Patterico's Pontifications

5/9/2016

Americans Face a Stark Choice This November: Supporting Hillary for President Edition

Filed under: General,Stark Choice — Patterico @ 10:26 pm

Americans have a clear choice in the upcoming presidential election.

Do you want the candidate who thought Hillary Clinton should be president in 2008? (Hillary, because she ran?)

Or the candidate who thought Hillary Clinton should be president in 2008? (Trump, because he donated to her.)

P.S. Thanks to DRJ for the link. I know, there is nothing new here. But it bears repeating.

P.P.S. This is Part Three of the ongoing Stark Choice series. A new Patterico.com semi-regular feature! Read them all!

98 Responses to “Americans Face a Stark Choice This November: Supporting Hillary for President Edition”

  1. Ah, choice.

    Patterico (86c8ed)

  2. Ready for a troll invasion on this one, Patterico? I predict lots of vulgarity, and little capitalization.

    But I’m glad you posted it.

    Simon Jester (c5ab4f)

  3. ronnie reagan voted for roosevelt
    and he got divorced
    (LOL)

    Cruz Supporter (102c9a)

  4. Patterico, I don’t suppose there is any chance to get you to give up your jihad against Trump, is there? Look, Trump is a pretty vile person, but he hasn’t betrayed his country by selling influence to foreigners the way Hillary has. I understand why you are angry and frustrated; a lot of Trump’s fans are as vile as Trump is. But what we conservatives are coming up against here is the unpleasant realization that we aren’t as influential as we thought. The Tea Party movement and a few other victories had us believing that we were growing in influence in the Republican party, and any election now we would be able to nominate a candidate who shared some of our beliefs. But we have seen an unbroken string of disappointments since 1976.

    Now I think it’s time to face the facts: there just aren’t that many of us. We can’t win a national election on our own; we can’t even win a national nomination on our own. If we want to have any influence at all, then we need allies. And we can’t demand ideological purity of those allies because if they were what we consider ideologically pure, then they would be us. And there aren’t enough of us (see above).

    So we have tried the libertarian allies. They’re reasonably good people. Very rational. Very opposed to totalitarianism, except that they are so in favor of gay marriage that they are willing to take a little predictable totalitarianism against Christians because letting gays get married is just that vital. Tend to hate police and prosecutors and soldiers and others who are responsible for keeping us safe. Can’t allow Christians to post the Ten Commandments because that’s like an establishment of religion, and love the idea of physician-assisted suicide. Fully in favor of bringing in millions of foreigners who love socialism and can’t speak English and take jobs away from unskilled Americans. So, not really perfect allies. But we got along with them mostly and accomplished a few good things.

    Now we have the Trumpkins. They aren’t perfect allies either. They tend to be rude and crude, but let’s be honest–they have some legitimate things to be angry about. They tend to favor more government and disfavor free trade, but then almost everyone except the libertarians and conservatives do. But we have a lot in common with them. They are opposed to the tyrannical Left and are better allies on that issue than the libertarians turned out to be. They tend to be better on social issues than either the Left or the libertarians. They tend to be opposed to the many social programs that let people not work. Maybe there is more common ground.

    So, they aren’t allies that will let us accomplish all of our goals, or probably even most of them.
    But if we refuse to work with them we will never accomplish any of our goals. Some strategic thinking is called for here.

    Cugel (75dd55)

  5. If I were a GOP Delegate, I’d be wanting a pin that said “No Sh1t Sandwich: #NeverTrump”

    Kevin M (25bbee)

  6. “Now we have the Trumpkins. They aren’t perfect allies either. They tend to be rude and crude, …… Maybe there is more common ground.”

    Encouraging, enabling, and electing ignorant, anti-Constitutional people is not a long term strategy. What would it motivate them to do next time?

    Luke Stywalker (37bdb9)

  7. do all your local fans a favor, and give us the 411 on the judges elections this June.

    *that’s* a public service, and one i’ve been grateful for all these years.

    redc1c4 (7ad526)

  8. I don’t want Hillary to be president. The rest is details.

    Tom Van Dyke (3623ea)

  9. I will take Trump over the muzzie luvin Paul Ryan and the republican party. How any conservative could back ryan is beyond me. Hang the useless prick.

    mg (31009b)

  10. Put Ryan in a burka, chain him to a wall and stone him to death.

    mg (31009b)

  11. Cugel, I appreciate that you are at least trying to state the case rationally instead of “vote Trump or else”. I recognize that a good portion- likely at least 1/2- of the 60% of the voting conservatives who viscerally hate Trunop will come around to your way of thinking and vote for him. They will feel they have no other choice. Trapped, you might call it. But here’ the rub: it’s a choice that gets us nothing. Just as an example, Trump just got through stating that we could get out of debt so easily if we just printed more money. Um, Mr Best Businessman in the World, you do understand that will ramp up inflation like we haven’t seen since 1923 Germany, right? It’ll be YUUUUUUGE.

    Sorry Cugel, but this is the choice you are asking me to make. I cannot in good conscience make it.

    Bill H (971e5f)

  12. Trump just got through stating that we could get out of debt so easily if we just printed more money.

    And it’s not even an original idea. Remember that Obama floated that ridiculous trillion dollar coin idea just a couple of years ago. Sorta gives you an idea where Trump’s thought process is at.

