Patterico's Pontifications

5/17/2017

Special Counsel Takes Over Russia Investigation

Filed under: General — Patterico @ 6:12 pm

There you have it.

Former Trump aides Michael Flynn and Paul Manafort have emerged as key figures in the FBI’s investigation into Russian campaign interference, which has just been taken over by a special counsel, four law enforcement officials told NBC News.

Officials say multiple grand jury subpoenas and records requests have been issued in connection with the two men during the past six months in the ongoing probe into whether the Trump campaign colluded with Russian attempts to influence the election, an inquiry that will now be overseen by former FBI Director Robert Mueller.

The FBI, with the help of the Treasury Department, the CIA and other agencies, is examining evidence of possible contacts, money transfers and business relationships between a variety of Trump associates and Russian officials, the sources say. The investigation goes well beyond Flynn, Manafort and a possible American connection, to include how Russian intelligence services carried out the campaign of fake news and leaking hacked emails that intelligence officials say was meant to hurt Hillary Clinton and benefit Donald Trump.

Have at it.

229 Responses to “Special Counsel Takes Over Russia Investigation”

  1. “. . . fake news and leaking hacked emails that intelligence officials say was meant to hurt Hillary Clinton and benefit Donald Trump.”

    Fake news itself, as intelligence officials who have neither the competence nor jurisdiction to determine what was meant to hurt who. Other than offering their own partisan political opinions as to the effect of the information on the voting public.

    Proud Prolifer (51f225)

  2. Trump hasn’t experienced anything close to this kind of bitch-slapping since the banks ordered him to live on an allowance back in the 90’s– or Ol’Dead Fred packed him off to military school. The SC should put him on notice that his WH is ‘on probation.’ Helluva civics lesson, Captain.

    But what a show!!

    “Well, as of this moment, they’re on DOUBLE SECRET PROBATION!” – Dean Wormer [John Vernon] ‘Animal House’ 1978

    DCSCA (797bc0)

  3. It’s like we never learn from Libby, delay, Perry, Paxton, walker, ted Stevens mcdonnell, the huntress, and Conrad black the process is the punishment, what legerdemain Is required to ring the bell is immaterial

    narciso (ae786b)

  4. Much ado about nothing. They’ll get Flynn for lying to someone and that will be it.

    Kevin M (25bbee)

  5. If you think this is the endgame then you’re not paying attention

    narciso (ae786b)

  6. The investigation alone will further taint Trump’s credibility and erode his already niggardly political capital. Everything he tries to do will be an uphill battle. Don’t expect any more Betsy DeVoses (good) or Neil Gorsuches (bad).

    nk (dbc370)

  7. Let us just hope there’s no premature leaks forthcoming from this investigation – we know how the Dems and the MSM feel about things being said about investigations before all the facts are in.

    Jerryskids (16a4d5)

  8. And yet still no evidence.

    Even the obstruction charge is idiotic because Comey needed to report it to DOJ to make it so.

    All Comey is going to say is “he made me uncomfortable but I did not think he was interfering”

    Don’t be shocked if Democrats end up get ensnared in this moreso than Republicans.

    Blah Blah (44eaa0)

  9. Remember what plouffe said during the capaign, ‘we must not only defeat trump, we must destroy him’

    narciso (ae786b)

  10. This is the same mo from 2007, comey’s sudden attack of conscience re events three years before.

    narciso (ae786b)

  11. That Comey “memo” is like a game of liar’s poker. Does Trump have tapes? Is Comey confident enough to present his memo under oath and risk a perjury trap? Will it go the way of the Susan Rice “illegal unmasking”?

    nk (dbc370)

  12. @ nk (#11): How would the perjury trap play out? I’m not following.

    Beldar (fa637a)

  13. Is it real or is it like the mythical Tom white memo that Leopold claimed existed like a crystal skull, re enron.

    narciso (ae786b)

  14. Breaking tonight– NYT reports Flynn informed Trump team on January 4 he was under investigation by FBI for Turkey issues– and Trump went ahead and hired him as NSA anyway.

    Captain, we’ve got those Yellowstain Blues…

    “And the hits just keep on coming…” – Lt. Daniel Kaffee [Tom Cruise] ‘A Few Good Men’ 1992

    DCSCA (797bc0)

  15. Comey is not the subject, yet he should be along with clapped and Brennan, for putting coward that bogus dhs report and the dossier, mail fraud maybe, at the very least

    narciso (ae786b)

  16. questioning reality is a pretty natural reaction to this knucklehead being President, narciso

    Dustin (ba94b2)

  17. We are a deeply unserious country if we allow this carp to matter.
    Maybe in the nuclear fallout over some western city we will reflect on that

    narciso (ae786b)

  18. Beldar @ 12. Before a grand jury, Congressional committee, or in a deposition, Comey relates the content of his memo under oath. The foundation as to place, time and persons present is pinned down. The White House produces tapes that show that the conversation he swore to did not happen.

    nk (dbc370)

  19. @16. And the day started out so sunny: Good morning graduates of the USCGA. Congratulations. Now let me talk about me…

    “D’oh!” – Homer Simpson [Dan Castellaneta] ‘The Simpsons’ Fox TV

    DCSCA (797bc0)

  20. And if Hillary had been elected the entire influence futures sale AKA the Clinton Family Foundation would be completely ignored by the MSM.

    harkin (e0ff3c)

  21. Of course they are all spectre board members.

    narciso (ae786b)

  22. He was writing of the “independent counsel” Godzilla, not the current “special counsel” position, but I still am reminded tonight of the words of Justice Scalia, dissenting in Morrision v. Olson (1988):

    That is what this suit is about. Power. The allocation of power among Congress, the President, and the courts in such fashion as to preserve the equilibrium the Constitution sought to establish — so that “a gradual concentration of the several powers in the same department,” Federalist No. 51, p. 321 (J. Madison), can effectively be resisted. Frequently an issue of this sort will come before the Court clad, so to speak, in sheep’s clothing: the potential of the asserted principle to effect important change in the equilibrium of power is not immediately evident, and must be discerned by a careful and perceptive analysis. But this wolf comes as a wolf.

    But hey, for tomorrow’s news cycle, we’ll have the leaks from Senators of Rosenstein’s testimony about all this stuff!

    Beldar (fa637a)

  23. There is a logic to this,sadly

    http://acecomments.mu.nu/?post=369807

    narciso (ae786b)

  24. @ nk (#18): Thanks, that was clear and I understand now!

    Beldar (fa637a)

  25. Bah, that ought to have read “Morrison,” sloppy proof-reading because I was trying to spell “Olson” right.

    Beldar (fa637a)

  26. And the left memorized Scalia’s defense just as they took Nixon s argument as there own. Maybe judicial watch is left to turn up real evidence.

    narciso (ae786b)

  27. Like I said in the previous thread there are some oficiales that are meant to be untouchable and others that are not.

    narciso (ae786b)

  28. Is the charge still obstruction of Justice?

    I know a guy who is dead to rights guilty, committed the crime on CSPAN. [YouTube]

    The penalties are fines, forfeitures, and not more than ten years, in the Federal Pen.

    Is that ten years for each count or just the one set of ten to cover the whole raft of sin?

    papertiger (c8116c)

  29. papertiger, your link (#28) is not to any of the many federal obstruction of justice statutes; the statute you linked is about unauthorized disclosure of classified information, which is a whole ‘nuther thing. You did manage to find Title 18; good for you. Re obstruction of justice, look here, for a start. Generally statutory punishments are on an “each offense” basis, but stacking them depends on federal sentencing guidelines, charging discretion, and a bunch of other factors.

    Beldar (fa637a)

  30. Quite true. Quite true. Flying by the seat of my rompers. How did that get in there?

    papertiger (c8116c)

  31. Another in the annuls of never believe a stinking word they say:

    The notion that I am serving for ‘the money’ or a ‘paycheck’ is absurd. As a campaign manager, I made a fraction of what other consultants have made on unsuccessful presidential campaigns. Then I walked away from dozens of opportunities for millions of dollars, and instead walked into the White House. I would do it again.
    It is a privilege to assist President Trump in the White House, just as it was during the campaign. I know him, I respect him, I believe in him, and I am confident in his capacity to be a transformative and successful President.”

    -Kelly Anne Conway in response to Foulmika Brzezinski, and “Which way’s the wind” Blow Scarborough, suggesting Conway doesn’t like or respect President Trump.

    papertiger (c8116c)

  32. This could end up fabulously for DJT (and us). There really is great opportunity here.

    The biggest potential avenue this might could go is to a light shining on Obama’s illegal end-around using British intel to surveil the DJT/GOP campaigns. It will certainly get to the unmasking issue around Flynn.

    Of course, the preternatural liar DJT could easily revert to his SOP and lie – not even needing to do so!

    Ed from SFV (3400a5)

  33. Shirley you can’t be serious, if Mueller drifts off the designated course, you know what the requisite template will be, racist, sexist, et al.

    narciso (ae786b)

  34. The only prosecution coming out of this investigation will be over some procedural violation. Somebody will have an inexact recollection of some years-old conversation and be indicted for perjury.
    The media and Patterico will scream that this is ABSOLUTE PROOF that Trump is a russian agent.

