Patterico's Pontifications

4/28/2016

“Trump’s Appeal Explained — Again”

Filed under: General — Patterico @ 7:51 am

Allahpundit highlighted this call to Rush Limbaugh. It is worth listening to, because I think this guy’s attitude is representative of a lot of people.

RUSH: I’m glad you made it through, Sean. Thanks so much.

CALLER: Thanks. I just wanted to make a point, at least my perspective on the support of Trump. I reluctantly support him but I do straight… I mean, I do support him, and it’s not about conservatism. It’s not, as some people say — and I’ve heard it on your show, too, from a lot of callers calling in. It’s not really about, “Well, you know, people are being fooled that he’s not really conservative.” It’s not. I know he’s not a conservative. The fact is, to put it simply, Trump will fight. Not only will he fight, he’ll fight dirty, and the thing is we gotta get that. We have to have someone that’s gonna fight in the mud, ’cause that’s where our opponents are. That’s where our opponents have been.

RUSH: Fight who?

CALLER: The Democrats. I mean, look at what happened after 9/11. Remember it was like a month or two after that, and then Kennedy came out and he started slamming George Bush. You know, all of his supporters were waiting for him to stand up and defend himself, and he didn’t. For eight years, he just let the Democrats plaster him. And then what happens? Obama gets elected, and he rams Obamacare down our throats. What were Reid and Pelosi doing? They were locking people out of committee meetings, remember that?

What was our response? Did we fight back? No. We didn’t fight back. So then what did we do? We have a landslide victory. We give them the House. Do they do it? Do they repeal Obamacare? No. They do nothing. They say, “Well, we can’t do anything ’cause we don’t have the Senate.” Okay, we give you the Senate. What do they do? “Oh, you know, we’re not gonna do anything ’cause we’re gonna take our only weapon off the table before we do battle with these people.”

We’re sick and tired of fighting with people who won’t fight, and when it comes to down to Cruz, you know, my instincts with Cruz is that, yeah, he’s a nice guy. And don’t get me wrong, if he magically wins this nomination, of course I’ll support him. But the problem is, I suspect he won’t fight. Three days ago there was an article in Breitbart where he’s being interviewed and he said, “You know, if I’m elected, “he said something to that effect of, “I’m not gonna get personal. This is gonna be about issues.”

Okay, great. You just handed them the election, ’cause you know what they’re gonna do? They’re gonna make it personal against you and you’re gonna be like the new George Bush just sitting up there like Jeb. You won’t fight. You’ll just sit there and take it and we’re gonna lose again. And the thing is, Trump, you know what? I disagree with probably 80% of the stuff that he believes in, or he purports to. But the thing is, I think we’re facing an existential crisis. It comes down to immigration, illegal immigration —

RUSH: Okay.

CALLER: — and Obamacare.

RUSH: Stop. You don’t need to say any more. You just said everything in about five words. “I don’t agree with 80% of what I think Trump stands for, but I’m voting for him.” That is why the Republican establishment is about ready to commit harakiri. They can’t figure this out.

Pretty much. Right now a lot of Trump people are nodding their heads thinking: “Exactly right! They don’t get it!”

And Cruz people are shaking their heads, at the very same time, thinking: “Exactly right! We don’t get it.”

I think I am hearing this caller loud and clear. This caller wants to win, and doesn’t really care what the policies will be. He thinks ObamaCare is part of an “existential threat” but is voting for a guy who said he likes the mandate and wants to provide health care for everyone and the government will pay for it.

To me? The caller sounds like a complete idiot.

Rush laughs when he says “they can’t figure this out” as if he is in the know. But I wonder if, when he says “they,” he means “we.”

These are the people deciding your fate, ladies and gentlemen. Sleep soundly!

217 Responses to ““Trump’s Appeal Explained — Again””

  1. I think I’m supposed to nod my head meaningfully and act like the caller has a Good Point that we should All Pay Attention To.

    Nnnope.

    Patterico (86c8ed)

  2. what about the last 12 years going back obama’s senate campaign, the attacks on delay, the huntress, walker, and cruz, (btw, snorfle at mazin’s spectacular facepalm with his film) makes you doubt that’s what they are going to do, we can go back 50 plus years to goldwater,

    narciso (732bc0)

  3. Desperate people do irrational and desperate things.

    crazy (cde091)

  4. Arsonists. Looking up into the sky for the Sweet Meteor of Death. Expectantly. Were there always so many and it was Twitter that brought them out from their storm cellars?

    nk (dbc370)

  5. I like the note of combat in Cruz declaring himself the nominee and proceeding early to pick his VP even when it looks desperate. Fiorina might be of some utility in the California primary.

    But he’s still hiding behind the women’s skirts. And is kind of living in his own alternate reality.

    papertiger (c2d6da)

  6. Twitter provides the illusion of large numbers. Among the rational, polling dispels the illusion but the word ‘rational’ is rather exclusive in this context.

    Rick Ballard (47d2c8)

  7. Not only will he fight, he’ll fight dirty

    I heard that call, and I can see his point. I would love a fighter to run!

    George W never defended himself, Mitt Romney laid down in the ring on the third debate…it’s beyond frustrating. I do however think Cruz will scrap too with Hillary and the Dems/media. He’s already done it!

    So Trump’s not the only fighter, IMO, and it’s not enough to make me vote for him.

    Patricia (5fc097)

  8. Here’s a shout out to Carly. “Dirty Deeds and They’re Done Dirt Cheap” (YouTube)

    papertiger (c2d6da)

  9. Trump will fight dirty to win for himself but he won’the fight the way Washington does business John Boehner is Trump’s buddy. These are the people Trump will rely on to run his Administration. It will be more of the same, but on steroids because it will be the President and Congress from both parties.

    DRJ (15874d)

  10. And I think crazy is right. Thesee are desperate people.

    DRJ (15874d)

  11. #0-DRJ. If Trump gets elected and performs as you say–think of how frustrated and furious these voters will be then. That’s when the SHTF. That may prove to be a perfect storm.

    bald01 (f38852)

  12. What was our response? Did we fight back? No. We didn’t fight back. So then what did we do? We have a landslide victory. We give them the House. Do they do it? Do they repeal Obamacare? No. They do nothing.

    Except, of course, the fact that the House has voted several times to repeal Obamacare. And this past January, the Senate finally overcame a Dem filibuster and voted to repeal Obamacare, so the bill went to the President who promptly vetoed it.

    And there’s the problem with low information conservatives. Either this guy is totally ignorant of the House’s attempts to undo the damage done by Obamacare, or he doesn’t really understand how legislation is advanced through Congress and what role the President plays in wether or not it is enacted into law. Being angry is no excuse for not knowing what the hell you are talking about, no matter on which side of the political aisle you sit.

    JVW (eabb2a)

  13. DRJ, more critically, Trump is close friends with Hillary and Bill. Does Hillary strike you as tolerant of peeps who disagree with her on key points?

    I dunno, this smells to me like a plot to get Hillary elected. I could see Donald feigning going into a Ross Perot huff two weeks before November and leaving the GOP with no one to vote for… This depends on Trump putting his Ego in check for the financial reward of Hillary throwing cronycap largesse his way…

    Even if this doesn’t work out that way, Trump will never be ANYTHING other than another Obama, with zero intention of doing anything he said, other than provide cronycap largesse for his benefactors while doing shit that actually screws America up. I’ve been saying for two months now that he’s just “singing the song of ‘Hope and Change’ in the key of ‘R'”….

    LISTers (Loony, Ignorant Supporters of Trump) are perhaps the worst thing out there… I dunno. They are certainly screwing up this election and defacto giving it over to the forces of darkness…

    IGotBupkis, "Si tacuisses, philosophus mansisses (da3982)

  14. To paraphrase Benjamin Franklin

    They that can give up essential liberty Principles to obtain a little temporary safety Victory deserve neither liberty Principles nor safety Victory .

    Torcer (f045ef)

  15. need we revisit macho grande, and the exertions to set o’donnell on suttee?

    narciso (732bc0)

  16. yes, a proforma statement, after funding obamacare during the lameduck spare me, that twaddle

    narciso (732bc0)

  17. One of the only real checks on the Executive Branch is the House’s power of the purse. It doesn’t matter how many bills the Congress passes and sends to the president. It only matters that his access to the nation’s piggy bank depends on listening to the voice of the people and acting accordingly.

    Otherwise he can open his own wallet and pay for his personal preferences. Members and Speakers of the House must live up to their constitutional responsibilities and be good stewards of the people’s treasure. It they can’t or won’t do that they serve no useful function and must be removed from office at the earliest opportunity – in handcuffs, with a rope around their necks, at the point of a bayonet, in an ambulance, or after an election.

    No more excuses: Do your job right now, or find another one in the private arena.

    ropelight (db17ed)

  18. Like Patton, Eisenhower and Bradley pointed out about allying with the Soviets to beat the Nazis. We allied with one tyrannical fascism to stomp out another.

    CrustyB (69f730)

  19. Hey, Trumpies, how does it feel to know your guy is secretly buddies with Boehner, who HATES Cruz but golfs with Trump and texts him back and forth. SOunds like Boehner has a spot in a Trump administration.

    What a con. And you can’t admit you fell for it now.

    http://www.nytimes.com/politics/first-draft/2016/04/28/john-boehner-ted-cruz/

    Former House Speaker John A. Boehner described Senator Ted Cruz as “Lucifer in the flesh” during a forum at Stanford University on Wednesday and said that he would not vote for the Texas Republican if he is the party’s presidential nominee.

    Mr. Boehner, who resigned from Congress last year, said that he would vote for Donald J. Trump if he is nominated, according to a report in The Stanford Daily. The two men have played golf together over the years, and Mr. Boehner described them as “texting buddies.”

    Kevin M (25bbee)

  20. explain the hitler stalin analogy, in that case,

    narciso (732bc0)

  21. “stomp out another”

    The other side is just worried to death about being stomped out.

    GE polls aren’t worth much until after the conventions so Trumpkins can use the polls to show how much room for growth ‘ol Bluster and Bombast enjoys.

    Rick Ballard (fa8b05)

  22. #18 you sound bitter – Boehner also had some choice words about Cruz which amplifies the concerns that he could get anything done with a congress hostile to him. By the time the primary is over Trump will likely break the record for votes (by a couple of million) cast for him and almost double what Cruz received. I suppose you can say that millions and millions of people were conned and not as savvy as you seem to see yourself.
    But it will be small consolation for you when all Cruz has left to do is to read Dr Seuss books in the Senate well….If I could give you a hug I would.

    spokanebob (1aaf2a)

  23. Hey, Cruz Loser, how does it feel to know that no matter what you say Trump’s supporters don’t give a rat’s ass? You’re pissing against the tide. And, all your pathetic attempts to hold Trump’s tsunami back aren’t going to prevent the people’s choice from winning the White House.

    No matter how low you go, it’s going to be President Trump and there’s not a damn thing you can do to prevent it.

    ropelight (db17ed)

  24. President Hillary.

    Danube River Guide (76b104)

  25. Boehner’s recent comment that Cruz is a Lucifer and a son of a B who can’t be worked with, while Boehner can work with Democrats and furthermore is a golfing buddy of Trump, simultaneously confirms the caller’s complaint about the lack of will in the Republicans under their current leaders, while casting doubt on whether Trump will in fact be the champion that Rush’s caller expects.

    And JVW (#12), if the House and the Senate were willing to play hard ball, they could shut down the government. The Ds did it to Reagan several times, but, of course, it was always “Reagan’s fault” as played out in the media in those days. If today’s Republicans could master their fear of the LHMFM, they could demand budgets for individual agencies and departments that would provide some transparency. This would garner them some respect from those who now flock to Trump. And as each small budget was passed, the power of the executive would be diminished since those portions of the government would no longer be in play in a “shut down”. But leaders like Boehner, McConnell, and Ryan have foresworn this tactic, their only weapon in the budget battle. The have it in their power to bring the government to its knees, but they prefer to see us on our knees to the government. They have persuaded themselves that this is the only way they can be reelected, which is the whole point after all.

    Being an optimist, if Cruz falls before the mindless ones, I’m looking forward to Trump and Obama playing a celebratory round of golf next spring with Boehner and Christy as caddies. Christy will be especially pathetic as he waddles behind the presidential golf cart, carrying a full load of clubs and a couple of dozen extra balls … “do overs” to keep the game moving.