    Bill H (971e5f)

  13. Nah, I’m with mg. Where was Paul Ryan when my fan belt broke? I had to call AAA. Forget the GOP.

    nk (dbc370)

  14. Couple of points:
    1. voting for Trump will not put Hillary in the White House
    2. if you don’t vote or are not voting, quit whining

    cedarhill (301e22)

  15. Will not voting for Trump put Hillary in the White House?

    nk (dbc370)

  16. 2. if you don’t vote or are not voting, quit whining

    cedarhill (301e22) — 5/10/2016 @ 4:49 am

    As far as I know, the only poster here who has openly said they weren’t voting was Happyfeet.

    Bill H (971e5f)

  17. 1. voting for Trump will not put Hillary in the White House

    cedarhill (301e22) — 5/10/2016 @ 4:49 am

    But the point I’ve tried to make to you is, in California that won’t matter. You can stomp your feet however much you like, this state, barring a miracle is going for Hillary.

    Bill H (971e5f)

  18. A petulant child taking a piss in the punch bowl is all I see.

    Drink deep fool.

    papertiger (c2d6da)

  19. You just defined Trumpkins, papertiger. Now go smear the stuff from your diaper on the wall of your playpen. But I’ve got a secret for you. Trump is not going to come and change your diaper and powder your behind. He says that’s women’s work.

    nk (dbc370)

  20. Donald Trump earned the GOP nomination, he won the primary elections. Now, he stands alone atop the GOP going into the general election. Attempts to deny that reality only serve to strengthen his Democrat opponents. Opposition to Trump is aid and comfort to his Democrat challengers. Deal with it.

    ropelight (6dce3e)

  21. They tend to be rude and crude, but let’s be honest–they have some legitimate things to be angry about. They tend to favor more government and disfavor free trade, but then almost everyone except the libertarians and conservatives do.

    You had me at “they tend to favor more government.”

    The stuff they’re angry about is the result of big government. But they’re too uninvolved and poorly educated to understand that. The stuff you say they’re good allies about, I don’t even understand. They are “opposed to the tyrannical Left” but favor big government policies? Then how are they opposed to the left? What you mean is that they support big government looting people, but they want to give the loot to different folks (I guess whites instead of blacks and Hispanics?). Nope. Can’t sign on to that. Won’t sign onto that. Will never sign onto that.

    Everyone’s mistake is seeing all this as ideological. First, we were told that the rage against the establishment was because we put in Republicans who were too soft in accomplishing their goals, like truly reining in crony capitalism, repealing ObamaCare, and cutting spending. I kept saying, no, because if those were truly their issues they’d go with Cruz, not Trump. Now everyone has flipped, and instead of assuming that these people are actually raging small-government conservatives, everyone takes their support for Trump as an indication that they now love big government.

    Nah. They’re low information people; they’re new voters and/or Democrats; they want to be entertained when they turn on the tube; they love a guy who goes around telling everyone to fuck off because ha ha look at that. But they’d support Trump if he were truly a raging Goldwater type policy-wise. They just like a guy who, while he leaves me cold, is perceived by the masses to be “entertaining.” This is what happens when you give immense political power to the masses.

    I have no ready solution, but my ideas are: educating people; structural changes that put more power at a local level; and building a coalition of motivated people to steamroll the people who ultimately care nothing about policy. None of it is going to work in the near term; maybe it won’t work in the long term either. I don’t know if it will ever get better, but I do know it will get worse before it gets better.

    Patterico (86c8ed)

  22. Speaking of taking the piss, Loretta Lynch vows to stand with transgenders.

    Careful you don’t get any on your shoes, Loretta. And since I guess she’s foreign to urinals, the etiquette is no peeking.

    papertiger (c2d6da)

  23. Donald Trump earned the GOP nomination, he won the primary elections. Now, he stands alone atop the GOP going into the general election. Attempts to deny that reality only serve to strengthen his Democrat opponents. Opposition to Trump is aid and comfort to his Democrat challengers. Deal with it.

    I’m dealing with it, in part, by noting that opposition to Hillary just gives aid and comfort to her Democrat challenger.

    We have no choice. Democrat or Democrat. The whole “line up behind our shitty candidate because otherwise the Democrat wins” thing doesn’t work when our shitty candidate is also a Democrat.

    Pass. And I will continue to encourage others to pass, too, on the whole thing — and to work instead on spreading these principles of limited government that the Smart Crowd has decided are now utterly irrelevant, so just go with the flow, man. I won’t.

    Patterico (86c8ed)

  24. #ropelite,

    Trump doesn’t become the nominee until the delegates at the Convention say so. That’s how it works. Deal with it.

    Cruz Supporter (102c9a)

  25. Patterico Exclusive: Rush Limbaugh is a secret Democrat, deep undercover.

    We have proof from 2008 when he led a movement to nominate Hillary Clinton for President.

    papertiger (c2d6da)

  26. Speaking of taking the piss, Loretta Lynch vows to stand with transgenders.

    Yay. If only there were a decent candidate for president who thought it was stupid to pile on North Carolina for this law . . .

    . . . oh yeah, except your idiot candidate, who stands with Loretta on this issue, drove out that decent candidate.

