I do have to admit making a mistake though.

    I screwed up in posting the link to the other (“June”) poll. It is not from this year, but from 2017. So President Trump would have been correct in calling the poll “fake”, at least in regard to the claimed date…

    The same organization did publish a poll in June 2019, but it only includes a “white/nonwhite” ethnic breakdown.

    Dave (1bb933)

  76. Clinton won every one of those districts in 2016 too. The only Southern CA districts Trump won in 2016 were the 42nd (Devin Nunes) and 50th (Duncan Hunter). Several of the reps managed to carry their districts despite the Trump albatross in 2016, but they couldn’t pull it off in 2018 even without Trump on the ballot.

    Yet each is rated R+0 or better. Presidential numbers mean utterly nothing in CA as the outcome is forgone. Not so in competitive Congressional districts. Using Presidential numbers to project Congressional outcomes is misleading people.

    Being admittedly biased, perhaps I’m wrong, but I sense nothing like a Trump groundswell here. He is not popular with the Latinos, for obvious reasons, nor with the educated. Who does that leave?

    Among Latino-Americans (citizens and legal immigrants) he polls reasonably well, and close to national averages. Among uninvited Latinos, not well at all, of course. A lot of US Latinos are EXTREMELY unhappy with the illegals, not only do they impact their communities with crime, crowding, employment competition and social costs, but they also bring legal residents into disrepute.

    It’s certainly true though that incumbents are most vulnerable in their first re-election bid.

    Especially when their party has never won there before.

    Interesting that Cox is running. Back when he represented the area, I met him once when he came to the University to discuss a national laboratory proposal we were putting together. He impressed us all, even my colleagues of the Democrat persuasion said so afterward. Hopefully he’ll speak out forcefully against Trump so I’ll be able to support him.

    Read his Wiki bio. Despite being part of the crew that missed Madoff and the whole real estate bubble, his resume remains stellar. Especially considering that he is in constant pain every hour of the day, after an accident as a youth.

    I doubt he will go after Trump, per se — he’s a politician in an ecosystem, not a posturing narcissist — but he will also take issues with the things Trump has done that concern his constituents, such as the SALT limit and trade with China.

    Kevin M (21ca15)

  77. Ballot harvesting, theft made legal.

    I wonder if ballot collectors have to be legal US residents. There are chain-of-custody issues here.

    Kevin M (21ca15)

  78. They’re Latino-Americans, Dave. Americans, got that?

    And many of them are educated — despite your suggestion otherwise.

    Not at all sure that those polls of Latinos were limited to the legally-present. You get much better numbers when they are.

    Kevin M (21ca15)

  79. Paul, of course racists are cheering Trump’s remarks. He’s saying what they’ve often thought for so long.

    Regardless, Trump and his cheerleaders will no doubt continue to tout that one 50% Latino approval poll from now until the end of time…

    Dave (1bb933) — 7/16/2019 @ 8:22 am

    They don’t believe it or anything. They just think it’s naive to be honest. They very much recognize the demographic nature of more and more hispanic voters. That cynical election issue is at the heart of both Trump and democrat efforts on the border.

    Dustin (6d7686)

  80. Why shouldn’t it be high, we’re not criminals no matter how much Telemundos cartel bloc insists on.

    Narciso (7adc33)

  81. He is not popular with the Latinos, for obvious reasons, nor with the educated.

    Let me pick on this from another angle. Trump was elected by the “common man” who was getting the less favored end of the stick by both sides of the political establishment. It used to be that an American could get a basic education, then get a blue-collar job and support a family. But many of those jobs disappeared for multiple reasons all traceable back to D.C. Trump was the first candidate who credibly championed their cause, and they turned out in droves for them.

    So, when you attack his supporters for being “uneducated” you expose your class bias pretty openly, and it is JUST this bias that these folks voting for Trump despite the warnings from their betters.

    Kevin M (21ca15)

  82. …that GOT these folks…

    Kevin M (21ca15)

  83. I wish the white people who have ruined my native state of California would go back to the states from which they came.

    Munroe (0b2761)

  84. Trump and his cheerleaders will no doubt continue to tout that one 50% Latino approval poll

    What is “Latino” to a pollster? It matters.

