Patterico's Pontifications

I could get into a lather about how he gave Kim the prestige of meeting the American president and being photographed with him — but it’s Donald Trump, so, really, how much prestige is involved?

Patterico (41bc87) — 6/11/2018 @ 10:28 pm

Churchill and Roosevelt met with Stalin.

I’m sure some mocked them too.

shipwreckedcrew (56b591) — 6/11/2018 @ 10:35 pm

What are they signing their scorecards?

mg (9e54f8) — 6/11/2018 @ 10:36 pm

And after Kim Kardashian ….

nk (dbc370) — 6/11/2018 @ 10:37 pm

I’m just glad Dennis Rodman is there, to lend some gravitas to the US delegation.

Dave (445e97) — 6/11/2018 @ 10:44 pm

I’m still wondering if Trump lied when he denied the existence of the official who said this was “impossible”.

random viking (6a54c2) — 6/11/2018 @ 10:44 pm

No wonder Beldar only gave 2:1 odds. Guess it wasn’t impossible after all.

NJRob (b00189) — 6/11/2018 @ 10:46 pm

What this situation needs is the gravitas of a Madeline Albright.

random viking (6a54c2) — 6/11/2018 @ 10:49 pm

Prediction: In a gesture of Nobel-worthy magnanimity sure to reduce Dennis Rodman to tears (again), Trump will pardon Kim (Jong-Un, not Kardashian) during one of the press conferences.

Dave (445e97) — 6/11/2018 @ 10:50 pm

Now we have a black door into China!

mg (9e54f8) — 6/11/2018 @ 11:01 pm

Yes, lots of folks wish they’d taken my bet. No one did.

We’ll soon know what the “historic document” was that Trump and Kim signed with such ceremony in Singapore. My first reaction, based on Trump’s lack of specificity, was: “Bruce and Harriett Nyborg,” and covfefe is for closers only. But I think I’ll reserve further comment until we see what the document says.

Beldar (fa637a) — 6/11/2018 @ 11:04 pm

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hQ95ffnU4Sw

“You must remember, the Americans are a very strange people. Whereas other countries rarely forgive anything, the Americans forgive anything. There isn’t a more profitable undertaking for any country than to declare war on the United States and to be defeated.” – PM Count Rupert Mountjoy [Peter Sellers] ‘The Mouse That Roared’ 1959

DCSCA (797bc0) — 6/11/2018 @ 11:17 pm

3.What are they signing their scorecards?

The hotel bills.

DCSCA (797bc0) — 6/11/2018 @ 11:20 pm

1.I could get into a lather about how he gave Kim the prestige of meeting the American president and being photographed with him — but it’s Donald Trump, so, really, how much prestige is involved?

This one is likely worth a little lathering, P.

Memo to Texas: want parody, respect and leverage w/Washington? Make like Alabama…’ya better get a bomb’–

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wvs_qTnUHMI

DCSCA (797bc0) — 6/11/2018 @ 11:27 pm

Adelson picked up the tab.

mg (9e54f8) — 6/11/2018 @ 11:31 pm

Remember, if the summit fails, you really only have Hillary Clinton’s Libyan Adventure to blame for Kim realizing that even if Trump is as good as his word, the next President may renege on the deal and give Kim the Kaddafi special.

THANKS A LOT, STATE DEPARTMENT, REAL GOOD FORWARD THINKING THERE!

Dysphoria Sam (312848) — 6/11/2018 @ 11:36 pm

Excuses are for losers. Winners don’t need them. But I see Trump’s losers already have theirs lined up.

nk (dbc370) — 6/11/2018 @ 11:56 pm

The Road To Singapore is in the can.

Next Kim & Don summit has to be in Casablanca:

The Road to Morocco.

DCSCA (797bc0) — 6/11/2018 @ 11:59 pm

With all of obamas brains he could only muster a fricking beer summit.

mg (9e54f8) — 6/11/2018 @ 11:59 pm

“Excuses are for losers. Winners don’t need them. But I see Trump’s losers already have theirs lined up.”

Unrepentant platitudes and lonely deaths surrounded by cut-rate Third World nurses are for boomers.

Dysphoria Sam (312848) — 6/12/2018 @ 12:02 am

But I think I’ll reserve further comment until we see what the document says.

Oh come on.

Trump has found another murderous dictator to shower him with flattery and pretend to take him seriously.

It’s a great day for America!

Dave (445e97) — 6/12/2018 @ 12:09 am

My transcription from a blurry photo enlargement of the signed document, which is barely more than a page long:

[Whereas blah blah] and recognizing that mutual confidence building can promote the denuclearization of the Korean Peninsula, President Trump and Chairman Kim Jong Un state the following:

1. The United States and the DPRK commit to establish new U.S.-DPRK relations in accordance with the desire of the peoples of the two countries for peace and prosperity.

2. The United States and the DPRK will join their efforts to build a lasting and stable peaced regime on the Korean Peninsula.

