A Sobering Thought on How Orlando Benefits Hillary
[guest post by JVW]
In a piece over at The Observer titled “The Coming Constitutional Crisis over Hillary Clinton’s EmailGate,” John R. Schindler plows, seeds, and harvests from a familiar field. He discusses the ongoing FBI investigation and the likelihood that they have discovered more than enough incriminating evidence to bring a criminal case to the Justice Department. He lists the litany of potentially explosive developments that have already been leaked, from her outing of covert CIA personnel overseas to discussions of impending drone attacks in Pakistan to the sheer sleaziness of Hillary serving as our top diplomat at the same time that her husband was shaking down foreign governments on behalf of the Clinton Foundation.
But Schindler provides a note of caution for those of us who hope that Mrs./Senator/Secretary Clinton’s goose is, at long last, cooked. With respect to President Obama’s recent endorsement of his erstwhile adversary despite the overwhelming evidence of her culpability, Schindler concludes:
How the FBI can look at all this and not recommend prosecution of someone for something in EmailGate strains the imagination. Yet President Obama has clearly signaled that it’s all no big deal. Director James Comey has a tough job before him when he takes the FBI’s official recommendations regarding EmailGate to Attorney General Lynch for action, probably sometime this summer. Since Comey is now under a cloud over the FBI’s embarrassing mishandling of Omar Mateen, the Orlando jihadist mass murderer, perhaps his resignation over that matter would be welcome in the White House, which then could find a new director more willing to bend to Obama’s wishes.
Yep, that sounds about right. Irrespective of whether or not Attorney General Lynch is allowed to (or even wants to) pursue prosecution, the Clinton Machine now has a powerful talking point. Expect to hear a lot of noise from them in coming weeks about incompetence in the FBI and how the agency is well overdue for a shake up from its poor leadership.
The Constitutional crisis in the headline to Schindler’s piece comes from what many of us anticipate to be the result: the Justice Department will provide a formal rebuke of HRC but will stop short of prosecuting her; the Clinton campaign will claim vindication and insist the matter has been settled. What Schindler and many other observers expect to happen then is some version of the following: Comey and perhaps senior intelligence officials will resign in disgust, along with some of the agents involved in the investigation; those remaining in the FBI who oppose the decision not to prosecute will begin a campaign of leaking information from the investigations to news sources, leading to a steady drumbeat of stories this fall during an election cycle that already promises to be memorable for the levels of vitriol spewed by the two major party candidates.
Should Hillary! be elected in November, we would face January 2017 with the following political landscape: an outgoing President thoroughly discredited for failing to apply the rule of law to the powerful and well-connected, a incoming President who will be the most unliked and distrusted new chief executive in our nation’s history, and an opposition party in absolute tatters. I wonder what Australia’s emigration policies are like.
– JVW
But Obama is Halfrican-American and Hillary identifies as a woman, so that’s far more important than anything so ephemeral as the rule of law. Identity politics trumps all (pun sheepishly intended).
JVW (aa050c) — 6/16/2016 @ 3:24 pmthe failmerican department of justice under that stupid sleazy harvardtrash hoochie is as corrupt as anything you’re likely to find north of venezuela
pls to quote me
happyfeet (831175) — 6/16/2016 @ 3:45 pmHey, if Australia fails, try New Zealand!
But seriously, I think you’ve nailed your analysis. One quibble – while Obama will be discredited, most people won’t even be aware because the media will brush it under the carpet.
scrubone (c3104f) — 6/16/2016 @ 3:50 pmhttps://www.newzealandnow.govt.nz/move-to-nz/new-zealand-visa/work-visa/skilled-migrant-visas
scrubone (c3104f) — 6/16/2016 @ 3:52 pmExcellent post, JVW! In particular, re this:
It would not surprise me if Obama, in response, doubled- and tripled-down on threats to prosecute leakers, whether they’ve resigned office or not. He’ll use the occasion to lecture us about something, it doesn’t matter what — anything to change or at least deflect the subject slightly.
I think the Clintons have been given their heads-up, and they’ve thought through the historical precedents, and they’ve decided that if necessary, then with the sitting and semi-sainted POTUS backing them, the Clintonistas can well survive their own version of Nixon’s Saturday Night Massacre to dismiss special prosecutor Archibald Cox, in much the same way that Bubba survived his own impeachment and Senate trial despite enormous pressure to resign.
I can even imagine Obama granting nominee Clinton a pardon, saying that her career of public service more than justifies erasing an unfair blot on her record regarding these hypertechnical arguments about emails and classified information blah blah blah. He’d compare himself to Ford, “healing the nation” with the Nixon pardon even over the outrage of Democrats at the time (it costs Obama nothing to throw those historical Democrats under the bus).
Nobody has been as successful as the Clintons in systematically obstructing justice. (Obama has tried, and made an impressive showing of his own, but he’s in no better than second place.) Obstruction of justice is just part of the Clinton brand, and has been going back to the state troopers who enforced his victims’ silence when Bubba was governor of Arkansas.
Beldar (fa637a) — 6/16/2016 @ 3:54 pmNew Zeland has a BMI limit. If you’re too fat for your height, you don’t get in. A sensible rule, which we should adopt ourselves. We don’t need no short, fat people. They eat too much, don’t work hard enough, and become a burden on the health care system.
nk (dbc370) — 6/16/2016 @ 4:04 pmNew Zeland has a BMI limit. If you’re too fat for your height, you don’t get in.
Screw that, I self-identify as Maori. So there.
JVW (aa050c) — 6/16/2016 @ 4:06 pmthat really is putting the cart before the horse,
http://www.breitbart.com/radio/2016/06/12/philip-haney-orlando-shooting-remarkably-similar-san-bernardino-theres-lot-overlap-two-networks/
I would venture that neither salafism nor the emails are receiving sufficient scrutiny,
narciso (732bc0) — 6/16/2016 @ 4:11 pmi loved that new zealand show on netflix
happyfeet (831175) — 6/16/2016 @ 4:11 pmThanks for the compliment, Beldar. I think your analysis is spot-on. The Clintons have a certain genius for escaping trouble, never more evident than in Bill’s famous “well I guess we’ll just have to win then” comment when it was made clear to him that polls showed the American people did not like him committing perjury.
