Patterico's Pontifications

12/7/2017

Sen. Al Franken Announces His Upcoming Resignation

Filed under: General — Dana @ 10:44 am

[guest post by Dana]

This morning, facing political pressure from his own party, Sen. Al Franken announced from the Senate floor that he will be resigning his Senate seat:

“I am announcing that in the coming weeks I will be resigning as a member of the United States Senate”

It’s interesting that his resignation is not going to be effectively immediately, like John Conyers. It’s a bit clever, given that in a few weeks time the special election will have taken place in Alabama. This allows time to see whether Republican Roy Moore, who faces serious allegations of sexual misconduct (including that involving a minor) and has the full support of the President of the United States, steps down. After all, if he doesn’t, what would actually compel Franken to follow through with his resignation?

Franken, who remained unapologetic and without contrition in his announcement, also noted this:

“I, of all people, am aware that there is some irony in the fact that I am leaving while a man who has bragged on tape about his history of sexual assault sits in the Oval Office and a man who has repeatedly preyed on young girls campaigns for the Senate with the full support of his party,”

There is a heated battle taking place between the major political parties as Democrats and Republicans valiantly struggle to claim the moral high ground. The problem, of course, is that both sides have sunk to new lows in the mucky cesspool of tribal politics, thus making it virtually impossible for either party to be covered in anything other than hypocritical scum. Until this week, when a cynical calculation was made to jump up a rung on the ladder of principles and try to force the hand of Republicans, Democrats circled the wagons for Al Franken and cited legacy and iconic status as a justification for keeping John Conyers on board. At the same time, Republicans have not only been defending Roy Moore from serious allegations involving a minor, but disgustingly continue to support him even when they believe the allegations are true. Today, on the left side of the aisle, Conyers is no longer in office and Franken has announced his upcoming resignation. On the right side of the aisle, Moore is being supported by a Republican president who also faces allegations of sexual misconduct, as well as being supported by substantial numbers of Republicans in Alabama. Given this, exactly who gets to make a claim to the moral high ground now? Unless Moore steps down, certainly not Republicans. Unfortunately, Republicans sacrificed their principles in November, 2016.

(Cross-posted at The Jury Talks Back.)

–Dana

187 Responses to “Sen. Al Franken Announces His Upcoming Resignation”

  1. I would say that if one is happy about Franken and Conyers, yet continues to defend Trump and Moore, then one is being disingenuous and hypocritical. Once upon a time, this would be expected behavior from Democrats but not Republicans. Once upon a time…

    Dana (023079)

  2. i think we elect Roy Moore in just 5 days from now, no?

    happyfeet (28a91b)

  3. It should be quid pro quo and tit-for-tat.

    Admiral Ben burn (b3d5ab)

  4. I am happy about Franken and Conyers and believe if someone can’t see the difference between them and Trump and Moore they are being disingenuous or deliberately obtuse.

    Rev.Hoagie (6bbda7)

  5. And Jen Rubin wants Clarence Thomas to fall on his sword because reciprocity.

    narciso (4346c7)

  6. Once upon a time, this would be expected behavior from Democrats but not Republicans. Once upon a time…

    Huh? Apparently in a time in ‘galaxy far, far away…’ Peruse at your pleasure: https://www.ranker.com/list/republican-sex-scandals/web-infoguy

    DCSCA (797bc0)

  7. Let us just say Abramson and mayers career path would be shorter without the slander.

    narciso (4346c7)

  8. Thx, happyfeet, I meant to say “will have taken place”. I updated.

    Dana (023079)

  9. Rev. Hoagie,

    I’m also happy about Franken and Conyers, but on Trump and Moore, we are just going to have to disagree.

    Dana (023079)

  10. He was the source for the slander about iseman and maverick in the times

    http://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/363693-
    gop-strategist-donates-to-alabama-democrat

    narciso (4346c7)

  11. While I agree that Moore should resign and that supporting him is a disgrace, there is a difference between the situations. Franken’s, and certainly Conyers’, seats are considered safe for the Democrats. So calling for them to resign carries little political risk. Moore’s seat, OTOH, could well go to a Democrat — it may still happen. And the Senate is very close.

    Point is, it is easy to talk righteous when you have little to lose. Much harder when adhering to principles might mean loss of power.

    Bored Lawyer (998177)

  12. i’m not wired to where i’m concerned about whether Rs or Ds hold some kind of contrived if not wholly chimerical moral high ground

    happyfeet (28a91b)

  13. Why so when the scam is up, the press can rub our noses in it.

    narciso (4346c7)

  14. “On the right side of the aisle, Moore is being supported by a Republican president who also faces allegations of sexual misconduct, as well as being supported by substantial numbers of Republicans in Alabama”

    And the RNC

    http://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/363239-rnc-reverses-will-support-moore-in-alabama

    harkin (f2baf4)

  15. 2. happyfeet (28a91b) — 12/7/2017 @ 10:56 am

    i think we elect Roy Moore in just 5 days from now, no?

    Then Gloria Allred gets to put up or shut up, and maybe we get to see the yearbook of Beverly Young Nelson where Roy Moore allegedly signed his name “DA” (looks very much like the signature from the 1999 divorce document where it definitely does not mean District Attorney.)

    The only other serious accusation of a sexual nature about Roy Moore (other than to a Southern Baptist maybe – he kissed some other women, almost 40 years ago, when he was in his early 30s and they were just 16 to 18 or so) remaining is that of Leigh Corfman’s attempted, and/or first steps initiated, seduction at age 14. And we need to know how the Washington Post heard of it to try to judge its truthfulness. And the only way that would have worked is if she called him, and he didn’t call her, to pick her up.

    Roy Moore seems to have gone overbroad in his denials.

    Sammy Finkelman (e70ce9)

  16. Trumboed.

    Men huddled in executive washrooms across the land have already concluded: minimize exposure. If quotas are filled and a guy and a gal are up for the same gig w/t same qualifications, hire the guy.

    DCSCA (797bc0)

  17. I’ve added the video of Franken’s announcement to the post.

    Dana (023079)

  18. Lots of GoPe coming out of the woodwork to support radical leftist, infanticide supporting Doug Jones.

    Guess they realize their scam of pretending there are 2 parties while it’s just leftist rule is up.

    A pox on them.

    NJRob (d16a49)

  19. @NJRob, i’m curious: in your mind, are there *any* Democrats who aren’t radical Leftists? If so, what do they look like politically?

    aphrael (3f0569)

  20. Given that we saw in the last presidential election how much Bill Clinton’s lack of character and sexual misconduct were a focal point of attack used against the Democrats by Republicans – particularly Trump – what makes anyone here think that the Democrats won’t use the very same tactics against Trump in 2018? There are long-term, unintended consequences for having sacrificed principles to elect as president a man with numerous allegations of sexual harassment and assault. And it works both ways.

    Dana (023079)

  21. Franken “will resign” in the near future.

    Moore will be seated.

    Franken will “still have not resigned” so he can be the face of Democrats for the double standard.

    reff (540fba)

  22. A little while ago, the New York times went into a certain random business location in Alabama where byu could find blacks as a rule. Six out of ten of them didn’t even know theer was a Senate election coming up. So there’s that. There are still, or were a week ago, people who are out of touch.

    19. Well, yes, that ad is saying there is a black man (maybe more than one) going after high school girls, and maybe not gently, and this is his picture, and Be on the Lookout for him. The text then says would anyone want to make a black man who was doing that Senator? It’s clearly aimed at whites who might have some racial prejudice. Anyway, Roy Moore did that 35 to 40 years ago, and not now, and he married one of them, although maybe he first saw her at when she was in college at around age 20, maybe even 21. He is 14 years older than her.(or did he first see her before she was in college, and is hiding it all these years?)

    Doug Jones has been running ads about Roy Moore being a sex offender or something, and accused him of being [a pedophile] based on one alleged incident 40 years ago. It’s not at thepoint where you can say it is credible. It is possible.

    He’s come out in favor of Alabama’s current law on late term abortions, which allows them only on grounds fof health (although that’s a big lophole, since mental health counts) so he probably can’t be accused of supporting infanticide – at least not all out.

