Patterico's Pontifications

1/11/2018

President Donald J. Trump on “Shithole Countries”

Filed under: General — Patterico @ 6:41 pm

In my review of Michael Wolff’s book, I left out the most unbelievable anecdote of all. There’s a scene described in which Trump is discussing an immigration deal with members of Congress sitting around the table, and refers to Haiti and African nations as “shithole countries.” According to fabulist Wolff, Trump contrasted these countries (which have a lot of black people) with Norway (which has a lot of white people).

I, for one, am sick of people discussing Wolff’s made-up fantasies as though they had any validity at all. The idea that Donald Trump would openly denigrate mostly-black countries with a mostly-white country strikes me as totally unlikely, not to mention the idea that he would call them “shithole countries” in front of a room full of members of Cong–

[A bespectacled man in a dark suit and tie enters and taps Patterico on the shoulder.]

Excuse me one moment.

[The man in the suit hands Patterico a note. Patterico reads it.]

Um, according to this note, this isn’t actually a story from Michael Wolff’s book. It just happened today:

President Trump on Thursday balked at an immigration deal that would include protections for people from Haiti and some nations in Africa, demanding to know at a White House meeting why he should accept immigrants from “shithole countries” rather than people from places like Norway, according to people with direct knowledge of the conversation.

Mr. Trump’s remarks, the latest example of his penchant for racially tinged remarks denigrating immigrants, left members of Congress from both parties attending the meeting in the Cabinet Room alarmed and mystified. He made them during a discussion of an emerging bipartisan deal to give legal status to immigrants illegally brought to the United States as children, the people said, speaking on the condition of anonymity to discuss the meeting.

That’s OK. #FAKENEWS!!1! amirite? How can you believe a story based on anonymous sources. Any second now, Trump will come out and deny — wait, what’s this?

In a written statement, Raj Shah, the White House deputy press secretary, did not deny the account of the meeting on Thursday or directly address Mr. Trump’s comments.

Oh.

Commence discussion about how these countries are, in fact, shithole countries, and for bonus points praise Trump for having the balls to say so. Just keep one thing in mind:

Representative Mia Love, a Republican of Utah who is of Haitian descent, demanded an apology from the president, saying his comments were “unkind, divisive, elitist, and fly in the face of our nation’s values.”

“This behavior is unacceptable from the leader of our nation,” Ms. Love went on in an emotional statement that noted her heritage and that her parents “never took a thing” from the government while achieving the American dream. “The president must apologize to both the American people and the nations he so wantonly maligned.”

Obviously, Mia Love is the cuckiest cuck that ever cucked.

I think I may avoid reading the comments to this post entirely. Have a nice night!

UPDATE:

I prefer “stupid” to “offensive” but the gist is right.

[Cross-posted at The Jury Talks Back.]

221 Responses to “President Donald J. Trump on “Shithole Countries””

  1. There’s a shithole at the White House and it’s overflowing with racism.

    TR (167a32)

  2. Ding.

    Patterico (115b1f)

  3. And bye.

    Patterico (115b1f)

  4. One last thing, though: I get to say “shithole.”

    You must say “sh!thole” or risk being put in moderation automatically, by a filter, and waiting until I fish your comment out.

    In that way, I’m special. Just like Donald Trump!

    Patterico (115b1f)

  5. Mia can pookie my cookie

    happyfeet (28a91b)

  6. But the treehouse is crazy because it mentions names places dates, as vicki iseman the value of any of these papers.

    narciso (d1f714)

  7. Norway? Norway! Doesn’t he know that Minnesota was settled mostly by Norwegians? Is that what he wants to turn all of America into? Minnesota?

    nk (dbc370)

  8. Were the countries he was talking about sh!tholes or not. If they were what’s the point? You mean people don’t believe some countries like Somalia aren’t sh!tholes compared to Norway? How is it racist to observe the facts?

    Rev.Hoagie (6bbda7)

  9. Although nk is right. Minnesota ain’t exactly heaven.

    Rev.Hoagie (6bbda7)

  10. Don’t care.

    If anyone would prefer to live in Haiti, go right ahead.

    Back to topics that matter.

    NJRob (ea8965)

  11. It’s not racist Mr. Reverend failmerica is just very snowflakey anymore

    Look at literacy rates in these countries and similar indicia

    And look at the nasty hepatitis diseases they bring

    happyfeet (28a91b)

  12. PURELL is your friend

    happyfeet (28a91b)

  13. Well you’ve seen Fargo, both the movie and the series, what do you think?

    narciso (d1f714)

  14. Yeah, too much of the Jante mindset which discourages displays of wealth and facilitates high taxation for communitarian purposes.

    urbanleftbehind (1d0126)

  15. Ann Coulter with the best response so far:

    He’s trying to win me back”.

    harkin (8256c3)

  16. UPDATE:

    I prefer “stupid” to “offensive” but the gist is right.

    Patterico (115b1f)

  17. He has tricked the CBC and OTM/OTLA into opposing a compromise-y, solely DACAn focused bill.

    urbanleftbehind (1d0126)

  18. They want to run with the issue, their methane exhalations has blinded them, they never intended to come to a deal.

    narciso (d1f714)

  19. BAD NEWS for the makers of genitalia-shaped headwear regarding the upcoming Gals’ Marches:

    They are offensive to women who don’t actually have vag*nas. [wasnt sure on that word]

    Really.

    https://hotair.com/archives/2018/01/11/feminists-ditch-pussy-hats-theyre-offensive-trans-people-something/

    harkin (8256c3)

  20. the vapid virtue signalling pom pom squad needs to pace themselves it’s gonna be the longest mlk weekend ever

    happyfeet (28a91b)

  21. That’s all they got, but some folks should know better.

    narciso (d1f714)

  22. 100 Haitians with AIDS would be less poisonous to America than Ann Coulter. But not more than 100. She’s not that significant.

    nk (dbc370)

  23. Is Coulter a Norwegian name?

    nk (dbc370)

  24. drudge is hilarious

    happyfeet (28a91b)


  25. 10.Don’t care.

    If anyone would prefer to live in Haiti, go right ahead.

    Back to topics that matter.
    NJRob (


    You called it, NJRob. Trump’s got them chasing that laser pointer again going into the weekend. Who gives a rat’s hairy a$$ if he called some sh!thile countries what we all know they are? But it keeps the Virtue Posse™ occupied making new brown S-hole hats to wear at the next rally.

    But I love Jerry Dunleavy:

    Things that matter in an immigrant:
    — A love for America
    — A desire to assimilate
    — A loyalty to the Constitution
    — A respect for the rule of law
    — A willingness to work hard

    Things that don’t matter:
    — If they’re from a “shithole” country

    Basic civics. This isn’t hard.

    He’s right except that I would imagine those five traits are more apt to be found in a first world country than a third.

    Rev.Hoagie (6bbda7)

  26. Which one of those things does tom Perez the tourettes afflicted rnc chair believes in, or lets be ecumenical Howard yeargh dean or lurch who live heard fought in Vietnam, of course then you have red squaw, a woman who has culturally appropriating natives Americans for 40 years

    narciso (d1f714)

  27. Thing is, the Kushners cannot sell all that many green cards, at $500,000 to $1,000,000 a pop, to people from sh!thole countries. Too small a market. Few people can afford them, and the ones who can don’t want them because they already live very good lives there. China and Europe — that’s where the millionaires who want to get out are.

    nk (dbc370)

  28. Across the nation, millions of Trumpkin idiots are now confused about whether they are supposed to love or hate Norway.

    “It’s not a sh*thole, apparently – Daddy said so – but maybe it’s a socialist hellhole? I dunno man, f*ck it…”

    Leviticus (b94909)

  29. “Kirsten Gillibrand
    @SenGillibrand
    U.S. attorneys should work for the people they serve and be independent from the executive branch—that is a cornerstone of our democracy.”

