Patterico's Pontifications

11/19/2018

James Kirchick on George Soros

Filed under: General — JVW @ 3:52 pm



[guest post by JVW]

As the Koch brothers are to the left, so George Soros inhabits the bogeyman role for the right, the crown prince of dark money funneled into nefarious organizations seeking to advance the causes of global socialism and one-world government. But what if, despite our hysteria, it turns out that the Soros of myth is somehow less than meets the eye? What if there is a complex side to him that at heart is in favor of open markets, democracy, and transparent governments faithfully serving the citizens, yet somehow his own hubris and neediness has drowned his good intentions under the tsunami of trendy social justice concerns? What if he is just another sad story of the philanthropist who aspired to good deeds, but his own insecurities and ego led him to make himself central to the story?

This is the portrait that James Kirchick, writing in Tablet magazine, paints of the Hungarian-born financier and policy dilettante. In an article that is fairly long but well worth reading in full, Kirchick seeks to delineate between Soros’ worthy endeavors to help post-Iron Curtain societies embrace liberal democracy and the billionaire’s need to be taken seriously by the intellectual elite of the West, which has increasingly drawn him into trendy left-wing politics. Kirchick begins by tracing Soros’ history of promoting the causes of society’s outcasts in the ex-Soviet bloc countries:

By the time I finished my European tour of duty, it had become axiomatic that, were I to encounter a democracy activist in Baku, a lesbian-rights campaigner in Bishkek, or a press freedom advocate in Belgrade, more likely than not they would have been beneficiaries of a Soros grant, scholarship, or in his employ. To take but one example of his generosity and foresight usually overlooked both by his detractors and fans, he is by far the largest private benefactor to the cause of the Roma—those long-persecuted, socially excluded, forgotten people of Europe.

Kirchick also gets uncomfortably close to attributing animosity towards Soros in Central European countries such as the Czech Republic, Poland, and Hungary as being laced by elements of antisemitism in those traditionally Catholic countries, suggesting that “[t]here are few better indicators of a European politician’s commitment to basic liberal democratic principles than the degree to which he blames Soros for his country’s woes.” I’ve been reflexively defensive of nationalist/populist leaders in Europe who refuse to knuckle-under to the dictates of Berlin and Brussels, and I am sympathetic to the idea that Soros’ massive wealth can do far much more harm propagandizing in those countries than it can do here. That said, Kirchick makes a solid case that Hungary’s Viktor Orban in particular is using loose language — “they are not national, but international; they do not believe in work, but speculate with money; they have no homeland, but feel that the whole world is theirs” — that has often been used by demagogues to stir up resentments of the Jews, yet I believe that Kirchick gives short shrift to the justifiable paranoia of a people who spent a half-century being dominated first by the Nazis and then by the Soviets, all of which occurred within the lifetime of a present-day octogenarian.

Paradoxically, the man whose followers believe that he is often the victim of far-right antisemitism tends to fund lots of political organizations that engage in their own use of innuendo and bigotry to criticize other Jews. Kirchick reminds us that protests by the Soros-funded group Freedom from Facebook used posters depicting Mark Zuckerberg and Sheryl Sandberg as a two-headed octopus, a image not unfamiliar to the Nazis, and that the Soros Equality Fellowship has passed out six-figure grants to apologists for Islamism and hatred of Israel. Kirchick also documents Soros’ antipathy towards donating to Jewish causes and a general distaste for supporting Jewish identity groups, even as he lavishly funds other racial and ethnic solidarity organizations. Worth noting too, is that Soros funds plenty of the MeToo activity including the anti-Kavanaugh activists who stormed Washington this past fall to confront the judge at his hearing, yet Soros himself has been the subject of shocking allegations of abuse which he has categorically denied.

And much of this gets to the heart of the contradictions of George Soros. The guy who pushes Europe to embrace capitalism, government transparency, pluralism, and freedom is investing his formidable fortune to undermine those very concepts here in the United States. For a guy who last summer told the New York Times Magazine that he yearns for a return to bipartisanship to devote pretty much all of his largesse exclusively to left-wing causes allied with Democrats isn’t just hypocritical, it indicates either a fundamental dishonesty or, at the very least, a willingness to delude himself. As Kirchick notes, groups like FIRE and Heterodox Academy which seek to broaden the narrow-minded groupthink so prevalent today at U.S. universities should be natural outlets for Soros’ philanthropy based upon his espoused principles as applied within Europe, yet instead he ignores those organizations in favor of ridiculously partisan Democrat outfits like the SPLC, the ACLU, and organizations which fund activities conducted under the Black Lives Matters banner.