    Kevin M (21ca15)

  85. I wish the white people who have ruined my native state of California would go back to the states from which they came.

    The white people who ruined the state never lived there. They’re the ones who prevented the state from reacting to the immigration flood 30 years ago. Now, there aren’t enough white people to matter. Did you know that LAUSD is over 70% Hispanic?

    Kevin M (21ca15)

  86. They’re the ones who prevented the state from reacting to the immigration flood 30 years ago.

    To clarify: The state passed several laws regarding illegal immigrants, such as Prop 187. They were overruled by federal judges under federal statutes, and a federal government that did not honor it’s commitments.

    Kevin M (21ca15)

  87. Wasnt it Stephen Reinhardt wraithlike hand that prevented 187 to go into effect.

    Narciso (7adc33)

  88. The 50% Latino approval rating number in January was for “adults”, not registered voters.

    Not exactly. It was of English-speaking adults.

    This survey of 1,023 adults was conducted January 10th through January 13th, 2019 by The Marist Poll sponsored in partnership with NPR and PBS NewsHour. Adults 18 years of age and older residing in the contiguous United States were contacted on landline or mobile numbers and interviewed in English by telephone using live interviewers.

    Note that the poll was not done for Fox.

    Kevin M (21ca15)

  89. “Did you know that LAUSD is over 70% Hispanic?”
    Kevin M (21ca15) — 7/16/2019 @ 11:15 am

    I was making a point at how ridiculous a lament like that sounds when scrubbed of verbiage that the thick sculled will claim is aimed at people of color.

    Munroe (0b2761)

  90. And the 9th Circuit. The situation in CA would have been very different had it gone into effect.

    Kevin M (21ca15)

  91. Yet each is rated R+0 or better. Presidential numbers mean utterly nothing in CA as the outcome is forgone. Not so in competitive Congressional districts. Using Presidential numbers to project Congressional outcomes is misleading people.

    Well, they are rated R+0 or better because they were GOP-held for a long time. But that’s a trailing indicator. In practice, Trump’s toxicity has handed them to the Democrats, and the next election they are up for grabs will be a referendum on Donald Trump, while 2018 was not.

    As a certain politician is fond of saying, “We’ll see what happens.”

    Among Latino-Americans (citizens and legal immigrants) he polls reasonably well, and close to national averages. Among uninvited Latinos, not well at all, of course. A lot of US Latinos are EXTREMELY unhappy with the illegals, not only do they impact their communities with crime, crowding, employment competition and social costs, but they also bring legal residents into disrepute.

    Well, as always I realize that my experiences are only anecdotal, but in this fairly well-off area that we’re talking about, and where I’ve lived for 22 years, there is no illegal immigration problem. Of course I have no idea who is legal and who isn’t, but the Latinos I interact with are universally kind, responsible and (insanely) hard-working. Model citizens, whether they are citizens or not. Up in LA, or Santa Ana, where life is harder, maybe things are different, but around here I just don’t see Trump’s fear- and hate-mongering gaining any purchase around here. It seems a lot more likely to drive people away (and it was two text messages the week before the election last November, parroting Trump’s immigration demagogy, that denied Mimi Walters my vote for the House seat she lost…).

    Your hypothesis would suggest Trump should run strongly in low- to middle-income majority Latino areas where illegals are thickest on the ground, but I don’t think there’s any evidence of that.

    I wonder if ballot collectors have to be legal US residents. There are chain-of-custody issues here.

    Because legal US residents would never tamper with ballots?

    Dave (1bb933)

  92. I was making a point at how ridiculous a lament like that sounds when scrubbed of verbiage that the thick sculled will claim is aimed at people of color.

    Munroe (0b2761) — 7/16/2019 @ 11:22 am

    Exactly. That wasn’t an honest argument. To Trump’s fans, being honest and direct is naive and stupid. Trump is on record as a racist, and many of his fans are, and they will attempt cheap arguments to show it’s ridiculous to care.