    Patterico (86c8ed)

  27. He is the presumptive toupee.

    nk (dbc370)

  28. And the top men of the senate, all gave assent to her, illustrating the point resistance is useless when you’re a democrat.

    narciso (1b4366)

  29. He did back guiliani, and in the fall he supported maverick, we saw what happened to eich when he backer the wrong horse.

    narciso (1b4366)

  30. That woman, Loretta Lynch, has porked up. She’s gained at least 50 pounds since she was confirmed. It might be informative now to name the Republican Senators who approved her nomination:

    Ten Republican senators broke ranks and sided with Democrats to get Lynch over the 50-vote threshold: Kelly Ayotte (N.H.), Orrin Hatch (Utah), Lindsey Graham (S.C.), Susan Collins (Maine), Jeff Flake (Ariz.), Mark Kirk (Ill.), Rob Portman (Ohio), Thad Cochran (Miss.), Ron Johnson (Wis.) and Mitch McConnell (Ky.).

    Ayotte, Kirk, Portman and Johnson are up for reelection in 2016. Texas Sen. Ted Cruz, a Republican presidential candidate who said he would oppose Lynch, missed the vote.

    These turncoats should be rejected at the earliest opportunity.

    ropelight (6dce3e)

  31. How many supported lurch or hagel or even carter, who presides over the smallest army since 1940, go back to your two minute hate.

    narciso (1b4366)

  32. Hillary stands with transgenders also.

    (someone needs to tell her she’s in the wrong restroom. Maybe Huma?)

    papertiger (c2d6da)

  33. #31 ropelite,

    Once again, you’re attacking a woman’s physical appearance—just like your father figure The Mr Donald likes to do. Her physique has nothing to do with how bad of an AG she is.
    Lynch is a really bad AG, but anyone nominated by Barack was going to be bad.

    Cruz Supporter (102c9a)

  34. 31. …These turncoats should be rejected at the earliest opportunity.

    ropelight (6dce3e) — 5/10/2016 @ 6:55 am

    Self-awareness just isn’t part of your personality make-up, is it, ropelight?

    You fell head-over-heels and you’re still drinking the kool-aid for a candidate who is more of liberal Democrat than those turncoats will ever be.

    Steve57 (412496)

  35. per Patterico’s commutative principle of political juxtaposition, Rush Limbaugh is a closet Democrat.

    It goes like this, if you supported Hillary’s failed run at the nomination in ’08 tangentially in any way, then you are a Democrat forever.

    papertiger (c2d6da)

  36. Its the same self destructive choice that yielded sadik khan, evidence of his misdeeds were irrelevant.

    narciso (1b4366)

  37. Cruz voted No on Lynch in the Judiciary Committe and on cloture, which were the votes that mattered. The final vote was a show vote. The Senate is addicted to show votes.

    DRJ (15874d)

  38. If you want dissent, heck institutional insurrection, vote republican.

    narciso (1b4366)

  39. Trump and Lunch agree on the North Carolina anti-Peeping Tom law.

    Slice it, dice it, any way you like it,
    Laugh about it, talk about it,
    What you got to choose
    Any way you look at this
    You Trumpkins are full of what’s in toilets.

    nk (dbc370)

  40. Although I can see why Donius Digitus Brevitus Vulgarianus would himself favor using the women’s restroom. It’s the only room where he’d be almost guaranteed to have the biggest … err hands. Almost guaranteed.

    nk (dbc370)

  41. You have a clear choice, all right.

    You can be trivial. Or you can be frivolous.

    If you’re excited about which political twit a businessman donated to in the past, I’d say you’re firmly in “frivolous” territory.

    tom swift (dd7c23)

  42. #38, DRJ, so Senator Ted Cruz couldn’t be bothered to show up and do his job. The vote you call a show vote was the event that put Loretta Lynch at the head of the Department of Justice. It was an opportunity for Ted Cruz to show up and demonstrate where he stood on that critical issue.

    Instead of standing up and voting his true position on Lynch’s fitness for the office of the nation’s Attorney General, Cruz was AWOL. No amount of downplaying the significance of that convenient absence is going to withstand the accusation of political cowardice.

    ropelight (6dce3e)

  43. papertiger,

    So Limbaugh’s Operation Chaos (telling people to vote for Hillary to stop Obama) = Trump donating his own money to and complimenting Hillary?

    Did Limbaugh also say Hillary is a good woman and a great friend the way Trump did?

    BLITZER: If Hillary Clinton had been the Democratic nominee, as opposed to Barack Obama, would you have endorsed her or John McCain?

    TRUMP: Well, I would rather not say, because I don’t have to worry about that.

    But Hillary’s a great friend of mine. Her husband is a great friend of mine. They’re fantastic people. I mean, they’re — you know, the thing, they get a bad knock. She’s a very nice woman. People think, tough, tough. And I guess she’s tough, but she’s a very nice woman. And he’s a very nice guy. We know all about the smarts and how smart they are, and all, but they are good people

    I’m not going to vote for Hillary. But why is supporting Hillary so is bad when Trump vouched for her as a good, smart person.

    DRJ (15874d)

  44. You can stomp your feet however much you like, this state, barring a miracle is going for Hillary.

    Which illustrates the phrase “doubling down on stupid.”

    I know two left-leaning people managing small businesses in the “Golden State” who have complained in the past about the tax burdens and legislative rigamarole imposed upon the economy by the liberals/Democrats in Sacramento. In spite of that, I heard both of them a few days ago snorting about not taking Trump seriously, with one of them glad Cruz dropped out because he’s a “Neanderthal.” They didn’t say anything about Hillary, but I’m guessing they’ll be among those millions of Americans who are happy enough with this era of “Goddamn America” to, in effect, continue the third term of liberalism run amok.