So why does George Soros play the left-wing mega-donor here in his adopted country? Kirchick argues that it is simply because — like movie stars, athletes, journalists, titans of the tech industry, and others — Soros desires the approbation of the progressive intelligentsia which dominates academia, entertainment, media, government bureaucracies, and most non-governmental organizations. This obsession to be thought of as an intellectual began for him in the mid-90s after he had amassed much of his tremendous wealth, and it’s led him to write fourteen books which are neither widely read nor well reviewed. Yet due to his vast wealth and his willingness to spread it around, venal members of what Mencken liked to call the Smart Set have decided to take him seriously, at least as long as the checks continue to clear. And as he became a darling of the cultural gatekeepers, Soros has expanded his left-wing advocacy, becoming a shrill and even unhinged critic of President George W. Bush which solidified him an enemy of the right every bit as much as it endeared him to the left. Kirchick is absolutely withering in his description of Washington and New York media elites who run interference for Soros, gleefully impugning the protestations of his critics while deftly ignoring some of the more unsavory company that he billionaire keeps and some of the more inflammatory rhetoric he subsidizes.

This write-up is in danger of going on as long as Kirchick’s essay (but I don’t mean that to criticize Kirchick’s piece — I urge everyone to go there and read it for yourself), so I’ll wrap up. The story that James Kirchick tells is that once upon a time George Soros wanted to use his vast wealth to make his native Europe a more open and welcoming place, but ironically he’s spent the last quarter century fanning the flames of division in his adopted country, all to be loved by the sort of people whom he should have recognized cannot hold a candle to his formidable achievements.

– JVW

139 Responses to “James Kirchick on George Soros”

  1. TL;DR — Soros is a whole lot worse here than he is in Europe, and it’s only because he wants Harvard and the New York Times to like him. And maybe be smiled at by Susan Sarandon.

    JVW (42615e)

  2. I think Soros is wrong about most things, and I’m not a fan of false equivalence, but man the Kochs and Soros are played the same by the opposition party.

    They’re rich guys trying to make things better. They have immigrant stories and are concerned by certain types of government excesses (largely different ones.) “Soros is wrong,” is fine. “Soros is evil,” is tiresome.

    And yes, this is a defense of George Soros. Certain language used against him is clearly anti-Semitic, but you don’t need to be one to oppose his ideas. A lot of his ideas are bad ones – but he’s a much richer Jimmy Carter, not a somewhat poorer Darth Vader.

    JRM (de6363)

  3. Hat tip to Powerline, by the way, who had this article in their daily items to read.

    JVW (42615e)

  4. I wonder how much Soros paid Kirchik to write that. And is it my imagination, or do I also detect more than a tinge of sympathy on the part of JVW? JVW?

    nk (dbc370)

  5. I think Soros is wrong about most things, and I’m not a fan of false equivalence, but man the Kochs and Soros are played the same by the opposition party.

    The Koch brothers strike me as slightly more principled. They made no bones about disliking Donald Trump and did not funnel money to him in 2016 because they felt he would be inimical to a society with free trade and a minimalist government. In fact, the Kochs do not seem to me to be too shy about opposing Republicans who they do not believe measure up to their libertarian standards. Soros on the other hand, strikes me as pretty much being for any Democrat as long as the Democrat is opposed by a conservative, libertarian, or Republican. He also seems to be the type who would be adamantly against Bush bombing Saddam’s bases in Iraq, but be in favor of Obama using drones to kill suspected terrorists. Dem attacks good; Rep attacks bad. Maybe that’s just the partisan in me, but I don’t see the same ideological consistency from Soros that I see from Charles and David Koch.

    JVW (42615e)

  6. Look, guys, Carnegie spent most of his life sucking the blood of coal miners and steel workers, and then endowed libraries and music halls so he wouldn’t be remembered as a bloodsucker after he died. Soros is doing the same except that he still cannot resist f**king with other people’s live while he’s “philanthroping” them.

    nk (dbc370)

  7. I wonder how much Soros paid Kirchik to write that. And is it my imagination, or do I also detect more than a tinge of sympathy on the part of JVW? JVW?

    Pity, nk, not sympathy. I see Soros as someone who perhaps knows better, but he is so insecure that he’s willing to adopt whatever left-wing shibboleths are in vogue if it makes him popular with the in crowd. I don’t see much difference between him and, say, Jimmy Kimmel, or even that dopey tenure-track assistant professor in the local sociology department. None of them have the balls to say what they truly believe, so they go along with the popular consensus of the crowd they’re in.