    Brian Epps (d5cd81)

  35. CrowdStrike, although not yet profitable, is aiming to go into the black in the next fiscal year[maybe], according to a spokesperson. The company declined to reveal its revenue figures, but said that it has an annual revenue run rate—a fuzzy yardstick that extrapolates sales for the year based on current figures—exceeding $100 million for 2017.
    Since raising a prior $100 million in a round led by CapitalG in July 2015,

    Very successful pan handlers. Like Jesse Jackson without the color.

    papertiger (c8116c)

  36. Hopefully, tommorrow they announce 4 more special counsels.

    1. Investigating the FBI’s handling of Hillary’s email server.
    2. Investigating the IRS treatment of the Tea Party.
    3. Investigating the Clinton Foundation’s acceptance of large gifts from foreign governments.
    4. Investigating certain FISA warrants and the handling of the information acquired.

    Kevin M (25bbee)

  37. I want the republican party dead. Whatever you do Trump end the republican party.
    Love it when this country shows who the pathetic losers will be. I hope the rooskies mess with the electrical grid, so the pathetic hacks in d.c. will die, quickly.

    mg (31009b)

  38. Trump has plenty of “buffahs”.

    Pinandpuller (d16daf)

  39. R.I.P. Chris Cornell, singer/songwriter/rhythm guitarist for Soundgarden and Audioslave

    Aaaaaaaaaand 2017 now officially SUCKS

    Icy (b7d04b)

  40. Chris Cornell — “Superunknown”

    For my money, one of the best hard rock vocal performances of all time.

    Icy (b7d04b)

  41. Dennis Kucinich has more guts than all republicans put together.
    Kucinich/2020

    mg (31009b)

  42. This is taking a turn toward the surreal.

    Putin offers transcript to prove Trump did not pass Russia secrets

    It’s not that Putin would offer to clear things up that generates the strangeness (although that is kind of strange), but rather that the Democrat media uniformly selected to misreport the character of the help Putin offered.

    Putin didn’t offer a transcript which would be easily altered and therefore wouldn’t prove anything. What Putin offered is a recording, a voice recording of the meeting between Lavrov and Trump.

    “If the US administration wants, we are ready to give the recordings of these conversations to the United States Senate and Congress. I am surprised that these people are destabilising their country using such anti-Russian slogans. So either they do not understand that they are hurting their own country, so they’re crazy, or they do understand what they are doing, so they are dangerous and nasty people.’‘

    Why do you suppose they got that wrong over and over and over again?

    papertiger (c8116c)

  43. 48. But in the Reuters story:

    http://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-trump-putin-idUSKCN18D1EA

    it says…

    A Kremlin aide, Yuri Ushakov, later told reporters that Moscow had a written record of the conversation, not an audio recording.

    It doesn’t matter too much.

    If it is word for word, McMaster and others will know if something has bene left out or added, and nobody will accept Putin’s version in that case.

    I think Sean Spicer said he wasn’t aware of the meeting being recorded by the Russians.

    Anything that gets even close to word for word means it was recorded.

    Sammy Finkelman (be6791)

  44. Officials say multiple grand jury subpoenas and records requests have been issued in connection with the two men during the past six months

    The problem here is we don’t need to know whether the two men go money from the Russian government, because we know taht aklready (although Manafort may not have known exactly where his money was coming from, and it wass for specified non-Trump favors anyway.)

    We know the quid. We know the quid wth Bill and Hillary Clinton too.

    We need to know, in both cases, if there was a quo. What if anything did they do in return.

    The question of whether there was collusion by the Trump campaign with Russia is entirely the wrong question, because it is exceedingly unlikely, and even to ask it is to show bias. The question is whether individuals in the Trump campaign or close to Trump, colludded with Russia and/or anyone else to influence what Trump said to the advantage of Russia.

    Sammy Finkelman (be6791)

  45. There was a dossier compiled by former Brtish MI6 agent Christopher Steele who was secrettly working for Fusion GPS in Washington, which in turn was probably hired, at the time Steele was taken on, by Democrats, that gave an explanation of the alleged hold the Russians had on
    Trump, but everyone seems to agree it’s completely nonsense and good portions of it are
    provably false.

    His disinformation probably came from high levels in the Russian government, and they thought he was still working for MI6 or for British conservatives, and tghat will explain why they mmay have seemed to be undermining their candidate.

    Sammy Finkelman (be6791)

  46. It’s the zinoviev letter in reverse, we’ve been through this, or the Niger letters that were probably put together by dgse

    narciso (ae786b)

  47. i love how many buffahs President Trump has

    happyfeet (28a91b)

  48. poor cowardly torture victim slut John McCain keeps faking orgasms

    but you can tell he’s faking cause he sounds so desperate and weird

    #theydidsomethingtohisbrain

    happyfeet (28a91b)

  49. B.I.H. Roger Ailes

    A legacy of leg lights, lipgloss and news poodles

    DCSCA (797bc0)

  50. papertiger,

    It’s pretty hilarious that Putin would call anyone nasty after murdering all those journalists.

    If he’s against it, it’s not a bad sign.

    Dustin (ba94b2)

  51. Today everyone loves Mueller and praises his independence and integrity. Fast forward to whatever conclusion(s) he reaches after whatever time it takes and however focused or far-reaching his efforts to follow the facts. Can’t we already write the headlines after the Special Counsel delivers his report to the DAG? Half will praise his conclusion. Half will attack it. All will demand more details of how do you justify reaching that conclusion.

    The Deputy Attorney General had one job once the AG recused himself from matters affecting the 2016 presidential campaigns. Hiring somebody else do his job demonstrates his unfitness for the position he occupies. Much like the criminal leakers, if you can’t honor your oath or do your job step aside and let someone who will do the job.

    BTW, Mueller would have been a better choice for AG than Sessions and we probably wouldn’t be here.

    crazy (d3b449)

  52. “Rarely in the last half-century have so many elite conservatives and intellectuals been so estranged both from a Republican administration and from those who voted for it—neither have they become so animated in their antipathy and disgust for a sitting president.

    During the 2016 election, and the current Trump presidency, there have appeared four implicit tenets to the conservative “Never Trump” position that, we are supposed to understand, justified not voting for him, actively opposing him, or voting for Hillary Clinton:

    1) The character flaws of the inexperienced and uncouth Trump would eventually nullify any positive agenda that he might enact; not opposing such a boorish character undermines one’s reputation as an empirical and fair-minded conservative;

    2) Trump is a liberal wolf in conservative sheep’s clothing; at any given moment he will break his campaign promises and revert to his 1980s New York Democratic self. Or, Trump has no ideology and is an empty vessel willing to embrace almost any ideology he finds efficacious to his ambitions of the moment. Either way, he will do the conservative cause real damage;

    3) Trump’s base supporters, while not irredeemables and deplorables, are prone to nationalist extremism and embrace certain prejudices that are antithetical to conservative values;

    4) Clinton’s progressive agendas would not do as much damage to the nation as would Trump’s uncouth character. Thus the defeat of the Republicans in 2016, or the failure of an ensuing Trump presidency, would be cathartic. Only a Trump implosion would teach Republicans never again to allow such an untried and dangerous populist nationalist without political experience to highjack their party, while cleansing the movement of some odious figures and unpalatable ideas that have no business in it—or both.

    How true have these nightmares so far played out?”

    http://amgreatness.com/2017/05/17/nightmares-realities-never-trump/

    Colonel Haiku (d3e242)

  53. “The childish response of Democrats — and ‘NeverTrump’ Republicans — to the 2016 election has done more damage to American politics and institutions than any foreign meddling could do.”

    — Glenn Reynolds, Instapundit

    Colonel Haiku (d3e242)

  54. You are quite a piece of… work, DCSCA.

    Colonel Haiku (d3e242)

  55. Today everyone loves Mueller and praises his independence and integrity. Fast forward to whatever conclusion(s) he reaches after whatever time it takes and however focused or far-reaching his efforts to follow the facts. Can’t we already write the headlines after the Special Counsel delivers his report to the DAG? Half will praise his conclusion. Half will attack it. All will demand more details of how do you justify reaching that conclusion.

    The Deputy Attorney General had one job once the AG recused himself from matters affecting the 2016 presidential campaigns. Hiring somebody else do his job demonstrates his unfitness for the position he occupies. Much like the criminal leakers, if you can’t honor your oath or do your job step aside and let someone who will do the job.

    BTW, Mueller would have been a better choice for AG than Sessions and we probably wouldn’t be here.

    crazy (d3b449) — 5/18/2017 @ 6:23 am

    Threadwinning comment right there.

    But this is an improvement over the DAG from a Trump fan point of view, right?

    Dustin (ba94b2)

  56. Thank you Dustin, but I don’t think so. Trump fan, Trump critic, Trump agnostic – it doesn’t matter. IMO Government officials need to do their jobs or let someone else do it. Period. Can you imagine Patterico, Beldar, Shipwreckedcrew, etc taking the job as DAG and then ducking the responsibility of the position because it was easier to let somebody else take the political heat off of them? I can’t.

    crazy (d3b449)

  57. 11. nk (dbc370) — 5/17/2017 @ 7:00 pm

    That Comey “memo” is like a game of liar’s poker. Does Trump have tapes?