    There was an article linked to the drudgereport.com yesterday about the complacency many Venezueleans have towards their society decimated by years of deranged Socialists and leftist idiocy. Their economy is in a shambles (eg, people having to line up to buy toilet paper) and crime is rampant.

    I struggle to feel sorry for those people, wanting to yell at them, “you broke it, now you fix it.”

    If the US electorate chooses to follow a pathway that’s merely a different shade of what folks in places like Venezuela have allowed themselves to stroll down, I won’t exactly feel too sorry for the citizens of this nation too.

    Mark (fc3a90)

  45. The Senate allows Senators to be absent. Cruz voted when it mattered and he’s not a coward. Trump, the guy who was afraid to debate Cruz, is the coward.

    DRJ (15874d)

  46. After nakoulah and citizens united, any flyer on red queen seems daft.

    narciso (1b4366)

  47. Looking For Satellites Voting For Catamites

    Nowhere, Still here, TV, Campaign, Suckzone
    Clinton, Showdown, Can’t stop
    Nowhere, Still here, TV, Campaign, Suckzone
    Clinton, Showdown, Can’t stop
    Where do we go from here?
    There’s something very wrong
    Sleepless every night
    One must still make a choice
    Nowhere, Still here, TV, Campaign, Suckzone
    Clinton, Showdown, Can’t stop, (Catamite)
    Nowhere, Still here, TV, Campaign, (Catamite), Suckzone
    Clinton, Showdown, Can’t stop, (Catamite)
    Nowhere, Still here, TV, Campaign, (Catamite), Suckzone
    Clinton, Showdown, Can’t stop
    Voting for catamites
    Voting for catamites
    Where do we go to now?
    There’s nothing in her words
    Money’s all been washed
    Send her far away
    Nowhere, Still here, TV, Campaign, Suckzone
    Clinton, Showdown, Can’t stop, (Catamite)
    Nowhere, Still here, TV, Campaign, (Catamite), Suckzone
    Clinton, Showdown, Can’t stop, (Catamite)
    Nowhere, Still here, TV, Campaign, (Catamite), Suckzone
    Slim tie, Showdown, Can’t stop
    Voting for catamites
    Voting for catamites
    Catamite, Catamite, Catamite, Catamite
    Voting for catamites
    Voting for catamites
    Where do we go from here?

    Colonel Haiku (40880a)

  48. 36. per Patterico’s commutative principle of political juxtaposition, Rush Limbaugh is a closet Democrat.

    It goes like this, if you supported Hillary’s failed run at the nomination in ’08 tangentially in any way, then you are a Democrat forever.

    papertiger (c2d6da) — 5/10/2016 @ 7:11 am

    Self-awareness is a personality trait all you Trumpkins lack entirely, I suppose.

    Cruz along with Sessions introduced an amendment to the Gang of Eight’s immigration bill proposing legal status with no path to citizenship. But that didn’t mean Cruz or Sessions actually wanted to give them legal status.

    http://www.redstate.com/diary/quill67/2016/01/29/time-line-transcript-shows-ted-cruzs-amendment-designed-kill-gang-eight-immigration-reform/

    …June 12, 2013 Ted Cruz offers amendment removing citizenship from the bill. Offering, instead, only legal status.

    June 19, 2013 Ted Cruz in interview with Rush Limbaugh states:

    “Chuck Schumer was very candid in the Senate Judiciary Committee when he said, “If there is no citizenship, there can be no reform.”

    In other words, Cruz knew Schumer would kill the bill if citizenship was removed.

    …Yes, Cruz went out and said he really wanted the bill to pass, however, this is what you do when you offer a poison pill. You don’t go out and say “I’m offering this amendment to kill this bill” No, you want the opposition to feel forced to accept the amendment so that it so offends the key supporters of the bill, in this case Chuck Schumer and the Democrats, that the opposition itself ends up voting to kill the bill.

    …Did Ted Cruz stay loyal to the voters of Texas who elected him to stop amnesty? Did he keep his campaign promises to the voters of Texas?

    Yes. Ted Cruz kept his campaign promise. He opposed amnesty and stood with the voters not the establishment.

    Read the transcript from Rush Limbaugh’s show and you will see exactly where Ted Cruz stood and that he kept his campaign promise. (I highlighted key portions)…

    Like Limbaugh’s “Operation Chaos,” it was designed to throw a wrench into the machine and stop something horrible from happening. But you Trumpkins bought the lie; that “Lyin’ Ted” had flip-flopped and was supporting amnesty.

    And now, in your delusions, you’re accusing others for being so simple as to be easily fooled by the superficial as you.

    I would say it’s amazing but nothing about you Trumpkins surprises me anymore. Trump calling Cruz “Lyin’ Ted” was just his way of saying, “Look over their, fools. SQUIRREL!”

    Cruz wasn’t lying. But the biggest liar in the race, Trump, needed to distract the LIVs from the reality of who was really who.

    Steve57 (412496)

  49. papertiger, as DRJ points out (really she’s hitting you over the head with a 2×4) Trump provided Hillary! with substantive support.

    But you can’t tell the difference between support and opposition. Apparently you think everyone else is so simple they can’t either.

    Steve57 (412496)

  50. DRJ, the voters who sent Ted Cruz to the Senate to represent them expect their representative to show up and vote. Maybe not every time a vote is held, but every time a critical confirmation decision is front and center.