3. Reaffirming the April 27, 2018 Panmunjom Declaration, the DPRK commits to work toward complete denuclearization of the Korean Peninsula.

4. The United States and the DPRK commit to recovering POW/MIA remains, including the immediate repatriation of those already identified.

Having acknowledged that the U.S.-DPRK summit — the first in history — was an epochal event of great significance in overcoming decades of tensions and hostilities between the two countries and the opening up of a new future, President Trump and Chairman Kim John Un commit to implementat the stipulations in this joint statement fully and expeditiously. The United States and the DPRK commit to hold follow-on negotiations, led by the U.S. Secretary of State, Mike Pompeo, and a relevant high-level DPRK official, at the earliest possible date, to implement the outcomes of the U.S.-DPRK summit.

President Donald J. Trump of the United States of America and Chairman Kim Jon Un of the State Affairs Commission of the Democratic People’s Republic of Korea have committed to cooperate for the development of new U.S.-DPRK relations and for the promotion of peace, prosperity, and securityh of the Korean Peninsula and of the world.

Trump got rolled. Kim is the World Champion Con Man.

Beldar (fa637a) — 6/12/2018 @ 12:10 am

Trump just made Jimmy Carter and Barack Obama seem like genius negotiators by contrast.

Beldar (fa637a) — 6/12/2018 @ 12:12 am

Trump: “We learned a lot about each other and our countries.”

Trump apparently thinks Kim showed up to the summit as clueless and unprepared as he did…

Dave (445e97) — 6/12/2018 @ 12:12 am

I filled three totes at the used book store today but they didn’t want any neo cons: Dana Perino, Bob Gates, John Bolton or Dick Cheney. Books my mom sent btw. Trump only wanted one out of four.

Be the Bigger Man

Picture in Picture

Pinandpuller (21514f) — 6/12/2018 @ 12:13 am

Trump just made Jimmy Carter and Barack Obama seem like genius negotiators by contrast.

Beldar (fa637a) — 6/12/2018 @ 12:12 am

You haven’t seen the North Korea Canal yet, Mr Beldar.

Pinandpuller (21514f) — 6/12/2018 @ 12:14 am

Madelyn Albright at least got a glass of champagne, without having to buy the bottle for her hosts. We’ve just paid for Kim to have a luxury vacation, during which we’ve transformed him into an international rock star.

Trump’s just given Kim and the Norks the most spectacular propaganda coup in the history of their nasty little country, and turned the Dear Leader into the Respected Leader, in exchange for which it appears that we may, perhaps, get ~~a handful of magic beans~~ some very old bones.

Beldar (fa637a) — 6/12/2018 @ 12:14 am

Beldar and Dave are apparently giving out their pre-programmed responses, do they actually have a clue what they’re talking about or are they still waiting for someone else to fax over the details?

Dysphoria Sam (312848) — 6/12/2018 @ 12:17 am

“Trump’s just given Kim and the Norks the most spectacular propaganda coup in the history of their nasty little country, and turned the Dear Leader into the Respected Leader, in exchange for which it appears that we may, perhaps, get a handful of magic beans some very old bones.”

Oh, Beldar’s mad that we GOT THE REMAINS OF THE WAR DEAD back, I see, yeah, screw those sentimental military families whose requests for these things gets in the way of Qaddafi Part II.

Dysphoria Sam (312848) — 6/12/2018 @ 12:20 am

I have never seen anyone achieve that combination of utterly callous ghoulishness and rank analytic incompetence that Beldar just demonstrated outside of talking to British leftists about the First and Second amendments.

Dysphoria Sam (312848) — 6/12/2018 @ 12:25 am

Losers will be happy with any bone you throw them.

nk (dbc370) — 6/12/2018 @ 12:25 am

“I could get into a lather about how he gave Kim the prestige of meeting the American president and being photographed with him — but it’s Donald Trump, so, really, how much prestige is involved?”

You could also save your breath about issues that aren’t in your jurisdiction. The world between nations is a prison yard that operates by prison rules, and the smart lawyers keep their work on their side of the wall.

Dysphoria Sam (312848) — 6/12/2018 @ 12:29 am

“Losers will be happy with any bone you throw them.”

What have you ever won, exactly?

Dysphoria Sam (312848) — 6/12/2018 @ 12:30 am

They’ve promised even this paltry cooperation before, Sam, repeatedly:

Operation Glory (and other returns): As required by the Armistice, both sides made an effort to return war dead during September through November of 1954. The Chinese and North Koreans provided a total of 4,167 containers, with an estimated 4,219 human remains, of whom 2,944 are known or believed to be Americans. Generalizing, the figures presented in the slide are “net,” after identifications from these returns have been deducted. This is also true of unilateral remains turnovers by the North Koreans in 1990-94 and in 2007, and our own recovery work in North Korea from 1996-2005.

You can make up words to insult POW/MIA families and pretend here that I said or wrote them, but what that boils down to is you making up words to insult POW/MIA families. I didn’t say or write them.