    The original Comey leak that prompted Trump to make the insinuation about having tapes was not about what’s in the memo about Trump hoping Comey could see his way to dropping the case against Flynn. (Which, interestingly enough, has not had its full text revealed, but only a partial texc combined with a spin to imply hat the investigationn Trump was talking about was what’s in the news now.)

    But it was about Trump having supposedly asked Comey for his loyalty. (Trump has since both denied this and offered his own spin about what loyalty might mean)

    I don’t know about Comey, who probably won’t take the risk in any case, but one person probably
    now convinced that Trump has tapes is Vladimir Putin.

    Sammy Finkelman (be6791)

  58. California, Becerra to Holder is a more egregious and far less noble example.

    urbanleftbehind (0f528b)

  59. 14. DCSCA (797bc0) — 5/17/2017 @ 7:06 pm

    Breaking tonight– NYT reports Flynn informed Trump team on January 4 he was under investigation by FBI for Turkey issues– and Trump went ahead and hired him as NSA anyway.

    He probably spun it as technical, and besides what would Turkey cause him to do?

    Breaking last night..

    http://www.mcclatchydc.com/news/politics-government/white-house/article151149647.html

    Flynn stopped military plan Turkey opposed – after being paid as its agent

    Explanation: The Obama Administration had decided to arm some Syrian Kurdish group in order to faciliate the taking of Raqqa (the capital of ISIS, or ISIL, as Obama called it)

    But it was only 10 days before the inauguration and all or most of the arms would actually get to the Kurds after January 20.

    So they called Michael Flynn to make sure this was OK with Trump.

    Flynn cancelled that arms transfer.

    It is not known whether he talked to Trump about that.

    Flynn probably knew that Turkey opposed this, and not just from Susan Rice and other Arministation officials, but he’d been talking to ambassadorrs and so on.

    What may not be clear is if Flynn did this because he was taking instuctions from Turkey, or on spec.

    P.S. In the last week or two, Trump decided to arm these Kurds after all.

    Sammy Finkelman (be6791)

  60. 57. crazy (d3b449) — 5/18/2017 @ 6:23 am

    The Deputy Attorney General had one job once the AG recused himself from matters affecting the 2016 presidential campaigns. Hiring somebody else do his job demonstrates his unfitness for the position he occupies.

    He does have his reason: Trump was dealing directly with a subordinate of his: The Director of the FBI – and now there was this accusation that Trump had given him directions about an investigation.

    Appointing a special counsel would insulate the investigation from the president as after that, he wouldn’t dare to talk to the Director of the FBI about that, or ask him any questions.

    Also, maybe, that would make getting an FBI Director nominated and confirmed easier as now someone the Democrats presumaably would accept as impartial was in charge.

    Sammy Finkelman (be6791)

  61. Janet Reno steadfastedly refuwed to appoint a special counsel to look into Bill Clinton’s 1996 campaign. That’s maybe the difference between Clinton and Trump.

    Sammy Finkelman (be6791)

  62. On this note, the Democrats have not won. The Republicans have not won. This is a sad day in America. The only faction winning, and simultaneously laughing at us, are the Russians. Creating chaos and strife was their goal. Putin has won, this round. He may have won this battle, but not the war. We can’t let him win the war.

    Tillman (a95660)

  63. Sheeesh, that would be tge one war most able bodied American men would conscientiously object to. Some out of fear of a formidable adversary others out of not wanting to go against a white Christian nation.

    urbanleftbehind (0f528b)

  64. Re: 67… May 18, 1998… “President Clinton said today that reported political campaign contributions from China to the Democrats had not influenced his foreign policy, but he welcomed further investigation into decisions that made it easier for China to launch American satellites and possibly obtain sensitive technology.”

    http://www.nytimes.com/1998/05/18/us/clinton-says-chinese-money-did-not-influence-us-policy.html

    Colonel Haiku (d3e242)

  65. @65. Reuters is reporting at least fourteen additional meetings w/Rooskies previously undisclosed, Sammy.

    DCSCA (797bc0)

  66. @60 –Haiku! Gesundheit.

    Hold your pickle; wash your lettuce, Special Councels don’t upset us.

    DCSCA (797bc0)

  67. Sammy, the FBI still needs a new Director. The President still makes the nomination. The Senate will still advise and consent. The nominee will still be grilled about potential conflicts and independence. Once confirmed the Director and subordinates will either serve two masters (DAG and Mueller) or Mueller’s investigatory team will be walled off from the rest of the bureau leading to 2 DOJ’s, 2 FBI’s etc. If anybody can navigate the mess Mueller probably can but I’m not seeing the conflicts that Rosenstein, other US attorney’s or litigating divisions of DOJ possess rendering them incapable of handling this in-house and therefore accountable. Reno, Holder and Lynch’s decisions to refuse demands for the appointment of special counsels made them and the presidents they served accountable. Right or wrong Congress and the public were able to hold them accountable.

    The Special Counsel will come and go disrupting the business of Washington and when it’s over we’ll be just as polarized about his decisions as we are today. Ducking the chain of command is ducking responsibility. Meanwhile the executive will be under the same cloud of suspicion appointment of a special counsel is hoped to addressed. Some will like this. Some won’t. That’s politics but the view that somehow an outside counsel operating outside the chain of command is better only holds if the outside counsel reaches the “right” conclusion which is in the eye of the beholder.

    If the extraordinary circumstances Rosenstein relies on to appoint a Special Counsel are anything other than political pressure I don’t see it. Big jobs have big responsibility. If Rosenstein didn’t believe what he wrote in his Comey memo or didn’t like the way it was used in terminating the guy Rosenstein said couldn’t be trusted to restore faith in the FBI then he’s not up to the job.

    I thought he was. Apparently I was wrong.

    crazy (d3b449)

  68. Desperation has set in. “Conservative elitist and intellectual” Bill Kristol is all over the teevee this AM “whispering” the secret words: President Pence.

    DCSCA (797bc0)

  69. that’s amusing man of mystery, they really have to credit quantico screenwriters,

    narciso (d1f714)

  70. AP reports Flynn will defy Senate Intel Panel and not honor subpoena.

    DCSCA (797bc0)

  71. Bill Kristol is “little people” same as the rest of us.

    All this stuff is doing is showing that the pezzonovantes do whatever they want with our government and our country and all we can do is talk about it. First Amendment, proles! Be grateful you live in a country with Freedom of Speech!

    *Pezzonovante: Big shot. From Italian. Literally “90-piece”, the 90mm field artillery cannon.

    nk (dbc370)

  72. How true have these nightmares so far played out?”

    1. True. Playing out before our eyes right now.

    2. It was obvious from the start that Trump is ideology-free (and almost idea-free). It’s outside circumstances that caused him to promote some conservative values.

    3. True, if you define conservative values as small government values. If you define conservative values as authoritarian, “law and order” values, then Trump’s base are real conservatives, and libertarians are not. This was also something that was obvious from the start.

    4. Speculative prediction, and it’s far too soon to see how accurate it will turn out to be. The GOP could in the wake of a Trump collapse double down on nationalist authoritarianism.

    kishnevi (bb03e6)

  73. If the extraordinary circumstances Rosenstein relies on to appoint a Special Counsel are anything other than political pressure I don’t see it.

    Then you need glasses. Two weeks on the job and Trump threw him under the bus with the Comey excuses. Rosenstein wasn’t going to let his integrity be sold so cheaply. Payback’s a bitch– especially when it’s perfectly legal.

    DCSCA (797bc0)

  74. WSJ:

    The classified information that President Donald Trump shared with Russian officials last week came from an Israeli source described by multiple U.S. officials as the most valuable source of information on external plotting by Islamic State.

    So he burned our best source of info on ISIS. But her emails!

    Spartacvs (2db708)

  75. Little people: From Blade Runner. Except that in our government of the people by the people and for the people, the cops are little people too.

    nk (dbc370)

  76. the folks behind greys anatomy went there, except it was the house speaker who was in the pay of the Russians

    narciso (d1f714)

  77. Spartacus @82 The Washington Post burned the source.

    nk (dbc370)

  78. When you are to the left of Camille Paglia, and less sane than Dennis Kucinich, maybe you need to look into the mirror.

    DCSCA – you out yourself as the cretin I suspected all along.

    Steven Malynn (4c1400)

  79. At his presser moments ago:

    “I just want people to know we can walk and chew gum at the same time.” – Paul Ryan (R-WI) Speaker of the U.S. House of Representatives.

    Pathetic.

    DCSCA (797bc0)

  80. nk:

    The Washington Post burned the source.

    Trump blabbed to the post too, who knew?

    Spartacvs (2db708)

  81. @86. When you are to the left of Camille Paglia, and less sane than Dennis Kucinich, maybe you need to look into the mirror. Then do so, Steverino– A budgie cage usually has two. You’ve got those Yellowstain Blues…

    Last night the Captain gave us a sane and measured response. Less than 12 hours later, he was tweeting out witchery.