    —-
    “t
    @maxcon11
    Replying to @SenGillibrand
    Kirsten,dear…..US attorneys are part of the executive branch……so, POTUS is their boss……US Constitution, like a boss!!”

    harkin (8256c3)

  30. Patrick,

    As a proud son of that sh1th0le Ireland, I could not agree more with you here. I try, how I try to get my mind right and love Big Brother support Trump, and then BLAMMO. He yanks the rug out one more time.

    Kevin M (752a26)

  31. “Let’s just make some vague reference to laser pointers to try to distract from our inability to maintain coherence.”

    Leviticus (b94909)

  32. Par for the course; a Trump Doral Port-au-Prince would be an 18-holer.

    DCSCA (797bc0)

  33. norway has many sophisticated potato recipes (they are a people what are fearless of carbs)

    happyfeet (28a91b)

  34. i love fjords

    happyfeet (28a91b)

  35. Trump [rumored to] Ask Why We Give Immigration Priority to “Sh*thole Countries”: Democrats lose their sh*t.

    papertiger (c8116c)

  36. Who cares that Mia Love finds this offensive? What makes her opinion special? And why is her statement something we should “keep in mind” if we’re inclined to think that Trump is right? Did she prove that he’s wrong? Did she discover surprising facts about those countries that show they’re not such bad places to live?

    Alan (751d4e)

  37. So did slartibifast, this doesnt pass the smell teat.

    narciso (d1f714)

  38. “Let’s just make some vague reference to laser pointers to try to distract from our inability to maintain coherence.”

    They’ve learned not to use laser pointers around Trump. His attention wanders.

    Kevin M (752a26)

  39. To those who find Trump’s comments offensive: how much would you have to be paid to spend ten years of your life in one of these countries? And does your answer to that question say something about whether those countries are indeed s***holes?

    Alan (751d4e)

  40. Oops, forgot to edit out the naughty word

    Repeat, with edit….
    First, for context, the rest of Raj Shah’s statement (copied from CNN’s version, the NYT won’t let me copy for some reason)

    Reached for comment about the article, White House spokesperson Raj Shah did not deny the “********” remark, but instead said in a statement that Trump “is fighting for permanent solutions that make our country stronger by welcoming those who can contribute to our society, grow our economy and assimilate into our great nation.

    I’ve worked with many Haitians over the years, and waited on many as customers–I am after all from SoFla–and almost all of them are hard workers who want nothing better than to contribute to our society, etc. Trump ought ask more of them to come here, if he wants that kind of immigrant.

    Kishnevi (2a9a02)

  41. Quiz:

    Most people come to America because:

    A: They are living in the lap of luxury in the old country, and want a change.
    B: The old country is a shith0le.

    Kevin M (752a26)

  42. Haiti and El Salvador are in fact sh!tholes. Trump only verbalized what we all already know.

    Bugg (08921e)

  43. I dont think think the post or the times will fetch that much

    https://mobile.twitter.com/zerohedge/status/951568670840549377

    Agreed, but there is this ritual habit of bad leadershsip, how mad when the president was machetes on the presidential palace steps in 1915,

    narciso (d1f714)

  44. I’ve worked with many Haitians over the years, and waited on many as customers–I am after all from SoFla–and almost all of them are hard workers who want nothing better than to contribute to our society, etc. Trump ought ask more of them to come here, if he wants that kind of immigrant.

    Stop saying things that make sense. This comments section is no place for that.

    Patterico (115b1f)

  45. he probably shoulda said poopholes to be more polite

    happyfeet (28a91b)

  46. Oops. Needed a better leet.

    To those who find Trump’s comments offensive: how much would you have to be paid to spend ten years of your life in one of these countries? And does your answer to that question say something about whether those countries are indeed s***holes?

    Perhaps this is too subtle for you, but Trump’s assertion was that the PEOPLE from sh1th0les were no people we wanted (i.e. there is something wrong with THEM because they flee a sh1th0le country). And his examples were all places with black people, vs good places with white people.

    To treat this as anything other than it is (utterly racist stupidity) is to betray your own utterly racist stupidity.

    [Italics added by Patterico to make clear that Kevin M is quoting that paragraph.]

    Kevin M (752a26)

  47. Patterico (115b1f)

  48. I keep hearing the predictable low-hanging fruit stuff about Haiti – I wanna hear more about Norway! Talk it up, conservatives! I’ve heard it’s great!

    Leviticus (b94909)

  49. I’ve worked with many Haitians over the years, and waited on many as customers–I am after all from SoFla–and almost all of them are hard workers who want nothing better than to contribute to our society, etc. Trump ought ask more of them to come here, if he wants that kind of immigrant.

    Replace Haitian with Mexican and SoFlo with SoCal and I would say the same.

    Kevin M (752a26)

  50. http://patterico.com/2016/08/13/election-free-summer-vacation-post/

    Tell me where you went for summer vacation and what you did. And if you didn’t go anywhere, tell me where you to hope to go. Some day.

    –Dana
    … in the comment section.


    We Went To Haiti!

    answered no-one.

    papertiger (c8116c)

  51. As a Minnesotan descended from pitifully poor Norwegian immigrants, I felt it worth pointing out that if he thought about it further he would have realized that 21st century Norwegians would arrive in America and promptly begin voting for gender and class equality, increased welfare, free education, free health care, gun control, and polite politicians untainted with whiffs of corruption.

    Which probably leaves the qualities Trump looked at being Norwegians’ wealth and race.

    Anondson (42b899)

  52. To those who find Trump’s comments offensive: how much would you have to be paid to spend ten years of your life in one of these countries? And does your answer to that question say something about whether those countries are indeed s***holes?

    Perhaps this is too subtle for you, but Trump’s assertion was that the PEOPLE from sh1th0les were no people we wanted (i.e. there is something wrong with THEM because they flee a sh1th0le country). And his examples were all places with black people, vs good places with white people.

    To treat this as anything other than it is (utterly racist stupidity) is to betray your own utterly racist stupidity.

    This comment confused me at first, because the second and third paragraphs (which I totally agree with) seemed to contradict the first paragraph.

    Then I realized that Kevin M was quoting someone else in the first paragraph.

    Patterico (115b1f)

  53. EVER!

    papertiger (c8116c)

  54. Well, to be fair, he is a moron.

    Leviticus (b94909)

  55. #48, that first line was a quote.

    Kevin M (752a26)

  56. Trump, that is. Obviously.

    Leviticus (b94909)

  57. Replace Haitian with Mexican and SoFlo with SoCal and I would say the same.

    Or folks from El Salvador or Guatemala. The key is that we are talking about legal immigration. The fact that many of us object to illegal immigration does not mean that we consider immigrants from Mexico to be substandard.

    Or at least that’s how I feel. I can’t say I necessarily feel the same about all others who object to illegal immigration.

    Patterico (115b1f)

  58. Thank you, Pat, for realizing I would not write that first line.

    Kevin M (752a26)

  59. norway has poley bears what will eat you face (their fur is hollow for so they can stay more warmer but sometimes in zoos algaes get all up in it and their fur looks green) (green poley bears will still eat you face tho)

    Norway!

    happyfeet (28a91b)

  60. #48, that first line was a quote.

    Yeah, I know, I just said that! Took me a second to figure it out.

    Patterico (115b1f)

  61. Well, to be fair, he is a moron.

    There is that.

    Patterico (115b1f)

  62. Well, there’s no question about stupidity on my part, since I did indeed completely miss the point, by focusing only on the “s***hole countries” part and missing the fact that Trump was equating those countries with the immigrants from them. That does show profound stupidity on my part. But not racism. Those countries are s***holes.

    Alan (751d4e)

  63. Thank you, Pat, for realizing I would not write that first line.

    Yeah, I kept reading it saying to myself, I know what he’s saying in those final paragraphs and he’s totally right, but what is going on with that first par– wait a second, let me control-f for that same language elsewhere in the comment section.

    Thank you for being sane and sensible.