But I will say that another empty, equivocal, toothless Nork promise about war remains is hardly the “complete, verifiable, irreversible denuclearization” that the WH has been promoting as the goal posts for the last two weeks.

Trump’s a sucker, a chump, a dupe, a mark. He’s just been outplayed on the world stage by a complete rookie. There’s no there there. They didn’t even bring in mirrors to make the smoke look thicker.

Beldar (fa637a) — 6/12/2018 @ 12:33 am

@24. “We learned a lot about each other and our countries.” Trump apparently thinks Kim showed up to the summit as clueless and unprepared as he did…

All Kim needed was Netflix:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uYMuJDajujc

DCSCA (797bc0) — 6/12/2018 @ 12:36 am

Full text from Politico:

Joint Statement of President Donald J. Trump of the United States of American and Chairman King Jong Un of the Democratic People’s Republic of Korea at the Singapore Summit

President Donald J. Trump of the United States of America and Chairman Kim Jong Un of the State Affairs Commission of the Democratic People’s Republic of Korea (DPRK) held a first, historic summit in Singapore on June 12, 2018.

President Trump and Chairman Kim Jong Un conducted a comprehensive, in-depth, and sincere exchange of opinions on the issues related to the establishment of new U.S.-DPRK relations and the building of a lasting and robust peace regime on the Korean Peninsula. President Trump committed to provide security guarantees to the DPRK and Chairman Kim Jong Un reaffirmed his firm and unwavering commitment to complete denuclearization of the Korean Peninsula.

Convinced that the establishment of new U.S.-DPRK relations will contribute to the peace and prosperity of the Korean Peninsula and of the world, and recognizing that mutual confidence building can promote the denuclearization of the Korean Peninsula, President Trump and Chairman Kim Jong Un state the following.

1. The United States and the DPRK commit to establish new U.S.-DPRK relations in accordance with the desire of the peoples of the two countries for peace and prosperity.

2. The United States and the DPRK will join their efforts to build a lasting and stable peace regime on the Korean Peninsula.

3. Reaffirming the April 27, 2018 Panmunjom Declaration, the DPRK commits to work toward complete denuclearization of the Korean Peninsula.

4. The United States and the DPRK commit to recovering POW/MIA remains, including the immediate repatriation of those already identified.

Having acknowledged that the U.S-DPRK summit — the first in history — was an epochal event of great significance in overcoming decades of tensions and hostilities between the two countries and for the opening up of a new future, President Trump and Chairman Kim Jong Un commit to implement the stipulations in this joint statement fully and expeditiously. The United States and the DPRK commit to hold follow-on negotiations, led by the U.S. Secretary of State Mike Pompeo, and a relevant high-level DPRK official, at the earliest possible date, to implement the outcomes of the U.S.-DPRK summit.

President Donald J. Trump of the United States and Chairman Kim Jong Un of the State Affairs Commission of the Democratic People’s Republic of Korea have committed to cooperate for the development of new U.S.-DPRK relations and for the promotion of peace, prosperity, and security of the Korean Peninsula and of the world.

“Epochal” vaporware. Trump got rolled.

Beldar (fa637a) — 6/12/2018 @ 12:39 am

You don’t have to worry about that infrastructure spending now:

Domino’s Pizza is hitting the streets to help “smooth the ride home” for deliveries by making pothole and road repairs in towns customers have nominated online.

The “Paving for Pizza” initiative will fill “cracks, bumps, potholes and other road conditions [that] can put good pizzas at risk after they leave the store,” the press release said.

“We know that feeling is heightened when you’re bringing home a carryout order from your local Domino’s store. We don’t want to lose any great-tasting pizza to a pothole, ruining a wonderful meal,” said Russell Weiner, president of Domino’s USA. “Domino’s cares too much about its customers and pizza to let that happen.”

http://www.foxnews.com/food-drink/2018/06/11/dominos-pizza-fixes-streets-fills-potholes-across-america.html

Pinandpuller (21514f) — 6/12/2018 @ 12:40 am

Nixon met with Mao. Only Trump could meet with Kim, for different reasons.

Kevin M (752a26) — 6/12/2018 @ 12:42 am

So what is the solution, Mr Beldar?

I hope that’s not coming across all snarky because that’s not my intent.

What are our options?

Do nothing

Talk

Secret Assassination

Overt Assassination

Conventional War

Nuclear Strike

What’s your choice?

Not characterizing you, but many will say, “Whatever Trump chooses is the wrong answer.”

Pinandpuller (21514f) — 6/12/2018 @ 12:45 am

@36. What?!?! No USS Pueblo!!?!!?

Jaysus, Beldar, the text o/t Boy Scout Oath has more substantive text. Characterizing our Captain as getting ‘rolled’ is an insult to ‘getting rolled.’

DCSCA (797bc0) — 6/12/2018 @ 12:47 am

Trump got rolled. Kim is the World Champion Con Man.