    The only consolation is that the leaders of the U. K. and France were equally cowardly and feckless when confronted with Hitler and Stalin, and they probably felt really awful as the war unfolded, killing scores of millions. And yet here we are. It all worked out just fine … for the survivors. I rather doubt Trumps’ supporters will find themselves and their kids in that category when the draft is reinstated and the country stumbles off to war. But they will have had their chance. Just as the voters in England and France had their chance and blew in the early 1930s.

    BobStewartatHome (a52abe)

  26. This caller wants to win, and doesn’t really care what the policies will be.

    That’s interesting since nobody knows what the policies will be. Nobody. One can guess, predict or just guess but nobody knows. But one thing all of us do know is that every single policy without exception of Hillary’s will be bad for America. Because Hillary is a commie douche. And every policy of hers from net neutrality to giving Obamacare to illegals to global warming mandates to ending fracking will be designed to bring what is left of this once great nation to it’s knees.

    And with comments like “To me? The caller sounds like a complete idiot.” the Cruz supporters have basically thrown away any support from Trump people if Cruz gets the nomination. I mean even the so called “idiot” isn’t so much and idiot that he’d vote for the people who called him an “idiot” to begin with.

    Every Cruz supporter I know and every one on TV and the net save myself just spent the last 5 months guaranteeing the Republican party will never unite over a Republican candidate now and perhaps never again. Congratulations, you’ve insured the new Eurostyle leftist democrat-socialist party, formerly known as democrats, and the reconstruction of the Republican party as the liberal answer. No longer any room for conservatives or TeaPartyer’s. That’s all the current liberal Republican leadership was waiting for.

    Hoagie ™ (e4fcd6)

  27. Well, it sounds like Ted Cruz needs to start taking about fighting. About putting the Obama administration in jail, about investigating the Fed and where all the bailout money went, and in gutting the federal government’s bureaucratic bloat.

    I’ve said it before — Cruz hides his flame under a bushel. He refuses to engage with the press and say the kinds of bold things that they are anxious to print. Trump has no problem with this, so it’s all Trump Trump Trump.

    It seems like Cruz thinks he;s arguing back with the Elect, rather than in front of the masses, making all the mistakes that were old when Brutus made them against Marc Antony.

    Kevin M (25bbee)

  28. #18 you sound bitter – Boehner also had some choice words about Cruz which amplifies the concerns that he could get anything done with a congress hostile to him. By the time the primary is over Trump will likely break the record for votes (by a couple of million) cast for him and almost double what Cruz received. I suppose you can say that millions and millions of people were conned and not as savvy as you seem to see yourself.
    But it will be small consolation for you when all Cruz has left to do is to read Dr Seuss books in the Senate well….If I could give you a hug I would.

    ************

    The percentage of registered Republican voters participating in the primary made a huuuuge and significant drop this last go around–see Nate Silver’s latest piece. Also to that “record” —the primary rarely goes this long and before New York–eight million Republicans had voted for The Donald, but something like– 12 million voted against The Donald–another “record”. And –you need those voters in the general against Hillary–but I doubt The Donald has even the charm of Trump fans here to bring them back, or the ability to unite them.

    Danube River Guide (76b104)

  29. No matter how low you go, it’s going to be President Trump and there’s not a damn thing you can do to prevent it.

    Romney/Rice to block.

    Kevin M (25bbee)

  30. Hey, Cruz Loser, how does it feel to know that no matter what you say Trump’s supporters don’t give a rat’s ass?

    Exactly the same way I feel to know that no matter what I say the homeless lady who defecates behind the 7-11 doesn’t give a rat’s ass. We only care about the opinions of people we respect, gropelight.

    nk (dbc370)

  31. That’s good, ropelight, and I’m being sincere. Find the votes to help Trump win, just as you would demand Cruz do if he were the nominee.

    Trump and his supporters demand that the rest of us jump on board the Trump ship but that’s not how politics works. If Trump is the nominee, winning the general election is up to Trump and Trump supporters like you.

    DRJ (15874d)

  32. The average Trump fan doesn’t even know who the hell Boehner is–and they won’t care if they do. Orange Men –United!

    Danube River Guide (76b104)

  33. ropelight

    Did it ever occur to you that part of Donald’s support is from the national socialist left?

    They want to pick the worst candidate they can to compete against their side, and Donald fit’s that to a Tan-zay-nia.

    Torcer (f045ef)

  34. But it’s nice to hear the Trump fanatics admit they are rabid running dogs impervious to facts, logic or even a dollop of truth or common sense. And that they view this as strength.

    Orwell was right: Ignorance IS strength to a Trumpie.

    Kevin M (25bbee)

  35. BobStewart,

    Your golf game description is hilarious. Well done.

    DRJ (15874d)

  36. No matter how low you go, it’s going to be President Trump and there’s not a damn thing you can do to prevent it.

    Romney/Rice to block.

    Kevin M (25bbee) — 4/28/2016 @ 10:19 am

    *********

    Oooooh I like it. Trump fans want balls and a fight–take that–you jack wagons. Also this caller is obviously unaware that Trump made the very same attacks on Grorge Bush and blamed him for 9/11 right in the middle of one of the debates. I think that’s what brought Romney out to bitch slap him in the first place.

    Danube River Guide (76b104)

  37. Every Cruz supporter I know and every one on TV and the net save myself just spent the last 5 months guaranteeing the Republican party will never unite over a Republican candidate now and perhaps never again.

    As this Rush caller and our local Trump supporters make clear, these voters will do anything to get even. They don’t care about their candidate’s character or policies, or if he even understands the issues. That does not deserve our support, and neither does the party that makes it possible.

    DRJ (15874d)

  38. I think the thing that makes me the saddest is their response to all the information showing that Trump cannot beat HRC.

    Because he won’t.

    This is getting old, but it describes the situation perfectly:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bsHUPqhAGrk

    Simon Jester (c8876d)

  39. I agree with Hoagie that the caller is not an idiot and the reason he is attracted to Trump is very reasonable and understandable —
    on the surface.

    Below the surface, when one really looks at Trump, one has to wonder what will he fight for, how will he fight, and just who will he fight for the most.

    If one asks those questions, one sees that it is Cruz who will fight for the Constitution, the rule of law, and the people, using Constitutional means.

    But Trump sucked up all of the anti-establishment O2 out of the room.

    Boehner can hate Cruz all he wants, good for Cruz.
    If Trump supporters figure out that Boehner hates Cruz more than Trump, some will switch to Cruz based on that alone.

    MD in Philly (f9371b)

  40. There may be 1237 votes bound to Trump, but there will most definitely NOT be 1237 delegates favoring Trump. When they ask for the vote to be declare unanimous, the Nays will have it, assuming they don’t just walk out.

    I’m really not sure how this will play out — there are a LOT of Republicans unwilling to support Trump, or even be in a party that nominates Trump. I suspect that there will be enough willing to muddle through with an awful nominee and pick up the pieces afterwards (given a suitable period of throat-cutting), but it could go the other way.

    In any event, when it comes time to pick a VP candidate, Trump’s choice is not a foregone conclusion. The delegates could accept it, they could insist on someone else, or the motion could die for lack of a quorum.

    Kevin M (25bbee)

  41. I forget what it is called, but there are those who say that to admit to supporting Trump is something many people do not want to do in a poll because they know how “wrong” that answer is going to be perceived, so they expect Trump to do better than the polls show.

    Maybe so, he will still be terrible for America.

    MD in Philly (f9371b)

  42. No matter how low you go, it’s going to be President Trump and there’s not a damn thing you can do to prevent it.

    ropelight (db17ed) — 4/28/2016 @ 10:05 am

    Well there’s an argument that won over a bunch of supporters!

    Except there is something we can do to prevent it. We can argue loudly against his nomination at the convention. We can vote for Hillary.

    What argument is there to vote for Trump over Hillary? Hillary seems the more conservative, is a nicer person, is more ethical (all statements are faint praise). Her inevitable failures would be the democrat’s fault. Republicans would oppose her in some sense.

    Trump will nominate die hard New York values nuts to the Supreme Court, but Hillary would nominating left leaning democrats. Again, advantage Clinton.

    Clinton won’t start as many wars to burnish her reputation. Trump’s contempt for the US Soldier is well documented at this point. They are cannon fodder to him. He even swindled them while running for President, when he should be faking that he cares about them.

    I think Clinton would be a terrible president, but how is she not preferable to Trump? I’ve never voted for a democrat for a legitimately higher office, and Trump’s (R) means nothing to me.

    What argument do you have to earn my vote?

    Texas is a swing state if Trump is the nominee. Clinton wins Texas over Trump by five percentage points among Texas registered voters.

    Right now, LBJ’s Austin radio station is pumping Trump up in its coverage. They spent hours yesterday saying Cruz was probably going to announce he was dropping out of the race, after everyone knew he would be naming his running mate. It’s been like that for months. What happens when the democrats stop trying to help Trump win the primary, and start trying to help Hillary win the general? The map will get really blue, I imagine.

    So I think you should change your tune to “it’s going to be President Clinton, but there’s one thing the GOP can do to prevent it”

    Dustin (2a8be7)

  43. Local polling place, about 80 votes for Clinton, 25 for Sanders, 5 for Trump, 1 for Cruz.
    Interior Philly.

    MD in Philly (f9371b)

  44. #31, DRJ, that’s right, it’s up to Trump and his supporters to win the election and save America from collectivist destruction. You can participate in the most worthy of causes or stay home and acquiesce in the results, it’s up to you it’s your right as an American citizen.

    But, you can’t sit out the most important election of your lifetime and still mouth off about much better the nation would be if we all pulled together.

    ropelight (db17ed)

  45. In that eventuality, it would really be :I work is done, and you can miss Texas goodbye as a functioning unit, who would you want to shoot your foot like that?

    narciso (d8c19d)

  46. Talked to a Trump supporter who said that he is essentially forced to go with Trump because Cruz creeps him out. And that Cruz reinforces that idea by bragging about how he is “stealing ” delegates. Cruz could be a terrible candidate–that is a possibility some might want to consider. Trump is looking like a “winner” but that might not be a reflection of how great Trump is–it might tell you something about –Cruz. I understand some here are lawyers and/or from Texas–you might have over-identified with him. Cruz goes out of his way to make enemies, he sells a false Army of One strategy and he continually allows Trump to set the battlefield. And finally –he couldn’t fight the democrat standing right next to him for the Republican nomination.

    Danube River Guide (76b104)

  47. Trump will be as bad for the rule of Constitutional law in this country as Obama,
    He will likely make a blip in the R/L balance,
    But when all is said and done,
    The Republic will be worse off.

    Evidence based, not opinion.

    MD in Philly (f9371b)

  48. Danube, what part of the country was that conversation with this Trump supporter?

    At any rate, yes Cruz makes enemies in DC. Any good person would. He’s a fighter, but the field was extremely divided at the beginning and Trump is a TV show star that the democrats pumped up as much as they could.

    Dustin (2a8be7)

  49. ropelight,

    Roger Simon thinks Trump can win by increasing the black vote. Race relations are in terrible shape after Obama and now Trump with Hispanics. I don’t think blacks will trust Trump more than Hillary but who knows.

    Here’s a thought: White voters think Trump will fight to stop immigrants and free trade so they will have jobs. Maybe Trump can win black votes by telling them he will get jobs for them, too.

    DRJ (15874d)

  50. Cruz supports policies that will reduce regulations and produce jobs for everyone but that thinking is so ancient, isn’t it?

    DRJ (15874d)

  51. I think that caller is a great example of why they support Trump. He fights and “tells it like it is”. Except how can you fight against something when there is no principles to back you up? You just become a flag in the wind. They hated it when the GOP gave into the Dems, and yet say Cruz won’t be able to work with Congress- to give into the Dems. Its crazy.

    And Kevin M- I’ve already seen Trumpers hand wave away Boehner being Trumps texting buddy. “Oh just because they text doesn’t mean anything!”. Except having Neil Bush on Cruz’s team was all “SEE HE’S GOPE” and the leader of the “GOPe” just said he hates Cruz and will vote for Trump. Its kind of hilarious in a morbid sort of way.

    The problem with Trump in the general is Hillary will just hang the whole clown show around the neck of Trump. Independents and LIVs will see the media portrayal and will want nothing to do with Trump.