    Patterico (115b1f)

  64. Yes, my main problem with illegal immigration is that it is illegal, not that the people who show up are not hard-working, etc.

    And part of that is because the family-chain migration rules bring in dependents and [try to] keep out workers. It is a bit sad that many of the people who come in legally are NOT who you would choose, and many of the people who came here illegally are (except for that one thing) ones you would.

    Kevin M (752a26)

  65. norway has poley bears what will eat you face (their fur is hollow for so they can stay more warmer but sometimes in zoos algaes get all up in it and their fur looks green) (green poley bears will still eat you face tho)

    Norway!

    It has white people and in the end isn’t that what’s truly important (to Trump)?

    Patterico (115b1f)

  66. We aren’t speaking of skilled and unskilled labor, its not like you dont have that problem in california, right that’s why they vote that fool betamax brown into the next century a nice fellow like kashkari, he didnt have a chance and of course there’s meg whitman

    narciso (d1f714)

  67. I’m going to add the italics to the first large paragraph of your comment, Kevin M, since I see from the version in moderation you were trying to do that.

    Patterico (115b1f)

  68. The bigger story to me, by far, is yet another example of hoe DJT is not to be allowed to function as a normal president with typical and necessary deference.

    This was a work session and not for public attribution. How can we possibly expect anyone to ever speak difficult truths in such sessions if their words are to become public?

    As far as I am concerned, this story is about the further attempts to delegitimize the true leader of our republic. He may be a buffoon. But, he is also the president.

    Ed from SFV (3400a5)

  69. it has some white people but guess what else?

    cloudberries!

    have any of you guys ever had?

    I would dearly love to taste cloudberries someday

    happyfeet said wistfully

    happyfeet (28a91b)

  70. But lets just assume Tim cotton is a cracker even though he has a Harvard law degree and fought in Afghanistan.

    narciso (d1f714)

  71. I’m beginning to realize that if there’s a pony here, it’s a very small pony.

    Kevin M (752a26)

  72. Ed from SFV,

    He said this in front of at least one Democrat Senator. I respect you greatly but I think you’re out to lunch if you think he can say stuff like that in front of the opposition and expect that they won’t repeat it.

    Patterico (115b1f)

  73. “He may be a buffoon. But he is also the President.”

    Words no self-respecting people should ever have to utter with a modicum of seriousness.

    Leviticus (b94909)

  74. I wanna hear more from Hoagie and papertiger about the awesomeness that is Norway.

    Leviticus (b94909)

  75. Right the same people who swore tea parties had spit at democrats.

    narciso (d1f714)

  76. 47

    Perhaps this is too subtle for you, but Trump’s assertion was that the PEOPLE from sh1th0les were no people we wanted (i.e. there is something wrong with THEM because they flee a sh1th0le country). And his examples were all places with black people, vs good places with white people.

    The assumption here is a country’s desirability has nothing to do with the people living there so some countries just have better weather or something. But in fact however lousy countries tend to lousy because they are full of lousy people.

    James B. Shearer (951d11)

  77. I think the northernmost settlement in the whirl is in norway (svalbard?)

    happyfeet (28a91b)

  78. Did you forget the jackals who was running the country for the last eight years, whole cities would catch when spoke loose words,

    narciso (d1f714)

  79. Because Obama never meant qwll in any of his statements, he just hard an army of street sweepers cleaning after him. It may take a generation to recover from what he wrought, if we have that long.

    narciso (d1f714)

  80. Hey. narciso. You’re supposed to be defending Norway, bro.

    Leviticus (b94909)

  81. Or you could defend whatever rarified land James B. Shearer’s people originate from.

    Leviticus (b94909)

  82. They can defend their own, they do have this odd displaced affection for Arabs and hatred of the Jews. As in Sweden where a popular series their version of 24, is about which pending threat guess?

    narciso (d1f714)

  83. Haitian immigration?

    Leviticus (b94909)

  84. Noneonazis sits really more like law and order

    narciso (d1f714)

  85. “Countries are lousy because they are full of lousy people of bad character” is the same kind of puerile nonsense that causes people to think the problem with politics is the people in Congress or the Oval Office, rather than the system that produces substantially the same result no matter who is there.

    It’s the system, every time.

    The system.

    Patterico (115b1f)

  86. That favoring of Arab>Jew is on the wane, but there does seem to still be a Arab > Subsaharan Africa view, particularly in the Mediterranean nations. It could harken back to Carthage or more the deadlier payback a lighter skinned Muslim could deal out.

    urbanleftbehind (1d0126)

  87. Btw we never got back to the report on Niger. That showed what a brave soldier sgt Johnson was fighting the enemy but our suppossed French allies, I was reminded by this:

    https://mobile.twitter.com/MENASTREAM?p=s

    narciso (d1f714)

  88. the norwegian rat is NOT actually native to norway this is a misnomer scientists believe it actually originated in Haiti but migrated cause it wanted out of that poophole

    happyfeet (28a91b)

  89. Well I meant among the political class, the people are a little more sensible, so the only explanation is the russian influence, the latest but is they are supposed swinging the election to their Bernie sanders (doc brown) lopez obrador

    narciso (d1f714)

  90. Happy, I would have guessed Rico due to their prevalence in Humboldt Park. In my younger days I made sure to always walk on the concrete..the grass parkways would be crawling withvthem.

    urbanleftbehind (1d0126)

  91. Pat – the breakdown in basic comity is a core piece of the rot which is destroying us. You don’t think most all presidents got “earthy” in work sessions with all manner of congress critters through the years? It was just understood that some settings were to never be “gotcha” opportunities.

    I do agree it would have been darn foolish of DJT to expect that type of privacy. Obama sure enjoyed such, though.

    Besides the damage done to our polity, this was just another dog bites man story. We didn’t know DJT had a bias for the rich over the poor? Really? This is somehow revelatory?

    Ed from SFV (3400a5)

  92. I been seeing less but i think the approach where they gas them with co2 has been a game changer

    happyfeet (28a91b)

  93. 87

    “Countries are lousy because they are full of lousy people of bad character” is the same kind of puerile nonsense that causes people to think the problem with politics is the people in Congress or the Oval Office, rather than the system that produces substantially the same result no matter who is there.

    Improving quotes now I see. If the Trump administration did this I suspect you would not approve.

    I said nothing about what makes people lousy. Some are just stupid which is not a character flaw. Nevertheless you don’t want too many stupid people around.

    And a lot of people from lousy countries do have bad character at least from our point of view. It would be surprising otherwise. If you grow up in a country where no one respects the law why would you respect the law?

    It’s the system, every time.

    So you think the US has a lousy system?

    James B. Shearer (951d11)

  94. Well they lavished practical adoration in bill Clinton and Obama for 16 years. So you figure it out.

    narciso (d1f714)

  95. Trump couldn’t be satisfied that he was already in the sewer – he had to find a way to go even lower.

    Tillman (a95660)

  96. So you think the US has a lousy system?

    Yup. It’s fundamentally flawed.

    Improving quotes now I see.

    I’m not saying you literally said that. The quotes signify a characterization of your claim. It would be different if I said: “James B. Shearer said: ‘quoted material that he did not actually say.'” If there was any confusion about this I hope this comment clears it up. It would be like saying “Fat dumb and happy” is no way to go through life. The phrase is a characterization of a certain mindset or state of being and is consequently set off by quotes.

    Patterico (115b1f)

  97. Pat – the breakdown in basic comity is a core piece of the rot which is destroying us. You don’t think most all presidents got “earthy” in work sessions with all manner of congress critters through the years? It was just understood that some settings were to never be “gotcha” opportunities.

    I do agree it would have been darn foolish of DJT to expect that type of privacy. Obama sure enjoyed such, though.