    Dustin (6d7686)

  93. These four idiots, self selected themselves, one incited a terrorist attack on an immigration facility, another pleads clemency for al Shabaab a third is a Hamas fangirl (the folks who blow innocent children and let rat poison infected nails go into peoples brains,

    Narciso (7adc33)

  94. Many cops are racist. But many cops aren’t racist, as well.

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  95. “Trump is on record as a racist, and many of his fans are, and they will attempt cheap arguments to show it’s ridiculous to care.”
    Dustin (6d7686) — 7/16/2019 @ 11:36 am

    Am I a Pepe the frog type racist, or of a Nicholas Sandmann punk caliber?

    There are plenty of white people who have ruined California. It cuts across racial lines. To go out of one’s way to remove any wiggle room that can be used to frame it as attacking only people of color is the ridiculous part, but you couldn’t grasp that I guess.

    When being incessantly led by the nose by media narratives, it’s so easy to take the bait.

    Munroe (0b2761)

  96. Blow up, they are all cair favorites, which used to be funded by the UAE but now exclusively by qatar.

    Narciso (7adc33)

  97. The people who squeal about racism aren’t keeping up with the science. Some people sunburn easier than others. That’s just about it.

    But there is bigotry.

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  98. No, you are not a racist punk, munroe. But I can mos def imagine you standing in one spot wearing a triggering MAGA hat.

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  99. And miss pressley was added because you can only have one point of view based on your skin color, and that’s prog eleventy.

    Narciso (7adc33)

  100. LOL, Colonel.

    Munroe (0b2761)

  101. 66. Colonel Haiku (2601c0) — 7/16/2019 @ 7:33 am

    Xe’s making a list and checking it twice

    Well, Xi is anyway, or plans to (it’s not yet quite ready for prime time) but already maybe it’s reducing China;s economic growth.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_Credit_System

    The Social Credit System (Chinese: 社会信用体系; pinyin: shèhuì xìnyòng tǐxì) is a national reputation system being developed by the Chinese government.[1][2][3] By 2020, it is intended to standardise the assessment of citizens’ and businesses’ economic and social reputation, or ‘Social Credit’.[4][5][6][7][8]

    The system will be one unified system and there will be a single system-wide social credit score for each citizen and business.[9] By 2018, some restrictions had been placed on citizens, whom state-owned media described as the first step toward creating a national social credit system.[10][11][12][7][13][14]..

    Sammy Finkelman (dec35d)

  102. Let me pick on this from another angle. Trump was elected by the “common man” who was getting the less favored end of the stick by both sides of the political establishment.

    More accurately, the systemic advantages whites enjoyed for decades have largely vanished, creating a level playing field. To someone raised on the right end of a tilted playing field, a level one looks “less favored,” it’s true.

    But this “common man” stuff is all narrative-driven BS. When Trump was elected, unemployment was around 4-5% (and even lower for whites). Where are these armies of impoverished, downtrodden whites? In point of fact, there is no significant discrimination – political or economic – against whites. We have it no worse – and to a greater and greater extent no better – than anyone else.

    It used to be that a [white] American could get a basic education, then get a blue-collar job and support a family. But many of those jobs disappeared for multiple reasons all traceable back to D.C.

    I’ve corrected the predicate of your assertion. Also, the jobs disappeared for reasons having virtually nothing to do with “D.C.” But D.C. makes a convenient scapegoat for the dishonest. The Democrats have been telling blacks for decades that they were poor because “D.C.” wasn’t doing enough for them. And now, we have so-called Republicans telling whites the same thing.

    In the America I grew up in, the government didn’t owe anyone a living.

    Trump was the first candidate who credibly championed their cause, and they turned out in droves for them.

    Yes, the Democrats have certainly demonstrated the viability of this “promise them whatever they want to hear” strategy. It’s the easiest thing in the world to convince people to blame their problems on someone else – especially someone else who looks different. And the closer (“vote for me and we’ll make them pay”) follows effortlessly.

    So, when you attack his supporters for being “uneducated” you expose your class bias pretty openly, and it is JUST this bias that these folks voting for Trump despite the warnings from their betters.

    And it will do them exactly as much good as voting for Democrats and believing their lies has for blacks.