    Patrick Henry, the 2nd (ddead1)

  52. you can’t sit out the most important election of your lifetime

    Trump versus Hillary is not an important election. Hell, Trump is a Clinton donor who has been pals with Pelosi, Reid, Weiner, and all the rest of Clinton’s fan club. The election means very little except which letter will be next to the lefty new york values president’s name.

    Cruz versus Hillary would be a real choice for once. Just imagine, a New York big government lefty who plays the pay for play crony game and sneers at veterans, versus a Texas conservative who fights to shrink encroachments on our liberty and economy. Oh wait, that’s the primary.

    Dustin (2a8be7)

  53. Narciso,

    Trump’s strong disapproval percentage in Texas is 58%. Texans are quite capable of rejecting Trump without rejecting the GOP. So are the electorates of Wisconsin and quite a number of other states. #NeverTrump is going to be a very small factor in his defeat and not cheering for the wino does not indicate support for the bag lady in the bum fight.

    Rick Ballard (fa8b05)

  54. It is the most important PRIMARY in US history. And if it falls to Trump, then the US also falls. And I damned sure will blame ropelight.

    John Hitchcock (160598)

  55. Why would I mouth off about how to fix America, ropelight? I am not prone to hopeless causes.

    DRJ (15874d)

  56. I suspect if the near-impossibility of Trump winning the General occurs, by 2018 there will be a yuuuge spike in the national suicide rate, as the Trumpsters start wailing “what have we done?”

    John Hitchcock (160598)

  57. “Trump will fight.”

    “Okay, for what?”

    “It doesn’t matter. I don’t agree with most of what he advocates. But he’ll fight.”

    “And will do what?”

    “Stop the Democrats.”

    “For what?”

    “He’ll fight to stop the left.”

    “But you don’t agree with what he’ll do, right? And you’re not sure what he’ll do?”

    “Yes, but he’ll fight.”

    It’s like trying to reason with a 6-year old.

    SteveMG (d90a27)

  58. DRJ, if you think preserving America is a hopeless cause, then you’ve got your account in the wrong bank.

    ropelight (db17ed)

  59. I don’t blame Ropelight if things don’t work out. He’s just as entitled to his views as I am to mine.

    But Hillary is polled as winning Utah against Trump. Utah. The only thing inevitable about Trump is that he will insist losing is not his fault, like all his other failures.

    But it’s pretty unsettling that the best argument against Cruz has been ‘I don’t like how he looks’. The primary system that gave us Mitt Romney was obviously pretty screwed up. That’s only more obvious now. Is there a solution?

    Dustin (2a8be7)

  60. Apparently a pulsating orange sphincter is more visually appealing to Trumpkins than an aquiline nose.

    Leviticus (efada1)

  61. The hopeless cause is the electorate, not the country.

    DRJ (15874d)

  62. But there is always hope that they will learn. It may have to be the hard way, but they can learn.

    DRJ (15874d)

  63. Donald Trump is the Jim Jones of the early 21st Century. His worshipers never learned. They never woke up. And then they committed suicide.

    John Hitchcock (160598)

  64. They have not yet plumbed the lowest of their depths, their loathing is bottomless, their vision is imaginary, and their self-aggrandizement is limitless. They are the hollow men, and they’re proud of themselves.

    ropelight (db17ed)

  65. There’s always secession, DRJ.

    Dustin (2a8be7)

  66. There is, Dustin.

    DRJ (15874d)

  67. The very same people who’ve given up on the country, who say things are near bottom, who say the government is worthless, who say “burn it down!!” now tell us they are the ones who have souls and principles?

    And the man who will personify this vision is one Donald Trump.

    SteveMG (d90a27)

  68. “I have great admiration for Hillary Clinton” – Carly Fiorina (YouTube)

    papertiger (c2d6da)

  69. After Trump gets crushed, the Trumper’s new claim will be “Cruz would have lost even worse!” even if he fares worse than McCain did. Conveniently for them that’s a counterfactual, non-falsifiable statement. For the record the evidence has pretty consistently been that

    Donald Trump’s chances against Hillary Clinton look far worse than Ted Cruz’s

    Of course Trumpers don’t seem to go by objective evidence. They go by “I think his nose is big so he can’t win” or “He’s too religious so he can’t win” or whatever exists inside their heads. It may well be that he’d lose to Hillary as well, however the notion that Trump is stronger simply has no objective evidence to support it.

    Gerald A (945582)

  70. By way of Walter Olsen at “Overlawyered

    And this is the dude you Trump guys want for a President.

    Bill H (dcdd7b)

  71. The Boehner tantrum today says it all about the Trump movement:

    Trump: The Republican establishment has screwed you by trying to grant amnesty to illegals–I will deport them all and make Mexico build a wall to keep them out!

    Boehner (former face of said pro-amnesty establishment): “I’m cool with Trump. Cruz is Lucifer!”

    Trump supporters: (ignore the obvious implications of this, goes right on cheering for Trump)

    M. Scott Eiland (3a0fd3)

  72. Gerald – you know there aren’t any super delegates for Hillary to count on in the general election.

    She can barely tread water against Bernie, with super delegates all in.

    papertiger (c2d6da)

  73. Why don’t you assholes take your toys and go home? Sit out the election. You don’t have a dog in the fight, you don’t care if Hillary wins. Keep your eye on the prize, anyone, even Slick’s wife Hillary is preferable to an outsider.

    Anyone and anything so long as Donald Trump comes up short. He may not actually be Lucifer in the flesh but he’ll do till the real thing comes along.

    ropelight (db17ed)

  74. …..however the notion that Trump is stronger simply has no objective evidence to support it.

    Sure it does. All you hysterical anti Trump people said he wouldn’t last a month. Then past the first debate. Then past the caucus. Then past super Tuesday. Then past…well, you get the point. That’s pretty objective evidence that if nothing else Trump has stayability. And that translates into strength. All the country has to fear is the Anti Trump people voting for Hillary in a childish tantrum should Trump win the nomination.

    Hoagie ™ (e4fcd6)

  75. The caller said: ” I suspect he won’t fight. Three days ago there was an article in Breitbart where he’s being interviewed and he said, “You know, if I’m elected, “he said something to that effect of, “I’m not gonna get personal. This is gonna be about issues.””

    Well, obviously the caller is ignorant.

    Who did he think fought against O’care (the Audacity Con Act) and illegals on the Senate floor and in speeches and debates around the country years BEFORE these primaries? Ted Cruz.
    Is the caller so ignorant he hasn’t a clue; or is he a wilful liar?

    jb (8d560a)

  76. Piss on them Hoagie, Trump can win without the naysayers. America is better off without them. Let them pound sand and grouse among themselves, they’re irrelevant.

    ropelight (db17ed)

  77. Why don’t you assholes take your toys and go home? Sit out the election. You don’t have a dog in the fight, you don’t care if Hillary wins. Keep your eye on the prize, anyone, even Slick’s wife Hillary is preferable to an outsider.

    I’m certain you’ll be a lot happier making a nuisance of yourself over at Breitbart, Ropelight. They’re far more openly pro-Trump over there. They might even be more amenable to your conspiracy theory concerning the JFK assassination.

    Bill H (dcdd7b)

  78. Ok, I’ve not read any of the comments but I get what the caller was saying.

    He’s pissed that we gave the GOPe everything they asked for and they dicked us again. Its that simple. Working people don’t trust anyone in DC now. To Democrats, bipartisanship means GOP surrender. Then they rammed ObamaCare down our throats any way. The GOPe has “gone along to get along for so long”…they’re a huge part of the problem. They told us they needed control of the House. We gave it to them. They’ve done nothing. They demanded the Senate…we gave it to them, and they’ve done nothing.

    With control of both the House and Senate, the GOPe could have used to power of the purse to beat down Democrats at the game they played for 50 years…but instead, the GOPe surrendered…all along the line. I work for a living. I’m a master cabinetmaker, but I had to move out of Maryland because why in the hell would anyone ever hire me and pay me a professional wage, when they can hire illegals (and do in the hundreds and thousands) and pay them 1/2 to 1/3 what I make? Go to any construction site in Maryland, DC and northern Virginia…80% of the people working will be illegals…speaking Spanish. That has crushed the working class tradesman on the east coast.

    You bastards want to know why so many working men and women are backing the imbecilic Trump? He’s talking the talk to support those people who work. He probably won’t walk the walk, but at least he’s talking. Right now, when a DC pol talks…we assume he’s lying. It’s that simple. WE KNOW Hillary is lying when she opens her mouth…same goes for pretty much every other politician out there…Trump isn’t a politician. I don’t like him and the only way I’ll vote for him is IF he’s the nominee of the Republican Party…but at least he says he’ll do something about the biggest problem we face today…30 million illegals (that was the number used 10-15 years ago…what happened 19 million went home?) who are literally stealing the food from American tables.

    We have record numbers of people out of work. The highest percentage of people not in the work force since the 1970’s…and the government says we have a 5.5% unemployment rate. I call bullshyte! Politicians got us into this mess, I no longer think they can get us out of it…after all, we sure as hell can’t do any worse than we have to this point. As Glenn Reynolds of Instapundit fame say’s, “Worst political class ever…”, at least since James Buchanan (another Democrat) whose policies pushed us into Civil War…it might be time to water the tree of Liberty. I suspect it will happen sooner than anyone could possibly suspect.

    Rich Vail (339dcb)

  79. #11, if that were to happen, the Mussolini comparisons will be justified, but not in terms of the trains running on time.

    urbanleftbehind (5eecdb)

  80. Rich Vail,

    It’s interesting to watch someone passionately make the case for Cruz and then declare that it is the case for Trump.

    Patterico (2975ef)

  81. That’s interesting since nobody knows what the policies will be. Nobody.

    Sure I do. They will be big government policies. To pass policies that adhere to constitutional principles, someone must understand those principles and care about them. Trump does neither.

    Hillary is better because the GOP will fight her big government policies but enact Trump’s big government policies.

    Patterico (2975ef)

  82. 5. …But he’s still hiding behind the women’s skirts.

    Maybe if Cruz were to slap Fiorina around every once in while and make derogatory remarks about her face you’d like Cruz better.

    …And is kind of living in his own alternate reality.

    papertiger (c2d6da) — 4/28/2016 @ 8:27 am

    Again, the Trumpanzees and their projection.

    …It’s not really about, “Well, you know, people are being fooled that he’s not really conservative.” It’s not. I know he’s not a conservative. The fact is, to put it simply, Trump will fight. Not only will he fight, he’ll fight dirty, and the thing is we gotta get that. We have to have someone that’s gonna fight in the mud, ’cause that’s where our opponents are. That’s where our opponents have been.

    What’s with this “our opponents” Trumptardian idiocy? He likes those people who have been fighting in the mud against us. He enjoys wallowing in the mud with people like Pelosi, Reid, and Schumer. Those people aren’t his opponents; they’re is mud wrestling tag team partners. They helped him get rich; that’s why he gave them all that money. He likes sell-outs like Boehner; and as the links in Kevin M’s and DRJ’s comments show, sell-outs like Boehner like him. Because, actually, Boehner isn’t a sell-out. Boehner is a fraud just like Trump. Boehner says what he needs to say to get to DC and stay there, and once he’s there he acts true to form and reverts to the establishment big government liberal he is.

    Just like Trump. Trump will fight in the mud, alright. Against what’s left of the GOP that remains conservatives AND against the idiots who were stupid enough to vote for him thinking he was going to do a damn thing he said.

    …And the thing is, Trump, you know what? I disagree with probably 80% of the stuff that he believes in, or he purports to. But the thing is, I think we’re facing an existential crisis. It comes down to immigration, illegal immigration —

    Or, rather, he was going to do any of the 20% that, like this idjit caller, he said that you liked. That’s how a good scam works, and Trump is a con-man. Mexico isn’t paying for a wall. You’re not going to get a wall. What will you get? Amnesty for 95% of the 11-30 million illegal aliens who are already in this country. Because Trump has already said that “the good ones” can come right back in. They just have to go back to first base and tag up before they can come back and steal the rest of the bases.

    So, you’re voting for amnesty, and you’re going to get more illegal immigrants because, Trumpanzees, amnesty is an illegal alien magnet. And because he’s going to have to make a deal with the Democrats (and the John Boehner/Mich McConnell wing of the GOP) to get a sh*t sandwich of an immigration bill passed, and then tell you you’re going to like it. And the Trumpanzees will like that sh*t sandwich because the object of their cult’s worship made it for them.