Maybe, or maybe rope-a-dope. It depends on how much influence Bolton has. If we are to go to war with North Korea, a sincere attempt at peace is a necessary check-off. This is Kim’s last best hope of forestalling regime change.

Oh! But the Nukes! He’ll have Nukes! Maybe, and delivery systems, too, largely untested. And a complete inability to use them and survive. Can I see the hands of those who think that Trump would refrain from unloading the wrath of Curtis LeMay on NK following a NK nuclear detonation on or near us, or worse, one of our allies. None? Good. If we were really worried, we’d start with a few nukes — the reverse of the promise in the NNPT.

Kevin M (752a26) — 6/12/2018 @ 12:48 am

“You can make up words to insult POW/MIA families and pretend here that I said or wrote them,”

BRO YOU LITERALLY JUST DID.

“but what that boils down to is you making up words to insult POW/MIA families. I didn’t say or write them.”

YOU SOUND LIKE A MIDDLE MANAGER FRANTICALLY ATTEMPTING TO REVERSE BLAME WHEN THE NEW ORG CHARTS COME DOWN WITHOUT YOU ON THEM.

“But I will say that another empty, equivocal, toothless Nork promise about war remains is hardly the “complete, verifiable, irreversible denuclearization” that the WH has been promoting as the goal posts for the last two weeks.”

BELDAR IS AN UTTER SOCIAL LIGHTWEIGHT AND HAS NO IDEA HOW DIPLOMACY WITH NUCLEAR-ARMED STATES WORKS, THINKS IN TERMS OF GOALS RATHER THAN SYSTEMS, SINGULAR ‘FINAL SOLUTION’ EVENTS RATHER THAN CONSTANT ENGAGEMENT TO PROBE FOR WEAKNESSES, AND AN ALL-OR-NOTHING APPROACH INSTEAD OF GIVE-AND-TAKE. HE ALSO PROBABLY THINKS CHINA AND SOUTH KOREA’S INTERESTS ARE IRRELEVANT TO THESE NEGOTIATIONS AND THAT LIL’ KIM IS IN COMPLETE CONTROL OF HIS COUNTRY WITH COMPLETE FREEDOM TO MAKE HIS OWN DECISIONS.

WHEN CALLED ON THIS HE POSTS GRAMATICALLY AND LOGICALLY NONSENSICAL REPLIES, INDICATING THAT HE DOES IN FACT FEEL THE COGNITIVE DISSONANCE BUT IT HURTS TOO MUCH TO ADMIT IT.

Dysphoria Sam (312848) — 6/12/2018 @ 12:49 am

___________ got rolled=status quo.

Pinandpuller (21514f) — 6/12/2018 @ 12:51 am

If you think that Trump doesn’t listen to his advisors, consider Kim who has been known to feed them to hungry dogs.

Kevin M (752a26) — 6/12/2018 @ 12:51 am

I cannot tell you how seldom I read paragraphs in all caps. Too hard.

Kevin M (752a26) — 6/12/2018 @ 12:53 am

Pin, giving Kim a promise of security guarantees is assuredly not on my list. Giving Kim the international and internal status we’ve just conferred upon him is assuredly not on my list. Giving the Norks more time under less pressure is assuredly not on my list. Promising to invite Kim to the White House is assuredly not on my list.

My list starts with the most severe sanctions we’ve ever had previously under Obama or Trump, and then adds a naval blockade and a deadline for complete, verifiable, irreversible denuclearization as we define it.

Beldar (fa637a) — 6/12/2018 @ 12:54 am

Sam, you never disappoint. Keep on Trumpkinin’, you’re emblematic of the class.

Beldar (fa637a) — 6/12/2018 @ 12:55 am

When do we attack Israel? Hello, the USS Liberty? They also have nukes.

Remember during the last administration? People actually speculated that Obama might have to attack Israel. Am I taking crazy pills?

Pinandpuller (21514f) — 6/12/2018 @ 12:56 am

The same Trump supporters who mocked Clinton, Bush, and Obama for getting suckered by the Norks are now going to demand that Trump get his Nobel Peace Price for this sack of horsesh!t.

Beldar (fa637a) — 6/12/2018 @ 12:59 am

I’m not following you, Pin. Israel?

Beldar (fa637a) — 6/12/2018 @ 1:01 am

38.Nixon met with Mao…

In February, 1972. And resigned 2 1/2 years later in August, 1974. NorK isn’t the PRC and Kim is no Mao. He’s only 34, too. Trump turns 72 in two days. Chocolate cake and two scoops of vanilla await his early return. =drum roll= Agree w/Beldar: Trump got chocolate-ice-cream-cake-rolled.

DCSCA (797bc0) — 6/12/2018 @ 1:01 am

45.I cannot tell you how seldom I read paragraphs in all caps. Too hard.

So glad you’re not in the Navy, K, and it is not 1941…

AIR RAID.
PEARL HARBOR.
THIS IS NO DRILL.

DCSCA (797bc0) — 6/12/2018 @ 1:04 am

My list starts with the most severe sanctions we’ve ever had previously under Obama or Trump, and then adds a naval blockade and a deadline for complete, verifiable, irreversible denuclearization as we define it.