    “Doctor. You have testified that the following symptoms exist… Rigidity of personality, feelings of persecution, unreasonable suspicion, a mania for perfection, and a neurotic certainty that he is always in the right. Doctor isn’t there one psychiatric term for this illness?” – Barney Greenwald [Jose Ferrer] ‘The Caine Mutiny’ 1954

    DCSCA (797bc0)

  82. AP:

    A lawyer for fired National Security Adviser Michael Flynn has informed the Senate Intelligence Committee he will not honor its subpoena for private documents. That’s according to the panel’s chairman, Republican Sen. Richard Burr of North Carolina.

    https://apnews.com/0bd8cb2c420448ab91464fabbd19d705?utm_campaign=SocialFlow&utm_source=Twitter&utm_medium=AP

    Spartacvs (2db708)

  83. @81. IOW political payback. Kinda my point. I expected better from Rosenstein.

    crazy (d3b449)

  84. 67. 70. The reason Bill Clinton spoke about that was:

    The New York Times reported on Friday that Johnny Chung, the former fund-raiser, had told Federal investigators that a large part of the nearly $100,000 he gave the Democrats in the 1996 campaign came from China’s People’s Liberation Army through Liu Chaoying, a Chinese lieutenant colonel and aerospace executive. The Democratic National Committee subsequently returned the money to Mr. Chung, who began cooperating with investigators after he pleaded guilty in March to campaign-related bank and tax fraud.

    That wasn’t the only contribution coming from China.

    Now what President Clinton did that people tried to connect to this thing was he removed authority for approving some exports from he state Department to the Commerce Depatment, which then allowed satellites to be launched in China atop Chinese rockets. But there could be a bunch of other favors.

    Sandy Burglar said there was no risk here of passing restricted technology on to the Chinese military because the satellites were ”put into a black box” under the supervision of the Department of Defense ”and taken to China, put on top of the missile and blown up into the sky.”

    Sammy Finkelman (be6791)

  85. Spartcvs @88: Disingenuousness butters no parsnips. Eisenhower probably shared some military intelligence with Zhukov as well as Montgomery in 1945. I doubt if any newspapers published it, on the pretext that he should not have, thereby informing the Germans too.

    nk (dbc370)

  86. 65. 72. DCSCA Are those 14 meetings, meetings between Mike Flynn and Russians before the inaguration? Between different people associated with Trump and Russian officials? Are they all meetings or is that both meetings and telephone calls? Do you have a link to the article?

    Sammy Finkelman (be6791)

  87. “The classified information that President Donald Trump shared with Russian officials last week came from an Israeli source described by multiple U.S. officials as the most valuable source of information on external plotting by Islamic State.”

    Why did so many people know who this most valuable source on external plotting by the Islamic state is.

    It seems to me the need to know principle has gone out the door.

    Davod (f3a711)

  88. Before 1999, it was a real special prosecutor, whom the attroney general did not appoint, but 3 federal judges did, but Patrick Fitzgerald was de facto completely independent, too.

    Janet Reno, who had probably been Bill Clinton’s secret first choice all the time, appointing all kinds of independent counsels against Clinton cabinet members, but when it came to the most important one, she refused. She also restricted the jurisdiction of one of the otgher counsels when he got too close to Clinton.

    The first one she appointed, in 1993, during a time when the special prosecutor law had lapsed, was an attempt to pull all investigations of Bill Clinton into the hands of alawyer whom Bill Clinton cold trust, Robert B. Fiske Jr. She and Clinton probably expected that when the law was renewed, the judges would ratify her decision, but they didn’t, instead relplacing him with Kenneth Starr.

    Sammy Finkelman (be6791)

  89. B.I.H. Roger Ailes

    This is why you can’t have good Karma, DCSCAT

    Kevin M (25bbee)

  90. 95. Davod (f3a711) — 5/18/2017 @ 9:16 am

    Why did so many people know who this most valuable source on external plotting by the Islamic state is.

    It could be they are lying, you know.

    Sammy Finkelman (be6791)

  91. @94. It was a TV report– go to Reuters site for details.
    ______

    Now Pence’s honesty and/or competence is in question about what he knew about Flynn. He ran Trump’s transition team and the team was made aware of the flaws in question.

    DCSCA (797bc0)

  92. It’s not just DCSCA being a crass ashhole.

    Shame on FOX News.

    Roger Ailes died in his sleep last night. His widow breaks the news to Drudge Report.

    That’s how sponged down FOX NEWS CHANNEL is by the onslaught of the femi-nazis.

    papertiger (c8116c)

  93. @97. Have not just good, but great, delicious, fresh-brewed Karma every morning!

    DCSCA (797bc0)

  94. @100- ?????? Speak for yourself, Cottonelle.

    Fox folks are crying crock tears if you’d listen instead of watching pretty legs cross. To a stocking and pantleg, they say: “He was a wonderful man- he hired me.” In other words, “So sad- now lets talk about me.”

    Jaysus, it’s too early for you to be drinking.

    DCSCA (797bc0)

  95. @103. “Back at the ranch” we’d call it a traffic accident. In Times Square, it’s an international incident?!

    DCSCA (797bc0)

  96. DCSCA:

    Now Pence’s honesty and/or competence is in question about what he knew about Flynn. He ran Trump’s transition team and the team was made aware of the flaws in question.

    His competency is not in question…..he’s never had any. His honesty speaks for itself in light of the revelations about Flynn and his recent public defense of the Comey firing.

    Spartacvs (2db708)

  97. No reports of “Allah Akbar”? Then it may just be a Roman driver (as in Rome, Italy, where they do drive on the sidewalks from time to time).

    kishnevi (bb03e6)

  98. @106. WNBC: driver, 26, history of DUIs, under arrest. It’s a frigging traffic accident in NYC. Film at 11.

    DCSCA (797bc0)

  99. well that’s always possible, the rest of the story, that reuters underplays

    https://twitter.com/GPIngersoll/status/865176549569552384

    narciso (d1f714)

  100. It’s too bad you can’t get a job after being canned by Fox (not entirely true), but that’s an indictment of the democrat media, not FNC.
    They don’t owe you a retirement package on account of a wink in the hallway, sweetheart.

    papertiger (c8116c)

  101. nevertrump lurvs them some slurpy propaganda sluts

    yeah that’ll end well for them

    happyfeet (a037ad)

  102. well that’s not exactly true, paula zahn, who had an interesting subsequent career path, and kiran chetry were subsequently hired, but brainslug implantation was required,

    narciso (d1f714)

  103. A waste only for the fact that a “Cincinnati Bengal” in the parlance of describing external features – Gretchen Carlson – brought him down.

    urbanleftbehind (5eecdb)

  104. @111. The criteria for on air talent at 1211 6th was to turn down the volume and watch how you looked— and crossed your legs. Teevee is a very visual medium.

    DCSCA (797bc0)

  105. His honesty speaks for itself in light of the revelations about Flynn and his recent public defense of the Comey firing.

    Spartacvs (2db708) — 5/18/2017 @ 9:36 am

    Sorry? Was there a public outcry for Comey to be restored to office that I somehow missed?

    papertiger (c8116c)

  106. @111- BTW, back in the day, there, secretaries were hired on their looks, not typing speed. Tall and well rounded blonds always got the gigs.

    DCSCA (797bc0)

  107. His honesty speaks for itself in light of the revelations about Flynn and his recent public defense of the Comey firing.

    Spartacvs (2db708) — 5/18/2017 @ 9:36 am

    I remember a lot of clapping and cheering when the Comey firing was announced, in all venues.
    A whole bunch of “Yea! The sob is gone!”

    “Jee. Why did he fire Comey?”, not so much.

    papertiger (c8116c)

  108. 111- BTW, back in the day, there, secretaries were hired on their looks, not typing speed. Tall and well rounded blonds always got the gigs.

    DCSCA

    Still do moron. In fact that’s a universal trait. You go to any business on earth. MSNBC included (although I suspect their commitment to the profit motive).

    papertiger (c8116c)

  109. Icy – I was lucky enough to get to see Temple of the Dog, at the Bill Graham Civic, last November. They were doing a one-off five-city tour on the twenty-fifth anniversary of the album release.

    The album was conceived as a memorial project for Andy Wood, who had been (a) Chris Cornell’s roommate and (b) the frontman of a band (Mother Love Bone) with a bunch of the guys who later joined Pearl Jam, and who had effectively died of depression.

    The tour was still clearly a memorial for this friend they had loved and lost, and it was the most emotionally authentic performance I’ve ever seen.

    Today is replete with irony, and sadness.

    aphrael (3f0569)

  110. @111. The criteria for on air talent at 1211 6th was to turn down the volume and watch how you looked— and crossed your legs. Teevee is a very visual medium.

    DCSCA

    You think NBC hired Melissa Harris-Perry for her talent?

    papertiger (c8116c)

  111. @117- In fact, you go to most businesses on Earth and it’s not. Start w/t bastion of blondness: China. Then work your way through tall blonde Japan. Then tall and blonde Indonesia. And so on…

    Still too early to be drinking, Cottonelle.

    DCSCA (797bc0)

  112. 106, it could have been a Roman from upstate, calling to mind Shemp’s line from one particular Three Stooges short Hold that Lion (1947): “Rome wasnt built in a day, and neither was Syracuse”.

    urbanleftbehind (5eecdb)

  113. 94 99. I found this.

    http://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-trump-russia-contacts-idUSKCN18E106

    Maybe it’s up to 18 now?