    Trump will then fight dirty in the mud against his opponents. Who will be everyone and anyone who sees through his BS and will point out Trump is making the illegal immigration problem worse.

    Just like with Obamacare. Because as with immigration he’s promised to make it worse.

    This idjit caller seems to have a problem with Obamacare. And he thinks Bernie Sanders/Canadian/British socialized medicine is the answer. Because that is what Trump is saying when he says he’s going to “take care of everybody.” Thus showing that the Trumptards are moronic, insane, and a danger even to themselves. In the past the leftist accusation has been that conservatives/Republicans didn’t have any principled opposition to socialism. We’re just a bunch of racists, bigots, and sexists who hated it it when a woman (Hillarycare) or a black man (Obamacare) was wielding that kind of power. But we’d love the idea if a white man proposed it.

    And Trump comes along and wants to double down on Obamacare and take us further down the road of socialism, and you Trumpanzees are all for it. Thus proving the leftists were right all along. You won’t have a rational argument against the charge because you’ve just kicked the legs out of any such argument. But then if rational arguments could sway the Trumpanzees, you all wouldn’t be Trumanzees in the first place.

    Trump loves big government. He loves a government so big it can forcibly redistribute what little the lower orders of citizens own to him for his business enterprises. That’s why he gets along so well with the socialists. Every single time he’s had the chance to talk about the size and scope of government he has said he’s all for either keeping the government the same size (we have to keep those BLM/Forest Service lands “great” and the only way to keep those federal lands great is to keep them federal and not let the states or private owners get their hands on them) or bigger (socialized medicine). His only problem with government, as he’s said over and over, is that he’s not in charge of it. If he’s in charge of it then government can’t be too YUUUUGE or too powerful. So large, so powerful, and so unaccountable it is the major threat to our rights and freedoms.

    And you Trumpanzees want to make it worse by electing an egomaniac who knows only one thing about the Consitution; it mentions the words “eminent domain.”

    I’m more and more convinced Trump is the greater of any two evils. Because Hillary! isn’t the “deal maker” Trump is. So even if she wants to do more damage to the country, Trump will actually be able to do more real damage. He gets along with everybody, he says. Great, Trumpanzees, that’s how we got into this “existential crisis” this fool was talking about with Rush. We got here by sending people to DC who go along to get along.

    Steve57 (52b365)

  83. And I call them like I see the because I am not a politician and therefore do not feel an obligation to pretend people who have no business voting are somehow wise.

    How the caller, who seems to have a pretty good memory for political details, somehow glosses over the fact that Cruz has actually stood up to these people, I have no idea.

    Patterico (2975ef)

  84. So there is Mr. Rich Vail’s opinion on Trump. He said what almost every single Trump supporter said to me when I asked why they support him. So instead of trying to understand his frustration and contempt with the Republican party (as well as the democrats) begin your name calling in 3….2….1.

    Hoagie ™ (e4fcd6)

  85. 60. I don’t blame Ropelight if things don’t work out. He’s just as entitled to his views as I am to mine…

    Dustin (2a8be7) — 4/28/2016 @ 11:25 am

    Damn right I’m going to blame ropelight when, not if, things don’t work out. Sure, he has a right to his own views. But so what? Since when does that mean people aren’t accountable for their own choices and actions? As the old saying goes, people get the government they deserve. So it’s not only rational but an obligation, when things get worse, to blame the Trumpeters for insisting we deserved worse.

    ropelight and the rest of these Trump cultists are voting to make things worse instead of voting to turn things around. Their not simply expressing views. They’re taking an active part in the shredding of the Constitution and the destruction of the country. And they will deserve all the blame in the world for their role in making things worse.

    Steve57 (52b365)

  86. BTW, I went out to therapy today and my Cruz lawn signs were gone. Kaput. History. So now I’ll get ten of the things just to bust everybody’s chops.

    Hoagie ™ (e4fcd6)

  87. He thinks Trump is imbecilic and he doesn’t like him, but he will vote for him IF he is the nominee of the Republican Party – which he hates, because it has “dicked” him somehow, even though he no doubt voted for all the other sh*tty candidates it put forward over the years… but this sh*tty candidate will be different, dang it!! Also, Hillary!i1!!

    I am not going to mollycoddle people proud to display such lazy, lazy thinking. And the repeated calls to do so are starting to remind me of Helen Lovejoy from the Simpsons.

    Leviticus (efada1)

  88. BTW, I went out to therapy today and my Cruz lawn signs were gone. Kaput. History. So now I’ll get ten of the things just to bust everybody’s chops.

    Hoagie ™ (e4fcd6) — 4/28/2016 @ 1:04 pm

    How’d therapy go, Rev?

    Bill H (dcdd7b)

  89. 85. So there is Mr. Rich Vail’s opinion on Trump. He said what almost every single Trump supporter said to me when I asked why they support him. So instead of trying to understand his frustration and contempt with the Republican party (as well as the democrats) begin your name calling in 3….2….1.

    Hoagie ™ (e4fcd6) — 4/28/2016 @ 12:53 pm

    The frustration I understand. It’s the insanity part I have a problem with. I have contempt for the GOP. But unlike the Trumpanzees my problem with the GOP is not because they weren’t making enough deals with the likes of Pelosi, Reid, Schumer, Frank, et al. You know, Trumps’s friends mud wrestling tag team members. My problem with the GOP is the opposite of the Trumpanzees problem with the GOP. The GOP was already making too many deals.

    It is moronic and insane to imagine that a crooked Northeast establishment liberal who enjoys buying influence from other crooked Northeast establishment liberals eager to sell influence is somehow any sort of fix to America’s problems just because he’s willing to to change the D after his name to an R.

    Unless the problem is you think, as the Trumpanzees must, that the Republicans have been TOO obstructionist and both parties need to be steering the ship of state harder to the left.

    Steve57 (52b365)

  90. Ted Cruz is not me. He is my apprentice the anti-christ. one pissed off lucifer!

    upset lucifer (3816c2)

  91. Ted cruz worships me. Satan.

    upset lucifer (3816c2)

  92. It is very simple how the caller glossed over the fact that Cruz walked the walk,
    And I think you were unfair to Rich.

    The MSM doesn’t discuss Cruz unless it is to say nobody likes him (they don’t say why nobody likes him, because he stands on principle).
    The repubs don’t discuss Cruz because he is an embarrassment to them or opposes them.

    Somewhere in the midst of the debate process Cruz never made the clear and effective case that he was the real principled anti-establishment fighter,
    For whatever combination of reasons.

    I can’t help but think things have been so misplayed, yet there is still the possibility of a victory, but the looming likelihood of a disaster.

    MD in Philly (f9371b)

  93. ropelight and the rest of these Trump cultists are voting to make things worse instead of voting to turn things around.

    I rarely disagree with you Steve57 but on this I must. ropelight and the rest are doing no such thing. They are doing exactly what you and I are doing: voting for the guy they believe is best for America. They are not in any way voting to make things worse. First of all, if you believe Trump will make things worse you’re crazy. Only a socialist grifter or an old commie can do that. And you ain’t seen worse until either of those two have Executive Orders and names Supreme Court justices. You’ll also get to see more of people “actively” shredding the Constitution.

    Hoagie ™ (e4fcd6)

  94. They will be big government policies

    Yes, but in what form.

    As others have noted, Trump apparently wants to create – or his supporters seemingly want – a European style nationalist party, one that embraces government but only when it acts on their behalf. For them, all of this conservative talk about limited government is so much nonsense. Government is here to serve our interests and look out for us. Government is bad when it helps them; but good when it helps us.

    This is why discussions about governing principles goes right over their heads. They don’t care about such things. That’s establishment diversions or concerns. For them it’s important to defeat Hillary and have the government serve us.

    Discussing whether Trump is qualified or exactly what he will do is meaningless. They don’t care.

    And if you criticize this approach then, well, you’re for Hillary. At this point – actually since the start – if you don’t like Trump then you want the liberals to continue destroying the country. And that is that.

    SteveMG (d90a27)

  95. “No matter how low you go, it’s going to be President Trump and there’s not a damn thing you can do to prevent it.”

    Total lack of self-awareness. Completely divorced from reality.

    JD (62d335)

  96. The angry ones are those the gods have marked out for destruction.

    ropelight (db17ed)

  97. JD

    Total lack of self-awareness. Completely divorced from reality.

    Thus is typical of Donners… try asking of any of the skeletons in his closet and the silence will be deafening.

    Torcer (f045ef)

  98. Patterico #81

    I voted for Cruz in the Michigan primary. The ONLY way I’ll vote for Trump is if he’s the nominee. I’d rather have Cruz OR Fiorina instead, but that’s not going to happen. I had hoped that Cruz would be able to push it to a 2nd ballot by denying Trump enough delegates to gain the nomination on the 1st ballot, but I don’t see that happening either. Hope springs eternal…while reality sets in.

    Rich Vail (339dcb)

  99. The people who will win will be the blue collar Americans and minorities who have been crapped on over the last 30 years. On the GOP side you have a minority percentage of the party who actively sabotages any person who dares present moderate ideas in attempts to reach compromise everyone can live with. They cheer when Romney loses the election and only voted for McCain with the hope that he would die so Sarah Palin could save the world.
    The new savior is Cruz – a LBJ retread from 1956 in tactics whose dismissive know it all views make it clear where the blue collar folks stand – they feel they have been used so that the Cruzies could enforce the take theirs not mine view of the world.

    Move over to the Democrats and the Pelosi leftists have blown up what few conservative democrats they had left with very similar tactics to the right except they declare someone racist if they don’t toe the line where the right declares their heretics amnesty shills or establishment wags. What remains are the elite who worship political correctness and love power for how they can lord over others with their opinions and regulations. Jobs are gone and the racial animus is at a fever pitch. Clinton, a 90’s artifact incapable of having any kind of heart is struggling and it is very possible that she could lose to Trump.

    I always thought there would be an epic battle in which the left was symbolically slain by the good conservatives. I was wrong. Both sides got sick of it and someone who did reality tv shows is on the brink of being nominated for president. 60 percent of the country probably sits firmly in the middle slightly left and slightly right — all are sick of the end of times, the other party is my enemy approach the purists want them to engage in. Compromise is not a dirty word to them because it implies working together toward incremental solutions.

    It doesn’t matter whether Hillary or Trump wins – the middle has declared enough of the partisan purists who say they know what is good for them. In 2020 the map will be different, many of the “purists” will be in their late 50’s and beyond, tired and out of fight. The extremists will not be welcome and will be encouraged to run third parties instead of sucking off the resources of the party they have hijacked.

    The purists on both sides should be thrilled and not too terribly surprised at what they have helped create. Give yourselves a good pat on the back while you cluck cluck about “sometimes they need to learn the hard way” – it will only get better.

    I wish I had invested in popcorn last summer.

    spokanebob (6797b5)

  100. My issue w/the GOPe is that they have surrendered to the Democrats & Obama on every single significant issue in the past 6 years. On the Budget, which originates in the House, they could have forced Obama’s hand and sent him a budget he’d veto…then send it back to him again, and again and again…forcing Obama, and the obstructionists in the Democratic party to “shut down the gov’t”…(but how can you really shut down a government when 90% of the Fed Dept of Ed is considered NECESSARY to running said gov’t?).

    In the Senate, they could easily do to the Dem’s what they’ve done for the past 50+ years when for most of that time, they had majorities in both houses, and the GOP presidents had to make deals…not roll over and surrender. That’s the issue I’ve had w/the GOPe for the past 6 years. They asked, America gave then they surrendered…

    Rich Vail (339dcb)

  101. So, it’s the High Noon gambit?

    bruce (9fb928)

  102. Is Trump Sherriff Kane, or Charles Foster Kane?

    bruce (9fb928)

  103. Sure. Trump fights. But he only fights for things that will benefit him which includes tax breaks for himself, crony politicians he can bribe, using illegals for cheap labor and buying eastern European brides.

    How this makes him a quality presidential candidate is beyond me.

    NJRob (a07d2e)

  104. DRJ, that’s right, it’s up to Trump and his supporters to win the election and save America from collectivist destruction. You can participate in the most worthy of causes or stay home and acquiesce in the results, it’s up to you it’s your right as an American citizen.

    I will NOT eat from YOUR crap sandwich.

    Kevin M (25bbee)

  105. you can’t sit out the most important election of your lifetime

    Trump vs Hillary is a sham election, brought to us by fifth column traitors, backing a fake Republican shill. It is *fukcing* amazing how militantly stupid you people are.