    Polling there might be even more difficult than usual, but polls do show Moore leading by 2 to 6 points, and the bias of the poll should be against him.

    Sammy Finkelman (e70ce9)

  23. Whether you have 99 or 100 senators, 50 plus the vice president is a majority, and 49 is not. I think you still need 60 to invoke cloture.

    Sammy Finkelman (e70ce9)

  24. Somebody called up the Rush Limbaugh show and said he was overjoyed. He’s disliked Franken because of te stolen 2008 election and something else he mentioned. He said it couldn’t happen to a more arrogant, hack, limosine liberal (he had more adjectives) and that even if he stays Al Franken will no longer be able to grandstand.

    Sammy Finkelman (e70ce9)

  25. “I am happy about Franken and Conyers and believe if someone can’t see the difference between them and Trump and Moore they are being disingenuous or deliberately obtuse.”

    – Rev. Hoagie

    What an unintentionally ironic statement. Carry on.

    Leviticus (c7071a)

  26. Moral high ground? I son’t think so. The Democrats are just putting the members of their tribe who can no longer produce and have become a burden on ice floes. The gloss of moral high ground they’re trying to put on it is what happyfeet said — contrived and chimerical.

    nk (dbc370)

  27. CNN does not invent quotes and sources out of whole cloth.

    It must be incredibly liberating for you, being able to dismiss – on the basis of no evidence – any and all information that bothers you.

    Dave (445e97) — 12/6/2017 @ 5:35 pm

    Zell Miller was one.

    Heath Schuler tried being another, but your party buried him by having him betray his values to support the radical left agenda.

    NJRob (d16a49)

  28. @NJRob, i’m curious: in your mind, are there *any* Democrats who aren’t radical Leftists? If so, what do they look like politically?

    aphrael (3f0569) — 12/7/2017 @ 11:51 am

    Zell Miller was one.

    Heath Schuler tried being another, but your party buried him by having him betray his values to support the radical left agenda.

    *correct quote

    NJRob (d16a49)

  29. Whether that’s what the Democrats are doing, nk, and I agree with happyfeet’s assessment, that does not mean that it’s right or demonstrative of any real and admirable principles that the right is following in their footsteps. What they do doesn’t, and shouldn’t justify what this side of the aisle does.

    Dana (023079)

  30. If the right side of the aisle cannot even come together and make a solid, unified stand against a candidate who has been credibly accused of sexual misconduct with a minor – then what the hell can we stand against, and what makes us any different than the Democrats who would sell their mother up a river in a heartbeat to win an election?

    Dana (023079)

  31. This is the political version of small children wagging their little fat fingers of accusation and deflection, hollering But he did it first!

    Dana (023079)

  32. Dana,

    How about due process? Roy Moore has vehemently denied every allegation. I don’t believe him, but that doesn’t mean that he isn’t entitled to a hearing of the charges and weighing of the evidence.

    People should not be rewarded for coming out with 40-year old stories one month prior to an election date. Just on that basis alone, we should not let these charges derail his election.

    The proper stance to take is that we’ll let the voters of Alabama make their decision. After the election is over, if Roy Moore is Senator, then we’ll let the wheels of due process grind.

    Moore isn’t the real target. Donal Trump is the target. He’s the real reason that Conyers and Franken are being forced to resign. This clears the decks for the Democrat Party coup to overturn an election, and try to inflame the female voter base for 2018. It’s a smart strategy, but Republicans should be running ads ad nauseum showing Bill, Hillary, and all the Democrat party apologists who enabled and excused his sexual misbehavior.

    Republicans must attack Democrats’ strategy and stop focusing upon the individuals being charged in the court of public opinion.

    Remember “Move On”? Why can’t we just move on to focusing upon what voters really care about?

    All the Dems got is inflamming racial and sexual divisions to gin up their base. Republicans should focus on jobs, jobs, jobs.

    El Gipper (f1f816)

  33. Can Al get a refund on his Mistletoe beltbuckle?

    Pinandpuller (16b0b5)

  34. No dems never move on ask Negroponte, reich Bolton, ’till perditions gate’

    narciso (4346c7)

  35. How about due process?

    Moore has no “due process” rights in regard to what people say about him when running for public office.

    Dave (445e97)

  36. Althouse on Franken:

    “What’s most notable about that speech — which I watched live — is that Al Franken did not apologize for anything he is accused of doing and he persistently — as strongly as he could — asserted his innocence.

    Yes – very strange to resign and at the same time refuse to apologize and imply the women are liars.

    More Althouse:

    He may have conceded that in some form, some of the accusations are based on things that really did happen, but not that anything said about him is accurate. I heard an expression of confidence that a fair investigation would vindicate him, but that he is being forced out for the good of the party, because his colleagues will not stand by him and give him due process but need him gone so they can go after Roy Moore (if Roy Moore happens to get elected next week). What a sad, tawdry mess! How is this supposed to bolster support for the Democratic Party? If Franken believes he is a good man being subjected to unfair treatment, he should stand his ground. He seems to be getting out of the way so that the forces of personal destruction can run wild. If he won’t confess to precisely what he did wrong and apologize, he should not have resigned. I’m thoroughly disgusted. He didn’t give the Democratic Party firmer ground to stand on as it promotes women’s equality. He made everything look ambiguous and corrupt.”

    http://althouse.blogspot.com/2017/12/al-franken-live_97.html?m=1

    harkin (f2baf4)

  37. I have no problem with Roy Moore being elected, then investigated, then found to have likely molested the 14-year-old back in the late 1970s, and then forced to resign his seat and have a GOP governor pick his replacement. That is pretty much no different than the way the Dems are playing it with Franken. Sorry to be super cynical, but if Franken were a Senator from Wisconsin or Illinois or Massachusetts or Vermont, or any other state with a Republican governor I would be willing to bet that the party would grit its teeth and continue to support him, allegations be dammed. It’s why the Dems are remaining silent about the allegations that Bob Menendez contorted with underage prostitutes in the Dominican Republic, at least until Democrat Phil Murphy is sworn in as governor and Chris Christie is safely out of office.

    JVW (42615e)

  38. Ted Cruz was just on Hannity. He gave ok answers to questions about Franken and Moore Before that he actually said the tax bill is a big win for Americans. Good things in it.

    So Dave, will you be sending money to his primary challenger?

    I only addressed you because I have a great vanity plate suggestion for you:

    DaveCon1

    At DaveCon1 the only way the president can redeem himself is to follow Jezebel’s footsteps, as it were.

    Pinandpuller (16b0b5)

  39. He made everything look ambiguous and corrupt.

    Franken, in his announcement, shamefully maintained the self-proclaimed innocence with his “I’m just a warm guy” excuse while letting his accusers take the hit as being less than honest.

    Dana (023079)

  40. Whatever happened to the Ted 3 or Ted 12 (which included that 1/2 black Pierson babe) that the Enquirer was trying to pin on him?

    urbanleftbehind (5eecdb)

  41. people have honey boo boo fatigue i think

    happyfeet (28a91b)

  42. soooo

    conyers being forced to resign
    and franken being forced to resign

    is basically morally equivalent

    to trump and moore being endorsed and encouraged to remain as candidates/elected officials?

    evidently the GOP lesson is: lie your ass off about the things you’re accused of doing, and there will literally no mechanism exists that will hold you accountable.

    all you need is not to have a conscience.

    Tom Ryberg (2c5752)

  43. lol, syntax. how about:

    evidently the GOP lesson is: lie your ass off about the things you’re accused of doing, and have no fear, because literally no internal mechanism exists that will hold you accountable.

    Tom Ryberg (2c5752)

  44. Franken is a monstrous spoiled brat

    Taylor (73be2e)

  45. More of Burnie’s friends stopping by I see.

    NJRob (d16a49)


  46. 26.“I am happy about Franken and Conyers and believe if someone can’t see the difference between them and Trump and Moore they are being disingenuous or deliberately obtuse.”