    JVW (42615e)

  8. Soros is like mr. potter, he has the whole community nailed down, maybe at one point, when he was operating exclusively behind the iron curtain, he was on the side of the angels, that was also around the time that he sponsored victor orban with some fellowship or another, but thirty years later, he seems intent on fostering exactly the same leftwing culture, that hungary broke out of back in the late 80s, he does seem to make common cause with islamists, in his opposition to the West,

    narciso (d1f714)

  9. Look, guys, Carnegie spent most of his life sucking the blood of coal miners and steel workers, and then endowed libraries and music halls so he wouldn’t be remembered as a bloodsucker after he died.

    Ah, lamentations: I once started drafting a post here in defense of the people that we now call the Robber Barons — Carnegie, Rockefeller, Vanderbilt, Stanford, Huntington, etc. — making that very point. I wish I had gotten around to finishing it.

    But I don’t see what George Soros has created, apart from some left-wing foundations that give money to professional agitators, that will last beyond his own mortality. Certainly not a well-renowned research university or a major museum or some large public work. Guys like him spend their money winning approval in the here and now, rather than thinking about any meaningful legacy.

    JVW (42615e)

  10. he doesn’t create he destroys, he is hell bent on dissolving the people, and selecting another, but like cthluthu, he has a 1,000 tentacles, the two minute hate directed against gosar, which he survived like a gom jabbar, was about daring to point out his influence, then again if there were any real opposition, except for Adelson who funds a contrary viewpoint, the Koch’s have learned their lesson, the mercers were put in their place,

    narciso (d1f714)

  11. Soros has been captured by evil. He does evil. Full stop.

    Ed from SFV (6d42fa)

  12. He’s a destroyer that wants to destroy nations because he believes in one world governance with himself at the top of the pyramid.

    NJRob (3f1b96)

  13. I hope Soros is caught, tried and convicted of the crimes that Hungary and other countries say he is guilty of

    Colonel Haiku (a7e08c)

  14. soros won’t get you ;but alexandra ocasio-cortez and her friends will get you and soros too!

    lany (be255f)

  15. but alexandra ocasio-cortez and her friends will get you and soros too!

    We have Vancomycin, antivirals, and antiretrovirals for that, these days, Perry.

    nk (dbc370)

  16. I started reading the piece this morning on link from Instapundit but gave up as it seemed to be a Soros PR piece.

    Maybe I’ll revisit.

    harkin (7ca65a)

  17. george soros terrifies me cause he doesn’t understand no means no

    happyfeet (28a91b)

  18. Soros has too many that will take up his torch, he bought himself protection from the authorities like apple’s paens to sky dragons eludes scrutiny of the conditions these devices are made under.

    Narciso (3d15df)

  19. Ryan Saavedra
    @RealSaavedra
    BREAKING: Actress Mareli Miniutti Files for Domestic Violence Restraining Order Against Michael Avenatti

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  20. As much as I can’t stand the Koch bros. They have built a few new cancer and surgical wings in hospitals across the country. Soros hires thugs to put people in hospitals.

    mg (ef2c8e)

  21. Dang! I was hoping it was Julie Sweatyneck.

    She’s 20 and he’s 47. It’s supposed to be half your age plus seven, Michael, not twice her age plus seven.

    nk (dbc370)

  22. So how does Jacob Wohl know her? Were they in the same class in high school?

    nk (dbc370)

  23. Hey look! I figured out how to do a Twitter share button!

    Now to figure out Facebook.

    Patterico (115b1f)

  24. @2. “Soros is wrong,” is fine. “Soros is evil,” is tiresome.

    Thank ya. The conspiracy stories are insane. People are super-obsessed with this dude. They say things like “Soros hires thugs to put people in hospitals” without providing evidence.

    JRH (f51cae)

  25. In the next to last paragraph you was “appropriation” when you likely mean “approbation.”

    I don’t see Soros though as the heart of darkness in our times. That seat of power is occupied by Tom Steyer, who gives more money to worse people than Koch and Soros combined.

    Kevin M (a57144)

  26. *was = say

    Kevin M (a57144)

  27. No that would probably be Robert creamer or another fellow we could refer. Jimmy Carter was merely a fool.

    Steyer is up and coming, but he has been narrow in his focus to date.