    Kevin M (25bbee)

  106. I don’t blame Ropelight if things don’t work out

    I will.

    Kevin M (25bbee)

  107. It’s like trying to reason with a PARTICULARLY RETARDED 6-year old.

    FIFY

    Kevin M (25bbee)

  108. With control of both the House and Senate, the GOPe could have used to power of the purse to beat down Democrats at the game they played for 50 years…but instead, the GOPe surrendered

    And they guy that tried to get the Senate and House to fight — Cruz — is running for President and you oppose him, Mr Vail, so YOU ARE PART OF IT. You support the guy who is buddies with the former Speaker who sat on his duff. You oppose the guy who called out the feckless Senate Majority Leader for lying and sucking up to Obama, in favor of a guy who supported Hillary in 2008, then supported Obama, and gives money to Democrats.

    YOU SIR ARE PART OF THE PROBLEM. You pretend to be part of the solution, but your actions show us differently. You align with the GOPe, and the con man fronting for it.

    Kevin M (25bbee)

  109. Sometimes I read a description of a Cruz and just have to laugh

    JD (62d335)

  110. Won’t someone please think of the Trumpkins?

    nk (dbc370)

  111. I seem to recall reading here a few days ago comments from various Trumpkin shills — the regular suspects — about how closely connected Ted Cruz and John Boehner were, and about how Cruz and Boehner were both part of the GOP establishment in Washington. Only their man Trump, they insisted, was the outsider in the race.

    Yeah, right:

    Boehner ripped Cruz during a Stanford University talk Wednesday. He called Cruz “Lucifer in the flesh” and said that he had “never worked with a more miserable son of a bitch in my life,” according to the Stanford Daily.

    The paper reported that Boehner said he would vote for Trump in the general election but not Cruz. He also said he has played golf with Trump and that they were “texting buddies.”

    John Boehner, self-proclaimed texting buddy with Donald Trump.

    Maybe Boehner can be Trump’s Veep, huh? That would be just about perfect.

    Beldar (fa637a)

  112. Omitted the link for that quote, sorry.

    Beldar (fa637a)

  113. Ah — and I’m late to the party anyway, shoulda at least skimmed the earlier comments before adding that.

    Beldar (fa637a)

  114. jb (8d560a) — 4/28/2016 @ 12:38 pm

    Is the caller so ignorant he hasn’t a clue; or is he a wilful liar?

    The caller is ignorantt, and not just about tactics,.

    He’s ignorant on the substance. I mean he said:

    But the thing is, I think we’re facing an existential crisis. It comes down to immigration, illegal immigration —

    RUSH: Okay.

    CALLER: — and Obamacare.

    Now, we’re NOT facing an existenttial cris,s although maybe the Republican Party is, if it wants to commit suicide.

    Now as to why he favord Trump over Cruz, it’s because Trump has said thing that Cruz has not echoed nor has he openly disagreed with .

    Trump talks about budiling a wall on the Mexican border. You say Cruz also supports that? Trump trumps that by saying he will force Mexico to pay for it! Cruz does not say that, nor does he disagree and explain why that’s a bad idea or why it can’t be done. So who looks more determined, who looks tougher, who looks more honest?

    Trump says he wanst to temporarily exclude all Moslems who are not U.S. citizens from entering the United states. Cruz does not say that. Nor does he argue against it. Who looks more determined, who looks tougher, who looks more honest, who looks less bound by political correctness??

    Trump talks tougher on trade.

    Sammy Finkelman (047868)

  115. Trump may be spewing nonsense, but no candidate is confronting him.

    Sammy Finkelman (047868)

  116. I understand Dennis Hastert is still waiting for the court’s permission to travel to Indiana to endorse Trump in person, otherwise he will do so in a joint press conference with Harry Reid in Chicago.

    nk (dbc370)

  117. Boehner just likes Orange Julius Caesar because they’re both the same color.

    Rick Ballard (fa8b05)

  118. That’s just dumb. Trump might fight for what HE believes in but that won’t necessarily be what conservatives believe in.

    BMill (397f94)

  119. Please! Tiberius Caesar. And Hillary is Livia Drusilla.

    nk (dbc370)

  120. tiberius, you recall his rep, maybe mark anthony,

    narciso (732bc0)

  121. Steve and Kevin,

    Ropelight is just a commenter on the internet. He didn’t make this trainwreck happen. The GOP has let these problems fester for a long time, ignoring the reality that a reaction would come. I didn’t think the reaction would be Trump conning disaffected people into voting for a democrat, along with democrats hoping to give the GOP a terrible nominee, but the reaction was coming.

    Blame Trump for being what he is, but really the blame goes with the GOP for refusing to be a political party in any functional sense. Trump could withdraw today, and after I was done cheering we’d still be left with the same basic problem where this party’s leaders are at war with the people they expect support from.

    Dustin (2a8be7)

  122. Trump might fight for what HE believes in but that won’t necessarily be what conservatives believe in.

    But that’s exactly what his supporters want. They trust him to do the right thing; whatever that is.

    All of this talk about conservative this or that is, for them, meaningless. What have the conservatives done for us all of these years?

    Government is here to stay; it’s time it’s used on behalf of us and not liberals and special interests. The governments of other countries are working on their country’s behalf; it’s time ours works for us. On trade, on immigration, on foreign policy. America first, everyone else is of no concern.

    SteveMG (d90a27)

  123. Dustin–

    I blame Trump. I blame his followers, too. I blame McConnell, who put the good of his precious Senate before the good of the People. I blame Boehner, who opted for compromise when almost no one wanted compromise. Like Doran Martell of Dorne, he got what was coming to him for that. I blame the people who stayed home in 2012, or who wouldn’t vote for a Mormon. I blame Romney for not tearing Candy Crowley a few more assh0les. And I blame Trump’s mindless, militantly ignorant and traitorous supporters everywhere.

    Kevin M (25bbee)

  124. Every morning Bill Clinton spends 10 minutes laughing at people like ropelight.

    Kevin M (25bbee)

  125. Then he pinches himself to prove he’s awake.

    Kevin M (25bbee)

  126. The average Trump fan doesn’t even know who the hell Boehner is–and they won’t care if they do. Orange Men –United!

    Danube River Guide (76b104) — 4/28/2016 @ 10:21 am

    That’s funny. I lost all respect for Speak of the House when I found out they let democrats vote for them too.

    papertiger (c2d6da)

  127. Kevin M (25bbee) — 4/28/2016 @ 2:28 pm …”And they guy that tried to get the Senate and House to fight — Cruz — is running for President and you oppose him, Mr Vail, so YOU ARE PART OF IT.”

    What part of this didn’t you understand?

    to Patterico #81

    “I voted for Cruz in the Michigan primary. The ONLY way I’ll vote for Trump is if he’s the nominee. ”

    While I’m not the brightest guy in the world…I do read for content now and then.

    Rich Vail (339dcb)

  128. Kevin, that’s a decent list of blameworthy folks.

    Dustin (2a8be7)

  129. A fighter for the 20% that matters beats a pacifist that does not fight for the 100% that does.

    The caller is dead right.

    To think the caller dumb speaks poorly to your own capacity to understand.

    Rodney King's Spirit (a2db57)

  130. The GOP and maybe lawyerly Ted Cruz from uber alles Harvard Princeton SCOTUS are not really fighters. Folks get it much like Lincoln understood his need for Grant. A man who will take the fight even if you don’t really like him much.

    Rodney King's Spirit (a2db57)

  131. the tories spent a dozen years in the wilderness, and all they learned from that was contempt for their voters, a point cameron has made in his handling of the brexit, they know who the real enemy is though, farage, who has been on point on immigration and the european superstate,

    narciso (732bc0)

  132. the opposition is as rabidly nihilist as ever, doc brown with an english accent,

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/04/28/ken-livingstone-suspended-labour-party-anti-semitism/

    narciso (732bc0)

  133. Team republican is to blame. The leaders of this lying cabal should be hung. And their graves urinated on hourly. They gave us Trump and they better not deliver Bill and his wife. Farging bastiges.

    mg (31009b)

  134. “With control of both the House and Senate, the GOPe could have used to power of the purse to beat down Democrats at the game they played for 50 years…but instead, the GOPe surrendered”

    So your solution is to support someone that is a lifelong big government Democrat, and probably has not even read the Constituion. In what world does this make sense?

    JD (62d335)

  135. Screaming insults from the other side of the playground, with tears streaming down your face and snot running out of your nose, is not fighting. Whiny McDuckface helps losers believe that it is, seeing as how that’s all they’re capable of themselves.

    nk (dbc370)

  136. Danube, what part of the country was that conversation with this Trump supporter?

    *********

    He is military–votes absentee in Florida.

    Danube River Guide (76b104)

  137. The GOP and maybe lawyerly Ted Cruz from uber alles Harvard Princeton SCOTUS are not really fighters. Folks get it much like Lincoln understood his need for Grant. A man who will take the fight even if you don’t really like him much.

    Rodney King’s Spirit (a2db57) — 4/28/2016 @ 3:48 pm

    Well it seems like the “he’s a fighter” theme has now replaced the “he’s anti-establishment” theme and seems equally stupid. So now, as long as Trump fights that’s the important thing. If he fights for single payer health care, Planned Parenthood or whatever, as long as he’s fighting.

    I’m 90% certain he’ll lose in November so all this talk about what he’ll do is pointless, but if he wins I cannot imagine him fighting for a conservative SCOTUS justice if the Dems take the Senate. I’m pretty confident that he wouldn’t, for several reasons, beginning with the fact that it’s not that important to him IMO. Plus he wouldn’t want to take the chance of losing a battle right off the bat.

    I believe Cruz would fight for one, primarily because it is important to him.

    Gerald A (7c7ffb)

  138. ropelight:

    DRJ, that’s right, it’s up to Trump and his supporters to win the election and save America from collectivist destruction. You can participate in the most worthy of causes or stay home and acquiesce in the results, it’s up to you it’s your right as an American citizen.

    I try to live my life according to reason, not threats by small men like Trump who thinks he can bully his way to power. His bullying may have worked on you but it hasn’t on me or most Americans.

    Do you know the reason Trump hates being called a “small-fingered vulgarian”? I think it’s because he knows he is a small, insecure man who hates it when someone points it out. His life is a testament to the idea that people can’t depend on him for anything more than money, and often not even for that. His wives, his children, his business partners, his creditora, and most of his fellow Americans know he only cares about himself. That you can’t see it and have fallen for his bluster and promises isn’t a reflection on me.

    DRJ (15874d)

  139. The people responsible for giving us such a terrible choice in November is everyone who voted for Trump. It was their choice that got us here.

    DRJ (15874d)

  140. “I voted for Cruz in the Michigan primary. The ONLY way I’ll vote for Trump is if he’s the nominee.”

    – Rich Vail

    If the ONLY reason you’ll vote for a candidate is that he’s the nominee of a party that has “dicked” you repeatedly over the course of multiple election cycles, then you are a glutton for punishment and a walking exercise in cognitive dissonance.

    Leviticus (c8fdf0)

  141. But don’t worry, ropelight, Ted Cruz will be there to pick up the pieces in 2020, provided he isn’t the President of the Republic of Texas.

    DRJ (15874d)

  142. then you are a glutton for punishment and a walking exercise in cognitive dissonance.

    Given all the bilge associated with the Democrat Party and most liberals, I’d say let us worry about the Republicans and conservatives, you worry about your side of the aisle.

    (I guess the squish-squish independents are up for grabs or are sort of neutral territory)

    Mark (fb60e8)

  143. The constitution being such a living breathing document, the first thing you got to do is put a rope on it, then ride the rough off.

    papertiger (c2d6da)

  144. perhaps, the house and senate had one job, to listen to those who put them in the majority, they have been criminally derelict in their efforts, in some instances,

    narciso (732bc0)

  145. You know what I said: The immigration issue in the early 21st century is going to be like the slavery issue in the mid-19th century. Nothing else will matter to many people.

    Sammy Finkelman (047868)

  146. Ted Cruz ran an excellent campaign and I’m proud of him. He is not giving up and he never gave up his principles. That a plurality of people voting in the GOP primary want vindictive emotion instead of reason is not his fault.

    DRJ (15874d)

  147. “You know what I said: The immigration issue in the early 21st century is going to be like the slavery issue in the mid-19th century. Nothing else will matter to many people.”