    – Rev. Hoagie

    What an unintentionally ironic statement. Carry on.
    Leviticus (c7071a) — 12/7/2017 @ 12:16 pm

    If you weren’t always ready to jump on my ass, Leviticus you may have realized I was being sarcastic. I was trying to show that beginning a thread with the idea that anyone who disagrees is disingenuous (insincere) and hypocritical (suggesting virtues one does not have) or more plainly a friggin liar tends to impune further response from anyone who disagrees.

    And exactly how was my statement “unintentionally ironic”? You seem to have a need to try and insult me at every opportunity and I don’t understand why.

    Rev.Hoagie (6bbda7)

  47. In this environment, Hoagie, online sarcasm seems to lend itself to misunderstanding more than to clarity.

    aphrael (3f0569)

  48. That speech of shame is all republicans need for election advertisements 2018.
    Such a pompous azz.

    mg (60b0f7)

  49. evidently the GOP lesson is: lie your ass off about the things you’re accused of doing, and have no fear, because literally no internal mechanism exists that will hold you accountable.

    Sort of like the Obama Justice Department, right?

    JVW (42615e)

  50. And the internal mechanism that holds politicians accountable is commonly referred to as the voters.

    JVW (42615e)


  51. evidently the GOP lesson is: lie your ass off about the things you’re accused of doing, and there will literally no mechanism exists that will hold you accountable.

    I think the lesson , comrade Tom is if there is proof you best resign, if there is not proof you should still be considered innocent even if leftist stare at the sky and scream. You can bet the only reason the Dems forced Franken out is because they want the gov to appoint another Dem. If the gov were a Rep they would have fought like a Clinton.

    Rev.Hoagie (6bbda7)

  52. so, [deflection to Obama], and let the voters worry about morality, cuz we won’t.

    …is that the best we can expect?

    Tom Ryberg (2c5752)

  53. It sounds like Ted Cruz drove Dave Mathews’ Band tour bus across a span that a bargeload of #neverTrumpers were cruising under.

    Pinandpuller (16b0b5)

  54. @32. Dana, there’s no end to this- it’s not a political issue but a matter of where to draw the line. Kennedy pal Orrin Hatch excuses Moore’s alleged behavior because it was ‘decades ago’ and they ‘need the seat’ yet Franken’s behavior before entering the Senate is fair game. It’s just goofy; pedos, flashers and gropers. Parading before staff in your BVDs then paying off staffers w/tax dollars is wacko. But where does this witch hunt end? When do you say, ‘that was then, this is now?’ Got scrapbook pix of a frat bro from college days puking in public, mooning and ‘manhandling’ co-eds at parties, passed out drunk on the sidewalk, rolling joints w/t guys and joyfully experiencing collegiate debauchery back in the day. He became a respected judge. Where does this end??

    DCSCA (797bc0)

  55. …is that the best we can expect?

    What is your alternative? Everyone who can express the proper level of contrived Internet outrage gets to 86 every single elected leader that they don’t like?

    JVW (42615e)

  56. We’ve seen this from the left before.

    the_nazis_of_yesterday_and_todays_national_socialist_left.html

    NJRob (d16a49)

  57. #52 Is your position that nobody should be made to resign thus far, as proof has not materialized? I think when evidence starts to pile up, that should influence the flow of consequences.

    And sure, JVW, one way or another, ideally, there will be consequences for politicians. Except there wasn’t for Trump. I think that’s because for many of his supporters, his willingness to degrade women is an energizing feature, not a flaw. Maybe our parties can be about higher standards than that.

    Right now though, evidence piles up and you can just dismiss it as fake news if you don’t like it. There is a clear incentive to just lie whenever, and like half the country is just fine with that. But damn, we could do better, right?

    Tom Ryberg (2c5752)

  58. So Dave, will you be sending money to his primary challenger?

    I donated a fair amount to Cruz’s presidential primary campaign. Policy-wise, I can’t think of any important issue where I disagree with him. However, his unwillingness to stand up and defend American decency and values against Trump’s daily assaults (as fellow conservatives Mike Lee, Jeff Flake and Ben Sasse have) makes me very sad.

    DisappoinTED, one might say.

    It’s reminiscent of his early cozying up to Trump during the primaries, which didn’t reflect well on him.

    His primary challenger, if he has one, would almost certainly be an even worse Trump cheerleader, so I don’t expect to donate to either side.

    I only addressed you because I have a great vanity plate suggestion for you:

    DaveCon1

    Oh my gosh, what a clever suggestion! Did you come up with that all by yourself?!

    Unfortunately, it’s eight characters, and in CA, vanity plates are limited to seven.

    Sadface.

    Dave (445e97)

  59. 2018 election could be the wildest mid term of all time after another 25 senators and representatives are brought up on perv charges.

    mg (60b0f7)

  60. What is your alternative? Everyone who can express the proper level of contrived Internet outrage gets to 86 every single elected leader that they don’t like?

    JVW, I’d like to see some courageous conservative leadership right about now. I genuinely believe it would be terrible for the country if the right’s political leadership continues this march toward no internal accountability for sexual misconduct.

    Tom Ryberg (2c5752)

  61. DCSCA, you just wrote the trailer for Old School 2.

    urbanleftbehind (5eecdb)

  62. I say the above as one who has never been a conservative (obviously). From a purely cynical political standpoint, I think the right stands to lose big if it keeps ceding all its moral authority regarding sexual misconduct.

    But I actually don’t care about pure politics here. Ultimately I see the current #metoo movement as shining light on a bigger failing of morality regarding men’s treatment of women in general, and I think it would be swell if people all over the political map could attend to the work of fixing this $#*+.

    And as long as taking that seriously is seen as partisanship, that’s bad for the country on the whole.

    Tom Ryberg (2c5752)

  63. america this is rachel dolezal and she is so good

    happyfeet (28a91b)

  64. @63. Meh! Force of habit.

    DCSCA (797bc0)

  65. Senator Franken… meet Senator Blutarsky.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wv5c2YR1lVE 

    Now that’s a speech.

    DCSCA (797bc0)

  66. The same party that said they’d blow Clinton for supporting abortion now claim to care about ethics.

    Hahahahahahaha

    NJRob (d16a49)

  67. Hey! Have the Iraq war mongers apologized for our nearly 4500 dead and the Trillions of shekels wasted?

    Admiral Ben burn (b3d5ab)

  68. The same party that said they’d blow Clinton for supporting abortion now claim to care about ethics.

    Hahahahahahaha

    I see your deflection to Clinton, but for me it just reinforces the question of where exactly the hell all the used-to-care-about-morality conservatives have gone?

    Tom Ryberg (2c5752)


  69. 70.Hey! Have the Iraq war mongers apologized for our nearly 4500 dead and the Trillions of shekels wasted?

    AS far as I know, comrade Ben! Kerry and the rest of the lying fools have not apologized.


    The Democrats who voted to support the war and rationalized that vote by making false claims about Iraq’s WMD programs were responsible for allowing the Bush administration to get away with lying about Iraq’s alleged threat. For example, Bush was able to note how “more than a hundred Democrats in the House and the Senate – who had access to the same intelligence – voted to support removing Saddam Hussein from power.” In a 2005 speech attacking anti-war activists, Bush noted how, “Many of these critics supported my opponent during the last election, who explained his position to support the resolution in the Congress this way: ‘When I vote to give the President of the United States the authority to use force, if necessary, to disarm Saddam Hussein, it is because I believe that a deadly arsenal of weapons of mass destruction in his hands is a threat, and a grave threat, to our security.'”

    Indeed, the fact that 2004 Democratic presidential nominee John Kerry chose to make such demonstrably false statements and voted in favor of the resolution likely cost the Democrats the White House since it led many potential supporters, myself included, to refuse to vote for him. Furthermore, because of Kerry’s vote in support for the war and his false claims about Iraq’s weapons capabilities, the debate during the fall campaign was not about who was right about Iraq (since they were both wrong), but Kerry’s alleged “flip-flopping” for belatedly raising questions about the conduct of the war.

    Rev.Hoagie (6bbda7)

  70. Whatever happened to censure?

    Sammy Finkelman (e70ce9)

  71. “We think your guy from 18 years ago is immoral, so now we have no moral standing either!” = not a convincing argument.