    Narciso (3d15df)

  28. You didn’t forget the j 20 riots did you already,

    Narciso (3d15df)

  29. Grant making networks funded by sob Soros funded groups that were engaged in violence in the Ferguson RIOTS.

    mg (ef2c8e)

  30. What I’ve read of Kirchik confirms what I’ve read from others. His Open Society Institute did great work in the countries that are not the USA, especially PutinLand and eastern Europe. Back when Bush was prez, Soros took a decidedly partisan route with his contributions and his Democracy Alliance, thus becoming a polarizing figure among conservatives, justifiably so. But conservatives can still be big enough to acknowledge his offshore contributions to democracy and freedom, and still criticize him siding with Progressive Left in the US.

    Paul Montagu (70fe18)

  31. Soros/Ryan/2020

    mg (ef2c8e)

  32. I started reading the piece this morning on link from Instapundit but gave up as it seemed to be a Soros PR piece.

    Maybe I’ll revisit.

    Seriously, do finish the piece. It does start off speaking favorably of the subject, but Kirchick finishes up providing a pretty strong indictment of the effect Soros has had on our national politics. It’s nicer to him than I would have been, but I do appreciate Kirchick’s perspective all the same.

    JVW (42615e)

  33. In the next to last paragraph you was “appropriation” when you likely mean “approbation.”

    Thanks. I probably spelled the latter incorrectly and auto-correct substituted the former. I appreciate you catching that.

    JVW (42615e)

  34. Hey look! I figured out how to do a Twitter share button!

    Now to figure out Facebook.

    Nice! But we won’t be big time until we have the Pinterest link.

    JVW (42615e)

  35. Es tut mir leid, Meine Herren, Ich habe weder Hochtöner noch Gesichtbuch.

    nk (dbc370)

  36. So a qualified defense of soros, who is destroying everything we hold dear, no soros is not merely contaminating our politics, but every aspect of our
    sociAL relations, now that we can pretend thAT orange county has no representation what so ever.

    narciso (d1f714)

  37. That was in part thanks for fox putting their weight in early in the day, of course there is the obligatory blocking of asylum rules because that’s the natural course of things.

    narciso (d1f714)

  38. He isn’t a bogeyman he really is a bane on our existence, whereas trump is a blunt instrument, to accomplish some of the things we have said we wanted.

    narciso (d1f714)

  39. Noticed that you used a OANN link a couple days ago. ..is Narciso in full boycott Fox mode?

    urbanleftbehind (7b3112)

  40. Tigar is not merely an Obama appointee, but came from Morrison and foerster

    narciso (d1f714)

  41. I recall they had a scandal not long ago, with a rogue trader,

    https://babalublog.com/2018/11/20/u-s-fines-french-bank-1-34-billion-after-it-laundered-nearly-13-billion-for-cubas-terror-sponsoring-castro-dictatorship/

    This is whAT the French engaged in after armando alejandre and his three cinradew were blown up, in international waters.

    narciso (d1f714)

  42. Comrades alejandre was a former marine, this was done in conjunction was sleeper agent (quite literally) in the exile camp.

    narciso (d1f714)

  43. Its not unheard of, heydrich was the head of it fir. While:

    https://www.bloomberg.com/opinion/articles/2018-11-20/interpol-russian-leadership-would-be-a-disaster

    narciso (d1f714)

  44. george soros and a red-haired prostitute ordered burritos at chipotle on randolph and when they got them they just ran out the door without paying

    this happened two weeks ago

    and guess what cause they’re both white Chipotle just let them do it (racist fresh-mex)

    happyfeet (28a91b)

  45. Soros is the man. He is behind all the electile dysfunction. Trump has to have voter id and a thumb print. Just like Mexicoand build the wall with defense money.

    mg (ef2c8e)

  46. Orange County voter for republican govna and not one Republican won a rep seat.
    Erectile dysfunctions

    mg (ef2c8e)

  47. Very convenient, don’t you think at least the hordes in omega man had an excuse,

    Narciso (333454)

  48. narciso:

    OK. Your #37 seems to suggest that the Orange County vote was stolen for the Dems. (Perhaps by Soros). Is that what you are trying to suggest?

    I hope you and your fellow base dwellers start taking a message. Constant natavist appeals to the base and conspiracy theory mongering tick off the people you call RINOs, and they won’t vote for you.