The big question is this: what if a huge segment of the Federal law-enforcement community — FBI agents, prosecutors, perhaps even CIA agents — resigns in disgust over this? That may be far-fetched: they would have to be willing to leave steady, well-paid government jobs and try their luck in private enterprise right when that is looking dicer and dicer, but how would the Justice Department handle something like, say, the inauguration if there was suddenly a shortage of FBI agents? What about the Super Bowl and other high-profile events? How quickly could they hire and train new agents? Wouldn’t it be something if for Hillary’s inauguration they had to resort of having active-duty military patrolling the streets to ensure her security? What optics that would provide!
JVW (aa050c) — 6/16/2016 @ 4:12 pmthis one
happyfeet (831175) — 6/16/2016 @ 4:12 pmNot now, because the status quo protects her, and because any new director would need to be confirmed by the Senate. If the director is going to be replaced, it would by her.
By the way, President Bill Clinton, even though he wasn’t allowed to fire the FBI Director actually did so. He could fire for cause, and he was in league with a cabal in the FBI that created some trumped up ethics charges that gave him the legal right to do so.
They tried to negotiate a resignation, but William Sessions adamantaly refused to agree to resign. On July 19 he was fired. Bill Clinton, in his public statement, did not dare to give as his reason what his legal grounds for doing this was.
Then, (I suspect) an email I sent to president@whitehouse.gov on July 19, routed through Rochester was printed out and given to Vincent Foster (because it had started out about Crown
Heights, and Governor Marip Cuomo was keeping the contents of the Girgente Report under wraps and they were afraid of what it would say)
My e-mail said, among other things, that reporters knew more than what they wrote about Waco, and for proof read that day’s (July 19) Wall Street Journal editorial, and that if the FBI Director was fired reporters would be released from their pledges of confidentality and Sessions would be free to tell what he knows about Waco, particularly how he was kept from the scene and how his water cannon plan was rejected in favor of tear gas, and Sessions announced he was going to hold a press conference on Thursday (July 22) ….and Vincent Foster’s worse nightmare seemed to be coming true.
A whole chain of events unfolded that was eventually to lead to Bill Clinton’s impeachment by the House of Representatives five and a half years later.
Sammy Finkelman (7ea384) — 6/16/2016 @ 4:23 pmDon’t fail to consider that Donald Trump might win the presidency no matter what Obama, Clinton, Lynch, or Comey et al do. He’s proved he can win against the odds time after time. I’d put my money on a proven winner, and never look back.
ropelight (596f46) — 6/16/2016 @ 4:26 pmI’m so sick at heart at what happened in Orlando and what’s happening in the aftermath, that I almost bought a cake at Whole Foods in Laguna Beach to use to pull a scam.
Colonel Haiku (7e501e) — 6/16/2016 @ 4:34 pmThe reason for exclusively having private e-mail would have been because of the possibility that she, or someone else e-mailing to her, might slip up, and leave something on the government e-mail that would be incrimination.
I think most likely she was forwarding material to somebody outside the State Department. What she turned over seems carefully calculatedto avoid turning anything like that over. Hillary Clinton only sent e-mails that were sent to state.gov addresses plus some that were retrieved by a few search terms like Benghazi” or “Libya” These search terms were all probably reverse engineered to avoid the most damaging e-mails. (there are actually some pretty damaging ones in the document
dump – like one where Sidney Blumenthal tells her he got an article published in Slate.)
Attachments were not searched,
And who is to say that if an extremely damaging e-mail turned up in the reverse engineered search, Hillary and her lawyers simply didn’t send it to the State Department??
She got the State Department to agree that what she supplied was all – and then promptly deleted the rest, all before anyone outside the State Department knew about any of this.
It’s been said that of the emails Hillary DID turn over to State, at least a few were edited to omit things I don’t think that’s correct.
I think that concerns e-mails sent to her by Sidney Blumenthal.
He was e-mailing what was supposed to be intelligence analysis to her at hdr22@clintonemail.com for circulation through the federal government, and she, was, presumably, communicating something back.
Sammy Finkelman (643dcd) — 6/16/2016 @ 4:44 pmAnyone know if Mateen was targeting Latinos? It was Latino Night at Pulse. Has anyone seen an ethnic breakdown of the victims, both dead and wounded?
ropelight (596f46) — 6/16/2016 @ 4:45 pmyes it came from alpha com, the outfit of the late tyler drumheller, and the still kicking william murray, the latter was the station chief in Paris, during the plame matter, in contact with the chief of the french security service, who subsequently provided those leads,
narciso (732bc0) — 6/16/2016 @ 4:53 pmBeldar (fa637a) — 6/16/2016 @ 3:54 pm
I think that may be the case – they are certainly acting that way – but it may not be, and probably was not, directly from Obama, but from contacts in the Department of Jusrtice and/or the FBI, probably done through lawyers. Just so long as the lawyers are not being wiretapped and so on, they’ll be OK.
Not before the election. Now something being hypertechnical could be different, but even in such a case, there would have to be a call for the law to be repealed, and other people pardoned too.
I think what they called this at Yale Law School was “legal realism.”
http://digitalcommons.law.yale.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=3643&context=fss_papers
According to this, you see, there’s no such thing as equal justice under law.
Sammy Finkelman (7ea384) — 6/16/2016 @ 5:07 pmthe fellow mentioned in the piece, alan chouet,
http://www.theleftcoaster.com/archives/007089.php
the reporter bob drogin, was the one who accepted a phony tale of how curveball was handled
narciso (732bc0) — 6/16/2016 @ 5:08 pmwhich absolved the german bnd, since they were his handler, sid vicious was among the ones who publicized drumheller’s claims,
ropelight (596f46) — 6/16/2016 @ 4:45 pm
Yes, in the New York Times, of the dead.
23 were Puerto Ricans or tied to Puerto Rico, and 90% were Hispanic, which would mean 44 Of the 21 Hispanics not from Puerto Rico, 3 were illegal aliens.
That should remind you, illegal immigrants are not just possible criminals, but also crime victims, and if they weren’t victims, American citizens might have been victims in their place.
The killer seemed to be sparing blacks a little. At least, anyway one time he called out who was black and nobody answerred but finally one male did and said there were about 6 or 7 of them in there and he said “you guys” had suffered enough.
This, in spite of, in some point in the past, his having used bad language in regard to African Americans.
Sammy Finkelman (7ea384) — 6/16/2016 @ 5:13 pmLarry Sabato says that Marco Rubio may run for re-election after all because of Orlando but he rates the race a toss up either way.