    Tom Ryberg (2c5752)


  72. I see your deflection to Clinton, but for me it just reinforces the question of where exactly the hell all the used-to-care-about-morality conservatives have gone?


    They constantly had the sh!t whipped out of them by lying, cheating baby killing leftists so decided to fight fire with fire. Don’t like it do ya, comrade?

    Rev.Hoagie (6bbda7)

  73. Hoagie, get the oatmeal out your ears. I’m talking about all the lying, cheating Bastards..every one.

    Admiral Ben burn (b3d5ab)

  74. Tom Ryber, regarding Trump the proper procedure is as follows:

    1) A woman whom he has molested files a civil suit, a la Paul Jones.
    2) The case goes to trial since the Supreme Court (Clinton vs. Jones) has ruled that separation of powers does not allow or a delay.
    3) Based upon what is uncovered in the trial, the House and Senate can act according to their Constitutional duties.

    If some jurisdiction in which an alleged crime occurred wants to try to criminally prosecute Trump then by all means they should do so pursuant to the applicable laws, and if he is found guilty then he should face whatever judgement is coming to him and then have the House and Senate consider impeachment and removal.

    Listen, I agree with you that the GOP sullied itself by nominating Trump (and I know that we have plenty of readers here who vehemently disagree with me). But now that it is a done deal, it wouldn’t be Constitutionally sound for Trump to be impeached based upon harassment allegations that pre-date his election and since they are as of yet unproven don’t rise to the level of “high crimes and misdemeanors” any more than it would be Constitutionally sound for the Trump Justice Department to prosecute Elizabeth Warren for lying about her heritage to score Ivy League jobs. We shouldn’t be using political power to settle scores or morally preen

    JVW (42615e)

  75. Oh my gosh, what a clever suggestion! Did you come up with that all by yourself?!

    Unfortunately, it’s eight characters, and in CA, vanity plates are limited to seven.

    Sadface.

    Dave (445e97) — 12/7/2017 @ 1:54 pm

    Well you finally pegged the Sarcasameter. It used to register “Cold Fish”.

    Shall We Play A Game???

    Pinandpuller (16b0b5)

  76. But there were no republicans or it was just a few, right hoagie?

    Admiral Ben burn (b3d5ab)

  77. “We think your guy from 18 years ago is immoral, so now we have no moral standing either!” = not a convincing argument.

    Exactly.

    You can’t claim redemption before acknowledging your sinful behaviors.

    Now would be a good time to begin.

    Admiral Ben burn (b3d5ab)

  78. the phenomenal sleaziness and corruption of fbi trash-maggot Christopher Wray dwarfs anything you can say about Moore or Franken

    but nevertrump’s way more concerned about penises and vaginas than for reals corruption

    pervy Mitt Romney lurvs them penises and vaginas but he doesn’t want to talk about the trashy FBI i wonder why

    happyfeet (28a91b)

  79. JVW – that was informative, thank you.

    Tom Ryberg (2c5752)

  80. Frankin doesn’t face “allegations”. He was groping that sleeping reporter’s tits on national TV for all to see.

    Exhibit A https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TtdgRPJNQBg

    If allegations from politically motivated hatchet jobs were enough then Patterico would be out of work due to “shooting” his wife. (Nevermind his wife is fine never having been shot. It’s the seriousness of the allegation that counts.)

    Exhibit B https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cISJnysCxck

    papertiger (c8116c)

  81. 37. harkin (f2baf4) — 12/7/2017 @ 12:53 pm

    37.Althouse on Franken:

    http://althouse.blogspot.com/2017/12/al-franken-live_97.html?m=1

    Yes – very strange to resign and at the same time refuse to apologize and imply the women are liars.

    he implied some of them were but he said women needed to be taken seriously.

    He said some people had the false impression that he was admitting doing something wrong, but he did deny that he did anything that brought discredit on the Senate, and said he was confident the teh ethics committee would clear him.

    But…

    He couldn’t defend himself and be an effective Senator, and the next Senator would be able to devote “her” full energies to representing the people of Minnesota.

    A lot of it was a farewell speech.

    He also said it was ironic he was leaving when you had a president who “bragged on tape” about [sexual abuse] and there was a candidate for the United States Senate who had “preyed on young girls” who was running with the full support of his party. But still irony or not, he was leaving, and he still hoped to continue to be an activist.

    He’ll “be just fine” – which are exactly the same words that James Comey, the fired FBI Director said after he was fired. Same ghostwriter(s) Plagiarism?

    Somebody doesn’t want protests – say it ain’t so, and so on.

    Sammy Finkelman (02a146)

  82. That was a low blow tiger, Voldemort did send his flying monkeys, after our host, and apparently has not been held accountable for said act. Anyways start smalleys category of established transgressions are sizable enough without hypothetical.

    narciso (d1f714)

  83. 83. That wasn’t a reporter, and it wasn’t on national TV. That was a fellow actor at the end of a a USO tour, who got annoyed when he stuck his tongue down her throat during a rehearsal for a skit – and afetrward he tried to annoy her for the rest of the tour.

    He left that picture for her to see. It might even have been photoshopped. At the time.

    Sammy Finkelman (02a146)

  84. @83. Keep in mind at the time, she was not exactly a ‘reporter’ and he was not exactly a sitting senator — and years later, at the very moment she teared up on CNN saying she just ‘make the world a better place for her children’ her personal website was– and still is- peddling autographed porn she posed for back in the day. So where do you draw the line on this? Orrin Hatch was a confidant and buddy of Kennedy — did he ever demand Teddy resign for behavior before and while a sitting senator? Should senile Congressional critters duly elected by their constituents resign for falling asleep on the job, sending lewd images to old flames, pack it in walking around in their skivvies or quit because have terminal brain tumors?? Where does this end?

    DCSCA (797bc0)

  85. GOP Rep. Trent Franks making a statement later, rumored to be resignation due to naughtiness.

    Dave (445e97)

  86. @88. Did he lick the backside of a Susan B. Anthony postage stamp? This is madness– there’s no end to it. Crazy.

    DCSCA (797bc0)

  87. “If you weren’t always ready to jump on my ass, Leviticus you may have realized I was being sarcastic.”

    – Rev. Hoagie

    What were you being sarcastic about?

    Your comment was “I am happy about Franken and Conyers and believe if someone can’t see the difference between them and Trump and Moore they are being disingenuous or deliberately obtuse.” Are you not happy about Franken? Not happy about Conyers? Do you believe that there is no difference between Franken/Conyers and Trump/Moore?

    Because if you actually are happy about Franken and Conyers, and you actually believe that there are meaningful differences between Franken/Conyers and Trump/Moore, then you weren’t being sarcastic.

    Leviticus (efada1)

  88. Off-hand, I can’t think of anyone in Congress who has been there for more than 18 years whom I would not like to see replaced. This includes the GOP warhorses like Hatch, McCain, McConnell, Shelby, Grassley and the like as much as it goes for Leahy, Feinstein, Murray, Durbin, Schumer, and the other Dems. And I mean the same for all of the dinosaurs in the House. So hearing that several House members may be implicated in these shenanigans is a good thing, assuming that many of them are these very old-timers who have lost all sense of propriety and reason.

    JVW (773988)

  89. Re the dormant thread, siniora is the ship figure:

    http://gulfnews.com/opinion/thinkers/difficult-times-for-lebanon-s-christians-1.542372

    narciso (d1f714)

  90. https://twitter.com/mikehtrujillo/status/938815136571129856

    Michael Trujillo‏
    @mikehtrujillo

    SOURCES: @CNN and @washingtonpost working on exposing 20-30 congressional members 4 sexual harassment. #DC

    8:59 AM – 7 Dec 2017

    That would be one way of protecting someone. That numeber sounds high. It might be all the cases that were settled over 20 years.

    Sammy Finkelman (02a146)

  91. Shia political figure, when Israel pulled out in 2000, they surrendered Lebanon to Iran.

    narciso (d1f714)

  92. @91. Other government jobs have age limits; ATCs and so on. Pilots as well. Mainly because their positions carry a level responsibility to others and their decisions can affect life and property. Might be time to consider similar requirements for Federal offices as well. It’s not exactly ‘term limits’ but maybe just some common sense.