    After the blatant corruption of Eric Holder, the approval of his replacement was exactly the time Texans expected their representative to stand up and be counted. Instead, Ted Cruz went AWOL. That’s what political cowards do – they duck important votes.

    ropelight (6dce3e)

  51. ropelight, are you actually so ignorant you think you can lecture Texans like DRJ and I about what we expect from Cruz, and Cruz failed us!

    We are extremely happy with Cruz; he showed up to vote every single time it was important.

    But go ahead and keep demonstrating that to qualify as a Trumpkin you need to a) fail an IQ test or b) get a lobotomy. I don’t really mind.

    Steve57 (412496)

  52. Cruz is out, you’re riding with red queen now.

    narciso (1b4366)

  53. Everyone has to keep in mind that Hillary has rated quite high in various opinion polls for over 20 years. The percentage of Americans who’ve felt positive towards her is large enough that it must encompass more than those people who are rock-ribbed liberals and loyal Democrats. Simply put, there are plenty of folks out there — of all political stripes — who similarly felt their hearts go pitter-patter in 2008 (and apparently again in 2012) over the crease of the pants of the current president and believed he even had patriotic biases towards the USA.

    I doubt such an absurd level of benefit of the doubt will ever be directed towards even a very ethical, respectable conservative in 21st-century America, much less one who has been shadowed for years by corruption. That is why we’re in the mess we’re in.

    Mark (fc3a90)

  54. Cruz didn’t duck the important vote. He went on the record twice as opposing Lynch.

    Speaking of courage, who said in 2011 that debate-dodgers lack courage? Trump did.

    DRJ (15874d)

  55. Trump is using Alinsky’s Rules, just like Hillary. They are two peas in a pod.

    DRJ (15874d)

  56. For part of one cruise we had a reserve seaman assigned to the squadron. He was so useless he was literally the kind of guy who could burn water if you let him cook. So we had him stand by the phone. Again, literally; we didn’t want him to actually answer it and (shudder) try to take a message and get it to the right person. Fortunately there were always enough guys in the ready room to take over the phone when it rang.

    After every flight cycle the Landing Signals Officer would come down to the ready room and he’d critique every pilot’s landing as they watched the tape on the PLAT. And this reserve seaman would go over and join in the critique. One time really sticks out. The LSO is talking with the skipper, going over his landing, and seaman whats-his-name pipes up, “I think you should have used more top flap sir.” There’s no such thing, if you didn’t already know.

    They both look at the guy with this WTF expression on their faces. After a long silence the skipper just says, “I’ll try to remember that next time.”

    ropelight, your little lecture on why we Texans should be so disappointed in Cruz made me think of that story. I have to lump you in the same category as that guy.

    If I remember correctly he didn’t last the whole two weeks of active duty. One day we tried to have him wax the deck. We didn’t think he could screw that up. I don’t know what chemical he got from the cleaning locker though; whatever it was it wasn’t wax. It turned the surface of the deck into a sticky goo. Apparently he tried to figure out how to clean it up, and failing that, he turned out the lights and went away. I guess he didn’t think we’d figure out who had done that.

    I don’t know what happened to him, but but where ever he is I’m sure he’s enthusiastically supporting Trump.

    Steve57 (412496)

  57. We are extremely happy with Cruz; he showed up to vote every single time it was important.

    Except when it came to approving Loretta Lynch for Attorney General. Only by insisting the post of AG is unimportant can you look the other way on Cruz’s convenient absence. The man didn’t do the job he was elected to do. When push came to shove Ted Cruz was playing pussyfoot with his bimbos.

    ropelight (6dce3e)

  58. you’re riding with red queen now.

    I don’t trust those Republicans, much less those people who deem themselves as truly conservative, who rant about Trump (which makes sense), but who then also say — far too easily and conveniently — that they’ll instead vote for Hillary. I’ve noticed a portion of that crowd is, ironically (or interestingly) enough, ideologically and emotionally squisher than they let on.

    Mark (fc3a90)

  59. Actually, narciso, Trump and his supporters/voters are with Hillary, in spirit if not in fact. His positions on everything but immigration are starting to look like hers. Is the master dealmaker thinking about a unity ticket?

    DRJ (15874d)

  60. Oh, my, ropelight.

    You just want to fight. And I get it: you have let your quite substantial pride wed you to a joke of a candidate. You are constantly trying to defend his bizarre and clearly non-right of center opinions. His vulgarity. His lack of preparation. His utter lack of even attempting to present cogent clear policies that would bring people together.

    Instead, you play logical Twister to make yourself feel better.

    You aren’t fooling anyone. Most especially, yourself.

    Everything you previously claimed to believe in is now a lie.

    Own it, then move on.

    I suspect all this is the source of your bizarre anger.

    Simon Jester (c5ab4f)

  61. DRJ, I really think Trump is designed to make HRC President.

    And the lemmings are cheering.

    Simon Jester (c5ab4f)

  62. I never said opposing LLynch wasn’t important, only that the final vote wasn’t important. The real vote was on cloture, which is the GOP Senate’s way of letting its members make the hard decisions in a separate vote and then use the final vote as a show vote to fool the folks at home. Are you one of the people they fooled or are you lying about the importance of the final vote?

    I suspect you are lying but it’s hard to tell since you are also repeating the National Enquirer’s adultery smears on Cruz. Maybe you are so devoted to Trump that you believe anything he and his allies say. If so, I feel sorry for you, ropelight.