Sammy Finkelman (7ea384) — 6/16/2016 @ 5:15 pm#20, Sammy, thanks. The information you provided supports my notion that Mateen man have been targeting Latinos rather than gays. After all, he could have attacked gays any night at Pulse, but he struck on Latino Night.
Mateen’s father confirmed the anti-homosexual meem when he claimed his son was enraged by the sight of two men kissing which was immediately and widely accepted largely because the attack took place in a gay club. Which could well be the case, but the Latino angle hasn’t been fully examined. Just Sayin’
ropelight (596f46) — 6/16/2016 @ 5:34 pmI wonder what Australia’s emigration policies are like.
Do they have laws against leaving Australia?
Kevin M (25bbee) — 6/16/2016 @ 5:59 pmDon’t fail to consider that Donald Trump might win the presidency
That’s a singularity. Nearly anything could follow. But I guess it’s remotely possible.
Kevin M (25bbee) — 6/16/2016 @ 6:03 pmabbott tightened them up, trumbull probably is trying to soften them up,
narciso (732bc0) — 6/16/2016 @ 6:05 pmIf they don’t indict Hillary, I’m not sure that Comey resigns. He might want to make them fire him. One thing he could do would be to
Kevin M (25bbee) — 6/16/2016 @ 6:14 pmreleaseshare a lot quashed stuff with House oversight. Or maybe he just wants to speak his mind and make them fire him for it. They’re going to try to destroy him no matter what he does — that’s the Clinton way. Going quietly isn’t going to help. Witness Petreus.ah kevin the contempt you feel for trump, I feel 10 fold for inspector dreyfus, he was the one that unleashed the fitzgerald, as a creature of schumer, who retroactively tried to push the narrative about gonzales out of control, the night before the madrid train bombing,
narciso (732bc0) — 6/16/2016 @ 6:20 pmand that’s not the half of it,
http://www.wsj.com/articles/orlando-shooter-traveled-to-saudi-arabia-on-trip-organized-by-nyu-center-1466122172
when you consider who heads that outfit,
narciso (732bc0) — 6/16/2016 @ 6:24 pmit’s almost the weekend
anyone still dining out on orlando gay nightclub terror tragedy come monday is just outing themselves as pitiful
happyfeet (831175) — 6/16/2016 @ 6:27 pm“what if a huge segment of the Federal law-enforcement community — FBI agents, prosecutors, perhaps even CIA agents — resigns in disgust over this?…… How quickly could they hire and train new agents?”
Train? Did you say “train”? [LAUGHS] Hitlery will immediately and happily hire a bunch of untrained illegals in a heartbeat. The purpose of the Narrative is to target and destroy the Real Enemy: the straight, white, Christian, normative, historical American.
These are Trotskyites, folks. Get that clear.
hunson abedeer (d84b76) — 6/16/2016 @ 6:37 pmWhy should the FBI be considered less of a political arm of the Democrat Party than the utterly corrupt Department of Justice? Resignations imply a level of honor for which no evidence exists.
Rick Ballard (534b65) — 6/16/2016 @ 6:42 pmwell we know how fitz played favorites, in favor of fleischer and armitage, (erdogan’s man in washington at last call) over libby and rove,
narciso (732bc0) — 6/16/2016 @ 7:01 pmah kevin the contempt you feel for trump‘s supporters
FIFY
Kevin M (25bbee) — 6/16/2016 @ 7:03 pmmr. drudge’s #shootback flag is gonna be banned by twittertrash douchebag jack dorsey lickety lickety lickety split
happyfeet (831175) — 6/16/2016 @ 7:04 pmthis puts that last piece in perspective,
http://www.danielpipes.org/blog/2007/03/on-new-yorks-khalil-gibran-international
narciso (732bc0) — 6/16/2016 @ 7:04 pmspeaking of
what kind of self-hating homo has a twitter account anyway
happyfeet (831175) — 6/16/2016 @ 7:05 pmIn 2010, President Barack Obama set a national goal to double exports in his State of the Union address. Five years later, we’re only halfway there.
oops
halfway would be highly ambitious for a cowardly tatted-up slag-state like failmerica
don’t worry pickles
hillary and her majestic #nevertrump strap-on gonna fick you right up
just wait for it
happyfeet (831175) — 6/16/2016 @ 7:11 pmthis was alluded to before,
http://acecomments.mu.nu/?post=364105
narciso (732bc0) — 6/16/2016 @ 7:18 pmhabla di diabolo, (is that the right dubbing, rick)
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3645576/National-security-aide-Reagan-George-W-Bush-vote-CLINTON-Trump-doesn-t-appear-Republican.html
narciso (732bc0) — 6/16/2016 @ 7:35 pma little levity,
http://monsterhunternation.com/2016/06/16/ask-kuntzman/
narciso (732bc0) — 6/16/2016 @ 7:38 pmwasn’t Richard Armitage sleazy weirdo Colin Powell’s amateur butt-boy?
or am i getting him confused with another amateur butt-boy
happyfeet (831175) — 6/16/2016 @ 7:39 pmWell in that case, Ropelight, do the LKs, Maniac Latin Disciples Netas, DDP, etc. get a letter of marque to hunt jihadis? Does Rubio now embrace, rather than hide, the foam?
urbanleftbehind (9515d0) — 6/16/2016 @ 7:41 pmthere were several, haas, a small ferret who appears on morning joke, wilkerson, the real life version of a brendan gleeson character,
narciso (732bc0) — 6/16/2016 @ 7:42 pmthere should be amateur butt-boy trading cards for the bush era
happyfeet (831175) — 6/16/2016 @ 7:42 pmas a general use, state department is useless, they turned me down for instance, they had a analyst spying for the cubans for 30 years, powell was terrible, rice wasn;t able to do much
narciso (732bc0) — 6/16/2016 @ 7:46 pmto reverse course,
Amazing how so many line up to give the corrupt in power what they want. Trump included, just lining up, ready to kiss Hillary’s ass on Larry King or give her a few hundred thousand dollars, just to prove he knows she is his boss.
Trump just flip flops one day and says whatever con artists say and a bunch of Republicans decide Cruz and Walker and the rest of them are too liberal, but Hillary’s lapdog is the true champion.
It’s pretty funny in a sick way.