Beldar (fa637a) — 6/12/2018 @ 12:54 am

The trouble is China. How do the sanctions work? There is an armistice and a blockade is an act of war. All I’m saying is, none of the options are great, but Il could be deathly allergic to roses and cherry blossoms, who knows?

Obama showed the Dalai Lama out the garbage exit. I suppose Trump could stumble into some insult like that. Also remember KAL 902 and that Trump is super good friends with Putin and Putin likes to kill people. Problem solved.

Nonetheless, I hope you are fairing well in the heat and budding tropical storms and such. We only have one nuclear threat in CST unless you count Trump and I don’t.

Pinandpuller (21514f) — 6/12/2018 @ 1:06 am

STOP

Pinandpuller (21514f) — 6/12/2018 @ 1:07 am

I’m not following you, Pin. Israel?

Beldar (fa637a) — 6/12/2018 @ 1:01 am

I’m funning on Mr DCSCA and the USS Pueblo, etc.

Pinandpuller (21514f) — 6/12/2018 @ 1:09 am

If we could get the CIA off tapping POTUS’ wires they could MK Ultra Dennis Rodham Ballhogg and he could take dear leader out, and we’d be rid of him to boot.

Pinandpuller (21514f) — 6/12/2018 @ 1:12 am

@48.Today USS Pueblo is a humiliating tourist attraction in Pyongyang, North Korea, PP. The USS Liberty, not so much. But if you write him nicely, Kim can get you tickets and a tour.

DCSCA (797bc0) — 6/12/2018 @ 1:20 am

This is the best site to read chickensh!t comments written by lawyers.

mg (9e54f8) — 6/12/2018 @ 1:37 am

NK, just destroyed its rocket engine production and test facilities…

That NK, not nk, the other NK, the mean one..

EPWJ (94bbf4) — 6/12/2018 @ 1:43 am

Make an argument if you’ve got one, mg.

Beldar (fa637a) — 6/12/2018 @ 1:50 am

So we’re getting back any remains of our honored dead found from 65 years ago and U.S. hostages already released in exchange to ending military exercises w/SK- or as our Captain calls them, ‘war games’ as the big planes- and he told us he knows a lot about airplanes- have to fly 6.5 hours from Guam. And no sleep for 25 hours!!

Oh, yes, Kim has definitely read the Art of the Deal.

The presser… sad. Just oh-so-sad.

DCSCA (797bc0) — 6/12/2018 @ 1:51 am

If Trump does actually effect long lasting permanent change he won’t need a prize, Mr Beldar, because he will get full credit from people like Bill Kristol.

Pinandpuller (21514f) — 6/12/2018 @ 2:09 am

How much do you charge to argue?

mg (9e54f8) — 6/12/2018 @ 2:10 am

The Real Estate Developer pitched a customer w/a frigging sales video?!

O.M.G.

DCSCA (797bc0) — 6/12/2018 @ 2:14 am

and yet he’s still president and commanding the world stage over the weekend…..

EPWJ (79e881) — 6/12/2018 @ 2:16 am

@65. Yes, a regular Millard Fillmore.

DCSCA (797bc0) — 6/12/2018 @ 2:17 am

62.If Trump does actually effect long lasting permanent change…

The correct diplomatic term is damage.

DCSCA (797bc0) — 6/12/2018 @ 2:23 am

Que the old disco tune “freakout”

EPWJ (79e881) — 6/12/2018 @ 2:31 am

OT

https://www.yahoo.com/lifestyle/little-boy-says-goodbye-dying-sister-heartbreaking-photo-doesnt-want-leave-side-000905451.html

EPWJ (79e881) — 6/12/2018 @ 2:43 am

this is what happens when your dirty useless corrupt tranny-trash mattis military isn’t up to the job of doing a military option

(filthy useless gold-plated US military suck suck suck)

you have to do the best you can with what you got

and this is why I sing my song I love my Donald Trump

he’s the best thing for to make the better international relations that’s for sure

happyfeet (28a91b) — 6/12/2018 @ 5:00 am

Trump does hyperbole the best. He’s the greatest. Unbelievable. Tremendous. Fantastic.

But others? Well, they are the worst, terrible, nasty and dishonest. (Unless they do what Donald wants. Then you can refer back to the first list. Temporarily.)

noel (b4d580) — 6/12/2018 @ 5:06 am

Fantastic! A “fantastic meeting”! As in fantasy.

nk (dbc370) — 6/12/2018 @ 5:15 am

It’s a bit much to expect anything major from the first meeting in terms of an agreement. I’d be more worried if he had come home with Peace In Our Time, or something like that. I would say Trump “got rolled” if he brought home an agreement that required a lot of verification — because Kim is good at avoiding the verification. As for a propaganda victory — is Kim going to be the vanguard of any global movement? After Trump’s performance in Canada, is anyone going to waste any time showing him “strange new respect”? If folks have a problem with Trump providing a propaganda victory for dictators — that ship sailed long ago.