    I almost never comment but that’s bunk – prove it.
    Obama had the temerity to say a cop did a “stupid thing” by arresting an older black man in his own house.
    And you all tore him apart for it and screamed bloody murder.
    Justifying this is pathetic.
    The point is that you just don’t say that around people you don’t know.
    It’s wrong in the first place, and yes there are sh!tholes in the world.
    But the POTUS blythly saying it to congress people and others is beyond stupid, and careless.
    This kind of sh!t makes us less safe.
    It can encourage hopeless people to act out, either here or abroad, it reduces our moral authority, it undermines the work to end extremism, and it’s embarrassing.
    And you excuse it.
    This isn’t a high horse I’m on, I’m looking at it purely as a plus/minus in terms of keeps us safe here and abroad.
    This makes it harder. Again.

    Thomas M (d5f11d)

  98. Pat – the breakdown in basic comity is a core piece of the rot which is destroying us. You don’t think most all presidents got “earthy” in work sessions with all manner of congress critters through the years? It was just understood that some settings were to never be “gotcha” opportunities.

    I do agree it would have been darn foolish of DJT to expect that type of privacy. Obama sure enjoyed such, though.

    I almost never comment but that’s bunk – prove it.
    Obama had the temerity to say a cop did a “stupid thing” by arresting an older black man in his own house.
    And you all tore him apart for it and screamed bloody murder.
    Justifying this is pathetic.
    The point is that you just don’t say that around people you don’t know.
    It’s wrong in the first place, and yes there are sh!tholes in the world.
    But the POTUS blythly saying it to congress people and others is beyond stupid, and careless.
    This kind of sh!t makes us less safe.
    It can encourage hopeless people to act out, either here or abroad, it reduces our moral authority, it undermines the work to end extremism, and it’s embarrassing.
    And you excuse it.
    This isn’t a high horse I’m on, I’m looking at it purely as a plus/minus in terms of what keeps us safe here and abroad.
    This makes it harder. Again.

    Thomas M (d5f11d)

  99. A system that lets Anthony pellicano back on the streets where along with that ex mossad shop black cube he wee working weinatein, a system that let whitey bulger get away with how much for 35 years give or take.

    narciso (d1f714)

  100. Saying Somalia is a Sh!thole has zero effect on our safety. Saying Norway is nice has zero effect on our safety. Where do you come up with our safety hinging on anybody’s description of another country? That’s something only a leftist tool could dream up.

    Rev.Hoagie (6bbda7)

  101. Why did Mia Love’s family leave Haiti? Is anyone seriously arguing that Trump is mistaken in his assessment of Haiti, among other countries? Or are we simply complaining that he had the indecency to say publicly what everyone knows to be true?

    Mike P. (dddb3b)

  102. We are complaining that he is a buffoon and not a President to be proud of.

    nk (dbc370)

  103. Yes, I know: Hillary!

    nk (dbc370)

  104. If I were to make one simple change that would drastically alter the way things work, I would have 2 or 3 representatives elected from a single district, with each voter getting ONE vote. This would:

    1) make gerrymanders useless
    2) allow the minority a voice
    3) allow groups/communities/factions/movements to band together and promote a candidate.
    4) tend to elect a balance of opinion.

    Kevin M (752a26)

  105. Is anyone seriously arguing that Trump is mistaken in his assessment of Haiti, among other countries?

    And, again, you are sliding RIGHT PAST Trump’s intended slur that PEOPLE from Haiti are sh1tty people.

    Kevin M (752a26)

  106. “I wanna hear more from Hoagie and papertiger about the awesomeness that is Norway.”

    Okay. Turn your speakers up to 11 (for the full effect).

    More about the awesomeness that is Norway. [YouTube]

    papertiger (c8116c)

  107. A little more about the awesomeness that is Norway. [YouTube]

    papertiger (c8116c)

  108. First its its a bogus statement, designed to camouflage a real discussion of low wage low skilled labor, that’s what the raise bill addresses.

    narciso (d1f714)

  109. @99

    You make a good point with the “But Obama” takes on this. A similar example also happened recently:
    Trump mentioned a delivery of F-52s to Norway (a model of plane that doesn’t exist). There’s a certain amount of mocking going on, but it was obviously overshadowed by the “sh*thole” comment. In any event, it’s likely that he got the numbers crossed, we actually delivered 52 F-35s to Norway, rather than an actual belief that we have such a plane. I honestly expect that you’ll stop hearing about Trump F-52s pretty quickly.

    During Obama’s campaign in 2008, he mentioned that he’d visited 57 states. Again, this was probably a mixup, as he’d visited 47 at this point. However it was quickly jumped on by the right as proof that he was a secret muslim (57 islamic states), or that he was an idiot who didn’t know how many states there actually were.

    It’s been 9 years now, and a poster on these forums brought this up within the last week.

    Davethulhu (99cc74)

  110. And one more about the awesomeness that is Norway. [YouTube]

    papertiger (c8116c)

  111. Less than two weeks after Mexico recorded its deadliest year on record, the Interior Minister of Mexico has decided to call it quits amid the out of control violence and soaring homicides.”

    https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2018-01-11/mexican-interior-minister-resigns-amid-soaring-murders-us-warns-do-not-travel

    Sounds like a real sh**hole.

    Guess the answer is uncontrolled immigration.

    harkin (8256c3)

  112. Naw. I’m not done yet. Awesomeness of Norway. [YouTube]

    TOP 10 MUST-SEE PLACES IN NORWAY – A Photographer’s Guide [YouTube]

    I might be just that Norway has a better press agent.

    papertiger (c8116c)

  113. And the univision VP was shot by his own bodyguards. They shoot lefty students 47 at one instance and either bury or dissapear them, and authorities did their perfunctory reviews,

    narciso (d1f714)

  114. It’s just too bad this meeting wasn’t televised, too. You know, to prove he’s not crazy.

    DCSCA (797bc0)

  115. F 35 is a carpy plane with a lousy ceramic engine, no matter how cool it looked in live free or die hard. F 22 is a better vehicle so of course its production run was curtailed

    narciso (d1f714)

  116. This was a work session and not for public attribution. How can we possibly expect anyone to ever speak difficult truths in such sessions if their words are to become public?

    Nixon lost that argument.

    DCSCA (797bc0)

  117. And, again, you are sliding RIGHT PAST Trump’s intended slur that PEOPLE from Haiti are sh1tty people.

    Is an IQ test for admission now okay? I have no problem with taking smart people from whatever country. But I thought an IQ test for admission was racist, or something.

    Mike P. (dddb3b)

  118. Haiti’s US Ambassador Paul Altidor tells me Haiti’s government has formally summoned a US official to explain Trump’s comments to Haiti’s officials. “Haitians fought along US soldiers in the revolutionary war and we continue to be great contributors to American society,” he said https://twitter.com/yamiche/status/951629375224668160

    Man. THis is getting good.

    papertiger (c8116c)

  119. 98

    “So you think the US has a lousy system?”

    Yup. It’s fundamentally flawed.

    Yet the US seems to be doing pretty well. Better than Haiti anyway. So perhaps good people can make a lousy system work. And perhaps bad people can foul up a good system.

    James B. Shearer (951d11)

  120. A list of some regions where life expectancy is 75 years…

    El Salvador
    Mississippi
    West Virginia
    Louisiana
    Alabama

    Jay (1ca3ae)

  121. What makes me laugh is that anyone is shocked that Trump would say something like this. It’s who he is. Somebody should do a top ten list thing, “Ten Things You Never Expected a President to Say.”

    Allen (33101f)

  122. The assumption here is a country’s desirability has nothing to do with the people living there so some countries just have better weather or something. But in fact however lousy countries tend to lousy because they are full of lousy people.

    It’s the weirdest thing – if you ship a large fraction of a country’s people across the ocean as slaves, work them to death for centuries, destroy their families on the auction block, deny them basic human rights, literacy, healthcare, etc, and then abandon the place after you’ve squeezed every last bit of wealth you can out of the people and the land, you end up with a country … that doesn’t look much like Norway.