    Appalled (d07ae6)

  49. Johnny and Edgar got shot up just the same.

    harkin (7ca65a)

  50. george soros guess what

    he’s very corrupt and he steals elections like they was chipotle burritos

    happyfeet (28a91b)

  51. With the help of fox news, don’t worry appalled you will get your wish in time, and then wonder what went wrong.

    Narciso (333454)

  52. No base creature will ever vote for a rino candidate. Ever.

    mg (ebf6c2)

  53. It’s because all the Orange County Republicans are moving to Arizona where they promptly proceed to elect practicing lipstick lesbians over old maid A-10 pilots to the U.S. Senate. California values!

    nk (dbc370)

  54. #53

    I am already wondering what went wrong, narc. That started in 2016, when it was clear the choice was Hillary vs Trump. With the GOP politicians lining up behind Trump with nary a peep, I continue wondering.

    I’m curious when you will start realizing that Trump crashed Flight 93, and we have all now gone to Hell.

    Appalled (d07ae6)

  55. Look at the margins, only few hundred votes, consider that Duncan hunter won despite the lawfare, nelson actually did marginally better than gillum (so much for new generation) but the felon vote will wash things put, because that’s who should be the beneficiaries.

    narciso (d1f714)

  56. old maid Bestialist A-10 pilots, you mean

    urbanleftbehind (5eecdb)

  57. Elizabeth Kim was defeated by a degenerate #metro target well if the press had focused on this, if Facebook jaunt trued to erase her public presence entirely, the Russians fell down on the job again (sarc)

    narciso (d1f714)

  58. When people enjoy being a rino they just as well liplock a frozen clothes line pole.

    mg (ebf6c2)

  59. No, I do not mean.

    nk (dbc370)

  60. #57

    I am happy to look at the margins, but maybe a clear statement would help. Do you think the Democrats actually stole elections from the Republicans in this election cycle in Orange County?

    In Florida, I agree the Broward County people behaved as if they were up to something, and Rubio’s intervention seemed appropriate to me. I don’t believe there was any other election stealing going on. Even here in Georgia.

    Do you believe that votes cast were stolen from Republicans in this election cycle?

    Appalled (d07ae6)

  61. Cantafordya is the home of elective dysfunction.
    More illegals voting than anywhere else.

    mg (ebf6c2)

  62. No probably those from Los Angeles and San Francisco that carry the goauld.

    Narciso (333454)

  63. So my view, is if we had a media with integrity (lol) soros would be denounced by every outlet, probably jailed for his previous offenses, his properties sold at auction. This is the treatment atl east attempted with koch adelson

    Narciso (333454)

  64. But no everyone sticks up for blofeld, as what this country used to be slips away, yes mini me Steyer deserves similar treatment.

    Narciso (333454)

  65. Which one of Soros’s offenses merits arrest in the US?

    Appalled (d07ae6)

  66. Having a face like soros should be the death penalty.

    mg (ebf6c2)

  67. Same with our designated grand inquisitor, no one rarely speaks up against him, who knows he’ll go after him, his conflicts of interest with Facebook and other clients, his long train of abuses.

    Narciso (333454)

  68. https://spectator.org/electoral-three-card-monte-how-the-democrats-stole-orange-county/

    So California is now Venezuela and they are trying to remake the rest of the nation in the same way.

    NJRob (4d595c)

  69. #70

    I read all that partisan boilerplate in your link, and missed seeing any evidence. Are mail in votes, by definition, fraudulent? Mia Love won, by the same process. You saying her win should be thought of as a fraud?

    #69

    Did Soros commit an actual crime, in your view? If so, please name it. A conflict of interest can be an ethics offense, or an SEC crime, but probably isn’t, in your context, unlesss Soros is a Facebook board member.

    Appalled (d07ae6)

  70. Any further questions, appalled, so lawfully designed regulations, In accordance with supreme court precedent are nullified, but lets focus more on horshack,

    narciso (d1f714)

  71. Partisan boilerplate is what you get from the Atlanta paper and the new York one and the one in dc

    narciso (d1f714)

  72. The new York post, goes halfway of the truth, and the journal about a third, remember that’s where glennsimpson got his start.

    narciso (d1f714)

  73. Some balanced account:

    http://thefederalist.com/2018/11/19/need-know-lawsuit-trumps-new-asylum-policies

    You will find this nowhere else, because virtually every mouthpiece has a soros or steyer connection

    narciso (d1f714)

  74. 71… Mia Love lost.

    Colonel Haiku (a7e08c)

  75. 70… a grand influx of foreign-born in the OC. Almost like that was the plan all along.

    Democrats will be the ruin of the United States of America yet…

    Colonel Haiku (a7e08c)

  76. Sadly so, well Romney will find a place for her, no?

    narciso (d1f714)

  77. #72

    Narc:

    Soros clearly uses his money for influence. As do a lot of other rich guys, including pre-Presidency Trump. That’s not a crime. It’s actually his right as a citizen.