If all Trump does is declare victory and come home, he hasn’t done any harm, which, from Trump, is an outcome I will take.

Appalled (96665e) — 6/12/2018 @ 5:19 am

it was not that long ago people round here were doing pee pee panties cause President Trump’s rhetoric was too belligerent

happyfeet (28a91b) — 6/12/2018 @ 5:24 am

Good lord! Is there a point at which hatred for Trump can come to a halt and allow common sense and a desire for success to b given a chance?

Can one look past the loathing for the man just long enough to hope he succeeds, all in consideration of what it would mean for that lofty goal, World Peace?

Or is the Maher stance–failure of the economy and what it would mean for ourselves and our family and our neighbors so trump will b forced out–the reigning POV, no matter what? Do u want to cut ur nose off just to spite ur face?

Amon-ra (5ec76b) — 6/12/2018 @ 5:47 am

Good points, Amon-ra. I agree. I want Trump to succeed both domestically and internationally. (Except where I want him to fail such as repeal of Net Neutrality, may Brahma’s snake bite Ajit Pai in the butt.) But it’s a lot of fun tweaking Trumpkins.

nk (dbc370) — 6/12/2018 @ 5:56 am

Trump is our President until 2021, and maybe beyond, barring someone raising a real case against him that would convince Republicans. It benefits the country if he can manage a success or two among all the unnecessary conflict and poo flinging.

Trump has experience running a very big family business, and fueling the business using his outrageous personality. That makes his personality and experience pretty similar to Kim. Trump’s sense of the world is America First and protectionism. He doesn’t really see much use in having troops in Korea. Another commonality with Kim.

In short — Trump can do some good in Korea. He’s almost uniquely situated in his ability to do it. The diplomatic approach will bring some gigantic perpetual peacemaking bureaucracy, with elegant design, insufficient personnel, and managed mediocrity which ends up perpetuating the status quo for years, and then ultimately fails, after Kim figures out all the loopholes and exploits them.

Appalled (96665e) — 6/12/2018 @ 6:13 am

The same angry blind #NeverTrumpers who got the GOP Primaries wrong, and the Presidential Election wrong, are continuing their vicious guttersnipe campaign of character assassination against Donald J Trump, while at the same time denying his astonishing record of outstanding achievements.

With respect to North Korea only time will reveal the effectiveness of Trump’s initiative to De-nuclearize the Korean Peninsula and extend the South’s level of prosperity to the impoverished North.

But, if well begun is half done, clearly it’s deranged to prematurely declare Trump’s well intentioned effort useless or counterproductive. Yet, that’s what we see here over and over again: angry blind character assassins competing with each other to give voice to a malignant hatred.

ropelight (104f4d) — 6/12/2018 @ 6:17 am

very eloquent Mr. ropelight

happyfeet (28a91b) — 6/12/2018 @ 6:20 am

I read somewhere recently that most of the opposition to Trump is aesthetic and not substantive. This post is a perfect example.

For all his buffoonery, Trump has come a lot closer than his predecessors to dealing with the nuclear North Korea problem. He still may fail, of course — right now, I give him an incomplete. But he is thus far dealing effectively with a problem that the last three administrations allowed to fester. I hope everyone here hopes he succeeds.

Now compare this to what Obama and Kerry did with Iran. For all their smooth talk, the deal was a complete disaster for the United States.

So what would you prefer — a buffoon who achieves a denuclearized rogue state, or a smooth talker who allows a rogue state to get billions to fund a nuclear program, not to mention terrorism and other mischief?

Bored Lawyer (998177) — 6/12/2018 @ 6:21 am

yes yes Mr. Lawyer

captain food stamp was pedigreed harvardtrash and he just let north korea develop all the nuclears they wanted

happyfeet (28a91b) — 6/12/2018 @ 6:24 am

I read somewhere recently that most of the opposition to Trump is aesthetic and not substantive. This post is a perfect example.

What aesthetic opposition to Trump do you see in this post?

Patterico (115b1f) — 6/12/2018 @ 6:33 am

Yet, that’s what we see here over and over again: angry blind character assassins competing with each other to give voice to a malignant hatred.
ropelight (104f4d) — 6/12/2018 @ 6:17 am

You have encapsulated the entirety of this blog since Nov. 2016. The NeverTrumpers have melded with the #resisters and joined the left. Only leftists are capable of being this childishly mad for this long. And only leftists refuse to applaud the good things Trump does when he does them. This used to be a really great conservative blog. Now it has degraded into leftist neverTrump silliness. Constantly.

Rev.Hoagie (c5d6cf) — 6/12/2018 @ 6:37 am

speaking of aesthetic opposition

sexy rexy tillerboobs coulda been a part of history

but he was too snotty and maladroit 🙁

this is a good lesson for other snotty people

happyfeet (28a91b) — 6/12/2018 @ 6:41 am

You have encapsulated the entirety of this blog since Nov. 2016. The NeverTrumpers have melded with the #resisters and joined the left. Only leftists are capable of being this childishly mad for this long. And only leftists refuse to applaud the good things Trump does when he does them.