    Dave (1bb933)

  103. 96. Narciso (7adc33) — 7/16/2019 @ 11:40 am

    another pleads clemency for al Shabaab

    Of course Trump had to accuse her of supporting al Qaeda, which she wasn’t crazy enough to do.

    https://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2019/jul/16/donald-trump/donald-trump-twists-ilhan-omar-comments

    There’s quite enough to attack her without exaggerating.

    Sammy Finkelman (dec35d)

  104. “If you’re not prepared to come to that table and represent that voice, don’t come, because we don’t need any more brown faces that don’t want to be a brown voice. We don’t need black faces that don’t want to be a black voice. We don’t need Muslims that don’t want to be a Muslim voice. We don’t need queers that don’t want to be a queer voice.”

    — Ayanna Pressley, Congressoccupant member of teh Jihad Squad

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  105. #35 The Democrats want open borders and approve anyone from anywhere coming here. They don’t believe in the rule of law and don’t want to enforce the immigration laws. Pelosi just voted for 300 thousand more Indians to be given H-1B’s visa with the approval of the Liberal D’s. The D’s don’t give a fig about the American worker OR America. Fortunately for them, their base is mostly yellow dog Democrats who will vote for them no matter what. These Democrat morons would vote for their own execution if the MSM told them it would hurt Republicans!

    rcocean (1a839e)

  106. “These Democrat morons would vote for their own execution if the MSM told them it would hurt Republicans!”

    You’re projecting.

    Davethulhu (fab944)

  107. They don’t believe in the rule of law and don’t want to enforce the immigration laws. Pelosi just voted for 300 thousand more Indians to be given H-1B’s visa with the approval of the Liberal D’s.

    Granting visas to people who meet the qualifications is the rule of law. It’s how the immigration laws are supposed to work…

    The D’s don’t give a fig about the American worker OR America.

    How many unemployed software developers, chemical engineers or IT professionals do you know?

    Do you realize that if companies can’t hire the skilled labor they need, the economy will suffer and truck drivers, secretaries and tradesmen will also lose work?

    Dave (1bb933)

  108. This country needs an enema. Open up H-1B visas to help cleanse academia of the blindered, one-sided propagandists that litter its ranks!

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  109. This country needs an enema.

    And you’re just the man to administer it!

    Dave (55e817)

  110. Well, the House is having a day. @repcleaver was presiding over the chamber, then announced that he was “abandoning the chair” and threw the gavel down. Two sides fighting over Pelosi calling Trump’s tweets racist in resolution.

    — Elizabeth Crisp (@elizabethcrisp) July 16, 2019

    Wut?

    Hoyer issues ruling AGAINST Pelosi from the chair, saying her words were not in order.

    The House is now *voting* on whether to strike Pelosi’s words (calling Trump’s tweets racist) from the record.

    — Andrew Desiderio (@AndrewDesiderio) July 16, 2019

    Lordy…

    .@LeaderHoyer: “The words should not be used in debate.” pic.twitter.com/nbjaSS2ggU

    — CSPAN (@cspan) July 16, 2019

    See… this is a problem in our politics… when Trump doesn’t something… democrats always goes too far, such that it provide Trump cover for his inanity.

    whembly (51f28e)

  111. Should be:
    when Trump does something…

    Jeez… what is it going to take to have an edit button?

    whembly (51f28e)

  112. I’ll note your enthusiasm and put a blue star next to your name, Dave!

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  113. Following up on whembly’s comments, more from the always entertaining Allahpundit

    Update: And there it is.

    @LeaderHoyer: “The words should not be used in debate.”

    Is Pelosi now … barred from speaking on the floor of the House for the rest of the day? Kevin McCarthy says yes.

    Update: Although Pelosi clearly broke the rules in calling Trump a racist, her caucus controls the House and therefore they’re going to protect her no matter what. Her words won’t be stricken from the record:

    Mark Knoller @markknoller

    By party line vote of 232-190, House Democrats defeat motion to strike @SpeakerPelosi’s words from the record for characterizing Pres Trump’s tweets as “racist.” It was ruled earlier that use of that characterization is not in order in floor debate.