    DCSCA (797bc0)

  93. Well, this is awkward.

    Franks resigns, claims it is because he asked two staff members if they would serve as surrogate mothers.

    Dave (445e97)

  94. Three people jump forward to defend Franken.

    Nobody going to step up for Pat?

    papertiger (c8116c)

  95. @77 For what it’s worth, impeachment is a political process, not a legal one.

    Davethulhu (fab944)

  96. Don’t be a jackass tiger, speaking of:

    https://mobile.twitter.com/alimhaider/status/938913858990821376/photo/1

    Vichy, heard of it, let grenouille.

    narciso (d1f714)

  97. This is turning into an episode of law and order:

    https://mobile.twitter.com/joshgerstein/status/938911065064333313?p=v

    narciso (d1f714)

  98. When Hatch starts shouting ‘albatross’ then drop his pants and urinates on the Senate floor for CSPAN cameras, expect GOP leadership to say, ‘Oh, that’s just Orrin being Orrin.’

    DCSCA (797bc0)

  99. key feature of the treasure trove of information Cummings and his colleagues released yesterday is a timeline on Flynn. Early developments on the timeline center on an appearance Flynn made on June 10, 2015 before the House Foreign Affairs Committee. As noted in the timeline, Flynn did not disclose his work at that time on behalf of ACU.

    https://www.emptywheel.net/2017/12/07/michael-flynn-serial-doublecrosser/

    Admiral Ben burn (b3d5ab)

  100. @99 LOL.

    Number of independent countries snuffed out of existence in agreements signed with the Nazis by:

    Britain: 1
    France: 1
    Soviet Union: 4
    USA: 0

    Dave (445e97)

  101. Forget politics; take a close look at Grassley, too. He’s exhibiting ‘non-ballistic motion’ as well; dismissive hand waves and babbling about women, booze and movies. If he was with your local sheriff you’d ‘Barney Fife’ him with the keys to the squad car and lock up his one bullet.

    DCSCA (797bc0)

  102. 104

    Don’t you mean Otis the town drunk?

    Admiral Ben burn (b3d5ab)

  103. Clearly one third of the Nation is a rubber room and Trump was just the who’re they go to the mattress with. Once he’s used up from sloppy seconds they’ll move on to another war of lascivious choice.

    Admiral Ben burn (b3d5ab)

  104. Speaking of more noble things on this day:

    https://mobile.twitter.com/ThomasWictor/status/938883981709213696/photo/1

    narciso (d1f714)

  105. Two emails to my Crispycritter..another colonel. (Btw, what do you call a colonel with below average IQ?–SIR!.

    Anyway I was pissed he voted for the House Harkonnen Tux Bill and I told him if he voted for this Creature from the Black Lagoon again I would come out of retirement to flip his friggin District. I don’t think he liked my tone. No reply…heh.

    Admiral Ben burn (b3d5ab)

  106. Mercy is denser than usual, the acu was a collaborative project tie prevent the Russians and Chinese from dominating the market.

    narciso (d1f714)

  107. 109, who? and you could just give me couple of clues not full name.

    urbanleftbehind (c54a05)

  108. 109 mincing and empty threats are no way to conduct your business, Rear Admiral BeenBurned.

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  109. Hers from the bay area, the odd he has a GOP congressman, extreme improbability drive.

    narciso (d1f714)

  110. Naw. I think the lack of informs about the perceived equation between Conyers/Franken and Trump/Moore.

    The allegations against Trump/Moore are obviously scurrilous, so much so that it quickly becomes tedious to mount a defence against every troll’s mention of “pussy grabber”.

    The troll knows he’s full of crap. Everyone reading it knows they are full of crap. Doesn’t require a defence, and yet we have Franken trying to delay his resignation in order to trade on the full of crap dequation in order to keep his phony baloney job.

    The thing I love about Trump, he could have recognized Jerusalem as the Capital of Israel at any time over the last 10 months, but he held off until the day after Obama crawled out of his hole to call Donald Trump a Nazi.
    Shows everybody, even Barry’s supporters, exactly who Obama is.

    papertiger (c8116c)

  111. Probably one of the Portos in the CV?

    urbanleftbehind (c54a05)

  112. and you actually believe that there are meaningful differences between Franken/Conyers and Trump/Moore,

    Trump is res judicata. The voters heard it all and they voted for him anyway.

    I think the stories about Moore are lies, but the voters of Alabama will render the verdict that matters next Tuesday. If they elect Moore: “Tough turkeys, losers!” Like Trump.

    I see a distinction between Franken and Conyers. Conyers is classic sexual harassment. He went after his employees. Al Franken is a crude buffoon who peeked up the skirts of the ladies on pedestals (that’s an old Steve Martin joke).

    All else aside (I mean it!), the distinction between the two Dems on the one hand and Trump and Moore on the other, is 1) they did their dirt while in the offices they’re resigning from (Leean Tweeden, bleech!) and … wait for it: 2) They’re f***ing resigning! Why should we believe in them when they don’t believe in themselves?

    nk (dbc370)

  113. There’s a landshark loose in Washington. No telling who the next victim will be.

    Kevin M (752a26)

  114. And his nephew is following the ike turner school of personnel management

    narciso (d1f714)

  115. So now we hear that an attorney who represented the Clinton IT staffer involved in the private server probe is now on the Mueller team.

    You can’t even make this stuff up

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  116. it quickly becomes tedious to mount a defence against every troll’s mention of “pussy grabber”

    Nobody ever said that defending the indefensible would be easy.

    Dave (445e97)

  117. Billy bush’s superior did more than grab, ahem, allegedly.

    narciso (d1f714)

  118. So now we hear that an attorney who represented the Clinton IT staffer involved in the private server probe is now on the Mueller team.

    Wait, attorneys are accountable for the actions of people they represent?

    Are you nuts?

    Dave (445e97)

  119. take the reds, man

    mg (60b0f7)

  120. 87. DCSCA (797bc0) — 12/7/2017 @ 3:33 pm

    Orrin Hatch was a confidant and buddy of Kennedy — did he ever demand Teddy resign for behavior before and while a sitting senator? But e did ersuade him to reform his life around the itime he married Vicki Reggie‎ (whose father, Edmund Reggie, had some connection to the avings and loan scandal – he was convicted of misapplication of funds (a felony) and was sentenced to 120 days of home confinement and a $30,000 fine in 1993.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Victoria_Reggie_Kennedy

    They were engaged in March 1992, and married July 3, 1992, in a civil ceremony at his home in McLean, Virginia. His political career had suffered from a long period of womanizing, drinking, and adverse publicity, and she is credited with stabilizing his personal life and helping him resume a productive career in the Senate.[3][6] Kennedy was devoted to her two children.[3]

    Sammy Finkelman (e70ce9)

  121. And a DOJ official was demoted for withholding info from his superiors about meetings with Glen Simpson and Christopher Steele of GPS Fusion fame. So they did find some collusion afterall.

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  122. Folks in Congress think it’s a big deal, ConDave. You fool no one, ConDave.

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  123. One way you can tell Manufacturing is making a comeback in America is Mueller hired a bunch of Hillary supporters.

    Pinandpuller (356abb)

  124. I think Mueller’s team should have consisted of Mike Cernovich, Milo Yiannopoulos, Lucian Wintrich, Jim Hoft, and Roger Stone, and such subordinates as they hired, for a fair, honest, unbiased, non-partisan, impartial investigation.

    nk (dbc370)

  125. Harkin, the wry DefComedy Jam blunder in theroot article forced this to come out before the Sunday sermons:
    http://www.yahoo.com/news/roy-moore-last-time-america-234233620.html

    urbanleftbehind (c54a05)

  126. So guess where the revised judge had been last year, how about the fisa court?

    narciso (4346c7)

  127. 129, they should have been locked in a vault for a couple days…who of the 2 straights would get “turned out”?

    urbanleftbehind (c54a05)

  128. Big shake-up coming at the FBI, maybe as early as tomorrow.

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  129. Recused, judge Sullivan did try for justice in the Stevens case and has enabled some of judicial watches investigations

    narciso (4346c7)

  130. So many experienced, highly qualified lawyers to choose from and Mueller stacks his staff with lawyers involved with the Clinton Foundation and other political orgs. Enough of this charade.