    DRJ (15874d)

  63. I see Simon Jester and I are on the same page. You aren’t fooling anyone but yourself, ropelight.

    DRJ (15874d)

  64. I know our pity makes you mad but it’s heartfelt and not intended to hurt you.

    DRJ (15874d)

  65. ropeliar,

    Perhaps you shouldn’t be sipping Pina Coladas this early in the day.
    So far, you’ve trashed Loretta Lynch’s physical appearance, and you’re now accusing Ted Cruz of having engaged in affairs with mistresses at the time of Lynch’s confirmation vote.
    You sound like a frustrated guy—or an inebriated one.

    The funny thing is, Cruz’s opposition vote wouldn’t have mattered in the final tally. Maybe if Lindsey Graham had contributed money to Harry Reid, Nancy Pelosi, Chuckie Schumer, and Hillary Clinton instead of voting “yay” on Lynch’s confirmation, you would have decided to support Graham for President rather than The Mr Donald, huh? (LOL)

    Cruz Supporter (102c9a)

  66. Trump and his supporters/voters are with Hillary, in spirit if not in fact.

    In turn, are the various Republicans (the ones you’ve described previously) who say they’ll vote for Hillary in November necessarily all that turned off by her?

    In terms of the likely reaction of X percentage of conservatives who encounter such a conversation, I know I personally would respond with “ya gotta be kidding me!” and immediately suggest any non-liberal (assuming such people are not actually emotionally more of the left than they realize) talking about voting for Hillary either leave the top part of the ballot blank or switch to a third candidate.

    Mark (fc3a90)

  67. The question at this point isn’t who is the worst person. The question is whose election will result in more harm to the country. I think some people believe Hillary will do more harm and some believe Trump will, and there are good reasons for both opinions.

    DRJ (15874d)

  68. I think they are both equally dangerous so, unless something happens to change my mind between now and November, I’m writing in a vote for Cruz.

    DRJ (15874d)

  69. #64, DRJ, yeah, I get your point. Cruz being AWOL on the Lynch confirmation vote didn’t fool me but it sure fooled you. he didn’t show up and do the job Texans elected him to do. Cruz was chicken to go on record.

    Also, you often complain that those who disagree with you are lying, maybe you should consider the possibility we’re the ones telling the truth.

    ropelight (6dce3e)

  70. Hillary’s a great friend of mine. Her husband is a great friend of mine. They’re fantastic people. I mean, they’re — you know, the thing, they get a bad knock. She’s a very nice woman. People think, tough, tough. And I guess she’s tough, but she’s a very nice woman. And he’s a very nice guy. We know all about the smarts and how smart they are, and all, but they are good people.

    DONALD TRUMP

    Donald Trump said that, ropelight.

    Thought you might’ve missed DRJ’s post, so I figured I’d bold the whole thing.

    Just own it, dude.

    Leviticus (efada1)

  71. The Trump Wall at UofW…

    ‘The crowd grew to more than 100 people, most of whom oppose Trump’s candidacy. Anti-Trump protesters waved signs saying “Stop Trump now” and “Immigrant lives matter,” and unveiled a long black banner that read: “Zero tolerance for walls or hate.” A man carrying a life-size cutout photo of Democratic candidate Bernie Sanders wordlessly set it in front of the wall

    Most of the students who passed by seemed amused or mildly curious, but a few got into heated arguments with Trump supporters, closing tightly in a circle around them as the event played out.m
    At 2p.m. student Crystal Pino, helped up by fellow students, went over the 8-foot-high wall, to cheers from the crowd. The Trump organizers reportedly had said she could not get over, so she decided to try.

    “I’m Mexican and to see this all going on is really upsetting,” Pino said.’

    I think Pino has unwittingly identified part of our problem

    Colonel Haiku (b0f43e)

  72. To be fair, everyone is (relatively) smart and nice compared to Donald Trump.

    Leviticus (efada1)

  73. 71. …Also, you often complain that those who disagree with you are lying, maybe you should consider the possibility we’re the ones telling the truth.

    ropelight (6dce3e) — 5/10/2016 @ 9:01 am</blockquote

    I considered it but then I laughed off that possibility long ago.

    Here you are lying about Cruz, ropelight. He vote against Lynch at the cloture vote which was the only vote that mattered. Once that vote failed to stop the Lynch confirmation. Once the Lynch nomination vote moved to the floor she was going to be confirmed. If he and other Senators couldn’t stop her nomination at cloture there was not point in sticking around to fail to stop her on the final vote. Unlike you Trumpkins, we Texans don’t expect our reps or senators to put on meaningless shows for us.

    You Trumpkins are the ones impressed by TV fakery, not us. That’s why you’re voting for a guy who is a reality show star and a defendant in several fraud trials.

    Mitch McConnell is right about people like you. You’re easily fooled by show votes.

    Steve57 (412496)

  74. Anyone with at least half a brain and at least 3 weeks in High School Civics class knows the cloture vote is the important vote and the final vote is just for show. And ropelight definitely spends hours a day spreading lies.

    John Hitchcock (18adbf)

  75. I think some people believe Hillary will do more harm and some believe Trump will

    But I’d like to know the exact, specific reasons behind any non-liberal believing Hillary will do less harm and Trump will do more harm. I’m not as interested in those people who think they’re equally bad or the ones who think Hillary is worse than Trump.

    I went through a bit of this Q&A with Dustin a few days ago and his overall responses made me realize he was more of the left than he realized or wanted to let on. Those are the people I’m very interested in scrutinizing. Most crucially, they’re the ones who in tandem with the devout (and mindless) liberals are the reason why I believe this society (and the Western World in general—much less debacles like Venezuela, Brazil, etc) is in such a mess.