    Dave (445e97)

  123. Is an IQ test for admission now okay?

    I’d suggest an IQ test for eligibility to run for president first.

    Dave (445e97)

  124. Trying to imagine the most racist thing Trump could say that would not be instantly supported by a large group of Internet commenters.

    Trump himself did a similar mental exercise some time ago:

    “I could stand in the middle of 5th Avenue and shoot somebody and I wouldn’t lose voters.”
    – Donald Trump

    Subsequent events have provided no reason to question this boast about his supporters’ immorality.

    Dave (445e97)


  125. It’s the weirdest thing – if you ship a large fraction of a country’s people across the ocean as slaves, work them to death for centuries, destroy their families on the auction block, deny them basic human rights, literacy, healthcare, etc, and then abandon the place after you’ve squeezed every last bit of wealth you can out of the people and the land, you end up with a country … that doesn’t look much like Norway.

    You have a point there cause it’s the weirdest thing how the entire continent the Haitian’s came from is a beautiful Norwayesque Utopia of health, cleanliness and prosperity.

    Rev.Hoagie (6bbda7)

  126. it’s the next morning and there’s still no proof he actually said this

    this is starting to smell like CNN Jake Tapper fake news

    happyfeet (28a91b)

  127. I can understand how bringing in Haitians:
    http://admin.americanthinker.com/images/bucket/2018-01/203497_5_.jpg
    can be beneficial to America since we’ve had so much luck in places like Minneapolis’ Little Mogadishu with Somali folks. As we can see they are readily assimilating.
    http://admin.americanthinker.com/images/bucket/2018-01/203495_5_.jpg

    Rev.Hoagie (6bbda7)

  128. You have a point there cause it’s the weirdest thing how the entire continent the Haitian’s came from is a beautiful Norwayesque Utopia of health, cleanliness and prosperity.

    You can’t be that ignorant of history…

    Dave (445e97)

  129. Seriously though.
    Who wouldn’t want to see the real Tortuga?
    Walk in the steps of the Pirates of the Caribbean?
    Hang their coat in Davey Jones’ locker?

    papertiger (c8116c)

  130. Is it the system or is it human nature, Patterico?

    I think human nature is the problem, and our system of checks and balances tries to protect us from human nature. Humans keep trying to find ways around the system and they often succeed, especially when politicians and the public decides character doesn’t matter.

    DRJ (15874d)

  131. @45 You know it is a shame that the blogger feels the need to disparage his commenters. I have to say that lately I learn more from the comments than Patterico’s predictable posts. I feel like a bit of a masochist coming here since I am a ‘hold my nose’ Trump supporter and I just know Patterico will be raving about Trump’s latest bon mot. But the commenters, most of them, are like the old book series Point/Counterpoint for me. I like to try to see the other side. So just because we may not agree with each other, that doesn’t mean the opposing view ‘doesn’t make sense’!

    peggy (b0a672)

  132. Newsflash: the American people elected a bigoted vulgarian as President.

    Film at 11.

    Bored Lawyer (998177)

  133. Let’s entertain for a moment the notion that the real Donald Trump never said any such thing.

    What downside do the “sh*tholers” at CNN risk by lying and claiming he did?

    papertiger (c8116c)

  134. Relax Dave. Everybody knows you’re a paragon of intellect and virtue. Don’t get the vapors because I’m not being absolutely exact with the way you want history. And I’m sure that with your great knowledge of history you realize both Haiti and Africa are……..
    http://patriotretort.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/01/SHITHOLE-PEARL-CLUTCHERS.jpg

    Rev.Hoagie (6bbda7)

  135. What the sh!thead in the White House, and the junior sh!theads supporting him here, are missing is that ALL the people who want to make America their home, whether Haitians or Norwegians, do it because they think their countries are sh!tholes COMPARED to America. If they did not think that, they’d stay THERE.

    Trump’s grandparents, all four of them, thought Germany and Scotland were sh!tholes. His first wife thought Czechoslovakia was a sh!thole. Melania thought Slovenia was a sh!thole. Jared and Ivanka and their kids are eligible for Israeli citizenship. Do you see them living in Israel. NO. Because Israel, COMPARED to America, is a sh!thole.

    Personally, I think the difference between Norway and Haiti is that one is a sh!thole where you can freeze to death before you know it, and the other is a sh!thole where some witch doctor can turn you into a zombie. That’s why

    I like to be in America!
    O.K. by me in America!
    Ev’rything free in America
    For a small fee in America!

    Automobile in America,
    Chromium steel in America,
    Wire-spoke wheel in America,
    Very big deal in America!

    Immigrant goes to America,
    Many hellos in America;
    Nobody knows in America
    Puerto Rico is in America!

    I like the shores of America!
    Comfort is yours in America!
    Knobs on the doors in America,
    Wall-to-wall floors in America!

    nk (dbc370)

  136. BTW, Dave. I still have family living in South Africa. Do you?

    Rev.Hoagie (6bbda7)

  137. We may see new legal claims and/or court decisions in the immigration ban cases because of this comment.

    DRJ (15874d)


  138. 137.What the sh!thead in the White House, and the junior sh!theads supporting him here, are missing is that ALL the people who want to make America their home, whether Haitians or Norwegians, do it because they think their countries are sh!tholes COMPARED to America. If they did not think that, they’d stay THERE.


    No they don’t and who the pluck are you to speak for everybody coming from every country and saying why they did? My wife is from Seoul and it ain’t no sh!thle. She came here for business opportunities not to escape a sh!tholes. You don’t have a right to speak for others nk, not even Trump or Melania.

    Rev.Hoagie (6bbda7)

  139. “Bet you a dollar I can get Jim Acosta to say “sh*thole” on the air ten times before the day is over.” – to Kelly Ann Conway.

    _- something like I would do for sh*ts and giggles if I were President.

    papertiger (c8116c)

  140. Korea is a sh!thole COMPARED to America.

    I get the same crap from Greeks, who tell me how wonderful Greece is. And when I ask them “Why are you here, then?”, they tell me “Because I could not make a living there”.

    nk (dbc370)

  141. It’s the weirdest thing – if you ship a large fraction of a country’s people across the ocean as slaves, work them to death for centuries, destroy their families on the auction block, deny them basic human rights, literacy, healthcare, etc, and then abandon the place after you’ve squeezed every last bit of wealth you can out of the people and the land, you end up with a country … that doesn’t look much like Norway.

    Haiti has been an independent country since 1804. It wasn’t “abandoned” by Europeans; there was a massacre of the remaining white people. So if Europeans stay, they are racist; if Europeans leave, they are racist. Okay…

    As for the long-term effects of slavery, the parts of Africa where most slaves came from -the western coast- are today the nicest parts of Africa.

    Mike P. (dddb3b)

  142. Read my lips: A-M-E-R-I-C-A I-S E-X-C-E-P-T-I-O-N-A-L!

    nk (dbc370)

  143. @ 139 Amen Reverand.