    These are either calls, emails or text messages but not meetings in person, and go from April, 2016 till the election. Six involve Kislyak, and the remaining 12 contacts involve either other Russian officials or people considered to be close to Putin. (One of them is Viktor Medvedchuk, a Ukrainian oligarch and politician) Nothing after the election is included in the 18.

    The party on the other end was either Flynn or other advisers to Donald Trump’s campaign

    They could have concerned anything, and several could have concerned the same thing, just split up among different emails, phone calls and text messages. Like maybe, say, about arrangements for an appearance Kislyak made at the Republican convention (along with some 50 other ambassadors, several of whom stayed for personal conversations.)

    I feel that if something important took place, it might not involve people known or suspected of acting on behalf of the Russian government, so someone could be corrupt and yet none of these contacts might mean anything.

    This is from Thu May 18, 2017 | 10:51am EDT twenty minutes before your comment @72.

    Here is a quote from the Reuters article:

    Michael Flynn and other advisers to Donald Trump’s campaign were in contact with Russian officials and others with Kremlin ties in at least 18 calls and emails during the last seven months of the 2016 presidential race, current and former U.S. officials familiar with the exchanges told Reuters….

    ….Six of the previously undisclosed contacts described to Reuters were phone calls between Sergei Kislyak, Russia’s ambassador to the United States, and Trump advisers, including Flynn, Trump’s first national security adviser, three current and former officials said.

    Conversations between Flynn and Kislyak accelerated after the Nov. 8 vote…

    But don’t count,

    Sammy Finkelman (be6791)

  114. I remember getting ready for Lollapalooza 2 in 1992 at the Tinley Park Music Center (now it changes corporate sponsor names every year) and blasting “Hunger Strike” out through the front door of my mom’s house.

    urbanleftbehind (5eecdb)

  115. It’s wildly off topic, but there’s no karma involved in Roger Ailes’ passing. Karma would have been an end like Nelson Rockefeller’s, if the stories about Ailes are true. Pretending that karma is involved is just another way of hating on a dead man. If karma lets me die at home in bed with my family at age 77, I’d consider myself well rewarded by the cosmos, but nobody gets out alive.

    Beldar (fa637a)

  116. Blonde Japanese Google image search.

    papertiger (c8116c)

  117. 124… if not karma, call it a sense of common decency.

    Colonel Haiku (d3e242)

  118. yes. man of mystery, was raised by lycans, no mere wolves saw to his upbringing,

    narciso (d1f714)

  119. Who would have guessed. Rare as hens teeth equals popular in Japan.

    papertiger (c8116c)

  120. That’s a sad commentary on society in general, and the culture of FOX NEWS. One blurb where they read the statement of Roger Ailes death off of the Drudge Report verbatum.

    {Edit]ing gutless cowards.

    papertiger (c8116c)

  121. I was oddly reassured to learn that Trump had, of course, issued two tweets in the wee small hours this morning that are radically inconsistent with the White House’s published statement yesterday afternoon in response to the Mueller appointment. The foresight, civility, and obvious rationality and wisdom radiating from that press release made me wonder if the POTUS had been carried off by aliens and replaced by someone with functioning political instincts. But no, this morning confirms that the aliens, if they’re out there, are still just watching with amusement.

    Obviously the grown-ups who wrote that press release need to organize in shifts, round the clock, to, errr, attend upon the POTUS and his cycling emotional needs. But that’s been obvious for a couple of years now, going back to the earliest days of the campaign.

    I believe all the reports which say that Trump doesn’t drink. The last POTUS for whom that was true was William Howard Taft, and his presidency didn’t end well. Drinking famously reduces inhibitions, though, and that’s clearly not the direction in which this WH needs to move.

    Beldar (fa637a)

  122. > just another way of hating on a dead man

    Blech. Why hate on a dead man? He’s dead; let his family mourn in peace.

    aphrael (3f0569)

  123. I don’t see how civility wins you any prizes beldar

    narciso (d1f714)

  124. papertiger:

    I remember a lot of clapping and cheering when the Comey firing was announced, in all venues.
    A whole bunch of “Yea! The sob is gone!”

    “Jee. Why did he fire Comey?”, not so much.

    Obviously, you need to get out more

    Spartacvs (2db708)

  125. papertiger:

    Sorry? Was there a public outcry for Comey to be restored to office that I somehow missed?

    Unresponsive, we are talking about Pence honesty. Or rather the lack of it.

    Spartacvs (2db708)

  126. Donald J. Trump‏Verified account @realDonaldTrump 4h4 hours ago
    More
    With all of the illegal acts that took place in the Clinton campaign & Obama Administration, there was never a special counsel appointed!

    Where’s the problem with that?

    I might have wrote that very thing last night (checking the records real quick. Naw. I didn’t.)

    If I were writing Trump’s tweets I would push the impeachment angle for the Democrats. Box them into a corner, and make them put their money where their mouth is.

    papertiger (c8116c)

  127. With all of the illegal acts that took place in the Clinton campaign & Obama Administration, there was never a special counsel appointed!

    Ha! As if the congresscritters running the various committees were ever going to give up that gig. Lol

    Spartacvs (2db708)

  128. You could actually argue that it was good for Rpger ailes that the scandal came out and he was fired before he died, so any obituaries will not later look like the product of ignorance. It would be a real disgrace to him for all this to come out after his death. But he was fortunate or blessed enough for all this to come out before, and people adjusted their opinions while he was alive. SNobody will regret anything that they said about him in memorium.

    But it also looks bad that he did not long survive his scandal. Still, he did by enough so that it doesn’t color the way the scandal is remembered, and it also doesn’t come out that he would have been gone from Fox News anyway.

    In truth his death and the scandal are probably more related than you might think. He was in somewhat failing health, and that caused his cover-up skills to deteriorate, and he made a blunder with Gretchen Carlson and was exposed.

    Sammy Finkelman (be6791)

  129. Unresponsive, we are talking about Pence honesty. Or rather the lack of it.

    Spartacvs (2db708)

    We are?
    When you’re calling someone a liar good rule of thumb is to not predicate your charge by implying something that is obviously a lie.

    Nobody wants Comey as FBI director, obviously.

    Except for you maybe. DID you want Comey back, Democratticvs?

    papertiger (c8116c)

  130. To clear up confusion, only hatin’ on Ailes I read here was >>> http://patterico.com/2017/05/17/special-counsel-takes-over-russia-investigation/#comment-1999369

    Colonel Haiku (d3e242)

  131. “I don’t see how civility wins you any prizes”

    – narciso

    Ditto.

    ThOR (c9324e)

  132. “Pretending that karma is involved is just another way of hating on a dead man. ”

    – Beldar

    Excellent point. Wonderful sentence.

    ThOR (c9324e)

  133. papertiger

    In retrospect it would appear that Pence lied in interviews with the press about his knowledge of Flynn’s foreign lobbying ties and about the official WH reason for firing Comey and the resignation of Flynn.

    True or false, you’re up.

    Spartacvs (2db708)

  134. We pretend there is something w could have done, perhaps not call in the fbi? Whereas there is nothing that the Clinton’s can do that will guarantee accountability. Even if you win, its the Ray Donovan question.

    narciso (ae786b)

  135. I see, Spartacvs, it’s time to go after Pence now. I demand a Special Prosecutor. What did Pence know and when did he know it?

    At what point in this coup will the arrests and killing begin?

    At this point I’m trying to envision living under a kakistocracy of celebrities, media people, civil servants and “educators” all manipulated by the Bezos/Soros cabal.

    Rev.Hoagie® (630eca)

  136. Calm down Rev. Don’t let your imaginings get too far out ahead of the story. Pence is on the hook for his public statements just like any other powerful politician, godly man or no and that’s just as it should be.

    Spartacvs (2db708)

  137. In retrospect it would appear that Pence lied in interviews with the press about his knowledge of Flynn’s foreign lobbying ties and about the official WH reason for firing Comey and the resignation of Flynn.

    True or false, you’re up.

    Spartacvs (2db708)

    What’s the right word? Bull[edit]! With an exclamation point!
    (which includes your Politico link. That’s a call of bull[edit] in usufruct.)

    papertiger (c8116c)

  138. CNN confirms Politico story – Lieberman it is.

    Spartacvs (2db708)

  139. Well if CNN confirms it. That changes everything.

    ///sarcasm

    papertiger (c8116c)

  140. Donald J. Trump

    @realDonaldTrump

    With all of the illegal acts that took place in the Clinton campaign & Obama Administration, there was never a special counsel appointed!

    7:07 AM – 18 May 2017 135.

    Where’s the problem with that?

    They didn’t have special counsels when Janet Reno refused to start the process of getting an idependent investigation of Bill Clintons 1996 campaign. There were at that time what were informally called special prosecutors, and they were not selected by the Attorney General, but by a panel of three federal judges, using an alternative method of appointing officers of the United States, other than being nominated by the president and confirmed by the Senate, or by a Senate-confirmed head of department, as provided under Article II Section 2, clause 2 of the United States constitution.

    Now actually Janet Reno had earlier appointed someone to investigate Bill Clinton, whom today they would call a special counsel, but she called a special prosecutor, back in January, 1994, at a time when the Independent Counsel law had expired but had not yet been re-enacted.

    This was actually I beleive part of Bill Clinton’s all-purpose solution to the coverup problem. It was an attempt to centralize all investigations of Bill Clinton and put them all under the control of a lawyer whom Bill Clinton could trust: Robert B Fiske Jr.