Dustin (2a8be7) — 6/16/2016 @ 7:51 pmNarciso,
In colloquial Italian it would be spuntano le corne or ecco – le corne. The Italians favor circumlocution when speaking of the devil. They might make an exception for Armitage.
Rick Ballard (534b65) — 6/16/2016 @ 7:54 pmscott walker lol – he had every opportunity – plenty of monies – and he blew it so bad
LOSER
and harvardtrash ted and his chubby sacky
they had every chance in the whirl and what did they do?
they suspended their campaign to snuffle deep up into the nethermost bigoted parts of Kim Davis and then barreled into Indiana screeching about tranny bathroom menace
That was just weird.
and decidedly unpresidential
happyfeet (831175) — 6/16/2016 @ 7:57 pmI hope the Obama does pick a fight with Comey over the fact that the FBI missed all sorts of clues regarding Omar Mateen. Just as they, and DHS and certainly other intel and national security agencies, missed all sorts of clues regarding the Tsarnaev brothers. Because they missed those clues because they were complying with Barack Obama’s decrees (not mere wishes) that they can not connect anything remotely concerning Islam with terrorism.
In other words it is Obama administration policy that the FBI and other agencies can not be permitted to acknowledge reality.
The emasculation of US intel, counter intel, and counter terrorism capabilities vis a vis Islamic terrorism didn’t start in the 2010/2011. But that’s when the emasculation really took off at break neck speed. A group of Muslim groups, most of which had been identified and demonstrated by the government to be front groups for radical Islamic groups,…
http://media.clarionproject.org/misc/pdf/43380629-2009-order-on-Holy-Land-Foundation-unindicted-coconspirator-list.pdf
…sent a letter to the WH objecting to counter terrorsm, intel, and counter intel trainers and training materials. Because they were being accurate in describing the Islamic terrorists and the ideology that motivates them.
Obama’s then national security adviser Brennan responded on White House stationary that they were going to get right on it. He could have used NSC stationary but this was coming from the top; from Obama. And Brennan was sending them an unmistakable signal that they had the President’s backing.
What did “get right on it” mean? It meant giving Muslim Brotherhood front groups, such as CAIR, ISNA, NAIT, as well as others whose names are still in the public record but were simply not party to the motions cited in the order I quote from above, the power to vet trainers and training materials. It meant wiping from all training materials any reference to Islam. It meant the trainers that Hamas had a problem with (through the front groups they established in the US to advance their interests and strategic goals) has their contracts cancelled and were blacklisted.
Meanwhile, these groups demanded that all FBI and other agents trained by the “Islamophic” trainers be reeducated. By Islamophobic, again, I mean accurate and effective. These trainers had studied the Islamic sources. But since now, under Obama, we have to pretend Islam has nothing to do with terrorism we are required to miss clues. How so? Both AQ and the Islamic State publish English language on-line magazines. But just like a prison guard has to understand gang code to understand when a imprisoned gang leader is trying to send an innocent looking latter that is actually ordering a hit or directing the gang’s criminal activities, unless you have studied the Islamic sources you will not really understand what AQ is saying in Inspire or IS is saying in Dabiq.
In fact, if you don’t understand anything about Islamic theology you won’t even understand what the significance of the name IS chose for it’s magazine. Without
These are the kind of people we have advising the government on how to train people to misunderstand terrorism. First of all, members of CAIR, which advises Muslims not to cooperate with law enforcement conducting terrorism investigations. While they’re advising Muslims not to cooperate with law enforcement they’re advising the government on what constitutes acceptable training for law enforcement? That’s insane. Then there’s this charming young lady, discussed in the post and comment thread, “Syrian Member of Homeland Security Subcommittee on Countering Violent Extremism: 9/11 Changed the World for Good:”
Whether she was a member of the MSA, is a member of CAIR, or is a member or former member of any other MB front groups, is not something I can establish. But her ties with at least one MB front group is well established.
http://www.mpac.org/programs/young-leaders/internships-fellowships/public-policy-alawa-intern.php
The Muslim Public Affairs Council (MPAC) was founded in the US by two brothers, Mather and Hassan Hathout, who eventually made their way to the US after they were released from prison in Egypt for their subversive activities on behalf of the MB. Initially they made their way to Kuwait, then Buffalo, then LA where they founded the Islamic Center of Southern California (you will note that the Islamic Centers Division is a MB front group listed in several exhibits from the HLF terror funding trial, and Islamic Centers are simply MB mosques that preach the doctrine of the founder of the MB, Hassan al Banna, as well as later MB “religious guides,” that doctrine being the foundation of all violent Islamic extremist groups). Later they founded a PR wing for the ICSC, and renamed it the MPAC when they ostensibly parted ways and became independent. They fact that the leadership and membership of both organizations were largely the same proves otherwise.
It has become for all practical purposes the US public relations arm of the MB. It accuses Israel of all sorts of crimes, such as harvesting organs from palestinians a la Dr. Mengele, and the president of the MPAC, Salam al-Marayati, gave a radio interview on 9/11/2001 suggesting Israel actually conducted the attack because it “diverts attention from what’s happening in the Palestinian territories so that they can go on with their aggression and occupation and apartheid policies.:” The MPAC routinely praise both US and foreign terrorists such as OBL as “freedom fighters” serving Allah while downplaying any link between Islam and terrorism. They oppose any and all US counter terrorism programs.
By the way, al Marayati is what is commonly referred to as a party operative, as he is very prominent in SoCal Democratic party circles and directly advises Barack Obama. Is it any wonder that Obama gives the MB what it wants, demanded Egypt release Morsi and reinstate him, and stabs Israel in the back?
Well, MPAC doesn’t oppose all US counter terror programs. Just any program that might be effective in targeting and fightng terrorist groups. MPAC supports counter terror programs that don’t fight terrorists or even identify them as was the case with Omar Mateen and the Tsarnaevs, will harm US national security, and that spread their false narratives, such as DHS’s dangerous and dishonest CVE program. Naturally Leila Alawa shares their goal of demanding the US stop using the vocabulary of the terrorists as that would identify them for who they are, and it would be productive when it comes to fighting them.
Along those lines, the Obama administration has implemented policies specifically intended to hide the identities and ideologies they are choosing to rely on for advice, for training, and to produce those training materials.