    What is this sense of entitlement that liberals feel they can speak for the whole world, rather than just the gratuitously insulting douche nozzle what they be?

    papertiger (c8116c)

  144. So dufuss Durwood who was the contact for the alexandria shooter (where did that story go) who cried crocodile tears for the 20th hijacker, Mohammed manea al quahtani was the source.

    narciso (21eb6d)

  145. I think the news snipers overloaded their pinheads calling the real Donald Trump a stable genius for a day. Hit a feedback loop and their internal dissonance caused them to invent the “sh*thole” quote out of thin air.

    papertiger (c8116c)

  146. Yes there was that incident in 1915, that precipitated our 19 year intervention there. Then their was their pidgin Marxist who was ousted in 1991, the subsequent exodus,was why gitmo became a detention facility, then 2004 guy Philippe another character necessitated an intsevention

    narciso (21eb6d)

  147. As usual they didn’t want to deal so they make up this garbage,

    narciso (21eb6d)

  148. And I’ll tell you something else. The people who come here “to escape sh!tholes” are the people I want to come here. Because they and their kids will become loyal Americans. The people who come here for “business opportunities” are the ones I want to keep out. Because their loyalties will be to their wallets first, and they’ll ditch America the first time some other country waves more Euros, or more Deutschmarks, or more yen at them.

    nk (dbc370)

  149. Which is why I also part company with the “no pathway to citizenship” crowd. “F’k you, and your permanent immigrants too, then. If they’re not going to become full-fledged Americans, why do we want them in the first place?”

    nk (dbc370)

  150. Woooo! Go nk!, go nk! (imagine a late 80s/ early 90s ghetto denizen doing the running man or some other ill begotten dance of the sort mocked on In Living Color).

    urbanleftbehind (5eecdb)

  151. Sounds like nk needs a bar of soap for his mouth, but also that he wants to import good little Nazi nationalists, at the expence of people with the old fashioned American value, profit motive.

    papertiger (c8116c)

  152. nk, aside from being an insulting idiot you are a fool. People who come here from sh!tholes make sh!tholes here. Or haven’t you noticed? How do you know whose kids will become loyal Americans? The people who come here for business do so to broaden their opportunities. They employ people, pay taxes, build businesses and homes and families that need zero government support. You want to bring in people who rather than improve their own sh!tholes want to come here for freebees and make America a sh!tholes too. Look at the ghettos in America and Europe and stop pretending it’s racist not to act like you’re blind. If you won’t recognize and admit to the problem you can’t fix it. That’s what democrats have been doing to blacks for decades.

    Rev.Hoagie (6bbda7)

  153. Yeah, Hoagie, the Jews who escaped the ghettos made sh!tholes, here. So did the Irish, the Greeks, the Italians, the Poles and all the other Slavs, the Chinese, the Koreans, and the Vietnamese, and the world’s richest man is not a Puerto Rican.

    nk (dbc370)

  154. Another thing about Norwegians, they came here to make a go of it. For the money baby.
    Visual Aid. [png]

    papertiger (c8116c)

  155. Rev Hoagie: lets say its autumn 1864, and you are a close advisor to Abraham Lincoln. Do you go full speed ahead on Reconstruction and the 13th-14th-15th amendments (the 14th/equal protection has had far more wider-ranging consequences beyond whatever the 13th and 15th have wrought) or do you push for a “5%” (a few states that are in effect black reservations) or a resettlement to Liberia/Carribean advocate?

    urbanleftbehind (5eecdb)

  156. “First, our cities will not be flooded with a million immigrants annually. Under the proposed bill, the present level of immigration remains substantially the same…

    Secondly, the ethnic mix of this country will not be upset… Contrary to the charges in some quarters, [the bill] will not inundate America with immigrants from any one country or area, or the most populated and deprived nations of Africa and Asia…

    In the final analysis, the ethnic pattern of immigration under the proposed measure is not expected to change as sharply as the critics seem to think… The bill will not flood our cities with immigrants. It will not upset the ethnic mix of our society. It will not relax the standards of admission. It will not cause American workers to lose their jobs.”Ted Kennedy on 1965 Immigration And Nationality Act

    Like nukes to despots and handouts to attack poverty, another example where liberals get it exactly backwards.

    Heck of a job, Libs!

    harkin (8256c3)

  157. OK, so what Hoagie is saying is he’s supportive of immigrants who come to the U.S. for “business opportunities.” Cool. That at least seems like a fairly workable standard, to me, even if I think it’s overly restrictive and crass.

    Of course, it also gives his seal of approval to the vast majority of immigrants from the countries he doesn’t like.

    Leviticus (efada1)

  158. Did he or didn’t he, are they or aren’t they are worthy questions that have now launched a viral news cycle guaranteed to continue no matter what the outcome of the underlying quest for a DACA deal in exchange for certain minimum essential border security and immigration reforms. The accusation that POTUS uses intemperate language behind closed doors or that politicians and/or their staffs who routinely also use intemperate language behind close doors would run to the press to expose and attack President potty-mouth because he didn’t sign on to their effort to land a deal before anyone else could says more about them than it does about President potty-mouth. We already know Trump has a potty-mouth and has condescending views towards the third world nations most guilty of abusing our immigration system. This episode confirms how untrustworthy this particular subset of the bipartisan group we saw on television earlier is.

    crazy (d99a88)

  159. No, Hoagie just likes some sh!tholes better than others. It happens with old people. They do get to the point where they have a favorite toilet. I see it in myself when I use the toilet at my daughter’s house. It’s just not the same as mine. And I’m six years younger than Hoagie.

    nk (dbc370)

  160. Well if you substitute Phillipines or Thailand(!) for South Korea, the nk-Hoagie beef could take on some other types of serious undertones…

    urbanleftbehind (5eecdb)

  161. Is it the system or is it human nature, Patterico?

    Good question. I would say that I’m talking about the way that humans, by their nature, respond to different systems. If we write it all off as simply human nature, we miss the point that different systems produce very different results, because humans, by their nature, respond to incentives — and different systems reward different behavior.

    No system is perfect, but the fundamental flaw of our system is that it allows us to achieve a phony prosperity by shifting the burdens onto our children. Most people will not do this on the family level, but society cannot resist doing it on a macro level. And human nature being what it is, with that option available, humans are going to take it. We have to do something about this or we face disaster.

    Patterico (fcc13e)

  162. That’s why character matters. Virtuous people don’t take advantage of others for personal gain.

    DRJ (15874d)

  163. The fundamental problem with our political system is that it intentionally restricts the responsiveness and representative capacity of the Legislative branches, leading to a sense of hopelessness and political nihilism. People can’t hold their legislators to account, and as such have no real expectations of them. It’s “But Hillary!” writ large.

    Leviticus (efada1)


  164. And I’m six years younger than Hoagie.

    Seven, mk. Last Sunday I turned 67.


    159.OK, so what Hoagie is saying is he’s supportive of immigrants who come to the U.S. for “business opportunities.” Cool. That at least seems like a fairly workable standard, to me, even if I think it’s overly restrictive and crass.

    Of course, it also gives his seal of approval to the vast majority of immigrants from the countries he doesn’t like.
    Leviticus

    I am supportive of immigrants coming to America from any country of any race Leviticus so don’t try and tell me who or what I’m for or paint me into some corner. You also know I work with the Asian community to help people from Korea, Japan, Vietnam, China and many other countries come and participate in this great country.

    I will not abide criminals, nor persons with disease, or the wholly uneducated or uneducable, nor communists, nor gang members, nor drug addicts, nor any other person who will not be a net advantage to our country. Regardless of their color, religion or sex. But we don’t have to take everybody and we have an obligation to both our Forefathers and our descendants to choose the best for our nation.

    Like anything else: Garbage in, garbage out.

    Rev.Hoagie (6bbda7)

  165. Five. I’ll be 62 in June, God willing.

    nk (dbc370)

  166. When it comes to Haitians in particular, I wonder if part of Trump’s feelings on the matter are related to the fact that the initial appearance of AIDS in NY was actually in the Haitian immigrant community, which was decimated *before* the gay community was.

    (Haitians who had volunteered in the UN peace keeping force in Congo brought it back to Haiti, and then to the US).

    aphrael (3f0569)

  167. i don’t think this is aids-related i think it has to do with correcting a bias what favors immigrants from squalid countries instead of nice ones

    happyfeet (28a91b)

  168. but the haitians should still wear condoms

    happyfeet (28a91b)

  169. but just when they’re making sexy

    happyfeet (28a91b)

  170. Why not make them go full Frank Drebin 24/7?

    urbanleftbehind (5eecdb)

  171. Let’s not pretend that plenty of shithole countries don’t exist, or that some people from those dangerous and poverty stricken cesspools are desperate to escape to safe, clean, orderly nations, preferably those with traditions of individual freedom, economic opportunity, and generous social welfare systems. Imbeded among those seeking a better life are also significant numbers of thugs and crooks looking for easy fat targets and grateful for lenient and easily manipulated legal sustems.