    [Bill Clinton had also, of course, made it look like Janet Reno was an almost accidental choice as Attorney General. Bill Clinton knew she was corrupt, or involved with corruption.

    As it is written:

    Janet Reno is a protege of Richard Gerstein. She got her start in government in the early 1970s when she accepted a position as personal aide to Gerstein, then state attorney. She took the post despite the fact that her late father, Herald police reporter Henry O. Reno, had made allegations that Richard Gerstein was on the take years later, when Gerstein stepped down as state attorney, Janet Reno became his successor.

    – Blue Thunder: How the Mafia Owned and Finally Murdered Cigarette Boat King Donald Aronow by Thomas Burdick and Charlene Mitchell (Simon and Schuster, 1990) page 366.

    This was written, you may note before Janet Reno was appointed Attorney General and before Bill Clinton was considered by anyone to be a serious candidate for president.]

    Sammy Finkelman (be6791)

  141. IDK papertiger. It may explain the extraordinary circumstances I was so skeptical about above. I may owe Rosenstein an apology.

    crazy (d3b449)

  142. Sorry Sparatcvs, I didn’t mean to get too far ahead of the story, I was only fantasizing about eliminating all these deplorables. It’s past time to admit there is no place in America for people who don’t vote the right way. If they happen to win one, just “resist”. Hillary should be President and everybody who should count knows it. The rest don’t count anyway so screw them. We have plenty of #neverTrumpers in government employ at least enough to jam up Trump’s administration and force him to quit. Then we have to call for a new election and get Pence out. That shouldn’t be too hard with now almost 100% of news and TV media on our side and every show, movie and appearance by a celebrity ends up a rally to oust Trump.

    Rev.Hoagie® (630eca)

  143. I don’t think the Democrats hated a Republican President this much since Abraham Lincoln took away their slaves. You see what they did then: Civil War.

    Rev.Hoagie® (630eca)

  144. You have a fevered imagination Rev. Sleeping well?

    Spartacvs (2db708)

  145. Damn it, should have been Frank Keating. But he’s too old just the same.

    urbanleftbehind (ebe312)

  146. The hope, of course, was that, after the special prosecutor law was enacted, the three federal judges would ratify the appoinment of Fiske, but instead they appointed Kenneth Starr.

    During the ensuing years, Janet Reno started the process of having numerous independent counsels appointed (remember the actual appointment was not done by her) for various Clinton Cabinet members, but never for Bill Clinton himself, and she restricted the jurisdiction of one of them whose investigation was beginning to get close to Clinton. (or forcefully reminded him of his limited jurisdiction. That was Donald Smaltz, assigned to investigate former Secretary of Agriculture Mike Espy.

    http://articles.latimes.com/1995-03-29/news/mn-48418_1_tyson-foods

    Smaltz said through a spokesman that he had “no comment on any communications or contacts with the Justice Department.” By law, a court-appointed special counsel must apply for permission to the attorney general to expand his legal mandate, which mainly dealt with allegations against Espy but gave him some leeway to look into other criminal activities he encountered. There is no appeal process. All documents are under court seal.

    Exactly how Smaltz sought to broaden his inquiry could not be learned. However, one legal source speculated that he wanted to expand beyond the 1993-1994 period when Espy served in Clinton’s Cabinet so he could investigate Tyson’s earlier relationship with Clinton as governor of Arkansas.

    At the time of Reno’s action, Smaltz already had questioned some witnesses about allegations by a former Tyson pilot who claimed that he carried envelopes filled with $100 bills to representatives of then-Gov. Clinton.

    (Although published statements seem to imply it was later that this happened, that must have been very early, only during 1979, or perhaps also before he became governor, because Tyson eliminated the necessity of getting envelopes of cash to Bill Clinton by having Hillary Clinton make $100,000 by investing in cattle futures in December, 1979. It could be the witness moved the time in attempt to put it, or at least similar things, within the statute of limitations.)

    In the absence of an independent counsel law, special prosecutors could be appointed by the attorney general, bt they had no legal standing – no standing beyond what the politics were.

    There had been a special prosecor to investigate Harding Administration scandals, which after six years, never got down to he bottom of things, and there was one during the Nixon Administration.

    In 1973, the Senate had made Elliot Richardson promise, as a condition of his confirmation as Attorney General after Rcard Kleindienst resigned, to appoint a special prosecutor and also to resign if Nixon fired the special prosecutor. Nixon did six months later, and fired the special preosecuor, Archibald Cox, and Elliot Richardson and also his deputy resigned, and pretty soon there was another special prosecutor, Leon Jaworski.

    Sammy Finkelman (be6791)

  147. Rev.Hoagie® (630eca) — 5/18/2017 @ 12:10 pm

    since Abraham Lincoln took away their slaves. You see what they did then: Civil War

    He didn’t take away their slaves until after the Civil War was won. And there were only a few slave states in Congress at that time.

    Sammy Finkelman (be6791)

  148. The new FBI Director should have a history of having been an agent. I would suggest Louis Freeh who was very popular with agents. He is 65 and I don’t know if he would take the job but Lieberman is 75 and has never been anything but a politician. I like him but he is not the one.

    Mike K (f469ea)

  149. What’s Trumps angle on picking Lieberman? That’s the interesting question.

    Spartacvs (2db708)

  150. He didn’t take away their slaves until after the Civil War was won.

    Sammy, you are too literal. The whole Civil War thing was about slavery. The South assumed Lincoln was an abolitionist but he did not plan to do so if they would compromise. He was thinking of paying the slave owners compensation. They refused any thought of compromise and thought they could win a war. Sherman tried to warn them.

    You people of the South don’t know what you are doing. This country will be drenched in blood, and God only knows how it will end. It is all folly, madness, a crime against civilization! You people speak so lightly of war; you don’t know what you’re talking about. War is a terrible thing! You mistake, too, the people of the North. They are a peaceable people but an earnest people, and they will fight, too. They are not going to let this country be destroyed without a mighty effort to save it … Besides, where are your men and appliances of war to contend against them? The North can make a steam engine, locomotive, or railway car; hardly a yard of cloth or pair of shoes can you make. You are rushing into war with one of the most powerful, ingeniously mechanical, and determined people on Earth — right at your doors. You are bound to fail. Only in your spirit and determination are you prepared for war. In all else you are totally unprepared, with a bad cause to start with.

    Mike K (f469ea)

  151. What’s Trumps angle on picking Lieberman?

    Picking a Democrat but it is still a bad idea to choose someone who has not been an agent.

    Mike K (f469ea)

  152. Confirmability

    ThOR (c9324e)

  153. Lieberman probably couldn’t get 50 GOP votes in the Senate, despite having a good personal relationship with many senators on both sides of the aisle. He was Al Gore’s running mate, although he supported John McCain in 2008, so he’s burned many bridges. He finished his Senate career as an “independent” who caucused with the Dems. He has no federal law enforcement experience at all; his only law enforcement experience was as the attorney general of Connecticut, in which he was a prominent populist in the Eliot Spitzer mold who cloaked himself in the garb of a warrior against big business.

    At present, Lieberman’s senior counsel (meaning a big billing rate for prestige clients, but no equity as a partner) to the law firm founded and still run by Donald Trump’s long-time go-to lawyer, Marc Kasowitz. Arguably, as a result, if he’s appointed as FBI Director, the first thing he’ll therefore be required to do, in the performance of his ethical and legal duties, will be to recuse himself on everything and anything at the Bureau involving President Trump.

    So basically Dems would accuse him of being Abe Fortas without the redeeming qualities. And naming him would not at all give any political cover to the GOP members of Congress in both houses, and indeed at the state political levels, who are exhausted from continuously flinching over what the next day’s bungling from the WH will be.

    I can see that there are reasons for having given Sen. Lieberman a courtesy interview — largely as a sop to counter the news that it was Israeli-“owned” foreign intelligence that Trump may have compromised.

    But he has no constituency for this position, no one who will say, “Yes! Joe Lieberman, what an inspired and perfect choice! Unquestionably the best available!”

    That’s pretty much the reaction from most of the world to Mueller’s announcement. But then, Trump had nothing to do with that. If he picks Lieberman, we’re going to re-fight every argument — the 2000 election, Bush v. Gore, 9/11, the Afghanistan & Iraq Wars, etc. — for the next week in the news cycle.

    Beldar (fa637a)

  154. DCSCA has been waiting for the USS Caine to come in. Turned out to be The Disco Volante.

    Pinandpuller (87a66a)

  155. *mould. (Perhaps a Freudian slip.)

    Beldar (fa637a)

  156. Breitbart:

    White House on Lockdown After Attempted Fence Jumping

    No mention of which direction.

    Spartacvs (2db708)

  157. This fake outrage looks oddly familiar…

    “You’re tearing me apart, Lisa!”

    Tommy Wiseau The Room

    Pinandpuller (87a66a)

  158. The Conventional Wisdom is that Senators are easy to confirm in the Senate.

    That Joe has no constituency means that he has no constituted opposition either.

    Hard to imagine a better choice for a President who wants to move on.