    I try to think you aren’t wanting Soros locked up, just because you strongly disagree with him. That sounds more like Cuba than America. I keep pressing you on this, because I want you to actually state a crime, rather than just insinuate stuff, because you don’t like him.

    #76

    Well, that’s what I get for trusting yesterday’s reports. I hate this vote by mail thing. It allows for an appearance of impropriety.

    Appalled (d07ae6)

  78. Its probably like a hamas hudna:
    https://www.breitbart.com/national-security/2018/11/19/iran-allied-houthis-in-yemen-we-are-ready-to-freeze-and-stop-military-operations/

    That’s not what the posts resident columnist told us.

    narciso (d1f714)

  79. It was designed this way appalled, to overwhelm electoral systems

    narciso (d1f714)

  80. Love hasn’t conceded and AP hasn’t called the race yet.

    Kevin M (a57144)

  81. Cloward Piven and the ability to commit fraud.

    NJRob (4d595c)

  82. Yes just like a hudna:

    https://mobile.twitter.com/IF_asia_/status/1064896783992668162?p=v

    Upthread there is an example of the sort of thing, Budapest hasn’t had to deal with.

    narciso (d1f714)

  83. Yes the bureau is hiring top notch people

    https://mobile.twitter.com/JesseKellyDC/status/1064663030569398273?p=v

    narciso (d1f714)

  84. So California is now Venezuela and they are trying to remake the rest of the nation in the same way.

    Orange County turned on Trump when he wiped out the SALT deduction in his tax plan. Trump intentionally stuck it to EVERYONE with an upper-middle class income (killing many itemized deductions) and in high-tax states (limiting SALT). If you were very rich, the AMT stayed the same and it didn’t matter. Only people taking the standard deduction AND living in a Red state got a tax cut.

    Orange County residents, where the average non-immigrant family income is well over $100K, all got hosed. Every one of those defeated GOP Congressmen voted against Trump’s “tax cut.” They KNEW how bad it would be for them, and they were right.

    The good news is that it won’t last. Two years from now the GOP picks up 3-4 seats there.

    Kevin M (a57144)

  85. If you don’t understand how terrible Trump’s tax cut was for affluent Californians, just ask our host. Maybe folks like him didn’t vote Democrat, but they didn’t vote Republican either.

    Kevin M (a57144)

  86. How did hunter survive then, did rohrabacher vote no as well or is this russiAN garbage we’ve been imagining

    narciso (d1f714)

  87. I was unenthusiastic to vote for desantis replacement because he defeated a good local man and was weak on sodebergs flank but I did it anyways.

    Narciso (f851ba)

  88. Kevin,

    I understand full well. But voting for more leftism will sure allow them to keep more of their money. It’s the state that’s robbing them blind. Not Trump’s fault that he won’t let the state double dip to fund their socialist enterprise.

    NJRob (4d595c)

  89. I just want to know why leftists seem to lose on election day, but somehow win over and over again after the day is over? So many late “ballots” skew far left. Statistically it doesn’t make sense. We are told that most mail-in ballots are the elderly and they are solidly Republican. But somehow, that doesn’t end up the case over and over again.

    NJRob (4d595c)

  90. Eight years ago when Jerry brown was elected, people thought what’s the worst that could happen, 90,000 acres later we have a possible answer.

    Narciso (f851ba)

  91. But it appears the beatings will continue, now bill kristols vapors were mostly harmless.

    Narciso (f851ba)

  92. And the close call with Oroville, and the super train to nowhere,

    Narciso (f851ba)

  93. “I just want to know why leftists seem to lose on election day, but somehow win over and over again after the day is over? So many late “ballots” skew far left. Statistically it doesn’t make sense.”

    It’s because urban areas take longer to count, and urban areas generally vote Democrat.

    Davethulhu (519d49)

  94. “Eight years ago when Jerry brown was elected, people thought what’s the worst that could happen, 90,000 acres later we have a possible answer.”

    It’s a real shame Jerry Brown brought an end to forest raking.