    – Sammy Finkelman

    And for the same reasons, for many of them.

    Leviticus (c8fdf0)

  148. yes there was a similar instance in late republic wars, it pitted the two heroes of the previous jugurthan war

    narciso (732bc0)

  149. we’ve been dealing with this fool for seven years now,

    http://www.wsj.com/articles/the-opposite-of-reagan-1461864417?tesla=y

    narciso (732bc0)

  150. Did Cruz get 50% of the vote in Texas?
    Team republican and its bootlicking followers are lame.

    mg (31009b)

  151. I have donated to Cruz, twice.
    I have made phone calls for Cruz.
    I have did my best to get him voters.
    Eff everyone of you self absorbed freeloading pontificators that won’t end up voting for Trump if he is the nominee.

    mg (31009b)

  152. But that’s exactly what his supporters want. They trust him to do the right thing; whatever that is

    ************
    Cult of Personality, a very dangerous thing but perhaps an equal and opposite reaction to the Obama Cult of Personality.

    It’s interesting that no one wants to blame the liberal media, Democrats or Obama. The Burn it All Down hatred for Republicans has probably created a vacuum of power for Hillaryland. Bill Clinton nominated 370 federal judges for life,–Hillary will get to nominate more judges who are perhaps even more radical –because she also is handed a Democratic Senate majority. Things couldn’t have worked out better for her.

    Danube River Guide (76b104)

  153. 94. … They are not in any way voting to make things worse. First of all, if you believe Trump will make things worse you’re crazy. Only a socialist grifter or an old commie can do that. And you ain’t seen worse until either of those two have Executive Orders and names Supreme Court justices. You’ll also get to see more of people “actively” shredding the Constitution.

    Hoagie ™ (e4fcd6) — 4/28/2016 @ 1:22 pm

    Hoagie, Trump has been a grifter all his life. That’s how he got rich, just like Hillary. There is not one thing we need to worry about Hillary! doing that Trump wouldn’t do.

    Not one single thing. And I say that not only because Trump has in the past commented frequently that his politics are more in line with Democrats such as his wedding guests the Clintons. He’s done so since he decided to run for President.

    Go ahead and try to prove me wrong. And I’ll come up with quotes from Trump that shows he’s the same crooked lying fraud of a NYC establishment liberal he’s always been. The only difference between him and Clinton is that he’s the buyer and she’s the seller in game of corrupting politics.

    Trump is more establishment insider than Reince Priebus, Carl Rove, James Carville, George Stephanoupols, et al. None of them ever got elected to office, either, and apparently that’s the only rule for who is an insider and who’s the outsider. Trump has been playing the establishment game longer than any of those guys, so if anyone wants to hallucinate that Trump is some anti-establishment rebel against the system I’ll have what you’re smoking.

    There really are only a few statements Trump has made in recent years. The ones he’s made under penalty of perjury admitting that he’s a liar and if you’re stupid enough and gullible enough to take his lies at face value without doing your due diligence then you deserve to get ripped off.

    http://zhlaw.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/10/Order-Granting-Class-Trump-RICO.pdf

    …Although Defendant may yet show that Plaintiff and the putative class members knew or should have known that Defendant had devised a scheme to falsely market Trump University via mail or wire prior to October 2009, the Court is satisfied that determination of Defendant’s statute of limitation defense in this case will not defeat the predominance of common issues in this case.

    Frankly, Hoagie, your entire argument is nonsensical. Only a socialist grifter or old commie can make things worse? But a mere lying amoral/immoral unprincipled say-anything fraud committing grifter can’t? No, Hoagie, you’re going to find out that a con-man like Trump can make things worse. He has no ideology but so what. He’s willing to make deals with his fellow grifters including the socialist ones, as well as the old commies, and Sanders isn’t the only one. He doesn’t know, and he doesn’t care. He’ll sell his soul to the highest bidder.

    Steve57 (52b365)

  154. I like this latest Trumpkin con. They are good at it.

    It’s not a cause; it’s a national temper tantrum. And if you have children you know you can’t reason with a 6-year old having a tantrum.

    SteveMG (d90a27)

  155. RKS,

    Cruz isn’t a warrior, but he is a fighter. He’s fought and won many times, for example in the Supreme Court and with the last amnesty effort.

    So no, you’re mistaken about who the fighter in the race is. Trump has flip flopped and then declared victory in grandiose terms, but to me this is cowardice. Trump would stick to an unpopular position and try to defend it if he were a fighter. Remember in Iowa when Cruz was explaining his plan to end subsidies over five years to an angry farmer. Trump simply promised more subsidies. To Trump’s fans, this makes Cruz the coward because his plan takes five years instead of cutting off the subsidies instantly. They don’t care that Trump wants to increase them for pander-points. He insulted Cruz’s wife so he’s a big man.

    Dustin (2a8be7)

  156. My bad; I should not assume Trump still has a soul left to sell.

    Steve57 (52b365)

  157. I have donated to Cruz, twice.
    I have made phone calls for Cruz.
    I have did my best to get him voters.
    Eff everyone of you self absorbed freeloading pontificators that won’t end up voting for Trump if he is the nominee.

    mg (31009b) — 4/28/2016 @ 4:32 pm
    ====================================================================

    Some seem to prefer Hillary Clinton, mg. I’m more inclined to agree with you than disagree. And John Boehner can ESAD, the crying jag jag-off.

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  158. Some seem to prefer Hillary

    Haiku, you misspelled ‘most’.

    Most Americans prefer Hillary. Quite a vast majority. She’s leading in Utah.

    I’ll support the most conservative candidate who can win. Right now that’s Cruz. In a match between Jane Fonda and Joseph Stalin, that’s Fonda. In a match between Hillary and Trump I don’t think there’s any serious thought explaining why the more conservative isn’t Hillary, and even more so the results, as Trump would make deals with the democrats and RINOs, while Hillary would face at least a little opposition.

    I feel sorry for those who take partisanship so far that they will vote against their own views just to win one for the team. But not that sorry. Ultimately Trump would be crushed, and I would be proud of doing my part to help.

    Dustin (2a8be7)

  159. If Trump wins, the Presidency will be debased beyond salvation. But I’m not telling anybody else not to vote for the Badgerhead. It’s your country and your White House too.

    nk (dbc370)

  160. I know back to vandal savage, but in reality, he’s not that or greg stillson, or deutscher of the 15th rule:

    https://pjmedia.com/election/2016/04/28/german-official-slams-trumps-america-first-foreign-policy-american-left-cheers/

    narciso (732bc0)

  161. “Government is here to stay; it’s time it’s used on behalf of us and not liberals and special interests”

    There is zero evidence Trump would not do the same.

    JD (62d335)

  162. this is the stark alternative we face, sooner rather than later,

    https://pjmedia.com/richardfernandez/2016/04/28/the-death-of-a-nation/

    narciso (732bc0)

  163. While I’m not the brightest guy in the world…I do read for content now and then.

    Sorry, Rich, if I misread you. Not a real happy camper today.

    Kevin M (25bbee)

  164. so there are examples of these tweets, recall they are forever, or is this another circle (redacted) that the top men put forward,

    narciso (732bc0)

  165. So your solution is to support someone that is a lifelong big government Democrat, and probably has not even read the Constituion. In what world does this make sense?

    This one, apparently

    Kevin M (25bbee)

  166. but enough about california, if I read you’re situation right, the dems did to arnold, much like what they did to kasich re sb 5, he was the black knight after that,

    narciso (732bc0)

  167. The immigration issue in the early 21st century is going to be like the slavery issue in the mid-19th century.

    Sammy, are you seriously suggesting that all people have a right to enter any country whatsoever and then demand services and support as if they were citizens? Or even invited? That countries that attempt to control their borders are Nazis?

    This CAN be made to work, of course. Just get rid of all welfare and public services. You want the fire department? Are you a subscriber?

    Kevin M (25bbee)

  168. If Trump wins, the Presidency will be debased beyond salvation. But I’m not telling anybody else not to vote for the Badgerhead. It’s your country and your White House too.

    Same for Hillary, actually. She will debase it through avarice and cronyism, and the sleaze will ooze out to cover all the other institutions. I really cannot say that she would be any better than Trump, or any worse. Probably different.

    I had hoped for better, though. With Trump as the nominee, we get a choice not of high road vs low road, but of which swamp we want to wade through.

    Again, a Romney/Rice independent run would have legs.

    Kevin M (25bbee)

  169. Kevin is quite right and that idea needs to be discussed more openly.

    If you want open immigration, you need to close out welfare programs. You just can’t have them both, even if you like either idea.

    Granted, the idea is to import a lot of voters who then need those benefits to survive in a state of fear and desperation, so democrats win power over what’s left. But in all practicality you just can’t have both.

    Dustin (2a8be7)

  170. sammy is slightly obtuse, however we’re talking power not logic or facts, or has the fate of 187 and SB 1070, escaped your recollection,

    how did obama come to power, he eliminated all his rivals from the ballot in ’95, he did a similar thing with his top rivals, hull and ryan, axelrod tried to do the same with the alaskan nutrooters in 2008, since maverick wasn’t worth targeting, those who went along with the narrative, were rewarded like halperin and heilman, wallace and schmidt, madden and jones,
    they went on to either be signed to other campaigns, or create the narrative,

    narciso (732bc0)

  171. Kevin – Sammy is an open borders idiot.

    JD (62d335)

  172. but by all means, ‘lets stay over macho grande’

    narciso (732bc0)

  173. farage, lepen, wilder, de vere, hofer, petry, what do they have in common?

    narciso (732bc0)

  174. so cruz represented boehner, in the mcdermott matter, as starr helped shepherd moldea’s tome through the libel courts, harry truman was right in at least one respect,

    narciso (732bc0)

  175. Again, a Romney/Rice independent run would have legs.

    Kevin M (25bbee) — 4/28/2016 @ 5:21 pm

    To clarify my mind, you’re talking Condoleezza, not Susan, correct?

    Bill H (dcdd7b)

  176. Boehner is a selfless, dedicated public servant, and anybody who thinks that he was motivated by pique for being thrown out of Congress on his country-club ass and by promises of $$$ from Trump’s “over 500″ (snicker) businesses should be thoroughly ashamed of himself; as should anybody else who thinks that Boehner is a borderline alcoholic with disabling emotional problems who only wants to hang around the golf course bar and peddle influence to the K Street lobbyists. For shame, for shame, for shame!

    nk (dbc370)

  177. 163. …In a match between Hillary and Trump I don’t think there’s any serious thought explaining why the more conservative isn’t Hillary, and even more so the results, as Trump would make deals with the democrats and RINOs, while Hillary would face at least a little opposition.

    Dustin (2a8be7) — 4/28/2016 @ 4:48 pm

    Actually, you’ve nailed the problem Dustin. Originally I didn’t put any thought into the notion that, between Hillary! and Trump, the more conservative option isn’t Hillary! As if it were a no-brainer. But as this primary season has dragged on, and as Trump has continued to shoot his mouth off, I am no longer convinced Trump is the lesser of two evils. For the reasons you mention.

    What would stop Trump from asking Bernie Sanders to join him on a “unity” ticket, for instance. Principles? Political philosophy? Along with a conscience and undoubtedly a soul, Trump has none of those to hinder him. So why not Sanders? They see eye-to-socialist-eye on many issues, most notably single-payer health care and trade. And since winning is the only important thing in what this year has devolved into a lemming race toward a cliff overlooking the Arctic Ocean, and Trump would bleed off a lot of Hillary! support in the general election portion of the lemming race, why not?

    The only thing that makes the authoritarian statist Trump “conservative” is the authoritarian statist’s own assertions that he’s a conservative. And since his cultists believe anything he says, they’ll insist whatever he wants to do is therefore conservative.

    Even if what he wants to do is taken straight off the list of the socialist leftist Progressive Congressional Caucus’ demands. Just so long as it has the “Trump stamp” of approval tattooed on it’s backside it’s OK with them.