    ThOR (c9324e)

  159. figurehead

    crazy (d3b449)

  160. I can’t imagine he’ll want to serve out the entire 10 year term, but that’s not why he’d be nominated. His job is to put out the fire.

    ThOR (c9324e)

  161. Yesterday: Drain the swamp

    Today: If you can’t beat em, join em

    crazy (d3b449)

  162. @159 Trump’s angle?

    Pick the oldest and weakest fool he can sucker into the gig. And there’s a lot of ham in Lieberman much to his own surprise. The last thing Trump ants is a strong, driven and totally qualified head of the FBI.

    DCSCA (797bc0)

  163. For Christ’s sake, Lieberman is 75 years old now. A ‘ten year term’ is a death sentence.

    DCSCA (797bc0)

  164. Ham, yes. I think you nailed it lol.

    Spartacvs (2db708)

  165. @ ThOR (#168): I agree with you, of course, about conventional wisdom. I even agree with you that as of this moment, Lieberman doesn’t have a well-coalesced set of opponents in or outside the Senate.

    That latter would change the millisecond that Trump nominated him, at which instant all of Trump’s fervent enemies will “re-discover” their profound unease about Lieberman’s partisanship, ethics, abilities, competence, age, background, etc.

    Mueller had no such baggage. Lieberman has lots, and again, isn’t the Efrem Zimbalist, Jr.-type that Trump obviously needs to pick if he’s to gain even temporary respite from this political storm.

    Beldar (fa637a)

  166. @164. – And what’s your pleasure- is Melania or Ivanka your ‘Domino’?

    DCSCA (797bc0)

  167. Trump desperately needs someone for whom his team can project — maybe literally — this kind of image as the new F.B.I. Director.

    Beldar (fa637a)

  168. Efrem Zimbalist Jr.?

    Jaysus…. try Droopy.

    DCSCA (797bc0)

  169. In his joint press conference with the Pres. of Columbia just now, in response to questions, Trump repeated his “witch hunt” line, but said that with respect to the Russia investigation, “I’m fine with whatever people want to do” while trying to pivot back to Making America Great etc. His veins weren’t bulging and he seemed to be under relatively good control.

    Beldar (fa637a)

  170. *Colombia, mea culpa.

    Beldar (fa637a)

  171. My favorite sentence from Trump’s presser today, when asked for his reaction to the Mueller appointment:

    There is no collusion between — certainly myself and my campaign, but I can only speak for myself — and the Russians, zero.

    Is he morphing into Bill Clinton? Or has he always been Bill Clinton?

    Beldar (fa637a)

  172. He’s Bill Clinton without the brains, and I mean that as maliciously as possible.

    Leviticus (efada1)

  173. Queeg’s skitzo-line from this presser:

    “I respect the appointment of a Special Councel but it’s a witch hunt.”

    With two scoops of ice cream… Strawberry Fields Forever.

    DCSCA (797bc0)

  174. @182. That’s too kind.

    He’s popcorn popping without a lid on the pot.

    DCSCA (797bc0)

  175. Jaysus… Joe Lieberman leading the FBI is equivalent to William Shatner helming NASA.

    DCSCA (797bc0)

  176. “At present, Lieberman’s senior counsel (meaning a big billing rate for prestige clients, but no equity as a partner) to the law firm founded and still run by Donald Trump’s long-time go-to lawyer, Marc Kasowitz.”

    – Beldar

    Ah, Kasowitz: the guy that got the “Go F*ck Yourself” letter from David McCraw at the NYT.

    Leviticus (efada1)

  177. 134… Sparky completely ignores the mountain of Democrat bad faith, dishonesty, perfidy, and general assclownery.

    Colonel Haiku (d3e242)

  178. 173… some don’t live dissolute lifestyles, sitting on their ass, watching movies, DCSCA. You are old before your time.

    Colonel Haiku (d3e242)

  179. @ Leviticus (#186): Having litigated against and, of course, having observed the Kasowitz firm’s work over time, I can confirm that Mr. Kasowitz’ reputation and history in the national civil-litigation legal community very closely approximate Mr. Trump’s reputation and history in the business community. They have much in common beyond style.

    Beldar (fa637a)

  180. “Lieberman . . . isn’t the Efrem Zimbalist, Jr.-type that Trump obviously needs to pick if he’s to gain even temporary respite from this political storm.”

    – Beldar

    I couldn’t agree more. Picking a candidate simply based on confirmability is shortsighted in the extreme. Trump needs a principled G-man type to clean up the obvious mess at the FBI and to protect his flank going forward. This is not the time to play defense. Let’s hope it is just more fake news.

    I’ve been sitting here all morning wondering who advised Trump that he shouldn’t clean the Augean Stables right out of the box. Most idiots could have seen what was coming if he didn’t. That must be the poorest decision of his entire presidency. It is going to be much harder now.

    ThOR (c9324e)

  181. There is simply no overstating the incompetence of the House Republican leadership.

    Can you say “passive-aggressive”?

    ThOR (c9324e)

  182. @188.Haiku! Gesundheit.

    See 185. Then wipe your nose.

    DCSCA (797bc0)

  183. Another vote? crank up the popcorn machine Caruthers, the gang that couldn’t shoot straight are up to bat again.

    Spartacvs (2db708)

  184. Re my speculation about Lieberman being a “courtesy interview,” see also this: Trump Taps Kasowitz Bankruptcy Atty For Israel Ambassador. Ambassador David M. Friedman was confirmed on March 23, but only by a 52-46 vote.

    Beldar (fa637a)

  185. And then … minutes later … Trump launches off into a rambling justification for firing Comey.

    No impulse control at all. No clutch between ego & mouth.

    (*accidentally posted this comment first on the Ailes thread, sorry)

    Beldar (fa637a)

  186. You just can’t make this sh1t up!

    Several sources close to Flynn and to the administration tell The Daily Beast that Trump has expressed his hopes that a resolution of the FBI’s investigation in Flynn’s favor might allow Flynn to rejoin the White House in some capacity—a scenario some of Trump’s closest advisers in and outside the West Wing have assured him absolutely should not happen.

    http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2017/05/18/donald-trump-talked-michael-flynn-into-white-house-job

    Spartacvs (2db708)

  187. Pres. Santos of Colombia was nimble and impressive in two languages. Trump supporters will surely appreciate and applaud Trump’s crisp if slightly condescending follow-up to a question posed to Pres. Santos about his views on Trump’s proposed border wall (which Pres. Santos dodged with all the grace of an experienced political matador).

    Trump cannot grasp that on this special counsel stuff, he will be at least ten times better off, immediately and in the long run, if he talks about 10% as much.

    Beldar (fa637a)

  188. And I believe Trump said he might have an announcement on the FBI Director tomorrow. I’m hoping for Richard McFeely, I think.

    Beldar (fa637a)

  189. Re the interviews yesterday:

    Asked as he left the White House whether he would say ‘yes’ if Trump offered him the job, Keating said, “I’m a public servant.” He added, “Let’s just say we had a good conversation.”

    Lieberman gave a thumbs-up to reporters camped out on the White House driveway and said “It was a good meeting.”

    McFeely departed without comment. Reporters did not see McCabe when he left the complex.

    So obviously McCabe has good stealth characteristics, but we kind of already knew that: many Hillary critics (including all of Trump’s base) are troubled by his wife’s political career and Terry McAuliffe’s fundraising for same, which apparently weren’t viewed as any impediment within the FBI for McCabe’s involvement in the Clinton email investigation.

    But McFeely departed without comment. Yeah, I’m rooting for that guy.

    Beldar (fa637a)

  190. Link for the quote in #199.

    Beldar (fa637a)

  191. You just can’t make this sh1t up!

    oh my goodness yes you can

    they make up so much stuff about our president they should be ashamed of themselves

    why they gotta be that way

    happyfeet (a037ad)

  192. I’d forgotten that Lieberman actually lost, as an incumbent, the Connecticut Democratic Primary for his Senate seat in 2006, and so had to run — successfully as it turned out — as an independent.

    Yeah, no, I don’t think he has many dear friends left in his former party.

    Beldar (fa637a)

  193. Trump evidently had no idea that theer’s abig controversy about that peace agreement with the FARC (it was rejected by a narrow margin ina referendum, and then he made soem minor chnged and said he didn’t need a referendum.

    That’s what Santos won the Nobel Peace Prize for.

    Trump stumbled witgh is words a bit but seemed to feel it when he noted that Venezuela is in bad shape now. There actually is no plan as to what to do about the situation.

    Sammy Finkelman (be6791)

  194. Breaking, from today’s Senate briefing: Rosenstein confirms he knew of Trumps intention to fire Comey before he wrote the memo Trump used to justify the firing.

    Spartacvs (2db708)

  195. Beldar (fa637a) — 5/18/2017 @ 2:24 pm

    Lieberman actually lost, as an incumbent, the Connecticut Democratic Primary for his Senate seat in 2006, and so had to run — successfully as it turned out — as an independent.

    Yeah, no, I don’t think he has many dear friends left in his former party.

    And he’s got maybe half of the Republican Party against him. John McCain wanted to nominate him for vice president in 2008, * but he was dissuaded from doing so by the report that a lot of Republicans wouldn’t like him, and might even vote down the nomination. So he picked the candidate he liked best among the others on his short vetted list: Sarah Palin.