    North American and European nations, along with Australia and New Zeland are certainly attractive destinations. All fit the bill for the great foreign throngs yearning for safety, freedom, food stamps, dumb cops, even dumber judges, and swanky prisons that offer generous accommodations like running water, toilet facilities, soft beds with clean sheets and warm blankets, and 3 meals a day featuring vegan, kosher, and Middle Eastern choices.

    Taken together, two undeniable observations suggest themselves: most immigrants come from countries with predominantly colored populations, and they seek entry into countries with predominantly white populations.

    The racists among us get indignantly apoplectic when that set of facts surfaces, and rather than acknowledge an inconvenient (unPC) truth, the usual tantrum of name calling and finger pointing ends all useful discussion.

    So, President Donald Trump doesn’t think any more uneducated, unskilled, non-English speaking immigrants, good, bad, crooked, or free loading, attempting to enter the US from faltering countries with high crime (and communicable disease) rates, should continue to receive favored, or preferential, consideration especially when numbers of highly skilled, English speaking, technologically sophisticated, individuals that would help Make America Great Again are given short shrift.

    Trump is right: the US doesn’t need any more burdensome immigrants from shithole countries, no matter their skin color.

    ropelight (044648)

  172. In the Oval at the time, Tom Cotton [R, AR.] and David Purdue [R, GA] ‘do not recall’ Trump making the comments.

    So say Senators Sh!tholer & Sh!thead.

    DCSCA (797bc0)

  173. Patterico, (Re: comment in moderation)
    I misunderstood your conditions expressed clearly at #4. I got it backwards and thought it was required usage – dyslexia strikes deep.

    Please either alter the offending construction, or strike the entire comment. My apologies, thanks, and Best Wishes.

    ropelight (044648)

  174. Aw c’mon that joke was gold Mr Patterico

    JP (aa4555)

  175. I see it in myself when I use the toilet at my daughter’s house. It’s just not the same as mine.

    Wait, I thought your daughter was still in high school. Is my memory growing, has it been that long, or is this a different daughter.

    I’ll be completing my sixth decade (or my twelfth lustrum, if you prefer)in March, so I’m not that far behind you.

    kishnevi (bb03e6)

  176. Belated happy birthday, Hoagie.

    kishnevi (bb03e6)

  177. This isn’t a new threat to our republic:

    John Adams:

    “Because power corrupts, society’s demands for moral authority and character increase as the importance of the position increases.”

    Calvin Coolidge:

    “There is no surer road to destruction than prosperity without character.”

    The Price of Freedom p. 64, Adequate Brevity p. 19

    “Character is the only secure foundation of the state.”

    Speech at a New York City Lincoln Day Dinner on February 12, 1924.

    DRJ (15874d)

  178. “I could stand in the middle of 5th Avenue and shoot somebody and I wouldn’t lose voters.”
    – Donald Trump

    Yes, and back then I though I was so clever saying that “Trump could come out against FOOTBALL and his supporters would back him.”

    Little did I know…

    Kevin M (752a26)


  179. Taken together, two undeniable observations suggest themselves: most immigrants come from countries with predominantly colored populations, and they seek entry into countries with predominantly white populations.


    From my perspective, ropelight that makes absolutely no difference. What does is they person himself. I don’t care if a person is from Kenya or Italy as long as he is a net plus for America. That’s what I try to explain to my Asian friends when they show up with a border-jumper who sneaks in from Canada. We need folks who respect the law not circumvent it.

    Rev.Hoagie (6bbda7)

  180. Another way you could elect Representatives would be to have one big list of all candidates for, say, the CA State Senate. Everyone gets one vote, the top 40 are elected. Any affinity group that wanted to have a voice could line up behind someone and stand a good chance. Yes, parties could work up slates and they’d elect some few but any group (e.g. cigarette smokers, or libertarians, or inner-city parents) who felt they were not well represented by the major parties could have their choice of representation, too.

    Kevin M (752a26)

  181. Anything is better than knowing that your Congressperson is Maxine Waters, and will be until she drops.

    Kevin M (752a26)

  182. Patterico, the only way to stop the borrowing is to limit spending to a proven level of economic output. The history of CA budgets shows that a simple “balanced-budget” rule doesn’t work as 1) they lie and 2) they still borrow.

    One thing that might work: Tying this year’s spending to a hard number, like a percentage of the average of the previous 3 year’s GDP, and disallowing appropriations over that amount.

    But I guess they’d find a way to cheat there, too.

    Kevin M (752a26)

  183. i hate spending but if President Trump thinks we need more better infrastructure we better do what he says

    happyfeet (28a91b)

  184. Though most would rather see the Gap Band or Sheriff Clarke doing it, at least that Florida Freddy chick is appropriating an American classic.

    urbanleftbehind (5eecdb)

  185. Actually Kevin M the democrats have no shortage of idiots.

    http://patriotretort.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/10/The-Village-Idiots.jpg

    Rev.Hoagie (6bbda7)

  186. nobody even really believes President Trump actually said what slick dick durbin says he said

    happyfeet (28a91b)

  187. The Gap Band is from Tulsa

    and that’s not jake tapper fake news it’s the real truth

    happyfeet (28a91b)

  188. 190, my bad I forgot about JC Watts who actually had a working ranch.

    urbanleftbehind (1d0126)

  189. Real Donald Trump says he didn’t do it. Reliable neutrals present in the room, who are not fans of the President, say he didn’t do it.

    My take at 147, that Democrat operatives @ CNN suddenly realized they had spent the better part of the week calling the President a genius, invented a lie from wholecloth to deceive Patterico.

    The “s*******” lie was specifically tailored to catch the gleem in Pat’s eye.

    Retractions>? Measure of a reporter’s character.

    papertiger (c8116c)

  190. Yes, and back then I though I was so clever saying that “Trump could come out against FOOTBALL and his supporters would back him.”

    I’m smelling a little bit of mission creep. I thought the NFL players were taking a knee over gun happy police officers or something. Morphed into sticking it to whitey so slowly I didn’t notice.

    papertiger (c8116c)

  191. 124

    It’s the weirdest thing – if you ship a large fraction of a country’s people across the ocean as slaves, work them to death for centuries, destroy their families on the auction block, deny them basic human rights, literacy, healthcare, etc, and then abandon the place after you’ve squeezed every last bit of wealth you can out of the people and the land, you end up with a country … that doesn’t look much like Norway.

    Even if one grants all this it doesn’t explain why we would these people in our country. It’s like a pit bull which was previously owned by an abusive drug dealer. It may not be the dog’s fault that it’s dangerous but you still wouldn’t want to adopt it into your home.

    James B. Shearer (951d11)

  192. Joe Biden sais although Trumps statement was insensitive it was no “big phukin’ deal”. Hillary stated trump should “help the Haitians like I did” after which Hums told her to shut the “F” up.

    Rev.Hoagie (6bbda7)

  193. Real Donald Trump says he didn’t do it. Reliable neutrals present in the room, who are not fans of the President, say he didn’t do it.

    False.

    Nobody has specifically denied the “shithole” comment. Tom Cotton and David Perdue weasel it: “We do not recall the President saying these comments specifically but what he did call out was the imbalance in our current immigration system, which does not protect American workers and our national interest.” Tim Scott says Sen. Graham confirmed the basic accuracy of the comments:

    However, Republican Sen. Tim Scott, the junior senator from South Carolina, told the Charleston Post and Courier that Graham told him the reported comments are “basically accurate.”

    “If that comment is accurate, the comment is incredibly disappointing,” Scott told the newspaper.

    Nobody has specifically denied the shithole comment. Not even Trump.

    Retractions>? Measure of a reporter’s character.

    OK. Retract your false claim then.