It is, of course, completely false that I have not acknowledged the good things that Trump has done. I have done it consistently. It makes me sad that you feel compelled to say untrue things about my blog, Hoagie, but I can’t control what you say.

Whether this summit is a good thing, of course, remains to be seen. History teaches us that the Norks make a lot of empty promises.

Patterico (115b1f) — 6/12/2018 @ 6:41 am

“What aesthetic opposition to Trump do you see in this post?”

Let’s see:

Comments about hair, fatness and Trump’s lack of prestige: all aesthetic.

Comments about achieving denuclearization of North Korea: none.

Balance of aesthetic vs. substantive: 100 to 0.

Bored Lawyer (998177) — 6/12/2018 @ 6:42 am

“As far as the risk of dealing with a madman, that’s his problem.” – then-Trump on the (apparently real) prospect of meeting with North Korea’s dictator.

I don’t hold out too much hope that much material freedom for North Korea’s beleaguered people will come of this besides a few IHOP outlets north of the 38th or something.

It’s more the tone of the thing that rankles; the overestimation and indulgence of such a wretch and his regime (no, not another Trump joke).

It doesn’t remind me so much as Truman meeting Stalin – Truman had the decency and horse-sense to treat the man with cordiality without losing contempt for him and what he stood for.

Contrast that with the accolades of when Nixon met Mao, or Carter met Tito, or even worse, Ceausescu.

And now Trump with Kim.

It better be worth it.

JP (2fb936) — 6/12/2018 @ 6:44 am

Comments about hair, fatness and Trump’s lack of prestige: all aesthetic.

Comments about Kim’s hair and fatness?

I can’t make a joke without people frowning and furrowing their brows angrily?

The lack of prestige was in the comments.

Patterico (115b1f) — 6/12/2018 @ 6:50 am

Balance of aesthetic vs. substantive: 100 to 0.

There is literally nothing substantive anyone can say about this other than to warn that the Norks have made empty promises before.

Patterico (115b1f) — 6/12/2018 @ 6:52 am

the dirty filth-persians must be wondering why they’re sitting in iran in a pile of their own oily poop while everybody’s fussing over a dirt-poor gulag state like North Korea

happyfeet (28a91b) — 6/12/2018 @ 7:05 am

Look, Hoagie, everyone is sorry for your health challenges. Everyone wants you to be healthy and happy. But when you write:

Only leftists are capable of being this childishly mad for this long.

I just have to remind you to look at your own posts, with respect For a long while now, you have been doing the very things you deride, with rude, insulting, and over the top childish comments.

I’m sorry you feel badly, but there is no cause to beat other people over the head with faults you yourself display.

I hope you feel better soon, truly.

Simon Jester (a15506) — 6/12/2018 @ 7:26 am

79, 83… Well said, Ropelight and Hoagie. Time will tell. That and reasonably unfettered access for purposes of verification.

Colonel Haiku (105ec6) — 6/12/2018 @ 7:33 am

Skepticism about the significance of Shrodinger’s Singapore summit is legitimate given the history of the players and the US-NK relationship post-1953. The decision to break with the failed confidence-building incrementalism of past diplomatic efforts in favor of a leader-to-leader agreement to choose a path to peace and prosperity is a paradigm-busting opportunity previously thought to be unthinkable. Capabilities and intentions define relations between nations. We know NK’s capabilities we don’t know their actual intentions. We’ll know in short order how sincere Kim’s willingness to denuclearize in favor of survival and economic prosperity is. History marks Lee and Grant’s meeting at Appomattox as the end of America’s Civil War despite the fact that the desire for vengeance remains. America’s acceptance of regime survival is distasteful but probably as necessary for NK’s voluntary denuclearization as Lincoln’s acceptance of Lee’s surrender to Grant was.

Old wounds won’t heal overnight but the future looks brighter than it did months ago if Kim’s intentions are as honorable as Lee’s.

crazy (5c5b07) — 6/12/2018 @ 7:34 am

But, if well begun is half done, clearly it’s deranged to prematurely declare Trump’s well intentioned effort useless or counterproductive.

Because all the previous useless and counterproductive efforts the Norks took advantage of weren’t well-intentioned.

Dave (445e97) — 6/12/2018 @ 7:48 am

I read somewhere recently that most of the opposition to Trump is aesthetic and not substantive.

And what’s wrong with that? Who said “”Beauty is truth, truth beauty,—that is all ye know on earth, and all ye need to know”? And long before Keats, in Greek, beauty and good was the same word, καλος.

nk (dbc370) — 6/12/2018 @ 7:53 am

that’s very bad manners to rub Mr. Hoagie’s illness in his face

let’s try and keep it a little more classy please

happyfeet (28a91b) — 6/12/2018 @ 7:54 am

nk:

#94. People who get their philosophy from a Grecian Urn aren’t really much different than folks who get their politics off of a bumper sticker.