    ———
    * in which case Lieberman would have the distinction of running for vice president two times within eight years, with two different presidential candiddtes, like Adlai E. Stevenson in 1892 and 1900, but on two different major party tickets.

    Sammy Finkelman (be6791)

  196. I don’t know why Trump wasn’t interested in former New York City Police Commissioner Ray Kelly except that maybe nobody close to Trump, whom Trump knows, promoted him. It can’t really be age if someone interested him in Joe Lieberman.

    Ray Kelly wouldn’t be there 10 years, but it’s very hard to see how anyone would any more. Kelly could also just sign on for two or three years and bring in and recommend his successor. That person, maybe, might have a shot at 10 years.

    Trump maybe just wasn’t involved or interested enough in New York City politics and government so that he would feel familiar with Ray Kelly. If the FBI fought terrorism like the New York City Police Department did it would be whole lot better.

    There are better choices but you;d have to find them. Chaffetz and Cornyn tok themselves out of consideration, both indicating it wasn’t good for somebody from politics.

    Sammy Finkelman (be6791)

  197. Spartacus, so now “Breaking news” means news that is utterly irrelevant and silly?

    SPQR (a3a747)

  198. @207. Ailes 101.

    DCSCA (797bc0)

  199. I’ve spent more time today parsing the terms of DoJ Order No. 3915-2017, Rosentein’s appointment of Mueller, after listening to this podcast of Ed Morrissey interviewing Andrew McCarthy about the appointment. McCarthy mused a great deal about the novelty of having a special counsel in charge of a foreign intelligence investigation. Other than assisting with getting FISA warrants and prosecuting any crimes revealed through the foreign intelligence investigation (of which Flynn and Manafort seem to be the subject, based on Comey’s March 20 congressional testimony and leaked grand jury subpoenas), McCarthy doesn’t see any useful role for a DoJ lawyer, special counsel or otherwise, in a foreign intelligence investigation.

    I’d speculate, however, that there may be a very useful role for Mueller to play in the foreign intelligence investigation, regardless of whether it eventually leads to any criminal indictments or convictions: Given what’s already been said by the intelligence community about Russian attempts to interfere, there needs to be a formal written report, with as much of it as possible made public, at the conclusion of the investigation. Even if he’s merely reporting — and associating his name and reputation with — the FBI’s findings and recommendations, that will have a better chance of getting at least some closure, for now (Russian interference isn’t going away, nor Chinese, nor ….), this whole topic into a less rigidly partisan framework.

    A nit: I double-checked the statutes referenced in Rosenstein’s order, all citations to Title 28 of the U.S. Code. They’re the statutory authorization for the AG (or acting AG) to delegate duties as a general matter. There’s no direct reference anywhere in the order to the particular regulation that authorizes the appointment of a special counsel for “criminal investigations,” 28 C.F.R. § 600.1, probably because to the extent Rosenstein has just appointed Mueller to oversee the foreign intelligence (as opposed to criminal) investigation(s), this particular regulation won’t support that. Nevertheless, the general delegation of authority statutes will, which is why they got cited instead. Whether mentioned or not in the order, section 600.1 would indeed support Mueller’s appointment as to criminal investigations, and for administrative clarity the order does go on to confirm that Mueller’s appointment (presumably in both criminal and foreign intelligence capacities) is indeed subject to all the rules in 28 C.F.R. part 600.

    This kind of stuff has to be attended to carefully from the outset, lest some future prosecution be invalidated on grounds that the prosecutor wasn’t appropriately authorized.

    Beldar (fa637a)

  200. SPQR

    Silly?

    It completely undercuts the public justification given by the administration for firing Comey and as a bonus makes Pence look a complete chump…..again.

    Spartacvs (2db708)

  201. There is no single active politician with broader public support President Trump. And his supporters are an excitable bunch. I can hardly imagine the reaction from Trump’s well armed militia to an attempt to impeach him, especially if Trump goes on the campaign trail with the intent of mobilizing them against the swamp dwellers who are trying to run him out of town. We’re not talking pantywaists either. And they will not be alone; most Americans, even non-supporters, love an underdog who fights against the corrupt system.

    I’d bet dollars to doughnuts that this will be a summer of campaign-like rallies across the Trump-belt (I’m not the first in these comments to make such a prediction). I expect to hear the theme we heard just the other day at the Coast Guard Academy graduation repeated across the land:

    “No politician in history, and I say this with great surety, has been treated worse or more unfairly”

    and

    “Never, never, never give up.”

    Trump is a fighter and a dirty one, at that. It will be an ugly fight.

    Be careful what you wish for, it might just come true.

    ThOR (c9324e)

  202. , if you’ve Mary o Grady at the journal you would have a more jaundiced view of Santos, notably the way an opposition candidate arias a protege of Uribe, was indicted to prevent him from challenging.

    He was once a brave news paper ublisher who wouldn’t knuckle under the cartel was uribe’ s defense minister and then vice resident but much like Rabin and Barak, entered into one sided deal with the farc and the eln

    narciso (d1f714)

  203. It’s got to be lovie who else is this dim.

    Sammeh he was briefed by both pastrana, and uribe at Mara lago so he is aware.

    narciso (d1f714)

  204. This kind of stuff has to be attended to carefully from the outset, lest some future prosecution be invalidated on grounds that the prosecutor wasn’t appropriately authorized.

    Beldar (fa637a) — 5/18/2017 @ 3:38 pm

    Are you sure they want to authorize a criminal prosecution?

    DRJ (15874d)

  205. So the end product of this leAk to the times is the laptop ban maybe put on hold. Yay Islamic state, when the result of this goes off at jfk or o’hafe remember that.

    narciso (d1f714)

  206. Mueller is, I’m told, a man of unimpeachable character.

    Yeah, right. Every time I’m told this it’s by the whores in D.C. Like I am going to take their word.

    But more to the point, this is an admission we are not a nation of laws but under the arbitrary rule of men. If that weren’t the case we could rely on institution like the FBi instead of stellar individuals like Muellar.

    Steve57 (0b1dac)

  207. Mueller is, I’m told, a man of unimpeachable character.

    Yeah, right. Every time I’m told this it’s by the street walkers D.C. Like I am going to take their word.

    But more to the point, this is an admission we are not a nation of laws but under the arbitrary rule of men. If that weren’t the case we could rely on institution like the FBi instead of stellar individuals like Muellar.

    Steve57 (0b1dac)

  208. It’s curious. How is it I am supposed to believe a particular individual is of unimpeachable character when the peeps vouching for the individual are of obviously impeachable character?

    Steve57 (0b1dac)

  209. Isn’t it the truth, it’s like when they refer to costello’s mole in the state police as having an ‘immaculate record’ with obvious irony, if one were really so, they wouldn’t be considered. Or they get dumped with slime as starr was.

    narciso (d1f714)

  210. yeah sleazy mueller thinks he’s all hot poop now that he got appointed to something but he’s still the same icky insignificant worm he’s always been and deep down, you know that don’t you Mueller

    that said, let’s get this silly investigation wrapped up chop chop cause we all got things to do

    happyfeet (a037ad)

  211. We now have the most honest man in Washington investigating. This is like have the most virtuous professional at the Bunny Ranch or the best ice hockey player in Ecuador verifying something.

    Steve57 (0b1dac)

  212. fancypants mueller doesn’t even have his twitter set up yet

    tells you a little something about what kind of half-assed investigation he’s planning on running

    happyfeet (a037ad)

  213. Of course of one wanted to be really devious one would suspect aq was behind this travisnockasham because they are the major beneficiaries.

    narciso (d1f714)

  214. 216.Mueller is, I’m told, a man of unimpeachable character.

    Yeah, right. Every time I’m told this it’s by the street walkers D.C. Like I am going to take their word.

    You called it, Steve57. If one pours a gallon of sh!t into a barrel of wine he now has a barrel of sh!t. But if one pours a gallon of wine into a barrel of sh!t he still has a barrel of sh!t. I’m not sold on whether Mueller is the wine or the sh!t but it doesn’t really matter, does it?

    BTW, I never quite understood that “we are a nation of laws meme”. Especially when the people who make the laws exclude themselves from them, ignore them, circumvent them and try to apply them to enemies only. The whole thing sounds like 1984 style propaganda.

    Rev.Hoagie® (630eca)

  215. yeah @RealSpecialCounselRobertMueller – this sounds like 1984 style propaganda

    your investigation is politicized and suspect #specialcounselFAIL

    happyfeet (a037ad)

  216. You have a fevered imagination Rev. Sleeping well?

    Spartacvs (2db708) — 5/18/2017 @ 12:11 pm

    Exactly what am I imagining, Spartacvs? There is no doubbr the Democrats hate Trump, is there? And it’s an historical fact Lincoln freed all the slaves of the Southern Democrat slave owners and they fought a Civil War. I believe it’s you who need the rest living in denial is no way to go through life.

    Rev.Hoagie® (630eca)

  217. Who watches the watchers, we have given them extraordinary power for a certain purpose yet we find they use it to conduct their own twisted games.

    narciso (d1f714)

  218. We are the audience of a blind man winning a clay pigeon shooting contest.

    mg (31009b)

  219. The republican party is made up of a bunch of Baghdad Bob’s.

    mg (31009b)


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