DHS’ Office of Civil Rights and Civil Liberties issued a directive in 2011 telling all agencies involved in countering terrorism not to use training materials or trainers that would say that “mainstream” Muslim organizations like CAIR are fronts for extremist groups. Which they are, as the DoJ overwhelmingly demonstrated in he HLF terror funding trial. It’s pretty hard to argue that they’re not fronts when the FBI recovered documents from the MB listing those “mainstream” Muslim groups as “our organizations and the organizations of our friends [Imagine if they all march according to one plan!!!].”
In 2012 the FBI implemented a new policy for selecting outside “subject matter experts” who would provide training and review training materials. And that policy established that just because an individual had ties to terrorist organizations, their association with such groups was constitutionally protected as long as the organization conducted legal activities (“advocacy”) as well as illegal activities (terrorism).
When Congress tried to find out who these outside “subject matter experts” were, the FBI did something unprecedented. Keep in mind these MB/Hamas front groups could demand veto power over USG counter terror training because they knew among things who was providing the training. It’s never been a secret before. But the government is now classifying the list because it’s doing the equivalent of relying on the KGB to control US intel training, intel collection, and national security policy during the cold war.
One more tidbit to show what huge anti-American lie this whole counter terror fraud is; one of the excuses Obama people make for refusing to link terrorism with Islam is that it would harm the relationship between law enforcement and these “mainstream Muslim partners” and would make America less safe.
This involves two lies. 1) if there really was not link between terrorism and Islam we would not need the help of these “mainstream” groups as, how can they help us with something that has nothing to do with them? And, 2) the only relationship these groups have with law enforcement is to obstruct investigations. Remember, CAIR tells Muslims not to cooperate with the LEOs.
I’m all for this traitorous President and his minions trying to blame Comey for this President’s own policies. Comey had nothing to do with them. He took over from Robert Mueller in 2013 after all this was a done deal. So, yeath, let’s get it on. It’s Obama and his willing accomplices who have betrayed the nation by blinding our counter terror services, giving them a lobotomy, and then handcuffing them.
Besides, they can demand his resignation all they want. He serves a fixed ten year term. He’s untouchable.
Steve57 (e33d44) — 6/16/2016 @ 7:57 pmas in the horn, interesting tidbit,
will you get over macho grande already!
narciso (732bc0) — 6/16/2016 @ 7:58 pmyes, he has been pushing back on ferguson, I’ll give him that, in the land of the blind, where haney, coughlin, deuce martinez have been forced out, he is the one eyed man,
narciso (732bc0) — 6/16/2016 @ 8:02 pmThey can’t fire him. He can’t be removed. He’s in office until 2023 whether Obama or Clinton like it or not.
Obama can direct the DoJ to indict him on trumped up charges. It would be the most obvious political prosecution in history, but Obama is a banana republic-style dictator and doesn’t care how it looks because he’s convinced no one is going to do anything about it, so Comey has to be careful about that.
Steve57 (e33d44) — 6/16/2016 @ 8:04 pmI’m sure my estimate of the unethical, amoral, unqualified ignoramus will improve greatly once the Master Persuader gets his SuperMesmerizer out of hock. Until he does so, I remain part of the 55%.
Rick Ballard (534b65) — 6/16/2016 @ 8:05 pmIf this has been noted on a different thread, apologies.
kishnevi (125429) — 6/16/2016 @ 8:06 pmBut UK gun laws acheived another notable”success” today.
http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-36550304
I remain part of the 55%.
them ones is poopers
just so you know
happyfeet (831175) — 6/16/2016 @ 8:08 pmit is a sad tragic tale, kish, being utilized by the remain forces, like a sledgehammer,
narciso (732bc0) — 6/16/2016 @ 8:15 pma little context, about the dangers of divining,
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3640880/Clinton-gets-primary-bounce-wrapping-nomination-leads-Trump-7-points-pollsters-talked-7-cent-Democrats-Republicans.html
narciso (732bc0) — 6/16/2016 @ 8:20 pmhappyfeet, Walker may not be perfect, but he has won tough elections and made substantial progress, improving the lives of others.
That’s much more than will ever be said for your boy, the Hillary ass kisser.
Dustin (2a8be7) — 6/16/2016 @ 8:40 pmthe problem lies less with the candidates, than their high priced advisors, take dayspring who ran his pac, into the ground, wiley wasn’t much better,
narciso (732bc0) — 6/16/2016 @ 8:45 pmSorry, this is completely OT, but I just thought I’d share it. I think we always need some good art to buck us up in these exasperating times.
My two favorite movies are Bergman’s “Persona” and Robert Altman’s “Nashville”. Here, from “Nashville,” is the great scene where Ronee Blakley delivers two masterful singing performances and then, weirdly, proceeds to have a nervous breakdown on stage. Cinema and music at their finest.
“I’d give a lot to love you
The way I used to do,
Wish I could.”
Enjoy. Although maybe “enjoy” isn’t the accurate word.
https://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=youtube+nashville+dues+ronee+blakley&view=detail&mid=421A1D56861D298B30A4421A1D56861D298B30A4&FORM=VIRE
hunson abedeer (d84b76) — 6/16/2016 @ 9:04 pmI know it’s overdone, but I’m classically inclined,
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gp5JCrSXkJY
or course we could also try barry mcguire,
narciso (732bc0) — 6/16/2016 @ 9:12 pmWeather Orlando benefits Hillary or not is largely irrelevant, the choice between Hillary and Donald Trump is a no-brainer. Sort of binary:
If you like the way things have been going for the last 7+ years => vote for Hillary, she’ll continue Obama’s anti-American agenda. We’ll have fewer jobs, more regulation, accelerating borrowing, higher taxes, more crime, more immigrants, more terrorism, more squandering of the nation we love.
If you’d like to see things change, if you’d like to see an America you can be proud of, one that’s moving in the right direction => Vote Trump.
ropelight (596f46) — 6/16/2016 @ 9:46 pmthey don’t really care, they trust the devil they know, even though every notable moment in her career has been about crushing dissent through state power, from watergate to benghazi,
narciso (732bc0) — 6/16/2016 @ 10:02 pmI was poking around Schindler’s site.
https://20committee.com/
He wrote other articles about the Orlando mass murder. Of course, to read them in their entirely to have to go to The Observer to “Read More.”