    Me, I have real problems with socialized medicine. Actual principled objections. And I don’t care if the @$$hole advocating socialized medicine has an “R for Republican” after his name or an “D for Democratic Socialist” after his name. Both of them are trying to get me killed. It probably slipped everyone’s notice that the Canadian Supreme Court agreed with me back in 2005.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chaoulli_v_Quebec_%28AG%29

    Chaoulli v Quebec (AG) [2005] 1 S.C.R. 791, 2005 SCC 35, was a decision by the Supreme Court of Canada of which the Court ruled that the Quebec Health Insurance Act and the Hospital Insurance Act prohibiting private medical insurance in the face of long wait times violated the Quebec Charter of Human Rights and Freedoms. In a 4 to 3 decision, the Court found the Acts violated Quebecers’ right to life and security of person under the Quebec Charter. The ruling is binding only in Quebec. Three of the seven judges also found that the laws violated section seven of the Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms…

    And:

    http://www.heritage.org/research/lecture/a-victory-for-freedom-the-canadian-supreme-courts-ruling-on-private-health-care

    Before 2005 it was illegal to pay cash for treatment if the Canadian “nationalized health care system” provided that same treatment for “free.” Sure, like our own VA you’d have to wait until you were dead before you’d see a doctor to even get a diagnosis to find out what kind of cancer you had.

    But it was “free!”

    No thanks. I don’t like being told I’m statistically insignificant in the big scheme of things. And I don’t care if it’s Donald Trump or Bernie Sanders or Hillary! telling me that. Ironically the Canadian Supreme Court agreed with my position; they ruled it is a violation of someone’s human rights to have to wait for four months just to get a diagnosis, and then after finding out the cancer will probably kill them in six months they need to wait another nine months to start chemo or radiation treatment. (A lot of Canadians still like their “free” health care, which isn’t free as the taxpayers pay for it, because Grandma would have had to pay $25K for her hip replacement otherwise, and she was happy with it even though she waited forever to get it, as if a hip replacement will kill you like cancer. For years the single best indicator that a Canadian would survive a life-threatening illness was if they could access and pay for treatment in the US. Most Canadians aren’t confronted with the problem; the ones who had to actually depend on
    Canadian “health care” to live hated it.)

    Now in Quebec at least they have “super hospitals.” What we in the states know of as regular ordinary hospitals where you can pay cash. Which is how most of us used to get health care from the time of our founding until Lyndon Johnson’s “great society” BS, and it’s cheaper then your deductible because government subsidies eff everything up.

    But the Trump fanbois only care who is telling them they’ll take what the government wants to give them and like it. And not just in health care.

    I Just can’t endorse the all-powerful centralized government no matter who wants to impose it on me.

    Steve57 (52b365)

  178. 166. “Government is here to stay; it’s time it’s used on behalf of us and not liberals and special interests”

    There is zero evidence Trump would not do the same.

    JD (62d335) — 4/28/2016 @ 4:58 pm

    The Trumpanzees talk about the “existential crisis,” and their solution is to demand we vote for better dictators.

    Oh, and for your further viewing pleasure, their “better dictator” is a guy named Trump who is both a liberal and who brags about how successful he was at corrupting the system as acted as his own special interest.

    And, this is sane, how, JD?

    Steve57 (52b365)

  179. I don’t “blame ropelight” specifically. But I do, in fact, blame Trump voters. So I blame him and people like him generally.

    And I blame a system that allows such bad decisionmakers to have so much control over my life.

    Patterico (86c8ed)

  180. well that’s one way to read it, another is to look at history, the first major milestone was medicare, and the immigration act of 1965, and the cuban adjustment act, I can’t complain about the last but the first two, were the hallmarks of fundamental transformation, now how did this come about, because the gop establishment had a hankering for nelson rockefeller,
    like rocky road ice cream, and this parvenu goldwater got in the way, they lost that match, but they chose to be ‘willing for lyndon’ in so far as the dems mined the primary attacks, and goldwater lost, what might have been a marginal defeat into an apocalypse, also we got the misbegotten vietnam expedition out of the deal, fought in the worst way possible,

    narciso (732bc0)

  181. “Haiku, you misspelled ‘most’.

    Most Americans prefer Hillary. Quite a vast majority. She’s leading in Utah.”

    Dustin, you seem to have willfully missed the target… the segment mg was opining about: Some Patterico posters.

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  182. Someone may have already pointed this out, but one of the chief reasons we are in this predicament is because the absolutely gutless Republican-controlled Congress refused to push back, refused to keep promise after promise, refused to stop the go-along-to-get-along environment, refused to stop lining their pockets and feathering their nests, refused to do their goddam jobs. We reap what we sow.

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  183. 189. Someone may have already pointed this out, but one of the chief reasons we are in this predicament is because the absolutely gutless Republican-controlled Congress refused to push back, refused to keep promise after promise, refused to stop the go-along-to-get-along environment, refused to stop lining their pockets and feathering their nests, refused to do their goddam jobs. We reap what we sow.

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0) — 4/28/2016 @ 6:37 pm

    Actually I pointed it out. I pointed it out when I was making the point that Trump brags about being one of the architects of redefining what the “gutless Republican-controlled Congress” job was. It wasn’t that they refused to do their jobs. It’s just that as far as high rollers like Trump are concerned lying to voters and, instead of doing what they lightly promised the suckers, doing what he pays them the big bucks to do IS their jobs.

    They know what their job is. Their job is, when Trump buys them or any other pol whatever the letter after their name, to stay bought.

    So, this guy Trump is supposed to be the solution, why?

    Steve57 (52b365)

  184. To clarify my mind, you’re talking Condoleezza, not Susan, correct?

    God yes. Since I was speaking of someone who might be President someday, I thought that part was obvious.

    It sure would be an oasis of sanity in this silly, silly year. Romney has the $ to make a go of it, and he doesn’t have to learn the ropes. Only question is whether Rice would do it. The prospect of a President Trump might concentrate her mind wonderfully, though.

    (Note that no one who has signed the RNC IP agreement for 2016 could do it, but I doubt either one of them has).

    Kevin M (25bbee)

  185. farage, lepen, wilder, de vere, hofer, petry, what do they have in common?

    No power?

    Kevin M (25bbee)

  186. why are they out of power, because the left-right codominium prefers it that way, because europe must be the master, and immigration must flow, unrestricted,

    narciso (732bc0)

  187. Cruz is the guy to do all that’s possible to get him elected, Steve, but goddamit, I would rather a buffoon like Trump get the job than the criminal Hillary Clinton, Destroyer of Western Civilization.

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  188. “I’ll support the most conservative candidate who can win. Right now that’s Cruz. In a match between Jane Fonda and Joseph Stalin, that’s Fonda. ”

    A man is nothing without his principles.

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  189. Haiku,

    Yeah, that was my point. If only elections were decided by the folks here, even wth our ridiculous trolls, even folks with wildly divergent opinions, I think the country would be so much better off its almost sickening.

    But it ain’t so. My refusal to ever again support a lesser of two evils Republican, to say nothing of my refusal to support a nut like Trump, isn’t important. It’s an important principle to me but what will actually wind up affecting our families is that the gop is set to nominate a genuinely bad person who will justifiably lose to another bad person.

    We got here because of a lot of things. The party hasn’t listened to the frustration, or even themselves when they talk about what’s wrong. The party has compromised where it shouldn’t have. Some voters think the problem is simply a lack of willpower, but I think it’s a lack of principles.

    At any rate, president Hillary is a terrible outcome and I hope it doesn’t come to that, but I believe there are worse possible outcomes.

    Dustin (72ab0a)

  190. You realize that Trump doesn’t WANT to win, don’t you. If he wins, he has to perform, and he really doesn’t have any ideas. His own people have admitted he was just in it to shake things up. But if he loses — and if he can blame his loss on other people — the Wreckers — then it’s all might-have-beens, like how JFK was going to get us out of VietNam.

    And meanwhile, his real backers — the Clintons — assume power once again, while Trump eats free for the rest of his life on the idolatry of his marks.

    Kevin M (25bbee)

  191. I Just can’t endorse the all-powerful centralized government no matter who wants to impose it on me.

    I hate to tell you Steve57 but you’re way too late. We already have an all powerful central government. They have the power to make you buy Obamacare, buy the light bulbs and toilets they decree, pay for Solyndra and now they have decreed by law there are more than two sexes. Trump ay not be the answer Steve57 but he sure wasn’t the cause. The status quo was the cause and Trump ain’t no status quo.

    … a guy named Trump who is both a liberal and who brags about how successful he was at corrupting the system as acted as his own special interest.

    I hate to disappoint you but he did not “corrupt the system”. The system was corrupt and all he did was use it to his advantage. Tat’s why I’m for Cruz, to fix it. But that’s not why I’m not for Trump. He did exactly what the system allows just like Warren Buffet, Steve Jobs, Mitt Romney and every other crony capitalist in America. The left designed the system that way It’s a feature not a bug. It’s there for the left to enter into a fascist collusion with business. Business gets money and special exemptions from regulations ad the left has a scape goat when their socialist crap goes pear shaped.

    You guys aren’t used to dealing with businessmen. You don’t understand them. For 40 years I was in my own businesses. America was a Republic but once you entered my business you entered a dictatorship and I was the dictator. Trump’s not used to people telling him “no” because he’s the boss, the dictator. He will get a rude awakening if he actually wins and finds out all the people he has to stroke to get things done. He’s used to being the strokee, then he’ll be the stroker. Or as we used to say before PC, the JO.

    But it’s still no reason for all you big tough guys to get your panties in a bunch. Fight the good fight for Cruz, but make sure Hillary! doesn’t win.

    Tomorrow my committeemen is bringing me new Cruz/Fiorina signs. I love it.

    Hoagie ™ (e4fcd6)

  192. Doing God’s work, Hoagie. Hang tough!

    Colonel Haiku (2601c0)

  193. You pro Trump and anti Trump guys can continue to dump all over each other but if you don’t soon realize our common enemy is a socialist grifter who will become Obama 3.0 and Obama 4.0 you’ll find out exactly what being in a dictatorship is.

    Now I’m going to bed. Good night.

    Rev. Hoagie ™ (e4fcd6)

  194. yes, it’s curious how prescient one can br,

    https://storify.com/SeanTrende/jay-cost-goes-nuclear-on-trumpkins

    narciso (732bc0)

  195. If Trump is the nominee, Hillary wins. Because Truck Fump. And every last one of his Primary voters. Every last one of them.

    John Hitchcock (160598)

  196. seems like a self fulfilling prophecy, I wouldn’t be in the move to accelerate the eschaton,

    narciso (732bc0)

  197. 144 Gerald,

    Cruz might be a fighter but Trump is most definitely one. Pretty clear to me folks see Cruz and see him as just another slime ball lawyer whose idea of fighting is shitting in the mouth of other slime ball lawyers all the while bleeding both parties dry.

    Rodney King's Spirit (a2db57)

  198. BS, Hoagie. Trump isn’t Team R. He is a tick to the right of Hillary, and a lifelong member of Team Dem. That fight is being fought now. If Trump succeeds, our choice will be between a dishonest Dem, and a slightly less dishonest Dem.

    JD (34f761)

  199. I hate to tell you Steve57 but you’re way too late. We already have an all powerful central government. They have the power to make you buy Obamacare, buy the light bulbs and toilets they decree, pay for Solyndra and now they have decreed by law there are more than two sexes. Trump ay not be the answer Steve57 but he sure wasn’t the cause. The status quo was the cause and Trump ain’t no status quo.

    Hoagie @200, I’m a big boy. I can take it. But, and I hate to tell you, by the same logic Hillary! is equally not the cause. She got an Ivy League MRS degree, rode her hubby’s coattails to the WH, then marked time as Senator from NY and SecState without accomplishing anything. So we got to where we are without her help and, if you’re honest, without Bernie Sanders’ help. Unless you think yelling at a CSPAN camera at three in the morning counts as an accomplishment.

    If Trump’s brags are to be believed he played a far bigger role in driving us toward this “existential crisis” than those two inside-the-beltway unaccomplished clock-punchers. Here, as when he doesn’t want to go to prison for lying to a judge about his frauds, I tend to believe him. According to the Gospel of Trump he, unlike Sanders or Hillary!, gets him done. So if you believe him he’s more to blame for the other two. If you don’t, then there’s no reason to vote for the impotent fraudster.

    I agree Trump “ain’t the status quo.” If someone could convince me this particular on-the-take NYC establishment influence-buying reflexively leftist grifter were the status quo I could be convinced he’s the lesser of two evils as opposed to the on-the-take NYC establishment influence-selling hardcore leftist grifter.

    But neither one is the status quo. They’re both worse than what we have now.

    Steve57 (52b365)

  200. explaining why the more conservative isn’t Hillary

    Excuse me while I stifle a guffaw over that clause.