Appalled (96665e) — 6/12/2018 @ 8:17 am

MAGA, Appalled.

nk (dbc370) — 6/12/2018 @ 8:20 am

Hoagie’s no mealeymouth half-stepper, he says what he thinks without embellishments or clever ambiguities. If you respect that kind of straight talk, and I do, there’s a welcoming audience for his contributions here.

Besides, Hoagie’s a celebrity. He made the all-time best Internet comment ever.

ropelight (104f4d) — 6/12/2018 @ 8:23 am

Visualize Whirled Peas, nk.

Appalled (96665e) — 6/12/2018 @ 8:24 am

that’s very bad manners to rub Mr. Hoagie’s illness in his face

It would be if that’s what had happened, which it wasn’t.

Patterico (208d52) — 6/12/2018 @ 8:28 am

Hoagie’s no mealeymouth half-stepper, he says what he thinks without embellishments or clever ambiguities. If you respect that kind of straight talk, and I do, there’s a welcoming audience for his contributions here

That’s all well and good, but I don’t appreciate his making factually untrue statements about my blog.

Patterico (208d52) — 6/12/2018 @ 8:29 am

i don’t see how it was relevant at all to Mr. Hoagie’s comment it was completely extraneous actually

happyfeet (28a91b) — 6/12/2018 @ 8:31 am

Empty promises and past behavior need to be factored in. Reportedly, Trump and Kim had been discussing things for a while, may be why they seemed to have some rapport.

“We got this infared stuff… it’s pretty cool.” LOL.

Colonel Haiku (105ec6) — 6/12/2018 @ 8:41 am

#93, Dave, no, not because previous attempts weren’t well-intentioned. Past failures largely hinged on the inability to reestablish mutual trust between the US and China sufficient to allow progress on the Korean Peninsula without reanimating the hostile fears of the early ’50s.

ropelight (104f4d) — 6/12/2018 @ 8:59 am

Patterico, you can say you’ve acknowledged the good things Trump has done, and that’s true as far as it goes. But Hoagie was referenceing how few of Trump’s accomplishments you’ve been willing to label ‘good.’

Hoagie also pointed out (wrongly) that “Only leftists are capable of being this childishly mad for this long.”

We have plenty of evidence here to prove that so-called ‘principled conservatives’ are as fully capable of holding onto childish animosities as the most rabid of die-hard moonbats.

ropelight (104f4d) — 6/12/2018 @ 9:26 am

Trump is a consumate liar. He exaggerates to the extreme, conjures up conspiracy theories and is an obvious narcissist. Where that falls on the aesthetic vs. substantive scale… I don’t really care.

noel (b4d580) — 6/12/2018 @ 10:32 am

Has there ever been a politician more consumed with aesthetics…. than Trump?

noel (b4d580) — 6/12/2018 @ 10:34 am

nk (dbc370) — 6/12/2018 @ 7:53 am

I like that comment. It was better humor than we deserve.

felipe (023cc9) — 6/12/2018 @ 10:47 am

Has there ever been a politician more consumed with ~~aesthetics~~MAGA…. than Trump?

Just consider that for a moment.

felipe (023cc9) — 6/12/2018 @ 10:51 am

Patterico, you can say you’ve acknowledged the good things Trump has done, and that’s true as far as it goes. But Hoagie was referenceing how few of Trump’s accomplishments you’ve been willing to label ‘good.’

I label “good” the ones I honestly think are good. So you want honesty or do you want a cheerleader?

Patterico (208d52) — 6/12/2018 @ 12:27 pm

Two years of “boo hoo you don’t praise Donald Trump enough” is more than enough. I can’t stop the endless stream of the same comment every single day but I can and will tune it out.

Patterico (208d52) — 6/12/2018 @ 12:31 pm

The Colonel’s one-week vacation for calling me an “asshole” is over.

Patterico (208d52) — 6/12/2018 @ 12:33 pm

And what’s wrong with that? Who said “”Beauty is truth, truth beauty,—that is all ye know on earth, and all ye need to know”? And long before Keats, in Greek, beauty and good was the same word, καλος.

nk (dbc370) — 6/12/2018 @ 7:53 am

What was the Ancient Greek term for “statutory rape”?

Pinandpuller (89577b) — 6/12/2018 @ 1:55 pm

MAGA, Appalled.

nk (dbc370) — 6/12/2018 @ 8:20 am

Make America Greek Again.

Pinandpuller (89577b) — 6/12/2018 @ 1:58 pm

Has there ever been a politician more consumed with aesthetics…. than Trump?

noel (b4d580) — 6/12/2018 @ 10:34 am

Dick Morris set up focus groups to figure out where the Clintons should go on vacation.

Pinandpuller (89577b) — 6/12/2018 @ 2:03 pm

113… it was “ah buddy”, but foxholebuddy would’ve worked better. My chagrin was sobering.