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  131. re: “Unfortunately, Republicans sacrificed their principles in November, 2016.”

    Those principles were lost by having to vote for crap like Bush Senior and McCain. Anybody who voted for the former head of the CIA and what a large number of people call the Bush Crime Syndicate (closely allied with the Clinton Crime Family) can’t complain about Trump being vulgar. That is like Mike Tyson complaining about Ron Paul once thinking about cheating on his wife.

    Besides, the real issues are policy ones. Trump supporters and opponents within the conservative/GOP world simply disagree about a lot of policies. For example, immigration. So man up if you don’t like populism or nationalism. Argue on what the real fight is about, not issues that a Social Justice Warrior is driven by.

    Donaldo (95053d)

  132. Folks in Congress think it’s a big deal, ConDave.

    Oh. Well then.

    What violation of professional ethics or law is “an attorney who represented the Clinton IT staffer involved in the private server probe” alleged to have committed?

    No IT staffer was indicted or even a target of the investigation, as far as I’m aware. At most, they testified before a grand jury and maybe congressional oversight committees.

    Grasp at straws much?

    Dave (445e97)

  133. https://youtu.be/scfilRe2sqU?t=36s

    Not that hard to defend, Dave.

    papertiger (c8116c)

  134. Well the directorship was passing through, preventing Colby from giving away all our secrets, (I’ve recommend Latham flowers for mother’ as window on that time) so first colonel berry who was a contributor to Doug Jones, is the ringer mcturtle turned up, now weaver who was the times source on iseman and thats not suspicious.

    narciso (4346c7)

  135. I think Mueller’s team should have consisted of Mike Cernovich, Milo Yiannopoulos, Lucian Wintrich, Jim Hoft, and Roger Stone, and such subordinates as they hired, for a fair, honest, unbiased, non-partisan, impartial investigation.

    nk (dbc370) — 12/7/2017 @ 6:24 pm

    Unbiased as Navan Johnson’s DA, judge and jury.

    Pinandpuller (16b0b5)

  136. Just to head things off-it’s been a while since I’ve seen The Jerk…

    Was it a criminal trial or a civil trial? I know, civil trial, no DA. My bad nerds, if true.

    Pinandpuller (16b0b5)

  137. Colonel Haiku

    Hey if you need to gap spark plugs, Dave will loan you his sense of humor.

    Pinandpuller (16b0b5)

  138. Besides, the real issues are policy ones. Trump supporters and opponents within the conservative/GOP world simply disagree about a lot of policies. For example, immigration.

    Exactly wrong, as far I’m concerned. I was an immigration hawk back when Trump was calling Mitt Romney’s immigration policy “mean-spirited”.

    It’s about values. I could have easily supported any of the other GOP presidential candidates in the 2016 general election (with greater or lesser degrees of enthusiasm – some, of course were far better than others on policy, as to be expected).

    But somebody who insults POWs, mocks the handicapped, verbally and physically abuses women, encourages his supporters to violently beat demonstrators, lacks even the slightest regard for the truth, shows clear signs of mental illness, cozies up to white supremacists, rails against freedom of the press, promises to do clearly unlawful or impossible things, praises murderous dictators, routinely utters dangerously imbecilic ideas, is too lazy to educate themselves about policy issues, etc, etc – no effing way.

    There are some things that just disqualify you outright, as far as I’m concerned. Any one of the above would suffice, but Trump was (and is) guilty of all of them.

    Given that, the fact that I might agree with some of his policy positions is actually problematic, since Donald Trump’s appropriation of any policy or position brings it immediately into disrepute.

    Dave (445e97)

  139. Colonel Haiku

    If you need a Dummy for the HOV lane, Ben Burn’s your guy.

    He’s a bit overqualified actually.

    Pinandpuller (16b0b5)

  140. 142… It’s a two-fer, gap teh plugs and use his needle dick to clean the crud out of the carb jets

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  141. Martin being a “poor, black child” and the theme maintained through the whole movie was what I liked best about it. After Bernadette Peters, of course.

    nk (dbc370)

  142. Dave,

    Then join the club. Some of us have felt the way about past GOP leaders as you do about this one. Politics attracts the worst kind of human, and the higher you go, the worse they get. To me, McCain is so far off the range that I feel he is deranged. He may actually believe that Islamic radicals are great. It is bad enough that so many of the GOP want to use them to weaken regimes in the Middle East and North Africa, but at least they may know that it is a deal with the Devil.

    And this new-found SJW movement within the GOP is likely to hurt you and your side. Can your guys, such as Rubio or Jeb, really withstand the morality test? Do your guys really win in some values fight against a Moore, Trump, or Bernie Sanders? Reagan would have lost to Carter if that was your standard.

    Donaldo (95053d)

  143. Even ABC noticed that Franken showed no remorse.

    He is only sorry that he looks so boorish.

    Neo (d1c681)

  144. He may be clueless enough not to realize you can’t let jihadist scorpions ride them, even the current house in Riyadh has figured that out, despite some of their more murky roots

    narciso (4346c7)

  145. so how did anyone who voted for Trump “sacrifice their principles”?

    we do not live in a country without due process or a Star Chamber. We are also centuries away from the Salem witch trials which were a travesty of true justice. To condemn someone without proof in the public sphere is not justice or “principled”.

    It is evil, corruption & rot.

    communists. fascists and nazis did the same thing to those who they were scared of or who were looked at as inferiors.

    The current Democrats & Republicans, news and entertainment figures who resigned had mountains of specific evidence i.e. photos, pay outs, public admissions of guilt or were simply caught lying under oath.

    I dont care if someone doesn’t like Trump or Moore, didn’t vote for them and voted against them or even hates both of them. But please don’t throw accusations without proof. If anything, Americans who voted for Trump saw through the lies, hatred, bigotry and corruption that was and is afoot against Trump and now Moore.

    Would have been nice if past Democrat or Republican presidents acted on what they promised when they ran for POTUS and won instead of pursuing policies that were effective in crippling many living in the USA. Both parties supported endless warfare & endless regulations, low if any job creation, and open borders and leniency towards illegal immigrants.

    This has been what has caused the deep state to lie, cheat and rob the will power of Americans to take control of their country.

    If Trump is such a cancer on the USA then why has the DNC, the Clintons and the Obamas and their deep state goons in the FBI gone so far to break every law known to man to get Trump kicked out? Are you trying to tell us that they are “principled”? They in fact have no principles and doing to Trump what they have done to any American (such as all of those Tea Party or conservative groups that the IRS shut down) who gets in their way of totalitarian world and American domination.

    cheers & good night. don’t let the deep state vampiric goons bite….

    Where Eagles Dare (8f562c)

  146. @133. =Haiku!= Gesundheit!

    Secret closet cache full of Hoover’s dresses discovered. J. Edgar was into Cassini and Dior just like Jackie!

    DCSCA (797bc0)

  147. Good grief that narrative game from a bitter mob moll and a fmr oss operative who was still bitter Hoover had his agency dismantled. Read Ronald kessler.

    narciso (4346c7)

  148. [McCain] may actually believe that Islamic radicals are great.

    I don’t suppose you have any evidence of that, like, say, a statement by McCain praising Islamic radicals?

    Didn’t think so…

    Everything in my list of complaints against Trump is fact-based. It actually happened. It’s all stuff he said, that exists in a YouTube link somewhere.

    Your entire worldview, on the other hand, is apparently founded on lies, self delusion and hallucination.

    Dave (445e97)

  149. The same folks who were taken in by the Arab springs messengers like the libyan an Syrian taskforce tbf this included fmr den ayotte as well as goose and maverick:

    narciso (4346c7)

  150. Dave,

    We have pictures of McCain with the worst of the Islamic brigades. He praised their efforts. And you know this. Insane McCain.