    Patterico (115b1f)

  194. Like when Dickless Cheney told Pat Leahy to go fu<k himself?

    Admiral Ben Bunsen Burner (e96021)

  195. Is Coulter a Norwegian name?

    nk (dbc370) — 1/11/2018 @ 7:15 pm

    She wasn’t exactly the first person of European descent to explore JJ Walker.

    Pinandpuller (3e96cd)

  196. Wait, I thought your daughter was still in high school. Is my memory growing, has it been that long, or is this a different daughter.

    Same daughter, but she does not live with me.

    nk (dbc370)

  197. “Don’t go to India, Jerry! It’s horrible! They still have the plague!

    Seinfeld

    Pinandpuller (3e96cd)

  198. I keep hearing the predictable low-hanging fruit stuff about Haiti – I wanna hear more about Norway! Talk it up, conservatives! I’ve heard it’s great!

    Leviticus (b94909) — 1/11/2018 @ 7:51 pm

    They have something called “Black Gold”.

    Pinandpuller (3e96cd)

  199. the norwegian rat is NOT actually native to norway this is a misnomer scientists believe it actually originated in Haiti but migrated cause it wanted out of that poophole

    happyfeet (28a91b) — 1/11/2018 @ 8:26 pm

    Does it also pine for the fjords?

    Pinandpuller (3e96cd)


  200. And one more about the awesomeness that is Norway. [YouTube]

    papertiger (c8116c) — 1/11/2018 @ 9:37 pm

    The girl with the Wyclef Jean Tattoo

    Pinandpuller (3e96cd)

  201. In places like Norway people can just walk up on your land and pick your fruit. I don’t care for that.

    Pinandpuller (3e96cd)

  202. F 35 is a carpy plane with a lousy ceramic engine, no matter how cool it looked in live free or die hard. F 22 is a better vehicle so of course its production run was curtailed

    narciso (d1f714) — 1/11/2018 @ 9:48 pm

    Patrick Swayze’s ghost hands hold it together.

    Pinandpuller (3e96cd)

  203. Haiti’s US Ambassador Paul Altidor tells me Haiti’s government has formally summoned a US official to explain Trump’s comments to Haiti’s officials. “Haitians fought along US soldiers in the revolutionary war and we continue to be great contributors…

    papertiger (c8116c) — 1/11/2018 @ 10:04 pm

    Did they teach us how to dig latrines?

    Pinandpuller (3e96cd)

  204. It’s the weirdest thing – if you ship a large fraction of a country’s people across the ocean as slaves, work them to death for centuries, destroy their families on the auction block, deny them basic human rights, literacy, healthcare, etc, and then abandon the place after you’ve squeezed every last bit of wealth you can out of the people and the land, you end up with a country … that doesn’t look much like Norway.

    Dave (445e97) — 1/12/2018 @ 12:43 am

    I thought we agreed Africa wasn’t a country.

    Pinandpuller (3e96cd)

  205. Does it also pine for the fjords?

    when it rouses itself from the all but perpetual ennui i think it does

    happyfeet (28a91b)

  206. Theirs also the inconvenient fact their warlords and kings sold them to the Europeans, and four century later theirvdescendants still rule the roost.

    narciso (d1f714)

  207. Without a tape there’s really no way to know what was said with 100% certainty. There were no reliable narrators present unfortunately except for President Trump, and he says he didn’t say it.

    So that’s where we have to leave it I guess.

    happyfeet (28a91b)

  208. “Bet you a dollar I can get Jim Acosta to say “sh*thole” on the air ten times before the day is over.” – to Kelly Ann Conway.

    _- something like I would do for sh*ts and giggles if I were President.

    papertiger (c8116c) — 1/12/2018 @ 7:11 am

    What’s he going to talk about meow?

    Pinandpuller (3e96cd)

  209. Read my lips: A-M-E-R-I-C-A I-S E-X-C-E-P-T-I-O-N-A-L!

    nk (dbc370) — 1/12/2018 @ 7:17 am

    You spelled M-A-G-I-C D-I-R-T wrong.

    Pinandpuller (3e96cd)

  210. nk (dbc370) — 1/12/2018 @ 8:02 am

    If it weren’t for Jews we wouldn’t know what to call the bad part of town.

    Pinandpuller (3e96cd)

  211. I’m smelling a whole lot of “If” and “wasn’t in the room” coming off of Senator Scott.

    And a whole lot of Graham not specifically address what was said.

    The president, according to Durbin, “said things that were hate-filled, vile and racist.” Trump used the words “repeatedly,” the senator said.

    With Durbin “chain letter” qualifies as “hate-filled, vile and racist.”

    The Washington Post is still running with “these people” as their confirmation. No names. {I guess “anonymous sources” had the day off.}

    papertiger (c8116c)

  212. Come on Pat. You know this hit right in your “too good to check” spot. Same as it hit a lot of Trump fans.

    Takes a genius to find the overlap.

    papertiger (c8116c)

  213. Another thing. Haiti, being the most famous harbor of the Pirates of The Caribbean, and also suffering from and being bypassed in recent natural disasters, and calamities of government, is actually as a vacation spot one of the very best in the region.

    The crime rate is half that of neighboring Dominican Republic. A quarter that of nearby Jamaica.

    I wasn’t kidding about Tortuga being absolutely beautiful. Crystal clear waters, lush vegetation, and rich historical benchmarks. A superior experience for a bargain rate.

    The only reason I can think of for it being singled out by the President for inclusion on the, for want of a better term, “sh*tlist”, after a glance at the vacation information, is that mention of Haiti brings the Clinton Family Foundation crimes back into the national conversation.

    papertiger (c8116c)

  214. 216

    The crime rate is half that of neighboring Dominican Republic. A quarter that of nearby Jamaica.

    This isn’t true, Haiti just keeps lousy crime statistics. According to the US State Department Haiti is Level 3 (Reconsider travel) while Jamaica and the Dominican Republic are Level 2 (Exercise increased caution). See Haiti, Jamaica and Dominican Republic.

    James B. Shearer (951d11)

  215. I’m going by murder rate. Just so you know I didn’t make it up.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_intentional_homicide_rate

    Haiti has 10 murders per 100k. Jamaica has 43. Dominican Republic 17.
    According to whatever statistics wiki uses.

    papertiger (c8116c)

  216. 218

    According to whatever statistics wiki uses.

    Wiki is using numbers reported by Haiti. These are unreliable. The Wikipedia article Crime in Haiti explains:

    Reliable crime statistics for Haiti is difficult to come by. A comparative analysis of figures from various police/security entities operating throughout Haiti indicates that incidents of crimes tend to be inaccurately or under-reported.[1] Thus, for example, the Haitian criminal justice system documented 1,033 murders, for a murder rate of 10.2 per 100,000 people, in 2012, and as few as 486 (5.1 per 100,000 people) in 2007.[2] In contrast, an independent study tracking a large number of households in urban areas of Haiti recorded 11 murders among 15690 tracked residents during a 7-month period from August 2011 to February 2012, for an effective annualized murder rate of 120 per 100,000 residents. All but one of the murders occurred in Port-au-Prince. In February 2012, the study observed 4 murders among its Port-au-Prince respondents, for a monthly murder rate of 60.9 per 100,000 residents.[3]

    In the 22 months after the end of the President Aristide era in 2004, the murder rate for Port-au-Prince reached a high of 219 murders per 100,000 residents per year.[4]

    See also this State Department report which says:

    Crime statistics are woefully underreported by the Haitian National Police (HNP), and reports indicating that Haiti is statistically safer than other countries in the Caribbean are inaccurate.

    James B. Shearer (951d11)

  217. Thanks for the information James.

    Port au Prince Haiti sounds like a real … Almost as bad as El Salvidor or an African country.

    Florida sounding a lot better now.

    papertiger (c8116c)

  218. As pointed out it earlier,, the police don’t help out in those parts much:
    http://miamiherald.com/news/nation-world/world/americas/haiti/article146495394.html

    narciso (d1f714)


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