    Davethulhu (519d49)

  95. It takes two weeks after the election, tell me another one, may be they should have split the state in three parts, that would be more manageable.

    narciso (d1f714)

  96. Hunter had a central casting villain running against him, imagine the Karate Kid rewritten to have the Cobra Kai dojo face a Chicano opponent in 1984 LA or an Arab opponent in mid 2000s suburban Detroit.

    urbanleftbehind (5eecdb)

  97. Dana R. was just an old fool, the emergence of a smarter version in the form of Mike Pompeo doomed Putin’s favorite congressman.

    urbanleftbehind (5eecdb)

  98. That’s sad that the TJs are doing it picking up the slack – it should have been the NAFTA belt factory towns and the ranchos/estados that have stickers on pick-up trucks up here doing that duty a week or 2 earlier.

    urbanleftbehind (5eecdb)

  99. I thought that was John Conyers,( d delta city) but his replacement yikes,

    narciso (d1f714)

  100. i unlike dirty cowardly lying mil-filth like John McCain, representative rohrbacher was true to his word and voted to repeal the obamacare

    happyfeet (28a91b)

  101. oopers

    i

    happyfeet (28a91b)

  102. The zetas have been falling down on the job, don’t they control that stretch of territory.

    narciso (d1f714)

  103. “It takes two weeks after the election, tell me another one, may be they should have split the state in three parts, that would be more manageable.”

    Mia Love was running in Utah, not California.

    Davethulhu (519d49)

  104. Mimi Walter Elizabeth Kim, try to keep up squid.

    narciso (d1f714)

  105. “rohrbacher was true to his word and voted to repeal the obamacare”

    And he was rewarded by the electorate.

    Davethulhu (519d49)

  106. dirty mia love’s gonna have to find a new venue where she can spread it around for corn pops and tater tots

    happyfeet (28a91b)

  107. “Mimi Walter Elizabeth Kim, try to keep up squid”

    I assumed you were following your comments @78 and @81, but you’re so incoherent I can only make sense of half your posts anyway.

    Davethulhu (519d49)

  108. nobody even knows what fetanyl is

    happyfeet (28a91b)

  109. Eight years ago when Jerry brown was elected, people thought what’s the worst that could happen, 90,000 acres later we have a possible answer

    Yeah, since 55% of all California forests are federal lands, and the source of the Camp fire being on Federal lands, Jerry Brown should have definitely managed those lands better. As President, Jerry Brown definitely has control of that.

    And the earlier Ranch Fire, the largest wildfire in state history, started on Federal land, as well as Hirz and Delta fires. Half of all wildfires in California over the last 25 years started on Federal land, as well as the 5 deadliest, of course, the Camp fire will end up being significantly worse than all of them.

    Forest management is both a state and federal issue, and the federal government owns the vast majority of forest land in the US, but it is an unsexy problem. Do you limit development into forested areas to reduce the risk of the unmanaged forest, do you pay the money to actively manage the forest, only a small portion of forested land is valuable for timber, so commercial companies are not going to go in unless subsidized. It’s an expensive problem, and not as sexy as spending $220M to showboat some troops a few hundred miles away from a tiny caravan of people walking a few thousand miles, just for a photo opp.

    The solution isn’t raking. Donnie is an imbecile, if he studies really hard, maybe he can be upgraded to moron, but he may just devolve into an idiot.

    Colonel Klink (Ret) (744849)

  110. how much is jerry brown spending on his silly medium-speed train boondoggle while his forests are neglected and everyone is getting barbecued

    happyfeet (28a91b)

  111. “It’s because urban areas take longer to count, and urban areas generally vote Democrat.”

    Shorter Cthulhu: “this is where opportunities abound, e.g., ballots mysteriously found in closets, lockers, or trunks of large late 70s GM sedans, provisional ballots never validated, counted anyways, ineligible voters, dead voters, etc….”

    Colonel Haiku (a7e08c)

  112. “Shorter Cthulhu”

    Your fantasy was twice as long as my post.

    In any event, I eagerly await proof of large scale fraud.

    Davethulhu (519d49)

  113. Yes about that, oh general burkhalter:
    https://wattsupwiththat.com/2018/11/17/fact-checking-the-ny-times-fact-checking/

    I didn’t look at NYT, but you’re posting a link somehow disproves of this starting on Federal land, but your link says:

    By the way, it is simply false that the Camp Fire “began in areas known as the wildland-urban interface”. The Camp Fire, which destroyed Paradise, is known to have started near Pulga, which is east and a little north of Paradise,

    in the Plumas National Forest.

    So, the fire starts in a forest — a National Forest — and driven by high winds becomes a virtual fire storm that sweeps through the “wildland-urban interface” called Paradise.

    The thing the author of your post has an argument with is the NYT person said it was technically “wildland-urban interface” fire, not a forest fire. He’s arguing that that may very well be technically and factually true, it still looks like a forest fire, to a layman. So he’s arguing about zoning and how the federal government defines the urban interface, nothing about it starting in the National Forrest.