    4:33 PM – Jul 16, 2019

    What a nifty irony that on a day they’re rebuking Trump for a breach of decorum, Dems just rubber-stamped their own leader’s breach of decorum.

    DRJ (15874d)

  114. Nevertheless, she persisted.

    Dave (55e817)

  115. They’re twerps.

    nk (dbc370)

  116. It’s a win-win… and Trump uses Twitter to run the Dems.

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  117. What a nifty irony that on a day they’re rebuking Trump for a breach of decorum, Dems just rubber-stamped their own leader’s breach of decorum.

    DRJ (15874d) — 7/16/2019 @ 3:01 pm

    LOL…

    History will look back and simply revel how insane the Trump era has been…

    whembly (51f28e)

  118. I assume the breach of decorum involved is that Pelosi’s resolution violates the Rule to “Refrain from speaking disrespectfully of the Speaker, other Members, the President or Vice President.”

    DRJ (15874d)

  119. well the niece, inspired a terrorist attack on an ice facility, so what can Pelosi do as a chaser,

    narciso (d1f714)

  120. Apparently there is no similar Rule in the White House.

    DRJ (15874d)

  121. accusations of treason, inspired scalises shooter, and I imagine at least one of those who have immolated themselves at the white house gates,

    https://twitter.com/marklevinshow/status/1151149901377626112

    narciso (d1f714)

  122. @77. Yes, Herr Trump is, Kevin.

    Though McConnell doesn’t think so; yet Tammy Faye Conway of ‘dark underbelly’fame has a different POV, doesn’t she.

    ‘Bonfire of thew Vanities’- watching the GOP pour gasoline on itself and strike a match every day. It’s… enlightening. 😉

    ‘Ein Volk, Ein Amerika, Ein Trump…’

    Trump/Haley 2020. Place your bets.

    DCSCA (797bc0)

  123. Moderation in the pursuit of justice is no virtue.

    Dave (55e817)

  124. 123… yes, so Trump should’ve been saved by the rules… which will probably be the only time we see this in our lifetimes…

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  125. And calling a Fifth Avenue fancy boy “the most 42nd Street streetwalker President ever” is no vice.

    nk (dbc370)

  126. True, Colonel, although I want a government whose elected officials speak respectfully — all of them, not just some — and if they do something wrong then we should vote them out. This isn’t 5th grade where we can bully and taunt instead of act like adults. Unfortunately, the public is so unhappy with things that they embrace acting like children as the only option left.

    DRJ (15874d)

  127. wasn’t she called racist, a few days because she demanded the trust fund waitress, actually apply herself, what did civility serve w,

    https://www.powerlineblog.com/archives/2019/07/an-accusation-in-search-of-an-argument.php

    narciso (d1f714)

  128. because being pro military and pro law enforcement is racist, that’s the vibe I’m getting,

    https://thehill.com/opinion/campaign/402754-the-myth-of-nixons-southern-strategy

    narciso (d1f714)

  129. No immigrant woman of color is safe in Trump’s xenophobic, racist America these days. https://www.npr.org/2019/07/16/742390932/planned-parenthood-removes-leana-wen-as-president-after-less-than-a-year

    nk (dbc370)

  130. As we weaponize law enforcement and intelligence agencies against a candidate and president, decorum dresses it up with a smiley face and makes it all better.

    Munroe (0b2761)

  131. Only four Republicans in the House voted to condemn Trump’s racist attacks.

    The party I supported my whole life is now a disgrace to our country, and themselves.

    Dave (1bb933)

  132. They didn’t want to get Republican votes, or else they might have changed teh wording somewhat.

    Sammy Finkelman (dec35d)

  133. They didn’t want to get Republican votes, or else they might have changed teh wording somewhat.

    There was nothing objectionable in the wording. It quoted Reagan and praised LEGAL immigration.

    Dave (1bb933)

  134. Yep, he’s a Democrat.

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  135. bag of hammers dumb
    and will bite the hand that feeds
    it’s the Jihad Squad

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  136. Both the Democrats and Trump Kellyanne have one goal, and one goal only, right now: To make dam’ sure that Trump is the Republican nominee in 2020.