    This is a fight you cannot win. Elements of both parties and within the establishment nurtured many different flavors of radical Islamic movements over the past few decades. Maybe it was wise to do this against the USSR, but is a terrible idea today. Assad and Khadaffi and the Egyptian military were/are less bad than the alternatives. Trying to break up Turkey is insane. Flooding Europe with refugees is unwise. It is a sorry state of affairs, but Trump is the adult in the room. Hillary, the neocons, and various establishment types are the ones that have gone off the deep end in foreign affairs. If they are this reckless abroad, why should we trust them with maintaining the rule of law or on immigration at home?

    Donaldo (95053d)

  151. Dave,

    By the way, is going ad hominem the TruCon way? Isn’t that what you hate in a Bannon type?

    Donaldo (95053d)

  152. Here’s Dave’s argument condensed down to 3:18 on YouTube.

    https://youtu.be/ROxvT8KKdFw

    papertiger (c8116c)

  153. Byron Allen’s Entertainment Studios is busy breaking out its checkbook.

    The newly formed media company has landed domestic rights to “Chappaquiddick,” a buzzy drama from John Curran about one of the most infamous political scandals in American history. The film sold for $4 million. Allen’s company has committed to spending $16 million on prints and advertising for the film.

    “Chappaquiddick” stars Jason Clarke as Sen. Ted Kennedy and Kate Mara as Mary Jo Kopechne, the campaign aide who died in a car accident on Chappaquiddick Island, Mass. After his car drove off a bridge, Kennedy’s decision to leave the scene of and failure to report the accident to authorities for 10 hours effectively ended his chance of being elected president.

    Clarke is best known for his work on Showtime’s “Brotherhood” and “Zero Dark Thirty.” Mara starred in Netflix’s “House of Cards” and appeared in “The Fantastic Four.” Curran directed “The Painted Veil” and “We Don’t Live Here Anymore.”

    She died in a car accident? Not exactly.

    His car drove off a bridge? Uh, no.

    Source

    Pinandpuller (02496a)

  154. Martin being a “poor, black child” and the theme maintained through the whole movie was what I liked best about it. After Bernadette Peters, of course.
    nk (dbc370) — 12/7/2017 @ 7:38 pm

    I don’t think you could make that movie today. It has to be something like The Blindside.

    Pinandpuller (02496a)

  155. Everything in my list of complaints against Trump is fact-based. It actually happened. It’s all stuff he said, that exists in a YouTube link somewhere.

    Dave (445e97) — 12/7/2017 @ 10:31 pm

    They are either in your Trump Promise Trapper Keeper or on your creepy stalker wall collage and candle altar.

    Pinandpuller (02496a)

  156. Here’s Dave’s argument condensed down to 3:18 on YouTube.

    papertiger (c8116c) — 12/8/2017 @ 12:12 am

    Animal House took place in Tennessee?

    Pinandpuller (02496a)

  157. Lieawatha\Dave\2020

    mg (60b0f7)

  158. 1992 Kramer goes after Calvin Klein re The Ocean

    2017 Calvin Klein goes after Dave re Obsession

    Pinandpuller (02496a)

  159. ow we hear that an attorney who represented the Clinton IT staffer involved in the private server probe is now on the Mueller team.

    122. Dave (445e97) — 12/7/2017 @ 5:41 pm

    Wait, attorneys are accountable for the actions of people they represent?

    Since the whole Clinton defense amounted to total dishonesty, (I know you can disagree about that, but that’s the way many many people see it, not just me, and I’m understating the fraud) it means something here.

    Hillary Clinton wouldn’t trust lawyers who were not fully committed to her, including ethics violations that would be hard to find out about.

    And it has a meaning of “us versus them” too.

    122.

    Sammy Finkelman (e70ce9)

  160. 153. Where Eagles Dare (8f562c) — 12/7/2017 @ 8:53 pm

    To condemn someone without proof in the public sphere is not justice or “principled”.

    That is what is going on, and that os what there is an organized campaign to get people to do, and that can onlly be for the purpose of manufacturing evidence.

    One caveat – it’s not without </i? evidence – it's without sufficient evidence, or without testing the evidence, without diligent inquiry. And declaring something credible doesn’t make it credible, and while different women independetly telling similar stories is a method of corroboration, they have to be independent and they have to be, in some way at least, similar stories. If the process by which they got together is secret, then you can’t say it is independent.

    And political campaigns have a motive. Right now, someone with something like this in his past has a motive to invent and to get outthere, any kind of stories, in the hopes of getting lost in he crowd, or there being a counter reaction before it gets to him.

    It is not: believe, or don’t believe, it is, as in Deuteronomy 17:4, you should make diligent inquiry. Taking the allegation seriously is not the same thing as taking any allegation anyone makes uncritically. And some of these allegations actually aren’t that serious.

    When it comes to elections, we can rest on probabilities for casting a vote, but it must be said they are only probabilities, and it must be important, and what they would do in office is more important than personal faults, especially when the faults are only in the past. There are not an infiniite number of choices. Do we want lobbyists looking around to disqualify people?

    The current Democrats & Republicans, news and entertainment figures who resigned had mountains of specific evidence i.e. photos, pay outs, public admissions of guilt or were simply caught lying under oath.

    Not always, but in most cases they coneded. Most had multiple accusers, who didn’t come forward all at once.

    Right now Leonard Lopate was suspended from WNYC radio 820 am in New York and he said he was called to a meeting without warning and not even told what the accusation was. And we have campus sexual misconduct tribunals. On the other hand there have been case in the past where women reported rapes and were themselves arrested for making a false report, and it turned out they were telling the truth.

    Sammy Finkelman (e70ce9)

  161. Both parties supported endless warfare & endless regulations, low if any job creation, and open borders and leniency towards illegal immigrants.

    This statement boggles my mind. It is not possible to enforce immigraton laws without intense regulations, and most of the laws are irrational. Why woould someone want all laws enforced? Power corrupt and absolute ppower corrupts absolutely. And we’re not talking enforcement – we’re talking about maintaining a situation where a lot of ordinary are in constant violation of the law. And we’re talking about getting people who try to violate immigration killed, and there are no two ways about it.

    Sammy Finkelman (e70ce9)

  162. 33. El Gipper (f1f816) — 12/7/2017 @ 12:34 pm

    People should not be rewarded for coming out with 40-year old stories one month prior to an election date. Just on that basis alone, we should not let these charges derail his election. I don’t agree with that because it is the nearness of an election that motivates people, especially ordinary people, to try to get something out. But it has to come from the individual. It shold not e withheld until theer are almost no other choices. How do we know that the other candidate doesn’t have some secret? In the ase of Doug Jones, we have at least that he would be a puppet, a rubber stamp for maybe not good, or wise, things? Not that Roy Moore is very good in public matters. The proper stance to take is that we’ll let the voters of Alabama make their decision. After the election is over, if Roy Moore is Senator, then we’ll let the wheels of due process grind.

    If any false accudations have ebeen made, I’d like to see them exposed and held to account. And the way for that to happen is for Roy Moore to be elected.

    Moore isn’t the real target. Donal Trump is the target. He’s the real reason that Conyers and Franken are being forced to resign. This clears the decks for the Democrat Party coup to overturn an election, and try to inflame the female voter base for 2018.

    hey can’t overturn teh election. What would happen – hey get Mike pence?

    What they can do is get more and more people to vote for a candidate on grounds other than public policy – and to do so on gthe basis of more and more criteria – which is their whole strategy from beginning to end. And to “disqualify” more and more people, but to do the disqualification when the timing is propitious – after the other party’s primary. And if it hppens to their own candidate put whatever pressure they can, and promis of reward, if they quit, so they substitute someone else even against the rules. And to knock people out of the ring even with lies. And to get people not to use their normal ways of evaluating evidence.

    Tha said, some thing really are too bad to elect someone. But the importance of the office is also afactor – the more important the office, the lower the standard must be because the choice becomes too important and everything, character flaws, character history, corruption and the nature of degree of corruption, and what someone would do must be weighed against the other.

    In 1991, in Louisiana, people voted for a crook for Governor in order not to elect a neo-Nazi/Klansman.