    When it comes to judging the innate biases of a public figure, the only type of observer who I have less confidence in than the ones who have even a tiny bit of soft feelings for hideous Hillary are the observers who apply the word “conservative” to her. She is intrinsically a liberal or leftist. Her built-in sentiments radiate a form of liberalism that’s more rotten than ever before. Combine that with her pathological degree of dishonesty and she’s a perfect match for an America that shows signs of being increasingly God damned.

    Mark (fb60e8)

  201. I read the article.

    Look there are people–just like soldiers in the field, that lose their heads. Its a herd instinct.

    This is why leadership is so damn hard to find and to actually train into combat officers. Leaders need to build a sense of purpose in a unit that will exist even when that leader is blown away.

    There are units that disintigrate when they lose a leader and other units that will fight to gates of hell when they see the leader take a round.

    Our problem as a country is that for too damn long we took the moral purpose out of our self-identity. When Iraq came, we cheered on the troops like they were watching a sports team and not commiting the lives of soldiers to a moral purpose.

    You wonder why suicides are high? These troops see the emptiness of the country to the cause they fought for and their friends died for when they came home.

    It was pulling teeth to finally get one damn candidate to acknowledge that we won the war by all rights–those mission objectives spelled out on the “authorization” that itemized why we were sent out to do–Perry.

    Now, let me tell you this and listen well.

    If this damned country votes for Trump, it is because it went coward. I loathe cowards.

    This country will deserve every plaque that the Almighty might care to visit on it.

    Those of us that understand the difference between right and wrong know this already. We are content that justice will finally be done.

    And I will leave you with one last thought.

    Get a backbone and get out there and fight. Fight for your values, families, churches, and for your posterity. You have mucked it up pretty bad already. Fighting for what you know to be right will not make it any worse.

    And who knows, maybe some good leader might emerge from you thay would allow your fellow yellow backs to find their own courage.

    Paul Deignan (d5379f)

  202. romney/rice
    don’t bogart that joint, my friend.

    mg (31009b)

  203. Cruz might be a fighter but Trump is most definitely one. Pretty clear to me folks see Cruz and see him as just another slime ball lawyer whose idea of fighting is shitting in the mouth of other slime ball lawyers all the while bleeding both parties dry.
    Rodney King’s Spirit (a2db57) — 4/28/2016 @ 8:25 pm

    Drinking too much Kool-Aid causes zits, you know.

    Eric in Hollywood (beeefc)

  204. Choosing between Trump and Hillary is an awful choice. Both are self-centered and will put their own interests first. Both are socially liberal, lack foreign policy sense, and extremely poor money managers — someone always has to bail them out. As President, it will be the taxpayers who have to pay when one of them overpromises or screws up, as they inevitably will. Both love to spend money and live extravagant lives like the royalty they think they are.

    To me, the only debatable issues are:

    1. Who will pick a better Supreme Court Justice to replace Scalia and any others that may die or resign? We don’t know who Trump will pick but Hillary will pick liberal Justices, and we may have a liberal Senate that will endorse her choice and oppose Trump’s choice. As a conservative who wants conservative policies and choices, I give Trump an advantage here.

    2. Who will Congress work with to rein in government? Congress loves pork and doesn’t care who offers it, and neither Trump nor Hillary have supported conservative policies. In addition, we may have a Democratic Senate. The GOP may stand up to Hillary but few will stand up to Trump. Advantage Hillary.

    3. Who will undo Obama’s executive orders and pick a Cabinet that will lead the Executive agencies in a conservative, competent, principled way? Neither. Even Trump won’t commit to repealing ObamaCare, saying he will “ask Congress” on day one to repeal ObamaCare because only “our elected representatives (not our President),” should eliminate the mandate. In other words, Trump will punt these issues to a divided Congress that is unlikely to change the status quo. No advantage here.

    DRJ (15874d)

  205. DRJ @213, you’re a treasure.

    As Dustin said earlier, and as I have echoed, no one has put any serious thought into just how Trump is better than Hillary! Admittedly my knee-jerk reaction was to presume that anyone who isn’t Hillary! must better but the more I look at Trump the less I can hold on to that fantasy. Only in some ways will he possibly be better but in other ways worse. And while I firmly believe that the epithets I apply to The Donald, i.e he’s just another crooked, lying on-the-take NY establishment leftist, are accurate and descriptive, they probably aren’t as persuasive as your well-thought and well-articulated comments.

    It certainly isn’t the most Christian way to make the case, on my part.

    Steve57 (52b365)

  206. hillary’s a pee-stanky criminal

    whereas Mr. Trump is a magnificent and also serendipitous

    he’s got verve!

    advantage: Let’s Make America Great Again! hi President Trump thanks for doing all the greatness back on America!

    disadvantage: what’s that smell it smells like urine oh yuck it’s President Hillary

    happyfeet (831175)

  207. #140: So your solution is to support someone that is a lifelong big government Democrat, and probably has not even read the Constituion. In what world does this make sense?

    JD (62d335) — 4/28/2016 @ 3:58 pm

    No sir, my point is I voted for Mr. Cruz. I hope that he’ll be able to win enough states to deny Mr. Trump the nomination outright and to win on a 2nd or 3rd ballot. That’s my hope. They ONLY way I’ll vote for Trump is if he ends up as the nominee of the Republican party…but then I’d crawl a mile across broken glass to vote AGAINST hillary!
    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

    140: While I’m not the brightest guy in the world…I do read for content now and then.

    Sorry, Rich, if I misread you. Not a real happy camper today.

    Kevin M (25bbee) — 4/28/2016 @ 5:05 pm

    No problem. I have those days too.

    Rich Vail (339dcb)

  208. from safespaces to no platforming, and this maybe the future prime minister,

    http://reason.com/blog/2016/04/28/speaker-disinvited-from-college-event-af

    narciso (732bc0)

  209. 174. SF: The immigration issue in the early 21st century is going to be like the slavery issue in the mid-19th century.

    Kevin M (25bbee) — 4/28/2016 @ 5:17 pm

    Sammy, are you seriously suggesting that all people have a right to enter any country whatsoever

    In principle. Unless they are enemies or similar reasons, but certainly not for economic reasons, which are mostly imaginary. It’s not even a profitable wrong. And some people aren’t arguing it is profitable, certainly not in all cases, but merely that the law is the law and should be upheld and enforced. We don’t do that even with unquestionably just laws, nor with neutral laws people break. Why should this be done with an imnherently unjust and unfair law?

    While this right has been carefully kept out of human rights declarations since immigration restrictions became common starting around the 1880s, but especially coinciding with World War I, expressions of human rights written before that, including the Declaration of Independence, do include that idea:

    http://www.archives.gov/exhibits/charters/declaration_transcript.html

    We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness. –That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed

    Self-evident: This doesn’t require any argument.

    All men are created equal: But not some are more equal than others. If someone is a human being they have these rights.

    Unalienable: They cannot be taken away.

    Pursuit of Happiness: Pursuit implies movement, like change of place. Sometimes this works so as to close off all good options.

    Government s: Plural.

    Just powers: While government can restrict these rights, this is not as just exercise of power.

    Consent of the governed: Where did Mexicans, Guatamalans etc give their consent to this? Yet power is being exercised over them. Are they not being governed?

    You will never knock the idea out of people’s heads that they have a right to come to another country, and live under a different set of circumstances. You see it that the idea is not kockcked out. And nobody expects to knock the idea out. That is why they talk of a wall. It’s too ingrained in human history. This concept of a right to go to another country breaks out regularly in speech like when people talk about leaving the country, going to Canada etc. And the thought doesn’t enter their mind that they need permission from Canada.

    and then demand services and support as if they were citizens?

    It depends on what kind of services. But they should be equal recipients of charity. That is Biblical.

    Numbers 15:16 One law and one ordinance shall be both for you, and for the stranger that sojourneth with you. (similar things are repeated at various places)

    Leviticus 19:33 “And if a stranger sojourn with thee in your land, ye shall not do him wrong. 34 The stranger that sojourneth with you shall be unto you as the home-born among you, and thou shalt love him as thyself; for ye were strangers in the land of Egypt: I am the LORD your God.”

    You may be familiar with Leviticus 19:18 “Thou shalt not take vengeance, nor bear any grudge against the children of thy people, but thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself: I am the LORD.”

    But the Bible not only says you shall love your neighbour as yourself, it also says, just 14 verses later, you shall love the alien as yourself. Yes, you can argue about just what it means.

    Of course we are talking about people who will abide by the law etc. Of all cuntries in the world, the United states has least to worry about culture.

    Why do you give charity? Because someone is a citizen or because someone is a human being?? It certainly makes sense to favor people you know, feel related to, people who live in your city or country, but it is twisted to first make something available to everyone, and then keep people away because then you would have to give them money or aid. Don’t give anything at all!!

    Or even invited?

    No need to invite anyone. But to interfere is another story.

    That countries that attempt to control their borders are Nazis?

    Not Nazis, but they are engaged in different lines of the same business. As amatter of fact, in the past, the INS recognized this, and was very sympathitic to Nazis who violated immigration laws. Not all immigration law violations were considered equal in their eyes. They gave the laws reasons and consistency it didn’t have.

    And if they take things too far, they wind up killing people. Not only by sentencing people to live where they will be killed, but the danger of the journey. There are no two ways about this. Anybody that thinks it is possible to control borders, beyond a certain point, without getting people killed is living in a dream world. Look anywhere in the world, you see the same thing.

    http://www.nytimes.com/2016/04/30/world/australia/nauru-refugee-dies.html?_r=0

    http://www.cnn.com/2016/04/20/middleeast/migrants-drown-mediterranean/

    There are no exceptions. And the United States will not take it past a certain point. The border will never be “controlled.” It will never be zero. In spite of the fact that some people say water should not be put in the desert, or that land mines should be placed on the Mexican border. Theer are some people who don’t understand what is wrong with that. They are starting to lose their moral compass. Others deny that reality.

    It will never stop, because it is not natural, and people will keep on trying, especially as communication grows between different countries. It did stop in the mid-Twentieth century, but only temporarily. No totalitarian system stays in place indefinitely and this is a totalitarian system.

    There is a further point to make: As Martin Luther King said, hardness of heart extends past the original group of people it is directed at.

    This CAN be made to work, of course. Just get rid of all welfare and public services. You want the fire department? Are you a subscriber?

    NO, you don’t need to get rid of all welfare. There is not an unlimited number of people who will make their way to the United States or Europe or Australia. BUt say something like tht is so. You can make it more rational. When you talk about the fire department you seem to think that everybody will be poor, and not able to pay any taxes. That’s more true when immigration is illegal. Some as this is as ridiculous as worrying that there could be a problem with allowing people from different countries to freely marry each other – native born people of one sex maybe could run out of spouses! There are certainly things governments should just not worry about it, but take thing as they are where the free market leaves it and work from there.

    There’s another point to make. The law can be tempered. It is easy enough to re-dorect migraiton, or to impose conditions that people can meet. You could demand people buy 3 year’s worth of unemployment insurance, for instance. You could eliminate all restrictions except for certain character ones, on people who have a college education and can speak English, with each such person being able to take with him or her one other person over 18.

    And when we have a situation in which people are paying smugglers you can put them out of business by letting them pay the same amount of money to the U.S. Treasury. And if you are not afraid of “unfairness” you can anyone smuggled in to stay provided they explain how it was done. Lots of things can be done.

    It’s this fanaticism on enforcement and uncaring that’s destroying the Republican Party. Now the democratic Party is not making an open critique of immigration laws – it just pretends they don’t exist when focusing on individual cases, and argues against deportation. Let the Republicans justify the law when they impact on people, which of course they do not. The Democrats will supply a reason for watnting to deport people if one is not given: anti-Hispanic racism. And saying you are enforcing the law because it is the law, but not because the law is good just doesn’t wash. It doesn’t wash even for Donald Trump. He has to say they are causing a rise in crime, or bringing disease. It may wash for Ted Cruz, but most people are not abstract legal philosophers – and Ted Cruz does not extend this to other laws..

    Senator Schumer just made a promise that since he will probably be Senate Democratic leader, if he is Majority Leader he will get an immigration bill through the Senate early next year taht will establish a path to citizenship.

    http://www.nydailynews.com/new-york/citizenship-now/sen-schumer-vows-immigration-reform-citizenship-hotline-article-1.2619429

    He’s of course not saying anything about the House.

    Sammy Finkelman (047868)


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