    Mark (168662)

  76. Repeating lies is still lying, ropeliar.

    Steve Malynn (1d7837)

  77. Further to Leviticus @72, Trump also said this:

    http://www.msnbc.com/msnbc/donald-trumps-change-heart-hillary-clinton

    …“Hillary Clinton I think is a terrific woman,” he told Fox News’ Greta Van Susteren in March of 2012. “I am biased because I have known her for years. I live in New York. She lives in New York. I really like her and her husband both a lot. I think she really works hard.”

    “I think she really works hard and I think she does a good job. I like her,” he added of the then-secretary of state.

    That’s Trump’s opinion of Hillary! after she had clearly sh*t the bed in Libya. It was the only thing Hillary! had actually done besides travel the globe fund raising for her the Clinton foundation slush fund. And it was horrible.

    But Trump though she did a “good job.” Smart diplomacy, I guess.

    Can someone tell my why this short fingered vulgar moron is going to be better then his BFF?

    Steve57 (412496)

  78. It seems to be popular to bash Speaker Ryan, but all things considered, I’d rather have him as President than either of these turds. Matter of fact, I’d rather have any GOP member of Congress, picked at random. We could not have had a worse choice as our candidate if we had intentionally tried (and of course the “Burn it down” fifth-column of Trumpies were after exactly that).

    Kevin M (25bbee)

  79. Gallup on NOClinton/NOTrumo

    Seventy-one percent of Republicans said they would be likely to vote for Trump, with 21% ruling it out. Clinton? Among Democrats, 73% said they would be likely to vote for her, with 21% ruling it out. So, in terms of vote projection at this point, Trump is no more dividing the Republican Party than Clinton is dividing the Democratic Party. The same percent of partisans say they will not vote for their party’s front-runner.

    The current Quinnipiac polling of Florida, Ohio and Pennsylvania reflects the distaste felt by registered voters for both candidates with the responses to questions 17 and 18. The respondents give Clinton a very clear edge as being more dishonest and untrustworthy.

    Rick Ballard (44b7ba)

  80. Let me clear up one thing.

    It is said that Hillary Rodham was fired from the House Judicoary committee. The story is a little bit different and the Clinton campaign and all the fact checkers will probably say it is completely erroneous but it’s not.

    Reading things carefully, it is like this:

    Jeffrey Rodham (whom Bill Clinton had suggested for the job when he declined it) worked directly for John Doar. John Doar headed up a special operation and did not report to anybody except Ppeter Rodino, the Chhairman of the House Judiciary Coimmittee. Zeifman was bypasssed. This all was independent of the regular House Judiciary Committee Democratic staff.

    What Hillary she did that was unethical was never mentioning the 1970 Douglas precedent for gicing atarget counsel in her legal brief and trying to hide the records from the Republican minority staff. This had the complete approval of Peter Rodino and John Doar and mostly didn’t work. Nixon did get the right to counsel. The Hillary defense here simply treats as beyond question that John Doar proceded ethically. Zeifman doesn’t seem to challenge that, either, and he puts all the bame on Hillary.

    Now when the inquiry ended after Nixon’s resignation, Hillary wanted to stay on for a while as a regular staff member of the Judiciary Committee and Jerry Zeifman refused to hire her and also refused to give her a letter of recommendation, one of onl;ly 3 people he refused to recommend.

    I also think that Hillary faked some of the tape transcripts to make Nixon sound worse.

    She was not officially involved in making the transcripts but I think she was. John Doar flew out to Arkansas (where she was staying with Bill Clinton) just to bring her back at a key time

    Here’s my source: You have to read between the lines.

    “A real measure of Hillary’s importance within the Doar inner circle came sometime that spring when she went off to visit Bill in Arkansas.

    Laughing about it later, she described the deference accorded her – not for her work on the impeachment committee, but because she was the candidate’s “girlfriend.” But it was nothing like the deference she was shown by John Doar, when, upon some new development in the case – memories are unclear as to the precise event – but it had something to do with the subpoena of more Nixon tapes – he summoned Hillary back to Washington. Immediately. He would arrange special transportation he told her, even send a plane.”

    – Hillary Rodham Clinton: A First Lady for Our Time by Donnie Radcliffe

    (Warner Books, 1993) page 128.

    You see what was really going on was he needed Hillary to amke Nixon say things he never said, and he needced her there when the regular people who usually did taht job were not there, so she could fill in.

    Hilalry has also admitted some place listening to the tapes at a time when very few people could.

    The words she probably into Nixon’s mouth were (my guess)

    “I want you all to stonewall it, let them plead the Fifth Amendment, cover-up or anything else…”

    I think the tapes are now available and somebody could check if those are the right words. Maybe you get people to start asking questions.

    Sammy Finkelman (643dcd)

  81. “When push came to shove Ted Cruz was playing pussyfoot with his bimbos.”

    Ropelight is still pushing the baseless dishonest National Enquirer smears. Shocking

    JD (7fd277)

  82. “When push came to shove Ted Cruz was playing pussyfoot with his bimbos.”

    Ropelight is still pushing the baseless dishonest National Enquirer smears. Shocking
    JD (7fd277) — 5/10/2016 @ 12:35 pm

    When I was a very young kid, I REALLY wanted to believe the moon was made of green cheese, like in the cartoons. When my siblings told me it wasn’t true, I shouted that it was at the top of my lungs. When my mother asked what the commotion was about, she told me the same thing; it’s not true.