    Sammy Finkelman (e70ce9)

  163. “The Ohr revelation comes not long after word that top FBI agent Peter Strzok was removed from the Mueller investigation for anti-Trump text messages he exchanged with a top FBI lawyer who had also worked for the Mueller probe. Now, with news of Ohr’s contacts with Steele and Simpson, Republicans on Capitol Hill — and perhaps some Democrats, too — will wonder just how far the Obama Justice Department officials went in the effort to stop Trump.”

    http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/byron-york-dossier-author-was-in-contact-with-obama-justice-department/article/2642930?platform=hootsuite

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  164. Sandy Burglar should have did serious time, Col. With Gowdy type mouthpieces representing the republicans I doubt anyone will be making grilled cheese sandwiches on a iron in their cell.

    mg (60b0f7)

  165. Burglar is running with the Devil now…

    Colonel Haiku (7f045b)

  166. Uou know who ran that investigation dontcha.

    narciso (4346c7)

  167. Hillary Clinton wouldn’t trust lawyers who were not fully committed to her, including ethics violations that would be hard to find out about.

    Nobody should trust lawyers who are not fully committed to them. But that works both ways. Don’t look for Friends Of Trump with MAGA hats and Deplorable t-shirts under their button-downs on Mueller’s team.

    nk (dbc370)

  168. James comey, aka inspector dreyfus.

    It appears rosenstein is of a piece, re Christian adams:

    narciso (4346c7)

  169. how did anyone who voted for Trump “sacrifice their principles”?

    Don’t you have have principles before they can be lost?

    Admiral Ben burn (b3d5ab)

  170. 161 Pin – “His car drove off a bridge? Uh, no.”

    Just like all those vehicles in Europe that go Christine and drive into crowds.

    And The Onion could take lessons on how to skewer both sides…….

    http://wwwcdn.printmag.com/wp-content/uploads/vw.jpg

    harkin (bd8145)

  171. The Onion could improve across the board I suppose, but they come across as anti-immrgrante e.g. their skewering of how Mayan pyramid making skills are now applied to the stacking of dishes.

    urbanleftbehind (5eecdb)

  172. whattabout Chappaquiddick?

    But, Gorsuch…

    Admiral Ben burn (b3d5ab)

  173. Oddly they were bought by univision.

    narciso (4346c7)

  174. They are under the umbrella of swarmy hipster formerly Gawker websites (Deadspin, Jezebel, etc.). They have changed leftward, but they were a lot more “bipartisan” in their critiques in the first decade of the 00s.

    urbanleftbehind (5eecdb)

  175. 168.

    Thanks Sammy very good and thorough post as always. I appreciate the analysis.

    “Not always, but in most cases they coneded. Most had multiple accusers, who didn’t come forward all at once.”

    ….and if someone wants to fight the accusations and show they did not commit what they are accused of, I am fine with that. I even give Pres. Clinton the benefit of the doubt until he was caught by his own words & actions. I have never once posted any support for unsubstantiated accusations, on anyone, regardless of beliefs or political affiliations.

    Companies & institutions have ways to investigate and verify, just like FOX and NBC have done, and a host of others before they suspended or fired bad employees. I do not like hearing someone is not told the reasons for a meeting. Again its Salem all over again, as well as what happens in totalitarian regimes.

    “On the other hand there have been case in the past where women reported rapes and were themselves arrested for making a false report, and it turned out they were telling the truth.”

    ..and those cases are the most sad & upsetting.

    In fact I am all for making accusations, even publicly or to the police. i hope any woman or man who experiences a sexual crime can come forward immediately. Unfortunately the system is not perfect but i feel its the best we have for now. Sexual crime victims should go to the police or a hospital immediately if they have been attacked/raped or assaulted.

    The sad thing is if the establishment cultures and institutions in Hollywood, NYC, and DC weren’t so corrupt in their support and coverage of the Clinton scandals for the last 25 years, a whole lot of people could have been better protected & BELIEVED, and those sex criminals could have been brought to justice much sooner, with a lot more sympathy for THE VICTIMS and not the CRIMINALS.

    Clinton was made to look like a martyr. In reality he was a sexual predator and criminal. He should have acted like a man, taken responsibility for his actions and not hurt the entire country for a generation, if not longer. Rep. Bob Livingston of Louisiana publicly challenged President Clinton to resign as well.

    I remember the day Livingston resigned, in Congress…what a sight. He came onto the floor of the House and admitted his infidelity and how he harmed his family, his office, even the country, and then the Democrat caucus yelled and screamed at him to resign. He stood their, let them humiliate him, and then he took up their challenge and resigned for make amends for his weakness, if not crime, of disgracing the US House of Representatives.

    As many said back then, and is still the case even today, it is a punishable offense to cheat on one’s spouse if you are in the military. Politicians seems to think they live by a higher authority then those they “govern”. Even if they are Commander in Chief. Adultery in the military is actually prosecuted under Article 134, which is also known as one of the “General Articles.” of the UUCMJ. Article 134 simply prohibits conduct which is of a nature to bring discredit upon the armed forces, or conduct which is prejudicial to good order and discipline. Its disgustingly coincidental, that Clinton recommended changes to the level of offense for these crimes (after his own actions were coming to light) , which Republican led Congress rejected. Then Pres. Bush got Congress to agree with Clinton’s changes for the UCMJ. The same Bush who once called Clinton “the brother from another mother.” Sad but true how both establishments and their leaders are really just different fingers on the same hand.

    sorry I digress…

    Going back to Livingston’s public resignation:

    And what did the Democrat caucus do in front of the cameras,for all the world to see? They marched over to the White House, like good little weak-willed zealots and brain-washed zombies, “to stand by their man”, Bubba.

    ….and that is another big reason why victims are looked down on for the last 20-25 years, and why they are afraid to come forward.

    so terribly sad.

    PS

    I posted on another thread more proof that the establishment more and more shows the “different parties” are just different fingers on the same hand.

    And THEY (meaning those in the DNC & RINOs who do not want Moore anywhere near the US Senate because he doesn’t support their policies or morality) twant to throw made up dirt at Moore all the way up until election night. Now we have this enlightening revelation:

    https://bigleaguepolitics.com/exclusive-former-jeb-bush-staffer-planted-anti-roy-moore-coverage-washington-post/

    again, just sad how these people make crap up and go after others they feel threatened by. And this is one person they are afraid of. Look at what the IRS did to al of those tea party groups. Now this. A Republican operative works with a Democrat owned newspaper and PRESTO! instant unsubstantiated scandal.

    I may not agree with everything Moore says or does but I don’t need to make up false accusations to show my disagreement with some one. i simply find reprehensible if not criminal.

    Where Eagles Dare (8f562c)

  176. IIons the only one of the stirs that Dorset make me reflexively gag

    narciso (d1f714)

  177. 168. 184. Where Eagles Dare (8f562c) — 12/9/2017 @ 6:54 am

    hanks Sammy very good and thorough post as always. I appreciate the analysis.//

    …I even give Pres. Clinton the benefit of the doubt until he was caught by his own words & actions.

    I went by whether it was logical or not. The way the whole thing about Monica Lewinsky came out it was almost certain it was true.

    The irony was that Bill Clinton was getting into trouble over such a small thing.

    President Clinton had made the tactical mistake of exiling both Linda Tripp and Monica Lewinsky, both of whom has stories to tell that he wanted them to keep quiet about, to the exact same office!

    That way (exiling them but not firing them) he thought he had a hold on them. Linda Tripp knew something of the chronology of Vincent Foster and that he looked not so good when he left the White House, and she had also seen Kathleen Willey leave the president’s office.

    President Clinton didn’t want Monica Lewinsky talking about their relationship, and he led her to believe other people had exiled her and they would get back together again at some time – he kept her hoping so she would not talk.

    Linda Tripp didn’t like the way Monica Lewinsky was obsessing over Bill Clinton when he was stringing her along and she wanted to break it up once and for all, and put an end to it – she thought Monica Lewinsky was like a groupie – and she informed Paula Jones’ lawyers indirectly – then refused to lie about it.

    Sammy Finkelman (63d78b)

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