I found this one interesting; it’s similar to what I was driving at @49:
http://observer.com/2016/06/the-road-to-orlando/
I hadn’t read this when I wrote my epic @49, but as Schindler notes none of this is a big secret. I’ve never considered myself in the exact terms “counter terrorism professional.” But I was a career Naval intelligence officer and when I was recalled after 9/11/01 it was to “provide intelligence support to force protection.” So, I think by any definition I’d qualify. This suicidal PC nonsense started under Bush, but it got much much worse after I retired and Obama was elected. Schindler talks about walking a fine line between being able to honestly discuss “political Islam” and stigmatizing all Muslims. I walked that line by pointing out that I am not a theologian, I was not trying to settle any disputes about what is “true Islam.” I could care less what true Islam teaches; that’s for Muslims to decide. My job was to simply learn what groups like AQ thought Islam teaches as they were the threat.
You could get away with that under Bush, but you can no longer get away with it under Obama. And there’s a reason for it.
Obama has decided to team up with some Muslim extremists to counter other Muslim extremists. Specifically, the Muslim Brotherhood. But Hassan al-Banna, the founder of the MB, is really the philosophical “father” of AQ, ISIS, and every other terrorist group that came later. They share the same theology, political ideology, and the same goals, but they differ on tactics to the extent that the MB is willing to abandon violence when they don’t believe the costs are worth it. But the MB isn’t opposed to violence. They just do a risk assessment and come up with different answers than groups like AQ. Sometimes; Hamas, the Gazan branch of the MB, has arrived at the same answer as AQ.
In order to hide the fact that Obama has decided to team up with some Muslim extremists to opposed other Muslim extremists, the answer that “I am not a theologian, I’m just trying to understand what AQ or IS believes Islam teaches,” can no longer be tolerated.
Because their understanding of what Islam teaches is no different that those Obama wants to partner with. And has partnered with. And the truth must not get out.
Steve57 (e33d44) — 6/16/2016 @ 11:08 pmUber, Lyft threaten to leave Chicago ahead of license vote
happyfeet (831175) — 6/17/2016 @ 4:51 amThank you, happyfeet. That’s good news. Ask me why.
nk (dbc370) — 6/17/2016 @ 5:52 ami’m curious why
for me it’ll save me a lot of money
happyfeet (831175) — 6/17/2016 @ 6:16 amUber only accepts “good fares”. But those “good fares” are the bread and butter of the radio-dispatched cabs. If Uber supplants enough cabs, we will have 1) Uber giving convenient rides in good neighborhoods; 2) cruising cabs downtown, and 3) very little service anywhere else. It’s already happened to us — we tried to get Uber to take us from Greektown to a second-ring suburb and we were turned down. A Yellow Cab was happy to do it. So that sealed it — pick dependable not trendy.
“Gypsy cabs”, which is reall what Uber is, have been around longer than licensed cabs to serve the areas the cab companies did not. But that has changed with licensed minority owner-operators who are not afraid to go anywhere. But if Uber takes their “good fares”, they’ll be screwed.
nk (dbc370) — 6/17/2016 @ 6:31 amI’m shocked! that a #4Hillary! (the commie biotch) supporter would be for stopping competition between cabs. Oh the horror! There’s competition for “the good” fares. First off Uber is cheaper, period. We have several friends in Philly who because they live in Center City don’t own cars. Yellow costs $80+tip to get to my house. Uber $25. Big difference, think that might be part of the problem? Or are the Uber cars too clean? Get there too quickly? Identify both the car and driver visually on your phone for security? Don’t smell like curry or worse.
There is cab service anywhere you’re willing to pay to get. Period.
Yellow cab has to pick you up, they’re medallion cabs. Uber are private people using their own cars. You were probably turned down by the Uber driver due to the seedy reputation of Greektown. They probably figured you were gonna stiff them for the fare. You see, Greeks can be dependable and not trendy too.
Rev. Hoagie© (734193) — 6/17/2016 @ 6:57 amSo how do you feel about a food truck, with home-cooked meals, in front of your restaurant, selling your top-sellers at half your price?
nk (dbc370) — 6/17/2016 @ 7:05 amNow Uber prices are 25/80ths of Yellow. What will be they be when it’s only Uber? Have you ever heard the expression “predatory pricing”?
nk (dbc370) — 6/17/2016 @ 7:07 amSo nk thinks it’s good news the Chicago crime syndicate otherwise known as the government wants to regulate Yellow Cab competition out of business thereby limiting the consumers choices and keeping an overpriced monopoly protected. Nk doesn’t care how many Uber drivers are put out of business.
Rev. Hoagie© (734193) — 6/17/2016 @ 7:08 amSeems comrade nk is letting his fake “conservatism” fall away in wake of his support for a commie President. Good for you nk, the truth shall set you free.
cabs are dirty though
ubers are nice
last cab i got in, the cabbie had the tipping part set to default at a minimum 20%
i infer from this that cabbies are sleazy
in the very near future all of this’ll be done by robots anyway
so i don’t really see the harm in the transitional use of lyft and uber
happyfeet (831175) — 6/17/2016 @ 7:11 amWe’ve all heard your arguments in #70 and #71 before, nk. If you have free markets the world won’t come to an end. “Predatory pricing” is a term dreamed up by commie lawyers to curb competition so yeah, I heard of it. You really do want America to become the sh!thole Greece has become, don’t you?
Rev. Hoagie© (734193) — 6/17/2016 @ 7:13 amwhy do all these comments gotta be so mean on people
it’s Friday
happyfeet (831175) — 6/17/2016 @ 7:19 am“So nk thinks it’s good news the Chicago crime syndicate otherwise known as the government wants to regulate Yellow Cab competition out of business thereby limiting the consumers choices and keeping an overpriced monopoly protected.”
– Hoagie
This from the guy who repeatedly claims that we need a wall to keep Mexican labour from stealing “our” jobs. You know: the jobs that Mexican workers are willing to do for longer hours, for less pay. And you have the gall to chastise nk for “keeping an overpriced monopoly protected”?
Who’s the commie biotch now?
You can be a nationalist, or a capitalist. Make up your mind.
Leviticus (efada1) — 6/17/2016 @ 7:22 amDon’t smell like curry or worse.
Adios, Hoagie.
nk (dbc370) — 6/17/2016 @ 7:24 amenemy action, clearly,
http://www.thelocal.de/20160616/germany-must-protect-osama-bin-laden-bodyguard-court-rules
narciso (732bc0) — 6/17/2016 @ 7:40 am“the guy who repeatedly claims that we need a wall to keep Mexican labour from stealing “our” jobs.”