    So thanks, for posting a link that confirms exactly what I said. I gather you didn’t bother to actually read the thing.

    Is your next spam message going to be about buying gold, or Iraqi dinar?

    Colonel Klink (744849)

  114. No, just like it wouldn’t be about bitcoin, but these folks have actually studied the science.

    Fentanyl often kills you dead pikachu, that’s very bad.

    Narciso (528eb1)

  115. I understand full well. But voting for more leftism will sure allow them to keep more of their money.

    They didn’t do that. They just stayed home and said things like “Why Does It Matter?”

    Kevin M (a57144)

  116. fentanyl’s good though if you have pain you just have to follow the instructions

    happyfeet (28a91b)

  117. I just want to know why leftists seem to lose on election day, but somehow win over and over again after the day is over? So many late “ballots” skew far left. Statistically it doesn’t make sense. We are told that most mail-in ballots are the elderly and they are solidly Republican. But somehow, that doesn’t end up the case over and over again.

    Once upon a time (like 1970), absentee ballots were from the elderly, military or affluent travelers. That changed when they remove restrictions on absentee ballot requests and changed even more when they started promoting the ease of mail-in and early balloting. When they started allowing provisional ballots from people too disorganized to figure out where to vote, or trying to cast an unlawful vote, it changed yet again.

    Reporters are parrots, and repeat memes long after they are canards. The elderly, military and traveler vote is now a minority of absentee/early voting, overwhelmed by mobs of casual voters.

    Early ballots and mail-in ballots are not counted until election day. Mail-in ballots need to have some verification, as do provisional ballots (many of which are invalid, but the Dems fight to count) which are counted last.

    Kevin M (a57144)

  118. “rohrbacher was true to his word and voted to repeal the obamacare”

    But it wasn’t repealed, and in California self-employed people were RAPED when they killed Ryan’s plan, wich was the only plan that would have lowered their premiums.

    As a result of what the REPUBLICANS did/failed to do with Obamacare, unsubsidized (e.g. self-employed) Obamacare rates went up yet again in CA as the money that the federal government used to pay the indigent was loaded on the full-pay private insurance market.

    Yet another reason people in OC (having many self-employed) didn’t love the GOP, or Trump. People vote their pocketbooks.

    Kevin M (a57144)

  119. dirty mia love’s gonna have to find a new venue where she can spread it around for corn pops and tater tots

    I’m having trouble deciding whether this is racist, misogynistic or anti-Mormon bigotry.

    Kevin M (a57144)

  120. I recently watched a NOVA episode on addiction. On that show, they said that fentanyl can be so powerful that it only takes the equivalent amount of two grains of sand to kill you.

    Tillman (61f3c8)

  121. it’s unfortunate Paul Ryan was so ineffective and useless

    happyfeet (28a91b)

  122. it’s unfortunate Donald Trump was so ineffective and useless

    FIFY

    Kevin M (a57144)

  123. n that show, they said that fentanyl can be so powerful that it only takes the equivalent amount of two grains of sand to kill you.

    Must be true then. They couldn’t say it if it wasn’t true.

    Kevin M (a57144)

  124. Hey, how about that stock market? Soros must be selling short again.

    Kevin M (a57144)

  125. Mostly Facebook laying an egg the size thAT Fred flintsone ate.

    narciso (d1f714)

  126. everybody hates facebook now they’re like harvey weinstein how they rape you and sell your data on the dark web to where your children move away and change their names and block you on their phones

    happyfeet (28a91b)

  127. Well he can’t do it by executive order, Kevin and besides a judge would nullify it,

    narciso (d1f714)

  128. Narciso, they took the “Cartel Nuevo Generacion Jalisco/Sinaloa” way, they probably didnt want to chance the Zetas in the northeast discovering their latent Tejano pride.

    urbanleftbehind (5eecdb)

  129. That’s probably true, yes getting Guzman loera out of the way, didn’t solve the problem.

    narciso (d1f714)

  130. breaking news not soros but trump administration funds agent provocateurs to infiltrate caravan to sabotage and give bad press.

    lany (221e7d)

  131. george soros is a stupid penis-face

    this is why he’s so mean to people, especially around the holidays

    happyfeet (28a91b)

  132. The bottom line would be that George Soros is not an evil genius (even if he made most of his money in an evil way) but actually, he’s rather stupid. and he may have switched from supporting one kind of thing 25 years ago to supporting other things now, or maybe is paying a lot less attention.

    Sammy Finkelman (102c75)

  133. Good article. Thanks for sharing.

    JP (1f50ca)


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