    And you can take that to the bank.

    nk (dbc370)

  137. bullschiff on a stick
    itz not his party and he’ll
    cry if he wants to

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  138. The one “out”, i.e., a legitimate reason to vote against the resolution, is that the House parliamentarian concluded that Pelosi’s wording violated House decorum, and then the Dems overruled the parliamentarian. It’s not a good out, but it’s an out.

    Paul Montagu (fc91e5)

  139. @134. Hi-test or regular, today?!

    “Match me, Sidney.” – JJ Hunsecker [Burt Lancaster] ‘The Sweet Smell Of Success’ 1957

    DCSCA (797bc0)

  140. Is Will Hurd your congressman, DRJ?

    He was one of the four who stood up to Trump.

    Dave (1bb933)

  141. Let’s not forget that Omar is a world class holocaust denier, ‘Israel hypnotized the world’s up there with the husseini-Arafat clan

    Narciso (7adc33)

  142. Not one of Trump’s tweets comes close to being as offensive as what these Jihad Squad members have said or written on multiple occasions.

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  143. @16. His tweets put a goose in your step.

    DCSCA (797bc0)

  144. ^146. Typo.

    DCSCA (797bc0)

  145. Ben Garrison remains a Trumpkin, too, despite being disinvited from the White House. https://grrrgraphics.com/the-dc-aftermath

    Now, I ain’t saying that Adams and Garrison are doing it for the money, but they’re sure doing it where the money is.

    nk (dbc370)

  146. “Not one of Trump’s tweets comes close to being as offensive as what these Jihad Squad members have said or written on multiple occasions.”

    I’m sorry your feelings were hurt.

    Davethulhu (bc6fa6)

  147. You miss the point, Cthulhu, as is your habit.

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  148. @69. aka ‘Reaganomics.’ 😉

    DCSCA (797bc0)

  149. Because legal US residents would never tamper with ballots?

    Well, they aren’t de facto law-breakers anyway.

    Kevin M (21ca15)

  150. DRACO. LOVE IT OR LEAVE IT.

    nk (dbc370)

  151. 141. Paul Montagu (fc91e5) — 7/16/2019 @ 6:10 pm

    141.The one “out”, i.e., a legitimate reason to vote against the resolution, is that the House parliamentarian concluded that Pelosi’s wording violated House decorum, and then the Dems overruled the parliamentarian.

    I think that was her wording in a speech. Republicans weanted her words stricken from the record.

    House rules forbid personal criticism of the (character of) the president (and other federal elected officials)

    The resolution itself does not descrobe President Trump as a racist, but says he made racist comments.

    https://www.congress.gov/bill/116th-congress/house-resolution/489/text

    It does not say where he made any aracist comments, or what comments were racist, but it specifically condemns him saying that:

    1) “Our fellow Americans who are immigrants, and those who may look to the President like immigrants should “go back” to other countries”

    AND

    2) “referring to immigrants and asylum seekers as “invaders.””

    AND

    “saying that Members of Congress who are immigrants (or those of our colleagues who are wrongly assumed to be immigrants) do not belong in Congress or in the United States of America.”

    None of that is racist, though. It’s a different form of prejudice, or invidious lumping together of people on the basis of ancestry or family history.

    And he didn’t say that those members of Congress who are immigrants or wrongly assumed or wrongly assumed to be immigrants to be immigrants do not belong in Congress or in the United States of America but only those immigrants or wrongly assumed to be immigrants who are critical of the United States – that is him. (this is adenial of eual citizenship, and also echoes the accusation that the men of Sodom made against Lot

    https://www.mechon-mamre.org/p/pt/pt0119.htm

    Genesisi 19:9

    And they said: ‘Stand back.’ And they said: ‘This one fellow came in to sojourn, and he will needs play the judge; now will we deal worse with thee, than with them.’ And they pressed sore upon the man, even Lot, and drew near to break the door.

    There;s no racism here, unless you want to say that wrongly assuming, or letting people assume, some members of Congress to be immigrants, who are not in fact immigrants, is racist.

    Sammy Finkelman (dec35d)


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