I don’t understand the scare quotes around “our” jobs. Yes, they are in fact OUR jobs. We live here, and have a right to do so, it’s “our” country after all (since you spell labor with a u, maybe it’s not yours, Knuckles), and have a right to work at OUR jobs. Illegal aliens, de facto, do NOT have a right to live or work here. If they’re so admirably hard-working, why don’t they just work hard to improve their own country so it’s not a vast human latrine that everybody wants to flee? Do you live in “your” home? Why can’t I just plop 16 illegal Somalis on “your” couch? Since you’re so virtuous and high-minded, you can pay to feed, clothe, and shelter them, with “your” money, which as all good leftards know isn’t really “yours” anyway. You have a nice home? You didn’t build that. We’re giving it to illegals, because liberalism.
hunson abedeer (d84b76) — 6/17/2016 @ 7:52 amWhat’s this “we” stuff, Christoph? You’re a Canadian.
nk (dbc370) — 6/17/2016 @ 7:56 amno dots connected,
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3646692/Omar-Mateen-conversation-suicide-bomber-Moner-Mohammad-Abu-Salha-says-friend.html
narciso (732bc0) — 6/17/2016 @ 8:02 amSeriously, Leviticus? You believe protecting jobs in America from illegal aliens who shouldn’t even be here is equal to our government picking winners and losers through regulation and restricting competition? Then you too have crossed the line and are now a #4Hillary!(the commie biotch) supporter and apologist. Yes, she is still the biotch now!
And just so you know comrade Leviticus, I can be both a nationalist an a capitalist if I so choose However, you can’t be both a communist and a conservative as they’re mutually exclusive. Sorry for the news.
Rev. Hoagie© (734193) — 6/17/2016 @ 8:25 amRev Hoagie
You are, I am afraid, a bit confused. If the government is saying you can not hire X, that is regulation and restricted competition.
The most you can say is that for reasons a,b,c that bit of regulation and restricted competition is a good thing. But strict free market it is not.
Which is why noting that set of facts is neither supporting Hillary nor advocating commumism.
kishnevi (a1a81b) — 6/17/2016 @ 8:44 amwell yorkshire is how they spell tucson
http://www.breitbart.com/london/2016/06/17/project-mourn-remains-dirty-politicking-has-hit-an-all-time-low/
narciso (732bc0) — 6/17/2016 @ 8:45 amkishnevi, a flourishing taxi cab industry is vital to Chicago’s quality of life and to its economic life. For visitors and for residents. It’s not a philosophical question.
nk (dbc370) — 6/17/2016 @ 9:11 amto flourish, the filthy cabs, they need competition
there’s simply not enough purell
happyfeet (831175) — 6/17/2016 @ 3:01 pmnothing to see here,
http://dailycaller.com/2016/06/17/2013-orlando-terrorist-threatened-to-kill-fla-sheriff-and-his-family-fbi-dismissed-threat/
narciso (732bc0) — 6/17/2016 @ 3:50 pm88. But he didn;t do it at an airport!
Sammy Finkelman (c5cea5) — 6/17/2016 @ 4:04 pmThe Florida killer signed over some property to family members at very nominal price in April, so he must have decided to do something by then.
Sammy Finkelman (c5cea5) — 6/17/2016 @ 4:06 pm“If one law, passed anywhere, can sacrifice a child to help us conceal the hidden identities of Muslim Brotherhood members and to protect the Ummah from what is righteously justifiable anger, it will have been worth all the dead alligators.”
Steve57 (e33d44) — 6/17/2016 @ 5:36 pm[Quote: Me, having completed the “transition.”]
By the way, shouldn’t sufficient mastery of the petty officer’s manual of cutlass count as a martial art?
I say yes.
http://www.navyandmarine.org/cutlassmanual/1906cutlass.pdf
Steve57 (e33d44) — 6/17/2016 @ 6:06 pmThere is a picture of the Afghani moslem shooter’s dad at HilLIARy’s office. http://libertyalliance.com/39292-2/
Steve (fc37de) — 6/18/2016 @ 11:39 amthings that make you go hmm,
http://www.breitbart.com/national-security/2016/06/17/nyu-paid-orlando-jihadis-trip-saudi-arabia/
narciso (732bc0) — 6/18/2016 @ 2:17 pmwhen they insist it’s one thing, it’s likely something else,
http://observer.com/2016/06/false-flags-the-kremlins-hidden-cyber-hand/
narciso (732bc0) — 6/18/2016 @ 2:41 pmjust one more question sir,
http://www.teaparty.org/saudi-imam-two-hijackers-lingering-mystery-911-171536/
narciso (732bc0) — 6/18/2016 @ 3:52 pmI FEEL SO SAFE: Doctor listed on psych-evaluation carried out on Omar Mateen by G4S says she never saw him and was not living in Florida at the time it was conducted. “A doctor who is listed on the psychological evaluation for Orlando shooter, Omar Mateen, said she did not see him and she was not even living in Florida at the time when G4S security firm ordered the evaluation. Psychologist, Dr Carol Nudelman, who now lives in Colorado, said in a statement released through her attorneys to the Miami Herald that she never evaluated Mateen nine years ago for G4S, a security firm that was known as Wackenhut at the time. However, Nudelman’s name appears on the document in Florida’s state records, which cleared Mateen to carry a firearm as a private security guard.”
https://pjmedia.com/instapundit/236613/
Colonel Haiku (3bf827) — 6/18/2016 @ 4:53 pmfbi lol
happyfeet (831175) — 6/18/2016 @ 5:13 pmsteve@93. I kind of figured Hillary Clinton, while Secetary of State, would be involved in possible negotiations with the Taliban, and that this goes back some years. No, it doesn’t mean the killer’s father planned the massacre – the electorate is not anti-American, nor is there any election coming up, but his father hoped to be chosen undemocratically at the end of negotiations as a “transitional president of Afganistan. The only connection with his son could be that helped put delusions of grandeur into his mind.
narciso@94 I think he still had to pay for it. He trip was booked at the same time as 3 other people “believed to be family members” Well, maybe it’s true they were family members, and maybe it’s not. They must have paid for it. About 80 people altogether took the trip – they didn’t all stick 100% to the itinerary. This is not the pilgrimage to Mecca – in fact neither of his two trips to Saudi Arabia, in 2011 and 2012, was. You would think the pilgrimage to Meca was more important.
narciso@95. I think that’s very possible. In fact I think it may be more than just the Cyber Caliphate that is really being run by Russia – the claims of responsibility may really come from there and maybe even some of the terrorist attacks themselves. I thought that about the Charlie Hebdo attacks, where somehow two people loyal to different terrorists groups acted together and both did not use the names that the terrorists groups called themselves. al Qaeda in Yemen calls itself Al Qaeda in the Arabian Peninsula and ISIS calls itself Islamic State.