    I kept screaming and crying. Why? In retrospect, I was trying to save face, but I had no idea how. I eventually realized that there was no way all my screaming and crying was going to make something that wasn’t true factual, and ate humble pie.

    The people who boost Trump by regurgitating his shullbit about Ted Cruz and his family are like that pre-school me, screaming about lunar cheese. They know damn well that what they’re saying isn’t true (that is, unless they’re complete morons, which is a strong possibility). But they wanna save face, very badly. The evidence mounts with every passing day that the man they say will Make America Great Again has no idea what he’s doing, thinks he’ll be able to pick it up as he goes along, and is not only as monstrous an egotist and liar as Barack Obama, but is spectacularly flamboyant about displaying those character flaws.

    Unfortunately, the Trumpkins have an “out” that I never did. I can’t gather millions of other ignorant children to my side, all shouting that the moon truly IS made of cheese, to overwhelm the voices of my mother and siblings. I didn’t have the option of thinking that if I got enough people to believe a lie (or, to be charitable to the Trump-humpers, an allegation without a shred of evidence), that it didn’t matter what anyone said to the contrary even if I was wrong.

    This is the kind of country that a victorious Trump will leave in his wake.

    L.N. Smithee (b84cf6)

  83. if electing Mr. Trump makes me feel better than that’s what we should do

    y’all are so overthinking this

    happyfeet (a037ad)

  84. You guys should stop letting Ropelight jerk your chain. His silly accusations against Cruz are just half a level above “he’s ugly and smells bad” but you keep reacting as if he were making an argument. It’s just trash talk. Don’t dignify it with rational responses.

    Cugel (dea4cc)

  85. ropelight 71:

    Also, you often complain that those who disagree with you are lying, maybe you should consider the possibility we’re the ones telling the truth.

    If you reread my comment, you will see I said “I suspect you are lying.” Other than this one time, I can’t recall accusing or being suspicious that other online commenters were lying so I question your assertion that I “often complain” that people who disagree with me are lying.

    In this case, however, I can’t think of any other reasons for your comments than that you are ignorant or lying about Senate cloture/show votes. A perfect attendance and voting record is nice but it isn’t an option for every Senator, especially one who is running for President. Being there for the meaningful votes is what is important, and Cruz was there for and voted against Lynch when it mattered.

    DRJ (15874d)

  86. You write very well, L. N. Your words paint a picture.

    DRJ (15874d)

  87. It’s ironic that Trump supporters are so mad at conservative Cruz supporters. Cruz conservatives are the last people Trump should be worried about. Cruz was the last real candidate to drop out and Cruz-Trump and their supporters are at opposite ends of the ideological specttum. There’s a reason we don’t think Cruz will be Trump’s running mate — because they aren’t compatible personally or ideologically. Neither are their supporters.

    Trump and his supporters need to look at the moderate wing of the GOP for support, where they will undoubtedly find support. Another place to look is blue collar independents, Democrats, and those who don’t vote. That is much more likely to pay dividends thsn bullying conservatives.

    DRJ (15874d)

  88. DRJ, Trump is about bullying. It is who he is, and what he has done so throughout his life. So it’s no wonder his followers excitedly try to do the same.

    LN, exactly right. Con men count on that principle. And I do think the “because shut up” approach worked well for the Left. Why wouldn’t Trump supporters do the same?

    Again: all Trump need do is act in a thoughtful and professional fashion. Come up with good policies. Make plans. Suggest advisors. Show he is ready to lead.

    You know, the things that Cruz would have asked him in a debate….

    Oh.

    Simon Jester (c8876d)

  89. ah simon, civility is not a skillset the dems really have in their toolkit, the counsels of ill macchia are overwrought in part because his model was cesare borgia, but there is some truth to it,

    narciso (732bc0)

  90. where alchemy is the new thing:

    http://ace.mu.nu/archives/363367.php

    narciso (732bc0)

  91. Barack Obama Hillary Clinton Picks a Doomed Fight With Americans Over Guns points out that maybe, just maybe, Americans might be a little perturbed by the notion that the government is going to regulate out of existence something that has always been part of the fabric of the nation. And oh, by the way, the 2nd Amendment has something to say about it too.

    “Australia is a good example” Clinton told an audience a few months ago. “The Australian government, as part of trying to clamp down on the availability of automatic weapons, offered a good price for buying hundreds of thousands of guns. Then, they basically clamped down, going forward.”
    That country’s 1996 law may well be a good example, but not of the sort the presidential candidate has in mind. In a country that lacked America’s heavy political associations with gun ownership, the Sporting Shooters’ Association of Australia estimates compliance with the compensated confiscation of self-loading rifles, self-loading shotguns, and pump-action shotguns at 19 percent.”

    http://ace.mu.nu/archives/363375.php

    Colonel Haiku (b0f43e)

  92. civility, we have to try it sometimes,

    https://twitter.com/ArmsControlWonk/status/729878358855540736

    narciso (732bc0)

  93. Here in California, there’s another option that looks promising.

    At least it might make the next four years tolerable.

    malclave (4ddf38)

  94. what they haven’t done that already, that would explain jerry brown’s winning twice,

    http://dailycaller.com/2016/05/10/hillarys-campaign-manager-mook-held-adviser-role-at-clinton-state-dept/

    narciso (732bc0)


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