Russia would have names of jihadists from the west and then it’s only necessary to secretly recruit them, while pretending to be ISIS, all for the purooses of trying to get the west to be less hostile to Russia because of a common enemy.
I might suspect the San Bernardino attackers as well, and the one in Orlando, and maybe the whole thing that was being run out of Belgium. We have people whose connections go back a few years, yet who weren’t active any longer. All at some point on a terrorism watch list, and maybe communicated to the Russians. If there is a Russian connection, it’s well hidden.
Whenever somebody destroys evidence, they are trying to protect other people, so I think there must be somebody else involved with the San Bernardino attacks. That includes Adam Lanza, the Sandy Hook killer, although I have no idea who that might in that case, maybe some other computer gaming nerd, but he must have discussed his ideas with somebody. What’s different with the Orlando killer is that he doesn’t seem to have destroyed any cell phones or computer hard disks. With Orlando we don’t know any connection to anyone except that killer knew to go on to Facebook right before the attack and declare loyalty to ISIS. He also was speaking some foreign langage to somebody when trying to buy body armor.
narciso@96. There will be a 60 Minutes story this Sunday on the unreleased pages of the 9/1 report.
The sudden resignation of the chief of Saudi intelligence on Sept. 1, 2001 probably is connected in some way to this. Prince Turki still makes appearances for his government.
Sammy Finkelman (7a22e4) — 6/18/2016 @ 11:39 pmGood allah, sammeh,
narciso (732bc0) — 6/19/2016 @ 6:06 am101. Uber and Lyft may indeed be transitional. Now if we can take that SJW skank from the other thread and flight test this baby over the Everglades:
https://pjmedia.com/news-and-politics/2016/06/16/buckle-up-hang-on-tight-nevada-wants-to-put-you-into-a-drone-taxi/
urbanleftbehind (847a06) — 6/19/2016 @ 8:32 am100. narciso (732bc0) — 6/19/2016 @ 6:06 am
Which particvular comment or comments, does that apply to? Russia being possibly responsible for he Orlando or other attacks? (Putin did that back in 1999 in Moscow, and that probably led to his rise to power)
http://www.nybooks.com/articles/2012/11/22/finally-we-know-about-moscow-bombings/
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Explanation_attempts_for_the_Russian_apartment_bombings
See also:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_apartment_bombings
What about that NYU didn’t actually pay for his two trips to Saudi Arabia in 2011 and 2012, and you should look at what links him to the 3 other people with whiom the tikets were boooked at the sqame time?
It is not about the 60 Minutes story that will be on tonight, I assume.
Sammy Finkelman (7a22e4) — 6/19/2016 @ 9:04 amThe 60 Minutes story was a re-run, which I don’t think I saw the first time. It started at about 7:20 pm. They re-ran a story of smart guns – and how any attempt to sell them has been stopped by NRA pressure and a New Jersey law – before that. The 9/11 story was first run in April.
The story refers to 28 pages in a Joint House and Senate investigation committee in 2003. It was turned over to the 9/11 commission and some of it, but not all of it. It appears in the 9/11 report, but buried in footnotes mostly.
The big focus is on two of the hijackers who arrived in 2000 from Malaysia and were set up in life, and also in flight school. One of the people helping them, who claimed to have met them accidentally, had a no show job for something with Saudi availation – which basically means he was working for Saudi intelligence although 60 Minutes didn’t say intelligence but just teh Saudi government.
60 Minutes points to a line in the 9/11 report which says that the Saudi government didn’t authorize, nor did senior Saudi officials acting individually, giving money to the hijackers or something. There is a snippet of an interview with lawyers suing the Saudi government with the lawyer saying maybe officials who weren’t so senior.
I see another possibility: Misappropriated government funds, or funds not intended by the top officials for that purpose.
More exactly:
http://www.cbsnews.com/news/60-minutes-911-classified-report-steve-kroft/
What does that leave out? Misappropriation of government money, or use in way not quite intended or carelessness in agreeing to some covert operation.
The sort of thing that could get the head of intelligence suddenly fired.
What does 60 Minutes say exactly?
No, no, no, no, no.
Not people using their own money. People using government money. Who maybe got approval from high up to spend the money on somewhat false pretences. After all, the chief of Saudi intelligence was probably fired 10 days before September 11. And they have got people in the U.S. government protecting that secret for the Saudis for years.
One question is why only 2 of the hijackers? The others maybe were helped another way, I suppose.
Prince Turki was later Ambassador to the UK (2003-2005) and the United States (2005-2006) He is still around doing things for his government. This past April he was in Washington at the Institute for Near East Policy where a conversation was staged beteen him and Israeli general Yaakov Amidror.
Eli Lake wrote that Prince Turki made it clear that there would be no Saudi recognition of Israel (in spite of the new common interests they claim?) until there was a “just peace” with the Palestinians. Since the Saudis are in a position to veto any peace, in fact to strangle it in its cradle, this just means that there won’t be diplomatic relations between Saudi Arabia and Israel until Saudi Arabia decides wants it, which it doesn’t, and that they are hiding behind the Palestinian Authority. Saudi recognition needs to come before, not after.
Sammy Finkelman (7a22e4) — 6/19/2016 @ 5:17 pmgeneralized sammy, your ability to ignore what’s right in front of you, persons who enable criminality even as private individuals are liable, for their behavior, the cybercaliphate, seemed a convenient target, like with north korea, a few years ago, for an act that had the fingerprints, of volodya, as wikileaks and snowden were before him,
re prince turki he is the nephew of the late head of general intelligence, kamal adham, a share holder in bcci, so it was the family business,
narciso (732bc0) — 6/19/2016 @ 5:23 pmEmigration policies?! Australia’s a free country, and doesn’t prevent anyone from leaving. But why does that interest you? Immigration’s a different matter. Getting permanent residence in Australia is about the same level of difficulty as doing so in the USA.
Milhouse (87c499) — 6/21/2016 @ 8:21 am